Speaker 1: Of the law and order franchises, SVU is considered especially watchable.
Speaker 2: We are the amateur detectives who kind of investigate the
Speaker 2: vicious felonies. These episodes are based on.
Speaker 3: These are our stories, done.
Speaker 2: Done, that's messed up? An SVU podcast. I'm your host
Speaker 2: Liza Traeger.
Speaker 1: And I'm your other hosts Kara Klank, and we talk
Speaker 1: SVU episodes true crime, and we're still holding off on
Speaker 1: guests even though the writer's strike has been resolved and
Speaker 1: we feel the SAG strike Hopefully by the time this
Speaker 1: episode even comes out will be resolved, I mean, fingers crossed,
Speaker 1: and we can get back to having some guests soon.
Speaker 2: They just rejected an offer. I wonder what it was.
Speaker 2: It's like the writer's about everything, like just the same.
Speaker 3: What are they doing?
Speaker 1: Yeah, I wonder if it just has like I feel
Speaker 1: like the AI thing with writing is one thing, but
Speaker 1: the AI thing with like scanning people's likenesses and like
Speaker 1: reusing it. Like I just saw an article yesterday that
Speaker 1: there's some insurance out or something with Tom Hanks in it,
Speaker 1: and he's like, that's not me, Like you know what
Speaker 1: I mean. So it's like they're they're they're just to me.
Speaker 1: With actors, there's more of an opportunity for AI to
Speaker 1: be like abusive than even with writers.
Speaker 3: So maybe that's what they're holding out on.
Speaker 2: I'm not confused why the actors are holding out. I'm
Speaker 2: confused why the studios aren't just giving in, like yeah,
Speaker 2: we like they really the writers won, they got what
Speaker 2: they wanted. Yeah, what makes them think the actors are
Speaker 2: not going to do that too?
Speaker 3: Like that's my thing?
Speaker 2: Like, you can't scan a person's face, yeah, keep it
Speaker 2: forever for one fee, for a two hundred and fifty
Speaker 2: dollars Like like that's not even this isn't even bit.
Speaker 2: This is wild behavior. You can't scan a face and
Speaker 2: keep it. Sorry, sorry, this isn't the movie The Island.
Speaker 2: You know what I mean? You can't do it. Listen,
Speaker 2: I have huge news.
Speaker 3: What's the news.
Speaker 2: I my friend's in town from London, and uh so
Speaker 2: I picked her up from the beach. From the beach,
Speaker 2: I picked up from the airport, and usually when I
Speaker 2: pick up visitors from the airport, I go straight to
Speaker 2: the beach, and that's what we did. Then we went
Speaker 2: to the Santa Monica Pier. I played whack a Mole
Speaker 2: against three people. I won. I won a squash mollow.
Speaker 2: It's like, I want this prize and it's it's like
Speaker 2: a blueberry cupcake with a face on it. It's so
Speaker 2: fucking cute. And I jumped up and down so hard
Speaker 2: and I the other people didn't know who they were
Speaker 2: up against in terms of whack a mole, but.
Speaker 3: It was it felt very important. I want to see it.
Speaker 3: Oh my god, that's very cute, very cute. It was
Speaker 3: so cute. We'll post it. We'll post it in the stories.
Speaker 2: Yeah, Ferris Wheel. You know, sometimes a tourist attraction is nice.
Speaker 3: So the alay No, So the huge news is the
Speaker 3: squash mollow. Yeah, correct, yes, yes, can you top that? Kara?
Speaker 1: No, No, I don't have any good I don't have
Speaker 1: any good, good good stuff to top that, unfortunately, But
Speaker 1: we do have news.
Speaker 2: If you guys have been living under a rock and
Speaker 2: truly skipping every intro we've ever discussed, we are on tour.
Speaker 3: Yes, thank you.
Speaker 1: It is the seventeenth of October today when this episode
Speaker 1: goes live, which means it's not too late for you
Speaker 1: to catch us in Cleveland tomorrow.
Speaker 3: We were back at Hilarities. We were there last year. Listen.
Speaker 1: I'll be the first to admit that last year we
Speaker 1: did an episode in Cleveland that was a bit of
Speaker 1: a bummer.
Speaker 3: Okay.
Speaker 1: It did start with two dead people and a dead
Speaker 1: child lying in the forest together, pose like lying down together,
Speaker 1: like they were having a little camping trip, but they
Speaker 1: were dead.
Speaker 3: We don't love that.
Speaker 1: We are coming back with a hot new episode to Cleveland.
Speaker 3: You're gonna love it.
Speaker 1: It's gonna be fun, much more fun and flirty than
Speaker 1: the last episode, and it's gonna be great. So come
Speaker 1: see us at Hilarities. Then on Thursday, we are in Boston.
Speaker 1: We are playing the Wilber. It's the biggest venue we've
Speaker 1: ever played. Grab a friend, please come out and see us.
Speaker 1: We really don't want to, you know, flop at the
Speaker 1: Wilber with like, you know, not too many people.
Speaker 3: So we'd love to see you.
Speaker 1: After Boston, we're in Toronto on the twenty fourth, Detroit
Speaker 1: on the twenty fifth, Pittsburgh on the twenty sixth, and
Speaker 1: then check That's Messed Up Live dot com for our
Speaker 1: Midwest dates Salt Lake, Sacramento, New York. Our first show
Speaker 1: has sold out. We are doing a second show. We're
Speaker 1: adding a late show, come see us at City Winery
Speaker 1: in New York and then closing the tour out in
Speaker 1: Philly in December.
Speaker 3: So yeah, we really want to see you, guys. We
Speaker 3: love you. And Lisa's doing some stand up as well.
Speaker 3: Yeah I'm out there. I'm out there, guys.
Speaker 1: Check her instagram, check the Glitter Cheese instagram for her
Speaker 1: shows and yeah that's not for now. What else is
Speaker 1: going on besides the amazing squash mollow.
Speaker 2: Oh, I am booking like I have like free times,
Speaker 2: so I'm booking some hotels in New York, and the
Speaker 2: hotels like there was even one thing that said, like, sorry,
Speaker 2: our prices are higher.
Speaker 3: It's fall.
Speaker 2: People are really coming here in fall, and it makes sense.
Speaker 2: Fall in New York is gorgeous. Yeah, but I didn't
Speaker 2: realize that the price is skyrocket so much for the fall.
Speaker 3: I just did. I didn't either.
Speaker 1: I just did this podcast where the host asked me,
Speaker 1: what's a movie that, if you could, you would like
Speaker 1: jump in and out of it, like you could like
Speaker 1: go to like different scenes in the movie.
Speaker 3: And I was like, oh my gosh.
Speaker 1: And I I ended up choosing when Harry met Sally
Speaker 1: because I would love to go to New York during
Speaker 1: all these different times, Like there's like fall in New York,
Speaker 1: they're in summer in New York, they're in like they're
Speaker 1: kind of like eighties New York, but maybe they start
Speaker 1: in seventies New York. So I that's what I chose.
Speaker 1: I always think of falling New York. I think of
Speaker 1: the cover of when Harry met Sally Wow.
Speaker 3: I don't know.
Speaker 2: I thought what movie would I want to hunt?
Speaker 3: I know it's her first thing.
Speaker 2: The first thing that came to mind was Jumanji, which
Speaker 2: is insane.
Speaker 3: You want to like run from animals, so that's wrong.
Speaker 2: Then once you started talking to New York, I was like, oh,
Speaker 2: I wonder what she's gonna say. So then I thought
Speaker 2: big business because the Plaza Hotel, so that would be fun.
Speaker 2: And then the fashion is so cool. But I like
Speaker 2: where you're thinking, like you could see every season, So
Speaker 2: what would I like to do?
Speaker 3: Maybe we bought a zoo. I like animals. I love that.
Speaker 2: With Matt Damon, I don't know, yeah, Or do I
Speaker 2: pick cartoon or do I pick inside out and go
Speaker 2: to you know, inside of a brain of a child.
Speaker 3: I don't know. I don't think you would like that.
Speaker 3: I don't think you would like that.
Speaker 2: What do all the things inside the head do when
Speaker 2: the girl hits puberty and starts, you know, getting fingered
Speaker 2: out and about? I feel I does Joy get jump
Speaker 2: up and down? Or does she close her eyes? What
Speaker 2: does Joy do? Great question I was gonna say.
Speaker 3: I feel like Disgust takes the wheel, like she starts
Speaker 3: driving the whole thing, and Joy is kind of like,
Speaker 3: I'm back here, but like kind of really only for
Speaker 3: like a couple of things, like but definitely a fingering.
Speaker 1: I bet Joy does have a good time. That movie
Speaker 1: was good, funny to think about. Yeah, oh I love that.
Speaker 1: It should be what is it called mandatory viewing?
Speaker 3: Yes, Rosie's outside right now watching the Lego movie. By
Speaker 3: the way, Rosie's home from school. Everybody, So, if I
Speaker 3: am you know, she'supt her string cheese.
Speaker 1: Yeah, if I'm interrupted during this recording, it's because she's
Speaker 1: like knock knock, knock, ding dong.
Speaker 2: Yeah, you did a good impression of her. That is
Speaker 2: how she kind of sounds.
Speaker 3: It's so cute.
Speaker 2: I hope she comes in. My friend from another country
Speaker 2: is out and about. She went for a walk to
Speaker 2: be respectful, but in my head. I was like, her
Speaker 2: accents insane, Like I have to acclimate to it. She's
Speaker 2: a Jordy for those who know what that means. She's
Speaker 2: from Newcastle and so like she just sounds like it
Speaker 2: takes me a couple of days to figure her out.
Speaker 2: Like Estra, I kept having to be like, wait, what
Speaker 2: was that. She's like, ugh, you know, She's like.
Speaker 3: You're right, yeah, you have to get you have to
Speaker 3: get acclimated for sure.
Speaker 1: I mean, I'm listening to this podcast right now that
Speaker 1: you know it's obviously about child murder sadly, but like
Speaker 1: it takes place in like the northeast of England, like
Speaker 1: Sunderland or something like that, and it's like everybody you know,
Speaker 1: like I cannot even understand what a lot of people
Speaker 1: are saying, Like it's like an English accent I've never
Speaker 1: heard before. So I'm really like, I like, I like,
Speaker 1: I'm always like I hope the host is going to
Speaker 1: summarize after this interview, because I don't know what this
Speaker 1: person is saying, but I love it. I can't wait
Speaker 1: to meet your friends because I love British accents. But
Speaker 1: I used to have a thing where I was like
Speaker 1: Meredith Marx and if I talk to somebody from a
Speaker 1: foreign country for like a little bit, I would just
Speaker 1: start talking in their accent.
Speaker 2: I think that's normal. I really think that's normal behavior.
Speaker 2: I think it's like they say, it's an empathy thing too.
Speaker 1: Yeah, and it's like I also just think the accents
Speaker 1: are cool like I and sound pretty, and I'm like, oh,
Speaker 1: can I talk like that?
Speaker 3: Like I don't know. No, I'm actually embarrassing.
Speaker 2: When I get to London, I'll say may, I'll say flat,
Speaker 2: it's not it's not good, it's not good. But I
Speaker 2: will just start talking like I belong there.
Speaker 3: It's not a crisps Yeah.
Speaker 2: But it's so wild because when people come to America
Speaker 2: they really keep their acts like oh that's different.
Speaker 3: Like I don't feel that people that come.
Speaker 2: From other places suddenly start talking more American.
Speaker 3: Well.
Speaker 1: I remember always asking, like my babysitters that were from
Speaker 1: other countries like New Zealand or Ireland or whatever.
Speaker 3: I'd be like, do an American accent?
Speaker 1: And they'd always be like yeah, okay, like they would
Speaker 1: do like Valley Girl.
Speaker 3: That I like.
Speaker 2: But that's them do but that's them pretending, that's them
Speaker 2: making fun of us. Like I like when they make
Speaker 2: fun of us, but they're never naturally just like Calipunga,
Speaker 2: Like they don't do that out of nowhere. But we'll
Speaker 2: be over there and we'll just be like cherryo out
Speaker 2: of nowhere.
Speaker 3: It's sick.
Speaker 2: We're sick. Yeah, we're sick. We're sick people. But let's
Speaker 2: move on and watch more sick people or listen, listen,
Speaker 2: thank you for also listening. We're really obsessed with you
Speaker 2: and we're we feel happy that we get to do this. Yes,
Speaker 2: oh many big news. I got to go to a restaurer.
Speaker 2: I never went to sushi belt restaurant.
Speaker 3: Whoa when did you go? In Chicago?
Speaker 2: I went with my sister, her husband and friend, and
Speaker 2: she's my friend there you know, they've known each other
Speaker 2: since they were twelve, like my elders. But and then
Speaker 2: you pay by the you know plate colors. It was
Speaker 2: so fun and then you could still order to yourself
Speaker 2: if you want it on a screen, and there's a
Speaker 2: train track on top with giant trucks and a truck
Speaker 2: will bring it just to your.
Speaker 1: Table and then to go on in La there is
Speaker 1: there are people like but I there's one that like
Speaker 1: it's so hard to get a reservation. It's not like
Speaker 1: it's exclusive, it's just like you have to do it
Speaker 1: on their app, and the app is like really not
Speaker 1: designed well, Like I have the app, like I really
Speaker 1: want to go.
Speaker 2: Speaking of poorly designed apps, like all the grocery stores
Speaker 2: in Chicago have apps.
Speaker 3: They're so hard to use.
Speaker 2: My dad needs so much help, and it like I
Speaker 2: was struggling figuring out how to apply the coupons and
Speaker 2: switch the screens and where to look. And it's like,
Speaker 2: go back to having a preferred card, go back to
Speaker 2: a paper thing, or make these apps easier, Like.
Speaker 3: What the fuck?
Speaker 2: Yeah, trying to keep coupons away from our elderly parents
Speaker 2: and I'm not here for it.
Speaker 3: You know, I'm not here for it. Yeah, Oh my god,
Speaker 3: that reminder that coupon queen movie, the Queen Pin movie
Speaker 3: that I watched on Delta. Anyway, I love that movie. Yeah.
Speaker 2: We love murder obviously in Scary Ship, but it's like
Speaker 2: I do love suspense when you know it's not gonna
Speaker 2: get too bad, like Curl Summer. It's fourteen's yeah, so
Speaker 2: it's not gonna get too dark, even though there's kidnapping,
Speaker 2: and I like that the impostors. I think that was
Speaker 2: like a VH one or Bravo scripted, like, you know,
Speaker 2: it's scary, it's there's suspense, but it'll be a look.
Speaker 3: The steaks are a little lower. Yeah, and that's how.
Speaker 2: Queen pen felt. And then isn't like bb Rexa in
Speaker 2: it wildly? Isn't Oh yeah, Hacker, Yes, oh my god, Yes,
Speaker 2: that's so funny. I forgot that that was bbe Rexa's
Speaker 2: big acting turn. You would hate mister Robot because mister
Speaker 2: Robot is like suspense, but like everything is like if
Speaker 2: this goes wrong, the fucking world is going.
Speaker 3: To shut down. Like it's so suspenseful and so high stakes.
Speaker 2: But well I like that too, you know, Arlington Road,
Speaker 2: I like. I like real suspense. I love a twist,
Speaker 2: twist for your nerves.
Speaker 1: Yes, well, well let's let's get into speaking of twists,
Speaker 1: let's get into excited episode.
Speaker 3: Yeah, such a good episode.
Speaker 1: And this is our one hundred and fiftieth episode, babies,
Speaker 1: that's the susk was Centennial, I believe is what it's called.
Speaker 1: Uh so that's our that's from Waiting for Golf Man.
Speaker 1: Remember it's the one hundred and fifteth anniversary of their town,
Speaker 1: so they have the Suska Centennial. That's the only reason
Speaker 1: I know, Well, what if I just knew the different
Speaker 1: uh center that name.
Speaker 2: Yeah, for those who don't know why Care is suddenly
Speaker 2: explaining herself, it's because I gave her a dirty look.
Speaker 1: For just like al the fuck? But yeah, we're excited.
Speaker 1: One hundred and fifteth episode. We've always wanted to do
Speaker 1: this EP and here we are, So don't go anywhere.
Speaker 3: Okay, we are doing a very.
Speaker 1: Requested episode called Authority. Everyone has asked for this since
Speaker 1: we started this podcast twenty years ago, and here we
Speaker 1: are finally doing it. It's season nine, episode seventeen.
Speaker 2: It does feel like a holiday like it feels extra special.
Speaker 2: It feels maybe not the first time we had you know,
Speaker 2: Captain Craig, and that was that. I remember that excitement,
Speaker 2: But this feels really special.
Speaker 3: Yeah, I'm excited to do this. What I mean?
Speaker 1: People call this one the Robin Williams episode, obviously, and
Speaker 1: it is our one hundred and fiftieth episode, so we
Speaker 1: had to pick a banger, and here we are with Authority.
Speaker 2: So I love one fifty. Honestly, I love it more
Speaker 2: than one hundred.
Speaker 3: I love it.
Speaker 1: Wait in Waiting for Guffman, I think the one hundred
Speaker 1: and fiftieth. It's called the Suska Centennial. I think, wait,
Speaker 1: they call it girl. So I forgot what city I
Speaker 1: was in, and this was Portland. I got a present
Speaker 1: with enamel.
Speaker 2: Pintons and one is clearly for me, and then like,
Speaker 2: one is clearly for you. But I didn't know the reference.
Speaker 2: So I was just like, I don't know which one
Speaker 2: it is. And just this week I looked and it's
Speaker 2: fucking it's park A Posy from Waiting for Guffman in
Speaker 2: her dairy queen outfit.
Speaker 3: Oh my god.
Speaker 2: Yeah, I had a pin. I know she's in my bag.
Speaker 2: So when I see you.
Speaker 3: Today, you have to have it. I just looked it up. Oh,
Speaker 3: and that reminds me.
Speaker 1: I have a fucking birthday present for you too, A
Speaker 1: small one.
Speaker 3: Yeah. Yeah, I'll bring that in the car today too.
Speaker 3: It won't be wrapped. I hope that's okay. It's really okay.
Speaker 3: But yeah.
Speaker 2: This was when we did trivia at our live show.
Speaker 2: This was one of the questions, what is this episode called?
Speaker 2: Because I think it's so you would call it the
Speaker 2: Robin Williams one. No one's calling it authority, but it
Speaker 2: makes so much sense, and he's such a good actor
Speaker 2: and he's so talented, and he really.
Speaker 3: More than Jim Carrey.
Speaker 2: But like both of these just wild looney tunes changed
Speaker 2: our lives. Yeah, they are singular talents in a way
Speaker 2: where it's like no one even comes close. They do
Speaker 2: these extraordinary things, pushing to the limits of comedy drama.
Speaker 3: I don't know it's.
Speaker 1: Wait, were you and I talking on this podcast about
Speaker 1: how there's like a PG and a PG thirteen and
Speaker 1: an R rated version of Missus Doubtfire?
Speaker 3: Because like, that's how good this.
Speaker 1: I'm like, Jared and I were talking about it because
Speaker 1: he tried to Jared tried to tell me that it
Speaker 1: was a drive by fruiting, and I go, it's a
Speaker 1: run by fruiting, like I know, Missus Doubtfire, so I
Speaker 1: had to google it and prove him wrong. And then
Speaker 1: he goes, I bet you, Robin Williams. I go, that
Speaker 1: sounds kind of improvised, like an improvised line, like it
Speaker 1: was a run by fruiting, because like, I don't know,
Speaker 1: it sounds improvised to me, and he goes, yeah, I
Speaker 1: bet Wob Williams had like fifty takes for like and
Speaker 1: everyone different anytime he did anything. So wow, this has
Speaker 1: turned into a full tribute.
Speaker 3: To Robin Williams. I'm about to like start crying to
Speaker 3: a picture of the genie.
Speaker 2: But I know and also just he did a lot
Speaker 2: for extremely hairy men, I would say too, he really is.
Speaker 2: He pushed hair to the limit. I would s body
Speaker 2: hair to the limit. For a fact, I don't know
Speaker 2: anyone as hairy as him. That's out famous.
Speaker 3: No, and he's living in the pre laser days. You know,
Speaker 3: who knows what would have happened.
Speaker 2: No, I think you would have left it because it
Speaker 2: gives you know, Jumanji and stuff like you don't have
Speaker 2: to Yeah, and bird cage. I mean he really he's
Speaker 2: Also he doesn't just like have body hair, he's.
Speaker 3: The he pushed it to the limit. He like a
Speaker 3: war Low cut.
Speaker 1: And do we have like funny man leading men like
Speaker 1: that now that are like not hotties, you know what
Speaker 1: I mean, Like we're giving cris Pine comedy roles or
Speaker 1: whatever we're giving you know, like certain people, but like
Speaker 1: who is like Robin Williams where it's like not conventionally
Speaker 1: a hot man, handsome, but like you know, and just
Speaker 1: such a good, big talent that they're carrying movies. You know,
Speaker 1: maybe like Steve Carell back when forty year old Virgin
Speaker 1: and stuff.
Speaker 3: Was his big times. And what about Seth Rogan, Yeah,
Speaker 3: I guess.
Speaker 1: A little bit more one note to me, like Seth
Speaker 1: Rogen's so funny to me, but he's like stone or
Speaker 1: dude like thing. And Robin Williams just did so much
Speaker 1: like we were saying singular.
Speaker 2: I don't think I didn't think we were trying to
Speaker 2: compare the comedic skill.
Speaker 3: I don't think anyone is Robin Williams. Yeah, you were
Speaker 3: just saying I was just that comedy guys. And then
Speaker 3: you're like, but they're not Robin Williams.
Speaker 1: I'm like, I'm playing no, no, no, no, no no, I
Speaker 1: kind of you know what I mean, like where their
Speaker 1: talent was enough to get them like huge rather than
Speaker 1: just like looks or hotness or nepo or whatever.
Speaker 3: But you're right, Seth Rogan would count for that.
Speaker 2: And he did a lot of drama. I mean, because
Speaker 2: I watch Awakenings. At one of our live show, I
Speaker 2: said Spring Awakening instead of Awakenings and only one person laughed,
Speaker 2: and I bet they were laughing at me.
Speaker 3: Now that I think about it's, well, it's probably one
Speaker 3: of those things where I just moved on because I've
Speaker 3: never seen Spring Awakening, but I have seen Awakenings, and
Speaker 3: oh my god, you remember this, you remember this? Mone
Speaker 3: I know I'm just saying it. Probably I probably was like, okay,
Speaker 3: like because I've never seen spre Awakening, because normally, if
Speaker 3: I knew, I would say something.
Speaker 2: But anyway, Awakenings Awakenings. They made us watch it in school,
Speaker 2: and I don't think I was ready. I don't think
Speaker 2: I think I was too young like that like fucked
Speaker 2: me up. Yeah, I think we really did justice to
Speaker 2: Robin Williams before you go into this really good twisty turning.
Speaker 2: And I think this is a Helen Shaver episode. Oh
Speaker 2: directed this because it is done like a movie, and
Speaker 2: I feel like her episodes are very movie like.
Speaker 3: But we'll see who it is, it says, directed by
Speaker 3: David Platt.
Speaker 2: Okay, let's see what he's up to, because it did
Speaker 2: seem like it's really cinematic. Yeah, let's see how many svus.
Speaker 2: He's really not that men. I'm a little confused. Oh direct, Okay,
Speaker 2: he's actually he's done my lucky number. So he's done
Speaker 2: fifty four episodes of SVU. Holy, okay, two thousand to
Speaker 2: twenty ten. Because it is it is done so well.
Speaker 2: There's like explosions. I feel like we're just in so
Speaker 2: many locations.
Speaker 1: Yeah, and he said he's directed an episode of Suits
Speaker 1: for all you freaking suits heads out there.
Speaker 3: Who's making Suits the biggest show in the world. It's
Speaker 3: so confusing. Oh yeah, fifty four fuck. And he did
Speaker 3: twenty nine of Regular Well it was trial by Jury.
Speaker 2: Was I was with friends at the beach and they
Speaker 2: started going in on like why they love suits, and
Speaker 2: they did sell it in a funny way, and they said,
Speaker 2: in every episode, someone says something and it sparks something
Speaker 2: in the lawyer. Every time it's like, oh my god,
Speaker 2: wait did you just say that? And then they run
Speaker 2: our and like, I guess that's in every episode. And
Speaker 2: they said that like the rules of times, like SBU
Speaker 2: is grounded in reality in a lot of ways. Yeah,
Speaker 2: And I guess Suits is just like science doesn't matter,
Speaker 2: law doesn't matter. Everything's made up and it's just But
Speaker 2: I'm having trouble getting into the first episode.
Speaker 3: I should just start on a random and see how
Speaker 3: I feel.
Speaker 1: Yeah, the funniest thing someone said to me about suits
Speaker 1: was that in suits, the whole law is.
Speaker 3: Just like a vibe. It's like the law part of
Speaker 3: it is a vibe. It's like they don't really get
Speaker 3: that into the law. It's just kind of like around
Speaker 3: that there's some law, you know.
Speaker 2: Ooh, okay, I'm looking through his episodes, you know, and
Speaker 2: he did sick the Michael Jackson one, which is a
Speaker 2: really funny one. Okay, if you haven't listened to our podcast,
Speaker 2: that one's a bit one of our part.
Speaker 3: That's one of our most popular because the Michael Jackson
Speaker 3: haters came for uh, I mean the Michael Jackson fans
Speaker 3: came for us. We're also Michael Jackson fans. Yes.
Speaker 2: Also there's a reality where he is a molester. Like, yeah,
Speaker 2: I don't understand. You think we all hated Michael Jackson, Like,
Speaker 2: grow up where we are at.
Speaker 3: We're tweeting us FBI files and all this stuff proving
Speaker 3: his innocence, and I was like, I can't read this,
Speaker 3: but I'm sorry.
Speaker 2: If a local employee at your local grocery store had
Speaker 2: to sleepovers with children, you would have his head, so yeah,
Speaker 2: bore me the details. But yes, of course we we're
Speaker 2: not tapping our foot when Michael Jackson comes on, these
Speaker 2: people like we hate him. It's disappointing when the ones
Speaker 2: you admire are molesters, but most men are.
Speaker 3: Okay, yeah, start this episode. Okay, here we go, we
Speaker 3: are doing authority.
Speaker 1: We open on a cheerful gal at a fast food
Speaker 1: place called Happy Burger, asking woman if she can take
Speaker 1: her order, to which the woman replies, what you can
Speaker 1: take is a mop and bucket to the ladies room.
Speaker 1: Poor kids, tossing her cookies in there, and you think
Speaker 1: that's gonna be where we're going, Like, uh oh, someone's
Speaker 1: in the bathroom having a like a crisis, and then
Speaker 1: here comes. But it's also been a minute since I've
Speaker 1: heard the term tossing your cookies, like such a gentle
Speaker 1: way to refer to the violence of vomiting.
Speaker 3: But this girl is like, thank you for your excellent.
Speaker 1: Feedback, have a happy Burger day, and that is customer service.
Speaker 1: Then she tells Joel he has to go deal with
Speaker 1: the bar from the bathroom. Joel is annoyed, and you
Speaker 1: know I am too, because they actually show a pile
Speaker 1: of barf on the show, and I did not need that.
Speaker 1: I understand what vomit looks like. You don't have to
Speaker 1: show it. So thank you David Platt for getting that shot.
Speaker 1: And as he's like monologuing to himself over how gross
Speaker 1: happy Burger is, he hears a scream from behind a door,
Speaker 1: so it's not even we're not even getting to the
Speaker 1: person who threw up. We hear a scream behind a
Speaker 1: door that says employees only, also the name of a
Speaker 1: new podcast I'm on, please check it out, and a
Speaker 1: girl yells, please don't make me do it, and Joel's like, Triney,
Speaker 1: is that you? And he starts trying to get the
Speaker 1: door open, but the door is locked. So now we
Speaker 1: cut to a uniformed officer leading Benson and Stabler in
Speaker 1: giving them the walk and Talk info. The suspect and
Speaker 1: the victim are barricaded in the manager's office.
Speaker 3: It's reinforced steel. That's never good.
Speaker 1: The only person with keys is the manager, Dwight Lomax,
Speaker 1: but he's Mia. Triney Martinez is the name of the victim,
Speaker 1: and the purpse says he'll only talk to detective Milgram,
Speaker 1: but one PP has no record of a Milgram on
Speaker 1: the job, so what the fuck is going on? They
Speaker 1: walk up to the door and announce themselves, and Live goes, yeah,
Speaker 1: I'm Milgram's partner. He's on his way. The door opens
Speaker 1: right up, and this is Scott Adsit of thirty rock
Speaker 1: fame if you're a thirty rock person. He's like a
Speaker 1: big character on thirty Rock and I love him. And
Speaker 1: he's like, oh, thank god, you're finally here. I did
Speaker 1: everything you told me to do. And Treeney is a
Speaker 1: really young girl. She's tied up, gagged and is wearing
Speaker 1: only a happy Burger apron and it doesn't look good
Speaker 1: in there, and we're at the credits, so they get
Speaker 1: to it pretty quick here, so top EVCT one Stabler
Speaker 1: walks into interrogation where a cheery Scott adds It, who
Speaker 1: is playing the manager Dwight Lomax. So that's why he
Speaker 1: was mia. He was in the steel room and he's like,
Speaker 1: is Milgrim here yet? I want my pat on the
Speaker 1: back from Milgram and Stabler's like, he's stuck in traffic,
Speaker 1: and then he goes, that's okay. He knows everything that happened,
Speaker 1: and Stabler's like, why don't you tell me what happened?
Speaker 3: And he said he was sitting in this desk.
Speaker 1: Milgram called and said that someone stole a wallet from
Speaker 1: a customer and that the woman at the precinct was
Speaker 1: at the precinct filling out a complaint. And he told
Speaker 1: Dwight to hold Trieney until he got there so that
Speaker 1: she couldn't hide any evidence. So he called her thieving
Speaker 1: little butt quote unquote into his office. Now, Triny is
Speaker 1: talking to Benson, who has a long bob. No highlights,
Speaker 1: just put us in a place in time. I feel
Speaker 1: like she's let the highlights grow out at this point. Also,
Speaker 1: Trieny is played I look this up because I didn't
Speaker 1: recognize her, but I don't know what made me look
Speaker 1: her up, played by Monica Raymond. She's also been in
Speaker 1: other stuff like Chicago Fire in the Dick Wolf universe,
Speaker 1: but she also has gone on to direct and directed
Speaker 1: the episode Hell's Kitchen, which we covered about the restaurant
Speaker 1: tour who was like, you know, assaulting his waiters and staff.
Speaker 3: So that's amazing.
Speaker 1: This girl went from being like kind of a bit
Speaker 1: part on this episode to directing go Monica Raymond, and
Speaker 1: she's also directed an episode of The Os of Lawn
Speaker 1: Order OC, so I don't know which one. Now we're
Speaker 1: bouncing back between stay Able talking to Dwight and Benson
Speaker 1: talking to Treeny, and she's describing how Dwight said she had.
Speaker 1: She told him she had nothing in her pockets but
Speaker 1: lip gloss, and he was basically telling everything to the
Speaker 1: phone to the quote unquote cops. He locked the door
Speaker 1: to search her, says Dwight. He said Milgram said he
Speaker 1: had evidence that she had money on her, and then
Speaker 1: he told him to pat her down. He touched her
Speaker 1: all over. Treeney says, starting to cry. She's very traumatized
Speaker 1: by what's happened to her. She told him it wasn't right,
Speaker 1: but he kept doing it. And he's like Milgram said
Speaker 1: to strip search her, and I was that I was
Speaker 1: acting as an agent of the police. He's like, I
Speaker 1: put on gloves. It's like so disturbing. He made her
Speaker 1: take her clothes off, put his hands on her everywhere.
Speaker 3: This is Treeny's account. She begged him to stop, but
Speaker 3: he wouldn't.
Speaker 1: And then now we're back to Dwight and he goes
Speaker 1: I told Milgram she was clean, but he said I
Speaker 1: must have missed something and just to hold her there
Speaker 1: till I got there. So Stabler breaks it down and goes,
Speaker 1: so you strip searched a teenage girl and kept her
Speaker 1: naked in your office for thirty minutes. And Dwight is like, well,
Speaker 1: Detective Milgram said she could keep her apron on, and
Speaker 1: Stabler goes, you're an idiot, which I love the directness
Speaker 1: of that, and he goes, I resent that, detective, after
Speaker 1: all I've done for the police department. It's like, so
Speaker 1: he goes, you sexually abused a girl because a voice
Speaker 1: on the phone told you to, and he's like, I
Speaker 1: was just following Milgram's orders. And he goes, there is
Speaker 1: no Milgram. The whole thing was a scam. And then
Speaker 1: you see Scott Adsett's character see Dwight realize what he's done,
Speaker 1: and he's like, oh fuck, Like what have I done?
Speaker 1: So they next scene they bring him into holding and
Speaker 1: he's crying. Obviously Q Munch obviously is going to get
Speaker 1: way into this. He's like, just following orders. That's the
Speaker 1: preferred defense of every war criminal, from Eikman to Melosovich.
Speaker 1: So Finn's like, whatever, Dwight got punked by a phone call,
Speaker 1: and Munch jumps his defense. He's like, he's just a
Speaker 1: victim of corporate America, and Finn's like here we go,
Speaker 1: and Munch totally gears up for his ted talk and
Speaker 1: he's like, these big corporations like McDonald's, which is clearly
Speaker 1: what Happy Burger is kind of supposed to be, are
Speaker 1: all about following orders from corporate, the franchise mentality where
Speaker 1: employees are lemmings, follow the manual. You know, Munch is
Speaker 1: getting into all of his shit about you know, big
Speaker 1: brother and the corporations. Stabler pops in to say, well,
Speaker 1: Dwight's looking at three to six years and Benson is like,
Speaker 1: what about this.
Speaker 3: Milgram who called him on the phone, And Munch is like.
Speaker 1: Oh, he's dead, and they're like, you know him, and
Speaker 1: obviously he explains that Milgram is a psychology professor who
Speaker 1: if you've ever taken like a psych or sociology class
Speaker 1: in college, you read about this experiment. It's a famous
Speaker 1: experiment where he instructed volunteers to give electric shocks to
Speaker 1: screaming victims. It turns out the shocks weren't real the
Speaker 1: people shocking them were just like friends shocking their friends
Speaker 1: because they someone told them too. So there's more on
Speaker 1: this later. We got nothing on the caller. They say
Speaker 1: he used a prepaid phone card on a payphone, and
Speaker 1: I have not seen a payphone in so long. What
Speaker 1: a fun blast from the past. And it was at
Speaker 1: a public library in Midtown. Maybe there's cameras at the library.
Speaker 1: Munch goes, no way, the librarians took on big brothers
Speaker 1: so they couldn't monitor what you and I are reading.
Speaker 3: I love that.
Speaker 1: Good job. I know we have a lot of librarian listeners.
Speaker 1: We thank you for your service. Taru tried to chase
Speaker 1: down who bought the card, but he couldn't. The guy
Speaker 1: is either really lucky or damn good. And Munch is like, well,
Speaker 1: my money's on good. And then he finds a website
Speaker 1: that's called I Hate Happyburger dot com where ex employees
Speaker 1: shit on Happy Burger and I wish that that was
Speaker 1: I think that's just Reddit now, but I would really
Speaker 1: love to see a website like that, and Munch goes
Speaker 1: revenge of the corporate wage slaves, and so there's a
Speaker 1: whole post about someone is behind a hoax where he
Speaker 1: calls and pretends to be a cop, making the employees
Speaker 1: that these happy burgers do stuff. This guy has hit
Speaker 1: fast food chains all over the country and a lot
Speaker 1: of them are right there in New York.
Speaker 3: So now we're.
Speaker 1: Talking to Ruben Morales aka Joel de la Fuente, friend
Speaker 1: of the pod, and he has built a hoax database, okay,
Speaker 1: and the guy has predictable routines. The calls come in
Speaker 1: weekday mornings, always between ten and eleven thirty am, which
Speaker 1: is after the breakfast rush, but before lunch, so that
Speaker 1: the manager's aren't so busy that they'll blow him off.
Speaker 3: So smart timing. The guy uses a fresh prepaid card
Speaker 3: every time. They can't trace the cards, but he did
Speaker 3: buy them all at the same value Mart, and they
Speaker 3: have to be activated by a cashier and that's in
Speaker 3: the computer, so we know when he bought them. And
Speaker 3: Morales is a step ahead. He's like, I.
Speaker 1: Already ran the value of Mart security footage through facial recognition,
Speaker 1: and I found this guy and we zoom in on
Speaker 1: the tape and it is the legendary Robin Williams, who
Speaker 1: we have already praised on this podcast. Then they do
Speaker 1: zoom in and enhance, which we know is not possible,
Speaker 1: but they do it. And they see that he's got
Speaker 1: a lanyard and an ID badge on. They can't make
Speaker 1: out his name, but the company is Aerodax Labs. At
Speaker 1: the lab they find out that this guy's name is
Speaker 1: Merrit Rook, which is funny because a rook is the
Speaker 1: name of a chess piece, and when I looked it up,
Speaker 1: the verb to rook is to defraud or swindle someone,
Speaker 1: so maybe a writer was having a fun time giving
Speaker 1: him a name. The guy at the lab can't believe
Speaker 1: that Merritt would have done anything illegal. He's an audio
Speaker 1: engineer in the aerospace division. It's very not merit. He's
Speaker 1: a nice guy. And then a woman named doctor Cheng
Speaker 1: comes out and is like, oh, Merrit's out sick today,
Speaker 1: and he was yesterday too, So Benson and Stabler are
Speaker 1: like house call, see you later. So now they're knocking
Speaker 1: on a door of an apartment and Merrett Rook answers
Speaker 1: and says how can I help you? And they comment,
Speaker 1: you don't look sick. Since when is it a crime
Speaker 1: to play hooky? Detective, he replies, So they asked to
Speaker 1: go inside, and Stabler calls him Detective Milgrum, and he goes, oh,
Speaker 1: you must have me confused with someone else. And he
Speaker 1: says he does buy the phone cards at that value, mar,
Speaker 1: but he gives them to the homeless so that they
Speaker 1: can call their families because he knows what it's like
Speaker 1: to be alone. And it's like, I think maybe they'd
Speaker 1: prefer a sandwich, but the phone cards are nice too.
Speaker 1: Did you use one of the cards at the Midtown
Speaker 1: library yesterday? He says, no, I was out of town
Speaker 1: on a trout fishing trip. Don't tell my boss. He
Speaker 1: shows them his fishing license and his hotel bill. He's
Speaker 1: got everything on him. He doesn't have credit cards because
Speaker 1: they gouge the working man with their interest rates, so
Speaker 1: he pays cash, I guess for everything. But he hands
Speaker 1: them a card of a place called Daffodils where he
Speaker 1: had every meal, and they're like, oh, you just happen
Speaker 1: to have that candy.
Speaker 2: I call bullshit. You can't get a hotel room without
Speaker 2: a credit card on file, because how were they going
Speaker 2: to do ancidentals in two thousand and eight. Oh yeah,
Speaker 2: because they need they need collateral. The whole point of
Speaker 2: the credit cards, not even to pay for it. It's
Speaker 2: so you don't fuck up the room and steal pillows.
Speaker 1: I know, I know, but I know that there are
Speaker 1: like I don't know, maybe because it was in like
Speaker 1: a tiny little fishing town, like they it was a
Speaker 1: motel and they let him pay cash. But you're right,
Speaker 1: it's just like you're not going to get very far
Speaker 1: in life without a credit card, unfortunately. I mean, I
Speaker 1: was thinking about that the other day. There's like all
Speaker 1: these there's tolls now that are like just credit card only,
Speaker 1: like everything goes to your credit card.
Speaker 3: I don't know what you do if you don't have
Speaker 3: a credit card.
Speaker 1: Anyway, he says, no, I kept the business card because
Speaker 1: the waitress had a crush on me and she wrote
Speaker 1: her number on the back. So now we're on the
Speaker 1: phone with the waitress and she says, oh, yeah, I
Speaker 1: remember that cutie and his fishing hat and waiters and
Speaker 1: he was there on Monday breakfast, lunch, and dinner. I
Speaker 1: don't think he came for the blue plate special, if
Speaker 1: you know what I mean.
Speaker 3: And this is obviously Robin Williams's voice, I'm having so
Speaker 3: I'm having missus doubtfire flashbacks of when he's like, Layla,
Speaker 3: get back in your sale, don't make me.
Speaker 1: Get the hose on you like all my family and
Speaker 1: I used to just do all his voices from mister
Speaker 1: and Missus Doubtfire.
Speaker 3: We love that.
Speaker 2: Yeah, you really know a lot of the lines from
Speaker 2: Missus Doutfire.
Speaker 1: It's like Clank Family Classic. I don't know what to say.
Speaker 1: I mean, we love it so much. And then I
Speaker 1: think it probably had a moment where it was playing
Speaker 1: on HBO all the time and that's all we.
Speaker 3: Had access to.
Speaker 1: So so the alibi checks out, I guess because of
Speaker 1: this lady on the phone. And now they call the
Speaker 1: hotel and the guy who answers also sounds like Robin Williams,
Speaker 1: but in this universe I get that he is not
Speaker 1: a beloved comedian and voice actor, and he puts them
Speaker 1: on hold and even has a recorded like your call
Speaker 1: is important to us like message.
Speaker 3: So it all seems very legit.
Speaker 1: As if this isn't wild enough, Craigan strolls up and
Speaker 1: blows the whole thing wide open.
Speaker 3: He goes he was fishing.
Speaker 1: Yeah, right, my friend just tried to go trout fishing
Speaker 1: and he was denied a license because the EPA put
Speaker 1: a ban on angling after they found chemical runoff in
Speaker 1: the rivers.
Speaker 3: Lol.
Speaker 1: This made me laugh so hard. I was like, what,
Speaker 1: So that's how they're busting this guy. He did all
Speaker 1: these things to cover his tracks, but he didn't check that.
Speaker 1: You can't even fucking fish in this area. That's funny.
Speaker 1: The hotel guy comes back and goes, yep, he was
Speaker 1: here Sunday and Monday nights. Munch asks about the trout
Speaker 1: and he goes, oh, yeah, they're biting up a storm.
Speaker 1: So we were figuring out that this is more hoaxy
Speaker 1: situation than an alibi. So now we've got Benson and
Speaker 1: Stable outside of Merritt's place and Elliott is whispering into
Speaker 1: a flip phone and they start calling one of the numbers,
Speaker 1: and the phone starts ringing inside the apartment and they
Speaker 1: hear Robin Williams answer the phone being like, you know,
Speaker 1: faraway motel or whatever, like I forgot what the name
Speaker 1: of it is, and they bust in. This guy's got
Speaker 1: a dozen flip phones on chargers. He's running a full
Speaker 1: scale like town out of multiple cell phones. He says,
Speaker 1: please as we fade to black, and it's like it
Speaker 1: is funny because it's serious and he's doing a good
Speaker 1: job acting. But I do still find him funny when
Speaker 1: he's like please hold like getting busted by the cops,
Speaker 1: like I don't know. It's the same with Martin Short.
Speaker 1: It's like, even though he was a psycho murderer, rapist,
Speaker 1: he was still making me laugh. So now top of
Speaker 1: AC two, we're an interrogation and he's admitting to lying
Speaker 1: about the fishing trip. He's like, listen, doctor Chang gave
Speaker 1: me a heads up that you guys had been at
Speaker 1: my work looking for me. I didn't want her to
Speaker 1: know the truth, which is that I was with a
Speaker 1: sex worker.
Speaker 3: I don't even know her name. My wife died three
Speaker 3: years ago.
Speaker 1: I missed her terribly, and when the pain gets really bad,
Speaker 1: I hit the streets and Stabler goes, you screw whores
Speaker 1: in your dead wife's bed, and it's like.
Speaker 3: He's the fuck up Stabler like.
Speaker 1: Jesus and Merritt's like, Merrit's like, but we don't have sex.
Speaker 3: We just sleep.
Speaker 1: It's just comforting having a warm, soft body next to me.
Speaker 1: I close my eyes and it feels like Juliette is back.
Speaker 1: That's his wife. That's very sad. Okay, so you made
Speaker 1: fake receipts, fake business car and put on voices just
Speaker 1: so your coworker wouldn't find out about your sleepover thing.
Speaker 1: Stablers not buying it that you get your rocks off,
Speaker 1: getting guys to molest young girls. A happy Burger and
Speaker 1: he's like, no way, I'm a locovore. He only buy
Speaker 1: which means he only buys organic, seasonal foods grown by
Speaker 1: local farmers.
Speaker 3: Me too.
Speaker 1: He doesn't have a credit card, and he that seems
Speaker 1: like a hard way to live in New York City.
Speaker 1: I feel like there's other places you would be happier.
Speaker 1: But he goes off about chain restaurants and how they
Speaker 1: suck so bad processed food, big mistake.
Speaker 2: And why would you give him this? Why would you
Speaker 2: give He's such a smart dude, all those little phones,
Speaker 2: and then you start this.
Speaker 1: You just can't help yourself. You just have to rail
Speaker 1: against how you get out of it.
Speaker 2: And just like jury duty, you know, it's like a
Speaker 2: fact I hate fast. Yeah I got a jury, not
Speaker 2: how you cover a crime. But yeah, go on, go on.
Speaker 1: Yeah, he's talking about the advertising is aim to toddlers,
Speaker 1: blah blah blah. And then on the other side of
Speaker 1: the on my glass, Craigan's talking a Novack and she's like,
Speaker 1: I mean, I could hold him on obstruction for lying,
Speaker 1: but we got to link him to the Happy Burger somehow.
Speaker 1: And they're like, what about a voice ID with the
Speaker 1: manager And she goes, he fooled Munch.
Speaker 3: With his cast of characters.
Speaker 1: You think he's gonna like sound the same way as
Speaker 1: he did when he was impersonating Detective Milgram. And she goes,
Speaker 1: I need proof he made those calls. And Finn walks
Speaker 1: in and goes, then I must be your fairy godmother.
Speaker 1: Love it, and he goes. They got back up surveillance
Speaker 1: footage of a guy going into the library right before
Speaker 1: the call.
Speaker 3: Morales cleaned it up and it's Merrit Rook.
Speaker 1: You can see it's like basically him wearing a hat,
Speaker 1: but it's like it's his face. It's so funny because
Speaker 1: Jared just got we just got nine months ago, we
Speaker 1: got a letter in the mail that was like, you
Speaker 1: ow five hundred dollars. We were like, what the fuck
Speaker 1: is this? Even for I went online, we couldn't even
Speaker 1: see what it was for. We didn't know if it
Speaker 1: was me or Jared that did it. It was like
Speaker 1: a ticket from California DMB. So we show up at court,
Speaker 1: we requested a court date, and they hand us a
Speaker 1: photo and it's black and white like fully xerox thousand
Speaker 1: times and it's so Jared like you can like, you
Speaker 1: cannot deny that it's him, Like people will go into
Speaker 1: those court things and be like, that's not me.
Speaker 3: You can't be positive that's me. It's so Jared like
Speaker 3: it's he goes, God, I wish that wasn't like my
Speaker 3: exact fucking face, like it's him running a light to
Speaker 3: my In our defense, it was the day we were
Speaker 3: taking Rosie to urgent care because she busted her head open.
Speaker 3: Anyway back to this.
Speaker 2: That seems like a way to get out of it.
Speaker 2: That's not a good excuse.
Speaker 1: Well, we went to the wrong courthouse because they since
Speaker 1: switched the courthouse since they sent us the note, and
Speaker 1: we were supposed to be in Santa Monica.
Speaker 3: We were Beverly Hills.
Speaker 1: So they go, you can just call in, and because
Speaker 1: we were calling in, the woman goes, I can't really
Speaker 1: take that excuse because you're not here. I can't see you,
Speaker 1: and I can, and it's like, thank God, because she
Speaker 1: would have been like, sir, that's you like. So we
Speaker 1: pleaded it down and had to pay less money, but
Speaker 1: still not a great amount of money for him running
Speaker 1: a light anyway.
Speaker 2: Now, I mean, isn't it a good enough reason if
Speaker 2: you're going to the urgent care?
Speaker 1: I know, but we didn't try it because he had
Speaker 1: already tried to deny it.
Speaker 3: He was not letting me talk on the phone. Trust me.
Speaker 3: I would have gone to a different I would have
Speaker 3: gone a different route. I said that I go tell them.
Speaker 3: It was like, we were trying to get our daughter
Speaker 3: urgent here, we have medical records that prove it, blah
Speaker 3: blah blah.
Speaker 1: And he was like, it's not me. I was like, okay,
Speaker 1: you know one of us is into us for you
Speaker 1: and the others not.
Speaker 3: Now.
Speaker 1: At his arraignment, Merritt's got one count of conspiracy to
Speaker 1: commits sexual abuse in the first degree, and it's Judge Petrowsky.
Speaker 1: She wants to know where's your lawyer, And like so
Speaker 1: many freaks before him, this guy wants to represent himself
Speaker 1: and she goes, you know the old adage, and he goes.
Speaker 1: A man that represents himself has a fool for a client.
Speaker 1: Of course he knows it, but he claims he doesn't
Speaker 1: make enough money to afford a private attorney. He makes
Speaker 1: too much money for a public defender. And I'm like,
Speaker 1: I don't think that's how it works. Anybody can get
Speaker 1: a public defender. And Petrovski's quite.
Speaker 2: Good, like he just yeah, and now he's like, listen,
Speaker 2: I've seen I've seen better, and I can't.
Speaker 3: I can't go with one of these fools totally.
Speaker 1: So Petrowski's like, we can bind you a lawyer, and
Speaker 1: he's like some court appointed hack a mouthpiece. So we'll
Speaker 1: sleep through a il a client who won't make him
Speaker 1: rich because he won't get the book rights. It's like, okay,
Speaker 1: where are we going here? Whatever, They let him rep himself.
Speaker 1: Novak asks for two hundred and fifty thousand dollars bail, and
Speaker 1: he goes, no problem. Petrowski's like, you're supposed to argue here,
Speaker 1: and he's like, no, that sounds fair, and she's like,
Speaker 1: I thought you were broke, and he's like, I can
Speaker 1: put my apartment up for that.
Speaker 3: It's it's worth way more than that.
Speaker 1: And he goes up to Novak and tells her he's
Speaker 1: really looking forward to working with her, and she's fuming,
Speaker 1: and but she goes, yeah, should be fun. And then
Speaker 1: he excuses himself to go post his bail and you
Speaker 1: have to post ten percent, which is twenty five k.
Speaker 3: Do you get that back? Let us know.
Speaker 1: I don't know if you get that back, even if
Speaker 1: you're innocent. But now we're at trial. Merritt approaches Stabler
Speaker 1: on the stand and says, any do you have any
Speaker 1: doubts that I'm guilty? And Stabler goes nope. And he's like, well,
Speaker 1: what qualifies you to make that decision? And he's like, well,
Speaker 1: I've been a detective for sixteen years. Merrett goes, have
Speaker 1: you ever heard of a situation like this before? Like
Speaker 1: someone fondling a young girl because a voice on the
Speaker 1: phone told him to. And Stabler says, nothing surprises me
Speaker 1: when it comes to the depraved mind, Like, you don't
Speaker 1: know what I've seen I've been on this job. Merritt goes,
Speaker 1: isn't it more probable that Dwight the manager had the
Speaker 1: hots for Triny and made this whole thing up to
Speaker 1: justify acting out a sexual fantasy. Stabler's like, we have
Speaker 1: proof of the phone call that you made with one
Speaker 1: of your cards, and he says, but I give those
Speaker 1: to the homeless, and they love the library, like famously
Speaker 1: homeless people love the library. So we have you on
Speaker 1: video entering the library to make the call, Sabler says,
Speaker 1: and he goes, are you sure? And that then we
Speaker 1: cut to Morales. Now Morales is on the stand, and
Speaker 1: by the way, Morales is the lieutenant. Now, congratulations king.
Speaker 1: How did you enhance the photo, Merritt asks him, and
Speaker 1: he goes, oh, I ran it through this software to
Speaker 1: remove shadow, etc. Essentially it sounds like the filters we
Speaker 1: now have on Instagram, Like you can do shadows, you
Speaker 1: can do highlights, you can brighten it up. You can
Speaker 1: see a lot more like on a dark photo now
Speaker 1: even on just the crap we have on our phones.
Speaker 1: And he goes, yeah, so I did this and that,
Speaker 1: and he goes, so you manipulated the image and he's like, yes, scientifically,
Speaker 1: and then he whips out a huge blow up of
Speaker 1: the original photo and you cannot see the person's face
Speaker 1: at all, and he goes, that could be me or
Speaker 1: dur number four, and Duror number four goes, it's not
Speaker 1: me and Merritt goes me either, and it's like he's
Speaker 1: so charming, Like I could see myself falling for this
Speaker 1: if I was a juror. And Morales explains how the
Speaker 1: computer cleans up the image, but it kind of looks
Speaker 1: like bad the way he's explaining it, that the computer
Speaker 1: is like guessing at how to clean it up, and
Speaker 1: that's like, not, I don't think that's really what's happening.
Speaker 1: But he starts playing. So he starts, you know, going
Speaker 1: on with this line of questioning and being like, well,
Speaker 1: if the computer's guessing, then it really could be anyone.
Speaker 1: It could be you, it could be you, it could
Speaker 1: be you whatever, and so everyone's Novak looks pissed, like
Speaker 1: this guy's doing well. Now Novak's in her office with
Speaker 1: Huang and he's like, babe, I brought you some coffee.
Speaker 1: I heard you got your ass handed to you in
Speaker 1: court today. Let's dish. And Novak's like, I'm like shocked
Speaker 1: at how good of a lawyer this guy is. And
Speaker 1: she understands why people rape and kill, but she cannot
Speaker 1: understand why this guy is playing these games. And here
Speaker 1: comes Hwog with the profile he's manipulative. He gets off
Speaker 1: on making people do things they don't want to do.
Speaker 1: Novak talks about this kid she knew in grade school
Speaker 1: who tricked kids into eating rabbit shit, saying they were raisins,
Speaker 1: and that she would never do that because the kid
Speaker 1: was a sadist. And the last she heard about that guy,
Speaker 1: he was selling used cars in Toledo and still scamming.
Speaker 1: So Twang goes, well, why don't you dig into merret
Speaker 1: Rook's childhood, maybe you'll find something.
Speaker 3: Boom boom boom Okay.
Speaker 1: Back in court, Merrit is on the stand and he's
Speaker 1: essentially cross examining himself.
Speaker 3: He's just like giving a statement.
Speaker 1: He's in the witness box, but he's just talking freely,
Speaker 1: and he's like, I'm a scientist. I work to improve
Speaker 1: people's lives. I've never had trouble with the law, and
Speaker 1: I hate what happened to that girl. I'm outrage and
Speaker 1: I want the perp to be brought to justice, but
Speaker 1: it wasn't me. Then he rests his case because yeah,
Speaker 1: he's he's a lawyer, I guess. And so now it's
Speaker 1: Novak's turn, and she's like, so, you've never been in
Speaker 1: trouble with the law and He's like nope, and she goes,
Speaker 1: you're under oath. Have you ever been arrested and he
Speaker 1: says no, and then she pulls out an article from
Speaker 1: the Hartford Tribune of thirteen year old Merritt Rook being
Speaker 1: arrested for malicious mischief, trespassing, burglary, and arson. He burned
Speaker 1: down a house and he tells the judge, I was
Speaker 1: a miner that was expunge for my record. And Novak's like,
Speaker 1: you can't expunge a newspaper record, baby, and it's now
Speaker 1: it's Judge Lois Preston and she says she'll allow it.
Speaker 1: Casey's like, so you lied. He says, I can explain
Speaker 1: and tells them the story about how the house was
Speaker 1: in his neighborhood. It was abandoned and kids used to
Speaker 1: drink and do drugs there, and they also raped a
Speaker 1: little eleven year old girl there. So he broke in
Speaker 1: and set their clubhouse on fire so that they couldn't
Speaker 1: continue to hurt people. And they're like, you didn't go
Speaker 1: to the police, and he goes, I did go to
Speaker 1: the police, but they didn't believe me because the son
Speaker 1: of the police chief was the ring leader. That's very
Speaker 1: possible in a small town, you know. And he's in
Speaker 1: prison right now for raping three women. So I had
Speaker 1: to stop these guys. And uh oh, casey, this has
Speaker 1: backfired because now I feel like the jury is thinks
Speaker 1: this man is a full hero. So now it's closing statements.
Speaker 1: He's addressing the jury saying Novak has no evidence. She
Speaker 1: has a doctored photograph and a phone card that I
Speaker 1: bought to give away as an act of charity. And
Speaker 1: he doesn't blame Benson is stable for arresting him or
Speaker 1: Novak putting him on trial. They're just following orders, like sheep.
Speaker 1: We're all in danger of being sheep. Never questioning authority.
Speaker 1: If you are drinking when they say the name of
Speaker 1: this title of the episode, this episode will get you wasted.
Speaker 3: They do say.
Speaker 1: Authority many times. He tells them to think for themselves,
Speaker 1: don't be a sheep. Novak's like, what a pretty little speech.
Speaker 1: And he's really good at convincing people to do things.
Speaker 1: But our evidence proves he did this. He's impersonating an
Speaker 1: innocent man. Don't be fooled. You guys are smart. Well,
Speaker 1: the jury comes back and they are like, no, we
Speaker 1: don't want to be sheep, so he's not guilty. Merrett
Speaker 1: screams out thank you, and then he tries to hug
Speaker 1: Casey like it's the end of senior year, and Stabler's
Speaker 1: like back off, and He's like it's been fun, and
Speaker 1: then he leaves.
Speaker 3: Stabler.
Speaker 1: Benson and Novak look very bummed out that this guy
Speaker 1: has gotten away with it. So now we're at the
Speaker 1: precinct and the gang is watching Meryrett Rook on Scarborough Country,
Speaker 1: which is Joe Who Scarborough's like MSNBC show, and Stabler
Speaker 1: comes in late and he was up all night with
Speaker 1: the baby and he's like, Colic is a bitch. I'm like,
Speaker 1: that's the first and only night you've ever stayed up
Speaker 1: with the baby all night.
Speaker 3: But okay.
Speaker 1: Merrett Rook is on a morning Joe with a sheep
Speaker 1: that he has named Elliott.
Speaker 3: What an own? I love this.
Speaker 1: He says he thinks we have to start questioning authority
Speaker 1: and he has merch it's a little pin with like
Speaker 1: a no smoking sign going through a sheep, and Elliot's
Speaker 1: like turn it off. Benson says, let's go crash his party.
Speaker 1: So they go to this rally where he's you know
Speaker 1: they're holding a no sheep rally. I guess, and there's
Speaker 1: a guy on a megaphone, and before I even look
Speaker 1: up who it is, I know who it is. It's
Speaker 1: Moroka because I can remember him from the Daily Show.
Speaker 1: He has a very recognizable voice, and he's like, don't
Speaker 1: be sheep whatever. And suddenly everybody takes out pillows and
Speaker 1: they start a huge pillow fight. The feathers are everywhere.
Speaker 1: My allergies started flaring up just watching it. I had
Speaker 1: to fast forward. Munch is fully engaged in the pillow
Speaker 1: fight and loves it. This is his jam, to just
Speaker 1: pillow fight with a bunch of other centers in the precinct.
Speaker 1: Now Munch is fully defending Merit. He's on the Merit train.
Speaker 1: He's like, you've got him all wrong. He made the calls,
Speaker 1: but it was never about sex. It was about the
Speaker 1: danger of obedience. If you don't question authority, you lose
Speaker 1: your humanity. He doesn't condone what he did, but he
Speaker 1: gets where he's coming from. He spoke to Merit and
Speaker 1: he just wants people to wake up. And they're like
Speaker 1: with pillow fights, and he's like, well, we stopped Vietnam
Speaker 1: with sit.
Speaker 3: Ins and they're like, well, what war is Merrit fighting? Here?
Speaker 3: The battle against fast food?
Speaker 1: And he goes, well you should hear his tirade against
Speaker 1: managed care lives like, so he has a problem with
Speaker 1: his HMO, who doesn't. Munch explains this is the big
Speaker 1: reveal that Merrit's wife died in childbirth and the baby
Speaker 1: died too, And they're like, oh my god, was it
Speaker 1: medical malpractice? Why didn't he sue? And there's like, there's
Speaker 1: no lawsuit because they looked it up when they were
Speaker 1: taking him to court.
Speaker 3: He's never filed a suit.
Speaker 1: So this guy's not going to let the doctor who
Speaker 1: killed his whole family get off the hook. So now
Speaker 1: we cut to Saint Mark's Hospital where Frenchy from Greece
Speaker 1: Akaddy Khn, who has been on three other episodes of
Speaker 1: the show, says, oh, doctor Slifkin, he's dead. He was
Speaker 1: in a freaky car accident a couple years ago. He
Speaker 1: t boned a semi and it decapitated him. She thinks
Speaker 1: he was drunk, but the official word was break failure.
Speaker 1: She remembers Juliette Rook so sad eighteen hours of heavy labor.
Speaker 1: The husband insisted on a c section, but the doctor
Speaker 1: thought he knew better than a first time dad. Juliette
Speaker 1: had a placental abruption. Doctor Slifkin missed it, so mister
Speaker 1: Rooke lost it understandably and said he'd kill the doctor,
Speaker 1: and security had to escort him out. So they go
Speaker 1: to Melinda's house and she's reviewed the autopsy and says
Speaker 1: that his blood alcohol was point four, which is tipsy
Speaker 1: but not over the limit, and also his liver was serotic,
Speaker 1: so he was an alcoholic, so one to two drinks
Speaker 1: and like a point oh four would.
Speaker 3: Not have done much to someone like that.
Speaker 1: U and o'haleran is there too, and he goes and
Speaker 1: there's no sign of tampering with the car. The investigation
Speaker 1: was pretty thorough. He sped through an intersection and thought
Speaker 1: he could beat the truck. But then why would they
Speaker 1: say was break failure? You can tell breaks work or not,
Speaker 1: So that's a fuck up to me. But Melinda says
Speaker 1: she sees a lot of suspicious mvas.
Speaker 3: I looked it up. I think it's multiple vehicle accidents
Speaker 3: or something, and she checked and the insurance company never
Speaker 3: paid out for this, so what's up? So the insurance
Speaker 3: company said it was suicide because he left a note
Speaker 3: for his wife saying he was taking his own life
Speaker 3: to spare her. Detective Milgrum won't stop calling me, says
Speaker 3: the note, he says, I'm going to prison for murder.
Speaker 3: I never meant to harm that woman and her baby.
Speaker 3: God forgive me.
Speaker 1: So Merritt drove this doctor to suicide, is what they're positing.
Speaker 1: They just need to link the calls to Merit and
Speaker 1: they've got him, and O'Halloran says, well, he won't be
Speaker 1: at home. There's another event for his social revolution happening
Speaker 1: at ten pm at Grand Central station. So they hurry
Speaker 1: down to Grand Central, which I think Grand Central is
Speaker 1: one of the most beautiful buildings. I love when they
Speaker 1: shoot there. I just love to see it. They hurry
Speaker 1: down there, everything looks normal. They start to look around
Speaker 1: and then they see Moroka again with his megaphone and
Speaker 1: he's chanting no sheep, no sheep, and then he blows
Speaker 1: a whistle and like half the people on the concourse
Speaker 1: freeze and they're totally frozen, like people are frozen mid yogurt.
Speaker 1: They're frozen midstride, like everybody's frozen. This is some kind
Speaker 1: of flash mob thing to prove that people are sheep.
Speaker 3: I don't know Merritt is there. They spot him.
Speaker 1: He's also frozen, and Benson's like, you're under arrest for
Speaker 1: the murder of doctor Francis Slifkin, and you're not walking
Speaker 1: away this time. He goes, I was a sheep and
Speaker 1: I let him slaughter my wife, and Benson says, that
Speaker 1: doesn't give you the right to destroy his life. Benson
Speaker 1: grabs his arm and suddenly we see Stabler jogging through
Speaker 1: the crowd.
Speaker 3: And he loses them.
Speaker 1: It's a weird transition because you just see what Live
Speaker 1: walk a right way with a suspect, which we've seen
Speaker 1: her do a thousand times, but now suddenly Stabler thinks
Speaker 1: something's weird because he can't find them. Next thing we
Speaker 1: see is Esu busting into Merritt Rook's apartment yelling police
Speaker 1: search warrant, but they're not there.
Speaker 3: Where did he take her?
Speaker 1: So we're just deducing that Merrittrook has kidnapped Lived somehow.
Speaker 3: Suddenly Lake there.
Speaker 1: They let him be in two scenes of this episode,
Speaker 1: and he's got photos of them from Grand Central, and
Speaker 1: Live is walking alongside Merrit, not resisting. In the next
Speaker 1: picture she's dumping her cell phone and her gun in
Speaker 1: a garbage and now Finn's got those things and Craigan says,
Speaker 1: have Terru look at it in case anything's on Olivia's phone.
Speaker 1: Elliott says he must have had a gun on her
Speaker 1: and she didn't want to risk shooting civilians.
Speaker 3: And Merritt.
Speaker 1: Does Merritt have a second home? Does he have friends
Speaker 1: or family close with anyone?
Speaker 3: At work?
Speaker 1: And in the apartment they see a picture of him
Speaker 1: with doctor Cheng, who we met earlier, and he was
Speaker 1: worried she would find out about him and the sex worker,
Speaker 1: but why would she care? So maybe there's something more
Speaker 1: between them. Now we cut the stabler talking to doctor Cheg.
Speaker 1: She admits that she went out at a date with Merritt
Speaker 1: years ago. Halfway through their date at a jazz club,
Speaker 1: a certain song came on and Merritt started sobbing. He
Speaker 1: didn't say why, he just ran out and left her there.
Speaker 1: And then the pianist that they were there to see said, oh,
Speaker 1: I forgot that I recorded that song with Merritt's wife.
Speaker 1: She was a singer. They met when he produced one
Speaker 1: of her albums, and they're like, understandably how did he
Speaker 1: go from music to aerospace? And I guess he quit
Speaker 1: music after his wife died. And audio engineering is the
Speaker 1: same wherever you do it. So she tells them that
Speaker 1: his old studio where he used to produce music was
Speaker 1: at Toned Down Records in Brooklyn. So Elliott heads there
Speaker 1: by himself. Of course, why would you bring back up?
Speaker 1: It's basically abandoned. He sees Merritt in a chair facing away.
Speaker 1: When he enters the room, Merritt spins around like a
Speaker 1: cartoon villain, and he goes, Oh, didn't think you'd make
Speaker 1: it here so quick, And he says I'm unarmed, and
Speaker 1: Elliot's like, get your hands up in the air. And
Speaker 1: he's like, yes, sir, where's my partner? And he goes
Speaker 1: when you like to know? And he's like, no more games,
Speaker 1: and he goes, or what you'll shoot me then you'll
Speaker 1: never find her. So Stabler's like, you got me there,
Speaker 1: lowers his gun. He turns on the light in the booth.
Speaker 1: He's basically in like a music recording room where you
Speaker 1: see people. You know, there's somebody in the sound booth
Speaker 1: and somebody at the boards and lives in the sound booth.
Speaker 1: She's strapped to a chair behind one way glass. She
Speaker 1: can't see or hear anything that's going on behind the
Speaker 1: door because like stablers obviously like live and she can't
Speaker 1: hear anything. He says the door is wired with an
Speaker 1: explosive and if he opens it, they'll all blow up.
Speaker 1: And he's holding the detonator in his hand, and he
Speaker 1: wants to do a little experiment. How far will you
Speaker 1: go to save your partner? He tells Olivia over a
Speaker 1: mic that Elliott is there, and liv goes, just do
Speaker 1: what he says, el and Elliott screams her name, and
Speaker 1: Merritt's like, look, I'm in charge. Now, sit your huge
Speaker 1: ass down and listen to me. And he's like not
Speaker 1: being mister Charming anymore. He explains that Olivia is sitting
Speaker 1: in a chair that's wired for electricity two hundred and
Speaker 1: fifty volts, controlled by a little buzzer. Old Sparky the
Speaker 1: famous electric Chair gives out ten times that so this
Speaker 1: electric shock won't kill her, but it will hurt, and
Speaker 1: so Elliott goes, oh the Milgrim experiment, only this time
Speaker 1: the shock's for real. He turns off the lights on
Speaker 1: Olivia and then presses the button, and we hear Olivia
Speaker 1: screaming in pain, and he tells sable to press the button,
Speaker 1: but he won't do it, and so then he presses
Speaker 1: it again.
Speaker 3: We hear another Olivia scream. He says that was two seconds.
Speaker 1: Keep refusing and I'll up it to four seconds and
Speaker 1: then I'll double the voltage. And he's like, why are
Speaker 1: you doing this? And he goes to teach you a
Speaker 1: little lesson about power and authority.
Speaker 3: Drink again.
Speaker 1: You cops with your guns and your badges, think you
Speaker 1: can do anything. You own the streets, and Elliott goes,
Speaker 1: I've never abused my authority. Drink again, but also drink
Speaker 1: another time for Elliot saying he's never abused his authority,
Speaker 1: which is hilarious. Marrett's like, uh, you all do. And
Speaker 1: he's not wrong. I mean, every single cop abuses their
Speaker 1: authority in some way, even if you're like fixing a
Speaker 1: parking ticket for someone. But Elliott realizes that this is
Speaker 1: about the cops in his town who didn't believe him
Speaker 1: about the rape of the little girl and he was
Speaker 1: too scared to stand up to them. What about Slifkin?
Speaker 1: You scared of him too. This isn't about obedience or sheep.
Speaker 1: You just want me to suffer like you have, and
Speaker 1: he goes, you have no idea how I've suffered, and
Speaker 1: he's really good. Elliott goes, I have no idea what
Speaker 1: you've been through to lose your family. He goes, I
Speaker 1: didn't lose them. They were taken from me. And he goes,
Speaker 1: I didn't challenge the doctor's authority. Again, drink. He goes,
Speaker 1: I caved in. I sat there and I held my
Speaker 1: wife's hand and I watched her bleed to death. And
Speaker 1: he's getting upset. He's crying. It's really sad. He goes,
Speaker 1: I put my faith in a little guy in a
Speaker 1: white coat, and he killed my wife and son. Push
Speaker 1: the button, he screams to Elliott, and then he pushes it,
Speaker 1: and we hear live scream again, and he yells again,
Speaker 1: and he keeps telling Elliot's push the button. And Elliott goes, no,
Speaker 1: too many people have suffered already, and he goes, then, you, Elliott.
Speaker 3: Are a human being. Congratulations. You're not a sheep like
Speaker 3: I was. You're a man. Thank you.
Speaker 1: Then he flips the light on and says, don't worry
Speaker 1: about your partner, and he hits the button again and
Speaker 1: we hear the scream, but Live is fine and just
Speaker 1: looking around confused because he says the screams were pre recorded.
Speaker 1: He brought Live into a sound booth and said, scream
Speaker 1: your heart out, baby.
Speaker 3: She did.
Speaker 1: And this thing he's holding in his hand is just
Speaker 1: a garage door opener. Referring to the detonator. He says
Speaker 1: the door's not wired either. So Elliot cuffs him and
Speaker 1: he goes to release Olivia. It was all fake. He
Speaker 1: faked it. Lives like, what the hell? They're taking him
Speaker 1: out of the studio to bring him in, and he goes,
Speaker 1: can I tie my shoe? And these guys should know
Speaker 1: that they should tie the purp shoes for them.
Speaker 3: They don't, don't fall for this shit.
Speaker 1: He bends down to tie his shoe and he has
Speaker 1: a detonator in his side. He blows the whole studio up.
Speaker 1: Benson and Stabler hit the ground somehow, Merritt's Fine takes
Speaker 1: off running. He goes through some hedges. He's cuffed the
Speaker 1: whole time, by the way. He goes through some hedges
Speaker 1: onto an abandoned playground. They lose him. They lose him
Speaker 1: like they're pretty fast at running. It's so crazy. There's
Speaker 1: a huge pond, but there's no sign of him. So
Speaker 1: a liv goes, if he went into that watercuffed, he's dead,
Speaker 1: but it's like it takes longer than thirty seconds to drown,
Speaker 1: like and there's not even a ripple in the water.
Speaker 3: So they just like walk away and call it a day.
Speaker 1: They're like, it's almost like they wanted him to get away,
Speaker 1: like they feel like he didn't really maybe do anything
Speaker 1: that bad.
Speaker 3: I don't know. And that's the end of the episode.
Speaker 3: That's dick Wolf.
Speaker 1: And I was just shocked at how this ended, like
Speaker 1: they just let him run away.
Speaker 2: The thing is, I want him to get away too,
Speaker 2: but I think they think he did something wrong, and
Speaker 2: so do I.
Speaker 3: But I still am like.
Speaker 2: Get out of here, Yeah, get out of here, mister rook.
Speaker 3: I think, yeah, But.
Speaker 2: Well, stay tuned, and this is so close to a
Speaker 2: real life situation, so buckle up, guys, don't be sheep.
Speaker 3: But by are things that we're going to advertise to.
Speaker 2: Okay, So this case is David Richard Stewart and this
Speaker 2: guy he's like thirty eight years old, married five kids,
Speaker 2: and this is the guy who's making all these calls. Right,
Speaker 2: So there were a series of fraudulent folle calls made
Speaker 2: to a number of restaurants and small businesses. And the
Speaker 2: calls began in nineteen ninety four and lasted for ten years.
Speaker 2: But we didn't really piece anything together till two thousand
Speaker 2: and four and then worked backwards, and so he really
Speaker 2: was getting away with this from coast to coast for
Speaker 2: a decade. He would call claim to be a police
Speaker 2: officer and then would convince employees to operate strip searches
Speaker 2: and perform humiliating acts. So there were seventy phone calls
Speaker 2: reported across thirty states. And the big case that kind
Speaker 2: of blew this all open, it's the McDonald's case. On
Speaker 2: April ninth, two thousand and four, an eighteen year old
Speaker 2: in Mount Washington, Kentucky, who was an employee of the McDonald's, Louise,
Speaker 2: Am I saying it.
Speaker 3: Right, Louise.
Speaker 2: It is Louise Yay named Louise Ogborn, and she was
Speaker 2: working the evening shift when the assistant manager, Donna Summers, and.
Speaker 3: Then sad to read a few times. I had to
Speaker 3: read it a few times. I was confused.
Speaker 2: So good, but so so The assistant manager Donna Summers
Speaker 2: called her into her office and she's like, hey, I'm
Speaker 2: on the phone with the police officer and he said
Speaker 2: that you match a description actually of someone who stole
Speaker 2: a purse from a customer. And Summers gave an option.
Speaker 2: She goes, listen, Ogborn, you submit to a search here,
Speaker 2: or you get escorted to a police station. Then she
Speaker 2: was directed on the phone to demand Ogborn to remove
Speaker 2: all of her clothing and then okay. So then so
Speaker 2: she's going through it and it takes a really long time,
Speaker 2: and this girl gets fully naked. She's sitting with an apron.
Speaker 2: It's very much from this Oh my god. And so
Speaker 2: basically this is all on camera. So there's a camera
Speaker 2: in the office, so this whole attack, everything is fully
Speaker 2: on camera. The detective. So there's a there's a couple
Speaker 2: documentaries about this, and I watched the one on Netflix
Speaker 2: and like the detective watching the video started tearing up.
Speaker 3: He was like crying. I mean it.
Speaker 2: Really like fucked people up. The video is pretty fucked up.
Speaker 2: So you know, she's naked whatever, she's holding her all
Speaker 2: these tests, but then she has to get back to work, right,
Speaker 2: She's like, I got to get back to the road.
Speaker 2: So the police officer on the phone is like, well,
Speaker 2: do you have any men that you trust?
Speaker 3: Like can you call a man that you trust?
Speaker 2: And so she brought She's like, I have a fiance,
Speaker 2: you know, Walter Nicks, so.
Speaker 3: Wild thing.
Speaker 2: The police are like, bring him over to monitor her,
Speaker 2: and this woman calls the fiance. She gets back to
Speaker 2: work and then the guy takes over he's and then
Speaker 2: it gets fucked. So he makes her do jumping jack
Speaker 2: snaked jogging in place, stand on a chair, and it
Speaker 2: kept going.
Speaker 3: This is a three hour ordeal.
Speaker 2: She was kept trapped in this McDonald's little office for
Speaker 2: three hours. And it is like, at what point would
Speaker 2: it not hit you like this is weird. Yeah, there's
Speaker 2: no way the cops would want me to have a
Speaker 2: young teen naked do jumping jacks, Like what the fuck?
Speaker 3: And at one.
Speaker 2: Point he he's spanking her naked ass like bent over
Speaker 2: his knee, and then he forced her to perform oral
Speaker 2: sexual act.
Speaker 3: The cop told him to do that or he decided
Speaker 3: to take that on for himself. Now the call, it
Speaker 3: was like the truly the directions, this is horrific. As
Speaker 3: for you watered it down like as you watered it down.
Speaker 1: It was only thirty minutes, and it was like and
Speaker 1: it didn't it was like it was just it was
Speaker 1: like more groping.
Speaker 3: This is horrible. He just wanted to test how far
Speaker 3: he could go.
Speaker 2: And what people say is that he never raised his voice,
Speaker 2: never aggressive, just cool, calm, collective, authoritative And that's that. Yes,
Speaker 2: I said authoritative. You can drink if you want.
Speaker 3: I don't know.
Speaker 2: It's not perfect. But and she was, you know, yeah,
Speaker 2: crying the whole time he hit and beat her. I
Speaker 2: mean it was awful, and all on camera. So the
Speaker 2: authorities are watching the tapes going what the fuck is
Speaker 2: going on? There is no sound, you know, they're just
Speaker 2: like watching this. The receivers of the call would eventually
Speaker 2: finally catch on and then they're the ones who reported
Speaker 2: the call, so like that, so suddenly it like hit
Speaker 2: them and like, wait, I think it's a hoax, you know,
Speaker 2: but always too fucking late, too fucking late. And then
Speaker 2: once it hit Walter what he'd done, he starts running,
Speaker 2: but they arrest him and then the detective on the
Speaker 2: scene is named Buddy Stump, which that's pretty cool. And
Speaker 2: the detective you know, finally sits down to take the
Speaker 2: victim statement, and he realizes he knows her.
Speaker 3: It's his neighbor. Oh and he's known her dad since
Speaker 3: they were kids.
Speaker 2: So he's he got activated. He's like, I'm gonna fucking
Speaker 2: get this motherfucker. I don't care if it's the last
Speaker 2: thing I do. So, you know, he starts doing red
Speaker 2: rope on a map. There's a lot of red rope
Speaker 2: safety pins, not safety pushpins. You know, he starts grouping
Speaker 2: this and finding more and more, and he realized again
Speaker 2: like a decade of calls, and they're all coming out
Speaker 2: of well he didn't find it right away, so they're
Speaker 2: all coming out of Panama City, baby, but at first
Speaker 2: we don't know. So basically, like a supermarket payphone with
Speaker 2: an AT and T calling card is what is fueling
Speaker 2: these calls. And you know, he found tons of them
Speaker 2: across everywhere and they're like bad. So one in Georgia,
Speaker 2: the caller convinced the janitor to perform a cavity search
Speaker 2: and a nineteen year old cashier and that was quoted
Speaker 2: to ABC News by the Sun and then Bert like
Speaker 2: a Burger King's trip search for seventeen year old employee
Speaker 2: and Fargo Taco Bell in Phoenix and on and on,
Speaker 2: and it's all young teens and he would call in
Speaker 2: with like a vague like or it would be payphones
Speaker 2: outside of the place so he would see the people,
Speaker 2: but he would just be like, oh.
Speaker 3: Yeah, we have a suspect.
Speaker 2: It's a young girl, brunette, like pretty vague, and there's
Speaker 2: always someone that kind of fitted.
Speaker 3: But it was always teen girls. Yeah, that's what I
Speaker 3: was going to ask.
Speaker 1: I was like, if it's across thirty states, does this
Speaker 1: guy go and so he can find the victims or
Speaker 1: does he.
Speaker 3: Just like like you said, he just plays it wow vague.
Speaker 2: It's really hard and the evidence is there's no it's
Speaker 2: really a tough case because it's clearly hit.
Speaker 3: So this is tough.
Speaker 2: But basically it is a big monster case and it's
Speaker 2: all on this one small town officer and it's like,
Speaker 2: why is anyone not helping him, the FBI or other
Speaker 2: cities or organization, Like, no one had his back. He's
Speaker 2: just like this batman, this hillbilly batman who has to
Speaker 2: take down this this this guy who they can't trap.
Speaker 2: And so then for Wendy's in Massachusetts get hit. And
Speaker 2: there was another cop in Massachusetts, and he's so massive,
Speaker 2: he's very boss, and he's he gets hopped, he gets
Speaker 2: hopped up, he gets activated. And what's cool is like
Speaker 2: part of the evidence is someone Star sixty nine, which
Speaker 2: is kind of thrilling, and like that gave.
Speaker 3: Him an my god, star six nine. I know, but
Speaker 3: it's it is, it's pretty, it's it's wild. Okay.
Speaker 2: So then they figure out that it's prepaid calling cards
Speaker 2: like Robin Williams, and so it means that means it's
Speaker 2: an out of state person. And because long distance phone
Speaker 2: calls are expensive and these are really long calls, so
Speaker 2: they're like, this is out of state people prepaid calling cards.
Speaker 2: But also the calling cards can't be tracked to an
Speaker 2: OG phone number. But the Massachusetts man wouldn't stop pushing,
Speaker 2: and he's like, you know, I'm gonna keep calling.
Speaker 3: I'm gonna keep calling.
Speaker 2: And finally this woman on the other line helps him
Speaker 2: get some information, calls him back and says, listen, post
Speaker 2: nine to eleven, we can actually give you the OG
Speaker 2: numbers associated.
Speaker 3: But we just can't have the public knowing this information.
Speaker 2: So so they get the info and they realize these
Speaker 2: calls for a decade are all coming out of Panama City,
Speaker 2: Panama City, Florida.
Speaker 3: Okay.
Speaker 2: To me, it's like it sounds like nothing good happens
Speaker 2: in Panama I know, right, like.
Speaker 1: This, I've never heard like amazing, amazing hero thing happened
Speaker 1: in Panama City, Florida.
Speaker 3: To me, it's just like neon and date rape, Like
Speaker 3: I don't know.
Speaker 1: No, if you're from Panama City, please message us and
Speaker 1: let it know what's good.
Speaker 3: I let us know.
Speaker 2: Maybe there is a manatee, you know, a sweet little ye.
Speaker 2: So yeah, supermarket payphones with AT and T calling cards.
Speaker 2: And then when they reach Panama City, they're like, yeah,
Speaker 2: we've actually heard of him, thank you. So they pump
Speaker 2: it into overdrive and try to catch this motherfucker. And
Speaker 2: so they're like, yeah, we fucking know who this guy is.
Speaker 2: And it's an almost identicalm o to like everywhere. Even
Speaker 2: the name of like the fake cop, it's Officer Scott always.
Speaker 2: And this obviously became huge news and it was a
Speaker 2: giant case because this is ludicrous, like who has ever
Speaker 2: heard of like it is a wild So there's so
Speaker 2: but they they still haven't found him. So the news
Speaker 2: hits that this is existing and then they have footage
Speaker 2: from Walmart, and they finally see this motherfucker walking in
Speaker 2: and he's wearing a pant that like only cops have,
Speaker 2: so it's like braided on the side. And obviously the
Speaker 2: cop realized the pant and was like, fuck that pant
Speaker 2: is this motherfucker's a cop. So they finally, like after
Speaker 2: a long chase, finally get him on the Walmart camera.
Speaker 2: They go to police departments and they're like, we don't
Speaker 2: know this motherfucker. That's not a cop pant. That's a
Speaker 2: correction officer pant. And so then they start hitting up
Speaker 2: all the prisons in Florida and he's yeah, and he's
Speaker 2: a prison guard for the Corrections Corporation of America.
Speaker 3: And that is so fucked up.
Speaker 1: You're already in a position where you tell people what
Speaker 1: to do all the time, where you're like in control
Speaker 1: of people, but it's not enough for you. You have
Speaker 1: to like call and make sure people get assaulted.
Speaker 3: That is beyond fucked Oh wow, I haven't seen you
Speaker 3: like this.
Speaker 1: I just feel like if he was a guy, if
Speaker 1: he was a truck driver, I'd be like, Okay, you're
Speaker 1: like a board psycho.
Speaker 3: But that is like crazy. You already are a person,
Speaker 3: you know.
Speaker 1: What I mean, Like, yeah, you're already in control of
Speaker 1: people and probably abusing your authority there as well. And now,
Speaker 1: oh my god, okay, go on. Well, the thing is
Speaker 1: he's a cop lover.
Speaker 2: He wanted to be a cop and he obviously failed,
Speaker 2: Like he went to the police academy and it did
Speaker 2: not work out for him. In his trailer they found guns,
Speaker 2: police paraphernalia, training manuals. He volunteered as a deputy, like
Speaker 2: he loved police. He was obsessed with police shit, never good,
Speaker 2: never good, you know, like your daughter Rosie Paw patrol.
Speaker 3: This is what happens. Yeah, it's waning, it's waning. Trust me.
Speaker 1: She's excited for the new movie it's coming out soon.
Speaker 1: But after that I think she's really she barely asks
Speaker 1: for it anymore. But the new movie obviously caught her eye.
Speaker 3: Yeah, I would see it.
Speaker 2: So David Richard Stewart gets arrested June thirtieth, two thousand
Speaker 2: and four, and he's playing cooy.
Speaker 3: I don't know, I don't know.
Speaker 2: And then finally when the Boston cops like the calls,
Speaker 2: he starts to sweat, he shakes a little, and what
Speaker 2: the cop says that he said was he asks, was
Speaker 2: anybody hurt?
Speaker 3: Duh?
Speaker 2: You fucking listened in? And then he said, thank god
Speaker 2: it's over. But then he pleads the fifth. He's not
Speaker 2: like a full assay. He's obviously like smart, you know,
Speaker 2: and he not smart enough to be a so pretty
Speaker 2: dumb but smart for dumb, I don't know. So he
Speaker 2: was charged with impersonating a police officer and solicitation of sodomy.
Speaker 2: And then October thirty first, two thousand and six. It
Speaker 2: reads like a title card on SVU. It is Halloween.
Speaker 2: There are no spider webs anywhere, and it's a sad
Speaker 2: day because he is acquitted of all charges. What he's
Speaker 2: acquitted of all charges from the case. The jury only
Speaker 2: deliberate an hour and forty minutes. He was facing fifteen years,
Speaker 2: which I think sounds fair. But the jury said there
Speaker 2: was a lack of evidence that he had placed the calls.
Speaker 2: The jurors got a lot of circumstantial evidence. There was
Speaker 2: a circumstantial case, but it just wasn't enough. There were
Speaker 2: no witnesses to identify him being on the payphones. There
Speaker 2: was no voice recordings. There was just like fuzzy photos
Speaker 2: of a man buying calling cards, and the calling cards
Speaker 2: were found in his home that were attached to other
Speaker 2: incidents in different states. So I wonder if, like they
Speaker 2: weren't able to tie the other calls or what like
Speaker 2: if a calling card that was used to call the
Speaker 2: other stores were found in your house.
Speaker 3: I don't know how that's not enough evidence. Yeah, I
Speaker 3: also don't know how to celebate it. Thank god, it's over.
Speaker 3: Not like a type of confession, right, Yeah, Like he
Speaker 3: hired an amazing defense attorney. I can tell you that
Speaker 3: much this guy.
Speaker 2: Yeah, he hired an amazing attorney.
Speaker 3: But it's confusing.
Speaker 2: Yeah, that little confession having the calling card in the home.
Speaker 3: I don't know.
Speaker 2: But but since all this, the phone calls have stopped.
Speaker 3: No one.
Speaker 2: That's never happened ever again, like nothing has ever been reported,
Speaker 2: so like nothing, you know, maybe something secret, but like
Speaker 2: nothing has happened since he got caught. And basically, you know,
Speaker 2: the hot shot defense attorney is just like, you can't
Speaker 2: sexually assault someone over the phone in regards to the statue,
Speaker 2: So you just can't so and that you know, that's
Speaker 2: the defensive Jurney's like, where when I got the case,
Speaker 2: I just knew it wasn't him, because you can't sexually
Speaker 2: assault someone over the phone. In regards to the statue,
Speaker 2: I did say it again, nix then, but NIX. So
Speaker 2: this is the fiance. He pled guilty to sexual abuse
Speaker 2: and other crimes on February second, two thousand and six,
Speaker 2: and he's serving a five year prison sentence. Summers entered
Speaker 2: an alfred plea later that month to a misdemeanor charge
Speaker 2: of unlawful imprisonmentitment and was placed on probation. And I
Speaker 2: watched footage of her. You know, she's crying in court.
Speaker 2: She obviously feels pretty sickened by what she has done.
Speaker 1: I don't understand how he convinced this guy to get
Speaker 1: oral sex or to assault her basically, like in that way,
Speaker 1: I don't understand like what they're like, you like the
Speaker 1: reason for strip searching her. She might have the wallet,
Speaker 1: she might have put it up her butt whatever, But
Speaker 1: like why would you be like, Okay, now get her
Speaker 1: to suck your dick? Like that doesn't make any sense
Speaker 1: to me. Oh horrible, Okay.
Speaker 3: Go on.
Speaker 2: And what's also wild, but not because we've done this
Speaker 2: podcast for a while, is that like this was happening everywhere,
Speaker 2: and nobody cared enough to do anything about it. Basically,
Speaker 2: like teenage girls from coast to coast were fucking assaulted
Speaker 2: at work, traumatized for life. In the doc, you talk
Speaker 2: to these women and they're never the same, you know,
Speaker 2: like their lives are forever changed. They were fucking assaulted
Speaker 2: as teens. And then that was that. No one looked
Speaker 2: for the call, no one figured it out. Some people
Speaker 2: got in trying. I mean there's over seventy cases. I
Speaker 2: obviously can't like go through all of them, but like
Speaker 2: no one cared enough. Like I just don't understand where
Speaker 2: the FBI wasn't involved, were any sort of national organization
Speaker 2: like this just seems so.
Speaker 3: Wild.
Speaker 2: And the fact that like I didn't even know these
Speaker 2: docs came out, I just don't understand it. So in
Speaker 2: good news and this is reported by ABC the October
Speaker 2: two thousand and seven said that a jury and Bullet County, Kentucky,
Speaker 2: awarded Luis Ogborn five million dollars in punitive damages and
Speaker 2: one point one million in compensatory compense.
Speaker 3: I don't know damages and expenses. Did she get that then? McDonald?
Speaker 3: Do you think no?
Speaker 2: Because so that's another thing. Like the McDonald obviously were
Speaker 2: it's hard to be liable for it, and I guess,
Speaker 2: I guess in the manuals they claim. All I saw
Speaker 2: was that McDonald's claims that in the manuals there are
Speaker 2: written things against scams and not to be scammed.
Speaker 3: But I just how do you prep for this.
Speaker 2: This has never happened in the issue of anything, so
Speaker 2: like I don't believe it. But McDonald's can't be held
Speaker 2: liable at the end of the day, so I don't
Speaker 2: know if it But I don't Summers is are they rich?
Speaker 3: No, so maybe it was McDonald's. It wasn't said who
Speaker 3: gave the money.
Speaker 2: Yeah, but people try to sue the she was asking
Speaker 2: for two hundred mil. But like it would be per place,
Speaker 2: it's really difficult. I guess with the courts it was difficult.
Speaker 2: So but there was one case. It was a Hardy's
Speaker 2: employee named Alan, and he did the strip search of
Speaker 2: a young employee and then it hit him while what
Speaker 2: was happening, and so he left, walked out when he
Speaker 2: realized it was a hoax. And like also one of
Speaker 2: the cases there was just like a bystander who's like
Speaker 2: what the fuck's going on. The energy here is wrong,
Speaker 2: and the employees are like, something's happening in the office,
Speaker 2: and he, like fucking like a regular Samaritan, busted into
Speaker 2: the office and saved one of the girls. Got on
Speaker 2: the phone and was like, you're not like got involved,
Speaker 2: and so like there's just there's probably.
Speaker 3: So many fucking stories.
Speaker 2: The other dog too, But so this one guy Alan,
Speaker 2: it hit him what he had done. He went home
Speaker 2: and then he went back the next day. The cops
Speaker 2: were there waiting for him, and he was charged with
Speaker 2: kidnapping and rape Jesus and so.
Speaker 3: Like his life fully changed.
Speaker 2: He was found not guilty, and it's like, I get it,
Speaker 2: he was listening in order, but he did do it.
Speaker 3: But the.
Speaker 2: Big piece of evidence was the girl kept being like
Speaker 2: cover the camera, cover the camera, and he goes, absolutely not,
Speaker 2: we are not covering the camera. And so his defense
Speaker 2: attorney was like, you know, criminals don't ask to be
Speaker 2: on camera, right, but you know, and he's crying and
Speaker 2: he's sorry. But it's also like I don't have any
Speaker 2: friends anymore and people stopped wanting to be around me,
Speaker 2: and I lost my family and it's like, well, yeah.
Speaker 3: Wait, that is what the Hardy's guy or Richard.
Speaker 2: Yeah, oh okay, heart is Richard Stewart's never said anything.
Speaker 3: He's been laying low. He's just like alive. Oh wow.
Speaker 1: I thought I thought maybe one of these docs would
Speaker 1: have gotten like to talk to him or something.
Speaker 2: But so, yeah, he was sad and sorry. But it's
Speaker 2: also terrible what this allan guy did. And even after
Speaker 2: all that, like they didn't go for the call person.
Speaker 2: No justice for so many of these victims. And if
Speaker 2: you want to know more information Netflix, it's called don't
Speaker 2: pick up the phone. And then Peacock it's pervert hunting
Speaker 2: the strip search callar.
Speaker 3: So I'm gonna watch that one next. And I remember
Speaker 3: this story in the news.
Speaker 1: I remember it and like hearing, Oh, it's like it
Speaker 1: was like a prank to strip search somebody. I don't
Speaker 1: think I realized how far the crime went. I don't
Speaker 1: think I really I thought it was like a strip
Speaker 1: search only, but I remember this when it came to.
Speaker 3: The age of the girls.
Speaker 1: Yeah, yeah, it's never like because the guy was never like,
Speaker 1: oh it's a you know, tall guy that he stole
Speaker 1: the wallet, go bring him into the bat, you know,
Speaker 1: like because that would never work. They had to like
Speaker 1: use victims that they could control.
Speaker 3: Oh horrible.
Speaker 2: Yeah, and it was usually like small towns, you know,
Speaker 2: like religious people, like authority in small towns is more.
Speaker 2: You're really taught to like listen to everyone and they're
Speaker 2: your neighbors.
Speaker 1: And I feel like Munch kind of had a point too,
Speaker 1: Like when you work at a fast food place in
Speaker 1: a small town or whatever, it is like, yeah, she's
Speaker 1: the assistant manager, I got a lit and everything she.
Speaker 3: Said, you know, like I gotta do it. So, yeah,
Speaker 3: you can't try that in a Brooklyn McDonald's. Yeah there.
Speaker 3: I bet he was not calling around the Burrows. Wow. Yeah.
Speaker 2: And then you know Karen the episode mentioned and it
Speaker 2: was like the you know, the detective mil Groom or whatever.
Speaker 2: So the Milgrim experiment on obedience to authority and what's
Speaker 2: funny is I get this in the Stanford prison experiment
Speaker 2: constantly confused. Yeah, me too, because both of them were
Speaker 2: ethical low points in research. And so both of these,
Speaker 2: both the prison and this Milgrim experiment changed like the
Speaker 2: APA style of what you can and can't do with
Speaker 2: subjects of testing and experiments.
Speaker 3: They really fucked with people here.
Speaker 2: Okay, So basically, the Stanley Milgram is a social Stanley
Speaker 2: Milgram is a social psychologist who researched the effect of
Speaker 2: authority on obedience and like, why do people obey when
Speaker 2: they field coursed? And this was a nineteen sixty one
Speaker 2: Yale University study, and he concluded that people obey either
Speaker 2: out of fear or out of desire to appear cooperative,
Speaker 2: and even when they're acting against their own better judgment
Speaker 2: and desires. And so he recruited subjects from all various
Speaker 2: walks of life. He put an ad in a paper
Speaker 2: and you were paid four dollars for one hour of
Speaker 2: your time. And over the next two years, hundreds of
Speaker 2: people showed up ready to be in the study. And
Speaker 2: the respondents were told the experiment would study the effects
Speaker 2: of punishment on learning ability. But all the people thought
Speaker 2: that they had an equal chance to be a teacher
Speaker 2: or student, but it was rigged and everyone played a teacher.
Speaker 2: So every single person that walked in to be a
Speaker 2: subject was a teacher, and all the students aka learners,
Speaker 2: were actors. So the learner was an actor and is
Speaker 2: a cohort And I kind of love that word of
Speaker 2: the experimenter and the teachers were told to administer increasing
Speaker 2: levels of electric shock to the learner when they answered
Speaker 2: a question wrong, but in reality, the only electric shock
Speaker 2: that was delivered was one single forty five volt shock
Speaker 2: to the teachers, so they knew how it felt, so
Speaker 2: they knew what they were doing, and so each teacher got.
Speaker 3: A little baby forty five volt shock.
Speaker 2: So they knew what was up and would understand what
Speaker 2: they're giving out. And the shock levels were labeled from
Speaker 2: fifteen to four hundred and fifty volts, and the actors
Speaker 2: so at seventy five volts they would grunt, they would
Speaker 2: complain at one twenty, asked to leave at one fifty
Speaker 2: plead with vigor was the words, then agonized screams at
Speaker 2: two eighty five, and then they were supposed to act desperate,
Speaker 2: yell loudly, complain of heart pain, and then finally at
Speaker 2: three hundred and thirty volts, the actor was instructed to
Speaker 2: go silent.
Speaker 3: Wow.
Speaker 2: Sixty five percent of the participants continued to give wild
Speaker 2: doses of electric shock, even though in all the video
Speaker 2: footage they didn't want to do it. It was all reluctant,
Speaker 2: like they wanted to stop. They're like the person made
Speaker 2: me do it. You know, someone would say the experiment
Speaker 2: requires that you continue, and someone's like, oh, I guess
Speaker 2: I have to. Some did back out early with like
Speaker 2: experimenters like pushing them and urging them, and those the
Speaker 2: experimenters were instructed to use force in different tools to
Speaker 2: also persuade people to do it.
Speaker 3: But some people backed out right away and was like
Speaker 3: fuck you.
Speaker 2: But the majority sixty five percent and these are like,
Speaker 2: we're willing to progress to the maximum voltage level even
Speaker 2: when they thought the learner was dead.
Speaker 3: My god, Like, there.
Speaker 2: Are people in this study who once they found out
Speaker 2: it wasn't real, we're like, oh, I'm so glad he
Speaker 2: wasn't He's not dead, but it's like you committed murder.
Speaker 2: And so the point of this whole thing is that
Speaker 2: the participants are seemingly good, average people, not evil. But
Speaker 2: they obeyed only under coersion, and one dude was like,
Speaker 2: I have to do it. I have to do it
Speaker 2: when he was told he needed to. And people were shocking,
Speaker 2: screaming people, and then finally they were debriefed, they were
Speaker 2: really relieved, and then there were groups of people out
Speaker 2: of that group. So the first group obeyed, but justify themselves.
Speaker 2: They're like, they gave up responsibility. It wasn't me, it
Speaker 2: was the experimenter. Then there were people that obeyed but
Speaker 2: blamed themselves. So these are the people that felt terrible
Speaker 2: what they had done. They were very hard on themselves,
Speaker 2: and then perhaps they'll be more likely to challenge authority
Speaker 2: in the future. And then there's the group that rebelled
Speaker 2: and they questioned authority of the experimenter and argued there
Speaker 2: was a greater ethical imperative calling for the protection of
Speaker 2: the students over the needs of the experiment. But these
Speaker 2: results can never be retested or recreated because of the
Speaker 2: ethical fucked upness of this study. So now the rules
Speaker 2: are like you you know, people have to know what
Speaker 2: they're getting into.
Speaker 3: You can't cause harm.
Speaker 2: And so you know, with decades of time, there's people
Speaker 2: that question it, there's new opinions about it, whatever, but
Speaker 2: at the end of the day, the findings can never
Speaker 2: be retested.
Speaker 3: This will stand alone.
Speaker 1: Oh my god, scary. You know what this reminded me
Speaker 1: of I wrote on this show the Stanford Prison Experiment,
Speaker 1: But also I wrote on this show called Magic for
Speaker 1: Humans that was like this magician guys show on Netflix,
Speaker 1: and I was in a writer's room with all magicians
Speaker 1: and they were like telling me so many interesting things
Speaker 1: about like how they they were telling me how a
Speaker 1: lot of like mentalists can get people to do hypnotism
Speaker 1: and stuff that they'll bring people into a room basically
Speaker 1: like a casting call, like the people don't know why
Speaker 1: they're there, and they'll have one person in the room
Speaker 1: who will just start like doing things like they'll let
Speaker 1: they'll a bell will go off and that person will
Speaker 1: stand up, and then the bell will go off and
Speaker 1: that person will stand will sit down, and after like
Speaker 1: a while, other people start following. And those are the
Speaker 1: people they eliminate. They're like these or no, those are
Speaker 1: the people they keep. If you don't follow those rules.
Speaker 1: If you're like I'm not going to stand up just
Speaker 1: because a bell is ringing, they kick you out because
Speaker 1: you're not open to suggestion, like you're not coercibles as
Speaker 1: much as other people. And that's how they find people
Speaker 1: to hypnotize on like television shows and stuff. They find
Speaker 1: people that are going to be the ones to follow
Speaker 1: like what someone else is doing, cause like it seems
Speaker 1: like they're just picking somebody out of a crowd. But
Speaker 1: when it's a crowd full of coercible people.
Speaker 3: It's interesting. Just reminded me of that. Yeah, it is
Speaker 3: like what would you do?
Speaker 1: I know, and I always like to think i'd be like,
Speaker 1: I'm not going to do I would never do that.
Speaker 1: But it's like maybe I don't. I mean, in the
Speaker 1: in the moment, I don't know.
Speaker 3: If the experimental is like it's fine, it's fine, keep going,
Speaker 3: I might be like, uh, oh, you know, I don't know.
Speaker 3: I don't think i'd go up to dead.
Speaker 2: It's this thing of like when I just stand in
Speaker 2: line for the bathroom and I want like I don't
Speaker 2: want to be a sheep, right, so I'll be like, did.
Speaker 3: You even check the door?
Speaker 2: To me, nothing is worse than when no one checks
Speaker 2: the door and you're just waiting in line and then
Speaker 2: you and you're like fuck all of you. But then
Speaker 2: if you're someone that thinks you're like then you go
Speaker 2: jingle the door and someone is in there and the
Speaker 2: person did check, and then you're just like humiliated. You're
Speaker 2: like an impatient loser. So it's like it's tough too.
Speaker 2: I don't know live life.
Speaker 1: Thank you for jamming for looking at all that up
Speaker 1: all that information.
Speaker 3: That was very interesting. I knew some of that story,
Speaker 3: but not all the details.
Speaker 1: And yeah, we'll just dive right into our post mortem
Speaker 1: because we don't have a guest today.
Speaker 2: Okay, So obviously this was one of our best episodes,
Speaker 2: can I say it? It was an incredible episode. Robin Williams.
Speaker 2: Obviously we did a full memoriam to him up top.
Speaker 2: But the crime is so fucked it. I talked to
Speaker 2: my sister's friend who's a lawyer, and it's just like,
Speaker 2: it's so messed up that these people had no justice
Speaker 2: because like obviously the managers, because it's like I don't
Speaker 2: want the managers to fully serve kidnapping terms like twenty
Speaker 2: five to life, but yeah, for them to fully serve
Speaker 2: no time is also fucked up.
Speaker 3: But if you say there at faults a little, then
Speaker 3: they're fully of fault.
Speaker 2: Like I get all of that, but they did abuse
Speaker 2: these people, but then to have the kingpin of it
Speaker 2: all get.
Speaker 3: Nothing, get nothing, it's insane.
Speaker 2: Even worse thinking about it more and more, and like
Speaker 2: it's like the fact that there was no intern, like
Speaker 2: no national or no FBI to get involved, like no.
Speaker 3: Like just that the construct I guess that's.
Speaker 2: That, like no one even tried to connect who the
Speaker 2: call was nothing like all dozens of victims with absolutely
Speaker 2: no justice, which is nothing new.
Speaker 3: It's just so upsetting.
Speaker 2: And the woman in the documentary just being like, you know,
Speaker 2: you're assaulted, your life changes, and some people it is
Speaker 2: forever cannot get what is it back to normal? Is
Speaker 2: that even a thing? Like it's just so heartbreaking that
Speaker 2: they get.
Speaker 1: No Like if somebody, if somebody like bullied somebody into
Speaker 1: committing a crime, if somebody was like just do it,
Speaker 1: just do it, just do it, like they would still
Speaker 1: get time. So I don't really get why somebody calling
Speaker 1: up and posing as somebody like you're still not exercising
Speaker 1: right and wrong. Like I don't really get why these
Speaker 1: people didn't get any punishment, you.
Speaker 2: Know, because like they don't even care about these women.
Speaker 2: They don't care, you know. The only real I mean,
Speaker 2: I think the detective that like that we met that
Speaker 2: I talked about, like you know, it was his neighbor's
Speaker 2: daughter and so we knew her her whole life. But
Speaker 2: if not, would he have gotten involved? Yeah, and not
Speaker 2: to bring you know what I just realized below Deck
Speaker 2: down Under did not have a reunion. Oh, bra wouldn't
Speaker 2: want to talk about it. Yeah, Ka chas Stain was
Speaker 2: just watch What Happens Live and they were playing like
Speaker 2: what would you do as a chief?
Speaker 3: Dude?
Speaker 2: Did this person do a good job? Didn't even bring
Speaker 2: it up? Like That's that's where Bravo does fail me.
Speaker 2: They really like they don't stand up until it's way
Speaker 2: too late. Yeah. Like, I just don't feel they're ever
Speaker 2: really ahead of the trend of like speaking out against
Speaker 2: anything very true, which is upsetting the opposite of Mrishkaarkitute
Speaker 2: also shout out, I don't even remember what time we
Speaker 2: were in what happened, but we did get gifted too
Speaker 2: Fearless Fearless necklaces.
Speaker 3: Not official but from like a story they were based
Speaker 3: off of. They were based on a true story.
Speaker 2: They were based I don't want you think people are
Speaker 2: showing up with seven hundred dollars gifts that you know
Speaker 2: that's not necessary.
Speaker 3: We do not expect anything at all.
Speaker 1: And also a shout out in Raleigh to the two
Speaker 1: listeners that showed up dressed as was it Rollin's and Malena.
Speaker 3: Yes, mortal enemy.
Speaker 1: Mortal Enemy is Melinda and Rollins, but it was their costumes.
Speaker 2: Were velo, so cute. There was a clipboard, there was
Speaker 2: a glove. I mean, they really like went for it
Speaker 2: in a way.
Speaker 1: Wait, come to our shows dressed up. No one will
Speaker 1: even look at you sideways. It's October. They'll assume you're
Speaker 1: going to a Halloween party. Come to our shows dressed up.
Speaker 3: We would love it. I love Halloween. We're gonna have fun. Wait.
Speaker 3: I just saw something some dynasty's doing.
Speaker 2: A death becomes her showing ooh, I know.
Speaker 1: I love that now a warning. Oh my god, I
Speaker 1: love death becomes.
Speaker 3: Her so much.
Speaker 2: Yeah, for those of you who are into Halloween but
Speaker 2: don't love like gory or horror, actual like scary. Death
Speaker 2: becomes her is like spooky, but comedy in a way
Speaker 2: that you would love.
Speaker 3: So we recommend that.
Speaker 2: And it's Goldiehan, Meryl Straight, Bruce Willis, Isabella Russellini.
Speaker 1: You can't get I mean, they don't make movies like
Speaker 1: this anymore. They simply don't. So you have to go
Speaker 1: watch it. I own it on DVD. I own a
Speaker 1: DVD I purchased. Jared got it for me a couple
Speaker 1: years ago because he's like, you need this.
Speaker 2: I was like, wait, let's see let's do a what's
Speaker 2: it called when you put it on the screen projector knight? Yeah, yeah,
Speaker 2: we totally can, we totally should.
Speaker 1: I wonder if I'm gonna get trigger treaters this year.
Speaker 1: I always get a few, but not a ton. All right,
Speaker 1: let's get into our what would Sister peg do? Our
Speaker 1: weekly segment where we, you know, direct you guys to
Speaker 1: a documentary, a blog post, an organization, something to give
Speaker 1: you more info about what we talked about this week.
Speaker 3: And we thought this week.
Speaker 1: It would be best to just have you go to
Speaker 1: the docuseries that Liza mentioned in her research.
Speaker 3: Don't pick up the phone. It's on Netflix if you
Speaker 3: want more.
Speaker 1: Information about these heinous crimes and this miscarriage of justice. Really,
Speaker 1: the documentary follows the investigation into the series of hoax
Speaker 1: phone calls that were quote unquote allegedly perpetrated by David
Speaker 1: Richard Stewart wouldn't want this prince of a man to
Speaker 1: sue us for saying that he actually committed any crimes.
Speaker 3: So if you want more info on that.
Speaker 1: Disturbing case, check out the doc and the We'll be
Speaker 1: posted in our stories when this episode releases, as well
Speaker 1: as Saved forever in our WWSPD highlight.
Speaker 2: Thank you so much for that, and next week another
Speaker 2: a episode appearances, Season four, episode nineteen, Get with it.
Speaker 3: We're obsessed with all of you.
Speaker 2: I hope to meet you at one of our live
Speaker 2: shows and tell a friend done done or not that
Speaker 2: made no sense, but have a great nay That's messed
Speaker 2: up as an exactly right production.
Speaker 1: If you have compliments you'd like to give us, or
Speaker 1: episodes you'd like us to cover, shoot us an email
Speaker 1: it That's Messed uppod at gmail dot com.
Speaker 2: Follow the podcast on Instagram at That's Messed Up Pod
Speaker 2: and on Twitter at messed Up Pod, and follow us
Speaker 2: personally at Karaklank and at glitter Cheese.
Speaker 1: As always, please see our show notes for sources and
Speaker 1: more information.
Speaker 2: Thank you so much to our producer Casey O'Brien and
Speaker 2: our associate producer Christina.
Speaker 1: Chamberlain, and to our mixer John Bradley and our guest
Speaker 1: booker Patrick Cottner, and to Henry Kaperski for our theme song,
Speaker 1: and Carly Geen Andrews for our artwork. Thank you to
Speaker 1: our executive producers Georgia hard Start, Karen Kilgarriff, Daniel Kramer,
Speaker 1: and everybody at exactly right media dun, dun,