Speaker 1: We have welcomed two new members of our family, Lucky
Speaker 1: and Pickle. We got cats, thank god.
Speaker 2: Because of those two new kids, I was gonna say,
Speaker 2: I'd like to work on their name twins, twins Lucky
Speaker 2: and Pickle.
Speaker 1: Oh no, we got so Lucky because they're just the best.
Speaker 1: And we have been talking about getting cats for actually
Speaker 1: a couple of years because Indy loves cats and we
Speaker 1: can't have a dog just because we travel so much,
Speaker 1: so cats were like the only option, and we've been
Speaker 1: talking about it, but every time we would like, you know,
Speaker 1: look into it, it was like you're just rolling the
Speaker 1: dice with cats personalities, you know. And I know this
Speaker 1: from my experience before where I got two cats and
Speaker 1: a little crazy and like then you're stuck with them
Speaker 1: forever or twenty years or whatever. So uh, this this
Speaker 1: time around, we had a friend happened to be like, oh,
Speaker 1: we've been fostering these two kittens and we know their
Speaker 1: personalities and they're amazing. And they'd already had them for
Speaker 1: like six weeks at that point, and then they're like
Speaker 1: a big cat household, you know, they've always had cats
Speaker 1: coming in and out. And they were like, you guys
Speaker 1: want to take them, and we did, and they've turned
Speaker 1: out great. How long was this It's been a couple
Speaker 1: of months now it's been like now they're getting big.
Speaker 1: They were so like little and now it's like, oh, oh,
Speaker 1: we have cats in the house.
Speaker 3: You know.
Speaker 4: They're like they used to like.
Speaker 1: Crawl into boxes, which was so cute. Now they're like
Speaker 1: crawl into boxes and knock them off just counter. It's
Speaker 1: like a little more. Yeah, but they're great.
Speaker 4: Are they indoor outdoor cats or just now keeping them indoor?
Speaker 3: Yeah?
Speaker 4: You know, we have a we have a yard, but
Speaker 4: we have possums and raccoons. Yeah, and coyotes.
Speaker 1: I see coyotes on the street, like on the sidewalk
Speaker 1: all the time, so I would just be terrified to
Speaker 1: let them out.
Speaker 5: No.
Speaker 6: Yeah, it's careful about the things on your counters, you do,
Speaker 6: you know. I shortly after Jensen and I started dating,
Speaker 6: I Jensen had concrete floors in the townhouse he was
Speaker 6: living in, and I walked in and put my cell
Speaker 6: phone down on the kitchen counter, and within ten minutes
Speaker 6: Bill swiped my phone. It landed on the concrete floor
Speaker 6: and shattered into a million pieces. It was like, right,
Speaker 6: anything you care about don't leave on any counters. Cats
Speaker 6: are little jerks. I love them to death, but they're
Speaker 6: little jerks. You are officially my friend who who just
Speaker 6: has secret pets?
Speaker 4: You Yeah, name was lived at your house. So now
Speaker 4: there you go.
Speaker 5: Just any other any other secrets.
Speaker 4: Yet not yet get into I'm ready.
Speaker 6: To right, not that you're ready to, fair enough.
Speaker 2: Now did they come with Lucky and pickle or did
Speaker 2: you stuck?
Speaker 1: She became pickles for some reason, miss pickles and pickles
Speaker 1: just sounded better at us than pickle, So it's Lucky
Speaker 1: and pickles, so we added the s. But other, Yeah,
Speaker 1: I thought those were great names. And we were like, oh,
Speaker 1: these great catneys are. Yeah, and they're so cute and
Speaker 1: they're they're not brother and sister, but they look exactly alike,
Speaker 1: like they have the same coloring, and you know, they're
Speaker 1: only a couple of weeks apart.
Speaker 4: At age, so that's so great.
Speaker 1: It's just it's so nice to have like kittens that
Speaker 1: like in the hold and that come around us when
Speaker 1: we were.
Speaker 4: On the couch and oh I missed the peer. Yeah,
Speaker 4: it's so fun. I love my dog, but I missed
Speaker 4: the Yeah.
Speaker 1: I mean, dogs are a lot It's funny because I
Speaker 1: used to you know, I grew up with dogs and
Speaker 1: always like a dog person. I had a dog before
Speaker 1: with my my ex girlfriend for a couple of years.
Speaker 4: But then when did you have a dog? I had
Speaker 4: a dog at Bernie's Mountain Dog, Georgia. You never met Georgia.
Speaker 4: Remember Georgia? Yes, I remember Georgia. She died at six.
Speaker 4: You know Bernie's Mountain dogs don't live longer. Bigger the
Speaker 4: dogger the dog. She was so great, so dumb, just
Speaker 4: the greatest, dumbest dog. I loved her so much. Anyway,
Speaker 4: what was I saying?
Speaker 5: You were a dog person?
Speaker 4: I was a person.
Speaker 1: But you know, after I had Indy, like when you
Speaker 1: have a baby and you deal with other people's dogs
Speaker 1: and suddenly other people are like not putting the dog
Speaker 1: on a leash or like in our neighborhood there's a
Speaker 1: lot of like people have dogs that are very loud
Speaker 1: and aggressive, like kind of a guard dog vibe, and like,
Speaker 1: just walking around with Indy, I started to just, you know,
Speaker 1: dislike dogs and'd be like, can you please put you more?
Speaker 4: Let me put it this way?
Speaker 1: Dislike dog owners, you know, it's like and so dog
Speaker 1: you know, and ever since then, I've just been like,
Speaker 1: I think, I don't know. As long as we have India,
Speaker 1: I don't know. I will probably never get a dog
Speaker 1: until maybe I'm older.
Speaker 5: Maybe like are much more similar.
Speaker 6: There's no animal that's ever close to actually what it's
Speaker 6: like to have a child. But dogs are a little
Speaker 6: more like children, even just in how high maintenance they are.
Speaker 5: Children are very high maintenance. Sh Okay, that's.
Speaker 4: Good until they mail your face off. But yeah, just
Speaker 4: but that's why, that's what babies do. Babies are very dangerous.
Speaker 6: And so after you have after you have children and
Speaker 6: you're looking to have a pet, the idea feels.
Speaker 5: Much more like am I ready to take on a dog?
Speaker 6: Whereas like cats still give you the love and affection
Speaker 6: assuming you don't have a cat, that's like, please do
Speaker 6: not come anywhere near me.
Speaker 2: Like that, we were just roommates who like would meet
Speaker 2: up once a month to talk about like, all right,
Speaker 2: you got the bills paid?
Speaker 4: Like I would walk in, she'd look at me. I'd
Speaker 4: look at her and be like, hey, hey, that was it.
Speaker 6: So very very affectionate. And he also will yes, he
Speaker 6: does love you.
Speaker 5: Bill.
Speaker 6: Also when we have people over, he can hear like.
Speaker 6: He usually hangs out in our room, but then he
Speaker 6: hears when people are over and he'll come downstairs to
Speaker 6: scope it out.
Speaker 5: Who's here? Hello? Do I like them? Do I want
Speaker 5: to hang out with them?
Speaker 6: He also is quite a hefty cat, although he's lost
Speaker 6: some weight since he had the clear yes, since he was.
Speaker 5: Nuclear radio radio.
Speaker 6: But he'll he hates to have his belly scratched. And
Speaker 6: but he rolls over and shows you his plump, squishy
Speaker 6: belly and you want to touch it, And then you
Speaker 6: go to touch. Yes, he lures you in with it.
Speaker 3: And then.
Speaker 5: I'm gonna I will mollel you anyway.
Speaker 6: I love cats. Well, congratulations on Lucky and Pickles. I
Speaker 6: look forward to cuddling the heck out of them the
Speaker 6: next time I'm over there. Loving Welcome to pod meets World.
Speaker 6: I'm Daniel Fischl, I'm right or strong, and I'm mister Pickles.
Speaker 6: I'm well for doubt you Commonly hear phrases like it's
Speaker 6: who you know or Nepo baby thrown around when it
Speaker 6: comes to show business.
Speaker 5: And if you take away one thing from.
Speaker 6: This podcast, it's that some child stars knew absolutely no
Speaker 6: one in the industry when they started out like us,
Speaker 6: and with today's guest, we hope you'll take away that
Speaker 6: some of the most successful working creatives currently in Hollywood
Speaker 6: all started somewhere, and that somewhere is sometimes the bottom.
Speaker 5: John D.
Speaker 6: Beck was a production assistant on Boy Meets World, a
Speaker 6: somewhat fancy term for a young jack of all trades
Speaker 6: who does just about everything they're told they are a
Speaker 6: crucial part of making a TV show, Often underestimated as
Speaker 6: an intern, but in truth working behind the scenes with
Speaker 6: various departments, working on things as tedious as a coffee order,
Speaker 6: but also becoming important cogs in the machine, ensuring everything
Speaker 6: is in place for tape day. If you have bad pas,
Speaker 6: absolutely everything could fall apart, trust us. Since his time
Speaker 6: collecting food orders and delivering scripts to our houses, he's
Speaker 6: gone on to become a big time executive producer and showrunner,
Speaker 6: working on according to Jim Fuller, House Side Hustle, That Girl, Leyley,
Speaker 6: and creating the very successful Disney sitcom Live in Maddie
Speaker 6: and Yes. One of his first jobs as a young
Speaker 6: man was on the Boy Meets World set, where we
Speaker 6: like to think watching us three youngungs take almost nothing
Speaker 6: serious gave him the knowledge and understanding of what not
Speaker 6: to take on his journey to the top. This week
Speaker 6: we hear from a new perspective that of a pa
Speaker 6: On boy meets world. Welcome to the show, John D.
Speaker 6: Beck H, It's so good.
Speaker 3: To see you. Fantastic to see you, guys.
Speaker 5: Oh my gosh, okay, well, thank you for joining us.
Speaker 7: Oh sure thing, thank you for me.
Speaker 5: I wanted to.
Speaker 6: Ask, how much cuckaroo do you think you picked up
Speaker 6: for the writer's room while you were a pa On?
Speaker 3: Do you have no idea how much cuckaroo? And as
Speaker 3: a matter of fact, I got in such trouble ones cuckoo.
Speaker 3: It was actually the one of the two moments I
Speaker 3: realized that show business was more business than show. Uh
Speaker 3: Bluckman and the guys over Cuckaroo and Mark Blums visiting.
Speaker 8: He said, make sure to get extra cuckaroo so we
Speaker 8: could take cuckaroo home.
Speaker 3: Get a lot of it. Well, I thought I was
Speaker 3: saying the day by getting a whole bunch of cuckaroo.
Speaker 3: And the accounts were like what you buy and like,
Speaker 3: am I really getting into trouble for buying too much?
Speaker 3: Chicken Shut TV show on ABC? So Yes, right right.
Speaker 6: I love that Blutman's like, listen, you got the company card,
Speaker 6: buy enough food for seventy five people, then we'll have
Speaker 6: leftovers for days, go home, and then you got in
Speaker 6: trouble for it.
Speaker 3: It works, Cuckaroo, get the home, get out the door.
Speaker 6: Does anyone want to explain to our dear listeners who
Speaker 6: may not know what cuckaroo is?
Speaker 5: It was a it was a chicken restaurant.
Speaker 2: It was an amazing chicken restaurant that apparently we were
Speaker 2: the only ones going to because the whole thing shut down,
Speaker 2: and it was like, how do you lose?
Speaker 4: Cuckaroo?
Speaker 3: Is just writer's rooms in Hollywood that loved Cuckaroo and
Speaker 3: what less sitcom rooms? Cuckaroo went out of business. Oh
Speaker 3: there's always a room for the Cuckaroo. And soup plantation
Speaker 3: are coming back.
Speaker 6: So really, soup plantation is going to be called sweet
Speaker 6: Tomatoes because that's what it's called on in one half
Speaker 6: of the country, and I think they're bringing a.
Speaker 5: Sweet tomabe brandy here.
Speaker 4: Yeah, maybe cocar.
Speaker 2: Row is coming back then, as they're going to change
Speaker 2: the names.
Speaker 1: Yeah, so many conversations about Cuckoo. I mean, it's kind
Speaker 1: of blonkers. I mean, I guess the reality is we're
Speaker 1: just always eating lunch together every day or you.
Speaker 4: Know, but the actors didn't order it that often. Did
Speaker 4: we even get lunch delivered every day? Or did we
Speaker 4: were on our own?
Speaker 6: We had a certain we had craft service certainly, and
Speaker 6: then we were definitely on our own once we could drive,
Speaker 6: because I.
Speaker 4: Remember going they did. I yeah, I remember, don't you.
Speaker 2: We would get the like we'd get the menus in
Speaker 2: the morning, we'd pick what we wanted, and then we
Speaker 2: get like the.
Speaker 4: Contest styrofoam containers with our name on it. It was
Speaker 4: like this is right, this is yeah. But I think
Speaker 4: after we were sixteen, Yeah, that was over.
Speaker 1: There was like, all right, good luck, have fun kid.
Speaker 6: Yeah exactly, We're not paying for your cuckaroo anymore.
Speaker 3: Okay, so lacious guys. You guys just keep finding ways
Speaker 3: to continue to reinvent yourself and be relevant and stick
Speaker 3: together as a group. And that's that's really really cool.
Speaker 3: That does not often happen in this business. And thank
Speaker 3: you something to see.
Speaker 5: So thank you.
Speaker 6: We're rather fond of each other. We can't seem to
Speaker 6: shake one another.
Speaker 2: And we're trying to hate each other. It just doesn't work.
Speaker 2: We don't know why.
Speaker 3: Looking at it, you'll eventually find something to hate you.
Speaker 5: Yeah, you know what, maybe at forty years. It's definitely
Speaker 5: hasn't happened after thirty, but maybe after forty he knows.
Speaker 6: So I know, Boy Meets World for you was just
Speaker 6: a stepping stone for what has become a long and
Speaker 6: prosperous career. But we were hoping we could start with
Speaker 6: how did you get the job on Boy Meets World?
Speaker 5: What season was it? How old were you? Tell us everything.
Speaker 7: I was just out of college.
Speaker 3: I went to Syracuse University and packed up all my
Speaker 3: stuff in my crappy Ford Tempo and drove out to
Speaker 3: Hollywood to make it big. It took me a couple
Speaker 3: of months to finally get an interview, got hired, and
Speaker 3: then on to this day, I think they might have
Speaker 3: hired the wrong person because.
Speaker 5: Was your first interview for Boy Meets World.
Speaker 3: I know I had won any interview before that, with
Speaker 3: family matters and a tie in a blazer and sitting
Speaker 3: down a guy by the name of Miles Christman who's
Speaker 3: eating a turkey sandwich with turkey flying out of his mouth,
Speaker 3: and and said, you know, we don't expect you to
Speaker 3: dress like that. I'm like, oh, I am definitely not
Speaker 3: getting this job because I look like somebody who doesn't
Speaker 3: know what the job is. Wow. Eventually ended up interviewing
Speaker 3: at Boy Meets World, was hired, and the very first
Speaker 3: run I had over to Michael Jacob's office, which was
Speaker 3: over at the Disney lot because were at the old
Speaker 3: KTLA lot that in season three, which is now the
Speaker 3: big fancy Netflix lot. Very first job or very first
Speaker 3: run I went over there. Somebody called on the phone
Speaker 3: while I happened to be there, and I just see
Speaker 3: a confused look on somebody's faces, like what are you
Speaker 3: talking about? Didn't didn't we just hire you? I'm like, oh,
Speaker 3: whoever that is? It's suppos to me. I'm getting out
Speaker 3: of here before they can fire me on day one.
Speaker 3: But so whatever happy.
Speaker 9: Accident happened, My gosh, So you think they'd like literally
Speaker 9: just called you and gave you the job, but they
Speaker 9: said they mixed message name.
Speaker 3: That seemed like a better story than it actually probably was.
Speaker 3: So that's so, how did you.
Speaker 6: Interview with We were over at KTLA, which means it
Speaker 6: must have been seasons.
Speaker 5: Three and three or four.
Speaker 6: Season three okay, season three, And do you remember who
Speaker 6: you interviewed with?
Speaker 3: Hearing Steve Lamar Okay Laar, Yeah, who I was like, Well,
Speaker 3: hold on a second, you worked on alf Oh my god,
Speaker 3: ever meet in my life?
Speaker 4: So I have a we often talk about now.
Speaker 2: When we were on the set, we were completely and
Speaker 2: totally essentially oblivious to all the work that was going
Speaker 2: on around us.
Speaker 4: We were completely you know.
Speaker 2: Into our own little tiny bubbles and in our worlds
Speaker 2: and where the actors and blow. So what is the
Speaker 2: normal day, the normal twenty nine hour day for a PA?
Speaker 6: What is it?
Speaker 3: You know?
Speaker 4: How? What's an average day like for a production system?
Speaker 2: Well, first of all, I guess we should start with
Speaker 2: what's the actual job description? Because it's such a catch
Speaker 2: all of being a production assistant? What were you at
Speaker 2: least told your job was going to be?
Speaker 3: I may be dating myself here, but do you remember
Speaker 3: the Muppet Show?
Speaker 2: Of course, of course Gopher, Yes, Gopher was a PA.
Speaker 7: Basically Gopher coffee.
Speaker 3: Go for this, Go for that, Go for this. Your
Speaker 3: Your job as a PA is to be available to
Speaker 3: do whatever anybody wants at any given moment, at any
Speaker 3: time during the day. It's very important that you have
Speaker 3: a car than you have a brain or any kind
Speaker 3: of skills. Stuff from here to there. This was pre internet,
Speaker 3: Like everything now is, here's the script. Let's send out
Speaker 3: the file. Like you would work working hours. You'd get
Speaker 3: there at eight nine o'clock with a big tray of
Speaker 3: bagels for Blutman and the writers, and you know, you
Speaker 3: take care of lunches, you take care of any errands
Speaker 3: it might be going on. You do use the copy,
Speaker 3: your NonStop and then you wait for run through which
Speaker 3: I didn't realize after run throughs and table reads that
Speaker 3: scripts are always massively rewritten after notes from the network.
Speaker 3: I assume the first big meeting where they're giving a
Speaker 3: bunch of notes, I'm like, oh my gosh, is this
Speaker 3: writer getting fired? Oh my god, what's going Yeah, everybody
Speaker 3: kind of gets in and talks about, you know, what
Speaker 3: jokes work and what jokes don't work, and then you
Speaker 3: sit and you wait for the writers to rewrite the scripts,
Speaker 3: and you get them their dinner, and then you wait
Speaker 3: and you wait and you wait for the script to
Speaker 3: come out. And that's really where the biggest party job,
Speaker 3: at least at the time, happened, because you would end
Speaker 3: up staying up all night copying two hundred and fifty
Speaker 3: three hundred scripts and then delivering them all around town
Speaker 3: and at the time, like we killed so many trees.
Speaker 8: Yep, because like people who were like, look, you knew
Speaker 8: that the head of the curtains department at Disney was
Speaker 8: not cracking the third rewrite of the Boynese World script
Speaker 8: right seven in the middle of the with the baby
Speaker 8: pig in it, Like the curtains department doesn't need this,
Speaker 8: but they have to get this, and they have to
Speaker 8: get it at.
Speaker 3: Two am or else if somebody does call them they said,
Speaker 3: well I didn't get the script. So you'd be out
Speaker 3: until two three in the morning most nights delivering these
Speaker 3: scripts and then going to sleep and waking up and
Speaker 3: starting the process all over again.
Speaker 5: So like five days a week.
Speaker 6: I mean, I know, like on tape days, maybe the
Speaker 6: schedule was a little bit later because that was for
Speaker 6: our Thursdays were tape night, so everybody came in a
Speaker 6: little later, but your hours were really like getting there
Speaker 6: at eight am and then working You're on the clock
Speaker 6: until like three am.
Speaker 7: You're on the.
Speaker 3: Clock until everything is delivered. Luckily, there was three of us.
Speaker 3: We had Carl Ellsworth and Mark Kooneerth are the other
Speaker 3: pas who were there with me. We were both very
Speaker 3: accomplished writers themselves. Yeah, and you you usually have somebody
Speaker 3: who was kind of staggered a little bit to the Okay,
Speaker 3: you're going to do these super late runs and you'll
Speaker 3: come in a little bit later.
Speaker 5: Okay.
Speaker 3: Yeah, that's just kind of what the job was. Then.
Speaker 5: So you mentioned some other pas. What was that?
Speaker 6: Did you were you guys particularly close? Did you have
Speaker 6: a way you would like did you talk ish about anybody?
Speaker 6: Like did you did you gather together.
Speaker 5: And go claw? Did you hear what he just asked
Speaker 5: me for? Like, I want to know what was.
Speaker 6: I just want to know about the relationship with you
Speaker 6: and the other pas, and like the sharing of information
Speaker 6: and the and the the knowing glances of Like we were.
Speaker 3: Pretty tight knit the the I mean the people that
Speaker 3: we dealt with for the We all wanted to be writers,
Speaker 3: and as you guys know the business and all of
Speaker 3: us were it was our first job. Uh So we
Speaker 3: all wanted to be writers. So you try to get
Speaker 3: in with the writers. And I will say this about
Speaker 3: the boy. These world writers were all ridiculously kind to
Speaker 3: us horror stories of other places where people wrong and
Speaker 3: they throw up, you know, throw food container up against
Speaker 3: the wall and you'll let you never ever, ever, ever
Speaker 3: had any of that.
Speaker 7: It was always really really fun. And they're also very fosters, like, oh,
Speaker 7: what do you want to do?
Speaker 3: Great? Okay, let me let me help you with that.
Speaker 3: Once you've read written something, let me read it. Uh.
Speaker 7: Yeah, it was great.
Speaker 3: And you know, Mark uh and Carl and I are
Speaker 3: all still in touch for this day. Wow.
Speaker 6: Was there ever a time where you got to where
Speaker 6: any of them asked you for an idea of a
Speaker 6: joke or you got to pitch a joke?
Speaker 5: Did you ever get close.
Speaker 6: Enough or we're in the room during a time where
Speaker 6: they were breaking a script where you felt comfortable making
Speaker 6: a suggestion?
Speaker 3: Not really unboy in Meats World Michael Jake and by
Speaker 3: actually the year I was there, Michael wasn't running the show.
Speaker 3: At the very beginning out of it was a guy
Speaker 3: David Kendall. Yes, I then worked later on with as
Speaker 3: a director who was fabulous. Yeah, we da. He always
Speaker 3: respected him as a good, decent, kind person. Yes, great,
Speaker 3: like great person to have as a boss. And you
Speaker 3: can kind of see how people are treated, especially people
Speaker 3: that many times in Hollywood. You've got the people you
Speaker 3: know you have to be nice to and the people
Speaker 3: you don't have to necessarily be nice to. And you
Speaker 3: watch how people treat the people that they don't have
Speaker 3: to be nice to, and you know they're a decent
Speaker 3: person when they feel them Yeah, end of all day long.
Speaker 3: So anyway, David was running the show, and because Michael
Speaker 3: had two other shows at the time, and those other
Speaker 3: two shows ended up kind of falling away and he
Speaker 3: was back at Boy by the end. But they had
Speaker 3: kind of a closed room where it was just the writers.
Speaker 3: You didn't have any in there, so you you got excited.
Speaker 3: It was like, oh, it's my day for lunch. Breaight,
Speaker 3: I get to go into the room to hear what's
Speaker 3: going on as I'm passing out passing out menu. I'll
Speaker 3: pass out the menus, but then I'll sit and I'll
Speaker 3: write out the orders, so I get to stay in
Speaker 3: the room a bit longer because it's such a magical,
Speaker 3: mysterious place once you're in when you're not allowed to
Speaker 3: be in there, because you want to know, like how
Speaker 3: the magic happens, where this is coming from, who writes
Speaker 3: what how does.
Speaker 7: It work on that particular show?
Speaker 3: Nothing for Boy These World specifically, But the writers were
Speaker 3: very good about reading other sample scripts because as a writer,
Speaker 3: you you write they call the spec script like what
Speaker 3: you would do if you had an opportunity to it,
Speaker 3: And they were really good about.
Speaker 4: How did you even have time to write? Though? Where
Speaker 4: were you? Where were you?
Speaker 1: You were just finding the hours on the weekends to
Speaker 1: pound out your own work.
Speaker 3: That's that's what I always tell people who are are
Speaker 3: trying to break into the business. There are two things
Speaker 3: that you kind of have to focus on. There's your
Speaker 3: job and there's your career, both equally important. Because your
Speaker 3: job might be a PA on Boy Meets World where
Speaker 3: you're working sixteen hours a day and doing everything you
Speaker 3: could possibly do, and that's how you're making your money,
Speaker 3: so you can hear and survive. But you've got to
Speaker 3: put in the same amount of time and effort in
Speaker 3: your career or else you're just always going to be
Speaker 3: your job.
Speaker 7: So the thing I would get together with.
Speaker 3: My writing partner who and work for a couple of
Speaker 3: hours and on the weekends cranking stuff out and just
Speaker 3: spending an equal time on both because you know, you, guys,
Speaker 3: I'm sure have heard all over and over and over
Speaker 3: that this business is all about being in the right
Speaker 3: place at the right time. I say it a different way.
Speaker 3: It's about being prepared to take advantage of an opportunity
Speaker 3: once that opportunity presents itself, and if you haven't done
Speaker 3: the work to take advantage of that opportunity by then,
Speaker 3: that opportunity goes away. You know, if you finally have
Speaker 3: someone say okay, yeah, i'd love to you want to
Speaker 3: be a writer? What have you read? What? What have
Speaker 3: you written? What can I read? And you want to
Speaker 3: be able to say, oh, here you go, Oh, while
Speaker 3: I'm working on something that I should be ready like
Speaker 3: two months or so, can I get back to that,
Speaker 3: because at that point you've blown the moment. So, especially
Speaker 3: when you're first starting out, it's it's incredibly difficult to
Speaker 3: still be doing this stuff on top of the career stuff,
Speaker 3: on top of the job stuff.
Speaker 6: Yeah, so you said that the writers were all really
Speaker 6: good about reading things. What was the first spec script
Speaker 6: you ever wrote? And then who did you give it
Speaker 6: to to read and what was the feedback The.
Speaker 3: First spec script that my writing partner Ron and I wrote,
Speaker 3: who I'm still ready with today. We wrote a news
Speaker 3: radio spec.
Speaker 4: Such one of my favorite shows of all time.
Speaker 3: It was one of those shows that if you remember,
Speaker 3: you remember it ridiculously fondly.
Speaker 4: Yep.
Speaker 7: So we wrote that and it was.
Speaker 3: I think at the time, I did the thing you're
Speaker 3: not supposed to do and was like sliding scenes under
Speaker 3: the door for it was even a completely written script.
Speaker 3: To the other writers who were like, oh wait, what
Speaker 3: is this. Is this something we're supposed to be doing,
Speaker 3: I'm like, oh no, no, it was just something I was
Speaker 3: wondering if you would kind of reading and seeing if
Speaker 3: I was on the right track, and they're like, oh yeah, okay.
Speaker 3: Like Jeff Manel was like, oh this is great. I'm
Speaker 3: gonna put a big tea here because that's when you
Speaker 3: teed up the story and that's how I mark up
Speaker 3: my scripts.
Speaker 7: Pictures on your scripts.
Speaker 4: That that's so cute.
Speaker 5: That sounds like Manel exactly.
Speaker 3: And then that that specscript ended up being the script
Speaker 3: that we that Ron and I submitted to the Warner
Speaker 3: Brothers writing program back when that was the thing, and
Speaker 3: that that got us kind of looked at as more
Speaker 3: than just people who were trying to become writers. We
Speaker 3: were writers who hadn't been hired yet.
Speaker 5: Wow.
Speaker 7: Wow, Yeah, that's.
Speaker 3: How we got representation and it just kind of went
Speaker 3: from there. And it still took us three years after
Speaker 3: that before we finally ended up. We were doing kind
Speaker 3: of freelance side gigs while we were still working our
Speaker 3: jobs instead of our career, and then it took us
Speaker 3: three four years after that, which seemed like an insurmountable
Speaker 3: amount of time. Then now it's like, wow, it's it's double,
Speaker 3: if not triple, that amount of time for most people
Speaker 3: to break in now because it's yes, it's just harder.
Speaker 4: Had you heard of Boy Meets World before you were
Speaker 4: on the show, and what did you think of it?
Speaker 7: I had not heard of boy Meets World.
Speaker 3: I got the interview, like uh, and it was a
Speaker 3: Friday thing and I had a younger brother. I'm like,
Speaker 3: you know the show boy meets Girl. He's like, it's
Speaker 3: Boye's world about it? My uh, I think thirteen or
Speaker 3: fourteen at the time, Like fill me in on everything
Speaker 3: so I know what's going on.
Speaker 7: So that's how he did my research.
Speaker 5: And were you just there one season? How long did
Speaker 5: you stay with us?
Speaker 7: Just there one season? And I was there for season three.
Speaker 3: At the time, I had it in my head because
Speaker 3: I knew Hollywood was all about kind of building relationships.
Speaker 3: I thought I was like, Okay, don't stay any place
Speaker 3: more than one year while you're an assistant, because then
Speaker 3: you'll meet more people. I don't know if that was
Speaker 3: the way which I jumped from that over to. And
Speaker 3: I always tried to move move to a different show,
Speaker 3: but move up the ladder one rock. Sure, So I
Speaker 3: hopped over from Boy Meets World. I was there. I
Speaker 3: went to Ellen for a month and then got as
Speaker 3: a writer's PA, and then I jumped onto a show
Speaker 3: called Unhappily Ever After for a year as a writer's assistant.
Speaker 2: With Nicki, with Nicki Cox and yeah another good show.
Speaker 2: Yeah Bobcat Golf Wade and yeah.
Speaker 7: Yeah, yeah, you come for Niki Cox, just stay for
Speaker 7: the talking Rabbit.
Speaker 4: It's true.
Speaker 2: Nicki was my first girlfriend in Los Angeles when I
Speaker 2: moved out first season of Boy Meets Roll. I think
Speaker 2: we were both like sixteen.
Speaker 3: He was red ridiculously sweet, and I can understand.
Speaker 4: She was ridiculously sweet.
Speaker 2: Yeah, she was ridiculously sweet.
Speaker 3: Then I jumped over to a show called Grace under
Speaker 3: Fire and then jumped Damon and finally ended up on
Speaker 3: a show called The Huge LEAs, which is where Ron
Speaker 3: and I finally got stabbed for the first time.
Speaker 4: Oh wow, were you there?
Speaker 2: I was gonna say, were you there a Grace Underfire
Speaker 2: when all the stuff went down?
Speaker 7: When didn't stuff go down?
Speaker 3: Yeah?
Speaker 4: Yeah it was I was there for the stuff at
Speaker 4: the end, you were okay.
Speaker 3: Fun fat. Technically I was the final executive producer of
Speaker 3: Grace utter Fire really, because Grace had fired. Everybody then realized,
Speaker 3: oh there's nobody left. So She's like, oh, what up
Speaker 3: do Yeah? What about what about this guy?
Speaker 7: He could be the executive producer. I'm like, I'm the
Speaker 7: guy typing at the keyboard.
Speaker 3: I don't know that. No, No, he the executive producer.
Speaker 3: So there was like six writers left at that point,
Speaker 3: and he sitting in a room with nothing to do
Speaker 3: because we knew we were all about to, like the
Speaker 3: show was about to go away, and the the I
Speaker 3: think it was a guy by the name of Mark Leagan,
Speaker 3: and Mark uh looked over me as like, so, executive producer,
Speaker 3: can we go to lunch?
Speaker 1: I'm like, yeah, cugaroo, go pick us up. Yeah, pick
Speaker 1: us up, I get to send somebody.
Speaker 6: Oh my god, that's unbelievable.
Speaker 4: I don't know any of the drama.
Speaker 1: It was just network notes that were just pushing back.
Speaker 3: RCI Werner had a habit of this is back when
Speaker 3: sitcoms were still king, and they had huge, huge, huge
Speaker 3: hits with Bill Cosby and Roseanne and your name is
Speaker 3: a Civil Shepherd, and they just kept finding mostly stand
Speaker 3: up comedians to build shows around. But many times, at
Speaker 3: least in that era, you you would build a show
Speaker 3: around the standard comedian who was used to doing things
Speaker 3: themselves on their own, so having a team of people
Speaker 3: around it's tough, was difficult for them, and it there
Speaker 3: were a lot of fireworks.
Speaker 4: We'll say, you are being so so wonderfully diplomatic, diplomatic.
Speaker 2: Well, our set wasn't like that at all, wasn't We
Speaker 2: had no drama.
Speaker 3: Well, you mentioned something that I thought was worth pointing out,
Speaker 3: like the fact that you guys didn't know like how
Speaker 3: the rest of everything was working is a credit to
Speaker 3: how well produced and boy these world was and.
Speaker 7: How well scare of you were. Yes, as a producer of.
Speaker 3: I mean I've been on everything from network to streamers
Speaker 3: to kids TV, you name it, and I've worked all
Speaker 3: exclusively in multicam, which is not something most people can
Speaker 3: say these days, but especially with kids. From where I'm standing,
Speaker 3: the number one job you have, like I always say,
Speaker 3: I'm a I'm a ad first, a producer second. So
Speaker 3: making sure that especially your kid actors are protected taken
Speaker 3: care of and I'll just be kids and listen. No,
Speaker 3: it's a job, but it should be fun. This is
Speaker 3: the glorified a drama club, you know, where you're just
Speaker 3: getting to do all kinds of fun things because you
Speaker 3: guys are pulled in like six hundred different directions, not
Speaker 3: just in the production of the show, but also promotions
Speaker 3: and appearances and you and it can be a lot,
Speaker 3: especially on shows where they allow they're behind the camera
Speaker 3: drama to the camera and for kid actors to kind
Speaker 3: of deal with that and that to be that's not fair.
Speaker 3: And I'm glad to hear that you guys there going
Speaker 3: on behind the cameras anyway, so a sign of a
Speaker 3: well run machine. But I'm glad to hear that you
Speaker 3: guys have such posive experiences from it, because yeah.
Speaker 6: We have given that credit now many times that it
Speaker 6: was so it was so we were so protected in
Speaker 6: the best ways.
Speaker 5: It's funny that now as adults were like, oh.
Speaker 6: Man, we had absolutely no idea any of that was
Speaker 6: going on, And you're exactly right.
Speaker 5: It is a it's it was.
Speaker 6: It was a nice way of our teachers and the
Speaker 6: adults in the production office, Karen McCain and and all
Speaker 6: the people who didn't let us know anything was going on.
Speaker 5: We were we were well insulated.
Speaker 6: And that that is that is the best I want
Speaker 6: to talk about when you would deliver the scripts again,
Speaker 6: because to us, we just can't even believe, like we
Speaker 6: remember it so well. We remember, you know, waking up
Speaker 6: in the scripts, being outside the door, or if it
Speaker 6: was if we were still awake getting the scripts, they'd
Speaker 6: sometimes be in plastic if it were raining outside because
Speaker 6: they were just you know, left on our porch. Was
Speaker 6: it only one pa doing the deliveries at night or
Speaker 6: would a couple.
Speaker 5: Of you do it?
Speaker 3: And there's always one person who had the super late
Speaker 3: although at the time it was Betsy Randall lived down
Speaker 3: in Ohi or something, and she was the.
Speaker 5: One who here was it Bill Daniels in Monacito.
Speaker 3: Bill was not in Monasito season.
Speaker 4: He had a valley, a valley place. He always had
Speaker 4: a house in the valley.
Speaker 1: I think it was Betsy was in Topanga Canyon, right
Speaker 1: or no, she wasn't.
Speaker 4: O High was the way in High.
Speaker 3: They didn't want to pay us for the hour, like
Speaker 3: whatever whatever rate it was. It was cheaper for them
Speaker 3: to pay for the facts than to have us drive
Speaker 3: out there.
Speaker 4: Facts.
Speaker 5: I remember, you would facts her script.
Speaker 3: You would get. Yeah, I sound like an old man
Speaker 3: now anytime I bring up these things, but.
Speaker 4: That's yeah.
Speaker 2: It was magic to us because he would just open
Speaker 2: your door and there the script would be. Now to
Speaker 2: make it hopefully make you feel better about all the
Speaker 2: deliveris you did? I still have all my scripts, he does, so,
Speaker 2: so that's it. What they did not go to waste.
Speaker 2: Just so you know I've still got him.
Speaker 6: He's We've signed them and given them away at some
Speaker 6: of our live shows to our dear listeners, so they
Speaker 6: your work is still out there in the.
Speaker 3: World, finalest work.
Speaker 2: Yes, Would you take the time because you want to
Speaker 2: be a writer at the time and you know that's
Speaker 2: your career. Would you read all the scripts as they
Speaker 2: were you were either you know, photocopying them or delivering
Speaker 2: them I mean, would you take the time to read
Speaker 2: the scripts and see the changes they made.
Speaker 4: Or was it like, I don't ever want to look
Speaker 4: at this anymore.
Speaker 3: One hundred percent. I read every script that came out.
Speaker 3: You get a chance to talk to her. I was like, Oh,
Speaker 3: I noticed this one changed. Why did that change? That
Speaker 3: seem to work? Like, oh the network felt that it
Speaker 3: was made this character to mean or didn't they needed
Speaker 3: to show up the relate So kind of learning the
Speaker 3: Notes process and realizing that this is a very collaborative medium,
Speaker 3: especially in world and sometimes you try stuff and see
Speaker 3: if it works, and if it doesn't, you can always
Speaker 3: kind of change it to something else and realize that, oh,
Speaker 3: these changes aren't necessarily it's not necessarily saying that you
Speaker 3: were wrong or did something bad.
Speaker 7: It's like, oh, we just want to try something else.
Speaker 3: We want to try to shade at this direction or
Speaker 3: this is the objective that we have now. And realizing
Speaker 3: that the notes process and including the studio and the
Speaker 3: network in that process is huge because at the time
Speaker 3: I didn't realize, oh, the studio the network kind of
Speaker 3: owned everything and you're really just there to kind of
Speaker 3: have a vision and then try to weave everything all
Speaker 3: into one cohesive thing and then hope you get you know,
Speaker 3: multiple seasons to do that and to build a vamily.
Speaker 6: Do you remember any specific weird requests you got or
Speaker 6: strange and how many packs of cigarettes were you sent
Speaker 6: out to purchase for Will?
Speaker 2: I always I was a responsible kid. I always bought
Speaker 2: my own smoke.
Speaker 6: Okay, all right, legal, Any weird request, Well, there's constant Kunkuru, which.
Speaker 5: Was one that's a little weird.
Speaker 3: You're the first twenty seven times, but the next twenty
Speaker 3: five times. And I got no particular weird request. But
Speaker 3: I remember there was a time when I got a
Speaker 3: traffic like. I got a ticket for turning left somewhere
Speaker 3: I wasn't supposed to left and got pulled over. And
Speaker 3: Jeff Sherman, one of the writers, like oh, because I
Speaker 3: was picking up something for him and his managers or ages.
Speaker 3: And he's like, oh, I feel terrible. And he didn't
Speaker 3: offer to pay the ticket, but he's like, I got
Speaker 3: a guy. I'm like, oh, I always love anytime somebody
Speaker 3: storts his sense. When I got say, I'm going to
Speaker 3: love yeah, And he's like, I got a guy, You're
Speaker 3: gonna go do traffic school with him, except you're not
Speaker 3: really going to do traffic school with him. To go
Speaker 3: to this address talk to Nico Nicoll be there. Nico
Speaker 3: doesn't exist, But say you're talking to Nico and then
Speaker 3: you're gonna pay whatever it is and you want to
Speaker 3: have to go to traffic school when you would credit
Speaker 3: for it. So that was pretty neat. When you're twenty
Speaker 3: one years old, you're like, like, what is the shady
Speaker 3: d I got going on here?
Speaker 2: I'm sure with the weird traffic school hookup?
Speaker 4: Like what, Jess love that story.
Speaker 3: That's amazing.
Speaker 6: What's the kind of adult I hope to be the
Speaker 6: one with the guys who's.
Speaker 5: Not really a guy and it's it's a little shady,
Speaker 5: but you'll get it done.
Speaker 4: I love that.
Speaker 3: I love it. Yeah, Mady, farther than you've ever been
Speaker 3: a man.
Speaker 5: Ask for Nico, but Nico doesn't exist. I love it.
Speaker 2: I have a question for you as somebody, because you
Speaker 2: mentioned before that you have almost exclusively spent your career
Speaker 2: in multicam. Yes, which is pretty amazing, and it's also
Speaker 2: my favorite thing in the world and always has been.
Speaker 3: It's the it's showbiz.
Speaker 4: Is it going away?
Speaker 3: People have said multicams are going away for decades at
Speaker 3: this point, Right, what I did once I finally got
Speaker 3: on staff as a writer. I was on staff on
Speaker 3: a show called The Hugeles for four seasons. It was
Speaker 3: a two different networks, four different nights, ninety episodes, the
Speaker 3: longest longest running show nobody has ever heard of.
Speaker 4: I Love Who Hysterical So.
Speaker 3: You just finally came back. It just it's just dropped
Speaker 3: on Netflix in this past August, so people are rediscovering it,
Speaker 3: which is cool. After The Hugles, I jumped over to
Speaker 3: a show called according to Gym, which it was Seasons.
Speaker 3: And the great thing about that is we were gainfully
Speaker 3: employed as writers for twelve straight seasons. When wow, like
Speaker 3: when I first started on Boy Mets World, and this
Speaker 3: is comedies in general, multi cam n single came there
Speaker 3: were ninety comedies on just network television.
Speaker 7: By the time, according to Gym ended, there were nine.
Speaker 3: Oh wow, we got canceled so by like literally by
Speaker 3: the end of the season, there were six comedies on
Speaker 3: network television.
Speaker 4: Right, I'm sorry, this is this is what the early
Speaker 4: two thousands, this is reality. This is a reality TV
Speaker 4: just came in, right, Yeah, the first strike.
Speaker 7: After that ron they looked around.
Speaker 3: It was like, oh shit, we shoop, we love doing
Speaker 3: I love doing multicams, Like who's still doing these? And
Speaker 3: looked around like, oh this, they're actually doing multicam TVs
Speaker 3: over on Disney Channel and Nickelodeon. Let's go sniff around
Speaker 3: over there. So they're still doing them there. And there's
Speaker 3: a whole generation of as you well know from Girl
Speaker 3: Mets World, there's a whole generation of former kids now
Speaker 3: adults who are suddenly hitting the demo, the age demographic
Speaker 3: who are used to watching their comedies their half hours
Speaker 3: in multicam format because they wrop on hand in Montana,
Speaker 3: Shake It Up Live in Mattie, Girl Meets World, and
Speaker 3: now they're suddenly in the uh in the demographic. And
Speaker 3: if you notice, there are more multicams on network primetime
Speaker 3: now than there have been in years. I think part
Speaker 3: of that is because they're significantly cheaper. You get to
Speaker 3: try out stuff multiple times before you lock in on
Speaker 3: it with single cams, and I love single cam shows
Speaker 3: as well, but you have to know exactly what is
Speaker 3: going to work and what is not going to work
Speaker 3: before you shoot it, and then hope what you want
Speaker 3: and then or hope you can fix it and post
Speaker 3: and I don't know. There's just something about that magic
Speaker 3: of being up in front of an audience that I
Speaker 3: always love with a multiicam, and it feels more like
Speaker 3: it's part of your family, like they're kind of there
Speaker 3: that single cams like, oh, I'm watching a tiny movie
Speaker 3: about people on TV. With multicams, it's like, oh, you're
Speaker 3: you're watching a live play every week.
Speaker 4: And you're yeah, you're in the house. It feels like
Speaker 4: you're there in the house. So that's really interesting.
Speaker 1: I've never thought about it that way, and we've kind
Speaker 1: of said a version of that, but I never thought
Speaker 1: about the fact that it's multiicam liveness actually makes it
Speaker 1: even though it's more presentational, it makes it feel more
Speaker 1: in person.
Speaker 4: That's super interesting.
Speaker 3: More in person, and it feels like it feels like
Speaker 3: someone you can know instead of someone you can experience
Speaker 3: on TV. It's it's a different feel to it that
Speaker 3: I feel like you your audience is more invested because
Speaker 3: of that.
Speaker 7: Yeah, especially younger audiences.
Speaker 6: So something we haven't talked about on the show before,
Speaker 6: but that I wanted to ask you, do you remember
Speaker 6: when the entire cast and crew was on lockdown at
Speaker 6: KTLA because there was a shooter on the roof.
Speaker 3: Was my first day of whoa welcome shoh my gosh, okay,
Speaker 3: please tell us your first day of work story. The
Speaker 3: first run over to Michael Jacob's off is when I
Speaker 3: realized I think they hearrd the wrong person. Second time
Speaker 3: I go over and I get a call saying, yeah,
Speaker 3: don't don't bother coming back, and I thought for sure
Speaker 3: we figured it out. I'm then they figured who the
Speaker 3: other guy is gonna be actually want to hire, and
Speaker 3: then they're like, there's a sniper on the top of
Speaker 3: the Metropolitan Hotel, so you can go home. So I
Speaker 3: was done by two o'clock that first day. I'm like,
Speaker 3: this has been a very uh.
Speaker 4: Strange Oh wow, I don't remember this at all. I
Speaker 4: don't remember this at all either. We've talked about this
Speaker 4: a number of times. Yeah, were we part of the lockdown?
Speaker 6: Do you remember so, John, when you're your first day,
Speaker 6: was it the first day of one of our weeks?
Speaker 6: Like was it a Friday? And then you're was this
Speaker 6: was the lockdown on a Monday? I'm trying to figure
Speaker 6: out if it was the start of an episode or
Speaker 6: were you in the middle of the week, because I'm
Speaker 6: trying to really like, where would we have been at
Speaker 6: two pm?
Speaker 3: If I remember right, it was one of the four
Speaker 3: days before, because Friday was table Reday.
Speaker 4: Yes, four days.
Speaker 3: And if again, going back many, many, many many decades here,
Speaker 3: if I recall correctly, you were there Danielle banking school
Speaker 3: hours before because she's very studious.
Speaker 5: Very studious. I was very studious.
Speaker 3: Yeah, I don't know who the rest of the cast
Speaker 3: was there.
Speaker 1: Okay, so you might have just been having a school
Speaker 1: day to bank hours for the next week when we
Speaker 1: were on hiatus or something.
Speaker 5: But during hiatus weeks, I always I would.
Speaker 6: Have always, I would have gone back to my regular school.
Speaker 6: And if it were yeah, So I don't know.
Speaker 5: I mean I have either. The funny thing is I
Speaker 5: have a vague.
Speaker 6: Very vague recollection of it. But there was a lot
Speaker 6: of action when we were at KTLA.
Speaker 4: Yeah, because of where we were. Well, that was the
Speaker 4: same day that rider. Ironically, you were on the roof
Speaker 4: of the Metropolitan.
Speaker 2: You told me, you told me that remember that that day.
Speaker 4: It was rightful Monday. We kind of snapped, right.
Speaker 5: I knew that half of it. I'm trying to remember
Speaker 5: the other part of it, you know, the terror.
Speaker 7: No.
Speaker 2: I just remember when we first went to KTLA because
Speaker 2: it was like, hey, which strip club should we go
Speaker 2: to for lunch?
Speaker 4: Because it was like it was such a different We
Speaker 4: went through the Disney.
Speaker 2: Yeah, like literally the squirrels would come up to you
Speaker 2: and like feed you grapes themselves to k t l
Speaker 2: A where it was like, hey, wow, I got heppatitis.
Speaker 4: So it was.
Speaker 5: Where the old spaghetti factory was.
Speaker 6: Yes, yeah, the old spaghetti factory.
Speaker 3: Factory that out in front had daytime hookers.
Speaker 6: Yes, not to be confused with night time hookers.
Speaker 8: If the.
Speaker 4: Afternoon, yeah, if you're working the day shift. Yikes.
Speaker 6: Okay, So you mentioned run throughs.
Speaker 5: Were you ever did you get to be on set
Speaker 5: for run throughs? Did you get to watch them?
Speaker 4: Not?
Speaker 3: They wanted people down there for the the reaction.
Speaker 5: What do you remember about the three of us? You
Speaker 5: can be honest, God, you guys are all great.
Speaker 3: I literally I wish I had some crubby things to
Speaker 3: say about you.
Speaker 5: You make something up, Just make up one crummy thing
Speaker 5: about Rider.
Speaker 4: We just made him an active shooter. Make it up
Speaker 4: about me.
Speaker 5: You're right, Okay, make it about well.
Speaker 3: A play several years ago where you did the Graduate
Speaker 3: with Jerry Hall.
Speaker 7: Oh, yes, theater years ago. I was like, I know
Speaker 7: that guy.
Speaker 3: Look at him, he's all grown up.
Speaker 2: Now do you play the guitar and or the keyboard?
Speaker 3: I do not. My son does. My son is a
Speaker 3: fantastic drummer.
Speaker 4: And that's the whole thing.
Speaker 3: The thing but it makes me look a lot cooler
Speaker 3: to have something that.
Speaker 6: So you mentioned that you're still close to Mark Blutman, uh,
Speaker 6: and one of an other person you met on Boy
Speaker 6: Meets World?
Speaker 5: Who else are you still close to?
Speaker 3: Uh? Well, the the cool thing is there's been two
Speaker 3: different times when like the writers from Boyme's World have
Speaker 3: kind of re entered my life later on, which like when, uh,
Speaker 3: because Michael likes to keep.
Speaker 7: His people around.
Speaker 9: Uh.
Speaker 3: Years later, when I had kind of moved up the
Speaker 3: ranks and had become an executive producer on according to Jim,
Speaker 3: Michael did a show called Misery Loves Company I believe, yeah,
Speaker 3: and they were going to air after according to Gym
Speaker 3: when they launched, and they the cast was supposed to
Speaker 3: come to our set to shoot promos for their launch
Speaker 3: and at the time I had no idea who what
Speaker 3: Misery Loves Company was. I just knew that they were
Speaker 3: coming in. And behind the actors comes all the guys
Speaker 3: I used to get lunch for. I'm like, oh my god,
Speaker 3: that's Bluckman and Matt Nelson. Well, and they came walking
Speaker 3: in and like, I'm like, oh my god, this is
Speaker 3: so cool that they're like over here now and they're like, oh, hey,
Speaker 3: could we do It would be okay if we I'm like,
Speaker 3: why are you talking like that? Gonna make you a sandwich? Like.
Speaker 3: It was cool to see them then and kind of
Speaker 3: reconnected then. And then when my writing part I created
Speaker 3: a show on Disney Channel called liv and Maddie. We
Speaker 3: were doing liv and Maddie season two when Girls World
Speaker 3: got picked up. So Michael and you know, Blutman and
Speaker 3: Manel and and uh ended up coming to set to
Speaker 3: kind of learn the ways of Disney Channel, which has
Speaker 3: a bit of a learning curve.
Speaker 5: Yeah, So it.
Speaker 3: Was again cool to just kind of intersect with these
Speaker 3: guys who I respected incredibly and have such fond memories for.
Speaker 3: And then they they got to come see me all
Speaker 3: grown up, which was nice. So cool.
Speaker 5: That's so cool.
Speaker 6: AU what a great full circle moment to be having
Speaker 6: been the PA bringing those guys kuckaroo and now being
Speaker 6: the person who says, yes, allow them to come on
Speaker 6: and see my set and let me teach them and
Speaker 6: guide them into what they're.
Speaker 5: About ready to embark on.
Speaker 4: That is so cool.
Speaker 5: That's such a great moment.
Speaker 3: Right there was the Boy Means World reunion strike, Yes,
Speaker 3: and I got into that, and so I Cuckreo was
Speaker 3: no longer around anymore. So I went and got a
Speaker 3: box of stonnuts and wrote Cuckreo on the top and
Speaker 3: he is your.
Speaker 4: That is just so cool?
Speaker 5: Do you think?
Speaker 6: And I'm sure the answer is yes, but I want
Speaker 6: to hear it from you. Do you think having been
Speaker 6: a PA yourself impacted the way you then lead a show,
Speaker 6: run a show, the way you interact with people?
Speaker 5: Were there? Did you?
Speaker 6: Did you walk away from that going I know I
Speaker 6: am always going to treat people with respect and kindness.
Speaker 3: It is yes.
Speaker 7: There.
Speaker 3: One of my all time heroes in uh in television
Speaker 3: is a guy with the name of Gary Marshall cast
Speaker 3: a Happy Days did guest on Boy Meets World the
Speaker 3: year I was really cool. Yeah, And Gary had a
Speaker 3: saying that I think about constantly in this business. He said,
Speaker 3: it's nice to be important, but it's more important to
Speaker 3: be nice. And I think that is hugely important, especially
Speaker 3: in especially in the entertainment business, because it can be
Speaker 3: so high stress, and it can be a place where
Speaker 3: nerves are afraid, and it's creative people who are trying
Speaker 3: to make things the best they could possibly make it,
Speaker 3: and tempers can flare. But at the end of the day,
Speaker 3: everybody's like, everybody from top to bottom, if you staffed
Speaker 3: your show correctly, is trying to do a great job
Speaker 3: for your show, your product, and everybody deserves the same
Speaker 3: respect that you hope you got when you were still
Speaker 3: starting out or when you were you know, whether you
Speaker 3: have screwed something up up or whether you which by
Speaker 3: the way, I did a lot when I was a
Speaker 3: BA or and especially the moments where you thought you
Speaker 3: were doing the right thing and it ends up screwing on.
Speaker 3: But yeah, that's hugely important to me, and it's I
Speaker 3: also remember what it was like to be the person
Speaker 3: who was trying so hard to do a good job
Speaker 3: with what you're doing, but also let you know, like
Speaker 3: I want to do more, and remembering how difficult it
Speaker 3: felt to get in the room, get through the door,
Speaker 3: to get to get to where you want to be.
Speaker 3: And you can't always do that for everybody, but you
Speaker 3: can at least provide an environment where you can learn
Speaker 3: and get yourself a little bit closer. And it takes
Speaker 3: more work on your part as a showrunner to do
Speaker 3: the little things that helped foster the next generation of people,
Speaker 3: but they were done for me and it's been, you know,
Speaker 3: my twenty five year goal to and in counting I
Speaker 3: hoped continue to create that kind of environment for other people.
Speaker 4: Yeah, that's great.
Speaker 2: It's also telling that Gary Marshall is the person who
Speaker 2: said that when he had to deal with personalities on
Speaker 2: things like Lavernon Shirley.
Speaker 3: So about that, as if you guys have worked in
Speaker 3: the Paramount lot, Yeah, yes, Happy Day stage and right
Speaker 3: next door to it was the Lavernon Shirley stage. There's
Speaker 3: literally about this much room between this door and this door. Gary,
Speaker 3: we go from the Laverne and Shirley stage, which was
Speaker 3: the most contentious high drama state ever and literally walk
Speaker 3: into the most beautiful place ever. On Happy Days during
Speaker 3: the pandemic, I was doing a show called Side Hustle,
Speaker 3: which happened to shoot on the Happy Day stage and
Speaker 3: we happen to be in the Happy Day's offices, and
Speaker 3: I realized, oh, I'm in.
Speaker 7: Gary Marshall's writer's room.
Speaker 3: Really difficult, really difficult time, because we were one of
Speaker 3: the first shows that we're kind of up back and
Speaker 3: producing after lockdown, and it was just kind of nice
Speaker 3: to feel that energy and realize, okay, like nerves are
Speaker 3: going to be even higher for people now, so your
Speaker 3: threshold for patience and kindness is going to be really
Speaker 3: important in it. It's kind of nice to feel like
Speaker 3: I was channeling Gary a little bit there.
Speaker 4: That's cool. That's cool.
Speaker 6: Well, for any of our dear listeners who are looking
Speaker 6: to get into the business, how do you tell people, like,
Speaker 6: what do you think the first step is? Do you
Speaker 6: still recommend a PA route? Is that even possible these days?
Speaker 6: What's your advice to young people.
Speaker 7: Look for a PA gig?
Speaker 3: The there used to be a fairly consistent pathway that
Speaker 3: I think. I think the door might have closed right
Speaker 3: as I finally got through it, where you'd work as
Speaker 3: a PA you would then work your way up to
Speaker 3: writer's assistant, and when you're a writer assistant more often
Speaker 3: than not. Then you were in the room and you're
Speaker 3: interacting with writers a little bit, and if you were
Speaker 3: in a cool place, maybe they'd let you pitch a joke,
Speaker 3: maybe they'd let you. But you've got access to outlines,
Speaker 3: you've got access, and more importantly, you've got access to
Speaker 3: the people who are doing the job that you want
Speaker 3: to eventually do. These are the relationships you want to
Speaker 3: build because one of those writers could end up getting
Speaker 3: their own show and bring you in as a script
Speaker 3: coordinator and then maybe get you a script. It's a
Speaker 3: little bit tougher now because rooms are smaller. There are
Speaker 3: less rooms, so those opportunities, like the pipeline is not there.
Speaker 3: But still you want to be around the people who
Speaker 3: you eventually want to be if because you're learning how
Speaker 3: to you're learning your craft, you're learning how they carry themselves.
Speaker 3: And you also have somebody who, like a vouch from
Speaker 3: somebody else, is worth his weight in gold in this business,
Speaker 3: whether that's oh, I read this kid's script, it's good,
Speaker 3: or you know what this this this this, this kid
Speaker 3: is a hard worker. You know, we could trust them
Speaker 3: to do little things, so why don't we trust them
Speaker 3: to do the big things? But at the same time,
Speaker 3: in addition to what I talk about, like you got
Speaker 3: you got your job, and you've got to also work
Speaker 3: on your career. I think it's even more important now
Speaker 3: than it has ever been to just be doing stuff
Speaker 3: you cause set yourself apart somehow, whether it's shooting shorts,
Speaker 3: whether it's I mean when I when I was when
Speaker 3: I was a PA and Boy Meets World, I became
Speaker 3: very close friends with Alex Dasaer, and Alex at the
Speaker 3: time was shooting Swingers, which at the time was like,
Speaker 3: oh yeah, they got this this little this movie thing
Speaker 3: that we're also kind of shooting. That became such a
Speaker 3: huge thing and launched so many careers. That's the kind
Speaker 3: of thing people need to be doing now, because it's
Speaker 3: always it's really hard to get somebody.
Speaker 7: To read something, to sit down descript.
Speaker 3: It's much easier to get somebody to watch something that
Speaker 3: you've sent them, and it's so much easier to kind
Speaker 3: of get that out there and distribute it now than
Speaker 3: it used to be. I always feel that's the kind
Speaker 3: of thing that gets you noticed more than anything now.
Speaker 3: Nothing nothing replaces being in a room and being around
Speaker 3: a staff of people and proving yourself to be invaluable.
Speaker 3: But if you don't have that access, producing something that
Speaker 3: you can get to people is also just as fantastic.
Speaker 3: And if you can do.
Speaker 4: Both, great, right, that's great, John.
Speaker 6: As I mentioned in your intro, which you didn't get
Speaker 6: to hear, but I mentioned all several of the shows
Speaker 6: you have been an executive producer for, one of which
Speaker 6: is Fuller House, and also many shows that you've.
Speaker 5: Created and show Ran.
Speaker 6: I want to thank you so much for spending your
Speaker 6: time here with us today. You are far more successful
Speaker 6: than our little podcast and I'm just we are so
Speaker 6: appreciative that you came and spent time with us today.
Speaker 6: And also i'd love to know what are you working
Speaker 6: on now? Where can people see your work, what are
Speaker 6: you excited about? Tell us what's in the pipeline for
Speaker 6: you that we can get behind and root for.
Speaker 7: Well, First of all, thank you guys for having me.
Speaker 3: This is something that David Kendall's talked to me about
Speaker 3: and Mark Bluman's talked to me about. A couple of
Speaker 3: people are like, I don't want to talk to me.
Speaker 5: I was just not true.
Speaker 3: I will say I was incredibly nervous to come on.
Speaker 3: I didn't realize I would be as nervous as I was.
Speaker 3: So thank you. That dream you have when you go
Speaker 3: back to high school and you're like, oh my gosh,
Speaker 3: everybody thought it was a jerk. I have no idea.
Speaker 3: So nice to come back and see some faces who
Speaker 3: I remember very finally and to find out that you
Speaker 3: either didn't remember me or remember me finally.
Speaker 5: Either right, you'll take either.
Speaker 3: Most recently, I was doing two different shows for Nickelodeon.
Speaker 3: I was doing a show called Back Rolele and a
Speaker 3: show Side Hustle, kind of out pitching and developing. Right
Speaker 3: now project I've been taken out with Jody Sweeten. I'm
Speaker 3: kind of waiting to hear on that and you know,
Speaker 3: just just kind of out hooking it. Well.
Speaker 6: We are big fans of Jody here so and big
Speaker 6: fans of yours as well, So I can't wait to
Speaker 6: hear where that ends up. We will be We would
Speaker 6: love to have you guys back on whenever that goes somewhere.
Speaker 6: We will have you back on to talk about it
Speaker 6: and promote it and get our dear listeners to watch
Speaker 6: it with us.
Speaker 3: How nice would that be?
Speaker 6: Yes, that's that's the hope. So, John thank you again
Speaker 6: for spending your time with us.
Speaker 7: Well, thank you guys for having me. I really appreciate it.
Speaker 4: Thank you great to see you. Bye bye.
Speaker 6: It's always so nice when you talk to people who
Speaker 6: are like him, and it just absolutely seems like something's
Speaker 6: right in the universe when a guy like that starts
Speaker 6: as a PA and then makes it to a showrunner.
Speaker 5: You know, just the kindest, nicest.
Speaker 1: Hardest work I work. The way that he's able to
Speaker 1: articulate the whole job career, I mean, it's so smart,
Speaker 1: like God, and like so many people I think, you know,
Speaker 1: think that oh I can just be a PA and
Speaker 1: just that's it and then the job ends or they
Speaker 1: stay in the like all the strategies.
Speaker 4: The fact that he kept moving, I'll get a job
Speaker 4: over here because I got to know more people like
Speaker 4: that's so smart. I know, I don't know, the deserve
Speaker 4: is the same.
Speaker 2: I hope the business is the same where that's still,
Speaker 2: like he said, a pathway to success where you can
Speaker 2: still do I mean, look any way.
Speaker 4: In is the way in right, right? Of course? Yeah?
Speaker 1: So, but I just you know, the saddest thing is
Speaker 1: just that there's not as much being made.
Speaker 6: Like that's just ninety sitcoms.
Speaker 5: On the sports television down to six in like eight seasons.
Speaker 1: Yeah, and then you get their Kardashians guys. You know
Speaker 1: we get the payoff the Apprentice.
Speaker 4: You know, well, I miss Lavert and surely they used
Speaker 4: to get that. Set was such a nightmare.
Speaker 2: They used to count each other's lines, and if one
Speaker 2: of them had had one line more.
Speaker 4: They wouldn't come out of their dressing room.
Speaker 2: They had to write the script to where both the
Speaker 2: actors had exactly the same number of lines.
Speaker 4: Can you imagine that?
Speaker 5: Oh, you know what, I want enough time to care.
Speaker 4: About that, right right?
Speaker 5: Could you imagine the.
Speaker 6: Kind of free time you must have to count your
Speaker 6: life and your line, not just count yours to see
Speaker 6: where you stand?
Speaker 5: What about the other person?
Speaker 4: I couldn't imagine. I couldn't imagine.
Speaker 5: Yeah, I just like to poop alone. That'd be nice.
Speaker 5: If I could just poop alone, ever, would be so great.
Speaker 6: Thank you all for joining us for this episode of
Speaker 6: Pod Meets World. As always, you can follow us on
Speaker 6: Instagram pod Meets World Show. You can send us your
Speaker 6: emails at podmeets World Show at gmail dot com.
Speaker 5: And we've got merch.
Speaker 4: Who are you pooping with merch?
Speaker 6: Children of the mails in this house, I can't be
Speaker 6: away from me, and Indy.
Speaker 1: Is finally at the age where he does not walk
Speaker 1: in on me in the bathroom. I'm like, I've yelled
Speaker 1: and screamed so many times and it's like, finally I am.
Speaker 1: I am able to go without having to lock the door,
Speaker 1: which is what I used to have to do. I'm
Speaker 1: just I'm locking the door, dude.
Speaker 6: Yes, yes, But the worst part is even if you
Speaker 6: lock the door, then it's still banging, handle, jiggling.
Speaker 2: Please, Mommy, hoop it alone, merch.
Speaker 4: That's where we're going.
Speaker 6: Pod meets World show dot Com will send us out.
Speaker 4: We love you all. Pod dismissed sentences.
Speaker 1: No one ever thought they'd hear from Tippega.
Speaker 2: Pod Meats World is Myheart podcast produced and hosted by
Speaker 2: Danielle Fischel, Wilfredell and Ryder Strong. Executive producers, Jensen Carp
Speaker 2: and Amy Sugarman, Executive in charge of production, Danielle Romo,
Speaker 2: producer and editor, Tara Sudbaksh, producer, Maddy Moore, engineer and
Speaker 2: boy Me's World super fan Easton Allen. Our theme song
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Speaker 2: at Podmetsworldshow at gmail dot com