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Speaker 1: It is a reflection of just the overall low level

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Speaker 1: of engagement that most of us have when it comes

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Speaker 1: to what's happening in our own back yards. There are

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Speaker 1: no girls on the Internet. As a production of I

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Speaker 1: Heart Radio and Unbust Creative, I'm bridget Todd and this

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Speaker 1: is there are no girls on the Internet. We can

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Speaker 1: all probably name a big, flashy national political leader who

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Speaker 1: successfully amassed a lot of political power in the United

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Speaker 1: States federal government. His name starts with the Donald and

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Speaker 1: ends with a Trump. But what about the extremist power

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Speaker 1: grabs happening in our own backyards. Right wing extremists have

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Speaker 1: been quietly and successfully building power at the local level,

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Speaker 1: zeroing in on institutions like local school boards and small towns.

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Speaker 1: And while many of us are paying attention to national issues,

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Speaker 1: it's happening right under our noses. I am the host

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Speaker 1: of bed Rock USA, which is a new podcast from

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Speaker 1: Bloomberg City Lab and I Heart Radio UH, and I'm

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Speaker 1: also a reporter on staff at Bloombook Say Lab. In

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Speaker 1: her podcast better Rock USA, reporter Laura Bliss uncovers how

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Speaker 1: the far right is making in roads and local government.

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Speaker 1: So how did you become someone who covers the way

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Speaker 1: that things like extremist ideology and conspiracy theories can really

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Speaker 1: impact small town life. Yeah. So I came into this

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Speaker 1: from a somewhat sideways path. I have been covering cities

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Speaker 1: and kind of local communities for most of my journalism career.

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Speaker 1: Uh And so because I report on that local level

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Speaker 1: and on issues like housing and transportation and kind of

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Speaker 1: you know, local policy issues, I really couldn't ignore the

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Speaker 1: way things like Q and On and other forms of

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Speaker 1: kind of anti democratic rhetoric we're starting to creep into

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Speaker 1: my beat. Um. And this became especially true, you know,

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Speaker 1: during the pandemic, and I think really became hard to ignore,

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Speaker 1: if possible ignore to ignore after January six them and

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Speaker 1: the capital instruction. I think we've all seen this at

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Speaker 1: this point, this explosion in stories about school board battles

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Speaker 1: waged by q and On believers, bath keepers running for

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Speaker 1: city councils, uh and and kind of the bread and

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Speaker 1: butter issues that local governments work on, you know, stuff

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Speaker 1: like you know, the development proposals for newshousing projects or

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Speaker 1: light rail stations, like even even issues like these started

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Speaker 1: to become not every case, but but in a sort

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Speaker 1: of surprising number of communities that was reporting and kind

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Speaker 1: of tinged by are just hyperpartisan and kind of increasingly

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Speaker 1: extreme political environment. UM. And so this podcast bed Rock USA,

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Speaker 1: which is really about how you fall ideologies are reshaping

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Speaker 1: local governments and kind of what local communities are doing

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Speaker 1: about it, really came out of that, um but also

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Speaker 1: all to but I think it's just really fascinating to

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Speaker 1: look at the local level, or or to sort of

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Speaker 1: use the local level as a lens into the broader

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Speaker 1: issues that you're talking about. Because you know, when you

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Speaker 1: are reporting to a small town, you're you're talking to

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Speaker 1: people who are really neighbors with each other, um. You know,

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Speaker 1: and if and if you're kind of like a anti

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Speaker 1: government conspiracy theorist in a small town, and you know,

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Speaker 1: you just profoundly mistrust the person who is on your

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Speaker 1: city council, or you're you know, railing against the school

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Speaker 1: board member. I mean not can mean going against your

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Speaker 1: own neighbor or just sort of believing that your own

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Speaker 1: neighbors fundamentally unworthy of your trust. Um. And so that

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Speaker 1: just provides some really interesting kind of human drama that

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Speaker 1: I I'm attracted to as a reporter, and I guess

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Speaker 1: someone who likes to tell stories. Um. And finally too,

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Speaker 1: I mean this kind of like hyperpartisanship that we're talking about,

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Speaker 1: and you know, ideologies that are infused with misinformation and

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Speaker 1: conspiracy theories. Uh, it's just really a sharp contrast with

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Speaker 1: the way local government theoretically is supposed to work. Normally,

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Speaker 1: we think of local government as the you know, institution

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Speaker 1: that takes care of our least partisan issues, right. I mean,

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Speaker 1: these are supposed to be the people working on keeping

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Speaker 1: our streets paved and making sure the trash gets picked up,

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Speaker 1: and you know, just the sort of bread and better

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Speaker 1: issues that you think would be immune to. Uh, you know,

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Speaker 1: ideologies like Q and on and so just all of

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Speaker 1: these kind of uh dynamics at play just really drew

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Speaker 1: me into this story. Think about the mundane, everyday issues

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Speaker 1: that come up in your community, where the bus stops are,

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Speaker 1: how schools are funded, what resources are available for what.

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Speaker 1: Now imagine that a well organized coalition of extremists could

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Speaker 1: hijack the conversation around those issues and signing any meaningful

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Speaker 1: progress on them. While reporting for Better Rock USA, Laura

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Speaker 1: found that the issues that you might have once thought

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Speaker 1: about as not really that polarizing would become hotbeds of

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Speaker 1: extremist conspiracy theory. Yeah, I'm wondering in your reporting, have

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Speaker 1: you seen that we're reaching a place for these resources

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Speaker 1: and these things in local government that you would think

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Speaker 1: of as being nonpartisan are just also deeply politicized. Yes. Absolutely,

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Speaker 1: And I mean I think that's really one of the

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Speaker 1: most interesting things about reporting on these issues in a

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Speaker 1: local kind of government context is that we're seeing issues

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Speaker 1: that are traditionally not partisan at all, or at least

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Speaker 1: not partisan in the kind of traditional left versus right

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Speaker 1: sids really become politically charged by politicians or political groups

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Speaker 1: and taking on you know, really kind of high political

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Speaker 1: stakes in ways that we write not previously expect and

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Speaker 1: so like, for example, one of the stories that we

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Speaker 1: reported on in the Bedrock USA podcast, um, which I

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Speaker 1: really hope people listening to this show check out, is

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Speaker 1: a story of how a proposal to build an opioid

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Speaker 1: addiction treatment clinic in a small town called Squid, which

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Speaker 1: is in Washington State, really drove the town apart into

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Speaker 1: two camps. And one side was opposed and the other

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Speaker 1: side was more supportive. And you know, it's not totally

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Speaker 1: unexpected that something like an opioid addiction treatment clinic would

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Speaker 1: be controversial or have supporters or opponents. But what was

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Speaker 1: really unusual is that, especially after the pandemic hit one

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Speaker 1: Facebook group in particular, it was against the clinic very

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Speaker 1: quickly aligned. It solved in support of various far right

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Speaker 1: ideologies around stuff like masking and vaccines, as well as

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Speaker 1: lies around the election results. Um And So I think

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Speaker 1: what's so fascinating and scary about that dynamic is that

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Speaker 1: it not only reflects kind of a broader or political

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Speaker 1: landscape where everything is partisan, everything is kind of a

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Speaker 1: left versus right, you know, cultural issue, but also that

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Speaker 1: this particular local opposition group on Facebook actually became a

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Speaker 1: pathway for radicalizing some people. There were people in this

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Speaker 1: town who were initially drawn into this group to discuss

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Speaker 1: the local clinic issue and discuss, you know, why they

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Speaker 1: were so opposed to it, But then that virtue of

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Speaker 1: being in this online space were exposed to more kind

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Speaker 1: of radical ideas. Um. And I'm not just talking about

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Speaker 1: masking in that scenes. So that's definitely worthy of you know,

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Speaker 1: our conversation. But you know, I was looking at this

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Speaker 1: Facebook group and seeing people you know, post in support

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Speaker 1: of stuff like we're posting in support of sovereign citizen groups. Uh,

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Speaker 1: which sovereign citizen it's kind of a ideology that fansy

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Speaker 1: promotes the idea that people living in the United States

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Speaker 1: can be exempt from US law. Uh And and this

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Speaker 1: is kind of the movement that's been linked over many

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Speaker 1: decades to numerous acts of political violence. You know, you

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Speaker 1: mentioned that someone being opposed to an opioid treatment clinic

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Speaker 1: in their small town. That's not terribly surprising. I can

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Speaker 1: imagine that somebody having that kind of response, but then

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Speaker 1: on an online platform like Facebook, that kind of gets

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Speaker 1: mixed in with anti mask stuff, you know, maybe q

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Speaker 1: and on stuff, election denying stuff. I guess my question

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Speaker 1: would be, how do these things all get kind of

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Speaker 1: wrapped up? You would think that these things would be

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Speaker 1: very disparate, but they all sort of travel in circles,

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Speaker 1: and so like anyone conspiracy theory kind of comes along

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Speaker 1: with multiple harmful conspiracy theories. It seems like, Yeah, I mean,

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Speaker 1: I think a big just part of the dynamic you're

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Speaker 1: you're kind of asking me about is you know, just

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Speaker 1: boils down to the people who are posting, right and

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Speaker 1: we saw in this particular example in Squid Washington. This

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Speaker 1: this opposition group was led by a woman who had

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Speaker 1: actually tried to run for a state legislator position previously.

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Speaker 1: Uh and and she and she was you know, Republican

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Speaker 1: and and sort of carried what what became increasingly pretty

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Speaker 1: extreme views on stuff like masking and vaccines and and

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Speaker 1: also election and so her as well as others the group,

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Speaker 1: you use that space as a forum to post about

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Speaker 1: these other topics and post misinformation and you know, links

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Speaker 1: to YouTube videos that spread lies about stuff like the

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Speaker 1: election or Anthony Fauci. You know, these kinds of hot

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Speaker 1: button you know, topics that became major drivers of of

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Speaker 1: misinformation and and and including Q and on right, which

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Speaker 1: we're seeing you know, has not died. Uh, just seeing

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Speaker 1: the last couple of weeks, you know, Donald Trump increasingly

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Speaker 1: embracing you know, Q and on slogans and kind of

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Speaker 1: Q and on related memes, even as in the birth

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Speaker 1: really disturbing acts of violence linked to Q and on

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Speaker 1: are also going up. Um. So, anyways, to to answer

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Speaker 1: your question directly, I think it really mostly boils down to,

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Speaker 1: you know, just the sort of then diagram of people

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Speaker 1: in these kinds of forums, you're going to have people

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Speaker 1: who are already sort of holding more extreme views and

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Speaker 1: are any are kind of linked to these you know,

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Speaker 1: networks related to conspiracy theories and sort of misinformation networks,

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Speaker 1: and then they're just exposing a wider kind of group

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Speaker 1: of people to those ideas who who may have entered

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Speaker 1: that space for different reasons to begin with. Right. Um. Yeah,

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Speaker 1: Actually I talked to one researcher who had studying this

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Speaker 1: particular Facebook group I'm talking about Squinn Washington, and he

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Speaker 1: was actually able to find an example of one Facebook

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Speaker 1: or of one group member I should say, who you

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Speaker 1: know literally moved from you know, in the time before

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Speaker 1: she joined this Facebook group from being like a Birdie

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Speaker 1: Sanders supporter to you know, posting in support of the

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Speaker 1: Sovereign Citizen movement, which is this very far right kind

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Speaker 1: of ideological movement like I mentioned, um, that promotes this

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Speaker 1: very dangerous and false idea that that you know, you

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Speaker 1: can you can you could be sort of exempt from

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Speaker 1: US law if you apply for this basically fake set

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Speaker 1: of documents. Um. Again, and this is something that's also

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Speaker 1: been linked to to actual political violence. So so this

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Speaker 1: is so it's just a really scary example of how

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Speaker 1: local issues, Uh, you know that traditionally we're sort of

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Speaker 1: outside this normal partisan dynamic are now becoming avenues for

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Speaker 1: you know, radicalization. The normal avenues of talking about what's

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Speaker 1: happening in your community become open like they're being exploited

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Speaker 1: and manipulated in a way that like you can't even

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Speaker 1: have the conversation about your school board, or your potholes

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Speaker 1: or your garbage because those conversations are being so easily

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Speaker 1: manipulated by bad actors. Yeah, and I think actually that

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Speaker 1: touches on a really important point and another I think

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Speaker 1: in are another reason that paying attention to these kind

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Speaker 1: of like local forums is so important, which is that

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Speaker 1: normally we don't pay attention to them, right, Like, local

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Speaker 1: government is the level of government that, on average, you know,

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Speaker 1: we know sort of least about, which is ironic because

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Speaker 1: in some ways it has the most direct impact. Like

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Speaker 1: we all care if our trash gets picked up, you know,

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Speaker 1: we all care about the probles on our roads and

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Speaker 1: our local school systems, but you know, we just sort

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Speaker 1: of take for granted that those things are just gonna

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Speaker 1: happen on their own, and so we tend to pay

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Speaker 1: a lot more attention to you know, national politics or

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Speaker 1: even sort of our state level, you know, political issues

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Speaker 1: than we do to to what's happening in our city

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Speaker 1: council meetings and school board meetings, you know, until now,

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Speaker 1: because these issues are becoming so much more kind of

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Speaker 1: inflamed and and and and extreme. Um. But I but

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Speaker 1: I think you sort of hit an important point, which

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Speaker 1: is that you know, folks who are exploiting, as you say,

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Speaker 1: that level ignorance you know in which most of us

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Speaker 1: exist around our local government. Your people are aware of that,

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Speaker 1: and so they're they're you're getting into these beatings where

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Speaker 1: there isn't necessarily a lot of scrutiny or a lot

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Speaker 1: of awareness in general public, and and you know, taking advantage.

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Speaker 1: Let's take a quick break at our back. It's easy

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Speaker 1: to stay read in on issues at the federal level,

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Speaker 1: you know who's running for president and what they stand for.

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Speaker 1: But if we're being real, I'd be willing to bet

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Speaker 1: that a lot fewer of us are as dialed into

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Speaker 1: issues happening at the local level. And we probably should be,

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Speaker 1: because from county clerk's offices to school boards, these issues

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Speaker 1: can really have a profound impact on our day to

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Speaker 1: day lives. Laura says that extremists exploit our tendency to

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Speaker 1: not always be so invested in local politics, and when

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Speaker 1: we aren't paying close attention, they can swoop in and

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Speaker 1: take over. Yeah, that's exactly what I was excited to

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Speaker 1: talk to you about. Next sort of, can you describe

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Speaker 1: what you've seen in your reporting about how folks have

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Speaker 1: been able to really a mass political power at the

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Speaker 1: local level, really in kind of a sleeper way. Before

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Speaker 1: you know it, you're like, oh, folks have really done

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Speaker 1: done a successful paragraph of our local government. Absolutely so

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Speaker 1: that RECTUSA really tells the story of two communities in particular,

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Speaker 1: and one of them I've already mentioned. It's it's squid Washington,

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Speaker 1: and the other is Shasta County, California, Uh, where the

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Speaker 1: story is really ongoing but played out in a pretty

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Speaker 1: dramatic fashion, especially last year. And Shasta County is a

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Speaker 1: very conservative pocket in northern California. It's a few hours

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Speaker 1: north of Sacramento. Um, it's always been, you know, pretty

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Speaker 1: pretty deep red bastion, but during the pandemic we really

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Speaker 1: saw how uh, you know, folks on the further right

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Speaker 1: end of the spectrum really took advantage of some of

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Speaker 1: the dynamics we've been talking about, you know, just the

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Speaker 1: fact that people don't retally show up to their you know,

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Speaker 1: uh county Board of Supervisor's meetings to sort of hear

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Speaker 1: what's going on. But some people with pretty extreme political

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Speaker 1: views did. Um. And so just to sort of illustrate

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Speaker 1: that a little bit more, a group of uh far

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Speaker 1: right sort of ideologically aligned folks, including militia leaders, uh,

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Speaker 1: you know, State of Jefferson supporters. State of Jefferson is

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Speaker 1: a movement to uh have a chunk of California and

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Speaker 1: a chunk of organ basically succeed some kind of conservative

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Speaker 1: secession fantasy movement, uh, you know, as well as anti

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Speaker 1: masters and just kind of all around disaffected you know,

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Speaker 1: conservatives who were sort of radicalized by the pandemic. All

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Speaker 1: of these folks banned together during COVID to uh we

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Speaker 1: call a conservative Shasta County supervisor. So the county supervisors

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Speaker 1: and Shasta it's it's basically city council but at the

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Speaker 1: county level. And by successfully recalling this person, which they did,

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Speaker 1: uh and install kind of one of their own, they

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Speaker 1: were actually able to shift the balance of power in

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Speaker 1: this conservative county, so that now you know, the board

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Speaker 1: is controlled by a majority of pretty far right individuals UH,

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Speaker 1: and you know, who have done things like, you know,

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Speaker 1: early and earlier this year, you know, repeal the local

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Speaker 1: state of emergency around the pandemic, and UH insists that

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Speaker 1: you know, county board meetings be conduct did in person

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Speaker 1: rather than taking place over zoom to you know, mitigate UH,

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Speaker 1: you know, pandemic risk. UH. And also you know, more worryingly,

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Speaker 1: fire the county public health director excuse me, the county

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Speaker 1: public Health officer. And there's actually been this sort of

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Speaker 1: alarming exodus a very high profile you know county officials

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Speaker 1: who oversee the Department of Health and the county CEO,

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Speaker 1: I believe, but there's been this really kind of worrying

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Speaker 1: exodus of of of high ranking you know, county officials

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Speaker 1: who are experts in their fields, you know, and who

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Speaker 1: really are responsible for just keeping this level of government

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Speaker 1: running in the kind of like day to day functioning

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Speaker 1: way that you know most of us would expect. And so, um,

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Speaker 1: this is a movement that's really alarmed quite a number

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Speaker 1: of residents in Shasta County. But again, in some ways

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Speaker 1: as you've been saying, like it is a reflection of

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Speaker 1: just the overall low level of engagement that most of

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Speaker 1: us have when it comes to what's happening in our

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Speaker 1: own backyards. Yeah, I mean, I'm glad that you're spotlighting this,

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Speaker 1: because I do think that it's just really easy to

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Speaker 1: get super fired up about who's in the White House,

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Speaker 1: who's in the Senate, who's in Congress, And I mean,

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Speaker 1: I think we're all I'm guilty of it. I just

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Speaker 1: think it's like very easy to focus on these bigger

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Speaker 1: conversations and elections and races and really overlook what's happening

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Speaker 1: on your own block and your own neighborhood and on

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Speaker 1: your own street. And so, like one, I'm really glad

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Speaker 1: that you're spotlighting that because it is really important. And

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Speaker 1: I guess my second question would be, you know, should

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Speaker 1: we take the reporting that you've seen in bed Rock,

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Speaker 1: USA as kind of a wake up call as to

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Speaker 1: why it's so critically important that we stay engaged and

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Speaker 1: checked in at the local level as well as the

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Speaker 1: national and federal level. Absolutely, I mean, I hope that

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Speaker 1: is one of the sort of take home messages. Um.

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Speaker 1: And you know, and I will say that you know,

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Speaker 1: local officials who are you know, working in some of

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Speaker 1: these communities where we reported would even say that, you know,

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Speaker 1: silver lining might to too optimistic of a phrase, but

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Speaker 1: you know that that they are glad, you know that

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Speaker 1: there is more attention being paid to the work that

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Speaker 1: they do, you know, as a result of these movements

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Speaker 1: that are you know, otherwise extremely harmful, right, I mean,

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Speaker 1: these are these are movements again that are fuel bus

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Speaker 1: misinformation about stuff like you know, from conspiracy theories like

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Speaker 1: you went on to election denialism and and other just

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Speaker 1: sort of misinformation systems. Um. But but that they are

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Speaker 1: glad that you know, people are showing up to let's say,

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Speaker 1: the elections office in Shasta County. My my producer and

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Speaker 1: I were there in Shasta County in June to report

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Speaker 1: on the UH primary election that took place there. And

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Speaker 1: there was a group of folks you know who were

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Speaker 1: associated with the recall movement and who who held pretty

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Speaker 1: pretty following views taking issue with the results of the election,

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Speaker 1: and that is extremely damaging UH. And at the same time,

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Speaker 1: it meant that the you know, county elections office had

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Speaker 1: more people paying attention to the way the system runs. Um.

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Speaker 1: I think what it really comes down to is the

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Speaker 1: fact that you know, we need more people who are

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Speaker 1: paying attention in good faith, right, who are paying attention

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Speaker 1: to the system and making sure things are going well, uh,

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Speaker 1: you know, with with the belief that democracy should continue. Um.

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Speaker 1: Because unfortunately, you know, many of these groups are are

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Speaker 1: looking at what's happening with a you know, pretty predetermined

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Speaker 1: belief that what's happening cannot be trusted. And so you know,

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Speaker 1: all the observation in the world, you know, are are

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Speaker 1: unlikely is unlikely to to sort of stem that that disbelief. Unfortunately,

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Speaker 1: real we saw that deeply, just just the profound, profound

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Speaker 1: level of mistrust um. And some of these people who

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Speaker 1: have imbibed the the kind of election wise that we're

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Speaker 1: so prominent. UM. But anyways, this is all just to say,

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Speaker 1: you know, we do need more people paying attention in

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Speaker 1: good faith. UM. Because if there's anything I learned from

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Speaker 1: this podcast, and you know, going deep into the uh,

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Speaker 1: you know, halls of local government and the people who

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Speaker 1: make these you know, small bureaucracies work, is that democracy

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Speaker 1: really comes down to people, and it's about the trust

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Speaker 1: that we place in each other and the local level

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Speaker 1: that literally comes down to trusting your neighbors and trusting

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Speaker 1: the people you you know, you go to the grocery

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Speaker 1: store with, and and trusting with people you hand your

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Speaker 1: ballot to. And and we do need that trust to work.

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Speaker 1: And we also need oversight people paying attention to to

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Speaker 1: ensure that you know, that trust is earned. Yeah, I

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Speaker 1: mean I wanted to ask you about that. What role?

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Speaker 1: I mean, it sounds like mistrust and the lack of

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Speaker 1: trust in general is really the thing that is the

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Speaker 1: problem here, right, Like, what role do you think that

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Speaker 1: a lack of trust in our institutions has played in

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Speaker 1: all of this? Oh, it's profound. I mean, it's definitely profound,

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Speaker 1: and it's it's it's not new, clearly. I mean, you know,

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Speaker 1: mistrusted in government, particularly at the at the federal national level,

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Speaker 1: you know, goes back, you know, decades, if not to

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Speaker 1: the founding of our country in some ways. Um, but

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Speaker 1: we're I think the sort of level of mistrust and

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Speaker 1: local government is actually some someone new because for the

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Speaker 1: most part, people tend to place more more trust in

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Speaker 1: the sort of people in institutions that are closest to them. Um.

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Speaker 1: And but we are starting to see that really kind

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Speaker 1: of degrade. And I think the pandemic, you know, played

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Speaker 1: a just a huge role in kind of accelerating this,

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Speaker 1: this crisis of mistrust. Um, you know, because of how

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Speaker 1: you know, our our local leaders and state leaders and

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Speaker 1: national leaders handled the crisis, and and and because of

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Speaker 1: you know, the way online platforms so readily you know,

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Speaker 1: spread and kind of supply misinformation and conspiracy theories to

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Speaker 1: to sort of give people alternate explanations for what was happening. Um.

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Speaker 1: And that's a huge problem. And it's not just in government,

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Speaker 1: it's also in science, it's also in media. And I

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Speaker 1: don't see that profound mistrust going away. And you know,

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Speaker 1: this is a huge problem that every community needs to

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Speaker 1: be confronting on some level. And so you know, again

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Speaker 1: I'm hopeful that there there are you know, folks at

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Speaker 1: every level who who are trying to get engaged or

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Speaker 1: that kind that kind of good faith way. But yeah,

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Speaker 1: this is something we're going to just continue to see

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Speaker 1: more dal quick break, let's get right back into it.

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Speaker 1: So I want to switch gears a little bit. You know,

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Speaker 1: so much of what you have covered on the podcast

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Speaker 1: has been pretty dark, but one of the sort of

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Speaker 1: silver and linings is that people didn't take this sitting

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Speaker 1: down in these in these you know, small communities, they

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Speaker 1: actually organized to resist the takeovers of their communities by

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Speaker 1: these extremist factions. Can you talk a bit about how

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Speaker 1: they were able to do that? Absolutely? So, yeah, the

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Speaker 1: community there is is Squim, Washington. And so this was

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Speaker 1: where okay we were talking about earlier. There was this

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Speaker 1: opiate addiction treatment clinic that was proposed really drove the

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Speaker 1: town into in the opposition group became this kind of

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Speaker 1: like forum for a most radicalization UM and And part

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Speaker 1: of the story too is that, you know, while people

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Speaker 1: were kind of asleep at the wheel, so to speak,

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Speaker 1: or not paying a whole lot of attention to what

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Speaker 1: was happening on their city council UM in this small town,

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Speaker 1: a guy was elected to city council and eventually became

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Speaker 1: mayor who was a professed supporter of Q and on

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Speaker 1: UM at that time, who actually you know, was posting

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Speaker 1: with the Q and on slogan where we go when

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Speaker 1: we go all on his Facebook page, and who eventually

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Speaker 1: would go on local radio station in this small town

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Speaker 1: and kind of uh advertise Q and on and encourage

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Speaker 1: people to go you know, look up YouTube videos that

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Speaker 1: that promoted this dangerous conspiracy theory. And so when that happened,

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Speaker 1: UM and and kind of then uh, all around the

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Speaker 1: same time as the big controversy around the clinic hit,

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Speaker 1: you know, people really freaked out. I mean not everybody, right,

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Speaker 1: because the mayor did that as supporters for sure, particularly

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Speaker 1: in this Facebook group. UM. But there was a group

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Speaker 1: of citizens in this community that came together and said,

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Speaker 1: you know, this is where we draw the line basically, UM.

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Speaker 1: And so they sort of set their eye on the

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Speaker 1: upcoming city council election. Uh. And they formed a group

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Speaker 1: which they called Good Governance League and it was a

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Speaker 1: bipartisan effort or folks on both sides the little while involved,

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Speaker 1: including other city council members um. One of it was

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Speaker 1: a Republican UM. And they campaigned together to say, you know,

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Speaker 1: we you know, the people of Squim care that our

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Speaker 1: government runs on facts. They banded together and say, what

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Speaker 1: we care most about is that our city council runs

432
00:27:48,040 --> 00:27:51,160
Speaker 1: on facts, and that you know, our city council members

433
00:27:51,160 --> 00:27:54,520
Speaker 1: are not that our city council members are paying attention

434
00:27:54,560 --> 00:27:57,320
Speaker 1: to the issues that affect us and not to you know,

435
00:27:57,400 --> 00:28:02,080
Speaker 1: conspiracy theories that are prominent at the national level, or

436
00:28:02,119 --> 00:28:05,680
Speaker 1: you know, to these kinds of national level political trends

437
00:28:05,720 --> 00:28:08,439
Speaker 1: that are there reshaping our country. We really want, you know,

438
00:28:08,520 --> 00:28:11,440
Speaker 1: our local leaders to focus on local issues. And so

439
00:28:11,520 --> 00:28:14,960
Speaker 1: that was really the message they campaigned on and they

440
00:28:16,880 --> 00:28:21,520
Speaker 1: member of candidates for city council. And I have to say,

441
00:28:21,560 --> 00:28:24,600
Speaker 1: they didn't really do anything particularly novel, right. I think

442
00:28:24,640 --> 00:28:28,199
Speaker 1: what was so striking about this story is that, you know,

443
00:28:28,240 --> 00:28:31,320
Speaker 1: they just deployed the tactics that organizers have been using

444
00:28:31,440 --> 00:28:34,280
Speaker 1: for decades, you know, if not forever. They went door

445
00:28:34,320 --> 00:28:37,480
Speaker 1: to door, They you know, talked to their fellow neighbors

446
00:28:37,480 --> 00:28:39,880
Speaker 1: about what was going on in their town. They just

447
00:28:39,960 --> 00:28:42,640
Speaker 1: kind of spread awareness about you know, what the mayor

448
00:28:42,800 --> 00:28:45,920
Speaker 1: was all about, what he was saying. You know, they

449
00:28:45,960 --> 00:28:51,240
Speaker 1: sent emails, they wrote postcards, just these kind of traditional methods,

450
00:28:51,480 --> 00:28:56,560
Speaker 1: and uh, they were successful. And so I do think

451
00:28:56,560 --> 00:29:01,680
Speaker 1: that that is a encouraging story about no just pretty

452
00:29:01,840 --> 00:29:04,800
Speaker 1: regular people, you know, drawing the line in the sand

453
00:29:05,520 --> 00:29:08,920
Speaker 1: around the way they wanted their government to work and

454
00:29:09,000 --> 00:29:11,200
Speaker 1: kind of what that meant for their local democracy, and

455
00:29:11,560 --> 00:29:16,840
Speaker 1: they did something about it. And I do think that

456
00:29:17,000 --> 00:29:19,040
Speaker 1: you know, just looking at some of the tactics and

457
00:29:19,080 --> 00:29:22,040
Speaker 1: methods they use, Like, I think that could definitely be

458
00:29:22,200 --> 00:29:25,720
Speaker 1: repeated in other communities. Well yeah, I mean that brings

459
00:29:25,760 --> 00:29:28,440
Speaker 1: me to one of my last questions for you. Given

460
00:29:28,480 --> 00:29:31,120
Speaker 1: all that you've reported on with bed Rock USA, are

461
00:29:31,160 --> 00:29:33,920
Speaker 1: you hopeful for the state of democracy, for the state

462
00:29:34,040 --> 00:29:37,560
Speaker 1: of politics and the way that decisions get made and

463
00:29:37,680 --> 00:29:44,040
Speaker 1: progress gets made in small towns? Who am I hopeful?

464
00:29:44,200 --> 00:29:47,520
Speaker 1: It's a it's a it's a tough question. Uh, you know,

465
00:29:47,560 --> 00:29:54,120
Speaker 1: I think I think we are in a really scary

466
00:29:54,160 --> 00:30:03,040
Speaker 1: spot right now. I mean, we have a significant proportion

467
00:30:03,200 --> 00:30:07,040
Speaker 1: of our voting public, you know, who still question the

468
00:30:07,720 --> 00:30:11,760
Speaker 1: election results. Uh, you know, who are likely to continue

469
00:30:11,840 --> 00:30:15,880
Speaker 1: to question the results of elections moving forward based on

470
00:30:17,960 --> 00:30:21,040
Speaker 1: beliefs that are just not rooted in fact, right. I mean,

471
00:30:21,120 --> 00:30:24,600
Speaker 1: we saw this in we are seeing it in local

472
00:30:24,600 --> 00:30:27,880
Speaker 1: elections moving forward, and we're very likely to see it

473
00:30:28,120 --> 00:30:33,880
Speaker 1: during mid terms. Um. And that's really scary, you know,

474
00:30:34,840 --> 00:30:37,320
Speaker 1: at the national level and also on the local level

475
00:30:37,360 --> 00:30:41,160
Speaker 1: because again, like a lot of us just aren't paying attention.

476
00:30:41,400 --> 00:30:45,520
Speaker 1: You know, local media outlets have been drained of their

477
00:30:45,560 --> 00:30:48,840
Speaker 1: resources to cover a lot of local elections, and so

478
00:30:49,680 --> 00:30:52,720
Speaker 1: there just isn't going to be you know, as much

479
00:30:52,800 --> 00:30:57,400
Speaker 1: coverage as as there should be of you know, election

480
00:30:57,480 --> 00:31:04,160
Speaker 1: deniers harassing election works for example, or you know pressuring, uh,

481
00:31:04,200 --> 00:31:08,080
Speaker 1: you know local officials too, you know, perform and necessary

482
00:31:08,120 --> 00:31:12,400
Speaker 1: investigations or or even throughout election results potentially. I mean

483
00:31:13,280 --> 00:31:18,600
Speaker 1: all things that you know we saw play out to

484
00:31:18,600 --> 00:31:21,360
Speaker 1: to sort of different degrees in the election. I think

485
00:31:21,360 --> 00:31:24,239
Speaker 1: we are going to continue to see that happen. And

486
00:31:24,320 --> 00:31:29,160
Speaker 1: so you know where that leads. When you have a

487
00:31:29,560 --> 00:31:33,120
Speaker 1: populous that does not accept the results of a sound

488
00:31:33,200 --> 00:31:37,120
Speaker 1: election is I don't know if you can call it

489
00:31:37,200 --> 00:31:44,160
Speaker 1: a democracy anymore, right, So, so that is really scary. Um.

490
00:31:44,280 --> 00:31:47,240
Speaker 1: I think that you know, based on my reporting, you

491
00:31:47,280 --> 00:31:51,840
Speaker 1: know where I put my hope I suppose is you know,

492
00:31:51,880 --> 00:31:54,560
Speaker 1: in groups of people who do you know, decide to

493
00:31:55,440 --> 00:32:02,640
Speaker 1: come together around a common belief and even you know,

494
00:32:02,800 --> 00:32:05,760
Speaker 1: faith that the system can work and that it should

495
00:32:05,800 --> 00:32:09,560
Speaker 1: work and that it can be better. Um. And also

496
00:32:09,760 --> 00:32:12,080
Speaker 1: just in some of the local officials I met, who

497
00:32:12,240 --> 00:32:14,440
Speaker 1: you know are continuing to do their jobs because they

498
00:32:14,480 --> 00:32:18,320
Speaker 1: believe so wholeheartedly in that system that they're just continuing

499
00:32:18,360 --> 00:32:22,000
Speaker 1: to do their jobs under really really challenging circumstances. You know,

500
00:32:22,040 --> 00:32:25,040
Speaker 1: in communities like Shasta County where there are just a

501
00:32:25,080 --> 00:32:28,520
Speaker 1: lot of people who do not trust the work that

502
00:32:28,560 --> 00:32:31,240
Speaker 1: you know, election workers do, or some of the you know,

503
00:32:31,280 --> 00:32:36,760
Speaker 1: county officials who run the health department for example. Um,

504
00:32:36,800 --> 00:32:40,320
Speaker 1: and they're harassed, you know, and they're they received threats,

505
00:32:40,440 --> 00:32:43,520
Speaker 1: and they are you know, doing their jobs in the

506
00:32:43,560 --> 00:32:46,240
Speaker 1: face of just really serious threats to the work that

507
00:32:46,280 --> 00:32:50,480
Speaker 1: they do. Um. But but they're persevering. And you know,

508
00:32:50,480 --> 00:32:53,600
Speaker 1: I'll say that this kind of environment is really discouraging

509
00:32:53,800 --> 00:32:56,000
Speaker 1: to a lot of people who might otherwise consider that

510
00:32:56,080 --> 00:32:58,920
Speaker 1: kind of work. But it's just it's so important. Um.

511
00:32:59,040 --> 00:33:03,160
Speaker 1: They're they're literally keeping or our kind of system running. UM.

512
00:33:03,240 --> 00:33:06,040
Speaker 1: So some of those folks give me, give me hope,

513
00:33:06,080 --> 00:33:11,480
Speaker 1: But I think the overall picture is is definitely scary. Oh.

514
00:33:11,560 --> 00:33:13,840
Speaker 1: I mean, I find this time and time again, it's

515
00:33:13,880 --> 00:33:15,840
Speaker 1: the people that make the only thing that gives me

516
00:33:15,880 --> 00:33:17,640
Speaker 1: any hope in covering any of this is the people.

517
00:33:18,280 --> 00:33:22,160
Speaker 1: Like the people working together coming together will always be

518
00:33:22,200 --> 00:33:25,440
Speaker 1: more powerful than the dark forces, I choose to believe,

519
00:33:25,480 --> 00:33:27,520
Speaker 1: and so that's the only way I have any hope

520
00:33:27,520 --> 00:33:31,440
Speaker 1: about any of this at all. Yep, yep, I mean,

521
00:33:31,600 --> 00:33:35,400
Speaker 1: and I think it's kind of it's like it's obvious,

522
00:33:35,440 --> 00:33:39,800
Speaker 1: but it's also kind of profound, right as I'm gonna

523
00:33:39,840 --> 00:33:42,320
Speaker 1: try to sort of say this earlier and probably was

524
00:33:42,320 --> 00:33:48,719
Speaker 1: pretty inarticulate, but like that is really the like and

525
00:33:48,760 --> 00:33:52,200
Speaker 1: not so profound, but kind of profound conclusion that gave

526
00:33:52,240 --> 00:33:55,000
Speaker 1: to in this whole reporting project project. It is just that,

527
00:33:56,000 --> 00:33:59,240
Speaker 1: you know, we think of democracy is like this abstract

528
00:34:00,040 --> 00:34:05,400
Speaker 1: institution and you know, this this like hallowed set of

529
00:34:05,520 --> 00:34:09,120
Speaker 1: processes and kind of rituals that it's just supposed to happen.

530
00:34:09,239 --> 00:34:12,920
Speaker 1: And and you know, democracy sounds like it's building or

531
00:34:12,960 --> 00:34:16,480
Speaker 1: something or like a like a physical structure, but it's people.

532
00:34:16,640 --> 00:34:18,919
Speaker 1: I mean literally, it comes down to the people who

533
00:34:18,920 --> 00:34:23,960
Speaker 1: are counting the balance and and running you know, polling

534
00:34:24,040 --> 00:34:29,920
Speaker 1: locations and you know, literally tabulating votes at the end

535
00:34:29,920 --> 00:34:32,040
Speaker 1: of the day. Right, And of course it's also the

536
00:34:32,040 --> 00:34:35,240
Speaker 1: people who we like to represent us, but it is people.

537
00:34:35,680 --> 00:34:38,200
Speaker 1: It really does come down to people. And and whether

538
00:34:38,400 --> 00:34:41,560
Speaker 1: you know, we can and do trust those we have

539
00:34:41,600 --> 00:34:44,280
Speaker 1: put in positions that you know, ought to be worthy

540
00:34:44,280 --> 00:34:48,239
Speaker 1: of our trust. But I completely agree with you. I

541
00:34:48,239 --> 00:34:51,200
Speaker 1: think we have to be looking to each other because

542
00:34:51,440 --> 00:34:53,920
Speaker 1: that's all we have that's all we have is one

543
00:34:53,920 --> 00:34:56,799
Speaker 1: another to sort of maas for system work or where

544
00:34:56,840 --> 00:34:59,000
Speaker 1: can people find the podcast and keep up with all

545
00:34:59,040 --> 00:35:02,799
Speaker 1: your work? Absolutely so, bed Rocky was Say is available

546
00:35:02,880 --> 00:35:07,520
Speaker 1: anywhere you listen to podcasts. You're finding on Apple podcast, Spotify,

547
00:35:08,200 --> 00:35:12,239
Speaker 1: iHeart Radio, um born Bloomberg dot com, and you can

548
00:35:12,280 --> 00:35:19,640
Speaker 1: follow me on Twitter. I'm at miss Laura Bliss. Got

549
00:35:19,640 --> 00:35:21,600
Speaker 1: a story about an interesting thing in tech, or just

550
00:35:21,640 --> 00:35:23,640
Speaker 1: want to say hi? You can reach us at Hello

551
00:35:23,680 --> 00:35:26,160
Speaker 1: at tang godi dot com. You can also find transcripts

552
00:35:26,160 --> 00:35:28,640
Speaker 1: for today's episode at tangdi dot com. There Are No

553
00:35:28,680 --> 00:35:30,719
Speaker 1: Girls on the Internet was created by me bridget Toad.

554
00:35:31,120 --> 00:35:34,160
Speaker 1: It's a production of iHeart Radio and Unboss creative Jonathan

555
00:35:34,200 --> 00:35:37,200
Speaker 1: Strickland as our executive producer. Terry Harrison is our producer

556
00:35:37,200 --> 00:35:41,080
Speaker 1: and sound engineer. Michaelmato is our contributing producer. I'm your host,

557
00:35:41,120 --> 00:35:43,920
Speaker 1: bridget Toad. If you want to help us grow, rate

558
00:35:43,960 --> 00:35:47,080
Speaker 1: and review us on Apple Podcasts. For more podcasts from

559
00:35:47,080 --> 00:35:49,680
Speaker 1: iHeart Radio, check out the iHeart Radio app, Apple podcast,

560
00:35:49,800 --> 00:36:01,880
Speaker 1: or wherever you get your podcasts. The Well Wait