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Speaker 1: Hey, what up? Welcome in, Um, Doug Gottlieb. This is

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Speaker 1: all ball, all basketball, all the time, and we are here.

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Speaker 1: It is that time of year, March badness. Um, I'm

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Speaker 1: glad you love the Woe Joe Pods. If you doubt

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Speaker 1: didn't get a chance to listen to them, download them

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Speaker 1: or we download this one All Ball with me Doug Gottlieb.

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Speaker 1: Of course, remember the Doug Gottlieb Show is daily three

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Speaker 1: to six Eastern twelve three Pacific, Fox Sports Radio, I

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Speaker 1: Heart Radio IP you can download that podcast forum as well.

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Speaker 1: But the Woe Joe Pods at Steve bo Jahowski, we

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Speaker 1: we cut into three parts really really really well received,

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Speaker 1: very very interesting, and I thought, man, we got to

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Speaker 1: some places I didn't I didn't think we would get to,

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Speaker 1: but it was. It was great. So download those ones

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Speaker 1: and listen. I have a bunch of other pods getting

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Speaker 1: ready for you. Will continue to bring you so many

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Speaker 1: of the big name players, coaches, people around college basketball

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Speaker 1: in the n c A tournman so you can learn

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Speaker 1: more about it, learn more about these matchups, make smarter bets. Um.

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Speaker 1: I do want to tell you I've I've now seen

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Speaker 1: Chet in person, Paolo in person. I've seen Jabari in person.

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Speaker 1: I've seen Jaden Ivy in person. I've she seen Keegan

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Speaker 1: Murray in person. So, in other words, all those top

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Speaker 1: guys that that you believe as I do, that they

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Speaker 1: will be drafted high in the NBA draft, I've gotten

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Speaker 1: a chance to see in person. And that's not humble bragg. Okay,

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Speaker 1: maybe it's a little bit humble bragg, but a lot

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Speaker 1: of it's humble brag simply because, Um, seeing them in

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Speaker 1: person is very, very different than seeing them on tape. Um,

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Speaker 1: I haven't seen Jalen Durham in person. Shaden Sharp didn't

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Speaker 1: play when I was there. I saw a J. Griffin.

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Speaker 1: I've seen Johnny Davis in person as well. I've seen

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Speaker 1: Tai Tai. I've seen Oh Chai in person several times.

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Speaker 1: E J. Ladell in person, UM Walker Kessler in person.

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Speaker 1: So you know of the Malachi Abrandum of the top

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Speaker 1: twenty guys, I would say I've seen fifteen of them,

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Speaker 1: at least in person. I haven't seen Diyson Daniels play

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Speaker 1: because I haven't watched the I've seen him play on TV,

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Speaker 1: but not in person anyway. Um, and I'm not sure

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Speaker 1: that Keegan Murray shouldn't be in the conversation that number

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Speaker 1: one overall. Pick Now, what I was blown away by

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Speaker 1: from Jabari is not any one thing he does, although

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Speaker 1: he shoots it really well from three and kind of

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Speaker 1: like Keegan, like they're so big they can just shoot

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Speaker 1: over people. And what isn't what isn't a good shot

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Speaker 1: now obviously has changed and you know, contested shots are

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Speaker 1: seen as as as more viable shots if your feet

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Speaker 1: are set, you're on time int the especially if you're big.

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Speaker 1: So I look at it and I'm like, you know, uh,

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Speaker 1: they both have great size. I think Keegan is a

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Speaker 1: little bit more developed physically, but also he's been in

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Speaker 1: college a year longer. Believe he's year older. They both

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Speaker 1: shoot it really well. They both shoot it kind of

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Speaker 1: over people with without any sort of fear. Again, I

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Speaker 1: would say Keegan is a little bit more advanced in

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Speaker 1: his shot taking, shot making. Um, I don't think Jabari

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Speaker 1: gets by people as well as Keegan does. And Keegan

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Speaker 1: kind of like Jabari, they just with their length of

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Speaker 1: their arms and hand size, they just they cause a

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Speaker 1: lot of disruption defensively more so than anything great they

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Speaker 1: do on the ball. They're They're not bad defenders in

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Speaker 1: any way, but I think their length helps them and

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Speaker 1: they use it very, very smartly. Like I just there's

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Speaker 1: a Keegan Murray instead of Jabari discussion. Now I've seen Chet,

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Speaker 1: and Chet's different. He he is really thin. Um. He

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Speaker 1: does really affect the game with his functional length and

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Speaker 1: shop locking. Uh. He's not nearly as developed as a shooter,

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Speaker 1: even though it looks like eventually it's going to go

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Speaker 1: in and go in a bunch, probably starting next year,

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Speaker 1: like if he was in college and a couple of

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Speaker 1: years in the pros. I'm just we're much more worried

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Speaker 1: about him defending out in the perimeter as opposed to

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Speaker 1: the other two. Now he's better at the rim, but

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Speaker 1: he's so thin, and I don't know what he'll look

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Speaker 1: like when you when you add that size. I just

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Speaker 1: I walked away from the Big Ten tournament thinking I

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Speaker 1: don't love Jaden Ivy's interaction with teammates. I love so

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Speaker 1: much about his game right that it's like he just

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Speaker 1: he has a step athletically that no one I've seen,

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Speaker 1: none of they got the guards seemed to have. Uh.

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Speaker 1: And now he's gotten to where he can make kind

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Speaker 1: of his set shot not really a shooter off the

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Speaker 1: dribble yet um. And as a finisher, he's got a

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Speaker 1: gear again if you have. He does not have as

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Speaker 1: advanced to finishing and passing game off of penetration as

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Speaker 1: you probably need to have in order to be a

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Speaker 1: star in the NBA. But I think that's coming. I mean,

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Speaker 1: you look at his improvement offensively from last year to

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Speaker 1: this year is remarkable. There's no reason to believe that

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Speaker 1: it won't continue to improve over time. But the part

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Speaker 1: that I don't know is I don't know if that

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Speaker 1: interaction issue. It sounds like this his teammates hate him,

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Speaker 1: like you know, you can watch and teammates just don't

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Speaker 1: like that they like him. He's just not in rhythm

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Speaker 1: with them, and there's just a different I don't know

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Speaker 1: how to express it. You gotta see it in person

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Speaker 1: and understand that he does not fit the bill as

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Speaker 1: this kind of purdue all in about our team. Guy.

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Speaker 1: Doesn't mean that he's selfish, but they're definitely not completely

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Speaker 1: aligned as some teams are. Does that Does that makes sense?

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Speaker 1: I think it makes sense anyway. Again, he's now he's

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Speaker 1: the guard and everybody else is big and big and

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Speaker 1: and you know, can handle on sub level and play

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Speaker 1: that versatile basketball. But he's the one kind of dominant

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Speaker 1: lead guard. On the other hand, he's not really a

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Speaker 1: dominant lead guard in college. He there's a lot of

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Speaker 1: Westbrook to him. And now he's a better shooter at

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Speaker 1: this stage than Westbrook was, although you know, college basketball

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Speaker 1: is so different than Westbrook didn't have to shoot, but

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Speaker 1: there's a similarity there in the gear that he has

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Speaker 1: that nobody else seems to have. And yet not really

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Speaker 1: a point guard and not really a leader of that team.

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Speaker 1: But no means is he a bad player. Would he

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Speaker 1: be a stay away. It's just if you're going to

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Speaker 1: put him in an environment to succeed, it's got to

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Speaker 1: be one in which he's likely to see success. And

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Speaker 1: placing him, you know, as for example, a lead ball

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Speaker 1: in handlers that's not gonna help him. And making him

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Speaker 1: a leader of your team when he's not naturally a leader,

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Speaker 1: I'm not sure that's gonna help him. If I were drafting,

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Speaker 1: I thought it was Jabari and Paolo and chet all

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Speaker 1: year long. I think now I'm in the polo. I'm

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Speaker 1: in the Excuse me, Keegan and Jabari for the one,

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Speaker 1: whoever you don't like for the two, Polo for the three,

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Speaker 1: and I would It would be a hard call based

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Speaker 1: upon what I would need Chet over Jade and Ivy.

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Speaker 1: Even though I like, you know, Chet blending in with

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Speaker 1: a team better than Ja Nivy, j nives athleticism may

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Speaker 1: limit him some when he gets to you know, deep

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Speaker 1: NBA playoffs, you really gotta be able to shoot the ball.

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Speaker 1: You can't get to the rim nearly. But in regular

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Speaker 1: season play, I mean that guys can be living at

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Speaker 1: the rim and it's a pretty good living. So I

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Speaker 1: think I'd take Chet ahead of him, but not by

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Speaker 1: a ton. All right, let's get to it. Richard Bertina

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Speaker 1: has become a friend over the years. Of course, he

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Speaker 1: coached UM, most recently at the University of Minnesota before

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Speaker 1: getting the job this past offseason at New Mexico. I

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Speaker 1: got a chance to catch up with him. He gave

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Speaker 1: me his thoughts on what went wrong at Minnesota and

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Speaker 1: what's allowed him to kind of stay balanced in UH

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Speaker 1: in this part of his career. Considering you know, the

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Speaker 1: name that he carries with him, I think the question

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Speaker 1: everybody wants to know, honestly is what it was like

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Speaker 1: to be you as a kid, right, Like, because obviously

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Speaker 1: you know your your dad's life and career has been

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Speaker 1: wildly discussed, but I mean there's so many turns and whatever.

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Speaker 1: But for you, like his son bearing his name, what

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Speaker 1: was it like to be you as a kid? I

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Speaker 1: would say for a thirty nine year old, I have

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Speaker 1: seen so many highs and lows in this profession, um,

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Speaker 1: and growing up kind of what was interesting to me

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Speaker 1: was like And obviously Calipari's family could tell you Kentucky

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Speaker 1: is not a normal way to live. Um, as your

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Speaker 1: dad being the head coach of Kentucky, this is not

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Speaker 1: a knock on the place, but it's just not real life.

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Speaker 1: I mean, it's the fanfare of the hooplah. All of

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Speaker 1: it was so extreme, um and he was there for

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Speaker 1: what eight years and six was postseason eligible, went to

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Speaker 1: multiple Final four's, elite age. I mean, just insane excess success.

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Speaker 1: And your dad is this rock star. And I've never

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Speaker 1: been one of these people who embraces any of that, Like,

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Speaker 1: I am not about that life. UM, I don't love attention.

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Speaker 1: I don't you know. I just wanted to do my

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Speaker 1: job to the best of my ability. I want to

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Speaker 1: be a great father, I want to be a great husband,

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Speaker 1: I want to be a great friend. But like I

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Speaker 1: am not in this profession for fame. That's not what

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Speaker 1: I like. So leaving there and going to Boston two

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Speaker 1: extremes like Boston they don't care, like you know, they're

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Speaker 1: they're either you win or you lose. And I loved Boston. Um,

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Speaker 1: I consider myself to be kind of from that. So

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Speaker 1: then you're going like on top of the world highest

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Speaker 1: paid coaching contract whatever in Boston in NBA history. And

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Speaker 1: I thought the NBA was really cool, like following every night,

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Speaker 1: like I love basketball. So Kobe had this or you know,

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Speaker 1: Michael had this, Like that was so much fun to

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Speaker 1: be a part of. But he didn't win. Um at

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Speaker 1: the level of and you know in the NBA. Like

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Speaker 1: not to say it's not about coaching, but if you

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Speaker 1: don't have the players you have, you have no chance.

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Speaker 1: It don't matter who the coaches. You look at Coach

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Speaker 1: Popovitch right now, like they understand what the roster is

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Speaker 1: like like like the example, he can't suddenly become an idiot, right,

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Speaker 1: he didn't suddenly become the middle of the pack. Coach

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Speaker 1: he's a spectaculor coach, but you can only do so much.

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Speaker 1: And so I believe March first is the anniversary of

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Speaker 1: the Bill Russell is not what Larry but does not

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Speaker 1: wanting to do that door right, right, and and what

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Speaker 1: he's saying is right, It's just people don't know how

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Speaker 1: to how to take it. They just they don't want

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Speaker 1: to admit it that they think. Here's what they think.

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Speaker 1: They think, Well, if it's all players, what do we

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Speaker 1: need you for? Right? What the truth is like, there's

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Speaker 1: there's a there's it's as we all know, as a combination.

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Speaker 1: No one's ever done without players, but no players ever

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Speaker 1: done without proper coaching, right, So it does kind of

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Speaker 1: work together. But again, you're you're a you're a kid, right,

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Speaker 1: And so like you said, your dad is a rock star.

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Speaker 1: Your dad really was one of the first to bring

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Speaker 1: kind of style and panash as a dresser on the sidelines,

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Speaker 1: you know, from his time with the Knicks and he

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Speaker 1: gets to Kentucky and there's a different level of is

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Speaker 1: just a different level of level of like elegant to

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Speaker 1: how his presentation right, Like I don't know if your

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Speaker 1: dad around the house was like unshaven and was it

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Speaker 1: his sweats? And but you never you'd never see him

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Speaker 1: that way publicly, you know, he was always very very

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Speaker 1: put together. Anyway, I'm just wondering, like from your when

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Speaker 1: you close your eyes you think back those days, what

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Speaker 1: was it like? You know, because there because you're at

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Speaker 1: school and like, as you said, like kids are vicious

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Speaker 1: because they repeat what their parents say. I was was

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Speaker 1: it I want to stay the hell away from this profession?

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Speaker 1: Was it? I love it and I want to be

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Speaker 1: around it. I think that, Yeah, I think like that's

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Speaker 1: where I think the Boston thing came in, because Kentucky

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Speaker 1: was like utopia because they didn't lose. You know, they

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Speaker 1: were winning so much. I mean he legitimately Nazi Mohammed

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Speaker 1: miss free throws. They should have been back to back champs, um,

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Speaker 1: you know, like and then the next year when he

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Speaker 1: leaves Tubby Smith wins so like I mean, as close

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Speaker 1: to a dynasty as you're gonna get. Um. But to me,

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Speaker 1: it was never like real world. I was never really

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Speaker 1: consumed with any of that. When I got to Boston,

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Speaker 1: it just felt more normal because you had the Red Sox,

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Speaker 1: you had the Celtics, you had the Bruins you have.

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Speaker 1: I mean, you had a million things going on, and like,

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Speaker 1: I really liked it because I'm not like when you were.

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Speaker 1: When you were living in Kentucky, you go out to eat.

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Speaker 1: My mom's not much of a cook, so we'd go

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Speaker 1: out to eat a lot, and you'd have a line

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Speaker 1: waiting for you at the table. Now this was before

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Speaker 1: cell phones where everybody's taking pictures. This is we want

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Speaker 1: an autograph, And honestly, it's just I didn't like it

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Speaker 1: at all. Um. So when you go to Boston, nobody

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Speaker 1: cares about that stuff. They just don't. Doesn't mean that

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Speaker 1: they don't care about I mean, they care about their sports.

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Speaker 1: They love their sports. But if you don't win, like

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Speaker 1: they're could be all over you. So going through the

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Speaker 1: like you said yesterday was Larry Burns. I walked through

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Speaker 1: that door and just seeing where your dad is, this

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Speaker 1: guy who never ever lost, And now you're in your

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Speaker 1: formative years and you're dealing with all this insanity of

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Speaker 1: the Celtics and so on. So I don't know, I

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Speaker 1: think it's shaped me for who I am because I

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Speaker 1: just don't buy into any of it. Like I am

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Speaker 1: a I've had really good years as a coach, and

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Speaker 1: I've had bad years as a coach, and I just

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Speaker 1: try to stay as level headed with all of it

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Speaker 1: as possible. I tried to. When somebody comes up to

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Speaker 1: me and says something nice, I appreciate. If somebody says

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Speaker 1: something mean, I'm like whatever, you know, I'm just kinda

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Speaker 1: that's the way it rolls. But everybody's not wired that way.

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Speaker 1: You know. There's a lot of guys too, and they

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Speaker 1: might not admit it on a recorded podcast or radio,

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Speaker 1: but there's a lot of guys that are very bitter, right,

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Speaker 1: very bitter because and the point they make is a

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Speaker 1: good one. It's like, you know, we had play a

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Speaker 1: good years, we have one bad years. You want to

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Speaker 1: fire me right like? You know, there's just and there's

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Speaker 1: a level of or or media guys who they when

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Speaker 1: you're winning, their your friend. When you're losing, you know,

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Speaker 1: they know there are other issues at play, right they

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Speaker 1: know there's things you can't say about a kid, about

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Speaker 1: an injury, he get screwed by a ref. There's administratively,

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Speaker 1: there's some but they don't there's just my from doing

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Speaker 1: this as the son of a far less accomplished coach,

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Speaker 1: and then as uh as a broadcaster. You're the rarity.

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Speaker 1: That's kind of why I'm fascinated by you have a

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Speaker 1: piece about you or so many other guys. Either they're

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Speaker 1: trying to break out of the shadow of their father,

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Speaker 1: they're bitter at how people have media, has fans have

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Speaker 1: treated them, or it's just all of the for lack

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Speaker 1: of a better word, bullshit, you know. It just it

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Speaker 1: makes them angry. You don't have that and I and

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Speaker 1: I'm wondering where that comes from. I'm wondering how you

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Speaker 1: found that that piece. Yeah, that's a great question. And

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Speaker 1: I think I try very hard to be that way. Um.

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Speaker 1: I think that when I was because people do say

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Speaker 1: that to me a lot, like I can't believe you

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Speaker 1: are the way you are. And not that my dad

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Speaker 1: is bad, but he's so different than what I am.

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Speaker 1: I mean, my dad's great, he's a great dad, but

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Speaker 1: he's I'm just way more. I just try to be

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Speaker 1: more normal with all of it. Um, I don't know.

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Speaker 1: I think and and and this is and I'm but

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Speaker 1: this is the fairest way I can say. It's not

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Speaker 1: his fault. I know, like like here's the here's the

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Speaker 1: here's the the every internetctent. Ever, now with your dad

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Speaker 1: is from as a broadcaster, is you know, you get

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Speaker 1: to you get to watch and be around practice and

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Speaker 1: it's like art, right because he just has the whole thing.

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Speaker 1: When it was at Louisville, it was just like art

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Speaker 1: with the microphone and everything. You're like, this is what

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Speaker 1: it's all supposed to look like. You know, it's amazing.

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Speaker 1: And then you know he comes over his scize very nice.

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Speaker 1: And then you get that little time before the game.

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Speaker 1: You know, he calls me in and he knows the

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Speaker 1: questions you're gonna ask. He gives you what they're looking

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Speaker 1: to do. Everybody's playing. It's very nice, shake hands and

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Speaker 1: now I'm gonna go talk to tem and like that

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Speaker 1: to it right because he gets everybody's asking for attention

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Speaker 1: and ever and for years he's had to deal with

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Speaker 1: this where he has to be a little bit and

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Speaker 1: you know, like I'm not close to them, so I'm

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Speaker 1: sure it's different with the Vitals and of the other guys.

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Speaker 1: But the point is he he kind of has to

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Speaker 1: be that way. But it is interesting, like your sentence

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Speaker 1: you said was the before the first time I met

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Speaker 1: you out as an assistant, and then I thought the

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Speaker 1: same thing as that had coached, and everybody talks like

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Speaker 1: he the way he is. It's just it's just different.

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Speaker 1: So it's it's shocking how normal you are. What is

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Speaker 1: it that gives you that balance? Yeah, I think I'm

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Speaker 1: not a yoga guy, but I do it is important

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Speaker 1: to me to be that way. Like it just is.

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Speaker 1: Like I do think my mentality is that, like I

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Speaker 1: there was a sense of pride that I had in

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Speaker 1: myself to make sure everybody knew that even though I

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Speaker 1: got fired at Minnesota, Like, it's not gonna define me. Uh,

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Speaker 1: I'm not gonna be bitter. I'm gonna be break grateful

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Speaker 1: for the eight years. Um, So it's just important to me.

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Speaker 1: I don't know. I mean, it's it's I'm just not

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Speaker 1: one of those those guys that really really feeds in

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Speaker 1: all that I think working. I think that the decision

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Speaker 1: I made to go from so I was an assistant coach,

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Speaker 1: I was at College Charleston, Duquesne, Northeastern, and then I

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Speaker 1: went to for two years and I had a decision

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Speaker 1: to make to go to Florida, And I think that

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Speaker 1: decision was the best thing I ever made, because I

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Speaker 1: got out of my comfort zone, and I went to

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Speaker 1: work for Billy Donovan, who everybody thinks my dad and

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Speaker 1: Billy are similar. They're really not similar at all. There's

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Speaker 1: a similar drive and they're both again like, this makes

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Speaker 1: it sound like my dad's bad, like bad, Like my

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Speaker 1: dad has impacted a lot of people's lives and is

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Speaker 1: an amazing father and one of my best friends. But

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Speaker 1: then I go to Billy and he's just so different

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Speaker 1: and the way that he lives his life is different,

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Speaker 1: like my Dad's one of those guys where when it's

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Speaker 1: the offseason, Hey, let's let's fly to Miami and let's

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Speaker 1: play golf, and let's go to dinner and let's it's

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Speaker 1: just like all right. And then Billy is the other

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Speaker 1: way like because go to the beach with the family

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Speaker 1: and and and live that low key life. And I

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Speaker 1: just thought, for me, I just liked that better. Um,

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Speaker 1: we all want to win in a high level and

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Speaker 1: we all want to be as great of a a coach

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Speaker 1: as we can be. But I just thought Billy was

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Speaker 1: at peace with He's not coaching because he wants money.

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Speaker 1: He's not coaching because he wants fame. He's coaching because

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Speaker 1: he wants to be the best coach he can be

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Speaker 1: for himself, and that was really good for me. Fox

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Speaker 1: Sports Radio has the best sports talk lineup in the nation.

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00:20:24,680 --> 00:20:27,600
Speaker 1: Catch all of our shows at Fox sports Radio dot

357
00:20:27,640 --> 00:20:30,639
Speaker 1: com and within the I Heart Radio app. Search f

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Speaker 1: s R to listen live. Um, okay college show us.

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Speaker 1: Who is that coach Tommy Harrian? So I was only there,

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Speaker 1: so I ended up. I was a high school coach. Um.

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Speaker 1: When I was at Providence College, I wasn't good enough

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Speaker 1: to play at Providence. So Mike Hart who's at St. Andrew's,

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Speaker 1: I don't ever met him. He's an absolute character. I

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Speaker 1: had a blast. I was a volunteer assistant for two years,

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Speaker 1: and I mean it was a lot of fun. We

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Speaker 1: were good. We had Demetrius Nichols played at Syracuse. I

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Speaker 1: mean we had some good teams and Bob Walsh who's

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Speaker 1: now still at Providence College. Um, after I went to

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Speaker 1: be kind of like the video guy for my junior

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Speaker 1: senior year of college, Bob Walsh says to me afterwards, like,

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Speaker 1: all right, you need to you need a real job.

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Speaker 1: I know Tommy Harran and uh, he needs an op scoy.

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Speaker 1: So I went down to College Charleston for a couple

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Speaker 1: of months. Loved it because it's a beautiful place and

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Speaker 1: coach Harryan was great and worked his butt off. Right

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Speaker 1: before the season, Ron Everhart calls me there, called my dad,

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Speaker 1: I think because he needed a young assistant. And my

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Speaker 1: it was like October. So I had took the Northeastern job,

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Speaker 1: went there as a full time assistant, got really really lucky.

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Speaker 1: Coach Everhart gave me a shot and was there with

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Speaker 1: Jose Wamba at J. J. Barret was there, really good player.

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Speaker 1: Sean James was one of the best shot blocker he's

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Speaker 1: overseas and we had a good year. And then coach

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Speaker 1: Everhart takes Duquane and I was there as a young

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Speaker 1: assistant when we had five coast shot You know you

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Speaker 1: I want to get to that in a second, Okay,

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Speaker 1: But College of Joleston is a past age job. It's

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Speaker 1: the job that every guy in the Northeast says, you

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Speaker 1: know what, the job I really want, good job. I

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Speaker 1: don't want to college right now. I know the Christs

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Speaker 1: got a nice arena. It's a great city. I've been

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Speaker 1: there twice in my life. But what is it that

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Speaker 1: everyone that all these old coaches just love the idea

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Speaker 1: of college. Well, it's uh, for one, it's a beautiful town. Um.

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Speaker 1: And the college, so my sister went there because of

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Speaker 1: my few months. I'm like, you have to go to

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Speaker 1: the College of Charleston. UM beautiful. Uh, it's it's got beaches,

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Speaker 1: but it's not like it's Miami or California where you

399
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Speaker 1: have an insane amount of traffic and it's you know,

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Speaker 1: like it's a small southern town with great food, great

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Speaker 1: quality of life. Um. And they actually like basketball like

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Speaker 1: it's a I think every coach is nostalgic about the

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Speaker 1: lowest level because they don't need to deal with the

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Speaker 1: nonsense of the NBA and all that. But then when

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Speaker 1: they get in it, they always want more money, they

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00:23:05,040 --> 00:23:08,600
Speaker 1: want more resources and so on. Um. But it is

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Speaker 1: a it's a great spot. I mean, I thought it

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Speaker 1: was their arena building. That new arena really helped them. Um.

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Speaker 1: But it is still a lower level. It's not necessarily

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Speaker 1: a mid major. UM. But I think a lot of

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Speaker 1: these older coaches, because of the golf and because of

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Speaker 1: the beach and the quality of life, they love it.

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Speaker 1: I'm not wrong though, right, Like, no, it's great, that's

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Speaker 1: a great, great job. Yeah, It's probably the equivalent to

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Speaker 1: everybody says out West Pepperdine, the problem of Pepperdine. You're

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Speaker 1: in the league with Gonzaga and and you have no facilities, right,

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Speaker 1: and everybody thinks that because outside of the arena there's

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Speaker 1: a beach there that you know, then then like, okay,

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Speaker 1: where do I live? Right? How do you afford to

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Speaker 1: live there? You know, all those all those other issues

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Speaker 1: with it. I know. Yeah, by the way, you know,

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Speaker 1: San Diego has a beach right outside a door, and

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Speaker 1: Little Merriman has the beach right outside of that door.

424
00:24:03,240 --> 00:24:06,040
Speaker 1: So it doesn't and people have kids have forgotten how

425
00:24:06,040 --> 00:24:08,840
Speaker 1: good pepper that was. That's a that's a great analogy. Okay,

426
00:24:08,880 --> 00:24:11,960
Speaker 1: So uh Everard, what was he like to work for?

427
00:24:12,960 --> 00:24:17,320
Speaker 1: He was awesome? Um So when I got to Northeastern.

428
00:24:18,359 --> 00:24:21,640
Speaker 1: You know, he's a tough dude. Uh Like, I remember

429
00:24:21,680 --> 00:24:26,160
Speaker 1: the way he challenged jj barea Like I'm I'm looking there,

430
00:24:26,200 --> 00:24:28,679
Speaker 1: like wow, you know, like he's just an old school

431
00:24:28,680 --> 00:24:33,159
Speaker 1: basketball coach. Coach. We would sit around talking ball the

432
00:24:33,160 --> 00:24:36,160
Speaker 1: whole time. But he was great. And then we went

433
00:24:36,600 --> 00:24:40,679
Speaker 1: so he gets the Duqueanne job, and I like, I'm like,

434
00:24:40,760 --> 00:24:43,480
Speaker 1: let's go coach, because when you're an assistant at that age,

435
00:24:43,520 --> 00:24:46,640
Speaker 1: you're making I don't know, you're making like fifty thou dollars.

436
00:24:47,000 --> 00:24:48,960
Speaker 1: And he tells you, hey, we can go to Duquesne

437
00:24:48,960 --> 00:24:52,040
Speaker 1: and get eighty thousand. You're like, let's go, you know,

438
00:24:52,080 --> 00:24:54,280
Speaker 1: I mean, you know, you're you're all about it. And

439
00:24:54,320 --> 00:24:58,400
Speaker 1: it's the Atlantic ten versus the CIA. So we went

440
00:24:58,480 --> 00:25:03,680
Speaker 1: to uh, we went Duquesne and that was a huge rebuild.

441
00:25:03,760 --> 00:25:05,640
Speaker 1: I mean really it's kind of similar to what I'm

442
00:25:05,680 --> 00:25:10,160
Speaker 1: dealing with here in New Mexico. But always treated me great. Uh,

443
00:25:10,400 --> 00:25:13,800
Speaker 1: just a just a good person and UM took over

444
00:25:13,960 --> 00:25:19,000
Speaker 1: some challenging, challenging jobs. Okay, so where were you when

445
00:25:19,200 --> 00:25:24,560
Speaker 1: the shooting app So this was I was at my apartment.

446
00:25:25,000 --> 00:25:27,720
Speaker 1: My my mother actually was visiting, so it was me,

447
00:25:27,840 --> 00:25:32,359
Speaker 1: my wife, UM, and my mom was in town visiting Pittsburgh.

448
00:25:32,440 --> 00:25:36,080
Speaker 1: And it was right around September, mid September, and all

449
00:25:36,080 --> 00:25:38,840
Speaker 1: of a sudden, UM, I get a bang on the door.

450
00:25:39,240 --> 00:25:42,399
Speaker 1: So this is like right after college where you have

451
00:25:42,440 --> 00:25:44,760
Speaker 1: your cell phone, but you got your drunk college friends

452
00:25:44,760 --> 00:25:46,439
Speaker 1: you're still calling you late night. And I got the

453
00:25:46,480 --> 00:25:50,640
Speaker 1: real job, so I started turning my phone off because

454
00:25:50,680 --> 00:25:52,479
Speaker 1: I'm like, you idiots are waking me up and this

455
00:25:52,520 --> 00:25:54,960
Speaker 1: and that or whatever. I got a real job. Well,

456
00:25:55,000 --> 00:25:58,679
Speaker 1: I turned my phone off in about two am. You

457
00:25:58,720 --> 00:26:02,080
Speaker 1: hear a banging on the door. So my first thought is, Okay,

458
00:26:02,119 --> 00:26:04,920
Speaker 1: my mom is out for a walk. My mom loves

459
00:26:04,920 --> 00:26:06,840
Speaker 1: to walk the neighborhood. Maybe it's like six am. I

460
00:26:06,840 --> 00:26:08,840
Speaker 1: don't know what it is. I opened the door and

461
00:26:08,880 --> 00:26:11,880
Speaker 1: it's Anthony Sarah, our ops guy, and he says, hey,

462
00:26:11,880 --> 00:26:15,000
Speaker 1: you gotta get down to campus. I'm like why. He's like,

463
00:26:15,320 --> 00:26:19,600
Speaker 1: five players have been shot. I'm like okay, So like

464
00:26:20,000 --> 00:26:22,479
Speaker 1: give me the health update of all this, right, So

465
00:26:22,480 --> 00:26:25,000
Speaker 1: we kind of get that we're in the middle of

466
00:26:25,040 --> 00:26:27,720
Speaker 1: taking over this new job. We bring in all these

467
00:26:27,720 --> 00:26:30,840
Speaker 1: new players and we're telling all these families like we

468
00:26:30,960 --> 00:26:33,720
Speaker 1: got your son, and almost half the team gets shot.

469
00:26:34,320 --> 00:26:40,560
Speaker 1: So the game have not coached the game. So legitimately,

470
00:26:40,600 --> 00:26:43,240
Speaker 1: we would go into work, So it was like September.

471
00:26:44,359 --> 00:26:46,360
Speaker 1: We would go into work and we would drop our

472
00:26:46,359 --> 00:26:48,800
Speaker 1: bag off and we would go to the hospital that

473
00:26:48,880 --> 00:26:52,880
Speaker 1: was right next to our our office and we'd visit

474
00:26:52,920 --> 00:26:56,240
Speaker 1: our players in the hospital who had been shot. Now,

475
00:26:57,080 --> 00:26:59,639
Speaker 1: sam Ashualou was the only one that really was in

476
00:26:59,680 --> 00:27:02,480
Speaker 1: it the hospital for a longer period of time where

477
00:27:02,480 --> 00:27:04,240
Speaker 1: it was like every day you just pop over there.

478
00:27:04,280 --> 00:27:08,480
Speaker 1: But um, most of them, four of the five didn't

479
00:27:08,480 --> 00:27:12,360
Speaker 1: have serious seriously, one of them missed Stewart Baldonado must

480
00:27:12,400 --> 00:27:15,720
Speaker 1: have missed most of the season. I don't remember. But uh,

481
00:27:16,080 --> 00:27:20,520
Speaker 1: it was just I mean, there's hard situations, but that

482
00:27:20,800 --> 00:27:24,159
Speaker 1: was as heartbreaking as it comes. It was a on

483
00:27:24,400 --> 00:27:28,040
Speaker 1: campus event where some neighborhood cames in. It was like

484
00:27:28,080 --> 00:27:30,480
Speaker 1: a dance or something, and our guys got into the

485
00:27:30,560 --> 00:27:34,000
Speaker 1: fight or whatever, and it just it was it was

486
00:27:34,080 --> 00:27:38,200
Speaker 1: It was really really challenging and and that job changes,

487
00:27:38,320 --> 00:27:40,520
Speaker 1: that changes everything. What did you learn from the times

488
00:27:40,520 --> 00:27:45,479
Speaker 1: of rebuilding? Yeah, so again like health of the student

489
00:27:45,480 --> 00:27:50,000
Speaker 1: athletes aside Duquesne. You know, they all got out of it,

490
00:27:50,000 --> 00:27:53,240
Speaker 1: which is great, But Duquesne is a challenging job. That

491
00:27:53,320 --> 00:27:59,520
Speaker 1: became a next to impossible job, and so you just

492
00:27:59,600 --> 00:28:02,639
Speaker 1: have to you understand what the situation is and do

493
00:28:02,760 --> 00:28:06,560
Speaker 1: your very very best with it. This what taken New

494
00:28:06,600 --> 00:28:12,640
Speaker 1: Mexico reminds me a lot of Duquesne. Not because of that,

495
00:28:12,840 --> 00:28:15,680
Speaker 1: but because of we legitimately had to bring in eight

496
00:28:15,680 --> 00:28:19,640
Speaker 1: new guys in a month. Um. So the hard part

497
00:28:19,800 --> 00:28:23,080
Speaker 1: is you have to and every every job is different.

498
00:28:23,119 --> 00:28:25,840
Speaker 1: Somebody asked me today one of our administrators, you know,

499
00:28:26,119 --> 00:28:28,399
Speaker 1: who would you hire in this spot, you know, or

500
00:28:28,440 --> 00:28:31,320
Speaker 1: who's a good coach? And I said, like, I don't

501
00:28:31,440 --> 00:28:35,199
Speaker 1: what does that mean good coach? Like every situation is

502
00:28:35,280 --> 00:28:40,840
Speaker 1: substantially different, Like you know, Nico bed bed where he's at,

503
00:28:41,200 --> 00:28:45,560
Speaker 1: like he's built a really good team. Um, and credit

504
00:28:45,600 --> 00:28:48,520
Speaker 1: to him and the Boise State Leon has been there

505
00:28:48,560 --> 00:28:51,960
Speaker 1: twelve years. You know, San Diego States had unbelievable consistency.

506
00:28:52,040 --> 00:28:54,400
Speaker 1: So UM, I think the biggest thing is you have

507
00:28:54,520 --> 00:28:58,160
Speaker 1: to build a program from the ground up. But every

508
00:28:58,240 --> 00:29:02,120
Speaker 1: situation is substantially a friend and you need to make

509
00:29:02,160 --> 00:29:07,880
Speaker 1: sure everybody understands that. I really believe that. Okay, So

510
00:29:07,880 --> 00:29:12,720
Speaker 1: so you're at at AT you go to Louisville. Okay,

511
00:29:12,760 --> 00:29:15,600
Speaker 1: what was the conversation like with your dad to bring

512
00:29:15,600 --> 00:29:19,200
Speaker 1: you back? Well, he needed UH he had on the

513
00:29:19,400 --> 00:29:24,280
Speaker 1: UH staff. It was Steve Bassiello, UM, and it was

514
00:29:25,080 --> 00:29:29,120
Speaker 1: Walter McCarty. And I think he thought Steve would be

515
00:29:29,120 --> 00:29:32,360
Speaker 1: close to a head coaching job. And I don't think

516
00:29:32,360 --> 00:29:35,160
Speaker 1: he was crazy about the idea of bringing me in.

517
00:29:35,640 --> 00:29:38,800
Speaker 1: But he, like every coach, you know, you just you

518
00:29:38,840 --> 00:29:41,240
Speaker 1: want people you can trust, who are loyal and so on.

519
00:29:41,680 --> 00:29:44,960
Speaker 1: So I do think it was I you know, I

520
00:29:44,960 --> 00:29:47,840
Speaker 1: think we throw him a bone as well as get

521
00:29:47,920 --> 00:29:52,600
Speaker 1: him going and it could be beneficial down the road. Um.

522
00:29:52,640 --> 00:29:55,240
Speaker 1: We had a really really good team, you know, I

523
00:29:55,240 --> 00:29:59,520
Speaker 1: mean really talented. I mean Earl Clark, Smarto, Samuel's, Derek Carrot.

524
00:29:59,520 --> 00:30:03,880
Speaker 1: I mean, it was amazing talent. Um. But it was

525
00:30:04,000 --> 00:30:06,600
Speaker 1: for me it was like, all right, how do I

526
00:30:07,440 --> 00:30:10,920
Speaker 1: how do I help without being Dad's son that nobody

527
00:30:10,960 --> 00:30:14,960
Speaker 1: trusts um. And I think my first two years I

528
00:30:15,000 --> 00:30:17,120
Speaker 1: was just trying to be a good scout and recruit

529
00:30:17,120 --> 00:30:20,720
Speaker 1: and this and that. But then my second stint, I

530
00:30:20,760 --> 00:30:27,240
Speaker 1: thought I really provided great value to the programs, just

531
00:30:27,240 --> 00:30:30,920
Speaker 1: that people understand. Okay, so you're there for for two

532
00:30:31,040 --> 00:30:35,760
Speaker 1: years two years ago, and then you leave. Okay, that's

533
00:30:35,760 --> 00:30:38,600
Speaker 1: when you go to Florida, right, which is like kind

534
00:30:38,640 --> 00:30:42,520
Speaker 1: of like finishing school, right. Okay, So then what was

535
00:30:42,560 --> 00:30:46,400
Speaker 1: it like then you came back? Why why come back? So? Yeah,

536
00:30:46,560 --> 00:30:49,920
Speaker 1: so I left to go to Florida. Greatest decision I

537
00:30:49,960 --> 00:30:52,520
Speaker 1: ever made, not even close. I still kind of to

538
00:30:52,600 --> 00:30:56,640
Speaker 1: this day regret going back to Louisville. UM, and now

539
00:30:56,920 --> 00:30:59,840
Speaker 1: I recruited players that won a national championship, like Peyton.

540
00:31:00,000 --> 00:31:01,920
Speaker 1: He was one of the best players to ever play there.

541
00:31:01,960 --> 00:31:04,120
Speaker 1: And he's like my pride and joy because he's such

542
00:31:04,160 --> 00:31:06,600
Speaker 1: an awesome human being and a great player and a

543
00:31:06,640 --> 00:31:10,160
Speaker 1: great kid, and just loved him. Um. I was able

544
00:31:10,200 --> 00:31:12,600
Speaker 1: to coach in a Final four with my dad, which

545
00:31:12,680 --> 00:31:16,880
Speaker 1: is awesome as the associate head coach. But I look

546
00:31:16,960 --> 00:31:20,520
Speaker 1: back and say, now that I'm a head coach, whenever

547
00:31:20,520 --> 00:31:23,600
Speaker 1: you lose an assistant, it's hard. And I hated because

548
00:31:23,600 --> 00:31:26,360
Speaker 1: I have so much respect for Billy that I went

549
00:31:26,480 --> 00:31:30,560
Speaker 1: back because I made Billy's life more difficult and I

550
00:31:30,560 --> 00:31:33,720
Speaker 1: should never have done that. Not that I regret the experience.

551
00:31:33,760 --> 00:31:38,160
Speaker 1: Experience was amazing, but I have so much appreciation and

552
00:31:38,200 --> 00:31:40,720
Speaker 1: love and respect for Billy Donovan that I should have

553
00:31:40,800 --> 00:31:44,240
Speaker 1: never made his life even a little bit difficult by

554
00:31:44,320 --> 00:31:47,120
Speaker 1: having to replace me. Not because I'm irreplaceable, but just

555
00:31:47,200 --> 00:31:52,160
Speaker 1: hiring an assistant just sucks. It's annoying. UM. But the

556
00:31:52,520 --> 00:31:55,479
Speaker 1: circumstances my dad had lost all these assistants, he had

557
00:31:55,520 --> 00:31:59,600
Speaker 1: no staff, so I thought, Okay, I can go there

558
00:31:59,760 --> 00:32:03,640
Speaker 1: and can really I can hire the staff because my

559
00:32:03,720 --> 00:32:06,080
Speaker 1: dad's getting older and I know all these assistants better

560
00:32:06,080 --> 00:32:09,400
Speaker 1: than he does, and I thought, okay, like I can

561
00:32:09,440 --> 00:32:12,040
Speaker 1: take care of this. And I really took pride in that,

562
00:32:12,680 --> 00:32:15,320
Speaker 1: so I hired Kevin Keats. I mean, my dad certainly

563
00:32:15,360 --> 00:32:17,760
Speaker 1: hired these guys, but Keats, I thought would be great

564
00:32:17,800 --> 00:32:20,200
Speaker 1: for him. You're you're you're his chief of staff. That's

565
00:32:20,240 --> 00:32:23,280
Speaker 1: That's basically what it was, basically, and I thought he

566
00:32:23,320 --> 00:32:26,000
Speaker 1: needed that quite frankly, and I still think he needs that,

567
00:32:26,280 --> 00:32:30,000
Speaker 1: um and I think the stuff that happened later was

568
00:32:30,000 --> 00:32:32,760
Speaker 1: because he didn't have that, Like we don't need to

569
00:32:32,800 --> 00:32:34,240
Speaker 1: get it out of take an hour or two hours

570
00:32:34,280 --> 00:32:39,360
Speaker 1: started by that. But he needs somebody who's not scared

571
00:32:39,400 --> 00:32:42,080
Speaker 1: of him because he is Rick Pettino. But like you

572
00:32:42,120 --> 00:32:44,880
Speaker 1: gotta respect him because he deserves that, but you need

573
00:32:45,160 --> 00:32:48,240
Speaker 1: protectors of that. And I felt like, right you, it's both.

574
00:32:48,440 --> 00:32:50,160
Speaker 1: He has to respect you, you have to respect him.

575
00:32:50,200 --> 00:32:53,120
Speaker 1: You gotta gotta know how it works, and and it's

576
00:32:53,000 --> 00:32:54,920
Speaker 1: a it's a it's a hard thing. And I do

577
00:32:55,040 --> 00:32:57,520
Speaker 1: think that's the like again, I know when it was

578
00:32:57,600 --> 00:33:00,280
Speaker 1: at some point we gotta hopefully we'll record to talk

579
00:33:00,320 --> 00:33:03,080
Speaker 1: about it. But it's interesting because the thing that he

580
00:33:04,640 --> 00:33:07,560
Speaker 1: got is guilty of is at least earlier in his career,

581
00:33:08,240 --> 00:33:11,080
Speaker 1: he was on top of everything, right. I mean, he's

582
00:33:11,120 --> 00:33:14,160
Speaker 1: amazing with the level of detail. He still has that

583
00:33:14,240 --> 00:33:17,960
Speaker 1: level of detail. It's just in it's just in smaller

584
00:33:18,160 --> 00:33:20,880
Speaker 1: sharper focus, right, because you're older, you don't have time,

585
00:33:20,920 --> 00:33:22,640
Speaker 1: you have other things that kind of going on. Is

586
00:33:22,640 --> 00:33:25,920
Speaker 1: that Is that A? Is that A? I think what

587
00:33:26,040 --> 00:33:30,200
Speaker 1: it is is he's still the same. It's just and

588
00:33:30,240 --> 00:33:33,440
Speaker 1: I'm not trying to blame all the assistance that he hired,

589
00:33:33,520 --> 00:33:36,520
Speaker 1: Like you can go down to that Christian Dawkins all

590
00:33:36,560 --> 00:33:40,000
Speaker 1: that stuff and say, there's a lot of assistance who

591
00:33:40,040 --> 00:33:42,520
Speaker 1: may not have had the experience that got trapped into that.

592
00:33:43,160 --> 00:33:45,640
Speaker 1: Like it was almost a sting, you know what I mean.

593
00:33:45,760 --> 00:33:48,280
Speaker 1: So I'm not trying to absolve the guys that got

594
00:33:48,280 --> 00:33:51,920
Speaker 1: in trouble or say he's my dad had no responsibility, certainly,

595
00:33:52,000 --> 00:33:58,160
Speaker 1: but um, I think that he's still very much on

596
00:33:58,280 --> 00:34:01,479
Speaker 1: top of it. It's just about who you hire and

597
00:34:01,560 --> 00:34:05,160
Speaker 1: not trusting them so much. And I think that's where

598
00:34:05,160 --> 00:34:08,279
Speaker 1: he does it. Is he hires you and he pushes you.

599
00:34:08,880 --> 00:34:11,319
Speaker 1: But it's impossible to know everything. I know that as

600
00:34:11,360 --> 00:34:14,200
Speaker 1: a head coach. Um, so I just I felt like

601
00:34:14,239 --> 00:34:16,920
Speaker 1: he needed that, and I still to this day field

602
00:34:17,040 --> 00:34:20,239
Speaker 1: now I own as a different level, but that he

603
00:34:20,280 --> 00:34:23,160
Speaker 1: needs that because there's so many things that go on

604
00:34:23,239 --> 00:34:26,040
Speaker 1: in a program at that level, you need to have

605
00:34:26,160 --> 00:34:29,560
Speaker 1: people that are constantly trying to protect it. And that

606
00:34:29,600 --> 00:34:35,680
Speaker 1: got away. Um okay, so you when you were created

607
00:34:35,760 --> 00:34:38,680
Speaker 1: Russ Smith, did you know his name would number would

608
00:34:38,719 --> 00:34:43,320
Speaker 1: be hanging in the rafters at lovel No, Um, Russ.

609
00:34:43,360 --> 00:34:45,120
Speaker 1: I have a kid, Jalen House, who reminds me of

610
00:34:45,160 --> 00:34:48,160
Speaker 1: Russ in a lot of ways because the House has

611
00:34:48,239 --> 00:34:50,440
Speaker 1: amazing moments and then he has moments where you're like

612
00:34:50,840 --> 00:34:53,200
Speaker 1: you just like you can't even put him on the court,

613
00:34:53,640 --> 00:34:56,800
Speaker 1: and Russ was very very similar in a lot of ways,

614
00:34:57,400 --> 00:35:01,080
Speaker 1: um to Jalen House. Uh. You still if you go

615
00:35:01,160 --> 00:35:04,719
Speaker 1: back and you watch moments of Russ Smith, there are

616
00:35:04,800 --> 00:35:07,799
Speaker 1: moments where you're like, I remember at Notre Dame there

617
00:35:07,880 --> 00:35:10,360
Speaker 1: was like a three or four overtime game and Russ

618
00:35:10,440 --> 00:35:12,920
Speaker 1: legitimately won the game and lost the game from and

619
00:35:13,520 --> 00:35:19,560
Speaker 1: multiple possessions. Um. Another though, like that team that when

620
00:35:19,560 --> 00:35:23,040
Speaker 1: we went to the Final four and then that team

621
00:35:23,080 --> 00:35:26,920
Speaker 1: that won the national championship was good, but there were

622
00:35:26,960 --> 00:35:32,440
Speaker 1: phenomenal kids, phenomenal and um, Russ was just like, it's

623
00:35:32,440 --> 00:35:34,920
Speaker 1: such a good way about him, but he he was

624
00:35:35,000 --> 00:35:38,719
Speaker 1: that New York City hooper and those are not succeeding

625
00:35:38,760 --> 00:35:42,440
Speaker 1: as much anymore. And he was just out there balling

626
00:35:42,560 --> 00:35:45,279
Speaker 1: and uh, just found a way to get it done

627
00:35:45,320 --> 00:35:48,560
Speaker 1: in an unorthodox way. But no, I did not see

628
00:35:48,560 --> 00:35:52,319
Speaker 1: that happening. Uh and uh but a great, awesome kid,

629
00:35:52,440 --> 00:35:57,040
Speaker 1: dad's awesome families. Great. Okay, what what was it like

630
00:35:57,200 --> 00:36:00,319
Speaker 1: to decide to take the Minnesota job? Take take to that?

631
00:36:00,680 --> 00:36:03,439
Speaker 1: Take me to where you were? What the process? Wasn't

632
00:36:03,480 --> 00:36:06,720
Speaker 1: the only job you're interviewing for, right, There's there's been others.

633
00:36:07,080 --> 00:36:09,400
Speaker 1: Great story. Yeah, so it's a great story. So I

634
00:36:09,480 --> 00:36:12,360
Speaker 1: take the f I U job. I took it because

635
00:36:12,360 --> 00:36:15,719
Speaker 1: of Miami. I thought I could sell Miami. Very very

636
00:36:15,760 --> 00:36:19,520
Speaker 1: difficult job, I mean insanely difficult. They had Isaiah Thomas.

637
00:36:19,560 --> 00:36:21,960
Speaker 1: They won like seven or eight the year before, similar

638
00:36:22,000 --> 00:36:24,040
Speaker 1: to kind of my New Mexico deal, but not in

639
00:36:24,080 --> 00:36:26,200
Speaker 1: the Mountain. Was not as good of a conference. We

640
00:36:26,320 --> 00:36:29,160
Speaker 1: end up being top three or whatever. We go to

641
00:36:29,200 --> 00:36:32,520
Speaker 1: the conference tournament finals, and we missed a shot at

642
00:36:32,520 --> 00:36:34,040
Speaker 1: the buzzer to go to the n stable A tournament

643
00:36:34,560 --> 00:36:37,040
Speaker 1: with walk On. I mean, just a great group of dudes,

644
00:36:37,080 --> 00:36:40,600
Speaker 1: but they were tough kids, great kids. So season ends

645
00:36:40,640 --> 00:36:44,320
Speaker 1: and I'm sitting there going f i U is not it.

646
00:36:44,320 --> 00:36:48,360
Speaker 1: It's not long term what I want. Um, it's just

647
00:36:48,480 --> 00:36:51,920
Speaker 1: it's a hard, hard job internally and it's just challenging.

648
00:36:52,480 --> 00:36:58,480
Speaker 1: So Sienna essentially wants to hire me. Sienna was way

649
00:36:58,520 --> 00:37:02,480
Speaker 1: more my speed. This is when Fran had it rolling

650
00:37:02,880 --> 00:37:05,240
Speaker 1: and he had left to go to Iowa. Fran leaves,

651
00:37:05,239 --> 00:37:10,040
Speaker 1: goes to Iowa. Um, Mitch gets the job. Mitch Spona

652
00:37:10,680 --> 00:37:13,719
Speaker 1: gets fired. Okay, so two years I think two or

653
00:37:13,760 --> 00:37:16,799
Speaker 1: three years after so we had known some people from

654
00:37:16,880 --> 00:37:22,240
Speaker 1: Saratoga family friends all Banny days, and Ciano was way

655
00:37:22,239 --> 00:37:25,440
Speaker 1: more my speed. Well, the A D and I spoke

656
00:37:25,520 --> 00:37:28,600
Speaker 1: and he was great, and he said, listen, I feel

657
00:37:28,600 --> 00:37:30,680
Speaker 1: great about you. I don't. He didn't say like I

658
00:37:30,719 --> 00:37:32,520
Speaker 1: want to hire you, but I feel great about you.

659
00:37:33,080 --> 00:37:36,880
Speaker 1: But we had had at f i U a pr

660
00:37:36,920 --> 00:37:39,279
Speaker 1: issues from the year before. I was worried we may

661
00:37:39,280 --> 00:37:41,400
Speaker 1: not be eligible for the postseason. There was a lot

662
00:37:41,440 --> 00:37:43,120
Speaker 1: that was going in that my players I just felt

663
00:37:43,160 --> 00:37:47,319
Speaker 1: horrible about. So I'm like, Okay, if I go up

664
00:37:47,360 --> 00:37:50,560
Speaker 1: there and I don't get the job, man, this is

665
00:37:50,560 --> 00:37:53,560
Speaker 1: a bad look. So Billy Donovan basically told me, like,

666
00:37:54,160 --> 00:37:55,960
Speaker 1: I call it, coach on my coach, what would you do?

667
00:37:56,360 --> 00:37:58,279
Speaker 1: He's like, if they don't offer you the job on

668
00:37:58,320 --> 00:38:00,239
Speaker 1: the spot, I would not go up and interview work.

669
00:38:00,880 --> 00:38:04,120
Speaker 1: So coach convinced me like pull out. I'm like, okay,

670
00:38:04,160 --> 00:38:07,120
Speaker 1: I'm gonna do it. And I was bummed because Ciana

671
00:38:07,360 --> 00:38:10,040
Speaker 1: was what I saw myself. That's what I wanted to

672
00:38:10,080 --> 00:38:13,080
Speaker 1: coach at. And I remember my dad said to me,

673
00:38:13,239 --> 00:38:16,839
Speaker 1: that's too cold up there. Anyway. Well, then I go

674
00:38:17,320 --> 00:38:20,080
Speaker 1: to the Duke game, right, so this is Louisville Duke.

675
00:38:21,320 --> 00:38:26,280
Speaker 1: Kevin Ware snaps his leg, right, I was. I recruited

676
00:38:26,360 --> 00:38:28,120
Speaker 1: Kevin Ware. So I'm the head coach at f I

677
00:38:28,239 --> 00:38:30,800
Speaker 1: you where snaps his leg? My dad says to me,

678
00:38:30,840 --> 00:38:32,960
Speaker 1: they beat Duke. It was a great game. My Dad's like,

679
00:38:33,040 --> 00:38:35,680
Speaker 1: let's stay over, let's go to St. Almos and let's

680
00:38:35,760 --> 00:38:39,840
Speaker 1: visit Kevin in the in the hospital next morning. I'm like, great,

681
00:38:40,600 --> 00:38:44,440
Speaker 1: So we visit Kevin. We're driving back from indeed, Guiville.

682
00:38:45,040 --> 00:38:47,880
Speaker 1: I get a call from Billy Donovan and I'm like,

683
00:38:47,880 --> 00:38:50,759
Speaker 1: what's up, coach, And Billy's really direct, like he's like, hey,

684
00:38:50,760 --> 00:38:53,799
Speaker 1: I think I just got you the Minnesota job. I'm like, what, Like,

685
00:38:53,880 --> 00:38:57,200
Speaker 1: Minnesota not even on my radar. I'm like, what do

686
00:38:57,200 --> 00:39:00,880
Speaker 1: you mean? He's like, nor Would tiguees d a d.

687
00:39:01,719 --> 00:39:04,960
Speaker 1: Nor Would hired Shaka Smart his assistant, Anthony Grant, his

688
00:39:05,000 --> 00:39:09,560
Speaker 1: assistant had a great experience. Nor Would is struggling to

689
00:39:09,680 --> 00:39:13,160
Speaker 1: find like Minnesota is a hard job, and he's trying

690
00:39:13,200 --> 00:39:15,640
Speaker 1: to struggle to find what he wants. I loved it.

691
00:39:15,680 --> 00:39:18,000
Speaker 1: I enjoyed it. But so I'm like, okay, he's like

692
00:39:18,040 --> 00:39:22,440
Speaker 1: Norm's gonna call you. Just be ready. So I answered

693
00:39:22,440 --> 00:39:24,160
Speaker 1: the phone, or so I get so I hand the

694
00:39:24,160 --> 00:39:26,160
Speaker 1: phone Billy right, and my dad's in the back. We

695
00:39:26,200 --> 00:39:29,240
Speaker 1: have a friend driving. Um he's kind of just sleeping

696
00:39:29,640 --> 00:39:31,319
Speaker 1: and I said no, I'm like, hey, Dad, I wake

697
00:39:31,400 --> 00:39:34,759
Speaker 1: him up. I'm like, Minnesota's gonna call me. Would you

698
00:39:34,800 --> 00:39:37,160
Speaker 1: take that job if you can get it? And he

699
00:39:37,239 --> 00:39:38,960
Speaker 1: kind of opens up one eye and he's like, who

700
00:39:39,000 --> 00:39:40,520
Speaker 1: the hell do you think you are? Of course you

701
00:39:40,600 --> 00:39:42,080
Speaker 1: take that job if you can get it, And just

702
00:39:42,120 --> 00:39:45,040
Speaker 1: goes back to bed and that was it. So I'm like,

703
00:39:45,120 --> 00:39:46,960
Speaker 1: all right, so nor would calls me, we have a

704
00:39:46,960 --> 00:39:50,200
Speaker 1: great talk. So way, wait, so that's just a question. Okay,

705
00:39:50,320 --> 00:39:52,840
Speaker 1: so you know Minnesota's gonna call, do you like quickly

706
00:39:52,880 --> 00:39:54,800
Speaker 1: get to your phone and do a little do a

707
00:39:54,800 --> 00:39:59,319
Speaker 1: little Minnesota research, Like do you do it cold? I

708
00:39:59,360 --> 00:40:01,520
Speaker 1: didn't have a lot of time. I think I might

709
00:40:01,560 --> 00:40:03,640
Speaker 1: have called Shaka No. I think I called Shock after

710
00:40:03,680 --> 00:40:05,800
Speaker 1: because I knew Shocking because I replaced Shock at Florida.

711
00:40:06,320 --> 00:40:08,680
Speaker 1: But like, Norwood is just a good dude. He's easy

712
00:40:08,719 --> 00:40:12,319
Speaker 1: to talk to, so he understood kind of like I

713
00:40:12,360 --> 00:40:14,600
Speaker 1: have no time to research any of this. So I

714
00:40:14,640 --> 00:40:17,080
Speaker 1: talked to Norwood and I'm like, listen, man, Like it

715
00:40:17,200 --> 00:40:20,040
Speaker 1: was a real casual conversation. He basically said, can you

716
00:40:20,080 --> 00:40:22,960
Speaker 1: get down to Florida to meet with me? The next day.

717
00:40:23,360 --> 00:40:25,680
Speaker 1: I'm in Louisville. I got my like my f I

718
00:40:25,760 --> 00:40:27,960
Speaker 1: don't have a suit, I don't have anything. So I

719
00:40:28,080 --> 00:40:30,680
Speaker 1: go fly down there and I meet with them. I

720
00:40:30,680 --> 00:40:34,480
Speaker 1: think it was in Naples or whatever, and it's him.

721
00:40:34,520 --> 00:40:37,600
Speaker 1: I had like, uh pants and like a button shirt,

722
00:40:37,640 --> 00:40:39,279
Speaker 1: like a button down shirt. I didn't have a sport code.

723
00:40:39,280 --> 00:40:41,080
Speaker 1: I didn't have anything, and I told nor but I'm like,

724
00:40:41,160 --> 00:40:43,480
Speaker 1: I don't have anything right now. I'm not at home base.

725
00:40:43,920 --> 00:40:45,759
Speaker 1: I don't have notes, I don't have anything. He's like,

726
00:40:45,840 --> 00:40:47,880
Speaker 1: I don't care about any of that. So we go

727
00:40:47,960 --> 00:40:51,400
Speaker 1: down there and it's Mike Ellis, who him and Norwood

728
00:40:51,440 --> 00:40:54,440
Speaker 1: started Villa seven and all that which was Billa seven

729
00:40:54,560 --> 00:40:56,920
Speaker 1: was like the thing for all of us young coaches.

730
00:40:57,200 --> 00:41:00,560
Speaker 1: I wasn't even in Villa seven. So it's Mike Ellis,

731
00:41:00,560 --> 00:41:02,840
Speaker 1: it's Dave Benedict, who is now the A D Yukon

732
00:41:03,920 --> 00:41:06,600
Speaker 1: Beth Gets is now an A D as well um

733
00:41:06,640 --> 00:41:09,239
Speaker 1: in Norwood and I just kind of walk in and

734
00:41:09,280 --> 00:41:12,400
Speaker 1: I'm like, all right, Like I don't know much about

735
00:41:12,400 --> 00:41:14,880
Speaker 1: any of this stuff. I know, Minnie Apples is an

736
00:41:14,880 --> 00:41:17,279
Speaker 1: awesome city. I know the Big Tens are great conference

737
00:41:17,920 --> 00:41:21,760
Speaker 1: and so on. So we had a great couple hours.

738
00:41:22,400 --> 00:41:25,200
Speaker 1: Uh it was pretty casual, you know, I mean it

739
00:41:25,360 --> 00:41:28,239
Speaker 1: was I think Norwood felt good about me, and he

740
00:41:28,360 --> 00:41:33,160
Speaker 1: basically that night was like hey, Like I remember we

741
00:41:33,160 --> 00:41:37,240
Speaker 1: went outside. He was like, how would uh a million dollars?

742
00:41:37,239 --> 00:41:39,560
Speaker 1: So I'm like, oh my god, like you know, because

743
00:41:39,560 --> 00:41:41,839
Speaker 1: I'm making like two the head coaching up. I mean

744
00:41:41,840 --> 00:41:44,480
Speaker 1: the salary have gone up so much since then. I'm like, yeah,

745
00:41:44,480 --> 00:41:46,920
Speaker 1: I would, That'd be fine by me, Norwood, you know.

746
00:41:47,040 --> 00:41:51,000
Speaker 1: So I I thought I had it, um, but I

747
00:41:51,040 --> 00:41:54,440
Speaker 1: didn't know. So then I left and I think the

748
00:41:54,480 --> 00:41:56,520
Speaker 1: next day or two he offered me the job. And

749
00:41:56,840 --> 00:42:00,719
Speaker 1: I really just I was not in a position. The

750
00:42:00,880 --> 00:42:03,239
Speaker 1: f I U thing was. It scared me so much

751
00:42:03,280 --> 00:42:06,000
Speaker 1: because of the a PR stuff from prior. It just

752
00:42:06,040 --> 00:42:10,080
Speaker 1: scared me, and I thought I had to take Minnesota, um.

753
00:42:10,120 --> 00:42:12,640
Speaker 1: And I'm happy I took Minnesota. Really am so I

754
00:42:12,719 --> 00:42:15,640
Speaker 1: got offered the job. It was funny. Within ten minutes

755
00:42:15,680 --> 00:42:17,640
Speaker 1: of my dad found out he got in the Hall

756
00:42:17,640 --> 00:42:21,960
Speaker 1: of Fame. I got the Minnesota job right in the

757
00:42:21,960 --> 00:42:23,400
Speaker 1: ten minutes. So, you know, when we were a family

758
00:42:23,400 --> 00:42:25,799
Speaker 1: text chain and so on. So it was a great time.

759
00:42:25,920 --> 00:42:27,520
Speaker 1: It was. It was. It was a lot of fun

760
00:42:27,600 --> 00:42:29,799
Speaker 1: and uh just kind of hit the ground. I remember

761
00:42:29,880 --> 00:42:32,960
Speaker 1: we were flying from Miami on a private plane and

762
00:42:33,160 --> 00:42:35,360
Speaker 1: we go from beautiful weather and there's still snow on

763
00:42:35,400 --> 00:42:38,520
Speaker 1: the ground and like April and I'm like, oh my god.

764
00:42:38,640 --> 00:42:41,920
Speaker 1: But I loved it, really did enjoy it. What uh

765
00:42:42,719 --> 00:42:47,680
Speaker 1: um see you get there okay, and now the the

766
00:42:47,680 --> 00:42:51,440
Speaker 1: the hard thing about Minneapolis is about Minnesota. About the

767
00:42:51,520 --> 00:42:53,840
Speaker 1: U is a good thing and a bad thing is

768
00:42:53,880 --> 00:42:57,799
Speaker 1: that there are players. There's like anywhere from one to

769
00:42:58,000 --> 00:43:02,040
Speaker 1: five a year, but none of them want to go

770
00:43:02,120 --> 00:43:04,600
Speaker 1: to the U, right they all want to go, Which

771
00:43:04,680 --> 00:43:07,160
Speaker 1: is what happened? You you hit the ground running and

772
00:43:07,200 --> 00:43:10,120
Speaker 1: there's this incredible you know, really three or four kids

773
00:43:11,320 --> 00:43:13,840
Speaker 1: what and you know where every fan thinks they should

774
00:43:13,840 --> 00:43:16,160
Speaker 1: want to go to Minnesota. The barn School is the

775
00:43:16,200 --> 00:43:19,239
Speaker 1: Big ten, it's the school of the state. But the

776
00:43:19,320 --> 00:43:22,520
Speaker 1: kids themselves, for whatever reason, all seem to want to

777
00:43:22,520 --> 00:43:24,480
Speaker 1: get the hell out of there. What is what is

778
00:43:24,480 --> 00:43:27,480
Speaker 1: that actually like in a reality? In reality? Yeah, the

779
00:43:27,800 --> 00:43:32,120
Speaker 1: reality of Minneapolis is and they call it the Twin Cities.

780
00:43:32,120 --> 00:43:35,440
Speaker 1: To get mad if you called Minneapolis, but it's different

781
00:43:35,440 --> 00:43:38,080
Speaker 1: than a lot of cities. If you look at a map,

782
00:43:38,400 --> 00:43:42,279
Speaker 1: Minnesota is up here at the top and everybody, all

783
00:43:42,320 --> 00:43:45,799
Speaker 1: the players are within twenty minutes of your campus. I

784
00:43:45,880 --> 00:43:49,000
Speaker 1: actually think you'd be better off if, like Minnesota was

785
00:43:49,040 --> 00:43:52,680
Speaker 1: in Rochester and it was two hours away, because the

786
00:43:52,719 --> 00:43:56,600
Speaker 1: allure of getting away from home but still being there

787
00:43:57,440 --> 00:44:00,440
Speaker 1: maybe a little bit better. Um. I didn't. I just

788
00:44:00,440 --> 00:44:02,960
Speaker 1: wanted like like gains sort of like Gainesville, right, Like

789
00:44:03,160 --> 00:44:06,399
Speaker 1: nobody goes up around Gainesville. Yeah you know, I mean

790
00:44:06,400 --> 00:44:09,319
Speaker 1: there's most even even Athens, right. And I know they

791
00:44:09,320 --> 00:44:11,480
Speaker 1: haven't done a great job of keeping Atlantic kids. But

792
00:44:11,520 --> 00:44:14,880
Speaker 1: it's not in Atlanta, right, Well, it's the only different

793
00:44:15,120 --> 00:44:20,320
Speaker 1: I think what it's comparable to is Seattle because there's

794
00:44:20,360 --> 00:44:23,880
Speaker 1: nothing near the Twin Cities, and I think a lot

795
00:44:24,000 --> 00:44:26,440
Speaker 1: of these kids now the West is so much more

796
00:44:26,480 --> 00:44:29,800
Speaker 1: spread out. But like a lot of these kids. Now,

797
00:44:30,000 --> 00:44:32,440
Speaker 1: this is not to absolve me of I made mistakes,

798
00:44:32,480 --> 00:44:35,439
Speaker 1: and like I'm not trying to say it's not my fault, um,

799
00:44:35,480 --> 00:44:37,760
Speaker 1: but I do think, like I just think the people

800
00:44:37,760 --> 00:44:40,560
Speaker 1: in the community. Like one of my best friends, like,

801
00:44:41,000 --> 00:44:44,440
Speaker 1: who's my neighbor. His daughter was a hockey player. She's like,

802
00:44:44,640 --> 00:44:46,520
Speaker 1: I just want to get away. So you had a

803
00:44:46,560 --> 00:44:50,799
Speaker 1: lot of these kids. The next closest school is Wisconsin,

804
00:44:50,840 --> 00:44:53,520
Speaker 1: Like there's no other schools around. So a lot of

805
00:44:53,520 --> 00:44:54,759
Speaker 1: these kids are like, well, I'd like to go to

806
00:44:54,760 --> 00:44:57,280
Speaker 1: Wisconsins three hours away. I could still get the value

807
00:44:57,360 --> 00:45:01,040
Speaker 1: of going home every now and then. Um, So I

808
00:45:01,080 --> 00:45:03,640
Speaker 1: don't know. I mean, I think Ben is going to

809
00:45:03,760 --> 00:45:06,960
Speaker 1: have to figure that out him being from there and

810
00:45:07,040 --> 00:45:10,040
Speaker 1: playing their helps. They like their own there, you know,

811
00:45:10,080 --> 00:45:13,200
Speaker 1: they like people that are from there. Um So I

812
00:45:13,239 --> 00:45:16,280
Speaker 1: didn't get enough consistent ones. I got back to back pros.

813
00:45:16,320 --> 00:45:18,520
Speaker 1: I mean a mirror coffee, Daniel Turre, we're from there

814
00:45:18,760 --> 00:45:22,200
Speaker 1: there in the n B A. Um So it just

815
00:45:22,320 --> 00:45:26,359
Speaker 1: became like I thought I had success there. I really did.

816
00:45:26,360 --> 00:45:28,560
Speaker 1: I was there for eight years. We went to two tournaments.

817
00:45:29,200 --> 00:45:31,759
Speaker 1: We went to we want to an n I t like,

818
00:45:32,320 --> 00:45:34,759
Speaker 1: Minnesota is just a it's a weird job. I don't

819
00:45:34,840 --> 00:45:38,279
Speaker 1: think it's a bad job. But I also think every

820
00:45:38,320 --> 00:45:40,240
Speaker 1: coach in the history of the program has been fired.

821
00:45:40,840 --> 00:45:43,840
Speaker 1: And I think like, like I remember, we want and

822
00:45:43,840 --> 00:45:45,480
Speaker 1: they're like, don't leave, and I'm like, I don't want

823
00:45:45,480 --> 00:45:48,520
Speaker 1: to leave. I love it here, like, but nobody's ever

824
00:45:48,560 --> 00:45:52,920
Speaker 1: won and left ever. Um So I think you need somebody,

825
00:45:53,440 --> 00:45:57,040
Speaker 1: you need to change the job. And I didn't change

826
00:45:57,120 --> 00:46:01,799
Speaker 1: the job. What is we we all when you have

827
00:46:01,840 --> 00:46:05,960
Speaker 1: time to process, if there is one mistake that you

828
00:46:05,960 --> 00:46:09,440
Speaker 1: can learn from, you're gonna make mistakes. But there's context

829
00:46:09,760 --> 00:46:12,520
Speaker 1: in it, right is if there If there's one that's

830
00:46:12,640 --> 00:46:16,160
Speaker 1: ringing in your ear as you rebuild New Mexico that

831
00:46:16,320 --> 00:46:23,399
Speaker 1: you don't want to replicate. What would that mistake be? Um,

832
00:46:23,480 --> 00:46:27,040
Speaker 1: I don't I don't know if there's one thing that

833
00:46:27,160 --> 00:46:29,799
Speaker 1: I could say, it's hard to say that one thing.

834
00:46:30,360 --> 00:46:34,919
Speaker 1: There's a player, you know, McKinley Wright, who went to Colorado,

835
00:46:34,960 --> 00:46:38,319
Speaker 1: and I took a Washington. But everybody thinks like, like,

836
00:46:38,400 --> 00:46:41,960
Speaker 1: McKinley Wright didn't tell me he was coming. So we're

837
00:46:42,000 --> 00:46:45,160
Speaker 1: in the mix with them. And then we take Isaiah Washington,

838
00:46:45,160 --> 00:46:47,080
Speaker 1: who's player of the year in the state of New York,

839
00:46:47,560 --> 00:46:50,680
Speaker 1: and he was a really good player. But everybody thinks,

840
00:46:50,719 --> 00:46:53,040
Speaker 1: like I said, McKinley was there saying I want to come,

841
00:46:53,400 --> 00:46:55,200
Speaker 1: and Isaiah was there, Someway I come, and I said, no,

842
00:46:55,239 --> 00:46:58,480
Speaker 1: I don't want you McKinley and Isaiah like not that simple, right, Okay.

843
00:46:58,480 --> 00:47:01,560
Speaker 1: So so and again that's this is a perfect example,

844
00:47:01,640 --> 00:47:05,720
Speaker 1: per example. And McKinley, by the way, like perfect college

845
00:47:05,719 --> 00:47:08,000
Speaker 1: player because he's a complementary guy. Right, he just he

846
00:47:08,080 --> 00:47:10,120
Speaker 1: makes he makes everybody else. He made everybody else better

847
00:47:10,120 --> 00:47:12,560
Speaker 1: at Colorado, right, And U asked Tad, He's like, he

848
00:47:12,600 --> 00:47:14,719
Speaker 1: made me look like a much better coach because it

849
00:47:14,840 --> 00:47:19,480
Speaker 1: just right. Whereas Isaiah, like you just in a basketball game,

850
00:47:19,480 --> 00:47:21,480
Speaker 1: if you watch the two of them play, like, oh

851
00:47:21,520 --> 00:47:25,160
Speaker 1: that guy, I want that guy. But doesn't necessarily make

852
00:47:25,160 --> 00:47:28,359
Speaker 1: everybody better, right there? Just very different. But okay, so

853
00:47:29,239 --> 00:47:32,200
Speaker 1: this is great because I'll give you the example. I

854
00:47:32,239 --> 00:47:36,080
Speaker 1: go to Notre Dame, but I really I didn't necessarily

855
00:47:36,160 --> 00:47:37,719
Speaker 1: think I wanted to go to Notre Dame was my

856
00:47:37,800 --> 00:47:39,719
Speaker 1: first visit, and then I wanted to go to I

857
00:47:39,760 --> 00:47:42,600
Speaker 1: love Michigan State, Izzo. I was would have been Iszo's

858
00:47:42,600 --> 00:47:45,640
Speaker 1: first recruit, the first point guard, but I wanted to

859
00:47:45,640 --> 00:47:49,040
Speaker 1: play with with Tractor Trailer and Albert White, and they

860
00:47:49,080 --> 00:47:52,200
Speaker 1: committed to to Michigan right and U c l A

861
00:47:52,239 --> 00:47:54,239
Speaker 1: Thought they were getting Stefan Marbury and like all these

862
00:47:54,280 --> 00:47:56,640
Speaker 1: things kind of came together. And Jeff Billett wanted to

863
00:47:56,640 --> 00:47:59,240
Speaker 1: go to Notre Dame and I had to decide before

864
00:47:59,239 --> 00:48:02,280
Speaker 1: he visited. Because he visited. It's whoever takes the scholarship.

865
00:48:02,320 --> 00:48:05,040
Speaker 1: That's how they did it. So what was tell me

866
00:48:05,280 --> 00:48:07,560
Speaker 1: the process of how it actually went down with the

867
00:48:07,560 --> 00:48:09,960
Speaker 1: ghost two. Yeah, and again like I don't want to

868
00:48:10,040 --> 00:48:12,560
Speaker 1: knock Isaiah, like Isaiah is a good kid. It just

869
00:48:12,640 --> 00:48:16,440
Speaker 1: it didn't work out But my point is I probably

870
00:48:16,480 --> 00:48:19,520
Speaker 1: should have held off a little bit to see I

871
00:48:19,560 --> 00:48:24,440
Speaker 1: thought McKinley was. It's funny about McKinley. He never shot

872
00:48:24,600 --> 00:48:27,160
Speaker 1: in au so you were kind of like canny shoot,

873
00:48:27,200 --> 00:48:29,719
Speaker 1: But what you loved about him was great kid. You

874
00:48:29,719 --> 00:48:32,160
Speaker 1: can tell you had all these intangibles, all the things

875
00:48:32,160 --> 00:48:35,319
Speaker 1: that Tad said, Like I felt like, yeah, like I

876
00:48:35,400 --> 00:48:40,960
Speaker 1: see that. Um, but it's just he he had visited

877
00:48:41,320 --> 00:48:44,200
Speaker 1: I believe he visited Dayton. You know, Archie was in

878
00:48:44,239 --> 00:48:46,960
Speaker 1: there really good. And I think he might have chosen

879
00:48:47,080 --> 00:48:49,600
Speaker 1: dating over us, honestly, Like, I think there was a

880
00:48:49,600 --> 00:48:51,759
Speaker 1: little bit of level of that. The only thing I

881
00:48:51,800 --> 00:48:55,440
Speaker 1: would have said was I would have probably been more patient,

882
00:48:55,520 --> 00:48:57,960
Speaker 1: Not because Isaiah is a bad player. I just thought

883
00:48:58,040 --> 00:49:03,120
Speaker 1: getting that Minnesota kid was probably more important than I

884
00:49:03,200 --> 00:49:07,239
Speaker 1: realized at the time. Um because just because because you

885
00:49:07,280 --> 00:49:10,040
Speaker 1: know Tyas Leaves, you know, and he goes to win

886
00:49:10,120 --> 00:49:13,120
Speaker 1: the national championship, right, and that that you know that

887
00:49:13,320 --> 00:49:15,200
Speaker 1: that's hard, and so now you have him and he

888
00:49:15,640 --> 00:49:19,200
Speaker 1: obviously McKinley in many ways probably had a better because

889
00:49:19,239 --> 00:49:21,680
Speaker 1: he stayed longer, a better career than than tis. Right,

890
00:49:21,840 --> 00:49:24,640
Speaker 1: And it's the it's one thing to have a great

891
00:49:24,680 --> 00:49:27,319
Speaker 1: point guard, but have a point guard who leaves your

892
00:49:27,360 --> 00:49:30,720
Speaker 1: home area. And as you said, they do like Minnesota kids. Yeah,

893
00:49:30,800 --> 00:49:33,960
Speaker 1: I think that's in the end, not to say. And

894
00:49:34,040 --> 00:49:36,759
Speaker 1: again like I had a I had a weird, like

895
00:49:36,840 --> 00:49:41,080
Speaker 1: a really weird eight years because I get there and

896
00:49:41,120 --> 00:49:44,319
Speaker 1: we had some good talent, not great good. You know

897
00:49:44,520 --> 00:49:47,279
Speaker 1: the Hollands, you know, they weren't brothers. Aready called him brothers,

898
00:49:47,280 --> 00:49:49,520
Speaker 1: but they weren't. But Andre was a good player, Austin

899
00:49:49,560 --> 00:49:52,840
Speaker 1: was a good player. Um, I had to add some guys.

900
00:49:52,960 --> 00:49:55,319
Speaker 1: Moll Walker had to lose about a hundred pounds and

901
00:49:55,360 --> 00:49:57,400
Speaker 1: he became a really good player, and we win the

902
00:49:57,480 --> 00:49:59,759
Speaker 1: n I T. So it's it's so different than New

903
00:49:59,760 --> 00:50:02,759
Speaker 1: mextic Acho, where you're you're totally rebuilding. Like everybody kind

904
00:50:02,760 --> 00:50:06,360
Speaker 1: of sees some decent pieces there. So you win twenty

905
00:50:06,360 --> 00:50:10,760
Speaker 1: five games. Well, I kept telling Norwood, Ill my Norwood,

906
00:50:10,800 --> 00:50:13,960
Speaker 1: I am really concerned. We just don't have any young

907
00:50:14,000 --> 00:50:18,880
Speaker 1: players in this program at the time. Bad facilities, We

908
00:50:18,920 --> 00:50:23,400
Speaker 1: had no practice facility. Um. I'm also trying to build

909
00:50:23,520 --> 00:50:25,960
Speaker 1: my rep because I hadn't really accomplished. I didn't win

910
00:50:26,000 --> 00:50:27,360
Speaker 1: at f I. You go to the tournament, and be

911
00:50:27,480 --> 00:50:29,480
Speaker 1: this hot name. Like everyone's kind of yeah, I think

912
00:50:29,520 --> 00:50:31,239
Speaker 1: he's a good guy, that he's a good coach. But

913
00:50:31,320 --> 00:50:35,759
Speaker 1: we'll see. Um. So we win eighteen. The next year

914
00:50:36,480 --> 00:50:39,520
Speaker 1: on the bubble, fine, you know, not not a horrible year,

915
00:50:39,600 --> 00:50:42,920
Speaker 1: not a good year at Minnesota. You're three. We win

916
00:50:42,960 --> 00:50:45,319
Speaker 1: eight and I told Nora at the time, we're gonna

917
00:50:45,320 --> 00:50:47,239
Speaker 1: have to start over. Man, I'm just telling you. So,

918
00:50:47,280 --> 00:50:50,800
Speaker 1: I got some young players, Nate Mason, great player playing

919
00:50:50,840 --> 00:50:54,319
Speaker 1: overseas right now, do premiate prayer playing overseas right now.

920
00:50:54,840 --> 00:50:58,240
Speaker 1: We get a Mere Coffee, Um, a local kid, Richard

921
00:50:58,239 --> 00:51:03,000
Speaker 1: Coffee's son. And uh, year four, I have the best

922
00:51:03,080 --> 00:51:06,520
Speaker 1: regular season in the history of the program besides Clems

923
00:51:06,560 --> 00:51:09,279
Speaker 1: that got vacated that ninety seven year. So it's the

924
00:51:09,360 --> 00:51:13,120
Speaker 1: second best regular season in the history of the program.

925
00:51:13,120 --> 00:51:15,759
Speaker 1: And uh we bounced back, thank god, because when you

926
00:51:15,800 --> 00:51:18,279
Speaker 1: win eight, like, you gotta bounce back. We went twenty four.

927
00:51:18,360 --> 00:51:20,959
Speaker 1: We're a five senior so of a tournament top four

928
00:51:21,719 --> 00:51:25,000
Speaker 1: like or everybody's like, Okay, we see it. I'm Big

929
00:51:25,000 --> 00:51:27,719
Speaker 1: ten coach of the year. I get an extension, I

930
00:51:27,800 --> 00:51:30,120
Speaker 1: might get a raise or whatever. We come back the

931
00:51:30,160 --> 00:51:33,720
Speaker 1: next year with a lot of those guys back Reggie

932
00:51:33,800 --> 00:51:37,040
Speaker 1: Lynch was Defensive Player of the Year, has a sexual

933
00:51:37,080 --> 00:51:40,120
Speaker 1: misconduct thing. He ends up quitting in the middle of

934
00:51:40,200 --> 00:51:42,719
Speaker 1: the year. So we lose our starting center. A Mere

935
00:51:42,840 --> 00:51:46,040
Speaker 1: Coffee has shoulder surgery. We lose our starting or starting

936
00:51:46,080 --> 00:51:47,960
Speaker 1: small forward. It was in the NBA playing with the

937
00:51:47,960 --> 00:51:50,799
Speaker 1: Clippers doing well, so I take a step back. We

938
00:51:50,920 --> 00:51:54,360
Speaker 1: ended up bottom, falling out because of these injuries. Bounce

939
00:51:54,400 --> 00:51:57,600
Speaker 1: back the next year. We go to the tournament, beat Louisville.

940
00:51:58,080 --> 00:52:00,879
Speaker 1: We hadn't won a game since an Answer Subway tournament

941
00:52:00,920 --> 00:52:04,680
Speaker 1: a long time. We come back the next year. We

942
00:52:04,760 --> 00:52:07,600
Speaker 1: got Marcus carm We get some good players. We're like

943
00:52:07,719 --> 00:52:09,719
Speaker 1: really high in the net and Kent bomb, but we

944
00:52:09,840 --> 00:52:12,680
Speaker 1: lost a lot of close games. COVID hits. And this

945
00:52:12,760 --> 00:52:14,879
Speaker 1: is where a lot of coaches have endured, this where

946
00:52:15,280 --> 00:52:17,160
Speaker 1: they say you didn't make the tournament. I'm like, I'm

947
00:52:17,200 --> 00:52:19,440
Speaker 1: still alive in the turn, I could have won a

948
00:52:19,520 --> 00:52:21,799
Speaker 1: game or two in the Big ten and maybe stuck

949
00:52:21,880 --> 00:52:25,560
Speaker 1: in the tournament. Um And then last year hits obviously

950
00:52:25,680 --> 00:52:29,279
Speaker 1: and just didn't have a chance because again last year

951
00:52:29,360 --> 00:52:34,879
Speaker 1: we beat five ranked teams. But Liam Robbins gets hurt

952
00:52:35,120 --> 00:52:38,279
Speaker 1: who's playing for Vanderbilt. Really good player. Gabe Calcer gets

953
00:52:38,360 --> 00:52:41,680
Speaker 1: hurt starting for Iowa State, really good player in the

954
00:52:41,719 --> 00:52:44,520
Speaker 1: bottom fat again again not to absolve be of any

955
00:52:44,600 --> 00:52:46,120
Speaker 1: mistakes that I made, but it was just it was

956
00:52:46,200 --> 00:52:49,480
Speaker 1: so up and down. There was no consistency. That the

957
00:52:49,560 --> 00:52:53,160
Speaker 1: problem with that program. And again you lived it, I

958
00:52:53,320 --> 00:52:56,640
Speaker 1: just watched it. The problem with the program is your

959
00:52:56,760 --> 00:53:01,359
Speaker 1: l level where everything has to go close to right

960
00:53:02,320 --> 00:53:06,239
Speaker 1: to be successful, and the margin for error is much

961
00:53:06,360 --> 00:53:11,040
Speaker 1: slighter there than it is most anywhere else in that league. Now, look,

962
00:53:11,640 --> 00:53:16,400
Speaker 1: you know, it's like, um, you know, like I remember,

963
00:53:16,640 --> 00:53:18,920
Speaker 1: you know, I remember Chris Collins tell me, you know,

964
00:53:19,000 --> 00:53:20,680
Speaker 1: this is after he made the n TERM. Like the

965
00:53:20,760 --> 00:53:22,560
Speaker 1: next year he was supposed to get a point guard

966
00:53:23,040 --> 00:53:24,799
Speaker 1: and the kid ends up having an off the court

967
00:53:24,840 --> 00:53:26,800
Speaker 1: issue and he goes he goes to UTEP. But I

968
00:53:27,120 --> 00:53:29,399
Speaker 1: knew the kid, and I was trying to help him

969
00:53:29,400 --> 00:53:32,360
Speaker 1: along whatever. And you try to explain to someone like,

970
00:53:32,440 --> 00:53:35,680
Speaker 1: look at at at Michigan. At Michigan State, you go

971
00:53:35,880 --> 00:53:39,360
Speaker 1: from being an Elite eight team to just make the

972
00:53:39,480 --> 00:53:41,520
Speaker 1: n A tournament when you don't get the right point guard.

973
00:53:41,520 --> 00:53:45,160
Speaker 1: When you're at Minnesota or Northwestern and you have one

974
00:53:45,239 --> 00:53:47,440
Speaker 1: thing go wrong, the bottom does kind of start to

975
00:53:47,480 --> 00:53:50,399
Speaker 1: come out because the margin for error is much slight.

976
00:53:50,719 --> 00:53:55,799
Speaker 1: Here here's the what is that like to lose your job,

977
00:53:56,080 --> 00:53:59,640
Speaker 1: to come home to your family when you know, like

978
00:54:00,000 --> 00:54:02,800
Speaker 1: we're gonna move. What's next? Because there was there was

979
00:54:02,840 --> 00:54:05,839
Speaker 1: a gap there between that in New Mexico. I wasn't

980
00:54:05,880 --> 00:54:10,360
Speaker 1: like that was the weird part. There really wasn't, um So.

981
00:54:10,640 --> 00:54:12,799
Speaker 1: I mean I I was pretty sure I was gonna

982
00:54:12,840 --> 00:54:15,600
Speaker 1: lose my job. So the what at what point in

983
00:54:15,680 --> 00:54:19,400
Speaker 1: time did you know? Did you? Like, probably the last

984
00:54:20,080 --> 00:54:22,840
Speaker 1: two weeks or so, like like me and the a

985
00:54:23,040 --> 00:54:26,000
Speaker 1: D still to this day talk probably once a week.

986
00:54:26,120 --> 00:54:28,680
Speaker 1: As weird as it sounds, Mark Coyle like we had

987
00:54:28,719 --> 00:54:31,440
Speaker 1: a great relationship, but you know you stopped hearing from

988
00:54:31,520 --> 00:54:33,000
Speaker 1: him a little bit. And I don't think it was

989
00:54:33,080 --> 00:54:37,000
Speaker 1: anything intentional, m But he wasn't telling me you're good.

990
00:54:37,640 --> 00:54:42,080
Speaker 1: Uh So I would say mid the late February, like

991
00:54:42,280 --> 00:54:45,480
Speaker 1: when Calscher was out and Robbins was out, I just

992
00:54:45,560 --> 00:54:48,560
Speaker 1: knew I couldn't win with my two starting you know,

993
00:54:49,520 --> 00:54:51,600
Speaker 1: key players out. We didn't have the depth to do it.

994
00:54:51,800 --> 00:54:56,920
Speaker 1: So um I felt it coming. We beat Northwestern on

995
00:54:57,000 --> 00:54:59,680
Speaker 1: the Wednesday in the Big Ten tournament. I'm like, okay,

996
00:54:59,760 --> 00:55:01,440
Speaker 1: the only the way, it's a miracle, like you win

997
00:55:01,520 --> 00:55:03,560
Speaker 1: the tournament, which I just converser in which I just

998
00:55:03,600 --> 00:55:06,120
Speaker 1: knew I was gonna do. So. Um that Thursday we

999
00:55:06,160 --> 00:55:09,960
Speaker 1: play Ohio State. We play him close. And I met

1000
00:55:10,040 --> 00:55:15,880
Speaker 1: with Mark that Friday and New Mexican in Indie or

1001
00:55:16,080 --> 00:55:19,080
Speaker 1: in Minnesota. We flew back and Mark was great, like,

1002
00:55:19,239 --> 00:55:21,959
Speaker 1: I mean, it's it's so New Mexico jumped in there,

1003
00:55:22,960 --> 00:55:25,160
Speaker 1: you know, right that Friday or whatever. I didn't have

1004
00:55:25,200 --> 00:55:28,080
Speaker 1: any conversation when they've spoken to my agent, so they

1005
00:55:28,160 --> 00:55:31,400
Speaker 1: had showed interest. But it was this whirlwind of well,

1006
00:55:31,440 --> 00:55:34,160
Speaker 1: I don't know if I'm getting fired. I know Steve

1007
00:55:34,200 --> 00:55:36,400
Speaker 1: Alford one big in New Mexico, I know the pit,

1008
00:55:36,520 --> 00:55:37,920
Speaker 1: I know the fan base, but I don't really know

1009
00:55:38,000 --> 00:55:41,759
Speaker 1: Albuquerque real well. So I met with Mark. Um. It

1010
00:55:41,960 --> 00:55:44,640
Speaker 1: wasn't the yelling and scream and flipping desk. It was like,

1011
00:55:44,760 --> 00:55:48,000
Speaker 1: I think Mark felt bad. He's like I like this dude,

1012
00:55:48,000 --> 00:55:49,799
Speaker 1: He's a good guy. I know he cares about his family,

1013
00:55:49,880 --> 00:55:52,719
Speaker 1: loves Minnesota. But Mark had to do what he felt

1014
00:55:52,840 --> 00:55:56,239
Speaker 1: was right. I respected as a coach. We need to

1015
00:55:56,280 --> 00:55:58,680
Speaker 1: act that way. More like when our players bitched that

1016
00:55:58,760 --> 00:56:01,120
Speaker 1: they don't play and we sit there and act like

1017
00:56:01,320 --> 00:56:03,560
Speaker 1: they're the worst human beings in the world. Just remember

1018
00:56:03,600 --> 00:56:05,440
Speaker 1: when it doesn't go our ways at coach, how do

1019
00:56:05,520 --> 00:56:09,000
Speaker 1: we act? So Mark was like, well, we heard New

1020
00:56:09,040 --> 00:56:11,960
Speaker 1: Mexico might be interested and it was some other job

1021
00:56:12,080 --> 00:56:15,279
Speaker 1: that was not because Twitter says it and all these

1022
00:56:15,320 --> 00:56:16,920
Speaker 1: a d s claim they don't read Twitter. They're all

1023
00:56:17,000 --> 00:56:19,960
Speaker 1: lying they read Twitter. So I said, well, I don't

1024
00:56:20,000 --> 00:56:23,000
Speaker 1: really know it, Mark, like I wanted to. I want

1025
00:56:23,040 --> 00:56:25,839
Speaker 1: to stay here um because part of me is like, well,

1026
00:56:25,880 --> 00:56:28,440
Speaker 1: maybe he sees the injuries. But it just had been

1027
00:56:28,560 --> 00:56:30,520
Speaker 1: so much and it had worn everybody down and I

1028
00:56:30,600 --> 00:56:33,840
Speaker 1: get it. So it was basically like, go try to

1029
00:56:33,880 --> 00:56:37,439
Speaker 1: get New Mexico, similar to Alford where Alford was kind

1030
00:56:37,480 --> 00:56:40,440
Speaker 1: of on his way out of Bible and I'm like, okay, well,

1031
00:56:41,239 --> 00:56:44,040
Speaker 1: so I fly to Chicago the next day and I

1032
00:56:44,200 --> 00:56:47,200
Speaker 1: meet with uh Eddie Newonis d a D. And it

1033
00:56:47,320 --> 00:56:50,200
Speaker 1: was great, but it was just emotionally it was like

1034
00:56:50,800 --> 00:56:54,200
Speaker 1: I'm sitting there in the middle of Chicago with my

1035
00:56:54,320 --> 00:56:57,600
Speaker 1: suit on that I probably wore to you know whatever,

1036
00:56:57,800 --> 00:56:59,960
Speaker 1: Like with the Minnesota pin on, I take it off,

1037
00:57:00,040 --> 00:57:03,479
Speaker 1: throw it away. And again it was another situation where

1038
00:57:04,160 --> 00:57:07,400
Speaker 1: I hadn't done all this research. It just kind of happened,

1039
00:57:07,719 --> 00:57:10,000
Speaker 1: and I sit down with Eddie Junez and we have

1040
00:57:10,080 --> 00:57:13,200
Speaker 1: a great talk um. So part of me is like,

1041
00:57:13,280 --> 00:57:15,319
Speaker 1: can I get it before I'm getting fired? And Eddie

1042
00:57:15,360 --> 00:57:16,920
Speaker 1: was great and he was like, don't worry about that.

1043
00:57:17,440 --> 00:57:21,000
Speaker 1: So Sunday hits. Eddie didn't offer me the job. I

1044
00:57:21,120 --> 00:57:23,920
Speaker 1: felt somewhat good about it, but not as good as

1045
00:57:23,960 --> 00:57:26,040
Speaker 1: the Minnesota one. I thought, I'm in the mix. I

1046
00:57:26,080 --> 00:57:27,440
Speaker 1: don't know if I'm gonna get it. And part of

1047
00:57:27,480 --> 00:57:29,240
Speaker 1: me is like, do I want to take a year off?

1048
00:57:29,760 --> 00:57:32,600
Speaker 1: Because Minnesota still owed me almost two million dollars and

1049
00:57:32,640 --> 00:57:34,800
Speaker 1: I'm like, screw them. They're gonna pay me without working,

1050
00:57:34,800 --> 00:57:37,320
Speaker 1: and that was kind of cool, but I'm like, no,

1051
00:57:37,480 --> 00:57:39,320
Speaker 1: I want to keep working. I want to keep coaching.

1052
00:57:39,360 --> 00:57:41,640
Speaker 1: I want to So albert Querque checked a lot of

1053
00:57:41,720 --> 00:57:44,760
Speaker 1: boxes because it was a you didn't have to rival

1054
00:57:44,880 --> 00:57:48,000
Speaker 1: the Vikings and you know, the Timberwolves and all these

1055
00:57:48,520 --> 00:57:51,240
Speaker 1: You're you're the Lakers, You're you're there, You're the show.

1056
00:57:51,720 --> 00:57:56,360
Speaker 1: So that was attractive to me. So Sunday Mark was

1057
00:57:56,520 --> 00:57:58,200
Speaker 1: like reached out to my age. It was like, we

1058
00:57:58,280 --> 00:58:00,760
Speaker 1: have to release it, and I had heard from New

1059
00:58:00,840 --> 00:58:04,280
Speaker 1: Mexico yet, so I'm like, no big deal, It's fine,

1060
00:58:04,400 --> 00:58:06,800
Speaker 1: not a big deal. So yeah, you know, your wife's

1061
00:58:06,840 --> 00:58:11,000
Speaker 1: crying and it's emotional. Um. But then I kind of

1062
00:58:11,080 --> 00:58:14,080
Speaker 1: like I got the job ten minutes after they released

1063
00:58:14,120 --> 00:58:16,920
Speaker 1: it on Twitter. So Eddie calls me and offers me

1064
00:58:17,000 --> 00:58:20,240
Speaker 1: a job. Great, I'm taking it. What was really hard

1065
00:58:20,600 --> 00:58:24,720
Speaker 1: was because the emotion of taking this job. Take care here,

1066
00:58:25,280 --> 00:58:28,040
Speaker 1: you know, saying the five months where I was in

1067
00:58:28,160 --> 00:58:32,320
Speaker 1: New Mexico, I couldn't go recruiting because the rules, the

1068
00:58:32,440 --> 00:58:34,600
Speaker 1: rules were not allowing us to recruiting. So you're you're

1069
00:58:35,120 --> 00:58:36,960
Speaker 1: normally when you take a job, like you don't see

1070
00:58:36,960 --> 00:58:40,040
Speaker 1: your family because you're flying all over. Like I added

1071
00:58:40,080 --> 00:58:41,960
Speaker 1: a you know, kid from Sweden. I would have been

1072
00:58:42,000 --> 00:58:44,120
Speaker 1: in Sweden. I had a kid from Atlanta. I had

1073
00:58:44,160 --> 00:58:46,360
Speaker 1: been flying to Atlanta. I would have been in Arizona,

1074
00:58:46,480 --> 00:58:48,560
Speaker 1: Jalen House. You didn't do any of it. You're sitting

1075
00:58:48,560 --> 00:58:52,720
Speaker 1: on a computer screen. So for me, that five months

1076
00:58:52,840 --> 00:58:57,840
Speaker 1: alone was really hard for me because every I couldn't

1077
00:58:57,840 --> 00:58:59,560
Speaker 1: really go anywhere. So I was able to fly back

1078
00:58:59,680 --> 00:59:02,680
Speaker 1: to Minnesota, and I remember I told Matt mccaull this,

1079
00:59:02,760 --> 00:59:04,640
Speaker 1: Matt mccaull just got let go of U Mass and

1080
00:59:04,680 --> 00:59:06,919
Speaker 1: I called Matt and I just checking in on this morning.

1081
00:59:07,200 --> 00:59:10,320
Speaker 1: I remember going to my daughter's five year old daughter,

1082
00:59:10,520 --> 00:59:13,800
Speaker 1: Zoe qt as can be she I go back to Minnesota.

1083
00:59:14,360 --> 00:59:16,480
Speaker 1: You know, all the people in her dance class. And

1084
00:59:16,520 --> 00:59:19,080
Speaker 1: so she's got the dance recital and I remember sitting

1085
00:59:19,120 --> 00:59:21,960
Speaker 1: there and I just start balling crying as I'm watching

1086
00:59:22,000 --> 00:59:23,880
Speaker 1: her up on stage and Jill's looking over there like

1087
00:59:24,040 --> 00:59:27,800
Speaker 1: you all right, And just the emotion of not not

1088
00:59:28,040 --> 00:59:30,640
Speaker 1: that I felt like I failed as a coach, like

1089
00:59:30,680 --> 00:59:33,480
Speaker 1: I didn't feel that, but I felt like we had

1090
00:59:33,520 --> 00:59:39,400
Speaker 1: this great situation personally family wise, and I'm taking them

1091
00:59:39,440 --> 00:59:42,200
Speaker 1: and I'm because I couldn't get the job done, away

1092
00:59:42,240 --> 00:59:44,880
Speaker 1: from all their friends, and I'm moving them across the

1093
00:59:44,920 --> 00:59:47,280
Speaker 1: country to Albuquerque that they don't know. It's not like

1094
00:59:47,400 --> 00:59:51,360
Speaker 1: I was moving to Boston or Florida or something like that.

1095
00:59:51,920 --> 00:59:56,120
Speaker 1: Guilt was really really hard for me emotionally, um. And

1096
00:59:56,560 --> 00:59:59,400
Speaker 1: I was telling Matt mccaull this, like your kids, you

1097
00:59:59,520 --> 01:00:02,280
Speaker 1: think they care, they don't care. They're gonna meet new

1098
01:00:02,360 --> 01:00:05,680
Speaker 1: friends and they're they're resilient. Um. But those couple of

1099
01:00:05,720 --> 01:00:08,400
Speaker 1: months was hard because you're sitting there. You can't go

1100
01:00:08,480 --> 01:00:10,959
Speaker 1: anywhere because of COVID. So I'm flying back and forth,

1101
01:00:11,080 --> 01:00:14,640
Speaker 1: but very very happy I took it. Uh, it's it's

1102
01:00:14,680 --> 01:00:17,040
Speaker 1: a great spot. I know. You gotta go in a

1103
01:00:17,080 --> 01:00:23,200
Speaker 1: second are Um Okay? So what is different about New

1104
01:00:23,280 --> 01:00:28,640
Speaker 1: Mexico now essentially one season in from what you perceived

1105
01:00:28,840 --> 01:00:32,960
Speaker 1: before you took the job. Well, I would say from

1106
01:00:33,080 --> 01:00:37,080
Speaker 1: a just car. Culturally it's way different. I mean probably

1107
01:00:37,120 --> 01:00:39,480
Speaker 1: would be the same way living in l A versus.

1108
01:00:39,640 --> 01:00:43,000
Speaker 1: The West is so different than the East and even

1109
01:00:43,040 --> 01:00:47,560
Speaker 1: the Midwest. So um, I think the biggest thing about

1110
01:00:47,720 --> 01:00:52,080
Speaker 1: New Mexico that I didn't understand is honestly, the weather,

1111
01:00:52,400 --> 01:00:57,360
Speaker 1: I believe year round is second to southern California. I

1112
01:00:57,440 --> 01:00:59,640
Speaker 1: don't know if there's a place in this country that

1113
01:00:59,800 --> 01:01:04,080
Speaker 1: year around where it's not sweltering hot. Uh. In the summertime,

1114
01:01:04,760 --> 01:01:08,919
Speaker 1: you know, Christmas, it's it's sunny and bright, so the sun,

1115
01:01:09,560 --> 01:01:13,040
Speaker 1: the weather is amazing. So you're still getting that l

1116
01:01:13,160 --> 01:01:18,520
Speaker 1: a weather in New Mexico. Um, I didn't realize, you know,

1117
01:01:18,720 --> 01:01:22,080
Speaker 1: Like the Lobos are a very very big deal to

1118
01:01:22,360 --> 01:01:25,600
Speaker 1: his city into this state. Here's what Here's what I've

1119
01:01:25,640 --> 01:01:28,240
Speaker 1: told people, and you're starting to experience it, although you

1120
01:01:28,320 --> 01:01:31,680
Speaker 1: haven't gotten the full force of it. I've never been

1121
01:01:31,760 --> 01:01:36,080
Speaker 1: to a place where the old people are louder than

1122
01:01:36,160 --> 01:01:40,000
Speaker 1: the young people. I've never that's. Everyone talks about the

1123
01:01:40,040 --> 01:01:43,160
Speaker 1: pit and the altitude and walking down the ramp and

1124
01:01:43,240 --> 01:01:45,920
Speaker 1: all that is great, okay, But what really makes that

1125
01:01:46,040 --> 01:01:50,560
Speaker 1: place unique and special is like the old people that

1126
01:01:50,600 --> 01:01:52,880
Speaker 1: are supposed to be the one. Usually what you want

1127
01:01:52,920 --> 01:01:55,400
Speaker 1: to do as a coach or you know, is move

1128
01:01:55,480 --> 01:01:57,320
Speaker 1: the old people out and get young people in because

1129
01:01:57,400 --> 01:01:59,200
Speaker 1: young people are loud and they help you win games.

1130
01:02:00,040 --> 01:02:01,680
Speaker 1: But the old people are more nuts from the young

1131
01:02:01,760 --> 01:02:04,080
Speaker 1: people there. I never see anything like there's a deep

1132
01:02:04,120 --> 01:02:07,960
Speaker 1: hatred for referees. I've never seen a fanmate know, the

1133
01:02:08,040 --> 01:02:13,880
Speaker 1: refs like the Hurly family of the family of fans.

1134
01:02:14,920 --> 01:02:17,560
Speaker 1: It's um like, like, so we're here, we have a

1135
01:02:17,640 --> 01:02:20,640
Speaker 1: vaccine mandate, we have a mask mandate to get into

1136
01:02:20,680 --> 01:02:24,960
Speaker 1: the building. Plus we're getting better. But we're at the

1137
01:02:25,040 --> 01:02:27,240
Speaker 1: towards the bottom of the conference and this is a rebuild,

1138
01:02:27,760 --> 01:02:30,800
Speaker 1: and we're averaging almost nine thousand fans a game and

1139
01:02:31,160 --> 01:02:34,120
Speaker 1: people are apologizing for this, and I'm like, guys, like

1140
01:02:34,720 --> 01:02:37,400
Speaker 1: you don't understand, like they won six games last year,

1141
01:02:37,840 --> 01:02:41,160
Speaker 1: Like we're gonna have to to get eight nine thousand fans.

1142
01:02:41,280 --> 01:02:44,920
Speaker 1: We played air Force the other day and US and

1143
01:02:45,000 --> 01:02:48,120
Speaker 1: air Force stores a bottom and the place was awesome

1144
01:02:48,880 --> 01:02:51,800
Speaker 1: with a vaccine mandate and with a mask mandate, So

1145
01:02:53,280 --> 01:02:58,160
Speaker 1: there's so much potential. I think the pit is it's

1146
01:02:58,240 --> 01:03:01,600
Speaker 1: all that's advertised. I really believe it. Like it's not

1147
01:03:01,800 --> 01:03:05,320
Speaker 1: only like like it's they upgraded a lot with sweets

1148
01:03:05,400 --> 01:03:09,360
Speaker 1: and so on. Um, I think it's a page. No,

1149
01:03:09,640 --> 01:03:11,840
Speaker 1: it's it's the right side, like that's how you do

1150
01:03:11,960 --> 01:03:16,560
Speaker 1: a remodel. Right, there's less seats, more and and and great.

1151
01:03:16,560 --> 01:03:18,880
Speaker 1: And then you got the practice place right there next

1152
01:03:18,880 --> 01:03:25,040
Speaker 1: to year did the coaching Jamal's son, you being your

1153
01:03:25,200 --> 01:03:28,320
Speaker 1: dad's son. Like, there's a lot of things that are

1154
01:03:28,320 --> 01:03:30,760
Speaker 1: pretty cool. I was trying to explain somebody to it

1155
01:03:31,320 --> 01:03:33,880
Speaker 1: that the whole, all of the layers to it. But

1156
01:03:34,000 --> 01:03:37,040
Speaker 1: there's also and again I don't know Jamal June. I don't.

1157
01:03:37,040 --> 01:03:39,120
Speaker 1: I don't know him at all. But there's also that

1158
01:03:39,240 --> 01:03:42,360
Speaker 1: his dad is brilliant businessman, right, like I worked with

1159
01:03:42,440 --> 01:03:44,440
Speaker 1: him in ESPN and he basically walked because he's like,

1160
01:03:44,560 --> 01:03:49,720
Speaker 1: I don't need it, right, But there's it feels like

1161
01:03:49,880 --> 01:03:52,640
Speaker 1: there's just like you. There's not the entitlement to you

1162
01:03:52,760 --> 01:03:55,080
Speaker 1: that there could be. It feels like he's much the

1163
01:03:55,160 --> 01:03:59,720
Speaker 1: same way. And that's really really unique, very very similar.

1164
01:04:00,160 --> 01:04:06,120
Speaker 1: And Jamal Senior, like you said, crazy businessman and passionate

1165
01:04:06,200 --> 01:04:08,560
Speaker 1: about it. Like whenever I see him, that's what we

1166
01:04:08,640 --> 01:04:10,120
Speaker 1: talked about. I'm like, hey man, you've got an investment

1167
01:04:10,160 --> 01:04:11,880
Speaker 1: for me, Like how do I make money? It's never

1168
01:04:12,000 --> 01:04:17,480
Speaker 1: really about Jamal jr Um a very rare family. When

1169
01:04:17,560 --> 01:04:20,960
Speaker 1: I was let go, Jamal Senor, he went, he went

1170
01:04:21,040 --> 01:04:23,200
Speaker 1: up to Mark clo'es like, you know, this is bs.

1171
01:04:23,240 --> 01:04:25,400
Speaker 1: We're in the middle of COVID. He's got injuries. This

1172
01:04:25,560 --> 01:04:29,000
Speaker 1: isn't right. And to his you know, like I didn't

1173
01:04:29,000 --> 01:04:31,640
Speaker 1: tell him to do that. And legitimately, when I took

1174
01:04:31,680 --> 01:04:33,720
Speaker 1: the New Mexico job, they called me and we're like,

1175
01:04:34,800 --> 01:04:36,600
Speaker 1: we signed up to play for you. We didn't sign

1176
01:04:36,720 --> 01:04:40,760
Speaker 1: up to play for Minnesota, you know. And that's so rare,

1177
01:04:41,280 --> 01:04:47,320
Speaker 1: so rare. Jamal Junior is as you talk about me

1178
01:04:47,480 --> 01:04:49,680
Speaker 1: being normal, like you would not know his dad was

1179
01:04:49,680 --> 01:04:52,760
Speaker 1: an NBA All Star. You'd never know it. Hardest worker

1180
01:04:52,800 --> 01:04:55,240
Speaker 1: I've coached by far. Everyone on our staffs is the

1181
01:04:55,320 --> 01:04:59,520
Speaker 1: same thing. Disciplined, unentitled um and a lot of that

1182
01:04:59,680 --> 01:05:03,600
Speaker 1: is Mall Senior just phenomenal father. So it worked out

1183
01:05:04,400 --> 01:05:06,560
Speaker 1: much like me, I mean, like everybody kind of wonders

1184
01:05:06,600 --> 01:05:07,920
Speaker 1: how you were the way you were. Like my dad

1185
01:05:08,000 --> 01:05:11,200
Speaker 1: was really tough on me to not act a certain

1186
01:05:11,240 --> 01:05:15,320
Speaker 1: way like this famous coach's son, Um, Jamal Jr. Is

1187
01:05:15,400 --> 01:05:18,800
Speaker 1: the same way. So it's been a I'm lucky, uh,

1188
01:05:18,960 --> 01:05:22,320
Speaker 1: And I wanted to work out for Jamal Junior because

1189
01:05:22,360 --> 01:05:24,760
Speaker 1: of that loyalty. You just don't see it anymore, you know.

1190
01:05:24,880 --> 01:05:27,800
Speaker 1: I mean it's that loyalty doesn't really exist anymore. And

1191
01:05:27,880 --> 01:05:30,440
Speaker 1: with him, it's cool to see that he's playing great

1192
01:05:30,760 --> 01:05:32,880
Speaker 1: and he's enjoying his experience because it does mean a

1193
01:05:32,920 --> 01:05:35,960
Speaker 1: little lecture to me. Okay, the real challenge that job,

1194
01:05:36,000 --> 01:05:38,720
Speaker 1: obviously is players. Now you can start to get back

1195
01:05:38,720 --> 01:05:43,080
Speaker 1: on the road. But the way New Mexico was built originally, Okay,

1196
01:05:43,200 --> 01:05:45,320
Speaker 1: when when Alfred was there, right, you got you get

1197
01:05:45,360 --> 01:05:48,560
Speaker 1: guys from southern California who are not as highly regarded

1198
01:05:48,880 --> 01:05:50,640
Speaker 1: you've always they've always been able to get guys that

1199
01:05:50,720 --> 01:05:54,040
Speaker 1: transfer as well. The transferring thing though and saying he

1200
01:05:54,080 --> 01:05:57,360
Speaker 1: was State was built on transfers as well as unrecruited guys.

1201
01:05:57,400 --> 01:06:01,360
Speaker 1: Sacramento in the Empire, etcetera. Um, it does feel like

1202
01:06:01,560 --> 01:06:04,080
Speaker 1: the way that New Mexico was built for San Diego State,

1203
01:06:04,160 --> 01:06:08,800
Speaker 1: Like everybody's copying that now, So how do you separate yourself?

1204
01:06:08,880 --> 01:06:13,040
Speaker 1: How do you in You know, in years in the past,

1205
01:06:14,480 --> 01:06:17,400
Speaker 1: you know that that there wasn't all these schools with

1206
01:06:17,520 --> 01:06:19,520
Speaker 1: the level of facilities that you guys had, the level

1207
01:06:19,600 --> 01:06:22,080
Speaker 1: investment you have that we're going in on trying to

1208
01:06:22,080 --> 01:06:25,160
Speaker 1: get bounced back kids or trying to is it foreign players? Like,

1209
01:06:25,200 --> 01:06:28,080
Speaker 1: how what's what gets you to that next level in

1210
01:06:28,240 --> 01:06:31,920
Speaker 1: terms of talent of athletes because as we started this discussion,

1211
01:06:32,000 --> 01:06:35,080
Speaker 1: no one's ever done it without players. Yeah, I think this, Uh,

1212
01:06:35,880 --> 01:06:38,680
Speaker 1: for one thing, I think our fan base needs to

1213
01:06:38,800 --> 01:06:41,240
Speaker 1: understand we were three oh three in the net last year.

1214
01:06:41,480 --> 01:06:45,080
Speaker 1: Three oh three. I mean that's really really low. So

1215
01:06:46,080 --> 01:06:51,360
Speaker 1: we took over this program and added eight players on

1216
01:06:51,560 --> 01:06:54,600
Speaker 1: zooms Like and that's not an excuse, it's just like

1217
01:06:55,280 --> 01:06:59,760
Speaker 1: the reality, it's reality. So what I think what we

1218
01:07:00,000 --> 01:07:02,240
Speaker 1: eat is for one, we need time, and nobody wants

1219
01:07:02,280 --> 01:07:04,440
Speaker 1: to hear that, and this fan base who's really passionate

1220
01:07:04,560 --> 01:07:07,600
Speaker 1: doesn't want to hear that. But anytime you fire coaches

1221
01:07:08,320 --> 01:07:11,960
Speaker 1: every four years, it's very, very hard. Un l V

1222
01:07:12,120 --> 01:07:14,720
Speaker 1: has kind of experienced that a little bit. They got

1223
01:07:14,760 --> 01:07:17,400
Speaker 1: a little bit of continuity with keeping Bryce Hamilton's because

1224
01:07:17,520 --> 01:07:19,960
Speaker 1: Krueger was on the staff. They knew kind of what

1225
01:07:20,120 --> 01:07:22,560
Speaker 1: they had with him being there. But when you're starting

1226
01:07:22,680 --> 01:07:25,720
Speaker 1: over over and over again, it's really hard. It's really hard.

1227
01:07:26,040 --> 01:07:29,200
Speaker 1: So we need time. But the question that you asked is, see,

1228
01:07:29,200 --> 01:07:31,720
Speaker 1: I think people think because of the portal you can

1229
01:07:31,840 --> 01:07:35,600
Speaker 1: change it quickly. You can't. You cannot flip it as

1230
01:07:35,680 --> 01:07:37,400
Speaker 1: quickly as you can. I actually think in the year

1231
01:07:37,480 --> 01:07:41,080
Speaker 1: one for us, it's gone pretty well, as crazy as

1232
01:07:41,120 --> 01:07:45,400
Speaker 1: it sounds, we're not the last. First well, first of

1233
01:07:45,440 --> 01:07:48,560
Speaker 1: all the league four and a half n c A

1234
01:07:48,640 --> 01:07:51,760
Speaker 1: tournament teams in the Mountain West, and the league's a beast.

1235
01:07:52,320 --> 01:07:54,800
Speaker 1: The league is at the top. And you at our

1236
01:07:54,840 --> 01:07:57,040
Speaker 1: Fresnel game the other day, I'm looking going this team

1237
01:07:57,080 --> 01:07:59,960
Speaker 1: has got a pro like they It was a tie game.

1238
01:08:00,600 --> 01:08:03,640
Speaker 1: They went pick and pop and he hits the three

1239
01:08:03,760 --> 01:08:08,280
Speaker 1: like that doesn't happen. So there's really good programs. I

1240
01:08:08,520 --> 01:08:12,000
Speaker 1: think the transfer portal is what's skewing a lot of

1241
01:08:12,360 --> 01:08:14,400
Speaker 1: people to think we can just flip it. You have

1242
01:08:14,560 --> 01:08:18,240
Speaker 1: to build a foundation, and that's why the houses in

1243
01:08:18,280 --> 01:08:20,320
Speaker 1: the mash burns in the world. Although they are transfers

1244
01:08:20,400 --> 01:08:23,320
Speaker 1: like mashes, technically a freshman has to teking a sophomore.

1245
01:08:23,760 --> 01:08:27,599
Speaker 1: Recruiting wise, Inland Empire, for sure, we got a kid

1246
01:08:27,680 --> 01:08:30,920
Speaker 1: Donovan Dent is terrific. A lot of Packed twelve schools

1247
01:08:30,960 --> 01:08:33,720
Speaker 1: were intrigued by him. Um Quinton Webb is another one

1248
01:08:33,760 --> 01:08:36,800
Speaker 1: in the Empire like terrific. So I think you do

1249
01:08:36,960 --> 01:08:39,880
Speaker 1: have to build the program, see what you need, and

1250
01:08:39,960 --> 01:08:43,280
Speaker 1: then supplement it with some transfers. San Diego State is

1251
01:08:43,320 --> 01:08:45,320
Speaker 1: the class of the league, and a lot of that

1252
01:08:45,400 --> 01:08:49,240
Speaker 1: has to do with culture. They grabbed Matt Bradley, but

1253
01:08:49,400 --> 01:08:52,639
Speaker 1: they had some guys that grew through the program. Um,

1254
01:08:53,160 --> 01:08:56,040
Speaker 1: you look at what Nico has done at Colorado State.

1255
01:08:56,479 --> 01:08:59,559
Speaker 1: David Roddy won like twelve games his first year. Now

1256
01:08:59,640 --> 01:09:01,360
Speaker 1: he's gonna a player to your in the league. He

1257
01:09:01,520 --> 01:09:04,920
Speaker 1: grew up through it. So I still think you need

1258
01:09:05,000 --> 01:09:07,280
Speaker 1: to build it the way we all do and get

1259
01:09:07,360 --> 01:09:11,400
Speaker 1: one or two transfers. I know, I'm you've been great

1260
01:09:11,439 --> 01:09:13,280
Speaker 1: with your time. I do got to ask you. So Roddy.

1261
01:09:13,400 --> 01:09:16,160
Speaker 1: Roddy is a perfect example right where there'll be people

1262
01:09:16,160 --> 01:09:20,639
Speaker 1: in Minnesota say, see at Petino taking Roddy Like, Okay, one,

1263
01:09:21,320 --> 01:09:23,880
Speaker 1: what do he looked like in high school? And two again,

1264
01:09:24,160 --> 01:09:25,800
Speaker 1: you and I both loved the Mountain West and think

1265
01:09:25,840 --> 01:09:29,479
Speaker 1: it's held league. But his his life is completely different

1266
01:09:29,560 --> 01:09:33,679
Speaker 1: if he's in the Big ten, just completely like remember

1267
01:09:33,720 --> 01:09:38,719
Speaker 1: the Big Ten, their centers are monsters, like everybody's legit

1268
01:09:39,200 --> 01:09:42,439
Speaker 1: big guys. Right. So now and he's he plays five,

1269
01:09:42,520 --> 01:09:45,160
Speaker 1: he plays four, but even as a four, his life

1270
01:09:45,280 --> 01:09:48,439
Speaker 1: is very, very different. But trying, how do you explain

1271
01:09:48,520 --> 01:09:51,479
Speaker 1: that to somebody who got people listening to podcasts of

1272
01:09:51,560 --> 01:09:54,360
Speaker 1: all guys understand what was Roddy like in high school?

1273
01:09:54,439 --> 01:09:57,560
Speaker 1: What was what? What? What was that actually experience? So

1274
01:09:57,640 --> 01:09:59,880
Speaker 1: I think the deal with Roddy was first time I

1275
01:10:00,040 --> 01:10:03,040
Speaker 1: saw him, I offered him, I really liked him. We

1276
01:10:03,280 --> 01:10:08,280
Speaker 1: had Daniel Aturo and we had Brandon Johnson. So people

1277
01:10:08,320 --> 01:10:13,240
Speaker 1: understand Daniel Turow six ft nine her size center, right,

1278
01:10:13,400 --> 01:10:17,920
Speaker 1: but he's a crazy athletic. Yeah, yeah, yeah, Daniel is

1279
01:10:18,000 --> 01:10:22,320
Speaker 1: like a better version of Orlando Johnson, you know Robinson

1280
01:10:22,439 --> 01:10:26,120
Speaker 1: Orleana Robinson. Yeah, and they can both end up being

1281
01:10:26,160 --> 01:10:28,920
Speaker 1: at the same but both that type of player. Um,

1282
01:10:29,360 --> 01:10:32,200
Speaker 1: so we really didn't need him, but when I saw him, like,

1283
01:10:32,320 --> 01:10:35,200
Speaker 1: I really like him. He's a little small for our league,

1284
01:10:35,800 --> 01:10:40,160
Speaker 1: but small ball five. The bottom line with David Roddy

1285
01:10:40,240 --> 01:10:43,600
Speaker 1: is David Roddy chose the right place. Uh right, you

1286
01:10:43,640 --> 01:10:46,280
Speaker 1: got to play right, you got to play more right away. Yeah,

1287
01:10:46,479 --> 01:10:48,559
Speaker 1: you know, they kind of built a thing around him eventually,

1288
01:10:49,040 --> 01:10:51,640
Speaker 1: no doubt, and he's gonna have a chance. What what

1289
01:10:51,760 --> 01:10:53,439
Speaker 1: all these players who are obsessed with the pros. I

1290
01:10:53,439 --> 01:10:57,160
Speaker 1: tell him all the time, David Roddy has measurable issues

1291
01:10:57,280 --> 01:11:00,200
Speaker 1: that we all know. He's a great player and when

1292
01:11:00,240 --> 01:11:03,160
Speaker 1: people watching me plays the right way. He's tough, he competes,

1293
01:11:03,439 --> 01:11:05,160
Speaker 1: he can find a way in there somewhere. I don't

1294
01:11:05,160 --> 01:11:06,880
Speaker 1: know how it's gonna be. And it's the same with

1295
01:11:07,000 --> 01:11:09,479
Speaker 1: Draymond Green and all these guys will be an NBA Allstar.

1296
01:11:09,560 --> 01:11:12,960
Speaker 1: I don't know. He is a great player. Uh, we

1297
01:11:13,160 --> 01:11:17,000
Speaker 1: liked him and he chose the right place, all right. Listen,

1298
01:11:17,040 --> 01:11:19,120
Speaker 1: you gotta get to church for your kid. You've been

1299
01:11:19,240 --> 01:11:21,080
Speaker 1: great with your time. I do want to do I

1300
01:11:21,160 --> 01:11:23,439
Speaker 1: want to do more when you get when you got time,

1301
01:11:23,760 --> 01:11:26,240
Speaker 1: and all these different stories. In the meantime, I truly

1302
01:11:26,240 --> 01:11:28,840
Speaker 1: appreciate your time, happy to do it, and thank you

1303
01:11:28,960 --> 01:11:33,439
Speaker 1: for everything I appreciate as well. Well. I hope you

1304
01:11:33,600 --> 01:11:37,000
Speaker 1: enjoyed that. I too, love the pit I'll get. I

1305
01:11:38,280 --> 01:11:40,160
Speaker 1: think I'll break out. We'll break out a pod my

1306
01:11:40,280 --> 01:11:43,519
Speaker 1: next pot here Thursday morning, so that you can get

1307
01:11:43,600 --> 01:11:46,080
Speaker 1: your final four, your final four picks and all the

1308
01:11:46,120 --> 01:11:48,320
Speaker 1: picks of all the first games, and we'll just keep

1309
01:11:48,360 --> 01:11:51,000
Speaker 1: dropping it that way. In the meantime, I appreciate you listening.

1310
01:11:51,240 --> 01:11:55,280
Speaker 1: Remember the download the Doug Gotlib Show, subscribe review rate

1311
01:11:55,520 --> 01:11:58,120
Speaker 1: download this sucker as well. I'm Doug Gottlieb. This is

1312
01:11:58,160 --> 01:11:58,519
Speaker 1: all ball