1 00:01:09,389 --> 00:01:12,669 Speaker 1: Hey, dear therapist listeners, it's Lori and Guy, and we 2 00:01:12,699 --> 00:01:13,559 Speaker 1: have a quick update. 3 00:01:13,839 --> 00:01:16,039 Speaker 2: Many of you have told us that you get something 4 00:01:16,099 --> 00:01:18,459 Speaker 2: new out of each episode when you listen to it 5 00:01:18,499 --> 00:01:21,819 Speaker 2: again the second or third time. In fact, when we 6 00:01:21,859 --> 00:01:24,789 Speaker 2: listen to the episodes again, we also get takeaways we 7 00:01:24,829 --> 00:01:25,829 Speaker 2: didn't remember were there. 8 00:01:26,109 --> 00:01:28,849 Speaker 1: Therapy is like that too. There are so many learning 9 00:01:28,889 --> 00:01:31,429 Speaker 1: moments in a session and it's difficult to absorb them 10 00:01:31,489 --> 00:01:34,369 Speaker 1: all at once. So while we're not taping new episodes 11 00:01:34,449 --> 00:01:38,029 Speaker 1: right now, we are offering you our most popular sessions 12 00:01:38,129 --> 00:01:41,029 Speaker 1: as encores so that you can continue to gain value 13 00:01:41,069 --> 00:01:41,449 Speaker 1: from them. 14 00:01:41,789 --> 00:01:45,299 Speaker 2: We love doing Dear Therapists episodes, but we're each busy 15 00:01:45,339 --> 00:01:47,979 Speaker 2: with new and exciting projects and that we hope you 16 00:01:48,019 --> 00:01:49,119 Speaker 2: will love just as much. 17 00:01:49,539 --> 00:01:52,659 Speaker 1: I have a new advice podcast called Since You Asked, 18 00:01:52,839 --> 00:01:55,139 Speaker 1: which you can get wherever you listen to podcasts. 19 00:01:55,399 --> 00:01:58,149 Speaker 2: And I have a new book coming out. It's called 20 00:01:58,569 --> 00:02:02,909 Speaker 2: Mind Over Grind, How to Break Free When Work Hijacks 21 00:02:02,929 --> 00:02:06,049 Speaker 2: Your Life. And it will be published by Simon & Schuster. 22 00:02:06,489 --> 00:02:09,719 Speaker 2: You can find out more about it on my website, guywench.com. 23 00:02:10,309 --> 00:02:13,479 Speaker 1: You can learn more about these on our socials. And meanwhile, 24 00:02:13,779 --> 00:02:16,619 Speaker 1: we hope you find these Dear Therapist sessions as valuable 25 00:02:16,659 --> 00:02:18,379 Speaker 1: as we have making them for you. 26 00:02:22,359 --> 00:02:23,299 Speaker 3: I'm Lori Gottlieb. 27 00:02:23,759 --> 00:02:25,869 Speaker 1: I'm the author of Maybe You Should Talk to Someone, 28 00:02:26,229 --> 00:02:29,009 Speaker 1: and I write the Dear Therapist advice column for The Atlantic. 29 00:02:29,549 --> 00:02:32,709 Speaker 2: And I'm Guy Winch. I'm the author of Emotional First Aid, 30 00:02:33,069 --> 00:02:35,189 Speaker 2: and I write the Dear Guy advice column for TED. 31 00:02:35,629 --> 00:02:40,009 Speaker 2: And this is Dear Therapists. This week, we're going to 32 00:02:40,049 --> 00:02:42,009 Speaker 2: check in on a guest from season two to hear 33 00:02:42,069 --> 00:02:43,449 Speaker 2: how they're doing a year later. 34 00:02:44,509 --> 00:02:48,009 Speaker 1: First, a quick note. Dear Therapist is for informational purposes only. 35 00:02:48,509 --> 00:02:51,629 Speaker 1: It does not constitute medical or psychological advice and is 36 00:02:51,669 --> 00:02:55,229 Speaker 1: not a substitute for professional health care advice, diagnosis, or treatment. 37 00:02:55,709 --> 00:02:58,069 Speaker 1: In the sessions you'll hear, all names have been changed 38 00:02:58,129 --> 00:02:59,489 Speaker 1: for the privacy of our guests. 39 00:03:01,309 --> 00:03:04,849 Speaker 2: Today, we're checking in with Lauren from season two. Her 40 00:03:04,889 --> 00:03:09,139 Speaker 2: episode was called Lauren's Sexual Shame. The issue was that 41 00:03:09,199 --> 00:03:11,729 Speaker 2: Lauren didn't have sex until she was in her 30s, 42 00:03:11,969 --> 00:03:15,389 Speaker 2: and she didn't have many relationships since then either. So 43 00:03:15,409 --> 00:03:17,669 Speaker 2: when she came to us last year, and she's in 44 00:03:17,709 --> 00:03:21,149 Speaker 2: her 50s at this point, she felt really embarrassed about 45 00:03:21,249 --> 00:03:24,369 Speaker 2: her lack of relationship experience. She was convinced that men 46 00:03:24,389 --> 00:03:27,669 Speaker 2: would judge her for not having that experience. We also 47 00:03:27,689 --> 00:03:29,889 Speaker 2: learned during the session that Lauren had been responsible for 48 00:03:29,929 --> 00:03:33,139 Speaker 2: her mother's emotional well-being growing up and her physical well-being 49 00:03:33,339 --> 00:03:36,799 Speaker 2: later in life. And she actually lived with Lauren then 50 00:03:36,939 --> 00:03:39,619 Speaker 2: until she died. Lauren's mother gave her the message in 51 00:03:39,659 --> 00:03:42,279 Speaker 2: subtle and sometimes not very subtle ways that she should 52 00:03:42,319 --> 00:03:44,699 Speaker 2: be there for her instead of being out there and 53 00:03:44,739 --> 00:03:47,379 Speaker 2: dating like her sisters, who had full lives. 54 00:03:48,139 --> 00:03:50,799 Speaker 1: Yeah, and Lauren really didn't see the extent of this 55 00:03:51,119 --> 00:03:54,379 Speaker 1: imperative that her mother conveyed to her over the years 56 00:03:55,129 --> 00:03:59,249 Speaker 1: and how her feeling guilty and disloyal really sabotaged her 57 00:03:59,389 --> 00:04:02,629 Speaker 1: efforts to be in a serious relationship in early adulthood. 58 00:04:03,589 --> 00:04:06,449 Speaker 1: And in fact, her first sexual experience didn't occur until 59 00:04:06,669 --> 00:04:09,389 Speaker 1: after her mother died. And as a result of all this, 60 00:04:09,569 --> 00:04:12,869 Speaker 1: Lauren really saw herself as damaged. And she had a 61 00:04:12,889 --> 00:04:16,219 Speaker 1: lot of shame around this rather than seeing herself as 62 00:04:17,059 --> 00:04:20,739 Speaker 1: being someone who was kind and compassionate and loyal for 63 00:04:20,779 --> 00:04:23,179 Speaker 1: the sacrifices that she did make. So let's get a 64 00:04:23,199 --> 00:04:24,799 Speaker 1: reminder from that session. 65 00:04:25,999 --> 00:04:28,599 Speaker 4: I guess I'm afraid to get into a relationship in 66 00:04:28,639 --> 00:04:31,619 Speaker 4: a sense, because then people ask you like about your 67 00:04:31,679 --> 00:04:37,289 Speaker 4: history and it's embarrassing one to be 53 and single 68 00:04:37,309 --> 00:04:41,389 Speaker 4: and no children. And, you know, when you mentioned that 69 00:04:41,409 --> 00:04:45,409 Speaker 4: to people, male or female, they're always like shocked. And 70 00:04:45,849 --> 00:04:48,659 Speaker 4: I've had people say, Oh gosh, what's wrong with you? 71 00:04:48,679 --> 00:04:48,759 Speaker 1: Yeah. 72 00:05:08,519 --> 00:05:11,259 Speaker 2: And now let's hear how Lauren is doing one year later. 73 00:05:11,279 --> 00:05:15,609 Speaker 3: Hi, Laurie and Guy. This is Lauren. A lot's changed. 74 00:05:15,789 --> 00:05:17,869 Speaker 3: I moved to the city where I'd wanted to live 75 00:05:17,909 --> 00:05:20,289 Speaker 3: for a very long time. And I went against everybody 76 00:05:20,369 --> 00:05:23,389 Speaker 3: else's advice and moved where I wanted to. I'm really 77 00:05:23,449 --> 00:05:26,869 Speaker 3: enjoying my life here. The biggest change that I made 78 00:05:26,969 --> 00:05:30,989 Speaker 3: is just being nicer and more compassionate to myself. And 79 00:05:31,009 --> 00:05:33,829 Speaker 3: I think that's allowed me to open up and deepen 80 00:05:34,049 --> 00:05:38,949 Speaker 3: my friendships more. In relationships with people, I feel like 81 00:05:39,469 --> 00:05:43,699 Speaker 3: I'm able to be a little bit more vulnerable, more loving. 82 00:05:44,179 --> 00:05:48,259 Speaker 3: I feel happier. I'm having deeper relationships, more honest relationships. 83 00:05:48,859 --> 00:05:51,739 Speaker 3: I actually met someone. I met a guy who I really, 84 00:05:51,779 --> 00:05:53,799 Speaker 3: really liked. And for the first time in my life, 85 00:05:53,879 --> 00:05:57,079 Speaker 3: I was able to actually tell this guy what I 86 00:05:57,139 --> 00:05:59,389 Speaker 3: liked about him, what I didn't like. You know, if 87 00:05:59,409 --> 00:06:02,229 Speaker 3: he did something I didn't like, I brought it to 88 00:06:02,369 --> 00:06:05,869 Speaker 3: his attention in a gentle way, about like pointing the finger. 89 00:06:06,479 --> 00:06:11,059 Speaker 3: He actually appreciated how I communicated with them. I ended 90 00:06:11,099 --> 00:06:14,499 Speaker 3: up breaking up with him basically because the relationship wasn't 91 00:06:14,559 --> 00:06:17,939 Speaker 3: headed in the direction that I wanted to go in. 92 00:06:17,959 --> 00:06:20,429 Speaker 3: It's the first time in my life that I've actually 93 00:06:20,489 --> 00:06:24,369 Speaker 3: broken up with someone. So I feel, although I'm sad 94 00:06:24,489 --> 00:06:27,269 Speaker 3: because I wanted it to work out, I feel proud 95 00:06:27,309 --> 00:06:31,069 Speaker 3: of myself that I was actually able to break up 96 00:06:31,149 --> 00:06:34,769 Speaker 3: with someone, someone who I really liked a lot and 97 00:06:35,369 --> 00:06:39,149 Speaker 3: So instead of just staying in a relationship to be 98 00:06:39,209 --> 00:06:42,539 Speaker 3: in a relationship or to get only half of what 99 00:06:42,599 --> 00:06:46,719 Speaker 3: I want, I decided I was worth more and that 100 00:06:46,819 --> 00:06:50,919 Speaker 3: I wasn't just going to stick around for crumbs. That 101 00:06:51,219 --> 00:06:53,869 Speaker 3: for me is huge. I think one of the things 102 00:06:53,959 --> 00:06:57,709 Speaker 3: is that Lori pointed out like how I was really 103 00:06:57,809 --> 00:07:01,329 Speaker 3: influenced by living with my mother and grandmother who were 104 00:07:01,369 --> 00:07:05,729 Speaker 3: both widowed and never remarried and never dated. after their 105 00:07:05,769 --> 00:07:10,469 Speaker 3: husbands died. So I thought about that a lot. And 106 00:07:10,489 --> 00:07:14,129 Speaker 3: I see where I was living my life based on 107 00:07:14,189 --> 00:07:18,939 Speaker 3: somebody else's expectations or just learned behavior from them. One 108 00:07:18,969 --> 00:07:21,439 Speaker 3: of the big things that I've learned recently is that 109 00:07:21,559 --> 00:07:24,219 Speaker 3: I make a lot of decisions based on what other 110 00:07:24,259 --> 00:07:27,279 Speaker 3: people think I should do. For example, my sister is 111 00:07:27,319 --> 00:07:29,619 Speaker 3: very big into telling me what to do. And I 112 00:07:29,679 --> 00:07:32,749 Speaker 3: realized that It's not good for me to listen to her. 113 00:07:32,889 --> 00:07:36,229 Speaker 3: My life is not hers. I'm not a married woman 114 00:07:36,289 --> 00:07:40,119 Speaker 3: with children. So I can't expect to live the life 115 00:07:40,529 --> 00:07:43,079 Speaker 3: of a married woman with children. I have to live 116 00:07:43,599 --> 00:07:47,699 Speaker 3: the life that I have based on my circumstances and 117 00:07:47,759 --> 00:07:52,039 Speaker 3: my wants and desires. I think that being more self-compassionate 118 00:07:52,199 --> 00:07:55,759 Speaker 3: made me value myself more too. Not just relationships, but 119 00:07:55,839 --> 00:07:58,939 Speaker 3: on the job. I was actually working for someone who's 120 00:07:58,999 --> 00:08:02,449 Speaker 3: a part-time job. And she hadn't paid me for six weeks. 121 00:08:03,349 --> 00:08:05,329 Speaker 3: And she acted like I had a lot of nerve 122 00:08:05,419 --> 00:08:09,999 Speaker 3: asking for money. And so I basically decided one night, 123 00:08:10,519 --> 00:08:12,539 Speaker 3: I'm just going to tell her that was my last 124 00:08:13,139 --> 00:08:15,659 Speaker 3: weekend that I'm working. When I told her that, she 125 00:08:15,719 --> 00:08:19,279 Speaker 3: was kind of floored. She was like, what? You're not 126 00:08:19,339 --> 00:08:21,529 Speaker 3: afraid you're going to get the money? And I'm like, no, 127 00:08:21,769 --> 00:08:24,129 Speaker 3: I just don't like the way I've been treated. So 128 00:08:24,169 --> 00:08:27,309 Speaker 3: I found myself standing up for myself, which is a 129 00:08:27,369 --> 00:08:31,179 Speaker 3: new thing for me. So I think that in talking 130 00:08:31,219 --> 00:08:33,879 Speaker 3: with you guys, it kind of acted as a catalyst 131 00:08:33,959 --> 00:08:40,049 Speaker 3: to start taking a better, more detailed look at my life. 132 00:08:40,379 --> 00:08:43,969 Speaker 3: So I really appreciate you, Lori and Guy, for the 133 00:08:44,049 --> 00:08:46,129 Speaker 3: insight that you gave me, the things that you pointed 134 00:08:46,389 --> 00:08:49,429 Speaker 3: out and the advice. I'm very grateful. 135 00:08:50,509 --> 00:08:50,929 Speaker 4: Thank you. 136 00:08:55,459 --> 00:08:58,309 Speaker 2: That was really great to hear. Lauren has done a 137 00:08:58,729 --> 00:09:01,129 Speaker 2: lot over this year. A few things really stood out 138 00:09:01,169 --> 00:09:04,509 Speaker 2: for me, and one is the self-compassion that she's practicing. 139 00:09:04,589 --> 00:09:07,009 Speaker 2: You could hear the joy in her voice where she 140 00:09:07,049 --> 00:09:10,709 Speaker 2: said it was like, this feels good to be self-compassionate. 141 00:09:10,749 --> 00:09:13,429 Speaker 2: It feels good to be kind to yourself. And it's 142 00:09:13,529 --> 00:09:16,429 Speaker 2: also allowing her to be more vulnerable and to deepen 143 00:09:16,509 --> 00:09:19,479 Speaker 2: her friendships. So I think that was a really pivotal 144 00:09:19,579 --> 00:09:22,749 Speaker 2: thing for her to really try and move away from 145 00:09:22,789 --> 00:09:28,589 Speaker 2: the judgmental self-criticism and become more self-compassionate. And it's part 146 00:09:28,609 --> 00:09:31,599 Speaker 2: of a larger thing that she's doing, which she's looking 147 00:09:31,659 --> 00:09:35,479 Speaker 2: inside more. She's figuring out what she wants. She's lowering 148 00:09:35,499 --> 00:09:37,999 Speaker 2: the volume on what everyone around her thinks so she 149 00:09:38,039 --> 00:09:41,379 Speaker 2: can hear her own internal voice more clearly and make 150 00:09:41,399 --> 00:09:44,159 Speaker 2: the decisions that are right for her, like moving to 151 00:09:44,199 --> 00:09:44,599 Speaker 2: the city. 152 00:09:45,019 --> 00:09:46,659 Speaker 1: Yeah, I love that she said she's not living her 153 00:09:46,699 --> 00:09:50,429 Speaker 1: life based on others' expectations anymore. And I think what's 154 00:09:50,449 --> 00:09:53,189 Speaker 1: really interesting is that we talked in the session about 155 00:09:53,289 --> 00:09:56,469 Speaker 1: how she missed all those years of developing into her 156 00:09:56,559 --> 00:10:00,499 Speaker 1: full adult self because she was living really at the 157 00:10:00,559 --> 00:10:03,439 Speaker 1: service of her mother for all those years. And then 158 00:10:03,519 --> 00:10:06,199 Speaker 1: after her mother died, she still didn't really have what 159 00:10:06,219 --> 00:10:10,049 Speaker 1: we were talking about, the self-compassion, the perspective of, hey, 160 00:10:10,199 --> 00:10:12,969 Speaker 1: I missed all this time and it's okay that I'm 161 00:10:12,989 --> 00:10:15,309 Speaker 1: making up for lost time. And I think over this 162 00:10:15,389 --> 00:10:18,969 Speaker 1: last year, she really took that to heart. She's had... 163 00:10:19,219 --> 00:10:22,719 Speaker 1: a real shift in perspective. And that shows with the 164 00:10:22,759 --> 00:10:26,199 Speaker 1: guy that she was dating. She was very open with 165 00:10:26,259 --> 00:10:30,289 Speaker 1: him and clear with herself about what was working for her, 166 00:10:30,389 --> 00:10:32,629 Speaker 1: what was not working for her. And it sounds like 167 00:10:32,649 --> 00:10:35,469 Speaker 1: she communicated that in a very kind way. So she 168 00:10:35,489 --> 00:10:39,469 Speaker 1: didn't overcompensate. She was very clear and reasonable about And 169 00:10:39,489 --> 00:10:42,619 Speaker 1: she said he even appreciated that. And ultimately he wasn't 170 00:10:42,759 --> 00:10:45,539 Speaker 1: able to give her what she wanted. She said she 171 00:10:45,579 --> 00:10:49,399 Speaker 1: didn't want 50% of her relationship. She wanted a full relationship. 172 00:10:49,419 --> 00:10:52,279 Speaker 1: She didn't want crumbs. And that shows that now she 173 00:10:52,339 --> 00:10:56,039 Speaker 1: appreciates her value. She knows her worth. And I think 174 00:10:56,059 --> 00:10:59,029 Speaker 1: that also showed up where she was standing up for herself, 175 00:10:59,369 --> 00:11:01,789 Speaker 1: not only in that relationship, but in her job where 176 00:11:01,829 --> 00:11:04,609 Speaker 1: she wasn't being paid on time. So she trusts that 177 00:11:04,629 --> 00:11:07,489 Speaker 1: she's asking for something reasonable. And that is a big 178 00:11:07,569 --> 00:11:08,149 Speaker 1: shift for her. 179 00:11:09,759 --> 00:11:12,579 Speaker 2: It's truly a big shift. And we always point out 180 00:11:12,799 --> 00:11:17,339 Speaker 2: that when people make changes that then generalize to other 181 00:11:17,459 --> 00:11:20,609 Speaker 2: areas of their lives, it means they made that change 182 00:11:20,629 --> 00:11:24,449 Speaker 2: from a very deep place. And so that self-compassion that 183 00:11:24,489 --> 00:11:27,889 Speaker 2: she's been practicing, getting in touch with her own needs 184 00:11:27,949 --> 00:11:30,869 Speaker 2: and feelings, and even being willing to break up with 185 00:11:30,909 --> 00:11:33,809 Speaker 2: someone in which the relationship is going well, but just 186 00:11:33,969 --> 00:11:37,129 Speaker 2: not well enough. All those are really assertive acts. And 187 00:11:37,149 --> 00:11:40,009 Speaker 2: then that sets her up to be assertive in other 188 00:11:40,249 --> 00:11:42,169 Speaker 2: domains as well, like her job. 189 00:11:42,389 --> 00:11:43,969 Speaker 1: And the one thing we didn't hear from Lauren that 190 00:11:43,989 --> 00:11:46,349 Speaker 1: I'm curious about is what's going on with her romantic 191 00:11:46,389 --> 00:11:49,589 Speaker 1: life now that she's out of this other relationship. So 192 00:11:49,749 --> 00:11:54,799 Speaker 1: is she actively dating? Is she asking her friends now 193 00:11:54,839 --> 00:11:57,399 Speaker 1: that she's more vulnerable with them? Do you have anybody 194 00:11:57,439 --> 00:11:59,909 Speaker 1: you can set me up with? Because That makes it 195 00:11:59,929 --> 00:12:03,349 Speaker 1: a positive experience. People love to set other people up. 196 00:12:03,389 --> 00:12:05,929 Speaker 1: People love to help people fall in love. And she 197 00:12:05,969 --> 00:12:08,399 Speaker 1: used to be so ashamed of her romantic life that 198 00:12:08,439 --> 00:12:10,759 Speaker 1: I hope she's opening up to people and saying, you know, 199 00:12:10,839 --> 00:12:12,899 Speaker 1: I really am looking for a partner. Do you know 200 00:12:12,959 --> 00:12:13,859 Speaker 1: anybody for me? 201 00:12:14,259 --> 00:12:16,359 Speaker 2: I also hope she's being active in her dating life. 202 00:12:16,959 --> 00:12:19,159 Speaker 2: I think what strikes me most here is that the 203 00:12:19,279 --> 00:12:22,339 Speaker 2: key thing she did was that she was finally able 204 00:12:22,429 --> 00:12:25,669 Speaker 2: to change her story. And the change was that instead 205 00:12:25,709 --> 00:12:28,949 Speaker 2: of being this person who it's shameful that she never 206 00:12:29,069 --> 00:12:32,789 Speaker 2: had sex. She now sees herself as someone who had 207 00:12:32,889 --> 00:12:36,049 Speaker 2: sacrificed so much to take care of her mother. And 208 00:12:36,149 --> 00:12:38,909 Speaker 2: what that did is it delayed her by 10 years. 209 00:12:38,969 --> 00:12:42,139 Speaker 2: And so very soon after that, she actually did find 210 00:12:42,179 --> 00:12:45,119 Speaker 2: her first boyfriend. She did have sex. Once she changed 211 00:12:45,159 --> 00:12:47,839 Speaker 2: that story, it freed her up so much that she's 212 00:12:47,899 --> 00:12:52,059 Speaker 2: made incredible changes over this one year. It's really great 213 00:12:52,219 --> 00:12:54,819 Speaker 2: to hear that she's finally living the life she deserves. 214 00:12:58,599 --> 00:13:01,869 Speaker 1: Next week, we'll check in with Hillary, an addictions counselor 215 00:13:01,909 --> 00:13:04,399 Speaker 1: who developed a new addiction of her own, to hear 216 00:13:04,459 --> 00:13:05,999 Speaker 1: how she's doing one year later. 217 00:13:06,719 --> 00:13:10,639 Speaker 5: For the first time in my life, I experienced physical 218 00:13:10,839 --> 00:13:16,289 Speaker 5: symptoms of anxiety. And to alleviate those physical symptoms, it 219 00:13:16,409 --> 00:13:20,049 Speaker 5: felt really good to fill up my cart and buy something. 220 00:13:20,989 --> 00:13:25,509 Speaker 5: And I didn't realize that that's what was happening until 221 00:13:25,569 --> 00:13:27,369 Speaker 5: I was $ 6, 000 in debt. 222 00:13:27,489 --> 00:13:30,559 Speaker 1: If you're enjoying our podcast, don't forget to subscribe for 223 00:13:30,619 --> 00:13:33,479 Speaker 1: free so that you don't miss any episodes. And please 224 00:13:33,519 --> 00:13:36,179 Speaker 1: help support Dear Therapist by telling your friends about it 225 00:13:36,459 --> 00:13:39,699 Speaker 1: and leaving a review on Apple Podcasts. Your reviews really 226 00:13:39,759 --> 00:13:40,919 Speaker 1: help people to find the show. 227 00:13:41,839 --> 00:13:43,909 Speaker 2: If you have a dilemma you'd like to discuss with us, 228 00:13:44,409 --> 00:13:51,189 Speaker 2: email us at laurieandguy at iheartmedia.com. Our executive producer is 229 00:13:51,249 --> 00:13:55,769 Speaker 2: Noel Brown. We're produced and edited by Josh Fisher. Additional 230 00:13:55,849 --> 00:14:00,369 Speaker 2: editing support by Helena Rosen, John Washington, and Zachary Fisher. 231 00:14:00,909 --> 00:14:05,509 Speaker 2: Our interns are Ben Bernstein, Emily Gutierrez, and Silver Lifton. 232 00:14:06,109 --> 00:14:09,679 Speaker 2: And special thanks to our podcast fairy godmother, Katie Couric. 233 00:14:10,139 --> 00:14:12,239 Speaker 2: We can't wait to see you at our next session. 234 00:14:12,979 --> 00:14:15,609 Speaker 2: Dear Therapists is a production of iHeartRadio.