Speaker 1: Before we jump into today's episode. We've been teasing it
Speaker 1: a little bit, but the time has finally come. We
Speaker 1: have a planetarium film that is coming out on November sixth. Okay,
Speaker 1: it's called Remix The Unexpected Side of Science, and we
Speaker 1: would love if some of our very very cool friends
Speaker 1: that are listening to our show right now would be
Speaker 1: a part of it. If you head to the link
Speaker 1: in our bio on Instagram, we have a really cool
Speaker 1: way for you to incorporate yourself into our planetarium film.
Speaker 1: I'm TT and I'm Zukiah and this is Dope Labs.
Speaker 1: Welcome to Dope Labs, a weekly podcast that mixes hardcore
Speaker 1: science with pop culture and a healthy dose of friendship.
Speaker 1: Have you seen that trend on social media that's like
Speaker 1: propaganda I'm falling for. It's basically people listing the things
Speaker 1: that they love that may be a scam or not
Speaker 1: very popular, but they don't care.
Speaker 2: You know.
Speaker 1: I have seen it, and I'm like, what's on my list?
Speaker 1: What's on your list? I got a few things. A
Speaker 1: probably that soda is not that bad for you. I
Speaker 1: don't even know if there's anything out there that says that,
Speaker 1: but that's what I.
Speaker 2: Tell so.
Speaker 1: I think I've had some shifts. I know, I've looked
Speaker 1: at the evidence and I'm like, coffee is good for me.
Speaker 1: Do you remember that that it was a wife swap
Speaker 1: episode or where they switched the wives out and the
Speaker 1: families and that little boy was like, bacon.
Speaker 2: Is good for me. I feel like that a lot
Speaker 2: of sad.
Speaker 1: About all the things I love, and I'm like, of course,
Speaker 1: even if there's evidence that tells me it's not, I
Speaker 1: feel the same way. I mean, I also believe that
Speaker 1: barrel jeans are cute. Now. I know that that is
Speaker 1: a polarizing topic right now because of the shape of them.
Speaker 1: Some people are like absolutely not me all the time.
Speaker 2: Yeah, I love a barrel jeane.
Speaker 1: You know, I think the mind is such a curious
Speaker 1: place because, like you were like, oh, they're calling it propaganda,
Speaker 1: but is it propaganda if you know it's not necessarily
Speaker 1: true and it just fits your belief Like, what's propaganda?
Speaker 2: Straight up and down? What is it?
Speaker 1: Right? Propaganda is a communication tactic that is used to
Speaker 1: influence people to further some type of agenda, and we
Speaker 1: know it works one hundred like almost one hundred percent
Speaker 1: of the time. We've seen it work throughout history. Actually,
Speaker 1: even when we think about how maps are drawn. We
Speaker 1: talked about that in our map episode. Yes, or I
Speaker 1: should say cartography. I lend a new word, Russia being
Speaker 1: drawn the way that it is, how it's really really large,
Speaker 1: Like when you look at a map, it's really big,
Speaker 1: it's actually not that big. And that was propaganda that
Speaker 1: was put in place a long time ago in order
Speaker 1: to make Russia seem like really big, so that they
Speaker 1: seemed like a really big threat. Imagine you see this
Speaker 1: whole big country, it's taken up so much of the map,
Speaker 1: and you're feeling like, oh, these are aggressive or people
Speaker 1: that are trying to change your way of life. It
Speaker 1: instills a little bit of fear in your heart. Yeah,
Speaker 1: that makes sense. And that's not the only place where
Speaker 1: we see propaganda at play. This week, we're putting ourselves
Speaker 1: under the microscope. We've talked about it before in little
Speaker 1: bits and pieces, but right, I think we just got
Speaker 1: to say it once and for all. Understanding objectivity or
Speaker 1: the perception of it, does not make you immune to bias.
Speaker 2: Right, You not too smart to fall for the okie doke.
Speaker 1: Okay, never you can have all the number studies, results
Speaker 1: and everything else in the world. And you know, all
Speaker 1: those tables don't move like a good story does.
Speaker 2: You know, look at the Jesse Smole a story.
Speaker 1: Man, what happened there is cause it was like everybody
Speaker 1: was behind him and then they were like then they
Speaker 1: were like nah, and then everybody's behind him again.
Speaker 2: Some people were like, I stand with Jesse.
Speaker 1: And there's a documentary that came out that I have
Speaker 1: not watched yet, but I need to because everybody's saying
Speaker 1: it's really good.
Speaker 2: M So we have to find that out.
Speaker 1: And you know, I think like when you see something
Speaker 1: like that, that's a prime example.
Speaker 2: I stand with Jesse.
Speaker 1: What would make you put on a shirt to stand
Speaker 1: with somebody that you don't even really know? Right?
Speaker 2: Right?
Speaker 1: But our brain prefers these like anecdotal sensational stories. And
Speaker 1: really it's just evolutionary psychology, old brain, old world brain.
Speaker 1: It's hijacking current modern day brain. You know, we got
Speaker 1: to reset. We need a new operating sys. Listen on our.
Speaker 2: Brain, no upgrades. It is terrible.
Speaker 1: And I think it's interesting because we have a brain
Speaker 1: that takes vivid stories, so whether it's rewarding or painful,
Speaker 1: and it don't even have to be rewarding and painful physically.
Speaker 1: It could be socially rewarding or painful. Your brain says
Speaker 1: this weighs the most, like this is the most important thing.
Speaker 1: This reminds me of Lab thirty eight.
Speaker 2: So anxious.
Speaker 1: When we had Wendy Suzuki on the show, she talked
Speaker 1: about anxiety and how before the anxiety system acted as
Speaker 1: a way for us to deter threats out in the wild.
Speaker 2: So back in the caveman that.
Speaker 1: Yeah, different things like hearing some stuff, wrestling.
Speaker 2: I think you were with me.
Speaker 1: That was just yesterday, just yesterday, those leaves were blowing
Speaker 1: and I was like, what is that.
Speaker 2: When we were together? Gonna scare my friend?
Speaker 1: Those evolutionary leaps have not occurred yet from my no,
Speaker 1: not for any of us.
Speaker 2: It'll running from rustling.
Speaker 1: But think about when you see like a silhouette or
Speaker 1: you think you see something and you kind of jump.
Speaker 2: All of those things, even.
Speaker 1: What feels like social discord, Like even if it feels like, okay,
Speaker 1: maybe this person is not having a good time, or
Speaker 1: oh they about to start fighting, you know, all those
Speaker 1: things triggered physiological changes in our bodies. And back in
Speaker 1: the day, Like we're saying that bought you time. Okay,
Speaker 1: faster heart rate, I know, to be more attentive. My
Speaker 1: muscles are gonna be ready. You know, all that anxiety
Speaker 1: system triggered all of that, so you could be like,
Speaker 1: all right, I'm ready to escape if I need to,
Speaker 1: or ready to fight, so fight or flight? Yeah, and
Speaker 1: so present day this translates to It might be something
Speaker 1: like you get a text message from somebody who's like, oh,
Speaker 1: we need to talk or I need that, which is
Speaker 1: what the kids are saying these days, where it's like
Speaker 1: be gonna fight, you need that. That's what they say.
Speaker 1: Somebody text me, you need that. I'm not responding, no
Speaker 1: fight or flight. You're not responding to the text, but
Speaker 1: your body is responding.
Speaker 2: Mine is freeze, fight or freeze. I'm freezing.
Speaker 1: And I think that's so interesting, Like our brains haven't
Speaker 1: made the leap, but our environments have so before you
Speaker 1: know that kind of thing, it was slow information, nothing
Speaker 1: to be alarmed about until there was real threat, and
Speaker 1: that worked great for our brains working like that was great.
Speaker 1: But now it's constant feedback, constant alerts. Is what's that
Speaker 1: sound outside? Is that the trash been or is that
Speaker 1: an intruder? Like so many things, there's a lot going on,
Speaker 1: and I think one of the things that I know
Speaker 1: for a fact that I fall victim too is like
Speaker 1: availability heuristics. Have you heard of this? Like what is
Speaker 1: most recently available in your mind? Like events that are
Speaker 1: easy to recall and that feel emotionally intense, they seem
Speaker 1: way more likely than they really are. I have this problem. Okay,
Speaker 1: I'm susceptible to this. This is when we started talking about, Hey,
Speaker 1: you're not immune to bias.
Speaker 2: I'm not immune to this.
Speaker 1: If I watch something and they're like, oh and the person,
Speaker 1: Now you know. I love a lot of true crime
Speaker 1: and false crime too, just fiction. If there is an
Speaker 1: episode of something I watch and there like, oh, and
Speaker 1: the body was chopped up and was on a trash
Speaker 1: bag in the side of the road. Every time I see
Speaker 1: your trash bag, I'm gonna be like, is it body shaped?
Speaker 2: What's it looking like?
Speaker 1: You know, it's just like whatever I last saw, And
Speaker 1: I'm like, oh, yeah. It's like when people used to
Speaker 1: send those emails that would be like don't step outside
Speaker 1: the gas station. They under your car, they swiping your
Speaker 1: tearing your achilles steel and all this, and I was like,
Speaker 1: you gotta jump to get in your car. Yeah, it's
Speaker 1: wild and those things still exist. It's not even back
Speaker 1: in the day. Like you go on TikTok, you can
Speaker 1: find people who say, oh, if you see a piece
Speaker 1: of tape on your wheel, it's because they're trying to
Speaker 1: traffic you. And hey, that works on me. I'm gonna
Speaker 1: start looking at my tires before I get in the
Speaker 1: car because all those things make me nervous. Yes, I'm
Speaker 1: falling for it, especially when it comes to my safety. Yeah, yes,
Speaker 1: I'm falling for it. But I think that's because what
Speaker 1: we see is there is some truth there right now,
Speaker 1: what the odds are that something like that is happening.
Speaker 1: Let's say tape on your car, tape on your car,
Speaker 1: that somebody might have had tape on their car and
Speaker 1: they got abducted and they were killed. That's a sad story.
Speaker 1: Maybe it's too graphic, but also somebody had tape on
Speaker 1: their car and it was just to hold that back
Speaker 1: windshield down because they went through the car wash, right,
Speaker 1: And what your brain says is, here's this tragic case.
Speaker 1: I remember that and that dominates, like what you think
Speaker 1: about and so your risk perception is like, oh nah,
Speaker 1: this is risky tape on here, call the whole lice,
Speaker 1: call somebody you know. And even when the information when
Speaker 1: it says, hey, crime is really low in your area,
Speaker 1: it doesn't matter. Your brain is just subject to this, right,
Speaker 1: And that makes me think of our monkey pox episode
Speaker 1: where that was Lap seventy six for anybody that's trying
Speaker 1: to go back and listen, where we talk about how
Speaker 1: sensational headlines how it impacts epidemiology, like showing how intense
Speaker 1: or memorable coverage can inflate perceive risk to base rates.
Speaker 1: And I remember there was a video that was going
Speaker 1: across TikTok and instagram reels of somebody on a New
Speaker 1: York train who had like bumps on their skin and
Speaker 1: people were like, look, this person's got monkey pocks.
Speaker 2: That person did not have monkey pocks.
Speaker 1: But I did not see a follow up video also
Speaker 1: going viral correcting the story, because the sensational thing is
Speaker 1: always gonna catch people's attention, but the correction was never
Speaker 1: as sensational. That reminds me, Okay, you said Lap seventy six,
Speaker 1: Lab eighty two in your feed where we talked about
Speaker 1: social media, and in that lab we unpatch how like
Speaker 1: attention hacking or like virality, things that go viral, and
Speaker 1: like kind of how your algorithm may be curated. So
Speaker 1: you're gonna see the things that other people are like,
Speaker 1: Oh my goodness, let me share.
Speaker 2: You can see.
Speaker 1: Sometimes I see stuff and I'm like, this is wild.
Speaker 1: I see how many little envelope paper envelope paper presser. Yeah,
Speaker 1: I'm like, people are sharing this. And so then you
Speaker 1: layer that things being shared and pushed in the front
Speaker 1: of your algorithm or the top of your feed, layer
Speaker 1: that on top of that, recall, right, And so it
Speaker 1: makes those top of mind stories that have the sensational
Speaker 1: thing about them they feel even more common or true
Speaker 1: because also when you tell it, somebody's like, yes, I
Speaker 1: saw that too, right, And it just confirms it in
Speaker 1: your mind even though I know these things. I think
Speaker 1: back to Lap thirty seven in Denial where we had
Speaker 1: doctor Gil Sinatras and Barber Hope Ford.
Speaker 2: That was such a good episode. I love that one.
Speaker 1: And they talked about why like these kind of vivid
Speaker 1: narratives and beat tables and charts. I don't want to
Speaker 1: look at tables and charts. I want a real with animation. Okay, right,
Speaker 1: And I think that's how anecdotes that you hear steer
Speaker 1: your judgment more so than like comprehensive evidence. These last
Speaker 1: few episodes over the past few weeks have just been
Speaker 1: showing me more and more how I am a victim
Speaker 1: to this brain and body. So already my brain is ancient.
Speaker 1: You said it had made evolutionary leaps. Now I didn't
Speaker 1: hear you say that yours hadn't made evolutionary leaps. So
Speaker 1: I don't know how to feel about it.
Speaker 2: You know what, To be fair, mine hasn't either.
Speaker 1: Mine has not either, because let me tell you, I
Speaker 1: will jump six feet into the air if I hear
Speaker 1: something while I'm sleeping, and it'll just be my dog's
Speaker 1: toenails on the ground.
Speaker 2: The other way.
Speaker 1: Okay, I'm jumping to conclusions, all right, swan diving into them,
Speaker 1: like if you said this, then it must mean you
Speaker 1: think this. And so all of this really makes me
Speaker 1: think about what's been going on recently with this whole
Speaker 1: Acetamenafin Talanov situation, you know, and how that this can
Speaker 1: lead to a lot of misinformation going viral and really hurting.
Speaker 2: A lot of people.
Speaker 1: Yeah, so if you haven't seen this in the news,
Speaker 1: which I'm pretty sure you have.
Speaker 2: So RFK.
Speaker 1: Junior is the Secretary of Health and Human Services, and
Speaker 1: he recently put out an alert that basically said that
Speaker 1: pregnant people should not be taking talanaw when they're pregnant
Speaker 1: to reduce their fever because it leads to autism in
Speaker 1: the child, which there's no proof of that. And so
Speaker 1: there's there's two things. There's two things that I'm just
Speaker 1: like jumped out of me at first, which I'm like,
Speaker 1: Talinow's a brand, right, explain that for people that don't
Speaker 1: understand that don't know. Talanaw is a branch of a
Speaker 1: company that creates medicine Aceta menafin. Talanaw is the brand.
Speaker 1: It's like Kleenex, you know what I mean. Kleenex is
Speaker 1: the brand, but the product is tissue. The product is tissue,
Speaker 1: like for blowing your nose, and it's just or what's
Speaker 1: another and if that's good? Because if blowing your nose
Speaker 1: was bad, you wouldn't say don't just use clean, you
Speaker 1: would say don't use tissue to blow.
Speaker 2: Your nose, exactly exactly.
Speaker 1: And so using talanol as the word that we are
Speaker 1: using is it just lacks all scientific integrity on its
Speaker 1: face because of that. But if we're talking about a
Speaker 1: sea of menafin that pregnant people use if they get
Speaker 1: sick when they're pregnant to reduce their fever, because when
Speaker 1: you are pregnant, you are carrying a baby in your belly.
Speaker 1: If you get a fever and it goes too high,
Speaker 1: it can potentially like really damage your fetus. And so
Speaker 1: what pregnant people do is take talan all to make
Speaker 1: sure that they keep their body temperature low so that
Speaker 1: they don't have any adverse effects on the baby that
Speaker 1: they're carrying. And so telling folks not to do that
Speaker 1: is one going to incite a lot of fear in
Speaker 1: the people who already have been doing that or the
Speaker 1: people who feel like they have to do that and
Speaker 1: are not sure what they could do to make their
Speaker 1: temperature go down. But then you're also hearing things from
Speaker 1: the current president of the United States saying you gotta
Speaker 1: like tough it out. That's not how that works. It's
Speaker 1: not an issue of toughness at all. And so, and
Speaker 1: when we're talking about biases and falling for the okie dog,
Speaker 1: this is coming from the highest office in the land.
Speaker 2: And it's scary. Yeah, it is.
Speaker 1: I think it's so interesting, like where people draw the line.
Speaker 1: You know, there are some things and people are like, oh,
Speaker 1: I see where they're going, or that's not for me.
Speaker 1: This what do you think we're seeing there with Talanow?
Speaker 1: Do you think it's just oh, people already had something
Speaker 1: against Talanow before. You think it's fear? Do you think
Speaker 1: it's like I think it's fear, and it's tapping into
Speaker 1: the fear of fear that a lot of people have
Speaker 1: about the health and wellness of their kids. Yeah, because
Speaker 1: autism is something that people are like, there was an
Speaker 1: autism back in my day.
Speaker 2: Yes, there was. They just didn't have a way of
Speaker 2: diagnosing it and.
Speaker 1: Or a name to call it, or.
Speaker 2: A name to call it.
Speaker 1: You know, you know, you might have said, oh, so
Speaker 1: and so is a little bit special, a little bit different.
Speaker 1: We didn't have the vocabulary, the words, the classifications that
Speaker 1: we have now. And they're looking for a silver bullet
Speaker 1: is not the right term, but a scapegoat is the
Speaker 1: right term. They're looking for a scapegoat so that they
Speaker 1: could say this is the reason why, Okay, we'll just
Speaker 1: stay away from that, so people can feel a sense
Speaker 1: of like comfort from that. Yes, and that's not wise.
Speaker 1: It's just not wise at all because it doesn't get
Speaker 1: to the fact. And the more we wave our hands
Speaker 1: and say, okay, it's probably a seed of menafin, it's
Speaker 1: a set of menafit. And he's also pulling funds away
Speaker 1: from research. You see where I'm going like, this is
Speaker 1: dangerous territory because like you're putting out things that have
Speaker 1: not been proved scientifically, but then not funding the science
Speaker 1: that can get us too actual fact. I think this
Speaker 1: is really interesting because there feels like multiple things at play.
Speaker 1: You know, you mentioned statements about things that haven't been proved,
Speaker 1: and I think even if there are things that have
Speaker 1: weak associations, you know, we've talked about causation and correlation
Speaker 1: being different, and I think another thing that we know
Speaker 1: about these brains is like they like to hold one story.
Speaker 1: They don't like to hold multiple things. So even as
Speaker 1: if we think back to what we saw at the
Speaker 1: top of twenty twenty when we were trying to make
Speaker 1: sense of a global pandemic, our brains don't like to
Speaker 1: hold multiple things. And so when you give someone a
Speaker 1: single storyline. That's a lot neaterer. That's a lot easier
Speaker 1: to think. And also when you layer social components on
Speaker 1: top of it, like, well, if this comes from someone
Speaker 1: who is part of this political party, if I am
Speaker 1: part of this political party, then I believe this thing. Right,
Speaker 1: you can really think about think and not even just
Speaker 1: group think. Is like when you go along with the crowd.
Speaker 1: This is like group identity, Like my identity is tied
Speaker 1: to this. I am a person who because I believe
Speaker 1: these other things, then I must believe this. And I
Speaker 1: think we are seeing more and more over time these
Speaker 1: odd things that are tied to group identity, Like I
Speaker 1: feel like group identity used to be like we celebrate
Speaker 1: Christmas or we don't, you know what I mean, And
Speaker 1: now it's tied to I wear an American flag pin
Speaker 1: or I don't and or I put a stick room
Speaker 1: this kind of stick room on my car or I
Speaker 1: don't like.
Speaker 2: It's all these little tiny things that.
Speaker 1: Feel so yeah, abstract and UNRELI how is that related
Speaker 1: to identity?
Speaker 2: You know?
Speaker 1: And then I think when something else that you said
Speaker 1: about in the case of a sentiment offin that felt
Speaker 1: really interesting to me, reminded me of what we talked
Speaker 1: about with Lindsay A Joe who did our episode on pain,
Speaker 1: and she talked about the expectation of relief. So if
Speaker 1: I tell you, hey, that's what it is, so you
Speaker 1: won't have to worry about this anymore, whether that's true
Speaker 1: or not, if you expect that, Hey, when I don't
Speaker 1: take a see of minifit, I don't have to worry
Speaker 1: about this thing that gives you immediate relief in your brain,
Speaker 1: your brain can start to think about like, Okay, well
Speaker 1: I can stop worrying about that. I can worry about
Speaker 1: something else. And I think for some.
Speaker 2: People that may feel good. I know, I like to
Speaker 2: take task off my plate, just clear it.
Speaker 1: I don't want to see it control all the league.
Speaker 1: What you're saying completely lines up when we start talking
Speaker 1: about crime, when we see people that are saying like
Speaker 1: whether or not we need you know, these different groups
Speaker 1: showing up in these various.
Speaker 2: Cities that we've been seeing recently.
Speaker 1: When we talk about health, when we talk about it,
Speaker 1: see the minifit, access to vaccines, this and that, like
Speaker 1: all of those things, we see these same kind of
Speaker 1: thought processes and cognitive biases playing out. And another place
Speaker 1: where we see that that we don't talk about often
Speaker 1: on this show, but something happened recently and we got
Speaker 1: to talk about.
Speaker 2: It is religion. That is very true, very true.
Speaker 1: We know that religion could be very sensitive for a
Speaker 1: lot of people, which makes it. But recently there's been
Speaker 1: some virality around people thinking that the rapture was upon them. So,
Speaker 1: for those of you who don't know in Christianity, I'm
Speaker 1: not sure which or which branches of Christianity, but I'll
Speaker 1: say Christianity as the big umbrella that the rapture is.
Speaker 1: When Jesus decides to come back, he takes the souls
Speaker 1: of all of his believers to heaven and leaves behind
Speaker 1: the non believers. And so people were saying that there
Speaker 1: are signs that this is going to happen. Even though
Speaker 1: in the Bible it says that nobody will know the
Speaker 1: time or day that the raptor has happened, these folks
Speaker 1: said that they did know the time and the day,
Speaker 1: and people were selling their cars, they were getting rid
Speaker 1: of their apartments, they were getting rid of all of
Speaker 1: their worldly possessions waiting for the rapture that did not come.
Speaker 1: I think that is another prime example of group identity.
Speaker 1: You know, it's hard for me to reconcile. It's easy
Speaker 1: actually now that we're talking about to step away and
Speaker 1: reconcile it. But when it was happening, I was like,
Speaker 1: it was easy for me to judge, right, and that
Speaker 1: is that exact same thing I was talking about. I
Speaker 1: was like, where I'm not immune to this kind of bias.
Speaker 1: I'm like, I'm a person that reads the literature and
Speaker 1: figures this stuff out. And so even if you read
Speaker 1: your text, it says you won't know the day or time,
Speaker 1: the day or the hour. So if somebody knows the
Speaker 1: day or the hour, then they're not the person that
Speaker 1: aligns with this text.
Speaker 2: Obvious. It says it in the user manual.
Speaker 1: And I'm like, girl, get off your high horse, right right.
Speaker 1: Think about how people may be feeling. Think about how
Speaker 1: overwhelmed people are because of the state of the world, yes, yes,
Speaker 1: because of the state of the world, and how excited
Speaker 1: you might be about the relief of being in a
Speaker 1: better place. Happen to worry about all of these things,
Speaker 1: And I just think one of the things I've been
Speaker 1: asking myself is how to meet these moments when I
Speaker 1: see these things and I'm like, well, that obviously doesn't
Speaker 1: make sense, and I'm you know, turning into Caddie Zakiyah.
Speaker 1: How do I meet those moments with some more compassion
Speaker 1: because I know there are plenty of people looking at
Speaker 1: the things that I believe and say and do and
Speaker 1: are saying, girl, it's not lining up, it's not adding up.
Speaker 1: And so this show working with you us talking to
Speaker 1: experts and being exposed to this information, I'm like, try,
Speaker 1: I try to infuse it in my mock patterns when
Speaker 1: I am reading information interacting with people all of that.
Speaker 1: It's so true, and I think that's a great place
Speaker 1: for us to land, you know, where it's like understanding
Speaker 1: each other in the grander sense, like everywhere all around
Speaker 1: the world, that we all are in search of belonging,
Speaker 1: and we're all in search of happiness, and that in
Speaker 1: pursuit of that, we might, you know, try and get
Speaker 1: some shortcuts to happiness and belonging and fall for some
Speaker 1: biases that might not necessarily be true, but you know,
Speaker 1: sometimes it's just propaganda that you're just gonna fall for.
Speaker 1: And it's okay, mm hm, you gotta you gotta fall
Speaker 1: for something.
Speaker 2: Because we're all gonna do it. Yes, Yeah, It's.
Speaker 1: Just part of living. That's how these human brains are wired.
Speaker 1: And so I'm like, hey, you mad at this person
Speaker 1: for being human? And that's the real that's the real
Speaker 1: question I have to ask myself. This reminds me of
Speaker 1: doctor Harrison just a few weeks ago saying the ultimate
Speaker 1: show of humanity is compassion. And so I've been trying
Speaker 1: to carry that put in my pocket a little nugget.
Speaker 2: Yes, yes, I love that.
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Speaker 1: R Underscore T s h O.
Speaker 2: And you can find Takiya at Ze said so. Dope
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