WEBVTT - Coffee Unions Spread to Peet's 0:00:01.720 --> 0:00:04.920 Cool Zone Media. 0:00:05.120 --> 0:00:07.800 Welcome to Get Happened Here, a podcast about things falling 0:00:07.800 --> 0:00:10.360 apart and how to put them back together again. I'm 0:00:10.400 --> 0:00:13.760 your host, Miya Loong. As the new regime settles in, 0:00:14.080 --> 0:00:17.040 we face a struggle on a thousand fronts. It's bewildering, 0:00:17.200 --> 0:00:20.319 it's terrifying. It's an offensive design to overwhelm us with 0:00:20.320 --> 0:00:23.959 the sheer totality of the horror. But its diversity is 0:00:23.960 --> 0:00:27.520 also our greatest advantage, because every struggle on every front 0:00:27.760 --> 0:00:31.000 brings us closer to victory. And that allows us and 0:00:31.040 --> 0:00:33.639 it allows you to pick a field and hold it. 0:00:34.520 --> 0:00:36.400 One of the most important fronts in the years to 0:00:36.440 --> 0:00:39.400 come is labor. Much of what is to come will 0:00:39.400 --> 0:00:42.320 be decided on the shop floor, and today we're talking 0:00:42.360 --> 0:00:45.560 about that. And with me to talk about that is 0:00:45.640 --> 0:00:49.159 fellow worker do you know and IWW PiZZ union organizer 0:00:49.159 --> 0:00:52.400 in Berkeley, and fellow worker Cole who is AWW Pizza 0:00:52.440 --> 0:00:55.320 union organizer in Portland, and both of you two, welcome 0:00:55.320 --> 0:00:55.880 to the show. 0:00:56.000 --> 0:00:57.320 Thank you. I'm excited to be here. 0:00:57.560 --> 0:00:59.400 Hello, thank you for having me on. 0:01:00.120 --> 0:01:02.320 Me too, I'm excited to talk to you both. So 0:01:02.360 --> 0:01:04.720 this is a Pete's Coffee Union. We have talked to 0:01:04.760 --> 0:01:06.520 several other unions, but this was kind of personal to 0:01:06.560 --> 0:01:08.400 me because this is one of the sort of coffee 0:01:08.520 --> 0:01:11.560 things that my dad kind of grew up on, and 0:01:11.600 --> 0:01:14.440 I'm now now here to deliver wrath against them for 0:01:14.480 --> 0:01:18.120 their many crimes. So, yeah, let's start off with can 0:01:18.160 --> 0:01:20.360 we talk a bit about how these unions came together 0:01:20.480 --> 0:01:22.480 and what the sort of like beginning process of this 0:01:22.600 --> 0:01:23.440 organizing look like. 0:01:23.800 --> 0:01:28.440 Yeah, so the first store that organized actually was in Davis, California. 0:01:28.520 --> 0:01:33.280 They organized I think in twenty twenty two. They launched 0:01:33.319 --> 0:01:36.280 their public campaign at the end in winter, and then 0:01:36.280 --> 0:01:40.160 they voted for their election back in January twenty twenty three. 0:01:40.280 --> 0:01:42.160 That's around the same time period where a lot of 0:01:42.240 --> 0:01:46.840 media was writing about their unionization process and a couple 0:01:46.920 --> 0:01:49.200 of the Bay area stores heard about it and started 0:01:49.200 --> 0:01:52.200 to meet together, and that's kind of where we started. 0:01:52.480 --> 0:01:56.040 We weren't IWW at the start, but we eventually started 0:01:56.080 --> 0:01:58.160 meeting with unions and chose IWW. 0:01:58.440 --> 0:02:00.760 Hell yeah, So it was it was an independent thing 0:02:00.800 --> 0:02:01.840 that became ANWW. 0:02:02.360 --> 0:02:02.560 Yeah. 0:02:02.600 --> 0:02:06.440 When we joined the IWW, we were basically fully organized 0:02:06.480 --> 0:02:09.320 to the extent that we were going to be. We 0:02:09.360 --> 0:02:11.960 already had our like committee set up, We had our 0:02:12.240 --> 0:02:16.639 meetings regularly. We had like Roberts rules and everything already implemented. 0:02:16.800 --> 0:02:19.880 That's so cool. Do you want to talk a little 0:02:19.919 --> 0:02:22.160 bit about like what the sort of process of doing 0:02:22.160 --> 0:02:24.520 that initial organizing before you went to the unions looked, 0:02:24.600 --> 0:02:26.880 like how how everything sort of came together. 0:02:27.400 --> 0:02:30.920 Yeah, when we started organizing, it was very secretive, and 0:02:30.960 --> 0:02:32.800 it was a little bit scary at the time because 0:02:32.800 --> 0:02:35.120 there was a lot of already kind of union busting 0:02:35.160 --> 0:02:38.160 from management. There was a lot of managers kind of 0:02:38.200 --> 0:02:40.880 like trying to overhear people were talking about the union 0:02:41.680 --> 0:02:43.880 or already instigating themselves. 0:02:43.400 --> 0:02:45.600 And asking like what do you think about unions? 0:02:45.639 --> 0:02:48.560 And it was a little bit scary to try to 0:02:48.600 --> 0:02:50.880 just like go up to coworkers and be like, hey, 0:02:50.960 --> 0:02:52.720 like are you interested in you know, hanging out after 0:02:52.760 --> 0:02:55.720 work and you know, talking shit about our like manager 0:02:55.800 --> 0:02:59.480 or something like that. And over time we eventually started 0:02:59.480 --> 0:03:03.320 doing like on one conversations with our coworkers and meeting together. 0:03:04.000 --> 0:03:06.880 Once we had our three stores that really were solidified, 0:03:06.919 --> 0:03:08.799 we had at least one person in each store that 0:03:08.919 --> 0:03:11.800 was like willing to like drive the campaign forward for 0:03:11.919 --> 0:03:14.760 moms in maybe even years as some of us have 0:03:14.840 --> 0:03:17.400 been around for that long now, we felt ready to 0:03:17.480 --> 0:03:20.160 kind of like start sending things into stone. So we 0:03:20.240 --> 0:03:22.880 had like meetings every single week and we had bi 0:03:22.919 --> 0:03:26.720 weekly meetings. At some point we had committee meetings, and 0:03:26.919 --> 0:03:30.240 people started to kind of select themselves into like social 0:03:30.280 --> 0:03:34.359 media or we had outreach, we had intakes, so other 0:03:34.360 --> 0:03:37.520 stores were also reaching out to us because there was 0:03:37.600 --> 0:03:41.160 like just secret kind of like people knew what was happening, 0:03:41.200 --> 0:03:43.520 people didn't want to say it out loud. Yeah, So 0:03:43.520 --> 0:03:45.360 it was just a lot of like hanging out, having 0:03:45.360 --> 0:03:48.480 socials and things like that that kind of like created 0:03:48.520 --> 0:03:52.360 the foundations for like personal relationships for organizing, and at 0:03:52.400 --> 0:03:54.520 the time, it was mostly just us complaining for a 0:03:54.560 --> 0:03:56.280 really long time until we were like, what if we 0:03:56.320 --> 0:03:57.120 did something about this? 0:03:57.640 --> 0:04:00.600 Yeah, What I think I'm curious about is like how large, 0:04:00.960 --> 0:04:02.560 roughly are these are these shops. 0:04:02.920 --> 0:04:07.200 There tends to be about twelve to sixteen workers at 0:04:07.240 --> 0:04:10.760 each shop. So I think the biggest union shop that 0:04:10.800 --> 0:04:13.400 we have has sixteen workers in it. The shop that 0:04:13.440 --> 0:04:18.000 I work at is fairly small. We only have twelve 0:04:18.200 --> 0:04:23.679 workers right now, so fairly small. And I will say, 0:04:24.240 --> 0:04:28.320 just to give some context for the organizing process from 0:04:28.320 --> 0:04:32.480 my shop as well. Piece did not make it difficult 0:04:32.839 --> 0:04:35.400 to organize in terms of like the policies that they 0:04:35.400 --> 0:04:40.560 were pushing. Yeah, everyone was pissed off about how we 0:04:40.560 --> 0:04:44.640 were being treated, and so just sort of pushing people 0:04:45.320 --> 0:04:49.760 in one on one conversations to look for solutions rather 0:04:49.839 --> 0:04:53.080 than just bitching about it, which is great. That's where 0:04:53.120 --> 0:04:56.560 it all starts, right, Piece is pushing poor policies. They're 0:04:56.600 --> 0:04:59.760 cutting hours, that's one of the biggest thing. They're slicing 0:04:59.760 --> 0:05:02.680 our hours week after week, even as the volume of 0:05:02.720 --> 0:05:05.880 sales goes up, and so just being like, hey, do 0:05:05.920 --> 0:05:09.120 you want more hours, Like do you feel like it's 0:05:09.360 --> 0:05:12.400 fair for us to be staffed this way, Let's try 0:05:12.440 --> 0:05:13.640 to do something about it. 0:05:14.279 --> 0:05:16.360 Yeah, and the staffing issues, this is one of the 0:05:16.400 --> 0:05:19.000 things we're talking to, I mean just people across sectors. 0:05:19.680 --> 0:05:22.080 It's really one of the it's one of the things 0:05:22.080 --> 0:05:25.400 that's the most obvious if you're working one of these jobs. 0:05:25.440 --> 0:05:28.359 And also somehow it's not something that ever gets talked 0:05:28.360 --> 0:05:31.479 about in the mainstream at all, Like it it's never 0:05:31.520 --> 0:05:35.239 a part of the discourse that you know, you don't 0:05:35.279 --> 0:05:37.719 have a set number of hours that you're going to work. 0:05:37.920 --> 0:05:39.839 You don't know when you're going to work them. And 0:05:39.920 --> 0:05:41.640 also you know, there's no guarantee that you're going to 0:05:41.680 --> 0:05:44.800 get to work enough hours to actually survive. And then 0:05:45.400 --> 0:05:49.000 also the entire condition of labor, like every sector is 0:05:49.480 --> 0:05:54.200 just chronic. It's just chronic underscheduling and chronic understaffing of everything, 0:05:54.240 --> 0:05:57.920 and you know, and that ranges from like coffee shops, 0:05:58.040 --> 0:06:01.480 like hospitals to schools to like everyone has decided that 0:06:01.880 --> 0:06:04.240 the way that you manage things is by by chronically 0:06:04.320 --> 0:06:06.760 overworking everyone and trying to pay people as little as 0:06:06.760 --> 0:06:09.720 possible by not giving them hours. You can talk a 0:06:09.760 --> 0:06:12.359 little bit more about about the kind of the actual 0:06:12.400 --> 0:06:14.560 effects of the understaffing and how that sort of drove 0:06:14.640 --> 0:06:15.599 people into the campaign. 0:06:16.480 --> 0:06:19.039 Yeah, I would be more than happy to. I mean, 0:06:19.160 --> 0:06:24.479 one of the sort of primary catalysts for organizing for 0:06:24.560 --> 0:06:29.880 our shop was the introduction of Uber Eats. So when 0:06:30.000 --> 0:06:32.080 I first started working at the shop, it was around 0:06:32.080 --> 0:06:36.640 two years ago, they had just recently introduced door Dash, 0:06:36.839 --> 0:06:40.200 so previously, you know, obviously it started it was just 0:06:40.240 --> 0:06:42.719 a cafe people would come in and get their coffee. 0:06:43.160 --> 0:06:46.400 Later on they ended up introducing mobile orders through pete 0:06:46.440 --> 0:06:51.120 Zone ordering system, and then when the pandemic hit initially 0:06:51.320 --> 0:06:54.960 and everything locked down, they started doing door dash to 0:06:55.040 --> 0:06:59.279 try to continue having a revenue stream. Now, after more 0:06:59.320 --> 0:07:02.640 things started open up, they open the shop up again. Obviously, 0:07:02.680 --> 0:07:05.760 they continued to have door Dash because it brings in 0:07:05.800 --> 0:07:10.000 a lot of revenue for them, and then without really 0:07:10.040 --> 0:07:14.160 any fore warning and certainly without any increase in staffing 0:07:14.280 --> 0:07:18.160 for us, they introduced uberre eats, which is a similar 0:07:18.320 --> 0:07:22.720 amount of volume increase, a similar amount of orders increase 0:07:23.000 --> 0:07:27.040 as door Dash, Like we're probably getting at peak like 0:07:27.640 --> 0:07:32.160 thirty forty drinks per hour in addition to what we're 0:07:32.160 --> 0:07:35.920 getting in store from door Dash and uber eats. 0:07:36.360 --> 0:07:40.880 That's a drink every like subtube minutes, yeah, Jesus. 0:07:41.120 --> 0:07:45.920 And we are expected to crank these out at less 0:07:45.960 --> 0:07:49.560 than three minutes in order, and that's per order, So 0:07:49.640 --> 0:07:52.960 an order might have like five drinks if it's DoorDash 0:07:53.040 --> 0:07:56.120 or uber eats, where in particular, people will order a 0:07:56.120 --> 0:07:59.080 lot of things at a time, because it seems like 0:07:59.600 --> 0:08:02.880 using these sort of apps and stuff, people will order 0:08:03.520 --> 0:08:07.320 much more egregious things, much larger orders than they do 0:08:07.760 --> 0:08:11.680 when they're in store. And so everyone's really annoyed about 0:08:11.720 --> 0:08:13.880 this just like, Okay, all of a sudden, we have 0:08:13.920 --> 0:08:16.360 all this extra work to do. They're not increasing our 0:08:16.360 --> 0:08:16.960 hours at all. 0:08:17.280 --> 0:08:19.360 You're not getting paid more either, well. 0:08:19.240 --> 0:08:21.760 Certainly not. And we don't get tips from that either. 0:08:21.920 --> 0:08:23.520 Oh Jesus, you don't get tipped from me? 0:08:23.640 --> 0:08:23.880 No? 0:08:23.880 --> 0:08:25.800 No, I mean like, wait, oh, the chips all go 0:08:25.800 --> 0:08:26.480 to the drivers. 0:08:26.560 --> 0:08:30.840 Jesus Christ, I won't. Like, that's not a bad thing. 0:08:31.160 --> 0:08:32.600 For the drivers, but you should get paid too. 0:08:33.040 --> 0:08:35.640 But it's like Uber who's taking the vast majority of 0:08:35.720 --> 0:08:38.840 the money from that and piece and so us and 0:08:38.880 --> 0:08:42.000 the drivers are both getting screwed over by this. Yeah, 0:08:42.040 --> 0:08:44.240 but we both have to do all the sextraneous work. 0:08:44.679 --> 0:08:49.160 So people were super fucking irritated about that, myself included 0:08:49.240 --> 0:08:52.880 for sure. And that really got people going with like, Okay, 0:08:52.880 --> 0:08:55.240 what are we going to do about this? How can 0:08:55.280 --> 0:08:58.520 we try to push them to staff us better? Yeah, 0:08:58.559 --> 0:09:01.920 And it seems like the incentive struckures for these delivery 0:09:01.960 --> 0:09:05.800 services add up really badly in terms of like the 0:09:05.800 --> 0:09:07.680 way that incenters people to order, because you know, you 0:09:07.720 --> 0:09:11.080 have these like minimums on the amount of like stuff 0:09:11.120 --> 0:09:13.160 you have to order to get below like there's all 0:09:13.160 --> 0:09:15.240 this you know, all those like threshold stuff of like 0:09:15.679 --> 0:09:17.720 if you do this, you get free delivery. You spend 0:09:17.720 --> 0:09:19.160 this much, you get blah blah blah blah blah, and 0:09:19.200 --> 0:09:21.720 so that. Yeah, it seems like the sort of perfect 0:09:21.760 --> 0:09:27.600 Mailstrom for producing even more work. Yeah. And I will 0:09:27.640 --> 0:09:32.400 say this is that they like to push out promotions 0:09:32.440 --> 0:09:34.680 to people of like buy one, get one free, that 0:09:34.800 --> 0:09:40.200 sort of thing for like our PiZZ location constantly, and 0:09:40.240 --> 0:09:43.160 they they never tell us about it. So, you know, 0:09:43.240 --> 0:09:46.400 one day, we'll just be getting like five large mochas 0:09:46.440 --> 0:09:48.160 and like six different orders, and we're like, why are 0:09:48.160 --> 0:09:50.480 we getting five large mochas and all of these orders, 0:09:50.679 --> 0:09:52.880 And someone pulls up the door Dash app and they're like, oh, 0:09:52.920 --> 0:09:55.320 it's because there's like a half off if you get 0:09:55.320 --> 0:09:58.640 more than four mochas or you know something like that. 0:09:59.040 --> 0:10:01.360 It's just like, we never hear about this until it's 0:10:01.400 --> 0:10:04.400 actually happening. Yeah. And that's the case both for door 0:10:04.480 --> 0:10:08.720 Dash newber Eats, but also for just like internal pizza promotions, 0:10:08.840 --> 0:10:10.840 Like we tend not to hear about any of these 0:10:10.880 --> 0:10:14.480 things until we are on the shop floor working and 0:10:14.559 --> 0:10:17.240 people are asking us about it. Customers are asking us 0:10:17.240 --> 0:10:17.640 about it. 0:10:17.960 --> 0:10:22.000 Yeah, it seems like the way that the integration of 0:10:22.040 --> 0:10:25.480 these apps into these business models is working. As it's 0:10:25.520 --> 0:10:28.280 just every every single thing they do just compounds the 0:10:28.320 --> 0:10:30.720 amount of work you have to do and compounds how 0:10:30.760 --> 0:10:34.400 awful the experience is, and speak speaking about how awful 0:10:34.400 --> 0:10:38.040 the experience is. Unfortunately, we are a podcast sponsored by ads, 0:10:38.280 --> 0:10:41.360 so go experience them or don't. I don't know. There's 0:10:41.360 --> 0:10:43.400 a if you have Apple, there's a there's a thing 0:10:43.440 --> 0:10:44.920 you can get called cold as that media where you 0:10:44.920 --> 0:10:49.280 don't have ads. De Android one. I don't even know 0:10:49.320 --> 0:10:51.160 what I'm legally allowed to say about that shit, but 0:10:51.240 --> 0:10:53.559 oh my god, it is the biggest legal clusterfuck I've 0:10:53.559 --> 0:10:55.840 ever seen in my entire life. We're gonna leave it 0:10:55.840 --> 0:11:03.360 at there, but we'll try it. We're doing our best. 0:11:08.640 --> 0:11:13.520 We are so back. Yeah, so let's go into other 0:11:13.600 --> 0:11:14.840 of their buried crimes. 0:11:15.240 --> 0:11:16.680 Oh man, where do I even start? 0:11:17.120 --> 0:11:20.240 So Pete, the second they found out that we were organizing, 0:11:21.160 --> 0:11:24.079 launched like their worst union busting campaign they could have 0:11:24.120 --> 0:11:27.000 ever imagined, wasting so much money. 0:11:27.240 --> 0:11:28.199 Oh god. 0:11:28.400 --> 0:11:31.679 Right after we went public, the first big thing that 0:11:31.720 --> 0:11:34.360 they messed up on was they took me off the 0:11:34.400 --> 0:11:37.720 schedule indefinitely and we had to like foule a whole 0:11:37.800 --> 0:11:39.240 unfair labor practice about it. 0:11:39.880 --> 0:11:41.520 An unfair labor practice is a. 0:11:41.600 --> 0:11:45.320 Charge with the National Labor Relations Board, and we claimed 0:11:45.360 --> 0:11:48.360 that they were being retaliatory. And at the time it 0:11:48.400 --> 0:11:51.960 was very clear that management thought I was a key organizer. 0:11:52.000 --> 0:11:54.240 I was very public and vocal about being a union 0:11:54.280 --> 0:11:57.240 member at the time, everyone was. But for some reason 0:11:57.280 --> 0:12:00.640 they signaled me out. That was one part of how 0:12:00.640 --> 0:12:02.480 they messed up. But they eventually put me back on 0:12:02.480 --> 0:12:04.680 the schedule, apologize, gave me back pay. 0:12:04.880 --> 0:12:06.199 Oh yeah, and we withdrew that. 0:12:06.920 --> 0:12:09.040 We withdrew the ULPE because they're like, all right, I 0:12:09.040 --> 0:12:10.400 guess it fixed itself. 0:12:11.080 --> 0:12:13.200 Yeah, that's the thing that happens. By the way, like 0:12:13.640 --> 0:12:15.920 if you're submitting an o fair labor practice and the 0:12:16.000 --> 0:12:19.320 company resolves it, you don't actually have to. And this 0:12:19.360 --> 0:12:21.480 is actually one of the things about up sometimes is 0:12:21.520 --> 0:12:25.559 that like neither you nor your employer wants to go 0:12:25.640 --> 0:12:29.120 sit in front of the National Labor Relations Board and 0:12:29.280 --> 0:12:32.120 like do a whole thing. So like sometimes you can 0:12:32.160 --> 0:12:34.320 get them to resolve it just by like just by 0:12:34.360 --> 0:12:36.040 the thread of it, and then you don't actually have 0:12:36.080 --> 0:12:37.600 to go sit in front of the Natural Labor relations 0:12:37.640 --> 0:12:39.440 board because they've done the thing they're supposed to do. 0:12:40.160 --> 0:12:42.200 So note for all you people out there who are 0:12:42.200 --> 0:12:44.040 considering file like one piece. 0:12:44.200 --> 0:12:46.040 Yeah, I know, just stack them up and sometimes that's 0:12:46.160 --> 0:12:50.360 enough to put pressure, especially for smaller businesses or people 0:12:50.360 --> 0:12:53.360 who just like especially corporations that don't necessarily have experience 0:12:53.400 --> 0:12:56.080 of union investing quite yet. Yeah, So at the time, 0:12:56.080 --> 0:12:58.600 that worked, and within a week I had my drop 0:12:58.679 --> 0:13:01.600 back and everything, And that was right after we had filed, 0:13:01.640 --> 0:13:04.360 which meant that if for some reason I wasn't put 0:13:04.400 --> 0:13:06.960 back on the schedule, I would have been gone leading 0:13:07.040 --> 0:13:09.280 up until the election, which would have been really bad 0:13:09.320 --> 0:13:11.440 in terms of you know, having those one on ones 0:13:11.480 --> 0:13:14.559 with coworkers making sure everyone was connected. 0:13:15.200 --> 0:13:17.080 I just I just want to mention here, like, it 0:13:17.200 --> 0:13:20.400 is illegal to fire someone for union organizing, Like it's 0:13:20.440 --> 0:13:24.280 not the most easily enforced thing, but they legally cannot 0:13:24.280 --> 0:13:27.440 do that. So just note for all the people who 0:13:27.480 --> 0:13:29.800 are listening to unte episodes for the first time, they 0:13:29.880 --> 0:13:32.040 can't do that. And if they do it, you can, 0:13:32.160 --> 0:13:34.679 you can launch campaigns and you can sort of force 0:13:34.720 --> 0:13:37.160 them to do it. But yeah, just this is the 0:13:37.240 --> 0:13:39.360 mea labor note of the episode. 0:13:39.720 --> 0:13:42.880 Yeah, no, and I think especially something that's very IWW 0:13:43.040 --> 0:13:45.920 of how we reacted to that situation was that my 0:13:46.080 --> 0:13:48.679 coworkers were also just like being really like annoying to 0:13:48.720 --> 0:13:51.480 the manager and being like, what happened to Dino? Why 0:13:51.480 --> 0:13:54.840 aren't they at work? Like what's going on? And I 0:13:54.840 --> 0:13:57.360 think that internal pressure also made it really uncomfortable for 0:13:57.440 --> 0:14:00.200 management to realize how much that had fucked up, how 0:14:00.240 --> 0:14:02.840 much my coworkers were willing to have my back. There's 0:14:02.880 --> 0:14:06.400 definitely more talk of like actual direct action in other 0:14:06.480 --> 0:14:10.520 ways that eventually like we actually didn't do because I 0:14:10.559 --> 0:14:13.480 got my my hours back, so that was really good. 0:14:13.720 --> 0:14:14.880 Yeah. 0:14:14.400 --> 0:14:14.600 Yeah. 0:14:14.920 --> 0:14:17.880 And then yeah, so that was still within the first 0:14:18.200 --> 0:14:21.880 few weeks of when we filed our paperwork to have 0:14:21.960 --> 0:14:25.640 an election with the NLRB to be a certified shop 0:14:25.920 --> 0:14:29.040 according to the government. Not that that's always important, Yeah, 0:14:29.120 --> 0:14:29.920 that's something that we. 0:14:29.920 --> 0:14:33.640 Wanted, especially as regime unfolds. Yeah. 0:14:33.840 --> 0:14:37.560 Yeah, No, it's really it's a really tough position, especially 0:14:37.600 --> 0:14:40.680 because I mean, we're we're IWW members, and I know 0:14:40.760 --> 0:14:43.360 that there's definitely an internal debate of whether or not, 0:14:43.400 --> 0:14:46.880 you know, contractual agreements versus direct action, but there's always 0:14:47.040 --> 0:14:50.440 the options to both a combination divers the fire tactics. 0:14:50.920 --> 0:14:56.320 But yeah, so that happened. They also hired a union buster. 0:14:56.280 --> 0:14:57.040 Of course they did. 0:14:57.200 --> 0:15:01.080 Now according to LM reports from the government that they 0:15:01.080 --> 0:15:03.680 have to file, they spent over one hundred thousand dollars 0:15:03.720 --> 0:15:06.160 in like a span of like two weeks to hire 0:15:06.160 --> 0:15:07.000 this union investor. 0:15:07.680 --> 0:15:09.840 And it wasn't the way. 0:15:09.880 --> 0:15:12.960 And it's like a report that you file with the 0:15:13.280 --> 0:15:15.920 I think forgetting which department it is. 0:15:15.760 --> 0:15:21.200 But is it the OLM, the Office of Labor and Management. 0:15:21.000 --> 0:15:23.840 Think you Yeah, So they are required to file that 0:15:24.040 --> 0:15:27.160 by I think March thirtieth of the following year for 0:15:27.200 --> 0:15:31.080 like fiscal reasons. So we finally got those documents this 0:15:31.240 --> 0:15:34.960 previous year. So they did spend a lot of money. 0:15:35.000 --> 0:15:39.000 And this guy who is just basically messing with us 0:15:39.040 --> 0:15:43.160 for like two weeks, and he was, you know, trying 0:15:43.200 --> 0:15:46.200 to be super helpful answer any questions about the union 0:15:46.480 --> 0:15:49.680 and like tell people that the union was you know, 0:15:49.760 --> 0:15:53.160 like racist, not for them, or that the union was exclusionary, 0:15:53.280 --> 0:15:56.600 or that unions cost a lot of money. And thankfully 0:15:56.640 --> 0:15:59.080 that didn't work. We won all of our elections, but 0:15:59.320 --> 0:16:04.080 leading up to them, it definitely kind of morale dropped 0:16:04.120 --> 0:16:09.120 a lot. People felt a little bit they were questioning 0:16:09.200 --> 0:16:11.320 whether or not it was the right decision we made 0:16:11.320 --> 0:16:13.360 to unionize in their first place, because it seemed like 0:16:13.360 --> 0:16:16.720 this was just the start of Pete's just messing with 0:16:16.840 --> 0:16:19.440 us because they care on and it didn't seem like 0:16:19.480 --> 0:16:20.960 there was much that we could have done in that 0:16:21.000 --> 0:16:24.400 situation other than try to maybe have fun with the 0:16:24.480 --> 0:16:25.880 union buster and mess with him. 0:16:25.960 --> 0:16:28.080 But even then that still wasn't like. 0:16:28.160 --> 0:16:31.520 Enough to kind of out the fact that like people 0:16:31.520 --> 0:16:33.360 were just being messed with at work and they couldn't 0:16:33.360 --> 0:16:35.800 literally leave, like there was someone like on the floor 0:16:35.840 --> 0:16:39.280 asking them questions about their you know, activity. 0:16:38.800 --> 0:16:39.400 With the union. 0:16:39.600 --> 0:16:42.200 And even though now we know it's like illegal and 0:16:42.240 --> 0:16:45.080 we could have filed unfairly were practices on that at 0:16:45.120 --> 0:16:46.920 the time, we just didn't do it. 0:16:47.200 --> 0:16:48.400 And now we're learning about it. 0:16:48.440 --> 0:16:51.280 But that's something I definitely wish we knew and stood 0:16:51.320 --> 0:16:52.240 up for a little bit more. 0:16:52.720 --> 0:16:54.800 Yeah, did you tell a little bit about what the 0:16:54.840 --> 0:16:57.680 specific thing was, so that if people are like experiencing 0:16:57.760 --> 0:17:00.040 it themselves, they can know what they can do. 0:17:00.720 --> 0:17:05.080 Yeah, So management shouldn't be asking for your like affiliation 0:17:05.200 --> 0:17:07.679 within like a union. They're not allowed to ask or 0:17:07.720 --> 0:17:10.920 make assumptions about it, So like if I'm a manager, 0:17:11.000 --> 0:17:13.119 I'm not allowed to like go up to me and 0:17:13.160 --> 0:17:15.520 be like, hey, do you know, like since you're in 0:17:15.560 --> 0:17:17.600 the union, like what is the union. 0:17:17.400 --> 0:17:19.679 Doing about X, Y and Z? Like that's not an 0:17:19.720 --> 0:17:20.560 appropriate question. 0:17:20.800 --> 0:17:23.800 And there's definitely times where, like my own manager asked 0:17:23.840 --> 0:17:26.480 me questions like that and I definitely had to like, hey, 0:17:26.560 --> 0:17:28.760 like this is actually like not appropriate for you to do, 0:17:29.040 --> 0:17:32.040 Like I don't feel comfortable with this. But that's not 0:17:32.080 --> 0:17:35.840 always the case, and some workers definitely were like disclosing 0:17:36.080 --> 0:17:39.320 private and confidential information about the union to management, and 0:17:39.359 --> 0:17:42.399 it was really hard to make sure that every worker 0:17:42.440 --> 0:17:46.360 felt comfortable. And they definitely picked out workers based on 0:17:46.600 --> 0:17:49.560 you know, like social like personalities and things like that, 0:17:49.600 --> 0:17:52.000 which is really disheartening to see. 0:17:52.280 --> 0:17:55.280 Yeah, really scummy. And I think morale is a traadeous 0:17:55.280 --> 0:17:57.440 struggle and that's one of the things here too, where 0:17:57.440 --> 0:18:00.640 it's like a lot of these efforts are just attempts 0:18:00.680 --> 0:18:03.399 to make everyone in a workplace miserable and to make 0:18:03.400 --> 0:18:05.760 people sort of too depressed and too despondent to sort 0:18:05.760 --> 0:18:07.200 of organize, and a lot of that. Yeah, again, it 0:18:07.240 --> 0:18:08.879 is like it's stuff you can organize against and stuff 0:18:08.880 --> 0:18:12.159 that like they're not allowed to do and whether or 0:18:12.200 --> 0:18:13.720 not they're going to be able to do it. It 0:18:13.880 --> 0:18:18.040 is a function of labor regulation, and labor law is 0:18:18.040 --> 0:18:19.920 not something that's enforced by the government. It's something that's 0:18:19.960 --> 0:18:22.560 enforced by you, as enforced by the people around you. 0:18:23.119 --> 0:18:25.840 And so you know, like the law can sometimes help 0:18:25.880 --> 0:18:29.280 and sometimes dozens. It's useful to cite to management. It's 0:18:29.359 --> 0:18:31.280 useful because it makes them think that there's like the 0:18:31.320 --> 0:18:33.439 full power of the state behind you or whatever. But 0:18:33.560 --> 0:18:36.879 like in terms of how you deal with this stuff, 0:18:36.920 --> 0:18:38.880 it is something that is enforced by you and by 0:18:38.880 --> 0:18:40.880 how organized you are, and by how organized your shop 0:18:40.880 --> 0:18:43.000 floor is, and by how who organize your community is. 0:18:43.400 --> 0:18:44.919 And that's something that's I think important for people to 0:18:44.960 --> 0:18:47.600 understand when you're forming your own unions, which you should 0:18:47.600 --> 0:18:50.240 also go do because you can just do it. I 0:18:50.280 --> 0:18:52.040 said it before and I'll say it again, Like the 0:18:52.040 --> 0:18:54.200 people who organize unions are just regular. 0:18:53.880 --> 0:18:57.240 People like you person, dear listener, So you can do 0:18:57.320 --> 0:18:59.560 this too. What they say it's like a union is 0:18:59.640 --> 0:19:03.760 just to workers talking to each other. Yeah, and yeah, 0:19:04.040 --> 0:19:06.840 just to expand on that point, a little bit. Like 0:19:06.880 --> 0:19:11.960 the NLRB is quite understaffed, and it will be more 0:19:12.160 --> 0:19:17.879 understaffed almost certainly as the Trump administration, you know, gets 0:19:17.920 --> 0:19:22.440 deeper into gutting the entirety of the government. It already 0:19:22.480 --> 0:19:27.240 takes months, two years to get unfair labor practice filings 0:19:27.320 --> 0:19:32.080 resolved for the NLRB to do most things. So that 0:19:32.200 --> 0:19:37.600 is a core tenet of the IWW is actually taking 0:19:37.680 --> 0:19:42.520 action on the shop floor. Yeah, Like that is the 0:19:43.000 --> 0:19:47.040 key aspect to unionism as a whole. And I think 0:19:47.119 --> 0:19:49.360 one of the great parts about the IWW is that 0:19:49.840 --> 0:19:54.560 it actually acknowledges that the power comes from the workers. 0:19:54.760 --> 0:19:58.199 It doesn't come from laws. The laws only came because 0:19:58.280 --> 0:20:00.720 workers were pushing for things on the shop floor in 0:20:00.760 --> 0:20:03.359 the first place. So it's like, let's get back to 0:20:03.440 --> 0:20:04.000 the root of that. 0:20:04.720 --> 0:20:06.720