1 00:00:01,720 --> 00:00:04,920 Speaker 1: Cool Zone Media. 2 00:00:05,120 --> 00:00:07,800 Speaker 2: Welcome to Get Happened Here, a podcast about things falling 3 00:00:07,800 --> 00:00:10,360 Speaker 2: apart and how to put them back together again. I'm 4 00:00:10,400 --> 00:00:13,760 Speaker 2: your host, Miya Loong. As the new regime settles in, 5 00:00:14,080 --> 00:00:17,040 Speaker 2: we face a struggle on a thousand fronts. It's bewildering, 6 00:00:17,200 --> 00:00:20,319 Speaker 2: it's terrifying. It's an offensive design to overwhelm us with 7 00:00:20,320 --> 00:00:23,959 Speaker 2: the sheer totality of the horror. But its diversity is 8 00:00:23,960 --> 00:00:27,520 Speaker 2: also our greatest advantage, because every struggle on every front 9 00:00:27,760 --> 00:00:31,000 Speaker 2: brings us closer to victory. And that allows us and 10 00:00:31,040 --> 00:00:33,639 Speaker 2: it allows you to pick a field and hold it. 11 00:00:34,520 --> 00:00:36,400 Speaker 2: One of the most important fronts in the years to 12 00:00:36,440 --> 00:00:39,400 Speaker 2: come is labor. Much of what is to come will 13 00:00:39,400 --> 00:00:42,320 Speaker 2: be decided on the shop floor, and today we're talking 14 00:00:42,360 --> 00:00:45,560 Speaker 2: about that. And with me to talk about that is 15 00:00:45,640 --> 00:00:49,159 Speaker 2: fellow worker do you know and IWW PiZZ union organizer 16 00:00:49,159 --> 00:00:52,400 Speaker 2: in Berkeley, and fellow worker Cole who is AWW Pizza 17 00:00:52,440 --> 00:00:55,320 Speaker 2: union organizer in Portland, and both of you two, welcome 18 00:00:55,320 --> 00:00:55,880 Speaker 2: to the show. 19 00:00:56,000 --> 00:00:57,320 Speaker 3: Thank you. I'm excited to be here. 20 00:00:57,560 --> 00:00:59,400 Speaker 1: Hello, thank you for having me on. 21 00:01:00,120 --> 00:01:02,320 Speaker 2: Me too, I'm excited to talk to you both. So 22 00:01:02,360 --> 00:01:04,720 Speaker 2: this is a Pete's Coffee Union. We have talked to 23 00:01:04,760 --> 00:01:06,520 Speaker 2: several other unions, but this was kind of personal to 24 00:01:06,560 --> 00:01:08,400 Speaker 2: me because this is one of the sort of coffee 25 00:01:08,520 --> 00:01:11,560 Speaker 2: things that my dad kind of grew up on, and 26 00:01:11,600 --> 00:01:14,440 Speaker 2: I'm now now here to deliver wrath against them for 27 00:01:14,480 --> 00:01:18,120 Speaker 2: their many crimes. So, yeah, let's start off with can 28 00:01:18,160 --> 00:01:20,360 Speaker 2: we talk a bit about how these unions came together 29 00:01:20,480 --> 00:01:22,480 Speaker 2: and what the sort of like beginning process of this 30 00:01:22,600 --> 00:01:23,440 Speaker 2: organizing look like. 31 00:01:23,800 --> 00:01:28,440 Speaker 4: Yeah, so the first store that organized actually was in Davis, California. 32 00:01:28,520 --> 00:01:33,280 Speaker 4: They organized I think in twenty twenty two. They launched 33 00:01:33,319 --> 00:01:36,280 Speaker 4: their public campaign at the end in winter, and then 34 00:01:36,280 --> 00:01:40,160 Speaker 4: they voted for their election back in January twenty twenty three. 35 00:01:40,280 --> 00:01:42,160 Speaker 4: That's around the same time period where a lot of 36 00:01:42,240 --> 00:01:46,840 Speaker 4: media was writing about their unionization process and a couple 37 00:01:46,920 --> 00:01:49,200 Speaker 4: of the Bay area stores heard about it and started 38 00:01:49,200 --> 00:01:52,200 Speaker 4: to meet together, and that's kind of where we started. 39 00:01:52,480 --> 00:01:56,040 Speaker 4: We weren't IWW at the start, but we eventually started 40 00:01:56,080 --> 00:01:58,160 Speaker 4: meeting with unions and chose IWW. 41 00:01:58,440 --> 00:02:00,760 Speaker 2: Hell yeah, So it was it was an independent thing 42 00:02:00,800 --> 00:02:01,840 Speaker 2: that became ANWW. 43 00:02:02,360 --> 00:02:02,560 Speaker 3: Yeah. 44 00:02:02,600 --> 00:02:06,440 Speaker 4: When we joined the IWW, we were basically fully organized 45 00:02:06,480 --> 00:02:09,320 Speaker 4: to the extent that we were going to be. We 46 00:02:09,360 --> 00:02:11,960 Speaker 4: already had our like committee set up, We had our 47 00:02:12,240 --> 00:02:16,639 Speaker 4: meetings regularly. We had like Roberts rules and everything already implemented. 48 00:02:16,800 --> 00:02:19,880 Speaker 2: That's so cool. Do you want to talk a little 49 00:02:19,919 --> 00:02:22,160 Speaker 2: bit about like what the sort of process of doing 50 00:02:22,160 --> 00:02:24,520 Speaker 2: that initial organizing before you went to the unions looked, 51 00:02:24,600 --> 00:02:26,880 Speaker 2: like how how everything sort of came together. 52 00:02:27,400 --> 00:02:30,920 Speaker 4: Yeah, when we started organizing, it was very secretive, and 53 00:02:30,960 --> 00:02:32,800 Speaker 4: it was a little bit scary at the time because 54 00:02:32,800 --> 00:02:35,120 Speaker 4: there was a lot of already kind of union busting 55 00:02:35,160 --> 00:02:38,160 Speaker 4: from management. There was a lot of managers kind of 56 00:02:38,200 --> 00:02:40,880 Speaker 4: like trying to overhear people were talking about the union 57 00:02:41,680 --> 00:02:43,880 Speaker 4: or already instigating themselves. 58 00:02:43,400 --> 00:02:45,600 Speaker 3: And asking like what do you think about unions? 59 00:02:45,639 --> 00:02:48,560 Speaker 4: And it was a little bit scary to try to 60 00:02:48,600 --> 00:02:50,880 Speaker 4: just like go up to coworkers and be like, hey, 61 00:02:50,960 --> 00:02:52,720 Speaker 4: like are you interested in you know, hanging out after 62 00:02:52,760 --> 00:02:55,720 Speaker 4: work and you know, talking shit about our like manager 63 00:02:55,800 --> 00:02:59,480 Speaker 4: or something like that. And over time we eventually started 64 00:02:59,480 --> 00:03:03,320 Speaker 4: doing like on one conversations with our coworkers and meeting together. 65 00:03:04,000 --> 00:03:06,880 Speaker 4: Once we had our three stores that really were solidified, 66 00:03:06,919 --> 00:03:08,799 Speaker 4: we had at least one person in each store that 67 00:03:08,919 --> 00:03:11,800 Speaker 4: was like willing to like drive the campaign forward for 68 00:03:11,919 --> 00:03:14,760 Speaker 4: moms in maybe even years as some of us have 69 00:03:14,840 --> 00:03:17,400 Speaker 4: been around for that long now, we felt ready to 70 00:03:17,480 --> 00:03:20,160 Speaker 4: kind of like start sending things into stone. So we 71 00:03:20,240 --> 00:03:22,880 Speaker 4: had like meetings every single week and we had bi 72 00:03:22,919 --> 00:03:26,720 Speaker 4: weekly meetings. At some point we had committee meetings, and 73 00:03:26,919 --> 00:03:30,240 Speaker 4: people started to kind of select themselves into like social 74 00:03:30,280 --> 00:03:34,359 Speaker 4: media or we had outreach, we had intakes, so other 75 00:03:34,360 --> 00:03:37,520 Speaker 4: stores were also reaching out to us because there was 76 00:03:37,600 --> 00:03:41,160 Speaker 4: like just secret kind of like people knew what was happening, 77 00:03:41,200 --> 00:03:43,520 Speaker 4: people didn't want to say it out loud. Yeah, So 78 00:03:43,520 --> 00:03:45,360 Speaker 4: it was just a lot of like hanging out, having 79 00:03:45,360 --> 00:03:48,480 Speaker 4: socials and things like that that kind of like created 80 00:03:48,520 --> 00:03:52,360 Speaker 4: the foundations for like personal relationships for organizing, and at 81 00:03:52,400 --> 00:03:54,520 Speaker 4: the time, it was mostly just us complaining for a 82 00:03:54,560 --> 00:03:56,280 Speaker 4: really long time until we were like, what if we 83 00:03:56,320 --> 00:03:57,120 Speaker 4: did something about this? 84 00:03:57,640 --> 00:04:00,600 Speaker 2: Yeah, What I think I'm curious about is like how large, 85 00:04:00,960 --> 00:04:02,560 Speaker 2: roughly are these are these shops. 86 00:04:02,920 --> 00:04:07,200 Speaker 1: There tends to be about twelve to sixteen workers at 87 00:04:07,240 --> 00:04:10,760 Speaker 1: each shop. So I think the biggest union shop that 88 00:04:10,800 --> 00:04:13,400 Speaker 1: we have has sixteen workers in it. The shop that 89 00:04:13,440 --> 00:04:18,000 Speaker 1: I work at is fairly small. We only have twelve 90 00:04:18,200 --> 00:04:23,679 Speaker 1: workers right now, so fairly small. And I will say, 91 00:04:24,240 --> 00:04:28,320 Speaker 1: just to give some context for the organizing process from 92 00:04:28,320 --> 00:04:32,480 Speaker 1: my shop as well. Piece did not make it difficult 93 00:04:32,839 --> 00:04:35,400 Speaker 1: to organize in terms of like the policies that they 94 00:04:35,400 --> 00:04:40,560 Speaker 1: were pushing. Yeah, everyone was pissed off about how we 95 00:04:40,560 --> 00:04:44,640 Speaker 1: were being treated, and so just sort of pushing people 96 00:04:45,320 --> 00:04:49,760 Speaker 1: in one on one conversations to look for solutions rather 97 00:04:49,839 --> 00:04:53,080 Speaker 1: than just bitching about it, which is great. That's where 98 00:04:53,120 --> 00:04:56,560 Speaker 1: it all starts, right, Piece is pushing poor policies. They're 99 00:04:56,600 --> 00:04:59,760 Speaker 1: cutting hours, that's one of the biggest thing. They're slicing 100 00:04:59,760 --> 00:05:02,680 Speaker 1: our hours week after week, even as the volume of 101 00:05:02,720 --> 00:05:05,880 Speaker 1: sales goes up, and so just being like, hey, do 102 00:05:05,920 --> 00:05:09,120 Speaker 1: you want more hours, Like do you feel like it's 103 00:05:09,360 --> 00:05:12,400 Speaker 1: fair for us to be staffed this way, Let's try 104 00:05:12,440 --> 00:05:13,640 Speaker 1: to do something about it. 105 00:05:14,279 --> 00:05:16,360 Speaker 2: Yeah, and the staffing issues, this is one of the 106 00:05:16,400 --> 00:05:19,000 Speaker 2: things we're talking to, I mean just people across sectors. 107 00:05:19,680 --> 00:05:22,080 Speaker 2: It's really one of the it's one of the things 108 00:05:22,080 --> 00:05:25,400 Speaker 2: that's the most obvious if you're working one of these jobs. 109 00:05:25,440 --> 00:05:28,359 Speaker 2: And also somehow it's not something that ever gets talked 110 00:05:28,360 --> 00:05:31,479 Speaker 2: about in the mainstream at all, Like it it's never 111 00:05:31,520 --> 00:05:35,239 Speaker 2: a part of the discourse that you know, you don't 112 00:05:35,279 --> 00:05:37,719 Speaker 2: have a set number of hours that you're going to work. 113 00:05:37,920 --> 00:05:39,839 Speaker 2: You don't know when you're going to work them. And 114 00:05:39,920 --> 00:05:41,640 Speaker 2: also you know, there's no guarantee that you're going to 115 00:05:41,680 --> 00:05:44,800 Speaker 2: get to work enough hours to actually survive. And then 116 00:05:45,400 --> 00:05:49,000 Speaker 2: also the entire condition of labor, like every sector is 117 00:05:49,480 --> 00:05:54,200 Speaker 2: just chronic. It's just chronic underscheduling and chronic understaffing of everything, 118 00:05:54,240 --> 00:05:57,920 Speaker 2: and you know, and that ranges from like coffee shops, 119 00:05:58,040 --> 00:06:01,480 Speaker 2: like hospitals to schools to like everyone has decided that 120 00:06:01,880 --> 00:06:04,240 Speaker 2: the way that you manage things is by by chronically 121 00:06:04,320 --> 00:06:06,760 Speaker 2: overworking everyone and trying to pay people as little as 122 00:06:06,760 --> 00:06:09,720 Speaker 2: possible by not giving them hours. You can talk a 123 00:06:09,760 --> 00:06:12,359 Speaker 2: little bit more about about the kind of the actual 124 00:06:12,400 --> 00:06:14,560 Speaker 2: effects of the understaffing and how that sort of drove 125 00:06:14,640 --> 00:06:15,599 Speaker 2: people into the campaign. 126 00:06:16,480 --> 00:06:19,039 Speaker 1: Yeah, I would be more than happy to. I mean, 127 00:06:19,160 --> 00:06:24,479 Speaker 1: one of the sort of primary catalysts for organizing for 128 00:06:24,560 --> 00:06:29,880 Speaker 1: our shop was the introduction of Uber Eats. So when 129 00:06:30,000 --> 00:06:32,080 Speaker 1: I first started working at the shop, it was around 130 00:06:32,080 --> 00:06:36,640 Speaker 1: two years ago, they had just recently introduced door Dash, 131 00:06:36,839 --> 00:06:40,200 Speaker 1: so previously, you know, obviously it started it was just 132 00:06:40,240 --> 00:06:42,719 Speaker 1: a cafe people would come in and get their coffee. 133 00:06:43,160 --> 00:06:46,400 Speaker 1: Later on they ended up introducing mobile orders through pete 134 00:06:46,440 --> 00:06:51,120 Speaker 1: Zone ordering system, and then when the pandemic hit initially 135 00:06:51,320 --> 00:06:54,960 Speaker 1: and everything locked down, they started doing door dash to 136 00:06:55,040 --> 00:06:59,279 Speaker 1: try to continue having a revenue stream. Now, after more 137 00:06:59,320 --> 00:07:02,640 Speaker 1: things started open up, they open the shop up again. Obviously, 138 00:07:02,680 --> 00:07:05,760 Speaker 1: they continued to have door Dash because it brings in 139 00:07:05,800 --> 00:07:10,000 Speaker 1: a lot of revenue for them, and then without really 140 00:07:10,040 --> 00:07:14,160 Speaker 1: any fore warning and certainly without any increase in staffing 141 00:07:14,280 --> 00:07:18,160 Speaker 1: for us, they introduced uberre eats, which is a similar 142 00:07:18,320 --> 00:07:22,720 Speaker 1: amount of volume increase, a similar amount of orders increase 143 00:07:23,000 --> 00:07:27,040 Speaker 1: as door Dash, Like we're probably getting at peak like 144 00:07:27,640 --> 00:07:32,160 Speaker 1: thirty forty drinks per hour in addition to what we're 145 00:07:32,160 --> 00:07:35,920 Speaker 1: getting in store from door Dash and uber eats. 146 00:07:36,360 --> 00:07:40,880 Speaker 2: That's a drink every like subtube minutes, yeah, Jesus. 147 00:07:41,120 --> 00:07:45,920 Speaker 1: And we are expected to crank these out at less 148 00:07:45,960 --> 00:07:49,560 Speaker 1: than three minutes in order, and that's per order, So 149 00:07:49,640 --> 00:07:52,960 Speaker 1: an order might have like five drinks if it's DoorDash 150 00:07:53,040 --> 00:07:56,120 Speaker 1: or uber eats, where in particular, people will order a 151 00:07:56,120 --> 00:07:59,080 Speaker 1: lot of things at a time, because it seems like 152 00:07:59,600 --> 00:08:02,880 Speaker 1: using these sort of apps and stuff, people will order 153 00:08:03,520 --> 00:08:07,320 Speaker 1: much more egregious things, much larger orders than they do 154 00:08:07,760 --> 00:08:11,680 Speaker 1: when they're in store. And so everyone's really annoyed about 155 00:08:11,720 --> 00:08:13,880 Speaker 1: this just like, Okay, all of a sudden, we have 156 00:08:13,920 --> 00:08:16,360 Speaker 1: all this extra work to do. They're not increasing our 157 00:08:16,360 --> 00:08:16,960 Speaker 1: hours at all. 158 00:08:17,280 --> 00:08:19,360 Speaker 2: You're not getting paid more either, well. 159 00:08:19,240 --> 00:08:21,760 Speaker 1: Certainly not. And we don't get tips from that either. 160 00:08:21,920 --> 00:08:23,520 Speaker 2: Oh Jesus, you don't get tipped from me? 161 00:08:23,640 --> 00:08:23,880 Speaker 1: No? 162 00:08:23,880 --> 00:08:25,800 Speaker 2: No, I mean like, wait, oh, the chips all go 163 00:08:25,800 --> 00:08:26,480 Speaker 2: to the drivers. 164 00:08:26,560 --> 00:08:30,840 Speaker 1: Jesus Christ, I won't. Like, that's not a bad thing. 165 00:08:31,160 --> 00:08:32,600 Speaker 2: For the drivers, but you should get paid too. 166 00:08:33,040 --> 00:08:35,640 Speaker 1: But it's like Uber who's taking the vast majority of 167 00:08:35,720 --> 00:08:38,840 Speaker 1: the money from that and piece and so us and 168 00:08:38,880 --> 00:08:42,000 Speaker 1: the drivers are both getting screwed over by this. Yeah, 169 00:08:42,040 --> 00:08:44,240 Speaker 1: but we both have to do all the sextraneous work. 170 00:08:44,679 --> 00:08:49,160 Speaker 1: So people were super fucking irritated about that, myself included 171 00:08:49,240 --> 00:08:52,880 Speaker 1: for sure. And that really got people going with like, Okay, 172 00:08:52,880 --> 00:08:55,240 Speaker 1: what are we going to do about this? How can 173 00:08:55,280 --> 00:08:58,520 Speaker 1: we try to push them to staff us better? Yeah, 174 00:08:58,559 --> 00:09:01,920 Speaker 1: And it seems like the incentive struckures for these delivery 175 00:09:01,960 --> 00:09:05,800 Speaker 1: services add up really badly in terms of like the 176 00:09:05,800 --> 00:09:07,680 Speaker 1: way that incenters people to order, because you know, you 177 00:09:07,720 --> 00:09:11,080 Speaker 1: have these like minimums on the amount of like stuff 178 00:09:11,120 --> 00:09:13,160 Speaker 1: you have to order to get below like there's all 179 00:09:13,160 --> 00:09:15,240 Speaker 1: this you know, all those like threshold stuff of like 180 00:09:15,679 --> 00:09:17,720 Speaker 1: if you do this, you get free delivery. You spend 181 00:09:17,720 --> 00:09:19,160 Speaker 1: this much, you get blah blah blah blah blah, and 182 00:09:19,200 --> 00:09:21,720 Speaker 1: so that. Yeah, it seems like the sort of perfect 183 00:09:21,760 --> 00:09:27,600 Speaker 1: Mailstrom for producing even more work. Yeah. And I will 184 00:09:27,640 --> 00:09:32,400 Speaker 1: say this is that they like to push out promotions 185 00:09:32,440 --> 00:09:34,680 Speaker 1: to people of like buy one, get one free, that 186 00:09:34,800 --> 00:09:40,200 Speaker 1: sort of thing for like our PiZZ location constantly, and 187 00:09:40,240 --> 00:09:43,160 Speaker 1: they they never tell us about it. So, you know, 188 00:09:43,240 --> 00:09:46,400 Speaker 1: one day, we'll just be getting like five large mochas 189 00:09:46,440 --> 00:09:48,160 Speaker 1: and like six different orders, and we're like, why are 190 00:09:48,160 --> 00:09:50,480 Speaker 1: we getting five large mochas and all of these orders, 191 00:09:50,679 --> 00:09:52,880 Speaker 1: And someone pulls up the door Dash app and they're like, oh, 192 00:09:52,920 --> 00:09:55,320 Speaker 1: it's because there's like a half off if you get 193 00:09:55,320 --> 00:09:58,640 Speaker 1: more than four mochas or you know something like that. 194 00:09:59,040 --> 00:10:01,360 Speaker 1: It's just like, we never hear about this until it's 195 00:10:01,400 --> 00:10:04,400 Speaker 1: actually happening. Yeah. And that's the case both for door 196 00:10:04,480 --> 00:10:08,720 Speaker 1: Dash newber Eats, but also for just like internal pizza promotions, 197 00:10:08,840 --> 00:10:10,840 Speaker 1: Like we tend not to hear about any of these 198 00:10:10,880 --> 00:10:14,480 Speaker 1: things until we are on the shop floor working and 199 00:10:14,559 --> 00:10:17,240 Speaker 1: people are asking us about it. Customers are asking us 200 00:10:17,240 --> 00:10:17,640 Speaker 1: about it. 201 00:10:17,960 --> 00:10:22,000 Speaker 2: Yeah, it seems like the way that the integration of 202 00:10:22,040 --> 00:10:25,480 Speaker 2: these apps into these business models is working. As it's 203 00:10:25,520 --> 00:10:28,280 Speaker 2: just every every single thing they do just compounds the 204 00:10:28,320 --> 00:10:30,720 Speaker 2: amount of work you have to do and compounds how 205 00:10:30,760 --> 00:10:34,400 Speaker 2: awful the experience is, and speak speaking about how awful 206 00:10:34,400 --> 00:10:38,040 Speaker 2: the experience is. Unfortunately, we are a podcast sponsored by ads, 207 00:10:38,280 --> 00:10:41,360 Speaker 2: so go experience them or don't. I don't know. There's 208 00:10:41,360 --> 00:10:43,400 Speaker 2: a if you have Apple, there's a there's a thing 209 00:10:43,440 --> 00:10:44,920 Speaker 2: you can get called cold as that media where you 210 00:10:44,920 --> 00:10:49,280 Speaker 2: don't have ads. De Android one. I don't even know 211 00:10:49,320 --> 00:10:51,160 Speaker 2: what I'm legally allowed to say about that shit, but 212 00:10:51,240 --> 00:10:53,559 Speaker 2: oh my god, it is the biggest legal clusterfuck I've 213 00:10:53,559 --> 00:10:55,840 Speaker 2: ever seen in my entire life. We're gonna leave it 214 00:10:55,840 --> 00:11:03,360 Speaker 2: at there, but we'll try it. We're doing our best. 215 00:11:08,640 --> 00:11:13,520 Speaker 2: We are so back. Yeah, so let's go into other 216 00:11:13,600 --> 00:11:14,840 Speaker 2: of their buried crimes. 217 00:11:15,240 --> 00:11:16,680 Speaker 3: Oh man, where do I even start? 218 00:11:17,120 --> 00:11:20,240 Speaker 4: So Pete, the second they found out that we were organizing, 219 00:11:21,160 --> 00:11:24,079 Speaker 4: launched like their worst union busting campaign they could have 220 00:11:24,120 --> 00:11:27,000 Speaker 4: ever imagined, wasting so much money. 221 00:11:27,240 --> 00:11:28,199 Speaker 2: Oh god. 222 00:11:28,400 --> 00:11:31,679 Speaker 4: Right after we went public, the first big thing that 223 00:11:31,720 --> 00:11:34,360 Speaker 4: they messed up on was they took me off the 224 00:11:34,400 --> 00:11:37,720 Speaker 4: schedule indefinitely and we had to like foule a whole 225 00:11:37,800 --> 00:11:39,240 Speaker 4: unfair labor practice about it. 226 00:11:39,880 --> 00:11:41,520 Speaker 3: An unfair labor practice is a. 227 00:11:41,600 --> 00:11:45,320 Speaker 4: Charge with the National Labor Relations Board, and we claimed 228 00:11:45,360 --> 00:11:48,360 Speaker 4: that they were being retaliatory. And at the time it 229 00:11:48,400 --> 00:11:51,960 Speaker 4: was very clear that management thought I was a key organizer. 230 00:11:52,000 --> 00:11:54,240 Speaker 4: I was very public and vocal about being a union 231 00:11:54,280 --> 00:11:57,240 Speaker 4: member at the time, everyone was. But for some reason 232 00:11:57,280 --> 00:12:00,640 Speaker 4: they signaled me out. That was one part of how 233 00:12:00,640 --> 00:12:02,480 Speaker 4: they messed up. But they eventually put me back on 234 00:12:02,480 --> 00:12:04,680 Speaker 4: the schedule, apologize, gave me back pay. 235 00:12:04,880 --> 00:12:06,199 Speaker 3: Oh yeah, and we withdrew that. 236 00:12:06,920 --> 00:12:09,040 Speaker 4: We withdrew the ULPE because they're like, all right, I 237 00:12:09,040 --> 00:12:10,400 Speaker 4: guess it fixed itself. 238 00:12:11,080 --> 00:12:13,200 Speaker 2: Yeah, that's the thing that happens. By the way, like 239 00:12:13,640 --> 00:12:15,920 Speaker 2: if you're submitting an o fair labor practice and the 240 00:12:16,000 --> 00:12:19,320 Speaker 2: company resolves it, you don't actually have to. And this 241 00:12:19,360 --> 00:12:21,480 Speaker 2: is actually one of the things about up sometimes is 242 00:12:21,520 --> 00:12:25,559 Speaker 2: that like neither you nor your employer wants to go 243 00:12:25,640 --> 00:12:29,120 Speaker 2: sit in front of the National Labor Relations Board and 244 00:12:29,280 --> 00:12:32,120 Speaker 2: like do a whole thing. So like sometimes you can 245 00:12:32,160 --> 00:12:34,320 Speaker 2: get them to resolve it just by like just by 246 00:12:34,360 --> 00:12:36,040 Speaker 2: the thread of it, and then you don't actually have 247 00:12:36,080 --> 00:12:37,600 Speaker 2: to go sit in front of the Natural Labor relations 248 00:12:37,640 --> 00:12:39,440 Speaker 2: board because they've done the thing they're supposed to do. 249 00:12:40,160 --> 00:12:42,200 Speaker 2: So note for all you people out there who are 250 00:12:42,200 --> 00:12:44,040 Speaker 2: considering file like one piece. 251 00:12:44,200 --> 00:12:46,040 Speaker 4: Yeah, I know, just stack them up and sometimes that's 252 00:12:46,160 --> 00:12:50,360 Speaker 4: enough to put pressure, especially for smaller businesses or people 253 00:12:50,360 --> 00:12:53,360 Speaker 4: who just like especially corporations that don't necessarily have experience 254 00:12:53,400 --> 00:12:56,080 Speaker 4: of union investing quite yet. Yeah, So at the time, 255 00:12:56,080 --> 00:12:58,600 Speaker 4: that worked, and within a week I had my drop 256 00:12:58,679 --> 00:13:01,600 Speaker 4: back and everything, And that was right after we had filed, 257 00:13:01,640 --> 00:13:04,360 Speaker 4: which meant that if for some reason I wasn't put 258 00:13:04,400 --> 00:13:06,960 Speaker 4: back on the schedule, I would have been gone leading 259 00:13:07,040 --> 00:13:09,280 Speaker 4: up until the election, which would have been really bad 260 00:13:09,320 --> 00:13:11,440 Speaker 4: in terms of you know, having those one on ones 261 00:13:11,480 --> 00:13:14,559 Speaker 4: with coworkers making sure everyone was connected. 262 00:13:15,200 --> 00:13:17,080 Speaker 2: I just I just want to mention here, like, it 263 00:13:17,200 --> 00:13:20,400 Speaker 2: is illegal to fire someone for union organizing, Like it's 264 00:13:20,440 --> 00:13:24,280 Speaker 2: not the most easily enforced thing, but they legally cannot 265 00:13:24,280 --> 00:13:27,440 Speaker 2: do that. So just note for all the people who 266 00:13:27,480 --> 00:13:29,800 Speaker 2: are listening to unte episodes for the first time, they 267 00:13:29,880 --> 00:13:32,040 Speaker 2: can't do that. And if they do it, you can, 268 00:13:32,160 --> 00:13:34,679 Speaker 2: you can launch campaigns and you can sort of force 269 00:13:34,720 --> 00:13:37,160 Speaker 2: them to do it. But yeah, just this is the 270 00:13:37,240 --> 00:13:39,360 Speaker 2: mea labor note of the episode. 271 00:13:39,720 --> 00:13:42,880 Speaker 4: Yeah, no, and I think especially something that's very IWW 272 00:13:43,040 --> 00:13:45,920 Speaker 4: of how we reacted to that situation was that my 273 00:13:46,080 --> 00:13:48,679 Speaker 4: coworkers were also just like being really like annoying to 274 00:13:48,720 --> 00:13:51,480 Speaker 4: the manager and being like, what happened to Dino? Why 275 00:13:51,480 --> 00:13:54,840 Speaker 4: aren't they at work? Like what's going on? And I 276 00:13:54,840 --> 00:13:57,360 Speaker 4: think that internal pressure also made it really uncomfortable for 277 00:13:57,440 --> 00:14:00,200 Speaker 4: management to realize how much that had fucked up, how 278 00:14:00,240 --> 00:14:02,840 Speaker 4: much my coworkers were willing to have my back. There's 279 00:14:02,880 --> 00:14:06,400 Speaker 4: definitely more talk of like actual direct action in other 280 00:14:06,480 --> 00:14:10,520 Speaker 4: ways that eventually like we actually didn't do because I 281 00:14:10,559 --> 00:14:13,480 Speaker 4: got my my hours back, so that was really good. 282 00:14:13,720 --> 00:14:14,880 Speaker 2: Yeah. 283 00:14:14,400 --> 00:14:14,600 Speaker 1: Yeah. 284 00:14:14,920 --> 00:14:17,880 Speaker 4: And then yeah, so that was still within the first 285 00:14:18,200 --> 00:14:21,880 Speaker 4: few weeks of when we filed our paperwork to have 286 00:14:21,960 --> 00:14:25,640 Speaker 4: an election with the NLRB to be a certified shop 287 00:14:25,920 --> 00:14:29,040 Speaker 4: according to the government. Not that that's always important, Yeah, 288 00:14:29,120 --> 00:14:29,920 Speaker 4: that's something that we. 289 00:14:29,920 --> 00:14:33,640 Speaker 2: Wanted, especially as regime unfolds. Yeah. 290 00:14:33,840 --> 00:14:37,560 Speaker 4: Yeah, No, it's really it's a really tough position, especially 291 00:14:37,600 --> 00:14:40,680 Speaker 4: because I mean, we're we're IWW members, and I know 292 00:14:40,760 --> 00:14:43,360 Speaker 4: that there's definitely an internal debate of whether or not, 293 00:14:43,400 --> 00:14:46,880 Speaker 4: you know, contractual agreements versus direct action, but there's always 294 00:14:47,040 --> 00:14:50,440 Speaker 4: the options to both a combination divers the fire tactics. 295 00:14:50,920 --> 00:14:56,320 Speaker 4: But yeah, so that happened. They also hired a union buster. 296 00:14:56,280 --> 00:14:57,040 Speaker 2: Of course they did. 297 00:14:57,200 --> 00:15:01,080 Speaker 4: Now according to LM reports from the government that they 298 00:15:01,080 --> 00:15:03,680 Speaker 4: have to file, they spent over one hundred thousand dollars 299 00:15:03,720 --> 00:15:06,160 Speaker 4: in like a span of like two weeks to hire 300 00:15:06,160 --> 00:15:07,000 Speaker 4: this union investor. 301 00:15:07,680 --> 00:15:09,840 Speaker 2: And it wasn't the way. 302 00:15:09,880 --> 00:15:12,960 Speaker 4: And it's like a report that you file with the 303 00:15:13,280 --> 00:15:15,920 Speaker 4: I think forgetting which department it is. 304 00:15:15,760 --> 00:15:21,200 Speaker 1: But is it the OLM, the Office of Labor and Management. 305 00:15:21,000 --> 00:15:23,840 Speaker 4: Think you Yeah, So they are required to file that 306 00:15:24,040 --> 00:15:27,160 Speaker 4: by I think March thirtieth of the following year for 307 00:15:27,200 --> 00:15:31,080 Speaker 4: like fiscal reasons. So we finally got those documents this 308 00:15:31,240 --> 00:15:34,960 Speaker 4: previous year. So they did spend a lot of money. 309 00:15:35,000 --> 00:15:39,000 Speaker 4: And this guy who is just basically messing with us 310 00:15:39,040 --> 00:15:43,160 Speaker 4: for like two weeks, and he was, you know, trying 311 00:15:43,200 --> 00:15:46,200 Speaker 4: to be super helpful answer any questions about the union 312 00:15:46,480 --> 00:15:49,680 Speaker 4: and like tell people that the union was you know, 313 00:15:49,760 --> 00:15:53,160 Speaker 4: like racist, not for them, or that the union was exclusionary, 314 00:15:53,280 --> 00:15:56,600 Speaker 4: or that unions cost a lot of money. And thankfully 315 00:15:56,640 --> 00:15:59,080 Speaker 4: that didn't work. We won all of our elections, but 316 00:15:59,320 --> 00:16:04,080 Speaker 4: leading up to them, it definitely kind of morale dropped 317 00:16:04,120 --> 00:16:09,120 Speaker 4: a lot. People felt a little bit they were questioning 318 00:16:09,200 --> 00:16:11,320 Speaker 4: whether or not it was the right decision we made 319 00:16:11,320 --> 00:16:13,360 Speaker 4: to unionize in their first place, because it seemed like 320 00:16:13,360 --> 00:16:16,720 Speaker 4: this was just the start of Pete's just messing with 321 00:16:16,840 --> 00:16:19,440 Speaker 4: us because they care on and it didn't seem like 322 00:16:19,480 --> 00:16:20,960 Speaker 4: there was much that we could have done in that 323 00:16:21,000 --> 00:16:24,400 Speaker 4: situation other than try to maybe have fun with the 324 00:16:24,480 --> 00:16:25,880 Speaker 4: union buster and mess with him. 325 00:16:25,960 --> 00:16:28,080 Speaker 3: But even then that still wasn't like. 326 00:16:28,160 --> 00:16:31,520 Speaker 4: Enough to kind of out the fact that like people 327 00:16:31,520 --> 00:16:33,360 Speaker 4: were just being messed with at work and they couldn't 328 00:16:33,360 --> 00:16:35,800 Speaker 4: literally leave, like there was someone like on the floor 329 00:16:35,840 --> 00:16:39,280 Speaker 4: asking them questions about their you know, activity. 330 00:16:38,800 --> 00:16:39,400 Speaker 3: With the union. 331 00:16:39,600 --> 00:16:42,200 Speaker 4: And even though now we know it's like illegal and 332 00:16:42,240 --> 00:16:45,080 Speaker 4: we could have filed unfairly were practices on that at 333 00:16:45,120 --> 00:16:46,920 Speaker 4: the time, we just didn't do it. 334 00:16:47,200 --> 00:16:48,400 Speaker 3: And now we're learning about it. 335 00:16:48,440 --> 00:16:51,280 Speaker 4: But that's something I definitely wish we knew and stood 336 00:16:51,320 --> 00:16:52,240 Speaker 4: up for a little bit more. 337 00:16:52,720 --> 00:16:54,800 Speaker 2: Yeah, did you tell a little bit about what the 338 00:16:54,840 --> 00:16:57,680 Speaker 2: specific thing was, so that if people are like experiencing 339 00:16:57,760 --> 00:17:00,040 Speaker 2: it themselves, they can know what they can do. 340 00:17:00,720 --> 00:17:05,080 Speaker 4: Yeah, So management shouldn't be asking for your like affiliation 341 00:17:05,200 --> 00:17:07,679 Speaker 4: within like a union. They're not allowed to ask or 342 00:17:07,720 --> 00:17:10,920 Speaker 4: make assumptions about it, So like if I'm a manager, 343 00:17:11,000 --> 00:17:13,119 Speaker 4: I'm not allowed to like go up to me and 344 00:17:13,160 --> 00:17:15,520 Speaker 4: be like, hey, do you know, like since you're in 345 00:17:15,560 --> 00:17:17,600 Speaker 4: the union, like what is the union. 346 00:17:17,400 --> 00:17:19,679 Speaker 3: Doing about X, Y and Z? Like that's not an 347 00:17:19,720 --> 00:17:20,560 Speaker 3: appropriate question. 348 00:17:20,800 --> 00:17:23,800 Speaker 4: And there's definitely times where, like my own manager asked 349 00:17:23,840 --> 00:17:26,480 Speaker 4: me questions like that and I definitely had to like, hey, 350 00:17:26,560 --> 00:17:28,760 Speaker 4: like this is actually like not appropriate for you to do, 351 00:17:29,040 --> 00:17:32,040 Speaker 4: Like I don't feel comfortable with this. But that's not 352 00:17:32,080 --> 00:17:35,840 Speaker 4: always the case, and some workers definitely were like disclosing 353 00:17:36,080 --> 00:17:39,320 Speaker 4: private and confidential information about the union to management, and 354 00:17:39,359 --> 00:17:42,399 Speaker 4: it was really hard to make sure that every worker 355 00:17:42,440 --> 00:17:46,360 Speaker 4: felt comfortable. And they definitely picked out workers based on 356 00:17:46,600 --> 00:17:49,560 Speaker 4: you know, like social like personalities and things like that, 357 00:17:49,600 --> 00:17:52,000 Speaker 4: which is really disheartening to see. 358 00:17:52,280 --> 00:17:55,280 Speaker 2: Yeah, really scummy. And I think morale is a traadeous 359 00:17:55,280 --> 00:17:57,440 Speaker 2: struggle and that's one of the things here too, where 360 00:17:57,440 --> 00:18:00,640 Speaker 2: it's like a lot of these efforts are just attempts 361 00:18:00,680 --> 00:18:03,399 Speaker 2: to make everyone in a workplace miserable and to make 362 00:18:03,400 --> 00:18:05,760 Speaker 2: people sort of too depressed and too despondent to sort 363 00:18:05,760 --> 00:18:07,200 Speaker 2: of organize, and a lot of that. Yeah, again, it 364 00:18:07,240 --> 00:18:08,879 Speaker 2: is like it's stuff you can organize against and stuff 365 00:18:08,880 --> 00:18:12,159 Speaker 2: that like they're not allowed to do and whether or 366 00:18:12,200 --> 00:18:13,720 Speaker 2: not they're going to be able to do it. It 367 00:18:13,880 --> 00:18:18,040 Speaker 2: is a function of labor regulation, and labor law is 368 00:18:18,040 --> 00:18:19,920 Speaker 2: not something that's enforced by the government. It's something that's 369 00:18:19,960 --> 00:18:22,560 Speaker 2: enforced by you, as enforced by the people around you. 370 00:18:23,119 --> 00:18:25,840 Speaker 2: And so you know, like the law can sometimes help 371 00:18:25,880 --> 00:18:29,280 Speaker 2: and sometimes dozens. It's useful to cite to management. It's 372 00:18:29,359 --> 00:18:31,280 Speaker 2: useful because it makes them think that there's like the 373 00:18:31,320 --> 00:18:33,439 Speaker 2: full power of the state behind you or whatever. But 374 00:18:33,560 --> 00:18:36,879 Speaker 2: like in terms of how you deal with this stuff, 375 00:18:36,920 --> 00:18:38,880 Speaker 2: it is something that is enforced by you and by 376 00:18:38,880 --> 00:18:40,880 Speaker 2: how organized you are, and by how organized your shop 377 00:18:40,880 --> 00:18:43,000 Speaker 2: floor is, and by how who organize your community is. 378 00:18:43,400 --> 00:18:44,919 Speaker 2: And that's something that's I think important for people to 379 00:18:44,960 --> 00:18:47,600 Speaker 2: understand when you're forming your own unions, which you should 380 00:18:47,600 --> 00:18:50,240 Speaker 2: also go do because you can just do it. I 381 00:18:50,280 --> 00:18:52,040 Speaker 2: said it before and I'll say it again, Like the 382 00:18:52,040 --> 00:18:54,200 Speaker 2: people who organize unions are just regular. 383 00:18:53,880 --> 00:18:57,240 Speaker 1: People like you person, dear listener, So you can do 384 00:18:57,320 --> 00:18:59,560 Speaker 1: this too. What they say it's like a union is 385 00:18:59,640 --> 00:19:03,760 Speaker 1: just to workers talking to each other. Yeah, and yeah, 386 00:19:04,040 --> 00:19:06,840 Speaker 1: just to expand on that point, a little bit. Like 387 00:19:06,880 --> 00:19:11,960 Speaker 1: the NLRB is quite understaffed, and it will be more 388 00:19:12,160 --> 00:19:17,879 Speaker 1: understaffed almost certainly as the Trump administration, you know, gets 389 00:19:17,920 --> 00:19:22,440 Speaker 1: deeper into gutting the entirety of the government. It already 390 00:19:22,480 --> 00:19:27,240 Speaker 1: takes months, two years to get unfair labor practice filings 391 00:19:27,320 --> 00:19:32,080 Speaker 1: resolved for the NLRB to do most things. So that 392 00:19:32,200 --> 00:19:37,600 Speaker 1: is a core tenet of the IWW is actually taking 393 00:19:37,680 --> 00:19:42,520 Speaker 1: action on the shop floor. Yeah, Like that is the 394 00:19:43,000 --> 00:19:47,040 Speaker 1: key aspect to unionism as a whole. And I think 395 00:19:47,119 --> 00:19:49,360 Speaker 1: one of the great parts about the IWW is that 396 00:19:49,840 --> 00:19:54,560 Speaker 1: it actually acknowledges that the power comes from the workers. 397 00:19:54,760 --> 00:19:58,199 Speaker 1: It doesn't come from laws. The laws only came because 398 00:19:58,280 --> 00:20:00,720 Speaker 1: workers were pushing for things on the shop floor in 399 00:20:00,760 --> 00:20:03,359 Speaker 1: the first place. So it's like, let's get back to 400 00:20:03,440 --> 00:20:04,000 Speaker 1: the root of that. 401 00:20:04,720 --> 00:20:06,720 Speaker 2: Yeah, Like the NLRB, We've talked about this on the 402 00:20:06,760 --> 00:20:09,199 Speaker 2: ship before, but the National Labor Relations Act, I think 403 00:20:09,200 --> 00:20:12,440 Speaker 2: that the established National Labor Relations Board like that that 404 00:20:12,640 --> 00:20:16,720 Speaker 2: was part of effectively like a truce that was enforced 405 00:20:16,920 --> 00:20:19,800 Speaker 2: by by the government because as a way to have 406 00:20:19,880 --> 00:20:22,600 Speaker 2: like labor unions stop being armed and stop getting into 407 00:20:22,640 --> 00:20:26,400 Speaker 2: shootouts with bosses. So yeah, it is as as as 408 00:20:26,400 --> 00:20:28,639 Speaker 2: this framework comes apart, it is important to remember like 409 00:20:29,280 --> 00:20:31,520 Speaker 2: why we had this in the first place, which was 410 00:20:32,240 --> 00:20:35,760 Speaker 2: union militias would occasionally start, like small scale civil wars 411 00:20:35,840 --> 00:20:38,800 Speaker 2: in the US with bosses over stuff, people in shoot 412 00:20:38,800 --> 00:20:41,600 Speaker 2: canons at each other, and we're sort of distant from 413 00:20:41,640 --> 00:20:43,720 Speaker 2: that period. But there's also another thing about direct action, 414 00:20:43,800 --> 00:20:47,439 Speaker 2: which is that, yeah, it's hard to organize, but also 415 00:20:48,560 --> 00:20:51,479 Speaker 2: like quite frankly, with the way that the NLRB is 416 00:20:51,520 --> 00:20:54,200 Speaker 2: functioning right now, like the time to organize that A 417 00:20:54,359 --> 00:20:56,000 Speaker 2: makes a union better and B is going to be 418 00:20:56,040 --> 00:20:59,760 Speaker 2: faster than the NLRB right now. So yeah, this is 419 00:20:59,800 --> 00:21:03,119 Speaker 2: this is this is your practical We have your ideological pitch. 420 00:21:03,160 --> 00:21:05,560 Speaker 2: We have your practical pitch for direct action, which is 421 00:21:05,560 --> 00:21:08,760 Speaker 2: that it's quick. Unfortunately, the other thing that's quick is 422 00:21:08,800 --> 00:21:23,600 Speaker 2: the approach of this AD break. Here's ads. We are back. 423 00:21:25,160 --> 00:21:28,359 Speaker 2: So let's talk about sort of what's happening right now 424 00:21:28,560 --> 00:21:31,160 Speaker 2: with the union, how things are going, and what management 425 00:21:31,240 --> 00:21:32,000 Speaker 2: has been doing. 426 00:21:32,480 --> 00:21:36,000 Speaker 1: Yeah, so right now, I mean we're dealing with a 427 00:21:36,000 --> 00:21:40,399 Speaker 1: lot of the same issues as we have been dealing with. 428 00:21:40,600 --> 00:21:44,560 Speaker 1: The staffing issue is only continuing to be worse. 429 00:21:44,880 --> 00:21:45,080 Speaker 4: Right. 430 00:21:45,680 --> 00:21:47,119 Speaker 1: One of the things that we are trying to get. 431 00:21:47,160 --> 00:21:50,359 Speaker 1: Initially is schedules further out right, now we get them 432 00:21:50,400 --> 00:21:55,520 Speaker 1: two weeks out, more consistent scheduling, more scheduling, obviously better wages, 433 00:21:56,840 --> 00:22:00,080 Speaker 1: better benefits, you know, all of these sort of things, 434 00:22:00,119 --> 00:22:05,000 Speaker 1: and those are only continuing to get worse, and so 435 00:22:05,600 --> 00:22:10,200 Speaker 1: we are continuing to try to think about tactics strategies 436 00:22:10,760 --> 00:22:14,520 Speaker 1: to counter that right to give us more power. So 437 00:22:14,760 --> 00:22:18,879 Speaker 1: we're both doing direct actions and trying to push for 438 00:22:18,920 --> 00:22:23,680 Speaker 1: a contract right now. Now. One of the big difficulties 439 00:22:24,280 --> 00:22:28,199 Speaker 1: is that Pizza has basically hired this law firm to 440 00:22:28,359 --> 00:22:32,480 Speaker 1: do the contract negotiations on their behalf, and the law 441 00:22:32,520 --> 00:22:37,040 Speaker 1: firm is basically stonewalling us, like they are responding to 442 00:22:37,080 --> 00:22:40,640 Speaker 1: the emails, but basically by just kicking the can down 443 00:22:40,640 --> 00:22:45,280 Speaker 1: the road yep, yep, and trying to not actually come 444 00:22:45,359 --> 00:22:48,919 Speaker 1: to the bargaining table. And so it's this very frustrating 445 00:22:48,960 --> 00:22:52,359 Speaker 1: thing of like how do we actually get them to 446 00:22:52,359 --> 00:22:56,240 Speaker 1: come to the bargaining table. And that's definitely still something 447 00:22:56,280 --> 00:23:00,000 Speaker 1: that we're wrestling with and that we're working on. Yeah, 448 00:23:00,000 --> 00:23:01,320 Speaker 1: don't know if you have any more to add to that, 449 00:23:01,400 --> 00:23:01,639 Speaker 1: do you know? 450 00:23:02,800 --> 00:23:05,720 Speaker 4: Yeah, I no, I think another thing that's kind of 451 00:23:05,760 --> 00:23:08,520 Speaker 4: on everyone's mind is that a group of us got 452 00:23:08,560 --> 00:23:11,880 Speaker 4: ridden up for another direct action that we did back 453 00:23:11,920 --> 00:23:15,280 Speaker 4: in October, and then we got ridden up like the 454 00:23:15,280 --> 00:23:19,080 Speaker 4: week of Thanksgiving and holidays and finals for most of 455 00:23:19,160 --> 00:23:23,320 Speaker 4: us that were students, so that kind of just dropped 456 00:23:23,320 --> 00:23:26,880 Speaker 4: morale and activity. And because of the holidays, people were 457 00:23:27,040 --> 00:23:31,200 Speaker 4: either kind of not paying attention or just organizing. Activity 458 00:23:31,240 --> 00:23:33,119 Speaker 4: tends to just drop during no holidays. 459 00:23:33,200 --> 00:23:34,879 Speaker 2: Yeah, people are just a little bit of checks out. 460 00:23:34,960 --> 00:23:37,919 Speaker 4: Yeah, people check out, People go home, and especially for 461 00:23:38,040 --> 00:23:41,520 Speaker 4: like us in like food service, retail, like a lot 462 00:23:41,520 --> 00:23:44,280 Speaker 4: of people are kind of just like around for school. 463 00:23:44,520 --> 00:23:47,239 Speaker 4: So my location were like a few blocks away from 464 00:23:47,320 --> 00:23:49,639 Speaker 4: UC Berkeley, so most of the students like go home 465 00:23:49,760 --> 00:23:52,560 Speaker 4: and they're not going to like log into zoom for 466 00:23:52,720 --> 00:23:55,919 Speaker 4: thirty minute union meeting and like hear what's like you know, 467 00:23:55,960 --> 00:23:58,880 Speaker 4: the most recent like check ins that we need to do. 468 00:23:58,960 --> 00:24:02,040 Speaker 4: So that is a little bit frustrating that Pet's definitely 469 00:24:02,280 --> 00:24:04,560 Speaker 4: wrote us up right at the perfect time that where 470 00:24:04,640 --> 00:24:08,359 Speaker 4: activity kind of drops. So they're adapting, they're learning a 471 00:24:08,400 --> 00:24:11,240 Speaker 4: little bit more, and it's kind of it's really frustrating. 472 00:24:11,240 --> 00:24:13,280 Speaker 4: But yeah, I know a group of us, including me 473 00:24:13,400 --> 00:24:16,840 Speaker 4: got ridden up for something, and it was just a 474 00:24:16,840 --> 00:24:21,119 Speaker 4: blanket discipline and it started restricting all of our abilities 475 00:24:21,119 --> 00:24:25,480 Speaker 4: to cover shifts, to swap shifts, to pick up hours, 476 00:24:25,520 --> 00:24:29,800 Speaker 4: to call out, and they restrict everything so badly, and 477 00:24:29,840 --> 00:24:34,000 Speaker 4: then are also like final warnings and there's no like 478 00:24:34,560 --> 00:24:38,200 Speaker 4: period in which all these made up rules that they're 479 00:24:38,200 --> 00:24:41,080 Speaker 4: making kind of end. I'm just like waiting to hear 480 00:24:41,119 --> 00:24:44,160 Speaker 4: when my manager decides to like stop punishing me, which 481 00:24:44,240 --> 00:24:48,439 Speaker 4: is like obviously very personal. And that's like really worries 482 00:24:48,480 --> 00:24:51,920 Speaker 4: some because we tried to file agreements with pets. According 483 00:24:51,960 --> 00:24:54,920 Speaker 4: to what they told us, all our district managers were like, yeah, 484 00:24:54,960 --> 00:24:57,560 Speaker 4: file agreements with HR, we'll discuss it there. 485 00:24:57,600 --> 00:24:58,479 Speaker 3: And then we did that. 486 00:24:59,080 --> 00:25:03,200 Speaker 4: We filed agreements, we all signed on and then management 487 00:25:03,240 --> 00:25:05,480 Speaker 4: turned around and was like, actually, you haven't bargained for 488 00:25:05,520 --> 00:25:07,919 Speaker 4: a grievance procedure, so we actually don't care about this 489 00:25:08,000 --> 00:25:11,919 Speaker 4: and unless it's legally mandated, we won't listen to you. Yeah, 490 00:25:12,040 --> 00:25:14,919 Speaker 4: so now we're again stuck between like we want to bargain, 491 00:25:15,000 --> 00:25:16,600 Speaker 4: we want to go to the table, we want to 492 00:25:16,640 --> 00:25:20,480 Speaker 4: meet with Pete's, but they are creating these made up 493 00:25:20,560 --> 00:25:23,480 Speaker 4: rules on how they want to bargain and meet with us, 494 00:25:23,640 --> 00:25:28,520 Speaker 4: and they're unwilling to cooperate with us. There's like five 495 00:25:28,560 --> 00:25:31,360 Speaker 4: public shops and they're like not willing to meet with us. 496 00:25:31,359 --> 00:25:34,240 Speaker 4: At the same time, that actually makes no sense. We 497 00:25:34,280 --> 00:25:36,560 Speaker 4: have like the same bargaining team members for all our shops. 498 00:25:36,600 --> 00:25:39,080 Speaker 4: We're in the one big union. Like, it doesn't make 499 00:25:39,119 --> 00:25:41,200 Speaker 4: any sense that they're trying to I mean, it makes 500 00:25:41,240 --> 00:25:43,560 Speaker 4: perfect sense for management to try to divide us, but 501 00:25:44,080 --> 00:25:47,439 Speaker 4: it's what the workers want to be in one contract 502 00:25:47,640 --> 00:25:50,080 Speaker 4: to you know, be able to do like one grievance 503 00:25:50,160 --> 00:25:53,360 Speaker 4: and like you know, go against management together. But yeah, 504 00:25:53,400 --> 00:25:57,600 Speaker 4: it's like a really annoying thing and it's really frustrating 505 00:25:57,640 --> 00:26:00,480 Speaker 4: to not really know exactly what our next is. 506 00:26:01,080 --> 00:26:02,960 Speaker 2: I mean, this is something that I think both unied 507 00:26:03,040 --> 00:26:05,640 Speaker 2: organizers and management knows, which is that the first place 508 00:26:05,640 --> 00:26:07,480 Speaker 2: that unions fail is trying to get the vote, trying 509 00:26:07,480 --> 00:26:08,920 Speaker 2: to get to which is trying to get enough people 510 00:26:09,000 --> 00:26:11,000 Speaker 2: organized around the sort of campaign. So the second place 511 00:26:11,000 --> 00:26:13,320 Speaker 2: that they fail is before the first contract or trying 512 00:26:13,359 --> 00:26:15,679 Speaker 2: to negotiate the first contract. And so every company just 513 00:26:15,800 --> 00:26:18,199 Speaker 2: like tries to draw the shit out as long as 514 00:26:18,280 --> 00:26:22,560 Speaker 2: humanly possible, like it took us god, I think, but 515 00:26:22,800 --> 00:26:27,000 Speaker 2: two years in bargaining and that's like not even that 516 00:26:27,080 --> 00:26:29,240 Speaker 2: like for a first contract. I mean, that's like bad, 517 00:26:29,320 --> 00:26:31,320 Speaker 2: but it's not even as bad as it can get. 518 00:26:31,840 --> 00:26:33,679 Speaker 2: And there's the other aspect of it too that you've 519 00:26:33,720 --> 00:26:37,480 Speaker 2: been talking about, which is that the way that companies 520 00:26:37,520 --> 00:26:40,520 Speaker 2: break union is just terror. Right, It's just it's just 521 00:26:40,560 --> 00:26:42,520 Speaker 2: a terror campaign. It is it is it is a 522 00:26:42,560 --> 00:26:45,720 Speaker 2: campaign to inflict sort of fear and suffering on people. 523 00:26:45,760 --> 00:26:47,159 Speaker 2: And the fact that this is the way that the 524 00:26:47,200 --> 00:26:50,600 Speaker 2: system works that you know, there are a bunch of 525 00:26:50,640 --> 00:26:53,160 Speaker 2: people in power who are to the way that they're 526 00:26:53,160 --> 00:26:56,639 Speaker 2: attempting to keep their power is just through fear and 527 00:26:56,680 --> 00:27:01,520 Speaker 2: through like inflicting pain on people is just ghastly. And 528 00:27:01,600 --> 00:27:03,640 Speaker 2: if you want to sort of take a step back 529 00:27:03,680 --> 00:27:06,119 Speaker 2: and go like why is everything like this, it's like, well, 530 00:27:06,960 --> 00:27:09,439 Speaker 2: that's because because that's what this entire system is built on. 531 00:27:09,480 --> 00:27:10,560 Speaker 2: It has always been built on. 532 00:27:11,200 --> 00:27:14,160 Speaker 1: Yeah, And I think in terms of countering that, one 533 00:27:14,240 --> 00:27:17,920 Speaker 1: thing that I definitely want to call for from all 534 00:27:18,000 --> 00:27:22,879 Speaker 1: of my fellow baristas out there is to organize your 535 00:27:22,920 --> 00:27:28,600 Speaker 1: own shops, right, Like that is the key thing. The 536 00:27:28,640 --> 00:27:34,520 Speaker 1: more people that we have pushing for better rights for 537 00:27:34,600 --> 00:27:37,879 Speaker 1: workers in the workplace, whether that's through a contract or not, 538 00:27:38,800 --> 00:27:42,000 Speaker 1: the more effective it's going to be. And it's when 539 00:27:42,080 --> 00:27:47,199 Speaker 1: we feel alone and isolated that their terror is most effective. 540 00:27:48,119 --> 00:27:51,440 Speaker 1: It's when we're together that it is the least effective. 541 00:27:51,520 --> 00:27:55,880 Speaker 1: That they are the most scared by our tactics. So 542 00:27:56,040 --> 00:27:57,800 Speaker 1: just keep pushing for it. I mean, I think that's 543 00:27:57,840 --> 00:28:00,760 Speaker 1: one of the things that the Starbucks campaign showed us. 544 00:28:00,840 --> 00:28:04,280 Speaker 1: You know it. They still don't have their first contract, sure, 545 00:28:04,320 --> 00:28:09,320 Speaker 1: but they're so much closer now, Like over what is 546 00:28:09,359 --> 00:28:12,280 Speaker 1: it like almost three years down the road with over 547 00:28:12,359 --> 00:28:15,040 Speaker 1: five hundred shops organized than they were when those first 548 00:28:15,040 --> 00:28:20,840 Speaker 1: shops organized in Buffalo. And that's due to that persistence 549 00:28:21,320 --> 00:28:26,199 Speaker 1: and due to having more weight on our side. So 550 00:28:26,359 --> 00:28:30,040 Speaker 1: please organize, do it. That's just my little call for that. 551 00:28:31,280 --> 00:28:34,080 Speaker 2: Yeah, it's a snowball rolling down the hills. Like the 552 00:28:34,080 --> 00:28:36,120 Speaker 2: more the more shops are organized, the more that will 553 00:28:36,160 --> 00:28:38,720 Speaker 2: convince other shops to organize. And the larger that snowball is, 554 00:28:38,720 --> 00:28:41,760 Speaker 2: the harder it is to stop its momentum. But what 555 00:28:42,120 --> 00:28:44,160 Speaker 2: do you think the next steps are going to be 556 00:28:44,240 --> 00:28:46,960 Speaker 2: for this campaign? If you can actually talk about it 557 00:28:47,640 --> 00:28:49,560 Speaker 2: in terms of like putting pressure on the company in 558 00:28:49,640 --> 00:28:52,600 Speaker 2: terms of like drawing other people in in terms of 559 00:28:52,640 --> 00:28:53,880 Speaker 2: like what's going on in the shops. 560 00:28:54,320 --> 00:28:56,440 Speaker 4: Yeah, I think one of the main things that we 561 00:28:57,040 --> 00:28:59,520 Speaker 4: think that we've been really quiet about is how much 562 00:28:59,560 --> 00:29:01,920 Speaker 4: do you need thing they've been doing and just talking 563 00:29:02,000 --> 00:29:04,560 Speaker 4: to the public about that. I think part of why 564 00:29:04,600 --> 00:29:06,840 Speaker 4: we're here today also is it's going to help with 565 00:29:06,880 --> 00:29:10,320 Speaker 4: that a lot of people, especially when people were calling 566 00:29:10,360 --> 00:29:13,480 Speaker 4: for boycott's on Starbucks, We're like, okay, we'll go to Petez. 567 00:29:13,520 --> 00:29:16,360 Speaker 4: Then they're like the good company, And I think Peetz 568 00:29:16,440 --> 00:29:19,240 Speaker 4: gets away with a lot because they have that kind 569 00:29:19,240 --> 00:29:21,600 Speaker 4: of protection of like, oh, they were a small company 570 00:29:21,640 --> 00:29:25,120 Speaker 4: from Berkeley and they're you know, still in the Bay Area. 571 00:29:25,200 --> 00:29:28,720 Speaker 4: They're so small. Now they have like so many shops 572 00:29:28,760 --> 00:29:32,960 Speaker 4: like across the world. They're like an international conglomerate. They're 573 00:29:33,000 --> 00:29:36,040 Speaker 4: part of like a large holding company. They got bought 574 00:29:36,080 --> 00:29:39,880 Speaker 4: out like over ten years ago, and the quality has 575 00:29:39,920 --> 00:29:42,480 Speaker 4: been declining. They treat their workers like shit, we don't 576 00:29:42,480 --> 00:29:47,160 Speaker 4: get any raises anymore unless it's like minimum wage increases 577 00:29:47,200 --> 00:29:52,400 Speaker 4: are mandated by law. So a company that maybe was 578 00:29:52,600 --> 00:29:56,120 Speaker 4: right and was maybe a little bit better is now 579 00:29:56,280 --> 00:29:59,440 Speaker 4: like just going downhill, and I think people still like 580 00:29:59,600 --> 00:30:02,080 Speaker 4: pride them themselves and being like a petnick and being 581 00:30:02,120 --> 00:30:06,080 Speaker 4: a customer and being part of this like weird sub 582 00:30:06,160 --> 00:30:10,200 Speaker 4: culture of coffee that is no longer kind of there's 583 00:30:10,280 --> 00:30:13,160 Speaker 4: just like it's just not what it was back when 584 00:30:13,160 --> 00:30:15,520 Speaker 4: it was created like in the sixties in Berkeley. It's 585 00:30:15,560 --> 00:30:17,640 Speaker 4: not it's not the same and it can't go back 586 00:30:17,640 --> 00:30:20,080 Speaker 4: to that anymore, just now with the way that they're 587 00:30:20,240 --> 00:30:22,280 Speaker 4: union busting, not with the way that they're just cutting 588 00:30:22,320 --> 00:30:26,920 Speaker 4: the quality of everything and over like yeah, everything the 589 00:30:26,960 --> 00:30:30,200 Speaker 4: expectation of us and in other ways that they do 590 00:30:30,480 --> 00:30:31,640 Speaker 4: is just not sustainable. 591 00:30:32,200 --> 00:30:33,720 Speaker 2: Yeah, and then you can see that it's not the 592 00:30:33,720 --> 00:30:36,840 Speaker 2: same company by just like oh yeah, hey, they've you know, 593 00:30:36,880 --> 00:30:38,120 Speaker 2: I mean, and this is this is this is not 594 00:30:38,200 --> 00:30:40,680 Speaker 2: a defense of like small businesses, which also do just 595 00:30:40,720 --> 00:30:43,120 Speaker 2: absolutely terrible shit to workers, like if you ever worked 596 00:30:43,120 --> 00:30:46,360 Speaker 2: for one, like good lord, But you know, like as 597 00:30:46,400 --> 00:30:49,960 Speaker 2: as these companies get larger and larger, and as as 598 00:30:49,960 --> 00:30:53,240 Speaker 2: this sort of the endless march of capital goes on, 599 00:30:53,400 --> 00:30:57,320 Speaker 2: you know, like you see the current like nightmare of 600 00:30:57,720 --> 00:31:01,240 Speaker 2: oh hey, here's like an additional fifty percent of your workload. 601 00:31:01,240 --> 00:31:04,000 Speaker 2: And also you don't get tips on it. And you know, 602 00:31:04,280 --> 00:31:06,680 Speaker 2: unless this stuff is rolled back, and unless people understand 603 00:31:06,680 --> 00:31:09,760 Speaker 2: what's happening, unless there's more organizing, Like that's just the 604 00:31:09,880 --> 00:31:12,040 Speaker 2: latest terrible thing that's going to happen. There, they're like 605 00:31:12,360 --> 00:31:14,960 Speaker 2: five years down the line, they're going to have invented 606 00:31:15,000 --> 00:31:18,400 Speaker 2: a new app that like does something, though the magnitude 607 00:31:18,440 --> 00:31:21,200 Speaker 2: of the horror of which we haven't even like comprehended yet, 608 00:31:21,280 --> 00:31:24,520 Speaker 2: Like I don't know, we're probably two years out from 609 00:31:24,600 --> 00:31:28,800 Speaker 2: like the Chinese style thing where you could order a 610 00:31:28,840 --> 00:31:31,160 Speaker 2: coffee on a train and someone has to go run 611 00:31:31,200 --> 00:31:33,520 Speaker 2: out to the train platform to the next station to 612 00:31:33,560 --> 00:31:37,360 Speaker 2: hand it to you on the train. Like there there 613 00:31:37,360 --> 00:31:39,840 Speaker 2: are there are, there are depths of even this algorithmic 614 00:31:39,880 --> 00:31:42,360 Speaker 2: hell that we haven't hit yet. And the only way 615 00:31:42,400 --> 00:31:44,840 Speaker 2: for us not to continue to plunge the depths of 616 00:31:45,000 --> 00:31:47,920 Speaker 2: suffering with a line the size of the universe is 617 00:31:48,320 --> 00:31:51,760 Speaker 2: by organizing more and by getting people to understand that, 618 00:31:52,200 --> 00:31:54,560 Speaker 2: you know, all of these sort of progressive brands are 619 00:31:55,680 --> 00:31:59,080 Speaker 2: a thin veneer for exploitation and suffering. 620 00:31:59,480 --> 00:32:03,040 Speaker 1: Absolutely and honestly, one of the legitimate worries that we 621 00:32:03,160 --> 00:32:08,400 Speaker 1: have about next steps in the evolution of what Pete's 622 00:32:08,440 --> 00:32:12,960 Speaker 1: coffee shops are going to look like is the register 623 00:32:13,400 --> 00:32:17,440 Speaker 1: folks being replaced with kiosks, you know, like self service kiosks. 624 00:32:17,560 --> 00:32:20,040 Speaker 1: I mean, that's something that we've seen, you know, in 625 00:32:20,080 --> 00:32:24,320 Speaker 1: a number of places, from grocery stores to like McDonald's 626 00:32:24,320 --> 00:32:28,520 Speaker 1: now and Dunkin Donuts. They're even rolling out some like 627 00:32:28,680 --> 00:32:32,920 Speaker 1: beta testing kiosk shops for Pete's in the Bay Area 628 00:32:33,600 --> 00:32:38,720 Speaker 1: and Pizza's introduced this new service deployment system within the 629 00:32:38,800 --> 00:32:43,000 Speaker 1: shops which basically pins the person on the register to 630 00:32:43,040 --> 00:32:46,000 Speaker 1: the register where they're not allowed to do anything else. 631 00:32:46,000 --> 00:32:48,080 Speaker 1: They're not even allowed to turn around and get coffee 632 00:32:48,800 --> 00:32:52,040 Speaker 1: for the people. And you know, the more that we 633 00:32:52,080 --> 00:32:53,840 Speaker 1: do this and the more that we get yelled at 634 00:32:53,840 --> 00:32:57,240 Speaker 1: by our managers for literally trying to help a customer 635 00:32:57,520 --> 00:33:01,280 Speaker 1: and get them something because we're you know, deployed to 636 00:33:01,400 --> 00:33:06,000 Speaker 1: the register, the clearer it becomes that they're just trying 637 00:33:06,080 --> 00:33:09,360 Speaker 1: to basically make that position obsolete so that they can 638 00:33:09,920 --> 00:33:13,880 Speaker 1: shift it into a kiosk. Yeah, it's it's just more 639 00:33:14,400 --> 00:33:17,920 Speaker 1: corporate cost cutting because you know, if they're not bringing 640 00:33:17,960 --> 00:33:20,400 Speaker 1: in any more revenue, they got to make that profit 641 00:33:20,440 --> 00:33:24,640 Speaker 1: line go up somehow, right, and so, Yeah, one of 642 00:33:24,640 --> 00:33:26,520 Speaker 1: the big things that we're doing right now to try 643 00:33:26,560 --> 00:33:29,600 Speaker 1: to push back against that is doing this sort of 644 00:33:29,640 --> 00:33:34,800 Speaker 1: pr campaign to try to just bring more people into 645 00:33:35,120 --> 00:33:38,200 Speaker 1: the organizing effort on the worker side of things and 646 00:33:38,200 --> 00:33:40,880 Speaker 1: then on the customer side of things, just making people 647 00:33:40,920 --> 00:33:44,800 Speaker 1: more aware of what's actually going on here and that 648 00:33:45,080 --> 00:33:49,360 Speaker 1: you know, we're not actually better than Starbucks. Yeah, you know, 649 00:33:49,440 --> 00:33:52,440 Speaker 1: we're not the better option. We're part of a massive 650 00:33:52,520 --> 00:33:58,080 Speaker 1: conglomerate that is practicing the same horrible anti labor business 651 00:33:58,120 --> 00:34:00,000 Speaker 1: practices as the rest of us. 652 00:34:00,880 --> 00:34:02,960 Speaker 2: Yeah. I think that's a good place to end. If 653 00:34:02,960 --> 00:34:05,840 Speaker 2: people want to support y'all, where should they go. We'll 654 00:34:05,880 --> 00:34:08,239 Speaker 2: also have links to stuff and what other things can 655 00:34:08,280 --> 00:34:09,680 Speaker 2: they do to help? 656 00:34:10,160 --> 00:34:14,799 Speaker 4: Yeah, so you can go to our social media at 657 00:34:14,800 --> 00:34:15,840 Speaker 4: Pete's Labor Union. 658 00:34:16,040 --> 00:34:17,239 Speaker 3: We also have our website. 659 00:34:17,239 --> 00:34:19,560 Speaker 4: We have an intake form, so if any Burista is 660 00:34:19,600 --> 00:34:23,200 Speaker 4: interested in reaching out learning more about organizing with that 661 00:34:23,440 --> 00:34:25,440 Speaker 4: entails and if you want to organize their own shop, 662 00:34:25,520 --> 00:34:29,239 Speaker 4: we have members part of our organizing committees that are 663 00:34:29,280 --> 00:34:32,959 Speaker 4: willing to meet with you sustain tell ye contact through 664 00:34:34,160 --> 00:34:36,480 Speaker 4: however long you need for your campaign, and you'll be 665 00:34:36,480 --> 00:34:39,960 Speaker 4: part of our organizing we have shops across the country 666 00:34:40,040 --> 00:34:40,920 Speaker 4: organizing with us. 667 00:34:41,000 --> 00:34:41,840 Speaker 3: It's very exciting. 668 00:34:41,880 --> 00:34:43,640 Speaker 4: I'm sure there might be a shop near you already 669 00:34:43,719 --> 00:34:46,520 Speaker 4: organizing and we can get y'all connected as well. 670 00:34:46,960 --> 00:34:50,200 Speaker 2: Oh yeah, and sus christ I had a terrible based 671 00:34:50,280 --> 00:34:53,160 Speaker 2: coffee people of the world unite pun thing, but it's 672 00:34:53,400 --> 00:34:56,120 Speaker 2: slipped from my mind. All right, all of you will 673 00:34:56,120 --> 00:34:58,600 Speaker 2: be spared by terrible coffee related puns as long as 674 00:34:58,600 --> 00:35:02,520 Speaker 2: you go organize your so go do that, Go join 675 00:35:02,560 --> 00:35:04,799 Speaker 2: the struggle, go make it stronger. And I don't know, 676 00:35:04,880 --> 00:35:06,600 Speaker 2: like there's going to be a number of you for 677 00:35:06,640 --> 00:35:08,480 Speaker 2: whom this is like not your terrain, right and if 678 00:35:08,480 --> 00:35:11,640 Speaker 2: this isn't your terrain, find it. Find find the struggle 679 00:35:11,680 --> 00:35:13,520 Speaker 2: that you were going to do, and wait and wage 680 00:35:13,560 --> 00:35:14,840 Speaker 2: it there and take your field. 681 00:35:14,640 --> 00:35:18,160 Speaker 3: And hold it. 682 00:35:18,160 --> 00:35:20,640 Speaker 2: It could Happen Here is a production of cool Zone Media. 683 00:35:20,840 --> 00:35:23,920 Speaker 2: For more podcasts from cool Zone Media, visit our website 684 00:35:24,000 --> 00:35:27,560 Speaker 2: Coolzonemedia dot com, or check us out on the iHeartRadio app, 685 00:35:27,640 --> 00:35:29,640 Speaker 2: Apple Podcasts, or wherever. 686 00:35:29,360 --> 00:35:30,520 Speaker 3: You listen to podcasts. 687 00:35:30,960 --> 00:35:32,879 Speaker 2: You can now find sources for it could Happen here. 688 00:35:32,920 --> 00:35:35,880 Speaker 2: Listened directly in episode descriptions. Thanks for listening.