WEBVTT - IDLES 0:00:15.476 --> 0:00:15.956 Pushkin. 0:00:20.236 --> 0:00:23.276 The British band Idols has released five albums in only 0:00:23.396 --> 0:00:27.756 seven years, starting with their critically acclaimed debut album Brutalism 0:00:27.836 --> 0:00:31.836 in twenty seventeen. The band's been growing steadily ever since, 0:00:31.956 --> 0:00:35.676 with their bombastic sound that brilliantly balances joy, chaos and 0:00:35.716 --> 0:00:39.276 an often critical take on the powers that be. The 0:00:39.276 --> 0:00:42.396 five piece band's lead singer, Joe Talbot, has always channeled 0:00:42.436 --> 0:00:45.556 his personal pain as well as his dissatisfaction with Britain's 0:00:45.596 --> 0:00:50.356 ruling class, into his songwriting. Mark Bowen, idols guitarist and producer, 0:00:50.596 --> 0:00:53.876 serves as Joe's primary musical partner in the band. They 0:00:53.916 --> 0:00:55.956 both bring a love of hip hop and old school 0:00:56.036 --> 0:00:59.396 soul and arm beat the mix, along with UK techno 0:00:59.476 --> 0:01:02.876 and house music. All of these influences can be heard 0:01:02.956 --> 0:01:06.516 on their latest album, Tank, a project produced by Mark Bowen, 0:01:06.876 --> 0:01:12.556 our friend Kenny Beats, and radiohead Nigel Godrich. On today's episode, 0:01:12.596 --> 0:01:14.716 I talked to Joe Talbot and Mark Bowen from the 0:01:14.716 --> 0:01:17.236 green room of The Tonight Show with Jimmy Fallon about 0:01:17.236 --> 0:01:21.476 their tumultuous creative partnership. They also explain how Mark helps 0:01:21.476 --> 0:01:25.196 temper Joe's sometimes passionate rage, and Joe breaks down why 0:01:25.236 --> 0:01:32.996 he'll forever despise England's monarchy. This is broken record liner 0:01:33.076 --> 0:01:34.356 notes for the digital Age. 0:01:34.516 --> 0:01:35.436 I'm justin Mitchman. 0:01:36.196 --> 0:01:40.916 Here's my conversation with Joe Talbot and Mark Bowen of Idols. 0:01:41.516 --> 0:01:42.516 Thank you for doing. 0:01:42.316 --> 0:01:43.996 This, Thank youth for having us. 0:01:44.356 --> 0:01:45.076 No man, I mean, you. 0:01:45.076 --> 0:01:48.276 Guys are backstage at Jimmy Fallon right now. I don't 0:01:48.276 --> 0:01:51.196 know how you guys keep it together. I can hardly 0:01:51.236 --> 0:01:53.236 do one thing in a day. You guys must be 0:01:53.316 --> 0:01:54.916 doing you know, a million things. 0:01:54.956 --> 0:01:55.516 It's crazy. 0:01:55.796 --> 0:01:58.956 I mean it comes to a sense of gratitude like 0:01:59.196 --> 0:02:04.236 we've been fucking fifteen years ago, Like Crappy sound Engine is. 0:02:04.276 --> 0:02:06.316 We give us shit form turning up early. 0:02:06.436 --> 0:02:07.036 Do you know what I mean? 0:02:07.396 --> 0:02:11.036 When we're working fifty sixty weeks and then we turn up, 0:02:11.356 --> 0:02:15.236 get paid fifty bucks for a show and some warm 0:02:15.276 --> 0:02:19.116 beers and then drive for four hours home to play 0:02:19.156 --> 0:02:21.716 to ten people. But we knew the value of that, 0:02:22.196 --> 0:02:26.156 we knew the experience, and we knew how special the 0:02:26.356 --> 0:02:30.876 learning curve was. So when we're here and we're given opportunities, 0:02:30.916 --> 0:02:34.636 we take them because that's fucking gift. When you have 0:02:34.716 --> 0:02:38.076 a platform, whether you're lucky or not. And there's a 0:02:38.076 --> 0:02:40.996 lot of entitled people in our industry. But when your 0:02:41.036 --> 0:02:45.156 gifted a platform, that is a beautiful opportunity to challenge 0:02:45.156 --> 0:02:48.636 yourself and give the audience back the energy they've given 0:02:48.676 --> 0:02:54.716 you by being present and fucking vital and full of 0:02:54.756 --> 0:02:58.676 life because you only get one and it's magic. 0:02:59.316 --> 0:03:02.036 Is it weird to see the audience get bigger and 0:03:02.036 --> 0:03:05.036 bigger and more like fans And. 0:03:05.036 --> 0:03:06.436 I mean, I don't know, it's got to be insane, 0:03:06.476 --> 0:03:06.996 but you get. 0:03:06.836 --> 0:03:07.396 What you build. 0:03:07.476 --> 0:03:12.876 Man, Like we a dialogue with our music that was 0:03:13.396 --> 0:03:17.076 a continual growth. You know, there's no surprises. We know 0:03:17.196 --> 0:03:19.996 what's happening, and we know what we've made, and we 0:03:20.116 --> 0:03:22.436 know what our audience is building. They've helped us from 0:03:22.476 --> 0:03:26.076 the start, so we've been carrying each other from twenty 0:03:26.316 --> 0:03:30.036 eleven and like, there's no surprises. You get what you 0:03:30.116 --> 0:03:30.476 work for. 0:03:31.356 --> 0:03:33.836 I love how self assured that answer is. You know 0:03:33.876 --> 0:03:35.156 what I mean that you guys kind of know what 0:03:35.196 --> 0:03:37.276 you put out there, and it really listening to the 0:03:37.316 --> 0:03:39.716 new record. You know, as the records have come out, 0:03:39.956 --> 0:03:41.956 it seems like you guys are pretty self contained. Like 0:03:41.996 --> 0:03:44.356 from the jump, you guys knew what you wanted to say, 0:03:44.356 --> 0:03:46.516 which you wanted to do, how you wanted to present it, 0:03:46.756 --> 0:03:49.476 even though I've seen the changes, Like every album sounds 0:03:49.516 --> 0:03:53.236 and feels very different. Every album is a really strong statement. 0:03:53.796 --> 0:03:56.996 Yeah, I mean that's. 0:03:55.916 --> 0:04:00.036 Definitely our biggest kind of moo as creators is the 0:04:00.956 --> 0:04:05.636 we're very much driven by our intent and our intentions 0:04:05.796 --> 0:04:08.676 you know, in the music, and then they kind of 0:04:08.756 --> 0:04:11.316 create with Joe's design and stuff like that. It's all 0:04:11.396 --> 0:04:14.356 very much there from the outset. It's not you know, 0:04:15.116 --> 0:04:18.436 about jamming and you know, exploring things in that way. 0:04:18.516 --> 0:04:21.556 It's about how do we represent what we're intending here. 0:04:21.996 --> 0:04:26.156 It's not you know, stumbling upon something. So yeah, it's 0:04:26.196 --> 0:04:27.876 a it's a big thing in this bland. 0:04:28.476 --> 0:04:28.676 You know. 0:04:28.756 --> 0:04:32.156 The title always comes first, the artwork of follow soon after, 0:04:32.676 --> 0:04:35.636 and then it's like conversations around that, and it's about 0:04:35.796 --> 0:04:39.996 kind of like Choo expressing what he meant when he 0:04:40.036 --> 0:04:43.596 gave that title, and then we talk all about that 0:04:43.676 --> 0:04:46.436 and talk kind of about maybe sometimes like what the 0:04:46.436 --> 0:04:48.236 song is going to be about or what the kind 0:04:48.236 --> 0:04:49.476 of music's going to be about. 0:04:50.116 --> 0:04:51.996 But you don't really have lyrics or music at that. 0:04:52.716 --> 0:04:54.556 We don't have distract. We don't have anything, it's all. 0:04:54.596 --> 0:04:56.516 It's all dealing in abstraction. And I think that I 0:04:56.516 --> 0:04:57.436 think that dealing in. 0:04:57.396 --> 0:05:00.876 The abstract is why we write the music first always 0:05:01.356 --> 0:05:04.996 because it's it's easy to translate the abstract into something abstract, 0:05:05.516 --> 0:05:08.636 and then it's about too translating that into into word. 0:05:08.836 --> 0:05:11.596 Yeah, I mean, the whole purpose of every album is, 0:05:12.356 --> 0:05:16.076 you know, life is abstract. There's there's no there's no 0:05:16.236 --> 0:05:18.916 actual rules. The whole point in philosophy, if you look 0:05:18.916 --> 0:05:24.276 at Plato's Republic, that's just creating structures that are imagined 0:05:24.316 --> 0:05:28.676 in order to understand the socio political like narrative that 0:05:28.756 --> 0:05:31.676 goes on and how people are dying to find purpose 0:05:31.716 --> 0:05:35.796 and meaning to move forward. And that's what art is. 0:05:35.916 --> 0:05:39.236 Art is the breach of existence. It allows you a 0:05:39.316 --> 0:05:43.236 sense of purpose and where you're at right there, and 0:05:43.316 --> 0:05:48.796 the more you understand your momentary purpose, the more you 0:05:48.836 --> 0:05:52.516 can move forward with vigor and understanding and more purpose. 0:05:53.076 --> 0:05:56.916 So every album is about the human condition and either 0:05:57.796 --> 0:06:03.716 how I'm affected by socioeconomic situations or relationships or whatever 0:06:03.796 --> 0:06:06.756 it is. I put that in, I document it, but 0:06:06.796 --> 0:06:09.516 that always comes from the present thing that's most of mind. 0:06:09.596 --> 0:06:11.236 I already know what the next album is going to 0:06:11.276 --> 0:06:14.076 be about and what it's called and with each one, 0:06:14.476 --> 0:06:18.756 and Bowen then takes my very small thing because I 0:06:18.756 --> 0:06:22.596 don't want to like overwhelm him his ship with my ego, 0:06:23.036 --> 0:06:25.836 because it's not just about my ego. It's about it's 0:06:25.836 --> 0:06:28.996 about some sort of landscape that we can make brilliant music. 0:06:29.996 --> 0:06:31.796 So I just go, well, this is the kind of 0:06:31.836 --> 0:06:33.316 thing I'm going to be talking about. 0:06:33.716 --> 0:06:36.156 But I don't have any lyrics and I won't force anything, 0:06:36.636 --> 0:06:39.716 but this is what I'm interested in thematically, and then 0:06:39.756 --> 0:06:42.796 he goes okay, and then he puts color to that, 0:06:42.916 --> 0:06:46.276 and he puts you know, some terror firma down. 0:06:46.396 --> 0:06:47.556 Some strong terror firm. 0:06:47.876 --> 0:06:50.596 Yeah, I believe, and then like and once it's all done, 0:06:50.636 --> 0:06:53.356 then then I sing on top. But it has to 0:06:53.396 --> 0:06:54.396 be done. 0:06:54.836 --> 0:06:57.196 Does the color that Mark comes up with in the 0:06:57.196 --> 0:06:59.876 rest of the band, does that help you sort of 0:07:00.116 --> 0:07:01.916 hone you in on what you want to talk about? 0:07:02.116 --> 0:07:03.916 Well, it's Bowing and I that writes some music. So 0:07:03.996 --> 0:07:07.396 it's kind of like just pushing, pulling together. Because he's 0:07:07.476 --> 0:07:12.556 a very philosophically and just emotional practice, very different to me. 0:07:13.236 --> 0:07:16.876 So between us we have this like really beautiful pushing 0:07:16.956 --> 0:07:21.436 pool creatively. That allows me a new perspective, like, you know, 0:07:21.796 --> 0:07:24.356 just saying I just wanted to smash the room up 0:07:24.596 --> 0:07:26.756 and I had to talk to Buying. I'd be like, 0:07:27.236 --> 0:07:29.756 what do I punch? And he's like, well, how about. 0:07:29.516 --> 0:07:29.916 You do this? 0:07:29.956 --> 0:07:32.516 And I'm like, oh, yeah, yeah, yeah, of course. You 0:07:32.596 --> 0:07:35.196 know he's my guy and like this because he's the 0:07:35.196 --> 0:07:39.996 opposite to me. So we understand that to create parameters 0:07:39.996 --> 0:07:44.316 within an album, it has to be outur boundaries. Create 0:07:44.356 --> 0:07:47.436 the boundaries, work within them, and you'll flourish. 0:07:48.156 --> 0:07:50.796 I mean, it's like it's also a strict if. 0:07:50.836 --> 0:07:53.756 I'm like, uh no, that's not joy as an act 0:07:53.756 --> 0:07:56.476 of resistance enough, no, no, no, no, no, it's not like that. 0:07:57.036 --> 0:07:59.236 So this is where I'm at, and that's a conversation. 0:07:59.676 --> 0:08:03.116 And I think that's why our music very much sounds 0:08:03.196 --> 0:08:08.596 like an insular entity is because we allow each other 0:08:08.636 --> 0:08:10.836 to breathe, all five of us, obviously the boys right 0:08:10.876 --> 0:08:12.236 shit as well. It's not just me and him, but 0:08:12.236 --> 0:08:15.356 it's mostly us. We allow all five of us to 0:08:15.436 --> 0:08:18.956 breathe within a parameter, but we have to have those parameters. 0:08:19.436 --> 0:08:21.876 That's the best way of creating something. I think creative 0:08:21.916 --> 0:08:25.676 thinking comes from problem solving and like it's good to 0:08:25.716 --> 0:08:28.156 have that, Like do whatever you want, but you can 0:08:28.196 --> 0:08:31.236 only use the color blue, and you're like, oh that's sick. Okay, 0:08:31.476 --> 0:08:35.356 where so do whatever you want. You're like, uh, okay. 0:08:35.076 --> 0:08:36.196 It's a little intimidating. 0:08:36.356 --> 0:08:39.396 Yeah, yeah, h it's just a little flat, Like what's 0:08:39.436 --> 0:08:42.916 the challenge in there? You like doing anything? That's how 0:08:42.996 --> 0:08:45.996 life works. Life doesn't go yeah, go ahead. We know 0:08:46.036 --> 0:08:48.676 how privilege we are, and we use to have privilege 0:08:49.276 --> 0:08:51.276 that there are people like the most brilliant and the 0:08:51.316 --> 0:08:56.516 most beautiful art comes from those voices that have a 0:08:56.556 --> 0:09:01.156 sense of tumultuous fire. They have to fight against something, 0:09:01.316 --> 0:09:08.036 whether it's oppression, depression, love, fucking civil wars, genocide, whatever 0:09:08.076 --> 0:09:11.396 it is. There's things under the like that's when the 0:09:11.476 --> 0:09:15.196 voices are most resent. I just think, Yeah, you set 0:09:15.196 --> 0:09:19.516 yourself the boundaries, and you set yourself the parameters to flourish. Obviously, 0:09:19.796 --> 0:09:23.676 like two different degrees. I'm not comparing myself to fucking 0:09:23.756 --> 0:09:26.516 Billie Holidays, you know what I mean. But I've been 0:09:26.516 --> 0:09:30.636 through some horrible shit and I'm allowing my traumas in 0:09:30.636 --> 0:09:33.036 in order to make a more brilliant picture. 0:09:33.756 --> 0:09:36.436 Mark, what's your sense of your guys's relationship? Is it similar? 0:09:36.756 --> 0:09:40.596 Yeah, I mean it's it's tumultuous, but that's good. That's 0:09:40.636 --> 0:09:44.196 that's where we get, you know, out of the rumble. 0:09:44.596 --> 0:09:47.476 You know, we start to move the earth around us, 0:09:47.516 --> 0:09:50.676 the water starts to flow, and I think that's it. 0:09:50.676 --> 0:09:54.796 It's like we're just so different creatively as well, and 0:09:55.476 --> 0:09:57.156 it's useful. 0:09:57.556 --> 0:10:00.036 And part as well. 0:10:00.516 --> 0:10:03.756 You know, you like, for two people that are so 0:10:04.076 --> 0:10:08.316 as individuals, so strong in their feelings about their creativity 0:10:08.476 --> 0:10:11.396 and about their about but it would it would almost 0:10:11.556 --> 0:10:14.876 suit us better to be auteurs and to be on 0:10:14.916 --> 0:10:17.276 our own, you know, just having people that are like 0:10:17.516 --> 0:10:20.916 yes around us, they all that happened, but it wouldn't. 0:10:20.716 --> 0:10:22.956 Have the same impact. It wouldn't work. 0:10:22.996 --> 0:10:26.596 It would be too self self serving and self immilating 0:10:26.676 --> 0:10:31.036 as well, because it's like, you know, Joe's approach needs 0:10:31.076 --> 0:10:34.956 my touch and my and my approach needs Joe's touch 0:10:35.596 --> 0:10:39.476 to become full, become complete, to become become resonant in 0:10:39.476 --> 0:10:43.556 that intention as well. I think that you know, you 0:10:43.676 --> 0:10:47.276 can have two down the line or to abstract to 0:10:48.036 --> 0:10:52.276 like you know, flourishy or or kind of a coming 0:10:52.316 --> 0:10:55.476 from a very different perspective. So I think I think 0:10:55.516 --> 0:10:58.956 it requires that for idols to be a thing. 0:10:59.196 --> 0:11:00.596 But probably more generally too. 0:11:00.596 --> 0:11:03.436 I mean, I think that's the in you know, the 0:11:03.516 --> 0:11:08.196 year twenty twenty four, it's like partnerships groups bands are 0:11:08.476 --> 0:11:11.636 rarer and rarer, but you kind of you look back 0:11:11.676 --> 0:11:14.156 over all of the best music came from on some 0:11:14.276 --> 0:11:17.236 level of partnership, you know, off the walls of solo record, 0:11:17.236 --> 0:11:19.916 but that's a partnership with him in Quincy, and yeah, 0:11:19.956 --> 0:11:22.956 there's always got to be something to sort of rein 0:11:23.036 --> 0:11:25.876 you in or something to play off of, you know. 0:11:25.916 --> 0:11:27.036 I think it's the playoff of. 0:11:27.076 --> 0:11:29.916 But I think it's also because like when you're creating art, 0:11:30.236 --> 0:11:34.236 you're creating something from your perspective to be observed from 0:11:34.476 --> 0:11:37.916 from a different perspective. So I guess it's useful at 0:11:37.956 --> 0:11:41.276 that at that point of creation for the art to 0:11:41.316 --> 0:11:43.916 them be informed by something from a different perspective, because 0:11:43.956 --> 0:11:47.156 it allies the best of a singularity. Because there is 0:11:47.196 --> 0:11:49.516 no singularity, there's no there's no truth. 0:11:49.956 --> 0:11:51.716 Yeah, I'm all for like that. 0:11:51.796 --> 0:11:54.796 There are there are things that are created like Nick 0:11:54.916 --> 0:11:58.076 Drake pink Man, that's just him on his I entirely. 0:11:58.516 --> 0:12:00.916 I mean maybe there's an engineer and a producer that, 0:12:01.996 --> 0:12:04.356 but I think you can get magic from anywhere. Some 0:12:04.396 --> 0:12:08.476 people are completely introverted. I think Baron and Aya, I'm 0:12:08.516 --> 0:12:12.756 definitely half half introvert extrovert, like I need time on 0:12:12.796 --> 0:12:16.756 my own to process, but we process very different. I 0:12:16.796 --> 0:12:20.996 think we just learned democratically, and you know, people forget 0:12:21.236 --> 0:12:24.596 democracies and the leaders. So like, you know, we're just 0:12:24.676 --> 0:12:26.916 we's taking it's a few albums, but now we're at 0:12:26.956 --> 0:12:27.436 a point. 0:12:27.236 --> 0:12:29.276 Where it's like, this is your two man, I'm just 0:12:29.316 --> 0:12:31.636 going to sing you crack on. I'm like, I'm fucking ready. 0:12:31.676 --> 0:12:33.836 This is beautiful, and that that's. 0:12:33.436 --> 0:12:35.596 A real thing as well that we've kind of learned 0:12:35.596 --> 0:12:38.196 as we've gone along as the idea of service. You know, 0:12:38.276 --> 0:12:40.796 we've learned more about kind of serving the song as 0:12:40.836 --> 0:12:43.356 we write, but also service to each other. You know, 0:12:43.396 --> 0:12:47.036 there's there's times where, especially when you're dealing with Joe's 0:12:47.076 --> 0:12:50.836 lyrics and his vocal approach, you know, sometimes it's not 0:12:50.876 --> 0:12:54.516 what I've been expecting or would have wanted, but you 0:12:54.596 --> 0:12:56.916 can see that there's something that you needed to get out, 0:12:57.156 --> 0:13:02.156 and it's like, actually, yeah, you're right, this doesn't need 0:13:02.196 --> 0:13:03.156 my two cents right now. 0:13:03.316 --> 0:13:06.676 And that happened with me with Gospel. It ended up 0:13:06.716 --> 0:13:09.796 getting cut and nothing to do with me piano. There 0:13:09.876 --> 0:13:12.916 was parts it was just short. I was unsure about 0:13:12.956 --> 0:13:14.756 the landscape because it's very you. 0:13:15.116 --> 0:13:15.476 It was you. 0:13:15.836 --> 0:13:19.716 Yeah, there was a different version of a Gospel the 0:13:19.756 --> 0:13:20.676 song on the new record. 0:13:21.276 --> 0:13:23.516 Well, I mean it's all there. It's all there. 0:13:23.516 --> 0:13:26.276 It's just like restructured a bit, as if there was 0:13:26.276 --> 0:13:27.116 something taken out. 0:13:27.196 --> 0:13:29.996 So it just happens once, but like that's it. It's 0:13:29.996 --> 0:13:30.796 not crazy. 0:13:31.036 --> 0:13:34.156 But I was just like, I felt how important it 0:13:34.196 --> 0:13:36.596 was to bow and how amazing it was. So I 0:13:36.636 --> 0:13:39.356 was just like, even though you know it got cut 0:13:39.516 --> 0:13:44.716 after your discussion with Nigel, right, it wasn't like my input, 0:13:44.876 --> 0:13:45.676 but I felt that. 0:13:45.796 --> 0:13:50.516 I was like, but I knew there's his. Also. 0:13:50.636 --> 0:13:53.876 The other thing was that whenever I showed it to you, 0:13:53.876 --> 0:13:56.076 you were like, oh, that's the verse and it's not. 0:13:57.836 --> 0:13:58.716 I didn't know what it was. 0:13:58.756 --> 0:14:02.076 The more big was the chorus in my head and 0:14:02.276 --> 0:14:04.476 whatever you said it was, I was like, that's not it, 0:14:04.516 --> 0:14:06.316 but then it has to be. 0:14:06.356 --> 0:14:06.996 It doesn't matter. 0:14:07.036 --> 0:14:10.396 It was the thing about Gospel I don't know if alright, 0:14:10.676 --> 0:14:12.156 it's just one big yeah. 0:14:12.636 --> 0:14:14.556 I'm glad you guys are sometimes confused by your song 0:14:14.596 --> 0:14:16.996 structures too, because I was about to bring that up 0:14:17.036 --> 0:14:19.436 about one of the new songs. I'm often I don't care, 0:14:19.556 --> 0:14:20.956 but if I listen back and trying to think, well, 0:14:20.956 --> 0:14:23.956 what's the verse, what's the chorus, what's the pre chorus, It's. 0:14:23.796 --> 0:14:25.316 Like, I don't actually, I don't know, like I have 0:14:25.396 --> 0:14:26.476 noub Yeah, I think. 0:14:26.316 --> 0:14:28.916 I think it's especially on this one, it was about, like, 0:14:29.796 --> 0:14:31.396 you know what, one of one of the biggest drivers 0:14:31.396 --> 0:14:33.756 that we've not actually spoken about that much actually and 0:14:34.076 --> 0:14:36.716 impress on this was like when we started out of 0:14:36.716 --> 0:14:38.956 this album, the things that we were listening to. Most 0:14:38.996 --> 0:14:40.836 of the things we were leaning on most was fifties 0:14:40.836 --> 0:14:45.956 and sexonties pop music and cool and that's really informant 0:14:45.996 --> 0:14:48.636 that you know, Roy is called Roy because I was 0:14:48.676 --> 0:14:50.916 trying to hep Roy Orbison song at the. 0:14:50.876 --> 0:14:53.436 Time, beautiful song Jesus Christ. 0:14:53.916 --> 0:14:56.156 I mean that was something that song is probably a 0:14:56.156 --> 0:14:59.836 perfect example of us too, like not compromising, what's the 0:14:59.836 --> 0:15:02.756 way colliding? So I had this chorus, it was like 0:15:02.756 --> 0:15:04.796 a Lee Moses chorus that I wanted to write for 0:15:04.836 --> 0:15:06.276 like two to three years. 0:15:07.876 --> 0:15:09.116 It's not the one. It's not the one. 0:15:09.836 --> 0:15:13.276 And Buying had this like the verse and the bridge, 0:15:13.436 --> 0:15:16.476 and the bridge was the chorus, and I was writing 0:15:16.476 --> 0:15:18.556 it with my friend like trying to write at home. 0:15:18.596 --> 0:15:20.596 It's the only thing I tried to write home, and 0:15:20.636 --> 0:15:23.396 I was like, everything I'm writing isn't the. 0:15:23.396 --> 0:15:26.396 Chorus, but it works and it's sick, and that's what's 0:15:26.436 --> 0:15:27.476 on the album. 0:15:27.796 --> 0:15:30.196 And then we were in the studio and we were 0:15:30.236 --> 0:15:33.196 packing down, the drugs were packed away. It was only me, 0:15:33.716 --> 0:15:37.356 Bowing and John in the studio with Nigel and Miko 0:15:37.836 --> 0:15:41.156 and like in London, and I was like, fuck, it's 0:15:41.236 --> 0:15:44.476 the Limoses chorus. And then I wrote the drum beat 0:15:44.476 --> 0:15:50.316 in what about a minute. I was like dagda and 0:15:50.396 --> 0:15:53.076 John was like, oh shit, okay okay. And then like 0:15:53.156 --> 0:15:54.836 I wrote all the films, got it down in like 0:15:54.996 --> 0:15:56.436 probably five minutes recorded. 0:15:57.036 --> 0:15:58.876 But I was like buying it, would you reckon? And 0:15:58.916 --> 0:15:59.996 we both were like for. 0:16:01.756 --> 0:16:04.956 Organ, I was like organ line four chords and then 0:16:04.996 --> 0:16:06.916 we both be almost exactly the same. 0:16:07.036 --> 0:16:09.996 I sang the same notes progressive and we. 0:16:09.876 --> 0:16:12.916 Were like that's it, that's the fucking one, and like 0:16:13.636 --> 0:16:17.116 you know, that it wrote itself in a minute, like 0:16:17.276 --> 0:16:19.676 it just and that's how fifties pop should be. 0:16:20.276 --> 0:16:23.036 That like soul, like sixties soul. 0:16:23.836 --> 0:16:28.356 It's like that ship was natural and like so it's 0:16:28.436 --> 0:16:31.516 called soul music because it's the most humane fucking element 0:16:31.556 --> 0:16:35.116 of music. It's like, well, of course that's it. It 0:16:35.196 --> 0:16:38.796 sounds easy to write because it's so fucking innate in 0:16:38.876 --> 0:16:41.956 the human condition to listen to what it's reading or 0:16:42.036 --> 0:16:46.676 Nina Simono fucking even like the Flamingos and shit like that. 0:16:46.716 --> 0:16:47.596 It just feels. 0:16:48.676 --> 0:16:51.836 It feels like you're being spoken to and you're heard, 0:16:52.316 --> 0:16:55.476 and when you feel heard, it just it feels like 0:16:55.596 --> 0:16:59.076 you're limb. And like that's what that's what I want 0:16:59.116 --> 0:17:01.316 from pop music. That's what I want from soul music. 0:17:01.676 --> 0:17:04.876 That's why you know you get all these I'll play 0:17:04.916 --> 0:17:06.036 my dad Frank Cosch. 0:17:05.836 --> 0:17:07.636 And Ivy and he's like, all right, I get it, 0:17:07.756 --> 0:17:10.596 I get you know you would. 0:17:10.236 --> 0:17:11.636 No one could be like, what's this ship? 0:17:11.996 --> 0:17:15.716 Yeah, and like you hear the soul, you know, it's 0:17:15.756 --> 0:17:19.036 so you feel the soul fuck everyone else, and like 0:17:19.716 --> 0:17:21.756 we were trying to connect that that's what we wanted 0:17:21.796 --> 0:17:23.316 when I said I want to make people dance. 0:17:23.396 --> 0:17:26.676 It's about the magic of music that you get when 0:17:26.676 --> 0:17:27.356 you allow it in. 0:17:27.516 --> 0:17:31.596 But you can only allow it in if the message 0:17:32.276 --> 0:17:35.556 is portrayed in a way that allows you to feel open, 0:17:36.196 --> 0:17:38.116 you know, And that's you know, the favor of the 0:17:38.156 --> 0:17:41.076 sun and the moon. If you just shine, you open 0:17:41.156 --> 0:17:43.356 that person up. If you blow hard and you get 0:17:43.396 --> 0:17:45.436 aggressive and you're trying to come on and just join 0:17:45.556 --> 0:17:49.476 us to say, it doesn't allow the sense of dialogue. 0:17:49.876 --> 0:17:52.276 So like it was all these things that we were 0:17:52.316 --> 0:17:54.516 practicing in that fifties pop thing was the first thing 0:17:54.596 --> 0:17:58.316 that really melded us together with purpose. And then next 0:17:58.316 --> 0:18:00.796 thing I know is writing fucking all sorts of shit. 0:18:01.796 --> 0:18:03.596 We're taking a break and then coming back with more 0:18:03.636 --> 0:18:09.556 of a conversation with Joe Talbott and Mark Bowen of Idols. 0:18:11.436 --> 0:18:15.276 We're back with Joan Mark of Idols. So Roy became 0:18:15.316 --> 0:18:17.076 like the kind of like the leadoff in a sense. 0:18:17.116 --> 0:18:18.716 That was the thing that kind of made it all 0:18:18.876 --> 0:18:19.436 come together. 0:18:19.676 --> 0:18:20.076 That was it. 0:18:20.116 --> 0:18:22.476 That was the only thing that we connected on all 0:18:22.516 --> 0:18:25.956 of us. Gotcha completing something that we're all like, that's it. 0:18:26.316 --> 0:18:28.356 Everything else was parts. We came to the studio in 0:18:28.396 --> 0:18:31.676 France with seventeen parts with like two or maybe three 0:18:31.716 --> 0:18:34.476 instruments song but like a verse and that's it. 0:18:34.556 --> 0:18:36.716 So we had we had we had an album too, right, 0:18:36.796 --> 0:18:38.356 we had nothing? Yeah, that was it. 0:18:38.396 --> 0:18:41.516 And that was when the idea of the fifty pop 0:18:41.556 --> 0:18:45.196 thing became slightly more abstract. It was more just about 0:18:45.276 --> 0:18:49.876 tone and that sense that the untenable thing that you 0:18:49.876 --> 0:18:52.516 can't really put a name too. And then it was 0:18:52.556 --> 0:18:56.316 about being playful with structure and playful with but I 0:18:56.396 --> 0:18:59.476 felt with like choosing your moments, like I think you know. 0:18:59.756 --> 0:19:02.036 Another big moment on the on the album was the 0:19:02.276 --> 0:19:04.396 instrumental end section of pop pop pop. 0:19:04.916 --> 0:19:07.356 I have that highlighted to ask you, like, what is 0:19:07.396 --> 0:19:07.836 the hook? 0:19:07.996 --> 0:19:10.836 It's like the sunbeams, some beams and the gold sugar 0:19:10.916 --> 0:19:14.116 part and then goes back to something what's going on here? 0:19:14.276 --> 0:19:14.476 Yeah? 0:19:14.556 --> 0:19:17.356 I mean it happens twice in really quick succession, then 0:19:17.396 --> 0:19:19.796 one time at the end, and then it's like that 0:19:19.956 --> 0:19:23.556 song was really kind of like very much for us. 0:19:23.596 --> 0:19:26.876 It was like it was so abstract the whole way through. 0:19:27.116 --> 0:19:29.756 I think, I mean it was it came from my 0:19:29.836 --> 0:19:31.916 idea I had. I had to beat in mind for 0:19:31.996 --> 0:19:35.676 quite a while again, and like it came from like 0:19:35.956 --> 0:19:40.676 UK garage and Mika Levi Mika Chew in the Shapes, 0:19:40.876 --> 0:19:44.236 which is like real grimy pot act that kind of 0:19:44.276 --> 0:19:49.516 crossed the line between sometimes grime, sometimes pot, sometimes indie, 0:19:49.676 --> 0:19:53.036 sometimes punk. Like they did whatever the fuck and it 0:19:53.076 --> 0:19:57.156 always sounded infectious, danceable, and I was like that. And 0:19:57.196 --> 0:20:01.236 there then MySpace what you call it, like the description 0:20:01.596 --> 0:20:04.956 genre description was pop pop pop oh sack because it 0:20:05.036 --> 0:20:06.996 was kind of like wre I came from. Yeah, yes, 0:20:07.356 --> 0:20:10.116 Like basically there was this reper the same garage at 0:20:10.116 --> 0:20:12.276 the time, which you know, everyone had the gun things. 0:20:12.396 --> 0:20:15.036 I didn't obviously think I'm talking about like that, like 0:20:15.156 --> 0:20:18.036 in the garage scene in Manchester, in London and Birmingham, 0:20:18.316 --> 0:20:19.996 you know, there was it was a real heavy gun 0:20:20.036 --> 0:20:23.476 crime in those areas and it was a very beautiful 0:20:23.876 --> 0:20:26.676 community of people that made something great out of serious 0:20:26.676 --> 0:20:29.516 deprivation at the time. There was also a lot of bullshit, 0:20:29.636 --> 0:20:32.196 you know, as it always with the racist media attaching 0:20:32.276 --> 0:20:33.836 gun crime to garage. 0:20:34.156 --> 0:20:36.836 It was like, but the gunfinger thing was a real thing. 0:20:37.316 --> 0:20:39.556