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Speaker 1: Pushkin.

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Speaker 2: The British band Idols has released five albums in only

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Speaker 2: seven years, starting with their critically acclaimed debut album Brutalism

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Speaker 2: in twenty seventeen. The band's been growing steadily ever since,

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Speaker 2: with their bombastic sound that brilliantly balances joy, chaos and

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Speaker 2: an often critical take on the powers that be. The

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Speaker 2: five piece band's lead singer, Joe Talbot, has always channeled

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Speaker 2: his personal pain as well as his dissatisfaction with Britain's

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Speaker 2: ruling class, into his songwriting. Mark Bowen, idols guitarist and producer,

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Speaker 2: serves as Joe's primary musical partner in the band. They

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Speaker 2: both bring a love of hip hop and old school

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Speaker 2: soul and arm beat the mix, along with UK techno

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Speaker 2: and house music. All of these influences can be heard

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Speaker 2: on their latest album, Tank, a project produced by Mark Bowen,

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Speaker 2: our friend Kenny Beats, and radiohead Nigel Godrich. On today's episode,

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Speaker 2: I talked to Joe Talbot and Mark Bowen from the

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Speaker 2: green room of The Tonight Show with Jimmy Fallon about

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Speaker 2: their tumultuous creative partnership. They also explain how Mark helps

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Speaker 2: temper Joe's sometimes passionate rage, and Joe breaks down why

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Speaker 2: he'll forever despise England's monarchy. This is broken record liner

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Speaker 2: notes for the digital Age.

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Speaker 3: I'm justin Mitchman.

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Speaker 2: Here's my conversation with Joe Talbot and Mark Bowen of Idols.

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Speaker 3: Thank you for doing.

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Speaker 1: This, Thank youth for having us.

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Speaker 3: No man, I mean, you.

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Speaker 2: Guys are backstage at Jimmy Fallon right now. I don't

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Speaker 2: know how you guys keep it together. I can hardly

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Speaker 2: do one thing in a day. You guys must be

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Speaker 2: doing you know, a million things.

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Speaker 1: It's crazy.

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Speaker 4: I mean it comes to a sense of gratitude like

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Speaker 4: we've been fucking fifteen years ago, Like Crappy sound Engine is.

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Speaker 4: We give us shit form turning up early.

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Speaker 1: Do you know what I mean?

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Speaker 4: When we're working fifty sixty weeks and then we turn up,

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Speaker 4: get paid fifty bucks for a show and some warm

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Speaker 4: beers and then drive for four hours home to play

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Speaker 4: to ten people. But we knew the value of that,

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Speaker 4: we knew the experience, and we knew how special the

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Speaker 4: learning curve was. So when we're here and we're given opportunities,

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Speaker 4: we take them because that's fucking gift. When you have

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Speaker 4: a platform, whether you're lucky or not. And there's a

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Speaker 4: lot of entitled people in our industry. But when your

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Speaker 4: gifted a platform, that is a beautiful opportunity to challenge

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Speaker 4: yourself and give the audience back the energy they've given

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Speaker 4: you by being present and fucking vital and full of

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Speaker 4: life because you only get one and it's magic.

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Speaker 2: Is it weird to see the audience get bigger and

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Speaker 2: bigger and more like fans And.

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Speaker 3: I mean, I don't know, it's got to be insane,

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Speaker 3: but you get.

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Speaker 1: What you build.

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Speaker 4: Man, Like we a dialogue with our music that was

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Speaker 4: a continual growth. You know, there's no surprises. We know

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Speaker 4: what's happening, and we know what we've made, and we

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Speaker 4: know what our audience is building. They've helped us from

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Speaker 4: the start, so we've been carrying each other from twenty

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Speaker 4: eleven and like, there's no surprises. You get what you

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Speaker 4: work for.

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Speaker 2: I love how self assured that answer is. You know

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Speaker 2: what I mean that you guys kind of know what

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Speaker 2: you put out there, and it really listening to the

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Speaker 2: new record. You know, as the records have come out,

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Speaker 2: it seems like you guys are pretty self contained. Like

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Speaker 2: from the jump, you guys knew what you wanted to say,

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Speaker 2: which you wanted to do, how you wanted to present it,

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Speaker 2: even though I've seen the changes, Like every album sounds

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Speaker 2: and feels very different. Every album is a really strong statement.

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Speaker 1: Yeah, I mean that's.

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Speaker 5: Definitely our biggest kind of moo as creators is the

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Speaker 5: we're very much driven by our intent and our intentions

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Speaker 5: you know, in the music, and then they kind of

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Speaker 5: create with Joe's design and stuff like that. It's all

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Speaker 5: very much there from the outset. It's not you know,

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Speaker 5: about jamming and you know, exploring things in that way.

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Speaker 5: It's about how do we represent what we're intending here.

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Speaker 5: It's not you know, stumbling upon something. So yeah, it's

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Speaker 5: a it's a big thing in this bland.

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Speaker 1: You know.

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Speaker 5: The title always comes first, the artwork of follow soon after,

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Speaker 5: and then it's like conversations around that, and it's about

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Speaker 5: kind of like Choo expressing what he meant when he

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Speaker 5: gave that title, and then we talk all about that

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Speaker 5: and talk kind of about maybe sometimes like what the

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Speaker 5: song is going to be about or what the kind

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Speaker 5: of music's going to be about.

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Speaker 3: But you don't really have lyrics or music at that.

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Speaker 5: We don't have distract. We don't have anything, it's all.

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Speaker 5: It's all dealing in abstraction. And I think that I

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Speaker 5: think that dealing in.

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Speaker 6: The abstract is why we write the music first always

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Speaker 6: because it's it's easy to translate the abstract into something abstract,

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Speaker 6: and then it's about too translating that into into word.

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Speaker 4: Yeah, I mean, the whole purpose of every album is,

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Speaker 4: you know, life is abstract. There's there's no there's no

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Speaker 4: actual rules. The whole point in philosophy, if you look

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Speaker 4: at Plato's Republic, that's just creating structures that are imagined

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Speaker 4: in order to understand the socio political like narrative that

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Speaker 4: goes on and how people are dying to find purpose

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Speaker 4: and meaning to move forward. And that's what art is.

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Speaker 4: Art is the breach of existence. It allows you a

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Speaker 4: sense of purpose and where you're at right there, and

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Speaker 4: the more you understand your momentary purpose, the more you

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Speaker 4: can move forward with vigor and understanding and more purpose.

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Speaker 4: So every album is about the human condition and either

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Speaker 4: how I'm affected by socioeconomic situations or relationships or whatever

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Speaker 4: it is. I put that in, I document it, but

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Speaker 4: that always comes from the present thing that's most of mind.

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Speaker 4: I already know what the next album is going to

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Speaker 4: be about and what it's called and with each one,

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Speaker 4: and Bowen then takes my very small thing because I

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Speaker 4: don't want to like overwhelm him his ship with my ego,

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Speaker 4: because it's not just about my ego. It's about it's

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Speaker 4: about some sort of landscape that we can make brilliant music.

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Speaker 1: So I just go, well, this is the kind of

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Speaker 1: thing I'm going to be talking about.

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Speaker 4: But I don't have any lyrics and I won't force anything,

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Speaker 4: but this is what I'm interested in thematically, and then

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Speaker 4: he goes okay, and then he puts color to that,

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Speaker 4: and he puts you know, some terror firma down.

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Speaker 3: Some strong terror firm.

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Speaker 4: Yeah, I believe, and then like and once it's all done,

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Speaker 4: then then I sing on top. But it has to

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Speaker 4: be done.

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Speaker 2: Does the color that Mark comes up with in the

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Speaker 2: rest of the band, does that help you sort of

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Speaker 2: hone you in on what you want to talk about?

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Speaker 4: Well, it's Bowing and I that writes some music. So

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Speaker 4: it's kind of like just pushing, pulling together. Because he's

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Speaker 4: a very philosophically and just emotional practice, very different to me.

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Speaker 4: So between us we have this like really beautiful pushing

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Speaker 4: pool creatively. That allows me a new perspective, like, you know,

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Speaker 4: just saying I just wanted to smash the room up

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Speaker 4: and I had to talk to Buying. I'd be like,

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Speaker 4: what do I punch? And he's like, well, how about.

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Speaker 1: You do this?

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Speaker 4: And I'm like, oh, yeah, yeah, yeah, of course. You

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Speaker 4: know he's my guy and like this because he's the

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Speaker 4: opposite to me. So we understand that to create parameters

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Speaker 4: within an album, it has to be outur boundaries. Create

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Speaker 4: the boundaries, work within them, and you'll flourish.

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Speaker 1: I mean, it's like it's also a strict if.

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Speaker 4: I'm like, uh no, that's not joy as an act

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Speaker 4: of resistance enough, no, no, no, no, no, it's not like that.

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Speaker 1: So this is where I'm at, and that's a conversation.

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Speaker 4: And I think that's why our music very much sounds

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Speaker 4: like an insular entity is because we allow each other

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Speaker 4: to breathe, all five of us, obviously the boys right

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Speaker 4: shit as well. It's not just me and him, but

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Speaker 4: it's mostly us. We allow all five of us to

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Speaker 4: breathe within a parameter, but we have to have those parameters.

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Speaker 4: That's the best way of creating something. I think creative

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Speaker 4: thinking comes from problem solving and like it's good to

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Speaker 4: have that, Like do whatever you want, but you can

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Speaker 4: only use the color blue, and you're like, oh that's sick. Okay,

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Speaker 4: where so do whatever you want. You're like, uh, okay.

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Speaker 3: It's a little intimidating.

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Speaker 4: Yeah, yeah, h it's just a little flat, Like what's

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Speaker 4: the challenge in there? You like doing anything? That's how

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Speaker 4: life works. Life doesn't go yeah, go ahead. We know

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Speaker 4: how privilege we are, and we use to have privilege

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Speaker 4: that there are people like the most brilliant and the

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Speaker 4: most beautiful art comes from those voices that have a

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Speaker 4: sense of tumultuous fire. They have to fight against something,

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Speaker 4: whether it's oppression, depression, love, fucking civil wars, genocide, whatever

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Speaker 4: it is. There's things under the like that's when the

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Speaker 4: voices are most resent. I just think, Yeah, you set

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Speaker 4: yourself the boundaries, and you set yourself the parameters to flourish. Obviously,

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Speaker 4: like two different degrees. I'm not comparing myself to fucking

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Speaker 4: Billie Holidays, you know what I mean. But I've been

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Speaker 4: through some horrible shit and I'm allowing my traumas in

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Speaker 4: in order to make a more brilliant picture.

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Speaker 3: Mark, what's your sense of your guys's relationship? Is it similar?

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Speaker 5: Yeah, I mean it's it's tumultuous, but that's good. That's

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Speaker 5: that's where we get, you know, out of the rumble.

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Speaker 5: You know, we start to move the earth around us,

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Speaker 5: the water starts to flow, and I think that's it.

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Speaker 5: It's like we're just so different creatively as well, and

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Speaker 5: it's useful.

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Speaker 1: And part as well.

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Speaker 5: You know, you like, for two people that are so

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Speaker 5: as individuals, so strong in their feelings about their creativity

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Speaker 5: and about their about but it would it would almost

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Speaker 5: suit us better to be auteurs and to be on

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Speaker 5: our own, you know, just having people that are like

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Speaker 5: yes around us, they all that happened, but it wouldn't.

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Speaker 1: Have the same impact. It wouldn't work.

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Speaker 5: It would be too self self serving and self immilating

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Speaker 5: as well, because it's like, you know, Joe's approach needs

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Speaker 5: my touch and my and my approach needs Joe's touch

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Speaker 5: to become full, become complete, to become become resonant in

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Speaker 5: that intention as well. I think that you know, you

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Speaker 5: can have two down the line or to abstract to

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Speaker 5: like you know, flourishy or or kind of a coming

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Speaker 5: from a very different perspective. So I think I think

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Speaker 5: it requires that for idols to be a thing.

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Speaker 3: But probably more generally too.

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Speaker 2: I mean, I think that's the in you know, the

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Speaker 2: year twenty twenty four, it's like partnerships groups bands are

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Speaker 2: rarer and rarer, but you kind of you look back

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Speaker 2: over all of the best music came from on some

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Speaker 2: level of partnership, you know, off the walls of solo record,

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Speaker 2: but that's a partnership with him in Quincy, and yeah,

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Speaker 2: there's always got to be something to sort of rein

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Speaker 2: you in or something to play off of, you know.

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Speaker 1: I think it's the playoff of.

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Speaker 5: But I think it's also because like when you're creating art,

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Speaker 5: you're creating something from your perspective to be observed from

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Speaker 5: from a different perspective. So I guess it's useful at

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Speaker 5: that at that point of creation for the art to

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Speaker 5: them be informed by something from a different perspective, because

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Speaker 5: it allies the best of a singularity. Because there is

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Speaker 5: no singularity, there's no there's no truth.

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Speaker 1: Yeah, I'm all for like that.

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Speaker 4: There are there are things that are created like Nick

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Speaker 4: Drake pink Man, that's just him on his I entirely.

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Speaker 4: I mean maybe there's an engineer and a producer that,

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Speaker 4: but I think you can get magic from anywhere. Some

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Speaker 4: people are completely introverted. I think Baron and Aya, I'm

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Speaker 4: definitely half half introvert extrovert, like I need time on

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Speaker 4: my own to process, but we process very different. I

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Speaker 4: think we just learned democratically, and you know, people forget

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Speaker 4: democracies and the leaders. So like, you know, we're just

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Speaker 4: we's taking it's a few albums, but now we're at

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Speaker 4: a point.

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Speaker 1: Where it's like, this is your two man, I'm just

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Speaker 1: going to sing you crack on. I'm like, I'm fucking ready.

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Speaker 1: This is beautiful, and that that's.

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Speaker 5: A real thing as well that we've kind of learned

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Speaker 5: as we've gone along as the idea of service. You know,

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Speaker 5: we've learned more about kind of serving the song as

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Speaker 5: we write, but also service to each other. You know,

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Speaker 5: there's there's times where, especially when you're dealing with Joe's

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Speaker 5: lyrics and his vocal approach, you know, sometimes it's not

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Speaker 5: what I've been expecting or would have wanted, but you

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Speaker 5: can see that there's something that you needed to get out,

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Speaker 5: and it's like, actually, yeah, you're right, this doesn't need

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Speaker 5: my two cents right now.

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Speaker 4: And that happened with me with Gospel. It ended up

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Speaker 4: getting cut and nothing to do with me piano. There

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Speaker 4: was parts it was just short. I was unsure about

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Speaker 4: the landscape because it's very you.

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Speaker 1: It was you.

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Speaker 2: Yeah, there was a different version of a Gospel the

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Speaker 2: song on the new record.

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Speaker 1: Well, I mean it's all there. It's all there.

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Speaker 4: It's just like restructured a bit, as if there was

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Speaker 4: something taken out.

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Speaker 1: So it just happens once, but like that's it. It's

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Speaker 1: not crazy.

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Speaker 4: But I was just like, I felt how important it

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Speaker 4: was to bow and how amazing it was. So I

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Speaker 4: was just like, even though you know it got cut

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Speaker 4: after your discussion with Nigel, right, it wasn't like my input,

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Speaker 4: but I felt that.

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Speaker 1: I was like, but I knew there's his. Also.

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Speaker 5: The other thing was that whenever I showed it to you,

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Speaker 5: you were like, oh, that's the verse and it's not.

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Speaker 1: I didn't know what it was.

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Speaker 5: The more big was the chorus in my head and

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Speaker 5: whatever you said it was, I was like, that's not it,

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Speaker 5: but then it has to be.

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Speaker 1: It doesn't matter.

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Speaker 5: It was the thing about Gospel I don't know if alright,

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Speaker 5: it's just one big yeah.

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Speaker 2: I'm glad you guys are sometimes confused by your song

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Speaker 2: structures too, because I was about to bring that up

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Speaker 2: about one of the new songs. I'm often I don't care,

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Speaker 2: but if I listen back and trying to think, well,

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Speaker 2: what's the verse, what's the chorus, what's the pre chorus, It's.

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Speaker 3: Like, I don't actually, I don't know, like I have

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Speaker 3: noub Yeah, I think.

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Speaker 5: I think it's especially on this one, it was about, like,

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Speaker 5: you know what, one of one of the biggest drivers

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Speaker 5: that we've not actually spoken about that much actually and

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Speaker 5: impress on this was like when we started out of

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Speaker 5: this album, the things that we were listening to. Most

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Speaker 5: of the things we were leaning on most was fifties

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Speaker 5: and sexonties pop music and cool and that's really informant

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Speaker 5: that you know, Roy is called Roy because I was

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Speaker 5: trying to hep Roy Orbison song at the.

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Speaker 3: Time, beautiful song Jesus Christ.

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Speaker 4: I mean that was something that song is probably a

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Speaker 4: perfect example of us too, like not compromising, what's the

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Speaker 4: way colliding? So I had this chorus, it was like

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Speaker 4: a Lee Moses chorus that I wanted to write for

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Speaker 4: like two to three years.

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Speaker 1: It's not the one. It's not the one.

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Speaker 4: And Buying had this like the verse and the bridge,

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Speaker 4: and the bridge was the chorus, and I was writing

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Speaker 4: it with my friend like trying to write at home.

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Speaker 4: It's the only thing I tried to write home, and

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Speaker 4: I was like, everything I'm writing isn't the.

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Speaker 1: Chorus, but it works and it's sick, and that's what's

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Speaker 1: on the album.

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Speaker 4: And then we were in the studio and we were

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Speaker 4: packing down, the drugs were packed away. It was only me,

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Speaker 4: Bowing and John in the studio with Nigel and Miko

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Speaker 4: and like in London, and I was like, fuck, it's

301
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Speaker 4: the Limoses chorus. And then I wrote the drum beat

302
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Speaker 4: in what about a minute. I was like dagda and

303
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Speaker 4: John was like, oh shit, okay okay. And then like

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Speaker 4: I wrote all the films, got it down in like

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Speaker 4: probably five minutes recorded.

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Speaker 1: But I was like buying it, would you reckon? And

307
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Speaker 1: we both were like for.

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Speaker 4: Organ, I was like organ line four chords and then

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Speaker 4: we both be almost exactly the same.

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Speaker 1: I sang the same notes progressive and we.

311
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Speaker 4: Were like that's it, that's the fucking one, and like

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Speaker 4: you know, that it wrote itself in a minute, like

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Speaker 4: it just and that's how fifties pop should be.

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Speaker 1: That like soul, like sixties soul.

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Speaker 4: It's like that ship was natural and like so it's

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Speaker 4: called soul music because it's the most humane fucking element

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Speaker 4: of music. It's like, well, of course that's it. It

318
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Speaker 4: sounds easy to write because it's so fucking innate in

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Speaker 4: the human condition to listen to what it's reading or

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Speaker 4: Nina Simono fucking even like the Flamingos and shit like that.

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Speaker 1: It just feels.

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Speaker 4: It feels like you're being spoken to and you're heard,

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Speaker 4: and when you feel heard, it just it feels like

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Speaker 4: you're limb. And like that's what that's what I want

325
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Speaker 4: from pop music. That's what I want from soul music.

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Speaker 1: That's why you know you get all these I'll play

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Speaker 1: my dad Frank Cosch.

328
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Speaker 4: And Ivy and he's like, all right, I get it,

329
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Speaker 4: I get you know you would.

330
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Speaker 1: No one could be like, what's this ship?

331
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Speaker 4: Yeah, and like you hear the soul, you know, it's

332
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Speaker 4: so you feel the soul fuck everyone else, and like

333
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Speaker 4: we were trying to connect that that's what we wanted

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Speaker 4: when I said I want to make people dance.

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Speaker 1: It's about the magic of music that you get when

336
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Speaker 1: you allow it in.

337
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Speaker 4: But you can only allow it in if the message

338
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Speaker 4: is portrayed in a way that allows you to feel open,

339
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Speaker 4: you know, And that's you know, the favor of the

340
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Speaker 4: sun and the moon. If you just shine, you open

341
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Speaker 4: that person up. If you blow hard and you get

342
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Speaker 4: aggressive and you're trying to come on and just join

343
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Speaker 4: us to say, it doesn't allow the sense of dialogue.

344
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Speaker 4: So like it was all these things that we were

345
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Speaker 4: practicing in that fifties pop thing was the first thing

346
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Speaker 4: that really melded us together with purpose. And then next

347
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Speaker 4: thing I know is writing fucking all sorts of shit.

348
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Speaker 2: We're taking a break and then coming back with more

349
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Speaker 2: of a conversation with Joe Talbott and Mark Bowen of Idols.

350
00:18:11,436 --> 00:18:15,276
Speaker 2: We're back with Joan Mark of Idols. So Roy became

351
00:18:15,316 --> 00:18:17,076
Speaker 2: like the kind of like the leadoff in a sense.

352
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Speaker 2: That was the thing that kind of made it all

353
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Speaker 2: come together.

354
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Speaker 1: That was it.

355
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Speaker 4: That was the only thing that we connected on all

356
00:18:22,516 --> 00:18:25,956
Speaker 4: of us. Gotcha completing something that we're all like, that's it.

357
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Speaker 4: Everything else was parts. We came to the studio in

358
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Speaker 4: France with seventeen parts with like two or maybe three

359
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Speaker 4: instruments song but like a verse and that's it.

360
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Speaker 1: So we had we had we had an album too, right,

361
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Speaker 1: we had nothing? Yeah, that was it.

362
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Speaker 5: And that was when the idea of the fifty pop

363
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Speaker 5: thing became slightly more abstract. It was more just about

364
00:18:45,276 --> 00:18:49,876
Speaker 5: tone and that sense that the untenable thing that you

365
00:18:49,876 --> 00:18:52,516
Speaker 5: can't really put a name too. And then it was

366
00:18:52,556 --> 00:18:56,316
Speaker 5: about being playful with structure and playful with but I

367
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Speaker 5: felt with like choosing your moments, like I think you know.

368
00:18:59,756 --> 00:19:02,036
Speaker 5: Another big moment on the on the album was the

369
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Speaker 5: instrumental end section of pop pop pop.

370
00:19:04,916 --> 00:19:07,356
Speaker 3: I have that highlighted to ask you, like, what is

371
00:19:07,396 --> 00:19:07,836
Speaker 3: the hook?

372
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Speaker 2: It's like the sunbeams, some beams and the gold sugar

373
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Speaker 2: part and then goes back to something what's going on here?

374
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Speaker 3: Yeah?

375
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Speaker 5: I mean it happens twice in really quick succession, then

376
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Speaker 5: one time at the end, and then it's like that

377
00:19:19,956 --> 00:19:23,556
Speaker 5: song was really kind of like very much for us.

378
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Speaker 1: It was like it was so abstract the whole way through.

379
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Speaker 4: I think, I mean it was it came from my

380
00:19:29,836 --> 00:19:31,916
Speaker 4: idea I had. I had to beat in mind for

381
00:19:31,996 --> 00:19:35,676
Speaker 4: quite a while again, and like it came from like

382
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Speaker 4: UK garage and Mika Levi Mika Chew in the Shapes,

383
00:19:40,876 --> 00:19:44,236
Speaker 4: which is like real grimy pot act that kind of

384
00:19:44,276 --> 00:19:49,516
Speaker 4: crossed the line between sometimes grime, sometimes pot, sometimes indie,

385
00:19:49,676 --> 00:19:53,036
Speaker 4: sometimes punk. Like they did whatever the fuck and it

386
00:19:53,076 --> 00:19:57,156
Speaker 4: always sounded infectious, danceable, and I was like that. And

387
00:19:57,196 --> 00:20:01,236
Speaker 4: there then MySpace what you call it, like the description

388
00:20:01,596 --> 00:20:04,956
Speaker 4: genre description was pop pop pop oh sack because it

389
00:20:05,036 --> 00:20:06,996
Speaker 4: was kind of like wre I came from. Yeah, yes,

390
00:20:07,356 --> 00:20:10,116
Speaker 4: Like basically there was this reper the same garage at

391
00:20:10,116 --> 00:20:12,276
Speaker 4: the time, which you know, everyone had the gun things.

392
00:20:12,396 --> 00:20:15,036
Speaker 4: I didn't obviously think I'm talking about like that, like

393
00:20:15,156 --> 00:20:18,036
Speaker 4: in the garage scene in Manchester, in London and Birmingham,

394
00:20:18,316 --> 00:20:19,996
Speaker 4: you know, there was it was a real heavy gun

395
00:20:20,036 --> 00:20:23,476
Speaker 4: crime in those areas and it was a very beautiful

396
00:20:23,876 --> 00:20:26,676
Speaker 4: community of people that made something great out of serious

397
00:20:26,676 --> 00:20:29,516
Speaker 4: deprivation at the time. There was also a lot of bullshit,

398
00:20:29,636 --> 00:20:32,196
Speaker 4: you know, as it always with the racist media attaching

399
00:20:32,276 --> 00:20:33,836
Speaker 4: gun crime to garage.

400
00:20:34,156 --> 00:20:36,836
Speaker 1: It was like, but the gunfinger thing was a real thing.

401
00:20:37,316 --> 00:20:39,556
Speaker 4: So I always thought it was kind of a reference

402
00:20:39,596 --> 00:20:41,236
Speaker 4: to that because some of that ship the beats that

403
00:20:41,356 --> 00:20:46,436
Speaker 4: used were kind of grime beats, anyway, fast forward, and

404
00:20:46,996 --> 00:20:50,716
Speaker 4: I had this beat that kind of felt like because

405
00:20:51,076 --> 00:20:54,476
Speaker 4: with the nature of sick beats, you change it from

406
00:20:54,476 --> 00:20:58,916
Speaker 4: one twenty to one forty to one sixty to one eighty.

407
00:20:59,596 --> 00:21:04,756
Speaker 4: You've just gone through techno, garage, house drum and bass,

408
00:21:05,436 --> 00:21:07,796
Speaker 4: you know, and all those things. You put that beat

409
00:21:07,836 --> 00:21:10,356
Speaker 4: on no matter what the speed was on that fucking dancel,

410
00:21:10,556 --> 00:21:12,236
Speaker 4: and I wanted a beat that you can do that with.

411
00:21:12,916 --> 00:21:16,036
Speaker 4: I mean, I'm guessing it's probably one fifteen or something

412
00:21:16,036 --> 00:21:18,556
Speaker 4: one two three, one two three, okay, so yeah, it's

413
00:21:18,636 --> 00:21:21,716
Speaker 4: technical beat, but it's got that kind of pushing Paul swing.

414
00:21:22,156 --> 00:21:25,156
Speaker 4: So it's like this was in our head, wasn't it.

415
00:21:25,396 --> 00:21:28,356
Speaker 4: And then like I started playing the thing, and then

416
00:21:28,436 --> 00:21:30,716
Speaker 4: bon took over because I was playing this bass line

417
00:21:30,756 --> 00:21:34,236
Speaker 4: on that an open bodied bass, she started feeding back

418
00:21:34,316 --> 00:21:37,196
Speaker 4: like fuck on this pokea. So I was like, play

419
00:21:37,236 --> 00:21:40,956
Speaker 4: that bassline with like this, and obviously I don't use

420
00:21:41,036 --> 00:21:43,956
Speaker 4: feedback and ship that's busting. So he just finessed it.

421
00:21:43,956 --> 00:21:44,756
Speaker 4: It sounded sick.

422
00:21:45,636 --> 00:21:47,916
Speaker 1: It was that thing. It basically he was he was.

423
00:21:47,956 --> 00:21:50,956
Speaker 5: He was playing it and you heard the the original

424
00:21:51,036 --> 00:21:54,036
Speaker 5: note and then the feedback was creating the harmonic.

425
00:21:54,156 --> 00:21:56,476
Speaker 1: But because it was a because there was a hollow body.

426
00:21:56,556 --> 00:21:58,796
Speaker 5: You still had the original note in there as well,

427
00:21:59,076 --> 00:22:01,876
Speaker 5: so it made this chord and I was like, oh,

428
00:22:01,956 --> 00:22:04,596
Speaker 5: can you did you change the feedback home?

429
00:22:04,756 --> 00:22:08,556
Speaker 4: And was like I could keep hitting this single now

430
00:22:08,716 --> 00:22:12,356
Speaker 4: for so I read him and then we're like walking around.

431
00:22:12,396 --> 00:22:13,756
Speaker 1: I was trying to find it. Was like, where's the

432
00:22:13,756 --> 00:22:15,916
Speaker 1: next note in the secrets? Where? And where is? Where

433
00:22:15,916 --> 00:22:17,796
Speaker 1: does it? We find it? And I was like, ah, ship,

434
00:22:17,956 --> 00:22:20,836
Speaker 1: we got it, and we got the we got the sequence.

435
00:22:20,956 --> 00:22:23,356
Speaker 4: In order, and then that was it and like we

436
00:22:23,556 --> 00:22:27,036
Speaker 4: we fucking it didn't sound like but Bowen added the

437
00:22:27,076 --> 00:22:30,316
Speaker 4: chords later on on the on the on the Prophet, which.

438
00:22:30,516 --> 00:22:31,756
Speaker 1: For me finess.

439
00:22:32,556 --> 00:22:35,636
Speaker 4: But like in between that and that, Kenny and I

440
00:22:35,676 --> 00:22:38,636
Speaker 4: are in the studio next door to these guys.

441
00:22:38,316 --> 00:22:40,156
Speaker 1: In Frank Kenny beats. Yeah. Boy.

442
00:22:40,396 --> 00:22:42,956
Speaker 2: I texted him yesterday that this is my ship. I

443
00:22:42,996 --> 00:22:45,796
Speaker 2: was like, yo, Roy, it's crazy, glad.

444
00:22:45,596 --> 00:22:45,916
Speaker 1: You like it.

445
00:22:46,236 --> 00:22:47,956
Speaker 3: I don't know if he worked on that one or not, but.

446
00:22:48,276 --> 00:22:50,316
Speaker 4: Work everything, yeah, he said with us the whole son.

447
00:22:51,436 --> 00:22:54,276
Speaker 4: So I was in there and I was like, I

448
00:22:54,676 --> 00:22:59,276
Speaker 4: was like started going in hard. Kenny was like, nah,

449
00:22:59,516 --> 00:23:01,956
Speaker 4: they say't that what are you doing I was like okay,

450
00:23:02,556 --> 00:23:04,876
Speaker 4: and then he You know, Kenny's got this amazing way

451
00:23:04,916 --> 00:23:08,636
Speaker 4: of just like he's very intuitive and he understands the

452
00:23:08,676 --> 00:23:12,036
Speaker 4: person as a musician. So what I mean by that

453
00:23:12,156 --> 00:23:17,716
Speaker 4: is any person can sing, but a musician understands how

454
00:23:17,916 --> 00:23:23,956
Speaker 4: to create a dialect of you outwardly. So you have

455
00:23:24,436 --> 00:23:27,956
Speaker 4: an internalized group of masks that are all you. They're

456
00:23:27,956 --> 00:23:31,556
Speaker 4: all true, but they come in cadence, they come in intonation,

457
00:23:31,876 --> 00:23:35,476
Speaker 4: they come in a timber, whatever it is tone.

458
00:23:36,556 --> 00:23:39,796
Speaker 1: You can use that to.

459
00:23:38,916 --> 00:23:43,116
Speaker 4: Truly portray your person who you really are, and like

460
00:23:43,236 --> 00:23:47,916
Speaker 4: that comes from somewhere within that you lack. You have

461
00:23:47,996 --> 00:23:51,236
Speaker 4: to have that openness with yourself and try new shit

462
00:23:51,356 --> 00:23:53,956
Speaker 4: to you Like that is that's it. That was me

463
00:23:54,036 --> 00:23:55,716
Speaker 4: when I was twelve, and that's how I want to

464
00:23:55,716 --> 00:23:59,156
Speaker 4: sing on this tune. I listen, this song reminds me

465
00:23:59,196 --> 00:24:01,876
Speaker 4: of the Cordetts and that was a time of innocence.

466
00:24:01,916 --> 00:24:04,476
Speaker 4: I'm going to sing with that innocent twelve year old

467
00:24:04,516 --> 00:24:06,956
Speaker 4: voice because that's what this song is and that's who

468
00:24:06,996 --> 00:24:09,596
Speaker 4: I am on this song. But you Need One is

469
00:24:09,676 --> 00:24:12,996
Speaker 4: incredible as Kenny pets, he puts you in there, he

470
00:24:13,076 --> 00:24:16,036
Speaker 4: goes think about where you are right now.

471
00:24:16,116 --> 00:24:17,156
Speaker 1: Think about who you are.

472
00:24:17,596 --> 00:24:20,876
Speaker 4: Remember when you told me that thing six months ago

473
00:24:20,996 --> 00:24:23,476
Speaker 4: about your mother that day and you said that thing

474
00:24:23,956 --> 00:24:26,636
Speaker 4: that's you right now go and you'd be like, that's

475
00:24:26,676 --> 00:24:30,316
Speaker 4: it brings out that thing and that's the voice, but

476
00:24:30,396 --> 00:24:33,516
Speaker 4: that's the dimerstudy musician, and a karaoke thing is that

477
00:24:33,556 --> 00:24:34,276
Speaker 4: you can easily.

478
00:24:34,636 --> 00:24:35,156
Speaker 1: I was doing it the.

479
00:24:35,196 --> 00:24:37,516
Speaker 4: Other day we covered the Warpman and I was I

480
00:24:37,676 --> 00:24:39,796
Speaker 4: just basically was trying. It sounded like I was trying

481
00:24:39,796 --> 00:24:43,396
Speaker 4: to sit like Hamilton Lighthouse. Obviously that guy's much better

482
00:24:43,436 --> 00:24:45,796
Speaker 4: voice than me, and I reined in. But I know

483
00:24:46,236 --> 00:24:48,556
Speaker 4: Kenny in my head like what you do it? And

484
00:24:48,596 --> 00:24:50,996
Speaker 4: I was like, okay, what will Kenny do? You know,

485
00:24:51,476 --> 00:24:54,116
Speaker 4: you have to find why you want to sing that

486
00:24:54,196 --> 00:24:58,316
Speaker 4: song and then you portray that with your skill set.

487
00:24:58,476 --> 00:25:00,076
Speaker 3: Right, that's great, I mean, that's beautiful.

488
00:25:00,116 --> 00:25:03,356
Speaker 2: I mean back to the fifties and sixties point, it's like,

489
00:25:03,676 --> 00:25:06,396
Speaker 2: how many times did artists do I mean they weren't covers,

490
00:25:06,396 --> 00:25:08,636
Speaker 2: but like versions of things, and they weren't covers because

491
00:25:08,636 --> 00:25:11,196
Speaker 2: they didn't just like ape whatever the I mean, sometimes

492
00:25:11,196 --> 00:25:13,876
Speaker 2: they did, but a lot of the great you know,

493
00:25:14,036 --> 00:25:17,916
Speaker 2: Aretha's respect per version versus Otises. It's like they're both beautiful,

494
00:25:17,956 --> 00:25:22,156
Speaker 2: but Aretha clearly had a vision of herself for that song.

495
00:25:22,236 --> 00:25:24,356
Speaker 2: You know, there wasn't just let's do what Otis did

496
00:25:24,396 --> 00:25:24,636
Speaker 2: you know?

497
00:25:25,116 --> 00:25:26,956
Speaker 4: It's also like if you go back to the early

498
00:25:27,076 --> 00:25:30,636
Speaker 4: first UK and US top tens, there would be three

499
00:25:30,716 --> 00:25:32,996
Speaker 4: versions of the same song in the top ten. Yeah

500
00:25:33,116 --> 00:25:37,356
Speaker 4: that's fucking well, but that's it. Like good example, I

501
00:25:37,476 --> 00:25:41,436
Speaker 4: thought that a Change Is Gonna Come was by Otis reading.

502
00:25:41,676 --> 00:25:45,556
Speaker 4: I didn't realize it was Sam Cooked until like muchs later,

503
00:25:46,156 --> 00:25:49,436
Speaker 4: and like I was like, does that mean in my

504
00:25:49,596 --> 00:25:52,276
Speaker 4: head that Otis owns it? Because it's the one that

505
00:25:52,316 --> 00:25:56,076
Speaker 4: I believe, But like the context of Sam Cook and

506
00:25:56,116 --> 00:25:58,036
Speaker 4: the reason why I wrote it and the bravery it

507
00:25:58,076 --> 00:25:58,956
Speaker 4: took for him to do.

508
00:25:58,876 --> 00:25:59,796
Speaker 1: That, it's insane.

509
00:26:00,076 --> 00:26:02,316
Speaker 4: Yeah, like if you put that in context of the

510
00:26:02,356 --> 00:26:06,116
Speaker 4: pop machine then and how racist it was, the bravery

511
00:26:06,196 --> 00:26:11,876
Speaker 4: is untouchable. But that I'm like this Besides, the point

512
00:26:12,116 --> 00:26:15,996
Speaker 4: is virgin is the one because it's it's what I

513
00:26:16,076 --> 00:26:19,396
Speaker 4: learned it to be, And like I think it's like

514
00:26:19,676 --> 00:26:23,036
Speaker 4: if that's a sense of ownership, like if I own

515
00:26:23,956 --> 00:26:29,116
Speaker 4: the Walkman's song and make it mine, because I mean it,

516
00:26:29,116 --> 00:26:31,676
Speaker 4: it's not my writing, but if I mean it, then

517
00:26:31,716 --> 00:26:33,836
Speaker 4: it's it's as beautiful.

518
00:26:33,556 --> 00:26:33,756
Speaker 5: You know.

519
00:26:34,396 --> 00:26:34,836
Speaker 1: I agree.

520
00:26:34,876 --> 00:26:36,916
Speaker 2: I wish that way of thinking was a little more

521
00:26:36,916 --> 00:26:38,996
Speaker 2: prevalent in music because it's like there, I mean, why

522
00:26:39,076 --> 00:26:41,756
Speaker 2: not pull from other things, you know, like make a

523
00:26:41,836 --> 00:26:45,036
Speaker 2: song yours like that kind of adding that kind of

524
00:26:45,596 --> 00:26:47,876
Speaker 2: variety back in the music would help make it, in

525
00:26:47,916 --> 00:26:48,916
Speaker 2: my view, more interesting.

526
00:26:49,356 --> 00:26:52,276
Speaker 4: There's issues there, like if you like, I mean, how

527
00:26:52,276 --> 00:26:54,796
Speaker 4: many writers did Harry Stele sound on that album? And

528
00:26:54,876 --> 00:26:56,316
Speaker 4: you get credit on all of it? I don't know

529
00:26:56,316 --> 00:26:59,076
Speaker 4: how much he wrote. I'm not criticizing the guy obviously,

530
00:26:59,356 --> 00:27:01,676
Speaker 4: Like I'm not gonna lie. I like Harry Starles's music,

531
00:27:02,276 --> 00:27:05,716
Speaker 4: but like obviously had lots of writers on that, and

532
00:27:06,316 --> 00:27:08,236
Speaker 4: I don't know whether I want to know that or

533
00:27:08,276 --> 00:27:10,996
Speaker 4: I don't think if I thought that Harry Steals wrote

534
00:27:10,996 --> 00:27:14,356
Speaker 4: it all, I'd enjoy even more. Yeah, not all of it.

535
00:27:14,436 --> 00:27:16,756
Speaker 4: I just like his singles. Some of them are really

536
00:27:16,876 --> 00:27:21,796
Speaker 4: good pop songs. I think like knowing that an artist has.

537
00:27:22,036 --> 00:27:23,996
Speaker 4: But like I think Frank Hoschsin is a great example.

538
00:27:24,076 --> 00:27:27,556
Speaker 4: How many producers does does he work with? And it's

539
00:27:27,596 --> 00:27:31,316
Speaker 4: still incredible to me? So I guess it's I don't know,

540
00:27:31,356 --> 00:27:33,596
Speaker 4: it's a cut us as well. I think I just

541
00:27:33,636 --> 00:27:35,076
Speaker 4: the less I know the better when it.

542
00:27:35,036 --> 00:27:37,796
Speaker 1: Comes to that stuff. I think, you know, that's it.

543
00:27:37,876 --> 00:27:40,956
Speaker 4: If you ignore all the bullshit and the noise around

544
00:27:40,996 --> 00:27:43,396
Speaker 4: the song, it's a good song. Because one of the

545
00:27:43,396 --> 00:27:48,116
Speaker 4: things I fucking hate that he's gatekeeping pricks in music

546
00:27:48,516 --> 00:27:51,036
Speaker 4: to think that you're not allowed to like something because

547
00:27:51,076 --> 00:27:54,196
Speaker 4: it's like in the pop machine or you know what

548
00:27:54,236 --> 00:27:56,716
Speaker 4: I mean, Like, you know, I got no time for

549
00:27:56,756 --> 00:27:59,236
Speaker 4: that ship. I think a good song is a good song.

550
00:27:59,356 --> 00:28:02,476
Speaker 4: The less I know the better because I'm a judgmental prick.

551
00:28:04,796 --> 00:28:06,236
Speaker 2: It's good to know about It's a good thing to

552
00:28:06,236 --> 00:28:08,556
Speaker 2: know about yourself, you know, as you move through the world.

553
00:28:09,236 --> 00:28:11,076
Speaker 1: I appreciate you three therapy man.

554
00:28:11,236 --> 00:28:15,596
Speaker 5: But I mean, but that's it. The mystery is key,

555
00:28:15,716 --> 00:28:20,916
Speaker 5: I think, especially since becoming musicians full time and as

556
00:28:20,956 --> 00:28:24,796
Speaker 5: a producer, and you kind of look behind the wizard's

557
00:28:24,836 --> 00:28:27,796
Speaker 5: curtain and it does dissolve away some of the mystery,

558
00:28:28,196 --> 00:28:31,716
Speaker 5: and it's kind of really, I'm not as enthusiastic about

559
00:28:31,716 --> 00:28:35,276
Speaker 5: other people's music anymore as I once was because I've

560
00:28:35,276 --> 00:28:36,756
Speaker 5: lost some of the sense of mystery.

561
00:28:37,036 --> 00:28:40,756
Speaker 2: Yeah, has it made making your music less fun in

562
00:28:40,756 --> 00:28:42,916
Speaker 2: a way too, or no, no.

563
00:28:42,596 --> 00:28:44,556
Speaker 1: No, not at all. That's the thing.

564
00:28:44,676 --> 00:28:49,236
Speaker 5: It's not added to that experience because I've got more

565
00:28:50,196 --> 00:28:54,236
Speaker 5: control to the chaos to happen. You know, we're not

566
00:28:54,276 --> 00:28:57,236
Speaker 5: sat behind the producer who's in front of us and

567
00:28:57,316 --> 00:29:01,036
Speaker 5: they're in charge of all this stuff and they're gatekeeping

568
00:29:01,116 --> 00:29:03,876
Speaker 5: some of the information and some of the way we

569
00:29:03,876 --> 00:29:07,156
Speaker 5: could go about stuff. No, I'm stood up there and

570
00:29:07,196 --> 00:29:10,476
Speaker 5: I'm going now, or you know, let's do this like

571
00:29:10,516 --> 00:29:12,716
Speaker 5: that was that was a big thing move on this

572
00:29:12,836 --> 00:29:15,876
Speaker 5: album was about what we've done before in the past,

573
00:29:15,996 --> 00:29:18,076
Speaker 5: and this isn't the negative things. Is just what happens

574
00:29:18,116 --> 00:29:20,196
Speaker 5: with bands, especially when they don't know a lot of

575
00:29:20,236 --> 00:29:25,716
Speaker 5: that about production is you bring the music, it guides

576
00:29:25,796 --> 00:29:29,676
Speaker 5: the production, but it's you're never able to completely one

577
00:29:29,796 --> 00:29:32,916
Speaker 5: hundred percent get what you were trying to guide because

578
00:29:33,476 --> 00:29:36,596
Speaker 5: there's a confluence through the producer that go through. And

579
00:29:36,676 --> 00:29:38,556
Speaker 5: what I wanted on this one was I wanted the

580
00:29:38,556 --> 00:29:43,596
Speaker 5: production to inform the writing so that it was all unified.

581
00:29:43,956 --> 00:29:46,196
Speaker 5: So that's why, you know, like on pop Up Up,

582
00:29:46,196 --> 00:29:48,316
Speaker 5: we were just talking about one of the reasons that

583
00:29:48,396 --> 00:29:51,516
Speaker 5: song is so successful in that achievement around the UK

584
00:29:51,556 --> 00:29:54,716
Speaker 5: garage kind of like aspect of it is because it's

585
00:29:54,716 --> 00:29:57,276
Speaker 5: on a tape loop, and because the tape loop, because

586
00:29:57,316 --> 00:30:00,916
Speaker 5: you're only hearing four snares, ever those snares on repeat,

587
00:30:00,956 --> 00:30:03,956
Speaker 5: it becomes a drum machine. It becomes that that thing

588
00:30:04,036 --> 00:30:06,036
Speaker 5: that you can patch on to you know, what's coming

589
00:30:06,116 --> 00:30:09,076
Speaker 5: up next to you, that repeated rhythm thing. But even

590
00:30:09,556 --> 00:30:13,556
Speaker 5: further down the line, I mean it's like, yes, no,

591
00:30:13,756 --> 00:30:15,916
Speaker 5: I can hear when that's happening in other people's music

592
00:30:15,956 --> 00:30:17,716
Speaker 5: and you're like, you know, it's kind of like why

593
00:30:17,796 --> 00:30:18,436
Speaker 5: is that so cool?

594
00:30:18,436 --> 00:30:19,756
Speaker 1: And I know why it's so cool.

595
00:30:20,036 --> 00:30:22,276
Speaker 5: That kind of removes some of the mystery, but it

596
00:30:22,356 --> 00:30:25,036
Speaker 5: also kind of adds another.

597
00:30:24,756 --> 00:30:25,996
Speaker 1: Tool to the expression.

598
00:30:26,596 --> 00:30:29,476
Speaker 5: Yeah, whereas before we were like we got so close

599
00:30:29,516 --> 00:30:32,236
Speaker 5: with that, but it's not it. Now we're like, we

600
00:30:32,356 --> 00:30:34,716
Speaker 5: got it, we got it, We've got the thing we're set.

601
00:30:34,556 --> 00:30:35,036
Speaker 1: At night to do.

602
00:30:35,716 --> 00:30:38,956
Speaker 2: I imagine working with Nigel god Rich too, is like a

603
00:30:38,996 --> 00:30:41,876
Speaker 2: big aid in that way, right, like in terms of

604
00:30:41,916 --> 00:30:45,076
Speaker 2: creating a more organic process between the writing and the

605
00:30:45,076 --> 00:30:47,396
Speaker 2: production and all that. Kenny, having Kenny, both Kenny and

606
00:30:47,476 --> 00:30:48,836
Speaker 2: Nigel involved.

607
00:30:48,556 --> 00:30:49,596
Speaker 1: Yeah, very much too.

608
00:30:49,796 --> 00:30:53,276
Speaker 5: I'm like absolutely The cool thing about working with Nigel

609
00:30:53,476 --> 00:30:56,156
Speaker 5: is that it's again coming back to that fifties and

610
00:30:56,196 --> 00:30:59,676
Speaker 5: sixties pop stuff. There is nothing that Nigel god Pritz does.

611
00:30:59,836 --> 00:31:02,596
Speaker 5: I mean, he likes to keep the mystery alive. He

612
00:31:02,636 --> 00:31:05,036
Speaker 5: doesn't like talking about his process too much. But there

613
00:31:05,076 --> 00:31:07,636
Speaker 5: is nothing that Nigel Godrich does that people weren't doing

614
00:31:07,676 --> 00:31:08,356
Speaker 5: in the sixties.

615
00:31:09,316 --> 00:31:11,876
Speaker 1: It's just a taste things tape.

616
00:31:11,916 --> 00:31:15,796
Speaker 5: It's all these old crappy eyeboard stuff that's broken. It's

617
00:31:15,796 --> 00:31:18,356
Speaker 5: all working around the restrictions of what you have to hand.

618
00:31:18,716 --> 00:31:20,836
Speaker 5: That's what I love, and I think that that's very

619
00:31:21,556 --> 00:31:25,476
Speaker 5: rare these days because we've all got access to everything. Yeah,

620
00:31:25,756 --> 00:31:28,756
Speaker 5: you know, you've got splice, You've got like all your

621
00:31:28,836 --> 00:31:32,316
Speaker 5: loop banks, you've got any kind of like process that

622
00:31:32,436 --> 00:31:34,316
Speaker 5: you want to hand. You can just you know, download

623
00:31:34,356 --> 00:31:36,396
Speaker 5: the vst you and a where you go. You've you've

624
00:31:36,436 --> 00:31:40,356
Speaker 5: got any kind of processing that you want. And you're

625
00:31:40,796 --> 00:31:44,316
Speaker 5: losing the restriction that creates creativity, and you're losing the

626
00:31:44,396 --> 00:31:49,116
Speaker 5: restriction that allows you to relinquish some of the control

627
00:31:50,316 --> 00:31:52,596
Speaker 5: because you're like, oh, this is the way that its

628
00:31:52,636 --> 00:31:56,556
Speaker 5: signs going through this great you know, like and once

629
00:31:56,636 --> 00:31:58,436
Speaker 5: once you get into certain places and you find that

630
00:31:58,516 --> 00:32:01,916
Speaker 5: little patch, the little thing, you know, like a weaverb

631
00:32:02,076 --> 00:32:05,276
Speaker 5: or something like that, that just that will inform the

632
00:32:05,396 --> 00:32:07,676
Speaker 5: sign to the rest of the album. As long as

633
00:32:07,716 --> 00:32:10,356
Speaker 5: there's a drum going there, something else in the background,

634
00:32:10,356 --> 00:32:13,276
Speaker 5: the vocals splashing the rhyme, it'll feel like the album.

635
00:32:14,276 --> 00:32:18,116
Speaker 1: So that was that was really cool. He challenged us

636
00:32:18,156 --> 00:32:19,156
Speaker 1: all in the right way.

637
00:32:20,076 --> 00:32:23,596
Speaker 4: I found it very difficult to start, but he was

638
00:32:23,756 --> 00:32:28,676
Speaker 4: very patient and insightful. He was intent on making us

639
00:32:29,476 --> 00:32:33,476
Speaker 4: as accomplished and brilliant as possible, and that meant being

640
00:32:33,636 --> 00:32:42,556
Speaker 4: uncomfortable and challenged. And he is forthright in making the

641
00:32:42,676 --> 00:32:45,476
Speaker 4: best of a song and an album as Kenny is,

642
00:32:46,196 --> 00:32:50,036
Speaker 4: and he worked us and he worked as brilliantly, and

643
00:32:50,156 --> 00:32:54,196
Speaker 4: I'm very fucking grateful that he allowed us the opportunity

644
00:32:54,516 --> 00:32:57,396
Speaker 4: to make something great, because you know, it's like it's

645
00:32:57,436 --> 00:33:00,316
Speaker 4: a steep learning curve keeping up with Nudge, Godrich and

646
00:33:00,396 --> 00:33:05,836
Speaker 4: Kenny beats. Yeah, it's not that fucking around time. It's

647
00:33:05,876 --> 00:33:09,036
Speaker 4: about learning, and I'm very grateful that they were all

648
00:33:09,236 --> 00:33:12,796
Speaker 4: so willing to learn. I hope we can continue for

649
00:33:12,876 --> 00:33:16,036
Speaker 4: at least one more album. If you're listening to Nodule

650
00:33:16,876 --> 00:33:18,396
Speaker 4: I'm fucking coming for you, boy.

651
00:33:20,876 --> 00:33:26,356
Speaker 2: I'm sure he loves to hear that. We're gonna pause

652
00:33:26,396 --> 00:33:28,316
Speaker 2: for one last quick break and then come back with

653
00:33:28,396 --> 00:33:36,196
Speaker 2: the rest of my conversation with Idols. We're back with

654
00:33:36,276 --> 00:33:38,756
Speaker 2: the rest of my conversation with Joe Tarbott and Mark

655
00:33:38,836 --> 00:33:39,956
Speaker 2: Bowen of Idols.

656
00:33:40,836 --> 00:33:42,396
Speaker 3: Were you fucking around it? You really know? The next

657
00:33:42,436 --> 00:33:43,316
Speaker 3: album is the name.

658
00:33:43,956 --> 00:33:46,996
Speaker 4: I'm never fucking around No, I mean I am, but

659
00:33:47,236 --> 00:33:50,276
Speaker 4: not like not with that stuff like that. Now I've

660
00:33:50,356 --> 00:33:51,036
Speaker 4: got it, it's on.

661
00:33:51,236 --> 00:33:55,036
Speaker 1: It's on lock Yeah, Okay, this is the latest he's

662
00:33:55,036 --> 00:33:55,316
Speaker 1: done this.

663
00:33:55,516 --> 00:33:57,196
Speaker 5: By the way, he's normally doing it when we're in

664
00:33:57,276 --> 00:34:00,876
Speaker 5: the studio working on the album, and then it becomes

665
00:34:00,916 --> 00:34:03,956
Speaker 5: all he talks about. It's normally when he's done his vocals,

666
00:34:03,996 --> 00:34:05,676
Speaker 5: he's like, so, guys, ive got the book on your.

667
00:34:06,556 --> 00:34:08,796
Speaker 1: Still drums recording on this song? You know?

668
00:34:08,916 --> 00:34:12,836
Speaker 4: It's like yeah, but I mean and me and both

669
00:34:12,916 --> 00:34:16,956
Speaker 4: talked about it two days ago over coffee in the morning,

670
00:34:17,636 --> 00:34:18,476
Speaker 4: and I was like, I've got it.

671
00:34:18,556 --> 00:34:22,236
Speaker 1: I've got a new title. I've got it, and sometimes

672
00:34:22,916 --> 00:34:26,236
Speaker 1: it's not right now. The first the first one, like

673
00:34:27,796 --> 00:34:28,796
Speaker 1: a Tomorrow, is going.

674
00:34:28,796 --> 00:34:33,316
Speaker 4: To be called Meditations wasn't it, because that was about stoicism,

675
00:34:34,276 --> 00:34:36,236
Speaker 4: and I realized I'm not patient enough to be a

676
00:34:36,316 --> 00:34:37,796
Speaker 4: stoic raga punk something.

677
00:34:38,876 --> 00:34:40,796
Speaker 1: So yeah, the King.

678
00:34:41,436 --> 00:34:43,236
Speaker 4: It's a rough time to be saying fuck the King. Man,

679
00:34:43,276 --> 00:34:45,636
Speaker 4: I don't no, no, no no, it's not no no, no,

680
00:34:45,716 --> 00:34:47,876
Speaker 4: no no. There's a there's a separation, you see. You

681
00:34:47,996 --> 00:34:50,596
Speaker 4: need to understand. And it's a good opportunity on the podcast,

682
00:34:50,636 --> 00:34:53,156
Speaker 4: so you was to do that. There is a difference

683
00:34:53,676 --> 00:34:57,036
Speaker 4: as a citizen of our country between the human being

684
00:34:57,356 --> 00:35:00,636
Speaker 4: that is Charles who has cancer. There's nothing fucking brave

685
00:35:00,876 --> 00:35:05,476
Speaker 4: or funny about celebrating someone else's demids with cancer. It's

686
00:35:05,556 --> 00:35:10,516
Speaker 4: pathetic and stupid. But I will for despise the monarchy

687
00:35:10,636 --> 00:35:13,956
Speaker 4: until it's abolished. There are people starving in our country

688
00:35:14,436 --> 00:35:17,996
Speaker 4: and the poor have been blamed for shit that our

689
00:35:18,116 --> 00:35:24,036
Speaker 4: government and the aristocracy have implemented, and our country is

690
00:35:24,116 --> 00:35:26,996
Speaker 4: falling apart because of that, because of the greally one

691
00:35:27,036 --> 00:35:30,916
Speaker 4: percent and the fucking horrid shit that they're getting away

692
00:35:30,996 --> 00:35:33,676
Speaker 4: with on a daily basis, one of which is the monarchy.

693
00:35:34,036 --> 00:35:35,036
Speaker 1: It needs to stop.

694
00:35:35,316 --> 00:35:37,836
Speaker 4: And until that happens, I will say fuck the King

695
00:35:37,916 --> 00:35:40,596
Speaker 4: with my eyes wide open. I know what I'm saying,

696
00:35:40,796 --> 00:35:44,116
Speaker 4: and I fucking mean it. Fuck the king and everyone

697
00:35:44,236 --> 00:35:45,116
Speaker 4: that reigns after it.

698
00:35:45,596 --> 00:35:46,996
Speaker 3: It's not my place to speak on that. I just

699
00:35:47,156 --> 00:35:48,196
Speaker 3: going to say I love the conviction.

700
00:35:48,596 --> 00:35:52,276
Speaker 1: Yeah, as a human being, I want for better all.

701
00:35:52,796 --> 00:35:57,156
Speaker 3: Ultimately, you seem consumed and driven by passion. You see

702
00:35:57,556 --> 00:36:00,516
Speaker 3: a better way forward, a vision for something to be better,

703
00:36:00,676 --> 00:36:04,396
Speaker 3: to be fair and just. It's not and I like that.

704
00:36:04,636 --> 00:36:06,516
Speaker 4: You know there's a fine line in this while I'm

705
00:36:06,556 --> 00:36:09,876
Speaker 4: exploring different tones and the produties to my message, because

706
00:36:09,876 --> 00:36:13,356
Speaker 4: I understand I've come across as a sanctimonious prick, and

707
00:36:13,436 --> 00:36:15,716
Speaker 4: the last thing I do is judge someone who I

708
00:36:15,836 --> 00:36:19,716
Speaker 4: feel is making a loveless choice in a voting ballad,

709
00:36:19,916 --> 00:36:22,556
Speaker 4: or a loveless choice when they're crossing a rod, or

710
00:36:22,596 --> 00:36:25,436
Speaker 4: a loveless choice when they say something to someone online

711
00:36:26,276 --> 00:36:29,196
Speaker 4: like I may judge their action, but I understand the

712
00:36:29,276 --> 00:36:36,796
Speaker 4: person behind that bullshit is scared, frustrated, hungry, fucking exhausted,

713
00:36:37,076 --> 00:36:41,316
Speaker 4: overworked all these things. And you know it's up to ask,

714
00:36:41,396 --> 00:36:44,716
Speaker 4: as a purveyors of messages within the populace, to try

715
00:36:44,756 --> 00:36:47,076
Speaker 4: and cut through the lines in order to create a

716
00:36:47,196 --> 00:36:50,276
Speaker 4: sense of empathy and love in order to move forward

717
00:36:50,476 --> 00:36:54,396
Speaker 4: with grace and power. That is, the people connecting on

718
00:36:54,516 --> 00:36:55,316
Speaker 4: a human level.

719
00:36:55,716 --> 00:36:57,236
Speaker 2: Were you a reader growing up? You have such a

720
00:36:57,356 --> 00:36:59,876
Speaker 2: really beautiful way with words. You know, whether it's lyrics,

721
00:37:00,076 --> 00:37:03,996
Speaker 2: whether it's speaking extemporaneously. You know how to wield the

722
00:37:04,076 --> 00:37:04,796
Speaker 2: power of words.

723
00:37:04,876 --> 00:37:07,796
Speaker 7: Man, you know, I think I'm got tired of breaking

724
00:37:07,836 --> 00:37:12,276
Speaker 7: my knuckles. You needed another way to exp like that,

725
00:37:12,716 --> 00:37:15,076
Speaker 7: And you really almost punched the wall in the other room.

726
00:37:15,196 --> 00:37:16,356
Speaker 3: That that was me.

727
00:37:16,596 --> 00:37:18,996
Speaker 4: I would never punch a wall. Yeah, I think my

728
00:37:19,156 --> 00:37:22,196
Speaker 4: friend said it brilliantly once when I was younger. He

729
00:37:22,356 --> 00:37:25,036
Speaker 4: was just like, there's nothing more stupid than losing a

730
00:37:25,156 --> 00:37:30,036
Speaker 4: fight to an object. Yeah, it's like, yeah, you're never

731
00:37:30,116 --> 00:37:30,956
Speaker 4: going away either.

732
00:37:32,556 --> 00:37:32,676
Speaker 1: Now.

733
00:37:32,836 --> 00:37:35,596
Speaker 4: What I meant was, I was very I was very frustrated,

734
00:37:35,796 --> 00:37:38,956
Speaker 4: and when my frustrations come out outwardly, I understand that

735
00:37:39,036 --> 00:37:42,636
Speaker 4: comes across quite aggressive. So I needed to cool off

736
00:37:42,716 --> 00:37:46,516
Speaker 4: and then just process it with Bone because Bones very

737
00:37:46,636 --> 00:37:49,396
Speaker 4: level headed and pragmatic when it comes to ship like that,

738
00:37:49,516 --> 00:37:51,956
Speaker 4: and he's who I trust, So I go to him

739
00:37:52,316 --> 00:37:55,516
Speaker 4: that I'm not punching anything, not anymore.

740
00:37:56,716 --> 00:37:59,516
Speaker 5: It's often that kind of like that aggressive kind of

741
00:37:59,596 --> 00:38:03,996
Speaker 5: angry approaches from a place of afters because you expect better.

742
00:38:04,356 --> 00:38:06,836
Speaker 1: You hope, yeah, for more from the world.

743
00:38:06,916 --> 00:38:10,996
Speaker 5: Do you hope for kindness, empathy and understand thing and

744
00:38:11,156 --> 00:38:13,836
Speaker 5: people to be as passionate, as driven them as as

745
00:38:14,716 --> 00:38:17,316
Speaker 5: wanting the best as you do, and then you get

746
00:38:17,316 --> 00:38:18,196
Speaker 5: disappointed by that.

747
00:38:18,676 --> 00:38:21,316
Speaker 4: But yeah, I mean the other thing is that I'm

748
00:38:21,396 --> 00:38:23,676
Speaker 4: just like, you know, you've got to do it yourself.

749
00:38:24,076 --> 00:38:26,396
Speaker 4: It doesn't get done right. That's that's what me and

750
00:38:26,516 --> 00:38:28,036
Speaker 4: Marco will manage to slime.

751
00:38:28,556 --> 00:38:31,476
Speaker 1: That's we're unnet stoicism as well.

752
00:38:31,756 --> 00:38:34,996
Speaker 5: Yeah, you're slowly coming round to the basically Marcus school

753
00:38:35,076 --> 00:38:37,156
Speaker 5: really is you are not Marcus really.

754
00:38:37,116 --> 00:38:40,036
Speaker 2: Is making picture Joe as a as a stoic. I mean,

755
00:38:40,116 --> 00:38:42,516
Speaker 2: maybe you know, borrow some tenants. It just doesn't really

756
00:38:42,556 --> 00:38:43,436
Speaker 2: seem like you can wear that.

757
00:38:43,676 --> 00:38:48,676
Speaker 5: Yeah, speaking as Marcus really is tattooed on his ribs,

758
00:38:49,796 --> 00:38:51,196
Speaker 5: you are on the journey too.

759
00:38:51,836 --> 00:38:57,276
Speaker 1: But I'm more, I'm more I'm Biggie Smalls. I got tired.

760
00:38:57,556 --> 00:38:59,556
Speaker 3: If you see more two PACs recorded me than.

761
00:39:01,036 --> 00:39:01,556
Speaker 1: That's true.

762
00:39:01,636 --> 00:39:05,436
Speaker 4: That yeah, I'd say artistically, but I never got I

763
00:39:05,556 --> 00:39:06,916
Speaker 4: never got on the two packs of music.

764
00:39:06,996 --> 00:39:10,316
Speaker 1: To be fair, I appreciate it. Obviously I'm not fucking stupid,

765
00:39:10,396 --> 00:39:13,676
Speaker 1: but I just I just love the flow.

766
00:39:14,036 --> 00:39:17,196
Speaker 3: The flow a bit off all day, all day.

767
00:39:17,156 --> 00:39:19,196
Speaker 1: Anyway, So fucking.

768
00:39:18,996 --> 00:39:21,196
Speaker 3: Fire hose like Park Man, like you just.

769
00:39:22,956 --> 00:39:24,916
Speaker 2: It's like you watch park and abusing me like this

770
00:39:25,036 --> 00:39:28,036
Speaker 2: motherfucker twenty two was like, it's like this guy was

771
00:39:28,076 --> 00:39:28,796
Speaker 2: a fucking genius.

772
00:39:28,836 --> 00:39:30,236
Speaker 3: It's kind of I'm not. I don't want to call

773
00:39:30,276 --> 00:39:31,476
Speaker 3: you a genius to your face.

774
00:39:31,316 --> 00:39:34,796
Speaker 1: Nor bad. I'm not fucking genius. But here's the thing,

775
00:39:34,956 --> 00:39:38,396
Speaker 1: And I'll tell you what if you listen to his.

776
00:39:40,556 --> 00:39:45,796
Speaker 4: Stunning, glorious, fucking parents and what they stood for, and

777
00:39:46,156 --> 00:39:49,876
Speaker 4: and you know I came from that, I am. I

778
00:39:49,996 --> 00:39:52,436
Speaker 4: am half my mother and half my father, and I

779
00:39:52,516 --> 00:39:55,556
Speaker 4: owe a lot of that today, the moral stance. My

780
00:39:55,676 --> 00:39:59,076
Speaker 4: father's an artist, my mom was a fucking powerhouse, and

781
00:39:59,196 --> 00:40:02,396
Speaker 4: they were full of love and empathy and courage in

782
00:40:02,516 --> 00:40:03,196
Speaker 4: different ways.

783
00:40:03,556 --> 00:40:05,116
Speaker 1: And I'm a product of that.

784
00:40:05,676 --> 00:40:10,116
Speaker 4: My dad was a socialist, is a socialist, and and

785
00:40:10,236 --> 00:40:13,276
Speaker 4: my mom was a fucking beautiful dancer.

786
00:40:14,236 --> 00:40:16,236
Speaker 1: And that that's where I come from.

787
00:40:16,476 --> 00:40:19,956
Speaker 4: And I you know, you can see that to the

788
00:40:19,996 --> 00:40:22,116
Speaker 4: beautiful things that he stood up for, you know, And

789
00:40:22,236 --> 00:40:24,836
Speaker 4: the same as bot I see his parents in him.

790
00:40:25,276 --> 00:40:28,396
Speaker 4: If you know how beautiful and wonderful his parents. His

791
00:40:28,516 --> 00:40:30,676
Speaker 4: mother is a power, his father as the powers in

792
00:40:30,756 --> 00:40:33,596
Speaker 4: different ways, and as a parent. Now I realized it's

793
00:40:33,636 --> 00:40:35,916
Speaker 4: so fucking magic and important.

794
00:40:36,036 --> 00:40:36,316
Speaker 1: That is.

795
00:40:37,236 --> 00:40:40,236
Speaker 3: Yeah, you have a kid. We do, yeah, both of us,

796
00:40:40,356 --> 00:40:44,276
Speaker 3: not together. You guys would make great parents. Are you

797
00:40:44,356 --> 00:40:47,996
Speaker 3: kidding me? Like you guys like the perfect co parent insituation?

798
00:40:48,396 --> 00:40:51,276
Speaker 5: No, no, no, no, no, it's like it's the thing

799
00:40:51,356 --> 00:40:54,676
Speaker 5: about the difference between now. So it's okay whenever. It's like,

800
00:40:54,796 --> 00:40:58,716
Speaker 5: you're creative, baby, but because we can cross each other's lines,

801
00:40:59,396 --> 00:41:01,316
Speaker 5: but I think on parents and it's real tough when

802
00:41:01,356 --> 00:41:02,356
Speaker 5: you cross each other's lines.

803
00:41:02,556 --> 00:41:06,396
Speaker 3: Yeah, yeah, I do want to ask Joe the repetition.

804
00:41:06,876 --> 00:41:09,876
Speaker 1: Yeah, in lyrics, it's really cool.

805
00:41:09,996 --> 00:41:12,756
Speaker 2: I don't know if something you do consciously, if it's

806
00:41:12,756 --> 00:41:15,356
Speaker 2: a float thing because you're in the biggie, if it's

807
00:41:15,436 --> 00:41:18,316
Speaker 2: something to do with the meaning of the words, but

808
00:41:18,556 --> 00:41:20,716
Speaker 2: like it comes up that Yeah.

809
00:41:20,756 --> 00:41:26,596
Speaker 4: I like wordplay, poetry and obviously rap music, so I

810
00:41:26,716 --> 00:41:30,756
Speaker 4: kind of grow up on airprop And is that thing

811
00:41:30,836 --> 00:41:33,916
Speaker 4: about a vocal hook, you know, like a soundple hook

812
00:41:34,076 --> 00:41:36,716
Speaker 4: or a vocal hook, you know, I just see certain

813
00:41:36,756 --> 00:41:39,116
Speaker 4: things like a sledgehammer, if you want to force something

814
00:41:39,236 --> 00:41:45,476
Speaker 4: home and make someone uncomfortable, or make something iconic, iconic

815
00:41:45,636 --> 00:41:49,556
Speaker 4: meaning that if you see, if you squint, you see

816
00:41:49,636 --> 00:41:51,556
Speaker 4: something blurred from a mile away, you know what it

817
00:41:51,676 --> 00:41:53,996
Speaker 4: is because you've seen it before, you've heard it before.

818
00:41:54,836 --> 00:41:57,796
Speaker 4: And I think, like, it's not necessarily my self as

819
00:41:57,876 --> 00:42:00,876
Speaker 4: part of the song, but if you use repetition in

820
00:42:00,996 --> 00:42:03,436
Speaker 4: a way like The Fall did it, there's a lot

821
00:42:03,476 --> 00:42:08,276
Speaker 4: of postport that did it as well, and like, I

822
00:42:08,396 --> 00:42:10,156
Speaker 4: just think it's word play and I think there's many

823
00:42:10,196 --> 00:42:13,276
Speaker 4: ways you can you can be beautiful, and I think

824
00:42:13,356 --> 00:42:16,036
Speaker 4: hip hop's the best example for that obviously.

825
00:42:16,316 --> 00:42:19,676
Speaker 1: Like for me, repetition is one. It's like a tropro

826
00:42:19,716 --> 00:42:22,196
Speaker 1: of us, like it's part of the Bibles is language,

827
00:42:22,396 --> 00:42:23,156
Speaker 1: and on.

828
00:42:23,236 --> 00:42:27,636
Speaker 5: This album, the more so I think in in its

829
00:42:27,716 --> 00:42:30,756
Speaker 5: purest form of garden like samples. I think, like both

830
00:42:30,796 --> 00:42:32,516
Speaker 5: of us, you know, your background is kind of hip

831
00:42:32,556 --> 00:42:35,396
Speaker 5: hop and your influences, and I come like I listened

832
00:42:35,396 --> 00:42:37,876
Speaker 5: to the loops of techno and hard Heus and stuff

833
00:42:37,916 --> 00:42:39,716
Speaker 5: like that as a kid, and so it's all like

834
00:42:39,796 --> 00:42:43,396
Speaker 5: you know, samples and actual repetition of sign and.

835
00:42:43,476 --> 00:42:46,916
Speaker 1: I think on the on this album. We've always tried

836
00:42:46,956 --> 00:42:47,276
Speaker 1: to do that.

837
00:42:47,436 --> 00:42:49,796
Speaker 5: You know, We've done it very in a very post

838
00:42:49,836 --> 00:42:52,436
Speaker 5: punk way, that kind of crowd rock way where you know,

839
00:42:52,476 --> 00:42:54,636
Speaker 5: you've got that motoric B and the bass line and

840
00:42:54,676 --> 00:42:58,356
Speaker 5: it's loop and rind and there's you know, pocket and

841
00:42:58,436 --> 00:42:59,996
Speaker 5: feel kind of comes out of that.

842
00:43:01,476 --> 00:43:05,076
Speaker 1: But like on on Tank, for the first time, we.

843
00:43:05,196 --> 00:43:08,316
Speaker 5: Literally are using samples of our Yeah yeah, yeah, it's

844
00:43:08,396 --> 00:43:11,676
Speaker 5: not all the played it's like, you know, the signed

845
00:43:11,756 --> 00:43:13,436
Speaker 5: on Pop Up Pop. You know, we only got those

846
00:43:13,476 --> 00:43:15,436
Speaker 5: frequencies once. We didn't run through the whole song.

847
00:43:16,756 --> 00:43:18,636
Speaker 4: I'd say, you what, So when we're in the studio

848
00:43:18,676 --> 00:43:20,876
Speaker 4: of Pop Pop Pop when I was in m Kenny, Yeah,

849
00:43:20,996 --> 00:43:23,276
Speaker 4: we were trying to figure out chorus and I was like,

850
00:43:23,476 --> 00:43:26,156
Speaker 4: I thought about a hip hop sample hook and I

851
00:43:26,276 --> 00:43:27,956
Speaker 4: was like, this is our hip hop sample. I was like,

852
00:43:28,316 --> 00:43:30,396
Speaker 4: I'll just sing it far away from the mic and

853
00:43:30,516 --> 00:43:33,156
Speaker 4: distort it and it would just sound like an old sample.

854
00:43:33,876 --> 00:43:36,116
Speaker 4: And he was like, fuck yeah, So I just did

855
00:43:36,156 --> 00:43:37,996
Speaker 4: that some beams because it's based on a Roll Dark

856
00:43:38,076 --> 00:43:42,356
Speaker 4: quote where he says that like basically shitty people and

857
00:43:42,436 --> 00:43:45,196
Speaker 4: their ugly thoughts come out in their face and they

858
00:43:45,316 --> 00:43:48,396
Speaker 4: look mean and they look like fucking horrible, not necessarily

859
00:43:48,476 --> 00:43:50,756
Speaker 4: ugly people about and what he's saying is so like

860
00:43:51,076 --> 00:43:52,836
Speaker 4: if you're a nasty prick, you can see it in

861
00:43:52,876 --> 00:43:56,036
Speaker 4: your face. But he said that good people and people

862
00:43:56,116 --> 00:43:58,556
Speaker 4: that have beautiful thoughts, it shines out of their flace

863
00:43:58,676 --> 00:43:59,356
Speaker 4: like somebeams.

864
00:43:59,956 --> 00:44:02,716
Speaker 1: And I just love I love that quote. And knowing

865
00:44:02,796 --> 00:44:04,876
Speaker 1: what he was like, you thought he was a real cynic.

866
00:44:05,356 --> 00:44:09,396
Speaker 4: He wrote, he's really kind of like Uncanny Chill, these

867
00:44:09,476 --> 00:44:12,916
Speaker 4: books that are kind of a bit sinister for sick

868
00:44:12,996 --> 00:44:16,436
Speaker 4: and empowering for children in like a wicked way. So

869
00:44:16,516 --> 00:44:18,116
Speaker 4: I wanted to do that quote, so I chucked it

870
00:44:18,156 --> 00:44:20,236
Speaker 4: in a sort of song spots for my kid. I

871
00:44:20,316 --> 00:44:22,276
Speaker 4: wanted it to be like a steparate thing that's a

872
00:44:22,396 --> 00:44:25,996
Speaker 4: sample and not to this song. It doesn't lyrically fit

873
00:44:26,516 --> 00:44:28,196
Speaker 4: with what I was singing in the verses, but it

874
00:44:28,356 --> 00:44:31,116
Speaker 4: fits in the theme of the song as a sample.

875
00:44:31,396 --> 00:44:32,796
Speaker 3: That's cool. And that's what I love about too.

876
00:44:32,836 --> 00:44:36,276
Speaker 2: It's like there's a lot of repetition, but there's also

877
00:44:36,316 --> 00:44:38,236
Speaker 2: a lot of chaos in your songs, and so it's

878
00:44:38,316 --> 00:44:40,876
Speaker 2: never like there's repetition so I know what's next, or

879
00:44:40,916 --> 00:44:44,116
Speaker 2: there's repetition. So I've heard this before, and I think

880
00:44:44,156 --> 00:44:47,996
Speaker 2: that's what makes you guys' music so listenable, you know,

881
00:44:48,196 --> 00:44:50,036
Speaker 2: like just makes people want to go back and listen

882
00:44:50,116 --> 00:44:53,556
Speaker 2: more and again. And you know, listening to Brutalism again recently,

883
00:44:53,556 --> 00:44:54,956
Speaker 2: it was like there's new things I'm hearing in that,

884
00:44:55,076 --> 00:44:55,996
Speaker 2: you know that I haven't listened to that in a

885
00:44:55,996 --> 00:44:58,316
Speaker 2: couple of years, And I can't believe you guys have

886
00:44:58,436 --> 00:44:59,596
Speaker 2: five albums in seven years.

887
00:45:00,356 --> 00:45:00,516
Speaker 1: Yeah.

888
00:45:00,716 --> 00:45:05,036
Speaker 4: Well, yeah, I mean we're very you know, we're privileged. Man,

889
00:45:05,316 --> 00:45:08,676
Speaker 4: We're lucky. We've got we've got time and space and

890
00:45:08,756 --> 00:45:11,156
Speaker 4: money to make beautiful ships. So we'll keep making it.

891
00:45:11,196 --> 00:45:13,836
Speaker 1: Until we're hunger for it as well.

892
00:45:13,996 --> 00:45:16,396
Speaker 4: Yeah, I mean obviously, Yeah, that's that's part of our

893
00:45:16,556 --> 00:45:19,196
Speaker 4: that's part of our privilege. Yeah, it's not just about

894
00:45:19,276 --> 00:45:22,756
Speaker 4: our circumstance and what we've been allowed. It's the fact

895
00:45:22,796 --> 00:45:24,396
Speaker 4: that we get up in the morning and we've got

896
00:45:24,436 --> 00:45:24,916
Speaker 4: shipped to do.

897
00:45:25,876 --> 00:45:28,876
Speaker 5: Yeah, that's fucking a gift to me that if I

898
00:45:29,236 --> 00:45:32,556
Speaker 5: got canceled like next week, I'd be like, well, let's

899
00:45:32,556 --> 00:45:33,036
Speaker 5: get the studio.

900
00:45:33,076 --> 00:45:33,876
Speaker 1: It's getting the studio.

901
00:45:36,636 --> 00:45:40,236
Speaker 8: Yeah, this is what else is going to do, Like

902
00:45:40,396 --> 00:45:44,196
Speaker 8: not not ship I mean Kenny's like that though as well,

903
00:45:44,356 --> 00:45:49,796
Speaker 8: like like more so he's insane, Like it's worked like

904
00:45:50,076 --> 00:45:52,556
Speaker 8: insane crazy, You'll be you'll be like working with stuff

905
00:45:52,556 --> 00:45:54,676
Speaker 8: and his hest and chilling, and then like these other

906
00:45:54,716 --> 00:45:57,396
Speaker 8: people will just turn up. It's like, yeah, just like

907
00:45:57,836 --> 00:46:02,396
Speaker 8: my brillin has just like dumped everything it has, can

908
00:46:02,436 --> 00:46:04,836
Speaker 8: you possibly have sparce.

909
00:46:04,516 --> 00:46:07,476
Speaker 1: To do more? And he's just he just is, He's

910
00:46:09,196 --> 00:46:11,236
Speaker 1: you know, he's gonna bring out the best in that

911
00:46:11,356 --> 00:46:13,356
Speaker 1: person exactly. Yeah, yeah, yeah, yeah sick.

912
00:46:13,516 --> 00:46:15,476
Speaker 2: I mean, I guess that's the thing about great producers,

913
00:46:15,516 --> 00:46:18,116
Speaker 2: like how it split. Like I couldn't thought about like

914
00:46:18,156 --> 00:46:20,316
Speaker 2: a father. I couldn't imagine splitting my time between like

915
00:46:20,356 --> 00:46:21,916
Speaker 2: eight different families of kids.

916
00:46:21,996 --> 00:46:24,236
Speaker 3: It's like, what the fuck? How do you? But people

917
00:46:24,316 --> 00:46:25,796
Speaker 3: like Kenny have this beautiful.

918
00:46:25,356 --> 00:46:29,116
Speaker 2: Gift of showing up being themselves in all these different

919
00:46:29,116 --> 00:46:30,356
Speaker 2: ways with all these different people.

920
00:46:30,956 --> 00:46:35,876
Speaker 5: And he shows up he's himself, but he's also like

921
00:46:36,796 --> 00:46:39,036
Speaker 5: I've never know, I've never seen him not change your

922
00:46:39,076 --> 00:46:41,516
Speaker 5: rip if he comes in the room, and he'll just

923
00:46:41,676 --> 00:46:44,436
Speaker 5: like he does something profine to people. It's an energy,

924
00:46:44,756 --> 00:46:45,916
Speaker 5: it's it's class.

925
00:46:46,836 --> 00:46:50,676
Speaker 2: I appreciate talking to y'all and good luck on the performance.

926
00:46:50,676 --> 00:46:51,636
Speaker 2: Tonight should be fun.

927
00:46:51,876 --> 00:46:54,716
Speaker 1: Yeah fuck yeah, all right, much up later, guys.

928
00:46:57,516 --> 00:46:59,556
Speaker 2: Thanks to Joe Talbot and Mark Bowen of Idols. They're

929
00:46:59,556 --> 00:47:02,196
Speaker 2: talking about their creative push and pull and the recording

930
00:47:02,236 --> 00:47:05,076
Speaker 2: of their latest album Tank. You can hear it along

931
00:47:05,116 --> 00:47:07,396
Speaker 2: with our other favorite Idol songs on the playlist at

932
00:47:07,436 --> 00:47:11,596
Speaker 2: broken Record podcast dot on. Subscribe to our YouTube channel

933
00:47:11,636 --> 00:47:14,516
Speaker 2: at YouTube dot com slash broken record Podcast, where you

934
00:47:14,556 --> 00:47:17,796
Speaker 2: can find all of our new episodes. You can follow

935
00:47:17,876 --> 00:47:21,316
Speaker 2: us on Twitter at broken Record. Broken Record is produced

936
00:47:21,356 --> 00:47:24,196
Speaker 2: and edited by Leah Rose, with marketing help from Eric

937
00:47:24,276 --> 00:47:28,636
Speaker 2: Sandler and Jordan McMillan. Our engineer is Ben Tolliday. Broken

938
00:47:28,676 --> 00:47:31,996
Speaker 2: Record is a production of Pushkin Industries. If you love

939
00:47:32,076 --> 00:47:36,156
Speaker 2: this show and others from Pushkin, consider subscribing to Pushkin Plus.

940
00:47:36,756 --> 00:47:40,036
Speaker 2: Pushkin Plus is a podcast subscription that offers bonus content

941
00:47:40,156 --> 00:47:42,836
Speaker 2: and ad free listening for four ninety nine a month.

942
00:47:43,556 --> 00:47:47,436
Speaker 2: Look for Pushkin Plus on Apple podcast subscriptions. And if

943
00:47:47,476 --> 00:47:49,876
Speaker 2: you like this show, please remember to share, rate, and

944
00:47:49,956 --> 00:47:52,756
Speaker 2: review us on your podcast app. Our theme music's by

945
00:47:52,836 --> 00:47:54,636
Speaker 2: Kenny Beats. I'm justin Richmond,