1
00:00:11,520 --> 00:00:12,880
Speaker 1: Welcome back to Cutting the Distance.

2
00:00:12,880 --> 00:00:14,800
Speaker 2: I met today's guest in my booth at the Pacific

3
00:00:14,840 --> 00:00:18,400
Speaker 2: Northwest Sportsman Show probably eight nine years ago. He was

4
00:00:18,440 --> 00:00:20,479
Speaker 2: a quiet guy. He didn't say a whole lot. He

5
00:00:20,520 --> 00:00:22,720
Speaker 2: was kind of sitting in the corner, and I knew

6
00:00:22,720 --> 00:00:24,599
Speaker 2: he was good at long range hunting and I was

7
00:00:24,680 --> 00:00:26,160
Speaker 2: kind of getting into it, so I kind of forced

8
00:00:26,239 --> 00:00:27,920
Speaker 2: him to talk to men.

9
00:00:27,920 --> 00:00:28,920
Speaker 1: That's not exactly how it goes.

10
00:00:28,960 --> 00:00:31,320
Speaker 2: He's a great guy, just very very quiet, and I

11
00:00:31,360 --> 00:00:33,879
Speaker 2: was getting more into my rifles, you know, my loads,

12
00:00:33,920 --> 00:00:35,800
Speaker 2: figuring out how to get all my equipment dialed, and

13
00:00:36,000 --> 00:00:38,879
Speaker 2: he was a great resource. So John Pinch is my

14
00:00:38,920 --> 00:00:41,640
Speaker 2: guest today. I don't know, he's too humble to probably

15
00:00:41,640 --> 00:00:43,200
Speaker 2: tell you how many, but I know he's won hundreds

16
00:00:43,200 --> 00:00:46,120
Speaker 2: of shooting events between the nrl PRS and other shooting events.

17
00:00:46,479 --> 00:00:49,199
Speaker 2: When he's not shooting, it seems to be traveling on

18
00:00:49,240 --> 00:00:52,839
Speaker 2: some pretty pretty kick ass big game hunts across the country.

19
00:00:53,280 --> 00:00:55,440
Speaker 2: He'd want to be better known as a family man.

20
00:00:55,480 --> 00:00:57,240
Speaker 2: I know he's got two kids, you know, a wife

21
00:00:57,240 --> 00:00:58,639
Speaker 2: that they spend a lot of time with.

22
00:00:58,680 --> 00:01:00,000
Speaker 1: And so welcome to the show.

23
00:01:00,160 --> 00:01:01,680
Speaker 3: John, thanks for having me.

24
00:01:01,720 --> 00:01:09,800
Speaker 4: Jason, good talking me. I don't know if I spend

25
00:01:09,800 --> 00:01:11,720
Speaker 4: a lot of time at home because I've gone so much,

26
00:01:11,800 --> 00:01:13,400
Speaker 4: but yeah, my wife and kids are awesome.

27
00:01:13,600 --> 00:01:15,880
Speaker 1: Yeah, how's everything going.

28
00:01:16,160 --> 00:01:17,480
Speaker 3: Yeah, No, it's been going good.

29
00:01:18,360 --> 00:01:21,880
Speaker 4: Been pretty busy, traveling a lot the last like November

30
00:01:21,880 --> 00:01:22,960
Speaker 4: December was real busy.

31
00:01:23,080 --> 00:01:25,039
Speaker 3: So it's actually been really laid back.

32
00:01:25,680 --> 00:01:29,600
Speaker 4: Just past New Year's here, had a pretty fun Christmas,

33
00:01:29,680 --> 00:01:31,759
Speaker 4: been hanging out with the boys and just landlow working

34
00:01:31,760 --> 00:01:32,680
Speaker 4: on some stuff at the house.

35
00:01:32,959 --> 00:01:33,840
Speaker 3: It feels pretty good.

36
00:01:33,880 --> 00:01:36,400
Speaker 4: So kind of revamp and getting ready for this next year,

37
00:01:36,560 --> 00:01:39,920
Speaker 4: making some plans for business and shooting. And I've done

38
00:01:40,000 --> 00:01:42,160
Speaker 4: landscaping for a long time, kind of phasing out of

39
00:01:42,200 --> 00:01:45,840
Speaker 4: that slowly, but I think this year is looking pretty

40
00:01:45,840 --> 00:01:49,160
Speaker 4: good to hopefully wrap that up and focus continue to

41
00:01:49,160 --> 00:01:51,040
Speaker 4: focus more on the shooting side of things.

42
00:01:51,040 --> 00:01:51,840
Speaker 3: So it's going good.

43
00:01:52,200 --> 00:01:54,200
Speaker 2: So that's a great segue, John, like, what does a

44
00:01:54,240 --> 00:01:56,480
Speaker 2: typical year for you look like as far as hunting

45
00:01:56,560 --> 00:01:59,600
Speaker 2: versus shooting? Like, what's what's a year in your life

46
00:01:59,600 --> 00:01:59,920
Speaker 2: look like?

47
00:02:00,440 --> 00:02:01,720
Speaker 3: Yeah? I fly by the.

48
00:02:01,720 --> 00:02:03,120
Speaker 4: Seat of my pants a little bit more than some

49
00:02:03,160 --> 00:02:05,280
Speaker 4: of my buddies where they playing out their whole year

50
00:02:05,520 --> 00:02:06,279
Speaker 4: starting in.

51
00:02:06,280 --> 00:02:08,959
Speaker 3: Probably let's see into this month.

52
00:02:08,840 --> 00:02:12,320
Speaker 4: January, the shoots start kicking off Interill Hunter and PRS,

53
00:02:12,360 --> 00:02:15,119
Speaker 4: which is the Precision Rifle League for Precision Rifle.

54
00:02:14,960 --> 00:02:16,000
Speaker 3: Series, and.

55
00:02:18,240 --> 00:02:22,600
Speaker 4: There's shoots all over US, Canada, you know, went to

56
00:02:22,960 --> 00:02:25,160
Speaker 4: South Africa this year to shoot one, There's something Norway.

57
00:02:25,200 --> 00:02:27,720
Speaker 4: They're all over so pretty much you could shoot almost

58
00:02:27,760 --> 00:02:31,440
Speaker 4: every weekend, especially through the spring and early summer. The

59
00:02:31,480 --> 00:02:33,040
Speaker 4: heat of the summer kind of moved some of the

60
00:02:33,040 --> 00:02:35,960
Speaker 4: matches around, Like generally there's not a lot of Arizona

61
00:02:36,000 --> 00:02:37,840
Speaker 4: matches in the middle of the summer and stuff like that.

62
00:02:37,960 --> 00:02:40,720
Speaker 4: So I usually am kind of if I have an

63
00:02:40,720 --> 00:02:45,200
Speaker 4: open weekend, you know, there's not a fan a big

64
00:02:45,280 --> 00:02:47,079
Speaker 4: family event, or you know, I.

65
00:02:47,040 --> 00:02:48,480
Speaker 3: Try to get to the kids baseball.

66
00:02:48,160 --> 00:02:50,720
Speaker 4: Tournaments and stuff as much as possible. But as long

67
00:02:50,760 --> 00:02:52,960
Speaker 4: as I got an open weekend, I'm usually booking a

68
00:02:53,000 --> 00:02:55,480
Speaker 4: flight somewhere and hitting the shoot somewhere. So I try

69
00:02:55,520 --> 00:03:00,000
Speaker 4: to shoot as much as I can. Hunting Trump's competent.

70
00:03:00,560 --> 00:03:03,799
Speaker 4: So the last couple of years we had hunts booked

71
00:03:03,800 --> 00:03:07,000
Speaker 4: over the Precision Rifle Series finale, I took a little

72
00:03:07,000 --> 00:03:09,239
Speaker 4: wind out of my sales for really hitting the season hard.

73
00:03:09,320 --> 00:03:12,280
Speaker 3: Knowing I couldn't shoot the championship, so I shot.

74
00:03:12,040 --> 00:03:14,800
Speaker 4: Three four matches instead of you know, eight to twelve

75
00:03:14,919 --> 00:03:17,400
Speaker 4: or some guys are shooting fifteen eighteen.

76
00:03:17,040 --> 00:03:18,600
Speaker 3: Matches a year, which which is a lot.

77
00:03:18,680 --> 00:03:21,040
Speaker 4: That's a lot of flights, a lot of travel, getting

78
00:03:21,080 --> 00:03:23,600
Speaker 4: guns ready and everything. So I try to shoot as

79
00:03:23,600 --> 00:03:27,600
Speaker 4: mini shoots as I can, schedule permitting, and hopefully I'm

80
00:03:27,600 --> 00:03:29,320
Speaker 4: doing more in the next few years the way some

81
00:03:29,360 --> 00:03:30,359
Speaker 4: of my schedules changing.

82
00:03:30,720 --> 00:03:32,520
Speaker 3: But then hunting trump's all that.

83
00:03:32,720 --> 00:03:35,280
Speaker 4: So some of our hunts we've got dates booked and

84
00:03:35,320 --> 00:03:37,680
Speaker 4: planning for next year. Other ones we try to keep

85
00:03:37,720 --> 00:03:40,160
Speaker 4: a pretty loose schedule, and we've hit multiple cancelation hunts

86
00:03:40,160 --> 00:03:43,480
Speaker 4: the last few years. Just went up to Kodiak last minute,

87
00:03:43,520 --> 00:03:45,840
Speaker 4: just on a DII thing a few weeks ago. That's

88
00:03:45,840 --> 00:03:48,240
Speaker 4: when you, I think you initially texted me view podcasts

89
00:03:48,320 --> 00:03:50,280
Speaker 4: is like I'm heading out on a planing tomorrow to

90
00:03:50,400 --> 00:03:52,320
Speaker 4: a little drop camp. So I was trying to kill

91
00:03:52,320 --> 00:03:55,960
Speaker 4: a sick of b locktails. But yeah, kind of some

92
00:03:56,000 --> 00:03:58,240
Speaker 4: of that stuff's just like I said, last minute, But

93
00:03:58,320 --> 00:03:59,960
Speaker 4: that's kind of the way schedule looks. I'm so we're

94
00:04:00,360 --> 00:04:02,680
Speaker 4: got family kids, we got baseball, we got you know,

95
00:04:02,720 --> 00:04:03,760
Speaker 4: fun stuff going on like that.

96
00:04:03,720 --> 00:04:06,720
Speaker 2: Too, so gotcha so so real busy. You could shoot

97
00:04:06,760 --> 00:04:08,360
Speaker 2: as much as you want, Then do you do you

98
00:04:08,400 --> 00:04:11,360
Speaker 2: tend to focus on PRS more so or NRL or

99
00:04:11,400 --> 00:04:13,120
Speaker 2: do you have to hit like a certain amount of

100
00:04:13,120 --> 00:04:15,760
Speaker 2: events to qualify? Like how how do you juggle that

101
00:04:15,800 --> 00:04:17,719
Speaker 2: as well? Like there's all these different events or maybe

102
00:04:17,800 --> 00:04:20,200
Speaker 2: just like you know, single events, like how do you

103
00:04:20,880 --> 00:04:22,200
Speaker 2: how do you how do you play the game?

104
00:04:22,960 --> 00:04:26,360
Speaker 3: I mean it's kind of kind of personal preference. I've

105
00:04:26,440 --> 00:04:31,040
Speaker 3: done Interall Hunter, probably a little more I wanted to.

106
00:04:32,960 --> 00:04:36,080
Speaker 4: There's a an interal Hunter. There's there's an open class,

107
00:04:36,120 --> 00:04:38,640
Speaker 4: which you're done. Can weigh sixteen pounds or less, so

108
00:04:38,720 --> 00:04:40,960
Speaker 4: you can run whatever you want up to sixteen pounds.

109
00:04:41,160 --> 00:04:43,440
Speaker 3: There's Light class, which is twelve pounds or less.

110
00:04:43,480 --> 00:04:46,320
Speaker 4: There's factory which they have a list of factory rifles

111
00:04:46,360 --> 00:04:47,880
Speaker 4: you can't modem at all. You take it out of

112
00:04:47,920 --> 00:04:50,560
Speaker 4: the box at Tica Brigar or whatever their list is.

113
00:04:51,080 --> 00:04:53,359
Speaker 4: And then there's teams when two guys can sign up

114
00:04:53,360 --> 00:04:55,800
Speaker 4: and shoot teams. And I wanted to be the first

115
00:04:56,000 --> 00:04:59,960
Speaker 4: one that won every class. So take an open gun

116
00:05:00,040 --> 00:05:02,520
Speaker 4: and when the overall shoot not just first in that

117
00:05:02,640 --> 00:05:05,480
Speaker 4: class take a light gun and when the entire shoot,

118
00:05:05,839 --> 00:05:07,960
Speaker 4: and then take a factory gun and beat all the

119
00:05:07,960 --> 00:05:10,240
Speaker 4: custom rifle guys for the entire shoot, and then do

120
00:05:10,279 --> 00:05:12,200
Speaker 4: it in the teams. And so I actually shot in

121
00:05:12,320 --> 00:05:14,479
Speaker 4: a hunter fair bit because I did. I did that,

122
00:05:14,720 --> 00:05:17,279
Speaker 4: So that was kind of just an internal goal of mine,

123
00:05:17,640 --> 00:05:20,000
Speaker 4: and so that's what I did. More so, I probably

124
00:05:20,000 --> 00:05:24,880
Speaker 4: I think I shot four PRS matches last year five

125
00:05:25,279 --> 00:05:26,000
Speaker 4: and ended up shooting.

126
00:05:26,000 --> 00:05:27,560
Speaker 3: I was able to shoot the finale this year.

127
00:05:28,240 --> 00:05:31,120
Speaker 4: Dude, I got six of the finale, so it was good.

128
00:05:31,120 --> 00:05:32,880
Speaker 4: It's the top two hundred and fifty guys and so

129
00:05:32,960 --> 00:05:35,320
Speaker 4: I shot. I had a good match, but I had

130
00:05:35,480 --> 00:05:38,920
Speaker 4: one bad stage that you know, he takes nothing to

131
00:05:39,080 --> 00:05:41,200
Speaker 4: drop to drop a few spots.

132
00:05:41,440 --> 00:05:43,200
Speaker 3: So it's, uh, there's some killers there.

133
00:05:43,240 --> 00:05:44,880
Speaker 4: There's a bunch of really good I have a really

134
00:05:44,880 --> 00:05:47,240
Speaker 4: good friends in that in that in that group, and

135
00:05:47,320 --> 00:05:50,839
Speaker 4: some guys that are super dedicated to it. So it's yeah,

136
00:05:51,040 --> 00:05:52,839
Speaker 4: just kind of I kind of ebb and flow, like

137
00:05:52,880 --> 00:05:54,479
Speaker 4: this year I want to hit perrs a little bit more.

138
00:05:54,520 --> 00:05:57,720
Speaker 3: It's it's uh, it's heavy, more purpose.

139
00:05:57,360 --> 00:05:59,760
Speaker 4: Built guns, where in or all Hunter is more hunting

140
00:06:00,080 --> 00:06:03,200
Speaker 4: type of guns where the PRS is you know, it's

141
00:06:03,240 --> 00:06:06,919
Speaker 4: a you're shooting a twenty pounds you know, six sixty

142
00:06:06,960 --> 00:06:10,720
Speaker 4: five twenty five cal gun, not much recoil, lots of movement,

143
00:06:10,839 --> 00:06:15,320
Speaker 4: real fast shooting, which I'm I'm real good at. But

144
00:06:15,480 --> 00:06:17,839
Speaker 4: it's the pinnacle shooting, like it is the best shooters

145
00:06:17,839 --> 00:06:20,560
Speaker 4: in the world. Yeah, and I want to shoot that

146
00:06:20,600 --> 00:06:21,880
Speaker 4: more just because it makes me better.

147
00:06:22,240 --> 00:06:22,440
Speaker 1: Yeah.

148
00:06:22,520 --> 00:06:27,480
Speaker 4: Interial Hunter is a different It combines glassing, u position building,

149
00:06:27,880 --> 00:06:29,920
Speaker 4: it combines a lot of different elements that I love.

150
00:06:31,000 --> 00:06:33,240
Speaker 3: But just purely shooting PRS.

151
00:06:32,880 --> 00:06:37,040
Speaker 2: Is Yeah, is difficult because there's target acquisition in NRAL,

152
00:06:37,120 --> 00:06:38,800
Speaker 2: Like you have to spot your target, get your own,

153
00:06:38,960 --> 00:06:40,840
Speaker 2: you know, all of that, which adds into the game.

154
00:06:41,040 --> 00:06:41,440
Speaker 1: The game.

155
00:06:42,080 --> 00:06:43,320
Speaker 2: So I want to I want to rewind this a

156
00:06:43,320 --> 00:06:45,039
Speaker 2: little bit. You would never say this, but it was

157
00:06:45,120 --> 00:06:47,919
Speaker 2: internally in your head. You basically took a gun that

158
00:06:47,960 --> 00:06:49,640
Speaker 2: you could buy off of a shelf and then went

159
00:06:49,960 --> 00:06:53,040
Speaker 2: and beat the some shooters shooting the best, most fancy

160
00:06:53,080 --> 00:06:54,080
Speaker 2: guns that you could build.

161
00:06:55,080 --> 00:06:58,160
Speaker 3: Yeah, so I did barely by idea.

162
00:06:59,080 --> 00:07:00,880
Speaker 2: So I mean you would, like I said, you're you're

163
00:07:01,000 --> 00:07:03,880
Speaker 2: very you know, modest, humble, But but that just kind

164
00:07:03,920 --> 00:07:06,280
Speaker 2: of for all the listeners. Lets you in the kind

165
00:07:06,279 --> 00:07:08,400
Speaker 2: of how good John is and he'll never say it,

166
00:07:08,440 --> 00:07:11,160
Speaker 2: but I mean to take a gun that's that's literally

167
00:07:11,640 --> 00:07:14,880
Speaker 2: a stock gun and beating you know, custom rifles. It

168
00:07:15,000 --> 00:07:17,240
Speaker 2: kind of just hints to to how good you are

169
00:07:17,280 --> 00:07:20,160
Speaker 2: behind a gun and you know, your your dedication, your time.

170
00:07:20,480 --> 00:07:22,800
Speaker 2: You know you're always shooting, always reload, and always tinkering,

171
00:07:22,880 --> 00:07:25,080
Speaker 2: and so it goes along ways to to kind of

172
00:07:25,120 --> 00:07:27,720
Speaker 2: just explain, you know, the level that you're at. And

173
00:07:27,760 --> 00:07:31,240
Speaker 2: so I think that's that's worth stating. So we're gonna

174
00:07:31,280 --> 00:07:33,960
Speaker 2: we're gonna jump into some into some listener questions now

175
00:07:34,000 --> 00:07:37,119
Speaker 2: like we always do, because you are a couple question

176
00:07:37,240 --> 00:07:40,200
Speaker 2: answers we've we've pulled from social media. If you have

177
00:07:40,280 --> 00:07:43,200
Speaker 2: questions for me or my guests, please email them to

178
00:07:43,320 --> 00:07:46,280
Speaker 2: us at c T D at Phelps game Calls dot com,

179
00:07:46,560 --> 00:07:49,720
Speaker 2: or hit us up on a social media message or

180
00:07:49,840 --> 00:07:52,760
Speaker 2: a social post. So our first question today comes from Tyson.

181
00:07:53,640 --> 00:07:57,800
Speaker 2: I screwed that all up, Tyson Lundahl, how do you

182
00:07:57,840 --> 00:08:01,760
Speaker 2: go about judging for win down range and over terrain features?

183
00:08:01,760 --> 00:08:03,920
Speaker 2: And I know this is probably like the trickiest part

184
00:08:03,960 --> 00:08:07,040
Speaker 2: of everything. We're going to talk about later. You know, like,

185
00:08:07,200 --> 00:08:09,520
Speaker 2: there isn't wind on your ridge. What are the science

186
00:08:09,600 --> 00:08:11,880
Speaker 2: or what are you picking out out there to make

187
00:08:11,880 --> 00:08:14,960
Speaker 2: your wind call? Which which I I don't know your answer,

188
00:08:14,960 --> 00:08:17,320
Speaker 2: but I'm going to assume that that up and down

189
00:08:17,400 --> 00:08:20,960
Speaker 2: is pretty easy for the most part. But left and

190
00:08:21,040 --> 00:08:23,280
Speaker 2: right is where the whole game and the art comes in.

191
00:08:23,320 --> 00:08:25,720
Speaker 2: But go ahead and explain, like what you can use

192
00:08:25,840 --> 00:08:26,920
Speaker 2: to figure out when?

193
00:08:27,960 --> 00:08:34,920
Speaker 3: Yeah, So, I mean, so there's there's the art and

194
00:08:35,000 --> 00:08:38,600
Speaker 3: the science of long range shooting, and wind is the art. Right,

195
00:08:38,840 --> 00:08:41,720
Speaker 3: there's it's never fixed, it's you're never on a flat plane.

196
00:08:41,800 --> 00:08:45,040
Speaker 3: There's ups, there's downs, there's left, there's rights, there's eddies,

197
00:08:45,080 --> 00:08:49,280
Speaker 3: there's box canyons that swirl. So so there's the science.

198
00:08:49,679 --> 00:08:52,360
Speaker 4: You know, there's a lot of data, there's a lot

199
00:08:52,360 --> 00:08:54,200
Speaker 4: of blissed calculators, there's a lot of things that do

200
00:08:54,200 --> 00:08:56,200
Speaker 4: a really good job with cross wind, jump and every

201
00:08:56,280 --> 00:09:00,400
Speaker 4: variable you can imagine. And then there's the art of it.

202
00:09:00,440 --> 00:09:02,720
Speaker 4: And so there isn't a hard and fast answer. You

203
00:09:02,800 --> 00:09:04,760
Speaker 4: pretty much you look at anything you can get. You

204
00:09:04,960 --> 00:09:07,560
Speaker 4: if there's grass, if there's trees, if there's anything in

205
00:09:07,559 --> 00:09:10,320
Speaker 4: the air, if there's rain, if there's fog, anything that

206
00:09:10,360 --> 00:09:13,720
Speaker 4: you can see you take into account obviously. I mean

207
00:09:13,760 --> 00:09:15,920
Speaker 4: it's kind of a kind of a no brainer. Some

208
00:09:15,960 --> 00:09:19,280
Speaker 4: people say, oh, you watch train when water rolls, and yeah,

209
00:09:19,320 --> 00:09:22,400
Speaker 4: that's that's good, But that doesn't also cover water doesn't

210
00:09:22,480 --> 00:09:23,120
Speaker 4: roll uphill.

211
00:09:23,640 --> 00:09:24,680
Speaker 3: And so if there's a big.

212
00:09:24,600 --> 00:09:27,680
Speaker 4: Updraft, like I don't know, Like so I've had some

213
00:09:27,800 --> 00:09:28,640
Speaker 4: big up drafts.

214
00:09:28,679 --> 00:09:31,280
Speaker 3: If I'm say I'm on.

215
00:09:31,520 --> 00:09:35,120
Speaker 4: A valley, I'm up here, I'm shooting over here more

216
00:09:35,200 --> 00:09:37,080
Speaker 4: it's actually more if I'm up here and this is

217
00:09:37,080 --> 00:09:40,079
Speaker 4: a long valley running out and there's like kind of

218
00:09:40,120 --> 00:09:42,600
Speaker 4: hills on this you know, here and here, and there's

219
00:09:42,640 --> 00:09:44,600
Speaker 4: a valley coming at you, and the wind's coming at you.

220
00:09:45,200 --> 00:09:47,880
Speaker 4: If I'm shooting across to those with a strong wind

221
00:09:47,920 --> 00:09:49,640
Speaker 4: in your face, you'll get a bit. I'll get a

222
00:09:49,640 --> 00:09:50,719
Speaker 4: big updraft.

223
00:09:50,400 --> 00:09:50,840
Speaker 3: On this hill.

224
00:09:50,880 --> 00:09:54,080
Speaker 4: That wind's ripping up this hill, and it'll hold my

225
00:09:54,160 --> 00:09:56,679
Speaker 4: bullet up. And so those are all things that are

226
00:09:56,679 --> 00:10:02,840
Speaker 4: so hard to take into account. It kind of leads

227
00:10:02,840 --> 00:10:05,800
Speaker 4: into another I think the most important thing that you

228
00:10:05,840 --> 00:10:09,840
Speaker 4: can do as a shooter, and it's it changed a

229
00:10:09,880 --> 00:10:12,960
Speaker 4: lot of my I don't know philosophy is the right.

230
00:10:12,840 --> 00:10:13,280
Speaker 3: Word, but.

231
00:10:16,000 --> 00:10:19,720
Speaker 4: Gun build choice weights calibers, so I can spot my

232
00:10:19,720 --> 00:10:23,080
Speaker 4: own shot. You have to see where your bullet lands.

233
00:10:23,080 --> 00:10:24,800
Speaker 4: And a lot of guys don't. A lot of guys

234
00:10:24,840 --> 00:10:27,600
Speaker 4: shoot the recoils gone. They rely on their buddy, and

235
00:10:27,640 --> 00:10:29,920
Speaker 4: if they're solo, they're out of lock. They shoot and

236
00:10:29,960 --> 00:10:33,200
Speaker 4: they hope they hit it. And if you can spot

237
00:10:33,240 --> 00:10:36,840
Speaker 4: your shots, stuff happens. You can make a bad wind call,

238
00:10:37,080 --> 00:10:39,440
Speaker 4: you can do anything. But if you can spot your shot,

239
00:10:39,760 --> 00:10:43,160
Speaker 4: generally you can measure that and make a quick correction

240
00:10:43,240 --> 00:10:44,440
Speaker 4: and get a second round impact.

241
00:10:44,880 --> 00:10:45,880
Speaker 3: That's not ideal.

242
00:10:46,200 --> 00:10:48,920
Speaker 4: I'm just saying there's stuff happens, and no one's ever

243
00:10:49,000 --> 00:10:51,160
Speaker 4: right one hundred percent of time on wind. And so

244
00:10:51,480 --> 00:10:53,480
Speaker 4: if I'm on the canyon and it's calm where I'm at,

245
00:10:53,559 --> 00:10:55,440
Speaker 4: generally you can hear wind, or you can see wind,

246
00:10:55,480 --> 00:11:00,240
Speaker 4: you know something's going on. If it's that far, if

247
00:11:00,240 --> 00:11:03,760
Speaker 4: it's if you're two canyons away, generally you're talking like

248
00:11:05,000 --> 00:11:09,839
Speaker 4: thousand plus yards depending on the train. I'm gonna recommend

249
00:11:09,880 --> 00:11:12,600
Speaker 4: cutting the distance. I'm not the long range guy. I've

250
00:11:12,640 --> 00:11:15,480
Speaker 4: shot as much as anybody or more, and I'm not

251
00:11:16,160 --> 00:11:19,120
Speaker 4: I'm never the guy that backs up to another one

252
00:11:19,200 --> 00:11:21,640
Speaker 4: hundred yards so I shoot a thousand instead of nine hundred,

253
00:11:21,640 --> 00:11:23,160
Speaker 4: and I'm not going to post that on social We

254
00:11:23,280 --> 00:11:24,400
Speaker 4: made a lot of long shots.

255
00:11:24,440 --> 00:11:26,880
Speaker 3: I'm never gonna people ask how far. I just don't

256
00:11:26,920 --> 00:11:27,560
Speaker 3: say I don't.

257
00:11:28,400 --> 00:11:31,160
Speaker 4: There's elements of long range shooting that I love it,

258
00:11:31,280 --> 00:11:33,880
Speaker 4: but I also I hate the social media. I killed

259
00:11:33,920 --> 00:11:35,840
Speaker 4: this at fourteen hundred yards of one shot. I was like, well,

260
00:11:35,880 --> 00:11:37,800
Speaker 4: you couldn't do that. If we went out and on steel,

261
00:11:37,840 --> 00:11:39,640
Speaker 4: you'd missed that steel a lot. I know you would

262
00:11:39,640 --> 00:11:41,719
Speaker 4: because I've shot more than you.

263
00:11:41,760 --> 00:11:44,920
Speaker 3: Not to sound arrogant, but yeah, it's hard, and so

264
00:11:45,320 --> 00:11:48,320
Speaker 3: you take anything. I mean, generally, you can hear wind.

265
00:11:48,480 --> 00:11:51,640
Speaker 4: You can see it, especially evergreen trees are real easy

266
00:11:51,640 --> 00:11:55,240
Speaker 4: to read, big fir trees. You can see the directs

267
00:11:55,240 --> 00:11:57,320
Speaker 4: and the winds hitting the backside of the trees relatively

268
00:11:57,360 --> 00:12:00,000
Speaker 4: calm the front the branches are kind of peeling around,

269
00:12:00,559 --> 00:12:03,000
Speaker 4: and then it's just experience. Hey, is that a seven over?

270
00:12:03,000 --> 00:12:04,440
Speaker 3: There? Is that a fifteen mile an hour?

271
00:12:04,920 --> 00:12:08,720
Speaker 4: And then if it's dead for three hundred yards, you

272
00:12:08,760 --> 00:12:11,120
Speaker 4: don't have wind until you hit four and five hundred yards,

273
00:12:11,120 --> 00:12:13,280
Speaker 4: so you can We're getting a little deep here for

274
00:12:13,320 --> 00:12:16,920
Speaker 4: a podcast, but you can you can run your brackets out.

275
00:12:16,600 --> 00:12:19,040
Speaker 3: Like when you shoot. When you shoot a.

276
00:12:19,040 --> 00:12:22,760
Speaker 4: Bullet, the biggest deflections right out of your gun. If

277
00:12:22,760 --> 00:12:24,800
Speaker 4: you take a bullet off course out of the muzzle,

278
00:12:25,040 --> 00:12:27,079
Speaker 4: it's going to be way off course down range.

279
00:12:27,200 --> 00:12:28,520
Speaker 3: If it doesn't go off course till.

280
00:12:28,400 --> 00:12:31,240
Speaker 4: Three or four hundred yards, if you're protected along a

281
00:12:31,280 --> 00:12:34,600
Speaker 4: clear cut tree line, or it's just you're in this

282
00:12:34,760 --> 00:12:36,760
Speaker 4: some sort of you're in the bottom and it doesn't

283
00:12:36,760 --> 00:12:38,559
Speaker 4: get into the wind until you shoot out the top.

284
00:12:39,080 --> 00:12:41,119
Speaker 3: Then you're cutting your wind drift down.

285
00:12:41,280 --> 00:12:43,200
Speaker 4: The first four hundred yards don't see wind and maybe

286
00:12:43,200 --> 00:12:45,520
Speaker 4: the last three hundred yards see a fifteen mile an hour.

287
00:12:45,880 --> 00:12:47,679
Speaker 3: So you can kind of break that down into brackets

288
00:12:47,679 --> 00:12:48,480
Speaker 3: of what it's going to do.

289
00:12:48,760 --> 00:12:50,880
Speaker 4: All that comes from experience. I wish I had like

290
00:12:50,920 --> 00:12:52,720
Speaker 4: this really good answer. You do this, this, and this.

291
00:12:52,880 --> 00:12:55,040
Speaker 4: It doesn't exist. It's an art. It comes from a

292
00:12:55,080 --> 00:12:58,760
Speaker 4: lot of practice and taking everything into account. What I

293
00:12:58,760 --> 00:13:01,640
Speaker 4: see a lot of guys do is the moment happens.

294
00:13:01,720 --> 00:13:04,560
Speaker 4: It's quick. Half the times they forget to dial something

295
00:13:04,679 --> 00:13:07,719
Speaker 4: or what just they don't level their gun. Go through

296
00:13:07,720 --> 00:13:11,160
Speaker 4: your checklist, make sure your range is perfect. These are

297
00:13:11,240 --> 00:13:14,080
Speaker 4: no brainer things. Make sure your levels perfect. Take a

298
00:13:14,120 --> 00:13:17,040
Speaker 4: second to slow down and make a really good thought

299
00:13:17,040 --> 00:13:20,360
Speaker 4: process on wind. Study the trees, study the cobwebs, floating

300
00:13:20,480 --> 00:13:23,600
Speaker 4: anything you can see, and don't be afraid to hold wind.

301
00:13:23,720 --> 00:13:26,640
Speaker 4: In the comp world, we talk about like missing on

302
00:13:26,679 --> 00:13:30,520
Speaker 4: the pro side. So beginners always miss downwind. They never

303
00:13:30,559 --> 00:13:33,000
Speaker 4: hold enough wind, and so missing on the pro side

304
00:13:33,040 --> 00:13:35,160
Speaker 4: would be missing upwind. If you're gonna if I'm gonna

305
00:13:35,160 --> 00:13:37,000
Speaker 4: miss a plan, I want to miss upwind because you

306
00:13:37,280 --> 00:13:40,800
Speaker 4: rarely overjudge wind. It's just like a natural tendency. People

307
00:13:40,800 --> 00:13:41,600
Speaker 4: will get scared.

308
00:13:41,400 --> 00:13:42,640
Speaker 1: To hold down much hold that far.

309
00:13:42,760 --> 00:13:45,160
Speaker 3: So yeah, I mean there's a lot of things we

310
00:13:45,160 --> 00:13:45,439
Speaker 3: could go.

311
00:13:45,679 --> 00:13:48,280
Speaker 4: You know, we could talk about this forever, but I

312
00:13:48,320 --> 00:13:50,480
Speaker 4: think just slow down and be very aware if you're

313
00:13:50,520 --> 00:13:51,199
Speaker 4: not comfortable.

314
00:13:51,320 --> 00:13:51,959
Speaker 3: Cut distance.

315
00:13:52,080 --> 00:13:54,200
Speaker 4: Generally, if you're looking over a couple of canyons, you

316
00:13:54,200 --> 00:13:57,240
Speaker 4: can get to the next ridge. Yeah, just cut the distance,

317
00:13:57,280 --> 00:13:58,760
Speaker 4: get to six hundred seven hundrey yards.

318
00:13:58,840 --> 00:13:59,040
Speaker 1: Yeah.

319
00:13:59,120 --> 00:14:01,520
Speaker 2: And one of the things you know, especially on wind,

320
00:14:01,600 --> 00:14:03,960
Speaker 2: that I like to do is in my ballistic calculator,

321
00:14:04,000 --> 00:14:05,680
Speaker 2: if I if I think it could be a five,

322
00:14:05,679 --> 00:14:07,360
Speaker 2: but then it could be a ten, I want to

323
00:14:07,400 --> 00:14:09,400
Speaker 2: go look at the difference like how much error is

324
00:14:09,440 --> 00:14:13,160
Speaker 2: in my my calculation? And if it's more than what's

325
00:14:13,160 --> 00:14:15,320
Speaker 2: acceptable at that range, then I need to get closer,

326
00:14:15,400 --> 00:14:17,440
Speaker 2: you know. And so it's like, how confident am I

327
00:14:17,480 --> 00:14:20,440
Speaker 2: that this is a five or a ten or if

328
00:14:20,440 --> 00:14:22,800
Speaker 2: it's only five hundred yards, it's not gonna matter, right,

329
00:14:22,920 --> 00:14:24,760
Speaker 2: But if if I'm taking a shot at seven or

330
00:14:24,800 --> 00:14:26,680
Speaker 2: eight hundred and it starts to move that bullet an

331
00:14:26,680 --> 00:14:28,960
Speaker 2: extra you know, whatever it might be, I'm like, well,

332
00:14:28,960 --> 00:14:31,360
Speaker 2: that's not that's not ethical, you know, in my opinion,

333
00:14:31,400 --> 00:14:33,120
Speaker 2: then I need to get closer or not take the shot.

334
00:14:33,160 --> 00:14:34,800
Speaker 2: And so I do a lot of that, Like here's

335
00:14:34,840 --> 00:14:37,200
Speaker 2: my envelope. I think it could be as low as three,

336
00:14:37,240 --> 00:14:39,720
Speaker 2: it could be as high as ten. And then like

337
00:14:39,840 --> 00:14:43,200
Speaker 2: where does that move my bullet? And can I compensate

338
00:14:43,200 --> 00:14:44,600
Speaker 2: for that? Am I still going to hit vitals if

339
00:14:44,640 --> 00:14:46,920
Speaker 2: I'm at either end? And can I you know, split that?

340
00:14:48,440 --> 00:14:50,160
Speaker 2: Like you say, it's all in art what you're comfortable with,

341
00:14:51,880 --> 00:14:53,960
Speaker 2: And I'm gonna go This kind of a good segue

342
00:14:53,960 --> 00:14:56,400
Speaker 2: to our next question from Charlie Smith, who's my buddy

343
00:14:56,480 --> 00:14:57,680
Speaker 2: of my good time hunting partner.

344
00:14:59,200 --> 00:15:01,120
Speaker 3: You guys, is this banter online?

345
00:15:01,120 --> 00:15:03,880
Speaker 2: As always gone, oh yeah, and this this this banner

346
00:15:04,000 --> 00:15:06,120
Speaker 2: kind of comes into this question where it's stuff that

347
00:15:06,160 --> 00:15:09,000
Speaker 2: we all talk about behind the scenes, but when you

348
00:15:09,000 --> 00:15:11,080
Speaker 2: you don't want to necessarily knock long range hunting. But

349
00:15:11,080 --> 00:15:13,840
Speaker 2: so Charlie Smith's question is do you think long range

350
00:15:13,920 --> 00:15:16,320
Speaker 2: rifles are ruining hunting? Which is is a fair question.

351
00:15:16,680 --> 00:15:19,560
Speaker 2: And when you say ruining hunting, is it ruining our season?

352
00:15:19,680 --> 00:15:21,880
Speaker 2: Shortening them? Is it taking too many animals? But like,

353
00:15:22,280 --> 00:15:24,080
Speaker 2: what's your opinion on that? Because it is something that

354
00:15:24,120 --> 00:15:25,440
Speaker 2: I feel like we should have to be able to

355
00:15:25,440 --> 00:15:27,880
Speaker 2: answer if you're gonna shoot. And then the other thing

356
00:15:27,960 --> 00:15:30,800
Speaker 2: is what is long range hunting defined as, which I

357
00:15:30,800 --> 00:15:32,600
Speaker 2: don't even want to get into right now, but like

358
00:15:32,960 --> 00:15:34,000
Speaker 2: in your opinion.

359
00:15:33,720 --> 00:15:35,840
Speaker 1: Is this whole long range movement? Is it? Is it

360
00:15:35,840 --> 00:15:37,720
Speaker 1: affecting hunting? And to what degree?

361
00:15:39,280 --> 00:15:39,480
Speaker 3: Yeah?

362
00:15:39,480 --> 00:15:41,600
Speaker 4: I mean I don't I don't understand how you you

363
00:15:41,640 --> 00:15:43,920
Speaker 4: could say it's not. How is technology not? I mean

364
00:15:44,360 --> 00:15:46,640
Speaker 4: when I started archery, I mean I shot archer for years,

365
00:15:46,840 --> 00:15:49,280
Speaker 4: years ago, a forty fifty yard shot was a tough shot.

366
00:15:49,360 --> 00:15:52,080
Speaker 4: Now now my bow's got a slider and I can

367
00:15:52,240 --> 00:15:55,280
Speaker 4: you can stackers at a hundred yards like it's it's

368
00:15:55,400 --> 00:15:57,600
Speaker 4: and you look at muzzleloaders, right, you look at these

369
00:15:58,000 --> 00:16:01,280
Speaker 4: crazy muzzleloaders that are shooting smoke powder some of the states.

370
00:16:01,280 --> 00:16:03,160
Speaker 4: I mean, I think those rules are changing. But there's

371
00:16:03,200 --> 00:16:05,480
Speaker 4: buzzle there's five six, seven hundred yards, you know, and

372
00:16:05,520 --> 00:16:08,120
Speaker 4: so yeah, absolutely.

373
00:16:07,440 --> 00:16:09,520
Speaker 3: More animals are dying. People are getting better at hunting.

374
00:16:09,560 --> 00:16:12,800
Speaker 4: There's so much information like this podcast and many others

375
00:16:13,200 --> 00:16:14,640
Speaker 4: and internet forums.

376
00:16:14,680 --> 00:16:17,760
Speaker 3: So yeah, I think it is. I think states.

377
00:16:18,720 --> 00:16:24,600
Speaker 4: I think I worry about a lot hunting. I've had

378
00:16:24,640 --> 00:16:27,320
Speaker 4: the opportunity to go on some high end hunts that

379
00:16:27,360 --> 00:16:31,480
Speaker 4: are out of my budget that because of the buddy

380
00:16:31,480 --> 00:16:34,320
Speaker 4: I have and experienced both sides the thing. I mean,

381
00:16:34,320 --> 00:16:36,280
Speaker 4: I grew up over the counter hunting and I live

382
00:16:36,320 --> 00:16:38,840
Speaker 4: in western Oregon, grew up in western Washington. So we're

383
00:16:38,880 --> 00:16:42,640
Speaker 4: hunting roses and blacktails parked in the trailhead which used

384
00:16:42,640 --> 00:16:45,280
Speaker 4: to be three or four trucks now it's ten or twenty,

385
00:16:45,360 --> 00:16:48,280
Speaker 4: and so we all see the same thing. I see

386
00:16:48,280 --> 00:16:52,920
Speaker 4: how money is affecting opportunity big time. It's not a

387
00:16:52,920 --> 00:16:54,280
Speaker 4: good thing or a bad thing. It just is what

388
00:16:54,280 --> 00:16:59,280
Speaker 4: it is. And hunting is, yeah, killing stuff with the

389
00:16:59,360 --> 00:17:03,120
Speaker 4: rifles easy than it used to be. I think unfortunately

390
00:17:03,200 --> 00:17:06,280
Speaker 4: fish you know, fish and game departments get funding from

391
00:17:06,280 --> 00:17:08,560
Speaker 4: tag sales, and they're not going to cut numbers, and

392
00:17:08,600 --> 00:17:10,560
Speaker 4: I wish they would. I think there needs to be

393
00:17:10,640 --> 00:17:13,159
Speaker 4: less opportunity. I mean, you look at Arizona and the

394
00:17:13,200 --> 00:17:14,560
Speaker 4: way they look at hunting. I got a lot of

395
00:17:14,600 --> 00:17:17,399
Speaker 4: buddies down there. They apply it their whole life, and

396
00:17:17,440 --> 00:17:20,720
Speaker 4: they hunt with other people because they draw every five, ten,

397
00:17:20,840 --> 00:17:23,680
Speaker 4: fifteen years, but they hunt every year with the group

398
00:17:24,480 --> 00:17:26,080
Speaker 4: just because tags are so hard to get. I don't

399
00:17:26,119 --> 00:17:31,400
Speaker 4: like that, but there's the reality of supplying demand quality

400
00:17:31,480 --> 00:17:33,680
Speaker 4: I don't and it's also a different value.

401
00:17:33,720 --> 00:17:36,040
Speaker 3: Some guys like to go into to fkinhorn. I want to, like.

402
00:17:36,080 --> 00:17:38,399
Speaker 4: I love the idea of finding a big buck, so

403
00:17:38,480 --> 00:17:41,800
Speaker 4: I wish there were you know, I wish there needs

404
00:17:41,800 --> 00:17:43,119
Speaker 4: to be less tags in some areas.

405
00:17:43,200 --> 00:17:44,919
Speaker 3: I mean, it's a sticky people are going to get

406
00:17:44,960 --> 00:17:47,800
Speaker 3: fired up. But yeah, I think it does. It makes

407
00:17:47,840 --> 00:17:52,359
Speaker 3: it easier in some ways. I don't like the guys.

408
00:17:52,080 --> 00:17:54,159
Speaker 4: Already mentioned this that are like puffing their chest up

409
00:17:54,160 --> 00:17:55,120
Speaker 4: because they shot so far.

410
00:17:56,600 --> 00:17:58,320
Speaker 3: The brag adocious of that kind.

411
00:17:58,240 --> 00:18:02,720
Speaker 4: Of stuff bugs me, but it happens in every everything

412
00:18:02,880 --> 00:18:05,000
Speaker 4: I shot. This at fifty five yards with my trad

413
00:18:05,040 --> 00:18:06,880
Speaker 4: and ball. I shot this at one twenty with my compound.

414
00:18:06,880 --> 00:18:08,800
Speaker 4: I shot this at five hundred with a muzzleoader, and

415
00:18:08,840 --> 00:18:10,520
Speaker 4: I show this at fifteen hundred with the center fire.

416
00:18:10,600 --> 00:18:12,840
Speaker 4: It's the same thing across the board. Everyone's getting better,

417
00:18:12,880 --> 00:18:15,000
Speaker 4: everyone's getting dead deadler in technologies.

418
00:18:15,320 --> 00:18:16,200
Speaker 1: Yeah, incredible.

419
00:18:16,320 --> 00:18:18,199
Speaker 3: We we're Oh, I mean, I don't I don't know

420
00:18:18,240 --> 00:18:18,879
Speaker 3: what the answer is.

421
00:18:19,000 --> 00:18:22,080
Speaker 2: Yeah, yeah, No, I think I think we both know.

422
00:18:22,119 --> 00:18:23,720
Speaker 2: And and I'm I'm on the side where yeah, we've

423
00:18:23,720 --> 00:18:27,000
Speaker 2: got and I would I say we, I I should

424
00:18:27,000 --> 00:18:29,040
Speaker 2: be careful to put myself on the same boat as you,

425
00:18:29,080 --> 00:18:31,680
Speaker 2: but like we have the ability to shoot to shoot

426
00:18:31,680 --> 00:18:33,880
Speaker 2: like long range, but I take more pride. And then

427
00:18:33,920 --> 00:18:36,040
Speaker 2: I snuck into that bucket one hundred and fifty, you know,

428
00:18:36,119 --> 00:18:38,200
Speaker 2: or one hundred. Yeah, I had a long range rifle,

429
00:18:38,240 --> 00:18:41,199
Speaker 2: but I was still hunting, you know. And and I

430
00:18:41,320 --> 00:18:43,960
Speaker 2: just it seems like you just have the skills necessary

431
00:18:44,000 --> 00:18:45,919
Speaker 2: to take the long range shot if you need to,

432
00:18:46,000 --> 00:18:48,119
Speaker 2: or a follow up shot. But you know, I just

433
00:18:48,119 --> 00:18:50,840
Speaker 2: assume see a trad guy kill at five yards, you know,

434
00:18:51,080 --> 00:18:53,679
Speaker 2: or or a compound guy kill at ten, you know,

435
00:18:54,359 --> 00:18:55,960
Speaker 2: whether they can shoot at a hundred or not is

436
00:18:55,960 --> 00:18:56,679
Speaker 2: a different story.

437
00:18:56,720 --> 00:18:59,960
Speaker 1: But to me, that's the challenge one percent.

438
00:19:00,080 --> 00:19:02,359
Speaker 4: I mean, we all want to be ethical and competent.

439
00:19:02,480 --> 00:19:05,600
Speaker 4: I loved archery hunting. I shot more balls and deer

440
00:19:05,640 --> 00:19:08,080
Speaker 4: with my deer. I shot more elk with both than

441
00:19:08,119 --> 00:19:10,200
Speaker 4: I have with a gun, and shot quite a few deer.

442
00:19:10,240 --> 00:19:12,639
Speaker 4: And I liked it because it was challenging. When I

443
00:19:12,920 --> 00:19:15,960
Speaker 4: back in the day, I had sided my whatever I

444
00:19:16,000 --> 00:19:18,400
Speaker 4: was shooting with my thirty six or three hundred wind

445
00:19:18,400 --> 00:19:19,480
Speaker 4: bag or whatever, and.

446
00:19:19,440 --> 00:19:20,840
Speaker 3: Then I was done. I was like, it's not fun

447
00:19:20,840 --> 00:19:22,719
Speaker 3: to shoot that gun at two hundred yards.

448
00:19:22,880 --> 00:19:26,159
Speaker 4: And so I was geeking out on the archery side,

449
00:19:27,240 --> 00:19:30,120
Speaker 4: and then found out about long range a long time ago,

450
00:19:30,680 --> 00:19:32,960
Speaker 4: and it just was interesting.

451
00:19:32,960 --> 00:19:33,320
Speaker 3: It was fun.

452
00:19:33,359 --> 00:19:35,359
Speaker 4: It was challenging again. It was fun to make wind calls.

453
00:19:35,359 --> 00:19:37,280
Speaker 4: It was fun to learn that art of it, and

454
00:19:37,359 --> 00:19:42,080
Speaker 4: so and then I started hunting that way, and.

455
00:19:42,160 --> 00:19:44,639
Speaker 3: It is fun. I mean, this year, pretty short kills.

456
00:19:44,680 --> 00:19:46,320
Speaker 3: I got shot.

457
00:19:46,480 --> 00:19:48,760
Speaker 4: I killed the big white, my biggest white tail at

458
00:19:49,359 --> 00:19:50,399
Speaker 4: sixty five yards.

459
00:19:50,400 --> 00:19:52,239
Speaker 3: I was working it was working these doughs and it

460
00:19:52,280 --> 00:19:53,040
Speaker 3: was in this thick stuff.

461
00:19:53,080 --> 00:19:54,679
Speaker 4: I just worked in on it and then you know,

462
00:19:54,720 --> 00:19:57,720
Speaker 4: shot my sidkat a couple hundred, I don't two fifty.

463
00:19:58,560 --> 00:20:01,760
Speaker 3: Just a lot of closer arrange stuff this year. It's

464
00:20:02,480 --> 00:20:04,959
Speaker 3: is it easy? I think it's easier to shoot an

465
00:20:05,000 --> 00:20:07,479
Speaker 3: animal four to six hundred yards than it is at

466
00:20:07,520 --> 00:20:10,920
Speaker 3: fifty to one hundred most of the time because it's calm.

467
00:20:11,240 --> 00:20:13,800
Speaker 3: I'm prone, like I'm not going to miss that shot, yeap,

468
00:20:13,920 --> 00:20:16,719
Speaker 3: And so yeah, I don't know.

469
00:20:16,840 --> 00:20:19,960
Speaker 4: I mean, it's a it is a debate, and I

470
00:20:20,040 --> 00:20:20,800
Speaker 4: totally get it.

471
00:20:20,880 --> 00:20:22,199
Speaker 3: I'm not one that's going to defend it.

472
00:20:22,240 --> 00:20:24,800
Speaker 4: I don't like when guys pick sides like compound guys

473
00:20:25,160 --> 00:20:26,160
Speaker 4: or muzzle or guys.

474
00:20:26,160 --> 00:20:30,520
Speaker 3: We're all We're all doing the same thing. The game is.

475
00:20:30,680 --> 00:20:33,280
Speaker 3: It's the sports change. And it's been weird the last

476
00:20:33,320 --> 00:20:37,679
Speaker 3: three years watching watching the money and everything change. And

477
00:20:37,880 --> 00:20:39,560
Speaker 3: it's a lot of it's all of it, it's all over,

478
00:20:40,160 --> 00:20:42,960
Speaker 3: it's social media, it's everything. But it's it is changing quick.

479
00:20:43,080 --> 00:20:44,520
Speaker 3: I don't know. It will be interesting to see where

480
00:20:44,520 --> 00:20:44,879
Speaker 3: it goes.

481
00:20:45,640 --> 00:20:48,119
Speaker 2: I think that if if we're going to be willing

482
00:20:48,200 --> 00:20:51,119
Speaker 2: to do it, we just have to accept or like

483
00:20:51,160 --> 00:20:53,399
Speaker 2: you said, make change like Arizona, that our seasons may

484
00:20:53,440 --> 00:20:55,520
Speaker 2: shorten because our take's going to be higher. We're going to,

485
00:20:55,520 --> 00:20:58,639
Speaker 2: you know, because of some of these things and technology advancements.

486
00:20:58,680 --> 00:21:00,119
Speaker 2: But then I don't want to be a hypocrite and

487
00:21:00,160 --> 00:21:02,239
Speaker 2: say that we shouldn't have them because I'm also using them,

488
00:21:02,240 --> 00:21:04,480
Speaker 2: because otherwise, if you're not, if you don't have the

489
00:21:04,480 --> 00:21:06,760
Speaker 2: ability year behind everybody. And so I I think it's

490
00:21:06,760 --> 00:21:10,280
Speaker 2: just a personal decision. I like the the art and

491
00:21:10,040 --> 00:21:13,480
Speaker 2: the science and the nerdiness behind it and getting the

492
00:21:13,560 --> 00:21:16,520
Speaker 2: setup that you're just like, you know, super confident, and

493
00:21:16,600 --> 00:21:18,600
Speaker 2: you know, for me, like five hundred yards, like I'm

494
00:21:18,600 --> 00:21:20,160
Speaker 2: gonna put this bullet inside of a two inch circle

495
00:21:20,160 --> 00:21:22,600
Speaker 2: at five hundred like no question where before you know,

496
00:21:22,640 --> 00:21:24,840
Speaker 2: growing up, I had a three by nine loopol Very

497
00:21:24,920 --> 00:21:25,639
Speaker 2: X two where you're like.

498
00:21:25,680 --> 00:21:26,720
Speaker 1: Oh, just aim at the post.

499
00:21:26,800 --> 00:21:28,400
Speaker 2: You know, that's all you ever heard on those duplexes

500
00:21:28,400 --> 00:21:30,879
Speaker 2: like fire no matter what, gun, no matter what.

501
00:21:32,600 --> 00:21:35,480
Speaker 3: And then put on the back, put on the back

502
00:21:35,480 --> 00:21:36,440
Speaker 3: to one thousand yards.

503
00:21:37,600 --> 00:21:39,200
Speaker 2: And then the one thing that really drives me nuts,

504
00:21:39,240 --> 00:21:40,840
Speaker 2: and I'm gonna throw some of my own family under

505
00:21:40,840 --> 00:21:43,120
Speaker 2: the bus, you know, because they had custom guns built

506
00:21:43,119 --> 00:21:45,679
Speaker 2: because we were out doing it and maybe taking longer shots.

507
00:21:45,720 --> 00:21:48,680
Speaker 2: And you know, I can like my Dad, you get

508
00:21:48,680 --> 00:21:50,439
Speaker 2: like ten bolts down the barrel and be like all right,

509
00:21:50,440 --> 00:21:52,040
Speaker 2: build my dope chart and showed me how to dial

510
00:21:52,119 --> 00:21:54,320
Speaker 2: this thing, you know, And I'm like, well, I don't

511
00:21:54,359 --> 00:21:56,399
Speaker 2: know if like you don't have a coach there or

512
00:21:56,440 --> 00:21:59,480
Speaker 2: like understanding all this. And like my uncle going on

513
00:21:59,520 --> 00:22:03,560
Speaker 2: a deer hunh it this year, like he never chronoled it.

514
00:22:03,760 --> 00:22:05,720
Speaker 2: He went off of like somebody else's load data for

515
00:22:05,760 --> 00:22:07,880
Speaker 2: a different gun, and then like, oh, I should be good.

516
00:22:07,960 --> 00:22:10,000
Speaker 1: He's He's like I should be good like eight hundred

517
00:22:10,160 --> 00:22:10,520
Speaker 1: right with this.

518
00:22:10,600 --> 00:22:13,560
Speaker 2: I'm like, no, you don't, like you haven't confirmed anything

519
00:22:13,960 --> 00:22:15,919
Speaker 2: besides a starting point, you know.

520
00:22:16,000 --> 00:22:17,160
Speaker 1: And it's the same.

521
00:22:17,200 --> 00:22:19,359
Speaker 4: It's the same guys that get their gun boar sided

522
00:22:19,400 --> 00:22:21,399
Speaker 4: Sportsman the night before season and think they're ready to

523
00:22:21,400 --> 00:22:23,080
Speaker 4: go hunt. It's the same guys that buy a bow

524
00:22:23,240 --> 00:22:24,200
Speaker 4: the week before season.

525
00:22:24,280 --> 00:22:26,679
Speaker 3: So it's the same. It's the same mentality.

526
00:22:26,720 --> 00:22:31,040
Speaker 4: There's uh yeah, it's yeah, I know.

527
00:22:31,000 --> 00:22:33,040
Speaker 3: What it is. There were guys outside care we don't

528
00:22:33,080 --> 00:22:34,240
Speaker 3: geek out like we do.

529
00:22:34,320 --> 00:22:36,600
Speaker 2: Yeah, and they think that just buying the equipment gets

530
00:22:36,680 --> 00:22:38,040
Speaker 2: him there, you know, and it's like, no, there's a

531
00:22:38,080 --> 00:22:42,320
Speaker 2: lot more to this, and so all diverge I know

532
00:22:42,440 --> 00:22:44,280
Speaker 2: Charlie brought that up more as a joke, but it's

533
00:22:44,320 --> 00:22:46,720
Speaker 2: something that we talk about. When when I said, when

534
00:22:46,720 --> 00:22:48,720
Speaker 2: we say ruining hunting, I wouldn't say it's ruining it,

535
00:22:48,760 --> 00:22:50,400
Speaker 2: but it's definitely affecting it in.

536
00:22:50,359 --> 00:22:51,720
Speaker 3: A change way.

537
00:22:51,920 --> 00:22:52,200
Speaker 1: Yep.

538
00:22:52,760 --> 00:22:54,720
Speaker 3: I mean, but what isn't like how has ONYX not

539
00:22:54,960 --> 00:22:55,359
Speaker 3: changed it?

540
00:22:55,440 --> 00:23:00,199
Speaker 4: How is everything we do like the application served us

541
00:23:00,600 --> 00:23:02,400
Speaker 4: and mapping and everything.

542
00:23:02,440 --> 00:23:05,880
Speaker 2: I mean, yeah, I mean you could throw you could

543
00:23:05,880 --> 00:23:07,720
Speaker 2: throw us under the bus, like easier to use calls

544
00:23:07,800 --> 00:23:10,320
Speaker 2: now you have more people that can use and so yeah,

545
00:23:10,359 --> 00:23:12,760
Speaker 2: I mean I'd be hypocritical to say this, but it's

546
00:23:12,760 --> 00:23:15,720
Speaker 2: just something I think is as a as a general

547
00:23:15,720 --> 00:23:18,359
Speaker 2: group of people, you know, hunters, we just have to

548
00:23:18,400 --> 00:23:20,800
Speaker 2: think about and make good decisions moving forward.

549
00:23:21,600 --> 00:23:21,920
Speaker 3: I think.

550
00:23:22,040 --> 00:23:24,080
Speaker 4: I think just being aware of it, having a discussion.

551
00:23:24,280 --> 00:23:28,280
Speaker 4: Everyone's using technology. The better trucks are farther, cutting gears lighter,

552
00:23:28,320 --> 00:23:31,320
Speaker 4: you can go in deeper, you stay drier, you stay warmer.

553
00:23:31,480 --> 00:23:32,240
Speaker 3: Everything we do.

554
00:23:32,640 --> 00:23:36,600
Speaker 4: Nutrition is lighter, peak put forty grams of protein instead

555
00:23:36,600 --> 00:23:37,399
Speaker 4: of ten like Mountain.

556
00:23:38,359 --> 00:23:42,920
Speaker 3: Everything's better, right, so you can you can do I

557
00:23:43,000 --> 00:23:45,439
Speaker 3: think the discussion and just to beware you can't get mad.

558
00:23:45,320 --> 00:23:46,800
Speaker 4: About it, but I think you've got to be open

559
00:23:46,840 --> 00:23:51,040
Speaker 4: to potential tag cut numbers and being not drawn as much.

560
00:23:52,240 --> 00:23:53,840
Speaker 3: I think that's ultimately where we need to go. I

561
00:23:53,840 --> 00:23:54,840
Speaker 3: don't know that when we do that.

562
00:23:54,760 --> 00:23:57,280
Speaker 4: Because fishing games were lying on the sales, we'll see

563
00:23:57,440 --> 00:23:59,879
Speaker 4: it's and then now we got wolves.

564
00:24:00,240 --> 00:24:05,720
Speaker 3: Yeah, yeah, we won't get into that one range. There's

565
00:24:05,760 --> 00:24:07,760
Speaker 3: no ethical distance for a wolf, so take that.

566
00:24:22,440 --> 00:24:25,200
Speaker 2: So this is this one may just pertain the long range,

567
00:24:25,200 --> 00:24:27,000
Speaker 2: and I'll let you put the parameters on it. So

568
00:24:27,560 --> 00:24:29,240
Speaker 2: when do you take and this comes from my buddy

569
00:24:29,240 --> 00:24:31,119
Speaker 2: Cody Wilson, not a whoming when do you look at

570
00:24:31,160 --> 00:24:34,879
Speaker 2: things like asthmuth and and bullets like spin drift, Like

571
00:24:34,920 --> 00:24:36,680
Speaker 2: when do those things come into play? Is that only

572
00:24:36,680 --> 00:24:38,400
Speaker 2: when you're looking at like really long range and maybe

573
00:24:38,440 --> 00:24:41,240
Speaker 2: explain asthmuth for people that you know don't understand.

574
00:24:41,359 --> 00:24:44,919
Speaker 4: For coriolis, yeah, you take a heading that generally referring

575
00:24:44,920 --> 00:24:47,320
Speaker 4: to coriols a fact the rotation of the earth. I mean,

576
00:24:47,359 --> 00:24:50,920
Speaker 4: that's I would say, I don't want to say never,

577
00:24:51,040 --> 00:24:51,880
Speaker 4: but pretty much never.

578
00:24:52,760 --> 00:24:53,960
Speaker 3: That's not going to affect anything.

579
00:24:54,000 --> 00:24:58,760
Speaker 4: Spin drift absolutely, I mean, you'll get for sure, have

580
00:24:58,880 --> 00:25:00,960
Speaker 4: your spind drift on in your calculators.

581
00:25:00,560 --> 00:25:03,560
Speaker 3: If you're zeroed almost all barrels or right twist, which

582
00:25:03,640 --> 00:25:05,360
Speaker 3: means if you're your zero is.

583
00:25:05,320 --> 00:25:08,439
Speaker 4: Dead on left right, you're gonna hit right at distance

584
00:25:08,480 --> 00:25:12,240
Speaker 4: because your bullet's rolling to the right. So yes, absolutely

585
00:25:12,320 --> 00:25:13,679
Speaker 4: use that spin drift is going to be.

586
00:25:14,000 --> 00:25:16,119
Speaker 3: It's going to be. It depends on the caliber and

587
00:25:16,200 --> 00:25:16,639
Speaker 3: the twist.

588
00:25:16,800 --> 00:25:18,359
Speaker 4: You know, it can be four or five six inches

589
00:25:18,359 --> 00:25:22,320
Speaker 4: of a thousand plus or minus, and it's definitely moving

590
00:25:22,320 --> 00:25:22,760
Speaker 4: your bullets.

591
00:25:22,800 --> 00:25:27,119
Speaker 3: So yes, do spin drift Coreyolis.

592
00:25:26,440 --> 00:25:30,320
Speaker 4: Or your asthmuth not near as important, I'd say in

593
00:25:30,400 --> 00:25:33,360
Speaker 4: hunting distances, it's nearly it's irrelevant relevant.

594
00:25:34,600 --> 00:25:36,760
Speaker 3: That would be my opinion. Some people may argue that,

595
00:25:36,840 --> 00:25:39,359
Speaker 3: but I don't really know anybody that would argue that.

596
00:25:39,359 --> 00:25:42,159
Speaker 2: A whole lot, and I might misquote you. I know

597
00:25:42,200 --> 00:25:45,120
Speaker 2: at one time you had actually told me to cite

598
00:25:45,160 --> 00:25:46,760
Speaker 2: my gun into one hundred a little bit to the

599
00:25:46,840 --> 00:25:48,800
Speaker 2: left to kind of account for that out to what

600
00:25:48,880 --> 00:25:50,840
Speaker 2: I would consider my hunting distance is right, and it

601
00:25:50,920 --> 00:25:53,119
Speaker 2: kind of just now you just said keep it on

602
00:25:53,119 --> 00:25:55,280
Speaker 2: your calculator, which I don't want to discredit that at all,

603
00:25:55,320 --> 00:25:57,280
Speaker 2: but for a guy like me, that's not going to

604
00:25:57,320 --> 00:25:59,560
Speaker 2: shoot it an animal unless it's a follow up shot.

605
00:25:59,600 --> 00:26:01,639
Speaker 2: Ever passed the thousand, Like I want to say, we

606
00:26:01,680 --> 00:26:04,160
Speaker 2: were like an inch maybe inch and a quarter left

607
00:26:04,200 --> 00:26:06,480
Speaker 2: at a hundred, which doesn't hurt me at one hundred,

608
00:26:06,480 --> 00:26:07,120
Speaker 2: But then a lot.

609
00:26:08,160 --> 00:26:09,000
Speaker 3: I wouldn't. I wouldn't.

610
00:26:09,040 --> 00:26:11,840
Speaker 4: I would never say that much. I'm usually if I'm left,

611
00:26:12,600 --> 00:26:14,680
Speaker 4: I'm shooting Mills now. I shot in the way forever

612
00:26:14,840 --> 00:26:16,760
Speaker 4: bolt grade. I'm not going to go into it in Mills.

613
00:26:16,880 --> 00:26:18,960
Speaker 4: M a discussion, but I shoot Mills now because it's

614
00:26:19,000 --> 00:26:20,560
Speaker 4: in the comp world, and I do like a lot

615
00:26:20,560 --> 00:26:21,600
Speaker 4: of aspects of it.

616
00:26:21,680 --> 00:26:23,399
Speaker 3: For I think there's some benefits to it in the

617
00:26:23,440 --> 00:26:24,280
Speaker 3: hunting world as well.

618
00:26:24,280 --> 00:26:28,399
Speaker 4: But uh so, each click in a mill is roughly

619
00:26:28,480 --> 00:26:33,720
Speaker 4: point three to three four three six whatever. If if

620
00:26:33,760 --> 00:26:38,280
Speaker 4: I can't land on my zero if I if I'm

621
00:26:38,320 --> 00:26:40,440
Speaker 4: going to be either left or right on my zero point,

622
00:26:40,560 --> 00:26:43,400
Speaker 4: I'm gonna I'm gonna choose the left to little left. Yeah,

623
00:26:43,440 --> 00:26:44,959
Speaker 4: it's I'm not. I'm never going to go on an

624
00:26:45,000 --> 00:26:46,240
Speaker 4: inch left. That's a lot.

625
00:26:47,240 --> 00:26:49,000
Speaker 3: I wouldn't. I wouldn't. I wouldn't say that.

626
00:26:49,080 --> 00:26:51,000
Speaker 4: But if I'm gonna choose either left or right, I'm

627
00:26:51,000 --> 00:26:53,080
Speaker 4: gonna choose left and just kind of have a mental

628
00:26:53,119 --> 00:26:55,240
Speaker 4: note of that when I'm calculating spin drift and we're

629
00:26:55,280 --> 00:26:57,840
Speaker 4: talking in the hunting world, You're right, it's not near

630
00:26:57,880 --> 00:27:00,480
Speaker 4: as important. I mean, five six inches of a thousand,

631
00:27:00,520 --> 00:27:02,720
Speaker 4: that's a chunk of But you know, in your three four, five,

632
00:27:02,760 --> 00:27:05,439
Speaker 4: six seven hundred yard range, you're talking a few inches,

633
00:27:05,560 --> 00:27:08,360
Speaker 4: you're still in the vitals. It's going to be more

634
00:27:08,359 --> 00:27:11,639
Speaker 4: of an issue judging the wind than spin drift. But

635
00:27:11,680 --> 00:27:14,200
Speaker 4: if you're dead calm and like I'm trying to shoot

636
00:27:14,200 --> 00:27:17,040
Speaker 4: a like a two inch steel target at six seven

637
00:27:17,080 --> 00:27:20,000
Speaker 4: hundred yards, if it's dead calm, you are going to

638
00:27:20,040 --> 00:27:20,440
Speaker 4: miss right.

639
00:27:20,800 --> 00:27:22,640
Speaker 3: You're going to mis right. So you have to take

640
00:27:22,680 --> 00:27:24,600
Speaker 3: that into account on tiny, little skinny targets.

641
00:27:24,680 --> 00:27:27,400
Speaker 2: Yeah, and then I actually ended up avoiding that going

642
00:27:27,480 --> 00:27:29,240
Speaker 2: left at all plans, which has probably saved me. It

643
00:27:29,280 --> 00:27:30,600
Speaker 2: sounds like, because that would have been too much, I

644
00:27:30,640 --> 00:27:32,320
Speaker 2: just went back to zero and then like, you have

645
00:27:32,400 --> 00:27:33,760
Speaker 2: my spin drift calculator on.

646
00:27:34,040 --> 00:27:35,320
Speaker 3: Yeah, I think that's the smartest.

647
00:27:35,440 --> 00:27:35,640
Speaker 1: Yeah.

648
00:27:35,960 --> 00:27:38,040
Speaker 3: Yeah, back in the day, I mean, when I started,

649
00:27:38,080 --> 00:27:39,719
Speaker 3: I'm kind of getting old now, I guess, But there

650
00:27:39,800 --> 00:27:41,360
Speaker 3: wasn't spin drifting calculators.

651
00:27:41,359 --> 00:27:43,480
Speaker 4: There's everybody just new, like all these bolts kind of

652
00:27:43,480 --> 00:27:45,160
Speaker 4: go right, so I'm going to zero a little left,

653
00:27:45,200 --> 00:27:46,399
Speaker 4: I mean, and then you just kind of have that

654
00:27:46,440 --> 00:27:49,760
Speaker 4: mental note. So it's progressing, like you get the new

655
00:27:49,880 --> 00:27:53,080
Speaker 4: like the Kestrel fifty seven hundred with appliaballistics, like they've

656
00:27:53,119 --> 00:27:56,000
Speaker 4: got cross wind jump and spin drip, you got every.

657
00:27:55,800 --> 00:27:58,719
Speaker 3: Calculation at Coriolis, they got everything in there.

658
00:27:58,760 --> 00:28:01,000
Speaker 4: I mean, it's a you know, and those apps are

659
00:28:01,040 --> 00:28:02,359
Speaker 4: on on your.

660
00:28:02,240 --> 00:28:03,719
Speaker 1: Phone as well and different things like that.

661
00:28:03,960 --> 00:28:06,479
Speaker 2: So okay, well, well that was that's going to kind

662
00:28:06,480 --> 00:28:10,240
Speaker 2: of wrap it up for the listener questions. Once again,

663
00:28:10,280 --> 00:28:12,280
Speaker 2: you have questions for us here at Cutting the Distance,

664
00:28:12,320 --> 00:28:15,840
Speaker 2: please email them to us at CTD at Phelpsgamecalls dot

665
00:28:15,840 --> 00:28:17,359
Speaker 2: com or send us a message and we'll do our

666
00:28:17,400 --> 00:28:19,320
Speaker 2: best to Again. So now we're gonna kind of jump

667
00:28:19,359 --> 00:28:23,080
Speaker 2: into my discussion, you know, on on the guns and

668
00:28:23,119 --> 00:28:26,959
Speaker 2: the equipment. But before we jump into those conversations about

669
00:28:27,000 --> 00:28:29,520
Speaker 2: the guns and components, which everybody loves to talk about,

670
00:28:29,600 --> 00:28:32,359
Speaker 2: right because you can control that with money, but you can't.

671
00:28:32,480 --> 00:28:34,800
Speaker 2: But let's talk about what, in my opinion, really matters

672
00:28:34,840 --> 00:28:36,879
Speaker 2: and we'll see if you agree is the things that

673
00:28:36,920 --> 00:28:38,880
Speaker 2: you can't buy with money, you know, whether it's reading

674
00:28:38,920 --> 00:28:40,880
Speaker 2: the wind, you know, the art of it, a bunch

675
00:28:40,960 --> 00:28:43,560
Speaker 2: of trigger time, you know, hundreds of thousands rounds. Like

676
00:28:44,080 --> 00:28:46,760
Speaker 2: what defines a good long range hunter versus a guy

677
00:28:46,800 --> 00:28:48,960
Speaker 2: that goes out and buys a ten thousand dollars rifle

678
00:28:49,880 --> 00:28:51,640
Speaker 2: That that equipment's no good if you don't have this

679
00:28:51,680 --> 00:28:53,960
Speaker 2: other stuff? So what what do people really need to

680
00:28:54,040 --> 00:28:56,400
Speaker 2: know in order to start pulling the trigger at long

681
00:28:56,480 --> 00:28:58,080
Speaker 2: ranges or be effective when they do.

682
00:28:59,400 --> 00:29:02,560
Speaker 4: Yeah, I mean, I obviously the list is super long.

683
00:29:02,800 --> 00:29:06,160
Speaker 4: I think I think you need to be interested in it.

684
00:29:06,160 --> 00:29:08,320
Speaker 4: It's got to be kind, it's got to be somewhat

685
00:29:08,360 --> 00:29:11,640
Speaker 4: of a hobby. I think you could make the argument.

686
00:29:13,200 --> 00:29:15,040
Speaker 4: And we and I do do this. We train people

687
00:29:15,040 --> 00:29:18,080
Speaker 4: and stuff. We take guys out that have more money

688
00:29:18,080 --> 00:29:20,520
Speaker 4: than time, you know, some of these some of these

689
00:29:20,560 --> 00:29:24,080
Speaker 4: bigger some of these guys that go on pretty big hunts,

690
00:29:24,320 --> 00:29:26,360
Speaker 4: or they're business guys that make a pretty good income,

691
00:29:26,480 --> 00:29:27,560
Speaker 4: so they don't have a lot of time to go

692
00:29:27,560 --> 00:29:29,240
Speaker 4: shoot on the weekends and they're not going to travel

693
00:29:29,240 --> 00:29:31,280
Speaker 4: around to comps. They're times more valuable than that. So

694
00:29:31,760 --> 00:29:32,960
Speaker 4: it's not there it's not their deal.

695
00:29:33,120 --> 00:29:36,160
Speaker 3: So you can make the argument that.

696
00:29:36,240 --> 00:29:39,640
Speaker 4: In that generally what was what was rapid shooting three

697
00:29:39,720 --> 00:29:41,840
Speaker 4: hundred yards and end type of a thing four hundred

698
00:29:41,880 --> 00:29:44,240
Speaker 4: was a long shot. You could make the argument that

699
00:29:44,360 --> 00:29:47,600
Speaker 4: three to six hundred yards with a good set up

700
00:29:47,680 --> 00:29:51,520
Speaker 4: gun and limited knowledge is nearly automatic. And so I

701
00:29:51,560 --> 00:29:53,200
Speaker 4: talk with a lot of guys as like, man, I'd

702
00:29:53,240 --> 00:29:55,080
Speaker 4: really like your limit to be in that six six

703
00:29:55,160 --> 00:29:58,360
Speaker 4: fifty range, unless the wind is howling and maybe less.

704
00:29:58,920 --> 00:30:01,920
Speaker 4: I think when you get as that five six hundred

705
00:30:01,960 --> 00:30:04,800
Speaker 4: yard range, you really you need to It's got to

706
00:30:04,800 --> 00:30:05,320
Speaker 4: be a hobby.

707
00:30:05,400 --> 00:30:07,320
Speaker 3: You got to be interested. You got to shoot.

708
00:30:07,560 --> 00:30:09,160
Speaker 4: You can't go out and shoot four or five rounds

709
00:30:09,160 --> 00:30:14,200
Speaker 4: a year. Your form, your follow through, your trigger pull,

710
00:30:15,080 --> 00:30:16,120
Speaker 4: everything is.

711
00:30:16,000 --> 00:30:19,680
Speaker 3: Not is not going to be adequate to do in

712
00:30:19,720 --> 00:30:20,680
Speaker 3: my opinion.

713
00:30:20,280 --> 00:30:22,320
Speaker 4: To be ethical, you know, to make a seven hundred

714
00:30:22,400 --> 00:30:25,240
Speaker 4: yard shot, even have the wherewithal to think about, Okay,

715
00:30:25,520 --> 00:30:28,440
Speaker 4: the thermals are coming down this hill a little bit

716
00:30:28,560 --> 00:30:30,800
Speaker 4: left to right. I'm going to you know, just all

717
00:30:30,840 --> 00:30:35,080
Speaker 4: the basics to stay calm in a situation. I see

718
00:30:35,160 --> 00:30:37,120
Speaker 4: guys get so keyed up when they get in and

719
00:30:37,120 --> 00:30:39,160
Speaker 4: they're getting ready to take a shot that all the

720
00:30:39,200 --> 00:30:42,040
Speaker 4: thought process of the small things go away. And I

721
00:30:42,080 --> 00:30:44,520
Speaker 4: think you can get that by shooting more. You go up,

722
00:30:44,560 --> 00:30:45,840
Speaker 4: You go up in a clear cut and shoot. I

723
00:30:45,840 --> 00:30:47,520
Speaker 4: tell guys to go up, take five rounds or ten

724
00:30:47,560 --> 00:30:49,280
Speaker 4: rounds and go shoot in a clearcut, shoot some rocks

725
00:30:49,320 --> 00:30:51,720
Speaker 4: at you know, five hundred two thousand yards and.

726
00:30:51,680 --> 00:30:54,200
Speaker 3: Don't just shoot shoot shoot, Oh I hit it. See

727
00:30:54,200 --> 00:30:54,840
Speaker 3: if you can hit.

728
00:30:54,760 --> 00:30:56,680
Speaker 4: On a first round, or see if you can get real,

729
00:30:56,760 --> 00:30:59,040
Speaker 4: real close, because that's all that matters. If you hit

730
00:30:59,080 --> 00:31:01,080
Speaker 4: on your fifth round, it's relevant. Like the guys that

731
00:31:01,120 --> 00:31:04,320
Speaker 4: shoot new world record at forty two hundred yards and

732
00:31:04,360 --> 00:31:08,240
Speaker 4: you shot seventeen rounds. To me, it's it's I guess

733
00:31:08,360 --> 00:31:10,800
Speaker 4: the equipment's interesting to get a you know whatever. I

734
00:31:10,840 --> 00:31:12,960
Speaker 4: don't want to it seems dumb to me. Yeah, and

735
00:31:13,040 --> 00:31:15,360
Speaker 4: I don't have close first round impacts.

736
00:31:15,400 --> 00:31:17,880
Speaker 2: I don't want to throw the L word around on that.

737
00:31:18,040 --> 00:31:20,360
Speaker 2: You know, like you said one shot finally hit at seventeen,

738
00:31:20,480 --> 00:31:22,960
Speaker 2: but like I don't want to say, and this is gonna.

739
00:31:23,120 --> 00:31:24,560
Speaker 2: I don't know if we have any extra you know,

740
00:31:24,640 --> 00:31:27,600
Speaker 2: extreme long range people here, but like at some point

741
00:31:27,640 --> 00:31:29,920
Speaker 2: I already hit it one out of seventeen. Yeah, it's

742
00:31:29,960 --> 00:31:32,120
Speaker 2: still a feat and you still accomplish something. But was

743
00:31:32,120 --> 00:31:33,840
Speaker 2: there a little bit of luck involved finally that you

744
00:31:33,920 --> 00:31:35,720
Speaker 2: did hit at the last sixteen you know, And so

745
00:31:36,480 --> 00:31:37,400
Speaker 2: I just like.

746
00:31:37,320 --> 00:31:41,480
Speaker 3: You, Yeah, as a disclaimer, uh, there are they're doing

747
00:31:41,520 --> 00:31:44,520
Speaker 3: the world records are now they're doing like three consecutive

748
00:31:44,520 --> 00:31:47,680
Speaker 3: shots Cold War plus two at twenty five hundred and

749
00:31:47,720 --> 00:31:49,880
Speaker 3: thirty two. Like that's impressive. Like I'm not going to

750
00:31:49,920 --> 00:31:53,200
Speaker 3: discredit that, we you know, so anyway, disclaimer, Yeah, the

751
00:31:53,240 --> 00:31:55,920
Speaker 3: whole world record thing is to me is stupid, but whatever.

752
00:31:56,280 --> 00:31:58,120
Speaker 2: Yeah, and then like growing up around here what we

753
00:31:58,240 --> 00:32:00,040
Speaker 2: considered long range growing up, you know, we have a

754
00:32:00,080 --> 00:32:02,240
Speaker 2: pretty good range here where I grew up. You know

755
00:32:02,240 --> 00:32:04,080
Speaker 2: a lot of guys that were bench tress shooters here

756
00:32:04,080 --> 00:32:06,080
Speaker 2: at the at the PO range.

757
00:32:06,120 --> 00:32:07,040
Speaker 1: They would always do.

758
00:32:07,360 --> 00:32:11,120
Speaker 2: They would shoot at a at a target maybe a

759
00:32:11,160 --> 00:32:13,680
Speaker 2: hundred yards off the deer or the elk that they

760
00:32:13,680 --> 00:32:16,120
Speaker 2: wanted to shoot in a clear cut, get the wind right,

761
00:32:16,160 --> 00:32:18,040
Speaker 2: and then they would bring their gun back over, which

762
00:32:18,120 --> 00:32:19,479
Speaker 2: just like you said, like you want to make that

763
00:32:19,520 --> 00:32:22,840
Speaker 2: first shot kill. But maybe I don't want to bring

764
00:32:22,920 --> 00:32:25,400
Speaker 2: up ethical or moral either, because if they're shooting seven

765
00:32:25,440 --> 00:32:27,840
Speaker 2: they know what they're drift is based on this spot shot,

766
00:32:28,120 --> 00:32:29,920
Speaker 2: and then a lot of times those deer elk wouldn't

767
00:32:29,920 --> 00:32:31,880
Speaker 2: even get bothered by it, you know, with the muzzle

768
00:32:31,920 --> 00:32:34,400
Speaker 2: break or a can or whatever they may have. And

769
00:32:34,440 --> 00:32:36,440
Speaker 2: so that's kind of how we grew up. That's what

770
00:32:36,520 --> 00:32:38,800
Speaker 2: I thought long range shooting was. And then as I

771
00:32:38,840 --> 00:32:40,160
Speaker 2: got into it, I'm like, no, I want to make

772
00:32:40,160 --> 00:32:43,000
Speaker 2: the right corrections up front, and then I'll take my

773
00:32:43,040 --> 00:32:45,040
Speaker 2: shot at the animal and then have a spotter and

774
00:32:45,040 --> 00:32:46,600
Speaker 2: then make a correction if I need to.

775
00:32:46,640 --> 00:32:48,560
Speaker 1: But yeah, I go.

776
00:32:48,760 --> 00:32:52,720
Speaker 4: It's that's not a bad as funny as that may

777
00:32:52,760 --> 00:32:55,080
Speaker 4: sound to some people, that's not If you're shooting a

778
00:32:55,080 --> 00:32:57,800
Speaker 4: long range and you can't cut the distance and you

779
00:32:58,120 --> 00:33:01,200
Speaker 4: trust your deer and stuff, it's not bad idea to

780
00:33:01,280 --> 00:33:03,840
Speaker 4: take a shot like that. If you can swing over,

781
00:33:03,920 --> 00:33:05,840
Speaker 4: you've got a rock face or something, you can shoot

782
00:33:05,840 --> 00:33:08,600
Speaker 4: one hundred two hundred yards of left right, that's I

783
00:33:08,600 --> 00:33:10,480
Speaker 4: don't want to discredit that at all. If you've got

784
00:33:10,480 --> 00:33:12,320
Speaker 4: something funky, you're like, hey, I'm going to take a

785
00:33:12,360 --> 00:33:15,120
Speaker 4: test shot, all right, you win calls on or it's off.

786
00:33:15,160 --> 00:33:17,719
Speaker 4: My correction to kill the animal like that is a decent,

787
00:33:17,960 --> 00:33:20,840
Speaker 4: a decent idea to keep in your head if the

788
00:33:20,880 --> 00:33:21,600
Speaker 4: conditions are real.

789
00:33:21,680 --> 00:33:23,080
Speaker 1: Sporty yeap, yep.

790
00:33:23,720 --> 00:33:24,920
Speaker 3: That's how we know what you're saying.

791
00:33:25,120 --> 00:33:27,000
Speaker 2: Yeah, yeah, there's an art to it where you want

792
00:33:27,000 --> 00:33:28,800
Speaker 2: to like you don't want to. It's almost like you're

793
00:33:28,840 --> 00:33:30,880
Speaker 2: using a cheat code like on an old video game, right,

794
00:33:31,000 --> 00:33:32,720
Speaker 2: Like I don't want I don't want that information. I

795
00:33:32,760 --> 00:33:35,480
Speaker 2: just want to try to do. But I also feel

796
00:33:35,520 --> 00:33:37,480
Speaker 2: we owe it to the animals that if if there's

797
00:33:37,520 --> 00:33:39,840
Speaker 2: any doubt in your mind, you know that this this

798
00:33:39,920 --> 00:33:41,719
Speaker 2: might not work out how you think it will, then

799
00:33:41,840 --> 00:33:44,040
Speaker 2: then that might be a good option, is to you know,

800
00:33:44,480 --> 00:33:46,960
Speaker 2: and you had mentioned and maybe you've changed, but like

801
00:33:47,120 --> 00:33:49,840
Speaker 2: on a windy shoot or even a competition, you maybe

802
00:33:50,200 --> 00:33:52,080
Speaker 2: not waste one, but you may test to see what

803
00:33:52,080 --> 00:33:53,760
Speaker 2: the wind is so you can clear the stage after

804
00:33:53,800 --> 00:33:56,120
Speaker 2: that first shot. Is that I thought i'd heard you

805
00:33:56,160 --> 00:33:58,800
Speaker 2: once like you may you used to do that, Maybe

806
00:33:58,800 --> 00:34:02,080
Speaker 2: that you would know I maybe misunderstanding.

807
00:34:02,160 --> 00:34:07,600
Speaker 5: So the only the only time any of the top

808
00:34:07,680 --> 00:34:12,440
Speaker 5: guys will do anything is if and this is rare, I.

809
00:34:12,400 --> 00:34:13,040
Speaker 3: Can I don't.

810
00:34:13,160 --> 00:34:15,960
Speaker 4: I might have done it once ever, but I'm always

811
00:34:16,000 --> 00:34:18,080
Speaker 4: trying to hit the target. The idea is to hit

812
00:34:18,120 --> 00:34:20,719
Speaker 4: the target, read where you hit the target, move your

813
00:34:20,719 --> 00:34:22,800
Speaker 4: impact of the center so you can stay in there

814
00:34:22,960 --> 00:34:25,800
Speaker 4: as the wind changes. But every once in a while

815
00:34:26,440 --> 00:34:28,319
Speaker 4: there's a couple stages I wish I would have done this.

816
00:34:28,360 --> 00:34:31,239
Speaker 4: You'll get maybe a skyline target at eight hundred nine

817
00:34:31,280 --> 00:34:34,120
Speaker 4: hundred yards where if you miss, you see nothing, nothing,

818
00:34:34,160 --> 00:34:36,040
Speaker 4: and so you'll see guys go up there. They think

819
00:34:36,080 --> 00:34:38,640
Speaker 4: they've got it. Boom miss, boom miss. Now there are

820
00:34:38,680 --> 00:34:41,640
Speaker 4: three four misses deep. Where so sometimes on a stage

821
00:34:41,680 --> 00:34:43,880
Speaker 4: like that, you could put one in the dirt, like

822
00:34:43,880 --> 00:34:45,719
Speaker 4: at the base of the t post and then go

823
00:34:45,760 --> 00:34:48,640
Speaker 4: to the target, so you're dropping one shot instead of two,

824
00:34:48,719 --> 00:34:52,640
Speaker 4: three or four. So on a skyline target, generally targets

825
00:34:52,640 --> 00:34:55,040
Speaker 4: were usually somewhere where you can either see trace or

826
00:34:55,120 --> 00:34:57,280
Speaker 4: you can you see bullet trays only left or right,

827
00:34:57,440 --> 00:35:00,040
Speaker 4: or you can see where the bullet actually lands. But

828
00:35:00,160 --> 00:35:03,520
Speaker 4: it's it's a pretty rare it's a pretty rare currence

829
00:35:03,600 --> 00:35:06,200
Speaker 4: when you would burn one in the dirt, but you

830
00:35:06,239 --> 00:35:07,200
Speaker 4: could there's been I.

831
00:35:07,200 --> 00:35:08,040
Speaker 3: Think I've done it once.

832
00:35:08,160 --> 00:35:08,600
Speaker 1: I gotcha.

833
00:35:08,719 --> 00:35:11,520
Speaker 2: Yeah, misunderstanding there, but yeah, that makes sense. Just you know,

834
00:35:11,560 --> 00:35:14,000
Speaker 2: try to spot your shot on the target and then

835
00:35:14,400 --> 00:35:16,759
Speaker 2: make your adjustments if you you know, micro adjustments at

836
00:35:16,800 --> 00:35:20,759
Speaker 2: that point to stay on or be center. Yeah, yeah,

837
00:35:20,760 --> 00:35:22,719
Speaker 2: that makes a lot of sense. So let's get into

838
00:35:22,719 --> 00:35:26,400
Speaker 2: the equipment because it's it's what everybody wants to talk about.

839
00:35:26,840 --> 00:35:27,960
Speaker 1: Yeah, so like.

840
00:35:28,000 --> 00:35:31,239
Speaker 2: Gun selection, where for me, I made the decision to

841
00:35:31,320 --> 00:35:33,759
Speaker 2: hunt with multiple guns. So I've got a big long

842
00:35:33,840 --> 00:35:35,560
Speaker 2: range gun that I don't like to pack around. I

843
00:35:35,600 --> 00:35:38,480
Speaker 2: went with a kind of a do it all mountain

844
00:35:38,560 --> 00:35:41,520
Speaker 2: rifle and seven short action ultramag and then just recently

845
00:35:41,560 --> 00:35:43,200
Speaker 2: got a six and a half PRC. As it seems

846
00:35:43,239 --> 00:35:45,319
Speaker 2: like some of these you know, So so that's kind

847
00:35:45,320 --> 00:35:48,520
Speaker 2: of my my. I either I have a three thirty

848
00:35:48,560 --> 00:35:50,920
Speaker 2: eight edge, I've got the seventh PSALM, or I've got

849
00:35:50,920 --> 00:35:53,600
Speaker 2: the six and a half pr C. Now, when people

850
00:35:53,600 --> 00:35:56,520
Speaker 2: are going in, you know, some random person going in,

851
00:35:56,560 --> 00:35:59,200
Speaker 2: they're gonna gonna get a long range gun built. What

852
00:35:59,280 --> 00:36:02,359
Speaker 2: factors do you think way into that gun? And then

853
00:36:02,360 --> 00:36:04,600
Speaker 2: how do you go on about like starting with the

854
00:36:04,680 --> 00:36:06,200
Speaker 2: caliber and then going from there.

855
00:36:07,800 --> 00:36:12,359
Speaker 4: So I've always been, uh, component first, I usually picked

856
00:36:12,400 --> 00:36:13,880
Speaker 4: my bullet and build the gun around that.

857
00:36:14,480 --> 00:36:16,520
Speaker 3: And I've been a big burger bullet fan for a

858
00:36:16,560 --> 00:36:17,279
Speaker 3: long long time.

859
00:36:17,320 --> 00:36:19,839
Speaker 4: I've recently actually shot some solids. I'm life and we'll

860
00:36:19,840 --> 00:36:23,200
Speaker 4: see playing with some different things. But been a Burger

861
00:36:23,239 --> 00:36:26,360
Speaker 4: bullet fan for a long long time. So I'm the

862
00:36:26,360 --> 00:36:29,239
Speaker 4: same as you. I have a six five PRC. I

863
00:36:29,360 --> 00:36:32,239
Speaker 4: like a thirty cow and a Big three thirty eight.

864
00:36:32,280 --> 00:36:33,880
Speaker 4: I haven't shot by Big three thirty eight years as

865
00:36:33,920 --> 00:36:36,200
Speaker 4: much as I used to. Mostly I'm six five and thirty.

866
00:36:37,719 --> 00:36:39,560
Speaker 4: But I kind of like the idea of, you know,

867
00:36:39,560 --> 00:36:41,759
Speaker 4: a few different golf clubs in your bag, so for

868
00:36:41,840 --> 00:36:43,480
Speaker 4: different different hunts, different weights.

869
00:36:43,800 --> 00:36:46,280
Speaker 3: Like, so I'm going to pick my bullet.

870
00:36:46,440 --> 00:36:49,880
Speaker 4: If I want to shoot a two fifteen hybrid Burger,

871
00:36:49,960 --> 00:36:51,480
Speaker 4: I'm going to kind of see it's a thirty cow.

872
00:36:51,719 --> 00:36:53,319
Speaker 4: I'm going to see, do I what do I want

873
00:36:53,360 --> 00:36:55,880
Speaker 4: to shoot? Well, I want to shoot good brass. Generally

874
00:36:55,880 --> 00:36:58,759
Speaker 4: that's been Lapua the last handful of years. Now we

875
00:36:58,800 --> 00:37:03,480
Speaker 4: have a DG, we've got Peterson, we've got Alpha, We've

876
00:37:03,520 --> 00:37:06,840
Speaker 4: got some pretty good brass selections that aren't your typical

877
00:37:06,920 --> 00:37:08,760
Speaker 4: Norman was consistent, but it was soft.

878
00:37:10,080 --> 00:37:10,239
Speaker 3: You know.

879
00:37:10,280 --> 00:37:12,439
Speaker 4: Then you've got all your hornerity and federal stuff that's

880
00:37:12,480 --> 00:37:15,600
Speaker 4: not not to the quality of some of the premium

881
00:37:15,640 --> 00:37:17,400
Speaker 4: brass brands, So I'm gonna pick my brass.

882
00:37:17,400 --> 00:37:18,000
Speaker 3: So I'm going to go.

883
00:37:18,840 --> 00:37:21,640
Speaker 4: Lately, it's been Lapua makes three hundred Norma. Three hundred

884
00:37:21,640 --> 00:37:24,240
Speaker 4: Norma has been really easy for me. It's about my shots.

885
00:37:24,280 --> 00:37:28,279
Speaker 4: Good speeds are decent. I'm not a speed demon like

886
00:37:28,360 --> 00:37:31,480
Speaker 4: a lot of guys. Gosh, a lot of guys are

887
00:37:31,520 --> 00:37:34,959
Speaker 4: into horsepower. They're into fast cars. I get it, it's fun.

888
00:37:35,080 --> 00:37:37,439
Speaker 4: But I am a slow and steady wins the race

889
00:37:37,480 --> 00:37:38,880
Speaker 4: in the gun world, and it took a lot of

890
00:37:38,880 --> 00:37:39,799
Speaker 4: shooting to get to that.

891
00:37:40,360 --> 00:37:41,840
Speaker 3: And every guy that gets into.

892
00:37:41,719 --> 00:37:45,600
Speaker 4: Camp shooting doesn't understand it until you shoot a while

893
00:37:45,760 --> 00:37:48,759
Speaker 4: and you realize that the faster, crazier guns tend to

894
00:37:48,760 --> 00:37:51,319
Speaker 4: be a little bit more finicky. So if I can

895
00:37:51,400 --> 00:37:55,240
Speaker 4: run a two point fifteen at twenty nine to fifty

896
00:37:55,280 --> 00:37:57,920
Speaker 4: to three thousand, thirty twenty, like, I don't, really, I

897
00:37:57,920 --> 00:37:59,880
Speaker 4: don't want to run at thirty one fifty if it shoots,

898
00:38:00,280 --> 00:38:02,680
Speaker 4: I mean you can. I'm not saying don't, But man,

899
00:38:02,840 --> 00:38:04,759
Speaker 4: the consistency that I get out of twenty nine to

900
00:38:04,760 --> 00:38:05,520
Speaker 4: fifty three.

901
00:38:05,320 --> 00:38:07,759
Speaker 3: Thousand, it's just day in and day out.

902
00:38:07,920 --> 00:38:10,239
Speaker 4: It's not finicky, And so I use That's how I

903
00:38:10,280 --> 00:38:11,799
Speaker 4: picked my gun, So then I picked my barrel.

904
00:38:11,840 --> 00:38:12,520
Speaker 3: Twist around that.

905
00:38:12,960 --> 00:38:15,480
Speaker 4: If I want to have a midweight gun, I like

906
00:38:15,560 --> 00:38:18,520
Speaker 4: thirty cows and at ten to eleven pound range, just

907
00:38:18,560 --> 00:38:20,239
Speaker 4: because I want to spot my shots. Like I talked

908
00:38:20,280 --> 00:38:25,160
Speaker 4: about earlier, a good muzzle break six five PRC. I

909
00:38:25,200 --> 00:38:28,799
Speaker 4: like the one fifty six Burger a lot, And then

910
00:38:29,040 --> 00:38:31,400
Speaker 4: you know, eighty g makes good brass. Lapooa makes brass

911
00:38:31,440 --> 00:38:35,080
Speaker 4: for it. And I'm going to run that gun and

912
00:38:35,200 --> 00:38:38,840
Speaker 4: probably between an eight to ten pound gun, probably with

913
00:38:38,920 --> 00:38:40,920
Speaker 4: a bipod with everything on it, and I run a

914
00:38:40,920 --> 00:38:42,920
Speaker 4: big scope. I don't not going to skimp on scope.

915
00:38:42,960 --> 00:38:45,960
Speaker 4: That's the last thing I'm going to skimp on. And

916
00:38:46,040 --> 00:38:47,600
Speaker 4: so those are kind of my weights in that eight

917
00:38:47,600 --> 00:38:49,480
Speaker 4: to ten pounds. I'm a six five. Ten to twelve

918
00:38:49,520 --> 00:38:51,640
Speaker 4: is a thirty and then twelve or above twelve to

919
00:38:51,680 --> 00:38:55,080
Speaker 4: sixteen is a three thirty eight something big. So I

920
00:38:55,080 --> 00:38:56,839
Speaker 4: think a lot of guys are moving to that kind

921
00:38:56,880 --> 00:38:58,520
Speaker 4: of thing. It works really well. I've shot a lot

922
00:38:58,520 --> 00:39:00,279
Speaker 4: of stuff in my six five I probably and like

923
00:39:00,320 --> 00:39:02,240
Speaker 4: I've shot a couple of moose with it, and some bears,

924
00:39:02,239 --> 00:39:05,400
Speaker 4: some bigger bears, like just because I'm so confident. I

925
00:39:05,440 --> 00:39:07,720
Speaker 4: shoot it so fast and you can see your shots

926
00:39:07,840 --> 00:39:08,920
Speaker 4: just so stick and good.

927
00:39:08,760 --> 00:39:09,680
Speaker 3: Good, just as a kid.

928
00:39:09,920 --> 00:39:10,120
Speaker 1: Yeah.

929
00:39:10,680 --> 00:39:13,200
Speaker 2: And so at the point, at the point you're selecting

930
00:39:13,920 --> 00:39:16,160
Speaker 2: your round and your caliber, are you already you've already

931
00:39:16,160 --> 00:39:18,120
Speaker 2: decided whether you want to reload or whether you want

932
00:39:18,160 --> 00:39:20,239
Speaker 2: to shoot box ammo? Right, you you have to make

933
00:39:20,239 --> 00:39:21,600
Speaker 2: that decision reloading.

934
00:39:22,480 --> 00:39:23,200
Speaker 3: I'm reloading.

935
00:39:23,239 --> 00:39:26,359
Speaker 4: And just just because I mean I'm saying I got

936
00:39:26,560 --> 00:39:28,600
Speaker 4: I reload a lot, I mean I've reloaded. I don't

937
00:39:28,600 --> 00:39:30,680
Speaker 4: even want to figure how many rounds I've reloaded. So

938
00:39:30,719 --> 00:39:33,960
Speaker 4: I've got a bigger room full of a billion presses

939
00:39:34,040 --> 00:39:35,279
Speaker 4: and just anyway.

940
00:39:34,920 --> 00:39:39,680
Speaker 3: I do all that. So yes, in it's been awesome

941
00:39:39,719 --> 00:39:40,640
Speaker 3: the last few years.

942
00:39:40,640 --> 00:39:43,080
Speaker 4: And I think the reason the six by PRC, the

943
00:39:43,200 --> 00:39:45,719
Speaker 4: seven PRC, the three hundred PRC has done well is

944
00:39:45,760 --> 00:39:47,640
Speaker 4: because Hornerty is doing a pretty good job.

945
00:39:48,600 --> 00:39:50,520
Speaker 3: We've we've shot up set up a bunch.

946
00:39:50,360 --> 00:39:52,680
Speaker 4: Of guns with guys like, hey, I want you to

947
00:39:52,760 --> 00:39:54,920
Speaker 4: factor amazal, so we'll get a few different lots of

948
00:39:55,000 --> 00:39:58,520
Speaker 4: six by PRC or seven PRC and they shoot pretty good.

949
00:39:58,680 --> 00:40:01,560
Speaker 4: So that's a good thing to bring up. I don't

950
00:40:01,600 --> 00:40:03,400
Speaker 4: even it doesn't really enter my head because I.

951
00:40:03,719 --> 00:40:04,800
Speaker 3: Just know I'm going to reload.

952
00:40:05,560 --> 00:40:07,560
Speaker 4: But yeah, if you're gonna reload, or if you're if

953
00:40:07,560 --> 00:40:10,439
Speaker 4: you're gonna buy factory, I would probably lean towards those

954
00:40:10,520 --> 00:40:12,880
Speaker 4: rounds right now because Hornet is doing a pretty good job,

955
00:40:12,960 --> 00:40:17,399
Speaker 4: pretty affordable, pretty good bullet choice, high BC longer range bullets, and.

956
00:40:17,320 --> 00:40:19,719
Speaker 3: They've been good. I mean six five PRC has been

957
00:40:20,360 --> 00:40:21,160
Speaker 3: been real accurate.

958
00:40:21,239 --> 00:40:24,520
Speaker 2: Yeah, yeah, so yeah, that's that's kind of like I say,

959
00:40:24,840 --> 00:40:27,319
Speaker 2: you know, and then you also, I mean we've had

960
00:40:27,360 --> 00:40:29,719
Speaker 2: some discussions about three hundred PRC Ver seven and what

961
00:40:29,760 --> 00:40:31,640
Speaker 2: your target animal or like what the gun is primarily

962
00:40:31,719 --> 00:40:33,799
Speaker 2: going to be used for, So if you know, for

963
00:40:33,880 --> 00:40:36,239
Speaker 2: an elk guy or or a moose or elk guy

964
00:40:36,280 --> 00:40:38,759
Speaker 2: primarily versus if you're just gonna be a meal deer hunter, Like,

965
00:40:39,120 --> 00:40:41,680
Speaker 2: how do you like, is there an energy ideas or

966
00:40:41,760 --> 00:40:45,320
Speaker 2: just like your experience on on terminal performance on game, Like,

967
00:40:45,360 --> 00:40:47,400
Speaker 2: how do you decide? Like, all right, I want I

968
00:40:47,400 --> 00:40:48,560
Speaker 2: want to be able to shoot this gun out to

969
00:40:48,600 --> 00:40:49,920
Speaker 2: eight hundred for elk or I want to be able

970
00:40:49,920 --> 00:40:51,719
Speaker 2: to shoot this gun out to six hundred for deer.

971
00:40:51,800 --> 00:40:54,440
Speaker 2: Like how does that weigh in on your final, you know,

972
00:40:54,680 --> 00:40:56,560
Speaker 2: and maybe you don't think of that as much as

973
00:40:56,600 --> 00:40:58,560
Speaker 2: maybe the guy that's wanting to buy, you know, a

974
00:40:58,560 --> 00:41:01,360
Speaker 2: different guy wanting to buy a gun. Shit, think about it.

975
00:41:03,200 --> 00:41:06,400
Speaker 4: Yeah, So there's one thousand pounds of energy on impact.

976
00:41:06,400 --> 00:41:08,120
Speaker 4: There's all kinds of different theories out there.

977
00:41:10,960 --> 00:41:14,040
Speaker 3: I am a big fan of less so now, but

978
00:41:14,120 --> 00:41:17,320
Speaker 3: I think overkill is always better. Some of them. My

979
00:41:17,360 --> 00:41:20,480
Speaker 3: stuff is antidotal. I don't want to talk bad about

980
00:41:21,080 --> 00:41:23,200
Speaker 3: seven mills, but I back in the day, I had

981
00:41:23,239 --> 00:41:25,440
Speaker 3: a to eighty actlete and I won't say what bullet.

982
00:41:25,800 --> 00:41:28,560
Speaker 3: It wasn't a burger, but I was using some bullets

983
00:41:28,760 --> 00:41:31,799
Speaker 3: and had some real bad experience on how it's an

984
00:41:31,800 --> 00:41:32,640
Speaker 3: accurate round.

985
00:41:32,840 --> 00:41:35,439
Speaker 4: Seven mills are awesome. I mean, there's there's a lot

986
00:41:35,440 --> 00:41:37,680
Speaker 4: of good seven mills out there. I just had We

987
00:41:37,760 --> 00:41:41,000
Speaker 4: had three different rosies, no two rosies in one rocky

988
00:41:41,520 --> 00:41:44,680
Speaker 4: that we shot with that gun in one year, and

989
00:41:45,520 --> 00:41:47,400
Speaker 4: it was really really bad performance.

990
00:41:47,440 --> 00:41:50,000
Speaker 3: So that's pretty anecdotal. There's a lot of different bullets.

991
00:41:50,320 --> 00:41:52,359
Speaker 3: Some of the bullet placement was most of those all

992
00:41:52,360 --> 00:41:53,439
Speaker 3: bullet placement was good.

993
00:41:53,520 --> 00:41:56,080
Speaker 4: It should have been adequate, you could say, not perfect.

994
00:41:56,080 --> 00:41:58,000
Speaker 4: It wasn't a double one heart shot, but it was

995
00:41:58,600 --> 00:41:59,280
Speaker 4: in the vitals.

996
00:41:59,280 --> 00:42:04,440
Speaker 3: It broke ball and so since then, like I shied

997
00:42:04,440 --> 00:42:05,080
Speaker 3: away from it.

998
00:42:05,280 --> 00:42:08,240
Speaker 4: So I if I'm going to go elkermose, I'm gonna

999
00:42:09,160 --> 00:42:11,560
Speaker 4: default to the thirty almost always. I've had really good

1000
00:42:11,640 --> 00:42:14,400
Speaker 4: luck with the two fifteen, a two thirty Burger, and

1001
00:42:14,480 --> 00:42:17,759
Speaker 4: even the two forty five. You know, the two twelve ELDX. Like,

1002
00:42:17,800 --> 00:42:19,480
Speaker 4: there's a lot of bullets that guys have had really

1003
00:42:19,480 --> 00:42:23,360
Speaker 4: good luck with. So I want a little bit more impact.

1004
00:42:23,600 --> 00:42:26,640
Speaker 4: That being said, I shot at Shyris this year with

1005
00:42:26,680 --> 00:42:29,520
Speaker 4: the six five PRC dropped it. It was quick, it

1006
00:42:29,560 --> 00:42:32,040
Speaker 4: was a three yard shot and it dropped it fast.

1007
00:42:32,160 --> 00:42:35,520
Speaker 4: So yeah, I think more energy is better.

1008
00:42:35,880 --> 00:42:38,360
Speaker 3: I like a bigger hole. I think it's not just energy.

1009
00:42:38,400 --> 00:42:41,600
Speaker 4: I feel like then three thirty eights and thirty seem

1010
00:42:41,680 --> 00:42:47,240
Speaker 4: like they kill really good. And I don't maybe it's subjective,

1011
00:42:47,280 --> 00:42:48,879
Speaker 4: but it seems like diameter and a lot of guys

1012
00:42:48,880 --> 00:42:50,600
Speaker 4: I talked to the shoot a lot of Elk always

1013
00:42:50,800 --> 00:42:54,080
Speaker 4: seemed to like thirties more than sevens, So personal preference,

1014
00:42:54,160 --> 00:42:55,879
Speaker 4: but I like, I like thirties.

1015
00:42:55,680 --> 00:42:57,360
Speaker 2: Yeah, and then like my three thirty eight, and I

1016
00:42:57,400 --> 00:42:59,520
Speaker 2: don't want to get into the like the again nerd

1017
00:42:59,560 --> 00:43:01,560
Speaker 2: out on it really like those big three hundred grain

1018
00:43:01,680 --> 00:43:04,440
Speaker 2: pills and like just a sexual just a sexual density

1019
00:43:04,440 --> 00:43:08,040
Speaker 2: of those they don't And it's my family growing up, like, oh,

1020
00:43:08,120 --> 00:43:10,000
Speaker 2: you're gonna have no meat left. And I'm like, I've

1021
00:43:10,120 --> 00:43:12,760
Speaker 2: killed elk with two forty threes and I've I've skinned

1022
00:43:12,800 --> 00:43:14,759
Speaker 2: your guys out to have two seventy holes in them,

1023
00:43:14,960 --> 00:43:17,440
Speaker 2: Like the sexual density and the construction of those bullet,

1024
00:43:17,520 --> 00:43:19,880
Speaker 2: like you can eat to the hole versus your guys'

1025
00:43:19,880 --> 00:43:22,279
Speaker 2: little bullets that explode, like, don't give me the two

1026
00:43:22,320 --> 00:43:24,440
Speaker 2: forty three to two seventy doesn't waste any meat, like

1027
00:43:24,640 --> 00:43:27,239
Speaker 2: the sexual density the whole, Like I always get an

1028
00:43:27,239 --> 00:43:29,080
Speaker 2: exit out of those three hundred grain burgers because there's

1029
00:43:29,080 --> 00:43:31,560
Speaker 2: so much energy to go through and so that that

1030
00:43:31,600 --> 00:43:33,839
Speaker 2: plays into it a lot in my opinion as well.

1031
00:43:33,880 --> 00:43:36,000
Speaker 4: I shot coups deer with my three thirty eight three

1032
00:43:36,080 --> 00:43:38,040
Speaker 4: hundred gad bullets. Say it's three thirty eight in and

1033
00:43:38,080 --> 00:43:40,719
Speaker 4: it's a quarter out and you're done. Where I've shot

1034
00:43:40,760 --> 00:43:43,239
Speaker 4: them with some smaller guns and it's a little hole

1035
00:43:43,280 --> 00:43:45,640
Speaker 4: in and six softball out the other side.

1036
00:43:45,719 --> 00:43:48,799
Speaker 3: So I mean, again, hitting bone, things change you guys

1037
00:43:48,840 --> 00:43:52,600
Speaker 3: know that. But yeah, I mean, yeah, three thirty eighths

1038
00:43:52,600 --> 00:43:55,480
Speaker 3: are awesome. I just I can't spot the shot generally

1039
00:43:55,520 --> 00:43:56,879
Speaker 3: in the way I want to carry.

1040
00:43:56,560 --> 00:43:59,480
Speaker 4: On all these backpack counts we do, Like, I'm just

1041
00:43:59,520 --> 00:44:00,879
Speaker 4: not willing to do that right now.

1042
00:44:01,160 --> 00:44:03,759
Speaker 3: Wait wise, because I'm not good jat packing camera. You're

1043
00:44:03,800 --> 00:44:06,560
Speaker 3: all my jeered ways to stinking Yeah. I was trying

1044
00:44:06,560 --> 00:44:09,120
Speaker 3: to cut some ways somewhere and she seems like I

1045
00:44:09,200 --> 00:44:11,080
Speaker 3: go down to that six five PRC or a thirty cow.

1046
00:44:11,640 --> 00:44:27,680
Speaker 2: Yeah, gotcha, We've got I mean, you build your rifles.

1047
00:44:27,719 --> 00:44:29,800
Speaker 2: You've had lots of rifles built for you over the years.

1048
00:44:29,800 --> 00:44:32,520
Speaker 2: Like how important with with all the technology out there

1049
00:44:32,560 --> 00:44:35,440
Speaker 2: and everybody building pretty good stuff? Like how important are

1050
00:44:35,560 --> 00:44:38,279
Speaker 2: the triggers and barrels and betting and stocks like all

1051
00:44:38,280 --> 00:44:39,560
Speaker 2: these things were you know, when you go to build

1052
00:44:39,560 --> 00:44:41,520
Speaker 2: a gun, you pick the barrel, you pick the stock

1053
00:44:41,600 --> 00:44:43,040
Speaker 2: you picked, you know, and then the betting.

1054
00:44:43,080 --> 00:44:44,120
Speaker 1: The betting is a little.

1055
00:44:43,920 --> 00:44:46,200
Speaker 2: Bit of of the the art and the gun builder

1056
00:44:46,239 --> 00:44:48,680
Speaker 2: and making sure it's done right. But in your opinion, like,

1057
00:44:49,600 --> 00:44:51,319
Speaker 2: how important is that stuff when you go to build

1058
00:44:51,320 --> 00:44:52,960
Speaker 2: a gun or should you just go with what your

1059
00:44:52,960 --> 00:44:55,719
Speaker 2: builder recommends? Or what you know, if I'm coming to mountain.

1060
00:44:55,480 --> 00:44:59,640
Speaker 3: For yeah, you have a good builder. Trust what they say.

1061
00:44:59,719 --> 00:45:04,080
Speaker 3: You know, we've done everything from you know a lot

1062
00:45:04,120 --> 00:45:04,279
Speaker 3: of it.

1063
00:45:04,520 --> 00:45:06,400
Speaker 4: Like a lot of the chassis say they're dropping ready

1064
00:45:06,400 --> 00:45:07,920
Speaker 4: Bolton go, and I've had great luck with that.

1065
00:45:08,239 --> 00:45:11,719
Speaker 3: I also like betting. I've also epoxied them together like

1066
00:45:11,760 --> 00:45:13,440
Speaker 3: I I'll do that too. I love that.

1067
00:45:13,960 --> 00:45:17,040
Speaker 4: Now I know there's no variables, and so yeah, triggers

1068
00:45:17,040 --> 00:45:19,520
Speaker 4: are important. Use the best trigger Like I think the

1069
00:45:19,520 --> 00:45:22,040
Speaker 4: top triggers right now are Trigger Tech, which is what

1070
00:45:22,080 --> 00:45:24,560
Speaker 4: I run, and Vix and Andy's making some real good triggers.

1071
00:45:24,960 --> 00:45:26,359
Speaker 3: Barrels I've had.

1072
00:45:26,600 --> 00:45:31,560
Speaker 4: I've seen every company there is make bad barrels.

1073
00:45:31,600 --> 00:45:33,520
Speaker 3: And but there's the top.

1074
00:45:33,600 --> 00:45:37,840
Speaker 4: There's you know, you've got Benchmark, Kreeger, Bartlin Proof.

1075
00:45:38,880 --> 00:45:40,680
Speaker 3: There's a whole bunch of good barrel makers. I don't

1076
00:45:41,040 --> 00:45:43,719
Speaker 3: I'm leaving a bunch out. But if there's an if

1077
00:45:43,719 --> 00:45:46,040
Speaker 3: they're a name in barrels, they're generally going to be fine.

1078
00:45:46,160 --> 00:45:48,120
Speaker 3: And everyone has made a bad barrel. It's the way

1079
00:45:48,160 --> 00:45:50,480
Speaker 3: it goes. There's all there's been. I've seen every scope

1080
00:45:50,480 --> 00:45:51,200
Speaker 3: break there is.

1081
00:45:51,360 --> 00:45:54,520
Speaker 4: I've never seen a single brand not break you just

1082
00:45:54,560 --> 00:45:57,480
Speaker 4: want to pick stuff that's got a pretty good reputation

1083
00:45:58,040 --> 00:46:00,600
Speaker 4: and it's tough, and so yeah, I think all those

1084
00:46:00,600 --> 00:46:04,879
Speaker 4: components play together. They're important to me. I think there's

1085
00:46:04,920 --> 00:46:07,839
Speaker 4: probably there's a lot of customer rifles out there. In

1086
00:46:07,880 --> 00:46:10,879
Speaker 4: my opinion, I'll bet eighty to ninety percent of them

1087
00:46:10,960 --> 00:46:14,360
Speaker 4: aren't being utilized. The load development's not done. People don't.

1088
00:46:14,600 --> 00:46:17,200
Speaker 4: Their chronos are different. They're switching lots of powder and

1089
00:46:17,200 --> 00:46:19,399
Speaker 4: they're not rechecking their gun or re zero and they're

1090
00:46:19,400 --> 00:46:22,919
Speaker 4: switching lots of bullets, lots of brass. Their barrels wearing people.

1091
00:46:23,360 --> 00:46:25,920
Speaker 4: Some people don't know the barrels speed up, Like a

1092
00:46:25,960 --> 00:46:27,719
Speaker 4: barrel's going to speed up at fifty to one hundred

1093
00:46:27,800 --> 00:46:29,879
Speaker 4: hundred and fifty rounds and it's going to speed up

1094
00:46:30,080 --> 00:46:32,799
Speaker 4: twenty fifty seventy feet a second. And they just get

1095
00:46:32,840 --> 00:46:35,200
Speaker 4: their load done in twenty rounds and then they go

1096
00:46:35,280 --> 00:46:37,440
Speaker 4: hunting a year or two later like why am I

1097
00:46:37,440 --> 00:46:38,799
Speaker 4: missing high or what's going on?

1098
00:46:39,120 --> 00:46:40,000
Speaker 3: So stuff changes.

1099
00:46:40,080 --> 00:46:42,120
Speaker 4: You got to check my guns all the time before

1100
00:46:42,160 --> 00:46:44,680
Speaker 4: every single hunt, I chrono and shoot it.

1101
00:46:44,760 --> 00:46:48,120
Speaker 3: I shoot at least to six hundred. But stuff changes.

1102
00:46:48,160 --> 00:46:50,360
Speaker 4: But yeah, get the best components you can get, but

1103
00:46:50,440 --> 00:46:52,480
Speaker 4: the setup. There's a lot of good guns out there

1104
00:46:52,480 --> 00:46:56,440
Speaker 4: that aren't being utilized correctly. So that comes from guys

1105
00:46:56,480 --> 00:46:58,640
Speaker 4: geeking out on it, being a hobby, learning and getting

1106
00:46:58,640 --> 00:46:59,720
Speaker 4: their guns set up correctly.

1107
00:47:00,080 --> 00:47:00,640
Speaker 1: Gotcha.

1108
00:47:00,760 --> 00:47:02,719
Speaker 2: Now, now we'll go into the optics, and we talked

1109
00:47:02,719 --> 00:47:06,080
Speaker 2: about all the gun components. Now maybe just as important,

1110
00:47:06,080 --> 00:47:08,120
Speaker 2: if not more important, or what you're gonna you know,

1111
00:47:08,680 --> 00:47:10,120
Speaker 2: glue to the top of the gun or stick to

1112
00:47:10,200 --> 00:47:12,239
Speaker 2: the top of the gun, you know, And yeah, so

1113
00:47:12,320 --> 00:47:15,400
Speaker 2: what's what's your opinion how do you approach optics? You know,

1114
00:47:15,440 --> 00:47:18,799
Speaker 2: you're mounting, like, is there the best way to mount

1115
00:47:18,880 --> 00:47:20,880
Speaker 2: or there multiple ways? And then and then ultimately what

1116
00:47:20,920 --> 00:47:22,640
Speaker 2: are you looking for in an optic on top of

1117
00:47:22,640 --> 00:47:23,040
Speaker 2: your gun?

1118
00:47:24,000 --> 00:47:30,120
Speaker 4: Yeah, So the whole laughing of rings and stuff, in

1119
00:47:30,160 --> 00:47:32,680
Speaker 4: my opinion, shouldn't be necessary. I've never done it. If

1120
00:47:32,680 --> 00:47:35,160
Speaker 4: you're using a good if you're using a good action

1121
00:47:35,520 --> 00:47:39,120
Speaker 4: with a straight rail and good rings, they better be straight.

1122
00:47:40,160 --> 00:47:42,120
Speaker 3: So I've never laughed any rings. I've never had any

1123
00:47:42,120 --> 00:47:42,960
Speaker 3: problems with the scope.

1124
00:47:43,000 --> 00:47:45,160
Speaker 4: So I don't think that you can ignore some of

1125
00:47:45,200 --> 00:47:47,239
Speaker 4: those things that used to be a lot more commonplace

1126
00:47:47,280 --> 00:47:50,200
Speaker 4: when guys laughed rings, when receivers were crooked and rails

1127
00:47:50,200 --> 00:47:51,719
Speaker 4: were out of spec and stuff like that.

1128
00:47:51,800 --> 00:47:56,040
Speaker 3: So I think that element is mostly gone.

1129
00:47:56,680 --> 00:47:59,960
Speaker 4: So I just I use good rings. I Nightforce makes

1130
00:48:00,040 --> 00:48:03,360
Speaker 4: great rings. I like the Loophole Mark four rings, Hocket.

1131
00:48:03,440 --> 00:48:05,440
Speaker 4: There's a lot of good rings out there, guys, So

1132
00:48:05,640 --> 00:48:08,680
Speaker 4: use use good rings. Don't skip on that. Don't make

1133
00:48:08,719 --> 00:48:11,880
Speaker 4: sure you're if you're I love actions with intego rails,

1134
00:48:12,160 --> 00:48:14,600
Speaker 4: you know, machined into the action. It's your If they're not.

1135
00:48:15,360 --> 00:48:19,080
Speaker 4: Take those screws out, clean them with alcohol. Use lock tight.

1136
00:48:19,480 --> 00:48:21,520
Speaker 4: You do not want your rail coming loose. I can't

1137
00:48:21,520 --> 00:48:23,879
Speaker 4: tell you how many guys, Johan, I'm in the jam.

1138
00:48:24,360 --> 00:48:26,400
Speaker 4: Can you come check my gun out before season? I

1139
00:48:26,400 --> 00:48:27,799
Speaker 4: got a hunt next week? And so they run over

1140
00:48:27,880 --> 00:48:28,280
Speaker 4: the house.

1141
00:48:28,840 --> 00:48:29,279
Speaker 3: We'll go up.

1142
00:48:29,600 --> 00:48:31,839
Speaker 4: I was like, Eh, everything good, Yeah, everything's tight. Everything's tight.

1143
00:48:31,960 --> 00:48:33,920
Speaker 4: Like okay, we go up there and shoot four rounds.

1144
00:48:33,960 --> 00:48:36,600
Speaker 4: It's all over the place, and I was like, hey,

1145
00:48:36,760 --> 00:48:39,640
Speaker 4: your scope's you know, pull the scope off, check the screws.

1146
00:48:39,640 --> 00:48:41,880
Speaker 3: They're all loose. And so that happens a lot. So

1147
00:48:42,600 --> 00:48:43,920
Speaker 3: just common sense, guys.

1148
00:48:44,440 --> 00:48:47,360
Speaker 4: You can't assume you got to pull everything apart, clean it,

1149
00:48:47,480 --> 00:48:49,200
Speaker 4: lock tight it and then redo it.

1150
00:48:49,120 --> 00:48:49,560
Speaker 3: I don't.

1151
00:48:49,800 --> 00:48:51,400
Speaker 4: You don't need to lock tight your cross bolts on

1152
00:48:51,440 --> 00:48:53,399
Speaker 4: your rings toward those most of them are fifty five

1153
00:48:53,440 --> 00:48:58,640
Speaker 4: pounds on the cross bolts fifty five inch pounds. And

1154
00:48:58,719 --> 00:49:01,520
Speaker 4: then and then all your torch specs for your caps.

1155
00:49:01,640 --> 00:49:03,680
Speaker 4: They're usually pretty good. You can use blue locked out

1156
00:49:03,680 --> 00:49:05,200
Speaker 4: in your caps if you want, but just make sure

1157
00:49:05,239 --> 00:49:08,600
Speaker 4: it doesn't move. The biggest hang up I see with

1158
00:49:08,680 --> 00:49:10,239
Speaker 4: guys getting it, and I don't know if hang ups

1159
00:49:10,320 --> 00:49:13,560
Speaker 4: right word, but they're hesitant to spend the money they

1160
00:49:13,560 --> 00:49:16,040
Speaker 4: need to on a scope. I would much rather see

1161
00:49:16,080 --> 00:49:18,239
Speaker 4: a guy shoot a five hundred dollars gun with a

1162
00:49:18,239 --> 00:49:21,279
Speaker 4: two thousand dollars scope than you know, a three or

1163
00:49:21,320 --> 00:49:23,800
Speaker 4: four thousand dollars rifle with a five hundred dollars scope.

1164
00:49:24,080 --> 00:49:27,920
Speaker 4: So all day long, I mean, I've had broken scopes.

1165
00:49:27,920 --> 00:49:30,040
Speaker 4: I've had scopes who don't track, and it is you're

1166
00:49:30,040 --> 00:49:31,440
Speaker 4: not going to hit what you You're not going to

1167
00:49:31,520 --> 00:49:33,360
Speaker 4: hit anything, You're not going to be consistent, you're not

1168
00:49:33,360 --> 00:49:34,520
Speaker 4: gonna really figure out your drops.

1169
00:49:34,600 --> 00:49:36,880
Speaker 3: Nothing's going to make sense. So spend the money on

1170
00:49:36,960 --> 00:49:37,440
Speaker 3: a good.

1171
00:49:37,239 --> 00:49:41,880
Speaker 4: Scope, I would say, if I would say at least

1172
00:49:43,200 --> 00:49:46,600
Speaker 4: it's at least fifteen hundred bucks and scopes go up

1173
00:49:46,600 --> 00:49:49,160
Speaker 4: to forty five hundred bucks or more.

1174
00:49:49,239 --> 00:49:51,080
Speaker 3: I mean some of the CCOs and the tangents. I

1175
00:49:51,120 --> 00:49:52,799
Speaker 3: don't know how much those are now, but they're a lot.

1176
00:49:53,280 --> 00:49:56,440
Speaker 4: But if you're in that, you know that that loophole.

1177
00:49:56,520 --> 00:50:01,600
Speaker 4: Mark five range, Night four cent say night Force attacker.

1178
00:50:02,760 --> 00:50:04,719
Speaker 4: I know, guys, some of the guys are lacking the trigger.

1179
00:50:04,520 --> 00:50:05,520
Speaker 3: CA on the ten mile.

1180
00:50:05,600 --> 00:50:07,520
Speaker 4: I think there's a lot of there's a lot of

1181
00:50:07,560 --> 00:50:11,000
Speaker 4: good scopes out there, but spend the money on a scope.

1182
00:50:11,239 --> 00:50:13,560
Speaker 3: Yeah, don't camp on a scope, don't buy.

1183
00:50:14,040 --> 00:50:16,040
Speaker 4: I don't well, I don't want to throw anyone into

1184
00:50:16,040 --> 00:50:18,840
Speaker 4: the bus, but there's some scopes out there that you

1185
00:50:19,160 --> 00:50:20,600
Speaker 4: need to spend more money on if you can. I

1186
00:50:20,640 --> 00:50:22,920
Speaker 4: understand there's budgets and there's stuff, but if you can

1187
00:50:22,960 --> 00:50:25,680
Speaker 4: afford a you know, if you can afford a big

1188
00:50:25,719 --> 00:50:28,040
Speaker 4: truck payment, buy a nice scoe.

1189
00:50:28,239 --> 00:50:29,080
Speaker 1: Yeah.

1190
00:50:29,120 --> 00:50:31,279
Speaker 2: And uh, with that said, I think we both we

1191
00:50:31,360 --> 00:50:33,359
Speaker 2: both hunt with the same rifle, right, You're you're a

1192
00:50:33,440 --> 00:50:37,000
Speaker 2: Mark five guy on your hunting rifles and they are

1193
00:50:37,080 --> 00:50:38,879
Speaker 2: are they on your competition guns as well?

1194
00:50:39,520 --> 00:50:39,840
Speaker 1: Okay?

1195
00:50:39,880 --> 00:50:42,960
Speaker 2: And then I've got Mark five's on to my seven

1196
00:50:43,000 --> 00:50:45,400
Speaker 2: Palm and my three thirty eight edge and then I, uh,

1197
00:50:45,640 --> 00:50:47,880
Speaker 2: I shoot the VX six four to twenty four on

1198
00:50:47,920 --> 00:50:49,600
Speaker 2: my my six and a half PRC.

1199
00:50:50,719 --> 00:50:53,160
Speaker 1: Okay, so I did. I did switch shot those enough

1200
00:50:53,160 --> 00:50:53,440
Speaker 1: if I.

1201
00:50:53,400 --> 00:50:56,040
Speaker 4: Get questions about those, the VX five and six hds

1202
00:50:56,080 --> 00:50:57,399
Speaker 4: and I just have a mess with them enough.

1203
00:50:57,480 --> 00:50:58,239
Speaker 3: Yeah, I've heard.

1204
00:50:58,360 --> 00:51:01,200
Speaker 4: I've heard some decent things about my other light. I

1205
00:51:01,320 --> 00:51:07,160
Speaker 4: just I'm so reliant on im, so I just want

1206
00:51:07,200 --> 00:51:08,320
Speaker 4: the most durable scope.

1207
00:51:08,440 --> 00:51:09,799
Speaker 3: I was. I had a hard time. I think I've

1208
00:51:09,840 --> 00:51:13,680
Speaker 3: said this before, like I had shot Loophold.

1209
00:51:13,320 --> 00:51:15,000
Speaker 4: Years and years ago, and I had switched the Night

1210
00:51:15,080 --> 00:51:18,880
Speaker 4: Force just because they were tanks and it was the

1211
00:51:18,920 --> 00:51:20,640
Speaker 4: old Loophold Mark four and No zero stopped.

1212
00:51:20,640 --> 00:51:21,439
Speaker 3: This is a long time ago.

1213
00:51:21,560 --> 00:51:24,680
Speaker 4: But and then you know, I was talking with Reza

1214
00:51:24,719 --> 00:51:26,520
Speaker 4: over at Loophol then she wanted me to shoot for them.

1215
00:51:26,520 --> 00:51:28,360
Speaker 3: They said, you know, the Mark five's coming out, and

1216
00:51:28,400 --> 00:51:29,840
Speaker 3: I was pretty hesitant because.

1217
00:51:29,600 --> 00:51:31,319
Speaker 4: I didn't love the Mark four, to be honest, And

1218
00:51:31,400 --> 00:51:34,080
Speaker 4: so I've gained a lot of trust in the markive

1219
00:51:34,080 --> 00:51:35,920
Speaker 4: over the years. I beat that first one up, like

1220
00:51:36,080 --> 00:51:39,280
Speaker 4: tried to break it. Just I dented it. I've dented

1221
00:51:39,280 --> 00:51:42,200
Speaker 4: the objective. I hit the I beat the crap out

1222
00:51:42,239 --> 00:51:43,680
Speaker 4: of it, and it held up, and they've held up

1223
00:51:43,680 --> 00:51:46,160
Speaker 4: really good. I've had some big drops on hunts, I've

1224
00:51:46,160 --> 00:51:48,479
Speaker 4: had big drops on competitions, and I haven't had any

1225
00:51:48,480 --> 00:51:50,200
Speaker 4: issues with them.

1226
00:51:51,440 --> 00:51:53,640
Speaker 3: So yeah, I've grown to trust them a lot.

1227
00:51:53,840 --> 00:51:56,600
Speaker 2: I'm a nerd, so I'm always doing research. And that

1228
00:51:56,719 --> 00:51:58,879
Speaker 2: one thing the PRS does that it always shows you,

1229
00:51:58,960 --> 00:52:01,520
Speaker 2: like what go were the top one hundred shooters using

1230
00:52:01,600 --> 00:52:04,040
Speaker 2: what triggers, what barrels and and so I went back

1231
00:52:04,160 --> 00:52:05,920
Speaker 2: I think it was like twenty eighteen, and you go

1232
00:52:06,040 --> 00:52:08,840
Speaker 2: back and it's like us off picks and and I

1233
00:52:08,840 --> 00:52:10,239
Speaker 2: don't know if you get all the credit for this

1234
00:52:10,320 --> 00:52:11,960
Speaker 2: or if it's a group of you guys, But you

1235
00:52:12,280 --> 00:52:15,399
Speaker 2: go back to like eighteen nineteen before the Mark five

1236
00:52:15,520 --> 00:52:17,840
Speaker 2: was released, and you're like, oh, loop Hold has like

1237
00:52:17,920 --> 00:52:18,640
Speaker 2: two shooters.

1238
00:52:18,840 --> 00:52:20,800
Speaker 1: Yeah, two shooters, and they might do in the fifty

1239
00:52:20,800 --> 00:52:21,480
Speaker 1: to one hundred.

1240
00:52:22,160 --> 00:52:25,560
Speaker 4: No, those two shooters were industry partners that got a

1241
00:52:25,600 --> 00:52:26,760
Speaker 4: free invite to the finale.

1242
00:52:27,000 --> 00:52:28,800
Speaker 3: That's who those people got you. They were running the

1243
00:52:28,840 --> 00:52:30,719
Speaker 3: March the Mark eights back in the day.

1244
00:52:30,960 --> 00:52:33,480
Speaker 4: Yeah, and nobody was running them. It was it was

1245
00:52:33,600 --> 00:52:35,240
Speaker 4: And now it's it's crazy.

1246
00:52:35,320 --> 00:52:35,520
Speaker 3: Yeah.

1247
00:52:35,520 --> 00:52:36,440
Speaker 1: I pulled it up the other day.

1248
00:52:36,440 --> 00:52:38,920
Speaker 2: I think it was, well, it was December one, I

1249
00:52:39,160 --> 00:52:41,399
Speaker 2: remember because I was talking to Dirk and I pulled

1250
00:52:41,400 --> 00:52:43,439
Speaker 2: it up. I said, what's everybody in twenty three used?

1251
00:52:43,440 --> 00:52:45,920
Speaker 2: And then you go there and it's like seventy percent

1252
00:52:45,960 --> 00:52:47,879
Speaker 2: of the shooters are now using the Mark five, which

1253
00:52:47,880 --> 00:52:49,719
Speaker 2: it's it's kind of cool to see that change. So,

1254
00:52:49,800 --> 00:52:52,320
Speaker 2: I mean, you know, the top shooters in the world

1255
00:52:52,320 --> 00:52:55,000
Speaker 2: are now trusting that that that Mark five is going

1256
00:52:55,080 --> 00:52:57,160
Speaker 2: to do what it's supposed to do and what you've

1257
00:52:57,200 --> 00:52:59,000
Speaker 2: proven it can do. So that's pretty cool. When you

1258
00:52:59,040 --> 00:53:01,400
Speaker 2: guys were lying on that to return to zero perfectly

1259
00:53:01,600 --> 00:53:04,239
Speaker 2: and that every you know that every click is as

1260
00:53:04,239 --> 00:53:06,040
Speaker 2: close to one as you can get. It's probably never

1261
00:53:06,080 --> 00:53:08,360
Speaker 2: going to be one point zero zero, you know, but

1262
00:53:08,440 --> 00:53:09,319
Speaker 2: it could be, but.

1263
00:53:09,280 --> 00:53:09,839
Speaker 1: It could be one.

1264
00:53:11,640 --> 00:53:15,719
Speaker 2: Yeah, go ahead, sorry, yeah, I mean it's it's it's

1265
00:53:15,760 --> 00:53:18,080
Speaker 2: splitting hairs, but you could be point nine ninety ninety seven,

1266
00:53:18,080 --> 00:53:20,080
Speaker 2: which is all you know. And so I mean that

1267
00:53:20,080 --> 00:53:22,680
Speaker 2: that things is dialed, as you know. I walked mine

1268
00:53:22,680 --> 00:53:24,879
Speaker 2: around twenty m a at one hundred just to make

1269
00:53:24,880 --> 00:53:26,919
Speaker 2: sure it shoots the square and comes back to zero

1270
00:53:26,960 --> 00:53:29,600
Speaker 2: and the thing's been super repeatable and never off track.

1271
00:53:30,400 --> 00:53:30,920
Speaker 1: Yeah.

1272
00:53:31,080 --> 00:53:32,520
Speaker 4: Yeah, I do the same thing. I have a big,

1273
00:53:33,239 --> 00:53:36,600
Speaker 4: like fourteen foot tall board I tracked test. I put

1274
00:53:36,640 --> 00:53:40,480
Speaker 4: scopes on this big fifty pounds steel thing with a pickrail,

1275
00:53:40,520 --> 00:53:42,319
Speaker 4: and I've tracked tested a ton of scopes and I've

1276
00:53:42,320 --> 00:53:42,680
Speaker 4: had them.

1277
00:53:43,080 --> 00:53:44,359
Speaker 3: I've had them all. We God, I had.

1278
00:53:44,600 --> 00:53:47,880
Speaker 4: Early prototype one that was a little bit off, but

1279
00:53:47,920 --> 00:53:51,440
Speaker 4: that wasn't for sale, and every production Mark five I

1280
00:53:51,480 --> 00:53:52,440
Speaker 4: had this track really well.

1281
00:53:52,560 --> 00:53:54,520
Speaker 3: I here's things on the eritor guys like, hey, are

1282
00:53:54,520 --> 00:53:56,600
Speaker 3: you really do you really trust the Mark five? I

1283
00:53:56,640 --> 00:53:58,560
Speaker 3: read this on the internet and I'm like, man, I

1284
00:53:58,600 --> 00:54:01,319
Speaker 3: haven't seen it. I do trust it. That being said,

1285
00:54:01,400 --> 00:54:03,920
Speaker 3: Nightforce makes an awesome scope. There's other companies that make

1286
00:54:03,960 --> 00:54:06,640
Speaker 3: great scopes, but I do like the Mark five. I

1287
00:54:06,640 --> 00:54:08,680
Speaker 3: think the balance for the cost.

1288
00:54:09,560 --> 00:54:11,160
Speaker 4: I don't want this to be a sales pitch whatever,

1289
00:54:11,200 --> 00:54:13,160
Speaker 4: but the cost of the way and the performance is

1290
00:54:13,160 --> 00:54:15,280
Speaker 4: pretty it is pretty good. It's pretty in the locking

1291
00:54:15,680 --> 00:54:18,279
Speaker 4: elevation and then the I like the cap windage. Yeah,

1292
00:54:18,560 --> 00:54:20,160
Speaker 4: so you're going to scabbard on the horse hunt or

1293
00:54:20,200 --> 00:54:22,879
Speaker 4: something like it's it's it's a pretty durable scope.

1294
00:54:22,960 --> 00:54:24,680
Speaker 2: Yeah, that was one thing that crept up and bid

1295
00:54:24,760 --> 00:54:26,680
Speaker 2: us on my dad's tour entered ultramag. We were in

1296
00:54:26,960 --> 00:54:29,680
Speaker 2: Colorado on a deer hunt and it doesn't have capped windage,

1297
00:54:29,880 --> 00:54:32,560
Speaker 2: and somewhere along the way it got off and he

1298
00:54:32,600 --> 00:54:34,200
Speaker 2: missed a shot at a great meal deer at like

1299
00:54:34,200 --> 00:54:36,080
Speaker 2: three hundred not even a long range shot, but his

1300
00:54:36,120 --> 00:54:39,759
Speaker 2: windage has got turned so much that it put him off.

1301
00:54:39,800 --> 00:54:42,880
Speaker 2: And so yeah, that's another cap windage. Yeah yeah, and

1302
00:54:42,920 --> 00:54:46,040
Speaker 2: then I'm pretty excited. Maybe I don't want to sound

1303
00:54:46,280 --> 00:54:48,560
Speaker 2: sound two sales pitchy, but I know the day that

1304
00:54:48,600 --> 00:54:51,239
Speaker 2: this podcast launches, Loophole's kind of following up their Mark

1305
00:54:51,280 --> 00:54:53,160
Speaker 2: five with a new Mark four HD, which will be

1306
00:54:53,239 --> 00:54:56,040
Speaker 2: kind of in that that same realm prices. I'm not

1307
00:54:56,080 --> 00:54:57,600
Speaker 2: going to even get into the prices I don't know

1308
00:54:57,640 --> 00:55:01,160
Speaker 2: per model, but like really really attractive for you might

1309
00:55:01,200 --> 00:55:03,239
Speaker 2: be able to change your your idea that you need

1310
00:55:03,239 --> 00:55:05,080
Speaker 2: to spend X on a scope because it sounds like

1311
00:55:05,080 --> 00:55:08,200
Speaker 2: we might get an option. Yeah that's you know, we

1312
00:55:08,280 --> 00:55:10,240
Speaker 2: have to do some more testing, but uh yeah.

1313
00:55:10,440 --> 00:55:13,040
Speaker 4: Yeah, yeah, you don't know a ton of what I

1314
00:55:13,040 --> 00:55:15,360
Speaker 4: can you know, talk about, but it's gonna be you

1315
00:55:15,360 --> 00:55:17,560
Speaker 4: guys will see it's the Mark four. It looks very

1316
00:55:17,640 --> 00:55:20,160
Speaker 4: very similar to a Mark five, a little different tube size.

1317
00:55:20,200 --> 00:55:22,080
Speaker 4: I think we talked about they're going to a thirty

1318
00:55:22,080 --> 00:55:23,800
Speaker 4: four on them instead of a thirty five on a

1319
00:55:23,800 --> 00:55:26,799
Speaker 4: bunch of them, but it's gonna be cheaper. They're taking

1320
00:55:26,800 --> 00:55:28,280
Speaker 4: a lot of the tech out of the Mark five.

1321
00:55:29,800 --> 00:55:32,160
Speaker 4: It's gonna it's gonna From what I've seen when i'm

1322
00:55:32,160 --> 00:55:35,080
Speaker 4: the ones i've played with, it's pretty impressive. And again

1323
00:55:35,120 --> 00:55:38,399
Speaker 4: I'm not one to say I never recommend something until

1324
00:55:38,440 --> 00:55:41,799
Speaker 4: I use it a lot. But from what I've seen

1325
00:55:41,840 --> 00:55:44,480
Speaker 4: so far, it looks pretty. It looks pretty impressive, So

1326
00:55:44,760 --> 00:55:46,759
Speaker 4: price points are going to be really good. It's it's

1327
00:55:46,800 --> 00:55:49,360
Speaker 4: not a replacement for a Mark five. It's gonna be

1328
00:55:49,480 --> 00:55:52,760
Speaker 4: uh it's kind of the tier below. And I think,

1329
00:55:52,960 --> 00:55:55,640
Speaker 4: you know, we'll see improvements to the Mark five is

1330
00:55:55,640 --> 00:55:57,759
Speaker 4: probably due for a revamp at some point, so I

1331
00:55:57,760 --> 00:55:59,959
Speaker 4: think it'll be the Mark four then, you know, which

1332
00:56:00,320 --> 00:56:04,480
Speaker 4: keep getting progressing. So it's it's cool. It's it looks

1333
00:56:04,760 --> 00:56:06,920
Speaker 4: when you guys see it, you'll laugh. It looks they

1334
00:56:06,920 --> 00:56:09,560
Speaker 4: did a little tiny subtle changes to the turrets, but

1335
00:56:09,600 --> 00:56:11,360
Speaker 4: it looks like a Mark five. It's it's it's a

1336
00:56:11,400 --> 00:56:12,160
Speaker 4: sexy little scope.

1337
00:56:12,239 --> 00:56:13,480
Speaker 1: Yeah, I'm excited it changed it.

1338
00:56:13,480 --> 00:56:14,920
Speaker 3: It set of like a five twenty five.

1339
00:56:14,960 --> 00:56:16,799
Speaker 4: It's a six twenty four type of brain, so they

1340
00:56:17,239 --> 00:56:19,040
Speaker 4: changed out a little bit to a four x.

1341
00:56:19,080 --> 00:56:20,680
Speaker 3: But yeah, it's it's good, it's cool.

1342
00:56:20,840 --> 00:56:25,520
Speaker 2: Yeah, you're excited about that. Now let's go in the

1343
00:56:25,600 --> 00:56:28,239
Speaker 2: issues you might So you've you've got your gun built. Now,

1344
00:56:28,239 --> 00:56:30,799
Speaker 2: we've got our optics mounted, We're we're all dialed in there.

1345
00:56:30,840 --> 00:56:34,080
Speaker 2: Like what issues could pop up if the gun builders did,

1346
00:56:34,120 --> 00:56:35,080
Speaker 2: like what have you found?

1347
00:56:36,200 --> 00:56:38,960
Speaker 1: The first thing? Everything? Everything, but like what are I

1348
00:56:38,960 --> 00:56:41,280
Speaker 1: guess what's the most probable issue? And like where should

1349
00:56:41,280 --> 00:56:41,720
Speaker 1: you start?

1350
00:56:43,000 --> 00:56:48,560
Speaker 4: I've I've seen so many weird things that I can't

1351
00:56:48,600 --> 00:56:56,480
Speaker 4: even I've had I've had good brass from companies that

1352
00:56:56,800 --> 00:56:59,080
Speaker 4: instead of testing and measuring everything, I just trust but

1353
00:56:59,160 --> 00:57:01,160
Speaker 4: open it up as it checked the necks and rock

1354
00:57:01,200 --> 00:57:04,319
Speaker 4: and roll and have issues with internal volumes that throw

1355
00:57:04,360 --> 00:57:05,200
Speaker 4: weird stuff off.

1356
00:57:05,560 --> 00:57:07,359
Speaker 3: One of the weirdest ones lately is I.

1357
00:57:07,360 --> 00:57:09,960
Speaker 4: Was fighting and fighting and fighting the carbon barrel a

1358
00:57:10,000 --> 00:57:12,640
Speaker 4: carbon barrel gun, and it was like I'd get some

1359
00:57:12,680 --> 00:57:15,080
Speaker 4: good groups and some bad groups. It just wasn't as consistent,

1360
00:57:15,400 --> 00:57:18,200
Speaker 4: consistent as I would like it to be. And I

1361
00:57:18,240 --> 00:57:20,600
Speaker 4: fought and fought and fought. I took it out, I checked,

1362
00:57:20,760 --> 00:57:23,120
Speaker 4: just redid it. I can't remember change the batting, I

1363
00:57:23,200 --> 00:57:26,160
Speaker 4: changed stocks, I changed scopes, I changed everything.

1364
00:57:26,200 --> 00:57:28,640
Speaker 3: I went, changed bullets, I changed powders, and I could

1365
00:57:28,720 --> 00:57:29,480
Speaker 3: not figure it out.

1366
00:57:30,080 --> 00:57:33,040
Speaker 4: The last thing I did was I pulled the muzzle

1367
00:57:33,080 --> 00:57:35,640
Speaker 4: brake off to just triple check that it was clean.

1368
00:57:35,720 --> 00:57:38,320
Speaker 4: There was, it wasn't carbon dup, and it wasn't, and

1369
00:57:38,360 --> 00:57:39,760
Speaker 4: I was like, screw, I'm going to put on a

1370
00:57:39,760 --> 00:57:42,960
Speaker 4: different brake. So I had a really lightweight, a titanium

1371
00:57:43,040 --> 00:57:46,480
Speaker 4: brake that was really light, and I just threw on

1372
00:57:46,480 --> 00:57:48,120
Speaker 4: one of my comp brakes and so I went from

1373
00:57:48,200 --> 00:57:50,720
Speaker 4: like a one ounce or a sub one ounce break

1374
00:57:51,040 --> 00:57:53,800
Speaker 4: to like an eight ounce break. I think it was

1375
00:57:54,640 --> 00:57:57,320
Speaker 4: just because I was I was gonna throw the gun away,

1376
00:57:57,680 --> 00:57:59,040
Speaker 4: and I put that out of the brake on and

1377
00:57:59,080 --> 00:58:01,200
Speaker 4: the gun just shot like I don't know.

1378
00:58:01,680 --> 00:58:03,640
Speaker 3: I don't want to say quarter age because that's whatever.

1379
00:58:03,640 --> 00:58:06,919
Speaker 4: But I had three eighths consistently, and I went from

1380
00:58:06,960 --> 00:58:08,720
Speaker 4: I'm talking, I went from an inch and a half

1381
00:58:09,120 --> 00:58:11,680
Speaker 4: to just sub half inch, just like just switching the

1382
00:58:11,720 --> 00:58:13,720
Speaker 4: brake and it stacked at a one hundred and I

1383
00:58:13,720 --> 00:58:15,360
Speaker 4: was like, okay, this is I'm running the heavy break

1384
00:58:15,360 --> 00:58:18,080
Speaker 4: on this gun. And it just whatever that barrel, whatever

1385
00:58:18,120 --> 00:58:20,160
Speaker 4: the deal was with the HARMONICX and that barrel, the

1386
00:58:20,200 --> 00:58:22,040
Speaker 4: weight off the end of it just settled it down.

1387
00:58:22,280 --> 00:58:24,080
Speaker 4: And that's a lot of guys. The weight of a

1388
00:58:24,080 --> 00:58:25,919
Speaker 4: suppress or a way of a break will change things.

1389
00:58:25,920 --> 00:58:29,560
Speaker 4: So that's just one example of things I've seen. I've

1390
00:58:29,600 --> 00:58:34,520
Speaker 4: seen so many different things, but I can't really say it,

1391
00:58:35,120 --> 00:58:37,960
Speaker 4: you know, pick one, but generally, if you're going to

1392
00:58:38,000 --> 00:58:41,480
Speaker 4: work on a gun, I do try I shot Hodge

1393
00:58:41,520 --> 00:58:43,600
Speaker 4: and powders a lot. I like the extreme lines. I like,

1394
00:58:43,880 --> 00:58:48,120
Speaker 4: you know, forty three fifty, H one thousand, I like

1395
00:58:48,160 --> 00:58:51,040
Speaker 4: a lot. Retumble went away for a long time. I

1396
00:58:51,080 --> 00:58:53,280
Speaker 4: haven't shot Retumble in years, and I didn't like it

1397
00:58:53,280 --> 00:58:55,200
Speaker 4: as much. I did get some weird pressure spice with

1398
00:58:55,160 --> 00:58:56,800
Speaker 4: a tumble back in the day that I didn't with

1399
00:58:56,960 --> 00:58:57,240
Speaker 4: H one.

1400
00:58:57,200 --> 00:59:00,959
Speaker 3: Thousand, forty eight thirty one varget. All those powders are great.

1401
00:59:01,640 --> 00:59:04,400
Speaker 4: There's a lot of good powder, So go with trusted components,

1402
00:59:04,440 --> 00:59:08,400
Speaker 4: good brass, good bullets. Go try to eliminate as many

1403
00:59:08,520 --> 00:59:11,440
Speaker 4: variables as you can so you don't question things if

1404
00:59:11,440 --> 00:59:13,880
Speaker 4: there's an issue. But there's all there's always.

1405
00:59:13,560 --> 00:59:14,120
Speaker 3: Stuff going on.

1406
00:59:14,280 --> 00:59:17,320
Speaker 4: Like I said, bullets barrow speeding up, lots lots of

1407
00:59:17,360 --> 00:59:19,920
Speaker 4: powder change, and I've seen a lot of speed differences

1408
00:59:20,000 --> 00:59:22,880
Speaker 4: in powders the last handful of years since COVID. I

1409
00:59:22,880 --> 00:59:26,040
Speaker 4: don't know if everyone's manufacturing is stress and everything, And

1410
00:59:26,080 --> 00:59:28,040
Speaker 4: I feel like the lots a lot VARIANTCE was bigger

1411
00:59:28,040 --> 00:59:30,320
Speaker 4: than used to be. So if you guys, are you

1412
00:59:30,440 --> 00:59:32,680
Speaker 4: got three pounds of this and you run out and

1413
00:59:32,720 --> 00:59:33,960
Speaker 4: you go buy an eight pound of.

1414
00:59:33,880 --> 00:59:35,680
Speaker 3: This, it's the same powder.

1415
00:59:35,840 --> 00:59:39,000
Speaker 4: Check your speeds, pressures most likely will be different some

1416
00:59:39,040 --> 00:59:41,240
Speaker 4: real basic stuff, but a lot of things people overlook

1417
00:59:42,240 --> 00:59:44,960
Speaker 4: and even do some measurements when you switch lots on bullets.

1418
00:59:45,000 --> 00:59:47,160
Speaker 4: So I try to buy big lots of stuff so

1419
00:59:47,160 --> 00:59:48,360
Speaker 4: I don't have to do that. Like if I can

1420
00:59:48,360 --> 00:59:50,640
Speaker 4: buy like forty or fifty pounds at a time of powder,

1421
00:59:51,080 --> 00:59:52,320
Speaker 4: don't worry about that as much.

1422
00:59:52,480 --> 00:59:52,720
Speaker 1: YEP.

1423
00:59:53,240 --> 00:59:55,320
Speaker 3: I try to do that, But I need you also

1424
00:59:55,360 --> 00:59:56,080
Speaker 3: going through a lot.

1425
00:59:56,280 --> 00:59:58,400
Speaker 2: I need you to explain that to my wife why

1426
00:59:58,440 --> 01:00:01,400
Speaker 2: I needed thirty two pounds of eight L twenty six

1427
01:00:01,440 --> 01:00:04,120
Speaker 2: at the same time. Was that was to make sure

1428
01:00:04,120 --> 01:00:07,080
Speaker 2: that there wasn't any lot, you know, variation, and yeah.

1429
01:00:07,000 --> 01:00:08,760
Speaker 3: And you got to protect her when the world ends,

1430
01:00:08,800 --> 01:00:09,360
Speaker 3: you gotta.

1431
01:00:09,120 --> 01:00:10,480
Speaker 1: Have Yeah, yeah, there you go.

1432
01:00:11,200 --> 01:00:14,280
Speaker 2: But like you talked about good, good powders like my

1433
01:00:14,440 --> 01:00:17,440
Speaker 2: H one thousand, like my ees my my spread on

1434
01:00:17,840 --> 01:00:20,560
Speaker 2: three thirty eight edge is like single digits on the

1435
01:00:20,680 --> 01:00:23,800
Speaker 2: edge and whether it's hot or cold. Where we tried

1436
01:00:23,840 --> 01:00:25,560
Speaker 2: to chase a little bit more performance with the r

1437
01:00:25,680 --> 01:00:27,200
Speaker 2: L twenty six, But I tell you what, if I

1438
01:00:27,240 --> 01:00:28,880
Speaker 2: go out and shoot that gun of eighty degrees here

1439
01:00:28,920 --> 01:00:30,840
Speaker 2: and then go out and shoot it at thirty, I'm

1440
01:00:30,880 --> 01:00:34,600
Speaker 2: like this, it wasn't worth chasing the speed and and uh,

1441
01:00:34,640 --> 01:00:35,800
Speaker 2: you know, I don't know if you've messed with bit

1442
01:00:35,920 --> 01:00:37,840
Speaker 2: of or bit of ore seems to have like a

1443
01:00:37,840 --> 01:00:39,960
Speaker 2: little more of that performance edge but a lot more

1444
01:00:40,120 --> 01:00:42,760
Speaker 2: temp stable And so we're we're doing some switching around,

1445
01:00:42,800 --> 01:00:45,280
Speaker 2: even in my own loads. But yeah, that was one thing.

1446
01:00:45,400 --> 01:00:48,120
Speaker 2: My r L twenty six did switch lots in between

1447
01:00:48,160 --> 01:00:50,600
Speaker 2: like my first load versus like this new load, and

1448
01:00:50,640 --> 01:00:54,080
Speaker 2: I could not the gun was you know, literally dropping

1449
01:00:54,120 --> 01:00:57,040
Speaker 2: primers out the back, not even just like ejector marks

1450
01:00:57,160 --> 01:00:59,480
Speaker 2: and sticky bolts, like dropping primers when I I'm oh

1451
01:00:59,520 --> 01:01:02,680
Speaker 2: that primary and like when I was here, like it was,

1452
01:01:02,760 --> 01:01:04,320
Speaker 2: it was shooting well, and then we had to go

1453
01:01:04,400 --> 01:01:06,840
Speaker 2: back and like move everything on that load, like the

1454
01:01:06,880 --> 01:01:09,840
Speaker 2: powder changed the you know, how how deep you were

1455
01:01:09,880 --> 01:01:11,480
Speaker 2: seat in the bullet to get the pressures to get

1456
01:01:11,480 --> 01:01:12,800
Speaker 2: in the right spot, and then now the gun shoots

1457
01:01:12,840 --> 01:01:15,880
Speaker 2: lights out again. But one thing we didn't talk about,

1458
01:01:15,880 --> 01:01:17,920
Speaker 2: which we don't even have that much time, is like

1459
01:01:17,960 --> 01:01:20,160
Speaker 2: when you get a good rifle built, you know, and

1460
01:01:20,160 --> 01:01:22,360
Speaker 2: you've built it backwards from a bullet, because that's going

1461
01:01:22,440 --> 01:01:25,200
Speaker 2: to have to you know, getting way into the deep end,

1462
01:01:25,240 --> 01:01:27,400
Speaker 2: like where you're gonna chamber the gun, how far out

1463
01:01:27,400 --> 01:01:29,600
Speaker 2: you're gonna push that bullet and try to be you know,

1464
01:01:29,720 --> 01:01:31,040
Speaker 2: out of the lands and all of that.

1465
01:01:31,520 --> 01:01:32,560
Speaker 1: I was, I've been amazed.

1466
01:01:32,600 --> 01:01:35,200
Speaker 2: Like one thing that really kind of you made me

1467
01:01:35,480 --> 01:01:38,360
Speaker 2: like open my eyes is just how finnicky it is

1468
01:01:38,400 --> 01:01:41,600
Speaker 2: with tentsive grains of powder and bullet seating and the

1469
01:01:42,280 --> 01:01:44,200
Speaker 2: balance of that. Because you might have a gun that

1470
01:01:44,240 --> 01:01:47,160
Speaker 2: shoots you know, quarter moa as long as you're doing

1471
01:01:47,160 --> 01:01:49,080
Speaker 2: your job, but if you don't get that node just

1472
01:01:49,200 --> 01:01:51,720
Speaker 2: perfectly and get your bullet seated right, or get the

1473
01:01:51,800 --> 01:01:53,160
Speaker 2: right amount of powder and get that all to match.

1474
01:01:53,200 --> 01:01:54,600
Speaker 2: And you might have a gun that's shooting, you know,

1475
01:01:54,640 --> 01:01:56,880
Speaker 2: three quarters do one m away on the same gun

1476
01:01:56,920 --> 01:01:58,520
Speaker 2: that you just bump things a little bit and it

1477
01:01:58,560 --> 01:02:01,480
Speaker 2: just seems to dial it in. Was one thing that's like, Wow,

1478
01:02:01,480 --> 01:02:03,080
Speaker 2: I didn't realize it mattered that much.

1479
01:02:04,560 --> 01:02:08,760
Speaker 3: Yeah, I think I don't. Honestly, I don't know if

1480
01:02:08,760 --> 01:02:09,200
Speaker 3: it does.

1481
01:02:11,600 --> 01:02:13,400
Speaker 4: If you take a three thirty eight and you're running

1482
01:02:13,640 --> 01:02:16,520
Speaker 4: or whatever, If I take my NORMA and I'm running whatever,

1483
01:02:16,560 --> 01:02:19,720
Speaker 4: eighty five, eighty four grains, whatever happens to be if.

1484
01:02:19,600 --> 01:02:22,000
Speaker 3: You drop if you go to if I'm shooting eighty.

1485
01:02:21,760 --> 01:02:25,120
Speaker 4: Four grains and I go to eighty three point eight,

1486
01:02:25,400 --> 01:02:28,280
Speaker 4: so two tenths less and you go shoot a three

1487
01:02:28,320 --> 01:02:30,880
Speaker 4: shot group. Maybe that group looks tighter on that group,

1488
01:02:30,920 --> 01:02:32,960
Speaker 4: but it's not going to look tighter over over a

1489
01:02:33,000 --> 01:02:35,240
Speaker 4: sample of fifty. Yeah, it's just it's too small of

1490
01:02:35,240 --> 01:02:38,720
Speaker 4: a percentage. So what I don't think it does.

1491
01:02:38,880 --> 01:02:40,919
Speaker 2: What percentage do you think matters are If you start

1492
01:02:40,920 --> 01:02:42,880
Speaker 2: to move a half a grain of powder, does it start.

1493
01:02:42,680 --> 01:02:45,520
Speaker 4: To so in the bigger guns, I generally do bigger jumps,

1494
01:02:45,520 --> 01:02:48,160
Speaker 4: and if I'm having problems, I will shrink down.

1495
01:02:48,200 --> 01:02:50,000
Speaker 3: But I don't think it matters as much.

1496
01:02:50,080 --> 01:02:53,600
Speaker 4: I think what I've been doing more lately is is

1497
01:02:54,000 --> 01:02:56,120
Speaker 4: I try to stay anywhere away from pressure because they

1498
01:02:56,160 --> 01:02:58,080
Speaker 4: can get finicky. And like when you said about dropping

1499
01:02:58,120 --> 01:03:00,280
Speaker 4: primers out the bottom, you guys need to be careful

1500
01:03:00,640 --> 01:03:02,680
Speaker 4: when you're on really Like I live in western Oregon,

1501
01:03:02,720 --> 01:03:05,200
Speaker 4: you grow up western Washington. It gets really wet and

1502
01:03:05,320 --> 01:03:07,840
Speaker 4: water causes pressure. So this is like I disclaimer outside

1503
01:03:07,840 --> 01:03:10,320
Speaker 4: your question, but if you're anywhere close to pressure under

1504
01:03:10,360 --> 01:03:14,000
Speaker 4: good conditions and you're pouring down rain and everything's soaking wet,

1505
01:03:14,040 --> 01:03:15,520
Speaker 4: you're going to pressure out really hard.

1506
01:03:15,640 --> 01:03:17,160
Speaker 3: So you guys can do water tests.

1507
01:03:17,200 --> 01:03:19,080
Speaker 4: You can pour out water on your animal feed it,

1508
01:03:19,120 --> 01:03:21,360
Speaker 4: shoot a couple of rounds, get that chamber wet, and

1509
01:03:21,440 --> 01:03:23,680
Speaker 4: see if you still are pressure free. So that's just

1510
01:03:24,160 --> 01:03:27,320
Speaker 4: a tip that you got to be pressure safe with water.

1511
01:03:27,640 --> 01:03:30,240
Speaker 4: So going back to the other thing, what I do

1512
01:03:30,920 --> 01:03:35,000
Speaker 4: I've been doing more lately is I generally will know

1513
01:03:35,800 --> 01:03:38,600
Speaker 4: there's enough information or I've shot enough calibers where I

1514
01:03:38,760 --> 01:03:42,720
Speaker 4: know there's a speed node for different calibers. For whatever reason,

1515
01:03:43,400 --> 01:03:46,600
Speaker 4: like my six five prcs. Depending on barrel light, it

1516
01:03:46,640 --> 01:03:50,080
Speaker 4: seems like twenty nine nine thirty twenty nine forty with

1517
01:03:50,160 --> 01:03:52,520
Speaker 4: the one fifty six is a really really good speed

1518
01:03:52,920 --> 01:03:56,000
Speaker 4: accuracy wise, and so I generally what I've been doing

1519
01:03:56,080 --> 01:03:59,760
Speaker 4: lately it's been working pretty good, is all experimental, a

1520
01:03:59,760 --> 01:04:02,520
Speaker 4: little bit with powder and maybe half grain increments, some bigger.

1521
01:04:02,320 --> 01:04:05,480
Speaker 3: Jumps, and then I'll hit that speed. I'll just load to.

1522
01:04:05,480 --> 01:04:08,600
Speaker 4: Twenty nine to twenty and then I'll do seating jumps.

1523
01:04:08,640 --> 01:04:12,760
Speaker 4: I'll go twenty fifty eighty one twenty like, I'll do

1524
01:04:12,880 --> 01:04:16,840
Speaker 4: big seating depth tests and kind of make some corrections

1525
01:04:16,880 --> 01:04:18,720
Speaker 4: off of that. That will change your speed a little bit.

1526
01:04:18,760 --> 01:04:22,280
Speaker 4: The bigger the the closer end of the lands, you're

1527
01:04:22,360 --> 01:04:24,520
Speaker 4: two with your bullet loaded, your pressure is gonna spike

1528
01:04:24,600 --> 01:04:25,080
Speaker 4: real quick.

1529
01:04:25,520 --> 01:04:27,160
Speaker 3: And that's like back in the day, would weather be

1530
01:04:27,200 --> 01:04:29,560
Speaker 3: you got all that speed. They just have massive freeboard

1531
01:04:29,560 --> 01:04:31,600
Speaker 3: built into their guns, so they get a bigger run

1532
01:04:31,640 --> 01:04:33,480
Speaker 3: and start with that bullet, slam it into the lands

1533
01:04:33,520 --> 01:04:34,840
Speaker 3: and you can get more speed that way.

1534
01:04:35,160 --> 01:04:38,040
Speaker 4: You can load more powder all that stuff, So your

1535
01:04:38,040 --> 01:04:40,640
Speaker 4: speeds will change as you get closer and further way

1536
01:04:40,640 --> 01:04:42,800
Speaker 4: from the lands. But I've been doing some testing that way.

1537
01:04:43,520 --> 01:04:45,720
Speaker 4: It's been working pretty good, kind of tuning a load

1538
01:04:45,760 --> 01:04:49,640
Speaker 4: with seating depth and so. But yeah, I don't in

1539
01:04:49,680 --> 01:04:51,880
Speaker 4: the small guns, like when I'm shooting my dashes a lot,

1540
01:04:51,920 --> 01:04:54,880
Speaker 4: when you're loading thirty grains and twenty nine and a

1541
01:04:54,920 --> 01:04:55,960
Speaker 4: half or thirty.

1542
01:04:55,680 --> 01:04:57,840
Speaker 3: One grains, like, I'll do the point two point three

1543
01:04:57,880 --> 01:04:59,520
Speaker 3: grain increments.

1544
01:04:59,760 --> 01:05:02,640
Speaker 4: But but if your gun is going to change, like

1545
01:05:02,680 --> 01:05:05,200
Speaker 4: I don't want my gun to change if I load

1546
01:05:06,160 --> 01:05:09,720
Speaker 4: a tenth or two either way, I don't think it's

1547
01:05:09,760 --> 01:05:11,840
Speaker 4: going to. I think over a big sample side, it's

1548
01:05:11,840 --> 01:05:13,480
Speaker 4: not going to If you go shoot a twenty round

1549
01:05:13,520 --> 01:05:15,680
Speaker 4: string or a ten round group, you shoot a five

1550
01:05:15,800 --> 01:05:18,760
Speaker 4: shots and five shots and five shots, let your arycle whatever.

1551
01:05:19,000 --> 01:05:20,920
Speaker 3: I don't think your group's going to be that much different.

1552
01:05:20,960 --> 01:05:22,480
Speaker 4: I think they're all kind of kind of cluster into

1553
01:05:22,480 --> 01:05:25,000
Speaker 4: you either a half inch or a three quarter the

1554
01:05:25,040 --> 01:05:29,360
Speaker 4: whole quarter minute gun idea, God, that's interest territory. Everyone

1555
01:05:29,360 --> 01:05:30,920
Speaker 4: wants to all the gun that seems to do that.

1556
01:05:31,040 --> 01:05:34,040
Speaker 4: But that's when people say quarter minute. If I do

1557
01:05:34,120 --> 01:05:36,320
Speaker 4: my part, I just called BS.

1558
01:05:36,080 --> 01:05:40,240
Speaker 1: Like the time. It's just a real rare gun to

1559
01:05:40,280 --> 01:05:40,520
Speaker 1: do that.

1560
01:05:41,680 --> 01:05:44,640
Speaker 4: Yeah, and it's just in a light magnum. I just

1561
01:05:44,680 --> 01:05:47,440
Speaker 4: don't the shoot ability those is difficult. If you're in

1562
01:05:47,520 --> 01:05:49,480
Speaker 4: a interrst gun, I get it. I'm not arguing with

1563
01:05:49,560 --> 01:05:52,240
Speaker 4: interrest guys. The guys that shoot the you know, the

1564
01:05:52,520 --> 01:05:55,640
Speaker 4: PPCs and the hundred yard interest and then different things

1565
01:05:55,680 --> 01:05:57,960
Speaker 4: like that, Like those guys are shooting tiny, tiny groups.

1566
01:05:57,960 --> 01:05:59,480
Speaker 4: But that's a different thing than we're talking about. We're

1567
01:05:59,480 --> 01:06:01,680
Speaker 4: talking about and we're talking about field. We're talking about

1568
01:06:01,720 --> 01:06:04,200
Speaker 4: positioning the field. That's not ideal. You know, if you

1569
01:06:04,200 --> 01:06:07,680
Speaker 4: can shoot half inch half mla all day, you're killing

1570
01:06:07,760 --> 01:06:08,600
Speaker 4: everything everywhere.

1571
01:06:08,640 --> 01:06:09,600
Speaker 3: You're not missing anything.

1572
01:06:10,240 --> 01:06:12,320
Speaker 4: So I mean, if you can extrapolate that all the

1573
01:06:12,360 --> 01:06:14,240
Speaker 4: way out, you're shooting two and a half inches of

1574
01:06:14,280 --> 01:06:16,320
Speaker 4: five hundred and five inches of a thousand, you're not

1575
01:06:16,360 --> 01:06:20,480
Speaker 4: missing anything anywhere. And so I want it's slow and steady, consistent,

1576
01:06:20,640 --> 01:06:22,600
Speaker 4: day in and day out. I don't want big flyers.

1577
01:06:22,640 --> 01:06:24,400
Speaker 4: I don't want pressure spikes. I don't want to be

1578
01:06:24,480 --> 01:06:27,960
Speaker 4: anywhere near my pressure limit, which if guys are shooting

1579
01:06:28,440 --> 01:06:31,400
Speaker 4: reloader powders have been really really accurate for me, but

1580
01:06:31,960 --> 01:06:34,880
Speaker 4: generally those are the guys chasing speed. They're grabbing sixteen

1581
01:06:35,080 --> 01:06:38,320
Speaker 4: twenty six thirty three, and even the bit powders are

1582
01:06:38,320 --> 01:06:40,040
Speaker 4: the same thing. The five sixty fives and the five

1583
01:06:40,120 --> 01:06:43,160
Speaker 4: seventies and the big magnums. Those guys are chasing speed

1584
01:06:43,360 --> 01:06:46,360
Speaker 4: and I'm just I'm not that guy anymore. Like I'll

1585
01:06:46,360 --> 01:06:49,080
Speaker 4: test them and if they shoot, great, great, but they

1586
01:06:49,120 --> 01:06:51,400
Speaker 4: have been more finicky. I feel like the bit powder's

1587
01:06:51,400 --> 01:06:53,600
Speaker 4: carbon up more than hodged in their way dirty or

1588
01:06:53,640 --> 01:06:54,480
Speaker 4: same as reloader.

1589
01:06:55,960 --> 01:06:58,400
Speaker 3: I just haven't had it as good as experience with them, gotcha?

1590
01:06:58,480 --> 01:07:02,480
Speaker 2: So yeah, no, you like I said there, it's obviously

1591
01:07:02,600 --> 01:07:04,520
Speaker 2: this podcast you've got some topics. We could go down

1592
01:07:04,560 --> 01:07:05,680
Speaker 2: some giant rabbit holes.

1593
01:07:05,720 --> 01:07:06,160
Speaker 3: We just don't.

1594
01:07:06,240 --> 01:07:06,560
Speaker 1: We could do it.

1595
01:07:06,600 --> 01:07:09,320
Speaker 2: We could do a series because there's so much to it.

1596
01:07:09,320 --> 01:07:11,360
Speaker 2: There's so much to it, and you know, even some

1597
01:07:11,520 --> 01:07:13,840
Speaker 2: info that I thought I had. You know, you've got

1598
01:07:13,880 --> 01:07:15,880
Speaker 2: different You know where we're we're doing these litt ladder

1599
01:07:15,920 --> 01:07:18,160
Speaker 2: tests that you know, point three jumps on a ninety

1600
01:07:18,160 --> 01:07:20,720
Speaker 2: three grain load. In my edge, you're saying didn't matter

1601
01:07:20,760 --> 01:07:22,280
Speaker 2: as much as we thought. It might have just been

1602
01:07:22,280 --> 01:07:24,480
Speaker 2: me shooting that group versus I do.

1603
01:07:25,920 --> 01:07:29,240
Speaker 4: There's man, I don't want to like rock the low Bow,

1604
01:07:29,320 --> 01:07:32,480
Speaker 4: but no, dude, if you're doing one shot ladder tests,

1605
01:07:33,840 --> 01:07:35,360
Speaker 4: I think if you do a bunch of them, if

1606
01:07:35,400 --> 01:07:37,360
Speaker 4: you do the same tests three times in a row

1607
01:07:38,040 --> 01:07:40,560
Speaker 4: and check those flat spot I do, there are nodes,

1608
01:07:40,680 --> 01:07:43,320
Speaker 4: barrels whip, there are speeds that shoot better. Like I

1609
01:07:43,320 --> 01:07:45,880
Speaker 4: said earlier, it seems like I've like twenty ninety with

1610
01:07:45,880 --> 01:07:48,840
Speaker 4: a six PC. I like they it seems like they

1611
01:07:48,840 --> 01:07:51,880
Speaker 4: shoot there a lot. There are different nodes, so I'm

1612
01:07:51,920 --> 01:07:54,960
Speaker 4: not arguing that. And in theory, the ladder's supposed to

1613
01:07:55,000 --> 01:07:58,880
Speaker 4: show those nodes, right, But I've also you've got extreme spreads,

1614
01:07:58,960 --> 01:08:00,600
Speaker 4: You've got your brass prepped.

1615
01:08:00,360 --> 01:08:03,760
Speaker 3: Your consistency. If you shoot that same test three four

1616
01:08:03,840 --> 01:08:07,080
Speaker 3: times and so it's thirty or forty rounds and overlay

1617
01:08:07,080 --> 01:08:10,200
Speaker 3: all that data, I'm okay with that. But when guys

1618
01:08:10,200 --> 01:08:12,520
Speaker 3: go out and shoot one round once and like there's

1619
01:08:12,560 --> 01:08:15,840
Speaker 3: a flat spot, I call bs on that, Like I've

1620
01:08:15,880 --> 01:08:17,200
Speaker 3: tried it, I just don't do it.

1621
01:08:17,320 --> 01:08:18,519
Speaker 1: Yeah, I.

1622
01:08:20,520 --> 01:08:24,000
Speaker 3: It's it's it's it's it's good info. It's good to have.

1623
01:08:24,200 --> 01:08:27,559
Speaker 4: I just think that the statistical relevance of it isn't

1624
01:08:27,560 --> 01:08:29,920
Speaker 4: near as significant as people think unless you have bigger

1625
01:08:30,000 --> 01:08:33,519
Speaker 4: data samples. So some of the best shooters, one of

1626
01:08:33,520 --> 01:08:36,320
Speaker 4: my buddy like Jake and Morgan, those guys are like,

1627
01:08:36,400 --> 01:08:38,280
Speaker 4: Morgan's top of the game right now.

1628
01:08:38,280 --> 01:08:39,519
Speaker 3: He's one of the He's a great shooter.

1629
01:08:39,920 --> 01:08:42,400
Speaker 4: I travel with him a lot, and he's like, he

1630
01:08:42,560 --> 01:08:44,439
Speaker 4: just goes and shoots ten and twenty round groups and

1631
01:08:44,479 --> 01:08:47,760
Speaker 4: he goes, if it's five eighths whatever, he goes, I'm

1632
01:08:47,800 --> 01:08:48,559
Speaker 4: gonna win a match.

1633
01:08:48,720 --> 01:08:51,920
Speaker 3: He goes, you're gonna you're gonna you know, so he

1634
01:08:52,000 --> 01:08:53,960
Speaker 3: just he doesn't even hardly do load development anymore.

1635
01:08:54,000 --> 01:08:56,120
Speaker 4: Sixty five creed with a one to fifty class bullet

1636
01:08:56,439 --> 01:09:00,519
Speaker 4: running at twenty six eighty to twenty seven hundred feet

1637
01:09:00,520 --> 01:09:02,600
Speaker 4: a second, it's going to shoot there, you know.

1638
01:09:02,640 --> 01:09:04,680
Speaker 3: If it doesn't, it's the barrel's problem. That's kind of

1639
01:09:04,720 --> 01:09:07,800
Speaker 3: his mentality. I geek out a little more than that, but.

1640
01:09:09,960 --> 01:09:13,839
Speaker 4: It's when you shoot a lot of big data sets,

1641
01:09:14,200 --> 01:09:17,439
Speaker 4: your little one and two tenths tweaks start to go away,

1642
01:09:17,479 --> 01:09:19,400
Speaker 4: and it gets frustrated. You're like, oh, wait, this is

1643
01:09:19,720 --> 01:09:22,080
Speaker 4: kind of meaningless because I shot one three shot group

1644
01:09:22,120 --> 01:09:23,679
Speaker 4: here and I shot another series show group.

1645
01:09:24,240 --> 01:09:25,799
Speaker 3: You know you need big data samples.

1646
01:09:25,880 --> 01:09:31,680
Speaker 2: Yeah, yeah, no, no, no, it's great information and you know,

1647
01:09:31,760 --> 01:09:33,640
Speaker 2: it's like same thing on the archery side where we

1648
01:09:33,720 --> 01:09:35,439
Speaker 2: used to all pay per tune and now I'm to

1649
01:09:35,479 --> 01:09:37,479
Speaker 2: the point where, you know, depending on the bow, you

1650
01:09:37,479 --> 01:09:38,840
Speaker 2: get it set and I'm just going to get my

1651
01:09:38,840 --> 01:09:41,080
Speaker 2: broad heads and field points to match in. And I

1652
01:09:41,160 --> 01:09:42,840
Speaker 2: you know, we used to get paper sometimes, so there's

1653
01:09:42,840 --> 01:09:45,439
Speaker 2: different ways to get there where you're you're just focusing

1654
01:09:45,439 --> 01:09:47,640
Speaker 2: on that speed that you know from so many you know,

1655
01:09:47,680 --> 01:09:50,040
Speaker 2: trigger polls and chrono checks that You're like, I'm gonna

1656
01:09:50,040 --> 01:09:51,559
Speaker 2: get the gun there and then mess with seating and

1657
01:09:51,600 --> 01:09:55,760
Speaker 2: we should be good, which sounds like it worked a lot. Yeah, yeah, no, no,

1658
01:09:55,800 --> 01:09:56,759
Speaker 2: And that's where I don't.

1659
01:09:56,600 --> 01:09:59,200
Speaker 3: Want to I changed power. The guys are like, oh

1660
01:09:59,200 --> 01:10:01,639
Speaker 3: my gosh, you know, but you know you do tweak powder.

1661
01:10:01,680 --> 01:10:03,599
Speaker 4: But just if I get to know a gun a lot,

1662
01:10:03,680 --> 01:10:06,519
Speaker 4: like I've shot a lot of six Dashers, six five creeds,

1663
01:10:06,760 --> 01:10:09,920
Speaker 4: twenty five creeds, six five prcs, three d enormous, there's

1664
01:10:09,920 --> 01:10:12,280
Speaker 4: a lot of guns I've shot a lot, and it

1665
01:10:12,400 --> 01:10:15,160
Speaker 4: just seems like I started all that with you know,

1666
01:10:15,280 --> 01:10:17,360
Speaker 4: three tents and half grain increments and up and down

1667
01:10:17,360 --> 01:10:19,439
Speaker 4: and seeing depth, and it just seemed like every gun

1668
01:10:19,479 --> 01:10:22,080
Speaker 4: tept coming back to a general bar ballpark. And that's

1669
01:10:22,080 --> 01:10:24,599
Speaker 4: why I'm saying that I started with the powder thing,

1670
01:10:24,800 --> 01:10:26,919
Speaker 4: you know, but I haven't changed a little.

1671
01:10:26,680 --> 01:10:28,800
Speaker 3: Bit over the years. Some a little less time too.

1672
01:10:28,840 --> 01:10:30,040
Speaker 3: It's like, hey, I know it's going to get here.

1673
01:10:30,080 --> 01:10:31,280
Speaker 3: Let's get here as fast as we can.

1674
01:10:31,720 --> 01:10:33,920
Speaker 4: Do a big seating depth test and try to do

1675
01:10:33,960 --> 01:10:36,400
Speaker 4: bigger sample sizes. You know, I'll shoot a three shot

1676
01:10:36,439 --> 01:10:37,360
Speaker 4: group with magnums.

1677
01:10:37,360 --> 01:10:38,880
Speaker 3: I don't want to shoot a ten round screen, right,

1678
01:10:38,920 --> 01:10:40,720
Speaker 3: I'll do that with my camp guns and shoot like

1679
01:10:40,760 --> 01:10:43,920
Speaker 3: a ten round group and just see how it goes.

1680
01:10:44,800 --> 01:10:47,160
Speaker 4: Both magnums. I'll shoot three, let it cool, shoot three,

1681
01:10:47,240 --> 01:10:49,160
Speaker 4: Let it cool, shoot three. So I'll have nine shots

1682
01:10:49,160 --> 01:10:51,920
Speaker 4: in a group or something like that. And I wanted

1683
01:10:51,960 --> 01:10:54,120
Speaker 4: to stay in there. You know, I don't want big flowers.

1684
01:10:54,160 --> 01:10:55,920
Speaker 3: But if you're shooting half inch like, I'm pretty happy

1685
01:10:55,920 --> 01:10:57,200
Speaker 3: with that, especially in the light guns.

1686
01:10:57,360 --> 01:11:00,439
Speaker 2: Gotcha. So yeah, thanks for coming on and John. We

1687
01:11:00,479 --> 01:11:03,760
Speaker 2: really appreciate having your your wealth and knowledge. You you know,

1688
01:11:03,800 --> 01:11:06,840
Speaker 2: you shoot great. Your your knowledge is goes deep into

1689
01:11:06,840 --> 01:11:09,799
Speaker 2: the end of the topic of long range guns shooting

1690
01:11:09,840 --> 01:11:13,120
Speaker 2: really well. And I love more so that you're not

1691
01:11:13,320 --> 01:11:15,559
Speaker 2: just a steel puncher that you you did all this

1692
01:11:15,640 --> 01:11:17,120
Speaker 2: because you love to hunt and then you like to

1693
01:11:17,160 --> 01:11:19,440
Speaker 2: go take what you know and into.

1694
01:11:19,520 --> 01:11:20,400
Speaker 1: You put it in animals.

1695
01:11:20,439 --> 01:11:22,120
Speaker 2: So do you have any big plans for twenty four

1696
01:11:22,160 --> 01:11:23,559
Speaker 2: that you're putting together?

1697
01:11:24,560 --> 01:11:29,439
Speaker 3: Huh Yeah, I mean we're working on it. Got there's

1698
01:11:29,479 --> 01:11:30,400
Speaker 3: a bunch of connections.

1699
01:11:30,760 --> 01:11:32,760
Speaker 4: Probably gonna go back up to the territories this year,

1700
01:11:33,000 --> 01:11:37,400
Speaker 4: kind of finalizing that for doll sheet, maybe Terribou.

1701
01:11:37,040 --> 01:11:37,920
Speaker 3: On a trophy fee.

1702
01:11:38,680 --> 01:11:40,760
Speaker 4: Trying to finish my North American twenty nine. I was

1703
01:11:40,840 --> 01:11:45,760
Speaker 4: up at Kodiak was number twenty seven. In December. I

1704
01:11:45,760 --> 01:11:47,599
Speaker 4: went up there and killed a pretty good block tailt

1705
01:11:47,600 --> 01:11:49,840
Speaker 4: there and so that was number twenty seven. So I

1706
01:11:49,920 --> 01:11:52,200
Speaker 4: have got a polar Bear left and a Rocky Mountain

1707
01:11:52,240 --> 01:11:55,479
Speaker 4: bighorn and so kind of working through that, maybe polar

1708
01:11:55,520 --> 01:11:58,040
Speaker 4: Bear this spring. There's a lot of stuff that's not

1709
01:11:58,080 --> 01:12:00,400
Speaker 4: in concrete that we're working on. So yeah, there's some

1710
01:12:00,479 --> 01:12:03,439
Speaker 4: hunts coming up, so we'll see kind of how things

1711
01:12:03,479 --> 01:12:06,240
Speaker 4: work out. Some of it comes down to raffle drawings

1712
01:12:06,320 --> 01:12:08,240
Speaker 4: and some luck and some other things.

1713
01:12:08,280 --> 01:12:11,439
Speaker 3: So yeah, so we'll see. And then black I love

1714
01:12:11,479 --> 01:12:14,439
Speaker 3: black Tai hunt around here when time time permits. It

1715
01:12:14,479 --> 01:12:16,000
Speaker 3: was fun. This year was fun. They bumped the.

1716
01:12:16,040 --> 01:12:18,920
Speaker 4: Oregon season dates back this year to like it ran

1717
01:12:19,000 --> 01:12:21,439
Speaker 4: to November tenth, and so I got back from the

1718
01:12:21,520 --> 01:12:23,840
Speaker 4: finale and I had five days to hunt.

1719
01:12:23,800 --> 01:12:26,080
Speaker 3: Which was awesome. So I was running out with my

1720
01:12:26,160 --> 01:12:28,720
Speaker 3: rifle and passed on more big blacktails than I've ever

1721
01:12:28,840 --> 01:12:31,080
Speaker 3: passed looking for a giant, but didn't shoot one of.

1722
01:12:31,120 --> 01:12:33,880
Speaker 4: I had a blast saw some big box at two

1723
01:12:33,880 --> 01:12:36,000
Speaker 4: three hundred yards that you normally wouldn't see because of

1724
01:12:36,000 --> 01:12:36,400
Speaker 4: the dates.

1725
01:12:36,400 --> 01:12:38,400
Speaker 3: So that was a lot of fun. So cool, cool, Yeah,

1726
01:12:38,439 --> 01:12:40,760
Speaker 3: we'll see, we'll fink, we'll fit something in. And there

1727
01:12:40,800 --> 01:12:42,559
Speaker 3: was always hunts that come up last week.

1728
01:12:42,600 --> 01:12:44,160
Speaker 2: So you're going to bring that six and a FPRC

1729
01:12:44,320 --> 01:12:45,920
Speaker 2: up there for the polar Bear. You're going to pick

1730
01:12:45,960 --> 01:12:47,559
Speaker 2: up a bigger gun, you think.

1731
01:12:47,439 --> 01:12:49,519
Speaker 3: So maybe bring the six, Maybe bring the sixth dasher

1732
01:12:49,640 --> 01:12:53,280
Speaker 3: up there there. I'll probably just bring a thirty.

1733
01:12:53,560 --> 01:12:55,800
Speaker 4: I was assuming probably just the three hundred normal, so

1734
01:12:55,840 --> 01:12:57,760
Speaker 4: I was actually gonna soccer with a guy we might

1735
01:12:57,840 --> 01:13:00,920
Speaker 4: actually shoot with solid just a test generally up there,

1736
01:13:00,920 --> 01:13:03,920
Speaker 4: it's I've been up there once before for bins for

1737
01:13:04,479 --> 01:13:08,600
Speaker 4: my buddy Ben's hunt in November and it's generally not

1738
01:13:08,720 --> 01:13:11,760
Speaker 4: long it's not a really long range uh hunt. The

1739
01:13:11,760 --> 01:13:15,160
Speaker 4: way it lays out, it's it's interesting. It's interesting deal.

1740
01:13:15,160 --> 01:13:17,160
Speaker 4: So I might take solid up there as a test,

1741
01:13:17,520 --> 01:13:18,040
Speaker 4: so we'll.

1742
01:13:17,880 --> 01:13:20,439
Speaker 2: See cool cool? Well, how can how can all my

1743
01:13:20,520 --> 01:13:23,800
Speaker 2: listeners follow along? I know you're not you know you're

1744
01:13:23,840 --> 01:13:25,960
Speaker 2: You're all over the p r S and the n

1745
01:13:26,040 --> 01:13:27,960
Speaker 2: r L stuff and there's articles and then you know

1746
01:13:28,000 --> 01:13:30,680
Speaker 2: all the all the shooting support that you get. But

1747
01:13:32,000 --> 01:13:35,639
Speaker 2: don't seem to be huge on social but it is there.

1748
01:13:36,720 --> 01:13:40,200
Speaker 4: I I just on my mostly just Instagram. I so

1749
01:13:40,240 --> 01:13:42,559
Speaker 4: far behind, didn't post on half my stuff this year.

1750
01:13:42,600 --> 01:13:45,920
Speaker 4: I love hate, mostly a hate relationship with social but

1751
01:13:46,240 --> 01:13:46,720
Speaker 4: I do need to.

1752
01:13:46,800 --> 01:13:47,639
Speaker 3: I like to see other.

1753
01:13:47,520 --> 01:13:49,559
Speaker 4: People and stuff, so I need to post more. So

1754
01:13:49,880 --> 01:13:51,760
Speaker 4: I'll be posting stuff on there, but just it's just

1755
01:13:52,280 --> 01:13:55,000
Speaker 4: John pinch It on Instagram j O N P y

1756
01:13:55,080 --> 01:13:57,679
Speaker 4: n c H. And I'm blocked, so you got to search.

1757
01:13:57,479 --> 01:13:58,360
Speaker 3: Me to find me that.

1758
01:13:58,760 --> 01:14:01,679
Speaker 4: I guess I'm a whatever I posted last, I posted

1759
01:14:01,720 --> 01:14:03,400
Speaker 4: this picture of I was up in Alaska and that

1760
01:14:03,479 --> 01:14:04,800
Speaker 4: we were on a bear hunt this year, and I

1761
01:14:04,800 --> 01:14:08,080
Speaker 4: show a harlequin. I posted a picture of that with

1762
01:14:08,120 --> 01:14:13,360
Speaker 4: a like an over under and my profile is banned

1763
01:14:13,400 --> 01:14:15,439
Speaker 4: for nudity because of that duck picture.

1764
01:14:17,200 --> 01:14:21,120
Speaker 3: I was like, what anyway, So aya, that's where I'm at.

1765
01:14:21,160 --> 01:14:25,160
Speaker 4: But yeah, follow on post pictures of mostly hunting stuff,

1766
01:14:25,200 --> 01:14:27,559
Speaker 4: a little bit of calm stuff, but reach out, shoot

1767
01:14:27,560 --> 01:14:30,759
Speaker 4: me a message if I can help you well, generally

1768
01:14:30,800 --> 01:14:34,240
Speaker 4: respond on Instagram relatively quickly, but yeah, if you have

1769
01:14:34,280 --> 01:14:35,120
Speaker 4: any questions.

1770
01:14:34,800 --> 01:14:36,880
Speaker 3: More than happy to help you guys with what I can.

1771
01:14:37,920 --> 01:14:39,880
Speaker 1: But yeah, yeah, I appreciate.

1772
01:14:39,960 --> 01:14:43,719
Speaker 2: I appreciate chatting with you. Usually our conversations or John,

1773
01:14:43,800 --> 01:14:46,800
Speaker 2: I got something's not going right with this this load

1774
01:14:46,960 --> 01:14:49,680
Speaker 2: or this gun or so it's nice to sit down

1775
01:14:49,720 --> 01:14:52,280
Speaker 2: and have a chat about, you know, for sure everything

1776
01:14:52,320 --> 01:14:55,519
Speaker 2: shooting and not even everything like barely scratch the surface

1777
01:14:55,560 --> 01:14:58,639
Speaker 2: on everything shooting. You know, you could probably talk for days,

1778
01:14:58,640 --> 01:15:01,120
Speaker 2: but I appreciate having you. Good luck on all your

1779
01:15:01,160 --> 01:15:02,559
Speaker 2: hunts is here, John, and we'll stay in touch.

1780
01:15:02,840 --> 01:15:04,799
Speaker 3: Thanks you too, Thanks for having me all about.

1781
01:15:07,000 --> 01:15:10,200
Speaker 1: M m.

1782
01:15:12,640 --> 01:15:15,040
Speaker 5: M h

1783
01:15:19,920 --> 01:15:25,080
Speaker 3: M hmmmmmmm