1 00:00:05,240 --> 00:00:07,920 Speaker 1: Hey, this is Annie and Samantha and welcome to Steph. 2 00:00:07,960 --> 00:00:19,120 Speaker 1: I never told you a production of I R Radio. Samantha, 3 00:00:19,239 --> 00:00:23,120 Speaker 1: have you ever gone surfing? No? Have you ever wanted 4 00:00:23,160 --> 00:00:26,799 Speaker 1: to go surfing? Of course, but I feel that my 5 00:00:27,040 --> 00:00:32,839 Speaker 1: lack of coordination m could get me killed. Also, all 6 00:00:32,840 --> 00:00:39,240 Speaker 1: the sharks, I'll s all the sharks. I have gone surfing. 7 00:00:39,280 --> 00:00:41,280 Speaker 1: And let me tell you the thing I was not 8 00:00:41,360 --> 00:00:44,440 Speaker 1: anticipating because I have bad balance. I'm clumsy. We've gotten 9 00:00:44,479 --> 00:00:46,519 Speaker 1: over this. You actually have a lot of upper arm 10 00:00:46,520 --> 00:00:49,479 Speaker 1: strength because you have to you like on a you're 11 00:00:49,520 --> 00:00:51,319 Speaker 1: in a flat position and you have to kind of 12 00:00:51,360 --> 00:00:54,720 Speaker 1: push yourself up into a standing position while on this board. 13 00:00:55,440 --> 00:00:58,400 Speaker 1: And that's where I fell down, literally fell off, I 14 00:00:58,400 --> 00:01:02,880 Speaker 1: guess uh. I did manage it once or twice like 15 00:01:03,040 --> 00:01:06,200 Speaker 1: little baby waves, and it was really fun. But it 16 00:01:06,280 --> 00:01:10,720 Speaker 1: was a lot more difficult then it looked. And this 17 00:01:10,800 --> 00:01:13,319 Speaker 1: is coming from someone who really had just seen Mary 18 00:01:13,400 --> 00:01:16,160 Speaker 1: Kayton Ashley do it in one of their like specials, 19 00:01:16,319 --> 00:01:20,720 Speaker 1: and they made it look really easy. It's not easy. 20 00:01:20,840 --> 00:01:24,080 Speaker 1: I forget often how much you loved Mary Kayton Ashley, 21 00:01:24,160 --> 00:01:27,120 Speaker 1: and then when you remind me that the joy of 22 00:01:27,160 --> 00:01:30,120 Speaker 1: them being like reminded about how much you love them 23 00:01:30,120 --> 00:01:35,120 Speaker 1: and how much they influenced you is a delight. I'm 24 00:01:35,120 --> 00:01:37,080 Speaker 1: glad to hear because I could really crank up the 25 00:01:37,080 --> 00:01:44,440 Speaker 1: Mary kay Ashley references. Yeah, So as this comes out, 26 00:01:44,800 --> 00:01:51,040 Speaker 1: the Olympics Olympics in Tokyo are underway or soon to 27 00:01:51,080 --> 00:01:54,200 Speaker 1: be underway. Obviously a lot is happening, and there's a 28 00:01:54,240 --> 00:01:57,400 Speaker 1: lot of discussion around that, so it could have changed, 29 00:01:57,480 --> 00:02:00,800 Speaker 1: but we did want to bring this up because this 30 00:02:01,200 --> 00:02:06,560 Speaker 1: Olympics marks the first time that there will be a 31 00:02:06,720 --> 00:02:09,600 Speaker 1: surfing event at the Olympics after it was approved in 32 00:02:11,160 --> 00:02:14,480 Speaker 1: and women will be competing in it, uh and there's 33 00:02:14,520 --> 00:02:16,799 Speaker 1: a lot of exciting stuff about that. Of course, there 34 00:02:16,800 --> 00:02:21,200 Speaker 1: are also a lot of conversations about whitewashing of indigenous 35 00:02:21,240 --> 00:02:25,840 Speaker 1: Hawaiian history and and those are important conversations to have. 36 00:02:26,160 --> 00:02:28,280 Speaker 1: But this is something one hundred years in the making 37 00:02:28,320 --> 00:02:31,800 Speaker 1: of trying to get this an Olympic sport, and so 38 00:02:33,120 --> 00:02:35,680 Speaker 1: I'm excited to see how it goes and to see 39 00:02:36,200 --> 00:02:40,720 Speaker 1: what these women pull off at at the Olympics. But 40 00:02:40,840 --> 00:02:44,280 Speaker 1: in the meantime, here is a classic episode about women 41 00:02:44,320 --> 00:02:51,320 Speaker 1: and surfing. Welcome to Stuff Mom Never told you From 42 00:02:51,320 --> 00:02:59,520 Speaker 1: how stuff works dot Com. Hold on, Welcome to the podcast. 43 00:02:59,560 --> 00:03:02,919 Speaker 1: I'm Chris Sin and I'm Caroline. And Caroline I prepared 44 00:03:03,440 --> 00:03:06,840 Speaker 1: so thoroughly for this episode on women and surfing that 45 00:03:06,919 --> 00:03:11,200 Speaker 1: I went to Hawaii. I went. I went to the 46 00:03:11,480 --> 00:03:15,079 Speaker 1: homeland of surfing. Yeah, yeah, you know, I've I've always 47 00:03:15,120 --> 00:03:20,560 Speaker 1: admired your commitment to Okay, granted it, it wasn't for 48 00:03:20,600 --> 00:03:23,040 Speaker 1: stuff I've never told you. But I did just get 49 00:03:23,080 --> 00:03:25,840 Speaker 1: back from Hawaii, and I was so excited to see 50 00:03:26,120 --> 00:03:30,640 Speaker 1: that surfing was next up on our podcast calendar, because 51 00:03:30,639 --> 00:03:34,400 Speaker 1: I was like, oh, I was just there. And by 52 00:03:34,440 --> 00:03:37,280 Speaker 1: the way, listeners in Hawaii, because I know you're out 53 00:03:37,280 --> 00:03:39,120 Speaker 1: there and we're gonna read a letter from one of 54 00:03:39,160 --> 00:03:42,480 Speaker 1: you at the end of the episode. I am in 55 00:03:42,520 --> 00:03:47,560 Speaker 1: love with your state. I wanted to marry it well, 56 00:03:47,560 --> 00:03:52,119 Speaker 1: because I can't unfortunately. Um And then which island would 57 00:03:52,120 --> 00:03:54,280 Speaker 1: I pick? You know, if you married Hawaii, would you 58 00:03:54,320 --> 00:03:56,840 Speaker 1: be marrying all of the islands or would you have 59 00:03:56,960 --> 00:04:03,880 Speaker 1: to you know, just marry Mauie or um. Anyway, Yeah, 60 00:04:03,920 --> 00:04:07,920 Speaker 1: I had never been to Hawaii before, and it just 61 00:04:07,960 --> 00:04:13,680 Speaker 1: blew my mind constantly, as did seeing people surf. How 62 00:04:13,720 --> 00:04:19,640 Speaker 1: about that transition, Caroline Um. When my husband denied were 63 00:04:19,920 --> 00:04:24,440 Speaker 1: on the Big Island. We ended up at a park 64 00:04:24,600 --> 00:04:29,359 Speaker 1: renowned for its surfing, and I just never seen waves 65 00:04:29,440 --> 00:04:34,000 Speaker 1: like that, and then to see people intentionally running out 66 00:04:34,080 --> 00:04:37,880 Speaker 1: into them. Uh, it's just kind of mind blowing. Part 67 00:04:38,040 --> 00:04:41,159 Speaker 1: partly because I'm a horrible swimmer. Oh my god, I 68 00:04:41,640 --> 00:04:44,600 Speaker 1: surfing terrifies me. And I say that as someone who's 69 00:04:44,640 --> 00:04:46,280 Speaker 1: never done it. But I look at pictures of people 70 00:04:46,279 --> 00:04:49,039 Speaker 1: and I'm like, how how how are you staying on 71 00:04:49,080 --> 00:04:53,039 Speaker 1: the board? Like I slip on like concrete in shoes, 72 00:04:53,279 --> 00:04:56,520 Speaker 1: So how how can I stay on a surfboard. Also, 73 00:04:56,800 --> 00:05:00,720 Speaker 1: I will now forever and always is have in my 74 00:05:00,800 --> 00:05:04,359 Speaker 1: head and I know this is ridiculous, but still the 75 00:05:04,480 --> 00:05:08,440 Speaker 1: sight and sound of Kate Bosworth's character and blue Crush 76 00:05:08,600 --> 00:05:11,560 Speaker 1: crack in her head on the rock underwater, and I 77 00:05:11,760 --> 00:05:15,279 Speaker 1: just like, I can't even I'll be I'll be in 78 00:05:15,360 --> 00:05:18,280 Speaker 1: the in the calm waters off of the coast of Georgia, 79 00:05:18,360 --> 00:05:20,640 Speaker 1: like bobbing around in the salt water, and I think 80 00:05:20,680 --> 00:05:23,680 Speaker 1: of that and I'm like, I better paddle back in. Yeah, 81 00:05:23,760 --> 00:05:26,800 Speaker 1: Getty seeing that now like firsthand. I mean I had 82 00:05:26,839 --> 00:05:31,719 Speaker 1: seen surfing before, but I feel like surfing in you know, 83 00:05:32,440 --> 00:05:36,040 Speaker 1: the East coast of the United States, like doesn't really count, um, 84 00:05:36,120 --> 00:05:39,280 Speaker 1: but seeing it for real now, it's it's a bucketless 85 00:05:39,320 --> 00:05:41,880 Speaker 1: thing to just stand on a surfboard. If I can 86 00:05:41,920 --> 00:05:45,880 Speaker 1: do that, I'll be happy. My sister can surf, yeah, 87 00:05:45,920 --> 00:05:48,919 Speaker 1: which is pretty cool. You have to brag. You know 88 00:05:48,960 --> 00:05:52,720 Speaker 1: what we should have done because for our Lady Skateboarding episode, 89 00:05:52,800 --> 00:05:55,880 Speaker 1: we recorded audio of of both of us failing it 90 00:05:56,360 --> 00:05:59,360 Speaker 1: being on a skateboard. I could I could get on 91 00:05:59,400 --> 00:06:03,279 Speaker 1: a surf board and recreate that at a more extreme level. 92 00:06:03,720 --> 00:06:07,320 Speaker 1: Let's go to the beach. Extreme sminty extreme. Yeah, it's 93 00:06:07,320 --> 00:06:10,960 Speaker 1: just me screaming, screaming and then gurgling because I'm underwater. 94 00:06:11,839 --> 00:06:16,360 Speaker 1: Well before, um, you hypothetically drowned totally. Okay, let's drag 95 00:06:16,400 --> 00:06:20,240 Speaker 1: you back to the beach and let's talk about women 96 00:06:20,480 --> 00:06:24,359 Speaker 1: and surfing in the history of surfing, because there's some 97 00:06:24,400 --> 00:06:28,360 Speaker 1: fascinating stuff also some terrible stuff. It's like basically yet 98 00:06:28,400 --> 00:06:32,599 Speaker 1: another lesson in white people being kind of awful. Um. 99 00:06:32,640 --> 00:06:34,800 Speaker 1: But for a quick stat just to kind of keep 100 00:06:34,839 --> 00:06:39,960 Speaker 1: in mind where we're at with women surfing today. From 101 00:06:40,000 --> 00:06:44,480 Speaker 1: the statistics I could find, um, in thees women made 102 00:06:44,520 --> 00:06:48,960 Speaker 1: up just five percent of surfers. My sister surfing. It's 103 00:06:49,040 --> 00:06:53,839 Speaker 1: a statistically pretty rare thing. But now it's over. So 104 00:06:53,880 --> 00:06:58,200 Speaker 1: there are more women surfing than ever before in in 105 00:06:58,240 --> 00:07:04,800 Speaker 1: this era. Um. Although if we go back to the Polynesians, um, 106 00:07:05,000 --> 00:07:09,480 Speaker 1: hundreds and hundreds of years ago, it would be like 107 00:07:09,720 --> 00:07:13,400 Speaker 1: it's pretty much it wasn't It wasn't a thing. Women 108 00:07:13,400 --> 00:07:19,840 Speaker 1: were surfing all the time. So surfing began with the 109 00:07:19,880 --> 00:07:23,840 Speaker 1: Polynesians as early as two thousand b C. According to 110 00:07:23,960 --> 00:07:27,840 Speaker 1: surf historian Ben Finney UM and that was sited in 111 00:07:28,040 --> 00:07:31,920 Speaker 1: the History of Surfing by Matt Warshaw. So basically that 112 00:07:31,960 --> 00:07:38,040 Speaker 1: means that surfing has existed in Hawaii ever since Polynesians 113 00:07:38,320 --> 00:07:43,480 Speaker 1: first settled in that gorgeous archipelago. Oh yes, it is 114 00:07:43,520 --> 00:07:47,360 Speaker 1: so gorgeous. Yeah. And by twelve hundred and that's a 115 00:07:47,440 --> 00:07:51,000 Speaker 1: d that's a long, a long time ago. Uh. Surfing 116 00:07:51,200 --> 00:07:56,520 Speaker 1: was totally a community wide pastime and passion in Hawaii, 117 00:07:56,840 --> 00:08:01,680 Speaker 1: and a nineteenth century Hawaiian sky Allers said, all thought 118 00:08:01,760 --> 00:08:03,760 Speaker 1: of work is at an end. The wife may go 119 00:08:03,960 --> 00:08:06,080 Speaker 1: hungry and the children, but the head of the house 120 00:08:06,120 --> 00:08:09,160 Speaker 1: does not care. All day. There is nothing but surfing 121 00:08:09,440 --> 00:08:13,360 Speaker 1: was this the nineteenth century white scholar, I think so. Um, 122 00:08:13,440 --> 00:08:16,120 Speaker 1: and to say that all day there's nothing but surfing 123 00:08:16,560 --> 00:08:19,360 Speaker 1: was a bit of an exaggeration unless it was during 124 00:08:19,400 --> 00:08:24,280 Speaker 1: that they had like a three month like festival every 125 00:08:24,360 --> 00:08:30,520 Speaker 1: year because again Hawaii's paradise, um, but partially because of 126 00:08:30,560 --> 00:08:36,800 Speaker 1: the just the way that the crops would come in, Um, 127 00:08:36,880 --> 00:08:39,000 Speaker 1: they were able to take this time off. But they 128 00:08:39,000 --> 00:08:41,920 Speaker 1: also took off time every day like pretty much like 129 00:08:42,040 --> 00:08:44,520 Speaker 1: every afternoon, there's like, yeah, I'm out of here, I'm 130 00:08:44,520 --> 00:08:48,880 Speaker 1: gonna go, I'm gonna go. Surf and even surfboards themselves 131 00:08:49,240 --> 00:08:54,000 Speaker 1: in that time had sacred significances and served as status 132 00:08:54,080 --> 00:08:58,560 Speaker 1: symbols because this was not just something that beach bums did. No, no, no, 133 00:08:59,000 --> 00:09:02,680 Speaker 1: this was Jack London would famously right, the sport of 134 00:09:02,760 --> 00:09:08,080 Speaker 1: kings and queen's that's right, because both men and women 135 00:09:08,160 --> 00:09:10,960 Speaker 1: were doing it. If you're living in paradise with all 136 00:09:10,960 --> 00:09:15,520 Speaker 1: these rad waves, why would you not. So ladies would 137 00:09:15,559 --> 00:09:20,400 Speaker 1: surf alongside the dudes, and everybody was naked, naked, they 138 00:09:20,400 --> 00:09:24,120 Speaker 1: were up to something. Um. Yeah. In mythology, we have 139 00:09:24,200 --> 00:09:28,160 Speaker 1: the goddess Mamala, who's a terrific surfer and she had 140 00:09:28,200 --> 00:09:31,920 Speaker 1: to leave her beloved surfer husband who became a shark 141 00:09:31,960 --> 00:09:35,760 Speaker 1: god in morning. Yeah, he was like, Mamala, no, I'll 142 00:09:35,800 --> 00:09:38,880 Speaker 1: become a shark god, which also sounds relation shop chump. 143 00:09:39,040 --> 00:09:41,040 Speaker 1: And then he what did he like, chase around as 144 00:09:41,040 --> 00:09:42,920 Speaker 1: a shark and try to get her back by chomping 145 00:09:43,000 --> 00:09:46,240 Speaker 1: or surf. She had to quit surfing and go marry 146 00:09:46,280 --> 00:09:50,439 Speaker 1: some dude on the mainland. This is the worst I know. Now, 147 00:09:50,440 --> 00:09:55,280 Speaker 1: I'm just thinking of the shark fruit snacks, which is 148 00:09:55,280 --> 00:09:57,760 Speaker 1: weird because I have already had lunch. Um. And then 149 00:09:57,760 --> 00:10:00,840 Speaker 1: there was this other oral tradition that may maintained that 150 00:10:01,000 --> 00:10:07,800 Speaker 1: King Kamehameha and Queen Kaahumanu surved side by side. That's sweet, 151 00:10:08,240 --> 00:10:10,240 Speaker 1: although I would just get so like, give me some 152 00:10:10,360 --> 00:10:13,160 Speaker 1: I could just picture I can picture myself right now 153 00:10:13,280 --> 00:10:16,040 Speaker 1: screaming at my boyfriend to give me more space. You're 154 00:10:16,080 --> 00:10:19,960 Speaker 1: gonna crash into me. I'm gonna get a traumatic head injury. 155 00:10:20,160 --> 00:10:23,480 Speaker 1: Don't take my wave, bro. That would be secondary to 156 00:10:23,480 --> 00:10:25,880 Speaker 1: all the other things i'd be screaming. Well, speaking of 157 00:10:25,920 --> 00:10:30,079 Speaker 1: your boyfriend, Caroline, if you and boyfriend dog we're surfing 158 00:10:30,120 --> 00:10:35,640 Speaker 1: the same wave, um, that would have meant that you 159 00:10:35,679 --> 00:10:41,720 Speaker 1: two were flirting. So apparently in old school Polynesian dating culture, 160 00:10:42,280 --> 00:10:44,920 Speaker 1: if a guy and a girl ended up sort of 161 00:10:44,960 --> 00:10:49,200 Speaker 1: surfing alongside each other, then that was kind of like 162 00:10:49,240 --> 00:10:52,120 Speaker 1: going to third base, and it was totally fine when 163 00:10:52,120 --> 00:10:53,920 Speaker 1: they got back to the beach to then just kind 164 00:10:53,920 --> 00:10:58,800 Speaker 1: of run off and let nature tickets course use the bathroom. 165 00:10:59,000 --> 00:11:03,000 Speaker 1: Oh is that what I mean? Now? I think that's 166 00:11:03,000 --> 00:11:07,719 Speaker 1: when nature calls okay, nature takes well maybe both who knows. 167 00:11:07,760 --> 00:11:09,880 Speaker 1: They went often froliced with some birds and some bees. 168 00:11:09,960 --> 00:11:13,880 Speaker 1: There you go. Yeah. Um, And you know, in competitions 169 00:11:13,920 --> 00:11:17,280 Speaker 1: that were held in Hawaii, women did hold their own 170 00:11:17,320 --> 00:11:21,160 Speaker 1: against the dudes. They often won. I mean, it just 171 00:11:21,200 --> 00:11:23,760 Speaker 1: wasn't a thing. And it wasn't it wasn't it wasn't 172 00:11:23,800 --> 00:11:26,440 Speaker 1: a gendered pursuit. There was no reason why men and 173 00:11:26,480 --> 00:11:30,480 Speaker 1: women would not compete. And one of the very first 174 00:11:31,040 --> 00:11:36,880 Speaker 1: Western records of this Hawaiian surfing is from Captain James Cook, 175 00:11:37,080 --> 00:11:40,920 Speaker 1: the infamous James Cook who royally screwed Hawaii. Um. He 176 00:11:41,040 --> 00:11:46,280 Speaker 1: recounted in his diaries seeing women's surfing as eagerly as 177 00:11:46,320 --> 00:11:48,680 Speaker 1: the men and also going out for the biggest waves. 178 00:11:48,880 --> 00:11:51,960 Speaker 1: So not only were women's surfing alongside the men and 179 00:11:52,080 --> 00:11:56,720 Speaker 1: winning competitions. They were also as aggressive in their surfing 180 00:11:56,840 --> 00:12:00,560 Speaker 1: as dudes were, which is interesting to note because you 181 00:12:00,600 --> 00:12:04,520 Speaker 1: hear a lot today in um the surfing culture about 182 00:12:04,600 --> 00:12:09,200 Speaker 1: how women are less aggressive surfers and are more stylistic, 183 00:12:09,240 --> 00:12:12,400 Speaker 1: whereas men, you know, tend to go for go for 184 00:12:12,440 --> 00:12:16,800 Speaker 1: the big waves, just like Patrick Swayze, Yes and point 185 00:12:16,800 --> 00:12:21,080 Speaker 1: break um. And when it came to surfing segregation, it 186 00:12:21,200 --> 00:12:25,360 Speaker 1: wasn't so much based on gender. It wasn't like men 187 00:12:25,440 --> 00:12:28,440 Speaker 1: and women were surfing separately like we've been hammering home, 188 00:12:29,000 --> 00:12:32,240 Speaker 1: but more by class. So for example, uh, there was 189 00:12:32,280 --> 00:12:37,200 Speaker 1: a Waikiki surf break that was reserved solely for the 190 00:12:37,280 --> 00:12:41,280 Speaker 1: queen's use. Yeah, I love that she had her own 191 00:12:41,280 --> 00:12:44,400 Speaker 1: little surfing area. And there was one queen, um, and 192 00:12:44,440 --> 00:12:49,480 Speaker 1: probably more than one queen, but surfing the spirit of 193 00:12:49,600 --> 00:12:54,280 Speaker 1: Hawaiian King's just cited a queen emma, which also does 194 00:12:54,320 --> 00:12:57,520 Speaker 1: not sound like a Polynesian name. I'm very skeptical of 195 00:12:57,720 --> 00:13:00,280 Speaker 1: this fact, so it might be a fact toid um, 196 00:13:00,320 --> 00:13:05,920 Speaker 1: But apparently this queen had a special surf chant because 197 00:13:06,080 --> 00:13:09,480 Speaker 1: not only would you sometimes have priests come out and 198 00:13:09,640 --> 00:13:12,040 Speaker 1: like shake up the waves, kind of they would actually 199 00:13:12,040 --> 00:13:16,400 Speaker 1: like take their sticks and like agitate the water to 200 00:13:16,440 --> 00:13:19,680 Speaker 1: try to bring sacred sticks, their sacred sticks and their 201 00:13:19,880 --> 00:13:25,880 Speaker 1: their pool noodles, um, to summon the waves. But you 202 00:13:25,880 --> 00:13:31,480 Speaker 1: would also have groups of singers who would essentially, uh 203 00:13:31,520 --> 00:13:34,680 Speaker 1: they were like your hype team, like a pep rally. Yes, 204 00:13:34,920 --> 00:13:37,920 Speaker 1: who would you know, sing these songs just for you 205 00:13:38,320 --> 00:13:41,160 Speaker 1: when you would, uh if you if you were royalty 206 00:13:41,160 --> 00:13:44,200 Speaker 1: of course when you would go out surfing, which also 207 00:13:44,240 --> 00:13:48,400 Speaker 1: reminds me of uh like during baseball games when uh, 208 00:13:48,920 --> 00:13:50,840 Speaker 1: the players will come out to bat and they'll have 209 00:13:50,880 --> 00:13:55,000 Speaker 1: like their own songs, you know, yeah, totally. Well, yeah, 210 00:13:55,000 --> 00:13:56,880 Speaker 1: I wonder if Queen Emma if that was just an 211 00:13:56,920 --> 00:14:01,319 Speaker 1: anglicized like if if Cook's minion just called her that 212 00:14:01,360 --> 00:14:04,880 Speaker 1: because they couldn't pronounce Hawaiian names probably and they were like, oh, 213 00:14:05,120 --> 00:14:07,920 Speaker 1: we're not sure about these native names. We're going to 214 00:14:08,000 --> 00:14:11,600 Speaker 1: give you a white name. Um. Yeah. Actually, speaking of 215 00:14:12,640 --> 00:14:17,640 Speaker 1: Captain Cook, when we were driving through the ConA Coast, 216 00:14:18,240 --> 00:14:22,240 Speaker 1: we passed the site where um, James Cook was murdered 217 00:14:22,240 --> 00:14:25,280 Speaker 1: by a mob and I was like, there you go, 218 00:14:25,680 --> 00:14:29,360 Speaker 1: James Cook, Well did you pass the point where he 219 00:14:29,480 --> 00:14:33,440 Speaker 1: landed in Hawaiian probably. I mean we kind of drove 220 00:14:33,480 --> 00:14:39,040 Speaker 1: around like everywhere that you could drive, but it was 221 00:14:39,080 --> 00:14:43,680 Speaker 1: more memorable and and noted on the National Geographic Matt 222 00:14:43,760 --> 00:14:45,640 Speaker 1: that I was looking at like he just had a 223 00:14:45,680 --> 00:14:48,680 Speaker 1: skull and cross him. Here's the point where he died. 224 00:14:48,680 --> 00:14:51,920 Speaker 1: But still so much stuff was named after him, and 225 00:14:52,040 --> 00:14:57,600 Speaker 1: so so many Christian churches in that particular area of 226 00:14:57,640 --> 00:15:00,760 Speaker 1: the Big Island. So when Cook showed up in why 227 00:15:00,920 --> 00:15:04,840 Speaker 1: he brought his Western white guy fear of the sea 228 00:15:04,960 --> 00:15:08,240 Speaker 1: respect and fear of the sea as a source of death. 229 00:15:08,280 --> 00:15:11,280 Speaker 1: It could kill you. It's it's fatal. It's not somewhere 230 00:15:11,280 --> 00:15:14,240 Speaker 1: that you jump into and ride the waves for leisure. 231 00:15:14,560 --> 00:15:19,160 Speaker 1: So of course they interpreted the sight of these people, 232 00:15:19,320 --> 00:15:24,240 Speaker 1: these savages as they would call them, going willingly out 233 00:15:24,280 --> 00:15:30,920 Speaker 1: into the water as just bonkers. Thank you. I could 234 00:15:30,920 --> 00:15:33,800 Speaker 1: not think of the word because it was so bonkers. Yeah, 235 00:15:33,840 --> 00:15:38,520 Speaker 1: I mean, they couldn't fathom it. Um. And speaking of 236 00:15:38,520 --> 00:15:42,640 Speaker 1: the nudity, of course that's scandalized the Calvinist missionaries who 237 00:15:42,720 --> 00:15:46,040 Speaker 1: showed up in eighteen nineteen, who are like, no, we 238 00:15:46,160 --> 00:15:52,600 Speaker 1: must put on clothes. And in fact missionaries are usually 239 00:15:52,640 --> 00:15:57,760 Speaker 1: the ones blamed for the initial demise of surfing in Hawaii. 240 00:15:58,120 --> 00:16:01,600 Speaker 1: But in fact, as Matt Warshaw notes in the History 241 00:16:01,640 --> 00:16:09,080 Speaker 1: of Surfing that bye when Queen Lily Kalana abdicates her throne, 242 00:16:09,720 --> 00:16:13,000 Speaker 1: the demise of surfing was really more to blame on 243 00:16:13,160 --> 00:16:19,760 Speaker 1: Captain Cook because he brought disease with him. I mean, 244 00:16:19,800 --> 00:16:22,520 Speaker 1: so in the missionaries, he brought a jar of disease, 245 00:16:22,960 --> 00:16:27,160 Speaker 1: and of course Native Hawaiians didn't have the immune systems 246 00:16:27,200 --> 00:16:31,000 Speaker 1: to combat these foreign diseases. So you have just the 247 00:16:31,000 --> 00:16:36,160 Speaker 1: basic population uh demise that happened. But then too, there's 248 00:16:36,160 --> 00:16:38,760 Speaker 1: an economic factor where you have a shift from a 249 00:16:38,800 --> 00:16:43,359 Speaker 1: bartering economy to a cash based economy that was dominated 250 00:16:43,360 --> 00:16:47,240 Speaker 1: by sugarcane. Yeah, because they were at work all day. Yeah, 251 00:16:47,360 --> 00:16:49,640 Speaker 1: they couldn't just drop things and go surfing like they 252 00:16:49,640 --> 00:16:52,400 Speaker 1: wanted to, which was perfectly fine. They had like subsisted 253 00:16:53,240 --> 00:16:56,400 Speaker 1: just fine like that for a long time. I know. 254 00:16:56,520 --> 00:16:58,720 Speaker 1: And what's interesting, and we'll we'll hit on this a 255 00:16:58,760 --> 00:17:02,720 Speaker 1: little bit in a minute, is that when you see 256 00:17:02,760 --> 00:17:06,520 Speaker 1: surfing emerge in the quote unquote modern era, especially as 257 00:17:06,960 --> 00:17:12,440 Speaker 1: you know in California, people who adopted the surfing lifestyle 258 00:17:12,560 --> 00:17:14,440 Speaker 1: went back to that idea of like, I don't want 259 00:17:14,440 --> 00:17:16,080 Speaker 1: to be working all day, I want to be able 260 00:17:16,119 --> 00:17:18,600 Speaker 1: to go surf. And it was like so rebellious too, 261 00:17:19,560 --> 00:17:23,280 Speaker 1: to have a different type of masculinity in this case 262 00:17:23,359 --> 00:17:26,439 Speaker 1: of of saying no to the office culture and saying 263 00:17:26,520 --> 00:17:29,199 Speaker 1: yes to being on the board all day, being on 264 00:17:29,240 --> 00:17:31,520 Speaker 1: the board, being on the board, not in the boardroom. 265 00:17:31,720 --> 00:17:34,680 Speaker 1: That's right, I didn't even mean to do that. Well, 266 00:17:34,720 --> 00:17:38,600 Speaker 1: in addition to the sport itself disappearing for a little while, 267 00:17:38,800 --> 00:17:44,480 Speaker 1: you also have Christianity uprooting surfing related religious customs, and 268 00:17:44,640 --> 00:17:49,080 Speaker 1: also cooler dancing and lais being banned. Essentially, they just 269 00:17:49,119 --> 00:17:54,880 Speaker 1: wanted to erase Native culture, which is you know, same song, 270 00:17:55,600 --> 00:17:59,879 Speaker 1: different verse. And on top of that, you have fewer people, 271 00:18:00,040 --> 00:18:03,440 Speaker 1: if you are Native people than ever before who even 272 00:18:03,520 --> 00:18:08,000 Speaker 1: recalled and would have practiced those things because those diseases 273 00:18:08,040 --> 00:18:12,359 Speaker 1: that we mentioned, like syphilis, tuberculosis, the flu, etcetera um 274 00:18:12,720 --> 00:18:16,600 Speaker 1: decimated the Native population from around four hundred thousand to 275 00:18:16,800 --> 00:18:22,760 Speaker 1: just thirty thousand. Yeah, that's insane, that's insane. These missionaries 276 00:18:23,160 --> 00:18:28,480 Speaker 1: and cook we're the worst. I'm sorry. It's colonialism. Colonialism 277 00:18:28,480 --> 00:18:31,280 Speaker 1: really just it's it's the worst. I don't think there's 278 00:18:31,280 --> 00:18:35,960 Speaker 1: any form of like gentle colonialism. Yeah no. Um, But 279 00:18:36,160 --> 00:18:38,960 Speaker 1: in nineteen o seven we start to see a slow 280 00:18:39,880 --> 00:18:44,199 Speaker 1: start to surfing revival in Wiki Ki. But here we 281 00:18:44,280 --> 00:18:47,159 Speaker 1: have it being segregated by gender. It was for dudes only, 282 00:18:47,440 --> 00:18:51,960 Speaker 1: which I would bet that that has to do with 283 00:18:53,040 --> 00:18:58,760 Speaker 1: Christianity and that whole like Judeo christian Um gender role 284 00:18:58,880 --> 00:19:03,080 Speaker 1: division probably being fairly set in stone by that point. Yeah, 285 00:19:03,160 --> 00:19:05,560 Speaker 1: where it wouldn't have been as appropriate for women to 286 00:19:05,600 --> 00:19:08,359 Speaker 1: be out there alongside the men. Yeah, so it's okay 287 00:19:08,359 --> 00:19:12,320 Speaker 1: for dudes to pursue this pastime. But it starts to spread, 288 00:19:12,400 --> 00:19:16,520 Speaker 1: like word of the surfing thing starts to spread first 289 00:19:16,600 --> 00:19:21,960 Speaker 1: with Jack London, who um goes to Honolulu in nineteen 290 00:19:22,000 --> 00:19:25,919 Speaker 1: ten or nineteen eleven. He learns to surf and writes 291 00:19:26,000 --> 00:19:31,000 Speaker 1: about it first for Women's Home Companion magazine. I love that, um, 292 00:19:31,040 --> 00:19:33,679 Speaker 1: but then an essay about it was published later in 293 00:19:33,760 --> 00:19:37,440 Speaker 1: his book Cruise of the Snark. That's actually, funnily enough, 294 00:19:37,480 --> 00:19:40,280 Speaker 1: that's the name of my memoir, Cruise of the Snark. 295 00:19:41,040 --> 00:19:44,680 Speaker 1: Love it, but then off the page. Hawaiian Olympic medalist 296 00:19:44,840 --> 00:19:50,520 Speaker 1: Duke Kahana Moku was essentially the surfing evangelist. He introduced 297 00:19:50,520 --> 00:19:55,040 Speaker 1: surfing to Australia, New Zealand and southern California in the 298 00:19:55,119 --> 00:19:57,600 Speaker 1: nineteen tents and thirties. He would actually, I mean literally 299 00:19:57,600 --> 00:20:01,200 Speaker 1: introducing it. He would go there and lead to instrations, 300 00:20:01,280 --> 00:20:04,840 Speaker 1: and I mean he was already known for being a 301 00:20:04,880 --> 00:20:11,520 Speaker 1: fantastic athlete, but he, you know, popularized this surfing thing, 302 00:20:11,880 --> 00:20:16,040 Speaker 1: this surfing thing that I have just an ingrained, innate 303 00:20:16,119 --> 00:20:19,960 Speaker 1: fear of. Um. Well around this time, though, I mean, 304 00:20:20,040 --> 00:20:22,399 Speaker 1: what are what are the women doing if they're not 305 00:20:22,480 --> 00:20:25,840 Speaker 1: allowed they're watching they're not allowed to surf. They're being 306 00:20:25,920 --> 00:20:28,760 Speaker 1: beach babes or beach bunnies as they were called. Yeah, 307 00:20:28,800 --> 00:20:31,840 Speaker 1: there's this horrific quote where I literally had to be like, 308 00:20:32,200 --> 00:20:36,680 Speaker 1: you don't know anything, John Snow, you know nothing. Um 309 00:20:37,640 --> 00:20:42,040 Speaker 1: nineteen sixty six world champion Not Young was quoted in 310 00:20:42,160 --> 00:20:47,199 Speaker 1: Surfing magazine as saying girls shouldn't surf. They make fools 311 00:20:47,200 --> 00:20:49,840 Speaker 1: of themselves. And I literally, I'm not kidding you, out 312 00:20:49,840 --> 00:20:53,960 Speaker 1: loud by myself to the computer screen, said you are 313 00:20:54,080 --> 00:20:58,440 Speaker 1: so ignorant. And that's why it's important to talk about 314 00:20:58,480 --> 00:21:02,480 Speaker 1: stuff like this sidebar, because if you lose the history 315 00:21:02,520 --> 00:21:06,879 Speaker 1: of a thing you don't realize that women have had 316 00:21:07,600 --> 00:21:11,320 Speaker 1: just as much of a history and a place in 317 00:21:11,440 --> 00:21:15,640 Speaker 1: this sport among so many others. And you don't get 318 00:21:15,680 --> 00:21:18,880 Speaker 1: to decide that women shouldn't do it because they'll make 319 00:21:18,920 --> 00:21:22,720 Speaker 1: fools of themselves. This was once an egalitarian pursuit for 320 00:21:22,760 --> 00:21:25,480 Speaker 1: the people who invented it. Shouldn't we ask the people 321 00:21:25,480 --> 00:21:28,880 Speaker 1: who invented it? Yeah? Yeah, I think I think Natt 322 00:21:28,920 --> 00:21:32,000 Speaker 1: Young should have. Maybe if he's alive, maybe he'll listen 323 00:21:32,040 --> 00:21:36,719 Speaker 1: to this podcast shake shake the ignorance right out of him. Well, 324 00:21:36,760 --> 00:21:41,600 Speaker 1: in this episode two very much parallels our skateboarding two 325 00:21:41,720 --> 00:21:46,520 Speaker 1: parter because these subcultures, uh, we're developing alongside each other. 326 00:21:46,560 --> 00:21:52,119 Speaker 1: I mean, skateboarding came out of surfing culture. So even 327 00:21:52,160 --> 00:21:55,600 Speaker 1: before skateboarding was really kicking up in the nineties and fifties, 328 00:21:55,640 --> 00:21:59,480 Speaker 1: you did have a few women making names for themselves 329 00:21:59,600 --> 00:22:01,760 Speaker 1: on the waves. UM. And there were a group of 330 00:22:01,800 --> 00:22:04,840 Speaker 1: them that formed, and this is in southern California, UM, 331 00:22:04,920 --> 00:22:09,439 Speaker 1: the Hailey Nalu Club to band together. So from the 332 00:22:09,480 --> 00:22:12,960 Speaker 1: get go you kind of have women finding each other 333 00:22:13,040 --> 00:22:15,120 Speaker 1: because there are so few of them and being like, Okay, 334 00:22:15,160 --> 00:22:17,400 Speaker 1: let's stick together, let's have a club. Because you would 335 00:22:17,440 --> 00:22:19,199 Speaker 1: also kind of have to stake out your part of 336 00:22:19,240 --> 00:22:22,200 Speaker 1: the beach guys in the same way that they could 337 00:22:22,280 --> 00:22:26,960 Speaker 1: be hostile at skate parks or at whatever sweet skate 338 00:22:27,040 --> 00:22:31,240 Speaker 1: spots they found. You know, I didn't necessarily want girls 339 00:22:31,280 --> 00:22:35,400 Speaker 1: hanging around, that's right. But then you get the development 340 00:22:36,440 --> 00:22:40,800 Speaker 1: by designer Joe Quig of this lighter balsa wood surfboard 341 00:22:40,840 --> 00:22:44,720 Speaker 1: that women were using because the older traditional surfboards were 342 00:22:44,880 --> 00:22:46,840 Speaker 1: really heavy. I mean they were huge. They could weigh 343 00:22:46,840 --> 00:22:48,960 Speaker 1: a hundred pounds and that was that was hard to 344 00:22:49,000 --> 00:22:51,520 Speaker 1: carry no matter who you were. So the women started 345 00:22:51,600 --> 00:22:54,840 Speaker 1: using them, and then total I roll of course, like 346 00:22:54,880 --> 00:22:57,840 Speaker 1: their boyfriends started borrowing them or their guy friends or 347 00:22:57,880 --> 00:23:00,640 Speaker 1: brothers or dads or whoever. And the guys were like, oh, 348 00:23:00,680 --> 00:23:03,760 Speaker 1: this is uh, this is a stupid girl thing, but 349 00:23:03,920 --> 00:23:08,440 Speaker 1: like it actually makes surfing a lot better. And designer 350 00:23:08,640 --> 00:23:12,639 Speaker 1: Quig even said the men were jealous. A lot of 351 00:23:12,640 --> 00:23:15,080 Speaker 1: people don't want to admit that, but a lot of 352 00:23:15,119 --> 00:23:18,240 Speaker 1: the big name Malibu guys did not like women out 353 00:23:18,280 --> 00:23:21,080 Speaker 1: there looking that good. Oh yeah, I mean because you 354 00:23:21,080 --> 00:23:23,159 Speaker 1: have people like not Young just being like, yeah, they 355 00:23:23,200 --> 00:23:26,879 Speaker 1: make fools themselves. Shut up, net young, I have you 356 00:23:26,920 --> 00:23:30,200 Speaker 1: know what you want to talk about hostility. I've got 357 00:23:30,200 --> 00:23:32,800 Speaker 1: a lot of hostility pin up that's being directed at 358 00:23:32,880 --> 00:23:35,119 Speaker 1: Nat Young, But he's a stand in for all of 359 00:23:35,200 --> 00:23:38,800 Speaker 1: the dudes who were painting on women at this time. Um. 360 00:23:38,840 --> 00:23:43,120 Speaker 1: But we get this huge cultural moment in the fifties 361 00:23:43,720 --> 00:23:47,000 Speaker 1: with Gidget, And that's a ridiculous sentence. I admit it. 362 00:23:47,000 --> 00:23:49,800 Speaker 1: It's a totally ridiculous sentence, but it's true. I had 363 00:23:49,840 --> 00:23:54,160 Speaker 1: no idea what an influence Gidget had. So in case 364 00:23:54,240 --> 00:23:58,040 Speaker 1: you are mixing up like I did originally in my 365 00:23:58,080 --> 00:24:01,720 Speaker 1: brain Gidget with the Flying nun because both were played 366 00:24:01,720 --> 00:24:04,520 Speaker 1: by Sally Field, I assure you that Gidget is a 367 00:24:04,520 --> 00:24:08,000 Speaker 1: cute little California surfer girl, or as the Flying Nun 368 00:24:08,080 --> 00:24:10,800 Speaker 1: is the Flying nun um. But it was originally a 369 00:24:10,800 --> 00:24:14,600 Speaker 1: book in nineteen fifty seven by Frederick Koner about his 370 00:24:14,760 --> 00:24:19,520 Speaker 1: real life Malibu surfing daughter Cathy that gave way to 371 00:24:19,600 --> 00:24:24,480 Speaker 1: Hollywood's first surfing film in nineteen fifty nine, starring Sandra 372 00:24:24,600 --> 00:24:28,320 Speaker 1: d We would get two more movies and then get 373 00:24:28,359 --> 00:24:32,640 Speaker 1: the nineteen sixty five TV show Gidget starring Sally Field, 374 00:24:33,240 --> 00:24:36,239 Speaker 1: and it had a huge influence on both girls and 375 00:24:36,320 --> 00:24:40,080 Speaker 1: guys like, not only hey girls, you can surf, but 376 00:24:40,160 --> 00:24:42,719 Speaker 1: hey people, this is the thing you can do, and 377 00:24:42,720 --> 00:24:47,080 Speaker 1: it's really fun. It's a cool cultural moment. Yeah. And um, 378 00:24:47,280 --> 00:24:51,720 Speaker 1: from what I can remember watching the Gidget movies as 379 00:24:51,760 --> 00:24:56,080 Speaker 1: a kid, which I did, and no I'm not seventy. Um, 380 00:24:56,880 --> 00:25:02,399 Speaker 1: I really enjoyed them. But there was always conflict of like, Gidget, 381 00:25:02,720 --> 00:25:05,879 Speaker 1: you you're going out there and serving with the boys. 382 00:25:05,920 --> 00:25:09,960 Speaker 1: And she had a crush on boy named Moondoggie, and he, 383 00:25:10,040 --> 00:25:14,280 Speaker 1: of course was kind of the um, like the native 384 00:25:14,920 --> 00:25:18,920 Speaker 1: stand in um who wasn't like those annoying white boys 385 00:25:18,960 --> 00:25:21,199 Speaker 1: who didn't think that she didn't belong on the beach, 386 00:25:21,520 --> 00:25:24,720 Speaker 1: you know. But it was very transgressive in her own 387 00:25:24,760 --> 00:25:28,320 Speaker 1: way for for Gidget to be surfing, and she always 388 00:25:28,359 --> 00:25:32,480 Speaker 1: surprised people with how well she could surf. Yeah, and 389 00:25:32,520 --> 00:25:35,160 Speaker 1: there's a lot of writing out there about how Gidget 390 00:25:35,680 --> 00:25:41,280 Speaker 1: supposedly presented this alternative masculinity and femininity, these other options 391 00:25:41,320 --> 00:25:44,760 Speaker 1: for people, because I mean, Gidget was sort of a 392 00:25:44,920 --> 00:25:47,720 Speaker 1: rebel in hanging out with a boy who was so 393 00:25:47,840 --> 00:25:50,840 Speaker 1: different from the rest and allowed her to be different 394 00:25:50,880 --> 00:25:54,520 Speaker 1: as well. And these surfer guys, they were, like we said, 395 00:25:54,560 --> 00:25:57,800 Speaker 1: they were saying no to the stuffy suits in the 396 00:25:57,880 --> 00:26:01,600 Speaker 1: offices and the conform many of the Cold War era, 397 00:26:02,200 --> 00:26:04,800 Speaker 1: and they were hitting the beach to to go surfing. 398 00:26:05,440 --> 00:26:07,199 Speaker 1: But you've got to keep in mind though, at the 399 00:26:07,280 --> 00:26:11,840 Speaker 1: same time, by the sixties and seventies, white dudes in particular, 400 00:26:11,840 --> 00:26:15,840 Speaker 1: we're really starting to act as gatekeepers to this sport, 401 00:26:16,000 --> 00:26:20,240 Speaker 1: this pastime. And so in the seventies you see more 402 00:26:20,359 --> 00:26:25,800 Speaker 1: women banding together to start surfing, start groups to help 403 00:26:25,920 --> 00:26:29,840 Speaker 1: each other into the surfing realm um. But it's also 404 00:26:30,000 --> 00:26:33,480 Speaker 1: helped along by a little thing called Title nine. Yeah. 405 00:26:33,520 --> 00:26:37,359 Speaker 1: This was something highlighted by authors Peter Westwick and Peter 406 00:26:37,720 --> 00:26:41,879 Speaker 1: Nushel in the World and the Curl and Unconventional History 407 00:26:41,880 --> 00:26:46,800 Speaker 1: of Surfing. They attributed the rise of womens surfing in 408 00:26:46,840 --> 00:26:50,639 Speaker 1: that era to the nineteen seventy two passage of Title nine, 409 00:26:51,119 --> 00:26:56,560 Speaker 1: which coincidentally was sponsored by Hawaii Senator Patsy mink Um. 410 00:26:56,640 --> 00:26:58,639 Speaker 1: And for those of you who have who haven't listened 411 00:26:58,640 --> 00:27:04,800 Speaker 1: to our episode on Title nine, um, it essentially enabled 412 00:27:05,320 --> 00:27:10,840 Speaker 1: girls athletics, women's athletics UM to happen. Um. So because 413 00:27:11,680 --> 00:27:14,760 Speaker 1: swimming is part of you know, school athletics, and you 414 00:27:14,800 --> 00:27:18,560 Speaker 1: have more girls swimming competitively, girls are in the water, 415 00:27:18,800 --> 00:27:23,920 Speaker 1: so you have more girls just being naturally led to surfing. Yeah, 416 00:27:23,960 --> 00:27:28,000 Speaker 1: but it is that sort of in the midst of 417 00:27:28,040 --> 00:27:30,840 Speaker 1: the second wave, I guess of feminism. You do have 418 00:27:30,960 --> 00:27:35,879 Speaker 1: a lot of pushback from dudes against women asserting their 419 00:27:36,000 --> 00:27:38,240 Speaker 1: right to participate in these things. And it's because of 420 00:27:38,280 --> 00:27:42,480 Speaker 1: that hostility that you see women's starting groups for themselves. 421 00:27:42,520 --> 00:27:45,359 Speaker 1: So in ninety five you get the formation of the 422 00:27:45,400 --> 00:27:50,320 Speaker 1: Women's International Surfing Association, in the late seventies you get 423 00:27:50,320 --> 00:27:54,280 Speaker 1: the women Professional Surfing Association, And these groups were basically 424 00:27:54,359 --> 00:27:58,800 Speaker 1: directly formed in response to the hostility that women were 425 00:27:58,800 --> 00:28:01,520 Speaker 1: facing who were just trying to surf. Yeah, I mean, 426 00:28:01,560 --> 00:28:04,960 Speaker 1: because while you have these super athletic women who were 427 00:28:05,000 --> 00:28:09,280 Speaker 1: really focused on the sport, you also have this environment 428 00:28:09,640 --> 00:28:14,240 Speaker 1: of sexism, not only of people not wanting them to surf, 429 00:28:14,280 --> 00:28:20,200 Speaker 1: but also of just relegating women to be like sexual objects, 430 00:28:20,520 --> 00:28:24,119 Speaker 1: tanning themselves on the beach and watching the guys. So 431 00:28:24,240 --> 00:28:28,680 Speaker 1: you have this kind of sexified, if you will, image 432 00:28:28,760 --> 00:28:31,440 Speaker 1: of if she's gonna surf, well, she should at least 433 00:28:31,440 --> 00:28:34,840 Speaker 1: like look sexy when she's going to do it. But 434 00:28:34,920 --> 00:28:37,919 Speaker 1: then in the nineties, probably largely due to all of 435 00:28:37,960 --> 00:28:41,760 Speaker 1: that grassroots organizing that those women were doing. In the seventies, 436 00:28:42,080 --> 00:28:45,760 Speaker 1: we start to see more of a girl focused surfer 437 00:28:45,800 --> 00:28:50,560 Speaker 1: culture arising. That came with independent clothing lines and surfboard lines, 438 00:28:50,920 --> 00:28:56,680 Speaker 1: surfing schools, and surf magazines all focused on women. But 439 00:28:57,120 --> 00:28:59,280 Speaker 1: it seems like that period of time is so short 440 00:28:59,360 --> 00:29:03,400 Speaker 1: before it's quickly modified. Well yeah, I mean, did you 441 00:29:03,440 --> 00:29:05,320 Speaker 1: get all those catalogs at your house when you were 442 00:29:05,320 --> 00:29:08,720 Speaker 1: growing up? I remember getting a Roxy catalog. Yeah, I 443 00:29:08,720 --> 00:29:11,600 Speaker 1: I got all of those like Roxy Quicksilver things because 444 00:29:11,640 --> 00:29:14,000 Speaker 1: I think that stuff was also sold a lot of 445 00:29:14,040 --> 00:29:16,240 Speaker 1: it by like Delia's and things like that. It was 446 00:29:16,280 --> 00:29:18,920 Speaker 1: definitely like super mall fashion. You can find it at Journeys, 447 00:29:18,960 --> 00:29:24,000 Speaker 1: which still exists. Journeys. Whoa flashbag? Yeah seriously, But I 448 00:29:24,120 --> 00:29:26,360 Speaker 1: just that is so burned into my brain that like 449 00:29:26,480 --> 00:29:31,720 Speaker 1: cool girl Roxy fashion with the short little board shorts. Um, 450 00:29:31,760 --> 00:29:35,760 Speaker 1: you know, she's so tan, she's got bleached hair because 451 00:29:35,760 --> 00:29:39,280 Speaker 1: she's been in the sun. Um. Like that was such 452 00:29:39,320 --> 00:29:42,400 Speaker 1: a big fashion moment as far as I can recall 453 00:29:42,480 --> 00:29:44,800 Speaker 1: being someone growing up in the nineties. Well, and it's 454 00:29:44,840 --> 00:29:50,920 Speaker 1: because there were four big surf brands Quicksilver, Billabong, Rip Curl, 455 00:29:51,040 --> 00:29:56,400 Speaker 1: and O'Neill that saw girls getting more interested in surfing 456 00:29:56,600 --> 00:29:59,680 Speaker 1: and saw an opportunity to make a lot of money. 457 00:29:59,680 --> 00:30:03,160 Speaker 1: So there like, oh, let's make a new line off 458 00:30:03,320 --> 00:30:05,920 Speaker 1: just for girls, to start making stuff for girls, and 459 00:30:05,960 --> 00:30:10,160 Speaker 1: so they essentially put a lot of the independent lines 460 00:30:10,240 --> 00:30:13,440 Speaker 1: out of business. Well they did, but at the same time, 461 00:30:14,000 --> 00:30:16,640 Speaker 1: the incredible amount of focus that went into marketing that 462 00:30:16,720 --> 00:30:22,920 Speaker 1: stuff to this new arena of consumers that then served 463 00:30:23,000 --> 00:30:26,080 Speaker 1: to open the door to more girls and women like 464 00:30:26,200 --> 00:30:28,240 Speaker 1: me getting a catalog at my house being like, oh, 465 00:30:28,280 --> 00:30:30,320 Speaker 1: this is something to do, Like this is something I 466 00:30:30,360 --> 00:30:32,760 Speaker 1: can do, and hear the clothes and the equipment I 467 00:30:32,800 --> 00:30:36,720 Speaker 1: need to do it. Um. So it was ushering more 468 00:30:36,760 --> 00:30:40,440 Speaker 1: girls and women into surfing or at least dressing like 469 00:30:40,480 --> 00:30:45,080 Speaker 1: a surfer, right, But you still had that image that 470 00:30:45,160 --> 00:30:48,320 Speaker 1: was being sold to you that was very specific. And 471 00:30:48,400 --> 00:30:51,480 Speaker 1: so we will talk more about that image and sexism 472 00:30:51,480 --> 00:31:05,840 Speaker 1: and surfing when we come right back from a quick break. So, 473 00:31:05,840 --> 00:31:07,840 Speaker 1: speaking to The l A Times a couple of years 474 00:31:07,840 --> 00:31:12,960 Speaker 1: ago about sexism in the surfing industry, Matt Warshaw said 475 00:31:13,120 --> 00:31:17,160 Speaker 1: the sport has had a long fairly shameful history of 476 00:31:17,200 --> 00:31:21,880 Speaker 1: sexism and it's still not over. And a lot of 477 00:31:21,920 --> 00:31:24,560 Speaker 1: it I think has to do with how the girl 478 00:31:24,680 --> 00:31:28,400 Speaker 1: culture was quickly commodified, and it's somewhat has to do 479 00:31:28,480 --> 00:31:31,760 Speaker 1: with the lasting image of Gidget, who, yes, in a 480 00:31:31,760 --> 00:31:34,240 Speaker 1: lot of ways could be seen as an empowering figure, 481 00:31:34,320 --> 00:31:38,800 Speaker 1: but she was also a conventionally attractive, thin, blonde girl. 482 00:31:39,000 --> 00:31:41,040 Speaker 1: You know who you know. Fast forward to two thousand 483 00:31:41,120 --> 00:31:44,680 Speaker 1: two and she's Kate Bosworth and Blue Crush. Yeah, you've 484 00:31:44,720 --> 00:31:47,680 Speaker 1: got to be cute and little and wearing a little 485 00:31:47,720 --> 00:31:51,320 Speaker 1: string bikini. And that's the image, like we were saying, like, 486 00:31:51,360 --> 00:31:54,000 Speaker 1: that's the image that has served up to consumers of 487 00:31:54,040 --> 00:31:56,520 Speaker 1: what a girls surfer supposed to look like. Yeah, because 488 00:31:56,520 --> 00:31:58,600 Speaker 1: it's like, if you're gonna if you're gonna do this 489 00:31:58,640 --> 00:32:02,480 Speaker 1: guy thing, needs to need to look sexy for us 490 00:32:02,520 --> 00:32:05,480 Speaker 1: while you're doing it. You know, Yeah, I've all just 491 00:32:05,600 --> 00:32:07,520 Speaker 1: rolled out of my head. But if we look at 492 00:32:07,560 --> 00:32:11,320 Speaker 1: competitive surfing, UM one big issue which has come up 493 00:32:11,320 --> 00:32:16,680 Speaker 1: in pretty much every sport there has been UM there's 494 00:32:16,800 --> 00:32:21,680 Speaker 1: a wage gap. So although some competitions have leveled their 495 00:32:21,680 --> 00:32:25,360 Speaker 1: winnings for male and female competitions, UM in Nurtia magazine 496 00:32:25,400 --> 00:32:29,200 Speaker 1: reported that women took home just t of the pro 497 00:32:29,360 --> 00:32:33,240 Speaker 1: surfing money in nine and that number increased to a 498 00:32:33,280 --> 00:32:40,120 Speaker 1: whopping in two thousand and eleven. Yeah, the World Surfly 499 00:32:40,240 --> 00:32:43,840 Speaker 1: did announce prize money paroity for male and female winners, 500 00:32:43,840 --> 00:32:47,200 Speaker 1: but I don't I think they're in the minority, correct, Like, 501 00:32:47,280 --> 00:32:52,000 Speaker 1: it's still it's still very unequal um And a lot 502 00:32:52,080 --> 00:32:57,680 Speaker 1: of the issue around making money comes down to sponsorships 503 00:32:57,800 --> 00:33:01,920 Speaker 1: because these brands who sponsor or surfing competitions and individual 504 00:33:02,000 --> 00:33:08,479 Speaker 1: surfers want marketable women, and that means looking like a model, 505 00:33:08,720 --> 00:33:13,000 Speaker 1: being a model, looking like a Kate Bosworth UM, and 506 00:33:13,080 --> 00:33:19,080 Speaker 1: also performing a very specific type of straight femininity UM. 507 00:33:19,200 --> 00:33:24,520 Speaker 1: For instance, in uh Rad, Lady Jodie Cooper became the 508 00:33:24,640 --> 00:33:29,040 Speaker 1: first pro surfer to come out. But there are so 509 00:33:29,080 --> 00:33:33,040 Speaker 1: many other surfer women who say that they have to 510 00:33:33,160 --> 00:33:36,400 Speaker 1: stay in the closet or at least try to appear 511 00:33:36,560 --> 00:33:41,040 Speaker 1: more feminine and straight to stay sponsored, because it can 512 00:33:41,120 --> 00:33:44,400 Speaker 1: cost tens and tens of thousands of dollars if you 513 00:33:44,480 --> 00:33:49,120 Speaker 1: don't have a sponsor to pursue this as your whole life, 514 00:33:49,240 --> 00:33:51,400 Speaker 1: your lifestyle. And who was it you were telling me 515 00:33:51,440 --> 00:33:56,720 Speaker 1: about who talked about guys specifically on the beach, yelling 516 00:33:56,800 --> 00:34:00,760 Speaker 1: homophobic slurs at her to throw her off her surfing game. Yeah, 517 00:34:00,800 --> 00:34:04,120 Speaker 1: so Claire Sullivan, not Claire Sullivan, but Claire Sullivan wrote 518 00:34:04,400 --> 00:34:08,120 Speaker 1: a piece for one of these surfing websites that we 519 00:34:08,120 --> 00:34:11,000 Speaker 1: were looking at, and she anonymously quoted a whole bunch 520 00:34:11,000 --> 00:34:13,759 Speaker 1: of women because the whole issue is these women are 521 00:34:13,800 --> 00:34:15,239 Speaker 1: at the top of their game and they don't want 522 00:34:15,280 --> 00:34:16,600 Speaker 1: to be out it because they don't want to lose 523 00:34:16,640 --> 00:34:20,839 Speaker 1: their sponsorships. And she talked to a woman who said, yeah, 524 00:34:20,880 --> 00:34:24,839 Speaker 1: you know, it's ridiculous. I uh, you know, I had 525 00:34:24,840 --> 00:34:28,560 Speaker 1: a girlfriend at the time, and guys before competitions would 526 00:34:28,600 --> 00:34:31,000 Speaker 1: be screaming homophobic things at me to throw me off 527 00:34:31,040 --> 00:34:34,239 Speaker 1: my game. And at this point, listeners, I like turned 528 00:34:34,239 --> 00:34:36,200 Speaker 1: to Christen as I'm reading this, and I'm just going like, 529 00:34:36,239 --> 00:34:39,600 Speaker 1: who cares? Not about the homophobia. We should care about 530 00:34:39,640 --> 00:34:43,479 Speaker 1: the homophobia, but who who cares about people being gay? 531 00:34:43,800 --> 00:34:46,920 Speaker 1: You know? And I understand that my viewpoint isn't the 532 00:34:46,960 --> 00:34:49,560 Speaker 1: viewpoint that everyone shares, but it's like, who cares if 533 00:34:49,560 --> 00:34:53,480 Speaker 1: she's a lesbian or bisexual or whatever? I mean? Is 534 00:34:53,520 --> 00:34:57,319 Speaker 1: she a good surfer? But it so goes back to 535 00:34:57,600 --> 00:35:04,240 Speaker 1: the issue of marketability because pro surfing is so entwined. 536 00:35:04,280 --> 00:35:06,920 Speaker 1: According to Claire Sullivan and the women that she interviewed 537 00:35:07,320 --> 00:35:12,640 Speaker 1: with surfing cultures, marketability and women's events draw a smaller crowd, 538 00:35:13,080 --> 00:35:17,400 Speaker 1: which means smaller funding. And then you have the issue 539 00:35:17,440 --> 00:35:20,719 Speaker 1: of surfing media, so magazine's websites and all of that 540 00:35:20,880 --> 00:35:24,120 Speaker 1: feeding off of ads from those sponsors who want the 541 00:35:24,160 --> 00:35:27,799 Speaker 1: girls and women to look super sexy. And this just 542 00:35:28,040 --> 00:35:31,800 Speaker 1: furthers the massive stigma that exists around anyone who doesn't 543 00:35:31,840 --> 00:35:34,279 Speaker 1: look like a kidget or a cap Osworth. If you 544 00:35:34,320 --> 00:35:39,239 Speaker 1: are a gay, athletic looking woman, you're so outside of 545 00:35:39,280 --> 00:35:41,600 Speaker 1: the bounds of what the media is telling you you 546 00:35:41,600 --> 00:35:44,800 Speaker 1: should look like. Well, or even a straight woman who 547 00:35:44,880 --> 00:35:48,440 Speaker 1: prefers to wear a wetsuit, Oh my god, God forbid 548 00:35:48,640 --> 00:35:51,120 Speaker 1: a woman wants to wear something that like if she 549 00:35:51,239 --> 00:35:52,920 Speaker 1: hits a big wave or falls in the water, like 550 00:35:53,000 --> 00:35:55,480 Speaker 1: her bottoms don't come off with it. Yeah. I just 551 00:35:55,560 --> 00:36:00,439 Speaker 1: bought um one pieces specifically for Hawaii because I knew 552 00:36:00,480 --> 00:36:04,000 Speaker 1: that I would be in uh wavier water for lack 553 00:36:04,040 --> 00:36:08,359 Speaker 1: of a better descriptor, And yeah, bikini tops just come 554 00:36:08,719 --> 00:36:11,920 Speaker 1: right off, which in some places and why. That's totally fine, 555 00:36:12,760 --> 00:36:15,759 Speaker 1: but but I wanted something that would just like stay 556 00:36:15,800 --> 00:36:17,680 Speaker 1: in place. And I gotta tell you, swimming in a 557 00:36:17,680 --> 00:36:20,000 Speaker 1: one piece is kind of liberating in its own way 558 00:36:20,000 --> 00:36:22,319 Speaker 1: because I don't have to worry about my boob's fallen 559 00:36:22,360 --> 00:36:25,719 Speaker 1: out anymore. Yeah, I pretty much only exclusively wear them now. 560 00:36:26,040 --> 00:36:29,480 Speaker 1: I love, I do love. We are becoming our mothers. 561 00:36:29,480 --> 00:36:34,040 Speaker 1: It's fine. It makes peeing harder, but you know whatever, Well, 562 00:36:34,080 --> 00:36:37,399 Speaker 1: I mean, that's why you just pee in the pool anyway, Caroline. Oh, 563 00:36:37,600 --> 00:36:40,520 Speaker 1: I do not be in the pool. I'm never going 564 00:36:40,560 --> 00:36:43,040 Speaker 1: swimming to a pool with you swimming to a pool. 565 00:36:43,080 --> 00:36:45,160 Speaker 1: I'm never swimming to a pool. I'm never swimming in 566 00:36:45,200 --> 00:36:48,319 Speaker 1: a pool with you anyway. But moving away from my 567 00:36:48,920 --> 00:36:52,120 Speaker 1: pool peeing my alleged pool being. I believe you don't. 568 00:36:52,400 --> 00:36:54,480 Speaker 1: Don't thank you, Caroline. You don't strike me as a 569 00:36:54,480 --> 00:36:56,920 Speaker 1: pool peer. Well that's why I wear my swim diapers, 570 00:36:57,480 --> 00:37:01,200 Speaker 1: you know. Um. But going back to the bikinis and 571 00:37:01,239 --> 00:37:03,480 Speaker 1: surfing thing, which I'm sure there are some women who 572 00:37:03,560 --> 00:37:06,040 Speaker 1: serve in bikinis and absolutely love it. But apparently, like 573 00:37:06,239 --> 00:37:11,279 Speaker 1: you know, different competitors like to wear different things. Sho understandable, Um, 574 00:37:11,560 --> 00:37:13,439 Speaker 1: but I think it was the l a time saying 575 00:37:13,440 --> 00:37:17,080 Speaker 1: that there was one surfer who was sponsored I believe 576 00:37:17,120 --> 00:37:20,600 Speaker 1: by Roxy, and she ended up parting ways with them 577 00:37:20,680 --> 00:37:23,719 Speaker 1: because she was complaining that they would pressure her to 578 00:37:23,760 --> 00:37:27,759 Speaker 1: wear their bikinis in competitions, UM, which she said was 579 00:37:28,000 --> 00:37:31,040 Speaker 1: just made it harder for her to surf. Now, of 580 00:37:31,080 --> 00:37:35,440 Speaker 1: course Roxy uh deny that they would pressure her to 581 00:37:35,560 --> 00:37:38,479 Speaker 1: do anything like that, saying, well, of course we would 582 00:37:38,480 --> 00:37:42,120 Speaker 1: want her to wear our line, but saying that it's 583 00:37:42,120 --> 00:37:45,800 Speaker 1: a bikini, now that's you know, a whole other thing. Um. 584 00:37:46,200 --> 00:37:50,120 Speaker 1: But I believe the surfer, you know, because if you 585 00:37:50,239 --> 00:37:54,080 Speaker 1: look at um, a lot of surf media in the 586 00:37:54,120 --> 00:37:57,360 Speaker 1: same way as you see with skateboarding, a lot of times, 587 00:37:58,160 --> 00:38:02,640 Speaker 1: the women featured in the bigger media are very sexy, 588 00:38:02,680 --> 00:38:07,719 Speaker 1: you know, very sexily portrayed. And another downside to the 589 00:38:07,840 --> 00:38:14,240 Speaker 1: lasting holdover of the blonde, thin, straight, um and bustier 590 00:38:14,760 --> 00:38:21,560 Speaker 1: gidget ideal is that it also erases the diversity within surfing, 591 00:38:21,640 --> 00:38:26,120 Speaker 1: not only in terms of sexual orientation, but also I mean, 592 00:38:26,160 --> 00:38:28,360 Speaker 1: it just whitewashes the whole thing. I mean, there was 593 00:38:28,400 --> 00:38:34,200 Speaker 1: even a documentary called Whitewash Um that focused on surfers 594 00:38:34,239 --> 00:38:38,120 Speaker 1: of color because so many black people in particular who 595 00:38:38,239 --> 00:38:42,319 Speaker 1: surf UM reported in this documentary being made fun of 596 00:38:42,520 --> 00:38:46,200 Speaker 1: constantly by people who are like, what are you doing here? 597 00:38:46,760 --> 00:38:49,200 Speaker 1: You don't surf like I mean, And that goes back 598 00:38:49,239 --> 00:38:54,320 Speaker 1: to just stereotypes too, about um African American people and swimming. 599 00:38:54,880 --> 00:38:58,000 Speaker 1: So I mean, it's like stereotypes on stereotypes, and then 600 00:38:58,120 --> 00:39:00,759 Speaker 1: if you are a woman of color who's surfs, I mean, 601 00:39:01,480 --> 00:39:04,719 Speaker 1: forget about it. People just like it does not compute 602 00:39:05,160 --> 00:39:07,920 Speaker 1: in people's brains. But it's just because of these images 603 00:39:07,960 --> 00:39:10,959 Speaker 1: a lot of times that are fed even though again, 604 00:39:11,000 --> 00:39:13,359 Speaker 1: like you said, Caroline, it's ironic because it started as 605 00:39:13,400 --> 00:39:17,279 Speaker 1: such an egalitarian sport. And speaking of images, like so 606 00:39:17,360 --> 00:39:21,600 Speaker 1: many times when we see photo spreads of female surfers, 607 00:39:21,640 --> 00:39:25,040 Speaker 1: whether they're pros or amateurs, a lot of times those 608 00:39:25,040 --> 00:39:29,520 Speaker 1: photo spreads aren't even showing them actually surfing. They're showing them, 609 00:39:29,640 --> 00:39:32,880 Speaker 1: you know, mostly naked, you know, rolling around in the 610 00:39:32,920 --> 00:39:35,360 Speaker 1: sand or in the shower or something like that. And 611 00:39:35,400 --> 00:39:39,480 Speaker 1: a lot of pro women have have really taken issue 612 00:39:39,480 --> 00:39:41,920 Speaker 1: with that and saying like, okay, we get that you're 613 00:39:41,920 --> 00:39:46,759 Speaker 1: gonna like sexualize female surfers. Because that's just what the 614 00:39:46,840 --> 00:39:50,960 Speaker 1: media are doing. But you seriously can't even show her 615 00:39:51,000 --> 00:39:54,600 Speaker 1: doing her job well in some women, some surfers make 616 00:39:54,680 --> 00:39:58,480 Speaker 1: their name that way, you know. I mean, they're just 617 00:39:58,600 --> 00:40:02,560 Speaker 1: like cursory. Google search is um to get the research 618 00:40:02,640 --> 00:40:07,319 Speaker 1: for this episode started turned up so many like X 619 00:40:07,400 --> 00:40:11,399 Speaker 1: number of sexiest or hottest girls in surfing, same way 620 00:40:11,400 --> 00:40:14,680 Speaker 1: as it was with skateboarding. But when I was looking 621 00:40:14,760 --> 00:40:18,800 Speaker 1: up a few names over at the Encyclopedia of Surfing website, 622 00:40:18,800 --> 00:40:22,640 Speaker 1: which is fantastic, which you should check out listeners um 623 00:40:22,680 --> 00:40:25,480 Speaker 1: if you're interested in the topic. It's very comprehensive and 624 00:40:25,800 --> 00:40:29,200 Speaker 1: just a visual delight. UM. But I was looking up 625 00:40:29,400 --> 00:40:34,920 Speaker 1: pros including Maya Gabera, Laura and Eva and a Llana Blanchard, 626 00:40:34,960 --> 00:40:42,080 Speaker 1: and all of their Encyclopedia of Surfing entries immediately kind 627 00:40:42,080 --> 00:40:47,799 Speaker 1: of described them as like known as a really sexy surfer, 628 00:40:48,040 --> 00:40:51,920 Speaker 1: you know, she's posed in Maxim or g Q or Playboy. 629 00:40:52,400 --> 00:40:55,960 Speaker 1: I mean, this is um definitely a part of the 630 00:40:56,000 --> 00:40:59,719 Speaker 1: industry for for some athletes. I mean, but that to 631 00:40:59,800 --> 00:41:05,200 Speaker 1: me also speaks to the bigger issue of female athletes 632 00:41:05,560 --> 00:41:10,000 Speaker 1: and media and the sexualization thereof and not getting paid 633 00:41:10,080 --> 00:41:12,080 Speaker 1: as much as the guy. So maybe if you can 634 00:41:12,160 --> 00:41:18,520 Speaker 1: make money posing for Playboy, then ellipses. But we have 635 00:41:18,600 --> 00:41:21,840 Speaker 1: some good news, Yes we do, because if we travel 636 00:41:21,880 --> 00:41:29,240 Speaker 1: to places where like Hawaii pre James Cook, we're surfing 637 00:41:29,320 --> 00:41:31,600 Speaker 1: is like a brand new thing and there are no 638 00:41:32,360 --> 00:41:37,920 Speaker 1: like gender norms attached to that surfboard. Yet again it 639 00:41:38,040 --> 00:41:45,680 Speaker 1: becomes this egalitarian and even liberating sport for young women. Yeah. 640 00:41:45,840 --> 00:41:49,239 Speaker 1: One great example is the Brown Girls Surf Collective that 641 00:41:49,360 --> 00:41:52,720 Speaker 1: was started by Ishida mala Via in India. She's India's 642 00:41:52,760 --> 00:41:56,680 Speaker 1: first female surfer and she learned how to surf from 643 00:41:56,719 --> 00:42:00,520 Speaker 1: American yogis, but was often taunted for her and skin 644 00:42:00,719 --> 00:42:04,719 Speaker 1: while surfing. Yeah, because, as we talked about in our 645 00:42:04,800 --> 00:42:10,359 Speaker 1: Colorism episode, UM, to intentionally have tanner skin would be 646 00:42:10,520 --> 00:42:15,440 Speaker 1: more unheard of. Um. But Malavilla loved surfing so much 647 00:42:15,640 --> 00:42:19,360 Speaker 1: and found it so empowering she didn't care and is 648 00:42:19,400 --> 00:42:23,040 Speaker 1: now more of a surf evangelist. Um. You also have 649 00:42:23,320 --> 00:42:28,720 Speaker 1: in Iran an Irish competitive surfer named Dr Easki Britton 650 00:42:29,120 --> 00:42:33,680 Speaker 1: who essentially brought women's surfing to Iran. And you might 651 00:42:33,719 --> 00:42:38,120 Speaker 1: be wondering, wait, how are Iranian women's surfing answer surfing 652 00:42:38,280 --> 00:42:41,600 Speaker 1: jobs yes, they exist. There are actual clothing companies that 653 00:42:41,760 --> 00:42:48,360 Speaker 1: make like, uh like modest swimwear um for Muslim women. Um. 654 00:42:48,360 --> 00:42:51,719 Speaker 1: But Brittain co founded Waves of Freedom, which is a 655 00:42:51,760 --> 00:42:56,120 Speaker 1: nonprofit that uses surfing to break down gender boundaries. Although 656 00:42:56,120 --> 00:42:59,280 Speaker 1: workshops are open to women and men, but of course 657 00:42:59,680 --> 00:43:02,800 Speaker 1: on Iranian beach, the men and women would be learning 658 00:43:02,800 --> 00:43:07,400 Speaker 1: to surf separately. Yeah, and it's so interesting to read 659 00:43:07,440 --> 00:43:13,600 Speaker 1: about um, this sport being introduced as a thing that 660 00:43:13,680 --> 00:43:17,200 Speaker 1: girls and women do and having boys approach her and 661 00:43:17,239 --> 00:43:20,080 Speaker 1: be like, well, this looks really cool. Can I do it? 662 00:43:20,640 --> 00:43:23,400 Speaker 1: Because they have only seen it through that lens of 663 00:43:23,480 --> 00:43:26,040 Speaker 1: it being something that women do. And one of the 664 00:43:26,040 --> 00:43:29,600 Speaker 1: interviewers asked her about what the basically like the cultural 665 00:43:29,719 --> 00:43:32,279 Speaker 1: police in Iran, what their response has been to it, 666 00:43:32,320 --> 00:43:35,000 Speaker 1: because you know, they cracked down on you can't wear 667 00:43:35,080 --> 00:43:37,680 Speaker 1: this or say this or do this whatever. And she 668 00:43:37,719 --> 00:43:40,160 Speaker 1: says that the police came down to the beach, they 669 00:43:40,160 --> 00:43:42,880 Speaker 1: saw that the women were training on one end, the 670 00:43:42,960 --> 00:43:46,000 Speaker 1: men were training on the other. The women were fully 671 00:43:46,120 --> 00:43:52,040 Speaker 1: covered literally from head to toe, uh, full wetsuits, heads covered, 672 00:43:52,239 --> 00:43:58,720 Speaker 1: even wearing a type of skirt, and they were like, well, okay, yeah, 673 00:43:59,480 --> 00:44:05,360 Speaker 1: just uh proceed well, and in an interview with Broadly 674 00:44:06,000 --> 00:44:10,759 Speaker 1: Britain was saying like how there are no rules, you know, 675 00:44:10,840 --> 00:44:14,279 Speaker 1: so they're almost redefining the sport because no one had 676 00:44:14,280 --> 00:44:19,319 Speaker 1: ever done it before. UM. And a similar thing has 677 00:44:19,360 --> 00:44:24,560 Speaker 1: happened in Bangladesh where you have Australian Rashad Alam who 678 00:44:24,760 --> 00:44:27,880 Speaker 1: has moved to Bangladesh and is a surfer and also 679 00:44:28,320 --> 00:44:31,080 Speaker 1: a lifeguard, who has taught a group of girls in 680 00:44:31,400 --> 00:44:36,280 Speaker 1: southern Bangladesh to surf and really just witnessed the confidence 681 00:44:36,760 --> 00:44:40,680 Speaker 1: that it quickly built in them, a similar to what 682 00:44:40,760 --> 00:44:45,880 Speaker 1: we've seen and read about with skatei San, the skateboarding 683 00:44:46,480 --> 00:44:50,560 Speaker 1: nonprofit in Afghanistan that focuses on teaching girls how to 684 00:44:50,600 --> 00:44:55,400 Speaker 1: skateboard UM And in two thousand eight Alarm started Cox's 685 00:44:55,440 --> 00:45:00,680 Speaker 1: Bizarre Surf Club to help I guess get other of 686 00:45:00,680 --> 00:45:03,719 Speaker 1: these girls who often like are are from very very 687 00:45:03,800 --> 00:45:06,040 Speaker 1: very poor families and would usually have to spend their 688 00:45:06,120 --> 00:45:10,400 Speaker 1: days um working to you know, earn money for their family. 689 00:45:10,600 --> 00:45:14,040 Speaker 1: So he it was also this process of having to 690 00:45:14,080 --> 00:45:16,440 Speaker 1: talk to the parents sort of convinced them that this 691 00:45:16,960 --> 00:45:21,600 Speaker 1: was something worthwhile for their daughters to do because it's 692 00:45:21,640 --> 00:45:25,640 Speaker 1: also in teaching them lifeguarding skills and CPR skills as well, 693 00:45:26,960 --> 00:45:31,040 Speaker 1: giving these girls like newer dreams that they had never 694 00:45:31,160 --> 00:45:33,759 Speaker 1: had before, like new possibilities of things that they could 695 00:45:33,800 --> 00:45:36,200 Speaker 1: possibly do with their lives. Right, And I mean just 696 00:45:36,239 --> 00:45:41,560 Speaker 1: the empowerment you get from participating in athletics and sports 697 00:45:41,600 --> 00:45:44,239 Speaker 1: and learning that you have this power to be able 698 00:45:44,280 --> 00:45:48,279 Speaker 1: to move your body and be strong and succeed in 699 00:45:48,360 --> 00:45:52,720 Speaker 1: something new and scary. I'm still saying it's scary for 700 00:45:52,719 --> 00:45:55,920 Speaker 1: for me. I need to be empowered. If like eleven 701 00:45:55,960 --> 00:45:58,759 Speaker 1: year old girls in Bangladesh can do it, Caroline, maybe 702 00:45:58,800 --> 00:46:02,799 Speaker 1: we can. Right, I'll sit on the board and just 703 00:46:02,840 --> 00:46:06,640 Speaker 1: float in a swimming pool sounds good, right, not a 704 00:46:06,640 --> 00:46:10,160 Speaker 1: pool that I'm in apparently, as long as you're wearing 705 00:46:10,160 --> 00:46:13,600 Speaker 1: your pool diaper. Now, before we close up the podcast, 706 00:46:13,640 --> 00:46:17,880 Speaker 1: so we do want to highlight three wahinis, which is 707 00:46:17,960 --> 00:46:22,000 Speaker 1: the Hawaiian term for lady surfer, that we think you 708 00:46:22,040 --> 00:46:24,879 Speaker 1: should know about, to kind of help bring this timeline 709 00:46:24,920 --> 00:46:27,399 Speaker 1: that we've gone over to life. And also I mean 710 00:46:27,520 --> 00:46:30,160 Speaker 1: to give these ladies their druthers. Yeah, I mean all 711 00:46:30,200 --> 00:46:33,759 Speaker 1: these names are new to me, I will admit, including 712 00:46:33,880 --> 00:46:37,759 Speaker 1: Linda Benson's which it shouldn't be new to me, because 713 00:46:37,800 --> 00:46:41,319 Speaker 1: she's the champion and godmother of surfing. Basically in our 714 00:46:41,360 --> 00:46:44,799 Speaker 1: modern era, she starts surfing. She's from California, and she 715 00:46:44,880 --> 00:46:49,399 Speaker 1: started surfing at eleven, and her fifteenth year was a 716 00:46:49,520 --> 00:46:52,760 Speaker 1: huge one for her, which I'm sure mine was too, 717 00:46:52,800 --> 00:46:57,560 Speaker 1: but for probably different reasons. Um. She entered the first 718 00:46:57,719 --> 00:47:02,279 Speaker 1: competition at the West Coast Surfing Championships, and one a 719 00:47:02,320 --> 00:47:05,200 Speaker 1: few weeks later, she became the youngest surfer to win 720 00:47:05,200 --> 00:47:08,759 Speaker 1: the Makaha International Surf Championships, and just a few weeks 721 00:47:08,840 --> 00:47:12,239 Speaker 1: after that, she became the first woman to surf the 722 00:47:12,480 --> 00:47:17,360 Speaker 1: massive eighteen foot breaks at Wymia Bay. I can't imagine 723 00:47:17,520 --> 00:47:20,320 Speaker 1: fifteen years old. Yeah, I was such a brat still, 724 00:47:20,400 --> 00:47:22,759 Speaker 1: I think I'm pretty sure, Like I'm pretty sure I 725 00:47:22,800 --> 00:47:24,640 Speaker 1: was still just but who knows, Maybe that would have 726 00:47:24,640 --> 00:47:26,399 Speaker 1: made me a better surfer, like out of my way? 727 00:47:27,040 --> 00:47:32,839 Speaker 1: Just g tfo. Is that a good thing? Yes? Okay, yes, 728 00:47:33,000 --> 00:47:37,080 Speaker 1: well then yes, sure she had pluck that gidget. Um. 729 00:47:37,200 --> 00:47:40,440 Speaker 1: But Benson ended up being a five time US champion 730 00:47:40,560 --> 00:47:44,439 Speaker 1: and a one time international champion, and in nineteen sixty three, 731 00:47:44,920 --> 00:47:47,800 Speaker 1: she was the first woman on the cover of Surf 732 00:47:47,800 --> 00:47:53,520 Speaker 1: Guide magazine cover line Linda Benson World's Greatest, but then 733 00:47:53,719 --> 00:47:56,000 Speaker 1: kind of a sad turn her story. She dropped out 734 00:47:56,000 --> 00:48:00,640 Speaker 1: of surfing in nineteen sixty nine because of addiction, but 735 00:48:00,680 --> 00:48:05,080 Speaker 1: then she returned in nineteen seventy nine, and she actually 736 00:48:05,080 --> 00:48:08,080 Speaker 1: referred to surfing as artistic expression, which makes sense to 737 00:48:08,120 --> 00:48:11,239 Speaker 1: me as like a complete, you know, ignoramus when it 738 00:48:11,280 --> 00:48:13,400 Speaker 1: comes to surfing, because I mean, just look at what 739 00:48:13,440 --> 00:48:15,880 Speaker 1: those people are doing with their boards and their bodies. 740 00:48:15,880 --> 00:48:20,360 Speaker 1: It totally feels like a form of artistic expression. Um. Okay, 741 00:48:20,400 --> 00:48:24,120 Speaker 1: So woman number two, who's awesome. We've got Rel's son. 742 00:48:24,280 --> 00:48:28,880 Speaker 1: She's Hawaii surf queen. Her middle name means heart of 743 00:48:28,920 --> 00:48:32,040 Speaker 1: the sea, so she was faded faded to be a surfer. 744 00:48:32,120 --> 00:48:35,920 Speaker 1: She's born in nineteen fifty in Oahu, started surfing at 745 00:48:35,920 --> 00:48:39,200 Speaker 1: the age of four, which is an adorable mental image, 746 00:48:39,480 --> 00:48:42,920 Speaker 1: and at just sixteen, won the Hawaiian Junior Championship and 747 00:48:43,000 --> 00:48:46,880 Speaker 1: was invited to the nineteen sixty six World Championships, which 748 00:48:47,360 --> 00:48:50,239 Speaker 1: wasn't the nineteen sixty six World champ Not young that 749 00:48:50,320 --> 00:48:54,719 Speaker 1: guy that I can't stand? Oh wow, full circle. Caroline 750 00:48:54,760 --> 00:49:00,440 Speaker 1: just swiveled her neck listeners. Um. She took a five 751 00:49:00,560 --> 00:49:03,120 Speaker 1: year break and maybe a little over five year break 752 00:49:03,160 --> 00:49:06,839 Speaker 1: when she moved to Oklahoma. Oklahoma. Your your middle name 753 00:49:06,920 --> 00:49:09,040 Speaker 1: literally needs part of the sea, and you moved to 754 00:49:09,120 --> 00:49:12,480 Speaker 1: Oklahoma while she got married. No surprise, it did not 755 00:49:12,560 --> 00:49:16,239 Speaker 1: work out because Real's son belonged in Hawaii, so she 756 00:49:16,320 --> 00:49:20,719 Speaker 1: moved back there, hit the waves and became the world's 757 00:49:20,760 --> 00:49:24,960 Speaker 1: best long border and What's Surfing magazine called the sports 758 00:49:25,200 --> 00:49:29,480 Speaker 1: premier stylist. Um. And one reason why Real's son is 759 00:49:29,520 --> 00:49:33,240 Speaker 1: considered Hawaii' surf queen is because she was just so 760 00:49:33,480 --> 00:49:39,000 Speaker 1: beloved for embodying Hawaii's what's called They're Aloha spirit in 761 00:49:39,040 --> 00:49:42,279 Speaker 1: the sport. Um. And that's not just some like touristy thing. 762 00:49:42,320 --> 00:49:47,760 Speaker 1: I mean it really is. Um, this idea of hospitality 763 00:49:47,920 --> 00:49:54,240 Speaker 1: and warmth um, wearing all those airbrush t shirts exactly um. 764 00:49:54,280 --> 00:49:56,480 Speaker 1: And I was so glad Caroline to run across rayl 765 00:49:56,600 --> 00:50:01,880 Speaker 1: Sun because the sport has been so co opted from 766 00:50:01,960 --> 00:50:06,840 Speaker 1: its Hawaiian roots. Yes, yes, exactly um. And in nineteen 767 00:50:06,880 --> 00:50:11,239 Speaker 1: seventy five, she was one of the women involved in 768 00:50:11,320 --> 00:50:15,160 Speaker 1: co founding the Women's Professional Surfing Association and the first 769 00:50:15,239 --> 00:50:19,640 Speaker 1: professional Women's World Tour. And not only was she a 770 00:50:19,680 --> 00:50:23,439 Speaker 1: supporter of other wahinees. She was also a supporter of 771 00:50:23,800 --> 00:50:29,160 Speaker 1: her fellow Hawaiian surfers, founding a competition, the Mahune Contest, 772 00:50:29,320 --> 00:50:33,960 Speaker 1: which was exclusively open to Hawaiian kids. And this woman 773 00:50:34,080 --> 00:50:38,880 Speaker 1: continued surfing even after being diagnosed with breast cancer in 774 00:50:39,080 --> 00:50:45,719 Speaker 1: Night three, and she continued surfing right up until she 775 00:50:45,920 --> 00:50:50,680 Speaker 1: passed away in just forty seven years old. I know, 776 00:50:50,880 --> 00:50:52,600 Speaker 1: but I want to say that she was even undergoing 777 00:50:53,040 --> 00:50:58,600 Speaker 1: radiation treatment and would still hit the beach every day. Well, 778 00:50:58,640 --> 00:51:01,880 Speaker 1: if you've got something that you feel is like healing 779 00:51:01,920 --> 00:51:04,759 Speaker 1: on a soul level, I mean, why wouldn't you well, 780 00:51:04,760 --> 00:51:08,280 Speaker 1: And we have to remember too that, I mean, surfing 781 00:51:08,800 --> 00:51:13,160 Speaker 1: was a spiritual sport, you know, in a spiritual pastime 782 00:51:13,760 --> 00:51:16,719 Speaker 1: in Hawaii, So I wonder if that had a tie 783 00:51:16,719 --> 00:51:18,960 Speaker 1: in with it as well. Yeah, I'm sure if you're 784 00:51:19,000 --> 00:51:23,839 Speaker 1: not scared of water and surfing, it's very healing, she 785 00:51:23,920 --> 00:51:28,000 Speaker 1: says nervously. Well, and Lisa Anderson finally are our third 786 00:51:28,040 --> 00:51:31,000 Speaker 1: woman we wanted to bring to your attention. Lisa Anderson 787 00:51:31,080 --> 00:51:34,680 Speaker 1: is the original Roxy Girl and basically she's surfing's first 788 00:51:34,719 --> 00:51:38,640 Speaker 1: female celebrity. She began surfing at thirteen when her family 789 00:51:38,680 --> 00:51:41,240 Speaker 1: moved to Florida, and then she ran away to Los 790 00:51:41,239 --> 00:51:45,000 Speaker 1: Angeles after her father destroyed her surfboard. Yeah. I think 791 00:51:45,040 --> 00:51:48,600 Speaker 1: she had a pretty uh not not cool home life. 792 00:51:48,840 --> 00:51:52,160 Speaker 1: Yeah sounds like it. But she turned pro. It's seventeen, 793 00:51:52,560 --> 00:51:56,080 Speaker 1: so so she was a badass, and her global rankings 794 00:51:56,120 --> 00:51:59,919 Speaker 1: gradually grew during the late eighties and she basically press 795 00:52:00,040 --> 00:52:02,600 Speaker 1: suit her Her effort was to pursue surfing like a 796 00:52:02,640 --> 00:52:07,520 Speaker 1: guy her her words, Yeah, being tough, being aggressive on 797 00:52:07,600 --> 00:52:10,839 Speaker 1: the waves, and not just like you said, uh, doing 798 00:52:10,880 --> 00:52:13,360 Speaker 1: what everybody assumes women do, which is just pursuing the 799 00:52:13,440 --> 00:52:18,040 Speaker 1: more stylistic aspect. And it's no surprise that she was 800 00:52:18,120 --> 00:52:23,279 Speaker 1: such a celebrity because from to which you know, the 801 00:52:23,320 --> 00:52:30,080 Speaker 1: heyday of this mainstreamed surf style. She snagged four world championships, 802 00:52:30,480 --> 00:52:34,480 Speaker 1: and she won the first one five weeks after giving birth. 803 00:52:36,040 --> 00:52:38,359 Speaker 1: My head just exploded. I don't know what giving birth 804 00:52:38,440 --> 00:52:39,920 Speaker 1: is like, but I know how tough it was for 805 00:52:39,960 --> 00:52:42,120 Speaker 1: me to get an I U D. And I wouldn't 806 00:52:42,160 --> 00:52:45,279 Speaker 1: want to surf after that. Um. She also snagged a 807 00:52:45,360 --> 00:52:48,800 Speaker 1: Surfer magazine cover. She was the first woman on there 808 00:52:48,840 --> 00:52:52,279 Speaker 1: by the way in fifteen years and the cover line 809 00:52:52,360 --> 00:52:55,759 Speaker 1: was Lisa Anderson surfs better than you. And apparently that 810 00:52:55,920 --> 00:53:00,400 Speaker 1: was like a wink to the fact that like pretty 811 00:53:00,480 --> 00:53:03,720 Speaker 1: much all of those subscribers were dudes, and it's like, oh, hey, guys, 812 00:53:04,000 --> 00:53:08,399 Speaker 1: girls surfs better than you. Well, in around the same 813 00:53:08,440 --> 00:53:11,600 Speaker 1: time that in Marietta, Georgia, Caroline Irvan was getting all 814 00:53:11,640 --> 00:53:16,480 Speaker 1: of those Roxy catalogs. Uh, Lisa Anderson became their face 815 00:53:16,800 --> 00:53:20,520 Speaker 1: and she really helped popularize their board shorts and this 816 00:53:20,560 --> 00:53:22,279 Speaker 1: is when you see also, this is you know, the 817 00:53:22,280 --> 00:53:24,799 Speaker 1: era we talked about where corporations were super getting in 818 00:53:24,880 --> 00:53:30,720 Speaker 1: on their new consumer base women um and uh. Corey Schumacher, 819 00:53:30,760 --> 00:53:34,640 Speaker 1: writing for Cooler mag writes about how this shift that 820 00:53:34,920 --> 00:53:38,480 Speaker 1: Lisa Anderson was a part of ushering in ignited a 821 00:53:38,600 --> 00:53:42,640 Speaker 1: wildfire of all girls surf schools, girls surf movies, and 822 00:53:42,719 --> 00:53:47,920 Speaker 1: female surf lifestyle clothing lines across surf brands. And they 823 00:53:47,960 --> 00:53:52,560 Speaker 1: also talked about how the you know, California surfer girls 824 00:53:53,280 --> 00:53:57,200 Speaker 1: weren't necessarily afraid of consumerism. And I don't mean that 825 00:53:57,280 --> 00:53:59,680 Speaker 1: to sound as like weird and kind of patronizing as 826 00:53:59,680 --> 00:54:01,880 Speaker 1: it might sound, but that they were literally like, no, 827 00:54:01,960 --> 00:54:03,839 Speaker 1: I want the gear to be able to do the 828 00:54:03,880 --> 00:54:05,520 Speaker 1: sport that I want to do, and so yeah, if 829 00:54:05,520 --> 00:54:09,040 Speaker 1: you want to market to me, bring it on. Unfortunately, 830 00:54:09,200 --> 00:54:14,640 Speaker 1: back problems basically deflated Anderson's career, but Surfer magazine still 831 00:54:14,719 --> 00:54:18,160 Speaker 1: named her one of its twenty five most influential Surfers 832 00:54:18,239 --> 00:54:22,680 Speaker 1: of the century, and also on that list, Gidget. That's right, 833 00:54:22,719 --> 00:54:25,040 Speaker 1: she was number seven. And it is kind of ironic, Caroline, 834 00:54:25,120 --> 00:54:29,680 Speaker 1: considering the enduring sexism of the sport and really the 835 00:54:29,680 --> 00:54:33,319 Speaker 1: the industry around the sport. Um is the fact that 836 00:54:33,480 --> 00:54:38,560 Speaker 1: in mid century American pop culture, it was a girl 837 00:54:38,600 --> 00:54:42,560 Speaker 1: that really, you know, brought the title wave of attention 838 00:54:42,600 --> 00:54:46,000 Speaker 1: to surfing, and it was not. It really wasn't that 839 00:54:46,080 --> 00:54:50,520 Speaker 1: long after Gidget emerged in pop culture that Nat Young 840 00:54:50,640 --> 00:54:53,120 Speaker 1: said girls shouldn't surf because they would make fools of themselves. 841 00:54:53,160 --> 00:54:56,839 Speaker 1: That is how short our collective memories are, that we 842 00:54:57,040 --> 00:55:01,759 Speaker 1: can't remember a time when sir thing was egalitarian and 843 00:55:01,760 --> 00:55:05,600 Speaker 1: when women were right there alongside their their kings because 844 00:55:05,640 --> 00:55:10,320 Speaker 1: of whitewashing. Just like the documentary name, I know, listeners, 845 00:55:10,520 --> 00:55:14,040 Speaker 1: now we're curious to hear whatever surfing insights you have. 846 00:55:14,719 --> 00:55:17,600 Speaker 1: Mom Stuff at house, stuffwork dot Com is our email address. 847 00:55:17,640 --> 00:55:20,279 Speaker 1: You can also tweet us at mom Stuff podcast or 848 00:55:20,360 --> 00:55:23,200 Speaker 1: messages on Facebook, and we got a couple of messages 849 00:55:23,200 --> 00:55:28,920 Speaker 1: to share with you right now. So I have a 850 00:55:29,000 --> 00:55:34,160 Speaker 1: letter here from another Christian uh talking about our STD episode. 851 00:55:34,960 --> 00:55:37,160 Speaker 1: She says, my husband and I were over the moon 852 00:55:37,239 --> 00:55:39,400 Speaker 1: to learn that we were expecting our first child a 853 00:55:39,400 --> 00:55:42,520 Speaker 1: few years ago. At my first doctor appointment for the pregnancy, 854 00:55:42,640 --> 00:55:45,040 Speaker 1: several tests were performed to determine my health and the 855 00:55:45,040 --> 00:55:47,759 Speaker 1: health of my newly conceived baby. The next day, I 856 00:55:47,760 --> 00:55:49,640 Speaker 1: got a call from the nurse who had a very 857 00:55:49,719 --> 00:55:52,480 Speaker 1: shaming tone at my doctor's office and was told that 858 00:55:52,520 --> 00:55:56,240 Speaker 1: I attested positive for chlamydia. This is a major shock 859 00:55:56,320 --> 00:55:58,680 Speaker 1: and sent me into a whirlwind of confusion and hurt. 860 00:55:58,719 --> 00:56:01,399 Speaker 1: Since my husband and I were and still are, very 861 00:56:01,400 --> 00:56:04,400 Speaker 1: happily married and monogamous, the only way this could have 862 00:56:04,480 --> 00:56:07,719 Speaker 1: happened is if my husband had been unfaithful. I confronted 863 00:56:07,800 --> 00:56:10,120 Speaker 1: him with this and he insisted that was not true, 864 00:56:10,160 --> 00:56:12,680 Speaker 1: and he was just as confused and hurt as I was. 865 00:56:13,239 --> 00:56:16,520 Speaker 1: After doing some research that same day, I learned that 866 00:56:16,680 --> 00:56:20,759 Speaker 1: false positives for chlamydia and pregnant women are not unheard of. 867 00:56:21,160 --> 00:56:23,280 Speaker 1: I became convinced that this had to be the case 868 00:56:23,320 --> 00:56:26,080 Speaker 1: for myself and my husband. I called the nurse back 869 00:56:26,160 --> 00:56:29,759 Speaker 1: and insisted that I be retested. She was very dismissive 870 00:56:29,800 --> 00:56:33,040 Speaker 1: and condescending, but agreed to retest me. This new test 871 00:56:33,120 --> 00:56:35,840 Speaker 1: came back negative. While the nurse did admit that the 872 00:56:35,880 --> 00:56:38,560 Speaker 1: first test was a false positive, she didn't go so 873 00:56:38,600 --> 00:56:41,480 Speaker 1: far as to apologize for the shame and judgment she 874 00:56:41,600 --> 00:56:45,160 Speaker 1: threw my way. The fact that false positives for STDs 875 00:56:45,200 --> 00:56:47,719 Speaker 1: and pregnant women are so common was surprising to me. 876 00:56:48,040 --> 00:56:51,600 Speaker 1: I'm thankful that I trusted in my relationship and my husband. 877 00:56:52,200 --> 00:56:56,560 Speaker 1: What's that phrase, trust but verify? Thanks so much and 878 00:56:56,600 --> 00:56:58,800 Speaker 1: thank you, Kristen, and I think that's some valuable stuff 879 00:56:58,840 --> 00:57:01,160 Speaker 1: to pass along to our list, nurse, because not only 880 00:57:02,719 --> 00:57:06,480 Speaker 1: you know do we want to encourage you to handle 881 00:57:06,600 --> 00:57:09,440 Speaker 1: the situation when your healthcare provider is shaming you, but 882 00:57:09,520 --> 00:57:12,120 Speaker 1: we also want you to know that false positives are 883 00:57:12,120 --> 00:57:14,440 Speaker 1: a thing that can happen, so don't be afraid to 884 00:57:14,840 --> 00:57:18,040 Speaker 1: trust and verify. Well, I've got a letter here from 885 00:57:18,400 --> 00:57:22,240 Speaker 1: Julie subject line tanning in Hawaii, so of course I 886 00:57:22,320 --> 00:57:25,440 Speaker 1: had to read it this episode. Julie writes I'm a 887 00:57:25,440 --> 00:57:28,000 Speaker 1: new listener to the show, and I really enjoy it. 888 00:57:28,320 --> 00:57:30,640 Speaker 1: I finally got around to listening to the Tanning Podcast 889 00:57:30,760 --> 00:57:34,680 Speaker 1: after hearing it referenced in several pieces of listener mail. Currently, 890 00:57:34,800 --> 00:57:37,880 Speaker 1: I live in Honolulu, which has a very complex history 891 00:57:37,880 --> 00:57:41,120 Speaker 1: and cultural identity, in particular when it comes to skin 892 00:57:41,200 --> 00:57:44,400 Speaker 1: tone and tanning. I'd be remist to try to explain 893 00:57:44,440 --> 00:57:47,480 Speaker 1: that background in a shortish email. Just know that there 894 00:57:47,520 --> 00:57:50,560 Speaker 1: are a lot of different cultures represented here and some 895 00:57:50,720 --> 00:57:54,160 Speaker 1: lingering resentment depending on who you ask at, not being 896 00:57:54,200 --> 00:57:58,640 Speaker 1: an independent nation led by the Hawaiian monarchy. That being said, 897 00:57:58,680 --> 00:58:01,240 Speaker 1: as a California raised chick, let me take a stab 898 00:58:01,280 --> 00:58:04,400 Speaker 1: at my own observations of tanning in the Aloha state. 899 00:58:05,120 --> 00:58:08,400 Speaker 1: I've never seen a tanning salon or spray tan facility here, 900 00:58:08,400 --> 00:58:11,720 Speaker 1: but they probably exist. It's pretty much assumed if you're 901 00:58:11,720 --> 00:58:14,120 Speaker 1: in Hawaii, you're tanning on the beach or pool side, 902 00:58:14,200 --> 00:58:16,720 Speaker 1: or just getting tanned by the sheer power of the sun. 903 00:58:17,600 --> 00:58:19,960 Speaker 1: I don't see being tan or not tan as a 904 00:58:20,000 --> 00:58:24,440 Speaker 1: socioeconomic issue here. It's more of an outsider versus local issue. 905 00:58:25,000 --> 00:58:27,600 Speaker 1: Just from my own personal experience and observations. Having a 906 00:58:27,640 --> 00:58:30,720 Speaker 1: tan here is a symbol of belonging as a ha 907 00:58:30,880 --> 00:58:33,840 Speaker 1: ola or white chick. Being tan is a way to 908 00:58:33,880 --> 00:58:36,680 Speaker 1: show that I'm not some random person who just flew 909 00:58:36,760 --> 00:58:39,960 Speaker 1: in from the mainland. Not being tanned shows that someone 910 00:58:40,040 --> 00:58:42,720 Speaker 1: isn't local. A few months back, my picture was in 911 00:58:42,760 --> 00:58:46,040 Speaker 1: the newspaper and one of my friends immediately commented, you 912 00:58:46,160 --> 00:58:49,640 Speaker 1: need to work on your dan. It's definitely an interesting 913 00:58:49,680 --> 00:58:53,080 Speaker 1: dynamic in Hawaiian, very different from what I experienced growing 914 00:58:53,160 --> 00:58:56,680 Speaker 1: up pasty as can be in NorCal so I thought 915 00:58:56,720 --> 00:58:59,120 Speaker 1: i'd share. On a related side note, I work as 916 00:58:59,120 --> 00:59:01,480 Speaker 1: an editor out here, and a few weeks ago was 917 00:59:01,560 --> 00:59:04,880 Speaker 1: at the opening of the Keels in Honolulu. I met 918 00:59:04,880 --> 00:59:07,280 Speaker 1: the company president for a quick interview and he shamed 919 00:59:07,320 --> 00:59:10,080 Speaker 1: me for my chan He said that my beautiful tan 920 00:59:10,240 --> 00:59:14,360 Speaker 1: hashtag humble Bragg was all sun damage that couldn't be undone. 921 00:59:14,800 --> 00:59:19,640 Speaker 1: I felt properly scolded, So thank you for that insight, 922 00:59:19,800 --> 00:59:22,560 Speaker 1: Julie Um and I will say that when I arrived 923 00:59:22,560 --> 00:59:26,880 Speaker 1: in Hawaii, I definitely stood out because of my blindingly 924 00:59:26,920 --> 00:59:30,880 Speaker 1: white skin. So now, listeners again, we'd love to hear 925 00:59:30,920 --> 00:59:35,520 Speaker 1: from you about all of your Hawaii and or surfing insights. 926 00:59:35,720 --> 00:59:38,360 Speaker 1: Mom stuff at how stuff Works dot com is our 927 00:59:38,440 --> 00:59:41,040 Speaker 1: email address and for links to all of our social 928 00:59:41,040 --> 00:59:43,400 Speaker 1: media as well as all of our blogs, videos, and 929 00:59:43,520 --> 00:59:47,280 Speaker 1: podcasts with our sources. So you can learn more about 930 00:59:47,280 --> 00:59:50,720 Speaker 1: the history of surfing. Head on over to stuff mom 931 00:59:50,800 --> 00:59:57,800 Speaker 1: Never Told You dot com for more on this and 932 00:59:57,840 --> 01:00:00,640 Speaker 1: thousands of other topics. Does it, how stuff Exact time