Speaker 1: Hello everybody, and welcome back to the Psychology of Your Twenties,
Speaker 1: the podcast where we talk through some of the big
Speaker 1: life changes and transitions of our twenties and what they
Speaker 1: mean for our psychology. Hello everybody, Welcome back to the show.
Speaker 1: Welcome back to the podcast, new listeners, own listeners, Wherever
Speaker 1: you are in the world, it is so great to
Speaker 1: have you here. Back for another episode as we, of
Speaker 1: course break down the psychology of our twenties. Today, let's
Speaker 1: talk about something that I don't think I have ever
Speaker 1: spoken about on the podcast before, having kids. Having babies.
Speaker 1: Having children it might seem so far off for some
Speaker 1: of us and so adult, but for other people it
Speaker 1: is right around the corner. It is part of their
Speaker 1: future two, five, ten year plan. And although I definitely
Speaker 1: think we've passed the days when we were kind of
Speaker 1: expected to have children by twenty two or twenty three,
Speaker 1: it is definitely something that a lot of us start
Speaker 1: considering in our twenties, whether children are part of our future,
Speaker 1: whether maybe we want to be younger parents, or whether
Speaker 1: we want to focus on our careers and wait. Regardless
Speaker 1: of your kind of preferences, regardless of what you want
Speaker 1: to do in your life. I do think that talking
Speaker 1: about children as a possibility, thinking about their role in
Speaker 1: our future is something that we really do need to
Speaker 1: start thinking about during this decade, as adult and mature
Speaker 1: as it seems. You know, I'm twenty four at the moment,
Speaker 1: and I always, for the longest time, was convinced that
Speaker 1: I did not want kids. I didn't want a family
Speaker 1: of my own. Especially when I was a teenager. I
Speaker 1: had these very huge, exaggerated fantasies of like being the
Speaker 1: archetype of the fun, drunk single art traveling around the world,
Speaker 1: like collecting I was gonna say trophies to collecting trinkets,
Speaker 1: you know, this whole fabulous vision. And people would always
Speaker 1: tell me that I would change my mind. I really
Speaker 1: resented that. I honestly still don't believe that everybody does
Speaker 1: change their mind. But let me tell you something. I
Speaker 1: turned twenty three, and it was like suddenly I was sure,
Speaker 1: and I was sure that I wanted children, And it
Speaker 1: was like something had clicked in my brain that I
Speaker 1: wanted to be a mum, a mom someday, and it
Speaker 1: really startled me, and for the first time it really
Speaker 1: had me considering things like parenting, things like fertility, and
Speaker 1: it brought a new lens to my health and who
Speaker 1: I was dating. And of course, when that happened, I'd
Speaker 1: turned to my friends about it because that is my
Speaker 1: main source of wisdom, and so many of them had
Speaker 1: experienced something similar. Some of my friends who had always
Speaker 1: been very firm in the decision that they did not
Speaker 1: want children, they remain firm. Others like me, had like
Speaker 1: shifted entirely. And you know, it's like I turned twenty
Speaker 1: four and suddenly I've had more conversations about egg freezing
Speaker 1: than I have ever had before, and so many people
Speaker 1: are talking to me about fertility or starting to really
Speaker 1: care that their period is consistent, or about what they're
Speaker 1: eating and their health, and I want to talk about it.
Speaker 1: When do we really need to start thinking about kids?
Speaker 1: Do we need to start thinking about it in our
Speaker 1: twenties or at all? What are the factors that we
Speaker 1: need to consider? What about when it comes to our
Speaker 1: romantic life, the pressure to find somebody, Is it all
Speaker 1: too adult too soon? And should we kind of preserve
Speaker 1: our youth for as long as possible? You know, there
Speaker 1: are so many questions that come up around this, and
Speaker 1: it's so easy to kind of just like put it off.
Speaker 1: I'm going to make the argument for why thinking about
Speaker 1: it is actually going to give you more, more freedom
Speaker 1: and more choice than not thinking about it. And we
Speaker 1: also heard from a few listeners who have children who
Speaker 1: are expecting in their twenties about having you when they
Speaker 1: were ready and what we can learn from their experiences
Speaker 1: when it comes to family and future planning. So, without
Speaker 1: further ado, it's a much different episode today, but one
Speaker 1: that I am so excited about. Let's get into it.
Speaker 1: Having children is such a distinctively adult conversation, regardless of
Speaker 1: where you are at in your twenties. It is still
Speaker 1: so shocking to hear from my friends in their late
Speaker 1: twenties or early thirties that they're expecting children, because it's
Speaker 1: kind of like you've heard a strange fork in the road,
Speaker 1: like an intersection of sorts where people's life paths split
Speaker 1: and children, and I think also, you know, marriage to
Speaker 1: some extent, but that is where the split occurs. Some
Speaker 1: of us are still getting drunk on the weekends, some
Speaker 1: of us don't have a dollar in savings, but there
Speaker 1: are other people posting, you know, engagement announcements or getting
Speaker 1: IVF or going to obgyn appointments. Everyone's path is super different,
Speaker 1: but I think for many of us we are in
Speaker 1: a few minds when it comes to whether it's even
Speaker 1: you know, the time to consider whether kids are part
Speaker 1: of the plan, let alone start trying to have kids.
Speaker 1: If we aren't sure, do we need to decide now
Speaker 1: or can we? You know, it kind of feels like
Speaker 1: even thinking about it pops the bubble a little bit.
Speaker 1: It pops the bubble of being carefree and young, because
Speaker 1: once you do start considering it, some really big things
Speaker 1: come up, you know, especially not just in terms of
Speaker 1: like do you want to start considering whether you should
Speaker 1: have kids now, it's even the question of like do
Speaker 1: I want to consider whether I want kids at all?
Speaker 1: And when I might want to start. What comes up
Speaker 1: with that is questions around like ethics and climate change
Speaker 1: and recession and like the world that we would be
Speaker 1: bringing children into. And it's almost like once you are like, yeah,
Speaker 1: maybe I do want children, is that when you have
Speaker 1: to start making a plan. Is that when we kind
Speaker 1: of start to feel strapped to a timeline Because once
Speaker 1: we start thinking about kids, there is this acknowledgment that
Speaker 1: there is a bit of a to do list that
Speaker 1: comes with that. You know, you have to find a
Speaker 1: suitable partner or most people would prefer to have a
Speaker 1: partner with them. To raise a child, you have to
Speaker 1: kind of get your finances sorted, get your life sorted,
Speaker 1: before a window closes. And for women, obviously that window
Speaker 1: is our biological clock. And you know, typically I really
Speaker 1: hate that phrase because it very much connotes that like
Speaker 1: when the clock hits zero, we expire or we are
Speaker 1: past our worth, that we've run out of time, you know,
Speaker 1: as if our lives don't continue whether we have children
Speaker 1: or not. But that is what we know it colloquially.
Speaker 1: And we also know that there is like a deadline
Speaker 1: for reproduction. Not to make it sound so clinical, but
Speaker 1: around you know, thirty to thirty five, our ability to
Speaker 1: have children declines and it continues on that kind of plane.
Speaker 1: It continues to decline before menopause. So knowing that does
Speaker 1: that change how we live our twenties, even if we
Speaker 1: don't want to start having kids to our thirties, knowing
Speaker 1: that it might.
Speaker 2: Be more difficult. And the thing that I often hear
Speaker 2: from people is like, if children are a certainty in
Speaker 2: my life plan, why not do it in my twenties
Speaker 2: because there is a greater chance that I can have
Speaker 2: children naturally, there's a greater chance that I'll be around longer,
Speaker 2: and I might have more of that support system in
Speaker 2: my parents, in my grandparents even you know, some of
Speaker 2: us are so lucky to still have you know, both
Speaker 2: sets of grandparents alive. I can bounce back from a
Speaker 2: career break easier. Like, there are a lot of pros,
Speaker 2: but there are also a lot of cons, right, the
Speaker 2: loss of freedom, the quick change in life trajectory compared
Speaker 2: to all of our friends. The money, that's a huge one,
Speaker 2: the money. Children are so expensive, but also it's this
Speaker 2: capacity and this lifestyle that we would be giving up,
Speaker 2: so that I think is the thing that really contributes
Speaker 2: to the decision to have kids in our twenties, or
Speaker 2: to even consider it, because even if you do want
Speaker 2: to have kids eventually in your thirties, there is kind
Speaker 2: of an acknowledgment that there is a chapter that will
Speaker 2: close when that decision is made. And of course there
Speaker 2: is a chapter for everything, but I think the chapter
Speaker 2: that you are in without children is one of immense freedom.
Speaker 2: It's being able to go out for drinks or out
Speaker 2: for dinner with your friends any night of the week.
Speaker 2: It's you know, coming home when you feel like it.
Speaker 2: It is having the freedom to travel where and when
Speaker 2: you would like it, is having the freedom to sleep
Speaker 2: in or you know, to just actually be in control
Speaker 2: of your life. And there is a brief window where
Speaker 2: we truly get that after we turn eighteen to when
Speaker 2: we might you know, have kids. Obviously, if you don't
Speaker 2: end up having kids, you literally you win the lot
Speaker 2: or you get to have that freedom for the rest
Speaker 2: of your life. Congratulations. But you know, if you want
Speaker 2: to have kids at some point, like you're likely going
Speaker 2: to want to start trying before you're like forty, So
Speaker 2: that's like twenty two years to get it all out
Speaker 2: of your system, to travel where you want, to do
Speaker 2: what you want. Like maybe Max, you might want to
Speaker 2: start trying early. You might not want to have like
Speaker 2: a geriatric pregnancy when you like, I'm obviously spiraling here.
Speaker 2: But it's the case that when you start thinking about it,
Speaker 2: you start thinking about how much this decision might impact
Speaker 2: other areas of your life. It's not just around like, yeah,
Speaker 2: I want to have a baby, it's work decisions. Will
Speaker 2: you be able to have a career break. Do you
Speaker 2: want to climb the corporate ladder or not? It's travel
Speaker 2: plans do I want to Are the places that I
Speaker 2: wouldn't be able to go with kids that I want
Speaker 2: to go? Now? Are there experiences that I want to
Speaker 2: have that I know are going to become more difficult?
Speaker 2: Like solo traveling? You obviously can't solo travel if you
Speaker 2: have a baby, because the baby's got to be there,
Speaker 2: big factor. And then dating, dating, do you like how
Speaker 2: serious are you going to get how quickly? And I
Speaker 2: think that when you have this acknowledgment of like, Okay, no,
Speaker 2: eventually I do want kids, and I know that it
Speaker 2: might be easier to try like in my late twenties
Speaker 2: or my early thirties, it might put a lot more
Speaker 2: pressure on the people that you are romantically interested in.
Speaker 2: So I was speaking to a friend about this very
Speaker 2: component the other day. And obviously we are, you know,
Speaker 2: in a day and age where it's not like a
Speaker 2: man and woman need to like get together at twenty
Speaker 2: two and have babies by twenty five otherwise like that's it,
Speaker 2: You're not going to reproduce. There are so many other options.
Speaker 2: There is IVF, there is adoption, there is sorrogacy, so
Speaker 2: many things, but you know, sometimes the dream is to
Speaker 2: have somebody to do it all with, to have a
Speaker 2: partner to help raise your child, especially a partner that
Speaker 2: we love. That can feel so special, but it also
Speaker 2: ups the stakes if you haven't already kind of found
Speaker 2: that person and you're getting older, you're not just facing
Speaker 2: the stigma of a society that puts romantic love on
Speaker 2: a pedestal and pities singleness, but it's also really confronting
Speaker 2: to realize that the key to unlocking your life plan
Speaker 2: rests in a stranger that you're yet to meet. And
Speaker 2: it's kind of like, how do you rush something that
Speaker 2: isn't always up to you? How do you tick this
Speaker 2: off your list to make it sound super super clinical?
Speaker 2: And I was speaking to a friend about that and
Speaker 2: how she is now in her kind of like early thirties,
Speaker 2: and how stressful it is that it's no longer just
Speaker 2: about finding a connection, because yes, of course that obviously
Speaker 2: is the most important thing, but it's also about making
Speaker 2: sure that you're on the same page. She said to me,
Speaker 2: She was like, when I decided that yes, I did
Speaker 2: want kids, it wasn't about that I wanted kids in
Speaker 2: my twenties, I just wanted them. Eventually everything else became
Speaker 2: a lot more serious, and she was like, I realized
Speaker 2: that I'm getting to an age where I don't have
Speaker 2: the luxury of getting to know you, like I don't
Speaker 2: have the luxury of like, let's figure it out. It
Speaker 2: was like, no, if I'm going to spend a year
Speaker 2: dating year, a couple of years, I want to know
Speaker 2: that we are on the same page about kids or
Speaker 2: about family, about values, and the timeline for things really shifts.
Speaker 2: Not that you are rushing it, hopefully you are not
Speaker 2: rushing it, but it's more that there is a directness
Speaker 2: and an intentionality, and it's more like you have to
Speaker 2: make calls about big things like kids earlier on and
Speaker 2: make sure that you're on the same page. And when
Speaker 2: you're nineteen or twenty two, you know you kind of
Speaker 2: have time to have your doubts. You can date people
Speaker 2: that you probably don't think is going to be the
Speaker 2: one and it's not going to really hurt your long
Speaker 2: term chances of creating the dream life with the kids
Speaker 2: or without the kids. You can have those kind of
Speaker 2: fairy tale conversations about the future without needing to enact
Speaker 2: plans right away, but that changes the order you get
Speaker 2: and it definitely is probably going to give you a
Speaker 2: fairly large dose of milestone anxiety if you kind of
Speaker 2: wake up to the conclusion that children are part of
Speaker 2: your life plan and that part of getting there is
Speaker 2: finding somebody and you haven't done that yet. And the
Speaker 2: reason I say milestone anxiety specifically is because that really
Speaker 2: derives from a sense that you are not where you
Speaker 2: want to be in life or where you should be.
Speaker 2: It can still feel like there is this like key
Speaker 2: ingredient that you are missing. And although milestone anxiety is
Speaker 2: typically applied to things like Korea or financial goals, when
Speaker 2: it does come to relationships, I think it's a lot
Speaker 2: more complicated because it's not like there is a formula
Speaker 2: for success or a correlation between effort and output. It
Speaker 2: is so influenced by things like chance and timing and
Speaker 2: if you believe in it, fate. So I think it's
Speaker 2: really hard to not feel in control of something so
Speaker 2: significant for the life you dream of. And even when
Speaker 2: I think everything goes according to plan right, even if
Speaker 2: you are, you know you've assessed your emotional preparedness, you've
Speaker 2: assessed your financial preparedness, your social preparedness, the strength of
Speaker 2: your relationship. You are in a relationship, you're both ready
Speaker 2: to have kids, you know, and you've been like, yeah,
Speaker 2: to start in my twenties. I mean, this is what
Speaker 2: I want. I want to be a younger parent. This
Speaker 2: is just what feels right for me. Sometimes it doesn't
Speaker 2: always work out the way that we want it. You
Speaker 2: can be absolutely sure of your decision, and life can
Speaker 2: still throw you curveballs. And a big one that I
Speaker 2: think a lot of us in our early twenties in
Speaker 2: particular don't think about, is fertility, not just like the
Speaker 2: biological clock, but also kind of whether we're able to
Speaker 2: even have kids, the state of all those other systems.
Speaker 2: This is just not something that we think about when
Speaker 2: we are twenty or twenty one. But the older you get,
Speaker 2: you start to hear stories. One of the stories was
Speaker 2: something that it's not a story, it's somebody's, you know,
Speaker 2: lived experience. The experiences of a friend of mine who
Speaker 2: I think really woke me up to this. A couple
Speaker 2: of years ago. She started having like these really weird
Speaker 2: symptoms and problems with like her period and with other things,
Speaker 2: and she went to the doctor, and I'm not going
Speaker 2: to disclose exactly what she had what happened, but basically
Speaker 2: they said to her that her chances of having like
Speaker 2: a natural pregnancy were incredibly low, and that if she
Speaker 2: and her partner wanted to have kids, they had to
Speaker 2: kind of start trying before she was like twenty eight
Speaker 2: twenty nine, Like she had to kind of get a
Speaker 2: wriggle on. That was essentially what the doctor suggested. This
Speaker 2: was such a wake up call for her and for
Speaker 2: I would say the people around her as well, where
Speaker 2: we were kind of all in this like bubble of like, yeah,
Speaker 2: let's just like fuck around and find out like we're
Speaker 2: having fun. We're focused on like graduating UNI and like yay,
Speaker 2: like dating around and like partying. And then it was
Speaker 2: suddenly like, oh wait, I actually, you know, I think
Speaker 2: about my future only as my career, and I think
Speaker 2: about my future only it's like oh, meeting the love
Speaker 2: of my life and like getting ahead and like buying
Speaker 2: a house. But it's like no, and there is a
Speaker 2: part of this that is happening right now, my fertility,
Speaker 2: that I hadn't even considered. And it really raised the
Speaker 2: question of is it better to be prepared now or
Speaker 2: to live in blissful ignorance. Is it worth bursting the
Speaker 2: bubble of not knowing and almost immediately fast forwarding your
Speaker 2: timeline if you do find out the news that she
Speaker 2: found out, which is that it might actually end up
Speaker 2: being really hard if she doesn't start now. Or is
Speaker 2: it just like better to just get to that problem
Speaker 2: when you get to it. Here's the thing. If you've
Speaker 2: always known that you want to be a parent, and
Speaker 2: that is a huge facet of your identity and your
Speaker 2: goals and your future, I do think that it's worth
Speaker 2: just knowing in your twenties if that is something that
Speaker 2: is possible for you, even if you don't feel responsible yet.
Speaker 2: Knowledge is power, especially as all the science starts to improve.
Speaker 2: There was this episode of New Girl that I watched
Speaker 2: a while back in which like if you've watched a
Speaker 2: New Girl, like CEC goes in and like Jess and
Speaker 2: CC the go in and they assess like their ability
Speaker 2: to have children, and it's like meant to be this
Speaker 2: fun thing, you know, like oh like goofy guga, Like
Speaker 2: you know when you like take a pregnancy test and
Speaker 2: like you know it's gonna be negative and you know
Speaker 2: you see those moviees where ends up positive like it
Speaker 2: was just meant to be. It's very much like that
Speaker 2: meant to be, like a funny thing, and cec it
Speaker 2: turns out like has very poor fertility and is like
Speaker 2: really Una will be unable to like conceive naturally. And
Speaker 2: in that scene she kind of talks about wishing that
Speaker 2: she had a magical wand to like go back to
Speaker 2: early twenties and like tell herself, like be a little
Speaker 2: bit more serious. So even if it does seem weird
Speaker 2: to be thinking about it now, and even if it
Speaker 2: does seem pretty intense intense, I think, especially if you're
Speaker 2: a woman, see you know, see this this questioning around
Speaker 2: your fertility and your future capacity or desire to have
Speaker 2: children as an investment in your health, the same way
Speaker 2: that you want to live a long, healthy life, the
Speaker 2: same way that you want to have a really successful career,
Speaker 2: And so you are making investments in that right now.
Speaker 2: If you do want kids, it's important to be thinking
Speaker 2: about it sooner rather than later. And I think what
Speaker 2: I began to realize was that the pressure doesn't increase,
Speaker 2: but is reduced by being able to make future decisions
Speaker 2: with full information that might actually derive from a decision
Speaker 2: that you make right now. That is kind of like
Speaker 2: the appeal of egg phrasing, right, Like, I've been reading
Speaker 2: so much stuff about egg phrasing recently. The premise is
Speaker 2: that you kind of store your good DNA from when
Speaker 2: you're like in your early mid thirty twenties, sorry for
Speaker 2: like later, when you're in like your thirties or maybe
Speaker 2: even your forties, so that it's kind of like insurance
Speaker 2: you have time you can delay the inevitable. It brings
Speaker 2: control back into the situation, even if, like you end
Speaker 2: up not using those eggs, even if like it's not
Speaker 2: something that you end up deciding to actually know, like
Speaker 2: I don't want kids, like the climate crisis is too terrible.
Speaker 2: I just never met the right person, Like I'm happy
Speaker 2: without them. It is the sense that, like, the decisions
Speaker 2: you make now give you the freedom in the future.
Speaker 2: It's like science has allowed us to control something we
Speaker 2: were never able to control before, which is time and biology.
Speaker 2: So that is kind of my argument for why I
Speaker 2: think it's important to firstly consider whether you even want
Speaker 2: kids in your twenties and not in your twenties, Like
Speaker 2: in your twenties, consider whether you want kids in the future.
Speaker 2: That's probably a better way to put it, because the
Speaker 2: decisions that you make around your health and your fertility
Speaker 2: now it might actually come back to help you when
Speaker 2: you do decide in your thirties or forties, and if
Speaker 2: you don't want kids, like great, then you can, you know,
Speaker 2: start making a plan to live your life more the
Speaker 2: way that you want it to. And I think the
Speaker 2: other component is, like, it's also important to think about
Speaker 2: whether you do want to have kids in your twenties right,
Speaker 2: whether like this is a better time, whether you like
Speaker 2: my friend's example, the knowledge that maybe it will get
Speaker 2: harder as you get as you age, and the older
Speaker 2: that you get, it's better to start in this moment.
Speaker 2: So I also wanted to hear from you guys, people
Speaker 2: who chose to have kids in their twenties, what they
Speaker 2: would want us to know, whether you're just considering, whether
Speaker 2: you're decided, or you're acting on it, stay with us
Speaker 2: for more after the break. There is obviously a perspective
Speaker 2: to this that I can't bring I don't have kids
Speaker 2: in as much as you know, I was speaking about
Speaker 2: this weird maternal urge that suddenly popped up out of
Speaker 2: nowhere in the last year. I really don't plan on
Speaker 2: it for the next like five to ten years. But
Speaker 2: I wanted to hear from people who have thought about
Speaker 2: it a lot, especially people in their twenties who have
Speaker 2: decided to have children, perhaps earlier than what most of
Speaker 2: us would expect in this day and age, or people
Speaker 2: who have had to make big decisions about fertility in
Speaker 2: their twenties that feel really adult and feel like they
Speaker 2: are something that should have you know, that they could
Speaker 2: have delayed but then couldn't. So I saw this actually
Speaker 2: really funny article before I read this first thing that
Speaker 2: having children in your twenties is now like punk, which
Speaker 2: is so funny, and that's kind of like, you know
Speaker 2: what I do. I kind of get it, because yet again,
Speaker 2: when I hear about people having kids in their twenties,
Speaker 2: it's not that I feel any certain way about it.
Speaker 2: I'm just like, oh, that's different, when actually it's not.
Speaker 2: Really it's not. So I do want to hear about it.
Speaker 2: I do want to hear from people about it, about
Speaker 2: their decision, their timeline when they started thinking about things,
Speaker 2: and their fears. So here's the first person that messaged us,
Speaker 2: and I really love her perspective. I always knew I
Speaker 2: wanted to be a parent, and had my baby girl
Speaker 2: at twenty three. I faced a lot of stigma. She
Speaker 2: was an accident. Oh my god, sidebar, Why would you
Speaker 2: ever say that to somebody? That is so freaking rude. Anyhow,
Speaker 2: back to this person, I was facing me that she
Speaker 2: was an accident, when actually I'd been together with my
Speaker 2: now husband since we were eighteen and it was part
Speaker 2: of our plan. I still lost friends who didn't get
Speaker 2: it and had people judge me. But she is now five,
Speaker 2: and I like knowing that she will be twenty when
Speaker 2: I'm forty three, and I could be a young parent
Speaker 2: as she grows up and keep up with her. See
Speaker 2: that is the kind of perspective that I think we
Speaker 2: don't hear too often, people who you know had kids young,
Speaker 2: and how that is actually like a really valuable thing
Speaker 2: for them. I think a lot of the time, and
Speaker 2: I will speak for myself here, you see people who
Speaker 2: have had children young and you're like, well, that's a
Speaker 2: bit different, and you think about what they might be
Speaker 2: missing out, because that wouldn't be your choice. But as
Speaker 2: this person said, like, no she didn't Yes, she may
Speaker 2: have missed out in the sense that she lost friends
Speaker 2: that sound like they were never really her friends, but
Speaker 2: she gained so much. And I think when you were
Speaker 2: clear that is going to be part of your plan,
Speaker 2: and when you have really considered it and thought about it,
Speaker 2: you can actually choose when it's going to work best
Speaker 2: for you. And for her, it sounded like when she
Speaker 2: was younger, that was really what was aligned with how
Speaker 2: she wanted to raise her child, and she's doing it.
Speaker 2: So I really liked that input. I thought that was
Speaker 2: really a perspective, a side of things that we don't
Speaker 2: always hear. Here is another person who wrote in I
Speaker 2: found out that I had half a uterus when I
Speaker 2: was twenty one, and that just put everything into perspective
Speaker 2: then and there. It felt like I aged out of
Speaker 2: my friend group immediately, and no one could understand how
Speaker 2: my life felt different, because suddenly I was thinking about
Speaker 2: decisions they didn't have to make for years. Well that
Speaker 2: was three years ago. I still don't have a partner,
Speaker 2: but I feel more at peace with the fact that
Speaker 2: I'll be okay if it doesn't work out because I
Speaker 2: had time and more time to consider whether this was
Speaker 2: even for me. I'm glad I got to be okay
Speaker 2: with what could happen and not be really excited about
Speaker 2: it when I was thirty and married, then find out
Speaker 2: the hard way. Yes, it was hard, but now I
Speaker 2: know more about my values and priorities than I did
Speaker 2: before I found out about my uterus. Why didn't I
Speaker 2: say it like that, my uterus? Thank you? Thank you
Speaker 2: for sharing. It really comes back to that point. You know,
Speaker 2: kids aren't everything. At the end of the day. You
Speaker 2: don't need to reproduce to have a purpose. But maybe
Speaker 2: to paraphrase what you're saying, it seems like at the
Speaker 2: end of the day, it's about having choice. That's what
Speaker 2: feels meaningful here. And choice also comes from knowledge and
Speaker 2: knowing more in your twenties, even if it might up
Speaker 2: the stakes, actually lets you have time to consider things
Speaker 2: and to consider what you want in long term and
Speaker 2: the alternatives to that ultimate choice. Let's hear from one
Speaker 2: more person. Hi, I am so glad that you were
Speaker 2: talking about this, because I feel like it is so
Speaker 2: weird amongst my group when I bring this up. People
Speaker 2: want to stay young. Thinking about kids feels old. I
Speaker 2: made the decision to freeze my eggs through work because
Speaker 2: I am twenty eight. I have a boyfriend slash life partner,
Speaker 2: but we haven't decided whether we want to have children yet,
Speaker 2: although we have definitely thought about it. Egg freezing just
Speaker 2: took the stress away and work paid for it. For
Speaker 2: people thinking about it, it does put a lot of
Speaker 2: strain on your body and it's costly. So know that.
Speaker 2: Going in, some part of me thought that if I
Speaker 2: went through that, I must know that I want kids,
Speaker 2: because otherwise why would I do it. Yes, it is
Speaker 2: important to think about kids in your twenties as a hypothetical,
Speaker 2: but I want to stress that you do not. I
Speaker 2: want to stress that you do have more time than
Speaker 2: you think. My mom had me at thirty eight, back
Speaker 2: then she was so old. She told me she was
Speaker 2: never worried about it though, because she loved her life
Speaker 2: and she would have had a full and wonderful life
Speaker 2: whether I came around or not. And I love that philosophy.
Speaker 2: It is a big decision, but you can wait until
Speaker 2: you're thirty eight or older and still be successful. Okay, Sorry,
Speaker 2: I feel like I really fell over my words there.
Speaker 2: I really love this point and I think this is
Speaker 2: a really good one to end on though, because it
Speaker 2: brings some nuance. As this person said, you know, she
Speaker 2: still made a huge decision about her fertility and she
Speaker 2: didn't know. But you do have time. Kids aren't everything.
Speaker 2: You can change your mind. You can start late. And
Speaker 2: I think it's a good way to finish us up
Speaker 2: is to really articulate and express that science is coming
Speaker 2: a long way, like this episode was not to sit
Speaker 2: down and stress us all out about you know, go
Speaker 2: and get a scan right now, Go and find out
Speaker 2: if you can have kids, like start on your family
Speaker 2: planning journey as young as possible, because that does sound
Speaker 2: very like the Handmaid's Tale. I understand it. But I
Speaker 2: think that the whole philosophy that underlies this whole episode
Speaker 2: is that more information equals more choice. And if we
Speaker 2: think about retirement in our twenties, if you think about
Speaker 2: our dream jobs in our twenties, if we think about
Speaker 2: finding the love of our life in our twenties, all
Speaker 2: these big things, right, we should you know, all these
Speaker 2: big things that are the ingredients for our life plan
Speaker 2: and are the ingredients for our five and ten year plan.
Speaker 2: We should also be thinking about children, and if you
Speaker 2: don't want them, that is honestly so, like I don't
Speaker 2: feel like I need to say that, but yes, to
Speaker 2: stress it all more time. If you don't want them, great,
Speaker 2: like you come to that decision, You come to that conclusion,
Speaker 2: and yes you can change your mind. But it's also like,
Speaker 2: if you do want kids, there are factors that are
Speaker 2: important to consider during this decade, whether that is your
Speaker 2: dating choices, whether that is your health that we have
Speaker 2: more power by thinking about earlier. So I do hope
Speaker 2: that this episode has made you think or has just
Speaker 2: been entertaining, has helped you learn something. Thank you so
Speaker 2: much to the people who wrote in with their perspectives
Speaker 2: and their life experience. It was just something really that
Speaker 2: I've been thinking about a lot and I was interested
Speaker 2: to talk about. I would love to hear what you
Speaker 2: guys think. If you have a story, if you have
Speaker 2: an opinion, something else that you want to say, please
Speaker 2: dm me on Instagram at that Psychology podcast. I would
Speaker 2: love to hear from you. And if there's somebody else
Speaker 2: you think would be interested in this episode who wants
Speaker 2: to hear it, please feel free to send it to them.
Speaker 2: Make sure you leave a five star review on Apple Podcasts, Spotify,
Speaker 2: wherever you're listening right now and that you're following along
Speaker 2: for future episodes, And until next time, stay safe, be kind,
Speaker 2: and be gentle to yourself, and we'll talk soon.