WEBVTT - Limitations w/ Jenny Bacon 0:00:00.080 --> 0:00:01.680 Hey, that's messed up listeners. 0:00:01.960 --> 0:00:04.720 Before we get into the episode, obviously, we do need 0:00:04.760 --> 0:00:08.119 to talk about June twenty fourth, twenty twenty two, the 0:00:08.160 --> 0:00:10.920 Supreme courp decided to overturn Roe v. 0:00:11.080 --> 0:00:13.640 Wade, and it's fucking horrible. 0:00:14.000 --> 0:00:18.799 Yeah, this decision has eliminated the opportunity for women to 0:00:18.840 --> 0:00:22.280 have safe and legal abortions. I don't believe abortions will stop, 0:00:22.320 --> 0:00:24.840 they will just not be safe and legal in many places. 0:00:25.280 --> 0:00:28.760 And we believe that everyone should have this freedom of choice. 0:00:28.840 --> 0:00:30.600 If you've ever listened to this podcast, you know that 0:00:30.600 --> 0:00:34.080 we're extremely pro choice and ending a pregnancy is a 0:00:34.080 --> 0:00:36.839 person's personal choice between them and their doctor. 0:00:37.080 --> 0:00:40.879 This decision is going to have such horrific consequences for 0:00:41.040 --> 0:00:44.680 individual health and safety, and it could also have harsh 0:00:44.720 --> 0:00:48.800 repercussions for other decisions in the future. Restricting access to 0:00:48.880 --> 0:00:53.560 comprehensive reproductive care, including abortion, threatens the health and independence 0:00:54.040 --> 0:00:55.120 of all Americans. 0:00:55.480 --> 0:00:57.840 So if you guys want to learn more, please check 0:00:57.880 --> 0:01:03.440 out Choice dot CRD dot That's choice dot c r 0:01:03.760 --> 0:01:07.119 D dot co. And if you're able to support others, 0:01:07.120 --> 0:01:11.240 please consider donating to abortion funds. We actually have many 0:01:11.319 --> 0:01:13.840 posted and we will actually We're going to start a 0:01:13.959 --> 0:01:16.600 highlight in our Instagram stories where you can find tons 0:01:16.640 --> 0:01:18.480 of abortion funds that we're going to be linking to. 0:01:18.840 --> 0:01:22.080 Yeah, speak up, take care, spread the word take care 0:01:22.080 --> 0:01:25.959 of yourselves, and you know, have empathy for others. 0:01:26.200 --> 0:01:30.039 Of the law and order franchises. SVU is considered especially watchable. 0:01:30.240 --> 0:01:32.840 We are the amateur detectives who kind of investigate the 0:01:32.880 --> 0:01:34.880 vicious felonies. These episodes are based on. 0:01:35.160 --> 0:01:47.680 These are our stories dot done. 0:01:53.960 --> 0:01:58.000 Hey, it's that's messed up an SVU podcast. I'm Liza Traeger. 0:01:57.800 --> 0:02:00.880 And I am Kara Klank and you guys, I mean 0:02:00.920 --> 0:02:03.400 hopefully you know, we're in the eighties in terms of 0:02:03.480 --> 0:02:07.440 numbers of this podcast. And we do an episode of SVU. 0:02:07.640 --> 0:02:09.480 We do a true crime it's based on, we do 0:02:09.520 --> 0:02:12.360 a celebrity you know, and then before that we sort 0:02:12.360 --> 0:02:14.000 of chit chat a little bit and just tell you 0:02:14.040 --> 0:02:15.240 what's going on with us. 0:02:15.560 --> 0:02:15.800 Yeah. 0:02:15.800 --> 0:02:18.880 But maybe someone just is obsessed with limitations and this 0:02:19.040 --> 0:02:20.119 is their first one. 0:02:20.200 --> 0:02:23.040 Yeah, I need, we really need to impress them. We 0:02:23.120 --> 0:02:25.200 do there, Like I wish there was a recap of 0:02:25.240 --> 0:02:30.920 an episode of television from twenty three years ago. Yeah, listen. 0:02:31.120 --> 0:02:33.200 Also, I was talking to some people when we were 0:02:33.240 --> 0:02:35.680 in San Francisco and they're like, yeah, but so many 0:02:35.680 --> 0:02:37.239 people watch us for you, and I go, yeah, but 0:02:37.280 --> 0:02:39.200 a lot of them like love the police and hate 0:02:39.200 --> 0:02:41.440 our opinions. So yeah, a lot of them, I think, 0:02:41.560 --> 0:02:46.920 join in and go you know, yeah, you can tell yeah, 0:02:47.000 --> 0:02:49.000 and then they go write a thing. I actually have 0:02:49.080 --> 0:02:51.600 not checked any of our reviews, and probably i'd want 0:02:51.639 --> 0:02:53.560 to say eight months. Oh, I haven't looked in a 0:02:53.600 --> 0:02:56.200 long time. But that's pretty good for you. I usually 0:02:56.280 --> 0:02:58.960 am only like once every few months. You used to 0:02:59.040 --> 0:02:59.880 really get in there. 0:03:00.160 --> 0:03:02.480 I used to check them out every few weeks, but 0:03:02.560 --> 0:03:03.080 now I don't. 0:03:03.120 --> 0:03:05.160 You're being generous to yourself. I think. 0:03:07.440 --> 0:03:09.440 I really haven't looked in. I haven't looked at least 0:03:09.480 --> 0:03:13.040 a month, at least maybe two. Yeah. So if you're 0:03:13.040 --> 0:03:15.120 writing us a review and you're here to see if 0:03:15.120 --> 0:03:18.360 I'm going to respond to it, I'm not. I mean 0:03:18.400 --> 0:03:19.880 a bad one. If it's a good one, thank you 0:03:19.919 --> 0:03:20.200 so much. 0:03:20.240 --> 0:03:20.920 We appreciate it. 0:03:21.000 --> 0:03:22.680 Oh my god, I know this is going to be 0:03:22.760 --> 0:03:25.639 so far in the future, and I'm sorry about the 0:03:25.639 --> 0:03:29.440 weird timeness, but this was also from last episode. This 0:03:29.520 --> 0:03:33.320 is nuts, but they are doing a Drag Race All 0:03:33.320 --> 0:03:36.280 Stars episode where they have to do their own TRL segment. 0:03:36.640 --> 0:03:40.200 I know, I'm excited. It's it, you've already seen it. 0:03:40.280 --> 0:03:42.600 We'll talk about it next time. But I cannot fucking 0:03:42.640 --> 0:03:45.560 wait right up your alley. 0:03:45.640 --> 0:03:49.480 As we just talked last episode about how Lisa brutalized 0:03:49.480 --> 0:03:51.640 her parents' home in order to get to a TRL 0:03:51.720 --> 0:03:52.440 video for Pierre. 0:03:52.800 --> 0:03:56.280 I just like my age coincided with the best era 0:03:56.400 --> 0:03:59.200 of pop music that's ever existed, and it just like 0:03:59.400 --> 0:04:01.400 has a whole on me that will never go away. 0:04:01.480 --> 0:04:01.840 And that's so. 0:04:02.000 --> 0:04:06.720 So did you know that My career at MTV started 0:04:06.880 --> 0:04:09.240 when I started working on a show called The Seven 0:04:09.840 --> 0:04:13.120 that was existed for nine months in twenty ten, and 0:04:13.200 --> 0:04:16.719 it was it was them kind of trying to bring 0:04:16.800 --> 0:04:20.120 TRL back. Not as much music video stuff and no 0:04:20.279 --> 0:04:22.920 in studio audience, but it was in the TRL studio. 0:04:23.080 --> 0:04:25.320 So I was in the TRL studio like every day. 0:04:25.240 --> 0:04:28.040 For nine months. I was like the social media person 0:04:28.720 --> 0:04:32.240 and yeah, it was did you look out the window? 0:04:32.720 --> 0:04:33.799 Yeah all the time. 0:04:33.920 --> 0:04:37.040 Oh and there was one cool moment where we did wait, 0:04:37.080 --> 0:04:39.360 this was a separate thing when I worked at MTV News. 0:04:39.480 --> 0:04:44.480 Later we had a concert where Lady Gaga was announcing 0:04:44.600 --> 0:04:46.040 it was a premiere of one of her videos. 0:04:46.040 --> 0:04:47.520 So they did it TRL style. 0:04:47.600 --> 0:04:49.560 They're like, we're going to premiere her video, and I 0:04:49.880 --> 0:04:52.000 honestly cannot tell you which video it was, but they 0:04:52.040 --> 0:04:53.440 had to shut down times. 0:04:53.440 --> 0:04:57.720 They're going to come for you the monsters. Oh, I thought, 0:04:57.920 --> 0:04:59.960 I don't know why. I heard Maria Mariah Carey's are 0:05:00.120 --> 0:05:03.279 the lamps? No, I heard Maria carry this whole time. 0:05:03.360 --> 0:05:04.520 That's what I was envisioning. 0:05:04.880 --> 0:05:07.120 Oh no, Lady Gaga. Did I say Mariah carry? No? 0:05:07.200 --> 0:05:09.760 I just heard something different. Oh okay, what is it? 0:05:09.839 --> 0:05:13.120 A mandala effect? Like I just had something different and 0:05:13.240 --> 0:05:14.080 attached to it. 0:05:14.160 --> 0:05:17.800 Barren Steam bears, Yeah, I yeah, it was Lady Gaga. 0:05:17.839 --> 0:05:20.200 And so I had the TRL experience where it was 0:05:20.240 --> 0:05:24.240 like full audience of people dressed as in Gaga like outfits, 0:05:24.800 --> 0:05:27.719 full time square shut down Lady Gaga. 0:05:27.800 --> 0:05:30.719 Sway the whole, the whole deal. I think I've told 0:05:30.760 --> 0:05:32.560 you this story. I told you. Sway told me he 0:05:32.600 --> 0:05:33.160 was nervous. 0:05:33.480 --> 0:05:36.679 No, So Sway goes, I'm in the elevator with Sway 0:05:36.720 --> 0:05:38.680 and I'm like, how you doing? And he goes, I'm nervous, 0:05:38.680 --> 0:05:42.159 Like Lady Gaga and I go sway, your sway, Lady 0:05:42.200 --> 0:05:45.480 Gaga's probably been watching you since she was sixteen years old, Like, 0:05:46.040 --> 0:05:48.240 do not worry about it? And he was like, yeah, 0:05:48.279 --> 0:05:49.400 I guess they didn't think about. 0:05:49.240 --> 0:05:51.640 It that way. And then afterwards he told me he 0:05:51.680 --> 0:05:53.760 goes that really helped me. Thank you for saying that 0:05:53.800 --> 0:05:54.000 to me. 0:05:54.279 --> 0:05:57.160 Oh my god, that's incredible. 0:05:57.680 --> 0:05:57.920 Yeah. 0:05:58.000 --> 0:06:00.640 I was like I just was like, sway, you've been around, 0:06:00.680 --> 0:06:02.599 like you've been in my life. Like I just feel 0:06:02.640 --> 0:06:06.080 like tangentially through MTV and everything like forever, like Lady 0:06:06.120 --> 0:06:08.880 gagaz gooped to be meeting you, Like why are you 0:06:09.240 --> 0:06:13.120 like so nervous? You know, because it was like a 0:06:13.200 --> 0:06:16.599 huge thing. It was a very trl throwback. No, but 0:06:16.640 --> 0:06:19.000 that a Parna has done something like that for me. 0:06:19.279 --> 0:06:22.960 A partner, non Charla. She's a very successful person and 0:06:23.040 --> 0:06:24.719 all very funny girl friend. 0:06:24.839 --> 0:06:26.120 Yeah, she is. 0:06:27.720 --> 0:06:31.120 The teen horse and BoJack Horseman. She's also herself and 0:06:31.160 --> 0:06:34.080 lots of things. But I love her as the little 0:06:34.120 --> 0:06:37.920 horse that I don't know why I can't remember her name. 0:06:38.040 --> 0:06:41.120 So I was to do it the first year of Clusterfest. 0:06:41.320 --> 0:06:43.440 I was doing that, but I didn't realize how big 0:06:43.480 --> 0:06:44.839 of a deal. It was gonna be like I just 0:06:44.880 --> 0:06:47.359 didn't realize. So I was at my friend Josie's house, 0:06:48.080 --> 0:06:51.120 having some cocktails, smoking some weed, and I was hosting 0:06:51.160 --> 0:06:53.480 a six o'clock show or something, and I was like, okay, whatever. 0:06:53.920 --> 0:06:57.040 We get stuck in terrible traffic. The people are calling me, 0:06:57.080 --> 0:06:58.719 They're like where are you. They're like, you know you're 0:06:58.720 --> 0:07:01.600 hosting this, and I was like, I'm just I'm gonna 0:07:01.600 --> 0:07:03.120 have to be there as on time as I can. 0:07:03.360 --> 0:07:05.359 The traffic wasn't moving. I had to get out and 0:07:05.360 --> 0:07:07.359 I had to run. I was like sprinting through the 0:07:07.400 --> 0:07:08.760 streets to get to this venue. 0:07:08.800 --> 0:07:10.200 Oh my god, I hate this. 0:07:10.640 --> 0:07:14.760 I'm like sweating. It's like a minute by minute it's counting. 0:07:14.800 --> 0:07:17.040 I'm like trying to run to this venue. I show up. 0:07:17.040 --> 0:07:20.200 It's it's the arena. It seats ten thousand. There's like 0:07:20.280 --> 0:07:22.560 six to eight thousand people in there. I'm like dripping 0:07:22.640 --> 0:07:25.920 sweat running. I make it right on time, and Aparna 0:07:26.160 --> 0:07:30.040 just said, pretend like it's the cellar. And then I 0:07:30.080 --> 0:07:32.360 walked on stage and it was like a Parna just 0:07:32.440 --> 0:07:35.480 like did everything like yeah, just said the right thing 0:07:35.520 --> 0:07:36.280 at the right moment. 0:07:36.400 --> 0:07:37.520 Yeah, And I was. 0:07:37.480 --> 0:07:40.400 Able to host and like relax, and I think about 0:07:40.400 --> 0:07:42.840 a partner a lot when I'm like about to be stressed. 0:07:43.720 --> 0:07:45.760 I think I'd like to think that Sway thinks about 0:07:45.760 --> 0:07:46.280 me a lot. 0:07:46.560 --> 0:07:49.600 Oh, I one hundred percent. I mean that's what led 0:07:49.640 --> 0:07:53.240 me to think of the story. You truly change. You 0:07:53.280 --> 0:07:56.760 were responsible for sweating, not for his performance. He could 0:07:56.760 --> 0:07:59.200 have been like nervous and weird and not performed at 0:07:59.200 --> 0:08:02.440 the level. Sometimes you just need a good pep Yeah, 0:08:02.560 --> 0:08:05.840 it's like I had a good Julia gave me a 0:08:05.920 --> 0:08:10.880 good talking too. Remember after my friend was being not nice? Yeah, yes, 0:08:12.320 --> 0:08:14.080 like the best pep talk off my life. And I 0:08:14.080 --> 0:08:16.600 was like, you're right, I don't know, it just feels nice. 0:08:16.880 --> 0:08:20.160 Yeah, love a good ever talk. What we're doing? 0:08:20.360 --> 0:08:23.840 Yeah, pep talk times like remember the Titans, Like live 0:08:23.880 --> 0:08:29.520 it out in little moments throughout your day. Yeah, Okay, 0:08:29.560 --> 0:08:31.800 this is the bad date. So it's not even oh 0:08:31.840 --> 0:08:32.840 my god anymore. 0:08:32.960 --> 0:08:34.120 Wait a minute, Wait a minute. 0:08:34.120 --> 0:08:37.080 You cannot just launch into it like this, Okay, everybody. 0:08:37.679 --> 0:08:41.920 We Lisa teased a bad date like maybe two months 0:08:42.000 --> 0:08:43.960 ago on the podcast that she had a bad date 0:08:44.040 --> 0:08:45.839 and then was like, I'll tell you guys, next week 0:08:45.880 --> 0:08:48.240 and then never did and people have written us messages 0:08:48.559 --> 0:08:49.040 where's the. 0:08:48.960 --> 0:08:49.760 Bad day matter? 0:08:50.000 --> 0:08:52.040 Like it was just like in that moment, it was like, 0:08:52.080 --> 0:08:53.760 oh my god, this just happened. 0:08:53.840 --> 0:08:56.040 And then now it's like I could care. Like it 0:08:56.080 --> 0:08:58.280 was just you know, like yeah. 0:08:57.840 --> 0:09:01.480 Now it's yeah, but everybody has been asking us at 0:09:01.480 --> 0:09:03.920 live show, so now finally we're going to hear about it, 0:09:03.920 --> 0:09:04.720 and I'm excited. 0:09:05.040 --> 0:09:05.240 Yeah. 0:09:05.280 --> 0:09:06.760 It was just like a tender moment. 0:09:06.920 --> 0:09:09.840 I was looking for, I would say, a fun hookup, 0:09:10.080 --> 0:09:15.000 and this person was meeting me in the hotel lobby 0:09:15.040 --> 0:09:17.960 bar and when I met him, like I just need 0:09:17.960 --> 0:09:20.120 to be complimented or what am I doing here? So 0:09:20.240 --> 0:09:22.400 I didn't get a compliment, didn't love it, but I could, 0:09:22.720 --> 0:09:25.960 you know, move past that. And then I had to 0:09:26.000 --> 0:09:27.640 buy my own drinks, so I was like, this is 0:09:27.720 --> 0:09:31.960 kind of a nightmare. And then I got tipsy and 0:09:31.960 --> 0:09:34.320 I was like talking myself into liking this person that 0:09:34.360 --> 0:09:35.959 I was not that into. And then I was talking 0:09:36.440 --> 0:09:39.040 this was just a funny moment, but we're I was 0:09:39.040 --> 0:09:41.360 talking about someone and I was like, oh, but they're millionaires, 0:09:41.360 --> 0:09:43.000 and he goes, how do you know I'm not a millionaire? 0:09:43.040 --> 0:09:45.199 And I was like, you truly took the bus here 0:09:45.240 --> 0:09:46.720 and you have not bought me a drink. I'm like, 0:09:46.760 --> 0:09:50.559 you're not a millionaire. But I kept just like seeing 0:09:50.559 --> 0:09:52.520 past this. So then we go outside to smoke weed, 0:09:52.840 --> 0:09:55.760 and oh, after twenty minutes too, I had to be like, 0:09:55.760 --> 0:09:57.360 you know, you have not asked me one question and 0:09:57.400 --> 0:09:58.880 he goes, no, I have. I go, no, you typed 0:09:58.880 --> 0:10:00.600 that earlier. I'm like, you've not asked me one question 0:10:00.679 --> 0:10:02.800 in twenty minutes. I'm just letting that. I just need 0:10:02.840 --> 0:10:03.400 you to know that. 0:10:03.480 --> 0:10:03.920 But weren't. 0:10:03.920 --> 0:10:06.079 Things were going okay right at that point. 0:10:06.120 --> 0:10:08.240 Then yeah, I talk to myself and so yeah, we 0:10:08.240 --> 0:10:10.160 were like chatting to it okay, but he was like 0:10:10.200 --> 0:10:13.760 annoying for sure, Like I did like after what happened 0:10:13.800 --> 0:10:16.000 at the end, like you put all the pieces together 0:10:16.120 --> 0:10:18.760 Memento style, you know what I mean. Like I would 0:10:18.800 --> 0:10:21.160 say I like this movie, like that's a dumb movie 0:10:21.200 --> 0:10:22.640 because of this and that and that, and it was 0:10:22.720 --> 0:10:25.440 just like okay, yeah, I still like, what do you talk? 0:10:25.480 --> 0:10:28.240 Don't talk about me. I'm like, truly, I don't know. 0:10:29.880 --> 0:10:33.440 So we're outside and he goes, listen, I gotta be honest, 0:10:33.440 --> 0:10:36.640 I'm really not into this anymore, and I went, what 0:10:36.760 --> 0:10:39.880 are you kidding? He goes, no, I'm not like the 0:10:39.920 --> 0:10:42.480 past ten minutes. I'm just like kind of done. And 0:10:42.559 --> 0:10:44.960 I was like, okay, I'm like all right, we'll have 0:10:45.000 --> 0:10:48.760 a good night. And then he went, I'm kidding, and 0:10:48.800 --> 0:10:52.240 I went I asked you if you were kidding, and 0:10:52.280 --> 0:10:54.280 you said you weren't, and he goes, I thought you 0:10:54.280 --> 0:10:55.120 were a comedian. 0:10:55.720 --> 0:10:58.199 Oh my god. It all came running back. 0:10:58.200 --> 0:11:00.120 I was like, oh, you hate that this because he 0:11:00.200 --> 0:11:01.679 kept being like, so you do it for money? Like 0:11:02.360 --> 0:11:04.640 and so I go, what does that have to do? 0:11:04.679 --> 0:11:06.400 He goes, it's a bit. Why don't you get the 0:11:06.440 --> 0:11:08.800 bit like if you're a comedian, like it's and I 0:11:08.840 --> 0:11:11.920 go all right, and he's and then he went into 0:11:11.960 --> 0:11:15.120 this long tirade about like it's like being Will Smith 0:11:15.480 --> 0:11:18.280 you I and like censorship started quoting Chris Rock and 0:11:18.320 --> 0:11:20.480 it's like I've fought with Chris Rock, like he took 0:11:20.559 --> 0:11:23.720 chips off my plate. Don't fucking quote Chris Rock to me, Like, 0:11:23.880 --> 0:11:26.280 I don't think you know who you're fucking talking to, bitch, 0:11:26.320 --> 0:11:27.439 Are you out of your mind? 0:11:27.679 --> 0:11:27.880 Oh? 0:11:28.000 --> 0:11:28.760 By god? 0:11:29.280 --> 0:11:30.400 I didn't have anything to prove. 0:11:30.480 --> 0:11:34.160 I was just like what And he's like, uh, censorship 0:11:34.200 --> 0:11:36.559 as fucked. You have to allow all jokes or no jokes. 0:11:36.679 --> 0:11:39.320 I'm like, we're not instage. I don't care what you think. 0:11:39.320 --> 0:11:41.360 I'm like, I don't need this dynamic in my life. 0:11:41.360 --> 0:11:42.360 I'm like, you're not not. 0:11:42.240 --> 0:11:43.199 Allowing a joke. 0:11:43.440 --> 0:11:48.280 It's not funny, it's not a joke, Like, oh my god, honestly, 0:11:48.640 --> 0:11:51.000 it's really it's a nag. 0:11:51.200 --> 0:11:53.560 He's trying. He was trying to nag you, to throw 0:11:53.600 --> 0:11:54.680 you off. Oh yeah. 0:11:54.679 --> 0:11:56.319 So then he went did I just fuck this up? 0:11:56.400 --> 0:11:59.640 And I went yeah, and then I went inside and 0:11:59.640 --> 0:12:02.920 then it was like whatever. But and then it was 0:12:02.960 --> 0:12:04.840 pissed because I smoked weed and then I was too 0:12:04.920 --> 0:12:08.120 high to kind of do anything else. But so it 0:12:08.200 --> 0:12:10.600 was just so fucking annoying, and I know this type 0:12:10.640 --> 0:12:12.240 of parton, and it was just like I kept like 0:12:12.559 --> 0:12:14.720 allowing things to happen. And then at the end it 0:12:14.760 --> 0:12:17.120 was like, of course you're a weird little incel. 0:12:17.240 --> 0:12:17.720 I don't know. 0:12:17.880 --> 0:12:20.640 That's like, yeah, mad about my life because you have 0:12:20.679 --> 0:12:21.240 a roommate. 0:12:21.800 --> 0:12:24.240 I went on a double date with Jared's friend, him 0:12:24.280 --> 0:12:27.040 and his wife, and he convinced me for like half 0:12:27.080 --> 0:12:29.400 an hour that he had never tried to taco before 0:12:29.559 --> 0:12:31.360 and like, okay, that's kind of funny. 0:12:31.480 --> 0:12:32.760 Like after a half an. 0:12:32.720 --> 0:12:35.120 Hour, I was like, wait you seriously, He's like I 0:12:35.160 --> 0:12:37.240 live in Canada, like we just tacos are not as 0:12:37.280 --> 0:12:40.000 readily available, Like I just have never tried tacos before. 0:12:40.320 --> 0:12:42.040 That's like a stupid bit. 0:12:41.960 --> 0:12:45.440 Of like just kidding, Ah, gotcha, that's like dumb and 0:12:45.480 --> 0:12:49.000 stupid and like a funny joke, not like hi, everything 0:12:49.080 --> 0:12:52.120 about you and this interaction is like not going great 0:12:52.160 --> 0:12:52.400 for me. 0:12:52.679 --> 0:12:53.000 Jk. 0:12:53.360 --> 0:12:56.680 Like it's just not funny, Like you cannot explain to 0:12:56.720 --> 0:12:57.559 me how that's funny. 0:12:57.679 --> 0:12:59.439 Well, lying isn't a joke. 0:12:59.520 --> 0:13:01.120 And that's what I think a lot of people who 0:13:01.120 --> 0:13:04.600 think they're sarcastic or funny think, because he also was 0:13:04.640 --> 0:13:06.719 trying to convince me that he had like a Sopranos 0:13:06.760 --> 0:13:08.920 tattoo on his butt and then he didn't. 0:13:09.120 --> 0:13:11.959 And it's like okay, but what lying is not here? 0:13:12.320 --> 0:13:15.160 I don't get it, Like I'm not a cynic. I 0:13:15.200 --> 0:13:18.800 don't like lies. I don't really improve in life, like 0:13:18.840 --> 0:13:21.280 I'm not going with your bits. Okay, have you had 0:13:21.280 --> 0:13:23.280 a taco or not? I don't care about what you're 0:13:23.280 --> 0:13:26.280 about to do like I don't need this bit. I 0:13:26.320 --> 0:13:29.920 don't need it, like even with gay, Like when we're 0:13:29.920 --> 0:13:33.040 playing at Telestrations, there's one group of friends, my friend 0:13:33.080 --> 0:13:35.320 from her friends like to do little joke pictures and 0:13:35.360 --> 0:13:37.680 I go, what is this? I want to play this 0:13:37.840 --> 0:13:40.160 game how it's supposed to be played Like, I just 0:13:40.360 --> 0:13:41.360 I don't like fakeness. 0:13:41.400 --> 0:13:41.800 I don't know. 0:13:42.280 --> 0:13:45.520 Yeah, I hear you as grounded as possible is my 0:13:45.720 --> 0:13:48.160 level of living. And I don't need to be tricked 0:13:48.320 --> 0:13:49.640 and that you're not into this. 0:13:49.720 --> 0:13:51.520 It's like okay, yeah, but. 0:13:51.480 --> 0:13:52.839 It's kind of when I went on that date with 0:13:52.880 --> 0:13:54.400 the girl who came to my house and the first 0:13:54.440 --> 0:13:56.440 thing she said, she goes, that's what you decided to wear, 0:13:56.600 --> 0:13:58.800 And I was like, are we trying to fuck or what? 0:13:59.000 --> 0:13:59.080 Like? 0:13:59.200 --> 0:14:01.400 Why are you not nice to me? I just don't 0:14:01.480 --> 0:14:03.040 understand it. I don't get it. 0:14:03.200 --> 0:14:04.360 No, you gotta give a call. 0:14:04.480 --> 0:14:06.760 I mean you got I give a compliment just to 0:14:06.840 --> 0:14:09.000 a friend I see off like after a while, like 0:14:09.040 --> 0:14:09.720 great to see you. 0:14:09.720 --> 0:14:12.600 You look great? You know, like I like this, I 0:14:12.679 --> 0:14:15.160 like that, Like I like your bracelet whatever, you know. 0:14:15.360 --> 0:14:18.000 I just don't I just don't understand a world where 0:14:18.120 --> 0:14:20.000 you wouldn't be nice to the person you're trying to 0:14:20.000 --> 0:14:20.520 have sex with. 0:14:20.960 --> 0:14:23.080 Yeah, I just that's the thing. 0:14:23.280 --> 0:14:26.680 The entire thing of the pickup artist is against that. 0:14:27.000 --> 0:14:29.520 It's like, throw a woman off their guard, nag them, 0:14:30.120 --> 0:14:32.760 make them feel like they are lucky to have you. 0:14:32.880 --> 0:14:35.320 Like this kind of shit, you know, like where it's 0:14:35.480 --> 0:14:37.600 not about complimenting or being nice to the person you 0:14:37.600 --> 0:14:38.080 want to fuck. 0:14:38.160 --> 0:14:40.800 It's crazy, You're right. I don't know. I just don't 0:14:40.800 --> 0:14:41.160 find it. 0:14:41.200 --> 0:14:41.560 That guy. 0:14:41.600 --> 0:14:44.320 I hope he listens to the pod. No, yeah, I 0:14:44.360 --> 0:14:46.760 don't know. He's managing a nerd rapper. 0:14:46.960 --> 0:14:49.600 I don't know. I don't know what his life is. 0:14:49.680 --> 0:14:52.400 But was so annoyed. 0:14:53.320 --> 0:14:56.120 Oh my god. Well I'm glad everybody finally got the 0:14:56.160 --> 0:15:00.480 fucking story. I know, but it's so antyclic. 0:15:00.760 --> 0:15:03.160 No, we need the whole All of our dick wolf 0:15:03.240 --> 0:15:07.000 babies can send that man bad energy now, it's worth it. 0:15:07.720 --> 0:15:11.640 Yeah, it was just weird. It's like I couldn't have 0:15:11.680 --> 0:15:13.840 been more of a sure thing, Like you're meeting in 0:15:13.880 --> 0:15:14.760 my hotel. 0:15:14.440 --> 0:15:16.400 Bar, you know what I mean? Like, yeah, like it's 0:15:16.440 --> 0:15:17.200 like sex is. 0:15:17.200 --> 0:15:20.240 An elevator ride away, you stupid dumba I'm just like 0:15:20.480 --> 0:15:24.040 so confused that like all the behavior that had happened. 0:15:24.560 --> 0:15:28.080 But you know, it's the Internet, It's the wild West. 0:15:28.240 --> 0:15:29.560 It is oh man. 0:15:30.360 --> 0:15:33.200 Sometimes I I'm sad that I never really got to 0:15:33.240 --> 0:15:35.160 do Tinder, and other times I'm like, maybe it's for 0:15:35.200 --> 0:15:36.200 the best. 0:15:36.880 --> 0:15:37.760 Yeah, I don't know. 0:15:38.000 --> 0:15:40.120 It's like I think it's fun when you're on vacation, 0:15:40.480 --> 0:15:43.880 and then it's like, yeah, I don't know, a nightmare 0:15:43.920 --> 0:15:48.000 if you're where you're living. That's how I feel. Yeah, 0:15:48.040 --> 0:15:51.600 like in London, it's like eh, and then when you're 0:15:51.600 --> 0:15:52.520 in la it's like. 0:15:53.560 --> 0:15:59.160 Yeah, yeah, well what do you think We just get started? 0:15:59.320 --> 0:16:02.160 Get into today episode? We have an episode an early 0:16:02.240 --> 0:16:03.360 guy this week. 0:16:03.720 --> 0:16:06.920 Oh my god. Yeah, season one. I demanded this one. 0:16:07.040 --> 0:16:09.040 I don't know why, I just I demanded it. I 0:16:09.080 --> 0:16:11.560 remember sending an email being like we have to do it, 0:16:11.880 --> 0:16:13.160 and I'm glad to get it. 0:16:13.160 --> 0:16:13.760 It is good. 0:16:14.200 --> 0:16:16.240 It's a good one. We have a fun guest and 0:16:16.440 --> 0:16:22.960 let's just get going. Guys, stay where you are. So 0:16:23.160 --> 0:16:27.360 here we are back in season one, episode fourteen, A 0:16:27.640 --> 0:16:30.520 very pre nine to eleven date of February eleventh, two 0:16:30.600 --> 0:16:32.360 thousand is when this episode came out. 0:16:32.440 --> 0:16:34.480 It's called limitations. I don't even know if I said 0:16:34.480 --> 0:16:35.040 that already. 0:16:35.920 --> 0:16:39.800 Limitations And we open on a map and we hear 0:16:39.920 --> 0:16:42.280 this man talking about how there's been a bunch of 0:16:42.400 --> 0:16:45.200 robberies by the same guy with no arrest, and then 0:16:45.640 --> 0:16:49.960 Cam returns to Isaiah Whitlock junior legend, who I guess 0:16:50.040 --> 0:16:52.200 people know from the Wire. I don't because I've never 0:16:52.240 --> 0:16:55.600 seen the wire. Sadly you know him, Oh my god, 0:16:55.760 --> 0:16:59.080 veep like he's been a fifth Hour. He's been on 0:16:59.120 --> 0:17:01.680 six episodes of his playing all different kinds of roles. 0:17:01.920 --> 0:17:03.760 We want them on the pod. If you know, Isaiah, 0:17:03.840 --> 0:17:06.919 let us know. Yeah, yeah, yeah, that would be amazing. Actually, 0:17:06.920 --> 0:17:08.800 we need to find an episode where he's like more 0:17:08.960 --> 0:17:10.439 this is This would not be a good one for 0:17:10.520 --> 0:17:13.239 him because he's sitting there. He's under fire from this 0:17:13.320 --> 0:17:16.320 like neasily white man who is the commissioner. And this 0:17:16.440 --> 0:17:18.359 is one of those calm stat meetings where like the 0:17:18.440 --> 0:17:20.680 higher up cop guys who like never really do any 0:17:20.680 --> 0:17:22.879 actual work with people or victims, just scream at the 0:17:22.920 --> 0:17:25.640 detectives and humiliate them in front of their peers while 0:17:25.640 --> 0:17:27.120 they wear their fanciest uniform. 0:17:27.240 --> 0:17:28.800 It's like a sorority hazing. 0:17:29.119 --> 0:17:31.960 It's truly like, yeah, it's like get on your fanciest outfit. 0:17:32.040 --> 0:17:35.040 We're gonna scream at you in front of everyone. That 0:17:35.200 --> 0:17:35.760 is what it is. 0:17:37.160 --> 0:17:38.840 So I guess in a way like it is a 0:17:38.880 --> 0:17:41.000 good thing to have because it keeps police accountable and 0:17:41.040 --> 0:17:43.040 like calls out mistakes. But it always feels like on 0:17:43.200 --> 0:17:46.240 SVU they're just like find the rapist by tomorrow at 0:17:46.240 --> 0:17:48.719 noon or you're all fired, and it's like, okay, like 0:17:48.760 --> 0:17:52.720 it's not that easy, and the SVU guys are always like, 0:17:52.760 --> 0:17:56.760 we're actually trying quite hard. But anyway, Isaiah Whitlock is going, yeah, 0:17:56.760 --> 0:17:58.840 I'm sorry, we made a mistake because they didn't connect 0:17:58.880 --> 0:18:00.600 all these robberies to each other until it was like 0:18:00.720 --> 0:18:02.840 too late or something. And then at the end the 0:18:02.840 --> 0:18:04.639 Commissioner's like you're being reassigned. 0:18:04.680 --> 0:18:05.360 It's like brutal. 0:18:05.440 --> 0:18:07.080 It feels like it's at the end of the sorority 0:18:07.080 --> 0:18:09.200 thing and they're like you're cut, like you're not joining 0:18:09.440 --> 0:18:12.720 like so he kind of just gets up tail between 0:18:12.720 --> 0:18:14.840 his legs leaves. You see Benson and Stabler sitting in 0:18:14.840 --> 0:18:17.600 the gallery with Daddy Craigan, and Benson has a look 0:18:17.640 --> 0:18:21.719 on her face like goo and Craigs is up next, 0:18:21.960 --> 0:18:25.439 and they he says good morning, so apparently it's morning 0:18:25.480 --> 0:18:28.080 in this room, but the NYPD cannot afford light bulbs 0:18:28.160 --> 0:18:31.200 or windows. The room is dark. There is a seance 0:18:31.240 --> 0:18:34.639 happening in there. And the Commissioner is like, good morning, 0:18:34.920 --> 0:18:37.159 Captain Craigan heard there's a guy jacking off on the 0:18:37.200 --> 0:18:40.359 third Avenue bus and Craigan's like, never fear. Benson and 0:18:40.400 --> 0:18:43.919 Stabler got that guy yesterday. So now he throws up 0:18:43.920 --> 0:18:46.240 a random slide of a map of Manhattan with three 0:18:46.320 --> 0:18:49.600 dots at various addresses, and he's like he's trying to 0:18:49.640 --> 0:18:51.600 like pull one over on Craigan kind of, he's trying 0:18:51.600 --> 0:18:53.960 to make him look bad, and he's like, recognize this map, 0:18:54.280 --> 0:18:56.280 and he's like, no, I do not, and he's like, 0:18:56.640 --> 0:18:59.040 three break in reaps in less than a week, and 0:18:59.440 --> 0:19:02.679 the DNA backlog just matched them last week to the 0:19:02.760 --> 0:19:06.560 same unknown assailant. And Craigan's like, I do not remember that, 0:19:06.640 --> 0:19:07.840 and the Commissioner's like, well, if you. 0:19:07.840 --> 0:19:10.040 Had read your circular, you would know. And so I 0:19:10.080 --> 0:19:12.840 guess the circular is like a newsletter that the cops 0:19:12.960 --> 0:19:15.320 send out and expect everyone to read right away. 0:19:16.480 --> 0:19:19.720 I imagine a lot of spelling errors and weird commas 0:19:19.960 --> 0:19:22.080 I feel like, and Craig bar newsletter. 0:19:22.280 --> 0:19:24.520 Yeah, yeah, there's like an eagle clip art at the 0:19:24.560 --> 0:19:25.320 top of it, Like. 0:19:25.680 --> 0:19:29.480 Sure miss the word art options from Microsoft word I 0:19:29.520 --> 0:19:32.760 wish it had. I wish Google slides had that fun 0:19:33.080 --> 0:19:36.320 those fun words. I like the rainbows and the thing 0:19:36.600 --> 0:19:38.080 like the yeah. 0:19:37.640 --> 0:19:40.280 The turquoise. It looked like it was popping forward, Like 0:19:40.320 --> 0:19:40.960 I missed those. 0:19:41.560 --> 0:19:43.840 Yeah, you have to go find your own PMNG files 0:19:43.880 --> 0:19:47.439 now it's annoying. But so the guy goes with, you 0:19:47.440 --> 0:19:49.840 had read your circular, which I imagine yeahs like the 0:19:49.840 --> 0:19:52.800 Trader Joe's Fearless Flyer or whatever it's called, then you 0:19:52.800 --> 0:19:55.640 would know that this is newly identified rape pattern four 0:19:55.720 --> 0:19:58.520 nineteen ninety five. And Craigan's like, well, I was in 0:19:58.560 --> 0:20:00.760 homicide in nineteen ninety five, and he's like, this is 0:20:00.760 --> 0:20:03.360 still your case, homeboy, Like you better figure it out. 0:20:03.359 --> 0:20:05.119 And if you don't make any headway on these cases 0:20:05.160 --> 0:20:08.480 soon we will be time barred from prosecuting them due 0:20:08.480 --> 0:20:11.760 to the five year statute of limitations on rape in 0:20:11.800 --> 0:20:14.600 New York. So I wanted to just really briefly touch 0:20:14.640 --> 0:20:17.480 on this because the statute of limitations in New York 0:20:17.760 --> 0:20:20.920 was five years for rape and it has now as 0:20:20.960 --> 0:20:26.399 of twenty nineteen alleged sex pest and then Governor Andrew 0:20:26.440 --> 0:20:31.800 Cuomo passed a law expanding the statute of limitations. When 0:20:31.840 --> 0:20:34.440 I found the photo of the signing of this law, 0:20:34.960 --> 0:20:39.160 Julianne Moore was there, Mira Sorvino, Amber Tamblin and Season 0:20:39.200 --> 0:20:43.000 one and two's Michelle Hurd Jeffries was sitting right by 0:20:43.040 --> 0:20:45.399 the governor signing this and she's a big part. 0:20:45.240 --> 0:20:47.360 Of this episode. So I thought that was interesting. 0:20:48.480 --> 0:20:51.320 So under this new law, the statute of limitations for 0:20:51.359 --> 0:20:54.760 reporting second degree rape increases to twenty years and third 0:20:54.800 --> 0:20:58.639 degree rape increases to ten years. Previously both were five years. 0:20:59.160 --> 0:21:02.959 And then there is I believe, no statute of limitations 0:21:02.960 --> 0:21:05.280 for rape one. So I was just curious about the 0:21:05.320 --> 0:21:07.639 degrees and I look that up too. So rape in 0:21:07.720 --> 0:21:11.439 the third degree is just general non consensual sex. In 0:21:11.480 --> 0:21:13.800 the second degree it is when it happens with someone 0:21:13.800 --> 0:21:17.200 who is less than fifteen or incapable of consenting due 0:21:17.200 --> 0:21:19.760 to it like a mental disability or in capacity. And 0:21:19.800 --> 0:21:21.920 then rape in the first degree is when it happens 0:21:22.119 --> 0:21:24.400 with force, like there's a weapon involved. 0:21:24.600 --> 0:21:25.640 So that's why a lot of them. 0:21:25.520 --> 0:21:29.640 Are first degree in SVU because someone's usually at knife 0:21:29.680 --> 0:21:32.840 point or gunpoint or something like that, so there's an 0:21:32.880 --> 0:21:35.640 implied threat of violence or a real threat of violence. 0:21:36.040 --> 0:21:38.480 Or the victim is less than thirteen years old. And 0:21:38.480 --> 0:21:41.120 then it says or less than eleven years old if 0:21:41.119 --> 0:21:44.440 the alleged rapist is a minor, so that's rape one. 0:21:44.440 --> 0:21:45.480 That's the first degree. 0:21:46.359 --> 0:21:49.240 And so yeah, this new law is great because it 0:21:49.720 --> 0:21:52.520 extends it for most cases, and the statute of limitations 0:21:52.560 --> 0:21:55.000 for incests and the first degree extends to twenty years 0:21:55.480 --> 0:21:57.679 and it's great, But in this episode the statute is 0:21:57.720 --> 0:22:00.520 five years. So it's this is one of those count down, 0:22:00.600 --> 0:22:03.560 running against the clock episodes that we love slash hating. 0:22:03.560 --> 0:22:05.040 I know, but I just wish I could be there 0:22:05.040 --> 0:22:08.119 in the meeting when they all decided to make a limit, 0:22:08.400 --> 0:22:11.199 Like that's what is confusing to me, Like, I just 0:22:11.200 --> 0:22:13.320 don't even understand how you would why and how you 0:22:13.359 --> 0:22:13.880 would do this. 0:22:14.000 --> 0:22:16.080 Well, they talk about it in this episode. They talk 0:22:16.119 --> 0:22:18.960 about it later and they say it's like so that 0:22:20.840 --> 0:22:25.240 you know, American citizens don't walk around for inordinate amount 0:22:25.240 --> 0:22:27.760 of time, worried that the government can bring charges against 0:22:27.800 --> 0:22:29.800 them whenever they want. I think it's like to prevent 0:22:30.280 --> 0:22:33.159 government they I think they it's implied that it's like 0:22:33.200 --> 0:22:36.040 to prevent abuse of the system or something. 0:22:36.359 --> 0:22:37.480 But this was also. 0:22:37.359 --> 0:22:42.400 Before a lot of DNA and medical like scientific breakthroughs 0:22:42.400 --> 0:22:44.720 had happened, so people thought. 0:22:44.480 --> 0:22:45.800 Of rape a lot, as he said. 0:22:45.840 --> 0:22:47.800 She said, and I'm sure the reason that there's a 0:22:47.800 --> 0:22:49.840 statute of limitations is because it's like, well, you can't 0:22:49.880 --> 0:22:52.280 just let a woman ruin your life after ten years, 0:22:52.600 --> 0:22:56.000 like you know, it's bullshit, It's complete bullshit. But yeah, 0:22:56.040 --> 0:22:58.840 that is what they try to address it in this episode, 0:22:59.280 --> 0:23:00.520 like it's a constant, usual thing. 0:23:00.560 --> 0:23:03.520 But anyway, in this episode, we're dealing with five years. 0:23:03.520 --> 0:23:05.600 The commissioner asked Craig and if he's spoken to any 0:23:05.640 --> 0:23:07.760 of these victims, and he's like, no, I literally, you 0:23:07.920 --> 0:23:09.840 just told me about the pattern. And he says, well, 0:23:09.880 --> 0:23:11.280 today's your lucky day because one. 0:23:11.200 --> 0:23:11.800 Of them is here. 0:23:12.119 --> 0:23:14.480 And then the back doors of the comstat meeting open 0:23:14.560 --> 0:23:17.560 and this absolute boss bitch with a bumpet walks in 0:23:17.680 --> 0:23:21.080 like she owns the place, struts to the front, turns 0:23:21.080 --> 0:23:23.280 around like she's about to own the whole debate team. 0:23:23.640 --> 0:23:26.280 And her name is Victoria Kraft and she testifies about 0:23:26.280 --> 0:23:28.240 her rape in nineteen ninety five when a man broke 0:23:28.280 --> 0:23:32.040 into her apartment, stripped, got into bed with her, raped her, 0:23:32.160 --> 0:23:35.160 maced her, and then left and she notified police. 0:23:35.320 --> 0:23:38.160 Is like, such overkill. It's like you already did the rape. 0:23:38.160 --> 0:23:41.560 What do you make now for I think it's Nichoh yeah, 0:23:41.600 --> 0:23:43.760 maybe so they can't go after I don't know, I 0:23:43.760 --> 0:23:49.520 don't know. So horrible, and then she notified the police 0:23:49.520 --> 0:23:52.639 there's been no arrest and she is confused on the 0:23:52.720 --> 0:23:55.000 same as Lisa about why and me about why there 0:23:55.000 --> 0:23:57.600 even is a step five year statute of limitation on rape, 0:23:57.680 --> 0:24:00.199 and she jokes it's harder to dodge a parking tick it, 0:24:00.760 --> 0:24:03.240 and then she asks SVU to revisit the case before 0:24:03.240 --> 0:24:06.960 the statute expires, and Craigan thanks Misscraft and promises to 0:24:07.040 --> 0:24:10.320 assign her case the highest priority, and then we're at 0:24:10.320 --> 0:24:13.440 the credits. Baby, So now top of act one, we're 0:24:13.480 --> 0:24:17.000 back in the squad and Jeffries is like, hey, how 0:24:17.040 --> 0:24:20.240 is comstat as if Compstat's ever good, and they're all like, uh, 0:24:20.280 --> 0:24:23.520 it was terrible, and Munch says, yeah, compstat's like having 0:24:23.520 --> 0:24:27.160 the irs audit you every three weeks, I guess your work. 0:24:28.480 --> 0:24:32.280 But Craigan, you know, the consummate captain, is like, yeah, 0:24:32.320 --> 0:24:34.040 it's a pain in the ass, but it does help 0:24:34.119 --> 0:24:36.320 weed out the slackers who aren't pulling their weight, Like, 0:24:36.359 --> 0:24:38.360 it's not that bad for guys like me, who are 0:24:38.359 --> 0:24:41.240 like the best captain in the world. And that's you know, 0:24:41.280 --> 0:24:43.639 that's why Daddy Craigan's not like the other captains. 0:24:43.800 --> 0:24:44.640 And uh. 0:24:44.880 --> 0:24:48.720 He hands Jeffries the file on another victim named Jennifer 0:24:48.760 --> 0:24:51.080 Neil and tells Benson and Stabler to take the other 0:24:51.119 --> 0:24:56.560 two victims so they don't have an ID on the DNA. 0:24:56.800 --> 0:24:58.960 So they're just gonna call him John Doe one twenty 0:24:59.000 --> 0:25:02.280 one and his as we've as we've heard from Vicky 0:25:02.720 --> 0:25:04.919 breaking in getting into bed with the women. When they 0:25:04.960 --> 0:25:07.560 wake up, his faces covered with a stocking, attacks them, 0:25:07.600 --> 0:25:10.920 maces them, gets dressed in leaves. So they're wondering why 0:25:10.920 --> 0:25:13.119 did he stop at three, and Craigan's like, well, he 0:25:13.160 --> 0:25:16.200 may have started wearing a condom very possibly, and Munch 0:25:16.280 --> 0:25:20.320 is like, huh, a thoughtful rapist, and it's like classic Munch. 0:25:20.840 --> 0:25:22.680 So then The profile of this guy is he's a 0:25:22.720 --> 0:25:25.520 white male twenties at this point, maybe in his thirties, 0:25:25.560 --> 0:25:28.159 between five ten and sixty one, one hundred and sixty pounds, 0:25:28.160 --> 0:25:30.640 but that could have changed it. It's been five years long. 0:25:30.720 --> 0:25:33.160 Black or brown hair could be a buzz cut by now. 0:25:33.200 --> 0:25:34.439 They don't have a lot to go on. You just 0:25:34.440 --> 0:25:37.520 described like half the men in New York. Jeffries points 0:25:37.520 --> 0:25:40.520 out the statute and Craigan's like, yeah, that's the point, babe, 0:25:40.520 --> 0:25:42.199 Like that's what we're talking about. That's why we're hustling 0:25:42.200 --> 0:25:45.120 on this, and like she's like, but there's a statue. 0:25:45.400 --> 0:25:49.040 So I think this is also season one where they're 0:25:49.320 --> 0:25:52.320 still hammering a lot of the technical at you because 0:25:52.400 --> 0:25:55.160 it hasn't become secondhand language to the viewers the way 0:25:55.200 --> 0:25:57.520 it has now where you're like, oh, this is first degree, 0:25:57.560 --> 0:25:59.439 second degree this, so we're going to do that. So 0:25:59.480 --> 0:26:01.600 they're really like, I don't know, it feels like they're 0:26:01.600 --> 0:26:03.560 hammering in a lot of the like let's go over 0:26:03.600 --> 0:26:05.560 this guy's m O again. Let's go even though we 0:26:05.720 --> 0:26:07.800 just heard it five seconds ago in the open, you know, 0:26:07.920 --> 0:26:10.080 like they're just doing a lot of hammering. So anyway, 0:26:10.640 --> 0:26:13.320 Cragan is going to try to play some legal tricks 0:26:13.400 --> 0:26:16.000 and see if the DA can file an arrest warrant 0:26:16.080 --> 0:26:18.680 based on this guy's DNA, which is like sort of 0:26:18.720 --> 0:26:20.639 a sneaky way to get an extension so that they 0:26:20.680 --> 0:26:25.040 have more time. So they would seek a warrant for him, 0:26:25.040 --> 0:26:27.520 and instead of using his name in the warrant or 0:26:27.560 --> 0:26:30.320 address or something like that, they would use his DNA 0:26:30.800 --> 0:26:35.320 because that is individual to every single person. So Jeffrey says, oh, 0:26:35.320 --> 0:26:38.119 they're trying that in Wisconsin. So I do bet this 0:26:38.240 --> 0:26:39.960 was based on a real thing. I did not look 0:26:39.960 --> 0:26:43.480 it up. I'm sorry. Cragan writes that the amount of 0:26:43.520 --> 0:26:45.720 time they have in each case, he puts up a 0:26:45.720 --> 0:26:48.240 photo of every woman and over their faces he puts 0:26:48.400 --> 0:26:51.240 how much time they have, and it's four days, three days, 0:26:51.359 --> 0:26:53.480 one day, which is completely nuts. 0:26:53.560 --> 0:26:55.120 Like this is definitely a TV. 0:26:54.800 --> 0:26:56.919 Show to think that cops are going to solve a 0:26:56.960 --> 0:26:59.439 cold case in a day or even four days, but 0:26:59.560 --> 0:27:02.080 you know he was gonna try. So now we're in 0:27:02.119 --> 0:27:05.440 the apartment of Lois Crean. She is like this mousey 0:27:05.440 --> 0:27:08.720 little brunette who seems very like Cage and shy, and 0:27:08.800 --> 0:27:12.440 she's played by I believe it's pronounced Shawna se A 0:27:12.640 --> 0:27:17.080 na Shauna Kofo ed well, I don't know. I'm sorry, Shawna. 0:27:17.080 --> 0:27:19.840 I'm butchering your name in all ways. And she still 0:27:19.840 --> 0:27:22.400 actually works a lot and was a recurring on clause, 0:27:22.440 --> 0:27:24.320 but I cannot remember her character at all. 0:27:24.920 --> 0:27:28.200 But clauses on. That was like my favorite thing that. 0:27:29.480 --> 0:27:31.480 If you miss if you missed the video of me 0:27:31.600 --> 0:27:33.320 getting onto the plane, I was trying to show how 0:27:33.320 --> 0:27:36.040 I always walk past Lisa in first class and the 0:27:36.080 --> 0:27:37.600 minute this woman got out of the way so I 0:27:37.600 --> 0:27:39.879 could see Lisa with my camera, Lisa goes clauses on. 0:27:40.200 --> 0:27:40.800 It was great. 0:27:41.960 --> 0:27:44.720 So I think I watched Insecure on that flight and 0:27:44.920 --> 0:27:46.159 I watched so. 0:27:48.080 --> 0:27:51.720 It just it is good. It's just you don't You're 0:27:51.760 --> 0:27:52.560 not able. 0:27:52.280 --> 0:27:54.080 To get the full depth of how good a show 0:27:54.119 --> 0:27:55.919 is when you have to wait week after week, like 0:27:56.000 --> 0:27:58.119 the binge is the way to really appreciate it. And 0:27:58.160 --> 0:28:00.720 I watched it four in a row, and it's like yes, 0:28:00.880 --> 0:28:03.119 or two in a row or whatever. And that's what 0:28:03.160 --> 0:28:05.560 I'm gonna do with Hacks, Like I can't wait. I know, 0:28:05.640 --> 0:28:07.639 I just need to sit down and watch all the hacks. 0:28:07.800 --> 0:28:10.240 Yeah, and then I'm halfway through the first episode, and 0:28:10.280 --> 0:28:12.080 I'm like, I need to just sit when I have time. 0:28:12.359 --> 0:28:13.960 It's gonna be an incredible day. 0:28:14.320 --> 0:28:16.520 I mean, if my kids could stop getting diseases for 0:28:16.560 --> 0:28:17.840 one second, that would be great. 0:28:17.920 --> 0:28:21.879 I would love to watch hacks. So this woman. 0:28:21.640 --> 0:28:24.440 Lois is talking to Benson and Stabler and she looks terrified, 0:28:24.560 --> 0:28:28.280 like her like like body language is terror one oh one, 0:28:28.400 --> 0:28:31.000 and she's asking they're asking her like, how did the 0:28:31.000 --> 0:28:33.000 guy leave? It doesn't really say in your report how 0:28:33.040 --> 0:28:35.680 he left. And she's like, great question, I don't remember. 0:28:36.119 --> 0:28:38.720 And then they show her a floor plan and she's like, oh, yeah, 0:28:38.720 --> 0:28:40.280 in my old apartment, you had to go through the 0:28:40.320 --> 0:28:42.200 bathroom to get to the bedroom. I'm like that so 0:28:42.360 --> 0:28:45.080 New York, like just go past a toilet to get 0:28:45.080 --> 0:28:47.400 into bed. And she thinks he must have just gone 0:28:47.400 --> 0:28:48.880 out the front door. And then they give her a 0:28:48.880 --> 0:28:52.320 card and they tell Lois, you did great, right, And 0:28:52.440 --> 0:28:54.840 she's like it didn't help, Like she's so a mess, 0:28:54.880 --> 0:28:56.920 Like she looks like she's about to break at any moment. 0:28:57.560 --> 0:29:00.320 So we cut to the courthouse where Craigan is hering 0:29:00.360 --> 0:29:03.080 the Ada and her name is Kathleen Eastman and she 0:29:03.240 --> 0:29:06.400 is played by Jenna Stern. She has been on not 0:29:06.440 --> 0:29:08.560 only Criminal Intent and Original, but she has been on 0:29:08.600 --> 0:29:12.959 twenty episodes of SVU because she only plays Kathleen Eastman 0:29:13.000 --> 0:29:15.200 in two episodes in season one and then they bring 0:29:15.280 --> 0:29:18.920 her back in season thirteen as trial judge Elana Barth. 0:29:19.600 --> 0:29:22.360 So she's like, you know how you always have your 0:29:22.400 --> 0:29:26.400 girl Lois? Who's Lewis slash Lois. She's the older redhead, 0:29:26.440 --> 0:29:28.440 I would say, and this is like the younger redhead. 0:29:28.720 --> 0:29:32.280 She straightened out hair right, like yeah, yeah. 0:29:31.920 --> 0:29:35.240 Exactly, and she's like still recording. She was just on 0:29:35.360 --> 0:29:38.120 season twenty three, so she's still in the SVU fam. 0:29:38.600 --> 0:29:40.680 And anyway, she's like headed down the hallway with a 0:29:40.680 --> 0:29:43.120 big ass filebox and some extra files that just won't 0:29:43.160 --> 0:29:45.160 fit in, and Craigan's just like begging her to get 0:29:45.160 --> 0:29:47.440 a judge to issue a warrant for this guy based 0:29:47.480 --> 0:29:49.840 on DNA instead of name, and she's like, oh, the 0:29:49.880 --> 0:29:52.640 Wisconsin maneuver, Like everyone keeps talking about Wisconsin again. 0:29:52.680 --> 0:29:55.320 I refuse to look it up. We don't have precedent. 0:29:55.360 --> 0:29:57.720 And Craigan is like, be the president you want to 0:29:57.760 --> 0:30:00.320 see in the world, Like he is like, let's we 0:30:00.360 --> 0:30:02.280 could start this in New York if you want it, 0:30:02.680 --> 0:30:04.600 and she's like, dude, that's a lot of legal work. 0:30:04.640 --> 0:30:07.440 And he's like, okay, how about if this guy, this 0:30:07.560 --> 0:30:09.840 rapist is your next cab driver, Like he just fully 0:30:09.840 --> 0:30:12.880 scare tactics her, and she's like, you're right, I don't 0:30:12.880 --> 0:30:14.320 want to get raped in a cab, and so she 0:30:14.400 --> 0:30:16.880 takes the paperwork and gives him the like fuck, I 0:30:16.880 --> 0:30:20.200 guess I'll try look so. In the next scene, Munch 0:30:20.200 --> 0:30:22.400 and Jefferies are talking to the third victim, who is 0:30:22.480 --> 0:30:25.720 Jennifer Neil played by an actress named Jenny Bacon, who 0:30:25.760 --> 0:30:28.080 I always remember exactly from this episode. 0:30:28.120 --> 0:30:29.040 She just has this. 0:30:29.520 --> 0:30:32.200 Very calm way of speaking and in my mind she's 0:30:32.200 --> 0:30:34.280 the thumbnail of this episode, whether or not she's the 0:30:34.320 --> 0:30:35.640 thumbnail for real on Hulu. 0:30:35.840 --> 0:30:36.040 Well. 0:30:36.120 --> 0:30:39.720 Also, these three victims are very like the Three Little 0:30:39.720 --> 0:30:41.600 Pigs and the Big Bad Wolf, Like they each have 0:30:41.960 --> 0:30:48.880 very specific personalities. Yes, like the Brunette is definitely like 0:30:48.920 --> 0:30:51.000 her house is made of straw, she's a mess, and 0:30:51.040 --> 0:30:51.959 that I don't know. 0:30:52.040 --> 0:30:56.080 I can't decide the other two, but I think definitely 0:30:56.200 --> 0:30:57.280 Victoria's one is. 0:30:57.240 --> 0:30:59.640 Made out of bricks because she's like the fucking boss 0:30:59.680 --> 0:31:02.400 bitch who was like threatening people to take them down. Yes, 0:31:02.480 --> 0:31:05.720 but is that really the strongest That's what I'm oh, 0:31:05.760 --> 0:31:09.040 you're right, like, is she actually would because it's a front. 0:31:09.560 --> 0:31:10.440 She's not healed. 0:31:11.240 --> 0:31:14.040 I might be giving something what I'm sorry, Okay, who 0:31:14.040 --> 0:31:15.280 knows of this healed? 0:31:15.520 --> 0:31:17.840 But yeah, we know nothing yet. 0:31:18.160 --> 0:31:21.480 So Jennifer Neil's telling them about her rape and saying 0:31:21.480 --> 0:31:23.080 it was the worst moment of her life, but that 0:31:23.240 --> 0:31:25.800 wasn't all. What happened after that changed my life. 0:31:26.320 --> 0:31:26.720 She says. 0:31:26.760 --> 0:31:29.760 The love and support she received after her attack reaffirmed 0:31:29.760 --> 0:31:32.640 her faith in humanity. She felt suicidal, and the people 0:31:32.640 --> 0:31:34.440 in her life took care of her. She realized she 0:31:34.480 --> 0:31:37.480 was part of a community. And then they tell her 0:31:37.680 --> 0:31:40.360 we're reopening the case because there were two other victims, 0:31:40.360 --> 0:31:43.600 like we've connected them now through DNA, And she's like, 0:31:43.800 --> 0:31:47.200 oh okay, and they're like, can you tell us anything, 0:31:47.200 --> 0:31:48.640 And she's like, I mean, here's what I told the 0:31:48.640 --> 0:31:51.320 other cops. This guy knew my dog's name, he knew 0:31:51.320 --> 0:31:54.360 the restaurant where I sometimes ate breakfast. But she also says, 0:31:54.400 --> 0:31:56.440 I just want this all to end, Like I don't 0:31:56.440 --> 0:31:58.920 think she cares that her Statute of limitations is coming up. 0:31:58.920 --> 0:32:03.520 She doesn't seem like she's not pressed. Yes, exactly. 0:32:04.280 --> 0:32:07.680 So back to Frantic Kraigan accosting people in courthouses. He 0:32:07.760 --> 0:32:11.240 and the Redhead are chasing down Judge Allan Riddanore, who 0:32:11.240 --> 0:32:14.240 has been on thirteen ups of SVU, seasons one through ten. 0:32:14.680 --> 0:32:17.000 He's got the bald top hair in the big back 0:32:17.040 --> 0:32:18.160 and then the hair in the back and then the 0:32:18.160 --> 0:32:20.240 big bushy mustache and he's like always kind of very 0:32:20.240 --> 0:32:23.040 sarcastic and funny. And I did see that he actually 0:32:23.080 --> 0:32:26.479 passed away in twenty seventeen. So rip to Harvey Atkin, 0:32:26.600 --> 0:32:30.000 the man who plays Judge Alan Riddanore. But in this scene, 0:32:30.040 --> 0:32:32.640 he's like he's like hustling through the courthouse and he's like, 0:32:32.680 --> 0:32:34.600 I want my lunch, you know, Like he's like a 0:32:34.640 --> 0:32:38.160 surly judge looking for food. And they're like selling him 0:32:38.320 --> 0:32:43.160 on this idea of issuing a warrant based on DNA, 0:32:43.680 --> 0:32:46.520 and he brings up Wisconsin again and says, yeah, but 0:32:46.560 --> 0:32:50.040 Wisconsin doesn't have New York's powerful defense bar. And he's like, 0:32:50.080 --> 0:32:51.800 you guys have had five years, why don't you give 0:32:51.840 --> 0:32:53.400 me to the end of the day, to make my decision. 0:32:53.600 --> 0:32:55.480 At least it's not a no. Right. That's good. 0:32:56.000 --> 0:32:58.760 So now Benson and Stabler are back talking to Victoria Kraft, 0:32:58.760 --> 0:33:00.680 the woman we met at the Comstown meeting, and she 0:33:00.960 --> 0:33:03.680 was never impressed with her original detective. She said they 0:33:03.680 --> 0:33:06.960 were neither the best nor the brightest. She hired a 0:33:06.960 --> 0:33:10.240 private investigator and hands them over the files. 0:33:10.240 --> 0:33:11.960 She's like, I wanted someone who answered to me. 0:33:12.720 --> 0:33:15.280 And she said, well, he discovered that the security of 0:33:15.280 --> 0:33:17.479 my building was bad, so I am suing them. And 0:33:17.560 --> 0:33:20.800 then there's this guy on a bike and the neighbor 0:33:20.880 --> 0:33:23.360 saw a kid speed away on a bike. That's a 0:33:23.400 --> 0:33:25.320 bit a tidbit that comes out of this file from 0:33:25.320 --> 0:33:30.200 the private investigator. So now we've instantly, in hours, tracked 0:33:30.200 --> 0:33:32.760 down that neighbor who five years ago saw a guy 0:33:32.840 --> 0:33:33.960 speed away on a bike. 0:33:34.200 --> 0:33:34.880 Very SVU. 0:33:35.280 --> 0:33:37.400 They're talking to him outside. He knows exactly where he 0:33:37.560 --> 0:33:40.719 was five years earlier. He goes, I was outside smoking 0:33:40.760 --> 0:33:42.560 a butt. And I really just love that because when 0:33:42.560 --> 0:33:44.120 I smoked, that's always what we called it. 0:33:44.160 --> 0:33:45.280 We would always be like, do you want to go 0:33:45.280 --> 0:33:46.200 outside and smoke a butt? 0:33:46.280 --> 0:33:49.280 Like we constantly, like my sister and I would be like, 0:33:49.800 --> 0:33:51.240 oh my god, my sister and I would be like, 0:33:51.280 --> 0:33:53.320 oh my god, I asked so many bees last night, 0:33:53.440 --> 0:33:55.640 like we would just the way we always talked about 0:33:55.640 --> 0:33:59.480 smoking butts. Yeah, I don't know why that was my vernacular. 0:33:59.480 --> 0:34:02.720 So this man kindred spirits. So he saw a man 0:34:02.760 --> 0:34:05.520 on a bike speeding away from the building the night 0:34:05.560 --> 0:34:08.960 of the attack. And the guy goes, oh, yeah, that bike. 0:34:09.080 --> 0:34:13.040 It's this kind of bike with the reflectorized lime green paint. 0:34:13.080 --> 0:34:15.640 It had the like he knows everything about this bucking bike. 0:34:15.680 --> 0:34:19.120 And they're like, okay, make model everything, and he's like, well, 0:34:19.160 --> 0:34:21.080 I oughta I worked in a bike shop for over 0:34:21.120 --> 0:34:23.920 twenty eight years, so I like that. They happen to 0:34:23.920 --> 0:34:26.719 find a bike expert who caught a biker and he's like, 0:34:26.840 --> 0:34:29.439 here's a weird thing. The guy was wearing a motorcycle 0:34:29.480 --> 0:34:32.920 helmet on a bike and he was wearing a jumpsuit 0:34:33.000 --> 0:34:35.080 and they're like, maybe a uniform and the guy goes, 0:34:35.120 --> 0:34:37.200 I don't know, it's been five years. It's like okay, 0:34:37.200 --> 0:34:40.960 but sir, the bike knowledge, you know everything else. So 0:34:41.080 --> 0:34:43.600 now back in the courtroom, Craigan and the Redhead are 0:34:43.640 --> 0:34:46.000 waiting with baited breath for the judge's verdict, and he 0:34:46.120 --> 0:34:49.120 says that they have a great idea there, it's a 0:34:49.160 --> 0:34:51.080 novel idea and that it but it is not his 0:34:51.200 --> 0:34:52.920 job to rule on novel ideas. 0:34:53.239 --> 0:34:56.160 And so he is rejecting the request for the warrant. 0:34:56.160 --> 0:34:59.520 But he is also passed the paperwork already onto an 0:34:59.520 --> 0:35:02.760 appellet judge because he said, if my decision is reversed, 0:35:02.760 --> 0:35:04.120 I want it to be done soon enough that you 0:35:04.120 --> 0:35:05.920 guys can get some good out of it. So would 0:35:06.040 --> 0:35:09.719 can you believe a bureaucratic position he's actually trying to 0:35:09.719 --> 0:35:10.520 push things through. 0:35:10.360 --> 0:35:12.200 A little bit quicker. Yeah, but why don't you just 0:35:12.360 --> 0:35:14.760 rule on that? Like that's what's annoying. 0:35:15.080 --> 0:35:16.840 It's like, I'm going to rule on this, but hopefully 0:35:16.880 --> 0:35:19.040 it'll get overturned. And it's like, you have the power. 0:35:19.200 --> 0:35:21.920 But I think it's because appellet courts have like a 0:35:21.960 --> 0:35:25.200 different power. Like I think it's like he has to 0:35:25.280 --> 0:35:27.480 just follow the law, and I think that appellate judges 0:35:27.520 --> 0:35:29.200 maybe are able to I mean, all of our lawyer 0:35:29.200 --> 0:35:30.520 people are going to write it and be like, carry, 0:35:30.520 --> 0:35:32.719 you're full of shit. I just got the impression that 0:35:32.760 --> 0:35:37.120 maybe an impellate judge could bend like laws more or 0:35:37.360 --> 0:35:40.600 like constitutions or something. So I have no idea, but 0:35:40.680 --> 0:35:42.440 it is a great question. Why didn't you just say yes? 0:35:43.600 --> 0:35:45.520 Because I know it was like an appellet judge that 0:35:45.600 --> 0:35:47.360 dropped the mask mandate, you know what I mean, Like 0:35:47.400 --> 0:35:49.640 it's it always feel maybe I'm just making this up. 0:35:49.719 --> 0:35:51.120 Tell us, please law people. 0:35:51.840 --> 0:35:55.839 So Victoria, here's what it's been denied and runs out 0:35:55.840 --> 0:35:56.520 of the courtroom. 0:35:56.680 --> 0:35:57.440 She's upset. 0:35:57.480 --> 0:36:00.600 Olivia goes after her and she's like, we're gonna appeal. 0:36:00.600 --> 0:36:03.680 It's gonna be okay, and Victoria is like, no, fuck you, 0:36:03.760 --> 0:36:06.359 it's not gonna be okay. I'm pissed you waited five 0:36:06.440 --> 0:36:09.480 years to do this hot, half cocked legal maneuver, she says, 0:36:09.920 --> 0:36:12.720 And then she's like, I endured everything, the rape exam, 0:36:12.880 --> 0:36:14.879 the intimate details of my life that I gave you, 0:36:15.040 --> 0:36:16.560 and I thought I was gonna get some help, but 0:36:16.640 --> 0:36:19.480 today you guys just said to me again, sorry, Vicky, 0:36:19.760 --> 0:36:21.640 you got raped and we're not going to do jack 0:36:21.680 --> 0:36:23.960 about it. And then she says, thank you for making 0:36:24.000 --> 0:36:26.200 this the second worst day of my entire life. 0:36:26.320 --> 0:36:30.160 I think you know what the first was well harsh. 0:36:30.360 --> 0:36:34.160 Svu monologues for a thousand, Alex okay, top. 0:36:34.000 --> 0:36:34.440 Of AC two. 0:36:34.520 --> 0:36:37.600 It's a new day in the workroom. Vicky's case has expired. 0:36:37.680 --> 0:36:39.480 But they're funny, we need to do that. 0:36:40.440 --> 0:36:43.359 I hate saying the precinct back in the squad room. 0:36:43.440 --> 0:36:46.520 It's the workroom. Oh my god, they're back in the workroom. 0:36:47.080 --> 0:36:50.280 Well, it's like, truly, it's sunny day. Everyone's wearing different clothes. 0:36:50.320 --> 0:36:53.400 It's the next day. And so Vicky's case has expired, 0:36:53.680 --> 0:36:56.680 like you know, he crosses it off on the list 0:36:56.719 --> 0:36:58.839 of ones that they can still work on. But there's 0:36:58.920 --> 0:37:01.239 still two days on low Us case and three days 0:37:01.239 --> 0:37:04.280 on Jennifer's case. So this is yeah, like the pressure 0:37:04.360 --> 0:37:08.280 is mounting. Benson points out that Victoria can still testify 0:37:08.320 --> 0:37:10.400 at the trial for one of the other rape victims 0:37:10.520 --> 0:37:11.240 under Molino. 0:37:11.800 --> 0:37:15.400 So I look up Malino, of course, and that is basically. 0:37:16.160 --> 0:37:19.799 Normally, evidence of a prior wrongdoing of crimes is not admissible, 0:37:19.880 --> 0:37:22.359 but in the Malino rule, or the Molino exception it's 0:37:22.360 --> 0:37:26.480 sometimes called, it is allowed if it's more probative than prejudicial, 0:37:26.560 --> 0:37:32.120 to prove, for example, motive, opportunity, intent, preparation, common scheme 0:37:32.239 --> 0:37:37.080 or plan, knowledge, identity, absence of mistake or accident or 0:37:37.120 --> 0:37:40.520 conduct that is inextricably interwoven with the charged ax. 0:37:40.800 --> 0:37:43.840 Okay, then what is not Molino? It seems like it's everything. 0:37:44.440 --> 0:37:47.359 I think it's like you can't just be like like 0:37:47.400 --> 0:37:49.000 if there's a rape, you can't just be like, well, 0:37:49.040 --> 0:37:51.080 one time in high school, this guy pinched my butt. 0:37:51.160 --> 0:37:54.640 Like that doesn't really like that doesn't really lead like 0:37:54.719 --> 0:37:57.440 to a pattern. This is like more of a specific 0:37:57.520 --> 0:38:00.200 pattern because the guy had the same exact m can 0:38:00.239 --> 0:38:04.080 talk about like crimes that have similar ems, So I 0:38:04.120 --> 0:38:07.160 guess this would count as Malino, and Munch calls Munch 0:38:07.239 --> 0:38:10.120 is pissed. He calls Malono another right wing and run 0:38:10.160 --> 0:38:13.279 around the constitution. And Craigan's like, what the fuck, Munch, 0:38:13.320 --> 0:38:14.960 do you want to get this guy or what? And 0:38:15.000 --> 0:38:16.560 He's like, of course I do. I just think in 0:38:16.600 --> 0:38:19.360 the name of cracking down on crime, we throw civil 0:38:19.360 --> 0:38:20.880 liberties to the winds sometimes. 0:38:21.360 --> 0:38:22.920 And like, I think. 0:38:22.760 --> 0:38:25.279 He's arguing this because he's like, look back in the day, 0:38:26.080 --> 0:38:28.839 I used to be a thorn in the government's side. 0:38:28.840 --> 0:38:31.400 He probably protested Vietnam. He probably did a bunch of 0:38:31.440 --> 0:38:34.359 shit and got arrested for some civil disobedience and He's like, 0:38:34.440 --> 0:38:36.520 I'm glad that there are laws that protect the government 0:38:36.600 --> 0:38:40.680 from just capriciously arresting me, which is very much how 0:38:41.400 --> 0:38:45.560 conspiracy theorists work and just about you. But it's also 0:38:45.719 --> 0:38:49.439 not capricious, like Jeffries goes, there's no capricious arrest here. 0:38:49.480 --> 0:38:52.080 There's DNA, like we know who this person is. Like, 0:38:52.440 --> 0:38:54.839 no one's coming in to just arrest you and saying, 0:38:54.880 --> 0:38:56.719 well that one time you threw a rock at a 0:38:56.760 --> 0:38:59.359 cop back in like sixty nine. You know that's not 0:38:59.400 --> 0:39:01.840 what is happening here. But you know, Munch always has to. 0:39:02.080 --> 0:39:04.800 There's like a writer who's like, I write for Munch, 0:39:04.840 --> 0:39:08.760 and all of my conspiracy theory shit and like kind 0:39:08.760 --> 0:39:14.920 of like very very almost socialist shit gets through for Munch. 0:39:15.680 --> 0:39:19.040 But anyway, not that there's anything wrong with socialism, it's 0:39:19.080 --> 0:39:20.880 just it's very you know Munch's point of view. 0:39:21.080 --> 0:39:23.360 Yeah, but he might be like a libertarian vibe. 0:39:23.440 --> 0:39:25.200 Yeah, that's what That's kind of what I was trying 0:39:25.239 --> 0:39:27.560 to say, more a libertarian more fuck the government, get 0:39:27.560 --> 0:39:30.560 off my lawn. Yeah, so don't tread on me flag 0:39:30.600 --> 0:39:31.399 on his pickup truck. 0:39:31.480 --> 0:39:33.239 Absolutely, Munch okay, And. 0:39:33.200 --> 0:39:35.600 So Craigan's like all right, let's all get back to work, like, 0:39:35.719 --> 0:39:37.799 as you know, we have five minutes to finish this case. 0:39:38.239 --> 0:39:40.960 Sabler wants to go visit all the old cops who 0:39:40.960 --> 0:39:43.600 worked on these cases, and Munch is like, oh, yeah, great, 0:39:43.640 --> 0:39:46.360 it'll be like seeing the old SVU alumni association. 0:39:46.880 --> 0:39:47.040 Like. 0:39:47.560 --> 0:39:51.160 So they go and they talk to a female detective 0:39:51.320 --> 0:39:53.799 who remembers the case being really frustrating. She was like, 0:39:53.800 --> 0:39:55.600 there were no leads. One of it was one of 0:39:55.640 --> 0:39:57.759 the reasons I transferred. And they're like, oh, because it 0:39:57.800 --> 0:40:00.719 was like frustrating, and she was like no, because Vicki 0:40:00.800 --> 0:40:04.320 Kraft sued me and my partner for dereliction of duty 0:40:04.800 --> 0:40:07.320 and so it like she's like it all got handled. 0:40:07.320 --> 0:40:09.680 Like I like, it sounds like, you know, internal affairs 0:40:09.760 --> 0:40:12.600 or whatever, your reps or whatever handled the suit. Like 0:40:12.880 --> 0:40:15.040 the actual monetary part of the suit was thrown out. 0:40:15.040 --> 0:40:17.600 But I guess she left SPU over that. And so 0:40:17.640 --> 0:40:19.879 she said, you know, we were working at twenty four 0:40:19.880 --> 0:40:22.440 to seven, there were just no suspects, like, but I 0:40:22.480 --> 0:40:24.680 had a clear mental picture of who this guy was. 0:40:24.960 --> 0:40:27.280 And they're like, oh, do tell and she's like, well, listen, 0:40:27.600 --> 0:40:30.319 he gets past two locked doors at a lot of 0:40:30.320 --> 0:40:32.880 these buildings, like you got to get buzzed into those, 0:40:32.960 --> 0:40:35.920 and no tenants remember letting anyone in, although someone must have. 0:40:36.320 --> 0:40:38.120 So this is the kind of guy that like no 0:40:38.160 --> 0:40:43.000 one notices, probably a white guy, underemployed, filled with resentment. 0:40:43.480 --> 0:40:46.239 And then they tell her, hey, by the way, we 0:40:46.320 --> 0:40:48.640 linked this to two other rapes, and she's like, oh man, 0:40:48.800 --> 0:40:51.600 I hate to hear it. And so now Benson and 0:40:51.600 --> 0:40:55.239 Stabler are talking to another former detective from Jennifer Neil's case, 0:40:55.280 --> 0:40:57.480 and he works at like a trucking company now or something. 0:40:57.520 --> 0:40:59.920 He's not a cop anymore, and he remembers the guy 0:41:00.040 --> 0:41:02.799 I knew a lot about the victim, like what kind 0:41:02.800 --> 0:41:05.520 of car she had, where she worked, what she liked 0:41:05.560 --> 0:41:08.080 to buy, when she went shopping, where she shopped, and 0:41:08.560 --> 0:41:10.279 we thought maybe he was like tapping her phone or 0:41:10.320 --> 0:41:12.359 reading her mail, but he's like, you know, it never 0:41:12.400 --> 0:41:14.640 gets sent, makes sense till you get them into interrogation, 0:41:15.000 --> 0:41:17.640 and Live is like, tell me about it. And then 0:41:17.840 --> 0:41:19.400 they tell him like, oh yeah, we're talking to the 0:41:19.440 --> 0:41:21.840 other cops like there was another victim, and he's like, 0:41:21.960 --> 0:41:23.759 oh man, Like he's also kind of bummed to hear 0:41:23.760 --> 0:41:25.279 that there were other victims, and he's like, well, who 0:41:25.320 --> 0:41:28.719 got the other girl's case? And he's talking about Lois's 0:41:28.760 --> 0:41:32.520 case and he goes, oh, Detective Dan Latimer and the 0:41:32.560 --> 0:41:35.840 guy goes, oh hell, Like he goes, this guy is 0:41:35.880 --> 0:41:37.600 just one of those guys that shouldn't be a cop. 0:41:37.680 --> 0:41:40.120 And he's like he thought most rapes were fantasies. And 0:41:40.160 --> 0:41:43.120 he's retired now and he owns a cop bar and 0:41:43.440 --> 0:41:45.360 guys go out there to like talk shit, and you 0:41:45.400 --> 0:41:46.839 guys should go out and see him. And then they 0:41:46.880 --> 0:41:50.040 ask this guy Roy, like what made you bounce from SVU? 0:41:50.200 --> 0:41:52.560 And he gives this like little monologue where he's like, yeah, 0:41:52.640 --> 0:41:55.080 you know, we had this victim. She was raped and 0:41:55.160 --> 0:41:58.239 murdered and that's the usual stuff, but like she had 0:41:58.239 --> 0:42:00.320 marks all over her body like she'd been tore orchard 0:42:00.400 --> 0:42:00.879 for a week. 0:42:01.080 --> 0:42:03.400 And her first name was Jojo. 0:42:03.719 --> 0:42:05.960 And he was like, nobody sees what we see and 0:42:06.000 --> 0:42:07.640 it was just like you could just tell this guy 0:42:07.800 --> 0:42:10.680 was like I've been touched by what I've seen on 0:42:10.719 --> 0:42:14.920 when I worked in SVU. So at the cop bar, uh, 0:42:15.440 --> 0:42:18.960 we are talking to this asshole cop and he's like, 0:42:19.560 --> 0:42:22.680 sex crimes detectives are just garbage collectors, do your two 0:42:22.760 --> 0:42:25.319 years and get out, and Olivia's like, okay, cool. Twenty 0:42:25.360 --> 0:42:28.879 three years later and then this guy is played by 0:42:29.000 --> 0:42:31.120 John Doman, who is booked and blessed. 0:42:31.120 --> 0:42:31.440 Baby. 0:42:31.480 --> 0:42:33.640 He is in so much shit. He was in Trial 0:42:33.680 --> 0:42:36.399 of the Chicago Seven. He's in the new show City 0:42:36.440 --> 0:42:39.080 on a Hill with our buddy Delaney Williams's. 0:42:39.320 --> 0:42:40.759 He was in the Affair Gotham. 0:42:41.000 --> 0:42:43.760 But he's also been on five episodes of SBU, including 0:42:43.840 --> 0:42:48.000 Liza's least favorite episode Shaherazade, where he plays Mike Molinax. 0:42:48.080 --> 0:42:51.720 And I remember, you know that episode with Brian Dennehy. Yeah, 0:42:51.800 --> 0:42:54.840 I think Mike Mollinax is like a main he's the 0:42:54.880 --> 0:42:57.680 main guy. Like he's the guy that Paget like thinks 0:42:57.760 --> 0:43:01.279 is her dad or whatever. But like this is you know, 0:43:01.640 --> 0:43:03.879 he's in a that big episode. So I know this guy, 0:43:04.640 --> 0:43:05.839 but I don't know if I just know him from 0:43:05.920 --> 0:43:07.719 SVU because he's in a lot of them. So he 0:43:07.800 --> 0:43:10.879 remembers Lois's case, but Benson's like, well, you barely made 0:43:10.920 --> 0:43:13.480 any notes, and he goes you'll learn like he's you 0:43:13.640 --> 0:43:16.359 hate this guy immediately, and it's like, yeah, do not 0:43:16.400 --> 0:43:18.399 talk down to Benson. You can tell she's already getting 0:43:18.440 --> 0:43:21.239 steamed up. And then Stabler's like does his like, let 0:43:21.320 --> 0:43:24.040 me handle this before Benson flips out on him, and 0:43:24.280 --> 0:43:26.239 he's like, well, what did you think happened? Like give 0:43:26.320 --> 0:43:29.200 us your insight? And Latimer's like, oh, the whole story's 0:43:29.280 --> 0:43:32.160 right there, ons and they're like ons, and he's like, 0:43:32.360 --> 0:43:35.239 one night stand, she was a bookworm. If she even 0:43:35.239 --> 0:43:36.960 caught a guy, she wouldn't know what to do with it. 0:43:37.320 --> 0:43:39.920 He thinks that she just like had sex or regretted it. 0:43:40.239 --> 0:43:44.080 And now she's making it up and Benson is getting 0:43:44.480 --> 0:43:48.279 more and more steamed, and now we the camera backs 0:43:48.360 --> 0:43:51.280 up and we see that this fucking psychopath is drinking 0:43:51.320 --> 0:43:55.480 a tall glass of milk at a bar that he owns. 0:43:56.480 --> 0:43:58.880 I cannot forgive this, No, it's disgusting. 0:43:58.960 --> 0:44:01.000 I actually lived a very sheltered life, and I didn't 0:44:01.040 --> 0:44:02.920 know people drank milk with their dinner until I went 0:44:02.960 --> 0:44:04.480 to college in Iowa and I was like, I need 0:44:04.480 --> 0:44:06.319 to get out of here, like I don't belong here. 0:44:06.360 --> 0:44:08.920 Oh really, what did you drink with dinner? Usually water? 0:44:09.239 --> 0:44:13.640 I don't know, water, juice like bubbly stuff, mineral, I 0:44:13.680 --> 0:44:15.440 don't know I don't, but definitely not. 0:44:15.680 --> 0:44:18.880 Early milk, only milk, and we like had to finish. 0:44:18.920 --> 0:44:21.640 But you're kind of jewy. I don't understand. Did you 0:44:21.680 --> 0:44:24.000 guys not eat meat? Like I just would never want no, 0:44:24.160 --> 0:44:24.600 we ate me. 0:44:24.719 --> 0:44:26.600 It was just like it was just like a thing 0:44:26.640 --> 0:44:29.239 that my parents' parents probably told them, so they were 0:44:29.280 --> 0:44:31.239 just doing to us, like there's no reason behind us. 0:44:31.360 --> 0:44:33.440 It's the got milk at yeah, it's the Yeah, it's 0:44:33.480 --> 0:44:33.759 like the. 0:44:33.719 --> 0:44:36.320 Milk mustaches, milk does a body good, all that bullshit, 0:44:36.360 --> 0:44:39.319 Like we just had to drink milk, like Rosy drinks milk. 0:44:39.320 --> 0:44:41.360 Now I offer it to her, but like I'm like, 0:44:41.360 --> 0:44:42.239 if you don't want it, you don't have. 0:44:42.239 --> 0:44:45.279 To have that's ahay, that's a tiny child allowed no no. 0:44:45.239 --> 0:44:47.640 But they say that even after like two or three, 0:44:47.800 --> 0:44:49.960 like the benefits of cow's milk is like their bones 0:44:50.000 --> 0:44:52.120 are doing okay, like you know, they're getting calcium from 0:44:52.239 --> 0:44:53.840 cheese and other things. Like you don't have to like 0:44:53.880 --> 0:44:56.200 be pumping milk down their throats like the way we 0:44:56.200 --> 0:44:58.279 did when we were kids or not you but me. 0:44:59.000 --> 0:45:01.720 So it it's just disgusting to see this man drinking 0:45:01.719 --> 0:45:04.800 a glass of milk like full nighttime glass of milk. 0:45:04.840 --> 0:45:05.759 Well you're gonna love this. 0:45:06.120 --> 0:45:08.680 So, you know, my nephew, the Littlest Meet had nephew 0:45:08.680 --> 0:45:10.960 went to camp and then when they arrive, they write 0:45:11.000 --> 0:45:12.600 a letter and it gets scanned and sent to the 0:45:12.640 --> 0:45:15.879 parents like technology whatever, But they write the letter, and 0:45:15.960 --> 0:45:18.960 all his letters said was I forgot my protein powder. 0:45:19.040 --> 0:45:21.799 Please send it. You're not allowed to bring protein powder 0:45:21.840 --> 0:45:26.760 to my camp. Really, you can't bring anything like extra 0:45:26.840 --> 0:45:28.080 to eat or anything like that. 0:45:28.520 --> 0:45:31.080 Yeah, I wonder. I mean his grandma runs the camp. 0:45:31.120 --> 0:45:31.800 I don't know what to tell you. 0:45:32.040 --> 0:45:34.840 Oh wow, Okay, he's in the buck with his cousin. 0:45:36.480 --> 0:45:40.120 So anyway, there's absolutely no way in hell that this 0:45:40.200 --> 0:45:42.399 man at his age is handling dairy well. And I'm 0:45:42.480 --> 0:45:44.799 just like really sickened by watching him drink a full 0:45:44.800 --> 0:45:47.640 glass of milk. But that's also a funny add to 0:45:47.680 --> 0:45:49.120 his character because he's so terrible. 0:45:49.200 --> 0:45:49.279 Well. 0:45:49.360 --> 0:45:51.600 Yeah, I'm saying at a friend's house a couple nights 0:45:51.640 --> 0:45:53.440 ago and they offered me a white Russian and I 0:45:53.480 --> 0:45:55.200 was like, are you out of your fucking mind? 0:45:56.160 --> 0:45:59.040 I've never had a white Russian for that reason, but 0:45:59.280 --> 0:46:00.239 people say they're good. 0:46:00.320 --> 0:46:00.640 I don't know. 0:46:00.680 --> 0:46:02.640 I just have never felt like drinking milk when I'm 0:46:02.640 --> 0:46:04.920 out to like drink, I don't know, and I'm a 0:46:04.920 --> 0:46:06.200 big big Lebowski fan. 0:46:06.360 --> 0:46:07.680 I just haven't had a white Russian. 0:46:08.920 --> 0:46:13.120 So Stabler breaks the news to this asshole that hey, 0:46:13.160 --> 0:46:15.640 by the way, that rapist was a cereal so she 0:46:15.719 --> 0:46:17.839 didn't make it up and it's real and he did 0:46:17.880 --> 0:46:19.839 it to two other women that we know of. And 0:46:19.880 --> 0:46:21.960 the guy goes, so, I made a mistake. Let me 0:46:21.960 --> 0:46:24.040 buy you a drink. And it's like, what a fucking 0:46:24.080 --> 0:46:28.120 shot of two percent? You fucking psycho. Anyway, Benson storms 0:46:28.160 --> 0:46:28.960 away from the table. 0:46:29.080 --> 0:46:29.719 She hates this. 0:46:29.800 --> 0:46:33.560 Man, as do I, and then we are smash cut 0:46:33.640 --> 0:46:36.960 non just kidding. We cut to the appellate hearing for 0:46:37.000 --> 0:46:40.160 the warrant, and the judge there is like, Okay, I 0:46:40.239 --> 0:46:43.040 see what you're trying to do here, but why if 0:46:43.080 --> 0:46:45.560 we can just do a DNA on this rapist, we 0:46:45.600 --> 0:46:47.760 can just issue a warrant based on this rapist DNA. 0:46:48.400 --> 0:46:50.799 Why can't we just do that on every rape and 0:46:51.080 --> 0:46:53.000 just get the DNA, get a warrant, and then we'll 0:46:53.000 --> 0:46:55.319 find the purp at our leisure And she argues, well, 0:46:55.320 --> 0:46:57.919 this is a unique circumstance, and the judge is like, yes, 0:46:57.920 --> 0:46:59.560 but like where would it end? Would it even stop 0:46:59.560 --> 0:47:01.560 at rapist? Would we just do this to every mugger, 0:47:01.600 --> 0:47:04.799 every turnstile jumper. I think that people like this worry 0:47:04.800 --> 0:47:09.880 about this turning into like what is it, what's like 0:47:10.239 --> 0:47:12.840 nineteen twelve, eighteen twelve or whatever, like a Big Brother 0:47:12.920 --> 0:47:15.200 situation where the government has all of our DNA on 0:47:15.320 --> 0:47:17.680 file and is like us using it to track us 0:47:17.719 --> 0:47:18.920 down for crimes we didn't commit. 0:47:18.960 --> 0:47:19.319 I don't know. 0:47:20.320 --> 0:47:23.680 But Craigan stands up and is like, sir, we have 0:47:23.760 --> 0:47:25.120 two days to get this guy. 0:47:25.520 --> 0:47:26.200 And the judge is. 0:47:26.200 --> 0:47:28.719 Like, I feel you, bro, but we cannot circumvent the law. 0:47:29.040 --> 0:47:30.520 And the application is denied. 0:47:30.600 --> 0:47:33.279 And Lois is there, and now she's stop inviting these 0:47:33.280 --> 0:47:35.920 women to these fucking warrant hearings, like just let them 0:47:35.960 --> 0:47:38.360 know later. Like Lois is there and she has a 0:47:38.400 --> 0:47:41.360 fucking full panic attack. She like breaks down, is crying, 0:47:41.560 --> 0:47:45.160 like it just feels like another you know, door slamming 0:47:45.160 --> 0:47:48.080 in her face. And so now they're at Lois's place 0:47:48.120 --> 0:47:50.160 at the top of back three and they're telling She's 0:47:50.160 --> 0:47:52.600 telling them a little bit more about like her situation 0:47:52.719 --> 0:47:54.319 she's opening up to them more than she did, I 0:47:54.320 --> 0:47:57.080 guess in like the first talk they had, and she's like, 0:47:57.120 --> 0:47:58.960 you know, at the time, I was twenty four, the 0:47:58.960 --> 0:48:01.320 biggest thing that had ever happened to me was Brandon 0:48:01.400 --> 0:48:03.680 Lee's death. The son of Bruce Lee, died on the 0:48:03.719 --> 0:48:06.400 set of The Crow, much like in what happened with 0:48:06.440 --> 0:48:08.200 the Alec Baldwin thing. I think it was like a 0:48:08.239 --> 0:48:11.040 gun that was loaded with a I actually think it 0:48:11.080 --> 0:48:13.279 was loaded with a blank, but he was shot with 0:48:13.320 --> 0:48:15.680 a blank that killed him, which I didn't even know 0:48:15.719 --> 0:48:18.480 that blank's I thought blanks were a noise. But anyway, 0:48:18.800 --> 0:48:20.960 this I remember this happening. This happened when I was 0:48:21.000 --> 0:48:23.560 probably like, yeah, eleven or something or ten, and it 0:48:23.640 --> 0:48:25.799 was like a thing everybody like talked about, and it 0:48:25.880 --> 0:48:29.640 was he was very beloved by people, and she and 0:48:29.680 --> 0:48:31.880 her best friend, she said, went to go see The 0:48:31.880 --> 0:48:34.680 Crow over and over and over again. And then when 0:48:34.719 --> 0:48:37.920 she's talking about the assault, she's like, the actual sex 0:48:37.960 --> 0:48:40.600 part wasn't the worst. She'd even thought about what would 0:48:40.600 --> 0:48:43.000 happen if this happened to her, And it was just 0:48:43.200 --> 0:48:46.760 that afterwards, he knew she liked Brandon Lee. He wanted 0:48:46.760 --> 0:48:49.120 to talk about the crow, and she's like, I just 0:48:49.160 --> 0:48:50.959 wanted him to go, and he wanted to talk about 0:48:50.960 --> 0:48:53.680 all these things that were my things, and like he 0:48:54.000 --> 0:48:56.279 like that felt like more of a violation to. 0:48:56.239 --> 0:48:57.839 Her that he just like knew about her. 0:48:57.920 --> 0:49:01.080 And then like after violating her, was like, let's chat 0:49:01.760 --> 0:49:04.480 and he left. At when he left, he said, you're 0:49:04.520 --> 0:49:08.239 a sweetheart, Lollie, and she says, the only person who 0:49:08.239 --> 0:49:10.560 calls me Lolli is my grandmother and like how would 0:49:10.560 --> 0:49:13.080 he know that? And she goes, the last detective told 0:49:13.080 --> 0:49:14.799 me to go to a shrink, like he didn't believe me, 0:49:14.800 --> 0:49:16.120 and I'm like, yes, that's milkman. 0:49:16.239 --> 0:49:16.880 He's the worst. 0:49:17.320 --> 0:49:19.200 And the purp new things about her she had never 0:49:19.200 --> 0:49:20.880 talked about on the phone, so she doesn't think it 0:49:20.920 --> 0:49:23.600 was a phone tap situation. She's like, he knew, like 0:49:23.640 --> 0:49:26.120 where I went rollerblading in the park, Like he knew 0:49:26.160 --> 0:49:27.719 what I was doing in the real world, not on 0:49:27.760 --> 0:49:30.920 a phone. And Olivia is like, well, could he have 0:49:30.960 --> 0:49:34.040 been on a bike and she was like, yes, I 0:49:34.160 --> 0:49:37.239 told the other detective about a green bicycle and he 0:49:37.280 --> 0:49:39.799 said I was going to see my rapist everywhere I went. 0:49:39.880 --> 0:49:42.319 At first, like he tried to tell her that she 0:49:42.480 --> 0:49:46.240 was seeing things, and she said he was always around 0:49:46.280 --> 0:49:48.279 and I just kept seeing him and I knew it 0:49:48.360 --> 0:49:51.239 was him, the man on the green bike. Okay, so 0:49:51.320 --> 0:49:53.800 this is a this is a turn. We're feel like 0:49:53.800 --> 0:49:55.879 we're getting somewhere in a five year case right now. 0:49:57.000 --> 0:49:59.799 Now we're at a PI firm and we're talking to 0:49:59.840 --> 0:50:02.719 the who Vicky hired about the guy on the green bike, 0:50:02.760 --> 0:50:04.399 and he pulls the file because he's like, I don't 0:50:04.400 --> 0:50:07.080 really even remember this, and he thought maybe it was 0:50:07.120 --> 0:50:11.000 this messenger service called Green Machine Bike Messengers, and he's like, 0:50:11.040 --> 0:50:12.759 I didn't tuck to anyone there because they went out 0:50:12.800 --> 0:50:17.279 of business. So now back at the workroom, we're discussing 0:50:17.360 --> 0:50:20.719 how this guy stalks the women, follows them on his 0:50:20.760 --> 0:50:25.120 bike for months, and Stabler goes, yeah, it's textbook power 0:50:25.160 --> 0:50:29.759 reassurance rapist behavior. So the spying is a prelude to 0:50:29.800 --> 0:50:32.040 the rape, like it's like making sure that you have 0:50:32.120 --> 0:50:36.480 power over the situation. And then Jeffries has a lead. 0:50:36.640 --> 0:50:38.839 She found the owner of Green Machine and he now 0:50:38.880 --> 0:50:43.000 owns a laundromat called Clean Machine. Loll to the writer's room, 0:50:43.520 --> 0:50:45.880 so Jeffries and Munch go to pay this guy a 0:50:45.960 --> 0:50:48.320 visit and he's at his laundromat, and he confirms the 0:50:48.400 --> 0:50:50.799 jumpsuits and the bikes, and then they're like, can we 0:50:50.800 --> 0:50:52.359 look at your records? Could you look up a couple 0:50:52.400 --> 0:50:54.839 of addresses for us on your computer. He pulls out 0:50:54.840 --> 0:50:57.200 a full summer camp trunk, like my trunk that I 0:50:57.239 --> 0:51:00.000 have for camp that is filled with old letters and playbills, 0:51:00.600 --> 0:51:03.760 and he's like, here are my files. And he's like, listen, 0:51:03.920 --> 0:51:06.120 I was a better cyclist than I was a businessman, 0:51:06.320 --> 0:51:08.360 Like I kind of forgot to pay my taxes and 0:51:08.360 --> 0:51:10.000 then one of my guys got hurt and I didn't 0:51:10.000 --> 0:51:12.800 have the right insurance. And he gives them the trunk 0:51:12.880 --> 0:51:14.560 and he's like, yeah, take all my records. If the 0:51:14.600 --> 0:51:16.680 irs comes after me again, I can tell them the. 0:51:16.719 --> 0:51:18.360 Cops took them. It's a perfect excuse. 0:51:18.760 --> 0:51:21.200 And so now the gang is back at the house 0:51:21.239 --> 0:51:23.000 and they are diving into these files, but it's going 0:51:23.040 --> 0:51:25.040 to take forever. It's like stacks and stacks and stacks 0:51:25.040 --> 0:51:27.840 of like very thin pieces of paper, and Jeffrey says 0:51:28.680 --> 0:51:31.200 they could just look at the billing records. So immediately 0:51:31.440 --> 0:51:34.040 looking at the billing records for ten seconds, Olivia finds 0:51:34.080 --> 0:51:37.360 four deliveries to Jennifer's workplace in the week before her rape. 0:51:37.760 --> 0:51:40.120 So then they immediately go over to Jennifer's work to 0:51:40.160 --> 0:51:42.360 ask her about it, and she's like, yes, I remember 0:51:42.400 --> 0:51:44.880 the messenger company, And when they ask do you recall 0:51:44.920 --> 0:51:48.319 anyone specific, she says, I'd rather not say, And so 0:51:48.360 --> 0:51:51.200 she's stonewalling them in a weird twist of events, and 0:51:51.280 --> 0:51:54.240 she tells them that in five years a lot can change, 0:51:54.239 --> 0:51:56.200 and she thinks it's wrong to pursue this, let's just 0:51:56.320 --> 0:51:59.640 drop it, and she thinks the statute of limitations might 0:51:59.680 --> 0:52:01.279 be good, like you have your certain amount of time 0:52:01.320 --> 0:52:02.960 to try, but if you fail, you just get to 0:52:02.960 --> 0:52:05.600 move on to other things. And Benson's like, okay, but 0:52:05.680 --> 0:52:07.600 the five years is not over yet, and I want 0:52:07.680 --> 0:52:10.520 to figure this out. And Stabler's like, this guy is 0:52:10.520 --> 0:52:12.440 a danger to others, and she's like, but what if 0:52:12.440 --> 0:52:15.000 he's not. And then Benson has a light bulb moment 0:52:15.040 --> 0:52:17.680 where she's like, you know who this guy is and 0:52:17.719 --> 0:52:21.560 she explains. Jennifer explains that she met him by accident. 0:52:21.680 --> 0:52:25.600 She recognized him, he didn't recognize her. She talked to him, 0:52:25.840 --> 0:52:27.720 which is crazy because if he was wearing a stalking 0:52:27.719 --> 0:52:29.520 over his face. How did you recognize him? But he 0:52:29.560 --> 0:52:32.200 didn't recognize you when he stalked you for four months. Anyway, 0:52:32.880 --> 0:52:36.359 she talked to him about his life, which she says 0:52:36.480 --> 0:52:38.839 was a hard life, and that when she was satisfied 0:52:38.880 --> 0:52:41.799 he had changed, she revealed her identity to him and 0:52:41.880 --> 0:52:44.440 he wanted to turn himself in and she talked him 0:52:44.440 --> 0:52:47.000 out a bit, and Benson is like getting very ragy. 0:52:47.080 --> 0:52:49.040 She's like, why would you do that? And he's like, 0:52:49.760 --> 0:52:53.640 she goes, he's a changed man. We prayed together, and 0:52:53.680 --> 0:52:56.720 then Ben a stabler, goes, you prayed with your rapist 0:52:57.239 --> 0:53:00.440 and he tries to tell her, like, these guys do 0:53:00.520 --> 0:53:02.840 not change. She's still a danger and she says, I 0:53:02.880 --> 0:53:03.600 disagree with you. 0:53:04.960 --> 0:53:05.160 Now. 0:53:05.160 --> 0:53:08.480 In interrogation with Jennifer, Olivia asks like, oh, what religion 0:53:08.520 --> 0:53:10.680 are you and we find out she's a Quaker and 0:53:10.719 --> 0:53:13.080 a member of the Society of Friends. Oh, they have 0:53:13.080 --> 0:53:16.120 a history of Pacifism. They believe that if you sit silently, 0:53:16.239 --> 0:53:18.359 God can speak to you, and this and that, and 0:53:18.920 --> 0:53:22.040 she believes her attacker reformed, and she says that it 0:53:22.160 --> 0:53:25.640 says love your enemy and the Bible and Olivia is like, well, 0:53:25.840 --> 0:53:27.680 I know a little bit about everything, so I do 0:53:27.800 --> 0:53:31.319 know that the Quakers created the penal system and she says, yes, 0:53:31.320 --> 0:53:33.880 but it's been perverted and the prisons are filled with violence. 0:53:34.200 --> 0:53:37.200 And then Olivia goes, well, if you're serious about prison reform, 0:53:37.360 --> 0:53:40.480 join prison watch. Like she's getting pissed about all the 0:53:40.480 --> 0:53:43.480 different ways that angles of this woman's taking and Olivia 0:53:43.600 --> 0:53:45.640 is arguing with her that it's great you came to 0:53:45.680 --> 0:53:47.880 peace with this, but like, what about the other victims, 0:53:48.160 --> 0:53:50.480 And she says, I'm not turning him in to satisfy 0:53:50.560 --> 0:53:54.480 some abstract concept of justice, and Olivia's like, it's not abstract, honey, 0:53:54.480 --> 0:53:57.480 it's very concrete. This guy's stalked, riped, and maced these women, 0:53:57.600 --> 0:53:59.759 and they deserve their justice, you know. 0:54:00.480 --> 0:54:01.600 So then they bring in. 0:54:01.520 --> 0:54:04.760 The other two victims to talk to Jennifer and Vicky 0:54:04.920 --> 0:54:07.920 is like, which I wonder if they would do in 0:54:07.960 --> 0:54:11.799 real life, only because if they talk to each other, 0:54:11.840 --> 0:54:16.000 it's like remember the Nicole Sullivan episode where she gets 0:54:16.080 --> 0:54:18.279 raped on the subway, and they like, they have all 0:54:18.320 --> 0:54:20.080 the women together in the same room, and that kind 0:54:20.120 --> 0:54:21.840 of negates it all because that gives them kind of 0:54:21.840 --> 0:54:23.880 a chance to like compare stories and get their stories 0:54:23.960 --> 0:54:24.680 straight together. 0:54:25.000 --> 0:54:25.400 I don't know. 0:54:25.560 --> 0:54:27.480 I just wonder if this would happen in real life anyway. 0:54:28.719 --> 0:54:31.840 Vicky's like, give me the name, and she thinks. Jennifer 0:54:32.280 --> 0:54:33.799 is like, she's like, you just want them all for 0:54:33.840 --> 0:54:35.879 yourself because you're holding the power of life and death 0:54:35.920 --> 0:54:37.879 over him. You can dime him out whenever you want, 0:54:38.400 --> 0:54:40.880 and that that's like why you're doing this, and you know, 0:54:40.960 --> 0:54:44.279 Jennifer's like, that's not why, and she's like, trust me, 0:54:44.400 --> 0:54:46.960 finding the name won't change anything. And that part like 0:54:47.040 --> 0:54:48.920 annoys me because it's like you don't know what will 0:54:49.080 --> 0:54:51.279 it will change for someone else, Like it didn't change 0:54:51.320 --> 0:54:53.279 it for you, but that doesn't mean it won't change 0:54:53.280 --> 0:54:57.160 it for someone else. So Vicky goes into full attack 0:54:57.239 --> 0:54:59.840 mode and is like, uh, I know your job and 0:55:00.280 --> 0:55:03.680 my company provides insurance for them, and I will take 0:55:03.840 --> 0:55:06.200 all of the health insurance away from your company if 0:55:06.280 --> 0:55:08.480 you do not tell me this man's name, Like I 0:55:08.480 --> 0:55:10.680 will tell your job that you're harboring a fugitive and 0:55:10.680 --> 0:55:13.520 that you're they're employing a hater of women or whatever. 0:55:13.840 --> 0:55:15.239 And Vicky's just going all in. 0:55:15.360 --> 0:55:17.879 She is a savage and then Lois just has a 0:55:17.920 --> 0:55:20.160 full meltdown, screaming at Jennifer, being. 0:55:20.000 --> 0:55:21.759 Like, do you know what it's like to never leave 0:55:21.760 --> 0:55:22.240 in the house. 0:55:22.600 --> 0:55:25.440 I'm like, she's so paranoid and this man's clearly like 0:55:25.600 --> 0:55:28.960 ruined her sense of safety. And she's like, I want 0:55:29.000 --> 0:55:31.480 him to pay tell me his name, you stupid bitch. 0:55:31.640 --> 0:55:34.080 One of the best lines, and you know, obviously we 0:55:34.120 --> 0:55:37.560 love that line. So then Jennifer says to Lois, I 0:55:37.600 --> 0:55:39.640 hope you find peace, and she goes, shut up, you. 0:55:39.760 --> 0:55:40.839 Freak like cold. 0:55:40.880 --> 0:55:43.799 I I mean, I feel for Lois so badly, Like 0:55:43.840 --> 0:55:46.279 I would kill this woman. Like she's so good at 0:55:46.280 --> 0:55:50.000 this part because she's so even keeled and zen, but 0:55:50.280 --> 0:55:53.760 that kind of temperament when I'm mad makes me crazy. 0:55:53.840 --> 0:55:54.439 Oh yeah. 0:55:54.480 --> 0:55:56.640 But it's also the vibe it's like anti choice people 0:55:56.640 --> 0:55:58.080 and stuff where it's like, well, this is what. 0:55:58.080 --> 0:55:59.840 Works for me, so it must work for all. 0:56:00.440 --> 0:56:02.560 Yeah. Yeah, I'm able to see outside of yourself in 0:56:02.640 --> 0:56:05.680 any way, and yeah, I hate her. 0:56:06.239 --> 0:56:10.200 Yeah, It's like I'm like, you should be able to 0:56:10.320 --> 0:56:12.759 like maybe tell this guy. Hey, we're gonna like they're 0:56:12.800 --> 0:56:14.640 investigating this. Other victims are gonna have to turn you in, 0:56:14.719 --> 0:56:16.440 Like I'll pray for you in jail. I'll visit you 0:56:16.440 --> 0:56:18.200 in jail, Like you can do your own bullshit that 0:56:18.239 --> 0:56:21.920 you want to do to like maintain your your forgiveness 0:56:21.920 --> 0:56:24.000 of this man. But that's your You can't make these 0:56:24.040 --> 0:56:27.719 decisions for other people. So in Cragan's office, we have 0:56:27.840 --> 0:56:30.360 fifteen hours. So they're going to ask a judge for 0:56:30.400 --> 0:56:33.320 a material witness order for Jennifer and compel her legally 0:56:33.440 --> 0:56:36.200 to talk. And Benson has this look on her face like, oh, 0:56:36.280 --> 0:56:40.959 that is not morally sound, and Stabler's like, yeah, we've 0:56:40.960 --> 0:56:43.640 never forced a rape victim to testify, and you know, 0:56:43.760 --> 0:56:46.120 Craigan does his usual you want this guy to walk like, 0:56:46.239 --> 0:56:49.719 Craigan gets really chaotic sometimes when he's trying to get 0:56:49.719 --> 0:56:53.000 a case closed. So in court they ask Jennifer to 0:56:53.040 --> 0:56:55.400 approach the bench and she refuses to tell the judge, 0:56:55.400 --> 0:56:58.080 even under threat of civil jail, who the identity of 0:56:58.120 --> 0:57:00.719 this man is. And she gets tempt of court and 0:57:00.760 --> 0:57:03.360 gets put into a woman's house of detention and Olivia 0:57:03.480 --> 0:57:05.400 just goes up to her like last ditch and goes, 0:57:05.640 --> 0:57:07.239 you can speak at his trial. You don't have to 0:57:07.320 --> 0:57:09.680 do this, and she's like, you know what, like how 0:57:09.719 --> 0:57:10.960 do you know what your values are? 0:57:11.040 --> 0:57:12.439 And until you put them to the test. 0:57:12.480 --> 0:57:14.279 I think we're both doing what we think is right, 0:57:14.360 --> 0:57:16.600 but we just disagree about what that is. And then 0:57:16.680 --> 0:57:19.680 Craigan asks Olivia, like are you okay? And she goes, well, 0:57:19.680 --> 0:57:21.520 we just sent a rape victim to lock up, so 0:57:21.840 --> 0:57:25.160 I'm not great. And now in the top of Act four, 0:57:25.480 --> 0:57:28.480 Commissioner Morris, the nasally white man from the beginning at 0:57:28.480 --> 0:57:31.880 the comstat meeting, makes a reappearance. He waltz into Daddi 0:57:31.920 --> 0:57:34.720 Craigan's office and he's like, we got to talk, and 0:57:34.840 --> 0:57:37.480 he's like he's just not psyched about the rape victim 0:57:37.520 --> 0:57:39.800 being sent to lock up. And he's like, I have 0:57:39.880 --> 0:57:41.880 to file a letter of complaint just for the record. 0:57:41.920 --> 0:57:43.720 And he's like, okay, well, who's putting you up to this? 0:57:44.120 --> 0:57:47.080 Victims rights groups? The press, and he's like, and the 0:57:47.120 --> 0:57:49.040 mayor and the police commissioner, and I'm like, I thought 0:57:49.080 --> 0:57:51.120 you were the police commissioner, but whatever. I find it 0:57:51.160 --> 0:57:53.520 hard to believe that the press would even cover this, 0:57:53.880 --> 0:57:55.880 Like the New York Post would be like dumb slut 0:57:55.880 --> 0:57:58.000 won't give up rapists, like for the headline, Like I 0:57:58.080 --> 0:58:00.800 just don't even know if this would get covered in 0:58:00.840 --> 0:58:02.880 a way where they would feel the pressure at one PP, 0:58:03.120 --> 0:58:07.920 like no one riches involved, maybe Victoria is rich anyway, Basically, 0:58:07.920 --> 0:58:10.120 the guy's being political and Craigin's like, I don't have 0:58:10.160 --> 0:58:11.919 time for this, and he's just like, you just want 0:58:11.920 --> 0:58:14.600 to cover your ass in case we don't bust this guy, 0:58:14.640 --> 0:58:17.400 which may happen, and we're running out of time. So 0:58:17.480 --> 0:58:20.920 Craigan's like, you only brought up the fact that these 0:58:21.200 --> 0:58:24.000 rapes were linked for your political reasons, and you brought 0:58:24.000 --> 0:58:26.080 it up at comstat to like kind of humiliate me 0:58:26.120 --> 0:58:28.400 and like make it political, and he's like, no, it 0:58:28.520 --> 0:58:30.520 was in the circular and Craigan's like, yeah, but you 0:58:30.520 --> 0:58:32.920 could have actually told me I lost three days instead 0:58:32.920 --> 0:58:34.680 of just waiting for me to like thumb through my 0:58:34.760 --> 0:58:37.840 circular or whatever it is. And he's like, you're dangerously 0:58:37.880 --> 0:58:41.640 close to insubordination, captain, and then he goes, well, then 0:58:41.720 --> 0:58:43.720 write me up or get the fuck out of here, 0:58:43.800 --> 0:58:46.040 because I got work to do until you take this 0:58:46.120 --> 0:58:48.200 job away from me, and I only have till midnight. 0:58:48.600 --> 0:58:50.560 So yeah, tick tick tick, we do not have much 0:58:50.560 --> 0:58:51.080 time left. 0:58:52.000 --> 0:58:55.120 Benson and Stabler are talking to a guy at the 0:58:55.160 --> 0:58:57.720 Quaker meetinghouse. And this man is like a part time 0:58:57.800 --> 0:59:02.520 in voluntary not like priests, but like maybe some kind 0:59:02.560 --> 0:59:05.160 of spiritual leader at the Quaker house who listens to, 0:59:05.400 --> 0:59:08.040 you know what, other people when people need counseling. But 0:59:08.080 --> 0:59:10.920 he's also a psychologist and he tries he tried to 0:59:11.000 --> 0:59:14.440 convince Jennifer to send this guy to jail. He's like, yeah, 0:59:14.480 --> 0:59:17.240 Quakers are all over the justice system. They're judges, they're lawyers, 0:59:17.280 --> 0:59:19.360 they're on juries. Like it's not a part of our 0:59:19.400 --> 0:59:21.680 religion that she can't send this guy to jail. And 0:59:21.720 --> 0:59:24.680 then they go, okay, well, can you give us a 0:59:24.680 --> 0:59:26.720 list of your members? And he's like that I won't do, 0:59:26.920 --> 0:59:30.120 like we have a history of civil disobedience, slavery, Vietnam, 0:59:30.280 --> 0:59:33.160 like all things that the Quakers have protested, and like 0:59:33.520 --> 0:59:35.800 we're not going to like just give you our list 0:59:35.800 --> 0:59:38.840 of people so that you can later, I don't know, prosecute. 0:59:39.040 --> 0:59:42.120 So Olivia says, we'll get a warrant, and he goes, okay, 0:59:42.200 --> 0:59:43.800 go ahead and get your warm but when you come back, 0:59:43.840 --> 0:59:44.800 I will not be alone. 0:59:45.400 --> 0:59:46.360 So they go and get it. 0:59:46.760 --> 0:59:48.800 They come back and Olivia's like about to knock on 0:59:48.840 --> 0:59:51.000 the door and she's like, I feel very uncomfortable about this. 0:59:51.480 --> 0:59:54.000 And so they go into the meetinghouse and all these 0:59:54.040 --> 0:59:56.360 members are sitting there and they're just sitting in silence. 0:59:56.720 --> 0:59:58.800 And then the man that we just spoke to peacefully 0:59:58.960 --> 1:00:01.040 like asks them to leave or to sit and pray 1:00:01.040 --> 1:00:03.880 with them, and they're like, we have to follow the law, 1:00:03.960 --> 1:00:05.880 and so they go into the back office. There's more 1:00:05.920 --> 1:00:08.960 members sitting in silence, and then Olivia has to like 1:00:09.040 --> 1:00:11.840 gently wrestle a rolodex from an old Quaker lady and 1:00:12.040 --> 1:00:14.120 I mean she doesn't really fight because she is a Quaker, 1:00:14.160 --> 1:00:16.240 but it's like a moment where she kind of pulls 1:00:16.280 --> 1:00:20.040 the rolodex from her. So now they're back at the precinct. 1:00:20.080 --> 1:00:22.440 They've narrowed down the list of bike messengers who were 1:00:22.480 --> 1:00:25.600 working at that time to thirty six people, and they're 1:00:25.640 --> 1:00:29.000 cross referencing it with the rolodex and they've got six hours, 1:00:29.000 --> 1:00:31.040 so they all like take different parts of the alphabet 1:00:31.040 --> 1:00:34.080 and they start getting down to comparing. Munch pretty quickly 1:00:34.120 --> 1:00:36.400 finds this guy whose name is Harvey Dennis. He was 1:00:36.480 --> 1:00:40.520 arrested in nineteen ninety five for burglary, so clearly he 1:00:40.600 --> 1:00:44.920 was arrested trying to commit another rape, and he served 1:00:45.040 --> 1:00:47.720 fifteen months in prison, and while he was in prison, 1:00:47.800 --> 1:00:51.320 he was hospitalized for being raped in prison. So they 1:00:51.360 --> 1:00:54.200 do find his address and they head over there. So 1:00:54.800 --> 1:00:57.600 when they're walking up to this like motel, Olivia's like, 1:00:57.640 --> 1:00:58.840 I walk past this place every day. 1:00:58.840 --> 1:00:59.520 I'm a way to the gym. 1:00:59.560 --> 1:01:01.320 This guy was under our noses. So it's like a 1:01:01.320 --> 1:01:04.120 CD kind of hotel kind of has like, you know, 1:01:04.280 --> 1:01:08.480 the chain link grate in front between the concierge and 1:01:08.560 --> 1:01:12.480 the customer, and they say, we're looking for Harvey Dennis. 1:01:12.480 --> 1:01:14.280 And the guy at the front desk goes, I'm right here, 1:01:14.880 --> 1:01:17.080 and they tell him you're under arrest. Stand up, put 1:01:17.080 --> 1:01:18.880 your hands behind your back, but we can't. We can't 1:01:18.880 --> 1:01:21.080 see his hands right away, and so they pull out 1:01:21.120 --> 1:01:22.720 their guns and they're like hands up, hands up, and 1:01:22.760 --> 1:01:24.680 he's like, wait, don't shoot, puts his hands up and 1:01:24.680 --> 1:01:26.800 he goes, I'm gonna buzz you in. So he buzzes 1:01:26.840 --> 1:01:29.280 them in to back behind the counter and that's when 1:01:29.360 --> 1:01:31.240 we discover he's in a wheelchair. 1:01:32.160 --> 1:01:33.360 Twist done done. 1:01:33.480 --> 1:01:35.760 So they wheel him out to the car and he 1:01:35.840 --> 1:01:38.200 tells them, you know whatever, just throw me in the car, 1:01:38.280 --> 1:01:40.080 like I can't feel anything from the ribcage down. 1:01:40.120 --> 1:01:40.800 It doesn't hurt. 1:01:41.200 --> 1:01:43.439 And so they ask him what happened and he's like, oh, 1:01:43.480 --> 1:01:45.959 a bike. I was on my bike and a truck 1:01:46.080 --> 1:01:51.840 side mirror smashed my spine. So he's paraplegic. And Stabler 1:01:51.840 --> 1:01:54.400 reads him his rights as he gingerly like places him 1:01:54.400 --> 1:01:54.920 in the car. 1:01:55.240 --> 1:01:56.800 And that's dick wolf baby. 1:01:57.480 --> 1:02:01.080 I wonder if his injury the injury that shut down 1:02:01.160 --> 1:02:02.560 Green Machine Bike messengers. 1:02:03.120 --> 1:02:06.400 Oh with the insurance, Wow, look at you. 1:02:06.760 --> 1:02:10.080 Because that's like, you know, that's he doesn't look like 1:02:10.120 --> 1:02:12.080 he got a great lawsuit or anything out of it, 1:02:12.120 --> 1:02:14.240 you know, so like or insurance cover it now? 1:02:14.400 --> 1:02:17.919 And I understand where you know, Jenny Bacon's coming from 1:02:17.960 --> 1:02:20.160 of like, well, he's he's not going to do this again, 1:02:20.840 --> 1:02:23.520 but also fuck that guy he did it. 1:02:24.200 --> 1:02:24.600 Yeah. 1:02:25.160 --> 1:02:27.400 I think that her thing is like, yeah, he's already 1:02:27.400 --> 1:02:31.720 been brutalized in prison, he's unable to hurt anyone again, 1:02:32.240 --> 1:02:34.960 and he's prison in a wheelchair. 1:02:35.040 --> 1:02:37.440 Sounds like a lot more challenging, you know. 1:02:38.040 --> 1:02:41.520 But my thing is this is I don't know, there's 1:02:41.560 --> 1:02:43.960 no way to excuse his behavior at all, but it's like, 1:02:44.040 --> 1:02:46.240 on top of like the physical attack he did, he 1:02:46.440 --> 1:02:49.840 stuck these women for months, like he thought about this, Like, 1:02:49.880 --> 1:02:52.240 this isn't a person that just was like, oh I 1:02:52.280 --> 1:02:54.640 got drunk and I thought this person wanted it or whatever. 1:02:54.760 --> 1:02:57.080 Not that that person is excusable at all, but this 1:02:57.160 --> 1:03:00.360 is a person who like very much premeditated these tacks 1:03:00.440 --> 1:03:03.080 for months at a time. Like I find it hard 1:03:03.080 --> 1:03:05.160 to believe you can kind of reform from that, to 1:03:05.200 --> 1:03:05.680 be honest. 1:03:05.760 --> 1:03:08.000 And the internet was like chill back then. But if 1:03:08.040 --> 1:03:10.440 he was, who knows what he could have done with 1:03:10.480 --> 1:03:14.800 the internet. If that's like, yeah, being of stalking and doing. 1:03:14.800 --> 1:03:16.960 He would have only like escalated this man. 1:03:17.120 --> 1:03:19.440 Yeah, three in a week, and those are all people 1:03:19.480 --> 1:03:21.640 that he'd been stalking for months. It's like he orchestrated 1:03:21.640 --> 1:03:22.640 it all to happen in a week. 1:03:22.760 --> 1:03:25.520 Yeah, put him to jail, all right. Annals is upset 1:03:25.560 --> 1:03:27.480 by this. We have to move on to the commercials. 1:03:28.960 --> 1:03:44.440 We'll be back with some crimes. So this is based 1:03:44.480 --> 1:03:46.400 on two crimes. But the more I think about it, 1:03:46.440 --> 1:03:48.560 who knows if the second one even makes sense. But 1:03:48.800 --> 1:03:52.160 we will start and we'll see what happens. So we 1:03:52.240 --> 1:03:57.840 have the Kathleen Ham rape case. And so Kathleen moved 1:03:57.880 --> 1:04:00.960 to New York, New York City in June twenty sixth, 1:04:01.040 --> 1:04:03.840 nineteen seventy three, and she was dreaming of a big 1:04:03.880 --> 1:04:06.760 career in publishing and she felt like her whole life 1:04:06.800 --> 1:04:09.160 was ahead of her. And then a man entered her 1:04:09.160 --> 1:04:11.960 apartment and she gives an account of the attack to 1:04:12.600 --> 1:04:15.440 an interview for NBC News and it's with Anne Curry. 1:04:15.800 --> 1:04:18.760 Who did you she just did the interview with. 1:04:18.960 --> 1:04:23.240 Herd right, No, that was Savannah Savannah Guthrie. But you 1:04:23.280 --> 1:04:26.720 know Anne Anne Corey had did like a famous Angelina 1:04:26.800 --> 1:04:29.400 Joli interview, like she's a very nice woman. 1:04:29.400 --> 1:04:32.320 I worked with her at the Olympics for a little Wait. 1:04:31.760 --> 1:04:34.560 But did you read that Savannah Guthrie's husband did like 1:04:34.760 --> 1:04:39.240 pr for Johnny Depp? No, like he was he was 1:04:39.280 --> 1:04:42.840 working with Johnny during all of this, So I don't understand. 1:04:43.040 --> 1:04:45.280 How did she not like recuse herself? 1:04:45.320 --> 1:04:47.960 Then, I don't know, And how comes she would agree 1:04:47.960 --> 1:04:49.600 to do an interview with someone that was working with 1:04:49.680 --> 1:04:50.680 I mean, I have no fucking. 1:04:50.520 --> 1:04:52.880 Idea unless she didn't know, but like Savannah should have 1:04:52.880 --> 1:04:53.880 been like, but how do I know? 1:04:54.520 --> 1:04:57.080 I know you're a Today's Show correspondent, but you're still 1:04:57.120 --> 1:04:59.960 technically a journalist, and I feel like ethics and journalism 1:05:00.200 --> 1:05:03.480 not to be Gamergate, Like you should probably say my 1:05:03.600 --> 1:05:07.440 husband works with the opposing person on this lawsuit. 1:05:07.440 --> 1:05:10.840 I should not interview you. Also, I was there was 1:05:10.880 --> 1:05:13.240 a big s view. Could I have done it? Well? 1:05:13.320 --> 1:05:16.120 Yeah, there was an SVW marathon yesterday at the hotel 1:05:16.120 --> 1:05:18.120 and I rewatched Intimidation game. 1:05:18.840 --> 1:05:21.320 She's good. Mousam is such a good actress. Oh yeah, 1:05:21.360 --> 1:05:23.160 she's great. Yeah. 1:05:23.200 --> 1:05:26.000 Anyways, back to this, you just brought up gamer Gate. 1:05:25.920 --> 1:05:28.520 So obviously, so yeah, sorry, I'd love to talk about 1:05:28.560 --> 1:05:30.760 Gamergate like every day if I can go on. 1:05:31.280 --> 1:05:33.120 Okay, So back to Kathleen. 1:05:33.240 --> 1:05:35.440 So what she is telling this interview with Ann Curry 1:05:35.680 --> 1:05:37.720 is she remembers seeing a light flickering on the fire 1:05:37.840 --> 1:05:40.600 escape outside of her window, and then she saw a 1:05:40.640 --> 1:05:43.360 hand attached to the light, and then she saw sneakers 1:05:43.440 --> 1:05:45.360 and then in a flash, she was inside the apartment. 1:05:46.080 --> 1:05:48.320 There was a huge struggle and he had a knife 1:05:48.360 --> 1:05:50.120 and then he threw a sheet over her head and 1:05:50.160 --> 1:05:52.160 she screamed, but then obviously he put the knife to 1:05:52.200 --> 1:05:52.720 her throat. 1:05:52.520 --> 1:05:54.080 And was like I'll fucking kill you. Stop it. 1:05:54.280 --> 1:05:57.439 Yeah, and then she was raped, so he raped her 1:05:57.600 --> 1:05:59.880 and a neighbor heard her screaming and did not get 1:06:00.120 --> 1:06:02.520 GENEVIZI in this up and did call nine one. 1:06:02.440 --> 1:06:05.160 One, So that is great. Wait, well you say it. 1:06:05.160 --> 1:06:07.200 Again, because I think you just said Genevisian, which is 1:06:07.200 --> 1:06:07.800 our old agent. 1:06:07.920 --> 1:06:09.440 I know, but I thought it was like, but how 1:06:09.480 --> 1:06:10.800 do I make it as a thing like. 1:06:11.120 --> 1:06:15.520 A verb, like yeah, kitty Geneviz? Yeah, how I said it? 1:06:16.040 --> 1:06:21.680 Go fuck it? Well you said Genevisian, go fuck yourself. 1:06:22.000 --> 1:06:23.520 I did it. Yeah. 1:06:23.560 --> 1:06:26.680 So when the cops arrived, the attacker was still inside 1:06:26.720 --> 1:06:29.200 and they were able to corner him. But after a 1:06:29.320 --> 1:06:32.480 chase around the neighborhood, they they did arrest his ass 1:06:32.520 --> 1:06:35.560 so they cornered him. He escaped, there was a chase, 1:06:35.680 --> 1:06:38.680 they did arrest him. The two officers that arrested him 1:06:38.720 --> 1:06:42.520 are Rose Snipes and Abe Mengola, and they said it 1:06:42.560 --> 1:06:44.960 felt like a Christmas present to have him there and 1:06:44.960 --> 1:06:46.640 they knew that they had him and they were just 1:06:46.760 --> 1:06:48.840 like kind of excited. I don't know if that's like 1:06:49.040 --> 1:06:51.240 the I don't know if they should call like getting 1:06:51.240 --> 1:06:53.280 a rapist a Christmas present, but the fact that it 1:06:53.360 --> 1:06:55.560 was like a done deal, you know, like they saw 1:06:55.640 --> 1:06:58.800 him in there and they got him. Meanwhile, she was 1:06:58.840 --> 1:07:02.880 sent to the hospital and a terrible, terrible experience. Not surprising, 1:07:03.400 --> 1:07:05.720 she said, nobody gave her any sympathy, not even a 1:07:05.720 --> 1:07:09.440 glass of water, And because she reacts very controlled in 1:07:09.480 --> 1:07:12.640 a crisis and wasn't crying, the hospital did not believe 1:07:12.640 --> 1:07:14.680 that she was raped. And even though all of her 1:07:14.720 --> 1:07:18.640 injuries were consistent with rape, and she heard the examiners go, oh, 1:07:18.720 --> 1:07:22.480 she was too calm, she wasn't raped, So yeah, they legit, 1:07:22.560 --> 1:07:26.040 were like, there's no sperms, so you're lying. There was 1:07:26.080 --> 1:07:27.960 no rape kid at this time, and there was no 1:07:28.080 --> 1:07:30.080 rape training and so it was a nightmare. 1:07:30.120 --> 1:07:32.320 And then the case was also fucked. On top of this. 1:07:32.600 --> 1:07:35.280 Terrible experience, the cops who thought that the case was 1:07:35.320 --> 1:07:37.240 going to be a slam dunk since they both could 1:07:37.280 --> 1:07:39.760 id the suspect, did not happen. 1:07:39.800 --> 1:07:42.000 The man went by the name Clarence Williams. 1:07:42.400 --> 1:07:45.400 And the huge problem, I guess even though he was 1:07:45.480 --> 1:07:50.840 inside Kathleen Ham never saw his face. I just I 1:07:50.880 --> 1:07:52.920 don't get this at all. But this was the seventies 1:07:52.920 --> 1:07:54.880 and the seventies. You're gonna hear something of a police 1:07:54.880 --> 1:07:59.040 captain said, and it's most fucked up ship. So reporter 1:07:59.200 --> 1:08:02.080 Julia pressed In, who covered the case for the New 1:08:02.160 --> 1:08:04.760 York Times, said there was a presumption and still kind 1:08:04.760 --> 1:08:07.560 of there is, but that a woman wouldn't be raped 1:08:07.560 --> 1:08:10.840 if she wasn't in some fashion asking for it. So 1:08:10.920 --> 1:08:13.520 the trials started in nineteen seventy four, and it was 1:08:13.560 --> 1:08:15.400 hard because they couldn't win the case on just the 1:08:15.520 --> 1:08:19.160 victim's word. The underwork did not have sperm, and the 1:08:19.200 --> 1:08:21.320 prosecution focused. 1:08:22.080 --> 1:08:23.800 Were his people trying to just say that he just 1:08:23.840 --> 1:08:26.200 broke in and it was like a robbery, like because 1:08:26.200 --> 1:08:27.439 it's apartment. 1:08:27.640 --> 1:08:31.760 Yeah, So the prosecution focused on the cops ID, which 1:08:31.760 --> 1:08:35.080 should be enough, I feel, But the defense went after Kathleen. 1:08:35.320 --> 1:08:38.599 So it's the classic like Buchanan vibes of like are 1:08:38.600 --> 1:08:40.320 you They asked her on the stand if she was 1:08:40.360 --> 1:08:44.400 a virgin, like it's like, and then they went at 1:08:44.479 --> 1:08:46.360 her for two days and they tried to portray her 1:08:46.360 --> 1:08:48.759 as a prostitute and that she's like a working girl 1:08:50.000 --> 1:08:52.400 that is like a slut and not a virgin and 1:08:52.520 --> 1:08:55.400 makes money having sex and like they just like spun 1:08:55.479 --> 1:09:00.040 it as like a character assassination vibe, and. 1:09:00.080 --> 1:09:01.719 They asked were her legs broken? 1:09:02.760 --> 1:09:07.439 Because she didn't run away, so and then they kept 1:09:07.439 --> 1:09:09.439 like yelling, like when she tried to talk, they just 1:09:09.520 --> 1:09:10.760 kept yelling like yes or no. 1:09:10.880 --> 1:09:12.320 These are yes and no questions. 1:09:12.640 --> 1:09:15.280 Oh well, he does that all the time, Buchanan or 1:09:15.640 --> 1:09:16.720 some of those lawyers do that. 1:09:16.920 --> 1:09:21.040 Oh, Buchanan, for sure. This is a Buchanan mosment, simple yes. 1:09:20.920 --> 1:09:23.120 Or no, will sifat you know? Yeah? 1:09:23.160 --> 1:09:25.240 So yeah, like to ask if you're a virgin and 1:09:25.240 --> 1:09:27.240 then ask if your legs are broken. It's like the 1:09:27.280 --> 1:09:29.439 most fucked up shit. And this is obviously before like 1:09:30.320 --> 1:09:32.400 all the language and all the stuff that we have. 1:09:32.520 --> 1:09:34.560 But also this isn't even that long ago. This is 1:09:34.600 --> 1:09:37.639 the seventies. And it was an eight day trial, two 1:09:37.720 --> 1:09:40.360 days of deliberations, and it ended in a hung journey. 1:09:40.880 --> 1:09:42.519 So that was that. 1:09:43.520 --> 1:09:46.120 She said to NBC News that she was shattered and 1:09:46.160 --> 1:09:49.479 she became very depressed. And while the fuck had Williams 1:09:49.520 --> 1:09:52.400 was out on bail awaiting trial. He was accused of 1:09:52.400 --> 1:09:54.599 sexually assaulting and shooting another woman. 1:09:55.840 --> 1:09:56.679 Oh my god. 1:09:57.640 --> 1:10:00.400 In a plea bargain, he plied guilty in the case 1:10:00.520 --> 1:10:04.960 and also to Kathleen's rape. Then that other case got overturned, 1:10:05.479 --> 1:10:07.560 so both cases had to be retried. 1:10:08.080 --> 1:10:11.240 Oh my god, sorry, I'm about to kill somebody. I 1:10:11.320 --> 1:10:12.000 know it's going on. 1:10:12.280 --> 1:10:15.320 I know this is like very fucked up. And she 1:10:15.439 --> 1:10:17.439 bounced to California. She's like, I don't want to take 1:10:17.479 --> 1:10:19.960 the stand again. I'm not dealing with this. Fuck New York, 1:10:20.080 --> 1:10:22.439 fuck everything. And she bounced. She's like, I'm not doing 1:10:22.520 --> 1:10:23.240 a trial again. 1:10:23.560 --> 1:10:25.679 I can see why you would not trust New York 1:10:25.840 --> 1:10:27.040 State to keep you safe. 1:10:27.160 --> 1:10:27.680 Yeah. 1:10:27.760 --> 1:10:33.160 Yeah, So she ran away, and then this fucker escaped, 1:10:33.280 --> 1:10:36.080 like ran away and vanished so no one could find him. 1:10:36.080 --> 1:10:40.320 So for decades Kathleen had all of this worry and guilt, 1:10:40.400 --> 1:10:42.120 and she thought that like it was her fault that 1:10:42.160 --> 1:10:44.920 she unleashed a monster and that he was out there 1:10:44.960 --> 1:10:47.120 and hurting other women, and that she could have tried 1:10:47.160 --> 1:10:48.200 to meet him in court again. 1:10:48.720 --> 1:10:50.240 So for decades she. 1:10:50.240 --> 1:10:52.640 Was just like fuck, like I could have put this 1:10:52.720 --> 1:10:55.080 guy away and I didn't, and now who knows what 1:10:55.120 --> 1:10:57.639 he's doing. So not only is she living in fear, 1:10:58.439 --> 1:11:01.240 like living through this trauma, now all of this guilt 1:11:01.479 --> 1:11:04.160 of like what could she have done? And I bet 1:11:04.200 --> 1:11:06.280 all those lawyers are sleeping very well at night, not 1:11:06.320 --> 1:11:09.479 even thinking about this again, So she went to law 1:11:09.520 --> 1:11:13.080 school and became a lawyer, and so that's like good news. 1:11:13.080 --> 1:11:14.240 And then it said like she had a lot of 1:11:14.280 --> 1:11:17.840 trouble dating and couldn't fucking sleep. But yeah, so she 1:11:17.880 --> 1:11:21.000 became a full insomniac and she would sit at the 1:11:21.000 --> 1:11:23.120 window with a butcher knife or lay by the door, 1:11:23.160 --> 1:11:25.320 and that's how she was able to kind of sleep, 1:11:25.439 --> 1:11:29.720 like she just yeah, her life was ruined. And then 1:11:29.760 --> 1:11:31.640 thirty two years later, she got a call from her 1:11:31.640 --> 1:11:34.880 former neighbor and the New York DA's office got in 1:11:34.920 --> 1:11:37.880 contact with her. So the DA's office got in contact 1:11:37.920 --> 1:11:40.920 with the former neighbor because they were looking for Kathleen. 1:11:41.000 --> 1:11:45.519 Because this fuck ass Clarence Williams changed his name to 1:11:45.600 --> 1:11:49.000 Fletcher Warrow and was trying to buy a gun in 1:11:49.040 --> 1:11:51.880 Atlanta and his name popped up on a background check 1:11:52.280 --> 1:11:54.200 and the warrant fell on him and he was brought 1:11:54.240 --> 1:11:55.000 back to New York. 1:11:55.800 --> 1:11:59.080 Dumb ass. Yeah, but just had to have a gun, 1:11:59.160 --> 1:11:59.479 didn't y. 1:11:59.720 --> 1:12:01.800 Yes, So this is why we need background checks for 1:12:01.920 --> 1:12:05.479 fucking guns. Yeah, so this rapist couldn't get a gun, 1:12:06.360 --> 1:12:07.880 Like have laws gone backwards? 1:12:07.960 --> 1:12:11.280 Is that's what's happened? Like is that? Like yeah, okay, 1:12:11.360 --> 1:12:12.160 So she. 1:12:12.240 --> 1:12:15.519 Was pissed to get the call and was shocked. She gasped, 1:12:15.880 --> 1:12:18.200 and she just wasn't ready to hear about this ever again. 1:12:19.040 --> 1:12:22.160 So they called her after Nancy gave her a heads up. 1:12:22.200 --> 1:12:23.320 So Nancy's the neighbors. 1:12:23.320 --> 1:12:25.479 So they like asked Nancy, like, can you just please 1:12:25.520 --> 1:12:29.639 talk to this woman? And so Nancy and Kathleen chatted. 1:12:29.640 --> 1:12:31.519 They asked if she was willing to testify, and this 1:12:31.680 --> 1:12:35.799 time she said yes. They had her testimony, but even bigger. 1:12:35.880 --> 1:12:39.320 They now had DNA technology and science advanced. So they 1:12:39.360 --> 1:12:42.719 tested the soiled underwear from decades before and it had matched. 1:12:43.160 --> 1:12:45.960 So whatever, like the hospital and all those people said 1:12:45.960 --> 1:12:49.160 that there wasn't DNA and the underwear were fucking idiots, 1:12:49.200 --> 1:12:51.679 Like I don't know, like maybe there was like touch 1:12:51.800 --> 1:12:53.960 DNA on it, but he like he may have used 1:12:53.960 --> 1:12:56.080 a condom or something, so there wasn't semen, but like 1:12:56.120 --> 1:12:58.200 there was touch DNA on the underwear, which proves like 1:12:58.200 --> 1:12:59.040 a sexual assault. 1:12:59.200 --> 1:13:01.559 People use condom in the seventies, isn't that the thing? 1:13:01.600 --> 1:13:03.519 Oh geez, I don't know but then why wasn't there 1:13:03.560 --> 1:13:06.439 any material genetic material? 1:13:07.080 --> 1:13:09.320 Girl, I don't know. If a scientist wants to hit 1:13:09.400 --> 1:13:12.200 us up, that would be great. Yeah, so it was 1:13:12.240 --> 1:13:14.879 a match. It was an exact match to Fletcher worl 1:13:15.040 --> 1:13:18.360 Aka Clarence, and then they found it matched two rapes 1:13:18.360 --> 1:13:20.400 in nineteen ninety three in New Jersey. So it's like 1:13:20.439 --> 1:13:22.760 her biggest fear came true, you know, like he was 1:13:23.160 --> 1:13:26.679 perpetrating more crimes. Then his DNA popped up in nine 1:13:26.800 --> 1:13:30.320 cases from Silver Spring, Maryland, where he was known as 1:13:30.320 --> 1:13:33.479 the Silver Spring Rapist, which was part of a twenty 1:13:33.600 --> 1:13:38.360 one rape pattern. Oh my god, So this motherfucker had 1:13:38.439 --> 1:13:42.680 like a nickname like that's how like not like prevalent 1:13:42.880 --> 1:13:45.320 his crime, Like he just committed so many crimes Like yeah, 1:13:45.400 --> 1:13:47.799 fucking nickname and no one. 1:13:47.680 --> 1:13:49.679 Could have taken I just saw, my god. 1:13:51.120 --> 1:13:53.840 So all the DNA match to at least twenty three 1:13:53.880 --> 1:13:57.160 other rapes in Maryland and Jersey over the past thirty years. 1:13:57.680 --> 1:14:01.919 I think that judge, the defense, the fucking hospital workers 1:14:01.920 --> 1:14:02.920 all should be jailed. 1:14:03.120 --> 1:14:05.440 No mistakes made. Fuck those motherfuckers. 1:14:05.720 --> 1:14:08.439 The cops found this guy in her fucking house. I 1:14:08.439 --> 1:14:09.160 don't understand. 1:14:09.320 --> 1:14:09.920 I don't either. 1:14:10.120 --> 1:14:13.439 That's like what shocks me because it is like if 1:14:13.479 --> 1:14:17.040 the cops saw him chased him out, Like I don't understand. 1:14:17.400 --> 1:14:18.960 Well, I think that's how badly. 1:14:20.120 --> 1:14:22.519 That's how badly, Like they need to make women look 1:14:22.600 --> 1:14:24.760 like there's like no such thing as rape, like all 1:14:24.800 --> 1:14:26.600 women kind of want it in a way, you know. 1:14:27.000 --> 1:14:31.240 That's I think that's like what is happening, just like 1:14:31.680 --> 1:14:32.880 garbage misogyny. 1:14:34.439 --> 1:14:37.680 And so then before the trial, Kathleen finally decided to 1:14:37.680 --> 1:14:39.920 come forward and go public with her story and reveal 1:14:39.960 --> 1:14:40.559 her identity. 1:14:40.600 --> 1:14:42.320 I think she was like a Jane Doe until then. 1:14:42.760 --> 1:14:45.280 She said she had nothing to be ashamed of, Like 1:14:45.320 --> 1:14:48.120 if she was burglarized, you would like you would use 1:14:48.120 --> 1:14:48.599 her names. 1:14:48.600 --> 1:14:50.240 So why the stigma? 1:14:50.680 --> 1:14:52.719 And this time the jury was made up of seven 1:14:52.760 --> 1:14:55.160 women and five men, and it only took two hours 1:14:55.200 --> 1:14:57.599 to find him guilty of first degree rape and robbery. 1:14:58.439 --> 1:15:01.240 And the robbery was he took Ford from her apartment. 1:15:01.400 --> 1:15:03.600 But glad we were able to add it on the 1:15:03.600 --> 1:15:08.280 retra years maybe And this brings up obviously with the 1:15:08.280 --> 1:15:11.599 episode talked about issues with statue of limitations. So her 1:15:11.680 --> 1:15:14.479 case was indicted when it happened, and they were able 1:15:14.520 --> 1:15:16.439 to use the underwear. But if it was just an 1:15:16.439 --> 1:15:20.200 old case, it would have been too old. So if 1:15:20.200 --> 1:15:22.800 this was just underwear laying around or whatever, like it 1:15:23.479 --> 1:15:25.519 passed the statue of limitations, then they could have never 1:15:25.560 --> 1:15:28.280 tried it. But since he was indicted and there was 1:15:28.360 --> 1:15:31.080 a trial, they were able to use the evidence from 1:15:31.120 --> 1:15:34.559 that trial. God because it was already like brought to court. 1:15:35.479 --> 1:15:38.040 So this case, backed by the lobbying muscle of the 1:15:38.040 --> 1:15:42.240 Manhattan DIA's Office and the National Organization for Women, helped 1:15:42.240 --> 1:15:45.040 persuade New York State to drop its five year statue 1:15:45.040 --> 1:15:48.400 of limitations for first degree rape. So back in the day, 1:15:48.479 --> 1:15:50.960 unless charges of rape were brought within five years, there 1:15:50.960 --> 1:15:54.040 could be no prosecution. And after two thousand and six, 1:15:54.080 --> 1:15:57.479 there'll be no limit in New York State for apprehending, arresting, 1:15:57.520 --> 1:15:59.160 or prosecuting rape in the first degree. 1:15:59.280 --> 1:16:00.200 Obviously, this is okay. 1:16:00.280 --> 1:16:02.400 So I guess what I was talking about was the 1:16:02.479 --> 1:16:03.599 second and third degree? 1:16:03.920 --> 1:16:07.040 Yeah, yeah, yeah, yeah, No. I was like panicking as 1:16:07.080 --> 1:16:08.879 you were reading. I was like, what the fuck is happening? 1:16:08.960 --> 1:16:12.160 So everything is correct. I didn't even realize that though, 1:16:12.200 --> 1:16:14.479 like when I looked it up. So two thousand and 1:16:14.520 --> 1:16:17.960 six is when they stopped first degree, got it. Yeah, 1:16:18.000 --> 1:16:19.679 And then if you want to learn more about statute 1:16:19.720 --> 1:16:22.519 of limitations, there's a state by state guide on rain 1:16:22.600 --> 1:16:26.280 dot org. And you're all smart and capable listeners, so 1:16:26.680 --> 1:16:30.320 you can look all that information up. And it's a nightmare. 1:16:30.400 --> 1:16:32.400 And I don't understand why you would have time limits 1:16:32.439 --> 1:16:36.080 on this crime. And then Kathleen Ham actually died at 1:16:36.080 --> 1:16:38.519 seventy three years old on January twentieth of this year 1:16:38.520 --> 1:16:39.559 and her home in Santa Monica. 1:16:40.680 --> 1:16:43.600 Well, I hope she died like at least feeling like 1:16:43.680 --> 1:16:45.160 she got justice eventually. 1:16:45.680 --> 1:16:47.959 Yeah. Fuck, that's fucking horrific. 1:16:48.040 --> 1:16:50.240 But I mean, I mean, the thing is too is 1:16:50.280 --> 1:16:52.800 like they had this guy on like twenty three rapes 1:16:52.840 --> 1:16:55.160 across New Jersey and Maryland. And those are women that 1:16:55.240 --> 1:16:57.400 went and reported, you know what I mean, Like I 1:16:57.439 --> 1:16:59.920 bet you it's so many more didn't even think. 1:16:59.760 --> 1:17:01.800 About it that yeah, and that they couldn't find this 1:17:01.920 --> 1:17:02.320 guy and. 1:17:02.280 --> 1:17:04.160 All these people, and I just it was like I'm 1:17:04.200 --> 1:17:05.320 sure it was like the seventies. 1:17:05.360 --> 1:17:06.200 Women were scared. 1:17:06.240 --> 1:17:08.200 They were like I'm not even going to the cops, 1:17:08.280 --> 1:17:10.439 Like I'll just move, you know what I mean, Like 1:17:10.479 --> 1:17:15.160 I bet there's so many more victims, like true true psychopath. 1:17:15.240 --> 1:17:17.400 Oh my god, I know. 1:17:17.760 --> 1:17:21.920 So the next case is about Paul Callo and he's 1:17:22.000 --> 1:17:26.000 in quotes the balcony Rapist. So Paul is a serial 1:17:26.080 --> 1:17:29.879 rapist and this happened in Toronto in the mid eighties. 1:17:30.680 --> 1:17:33.280 He would break into women's homes by climbing onto second 1:17:33.320 --> 1:17:37.120 or third story balconies. He was convicted of raping five 1:17:37.120 --> 1:17:39.679 women at knife point and spent twenty years in jail. 1:17:40.600 --> 1:17:43.759 So that's I guess good news. But as of twenty seventeen, 1:17:43.840 --> 1:17:46.160 this is the article said that Canada doesn't have a 1:17:46.200 --> 1:17:49.840 public sex offender registry, so there are no ways to 1:17:49.920 --> 1:17:53.280 provide like where sex offenders live. And the first article 1:17:53.280 --> 1:17:55.280 I found was a community just like pissed he. 1:17:55.280 --> 1:17:56.240 Was going to be living with them. 1:17:56.479 --> 1:17:58.400 I kept trying to find more articles from the eighties 1:17:58.400 --> 1:18:00.840 and it was all people being like, get him the 1:18:00.880 --> 1:18:04.000 fuck out of my community, like so many Google pages 1:18:04.040 --> 1:18:06.519 of just people being like how dare he live? And 1:18:06.600 --> 1:18:08.720 so this just brings up a lot of interesting like 1:18:09.439 --> 1:18:12.840 legal shit. Again, I don't know how this attaches to 1:18:12.880 --> 1:18:16.639 the case, but whatever the WICKI said. So, so he's 1:18:16.680 --> 1:18:19.040 a little too casual, but I guess he's right, But 1:18:19.120 --> 1:18:22.200 he's quoted saying there's nothing I can do at this point. 1:18:22.240 --> 1:18:24.040 All I can do is see to it that I 1:18:24.080 --> 1:18:26.200 don't do anything like that again. And it's like, I 1:18:26.200 --> 1:18:29.320 guess that makes sense, but I don't know, Like why 1:18:29.360 --> 1:18:31.720 would people feel safe with you? But that was his 1:18:31.800 --> 1:18:35.360 response to communities not wanting to live around him, But 1:18:35.400 --> 1:18:37.360 the residents are like, we just wanted a heads up, 1:18:37.360 --> 1:18:39.840 Like why can't we get a heads up? And this 1:18:39.920 --> 1:18:42.920 guy gives off like big manipulator, ed kemper vibes, Like 1:18:42.960 --> 1:18:44.920 that's what I get from him, like lying to parole, 1:18:45.000 --> 1:18:47.439 giving them what they want to hear to like think 1:18:47.479 --> 1:18:50.160 that you've rehabilitated, but you really haven't. So those are 1:18:50.160 --> 1:18:53.080 the vibes that I get from him. Or he's just 1:18:53.120 --> 1:18:56.080 really super delusional. I'm not sure, but the parole board 1:18:56.120 --> 1:18:59.360 consistently denied mister Callo early release and said that he 1:18:59.400 --> 1:19:03.799 had made apps no progress towards rehabilitation. He was released 1:19:03.800 --> 1:19:06.800 with seventeen conditions, so there was like curfew. He can't 1:19:06.800 --> 1:19:10.200 have drugs, alcohol, weapons, no rope, tape, wire, gloves or pliers, 1:19:10.240 --> 1:19:13.360 so specific, like you can never have gloves again, but yeah, 1:19:13.400 --> 1:19:15.920 so this is just like interesting, Oh, I guess maybe 1:19:16.000 --> 1:19:18.360 this connects the episode of like punishment and what's fair 1:19:18.400 --> 1:19:20.639 and what's not where it's like, he did serve twenty 1:19:20.680 --> 1:19:24.400 years in jail. Yeah, so he did his time. But 1:19:24.479 --> 1:19:27.000 I also understand people not wanting to be around the 1:19:27.120 --> 1:19:29.160 serial rapist. So it's like, what do you do? 1:19:29.360 --> 1:19:34.519 Like, do you it's just tough? And yeah, it's just tough. 1:19:35.120 --> 1:19:37.200 And we've talked about this all the time and this 1:19:37.280 --> 1:19:39.320 happened in some cases we covered in the UK, but 1:19:39.400 --> 1:19:42.200 this guy actually raped someone in nineteen eighty two and 1:19:42.600 --> 1:19:46.040 served jail time and did not give a shit, Like 1:19:46.080 --> 1:19:47.519 he was like, I'm just gonna do my time and 1:19:47.560 --> 1:19:49.800 get out and go back at it, like he did 1:19:49.800 --> 1:19:52.960 not care. And they released him and he got married 1:19:53.520 --> 1:19:56.120 and what he started doing was just breaking into apartments 1:19:56.120 --> 1:19:59.080 and robbing, and then he started noticing a pattern if 1:19:59.120 --> 1:20:01.320 there wasn't men's clothes, and then he knew the women 1:20:01.360 --> 1:20:04.080 lived alone. So he was this robber who put the 1:20:04.080 --> 1:20:07.479 connection together and then was like, oh, I'm gonna remember 1:20:07.520 --> 1:20:09.800 where all these women live alone. And I feel like 1:20:09.840 --> 1:20:12.160 I don't want to give validity to his excuses of 1:20:12.200 --> 1:20:14.040 why he did the crimes, but he's like boo, who, 1:20:14.240 --> 1:20:16.600 I'm an alcoholic and my wife was the breadwinner and 1:20:16.640 --> 1:20:19.120 I'm sad. So that's he's like an in cell in 1:20:19.200 --> 1:20:22.600 sells throughout time. My wife makes more money and I 1:20:22.640 --> 1:20:25.479 get to live off her money, and I'm gonna rape 1:20:25.520 --> 1:20:28.760 people instead. So when he was arrested and went away 1:20:28.760 --> 1:20:31.040 for twenty years, he did interviews and said like he 1:20:31.080 --> 1:20:34.719 wanted to make strides towards rehabilitation, and he brags about 1:20:34.760 --> 1:20:38.200 all these like prison programs he completed, like anger management. 1:20:39.320 --> 1:20:42.679 He then wanted to like sue the department for slander, 1:20:42.720 --> 1:20:45.240 that he's not that bad of a guy. 1:20:45.320 --> 1:20:46.280 He's just the sick o. 1:20:46.400 --> 1:20:49.599 So he rape someone, serves his time, gets out, starts robbing, 1:20:49.720 --> 1:20:52.559 starts serial raping, goes to jail, and then wants to 1:20:52.600 --> 1:20:55.880 sue the department for slander because he's not that bad. 1:20:56.680 --> 1:20:58.519 I bet you if you talk to this guy, he 1:20:58.560 --> 1:21:02.760 would be like a like a malignant narcissist, psychopath, like 1:21:03.920 --> 1:21:07.000 or sociopath. I mean, I know there's differences in the designations, 1:21:07.040 --> 1:21:10.800 but like the delusion of grandeur, you know, like I'm 1:21:10.800 --> 1:21:12.320 not that bad. They need to take back what they 1:21:12.360 --> 1:21:15.240 said about me. You know, it's like it's not something 1:21:15.280 --> 1:21:16.040 that makes any sense. 1:21:16.160 --> 1:21:16.800 Yeah. 1:21:16.840 --> 1:21:19.519 And then other big and unique issues with this case 1:21:19.640 --> 1:21:22.479 is the fifth victim felt like the police used her 1:21:22.560 --> 1:21:25.600 as bait, that they should have communicated a warning so 1:21:25.680 --> 1:21:29.800 people could have protected themselves, but they wanted to catch him. So. 1:21:30.080 --> 1:21:32.439 Victim five is known as Jane Doe, and in nineteen 1:21:32.479 --> 1:21:34.280 eighty six, she said that the police knew there was 1:21:34.280 --> 1:21:36.720 a serial rapist in the neighborhood. They knew he was 1:21:36.760 --> 1:21:39.559 operating in a very small six block radius, that he 1:21:39.680 --> 1:21:42.040 was attacking women who lived alone in second or third 1:21:42.040 --> 1:21:44.840 floor balcony apartments and who had long brown hair. They 1:21:44.920 --> 1:21:47.680 knew the attacks were cyclical, They knew the day he 1:21:47.720 --> 1:21:50.920 would strike, she claims to the Buffalo News, and instead 1:21:50.920 --> 1:21:53.519 of warning women like her who lived in the area 1:21:53.600 --> 1:21:57.000 so they can make adequate decisions about protecting themselves, they 1:21:57.120 --> 1:22:00.519 used this woman to catch him in the act of she. 1:22:00.600 --> 1:22:03.240 Argues, so she sued the department so. 1:22:03.280 --> 1:22:05.880 Like they'd warned the neighborhood about robberies but did not 1:22:06.160 --> 1:22:09.600 mention the rapes to the media at all. Oh, the 1:22:09.680 --> 1:22:13.160 police say, revealing that would have changed his tactics and targets. 1:22:13.160 --> 1:22:15.400 So would have fucked with the investigation. But it's also 1:22:15.439 --> 1:22:18.200 like someone else could have not been raped. But okay, 1:22:18.640 --> 1:22:20.280 and this is what I told you earlier. That's going 1:22:20.320 --> 1:22:22.320 to make you so mad. So at the time of 1:22:22.360 --> 1:22:26.800 the attack, a senior police officers rejected calls from the 1:22:26.840 --> 1:22:30.559 Toronto Rape Crisis Center for sex Crimes unit because they 1:22:30.600 --> 1:22:35.439 considered rape not significantly different from other crimes. According to 1:22:35.800 --> 1:22:40.200 minutes of a nineteen seventy five police meeting, so like. 1:22:41.640 --> 1:22:43.000 The rape Crisis. 1:22:42.560 --> 1:22:45.080 Center was calling them and like wanted help, and they 1:22:45.080 --> 1:22:47.160 were just like fuck off, Like we know what we're doing. 1:22:47.200 --> 1:22:49.720 It's not like it's a special crime. And I think 1:22:49.880 --> 1:22:53.240 the reason I included this is because it kind of 1:22:53.400 --> 1:22:55.479 goes back to the Kathleen Ham case of like why 1:22:55.560 --> 1:22:58.720 was it mismanaged so poorly? And it's because people like this, 1:22:58.880 --> 1:23:01.840 like the men in charge did not think rape was 1:23:01.880 --> 1:23:06.559 a unique crime at y'ao. Yeah, So in Toronto, a 1:23:06.640 --> 1:23:10.160 sexual assault squad finally was established in nineteen eighty seven, 1:23:10.760 --> 1:23:13.120 and this uh Jane Doe number five did win her 1:23:13.200 --> 1:23:15.280 case and the judge awarded her more than one hundred 1:23:15.320 --> 1:23:19.439 and fifty thousand US dollars In nineteen ninety eight and yeah, 1:23:19.479 --> 1:23:24.160 just thinking if the police were better. So those are 1:23:24.200 --> 1:23:27.000 the two cases that inspired the episode. 1:23:27.040 --> 1:23:29.760 But I also think the episode is like very heavily. 1:23:31.080 --> 1:23:35.320 And just like about the limitations about the statue. 1:23:34.640 --> 1:23:37.280 I don't know that there's maybe ever been a woman 1:23:37.400 --> 1:23:43.600 who's like hiding her rapist's identity because she feels he's rehabilitated, 1:23:43.840 --> 1:23:45.479 or maybe that's happened in real life. 1:23:45.520 --> 1:23:47.639 I wonder no, And I guess this case just deals 1:23:47.640 --> 1:23:50.200 with rehabilitation and what is it and what is not 1:23:50.400 --> 1:23:53.720 because this guy got out, but like the parole board 1:23:53.800 --> 1:23:56.360 legits like this man is unchanged, so who cares if 1:23:56.360 --> 1:23:58.880 he served twenty years? Like, and I don't know about 1:23:59.479 --> 1:24:01.720 I don't know really know about Canadian prisons, but it 1:24:01.760 --> 1:24:04.160 doesn't really feel like in US prisons there's much of 1:24:04.160 --> 1:24:08.360 an opportunity to like reform and change, right, Like aren't 1:24:08.360 --> 1:24:12.000 you just kind of living well it's a violence and yeah, 1:24:12.120 --> 1:24:14.120 you're like he got everybody. 1:24:14.880 --> 1:24:19.040 It's about punishment. It's not about you know, rehabilitation, it's 1:24:19.080 --> 1:24:21.920 about free labor. It's modern new slavery. It's not about it. 1:24:21.920 --> 1:24:25.839 It's like it's that's like the wildest thing when traveling 1:24:25.880 --> 1:24:29.719 abroad being like, oh wow, our prisons are businesses, Like that's. 1:24:29.520 --> 1:24:30.480 The most twisted. 1:24:31.280 --> 1:24:33.599 There's so much twisted things in our culture, but like 1:24:33.880 --> 1:24:36.120 that prisons are for profit is probably. 1:24:35.880 --> 1:24:40.520 One of the most sick. I would say, yeah, but yeah. 1:24:40.680 --> 1:24:45.200 Also hopefully by now Canada has like a sexual predator registry, 1:24:45.360 --> 1:24:46.520 Like what the fuck. 1:24:46.640 --> 1:24:51.120 Yeah, especially because we've specifically read so much about Canadian 1:24:51.280 --> 1:24:54.439 like killers and rapists, like there's a lot of them 1:24:54.479 --> 1:24:54.880 up there. 1:24:56.400 --> 1:25:00.760 Annalis did just check and Canada does have a registry, 1:25:00.920 --> 1:25:04.160 So thank you so much Canada for doing the bare minimum. 1:25:04.280 --> 1:25:05.800 Get on it, Canada, way to go. 1:25:07.400 --> 1:25:09.639 But it is like a it is wild because it's 1:25:09.680 --> 1:25:11.600 like if you did serve twenty years for crime, like 1:25:12.200 --> 1:25:13.880 what are the rules? I don't want to live next 1:25:13.880 --> 1:25:16.000 to cerial rapist, whether he spent twenty years in jail 1:25:16.120 --> 1:25:17.599 or not, Like I don't know, I. 1:25:17.520 --> 1:25:20.720 Know, And it's like I my tendency is to like 1:25:20.800 --> 1:25:24.360 feel bad, which is wrong. Like when they did that 1:25:24.479 --> 1:25:28.439 episode of like Welcome to the Pedo Motel where like 1:25:28.520 --> 1:25:31.880 Caresi's undercover with like all these people that are pedophiles 1:25:31.880 --> 1:25:34.320 and like some of them have been some of them 1:25:34.400 --> 1:25:37.000 just were arrested for sex abuse images. Some of them, 1:25:37.160 --> 1:25:41.120 you know, actually had worse crimes, and you're like, oh, 1:25:41.240 --> 1:25:44.920 that does suck that you served your time and no 1:25:45.000 --> 1:25:47.760 one will allow you to coexist with them anywhere. Like, 1:25:48.600 --> 1:25:50.320 but it also is like I don't want that. 1:25:50.560 --> 1:25:53.360 You know, there's like an area in Florida where a 1:25:53.400 --> 1:25:56.960 bunch of pedophiles live, like in a cornfield somewhere. Really 1:25:57.240 --> 1:25:59.760 Florida's have corn I think there's a documentary about it, 1:25:59.760 --> 1:26:01.599 because the whole thing is it's like it is hard 1:26:01.640 --> 1:26:04.160 to find somewhere to live because you can't be near 1:26:04.160 --> 1:26:07.480 a school, you can't be near all of these different places. 1:26:07.560 --> 1:26:10.160 So it's you get all the background checks and like 1:26:10.360 --> 1:26:11.559 apartments won't take you. 1:26:11.920 --> 1:26:14.720 And so there's like a community of sexual offenders and 1:26:14.760 --> 1:26:17.680 pedophiles in Florida that all live together in that like 1:26:17.800 --> 1:26:20.680 some trailer park or I'm making this up in like 1:26:20.760 --> 1:26:21.719 a fever dream. 1:26:21.520 --> 1:26:23.680 That I had, but I do feel it. Israel. I 1:26:23.680 --> 1:26:24.639 think you're looking it up. 1:26:25.120 --> 1:26:30.120 I am. Originally I just got Jeffrey Epstein's Island but 1:26:31.120 --> 1:26:37.839 inside Miracle Village Florida's isolated community of sexual sex offenders. Yeah, yeah, yeah, 1:26:37.880 --> 1:26:39.639 there's a big Vice article about it. 1:26:39.680 --> 1:26:41.719 From twenty fifteen. 1:26:42.160 --> 1:26:44.080 They all live there, and then I wonder like do 1:26:44.160 --> 1:26:48.120 they all have like spouses and are they raising families 1:26:48.160 --> 1:26:51.880 around the other pedophiles or the person. 1:26:51.600 --> 1:26:53.000 They interview here is a woman. 1:26:53.040 --> 1:26:56.200 And I'm not saying women can't be sex offenders, but 1:26:56.640 --> 1:26:59.839 it's just it's like, Yeah, this woman's moving into this community, 1:27:00.120 --> 1:27:03.120 these other sex offenders, and it's interesting. 1:27:03.200 --> 1:27:04.080 She's like it's varied. 1:27:04.160 --> 1:27:06.240 Like sometimes it's guys that are like eighteen and had 1:27:06.280 --> 1:27:07.040 a girlfriend. 1:27:06.720 --> 1:27:07.479 Who was sixteen. 1:27:07.600 --> 1:27:11.759 You know, like that sucks that you should be turned 1:27:11.760 --> 1:27:13.840 out from society because you were dating someone two years 1:27:13.840 --> 1:27:14.400 younger than you. 1:27:16.080 --> 1:27:17.840 Yeah, it sucks. 1:27:18.120 --> 1:27:22.360 I find myself immediately going to a place of pity 1:27:22.560 --> 1:27:25.160 and feeling bad, and then I'm like, wait, no, they 1:27:25.160 --> 1:27:26.720 did commit horrible crimes. 1:27:26.439 --> 1:27:28.880 Like a lot of them. But then it's like it's 1:27:29.000 --> 1:27:30.160 why are you taking the risk? 1:27:30.240 --> 1:27:32.640 I just feel like so often us as women like 1:27:32.920 --> 1:27:34.680 don't walk at night, don't do this, don't do that, 1:27:34.760 --> 1:27:36.439 don't do that, And so for a minute's like, yeah, 1:27:36.479 --> 1:27:37.840 just don't fuck people under eighteen. 1:27:37.880 --> 1:27:39.080 Can you not handle that? Yeah? 1:27:39.200 --> 1:27:41.439 You can't handle this one little thing that you're supposed 1:27:41.479 --> 1:27:43.040 to do to not go to jail. So to me, 1:27:43.120 --> 1:27:44.960 it's like, oh, fuck yourself, I don't care about you. 1:27:45.400 --> 1:27:46.000 That's not true. 1:27:46.040 --> 1:27:48.639 I care. I don't know. I just do a funny 1:27:48.720 --> 1:27:49.280 joke about it. 1:27:51.200 --> 1:27:53.800 Go see her live, all right, And now we have 1:27:54.120 --> 1:27:57.320 a guest to cleanse the palette. As always, stay right 1:27:57.320 --> 1:28:08.920 where you are, Guys, today's guests, you could call a 1:28:09.040 --> 1:28:12.559 queen of the procedural drama. You've seen her in tons 1:28:12.600 --> 1:28:15.560 of appearances on everything from not just a Law and 1:28:15.680 --> 1:28:18.400 Order original Recipe, not just Criminal Intent, but also more 1:28:18.400 --> 1:28:23.080 recently Chicago Med New Amsterdam Blue Bloods, and today you 1:28:23.160 --> 1:28:26.679 know her as the rape victim who will never tell 1:28:27.240 --> 1:28:32.519 Jennifer Neil. Guys are interview is with the lovely Jenny Bacon. 1:28:33.120 --> 1:28:34.639 Are you based in New York area? 1:28:35.120 --> 1:28:37.760 Yes, am, okay, I can tell. 1:28:37.800 --> 1:28:39.400 The daylight's a little bit different over there. 1:28:39.439 --> 1:28:42.240 It's a little different, and it's springtime. 1:28:43.080 --> 1:28:44.720 Yeah, I was just I just flew back from New 1:28:44.800 --> 1:28:47.880 York yesterday. But also you're a theater gal, so we 1:28:47.960 --> 1:28:50.800 kind of assumed you were in New York doing all 1:28:50.800 --> 1:28:55.799 the hits. Obviously you probably missed so much during pandemic lockdown, 1:28:55.880 --> 1:28:57.519 and how thrilled you probably are to be back. 1:28:58.200 --> 1:29:01.360 Yeah, yeah, you know most if it's being mom now though, 1:29:01.560 --> 1:29:03.280 Oh yeah, no, it's mostly being mom. 1:29:03.479 --> 1:29:04.519 How old are your kids? 1:29:04.920 --> 1:29:06.720 There are seventeen and fifteen? 1:29:06.960 --> 1:29:09.040 Oh my gosh, teens? 1:29:09.680 --> 1:29:10.040 Yeah? 1:29:10.439 --> 1:29:11.920 Are they in the arts? 1:29:12.160 --> 1:29:12.599 They are? 1:29:13.320 --> 1:29:13.639 Are they? 1:29:13.640 --> 1:29:15.439 Are you going to like their school plays and stuff? 1:29:15.439 --> 1:29:17.040 Are they in the Yeah? 1:29:17.040 --> 1:29:18.040 That's really cute. 1:29:18.880 --> 1:29:22.320 And do you remember any of your favorite kind of 1:29:22.360 --> 1:29:24.760 plays that you were in at school? Or I did 1:29:24.760 --> 1:29:27.240 see your went to Northwestern and I'm a scho I 1:29:27.240 --> 1:29:28.040 grew up in Skoki. 1:29:28.600 --> 1:29:31.280 Oh yeah, and we have a theory. We don't know 1:29:31.280 --> 1:29:32.080 what the theory. 1:29:31.920 --> 1:29:34.400 Is, but we've talked to like a dozen people from 1:29:34.560 --> 1:29:37.880 SVU that have gone to Northwestern, so many people. We 1:29:37.920 --> 1:29:38.840 don't have the theory yet. 1:29:38.840 --> 1:29:42.760 But are there another person in the episode that we're 1:29:42.760 --> 1:29:45.320 going to be talking about We were at Northwestern at 1:29:45.320 --> 1:29:49.320 the same time. Oh yeah, Seana Coovid, who played the 1:29:50.040 --> 1:29:52.920 very shy and afraid victim. 1:29:53.080 --> 1:29:54.879 Yeah, and she calls you a bitch? 1:29:55.120 --> 1:29:55.320 Yeah? 1:29:55.400 --> 1:29:57.920 Yeah, yeah, that was really fun. Does she call me 1:29:58.000 --> 1:29:58.960 a crazy bitch or. 1:29:58.960 --> 1:30:01.880 A stupid bitch? Tell me his name? You crazy? 1:30:02.160 --> 1:30:02.240 Like? 1:30:02.720 --> 1:30:03.920 Yeah? 1:30:03.520 --> 1:30:04.599 Yeah, it was awesome. 1:30:04.600 --> 1:30:07.080 So yeah, we knew each other, so even more cool 1:30:07.080 --> 1:30:11.840 cold yeah, I think that the secret mystery is just 1:30:11.880 --> 1:30:14.760 that Northwestern has a great acting school, right, is that it? 1:30:15.600 --> 1:30:15.800 Yeah? 1:30:16.040 --> 1:30:16.760 I think that is. 1:30:18.200 --> 1:30:20.120 But you but that's so cool that you get to 1:30:20.320 --> 1:30:23.000 run into old alums and pals from that when you're 1:30:23.000 --> 1:30:25.920 doing TV work and stuff. And I looked her up too, 1:30:25.960 --> 1:30:28.479 and she's she works and seems like she's doing great. 1:30:29.000 --> 1:30:31.439 Yeah, it's awesome. She's totally awesome. 1:30:32.040 --> 1:30:35.120 But yeah, are there any like roles you remember as 1:30:35.160 --> 1:30:36.760 like a youth where you were like, oh, yeah, this 1:30:36.960 --> 1:30:39.280 is I'm gonna yeah that you look fondly on that 1:30:39.600 --> 1:30:40.200 you remember. 1:30:40.520 --> 1:30:43.520 Well, the first big break I got as a sophomore 1:30:43.720 --> 1:30:47.960 was playing violin Twelfth Night. Oh that was super duper 1:30:48.000 --> 1:30:50.559 fun because it was a pants part, you know, oh 1:30:50.640 --> 1:30:54.320 yeah wear the pants. So that was awesome. 1:30:54.680 --> 1:30:56.320 That's cool, and. 1:30:56.240 --> 1:30:58.240 It is an honor to have you not only as you, 1:30:58.360 --> 1:31:01.280 but you have the trifecta. You know, your Law and 1:31:01.400 --> 1:31:04.200 Order Criminal Intent and an SVU a. 1:31:04.240 --> 1:31:06.640 Lot the two sews. 1:31:06.840 --> 1:31:09.559 Yeah, yes, oh we know we know about both, but 1:31:10.080 --> 1:31:12.040 we knew so was what Like? 1:31:12.080 --> 1:31:15.160 I think Law and Order original Recipe is probably one 1:31:15.160 --> 1:31:19.200 of your first big breaks that you got. And then 1:31:19.240 --> 1:31:21.000 did it just work where they knew you at the 1:31:21.040 --> 1:31:22.559 casting office, and so they pushed. 1:31:22.320 --> 1:31:24.599 You over for SVU or like, how did all these 1:31:24.800 --> 1:31:26.760 how did you how did your Dick Wolf journey begin? 1:31:26.840 --> 1:31:28.479 Please tell us your origin story. 1:31:29.160 --> 1:31:34.280 So apparently the great thing about original recipe is that 1:31:34.800 --> 1:31:38.160 they had been working together for so long as complete meritocracy, 1:31:38.720 --> 1:31:40.760 and everybody knew that they were working at the top 1:31:40.800 --> 1:31:43.040 of their game, and people could work their way up 1:31:43.120 --> 1:31:46.760 inside in the production half of things. So the guy 1:31:46.760 --> 1:31:49.959 who directed my episode, it was his first time directing 1:31:50.520 --> 1:31:53.080 Wow the show, and he had worked his way up. 1:31:53.120 --> 1:31:55.280 He had just you know, like from you know, third 1:31:55.360 --> 1:31:57.320 a D to second a D to first D a D 1:31:57.920 --> 1:32:00.519 and this was his thing. And he had She's seen 1:32:00.560 --> 1:32:03.720 me do play down in the East Village, like you know, 1:32:03.800 --> 1:32:06.360 like you know, rock and roll theater. And he's like, 1:32:06.920 --> 1:32:09.160 that's my you know, like because I always have to 1:32:09.200 --> 1:32:10.680 be a villain, you know, I just have to be 1:32:10.720 --> 1:32:14.439 like sort of psycho. He's like, she's my villain, you know, 1:32:14.520 --> 1:32:17.320 like I got her, you know, and uh, and so 1:32:17.400 --> 1:32:21.599 that was awesome. And Constantine Machris, who directed the episode 1:32:21.600 --> 1:32:25.280 that we're talking about, he was the cinematographer on that 1:32:25.360 --> 1:32:29.600 first episode. Oh, he knew that I was going to 1:32:29.640 --> 1:32:34.400 be his villain because we had done the other together. Yeah. 1:32:34.880 --> 1:32:38.880 So it's just it's the whole like family aspect of 1:32:38.920 --> 1:32:41.800 these shows is amazing. And I got to say that 1:32:41.920 --> 1:32:46.919 it's SVU that has the real because Marishka is the goddess. 1:32:47.439 --> 1:32:50.719 Yeah yeah, and so she's like and it was really 1:32:50.760 --> 1:32:54.400 fun to go back and see like way back when, 1:32:54.479 --> 1:32:57.160 you know, because when she first started, she's like coming 1:32:57.160 --> 1:33:00.479 in to work and she's wearing her like leather parents 1:33:00.520 --> 1:33:05.360 and her fabulous like super furry coat. She's so gorgeous 1:33:05.400 --> 1:33:08.360 and sexy, and then she has to bensen up, you 1:33:08.400 --> 1:33:10.920 know and just like go gray, all gray, like buttoned 1:33:11.000 --> 1:33:13.080 up and stuff. And it's kind of fun to see 1:33:13.120 --> 1:33:17.599 how over the years, uh, you know, Olivia has been 1:33:17.760 --> 1:33:20.960 having Marishka bleed into her. You know, like she's just 1:33:21.320 --> 1:33:26.080 like getting more like fluid and you know, sexy, and 1:33:26.160 --> 1:33:29.600 it's it's just been really fun to see. But she 1:33:29.960 --> 1:33:34.559 is the centerpiece. She like holds the whole thing together 1:33:34.920 --> 1:33:37.439 from the minute you walk in. You know, she is 1:33:37.520 --> 1:33:41.720 in charge, and she knows everybody's great at what they do, 1:33:42.040 --> 1:33:44.559 and she wants them to be great at what they 1:33:44.600 --> 1:33:48.600 do and she makes that happen. And she's so supportive 1:33:48.600 --> 1:33:52.679 and she's specifically supportive too, like she knows when somebody's 1:33:52.720 --> 1:33:55.320 doing a really good job at what they do. She 1:33:55.439 --> 1:33:58.840 knows what everybody is doing, and she'll offer, like for 1:33:58.920 --> 1:34:01.880 a guest person, she will offer when the cameras go off, 1:34:02.520 --> 1:34:06.679 she'll offer something really generous. She'll say something super nice 1:34:07.120 --> 1:34:11.400 that just makes you go because you're always sort of like, uh, 1:34:11.439 --> 1:34:12.240 am I doing it? 1:34:12.360 --> 1:34:13.439 Right? Sure? 1:34:13.960 --> 1:34:16.600 She just like well, And also because you were on 1:34:16.680 --> 1:34:20.280 the first season, so right, like I don't even know 1:34:20.320 --> 1:34:23.479 if it was you know, now it's a well oiled 1:34:23.520 --> 1:34:26.080 machine and like you know it's so but like but 1:34:26.200 --> 1:34:28.519 for season one, I wondered did she have that same yeah, 1:34:28.560 --> 1:34:31.280 like same question as Lisa, Like was she that way 1:34:31.680 --> 1:34:32.000 right then? 1:34:32.160 --> 1:34:33.040 Or are you speaking more. 1:34:32.920 --> 1:34:34.880 About season fourteen when you came back, or was she 1:34:34.920 --> 1:34:36.840 from the get go just like a boss. 1:34:37.280 --> 1:34:39.559 I would say that from the get go she was 1:34:39.560 --> 1:34:42.320 a boss because you can see it in her eyes, 1:34:42.400 --> 1:34:44.280 you know, like when she's like when they put her 1:34:44.400 --> 1:34:46.760 up against like a bad guy and she just looks 1:34:46.840 --> 1:34:47.880 right at him and she's like. 1:34:49.880 --> 1:34:50.479 Not today. 1:34:51.040 --> 1:34:53.800 And it's just that she has that energy in her, 1:34:53.800 --> 1:34:56.240 And part of it's like because she's just a perfect 1:34:56.360 --> 1:35:00.479 physical specimen of a human being. You know, she's walks 1:35:00.479 --> 1:35:03.120 into a room and she just like kind of she 1:35:03.280 --> 1:35:08.360 just knows that her job is to be optimistic, confident, 1:35:08.880 --> 1:35:10.800 you know, and to deal with it if it goes wrong, 1:35:10.960 --> 1:35:13.559 you know, like find a way. Yeah, and she does. 1:35:14.520 --> 1:35:18.080 It's like, Wow, it's like I wish you were my mom. 1:35:21.840 --> 1:35:23.360 That's cool to hear that. 1:35:23.479 --> 1:35:25.720 It was from season one and I loved what you 1:35:25.760 --> 1:35:27.840 said that, like she knows other people are good at 1:35:27.880 --> 1:35:30.760 what they do, and like that's like cool leadership to 1:35:30.880 --> 1:35:32.880 kind of trust the people around. 1:35:32.600 --> 1:35:39.080 You exactly exactly and reinforce everything good that's happening. She's fantastic. 1:35:39.120 --> 1:35:41.080 And then you got to come back for season fourteen 1:35:41.160 --> 1:35:44.040 and see how after like you know, a decade plus, 1:35:44.080 --> 1:35:47.040 how much like more in charge she was, because I 1:35:47.040 --> 1:35:49.360 think by now she was like an executive producer and 1:35:49.439 --> 1:35:53.360 like actually really in charge, like not just attitude. 1:35:52.800 --> 1:35:58.160 But like you know, title exactly and yeah, and she's 1:35:58.200 --> 1:36:00.560 just she does. What you would want to do is 1:36:00.600 --> 1:36:03.519 like if you were emperor of the world, how would 1:36:03.560 --> 1:36:06.080 you want to be You'd want to be like Maurushika 1:36:06.160 --> 1:36:07.240 that's how you'd want to be. 1:36:07.439 --> 1:36:10.360 Yeah, because so many people choose another way, right, so 1:36:10.400 --> 1:36:13.360 many people are like evil dictators, and she just chooses 1:36:13.400 --> 1:36:14.280 this positivity. 1:36:14.280 --> 1:36:16.679 It's really cool to hear from so many people. 1:36:17.520 --> 1:36:23.840 And how was Maloney shop liver compared to Murska? But yeah, 1:36:23.920 --> 1:36:25.440 any Maloney scoops? 1:36:25.800 --> 1:36:27.960 No, I don't really have any Maloney scoops. I just 1:36:28.000 --> 1:36:31.640 know that, you know. Part of my job was he 1:36:31.720 --> 1:36:35.120 has one really great line in one scene that we 1:36:35.240 --> 1:36:43.800 have together where he goes, you prayed with your rapist, like, 1:36:44.200 --> 1:36:46.680 and so I felt like the whole scene was just 1:36:46.720 --> 1:36:48.439 to make sure that we set that up so that 1:36:48.840 --> 1:36:50.760 would just like man and. 1:36:50.680 --> 1:36:53.559 It's it's like a kind of a fun line from 1:36:53.640 --> 1:36:56.000 him because his character is so religious too. He's like 1:36:56.040 --> 1:36:56.719 the church boy. 1:36:56.840 --> 1:36:59.559 So it's, yeah, I know, praying, and I don't think 1:36:59.560 --> 1:37:00.639 you do that with your rapist. 1:37:00.760 --> 1:37:00.920 You know. 1:37:01.439 --> 1:37:03.800 That was what was fun about the episode actually was 1:37:03.800 --> 1:37:06.280 that it really put both of the detectives in the 1:37:06.280 --> 1:37:10.840 hot seat personally. You know, that was really fun because 1:37:11.280 --> 1:37:14.439 you know, Benson doesn't want to doesn't want to be there, 1:37:14.520 --> 1:37:18.760 and neither does you know, neither does Maloney. Then neither 1:37:18.800 --> 1:37:19.719 of them want to be there. 1:37:20.320 --> 1:37:22.200 Yeah, it is a cool episode because I feel like 1:37:22.240 --> 1:37:24.880 there's like there are like moral dilemmas, Like at first, 1:37:25.280 --> 1:37:27.800 everybody hates your character, you know, they're just like say it, 1:37:27.840 --> 1:37:30.000 give up the name, you know, But then kind of at. 1:37:29.880 --> 1:37:31.720 The end you're like, I don't know, maybe you know 1:37:31.920 --> 1:37:34.880 like this, I don't know. I'm not saying. 1:37:34.920 --> 1:37:37.000 I was totally like, yeah, don't give I'm not saying 1:37:37.000 --> 1:37:38.800 I thought she was totally right, but I could see 1:37:38.800 --> 1:37:40.640 a little bit more where she was coming from, you know, 1:37:40.800 --> 1:37:43.040 Like I think it just makes you stop and think, Yeah, 1:37:43.040 --> 1:37:43.360 what are. 1:37:43.280 --> 1:37:45.160 Your views on your character that you played? How do 1:37:45.160 --> 1:37:45.880 you feel about her? 1:37:46.320 --> 1:37:49.759 I am so glad that you said that, because actually, 1:37:50.320 --> 1:37:53.719 because when you know the end, right, and my character 1:37:53.760 --> 1:37:56.720 is the only one who knows the end, she's like 1:37:57.439 --> 1:37:59.920 she thinks she's so good, and you know, when you're 1:38:00.280 --> 1:38:03.519 playing the bad guy who's the good guy, who is 1:38:03.520 --> 1:38:05.759 the bad guy's good gun, you still have to believe. 1:38:05.800 --> 1:38:08.519 He was like, no, no, she really wants to do 1:38:08.600 --> 1:38:11.800 the right thing. This is Yeah. So I have a 1:38:11.800 --> 1:38:13.920 funny story to tell you about that. Actually, it's a 1:38:13.960 --> 1:38:17.120 couple of days after the episode aired. I was out 1:38:17.640 --> 1:38:21.120 waiting to meet a friend at Vasilka, the amazing Kreated 1:38:21.439 --> 1:38:24.479 restaurant in the East Village, and I'm standing there and waiting. 1:38:24.520 --> 1:38:27.280 My friend is late, and this woman is looking at 1:38:27.320 --> 1:38:32.240 me like her eyes she is she is sending so 1:38:32.360 --> 1:38:35.200 much shade my way. She's like trying to make me 1:38:35.439 --> 1:38:38.840 leave with her eyes, and I'm like what. And I'm 1:38:38.880 --> 1:38:41.519 a natural beta, so I'm like, I did something wrong, 1:38:41.560 --> 1:38:43.479 I did something wrong? What did I do? What did 1:38:43.520 --> 1:38:45.760 I do wrong? I'm like getting more and more and 1:38:45.840 --> 1:38:48.200 like trying to say I don't do anything. I'm fine, 1:38:48.240 --> 1:38:50.200 I'm fine. And then all of a sudden, her face 1:38:50.760 --> 1:38:54.000 like a veil lists and she went, oh my god, 1:38:54.640 --> 1:38:58.160 you were on TV. She's like I'm over here thinking, 1:38:58.320 --> 1:39:00.599 oh my god, why do I think this woman. 1:39:00.479 --> 1:39:01.640 Is so creepy? 1:39:01.880 --> 1:39:05.120 I don't know you. It was like the funniest thing. 1:39:05.240 --> 1:39:07.880 I'm thinking, like, Oh, On the one hand, I like, wow, 1:39:08.000 --> 1:39:10.519 hooray someone recognized me. And then I'm like, how many 1:39:10.560 --> 1:39:14.320 people are my walking past thinking like I hate her? 1:39:14.439 --> 1:39:17.000 I don't know why that I hate her, just like 1:39:17.080 --> 1:39:20.040 in the back of their minds Oh so funny. 1:39:20.040 --> 1:39:21.639 It's like did we go to high school together? Why 1:39:21.640 --> 1:39:22.240 do I hate you? 1:39:22.400 --> 1:39:25.599 Like why do I hate you? 1:39:25.600 --> 1:39:29.879 No, she is yeah, an easily hateable character. 1:39:30.760 --> 1:39:34.160 Did you know about statue of limitations or like Quakerism 1:39:34.280 --> 1:39:36.639 or anything like that before you came to film. 1:39:36.680 --> 1:39:39.000 Did you do any research or learn anything like from 1:39:39.040 --> 1:39:39.840 the episode? 1:39:40.160 --> 1:39:45.559 Absolutely? Mostly though what I was interested I did have 1:39:45.680 --> 1:39:48.080 my brother had a friend who had watched these episodes, 1:39:48.120 --> 1:39:50.760 and they sort of played a game where she would guess. 1:39:51.080 --> 1:39:54.640 She'd be like, she's an abused woman, she's religious, she 1:39:54.680 --> 1:39:56.799 said like, she like, she's like and she was always 1:39:56.920 --> 1:39:58.920 right and she could guess like I would like lay 1:39:58.960 --> 1:40:01.800 the clues in just for her and she would know, 1:40:02.120 --> 1:40:06.080 like right away what was happening. Wow, so the deal 1:40:06.200 --> 1:40:09.200 is right, there's a trauma that's happened, and how do 1:40:09.240 --> 1:40:12.920 you It's the trauma that comes first, and then how 1:40:12.920 --> 1:40:16.280 do these people like, uh, how do they grab the 1:40:16.320 --> 1:40:18.800 tools that they need? And once you've grabbed a tool, 1:40:19.600 --> 1:40:21.960 you don't let go of it. You hang on to 1:40:22.040 --> 1:40:24.519 that tool for dear life and you do not let go. 1:40:25.000 --> 1:40:28.200 And I felt like for it to stay alive, the 1:40:28.280 --> 1:40:30.600 question had to keep coming up. The question had to 1:40:30.640 --> 1:40:33.559 always be in front of her, and that was partly 1:40:33.600 --> 1:40:36.000 why she was so annoying was because she would talk 1:40:36.280 --> 1:40:45.880 really slowly, like she's very cautiously moving towards the thing 1:40:46.040 --> 1:40:51.160 that is probably going to happen. That sort of that 1:40:51.280 --> 1:40:54.280 was the So I didn't do so much on Quakerism 1:40:54.320 --> 1:40:55.920 in June. But I thought it was a good choice 1:40:55.960 --> 1:41:01.360 that they chose Quakerism as the as the backdrop, because 1:41:01.400 --> 1:41:05.240 it puts the whole It puts Olivia in a bigger bind. Right. 1:41:05.320 --> 1:41:07.400 The idea is to make the problem as hard as 1:41:07.439 --> 1:41:11.519 possible for the protagonists of the show. Right right now, you. 1:41:11.680 --> 1:41:13.760 Just kind of changed my mind a little bit because 1:41:13.760 --> 1:41:14.679 I forgot about the trumper. 1:41:14.720 --> 1:41:15.920 It's like, yeah, she's holding onto it. 1:41:15.920 --> 1:41:18.040 Who knows if she even believes it, but she feels 1:41:18.080 --> 1:41:21.719 like she has to continue doing this for the way something. 1:41:21.840 --> 1:41:24.280 Yeah, it's the only way that she can wake up 1:41:24.280 --> 1:41:29.519 in the morning, you know, Right, And so that's but 1:41:29.560 --> 1:41:32.040 this is what happens when we bumped up against each other, right. 1:41:32.160 --> 1:41:34.120 But I feel like your voice is a huge part 1:41:34.160 --> 1:41:36.280 of the character. Like, listen, I've seen all five hundred 1:41:36.280 --> 1:41:38.439 and whatever episodes of the show. There are many of them, 1:41:38.439 --> 1:41:41.679 many times, and you're a victim that like stands out 1:41:41.720 --> 1:41:43.960 to me because of the way you talk. I think 1:41:44.120 --> 1:41:46.480 like because of the way you spoke in this episode, 1:41:46.720 --> 1:41:48.680 I'm always like, oh, yes, the woman who won't give 1:41:48.760 --> 1:41:50.840 up her own rapist and she knows him, and she's 1:41:50.920 --> 1:41:54.479 so zen and calm, like you, you know, you stick 1:41:54.479 --> 1:41:57.920 out in a sea of victims in the show, and. 1:41:57.840 --> 1:42:03.400 How is it filming getting yelled at by your other awesome? 1:42:03.840 --> 1:42:06.960 Well, see this was also interesting, right because there's three victims, 1:42:06.960 --> 1:42:09.600 and so it's like a fairy tale, right, and so 1:42:09.720 --> 1:42:14.000 there's only one of us that's actually sympathetic, and that's 1:42:14.120 --> 1:42:17.160 Shawna's character. And I think that Judith and I both 1:42:17.240 --> 1:42:20.280 were sort of wondering, like, well, how come my how 1:42:20.280 --> 1:42:22.360 come I guy? I mean, my good has a good 1:42:22.360 --> 1:42:24.559 reason to behave the way they're behaving. They have to 1:42:24.560 --> 1:42:27.439 behave this way. But like if everybody was like Shawna's character, 1:42:27.520 --> 1:42:29.960 nothing would get done. I mean, like what about us, 1:42:30.000 --> 1:42:31.679 you know, like we're not bad, We're not bad. 1:42:32.120 --> 1:42:33.080 She's just like so. 1:42:32.960 --> 1:42:35.519 Sweet and like cannot move on until you say and 1:42:35.560 --> 1:42:37.760 the other one's just like I sue everyone and then 1:42:38.280 --> 1:42:39.160 you have the secret. 1:42:39.240 --> 1:42:41.519 And so yeah, she is the sweet one kind of. 1:42:41.720 --> 1:42:43.280 And then all of a sudden she switches. 1:42:46.720 --> 1:42:49.280 Oh my god, it was so good. We love it. 1:42:49.320 --> 1:42:51.599 We love a you crazy bitch lying on this show 1:42:51.680 --> 1:42:55.240 for sure. And you noticed any big differences between like 1:42:55.280 --> 1:42:58.559 when you do when you've done original recipe versus sbu 1:42:58.640 --> 1:43:02.800 versus criminal Intent, since you've done all three. 1:43:01.960 --> 1:43:09.320 Well yes, mostly because Marishka. Mostly because Marishka. The Criminal 1:43:09.360 --> 1:43:13.439 Intent was super duper fun. But you don't feel that 1:43:13.600 --> 1:43:18.839 they are at risk, Like it's Marishka's character. She's managed 1:43:18.840 --> 1:43:22.400 to create like an arc, like a never ending arc 1:43:23.000 --> 1:43:27.000 that's always moving forward. She has a capacity to accumulate experience, 1:43:27.120 --> 1:43:31.400 she has capacity to grow, she has the capacity to change. 1:43:31.600 --> 1:43:36.120 She's therefore unpredictable, like we're never entirely sure how she's 1:43:36.160 --> 1:43:41.960 going to absorb something and then move it forward the 1:43:42.040 --> 1:43:46.200 other shows. The Criminal Intent was really fun because that 1:43:46.479 --> 1:43:48.599 character that I got to play was a complete psycho 1:43:48.680 --> 1:43:51.800 killer that's like utterly and so I remember there was 1:43:51.840 --> 1:43:54.080 one scene where the director was like, Okay, in this scene, 1:43:54.120 --> 1:43:57.160 I think she should be even crazier, and I said, no, 1:43:58.160 --> 1:44:03.479 this scene, she should be perfectly normal. She should be 1:44:03.520 --> 1:44:05.320 it should be like just one of those other like 1:44:05.360 --> 1:44:08.559 really short dum you know moments where they're like, hey, 1:44:08.600 --> 1:44:10.599 the well, the garbage truck came and then he left, 1:44:10.960 --> 1:44:12.880 you know, like the end. And I should be like 1:44:13.000 --> 1:44:18.360 the most normal possible like presentation, so that it's like 1:44:18.400 --> 1:44:20.479 this that you never know it's so the data set 1:44:20.520 --> 1:44:23.479 is just completely random. Yeah, you have no idea what's 1:44:23.520 --> 1:44:27.439 going to happen. And then the original recipe was just 1:44:27.479 --> 1:44:31.160 sort of more I don't know, it's more serious somehow, 1:44:31.160 --> 1:44:36.920 I think, cause Sam Waterston's eyebrows just it's just very serious, very. 1:44:36.800 --> 1:44:39.000 Important character on the show, those eyebrows. 1:44:39.080 --> 1:44:42.519 Yeah, we talked to a lot of actors that say, like, 1:44:42.720 --> 1:44:45.120 while in New York, being in a Law and Order 1:44:45.160 --> 1:44:47.280 as a stamp of approval, you're not a New York 1:44:47.320 --> 1:44:49.240 actor till you get to do SV and stuff. 1:44:49.600 --> 1:44:52.320 But you did those all so early. Did you still 1:44:52.320 --> 1:44:53.479 feel that or was. 1:44:53.439 --> 1:44:55.639 It like a bragging thing like I was on season one, 1:44:55.960 --> 1:44:59.280 Like how did you feel about getting that stamp? 1:45:00.160 --> 1:45:00.360 Men? 1:45:00.760 --> 1:45:05.080 No, it's a massive stamp. It's massive. It's like you're yeah, 1:45:05.120 --> 1:45:07.600 and you know I did do them early, but that 1:45:07.760 --> 1:45:10.720 was more like like go for it, man, go for it. 1:45:10.800 --> 1:45:12.960 You're here, You're part of the you're part of the 1:45:13.040 --> 1:45:13.960 tribe now. 1:45:14.120 --> 1:45:16.920 Yeah, and could you imagine that show would go on 1:45:16.960 --> 1:45:18.040 for twenty three seasons? 1:45:18.080 --> 1:45:18.320 Wow? 1:45:18.840 --> 1:45:19.320 Amazing. 1:45:19.439 --> 1:45:21.680 I mean, Karen and I are always really impressed, and 1:45:21.680 --> 1:45:23.960 we ask a lot of questions about the tears, the crying, 1:45:24.040 --> 1:45:26.960 the single tear. But you and and actually both of 1:45:27.000 --> 1:45:29.519 your episodes, what's impressive is like you have wet eyes, 1:45:29.600 --> 1:45:32.040 they're not dropping. Is that just naturally you're in the moment. 1:45:32.280 --> 1:45:35.080 Is that a calculated decision? And how do you keep 1:45:35.120 --> 1:45:36.240 your eyes so wet? 1:45:39.720 --> 1:45:42.280 You're using drops? Tell us you're using drops in between two? 1:45:42.400 --> 1:45:43.320 That's all we want to hear. 1:45:43.920 --> 1:45:49.960 It's funny, you know, it's actually I remember when I 1:45:50.000 --> 1:45:52.639 was very young, I worked with this amazing actress named 1:45:52.640 --> 1:45:57.559 Irma p. Hall who's unfortunately passed on now. But she 1:45:57.720 --> 1:46:00.040 was a woman who came to acting late in life, 1:46:00.120 --> 1:46:03.040 and she would talk about how people would say, oh, 1:46:03.080 --> 1:46:04.960 you know, do you think you could cry in this scene? 1:46:05.320 --> 1:46:11.040 She'd be like, honey, I could cry all day. I 1:46:11.040 --> 1:46:17.160 could just cry and cry and cry. And really, you know, 1:46:18.240 --> 1:46:22.080 you can think about any number of things that but 1:46:22.200 --> 1:46:24.800 especially with the second one, it was it was that 1:46:24.920 --> 1:46:28.000 poor woman was just hit with so much all at once. 1:46:28.360 --> 1:46:32.080 And you know, when you love somebody, it just kicks in, right. 1:46:32.880 --> 1:46:36.080 Yeah. I just loved how progressive that relationship was too, 1:46:36.680 --> 1:46:39.360 just like yeah, we just we're partners. We love each other, 1:46:39.439 --> 1:46:41.320 we let each other do what we do. Like it 1:46:41.400 --> 1:46:41.880 was great. 1:46:41.960 --> 1:46:44.120 It's pretty exciting and unexpected. 1:46:44.640 --> 1:46:48.240 Well, both of your characters are so different from what 1:46:48.320 --> 1:46:51.599 you expect normal to be. You know, both the season 1:46:51.600 --> 1:46:53.559 one and fourteen characters are very different. 1:46:53.680 --> 1:46:54.360 Yeah, that's true. 1:46:54.439 --> 1:46:54.840 That's true. 1:46:54.880 --> 1:46:58.720 I mean you're almost like this radical forgiveness is progressive 1:46:58.760 --> 1:47:00.720 as well, I would say in a way. You know that, 1:47:00.920 --> 1:47:03.200 Like you didn't see a lot of characters, like a 1:47:03.240 --> 1:47:05.679 lot of shows were just about fully law and order, 1:47:05.800 --> 1:47:09.160 like where's the justice, Like everyone wants justice and you're like, well, 1:47:09.760 --> 1:47:11.320 my idea of justice is different. 1:47:11.560 --> 1:47:12.879 And yeah, it's interesting. 1:47:13.400 --> 1:47:15.759 That is I never thought of the through line between 1:47:15.800 --> 1:47:20.960 those two characters is radical forgiveness, but it's true. That's funny. 1:47:21.080 --> 1:47:23.280 Yeah, And how did you feel did you get to 1:47:23.320 --> 1:47:24.960 work with Amorrow Danny Pino? 1:47:26.320 --> 1:47:29.080 He was the other detective, wasn't he in your scene 1:47:29.120 --> 1:47:31.840 when you were I was telling a story, Yes, when 1:47:31.840 --> 1:47:33.040 I was telling this story. 1:47:33.880 --> 1:47:36.280 It's hard to say because Marishka is such a nice 1:47:36.400 --> 1:47:40.000 person that I feel like she could be partners with anybody, 1:47:40.479 --> 1:47:44.160 but there was definitely a gentleness and an ease to 1:47:44.320 --> 1:47:49.519 their partnership, and it was fun how they're allowed to 1:47:49.560 --> 1:47:52.200 have different they don't have to have the same reaction 1:47:52.520 --> 1:47:54.479 to the surprise. 1:47:55.680 --> 1:47:59.439 You notice so many good details. That's the theater. That's 1:47:59.479 --> 1:48:03.200 the theater, right, and. 1:48:03.120 --> 1:48:05.400 Then being in the Dick Wolf universe. We saw you 1:48:05.439 --> 1:48:07.600 also did Chicago Med. How was it going back to 1:48:07.680 --> 1:48:10.120 Chicago after doing theater there for so long and being 1:48:10.160 --> 1:48:12.640 able to film and like, what are the places you 1:48:12.720 --> 1:48:15.360 love to go and stay while you're in Chicago? 1:48:15.760 --> 1:48:20.879 Yeah, oh my gosh, it always becomes a Chicago tourism 1:48:21.520 --> 1:48:22.280 towards the end. 1:48:22.840 --> 1:48:27.280 Wow, well my mom is still there, as is my brother. 1:48:27.560 --> 1:48:30.479 So my mom actually got sick while I was shooting 1:48:30.520 --> 1:48:33.760 Chicago Med and so I was bringing her, you know, 1:48:34.000 --> 1:48:38.479 Thai food and stuff to that delicious chicken soup that 1:48:38.560 --> 1:48:42.560 makes you feel better. You know. It's always fun to 1:48:42.600 --> 1:48:45.719 go to Stuff and Wolf, that's for sure. That makes 1:48:45.720 --> 1:48:46.320 me happy. 1:48:47.760 --> 1:48:49.439 We saw that you did an episode of Bold. 1:48:49.439 --> 1:48:51.840 Did you ever get to meet Geneva Carr, She's the 1:48:51.880 --> 1:48:54.639 blonde that's like the main No, I. 1:48:54.720 --> 1:48:57.640 Did not that was another psycho killer. I was just 1:48:57.680 --> 1:48:59.559 an a warehouse holding a gun to his head from 1:48:59.640 --> 1:49:01.639 Oh yeah, I think. 1:49:01.439 --> 1:49:03.960 It's so funny we get cast as a psycho so much. 1:49:04.040 --> 1:49:06.879 Wow, Yeah right casting. 1:49:07.280 --> 1:49:08.960 Well, it was exciting to talk to you because it 1:49:09.040 --> 1:49:11.320 was gonna be like does her what is her voice? 1:49:11.400 --> 1:49:11.880 You know what I mean? 1:49:12.560 --> 1:49:17.720 Like it's similar to your character? Very good demon. Yeah. 1:49:17.880 --> 1:49:18.800 Do you do voiceover? 1:49:19.680 --> 1:49:22.160 Uh? No, nobody wants to because I can't sell anything. 1:49:22.160 --> 1:49:23.519 I just make everybody fall asleep. 1:49:25.040 --> 1:49:29.200 No, you could absolutely do meditation apps. You're gonna do 1:49:29.280 --> 1:49:31.920 meditation apps Like I would absolutely listen to you to 1:49:31.920 --> 1:49:34.559 fall asleep, like just to calm down and not have 1:49:34.600 --> 1:49:35.760 anxiety at the end of the night. 1:49:35.840 --> 1:49:37.960 Not that you're putting me to sleep. You're very interesting. 1:49:38.320 --> 1:49:39.679 I just be in the tone of your voice. 1:49:39.720 --> 1:49:43.160 If you were like telling me a mundane story, I'd 1:49:43.160 --> 1:49:44.960 be right out like. 1:49:44.520 --> 1:49:48.160 Like awsome, get the phone book, let's do it. 1:49:48.280 --> 1:49:48.519 Yes. 1:49:50.520 --> 1:49:54.000 Is there any where that our listeners like any future 1:49:54.040 --> 1:49:56.600 projects or anything you want anyone to check out or 1:49:56.640 --> 1:49:59.240 find you on the internet or a cause you're into. 1:49:59.760 --> 1:50:02.800 Yeah, if you don't mind, there's there's a very small 1:50:02.840 --> 1:50:05.519 theater company in New York City and the name is 1:50:05.600 --> 1:50:10.880 Houses on the Moon and I love I work with them, 1:50:10.960 --> 1:50:14.599 sometimes not as an actor, but behind things. What's amazing 1:50:14.640 --> 1:50:16.800 about them is that each play that they do is 1:50:16.920 --> 1:50:21.599 completely unique and unique to the cause that they're from 1:50:21.760 --> 1:50:24.760 two thousand and one. Their mission statement has been to 1:50:24.840 --> 1:50:28.439 amplify the unheard voice, and they go into communities they 1:50:28.479 --> 1:50:30.800 walk the walk. They don't just talk the talk. They 1:50:30.800 --> 1:50:34.519 have community partners that they build relationships with that are 1:50:34.560 --> 1:50:37.759 sustained year after year after year. So for like, for example, 1:50:37.920 --> 1:50:43.080 when they worked on a show about deportation of gang 1:50:43.120 --> 1:50:50.120 youths back to Central America, they made relationships with advocacy 1:50:50.160 --> 1:50:53.800 groups and pro bono lawyer groups and all of these 1:50:53.960 --> 1:50:56.720 and these relationships are sustained. And when they did one 1:50:56.800 --> 1:51:00.920 about gun violence, they work with like different community groups 1:51:00.920 --> 1:51:06.160 that work with kids and neighborhoods that are difficult. They 1:51:06.200 --> 1:51:07.880 have a show on right now. I don't know when 1:51:07.880 --> 1:51:12.200 this episode airs, but it's called Superhero and it's happening 1:51:12.200 --> 1:51:15.719 at the Sheen Arts Center and it's really, really, really 1:51:15.760 --> 1:51:19.040 good and it's funny. That's the thing. Their shows are funny, 1:51:19.680 --> 1:51:22.759 but they never tell you what you're supposed to think about. 1:51:23.040 --> 1:51:26.200 These issues. They basically just lay it out for you. 1:51:26.280 --> 1:51:30.160 They're just laying it out. They're very authentic. That takes 1:51:30.160 --> 1:51:32.880 them forever to make a show. They're really cool and 1:51:32.920 --> 1:51:35.759 what is it called again, Houses on the Moon? 1:51:35.960 --> 1:51:40.080 Houses on the Moon? Okay, awesome, Thank you for sharing 1:51:40.120 --> 1:51:40.559 about that. 1:51:40.600 --> 1:51:42.960 Thank you for asking that. It be really nice to 1:51:42.960 --> 1:51:44.160 be able to talk about them. 1:51:44.439 --> 1:51:48.320 Are there any other like stories or tidbits that you'd 1:51:48.360 --> 1:51:49.080 love to share? 1:51:50.520 --> 1:51:52.920 All I can think is that, you know, when I 1:51:52.920 --> 1:51:56.840 did the original recipe, I was so amazed at the 1:51:57.000 --> 1:51:59.280 machine that whenever we had a break, I had changed 1:51:59.280 --> 1:52:01.320 it into my costume is fast as possible, and then 1:52:01.320 --> 1:52:07.240 I just watch everybody doing their thing, and it was 1:52:07.360 --> 1:52:10.439 just it was so amazing to watch everybody working at 1:52:10.439 --> 1:52:13.679 the same time, the lighting, the props, you know, set 1:52:14.160 --> 1:52:17.840 everything like and the pieces you know that they that 1:52:18.360 --> 1:52:20.400 it's like a big erector set and they can like 1:52:20.439 --> 1:52:23.040 take it apart and put it back together. And it's 1:52:23.080 --> 1:52:27.000 so different from live theater, but at the same time, 1:52:27.080 --> 1:52:31.000 the theatricality of it is so exciting. Just the very 1:52:31.040 --> 1:52:32.799 similitude if that's the word. 1:52:32.680 --> 1:52:34.880 Right, Yeah, I've never heard that word in my life. 1:52:34.920 --> 1:52:35.639 But care. 1:52:38.400 --> 1:52:41.000 We're just down to the very the tiniest details, like 1:52:41.040 --> 1:52:44.679 everything was perfect. Everybody just does their jobs so well. 1:52:44.600 --> 1:52:46.720 Yeah, yeah, we talk about that all the time, and 1:52:46.760 --> 1:52:50.599 I think as like, when you're not in the biz 1:52:50.680 --> 1:52:53.640 or whatever, you really don't know how many people and 1:52:53.680 --> 1:52:56.040 how many skills it takes to make this bee like 1:52:56.080 --> 1:52:59.360 a great production. And as to you, it's like we 1:52:59.360 --> 1:53:01.800 were just doing an episode where it was in a restaurant, 1:53:01.880 --> 1:53:04.080 and like they're the schedules in the back and the 1:53:04.120 --> 1:53:07.439 stickers and there's always just these little details everywhere that 1:53:07.520 --> 1:53:08.360 are so good. 1:53:08.600 --> 1:53:11.280 I think people think that they're just renting out a 1:53:11.280 --> 1:53:14.120 restaurant using whatever's around, and it's like no, no, no, They're 1:53:14.160 --> 1:53:17.880 like they're set decorating this whole thing, like they it's 1:53:18.000 --> 1:53:18.800 like all. 1:53:18.600 --> 1:53:20.679 The details and the mediculous control. 1:53:21.439 --> 1:53:22.080 Yeah. 1:53:22.400 --> 1:53:24.240 So we're very impressed by it all the time and 1:53:24.720 --> 1:53:26.240 glad to hear. We're glad to hear you are too. 1:53:26.680 --> 1:53:29.320 God, I wish I could think of some amazing story. 1:53:29.520 --> 1:53:32.120 I can't think of asking for the. 1:53:32.080 --> 1:53:34.400 Fact that this episode was on twenty one years ago, 1:53:34.560 --> 1:53:37.120 so you really really Oh, I. 1:53:37.000 --> 1:53:39.719 Know one thing, at the very beginning of the episode, 1:53:39.840 --> 1:53:41.880 it's not really a memory thing but it's just at 1:53:41.880 --> 1:53:44.280 the very beginning of the episode, I say a whitlock. 1:53:44.400 --> 1:53:47.680 Did you see I say A whitlock? Is like, he's like, 1:53:47.760 --> 1:53:51.000 that's the time you see the very beginning of the show, 1:53:51.600 --> 1:53:54.760 and it's just like I knew him from around and 1:53:54.840 --> 1:53:57.040 it's just so exciting to see it, to go back 1:53:57.040 --> 1:53:59.720 in time because I had actually forgotten because it's so 1:53:59.800 --> 1:54:02.639 tough and it's so just at the very very beginning. 1:54:02.840 --> 1:54:06.640 It's like, I'm so honored that he's like that he 1:54:06.840 --> 1:54:10.760 opens my first episode of SVU. Now you know now 1:54:10.840 --> 1:54:11.800 that he's. 1:54:11.400 --> 1:54:15.880 Like oh yeah, yeah, yeah, totally. Yeah, he's so young. 1:54:15.960 --> 1:54:17.840 It's wild when you get to grow up with a 1:54:17.840 --> 1:54:21.120 lot of these actors and then be surprised. 1:54:21.439 --> 1:54:23.760 Yeah, that is always a surprising start. 1:54:23.640 --> 1:54:25.280 And that you don't know, like because you know, there 1:54:25.280 --> 1:54:27.000 are a lot of people out there like, you know, oh, 1:54:27.040 --> 1:54:30.040 I'm going to be a star and it's like sure, yeah, 1:54:30.080 --> 1:54:31.479 you know, and it's like no, he's like, you know, 1:54:31.520 --> 1:54:34.040 he's Spike Lee's right hand man and he's like working 1:54:34.040 --> 1:54:36.800 with Donald Glover and he's like no, It's just like 1:54:37.320 --> 1:54:41.240 this is so cool. It's the little time capsules too. 1:54:41.320 --> 1:54:43.080 It's fun to take the ride back in the time 1:54:43.120 --> 1:54:46.560 capsule the nineties hair, So I kind of like, wow, 1:54:46.840 --> 1:54:47.360 look at that. 1:54:49.440 --> 1:54:53.040 Well, I was gonna say, a lot of the people 1:54:53.040 --> 1:54:55.760 that we talked to from the earlier seasons to that, like, 1:54:55.840 --> 1:54:57.880 there wasn't a lot shooting in New York, So it 1:54:57.920 --> 1:55:00.160 does seem like it was really a small community of 1:55:00.200 --> 1:55:03.240 actors overlapping and you probably saw each other at the 1:55:03.320 --> 1:55:06.400 Chelsea Piers all the time. And I kind of love 1:55:07.000 --> 1:55:09.600 thinking about all of you guys running into each other 1:55:09.640 --> 1:55:10.280 all the time. 1:55:10.880 --> 1:55:14.200 Definitely, Well, they have not had you now in a 1:55:14.200 --> 1:55:16.440 few years. I think we've all forgotten about a back role. 1:55:16.520 --> 1:55:19.080 Now it's time and I'd like to see that psycho 1:55:19.200 --> 1:55:21.800 killer of you on this because you haven't done that 1:55:21.840 --> 1:55:25.000 on this one yet. So if you're listening, yes, for 1:55:25.120 --> 1:55:29.280 you casting, we have one Ny Bacon with a knife. 1:55:29.560 --> 1:55:34.760 We need her back, yeah, killing children or something really well. 1:55:35.480 --> 1:55:38.040 Oh yeah, like an unhinged mom. 1:55:38.160 --> 1:55:41.760 Yeah, yeah, that's I think that's that's what America needs. 1:55:42.160 --> 1:55:49.400 Yeah, you know, I just love a Thespian. 1:55:49.160 --> 1:55:49.800 You know what I mean. 1:55:51.800 --> 1:55:55.160 I'm actually in the hotel where my Thespian high school 1:55:55.200 --> 1:55:57.120 banquet was upstairs. 1:55:57.400 --> 1:56:01.320 Really yeah, kind of cool. Right, Oh wow, Memory Lane, 1:56:01.520 --> 1:56:03.640 that's fun. That is fun. 1:56:04.000 --> 1:56:07.560 Yeah, but I do love a theater goo you know 1:56:07.600 --> 1:56:07.960 what I mean? 1:56:08.040 --> 1:56:11.080 Yeah, yeah, No, she was great. She definitely has like 1:56:11.920 --> 1:56:13.680 she should. I like, I told her, I'm like, you 1:56:13.720 --> 1:56:16.960 need to like be on like the meditation apps or something. 1:56:16.960 --> 1:56:19.240 Her voice is like so soothing, like she would put 1:56:19.240 --> 1:56:19.960 me right to sleep. 1:56:20.200 --> 1:56:22.520 Yeah, And I like that she had the inside scoop 1:56:22.600 --> 1:56:25.480 that Marishka was a star from season one. You know, 1:56:26.080 --> 1:56:29.560 she could tell. She could tell the more gossip the better. 1:56:29.960 --> 1:56:32.760 That was really cool and I like it. 1:56:32.960 --> 1:56:33.200 Well. 1:56:33.280 --> 1:56:37.160 I love this this episode at everything Quakers fighting. 1:56:38.840 --> 1:56:43.400 Just tell me his name, you stupid bitch. It's so 1:56:43.840 --> 1:56:45.680 good and I love U. 1:56:45.840 --> 1:56:52.680 Not I love but I enjoy doing local, smaller types 1:56:52.720 --> 1:56:55.240 of crimes that maybe not a lot of people know about. 1:56:55.280 --> 1:56:57.600 I obviously love doing the massive research of like a 1:56:57.600 --> 1:57:01.480 Scott Peterson or Eileen Morenos, but I really do, in 1:57:01.520 --> 1:57:08.400 a different way enjoy researching these smaller crimes that just 1:57:08.400 --> 1:57:10.280 like have what do you call it? 1:57:10.320 --> 1:57:12.720 I don't know all crimes are equally important. 1:57:12.440 --> 1:57:15.760 No, but more like yeah, not sort of lower profile 1:57:15.840 --> 1:57:19.400 crime and though they're even though they're just the magnitude 1:57:19.400 --> 1:57:21.680 of every crime is important, like they're just not they 1:57:21.680 --> 1:57:24.280 don't just all get picked up by people magazine, you know. 1:57:24.720 --> 1:57:30.080 And this case like sparked new legislation and so that's 1:57:32.000 --> 1:57:35.240 you know, even like one person, I don't know, one 1:57:35.280 --> 1:57:36.680 bad thing can make a difference. 1:57:36.720 --> 1:57:38.440 I don't know what, I don't know what to say. 1:57:38.760 --> 1:57:42.280 No, it's like we have, like we have talked about 1:57:42.320 --> 1:57:44.440 a lot of cases where even if a person doesn't 1:57:44.440 --> 1:57:48.080 get justice, like it has changed one thing, you know, 1:57:48.240 --> 1:57:51.680 like sadly they don't, you know, they don't get the 1:57:51.760 --> 1:57:54.840 justice they deserve, but then hopefully future victims have been 1:57:55.400 --> 1:57:58.800 saved by their I hate to say sacrifice because they 1:57:58.800 --> 1:58:00.840 didn't do anything intentional, but you know. 1:58:01.480 --> 1:58:03.720 Yeah, but having to take the stand and doing all 1:58:03.800 --> 1:58:07.280 that it is. Yeah, and that's what the episode showed too, 1:58:08.000 --> 1:58:11.280 right right. Oh and it's the classic thing of someone 1:58:11.320 --> 1:58:13.920 commits a sexual crime and then gets not a lot 1:58:13.960 --> 1:58:15.879 of jail time and then comes back out and commits 1:58:15.960 --> 1:58:18.880 lots and lots more crimes like or all these like 1:58:19.040 --> 1:58:21.720 mass shooters and stuff like we just don't take these crimes. 1:58:21.800 --> 1:58:25.080 So this guy like raped got a small sentence, came 1:58:25.120 --> 1:58:27.320 out and then raped so many more people it's like, 1:58:27.400 --> 1:58:29.480 why are we not keeping rapists in jail? 1:58:29.600 --> 1:58:32.760 What the fuck? Yeah? But a great episode. 1:58:32.920 --> 1:58:36.000 But I also yeah, I also like Jenny Bacon did 1:58:36.000 --> 1:58:38.080 bring shit to light because I hated the character and 1:58:38.080 --> 1:58:40.520 then hearing her be like, you know, people heal in 1:58:40.560 --> 1:58:42.440 different ways, and this was the way that she was 1:58:42.480 --> 1:58:45.520 able to like yeat through. It made me really open 1:58:45.560 --> 1:58:48.800 my eyes to a different perspective on the character. 1:58:49.120 --> 1:58:50.560 No, that's a really good point. 1:58:50.640 --> 1:58:55.320 I forgot about that, And yeah, it's that was really interesting. 1:58:56.960 --> 1:58:59.720 I always like from the beginning was kind of like 1:59:00.120 --> 1:59:02.560 I see what she's talking about, but like you have 1:59:02.640 --> 1:59:05.600 to empathize with the other women and that they want justice, 1:59:05.760 --> 1:59:07.800 and yeah, I mean I don't know, what do you think? 1:59:08.080 --> 1:59:09.600 What do you think? And I know we like to 1:59:09.800 --> 1:59:12.800 pretend we know what's happening after the episode's over, Like, 1:59:12.840 --> 1:59:14.760 what do you think happens to that guy? He like 1:59:14.840 --> 1:59:19.080 goes to jail? Yeah, yeah, as he should. 1:59:19.200 --> 1:59:23.000 I don't know, right, Sometimes it's good that the show 1:59:23.120 --> 1:59:25.880 is fiction, but it's not what does our podcast prove? 1:59:26.040 --> 1:59:30.800 What else? Okay? I did see the meme making. 1:59:30.480 --> 1:59:35.960 Fun of like two women doing murder podcasts, but in 1:59:36.000 --> 1:59:38.800 it it was like what's up murder muffins? And we 1:59:38.880 --> 1:59:41.160 still don't have a name for everybody, And I wish 1:59:41.200 --> 1:59:44.160 we did. Murder muffins would have been good. 1:59:44.320 --> 1:59:47.800 I like calling them our dick wolf babies. Oh, okay, 1:59:48.040 --> 1:59:51.320 dick wolf babies. Oh I didn't know that. Okay, did 1:59:51.400 --> 1:59:53.880 I miss that? Said? We said it a long time ago, 1:59:53.920 --> 1:59:55.480 but then we like never really said it again. I 1:59:55.520 --> 1:59:57.720 don't think anyone's really attached to it. 1:59:57.880 --> 1:59:59.960 Please let us know how you feel about Dick will 2:00:00.160 --> 2:00:07.480 maybe our little dick wolf pops. Oh, I get it more. 2:00:07.760 --> 2:00:09.720 Oh my god, I watched a wild video on the 2:00:09.720 --> 2:00:12.640 Internet of a cat and a fox getting into a 2:00:12.680 --> 2:00:14.800 fight and the cat fucking got away. 2:00:14.880 --> 2:00:22.320 But it was fucking wild. It was wild. Oh my gosh, 2:00:22.440 --> 2:00:24.760 cat you've got for her life and the cat one. 2:00:25.680 --> 2:00:28.040 You know what Olivia Benson would have said to that cat. 2:00:28.080 --> 2:00:31.080 You did what you needed to do to survive. Yeah, 2:00:31.480 --> 2:00:35.720 don't blame yourself, mittens, Mittens, don't blame yourself. 2:00:35.760 --> 2:00:40.200 You did exactly what you had to do. All right. Listen, 2:00:40.600 --> 2:00:43.720 let's move in to our what would Sister Peg do? 2:00:43.880 --> 2:00:47.680 Segment? This is our weekly segment where we point you 2:00:47.760 --> 2:00:52.680 to a organization book article, something to help shed more 2:00:52.760 --> 2:00:55.440 light on the topic we touched on in today's episode, 2:00:55.560 --> 2:00:58.280 and I wanted to point out this New York Times 2:00:58.400 --> 2:01:02.840 article that is called should Statutes of Limitations for Rape 2:01:02.960 --> 2:01:06.800 Be Abolished? And obviously the link is in our show notes. 2:01:07.360 --> 2:01:11.720 And the article is a story about Donna Palumba, a 2:01:11.760 --> 2:01:15.080 woman who was raped in nineteen ninety three and shoddy 2:01:15.120 --> 2:01:18.320 police work and statutal limitations in the state of Connecticut 2:01:18.440 --> 2:01:22.080 all contributed to her not getting the justice she deserved. 2:01:22.480 --> 2:01:25.120 And it explains the history of the statute of limitations 2:01:25.120 --> 2:01:28.160 that exist for sexual assault cases in several states and 2:01:28.160 --> 2:01:29.880 how that's gotten in the way of helping a lot 2:01:29.880 --> 2:01:30.720 of people in the. 2:01:30.680 --> 2:01:32.280 Same situation as Donna. 2:01:32.400 --> 2:01:34.280 And so I just thought it shed a lot more 2:01:34.360 --> 2:01:37.280 light in case you're like, what is the statute of limitations? 2:01:37.320 --> 2:01:39.480 Because you know it was different. This is a season 2:01:39.480 --> 2:01:42.240 one episode. The statutal limitations in New York has changed 2:01:42.360 --> 2:01:45.600 since this article came out, So since this episode came out, 2:01:45.640 --> 2:01:48.480 and since this article came out, So I think it's 2:01:48.480 --> 2:01:50.600 important if you want to know more about the statute 2:01:50.640 --> 2:01:54.640 limitations to get a little bit more context. This article 2:01:54.680 --> 2:01:57.520 is very helpful and that is as you know, as 2:01:57.560 --> 2:02:00.560 always in our show notes and on Instagram in our 2:02:00.680 --> 2:02:03.600 WWSPD highlight along with all of our other what would 2:02:03.600 --> 2:02:05.240 Sister peg dos that we've ever done. 2:02:05.840 --> 2:02:09.000 Next week's episode, we'll be doing Criminal Stories Season fifteen, 2:02:09.200 --> 2:02:15.720 episode eighteen. Get ready for Benson's Bouncing Curls and Hulu 2:02:15.760 --> 2:02:20.520 Peacock VPNs. Get your episodes in, do your homework or else, 2:02:21.480 --> 2:02:35.480 and we'll see you next week. Bye, guys, That's Messed 2:02:35.560 --> 2:02:37.120 Up as an exactly right production. 2:02:37.520 --> 2:02:39.640 If you have compliments you'd like to give us or 2:02:39.720 --> 2:02:41.960 episodes you'd like us to cover, shoot us an email 2:02:41.960 --> 2:02:44.680 it That's Messed uppod at gmail dot com. 2:02:44.880 --> 2:02:48.040 Follow the podcast on Instagram at That's Messed Up Pod 2:02:48.280 --> 2:02:51.160 and on Twitter at Messed Up Pod, and follow us 2:02:51.200 --> 2:02:54.280 personally at Kara Klank and at glitter Cheese. 2:02:54.520 --> 2:02:57.240 As always, please see our show notes for sources and 2:02:57.240 --> 2:02:57.919 more information. 2:02:58.320 --> 2:03:01.480 Thank you so much to our producer Annalie Nelson. 2:03:01.480 --> 2:03:03.600 And to our mixer John Bradley. 2:03:03.520 --> 2:03:06.200 And to Henry Kaperski for our theme song and Carly 2:03:06.320 --> 2:03:09.440 Jean Andrews for our artwork. Thank you to our executive 2:03:09.440 --> 2:03:13.520 producers Georgia hard Start, Karen Kilgarriff, Daniel Kramer and everybody 2:03:13.520 --> 2:03:14.560 at exactly right media. 2:03:16.000 --> 2:03:16.760 Dun dun