1
00:00:00,800 --> 00:00:03,680
Speaker 1: Hey, guys, ready or not, twenty twenty four is here

2
00:00:03,880 --> 00:00:06,360
Speaker 1: and we here at breaking points, are already thinking of

3
00:00:06,400 --> 00:00:08,600
Speaker 1: ways we can up our game for this critical election.

4
00:00:08,800 --> 00:00:11,760
Speaker 2: We rely on our premium subs to expand coverage, upgrade

5
00:00:11,760 --> 00:00:15,120
Speaker 2: the studio ad staff, give you, guys, the best independent

6
00:00:15,160 --> 00:00:17,440
Speaker 2: coverage that is possible. If you like what we're all about,

7
00:00:17,720 --> 00:00:20,040
Speaker 2: it just means the absolute world to have your support.

8
00:00:20,160 --> 00:00:21,880
Speaker 2: But enough with that, let's get to the show.

9
00:00:25,120 --> 00:00:27,600
Speaker 1: We're very fortunate to be joined this morning by the

10
00:00:27,720 --> 00:00:31,000
Speaker 1: Green Party candidate for president, doctor Jill Stein. Is great

11
00:00:31,000 --> 00:00:32,160
Speaker 1: to see you, Doctor Stein.

12
00:00:32,080 --> 00:00:32,680
Speaker 2: Great to see you.

13
00:00:32,840 --> 00:00:33,760
Speaker 3: Good to see you both.

14
00:00:34,400 --> 00:00:36,839
Speaker 1: So I know you've been working to highlight an issue

15
00:00:36,920 --> 00:00:40,360
Speaker 1: core to democracy about the denial of your name to

16
00:00:40,360 --> 00:00:42,080
Speaker 1: be on the ballot in Nevado. You can go ahead

17
00:00:42,120 --> 00:00:44,960
Speaker 1: and put up the press release that you put out,

18
00:00:45,000 --> 00:00:48,960
Speaker 1: but just explain to people what exactly happened here, because

19
00:00:49,560 --> 00:00:51,360
Speaker 1: you know, I know, one of the things that the

20
00:00:51,360 --> 00:00:53,880
Speaker 1: Green Party's been very effective at is being able to

21
00:00:53,880 --> 00:00:57,600
Speaker 1: obtain ballot access in states across the country. So how

22
00:00:57,600 --> 00:00:59,320
Speaker 1: are they able to keep you off in you know,

23
00:00:59,360 --> 00:01:00,440
Speaker 1: those criticals state.

24
00:01:01,640 --> 00:01:04,520
Speaker 4: Yeah, so the Democrats had announced way back in the

25
00:01:04,520 --> 00:01:07,399
Speaker 4: spring that they had hired an army of lawyers for

26
00:01:07,480 --> 00:01:10,840
Speaker 4: the purpose of throwing their competition off the ballot, basically

27
00:01:10,959 --> 00:01:15,480
Speaker 4: using law fare, misusing details of the law in order

28
00:01:15,520 --> 00:01:18,200
Speaker 4: to undermine basically the spirit of the law, which is

29
00:01:18,200 --> 00:01:20,320
Speaker 4: what they've been doing, and Nevada is a very good

30
00:01:20,319 --> 00:01:24,640
Speaker 4: example of that. In Nevada, they challenged the forms that

31
00:01:24,720 --> 00:01:28,760
Speaker 4: we had been given by the Secretary of State, forms

32
00:01:28,760 --> 00:01:32,920
Speaker 4: for collecting signatures, and in fact, we had started out

33
00:01:33,000 --> 00:01:36,560
Speaker 4: the petition drive using the correct forms, which happened to

34
00:01:36,600 --> 00:01:43,120
Speaker 4: have a small footnote about verifying that signers actually lived

35
00:01:43,120 --> 00:01:47,120
Speaker 4: in the district, making a verbal verification that they lived

36
00:01:47,160 --> 00:01:51,120
Speaker 4: in the district they claimed, and that footnote was contained

37
00:01:51,200 --> 00:01:53,400
Speaker 4: on the first form that in fact we were using.

38
00:01:53,760 --> 00:01:55,360
Speaker 3: And then the Secretary of State.

39
00:01:55,800 --> 00:01:59,960
Speaker 4: In error or who knows why, but they told us

40
00:02:00,080 --> 00:02:02,680
Speaker 4: that that was the incorrect form and we should switch

41
00:02:02,720 --> 00:02:06,360
Speaker 4: the forms, which we did, and we then collected three

42
00:02:06,560 --> 00:02:10,480
Speaker 4: times the number of required signatures, so we were certainly fulfilling,

43
00:02:10,840 --> 00:02:12,000
Speaker 4: you know, the spirit.

44
00:02:11,639 --> 00:02:13,760
Speaker 3: Of the law, and we had done it correctly, and the.

45
00:02:13,720 --> 00:02:19,040
Speaker 4: Secretary of State basically gave us the wrong form, and

46
00:02:19,080 --> 00:02:24,720
Speaker 4: then after these signatures were all submitted, they challenged the

47
00:02:24,760 --> 00:02:27,720
Speaker 4: signatures based on the form.

48
00:02:27,480 --> 00:02:29,120
Speaker 3: On the incorrect form they had given us.

49
00:02:29,360 --> 00:02:33,200
Speaker 4: The first court actually throughout the case and ruled in

50
00:02:33,200 --> 00:02:38,920
Speaker 4: our favor. But then the Democratic Party appealed and the

51
00:02:38,960 --> 00:02:43,200
Speaker 4: Court of Appeals, which was full of political appointments, ruled

52
00:02:43,200 --> 00:02:46,240
Speaker 4: in their favor, and the Supreme Court, you know.

53
00:02:46,240 --> 00:02:46,920
Speaker 3: Validated that.

54
00:02:47,040 --> 00:02:51,840
Speaker 4: So it basically provides an incentive for any secretary of

55
00:02:51,919 --> 00:02:56,280
Speaker 4: State to make a mistake and you know, and thereby

56
00:02:56,400 --> 00:02:57,799
Speaker 4: throw the competition off the ballant.

57
00:02:57,919 --> 00:02:59,720
Speaker 2: Yeah, it's absolutely ridiculous. I want to ask you if

58
00:02:59,720 --> 00:03:03,520
Speaker 2: phill sophical question as somebody who's now been experiencing this

59
00:03:03,680 --> 00:03:06,240
Speaker 2: lawfare to keep you off the ballot. One of the

60
00:03:06,280 --> 00:03:10,080
Speaker 2: reasons that RFK Junior gave for specifically endorsing Trump was

61
00:03:10,120 --> 00:03:13,960
Speaker 2: exactly this lawfare campaign. So I guess could you talk

62
00:03:14,000 --> 00:03:17,000
Speaker 2: about what it's like to be experiencing this type of

63
00:03:17,080 --> 00:03:19,920
Speaker 2: lawfair but why you don't feel that that's a reason

64
00:03:19,960 --> 00:03:22,399
Speaker 2: to then endorse one of the major two party candidates.

65
00:03:24,240 --> 00:03:26,880
Speaker 4: I mean, it's a symbol I think of what is

66
00:03:26,880 --> 00:03:29,480
Speaker 4: wrong with the two parties that the two parties, you know,

67
00:03:29,480 --> 00:03:32,799
Speaker 4: they're bought and paid for, they manipulate the process, and

68
00:03:33,080 --> 00:03:36,680
Speaker 4: they claim to be you know, legitimate and representing the

69
00:03:36,680 --> 00:03:39,360
Speaker 4: interests of the people, but they're actually you know, doing

70
00:03:39,360 --> 00:03:43,200
Speaker 4: the opposite. And as RFK Junior said that he was

71
00:03:43,240 --> 00:03:46,760
Speaker 4: actually more of a threat to you know, to Republicans

72
00:03:46,800 --> 00:03:50,520
Speaker 4: if you were looking at who might vote for him

73
00:03:52,000 --> 00:03:54,320
Speaker 4: or who might vote you know, for which candidate if

74
00:03:54,320 --> 00:03:56,760
Speaker 4: you weren't in the race, but that the Republicans were

75
00:03:56,800 --> 00:03:59,040
Speaker 4: not trying to throw him off. It was the Democrats

76
00:03:59,080 --> 00:04:01,240
Speaker 4: who were trying to throw him off, you know, until

77
00:04:01,280 --> 00:04:03,400
Speaker 4: he you know, threw in with Trump and then they

78
00:04:03,400 --> 00:04:05,160
Speaker 4: were suing to like keep him on the ballot.

79
00:04:05,200 --> 00:04:07,320
Speaker 3: So it's just, you know, it's ridiculous.

80
00:04:07,360 --> 00:04:10,280
Speaker 4: And as far as we're concerned, this is, you know,

81
00:04:10,360 --> 00:04:13,720
Speaker 4: this is the symptom of what's wrong with this system

82
00:04:14,000 --> 00:04:16,680
Speaker 4: and these parties that are basically bought and paid for

83
00:04:17,040 --> 00:04:20,120
Speaker 4: and they're violating you know, not only you know, the

84
00:04:20,120 --> 00:04:22,920
Speaker 4: interests of third parties, but fundamentally the right of voters.

85
00:04:23,160 --> 00:04:27,480
Speaker 4: Voters are demanding you know, other choices, and you know,

86
00:04:27,560 --> 00:04:31,040
Speaker 4: before this election had really started, in the most recent

87
00:04:31,440 --> 00:04:34,479
Speaker 4: Gallop poll, the numbers were off the charts at an

88
00:04:34,560 --> 00:04:38,440
Speaker 4: all time record high. That people were demanding other choices

89
00:04:38,480 --> 00:04:41,119
Speaker 4: because the two parties had done such a poor job

90
00:04:41,360 --> 00:04:42,760
Speaker 4: of serving the public interest.

91
00:04:43,720 --> 00:04:45,880
Speaker 1: Doctor Sign wanted to ask you, So, I think a

92
00:04:45,880 --> 00:04:49,400
Speaker 1: lot of people are very sympathetic and interested in your

93
00:04:49,400 --> 00:04:52,559
Speaker 1: campaign because they see you as one of the only

94
00:04:52,800 --> 00:04:55,480
Speaker 1: Canada's the only candidate with a large amount of ballot

95
00:04:55,520 --> 00:05:00,280
Speaker 1: access who is opposing the genocide in Gaza. But they

96
00:05:00,320 --> 00:05:03,160
Speaker 1: may not see how a vote for you is more

97
00:05:03,200 --> 00:05:06,800
Speaker 1: than a protest vote at this point, given the nature

98
00:05:07,000 --> 00:05:09,479
Speaker 1: of this locked in two party system that we have.

99
00:05:09,680 --> 00:05:12,520
Speaker 1: So can you explain your theory of power? I mean,

100
00:05:12,560 --> 00:05:14,839
Speaker 1: should people see that as just a protest vote? Is

101
00:05:14,839 --> 00:05:17,120
Speaker 1: that enough to feel like I'm taking a moral stand

102
00:05:17,160 --> 00:05:19,800
Speaker 1: against this genocide or against other issues that you know

103
00:05:19,880 --> 00:05:24,000
Speaker 1: you represent and the two major party candidates don't, Or

104
00:05:24,040 --> 00:05:26,279
Speaker 1: is there a theory of power behind this that a

105
00:05:26,400 --> 00:05:31,720
Speaker 1: vote for you translates into some broader political change down

106
00:05:31,720 --> 00:05:32,120
Speaker 1: the road.

107
00:05:33,320 --> 00:05:35,880
Speaker 4: Yeah, exactly. You know, this is my third run. We

108
00:05:35,880 --> 00:05:39,279
Speaker 4: wouldn't be here had we not had the two prior

109
00:05:39,400 --> 00:05:44,320
Speaker 4: runs to basically build recognition, to build support for our agenda,

110
00:05:44,400 --> 00:05:49,480
Speaker 4: which is essentially become the agenda that the Progressive Democrats

111
00:05:49,480 --> 00:05:51,839
Speaker 4: give lip service to for the most part. That is,

112
00:05:52,200 --> 00:05:57,359
Speaker 4: you know, a Green New Deal, free public higher education,

113
00:05:57,920 --> 00:06:02,120
Speaker 4: ending student debt, reparations, Medicare for all, healthcare as a

114
00:06:02,160 --> 00:06:04,440
Speaker 4: human right. I mean, these are all issues which were

115
00:06:04,440 --> 00:06:09,240
Speaker 4: specifically launched into the national dialogue through Green candidates, beginning

116
00:06:09,279 --> 00:06:12,680
Speaker 4: with Ralph Nader back in the two thousand election, launching

117
00:06:13,200 --> 00:06:16,400
Speaker 4: Medicare for all. So, you know, there's a very concrete

118
00:06:16,440 --> 00:06:19,480
Speaker 4: process by which you build power and in the system

119
00:06:19,800 --> 00:06:22,680
Speaker 4: that we currently have, which is so steeply tilted, the

120
00:06:22,720 --> 00:06:27,320
Speaker 4: playing field, so steeply tilted towards you know, big money

121
00:06:27,520 --> 00:06:31,880
Speaker 4: and the power of big corporations and special interests to

122
00:06:32,040 --> 00:06:35,960
Speaker 4: buy influence. You know, it's not something that one overcomes

123
00:06:35,960 --> 00:06:36,800
Speaker 4: in a single run.

124
00:06:36,839 --> 00:06:38,680
Speaker 3: You have to really run repeatedly.

125
00:06:38,720 --> 00:06:41,120
Speaker 4: You have to build name recognition to where we are

126
00:06:41,160 --> 00:06:44,279
Speaker 4: now that most people really understand that. You know that

127
00:06:44,400 --> 00:06:47,040
Speaker 4: we are the party of peace, we are the party

128
00:06:47,040 --> 00:06:49,719
Speaker 4: of the public interest. We are the party that would

129
00:06:49,960 --> 00:06:54,440
Speaker 4: definitively deal with climate change. And in this race, especially

130
00:06:54,520 --> 00:06:57,440
Speaker 4: where genocide is a huge issue, you know, I would

131
00:06:57,560 --> 00:07:01,240
Speaker 4: say that it's not simply a symbolic acts that if

132
00:07:01,279 --> 00:07:05,200
Speaker 4: you vote for genocide, you're basically affirming it, You're endorsing it,

133
00:07:05,960 --> 00:07:09,760
Speaker 4: you're affirming genocide at a time. You know that most

134
00:07:09,840 --> 00:07:13,400
Speaker 4: Americans are absolutely horrified by this genocide and in fact

135
00:07:13,440 --> 00:07:17,920
Speaker 4: not only want an immediate diplomatic solution, but also want

136
00:07:17,960 --> 00:07:20,800
Speaker 4: an immediate weapons of bargo to Israel. So the American

137
00:07:20,840 --> 00:07:25,240
Speaker 4: people feel very strongly, and you know, every vote for

138
00:07:25,320 --> 00:07:28,200
Speaker 4: our campaign is a shot across the bow of the

139
00:07:28,240 --> 00:07:30,880
Speaker 4: empire telling them that we are here and we're growing.

140
00:07:31,000 --> 00:07:33,640
Speaker 4: And you know, if we wind up with five, ten,

141
00:07:33,800 --> 00:07:37,040
Speaker 4: even fifteen percent of the vote, you know, and that

142
00:07:37,120 --> 00:07:39,960
Speaker 4: really depends on whether the word gets out. I don't

143
00:07:39,960 --> 00:07:42,840
Speaker 4: know if you have read the commentary on the Breakfast

144
00:07:42,840 --> 00:07:46,240
Speaker 4: Club interview, but you know we were basically being ambushed

145
00:07:46,280 --> 00:07:50,280
Speaker 4: by you know, by Democratic Party attack dogs, as we

146
00:07:50,360 --> 00:07:53,360
Speaker 4: often are, and it completely backfired on them, as it

147
00:07:53,480 --> 00:07:57,160
Speaker 4: usually does. And to read the comments you'll see and

148
00:07:57,280 --> 00:08:00,440
Speaker 4: there are you know, maybe twenty thousand comments now on

149
00:08:00,840 --> 00:08:03,640
Speaker 4: the main posting people are saying I wasn't going to

150
00:08:03,720 --> 00:08:05,720
Speaker 4: vote for Before, I wasn't going to vote at all

151
00:08:05,760 --> 00:08:08,240
Speaker 4: because there was nothing to vote for. But now you know,

152
00:08:08,760 --> 00:08:11,240
Speaker 4: I've been persuaded that I'm going to register green and

153
00:08:11,320 --> 00:08:14,720
Speaker 4: vote green. So you know, our particular demographic is people

154
00:08:14,720 --> 00:08:16,480
Speaker 4: who are not voting in twenty twenty.

155
00:08:16,680 --> 00:08:18,440
Speaker 3: That was one out of every three.

156
00:08:18,320 --> 00:08:21,800
Speaker 4: Voters eligible voters, that is, who didn't vote, So don't

157
00:08:21,800 --> 00:08:24,280
Speaker 4: they deserve a vote as well? And if the word

158
00:08:24,320 --> 00:08:26,679
Speaker 4: were to get out and those people get out and register,

159
00:08:27,080 --> 00:08:28,880
Speaker 4: you know, we could really see this election turned on

160
00:08:29,000 --> 00:08:31,800
Speaker 4: its head. In a four way race, which this is

161
00:08:31,840 --> 00:08:35,320
Speaker 4: because in most states RFK is still on the ballot,

162
00:08:35,800 --> 00:08:39,480
Speaker 4: you basically have three pro genocide, pro war candidates and

163
00:08:39,679 --> 00:08:43,560
Speaker 4: you have our one anti genocide, anti war, pro worker

164
00:08:43,760 --> 00:08:47,360
Speaker 4: climate emergency campaign that could unify a lot of votes.

165
00:08:47,400 --> 00:08:50,080
Speaker 4: In a four way race, an election can be won

166
00:08:50,160 --> 00:08:53,560
Speaker 4: with as little as twenty six percent of the vote,

167
00:08:53,640 --> 00:08:56,760
Speaker 4: So the hurdles are not out of sight. And let

168
00:08:56,760 --> 00:09:00,200
Speaker 4: me just say it's a second major propaganda campaign that

169
00:09:00,200 --> 00:09:04,880
Speaker 4: we the people are powerless and that resistance is futile. Well,

170
00:09:04,920 --> 00:09:08,160
Speaker 4: we believe, as Frederick Douglass said, that power concedes nothing

171
00:09:08,240 --> 00:09:11,599
Speaker 4: without a demand, and if you simply vote for the

172
00:09:11,679 --> 00:09:15,520
Speaker 4: lesser evil, there is no record that there is a

173
00:09:15,679 --> 00:09:21,240
Speaker 4: strong demand to end the genocide. So whatever the outcome

174
00:09:21,280 --> 00:09:28,000
Speaker 4: of the election, recording that there is a substantial portion

175
00:09:28,040 --> 00:09:31,359
Speaker 4: of the electorate that really wants an end to the genocide,

176
00:09:31,400 --> 00:09:33,840
Speaker 4: that wants healthcare as a human right, that wants to

177
00:09:33,920 --> 00:09:37,120
Speaker 4: end student debt and have a free public higher education

178
00:09:37,240 --> 00:09:40,120
Speaker 4: and so on. To have that actually represented by a

179
00:09:40,200 --> 00:09:44,000
Speaker 4: number gives those issues real traction, which they don't have

180
00:09:44,400 --> 00:09:48,320
Speaker 4: if they are disappeared by this mythology of lesser evil.

181
00:09:48,800 --> 00:09:50,160
Speaker 1: Let me just push you on that a little bit,

182
00:09:50,200 --> 00:09:52,720
Speaker 1: because in twenty sixteen, in fact, you would know the numbers,

183
00:09:52,840 --> 00:09:55,080
Speaker 1: quite a lot of people did vote for you because

184
00:09:55,480 --> 00:09:57,920
Speaker 1: they felt that way. They felt, I just can't with

185
00:09:57,960 --> 00:10:00,559
Speaker 1: either of these candidates, and You're someone and who more

186
00:10:00,559 --> 00:10:04,240
Speaker 1: closely represents my political ideology, and I'm going to support her.

187
00:10:04,760 --> 00:10:08,320
Speaker 1: And I didn't see the Democratic Party see that as like, oh,

188
00:10:08,320 --> 00:10:10,560
Speaker 1: we got to take these issues more seriously. In fact,

189
00:10:10,600 --> 00:10:11,960
Speaker 1: in a lot of ways, what I saw was them

190
00:10:12,000 --> 00:10:15,720
Speaker 1: moving further to the right, demonizing the left, painting you

191
00:10:15,760 --> 00:10:18,640
Speaker 1: and anyone who would support you as a putin puppet,

192
00:10:18,679 --> 00:10:22,280
Speaker 1: and you know, completely trying to marginalize any of that

193
00:10:22,520 --> 00:10:25,680
Speaker 1: legitimate criticism of the party. So why would it be

194
00:10:25,760 --> 00:10:26,600
Speaker 1: different this time.

195
00:10:27,840 --> 00:10:30,839
Speaker 4: Well, first, let me just you know, remind you that

196
00:10:30,880 --> 00:10:33,760
Speaker 4: there was a huge smear campaign going on against me

197
00:10:33,800 --> 00:10:37,240
Speaker 4: at the time, and I was I was investigated for

198
00:10:37,280 --> 00:10:40,720
Speaker 4: three years by the Senate Intelligence Committee, who were trying

199
00:10:40,760 --> 00:10:44,000
Speaker 4: to find some substance to this charge, you know, and

200
00:10:44,120 --> 00:10:46,679
Speaker 4: had they been able to find any evidence, you can

201
00:10:46,720 --> 00:10:49,800
Speaker 4: be sure that you know, I would not be walking free.

202
00:10:50,080 --> 00:10:52,120
Speaker 4: You know, I would certainly have been charged with being

203
00:10:52,480 --> 00:10:56,000
Speaker 4: a foreign agent, which is a fifteen year jail sentence.

204
00:10:56,040 --> 00:10:58,760
Speaker 4: They could not find a darned thing, and they wound

205
00:10:58,840 --> 00:11:01,520
Speaker 4: up giving me basically a full exoneration and saying there

206
00:11:01,559 --> 00:11:04,840
Speaker 4: was absolutely no evidence of wrongdoing whatsoever.

207
00:11:05,240 --> 00:11:06,080
Speaker 3: But you know that.

208
00:11:06,000 --> 00:11:11,160
Speaker 4: Required my full time, you know, energy and focus and commitment,

209
00:11:11,160 --> 00:11:17,120
Speaker 4: and you really rely on having your candidate basically translate

210
00:11:17,160 --> 00:11:20,040
Speaker 4: the momentum from the campaign into the growth of the party.

211
00:11:20,240 --> 00:11:25,400
Speaker 4: And we wound up being basically standing still. And you know,

212
00:11:25,440 --> 00:11:28,800
Speaker 4: we now have evidence that they are also you know,

213
00:11:29,280 --> 00:11:33,839
Speaker 4: launching infiltration campaigns and spies and all that. So we

214
00:11:33,840 --> 00:11:38,040
Speaker 4: were tied up by a number of things that you know,

215
00:11:38,120 --> 00:11:41,840
Speaker 4: we're circumstantial, and I don't think will be the case

216
00:11:41,880 --> 00:11:42,400
Speaker 4: this time.

217
00:11:42,520 --> 00:11:43,760
Speaker 3: Also, if you've.

218
00:11:43,640 --> 00:11:45,640
Speaker 4: Only had about you know, one or one and a

219
00:11:45,679 --> 00:11:48,600
Speaker 4: half percent of the vote, that's entirely different from if

220
00:11:48,600 --> 00:11:51,280
Speaker 4: you begin to get four or five percent, And as

221
00:11:51,280 --> 00:11:54,839
Speaker 4: you well know, at five percent, you then not only

222
00:11:54,880 --> 00:11:58,080
Speaker 4: do you ensure your ballot access in many of the states,

223
00:11:58,120 --> 00:12:01,160
Speaker 4: so you don't have to spend your first nine months

224
00:12:01,280 --> 00:12:05,120
Speaker 4: just you know, getting into the barred gates, you actually

225
00:12:05,120 --> 00:12:10,000
Speaker 4: can begin the election full, full bore. But also we

226
00:12:10,080 --> 00:12:17,400
Speaker 4: would then basically receive federal funding for the general election

227
00:12:18,040 --> 00:12:20,720
Speaker 4: in the next next presidential race, so we would begin

228
00:12:20,840 --> 00:12:24,480
Speaker 4: to have a whole lot more resources to build. And

229
00:12:24,520 --> 00:12:26,760
Speaker 4: you know, the journey of one thousand miles begins with

230
00:12:26,800 --> 00:12:29,160
Speaker 4: a single step. You have to build from where you

231
00:12:29,200 --> 00:12:31,640
Speaker 4: are if you're ever going to proceed. And this mythology

232
00:12:31,679 --> 00:12:34,359
Speaker 4: that it's a wasted vote is part of the propaganda

233
00:12:34,640 --> 00:12:37,840
Speaker 4: of really silencing opposition. And if people are happy, you know,

234
00:12:37,880 --> 00:12:41,320
Speaker 4: with the genocide, if they are happy with the expanding war,

235
00:12:41,440 --> 00:12:45,679
Speaker 4: which you know is just on the verge of major

236
00:12:45,800 --> 00:12:51,079
Speaker 4: regional and potentially even global and nuclear confrontation. Yeah, sure,

237
00:12:51,360 --> 00:12:54,000
Speaker 4: you know why bother resisting. But there are many people

238
00:12:54,000 --> 00:12:56,800
Speaker 4: who feel that we have crossed now many red lines

239
00:12:56,840 --> 00:12:59,160
Speaker 4: our democracy. It's not we don't have to wait for

240
00:12:59,200 --> 00:13:02,960
Speaker 4: Donald Trump, you know, for real threats, real fascist threats

241
00:13:02,960 --> 00:13:03,760
Speaker 4: to our democracy.

242
00:13:03,920 --> 00:13:05,920
Speaker 2: When I speak, so one of the things I'll put

243
00:13:05,960 --> 00:13:08,000
Speaker 2: on the face of like a Democrat. Let's say I

244
00:13:08,040 --> 00:13:12,040
Speaker 2: live in North Carolina or Georgia or a state like that,

245
00:13:12,080 --> 00:13:14,040
Speaker 2: and I'm saying, I hear you. You know, I'm upset

246
00:13:14,080 --> 00:13:17,480
Speaker 2: about Israel, but I've got this abortion referendum or whatever

247
00:13:17,559 --> 00:13:20,080
Speaker 2: on the ballot. If I don't vote to make sure

248
00:13:20,200 --> 00:13:22,480
Speaker 2: that Donald Trump doesn't get into the office, then I

249
00:13:22,520 --> 00:13:24,439
Speaker 2: could literally have, you know, an issue I care a

250
00:13:24,480 --> 00:13:26,880
Speaker 2: lot about suffer. What would you say to somebody like that.

251
00:13:26,880 --> 00:13:28,640
Speaker 2: You've talked a lot about abortion, but you know they

252
00:13:28,640 --> 00:13:29,480
Speaker 2: have to think that way.

253
00:13:29,720 --> 00:13:32,720
Speaker 4: For one thing, Democrats could solve that problem right now,

254
00:13:32,840 --> 00:13:36,439
Speaker 4: and the Biden Harris administration could set up the abortion

255
00:13:36,559 --> 00:13:41,080
Speaker 4: clinics on federal land, on military basis and so on

256
00:13:41,240 --> 00:13:43,840
Speaker 4: all around the country, so this problem could be solved,

257
00:13:43,880 --> 00:13:45,720
Speaker 4: and shame on them for not solving it.

258
00:13:46,080 --> 00:13:48,400
Speaker 3: And sure, yeah, the White House.

259
00:13:48,160 --> 00:13:51,400
Speaker 4: Administration might change, but once those abortion clinics are set

260
00:13:51,440 --> 00:13:53,320
Speaker 4: up on federal land, it will be very hard to

261
00:13:53,360 --> 00:13:55,960
Speaker 4: take them away. Also, you know, you have the fact

262
00:13:56,000 --> 00:14:01,000
Speaker 4: that these referendums are passing all over in just about

263
00:14:01,000 --> 00:14:05,319
Speaker 4: every state that I'm aware of, the referendums to establish

264
00:14:05,400 --> 00:14:10,760
Speaker 4: abortion rights state by state are succeeding and Furthermore, this

265
00:14:10,920 --> 00:14:14,600
Speaker 4: is really on the Democrats that Roe was not already codified.

266
00:14:14,600 --> 00:14:16,199
Speaker 3: They had plenty of time to do it.

267
00:14:16,520 --> 00:14:22,240
Speaker 4: They had time when the Democrats could have overridden the veto,

268
00:14:23,320 --> 00:14:26,760
Speaker 4: and they could have. Furthermore, they could have modified the

269
00:14:26,840 --> 00:14:30,280
Speaker 4: veto to have ensured that Roe v.

270
00:14:30,360 --> 00:14:31,440
Speaker 3: Wade was codified.

271
00:14:31,520 --> 00:14:35,520
Speaker 4: And both Biden and Obama promised during their elections that

272
00:14:35,560 --> 00:14:37,160
Speaker 4: this would be the first thing that they did, but

273
00:14:37,200 --> 00:14:39,480
Speaker 4: they managed never to get to it. So, you know,

274
00:14:39,520 --> 00:14:42,600
Speaker 4: there's a lot of blame to guard around here as Republicans.

275
00:14:42,720 --> 00:14:44,800
Speaker 1: So, doctor Sin, I know you object to the idea

276
00:14:45,080 --> 00:14:48,560
Speaker 1: of lesser evil voting, but do you, in fact think

277
00:14:48,600 --> 00:14:51,160
Speaker 1: that Democrats are the lesser evil of the two parties?

278
00:14:52,880 --> 00:14:57,120
Speaker 4: You know, how do you get more evil than conducting genocide?

279
00:14:57,440 --> 00:15:00,440
Speaker 4: You know, how do you get more evil than hacking

280
00:15:01,560 --> 00:15:04,920
Speaker 4: peaceful protesters who are simply giving voice to the values

281
00:15:04,960 --> 00:15:07,480
Speaker 4: of the American people and the values of the world

282
00:15:07,560 --> 00:15:10,400
Speaker 4: and having your heads cracked in? How do you get

283
00:15:10,440 --> 00:15:13,880
Speaker 4: more evil than establishing the cop cities. There are some

284
00:15:14,000 --> 00:15:16,880
Speaker 4: eighty of them that are being built now around the country,

285
00:15:16,920 --> 00:15:22,359
Speaker 4: and many of them under democratic municipal administrations, like in Atlanta.

286
00:15:23,200 --> 00:15:26,360
Speaker 4: You know, this is an assault on our basic democratic rights,

287
00:15:26,400 --> 00:15:30,520
Speaker 4: on our freedom of speech, you know, on you know,

288
00:15:30,640 --> 00:15:33,960
Speaker 4: on basic human rights and international law that's going on.

289
00:15:34,040 --> 00:15:37,000
Speaker 1: So so to me, do you see Republicans then as

290
00:15:37,040 --> 00:15:37,760
Speaker 1: a lesser evil.

291
00:15:39,000 --> 00:15:40,400
Speaker 3: I don't see a lesser evil, you know.

292
00:15:40,440 --> 00:15:43,040
Speaker 4: I think we have two greater evils, and our job

293
00:15:43,200 --> 00:15:45,520
Speaker 4: is to basically stand up and fight for the greater good,

294
00:15:46,120 --> 00:15:49,000
Speaker 4: which you know, our very lives are depending on. As

295
00:15:49,000 --> 00:15:51,560
Speaker 4: we stand on the verge of you know, enlarging and

296
00:15:51,640 --> 00:15:54,880
Speaker 4: extremely dangerous wars, both you know, at the border of

297
00:15:54,960 --> 00:15:57,880
Speaker 4: Ukraine and Russia and as well in the Middle East,

298
00:15:57,960 --> 00:16:01,160
Speaker 4: and you know where the US is jinning, uh, you know,

299
00:16:01,240 --> 00:16:05,640
Speaker 4: conflict with China as well. We have an extremely aggressive

300
00:16:06,800 --> 00:16:10,080
Speaker 4: foreign policy which is bought and paid for not just

301
00:16:10,120 --> 00:16:13,560
Speaker 4: by a pack but also by the war contractors. Both parties,

302
00:16:13,880 --> 00:16:19,320
Speaker 4: you know, UH take contributions from uh, from packs, corporate packs.

303
00:16:19,480 --> 00:16:20,840
Speaker 3: They work with super packs.

304
00:16:21,200 --> 00:16:21,360
Speaker 4: Uh.

305
00:16:21,400 --> 00:16:22,240
Speaker 3: They can take.

306
00:16:22,120 --> 00:16:26,440
Speaker 4: Million dollar checks a single uh you know donor with

307
00:16:26,520 --> 00:16:29,920
Speaker 4: deep pockets can write a check for a million dollars

308
00:16:29,960 --> 00:16:34,440
Speaker 4: and exert enormous influence. The Greens UH do not participate

309
00:16:34,800 --> 00:16:40,040
Speaker 4: in these legalized polls for corruption. So you know we uh,

310
00:16:40,160 --> 00:16:44,000
Speaker 4: we are you know, the one national scope party that

311
00:16:44,120 --> 00:16:48,360
Speaker 4: can actually stand for what the American people desperately need.

312
00:16:48,480 --> 00:16:51,560
Speaker 4: And it's not only you know, the foreign policy, which

313
00:16:51,600 --> 00:16:54,920
Speaker 4: is squandering half of our congressional budget on the endless

314
00:16:54,920 --> 00:16:58,160
Speaker 4: war machine, but it's also what we desperately need here

315
00:16:58,200 --> 00:17:01,080
Speaker 4: at home by way of healthcare and housing, with half

316
00:17:01,160 --> 00:17:04,480
Speaker 4: of all renters now paying thirty to fifty percent of

317
00:17:04,520 --> 00:17:07,040
Speaker 4: their monthly income just to keep a group over their heads,

318
00:17:07,200 --> 00:17:10,639
Speaker 4: and rates of evictions and homelessness or skyrocketing, so we

319
00:17:10,720 --> 00:17:14,440
Speaker 4: have an emergency at home here as well. And you know,

320
00:17:14,520 --> 00:17:16,800
Speaker 4: how do we ever fix this when the two parties

321
00:17:16,880 --> 00:17:19,800
Speaker 4: keep marching lockstep to the right. It's not Greens that

322
00:17:19,920 --> 00:17:22,920
Speaker 4: are forcing Democrats to march to the right, and it's

323
00:17:22,960 --> 00:17:28,240
Speaker 4: not third parties that are basically creating Republican wins. Just

324
00:17:28,320 --> 00:17:31,920
Speaker 4: look at the election, the midterms of twenty ten, where

325
00:17:32,640 --> 00:17:36,400
Speaker 4: the Democrats lost a thousand seats and state legislatures and

326
00:17:36,760 --> 00:17:41,040
Speaker 4: sixty four seats in Congress and twelve in the Senate

327
00:17:41,080 --> 00:17:44,840
Speaker 4: and the same number of governorships. And that was after

328
00:17:44,960 --> 00:17:49,400
Speaker 4: the Wall Street bailout, the two Democratic houses of Congress

329
00:17:49,440 --> 00:17:53,480
Speaker 4: and the Obama White House. Throughout millions of homeowners while

330
00:17:53,520 --> 00:17:55,680
Speaker 4: they bailed out the crooks on Wall Street who crash

331
00:17:55,760 --> 00:17:59,080
Speaker 4: the economy. So they have been consistently punished, you know,

332
00:17:59,280 --> 00:18:02,960
Speaker 4: by the by the loss of their base. So this

333
00:18:03,080 --> 00:18:05,639
Speaker 4: is not something to blame on third parties. We've got too,

334
00:18:06,160 --> 00:18:08,320
Speaker 4: you know, bought and paid for parties which are marching

335
00:18:08,359 --> 00:18:11,320
Speaker 4: to the right. And the way to stop this march

336
00:18:11,400 --> 00:18:13,960
Speaker 4: to the right is by standing up and fighting for

337
00:18:14,080 --> 00:18:17,639
Speaker 4: a real left agenda that can actually or populist agenda,

338
00:18:17,680 --> 00:18:19,520
Speaker 4: whatever you want to call it, but an agenda that

339
00:18:19,560 --> 00:18:24,040
Speaker 4: will deliver for the very serious material needs of the

340
00:18:24,080 --> 00:18:24,879
Speaker 4: American people.

341
00:18:25,119 --> 00:18:28,520
Speaker 3: We are not taking small steps in the right direction.

342
00:18:28,920 --> 00:18:32,520
Speaker 4: We are actually backsliding, you know, by huge, giant leaps

343
00:18:32,600 --> 00:18:35,560
Speaker 4: right now, and our very survival is at stake.

344
00:18:35,680 --> 00:18:38,880
Speaker 1: So one of the arguments that leftists will make in

345
00:18:38,920 --> 00:18:42,399
Speaker 1: favor of voting for Kamala Harrison a Democratic ticket is

346
00:18:42,440 --> 00:18:45,679
Speaker 1: basically like, listen, the electoral landscape is not ultimately at

347
00:18:45,680 --> 00:18:47,479
Speaker 1: the core of what's going to drive change. We need

348
00:18:47,520 --> 00:18:50,159
Speaker 1: to focus on organizing, We need to focus on labor movement,

349
00:18:50,160 --> 00:18:53,480
Speaker 1: maybe focus more on down ballot races and the operative

350
00:18:53,560 --> 00:18:56,480
Speaker 1: question for the top of the ticket. In a landscape

351
00:18:56,480 --> 00:18:59,040
Speaker 1: where it's either going to be Donald Trump or Kamala Harris.

352
00:18:59,359 --> 00:19:01,840
Speaker 1: Is which can would you rather be in opposition to?

353
00:19:02,040 --> 00:19:04,920
Speaker 1: Because they're going to be an opposition whether it's either

354
00:19:04,960 --> 00:19:06,600
Speaker 1: one of these, because we don't agree with them on

355
00:19:06,640 --> 00:19:08,280
Speaker 1: a bunch of stuff. So who would you rather be

356
00:19:08,359 --> 00:19:12,560
Speaker 1: in opposition to? And although the track record has been

357
00:19:12,800 --> 00:19:16,080
Speaker 1: horrifying when it comes to Biden Harris with regard to

358
00:19:16,359 --> 00:19:19,720
Speaker 1: the genocide in Gaza, on the other side, you have

359
00:19:19,960 --> 00:19:22,400
Speaker 1: Donald Trump, where the interests of the Republican Party are

360
00:19:22,480 --> 00:19:25,680
Speaker 1: all aligned in favor of letting Israel do whatever they

361
00:19:25,720 --> 00:19:28,960
Speaker 1: want forever. Where he's taking you know, one hundred million

362
00:19:29,000 --> 00:19:31,679
Speaker 1: dollars from Miriam Addilson, who says she wants them to,

363
00:19:31,840 --> 00:19:35,560
Speaker 1: you know, take over the West Bank, where his language

364
00:19:35,600 --> 00:19:38,520
Speaker 1: has all been critical of Biden and Harris for not

365
00:19:38,560 --> 00:19:41,640
Speaker 1: being hawkish enough with regard to that. And they say, well,

366
00:19:41,680 --> 00:19:45,400
Speaker 1: at least if it was the Harris administration, there's some opportunity,

367
00:19:45,480 --> 00:19:49,159
Speaker 1: some possibility of more pressure. And then we focus, you know,

368
00:19:49,240 --> 00:19:52,080
Speaker 1: more of our efforts on building up the labor movement

369
00:19:52,119 --> 00:19:55,680
Speaker 1: and those sorts of things changing, you know, making choice

370
00:19:56,440 --> 00:19:59,320
Speaker 1: voting a reality so that there's more of an opportunity

371
00:19:59,359 --> 00:20:02,119
Speaker 1: to vote for Cannon to actually reflect our interests. So

372
00:20:02,280 --> 00:20:06,040
Speaker 1: what is your response to that view that leftists would

373
00:20:06,119 --> 00:20:08,439
Speaker 1: rather be an opposition to Kamala Harris than be an

374
00:20:08,440 --> 00:20:11,119
Speaker 1: opposition to Donald Trump, who says he's going to deport

375
00:20:11,400 --> 00:20:16,080
Speaker 1: you know, people who are protesting in favor of Palestine.

376
00:20:16,960 --> 00:20:19,600
Speaker 4: Yeah, so let me just say that in spite of

377
00:20:19,600 --> 00:20:23,360
Speaker 4: what the candidates say. You know, we've seen for example,

378
00:20:24,040 --> 00:20:31,000
Speaker 4: both Joe Biden and and Barack Obama exceed all, you know,

379
00:20:31,240 --> 00:20:36,240
Speaker 4: all offenses of the Republicans in many areas, including deportations,

380
00:20:36,280 --> 00:20:40,119
Speaker 4: you know, and we've seen the Democratic heads in the

381
00:20:40,200 --> 00:20:43,520
Speaker 4: in the White House be the deporters in chief, and

382
00:20:43,840 --> 00:20:46,520
Speaker 4: you know, all bets are off between what they say

383
00:20:46,560 --> 00:20:48,399
Speaker 4: and what they actually do. You know, we have a

384
00:20:48,480 --> 00:20:50,879
Speaker 4: corrupt system which at the end of the day is

385
00:20:50,920 --> 00:20:54,239
Speaker 4: taking its marching orders from its big donors. And in

386
00:20:54,280 --> 00:20:57,320
Speaker 4: my view, you can make the exact opposite argument that

387
00:20:57,400 --> 00:21:00,760
Speaker 4: in fact, under democratic administrations, you see the peace movement

388
00:21:00,840 --> 00:21:03,560
Speaker 4: go to sleep, and you see actually most of the

389
00:21:03,600 --> 00:21:07,760
Speaker 4: protest movements get very quiet, and it's generally under Republicans

390
00:21:07,760 --> 00:21:12,320
Speaker 4: that we generally have a very invigorated set of social

391
00:21:12,320 --> 00:21:17,040
Speaker 4: movements that can push you know, witness under under Richard Nixon.

392
00:21:17,200 --> 00:21:18,919
Speaker 3: You know, we got Roe v.

393
00:21:19,040 --> 00:21:21,600
Speaker 4: Wade, We got the e p A and the Clean

394
00:21:21,640 --> 00:21:23,639
Speaker 4: Air Act and the Clean Water Act. We brought the

395
00:21:23,680 --> 00:21:27,439
Speaker 4: troops home from from Vietnam. That so much has to

396
00:21:27,480 --> 00:21:30,080
Speaker 4: do with what we are doing. And if we are

397
00:21:30,119 --> 00:21:33,760
Speaker 4: in a mode of, you know, of taking marching orders

398
00:21:34,040 --> 00:21:38,119
Speaker 4: from either political party, that doesn't bode well for really

399
00:21:38,160 --> 00:21:41,680
Speaker 4: empowered and you know, hard driving movements.

400
00:21:41,720 --> 00:21:43,160
Speaker 3: We need hard driving movements.

401
00:21:43,359 --> 00:21:45,120
Speaker 4: And if at the end of the day, as you argue,

402
00:21:45,160 --> 00:21:46,520
Speaker 4: if at the end of the day it really is

403
00:21:46,560 --> 00:21:49,000
Speaker 4: the nature of our movements, why don't we you know,

404
00:21:49,119 --> 00:21:52,040
Speaker 4: stand up and fight for you know, for the electoral

405
00:21:52,080 --> 00:21:55,680
Speaker 4: representation that we deserve as well as having strong movements.

406
00:21:55,800 --> 00:21:58,520
Speaker 1: So again that's I mean, that sounds like, are you

407
00:21:58,560 --> 00:22:00,399
Speaker 1: making the argument that is actually by to be an

408
00:22:00,400 --> 00:22:03,760
Speaker 1: opposition to Donald Trump, that morgets done for peace movement

409
00:22:03,800 --> 00:22:06,600
Speaker 1: and other important movements under Republicans, because that actually seems

410
00:22:06,640 --> 00:22:08,960
Speaker 1: like an argument in favor voting for Republicans.

411
00:22:09,480 --> 00:22:13,320
Speaker 4: Well, what I'm saying is that there are many mythologies

412
00:22:13,359 --> 00:22:16,040
Speaker 4: out there that disempower us. And at the end of

413
00:22:16,080 --> 00:22:18,600
Speaker 4: the day, I think Frederick Douglass had it right that

414
00:22:18,680 --> 00:22:21,520
Speaker 4: power concedes nothing without a demand. It never has and

415
00:22:21,560 --> 00:22:25,320
Speaker 4: it never will. Remember, the first spoiler parties were labeled

416
00:22:25,320 --> 00:22:28,679
Speaker 4: as such before the Civil War, and the spoiler parties

417
00:22:28,720 --> 00:22:31,879
Speaker 4: were those who were fighting for the abolition of slavery.

418
00:22:32,000 --> 00:22:35,040
Speaker 4: So I think it's really important to reject the propaganda

419
00:22:35,080 --> 00:22:38,240
Speaker 4: of powerlessness and remember the words of Alice Walker that

420
00:22:38,320 --> 00:22:40,320
Speaker 4: the biggest way people give up power is by not

421
00:22:40,440 --> 00:22:43,880
Speaker 4: knowing we have it to start with. If we simply

422
00:22:44,520 --> 00:22:46,880
Speaker 4: got the word out to one out of every three

423
00:22:46,920 --> 00:22:51,679
Speaker 4: eligible voters who tend to be lower income of color,

424
00:22:52,040 --> 00:22:57,680
Speaker 4: and what's the third lower income of color? And it'll

425
00:22:57,680 --> 00:23:00,520
Speaker 4: come to me in a moment, But you know, basic

426
00:23:01,000 --> 00:23:05,520
Speaker 4: working people who are struggling. We have the power actually

427
00:23:05,600 --> 00:23:08,639
Speaker 4: to even win a four way race or even a

428
00:23:08,640 --> 00:23:11,280
Speaker 4: three way race. So I would not accept the mythology

429
00:23:11,320 --> 00:23:13,800
Speaker 4: of powerlessness. We need to build our power, and we

430
00:23:13,840 --> 00:23:17,480
Speaker 4: don't do that by basically canceling. You know, the evidence

431
00:23:17,480 --> 00:23:19,800
Speaker 4: of our power. It needs to show, and we need

432
00:23:19,840 --> 00:23:25,480
Speaker 4: to stand up strong and reject the many, many propaganda

433
00:23:25,680 --> 00:23:28,359
Speaker 4: arguments that tell us we are powerless and resistance is

434
00:23:28,400 --> 00:23:31,600
Speaker 4: futile and we should just roll over, you know, for

435
00:23:31,720 --> 00:23:34,439
Speaker 4: whoever you think the lesser evil is and accept the

436
00:23:34,440 --> 00:23:36,640
Speaker 4: direction that they've been taking us. We have not been

437
00:23:36,680 --> 00:23:40,760
Speaker 4: making progress. We've been backsliding desperately under both Democrats, even

438
00:23:40,800 --> 00:23:44,480
Speaker 4: with three you know, with three branches of government, we've

439
00:23:44,480 --> 00:23:48,239
Speaker 4: been you know, just the evidence is very clear that

440
00:23:48,280 --> 00:23:50,520
Speaker 4: we are not moving forward. We need to stand up,

441
00:23:51,000 --> 00:23:52,879
Speaker 4: and no one's going to do it for us. We

442
00:23:52,960 --> 00:23:54,280
Speaker 4: are the ones we've been waiting for.

443
00:23:54,640 --> 00:23:57,080
Speaker 2: It's always a fascinating to talk to you. We appreciate

444
00:23:57,119 --> 00:23:59,000
Speaker 2: your time. Thank you for coming on, doctor Stein.

445
00:23:59,320 --> 00:24:00,440
Speaker 1: Great to see that so much.

446
00:24:00,440 --> 00:24:02,760
Speaker 3: And it's Jill Stein twenty twenty four. For those who'd

447
00:24:02,840 --> 00:24:04,960
Speaker 3: like to know more. Thanks very much, our pleasure