1 00:00:03,400 --> 00:00:06,600 Speaker 1: Hi everyone, I'm Kitty Kuric and this is next question 2 00:00:10,080 --> 00:00:13,920 Speaker 1: today everyone. My guest is Steve Schmidt. He's a veteran 3 00:00:13,960 --> 00:00:18,840 Speaker 1: political strategist who shaped major campaigns for Republican heavyweights like 4 00:00:19,280 --> 00:00:23,000 Speaker 1: John McCain and George W. Bush. Now he has turned 5 00:00:23,040 --> 00:00:27,120 Speaker 1: his sharp eye on the party itself, emerging as a 6 00:00:27,240 --> 00:00:31,960 Speaker 1: very powerful voice against its transformation under Donald J. 7 00:00:32,120 --> 00:00:32,519 Speaker 2: Trump. 8 00:00:33,120 --> 00:00:35,000 Speaker 1: With Trump headed back to the White House, we're going 9 00:00:35,080 --> 00:00:37,479 Speaker 1: to try to make heads or tails of this chaotic 10 00:00:37,560 --> 00:00:41,720 Speaker 1: transition period. And it is chaotic, folks. We're looking ahead 11 00:00:41,760 --> 00:00:44,400 Speaker 1: at what twenty twenty five might hold with a few 12 00:00:44,479 --> 00:00:47,840 Speaker 1: glances back at what led to Trump's second term, from 13 00:00:47,880 --> 00:00:52,000 Speaker 1: media trust to democratic strategy and Trump's wild cabinet picks. 14 00:00:52,520 --> 00:00:56,440 Speaker 1: Steve has thoughts, and he is not holding back, and 15 00:00:56,480 --> 00:01:00,960 Speaker 1: he really likes to talk. Fair warning everyone. I love him, though, 16 00:01:01,440 --> 00:01:04,560 Speaker 1: so grab your favorite beverage. My drink of choice these 17 00:01:04,680 --> 00:01:07,560 Speaker 1: days is to kill on the rocks and settle in 18 00:01:07,600 --> 00:01:12,720 Speaker 1: for a candid, no holds barred conversation about America's next chapter. 19 00:01:17,880 --> 00:01:21,080 Speaker 1: Steve Schmidt, so happy to see you. I haven't talked 20 00:01:21,080 --> 00:01:26,720 Speaker 1: to you since election night, as we were processing the 21 00:01:26,760 --> 00:01:30,200 Speaker 1: fact that Donald Trump was going to win the election. 22 00:01:30,920 --> 00:01:33,920 Speaker 1: That was about three weeks ago, Steve, and I'm just 23 00:01:34,120 --> 00:01:40,200 Speaker 1: curious how you've been able to understand what happened in 24 00:01:40,200 --> 00:01:41,479 Speaker 1: this election and why. 25 00:01:42,440 --> 00:01:48,360 Speaker 2: Huh. Well, so, I think in the end that Donald 26 00:01:48,400 --> 00:01:54,880 Speaker 2: Trump is many, many, many things, but among them is 27 00:01:54,920 --> 00:02:00,720 Speaker 2: not a hypocrite. And that is the high card of 28 00:02:00,760 --> 00:02:08,000 Speaker 2: American life, the unpardonable sin that you're full of shit. 29 00:02:09,600 --> 00:02:13,400 Speaker 2: And at the end of the day, more clear now 30 00:02:13,880 --> 00:02:19,360 Speaker 2: than when we spoke, exampled by Joe Scarborough and Mika Brazinski, 31 00:02:20,000 --> 00:02:24,519 Speaker 2: is the performative nature of all of this. Soon will 32 00:02:24,560 --> 00:02:27,600 Speaker 2: be on the four year anniversary of January sixth. I 33 00:02:27,680 --> 00:02:32,720 Speaker 2: watched it when CNN reported it as a riot. I 34 00:02:32,760 --> 00:02:35,919 Speaker 2: tweeted out in that moment, that's not a riot, it's 35 00:02:35,919 --> 00:02:41,920 Speaker 2: an insurrection. It's exactly what it was. And the American 36 00:02:42,000 --> 00:02:47,480 Speaker 2: people in the end were unbothered by it. And so 37 00:02:48,280 --> 00:02:52,880 Speaker 2: we had a breach of the peaceful transition of power, 38 00:02:54,200 --> 00:03:01,240 Speaker 2: and we had a failure by the Biden administry and 39 00:03:01,280 --> 00:03:09,280 Speaker 2: by Joe Biden, both exceptionally and singularly, to communicate effectively 40 00:03:09,400 --> 00:03:15,400 Speaker 2: to the country when he became president two weeks after that, 41 00:03:15,400 --> 00:03:23,120 Speaker 2: that what happened was astonishing, extraordinary, and there was nothing 42 00:03:24,080 --> 00:03:32,640 Speaker 2: more important than it ever ever right, not happening again, 43 00:03:34,200 --> 00:03:39,280 Speaker 2: and so the entire focus of the administration should have 44 00:03:39,440 --> 00:03:44,240 Speaker 2: been that. Instead, he treated Donald Trump as a prop 45 00:03:44,880 --> 00:03:49,920 Speaker 2: to be used to turn out voters like Voldemort in 46 00:03:50,000 --> 00:03:56,840 Speaker 2: a Harry Potter movie. And so for years Trump was 47 00:03:56,880 --> 00:04:02,680 Speaker 2: the justification for Joe Biden and I'm breaking my promise 48 00:04:03,040 --> 00:04:07,000 Speaker 2: and running for four more years. During all of this, 49 00:04:07,280 --> 00:04:13,000 Speaker 2: what rose was oppositional to the media, that you were 50 00:04:13,040 --> 00:04:16,880 Speaker 2: part of the media, that you were part of held 51 00:04:16,960 --> 00:04:20,960 Speaker 2: power to account when you worked at a network, and 52 00:04:21,000 --> 00:04:25,680 Speaker 2: that media was deeply connected to what happened in nineteen 53 00:04:25,800 --> 00:04:31,920 Speaker 2: seventy two, nineteen seventy three, in nineteen seventy four, when 54 00:04:31,920 --> 00:04:34,640 Speaker 2: a president of the United States said he was above 55 00:04:34,680 --> 00:04:38,520 Speaker 2: the law and inspired a generation. By the time we 56 00:04:38,640 --> 00:04:42,440 Speaker 2: get to where we are now, it's very different. When 57 00:04:42,440 --> 00:04:45,680 Speaker 2: Scarborough looks into the camera and he says to his 58 00:04:45,760 --> 00:04:50,560 Speaker 2: audience on what's supposed to be the most important public 59 00:04:50,600 --> 00:04:54,640 Speaker 2: affairs morning show in the country on a network that 60 00:04:54,760 --> 00:05:02,400 Speaker 2: Tom brokecaw worked at, to his audience, fuck you if 61 00:05:02,440 --> 00:05:07,080 Speaker 2: you don't believe what I'm telling you, which is the truth. 62 00:05:07,520 --> 00:05:12,320 Speaker 2: This is the best Biden we've ever had analytically and 63 00:05:12,520 --> 00:05:17,840 Speaker 2: intellectually in every single person, including me, who said that 64 00:05:17,839 --> 00:05:24,480 Speaker 2: that was bullshit was shouted down and smeared by somebody 65 00:05:25,240 --> 00:05:29,880 Speaker 2: in a position of power, or by somebody making money 66 00:05:30,560 --> 00:05:35,360 Speaker 2: from somebody in a position of power close to the 67 00:05:35,520 --> 00:05:42,039 Speaker 2: power in a political establishment that has been repudiated, has 68 00:05:42,120 --> 00:05:47,320 Speaker 2: been rejected and cast out in favor of Donald Trump, 69 00:05:47,880 --> 00:05:51,760 Speaker 2: and their takeaway from it, by and large three weeks 70 00:05:51,839 --> 00:05:58,560 Speaker 2: later is the American people are stupid, racist and we 71 00:05:58,680 --> 00:06:03,440 Speaker 2: did nothing wrong. So at this moment, fifty one days 72 00:06:03,480 --> 00:06:08,320 Speaker 2: before the inauguration, the American people are going to have 73 00:06:09,320 --> 00:06:13,440 Speaker 2: an experiential odyssey for which I think they have a 74 00:06:13,520 --> 00:06:18,640 Speaker 2: real lack of imagination, despite being warned about it, despite 75 00:06:18,680 --> 00:06:22,000 Speaker 2: having nine years to process it. And so we're going 76 00:06:22,080 --> 00:06:25,200 Speaker 2: to get to see the answer to the question spill 77 00:06:25,240 --> 00:06:28,360 Speaker 2: out in real time about what happens next when a 78 00:06:28,480 --> 00:06:31,960 Speaker 2: Pete Hegseth is the Secretary of Defense, when a man 79 00:06:32,440 --> 00:06:36,359 Speaker 2: who wants to bring back polio in smallpox, like Robert F. 80 00:06:36,440 --> 00:06:39,440 Speaker 2: Kennedy becomes the head of the public health services. So 81 00:06:39,480 --> 00:06:42,560 Speaker 2: it's going to end up tragically and badly. There will 82 00:06:42,600 --> 00:06:44,800 Speaker 2: be a lot of harm. But in a democracy, you 83 00:06:44,839 --> 00:06:47,920 Speaker 2: get the government you deserve. I'm sorry for the long answer, 84 00:06:47,960 --> 00:06:48,960 Speaker 2: but that's what happened. 85 00:06:49,520 --> 00:06:52,080 Speaker 1: Well, let me pull apart some of the things you 86 00:06:52,200 --> 00:06:54,680 Speaker 1: just claimed because it was a long answer, Steve, And 87 00:06:55,360 --> 00:06:58,799 Speaker 1: is it really fair to put the onus on Joe 88 00:06:58,839 --> 00:07:01,800 Speaker 1: Biden for Donald try Trump's victory. Is what I'm hearing 89 00:07:01,880 --> 00:07:05,640 Speaker 1: you say that he should have been focused on the 90 00:07:05,640 --> 00:07:09,760 Speaker 1: insurrection and saying it was unacceptable. But he did have 91 00:07:09,840 --> 00:07:12,920 Speaker 1: to go about the business of running the country and 92 00:07:12,960 --> 00:07:16,200 Speaker 1: being president of the United States. You're faulting him for 93 00:07:16,280 --> 00:07:19,920 Speaker 1: not emphasizing that enough and for running a second time. 94 00:07:20,360 --> 00:07:25,400 Speaker 2: I'm faulting him for his titanic egotism that led to 95 00:07:25,440 --> 00:07:29,720 Speaker 2: his breaking of his implicit promise, which is I will 96 00:07:29,760 --> 00:07:32,320 Speaker 2: be a one term president and put the country first. 97 00:07:32,360 --> 00:07:35,160 Speaker 2: It's not what he did. The truth of the matter 98 00:07:35,320 --> 00:07:38,440 Speaker 2: is is the quiet part just wasn't set out loud 99 00:07:38,520 --> 00:07:42,840 Speaker 2: by anyone except for Dean Phillips, who's now patted again 100 00:07:42,920 --> 00:07:45,640 Speaker 2: on the back by all of his colleagues who knew 101 00:07:45,640 --> 00:07:48,560 Speaker 2: what he was saying was true, then attacked him when 102 00:07:48,560 --> 00:07:51,440 Speaker 2: he set it out loud outside the green room. And 103 00:07:51,520 --> 00:07:54,320 Speaker 2: now that it's been proven true. It can be talked 104 00:07:54,360 --> 00:07:56,480 Speaker 2: again about in private. 105 00:07:56,480 --> 00:07:59,680 Speaker 1: When you say something has been proven true, Steve, you're 106 00:07:59,720 --> 00:08:03,840 Speaker 1: talking about Joe Biden's inability to run the government. Is 107 00:08:03,880 --> 00:08:06,160 Speaker 1: that what you're referring to. 108 00:08:05,520 --> 00:08:10,400 Speaker 2: To communicate, to talk to inspire, to lead, to make 109 00:08:10,440 --> 00:08:13,960 Speaker 2: it up the full set of stairs on Air Force 110 00:08:14,040 --> 00:08:19,800 Speaker 2: one in an urgent moment. And so there was a 111 00:08:19,920 --> 00:08:22,720 Speaker 2: moment in history in the country where the president was 112 00:08:22,760 --> 00:08:24,440 Speaker 2: incapacitated by a stroke. 113 00:08:24,600 --> 00:08:28,200 Speaker 1: President Wilson, right, and Edith was running the government, and 114 00:08:28,600 --> 00:08:31,560 Speaker 1: he was propped up in the car, propped. 115 00:08:31,240 --> 00:08:34,480 Speaker 2: Up running the country. And Edith Wilson believes she did 116 00:08:34,520 --> 00:08:39,840 Speaker 2: the right thing. She sincerely and honestly believed. It really 117 00:08:39,960 --> 00:08:44,320 Speaker 2: wasn't a book. Well what do you do in that circumstance? 118 00:08:44,720 --> 00:08:48,480 Speaker 2: You know, she did in her estimation what Woodrow Wilson 119 00:08:48,520 --> 00:08:53,400 Speaker 2: would have wanted. But the point is the main point 120 00:08:54,360 --> 00:08:57,560 Speaker 2: is that everybody and the most that can never happen again. 121 00:08:58,600 --> 00:09:01,160 Speaker 2: And so over and over an over again, the American 122 00:09:01,200 --> 00:09:05,720 Speaker 2: people were told things Joe Biden's FDR, the economy's the 123 00:09:05,760 --> 00:09:09,960 Speaker 2: best it's ever been, Bidenomics. You know what, the American people, 124 00:09:10,000 --> 00:09:13,079 Speaker 2: working people in the country, forty percent of which don't 125 00:09:13,080 --> 00:09:16,880 Speaker 2: have four hundred dollars available, don't like being lectured by 126 00:09:16,960 --> 00:09:21,480 Speaker 2: millionaires on television telling them how great it is. They said, fu, 127 00:09:22,240 --> 00:09:25,440 Speaker 2: and they voted for Trump because the economy wasn't great. 128 00:09:25,800 --> 00:09:28,800 Speaker 2: That was a figment of a bunch of elites imaginations 129 00:09:28,800 --> 00:09:31,480 Speaker 2: in New York and Washington. And we now have Trump 130 00:09:31,480 --> 00:09:34,320 Speaker 2: in the White House. That's one reason. That's one thing. 131 00:09:34,400 --> 00:09:40,120 Speaker 2: He did Afghanistan, completing total incompetence on the withdrawal, and 132 00:09:40,200 --> 00:09:43,560 Speaker 2: he was beaten about the head on it for four 133 00:09:43,600 --> 00:09:49,160 Speaker 2: straight years. Joe Biden said that the border was secure? 134 00:09:49,920 --> 00:09:54,559 Speaker 2: Was the border secure? It was not secure. Adult life 135 00:09:54,600 --> 00:09:57,239 Speaker 2: and I may have said this on election night requires 136 00:09:57,280 --> 00:10:01,320 Speaker 2: you to hold multiple contradictory thoughts. Trump is the most 137 00:10:01,360 --> 00:10:04,800 Speaker 2: prolific liar in American history. But if the country thinks 138 00:10:04,840 --> 00:10:08,280 Speaker 2: he's the most honest president we've ever had, because there's 139 00:10:08,320 --> 00:10:11,800 Speaker 2: no filtered thought. But when you apply the test about 140 00:10:11,800 --> 00:10:14,640 Speaker 2: who's telling the truth, who's really honest, who was telling 141 00:10:14,640 --> 00:10:17,520 Speaker 2: the truth about the border, who was telling the truth 142 00:10:17,559 --> 00:10:21,720 Speaker 2: about the economy, who was telling the truth about what 143 00:10:21,800 --> 00:10:26,200 Speaker 2: happened in Afghanistan? Who was telling the truth about Biden's capacity? 144 00:10:26,640 --> 00:10:30,920 Speaker 2: It was Donald Trump, not Joe Biden, and the problem 145 00:10:30,960 --> 00:10:36,160 Speaker 2: with that strategically, if your foundation is the opposition party 146 00:10:36,200 --> 00:10:40,680 Speaker 2: to Donald Trump is built on a sandbox, on mush 147 00:10:41,320 --> 00:10:44,480 Speaker 2: on the same type of Trump in dishonesty, you rail against, 148 00:10:45,280 --> 00:10:47,880 Speaker 2: you lose, and that's what happened. 149 00:10:48,440 --> 00:10:50,680 Speaker 1: Let me ask you about the role of the media, 150 00:10:50,720 --> 00:10:54,520 Speaker 1: because you point out Joe Scarborough and Mika Brzenski as 151 00:10:54,600 --> 00:11:01,160 Speaker 1: sort of the consummate media, I guess enablers in some ways. 152 00:11:01,960 --> 00:11:05,360 Speaker 1: Talk about that and the role you believe they played 153 00:11:05,520 --> 00:11:09,560 Speaker 1: in turning many voters against Joe Biden and Kamala Harris 154 00:11:10,120 --> 00:11:12,840 Speaker 1: and into the arms of Donald Trump. 155 00:11:13,920 --> 00:11:19,160 Speaker 2: I don't think that enough people watch the show that 156 00:11:19,360 --> 00:11:27,520 Speaker 2: it determines outcomes. What it does is shape a narrative, right. 157 00:11:28,080 --> 00:11:34,920 Speaker 2: It creates a choke point in the artery of information 158 00:11:35,760 --> 00:11:39,720 Speaker 2: around what you can say and what you can't say 159 00:11:40,720 --> 00:11:45,040 Speaker 2: in the acceptable speech lane, in the truth lane. At 160 00:11:45,080 --> 00:11:48,959 Speaker 2: a moment in American politics that some of us are 161 00:11:49,000 --> 00:11:53,720 Speaker 2: trying to say is urgent, is exigent, and is a crisis. 162 00:11:54,080 --> 00:11:59,040 Speaker 2: And when you watch Joe Biden perform by twenty twenty two, 163 00:11:59,200 --> 00:12:03,760 Speaker 2: twenty twenty three, and you appreciate what the central line 164 00:12:03,760 --> 00:12:07,680 Speaker 2: of attack is and you look at the reality that 165 00:12:07,800 --> 00:12:11,880 Speaker 2: it's clear if you have competency with regard to being 166 00:12:11,920 --> 00:12:17,000 Speaker 2: able to assess the landscape of a presidential campaign, you 167 00:12:17,040 --> 00:12:19,840 Speaker 2: can do that that Biden's in a lot of trouble. 168 00:12:20,280 --> 00:12:24,920 Speaker 2: And what Joe Biden got from Joe Scarborough, his friend, 169 00:12:25,600 --> 00:12:31,440 Speaker 2: wasn't favorable coverage, sympathetic coverage. Joe Scarborough decided, I'm gonna 170 00:12:31,440 --> 00:12:34,640 Speaker 2: wear three hats, I'm gonna be the guy on the show, 171 00:12:35,240 --> 00:12:38,360 Speaker 2: I'm gonna be the president's friend, and I'm gonna be 172 00:12:38,400 --> 00:12:42,079 Speaker 2: his political advisor. And he was. And what's special about 173 00:12:42,120 --> 00:12:45,839 Speaker 2: the United States is the and I really mean this, 174 00:12:46,679 --> 00:12:50,920 Speaker 2: the genius of the people who founded the country. They 175 00:12:50,920 --> 00:12:57,679 Speaker 2: were imperfect, they weren't just, but man, were they fucking brilliant. 176 00:12:58,720 --> 00:13:02,880 Speaker 2: And they left us something called the First Amendment. And 177 00:13:02,960 --> 00:13:06,760 Speaker 2: what the First Amendment guarantees is that the next era 178 00:13:06,880 --> 00:13:10,800 Speaker 2: of journalism in America will be bottom up. And from 179 00:13:10,840 --> 00:13:14,480 Speaker 2: this bottom up journalism will come the accountability, will come 180 00:13:14,520 --> 00:13:20,680 Speaker 2: the challenge, and will come the information the American people 181 00:13:21,240 --> 00:13:24,160 Speaker 2: need to have so that the next time they get 182 00:13:24,160 --> 00:13:30,400 Speaker 2: a choice, which they'll have again, they can say time 183 00:13:30,440 --> 00:13:32,480 Speaker 2: to turn around and change direction. 184 00:13:41,480 --> 00:13:43,600 Speaker 1: If you want to get smarter every morning with a 185 00:13:43,600 --> 00:13:46,880 Speaker 1: breakdown of the news and fascinating takes on health and 186 00:13:46,920 --> 00:13:50,280 Speaker 1: wellness and pop culture. Sign up for our daily newsletter, 187 00:13:50,360 --> 00:14:02,920 Speaker 1: Wake Up Call by going to Katiecuric dot com. Let's 188 00:14:02,960 --> 00:14:08,120 Speaker 1: talk about these cabinet picks, Steve, because Chris Coons of Delaware, 189 00:14:08,120 --> 00:14:12,840 Speaker 1: a Democrat, described it as a reality show casting call, 190 00:14:12,880 --> 00:14:17,079 Speaker 1: and there were a slew of people named over the weekend. 191 00:14:17,960 --> 00:14:24,160 Speaker 1: Donald Trump doesn't want FBI background checks, he wants recess appointments, 192 00:14:24,200 --> 00:14:27,240 Speaker 1: so the Senate doesn't even have to confirm these people. 193 00:14:28,200 --> 00:14:31,840 Speaker 1: And there are a lot of questions about some of 194 00:14:31,880 --> 00:14:38,520 Speaker 1: these folks. From RFK Junior Telsey Gavard Pete Hegseth. I 195 00:14:38,560 --> 00:14:41,440 Speaker 1: thought Maureen Dowd's column was good this weekend when she 196 00:14:41,520 --> 00:14:45,640 Speaker 1: said is Donald Trump protecting women or predators? Because there 197 00:14:45,800 --> 00:14:49,240 Speaker 1: is a thread amongst some of these people in terms 198 00:14:49,280 --> 00:14:54,680 Speaker 1: of the allegations they have faced. So, as you've watched 199 00:14:54,720 --> 00:15:00,320 Speaker 1: these people be named and cabinet positions, other power full 200 00:15:00,320 --> 00:15:05,000 Speaker 1: positions in the government, what has your reaction been shocking? 201 00:15:05,520 --> 00:15:10,720 Speaker 2: It's not surprising as shocking, Pete Hegsath cannot be must 202 00:15:10,760 --> 00:15:13,840 Speaker 2: not be in the chain of command for the release 203 00:15:13,880 --> 00:15:17,760 Speaker 2: of nuclear weapons with his white nationalist tattoos stamped on 204 00:15:17,800 --> 00:15:21,680 Speaker 2: his chest. The answer is no. Now. If the United 205 00:15:21,680 --> 00:15:26,280 Speaker 2: States Senate is unable to deliver the no with an 206 00:15:26,320 --> 00:15:32,200 Speaker 2: assertion of its coequal power under the American system, that 207 00:15:32,280 --> 00:15:36,280 Speaker 2: means we're in a crisis. If Trump appoints all of 208 00:15:36,320 --> 00:15:43,040 Speaker 2: these people, these misfits, the disordered ones, absent FBI investigations, 209 00:15:43,320 --> 00:15:50,280 Speaker 2: which is reckless, but through a recess process with the 210 00:15:50,800 --> 00:15:58,080 Speaker 2: implicit approval of Republican senators objectively, in that moment, I 211 00:15:58,120 --> 00:16:02,080 Speaker 2: could make an argument that the American Republic has fallen. 212 00:16:02,920 --> 00:16:06,160 Speaker 1: The big question is what will these senators do? And 213 00:16:06,240 --> 00:16:10,240 Speaker 1: I think it's a big question mark at this juncture, 214 00:16:10,600 --> 00:16:14,800 Speaker 1: we don't know what do you think reading the tea leaves, Steve, 215 00:16:15,800 --> 00:16:18,360 Speaker 1: do you think they are going to give Donald Trump 216 00:16:18,440 --> 00:16:22,560 Speaker 1: a green light? Or are they going to say our 217 00:16:22,680 --> 00:16:27,600 Speaker 1: role is to advise and consent and we need to 218 00:16:27,760 --> 00:16:32,640 Speaker 1: fully vet these individuals before they're put in these positions 219 00:16:32,680 --> 00:16:33,840 Speaker 1: of incredible power. 220 00:16:34,800 --> 00:16:39,600 Speaker 2: So I completely appreciate the ministerial part of this. If 221 00:16:39,680 --> 00:16:44,160 Speaker 2: you're a senator to say, I'm not going to prejudge 222 00:16:44,920 --> 00:16:48,800 Speaker 2: Nay Pete Hagsath, Tulca Gabbard we're going to wait for 223 00:16:48,840 --> 00:16:54,000 Speaker 2: the confirmation hearings. I'm going to examine them, and I 224 00:16:54,040 --> 00:16:59,040 Speaker 2: get the politics of that. There is nothing, not a 225 00:16:59,080 --> 00:17:03,960 Speaker 2: single thing that any sentient US senator needs to know 226 00:17:05,440 --> 00:17:09,679 Speaker 2: regarding these people's on fitness that isn't available right now. 227 00:17:10,480 --> 00:17:13,600 Speaker 2: In this moment, you had a guy like Pete Hegseth, Right, 228 00:17:13,680 --> 00:17:15,199 Speaker 2: you look at all these people. I was talking to 229 00:17:15,240 --> 00:17:17,240 Speaker 2: someone like, who would you stop? If you can only 230 00:17:17,240 --> 00:17:21,360 Speaker 2: stop one, which one would it be? And so I've 231 00:17:21,400 --> 00:17:23,840 Speaker 2: talked to like fifteen people about this, right, I've had 232 00:17:23,880 --> 00:17:26,520 Speaker 2: great conversations on this to some of these people all 233 00:17:26,520 --> 00:17:29,760 Speaker 2: over the world. And I was talking to one of 234 00:17:29,760 --> 00:17:32,960 Speaker 2: the I think I don't think he would mind. I 235 00:17:32,960 --> 00:17:35,760 Speaker 2: was talking to John Nichols at the Nation magazine, and 236 00:17:35,920 --> 00:17:39,479 Speaker 2: I think it's one of the smartest, brightest, most thoughtful people. 237 00:17:39,480 --> 00:17:42,680 Speaker 2: And we came to the same conclusion, right, which is 238 00:17:42,720 --> 00:17:46,040 Speaker 2: heg Seth, which is, if you were Captain Benson, you 239 00:17:46,080 --> 00:17:48,359 Speaker 2: would follow the bread comes in the clues to the 240 00:17:48,440 --> 00:17:52,320 Speaker 2: nuclear weapons. That job comes with nuclear weapons command and control. 241 00:17:53,280 --> 00:17:56,359 Speaker 2: You want a lieutenant colonel following Pete Hegseeth around with 242 00:17:56,400 --> 00:17:59,480 Speaker 2: the launch codes for the nuclear weapons. He gets to 243 00:17:59,520 --> 00:18:04,760 Speaker 2: turn the key with the president, right, right, you know? 244 00:18:05,359 --> 00:18:10,399 Speaker 2: Uh no. So you look at all these people and 245 00:18:11,240 --> 00:18:14,800 Speaker 2: I try to imagine, like what could go wrong, what 246 00:18:14,920 --> 00:18:17,400 Speaker 2: could go right? And I look at some of them 247 00:18:17,520 --> 00:18:22,480 Speaker 2: like a Gabbard, there's nothing that can go right. A 248 00:18:22,560 --> 00:18:27,440 Speaker 2: hag Seth, there's nothing that can go right. A Bobby Kennedy. Right, 249 00:18:27,720 --> 00:18:31,680 Speaker 2: he could be in pharmaceutical advertising. But polio's coming back, 250 00:18:31,720 --> 00:18:35,920 Speaker 2: so I'm against him too, right, We and and and 251 00:18:35,920 --> 00:18:40,920 Speaker 2: and Christy noan Christine, No, we haven't even talked about her, right, 252 00:18:41,000 --> 00:18:45,280 Speaker 2: Like the whole shooting of the dog. And I'm a 253 00:18:45,320 --> 00:18:47,440 Speaker 2: dog lover, right, I have like dogs are a big 254 00:18:47,440 --> 00:18:49,240 Speaker 2: part of my life, a lot of big part of 255 00:18:49,320 --> 00:18:53,359 Speaker 2: like a lot of lives of Americans. She confessed to 256 00:18:53,400 --> 00:18:56,800 Speaker 2: shooting the dog because the dog embarrassed her at a 257 00:18:56,800 --> 00:18:59,200 Speaker 2: at a hunting party. And she just had the dog 258 00:18:59,320 --> 00:19:01,479 Speaker 2: loose in the back of a pickup truck, so of 259 00:19:01,480 --> 00:19:05,000 Speaker 2: course it jumped out because it wasn't trained to sitting there, 260 00:19:05,160 --> 00:19:08,480 Speaker 2: and she killed it. And we want to make we 261 00:19:08,520 --> 00:19:15,879 Speaker 2: want to make her the head of a gigantic federal 262 00:19:16,040 --> 00:19:22,000 Speaker 2: police bureaucracy. It should be ninety eight to nothing. Send 263 00:19:22,080 --> 00:19:25,840 Speaker 2: us somebody new that's not going to happen. But with 264 00:19:25,960 --> 00:19:29,240 Speaker 2: regard to those people, in the scenario that you're laying out, 265 00:19:29,240 --> 00:19:31,600 Speaker 2: what you're really talking about is you should start with 266 00:19:31,680 --> 00:19:38,720 Speaker 2: a hard no of all of the Democrats, plus Murkowski 267 00:19:38,800 --> 00:19:44,440 Speaker 2: and Collins, if they are who everybody seems to think 268 00:19:44,480 --> 00:19:48,479 Speaker 2: they are, which isn't in a position of agreement with 269 00:19:48,600 --> 00:19:53,000 Speaker 2: the Democrats, but serious people, but of course they would be. 270 00:19:53,040 --> 00:19:53,080 Speaker 1: No. 271 00:19:54,200 --> 00:19:58,639 Speaker 2: Sullivan in Alaska is a Marine Corps colonel in his 272 00:19:58,760 --> 00:20:01,880 Speaker 2: previous life. Is U S Senator? Does he think it's 273 00:20:01,960 --> 00:20:06,080 Speaker 2: okay for Pete Hegseth, who's regardless of whether he raped 274 00:20:06,119 --> 00:20:08,040 Speaker 2: the woman or not that he's been accused of by 275 00:20:08,040 --> 00:20:12,840 Speaker 2: our of raping or right that the police reports make clear, 276 00:20:13,920 --> 00:20:18,760 Speaker 2: he's a dipshit of the highest variety. Right, he shouldn't. 277 00:20:18,840 --> 00:20:22,000 Speaker 2: He shouldn't. He's not eligible to be an officer in 278 00:20:22,040 --> 00:20:26,000 Speaker 2: the junior class at West Point with that type of conduct. 279 00:20:26,080 --> 00:20:32,720 Speaker 2: It's unbecoming. Right. So, honestly, Robert Kennedy, right, is interesting 280 00:20:33,080 --> 00:20:36,040 Speaker 2: right of all of these So for example, and I 281 00:20:36,160 --> 00:20:38,560 Speaker 2: this is the one. I can argue this all day. 282 00:20:39,440 --> 00:20:42,200 Speaker 2: But what I'm most interested about with regard to him 283 00:20:42,280 --> 00:20:47,360 Speaker 2: is is two things He's declared war on the sugar 284 00:20:47,520 --> 00:20:52,560 Speaker 2: soda industry, and they're gearing up like in Washington, like 285 00:20:52,840 --> 00:20:56,280 Speaker 2: right now, right if there was still functional journalism, like 286 00:20:56,440 --> 00:21:01,040 Speaker 2: every PR agency, right they are, they're going right now 287 00:21:01,440 --> 00:21:05,280 Speaker 2: in anticipation that rfks and he got in there right 288 00:21:05,359 --> 00:21:09,160 Speaker 2: for the soda war. The other thing, right, I find 289 00:21:09,200 --> 00:21:12,320 Speaker 2: fascinating is RFK said no more and he can do this. 290 00:21:12,880 --> 00:21:15,280 Speaker 2: He can get rid of it pretty easily, no more 291 00:21:15,320 --> 00:21:18,800 Speaker 2: pharmaceutical advertising. So it's just to me, it's just. 292 00:21:18,920 --> 00:21:23,080 Speaker 1: Fascinating, right send to play devil's advocate. What would be 293 00:21:23,200 --> 00:21:29,480 Speaker 1: wrong with defenestrating the pharmaceutical industry's ability. 294 00:21:29,359 --> 00:21:32,639 Speaker 2: For it completely for it? My question would be, do 295 00:21:32,680 --> 00:21:35,160 Speaker 2: you have to bring back polio and do it? Right? 296 00:21:35,280 --> 00:21:36,760 Speaker 2: I don't, right, I think. 297 00:21:37,119 --> 00:21:40,600 Speaker 1: I think the scary thing about RFK Junior is to 298 00:21:41,800 --> 00:21:47,440 Speaker 1: paint all pharmaceutical companies with a broad brush when they 299 00:21:47,520 --> 00:21:54,200 Speaker 1: have developed life saving, life changing drugs that are helping people. Yes, 300 00:21:54,280 --> 00:21:57,560 Speaker 1: I understand, we want to look at the core problems 301 00:21:57,640 --> 00:22:01,040 Speaker 1: that are making people sick, so we don'tcessarily always have 302 00:22:01,200 --> 00:22:04,320 Speaker 1: to rely on pharmaceuticals. But they've done a lot of 303 00:22:04,359 --> 00:22:10,240 Speaker 1: great things like vaccines and curing polio and the HPV vaccine, 304 00:22:10,359 --> 00:22:12,800 Speaker 1: et cetera, et cetera. And I think it's sort of 305 00:22:13,119 --> 00:22:16,400 Speaker 1: frightening to have someone who's the head of the Department 306 00:22:16,440 --> 00:22:21,520 Speaker 1: of Health and Human Services, which oversees the FDA, the CDC, 307 00:22:21,920 --> 00:22:26,879 Speaker 1: the NIH, Medicare and Medicaid services. Although I guess doctor 308 00:22:26,960 --> 00:22:30,479 Speaker 1: Oz is going to be doing that, But to have 309 00:22:30,600 --> 00:22:34,359 Speaker 1: someone who is so anti pharmaceutical doesn't sit well with 310 00:22:34,400 --> 00:22:34,920 Speaker 1: me either. 311 00:22:35,520 --> 00:22:42,040 Speaker 2: Well, I'm listening to you. My existence. My grandfather was 312 00:22:42,119 --> 00:22:47,880 Speaker 2: a twin, and he and his twin both lost their 313 00:22:47,960 --> 00:22:55,560 Speaker 2: first wives and children in childbirth. My father was his 314 00:22:55,680 --> 00:23:00,760 Speaker 2: son by a second marriage. My grandfather's brother, I was 315 00:23:00,800 --> 00:23:04,480 Speaker 2: a D Day paratrooper. When I met him, was in 316 00:23:04,520 --> 00:23:07,640 Speaker 2: a wheelchair, not from war rooms, but from polio, which 317 00:23:07,680 --> 00:23:13,320 Speaker 2: he got in the nineteen fifties. Right, suffering, suffering, Right, 318 00:23:13,359 --> 00:23:17,159 Speaker 2: that default position of humanity since the beginning of time, 319 00:23:17,560 --> 00:23:22,919 Speaker 2: alleviated by profound leaps forward in science. Now, for my 320 00:23:23,240 --> 00:23:29,840 Speaker 2: entire political career, right, let's call it. Between age twenty 321 00:23:29,920 --> 00:23:34,639 Speaker 2: five and forty, big Pharma was the target of the 322 00:23:34,680 --> 00:23:38,480 Speaker 2: Democratic Party, right politically, big form of this big pharma 323 00:23:38,600 --> 00:23:43,320 Speaker 2: screwing you, YadA, YadA, YadA. Now, these companies are powerful, 324 00:23:44,119 --> 00:23:48,560 Speaker 2: billion dollar organizations. I have skepticism of anything big and powerful, 325 00:23:48,840 --> 00:23:52,480 Speaker 2: as I know you do, so should your audience. And 326 00:23:52,560 --> 00:23:56,160 Speaker 2: one of the worst ideas of the last thirty years 327 00:23:56,720 --> 00:23:59,800 Speaker 2: was to put pharmaceutical advertising on television. It wasn't a 328 00:23:59,840 --> 00:24:03,720 Speaker 2: lot out before. That shouldn't be allowed. And I do 329 00:24:03,760 --> 00:24:06,639 Speaker 2: think that some of the fights that RFK has picked, 330 00:24:06,680 --> 00:24:11,000 Speaker 2: some of his enemies have real teeth, and to have 331 00:24:11,320 --> 00:24:15,159 Speaker 2: somebody who's literally nuts enough to make a full charge 332 00:24:15,200 --> 00:24:18,800 Speaker 2: at them in Washington, DC is something I haven't seen 333 00:24:18,880 --> 00:24:20,920 Speaker 2: over the course of my career. And I'm just as 334 00:24:20,920 --> 00:24:24,679 Speaker 2: a practitioner of campaign politics who spend a lot of 335 00:24:24,720 --> 00:24:27,280 Speaker 2: time in this space, in this world and has watched 336 00:24:27,320 --> 00:24:29,560 Speaker 2: how it's all covered in the media as a political 337 00:24:29,640 --> 00:24:32,840 Speaker 2: science experiment. I just I can't. I could, I could 338 00:24:32,880 --> 00:24:34,919 Speaker 2: set up a podcast and cover it. I mean, I 339 00:24:35,040 --> 00:24:37,280 Speaker 2: just it's endlessly fascinating to me. 340 00:24:37,960 --> 00:24:42,200 Speaker 1: So do you think some of his desires to tackle 341 00:24:42,280 --> 00:24:47,720 Speaker 1: these intractable problems like the power or the size of 342 00:24:47,800 --> 00:24:53,160 Speaker 1: these big pharmaceutical bohemoths is in some ways a good thing? 343 00:24:55,680 --> 00:25:00,720 Speaker 2: I think that I live in a ski town and 344 00:25:00,800 --> 00:25:06,960 Speaker 2: in a city, and most people where I live, generally speaking, 345 00:25:07,280 --> 00:25:10,560 Speaker 2: are in pretty good shape. If you go to Disney 346 00:25:10,600 --> 00:25:14,560 Speaker 2: World or to Disneyland, you're going to find a real 347 00:25:14,680 --> 00:25:20,720 Speaker 2: cross section of America. It's frightening, it's unhealthy. If you 348 00:25:20,880 --> 00:25:24,560 Speaker 2: brought somebody back who is a medical doctor, who let's 349 00:25:24,560 --> 00:25:27,960 Speaker 2: say passed away in nineteen sixty five, and you showed 350 00:25:28,000 --> 00:25:32,640 Speaker 2: them what the American citizen looks like in his or 351 00:25:32,680 --> 00:25:37,480 Speaker 2: her aggregate in twenty twenty four, what would their reaction 352 00:25:37,640 --> 00:25:42,679 Speaker 2: be if we had to fight, right, we had a 353 00:25:42,760 --> 00:25:47,920 Speaker 2: draft World War two. It's the physical training, level of 354 00:25:47,960 --> 00:25:54,240 Speaker 2: physical fitness in the country. It's deplorable. The country is sick. 355 00:25:56,200 --> 00:26:01,639 Speaker 2: And I think that that is a fair observation. A 356 00:26:01,680 --> 00:26:04,479 Speaker 2: lot of it has to do with the culture, with 357 00:26:04,520 --> 00:26:08,000 Speaker 2: the food people are. By the way, this isn't this 358 00:26:08,080 --> 00:26:12,680 Speaker 2: isn't a European problem. This is an American problem, right. 359 00:26:12,720 --> 00:26:16,720 Speaker 2: This is an American political problem. Right. This is a 360 00:26:16,760 --> 00:26:19,119 Speaker 2: lot of corruption, a lot of power, a lot of 361 00:26:19,200 --> 00:26:24,240 Speaker 2: in these in these industries, and so kind of crazy 362 00:26:24,359 --> 00:26:29,440 Speaker 2: person observes something correctly, Does that mean that that person's 363 00:26:29,600 --> 00:26:35,960 Speaker 2: observation qualifies them to fix the thing that they've observed correctly? 364 00:26:36,000 --> 00:26:39,680 Speaker 2: Of course not, you know, he he is there are 365 00:26:39,840 --> 00:26:43,840 Speaker 2: there are kind of a couple qualification bars in these jobs, 366 00:26:43,960 --> 00:26:50,120 Speaker 2: right that, and they matter most on a sliding scale. Character, honesty, judgment. 367 00:26:50,920 --> 00:26:54,840 Speaker 2: Tell me about the bear again in Central Park, about 368 00:26:54,880 --> 00:27:00,280 Speaker 2: the whale, about the revelations and the diary. Now, now 369 00:27:00,359 --> 00:27:05,880 Speaker 2: let's look at your your ability to process reality information. 370 00:27:07,280 --> 00:27:10,639 Speaker 2: I'm going to tell you something. Okay, what I'd like 371 00:27:10,720 --> 00:27:13,360 Speaker 2: from you is a response about what we should do. 372 00:27:14,760 --> 00:27:17,920 Speaker 2: There's no evidence to suggest that Robert Kennedy has any 373 00:27:17,960 --> 00:27:22,320 Speaker 2: capacity to know what to do in any given situation. 374 00:27:23,320 --> 00:27:28,040 Speaker 2: Can't process information. It's bad judgment and a rotten character, 375 00:27:28,560 --> 00:27:29,359 Speaker 2: and so he's unfit. 376 00:27:29,920 --> 00:27:32,280 Speaker 1: Well, I think, I think to your point, Robert F. 377 00:27:32,359 --> 00:27:35,399 Speaker 1: Kennedy Junior is a mixed bag. I think he says 378 00:27:35,920 --> 00:27:39,920 Speaker 1: some things that are true about chronic disease in this country, 379 00:27:40,480 --> 00:27:44,960 Speaker 1: about pesticides, about some of the things that so on 380 00:27:45,080 --> 00:27:48,760 Speaker 1: in this country that are keeping people unhealthy. On the 381 00:27:48,800 --> 00:27:52,040 Speaker 1: other hand, you know, there are things that he says 382 00:27:52,119 --> 00:27:56,359 Speaker 1: that are really scary about vaccines. He went to Samoa, 383 00:27:56,800 --> 00:27:58,880 Speaker 1: and I don't know if you've read that story. 384 00:27:58,760 --> 00:28:00,119 Speaker 2: Killed a lot of people, kill. 385 00:28:00,200 --> 00:28:04,480 Speaker 1: A lot of us died, and and there are other 386 00:28:04,560 --> 00:28:08,480 Speaker 1: positions he has taken that are really scary too, So. 387 00:28:08,880 --> 00:28:11,840 Speaker 2: He's got let me like I just like one he 388 00:28:11,960 --> 00:28:16,240 Speaker 2: will get people will die. People will die, right if 389 00:28:16,240 --> 00:28:19,440 Speaker 2: someone like him runs the public health services, right, And 390 00:28:19,960 --> 00:28:22,320 Speaker 2: it's like one of the things I find most curious 391 00:28:22,359 --> 00:28:25,040 Speaker 2: about this era. I say, this is like a Gen 392 00:28:25,240 --> 00:28:29,960 Speaker 2: X or fifty four. There's a lot more sensitivity today. 393 00:28:30,880 --> 00:28:34,320 Speaker 2: Some of it's good than there used to be, but 394 00:28:35,440 --> 00:28:40,520 Speaker 2: there's a real current in the culture that if you 395 00:28:41,160 --> 00:28:45,640 Speaker 2: talk to somebody about consequences, there's just like a real 396 00:28:45,760 --> 00:28:48,560 Speaker 2: resistance right to the concept. 397 00:28:48,960 --> 00:28:49,640 Speaker 1: What do you mean. 398 00:28:50,080 --> 00:28:53,680 Speaker 2: I was in a restaurant and in a waiter a 399 00:28:53,680 --> 00:28:57,040 Speaker 2: couple of weeks ago, spilled four drinks on me and 400 00:28:57,080 --> 00:28:59,080 Speaker 2: I didn't, but he was. He was a young guy. 401 00:28:59,280 --> 00:29:02,840 Speaker 2: It's like twenty three. And the first thing he says 402 00:29:02,880 --> 00:29:07,280 Speaker 2: to me, he goes, it was the tray. It was 403 00:29:07,320 --> 00:29:11,320 Speaker 2: the tray, and I just I grew up in a 404 00:29:11,400 --> 00:29:16,360 Speaker 2: place and in a time it wasn't the tray, it 405 00:29:16,400 --> 00:29:22,320 Speaker 2: was you, Right, I wasn't mad. Shit happens. But the 406 00:29:22,440 --> 00:29:27,080 Speaker 2: point is, in a world where nothing is ever anyone's fault, 407 00:29:27,120 --> 00:29:30,200 Speaker 2: it's not possible. I couldn't have spilled that drink on you. 408 00:29:30,320 --> 00:29:33,400 Speaker 2: It was the track. Did it, right, you know, it 409 00:29:33,440 --> 00:29:37,160 Speaker 2: was the tray in this world right in which our 410 00:29:37,280 --> 00:29:41,960 Speaker 2: politics takes place. Right, all of this is downrange from 411 00:29:42,040 --> 00:29:47,200 Speaker 2: culture incredibly. I mean, you're in the nine to eleven Museum, Katie, 412 00:29:47,960 --> 00:29:51,880 Speaker 2: that's you on the television. I remember watching it. That 413 00:29:51,960 --> 00:29:56,760 Speaker 2: was the most horrible day of my adult life, watching horror, 414 00:29:56,840 --> 00:29:59,880 Speaker 2: American horror on the screen. And it seems to me 415 00:30:00,760 --> 00:30:09,280 Speaker 2: quarter century later, just total amnesia, right, real numbness about 416 00:30:09,320 --> 00:30:11,959 Speaker 2: bad things that could happen. So, you know, we used 417 00:30:12,000 --> 00:30:14,720 Speaker 2: to there used to be movies right about what would 418 00:30:14,760 --> 00:30:17,479 Speaker 2: happen if there were two astronauts like stranded in space. 419 00:30:18,200 --> 00:30:20,280 Speaker 2: That's happening right now. No, just as a fuck right 420 00:30:20,320 --> 00:30:24,480 Speaker 2: at all? Right, right, except for like at NASA, And 421 00:30:24,520 --> 00:30:28,000 Speaker 2: so what I'm saying is with all of these people 422 00:30:29,240 --> 00:30:34,600 Speaker 2: is terrible, terrible things will happen. I know it will happen. 423 00:30:34,960 --> 00:30:39,040 Speaker 2: It's not a debate. If you take a guy who 424 00:30:39,120 --> 00:30:43,120 Speaker 2: doesn't believe in science and vaccines and medicine with a 425 00:30:43,200 --> 00:30:45,880 Speaker 2: track record of doing what he did in Samoa, of 426 00:30:45,880 --> 00:30:50,200 Speaker 2: course people are gonna die. Right if you politicize the 427 00:30:50,280 --> 00:30:55,160 Speaker 2: American military, Trump is at hour one right, all transgender 428 00:30:55,200 --> 00:30:58,880 Speaker 2: personnel or out the military. They'll be disqualified for military service. 429 00:30:59,080 --> 00:31:01,960 Speaker 2: They're gonna be medically discharged, all of them. Fifteen thousand. 430 00:31:02,560 --> 00:31:07,480 Speaker 2: He's going to fire the Joint Staff, right the chiefs, 431 00:31:07,480 --> 00:31:11,960 Speaker 2: the Chief of Naval Operations, Linda Franchetti, Admiral Fanchetti, first 432 00:31:11,960 --> 00:31:14,080 Speaker 2: woman to be Chief of Naval Operations, she's going to 433 00:31:14,080 --> 00:31:16,720 Speaker 2: be out. Chairman of the Joint Chiefs of Staff, who 434 00:31:16,840 --> 00:31:20,800 Speaker 2: was a confidant and friend of General Millet, he's going 435 00:31:20,880 --> 00:31:24,680 Speaker 2: to be out. Mark Wayne Mullin just put a hold 436 00:31:24,720 --> 00:31:29,000 Speaker 2: on promotion of the three star officer who's being promoted 437 00:31:29,000 --> 00:31:31,840 Speaker 2: to four star rank to take over US forces in Europe. 438 00:31:32,000 --> 00:31:35,160 Speaker 2: He's going to be out of the military. So you're 439 00:31:35,200 --> 00:31:38,800 Speaker 2: going to see a culling of the senior leadership of 440 00:31:38,840 --> 00:31:43,360 Speaker 2: the military, unlike anything that the country's seen since nineteen 441 00:31:43,600 --> 00:31:47,000 Speaker 2: thirty seven, thirty eight, thirty nine, when Marshall got the 442 00:31:47,040 --> 00:31:50,280 Speaker 2: military ready to fight the Second World War, and guys 443 00:31:50,320 --> 00:32:05,480 Speaker 2: like Eisenhower went from lieutenant colonel to Brevett major generals overnight. 444 00:32:13,520 --> 00:32:17,720 Speaker 1: I also understand that there may be a mission to 445 00:32:18,320 --> 00:32:22,440 Speaker 1: court martial some of the high ranking military official Steve 446 00:32:22,560 --> 00:32:26,200 Speaker 1: who spoke ill of Donald Trump during the campaign of 447 00:32:26,240 --> 00:32:30,360 Speaker 1: course I'm talking about John Kelly and Mark Milly. General 448 00:32:30,440 --> 00:32:34,240 Speaker 1: Mattis did not. He did write a resignation letter, and 449 00:32:34,320 --> 00:32:37,719 Speaker 1: I think sort of you could read between the lines 450 00:32:37,760 --> 00:32:41,480 Speaker 1: what he was saying. But could he actually court martial 451 00:32:41,840 --> 00:32:44,400 Speaker 1: some of these individuals who spoke out against him. 452 00:32:44,840 --> 00:32:49,360 Speaker 2: Yes, he could recall them to active service and convene 453 00:32:49,400 --> 00:32:53,080 Speaker 2: a court martial under a uniform Code of Military Justice, 454 00:32:53,120 --> 00:32:57,040 Speaker 2: which is the military's legal system. That is a prosecution, 455 00:32:57,240 --> 00:33:01,280 Speaker 2: that is a kangaroo court prosecution all sorts of problems, 456 00:33:01,280 --> 00:33:06,440 Speaker 2: including the command influence or undue influence of the commander 457 00:33:06,560 --> 00:33:10,960 Speaker 2: in chief in the court martial. And of course that 458 00:33:11,160 --> 00:33:17,280 Speaker 2: court martial would be tried by a jury of Millie's peers, 459 00:33:18,120 --> 00:33:22,000 Speaker 2: who of course would not convict him, and it would 460 00:33:22,040 --> 00:33:25,720 Speaker 2: be found not guilty. Right, So that's an example. Could 461 00:33:25,720 --> 00:33:32,360 Speaker 2: Trump do it? Yeah? Is there a release valve? There is. 462 00:33:33,080 --> 00:33:35,440 Speaker 2: We don't live in the Third Reich. We live in America. 463 00:33:35,600 --> 00:33:39,800 Speaker 2: So Millie would go have his court martial. I think 464 00:33:39,880 --> 00:33:43,280 Speaker 2: Jackie Robinson was court martialed, right, It will be as 465 00:33:43,360 --> 00:33:46,360 Speaker 2: unjust as that a lot of people have faced on 466 00:33:46,560 --> 00:33:49,680 Speaker 2: just court martial in the history of the military for 467 00:33:49,800 --> 00:33:55,520 Speaker 2: racial reasons. A lot of them. The military justice system, though, 468 00:33:55,680 --> 00:33:59,080 Speaker 2: like the American justice system, which it's much a part of, 469 00:33:59,560 --> 00:34:03,920 Speaker 2: is resilton. And so you don't go to get Milly 470 00:34:04,040 --> 00:34:08,600 Speaker 2: up against the wall. Millie's going to be acquitted, and 471 00:34:08,719 --> 00:34:14,400 Speaker 2: with that acquittal will be a rebuke morally of the 472 00:34:14,440 --> 00:34:21,320 Speaker 2: outrageousness of the action. And so that's how it works. 473 00:34:21,880 --> 00:34:26,000 Speaker 1: In that case. You're describing Steve guardrails that exist, but 474 00:34:26,719 --> 00:34:31,400 Speaker 1: there are few and far between guardrails currently in place 475 00:34:32,120 --> 00:34:37,120 Speaker 1: with a Trump presidency and a Senate controlled by Republicans, 476 00:34:37,120 --> 00:34:41,480 Speaker 1: a House controlled by Republicans, and of course a Justice 477 00:34:41,520 --> 00:34:46,360 Speaker 1: Department controlled by Republicans. So what are your biggest fears 478 00:34:46,680 --> 00:34:50,200 Speaker 1: as you look toward these next four years? 479 00:34:50,680 --> 00:34:54,399 Speaker 2: I guess I have a slight dissent, and I think 480 00:34:54,440 --> 00:34:59,520 Speaker 2: it's a really important in distinction, which is this, The 481 00:34:59,600 --> 00:35:03,560 Speaker 2: guard are exactly the same as they've ever been. They're 482 00:35:03,600 --> 00:35:09,319 Speaker 2: exactly the same. Nothing has changed. Constitutions, the constitution, the 483 00:35:09,400 --> 00:35:13,319 Speaker 2: votes are the votes right, All the facts of what's right, 484 00:35:13,440 --> 00:35:17,160 Speaker 2: what's wrong, what's decent, what's not, what's crazy, what's not, 485 00:35:17,280 --> 00:35:26,919 Speaker 2: nothing has changed. What's changed is the incentives and maybe 486 00:35:27,480 --> 00:35:32,960 Speaker 2: the tolerance that a Bill Haggerty from Tennessee would go 487 00:35:33,000 --> 00:35:35,800 Speaker 2: out and say, we don't for the most sensitive jobs 488 00:35:35,840 --> 00:35:39,160 Speaker 2: of the US government. I don't care whatsoever who these 489 00:35:39,200 --> 00:35:41,560 Speaker 2: people are, what they'll do, who they're on the payroll, 490 00:35:41,600 --> 00:35:44,319 Speaker 2: if they're compromised, if they're not, don't give a shit 491 00:35:44,480 --> 00:35:50,600 Speaker 2: at all. I trust Trump, And so if there are 492 00:35:50,840 --> 00:35:53,640 Speaker 2: enough of those people, then Trump will get to do 493 00:35:54,560 --> 00:36:01,960 Speaker 2: whatever he wants. Now, the recess appointment is a bigger deal, right, 494 00:36:02,000 --> 00:36:08,440 Speaker 2: because that's a systemic assault. If you take all of 495 00:36:08,480 --> 00:36:13,239 Speaker 2: these unqualified people with the acquiescence of the Senate, who 496 00:36:13,320 --> 00:36:18,160 Speaker 2: seeks to evade their complete lack of fitness by evading 497 00:36:18,239 --> 00:36:24,880 Speaker 2: their constitutional role, by giving away their coequal status in 498 00:36:24,920 --> 00:36:30,400 Speaker 2: the American government with an acting capitulation, well, I would argue, 499 00:36:30,440 --> 00:36:34,200 Speaker 2: like I said earlier, the republic has fallen, right, And 500 00:36:34,239 --> 00:36:39,720 Speaker 2: it's not about Republicans and checks and bounces about whether 501 00:36:41,160 --> 00:36:45,359 Speaker 2: ten to fifteen people. We know who those people are, right, 502 00:36:45,400 --> 00:36:51,960 Speaker 2: we know their names. Will they process somebody right on 503 00:36:52,160 --> 00:36:57,360 Speaker 2: national television that's clearly unfit? Right? I mean these people 504 00:36:57,360 --> 00:37:00,680 Speaker 2: were flying a commercial jetliner. You got to leave your 505 00:37:00,760 --> 00:37:06,279 Speaker 2: kid with him, right, whatever circumstance, analogy that works for you, Right, 506 00:37:06,880 --> 00:37:11,640 Speaker 2: I think most people would be like those people in 507 00:37:11,719 --> 00:37:16,360 Speaker 2: these positions. The great question in our politics is just, 508 00:37:16,800 --> 00:37:18,960 Speaker 2: really you're going to say yes to that? 509 00:37:19,520 --> 00:37:23,799 Speaker 1: Are you talking about Republican senators like Susan Collins and 510 00:37:24,000 --> 00:37:25,160 Speaker 1: Lisa Murkowski? 511 00:37:25,239 --> 00:37:27,440 Speaker 2: And absolutely? Of course? 512 00:37:27,640 --> 00:37:30,000 Speaker 1: Of course who else comes to mind, Steve. 513 00:37:30,400 --> 00:37:36,320 Speaker 2: Sullivan in Alaska. There's been a couple of them, Mitch McConnell. 514 00:37:36,800 --> 00:37:42,120 Speaker 2: Does Mitch McConnell believe that Pete Hegsa is fit to 515 00:37:42,200 --> 00:37:45,399 Speaker 2: be the Secretary of Defense? I don't think he has 516 00:37:45,440 --> 00:37:49,080 Speaker 2: any core right, but I don't know what he's going 517 00:37:49,160 --> 00:37:49,560 Speaker 2: to do. 518 00:37:50,040 --> 00:37:52,880 Speaker 1: And he has said he felt liberated not having to 519 00:37:52,920 --> 00:37:54,160 Speaker 1: be the majority leader. 520 00:37:55,400 --> 00:37:59,000 Speaker 2: And there's nothing that makes me crazier than the sense 521 00:37:59,560 --> 00:38:03,359 Speaker 2: that I would the Senate majority leader. But now I'm liberated. 522 00:38:03,960 --> 00:38:04,040 Speaker 1: Now. 523 00:38:04,840 --> 00:38:08,880 Speaker 2: If you have power, you can exercise it how you wish, 524 00:38:08,920 --> 00:38:11,279 Speaker 2: when you wish, for whatever cause you wish. And that's 525 00:38:11,320 --> 00:38:15,399 Speaker 2: why people like John McCain when he was at his best. 526 00:38:15,960 --> 00:38:18,719 Speaker 2: The issue here is right, it's not there's no there's 527 00:38:18,719 --> 00:38:22,160 Speaker 2: nothing to discover. There's new bad stuff that will come out, 528 00:38:22,239 --> 00:38:25,640 Speaker 2: for sure, because that's who these people are, but there's 529 00:38:25,719 --> 00:38:31,560 Speaker 2: nothing right that will make them more wet, more saturated. 530 00:38:32,040 --> 00:38:35,200 Speaker 2: By unfitness than they already are. So the question is, 531 00:38:35,200 --> 00:38:39,319 Speaker 2: is really like Susan Collins right? And three more? Are 532 00:38:39,320 --> 00:38:44,800 Speaker 2: you kidding me? Her him? Christine? 533 00:38:44,840 --> 00:38:49,320 Speaker 1: No, come on, I want to ask you about Pam 534 00:38:49,400 --> 00:38:53,480 Speaker 1: BONDI what reasons do you think she should not be confirmed? 535 00:38:54,120 --> 00:39:01,360 Speaker 2: Because in twenty twenty three she said that the prosecutors 536 00:39:02,280 --> 00:39:08,600 Speaker 2: and the Justice Department officials who prosecuted Trump should themselves 537 00:39:08,680 --> 00:39:15,839 Speaker 2: be prosecuted because for revenge. We live in a nation 538 00:39:16,480 --> 00:39:19,839 Speaker 2: where the rule of law is supreme. Donald Trump is 539 00:39:19,880 --> 00:39:25,560 Speaker 2: prosecuted because he broke the law and he was found guilty. 540 00:39:26,040 --> 00:39:31,320 Speaker 2: And then the Supreme Court held that the president has immunity, which, 541 00:39:31,360 --> 00:39:33,799 Speaker 2: though is a new and novel concept and all the 542 00:39:33,800 --> 00:39:39,399 Speaker 2: broad scope of American jurisprudence and history, the Court does 543 00:39:39,440 --> 00:39:42,600 Speaker 2: in fact have the power to say so and to 544 00:39:42,680 --> 00:39:45,239 Speaker 2: make it so, and now it is so. And so 545 00:39:45,320 --> 00:39:51,000 Speaker 2: those charges have been dismissed because of the complexity, the 546 00:39:51,120 --> 00:39:59,080 Speaker 2: layerings of the American justice system that always offer another 547 00:39:59,320 --> 00:40:05,839 Speaker 2: opportunity unity for another look on a question of law. 548 00:40:06,400 --> 00:40:09,799 Speaker 2: So I would be, despite not being someone who would 549 00:40:09,800 --> 00:40:12,440 Speaker 2: ever pick him, if I was in the Senate and 550 00:40:12,520 --> 00:40:15,880 Speaker 2: I had a vote, I would be like yes to 551 00:40:16,040 --> 00:40:20,439 Speaker 2: Marco Rubio, I would be no to all of these 552 00:40:20,480 --> 00:40:24,920 Speaker 2: other people, because there's no case to be made that 553 00:40:25,040 --> 00:40:30,600 Speaker 2: these people can run these agencies, do these jobs, and 554 00:40:30,640 --> 00:40:34,880 Speaker 2: these are life and death jobs. They're ludicrous appointments. 555 00:40:35,200 --> 00:40:37,960 Speaker 1: What I think is interesting is so many of these 556 00:40:38,040 --> 00:40:43,200 Speaker 1: people have absolutely no expertise in the agencies they are 557 00:40:43,239 --> 00:40:44,720 Speaker 1: being tasked to run. 558 00:40:45,920 --> 00:40:52,640 Speaker 2: There's no difference, none, between making Pete Hegseth the Secretary 559 00:40:52,680 --> 00:40:57,919 Speaker 2: of Defense and having an Apprentice episode and making Meat 560 00:40:57,960 --> 00:41:02,360 Speaker 2: Love or Little John or both of them together with 561 00:41:02,480 --> 00:41:08,359 Speaker 2: Gary Busey the Secretary of Defense. It's the same thing. 562 00:41:09,000 --> 00:41:12,759 Speaker 2: When Donald Trump was on the Apprentice set, he assembled 563 00:41:12,800 --> 00:41:18,719 Speaker 2: a menagerie of characters that coagulated there same thing. And 564 00:41:18,760 --> 00:41:25,720 Speaker 2: those are the people that are his casting call him her, him, 565 00:41:26,120 --> 00:41:30,640 Speaker 2: and these people right have been put forward. There are 566 00:41:30,800 --> 00:41:36,319 Speaker 2: other people in the country, we call them senators. Their 567 00:41:36,440 --> 00:41:43,400 Speaker 2: job is to objectively look at those people, sayon and 568 00:41:43,480 --> 00:41:48,160 Speaker 2: the diplomatic way to do this, and Republicans will have 569 00:41:48,280 --> 00:41:52,080 Speaker 2: to do it this way, and they should be given 570 00:41:52,200 --> 00:41:58,280 Speaker 2: the space to do this by their democratic colleagues because 571 00:41:58,280 --> 00:42:02,880 Speaker 2: it's good for the country. Trump can never be wrong. 572 00:42:04,440 --> 00:42:05,520 Speaker 2: We've left that world. 573 00:42:05,840 --> 00:42:08,960 Speaker 1: What will happen to some of these senators, Steve, if 574 00:42:08,960 --> 00:42:11,960 Speaker 1: they vote not to confirm some of these people. 575 00:42:12,600 --> 00:42:16,400 Speaker 2: So what these senators their back door, of their escape 576 00:42:16,400 --> 00:42:19,880 Speaker 2: patch to be able to go out and say again, 577 00:42:20,800 --> 00:42:23,680 Speaker 2: because in this world Trump can never be wrong, is 578 00:42:23,719 --> 00:42:29,799 Speaker 2: that Trump didn't know Trump was ill served. Trump is 579 00:42:29,880 --> 00:42:35,120 Speaker 2: christ Like, he makes no mistakes ever. But there are 580 00:42:35,200 --> 00:42:39,759 Speaker 2: judases around Christ, and they are judases around Trump. And 581 00:42:39,800 --> 00:42:42,920 Speaker 2: it will be the Judas who is blamed, never Trump, 582 00:42:43,280 --> 00:42:47,120 Speaker 2: by a Republican senator, for sending Trump into a position 583 00:42:47,160 --> 00:42:51,200 Speaker 2: where Trump was humiliated. It isn't that Donald Trump knew 584 00:42:51,239 --> 00:42:55,000 Speaker 2: who mack Gates was. It was that Donald Trump just 585 00:42:55,040 --> 00:42:58,239 Speaker 2: found out who mack Gates was because Donald Trump was 586 00:42:58,280 --> 00:43:01,440 Speaker 2: badly served. Because of course, Donald Trump is an Ajenoux. 587 00:43:01,719 --> 00:43:06,200 Speaker 2: How could he have known. So it's important to appreciate 588 00:43:06,320 --> 00:43:13,279 Speaker 2: the performative aspects of all of this stuff. Right, if 589 00:43:13,320 --> 00:43:19,479 Speaker 2: the federal government shrank by some gigantic percentage and amount, right, 590 00:43:19,520 --> 00:43:22,760 Speaker 2: they're still going to be a need to deliver food 591 00:43:22,880 --> 00:43:27,440 Speaker 2: services to poor children four years from now. What's going 592 00:43:27,520 --> 00:43:31,759 Speaker 2: to be left behind is the nothingness that gives democrats 593 00:43:31,760 --> 00:43:36,400 Speaker 2: and progressives their golden age and golden opportunity because for 594 00:43:36,440 --> 00:43:38,799 Speaker 2: the first time in a long time, they get to 595 00:43:38,920 --> 00:43:43,640 Speaker 2: imagine something new, something different, how to deliver twenty first 596 00:43:43,680 --> 00:43:47,640 Speaker 2: century services to people who need it without having to 597 00:43:47,719 --> 00:43:51,279 Speaker 2: defend the broken institutions made in the nineteen fifties in 598 00:43:51,400 --> 00:43:54,239 Speaker 2: nineteen sixties that are going to be gone right, going 599 00:43:54,280 --> 00:43:56,759 Speaker 2: to be gone right by the time we get to 600 00:43:56,800 --> 00:43:58,520 Speaker 2: the end of the Trump presidency. But they're not going 601 00:43:58,600 --> 00:44:02,160 Speaker 2: to be gone by Elon Mosker or Ramaswami. 602 00:44:02,840 --> 00:44:06,320 Speaker 1: I'm taking away from this conversation Steve that you're pretty 603 00:44:06,360 --> 00:44:09,640 Speaker 1: stoked about this incoming crew of folks. 604 00:44:10,200 --> 00:44:14,520 Speaker 2: I think that was a joke, right, I think, you know, 605 00:44:14,600 --> 00:44:17,160 Speaker 2: John Lewis talked about this, right, you know, I don't 606 00:44:17,239 --> 00:44:20,719 Speaker 2: you know. My life overlapped with his. You know, I 607 00:44:20,880 --> 00:44:23,920 Speaker 2: went to Auschwitz with lv z L on the sixtieth 608 00:44:24,000 --> 00:44:28,040 Speaker 2: anniversary of its liberation when I worked in the White House. 609 00:44:28,600 --> 00:44:31,200 Speaker 2: And this is the time that I was born into. 610 00:44:32,080 --> 00:44:35,239 Speaker 2: I was born in nineteen seventy. I was ten years 611 00:44:35,280 --> 00:44:38,919 Speaker 2: old when Ronald Reagan became president. It's a long time ago. Now. 612 00:44:39,960 --> 00:44:44,560 Speaker 2: I was thirty when the millennia turned and Bill Clinton 613 00:44:44,640 --> 00:44:48,000 Speaker 2: was president. We were the most powerful nation in the 614 00:44:48,080 --> 00:44:51,960 Speaker 2: history of the world pre eminent in all things, to 615 00:44:52,120 --> 00:44:54,520 Speaker 2: such a degree that people were saying, we're at the 616 00:44:54,640 --> 00:44:59,480 Speaker 2: end of history. I've watched a lot happen over the 617 00:44:59,560 --> 00:45:02,360 Speaker 2: last years, and all I can say in this moment 618 00:45:02,400 --> 00:45:06,439 Speaker 2: for any American, our country's going to outlive all of us. 619 00:45:07,560 --> 00:45:11,520 Speaker 2: We'll never see the whole. We're never gonna get to 620 00:45:11,560 --> 00:45:16,640 Speaker 2: see the ending. We just won't, right. And I think 621 00:45:16,640 --> 00:45:22,239 Speaker 2: this is like so deeply important to appreciate in the 622 00:45:22,280 --> 00:45:28,600 Speaker 2: context of there are things bigger than us, and as 623 00:45:28,600 --> 00:45:32,279 Speaker 2: an American, there is nothing bigger than us than the 624 00:45:32,400 --> 00:45:37,080 Speaker 2: United States. And in our story, this chapter of it, 625 00:45:37,800 --> 00:45:41,319 Speaker 2: I think it's exciting to be part of it and 626 00:45:41,360 --> 00:45:45,240 Speaker 2: to oppose something that I think is deeply terrible, because 627 00:45:45,360 --> 00:45:51,160 Speaker 2: on the other side of it is something a lot better. 628 00:45:52,080 --> 00:45:59,799 Speaker 2: That's the greatness of the country. Lincoln was preceded by 629 00:45:59,840 --> 00:46:05,160 Speaker 2: the worst president in American history until Trump became president. 630 00:46:06,880 --> 00:46:12,040 Speaker 2: And so I think Trump is going to be a disaster, disaster, 631 00:46:13,160 --> 00:46:19,600 Speaker 2: but the country will endure, damage will be done, Terrible 632 00:46:19,680 --> 00:46:27,640 Speaker 2: consequences might happen, but one of the consequences that will 633 00:46:27,680 --> 00:46:35,120 Speaker 2: come from the disaster ahead is greatness that will emerge 634 00:46:35,120 --> 00:46:39,480 Speaker 2: from it. A greatness that didn't exist in the moment 635 00:46:41,239 --> 00:46:47,680 Speaker 2: when what's to come could have been prevented. Destiny did 636 00:46:47,719 --> 00:46:52,759 Speaker 2: not shape the events at hand like that. So I 637 00:46:52,800 --> 00:46:57,840 Speaker 2: think in this moment, opposing what is about to come 638 00:46:58,440 --> 00:47:02,799 Speaker 2: is a deep import and I'm excited to have a 639 00:47:02,840 --> 00:47:09,640 Speaker 2: small voice in that effort because for me, some people 640 00:47:09,680 --> 00:47:17,480 Speaker 2: are great at sports and some people love music and painting. 641 00:47:17,600 --> 00:47:21,200 Speaker 2: This is what I care about. There's nothing more important 642 00:47:21,239 --> 00:47:27,759 Speaker 2: to me outside of my family than the country. And 643 00:47:27,800 --> 00:47:31,360 Speaker 2: what that's come to mean to me over recent years 644 00:47:31,960 --> 00:47:34,880 Speaker 2: is not the partisan victory and the excitement of winning 645 00:47:34,920 --> 00:47:37,880 Speaker 2: a campaign when I was a young man, but about 646 00:47:37,880 --> 00:47:41,920 Speaker 2: the opportunities that everybody ought to have in a country. 647 00:47:41,960 --> 00:47:44,520 Speaker 2: That ought to mean when it comes to freedom, the 648 00:47:44,520 --> 00:47:49,080 Speaker 2: same thing for everybody, and that is very much on 649 00:47:49,239 --> 00:47:53,520 Speaker 2: the table right now, that question. And I could not 650 00:47:54,440 --> 00:47:58,000 Speaker 2: think of a better thing to do if I got 651 00:47:58,040 --> 00:48:03,799 Speaker 2: a day left, a week left, or thirty five years left, 652 00:48:04,160 --> 00:48:10,200 Speaker 2: than to talk about that right now, because what's been 653 00:48:10,239 --> 00:48:15,440 Speaker 2: handed down to us to preserve it makes stronger for 654 00:48:16,080 --> 00:48:20,920 Speaker 2: the next generation is of profound importance. There's three hundred 655 00:48:20,920 --> 00:48:24,680 Speaker 2: and forty million Americans alive, half of us who have 656 00:48:24,800 --> 00:48:28,600 Speaker 2: ever lived or alive right now, because there's only been 657 00:48:28,640 --> 00:48:31,719 Speaker 2: seven hundred million people in all the history of the 658 00:48:31,760 --> 00:48:36,440 Speaker 2: world since July fourth, seventeen seventy six who've been able 659 00:48:36,480 --> 00:48:40,080 Speaker 2: to say these words that mean more to me and 660 00:48:40,120 --> 00:48:43,120 Speaker 2: I think mean more to a lot of people in 661 00:48:43,200 --> 00:48:48,600 Speaker 2: the country than any other association in their life. And 662 00:48:48,640 --> 00:48:53,719 Speaker 2: it's this I am an American. 663 00:48:54,600 --> 00:48:58,239 Speaker 1: Steve Schmidt, thank you as always for talking with me. 664 00:48:58,520 --> 00:49:01,760 Speaker 1: I always appreciate our conversations. Thank you, Steve. 665 00:49:02,120 --> 00:49:04,560 Speaker 2: Great to be with you, always, always great to see you. 666 00:49:13,040 --> 00:49:16,239 Speaker 1: Thanks for listening everyone. If you have a question for me, 667 00:49:16,640 --> 00:49:19,120 Speaker 1: a subject you want us to cover, or you want 668 00:49:19,160 --> 00:49:22,520 Speaker 1: to share your thoughts about how you navigate this crazy world, 669 00:49:22,880 --> 00:49:26,080 Speaker 1: reach out send me a DM on Instagram. I would 670 00:49:26,160 --> 00:49:29,200 Speaker 1: love to hear from you. Next Question is a production 671 00:49:29,320 --> 00:49:33,800 Speaker 1: of iHeartMedia and Katie Couric Media. The executive producers are Me, 672 00:49:34,120 --> 00:49:38,800 Speaker 1: Katie Kuric, and Courtney Ltz. Our supervising producer is Ryan Martz, 673 00:49:39,280 --> 00:49:44,120 Speaker 1: and our producers are Adriana Fazzio and Meredith Barnes. Julian 674 00:49:44,200 --> 00:49:49,320 Speaker 1: Weller composed our theme music. For more information about today's episode, 675 00:49:49,480 --> 00:49:51,880 Speaker 1: or to sign up for my newsletter wake Up Call, 676 00:49:52,320 --> 00:49:55,240 Speaker 1: go to the description in the podcast app, or visit 677 00:49:55,320 --> 00:49:58,520 Speaker 1: us at Katiecuric dot com. You can also find me 678 00:49:58,560 --> 00:50:02,319 Speaker 1: on Instagram and all my social media channels. For more 679 00:50:02,360 --> 00:50:07,680 Speaker 1: podcasts from iHeartRadio, visit the iHeartRadio app, Apple Podcasts, or 680 00:50:07,719 --> 00:50:09,800 Speaker 1: wherever you listen to your favorite shows.