1
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Speaker 1: I asked it to get his ID and they said yes,

2
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Speaker 1: he was still sitting in his car. I still had

3
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Speaker 1: my composite sketch and I pulled it out. He had

4
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Speaker 1: these little glasses on and I drew the glasses and

5
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Speaker 1: I held it up and I said, anybody recognized this guy?

6
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Speaker 1: And it was Wayne Williams to the tee, I mean

7
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Speaker 1: it just it was just Wayne. Ironically, we caught Wayne

8
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Speaker 1: Williams at two fifty five am on the last day

9
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Speaker 1: of the surveillance. When we got there, we were immediately

10
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Speaker 1: briefed that this guy was seen on the bridge and

11
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Speaker 1: something hit the water. It hadn't been recovered. Of course,

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Speaker 1: nobody could get in that water because a it's two

13
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Speaker 1: fifty five am and the water but current was just outrageous.

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Speaker 1: Somebody would have drowned and wouldn't have stood a good

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Speaker 1: chance of recovering anything.

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Speaker 2: Anyway, I don't think up to him and.

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Speaker 1: Identified myself as a special agent with the FBI, and

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Speaker 1: I asked him immediately if he knew why he was

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Speaker 1: being pulled over, and he said, yes, it's probably because

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Speaker 1: about those those kids that are missing, which kind of

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Speaker 1: surprised me.

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Speaker 2: That was an unusual answer.

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Speaker 3: I thought that was his answer.

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Speaker 1: Well it was, you know, it's a paraphrase of it.

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Speaker 1: That wasn't his verbatim answer, but yeah, it was something

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Speaker 1: like that. And the next words out of his mouth

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Speaker 1: was he says, you know, he said, Channel five is

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Speaker 1: really covering this very well, but Channel eleven I don't

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Speaker 1: think covers it enough. So that kind of surprised me.

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Speaker 1: I remember that jumped out at me as well.

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Speaker 3: And Atlanta, another bonder was discovered today, but twenty third.

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Speaker 4: At the Police Task Force headquarters, there are twenty seven

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Speaker 4: faces on the wall, twenty six murdered, one missing.

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Speaker 2: We do not know the personilar persons that are responsible.

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Speaker 5: Therefore, we do not have the money from Tenderfoot TV

36
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Speaker 5: in house to forks in Atlanta.

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Speaker 6: Like eleven other recent victims in Atlanta, rogers are currently

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Speaker 6: was asphixiator.

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Speaker 4: Atlanta is unlikely to catch the killer unless he keeps

40
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Speaker 4: on killing.

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Speaker 3: This is Atlanta monster.

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Speaker 1: I asked him if I could talk to him in

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Speaker 1: my car. I told him we needed to get out

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Speaker 1: of the traffic because the tractor trailers were rolling by

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Speaker 1: and you couldn't hear. Plus, I wanted to interview him.

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Speaker 1: I wanted to get him in my car and interview him.

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Speaker 1: He agreed, real mediable, very friendly guy.

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Speaker 2: I mean he was he nervous. No, no, he wasn't nervous.

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Speaker 1: It was the first impression of well, I didn't have

50
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Speaker 1: one other than me telling you what he just kind

51
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Speaker 1: of surprised me with the media comment and acknowledging that

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Speaker 1: it was about the kids. I really didn't have much

53
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Speaker 1: of an impression.

54
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Speaker 2: I was wanting to.

55
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Speaker 1: Know more about what his story was, and eventually I

56
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Speaker 1: got it. He gets in the car with me, and

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Speaker 1: the first thing I asked him to do, and he

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Speaker 1: surprised me again. I said, can we have consent to

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Speaker 1: search your vehicle? And he said sure.

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Speaker 2: So we had.

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Speaker 1: A consent for him that I had him sign, and

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Speaker 1: he signed it and let us search his vehicle. Now,

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Speaker 1: as I had walked by his vehicle, I stuck my

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Speaker 1: head in the window and looked around. There was a

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Speaker 1: bag of clothes laying on the floor, and there was

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Speaker 1: a pair of gloves laying on the seat. And what

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Speaker 1: really struck me though, was is that there was a

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Speaker 1: nylon cord kind of like a ski rope. It was

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Speaker 1: about twenty four inches long and it was knotted on

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Speaker 1: each end. That rope really interested me, so I started

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Speaker 1: interviewing him and ask him what he was out this

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Speaker 1: late at night, because, like I said, it was two

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Speaker 1: fifty five am when he got in my car. He

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Speaker 1: said that he was a talent scout and that he

75
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Speaker 1: had an eight o'clock appointment I think eight am the

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Speaker 1: next morning, but he was out trying to find their

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Speaker 1: address so that he wouldn't know where it is the

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Speaker 1: next morning and not be late. That just didn't have

79
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Speaker 1: an air of truthfulness to it. Nobody goes out at

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Speaker 1: two o'clock or three o'clock in the morning to find

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Speaker 1: an address to make sure they're not late at eight o'clock.

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Speaker 1: I found out he was an only child. He lived

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Speaker 1: with his parents, his mom and dad. His dad was

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Speaker 1: a freelance photographer and his mother had been a retired teacher.

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Speaker 1: They were quite elderly that he had come along pretty

86
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Speaker 1: late in life. He was a pretty intelligent guy too.

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Speaker 1: He had a very high IQ. Word had it that

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Speaker 1: he had built an AMFM radio station in his backyard

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Speaker 1: when he was about fourteen. In the FCC. It had

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Speaker 1: made him tear it down. I asked the guys, I said,

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Speaker 1: search of his car over and they said yes, and

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Speaker 1: I said okay. So I said, if anybody any reason

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Speaker 1: for him to stay here any longer, and they said no,

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Speaker 1: So we let him go. There was some things there

95
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Speaker 1: that happened, that transpired that.

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Speaker 2: That shouldn't have happened.

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Speaker 1: The FBI has always been and remains an institution that

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Speaker 1: is very conscious of not falsely arresting people. They've made

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Speaker 1: mistakes in the past, everybody does. It's a judgment call.

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Speaker 1: But we did not that night want to violate any

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Speaker 1: of his civil liberties, his civil rights, and so we

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Speaker 1: aired on the side of caution. It was my decision

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Speaker 1: and let him go. What wasn't my decision is when

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Speaker 1: I asked them, I said, where is these things you

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Speaker 1: found in the car? And I went, we didn't keep

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Speaker 1: any of it, And I went, what you didn't What

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Speaker 1: I said, what about the gloves and the rope, because

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Speaker 1: I'm thinking that that's probably part of crimes that had

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Speaker 1: been committed since the people had been killed from ligature strangulation.

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Speaker 1: But somewhere we dropped the ball. I was in charge,

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Speaker 1: so I went ahead and took the hit for it.

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Speaker 1: I said, Oh, that's just the decision you guys made.

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Speaker 1: And I'll back you. I don't agree with it right now,

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Speaker 1: but as far as official official word goes, and we

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Speaker 1: made that decision, and that's that's the way it goes.

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Speaker 5: Did anyone ever see Wayne toss anything over the bridge?

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Speaker 1: No, never did. But there wasn't another car on that bridge.

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Speaker 1: He was the only car there. They saw the headlights approach,

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Speaker 1: they heard the splash, and then they saw what, like

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Speaker 1: I described earlier as him appeared to just be starting

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Speaker 1: out again at two or three miles an hour.

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Speaker 5: Did you guys ask him that night if he tossed

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Speaker 5: anything over the bridge?

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Speaker 1: Yes, and he I asked him, you know, there'd been

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Speaker 1: a splash, And I think I asked him he tossed anything,

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Speaker 1: And I don't remember if he said he was throwing

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Speaker 1: trash out or something. I can't remember that part. I

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Speaker 1: don't remember what his answer was, but he did say

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Speaker 1: I think he said he was throwing trash away or something,

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Speaker 1: that he had some trash that he needed to get

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Speaker 1: rid of and he threw it in the river that night.

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Speaker 5: No one ever saw or found what caused the alleged

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Speaker 5: splash that was hurt in the water.

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Speaker 1: We let him go and at six am we packed

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Speaker 1: up and I went ahead and went home. And home

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Speaker 1: was down south of Atlanta, lived in marl Georgia. I

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Speaker 1: drove up to East Tennessee because it was Memorial Day weekend.

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Speaker 1: It was a long weekend to see my mother and

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Speaker 1: basically crashed. I was totally exhausted. I slept for I

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Speaker 1: think I got there. It's about a three hour drive,

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Speaker 1: and I got there about noon on Friday, went to sleep,

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Speaker 1: woke up at noon on Saturday eight went back to sleep.

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Speaker 5: Though police had a strange encounter with the man on

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Speaker 5: the bridge, they decided to let him go.

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Speaker 3: They had no reason to hold him in custody. The

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Speaker 3: bridge steak.

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Speaker 5: Out operation was now officially over, and Mike Macombus went

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Speaker 5: home to rest for the weekend.

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Speaker 3: But meanwhile, investigators.

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Speaker 5: Were still hard at work, suspicious of the man they

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Speaker 5: top from the bridge, and by the time the combas

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Speaker 5: woke up again, big things were happening.

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Speaker 1: Sunday morning, I got a call from Bill McGrath. He

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Speaker 1: was one of the administrative supervisors on the case.

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Speaker 2: And Bill called me in.

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Speaker 1: He said, did you interview Wayne Williams. I said yes.

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Speaker 1: He said, well, do you have any notes? I said, oh, yeah,

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Speaker 1: I got a lot of notes. Well, we just found

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Speaker 1: a body about five hundred meters down stream. You need

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Speaker 1: to call in and do your report right now. And

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Speaker 1: he said, and get yourself back to Atlanta.

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Speaker 7: We think we got him.

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Speaker 5: A few days later, a body washed up in the river,

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Speaker 5: just a few miles downstream from the bridge.

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Speaker 8: The body was found around eleven this morning in the

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Speaker 8: Chattahoochee River, just south of the I two eighty five bridge,

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Speaker 8: where the river forms the border between Cobb and Fulton Counties.

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Speaker 8: The body was nude, and medical examiners estimated it had

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Speaker 8: been in the water a couple of days. It was

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Speaker 8: found by a fisherman. The body was on the Fulton

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Speaker 8: County side of the river, but it was difficult for

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Speaker 8: police to get to that part of the river. Boats

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Speaker 8: were launched from the Cobb County side. Members of the

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Speaker 8: Special Task Force poured in. About two hours later the

175
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Speaker 8: body was brought out. A medical examiner said it was

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Speaker 8: a young black man in his early twenties.

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Speaker 5: The body was of twenty seven year old Nathaniel Cater.

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Speaker 5: The FBI now had their first real suspect the man

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Speaker 5: they had stopped on the bridge.

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Speaker 3: That man was Wayne Williams.

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Speaker 9: The man who has been questioned, was stopped late at

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Speaker 9: night on May twenty first, after arousing the curiosity of

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Speaker 9: police on a river's stakeout. The investigators heard a splash

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Speaker 9: in the water underneath the Jackson Parkway Bridge.

185
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Speaker 10: No arrest was made then, and no one inspected two

186
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Speaker 10: bags of clothes, the pair of men's shoes, or the

187
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Speaker 10: gloves seen inside the station wagon. For two days, the

188
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Speaker 10: task force quietly dragged the river, not finding anything. Three

189
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Speaker 10: days later, two people in a canoe did the nude

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Speaker 10: body of Nathaniel Cater a mile downstream from the South

191
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Speaker 10: Cobb Bridge.

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Speaker 5: Within a matter of minutes, news stations formed the rigs

193
00:10:00,440 --> 00:10:03,480
Speaker 5: where Nathaniel Cater's body was found, and it wasn't long

194
00:10:03,520 --> 00:10:09,720
Speaker 5: after that the media discovered the name Wayne Williams. Though

195
00:10:09,720 --> 00:10:13,080
Speaker 5: no arrests have been made, news stations released his name anyways.

196
00:10:13,960 --> 00:10:16,600
Speaker 11: To anyone who's been anywhere even close to the non

197
00:10:16,640 --> 00:10:20,120
Speaker 11: suspect's home, it's obvious he doesn't have any privacy anymore.

198
00:10:20,520 --> 00:10:22,960
Speaker 11: In spite of his pleas to remain anonymous, and in

199
00:10:23,000 --> 00:10:25,560
Speaker 11: spite of the police begging the media to use restraint,

200
00:10:25,800 --> 00:10:27,520
Speaker 11: most have released his name anyway.

201
00:10:28,040 --> 00:10:30,880
Speaker 5: Reporters and camera crews from all around the nation lined

202
00:10:30,960 --> 00:10:33,920
Speaker 5: up outside the home of Wayne Williams, anxiously awaiting for

203
00:10:33,960 --> 00:10:34,680
Speaker 5: something to happen.

204
00:10:35,120 --> 00:10:38,800
Speaker 10: A horde of police, news reporters and photographers smothered this

205
00:10:38,920 --> 00:10:42,040
Speaker 10: quiet neighborhood. The media didn't want to miss any arrests

206
00:10:42,120 --> 00:10:43,920
Speaker 10: that so far hasn't happened.

207
00:10:44,120 --> 00:10:47,640
Speaker 5: And with this man now under the national spotlight, the

208
00:10:47,720 --> 00:10:50,400
Speaker 5: FBI's investigation was sent in the overdrive.

209
00:10:51,000 --> 00:10:54,680
Speaker 12: Two FBI agents and two detectives with the Atlanta Police

210
00:10:54,679 --> 00:10:59,400
Speaker 12: Department sat perched on their cars, guns visible, never taking

211
00:10:59,400 --> 00:11:03,520
Speaker 12: their eyes off the modest home in northwest Atlanta. The mother, father,

212
00:11:03,679 --> 00:11:07,480
Speaker 12: and son inside became a family under siege in their

213
00:11:07,520 --> 00:11:10,240
Speaker 12: own home. In around ten this morning, the man's father

214
00:11:10,360 --> 00:11:13,200
Speaker 12: came out of the house, pushed the cameras away with

215
00:11:13,320 --> 00:11:17,960
Speaker 12: his commanding presence, and silently walked toward the police. Without

216
00:11:18,000 --> 00:11:20,680
Speaker 12: saying a word, He signaled them to follow him into

217
00:11:20,679 --> 00:11:21,079
Speaker 12: the house.

218
00:11:21,160 --> 00:11:22,160
Speaker 13: Have they asked you to leave?

219
00:11:23,360 --> 00:11:25,040
Speaker 3: Do they have anything of a confession?

220
00:11:25,400 --> 00:11:28,600
Speaker 5: The nation was glued to their TVs as reporters scrambled

221
00:11:28,600 --> 00:11:31,120
Speaker 5: to find more information on the manning question for the

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Speaker 5: murder of Atlanta's children.

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Speaker 3: Everyone wanted to know who was Wayne Williams.

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Speaker 9: Wayne Williams is an Atlanta born and bred twenty three

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Speaker 9: years old. A product of the city's public school system.

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Speaker 9: He went to Anderson Park Elementary School and graduated from

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Speaker 9: Frederick Douglas High School on High Tower Road, Northwest. People

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Speaker 9: who know Williams say he is a highly intelligent young man,

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Speaker 9: a good student when he was in school. That opinion

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Speaker 9: is echoed by William's seventh grade teacher, Archie Wilson, who

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Speaker 9: Williams continues to list as a personal reference on his resume.

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Speaker 3: Those who knew Wayne Williams were completely shocked.

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Speaker 14: As a student, he was extremely bright, fair, intelligent young man, quiet, respectful,

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Speaker 14: honest student, very dependable, just an idea student.

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Speaker 9: Williams's resume lists a number of clubs and organizations he

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Speaker 9: says he belonged to in high school National Honor Society

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Speaker 9: ROTC rifle team, but his high school class yearbook does

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Speaker 9: not show him in any of the organization pictures. Williams's

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Speaker 9: acquaintances say he is one who tends to exaggerate his

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Speaker 9: accomplishments and his contacts. His resumes list of professional references

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Speaker 9: includes many familiar names in the local media. Most of

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Speaker 9: those references say they knew Williams only briefly and not

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Speaker 9: very well, but it is clear Wayne Williams is a

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Speaker 9: bright and ambitious person. He started a radio station in

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Speaker 9: his parents' home when he was only twelve. In his teens,

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Speaker 9: he spent time hanging around many of the city's radio stations,

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Speaker 9: doing odd jobs, mostly as an unpaid volunteer, and talking

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Speaker 9: to the people he met about broadcasting.

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Speaker 2: He was a bit old for his age, so to speak.

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Speaker 13: I'm saying that to talk to a kid at that

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Speaker 13: age about something that you're doing as an adult and

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Speaker 13: he's talking on your level.

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Speaker 2: It's really amazing.

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Speaker 13: And as I said before, he was a likable type

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Speaker 13: of individual, maybe because of the knowledge of the industry

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Speaker 13: as far.

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Speaker 2: As I'm concerned.

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Speaker 9: Several years ago, he was arrested for impersonating a police

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Speaker 9: officer and for using police emergency lights on his car.

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Speaker 9: The charges were reduced and handled in traffic court. In

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Speaker 9: nineteen seventy seven, Williams began offering his photographic services to

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Speaker 9: the Atlantic TV stations. Williams would drive the city streets

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Speaker 9: through the night, listening to police monitors in his car,

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Speaker 9: racing to the scene of accidents, fires and homicides, then

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Speaker 9: peddling film of what had happened to the news departments.

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Speaker 9: But the freelance photography business was never very successful, and

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Speaker 9: most recently, william says he has acted as a talent scout,

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Speaker 9: helping young people get ahead in the entertainment industry. Williams

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Speaker 9: has always lived with his parents in this house on

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Speaker 9: Penelope Road, Northwest, the quiet neighborhood that has suddenly become

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Speaker 9: a constant subject of interest for the police and news media.

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Speaker 9: Neighbors say they never knew the family very well, the

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Speaker 9: typical wave as you go by type of thing.

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Speaker 15: He've been such a good boar for it.

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Speaker 16: I know, I haven't seen nothing to make me suspicious

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Speaker 16: of him.

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Speaker 2: If he has really surprised me, really shocks me.

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Speaker 12: Why would you think it would be a shock to you?

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Speaker 13: So close and I got son and that sons, one

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Speaker 13: of them used to go in and wait with him

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Speaker 13: in his radio station.

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Speaker 2: Right.

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Speaker 9: Intelligent, not terribly close to a lot of people, A

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Speaker 9: news and police groupie of sorts. That is how Wayne

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Speaker 9: Williams is described by those who know him, and as

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Speaker 9: his neighbors said, there is shocked that this quiet and

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Speaker 9: promising kid is now a major suspect in the Atlanta

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Speaker 9: child murders.

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Speaker 5: He was described repeatedly as someone who was intelligent and docile,

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Speaker 5: the last person you would suspect in a murder, but

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Speaker 5: the FBI was convinced otherwise. They continued their investigation in

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Speaker 5: searched Wayne williams house.

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Speaker 17: On Wednesday night, June third, Action News learned that FBI

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Speaker 17: agents and a representative of the Special Task Force had

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Speaker 17: executed a search warrant and had collected potential evidence from

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Speaker 17: Williams's home and car.

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Speaker 1: They found an eight by ten sheet of paper that

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Speaker 1: basically was a flyer that said, if you're between the

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Speaker 1: ages of six and ten and you think you can

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Speaker 1: sing or dance, I'm a talent scout.

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Speaker 5: Wayne Williams called himself a talent scout, and he had

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Speaker 5: passed out flyers throughout the city in search of young

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Speaker 5: kids to form a music group. I recently found a

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Speaker 5: copy of that flyer, the same one the FBI had

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Speaker 5: found in his home.

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Speaker 3: The flyer reads, in bold letters.

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Speaker 5: Can you sing or play an instrument if you were

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Speaker 5: between eleven and twenty one, male or female and would

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Speaker 5: like to become a professional entertainer. All interviews private and free,

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Speaker 5: no experience necessary. The FBI found this very interesting. The

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Speaker 5: flyer suggests that Wayne was putting contact with young kids,

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Speaker 5: probably more than one.

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Speaker 1: So he put himself out there as a talent scout.

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Speaker 1: And that's that's how we surmised that he was getting

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Speaker 1: the kids into the car, Because when you're having that

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Speaker 1: many kids and getting that much worldwide publicity, you would

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Speaker 1: think somebody would have enough brains to not get in

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Speaker 1: the car with somebody.

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Speaker 2: But he was pretty good at what he did.

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Speaker 5: It could be a huge coincidence, a line of work

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Speaker 5: with the best intentions, or it was the perfect way

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Speaker 5: to get children alone. Investigators were now more certain than

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Speaker 5: ever that they'd found their man, and it was time

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Speaker 5: they spoke to Wayne Williams again, so they brought him

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Speaker 5: in for questioning.

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Speaker 15: They went out, picked him up and brought him into

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Speaker 15: the FBI office, take him into the back and as

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Speaker 15: a massive scene of city of dignitarian and state and

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Speaker 15: everybody in the world wanted to get involved in it.

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Speaker 2: They in and gather.

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Speaker 15: He agreed to take a potograph test, and we talked

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Speaker 15: for him, and they went downstairs and I did the

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Speaker 15: testing downstairs in my office.

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Speaker 7: Just you two, just the two of us.

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Speaker 15: The full task force, and everybody was on the tenth floor,

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Speaker 15: press and news all around the entire building, and we

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Speaker 15: were kind of on the ninth floor, just the two

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Speaker 15: of us.

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Speaker 5: This is Richard Ratcliffe, former special agent with the FBI.

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Speaker 5: He sat down alone in a room with Wayne Williams

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Speaker 5: to conduct a polygraph test.

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Speaker 15: We had this very interesting interview for about two hours.

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Speaker 15: I said, you're very intelligent, so what's your IQ And

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Speaker 15: he said, I don't believe in that case the potograph.

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Speaker 15: You have to have confidence in it. I think he

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Speaker 15: was totally confident he could beat it. He said that

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Speaker 15: he was just totally calm that he could beat it.

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Speaker 2: And what you do?

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Speaker 15: You ask us series of comparative questions? This series of

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Speaker 15: about ten questions or some of them are very simple.

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Speaker 15: It's everything we've discussed, all yes and no answers. It's

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Speaker 15: not really confusing, is really clear, very pretty simple and

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Speaker 15: no surprises. And at that time I ran what's considered

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Speaker 15: to be the most valid format in the potograph research,

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Speaker 15: and that was the zone comparison test, A former set

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Speaker 15: of questions about ten questions. I'll go through that and

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Speaker 15: record the physiology, and then I'll ask him, was any

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Speaker 15: problem to anything, anything need to explain or correct or know.

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Speaker 15: Then you run a second time, you ask the same

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Speaker 15: set of questions, and I record a second chart. You

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Speaker 15: run the same set of questions the third time, and

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Speaker 15: after the third time, then you score each one of

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Speaker 15: those and compare the responses to the other responses, and

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Speaker 15: then you add those scores up, and it would show

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Speaker 15: either either deception or no deception. And this human nature

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Speaker 15: to want to believe people, So I'm assuming he's going

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Speaker 15: to pass the test. He stayed pretty much composed the

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Speaker 15: whole time. He was composed, and he's not really fair

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Speaker 15: to say relaxed, because the whole situation is not one

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Speaker 15: where you're relaxed. He was very engaged, and he was

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Speaker 15: very much operative and in participated willingly. We had this

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Speaker 15: very interesting conversation and then about what happened, why he's

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Speaker 15: on the bridge, and one of his things that made

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Speaker 15: him suspect was every time he was asking about the bridge,

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Speaker 15: he gave a different story, so he'd already given two

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Speaker 15: or three different versions by the time I talked to

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Speaker 15: him about where he was going, what he was doing,

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Speaker 15: didn't stop on the bridge, just stopping the bridge through

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Speaker 15: the boxes in the river, didn't throw anything in the river. So,

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Speaker 15: I mean he had variations of his story. He's a

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Speaker 15: talent scout, and he had this girl's name, Cheryl, whoever

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Speaker 15: her name was, and he's supposed to meet her the

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Speaker 15: next morning at seven am. And so he went to

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Speaker 15: see if he'd find the apartment. And I said, are

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Speaker 15: you interviewing young girls at seven in the morning in

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Speaker 15: their apartments? And that puts you in an awkward position.

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Speaker 15: I said, I wouldn't do that. He said, I'm not homosexual.

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Speaker 15: He just made a point, I'm not homosexual. He argued

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Speaker 15: that that he wasn't homosexual. I was asking about being

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Speaker 15: alone with this girl in her apartment seven in the morning,

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Speaker 15: and I was asking him why he would do that.

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Speaker 15: Why he would just set up interview at seven in

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Speaker 15: the morning in the girl's apartment. That would make him heterosexual,

394
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Speaker 15: making mineral sexual, right, Yeah, And that's why I was asking.

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Speaker 15: But his argument was that he wasn't homosexual. People I

396
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Speaker 15: guess were suspicious of him being homosexual. I said, well,

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Speaker 15: I'm not accusing you of being homosexual. Well, but we

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Speaker 15: had that discussion. So I said, what do you have

399
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Speaker 15: a girlfriend?

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Speaker 18: Iza?

401
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Speaker 2: Can you? He said not right now?

402
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Speaker 15: So I said have you ever had a girlfriend? And

403
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Speaker 15: he couldn't name one.

404
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Speaker 5: After a long conversation, Racliffe asked the big question that

405
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Speaker 5: had brought him there in the first place.

406
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Speaker 15: Did you cause the death in Nathaniel Cater? Did you

407
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Speaker 15: throw Cater's body into the cheers the river that night?

408
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Speaker 2: What do you say? He said, no, he's denied it.

409
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Speaker 15: I don't know the Kaniell Cater. I didn't have any

410
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Speaker 15: conduct Nathaniel Cater, didn't know him, had never been on

411
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Speaker 15: he didn't have a body, he didn't throw anything in

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Speaker 15: the river.

413
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Speaker 5: Wayne Williams denied any involvement in the murder of Nathaniel Cater,

414
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Speaker 5: claiming that he never even knew him.

415
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Speaker 3: But the results of the polygraph told a different story.

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Speaker 15: The test to his deceptive and that's a first indication

417
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Speaker 15: in two years on who did it? Wow, So you're

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Speaker 15: the guy we were looking for me And that's how

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Speaker 15: kind of how I reacted when I got through and

420
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Speaker 15: great it all out when I got through and said,

421
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Speaker 15: this show's deception. I'll been learning you're the guy that

422
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Speaker 15: we've been looking for you, you're the one killing these kids.

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Speaker 15: He said, that's not me, So let me see that.

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Speaker 15: So then he spread up the charts. Well, the charts,

425
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Speaker 15: you wouldn't know from what I just saw. Would you

426
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Speaker 15: look at that and tell me that somebody's liner that

427
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Speaker 15: killed the guests? So he spread the charts, look at

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Speaker 15: all the tracings. So he points on he says, what's

429
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Speaker 15: that question right there? I said, that's pretty good. Did

430
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Speaker 15: you cause the death Nathaniel Cater? So he picked out

431
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Speaker 15: that question, which is where his reaction was, you know,

432
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Speaker 15: and then I make my call. I go out and

433
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Speaker 15: tell the whole world you know that he's deceptive and

434
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Speaker 15: indicates that he's the one that killed in the can

435
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Speaker 15: of Cater.

436
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Speaker 5: Though Wayne appeared to show deception in his polygraph test,

437
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Speaker 5: investigators let him go and now arrest was made.

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Speaker 17: After twelve hours of interrogation. Public Safety Commissioner Lee Brown

439
00:21:52,000 --> 00:21:54,879
Speaker 17: told waiting reporters that the man had been released and

440
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Speaker 17: no arrest made.

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Speaker 19: In terms of our efforts tonight, we have not ended

442
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Speaker 19: up with the information that would resolved in an arrest.

443
00:22:03,600 --> 00:22:06,359
Speaker 5: A late night press conference was held outside the building,

444
00:22:06,560 --> 00:22:09,600
Speaker 5: kilding questions from reporters that is correct, But as it

445
00:22:09,680 --> 00:22:11,400
Speaker 5: turned out, this was a distraction.

446
00:22:12,000 --> 00:22:14,320
Speaker 17: What the reporters on hand did not know was that

447
00:22:14,480 --> 00:22:16,879
Speaker 17: Brown was creating a diversion for the man and his

448
00:22:17,040 --> 00:22:18,159
Speaker 17: father to leave the building.

449
00:22:18,800 --> 00:22:21,600
Speaker 5: Soon after, the media rushed to way Williams home in

450
00:22:21,680 --> 00:22:24,119
Speaker 5: hopes of a statement from the man, and what happened

451
00:22:24,200 --> 00:22:28,240
Speaker 5: next shocked everyone. Wayne invited all the reporters into his

452
00:22:28,359 --> 00:22:31,280
Speaker 5: living room and held his own press conference for the

453
00:22:31,400 --> 00:22:32,040
Speaker 5: nation to see.

454
00:22:32,160 --> 00:22:35,440
Speaker 17: At seven am, three and a half hours after returning home,

455
00:22:35,760 --> 00:22:39,040
Speaker 17: the young man conducted a news conference, setting the condition

456
00:22:39,200 --> 00:22:41,160
Speaker 17: that he would not be shown and that his name

457
00:22:41,240 --> 00:22:43,840
Speaker 17: not be used. You will hear him, but you will

458
00:22:43,920 --> 00:22:47,080
Speaker 17: see reporters and photographers. He contended that he was being

459
00:22:47,160 --> 00:22:51,280
Speaker 17: harassed prior to his detainment, intimidated during his custody, and

460
00:22:51,440 --> 00:22:54,080
Speaker 17: pressured to confess to crimes he says he did not commit.

461
00:22:54,440 --> 00:22:58,800
Speaker 6: They openly said, you kill Nathaniel Cater and you know it,

462
00:22:58,920 --> 00:23:01,159
Speaker 6: and you line to us. They said that, and they

463
00:23:01,240 --> 00:23:02,440
Speaker 6: said it a number of occasions.

464
00:23:02,440 --> 00:23:02,840
Speaker 16: They said it.

465
00:23:02,920 --> 00:23:05,920
Speaker 6: On that night, one of the task force captains on

466
00:23:06,000 --> 00:23:08,359
Speaker 6: the scene pointed his finger at me and said it,

467
00:23:08,720 --> 00:23:11,920
Speaker 6: and said he was tired of the bs about working

468
00:23:11,960 --> 00:23:14,840
Speaker 6: the long hours working the steakouts, and that he was

469
00:23:14,920 --> 00:23:17,560
Speaker 6: ready to pull the thing to an end. Done, they

470
00:23:17,640 --> 00:23:20,440
Speaker 6: put a tail on me starting last week. I made

471
00:23:20,520 --> 00:23:23,800
Speaker 6: him probably in the first hour or two, and in

472
00:23:23,880 --> 00:23:26,840
Speaker 6: the process of telling me, a couple of the guys

473
00:23:26,880 --> 00:23:29,080
Speaker 6: apparently weren't very good drivers, and I caused them to

474
00:23:29,119 --> 00:23:31,560
Speaker 6: have a minor accident, and I think they were just pissed.

475
00:23:32,240 --> 00:23:35,600
Speaker 5: After claiming his innocence and expressing frustration with law enforcement,

476
00:23:35,880 --> 00:23:38,600
Speaker 5: he began to elaborate on his role as a talent scout,

477
00:23:38,920 --> 00:23:40,800
Speaker 5: detailing his involvement in music groups.

478
00:23:41,440 --> 00:23:44,240
Speaker 6: It's our job to take some entertainer, say, basically from

479
00:23:44,320 --> 00:23:46,480
Speaker 6: the street, polishing them up, get them professional, and try

480
00:23:46,520 --> 00:23:48,600
Speaker 6: and shop a record deal for them. And we had

481
00:23:48,640 --> 00:23:50,800
Speaker 6: a young group that we have been putting together since

482
00:23:51,000 --> 00:23:54,440
Speaker 6: nineteen seventy seven, a group called Gemini. When we're trying

483
00:23:54,480 --> 00:23:57,080
Speaker 6: to do is just capture the marketplace basically that Jackson

484
00:23:57,160 --> 00:23:57,640
Speaker 6: five had.

485
00:23:58,040 --> 00:24:01,119
Speaker 5: He mentioned recruiting kids to form music, nay one in

486
00:24:01,160 --> 00:24:04,760
Speaker 5: particular that he was currently working on that he called Gemini.

487
00:24:05,040 --> 00:24:07,960
Speaker 17: Williams himself did not exactly go into hiding. He did,

488
00:24:08,040 --> 00:24:12,119
Speaker 17: on several occasions call local reporters. He led police surveillance

489
00:24:12,200 --> 00:24:15,119
Speaker 17: on some wild goose chases passing by Commissioner Browns and

490
00:24:15,160 --> 00:24:16,280
Speaker 17: Mayor Jackson's houses.

491
00:24:16,640 --> 00:24:19,200
Speaker 5: Was this the man who was killing Atlanta's children or

492
00:24:19,280 --> 00:24:21,520
Speaker 5: just a local talent scout who was simply at the

493
00:24:21,560 --> 00:24:24,280
Speaker 5: wrong place at the wrong time. The FBI had gone

494
00:24:24,320 --> 00:24:26,800
Speaker 5: through countless leads over the past two years, but in

495
00:24:26,840 --> 00:24:29,440
Speaker 5: their eyes, the one that made the most sense was

496
00:24:29,480 --> 00:24:30,240
Speaker 5: Wayne Williams.

497
00:24:31,760 --> 00:24:34,120
Speaker 1: When you work a case that long with that many people,

498
00:24:34,160 --> 00:24:35,840
Speaker 1: there's going to be a lot of theories, a lot

499
00:24:35,920 --> 00:24:37,760
Speaker 1: of names, a lot of people that you have to

500
00:24:37,920 --> 00:24:41,160
Speaker 1: check and wash out. I mean, it's quite an ordeal.

501
00:24:42,000 --> 00:24:43,720
Speaker 1: So there were a lot of theories out there, but

502
00:24:44,600 --> 00:24:46,720
Speaker 1: none of them had the substance of Wayne Williams.

503
00:24:47,200 --> 00:24:50,160
Speaker 5: What they had on Williams was almost entirely circumstantial.

504
00:24:50,760 --> 00:24:54,400
Speaker 1: I'm not sure that we had a gigantic case when

505
00:24:54,440 --> 00:24:58,480
Speaker 1: it comes to physical evidence, but we had an overwhelming

506
00:24:58,560 --> 00:25:00,320
Speaker 1: wave of circumstantial evidence.

507
00:25:00,520 --> 00:25:02,479
Speaker 3: Except for one key piece of physical evidence.

508
00:25:02,920 --> 00:25:05,480
Speaker 10: They do have numerous fibers from the man's house that

509
00:25:05,600 --> 00:25:09,440
Speaker 10: match those found on several victims the fibers. The fibers

510
00:25:09,480 --> 00:25:12,480
Speaker 10: are of different colors and texture. Some think that's good

511
00:25:12,600 --> 00:25:15,920
Speaker 10: enough others, including prosecutors, disagree.

512
00:25:15,840 --> 00:25:18,720
Speaker 5: But even the fibers they found weren't convincing enough for

513
00:25:18,800 --> 00:25:20,359
Speaker 5: the district attorney to press charges.

514
00:25:20,840 --> 00:25:24,680
Speaker 8: Public Safety Commissioner Brown, FBI had John Glover and Task

515
00:25:24,800 --> 00:25:28,120
Speaker 8: Force had Morris Redding met with District Attorney Lewis Slayton

516
00:25:28,200 --> 00:25:30,960
Speaker 8: for an hour this morning. Slayton's office took out the

517
00:25:31,040 --> 00:25:33,920
Speaker 8: search warrants to search the house of the man police question,

518
00:25:34,400 --> 00:25:37,440
Speaker 8: and Slayton decided last night there was not enough evidence

519
00:25:37,520 --> 00:25:40,520
Speaker 8: to charge the man, so he didn't press charges. No

520
00:25:40,720 --> 00:25:43,280
Speaker 8: charges filed. You might have missed that fact if you

521
00:25:43,400 --> 00:25:46,920
Speaker 8: read the New York Post. It's headlined this morning was sensational.

522
00:25:47,359 --> 00:25:49,680
Speaker 5: But the New York Post had already run their morning

523
00:25:49,720 --> 00:25:54,720
Speaker 5: paper with a very conflicting headline that read Atlanta monster ceased.

524
00:25:55,040 --> 00:25:59,040
Speaker 8: But investigators here are worried about sensationalism, only to the

525
00:25:59,160 --> 00:26:01,120
Speaker 8: extended effect their investigation.

526
00:26:02,440 --> 00:26:07,200
Speaker 20: He was a freelance photographer for WSBTV, so that was

527
00:26:07,440 --> 00:26:09,480
Speaker 20: the shocker for our newsroom.

528
00:26:09,840 --> 00:26:12,760
Speaker 5: As the media dove deeper into Wayne Williams's background, his

529
00:26:12,840 --> 00:26:15,720
Speaker 5: story became even more interesting. In addition to being a

530
00:26:15,800 --> 00:26:18,600
Speaker 5: talent scout, he had also worked as a freelance photographer

531
00:26:18,800 --> 00:26:22,680
Speaker 5: for the local news station in Atlanta, WSBTV. Monica Pearson,

532
00:26:22,880 --> 00:26:25,960
Speaker 5: who worked at WSBTV was also anchor at that time,

533
00:26:26,200 --> 00:26:28,480
Speaker 5: recalls us very well, I was.

534
00:26:28,640 --> 00:26:31,920
Speaker 20: Just an anchor, but I can tell you from our viewpoint,

535
00:26:32,320 --> 00:26:35,080
Speaker 20: it was what, you know, this is somebody we all

536
00:26:35,200 --> 00:26:39,320
Speaker 20: worked with who was a photographer, but a freelance photographer,

537
00:26:39,440 --> 00:26:43,320
Speaker 20: not on staff, and I did not know him, but

538
00:26:44,160 --> 00:26:46,920
Speaker 20: because he worked mainly on weekends, but other people did,

539
00:26:47,160 --> 00:26:49,520
Speaker 20: and it was kind of a matter of not Wayne.

540
00:26:49,800 --> 00:26:52,480
Speaker 20: He is so mild mannered and you know, what do

541
00:26:52,520 --> 00:26:56,520
Speaker 20: you mean he couldn't hurt fly. But then there were

542
00:26:56,600 --> 00:26:58,760
Speaker 20: others who said, well maybe.

543
00:27:00,240 --> 00:27:02,960
Speaker 5: In the weeks following the bridge incident, America was gripped

544
00:27:02,960 --> 00:27:05,680
Speaker 5: by the ups and downs of the FBI's investigation into

545
00:27:05,720 --> 00:27:09,000
Speaker 5: Wayne Williams. But on June twenty first, nineteen eighty one,

546
00:27:09,480 --> 00:27:10,600
Speaker 5: everything would change.

547
00:27:13,040 --> 00:27:16,320
Speaker 8: Suddenly. Late in the afternoon, authorities arrested Williams.

548
00:27:17,000 --> 00:27:18,639
Speaker 19: As you know, we meet on this on a day

549
00:27:18,680 --> 00:27:21,800
Speaker 19: to day basis. As a result of the meetings we've

550
00:27:21,840 --> 00:27:26,320
Speaker 19: had today, the decision was made to issue the arrest warrned,

551
00:27:26,359 --> 00:27:28,560
Speaker 19: which was done and he was taken into custy As

552
00:27:28,600 --> 00:27:29,320
Speaker 19: a result.

553
00:27:29,040 --> 00:27:31,600
Speaker 8: Of that, Williams was taken to the Fulton County Jail.

554
00:27:31,720 --> 00:27:34,240
Speaker 8: He was booked on a charge of murder the murder

555
00:27:34,320 --> 00:27:36,080
Speaker 8: of twenty eight year old Nathaniel Cater.

556
00:27:36,400 --> 00:27:39,840
Speaker 5: Despite his initial hesitation, the district attorney suddenly changed his

557
00:27:39,920 --> 00:27:43,600
Speaker 5: mind and Wayne Williams was charged with the murder of

558
00:27:43,720 --> 00:27:44,400
Speaker 5: Nathaniel Cater.

559
00:27:58,880 --> 00:28:02,560
Speaker 10: An indictment for the was almost predictable, but the surprise

560
00:28:02,720 --> 00:28:05,600
Speaker 10: came when District Attorney Lewis Slayton made the announcement.

561
00:28:05,840 --> 00:28:09,960
Speaker 21: The grand jury had returned an indictment in two counts,

562
00:28:10,840 --> 00:28:16,200
Speaker 21: charging Wayne Bertram Bertram Williams with the murder of Jimmy

563
00:28:16,320 --> 00:28:20,200
Speaker 21: ray Payne and one count and Theathaniel Kata and the

564
00:28:20,480 --> 00:28:21,160
Speaker 21: second count.

565
00:28:21,400 --> 00:28:24,680
Speaker 5: Wayne was also charged with the second murder. On April

566
00:28:24,720 --> 00:28:27,560
Speaker 5: twenty seventh, nineteen eighty one, the body of twenty one

567
00:28:27,640 --> 00:28:30,280
Speaker 5: year old Jimmy ray Payne was also found in the

568
00:28:30,359 --> 00:28:31,159
Speaker 5: Chattahoochee River.

569
00:28:31,600 --> 00:28:33,600
Speaker 3: The cause of death was asphyxiation.

570
00:28:33,880 --> 00:28:37,320
Speaker 10: That announcement came as a very big surprise late this afternoon.

571
00:28:37,400 --> 00:28:38,120
Speaker 3: Not only did the.

572
00:28:38,080 --> 00:28:41,080
Speaker 10: Attorneys for Wayne Williams think any indictment wouldn't come until

573
00:28:41,160 --> 00:28:44,320
Speaker 10: next Tuesday, they never thought their client would be indicted

574
00:28:44,400 --> 00:28:46,880
Speaker 10: for the murder of twenty one year old Jimmy Ray Payne.

575
00:28:47,640 --> 00:28:52,240
Speaker 20: The police have arrested and charged him, but he still

576
00:28:52,520 --> 00:28:55,200
Speaker 20: has to be judged by his peers and in a

577
00:28:55,280 --> 00:28:58,960
Speaker 20: court of law. So until he is found guilty, we

578
00:28:59,120 --> 00:29:02,040
Speaker 20: have to say all let there was still the question

579
00:29:02,520 --> 00:29:04,400
Speaker 20: is is he guilty or is he not?

580
00:29:05,760 --> 00:29:08,080
Speaker 10: In a brief statement, william stood in front of Judge

581
00:29:08,080 --> 00:29:11,880
Speaker 10: Clarence Cooper and said, I plead not guilty to both counts.

582
00:29:12,400 --> 00:29:15,480
Speaker 5: The trial was under way and Wayne William's defense attorney,

583
00:29:15,640 --> 00:29:17,640
Speaker 5: Mary Welcome was ready to fight back.

584
00:29:18,400 --> 00:29:21,480
Speaker 18: There has been a serious effort on the part of

585
00:29:21,960 --> 00:29:25,320
Speaker 18: the government, the law enforcement agencies of various and agencies

586
00:29:25,680 --> 00:29:30,040
Speaker 18: to convince the country, even the world, that Wayne is

587
00:29:31,320 --> 00:29:34,960
Speaker 18: implicated in all of the murders. So on reflection, I

588
00:29:34,960 --> 00:29:37,480
Speaker 18: shouldn't be too surprised that they would trying to tie

589
00:29:37,600 --> 00:29:38,200
Speaker 18: at least.

590
00:29:38,080 --> 00:29:41,480
Speaker 5: One more in to She implied that law enforcement was

591
00:29:41,560 --> 00:29:44,560
Speaker 5: ganging up against Wayne in an effort to close the case,

592
00:29:44,880 --> 00:29:47,080
Speaker 5: and felt very strongly about her client's innocence.

593
00:29:48,240 --> 00:29:50,960
Speaker 10: From the beginning, many people thought the state's case against

594
00:29:51,040 --> 00:29:55,560
Speaker 10: Wayne Williams was as suspect as the suspect himself. Prosecutors

595
00:29:55,640 --> 00:29:59,200
Speaker 10: had no eyewitness to the crimes, no confession, but on

596
00:29:59,280 --> 00:30:01,520
Speaker 10: December twenty, the eighth of last year, the state went

597
00:30:01,560 --> 00:30:05,120
Speaker 10: ahead with its case. Its main ingredients fibers and animal

598
00:30:05,160 --> 00:30:06,520
Speaker 10: hair that allegedly matched.

599
00:30:12,000 --> 00:30:15,360
Speaker 5: Larry Peterson of the Georgia State Crime Lab began analyzing

600
00:30:15,440 --> 00:30:19,040
Speaker 5: fibers found in the bodies of victims. The fibers collected

601
00:30:19,240 --> 00:30:23,320
Speaker 5: were dog hairs and green, violet, yellow, and red material fibers.

602
00:30:23,800 --> 00:30:26,880
Speaker 5: In particular, some of the green fibers reportedly came from

603
00:30:27,000 --> 00:30:29,960
Speaker 5: unique carpeting that was found inside Willie William's family home.

604
00:30:30,800 --> 00:30:34,760
Speaker 1: We came up with three types of fiber, some of

605
00:30:34,840 --> 00:30:39,000
Speaker 1: it was microscopically found. The green fiber I have personal

606
00:30:39,080 --> 00:30:41,320
Speaker 1: knowledge of because my partner and I tracked that down.

607
00:30:41,960 --> 00:30:44,280
Speaker 1: They used to have an old green carpet. It was

608
00:30:45,160 --> 00:30:47,960
Speaker 1: a shag carpet. Did you guys ever see any.

609
00:30:47,800 --> 00:30:48,480
Speaker 2: Of that will check?

610
00:30:48,680 --> 00:30:52,200
Speaker 1: Yeah, it's quite it's quite old, very dated, and it

611
00:30:52,360 --> 00:30:55,640
Speaker 1: was a green collar. And when Harold Dedman told us

612
00:30:55,840 --> 00:30:58,440
Speaker 1: when he finished with his he took a microscopic fiber

613
00:30:58,560 --> 00:31:00,680
Speaker 1: and found out that this was manified actually in South

614
00:31:00,760 --> 00:31:05,280
Speaker 1: Carolina and it was transported by West Point Pepperrell to Dalton, Georgia.

615
00:31:05,560 --> 00:31:08,560
Speaker 1: At Dalton there was like two hundred thousand square yards

616
00:31:08,600 --> 00:31:11,240
Speaker 1: of it. It went to ten or twelve different distributors

617
00:31:11,600 --> 00:31:14,360
Speaker 1: in Atlanta, and then we came down from Dalton and

618
00:31:14,440 --> 00:31:17,800
Speaker 1: we contacted those ten or twelve and we found the

619
00:31:17,880 --> 00:31:23,480
Speaker 1: paperwork where Wayne Williams's parents had purchased that carpet like

620
00:31:23,720 --> 00:31:27,520
Speaker 1: fifteen years before. So we traced a microscopic fiber from

621
00:31:27,560 --> 00:31:29,480
Speaker 1: its very beginning all the way to Wayne's house, and

622
00:31:29,560 --> 00:31:31,719
Speaker 1: it was the same fiber that we were pulling off

623
00:31:31,760 --> 00:31:35,800
Speaker 1: of the bodies. Now that my friend is a piece

624
00:31:35,840 --> 00:31:36,560
Speaker 1: of investigation.

625
00:31:36,720 --> 00:31:36,960
Speaker 2: Okay.

626
00:31:39,120 --> 00:31:41,800
Speaker 5: The second major part of the prosecution's case was the

627
00:31:41,880 --> 00:31:45,400
Speaker 5: bridge incident, but the prosecution had no eyewitnesses.

628
00:31:45,680 --> 00:31:48,680
Speaker 10: The bridge incident was the closest investigators could put their

629
00:31:48,760 --> 00:31:52,720
Speaker 10: suspect to a dead body, a legal necessity called corpus delecti.

630
00:31:53,200 --> 00:31:55,760
Speaker 10: Although prosecutors had most of the pieces that night in

631
00:31:55,840 --> 00:31:59,040
Speaker 10: May a splash, an alleged slow moving car a body

632
00:31:59,120 --> 00:32:02,200
Speaker 10: downstream just two days later, it's still lacked the essential

633
00:32:02,280 --> 00:32:05,960
Speaker 10: part of the puzzle, someone actually seeing William's car stopped

634
00:32:06,000 --> 00:32:08,520
Speaker 10: on the bridge, or better yet, the suspect throwing a

635
00:32:08,600 --> 00:32:09,680
Speaker 10: body from the structure.

636
00:32:10,120 --> 00:32:12,680
Speaker 5: No one who actually saw what allegedly happened on the

637
00:32:12,720 --> 00:32:17,320
Speaker 5: bridge that night. The defense argued in the courtroom that

638
00:32:17,440 --> 00:32:21,120
Speaker 5: Wayne Williams was five foot seven and Nathaniel Cater was

639
00:32:21,160 --> 00:32:24,000
Speaker 5: six foot one, claiming that it was impossible for a

640
00:32:24,080 --> 00:32:26,440
Speaker 5: man of Wayne's size to pick up his body and

641
00:32:26,520 --> 00:32:27,600
Speaker 5: throw it over a bridge.

642
00:32:28,040 --> 00:32:29,400
Speaker 3: I asked Mike mccombis about this.

643
00:32:30,320 --> 00:32:32,720
Speaker 1: Wayne wasn't a great big guy, but he was round

644
00:32:33,960 --> 00:32:36,840
Speaker 1: and he was pudgy. I don't know if you ever

645
00:32:37,000 --> 00:32:40,800
Speaker 1: had a real rush of adrenaline. People do amazing things

646
00:32:40,840 --> 00:32:44,360
Speaker 1: when they've got a rush out of adrenaline. And when

647
00:32:44,400 --> 00:32:47,280
Speaker 1: you're not trying to be careful and hurt somebody, you

648
00:32:47,360 --> 00:32:48,640
Speaker 1: can drag them, pick them up.

649
00:32:49,400 --> 00:32:50,160
Speaker 2: It's no problem.

650
00:32:50,720 --> 00:32:53,400
Speaker 5: Another point the prosecution argued was the sound that a

651
00:32:53,480 --> 00:32:55,719
Speaker 5: car would make when driving across the bridge.

652
00:32:55,960 --> 00:32:56,600
Speaker 3: What was interesting.

653
00:32:56,640 --> 00:32:58,560
Speaker 22: There was an expansion played on the bridge, and if

654
00:32:58,600 --> 00:33:00,920
Speaker 22: a car goes over the way. Later determined if a

655
00:33:01,000 --> 00:33:03,960
Speaker 22: cargoes over the bridge faster than five miles an hour,

656
00:33:04,080 --> 00:33:08,320
Speaker 22: the expansion plate will make a loud clank. Under five

657
00:33:08,360 --> 00:33:09,560
Speaker 22: miles an hour, there's no sound.

658
00:33:12,520 --> 00:33:15,280
Speaker 10: That sound, the defense claims, is the key to their proof.

659
00:33:15,560 --> 00:33:18,320
Speaker 10: Police recruit Bob Campbell, part of the stakeout team, says

660
00:33:18,680 --> 00:33:22,040
Speaker 10: Williams card did not make that sound, indicating the vehicle

661
00:33:22,120 --> 00:33:24,520
Speaker 10: was traveling at a slow rate of speed, But a

662
00:33:24,600 --> 00:33:27,680
Speaker 10: sound expert hired by the defense as that's impossible that

663
00:33:27,840 --> 00:33:30,640
Speaker 10: even at four miles an hour, the family station wagon

664
00:33:30,720 --> 00:33:33,600
Speaker 10: makes the joint rattle loud enough for someone underneath the

665
00:33:33,640 --> 00:33:37,320
Speaker 10: bridge to hear it, suggestion that recruit Campbell was fast

666
00:33:37,360 --> 00:33:39,920
Speaker 10: asleep on the job the night Williams was stopped, and

667
00:33:40,120 --> 00:33:43,840
Speaker 10: the prosecution surprisingly went along with a theory. Asking Mark

668
00:33:43,880 --> 00:33:46,400
Speaker 10: Oviot if a loud splash would wake the recruit up,

669
00:33:46,840 --> 00:33:50,440
Speaker 10: the expert said yes. The state contends that loud splash

670
00:33:50,600 --> 00:33:53,800
Speaker 10: was the body of Nathaniel Cater heading the water. Williams

671
00:33:53,840 --> 00:33:56,400
Speaker 10: bluntly stated the police version of the now famous bridge

672
00:33:56,440 --> 00:33:59,680
Speaker 10: incident was wrong, a lie. He claimed he wasn't driving

673
00:33:59,720 --> 00:34:02,280
Speaker 10: slowp that he didn't turn around in a parking lot

674
00:34:02,400 --> 00:34:04,720
Speaker 10: next to the bridge, that he did not throw anything

675
00:34:04,800 --> 00:34:07,040
Speaker 10: into the river. He tried to persuade the jury he

676
00:34:07,160 --> 00:34:09,640
Speaker 10: really was out near a bridge that night looking for

677
00:34:09,719 --> 00:34:12,800
Speaker 10: a Cheryl Johnson, who still remains a mystery to this trial.

678
00:34:13,320 --> 00:34:15,960
Speaker 5: According to Wayne Williams, the night he was stopping the bridge,

679
00:34:16,239 --> 00:34:18,479
Speaker 5: he was going to find a young woman named Cheryl

680
00:34:18,600 --> 00:34:21,520
Speaker 5: Johnson who wanted to do an audition for him. Earlier

681
00:34:21,600 --> 00:34:24,480
Speaker 5: that day, Cheryl Johnson had called his home and Wayne's

682
00:34:24,480 --> 00:34:27,360
Speaker 5: mother answered and wrote down her name, phone number, and address.

683
00:34:27,719 --> 00:34:30,440
Speaker 5: According to Wayne, that night he was going to verify

684
00:34:30,520 --> 00:34:32,440
Speaker 5: her home address so he would know where to go

685
00:34:32,600 --> 00:34:36,240
Speaker 5: for the morning appointment. But the major problem was investigators

686
00:34:36,440 --> 00:34:38,800
Speaker 5: never found a Cheryl Johnson When they went to the

687
00:34:38,840 --> 00:34:40,959
Speaker 5: address on the piece of paper. There was no Cheryl

688
00:34:41,000 --> 00:34:43,759
Speaker 5: Johnson who lived there, and the phone number didn't work.

689
00:34:44,400 --> 00:34:46,960
Speaker 5: So who was Cheryl Johnson and where was she? The

690
00:34:47,040 --> 00:34:50,719
Speaker 5: prosecution claimed that she wasn't real, but Wayne stuck by

691
00:34:50,719 --> 00:34:51,160
Speaker 5: a story.

692
00:34:51,640 --> 00:34:54,560
Speaker 10: The state implied he fabricated the story, but Williams didn't

693
00:34:54,600 --> 00:34:57,040
Speaker 10: budge from it, claiming the woman simply gave him a

694
00:34:57,080 --> 00:34:58,720
Speaker 10: wrong number and wrong address.

695
00:34:59,120 --> 00:35:01,880
Speaker 3: After a grueling two month trial, it was time for

696
00:35:01,960 --> 00:35:02,400
Speaker 3: a verdict.

697
00:35:03,040 --> 00:35:06,319
Speaker 10: After several days of testimony, three experts summed it up

698
00:35:06,400 --> 00:35:09,640
Speaker 10: in two sentences. Fiber and hair from William's home and

699
00:35:09,760 --> 00:35:12,279
Speaker 10: car matted fibers and hair taken from the bodies of

700
00:35:12,360 --> 00:35:15,400
Speaker 10: cater and pain. They also painted him as a possible

701
00:35:15,440 --> 00:35:19,359
Speaker 10: homosexual who hated poor, young blacks. The defense, steered by

702
00:35:19,440 --> 00:35:22,840
Speaker 10: a Mississippi lawyer, fought back better than many had predicted.

703
00:35:23,160 --> 00:35:26,680
Speaker 10: Their goal placed out in these people's minds. As Binder

704
00:35:26,760 --> 00:35:29,760
Speaker 10: said throughout the trial, Wayne Williams is not a killer.

705
00:35:30,080 --> 00:35:32,880
Speaker 10: He countered with former police recruits who charged members of

706
00:35:32,960 --> 00:35:35,680
Speaker 10: the stakeout team that night in May were drinking and asleep.

707
00:35:36,239 --> 00:35:39,160
Speaker 10: A loose fitting fiber expert from Kansas came in and

708
00:35:39,320 --> 00:35:41,759
Speaker 10: showed that fibers may not be as unique as the

709
00:35:41,840 --> 00:35:42,720
Speaker 10: state had claimed.

710
00:35:46,480 --> 00:35:50,880
Speaker 5: For twelve hours, the jury deliberated you. On February twenty seventh,

711
00:35:51,239 --> 00:35:53,920
Speaker 5: nineteen eighty two, the jury returned their verdict.

712
00:36:00,680 --> 00:36:01,080
Speaker 3: Guilty.

713
00:36:01,520 --> 00:36:04,000
Speaker 10: When the verdicts were read, William's father stood before the

714
00:36:04,080 --> 00:36:07,160
Speaker 10: court and said, I feel this is very unjust. I

715
00:36:07,280 --> 00:36:10,720
Speaker 10: don't see how anyone could find my son guilty of anything.

716
00:36:10,920 --> 00:36:14,040
Speaker 10: I just don't see it. William's mother called the judge

717
00:36:14,080 --> 00:36:17,400
Speaker 10: and uncle Tom, the twenty three year old freelance photographer,

718
00:36:17,480 --> 00:36:21,080
Speaker 10: this morning only a suspect, was optimistic. Tonight as he

719
00:36:21,160 --> 00:36:23,839
Speaker 10: left the courthouse, his mood had changed. He is now

720
00:36:23,960 --> 00:36:25,920
Speaker 10: painted as the mass murderer.

721
00:36:26,040 --> 00:36:28,720
Speaker 5: Wayne Williams was found guilty for the murder of Nathaniel

722
00:36:28,800 --> 00:36:32,680
Speaker 5: Cater and Jimmy ray Payne, but in addition, the FBI

723
00:36:32,840 --> 00:36:37,600
Speaker 5: essentially closed all other cases of Atlanta's murdered children, attributing

724
00:36:37,640 --> 00:36:39,120
Speaker 5: them to Wayne Williams.

725
00:36:39,360 --> 00:36:41,840
Speaker 10: The question of race popped up a lot tonight. Missus

726
00:36:41,840 --> 00:36:45,239
Speaker 10: Williams remarks about Uncle Tom Binder even said a white

727
00:36:45,280 --> 00:36:47,800
Speaker 10: man would have been treated differently, and the mother of

728
00:36:47,880 --> 00:36:50,960
Speaker 10: victim Joseph Bell, a woman who prodded police into forming

729
00:36:51,000 --> 00:36:54,720
Speaker 10: a task force several years ago, was very disappointed.

730
00:36:54,120 --> 00:36:54,800
Speaker 3: With the outcome.

731
00:36:55,239 --> 00:36:58,560
Speaker 5: Camille Bell, mother to victim Yusef, Bell, acted as a

732
00:36:58,640 --> 00:37:01,000
Speaker 5: voice for the appearance of the missing her children, and

733
00:37:01,080 --> 00:37:02,520
Speaker 5: she wasn't very happy with the verdict.

734
00:37:02,960 --> 00:37:07,080
Speaker 23: If I believe that Wayne Williams killed the other twelve

735
00:37:07,239 --> 00:37:10,000
Speaker 23: that they claimed the same fibers that were found on

736
00:37:10,120 --> 00:37:12,920
Speaker 23: those bodies were also found on Usef's body, then I

737
00:37:13,040 --> 00:37:16,280
Speaker 23: must believe that Wayne Williams killed my son. But since

738
00:37:16,400 --> 00:37:20,640
Speaker 23: I don't believe that Wayne Williams killed anybody, I can't

739
00:37:20,719 --> 00:37:24,040
Speaker 23: believe that Wayne Williams therefore killed my son. What it

740
00:37:24,160 --> 00:37:28,040
Speaker 23: all boils down to is now we have Williams twenty three,

741
00:37:28,480 --> 00:37:30,520
Speaker 23: the thirtieth victim of the Atlanta Slaves.

742
00:37:34,960 --> 00:37:38,240
Speaker 5: From that day forward, Wayne Williams was in history books

743
00:37:39,719 --> 00:37:41,160
Speaker 5: as the Atlanta child murderer.

744
00:37:42,280 --> 00:37:45,239
Speaker 3: A lot of people think he's innocent, believe it or not.

745
00:37:45,960 --> 00:37:48,880
Speaker 24: You know, I think they view him as someone who

746
00:37:49,440 --> 00:37:51,560
Speaker 24: who got caught up in it and ended up getting

747
00:37:51,600 --> 00:37:52,160
Speaker 24: bland for it.

748
00:37:53,480 --> 00:37:55,320
Speaker 25: I mean, I'm gonna be honest with you. I you know,

749
00:37:55,600 --> 00:37:58,400
Speaker 25: I never spent a lot of time paying attention. I

750
00:37:58,520 --> 00:38:02,359
Speaker 25: was happy when they was like, we off cold Red.

751
00:38:02,480 --> 00:38:04,080
Speaker 25: Now everybody can go out and play again.

752
00:38:06,920 --> 00:38:09,000
Speaker 3: So is Wayne Williams the Atlanta child murderer.

753
00:38:09,840 --> 00:38:12,600
Speaker 1: Absolutely, without a shadow of doubt, Wayne Williams was the

754
00:38:12,719 --> 00:38:15,759
Speaker 1: child murderer. I'm not saying he did all of them.

755
00:38:16,360 --> 00:38:18,399
Speaker 1: He was convicted on two because we didn't have enough

756
00:38:18,440 --> 00:38:20,440
Speaker 1: evidence to take him on the rest of them. We

757
00:38:20,840 --> 00:38:24,000
Speaker 1: contributed the lion's share of him to him.

758
00:38:24,040 --> 00:38:24,440
Speaker 2: I mean, he.

759
00:38:25,160 --> 00:38:27,400
Speaker 1: Definitely did more than just two, but that was the

760
00:38:27,480 --> 00:38:29,160
Speaker 1: only two that we had enough to take him to

761
00:38:29,239 --> 00:38:29,560
Speaker 1: court and.

762
00:38:29,680 --> 00:38:30,279
Speaker 2: Convict him on.

763
00:38:31,440 --> 00:38:34,279
Speaker 1: I didn't have any problem with the way it was concluded,

764
00:38:34,840 --> 00:38:36,239
Speaker 1: you know. You know, it's like if you catch a

765
00:38:36,280 --> 00:38:38,120
Speaker 1: guy with one hundred bank robberies, he's not going to

766
00:38:38,200 --> 00:38:40,000
Speaker 1: get any more. I mean, you can only sentence a

767
00:38:40,040 --> 00:38:43,280
Speaker 1: guy so many times, so much so two life sentences

768
00:38:43,600 --> 00:38:45,040
Speaker 1: is the same as ten life sentences.

769
00:38:45,160 --> 00:38:45,799
Speaker 2: Life is life.

770
00:38:48,440 --> 00:38:52,959
Speaker 7: It really wasn't over. It really wasn't over.

771
00:38:54,760 --> 00:39:00,360
Speaker 20: Today it's not over. Wayne Williams says he did do it.

772
00:39:00,880 --> 00:39:05,319
Speaker 20: The families don't believe he did it. Law enforcement says

773
00:39:05,400 --> 00:39:09,239
Speaker 20: he did it, the court said he did the adults,

774
00:39:09,680 --> 00:39:13,560
Speaker 20: but no one has ever convicted him on killing the children,

775
00:39:14,400 --> 00:39:19,680
Speaker 20: the boys who were found suffocated. I still think it's

776
00:39:19,719 --> 00:39:21,759
Speaker 20: a story that needs to be investigated.

777
00:39:22,600 --> 00:39:24,440
Speaker 7: I would love and I'm glad you're.

778
00:39:24,320 --> 00:39:28,160
Speaker 20: Doing this to open up the case again and see

779
00:39:28,239 --> 00:39:29,120
Speaker 20: what you can find.

780
00:39:29,880 --> 00:39:31,040
Speaker 3: All these years later.

781
00:39:33,080 --> 00:39:36,800
Speaker 5: Remember Russell Boltazor, whose brother Patrick was found brutally murdered.

782
00:39:37,400 --> 00:39:38,279
Speaker 3: I asked him about this.

783
00:39:38,960 --> 00:39:41,080
Speaker 24: I think he got taken as an escape goat to

784
00:39:41,160 --> 00:39:44,080
Speaker 24: shut down the problems we had. I don't believe that

785
00:39:44,200 --> 00:39:47,680
Speaker 24: he was tried with all evidence and said you are

786
00:39:47,760 --> 00:39:51,719
Speaker 24: guilty for killing all of those kids. I think it

787
00:39:51,840 --> 00:39:55,360
Speaker 24: was a way for them to slow it down. Somebody

788
00:39:55,480 --> 00:39:59,560
Speaker 24: better find somebody to put into jailhouse, so make a

789
00:39:59,600 --> 00:40:02,480
Speaker 24: lot of the these people start being quiet.

790
00:40:16,880 --> 00:40:21,279
Speaker 10: Jerry find the defendant, Wayne Bertram Williams, guilty on count

791
00:40:21,400 --> 00:40:21,839
Speaker 10: number one.

792
00:40:24,920 --> 00:40:27,520
Speaker 4: The arrest of Wayne Williams appeared to solve one of

793
00:40:27,560 --> 00:40:30,760
Speaker 4: the biggest multiple murder mysteries in American history.

794
00:40:31,920 --> 00:40:35,560
Speaker 26: The closing of the cases effectively branded Wayne Williams the

795
00:40:35,640 --> 00:40:36,960
Speaker 26: Atlanta child murderer.

796
00:40:37,760 --> 00:40:40,600
Speaker 5: On nearly every list of American serial killers, you'll find

797
00:40:40,600 --> 00:40:41,600
Speaker 5: the name Wayne Williams.

798
00:40:41,880 --> 00:40:44,799
Speaker 27: Wayne Williams remains in jail and may well be there

799
00:40:44,880 --> 00:40:45,879
Speaker 27: for the rest of his life.

800
00:40:46,880 --> 00:40:49,279
Speaker 5: In nineteen eighty five, they made a movie about it,

801
00:40:49,520 --> 00:40:50,520
Speaker 5: Starry Morgan Freeman.

802
00:40:51,239 --> 00:40:55,400
Speaker 10: Was this the man who choked the life out of shocked, bludgeoned,

803
00:40:55,440 --> 00:40:57,640
Speaker 10: and drowned twenty eight human beings?

804
00:41:06,120 --> 00:41:11,680
Speaker 26: Becuse You're by sentences? The defender Dwayne Bertram Williams to

805
00:41:11,800 --> 00:41:14,120
Speaker 26: the custody of the State Board of Corrections, where he

806
00:41:14,280 --> 00:41:18,360
Speaker 26: is to serve two life sentences, and.

807
00:41:18,400 --> 00:41:20,719
Speaker 5: Over the next three decades, they continue to make its

808
00:41:20,719 --> 00:41:23,680
Speaker 5: way into pop culture, especially in the hip hop community,

809
00:41:24,040 --> 00:41:25,600
Speaker 5: being so closely linked to Atlanta.

810
00:41:29,120 --> 00:41:32,400
Speaker 3: Y'all, when we was kids, I was there to.

811
00:41:32,520 --> 00:41:34,960
Speaker 28: Chris Kisses and then they imposed the troupe.

812
00:41:34,760 --> 00:41:35,960
Speaker 7: Atlanta Kids Missing.

813
00:41:36,239 --> 00:41:39,040
Speaker 28: Oh, we with them kids, and now we grow hip

814
00:41:39,120 --> 00:41:40,480
Speaker 28: to every evil plots.

815
00:41:40,239 --> 00:41:40,920
Speaker 2: You want to put on.

816
00:41:41,840 --> 00:41:44,640
Speaker 5: Andre three thousand from Outcasts even has a verse on

817
00:41:44,760 --> 00:41:46,640
Speaker 5: Travis Scott's twenty sixteen albums.

818
00:41:47,080 --> 00:41:47,759
Speaker 7: In the town they with.

819
00:41:47,880 --> 00:41:50,640
Speaker 29: Murdering kids and dumped them in the creek up from

820
00:41:50,680 --> 00:41:54,040
Speaker 29: where it is by the Spider Spider sprint cooader around.

821
00:41:54,800 --> 00:41:58,560
Speaker 29: We run in through the sprint around. We'll show what

822
00:41:58,680 --> 00:42:03,960
Speaker 29: with boxes pieces. It said he had unlabel on my

823
00:42:04,080 --> 00:42:07,279
Speaker 29: grandma and airth My homie said he told him his

824
00:42:07,440 --> 00:42:08,040
Speaker 29: name was Wayne.

825
00:42:15,239 --> 00:42:17,360
Speaker 5: But a lot of people think he didn't do it.

826
00:42:18,520 --> 00:42:21,440
Speaker 5: Russell bultasor doesn't and he has his own story to

827
00:42:21,520 --> 00:42:25,440
Speaker 5: back that up. Russell heard about his strange incident involving

828
00:42:25,480 --> 00:42:28,399
Speaker 5: his brother Patrick, and it made him doubt that Wayne

829
00:42:28,440 --> 00:42:29,319
Speaker 5: Williams was the killer.

830
00:42:30,560 --> 00:42:32,840
Speaker 24: Spoke to several people out there, and one of the

831
00:42:33,080 --> 00:42:37,120
Speaker 24: police officers the story was told to me that they

832
00:42:37,200 --> 00:42:41,400
Speaker 24: had him on tape that he was running him and

833
00:42:41,480 --> 00:42:46,400
Speaker 24: two kids from individuals in more than one person and

834
00:42:47,719 --> 00:42:50,840
Speaker 24: they ran into a phone booth. He picks up the

835
00:42:50,920 --> 00:42:54,000
Speaker 24: phone and dial I guess nine one one to call

836
00:42:54,080 --> 00:42:57,600
Speaker 24: the police department, and they supposedly had it on recording

837
00:42:57,719 --> 00:42:59,759
Speaker 24: that he said that someone was chasing.

838
00:42:59,480 --> 00:43:03,920
Speaker 3: Him did he describe the person?

839
00:43:04,960 --> 00:43:08,000
Speaker 24: He said, it was two white people that was chasing him,

840
00:43:10,160 --> 00:43:15,719
Speaker 24: and that's all I've ever heard about that story. I

841
00:43:15,840 --> 00:43:18,480
Speaker 24: did try to call the police department and talk to

842
00:43:18,600 --> 00:43:22,279
Speaker 24: someone about that tape, and all of a sudden, no

843
00:43:22,360 --> 00:43:26,040
Speaker 24: one knew what I was talking about, so pretty much

844
00:43:26,160 --> 00:43:29,279
Speaker 24: just left that alone up until now you mentioned to me,

845
00:43:29,360 --> 00:43:32,480
Speaker 24: I'm telling you the story about it. I think most

846
00:43:32,560 --> 00:43:35,359
Speaker 24: of us, like myself, if I knew in my heart

847
00:43:36,320 --> 00:43:39,560
Speaker 24: that they proved that he killed those kids, then that

848
00:43:39,600 --> 00:43:42,040
Speaker 24: would be a lot of relief for us. But I

849
00:43:42,160 --> 00:43:42,960
Speaker 24: don't think they did.

850
00:43:46,120 --> 00:43:48,759
Speaker 5: I realized that Russell Boltazar was probably not the only

851
00:43:48,840 --> 00:43:51,239
Speaker 5: person related to a victim that doesn't believe it was

852
00:43:51,239 --> 00:43:55,080
Speaker 5: Wayne Williams. I started scouring the internet for other stories

853
00:43:55,160 --> 00:43:57,520
Speaker 5: like this, and one day I found a YouTube video

854
00:43:57,880 --> 00:44:01,640
Speaker 5: from twenty fifteen under the user name in just Us.

855
00:44:02,440 --> 00:44:05,239
Speaker 5: It's a video of a guy named Emmanuel, brother of

856
00:44:05,280 --> 00:44:07,240
Speaker 5: Clifford Jones, one of the victims.

857
00:44:08,160 --> 00:44:11,640
Speaker 7: Okay, and your brother's name was Clifford Jones.

858
00:44:12,400 --> 00:44:17,440
Speaker 30: Basically, it was one early morning all of the twenty

859
00:44:18,080 --> 00:44:21,920
Speaker 30: nineteen eighty My brother and I basically walked up to

860
00:44:22,400 --> 00:44:28,359
Speaker 30: a grocery store for my grandmother. People had kidnapped my brother,

861
00:44:29,440 --> 00:44:33,239
Speaker 30: man named Jamie Brooks, Horrace.

862
00:44:32,960 --> 00:44:35,080
Speaker 7: Hopgood, Freddy Costy.

863
00:44:36,440 --> 00:44:37,439
Speaker 15: These guys.

864
00:44:38,640 --> 00:44:43,000
Speaker 30: Helped my brother captive in a lundromat right on the

865
00:44:43,080 --> 00:44:48,360
Speaker 30: corner Hollywood Road. They raped him and beat him.

866
00:44:49,960 --> 00:44:50,759
Speaker 16: All day long.

867
00:44:55,920 --> 00:44:59,160
Speaker 30: One of the people stood in the doorway watching my

868
00:44:59,280 --> 00:45:04,399
Speaker 30: brother get raped, crying, screaming, saying he wanted to go home,

869
00:45:04,560 --> 00:45:07,040
Speaker 30: and saying that he was going to tell his grandmother

870
00:45:08,000 --> 00:45:11,040
Speaker 30: and said that the dude Jamie Brooks put a rope

871
00:45:11,080 --> 00:45:15,120
Speaker 30: around his neck and pulled on the rope and made

872
00:45:15,200 --> 00:45:18,960
Speaker 30: the man told the police did and the police had

873
00:45:19,040 --> 00:45:25,520
Speaker 30: all this information, and they still they still blame someone

874
00:45:25,640 --> 00:45:30,240
Speaker 30: else for clifford murder and knowing why William didn't kill Clifford.

875
00:45:31,080 --> 00:45:34,120
Speaker 3: So who made this? Who was in just us? Who

876
00:45:34,200 --> 00:45:36,480
Speaker 3: is the man behind the camera? Whoever it was.

877
00:45:36,800 --> 00:45:38,800
Speaker 5: They had been doing their own research on this case

878
00:45:39,120 --> 00:45:42,759
Speaker 5: decades later, someone I definitely wanted to talk to. After

879
00:45:42,800 --> 00:45:45,480
Speaker 5: a little digging, I found him. The man who made

880
00:45:45,520 --> 00:45:48,799
Speaker 5: the video was a guy named Dwayne Hendrix. I tracked

881
00:45:48,880 --> 00:45:53,080
Speaker 5: him down and I gave him a call, and within

882
00:45:53,160 --> 00:45:56,600
Speaker 5: the first thirty seconds it was already getting interesting.

883
00:45:59,120 --> 00:46:04,759
Speaker 16: With this said, you know it's gonna be how do

884
00:46:04,920 --> 00:46:10,520
Speaker 16: you want to go to get to the bottom of

885
00:46:10,600 --> 00:46:15,719
Speaker 16: this would literally change American history. I mean it would

886
00:46:15,760 --> 00:46:20,080
Speaker 16: through so many things. When when you just get into this,

887
00:46:20,280 --> 00:46:22,640
Speaker 16: then you get into, like all the layers of it,

888
00:46:23,400 --> 00:46:27,160
Speaker 16: the corruption, you deal with, the cover up, the actual

889
00:46:27,320 --> 00:46:32,080
Speaker 16: murders themselves. Who is responsible for a lot of this.

890
00:46:33,280 --> 00:46:35,839
Speaker 16: There are people in high places that want this shit

891
00:46:35,960 --> 00:46:39,120
Speaker 16: to come out, and then there are some people that

892
00:46:40,040 --> 00:46:42,520
Speaker 16: wanted to come out, but they're afraid of how it's

893
00:46:42,600 --> 00:46:47,040
Speaker 16: gonna come out. And then there are some people that

894
00:46:47,480 --> 00:46:50,279
Speaker 16: don't want it to come out at all because there's

895
00:46:50,280 --> 00:46:52,200
Speaker 16: gonna be some other buckers that's gonna have to lay

896
00:46:52,239 --> 00:46:56,799
Speaker 16: on the sword. It depends on how deep you want

897
00:46:56,840 --> 00:46:59,920
Speaker 16: to go. So this rabbit hole is very.

898
00:47:01,760 --> 00:47:04,280
Speaker 5: Dwayne Hendrix told me that he wanted to meet in person,

899
00:47:04,480 --> 00:47:06,680
Speaker 5: but he lived in Texas and I was in Atlanta.

900
00:47:07,160 --> 00:47:09,360
Speaker 5: So the next weekend it hopped on a flight. I

901
00:47:15,880 --> 00:47:19,080
Speaker 5: wanted to hear his whole story. He was so invested,

902
00:47:19,600 --> 00:47:21,240
Speaker 5: so personally involved.

903
00:47:21,160 --> 00:47:22,480
Speaker 7: It popped up in the news.

904
00:47:24,040 --> 00:47:26,960
Speaker 27: I just knew it wasn't right, and I remember saying

905
00:47:27,400 --> 00:47:31,239
Speaker 27: out loud, they lying on that man. When I grow

906
00:47:31,360 --> 00:47:33,240
Speaker 27: up I'm gonna help him get out of jail.

907
00:47:33,920 --> 00:47:37,359
Speaker 7: Those are my exact words. And my grandmama goes, if

908
00:47:37,400 --> 00:47:40,480
Speaker 7: you don't sit your little narrow ass down, the racist

909
00:47:40,480 --> 00:47:41,840
Speaker 7: ass white boys will kill you.

910
00:47:42,880 --> 00:47:44,400
Speaker 27: And I told her, I said, well, they have to

911
00:47:44,480 --> 00:47:47,879
Speaker 27: kill me then, because that man didn't do it. That's

912
00:47:48,000 --> 00:47:49,920
Speaker 27: one of the memories from my.

913
00:47:50,120 --> 00:47:55,080
Speaker 7: Childhood that was just always etched in my psyche.

914
00:47:55,440 --> 00:48:00,359
Speaker 27: This case, it was just something so long it needed

915
00:48:00,440 --> 00:48:02,680
Speaker 27: in my soul that it's something wrong about this.

916
00:48:04,719 --> 00:48:07,239
Speaker 5: Dwayne remembers seeing the arrest of Wayne Williams in the

917
00:48:07,320 --> 00:48:09,560
Speaker 5: news as a child, and it was something that stuck

918
00:48:09,640 --> 00:48:09,920
Speaker 5: with him.

919
00:48:10,520 --> 00:48:11,440
Speaker 2: We were real close.

920
00:48:12,040 --> 00:48:14,640
Speaker 27: She had me when she was getting ready to go

921
00:48:15,360 --> 00:48:19,000
Speaker 27: for her freshman year in college. We basically grew up together.

922
00:48:19,400 --> 00:48:24,120
Speaker 27: We had this bond and it was almost like if

923
00:48:24,160 --> 00:48:26,440
Speaker 27: anything was ever wrong with my mom, she didn't have

924
00:48:26,560 --> 00:48:28,120
Speaker 27: to say something. I could just look at her and

925
00:48:28,200 --> 00:48:31,879
Speaker 27: I knew. And she's a tough woman. So to see

926
00:48:31,960 --> 00:48:35,080
Speaker 27: her crying uncontrollably to the point to where you know,

927
00:48:35,200 --> 00:48:38,839
Speaker 27: it's like snot all over the place, it was real tough.

928
00:48:39,440 --> 00:48:43,080
Speaker 27: My mom was crying like every day, NonStop for like

929
00:48:43,239 --> 00:48:48,040
Speaker 27: four days in a row, and she basically didn't want

930
00:48:48,080 --> 00:48:49,479
Speaker 27: to tell us in my pop.

931
00:48:49,800 --> 00:48:49,960
Speaker 6: You know.

932
00:48:50,120 --> 00:48:53,759
Speaker 7: He pulled me to the side and he sat me

933
00:48:53,880 --> 00:48:56,280
Speaker 7: down and he said, you know, son, this was about

934
00:48:56,320 --> 00:48:58,120
Speaker 7: to happen. I'm gonna have to turn myself in.

935
00:48:58,800 --> 00:49:00,880
Speaker 5: Dwayne told me that he was all too familiar with

936
00:49:01,000 --> 00:49:03,960
Speaker 5: injustice from a very young age. He talked about his

937
00:49:04,000 --> 00:49:07,000
Speaker 5: stepdad's wrongful conviction, which happened during a pivotal point in

938
00:49:07,080 --> 00:49:07,800
Speaker 5: his childhood.

939
00:49:08,200 --> 00:49:11,960
Speaker 27: It was very difficult because those years of your life,

940
00:49:12,040 --> 00:49:15,920
Speaker 27: you're basically becoming a young man. I ended up becoming,

941
00:49:16,080 --> 00:49:20,800
Speaker 27: like so many things in life based on the example

942
00:49:20,840 --> 00:49:25,360
Speaker 27: that he said, this was my first respectable man that

943
00:49:25,680 --> 00:49:28,200
Speaker 27: I was around all the time, and I could ask

944
00:49:28,280 --> 00:49:30,920
Speaker 27: for advice and talk to and he would teach me

945
00:49:31,000 --> 00:49:33,200
Speaker 27: stuff like doing this is what a man does.

946
00:49:33,120 --> 00:49:33,879
Speaker 7: That type of thing.

947
00:49:34,160 --> 00:49:34,360
Speaker 18: You know.

948
00:49:35,000 --> 00:49:38,200
Speaker 27: It was tough, man, It was real tough because you

949
00:49:38,360 --> 00:49:43,279
Speaker 27: go from just trying to figure out your body and

950
00:49:43,400 --> 00:49:45,680
Speaker 27: the changes you're going through as a young man and

951
00:49:45,760 --> 00:49:48,800
Speaker 27: everything else, and you have all that wound up in

952
00:49:48,880 --> 00:49:50,520
Speaker 27: your head and now you got to figure out how

953
00:49:50,520 --> 00:49:52,440
Speaker 27: you're going to lie to your homeboys.

954
00:49:51,960 --> 00:49:53,960
Speaker 7: About where's your step pops.

955
00:49:54,400 --> 00:49:58,600
Speaker 27: It really psychologically, it does something to you, it makes

956
00:49:58,680 --> 00:49:59,920
Speaker 27: you very angry.

957
00:50:01,000 --> 00:50:04,720
Speaker 7: For me, it made me hate any.

958
00:50:04,600 --> 00:50:08,400
Speaker 27: Authoritative figure at that particular time in my life. I

959
00:50:08,480 --> 00:50:13,080
Speaker 27: didn't realize it, but I would just disrespect teachers in class.

960
00:50:14,120 --> 00:50:14,320
Speaker 18: You know.

961
00:50:14,680 --> 00:50:16,279
Speaker 7: I would go in class and I would just go

962
00:50:16,440 --> 00:50:19,000
Speaker 7: to sleep in class, you.

963
00:50:19,040 --> 00:50:23,200
Speaker 27: Know, because I just really psychologically didn't understand what I

964
00:50:23,360 --> 00:50:23,960
Speaker 27: was going through.

965
00:50:24,640 --> 00:50:27,600
Speaker 7: But it made me very rebellious.

966
00:50:28,320 --> 00:50:32,000
Speaker 5: All this together inspired Dwayne to research Wayne William's story.

967
00:50:32,600 --> 00:50:34,759
Speaker 5: I asked him about the YouTube video of one of

968
00:50:34,760 --> 00:50:36,880
Speaker 5: the victim's brothers, Clifford Jones.

969
00:50:37,200 --> 00:50:41,640
Speaker 28: When we initially spoke with one another, I cried in

970
00:50:41,760 --> 00:50:43,120
Speaker 28: the meeting that we were having.

971
00:50:43,480 --> 00:50:45,200
Speaker 2: I had to walk out of the meeting.

972
00:50:45,080 --> 00:50:45,960
Speaker 7: A couple of times.

973
00:50:46,560 --> 00:50:50,200
Speaker 27: His brother was inside being beaten and raped all day

974
00:50:50,920 --> 00:50:53,600
Speaker 27: before they actually killed him in disposed of his body.

975
00:50:54,960 --> 00:50:58,040
Speaker 28: He said he knew that Wayne Williams didn't kill his brother.

976
00:50:59,239 --> 00:51:04,040
Speaker 28: He knew that. It made me even more wanna try

977
00:51:04,080 --> 00:51:05,480
Speaker 28: to do everything in my power.

978
00:51:06,080 --> 00:51:08,680
Speaker 5: After talking to Cliffer's brother, Dwaine reached out to more

979
00:51:08,760 --> 00:51:12,799
Speaker 5: families and was slowly piecing together a documentary with one

980
00:51:12,880 --> 00:51:13,479
Speaker 5: goal in mind.

981
00:51:13,800 --> 00:51:16,239
Speaker 28: The actual goal was to to make sure that we

982
00:51:16,360 --> 00:51:18,040
Speaker 28: put together a piece that was.

983
00:51:18,080 --> 00:51:22,200
Speaker 27: Going to actually highlight everything that needed to be highlighted

984
00:51:22,440 --> 00:51:27,319
Speaker 27: to give the public the facts that they would need

985
00:51:27,480 --> 00:51:30,359
Speaker 27: to know to make an informed decision as to whether

986
00:51:30,480 --> 00:51:33,560
Speaker 27: or not they believe Wayne Williams is the Atlanta child

987
00:51:33,640 --> 00:51:37,320
Speaker 27: murder or not. That was the whole goal, whether or

988
00:51:37,400 --> 00:51:43,960
Speaker 27: not Wayne was a murderer at all. He was never

989
00:51:44,840 --> 00:51:50,480
Speaker 27: formally charged or indicted for killing any children. So again

990
00:51:50,600 --> 00:51:55,320
Speaker 27: that's another big misconception, right that comes with the cases

991
00:51:55,400 --> 00:51:59,160
Speaker 27: that you know, he's been dubbed the Atlanta child murderer.

992
00:52:01,120 --> 00:52:03,960
Speaker 3: Dwayne had one main point that I really couldn't argue with.

993
00:52:04,440 --> 00:52:08,759
Speaker 27: He was only charged with the murder of Nathaniel cater

994
00:52:09,160 --> 00:52:13,120
Speaker 27: In Jimmy ray Payne. These are anomalies because these was

995
00:52:13,200 --> 00:52:18,400
Speaker 27: two adults. This thing is like something that has always

996
00:52:18,520 --> 00:52:23,280
Speaker 27: been talked about, and it won't go away until something

997
00:52:23,400 --> 00:52:26,480
Speaker 27: is done about it. It will always be the elephant

998
00:52:26,560 --> 00:52:28,000
Speaker 27: in the room in the city of Atlanta.

999
00:52:29,440 --> 00:52:31,880
Speaker 5: A few months into making this documentary, you got a

1000
00:52:31,960 --> 00:52:34,320
Speaker 5: random phone call late one night in the studio.

1001
00:52:35,120 --> 00:52:40,640
Speaker 27: I'm in a recording studio and I'm recording a song

1002
00:52:41,000 --> 00:52:52,680
Speaker 27: in my phone rings. It's Wayne Williams, and everybody in

1003
00:52:52,800 --> 00:52:55,560
Speaker 27: his studio is like everyone was stuck.

1004
00:52:56,840 --> 00:53:00,000
Speaker 3: From that point forward. What transpired? What it Wayne said?

1005
00:53:00,480 --> 00:53:02,200
Speaker 3: What was developing after that?

1006
00:53:03,640 --> 00:53:05,800
Speaker 2: Welcome to the real world, Neo.

1007
00:53:10,360 --> 00:53:35,920
Speaker 3: H next time on Atlanta Monster.

1008
00:53:39,960 --> 00:53:43,239
Speaker 28: So you know Wayne Williams absolutely.

1009
00:53:47,960 --> 00:53:49,360
Speaker 3: Describe Wayne to me, what's he like?

1010
00:53:52,200 --> 00:54:02,680
Speaker 31: Brilliant asshole, very intelligent asshole. That that's the best way

1011
00:54:02,719 --> 00:54:03,279
Speaker 31: I could put it.

1012
00:54:03,400 --> 00:54:06,719
Speaker 27: And I don't mean it in a bad way because

1013
00:54:06,760 --> 00:54:08,200
Speaker 27: I'm an asshole at times.

1014
00:54:12,160 --> 00:54:13,040
Speaker 2: This thing is huge.

1015
00:54:13,719 --> 00:54:16,200
Speaker 28: It's huge, and blame me.

1016
00:54:17,320 --> 00:54:20,680
Speaker 7: It was more hands than this shit to me. Stay eye.

1017
00:54:22,520 --> 00:54:29,080
Speaker 2: And we're gonna bring That was the name that the

1018
00:54:29,440 --> 00:54:31,279
Speaker 2: media giving way with you.

1019
00:54:32,520 --> 00:54:34,799
Speaker 14: They wouldn't use his name, They gave him this name,

1020
00:54:35,440 --> 00:54:36,720
Speaker 14: Atlanta Monster.

1021
00:54:41,600 --> 00:54:45,040
Speaker 5: Atlanta Monster is an investigative podcast told week by week,

1022
00:54:45,480 --> 00:54:48,680
Speaker 5: with new episodes every Friday, A joint production between How

1023
00:54:48,760 --> 00:54:53,360
Speaker 5: Stuff Works and Tenderfoot TV. Original music is by Makeup

1024
00:54:53,440 --> 00:54:57,919
Speaker 5: and Vanity Set. Audio archives courtesy of WSB News Film

1025
00:54:58,000 --> 00:55:02,680
Speaker 5: and videotape collection Brown Meat at Archives, University of Georgia Libraries.

1026
00:55:03,239 --> 00:55:05,360
Speaker 3: For the latest updates, please visit.

1027
00:55:05,239 --> 00:55:30,440
Speaker 5: Atlantamonster dot com or follow us on social media. Do

1028
00:55:30,520 --> 00:55:32,440
Speaker 5: you keep your hands on this the whole time? You

1029
00:55:32,520 --> 00:55:34,840
Speaker 5: stay like that, and where are you at? Are you

1030
00:55:34,920 --> 00:55:35,279
Speaker 5: behind me?

1031
00:55:36,920 --> 00:55:37,560
Speaker 2: You know what that does?

1032
00:55:38,160 --> 00:55:39,719
Speaker 3: No, it picks up muscle boo less.

1033
00:55:39,760 --> 00:55:40,719
Speaker 2: We didn't have that back then.

1034
00:55:41,280 --> 00:55:43,120
Speaker 15: So now you want to squeeze your tail or put

1035
00:55:43,200 --> 00:55:43,879
Speaker 15: it back in your ear.

1036
00:55:44,360 --> 00:55:47,759
Speaker 3: Oh wow, it's pretty stiff. It's not that bad.