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Speaker 1: Now here's a highlight from Coast to coast AM on iHeartRadio.

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Speaker 2: Richard Langa, before I interrupted, you were talking about abduction cases,

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Speaker 2: and you've investigated a bunch of them, and as we

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Speaker 2: noted years ago, not that long ago, move On and

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Speaker 2: other UFO organizations didn't want to touch that stuff. It

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Speaker 2: seemed too weird and out of bound. So but you've

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Speaker 2: seen the evidence. And one of the things that this

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Speaker 2: DEA program did was look for evidence of harm physical

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Speaker 2: interaction between us and them whoever they.

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Speaker 3: Are correct, Yes, that's true.

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Speaker 4: And I think one of the conclusions that was drawn

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Speaker 4: from that whole project was, yes, there have been people

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Speaker 4: that have been injured. Clearly they have been people that

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Speaker 4: have been injured, but that most of the time that

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Speaker 4: happened is where someone was basically in the right place

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Speaker 4: at the wrong time or the wrong place at the

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Speaker 4: right time, where somebody walked under a hovering craft and

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Speaker 4: you know, got exposed to electromagnetic radiation. And but essentially

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Speaker 4: that I think the conclusion was that the physical harm

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Speaker 4: that happened to people wasn't deliberately. Uh, it wasn't done

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Speaker 4: deliberate to hurt someone. It was just where someone got

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Speaker 4: too close to something and maybe got exposed to magnetic

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Speaker 4: fields or radiation.

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Speaker 3: That kind of thing.

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Speaker 2: The abductions, though, as you were saying, you you've looked

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Speaker 2: into a lot of those cases, you think some of

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Speaker 2: them are legit correct.

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Speaker 4: Well, there's there's no question they are. And as I

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Speaker 4: said before, back in the day, when we first started

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Speaker 4: doing this, it was it was very taboo. And of

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Speaker 4: course now Muffon has a whole division that does does

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Speaker 4: abduction research and works with the experiencers. But the clear

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Speaker 4: clearly that you know, I mean, in my in my

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Speaker 4: in my world.

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Speaker 3: You know, basically, I had a.

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Speaker 4: Degree aeronautics, I'm a pilot, and you know, I started

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Speaker 4: doing this research and the first couple of times that

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Speaker 4: I talked to abductees, I was I was creeped out.

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Speaker 4: I was like, there's no way you know this can

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Speaker 4: you know, I'm just like I need to get tell

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Speaker 4: out of here. You know, this person's crazy. And then

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Speaker 4: you interview another one and they tell you the same thing,

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Speaker 4: and then I mean, I just had this like visual

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Speaker 4: I had this experience one night driving home in the

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Speaker 4: middle of the night after an interviewing somebody I had

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Speaker 4: interviewed about maybe twelve people abductees and experiencers, and I'm

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Speaker 4: driving home going you know what, these guys are all

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Speaker 4: telling the truth because all the little details match up,

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Speaker 4: and everything they said is consistent of what with the

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Speaker 4: other one said.

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Speaker 3: And none of these people.

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Speaker 4: Knew each other. And if that's true, that half the

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Speaker 4: stuff I learned in college and physics isn't what we

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Speaker 4: really think it is. So you kind of go through this,

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Speaker 4: you know, change what I called it. In my books,

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Speaker 4: I've written about the change and your perception of reality

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Speaker 4: if you will, and I think you know, any good

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Speaker 4: investigator goes through that process at some point.

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Speaker 2: Eric Davis, doctor Eric Davis, the guy we both know

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Speaker 2: really well. He was with Knids, that he worked with Bass.

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Speaker 2: He went on to other classified work for different employers,

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Speaker 2: has made some startling, maybe overly broad statements in public

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Speaker 2: about Poulter guys. How Poultergeist type activity is inherent in

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Speaker 2: UFO activity. When you have a UFO encounter, chances are

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Speaker 2: pretty good you're going to have something. When he says Poultergeist,

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Speaker 2: he doesn't mean ghosts and spirits. He's comparing it like

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Speaker 2: a simile or a metaphor pultergeist type activity sometimes follows.

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Speaker 2: Not everyone obviously, but a lot of times it does.

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Speaker 2: Have you found that in.

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Speaker 4: The cases well that you know, and that's a really

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Speaker 4: that's an excellent point, George, because back in the day,

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Speaker 4: you know, the report formats that I worked on and filed.

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Speaker 4: You know, basically, we go through a process, you know,

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Speaker 4: we take the report, we go interview the witnesses, we

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Speaker 4: look at the data, you know, evaluate anything that you know,

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Speaker 4: like video or audio or fixtures or whatever, and ultimately,

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Speaker 4: when we were done, we'd file this report if you will.

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Speaker 4: And I think, you know, looking back on that going forward,

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Speaker 4: my recommendation would be, Okay, once the report's done, go

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Speaker 4: back and talk to the per since six months or

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Speaker 4: a year later and see if anything's changed in their life.

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Speaker 4: And that's exactly what I'm looking for. Is this poldergeis stuff,

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Speaker 4: you know, if you know, after this all occurred and

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Speaker 4: everything's settled down, you know, now the person's three months

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Speaker 4: way to their seeing shadow figures in the house, or

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Speaker 4: they're saying some weird you know, hearing noises or sounds

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Speaker 4: or things moving in their home that that just doesn't

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Speaker 4: make sense. But it's very I've learned, you know, again

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Speaker 4: this whole process of learning, I've learned that that.

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Speaker 3: Does that does happen.

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Speaker 4: And back in the day, we really didn't go back

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Speaker 4: and look at that like we do now.

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Speaker 2: If that makes sense, you know, it's hard to explain

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Speaker 2: why it can possibly happen that way. But that that

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Speaker 2: paper you're referring to, this white paper by Eric Davis

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Speaker 2: and Josh Ballet, goes into the details. It sort of

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Speaker 2: established as a six layer model for what reality is

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Speaker 2: all about. That explains how those things could be interconnected.

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Speaker 2: And I got to tell you, when I read that paper,

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Speaker 2: I'm sure you had the same react it. It changes

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Speaker 2: you on a fundamental level when you realize that your

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Speaker 2: idea of reality isn't the way it really is.

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Speaker 4: Well, yeah, yes, George, there was a couple of things

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Speaker 4: that really jumped out at me, you know when I

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Speaker 4: quite initially looked at that paper. You know they talk

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Speaker 4: about the physical stuff. You know that basically when it lands,

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Speaker 4: it makes marks on the ground. You know, you can

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Speaker 4: take pictures of it, it shows up on radar, it'll

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Speaker 4: leave you know, residue traces, you can calculate the velocity

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Speaker 4: and all that. The basic stuff that you know happens,

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Speaker 4: you know with you know, the basic, easy to understand

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Speaker 4: physical stuff. But then they talk about the anti physical

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Speaker 4: stuff and that's where you know, it gets weird. It's

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Speaker 4: like some of the things are like the observation of

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Speaker 4: an entity or an object that can pass through solid

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Speaker 4: walls or through a metal fence low density, an object

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Speaker 4: that appears to be plummeting into the solid ground where

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Speaker 4: it's you know, like an object will go right into

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Speaker 4: the ground, like a rock slips into the water without

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Speaker 4: making any kind of a crash or an impact. Objects

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Speaker 4: that you know, they'll be like shrinking in size, growing large,

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Speaker 4: or changing shapes, or two or three different objects, like

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Speaker 4: you know, there'll be three or four orbs and they'll

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Speaker 4: all converge into one thing.

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Speaker 3: They'll disappear, reappear.

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Speaker 4: The you know, the things that they've Sometimes they won't

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Speaker 4: show up on radar. I've been involved in cases where

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Speaker 4: you've got three people in a craft is in close

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Speaker 4: proximity and they look up and they can see the craft,

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Speaker 4: but they've got a camera with a little video screen

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Speaker 4: on the side. They point the camera at it and

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Speaker 4: it doesn't show up. You can see it with your

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Speaker 4: eyes and it doesn't show up on the camera.

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Speaker 3: That kind of stuff.

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Speaker 2: You know, it's it's hard enough to get your head

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Speaker 2: around UFOs as nuts and bolt craft from some other

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Speaker 2: planet or some other reality. You know, it takes a

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Speaker 2: long time to Okay, maybe that's real, because we see them,

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Speaker 2: they show up on camera, they show up on radar,

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Speaker 2: then they're gone. That's one thing. But to suggest that

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Speaker 2: they're a manifestation of a larger reality that we do

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Speaker 2: not understand, and whoever the intelligence is, whatever the intelligence is,

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Speaker 2: mixes in these high strange things to really confound us,

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Speaker 2: but also to get our attention, similar to what's happened

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Speaker 2: for so many years at Skinwalker Ranch. You didn't get there,

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Speaker 2: but you do get that point.

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Speaker 4: Absolutely, No, I am. You know, when I was working

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Speaker 4: on a project, I was really busy, and I think

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Speaker 4: if I had have asked them if I could have

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Speaker 4: gone go there, they would have let me go. Although

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Speaker 4: in some of the people would have been there and

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Speaker 4: having the Poldergeist stuff in their house, I'm not so

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Speaker 4: sure that that's you know, it might have been better

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Speaker 4: to have not gone there.

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Speaker 3: But there's some very you know, there's some very weird.

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Speaker 4: Things going on there, And to be honest with you,

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Speaker 4: you remember the first book that you and Colin wrote

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Speaker 4: about the Skinwalker Ranch. I had not read that book

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Speaker 4: when I worked on project, and I read that book

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Speaker 4: after I worked on the project. Oh boy, if i'd

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Speaker 4: have read that book before I knew you guys, I

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Speaker 4: wouldn't have believed half of it. But obviously, getting to

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Speaker 4: know you guys and understand the kind of research that

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Speaker 4: we were doing there, I'm sure everything that you said

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Speaker 4: in your book is true, but it's there's a lot

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Speaker 4: of crazy stuff there.

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Speaker 2: Yeah, it's hard to get your head around it. And

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Speaker 2: you know, we've talked about it on this show and

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Speaker 2: with other guests. Kenneth Arnold, who started the modern UFO

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Speaker 2: Wave in nineteen forty seven his sighting of these nine

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Speaker 2: objects in Washington State, he had poltergeist type stuff in

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Speaker 2: his house for the rest of his life. He didn't

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Speaker 2: really talk about it during his life, but that's true.

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Speaker 2: He did have you read.

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Speaker 3: About it, yes, and that's true.

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Speaker 4: As I indicated though in a lot of the research

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Speaker 4: that we did, we never we weren't really looking at

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Speaker 4: that now, you know, to go back, you know, after

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Speaker 4: the case is done, six months of years later, go

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Speaker 4: back and to the person and it'd be really interesting

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Speaker 4: to see what kind of things have changed.

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Speaker 3: In their life.

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Speaker 2: Yeah, you know, the folks who went to Skinwalker, there

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Speaker 2: were five intelligence officers that I know of who went there,

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Speaker 2: had experiences, and then they took something home with him.

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Speaker 2: And you know, one of the guys was Jay Stratton,

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Speaker 2: who he's working on a book. It's going to be

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Speaker 2: coming out hopefully this year. He's given hints about it.

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Speaker 2: We had a pseudonym that was used for the people

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Speaker 2: that were on the ranch who work for intel agencies,

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Speaker 2: and they took stuff home that stayed with him for years,

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Speaker 2: which is it's a life changing experience in some cases.

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Speaker 4: Yeah, I remember reading one of them. The lady was

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Speaker 4: in her house up in Northern Virginia townhous and a

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Speaker 4: wine bottle comes out of the rack and comes flying

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Speaker 4: across the room right smashed up against the wall.

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Speaker 3: I mean, it's just like wow.

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Speaker 4: You know, in these people like these are like highly

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Speaker 4: skilled special forces offer raiders.

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Speaker 3: They don't make stuff like this up, you know what

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Speaker 3: I'm saying.

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Speaker 2: Right, there was a case, a very strange sequence of

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Speaker 2: events in southern California at a ranch it's not skinwalker,

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Speaker 2: but skinwalker ish. I just don't know if that rings

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Speaker 2: a bell with you, whether that's one that you worked

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Speaker 2: on or not.

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Speaker 4: Well, let me ask you, was a member of Congress

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Speaker 4: to the owner.

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Speaker 3: Of the ranch.

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Speaker 2: You know, I don't want to get into that.

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Speaker 3: That's why I don't want to go there. But that's

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Speaker 3: the one I'm thinking about.

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Speaker 2: Well, we'll talk about that some other time.

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Speaker 3: Yeah, So.

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Speaker 2: Are you confident based on what you're seeing that's unfolding

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Speaker 2: in Washington with all this new enthusiasm and whistleblowers coming

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Speaker 2: forward and members of Congress saying that they're interested and

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Speaker 2: want to get to the bottom of it. Trump's proclamations

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Speaker 2: we're going to declassify and open up the files. Are

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Speaker 2: you confident that something really is about to happen.

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Speaker 4: Well, I can say it this way. You know, I've

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Speaker 4: been doing this for thirty years, and I'm seeing more

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Speaker 4: stuff happening coming out of the closet, if you will,

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Speaker 4: in the last year than there has in the last

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Speaker 4: twenty years. So yeah, I think there's a lot going

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Speaker 4: on with you know, with the National Defense Authorization Act

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Speaker 4: where they gave immunity to people that can come forward

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Speaker 4: and testify in Congress. You know, so you're you're dealing

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Speaker 4: with uh, you know, uh aggression. Some of these other guys,

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Speaker 4: Lou Alizondo, you know, they've been pretty pretty blatant about

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Speaker 4: talking to people in Congress about what's going on. And yeah,

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Speaker 4: I mean, I think the immunity gives it really opened

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Speaker 4: the door because a lot of these people that were

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Speaker 4: under certain constraints as far as national security agreements, they've

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Speaker 4: gotten some some some relief in terms of being able

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Speaker 4: to talk to Congress, which I think is a big,

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Speaker 4: a big deal, a really big thing.

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Speaker 2: I hope, I hope it continues. I hope that Trump

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Speaker 2: is able to live up to his promise about opening

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Speaker 2: this stuff. I've just, you know, after being at it

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Speaker 2: for a long time, I've heard these kind of promises before.

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Speaker 2: You're right, We've had more progress in the last six

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Speaker 2: seven years that I've seen in the previous thirty. Absolutely,

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Speaker 2: you know, I guess I'd like to think that more

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Speaker 2: whistleblowers will come forward and that the disclosure is around

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Speaker 2: the corner. I just don't know how they explain it

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Speaker 2: to the public. How do you explain to the general

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Speaker 2: public the nature of reality that you've grown up believing

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Speaker 2: is true and accurate, the chair that you're sitting on

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Speaker 2: is real and physical. All that throw it out the window. Disclosure, right,

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Speaker 2: disclosure sounds great, but disclosing what.

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Speaker 4: Well again, you know, I think there's a lot of

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Speaker 4: political implications in that too, and people are you know,

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Speaker 4: a lot of people said, well, you know, they've kept

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Speaker 4: a secret because the public can't handle and that's not true.

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Speaker 4: I think a big part of the secret has to

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Speaker 4: do with technology that's been developed behind closed doors under

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Speaker 4: RUBB you know, in black operations, and you know some

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Speaker 4: of the defense contractors and other these technology corporations have

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Speaker 4: you know, over the years, they've been in my book,

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Speaker 4: i wrote the history Less than It basically since Truman's time.

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Speaker 4: You know, when they recover these crashes they were they

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Speaker 4: turned them over to private companies that would do research

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Speaker 4: and back engineering, and that started out in a good way.

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Speaker 4: But you know, when Eilanhower left office, he said beware

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Speaker 4: of the military industrial complex. And that's what he was

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Speaker 4: talking about, because these guys were all going renegade on

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Speaker 4: the government and they're just doing their own thing and

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Speaker 4: not telling the government what's going on anymore. So fast

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Speaker 4: forward fifty years and you've got this unbelievable technology that's developed,

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Speaker 4: billions and billions of dollars made on it, and you know,

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Speaker 4: with free energy and you know, anti gravity, you know,

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Speaker 4: transportation that they're not ready to hand that over yet.

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Speaker 4: And I think a lot of it's just physically, you know,

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Speaker 4: it's financial. You know, these companies, you know, we're going

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Speaker 4: to have to at some point fess up that what's

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Speaker 4: been going on, and there might be some consequences to

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Speaker 4: that that they're not in any to get involved in.

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Speaker 2: That's my thought on I mean the technology, if you

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Speaker 2: make a breakthrough, it's worth unbelievable amounts of money, trillions.

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Speaker 2: Maybe you know, an anti gravity device or to do

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Speaker 2: what we've seen UFOs do to bend space time, that

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Speaker 2: would be worth a lot of money. So if I

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Speaker 2: had that tech, I wouldn't be so quick, probably if

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Speaker 2: I had a publicly traded company to give it up.

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Speaker 2: But there is a place, it seems in DC by

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Speaker 2: these tech guys, to look, if you lockheeds of the

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Speaker 2: world and these aerospace giants, if you haven't made any

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Speaker 2: progress in seventy five plus years, let us take a

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Speaker 2: crack at it. I think that might be underway.

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Speaker 3: Well, I think that.

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Speaker 4: You know, the reality is when you look at the

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Speaker 4: when you look at these case reports over the years,

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Speaker 4: there's always been this type of a craft. It's like

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Speaker 4: a triangle craft. I mean I can see it clearly.

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Speaker 4: A picture in my mind is basically a triangle craft

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Speaker 4: with white lights in each corner, red light in the middle.

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Speaker 4: And I think most of us that have been doing

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Speaker 4: this research for a long time know that those are

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Speaker 4: human made craft. I think not to mention a names

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Speaker 4: by Locke Martin, I think is one of the companies

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Speaker 4: that has made them and manufactured them and testify them

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Speaker 4: all over the place. So yeah, I mean anti gravity

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Speaker 4: transportation has been protected. I mean, it's been perfected for

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Speaker 4: fifteen years at least, you know, and a.

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Speaker 2: Lockey gets beat up a lot. And we've taken some

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Speaker 2: shots out of this program and in news stories I've

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Speaker 2: done about secrecy on this topic and things of that sort.

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Speaker 4: But we know, as long as they're not taking shots

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Speaker 4: back at year, you're good, you know.

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Speaker 2: No, I mean they were. We now know they were

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Speaker 2: willing to hand over some of the special material to

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Speaker 2: Bass that I remember the reason bass was created. I

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Speaker 2: mean Big Oel has spent a million dollars to retrofit

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Speaker 2: one of his error space buildings to receive that material.

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Speaker 2: And they stepped in.

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Speaker 3: Yeah.

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Speaker 2: Yeah, it was an Intel agency that stepped in and

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Speaker 2: stopped that transfer from happening. Otherwise we might know a

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Speaker 2: lot more about it by now. So Keyt is not

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Speaker 2: always the bad guy, I think.

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Speaker 4: No, I'm not saying they're bad. I'm just saying that

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Speaker 4: they they've got a lot of technology, and I think

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Speaker 4: they're probably in between a rock and a hard place too,

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Speaker 4: because you know, at some point, you know, it's all

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Speaker 4: going to come out and they're going to have to

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Speaker 4: be able to do some damage control and manage how

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Speaker 4: that happens. And you know, but I mean, George, there's

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Speaker 4: some some some of this technology is like, you know,

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Speaker 4: there was one of the things in the paper and.

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Speaker 3: I've seen it in reports.

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Speaker 4: It's called topographical inversion or space dilation. And and what

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Speaker 4: people will do is they'll say, you know, there was

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Speaker 4: this craft and.

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Speaker 3: It was like maybe the size.

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Speaker 4: Of a small school bus. But when when I went

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Speaker 4: inside it, it was like stepping inside a football stadium,

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Speaker 4: you know, where where the exterior size and the interior

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Speaker 4: size is different and and some of that stuff.

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Speaker 3: It's just mind blowing.

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Speaker 4: I was told that that Gresh had done a presentation

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Speaker 4: of some Wall Street people up in New York, uh,

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Speaker 4: just very rely, and there was a picture of a

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Speaker 4: forty foot you know, saucer type crap and they were

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Speaker 4: basically told that when you get went inside this, it

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Speaker 4: was like stepping inside of football stadium.

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Speaker 2: Heard that from witnesses many times over the years.

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