Speaker 1: What's up everybody, Welcome back to the podcast. Thank you
Speaker 1: for being here. I answer your questions podcast at grangersmith
Speaker 1: dot com, and you could ask me anything you want.
Speaker 1: That's the format of this podcast. That's a way it's
Speaker 1: been for a long time. And so I want to
Speaker 1: tell you that I think about this often before I
Speaker 1: start a podcast, that I don't have any notes. I'm
Speaker 1: not prepared with a bunch of like fancy quotes or
Speaker 1: book recommendations or cross references, and I don't think the
Speaker 1: podcast should be that way. I think it's better if
Speaker 1: I hear a question from you about whatever is going
Speaker 1: on in your life, and I answer it like I
Speaker 1: would if we were close friends riding side by side
Speaker 1: in a pickup truck on a back road. I think
Speaker 1: that way, and I say that to say that you
Speaker 1: know that that means I'm not always right about things,
Speaker 1: but it's more so that we all think together. We
Speaker 1: think through these often. These questions are really difficult life situations,
Speaker 1: and so we should think of them because I you know,
Speaker 1: think about all the people that don't ask a question,
Speaker 1: They just listen, and everyone's got something going on, you know,
Speaker 1: everyone's got some kind of problem and so for all
Speaker 1: of those people that don't ask a question, we're learning
Speaker 1: how to think through them right once again. The email
Speaker 1: is podcast at grangersmith dot com. First question comes from
Speaker 1: Kayley and this says this, Hey granger, I have sort
Speaker 1: of a multi question email for you. My husband and
Speaker 1: I have two children, ages seven and nine, and our
Speaker 1: nine year old is autistic. He doesn't speak and struggles
Speaker 1: with being very hyperactive. He can get very disregulated in
Speaker 1: unfamiliar environments. We do not attend church due to it
Speaker 1: being very difficult to have him sitting or basically going
Speaker 1: into overdrive in an open space where there are lots
Speaker 1: of things to touch or to look at. He is
Speaker 1: also in a looper in other words, he could run
Speaker 1: away and put himself in danger. Having a child with
Speaker 1: special needs can be very isolating, and while I know
Speaker 1: God knows my heart, I crave being a part of
Speaker 1: a community and I think it's a big missing piece
Speaker 1: of our life as a family. I guess my question
Speaker 1: is should we try and find a church that can
Speaker 1: accommodate children in general, but specifically that has a special
Speaker 1: needs program? But also, what are your thoughts on having
Speaker 1: special needs programs for children that separate them from their
Speaker 1: parents during services. I know some churches do not agree
Speaker 1: with that concept. I appreciate your feedback and opinion. Thank you, Kaylee.
Speaker 1: All right, Kaylee, Well, thank you for for trusting me.
Speaker 1: Trusting me in this podcast was something that's probably so
Speaker 1: you know, the forefront of your mind all the time
Speaker 1: and so sensitive of a subject. So thank you for
Speaker 1: trusting me with that. And I think we could kind
Speaker 1: of approach this from a few different ways. One something
Speaker 1: that stuck out to me the first time I read
Speaker 1: it just now was you said having a special needs
Speaker 1: child could be very isolating. And while I know I
Speaker 1: know God knows my heart, I crave being a part
Speaker 1: of a community. I don't necessarily know what you mean
Speaker 1: by saying God knows my heart, but I've craved been
Speaker 1: part of a community. You probably mean God knows that
Speaker 1: I want to be in church even though i'm not,
Speaker 1: and he has grace that i'm not. I think that's
Speaker 1: what you mean, and I understand, I understand that. But
Speaker 1: but what's more interesting about that thought is that you
Speaker 1: crave to be part of a community, and that is
Speaker 1: this is a craving that humans have always had. You
Speaker 1: don't have to be a Christian. To have that craving,
Speaker 1: you just have to be a human. And that is
Speaker 1: because we're made in God's image and we were made
Speaker 1: with a need. We we were you know, we were
Speaker 1: created with certain desires, right, and one of those desires
Speaker 1: we are created to have is to seek to crave
Speaker 1: other people around us. And there are many reasons. I'm
Speaker 1: not going to ask, I'm not going to act like
Speaker 1: I know all the reasons, but one of the clear
Speaker 1: reasons is our gifts that were given to us different
Speaker 1: from other people. Certain people have certain gifts, other people
Speaker 1: have other gifts. In the Bible, it talks about members
Speaker 1: of a body like an eye, how obviously has a
Speaker 1: different function than a hand, and a hand as a
Speaker 1: different function than an ear, or a nose or a foot.
Speaker 1: And it's the same with us. Right. If you look
Speaker 1: around any community, any city, or town, or neighborhood or
Speaker 1: even family, everyone has they bring something different to the table.
Speaker 1: Everyone does. And the Church is supposed to be like that.
Speaker 1: It's made up the body, which is the Church. The
Speaker 1: head is Christ. That's the symbolism given in the Bible.
Speaker 1: The head is Christ and the body is the Church,
Speaker 1: and the Church is the gathering of people. That's what
Speaker 1: that word church, that the roots of that word mean,
Speaker 1: that means gathering. And so if we think of ourselves
Speaker 1: as the body with different members functioning differently, then we
Speaker 1: really needed each other to function as a is a
Speaker 1: functioning body, you know, like if we were missing eyes,
Speaker 1: we wouldn't be a good body. If we were missing ears,
Speaker 1: or if we're missing hands, we wouldn't be the church
Speaker 1: as it's supposed to be, as it's intended to be.
Speaker 1: And why did I say that, Well, the reason I'm
Speaker 1: saying that is because we all are given different gifts.
Speaker 1: Those gifts that God gave us are only activated, are
Speaker 1: used in the context of the gathering. Like an eye
Speaker 1: is no good by itself, and an eye that sees
Speaker 1: benefits the body, but to itself it's nothing. A hand
Speaker 1: is nothing by itself unless it's benefiting the body. You
Speaker 1: see what I mean. And so these gifts spiritual gifts,
Speaker 1: you can call them physical gifts. The different attributes, the
Speaker 1: characteristics that God has gifted us with are seen and
Speaker 1: used in the context of the body. For instance, most
Speaker 1: of my life have been a singer. Now as a singer,
Speaker 1: the gift that God gave me to sing. Now, whether
Speaker 1: whether I'm good or not, that's irrelevant. The gift that
Speaker 1: God gave me to sing means nothing by myself. If
Speaker 1: I'm isolated and it's stuck in a room my whole life,
Speaker 1: then I don't get to share my gift. My singing
Speaker 1: only influences me so much before it's meant to influence, encourage,
Speaker 1: lift up others. And it's the same with every gift.
Speaker 1: So that's why you crave to be part of the community,
Speaker 1: because not only do you crave without being able to
Speaker 1: say it, using your gifts in the church, but you
Speaker 1: also crave the other people's gifts given to you. So
Speaker 1: you are like a hand saying I just wish I
Speaker 1: had an eye and a nose, and an ear, and
Speaker 1: the the ear and the and the nose and the
Speaker 1: and the eye, say I wish we had a hand.
Speaker 1: And it all comes together when the church, the gathering,
Speaker 1: does what it does, and that is gather. So think
Speaker 1: about that. Let's start with the conversation with that idea
Speaker 1: that yes, you crave being a part of community. Then
Speaker 1: that's not just a unique something, that something that's unique
Speaker 1: to you. That's because you're made in the image of
Speaker 1: God and you're you crave to gather with the body. Okay,
Speaker 1: So so then let's put that on top of let's
Speaker 1: use that lens and think about your autot son. Is
Speaker 1: his son? Yes, son. I'm trying to say this as
Speaker 1: easy as I can. But the problem, the problem that
Speaker 1: you're dealing with really okay, let me just say it plainly.
Speaker 1: The problem you're dealing with is you haven't found a
Speaker 1: healthy church yet. Because because a healthy church, and once again,
Speaker 1: don't think of it as a building. Don't think of
Speaker 1: church when I say that as a denominational building with
Speaker 1: bricks and mortar. When I use that word, think of
Speaker 1: it every time as the body, the gathering of people.
Speaker 1: You haven't you haven't been part of a healthy body
Speaker 1: of the gathering of people yet, because you could make
Speaker 1: these kind of decisions with them, and they would come
Speaker 1: together with your autistic son and help you. And I
Speaker 1: don't think right, I know, I know they don't have
Speaker 1: to be qualified in special needs children, and I think
Speaker 1: they would move the direction if you were part of
Speaker 1: that body, They would move the inento the direction of
Speaker 1: learning how to better serve you and your autistic son
Speaker 1: in your family. But right off the bat, you wouldn't
Speaker 1: say I should go find a church that has a
Speaker 1: special needs program. Instead, you would say, I'm going to
Speaker 1: go find a church that preaches the Gospel clearly and
Speaker 1: applies it for the body of people. Because if a
Speaker 1: church is doing that, they're preaching a clear gospel, I'm unashamed, boldly,
Speaker 1: with humility and love. When they're doing that, then that
Speaker 1: fulfills all the requirements you're going to need for your son.
Speaker 1: You see what I mean, Because if you go to
Speaker 1: a church the opposite, if you go to a church
Speaker 1: that has a very good doctorate driven special needs program,
Speaker 1: but they're not preaching the Gospel, then they're actually killing
Speaker 1: you and your son. And I've said it before on
Speaker 1: this podcasts. It's like a little drop of cyanide poisoning
Speaker 1: that you're putting into your drink every time you go
Speaker 1: to a church that's not feeding you the Word of
Speaker 1: God through the preaching. I mean, that's that is the
Speaker 1: number one thing in a church. Everything else is secondary,
Speaker 1: and that is preaching the Word of God. And I'm
Speaker 1: not talking about preaching the needs of man or families
Speaker 1: or marriages. I'm talking about preaching what the word says
Speaker 1: and applying it to you in your life. If you're
Speaker 1: not getting that, then you're not growing in your knowledge
Speaker 1: of God. If you're not, If you're not growing in
Speaker 1: your knowledge of God, then then you're growing in something else,
Speaker 1: and that's usually fear, anxiety, hopelessness. Those things of the
Speaker 1: world start growing in you. So all that to say,
Speaker 1: you say, should we try to find the church that
Speaker 1: ad that can accommodate special needs children? Basically you're saying
Speaker 1: I say no, you find a healthy church that preaches
Speaker 1: the gospel, that loves you, that loves your family, that
Speaker 1: loves your son, and welcomes you in like the body's
Speaker 1: supposed to. And they will say, Kaylee, we're going to
Speaker 1: love your son. We're going to find ways that we
Speaker 1: could we could serve you and your family. Well, now
Speaker 1: there's one last little question here that you asked, and
Speaker 1: that is what are your thoughts on having a special
Speaker 1: needs program that separates the children from the parents during
Speaker 1: the services. I think that gets worked out with the
Speaker 1: healthy church. So I'm not going to stand on either
Speaker 1: side of the fence saying children absolutely should be in
Speaker 1: the services. I think they're welcome to be in the services.
Speaker 1: I think I think having children in the services is
Speaker 1: a very beautiful thing. Having babies crying in a service
Speaker 1: is actually a beautiful thing because it's a it's a
Speaker 1: sign that the soil is fertile in the church, you know,
Speaker 1: and and it's growing and it's healthy. That's that's a
Speaker 1: great fruit of a healthy church is there's babies, you know.
Speaker 1: And so I'm not going to say that children shouldn't
Speaker 1: be in the service. They're a distraction. But at the
Speaker 1: same time, if you have a special needs son that
Speaker 1: just actually physically just can't sit there, then then we
Speaker 1: don't want to push that too far, and we want
Speaker 1: to say, yeah, then he needs to he needs to
Speaker 1: have his needs met and he needs to be growing
Speaker 1: in the church in another way. And so if he
Speaker 1: needs to leave the service with with a group or
Speaker 1: with someone that could teach him in another way, and
Speaker 1: I say, okay, I don't have a problem with that,
Speaker 1: as long as the church is a family. And sometimes
Speaker 1: that just means it can't be too big. Because if
Speaker 1: a church is way too big, and if a church
Speaker 1: has a special needs program, they're probably too big. You
Speaker 1: could say that too. That's an all that's a red flag.
Speaker 1: If a church is too big to be able to
Speaker 1: accommodate personally, then I think I think that's also a problem.
Speaker 1: We can probably talk about this for an hour, but
Speaker 1: I think I've given you enough of my opinion on this.
Speaker 1: Next question comes from Christine. It says, hey, grandeur Christine here,
Speaker 1: I'm twenty years old and I'm a believer. I have
Speaker 1: a friend who's twenty one and she's been married for
Speaker 1: a year and a half now, and they're really struggling.
Speaker 1: She's a Christian, but since they've been married, her husband
Speaker 1: doesn't want anything to do with God and basically just
Speaker 1: uses her for her body. He's winning an open relationship
Speaker 1: and she's not open to that. She's almost to the
Speaker 1: end of her rope and doesn't know what to do.
Speaker 1: I know that she has guy best friends that she
Speaker 1: messages with I ask and she also asks them for advice,
Speaker 1: and she asked me for advice as well. I'm not married,
Speaker 1: but I'm probably not the best person to ask for advice.
Speaker 1: So what advice do you have and what would you
Speaker 1: tell her or encourage her with? And what should I
Speaker 1: tell her? Thank you for answering PS. She tells me
Speaker 1: ninety seven percent of the details about her marriage, and
Speaker 1: she doesn't have a whole lot of friends, and he
Speaker 1: has quite a few drinking buddies. I think I got
Speaker 1: the situation. Christine. Thanks for thanks for opening up with
Speaker 1: this and bringing your friend, and know that this is
Speaker 1: going to be difficult for both of y'all, especially her.
Speaker 1: So the last few years of doing this podcast, I
Speaker 1: worry and you guys could you guys could let me
Speaker 1: know by commenting. But which is in fact might be
Speaker 1: a good point to make right now. If you want
Speaker 1: to comment on something I'm saying, or double down on
Speaker 1: something I'm saying, go to the YouTube version of this
Speaker 1: and you could be listening anywhere, but go to the
Speaker 1: go to YouTube on you can just google or YouTube
Speaker 1: Granger Smith podcast and go to this episode and then
Speaker 1: go comment below your thoughts. You could do that on
Speaker 1: any episode and I'll check those out, and that way
Speaker 1: we could have also have a dialogue that way. But
Speaker 1: there is a theme that that it's been like a
Speaker 1: thread just kind of threading its way through these last
Speaker 1: few years, and that is this the lack of a good,
Speaker 1: healthy local church is so commonly the root of many problems.
Speaker 1: I said it on the last that was part of
Speaker 1: the last answer. It's part of this answer. I don't
Speaker 1: have it read the next question yet, but it's probably
Speaker 1: part of the next question as well. I hope, and
Speaker 1: really my hope for this this podcast is that And
Speaker 1: I understand that not everyone's a Christian that listens, and
Speaker 1: I completely get that, and this isn't a Christian only podcast,
Speaker 1: but I do hope that people they start to hear
Speaker 1: me repeating things and it starts to sink in, like
Speaker 1: like roots getting deeper and deeper into the soil. Really,
Speaker 1: that's that's part of the hope for this. And so
Speaker 1: when you say talking about your friend, you say she's
Speaker 1: a Christian, and then you go into this big exposition
Speaker 1: of why she's having huge problems. My mind, I always
Speaker 1: wonder where's the pastor like, where where's her church? Where
Speaker 1: are her sisters, who's taking her to lunch, who's taking
Speaker 1: her to Bible study and walking through these things with her,
Speaker 1: Who's counseling her, Who's who's encouraging her, Who's who's crying
Speaker 1: with her, Who's saying coming over to my house, honey,
Speaker 1: come to my house and sleep on our couch as
Speaker 1: long as you want. While he's your husband's off doing this,
Speaker 1: who's doing that? Because that's once again, just like the
Speaker 1: last question, that's how a good church should be, functioning
Speaker 1: like a family gathering of the body of believers. Okay,
Speaker 1: so that's right off the bat. Let's go there. We're
Speaker 1: gonna I'm gonna say a couple of things. He wants
Speaker 1: an open relationship. That's adultery. That's grounds for divorce in
Speaker 1: the Bible. An open relationship is adultery. I don't I
Speaker 1: don't know, there's there's not a that might be like
Speaker 1: a nice way an open relationship might be like a
Speaker 1: nice way of saying he wants to cheat on you,
Speaker 1: you know, which is weird to me. He says, hey, babe,
Speaker 1: I want to cheat on you. Is that cool? And
Speaker 1: she's like, no, I'm not open to that. That. See,
Speaker 1: when you change the word, it just gets way more
Speaker 1: intense and you kind of reveal. It's kind of like
Speaker 1: flipping the lights on in an old motel room and
Speaker 1: all the cockroaches start running everywhere. You don't see the
Speaker 1: cockroaches in the dark, and you flip on the light
Speaker 1: and you see them running everywhere. That's what happens when
Speaker 1: you change that word. Open relationship to adultery. She's not
Speaker 1: open to that. I wonder why, of course she's not
Speaker 1: open to that. And then you say she's at the
Speaker 1: end of a rope and doesn't know what to do. Yeah,
Speaker 1: I could, of course. She's twenty one years old. She
Speaker 1: has a husband that just doesn't want anything to do
Speaker 1: with God, wants to use her for her body. She's
Speaker 1: not really down for that. And now he's asking to
Speaker 1: cheat on her. If she's cool with that, and she's
Speaker 1: not part of the part of the problem, if it's
Speaker 1: not a problem yet, is the sentence she said you
Speaker 1: said she has a bunch of best friends that are
Speaker 1: got is that she messages and gets advice from. Not cool.
Speaker 1: That's that's not gonna that's not gonna fix anything. That's
Speaker 1: not gonna help anything. It can only make it worse.
Speaker 1: Seeking counsel from best friends that are guys. When you're
Speaker 1: married and you're talking about your husband and you're trying
Speaker 1: to get advice from them, and your husband's asking you
Speaker 1: to cheat on you, and meanwhile you're messaging these guys
Speaker 1: saying what should I do? That's going to lead to
Speaker 1: something worse, and you don't want to do that. I
Speaker 1: think I think you understand what I'm talking about here.
Speaker 1: That's nothing good can come out of it, can come
Speaker 1: out of that. And so so what do you do
Speaker 1: she is I would counsel her to first be in
Speaker 1: a local church, to seek the counsel from the sisters
Speaker 1: there and the pastor's plural, because the same problem is
Speaker 1: created if you're in a church and you're seeking private
Speaker 1: counsel from one pastor. That should never happen. A woman
Speaker 1: would never seek counsel alone with a pastor, much less
Speaker 1: of a guy friend. But that includes pastors. So hey,
Speaker 1: make let's let's make that aware as well. She's having
Speaker 1: problem with with her marriage, she's not gonna it's not
Speaker 1: going to fix anything by going to a local church
Speaker 1: and sitting privately with a pastor that's a male. That's
Speaker 1: not gonna work. So plural, you know, a plurality of elders,
Speaker 1: she's gonna sit with them two or more. Uh, and
Speaker 1: with women, she's gonna sit with women, and she's gonna
Speaker 1: she's been going to coffee with these, with these ladies.
Speaker 1: And probably I don't I don't know, that's my advice. Well,
Speaker 1: you could end it there, but probably what would happen
Speaker 1: if she does that is they're going to take her
Speaker 1: out for coffee and they're gonna be like, hey, you
Speaker 1: need to you need to be separated, because if he's
Speaker 1: asking for an open relationship, he's probably already cheating on you.
Speaker 1: We need to separate you and you guys need to
Speaker 1: have some biblical counseling together, some marriage counseling, and I
Speaker 1: would imagine you kick the can a little bit further.
Speaker 1: That's going to open up bigger problems. But you don't
Speaker 1: know what those problems are until you separate and you
Speaker 1: find a local church, you seek wise counsel in the church.
Speaker 1: That's probably that's the end of my advice. Then it's
Speaker 1: probably going to lead to separating, and then after separating,
Speaker 1: then you're gonna be going to counseling together probably and
Speaker 1: then that's probably going to turn on more lights with
Speaker 1: more cockroaches running everywhere. But this is where this is
Speaker 1: where it starts. So you can't take the last step.
Speaker 1: You got to take the first step. So it's a
Speaker 1: tough situation. But if she's claiming to be a Christian,
Speaker 1: she has to be involved with this local church. She
Speaker 1: has to There is no advice that comes in front
Speaker 1: of that one, because through the low Church will also
Speaker 1: be seeking God herself. She'll be she'll be seeking the
Speaker 1: Lord through his word in the Bible. Her spiritual disciplines
Speaker 1: will increase. We could start with that and tell her
Speaker 1: to do that stuff. But if she's outside of the body,
Speaker 1: you remember what I said in that last question, then
Speaker 1: she's just an eye without an ear. She's an ear
Speaker 1: without a hand, a hand without a nose. She can't
Speaker 1: do it. She's not made to be alone, and she
Speaker 1: can't do this alone. The Bible would say you can't
Speaker 1: do it alone, just like the first question when she said,
Speaker 1: I don't know what it is by a crave to
Speaker 1: be part of the community. That's part of the reason
Speaker 1: is when when trouble happens, when suffering and affliction in
Speaker 1: the world brings troubling, troubling things to you, the community
Speaker 1: is is how you're fortified. Right, that's the foundation that
Speaker 1: you You want to be in this community to stand
Speaker 1: on the foundation of faith of the community believers, and
Speaker 1: you're fortified to move forward in the suffering. Hey, if
Speaker 1: you want to get a hold of me, go to
Speaker 1: cameo dot com. Slash Grangersmith at is cameeo dot com
Speaker 1: slash granger Smith. And what that allows you to do
Speaker 1: is I can make you a video message according to
Speaker 1: whatever you want me to say. It could be happy birthday,
Speaker 1: happy anniversary, a word of encouragement, even at prayer request.
Speaker 1: And I love these. They come straight to my phone.
Speaker 1: I pull out my phone, I pull out my selfie
Speaker 1: camera and I begin to send you a message according
Speaker 1: to what you want me to say. This is great,
Speaker 1: especially with the holidays coming. To get someone a gift
Speaker 1: that you just don't know what to give them, well,
Speaker 1: get them a video message from me at cameo dot
Speaker 1: com slash Grangersmith. Okay, if you have a question for me,
Speaker 1: email podcast at grangersmith dot com. There is no limit
Speaker 1: to what you could ask about it subject could be anything.
Speaker 1: We'll find out what this next one is. It comes
Speaker 1: from Jake and it says, Hey, Grainger, thank you for
Speaker 1: the podcast. I've been listening for a while now. I've
Speaker 1: picked up on some things you've mentioned about fame, the
Speaker 1: music industry, and pride, and I've been mulling over what
Speaker 1: to say for some time now. And I heard the
Speaker 1: episode called I Left Music because it was a sin
Speaker 1: which prompted my response below. I'm a local artist. In
Speaker 1: order to get anywhere with my music, I've got to
Speaker 1: promote myself. It's always felt weird, and your words have
Speaker 1: convicted me to have to make a decision. Now I've
Speaker 1: sought wisdom from my pastor and another local pastor that
Speaker 1: I look up to. My challenge to your thoughts slash
Speaker 1: stance is this, how then, is anyone to put up
Speaker 1: music for God and other people, for other people to
Speaker 1: be able to enjoy, listen, and worship belong with it.
Speaker 1: It facilitates worship by creating new songs about or to God.
Speaker 1: So someone has to do it right. How can the
Speaker 1: music get to people without being promoted and the artist
Speaker 1: becoming famous. I know that God always uses as people,
Speaker 1: though they are not one hundred percent correct one hundred
Speaker 1: percent correct. So in this situation where yes, there is
Speaker 1: pride at the root of it, and people people that
Speaker 1: you could could idolize you for the sake of bringing
Speaker 1: music to people for the worship of God, we push
Speaker 1: forward anyway, trying our hardest not to allow pride and idolatry,
Speaker 1: and knowing that we will probably fail, but rely on
Speaker 1: God for his mercy and grace because of the ultimate
Speaker 1: goal in this to praise him with music. Okay, Jake,
Speaker 1: I appreciate your brother so much and thank you for
Speaker 1: thinking through this. And I truly it's encouraging to be challenged,
Speaker 1: because I certainly need to be challenged, and all the
Speaker 1: thoughts that I throw out on this podcast need to
Speaker 1: need to be thought through. And no one should take
Speaker 1: what I say on this podcast and create a manuscript
Speaker 1: and then publish it. You know, because I said before
Speaker 1: at the earlier earlier in the break said that I
Speaker 1: don't have notes. These are just thoughts. And so sometimes
Speaker 1: you could say that I might have a thought that
Speaker 1: just comes out that I should probably think through, and
Speaker 1: if I had the chance to think through it again,
Speaker 1: maybe I would say it differently. And for a lot
Speaker 1: of episodes, I don't have a guest, like today, have
Speaker 1: an empty chair sitting next to me. I don't have
Speaker 1: Marshall or Parker or Chat or aunt Man or Bernie
Speaker 1: sitting with me. And it's good to have those guys
Speaker 1: because sometimes they'll be able to push back in real time.
Speaker 1: But today it's just me. It's me and you, Jake,
Speaker 1: and I'm going to take your challenge, and I'm going
Speaker 1: to dig into it. So here's your thought. You're a
Speaker 1: local artist. You've been convicted because you're thinking, man, i've
Speaker 1: heard Granger say that he left music because he was
Speaker 1: trying to promote himself, and now I'm feeling that feel
Speaker 1: a little funny about that. So you've sought counsel from
Speaker 1: your pastor great? Great, that's you know, that was the
Speaker 1: first place I would usually go. And so you've done that. Excellent.
Speaker 1: I'm so glad you're wrestling through that with him. But
Speaker 1: then you're thinking, Okay, well, there's the the flip side
Speaker 1: of the coin, Granger. If I don't promote myself, then
Speaker 1: no one's going to hear my music. And if I
Speaker 1: put up music for God, if I write music or
Speaker 1: perform music for God and no one hears it, then
Speaker 1: what's the purpose? And if everyone did this, then no
Speaker 1: one would hear music from God's that's the argument. And
Speaker 1: then here's the back half of your argument. God always
Speaker 1: uses flawed people for his good. He uses people for
Speaker 1: his good, and all people are flawed, and so therefore
Speaker 1: he uses broken, sinful note correct in your terms people
Speaker 1: to glorify himself. Yeah, and so everything we just said,
Speaker 1: I would say, yes, okay, I got it, I understand.
Speaker 1: Here's the other thing. We'll start here. We'll start with
Speaker 1: the God uses flawed people. We'll start there. You're absolutely right,
Speaker 1: God uses flawed people for good for his glory, but
Speaker 1: that is never an excuse for us to continue in
Speaker 1: the flawed way. We never continue in sin and pride.
Speaker 1: Pride is what we're talking about here. We would never
Speaker 1: move forward knowingly sinning pridefully and then say I'm doing
Speaker 1: this because I'm not perfect and God will use my
Speaker 1: imperfection for his glory. The Bible would never speak in
Speaker 1: those kind of terms or advocate that, And we also
Speaker 1: don't see an example of that being what we're supposed
Speaker 1: to do as believers. Instead, we're called to constantly eradicate
Speaker 1: our sin. Jesus speaks so seriously about sin that he says,
Speaker 1: if your eye causes you to stumble, gouge it out right.
Speaker 1: If your hand causes you to stumble, cut it off.
Speaker 1: You know, he doesn't speak lightly about it. Jesus is
Speaker 1: not saying if your hand causes you to stumble, it's okay,
Speaker 1: because God uses all things for good and for his
Speaker 1: glory nobody's perfect. The Bible doesn't speak in that way. Now,
Speaker 1: we know that no one's perfect, and we know that
Speaker 1: God uses all things for good for his glory, and
Speaker 1: we know that he uses flawed, bad things for good.
Speaker 1: We know that, but that doesn't take away the fact
Speaker 1: that the Bible also says be perfect for your heavenly Father,
Speaker 1: it's perfect. Another way to say this is pursue holiness.
Speaker 1: Seek holiness at all costs. Not because the seeking saves you,
Speaker 1: not because the holiness that you create saves you. That's
Speaker 1: not what we're talking about. But a faithful saved Christian
Speaker 1: always seeks holiness as a result of the saving faith
Speaker 1: that was gifted to them by the Lord. And what
Speaker 1: we don't do as saved Christians is continue in sin.
Speaker 1: Notice I didn't say that we don't sin, but we do,
Speaker 1: but we don't continue in it because we always try.
Speaker 1: We try to eradicate it, seeking holiness, pursuing holiness because
Speaker 1: that is our sanctification and that is Listen to this.
Speaker 1: That is God's will for your life to be holy. Now,
Speaker 1: to say God's will for your life is somewhat complex,
Speaker 1: but certainly part of it is for you to be holy.
Speaker 1: That is his will for you. It is not to
Speaker 1: sin so that he could use your music to get
Speaker 1: to a lot of people. His will for you is
Speaker 1: to be holy. And if music is causing you to
Speaker 1: be prideful and prideful pridefulness is a sin, then cut
Speaker 1: it off, like Jesus would say about your eye. Gouge
Speaker 1: it out. Okay, So let me continue building the argument
Speaker 1: to say that no one can enjoy music unless it
Speaker 1: comes from a famous person. Ah, you know it's weird, right,
Speaker 1: You know that's not true because famous musicians is a
Speaker 1: is a recent thing. I mean, for the most part,
Speaker 1: only in the last one hundred years. You can go
Speaker 1: back to you could talk about Beethoven and Mozart. But
Speaker 1: to talk about in terms of what you're saying, an
Speaker 1: artist promoting, being promoted, promoting himself, and then becoming famous,
Speaker 1: that's like almost just shive a one hundred years old
Speaker 1: in the history of humanity. So to say that music
Speaker 1: needs to come from a famous person, and the famous
Speaker 1: person needs to promote themselves otherwise the music doesn't get
Speaker 1: heard that we can make a thousand arguments of why
Speaker 1: that's just not true. So many of the old hymn
Speaker 1: writers wrote thousands of hymns, and they never had the
Speaker 1: intention of being that their name being connected to it
Speaker 1: and them needing to promote themselves so that the hymn
Speaker 1: was heard and used for God's praise. That's never been
Speaker 1: the case. That's this is a brand new mentality, and
Speaker 1: even since the rise of social media has that idea
Speaker 1: really solidified. So let's read it. Let's read again with
Speaker 1: all these things in mind. Let's read these things. How then,
Speaker 1: is anyone to put up music for God? You say,
Speaker 1: so that other people can enjoy it and listen to
Speaker 1: it and worship along with it. And then you say
Speaker 1: it facilitates worship by creating new songs about God. Someone
Speaker 1: has to do it. And how can the music get
Speaker 1: out there without being promoted? I think of a lot
Speaker 1: of ways. I think I can think of a lot
Speaker 1: of ways of how a song about God could could
Speaker 1: be used by God for his people to worship him
Speaker 1: without the person who created it being famous or promoting themselves. However,
Speaker 1: I don't think that's your argument. I think you're kind
Speaker 1: of looking for it technicality in the argument that you're
Speaker 1: pushing back on me with your challenge. I don't think
Speaker 1: that's what you want to do. And so I would say, brother,
Speaker 1: search your heart on this. And this has come from
Speaker 1: one artist to the next. Jake, I would say, search
Speaker 1: your heart and figure out this. Took me years to
Speaker 1: test myself figure out where the motivation is coming from
Speaker 1: to promote yourself to be famous. Is the motivation to
Speaker 1: be famous coming on solely so that God may be glorified,
Speaker 1: or is it coming maybe maybe in a large part
Speaker 1: by you desiring to be famous or desiring to be
Speaker 1: successful in music. That's something to really wrestle with, something
Speaker 1: to really think through, and I think your answer will
Speaker 1: be surprising. I mean, I would go so far as
Speaker 1: to fast over this. I would go so far as
Speaker 1: to to to seek some kind of wilderness. We see
Speaker 1: this these kind of spiritual disciplines with Jesus himself seeking
Speaker 1: a quiet place, seeking the desert or the woods. Fasting
Speaker 1: in this I'm saying. I'm actually saying that because next week,
Speaker 1: as I record this next week, I'm going to be
Speaker 1: five days in the absolute barren desert, fasting for some
Speaker 1: things that I'm I'm working through, things that I need
Speaker 1: to be doing. So maybe that's something you can think about.
Speaker 1: I would I would make sure your spiritual disciplines are
Speaker 1: locked in in your your personal Bible reading time, your
Speaker 1: your personal prayer life, your Bible memory, scripture memory that
Speaker 1: your metadating on scripture consistency, sitting under a local church.
Speaker 1: Remember that was one of my arguments against being a
Speaker 1: famous singer, is you're sacrificing your Sunday mornings because typically
Speaker 1: you're out on a Saturday night traveling somewhere. So don't
Speaker 1: make yourself out to be a hero. I'm all finished
Speaker 1: with that idea. If you are struggling with the thought,
Speaker 1: if you're challenged, convicted by the thought that self promotion
Speaker 1: is not taking up your cross, denying yourself taking up
Speaker 1: your cross and following Jesus, or making more of him
Speaker 1: and less of you, if you find that that doesn't reconcile,
Speaker 1: and you're convicted with your current lifestyle, I will say,
Speaker 1: first of all, that's very much sound like the Holy
Speaker 1: Spirit convicting you in that. And then I would say,
Speaker 1: don't make yourself a hero, because you don't want to
Speaker 1: self appoint yourself as a martyr of sin and pride
Speaker 1: so that all these other people could listen to your
Speaker 1: songs and worship God. Don't be that guy. Don't be
Speaker 1: the guy. Yeah, I think all the end right there.
Speaker 1: I think only in there, Jake, will you keep in
Speaker 1: touch brother? Will you email back to so that I
Speaker 1: could hear. I'd love to hear your journey and how
Speaker 1: you're continuing to wrestle through this. And I would love
Speaker 1: to be a sounding board once again. Not that I'm right,
Speaker 1: but I would love to just hear how your journey continues.
Speaker 1: Next question comes from one of my favorite people that
Speaker 1: writes in, and that's the person that's named Anonymous. This
Speaker 1: person writes in all the time. It says, hey, there,
Speaker 1: I've been enjoying your podcast in your YouTube channel. I
Speaker 1: hope that Amber continues her podcast. They are truly seeing
Speaker 1: the spiritual growth you both have had since the beginning
Speaker 1: is amazing. I have a question. And by the way,
Speaker 1: I don't know this person. They said Anonymous, that was
Speaker 1: a joke I said earlier. I'll continue. I have a question.
Speaker 1: I'm wondering if someone could help me out. I'm from
Speaker 1: a small village in British Columbia, Canada, a small Mennonite village.
Speaker 1: We have three different churches in our community, Old Colony,
Speaker 1: which is a parenthesis very religious and said in their
Speaker 1: ways Mennonite Church more of any Evangelical with some Mennonite traditions.
Speaker 1: And In Grace Bible Church, which just opened up a
Speaker 1: few years ago. My husband and I grew up in
Speaker 1: the OC, which I'm assuming this old colony, but we
Speaker 1: have not attended church in the past ten years. I
Speaker 1: really like the teachings of In Grace Church, but they
Speaker 1: do one thing that was strongly taught against as we
Speaker 1: were growing up. If you were only baptized by pouring,
Speaker 1: they believe you should be immersed to join the church.
Speaker 1: The OC we grew up in does baptism. I would
Speaker 1: like to hear your points of view. I would love
Speaker 1: to hear what your Men and Nite friend has to share.
Speaker 1: Breaking free of the OC religion has been a journey.
Speaker 1: Thank you all right, Anonymous, Thank you for the email.
Speaker 1: I appreciate you so much. You're speaking my mind night friend.
Speaker 1: You're talking about Marv, and Marv is a He's more
Speaker 1: than a friend, he's a dear brother. I love that
Speaker 1: man and his family, and in fact I got to
Speaker 1: spend a little bit of time with him and his
Speaker 1: son Ross and my son Lincoln in North Carolina. We
Speaker 1: we took a little trip there, kind of a missionary
Speaker 1: trip really for humanitarian reasons after the hurricane. He's from
Speaker 1: South Carolina. We kind of met and and then just
Speaker 1: had a just a great time. I love Marv. I
Speaker 1: love his family, love his wife Brooke. So you need
Speaker 1: to know something about Marv. And he is a Mennonite pastor,
Speaker 1: but he is also a saved by grace, reborn believe
Speaker 1: in Christian and that comes before Mennonite or for my case, Baptist.
Speaker 1: So believing in Jesus, trusting him as your Lord and Savior,
Speaker 1: trusting the work that he did on the cross, dying
Speaker 1: on the cross, becoming a substitute for the punishment we
Speaker 1: deserve for our rebellion against God, and trusting that Jesus
Speaker 1: died on the cross for sins, saying that all who
Speaker 1: believe in him repent from their sins, will be saved
Speaker 1: and then live a surrendered life sanctified as a result
Speaker 1: of that saving of grace. That's what it means to
Speaker 1: be a Christian walking in repentance and faith because of
Speaker 1: the grace that we've been saved by. That's what it means.
Speaker 1: And so we'll put that ahead of Mennonite's Baptists, whatever
Speaker 1: evangelical version of the Mennonite Church that you're seeing or whatever.
Speaker 1: In grace Bible churches, I'm not really sure what they are.
Speaker 1: I'm assuming it's more of a typical Bible church that
Speaker 1: that I would know, but I'm not totally familiar with
Speaker 1: BC Canada. So we have to put that stuff first.
Speaker 1: Baptism is important. You know, a lot of people will
Speaker 1: view that as the the first good work as a
Speaker 1: result of the saving grace. So baptism doesn't save you,
Speaker 1: but it's a it's the first public display of God's
Speaker 1: transformation in us after we're saved. Baptism now, you know,
Speaker 1: if we study church history baptism, that that sacrament of
Speaker 1: baptism has been has been carried out in different ways, sprinkling, pouring,
Speaker 1: full immersion, and it's been handled as far as babies, children,
Speaker 1: and adults. Now, the Baptist tradition, for anyone that doesn't know,
Speaker 1: it's called believers baptism, and it's really just a straightforward idea.
Speaker 1: It's there's there's nothing super deep about it. I think
Speaker 1: even a non believer could understand what this means, and
Speaker 1: it means we baptize as a as a Baptist community,
Speaker 1: we baptize after a person confesses a belief in Jesus,
Speaker 1: after they have a have a reason too to identify
Speaker 1: or to enunciate, pronounce, tell about the transformation that they've
Speaker 1: had in Christ. It's an understanding. And basically, I'm just
Speaker 1: going back and defining again the same thing I said
Speaker 1: earlier about being a Christian knowing what Jesus did, knowing
Speaker 1: that we are sinners, and then there's nothing we could
Speaker 1: do to save ourselves from our own sin that's been
Speaker 1: inherited from our ancestors, the original sin that we have inherited,
Speaker 1: and it is killing us, and it will kill us,
Speaker 1: and we will end up in eternal judgment if we
Speaker 1: continue on without a savior to pull us out of it.
Speaker 1: So that and acknowledgment means, hey, I'm a Christian. You know,
Speaker 1: I guess this is a long way of saying I'm
Speaker 1: a Christian and I trust Jesus for the forgiveness of
Speaker 1: my sins. And when someone could say that and understand
Speaker 1: it at whatever age that might be, typically you most
Speaker 1: likely you would see that is something that a teenager
Speaker 1: at the earliest age could start saying, I understand now
Speaker 1: what Jesus did on a cross. I understand what it
Speaker 1: means to walk in faith, trusting Him for my forgiveness,
Speaker 1: not in myself. Typically, the earliest age you see that
Speaker 1: as teenage age, even though we know that people could
Speaker 1: be faithfully baptized at eight, nine, ten, eleven years old,
Speaker 1: but typically this is something an adult understands. It's an
Speaker 1: adult concept to be able to profess that faith, or
Speaker 1: as the Bible says, confess, So that is called that's
Speaker 1: the believer's baptism that Baptists have traditionally believed since the
Speaker 1: seventeenth century eighteenth century, right that that also it needs
Speaker 1: to be said that there's the tradition of pouring or
Speaker 1: baby sprinkling is also has a long history. And what
Speaker 1: we're talking about here, without me getting too fear into
Speaker 1: the weeds with this, I'm trying to make this as
Speaker 1: simple of a conversation as I can. What we're really
Speaker 1: talking about here is membership into that church. And so
Speaker 1: it is a bit of a formality, but I think
Speaker 1: it's a I think it's an intelligent formality. I think
Speaker 1: it makes sense that if you want to be in
Speaker 1: the church, you should be a Christian, and if you're
Speaker 1: a Christian, you should be baptized. And the tradition would say,
Speaker 1: as Baptist that you should be baptized after you're converted.
Speaker 1: You know that that's just it's kind of a simple thought,
Speaker 1: but I think it creates a little bit of a
Speaker 1: of a doorway into membership, and it's it shows a
Speaker 1: bit of a commitment and a step. It shows a
Speaker 1: public step in faith to say, you know what, I'm
Speaker 1: not ashamed that I believe that Jesus has died from
Speaker 1: my sins and I trust him with all the forgiveness
Speaker 1: that that I don't deserve. I believe in that with
Speaker 1: every fiber of my being. And I want to show
Speaker 1: that through baptism. And if you come up against a
Speaker 1: technicality where you love a church and you go, you know,
Speaker 1: I was sprinkled as a baby, but I love this
Speaker 1: church and I believe not just not just because I'm
Speaker 1: coerced into this idea, but I actually see that that
Speaker 1: practically makes sense that you know, baptism would come after
Speaker 1: I'm converted, and so I'm gonna get immersed. I think
Speaker 1: that's a that would be a way to show the
Speaker 1: church and anyone else that's watching that you know you
Speaker 1: don't you don't really care about looking silly or feeling
Speaker 1: dumb or being embarrassed. You're ready to tell people about
Speaker 1: what Jesus has done for you, and you're gonna do
Speaker 1: that in front of people, telling your testimony and getting
Speaker 1: into the water. So I'm trying my best to navigate
Speaker 1: a very difficult, honestly, a very difficult situation because I
Speaker 1: have a lot of respect for my dear Presbyterian brothers
Speaker 1: and sisters and so many in the men in Nite Church,
Speaker 1: and I believe there are people in the Baptist Church
Speaker 1: that are not converted. And I believe there are people
Speaker 1: in the men Nite Church that are not converted, and
Speaker 1: Presbyterian they're not converted. But I think there are people,
Speaker 1: hopefully mostly people that actually are converted. And I think
Speaker 1: this type of baptism of believers baptism helps fense that
Speaker 1: off a little bit. It helps distinguish the difference because
Speaker 1: so you don't have a church with with a bunch
Speaker 1: of members that are actually not believers. Yeah, I think
Speaker 1: even if you're if you're not a Christian, you could
Speaker 1: see how that could be problematic. You have a body,
Speaker 1: a membership, and they're not believers. That creates all kinds
Speaker 1: of problems, like endless problems. We could go for an
Speaker 1: hour talking about the problems that that could create. And
Speaker 1: that that's also different than saying just attending the church.
Speaker 1: Attending the church is open to everybody. Please, the doors
Speaker 1: are open. Everyone is welcome indiscriminately. You could come to
Speaker 1: the church and join in on the feasting of the
Speaker 1: Word that's being preached. But when it comes to baptism
Speaker 1: and the Holy and and and the and the Lord's
Speaker 1: Upper and the church membership, when it comes to those things,
Speaker 1: you gotta gotta be a Christian, you know. I mean,
Speaker 1: I don't think that's too much to ask, and I
Speaker 1: think anyone can understand it. So here's my point. I
Speaker 1: don't know anything about this North Grace Bible Church, so
Speaker 1: I can't speak, and I can't say, yeah, that sounds
Speaker 1: like a good deal. You should go, because you might
Speaker 1: be in the old colony. I don't know anything about. Besides,
Speaker 1: you said set in their ways, but I don't. I
Speaker 1: don't have a reference to which of these three churches
Speaker 1: is better. I don't know, and so I can't speak
Speaker 1: about how baptism would be the one thing that separates you,
Speaker 1: because it's not. I wouldn't go there. I would back
Speaker 1: up further and go a step before that and say,
Speaker 1: which one of these three is preaching the word of God?
Speaker 1: Which one of these three is teaching from the pulpit
Speaker 1: the Bible? Not an opinion, but they're they're they're going,
Speaker 1: they're working through text, and they're saying today the message
Speaker 1: today is John. Please turn with me to John chapter three,
Speaker 1: verses one through six, and we're gonna work. I'm gonna
Speaker 1: tell you, I'm gonna read these and then we're going
Speaker 1: to talk about what this author meant by this and
Speaker 1: how it can apply to our lives today. And that
Speaker 1: would be the teaching we need to hear and we
Speaker 1: want to hear. And if if one of these three
Speaker 1: is doing that and the other two aren't, go to
Speaker 1: that one and we could deal with this baptism. And
Speaker 1: that's a lot for a Baptist to say that, but
Speaker 1: we could deal with that later. But first, I want
Speaker 1: you to be fed and nourished in your town, as
Speaker 1: you say, a small town in British Columbia. I want
Speaker 1: you to be nourished by the word of God, and
Speaker 1: I want that to happen before you're arguing or trying
Speaker 1: to deal with Should you be immersed or sprinkled or poured?
Speaker 1: Does that makes sense? Difficult situation with you, anonymous, but
Speaker 1: I think we shouldn't know for complicated. I hope that
Speaker 1: makes sense. I hope all these questions make sense. And
Speaker 1: I love that you guys email me tough things, so
Speaker 1: message me podcast at grangersmith dot com. See y'all next Monday, Gig,
Speaker 1: thanks for joining me on the Grangersmith podcast. I appreciate
Speaker 1: all of you guys. You could help me out by
Speaker 1: rating this podcast on iTunes. If you're on YouTube, subscribe
Speaker 1: to this channel, hit that little like button and notification
Speaker 1: spell so that you never miss anytime I upload a video.
Speaker 1: Yigi