1 00:00:11,800 --> 00:00:13,880 Speaker 1: What's up everybody, Welcome back to the podcast. Thank you 2 00:00:13,880 --> 00:00:17,200 Speaker 1: for being here. I answer your questions podcast at grangersmith 3 00:00:17,200 --> 00:00:19,200 Speaker 1: dot com, and you could ask me anything you want. 4 00:00:19,239 --> 00:00:21,280 Speaker 1: That's the format of this podcast. That's a way it's 5 00:00:21,280 --> 00:00:25,000 Speaker 1: been for a long time. And so I want to 6 00:00:25,000 --> 00:00:27,960 Speaker 1: tell you that I think about this often before I 7 00:00:27,960 --> 00:00:31,400 Speaker 1: start a podcast, that I don't have any notes. I'm 8 00:00:31,440 --> 00:00:34,600 Speaker 1: not prepared with a bunch of like fancy quotes or 9 00:00:35,080 --> 00:00:40,519 Speaker 1: book recommendations or cross references, and I don't think the 10 00:00:40,560 --> 00:00:45,120 Speaker 1: podcast should be that way. I think it's better if 11 00:00:45,159 --> 00:00:48,920 Speaker 1: I hear a question from you about whatever is going 12 00:00:48,920 --> 00:00:52,320 Speaker 1: on in your life, and I answer it like I 13 00:00:52,360 --> 00:00:56,280 Speaker 1: would if we were close friends riding side by side 14 00:00:56,360 --> 00:01:00,120 Speaker 1: in a pickup truck on a back road. I think 15 00:01:01,120 --> 00:01:05,120 Speaker 1: that way, and I say that to say that you 16 00:01:05,160 --> 00:01:07,440 Speaker 1: know that that means I'm not always right about things, 17 00:01:07,480 --> 00:01:11,600 Speaker 1: but it's more so that we all think together. We 18 00:01:12,440 --> 00:01:18,880 Speaker 1: think through these often. These questions are really difficult life situations, 19 00:01:19,480 --> 00:01:22,679 Speaker 1: and so we should think of them because I you know, 20 00:01:24,280 --> 00:01:27,640 Speaker 1: think about all the people that don't ask a question, 21 00:01:27,720 --> 00:01:32,960 Speaker 1: They just listen, and everyone's got something going on, you know, 22 00:01:33,000 --> 00:01:36,560 Speaker 1: everyone's got some kind of problem and so for all 23 00:01:36,600 --> 00:01:40,119 Speaker 1: of those people that don't ask a question, we're learning 24 00:01:40,200 --> 00:01:44,360 Speaker 1: how to think through them right once again. The email 25 00:01:44,440 --> 00:01:46,920 Speaker 1: is podcast at grangersmith dot com. First question comes from 26 00:01:47,000 --> 00:01:51,280 Speaker 1: Kayley and this says this, Hey granger, I have sort 27 00:01:51,320 --> 00:01:54,880 Speaker 1: of a multi question email for you. My husband and 28 00:01:54,920 --> 00:01:58,680 Speaker 1: I have two children, ages seven and nine, and our 29 00:01:58,720 --> 00:02:02,600 Speaker 1: nine year old is autistic. He doesn't speak and struggles 30 00:02:02,600 --> 00:02:07,400 Speaker 1: with being very hyperactive. He can get very disregulated in 31 00:02:07,520 --> 00:02:10,720 Speaker 1: unfamiliar environments. We do not attend church due to it 32 00:02:10,800 --> 00:02:14,000 Speaker 1: being very difficult to have him sitting or basically going 33 00:02:14,040 --> 00:02:17,480 Speaker 1: into overdrive in an open space where there are lots 34 00:02:17,520 --> 00:02:21,800 Speaker 1: of things to touch or to look at. He is 35 00:02:22,200 --> 00:02:24,680 Speaker 1: also in a looper in other words, he could run 36 00:02:24,720 --> 00:02:27,400 Speaker 1: away and put himself in danger. Having a child with 37 00:02:27,440 --> 00:02:29,960 Speaker 1: special needs can be very isolating, and while I know 38 00:02:30,040 --> 00:02:33,120 Speaker 1: God knows my heart, I crave being a part of 39 00:02:33,160 --> 00:02:35,560 Speaker 1: a community and I think it's a big missing piece 40 00:02:35,600 --> 00:02:37,800 Speaker 1: of our life as a family. I guess my question 41 00:02:37,919 --> 00:02:39,720 Speaker 1: is should we try and find a church that can 42 00:02:39,760 --> 00:02:44,560 Speaker 1: accommodate children in general, but specifically that has a special 43 00:02:44,560 --> 00:02:47,240 Speaker 1: needs program? But also, what are your thoughts on having 44 00:02:47,280 --> 00:02:50,799 Speaker 1: special needs programs for children that separate them from their 45 00:02:50,800 --> 00:02:53,960 Speaker 1: parents during services. I know some churches do not agree 46 00:02:54,000 --> 00:02:57,800 Speaker 1: with that concept. I appreciate your feedback and opinion. Thank you, Kaylee. 47 00:02:58,040 --> 00:03:01,160 Speaker 1: All right, Kaylee, Well, thank you for for trusting me. 48 00:03:01,600 --> 00:03:05,200 Speaker 1: Trusting me in this podcast was something that's probably so 49 00:03:06,200 --> 00:03:08,679 Speaker 1: you know, the forefront of your mind all the time 50 00:03:08,720 --> 00:03:13,200 Speaker 1: and so sensitive of a subject. So thank you for 51 00:03:13,200 --> 00:03:18,360 Speaker 1: trusting me with that. And I think we could kind 52 00:03:18,360 --> 00:03:24,760 Speaker 1: of approach this from a few different ways. One something 53 00:03:24,760 --> 00:03:26,120 Speaker 1: that stuck out to me the first time I read 54 00:03:26,160 --> 00:03:31,679 Speaker 1: it just now was you said having a special needs 55 00:03:32,560 --> 00:03:36,160 Speaker 1: child could be very isolating. And while I know I 56 00:03:36,240 --> 00:03:38,840 Speaker 1: know God knows my heart, I crave being a part 57 00:03:38,880 --> 00:03:42,640 Speaker 1: of a community. I don't necessarily know what you mean 58 00:03:42,680 --> 00:03:46,320 Speaker 1: by saying God knows my heart, but I've craved been 59 00:03:46,360 --> 00:03:50,640 Speaker 1: part of a community. You probably mean God knows that 60 00:03:50,720 --> 00:03:52,560 Speaker 1: I want to be in church even though i'm not, 61 00:03:52,840 --> 00:03:55,280 Speaker 1: and he has grace that i'm not. I think that's 62 00:03:55,280 --> 00:04:01,080 Speaker 1: what you mean, and I understand, I understand that. But 63 00:04:01,080 --> 00:04:07,040 Speaker 1: but what's more interesting about that thought is that you 64 00:04:07,680 --> 00:04:11,400 Speaker 1: crave to be part of a community, and that is 65 00:04:12,320 --> 00:04:15,960 Speaker 1: this is a craving that humans have always had. You 66 00:04:15,960 --> 00:04:17,840 Speaker 1: don't have to be a Christian. To have that craving, 67 00:04:17,880 --> 00:04:23,000 Speaker 1: you just have to be a human. And that is 68 00:04:23,040 --> 00:04:25,320 Speaker 1: because we're made in God's image and we were made 69 00:04:26,080 --> 00:04:28,360 Speaker 1: with a need. We we were you know, we were 70 00:04:28,360 --> 00:04:32,480 Speaker 1: created with certain desires, right, and one of those desires 71 00:04:32,480 --> 00:04:37,840 Speaker 1: we are created to have is to seek to crave 72 00:04:38,520 --> 00:04:43,320 Speaker 1: other people around us. And there are many reasons. I'm 73 00:04:43,360 --> 00:04:44,680 Speaker 1: not going to ask, I'm not going to act like 74 00:04:44,720 --> 00:04:47,119 Speaker 1: I know all the reasons, but one of the clear 75 00:04:47,160 --> 00:04:53,920 Speaker 1: reasons is our gifts that were given to us different 76 00:04:53,960 --> 00:04:56,880 Speaker 1: from other people. Certain people have certain gifts, other people 77 00:04:57,000 --> 00:05:00,880 Speaker 1: have other gifts. In the Bible, it talks about members 78 00:05:00,880 --> 00:05:04,320 Speaker 1: of a body like an eye, how obviously has a 79 00:05:04,320 --> 00:05:09,200 Speaker 1: different function than a hand, and a hand as a 80 00:05:09,200 --> 00:05:13,279 Speaker 1: different function than an ear, or a nose or a foot. 81 00:05:14,080 --> 00:05:17,000 Speaker 1: And it's the same with us. Right. If you look 82 00:05:17,040 --> 00:05:21,520 Speaker 1: around any community, any city, or town, or neighborhood or 83 00:05:21,560 --> 00:05:26,080 Speaker 1: even family, everyone has they bring something different to the table. 84 00:05:26,440 --> 00:05:30,960 Speaker 1: Everyone does. And the Church is supposed to be like that. 85 00:05:31,160 --> 00:05:35,159 Speaker 1: It's made up the body, which is the Church. The 86 00:05:35,279 --> 00:05:38,880 Speaker 1: head is Christ. That's the symbolism given in the Bible. 87 00:05:39,240 --> 00:05:42,400 Speaker 1: The head is Christ and the body is the Church, 88 00:05:42,440 --> 00:05:46,320 Speaker 1: and the Church is the gathering of people. That's what 89 00:05:46,400 --> 00:05:48,640 Speaker 1: that word church, that the roots of that word mean, 90 00:05:48,760 --> 00:05:54,160 Speaker 1: that means gathering. And so if we think of ourselves 91 00:05:54,560 --> 00:05:59,320 Speaker 1: as the body with different members functioning differently, then we 92 00:05:59,440 --> 00:06:04,039 Speaker 1: really needed each other to function as a is a 93 00:06:04,040 --> 00:06:08,120 Speaker 1: functioning body, you know, like if we were missing eyes, 94 00:06:08,400 --> 00:06:12,240 Speaker 1: we wouldn't be a good body. If we were missing ears, 95 00:06:12,440 --> 00:06:16,599 Speaker 1: or if we're missing hands, we wouldn't be the church 96 00:06:16,600 --> 00:06:19,640 Speaker 1: as it's supposed to be, as it's intended to be. 97 00:06:21,400 --> 00:06:24,560 Speaker 1: And why did I say that, Well, the reason I'm 98 00:06:24,600 --> 00:06:29,280 Speaker 1: saying that is because we all are given different gifts. 99 00:06:30,320 --> 00:06:36,360 Speaker 1: Those gifts that God gave us are only activated, are 100 00:06:36,560 --> 00:06:42,599 Speaker 1: used in the context of the gathering. Like an eye 101 00:06:42,920 --> 00:06:46,679 Speaker 1: is no good by itself, and an eye that sees 102 00:06:47,760 --> 00:06:52,559 Speaker 1: benefits the body, but to itself it's nothing. A hand 103 00:06:52,680 --> 00:06:55,520 Speaker 1: is nothing by itself unless it's benefiting the body. You 104 00:06:55,560 --> 00:06:59,360 Speaker 1: see what I mean. And so these gifts spiritual gifts, 105 00:06:59,400 --> 00:07:04,040 Speaker 1: you can call them physical gifts. The different attributes, the 106 00:07:04,120 --> 00:07:10,960 Speaker 1: characteristics that God has gifted us with are seen and 107 00:07:11,200 --> 00:07:15,600 Speaker 1: used in the context of the body. For instance, most 108 00:07:15,640 --> 00:07:18,920 Speaker 1: of my life have been a singer. Now as a singer, 109 00:07:20,680 --> 00:07:24,840 Speaker 1: the gift that God gave me to sing. Now, whether 110 00:07:25,040 --> 00:07:27,680 Speaker 1: whether I'm good or not, that's irrelevant. The gift that 111 00:07:27,720 --> 00:07:32,720 Speaker 1: God gave me to sing means nothing by myself. If 112 00:07:32,720 --> 00:07:37,480 Speaker 1: I'm isolated and it's stuck in a room my whole life, 113 00:07:38,640 --> 00:07:41,760 Speaker 1: then I don't get to share my gift. My singing 114 00:07:42,760 --> 00:07:48,240 Speaker 1: only influences me so much before it's meant to influence, encourage, 115 00:07:48,920 --> 00:07:51,720 Speaker 1: lift up others. And it's the same with every gift. 116 00:07:53,280 --> 00:07:56,840 Speaker 1: So that's why you crave to be part of the community, 117 00:07:57,560 --> 00:08:00,520 Speaker 1: because not only do you crave without being able to 118 00:08:00,520 --> 00:08:05,360 Speaker 1: say it, using your gifts in the church, but you 119 00:08:05,440 --> 00:08:09,360 Speaker 1: also crave the other people's gifts given to you. So 120 00:08:09,440 --> 00:08:12,680 Speaker 1: you are like a hand saying I just wish I 121 00:08:12,760 --> 00:08:16,840 Speaker 1: had an eye and a nose, and an ear, and 122 00:08:17,760 --> 00:08:20,440 Speaker 1: the the ear and the and the nose and the 123 00:08:20,560 --> 00:08:22,520 Speaker 1: and the eye, say I wish we had a hand. 124 00:08:23,240 --> 00:08:27,160 Speaker 1: And it all comes together when the church, the gathering, 125 00:08:27,760 --> 00:08:33,920 Speaker 1: does what it does, and that is gather. So think 126 00:08:33,960 --> 00:08:36,640 Speaker 1: about that. Let's start with the conversation with that idea 127 00:08:37,240 --> 00:08:40,160 Speaker 1: that yes, you crave being a part of community. Then 128 00:08:40,240 --> 00:08:43,839 Speaker 1: that's not just a unique something, that something that's unique 129 00:08:43,880 --> 00:08:46,240 Speaker 1: to you. That's because you're made in the image of 130 00:08:46,240 --> 00:08:50,960 Speaker 1: God and you're you crave to gather with the body. Okay, 131 00:08:51,320 --> 00:08:56,640 Speaker 1: So so then let's put that on top of let's 132 00:08:56,720 --> 00:09:01,360 Speaker 1: use that lens and think about your autot son. Is 133 00:09:01,400 --> 00:09:11,080 Speaker 1: his son? Yes, son. I'm trying to say this as 134 00:09:11,120 --> 00:09:14,800 Speaker 1: easy as I can. But the problem, the problem that 135 00:09:14,840 --> 00:09:17,920 Speaker 1: you're dealing with really okay, let me just say it plainly. 136 00:09:18,520 --> 00:09:21,320 Speaker 1: The problem you're dealing with is you haven't found a 137 00:09:21,320 --> 00:09:26,920 Speaker 1: healthy church yet. Because because a healthy church, and once again, 138 00:09:27,000 --> 00:09:29,760 Speaker 1: don't think of it as a building. Don't think of 139 00:09:29,920 --> 00:09:34,280 Speaker 1: church when I say that as a denominational building with 140 00:09:34,400 --> 00:09:37,360 Speaker 1: bricks and mortar. When I use that word, think of 141 00:09:37,360 --> 00:09:40,200 Speaker 1: it every time as the body, the gathering of people. 142 00:09:40,520 --> 00:09:45,280 Speaker 1: You haven't you haven't been part of a healthy body 143 00:09:45,400 --> 00:09:49,600 Speaker 1: of the gathering of people yet, because you could make 144 00:09:49,640 --> 00:09:52,880 Speaker 1: these kind of decisions with them, and they would come 145 00:09:52,880 --> 00:09:57,560 Speaker 1: together with your autistic son and help you. And I 146 00:09:57,600 --> 00:10:00,600 Speaker 1: don't think right, I know, I know they don't have 147 00:10:00,679 --> 00:10:05,440 Speaker 1: to be qualified in special needs children, and I think 148 00:10:05,880 --> 00:10:08,400 Speaker 1: they would move the direction if you were part of 149 00:10:08,400 --> 00:10:10,679 Speaker 1: that body, They would move the inento the direction of 150 00:10:10,800 --> 00:10:15,080 Speaker 1: learning how to better serve you and your autistic son 151 00:10:15,880 --> 00:10:20,079 Speaker 1: in your family. But right off the bat, you wouldn't 152 00:10:20,120 --> 00:10:23,520 Speaker 1: say I should go find a church that has a 153 00:10:23,520 --> 00:10:27,320 Speaker 1: special needs program. Instead, you would say, I'm going to 154 00:10:27,320 --> 00:10:32,959 Speaker 1: go find a church that preaches the Gospel clearly and 155 00:10:33,200 --> 00:10:39,360 Speaker 1: applies it for the body of people. Because if a 156 00:10:39,440 --> 00:10:47,160 Speaker 1: church is doing that, they're preaching a clear gospel, I'm unashamed, boldly, 157 00:10:48,120 --> 00:10:53,199 Speaker 1: with humility and love. When they're doing that, then that 158 00:10:54,720 --> 00:10:57,080 Speaker 1: fulfills all the requirements you're going to need for your son. 159 00:10:57,800 --> 00:11:00,120 Speaker 1: You see what I mean, Because if you go to 160 00:11:00,160 --> 00:11:01,800 Speaker 1: a church the opposite, if you go to a church 161 00:11:01,840 --> 00:11:10,040 Speaker 1: that has a very good doctorate driven special needs program, 162 00:11:10,880 --> 00:11:14,199 Speaker 1: but they're not preaching the Gospel, then they're actually killing 163 00:11:14,280 --> 00:11:19,160 Speaker 1: you and your son. And I've said it before on 164 00:11:19,200 --> 00:11:22,400 Speaker 1: this podcasts. It's like a little drop of cyanide poisoning 165 00:11:23,320 --> 00:11:25,600 Speaker 1: that you're putting into your drink every time you go 166 00:11:25,640 --> 00:11:29,800 Speaker 1: to a church that's not feeding you the Word of 167 00:11:29,840 --> 00:11:33,880 Speaker 1: God through the preaching. I mean, that's that is the 168 00:11:33,960 --> 00:11:37,559 Speaker 1: number one thing in a church. Everything else is secondary, 169 00:11:37,679 --> 00:11:43,240 Speaker 1: and that is preaching the Word of God. And I'm 170 00:11:43,240 --> 00:11:47,240 Speaker 1: not talking about preaching the needs of man or families 171 00:11:47,280 --> 00:11:50,880 Speaker 1: or marriages. I'm talking about preaching what the word says 172 00:11:51,240 --> 00:11:53,720 Speaker 1: and applying it to you in your life. If you're 173 00:11:53,760 --> 00:11:56,440 Speaker 1: not getting that, then you're not growing in your knowledge 174 00:11:56,440 --> 00:11:58,200 Speaker 1: of God. If you're not, If you're not growing in 175 00:11:58,240 --> 00:12:00,720 Speaker 1: your knowledge of God, then then you're growing in something else, 176 00:12:00,760 --> 00:12:07,120 Speaker 1: and that's usually fear, anxiety, hopelessness. Those things of the 177 00:12:07,120 --> 00:12:14,320 Speaker 1: world start growing in you. So all that to say, 178 00:12:14,480 --> 00:12:17,520 Speaker 1: you say, should we try to find the church that 179 00:12:16,960 --> 00:12:21,680 Speaker 1: ad that can accommodate special needs children? Basically you're saying 180 00:12:21,880 --> 00:12:25,679 Speaker 1: I say no, you find a healthy church that preaches 181 00:12:25,679 --> 00:12:29,040 Speaker 1: the gospel, that loves you, that loves your family, that 182 00:12:29,080 --> 00:12:32,120 Speaker 1: loves your son, and welcomes you in like the body's 183 00:12:32,160 --> 00:12:36,760 Speaker 1: supposed to. And they will say, Kaylee, we're going to 184 00:12:37,080 --> 00:12:39,880 Speaker 1: love your son. We're going to find ways that we 185 00:12:39,960 --> 00:12:44,840 Speaker 1: could we could serve you and your family. Well, now 186 00:12:45,120 --> 00:12:47,920 Speaker 1: there's one last little question here that you asked, and 187 00:12:47,960 --> 00:12:50,880 Speaker 1: that is what are your thoughts on having a special 188 00:12:50,880 --> 00:12:53,160 Speaker 1: needs program that separates the children from the parents during 189 00:12:53,160 --> 00:12:57,280 Speaker 1: the services. I think that gets worked out with the 190 00:12:57,360 --> 00:13:04,880 Speaker 1: healthy church. So I'm not going to stand on either 191 00:13:04,920 --> 00:13:08,200 Speaker 1: side of the fence saying children absolutely should be in 192 00:13:08,240 --> 00:13:11,600 Speaker 1: the services. I think they're welcome to be in the services. 193 00:13:11,640 --> 00:13:14,120 Speaker 1: I think I think having children in the services is 194 00:13:14,160 --> 00:13:17,520 Speaker 1: a very beautiful thing. Having babies crying in a service 195 00:13:17,600 --> 00:13:20,040 Speaker 1: is actually a beautiful thing because it's a it's a 196 00:13:20,080 --> 00:13:24,480 Speaker 1: sign that the soil is fertile in the church, you know, 197 00:13:24,520 --> 00:13:28,200 Speaker 1: and and it's growing and it's healthy. That's that's a 198 00:13:28,240 --> 00:13:31,280 Speaker 1: great fruit of a healthy church is there's babies, you know. 199 00:13:32,760 --> 00:13:36,840 Speaker 1: And so I'm not going to say that children shouldn't 200 00:13:36,880 --> 00:13:39,599 Speaker 1: be in the service. They're a distraction. But at the 201 00:13:39,640 --> 00:13:41,800 Speaker 1: same time, if you have a special needs son that 202 00:13:41,920 --> 00:13:46,000 Speaker 1: just actually physically just can't sit there, then then we 203 00:13:46,040 --> 00:13:47,760 Speaker 1: don't want to push that too far, and we want 204 00:13:47,760 --> 00:13:49,720 Speaker 1: to say, yeah, then he needs to he needs to 205 00:13:49,720 --> 00:13:53,559 Speaker 1: have his needs met and he needs to be growing 206 00:13:53,640 --> 00:13:56,679 Speaker 1: in the church in another way. And so if he 207 00:13:57,160 --> 00:14:01,760 Speaker 1: needs to leave the service with with a group or 208 00:14:01,760 --> 00:14:04,240 Speaker 1: with someone that could teach him in another way, and 209 00:14:04,320 --> 00:14:06,160 Speaker 1: I say, okay, I don't have a problem with that, 210 00:14:06,480 --> 00:14:11,320 Speaker 1: as long as the church is a family. And sometimes 211 00:14:11,320 --> 00:14:13,360 Speaker 1: that just means it can't be too big. Because if 212 00:14:13,360 --> 00:14:16,400 Speaker 1: a church is way too big, and if a church 213 00:14:16,400 --> 00:14:18,880 Speaker 1: has a special needs program, they're probably too big. You 214 00:14:18,920 --> 00:14:22,240 Speaker 1: could say that too. That's an all that's a red flag. 215 00:14:22,280 --> 00:14:25,720 Speaker 1: If a church is too big to be able to 216 00:14:25,720 --> 00:14:31,640 Speaker 1: accommodate personally, then I think I think that's also a problem. 217 00:14:32,680 --> 00:14:34,720 Speaker 1: We can probably talk about this for an hour, but 218 00:14:34,760 --> 00:14:37,240 Speaker 1: I think I've given you enough of my opinion on this. 219 00:14:37,800 --> 00:14:40,920 Speaker 1: Next question comes from Christine. It says, hey, grandeur Christine here, 220 00:14:40,960 --> 00:14:43,480 Speaker 1: I'm twenty years old and I'm a believer. I have 221 00:14:43,480 --> 00:14:46,160 Speaker 1: a friend who's twenty one and she's been married for 222 00:14:46,200 --> 00:14:48,160 Speaker 1: a year and a half now, and they're really struggling. 223 00:14:48,880 --> 00:14:52,080 Speaker 1: She's a Christian, but since they've been married, her husband 224 00:14:52,200 --> 00:14:54,160 Speaker 1: doesn't want anything to do with God and basically just 225 00:14:54,240 --> 00:14:58,080 Speaker 1: uses her for her body. He's winning an open relationship 226 00:14:58,120 --> 00:15:00,920 Speaker 1: and she's not open to that. She's almost to the 227 00:15:01,000 --> 00:15:02,720 Speaker 1: end of her rope and doesn't know what to do. 228 00:15:04,000 --> 00:15:07,280 Speaker 1: I know that she has guy best friends that she 229 00:15:07,360 --> 00:15:11,000 Speaker 1: messages with I ask and she also asks them for advice, 230 00:15:11,360 --> 00:15:13,840 Speaker 1: and she asked me for advice as well. I'm not married, 231 00:15:14,120 --> 00:15:17,080 Speaker 1: but I'm probably not the best person to ask for advice. 232 00:15:17,200 --> 00:15:20,760 Speaker 1: So what advice do you have and what would you 233 00:15:20,800 --> 00:15:23,920 Speaker 1: tell her or encourage her with? And what should I 234 00:15:24,000 --> 00:15:26,960 Speaker 1: tell her? Thank you for answering PS. She tells me 235 00:15:27,800 --> 00:15:30,640 Speaker 1: ninety seven percent of the details about her marriage, and 236 00:15:30,680 --> 00:15:33,160 Speaker 1: she doesn't have a whole lot of friends, and he 237 00:15:33,240 --> 00:15:36,080 Speaker 1: has quite a few drinking buddies. I think I got 238 00:15:36,120 --> 00:15:40,880 Speaker 1: the situation. Christine. Thanks for thanks for opening up with 239 00:15:40,920 --> 00:15:43,480 Speaker 1: this and bringing your friend, and know that this is 240 00:15:43,520 --> 00:15:46,520 Speaker 1: going to be difficult for both of y'all, especially her. 241 00:15:47,760 --> 00:15:57,400 Speaker 1: So the last few years of doing this podcast, I 242 00:15:57,520 --> 00:15:59,920 Speaker 1: worry and you guys could you guys could let me 243 00:15:59,920 --> 00:16:02,480 Speaker 1: know by commenting. But which is in fact might be 244 00:16:02,480 --> 00:16:06,320 Speaker 1: a good point to make right now. If you want 245 00:16:06,360 --> 00:16:09,160 Speaker 1: to comment on something I'm saying, or double down on 246 00:16:09,320 --> 00:16:13,200 Speaker 1: something I'm saying, go to the YouTube version of this 247 00:16:13,280 --> 00:16:14,800 Speaker 1: and you could be listening anywhere, but go to the 248 00:16:15,040 --> 00:16:19,120 Speaker 1: go to YouTube on you can just google or YouTube 249 00:16:19,160 --> 00:16:22,960 Speaker 1: Granger Smith podcast and go to this episode and then 250 00:16:23,040 --> 00:16:25,800 Speaker 1: go comment below your thoughts. You could do that on 251 00:16:25,880 --> 00:16:28,840 Speaker 1: any episode and I'll check those out, and that way 252 00:16:28,880 --> 00:16:31,440 Speaker 1: we could have also have a dialogue that way. But 253 00:16:31,680 --> 00:16:35,480 Speaker 1: there is a theme that that it's been like a 254 00:16:35,600 --> 00:16:39,360 Speaker 1: thread just kind of threading its way through these last 255 00:16:39,440 --> 00:16:44,720 Speaker 1: few years, and that is this the lack of a good, 256 00:16:45,120 --> 00:16:52,600 Speaker 1: healthy local church is so commonly the root of many problems. 257 00:16:55,040 --> 00:16:56,640 Speaker 1: I said it on the last that was part of 258 00:16:56,640 --> 00:16:59,760 Speaker 1: the last answer. It's part of this answer. I don't 259 00:16:59,800 --> 00:17:01,680 Speaker 1: have it read the next question yet, but it's probably 260 00:17:02,160 --> 00:17:08,159 Speaker 1: part of the next question as well. I hope, and 261 00:17:08,200 --> 00:17:12,080 Speaker 1: really my hope for this this podcast is that And 262 00:17:12,119 --> 00:17:14,280 Speaker 1: I understand that not everyone's a Christian that listens, and 263 00:17:14,960 --> 00:17:18,800 Speaker 1: I completely get that, and this isn't a Christian only podcast, 264 00:17:19,760 --> 00:17:22,560 Speaker 1: but I do hope that people they start to hear 265 00:17:22,600 --> 00:17:26,040 Speaker 1: me repeating things and it starts to sink in, like 266 00:17:26,040 --> 00:17:29,240 Speaker 1: like roots getting deeper and deeper into the soil. Really, 267 00:17:29,280 --> 00:17:33,439 Speaker 1: that's that's part of the hope for this. And so 268 00:17:34,040 --> 00:17:36,840 Speaker 1: when you say talking about your friend, you say she's 269 00:17:36,880 --> 00:17:41,600 Speaker 1: a Christian, and then you go into this big exposition 270 00:17:41,640 --> 00:17:45,720 Speaker 1: of why she's having huge problems. My mind, I always 271 00:17:45,760 --> 00:17:50,480 Speaker 1: wonder where's the pastor like, where where's her church? Where 272 00:17:50,480 --> 00:17:55,040 Speaker 1: are her sisters, who's taking her to lunch, who's taking 273 00:17:55,040 --> 00:17:58,400 Speaker 1: her to Bible study and walking through these things with her, 274 00:17:58,960 --> 00:18:03,199 Speaker 1: Who's counseling her, Who's who's encouraging her, Who's who's crying 275 00:18:03,240 --> 00:18:06,119 Speaker 1: with her, Who's saying coming over to my house, honey, 276 00:18:06,240 --> 00:18:09,240 Speaker 1: come to my house and sleep on our couch as 277 00:18:09,280 --> 00:18:11,840 Speaker 1: long as you want. While he's your husband's off doing this, 278 00:18:12,280 --> 00:18:15,879 Speaker 1: who's doing that? Because that's once again, just like the 279 00:18:15,960 --> 00:18:20,040 Speaker 1: last question, that's how a good church should be, functioning 280 00:18:20,880 --> 00:18:26,760 Speaker 1: like a family gathering of the body of believers. Okay, 281 00:18:27,160 --> 00:18:31,800 Speaker 1: so that's right off the bat. Let's go there. We're 282 00:18:31,800 --> 00:18:34,280 Speaker 1: gonna I'm gonna say a couple of things. He wants 283 00:18:34,280 --> 00:18:39,040 Speaker 1: an open relationship. That's adultery. That's grounds for divorce in 284 00:18:39,080 --> 00:18:43,560 Speaker 1: the Bible. An open relationship is adultery. I don't I 285 00:18:43,600 --> 00:18:46,679 Speaker 1: don't know, there's there's not a that might be like 286 00:18:46,720 --> 00:18:49,199 Speaker 1: a nice way an open relationship might be like a 287 00:18:49,280 --> 00:18:51,920 Speaker 1: nice way of saying he wants to cheat on you, 288 00:18:51,920 --> 00:18:56,320 Speaker 1: you know, which is weird to me. He says, hey, babe, 289 00:18:56,359 --> 00:18:59,200 Speaker 1: I want to cheat on you. Is that cool? And 290 00:18:59,240 --> 00:19:03,240 Speaker 1: she's like, no, I'm not open to that. That. See, 291 00:19:03,320 --> 00:19:05,640 Speaker 1: when you change the word, it just gets way more 292 00:19:05,640 --> 00:19:08,359 Speaker 1: intense and you kind of reveal. It's kind of like 293 00:19:08,400 --> 00:19:11,000 Speaker 1: flipping the lights on in an old motel room and 294 00:19:11,040 --> 00:19:13,679 Speaker 1: all the cockroaches start running everywhere. You don't see the 295 00:19:13,680 --> 00:19:15,439 Speaker 1: cockroaches in the dark, and you flip on the light 296 00:19:15,440 --> 00:19:17,600 Speaker 1: and you see them running everywhere. That's what happens when 297 00:19:17,600 --> 00:19:21,359 Speaker 1: you change that word. Open relationship to adultery. She's not 298 00:19:21,480 --> 00:19:24,119 Speaker 1: open to that. I wonder why, of course she's not 299 00:19:24,200 --> 00:19:27,040 Speaker 1: open to that. And then you say she's at the 300 00:19:27,119 --> 00:19:31,359 Speaker 1: end of a rope and doesn't know what to do. Yeah, 301 00:19:31,520 --> 00:19:35,040 Speaker 1: I could, of course. She's twenty one years old. She 302 00:19:35,040 --> 00:19:37,200 Speaker 1: has a husband that just doesn't want anything to do 303 00:19:37,280 --> 00:19:40,520 Speaker 1: with God, wants to use her for her body. She's 304 00:19:40,560 --> 00:19:43,159 Speaker 1: not really down for that. And now he's asking to 305 00:19:43,240 --> 00:19:46,160 Speaker 1: cheat on her. If she's cool with that, and she's 306 00:19:46,200 --> 00:19:51,760 Speaker 1: not part of the part of the problem, if it's 307 00:19:51,760 --> 00:19:55,480 Speaker 1: not a problem yet, is the sentence she said you 308 00:19:55,560 --> 00:19:59,720 Speaker 1: said she has a bunch of best friends that are 309 00:19:59,720 --> 00:20:04,600 Speaker 1: got is that she messages and gets advice from. Not cool. 310 00:20:04,920 --> 00:20:08,120 Speaker 1: That's that's not gonna that's not gonna fix anything. That's 311 00:20:08,160 --> 00:20:10,720 Speaker 1: not gonna help anything. It can only make it worse. 312 00:20:11,240 --> 00:20:14,680 Speaker 1: Seeking counsel from best friends that are guys. When you're 313 00:20:14,720 --> 00:20:17,480 Speaker 1: married and you're talking about your husband and you're trying 314 00:20:17,520 --> 00:20:19,960 Speaker 1: to get advice from them, and your husband's asking you 315 00:20:20,359 --> 00:20:23,320 Speaker 1: to cheat on you, and meanwhile you're messaging these guys 316 00:20:23,359 --> 00:20:25,840 Speaker 1: saying what should I do? That's going to lead to 317 00:20:25,880 --> 00:20:29,639 Speaker 1: something worse, and you don't want to do that. I 318 00:20:29,680 --> 00:20:32,479 Speaker 1: think I think you understand what I'm talking about here. 319 00:20:32,520 --> 00:20:34,720 Speaker 1: That's nothing good can come out of it, can come 320 00:20:34,760 --> 00:20:37,440 Speaker 1: out of that. And so so what do you do 321 00:20:39,880 --> 00:20:43,399 Speaker 1: she is I would counsel her to first be in 322 00:20:43,400 --> 00:20:47,040 Speaker 1: a local church, to seek the counsel from the sisters 323 00:20:47,119 --> 00:20:53,199 Speaker 1: there and the pastor's plural, because the same problem is 324 00:20:53,240 --> 00:20:57,800 Speaker 1: created if you're in a church and you're seeking private 325 00:20:57,840 --> 00:21:00,480 Speaker 1: counsel from one pastor. That should never happen. A woman 326 00:21:01,440 --> 00:21:07,040 Speaker 1: would never seek counsel alone with a pastor, much less 327 00:21:07,040 --> 00:21:11,160 Speaker 1: of a guy friend. But that includes pastors. So hey, 328 00:21:11,240 --> 00:21:14,520 Speaker 1: make let's let's make that aware as well. She's having 329 00:21:14,560 --> 00:21:17,399 Speaker 1: problem with with her marriage, she's not gonna it's not 330 00:21:17,440 --> 00:21:19,280 Speaker 1: going to fix anything by going to a local church 331 00:21:19,680 --> 00:21:22,680 Speaker 1: and sitting privately with a pastor that's a male. That's 332 00:21:22,720 --> 00:21:27,919 Speaker 1: not gonna work. So plural, you know, a plurality of elders, 333 00:21:28,000 --> 00:21:32,480 Speaker 1: she's gonna sit with them two or more. Uh, and 334 00:21:32,680 --> 00:21:35,679 Speaker 1: with women, she's gonna sit with women, and she's gonna 335 00:21:36,080 --> 00:21:38,479 Speaker 1: she's been going to coffee with these, with these ladies. 336 00:21:38,920 --> 00:21:43,000 Speaker 1: And probably I don't I don't know, that's my advice. Well, 337 00:21:43,040 --> 00:21:45,560 Speaker 1: you could end it there, but probably what would happen 338 00:21:46,160 --> 00:21:48,639 Speaker 1: if she does that is they're going to take her 339 00:21:48,680 --> 00:21:50,439 Speaker 1: out for coffee and they're gonna be like, hey, you 340 00:21:50,440 --> 00:21:53,400 Speaker 1: need to you need to be separated, because if he's 341 00:21:53,400 --> 00:21:57,840 Speaker 1: asking for an open relationship, he's probably already cheating on you. 342 00:21:57,880 --> 00:21:59,879 Speaker 1: We need to separate you and you guys need to 343 00:21:59,920 --> 00:22:05,480 Speaker 1: have some biblical counseling together, some marriage counseling, and I 344 00:22:05,520 --> 00:22:07,600 Speaker 1: would imagine you kick the can a little bit further. 345 00:22:08,119 --> 00:22:11,520 Speaker 1: That's going to open up bigger problems. But you don't 346 00:22:11,520 --> 00:22:17,080 Speaker 1: know what those problems are until you separate and you 347 00:22:17,840 --> 00:22:20,359 Speaker 1: find a local church, you seek wise counsel in the church. 348 00:22:20,920 --> 00:22:22,840 Speaker 1: That's probably that's the end of my advice. Then it's 349 00:22:22,840 --> 00:22:26,920 Speaker 1: probably going to lead to separating, and then after separating, 350 00:22:26,960 --> 00:22:30,280 Speaker 1: then you're gonna be going to counseling together probably and 351 00:22:30,280 --> 00:22:32,280 Speaker 1: then that's probably going to turn on more lights with 352 00:22:32,400 --> 00:22:35,520 Speaker 1: more cockroaches running everywhere. But this is where this is 353 00:22:35,520 --> 00:22:38,760 Speaker 1: where it starts. So you can't take the last step. 354 00:22:38,800 --> 00:22:42,760 Speaker 1: You got to take the first step. So it's a 355 00:22:42,800 --> 00:22:46,240 Speaker 1: tough situation. But if she's claiming to be a Christian, 356 00:22:48,280 --> 00:22:50,800 Speaker 1: she has to be involved with this local church. She 357 00:22:50,920 --> 00:22:55,880 Speaker 1: has to There is no advice that comes in front 358 00:22:55,880 --> 00:23:00,840 Speaker 1: of that one, because through the low Church will also 359 00:23:00,840 --> 00:23:04,760 Speaker 1: be seeking God herself. She'll be she'll be seeking the 360 00:23:04,800 --> 00:23:08,320 Speaker 1: Lord through his word in the Bible. Her spiritual disciplines 361 00:23:08,320 --> 00:23:11,040 Speaker 1: will increase. We could start with that and tell her 362 00:23:11,080 --> 00:23:13,359 Speaker 1: to do that stuff. But if she's outside of the body, 363 00:23:13,480 --> 00:23:15,560 Speaker 1: you remember what I said in that last question, then 364 00:23:15,600 --> 00:23:18,200 Speaker 1: she's just an eye without an ear. She's an ear 365 00:23:18,240 --> 00:23:22,160 Speaker 1: without a hand, a hand without a nose. She can't 366 00:23:22,200 --> 00:23:25,919 Speaker 1: do it. She's not made to be alone, and she 367 00:23:26,040 --> 00:23:29,199 Speaker 1: can't do this alone. The Bible would say you can't 368 00:23:29,520 --> 00:23:32,440 Speaker 1: do it alone, just like the first question when she said, 369 00:23:32,760 --> 00:23:34,720 Speaker 1: I don't know what it is by a crave to 370 00:23:34,760 --> 00:23:37,359 Speaker 1: be part of the community. That's part of the reason 371 00:23:37,440 --> 00:23:40,800 Speaker 1: is when when trouble happens, when suffering and affliction in 372 00:23:40,520 --> 00:23:45,520 Speaker 1: the world brings troubling, troubling things to you, the community 373 00:23:45,720 --> 00:23:51,720 Speaker 1: is is how you're fortified. Right, that's the foundation that 374 00:23:51,800 --> 00:23:55,639 Speaker 1: you You want to be in this community to stand 375 00:23:55,720 --> 00:24:00,439 Speaker 1: on the foundation of faith of the community believers, and 376 00:24:00,480 --> 00:24:03,959 Speaker 1: you're fortified to move forward in the suffering. Hey, if 377 00:24:03,960 --> 00:24:05,119 Speaker 1: you want to get a hold of me, go to 378 00:24:05,200 --> 00:24:09,320 Speaker 1: cameo dot com. Slash Grangersmith at is cameeo dot com 379 00:24:09,320 --> 00:24:11,800 Speaker 1: slash granger Smith. And what that allows you to do 380 00:24:12,040 --> 00:24:14,399 Speaker 1: is I can make you a video message according to 381 00:24:14,480 --> 00:24:16,960 Speaker 1: whatever you want me to say. It could be happy birthday, 382 00:24:17,000 --> 00:24:20,840 Speaker 1: happy anniversary, a word of encouragement, even at prayer request. 383 00:24:21,480 --> 00:24:23,080 Speaker 1: And I love these. They come straight to my phone. 384 00:24:23,119 --> 00:24:25,640 Speaker 1: I pull out my phone, I pull out my selfie 385 00:24:25,640 --> 00:24:28,680 Speaker 1: camera and I begin to send you a message according 386 00:24:28,720 --> 00:24:30,520 Speaker 1: to what you want me to say. This is great, 387 00:24:30,680 --> 00:24:33,400 Speaker 1: especially with the holidays coming. To get someone a gift 388 00:24:33,440 --> 00:24:35,639 Speaker 1: that you just don't know what to give them, well, 389 00:24:35,920 --> 00:24:39,120 Speaker 1: get them a video message from me at cameo dot 390 00:24:39,119 --> 00:24:42,560 Speaker 1: com slash Grangersmith. Okay, if you have a question for me, 391 00:24:42,640 --> 00:24:46,639 Speaker 1: email podcast at grangersmith dot com. There is no limit 392 00:24:46,680 --> 00:24:48,840 Speaker 1: to what you could ask about it subject could be anything. 393 00:24:49,640 --> 00:24:51,200 Speaker 1: We'll find out what this next one is. It comes 394 00:24:51,200 --> 00:24:53,520 Speaker 1: from Jake and it says, Hey, Grainger, thank you for 395 00:24:53,560 --> 00:24:55,680 Speaker 1: the podcast. I've been listening for a while now. I've 396 00:24:55,680 --> 00:24:58,199 Speaker 1: picked up on some things you've mentioned about fame, the 397 00:24:58,320 --> 00:25:01,399 Speaker 1: music industry, and pride, and I've been mulling over what 398 00:25:01,480 --> 00:25:03,800 Speaker 1: to say for some time now. And I heard the 399 00:25:03,800 --> 00:25:06,880 Speaker 1: episode called I Left Music because it was a sin 400 00:25:07,280 --> 00:25:11,000 Speaker 1: which prompted my response below. I'm a local artist. In 401 00:25:11,080 --> 00:25:13,879 Speaker 1: order to get anywhere with my music, I've got to 402 00:25:13,960 --> 00:25:17,639 Speaker 1: promote myself. It's always felt weird, and your words have 403 00:25:17,760 --> 00:25:22,160 Speaker 1: convicted me to have to make a decision. Now I've 404 00:25:22,200 --> 00:25:25,639 Speaker 1: sought wisdom from my pastor and another local pastor that 405 00:25:25,720 --> 00:25:29,120 Speaker 1: I look up to. My challenge to your thoughts slash 406 00:25:29,160 --> 00:25:32,879 Speaker 1: stance is this, how then, is anyone to put up 407 00:25:32,960 --> 00:25:36,480 Speaker 1: music for God and other people, for other people to 408 00:25:36,600 --> 00:25:41,440 Speaker 1: be able to enjoy, listen, and worship belong with it. 409 00:25:41,440 --> 00:25:45,919 Speaker 1: It facilitates worship by creating new songs about or to God. 410 00:25:46,680 --> 00:25:49,480 Speaker 1: So someone has to do it right. How can the 411 00:25:49,560 --> 00:25:52,680 Speaker 1: music get to people without being promoted and the artist 412 00:25:52,760 --> 00:25:56,000 Speaker 1: becoming famous. I know that God always uses as people, 413 00:25:56,320 --> 00:26:00,560 Speaker 1: though they are not one hundred percent correct one hundred 414 00:26:00,560 --> 00:26:04,480 Speaker 1: percent correct. So in this situation where yes, there is 415 00:26:04,520 --> 00:26:07,639 Speaker 1: pride at the root of it, and people people that 416 00:26:07,680 --> 00:26:11,399 Speaker 1: you could could idolize you for the sake of bringing 417 00:26:11,480 --> 00:26:14,840 Speaker 1: music to people for the worship of God, we push 418 00:26:14,920 --> 00:26:18,400 Speaker 1: forward anyway, trying our hardest not to allow pride and idolatry, 419 00:26:18,720 --> 00:26:21,080 Speaker 1: and knowing that we will probably fail, but rely on 420 00:26:21,119 --> 00:26:23,480 Speaker 1: God for his mercy and grace because of the ultimate 421 00:26:23,520 --> 00:26:29,359 Speaker 1: goal in this to praise him with music. Okay, Jake, 422 00:26:29,600 --> 00:26:31,840 Speaker 1: I appreciate your brother so much and thank you for 423 00:26:32,800 --> 00:26:39,000 Speaker 1: thinking through this. And I truly it's encouraging to be challenged, 424 00:26:39,160 --> 00:26:43,080 Speaker 1: because I certainly need to be challenged, and all the 425 00:26:43,119 --> 00:26:47,119 Speaker 1: thoughts that I throw out on this podcast need to 426 00:26:47,480 --> 00:26:50,800 Speaker 1: need to be thought through. And no one should take 427 00:26:51,119 --> 00:26:53,520 Speaker 1: what I say on this podcast and create a manuscript 428 00:26:53,560 --> 00:26:56,840 Speaker 1: and then publish it. You know, because I said before 429 00:26:57,600 --> 00:27:01,280 Speaker 1: at the earlier earlier in the break said that I 430 00:27:01,320 --> 00:27:07,120 Speaker 1: don't have notes. These are just thoughts. And so sometimes 431 00:27:07,240 --> 00:27:09,479 Speaker 1: you could say that I might have a thought that 432 00:27:09,640 --> 00:27:12,879 Speaker 1: just comes out that I should probably think through, and 433 00:27:12,920 --> 00:27:15,639 Speaker 1: if I had the chance to think through it again, 434 00:27:16,160 --> 00:27:20,560 Speaker 1: maybe I would say it differently. And for a lot 435 00:27:20,560 --> 00:27:23,000 Speaker 1: of episodes, I don't have a guest, like today, have 436 00:27:23,000 --> 00:27:25,280 Speaker 1: an empty chair sitting next to me. I don't have 437 00:27:25,359 --> 00:27:29,600 Speaker 1: Marshall or Parker or Chat or aunt Man or Bernie 438 00:27:30,080 --> 00:27:32,640 Speaker 1: sitting with me. And it's good to have those guys 439 00:27:32,640 --> 00:27:35,119 Speaker 1: because sometimes they'll be able to push back in real time. 440 00:27:35,640 --> 00:27:37,480 Speaker 1: But today it's just me. It's me and you, Jake, 441 00:27:38,040 --> 00:27:40,760 Speaker 1: and I'm going to take your challenge, and I'm going 442 00:27:40,800 --> 00:27:45,199 Speaker 1: to dig into it. So here's your thought. You're a 443 00:27:45,200 --> 00:27:49,920 Speaker 1: local artist. You've been convicted because you're thinking, man, i've 444 00:27:49,920 --> 00:27:52,280 Speaker 1: heard Granger say that he left music because he was 445 00:27:52,359 --> 00:27:55,840 Speaker 1: trying to promote himself, and now I'm feeling that feel 446 00:27:55,840 --> 00:27:59,000 Speaker 1: a little funny about that. So you've sought counsel from 447 00:27:59,040 --> 00:28:03,800 Speaker 1: your pastor great? Great, that's you know, that was the 448 00:28:03,840 --> 00:28:07,560 Speaker 1: first place I would usually go. And so you've done that. Excellent. 449 00:28:07,880 --> 00:28:12,600 Speaker 1: I'm so glad you're wrestling through that with him. But 450 00:28:12,600 --> 00:28:16,400 Speaker 1: then you're thinking, Okay, well, there's the the flip side 451 00:28:16,400 --> 00:28:21,440 Speaker 1: of the coin, Granger. If I don't promote myself, then 452 00:28:21,480 --> 00:28:24,119 Speaker 1: no one's going to hear my music. And if I 453 00:28:24,160 --> 00:28:26,080 Speaker 1: put up music for God, if I write music or 454 00:28:26,119 --> 00:28:28,840 Speaker 1: perform music for God and no one hears it, then 455 00:28:28,880 --> 00:28:32,439 Speaker 1: what's the purpose? And if everyone did this, then no 456 00:28:32,480 --> 00:28:38,520 Speaker 1: one would hear music from God's that's the argument. And 457 00:28:38,560 --> 00:28:42,479 Speaker 1: then here's the back half of your argument. God always 458 00:28:42,640 --> 00:28:48,400 Speaker 1: uses flawed people for his good. He uses people for 459 00:28:48,480 --> 00:28:51,400 Speaker 1: his good, and all people are flawed, and so therefore 460 00:28:51,880 --> 00:28:57,520 Speaker 1: he uses broken, sinful note correct in your terms people 461 00:28:58,120 --> 00:29:04,320 Speaker 1: to glorify himself. Yeah, and so everything we just said, 462 00:29:04,600 --> 00:29:08,600 Speaker 1: I would say, yes, okay, I got it, I understand. 463 00:29:10,600 --> 00:29:13,120 Speaker 1: Here's the other thing. We'll start here. We'll start with 464 00:29:13,160 --> 00:29:19,560 Speaker 1: the God uses flawed people. We'll start there. You're absolutely right, 465 00:29:20,200 --> 00:29:26,320 Speaker 1: God uses flawed people for good for his glory, but 466 00:29:27,720 --> 00:29:31,520 Speaker 1: that is never an excuse for us to continue in 467 00:29:31,560 --> 00:29:37,959 Speaker 1: the flawed way. We never continue in sin and pride. 468 00:29:38,240 --> 00:29:41,640 Speaker 1: Pride is what we're talking about here. We would never 469 00:29:41,880 --> 00:29:49,840 Speaker 1: move forward knowingly sinning pridefully and then say I'm doing 470 00:29:49,880 --> 00:29:52,920 Speaker 1: this because I'm not perfect and God will use my 471 00:29:53,440 --> 00:29:58,840 Speaker 1: imperfection for his glory. The Bible would never speak in 472 00:29:58,880 --> 00:30:01,960 Speaker 1: those kind of terms or advocate that, And we also 473 00:30:02,000 --> 00:30:06,280 Speaker 1: don't see an example of that being what we're supposed 474 00:30:06,280 --> 00:30:11,920 Speaker 1: to do as believers. Instead, we're called to constantly eradicate 475 00:30:12,000 --> 00:30:17,640 Speaker 1: our sin. Jesus speaks so seriously about sin that he says, 476 00:30:17,800 --> 00:30:22,400 Speaker 1: if your eye causes you to stumble, gouge it out right. 477 00:30:22,880 --> 00:30:26,640 Speaker 1: If your hand causes you to stumble, cut it off. 478 00:30:27,400 --> 00:30:32,200 Speaker 1: You know, he doesn't speak lightly about it. Jesus is 479 00:30:32,240 --> 00:30:36,680 Speaker 1: not saying if your hand causes you to stumble, it's okay, 480 00:30:36,800 --> 00:30:40,040 Speaker 1: because God uses all things for good and for his 481 00:30:40,160 --> 00:30:46,640 Speaker 1: glory nobody's perfect. The Bible doesn't speak in that way. Now, 482 00:30:47,000 --> 00:30:48,760 Speaker 1: we know that no one's perfect, and we know that 483 00:30:48,760 --> 00:30:51,240 Speaker 1: God uses all things for good for his glory, and 484 00:30:51,280 --> 00:30:53,480 Speaker 1: we know that he uses flawed, bad things for good. 485 00:30:53,600 --> 00:30:56,960 Speaker 1: We know that, but that doesn't take away the fact 486 00:30:56,960 --> 00:31:01,480 Speaker 1: that the Bible also says be perfect for your heavenly Father, 487 00:31:01,520 --> 00:31:06,240 Speaker 1: it's perfect. Another way to say this is pursue holiness. 488 00:31:06,680 --> 00:31:10,400 Speaker 1: Seek holiness at all costs. Not because the seeking saves you, 489 00:31:10,760 --> 00:31:13,760 Speaker 1: not because the holiness that you create saves you. That's 490 00:31:13,800 --> 00:31:21,080 Speaker 1: not what we're talking about. But a faithful saved Christian 491 00:31:22,440 --> 00:31:26,320 Speaker 1: always seeks holiness as a result of the saving faith 492 00:31:27,520 --> 00:31:32,760 Speaker 1: that was gifted to them by the Lord. And what 493 00:31:32,800 --> 00:31:37,160 Speaker 1: we don't do as saved Christians is continue in sin. 494 00:31:38,880 --> 00:31:43,840 Speaker 1: Notice I didn't say that we don't sin, but we do, 495 00:31:44,320 --> 00:31:47,880 Speaker 1: but we don't continue in it because we always try. 496 00:31:48,680 --> 00:31:53,960 Speaker 1: We try to eradicate it, seeking holiness, pursuing holiness because 497 00:31:53,960 --> 00:31:57,000 Speaker 1: that is our sanctification and that is Listen to this. 498 00:31:57,480 --> 00:32:02,560 Speaker 1: That is God's will for your life to be holy. Now, 499 00:32:02,800 --> 00:32:06,920 Speaker 1: to say God's will for your life is somewhat complex, 500 00:32:07,600 --> 00:32:10,560 Speaker 1: but certainly part of it is for you to be holy. 501 00:32:10,680 --> 00:32:15,120 Speaker 1: That is his will for you. It is not to 502 00:32:15,320 --> 00:32:17,520 Speaker 1: sin so that he could use your music to get 503 00:32:17,560 --> 00:32:19,880 Speaker 1: to a lot of people. His will for you is 504 00:32:19,920 --> 00:32:23,840 Speaker 1: to be holy. And if music is causing you to 505 00:32:23,840 --> 00:32:27,600 Speaker 1: be prideful and prideful pridefulness is a sin, then cut 506 00:32:27,640 --> 00:32:31,240 Speaker 1: it off, like Jesus would say about your eye. Gouge 507 00:32:31,280 --> 00:32:35,640 Speaker 1: it out. Okay, So let me continue building the argument 508 00:32:39,400 --> 00:32:46,480 Speaker 1: to say that no one can enjoy music unless it 509 00:32:46,480 --> 00:32:49,880 Speaker 1: comes from a famous person. Ah, you know it's weird, right, 510 00:32:50,440 --> 00:32:55,760 Speaker 1: You know that's not true because famous musicians is a 511 00:32:56,000 --> 00:32:58,880 Speaker 1: is a recent thing. I mean, for the most part, 512 00:33:00,080 --> 00:33:02,560 Speaker 1: only in the last one hundred years. You can go 513 00:33:02,640 --> 00:33:06,040 Speaker 1: back to you could talk about Beethoven and Mozart. But 514 00:33:07,200 --> 00:33:10,760 Speaker 1: to talk about in terms of what you're saying, an 515 00:33:10,880 --> 00:33:16,800 Speaker 1: artist promoting, being promoted, promoting himself, and then becoming famous, 516 00:33:16,360 --> 00:33:20,920 Speaker 1: that's like almost just shive a one hundred years old 517 00:33:21,120 --> 00:33:25,920 Speaker 1: in the history of humanity. So to say that music 518 00:33:26,440 --> 00:33:28,800 Speaker 1: needs to come from a famous person, and the famous 519 00:33:28,800 --> 00:33:31,440 Speaker 1: person needs to promote themselves otherwise the music doesn't get 520 00:33:31,480 --> 00:33:34,320 Speaker 1: heard that we can make a thousand arguments of why 521 00:33:34,320 --> 00:33:39,040 Speaker 1: that's just not true. So many of the old hymn 522 00:33:39,080 --> 00:33:44,719 Speaker 1: writers wrote thousands of hymns, and they never had the 523 00:33:44,720 --> 00:33:48,160 Speaker 1: intention of being that their name being connected to it 524 00:33:48,440 --> 00:33:51,680 Speaker 1: and them needing to promote themselves so that the hymn 525 00:33:52,960 --> 00:33:57,520 Speaker 1: was heard and used for God's praise. That's never been 526 00:33:57,520 --> 00:34:03,520 Speaker 1: the case. That's this is a brand new mentality, and 527 00:34:03,960 --> 00:34:07,200 Speaker 1: even since the rise of social media has that idea 528 00:34:08,000 --> 00:34:13,880 Speaker 1: really solidified. So let's read it. Let's read again with 529 00:34:13,960 --> 00:34:16,480 Speaker 1: all these things in mind. Let's read these things. How then, 530 00:34:16,560 --> 00:34:19,120 Speaker 1: is anyone to put up music for God? You say, 531 00:34:19,719 --> 00:34:21,560 Speaker 1: so that other people can enjoy it and listen to 532 00:34:21,600 --> 00:34:27,120 Speaker 1: it and worship along with it. And then you say 533 00:34:27,200 --> 00:34:30,280 Speaker 1: it facilitates worship by creating new songs about God. Someone 534 00:34:30,320 --> 00:34:32,359 Speaker 1: has to do it. And how can the music get 535 00:34:32,360 --> 00:34:35,799 Speaker 1: out there without being promoted? I think of a lot 536 00:34:35,840 --> 00:34:38,359 Speaker 1: of ways. I think I can think of a lot 537 00:34:38,360 --> 00:34:44,239 Speaker 1: of ways of how a song about God could could 538 00:34:44,400 --> 00:34:47,839 Speaker 1: be used by God for his people to worship him 539 00:34:48,200 --> 00:34:54,400 Speaker 1: without the person who created it being famous or promoting themselves. However, 540 00:34:55,120 --> 00:34:59,440 Speaker 1: I don't think that's your argument. I think you're kind 541 00:34:59,440 --> 00:35:02,040 Speaker 1: of looking for it technicality in the argument that you're 542 00:35:02,320 --> 00:35:06,239 Speaker 1: pushing back on me with your challenge. I don't think 543 00:35:06,280 --> 00:35:11,600 Speaker 1: that's what you want to do. And so I would say, brother, 544 00:35:12,280 --> 00:35:14,040 Speaker 1: search your heart on this. And this has come from 545 00:35:14,040 --> 00:35:17,040 Speaker 1: one artist to the next. Jake, I would say, search 546 00:35:17,080 --> 00:35:22,200 Speaker 1: your heart and figure out this. Took me years to 547 00:35:22,320 --> 00:35:27,080 Speaker 1: test myself figure out where the motivation is coming from 548 00:35:28,680 --> 00:35:33,920 Speaker 1: to promote yourself to be famous. Is the motivation to 549 00:35:33,920 --> 00:35:39,520 Speaker 1: be famous coming on solely so that God may be glorified, 550 00:35:40,520 --> 00:35:45,959 Speaker 1: or is it coming maybe maybe in a large part 551 00:35:47,440 --> 00:35:52,600 Speaker 1: by you desiring to be famous or desiring to be 552 00:35:52,680 --> 00:35:57,920 Speaker 1: successful in music. That's something to really wrestle with, something 553 00:35:57,960 --> 00:36:01,359 Speaker 1: to really think through, and I think your answer will 554 00:36:01,360 --> 00:36:04,279 Speaker 1: be surprising. I mean, I would go so far as 555 00:36:04,280 --> 00:36:07,080 Speaker 1: to fast over this. I would go so far as 556 00:36:07,080 --> 00:36:14,399 Speaker 1: to to to seek some kind of wilderness. We see 557 00:36:14,400 --> 00:36:18,640 Speaker 1: this these kind of spiritual disciplines with Jesus himself seeking 558 00:36:18,719 --> 00:36:24,320 Speaker 1: a quiet place, seeking the desert or the woods. Fasting 559 00:36:24,480 --> 00:36:28,680 Speaker 1: in this I'm saying. I'm actually saying that because next week, 560 00:36:29,080 --> 00:36:30,680 Speaker 1: as I record this next week, I'm going to be 561 00:36:30,840 --> 00:36:36,160 Speaker 1: five days in the absolute barren desert, fasting for some 562 00:36:36,239 --> 00:36:38,960 Speaker 1: things that I'm I'm working through, things that I need 563 00:36:39,000 --> 00:36:43,000 Speaker 1: to be doing. So maybe that's something you can think about. 564 00:36:44,560 --> 00:36:47,759 Speaker 1: I would I would make sure your spiritual disciplines are 565 00:36:47,800 --> 00:36:52,160 Speaker 1: locked in in your your personal Bible reading time, your 566 00:36:52,200 --> 00:36:59,480 Speaker 1: your personal prayer life, your Bible memory, scripture memory that 567 00:36:59,560 --> 00:37:06,160 Speaker 1: your metadating on scripture consistency, sitting under a local church. 568 00:37:06,480 --> 00:37:09,319 Speaker 1: Remember that was one of my arguments against being a 569 00:37:09,320 --> 00:37:15,440 Speaker 1: famous singer, is you're sacrificing your Sunday mornings because typically 570 00:37:15,480 --> 00:37:22,279 Speaker 1: you're out on a Saturday night traveling somewhere. So don't 571 00:37:22,320 --> 00:37:25,680 Speaker 1: make yourself out to be a hero. I'm all finished 572 00:37:25,680 --> 00:37:30,880 Speaker 1: with that idea. If you are struggling with the thought, 573 00:37:31,120 --> 00:37:36,720 Speaker 1: if you're challenged, convicted by the thought that self promotion 574 00:37:37,920 --> 00:37:41,239 Speaker 1: is not taking up your cross, denying yourself taking up 575 00:37:41,239 --> 00:37:46,439 Speaker 1: your cross and following Jesus, or making more of him 576 00:37:46,760 --> 00:37:50,000 Speaker 1: and less of you, if you find that that doesn't reconcile, 577 00:37:50,680 --> 00:37:54,160 Speaker 1: and you're convicted with your current lifestyle, I will say, 578 00:37:54,160 --> 00:37:57,759 Speaker 1: first of all, that's very much sound like the Holy 579 00:37:57,800 --> 00:38:01,359 Speaker 1: Spirit convicting you in that. And then I would say, 580 00:38:01,360 --> 00:38:05,960 Speaker 1: don't make yourself a hero, because you don't want to 581 00:38:06,800 --> 00:38:09,720 Speaker 1: self appoint yourself as a martyr of sin and pride 582 00:38:10,080 --> 00:38:12,160 Speaker 1: so that all these other people could listen to your 583 00:38:12,200 --> 00:38:16,880 Speaker 1: songs and worship God. Don't be that guy. Don't be 584 00:38:17,120 --> 00:38:23,000 Speaker 1: the guy. Yeah, I think all the end right there. 585 00:38:23,160 --> 00:38:27,320 Speaker 1: I think only in there, Jake, will you keep in 586 00:38:27,360 --> 00:38:29,799 Speaker 1: touch brother? Will you email back to so that I 587 00:38:29,800 --> 00:38:33,080 Speaker 1: could hear. I'd love to hear your journey and how 588 00:38:33,120 --> 00:38:35,640 Speaker 1: you're continuing to wrestle through this. And I would love 589 00:38:35,680 --> 00:38:38,279 Speaker 1: to be a sounding board once again. Not that I'm right, 590 00:38:39,040 --> 00:38:42,240 Speaker 1: but I would love to just hear how your journey continues. 591 00:38:44,239 --> 00:38:47,400 Speaker 1: Next question comes from one of my favorite people that 592 00:38:47,480 --> 00:38:51,520 Speaker 1: writes in, and that's the person that's named Anonymous. This 593 00:38:51,600 --> 00:38:54,520 Speaker 1: person writes in all the time. It says, hey, there, 594 00:38:54,520 --> 00:38:57,080 Speaker 1: I've been enjoying your podcast in your YouTube channel. I 595 00:38:57,120 --> 00:39:00,800 Speaker 1: hope that Amber continues her podcast. They are truly seeing 596 00:39:00,800 --> 00:39:02,880 Speaker 1: the spiritual growth you both have had since the beginning 597 00:39:02,920 --> 00:39:06,160 Speaker 1: is amazing. I have a question. And by the way, 598 00:39:06,400 --> 00:39:08,440 Speaker 1: I don't know this person. They said Anonymous, that was 599 00:39:08,480 --> 00:39:11,520 Speaker 1: a joke I said earlier. I'll continue. I have a question. 600 00:39:11,719 --> 00:39:13,839 Speaker 1: I'm wondering if someone could help me out. I'm from 601 00:39:13,840 --> 00:39:18,640 Speaker 1: a small village in British Columbia, Canada, a small Mennonite village. 602 00:39:18,760 --> 00:39:21,920 Speaker 1: We have three different churches in our community, Old Colony, 603 00:39:22,080 --> 00:39:25,359 Speaker 1: which is a parenthesis very religious and said in their 604 00:39:25,440 --> 00:39:31,120 Speaker 1: ways Mennonite Church more of any Evangelical with some Mennonite traditions. 605 00:39:31,640 --> 00:39:34,200 Speaker 1: And In Grace Bible Church, which just opened up a 606 00:39:34,200 --> 00:39:36,719 Speaker 1: few years ago. My husband and I grew up in 607 00:39:36,760 --> 00:39:39,680 Speaker 1: the OC, which I'm assuming this old colony, but we 608 00:39:39,760 --> 00:39:42,400 Speaker 1: have not attended church in the past ten years. I 609 00:39:42,440 --> 00:39:46,239 Speaker 1: really like the teachings of In Grace Church, but they 610 00:39:46,280 --> 00:39:49,880 Speaker 1: do one thing that was strongly taught against as we 611 00:39:49,880 --> 00:39:53,440 Speaker 1: were growing up. If you were only baptized by pouring, 612 00:39:53,880 --> 00:39:56,399 Speaker 1: they believe you should be immersed to join the church. 613 00:39:57,000 --> 00:40:01,520 Speaker 1: The OC we grew up in does baptism. I would 614 00:40:01,520 --> 00:40:03,560 Speaker 1: like to hear your points of view. I would love 615 00:40:03,560 --> 00:40:05,520 Speaker 1: to hear what your Men and Nite friend has to share. 616 00:40:05,960 --> 00:40:08,920 Speaker 1: Breaking free of the OC religion has been a journey. 617 00:40:09,040 --> 00:40:12,040 Speaker 1: Thank you all right, Anonymous, Thank you for the email. 618 00:40:12,080 --> 00:40:14,680 Speaker 1: I appreciate you so much. You're speaking my mind night friend. 619 00:40:14,680 --> 00:40:17,640 Speaker 1: You're talking about Marv, and Marv is a He's more 620 00:40:17,680 --> 00:40:19,360 Speaker 1: than a friend, he's a dear brother. I love that 621 00:40:19,440 --> 00:40:22,480 Speaker 1: man and his family, and in fact I got to 622 00:40:22,520 --> 00:40:24,759 Speaker 1: spend a little bit of time with him and his 623 00:40:24,840 --> 00:40:28,480 Speaker 1: son Ross and my son Lincoln in North Carolina. We 624 00:40:28,800 --> 00:40:32,640 Speaker 1: we took a little trip there, kind of a missionary 625 00:40:32,680 --> 00:40:38,440 Speaker 1: trip really for humanitarian reasons after the hurricane. He's from 626 00:40:38,480 --> 00:40:41,960 Speaker 1: South Carolina. We kind of met and and then just 627 00:40:42,040 --> 00:40:44,520 Speaker 1: had a just a great time. I love Marv. I 628 00:40:44,560 --> 00:40:50,000 Speaker 1: love his family, love his wife Brooke. So you need 629 00:40:50,040 --> 00:40:54,360 Speaker 1: to know something about Marv. And he is a Mennonite pastor, 630 00:40:55,040 --> 00:41:01,520 Speaker 1: but he is also a saved by grace, reborn believe 631 00:41:01,560 --> 00:41:07,360 Speaker 1: in Christian and that comes before Mennonite or for my case, Baptist. 632 00:41:08,920 --> 00:41:14,840 Speaker 1: So believing in Jesus, trusting him as your Lord and Savior, 633 00:41:15,800 --> 00:41:19,360 Speaker 1: trusting the work that he did on the cross, dying 634 00:41:19,400 --> 00:41:23,400 Speaker 1: on the cross, becoming a substitute for the punishment we 635 00:41:23,520 --> 00:41:27,719 Speaker 1: deserve for our rebellion against God, and trusting that Jesus 636 00:41:27,760 --> 00:41:30,879 Speaker 1: died on the cross for sins, saying that all who 637 00:41:30,920 --> 00:41:35,840 Speaker 1: believe in him repent from their sins, will be saved 638 00:41:36,960 --> 00:41:41,400 Speaker 1: and then live a surrendered life sanctified as a result 639 00:41:41,440 --> 00:41:45,200 Speaker 1: of that saving of grace. That's what it means to 640 00:41:45,200 --> 00:41:52,520 Speaker 1: be a Christian walking in repentance and faith because of 641 00:41:52,560 --> 00:41:54,960 Speaker 1: the grace that we've been saved by. That's what it means. 642 00:41:55,640 --> 00:42:01,360 Speaker 1: And so we'll put that ahead of Mennonite's Baptists, whatever 643 00:42:02,120 --> 00:42:07,080 Speaker 1: evangelical version of the Mennonite Church that you're seeing or whatever. 644 00:42:07,280 --> 00:42:10,520 Speaker 1: In grace Bible churches, I'm not really sure what they are. 645 00:42:12,000 --> 00:42:16,600 Speaker 1: I'm assuming it's more of a typical Bible church that 646 00:42:16,600 --> 00:42:19,000 Speaker 1: that I would know, but I'm not totally familiar with 647 00:42:19,360 --> 00:42:25,240 Speaker 1: BC Canada. So we have to put that stuff first. 648 00:42:26,040 --> 00:42:28,560 Speaker 1: Baptism is important. You know, a lot of people will 649 00:42:28,640 --> 00:42:32,880 Speaker 1: view that as the the first good work as a 650 00:42:32,920 --> 00:42:37,279 Speaker 1: result of the saving grace. So baptism doesn't save you, 651 00:42:37,760 --> 00:42:44,560 Speaker 1: but it's a it's the first public display of God's 652 00:42:44,560 --> 00:42:52,480 Speaker 1: transformation in us after we're saved. Baptism now, you know, 653 00:42:52,560 --> 00:43:00,200 Speaker 1: if we study church history baptism, that that sacrament of 654 00:43:00,239 --> 00:43:07,760 Speaker 1: baptism has been has been carried out in different ways, sprinkling, pouring, 655 00:43:08,520 --> 00:43:16,839 Speaker 1: full immersion, and it's been handled as far as babies, children, 656 00:43:17,040 --> 00:43:22,120 Speaker 1: and adults. Now, the Baptist tradition, for anyone that doesn't know, 657 00:43:22,640 --> 00:43:28,240 Speaker 1: it's called believers baptism, and it's really just a straightforward idea. 658 00:43:28,640 --> 00:43:33,359 Speaker 1: It's there's there's nothing super deep about it. I think 659 00:43:33,400 --> 00:43:37,000 Speaker 1: even a non believer could understand what this means, and 660 00:43:37,120 --> 00:43:41,080 Speaker 1: it means we baptize as a as a Baptist community, 661 00:43:41,880 --> 00:43:49,880 Speaker 1: we baptize after a person confesses a belief in Jesus, 662 00:43:49,920 --> 00:44:00,640 Speaker 1: after they have a have a reason too to identify 663 00:44:01,000 --> 00:44:08,399 Speaker 1: or to enunciate, pronounce, tell about the transformation that they've 664 00:44:08,440 --> 00:44:13,560 Speaker 1: had in Christ. It's an understanding. And basically, I'm just 665 00:44:13,600 --> 00:44:15,480 Speaker 1: going back and defining again the same thing I said 666 00:44:15,480 --> 00:44:18,240 Speaker 1: earlier about being a Christian knowing what Jesus did, knowing 667 00:44:18,280 --> 00:44:21,600 Speaker 1: that we are sinners, and then there's nothing we could 668 00:44:21,600 --> 00:44:25,879 Speaker 1: do to save ourselves from our own sin that's been 669 00:44:26,080 --> 00:44:31,279 Speaker 1: inherited from our ancestors, the original sin that we have inherited, 670 00:44:31,600 --> 00:44:33,560 Speaker 1: and it is killing us, and it will kill us, 671 00:44:33,880 --> 00:44:38,839 Speaker 1: and we will end up in eternal judgment if we 672 00:44:39,520 --> 00:44:42,520 Speaker 1: continue on without a savior to pull us out of it. 673 00:44:43,640 --> 00:44:47,239 Speaker 1: So that and acknowledgment means, hey, I'm a Christian. You know, 674 00:44:47,640 --> 00:44:49,399 Speaker 1: I guess this is a long way of saying I'm 675 00:44:49,440 --> 00:44:52,520 Speaker 1: a Christian and I trust Jesus for the forgiveness of 676 00:44:52,560 --> 00:44:56,200 Speaker 1: my sins. And when someone could say that and understand 677 00:44:56,320 --> 00:45:01,080 Speaker 1: it at whatever age that might be, typically you most 678 00:45:01,120 --> 00:45:04,880 Speaker 1: likely you would see that is something that a teenager 679 00:45:05,320 --> 00:45:09,520 Speaker 1: at the earliest age could start saying, I understand now 680 00:45:09,840 --> 00:45:13,520 Speaker 1: what Jesus did on a cross. I understand what it 681 00:45:13,560 --> 00:45:18,279 Speaker 1: means to walk in faith, trusting Him for my forgiveness, 682 00:45:18,520 --> 00:45:22,640 Speaker 1: not in myself. Typically, the earliest age you see that 683 00:45:22,680 --> 00:45:27,319 Speaker 1: as teenage age, even though we know that people could 684 00:45:27,320 --> 00:45:30,120 Speaker 1: be faithfully baptized at eight, nine, ten, eleven years old, 685 00:45:30,640 --> 00:45:34,080 Speaker 1: but typically this is something an adult understands. It's an 686 00:45:34,120 --> 00:45:39,480 Speaker 1: adult concept to be able to profess that faith, or 687 00:45:39,520 --> 00:45:48,799 Speaker 1: as the Bible says, confess, So that is called that's 688 00:45:48,800 --> 00:45:54,399 Speaker 1: the believer's baptism that Baptists have traditionally believed since the 689 00:45:54,440 --> 00:46:04,439 Speaker 1: seventeenth century eighteenth century, right that that also it needs 690 00:46:04,480 --> 00:46:08,640 Speaker 1: to be said that there's the tradition of pouring or 691 00:46:08,680 --> 00:46:16,399 Speaker 1: baby sprinkling is also has a long history. And what 692 00:46:16,440 --> 00:46:22,279 Speaker 1: we're talking about here, without me getting too fear into 693 00:46:22,320 --> 00:46:24,319 Speaker 1: the weeds with this, I'm trying to make this as 694 00:46:24,320 --> 00:46:26,879 Speaker 1: simple of a conversation as I can. What we're really 695 00:46:26,880 --> 00:46:31,520 Speaker 1: talking about here is membership into that church. And so 696 00:46:31,560 --> 00:46:34,879 Speaker 1: it is a bit of a formality, but I think 697 00:46:34,960 --> 00:46:40,040 Speaker 1: it's a I think it's an intelligent formality. I think 698 00:46:40,080 --> 00:46:43,120 Speaker 1: it makes sense that if you want to be in 699 00:46:43,160 --> 00:46:46,839 Speaker 1: the church, you should be a Christian, and if you're 700 00:46:46,840 --> 00:46:53,000 Speaker 1: a Christian, you should be baptized. And the tradition would say, 701 00:46:53,239 --> 00:46:57,520 Speaker 1: as Baptist that you should be baptized after you're converted. 702 00:46:58,239 --> 00:47:01,080 Speaker 1: You know that that's just it's kind of a simple thought, 703 00:47:01,760 --> 00:47:06,400 Speaker 1: but I think it creates a little bit of a 704 00:47:06,440 --> 00:47:12,360 Speaker 1: of a doorway into membership, and it's it shows a 705 00:47:12,400 --> 00:47:17,920 Speaker 1: bit of a commitment and a step. It shows a 706 00:47:17,960 --> 00:47:21,919 Speaker 1: public step in faith to say, you know what, I'm 707 00:47:21,920 --> 00:47:26,040 Speaker 1: not ashamed that I believe that Jesus has died from 708 00:47:26,080 --> 00:47:29,360 Speaker 1: my sins and I trust him with all the forgiveness 709 00:47:29,360 --> 00:47:34,520 Speaker 1: that that I don't deserve. I believe in that with 710 00:47:34,680 --> 00:47:38,200 Speaker 1: every fiber of my being. And I want to show 711 00:47:38,239 --> 00:47:43,920 Speaker 1: that through baptism. And if you come up against a 712 00:47:43,960 --> 00:47:47,319 Speaker 1: technicality where you love a church and you go, you know, 713 00:47:47,360 --> 00:47:50,520 Speaker 1: I was sprinkled as a baby, but I love this 714 00:47:50,680 --> 00:47:54,640 Speaker 1: church and I believe not just not just because I'm 715 00:47:55,000 --> 00:47:58,840 Speaker 1: coerced into this idea, but I actually see that that 716 00:47:59,120 --> 00:48:02,200 Speaker 1: practically makes sense that you know, baptism would come after 717 00:48:02,920 --> 00:48:08,520 Speaker 1: I'm converted, and so I'm gonna get immersed. I think 718 00:48:08,560 --> 00:48:12,279 Speaker 1: that's a that would be a way to show the 719 00:48:12,400 --> 00:48:16,360 Speaker 1: church and anyone else that's watching that you know you 720 00:48:16,400 --> 00:48:21,360 Speaker 1: don't you don't really care about looking silly or feeling 721 00:48:21,440 --> 00:48:26,080 Speaker 1: dumb or being embarrassed. You're ready to tell people about 722 00:48:26,120 --> 00:48:28,200 Speaker 1: what Jesus has done for you, and you're gonna do 723 00:48:28,239 --> 00:48:30,840 Speaker 1: that in front of people, telling your testimony and getting 724 00:48:30,840 --> 00:48:37,200 Speaker 1: into the water. So I'm trying my best to navigate 725 00:48:37,640 --> 00:48:41,719 Speaker 1: a very difficult, honestly, a very difficult situation because I 726 00:48:41,760 --> 00:48:47,680 Speaker 1: have a lot of respect for my dear Presbyterian brothers 727 00:48:47,840 --> 00:48:51,399 Speaker 1: and sisters and so many in the men in Nite Church, 728 00:48:52,680 --> 00:48:54,600 Speaker 1: and I believe there are people in the Baptist Church 729 00:48:54,640 --> 00:48:56,799 Speaker 1: that are not converted. And I believe there are people 730 00:48:56,840 --> 00:48:58,320 Speaker 1: in the men Nite Church that are not converted, and 731 00:48:58,480 --> 00:49:02,560 Speaker 1: Presbyterian they're not converted. But I think there are people, 732 00:49:03,440 --> 00:49:06,640 Speaker 1: hopefully mostly people that actually are converted. And I think 733 00:49:06,960 --> 00:49:10,520 Speaker 1: this type of baptism of believers baptism helps fense that 734 00:49:10,600 --> 00:49:14,320 Speaker 1: off a little bit. It helps distinguish the difference because 735 00:49:14,480 --> 00:49:16,799 Speaker 1: so you don't have a church with with a bunch 736 00:49:16,800 --> 00:49:20,239 Speaker 1: of members that are actually not believers. Yeah, I think 737 00:49:20,280 --> 00:49:21,920 Speaker 1: even if you're if you're not a Christian, you could 738 00:49:21,920 --> 00:49:24,880 Speaker 1: see how that could be problematic. You have a body, 739 00:49:25,520 --> 00:49:31,000 Speaker 1: a membership, and they're not believers. That creates all kinds 740 00:49:31,000 --> 00:49:34,680 Speaker 1: of problems, like endless problems. We could go for an 741 00:49:34,680 --> 00:49:37,160 Speaker 1: hour talking about the problems that that could create. And 742 00:49:37,200 --> 00:49:40,600 Speaker 1: that that's also different than saying just attending the church. 743 00:49:40,680 --> 00:49:43,680 Speaker 1: Attending the church is open to everybody. Please, the doors 744 00:49:43,680 --> 00:49:47,440 Speaker 1: are open. Everyone is welcome indiscriminately. You could come to 745 00:49:47,520 --> 00:49:52,640 Speaker 1: the church and join in on the feasting of the 746 00:49:52,680 --> 00:49:57,440 Speaker 1: Word that's being preached. But when it comes to baptism 747 00:49:57,440 --> 00:49:59,960 Speaker 1: and the Holy and and and the and the Lord's 748 00:50:00,080 --> 00:50:03,520 Speaker 1: Upper and the church membership, when it comes to those things, 749 00:50:03,560 --> 00:50:06,120 Speaker 1: you gotta gotta be a Christian, you know. I mean, 750 00:50:06,560 --> 00:50:08,080 Speaker 1: I don't think that's too much to ask, and I 751 00:50:08,120 --> 00:50:12,600 Speaker 1: think anyone can understand it. So here's my point. I 752 00:50:12,640 --> 00:50:14,960 Speaker 1: don't know anything about this North Grace Bible Church, so 753 00:50:15,000 --> 00:50:17,480 Speaker 1: I can't speak, and I can't say, yeah, that sounds 754 00:50:17,480 --> 00:50:20,279 Speaker 1: like a good deal. You should go, because you might 755 00:50:20,360 --> 00:50:24,080 Speaker 1: be in the old colony. I don't know anything about. Besides, 756 00:50:24,120 --> 00:50:26,080 Speaker 1: you said set in their ways, but I don't. I 757 00:50:26,120 --> 00:50:28,680 Speaker 1: don't have a reference to which of these three churches 758 00:50:28,760 --> 00:50:33,080 Speaker 1: is better. I don't know, and so I can't speak 759 00:50:33,120 --> 00:50:37,279 Speaker 1: about how baptism would be the one thing that separates you, 760 00:50:37,680 --> 00:50:40,160 Speaker 1: because it's not. I wouldn't go there. I would back 761 00:50:40,239 --> 00:50:43,160 Speaker 1: up further and go a step before that and say, 762 00:50:43,320 --> 00:50:46,680 Speaker 1: which one of these three is preaching the word of God? 763 00:50:46,800 --> 00:50:50,400 Speaker 1: Which one of these three is teaching from the pulpit 764 00:50:51,120 --> 00:50:55,439 Speaker 1: the Bible? Not an opinion, but they're they're they're going, 765 00:50:55,440 --> 00:51:00,000 Speaker 1: they're working through text, and they're saying today the message 766 00:51:00,160 --> 00:51:04,319 Speaker 1: today is John. Please turn with me to John chapter three, 767 00:51:04,960 --> 00:51:08,000 Speaker 1: verses one through six, and we're gonna work. I'm gonna 768 00:51:08,000 --> 00:51:10,200 Speaker 1: tell you, I'm gonna read these and then we're going 769 00:51:10,280 --> 00:51:12,680 Speaker 1: to talk about what this author meant by this and 770 00:51:12,719 --> 00:51:16,960 Speaker 1: how it can apply to our lives today. And that 771 00:51:17,000 --> 00:51:19,880 Speaker 1: would be the teaching we need to hear and we 772 00:51:19,920 --> 00:51:22,040 Speaker 1: want to hear. And if if one of these three 773 00:51:22,160 --> 00:51:24,360 Speaker 1: is doing that and the other two aren't, go to 774 00:51:24,480 --> 00:51:28,440 Speaker 1: that one and we could deal with this baptism. And 775 00:51:28,040 --> 00:51:30,480 Speaker 1: that's a lot for a Baptist to say that, but 776 00:51:30,800 --> 00:51:34,200 Speaker 1: we could deal with that later. But first, I want 777 00:51:34,239 --> 00:51:40,160 Speaker 1: you to be fed and nourished in your town, as 778 00:51:40,160 --> 00:51:41,880 Speaker 1: you say, a small town in British Columbia. I want 779 00:51:41,920 --> 00:51:43,840 Speaker 1: you to be nourished by the word of God, and 780 00:51:43,920 --> 00:51:48,040 Speaker 1: I want that to happen before you're arguing or trying 781 00:51:48,040 --> 00:51:55,800 Speaker 1: to deal with Should you be immersed or sprinkled or poured? 782 00:51:56,960 --> 00:52:01,840 Speaker 1: Does that makes sense? Difficult situation with you, anonymous, but 783 00:52:03,440 --> 00:52:07,080 Speaker 1: I think we shouldn't know for complicated. I hope that 784 00:52:07,120 --> 00:52:08,880 Speaker 1: makes sense. I hope all these questions make sense. And 785 00:52:09,000 --> 00:52:13,239 Speaker 1: I love that you guys email me tough things, so 786 00:52:14,680 --> 00:52:18,680 Speaker 1: message me podcast at grangersmith dot com. See y'all next Monday, Gig, 787 00:52:19,160 --> 00:52:22,200 Speaker 1: thanks for joining me on the Grangersmith podcast. I appreciate 788 00:52:22,440 --> 00:52:24,399 Speaker 1: all of you guys. You could help me out by 789 00:52:24,520 --> 00:52:28,320 Speaker 1: rating this podcast on iTunes. If you're on YouTube, subscribe 790 00:52:28,360 --> 00:52:31,759 Speaker 1: to this channel, hit that little like button and notification 791 00:52:31,880 --> 00:52:35,720 Speaker 1: spell so that you never miss anytime I upload a video. 792 00:52:36,200 --> 00:52:36,520 Speaker 1: Yigi