WEBVTT - Death Row Inmate Says Tonight’s Execution Will Be “Torturous”

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<v Speaker 1>Hey, folks. It is Thursday, November twentieth, and a man

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<v Speaker 1>is scheduled to die in a matter of hours in

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<v Speaker 1>Florida by lethal injection. He is making an argument though,

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<v Speaker 1>that the execution should be stopped. Why because it might

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<v Speaker 1>be too painful for him? And with that, welcome to

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<v Speaker 1>this episode of Amy and TJ. Robes. It's he has

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<v Speaker 1>some logic here for why he might feel more pain

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<v Speaker 1>than anyone else. I don't know if I've heard this

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<v Speaker 1>argument necessarily before, and we have covered a bunch of

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<v Speaker 1>executions here lately.

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<v Speaker 2>Yeah, this is the first one that I've heard that

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<v Speaker 2>is trying to use a medical condition that he says

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<v Speaker 2>will make lethal injection be torturous for him. We're talking

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<v Speaker 2>about sixty three year old Richard Barry Randolph, and his

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<v Speaker 2>attorneys say, yes, that injecting him with lethal injection will

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<v Speaker 2>be tortuous because he has lupus. And lupus one of

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<v Speaker 2>the side effects is that you have increased pain sensitivity,

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<v Speaker 2>so it causes chronic pain, and it leads to nerve

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<v Speaker 2>sensations like heightened nerve sensations basically, so your central nervous

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<v Speaker 2>system is basically ramped up.

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<v Speaker 1>It's painful.

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<v Speaker 3>It can be something that.

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<v Speaker 2>Would be painful to you and I would be extraordinarily

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<v Speaker 2>painful to somebody who has lupus.

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<v Speaker 1>Okay, So that's the argument this man is making. Don't

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<v Speaker 1>know how far that's going to go, but that's certainly interesting. Robes.

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<v Speaker 1>As we sit here getting ready for Florida now to

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<v Speaker 1>continue a record pace, this will officially put them over.

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<v Speaker 1>They have more than if his execution goes through tonight,

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<v Speaker 1>they would have more than doubled their previous record for

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<v Speaker 1>executions in a year. That's correct, and they're not even

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<v Speaker 1>done after this one, that's right.

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<v Speaker 2>So the previous record was eight executions in the state

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<v Speaker 2>of Florida in one calendar year. Tonight's execution is number

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<v Speaker 2>seventeen in the state of Florida, and Governor de Santa

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<v Speaker 2>announced this week another execution that he's just put on

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<v Speaker 2>the books for next month. So there are two more

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<v Speaker 2>planned executions in the state of Florida alone. So yes,

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<v Speaker 2>it looks like if things all go according to the

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<v Speaker 2>plan Governor DeSantis has put in place, there will be

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<v Speaker 2>a total of nineteen inmates executed in the state of Florida.

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<v Speaker 1>And that's way ahead. Usually we have I don't think

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<v Speaker 1>nobody surprised Texas leading the way. I guess Texas, Alabama,

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<v Speaker 1>South Carolina are the ones now that have five There

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<v Speaker 1>you go. So Florida is way out and way ahead,

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<v Speaker 1>and Desantas has been signing death warrens left and right,

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<v Speaker 1>it seems here lately now this road, we've covered several

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<v Speaker 1>of these, most recently Tremaine Wood who's execution in Oklahoma.

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<v Speaker 1>He got commuted and he's life in prison. That was

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<v Speaker 1>special circumstances of the case that folks thought were worthy

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<v Speaker 1>of looking at. Not the argument being made for this

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<v Speaker 1>guy when it comes to the crime itself. No.

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<v Speaker 2>In fact, the only arguments attorneys have made is that

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<v Speaker 2>he had a terrible childhood, that he did have an

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<v Speaker 2>honorable service as a member of the military, but that

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<v Speaker 2>he suffered PTSD, he was addicted to crack cocaine.

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<v Speaker 3>So they were.

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<v Speaker 2>Trying to kind of basically lay out as woe as me.

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<v Speaker 2>I had a terrible lot in life and I made

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<v Speaker 2>a really bad decision.

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<v Speaker 3>But it has not worked.

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<v Speaker 2>The Florida Supreme Court said, sorry, that is not an

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<v Speaker 2>argument that you can make to take away a death penalty.

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<v Speaker 1>Did I see right? One of the arguments was about

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<v Speaker 1>is really a lack of love from his parents or

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<v Speaker 1>his mom in particular, but apparently he had loving, adoptive,

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<v Speaker 1>correct parents.

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<v Speaker 3>The judge pointed that out.

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<v Speaker 2>Yeah, like, I don't want to hear about your problem

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<v Speaker 2>with your biological parents because you were adopted by a

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<v Speaker 2>loving family. And he claimed though, that the mom who

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<v Speaker 2>adopted him was an alcoholic and that the father was abusive.

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<v Speaker 3>So you know, he's claiming all of these things.

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<v Speaker 2>But I figure anyone who's in a situation like his

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<v Speaker 2>probably could point to a terrible childhood.

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<v Speaker 1>Yeah, so all that's been rejected. I think the Supreme

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<v Speaker 1>Court is the only thing that could save him. Now.

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<v Speaker 1>Obviously Desanta's could save him tonight. Nobody is expecting that

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<v Speaker 1>at all, of course, so that is his last hope.

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<v Speaker 1>But this was a pretty This is another one row.

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<v Speaker 1>If this crime was thirty eight years ago, Yes, that's

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<v Speaker 1>a death row for thirty eight years.

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<v Speaker 2>And that is what DeSantis is trying to clear us.

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<v Speaker 2>He's saying, this is not justice, this is taking way

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<v Speaker 2>too long. We are not we are not following through

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<v Speaker 2>on what a jury has chosen as the fate of

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<v Speaker 2>these prisoners, and we are just dragging our feet. There

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<v Speaker 2>have been lots of reasons why, but he has now

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<v Speaker 2>tried to speed up the process and he is certainly

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<v Speaker 2>doing so. So, yes, this was a crime. It happened

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<v Speaker 2>back in nineteen eighty eight, the murder of a sixty

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<v Speaker 2>two year old woman, Minnie Ruth McCollums. She was working

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<v Speaker 2>in a convenience store a small town, Florida, East Palatka.

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<v Speaker 2>Never heard of it, but he was Richard Barry Randolph

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<v Speaker 2>was a former co worker of her, so he knew her.

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<v Speaker 2>And he went back to the store to rob the safe,

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<v Speaker 2>that was his goal, and she interrupted him. She came

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<v Speaker 2>in while he was trying to break into the safe.

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<v Speaker 1>Yeah, well he's twenty seven at the time and she's

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<v Speaker 1>sixty What did you just say, sixty two? Sixty two

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<v Speaker 1>year old lady. So this a scuffle ensues you off,

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<v Speaker 1>certainly assume he has the advantage in that scuffle. So

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<v Speaker 1>this is where it gets awful. He does beat her.

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<v Speaker 1>He beats her repeatedly, essentially almost taking breaks from beating

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<v Speaker 1>her so he can go continue to try to open

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<v Speaker 1>the safe. If you can imagine that horror. He's essentially

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<v Speaker 1>going back and forth between robbing and killing her essentially,

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<v Speaker 1>and this went on for quite some time. This was

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<v Speaker 1>a horrific scene they described.

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<v Speaker 2>Yeah, prosecutors say it was prolonged and it was brutal,

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<v Speaker 2>and they did. They pointed out the fact that he

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<v Speaker 2>was taking the time to continue to try and break

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<v Speaker 2>into the safe, and then he apparently said something to

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<v Speaker 2>authorities alluding to the fact that she was stronger than

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<v Speaker 2>he thought, like he was annoyed that she wouldn't die,

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<v Speaker 2>so he was strangling her, he was beating her, he

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<v Speaker 2>was stabbing her, and then he raped her. So this

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<v Speaker 2>is horrific and he doesn't deny it. He admitted this.

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<v Speaker 2>He actually showed police where the bloody clothes were that

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<v Speaker 2>he stashed away when he was caught a short while later.

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<v Speaker 2>So this is not a question of guilt or innocence,

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<v Speaker 2>but the brutality of the crime speaks volumes and it

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<v Speaker 2>is a tough one to stomach.

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<v Speaker 1>And this is one now we keep an eye on

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<v Speaker 1>robe to talk about lupus. Is this going to factor in.

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<v Speaker 1>We've seen several lethal in jets. I's say scene, but

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<v Speaker 1>you know what I mean, I don't mean that literally

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<v Speaker 1>during the year, and there are different reports afterwards of

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<v Speaker 1>what the witnesses say the inmate, how the inmate reacted

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<v Speaker 1>to being getting those drugs. And I think a lot

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<v Speaker 1>of people are going to be watching closely tonight to

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<v Speaker 1>see if this guy with lupes ends up, I don't know,

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<v Speaker 1>having some kind of an adverse reaction.

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<v Speaker 3>In extraordinary pain or not.

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<v Speaker 2>It Also, it was you mentioned you asked how old

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<v Speaker 2>she was, and I was looking at how old he was.

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<v Speaker 3>I think it's so interesting.

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<v Speaker 2>She was sixty two years old when he brutally painfully

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<v Speaker 2>beat her. They were talking. By the way, she was

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<v Speaker 2>alive when police found her. I want to point that out.

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<v Speaker 2>She was alive, still clinging to life. She spent six

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<v Speaker 2>days in the hospital before she finally succumbed to her injuries.

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<v Speaker 2>He essentially beat her into a coma, and it was

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<v Speaker 2>the brain injuries that ended up. Her brain swelled and

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<v Speaker 2>she ended up dying. But she was stabbed in the throat.

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<v Speaker 2>I mean, it was as excruciating as you could possibly imagine.

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<v Speaker 2>She was sixty two. He is now sixty three. He

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<v Speaker 2>got to live one year longer than her. But now

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<v Speaker 2>he's upset and complaining about and concerned about and afraid

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<v Speaker 2>of feeling extraordinary pain. I don't know how many people

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<v Speaker 2>are going to feel very sympathetic when they read the

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<v Speaker 2>crime and what he did, and there was zero regard

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<v Speaker 2>for her pain, or her suffering or anything that this

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<v Speaker 2>sixty two year old woman went through. So now he

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<v Speaker 2>is sixty three and he will probably be spared, certainly

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<v Speaker 2>given the circumstances of her death, some of the pain

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<v Speaker 2>she experienced.

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<v Speaker 1>Then we talk about what we talk about just recently

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<v Speaker 1>about the end, right, we talked about, you know the

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<v Speaker 1>story of these entertainment twins who died together double suicide,

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<v Speaker 1>assisted suicide, and we were talking about in prison, if

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<v Speaker 1>you gave people the option to die and to die

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<v Speaker 1>pain painlessly, do you think people in prison with long

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<v Speaker 1>sentences would take it? And you and I I think

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<v Speaker 1>both said no, because in the end, people want to live.

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<v Speaker 1>And so here he is prison, thirty eight years death row.

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<v Speaker 1>This is the end, and he's fighting, fighting as hard

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<v Speaker 1>as he can, coming up with anything he can because

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<v Speaker 1>he wants to live. I'm always fascinated we all have

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<v Speaker 1>this thing. It's inherent in us. It's just instinct to

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<v Speaker 1>want to live, to want to survive. So we're not

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<v Speaker 1>surprised to see any of this. He's trying everything he

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<v Speaker 1>can to stay alive, no hope of getting out. He's

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<v Speaker 1>not trying to, you know, get his conviction overturned. He

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<v Speaker 1>just wants to live. I think that is it's always

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<v Speaker 1>fascinating about these stories.

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<v Speaker 2>It is fascinating. I absolutely agree with you, and you

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<v Speaker 2>see it every time. Only one execution that I can

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<v Speaker 2>remember from this year, and we have covered most of

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<v Speaker 2>them where we had an inmate who said, yep, go

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<v Speaker 2>ahead kill me.

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<v Speaker 1>He skipped all the guy on in Florida.

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<v Speaker 2>We don't want any more appeals, don't care about trying

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<v Speaker 2>to get the Supreme Court to take a look at

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<v Speaker 2>my case.

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<v Speaker 3>Just go ahead and do it.

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<v Speaker 1>Wasn't he also the one where they asked any last

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<v Speaker 1>words and his response was simply no, And that was it.

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<v Speaker 1>So yes, that is the only one.

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<v Speaker 3>He is the exception.

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<v Speaker 1>You are right.

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<v Speaker 2>Most most in maids on death row, regardless of the

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<v Speaker 2>quality of their life, it's still a life, and people

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<v Speaker 2>there's a human instinct to live, to survive, regardless of

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<v Speaker 2>your circumstances, and that is what we have seen time

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<v Speaker 2>and time again. Now when we come back, there is

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<v Speaker 2>an interesting part of this case. He and this is

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<v Speaker 2>very rare. There was not a unanimous decision for the

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<v Speaker 2>death penalty. In fact, when you hear what the spread

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<v Speaker 2>was among the jury, it does raise some eyebrows and

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<v Speaker 2>certainly has raised some questions as to whether.

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<v Speaker 3>Or not that should be allowed.

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<v Speaker 2>And continuing our coverage of Florida's seventeenth execution of the year,

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<v Speaker 2>happening tonight, sixty three year old Richard Barry Randolph will

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<v Speaker 2>die by lethal injection. He has made complaints and appeals

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<v Speaker 2>to anyone who will listen to try and stay his

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<v Speaker 2>execution or at least change the method of his execution.

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<v Speaker 2>He has lupus, and he says that this is going

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<v Speaker 2>to be a torturous death because of his condition, his

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<v Speaker 2>nerve endings, his nervous system is already experiences more pain

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<v Speaker 2>than most people. So to go through a lethal injection

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<v Speaker 2>while suffering lupus, his attorneys had argued, was cruel and unusual.

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<v Speaker 3>But that has fallen on deaf ears.

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<v Speaker 1>And how did the judge put it? He really said, really,

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<v Speaker 1>now I'm going to bring this up now, He.

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<v Speaker 2>Said, You've had lupus for quite some time. You're just

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<v Speaker 2>now bringing this up. You had years to try and

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<v Speaker 2>change the method of execution, and you didn't. You chose

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<v Speaker 2>to do it in the eleventh hour, which makes him

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<v Speaker 2>feel like this is just an attempt to stay an

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<v Speaker 2>execution rather than actually mitigate pain.

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<v Speaker 3>So that is what the judge said. But there was

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<v Speaker 3>something really.

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<v Speaker 2>Interesting that I have learned so much as we've been

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<v Speaker 2>covering these executions. But in Randolph's jury, the death sentence,

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<v Speaker 2>there was a vote, right the jury votes. In most states,

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<v Speaker 2>you have to have a unanimous decision by a jury

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<v Speaker 2>to vote for the death penalty, and in some cases

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<v Speaker 2>the judge can intervene. But his jury voted eight to four,

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<v Speaker 2>and even the trial court at the time acknowledged that

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<v Speaker 2>that narrow margin, they said, reflected significant disagreement about what

0:12:15.320 --> 0:12:18.760
<v Speaker 2>the appropriate punishment was. They also pointed out that this

0:12:18.880 --> 0:12:21.840
<v Speaker 2>jury only heard from one mitigation witness when there should

0:12:21.880 --> 0:12:23.520
<v Speaker 2>have been more so they could have had a better

0:12:23.640 --> 0:12:25.880
<v Speaker 2>clearer picture. They say, the jury didn't get to hear

0:12:25.880 --> 0:12:28.000
<v Speaker 2>about his trouble childhood. They didn't get to hear about

0:12:28.000 --> 0:12:30.720
<v Speaker 2>his crack addiction, or about his military service and all

0:12:30.760 --> 0:12:32.840
<v Speaker 2>the good that he did. So there was a lot

0:12:32.920 --> 0:12:35.840
<v Speaker 2>of frustration about that. Now listen to this, I didn't

0:12:35.880 --> 0:12:41.840
<v Speaker 2>realize this. The Florida Supreme Court then changed this law

0:12:41.880 --> 0:12:45.640
<v Speaker 2>and said death sentences have to be unanimous, and then

0:12:45.640 --> 0:12:47.840
<v Speaker 2>they gave it. It had to happen in cases after

0:12:48.080 --> 0:12:50.520
<v Speaker 2>two thousand and four, there was some sort of thing.

0:12:50.559 --> 0:12:52.559
<v Speaker 3>So he missed out on that because it happened to early.

0:12:52.760 --> 0:12:53.560
<v Speaker 3>And then just two.

0:12:53.559 --> 0:12:57.400
<v Speaker 2>Years ago in twenty twenty three, the Florida State Leasure

0:12:57.720 --> 0:12:59.600
<v Speaker 2>just wiped it all clean and said, you know what,

0:13:00.559 --> 0:13:02.680
<v Speaker 2>you can have a non unanimous death sentence. Now they

0:13:02.760 --> 0:13:05.319
<v Speaker 2>put it back to where it was, and so there

0:13:05.360 --> 0:13:08.520
<v Speaker 2>have been other instances where you have seen that eight

0:13:08.600 --> 0:13:09.680
<v Speaker 2>to four split.

0:13:10.679 --> 0:13:14.040
<v Speaker 1>That is tough. Well, I don't think it's the way

0:13:14.040 --> 0:13:19.480
<v Speaker 1>you talk. It's a tough, tough challenge for some to

0:13:19.640 --> 0:13:25.880
<v Speaker 1>accept state sanctioned killings, right. I get it, it's a

0:13:25.880 --> 0:13:30.320
<v Speaker 1>part of our system. But some people say these are monsters.

0:13:30.320 --> 0:13:32.840
<v Speaker 1>Sometimes they need to be I find then others argue

0:13:32.920 --> 0:13:34.920
<v Speaker 1>I'm not having the argument about it being deterrent. I'm

0:13:34.960 --> 0:13:38.880
<v Speaker 1>just saying, as a human being, it's uncomfortable the idea

0:13:39.040 --> 0:13:46.319
<v Speaker 1>of us going through ceremony of killing somebody. So it

0:13:46.400 --> 0:13:50.320
<v Speaker 1>was this guy. I still think this is a bigger

0:13:50.480 --> 0:13:52.320
<v Speaker 1>part of a problem. For me, we've seen too many

0:13:52.360 --> 0:13:56.480
<v Speaker 1>people exonerated when we're talking about somebody's life. We can't

0:13:56.720 --> 0:14:00.320
<v Speaker 1>have eight to four decisions. We can't have it that

0:14:00.400 --> 0:14:03.080
<v Speaker 1>kind of split. We need to be more sure than that.

0:14:03.160 --> 0:14:04.680
<v Speaker 3>Agreed, and that is the split.

0:14:04.720 --> 0:14:07.600
<v Speaker 2>If it had been nine or sorry, if it had

0:14:07.640 --> 0:14:09.400
<v Speaker 2>been uh, what would have been been too?

0:14:09.440 --> 0:14:11.520
<v Speaker 1>I'm not a saying eleven one still not eight.

0:14:11.360 --> 0:14:14.040
<v Speaker 2>Four is what it is in the state of Florida

0:14:14.080 --> 0:14:16.480
<v Speaker 2>now since they put it back in place. Guess what

0:14:16.520 --> 0:14:19.640
<v Speaker 2>the only other state is that allows a non unanimous

0:14:19.960 --> 0:14:21.240
<v Speaker 2>death sentence to stand.

0:14:22.000 --> 0:14:22.640
<v Speaker 3>Alabama.

0:14:23.240 --> 0:14:25.160
<v Speaker 2>Now they have a ten to two split, so they

0:14:25.160 --> 0:14:28.440
<v Speaker 2>say it has to be it has to be higher.

0:14:28.800 --> 0:14:32.480
<v Speaker 2>It's higher the threshold hire ten to two. That's to me,

0:14:32.680 --> 0:14:35.720
<v Speaker 2>I was surprised eight to four. I had no idea

0:14:35.760 --> 0:14:37.600
<v Speaker 2>that it could be that wide of a margin and

0:14:37.680 --> 0:14:38.480
<v Speaker 2>still go through.

0:14:40.240 --> 0:14:42.240
<v Speaker 1>We would never accept that margin when it comes to

0:14:42.280 --> 0:14:45.880
<v Speaker 1>guilt or innocence. Now, so wide life or death. That's

0:14:46.280 --> 0:14:49.080
<v Speaker 1>that's bizarre. It's strange. Yes, we have learned so much

0:14:49.080 --> 0:14:51.520
<v Speaker 1>about the death penalty. We've learned a lot about cases

0:14:51.640 --> 0:14:53.600
<v Speaker 1>mistakes would have made and how you need to sometimes

0:14:53.680 --> 0:14:55.680
<v Speaker 1>dig a little deeper in a lot of these stories

0:14:55.680 --> 0:14:58.720
<v Speaker 1>and not just read the headlines and you understand and

0:14:58.760 --> 0:15:01.720
<v Speaker 1>can have Now even you don't have to have sympathy,

0:15:01.760 --> 0:15:04.800
<v Speaker 1>but you can have at least some kind of compassion

0:15:05.400 --> 0:15:08.840
<v Speaker 1>and sometimes not sympathy but empathy because you hear so

0:15:09.000 --> 0:15:11.600
<v Speaker 1>much of what families are going through on both sides

0:15:11.680 --> 0:15:13.920
<v Speaker 1>is you can relate to in a lot of ways.

0:15:13.920 --> 0:15:16.520
<v Speaker 1>And there's pain all around in these stories. And it's

0:15:16.600 --> 0:15:19.040
<v Speaker 1>rare to get a celebration robes. I know, the guy

0:15:19.120 --> 0:15:21.960
<v Speaker 1>and Tremaine with Treminwood. Yet right, it's weird to have

0:15:22.000 --> 0:15:24.560
<v Speaker 1>one where it feels like you are celebrated. Somebody died

0:15:24.600 --> 0:15:28.080
<v Speaker 1>in that case, but here we are celebrating at least

0:15:28.080 --> 0:15:31.720
<v Speaker 1>maybe that the system got it. Maybe not one hundred

0:15:31.720 --> 0:15:33.720
<v Speaker 1>percent right, but goid it better.

0:15:33.840 --> 0:15:37.280
<v Speaker 2>And look, all of these inmates, these death row inmates

0:15:37.360 --> 0:15:40.200
<v Speaker 2>are never getting out of prison. They are all sentenced

0:15:40.200 --> 0:15:43.360
<v Speaker 2>to life without the possibility of parole. So the question

0:15:43.520 --> 0:15:46.640
<v Speaker 2>is do you go through a thirty six and in

0:15:46.640 --> 0:15:49.000
<v Speaker 2>one case last week was it a forty seven year,

0:15:49.080 --> 0:15:51.760
<v Speaker 2>forty six year, almost fifty years on death row? You know,

0:15:51.800 --> 0:15:54.200
<v Speaker 2>do you go through that process with the appeals and

0:15:54.240 --> 0:15:57.520
<v Speaker 2>with all of there's a financial burden when you when

0:15:57.560 --> 0:16:01.280
<v Speaker 2>you sentence someone to death significantly than just putting someone

0:16:01.480 --> 0:16:02.800
<v Speaker 2>in prison for the rest of their lives.

0:16:02.960 --> 0:16:04.200
<v Speaker 3>And we've talked about this before too.

0:16:04.240 --> 0:16:06.840
<v Speaker 2>When you have family members of the victims who don't

0:16:06.880 --> 0:16:09.560
<v Speaker 2>want to see an eye for an eye take place

0:16:09.640 --> 0:16:11.360
<v Speaker 2>in the name of their loved one who died, you

0:16:11.400 --> 0:16:14.000
<v Speaker 2>know there are other We have learned so much about

0:16:14.320 --> 0:16:17.320
<v Speaker 2>the fact that victims don't really have a voice in

0:16:17.360 --> 0:16:20.440
<v Speaker 2>a lot of these cases. And it's surprising to me

0:16:20.800 --> 0:16:23.960
<v Speaker 2>state by state just how different it is the rules

0:16:24.280 --> 0:16:27.000
<v Speaker 2>and what has to be put in place or what

0:16:27.080 --> 0:16:29.560
<v Speaker 2>laws need to be there for people to die without

0:16:29.600 --> 0:16:35.240
<v Speaker 2>a unanimous decision, what methods yes it is.

0:16:35.280 --> 0:16:36.640
<v Speaker 3>It is fascinating. I am surprised.

0:16:36.680 --> 0:16:38.400
<v Speaker 2>We talk about how the death penalty it's never been

0:16:38.440 --> 0:16:41.120
<v Speaker 2>proven to be a deterrent in any way, shape or form,

0:16:41.360 --> 0:16:43.360
<v Speaker 2>But my god, I feel like after this year in Florida,

0:16:43.440 --> 0:16:45.480
<v Speaker 2>you would think a criminal would say, maybe, if I'm

0:16:45.480 --> 0:16:48.040
<v Speaker 2>going to commit a crime, I'm not going to do

0:16:48.080 --> 0:16:48.520
<v Speaker 2>it in Florida.

0:16:48.600 --> 0:16:50.080
<v Speaker 1>I hadn't thought about that, But you make a point

0:16:50.400 --> 0:16:54.440
<v Speaker 1>if you see people actually following through on the death penalty,

0:16:54.480 --> 0:16:56.200
<v Speaker 1>and I think a lot of people who are pro

0:16:56.240 --> 0:16:59.080
<v Speaker 1>death penalty, will absolutely tell you that it's not. Yeah,

0:16:59.120 --> 0:17:01.520
<v Speaker 1>it would be a determined if we actually used it,

0:17:01.960 --> 0:17:03.360
<v Speaker 1>So here we are. It's not a deterrent to be

0:17:03.400 --> 0:17:05.560
<v Speaker 1>on death row for thirty forty fifty years.

0:17:05.560 --> 0:17:05.960
<v Speaker 3>Not really.

0:17:06.520 --> 0:17:08.280
<v Speaker 2>And first of all, people never think they're going to

0:17:08.280 --> 0:17:10.800
<v Speaker 2>get caught. That's the number one reason why it's not

0:17:10.880 --> 0:17:13.560
<v Speaker 2>a deterrent. But then yes, if you don't have states

0:17:13.600 --> 0:17:16.439
<v Speaker 2>following through on the death penalties that they enact, if

0:17:16.440 --> 0:17:19.600
<v Speaker 2>you're not enforcing it, then yes, it doesn't seem that scary.

0:17:19.640 --> 0:17:21.680
<v Speaker 1>You make a good point, a financial one as well,

0:17:21.720 --> 0:17:25.280
<v Speaker 1>because you hear it initially, welly is it more expensive? Right?

0:17:25.359 --> 0:17:28.199
<v Speaker 1>You kill them and it's over. You're not taking care

0:17:28.200 --> 0:17:32.480
<v Speaker 1>of him in prison anymore. This is thirty years of trials, appeals,

0:17:32.640 --> 0:17:36.920
<v Speaker 1>attorneys taking them back and forth for quarter, all of that.

0:17:37.000 --> 0:17:38.960
<v Speaker 2>And you have to have and you have to have

0:17:39.040 --> 0:17:42.199
<v Speaker 2>that in place because of the innocent people who have

0:17:42.320 --> 0:17:44.520
<v Speaker 2>been placed on death row. You have to give these

0:17:44.560 --> 0:17:48.520
<v Speaker 2>inmates every last opportunity to try and reverse course or

0:17:48.560 --> 0:17:50.840
<v Speaker 2>prove their innocence in a way that you wouldn't if

0:17:50.880 --> 0:17:53.520
<v Speaker 2>someone just had a life sentence, Because it is life

0:17:53.640 --> 0:17:55.719
<v Speaker 2>or death and We will of course be following this

0:17:55.760 --> 0:17:59.199
<v Speaker 2>case as well as the other of three scheduled for

0:17:59.240 --> 0:18:01.320
<v Speaker 2>the rest of the year, but in the meantime, thank

0:18:01.320 --> 0:18:03.119
<v Speaker 2>you all for listening to us. I'm a me roboch

0:18:03.160 --> 0:18:03.880
<v Speaker 2>alongside TJ.

0:18:03.960 --> 0:18:05.480
<v Speaker 3>Holmes. We'll talk to you soon.