1 00:00:02,040 --> 00:00:07,680 Speaker 1: Now from our nation's capital. This is Bloomberg Sound On. Well, 2 00:00:07,720 --> 00:00:10,879 Speaker 1: first of all, no one's sending balloons for Valentine. President 3 00:00:10,880 --> 00:00:15,600 Speaker 1: Biden should speak on camera directly to the American people today. 4 00:00:15,640 --> 00:00:17,400 Speaker 1: So we go to great Lanes to make sure that 5 00:00:17,480 --> 00:00:21,280 Speaker 1: the air space is clear. These objects have been flying 6 00:00:21,520 --> 00:00:26,960 Speaker 1: over USh for years. Bloomberg Sound On, Politics, Policy and 7 00:00:27,040 --> 00:00:30,520 Speaker 1: perspective from DC's top name. Y'all know I ran for 8 00:00:30,600 --> 00:00:35,240 Speaker 1: governor and um, yeah please I did win. Actually, Donald 9 00:00:35,320 --> 00:00:37,800 Speaker 1: Trump is everything I taught my children not to do 10 00:00:37,880 --> 00:00:45,960 Speaker 1: in kindergarten. Bloomberg Sound On with Joe Matthew on Bloomberg Radio. 11 00:00:46,800 --> 00:00:50,760 Speaker 1: The Pentagon does not believe the unidentified flying objects are 12 00:00:50,800 --> 00:00:53,680 Speaker 1: part of a Chinese spy program. Welcome to the fastest 13 00:00:53,680 --> 00:00:57,080 Speaker 1: hour in politics. As senators call on President Biden now 14 00:00:57,160 --> 00:01:01,440 Speaker 1: to address the nation following another classified thing they received today, 15 00:01:01,520 --> 00:01:04,600 Speaker 1: we will learn more from an expert military analyst, Ward Carol, 16 00:01:04,640 --> 00:01:09,160 Speaker 1: a former naval aviator who spent years intercepting Russian bombers 17 00:01:09,200 --> 00:01:13,479 Speaker 1: at altitude. President Biden reshapes his economic team will talk 18 00:01:13,520 --> 00:01:17,080 Speaker 1: about the policy implications along with today's inflation data with 19 00:01:17,120 --> 00:01:20,600 Speaker 1: Mark Zandi of Moody's Analytics and as Nicky Haley makes 20 00:01:20,640 --> 00:01:23,319 Speaker 1: her run for president, official will survey the landscape with 21 00:01:23,319 --> 00:01:27,679 Speaker 1: our panel. Republican strategist Boyd Matheson Democratic strategist Tim Hogan 22 00:01:27,720 --> 00:01:30,240 Speaker 1: from our Initiatives with Us for the Hour. It's not 23 00:01:30,280 --> 00:01:34,000 Speaker 1: every day we shoot things down in US airspace. In fact, 24 00:01:34,080 --> 00:01:37,280 Speaker 1: while it seems like a daily occurrence lately, it never 25 00:01:37,400 --> 00:01:41,399 Speaker 1: happened before a week ago. And so that's why senators 26 00:01:41,400 --> 00:01:44,400 Speaker 1: today received another classified briefing from the Pentagon. Have been 27 00:01:45,319 --> 00:01:48,600 Speaker 1: demanding answers from the administration. And you better believe those 28 00:01:48,600 --> 00:01:53,200 Speaker 1: senators spoke to reporters when they came from their session. 29 00:01:53,240 --> 00:01:56,720 Speaker 1: Here's Senator Marshall Blackburn, Republican from Tennessee. I think it 30 00:01:56,840 --> 00:02:00,320 Speaker 1: is time for the president to address the nation assist 31 00:02:00,400 --> 00:02:03,880 Speaker 1: when we need to have an Oval Office address, and 32 00:02:04,000 --> 00:02:06,680 Speaker 1: he needs to say this is what we know, this 33 00:02:06,760 --> 00:02:10,400 Speaker 1: is what we're doing, and that approach that answer was, 34 00:02:11,680 --> 00:02:14,920 Speaker 1: I think fair to say bipartisan. Today. Listen to Senator 35 00:02:15,280 --> 00:02:19,520 Speaker 1: Richard Bluemanthal Democrat from Connecticut. There is a lot of 36 00:02:19,560 --> 00:02:24,959 Speaker 1: information presented to us this morning that could be totally 37 00:02:24,960 --> 00:02:28,560 Speaker 1: the American people without any harm to sources or methods 38 00:02:28,720 --> 00:02:32,160 Speaker 1: or our national security. And the American people need to 39 00:02:32,240 --> 00:02:37,000 Speaker 1: know more so they'll have more confidence in our national security. 40 00:02:37,120 --> 00:02:39,679 Speaker 1: That refrain was repeated over and over. I think it 41 00:02:39,720 --> 00:02:43,480 Speaker 1: was Senator Tom Cotton who said about what we heard 42 00:02:43,480 --> 00:02:46,440 Speaker 1: in here today could in fact be made public, and 43 00:02:46,880 --> 00:02:50,440 Speaker 1: a lot of it already was as we turned to 44 00:02:50,440 --> 00:02:54,080 Speaker 1: the terminal here, the Biden administration suspects that the three 45 00:02:54,120 --> 00:02:59,000 Speaker 1: identified objects down since last Friday, all but the Chinese 46 00:02:59,040 --> 00:03:03,959 Speaker 1: spy balloon. We're in fact not used for spying, served 47 00:03:03,960 --> 00:03:11,000 Speaker 1: commercial purposes. We're likely private important details here. The intelligence 48 00:03:11,040 --> 00:03:14,320 Speaker 1: community believes the objects, unlike again the big one, the 49 00:03:14,320 --> 00:03:17,760 Speaker 1: big balloon quote, could be just balloons tied to some 50 00:03:18,360 --> 00:03:22,960 Speaker 1: commercial or benign purpose. That's what John Kirby said today. 51 00:03:23,040 --> 00:03:24,760 Speaker 1: So we have a lot of questions about this, just 52 00:03:24,840 --> 00:03:28,320 Speaker 1: like you do. In really looking forward to this conversation 53 00:03:28,360 --> 00:03:32,639 Speaker 1: with Ward Carroll, retired Navy commander flu Combat Missions. The 54 00:03:32,680 --> 00:03:35,040 Speaker 1: backseat of the F four team a rio or radar 55 00:03:35,080 --> 00:03:38,240 Speaker 1: intercept officer. He was up there at altitude when they 56 00:03:38,280 --> 00:03:42,920 Speaker 1: were coming face to face with intercepting Russian bar bombers 57 00:03:42,960 --> 00:03:45,320 Speaker 1: among other aircraft. That was part of the deal. Then 58 00:03:45,360 --> 00:03:47,920 Speaker 1: he also helped to enforce the no fly zone over Iraq. 59 00:03:48,000 --> 00:03:50,800 Speaker 1: He is now host of the Ward Carol YouTube channel 60 00:03:50,800 --> 00:03:54,400 Speaker 1: and with us here on Bloomberg Sound on Board. It's 61 00:03:54,440 --> 00:03:56,840 Speaker 1: really great to have you. I'm gonna ask you what 62 00:03:56,920 --> 00:03:59,840 Speaker 1: probably sound like some dumb questions, hopefully they won't all be. 63 00:04:00,920 --> 00:04:04,400 Speaker 1: Let me start with the real dumb stuff. If these 64 00:04:04,640 --> 00:04:10,040 Speaker 1: latter three were not balloons, and by the way, General 65 00:04:10,120 --> 00:04:12,280 Speaker 1: Millie today referred to them all as balloons, just as 66 00:04:12,280 --> 00:04:15,760 Speaker 1: an aside in his briefing, what does that allow things 67 00:04:15,760 --> 00:04:17,760 Speaker 1: aren't just floating up there right? That would have to 68 00:04:17,760 --> 00:04:20,680 Speaker 1: be a drone or some sort of junk that that 69 00:04:20,839 --> 00:04:25,600 Speaker 1: carried no weight. What say you? Um, I don't think 70 00:04:25,640 --> 00:04:30,000 Speaker 1: that's a dumb question, Joe. I think that's the question right. 71 00:04:30,160 --> 00:04:33,760 Speaker 1: And and you know, I mean, for all you said 72 00:04:33,800 --> 00:04:37,160 Speaker 1: in the UH introduction there about my tactical experience, I 73 00:04:37,200 --> 00:04:40,360 Speaker 1: don't know the answer, um. And this is what's frustrating 74 00:04:40,880 --> 00:04:42,839 Speaker 1: at all levels. And I've talked to a few of 75 00:04:42,880 --> 00:04:47,680 Speaker 1: the other fighter above us, including former fighter pilot who 76 00:04:47,720 --> 00:04:52,680 Speaker 1: was my pilot and astronaut Scott Kelly UH and the 77 00:04:52,680 --> 00:04:57,320 Speaker 1: the opinions and the ideas of very widely. So as 78 00:04:57,360 --> 00:04:58,880 Speaker 1: you said, the only thing we know for sure is. 79 00:04:58,920 --> 00:05:03,360 Speaker 1: A week ago sund A, we shot down a uh 80 00:05:03,400 --> 00:05:05,359 Speaker 1: what we think we're calling a spy balloon off the 81 00:05:05,400 --> 00:05:08,359 Speaker 1: coast of South Carolina. I did an episode about that 82 00:05:08,400 --> 00:05:11,520 Speaker 1: on my channel, UM, and I thought, okay, that that's 83 00:05:11,560 --> 00:05:14,360 Speaker 1: probably it. And then again, as you said, in the 84 00:05:14,400 --> 00:05:17,680 Speaker 1: next seventy two hours, there was one. Every day. You 85 00:05:17,680 --> 00:05:21,479 Speaker 1: couldn't keep up. You're like, you know, um, Alaska, and 86 00:05:21,480 --> 00:05:23,719 Speaker 1: then you hear Yukon you mean And I'm like you 87 00:05:23,760 --> 00:05:26,039 Speaker 1: mean Alaska, Like no, no, this is a different one. 88 00:05:26,440 --> 00:05:29,359 Speaker 1: And then the next day it's like Lake Huron. I'm like, 89 00:05:29,440 --> 00:05:31,880 Speaker 1: you think you mean you got no no, that there 90 00:05:31,920 --> 00:05:35,600 Speaker 1: was another one. UM. And so I've known John Kirby 91 00:05:35,600 --> 00:05:38,160 Speaker 1: since he was a lieutenant. He was actually the p 92 00:05:38,360 --> 00:05:41,400 Speaker 1: a O for the Blue Angels when I first met him. 93 00:05:42,120 --> 00:05:46,680 Speaker 1: And uh, he's uh Admiral Mullen man as as I am. 94 00:05:46,760 --> 00:05:48,640 Speaker 1: You know, he served with Adam Mullin all the way 95 00:05:48,640 --> 00:05:53,039 Speaker 1: through his tenure as Chairman of the Joint Chiefs. Great guy. Um. 96 00:05:53,120 --> 00:05:55,599 Speaker 1: As we know, he's sort of an animal inside the 97 00:05:55,600 --> 00:05:58,080 Speaker 1: belt Way. He's been all around and now he's at 98 00:05:58,080 --> 00:06:02,400 Speaker 1: the White House. And so when he's stuck for terms, 99 00:06:03,360 --> 00:06:05,760 Speaker 1: we got an issue we got a problem. And so 100 00:06:06,040 --> 00:06:09,360 Speaker 1: he just sort of has been punting on this thing 101 00:06:09,400 --> 00:06:12,680 Speaker 1: that uh, we're calling it an object. That's all he 102 00:06:12,680 --> 00:06:15,880 Speaker 1: could say. Listen to General Mark Milly today on this 103 00:06:16,000 --> 00:06:18,400 Speaker 1: very same score, this again the Chair of the Joint 104 00:06:18,440 --> 00:06:22,200 Speaker 1: Chiefs of Staff, referring to he's talking about, by the way, 105 00:06:22,880 --> 00:06:25,080 Speaker 1: the fact that one of the missiles missed on the 106 00:06:25,120 --> 00:06:27,680 Speaker 1: fourth object. He just runs through all four of them. 107 00:06:27,720 --> 00:06:30,279 Speaker 1: Listen to the language he uses. Here's General Millie, the 108 00:06:30,320 --> 00:06:32,720 Speaker 1: first blue in the Chinese spy balloon that went down 109 00:06:32,800 --> 00:06:34,720 Speaker 1: over the Atlantic on the South Carolina coast. That was 110 00:06:35,279 --> 00:06:38,560 Speaker 1: that shot hit, the second one over Alaska on the 111 00:06:38,600 --> 00:06:41,479 Speaker 1: north coast of Alaska, that one hit, the third one 112 00:06:41,560 --> 00:06:43,800 Speaker 1: in that landed in the Yukon. That one hit on 113 00:06:43,839 --> 00:06:46,480 Speaker 1: the fourth one over like you're on. First shot missed, 114 00:06:46,520 --> 00:06:49,720 Speaker 1: a second shot hit. Okay, So he's kind of referring 115 00:06:49,720 --> 00:06:52,200 Speaker 1: to the Malla's balloons there. A reporter later asked him, 116 00:06:52,240 --> 00:06:55,000 Speaker 1: and he changed his language to objects. But let's talk 117 00:06:55,000 --> 00:06:58,440 Speaker 1: about shooting them down here. Also ward, it took two 118 00:06:58,520 --> 00:07:02,040 Speaker 1: missiles then, that means one of the sidewinder missiles ended 119 00:07:02,120 --> 00:07:04,680 Speaker 1: up in the lake, the other one made contact with 120 00:07:04,800 --> 00:07:09,120 Speaker 1: and and presumably destroyed or brought down that object. Uh. 121 00:07:09,440 --> 00:07:12,440 Speaker 1: Those are heat seeking missiles, right, the sidewinder missile. What 122 00:07:12,440 --> 00:07:16,120 Speaker 1: does that tell you about their choice of weaponry. Um? Well, 123 00:07:16,160 --> 00:07:19,080 Speaker 1: I think they're doing the risk mitigation. Um. You're not 124 00:07:19,160 --> 00:07:22,680 Speaker 1: gonna gun it. You're not going to shoot a longer 125 00:07:22,840 --> 00:07:25,920 Speaker 1: range radar guided missile like an AM ram in A 126 00:07:26,080 --> 00:07:28,920 Speaker 1: one twenty. So as we've you know, I think the 127 00:07:28,960 --> 00:07:31,560 Speaker 1: whole nation is now familiar with the nomenclature of an 128 00:07:31,600 --> 00:07:34,520 Speaker 1: AM nine and and further, people saying AM nine X 129 00:07:34,560 --> 00:07:36,200 Speaker 1: You mean the X model, right, If now in the 130 00:07:36,280 --> 00:07:39,720 Speaker 1: public consciousness, Um, And so it's got a proximity fuse. 131 00:07:39,800 --> 00:07:42,640 Speaker 1: As we saw with the balloon. As soon as it 132 00:07:42,720 --> 00:07:45,320 Speaker 1: hit underneath, it exploded in the direction of the balloon, 133 00:07:45,320 --> 00:07:49,000 Speaker 1: took the balloon out, very small warhead. But to your question, 134 00:07:49,760 --> 00:07:51,520 Speaker 1: if I'm in and in that case it was an 135 00:07:51,520 --> 00:07:53,800 Speaker 1: F sixteen, the others have all been F twenty two 136 00:07:53,840 --> 00:07:56,920 Speaker 1: is the stealth fighter. This one was an F sixteen, 137 00:07:57,080 --> 00:08:00,440 Speaker 1: very widely used both domestically in international. When I have 138 00:08:00,600 --> 00:08:04,480 Speaker 1: some flight hours in a Navy aggressor version they have sixteen. 139 00:08:04,480 --> 00:08:06,760 Speaker 1: It is a cool airplane. Um. But if I shoot 140 00:08:06,800 --> 00:08:10,760 Speaker 1: a sidewinder and it misses. And I think that that one, 141 00:08:10,840 --> 00:08:14,160 Speaker 1: that object was at twenty feet, so that thing's gonna 142 00:08:14,280 --> 00:08:17,760 Speaker 1: sail pretty far beyond. So let's just say it goes 143 00:08:17,800 --> 00:08:22,600 Speaker 1: for another five miles before it hits the lake. And UM, 144 00:08:22,640 --> 00:08:24,880 Speaker 1: I can't answer whether or not. A friend of mine 145 00:08:24,880 --> 00:08:27,600 Speaker 1: asked whether it explodes when it hits I don't know. 146 00:08:28,640 --> 00:08:32,199 Speaker 1: So what happens when you're doing these is before you 147 00:08:32,840 --> 00:08:36,679 Speaker 1: are authorized to shoot, the planners put down a footprint 148 00:08:36,840 --> 00:08:39,480 Speaker 1: over you know, like over the area, and you have 149 00:08:39,520 --> 00:08:42,120 Speaker 1: a run in access. They did this off of South Carolina. 150 00:08:42,120 --> 00:08:45,280 Speaker 1: The running access was so you're not going to shoot 151 00:08:45,280 --> 00:08:47,840 Speaker 1: back towards the shore in the event that it misses. 152 00:08:48,080 --> 00:08:51,040 Speaker 1: And and so you know, this is this is where 153 00:08:51,040 --> 00:08:54,240 Speaker 1: you're like, imagine you're in your backyard with your son 154 00:08:54,320 --> 00:08:56,520 Speaker 1: and you you have an archery thing and your son's 155 00:08:56,520 --> 00:09:01,040 Speaker 1: sales one, you know, over the back fence, like, oh geez, 156 00:09:01,040 --> 00:09:03,600 Speaker 1: where did that go? You know? And and and that's 157 00:09:03,720 --> 00:09:07,600 Speaker 1: kind of what we're doing here. And so the other 158 00:09:07,679 --> 00:09:10,320 Speaker 1: thing that is curious to me as you hear the 159 00:09:10,360 --> 00:09:14,360 Speaker 1: explanations from mal Kirby and general writer and now General 160 00:09:14,400 --> 00:09:17,360 Speaker 1: Millie Um, where they're like we don't quite know what 161 00:09:17,440 --> 00:09:19,640 Speaker 1: it is. So I'm a guy who's lived by rules 162 00:09:19,679 --> 00:09:23,080 Speaker 1: of engagement very strict, So it strikes me the rules 163 00:09:23,080 --> 00:09:26,800 Speaker 1: of engagement here are shoot and then tell us what 164 00:09:26,880 --> 00:09:30,040 Speaker 1: you think it was a few days later. Right. I 165 00:09:30,080 --> 00:09:32,880 Speaker 1: would have loved that autowe Joe back in the day. 166 00:09:33,080 --> 00:09:35,200 Speaker 1: You know, we would have been all over the place 167 00:09:35,240 --> 00:09:39,440 Speaker 1: with that r we I'm not quite sure what's going on. 168 00:09:39,480 --> 00:09:43,320 Speaker 1: I think we really have reached the sort of ridiculous here. 169 00:09:43,320 --> 00:09:46,040 Speaker 1: And again, back to your original question, I don't know 170 00:09:46,080 --> 00:09:50,720 Speaker 1: the answer. You flew in fighter jets for the Navy, 171 00:09:50,800 --> 00:09:53,200 Speaker 1: and a lot of people have watched videos on YouTube 172 00:09:53,200 --> 00:09:57,679 Speaker 1: of naval aviators marveling at things that they cannot identify, 173 00:09:57,800 --> 00:10:01,680 Speaker 1: the pill shaped craft that went master and turned more 174 00:10:01,760 --> 00:10:05,520 Speaker 1: quickly than anything that we could construct. Ward, I don't 175 00:10:05,520 --> 00:10:07,480 Speaker 1: mean to ask you the wrong thing here, but did 176 00:10:07,559 --> 00:10:09,960 Speaker 1: you ever see anything you could not identify? And and 177 00:10:10,080 --> 00:10:15,079 Speaker 1: is there some merging of stories here? Yes, and the 178 00:10:15,200 --> 00:10:17,640 Speaker 1: show because we go way back, I'm going to admit 179 00:10:17,679 --> 00:10:21,400 Speaker 1: what this situation. Right. So I'm in the Mediterranean, it's 180 00:10:21,440 --> 00:10:25,240 Speaker 1: February UM at night, and there's something low on the 181 00:10:25,280 --> 00:10:29,400 Speaker 1: horizon that's blinking green and red um. We actually got 182 00:10:29,440 --> 00:10:33,160 Speaker 1: a sidewinder tone on it. It was that right, because 183 00:10:33,320 --> 00:10:36,240 Speaker 1: sidewinders I described in my episode about the blue and 184 00:10:36,240 --> 00:10:39,240 Speaker 1: shoot on. When you say heat seeking, it's what you're 185 00:10:39,240 --> 00:10:41,800 Speaker 1: really talking about is the I R spectrum, and it's 186 00:10:41,960 --> 00:10:45,320 Speaker 1: light seeking, so it comes out with differences in light, 187 00:10:45,440 --> 00:10:49,520 Speaker 1: not in heat. So, um, go back, tell the Intel guys, hey, 188 00:10:49,559 --> 00:10:52,200 Speaker 1: I think we saw something, can't quite explain, and they 189 00:10:52,240 --> 00:10:56,000 Speaker 1: immediately said, yeah, it was Mars, you know, planet of 190 00:10:56,080 --> 00:11:00,200 Speaker 1: Mars um And and so that's my UFO story. You 191 00:11:00,280 --> 00:11:03,400 Speaker 1: managed to lock onto it. You can you can lock 192 00:11:03,440 --> 00:11:05,280 Speaker 1: onto a planet. Well, you can get a you can 193 00:11:05,320 --> 00:11:09,959 Speaker 1: get a sidewinder tone it because of the light. Because 194 00:11:10,000 --> 00:11:13,960 Speaker 1: of the light. Yeah. Um. And so I think in 195 00:11:14,000 --> 00:11:18,839 Speaker 1: my experience, anything that is a UFO has some if 196 00:11:18,880 --> 00:11:22,160 Speaker 1: you you know, walk that dog backwards, do the forensics, 197 00:11:22,200 --> 00:11:25,800 Speaker 1: there's always some explanation for what it is. And I 198 00:11:25,840 --> 00:11:28,160 Speaker 1: go way back to the fifties when Area fifty one 199 00:11:28,240 --> 00:11:31,480 Speaker 1: was first created. It was created for the YouTube program 200 00:11:31,520 --> 00:11:34,120 Speaker 1: and then for the H twelve, which became the SR 201 00:11:34,200 --> 00:11:37,840 Speaker 1: seventy one. So airline pilots were seeing things is they're 202 00:11:37,840 --> 00:11:41,480 Speaker 1: flying at thirty feet but eighty thousand feet, like nothing 203 00:11:41,520 --> 00:11:43,679 Speaker 1: goes to eighty thousand feet and start of going up 204 00:11:44,120 --> 00:11:46,560 Speaker 1: and talking to the air traffic control and saying, I 205 00:11:46,640 --> 00:11:48,880 Speaker 1: see something I can't explain. I think it's a UFO. 206 00:11:49,400 --> 00:11:51,400 Speaker 1: And then when the program is revealed to the public, 207 00:11:51,440 --> 00:11:54,360 Speaker 1: they're like, oh, all of these us UFO reports to 208 00:11:54,400 --> 00:11:58,719 Speaker 1: the last you know, five seven years were these test programs, 209 00:11:58,720 --> 00:12:02,040 Speaker 1: these eight you know, the the YouTube program. So but 210 00:12:02,440 --> 00:12:04,520 Speaker 1: the thing you're talking about in two thousand and four 211 00:12:04,600 --> 00:12:08,760 Speaker 1: with the tic TAC, that one's hard to explain, right, 212 00:12:09,280 --> 00:12:13,760 Speaker 1: And and I know the female wingman um, and these 213 00:12:13,760 --> 00:12:18,280 Speaker 1: are rational beings that the skipper was actually leading that flight, um. 214 00:12:18,400 --> 00:12:21,400 Speaker 1: And so sometimes in spite of what I just said 215 00:12:21,440 --> 00:12:25,839 Speaker 1: there there is no explanation. Um. But my personal experience is, 216 00:12:26,160 --> 00:12:28,840 Speaker 1: you know, anytime I thought I saw something that was unexplainable, 217 00:12:29,480 --> 00:12:32,040 Speaker 1: when you sort of did the root cause it really 218 00:12:32,120 --> 00:12:36,000 Speaker 1: was something that was explainable. Ward Carroll with us here 219 00:12:36,040 --> 00:12:38,480 Speaker 1: on Bloomberg's sound On. Lastly, we we learned a bit 220 00:12:38,480 --> 00:12:41,080 Speaker 1: about radar this week. How come we were not picking 221 00:12:41,160 --> 00:12:46,400 Speaker 1: up all of these objects intuh range if that's where 222 00:12:46,440 --> 00:12:49,800 Speaker 1: commercial airliners are, and are we going to see these 223 00:12:50,040 --> 00:12:51,760 Speaker 1: on a regular basis from now on. Is there that 224 00:12:51,840 --> 00:12:55,400 Speaker 1: much junk up there? Yes, there's a lot of junk 225 00:12:55,480 --> 00:12:58,240 Speaker 1: up there. Um, And this is what my astronaut friend 226 00:12:58,240 --> 00:13:02,160 Speaker 1: Scott Kelly is telling me. So I think the basic explanation, Joe, 227 00:13:02,280 --> 00:13:05,560 Speaker 1: is when the first thing happened, when the when the 228 00:13:05,679 --> 00:13:10,440 Speaker 1: Chinese spy balloon came overhead, they sort of took the 229 00:13:10,480 --> 00:13:13,920 Speaker 1: filter and reduced it, right, So you can use a 230 00:13:13,960 --> 00:13:16,600 Speaker 1: million analogies for that, you know, squelch on your radio 231 00:13:16,760 --> 00:13:20,880 Speaker 1: or signal to noise ratio. As you bring that down, 232 00:13:20,920 --> 00:13:24,400 Speaker 1: then suddenly you see a lot of things, um, that 233 00:13:24,400 --> 00:13:27,199 Speaker 1: that you weren't seeing before. So I think that's the 234 00:13:27,280 --> 00:13:31,320 Speaker 1: factile explanation for what we're seeing over the last week 235 00:13:31,480 --> 00:13:33,720 Speaker 1: or so. Do you want to hear from the president 236 00:13:34,040 --> 00:13:40,360 Speaker 1: on this? Um? I guess you're not waiting around for 237 00:13:40,400 --> 00:13:43,360 Speaker 1: an Oval office address. That's what this this gets into 238 00:13:43,480 --> 00:13:47,360 Speaker 1: the you know, the politics, lane, right. I don't look 239 00:13:47,440 --> 00:13:50,840 Speaker 1: to him for my inspiration again, you know me, I'm 240 00:13:50,880 --> 00:13:54,839 Speaker 1: not maga, but I guess I need to hear from 241 00:13:54,840 --> 00:13:59,199 Speaker 1: the president. Like Senator Blackburn said, there, um, so sure, 242 00:13:59,320 --> 00:14:04,080 Speaker 1: let's hear from what's he going to say? Right? So? Yeah, no, 243 00:14:04,440 --> 00:14:07,679 Speaker 1: but when Ward Carol's laughing. I'm listening. Find him on 244 00:14:07,760 --> 00:14:11,200 Speaker 1: the YouTube channel. I'm a subscriber. It's always a great 245 00:14:11,200 --> 00:14:15,200 Speaker 1: pleasure of Ward Carroll, retired U S. Navy commander. Anybody 246 00:14:15,240 --> 00:14:17,600 Speaker 1: who flew in the F four team just stands a 247 00:14:17,600 --> 00:14:19,880 Speaker 1: couple of feet taller than everyone else around him. Right, 248 00:14:20,040 --> 00:14:22,680 Speaker 1: let's assemble the panel. Boyd Mathison his back with US 249 00:14:22,720 --> 00:14:25,320 Speaker 1: Republican strategist former chief of staff or Senator Mike Lee, 250 00:14:25,840 --> 00:14:29,880 Speaker 1: along with Tim Hogan, Democratic strategist, senior advisor at Our Initiatives, 251 00:14:29,880 --> 00:14:33,280 Speaker 1: former calms director for Amy Klobascher's presidential campaign. Gentlemen, it's 252 00:14:33,320 --> 00:14:35,960 Speaker 1: great to have you both here. Boyd, do we need 253 00:14:36,000 --> 00:14:39,320 Speaker 1: to hear from the president now? I think it is 254 00:14:39,360 --> 00:14:41,480 Speaker 1: time for the president to speak, and not that he 255 00:14:41,520 --> 00:14:44,240 Speaker 1: has a great deal more of information. I think it's 256 00:14:44,280 --> 00:14:47,320 Speaker 1: just what he needs to do really for three distinct 257 00:14:47,320 --> 00:14:49,400 Speaker 1: groups I need and he needs to send a message 258 00:14:49,400 --> 00:14:52,200 Speaker 1: to the American people that we're on this, we got this, 259 00:14:52,360 --> 00:14:54,360 Speaker 1: and we're moving forward. I think he needs to send 260 00:14:54,360 --> 00:14:56,520 Speaker 1: a message to our allies around the world that we 261 00:14:56,600 --> 00:14:59,000 Speaker 1: are aware of this. We know you're dealing with these 262 00:14:59,520 --> 00:15:02,120 Speaker 1: issues as well. Let's do that. And he also needs 263 00:15:02,160 --> 00:15:03,960 Speaker 1: to send a message to our enemies that we are 264 00:15:03,960 --> 00:15:07,000 Speaker 1: going to protect our our sovereign territory here in the 265 00:15:07,080 --> 00:15:09,920 Speaker 1: United States. So I think that the main thing. Again, 266 00:15:09,960 --> 00:15:11,320 Speaker 1: I don't think it needs to be a great in 267 00:15:11,400 --> 00:15:14,160 Speaker 1: depth dive. I think he needs to speak with the 268 00:15:14,200 --> 00:15:18,160 Speaker 1: American people, not to him, not to them, not at them, uh, 269 00:15:18,200 --> 00:15:21,200 Speaker 1: and really just create some some clarity. I think a 270 00:15:21,200 --> 00:15:24,720 Speaker 1: little bit of communication from the leader I think always 271 00:15:24,760 --> 00:15:27,800 Speaker 1: creates clarity. And what we have right now is just confusion, 272 00:15:27,840 --> 00:15:30,760 Speaker 1: which creates a vacuum for conspiracy theories and and a 273 00:15:30,760 --> 00:15:33,280 Speaker 1: lot of politics. And we don't need politics around this. 274 00:15:33,520 --> 00:15:34,760 Speaker 1: And I think you heard that coming out of the 275 00:15:34,800 --> 00:15:37,960 Speaker 1: briefing today. The Senators were very much in agreement in 276 00:15:38,040 --> 00:15:39,960 Speaker 1: terms of, Hey, this is what we got. The American 277 00:15:40,000 --> 00:15:43,040 Speaker 1: people should hear most of this. Tim, what's your thought here. 278 00:15:43,240 --> 00:15:46,239 Speaker 1: Does the President need to address the nation just to 279 00:15:45,960 --> 00:15:49,320 Speaker 1: to give some calm, to provide some confidence, as Boyd 280 00:15:49,360 --> 00:15:51,840 Speaker 1: is suggesting, or does he need to learn more and 281 00:15:51,880 --> 00:15:55,720 Speaker 1: have very specific information when he speaks. Well, I think 282 00:15:55,720 --> 00:15:58,960 Speaker 1: we're hearing two different stories coming out of these briefings. 283 00:15:58,960 --> 00:16:00,880 Speaker 1: There are a lot of Republican is out there right now. 284 00:16:01,000 --> 00:16:04,120 Speaker 1: Thing he needs to address the nation. That's the decision 285 00:16:04,120 --> 00:16:05,960 Speaker 1: that the president needs to make. But you do have 286 00:16:06,000 --> 00:16:09,160 Speaker 1: some folks like Senator Mike Browns came out of the 287 00:16:09,280 --> 00:16:12,000 Speaker 1: briefing and said that they're trying to get us all 288 00:16:12,040 --> 00:16:14,480 Speaker 1: the information that they can, but there's not a ton 289 00:16:14,480 --> 00:16:17,840 Speaker 1: of new data, and um, you know, until they actually 290 00:16:17,880 --> 00:16:20,760 Speaker 1: get that information and more hard facts, we'll see. You 291 00:16:20,840 --> 00:16:24,320 Speaker 1: have folks like Senator Gary Peters saying they also feel 292 00:16:24,320 --> 00:16:27,240 Speaker 1: like they need more information that there haven't been completely 293 00:16:27,240 --> 00:16:31,240 Speaker 1: definitive statements about recovering the debris, and so yeah, there 294 00:16:31,240 --> 00:16:33,360 Speaker 1: needs to be some communications to the American people. But 295 00:16:33,400 --> 00:16:37,120 Speaker 1: I do think that the Pentagon is doing a lot 296 00:16:37,120 --> 00:16:39,360 Speaker 1: of that communication. A lot of our military leaders are. 297 00:16:39,360 --> 00:16:43,640 Speaker 1: We see UH Kirby at the podium communicating information about 298 00:16:44,320 --> 00:16:47,880 Speaker 1: military intelligence and what they know about these three objects 299 00:16:47,960 --> 00:16:51,440 Speaker 1: and what part of intelligence collection effort they were. We'll 300 00:16:51,440 --> 00:16:54,640 Speaker 1: see if we learn more. It's the mother Shift Bloomer. 301 00:16:58,040 --> 00:17:01,440 Speaker 1: You're listening to the Bloomberg Sound on podcast. Catch the 302 00:17:01,480 --> 00:17:05,240 Speaker 1: program live weekdays at five pm Easter on Bloomberg Radio, 303 00:17:05,359 --> 00:17:08,159 Speaker 1: the tune in app, Bloomberg dot Com, and the Bloomberg 304 00:17:08,200 --> 00:17:11,480 Speaker 1: Business App. You can also listen live on Amazon Alexa 305 00:17:11,560 --> 00:17:15,120 Speaker 1: from our flagship New York station. Just say Alexa play 306 00:17:15,200 --> 00:17:21,040 Speaker 1: Bloomberg eleven dirty. President Biden makes it official just about 307 00:17:21,040 --> 00:17:24,879 Speaker 1: the time the closing bell rang Lal Brainerd becomes his 308 00:17:25,040 --> 00:17:29,200 Speaker 1: top economic aid, replacing Brian Dee. So I'll be looking 309 00:17:29,200 --> 00:17:32,240 Speaker 1: forward to hearing from tomorrow on Bloomberg. He's gonna be 310 00:17:32,240 --> 00:17:35,720 Speaker 1: talking on balance of power with David Weston. But this 311 00:17:35,800 --> 00:17:37,520 Speaker 1: is something that's been on the works for some time, 312 00:17:37,520 --> 00:17:39,639 Speaker 1: and there are a couple of moving parts here. President 313 00:17:39,680 --> 00:17:45,120 Speaker 1: Biden also announcing appointments of other economic aids, namely Jared Bernstein, 314 00:17:45,119 --> 00:17:48,159 Speaker 1: who you've heard many times on this program, as the 315 00:17:48,200 --> 00:17:53,359 Speaker 1: new chair of the Council of Economic Advisors. As Cecilia 316 00:17:53,440 --> 00:17:58,520 Speaker 1: Rouse heads back to Princeton, now the deck chairs being 317 00:17:58,520 --> 00:18:02,520 Speaker 1: moved around here. The new low chart, implemented as the 318 00:18:02,600 --> 00:18:07,040 Speaker 1: latest CPI data, hits consumer prices up briskly the start 319 00:18:07,040 --> 00:18:08,680 Speaker 1: of the year, as I read on the terminal, a 320 00:18:08,760 --> 00:18:12,960 Speaker 1: sign of persistent inflationary pressures that could push the FED 321 00:18:13,000 --> 00:18:16,240 Speaker 1: to high rates even higher than previously expected. We spoke 322 00:18:16,240 --> 00:18:19,840 Speaker 1: with economist Diane Swonk about this earlier today on Bloomberg. 323 00:18:19,920 --> 00:18:23,560 Speaker 1: She says that year to year comparison is a problem. Listen, 324 00:18:23,720 --> 00:18:26,720 Speaker 1: even though we had a little ticked down in January 325 00:18:26,720 --> 00:18:31,280 Speaker 1: on that core x shelter component, it still is way 326 00:18:31,280 --> 00:18:33,320 Speaker 1: too hot. And on a year of year basis, it's 327 00:18:33,359 --> 00:18:35,960 Speaker 1: still very very hot, which is important because remember a 328 00:18:36,080 --> 00:18:39,440 Speaker 1: year ago, this is when inflation was just beginning to accelerate. 329 00:18:39,480 --> 00:18:43,000 Speaker 1: So the year and your comparison should be easier, not harder, 330 00:18:43,480 --> 00:18:47,360 Speaker 1: but it's still getting harder. That's Diane Swonk again now 331 00:18:47,400 --> 00:18:50,760 Speaker 1: at KPMG, and we're always glad to talk about this 332 00:18:50,800 --> 00:18:54,320 Speaker 1: stuff with Mark Zandy, who is a great translator and 333 00:18:54,400 --> 00:18:57,640 Speaker 1: of course the chief economist at Moody's Analytics. It's great 334 00:18:57,680 --> 00:18:59,919 Speaker 1: to have you mark this report before I ask you 335 00:19:00,000 --> 00:19:02,000 Speaker 1: about some of the personality is moving around with the 336 00:19:02,000 --> 00:19:04,919 Speaker 1: White House here. Does this report change your forecast at 337 00:19:04,960 --> 00:19:08,600 Speaker 1: all for the Fed? No? No, no. I think they'll 338 00:19:08,720 --> 00:19:12,080 Speaker 1: raise rates one more time in March quarter point, another 339 00:19:12,200 --> 00:19:14,560 Speaker 1: time in May. You know, the quarter point now would 340 00:19:14,560 --> 00:19:17,440 Speaker 1: put the funds rate just north of five percent, and 341 00:19:17,520 --> 00:19:20,000 Speaker 1: I think that's where they'll still still pause, will stop, 342 00:19:20,000 --> 00:19:22,320 Speaker 1: take a look around. In my my sense is that 343 00:19:23,000 --> 00:19:25,400 Speaker 1: we'll get enough good news on inflation and the job 344 00:19:25,440 --> 00:19:27,560 Speaker 1: markets that will be the end of the rate hikes, 345 00:19:27,800 --> 00:19:29,760 Speaker 1: not not that they're going to cut race anytime soon. 346 00:19:30,080 --> 00:19:32,439 Speaker 1: Sure I don't think that happens in three but I 347 00:19:32,480 --> 00:19:34,720 Speaker 1: think that's a so called terminal rate of just north 348 00:19:34,800 --> 00:19:36,960 Speaker 1: of five percent. That feels about right to me. You 349 00:19:37,000 --> 00:19:39,600 Speaker 1: point out in a great threat on Twitter that the 350 00:19:39,640 --> 00:19:42,359 Speaker 1: most encouraging part of this report for you is that 351 00:19:42,400 --> 00:19:45,320 Speaker 1: we know the cost of housing, which accounts for a 352 00:19:45,359 --> 00:19:48,600 Speaker 1: big chunk of the CPI UH is set to slow 353 00:19:48,680 --> 00:19:51,080 Speaker 1: as rents go soft. What does that mean as well 354 00:19:51,160 --> 00:19:56,439 Speaker 1: for for for home a single family home prices, Well, 355 00:19:56,480 --> 00:19:58,920 Speaker 1: I mean the cost of having services a third of 356 00:19:58,920 --> 00:20:01,000 Speaker 1: the CPI, So it's a big chunk of the consumer 357 00:20:01,040 --> 00:20:03,480 Speaker 1: price index. And we know that that's going to moderate, 358 00:20:03,600 --> 00:20:07,399 Speaker 1: right Joe, because rents have gone flat, and that's gonna 359 00:20:07,440 --> 00:20:10,040 Speaker 1: be very positive with a part of those year over 360 00:20:10,119 --> 00:20:12,199 Speaker 1: year inflation numbers by the end of the year. And 361 00:20:12,200 --> 00:20:15,440 Speaker 1: then we also know that new vehicle prices, which continue 362 00:20:15,440 --> 00:20:16,960 Speaker 1: to move higher, they're going to start to move in 363 00:20:17,000 --> 00:20:20,000 Speaker 1: South too, because vehicle production is going to improve globally 364 00:20:20,800 --> 00:20:23,600 Speaker 1: as supply chains. He's given what China has done and 365 00:20:23,920 --> 00:20:25,639 Speaker 1: that will help a lot too. So I think by 366 00:20:25,640 --> 00:20:28,600 Speaker 1: the end of the year, year over year CPI inflation, 367 00:20:28,760 --> 00:20:31,679 Speaker 1: which is north of six percent now will be closer 368 00:20:31,720 --> 00:20:34,240 Speaker 1: to three. So I think we're heading in the right direction. 369 00:20:35,080 --> 00:20:38,120 Speaker 1: But you know, when they go to house prices, uh, 370 00:20:38,160 --> 00:20:41,439 Speaker 1: you know, they obviously are are weakening. Uh there they 371 00:20:41,760 --> 00:20:44,760 Speaker 1: they peek back in the summer July, They're down on 372 00:20:44,800 --> 00:20:47,720 Speaker 1: a couple of percentage points. I expect more declined because 373 00:20:47,840 --> 00:20:51,800 Speaker 1: affordability than hammered. Uh. You know, you've got much higher 374 00:20:51,800 --> 00:20:54,520 Speaker 1: house prices given what happened during the pandemic and now 375 00:20:54,600 --> 00:20:58,240 Speaker 1: higher mortgage rates and affordability needs to be restored. And 376 00:20:58,280 --> 00:21:01,880 Speaker 1: that can only happen in three different ways. Either house 377 00:21:01,880 --> 00:21:06,359 Speaker 1: prices decline, incomes rise and fall. I expect at some 378 00:21:06,400 --> 00:21:08,199 Speaker 1: point all three things will happen, so we'll get more 379 00:21:08,240 --> 00:21:11,639 Speaker 1: price to clients. You know, you're going forward some interesting 380 00:21:11,680 --> 00:21:13,600 Speaker 1: moves today at the White House. I don't know how 381 00:21:13,640 --> 00:21:15,560 Speaker 1: much they mean to you in the real world here, 382 00:21:15,600 --> 00:21:19,720 Speaker 1: but lal brainers are going to replace Brian Deese, and 383 00:21:19,760 --> 00:21:21,480 Speaker 1: you can weigh in on that if you choose, is 384 00:21:21,520 --> 00:21:23,159 Speaker 1: going to create an opening at the FED. And I 385 00:21:23,200 --> 00:21:26,400 Speaker 1: wonder which one you're more concerned with. Well, I'm I'm 386 00:21:26,440 --> 00:21:29,760 Speaker 1: a fan of Lao Brainerd and and Jared Bernstein, you know, 387 00:21:29,960 --> 00:21:32,520 Speaker 1: as head of the Council of Economic Advisors. They both 388 00:21:32,600 --> 00:21:36,159 Speaker 1: have a long history working with President Biden and the 389 00:21:36,200 --> 00:21:39,520 Speaker 1: rest of the administration. You know, they've been in Laos 390 00:21:39,680 --> 00:21:42,000 Speaker 1: was you know, in the Treasury and the FED, and 391 00:21:42,119 --> 00:21:45,920 Speaker 1: Jared's been was Vice President and Vice President Biden back 392 00:21:45,960 --> 00:21:49,840 Speaker 1: in Obama administration, so chief economic advisors. So they're they're 393 00:21:49,920 --> 00:21:52,280 Speaker 1: very good and I think they'll be you know, excellent 394 00:21:52,320 --> 00:21:55,639 Speaker 1: at their jobs on. Very encouraged by that. Uh And 395 00:21:55,840 --> 00:21:58,080 Speaker 1: you know, I do think there's a lot of good 396 00:21:58,119 --> 00:22:02,120 Speaker 1: choices for uh, you know, taking going on the FED 397 00:22:02,160 --> 00:22:04,240 Speaker 1: and so I don't think while having trouble finding the 398 00:22:04,359 --> 00:22:06,119 Speaker 1: like kind of people there. So I feel pretty good 399 00:22:06,119 --> 00:22:08,560 Speaker 1: about the personal changes. So I know Brian D's is 400 00:22:08,600 --> 00:22:12,400 Speaker 1: great to see, Rouse is fantastic, but you know, they've 401 00:22:12,440 --> 00:22:15,359 Speaker 1: got good folks stuffing in here. So I feel pretty 402 00:22:15,400 --> 00:22:17,760 Speaker 1: good about the advice of president is going to be 403 00:22:17,800 --> 00:22:19,600 Speaker 1: getting here over the next couple of years. Is there 404 00:22:19,680 --> 00:22:22,080 Speaker 1: much some light between Brian Daese and Leo Branderd for 405 00:22:22,080 --> 00:22:23,840 Speaker 1: for the benefit of our listeners, do you see them 406 00:22:23,880 --> 00:22:28,280 Speaker 1: as as having different styles, different types of economists? Oh, 407 00:22:28,320 --> 00:22:32,719 Speaker 1: that's an interesting question. Uh. You know, they're very similar 408 00:22:32,760 --> 00:22:35,280 Speaker 1: in their perspectives and the way they think about things, 409 00:22:35,320 --> 00:22:38,119 Speaker 1: So I don't think there are big differences there. You know. 410 00:22:38,160 --> 00:22:42,960 Speaker 1: Obviously they have different approaches, you know, Uh, but both 411 00:22:42,960 --> 00:22:45,080 Speaker 1: are I think they're gonna land with land. You know, 412 00:22:45,359 --> 00:22:48,320 Speaker 1: decent briandas fantastic job and Layol will do a great 413 00:22:48,359 --> 00:22:50,560 Speaker 1: job as well. But but they are very kind of 414 00:22:50,600 --> 00:22:52,560 Speaker 1: different in terms of their styles, but in terms of 415 00:22:52,560 --> 00:22:55,560 Speaker 1: their perspectives and how they approach policy, I think very similar. 416 00:22:57,000 --> 00:22:59,000 Speaker 1: Great talk is always with Mark Sandy. I appreciate it, 417 00:22:59,040 --> 00:23:01,560 Speaker 1: Mark Moody's analytic chief Economists. Let's play it to the 418 00:23:01,560 --> 00:23:05,119 Speaker 1: panel here, Boyd mathieson Republican strategists, joined today by Tim Hogan, 419 00:23:05,119 --> 00:23:09,120 Speaker 1: Democratic strategist. As we find our way through all of this. 420 00:23:09,119 --> 00:23:12,520 Speaker 1: This is the this is the tough part here, obviously, Boyd, 421 00:23:12,560 --> 00:23:15,720 Speaker 1: when you start talking about inflation that CPI data today 422 00:23:15,720 --> 00:23:20,679 Speaker 1: and encourage some it had others predicting continued interest rate hikes. 423 00:23:21,280 --> 00:23:24,040 Speaker 1: But this is clearly, uh, not a problem that has 424 00:23:24,080 --> 00:23:25,760 Speaker 1: been solved, and maybe going in the right direction of 425 00:23:25,800 --> 00:23:28,680 Speaker 1: Wall Street sure thinks that the Fed has this licked. 426 00:23:28,720 --> 00:23:31,320 Speaker 1: But if you're Joe Biden right now, and you're considering 427 00:23:31,359 --> 00:23:34,119 Speaker 1: the possibility of a recession in the second half of 428 00:23:34,119 --> 00:23:38,160 Speaker 1: this year if too much hiking follows. This is still 429 00:23:38,160 --> 00:23:40,960 Speaker 1: a great concern for you as you prepared one for 430 00:23:41,040 --> 00:23:44,119 Speaker 1: re election. Yeah, that's right. Threatening the needle is the 431 00:23:44,160 --> 00:23:46,880 Speaker 1: real trick for President Biden right now. Obviously he wants 432 00:23:46,880 --> 00:23:49,280 Speaker 1: to the positives of the job numbers and so on. 433 00:23:49,480 --> 00:23:50,600 Speaker 1: Are you trying to do a lot of that in 434 00:23:50,640 --> 00:23:53,600 Speaker 1: the State of the Union addressed? And his biggest challenges 435 00:23:54,000 --> 00:23:56,480 Speaker 1: is making sure that what he's touting and saying is 436 00:23:56,560 --> 00:24:01,040 Speaker 1: positive actually is congluent with what the America people are feeling, 437 00:24:01,080 --> 00:24:04,880 Speaker 1: living and experiencing around the kitchen table. And sometimes they're 438 00:24:04,920 --> 00:24:08,399 Speaker 1: trying to do that by more redefining of definitions. Today 439 00:24:08,440 --> 00:24:12,080 Speaker 1: even just the emphasis on the super core inflation where 440 00:24:12,160 --> 00:24:15,200 Speaker 1: you take out food, energy, and shelter. If we take 441 00:24:15,240 --> 00:24:18,840 Speaker 1: everything out, we will get inflation to zero. People are 442 00:24:18,840 --> 00:24:21,040 Speaker 1: still going to be suffering. And so again, I think 443 00:24:21,040 --> 00:24:23,240 Speaker 1: it's regardless of whether you love the president or you 444 00:24:23,240 --> 00:24:26,800 Speaker 1: don't like the president, it's a communication issue, and he's 445 00:24:26,800 --> 00:24:29,440 Speaker 1: got us thread that needle because if what he's saying 446 00:24:29,640 --> 00:24:32,440 Speaker 1: and the American people are living are not congruent, then 447 00:24:32,480 --> 00:24:34,520 Speaker 1: he does have a problem. Well, Tim Hogan, if he's 448 00:24:34,520 --> 00:24:36,440 Speaker 1: going to communicate anything, it's the job market, and he 449 00:24:36,480 --> 00:24:37,920 Speaker 1: certainly did that in the State of the Union. It 450 00:24:37,960 --> 00:24:40,040 Speaker 1: does it almost every time he's in front of a microphone. 451 00:24:40,480 --> 00:24:42,960 Speaker 1: Three point four percent unemployment gives the Fed a lot 452 00:24:42,960 --> 00:24:45,840 Speaker 1: of room to play with here, and it could keep 453 00:24:45,920 --> 00:24:48,240 Speaker 1: this country out of a recession. Is that how you 454 00:24:48,240 --> 00:24:51,640 Speaker 1: see it? Well? I think so, and I also think 455 00:24:51,680 --> 00:24:54,679 Speaker 1: it is the message that he's communicating and is a 456 00:24:54,720 --> 00:24:57,080 Speaker 1: little in track with what Mark Xandy was saying, which 457 00:24:57,119 --> 00:25:00,399 Speaker 1: is there does appear to be a cost slowdown um 458 00:25:00,440 --> 00:25:03,800 Speaker 1: in housing and in rents, issues like vehicle production year 459 00:25:03,840 --> 00:25:06,959 Speaker 1: over year. We do think that EPI inflation is going 460 00:25:07,040 --> 00:25:10,040 Speaker 1: to continue to come down. We saw in the previous 461 00:25:10,080 --> 00:25:14,439 Speaker 1: month thousand jobs created, over million jobs created since he 462 00:25:14,480 --> 00:25:17,679 Speaker 1: took office, lowest unemployment rate since nineteen sixty nine. So 463 00:25:17,720 --> 00:25:20,840 Speaker 1: absolutely it is about what people are feeling in this economy. 464 00:25:21,400 --> 00:25:24,200 Speaker 1: But we look at different places where they have been inflation. 465 00:25:24,280 --> 00:25:26,520 Speaker 1: Gas prices are down about a buck six the peak 466 00:25:26,640 --> 00:25:28,840 Speaker 1: last year, so there's still work to be done, but 467 00:25:28,960 --> 00:25:30,840 Speaker 1: they are doing the work, I think is what needs 468 00:25:30,840 --> 00:25:35,040 Speaker 1: to be underlined. How important is this realignment after two 469 00:25:35,119 --> 00:25:38,560 Speaker 1: years here in the White House, Boyd, we saw the 470 00:25:38,640 --> 00:25:42,080 Speaker 1: Labor Secretary make a move. Press secretary left a few 471 00:25:42,119 --> 00:25:44,679 Speaker 1: months back. It's been actually probably six months at this point, 472 00:25:45,359 --> 00:25:50,080 Speaker 1: but but no real internal noise on the economic team 473 00:25:50,119 --> 00:25:53,040 Speaker 1: until now. Is this part for the course for an 474 00:25:53,040 --> 00:25:56,200 Speaker 1: administration halfway through the first term. Yeah, I don't. I 475 00:25:56,200 --> 00:25:58,280 Speaker 1: don't think there's anything. I don't think there's any panic 476 00:25:58,280 --> 00:26:00,760 Speaker 1: buttons being pushed or people trying to ale on anything. 477 00:26:01,000 --> 00:26:03,800 Speaker 1: I think it's just natural adjustment and course of business 478 00:26:03,840 --> 00:26:06,240 Speaker 1: inside of a of a White House. Again. I think 479 00:26:06,280 --> 00:26:09,160 Speaker 1: the real issues will be what comes next and making 480 00:26:09,200 --> 00:26:12,600 Speaker 1: sure they're communicating what they're doing, how they're approaching these 481 00:26:12,600 --> 00:26:16,000 Speaker 1: issues to the American people again, not at them with them, 482 00:26:16,160 --> 00:26:18,240 Speaker 1: and helping them feel like, hey, now this team that 483 00:26:18,280 --> 00:26:20,760 Speaker 1: we have now is on your side and we're trying 484 00:26:20,800 --> 00:26:22,840 Speaker 1: to push everything forward. I think that's the key for 485 00:26:22,880 --> 00:26:27,320 Speaker 1: the administration. Sam Lile Brandard has been framed as a 486 00:26:27,359 --> 00:26:29,359 Speaker 1: bit more dubbish than j Powell. That was some of 487 00:26:29,400 --> 00:26:32,320 Speaker 1: the concern when she was floated for uh FED chair 488 00:26:32,800 --> 00:26:37,280 Speaker 1: that she has more concern about people's jobs and income 489 00:26:37,359 --> 00:26:42,400 Speaker 1: being impacted by a series of interest rate hikes. Uh, 490 00:26:42,640 --> 00:26:44,760 Speaker 1: she can feel your pain. I guess is the idea? 491 00:26:44,800 --> 00:26:47,040 Speaker 1: Does that make her more suited to be sitting next 492 00:26:47,040 --> 00:26:50,399 Speaker 1: to Joe Biden in the West Wing. I think in 493 00:26:50,520 --> 00:26:54,600 Speaker 1: terms of communicating the message, yes, it is understanding what 494 00:26:54,800 --> 00:26:58,000 Speaker 1: the economy means to people day to day. Um, and 495 00:26:58,119 --> 00:27:00,000 Speaker 1: there are a lot of metrics that show that there 496 00:27:00,119 --> 00:27:01,320 Speaker 1: is hope in the future. And I think it is 497 00:27:01,359 --> 00:27:04,480 Speaker 1: having messengers who can communicate that that ten million new 498 00:27:04,520 --> 00:27:07,159 Speaker 1: businesses have been created, that people are actually sitting on 499 00:27:07,520 --> 00:27:10,080 Speaker 1: a trillion dollars of additional savings from the pandemic, that 500 00:27:10,119 --> 00:27:13,440 Speaker 1: inflation adjusted wealth in the middle class has actually gone up, 501 00:27:14,080 --> 00:27:17,200 Speaker 1: being able to get that message out and not as 502 00:27:17,240 --> 00:27:19,800 Speaker 1: you're as as my fellow panelist says, you're not just 503 00:27:20,040 --> 00:27:22,480 Speaker 1: talk at people, would have a conversation with the American 504 00:27:22,520 --> 00:27:26,960 Speaker 1: public about what's happening in the economy. Boyd matheson Tim 505 00:27:27,000 --> 00:27:31,520 Speaker 1: Hogan with us. You're listening to the Bloomberg Sound on podcast. 506 00:27:31,920 --> 00:27:35,280 Speaker 1: Catch us live weekdays at five Eastern on Bloomberg dot com, 507 00:27:35,440 --> 00:27:37,880 Speaker 1: the I Heart Radio app, and the Bloomberg Business App. 508 00:27:38,080 --> 00:27:42,480 Speaker 1: We're listening on demand wherever you get your podcast. So 509 00:27:42,520 --> 00:27:45,439 Speaker 1: will Donald Trump have a nickname for Nicky Hayley? Does 510 00:27:45,480 --> 00:27:48,120 Speaker 1: he have one already? This book been going pretty easy 511 00:27:48,119 --> 00:27:50,440 Speaker 1: on her since news first broke that she would announce 512 00:27:50,440 --> 00:27:53,360 Speaker 1: the campaign for the White House, and she did so 513 00:27:53,480 --> 00:27:55,879 Speaker 1: this morning out with a well produced video That's how 514 00:27:55,920 --> 00:27:58,640 Speaker 1: you do it. Now you need a video in which 515 00:27:58,640 --> 00:28:01,280 Speaker 1: the former governor of South carol Na made her case. Listen, 516 00:28:01,720 --> 00:28:04,919 Speaker 1: Republicans have lost the popular vote in seven out of 517 00:28:04,920 --> 00:28:09,800 Speaker 1: the last eight presidential elections. That has to change. Joe 518 00:28:09,840 --> 00:28:13,600 Speaker 1: Biden's record is abysmal, but that shouldn't come as a surprise. 519 00:28:14,240 --> 00:28:17,600 Speaker 1: Current polls, though, show a lot of work ahead for 520 00:28:17,680 --> 00:28:21,840 Speaker 1: Nicky Hayley, also the former UN ambassador and the Trump 521 00:28:21,840 --> 00:28:26,199 Speaker 1: administration single digits in the polls. We've talked about this before, 522 00:28:26,440 --> 00:28:31,880 Speaker 1: very little name recognition, considering a crowded field dominated by 523 00:28:32,000 --> 00:28:36,399 Speaker 1: Donald Trump, by the likes of Rhonda Santis and potentially 524 00:28:36,440 --> 00:28:38,680 Speaker 1: other members of the Trump administration. Right we talked about 525 00:28:39,000 --> 00:28:43,280 Speaker 1: Mike Pompeo, Mike Pence, who else could there be? She 526 00:28:43,360 --> 00:28:46,040 Speaker 1: had earlier said she would not challenge Donald Trump, by 527 00:28:46,080 --> 00:28:47,360 Speaker 1: the way, but I guess they got on the phone. 528 00:28:47,360 --> 00:28:51,240 Speaker 1: He said, follow your heart let's assemble the panel ought 529 00:28:51,280 --> 00:28:55,880 Speaker 1: to be first. Boyd Mathison, Republican strategist former chief of 530 00:28:55,880 --> 00:28:57,760 Speaker 1: staff of Senator Mike Lee, is with us along with 531 00:28:57,800 --> 00:29:02,200 Speaker 1: Tim Hogan, Democratic strategist, senior adviser our Initiatives, was once 532 00:29:02,280 --> 00:29:05,400 Speaker 1: coms director for Amy Klobaschar's presidential campaign. So here we 533 00:29:05,440 --> 00:29:09,920 Speaker 1: go again, Tim, your advice to NICKI Haley? Who would 534 00:29:09,920 --> 00:29:14,520 Speaker 1: want to share a stage with Donald Trump? I, you know, 535 00:29:15,000 --> 00:29:19,520 Speaker 1: candidates cannot run for president and not confront Donald Trump 536 00:29:19,640 --> 00:29:21,640 Speaker 1: on the Republican side, So I'm looking for a vice 537 00:29:21,640 --> 00:29:24,200 Speaker 1: presidential not here. Is that what this is? Maybe it's 538 00:29:24,280 --> 00:29:27,280 Speaker 1: it's entirely possible. That's that's what it is. You know, 539 00:29:27,360 --> 00:29:30,680 Speaker 1: she was on Hannity back in late January and teasing 540 00:29:30,720 --> 00:29:34,239 Speaker 1: her announcement, and he asked a good question of her 541 00:29:34,280 --> 00:29:36,080 Speaker 1: that she still hasn't answered, which is what is the 542 00:29:36,120 --> 00:29:39,440 Speaker 1: policy difference that you have with Donald Trump? And I 543 00:29:39,480 --> 00:29:41,800 Speaker 1: don't know what it is. He has the record that 544 00:29:41,960 --> 00:29:44,280 Speaker 1: is just a a bysinal that Democrats can draw some 545 00:29:44,400 --> 00:29:47,760 Speaker 1: contrast with. But you just can't run in the Republican primary. 546 00:29:47,960 --> 00:29:50,800 Speaker 1: And I hope that Donald Trump ignores you. I don't 547 00:29:50,800 --> 00:29:53,320 Speaker 1: know what the nickname is yet for Nicky Haley. You know, 548 00:29:53,360 --> 00:29:56,600 Speaker 1: meat Ball Ron, I know he's work shopping not too bad. Um, well, 549 00:29:56,680 --> 00:29:59,040 Speaker 1: we'll see what he comes on. Point well, well as 550 00:29:59,240 --> 00:30:01,040 Speaker 1: the saying the money is, I mean, Boyd, you're not 551 00:30:01,040 --> 00:30:05,719 Speaker 1: going to get better he was. I feel like that 552 00:30:05,760 --> 00:30:08,280 Speaker 1: was an early draft and he's moved on. He's moved on. 553 00:30:08,320 --> 00:30:13,040 Speaker 1: The Meatball Boyd matheson. Uh. Nicky Haley has a great 554 00:30:13,080 --> 00:30:16,000 Speaker 1: story to tell. Can she get around Donald Trump? Or 555 00:30:16,040 --> 00:30:17,400 Speaker 1: is that not the point she wants to be with 556 00:30:17,440 --> 00:30:20,680 Speaker 1: Donald Trump? Uh? You know, I think she does have 557 00:30:20,680 --> 00:30:22,040 Speaker 1: a story to tell. And this trially and she and 558 00:30:22,080 --> 00:30:25,560 Speaker 1: Tim gets this his his former boss, Senator Quota char 559 00:30:25,760 --> 00:30:28,280 Speaker 1: you know, went with really long ards odds and you 560 00:30:28,320 --> 00:30:31,240 Speaker 1: know it's probably inside the margin of error when she started. 561 00:30:31,840 --> 00:30:33,800 Speaker 1: But she had a story to tell and she made 562 00:30:33,840 --> 00:30:37,320 Speaker 1: some great inroads. I actually wish you would have gone further. Uh. 563 00:30:37,360 --> 00:30:38,800 Speaker 1: And and so you have to look at that from 564 00:30:38,800 --> 00:30:40,960 Speaker 1: an overall perspective. But I would love to be in 565 00:30:40,960 --> 00:30:42,800 Speaker 1: the room, and I bet Tim would two with the 566 00:30:42,880 --> 00:30:46,000 Speaker 1: Nicky Haley group to say, Okay, when you're gonna launch 567 00:30:46,040 --> 00:30:47,959 Speaker 1: such an endeavor, you first you have to look at 568 00:30:47,960 --> 00:30:50,120 Speaker 1: the polling numbers. You have to have a reality set there. 569 00:30:50,400 --> 00:30:52,400 Speaker 1: Then you have to be able to identify a lane. 570 00:30:52,600 --> 00:30:55,360 Speaker 1: Is there a lane to run in? Uh? And then 571 00:30:55,360 --> 00:30:57,160 Speaker 1: can you raise the money to actually do it? But 572 00:30:57,200 --> 00:30:58,880 Speaker 1: I think in terms of a lane, I think you 573 00:30:58,920 --> 00:31:01,040 Speaker 1: can see what she's trying to do. Whether she can 574 00:31:01,040 --> 00:31:03,320 Speaker 1: get traction on it will be a test. But starting 575 00:31:03,360 --> 00:31:06,720 Speaker 1: with that very simple idea of Republicans have lost seven 576 00:31:06,760 --> 00:31:09,880 Speaker 1: out of the last eight popular votes, maybe we should 577 00:31:09,880 --> 00:31:12,720 Speaker 1: try something a little different. Uh. Now, I don't know 578 00:31:12,760 --> 00:31:15,360 Speaker 1: that the Republican Party has appetite for that when you're 579 00:31:15,800 --> 00:31:18,440 Speaker 1: most likely going to have Rhonda Santis and Donald Trump 580 00:31:18,680 --> 00:31:22,800 Speaker 1: trading nicknames and body blows. But maybe she's hoping that 581 00:31:22,880 --> 00:31:25,920 Speaker 1: she'll have a lane enough that if those two kind 582 00:31:25,920 --> 00:31:28,560 Speaker 1: of divide things amongst them kills there, there may be 583 00:31:28,680 --> 00:31:31,760 Speaker 1: enough scraps over to have away. Let's bring you back 584 00:31:31,800 --> 00:31:35,240 Speaker 1: to little harp music. Here in my mind, this is 585 00:31:35,360 --> 00:31:40,560 Speaker 1: Nicky Haley with Marco Rubio on stage in South Carolina. 586 00:31:40,640 --> 00:31:45,160 Speaker 1: She's stumping for Rubio and took aim at then candidate 587 00:31:45,200 --> 00:31:48,920 Speaker 1: Donald Trump said she taught her two kids to not 588 00:31:49,080 --> 00:31:51,680 Speaker 1: be like him, and went on to say this, I 589 00:31:51,720 --> 00:31:54,800 Speaker 1: taught my two little ones you don't line and make 590 00:31:54,880 --> 00:32:01,000 Speaker 1: things up. I taught my two little ones that you 591 00:32:01,040 --> 00:32:04,000 Speaker 1: don't push people around and just tell them what you 592 00:32:04,080 --> 00:32:07,200 Speaker 1: think should happen. And I told my two little ones 593 00:32:07,600 --> 00:32:10,560 Speaker 1: to do exactly what Marco Rubio did in the last debate. 594 00:32:10,760 --> 00:32:17,880 Speaker 1: When a bully hit you, you hit that bully right back. Boy. 595 00:32:17,960 --> 00:32:20,840 Speaker 1: Marco Rubio looks really uncomfortable, and it's like, man, this 596 00:32:20,920 --> 00:32:23,720 Speaker 1: is about to get really tough. And it did get tough. 597 00:32:25,200 --> 00:32:27,280 Speaker 1: Is that water under the bridge? Because he was still 598 00:32:27,480 --> 00:32:32,040 Speaker 1: a candidate tim Uh in a certain sense, yes, I mean, 599 00:32:32,280 --> 00:32:35,600 Speaker 1: you know, she our politics are fluid, right and if 600 00:32:35,680 --> 00:32:39,120 Speaker 1: if he is running for vice president, she she was 601 00:32:39,240 --> 00:32:43,280 Speaker 1: part of, uh, you know, the Trump administration. So Trump 602 00:32:43,280 --> 00:32:45,640 Speaker 1: has shown that if people come back and grovel to 603 00:32:45,760 --> 00:32:49,280 Speaker 1: him that that he will, you know, potentially throw them 604 00:32:49,400 --> 00:32:52,040 Speaker 1: a bone. But you know, the story that she has 605 00:32:52,080 --> 00:32:54,800 Speaker 1: to tell. She she may have one in the Republican primire. 606 00:32:54,800 --> 00:32:59,360 Speaker 1: But I just think the lane of not Trump is 607 00:33:00,080 --> 00:33:03,280 Speaker 1: very small and it has shrunk, and the message that 608 00:33:03,360 --> 00:33:07,320 Speaker 1: you're hearing from her there in I don't even know 609 00:33:07,360 --> 00:33:10,280 Speaker 1: that we're going to really hear that from a viable candidate. 610 00:33:10,480 --> 00:33:14,480 Speaker 1: In I I believe that someone has to stand up 611 00:33:14,520 --> 00:33:16,200 Speaker 1: the Trump in the primary. But I do think the 612 00:33:16,280 --> 00:33:18,440 Speaker 1: cast of characters that you're gonna get are going to 613 00:33:18,520 --> 00:33:21,320 Speaker 1: be pretty lame and weak in terms of drawing contrast 614 00:33:21,400 --> 00:33:24,640 Speaker 1: with the president. It's it's to be seen. Um. But 615 00:33:25,280 --> 00:33:28,840 Speaker 1: you know she's She's said before she was running that 616 00:33:28,920 --> 00:33:32,600 Speaker 1: she was going to support Trump, will not run if 617 00:33:32,600 --> 00:33:35,120 Speaker 1: he runs. Now she's running, I don't know what she's 618 00:33:35,160 --> 00:33:36,640 Speaker 1: I don't know what the planet is, to be honest, 619 00:33:36,840 --> 00:33:40,320 Speaker 1: and the thin Boyd, the first debate is less than 620 00:33:40,480 --> 00:33:43,200 Speaker 1: six months away. If I have this right, six months 621 00:33:43,200 --> 00:33:46,400 Speaker 1: away in Milwaukee, how big is this field going to be, 622 00:33:46,640 --> 00:33:49,479 Speaker 1: Boyd Matheson, I think it's gonna be I don't think 623 00:33:49,520 --> 00:33:51,280 Speaker 1: it's gonna be huge. I think there's a lot of 624 00:33:51,280 --> 00:33:52,880 Speaker 1: folks who are going to look at it and figure 625 00:33:52,920 --> 00:33:55,200 Speaker 1: that there's there's just about a clear path there and 626 00:33:55,240 --> 00:33:58,040 Speaker 1: stay on the sidelines. And I do think Nicky Hay 627 00:33:58,040 --> 00:34:01,000 Speaker 1: I was actually in the room that she introduced Marco 628 00:34:01,080 --> 00:34:03,520 Speaker 1: Rubio way back then, and I also thought it was 629 00:34:03,640 --> 00:34:07,120 Speaker 1: very interesting today that she actually alluded back to that. 630 00:34:07,240 --> 00:34:10,399 Speaker 1: She ended by talking about the bully and the fact 631 00:34:10,400 --> 00:34:12,359 Speaker 1: that it's always hurts a little more when you've got 632 00:34:12,440 --> 00:34:15,360 Speaker 1: Spike peels On and kind of took a little shot 633 00:34:15,360 --> 00:34:17,879 Speaker 1: at the former president. So I think the field will 634 00:34:17,920 --> 00:34:20,600 Speaker 1: not be There's a lot of names obviously being floated 635 00:34:20,600 --> 00:34:24,240 Speaker 1: there floated there, including another South Carolinian Senator, Tim Scott, 636 00:34:24,560 --> 00:34:27,520 Speaker 1: which would make the South Carolina early primary for the 637 00:34:27,560 --> 00:34:31,919 Speaker 1: Republicans really interesting. But in terms of getting to there, 638 00:34:31,960 --> 00:34:34,880 Speaker 1: I don't think we're going to see US eighteen like 639 00:34:34,920 --> 00:34:39,520 Speaker 1: we did in or with the Democrats. In the other 640 00:34:39,560 --> 00:34:43,120 Speaker 1: big breaker today in the world of politics brings us 641 00:34:43,160 --> 00:34:47,319 Speaker 1: to California, it was Diane Feinstein. Maybe you guys are 642 00:34:47,320 --> 00:34:49,160 Speaker 1: not surprised because a lot of folks have been waiting 643 00:34:49,200 --> 00:34:52,399 Speaker 1: for this. She's not running for a seventh term. Now 644 00:34:52,440 --> 00:34:56,040 Speaker 1: this opens up a lane to potentially more candidates. But 645 00:34:56,080 --> 00:34:59,040 Speaker 1: we've already got Adam Schiff, We've already got Katie Porter, Tim. 646 00:34:59,040 --> 00:35:00,360 Speaker 1: This is going to be an importan and want to 647 00:35:00,400 --> 00:35:05,880 Speaker 1: watch And I suspect a very expensive race. Yeah, always 648 00:35:05,960 --> 00:35:09,200 Speaker 1: always an expensive race in California. Um. You know the 649 00:35:09,239 --> 00:35:14,560 Speaker 1: center fine sign has had an incredible career in public service. Um. 650 00:35:14,680 --> 00:35:18,120 Speaker 1: She came into the Senate as a reformer and it's 651 00:35:18,160 --> 00:35:20,719 Speaker 1: a big announcement from her today. Obviously like you said, 652 00:35:20,760 --> 00:35:24,680 Speaker 1: we've seen some people who got ahead here in Representative 653 00:35:24,680 --> 00:35:28,359 Speaker 1: Shift and Representative porter. Uh. It is going to be 654 00:35:28,600 --> 00:35:32,640 Speaker 1: a tough primary. It is a expensive place to compete 655 00:35:32,960 --> 00:35:35,520 Speaker 1: um and at the same time, the test of being 656 00:35:35,560 --> 00:35:39,000 Speaker 1: able to raise money is infinitely more important in a 657 00:35:39,080 --> 00:35:42,680 Speaker 1: state like California. So we'll see very early on who's 658 00:35:42,680 --> 00:35:45,200 Speaker 1: able to separate themselves in that pack. And to think 659 00:35:45,239 --> 00:35:47,680 Speaker 1: I didn't have time to bring up Carry Lake, she 660 00:35:47,800 --> 00:35:51,520 Speaker 1: spent two days in Iowa over the weekend. Boyd Matheson 661 00:35:51,640 --> 00:35:53,680 Speaker 1: and Tim Hogan stay right where you are. We're gonna 662 00:35:53,719 --> 00:35:56,399 Speaker 1: have some final thoughts as we go back to where 663 00:35:56,440 --> 00:36:03,279 Speaker 1: we started. The fastest hour in politics. Think balloons and 664 00:36:03,440 --> 00:36:05,920 Speaker 1: something that you won't hear anywhere else. Coming up next 665 00:36:06,960 --> 00:36:10,840 Speaker 1: with our panel, Boyden timp On. Sound On, This is Bloomberg. 666 00:36:13,880 --> 00:36:17,359 Speaker 1: You're listening to the Bloomberg Sound On podcast. Catch us 667 00:36:17,440 --> 00:36:20,400 Speaker 1: live week days at five Eastern on Bloomberg dot Com, 668 00:36:20,440 --> 00:36:22,960 Speaker 1: the I Heart Radio app and the Bloomberg Business Appen. 669 00:36:23,080 --> 00:36:27,719 Speaker 1: We're listening on demand wherever you get your podcast. I 670 00:36:27,760 --> 00:36:30,719 Speaker 1: believe it was Senator Roger Marshall of Kansas who this 671 00:36:30,800 --> 00:36:34,880 Speaker 1: morning said, well, no one's buying balloons this Valentine's Day, 672 00:36:35,280 --> 00:36:38,120 Speaker 1: as he emerged from his classified briefing that, of course, 673 00:36:38,160 --> 00:36:41,360 Speaker 1: in the wake of the China balloon fiasco and everything 674 00:36:41,920 --> 00:36:45,680 Speaker 1: that has followed, the three unidentified flying objects that we 675 00:36:45,760 --> 00:36:50,040 Speaker 1: have shot down since then, we spoke today Bloomberg, by 676 00:36:50,040 --> 00:36:53,000 Speaker 1: the way, and specifically Bloomberg sound On has a vast 677 00:36:53,080 --> 00:36:56,960 Speaker 1: production staff, and we reached out today to Pat Cannon, 678 00:36:57,760 --> 00:37:00,719 Speaker 1: who's the president of the Balloon Federation of an America. Yes, 679 00:37:00,760 --> 00:37:04,160 Speaker 1: of course there's one, a five oh one c three 680 00:37:04,160 --> 00:37:08,279 Speaker 1: nonprofit that rights itself here dedicated to the advancement of 681 00:37:08,320 --> 00:37:12,000 Speaker 1: the sport and science of lighter than air aviation, both 682 00:37:12,080 --> 00:37:18,120 Speaker 1: hot air and gas balloons. Yes, I said gas balloons. 683 00:37:18,239 --> 00:37:22,799 Speaker 1: This is important. Now. They may not be concerned with 684 00:37:22,920 --> 00:37:27,000 Speaker 1: Valentine's Day, but they are concerned with people trying to 685 00:37:27,000 --> 00:37:31,520 Speaker 1: be heroes. That gas balloon, I mentioned, looks a lot 686 00:37:31,600 --> 00:37:35,440 Speaker 1: like the China balloon that we shot down, and Pat 687 00:37:35,480 --> 00:37:39,000 Speaker 1: Cannon's worried that people might try some sort of vigilante 688 00:37:39,000 --> 00:37:42,600 Speaker 1: act here if they see when floating over their property. Listen. So, 689 00:37:42,680 --> 00:37:46,120 Speaker 1: I guess our concern is that that there are people 690 00:37:46,160 --> 00:37:49,160 Speaker 1: out there that would see one of these balloons and well, 691 00:37:49,160 --> 00:37:50,560 Speaker 1: I'm going to save the world, so I'm going to 692 00:37:50,600 --> 00:37:52,839 Speaker 1: shoot down another spine balloon and maybe take a pot 693 00:37:52,880 --> 00:37:56,520 Speaker 1: shot one of these balloons. Um, they only fly at 694 00:37:56,640 --> 00:38:00,479 Speaker 1: probably five ten thousand feet, which would be well within 695 00:38:00,560 --> 00:38:04,600 Speaker 1: the range of of a high projectile or a high 696 00:38:04,800 --> 00:38:10,200 Speaker 1: projectile cartridge from a rifle. And guess what, They're full 697 00:38:10,239 --> 00:38:16,040 Speaker 1: of hydrogen because helium is so expensive. And Pat Cannon 698 00:38:16,080 --> 00:38:18,239 Speaker 1: tells us this is a man of experience, he is 699 00:38:19,480 --> 00:38:23,239 Speaker 1: the balloon maestro. As I read on Facebook, he says, 700 00:38:23,280 --> 00:38:25,799 Speaker 1: this has actually happened before. Here he is again, it 701 00:38:25,880 --> 00:38:28,520 Speaker 1: has happened before. It happened many many years ago in 702 00:38:28,560 --> 00:38:31,319 Speaker 1: Belarus where a gas balloon that was involved in a 703 00:38:31,400 --> 00:38:34,800 Speaker 1: race in Europe was actually shot down by an airplane, 704 00:38:34,960 --> 00:38:37,480 Speaker 1: shot down by an aircraft and killed both the pilot 705 00:38:37,560 --> 00:38:40,520 Speaker 1: and the other the second pilot on board that balloon. 706 00:38:40,920 --> 00:38:44,400 Speaker 1: And that could happen again from some farmer, he says, 707 00:38:44,800 --> 00:38:46,960 Speaker 1: who decides to shoot a gun up, It depends on 708 00:38:47,000 --> 00:38:50,200 Speaker 1: what altitude the balloon is that it would be explosive. 709 00:38:51,960 --> 00:38:54,360 Speaker 1: So final thoughts with our panel here Boyd Matheson and 710 00:38:54,400 --> 00:38:56,799 Speaker 1: Tim Hogan, as we get back to the idea of 711 00:38:56,880 --> 00:39:01,080 Speaker 1: President Biden making an oval office address. Boyd, wouldn't this 712 00:39:01,200 --> 00:39:04,560 Speaker 1: be enough reason? Here, Look, here's what we know. By 713 00:39:04,600 --> 00:39:08,160 Speaker 1: the way, don't take pot shots and any balloons that 714 00:39:08,239 --> 00:39:12,759 Speaker 1: you see. Yeah, no, no no heroes needed. Do not 715 00:39:13,160 --> 00:39:15,560 Speaker 1: do not apply. Do not fire the rivals straight up 716 00:39:15,560 --> 00:39:18,360 Speaker 1: into the air. Whether that one comes from the President 717 00:39:18,440 --> 00:39:20,160 Speaker 1: or somebody else, that one should just be made very 718 00:39:20,160 --> 00:39:22,960 Speaker 1: clear to the public. Let's not be going after our 719 00:39:22,960 --> 00:39:25,960 Speaker 1: hot air balloon enthusiasts. They're they're part of our American 720 00:39:26,200 --> 00:39:29,359 Speaker 1: tapestry as well. Here, here and there. You know there 721 00:39:29,400 --> 00:39:32,879 Speaker 1: are various gas balloons, I guess for various things. Here, Tim, 722 00:39:32,920 --> 00:39:36,080 Speaker 1: maybe it's time for a little education for all Americans, 723 00:39:36,120 --> 00:39:39,719 Speaker 1: because no one seems to know what they're talking about. Look, 724 00:39:39,760 --> 00:39:42,400 Speaker 1: I think there are ways of communicating with the American 725 00:39:42,440 --> 00:39:44,680 Speaker 1: people that are not always just a noble office address. 726 00:39:44,719 --> 00:39:47,200 Speaker 1: I feel like we've really narrowed ourselves into that. The 727 00:39:47,239 --> 00:39:49,000 Speaker 1: mechanism we've got to do it just to get the 728 00:39:49,040 --> 00:39:51,640 Speaker 1: word out not to shoot down our hot air balloon enthusiasts, 729 00:39:51,640 --> 00:39:54,880 Speaker 1: which is something I agree with, But there are ways 730 00:39:54,920 --> 00:39:57,440 Speaker 1: of getting that message out. He's got trusted messenges in 731 00:39:57,440 --> 00:40:00,640 Speaker 1: the military from the Pentagon at the podium talking about this. 732 00:40:00,719 --> 00:40:02,560 Speaker 1: I agree there's there has been a demand in a 733 00:40:02,600 --> 00:40:04,480 Speaker 1: call for more information, and I think it's going to 734 00:40:04,560 --> 00:40:06,960 Speaker 1: come out. I just I'm not sure. And the President 735 00:40:06,960 --> 00:40:08,600 Speaker 1: has to make this decision. Whether it's got to be 736 00:40:08,640 --> 00:40:11,480 Speaker 1: from the Oval, you gotta think, Boyd, they never had 737 00:40:11,520 --> 00:40:14,200 Speaker 1: such a busy week at the Balloon Federation of America. 738 00:40:14,239 --> 00:40:17,440 Speaker 1: The press off is gonna be burning down there. Yeah, 739 00:40:17,480 --> 00:40:21,600 Speaker 1: they are definitely violent for some overtime. They're at the 740 00:40:21,600 --> 00:40:24,600 Speaker 1: Balloon Federation. Who knew? Thank you both for humoring the 741 00:40:24,719 --> 00:40:28,400 Speaker 1: Boyd Mathison and Tim Hogan. Great panel, great discussion. I 742 00:40:28,480 --> 00:40:30,480 Speaker 1: remember as a kid, you'd look up, you'd see that 743 00:40:30,760 --> 00:40:35,480 Speaker 1: lone balloon, the stray balloon flying away that clearly some 744 00:40:35,600 --> 00:40:38,080 Speaker 1: poor child let go or lost. My mother used to 745 00:40:38,120 --> 00:40:42,480 Speaker 1: look up and say, well, some kids crying somewhere. I'm 746 00:40:42,560 --> 00:40:44,480 Speaker 1: Joe Matthew, this is Bloomberg.