WEBVTT - Ep. 329: Render - “Tennessee“ Jones and Lake Pickle 0:00:14.640 --> 0:00:17.200 My name is Clay Nukleman. This is a production of 0:00:17.239 --> 0:00:21.400 the Bear Grease podcast called the Bear Grease Render, where 0:00:21.400 --> 0:00:25.720 we render down, dive deeper, and look behind the scenes 0:00:26.040 --> 0:00:31.280 of the actual bear Grease podcast presented by f HF Gear, 0:00:31.760 --> 0:00:36.520 American Maid, purpose built hunting and fishing gear that's designed 0:00:36.520 --> 0:00:39.280 to be as rugged as the place as we explore. 0:00:45.159 --> 0:00:49.200 So this is this is the offspring. I'm holding a 0:00:49.200 --> 0:00:52.480 about a six week old puppy. This is the offspring 0:00:53.640 --> 0:00:59.400 of a very sought after cross of dogs. This is 0:00:59.480 --> 0:01:05.640 a ten the famous Singing squirrel Dogs pup and O Sage, 0:01:06.000 --> 0:01:10.520 which the Registry of squirrel Dogs. I've been in squirrel 0:01:10.520 --> 0:01:13.319 dogs for a fair number of years. I hadn't had 0:01:13.360 --> 0:01:16.279 squirrel dogs my whole life, but probably for the last 0:01:16.319 --> 0:01:20.399 six seven years. And I still don't completely understand the 0:01:20.440 --> 0:01:25.080 way they register and talk about squirrel dogs because these 0:01:25.160 --> 0:01:30.600 dogs actually could be registered as tree and curves, but 0:01:31.160 --> 0:01:36.280 they're also considered feists because a feist is a category 0:01:36.319 --> 0:01:41.080 of dog. Okay, okay, it's not. It's not a breed. 0:01:41.240 --> 0:01:44.479 It's handled. It's handled as a breed, like you say, 0:01:44.520 --> 0:01:46.560 it's a feist. But there's a lot of different kinds 0:01:46.560 --> 0:01:49.480 of fights. There's mullin phis, there's tree and feist, there's 0:01:49.560 --> 0:01:52.680 mountain feists, and they all look slightly different. But a 0:01:52.760 --> 0:01:56.080 feist is, as I understand that, it is a category 0:01:56.640 --> 0:02:02.040 of dog that's under eighteen inches, under thirty pounds and 0:02:02.160 --> 0:02:03.200 will tree. 0:02:03.560 --> 0:02:05.680 Really like that's the only classification. 0:02:05.840 --> 0:02:09.679 Yeah, So technically, as I understand it, and somebody could 0:02:09.680 --> 0:02:10.920 correct me, and we're gonna. 0:02:10.639 --> 0:02:13.280 Have somebody somebody will yeah, yeah. 0:02:13.160 --> 0:02:15.560 We're gonna have at some point a real good squirrel 0:02:15.600 --> 0:02:18.760 dog man that I know that had a lot to 0:02:18.840 --> 0:02:21.040 do with breeding. These dogs got named Tyler Asberry. At 0:02:21.040 --> 0:02:23.240 some point we're gonna have Tyler on here and he 0:02:23.320 --> 0:02:27.240 can describe it. But but as I understand it, if 0:02:27.280 --> 0:02:29.679 you had a dog that met those qualifications, he could 0:02:29.680 --> 0:02:32.919 be considered a feist. But these I call him tree 0:02:32.919 --> 0:02:33.600 and feists. 0:02:33.960 --> 0:02:38.280 So if that dog were to be registered, it would 0:02:38.280 --> 0:02:39.720 be a feist. 0:02:39.520 --> 0:02:41.920 Or it could be registered as a tree and feist, 0:02:42.040 --> 0:02:46.160 and it could also well, tim and test could have 0:02:46.200 --> 0:02:47.720 been registered as tree in curves. 0:02:48.840 --> 0:02:54.080 But they qualify as is one title more prestigious than 0:02:54.120 --> 0:02:54.400 the other. 0:02:54.520 --> 0:02:54.920 Feist. 0:02:55.440 --> 0:02:59.240 See going off those rules, thought, I got a neighbor 0:02:59.280 --> 0:03:01.920 at home he he's got a fist that looks awful 0:03:01.960 --> 0:03:03.400 lot like a Yorkie. 0:03:04.480 --> 0:03:09.079 Will it tree. Yeah, that's where that's where I kind 0:03:09.080 --> 0:03:12.560 of lose like knowledge of it. But welcome to the 0:03:12.560 --> 0:03:13.400 bear Grease render. 0:03:13.480 --> 0:03:13.720 Yeah. 0:03:13.760 --> 0:03:17.720 I've got a very cute little pup, little brindle pup 0:03:17.720 --> 0:03:22.000 here in my hands. I'm excited about today. I've got 0:03:22.160 --> 0:03:25.760 the one and only Doctor Lake Pickle here from Mississippi, 0:03:25.919 --> 0:03:30.200 straight out of Mississippi. Arkansas's favorite state, the only state 0:03:30.240 --> 0:03:32.359 that we have any right to pick on for any 0:03:32.400 --> 0:03:35.920 statistic you want is Mississippi. Thank you Lake for that. 0:03:36.480 --> 0:03:38.640 Yeah, I've enjoyed my time here and I'm gonna leave now. 0:03:40.920 --> 0:03:45.040 Uh No, you know I love Mississippi. And then we 0:03:45.120 --> 0:03:48.440 have Josh Lambridge, spellmaker here here again learning quite a 0:03:48.440 --> 0:03:50.640 bit more and more about the land Bridge. I'll share 0:03:50.680 --> 0:03:51.800 with you something wonderful. 0:03:51.960 --> 0:03:52.280 Excited. 0:03:52.360 --> 0:03:56.640 But our guest of honored today is my friend, been 0:03:56.680 --> 0:03:59.480 a friend for about a decade or so. We decided 0:04:00.080 --> 0:04:06.240 Tracy Jones from East Tennessee Greenville and uh he's also 0:04:06.320 --> 0:04:07.040 known as t L. 0:04:08.400 --> 0:04:08.840 What do you? 0:04:09.280 --> 0:04:10.720 What do you prefer? People call you? 0:04:12.520 --> 0:04:17.279 It's been a weird thing my whole life. Tracy's on 0:04:17.320 --> 0:04:21.800 the birth certificate that my family just always called me Trace. Trace. Yeah, 0:04:21.920 --> 0:04:25.600 anybody that you know was close, mom, dad, grandparents, it 0:04:25.680 --> 0:04:30.400 was always Trace. Then when I began to pastor and 0:04:30.520 --> 0:04:34.719 put my name on the signs and the brochures, some 0:04:34.760 --> 0:04:37.599 people would get confused and think it was a lady 0:04:37.680 --> 0:04:41.719 pastor in the church, which some people wouldn't like. Yeah, 0:04:41.760 --> 0:04:43.520 some people wouldn't come in the building. 0:04:43.240 --> 0:04:46.560 Because you said you You said, Tracy Jones. 0:04:46.640 --> 0:04:50.640 Yeah, I understand. I went to preach a meeting for 0:04:50.680 --> 0:04:54.600 a pastor who was had brochures printed up and he 0:04:54.600 --> 0:04:57.040 didn't want to use the name Tracy, so he put 0:04:57.080 --> 0:05:03.080 Tennessee Jones about a thin blue hair said he went 0:05:03.120 --> 0:05:05.520 to one house, invited a woman to come hander to 0:05:05.560 --> 0:05:08.040 the brochure said Tennessee Jones, and she said, yeah, I've 0:05:08.040 --> 0:05:11.120 heard of him, Indiana Jones cousin. 0:05:13.360 --> 0:05:16.200 I didn't see Jones. Man, if you'd told me that 0:05:16.320 --> 0:05:18.679 ten years ago, you would have never had another name. 0:05:18.520 --> 0:05:21.200 You'd have a career in country music. Man. So what 0:05:21.720 --> 0:05:24.200 I did is I just started using my initials TL 0:05:24.440 --> 0:05:27.400 for you know, Facebook, social media, and. 0:05:27.600 --> 0:05:28.560 It's like your stagua. 0:05:28.760 --> 0:05:31.479 Yeah, I guess. So, Yeah, it's weird. 0:05:31.520 --> 0:05:35.119 But well, people would know you if they follow along 0:05:35.160 --> 0:05:39.000 on Bear Grease. They might not well they wouldn't know it, 0:05:39.360 --> 0:05:42.720 but so we did. Tracy was a part of a 0:05:42.760 --> 0:05:46.920 series that we did two years ago that started out 0:05:47.080 --> 0:05:52.839 as plot Hounds, but the second the second part of 0:05:52.880 --> 0:05:56.760 the series was essentially about your grandfather and your family 0:05:57.240 --> 0:06:04.279 in Houston Valley plots and so so Tennessee, Tennessee. Jones 0:06:04.839 --> 0:06:09.719 Homes is to me in a in an elite class 0:06:09.800 --> 0:06:16.520 of people that are longtime plot breeders, bear dog breeders 0:06:16.560 --> 0:06:20.240 from East Tennessee for real. Yeah, I mean like you 0:06:20.279 --> 0:06:23.520 guys would have heard me talk about Roy Clark, who's 0:06:23.560 --> 0:06:26.920 in the Hall of Fame burgeras Hall of Fame. And 0:06:27.600 --> 0:06:29.800 I was introduced to the to the kind of the 0:06:30.279 --> 0:06:33.960 plot world of Southern Appalachia, which plots aren't just in 0:06:34.080 --> 0:06:37.280 Southern Appalachia, but the epicenter of the universe for the 0:06:37.320 --> 0:06:39.960 plot hound, which is a it's like being a big 0:06:40.000 --> 0:06:42.640 fish in a very small pond. I'm glad Brent's not 0:06:42.760 --> 0:06:45.880 here to talk about his walkers and everybody in the 0:06:45.920 --> 0:06:49.520 world that has one. Uh, the plot world is very 0:06:49.560 --> 0:06:55.880 small comparatively, and there's these it's it's actually hard to describe, 0:06:56.320 --> 0:07:01.240 but their families over in Appalachia that can you know, 0:07:01.360 --> 0:07:06.039 go back generations of having plot dogs and and Tracy's 0:07:06.080 --> 0:07:08.240 family is one of those. And and to this day 0:07:08.360 --> 0:07:12.440 they have a line of dogs called Houston Valley Plots. 0:07:13.240 --> 0:07:21.800 And Tracy's grandfather father him, and then Tracy's son, Ben Jones, 0:07:22.200 --> 0:07:28.080 young man in his thirties, is is as tough of 0:07:28.200 --> 0:07:31.600 mountain bear hunter as I've ever been around. So anyway, 0:07:32.640 --> 0:07:33.520 Tracy's good friend. 0:07:34.360 --> 0:07:36.480 Yeah, glad to be here, Thank you for the invitation. 0:07:36.880 --> 0:07:40.040 Yeah, And so we're going to end up talking about 0:07:40.480 --> 0:07:43.760 a book that Tracy has written, so that that we'll 0:07:43.760 --> 0:07:46.840 get to that'll kind of bell. We'll get to that later. 0:07:47.600 --> 0:07:55.040 But anyway, I was going to introduce Tracy as as 0:07:55.080 --> 0:07:59.360 the only man more paranoid to me that he is involved, 0:07:59.440 --> 0:08:05.240 unknowingly and in an underground wildlife sting. When I when 0:08:05.280 --> 0:08:11.440 I when I first met Brent Reeves, I honestly in 0:08:11.480 --> 0:08:13.840 the back, deep in the recesses of the back of 0:08:13.880 --> 0:08:18.720 my mind, Brent was just way too available, way too generous, 0:08:19.760 --> 0:08:26.720 way too nice. It's suspicious and way too like, hey, 0:08:26.800 --> 0:08:29.360 I'm done with my I mean, it was like, yeah, 0:08:29.360 --> 0:08:32.319 I used to be a in law enforcement, not anymore, 0:08:33.600 --> 0:08:37.160 and at that time I don't know why, but I 0:08:37.200 --> 0:08:40.480 was like very paranoid for someone who doesn't break the 0:08:40.559 --> 0:08:43.640 law and purpose, which I'd say that to anybody in 0:08:43.679 --> 0:08:46.320 the world. I mean like I have a lifetime record 0:08:46.360 --> 0:08:49.760 of not trying to break the law and purpose. Okay, 0:08:50.160 --> 0:08:53.079 I mean like I've broken the law, but not on purpose. 0:08:53.800 --> 0:08:58.520 And to this day, I'm pretty sure Brent's still working 0:08:58.559 --> 0:09:02.160 on her cover. I'm pretty sure t L probably thought 0:09:02.240 --> 0:09:04.600 I was an undercover agent when I first reached out 0:09:04.640 --> 0:09:05.280 to TM. 0:09:06.880 --> 0:09:11.720 Well. In my defense, now, first of all, I'm a 0:09:11.760 --> 0:09:16.600 stickler about trying to keep the law for obvious reasons, yes, 0:09:17.120 --> 0:09:19.120 but I grew up daring what I would call the 0:09:19.160 --> 0:09:25.679 outlaw error of hunting and Appalachia, and most people who 0:09:25.679 --> 0:09:28.199 would hear this podcast would never be able to come 0:09:28.240 --> 0:09:31.880 to an understanding of that culture where a lot of 0:09:31.880 --> 0:09:35.240 them would have been viewed from the outside of outlaws, 0:09:35.240 --> 0:09:37.920 but they didn't see it that way. That was their home, 0:09:38.840 --> 0:09:42.880 they lived there, they settled the place, and then people 0:09:42.920 --> 0:09:44.640 come in from the outside and all of a sudden 0:09:44.720 --> 0:09:46.560 said no, you're going to go with these rules now, 0:09:47.600 --> 0:09:49.920 and they just didn't see a need for it, right, 0:09:50.760 --> 0:09:53.680 And I'm not justifying it or saying it's right or wrong. 0:09:53.720 --> 0:09:58.199 I'm just saying that there's a perspective of difference of 0:09:58.240 --> 0:10:00.920 having people come in from the outside and all of 0:10:00.960 --> 0:10:02.520 a sudden give you a new set of rules you 0:10:02.600 --> 0:10:05.200 got to go by, and then calling you an outlaw 0:10:05.200 --> 0:10:08.080 if you don't keep it. And it took several decades 0:10:08.080 --> 0:10:13.839 for people to transition. And for the most part, all 0:10:13.960 --> 0:10:16.800 that stuff is a thing in the past. But when 0:10:16.800 --> 0:10:20.840 I was growing up, there was a lot of undercover 0:10:20.960 --> 0:10:23.000 agents that were sent into the area to try to 0:10:23.040 --> 0:10:27.199 find people violating the law. Laws. Yeah, so we were 0:10:27.200 --> 0:10:32.480 taught early. You know. Of course, Appalachia is a suspicious place. 0:10:32.600 --> 0:10:37.240 You know, historians say that Appalachia was actually opened up 0:10:37.320 --> 0:10:40.600 after the West. They say the West was settled before Appalachia. 0:10:40.720 --> 0:10:48.079 Are attained before Appalachia was and so you know, I 0:10:48.160 --> 0:10:51.520 the general rule was everybody you don't know as a 0:10:51.600 --> 0:10:58.680 fed and everybody you do know is a possible informant. Yeah. 0:10:58.800 --> 0:11:02.120 Yeah, how you were how you're taught to operate. 0:11:02.400 --> 0:11:04.880 Just you know, you weren't sat down told that, but 0:11:05.280 --> 0:11:07.520 you understood that to be the way it worked. Yeah, 0:11:07.640 --> 0:11:12.439 and it's I have mixed feelings on a lot of 0:11:12.520 --> 0:11:15.760 the undercover stuff just because of the deception that has 0:11:15.800 --> 0:11:17.360 to be a part of it and the lies, and 0:11:18.360 --> 0:11:20.920 I especially hate the part of it that involves building 0:11:20.960 --> 0:11:25.400 friendships under the guise of something that's eventually going to 0:11:25.640 --> 0:11:30.640 break you. And I'm not here to say it's right 0:11:30.720 --> 0:11:33.600 or wrong. I'm just saying it's there's a there's areas 0:11:33.640 --> 0:11:36.280 there that I think are not as black and white 0:11:36.280 --> 0:11:39.160 as we make them out to be. Yeah, you know, 0:11:39.520 --> 0:11:42.160 I knew, of course. I mean I knew a deal 0:11:42.200 --> 0:11:44.000 where a guy had to come in to do undercover 0:11:44.080 --> 0:11:47.400 work that married a man's daughter. Oh my goodness, and 0:11:47.480 --> 0:11:49.559 I thought that was one of the most horrific things 0:11:49.640 --> 0:11:50.440 I'd ever heard of. 0:11:50.920 --> 0:11:55.160 You and you the story is told as he married 0:11:55.200 --> 0:11:56.760 the girl just to get in. 0:11:57.760 --> 0:12:00.000 I don't know all the details of it that I 0:12:00.040 --> 0:12:03.600 and I certainly wouldn't share him if I did, But uh, 0:12:04.880 --> 0:12:06.920 he came in to try to set a guy up 0:12:07.160 --> 0:12:11.960 to bust him and ended up marrying his daughter and then 0:12:12.080 --> 0:12:17.040 followed through with knelling the guy wow, wow wow. And uh, 0:12:17.440 --> 0:12:19.720 you I could not imagine what you'd feel like as 0:12:19.760 --> 0:12:23.840 a dad knowing your daughter had been yeah, as a wife, 0:12:24.120 --> 0:12:26.440 knowing your family had been used that way. I mean, 0:12:26.679 --> 0:12:31.080 to me, that's far beyond the pale of acceptance no 0:12:31.120 --> 0:12:34.079 matter what you're trying to catch a guy at. Really, Yeah, 0:12:34.200 --> 0:12:38.600 especially in wildlife related things which are serious, but not 0:12:38.720 --> 0:12:41.120 to the degree of seriousness of catching somebody in sect 0:12:41.200 --> 0:12:42.439 trafficking or something like that. 0:12:42.480 --> 0:12:48.719 It's true. Yeah, yeah, wow, Yeah, it's you know, the 0:12:48.800 --> 0:12:52.120 last couple of years, with some of the stories that 0:12:52.160 --> 0:12:56.120 we've told, you know, I've I've interviewed some undercovered people 0:12:56.200 --> 0:12:58.760 and learned more about it, and I think that's the 0:12:58.800 --> 0:13:03.280 conflict that a lot of us have felt, is that, 0:13:04.040 --> 0:13:10.360 you know, especially with Artie Stewart, Ye, that original Secret 0:13:10.360 --> 0:13:13.880 Agent Man series we did back in the nineties in Ohio, 0:13:14.440 --> 0:13:17.559 there were no there were less rules that they were 0:13:17.640 --> 0:13:21.320 some of the first under wildlife undercover agents, and I 0:13:21.320 --> 0:13:23.560 mean they were just kind of like turned loose, you know, 0:13:23.679 --> 0:13:25.359 That's what it felt anyway. 0:13:25.679 --> 0:13:25.839 And. 0:13:27.360 --> 0:13:30.760 It it's definitely a catch twenty two. But yeah, back 0:13:30.800 --> 0:13:34.080 in the day, there was a lot of there were 0:13:34.120 --> 0:13:36.120 a lot of stings, or maybe not a lot, but 0:13:36.160 --> 0:13:39.240 there were There was the bear gallbladder stuff that went 0:13:39.280 --> 0:13:43.000 on over in Appalachia where they decided the bear hunters 0:13:43.040 --> 0:13:46.800 were selling gallbladders and. 0:13:46.120 --> 0:13:48.319 And there were some people who needed to be caught. 0:13:48.559 --> 0:13:51.000 I mean, there were some people, you know, just killing 0:13:51.000 --> 0:13:53.440 the bear for no other reason than to sell a gallbladder. 0:13:53.480 --> 0:13:55.920 And you can't sustain a bear population if you're just 0:13:55.920 --> 0:13:59.800 slaughtering them for sale. So yeah, I mean, my family 0:13:59.880 --> 0:14:02.400 was the law. My grandfather was a constable. My dad 0:14:02.440 --> 0:14:04.480 eventually was the sheriff of our county. So I'm not 0:14:04.559 --> 0:14:09.560 anti law enforcement, yeah, but I was caught in that 0:14:09.720 --> 0:14:13.040 crux of my family being the law, and I also 0:14:13.160 --> 0:14:16.200 understanding at the same time there was other law you know, 0:14:16.960 --> 0:14:19.920 that would come in and try to set you up. 0:14:19.960 --> 0:14:22.600 I'll give you an example. My grandfather and a group 0:14:22.640 --> 0:14:27.480 of men had a guy come in and made friends 0:14:27.520 --> 0:14:30.680 with them and buy them to think. It was New 0:14:30.720 --> 0:14:34.800 Mexico that they went to. I was already out of 0:14:34.840 --> 0:14:38.880 going away to college when this happened. I think they 0:14:39.000 --> 0:14:42.160 drove all the way to New Mexico to go bear hunting, 0:14:42.200 --> 0:14:44.000 and when they got out there, the guy changed the 0:14:44.040 --> 0:14:46.080 plans on them and said that they couldn't hunt where 0:14:46.080 --> 0:14:49.800 they were going to hunt. But he had an alternative plan. Well, 0:14:49.800 --> 0:14:53.920 the all turned to plan was entirely illegal. My grandfather 0:14:54.160 --> 0:14:57.040 was a pretty wise fella. He said, well, we've been 0:14:57.080 --> 0:15:00.720 set up, let's go home in ever return the dog loose. 0:15:02.000 --> 0:15:04.280 So they turned around in New Mexico and drove all 0:15:04.280 --> 0:15:07.360 the way back to Tennessee, m And to me, that's 0:15:07.400 --> 0:15:11.120 the kind of thing that's that's unacceptable. You know, those 0:15:11.120 --> 0:15:13.280 guys were not sitting in Tennessee thinking let's go to 0:15:13.280 --> 0:15:16.880 New Mexico and violate the law, right, but somebody comes 0:15:16.920 --> 0:15:19.440 and invites them to go out to get them to. 0:15:20.960 --> 0:15:23.720 And do you think this guy was working under cover 0:15:23.840 --> 0:15:24.320 for sure? 0:15:24.640 --> 0:15:28.400 Wow? Yeah, so like an entrapment scenario. Yeah, that was 0:15:28.440 --> 0:15:32.080 absolutely entrapment. But the problem with entrapment is that people 0:15:32.120 --> 0:15:34.160 who get to decide whether it's entrapment or not are 0:15:34.200 --> 0:15:35.840 the same people who get decided to do it to 0:15:35.840 --> 0:15:36.240 begin with. 0:15:37.080 --> 0:15:40.200 Yeah, yeah, yeah, yeah, yeah. 0:15:40.640 --> 0:15:44.000 You know, good luck and court, Yeah exactly. Yeah. 0:15:44.200 --> 0:15:47.680 You know, Tracy, you talked about that that area. I 0:15:47.720 --> 0:15:50.320 got to go with Clay over there. Gosh, it's probably 0:15:50.360 --> 0:15:53.920 been almost probably nine months ago, and it is a 0:15:53.960 --> 0:15:58.440 mysterious feeling country. I mean, you're driving down those curvy roads, 0:15:58.440 --> 0:16:00.600 you got all that cudsh growing up on the side, 0:16:00.600 --> 0:16:03.640 and it feels like you're almost entering another world. 0:16:03.720 --> 0:16:03.920 You know. 0:16:03.960 --> 0:16:07.960 It's like like, yeah, it's it's it's pretty pretty unique place. 0:16:08.400 --> 0:16:14.280 Yeah. Well, the the it was so neat doing the 0:16:14.320 --> 0:16:18.480 story on on Teal's grandfather, who was this plot man. 0:16:19.000 --> 0:16:22.920 I'll tell you what I remember that just stands It 0:16:23.000 --> 0:16:27.160 kind of stands out. I don't know why, but when 0:16:27.200 --> 0:16:33.040 you described the daily routine of Barry Tarleton, I'll never 0:16:33.120 --> 0:16:36.560 forget that. Yeah, if that were in a book, in 0:16:36.600 --> 0:16:39.800 the way you described it, if that were in a book, 0:16:39.840 --> 0:16:43.080 that's what people would remember because it painted a picture 0:16:43.840 --> 0:16:50.440 of that generation of people so powerfully. And and basically, 0:16:51.720 --> 0:16:55.400 you know, he talked about his grandfather worked at a 0:16:56.280 --> 0:17:00.520 pet milk plant I mean basically in an industrial I 0:17:00.560 --> 0:17:04.200 mean a big plant. Yeah, And basically he described his 0:17:04.320 --> 0:17:09.000 daily routine and how he he his wife did stuff 0:17:09.000 --> 0:17:11.439 for him and anyway it was unique. 0:17:13.680 --> 0:17:16.159 She would like set his breakfast out at night. I 0:17:16.160 --> 0:17:19.919 remember like that that was such a great such a 0:17:19.960 --> 0:17:22.399 great picture of what their relationship was. 0:17:22.440 --> 0:17:22.520 Like. 0:17:22.560 --> 0:17:23.480 I loved that story. 0:17:23.600 --> 0:17:26.240 Well, without drawing it out too long, I mean I 0:17:26.280 --> 0:17:28.119 could rehearse it. 0:17:28.359 --> 0:17:30.800 Let's do it. I was, I. 0:17:30.800 --> 0:17:34.720 Was was, Yeah, she was. She was a stay at 0:17:34.760 --> 0:17:38.560 home wife and wanted to be and he wanted her 0:17:38.600 --> 0:17:42.240 to be at home. And he would leave for work 0:17:42.280 --> 0:17:44.400 in the mornings around four o'clock or so, I think 0:17:44.400 --> 0:17:46.399 he had to be at work, like around four thirty, 0:17:47.280 --> 0:17:51.119 and he would get off around two. And when he 0:17:51.160 --> 0:17:54.640 would come home, you could hear him coming down the road. 0:17:54.640 --> 0:17:57.119 He had great, big what they called co op Gripsburg 0:17:57.200 --> 0:17:59.840 mud tires on his truck, one one one one, one 0:17:59.840 --> 0:18:01.960 on one, and the dogs could hear him, you know, 0:18:02.080 --> 0:18:04.800 for half a mile, and they'd go crazy. Well that 0:18:04.920 --> 0:18:07.520 was mama's sound, you know. She knew he was coming 0:18:07.560 --> 0:18:11.400 then when the dogs wild. So when he pulled the driveway, 0:18:11.800 --> 0:18:14.320 he'd go up into his apple orchard where his dogs 0:18:14.320 --> 0:18:17.600 were and begin to feed them. She would have supper 0:18:17.640 --> 0:18:20.320 already cooked and she'd set it on the table for him, 0:18:20.800 --> 0:18:24.159 and he'd come in from feeding, sit down at the table, 0:18:25.840 --> 0:18:29.439 begin to eat his supper. She would grow dry his 0:18:29.520 --> 0:18:33.119 bath water. When he got up from the supper table, 0:18:33.160 --> 0:18:35.960 he'd go get in the bath and clean up. While 0:18:36.000 --> 0:18:38.199 he was doing that, she'd get his pajamas and his 0:18:38.280 --> 0:18:43.160 underclothes and everything and bring them to him. He come 0:18:43.200 --> 0:18:45.560 out there, he'd go sit in his chair. He washed 0:18:45.600 --> 0:18:51.520 the news religiously. He was a news fanatic. In fact 0:18:51.560 --> 0:18:53.920 that the only spanking he ever gave him my whole 0:18:53.920 --> 0:19:00.919 life was for interrupting the news. He wanted to know 0:19:01.000 --> 0:19:04.000 what was going on in the world. And while he 0:19:04.080 --> 0:19:06.120 was watching the news, she'd go turn his bed down, 0:19:07.760 --> 0:19:10.119 his covers down for him. 0:19:09.840 --> 0:19:12.080 Like unfold the covers so that he. 0:19:12.000 --> 0:19:16.200 Could just like, yes, I told the covers. And when 0:19:16.240 --> 0:19:18.520 the news was over, he went to bed about eight 0:19:18.520 --> 0:19:22.040 to eight thirty to the latest. And when after he 0:19:22.119 --> 0:19:24.840 went to bed, she'd go back to the kitchen and 0:19:24.920 --> 0:19:28.040 she would pour cereal in a bowl, put sugar on it, 0:19:28.119 --> 0:19:30.840 covered up with a luminifol, set on the table. So 0:19:30.880 --> 0:19:32.359 when he got up the next morning, all he had 0:19:32.400 --> 0:19:35.800 to do was poor milk any cereal. And then she 0:19:35.840 --> 0:19:38.159 would pack his lunch box for him for work, in 0:19:38.280 --> 0:19:41.240 an old metal lunch box. She'd put that in the 0:19:41.240 --> 0:19:44.520 refrigerator for him, already packed. So he got up eighty cereal, 0:19:44.560 --> 0:19:46.480 picked his lunch box up and went back to work. 0:19:47.600 --> 0:19:51.000 And she didn't want very much in life. She was 0:19:51.040 --> 0:19:53.800 not a materialistic person. But the one thing she wanted 0:19:53.920 --> 0:19:57.000 was a good car, so he kept her with a 0:19:57.080 --> 0:19:59.879 nice car all the time. She loved great, big, long cars. 0:20:00.080 --> 0:20:04.199 Had a seventy four or four Galaxy five hundred. 0:20:04.320 --> 0:20:05.600 Oh man, that's a big old car. 0:20:05.760 --> 0:20:12.080 Yeah. Drove like a maniac. And you know, my cousin 0:20:12.520 --> 0:20:16.920 races race cars, and he will still tell you that 0:20:17.359 --> 0:20:19.520 one of the only times he was really ever scared 0:20:19.520 --> 0:20:22.880 in the vegles riding with Mammo down the Houston Valley road. 0:20:23.080 --> 0:20:25.920 She'd white knuckle you in that car. It's like crazy. 0:20:26.440 --> 0:20:28.520 She's the only person I know drove so fast. She 0:20:28.600 --> 0:20:29.480 hit a covey of quail. 0:20:33.920 --> 0:20:36.560 You need to put that in here. That's great. This 0:20:36.600 --> 0:20:42.720 will be a great segue into the latest. 0:20:40.480 --> 0:20:43.840 Hite that I was with her. 0:20:45.240 --> 0:20:47.119 That's a really good point. 0:20:47.520 --> 0:20:49.200 Oh I'm going to use that from now. 0:20:49.600 --> 0:20:51.720 Anyone that knows the covey of quill is going to 0:20:51.720 --> 0:20:52.800 go and that's pretty fast. 0:20:54.880 --> 0:20:55.080 Uh. 0:20:55.119 --> 0:20:58.280 You know what, I appreciate it about that story. That 0:20:58.320 --> 0:21:00.760 story could be taken out of context. It was like 0:21:00.800 --> 0:21:05.920 a glorification of like a wife like servant her husband's 0:21:05.920 --> 0:21:08.159 hand and foot. But that was not the point of 0:21:08.200 --> 0:21:08.960 what you said. 0:21:09.520 --> 0:21:12.560 No, if you knew her, you would know that there 0:21:12.680 --> 0:21:15.720 was nothing about her that was you know, the door 0:21:15.800 --> 0:21:18.720 mat mentality that she was being run over. I mean, 0:21:18.760 --> 0:21:22.440 if he got out of hand, she'd light him up. Yeah, yeah, 0:21:22.480 --> 0:21:24.840 And I mean she'd light him up good and let 0:21:24.920 --> 0:21:28.959 him know exactly you know she was. I called her 0:21:29.000 --> 0:21:30.679 a pistol. I mean when I was a little kid, 0:21:30.760 --> 0:21:32.119 I was in the bathtub one day, like in the 0:21:32.160 --> 0:21:34.640 middle of the day. You know, Tarzan was a thing. 0:21:35.040 --> 0:21:37.320 I was in the bathtub in my underwear with a 0:21:37.320 --> 0:21:39.840 plastic knife, playing Tarzan in the bathtub because his only 0:21:39.880 --> 0:21:44.119 place I could have water and little kid, and I 0:21:44.200 --> 0:21:47.919 heard come boom, and of course I want to know 0:21:47.960 --> 0:21:50.080 what happened. Somebody had stopped in front of the house 0:21:50.160 --> 0:21:51.959 to gaucket deer, and she didn't like him parking from 0:21:51.960 --> 0:21:54.920 the house, so she lowered a double barrel twelve gage 0:21:54.960 --> 0:21:57.200 over the roof of their car and set her off 0:21:58.920 --> 0:22:03.560 and sent them on road. And she was she would 0:22:03.640 --> 0:22:06.280 drive the liquor cars to town. After he'd pull them 0:22:06.280 --> 0:22:08.640 over and arrest who was in the liquor car. He'd 0:22:08.680 --> 0:22:11.240 take the criminal to town and put them in jail. She'd 0:22:11.320 --> 0:22:13.560 drive the liquor car on end so they have the evidence. 0:22:14.480 --> 0:22:18.119 So she was it was a relationship that I say this. 0:22:18.600 --> 0:22:23.400 She loved him with all her heart and her care 0:22:23.520 --> 0:22:28.120 for him wasn't subservient, it was love. But his care 0:22:28.200 --> 0:22:31.640 for her was the same way he adored her. 0:22:32.480 --> 0:22:32.880 Yeah. 0:22:32.920 --> 0:22:36.240 So yeah, yeah, yeah, what a great story. 0:22:36.320 --> 0:22:47.240 That's yeah, that's cool. Well, go ahead and tell again. 0:22:47.280 --> 0:22:52.160 This was on an episode two years ago about plot 0:22:52.200 --> 0:22:54.480 hoounds to put it in the show notes of which 0:22:54.520 --> 0:22:58.320 episode it was. You can hear these stories, but tell 0:22:58.400 --> 0:23:01.720 us about when they blew up Barry Tarleton's car. 0:23:02.280 --> 0:23:07.439 Yeah, my mom, Mama and Papa had two daughters. My 0:23:07.560 --> 0:23:11.720 mom is Jane, had a sister named Sandy. Mom I 0:23:11.720 --> 0:23:14.399 think was like two or three, and Sandy was a baby. 0:23:15.760 --> 0:23:18.760 And Papa had made life pretty rough on the Moonshiner's 0:23:18.960 --> 0:23:22.439 because they had He had two brothers killed in relation 0:23:22.560 --> 0:23:25.720 to liquor. One brother had his head blowed off with 0:23:25.760 --> 0:23:29.120 a shotgun and his other brother had his throat cut 0:23:29.160 --> 0:23:31.760 and left him for left him dead in a creek 0:23:31.840 --> 0:23:36.960