1 00:00:03,840 --> 00:00:06,680 Speaker 1: I am very very pleased this afternoon on the warning 2 00:00:06,800 --> 00:00:11,039 Speaker 1: to be joined by Virginia congresswoman from the seventh district 3 00:00:11,080 --> 00:00:15,160 Speaker 1: in her third term, Abigail Spanberger. Welcome, Congresswoman. 4 00:00:15,440 --> 00:00:16,720 Speaker 2: Thank you so much for having me. 5 00:00:17,320 --> 00:00:20,959 Speaker 1: So I'm really excited to have you on today for 6 00:00:21,040 --> 00:00:24,520 Speaker 1: a lot of different reasons, but the first is this. 7 00:00:25,239 --> 00:00:30,040 Speaker 1: It's simply not true that every member of Congress is 8 00:00:30,040 --> 00:00:34,520 Speaker 1: a ne'er do well, is a crook, is somebody who 9 00:00:35,280 --> 00:00:39,400 Speaker 1: on any given day should be institutionalized. There are some 10 00:00:39,760 --> 00:00:47,080 Speaker 1: exceptional people, people of judgment, people of intellect, people of character, 11 00:00:47,840 --> 00:00:53,400 Speaker 1: who are patriots, who you want in positions of responsibility 12 00:00:54,800 --> 00:00:59,080 Speaker 1: for the nation's future, for its security in the present 13 00:00:59,680 --> 00:01:02,720 Speaker 1: and looking down the road fifty years from now. And 14 00:01:02,880 --> 00:01:06,040 Speaker 1: this is one of those one of those people. So 15 00:01:06,120 --> 00:01:09,000 Speaker 1: I am really thrilled to have her with us today 16 00:01:09,040 --> 00:01:13,479 Speaker 1: to talk about the future of the country and this 17 00:01:13,600 --> 00:01:17,280 Speaker 1: moment in politics. So I'm really thrilled to have you. 18 00:01:18,160 --> 00:01:24,160 Speaker 2: Thank you for the kind words, thank you, And yeah, 19 00:01:24,480 --> 00:01:27,520 Speaker 2: I'm proud to serve and proud to be considered among 20 00:01:27,560 --> 00:01:29,039 Speaker 2: those who are not ne'ir do wills. 21 00:01:31,280 --> 00:01:35,080 Speaker 1: So I think that history can teach us a lot. 22 00:01:36,280 --> 00:01:40,760 Speaker 1: We can look back at its lessons, it tends to 23 00:01:40,800 --> 00:01:46,360 Speaker 1: repeat itself, or at least as an imitation. But the 24 00:01:46,400 --> 00:01:50,120 Speaker 1: one thing we can't know from history is we can't 25 00:01:50,160 --> 00:01:54,680 Speaker 1: know what it felt like in the moment the tension 26 00:01:55,480 --> 00:02:00,520 Speaker 1: when Franklin Roosevelt was facing off against Charles Lindberg nineteen 27 00:02:00,680 --> 00:02:04,880 Speaker 1: forty and the len Weise Act passed by a handful 28 00:02:05,000 --> 00:02:10,079 Speaker 1: of votes, or when the Draft was maintained in nineteen 29 00:02:10,280 --> 00:02:13,800 Speaker 1: forty by a single vote, And you think about the 30 00:02:13,840 --> 00:02:19,320 Speaker 1: implications if the US Army had not begun the draft 31 00:02:19,400 --> 00:02:24,040 Speaker 1: when it did before Pearl Harbor, and the catastrophic results 32 00:02:24,040 --> 00:02:28,080 Speaker 1: would have followed. So understanding the stakes in those moments, 33 00:02:28,120 --> 00:02:32,280 Speaker 1: whether it's eighteen sixty three and the draft riots, what 34 00:02:32,440 --> 00:02:36,040 Speaker 1: does it feel like to be a member of Congress 35 00:02:36,840 --> 00:02:39,639 Speaker 1: right now? And how worried are you? 36 00:02:41,639 --> 00:02:48,520 Speaker 2: Oh, this is a very interesting question. It feels What 37 00:02:48,560 --> 00:02:54,280 Speaker 2: does it feel like? There are days when it feels 38 00:02:54,480 --> 00:03:00,960 Speaker 2: disorienting and like I'm trying to maintain touch with reality. 39 00:03:01,040 --> 00:03:06,200 Speaker 2: There are days when it's exasperating. There are days when 40 00:03:06,560 --> 00:03:09,200 Speaker 2: you know, you kind of have those moments looking around 41 00:03:09,880 --> 00:03:11,880 Speaker 2: and hear some of the things that some of my 42 00:03:11,960 --> 00:03:13,920 Speaker 2: colleagues on the other side of the aisle say and 43 00:03:13,960 --> 00:03:20,760 Speaker 2: think like, you can't possibly be serious. And I think 44 00:03:20,840 --> 00:03:25,520 Speaker 2: that really in terms of, you know, my commitment to 45 00:03:25,600 --> 00:03:28,200 Speaker 2: service at this time is that there has to be 46 00:03:28,240 --> 00:03:32,160 Speaker 2: studying forces. You know, there are people who want to 47 00:03:32,440 --> 00:03:35,440 Speaker 2: dizzy us with the things that they say. And I 48 00:03:36,040 --> 00:03:37,920 Speaker 2: remember actually a piece of advice I got when I 49 00:03:37,920 --> 00:03:42,880 Speaker 2: first started running for Congress and I ran against, you know, 50 00:03:42,920 --> 00:03:45,160 Speaker 2: a guy who came in the Tea Party wave. It 51 00:03:45,200 --> 00:03:47,600 Speaker 2: was the seat that previously had been held by Eric Cantor, 52 00:03:48,040 --> 00:03:51,080 Speaker 2: then majority leader. He had a primary from the right 53 00:03:51,120 --> 00:03:53,680 Speaker 2: as part of that Tea Party wave and he was 54 00:03:53,720 --> 00:03:55,920 Speaker 2: ousted in the primary. And so then I ran against 55 00:03:56,000 --> 00:03:59,320 Speaker 2: in twenty eighteen Dave Bratt, who had unseated Cantor, and 56 00:03:59,360 --> 00:04:02,800 Speaker 2: I had someone tell me, you know, when you're dealing 57 00:04:03,080 --> 00:04:07,520 Speaker 2: with him, like, don't don't follow the shiny And at 58 00:04:07,520 --> 00:04:09,200 Speaker 2: first I thought it was a kind of a strange 59 00:04:09,240 --> 00:04:12,520 Speaker 2: turn of phrase, and you know, he further explained it. 60 00:04:12,560 --> 00:04:16,159 Speaker 2: He said, he will say things that you want to 61 00:04:16,320 --> 00:04:19,600 Speaker 2: kind of follow those rabbit holes because they are at 62 00:04:19,680 --> 00:04:25,280 Speaker 2: times just so outrageous or so kind of disconnected from 63 00:04:25,320 --> 00:04:29,680 Speaker 2: the reality of governance, Like don't follow the shiny all 64 00:04:29,720 --> 00:04:33,520 Speaker 2: the places, because you'll become unsteady, and it'll you never 65 00:04:33,600 --> 00:04:36,400 Speaker 2: know what you're sort of kind of going against, or 66 00:04:36,400 --> 00:04:39,560 Speaker 2: you only are going against something. You're not providing that steadiness. 67 00:04:40,080 --> 00:04:43,080 Speaker 2: And I think about that because I think the individual 68 00:04:43,080 --> 00:04:45,720 Speaker 2: who gave me that advice could have never imagined how 69 00:04:45,760 --> 00:04:49,560 Speaker 2: important it would be on Capitol Hill, because sometimes you'll hear, 70 00:04:49,760 --> 00:04:52,920 Speaker 2: you know, particularly the people who say unbelievably ridiculous things, 71 00:04:53,279 --> 00:04:56,039 Speaker 2: you know Marjorie Taylor Green or Lauren Bobert or you know, 72 00:04:56,080 --> 00:04:59,160 Speaker 2: Bob Good from Virginia, a whole host of people who 73 00:04:59,200 --> 00:05:06,760 Speaker 2: say unbelievably outrageous things that feel disconnected from the Constitution, 74 00:05:06,960 --> 00:05:11,039 Speaker 2: disconnected from American values, disconnected from the responsibility of governance. 75 00:05:11,920 --> 00:05:15,080 Speaker 2: And you have to continue to you almost stay steady 76 00:05:15,240 --> 00:05:20,200 Speaker 2: and like back back these ideas without just you know, 77 00:05:20,320 --> 00:05:23,880 Speaker 2: following them in these places where you become disoriented from reality. 78 00:05:23,920 --> 00:05:26,520 Speaker 2: And I think that, you know, there's this effort afoot 79 00:05:26,560 --> 00:05:30,359 Speaker 2: to try and dizzy the American people. Sometimes it certainly 80 00:05:30,400 --> 00:05:32,919 Speaker 2: feels that way with Trump. You know, the more he 81 00:05:33,040 --> 00:05:38,719 Speaker 2: says in sandiary ridiculous things, the more dizzying it becomes. 82 00:05:38,839 --> 00:05:44,479 Speaker 2: And so I think at times it feels dizzying to 83 00:05:44,560 --> 00:05:47,039 Speaker 2: be in the halls of Congress and or on the 84 00:05:47,080 --> 00:05:50,240 Speaker 2: floor and listening to some of the debate, But it 85 00:05:50,279 --> 00:05:52,960 Speaker 2: also feels like a really important time to just stay 86 00:05:53,480 --> 00:06:01,400 Speaker 2: really steady, kind of and grounded and and heavy with 87 00:06:01,960 --> 00:06:04,440 Speaker 2: the responsibility of the work that we're supposed to be doing, 88 00:06:05,160 --> 00:06:09,240 Speaker 2: and with the responsibility of what governance should be. And 89 00:06:09,240 --> 00:06:10,640 Speaker 2: I'm going to be thinking about that question a lot 90 00:06:10,680 --> 00:06:11,680 Speaker 2: longer for us. 91 00:06:11,880 --> 00:06:14,320 Speaker 1: One of the one of the things that's interesting about you. 92 00:06:14,320 --> 00:06:17,000 Speaker 1: You spent you spent eight years, i believe, as a 93 00:06:17,120 --> 00:06:25,200 Speaker 1: CIA officer, and that's the business of assessing information intelligence, 94 00:06:25,960 --> 00:06:31,000 Speaker 1: trying to find out things. It's very rare that you 95 00:06:31,120 --> 00:06:37,280 Speaker 1: find the user's manual rights. It's an interpretive business. If 96 00:06:37,320 --> 00:06:40,960 Speaker 1: you go and you look at this from a cinema perspective, 97 00:06:41,120 --> 00:06:45,920 Speaker 1: there's the room where before the bin laden raid, James 98 00:06:45,960 --> 00:06:49,200 Speaker 1: Gandolfini is playing Leon Panetta, and he goes around the 99 00:06:49,279 --> 00:06:52,960 Speaker 1: room and he asks everybody in the room what percentage 100 00:06:53,400 --> 00:06:54,720 Speaker 1: chance do you think he's there? 101 00:06:54,839 --> 00:06:55,000 Speaker 2: Right? 102 00:06:55,040 --> 00:06:57,760 Speaker 1: And it ranges from fifty to sixty, and you know 103 00:06:57,800 --> 00:07:02,120 Speaker 1: it's all arbitrary. And so when you look at Trump 104 00:07:02,560 --> 00:07:06,840 Speaker 1: and you look at the extremeist movement in the country. 105 00:07:07,160 --> 00:07:09,360 Speaker 1: One of the things that I've always done, going back 106 00:07:09,440 --> 00:07:14,360 Speaker 1: seven years, I've taken everything that he says both literally 107 00:07:14,880 --> 00:07:18,600 Speaker 1: and seriously, and I tend to do that with all people. 108 00:07:19,160 --> 00:07:23,000 Speaker 1: If you say it, I interpret you as meaning it. 109 00:07:23,440 --> 00:07:27,680 Speaker 1: So if Elon Musk says that sixty percent of his 110 00:07:27,840 --> 00:07:32,520 Speaker 1: revenue has incinerated and it's because of the Jews, I 111 00:07:32,600 --> 00:07:37,240 Speaker 1: take him literally. When I hear Mike Huckabee say this 112 00:07:37,440 --> 00:07:43,120 Speaker 1: is the last election without bullets. If Trump is disqualified 113 00:07:43,160 --> 00:07:47,600 Speaker 1: from running, or if Trump loses the election, I take 114 00:07:47,720 --> 00:07:54,520 Speaker 1: him seriously. When you hear the calls to violence, intimations 115 00:07:54,880 --> 00:07:59,240 Speaker 1: to violence in our politics from a member of Congress, 116 00:08:00,080 --> 00:08:03,800 Speaker 1: I'm a former governor like Huckabee. Is this something that 117 00:08:03,840 --> 00:08:07,160 Speaker 1: you're dialed into, that you hear that you're attuned to. 118 00:08:07,880 --> 00:08:11,520 Speaker 1: Is it passing over you just part of the noise 119 00:08:11,640 --> 00:08:14,720 Speaker 1: of the moment, or do you take it seriously? Do 120 00:08:14,760 --> 00:08:18,520 Speaker 1: you assess it as seriously? Do you think we could 121 00:08:18,600 --> 00:08:23,120 Speaker 1: be on the edge of an era of political violence 122 00:08:23,600 --> 00:08:29,200 Speaker 1: that's being prefaced by the rhetoric, Because certainly it's the 123 00:08:29,280 --> 00:08:34,360 Speaker 1: case that the actions that followed the previous burst of rhetoric, 124 00:08:34,400 --> 00:08:36,959 Speaker 1: which moved the line, which is hey, and we had 125 00:08:36,960 --> 00:08:39,480 Speaker 1: a long warning for it. I'm not going to concede 126 00:08:39,520 --> 00:08:41,719 Speaker 1: the results of the election if I lose. It's only 127 00:08:41,720 --> 00:08:44,720 Speaker 1: a legitimate election if I win. And my view has 128 00:08:44,760 --> 00:08:48,600 Speaker 1: always been as an intelligence matter that should have struck 129 00:08:48,640 --> 00:08:52,880 Speaker 1: a five alarm for this entire country back in twenty 130 00:08:53,120 --> 00:08:55,840 Speaker 1: fifteen when he said it. So I'm just curious, as 131 00:08:55,840 --> 00:09:00,440 Speaker 1: a former intelligence officer, how you process through all the 132 00:09:00,520 --> 00:09:05,040 Speaker 1: noise the stuff that really matters is dangerous, and how 133 00:09:05,040 --> 00:09:06,080 Speaker 1: do you think about it? 134 00:09:06,760 --> 00:09:10,640 Speaker 2: Well, I think I perceive it the same way that 135 00:09:10,679 --> 00:09:13,600 Speaker 2: you do, which is, if you don't mean it, why 136 00:09:13,640 --> 00:09:16,720 Speaker 2: would someone say it if you don't think there's a 137 00:09:16,800 --> 00:09:19,640 Speaker 2: hint of truth, even just a hint of truth and 138 00:09:19,760 --> 00:09:23,240 Speaker 2: something that someone is saying, right, be it former Governor 139 00:09:23,320 --> 00:09:29,560 Speaker 2: Huckebee's comments or you know, any intimations however overt or 140 00:09:30,679 --> 00:09:37,720 Speaker 2: kind of more cute, if I could actually use that 141 00:09:37,760 --> 00:09:40,440 Speaker 2: word that you know, people in Trump's circle were trying 142 00:09:40,480 --> 00:09:41,960 Speaker 2: to say, like, of course he's going to win, and 143 00:09:41,960 --> 00:09:43,800 Speaker 2: if he doesn't, there was something wrong, Like even if 144 00:09:43,840 --> 00:09:47,360 Speaker 2: they're being a little jokey with it, like that is 145 00:09:47,440 --> 00:09:51,840 Speaker 2: not something that you hear from people who are serious 146 00:09:51,880 --> 00:09:54,760 Speaker 2: about governance, right, you will never hear people who are 147 00:09:54,760 --> 00:09:57,760 Speaker 2: serious about governance joke about, well, you know, now we 148 00:09:57,840 --> 00:10:01,680 Speaker 2: might have violence. You never know, like it's actually a 149 00:10:01,679 --> 00:10:05,840 Speaker 2: pretty grotesque thing, even if you're just joking to joke about. 150 00:10:06,160 --> 00:10:09,079 Speaker 2: And so there has to be some level of seriousness. 151 00:10:10,040 --> 00:10:14,440 Speaker 2: And importantly, because even if the person saying it says, oh, 152 00:10:14,480 --> 00:10:16,440 Speaker 2: but I was joking or I didn't really mean it, 153 00:10:16,520 --> 00:10:20,920 Speaker 2: or I was being hyperbolic, somebody somewhere is hearing them, 154 00:10:21,320 --> 00:10:24,839 Speaker 2: and somebody somewhere is taking it literally. And so there 155 00:10:24,920 --> 00:10:28,760 Speaker 2: is a tremendous responsibility for any legislator or person with 156 00:10:28,800 --> 00:10:32,160 Speaker 2: an elevated voice because of elected office or you know, 157 00:10:32,200 --> 00:10:35,600 Speaker 2: because they own a gazillion dollar company, like any person 158 00:10:35,720 --> 00:10:38,280 Speaker 2: with some level of an elevated voice that people listen 159 00:10:38,360 --> 00:10:42,440 Speaker 2: to have a responsibility to be pretty clear with their language, 160 00:10:42,800 --> 00:10:47,080 Speaker 2: particularly if they're talking about issues or topics related to 161 00:10:47,520 --> 00:10:51,920 Speaker 2: or that could be perceived as inciting violence, spreading hate, 162 00:10:52,240 --> 00:10:56,680 Speaker 2: dividing communities, or impugning you know, whole groups of people 163 00:10:56,720 --> 00:10:59,640 Speaker 2: that could lead to those sorts of things. And so, 164 00:11:00,040 --> 00:11:03,440 Speaker 2: you know, I even if I don't think that someone 165 00:11:03,559 --> 00:11:08,680 Speaker 2: means it literally, it doesn't matter because somebody somewhere likely does. 166 00:11:09,280 --> 00:11:11,560 Speaker 2: And it's not a question of what you say or 167 00:11:11,600 --> 00:11:14,360 Speaker 2: what you mean, it's a question of how people perceive 168 00:11:14,440 --> 00:11:19,600 Speaker 2: your comments. And you know, there's examples along the way 169 00:11:19,640 --> 00:11:22,599 Speaker 2: where you know, I have long been in the in 170 00:11:23,000 --> 00:11:26,440 Speaker 2: the bucket of advocating for people to be really clear 171 00:11:26,520 --> 00:11:29,360 Speaker 2: with what their language does or doesn't mean. And in 172 00:11:29,400 --> 00:11:31,800 Speaker 2: some cases it's because you can make people misunderstand your 173 00:11:31,840 --> 00:11:34,800 Speaker 2: policy stances. And in some cases it means you can 174 00:11:34,880 --> 00:11:39,560 Speaker 2: actually be aggressively inciting violence or creating a foundation where 175 00:11:39,640 --> 00:11:44,480 Speaker 2: violence is expected or you know, presumed, just by the 176 00:11:44,559 --> 00:11:47,120 Speaker 2: virtue of what you say, how you say it, and 177 00:11:47,200 --> 00:11:48,440 Speaker 2: importantly what people hear. 178 00:11:49,800 --> 00:11:51,480 Speaker 1: Well. One of the questions I wanted to ask you 179 00:11:51,520 --> 00:11:54,480 Speaker 1: when you came into Congress in twenty eighteen, you were 180 00:11:54,520 --> 00:11:58,680 Speaker 1: in a group that got a lot of attention of 181 00:11:58,880 --> 00:12:04,160 Speaker 1: women candidate than who became members, who all worked in 182 00:12:05,040 --> 00:12:09,760 Speaker 1: national security business, UH, military officer, C I, A FBI, 183 00:12:10,320 --> 00:12:14,440 Speaker 1: whole gamut. You represent the seventh District of Virginia. Do 184 00:12:14,480 --> 00:12:16,400 Speaker 1: you still have Quantico in your in. 185 00:12:16,360 --> 00:12:19,679 Speaker 2: Your I do? I proudly represent Quantico, UH and a 186 00:12:20,160 --> 00:12:25,160 Speaker 2: number of other military installations, but a ton of military veterans. Uh, 187 00:12:25,360 --> 00:12:28,000 Speaker 2: and certainly lots of active duty service members. 188 00:12:28,080 --> 00:12:33,800 Speaker 1: Okay, So the Marine Corps, of course is based in 189 00:12:33,800 --> 00:12:39,120 Speaker 1: in Quantico, the Officer Candidate School. And we have no 190 00:12:39,240 --> 00:12:46,839 Speaker 1: Commandant of the Marine Corps. Yes, we don't have or 191 00:12:46,840 --> 00:12:51,120 Speaker 1: are about not to have a Chief of Naval Operations 192 00:12:51,520 --> 00:12:55,640 Speaker 1: mm hm, we are about not to have an Army 193 00:12:55,720 --> 00:12:56,520 Speaker 1: Chief of Staff. 194 00:12:59,400 --> 00:13:07,240 Speaker 2: I we have more than three hundred positions that are unfilled, 195 00:13:08,880 --> 00:13:13,280 Speaker 2: including the Commandant of the Marine Corps, including leadership roles 196 00:13:13,320 --> 00:13:19,719 Speaker 2: at military installations at home and abroad that are unfilled 197 00:13:20,160 --> 00:13:22,520 Speaker 2: because of one senator, which I know is where you're 198 00:13:22,520 --> 00:13:27,880 Speaker 2: going with this, Steve. It is outrageous, It is shameful, 199 00:13:28,240 --> 00:13:33,720 Speaker 2: It is ridiculous, and there's two pieces to it. One, 200 00:13:34,000 --> 00:13:38,960 Speaker 2: it is impacting our readiness right when mil when service 201 00:13:39,040 --> 00:13:42,679 Speaker 2: secretaries have to write a joint op ed as some 202 00:13:42,720 --> 00:13:46,720 Speaker 2: sort of call to you know, please understand how difficult 203 00:13:46,720 --> 00:13:49,800 Speaker 2: and how bad this is. Like, that's a ridiculous state 204 00:13:49,840 --> 00:13:53,280 Speaker 2: of affairs. Right they should be focused on the job 205 00:13:53,360 --> 00:13:56,120 Speaker 2: that they have at hand, but instead they're having to 206 00:13:56,200 --> 00:13:59,360 Speaker 2: raise the alarm because apparently not enough people are listening 207 00:13:59,600 --> 00:14:01,520 Speaker 2: about what it is the Tubber Bill's doing and the 208 00:14:01,520 --> 00:14:04,120 Speaker 2: detriment to our military readiness. And I could go on 209 00:14:04,240 --> 00:14:06,920 Speaker 2: and on about the detriment to our military readiness. Then 210 00:14:06,960 --> 00:14:09,800 Speaker 2: there's the very real impact on the men and women 211 00:14:09,840 --> 00:14:15,480 Speaker 2: who have sacrificed like in countless ways, everything from you know, 212 00:14:15,640 --> 00:14:19,960 Speaker 2: injury and combat and loss of their you know, their 213 00:14:20,080 --> 00:14:23,160 Speaker 2: brothers and sisters in arms, to miss birthdays and miss 214 00:14:23,240 --> 00:14:28,040 Speaker 2: holidays and time away from loved ones and milestones, not 215 00:14:28,160 --> 00:14:30,000 Speaker 2: just when they're in war zones, but when they're on 216 00:14:30,040 --> 00:14:32,840 Speaker 2: long term TDY or when they're PCs places that they 217 00:14:32,840 --> 00:14:37,360 Speaker 2: can't bring family members. And now we have at this 218 00:14:37,440 --> 00:14:39,240 Speaker 2: point more than three hundred by the end of the year, 219 00:14:39,360 --> 00:14:42,120 Speaker 2: be more than six hundred people who are in limbo. 220 00:14:42,320 --> 00:14:45,680 Speaker 2: Are they going to get that next promotion? They've missed 221 00:14:45,720 --> 00:14:48,640 Speaker 2: PCs season. Anybody with kids in school, you know, kids 222 00:14:48,680 --> 00:14:52,880 Speaker 2: who are presumably on there maybe seventh, tenth, fifteenth move 223 00:14:53,000 --> 00:14:55,720 Speaker 2: throughout their childhood, didn't get to move in the summer. 224 00:14:55,880 --> 00:14:59,880 Speaker 2: Maybe they'll move, maybe they won't. Right, Like, it's unblu 225 00:15:00,080 --> 00:15:06,720 Speaker 2: believable the disdain that Tommy Tuberville is demonstrating for the 226 00:15:07,160 --> 00:15:12,520 Speaker 2: people who give themselves to our military, as well as 227 00:15:12,560 --> 00:15:17,200 Speaker 2: his overall disdain for our national security. And he keeps 228 00:15:17,240 --> 00:15:21,880 Speaker 2: coming back with it's not a threat to national security. Well, literally, 229 00:15:21,920 --> 00:15:25,480 Speaker 2: when service secretaries are writing op eds to make the 230 00:15:25,680 --> 00:15:29,560 Speaker 2: argument about how it is a threat to our national security, 231 00:15:29,960 --> 00:15:32,960 Speaker 2: like believe them? And what the hell does he know? 232 00:15:33,440 --> 00:15:39,800 Speaker 1: Like, ugh, I'll stop, I think so, and then here's 233 00:15:39,840 --> 00:15:43,160 Speaker 1: my question, because it becomes a political question. Right, So 234 00:15:43,360 --> 00:15:47,520 Speaker 1: the NFL season is upon us, right, So the great 235 00:15:48,120 --> 00:15:54,120 Speaker 1: theater of performative patriotism, right is about to begin anew 236 00:15:55,480 --> 00:15:59,960 Speaker 1: we will see the giant one hundred yard flags, wills, 237 00:16:00,080 --> 00:16:07,120 Speaker 1: see military flyovers, and all of it, without regard to 238 00:16:07,160 --> 00:16:12,840 Speaker 1: any of the underpinning ideas of the republic. High sugar jello, right, 239 00:16:13,000 --> 00:16:16,920 Speaker 1: a diet of a diet of pure crapola. And I 240 00:16:16,960 --> 00:16:20,440 Speaker 1: guess it's a political question. And I tend to think 241 00:16:20,480 --> 00:16:23,920 Speaker 1: about these things through the prism of my age, right, 242 00:16:24,080 --> 00:16:28,280 Speaker 1: and between our age group. Right. You know, mid forties, 243 00:16:28,360 --> 00:16:31,440 Speaker 1: early fifties, the people were talking about in the military, right, 244 00:16:32,360 --> 00:16:36,560 Speaker 1: lieutenant colonel, colonel, brigadier general, major general. Let's say you 245 00:16:36,600 --> 00:16:41,160 Speaker 1: have a woman army colonel, right, whose husband has moved 246 00:16:41,240 --> 00:16:46,720 Speaker 1: ten to eleven times, has a job, has some flexibility 247 00:16:46,720 --> 00:16:50,160 Speaker 1: in the job, but that guy has a career that 248 00:16:50,280 --> 00:16:53,440 Speaker 1: might be twenty five years into it that he has 249 00:16:53,520 --> 00:16:56,880 Speaker 1: to move where his wife, the colonel is supposed to 250 00:16:56,920 --> 00:17:00,960 Speaker 1: move to. She's been promoted, she has as an assignment, 251 00:17:01,040 --> 00:17:05,560 Speaker 1: but she can't lawfully engage in the assignment because she's 252 00:17:05,600 --> 00:17:09,080 Speaker 1: above a rank that requires a Senate confirmation. So you've 253 00:17:09,160 --> 00:17:13,560 Speaker 1: created this traffic jam. Have you said that we'll exponentially grow. 254 00:17:13,640 --> 00:17:16,120 Speaker 1: Now it's at three hundred, a couple months from now, 255 00:17:16,160 --> 00:17:19,200 Speaker 1: it'll be at six hundred, and then it'll start to 256 00:17:19,240 --> 00:17:22,520 Speaker 1: demonstrate the miracle of compound interest. Right, We'll go from 257 00:17:22,560 --> 00:17:25,760 Speaker 1: six hundred to twelve hundred, and we will very quickly 258 00:17:25,840 --> 00:17:29,719 Speaker 1: have a force that is not ready to fight and steve. 259 00:17:29,920 --> 00:17:34,120 Speaker 2: What happens to that, you know, forty to forty five 260 00:17:34,200 --> 00:17:39,280 Speaker 2: year old who's hit their twenty right, who can easily 261 00:17:39,320 --> 00:17:43,360 Speaker 2: pivot out, can go frankly, make a lot more money, 262 00:17:43,400 --> 00:17:46,080 Speaker 2: and a lot more money vector can have a lot 263 00:17:46,119 --> 00:17:49,760 Speaker 2: more home life stability in the private sector. You know, 264 00:17:49,800 --> 00:17:51,800 Speaker 2: it's going to be headhunted as soon as they come 265 00:17:51,800 --> 00:17:56,000 Speaker 2: out with their military credentials and their incredible experience of 266 00:17:56,080 --> 00:17:59,320 Speaker 2: leadership and all that you know their resume would would 267 00:17:59,359 --> 00:18:05,520 Speaker 2: contain and yet like, what is the what? What are 268 00:18:05,560 --> 00:18:09,960 Speaker 2: we the United States of America demonstrating as our commitment 269 00:18:10,040 --> 00:18:12,840 Speaker 2: to those who say, you know what, I could leave 270 00:18:13,119 --> 00:18:16,120 Speaker 2: after my full twenty proud of the work that I've done, 271 00:18:16,160 --> 00:18:19,919 Speaker 2: the sacrifices I've made, the service that I have demonstrated, 272 00:18:20,160 --> 00:18:22,919 Speaker 2: and I can go do chapter like my second chapter 273 00:18:23,119 --> 00:18:25,560 Speaker 2: and it'll be great, and I'll take family vacations and 274 00:18:25,600 --> 00:18:28,719 Speaker 2: I'll make a shit ton more money. Right, And now 275 00:18:29,280 --> 00:18:33,960 Speaker 2: those same folks are watching the people who made the 276 00:18:34,000 --> 00:18:37,320 Speaker 2: commitment to stay, or are making the commitment to stay, 277 00:18:37,440 --> 00:18:39,360 Speaker 2: the folks who say, no, I'm going to go out 278 00:18:39,400 --> 00:18:41,320 Speaker 2: and I'm you know, I'm going to aspire to be 279 00:18:41,480 --> 00:18:44,080 Speaker 2: and I'm going to keep leading. And my commitment is 280 00:18:44,119 --> 00:18:46,359 Speaker 2: to the you know, the soldiers and the airmen and 281 00:18:46,400 --> 00:18:50,840 Speaker 2: the Marines and the sailors behind me. And they're watching 282 00:18:50,920 --> 00:18:54,560 Speaker 2: those folks be part of that traffic jam. They're watching 283 00:18:54,680 --> 00:18:58,600 Speaker 2: spouses lose out on jobs. They're watching kids get screwed 284 00:18:58,640 --> 00:19:02,520 Speaker 2: with in their to move between schools. Right, they're watching 285 00:19:02,600 --> 00:19:07,359 Speaker 2: that happen, and they're watching it as some performative level 286 00:19:07,520 --> 00:19:10,760 Speaker 2: of just you know, who knows what is his actual 287 00:19:10,760 --> 00:19:16,240 Speaker 2: goal and intention of one random senator. Right, they're watching 288 00:19:16,400 --> 00:19:20,400 Speaker 2: all of that is happening because of one senator, and frankly, 289 00:19:20,840 --> 00:19:24,720 Speaker 2: who are their Republican senators who are railing on him, 290 00:19:24,840 --> 00:19:28,280 Speaker 2: or Republican House members who are saying, cut it out. 291 00:19:28,359 --> 00:19:31,320 Speaker 2: You are hurting people, You are hurting our military, you 292 00:19:31,359 --> 00:19:35,040 Speaker 2: are hurting our readiness, and the impact of this will 293 00:19:35,040 --> 00:19:38,160 Speaker 2: be felt in years into the future. Right, So no 294 00:19:38,200 --> 00:19:41,480 Speaker 2: one is speaking up for them, right, They are watching, 295 00:19:42,280 --> 00:19:44,800 Speaker 2: like the folks who are a couple years ahead of 296 00:19:44,800 --> 00:19:47,280 Speaker 2: them at the academy, or the folks who are their mentors, 297 00:19:47,840 --> 00:19:50,919 Speaker 2: or in many cases, you know, some of their own circumstances. 298 00:19:51,000 --> 00:19:54,679 Speaker 2: They are watching the impact of one man's kind of 299 00:19:55,119 --> 00:20:00,800 Speaker 2: you know, culture war drama impact the entire of the 300 00:20:00,880 --> 00:20:01,960 Speaker 2: United States military. 301 00:20:03,480 --> 00:20:05,800 Speaker 1: So I want to ask you a question, and it 302 00:20:05,840 --> 00:20:09,520 Speaker 1: is not aimed at getting you in trouble, though I 303 00:20:09,560 --> 00:20:14,880 Speaker 1: think you probably don't care, with your reputation for being 304 00:20:14,920 --> 00:20:20,320 Speaker 1: a straight shooter. So I spent a long stretch of 305 00:20:20,400 --> 00:20:26,480 Speaker 1: my career working in Republican politics. If it was a 306 00:20:26,520 --> 00:20:33,280 Speaker 1: Democratic senator who was doing this, the senator and the 307 00:20:33,480 --> 00:20:38,080 Speaker 1: entire party would have been crucified and would have broken 308 00:20:39,040 --> 00:20:42,240 Speaker 1: very very quickly. It would have been a blood leving. 309 00:20:43,840 --> 00:20:54,080 Speaker 1: What is wrong with the Democratic Party politically that the institution? Yeah, 310 00:20:55,000 --> 00:20:59,040 Speaker 1: not Abigail Spanberger, not Chuck Schumer. I'm talking about the party. 311 00:20:59,080 --> 00:21:05,080 Speaker 1: I'm talking about that and Morphis whatever, whatever. Why can't 312 00:21:05,200 --> 00:21:15,200 Speaker 1: the party organize, target, attack, and destroy on an issue 313 00:21:15,240 --> 00:21:19,000 Speaker 1: like this, which I would argue is a skill that's 314 00:21:19,040 --> 00:21:22,960 Speaker 1: going to be necessary to deploy in twenty twenty four. 315 00:21:24,920 --> 00:21:27,000 Speaker 2: So I'm going to give you two different answers. There 316 00:21:27,320 --> 00:21:30,200 Speaker 2: write what I would love to believe, and I can't 317 00:21:30,200 --> 00:21:33,000 Speaker 2: speak for the Senate. You know, Let's pretend in some 318 00:21:33,040 --> 00:21:37,520 Speaker 2: fake scenario that you know this is well, even if 319 00:21:37,520 --> 00:21:40,000 Speaker 2: it's you know, Senates that's doing the confirmation. If this 320 00:21:40,080 --> 00:21:45,480 Speaker 2: were a Democratic senator like you would have like it 321 00:21:45,520 --> 00:21:49,439 Speaker 2: would you'd have to wait in line to assail that 322 00:21:49,680 --> 00:21:52,080 Speaker 2: like to as sale that person, right, there would be 323 00:21:52,320 --> 00:21:56,120 Speaker 2: teams of Democrats saying, we will fund your primary opponent, 324 00:21:56,240 --> 00:21:59,359 Speaker 2: we will campaign against you. You do not deserve to 325 00:21:59,400 --> 00:22:02,359 Speaker 2: be in the United States Senate. This is disgraceful, this 326 00:22:02,400 --> 00:22:06,439 Speaker 2: is terrible. We are taking you out. So for starters, 327 00:22:06,560 --> 00:22:10,400 Speaker 2: I would say, there's an entirety like there's an entire problem, 328 00:22:10,440 --> 00:22:12,320 Speaker 2: and I'll get to the Democratic Party, I mean right, 329 00:22:12,560 --> 00:22:16,200 Speaker 2: like we would turn on our own and like punch 330 00:22:16,240 --> 00:22:19,560 Speaker 2: them in the face over this, right, And I can 331 00:22:19,760 --> 00:22:22,800 Speaker 2: you know, I can see my colleagues in my mind 332 00:22:22,840 --> 00:22:24,880 Speaker 2: who would be right there with us, right, you could. 333 00:22:25,080 --> 00:22:27,480 Speaker 2: You'd have to use like a wide shot camera because 334 00:22:27,480 --> 00:22:30,840 Speaker 2: everybody would be ready to just say we're done, this 335 00:22:30,920 --> 00:22:35,439 Speaker 2: is ridiculous, year out, like change your position, right, and 336 00:22:35,480 --> 00:22:38,160 Speaker 2: then there'd be all the peer pressure behind the scenes 337 00:22:38,480 --> 00:22:40,639 Speaker 2: that Democrats are really good at. And if there were 338 00:22:40,680 --> 00:22:44,560 Speaker 2: ever a Democrat doing this, like, it would crumble really quickly, right. 339 00:22:44,640 --> 00:22:48,440 Speaker 2: And so that's that's a question of like why are 340 00:22:48,480 --> 00:22:51,040 Speaker 2: they not doing that on the Republican side of the aisle, right, 341 00:22:51,119 --> 00:22:54,240 Speaker 2: Why are they not coming to him and saying, listen, 342 00:22:54,400 --> 00:22:57,600 Speaker 2: you're a United States senator, You're not a football coach anymore. 343 00:22:58,040 --> 00:23:01,280 Speaker 2: Like you are hurting national secure parity. You fix this, 344 00:23:01,359 --> 00:23:04,520 Speaker 2: You stop this, or we will one by one start 345 00:23:04,600 --> 00:23:08,240 Speaker 2: denouncing you. We will one by one start pummeling you. 346 00:23:08,320 --> 00:23:10,760 Speaker 2: We will find a primary opponent, we will fund him, 347 00:23:10,760 --> 00:23:13,560 Speaker 2: and you are out right. So first question is why 348 00:23:13,600 --> 00:23:15,000 Speaker 2: are the Republicans not doing that? 349 00:23:15,040 --> 00:23:17,240 Speaker 1: Of course, to get it and let me and let 350 00:23:17,240 --> 00:23:21,120 Speaker 1: me answer that one right, because they're bad, right. 351 00:23:21,240 --> 00:23:23,560 Speaker 2: And they don't have to because they have this mantle. 352 00:23:23,640 --> 00:23:26,000 Speaker 2: People think they're good on military issues. They don't vote 353 00:23:26,040 --> 00:23:29,720 Speaker 2: for the Pack Act. Well some do, right, they There's 354 00:23:29,800 --> 00:23:32,000 Speaker 2: plenty of people that get to vote and say, well, 355 00:23:32,040 --> 00:23:34,440 Speaker 2: you know, I don't really like it had a semicolon 356 00:23:34,520 --> 00:23:37,320 Speaker 2: here or an asterisk there, so I voted against the legislation, 357 00:23:37,800 --> 00:23:41,040 Speaker 2: which then you know they'll show up talking about all 358 00:23:41,040 --> 00:23:43,080 Speaker 2: the good things that legislation they didn't vote for does 359 00:23:43,119 --> 00:23:46,640 Speaker 2: for veterans. Right, And that's just an accepted reality. 360 00:23:46,280 --> 00:23:49,960 Speaker 1: That it's life's not life's not fair, but there but there. 361 00:23:49,960 --> 00:23:53,359 Speaker 1: But there can be no expectations on them, right, I 362 00:23:53,359 --> 00:23:56,000 Speaker 1: mean when you've taken a walk on the idea of 363 00:23:56,080 --> 00:23:59,320 Speaker 1: we choose our leaders through an election, which the facto 364 00:23:59,560 --> 00:24:04,360 Speaker 1: through a mix of complicity, cowardice and silence, right, that 365 00:24:04,359 --> 00:24:06,760 Speaker 1: that is the de facto position of the party, Right, 366 00:24:06,920 --> 00:24:09,159 Speaker 1: so there are no expectations for that, right. 367 00:24:10,400 --> 00:24:13,600 Speaker 2: Answer your question about Democrats, you know, I think that 368 00:24:13,960 --> 00:24:17,760 Speaker 2: what continues to be a problem is Democrats are too nice, right, 369 00:24:18,480 --> 00:24:21,560 Speaker 2: And I say that as a I'm a very kind, 370 00:24:22,119 --> 00:24:25,399 Speaker 2: like imminently nice person, at least I try to be. 371 00:24:26,000 --> 00:24:30,840 Speaker 2: But where we could be in this circumstance just ringing 372 00:24:30,880 --> 00:24:35,359 Speaker 2: the alarm bells, just pounding in a coordinated message, right, 373 00:24:35,400 --> 00:24:37,840 Speaker 2: and you see organizations doing it. Vote Vets is a 374 00:24:39,080 --> 00:24:42,840 Speaker 2: veterans organization that supports democratic veterans running for office or 375 00:24:42,920 --> 00:24:45,520 Speaker 2: those who support veterans running for office, et cetera. Like 376 00:24:45,760 --> 00:24:48,000 Speaker 2: we have seen them take this issue on and there 377 00:24:48,040 --> 00:24:52,120 Speaker 2: are you know, entities within politics doing it. But what 378 00:24:52,160 --> 00:24:56,680 Speaker 2: we're not seeing is a coordinated effort, certainly within the 379 00:24:56,800 --> 00:24:58,440 Speaker 2: United States Senate, where I think it would be most 380 00:24:58,480 --> 00:25:02,920 Speaker 2: appropriate to just pound on this every single day, because 381 00:25:02,920 --> 00:25:06,000 Speaker 2: you're right, if this were a Democratic senator, like I mean, 382 00:25:07,920 --> 00:25:11,080 Speaker 2: you'd get run over on the way for all of 383 00:25:11,080 --> 00:25:12,960 Speaker 2: the Republicans who would want to be speaking to a 384 00:25:13,000 --> 00:25:17,160 Speaker 2: microphone about how awful this is. And yet while there 385 00:25:17,200 --> 00:25:21,000 Speaker 2: have been many senators who have spoken up, it isn't 386 00:25:21,000 --> 00:25:25,520 Speaker 2: in the same coordinated you know, how's your day? Like 387 00:25:25,680 --> 00:25:28,080 Speaker 2: would you like cream in your coffee? Let me tell 388 00:25:28,119 --> 00:25:31,760 Speaker 2: you about this Democratic senator, right, like any question asked 389 00:25:31,800 --> 00:25:36,040 Speaker 2: would be don't answer, pivot towards talking about how horrible 390 00:25:36,119 --> 00:25:39,280 Speaker 2: this you know, imaginary democratic senator is, you know, whereas 391 00:25:39,480 --> 00:25:44,320 Speaker 2: Democrats like are just not taking that like aggressive, aggressive, 392 00:25:44,760 --> 00:25:50,919 Speaker 2: aggressive stance, and I there's a whole host of reasons 393 00:25:50,920 --> 00:25:56,159 Speaker 2: that perhaps it's it's it's the case, but you know, 394 00:25:56,240 --> 00:26:00,760 Speaker 2: I'm I'm ringing the alarm bells. I'm telling on this issue. 395 00:26:00,800 --> 00:26:03,840 Speaker 2: I welcome anybody and everyone who wants to join me 396 00:26:04,960 --> 00:26:07,639 Speaker 2: to do so. But you know, it also gets to 397 00:26:07,960 --> 00:26:11,400 Speaker 2: the fact that, you know, again I'm not a member 398 00:26:11,400 --> 00:26:14,160 Speaker 2: of the United States Senate, but if I were Queen 399 00:26:14,200 --> 00:26:17,520 Speaker 2: for the day, I would love to see just you know, 400 00:26:17,680 --> 00:26:21,040 Speaker 2: an entire Senate floor full, just we're here to vote, 401 00:26:21,200 --> 00:26:24,400 Speaker 2: like we're here to ensure our national security, like we're 402 00:26:24,400 --> 00:26:27,280 Speaker 2: not leaving till that gets done. And I will say 403 00:26:27,320 --> 00:26:28,800 Speaker 2: that that's a little bit of a difference between the 404 00:26:28,840 --> 00:26:31,560 Speaker 2: House and the Senate, because there's certainly been times that 405 00:26:31,840 --> 00:26:35,639 Speaker 2: you know, in the House, both Democrats and Republicans have 406 00:26:35,680 --> 00:26:40,560 Speaker 2: an inclination to be a little bit more demonstrative with 407 00:26:40,920 --> 00:26:41,960 Speaker 2: the way they make points. 408 00:26:42,520 --> 00:26:44,280 Speaker 1: Yeah, it's so funny when you're when you're in the 409 00:26:44,280 --> 00:26:47,119 Speaker 1: fight and in the you know, back and forth of 410 00:26:47,160 --> 00:26:50,399 Speaker 1: a campaign, and especially when you think you're you're just 411 00:26:50,480 --> 00:26:54,199 Speaker 1: absolutely on the right side. I just like if I 412 00:26:54,320 --> 00:26:57,920 Speaker 1: was back in campaign politics, right in washing. Can I 413 00:26:58,359 --> 00:27:00,840 Speaker 1: know that I would walk into our room in the 414 00:27:00,880 --> 00:27:03,080 Speaker 1: Democratic Party and I said, we're just gonna have a 415 00:27:03,080 --> 00:27:06,960 Speaker 1: fun week. Right. We got America's dumbest senator by far, 416 00:27:07,440 --> 00:27:11,919 Speaker 1: which is saying something right, holding up hundreds and hundreds 417 00:27:11,960 --> 00:27:14,919 Speaker 1: of military promotions, weakening the national defense of the country. 418 00:27:15,040 --> 00:27:15,800 Speaker 1: Let's let's go. 419 00:27:16,200 --> 00:27:18,360 Speaker 2: And if you said nothing, you agree with him? 420 00:27:18,720 --> 00:27:25,000 Speaker 1: No, It's incredible after the after the last election, you 421 00:27:25,000 --> 00:27:29,360 Speaker 1: you you caused a little bit of a kerfuffle right 422 00:27:29,440 --> 00:27:36,480 Speaker 1: within the within the Democratic Party when you said that 423 00:27:37,359 --> 00:27:42,560 Speaker 1: and advised, uh, the party apparatics and consultant should watch 424 00:27:42,600 --> 00:27:48,040 Speaker 1: all of the Republican ads and then nobody should ever 425 00:27:48,080 --> 00:27:52,240 Speaker 1: say the words defund the police again. And the response 426 00:27:52,320 --> 00:27:58,399 Speaker 1: to that from some was no congressional Democrat campaigned on 427 00:27:58,520 --> 00:28:03,439 Speaker 1: defunding the police, which is true. But I guess, like 428 00:28:03,560 --> 00:28:13,400 Speaker 1: my question is, why do you think the people who 429 00:28:13,440 --> 00:28:18,879 Speaker 1: criticized you, why is it that they think that those 430 00:28:18,960 --> 00:28:23,840 Speaker 1: issues are associated with your party? How did that come 431 00:28:23,880 --> 00:28:25,879 Speaker 1: to be? 432 00:28:25,880 --> 00:28:30,400 Speaker 2: Because there's members of Congress who literally said those words, right, 433 00:28:30,600 --> 00:28:33,719 Speaker 2: and there's video, and that video made it into attack 434 00:28:33,800 --> 00:28:36,879 Speaker 2: ads across the country, you know, and this goes back 435 00:28:36,880 --> 00:28:42,240 Speaker 2: to your earlier question, whether it's a Republican congressman or 436 00:28:42,400 --> 00:28:46,080 Speaker 2: you know, as someone speaking about potential of violence or 437 00:28:46,120 --> 00:28:51,000 Speaker 2: an inevitability of violence or something, or it's Democrats just 438 00:28:51,280 --> 00:28:55,240 Speaker 2: using clumsy language or saying something that they don't really mean, 439 00:28:55,440 --> 00:28:58,680 Speaker 2: or what we really mean is and like there is 440 00:28:58,720 --> 00:29:02,840 Speaker 2: a responsibility to be clear in our language to voters. 441 00:29:03,240 --> 00:29:05,280 Speaker 2: And so you know, on the Democratic side of the aisle, 442 00:29:05,280 --> 00:29:07,560 Speaker 2: there are a bunch of people who use this, you know, 443 00:29:07,640 --> 00:29:13,320 Speaker 2: cute little catchphrase that looks good on a poster and 444 00:29:13,360 --> 00:29:17,840 Speaker 2: then said, well, that's not what we really mean. Is Meanwhile, 445 00:29:17,880 --> 00:29:22,680 Speaker 2: the words defund and then the police that has a 446 00:29:22,800 --> 00:29:29,000 Speaker 2: meaning and if you don't mean defund, then use something else, 447 00:29:29,040 --> 00:29:33,120 Speaker 2: say invest in mental health services or you know, invest 448 00:29:33,160 --> 00:29:37,240 Speaker 2: in community policing or write like all of these things 449 00:29:37,400 --> 00:29:41,280 Speaker 2: that the very same people. And in fairness, little asterisk 450 00:29:41,280 --> 00:29:44,520 Speaker 2: like there were a couple localities that actually wanted to 451 00:29:45,120 --> 00:29:49,680 Speaker 2: fully defund or make substantial financial cuts, but for the 452 00:29:49,960 --> 00:29:53,080 Speaker 2: vast majority of people, we said, well, what we really 453 00:29:53,120 --> 00:29:56,160 Speaker 2: mean is, well people know that. No, no, people don't 454 00:29:56,200 --> 00:29:58,800 Speaker 2: know that because people aren't listening to your speech on 455 00:29:58,840 --> 00:30:02,400 Speaker 2: the House floor watching c SPAN on a random Tuesday morning, 456 00:30:02,680 --> 00:30:05,680 Speaker 2: right they're seeing the ads where you're holding a sign 457 00:30:05,800 --> 00:30:08,040 Speaker 2: or you're saying the words, and so if you don't 458 00:30:08,040 --> 00:30:12,520 Speaker 2: mean it, don't say it. And if you mean something, frankly, 459 00:30:12,880 --> 00:30:16,920 Speaker 2: that is, you know, impactful and thoughtful policy, then why 460 00:30:16,960 --> 00:30:20,960 Speaker 2: would you not want to convey what is your sort 461 00:30:21,000 --> 00:30:24,680 Speaker 2: of comprehensive plan or your thoughtful policy or something that's 462 00:30:24,720 --> 00:30:27,880 Speaker 2: really meant to get at the heart of, you know, 463 00:30:27,920 --> 00:30:31,360 Speaker 2: the challenge that people are facing. And so I think 464 00:30:31,400 --> 00:30:35,960 Speaker 2: that you know, certainly, I'll say for me in my experience, 465 00:30:36,040 --> 00:30:38,240 Speaker 2: part of the challenge is this gets back to the 466 00:30:38,280 --> 00:30:41,240 Speaker 2: issue that there's so few competitive seats around the country 467 00:30:41,800 --> 00:30:45,880 Speaker 2: and so many of my colleagues Democrats and Republicans. If 468 00:30:45,880 --> 00:30:48,280 Speaker 2: you're in a safe seat, you're in a bit of 469 00:30:48,280 --> 00:30:51,280 Speaker 2: an echo chamber because while you might have if you're 470 00:30:51,280 --> 00:30:54,600 Speaker 2: a Democrat, while you might have Democrats across the gamut, 471 00:30:54,600 --> 00:30:57,520 Speaker 2: and certainly, you know, Republicans across the gamut in your district, 472 00:30:57,920 --> 00:31:00,400 Speaker 2: if you're winning with sixty five seventy percent of the vote, 473 00:31:00,760 --> 00:31:04,360 Speaker 2: you know, you're probably not hearing from them, right or 474 00:31:04,440 --> 00:31:07,240 Speaker 2: you're maybe not visiting the events where they're going to say, oh, 475 00:31:07,280 --> 00:31:10,360 Speaker 2: you know, Congressman, let me tell you this, When you 476 00:31:10,400 --> 00:31:14,160 Speaker 2: represent toss up districts, you better believe that people across 477 00:31:14,320 --> 00:31:18,200 Speaker 2: the the you know, the entire span of political ideology, 478 00:31:18,680 --> 00:31:20,560 Speaker 2: you know, will come up to you and say, you know, 479 00:31:20,760 --> 00:31:23,440 Speaker 2: you you barely want or this is a toss up district. 480 00:31:23,760 --> 00:31:26,880 Speaker 2: Let me tell you something, right, because there's a certain 481 00:31:26,920 --> 00:31:28,920 Speaker 2: empowerment I think that comes when they think that, like, 482 00:31:29,120 --> 00:31:31,800 Speaker 2: we might get you next time. Which I say it jokingly, 483 00:31:31,880 --> 00:31:36,320 Speaker 2: but I actually deeply appreciate the fact that I get 484 00:31:36,320 --> 00:31:40,200 Speaker 2: to hear from people across the spectrum on a regular basis, 485 00:31:41,240 --> 00:31:45,000 Speaker 2: And so I know how these you know, glib comments 486 00:31:45,040 --> 00:31:48,959 Speaker 2: here or a slogan there, like not only yes, it 487 00:31:49,000 --> 00:31:54,240 Speaker 2: gets kind of uh, you know, turbocharged through some of 488 00:31:54,280 --> 00:31:57,800 Speaker 2: the you know, right wing or just you know, right 489 00:31:58,000 --> 00:32:03,080 Speaker 2: ish media echo chain, but like, I also know how 490 00:32:03,080 --> 00:32:06,000 Speaker 2: it translates into the minds of people because I'm hearing 491 00:32:06,040 --> 00:32:09,840 Speaker 2: them right talk about things that are either deeply concerning right. 492 00:32:10,080 --> 00:32:14,240 Speaker 2: On election day in twenty twenty, I had a police officer, 493 00:32:15,200 --> 00:32:19,360 Speaker 2: a black man police officer, come up to me at 494 00:32:19,360 --> 00:32:22,560 Speaker 2: the polls in uniform, take me aside for a moment 495 00:32:23,040 --> 00:32:24,640 Speaker 2: and said, I think I know the answer, but I 496 00:32:24,760 --> 00:32:27,960 Speaker 2: just I just want to be sure, like you don't 497 00:32:28,000 --> 00:32:32,200 Speaker 2: want to defund the police, right, And I said, no, sir, 498 00:32:32,400 --> 00:32:36,040 Speaker 2: like thank you for your service, like in fact, a 499 00:32:36,080 --> 00:32:40,480 Speaker 2: lot of the improvements and the needs of police departments 500 00:32:40,480 --> 00:32:43,680 Speaker 2: across the country actually cost a lot, and I want 501 00:32:43,680 --> 00:32:46,760 Speaker 2: to have honest conversations about that. And he said, okay, okay, 502 00:32:46,840 --> 00:32:50,320 Speaker 2: you know, and it he was clear that that was 503 00:32:50,320 --> 00:32:53,719 Speaker 2: a legitimate question that he came to the polls and 504 00:32:54,480 --> 00:32:57,680 Speaker 2: you know, asked me, right, And and so I think 505 00:32:57,720 --> 00:33:02,480 Speaker 2: that people need to understand that, like the concerns that 506 00:33:02,560 --> 00:33:06,920 Speaker 2: people have are real, and in districts, in toss up districts, 507 00:33:06,920 --> 00:33:09,280 Speaker 2: we get to hear them all. And the reason I 508 00:33:09,280 --> 00:33:12,920 Speaker 2: said people should watch attack ads is because I think 509 00:33:12,920 --> 00:33:15,840 Speaker 2: there's a real lack of understanding of what they are. 510 00:33:16,840 --> 00:33:19,960 Speaker 2: And I thought this back in twenty twenty, and Steve 511 00:33:20,040 --> 00:33:24,040 Speaker 2: allow me one more rant on them, but I had 512 00:33:24,160 --> 00:33:28,280 Speaker 2: actual proof of that. So with redistricting, my district changed substantially, 513 00:33:28,840 --> 00:33:31,800 Speaker 2: and my media market went from being twenty percent the 514 00:33:31,880 --> 00:33:34,640 Speaker 2: DC media market to eighty percent the DC media market. 515 00:33:34,760 --> 00:33:38,680 Speaker 2: So I ran far more ads on DCTV, as did 516 00:33:39,120 --> 00:33:42,560 Speaker 2: all of the iees spending against me, and I had 517 00:33:43,600 --> 00:33:48,680 Speaker 2: quite a few members of Congress, wonderful colleagues come to 518 00:33:48,720 --> 00:33:53,120 Speaker 2: me and very earnestly and very kindly talk to me 519 00:33:53,280 --> 00:33:56,680 Speaker 2: about the attack ADS. Oh, I'm so sorry I saw 520 00:33:56,720 --> 00:33:59,080 Speaker 2: the attack ADS. I can't believe the things they're saying. 521 00:33:59,400 --> 00:34:01,400 Speaker 2: I had multiple will colleagues give me a hug and 522 00:34:01,440 --> 00:34:06,440 Speaker 2: ask if I was okay, sincerely, earnestly and kindly. And 523 00:34:06,520 --> 00:34:12,120 Speaker 2: what that meant to me is like wow, right, Like 524 00:34:12,600 --> 00:34:17,239 Speaker 2: people are wonderful people who are earnestly concerned about me 525 00:34:17,600 --> 00:34:21,839 Speaker 2: because they've suddenly seen the terrible attack ADS that get 526 00:34:21,920 --> 00:34:25,040 Speaker 2: run against me. And then it gave me actually quite 527 00:34:25,040 --> 00:34:27,239 Speaker 2: a bit of empathy because I thought, oh, all those 528 00:34:27,280 --> 00:34:31,360 Speaker 2: times I thought that many people didn't understand, like indeed 529 00:34:31,840 --> 00:34:34,840 Speaker 2: they didn't because it wasn't until they're getting dressed for 530 00:34:34,880 --> 00:34:37,160 Speaker 2: work in the morning and they see an attack AD 531 00:34:37,480 --> 00:34:39,759 Speaker 2: you know, saying X y Z terrible things about me 532 00:34:40,280 --> 00:34:43,200 Speaker 2: that they were like, oh my gosh, and they're seeking 533 00:34:43,239 --> 00:34:46,720 Speaker 2: me out on the house floor, right, And people I know, well, 534 00:34:46,840 --> 00:34:50,000 Speaker 2: people I seldom talk to, right, it really runs the gamut, 535 00:34:50,520 --> 00:34:53,719 Speaker 2: and they're like deeply concerned for me. And so it 536 00:34:53,920 --> 00:34:58,200 Speaker 2: just is one more indicator that so frequently you know, 537 00:34:58,280 --> 00:35:01,799 Speaker 2: people live not only in safety, but also in kind 538 00:35:01,840 --> 00:35:05,600 Speaker 2: of safer regions or media markets where they're not seeing 539 00:35:05,680 --> 00:35:11,120 Speaker 2: their colleagues attacked in a way where it feels more personal, 540 00:35:11,520 --> 00:35:14,879 Speaker 2: and they really don't understand how much those attack ads 541 00:35:14,920 --> 00:35:19,440 Speaker 2: are not only on television but in fact permeating in communities. 542 00:35:20,800 --> 00:35:25,480 Speaker 1: I just drove across the country from Santa Barbara, California, 543 00:35:26,320 --> 00:35:31,399 Speaker 1: up through Mount Shasta, through Oregon, Washington, through British Columbia 544 00:35:32,160 --> 00:35:34,799 Speaker 1: kind of on the border, and ended up in New 545 00:35:34,840 --> 00:35:40,280 Speaker 1: Hampshire where my parents live, about forty three hundred total miles, 546 00:35:40,320 --> 00:35:45,400 Speaker 1: and at a couple of observations from the trip, and 547 00:35:45,480 --> 00:35:53,600 Speaker 1: the first was how utterly and completely irrelevant the overwhelming 548 00:35:53,800 --> 00:36:00,520 Speaker 1: majority of cable news is to the lives of the 549 00:36:00,640 --> 00:36:05,239 Speaker 1: people whose lives I pass by on the road. The 550 00:36:05,640 --> 00:36:12,640 Speaker 1: total disconnect, just visually driving by between what those people 551 00:36:12,719 --> 00:36:17,080 Speaker 1: see on cable news. And in that sense, when you 552 00:36:17,120 --> 00:36:20,799 Speaker 1: watch Mitch McConnell and you watch the freeze, and you 553 00:36:20,840 --> 00:36:24,960 Speaker 1: watch the reaction after it, which is he's fine, no problem, 554 00:36:25,000 --> 00:36:28,640 Speaker 1: he's dehydrated, kind of the reaction, tongue in cheek is hey, 555 00:36:28,840 --> 00:36:32,040 Speaker 1: he looks great, six more years, right, So there's this 556 00:36:32,200 --> 00:36:39,440 Speaker 1: constancy of people are constantly told things that do not 557 00:36:39,880 --> 00:36:45,120 Speaker 1: compute with what they are visually seeing. I talk to 558 00:36:45,200 --> 00:36:49,280 Speaker 1: people with green hair and nose rings and a sleeve 559 00:36:49,360 --> 00:36:56,480 Speaker 1: of tattoos, cowboys, farmers, all sorts of people. There's not 560 00:36:56,600 --> 00:37:02,840 Speaker 1: a single person I met that wants a Trump Biden rematch, 561 00:37:03,600 --> 00:37:09,040 Speaker 1: even the even the Trump supporters, right and I. And secondly, 562 00:37:09,880 --> 00:37:12,759 Speaker 1: there's not a person I met in the in the 563 00:37:12,840 --> 00:37:18,560 Speaker 1: vast middle of the country who doesn't believe that, through 564 00:37:18,680 --> 00:37:22,880 Speaker 1: the district attorneys of a couple of cities, that the 565 00:37:22,960 --> 00:37:32,360 Speaker 1: Democratic Party is an utterly lawless advocate San Francisco and 566 00:37:32,520 --> 00:37:39,280 Speaker 1: Los Angeles. Is there an understanding in Congress among Democrats 567 00:37:39,400 --> 00:37:44,840 Speaker 1: of the impact of the Fox propaganda around those cities, 568 00:37:45,600 --> 00:37:50,040 Speaker 1: combined with the real policies of those district attorneys, as 569 00:37:50,120 --> 00:37:55,600 Speaker 1: having imprinted on the national brand of the entire party, 570 00:37:55,760 --> 00:37:57,200 Speaker 1: or is there a denial. 571 00:37:56,840 --> 00:38:00,680 Speaker 2: About that, you know, not to speak there's exceptions to 572 00:38:00,680 --> 00:38:04,920 Speaker 2: every rule, but I think broadly there's either a denial 573 00:38:05,960 --> 00:38:10,200 Speaker 2: or there's a sense that it's not relevant, or there's 574 00:38:10,200 --> 00:38:13,800 Speaker 2: a lack of attention. So whether it's you know, someone 575 00:38:13,840 --> 00:38:15,880 Speaker 2: actually sort of making the decision to say no, no, no, 576 00:38:15,920 --> 00:38:20,279 Speaker 2: that doesn't matter, or someone just saying that you know, 577 00:38:20,560 --> 00:38:24,040 Speaker 2: that's that's not relevant. I do think that it is 578 00:38:24,280 --> 00:38:29,360 Speaker 2: a very very very significant problem. And you know, I 579 00:38:29,520 --> 00:38:32,920 Speaker 2: hear it in my district. I always have, you know, 580 00:38:33,040 --> 00:38:38,440 Speaker 2: some of these comments that you know are coming to 581 00:38:38,480 --> 00:38:41,840 Speaker 2: you straight from Fox News or straight from you know, 582 00:38:41,840 --> 00:38:47,640 Speaker 2: whichever podcaster. And and I do think that across the board, 583 00:38:48,440 --> 00:38:53,000 Speaker 2: there's a denial that those comments are breaking through, but 584 00:38:53,360 --> 00:38:57,000 Speaker 2: more importantly, a lack of understanding of who they're breaking 585 00:38:57,040 --> 00:39:00,000 Speaker 2: through with. Right, It isn't the folks who have been 586 00:39:00,120 --> 00:39:04,960 Speaker 2: wearing MAGA hats since twenty sixteen, Right, that isn't just 587 00:39:05,000 --> 00:39:07,680 Speaker 2: the folks who have been all in for Trump since 588 00:39:07,719 --> 00:39:11,640 Speaker 2: he came down the escalator. It's it's an issue, and 589 00:39:12,200 --> 00:39:14,480 Speaker 2: I think you were getting at it with a comment 590 00:39:14,480 --> 00:39:17,879 Speaker 2: about Mitch McConnell. Like it's also just an element of 591 00:39:18,680 --> 00:39:22,840 Speaker 2: people feeling disoriented and feeling like people aren't being honest 592 00:39:22,840 --> 00:39:26,200 Speaker 2: with them and so and you know, I don't want 593 00:39:26,239 --> 00:39:29,360 Speaker 2: to necessarily get into the man's personal health, but you know, 594 00:39:29,600 --> 00:39:33,719 Speaker 2: I've been dehydrated before, right, I've I'm drinking water during 595 00:39:33,719 --> 00:39:37,320 Speaker 2: this interview, right, Like, I think there's if you're saying 596 00:39:37,360 --> 00:39:40,440 Speaker 2: that to a farmer out in the field who's working 597 00:39:41,040 --> 00:39:44,080 Speaker 2: in a hundred degree weather, you know, checking on his 598 00:39:44,200 --> 00:39:48,200 Speaker 2: cattle in Virginia. Like the idea that a man in 599 00:39:48,239 --> 00:39:52,200 Speaker 2: a suit is just so dehydrated that he you know, 600 00:39:52,280 --> 00:39:55,160 Speaker 2: freezes in place and has this episode, you know, two 601 00:39:55,160 --> 00:39:58,080 Speaker 2: of which have been caught on television. You know, who 602 00:39:58,080 --> 00:40:01,319 Speaker 2: knows if there's more right, there's just yeah, I don't 603 00:40:01,360 --> 00:40:05,640 Speaker 2: I don't get it right, and and that's it may 604 00:40:05,640 --> 00:40:07,359 Speaker 2: not be the focus of their day, they might not 605 00:40:07,400 --> 00:40:09,680 Speaker 2: think another thing of it, but it's a little bit 606 00:40:09,680 --> 00:40:13,520 Speaker 2: of like okay, sure, just more kind of politician saying, 607 00:40:13,840 --> 00:40:17,840 Speaker 2: don't believe your eyes right. And so whether that happens 608 00:40:18,440 --> 00:40:21,600 Speaker 2: on whichever like, no matter where that happens. I think 609 00:40:21,640 --> 00:40:24,359 Speaker 2: that one of the biggest challenges that we face as 610 00:40:24,400 --> 00:40:28,080 Speaker 2: a country is that we're not giving the American people 611 00:40:29,000 --> 00:40:34,200 Speaker 2: enough reasons to trust us and believe in us as legislators, 612 00:40:34,600 --> 00:40:39,200 Speaker 2: as members of Congress, as you know, folks who should 613 00:40:39,239 --> 00:40:43,160 Speaker 2: be focused on governance. And I think that that is 614 00:40:43,200 --> 00:40:47,040 Speaker 2: the foundation on which, you know, there's really fertile ground 615 00:40:47,560 --> 00:40:52,080 Speaker 2: for people to believe anything from extreme conspiracies to just 616 00:40:53,080 --> 00:40:56,560 Speaker 2: it's all broken, I'm done, right, and I think that 617 00:40:56,560 --> 00:41:02,359 Speaker 2: that's the foundational piece that's really problematic. And then you know, 618 00:41:02,440 --> 00:41:05,319 Speaker 2: to get to your question related to you know, the 619 00:41:05,320 --> 00:41:10,320 Speaker 2: democrats perception of things. You know, we like, I know 620 00:41:10,440 --> 00:41:15,799 Speaker 2: that my district is unbelievably different from San Francisco, right, 621 00:41:15,960 --> 00:41:19,319 Speaker 2: like everything our geography, our industry, like all of it. 622 00:41:20,239 --> 00:41:23,680 Speaker 2: But I also know that, you know, people in my 623 00:41:23,760 --> 00:41:27,080 Speaker 2: district might be seeing two things. They might be seeing 624 00:41:27,440 --> 00:41:30,279 Speaker 2: what's happening in some far off place that you know, 625 00:41:30,360 --> 00:41:33,120 Speaker 2: maybe they visited, maybe they've not, maybe they never will. 626 00:41:34,120 --> 00:41:36,640 Speaker 2: Like that that's they're being told it's somehow relevant to them, 627 00:41:36,920 --> 00:41:40,239 Speaker 2: and do they listen? Do they not? But then it's 628 00:41:40,320 --> 00:41:45,239 Speaker 2: also where they live, right where, like what's important to 629 00:41:45,280 --> 00:41:48,400 Speaker 2: them is also not being talked about. Right when was 630 00:41:48,440 --> 00:41:53,880 Speaker 2: the last time we had you know, national media or 631 00:41:54,760 --> 00:42:01,120 Speaker 2: you know, cable TV just talking about what's happening in 632 00:42:01,200 --> 00:42:04,440 Speaker 2: agricultural communities right outside of some of the fear mongering 633 00:42:04,480 --> 00:42:09,440 Speaker 2: related to farmland, which of course is an incredibly important issue. 634 00:42:09,440 --> 00:42:13,239 Speaker 2: But like unless it's some kind of weird exploitive man 635 00:42:13,280 --> 00:42:16,840 Speaker 2: on the street, like you're in Iowa, you're in New Hampshire, Like, 636 00:42:16,920 --> 00:42:23,319 Speaker 2: what do you think, right, it's it's not a real engagement, right, Beautiful, 637 00:42:23,560 --> 00:42:28,480 Speaker 2: vast communities and people that exist certainly across my district. 638 00:42:28,520 --> 00:42:31,759 Speaker 2: But I'd argue, you know across that that route you 639 00:42:31,840 --> 00:42:33,520 Speaker 2: took across the country. 640 00:42:33,840 --> 00:42:37,000 Speaker 1: Well, what a what a great answer to that to 641 00:42:37,080 --> 00:42:45,040 Speaker 1: that question, very very kind of wise. Look at the country, 642 00:42:45,080 --> 00:42:52,360 Speaker 1: which is very quickly we will be celebrating a birthday. 643 00:42:53,760 --> 00:42:58,719 Speaker 1: This country will be two hundred and fifty years old. 644 00:42:59,360 --> 00:43:06,080 Speaker 1: It's an extraordinary achievement. The oldest constitutional republic in the world. 645 00:43:07,920 --> 00:43:13,399 Speaker 1: The founding father of the country, George Washington. I think 646 00:43:13,440 --> 00:43:18,360 Speaker 1: there's a real lack of understanding of why he was great. 647 00:43:19,480 --> 00:43:24,960 Speaker 1: And there's a portrait of Washington in the capital rotunda, 648 00:43:26,880 --> 00:43:35,040 Speaker 1: Keep Going, And in that portrait, Washington is coming to 649 00:43:35,080 --> 00:43:42,520 Speaker 1: resign his military commission, and the painter viewed that as 650 00:43:42,600 --> 00:43:48,640 Speaker 1: the noblest act in history. And in that painting, Washington 651 00:43:48,760 --> 00:43:52,719 Speaker 1: has laid down his cloak and draped it over a 652 00:43:52,840 --> 00:43:57,440 Speaker 1: chair which is larger than all of the other chairs 653 00:43:57,480 --> 00:44:03,520 Speaker 1: in the painting, but it sits and unoccupied. The symbolism 654 00:44:03,680 --> 00:44:10,680 Speaker 1: is that Washington has rejected Caesarism. Washington, in a highly 655 00:44:10,920 --> 00:44:17,040 Speaker 1: prescribed ceremony, bows to Congress. The man who could have 656 00:44:17,160 --> 00:44:24,359 Speaker 1: been king, could have been emperor, and he retires and 657 00:44:24,400 --> 00:44:28,880 Speaker 1: then he does it again. Really the first person in 658 00:44:28,960 --> 00:44:34,360 Speaker 1: two thousand years of history that walks away from power. 659 00:44:34,520 --> 00:44:38,560 Speaker 1: And so on, this drive crossing into Canada, and I'm 660 00:44:38,600 --> 00:44:43,879 Speaker 1: married to a Canadian and I love the country. When 661 00:44:43,880 --> 00:44:49,279 Speaker 1: you cross the border, Charles the third is sovereign, he is, 662 00:44:49,400 --> 00:44:54,680 Speaker 1: he is King of Canada. Every society on Earth is 663 00:44:54,920 --> 00:44:59,480 Speaker 1: organized in one form of another. And there are a 664 00:44:59,520 --> 00:45:03,879 Speaker 1: lot of democracies that have a monarchy as the head 665 00:45:03,880 --> 00:45:09,640 Speaker 1: of state, and their country's democratic processes are the same 666 00:45:09,719 --> 00:45:14,560 Speaker 1: as ours, with variations and differences. But really in many ways, 667 00:45:15,000 --> 00:45:19,840 Speaker 1: no less freedoms, just different. But in this country, we 668 00:45:19,920 --> 00:45:24,840 Speaker 1: don't have a king. We don't tolerate a king. The 669 00:45:25,040 --> 00:45:33,160 Speaker 1: people elect choose people like you, and you are given 670 00:45:34,080 --> 00:45:41,160 Speaker 1: a lawful power with many, many limits on it that 671 00:45:41,200 --> 00:45:45,720 Speaker 1: can never interfere with the rights of the individual, within 672 00:45:45,800 --> 00:45:50,880 Speaker 1: a system that restrains the power of government. That's endured 673 00:45:50,920 --> 00:45:54,919 Speaker 1: for two hundred and fifty years. And however, you think 674 00:45:54,960 --> 00:46:00,000 Speaker 1: about the Great Jenga game of life. At the fact, 675 00:46:00,000 --> 00:46:04,280 Speaker 1: foundation of the American way of life, at the American 676 00:46:04,360 --> 00:46:12,279 Speaker 1: civilization is this we choose our leaders. And if you 677 00:46:12,360 --> 00:46:18,000 Speaker 1: walk away from that, you've reset a debate and argument 678 00:46:18,160 --> 00:46:23,719 Speaker 1: back not to nineteen sixty five in the birth of 679 00:46:23,719 --> 00:46:28,600 Speaker 1: the modern civil rights movement, not to the desegregation of 680 00:46:28,640 --> 00:46:32,080 Speaker 1: the military in nineteen forty seven, not even to eighteen 681 00:46:32,160 --> 00:46:36,360 Speaker 1: sixty five, and appamax, you've reset the debate and the 682 00:46:36,520 --> 00:46:44,360 Speaker 1: argument all the way back to seventeen seventy six. And 683 00:46:44,440 --> 00:46:48,239 Speaker 1: so my question is what is this twenty twenty four 684 00:46:48,400 --> 00:46:52,400 Speaker 1: election about, because I don't think it's about the economy. 685 00:46:54,719 --> 00:46:59,080 Speaker 2: Well, I will add before answering your question, that that 686 00:46:59,480 --> 00:47:02,839 Speaker 2: portrait any time I am with any group visiting that 687 00:47:02,960 --> 00:47:06,200 Speaker 2: is that is the painting that I point out because 688 00:47:06,239 --> 00:47:08,880 Speaker 2: here is a man who could have been king, who 689 00:47:08,960 --> 00:47:12,440 Speaker 2: chose to resign his commission, who chose to limit his 690 00:47:12,440 --> 00:47:15,799 Speaker 2: own power, and he did that for the country for 691 00:47:15,960 --> 00:47:16,600 Speaker 2: an ideal. 692 00:47:17,080 --> 00:47:17,239 Speaker 1: Right. 693 00:47:19,000 --> 00:47:23,640 Speaker 2: Also, beneath where that that's in the rotunda. Beneath it 694 00:47:23,680 --> 00:47:26,400 Speaker 2: is the crypt, and the crypt is called the crypt 695 00:47:26,480 --> 00:47:28,920 Speaker 2: because it was supposed to be the burial place a 696 00:47:29,000 --> 00:47:33,000 Speaker 2: George Washington. He was supposed to be entombed like a king, 697 00:47:33,480 --> 00:47:39,239 Speaker 2: like a monarch, like this extraordinary person, you know, and 698 00:47:41,160 --> 00:47:45,200 Speaker 2: he didn't want that. And after his death, his you know, 699 00:47:45,239 --> 00:47:48,640 Speaker 2: he was brought back home to Virginia to be laid 700 00:47:48,640 --> 00:47:53,560 Speaker 2: to rest in Virginia, the place he's from, and not 701 00:47:54,760 --> 00:47:57,920 Speaker 2: at the seat of power for the United States. And 702 00:47:57,960 --> 00:48:00,960 Speaker 2: I think that there's something even you know, Virginians we 703 00:48:01,080 --> 00:48:04,040 Speaker 2: like to tell that story because he went home to Virginia, 704 00:48:04,080 --> 00:48:08,520 Speaker 2: But there's something really important about saying no, you know, yes, 705 00:48:08,560 --> 00:48:13,399 Speaker 2: I want to go home to Virginia, but actually like, yes, 706 00:48:13,600 --> 00:48:16,760 Speaker 2: be revered, yes, recognized for the important role in history, 707 00:48:17,200 --> 00:48:21,200 Speaker 2: but to be entombed in this space the way kings are, right, 708 00:48:21,200 --> 00:48:25,040 Speaker 2: that's not that's not what we're going to do in 709 00:48:25,040 --> 00:48:28,359 Speaker 2: this country. And I think that's another element of it. 710 00:48:28,440 --> 00:48:30,439 Speaker 2: And when we look at what the twenty twenty four 711 00:48:30,560 --> 00:48:33,600 Speaker 2: election is, you know, I think there's a couple different 712 00:48:33,600 --> 00:48:37,280 Speaker 2: things that have deeply distressed me within our political system. 713 00:48:37,360 --> 00:48:41,200 Speaker 2: The divisions, the lack of respect, the kind of reductive 714 00:48:41,239 --> 00:48:44,800 Speaker 2: way that we talk to each other. But there's also 715 00:48:44,880 --> 00:48:47,680 Speaker 2: a lack of pride. And we saw this even in 716 00:48:47,719 --> 00:48:51,319 Speaker 2: the twenty twenty one elections in Virginia and our gubernatorial race, 717 00:48:51,440 --> 00:48:54,560 Speaker 2: right it was some of the same language about you know, 718 00:48:55,320 --> 00:48:58,879 Speaker 2: everything's terrible everything's terrible. People are terrible. You know, it's 719 00:48:58,920 --> 00:49:01,759 Speaker 2: all this doom and which you know, for anyone who 720 00:49:01,840 --> 00:49:06,440 Speaker 2: remembers the horror that was Trump's inauguration speech, right, he 721 00:49:06,680 --> 00:49:11,799 Speaker 2: spoke of a country in that speech that is not 722 00:49:12,480 --> 00:49:14,680 Speaker 2: the country that I believe in. That is not the 723 00:49:14,719 --> 00:49:17,600 Speaker 2: country that I served as an intelligence officer, is not 724 00:49:17,640 --> 00:49:20,319 Speaker 2: the country I'm raising my daughters in, is not the 725 00:49:20,360 --> 00:49:25,200 Speaker 2: country that I believe is truly extraordinary because of our 726 00:49:25,320 --> 00:49:27,560 Speaker 2: history and because of our possibility, and because of what 727 00:49:27,640 --> 00:49:31,759 Speaker 2: we have done over you know, and we have been imperfect, 728 00:49:31,760 --> 00:49:35,120 Speaker 2: but we have always been progressing, right and you and 729 00:49:35,160 --> 00:49:40,640 Speaker 2: we hit you know, we hit you know, stoppages along 730 00:49:40,680 --> 00:49:42,600 Speaker 2: the way, and we keep going. And so I think 731 00:49:42,640 --> 00:49:45,200 Speaker 2: the twenty twenty four election I had frankly hoped it 732 00:49:45,280 --> 00:49:49,160 Speaker 2: was the twenty twenty election. I think because of COVID 733 00:49:49,200 --> 00:49:51,480 Speaker 2: and because of a whole host of you know, predominantly 734 00:49:51,480 --> 00:49:54,719 Speaker 2: because of COVID. I think that you know, some of that, 735 00:49:55,200 --> 00:50:01,080 Speaker 2: you know, we're going to break through this barrier, this 736 00:50:02,239 --> 00:50:04,359 Speaker 2: little regression that we've had along the way, I think 737 00:50:04,360 --> 00:50:06,520 Speaker 2: that that was slowed. And so for me, twenty twenty 738 00:50:06,560 --> 00:50:11,440 Speaker 2: four is really a question of you know, freedom and possibility, 739 00:50:11,680 --> 00:50:14,680 Speaker 2: and you know, a wide eyed view of the fact that, yeah, 740 00:50:14,760 --> 00:50:18,880 Speaker 2: eggs are more expensive, right, interest rates are high. Buying 741 00:50:18,920 --> 00:50:21,120 Speaker 2: a house for the first time if you're starting a 742 00:50:21,120 --> 00:50:22,200 Speaker 2: family is difficult. 743 00:50:22,280 --> 00:50:22,440 Speaker 1: Right. 744 00:50:22,760 --> 00:50:26,040 Speaker 2: I'm not saying everything is perfect. That's like, if you 745 00:50:26,239 --> 00:50:32,600 Speaker 2: truly love something, you are honest about it's imperfections, but 746 00:50:32,719 --> 00:50:35,920 Speaker 2: it is a devotion to making it better. And so 747 00:50:36,280 --> 00:50:39,880 Speaker 2: I think that the twenty twenty four elections are about 748 00:50:39,920 --> 00:50:44,080 Speaker 2: exactly that. Right, Are we going to have members of 749 00:50:44,120 --> 00:50:48,480 Speaker 2: Congress who love their country, who love their communities, who 750 00:50:48,560 --> 00:50:51,600 Speaker 2: love the people that they represent, whether they vote for 751 00:50:51,640 --> 00:50:55,799 Speaker 2: them or not, right, and will demonstrate respect day in 752 00:50:55,840 --> 00:50:58,239 Speaker 2: and day out. Because one of the things that I 753 00:50:58,239 --> 00:51:02,600 Speaker 2: think is most corrosive to our political system is the 754 00:51:02,640 --> 00:51:06,120 Speaker 2: fact that there is a disdain for people who disagree 755 00:51:06,160 --> 00:51:09,799 Speaker 2: with you. And I may listen to someone present me 756 00:51:09,840 --> 00:51:13,080 Speaker 2: with what I find to be the most objectionable opinion 757 00:51:13,560 --> 00:51:17,839 Speaker 2: or assessment, but like, what's at the heart of that? 758 00:51:18,800 --> 00:51:21,680 Speaker 2: And you know when it is something that is just 759 00:51:22,120 --> 00:51:25,239 Speaker 2: objectionable and violent or racist or anti semitic, Right, Like 760 00:51:25,280 --> 00:51:28,319 Speaker 2: there's obvious lines where you say, like no, sir, like 761 00:51:28,360 --> 00:51:31,360 Speaker 2: I will not even abide these sorts of comments. But 762 00:51:32,000 --> 00:51:35,040 Speaker 2: you know, when I had, as this has happened, had 763 00:51:35,080 --> 00:51:41,240 Speaker 2: a Vietnam veteran come to me after the twenty twenty 764 00:51:41,239 --> 00:51:48,520 Speaker 2: election and take me by the shoulders and like at 765 00:51:48,560 --> 00:51:52,160 Speaker 2: a Veterans Day event shortly after the election, and say, 766 00:51:52,239 --> 00:51:55,080 Speaker 2: I'm so worried. I'm so worried about our country. I'm 767 00:51:55,120 --> 00:51:59,279 Speaker 2: so worried. I think the election was stolen. Right, and 768 00:51:59,360 --> 00:52:02,200 Speaker 2: in the first part right, because I have in this 769 00:52:02,239 --> 00:52:04,799 Speaker 2: particular example, I have Vietnam veterans who come to me, 770 00:52:05,440 --> 00:52:09,040 Speaker 2: I'm so worried. I'm so worried I lost like dear 771 00:52:09,120 --> 00:52:13,480 Speaker 2: friends on the battlefield defending the ideals of democracy. And 772 00:52:13,520 --> 00:52:17,480 Speaker 2: I'm so worried because Donald Trump and the you know, 773 00:52:18,239 --> 00:52:20,839 Speaker 2: his supporters are undoing that. Right, I've heard that time 774 00:52:20,880 --> 00:52:25,480 Speaker 2: and time again. But this man came to me earnestly, 775 00:52:26,200 --> 00:52:30,480 Speaker 2: fearful and good for him, frankly that he was willing 776 00:52:30,520 --> 00:52:32,920 Speaker 2: to go to his Democratic congressoman because he was certainly 777 00:52:32,920 --> 00:52:36,520 Speaker 2: not a Democrat, and expressed an earnest fear. And I 778 00:52:36,520 --> 00:52:40,400 Speaker 2: think that where in advance of the twenty twenty four election, 779 00:52:40,960 --> 00:52:45,040 Speaker 2: being able to recognize that, you know, there are the 780 00:52:45,080 --> 00:52:48,160 Speaker 2: pied pipers who are leading people astray, right, and they're 781 00:52:48,160 --> 00:52:51,040 Speaker 2: a problem. But there are people who are listening to 782 00:52:51,080 --> 00:52:55,840 Speaker 2: their messages, who are concerned, who are worried, who are fearful, 783 00:52:55,920 --> 00:52:59,480 Speaker 2: are not the problem, who are not the problem, but 784 00:52:59,800 --> 00:53:02,960 Speaker 2: are the victims who are the victims of this ideology, 785 00:53:03,000 --> 00:53:05,719 Speaker 2: who are the victims of manipulation, you know, or who 786 00:53:05,880 --> 00:53:09,600 Speaker 2: just are taking on the information that they receive. And 787 00:53:09,840 --> 00:53:12,520 Speaker 2: we can't obviously talk one on one to every single person, 788 00:53:12,560 --> 00:53:15,640 Speaker 2: but to make sure that when we have someone come 789 00:53:15,680 --> 00:53:17,800 Speaker 2: to us, you know, be it in a TV and 790 00:53:17,880 --> 00:53:21,440 Speaker 2: or however, we can get the message out to demonstrate 791 00:53:21,960 --> 00:53:29,920 Speaker 2: extraordinary respect for people, extraordinary respect for our nation, and 792 00:53:30,000 --> 00:53:35,719 Speaker 2: an extraordinary level of commitment to continuing that path for progress. 793 00:53:36,000 --> 00:53:39,160 Speaker 2: You know, not oh no, everything's fine, nothing to see here, right, 794 00:53:39,600 --> 00:53:42,799 Speaker 2: a clear eyed view of the challenges we face, but 795 00:53:42,920 --> 00:53:46,240 Speaker 2: a deep commitment to make it, to make it better. 796 00:53:46,960 --> 00:53:49,919 Speaker 2: And I think that the twenty twenty four elections, Yes, 797 00:53:50,000 --> 00:53:52,760 Speaker 2: issues of the economy will be important because at times 798 00:53:52,840 --> 00:53:55,760 Speaker 2: that's the way people talk about things. Yes, abortion rights 799 00:53:55,800 --> 00:53:58,840 Speaker 2: will be important because it's a question of freedoms and 800 00:53:58,920 --> 00:54:02,719 Speaker 2: how people feel respect did or not respected within their society, 801 00:54:03,200 --> 00:54:07,600 Speaker 2: but foundationally it's do we believe in this system and 802 00:54:07,680 --> 00:54:09,919 Speaker 2: do we believe in the people. And this is where 803 00:54:09,960 --> 00:54:14,280 Speaker 2: there's a responsibility for members of Congress or any elected 804 00:54:14,280 --> 00:54:20,319 Speaker 2: official to just demonstrate good behavior and professionalism and a 805 00:54:20,400 --> 00:54:24,399 Speaker 2: commitment to doing right by people. And I think that 806 00:54:24,440 --> 00:54:27,520 Speaker 2: sometimes this gets back to, you know, how do you 807 00:54:27,560 --> 00:54:31,120 Speaker 2: separate that from, you know, sometimes the politics of it. 808 00:54:31,800 --> 00:54:36,920 Speaker 2: And I think the reality is, like I want my 809 00:54:37,160 --> 00:54:41,960 Speaker 2: children to grow up as proud of this country as 810 00:54:42,000 --> 00:54:44,960 Speaker 2: I was. As I grew up, right, my father had 811 00:54:45,000 --> 00:54:47,920 Speaker 2: been in the military. He was a federal law enforcement 812 00:54:48,120 --> 00:54:52,160 Speaker 2: officer my entire career. Like for me, it was how 813 00:54:52,160 --> 00:54:55,359 Speaker 2: do I serve my country like this place? Right? Like 814 00:54:55,760 --> 00:54:58,000 Speaker 2: when I was in I speak multiple languages every time 815 00:54:58,040 --> 00:55:01,160 Speaker 2: I was an exchange student, like languages, do you speak 816 00:55:01,560 --> 00:55:05,480 Speaker 2: flag badge on it? I'm like, proud to be the American. 817 00:55:06,040 --> 00:55:09,440 Speaker 2: I speak French, Spanish, and my German's pretty bad at 818 00:55:09,440 --> 00:55:11,680 Speaker 2: this point. And once upon a time I was highly 819 00:55:11,680 --> 00:55:14,600 Speaker 2: converse in Italian. I can still read it, but I 820 00:55:14,640 --> 00:55:17,680 Speaker 2: can get by in a lot of ways, but professional 821 00:55:17,719 --> 00:55:20,960 Speaker 2: conversations at this point French and Spanish. 822 00:55:21,000 --> 00:55:23,919 Speaker 1: But I wanted I wanted to ask you two last 823 00:55:24,000 --> 00:55:28,239 Speaker 1: questions the first. I was on a conference call yesterday 824 00:55:28,440 --> 00:55:32,160 Speaker 1: with two guys. One of them was a Democrat, another 825 00:55:32,239 --> 00:55:35,560 Speaker 1: old school but anti Trump Republican, but we share in commons. 826 00:55:35,560 --> 00:55:38,160 Speaker 1: We're all from New Jersey, which is where you're from. 827 00:55:38,160 --> 00:55:41,640 Speaker 1: And I said, I was interviewing you, and you left 828 00:55:41,640 --> 00:55:45,520 Speaker 1: New Jersey at age thirteen, and so there. 829 00:55:45,560 --> 00:55:46,719 Speaker 2: Was fact check you on that. 830 00:55:47,040 --> 00:55:47,360 Speaker 1: Okay. 831 00:55:47,800 --> 00:55:50,880 Speaker 2: I was born in New Jersey. I left as a baby, okay, 832 00:55:51,080 --> 00:55:54,800 Speaker 2: and then we moved back when I was kindergarten through 833 00:55:55,400 --> 00:55:58,040 Speaker 2: the middle of fourth grade. So I lived there twice 834 00:55:58,120 --> 00:55:59,279 Speaker 2: for little stints. 835 00:55:59,680 --> 00:56:01,719 Speaker 1: So so we had a question like did you did 836 00:56:01,760 --> 00:56:04,640 Speaker 1: you qualify as a Jersey Girl? When I said we 837 00:56:04,640 --> 00:56:07,319 Speaker 1: were when we were doing this, and the question right 838 00:56:07,400 --> 00:56:09,880 Speaker 1: because there was it was a mixed result on the vote, 839 00:56:10,320 --> 00:56:12,799 Speaker 1: and the question was to figure it out if you 840 00:56:13,000 --> 00:56:16,080 Speaker 1: if you qualified as a true Jersey girl, can you 841 00:56:16,200 --> 00:56:19,399 Speaker 1: name the exit number on the Parkway for Red Bank, 842 00:56:19,480 --> 00:56:20,080 Speaker 1: New Jersey? 843 00:56:20,480 --> 00:56:23,239 Speaker 2: All right? I have two comments to this. One the 844 00:56:23,320 --> 00:56:25,359 Speaker 2: day after I won. So I moved away from New 845 00:56:25,400 --> 00:56:27,319 Speaker 2: Jersey when I was nine years old. I lived there 846 00:56:27,320 --> 00:56:31,400 Speaker 2: for four years. I was born there, baby left when 847 00:56:31,400 --> 00:56:33,720 Speaker 2: I was nine months old. Then was there from five 848 00:56:33,800 --> 00:56:37,960 Speaker 2: to nine. The day after I won in twenty eighteen, 849 00:56:39,719 --> 00:56:42,760 Speaker 2: Governor Murphy called I get an unknown number. I answered 850 00:56:42,800 --> 00:56:46,120 Speaker 2: my phone and I hear from the governor of New Jersey. 851 00:56:46,680 --> 00:56:49,879 Speaker 2: Looks like a Jersey girl one in Virginia, I would say. 852 00:56:49,920 --> 00:56:54,640 Speaker 2: According to Governor Murphy, yes I qualify, but absolutely not. 853 00:56:54,719 --> 00:56:58,560 Speaker 2: I have no idea. But I lived at and worse 854 00:56:58,600 --> 00:57:04,959 Speaker 2: than that. I lived in Madawan, in Mammouth County. And 855 00:57:05,239 --> 00:57:07,919 Speaker 2: I was talking maybe this is two or three years 856 00:57:07,960 --> 00:57:11,320 Speaker 2: ago with my aunt and saying, oh, you know, I 857 00:57:11,400 --> 00:57:14,480 Speaker 2: always loved visiting you all because you were so close 858 00:57:14,520 --> 00:57:16,880 Speaker 2: to the water, and we would always go to the shore, 859 00:57:17,800 --> 00:57:20,800 Speaker 2: you know. And my aunt was like, you know, about 860 00:57:20,840 --> 00:57:23,880 Speaker 2: an hour and change away from me, And she looks 861 00:57:23,880 --> 00:57:28,000 Speaker 2: at me and said, Abigail, are you serious, to which 862 00:57:28,080 --> 00:57:31,920 Speaker 2: I said what, And she said, you were fifteen minutes 863 00:57:32,280 --> 00:57:35,320 Speaker 2: from the shore, like the entirety of the time you 864 00:57:35,400 --> 00:57:40,200 Speaker 2: lived in New Jersey. That's how bad my New Jersey 865 00:57:40,240 --> 00:57:44,440 Speaker 2: geography is. Well, and also in fairness, it's because I 866 00:57:44,480 --> 00:57:47,240 Speaker 2: sunburn and my parents hate the heat, so literally they 867 00:57:47,440 --> 00:57:50,800 Speaker 2: let me believe that the shore was over by my 868 00:57:50,840 --> 00:57:53,720 Speaker 2: aunt's house, when indeed we lived very close to it. 869 00:57:53,800 --> 00:57:56,240 Speaker 2: So I failed on that front, Gail. 870 00:57:56,360 --> 00:58:00,320 Speaker 1: But if the governor says you're a Jersey girl, it 871 00:58:00,400 --> 00:58:01,040 Speaker 1: must be so. 872 00:58:01,480 --> 00:58:03,720 Speaker 2: And I will say all my New Jersey people. My 873 00:58:04,360 --> 00:58:07,000 Speaker 2: parents were both originally from New Jersey. They longed the. 874 00:58:07,080 --> 00:58:10,480 Speaker 1: New Jersey people everywhere wherever you get on the somewhere 875 00:58:10,520 --> 00:58:11,600 Speaker 1: from New Jersey. 876 00:58:11,400 --> 00:58:14,560 Speaker 2: May Virginia home. Yes, that's true. 877 00:58:14,880 --> 00:58:17,360 Speaker 1: Here's my here's my last question for you. And I'm 878 00:58:17,400 --> 00:58:21,080 Speaker 1: curious about what you're thinking on this is as a 879 00:58:21,160 --> 00:58:27,520 Speaker 1: Republican back in the day when the party was a 880 00:58:27,640 --> 00:58:30,480 Speaker 1: conservative to moderate party. I grew up in New Jersey 881 00:58:30,600 --> 00:58:32,640 Speaker 1: moderate part of the party. But one of the one 882 00:58:32,680 --> 00:58:36,280 Speaker 1: of the issue differences in the era was on the 883 00:58:36,360 --> 00:58:41,800 Speaker 1: question of privatization. You know what what services are appropriate 884 00:58:42,520 --> 00:58:48,400 Speaker 1: right for government to privatize? What public private partnerships? And 885 00:58:48,440 --> 00:58:53,560 Speaker 1: there was an absolutist Democrat Union position was never there's 886 00:58:53,600 --> 00:59:00,800 Speaker 1: a Republican position of privatize everything. And I have evolved 887 00:59:00,880 --> 00:59:08,000 Speaker 1: on this issue in a way towards partnership but against 888 00:59:08,040 --> 00:59:12,560 Speaker 1: full privatization. There are some things like prisons, which I 889 00:59:12,600 --> 00:59:15,920 Speaker 1: think are the province of the state and that no 890 00:59:16,080 --> 00:59:20,880 Speaker 1: private company should ever be outsourced that. But you are 891 00:59:20,920 --> 00:59:28,520 Speaker 1: a serious national security person. I think that America's strategic 892 00:59:29,040 --> 00:59:35,120 Speaker 1: postures should be that we must maintain pre eminence in 893 00:59:35,200 --> 00:59:42,040 Speaker 1: the air, on the ground, in space, in cyberspace. When 894 00:59:42,080 --> 00:59:49,960 Speaker 1: you read about Elon Musk disabling an attack by the 895 00:59:50,080 --> 00:59:57,080 Speaker 1: Ukrainian military on the Russian fleet through his Starlank service 896 00:59:58,160 --> 01:00:04,240 Speaker 1: and the primacy of his position regarding America's space program, 897 01:00:05,320 --> 01:00:16,640 Speaker 1: it's reliance on him, the erratic behavior, the overt anti semitism. 898 01:00:16,800 --> 01:00:18,040 Speaker 1: Do we have a problem. 899 01:00:19,400 --> 01:00:23,959 Speaker 2: I think we have an absolutely significant problem. I think 900 01:00:24,000 --> 01:00:28,360 Speaker 2: that there's discussions related to privatization, and then there are 901 01:00:28,440 --> 01:00:33,000 Speaker 2: discussions about privatization that are also then wholly dependent on 902 01:00:33,000 --> 01:00:37,320 Speaker 2: one company, one person. Right, it's one thing to bring 903 01:00:37,360 --> 01:00:40,880 Speaker 2: in a variety of bids. It's one thing to say, okay, 904 01:00:40,960 --> 01:00:44,840 Speaker 2: you know the express lanes from DC to Fredericksburg, Like, 905 01:00:45,720 --> 01:00:48,920 Speaker 2: where can we work with private industry to build those out? Right, 906 01:00:49,480 --> 01:00:53,560 Speaker 2: That's very different from are we going to be able 907 01:00:53,600 --> 01:00:56,200 Speaker 2: to help our Ukrainian partners or will the whims and 908 01:00:56,280 --> 01:00:59,560 Speaker 2: pro Russia kind of position of one man impede that 909 01:01:00,160 --> 01:01:02,440 Speaker 2: when we're talking about are we going to be able 910 01:01:02,480 --> 01:01:07,520 Speaker 2: to get you know, our researchers and you know, items 911 01:01:07,600 --> 01:01:11,200 Speaker 2: up into space and it's dependent on you know, one 912 01:01:11,280 --> 01:01:14,360 Speaker 2: man and the whims that he may choose to take 913 01:01:14,760 --> 01:01:17,440 Speaker 2: you know, his company in a particular direction or another. 914 01:01:17,960 --> 01:01:21,920 Speaker 2: Right there. It is literally the I think example of 915 01:01:22,040 --> 01:01:25,280 Speaker 2: we've put all of our eggs in one basket. And 916 01:01:25,360 --> 01:01:29,400 Speaker 2: I honestly think there's something very interesting about you know, 917 01:01:29,400 --> 01:01:31,800 Speaker 2: if you look back about all of the articles about 918 01:01:31,800 --> 01:01:37,320 Speaker 2: Elon Musk, right, all of these effusive look at this 919 01:01:37,520 --> 01:01:41,640 Speaker 2: interesting genius right like, it was almost like the makings 920 01:01:41,640 --> 01:01:44,200 Speaker 2: of a Marvel movie, right the way that he is. 921 01:01:44,800 --> 01:01:47,360 Speaker 2: He was viewed as this like person who was doing 922 01:01:47,360 --> 01:01:52,240 Speaker 2: all these things. And I think that and I suppose 923 01:01:52,320 --> 01:01:55,760 Speaker 2: I would venture a guess that somebody in room somewhere 924 01:01:55,760 --> 01:01:57,920 Speaker 2: we're saying, hey, guys, wait, wait a sec is this 925 01:01:58,000 --> 01:02:01,800 Speaker 2: a good idea? But the reality of the way that 926 01:02:02,240 --> 01:02:04,360 Speaker 2: be it, you know, the United States tries to cut 927 01:02:04,440 --> 01:02:08,840 Speaker 2: costs or you know, streamline things, or you know, bring 928 01:02:08,840 --> 01:02:17,000 Speaker 2: in corporate partners or you know, unite business with government priorities, 929 01:02:17,400 --> 01:02:23,480 Speaker 2: Like there was a very significant gap I think in 930 01:02:23,520 --> 01:02:26,880 Speaker 2: the way that in this particular case with Elon Musk 931 01:02:26,960 --> 01:02:30,440 Speaker 2: between you know, his engagement in space and his engagement 932 01:02:30,440 --> 01:02:35,760 Speaker 2: with Starlink and you know, now Twitter right like he 933 01:02:35,960 --> 01:02:39,480 Speaker 2: has been. He's proven himself to be, uh, you know, 934 01:02:40,160 --> 01:02:44,040 Speaker 2: a highly unreliable partner. And there's one thing for there 935 01:02:44,080 --> 01:02:48,000 Speaker 2: to be public private partnerships. It's quite another when it's 936 01:02:48,280 --> 01:02:52,840 Speaker 2: public one man partnerships. And so I do think that 937 01:02:52,880 --> 01:02:57,160 Speaker 2: they're significant national security implications because you know what's next 938 01:02:57,200 --> 01:02:58,800 Speaker 2: for him, what does he choose to do or not 939 01:02:58,920 --> 01:02:59,440 Speaker 2: do next. 940 01:03:01,280 --> 01:03:03,720 Speaker 1: Well, I can't thank you enough for taking time out 941 01:03:03,720 --> 01:03:07,240 Speaker 1: of your schedule. I know how busy you are. One 942 01:03:07,280 --> 01:03:11,120 Speaker 1: of the very finest congresswomen. We have an outstanding member 943 01:03:11,160 --> 01:03:14,120 Speaker 1: of Congress, and thank you very much. 944 01:03:14,520 --> 01:03:16,440 Speaker 2: Thank you, Steve. I really appreciate the conversation.