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Speaker 1: Hey, what's up everybody.

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Speaker 2: I'm Jamel Hill and welcome to politics and I Heeart

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Speaker 2: Podcast and Unbothered Production.

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Speaker 1: Time to get spolitical.

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Speaker 2: The big story out of last week's NFL draft was

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Speaker 2: the fall of draft prospect Shadur Sanders. Now I put

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Speaker 2: fall in air quotes, because was it really a fall?

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Speaker 3: Now?

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Speaker 2: There have been plenty of takes and opinions about why

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Speaker 2: Shadur Sanders wasn't drafted early, including by my former colleague

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Speaker 2: Steven A. Smith, who said he was told by someone

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Speaker 2: he did not say whether or not they were affiliated

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Speaker 2: with the NFL, that Shador Sanders was the victim of

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Speaker 2: quote Kaeperneck level collusion. Now, even the President took some

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Speaker 2: time out from playing golf to chime in.

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Speaker 1: He wrote on truth Social.

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Speaker 2: His own social media platform, what is wrong with NFL owners?

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Speaker 1: Are they stupid?

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Speaker 2: Deon Sanders was a great college football player and was

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Speaker 2: even greater in the NFL.

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Speaker 1: He's also a very good coach, street.

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Speaker 2: Wise and smart. Wait did he say street wise? That

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Speaker 2: sounded very what you mean you people?

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Speaker 3: Now?

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Speaker 2: Donald Trump went on to say, therefore, Shadeur, his quarterback son,

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Speaker 2: has phenomenal genes and is all set for greatness. He

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Speaker 2: should be picked immediately by a team that wants to win.

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Speaker 2: Good luck, Shadeur, and say hello to your wonderful father Buck.

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Speaker 2: I got a lot of questions about that, but that's

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Speaker 2: a podcast for another day. But the gist of it

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Speaker 2: is that there seems to be a prevailing belief that

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Speaker 2: the NFL engaged in some kind of wide ranging conspiracy

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Speaker 2: to humiliate Shadur Sanders because they can't handle a young,

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Speaker 2: confident black man.

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Speaker 3: Now.

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Speaker 2: I have an extensive history of calling out the NFL

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Speaker 2: for its racism and for often undermining player empowerment. The

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Speaker 2: NFL is the last organization that deserves the benefit of

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Speaker 2: the doubt about practically anything. And yet I have a

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Speaker 2: hard time believing Shadir Sanders being drafted in the fifth

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Speaker 2: round had to do with race or some massive conspiracy. Yeah,

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Speaker 2: I know, I'm kind of surprised. I'm saying this too,

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Speaker 2: but hear me out. What we might have just witnessed

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Speaker 2: was a perfect storm for disaster, and not necessarily some

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Speaker 2: orchestrated plot to humble and humiliate Shador Sanders.

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Speaker 1: Let's be honest about something.

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Speaker 2: Shadur Sanders was never considered to be a bona fide

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Speaker 2: can't miss surefire first round pick. Never now reading what

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Speaker 2: mel Kuiper said, No disrespect is not the same as

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Speaker 2: listening to people whose jobs will be saved or lost

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Speaker 2: by the draft picks they select or don't select. Reports

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Speaker 2: were that Shador was initially graded as a second or

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Speaker 2: third round pick by the NFL. Now, for those who

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Speaker 2: don't know, if you are an NFL draft prospect, you

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Speaker 2: can personally ask the NFL to provide you with an

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Speaker 2: assessment of where you might be drafted. You get this

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Speaker 2: information before the pre process begins. And there were questions

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Speaker 2: about Shadeur's actual ability. While it's true he did not

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Speaker 2: have a great offensive line at Colorado, by NFL standards,

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Speaker 2: he was considered to have only a slightly above average

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Speaker 2: arm and good but not great athleticism. He's been coached

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Speaker 2: by his father his entire career, and yes, people in

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Speaker 2: the NFL wondered how he would adapt in a system

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Speaker 2: that wasn't guided by his father. Fair Now, these are

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Speaker 2: all legitimate questions that he had an opportunity to address

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Speaker 2: in the pre draft process, but according to reports, that

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Speaker 2: isn't exactly what he did. He apparently had some awful interviews,

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Speaker 2: with some speculating this was part of a concerted effort

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Speaker 2: to try to control where he was going to be drafted.

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Speaker 1: There are also teams he refused to interview with.

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Speaker 2: Now there's confidence, arrogance, and then shooting yourself in the

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Speaker 2: foot if there already is a debate about whether you

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Speaker 2: can be a starter or a franchise quarterback in this league,

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Speaker 2: Purposely performing poorly on interviews and refusing to interview with

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Speaker 2: certain teams only further proofs to NFL teams you ain't

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Speaker 2: that guy.

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Speaker 1: Now.

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Speaker 2: I'm not one to automatically believe certain narratives about players

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Speaker 2: before the NFL draft, because it seems like every draft

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Speaker 2: some bullshit narrative about a player's surfaces.

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Speaker 1: Out of nowhere.

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Speaker 2: I'm also old enough to remember when Miami Dolphins general

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Speaker 2: manager Jeff Ireland asked Dez Bryant, who was coming out

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Speaker 2: of Oklahoma State at the time, if his mother was

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Speaker 2: ever a prostitute, Knowing it was entirely possible that an

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Speaker 2: interview with Shadur might have gone sideways because of something

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Speaker 2: like that, I did my own reporting. I reached out

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Speaker 2: to an ex NFL player who is still well connected

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Speaker 2: in the league, and someone else who is in a

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Speaker 2: decision making capacity with an NFL team, and in case

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Speaker 2: it matters.

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Speaker 1: Both of them are black.

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Speaker 2: Both told me it was true that Shaduur at some

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Speaker 2: points made a mockery of the process and came off

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Speaker 2: as someone who thought he was far better than the

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Speaker 2: film indicated. Now in the NFL, confidence is a must,

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Speaker 2: especially at quarterback. Not forget that, Jess. Last year, people

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Speaker 2: were calling Caleb Williams, who last I checked, is black,

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Speaker 2: arrogant because of some of the things he said at

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Speaker 2: the NFL combine.

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Speaker 3: I didn't feel the need to go out and throw

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Speaker 3: I played around thirty some.

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Speaker 1: Games, I believe. Go ahead and go watch real, real,

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Speaker 1: live ball of me and see how I am as

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Speaker 1: a competitor.

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Speaker 2: Also, do I need to remind you of who Shador's

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Speaker 2: father is and what he said at his NFL draft.

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Speaker 3: Your feelings about going to Atlanta, no doubt it was

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Speaker 3: your first preference, definitely Lanta or Tampa Bay, and Atlanta

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Speaker 3: chose me, and I'm very pleased with At the season,

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Speaker 3: I can't wait to get to town. We called Campbell

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Speaker 3: and get with them fans down there and thank them

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Speaker 3: in there.

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Speaker 1: When Detroit took the other standards.

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Speaker 3: I saw, did grin come across your face? I was

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Speaker 3: so happy I was going, but I was kind of scared.

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Speaker 3: I thought the truck was gonna take me. I would

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Speaker 3: ask you so much money, and I had to put

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Speaker 3: me on their way. No baseball.

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Speaker 1: I'm glad there.

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Speaker 3: Huh.

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Speaker 1: That was in nineteen eighty nine.

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Speaker 2: So you mean to tell me that the NFL was

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Speaker 2: more tolerant of confident black men then, more so than

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Speaker 2: they are now. The issue isn't Schadeur's confidence, but his

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Speaker 2: lack of self awareness. Here's a breakdown from Charles Robinson,

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Speaker 2: a senior NFL writer for Yahoo who has been covering

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Speaker 2: the league for years. And if it helps, Charles and

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Speaker 2: I went to college together. I'm known forever and I

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Speaker 2: trust his reporting. Here's what Charles wrote. And while I

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Speaker 2: don't know the ins and outs of how Sanders's draft

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Speaker 2: process went with every team, I will say this. When

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Speaker 2: NFL Network chose to publicize visceral anonymous comments from a

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Speaker 2: handful of league sources about their discontent with sanders approach

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Speaker 2: and meetings or what they viewed as quote arrogance, I

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Speaker 2: wasn't shot. I also had heard some extremely negative opinions

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Speaker 2: about Sanders inside teams. Some dealt with his football evaluation

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Speaker 2: on the field. Others were about how he carried himself.

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Speaker 2: Still others were, and this can't be ignored, rooted in Sanders'

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Speaker 2: football career, having been guided at seemingly every step by

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Speaker 2: his father, Dion Sanders. For those looking for the one

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Speaker 2: thing that culminated in Shadeur's draft fall, there's going to

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Speaker 2: be disappointment, because I believe it was a different cocktail

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Speaker 2: for each franchise and maybe for every single evaluator who

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Speaker 2: was tasked with building a dossier on Shadeur. You can

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Speaker 2: find some who thought his decision to completely check out

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Speaker 2: of the combine was a massive mistake, born out of

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Speaker 2: him not understanding how his evaluations were really shaping up.

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Speaker 2: Others point to his interviews, his preparedness to face curve

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Speaker 2: balls when meeting with teams, or never having played for

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Speaker 2: a head coach at a high level of football, who

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Speaker 2: wasn't his father.

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Speaker 1: Not having an.

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Speaker 2: Agent to prepare him at the start of the process,

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Speaker 2: or then try to stop his fall at the end

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Speaker 2: of it might have been costly.

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Speaker 1: Some simply pointed.

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Speaker 2: To football evaluations that they believed or lacking like Charles

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Speaker 2: I also was done when last week the NFL networks

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Speaker 2: Tom Pellisero reported that an anonymous NFL assistant coach him

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Speaker 2: that leading up to the draft, Shadur had quote the

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Speaker 2: worst formal interview ever. Now, Shador Sanders has the right

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Speaker 2: to strategize as he sees fit, but his strategy backfire

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Speaker 2: because the people making decisions in the NFL did not

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Speaker 2: see Shador Sanders as being so talented that he could

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Speaker 2: completely disregard the evaluation process. We have endless examples of

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Speaker 2: the NFL excusing, rationalizing, or flat out ignoring practically anything

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Speaker 2: if a player is talented enough. In the twenty eleven draft,

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Speaker 2: a draft analyst for Pro Football Weekly wrote this about

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Speaker 2: Cam Newton. Very disingenuous, has a fake smile, comes off

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Speaker 2: as very scripted, and has a selfish meet first makeup.

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Speaker 2: Always knows where the cameras are and plays to them.

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Speaker 2: He has an enormous ego with a sense of entitlement

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Speaker 2: that continually invites trouble and makes him believe he is

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Speaker 2: above the law. Does not command respect from teammates and

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Speaker 2: will always struggle to win a locker room. Lacks accountability, focus,

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Speaker 2: and trustworthiness, is not punctual, seeks shortcuts and sets a

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Speaker 2: bad example, immature, and has had issues with authority. Not dependable.

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Speaker 2: I mean, damn that Cam Newton pee in his cornflakes.

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Speaker 2: So still his girl back in eighth grade. But guess

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Speaker 2: where Cam Newton went in the twenty eleven NFL draft. First,

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Speaker 2: Cam was a generational talent, so it didn't matter if

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Speaker 2: Nolan Nrocki wrote that Cam liked to beat baby seals

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Speaker 2: in his spare time because the Panthers were never going

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Speaker 2: to pass on him. Johnny Manziel was as cocky as

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Speaker 2: they come, but he also was the first freshman to

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Speaker 2: ever win the Heisman Trophy. Baker Mayfield another cocky dude,

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Speaker 2: number one overall pick, and in this year's draft, the

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Speaker 2: Baltimore Ravens selected edge rusher Mike Green in the second round,

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Speaker 2: who has twice faced sexual assault allegations. As much as

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Speaker 2: people want to use Eli Manning as an example of

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Speaker 2: the NFL's double standard, that comparison just doesn't hold up.

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Speaker 2: Eli Manning, who I put third on my Heisman bad

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Speaker 2: when I was a Heisman voter, was the consensus number

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Speaker 2: one overall pick. He made it clear he didn't want

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Speaker 2: to play in San Diego, who had the number one

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Speaker 2: pick in two thousand and four, The Giants traded for

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Speaker 2: Eli and the rest, as they say, is history fair

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Speaker 2: or not.

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Speaker 1: You can do that when you're the number one pick

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Speaker 1: because you have leverage.

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Speaker 2: Now, certainly, there were some quarterbacks taken before Shador Sanders,

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Speaker 2: such as Dylan Gabriel, who joins him in Cleveland, or

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Speaker 2: Tyler Show, who the Saints took with the fortieth overall

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Speaker 2: pick based on where he was drafted. NFL teams, though

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Speaker 2: did not see shaduor Sanders as a starter. That, of course,

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Speaker 2: doesn't mean they're right, and that doesn't mean that Shaduur

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Speaker 2: Sanders won't be a terrific NFL player. Jalen Hurts wasn't

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Speaker 2: a first round pick, and neither was Russell Wilson. Tom Brady,

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Speaker 2: who is one of Shaduur's mentors, is the greatest late

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Speaker 2: rown pick in NFL history, since he went on to

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Speaker 2: become the.

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Speaker 1: Greatest quarter back ever. I'm not naive.

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Speaker 2: Race is always a factor in America, and one of

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Speaker 2: those components of race is that black men have historically

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Speaker 2: and are presently considered a threat confidence on black men

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Speaker 2: is weighed and scrutinized much differently. The NFL, of all leads,

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Speaker 2: certainly doesn't deserve the benefit of the doubt considering their

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Speaker 2: poor racial track record. The NFL, damn sure ain't innocent,

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Speaker 2: But are they guilty of colluding against a player that

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Speaker 2: has yet to actually prove he.

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Speaker 1: Can play in the NFL? The answer is no.

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Speaker 2: Comparing Shadeur Sanders drafts lip to Colin Kaepernick being exil

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Speaker 2: from the league is just unseerious. Shardeur will get an

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Speaker 2: opportunity to play in the NFL. Colin Kaepernick likely never will.

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Speaker 2: Donald Trump tweeted his support for Shadeur Sanders, but he

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Speaker 2: had this to say about Colin Kaepernick, and you know.

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Speaker 4: Your San Francisco quarterback. I'm sure nobody ever heard of that.

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Speaker 4: I'm just reporting the news. There was an article today.

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Speaker 3: I love to report the news.

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Speaker 4: And then they said I made a mistake, right, I said, no,

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Speaker 4: the people reporting the news, madam second, it's wrong, But

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Speaker 4: there was an artic goal. Today is reported that NFL

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Speaker 4: elders don't want to pick them up because they don't

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Speaker 4: want to get a nasty tweet from Donald Trump.

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Speaker 2: Do you believe that Shador Sanders is not a freedom

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Speaker 2: fighter nor a political prisoner. He's a talented player with

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Speaker 2: a bright future, and now that he's with the Cleveland Browns,

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Speaker 2: he has an opportunity to prove that not only is

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Speaker 2: he a starter in the NFL, but he can make

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Speaker 2: a bunch of NFL teams look like fools. I'm Jamelle Hill,

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Speaker 2: and I.

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Speaker 1: Approve this message.

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Speaker 2: As you all have heard me mentioned many many times before,

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Speaker 2: I've become a golf fanatic, and my guest on this

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Speaker 2: episode is someone I met while hosting a golf event

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Speaker 2: last year in Washington, DC. She's incredibly talented and has

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Speaker 2: been on the professional golf circuit for a number of years,

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Speaker 2: a former long drive champion, but she has such a

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Speaker 2: compet telling story about how she got into golf and

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Speaker 2: how challenging it's been for her as a black woman

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Speaker 2: trying to compete in a majority white, wealthy sport. It's

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Speaker 2: created some mental health challenges for her, and she's spoken

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Speaker 2: so candidly about that part of it. Trust me, this

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Speaker 2: is a story that is absolutely worth you hearing. Coming

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Speaker 2: up next on Spolitics, Alexis Belton. So Alexis, I'm going

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Speaker 2: to start this podcast by asking you a question that

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Speaker 2: I asked every guest who appears on politics, and that

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Speaker 2: is name an athlete or a moment that made you

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Speaker 2: love sports.

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Speaker 3: That's a great question. I would have to go with,

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Speaker 3: not necessarily an athlete, but a moment that made me

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Speaker 3: love sports was the Battle of the Bands that was

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Speaker 3: hosted between Southern and Grandlin every year. My dad was

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Speaker 3: a chairman of Southern, but then also we lived in

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Speaker 3: Grand Lane resting area. That whole atmosphere gave me the

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Speaker 3: love for sport and ever since then that's been in

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Speaker 3: every sport. I want to see about old bands.

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Speaker 1: Do you want to see it? Yeah?

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Speaker 2: No, I mean and for people who have not seen

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Speaker 2: that's it's truly remarkable.

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Speaker 3: Yea.

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Speaker 2: And because I was, I felt like I was late.

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Speaker 2: I didn't go to my first black college football game

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Speaker 2: until I was in my early twenties. I mean, I

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Speaker 2: went to a PWI so I went to Michigan State,

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Speaker 2: so obviously didn't get to experience that there. And you know,

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Speaker 2: I went to the North Carolina Central North Carolina A

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Speaker 2: and tea game and I was like, oh my.

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Speaker 1: God, this is different. This is so different. The food.

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Speaker 1: I mean, oh we tailgated.

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Speaker 2: It's the only football game I've been to where everybody

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Speaker 2: was tailgating pretty much most of the first half.

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Speaker 1: But when it was half for the band to perform,

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Speaker 1: everybody in.

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Speaker 2: Yeah, you stay for a little while, then you go back,

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Speaker 2: you go back out finished jail gate, and I was like,

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Speaker 2: I ain't never tailgate. It just hard about life, right, So,

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Speaker 2: but it was a wonderful experience. So it's great that

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Speaker 2: you have like such a presient memory of that.

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Speaker 1: On your Facebook page.

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Speaker 2: You described sort of your childhood loosely a saying we had,

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Speaker 2: you know, basically your family's passionate about two things, a

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Speaker 2: love for Jesus and sports.

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Speaker 1: Right, So tell me what it.

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Speaker 2: Was like for you growing up in Ruston or Ruston area.

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Speaker 1: Yeah.

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Speaker 3: I think it's just true Southern culture, Like we're Bible

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Speaker 3: Belt Louisiana and so everything that came with that, being

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Speaker 3: so close to the historic Grandmain state. But then also

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Speaker 3: right there with Louisiana Tech. So I grew up watching

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Speaker 3: you know, kem Olki and Theresa Weatherspoon and coach Barmore.

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Speaker 3: My dream was to just like be able to play

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Speaker 3: basketball under coach Barmore, and right when I was had

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Speaker 3: that ability he retired, and at the same time, I'm

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Speaker 3: you know Eddie Robinson, you know, just the history of

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Speaker 3: that and watching as I grew older and seeing everyone

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Speaker 3: getting this Eddie Robinson Award and knowing who he was

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Speaker 3: as icon and you can go down the list of

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Speaker 3: such a small town having such a rich history and

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Speaker 3: sport that also had an a rich history and like

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Speaker 3: values and so yeah, growing up in Ruslon was interesting

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Speaker 3: because even though there was still division, my parents were

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Speaker 3: the first, one of the first African Americans have their

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Speaker 3: own law firm, and watching what my mom went through that,

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Speaker 3: I think there's they both struggled, but watching a black

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Speaker 3: woman go through that was a lot different. And if

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Speaker 3: there's one thing that unified everybody even before even before religion,

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Speaker 3: was sports, So I think that was really interesting. And

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Speaker 3: then growing up going to school in West Monroe instead

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Speaker 3: of Ruston was also a culture or shock, even though

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Speaker 3: it's thirty minutes away where when I first moved there

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Speaker 3: to play basketball, the mascot was a rebel flag and

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Speaker 3: going to a school where some of the students didn't

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Speaker 3: know what that was, some of even like my black teammates,

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Speaker 3: but then also holding this opportunity that sports allowed to get.

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Speaker 3: The floor changes in the basketball gym because I wouldn't

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Speaker 3: play on it, or different things like that. So it

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Speaker 3: was a very interesting childhood. But at the end of

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Speaker 3: the day, not only do I see the power of sport,

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Speaker 3: but also saw how it can bring people together and

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Speaker 3: how it can change something that already existed.

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Speaker 2: You are a I think your dad is a district attorney.

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Speaker 2: Is yeah, yep, your dad's a district attorney. And obviously

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Speaker 2: the lawyering is a lineage in your family. And seeing

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Speaker 2: as you just alluded to seeing your mother go through

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Speaker 2: the struggle she did, seeing your father, and what having

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Speaker 2: these positions meant, and what it meant to be black

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Speaker 2: and having those positions, how did seeing what your parents

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Speaker 2: went through and living in the area you were in,

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Speaker 2: how did that shape or inform your attitudes about race?

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Speaker 3: That's a great question. They were so active, like you know,

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Speaker 3: going back to my dad be a full Southern night,

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Speaker 3: a full jag who also at times was you know,

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Speaker 3: a tiger. Just all the things were very interesting, But

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Speaker 3: I think they had me rooted so much into my

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Speaker 3: heritage and not even just like my overall what it

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Speaker 3: is to be African American. But just like first let's

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Speaker 3: look at our own history. Like my grandfather was a pioneer.

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Speaker 3: They lived in the first brick house built, and the small,

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Speaker 3: small small town called Bazil that doesn't even have a stoplight,

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Speaker 3: only has you know a stop sign that you will

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Speaker 3: probably drive straight through. And to watch my grandfather be

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Speaker 3: an entrepreneur and do all these different things but also

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Speaker 3: wrestle with his own struggles and come to terms with

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Speaker 3: those things and make a better future for my dad,

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Speaker 3: and my dad doing the same thing for me. But

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Speaker 3: it all comes through knowing where you come from. And

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Speaker 3: so I think they did such a great job of

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Speaker 3: not only say like, hey, we want to make this

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Speaker 3: better for you, but you have to understand where you're

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Speaker 3: coming from.

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Speaker 2: So having that sense of your identity as you talked about,

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Speaker 2: then you go to West Monroe to play basketball, even

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Speaker 2: though we know that wasn't the sport you eventually sort

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Speaker 2: of unfortunately, yeah, onto necessarily or let's go on in

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Speaker 2: a different way. But having that experience growing up there

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Speaker 2: and seeing what your parents did, and you say you

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Speaker 2: described them as active, how did you make the decision,

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Speaker 2: be it conscious or unconscious, to begin to use your

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Speaker 2: voice within the realm of sports to push for change.

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Speaker 3: Yeah, I think it was unconscious. I think like for

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Speaker 3: a lot of it, you see something happening for one

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Speaker 3: person or one group and then you think, well, wait

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Speaker 3: a minute, y'all not eat at the gas stations, even

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Speaker 3: though we're champions, but we hit the gas station. You know.

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Speaker 3: It's just like learning little things like that. And I

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Speaker 3: think obviously always going back to the way that my

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Speaker 3: parents raised me was just like, oh, if you see

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Speaker 3: something wrong, fix it and if you can't fix it,

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Speaker 3: find people that can. And I think that's what it

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Speaker 3: came down to, is how do we make impact with sport.

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Speaker 3: I think there's a facade of like we'll brand it,

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Speaker 3: but we won't fix it. We'll brand it being fixed,

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Speaker 3: but we won't fix the problem. And to actually fix

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Speaker 3: it means that you have to go through the ebbs

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Speaker 3: and flows of it. And so going to school that

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Speaker 3: again had like rebel flags, as you know, it's like saying, hey,

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Speaker 3: I'm not wearing that we're having a rebel flag parade.

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Speaker 3: I'm not attending that, even though you might think that

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Speaker 3: I need to be there. I'm going to also educate

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Speaker 3: you in this because there's an ignorance that exists within that.

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Speaker 3: And so I think that sparked my love for what

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Speaker 3: not only just sports, but what we can do with

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Speaker 3: those around us in order to make change, like genuine change.

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Speaker 3: And then whenever I started playing golf and I had

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Speaker 3: kind of one of the peaks in my career, I

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Speaker 3: thought that that would give me a platform for change,

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Speaker 3: and I realized it doesn't. You have to be the

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Speaker 3: one to initiate, create, and hopefully lead that challenge for people.

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Speaker 2: So when you drew that boundary about not wanting to

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Speaker 2: participate in things because of the shadow of the rebel flag,

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Speaker 2: how was that received?

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Speaker 3: Not well? Obviously? I think I think it was not

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Speaker 3: received well because it was a part of people's identity.

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Speaker 3: Even though it wasn't the value might not have been

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Speaker 3: a part of their identity. So it's kind of like

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Speaker 3: when you see a sports team change a mascot, right,

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Speaker 3: it's like, you can this is an abomination. You can't

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Speaker 3: do this, even though there's no like, that's not a frog,

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Speaker 3: has nothing to do with a person. And I think

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Speaker 3: that is what I saw was like, Okay, one, it's

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Speaker 3: your identity. Is this this rebel flag? And even though

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Speaker 3: you might not be attached to it from a value standpoint.

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Speaker 3: Once you learn and you agree to be attached, that's

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Speaker 3: when the issue kind of arises. And I think it

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00:22:23,480 --> 00:22:26,000
Speaker 3: was just like having a lot of hard conversations, but

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Speaker 3: then also, yeah, just refusing to show up at things

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Speaker 3: that continued to kind of follow that it's never met

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Speaker 3: with anything. Well, it's it's always like, what's wrong with you?

421
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Speaker 3: Why do you have to be difficult? And I think

422
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Speaker 3: also that in that tension, battling not trying to be

423
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Speaker 3: a not trying to be labeled as a strong, you know,

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Speaker 3: black woman in the context of what society has named

425
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Speaker 3: that I didn't want to be. She's a difficult black woman, this, this,

426
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Speaker 3: and this, so juggling that even within golf has been difficult.

427
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Speaker 3: So I'm like, oh, I'm just being myself, but I'm

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Speaker 3: also trying to implement something that might help increase a

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Speaker 3: lot of the initiatives that y'all say want to be increased.

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Speaker 1: Yeah, and we're we're gonna definitely get to that part

431
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Speaker 1: of it. But I guess to.

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Speaker 2: To to unpack it off, how do how do you

433
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Speaker 2: go from being a basketball player to then becoming a

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Speaker 2: professional golfer.

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Speaker 3: Yeah, that's a great question, because I never saw it

436
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Speaker 3: in my future. Whenever I was like, what is my

437
00:23:30,200 --> 00:23:35,399
Speaker 3: future hold, I was junior high school and I wanted

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Speaker 3: to think it around junior high school and I wanted

439
00:23:37,160 --> 00:23:41,040
Speaker 3: to I was taking my health class, which is in Louisiana,

440
00:23:41,600 --> 00:23:43,800
Speaker 3: you have a health class, you have your.

441
00:23:43,760 --> 00:23:46,120
Speaker 1: Hunting class, you have a hunting class, you.

442
00:23:46,080 --> 00:23:48,359
Speaker 3: Have a hunting class. So the same year you're in health,

443
00:23:48,400 --> 00:23:51,240
Speaker 3: you're also getting your hunting license, whether you use it

444
00:23:51,320 --> 00:23:53,560
Speaker 3: or not, which is very interesting. That's another topic for

445
00:23:53,600 --> 00:23:59,399
Speaker 3: another day. But my health teacher, who also was the

446
00:23:59,400 --> 00:24:02,360
Speaker 3: football code, who also was the history teacher, right, and

447
00:24:02,359 --> 00:24:04,520
Speaker 3: the golf coach was like, hey, we need an extra

448
00:24:04,560 --> 00:24:07,119
Speaker 3: girl to play on the golf team to make it

449
00:24:07,160 --> 00:24:09,920
Speaker 3: a team. And I was like, now, that's for old

450
00:24:09,920 --> 00:24:13,600
Speaker 3: white men. And he was like, well, you get out

451
00:24:13,600 --> 00:24:16,960
Speaker 3: of school all day, you get free food, and you

452
00:24:17,000 --> 00:24:18,800
Speaker 3: get to pick your outfit. And I'd never been to

453
00:24:18,800 --> 00:24:21,040
Speaker 3: a country club before, so I was like, you should

454
00:24:21,080 --> 00:24:23,160
Speaker 3: have led with that. Why would you lead with golf?

455
00:24:23,640 --> 00:24:27,679
Speaker 3: Lead with the ladder? And that's how I fell in

456
00:24:27,680 --> 00:24:30,160
Speaker 3: love with the game of golf, and then from there,

457
00:24:30,480 --> 00:24:32,879
Speaker 3: my high school basketball coach told me it was a

458
00:24:32,880 --> 00:24:34,600
Speaker 3: bad idea to play golf that was going to ruin

459
00:24:34,640 --> 00:24:38,560
Speaker 3: a basketball career. In hindsight, like as an adult, I

460
00:24:38,600 --> 00:24:40,719
Speaker 3: realized like he was coming from the best place. But

461
00:24:41,400 --> 00:24:43,440
Speaker 3: for me that was a challenge. Is it's always a

462
00:24:43,480 --> 00:24:46,159
Speaker 3: challenge when you say you can't. And so I was like, well,

463
00:24:47,040 --> 00:24:50,320
Speaker 3: I'll just get a scholarship in golf and I'll quit basketball,

464
00:24:50,920 --> 00:24:53,199
Speaker 3: which my parents were met with tears of like, we

465
00:24:53,520 --> 00:24:55,800
Speaker 3: put you in aau and we put so much money

466
00:24:55,800 --> 00:24:59,159
Speaker 3: into this, and golf was expensive. Do you know how

467
00:24:59,200 --> 00:25:03,160
Speaker 3: much a golf club coss versus of basketball? And they

468
00:25:03,160 --> 00:25:05,639
Speaker 3: were supportive with that because that was my dad's first

469
00:25:05,680 --> 00:25:11,359
Speaker 3: love whenever he became a young adult, and so it

470
00:25:11,480 --> 00:25:13,199
Speaker 3: brought him back to it and brought kind of a

471
00:25:13,200 --> 00:25:14,040
Speaker 3: connection for us.

472
00:25:14,600 --> 00:25:18,200
Speaker 2: So obviously, I'm sure you looked around the landscape because

473
00:25:18,200 --> 00:25:21,080
Speaker 2: it was why your initial reaction was, Hey.

474
00:25:21,640 --> 00:25:24,200
Speaker 1: There's this is a this is a sport for white me,

475
00:25:24,320 --> 00:25:26,200
Speaker 1: and like, you know why me?

476
00:25:26,560 --> 00:25:29,679
Speaker 2: Yeah, So looking at what the landscape was and the

477
00:25:29,680 --> 00:25:32,400
Speaker 2: fact that you don't have a lot of people of color,

478
00:25:32,480 --> 00:25:34,719
Speaker 2: not a lot of black people, and certainly not a

479
00:25:34,720 --> 00:25:36,480
Speaker 2: lot of black women in this sport.

480
00:25:36,720 --> 00:25:39,919
Speaker 1: What gave you the confidence that you belonged in it.

481
00:25:40,640 --> 00:25:44,280
Speaker 3: I think golf in general, if you find yourself having

482
00:25:44,280 --> 00:25:47,440
Speaker 3: the opportunity to play, and if you have some sort

483
00:25:47,480 --> 00:25:51,440
Speaker 3: of competitiveness in you, like if you go home and play,

484
00:25:51,480 --> 00:25:53,680
Speaker 3: you know, with your family and you're the one that's

485
00:25:53,720 --> 00:25:58,080
Speaker 3: the loudest, you're gonna love golf. And so the initial

486
00:25:58,119 --> 00:26:01,399
Speaker 3: love of golf and drive of golf was definitely the

487
00:26:01,400 --> 00:26:06,119
Speaker 3: competitive aspect, like it's all on me. You hit it

488
00:26:06,160 --> 00:26:08,239
Speaker 3: one time in the center of the club face and

489
00:26:08,240 --> 00:26:12,560
Speaker 3: you're like, I'm Tiger Woods. And so that's what gave

490
00:26:12,600 --> 00:26:15,919
Speaker 3: me the original love for the game without even having

491
00:26:15,960 --> 00:26:20,919
Speaker 3: to see representation. And I think moving forward in that

492
00:26:21,200 --> 00:26:25,440
Speaker 3: is like it's it's a twofold of trying to find

493
00:26:25,520 --> 00:26:29,000
Speaker 3: history about black golfers, which is really hard. It was

494
00:26:29,040 --> 00:26:31,320
Speaker 3: just like, oh, we just have Tiger is that it

495
00:26:31,440 --> 00:26:34,679
Speaker 3: I don't I've never heard of anybody else. And then

496
00:26:34,720 --> 00:26:37,800
Speaker 3: there's this other thing that exists that's really hard for

497
00:26:38,320 --> 00:26:41,600
Speaker 3: specifically black women, is like, oh, I need to carry

498
00:26:41,600 --> 00:26:45,760
Speaker 3: the shoulders of being the first. And so I think

499
00:26:47,119 --> 00:26:49,159
Speaker 3: getting into the game and trying to figure out what

500
00:26:49,200 --> 00:26:52,480
Speaker 3: representation looked like was a mix of both of like, Okay,

501
00:26:52,560 --> 00:26:54,560
Speaker 3: there's tiger and I feel like I should follow that,

502
00:26:55,080 --> 00:26:57,720
Speaker 3: and there's this other of like, but then I also

503
00:26:57,720 --> 00:26:59,720
Speaker 3: have the shoulders of everyone who's behind me. But I'm

504
00:27:00,160 --> 00:27:03,359
Speaker 3: only sixteen. There's nobody behind me, you know which is

505
00:27:03,359 --> 00:27:05,800
Speaker 3: I always tell the little girls. Now, I'm like, just

506
00:27:06,040 --> 00:27:08,520
Speaker 3: have fun. You don't have the nothing's on, you don't

507
00:27:08,560 --> 00:27:10,240
Speaker 3: have weight on you. Right now, it's chill.

508
00:27:11,640 --> 00:27:15,840
Speaker 1: So yeah, So you you wound up though, leaving West

509
00:27:15,920 --> 00:27:18,080
Speaker 1: Monroe and you went to was it Texas Wesleyan?

510
00:27:18,680 --> 00:27:21,760
Speaker 3: Yep, I finish. I finished college. So I actually went

511
00:27:21,800 --> 00:27:26,159
Speaker 3: to a small school in Mobile. It was my first stop,

512
00:27:26,840 --> 00:27:30,320
Speaker 3: and there was in the first semester I was recruited

513
00:27:30,320 --> 00:27:32,359
Speaker 3: by a younger coach and there was an older coach there,

514
00:27:33,080 --> 00:27:36,320
Speaker 3: and the older coach had built that program, and so

515
00:27:36,600 --> 00:27:39,439
Speaker 3: my goal was like to go there hopefully transfer I

516
00:27:39,680 --> 00:27:41,600
Speaker 3: you know, we didn't have no portal and I all

517
00:27:41,680 --> 00:27:47,600
Speaker 3: back to But yeah, so while I was there, the

518
00:27:47,680 --> 00:27:50,080
Speaker 3: older gentleman had a really big struggle with me being

519
00:27:50,119 --> 00:27:53,479
Speaker 3: on the team, and so he actually, my teammates would say,

520
00:27:53,480 --> 00:27:55,600
Speaker 3: he was used slurs of the N word. And then

521
00:27:55,880 --> 00:27:58,119
Speaker 3: it wasn't until he got really frustrated with me and

522
00:27:58,200 --> 00:27:59,960
Speaker 3: kind of threw my club down, called me the N word.

523
00:28:00,119 --> 00:28:03,000
Speaker 3: I called my mom, which is now I think about it,

524
00:28:03,040 --> 00:28:05,400
Speaker 3: probably should have called my dad first, because she was like, oh,

525
00:28:05,600 --> 00:28:07,440
Speaker 3: oh real quick. My dad would have been a little

526
00:28:07,440 --> 00:28:09,240
Speaker 3: bit more like, Okay, how are we gonna what are

527
00:28:09,240 --> 00:28:09,639
Speaker 3: we gonna do?

528
00:28:09,960 --> 00:28:11,040
Speaker 1: Mom was ready to run.

529
00:28:11,160 --> 00:28:13,720
Speaker 3: Mom was like, I'm on my way, I got the keys,

530
00:28:13,800 --> 00:28:18,199
Speaker 3: let's go, and she was. She was there really shortly afterwards.

531
00:28:18,880 --> 00:28:21,159
Speaker 3: But I wrote a letter to the ad and I

532
00:28:21,160 --> 00:28:23,480
Speaker 3: was like, Hey, this is the situation. How do we

533
00:28:23,520 --> 00:28:24,840
Speaker 3: move forward from here? And they're like, oh, you just

534
00:28:24,840 --> 00:28:26,879
Speaker 3: have to understand he's from a different generation.

535
00:28:27,080 --> 00:28:29,399
Speaker 1: Also, and so they wanted you to tolerate it.

536
00:28:29,960 --> 00:28:34,280
Speaker 3: Yeah. Yeah, my mom's name is Alana, so is it

537
00:28:34,359 --> 00:28:36,919
Speaker 3: mam Alana. She was like, yeah, we're not. You're going

538
00:28:36,960 --> 00:28:40,640
Speaker 3: to take your finals at home online and we're going

539
00:28:40,680 --> 00:28:42,560
Speaker 3: to find you somewhere else to go. And so I

540
00:28:42,600 --> 00:28:44,600
Speaker 3: had kind of a lull in between that season and

541
00:28:44,600 --> 00:28:47,320
Speaker 3: then finished at Texas Westland.

542
00:28:47,680 --> 00:28:49,040
Speaker 1: So how did you process all that?

543
00:28:49,160 --> 00:28:51,640
Speaker 2: I mean, here you are, I mean you're a young person,

544
00:28:51,720 --> 00:28:54,280
Speaker 2: and I know even though you grew up in the

545
00:28:54,720 --> 00:28:58,280
Speaker 2: the Deep South and growing up in the Bible Belt,

546
00:28:58,320 --> 00:29:01,160
Speaker 2: and I'm sure that wasn't your first encounter with people

547
00:29:02,000 --> 00:29:05,040
Speaker 2: like that, but for it to be just so blatant

548
00:29:05,080 --> 00:29:08,280
Speaker 2: and so on your face and more even worse in

549
00:29:08,320 --> 00:29:11,320
Speaker 2: the space of a sport you were, you know that

550
00:29:11,360 --> 00:29:14,040
Speaker 2: you love, Like, how did you emotionally process that?

551
00:29:14,920 --> 00:29:17,680
Speaker 3: I think I've I don't think I emotionally processed that

552
00:29:18,000 --> 00:29:22,560
Speaker 3: up until maybe like five years ago. For me, I

553
00:29:22,600 --> 00:29:24,560
Speaker 3: was just like, this is the weight that comes with

554
00:29:24,600 --> 00:29:27,160
Speaker 3: being a black female in the golf world. Everyone has

555
00:29:27,200 --> 00:29:31,280
Speaker 3: some sort of story, and especially when you're pursuing collegiate

556
00:29:31,360 --> 00:29:34,800
Speaker 3: or professional, especially when pursued professional, is like someone has

557
00:29:34,800 --> 00:29:39,200
Speaker 3: a story similar to that. So the process of that

558
00:29:39,360 --> 00:29:42,400
Speaker 3: was like, Okay, well what do I do next? Did

559
00:29:42,400 --> 00:29:44,600
Speaker 3: I do everything that I was supposed to do? And

560
00:29:44,640 --> 00:29:46,959
Speaker 3: it's more of an internal look too, because you're like

561
00:29:47,000 --> 00:29:48,680
Speaker 3: I was a young woman who was trying to figure

562
00:29:48,720 --> 00:29:50,920
Speaker 3: out who I am in life, you know, thinking that

563
00:29:50,960 --> 00:29:56,320
Speaker 3: I knew everything and there was apart met to it

564
00:29:56,440 --> 00:29:58,720
Speaker 3: is like what's wrong with me? And the way that

565
00:29:58,760 --> 00:30:00,800
Speaker 3: I approached the game of golf was like I need

566
00:30:00,840 --> 00:30:04,640
Speaker 3: to be tolerable for people. How do I come and

567
00:30:04,640 --> 00:30:08,440
Speaker 3: and be in golf spaces. But make sure that you

568
00:30:08,480 --> 00:30:12,000
Speaker 3: know almost to the point where my personality wasn't there,

569
00:30:12,120 --> 00:30:14,560
Speaker 3: that I just showed up and I lived like, how

570
00:30:14,560 --> 00:30:16,400
Speaker 3: do I present as a country club person so I

571
00:30:16,440 --> 00:30:18,200
Speaker 3: can be accepted, so I can get what I need?

572
00:30:18,760 --> 00:30:22,080
Speaker 3: And it wasn't until Long Drive. It wasn't until maybe

573
00:30:22,120 --> 00:30:23,640
Speaker 3: a few years ago where I was like, oh, I

574
00:30:23,640 --> 00:30:24,800
Speaker 3: can be myself. That's okay.

575
00:30:25,880 --> 00:30:30,760
Speaker 2: So you initially started college on a basketball scholarship, So

576
00:30:30,800 --> 00:30:33,400
Speaker 2: how did you make the golf scholarship?

577
00:30:33,600 --> 00:30:34,960
Speaker 1: Like that part of it happened.

578
00:30:34,960 --> 00:30:38,720
Speaker 3: Actually it turned down my basketball scholarship. You turned it down.

579
00:30:38,760 --> 00:30:42,720
Speaker 3: I turned it down, Yeah, fully turned it down, turned

580
00:30:42,720 --> 00:30:45,760
Speaker 3: down full ride. I was like, I work until.

581
00:30:45,480 --> 00:30:47,280
Speaker 1: I got to where were you supposed to go?

582
00:30:48,040 --> 00:30:51,080
Speaker 3: I had an opportunity to play at Baylor because Kim

583
00:30:51,080 --> 00:30:54,320
Speaker 3: Olkie was there. But the crazy part about that is

584
00:30:54,320 --> 00:30:58,120
Speaker 3: that so I had like Baylor, Louisiana Tack a few

585
00:30:58,160 --> 00:31:00,880
Speaker 3: other schools that were options, but those two like a favorite,

586
00:31:01,280 --> 00:31:07,240
Speaker 3: and Kim Kim was asked the coach at Louisiana Tech.

587
00:31:07,280 --> 00:31:09,480
Speaker 3: But back then, like they didn't have the resources to

588
00:31:09,600 --> 00:31:12,880
Speaker 3: like give the little extra and so coach Barmore had

589
00:31:12,880 --> 00:31:16,200
Speaker 3: retired and played and coached as an assistant coach for

590
00:31:16,280 --> 00:31:19,720
Speaker 3: kim Olki, and I was like an opportunity to play

591
00:31:19,760 --> 00:31:23,680
Speaker 3: for coach Barmore, this is amazing, and then turned that

592
00:31:23,760 --> 00:31:26,680
Speaker 3: down full circle. Long story short is that now gets

593
00:31:26,680 --> 00:31:29,440
Speaker 3: a golf with coach Barmore, which was like really cool

594
00:31:29,560 --> 00:31:32,040
Speaker 3: going back to Louisiana. But yeah, so I turned down

595
00:31:32,080 --> 00:31:34,400
Speaker 3: the scholarship in order to try and create a path

596
00:31:34,440 --> 00:31:35,040
Speaker 3: within golf.

597
00:31:35,320 --> 00:31:35,640
Speaker 1: Wow.

598
00:31:37,240 --> 00:31:40,960
Speaker 2: When you think about that decision now in hindsight, is

599
00:31:40,960 --> 00:31:44,520
Speaker 2: there any part of you that is curious or wonders

600
00:31:44,560 --> 00:31:46,920
Speaker 2: how it might have turned out if you pursued basketball

601
00:31:47,520 --> 00:31:47,920
Speaker 2: without it.

602
00:31:47,920 --> 00:31:50,120
Speaker 3: Doubt I think that at the end of the day,

603
00:31:51,360 --> 00:31:54,640
Speaker 3: going back to like small town, I didn't know a

604
00:31:54,680 --> 00:31:57,000
Speaker 3: lot of things that existed. So I'd gotten a letter

605
00:31:57,040 --> 00:31:59,280
Speaker 3: in from like Brown University, and all I knew was

606
00:31:59,280 --> 00:32:00,760
Speaker 3: that it was just cool up there. And that's not

607
00:32:00,840 --> 00:32:03,520
Speaker 3: meant for me, you know. Like I had had a

608
00:32:03,520 --> 00:32:05,320
Speaker 3: lot of letters from a lot of schools, I just

609
00:32:05,360 --> 00:32:08,280
Speaker 3: didn't know what they were, fully, Like I didn't know

610
00:32:08,760 --> 00:32:13,640
Speaker 3: what IVY League was or anything like that. And with that,

611
00:32:13,720 --> 00:32:15,600
Speaker 3: I didn't know that you could do multiple things, Like

612
00:32:15,600 --> 00:32:19,040
Speaker 3: I didn't know, like I thought especially small town sports

613
00:32:19,120 --> 00:32:21,960
Speaker 3: rules like you're either a football player, you're either you know,

614
00:32:22,600 --> 00:32:25,400
Speaker 3: a cheerleader, You're either this, you're either that. And even

615
00:32:25,440 --> 00:32:28,400
Speaker 3: though I played an array of sports whatever that was offered,

616
00:32:28,480 --> 00:32:31,560
Speaker 3: from dance to anything, it was just like I have

617
00:32:31,640 --> 00:32:34,560
Speaker 3: to pick one. Now, as I look back, I probably

618
00:32:34,560 --> 00:32:35,320
Speaker 3: would have done at all.

619
00:32:36,000 --> 00:32:39,600
Speaker 2: So what at one point did you feel like you

620
00:32:39,640 --> 00:32:42,640
Speaker 2: could create some kind of professional future for yourself and golf?

621
00:32:43,000 --> 00:32:47,840
Speaker 3: Yeah, I think, you know, thinking about hindsight of basketball,

622
00:32:47,880 --> 00:32:50,920
Speaker 3: the goal was like WNBA, watching Lisa Leslie Santurs of

623
00:32:50,920 --> 00:32:52,880
Speaker 3: other spoon like that was that was the goal. And

624
00:32:52,920 --> 00:32:54,760
Speaker 3: so I just knew I wanted to be a professional

625
00:32:54,760 --> 00:32:57,400
Speaker 3: athlete and somehow, some way I wanted to play at

626
00:32:57,400 --> 00:33:01,720
Speaker 3: the highest level that I could. Once I graduated college,

627
00:33:01,800 --> 00:33:03,640
Speaker 3: I tried to be a coach. So I was an

628
00:33:03,640 --> 00:33:06,320
Speaker 3: assistant coach for a team. I quickly realized that it

629
00:33:06,360 --> 00:33:12,240
Speaker 3: is not my calling. That's okay. And golf is an

630
00:33:12,280 --> 00:33:14,920
Speaker 3: interesting sport too, because there's so much privilege into it.

631
00:33:15,360 --> 00:33:19,240
Speaker 3: So like when you're coaching someone with a lot of privilege,

632
00:33:19,520 --> 00:33:25,520
Speaker 3: you're like, what's going on here? So after that, I

633
00:33:25,560 --> 00:33:28,760
Speaker 3: was like, I think that I have the skills I

634
00:33:28,800 --> 00:33:31,840
Speaker 3: know that I have the skill to be one of

635
00:33:31,880 --> 00:33:33,920
Speaker 3: the best players in the world, and that's when I

636
00:33:33,960 --> 00:33:35,520
Speaker 3: started to pursue the game of golf.

637
00:33:36,360 --> 00:33:41,760
Speaker 2: Now, what is the scholarship to raign like? And you know,

638
00:33:41,920 --> 00:33:44,800
Speaker 2: in terms of pursuing like when you're a golfer. I mean,

639
00:33:44,840 --> 00:33:46,920
Speaker 2: I think people have some idea what it's like when

640
00:33:46,960 --> 00:33:49,800
Speaker 2: you are a football player or a basketball player. What

641
00:33:49,880 --> 00:33:52,320
Speaker 2: is it like for a golfer in terms of trying

642
00:33:52,320 --> 00:33:53,880
Speaker 2: to get a college scholarship to play?

643
00:33:54,400 --> 00:33:56,200
Speaker 3: Yeah, I think it depends on what school you're going

644
00:33:56,200 --> 00:33:57,840
Speaker 3: to at the end of the day for any anything.

645
00:33:57,960 --> 00:34:00,480
Speaker 3: But you know, often here like oh, I need to

646
00:34:00,480 --> 00:34:02,600
Speaker 3: get my child in golf. I hear there's tons of scholarships.

647
00:34:02,760 --> 00:34:02,960
Speaker 1: Yeah.

648
00:34:03,000 --> 00:34:08,399
Speaker 3: Yeah, for two thousand dollars it is. You can get

649
00:34:08,480 --> 00:34:11,320
Speaker 3: partial scholarship and you can get that met with maybe

650
00:34:11,520 --> 00:34:14,560
Speaker 3: academic scholarship to cover all of your schooling. But there's

651
00:34:14,600 --> 00:34:19,720
Speaker 3: definitely opportunities out there within the game of golf to

652
00:34:19,760 --> 00:34:23,680
Speaker 3: receive some sort of financial aid as you're an athlete

653
00:34:23,719 --> 00:34:26,160
Speaker 3: and playing, and that looks different for everyone. That could

654
00:34:26,160 --> 00:34:29,480
Speaker 3: be partial, that could be a third, that could be full,

655
00:34:29,600 --> 00:34:33,560
Speaker 3: but almost with any sport that's not one of your majors,

656
00:34:33,560 --> 00:34:35,400
Speaker 3: you want to make sure that you have other opportunities,

657
00:34:35,400 --> 00:34:37,920
Speaker 3: and so you have so many great organizations like First

658
00:34:37,920 --> 00:34:43,240
Speaker 3: Tea that apply scholarships, and there's Midnight Golf in Detroit

659
00:34:44,080 --> 00:34:48,080
Speaker 3: actually yeap that has for years and years and years

660
00:34:48,080 --> 00:34:50,960
Speaker 3: before even like the wave of diversity hit the golf

661
00:34:51,000 --> 00:34:54,240
Speaker 3: industry like has been serving the community. And so those

662
00:34:54,239 --> 00:34:57,799
Speaker 3: are where majority of opportunities to have a full ride

663
00:34:57,800 --> 00:34:58,239
Speaker 3: come from.

664
00:34:59,200 --> 00:35:02,239
Speaker 2: Now, what you kind of made that decision to, you know,

665
00:35:02,480 --> 00:35:08,239
Speaker 2: to be a professional golfer? How did you sort of

666
00:35:08,239 --> 00:35:10,000
Speaker 2: plot out what that looked like for you?

667
00:35:10,200 --> 00:35:13,520
Speaker 3: It's a great question. I probably could plot it out now,

668
00:35:13,840 --> 00:35:16,000
Speaker 3: but I did not know how to thought about it then.

669
00:35:16,840 --> 00:35:20,160
Speaker 3: The crazy thing about then is that, like I didn't

670
00:35:20,160 --> 00:35:21,839
Speaker 3: even know that there was a tournament called the Bill

671
00:35:21,920 --> 00:35:25,080
Speaker 3: Vicki Tournament that was hosted in Atlanta for all black golfers,

672
00:35:25,280 --> 00:35:28,279
Speaker 3: junior golfers to come in play. So my resources and

673
00:35:28,400 --> 00:35:31,600
Speaker 3: like trying to understand the land of not even just

674
00:35:31,640 --> 00:35:35,640
Speaker 3: like professional golf, but golf in general, were very very small.

675
00:35:36,480 --> 00:35:39,040
Speaker 3: So it just started with literally getting on Google what

676
00:35:39,080 --> 00:35:41,319
Speaker 3: does it look like to be a professional golfer? Which

677
00:35:41,320 --> 00:35:43,200
Speaker 3: I had chat GPT back then, because I feel like

678
00:35:43,280 --> 00:35:45,200
Speaker 3: I could have, you know, had an actual thing that

679
00:35:45,239 --> 00:35:47,279
Speaker 3: could have put in canva and had visuals too, but

680
00:35:48,520 --> 00:35:51,759
Speaker 3: it was essentially Okay, Q School. I have to go

681
00:35:51,760 --> 00:35:54,520
Speaker 3: to Q School, qualify for every all three stages. If

682
00:35:54,560 --> 00:35:57,160
Speaker 3: you make it to the second stage, you get status

683
00:35:57,200 --> 00:35:58,920
Speaker 3: with on the Epstent Tour, which is the theater to

684
00:35:58,960 --> 00:36:04,319
Speaker 3: the LPGA. Q School in total can cost anywhere from

685
00:36:04,360 --> 00:36:07,239
Speaker 3: seven thousand to ten thousand dollars, So what does that

686
00:36:07,280 --> 00:36:09,560
Speaker 3: look like? A lot of that time was like, Okay,

687
00:36:09,560 --> 00:36:12,000
Speaker 3: I'm gonna work. I'm going to try and get some

688
00:36:12,000 --> 00:36:17,520
Speaker 3: sort of sponsorship, which is a whole nother learning thing curve,

689
00:36:18,800 --> 00:36:20,440
Speaker 3: and then try and show up and do my best.

690
00:36:20,440 --> 00:36:23,799
Speaker 3: And so that was kind of I learned how to

691
00:36:23,840 --> 00:36:24,839
Speaker 3: do it along the way.

692
00:36:25,320 --> 00:36:29,520
Speaker 2: Yeah, talk about that part of it, the getting the sponsorships,

693
00:36:29,560 --> 00:36:34,759
Speaker 2: because I think the average person doesn't understand what that

694
00:36:34,920 --> 00:36:39,000
Speaker 2: dynamic is like. So how you know if you're a golfer,

695
00:36:39,040 --> 00:36:42,319
Speaker 2: and let's say, especially if you don't have like when

696
00:36:42,320 --> 00:36:44,200
Speaker 2: Tiger Woods came out of Stanford, he had a lot

697
00:36:44,200 --> 00:36:48,000
Speaker 2: of momentum behind him, right everything. You know, for as

698
00:36:48,080 --> 00:36:51,279
Speaker 2: much as people knew about college golf, you knew his name,

699
00:36:51,640 --> 00:36:55,120
Speaker 2: and so if you are not somebody who is super

700
00:36:55,160 --> 00:36:57,319
Speaker 2: well known or people have been whispering about and those

701
00:36:57,400 --> 00:37:00,160
Speaker 2: kinds of things like what does that hunt for or

702
00:37:00,160 --> 00:37:02,400
Speaker 2: a sponsor, what does that look like?

703
00:37:03,120 --> 00:37:04,799
Speaker 3: Yeah, I'll kind of give you two versions of that.

704
00:37:04,840 --> 00:37:09,600
Speaker 3: I think the first one is what I learned was

705
00:37:09,640 --> 00:37:13,719
Speaker 3: people would ask maybe ten people for five thousand dollars

706
00:37:14,400 --> 00:37:17,160
Speaker 3: and that was either as a donation or maybe you know,

707
00:37:17,200 --> 00:37:19,320
Speaker 3: as an investment, and they would get a percentage back,

708
00:37:20,360 --> 00:37:22,239
Speaker 3: so on and so forth. There's also you know, you

709
00:37:22,239 --> 00:37:24,799
Speaker 3: could get sponsored by a company, whether that be a

710
00:37:24,840 --> 00:37:30,760
Speaker 3: bank or a big, bigger entity, and then sponsorship also

711
00:37:30,800 --> 00:37:35,920
Speaker 3: looked like just family in community putting money in a

712
00:37:35,960 --> 00:37:37,600
Speaker 3: pot to try and make sure that you can make it,

713
00:37:37,960 --> 00:37:40,440
Speaker 3: and so you have that that exists. I think one

714
00:37:40,440 --> 00:37:42,800
Speaker 3: thing that has not talked about often is what a

715
00:37:42,840 --> 00:37:47,359
Speaker 3: sponsorship look for look like for if you're a young

716
00:37:47,400 --> 00:37:50,200
Speaker 3: black person within the golf game. And for me, that

717
00:37:50,320 --> 00:37:52,919
Speaker 3: was a lot harder. So I saw a counterpart of mine,

718
00:37:53,440 --> 00:37:57,520
Speaker 3: a white male from the same company, ten times more

719
00:37:57,560 --> 00:37:59,400
Speaker 3: than I did, even though I had at that time

720
00:37:59,440 --> 00:38:02,920
Speaker 3: in place, I had like more notoriety, I had like

721
00:38:03,000 --> 00:38:06,759
Speaker 3: more wins, and things of that sort. And then you

722
00:38:06,800 --> 00:38:10,040
Speaker 3: break that down from just being a black female, so

723
00:38:10,239 --> 00:38:13,960
Speaker 3: as being a black female, you're also kind of backs

724
00:38:14,000 --> 00:38:17,200
Speaker 3: against the wall because what is beauty? You know, Now

725
00:38:17,239 --> 00:38:19,760
Speaker 3: you're looked at not just for like your talent. They're like, well,

726
00:38:19,800 --> 00:38:21,600
Speaker 3: how can we market you if you're going to be here?

727
00:38:22,520 --> 00:38:25,480
Speaker 3: Now you're looked at as like sponsorships sometimes look like, oh,

728
00:38:25,480 --> 00:38:26,600
Speaker 3: we want you to come and do this thing, and

729
00:38:26,640 --> 00:38:28,479
Speaker 3: there's going to be people there that you can meet

730
00:38:29,160 --> 00:38:31,160
Speaker 3: that might help you out. So this is a great

731
00:38:31,200 --> 00:38:35,400
Speaker 3: networking thing, but in reality you leave depleted and not

732
00:38:36,440 --> 00:38:38,520
Speaker 3: connected to anything and you just did a whole job

733
00:38:38,560 --> 00:38:41,359
Speaker 3: for free for an entire day. And so I think

734
00:38:41,440 --> 00:38:45,080
Speaker 3: learning those things along the way of like what does

735
00:38:45,080 --> 00:38:49,839
Speaker 3: sponsorship look like for me specifically, and trying to get

736
00:38:49,960 --> 00:38:53,680
Speaker 3: creative of building sponsorships. So for me that once I

737
00:38:53,760 --> 00:38:57,399
Speaker 3: kind of fell flat on my face and got back

738
00:38:57,440 --> 00:38:59,799
Speaker 3: up and learned. Essentially for me, it's like, oh, I

739
00:38:59,800 --> 00:39:04,120
Speaker 3: can provide something for companies that might look like a

740
00:39:04,120 --> 00:39:07,239
Speaker 3: corporate engagement and they can purchase that for me, and

741
00:39:07,280 --> 00:39:09,960
Speaker 3: I can come out four times a year play with

742
00:39:10,040 --> 00:39:14,400
Speaker 3: them and also help them utilize golf for programming so

743
00:39:14,400 --> 00:39:17,000
Speaker 3: how can I help them consult by utilizing the game

744
00:39:17,000 --> 00:39:18,800
Speaker 3: of golf and so on and so forth.

745
00:39:19,120 --> 00:39:21,320
Speaker 2: And so when you were, you know, starting out and

746
00:39:21,400 --> 00:39:24,200
Speaker 2: you're trying to manage the business side of this, how

747
00:39:24,239 --> 00:39:28,520
Speaker 2: did that impact or what was the impact on your game? Like,

748
00:39:28,680 --> 00:39:32,280
Speaker 2: you know, how challenging is that to be both business

749
00:39:32,320 --> 00:39:35,120
Speaker 2: person you know, your own you know, you're basically your

750
00:39:35,160 --> 00:39:38,480
Speaker 2: own company, but also trying to be the best golfer

751
00:39:38,480 --> 00:39:38,960
Speaker 2: that you can be.

752
00:39:39,640 --> 00:39:42,239
Speaker 3: Yeah, A great example that I always go back to,

753
00:39:42,400 --> 00:39:48,000
Speaker 3: and there's a phenomenal story on PGA Tours about Tim O'Neill.

754
00:39:48,560 --> 00:39:52,919
Speaker 3: Tim is an excellent golfer and he has just been

755
00:39:53,440 --> 00:39:57,520
Speaker 3: winning tournaments and grinding for his entire life and then

756
00:39:57,560 --> 00:39:59,680
Speaker 3: finally gets of age to be on the Champions Tour

757
00:40:00,280 --> 00:40:03,839
Speaker 3: wins do you one last year? I think? I really

758
00:40:03,920 --> 00:40:06,520
Speaker 3: think when last year, like when's you know, finally gets

759
00:40:06,560 --> 00:40:09,520
Speaker 3: a big check and everything that kind of goes into that.

760
00:40:09,640 --> 00:40:14,360
Speaker 3: And so I think that watching him shows me a

761
00:40:14,400 --> 00:40:20,240
Speaker 3: lot of is very similar to my life of Like, sorry,

762
00:40:20,239 --> 00:40:21,759
Speaker 3: I totally forgot the question that you had and where

763
00:40:21,800 --> 00:40:22,360
Speaker 3: I was going with that.

764
00:40:22,760 --> 00:40:25,440
Speaker 2: Oh, yeah, just asking you about the challenge of being

765
00:40:26,600 --> 00:40:28,919
Speaker 2: you know, kind of having to be wearing all those heats.

766
00:40:29,000 --> 00:40:30,640
Speaker 3: Yeah, business, and yeah it.

767
00:40:30,920 --> 00:40:32,120
Speaker 1: Kind of be a great golfer.

768
00:40:33,160 --> 00:40:36,319
Speaker 3: It delays a lot of things. So if I were

769
00:40:36,360 --> 00:40:38,880
Speaker 3: to look back now, I would say, like, oh, and

770
00:40:38,960 --> 00:40:41,160
Speaker 3: I think about Tim, like if he would have had

771
00:40:41,200 --> 00:40:43,960
Speaker 3: all the resources, if he would have had the support,

772
00:40:44,040 --> 00:40:48,120
Speaker 3: because then you also need emotional support. And I'll kind

773
00:40:48,160 --> 00:40:50,319
Speaker 3: of go through quickly of like things that you need

774
00:40:50,360 --> 00:40:53,240
Speaker 3: to be truly successful, and you'll hear a Scottie Shuffler,

775
00:40:53,360 --> 00:40:56,200
Speaker 3: Jordan Speed talk about this, or even Tiger like you

776
00:40:56,280 --> 00:40:57,960
Speaker 3: got to have a trainer, but then you also have

777
00:40:58,920 --> 00:41:02,480
Speaker 3: a mental coach, and some people also have like a

778
00:41:02,480 --> 00:41:05,560
Speaker 3: breathwork coach, but then you need your other just swing coach,

779
00:41:05,600 --> 00:41:09,359
Speaker 3: which is two hundred dollars an hour minimum. You got

780
00:41:09,400 --> 00:41:11,279
Speaker 3: to have a place to live. You're also paying for

781
00:41:11,440 --> 00:41:13,000
Speaker 3: entry fees, and entry fees for the women are a

782
00:41:13,000 --> 00:41:14,640
Speaker 3: lot higher for the men. Where the men might be

783
00:41:14,640 --> 00:41:17,480
Speaker 3: paying a twenty five dollars entry fee, thirty dollars entry fee,

784
00:41:17,520 --> 00:41:20,520
Speaker 3: we're paying five hundred dollars. You're also paying.

785
00:41:20,280 --> 00:41:22,400
Speaker 1: Why is there such a disparity?

786
00:41:22,800 --> 00:41:25,760
Speaker 3: That is something I'm not sure I think. Yeah, obviously

787
00:41:26,640 --> 00:41:30,719
Speaker 3: LPGA have the finances that PGA does, So I don't

788
00:41:30,760 --> 00:41:32,080
Speaker 3: know if that plays a big thing is.

789
00:41:32,040 --> 00:41:36,959
Speaker 1: To do they're trying to it has to be revenue, yeah, basic, gotcha.

790
00:41:37,360 --> 00:41:39,759
Speaker 3: And so yeah, there's just so many elements and then

791
00:41:39,760 --> 00:41:42,839
Speaker 3: your flights and then are you going to drive? That

792
00:41:42,880 --> 00:41:45,680
Speaker 3: play a big part to truly be successful on tour

793
00:41:45,760 --> 00:41:48,480
Speaker 3: for a year and have not have to have that

794
00:41:48,760 --> 00:41:50,480
Speaker 3: thing of like where's money going to come from? Who

795
00:41:50,520 --> 00:41:52,200
Speaker 3: do I owe in the back of your head you

796
00:41:52,200 --> 00:41:53,640
Speaker 3: need one hundred thousand dollars.

797
00:41:54,080 --> 00:41:56,000
Speaker 2: Yeah, and give people out there who may not be

798
00:41:56,680 --> 00:42:00,640
Speaker 2: familiar with Tim's story. He didn't play I believe his

799
00:42:00,800 --> 00:42:06,200
Speaker 2: first he's like in his forties and he or he

800
00:42:06,280 --> 00:42:08,160
Speaker 2: was in his forties. I think when he played finally

801
00:42:08,160 --> 00:42:11,120
Speaker 2: played his first PGA Tour event when he I think

802
00:42:11,160 --> 00:42:13,400
Speaker 2: he qualified for the US Open and that was the

803
00:42:13,440 --> 00:42:16,880
Speaker 2: one and I think it was last year referred to

804
00:42:16,920 --> 00:42:18,440
Speaker 2: his victory he won a tournament.

805
00:42:18,480 --> 00:42:21,240
Speaker 1: I think it was the Dominion Energy Charity.

806
00:42:20,840 --> 00:42:25,799
Speaker 2: Classic is what he won, Champions Champions Tour, and you

807
00:42:25,840 --> 00:42:28,360
Speaker 2: know that allowed him to get his card for the

808
00:42:28,680 --> 00:42:31,920
Speaker 2: twenty twenty five season, which is a big deal. So

809
00:42:32,480 --> 00:42:35,799
Speaker 2: I think we as Tiger was emerging, I think that's

810
00:42:35,840 --> 00:42:39,759
Speaker 2: when people and had learned a lot about you know,

811
00:42:39,840 --> 00:42:44,759
Speaker 2: golf and the barriers of entry. How much you know,

812
00:42:45,200 --> 00:42:48,920
Speaker 2: looking at those barriers of entry for black golfers in particularly,

813
00:42:49,400 --> 00:42:51,880
Speaker 2: how much of this is about simply money?

814
00:42:51,920 --> 00:42:55,560
Speaker 1: And because you mentioned the support, like, is.

815
00:42:55,480 --> 00:42:58,840
Speaker 2: That probably the biggest barrier of entry you know, beyond

816
00:42:58,920 --> 00:43:00,920
Speaker 2: just sort of social and racial dynamics.

817
00:43:01,080 --> 00:43:02,719
Speaker 3: Yeah, thing money is a big one, but then also

818
00:43:02,840 --> 00:43:07,120
Speaker 3: knowledge where do you play? I think also our leadership

819
00:43:07,120 --> 00:43:09,080
Speaker 3: of who do we have in leadership in certain sectors

820
00:43:09,080 --> 00:43:11,920
Speaker 3: and organizations to help move the needle forward? And are

821
00:43:11,920 --> 00:43:14,920
Speaker 3: we allowing you know, brown and black people to have

822
00:43:14,960 --> 00:43:16,719
Speaker 3: that representation, to have a seat at the table to

823
00:43:16,800 --> 00:43:19,720
Speaker 3: kind of discuss what does that look like moving people forward.

824
00:43:20,480 --> 00:43:22,799
Speaker 3: The big thing is I see so many different organizations

825
00:43:22,840 --> 00:43:26,160
Speaker 3: popping up for us, which is amazing. But at the

826
00:43:26,160 --> 00:43:29,440
Speaker 3: same time, as someone that's been through it, if I had,

827
00:43:30,560 --> 00:43:32,440
Speaker 3: if I would advise, I would say, hey, you know,

828
00:43:33,200 --> 00:43:35,879
Speaker 3: this is awesome. This might be awesome for the men,

829
00:43:36,080 --> 00:43:38,360
Speaker 3: This isn't great for the women. Majority of your women

830
00:43:38,840 --> 00:43:41,279
Speaker 3: are already on an epsent tour, They're already on a led.

831
00:43:41,480 --> 00:43:45,640
Speaker 3: What they need is more maybe developmental they need Hey,

832
00:43:45,840 --> 00:43:50,080
Speaker 3: instead of money, Could you give time as a mental

833
00:43:50,120 --> 00:43:53,600
Speaker 3: coach instead of money? Could you connect them to people

834
00:43:54,040 --> 00:43:56,799
Speaker 3: so they could get someone on the board for an

835
00:43:56,920 --> 00:43:59,800
Speaker 3: LPGA tournament, Because that's another thing. It's all at the

836
00:43:59,880 --> 00:44:01,319
Speaker 3: end of the day, it's all about who you know.

837
00:44:01,400 --> 00:44:03,840
Speaker 3: You will see certain people in tournaments that don't have

838
00:44:03,880 --> 00:44:06,799
Speaker 3: the residentay, but to have the connections, and that's what

839
00:44:06,840 --> 00:44:11,040
Speaker 3: golf is is a game of connections. I think sometimes

840
00:44:11,080 --> 00:44:15,680
Speaker 3: we are like separating our players to compete against the

841
00:44:15,719 --> 00:44:19,480
Speaker 3: big players, which might be AJGA or events like that.

842
00:44:19,840 --> 00:44:24,040
Speaker 3: But because we don't know about that, then the education

843
00:44:24,160 --> 00:44:25,680
Speaker 3: that we have and like how do we get our

844
00:44:25,680 --> 00:44:28,480
Speaker 3: players on tour and how do we get success for

845
00:44:28,560 --> 00:44:30,759
Speaker 3: them looks a lot different. And I think the other

846
00:44:30,800 --> 00:44:33,640
Speaker 3: thing is just supporting them, like supporting them from the

847
00:44:33,680 --> 00:44:38,080
Speaker 3: standpoint of like, hey, this sixteen year old phenom or

848
00:44:38,200 --> 00:44:41,279
Speaker 3: this you know, thirty seven year old who's still trying

849
00:44:41,280 --> 00:44:43,239
Speaker 3: to make it, that has all the talent. We just

850
00:44:43,239 --> 00:44:45,200
Speaker 3: want to let you know that we support you and

851
00:44:45,200 --> 00:44:48,359
Speaker 3: that we're here. These are the whatever we can do.

852
00:44:49,120 --> 00:44:51,719
Speaker 3: We don't want anything from you, And so I think

853
00:44:52,360 --> 00:44:56,560
Speaker 3: overall it's a mindset thing. But I think that there's

854
00:44:57,920 --> 00:44:59,560
Speaker 3: that there's things that we can do from a systematic

855
00:44:59,600 --> 00:45:03,879
Speaker 3: standpoint point to help leverage brown and black people into

856
00:45:03,920 --> 00:45:05,400
Speaker 3: the game of golf to have success.

857
00:45:05,800 --> 00:45:06,680
Speaker 1: Yeah, there's a lot more.

858
00:45:06,680 --> 00:45:09,000
Speaker 2: I definitely want to ask you about that, and also

859
00:45:09,320 --> 00:45:13,120
Speaker 2: about some of the things that you have candidly shared about,

860
00:45:13,840 --> 00:45:15,680
Speaker 2: you know, some of the mental health challenges that you've

861
00:45:15,719 --> 00:45:18,520
Speaker 2: experienced and you know as it related to the game

862
00:45:18,560 --> 00:45:20,640
Speaker 2: of golf and all the things that you've had to carry.

863
00:45:21,120 --> 00:45:23,279
Speaker 2: So I when I ask you about that, and I

864
00:45:23,360 --> 00:45:27,560
Speaker 2: have a messy question for you about par threes, we

865
00:45:27,600 --> 00:45:31,480
Speaker 2: will were partner will get into it, but real quick,

866
00:45:31,520 --> 00:45:33,719
Speaker 2: we're going to take a very short break and we'll

867
00:45:33,719 --> 00:45:46,680
Speaker 2: be back with more with Alexis. So, Alexis, before we

868
00:45:46,719 --> 00:45:49,400
Speaker 2: took a break, you were talking about the you know,

869
00:45:49,480 --> 00:45:51,719
Speaker 2: the support and what that really looks like and what

870
00:45:51,760 --> 00:45:55,720
Speaker 2: it means to support golfers of color, black women, women

871
00:45:55,760 --> 00:46:00,560
Speaker 2: of color in this in this sport. Maybe people don't

872
00:46:00,760 --> 00:46:04,120
Speaker 2: I think most people probably don't realize this. But what

873
00:46:04,160 --> 00:46:06,720
Speaker 2: does it take like if you are, you know, full

874
00:46:06,800 --> 00:46:11,200
Speaker 2: time going these tournaments, Like what does it cost you

875
00:46:11,239 --> 00:46:13,600
Speaker 2: to go to a and participate in a tournament?

876
00:46:13,640 --> 00:46:15,560
Speaker 1: Like what's the breakdown of like what that looks like

877
00:46:15,600 --> 00:46:16,480
Speaker 1: for you financially.

878
00:46:16,560 --> 00:46:20,120
Speaker 3: Yeah, so you're gonna start with your entry fee, and

879
00:46:20,160 --> 00:46:22,239
Speaker 3: so you have an entry fee that's probably it might

880
00:46:22,239 --> 00:46:24,200
Speaker 3: be like four fifty now, but it was five hundred

881
00:46:24,200 --> 00:46:26,880
Speaker 3: when I was playing. And then on top of the

882
00:46:27,000 --> 00:46:30,080
Speaker 3: entry fee, you need a place to stay. Then you

883
00:46:30,120 --> 00:46:34,479
Speaker 3: also are hotels or hotel or host family which is family.

884
00:46:34,560 --> 00:46:39,120
Speaker 3: Ye from a minority standpoint and a foreign standpoint, because

885
00:46:39,640 --> 00:46:42,759
Speaker 3: the golf is full, it is just like the World's tour.

886
00:46:43,239 --> 00:46:46,759
Speaker 3: So from that standpoint, we're in kind of rural areas

887
00:46:46,840 --> 00:46:49,560
Speaker 3: and different places all over the country. That can also

888
00:46:50,360 --> 00:46:55,680
Speaker 3: kind of pose an issue as well, and so oftentimes

889
00:46:55,719 --> 00:46:59,160
Speaker 3: you'll see a lot of minorities and international players opting

890
00:46:59,200 --> 00:47:04,000
Speaker 3: to get a hotel all because of that. Now you're

891
00:47:04,000 --> 00:47:06,680
Speaker 3: thinking about a caddy, and to be quite honest, you

892
00:47:06,719 --> 00:47:08,480
Speaker 3: need a caddy to be successful. But a lot of

893
00:47:08,480 --> 00:47:11,800
Speaker 3: girls are going to choose to maybe carry their bag

894
00:47:12,040 --> 00:47:14,480
Speaker 3: or push their own bag just to save costs.

895
00:47:15,800 --> 00:47:19,799
Speaker 1: And what is a caddy run? Like how much was that?

896
00:47:20,040 --> 00:47:25,200
Speaker 3: Oh man, So at the least maybe twenty five hundred,

897
00:47:26,400 --> 00:47:29,799
Speaker 3: and then a part of your whatever check you make,

898
00:47:29,840 --> 00:47:34,640
Speaker 3: if you make a check, if it's a friend, you

899
00:47:34,719 --> 00:47:36,080
Speaker 3: might can get a better deal, but if you want

900
00:47:36,080 --> 00:47:39,960
Speaker 3: a decent caddy, that's about around for epsent tour level.

901
00:47:41,400 --> 00:47:45,720
Speaker 3: And then you're looking at your fee for your coach,

902
00:47:45,800 --> 00:47:47,840
Speaker 3: like you're sending stuff into your coach, getting kind of

903
00:47:47,880 --> 00:47:50,280
Speaker 3: tweaks here and there. If you have a mental coach,

904
00:47:50,360 --> 00:47:54,480
Speaker 3: you're paying for that as well. During that event. If

905
00:47:54,480 --> 00:47:56,680
Speaker 3: you're driving to the event, so I've driven from New

906
00:47:56,719 --> 00:48:00,080
Speaker 3: York to Louisiana way too many times, you're also thinking

907
00:48:00,080 --> 00:48:04,880
Speaker 3: about gas, transportation, rental car. Are is everyone going to

908
00:48:04,880 --> 00:48:08,400
Speaker 3: travel together or not? One tournament can be anywhere from

909
00:48:08,520 --> 00:48:12,200
Speaker 3: five thousand dollars to ten thousand dollars, depending if you're

910
00:48:12,239 --> 00:48:14,760
Speaker 3: going to be frugal and just trying to give everything

911
00:48:14,800 --> 00:48:18,319
Speaker 3: you have, or if you're going to say I need

912
00:48:18,360 --> 00:48:20,319
Speaker 3: all these things to be successful, which you do, and

913
00:48:20,400 --> 00:48:21,839
Speaker 3: you have the resources to pay for that.

914
00:48:22,400 --> 00:48:26,279
Speaker 2: In addition to you know, you going that avenue of

915
00:48:26,280 --> 00:48:31,240
Speaker 2: like competing in tournaments. You then made a transition into

916
00:48:31,280 --> 00:48:34,840
Speaker 2: doing long drive, right, And I know a lot of

917
00:48:34,880 --> 00:48:37,160
Speaker 2: people are super fascinated. I mean it's one of the

918
00:48:37,160 --> 00:48:39,680
Speaker 2: things that he is fascinated about golf, is like the

919
00:48:39,680 --> 00:48:41,920
Speaker 2: long drive is the equivalent to the home run, is

920
00:48:41,920 --> 00:48:44,760
Speaker 2: the equivalent to the touch you know, is the equivalent

921
00:48:44,800 --> 00:48:46,680
Speaker 2: to a touchdown? Like there are these things and sports

922
00:48:46,719 --> 00:48:49,799
Speaker 2: that are just captivating, right, You just started competing on

923
00:48:49,840 --> 00:48:52,279
Speaker 2: the long drive circuit in these various championships.

924
00:48:52,360 --> 00:48:55,919
Speaker 1: So how did you get involved in doing that?

925
00:48:56,520 --> 00:48:58,280
Speaker 3: It all goes back to trying to figure out another

926
00:48:58,320 --> 00:49:00,400
Speaker 3: way to make a buck to be able to use school.

927
00:49:01,320 --> 00:49:04,440
Speaker 3: So I was trying to prepare for Q school and

928
00:49:04,600 --> 00:49:07,439
Speaker 3: I still needed to make some money to be able

929
00:49:07,480 --> 00:49:10,960
Speaker 3: to afford housing and a few other items. And so

930
00:49:11,000 --> 00:49:13,560
Speaker 3: someone's like, you hit really far. You should do long drive.

931
00:49:13,960 --> 00:49:16,080
Speaker 3: People would say that, but I would watch these and

932
00:49:16,120 --> 00:49:18,319
Speaker 3: it's still to this day. I will watch some of

933
00:49:18,400 --> 00:49:21,920
Speaker 3: my competitors hit the ball and I'm like, it's incredible.

934
00:49:21,960 --> 00:49:25,239
Speaker 3: I could never you know. And so I would watch

935
00:49:25,280 --> 00:49:26,920
Speaker 3: and I was like, look, if I come in eighth place.

936
00:49:26,960 --> 00:49:30,080
Speaker 3: I sent an email to them for the World Championships,

937
00:49:30,080 --> 00:49:31,640
Speaker 3: out of all tournaments, we're going to go straight to

938
00:49:31,680 --> 00:49:34,359
Speaker 3: the biggest one. I was like, hey, you know, you're

939
00:49:34,400 --> 00:49:36,319
Speaker 3: an hour half away from I am. I was wondering

940
00:49:36,320 --> 00:49:39,160
Speaker 3: if they still have a spot open. Golf Channel owned

941
00:49:39,160 --> 00:49:41,480
Speaker 3: it at the time. They're like, yeah, we do love

942
00:49:41,520 --> 00:49:44,400
Speaker 3: to have you here. I go. My goal was like

943
00:49:44,440 --> 00:49:46,960
Speaker 3: to come in eighth place, and if I can fish

944
00:49:46,960 --> 00:49:49,320
Speaker 3: in eighth, I'll be able to afford Q school.

945
00:49:50,400 --> 00:49:53,520
Speaker 1: And it was what was was what was the eighth place?

946
00:49:53,560 --> 00:49:53,799
Speaker 3: Money?

947
00:49:53,800 --> 00:49:54,239
Speaker 1: Looking like?

948
00:49:54,280 --> 00:49:55,719
Speaker 3: Is that is that? Yeah? I think it was like

949
00:49:55,760 --> 00:49:59,919
Speaker 3: somewhere right around twenty five hundred or three thousand then

950
00:49:59,760 --> 00:50:04,760
Speaker 3: and and yeah. So I competed. I just kept getting

951
00:50:04,760 --> 00:50:06,680
Speaker 3: further and further, and I had my regular driver. So

952
00:50:06,760 --> 00:50:09,359
Speaker 3: I've only competed in long drive with a standard driver,

953
00:50:09,480 --> 00:50:11,759
Speaker 3: and my standard driver is actually forty four. And in

954
00:50:11,800 --> 00:50:15,480
Speaker 3: comparison for people that aren't aware, long drive drivers typically

955
00:50:15,520 --> 00:50:18,760
Speaker 3: are anywhere from forty eight that stay in regulation of USGA,

956
00:50:19,360 --> 00:50:22,120
Speaker 3: and they also hit typically with like a lower lofted club,

957
00:50:22,160 --> 00:50:24,280
Speaker 3: So where a driver might be standard at a nine

958
00:50:24,560 --> 00:50:27,480
Speaker 3: or ten, it's lofted down anywhere from a seven, and

959
00:50:27,520 --> 00:50:29,520
Speaker 3: you have some guys that are hitting a two, which

960
00:50:29,560 --> 00:50:32,080
Speaker 3: is like a putter. And so I just came in

961
00:50:32,400 --> 00:50:35,279
Speaker 3: with my school bag ready to go, and when it

962
00:50:35,360 --> 00:50:37,840
Speaker 3: finished ty third and I was like, oh, this is awesome.

963
00:50:38,120 --> 00:50:41,240
Speaker 3: That was fun. That was cool. It's where I realized

964
00:50:41,239 --> 00:50:44,360
Speaker 3: that I love entertainment, Like I love. I mean, that

965
00:50:44,440 --> 00:50:47,680
Speaker 3: was my hardest thing with golf is girls would make

966
00:50:47,719 --> 00:50:49,719
Speaker 3: a fifty footer, you know, and just like.

967
00:50:50,760 --> 00:50:53,440
Speaker 1: Just be very slowly yeah.

968
00:50:53,800 --> 00:50:58,839
Speaker 3: And I'm making a fifty footer. I'm like, oh my gosh,

969
00:50:58,920 --> 00:51:03,120
Speaker 3: but my mom's like yeah. And so yeah, I found

970
00:51:03,160 --> 00:51:06,360
Speaker 3: that long drive allowed me to a certain extent to

971
00:51:06,360 --> 00:51:09,000
Speaker 3: be myself even though it's still had some things that

972
00:51:09,040 --> 00:51:12,080
Speaker 3: it was working out, and then continue to do that

973
00:51:12,239 --> 00:51:14,759
Speaker 3: while playing. So some of my weeks on tour it

974
00:51:14,840 --> 00:51:17,319
Speaker 3: looked like on a Monday doing a program to make

975
00:51:17,360 --> 00:51:20,440
Speaker 3: a buck, going to Tuesday for a long drive event,

976
00:51:21,120 --> 00:51:24,400
Speaker 3: Wednesday flying to whatever epsent event that we had, or

977
00:51:24,440 --> 00:51:27,040
Speaker 3: whatever tour I was playing on to do a practice

978
00:51:27,120 --> 00:51:29,680
Speaker 3: round if I could make it, if not, I would

979
00:51:29,680 --> 00:51:31,800
Speaker 3: do it Thursday, and then going straight into the tournament.

980
00:51:31,960 --> 00:51:37,680
Speaker 3: And so I look back and like, obviously, I always

981
00:51:37,840 --> 00:51:39,880
Speaker 3: just thought of my career being such a failure, and

982
00:51:39,920 --> 00:51:41,799
Speaker 3: I look back and I'm like, whoa, there's so much

983
00:51:41,880 --> 00:51:44,800
Speaker 3: success within that. And I was doing so much that

984
00:51:44,840 --> 00:51:48,120
Speaker 3: I'd never realized. But obviously, as an athlete, you have

985
00:51:48,239 --> 00:51:51,879
Speaker 3: like one goal do it. If you don't, all else

986
00:51:51,960 --> 00:51:53,600
Speaker 3: is off. And so it really taught me to celebrate

987
00:51:53,600 --> 00:51:54,200
Speaker 3: the little wins.

988
00:51:54,239 --> 00:51:56,160
Speaker 1: What's the longest drive you've ever hit?

989
00:51:56,640 --> 00:52:00,560
Speaker 3: It was like three eighty four eight and Phoenix. Yeah,

990
00:52:00,880 --> 00:52:02,480
Speaker 3: I do want to hit in Dember again because I

991
00:52:02,480 --> 00:52:05,080
Speaker 3: think I can break the four hundred threshold. You know,

992
00:52:05,120 --> 00:52:06,239
Speaker 3: a little advantage up there.

993
00:52:07,920 --> 00:52:09,399
Speaker 1: So what's you know?

994
00:52:09,600 --> 00:52:13,600
Speaker 2: As you even though sometimes it's not necessarily reflected in

995
00:52:13,680 --> 00:52:17,439
Speaker 2: the game, but you know this from you know your

996
00:52:17,560 --> 00:52:19,759
Speaker 2: experience and because you're in the golf atmosphere.

997
00:52:19,800 --> 00:52:22,480
Speaker 1: A lot is that recreationally black people.

998
00:52:22,239 --> 00:52:25,080
Speaker 2: Out here playing golf right right, I'm one of these people,

999
00:52:25,120 --> 00:52:27,120
Speaker 2: Like I'm completely obsessed with it.

1000
00:52:27,280 --> 00:52:29,840
Speaker 1: You and I met because we did a golf event together.

1001
00:52:30,560 --> 00:52:36,200
Speaker 2: And so for those those of us amateur crappy golfers,

1002
00:52:36,560 --> 00:52:41,000
Speaker 2: what is the secret? What's the secret sauce to a

1003
00:52:41,360 --> 00:52:43,200
Speaker 2: you know, sort of perfecting your drive?

1004
00:52:43,920 --> 00:52:47,719
Speaker 3: Yeah, this is not to be harsh at all. The

1005
00:52:47,800 --> 00:52:50,759
Speaker 3: secret to hitting a longer drive and what allows me

1006
00:52:50,800 --> 00:52:54,520
Speaker 3: to hit to compete with you know, these phenomenal athletes

1007
00:52:54,680 --> 00:52:57,080
Speaker 3: with a regular club is finding the center of the

1008
00:52:57,120 --> 00:52:57,640
Speaker 3: club base.

1009
00:52:58,440 --> 00:53:01,720
Speaker 1: I can cut you out right now. You know that.

1010
00:53:05,239 --> 00:53:07,080
Speaker 3: We're hitting all over that club and we're not at

1011
00:53:07,080 --> 00:53:12,000
Speaker 3: the center. No, I would definitely say don't swing as hard,

1012
00:53:12,120 --> 00:53:16,200
Speaker 3: don't swing harder, swing faster. Most people go through the

1013
00:53:16,200 --> 00:53:19,360
Speaker 3: club and they're trying to swing super hard at the ball,

1014
00:53:19,880 --> 00:53:22,200
Speaker 3: versus if you're swinging faster, it's more of your hands

1015
00:53:22,239 --> 00:53:25,400
Speaker 3: going to second base and speeding up in this area

1016
00:53:25,520 --> 00:53:29,839
Speaker 3: from ball to kind of hip. It's so much like life.

1017
00:53:29,920 --> 00:53:31,920
Speaker 3: I think one thing that I wish I had was

1018
00:53:31,920 --> 00:53:34,520
Speaker 3: the better mindset when I was playing and now I'm like,

1019
00:53:34,640 --> 00:53:38,160
Speaker 3: oh whatever, Like, first of all, i can't be embarrassed

1020
00:53:38,200 --> 00:53:40,640
Speaker 3: because I'm going to take ownership. But the biggest thing

1021
00:53:40,680 --> 00:53:43,319
Speaker 3: is after hitting a shot, I always say, I don't care.

1022
00:53:43,320 --> 00:53:45,200
Speaker 3: I can make berdie from there, I don't care. Like

1023
00:53:45,280 --> 00:53:48,239
Speaker 3: if Pars Max or Bogie's Max is like okay, and

1024
00:53:48,880 --> 00:53:51,600
Speaker 3: is it still in play? Cool? I still have a shot.

1025
00:53:51,760 --> 00:53:54,720
Speaker 3: And so golf really, I mean, as you're telling talking

1026
00:53:54,719 --> 00:53:57,440
Speaker 3: about that, golf midx life so much. And I think

1027
00:53:57,440 --> 00:53:59,719
Speaker 3: people think that from a business standpoint, but also just

1028
00:53:59,719 --> 00:54:03,360
Speaker 3: from a storytelling standpoint, Like we look at success and

1029
00:54:03,400 --> 00:54:06,520
Speaker 3: say like, oh, they're successful because they have, you know,

1030
00:54:06,840 --> 00:54:10,840
Speaker 3: these assets, But in reality it's like you have to

1031
00:54:10,960 --> 00:54:13,520
Speaker 3: form your pitcher and you have to have a certain

1032
00:54:13,600 --> 00:54:17,680
Speaker 3: view and there are you know, specific things fundamentals that

1033
00:54:17,719 --> 00:54:20,080
Speaker 3: you need. But outside of that, I can take the

1034
00:54:20,120 --> 00:54:22,080
Speaker 3: club up here and then as long as I find

1035
00:54:22,080 --> 00:54:23,880
Speaker 3: the loot, I'm going to make contact. It's going to

1036
00:54:23,920 --> 00:54:26,680
Speaker 3: be great. And so it's whatever painting that you're that

1037
00:54:26,760 --> 00:54:29,080
Speaker 3: you're doing that will lead to you having a fun

1038
00:54:29,120 --> 00:54:31,279
Speaker 3: and great golf game. I don't know if you've done

1039
00:54:31,400 --> 00:54:35,080
Speaker 3: fash pitch softball in any recent years, but I'm pretty

1040
00:54:35,080 --> 00:54:37,319
Speaker 3: sure in your head you're like, oh, I still can

1041
00:54:37,320 --> 00:54:40,239
Speaker 3: slide into this base. I'm an athlete. Why can I

1042
00:54:40,280 --> 00:54:42,360
Speaker 3: not do this right?

1043
00:54:43,520 --> 00:54:44,120
Speaker 1: Precisely?

1044
00:54:44,200 --> 00:54:46,839
Speaker 2: Now, you've sort of alluded to it, and I know,

1045
00:54:47,040 --> 00:54:52,719
Speaker 2: just based off this wonderful column that you wrote, I

1046
00:54:52,760 --> 00:54:56,120
Speaker 2: believe it was for an organization that deals with depression

1047
00:54:56,160 --> 00:54:59,600
Speaker 2: and anxiety. About your decision to step away from golf,

1048
00:55:00,760 --> 00:55:03,759
Speaker 2: let's chat about that. How did you arrive at this

1049
00:55:03,840 --> 00:55:07,040
Speaker 2: decision that you were going to step away because of

1050
00:55:07,200 --> 00:55:10,360
Speaker 2: some of the mental health challenges you were having.

1051
00:55:11,200 --> 00:55:13,960
Speaker 3: Yeah, I don't think I never arrived at it. It

1052
00:55:14,120 --> 00:55:16,520
Speaker 3: just you know, they say either you quit or the

1053
00:55:16,520 --> 00:55:20,160
Speaker 3: sport quit to you. I'd say my mental health quit me,

1054
00:55:20,480 --> 00:55:25,200
Speaker 3: and that made me force me out of golf and

1055
00:55:25,360 --> 00:55:29,120
Speaker 3: just struggling with like, who am I in this realm

1056
00:55:29,120 --> 00:55:30,880
Speaker 3: of the golf world? Is there a place for me?

1057
00:55:32,600 --> 00:55:36,799
Speaker 3: Really struggling with success? Like and when I tell you,

1058
00:55:36,880 --> 00:55:39,879
Speaker 3: I felt like I had zero success in life. I

1059
00:55:40,000 --> 00:55:44,759
Speaker 3: just did not feel like I had support or that

1060
00:55:44,840 --> 00:55:47,640
Speaker 3: I was going to I knew that doing all these

1061
00:55:47,680 --> 00:55:49,719
Speaker 3: things to try and make money to play, that I

1062
00:55:49,760 --> 00:55:53,840
Speaker 3: would not be successful from a rhythm of life standpoint,

1063
00:55:54,239 --> 00:55:57,719
Speaker 3: because there was no rest. There was no you know,

1064
00:55:58,040 --> 00:56:00,800
Speaker 3: any opportunity that came. And we were talking about financially

1065
00:56:00,840 --> 00:56:03,600
Speaker 3: early earlier, like if you're on the brink of making

1066
00:56:03,600 --> 00:56:06,239
Speaker 3: a tournament in or not. Sometimes you're flying out to

1067
00:56:06,280 --> 00:56:09,560
Speaker 3: an event, sitting on the alternate list, spending you know,

1068
00:56:09,680 --> 00:56:12,480
Speaker 3: two thousand dollars hoping for a chance to play it.

1069
00:56:12,520 --> 00:56:15,640
Speaker 3: If you don't instead of like doing something else, then

1070
00:56:15,680 --> 00:56:18,799
Speaker 3: you're just out. You're just out of luck. And so

1071
00:56:18,840 --> 00:56:22,560
Speaker 3: I really really struggled with that. And then you add,

1072
00:56:22,800 --> 00:56:26,439
Speaker 3: in this case, you add personal things to hop onto that,

1073
00:56:27,080 --> 00:56:32,279
Speaker 3: and I felt like from a personal life, my life

1074
00:56:32,320 --> 00:56:34,839
Speaker 3: kind of just blew up. And so to juggle both

1075
00:56:34,840 --> 00:56:38,719
Speaker 3: of those things at the same time, the healthiest thing

1076
00:56:39,000 --> 00:56:40,120
Speaker 3: was to just stop.

1077
00:56:40,480 --> 00:56:44,480
Speaker 2: Now for you, was this just an accumulation as opposed

1078
00:56:44,520 --> 00:56:46,879
Speaker 2: to maybe one thing happening where you were like, oh

1079
00:56:47,000 --> 00:56:49,960
Speaker 2: that's it. So was this more or less a snowball

1080
00:56:50,040 --> 00:56:50,680
Speaker 2: kind of effect?

1081
00:56:51,000 --> 00:56:53,640
Speaker 3: It definitely was a snowball. And I also think now

1082
00:56:54,440 --> 00:57:03,200
Speaker 3: also stepped away from long drive as well. The I

1083
00:57:03,239 --> 00:57:11,319
Speaker 3: would describe long drive and certain in certain words is

1084
00:57:11,360 --> 00:57:15,320
Speaker 3: like I don't know, I do know, I have a thought.

1085
00:57:14,640 --> 00:57:19,760
Speaker 3: I would describe long drive as like kind of your

1086
00:57:19,920 --> 00:57:26,320
Speaker 3: WWE meets ultra conservative golf. And so there's a space

1087
00:57:26,360 --> 00:57:29,160
Speaker 3: where like it reminded me a lot of home in

1088
00:57:29,200 --> 00:57:32,920
Speaker 3: a sense in going back to high school, being like, oh,

1089
00:57:33,000 --> 00:57:35,880
Speaker 3: I love the sport, but why are we having rebel

1090
00:57:35,880 --> 00:57:39,920
Speaker 3: flags around us? And so and not to that extent,

1091
00:57:40,120 --> 00:57:41,880
Speaker 3: but it was just like I don't think that I

1092
00:57:41,920 --> 00:57:43,959
Speaker 3: could be myself or that there's a place for me here,

1093
00:57:44,480 --> 00:57:45,960
Speaker 3: and this is what I'm really good at, and you're

1094
00:57:46,000 --> 00:57:48,280
Speaker 3: telling me I don't have to practice putting. And then

1095
00:57:48,400 --> 00:57:51,760
Speaker 3: on the flip side, there's like golf where I'm trying

1096
00:57:51,760 --> 00:57:54,720
Speaker 3: to figure out I have this big personality, my whole

1097
00:57:54,720 --> 00:57:57,600
Speaker 3: mission is like golfing for good, But how much good

1098
00:57:57,680 --> 00:57:59,840
Speaker 3: can you do if you don't have support or resources?

1099
00:58:00,320 --> 00:58:02,120
Speaker 3: And so like if I knew I wasn't going to

1100
00:58:02,200 --> 00:58:04,400
Speaker 3: make the cut, or if I'm playing like my final round,

1101
00:58:04,560 --> 00:58:07,280
Speaker 3: I'd always find some little girl that's traveling with us

1102
00:58:07,320 --> 00:58:09,680
Speaker 3: and to say like, hey, I'd do this thing with

1103
00:58:09,680 --> 00:58:11,400
Speaker 3: my caddy and act like I'm firing him and then

1104
00:58:11,720 --> 00:58:14,480
Speaker 3: hire her on to walk the last spearwaid with me.

1105
00:58:14,880 --> 00:58:18,000
Speaker 3: And so I was like, oh, I literally enjoyed utilizing

1106
00:58:18,040 --> 00:58:22,400
Speaker 3: golf for good and really enjoyed entertaining people, but I

1107
00:58:22,520 --> 00:58:25,520
Speaker 3: didn't know how to do that and be myself. And

1108
00:58:25,600 --> 00:58:30,840
Speaker 3: so now this year I did some commentating for long

1109
00:58:30,960 --> 00:58:33,520
Speaker 3: Drive and some other things, but now going back to it,

1110
00:58:33,560 --> 00:58:36,680
Speaker 3: this year, I did my first event in long Drive

1111
00:58:37,240 --> 00:58:39,800
Speaker 3: and Forever, and it was like, I think that was

1112
00:58:39,880 --> 00:58:41,480
Speaker 3: more of myself than I have been. But I think

1113
00:58:41,480 --> 00:58:44,240
Speaker 3: there's so much more to bring along that. But I

1114
00:58:44,320 --> 00:58:46,160
Speaker 3: don't think that would have ever happened if I didn't

1115
00:58:46,200 --> 00:58:50,320
Speaker 3: step away from the sport, find community and find like

1116
00:58:50,920 --> 00:58:54,200
Speaker 3: there doesn't need. I think actually use you as an

1117
00:58:54,240 --> 00:58:58,280
Speaker 3: example often of like create the space, create your space.

1118
00:58:58,400 --> 00:59:01,400
Speaker 3: If there's not a voice in this space, create the

1119
00:59:01,400 --> 00:59:02,800
Speaker 3: space for you and others.

1120
00:59:03,400 --> 00:59:06,400
Speaker 2: You know, as I mentioned in the piece that you

1121
00:59:06,440 --> 00:59:10,400
Speaker 2: wrote for the it's the Anxiety and Depression Association of America.

1122
00:59:10,640 --> 00:59:13,080
Speaker 1: And you know, one of the things.

1123
00:59:12,720 --> 00:59:16,000
Speaker 2: That you discussed in this piece was kind of how

1124
00:59:16,440 --> 00:59:21,880
Speaker 2: challenging it could be that to discuss mental health struggles,

1125
00:59:22,200 --> 00:59:25,440
Speaker 2: especially within our community, because we haven't always been a

1126
00:59:25,480 --> 00:59:28,400
Speaker 2: community that's been open to that. And it feels like

1127
00:59:28,480 --> 00:59:31,240
Speaker 2: now there has been a little bit of a corner

1128
00:59:31,280 --> 00:59:35,040
Speaker 2: that's been turned where I see more of us discussing

1129
00:59:35,280 --> 00:59:39,200
Speaker 2: our mental health challenges. And it's certainly more more professional athletes,

1130
00:59:39,240 --> 00:59:42,000
Speaker 2: to be honest, like they really have been some real

1131
00:59:42,120 --> 00:59:45,960
Speaker 2: leaders in that space. But you touched on something that

1132
00:59:46,040 --> 00:59:48,920
Speaker 2: I think a lot of black women, especially feel You

1133
00:59:49,520 --> 00:59:56,040
Speaker 2: talked about imposter syndrome. For you, as you know, as

1134
00:59:56,080 --> 01:00:00,800
Speaker 2: you reflect or continue to reflect about that, what was

1135
01:00:00,840 --> 01:00:04,320
Speaker 2: it that was making you feel triggering you to feel

1136
01:00:04,320 --> 01:00:07,160
Speaker 2: like you were an imposter despite the fact that you

1137
01:00:07,240 --> 01:00:11,400
Speaker 2: had seemingly accomplished, you know, so much to most of

1138
01:00:11,440 --> 01:00:14,440
Speaker 2: us who are looking at you grinding and trying to

1139
01:00:14,440 --> 01:00:18,880
Speaker 2: make your career and trying to make this happen. It

1140
01:00:18,960 --> 01:00:20,840
Speaker 2: might look like successful a lot of people on the outside.

1141
01:00:20,840 --> 01:00:23,360
Speaker 2: But what was making you feel like I'm an imposter

1142
01:00:23,520 --> 01:00:24,200
Speaker 2: in this space?

1143
01:00:25,960 --> 01:00:29,200
Speaker 3: Analogy that I'll give is when I started playing golf,

1144
01:00:29,360 --> 01:00:31,560
Speaker 3: I knew that I had it far. But what people

1145
01:00:31,560 --> 01:00:35,000
Speaker 3: didn't realize was that they tried to keep me in

1146
01:00:35,040 --> 01:00:37,880
Speaker 3: the same statistics of what it takes to make a

1147
01:00:37,880 --> 01:00:40,800
Speaker 3: great golfer, which is you probably know is like when

1148
01:00:40,840 --> 01:00:42,400
Speaker 3: you first start playing, everyone's like, you need to hit

1149
01:00:42,400 --> 01:00:44,640
Speaker 3: the fairway, you need to hit the green and regulation,

1150
01:00:45,120 --> 01:00:48,480
Speaker 3: you know, like fairways are really important. Your drive off

1151
01:00:48,480 --> 01:00:54,120
Speaker 3: the teams that sets the tone for everything. So with that,

1152
01:00:54,720 --> 01:00:58,000
Speaker 3: it wasn't until college and a little bit of post

1153
01:00:58,000 --> 01:01:00,880
Speaker 3: college where someone was finally like, you hit it far,

1154
01:01:01,040 --> 01:01:03,160
Speaker 3: just hit your driver. Why are we hitting irons off

1155
01:01:03,160 --> 01:01:05,680
Speaker 3: the tee? And so I think for me, my imposture

1156
01:01:05,760 --> 01:01:08,560
Speaker 3: syndrome came from like I'm trying to fulfill these stics

1157
01:01:08,600 --> 01:01:12,520
Speaker 3: that everyone says will equal success, but in reality, success

1158
01:01:12,560 --> 01:01:15,440
Speaker 3: for me would look like hitting a driver and having

1159
01:01:15,480 --> 01:01:17,840
Speaker 3: one hundred yards in Who cares if it's in the

1160
01:01:17,840 --> 01:01:20,080
Speaker 3: fair way or not, if there's an opportunity to burdy

1161
01:01:20,120 --> 01:01:22,320
Speaker 3: it and you're way back there with a five iron

1162
01:01:22,400 --> 01:01:28,960
Speaker 3: hitting you know however far that it's just different, and

1163
01:01:29,000 --> 01:01:31,240
Speaker 3: that goes back to like successive life, it's just different,

1164
01:01:31,400 --> 01:01:33,520
Speaker 3: Like if you're telling me I still have a chance

1165
01:01:33,560 --> 01:01:36,520
Speaker 3: even if my driver goes left into the water, and

1166
01:01:36,560 --> 01:01:38,440
Speaker 3: I can hit it on because I have the distance

1167
01:01:38,440 --> 01:01:41,240
Speaker 3: and then put one put great. And I think that's

1168
01:01:41,320 --> 01:01:45,840
Speaker 3: what my imposture posture syndrome sat in, not only just

1169
01:01:45,840 --> 01:01:48,080
Speaker 3: like in the golf space, but even in life. Coming

1170
01:01:48,080 --> 01:01:52,600
Speaker 3: from a small town successes. You're a doctor, you're a lawyer,

1171
01:01:52,720 --> 01:01:55,560
Speaker 3: you're a banker, you're a teacher, you're a mother. And

1172
01:01:57,480 --> 01:02:00,400
Speaker 3: as I'm also getting older and pursuing this dream, I'm

1173
01:02:00,440 --> 01:02:03,320
Speaker 3: not married, I'm not a mother. I don't have I

1174
01:02:03,320 --> 01:02:06,040
Speaker 3: don't feel like I don't have the things that the

1175
01:02:06,080 --> 01:02:09,880
Speaker 3: statistics of life that people would say make success or

1176
01:02:09,920 --> 01:02:13,600
Speaker 3: make you somebody in this world. And so I decided

1177
01:02:13,640 --> 01:02:16,520
Speaker 3: to rip up the rip up the scorecard.

1178
01:02:17,040 --> 01:02:20,760
Speaker 2: Well, as you have been more public about your mental

1179
01:02:20,800 --> 01:02:24,960
Speaker 2: health journey, how what has the reception been like among

1180
01:02:25,040 --> 01:02:25,919
Speaker 2: your peers.

1181
01:02:26,360 --> 01:02:28,520
Speaker 3: Yeah, I think it's it's been good. I think that

1182
01:02:28,600 --> 01:02:33,480
Speaker 3: there's been Like I mean, in all honesty, I'm like

1183
01:02:33,480 --> 01:02:37,479
Speaker 3: in the thick of you know, struggling with depression right now,

1184
01:02:37,760 --> 01:02:43,880
Speaker 3: and I think it's one of those things where I've

1185
01:02:43,960 --> 01:02:47,919
Speaker 3: learned how to have help, and so I think when

1186
01:02:47,920 --> 01:02:51,880
Speaker 3: I when talking about it, I've seen you know, you'll

1187
01:02:51,920 --> 01:02:55,080
Speaker 3: have people on the internet that will comment, You'll have

1188
01:02:55,080 --> 01:02:57,480
Speaker 3: all those things, and that's great, but as you know,

1189
01:02:57,520 --> 01:02:59,680
Speaker 3: when you're trying to deal with something internally, someone can

1190
01:02:59,720 --> 01:03:03,480
Speaker 3: be like you can be Beyonce and be like, I'm

1191
01:03:03,520 --> 01:03:06,919
Speaker 3: still I'm still not talented or beautiful. You know, it's

1192
01:03:06,960 --> 01:03:09,760
Speaker 3: like you know, Beyonce, and so at the end of

1193
01:03:09,800 --> 01:03:13,680
Speaker 3: the day, it's like, oh, accepting the help from friends

1194
01:03:13,680 --> 01:03:18,400
Speaker 3: and family, understanding to put up boundaries of like there,

1195
01:03:18,520 --> 01:03:21,280
Speaker 3: I have a big, big thing when people speak negative

1196
01:03:21,360 --> 01:03:23,640
Speaker 3: around me, even if they're talking about themselves, Like words

1197
01:03:23,640 --> 01:03:26,840
Speaker 3: are so powerful. I'm not going to let people speak

1198
01:03:26,880 --> 01:03:31,640
Speaker 3: words about themselves or others or anything that is not true.

1199
01:03:31,680 --> 01:03:33,520
Speaker 3: Like even when we think about kids, we're like, oh,

1200
01:03:33,680 --> 01:03:36,920
Speaker 3: how them bad kids doing? That doesn't exist. It's like

1201
01:03:37,240 --> 01:03:39,040
Speaker 3: how the kids doing. Are they like struggling with some

1202
01:03:39,080 --> 01:03:40,960
Speaker 3: things or whatever whatever, But I'm not going to speak

1203
01:03:40,960 --> 01:03:45,040
Speaker 3: that over someone's life. And then for me, I'm learning

1204
01:03:45,080 --> 01:03:47,800
Speaker 3: how to be more vulnerable. That's still a huge struggle

1205
01:03:47,800 --> 01:03:50,360
Speaker 3: for me. I Mean, my Instagram is something where it's

1206
01:03:50,360 --> 01:03:53,080
Speaker 3: like I don't know how to say, like this is

1207
01:03:53,080 --> 01:03:56,200
Speaker 3: what I'm struggling on but maybe get to a point

1208
01:03:56,240 --> 01:03:58,840
Speaker 3: one day where over time kind of like this article

1209
01:03:58,880 --> 01:04:00,000
Speaker 3: where I'm able to speak about it.

1210
01:04:00,600 --> 01:04:02,080
Speaker 2: Yeah, because I was going to ask you, how did

1211
01:04:02,200 --> 01:04:07,000
Speaker 2: writing that that article and being candid about the conditions

1212
01:04:07,040 --> 01:04:08,200
Speaker 2: you were facing.

1213
01:04:07,880 --> 01:04:08,920
Speaker 1: How did that make you feel?

1214
01:04:10,400 --> 01:04:13,040
Speaker 3: I mean, it's even a little unsettling of bringing it up.

1215
01:04:13,080 --> 01:04:16,080
Speaker 3: I'm like, I kind of forgot about it. It was

1216
01:04:16,640 --> 01:04:20,360
Speaker 3: two things. It was really great to go through that

1217
01:04:20,440 --> 01:04:24,040
Speaker 3: with my therapist and even learn how to put language

1218
01:04:24,040 --> 01:04:28,120
Speaker 3: around things that I feel, and also be respectable to

1219
01:04:28,320 --> 01:04:30,680
Speaker 3: the people that did their best, you know, didn't know

1220
01:04:30,720 --> 01:04:32,840
Speaker 3: what they were speaking or didn't know what they were

1221
01:04:32,880 --> 01:04:36,440
Speaker 3: doing that that caused it, and having greater understanding around that.

1222
01:04:38,280 --> 01:04:41,840
Speaker 3: And also, like I said, it really gives me a

1223
01:04:41,840 --> 01:04:47,960
Speaker 3: lot of drive to be more vulnerable in different spaces

1224
01:04:48,040 --> 01:04:51,560
Speaker 3: and like share outside of a one on one conversation

1225
01:04:51,760 --> 01:04:56,360
Speaker 3: but say like, hey, I'm not okay, and that that

1226
01:04:56,640 --> 01:04:59,800
Speaker 3: is okay. But we also have tools and structures to

1227
01:04:59,800 --> 01:05:02,000
Speaker 3: get to the place that we need to go. Like

1228
01:05:02,680 --> 01:05:06,600
Speaker 3: I mean, a great example is like me thinking that oh,

1229
01:05:06,680 --> 01:05:11,600
Speaker 3: everything's frollicking throughout the hallways, you know, because everything's great,

1230
01:05:11,760 --> 01:05:15,200
Speaker 3: and forgetting oh, the medication is helping and then going

1231
01:05:15,200 --> 01:05:18,240
Speaker 3: off medication because I think I'm doing great. It's little

1232
01:05:18,240 --> 01:05:21,080
Speaker 3: things like that of like, Okay, I need people to

1233
01:05:21,080 --> 01:05:24,560
Speaker 3: see the signs around me, and coaches like I think

1234
01:05:24,600 --> 01:05:27,360
Speaker 3: that's one thing that's really big now, like coaches have

1235
01:05:27,440 --> 01:05:29,520
Speaker 3: more language around that. Instead of just saying like, oh,

1236
01:05:29,560 --> 01:05:31,840
Speaker 3: you're injured, it's okay, get out there, we need you,

1237
01:05:32,240 --> 01:05:35,200
Speaker 3: I'm saying like, oh, this could affect your life forever.

1238
01:05:35,720 --> 01:05:39,200
Speaker 2: Yeah, a lot of the things that you've shared publicly

1239
01:05:39,480 --> 01:05:43,720
Speaker 2: about your mental health challenges, my sense is that not

1240
01:05:43,760 --> 01:05:46,160
Speaker 2: only there are there a lot of people in general

1241
01:05:46,280 --> 01:05:48,320
Speaker 2: who struggle with those same things, but I think there's

1242
01:05:48,360 --> 01:05:50,120
Speaker 2: a lot of athletes and probably a lot of athletes

1243
01:05:50,120 --> 01:05:55,760
Speaker 2: in your sport who who struggle with those saying dynamics

1244
01:05:55,800 --> 01:05:58,840
Speaker 2: that you talked about. So, what would you say to them?

1245
01:05:59,800 --> 01:06:03,120
Speaker 2: To other people who are struggling with depression and anxiety

1246
01:06:03,200 --> 01:06:06,520
Speaker 2: and you know, imposter syndrome and all the things that

1247
01:06:06,560 --> 01:06:10,480
Speaker 2: you have given language and voice to, what would you

1248
01:06:10,680 --> 01:06:14,360
Speaker 2: say to them that you think could maybe inform them

1249
01:06:14,440 --> 01:06:17,120
Speaker 2: about how they're feeling and maybe how to address some

1250
01:06:17,200 --> 01:06:17,440
Speaker 2: of it.

1251
01:06:18,240 --> 01:06:22,000
Speaker 3: Yeah, I think first and foremost is that it's normal

1252
01:06:22,920 --> 01:06:26,880
Speaker 3: like I think really tearing down that you are weird

1253
01:06:27,080 --> 01:06:29,600
Speaker 3: or you're not normal or this is and that it's

1254
01:06:29,600 --> 01:06:31,320
Speaker 3: a part of life. And then you add the element

1255
01:06:31,360 --> 01:06:33,960
Speaker 3: as a woman and you put hormones into that. There

1256
01:06:33,960 --> 01:06:36,560
Speaker 3: are also different things that come in play in that.

1257
01:06:37,440 --> 01:06:39,800
Speaker 3: And the second thing is just like really making sure

1258
01:06:39,840 --> 01:06:44,200
Speaker 3: that you are building a community around you that you

1259
01:06:44,200 --> 01:06:47,720
Speaker 3: can invite in, whether that's one person or two people

1260
01:06:49,440 --> 01:06:51,760
Speaker 3: that see you regularly that can I mean I have

1261
01:06:51,800 --> 01:06:57,120
Speaker 3: friends now that I have an introvert who has tons

1262
01:06:57,160 --> 01:07:02,160
Speaker 3: of extra equalities that also has social anxiety, right, and

1263
01:07:02,200 --> 01:07:04,760
Speaker 3: they will see me in a crowd and they're like, hey, good,

1264
01:07:04,840 --> 01:07:06,480
Speaker 3: you need to step out for a second and just

1265
01:07:06,480 --> 01:07:10,560
Speaker 3: like have a moment and they're like yeah, thanks. And

1266
01:07:10,600 --> 01:07:12,840
Speaker 3: so really making sure that even if you don't have

1267
01:07:12,880 --> 01:07:16,360
Speaker 3: the words for it, describing it to somebody and making

1268
01:07:16,360 --> 01:07:18,880
Speaker 3: sure that that you have somebody safe around you at

1269
01:07:18,880 --> 01:07:22,240
Speaker 3: all times. And if you can't be the advocate for yourself,

1270
01:07:22,440 --> 01:07:25,160
Speaker 3: whether that is to a coach or to an authority figure,

1271
01:07:25,960 --> 01:07:29,200
Speaker 3: therapy is the best way to go, especially to have

1272
01:07:29,240 --> 01:07:31,680
Speaker 3: someone to be in your corner to kind of champion

1273
01:07:31,720 --> 01:07:32,280
Speaker 3: you through.

1274
01:07:32,360 --> 01:07:34,720
Speaker 1: So how would you describe your relationship with Golf.

1275
01:07:34,800 --> 01:07:39,560
Speaker 3: Now it's growing. I feel like I feel like me

1276
01:07:39,680 --> 01:07:41,919
Speaker 3: and Golf we were so in love at one time.

1277
01:07:42,000 --> 01:07:44,120
Speaker 3: I mean like as a kid, you know, like when

1278
01:07:44,160 --> 01:07:47,240
Speaker 3: you're in middle school and you got your fellow's boot

1279
01:07:47,360 --> 01:07:49,480
Speaker 3: and you just like holding hands in the classroom, but

1280
01:07:49,480 --> 01:07:51,120
Speaker 3: you're not really going on dates because you ain't got

1281
01:07:51,200 --> 01:07:54,240
Speaker 3: no car, but you're like obsessed with each other. That

1282
01:07:54,440 --> 01:07:57,320
Speaker 3: was like me and Golf from the get go. And

1283
01:07:57,360 --> 01:08:02,240
Speaker 3: then you know, you realize what a relationship is. You know,

1284
01:08:02,360 --> 01:08:06,720
Speaker 3: you're like, oh, this dude, beginning my last nerve, why'd

1285
01:08:06,760 --> 01:08:08,880
Speaker 3: you say okay? Why did you say like, why'd you

1286
01:08:08,880 --> 01:08:10,680
Speaker 3: say bye? Why'd you say bye? I love you? You know.

1287
01:08:11,920 --> 01:08:14,080
Speaker 3: And then so me and Golf had that relationship and

1288
01:08:14,840 --> 01:08:17,160
Speaker 3: we broke up and it was a little toxic there

1289
01:08:17,200 --> 01:08:21,160
Speaker 3: for a second. And now it's like, you know, like

1290
01:08:21,280 --> 01:08:27,600
Speaker 3: I just saw my high school sweetheart and in the

1291
01:08:27,640 --> 01:08:31,200
Speaker 3: grocery store and I was like, oh, you turned out

1292
01:08:31,240 --> 01:08:36,680
Speaker 3: very nice. You know, it was good. And then he's like, oh,

1293
01:08:36,720 --> 01:08:38,640
Speaker 3: I see you, and you ain't got no ring on

1294
01:08:38,680 --> 01:08:41,120
Speaker 3: your finger, you know. And then now we're just kind

1295
01:08:41,120 --> 01:08:44,280
Speaker 3: of in that phase of don't have to do online dating,

1296
01:08:44,360 --> 01:08:45,559
Speaker 3: so I don't have to go to like a top

1297
01:08:45,640 --> 01:08:47,760
Speaker 3: golf with some friends to feel good. Now we're like

1298
01:08:47,880 --> 01:08:52,360
Speaker 3: on the course again and feeling good about shots and

1299
01:08:52,400 --> 01:08:55,679
Speaker 3: finding our people. We got our community. We're like, okay,

1300
01:08:55,840 --> 01:08:58,760
Speaker 3: we're doing this thing. This might be real, so go

1301
01:08:59,080 --> 01:09:03,360
Speaker 3: right now we're we're like talking about engagement. But we'll

1302
01:09:03,400 --> 01:09:05,920
Speaker 3: see if marriage plays out in that will be a

1303
01:09:06,000 --> 01:09:06,960
Speaker 3: one term I'm.

1304
01:09:06,880 --> 01:09:08,439
Speaker 1: Saying is golf spinning the block.

1305
01:09:08,600 --> 01:09:12,360
Speaker 3: Golf is the kids golf.

1306
01:09:14,760 --> 01:09:19,040
Speaker 2: That's where you are, Okay, well, alexis before I let

1307
01:09:19,080 --> 01:09:22,280
Speaker 2: you go, always end every podcast what I call a

1308
01:09:22,320 --> 01:09:23,120
Speaker 2: messy question.

1309
01:09:23,640 --> 01:09:25,760
Speaker 1: This is the question that's gonna get us on the

1310
01:09:25,800 --> 01:09:26,439
Speaker 1: shave room.

1311
01:09:27,760 --> 01:09:29,920
Speaker 3: This is my goal, that's my belong dream, Like I'll

1312
01:09:30,200 --> 01:09:32,080
Speaker 3: exactly to get on the share room. All right.

1313
01:09:32,439 --> 01:09:34,519
Speaker 2: This is the question that's going to get us at

1314
01:09:34,560 --> 01:09:39,479
Speaker 2: some level of viral fame. I've seen this debated often

1315
01:09:39,640 --> 01:09:41,920
Speaker 2: in the golf community, so I need you to sell

1316
01:09:41,960 --> 01:09:45,200
Speaker 2: it once for all, once and for all. If you

1317
01:09:46,040 --> 01:09:49,240
Speaker 2: make a hole in one on a par three course,

1318
01:09:50,080 --> 01:09:51,599
Speaker 2: does it count out?

1319
01:09:51,960 --> 01:09:55,200
Speaker 3: Yes, yes, yes. And if you make a hole in

1320
01:09:55,280 --> 01:09:58,400
Speaker 3: one on indoor simulator, is a half.

1321
01:09:58,760 --> 01:10:00,679
Speaker 1: It's a half, not a hole, but it's half.

1322
01:10:01,479 --> 01:10:05,960
Speaker 3: So right now I have three and a half holly.

1323
01:10:05,760 --> 01:10:09,240
Speaker 2: Ones, you know, because I feel like the Saditi golfers

1324
01:10:09,600 --> 01:10:12,439
Speaker 2: because I've seen this debated across the interne Yeah about

1325
01:10:12,640 --> 01:10:15,479
Speaker 2: does it count if you do this? And the Siditi

1326
01:10:15,520 --> 01:10:17,640
Speaker 2: golfers say it doesn't right that they like, no, that

1327
01:10:17,680 --> 01:10:18,200
Speaker 2: doesn't count.

1328
01:10:18,200 --> 01:10:19,960
Speaker 1: It like it only counts.

1329
01:10:19,760 --> 01:10:23,080
Speaker 2: If you're playing, you know, eighteen at Pebble Beach, Like

1330
01:10:23,120 --> 01:10:23,799
Speaker 2: that's the only.

1331
01:10:23,680 --> 01:10:28,360
Speaker 3: Time, right with the with the tour cameras on and

1332
01:10:28,439 --> 01:10:31,680
Speaker 3: a pro am because you got lucky because it like

1333
01:10:31,720 --> 01:10:34,000
Speaker 3: skipped across the water when you chunked it and then

1334
01:10:34,200 --> 01:10:34,800
Speaker 3: got in the hole.

1335
01:10:34,960 --> 01:10:37,200
Speaker 1: Yeah, I'm like, a holy one is a holy one.

1336
01:10:37,360 --> 01:10:38,000
Speaker 1: A hold on one is.

1337
01:10:37,960 --> 01:10:41,000
Speaker 3: A holy one. Not a lot of people have it, exactly.

1338
01:10:41,600 --> 01:10:43,920
Speaker 3: I'm super rare. I definitely think that it count.

1339
01:10:44,080 --> 01:10:46,000
Speaker 1: Yes, you settled it now.

1340
01:10:46,720 --> 01:10:50,400
Speaker 2: This was sure clipping off to put on the social media.

1341
01:10:50,479 --> 01:10:51,599
Speaker 3: How many hold ones do you have?

1342
01:10:51,920 --> 01:10:52,240
Speaker 1: None?

1343
01:10:52,400 --> 01:10:56,000
Speaker 3: But that's one coming up, one coming up, coming up?

1344
01:10:56,000 --> 01:10:57,559
Speaker 1: What about you? How many holy ones?

1345
01:10:57,840 --> 01:11:03,799
Speaker 3: Three and a half one during COVID two during COVID

1346
01:11:03,800 --> 01:11:06,400
Speaker 3: one on a simulator and my first one ever was

1347
01:11:06,560 --> 01:11:10,000
Speaker 3: in Australia. I might have to send you the video

1348
01:11:10,080 --> 01:11:13,519
Speaker 3: that I did afterwards because I thanked everybody, even though

1349
01:11:13,560 --> 01:11:14,840
Speaker 3: I didn't even see it go in. I was like

1350
01:11:14,840 --> 01:11:18,479
Speaker 3: this for my mama, for everybody else. I couldn't do it.

1351
01:11:18,520 --> 01:11:20,680
Speaker 3: You know. I had the whole speech ready and it

1352
01:11:20,720 --> 01:11:21,679
Speaker 3: comes out every time.

1353
01:11:21,880 --> 01:11:25,080
Speaker 2: So yeah, okay, this really is the last question. But

1354
01:11:25,280 --> 01:11:28,040
Speaker 2: you just by saying that, maybe super curious. What's the

1355
01:11:28,080 --> 01:11:30,320
Speaker 2: best golf shot you think you've ever hit?

1356
01:11:30,840 --> 01:11:33,599
Speaker 3: First time? What's yours mine?

1357
01:11:35,000 --> 01:11:36,880
Speaker 2: I'm trying to remember where I was playing, but I

1358
01:11:37,040 --> 01:11:41,400
Speaker 2: chipped it in from like thirty thirty five yards out

1359
01:11:41,520 --> 01:11:42,679
Speaker 2: and you couldn't have told.

1360
01:11:42,600 --> 01:11:45,439
Speaker 1: Me nothing that day, Like, I mean, period period.

1361
01:11:45,520 --> 01:11:49,640
Speaker 2: I was like, yo, listen, I'm Nellie Carter out here.

1362
01:11:49,640 --> 01:11:53,400
Speaker 2: I don't know right, you could have told me nothing

1363
01:11:53,840 --> 01:11:54,320
Speaker 2: after that.

1364
01:11:54,400 --> 01:11:56,320
Speaker 3: Drive up to the gas station like somebody pumped it,

1365
01:11:56,439 --> 01:11:57,120
Speaker 3: you know what I'm saying.

1366
01:11:57,200 --> 01:12:00,200
Speaker 2: I'm like, yeah, I mean I just chipped out time. Guys,

1367
01:12:00,200 --> 01:12:01,760
Speaker 2: you can't even look me like but I.

1368
01:12:01,760 --> 01:12:04,800
Speaker 3: Beat you though, and did you chip out? Yeah? Exactly

1369
01:12:06,000 --> 01:12:08,320
Speaker 3: A recent one that I've had, because there's there's a

1370
01:12:08,400 --> 01:12:10,920
Speaker 3: few that replay in my mind over and over again.

1371
01:12:10,960 --> 01:12:13,200
Speaker 3: I can think of one from when I first started playing,

1372
01:12:13,200 --> 01:12:17,120
Speaker 3: but recently, I was at an event and I had

1373
01:12:17,160 --> 01:12:19,160
Speaker 3: a really great drive and I was like less than

1374
01:12:19,160 --> 01:12:21,040
Speaker 3: one hundred yards in and I hit the worst best

1375
01:12:21,080 --> 01:12:24,559
Speaker 3: shot I've ever seen, and it like almost does the

1376
01:12:24,600 --> 01:12:28,080
Speaker 3: S word. You can like type that word out because

1377
01:12:28,080 --> 01:12:30,080
Speaker 3: I can't say it, but it almost does the S word.

1378
01:12:30,160 --> 01:12:33,719
Speaker 3: Lands in the bunker, and it's like I love bunkers

1379
01:12:33,800 --> 01:12:36,200
Speaker 3: rather bunker than a grass any day. Hit it out

1380
01:12:36,200 --> 01:12:39,800
Speaker 3: the bunker and pen is like on a slope, and

1381
01:12:39,840 --> 01:12:41,880
Speaker 3: so it goes over the bunker and I have maybe

1382
01:12:41,960 --> 01:12:46,000
Speaker 3: like five feet to work with pen right here, straight

1383
01:12:46,040 --> 01:12:49,679
Speaker 3: downhill slope and I'm like, I don't want to get

1384
01:12:49,720 --> 01:12:52,240
Speaker 3: a bogie. That's my number one thing. And going back

1385
01:12:52,280 --> 01:12:54,360
Speaker 3: to mindset, I'm like, I can ship it in from

1386
01:12:54,360 --> 01:12:58,120
Speaker 3: here right So as I'm walking past the guys see that,

1387
01:12:58,200 --> 01:13:00,920
Speaker 3: I'm a little frustrated. And I love as guys because

1388
01:13:01,200 --> 01:13:03,040
Speaker 3: you know, it's it's great. That's one thing that which

1389
01:13:03,040 --> 01:13:05,000
Speaker 3: we had more of is banter with on the golf

1390
01:13:05,040 --> 01:13:10,120
Speaker 3: course in the women's world. But I walking past them,

1391
01:13:10,120 --> 01:13:12,479
Speaker 3: I'm like, I'm about to make this. I just said it,

1392
01:13:12,520 --> 01:13:14,720
Speaker 3: like I called inn Im about to make this, and

1393
01:13:14,720 --> 01:13:17,120
Speaker 3: they're like, there's no way now you're on a downhill

1394
01:13:17,160 --> 01:13:20,680
Speaker 3: slope with no grass to work with, like, this is

1395
01:13:20,720 --> 01:13:24,559
Speaker 3: an awful lie, and I do one hand practice, put

1396
01:13:24,560 --> 01:13:27,800
Speaker 3: my other hand on there, hit it, knock, it goes

1397
01:13:27,840 --> 01:13:30,200
Speaker 3: in and everyone just like freaks out. That was awesome.

1398
01:13:31,280 --> 01:13:33,040
Speaker 2: And after that you were like, don't nobody look at

1399
01:13:33,080 --> 01:13:34,679
Speaker 2: me and the eye. I just hit the shot about.

1400
01:13:34,479 --> 01:13:37,599
Speaker 3: Light right right? I have nothing else to give you

1401
01:13:37,840 --> 01:13:43,120
Speaker 3: guys like you want to tip do that? Yeah?

1402
01:13:43,160 --> 01:13:45,479
Speaker 2: Well, Alexis, thank you so much for spending this time

1403
01:13:45,600 --> 01:13:48,519
Speaker 2: and for being a guest on politics. And I think

1404
01:13:48,560 --> 01:13:52,680
Speaker 2: a lot of people you know who hear about your

1405
01:13:52,720 --> 01:13:55,960
Speaker 2: testimony and just how open a candidate you have been.

1406
01:13:56,320 --> 01:13:59,320
Speaker 1: You're I hope you know you're helping people.

1407
01:13:59,560 --> 01:14:02,320
Speaker 2: And it may not always feel that way, especially you

1408
01:14:02,360 --> 01:14:04,080
Speaker 2: know as right now as you admit it, like, hey,

1409
01:14:04,120 --> 01:14:06,479
Speaker 2: I'm struggling right now, So it may not feel that

1410
01:14:06,560 --> 01:14:09,080
Speaker 2: right now in this struggle, but trust me, somebody's going

1411
01:14:09,120 --> 01:14:11,720
Speaker 2: to hear this conversation and it's going to give them

1412
01:14:11,720 --> 01:14:15,639
Speaker 2: some aha moments, some clarity, something that they can ground

1413
01:14:15,680 --> 01:14:19,040
Speaker 2: themselves with. So I hope that you walk away trusting

1414
01:14:19,080 --> 01:14:23,040
Speaker 2: and believing that your testimony is powerful and you are

1415
01:14:23,160 --> 01:14:27,160
Speaker 2: enough and so I hope you really allow yourself to

1416
01:14:27,280 --> 01:14:29,680
Speaker 2: receive that, because some of us, I mean, we have

1417
01:14:29,720 --> 01:14:32,240
Speaker 2: a problem receiving. You know, I said one of my

1418
01:14:32,320 --> 01:14:34,880
Speaker 2: things I was going to be working on the last

1419
01:14:34,920 --> 01:14:39,240
Speaker 2: few years is how to receive compliments and really like

1420
01:14:39,360 --> 01:14:41,880
Speaker 2: believe them. And I know that makes me silly to somebody.

1421
01:14:41,600 --> 01:14:45,960
Speaker 1: Who's listening at home, but it is truly. That's how.

1422
01:14:46,200 --> 01:14:49,240
Speaker 2: That's the only way I knew how to fight the

1423
01:14:49,360 --> 01:14:52,599
Speaker 2: imposter syndrome. It's like, I got to receive and accept

1424
01:14:52,640 --> 01:14:54,680
Speaker 2: these flowers and water these flowers when people give it

1425
01:14:54,720 --> 01:14:57,360
Speaker 2: to me instead of dismissing them, because then I won't

1426
01:14:57,360 --> 01:15:00,760
Speaker 2: always go into spaces and feel like do we belong here?

1427
01:15:01,160 --> 01:15:02,920
Speaker 1: I need to learn how to receive the love when

1428
01:15:02,920 --> 01:15:03,320
Speaker 1: it's there.

1429
01:15:03,360 --> 01:15:07,679
Speaker 2: So I hope you receive that and understand that your

1430
01:15:07,800 --> 01:15:09,880
Speaker 2: voice is providing something for people.

1431
01:15:09,960 --> 01:15:12,760
Speaker 1: So good luck. I hope you appreciate that you and

1432
01:15:12,840 --> 01:15:14,320
Speaker 1: Golf continue to court.

1433
01:15:14,680 --> 01:15:15,400
Speaker 3: You know, you.

1434
01:15:17,160 --> 01:15:19,479
Speaker 2: Know, saying it might be the way to at least

1435
01:15:19,520 --> 01:15:21,080
Speaker 2: go to the Bachelor rep party or whatever.

1436
01:15:21,760 --> 01:15:24,759
Speaker 3: Yeah, because that's gonna be fine, but we got.

1437
01:15:24,560 --> 01:15:27,360
Speaker 2: To make it there first. I know y'all still working,

1438
01:15:27,400 --> 01:15:31,800
Speaker 2: y'all building, but yeah, no doubt that this is this

1439
01:15:31,880 --> 01:15:34,320
Speaker 2: is going to be a marriage that that will work out.

1440
01:15:34,439 --> 01:15:37,120
Speaker 2: So good luck for sure, and I can't wait to

1441
01:15:37,160 --> 01:15:38,560
Speaker 2: see you again on the course.

1442
01:15:39,000 --> 01:15:43,200
Speaker 3: Same can you just quick shout out go ahead. So

1443
01:15:43,360 --> 01:15:46,320
Speaker 3: I've been a part of my initiative just utilizing golf

1444
01:15:46,320 --> 01:15:48,479
Speaker 3: for good. I have my own foundation that helps support

1445
01:15:48,520 --> 01:15:50,479
Speaker 3: others as well as just doing helping people out with

1446
01:15:50,560 --> 01:15:53,879
Speaker 3: programming things. And one thing that we're doing that's the

1447
01:15:54,520 --> 01:15:57,559
Speaker 3: uh the anniversary year of Alphad top Holmes integrating the

1448
01:15:57,560 --> 01:16:00,880
Speaker 3: game of golf. Where his attorney is actually for Good

1449
01:16:00,920 --> 01:16:04,120
Speaker 3: Marshall and so here in Atlanta, I've been working on

1450
01:16:04,160 --> 01:16:07,360
Speaker 3: the Alphad Topholmes Museum and now we're kind of incorporating

1451
01:16:07,400 --> 01:16:09,760
Speaker 3: programming and different things like that. So if anyone's ever

1452
01:16:09,800 --> 01:16:13,120
Speaker 3: in the Atlanta area, please visit. But number one thing,

1453
01:16:13,120 --> 01:16:14,840
Speaker 3: if you're looking to get into the game of golf,

1454
01:16:16,320 --> 01:16:20,719
Speaker 3: please research history within the game. It is so vital

1455
01:16:20,760 --> 01:16:23,160
Speaker 3: to continue this game, to move forward to where we're

1456
01:16:23,200 --> 01:16:26,200
Speaker 3: not just branding it, but we're actually making impact and

1457
01:16:26,200 --> 01:16:28,519
Speaker 3: continuing on the legacies that others have built. And that's

1458
01:16:28,560 --> 01:16:30,400
Speaker 3: my number one thing is I really want to make

1459
01:16:30,400 --> 01:16:33,720
Speaker 3: sure that we honor and that we steward legacy as well.

1460
01:16:33,800 --> 01:16:36,439
Speaker 3: So yeah, it's glad to make that little note.

1461
01:16:36,479 --> 01:16:39,599
Speaker 2: Okay, well that's a great way to end this again.

1462
01:16:39,720 --> 01:16:41,759
Speaker 2: Thank you and good luck going forward.

1463
01:16:41,840 --> 01:16:42,160
Speaker 3: Thank you.

1464
01:16:42,439 --> 01:16:45,240
Speaker 2: All Right, y'all know what's coming up next, final segment

1465
01:16:45,320 --> 01:16:47,920
Speaker 2: of his Politics that's on the way in just a moment.

1466
01:16:55,000 --> 01:16:57,439
Speaker 2: All right, everybody, thank you for listening to another episode

1467
01:16:57,439 --> 01:16:58,160
Speaker 2: of politics.

1468
01:16:58,240 --> 01:17:00,000
Speaker 1: I still love hearing from you.

1469
01:17:00,080 --> 01:17:02,080
Speaker 2: If you have a question or comment for me, you

1470
01:17:02,120 --> 01:17:04,720
Speaker 2: can hit me up on social media or email. I'm

1471
01:17:04,720 --> 01:17:08,440
Speaker 2: at Jamail Hill Across all social media platforms, Twitter, Instagram,

1472
01:17:08,479 --> 01:17:12,480
Speaker 2: fan based, Blue Sky, and threads. Please use the hashtags politics.

1473
01:17:12,680 --> 01:17:15,240
Speaker 2: You also have the option of emailing me at Spolitics

1474
01:17:15,240 --> 01:17:18,040
Speaker 2: twenty twenty four at gmail dot com. You can also

1475
01:17:18,080 --> 01:17:20,400
Speaker 2: send me a video of your question, but please make

1476
01:17:20,400 --> 01:17:23,080
Speaker 2: sure it's thirty seconds or less. Don't forget to follow

1477
01:17:23,120 --> 01:17:25,879
Speaker 2: and subscribe to this Politics on iHeart and follows Politics

1478
01:17:25,920 --> 01:17:30,040
Speaker 2: pod on Instagram and TikTok. Politics is spelled SPO l

1479
01:17:30,040 --> 01:17:33,040
Speaker 2: I t I c s. A new episode of Spolitics

1480
01:17:33,080 --> 01:17:36,760
Speaker 2: drops every Thursday on iHeart podcast or wherever you get

1481
01:17:36,760 --> 01:17:40,920
Speaker 2: your podcasts. This is politics where sports and politics don't

1482
01:17:40,960 --> 01:17:46,719
Speaker 2: just mix, They Matter. Spolitics is the production of iHeart

1483
01:17:46,800 --> 01:17:48,599
Speaker 2: Podcasts and the Unbothered network.

1484
01:17:49,000 --> 01:17:50,599
Speaker 1: I'm Your host Jamail Hill.

1485
01:17:51,120 --> 01:17:54,760
Speaker 2: Executive producer is Taylor Schakoin Lucas Hymen is head of

1486
01:17:54,760 --> 01:17:59,320
Speaker 2: Audio and executive producer. Original music for Spolitics provided by

1487
01:17:59,360 --> 01:18:01,400
Speaker 2: Kyle Visk from whis f X