1 00:00:00,560 --> 00:00:02,880 Speaker 1: Welcome to good Game of Sarah Spain, where I'm walking 2 00:00:02,920 --> 00:00:05,720 Speaker 1: into my local bookstore pointing to my book and bragging 3 00:00:05,760 --> 00:00:10,200 Speaker 1: to anyone who walks by. Hey, I wrote that. It's Tuesday, 4 00:00:10,280 --> 00:00:12,800 Speaker 1: June third, and on today's show, we're doing something a 5 00:00:12,800 --> 00:00:16,000 Speaker 1: little bit different and I got to address the elephant 6 00:00:16,040 --> 00:00:18,480 Speaker 1: in the room. And we're not talking about Ellie here. 7 00:00:19,720 --> 00:00:22,119 Speaker 1: I wrote a book about a man, and for that, 8 00:00:22,520 --> 00:00:25,720 Speaker 1: I'm sorry. There are women in the book, though, So 9 00:00:25,960 --> 00:00:28,600 Speaker 1: if you could stand to listen to a whole episode 10 00:00:28,600 --> 00:00:31,400 Speaker 1: that isn't about women's sports, I actually think you'll really 11 00:00:31,520 --> 00:00:34,280 Speaker 1: enjoy it. To celebrate the release of my book Runs 12 00:00:34,280 --> 00:00:37,440 Speaker 1: in the Family, an incredible true story of football, fatherhood 13 00:00:37,440 --> 00:00:39,680 Speaker 1: and belonging, I sat down last week with my co 14 00:00:39,760 --> 00:00:42,320 Speaker 1: author and the subject of the book, Raiders running backs 15 00:00:42,360 --> 00:00:46,280 Speaker 1: coach Dylan McCullough. We talk about the sometimes uncomfortable act 16 00:00:46,320 --> 00:00:49,479 Speaker 1: of excavating year past, the reactions of his friends and 17 00:00:49,520 --> 00:00:52,760 Speaker 1: family to the book, his emotions as launch day approached, 18 00:00:52,840 --> 00:00:57,040 Speaker 1: and the serendipitous and almost unbelievable circumstances of his new 19 00:00:57,120 --> 00:01:01,080 Speaker 1: job with Pete Carroll and the Raiders. Spoiler alert, y'all. 20 00:01:01,200 --> 00:01:03,800 Speaker 1: We've talked openly about the big reveal in this book 21 00:01:03,880 --> 00:01:06,840 Speaker 1: ever since our first story and e sixty feature ran 22 00:01:06,880 --> 00:01:09,280 Speaker 1: on ESPN a few years ago. But if you haven't 23 00:01:09,319 --> 00:01:10,959 Speaker 1: already heard it and you want to read the book 24 00:01:11,000 --> 00:01:14,200 Speaker 1: without knowing the twist, wait to listen to this episode 25 00:01:14,280 --> 00:01:15,960 Speaker 1: until after you've read or listened. 26 00:01:15,680 --> 00:01:16,160 Speaker 2: To the book. 27 00:01:16,480 --> 00:01:20,720 Speaker 1: My chat with Dylan, plus a WNBA reset, roster movement galore, 28 00:01:20,959 --> 00:01:23,880 Speaker 1: and how to switch teams but not owners is all 29 00:01:23,920 --> 00:01:35,200 Speaker 1: coming up right after this welcome back slices. Here's what 30 00:01:35,240 --> 00:01:39,600 Speaker 1: you need to know today. Let's start with the WNBA. 31 00:01:39,959 --> 00:01:42,240 Speaker 1: We're two weeks into the regular season, so let's take 32 00:01:42,280 --> 00:01:45,119 Speaker 1: a minute to step back and admire the standings and 33 00:01:45,200 --> 00:01:48,360 Speaker 1: the gap that's already emerging. At the top of the league, 34 00:01:48,360 --> 00:01:50,760 Speaker 1: you got the New York Liberty and Minnesota Links, both 35 00:01:50,920 --> 00:01:53,880 Speaker 1: undefeated through seven games. Then the middle of the PAC 36 00:01:53,960 --> 00:01:56,600 Speaker 1: teams including the five and two Atlanta Dream and Phoenix 37 00:01:56,640 --> 00:01:59,360 Speaker 1: Mercury anyone else surprised to see Phoenix all the way 38 00:01:59,440 --> 00:02:02,240 Speaker 1: up there. Then all the way at the bottom, we 39 00:02:02,320 --> 00:02:04,800 Speaker 1: got the one in six Dallas Wings and Connecticut Sun. 40 00:02:05,560 --> 00:02:08,520 Speaker 1: Worth noting that the tough start has inspired a roster 41 00:02:08,720 --> 00:02:11,280 Speaker 1: change for the Sun Already On Monday morning, the team 42 00:02:11,320 --> 00:02:15,080 Speaker 1: announced it had waived Robin Parks and signed Jalen Brown. Brown, 43 00:02:15,160 --> 00:02:17,200 Speaker 1: a six to one guard forward, played for the Dallas 44 00:02:17,200 --> 00:02:20,040 Speaker 1: Wings last season before getting traded to the Indiana Fever, 45 00:02:20,240 --> 00:02:22,960 Speaker 1: who waved her ahead of the regular season. So the 46 00:02:23,000 --> 00:02:26,120 Speaker 1: Sun already trying to make moves to improve things. Obviously, 47 00:02:26,280 --> 00:02:28,560 Speaker 1: still a lot of basketball to play this season, but 48 00:02:28,680 --> 00:02:30,880 Speaker 1: so far, it does look like Minnesota and New York 49 00:02:30,919 --> 00:02:35,560 Speaker 1: are gun in for that WNBA Finals rematch. More hoops, 50 00:02:35,639 --> 00:02:39,000 Speaker 1: The Golden State Valkyries may not be winning games yet, 51 00:02:39,040 --> 00:02:42,960 Speaker 1: but their fans are enjoying Balhalla. The new expansion team 52 00:02:43,040 --> 00:02:44,880 Speaker 1: is two and four, but the fans are showing up 53 00:02:44,919 --> 00:02:47,440 Speaker 1: and showing out. All three of their home games today 54 00:02:47,680 --> 00:02:51,880 Speaker 1: have been eighteen thousand plus person sellouts, including Sunday's eighty 55 00:02:51,919 --> 00:02:54,359 Speaker 1: six seventy five loss to the Minnesota Links, where they 56 00:02:54,360 --> 00:02:57,280 Speaker 1: made a real good run before coming up short down 57 00:02:57,280 --> 00:03:01,560 Speaker 1: the stretch. More WNBA. After all those injuries we mentioned yesterday, 58 00:03:01,720 --> 00:03:04,480 Speaker 1: it's not surprising we've got some hardship contract news to 59 00:03:04,520 --> 00:03:07,799 Speaker 1: report today down at Phoenix, Wherecalia Copper is still out 60 00:03:07,800 --> 00:03:10,880 Speaker 1: after arthroscopic knee surgery and alyssa Thomas is sidelined with 61 00:03:10,919 --> 00:03:13,840 Speaker 1: a calf injury. The Mercury signed Hayley Jones to a 62 00:03:13,880 --> 00:03:17,200 Speaker 1: hardship contract on Sunday. Drafted sixth overall in the twenty 63 00:03:17,200 --> 00:03:20,800 Speaker 1: twenty three WNBA draft after four seasons at Stanford, Jones 64 00:03:20,840 --> 00:03:23,520 Speaker 1: played forty games for the Atlanta Dream last season, but 65 00:03:23,760 --> 00:03:27,600 Speaker 1: was waved back in May. Meantime, in Indiana, is Caitlin Clark, 66 00:03:27,639 --> 00:03:30,840 Speaker 1: Sidney Colson, and Sophie Cunningham are all sidelined. The Fever 67 00:03:30,919 --> 00:03:34,080 Speaker 1: signed Airy McDonald to a hardship contract after wrapping up 68 00:03:34,080 --> 00:03:36,640 Speaker 1: her college career at Arizona in twenty twenty one. McDonald 69 00:03:36,640 --> 00:03:39,480 Speaker 1: played three seasons for the Dream, then spent twenty twenty 70 00:03:39,520 --> 00:03:42,160 Speaker 1: four with the Los Angeles Sparks before getting waved heading 71 00:03:42,200 --> 00:03:46,000 Speaker 1: into this season. Despite the circumstances, it's good to see 72 00:03:46,040 --> 00:03:48,920 Speaker 1: both of those players back in the w Can you 73 00:03:48,960 --> 00:03:53,280 Speaker 1: believe it even more? WNBA Los Angeles Sparks tweener Rakia 74 00:03:53,360 --> 00:03:56,400 Speaker 1: Jackson has missed her squad's past two games for quote 75 00:03:56,480 --> 00:04:00,920 Speaker 1: unquote personal reasons, and it's got some folks cyebrows. Race Jackson, 76 00:04:00,960 --> 00:04:03,360 Speaker 1: the number four pick in last year's draft, average over 77 00:04:03,480 --> 00:04:06,600 Speaker 1: thirteen points per game. In twenty twenty four. She's been 78 00:04:06,600 --> 00:04:08,960 Speaker 1: coming off the bench for new head coach Lynn Roberts 79 00:04:08,960 --> 00:04:11,440 Speaker 1: team lately, and her average is down to seven points 80 00:04:11,440 --> 00:04:15,400 Speaker 1: per game. On Sunday, an eagle eyed social media user 81 00:04:15,480 --> 00:04:19,400 Speaker 1: claims Rakia unfollowed the Sparks on Instagram and took mention 82 00:04:19,520 --> 00:04:22,560 Speaker 1: of the team out of her bio. We haven't confirmed this, 83 00:04:23,000 --> 00:04:25,359 Speaker 1: but we do know that Roberts was asked about Jackson 84 00:04:25,400 --> 00:04:27,599 Speaker 1: in a press conference on Sunday and had this to say, 85 00:04:27,920 --> 00:04:30,240 Speaker 1: per an ex post from John W. Davis of the 86 00:04:30,279 --> 00:04:33,480 Speaker 1: Long Beach Press Telegram response to Rakia, Rikey's a big 87 00:04:33,520 --> 00:04:36,160 Speaker 1: part of our organization and our team, and. 88 00:04:37,640 --> 00:04:39,760 Speaker 2: She's taking personal time. 89 00:04:39,520 --> 00:04:43,599 Speaker 1: And we support her and we're excited to get her back. 90 00:04:43,440 --> 00:04:44,600 Speaker 2: When she's ready to be back. 91 00:04:45,040 --> 00:04:49,479 Speaker 1: We'll keep you updated on this situation as it unfolds. Meantime, 92 00:04:49,520 --> 00:04:51,240 Speaker 1: I do want to shout out a bright spot on 93 00:04:51,279 --> 00:04:55,520 Speaker 1: the Sparks roster, Odyssey Simms. She shined on Sunday, putting 94 00:04:55,600 --> 00:04:58,040 Speaker 1: up thirty two points in her LA Sparks eighty five 95 00:04:58,120 --> 00:05:00,839 Speaker 1: eighty loss to the Mercury. It was sim first thirty 96 00:05:00,839 --> 00:05:05,560 Speaker 1: plus point game in six seasons. To Soccer Washington's spirit 97 00:05:05,640 --> 00:05:08,640 Speaker 1: coach Jonathan Heraldez is departing the team to take the 98 00:05:08,720 --> 00:05:12,560 Speaker 1: recently vacated head coaching position at French club Oel Lyon 99 00:05:13,200 --> 00:05:16,360 Speaker 1: both teams, the Spirit and oel are owned by Michelle 100 00:05:16,480 --> 00:05:20,440 Speaker 1: Kang's company Kiniska. Heraldez was hired by the Spirit last 101 00:05:20,520 --> 00:05:22,680 Speaker 1: January as one of the most sought after managers in 102 00:05:22,720 --> 00:05:26,520 Speaker 1: women's soccer after leading FC Barcelona Femini to two Women's 103 00:05:26,600 --> 00:05:30,520 Speaker 1: UEFA Champions League titles. He joined the Spirit Midsummer, and 104 00:05:30,600 --> 00:05:33,200 Speaker 1: his short time in Washington was highlighted by a runner 105 00:05:33,240 --> 00:05:36,960 Speaker 1: up finish in last year's NWSL championship game and a 106 00:05:37,040 --> 00:05:39,560 Speaker 1: Challenge Cup win to start the twenty twenty five season. 107 00:05:39,839 --> 00:05:43,159 Speaker 1: Spirit assistant coach Adrian Gonzalez, who served as the team's 108 00:05:43,160 --> 00:05:46,279 Speaker 1: interim head coach last season before herald has arrived, will 109 00:05:46,320 --> 00:05:49,200 Speaker 1: take over again as official head coach once Heralda's tenure 110 00:05:49,240 --> 00:05:52,600 Speaker 1: officially concludes in July. This is the sixth coaching change 111 00:05:52,640 --> 00:05:56,159 Speaker 1: since Kang became Washington's majority owner in twenty twenty two. 112 00:05:56,839 --> 00:05:59,520 Speaker 1: To the PWHL, today's the day that teams have to 113 00:05:59,560 --> 00:06:02,159 Speaker 1: submit a list of three players that they're protecting for 114 00:06:02,200 --> 00:06:06,480 Speaker 1: the upcoming Expansion Draft. Starting tomorrow, the five day exclusive 115 00:06:06,560 --> 00:06:10,040 Speaker 1: signing window begins. That's when Seattle and Vancouver will be 116 00:06:10,080 --> 00:06:14,600 Speaker 1: allowed to start negotiating with unprotected players. Both Vancouver and 117 00:06:14,640 --> 00:06:17,320 Speaker 1: Seattle will be allowed to sign five players each during 118 00:06:17,360 --> 00:06:20,719 Speaker 1: this period. Then on June ninth, it's the Expansion Draft, 119 00:06:20,880 --> 00:06:22,960 Speaker 1: where both teams will be able to build their rosters 120 00:06:23,000 --> 00:06:26,840 Speaker 1: out to include twelve players each. Like we said before, 121 00:06:26,880 --> 00:06:29,400 Speaker 1: only being allowed to protect three players from the jump 122 00:06:29,520 --> 00:06:32,400 Speaker 1: is wild. We're trying not to get too deep into 123 00:06:32,400 --> 00:06:35,880 Speaker 1: internet rumors and speculation about our favorite players getting snagged 124 00:06:35,920 --> 00:06:38,159 Speaker 1: and relocated. I don't know if I could say the 125 00:06:38,160 --> 00:06:40,800 Speaker 1: same for the players on those teams. If I were them, 126 00:06:40,839 --> 00:06:45,560 Speaker 1: I would be googlin' up a storm. Finally, some cool 127 00:06:45,600 --> 00:06:49,520 Speaker 1: news out of Chicago. The Chicago Color Neutral Stars formerly 128 00:06:49,560 --> 00:06:52,440 Speaker 1: Red Stars, may be losing most of their games, but 129 00:06:52,560 --> 00:06:55,960 Speaker 1: the team's president, Karen Litzo, is winning in the Illinois 130 00:06:55,960 --> 00:06:59,640 Speaker 1: General Assembly. Per release from the Stars, the Assembly quote 131 00:06:59,720 --> 00:07:02,479 Speaker 1: voting to pass House built twenty seven to seventy two, 132 00:07:02,880 --> 00:07:05,279 Speaker 1: a bill backed by the Chicago Stars that a men's 133 00:07:05,320 --> 00:07:09,760 Speaker 1: the Illinois Sports Facility Authority Act, known as the Equity Amendment. 134 00:07:09,880 --> 00:07:13,520 Speaker 1: This legislation ensures that if conversations are had regarding public 135 00:07:13,560 --> 00:07:17,680 Speaker 1: funding for sports facilities through ISFA, that women's professional sports 136 00:07:17,680 --> 00:07:21,240 Speaker 1: teams are to be considered, effectively securing women a seat 137 00:07:21,280 --> 00:07:23,080 Speaker 1: at the table, the bill will be sent to the 138 00:07:23,120 --> 00:07:27,080 Speaker 1: Governor's desk for his consideration. End quote. Now, if you 139 00:07:27,120 --> 00:07:29,560 Speaker 1: listen to the show, you know I often mentioned taxpayer 140 00:07:29,600 --> 00:07:32,520 Speaker 1: funds and city assistants as one of the many benefits 141 00:07:32,600 --> 00:07:36,080 Speaker 1: enjoyed by men's pro leagues but historically denied to women's leagues. 142 00:07:36,520 --> 00:07:38,480 Speaker 1: It feels like there's finally a push in a couple 143 00:07:38,560 --> 00:07:41,880 Speaker 1: different places to start demanding equal support and financial assistance 144 00:07:41,920 --> 00:07:45,800 Speaker 1: for women's stadiums and facilities too, which we love to see. 145 00:07:46,040 --> 00:07:50,800 Speaker 1: So shout out Chicago. We got to take a quick break, y'all. 146 00:07:50,840 --> 00:07:52,760 Speaker 1: When we come back, it's a big day for me 147 00:07:52,920 --> 00:07:55,720 Speaker 1: and my co author, Delan McCullough. Our chat is coming 148 00:07:55,840 --> 00:08:06,600 Speaker 1: up next joining me. He's one of football's premier running 149 00:08:06,640 --> 00:08:09,480 Speaker 1: back coaches, helping nearly twenty backs to one thousand plus 150 00:08:09,600 --> 00:08:12,680 Speaker 1: yard seasons. A five time national finalist for Top running 151 00:08:12,680 --> 00:08:14,440 Speaker 1: Back Coach, he played a key role in the chief 152 00:08:14,520 --> 00:08:16,800 Speaker 1: Super Bowl win helped Notre Dame get back to the 153 00:08:16,840 --> 00:08:19,240 Speaker 1: National Title Game last season and just join the staff 154 00:08:19,240 --> 00:08:21,360 Speaker 1: of the Las Vegas Raiders. He and I wrote a 155 00:08:21,400 --> 00:08:26,200 Speaker 1: book together about his incredible life. It's Delan McCullough. Hi, Delan, Hey, 156 00:08:26,200 --> 00:08:26,800 Speaker 1: how you doing. 157 00:08:27,000 --> 00:08:27,800 Speaker 2: Thank you? Thank you. 158 00:08:28,120 --> 00:08:30,600 Speaker 1: I'm so excited to just chat about this book. We're 159 00:08:30,640 --> 00:08:33,600 Speaker 1: doing lots of interviews together, but me getting to interview 160 00:08:33,640 --> 00:08:35,800 Speaker 1: you is very fun and I want to spend most 161 00:08:35,800 --> 00:08:37,880 Speaker 1: of our time just you know, talking and not rehashing 162 00:08:37,920 --> 00:08:39,599 Speaker 1: the book. So I'm going to give a brief synopsis 163 00:08:39,640 --> 00:08:41,560 Speaker 1: so people kind of know what we're talking about, but 164 00:08:42,120 --> 00:08:44,079 Speaker 1: the goal is to get people to buy the book, 165 00:08:44,160 --> 00:08:46,640 Speaker 1: so we're not going to give all the good stuff. Basically, 166 00:08:47,440 --> 00:08:52,280 Speaker 1: you grew up. You were adopted Youngstown, Ohio, post industrial collapse. 167 00:08:52,360 --> 00:08:55,680 Speaker 1: So you had a young radio DJ and his wife 168 00:08:55,720 --> 00:08:58,040 Speaker 1: who adopted you, and when you were two years old, 169 00:08:58,480 --> 00:09:01,000 Speaker 1: the DJ decided to leave. Now you've got a single 170 00:09:01,040 --> 00:09:03,960 Speaker 1: mom with you and your brother Damon. In a pretty 171 00:09:04,000 --> 00:09:07,480 Speaker 1: tough time in Youngstown, she dealt with a turbulent divorce, 172 00:09:08,679 --> 00:09:11,640 Speaker 1: subsequent relationships that weren't always all that great. There was 173 00:09:11,679 --> 00:09:14,240 Speaker 1: some abuse, there were some drugs, and during all of 174 00:09:14,280 --> 00:09:17,080 Speaker 1: this you're just trying to figure out what your identity 175 00:09:17,200 --> 00:09:20,560 Speaker 1: is as both an adopted kid and as a person 176 00:09:20,600 --> 00:09:21,880 Speaker 1: who do I want to be? What do I want 177 00:09:21,880 --> 00:09:24,960 Speaker 1: to become? You find football. Football becomes a sanctuary. You 178 00:09:25,000 --> 00:09:27,720 Speaker 1: become a great player. Get recruited to play for Miami 179 00:09:27,760 --> 00:09:30,839 Speaker 1: of Ohio by a fellow Youngstown guy, Sherman Smith, who 180 00:09:30,840 --> 00:09:33,040 Speaker 1: had made it big in the NFL and came back 181 00:09:33,040 --> 00:09:35,680 Speaker 1: to recruit for is alma mater was coaching there, brought 182 00:09:35,720 --> 00:09:37,679 Speaker 1: you there. You break a bunch of records. Things are 183 00:09:37,720 --> 00:09:39,520 Speaker 1: going great. You think you're going to be in the NFL. 184 00:09:40,000 --> 00:09:43,120 Speaker 1: Injuries hit the NFL. Dream doesn't happen. You bounce around football. 185 00:09:43,360 --> 00:09:46,200 Speaker 1: You get into teaching. You get into coaching. You're making 186 00:09:46,240 --> 00:09:48,120 Speaker 1: a name for yourself as a coach, all while being 187 00:09:48,360 --> 00:09:51,280 Speaker 1: mentored by a handful of your coaches, including Sherman Smith. 188 00:09:51,520 --> 00:09:54,960 Speaker 1: You have four sons, and every time you have to 189 00:09:54,960 --> 00:09:56,679 Speaker 1: tell them, I'm just not sure what my history is. 190 00:09:56,720 --> 00:09:58,200 Speaker 1: I don't know my birth parents, I don't know my 191 00:09:58,240 --> 00:10:02,240 Speaker 1: medical history. And final in your early forties, the laws 192 00:10:02,320 --> 00:10:04,480 Speaker 1: change and you're able to find your birth certificate. You'll 193 00:10:04,520 --> 00:10:07,920 Speaker 1: find your mom within two days on Facebook. Turns out 194 00:10:07,960 --> 00:10:10,720 Speaker 1: she was a sixteen year old honor student who was 195 00:10:10,760 --> 00:10:13,600 Speaker 1: sent away to have you in private, went back to 196 00:10:13,640 --> 00:10:15,880 Speaker 1: school with no one. The wiser only told her parents, 197 00:10:15,880 --> 00:10:17,560 Speaker 1: and her cousin didn't even tell the dad because he 198 00:10:17,600 --> 00:10:19,400 Speaker 1: was already off to school and she didn't want to 199 00:10:19,400 --> 00:10:22,720 Speaker 1: disrupt his life. And you find her on Facebook and 200 00:10:22,800 --> 00:10:24,679 Speaker 1: ask her about her life. It turns out she was 201 00:10:24,720 --> 00:10:27,160 Speaker 1: in Youngstown, right down the street from you, but you 202 00:10:27,240 --> 00:10:29,960 Speaker 1: never knew. And you asked, you know who my dad is? 203 00:10:30,000 --> 00:10:33,200 Speaker 1: And she says, your dad is a man named Sherman Smith. 204 00:10:33,640 --> 00:10:36,079 Speaker 1: So it turns out your college football coach and mentor 205 00:10:36,120 --> 00:10:39,600 Speaker 1: of nearly thirty years was your dad all along. Now 206 00:10:39,600 --> 00:10:41,440 Speaker 1: it sounds like we're giving away the story, but I 207 00:10:41,440 --> 00:10:43,480 Speaker 1: promise you there is so much good stuff in this 208 00:10:43,800 --> 00:10:46,720 Speaker 1: that it's not really about the twist. It's about everything else. 209 00:10:47,640 --> 00:10:49,480 Speaker 1: So Deilan, I just want to ask you were just 210 00:10:49,520 --> 00:10:51,760 Speaker 1: a few days out from the official launch date of 211 00:10:51,840 --> 00:10:55,520 Speaker 1: the book. How are you feeling? What are the predominant emotions? 212 00:10:55,880 --> 00:10:56,040 Speaker 3: Oh? 213 00:10:56,080 --> 00:10:57,400 Speaker 2: I'm excited, you know. 214 00:10:57,760 --> 00:11:04,400 Speaker 4: I'm looking forward to every getting a resonated message of 215 00:11:04,440 --> 00:11:09,360 Speaker 4: hope and overcoming adversity and searching for who you really 216 00:11:09,440 --> 00:11:12,800 Speaker 4: are and overcoming whatever it takes to find out those answers, 217 00:11:12,840 --> 00:11:15,800 Speaker 4: So I'm excited about it. There was some trepidation for 218 00:11:15,880 --> 00:11:19,080 Speaker 4: a little bit, of course, but I'm past that and 219 00:11:19,120 --> 00:11:21,920 Speaker 4: I'm excited about the message that the book. 220 00:11:21,679 --> 00:11:22,160 Speaker 2: Is going to say. 221 00:11:22,720 --> 00:11:25,199 Speaker 1: I'm glad to hear that. I was worried about the trepidation. 222 00:11:25,320 --> 00:11:27,760 Speaker 1: I was trying to make sure I was supportive during that, 223 00:11:27,800 --> 00:11:30,640 Speaker 1: because it's tough to tell the whole world your story. 224 00:11:30,640 --> 00:11:33,000 Speaker 1: It's tough to unearth some of this stuff. But I 225 00:11:33,080 --> 00:11:35,360 Speaker 1: knew once we got to the end, it would not 226 00:11:35,400 --> 00:11:37,439 Speaker 1: only serve you and your family, but so many other 227 00:11:37,480 --> 00:11:39,680 Speaker 1: people who are going to read it. And I wonder 228 00:11:39,800 --> 00:11:42,280 Speaker 1: that trepidation. What was the toughest part for you in 229 00:11:42,320 --> 00:11:45,480 Speaker 1: figuring out, Okay, I'm opening up my life and my 230 00:11:45,520 --> 00:11:47,760 Speaker 1: family and my friends, not only to Sarah to tell 231 00:11:47,800 --> 00:11:49,680 Speaker 1: the story, but soon to the world. 232 00:11:50,400 --> 00:11:54,280 Speaker 4: I'm a really quiet person, so I'm really reserved and 233 00:11:54,320 --> 00:11:58,640 Speaker 4: to myself, you know. But I think the story says 234 00:11:58,760 --> 00:12:02,319 Speaker 4: this that when I open up and let people in, 235 00:12:02,400 --> 00:12:04,920 Speaker 4: that there's things that people can learn from me. So, 236 00:12:05,120 --> 00:12:07,600 Speaker 4: you know, just just doing that kind of opening myself 237 00:12:07,679 --> 00:12:11,240 Speaker 4: up to other people. But again, I think the thing 238 00:12:11,280 --> 00:12:13,960 Speaker 4: that was overwriting for me is what people can learn 239 00:12:14,000 --> 00:12:16,160 Speaker 4: from this, and it was therapy in this for me too. 240 00:12:16,360 --> 00:12:17,240 Speaker 2: I mean, it just. 241 00:12:17,240 --> 00:12:21,720 Speaker 4: Really was was immensely therapeutic for me, kind of going 242 00:12:21,720 --> 00:12:26,720 Speaker 4: through having these conversations, writing these things down, having it written. 243 00:12:26,760 --> 00:12:29,520 Speaker 4: At least that first draft was pretty hardcore, man, and 244 00:12:29,559 --> 00:12:31,520 Speaker 4: I was like, whoa, this is something. You know, when 245 00:12:31,559 --> 00:12:33,680 Speaker 4: you get it back the way that you got it back, 246 00:12:34,200 --> 00:12:37,960 Speaker 4: you don't realize how tough it is, you know, and 247 00:12:37,960 --> 00:12:39,800 Speaker 4: it makes you look yourself in the mirror. But once 248 00:12:39,840 --> 00:12:43,000 Speaker 4: we got through, we did kind of smoothed out some edges, 249 00:12:43,360 --> 00:12:45,360 Speaker 4: but not taking away the true flavor for what the 250 00:12:45,400 --> 00:12:46,160 Speaker 4: book is going to be. 251 00:12:46,480 --> 00:12:48,600 Speaker 2: I'm excited to see what people get from Yeah. 252 00:12:48,640 --> 00:12:52,520 Speaker 1: I remember I was sitting with my friends at dinner 253 00:12:52,559 --> 00:12:55,480 Speaker 1: getting ready to go see Madonna, and that was the 254 00:12:55,480 --> 00:12:57,960 Speaker 1: first text I got from you after I sent the 255 00:12:57,960 --> 00:12:59,960 Speaker 1: first draft. And a lot of people as they're writing book, 256 00:13:00,080 --> 00:13:02,760 Speaker 1: they're sort of like checking in chapter by chapter. But 257 00:13:02,760 --> 00:13:04,400 Speaker 1: I knew a lot of my interviews with you and 258 00:13:04,440 --> 00:13:06,719 Speaker 1: your family would cause me to revise things and go 259 00:13:06,760 --> 00:13:09,160 Speaker 1: back and change the order of things. So as we 260 00:13:09,160 --> 00:13:11,679 Speaker 1: were doing the interviews and talking, I was like, all right, 261 00:13:11,720 --> 00:13:13,480 Speaker 1: he's going to get the one big first draft and 262 00:13:13,520 --> 00:13:15,560 Speaker 1: then we'll work on it together. And I was so 263 00:13:15,720 --> 00:13:19,080 Speaker 1: nervous about what you might say, and you were super positive, 264 00:13:19,080 --> 00:13:21,360 Speaker 1: which I loved. But you also said I learned a lot. 265 00:13:21,960 --> 00:13:23,240 Speaker 1: And I said that to my friend. I was, oh, 266 00:13:23,320 --> 00:13:24,920 Speaker 1: I'm so glad he said he learned a lot. She's like, 267 00:13:24,960 --> 00:13:26,440 Speaker 1: it's his life, what does he have to learn? And 268 00:13:26,480 --> 00:13:29,439 Speaker 1: I'm like, girl, I read like nine books to prep 269 00:13:29,480 --> 00:13:31,240 Speaker 1: for this so I could make sure it wasn't just 270 00:13:31,280 --> 00:13:33,360 Speaker 1: about him but about all of us and how we 271 00:13:33,440 --> 00:13:36,040 Speaker 1: all get to make these choices about ourselves and our family. 272 00:13:36,600 --> 00:13:40,320 Speaker 1: And I was also really happy that throughout your brother 273 00:13:40,400 --> 00:13:42,319 Speaker 1: and some other members of your family were reading it 274 00:13:42,360 --> 00:13:45,840 Speaker 1: and really saying, you got me, you understood me, and 275 00:13:45,880 --> 00:13:48,559 Speaker 1: you told my story right. I wonder now that you've 276 00:13:48,559 --> 00:13:50,400 Speaker 1: shared the book with more of your friends and family, 277 00:13:50,720 --> 00:13:53,440 Speaker 1: were you surprised by anyone's reaction or feedback? 278 00:13:54,920 --> 00:13:58,360 Speaker 4: Not really, you know what it was overall, it was 279 00:13:58,440 --> 00:14:01,200 Speaker 4: very positive. So what I sent to an array of 280 00:14:01,240 --> 00:14:05,079 Speaker 4: people now, like hey, friends from long time ago, recent 281 00:14:05,520 --> 00:14:09,280 Speaker 4: you know obviously you know, longstanding friends, people in my family, 282 00:14:09,320 --> 00:14:10,320 Speaker 4: different things like that. 283 00:14:10,240 --> 00:14:12,800 Speaker 2: Who I knew I would get the truth from. And 284 00:14:13,080 --> 00:14:14,679 Speaker 2: you know, at one point. 285 00:14:14,520 --> 00:14:15,840 Speaker 4: I thought, I mean, I would get maybe one of 286 00:14:15,840 --> 00:14:18,200 Speaker 4: my cousins say, hey, this ain't a good idea. 287 00:14:18,280 --> 00:14:21,200 Speaker 2: Hey chapter six or chapter fifteen, this is going to 288 00:14:21,240 --> 00:14:23,920 Speaker 2: be a problem. But everyone was so supportive. 289 00:14:24,000 --> 00:14:27,000 Speaker 4: Everybody, and I went into it and loaded it's saying, hey, 290 00:14:27,240 --> 00:14:29,160 Speaker 4: tell me the truth, tell me where you think it's 291 00:14:29,200 --> 00:14:31,400 Speaker 4: going to be some hot spots, just give me your 292 00:14:31,440 --> 00:14:32,200 Speaker 4: perspective on it. 293 00:14:32,240 --> 00:14:35,360 Speaker 2: And it's been overwhelmingly positive. I didn't hear anything about 294 00:14:35,440 --> 00:14:37,920 Speaker 2: any issues or things like that. 295 00:14:37,960 --> 00:14:39,640 Speaker 4: And I know it's not perfect, but it's going to 296 00:14:39,720 --> 00:14:43,680 Speaker 4: be pretty perfect in how it hits people's hearts and 297 00:14:43,720 --> 00:14:47,080 Speaker 4: hopefully it gives them some insight that can help elevate 298 00:14:47,160 --> 00:14:49,560 Speaker 4: things that they have going on in their own lives. 299 00:14:49,880 --> 00:14:52,080 Speaker 1: Yeah, I'm so glad to hear that. It is scary 300 00:14:52,160 --> 00:14:54,920 Speaker 1: to tell stories, and we all have our own memories 301 00:14:54,920 --> 00:14:57,400 Speaker 1: of things. We all remember things differently. And one of 302 00:14:57,480 --> 00:14:59,440 Speaker 1: the most powerful things you said to me is you 303 00:14:59,680 --> 00:15:02,640 Speaker 1: were telling me these stories of your past and your 304 00:15:02,720 --> 00:15:04,720 Speaker 1: childhood and growing up and all these other things. Is 305 00:15:04,720 --> 00:15:08,520 Speaker 1: a conversation you had with your adoptive mom Adele. And 306 00:15:08,560 --> 00:15:11,400 Speaker 1: you said, listen, Ma, like I get that this is 307 00:15:11,440 --> 00:15:14,080 Speaker 1: how you remember this and I get that you're giving 308 00:15:14,120 --> 00:15:16,200 Speaker 1: me context that I didn't know as a kid about 309 00:15:16,200 --> 00:15:18,240 Speaker 1: why you made these choices or why these things happened. 310 00:15:18,560 --> 00:15:20,440 Speaker 1: But I was a kid and I didn't know that. 311 00:15:20,560 --> 00:15:23,080 Speaker 1: So this is how I took it then. And that's 312 00:15:23,120 --> 00:15:25,480 Speaker 1: the part we have to share, is not the revised 313 00:15:25,560 --> 00:15:27,720 Speaker 1: version of now I understand looking back, but how it 314 00:15:27,760 --> 00:15:30,440 Speaker 1: felt for you as a kid as a teen to 315 00:15:30,520 --> 00:15:32,080 Speaker 1: go through some of the tough times. And that was 316 00:15:32,120 --> 00:15:34,120 Speaker 1: really powerful. And I think that's why it's so useful 317 00:15:34,200 --> 00:15:37,280 Speaker 1: to really get your story out. When it lives in 318 00:15:37,320 --> 00:15:40,120 Speaker 1: your head, you can just keep editing as you go, 319 00:15:40,200 --> 00:15:42,760 Speaker 1: but there's something about putting it down and really being 320 00:15:42,800 --> 00:15:45,160 Speaker 1: honest about what it was. You know, one of the 321 00:15:45,200 --> 00:15:47,600 Speaker 1: big parts of this book is choice. You have been 322 00:15:47,680 --> 00:15:50,520 Speaker 1: very clear since the beginning that life did not happen 323 00:15:50,640 --> 00:15:53,120 Speaker 1: to you. You chose the person that you are. You 324 00:15:53,160 --> 00:15:55,760 Speaker 1: didn't let a tough childhood hold you back. You didn't 325 00:15:55,760 --> 00:15:58,000 Speaker 1: want to repeat the behaviors of some of the toxic 326 00:15:58,120 --> 00:16:00,480 Speaker 1: parents or parent figures that you had. Where do you 327 00:16:00,520 --> 00:16:03,160 Speaker 1: think you found that strength throughout your life to be 328 00:16:03,280 --> 00:16:05,800 Speaker 1: resilient and choose your own path, Maybe not the path 329 00:16:05,840 --> 00:16:07,360 Speaker 1: that would have been handed to you. 330 00:16:08,120 --> 00:16:09,040 Speaker 2: That's a great question. 331 00:16:09,200 --> 00:16:11,240 Speaker 4: I don't know, just just sitting there and hearing some 332 00:16:11,320 --> 00:16:12,920 Speaker 4: of the things that I heard, some of the things 333 00:16:13,000 --> 00:16:19,040 Speaker 4: I experienced, you know, just it was like a switch 334 00:16:19,160 --> 00:16:21,320 Speaker 4: was flipped and I was just saying, you know what, 335 00:16:21,440 --> 00:16:23,960 Speaker 4: I sat up one night and it's an argument or 336 00:16:23,960 --> 00:16:26,200 Speaker 4: whatever going on, and again, not being. 337 00:16:26,000 --> 00:16:28,320 Speaker 2: Disrespectful to anything, I just said, you know what, this 338 00:16:28,480 --> 00:16:32,080 Speaker 2: is not how my life is going to be when I. 339 00:16:32,000 --> 00:16:36,000 Speaker 4: Grow up and I'm in a position to have influence 340 00:16:36,120 --> 00:16:38,360 Speaker 4: or I have my own family, that it won't be 341 00:16:38,520 --> 00:16:42,720 Speaker 4: like this. So I took a lot of those lessons 342 00:16:43,120 --> 00:16:44,960 Speaker 4: that I learned to kind of reverse them, because you 343 00:16:45,000 --> 00:16:46,920 Speaker 4: would say, well, shoot, those are some bad things that 344 00:16:46,960 --> 00:16:47,400 Speaker 4: you've seen. 345 00:16:47,840 --> 00:16:49,400 Speaker 2: Why didn't you mimic them or what? 346 00:16:49,720 --> 00:16:52,160 Speaker 4: Or they were things that you could end up kind 347 00:16:52,160 --> 00:16:54,800 Speaker 4: of falling victim to as far as your decision making, 348 00:16:54,840 --> 00:16:55,440 Speaker 4: And I said no. 349 00:16:55,840 --> 00:16:57,760 Speaker 2: I looked at him as the reverse and said, look, 350 00:16:57,840 --> 00:16:58,440 Speaker 2: I'm glad. 351 00:16:58,480 --> 00:17:02,440 Speaker 4: I said, I'm glad that I had these experiences because 352 00:17:02,440 --> 00:17:04,119 Speaker 4: it moted me into who I am, and I wanted 353 00:17:04,160 --> 00:17:05,320 Speaker 4: to be the opposite of let lesson. 354 00:17:05,600 --> 00:17:07,760 Speaker 1: Yeah, that's a through line something that your mom told 355 00:17:07,760 --> 00:17:10,919 Speaker 1: you when you were young, which was God gives you 356 00:17:10,960 --> 00:17:14,120 Speaker 1: a choice. You know you can. God gives you let's 357 00:17:14,160 --> 00:17:15,880 Speaker 1: you see good and bad, and you get to choose 358 00:17:15,880 --> 00:17:17,760 Speaker 1: what you want to be. And it feels like you 359 00:17:17,880 --> 00:17:20,800 Speaker 1: kept doing that. You know, it's really a book about you, 360 00:17:20,880 --> 00:17:23,280 Speaker 1: but about all of us and all of our families, 361 00:17:23,320 --> 00:17:27,439 Speaker 1: both birth and found families, and you know, I wanted 362 00:17:27,440 --> 00:17:29,840 Speaker 1: to be sure to write about it, and I wanted 363 00:17:29,840 --> 00:17:32,439 Speaker 1: to really understand how interesting it is to be handed 364 00:17:32,480 --> 00:17:36,119 Speaker 1: stuff via blood that's very obvious, DNA and genes, but 365 00:17:36,200 --> 00:17:39,679 Speaker 1: also what were handed via family messaging and lessons and traditions. 366 00:17:39,720 --> 00:17:42,000 Speaker 1: And it's so easy to sometimes take those things as 367 00:17:42,119 --> 00:17:44,840 Speaker 1: fact after you hear them over and over, the things 368 00:17:44,840 --> 00:17:47,639 Speaker 1: your parents always say, or the kind of throwaway lines 369 00:17:47,680 --> 00:17:49,960 Speaker 1: that they don't even recognize their repeating, and you start 370 00:17:50,000 --> 00:17:51,800 Speaker 1: to internalize it and you're like, well, that's how it is. 371 00:17:52,320 --> 00:17:54,280 Speaker 1: But I wanted folks who read it to consider that 372 00:17:54,920 --> 00:17:57,439 Speaker 1: while their genes are decided, they get to choose what 373 00:17:57,480 --> 00:17:59,359 Speaker 1: they passed down to their children. They get to choose 374 00:17:59,359 --> 00:18:01,800 Speaker 1: what they continue with their siblings, even with their parents. 375 00:18:02,000 --> 00:18:04,040 Speaker 1: You can go back and heal backwards. If you decide 376 00:18:04,080 --> 00:18:06,639 Speaker 1: something that you have with your family isn't serving you. 377 00:18:07,200 --> 00:18:09,840 Speaker 1: Did the book help you have some of those tough 378 00:18:09,840 --> 00:18:12,320 Speaker 1: conversations with your family? Did it bring up some stuff 379 00:18:12,359 --> 00:18:14,240 Speaker 1: through reading it that made you want to talk to 380 00:18:14,280 --> 00:18:15,480 Speaker 1: them about some of those choices. 381 00:18:16,160 --> 00:18:16,360 Speaker 2: Yeah. 382 00:18:16,400 --> 00:18:19,359 Speaker 4: I mean it's interesting when you look back and you 383 00:18:19,400 --> 00:18:24,840 Speaker 4: talk about the habits or the tendencies you pick up 384 00:18:24,960 --> 00:18:27,919 Speaker 4: just based on how you were raising. I mean, and 385 00:18:28,000 --> 00:18:30,119 Speaker 4: I was aware of those things, you know, to a 386 00:18:30,200 --> 00:18:33,360 Speaker 4: degree as we went through the book, and I thought about, hey, 387 00:18:33,400 --> 00:18:37,119 Speaker 4: as a young you know, as a young person and 388 00:18:37,160 --> 00:18:40,280 Speaker 4: an young adult, just the way the structure of our 389 00:18:40,280 --> 00:18:40,800 Speaker 4: home was. 390 00:18:40,840 --> 00:18:42,960 Speaker 2: And it wasn't anything wrong. A lot of people raised 391 00:18:43,000 --> 00:18:45,679 Speaker 2: like this. You didn't question authority, You didn't question some 392 00:18:45,720 --> 00:18:48,080 Speaker 2: things you didn't. You just kind of went with the flow. 393 00:18:48,560 --> 00:18:50,679 Speaker 4: And I talk to people about the books, you know 394 00:18:50,760 --> 00:18:52,400 Speaker 4: right now, shoot a couple hours ago. 395 00:18:54,000 --> 00:18:55,240 Speaker 2: That resonates with people. 396 00:18:55,280 --> 00:18:58,520 Speaker 4: They say, look, I still do that today for me 397 00:18:59,440 --> 00:19:02,520 Speaker 4: in my home, I just said, look, I wanted people 398 00:19:02,560 --> 00:19:04,720 Speaker 4: to understand the why, you know. 399 00:19:04,720 --> 00:19:06,480 Speaker 2: This is what we're doing this for. Here's why this 400 00:19:06,520 --> 00:19:07,119 Speaker 2: is happening. 401 00:19:07,320 --> 00:19:09,320 Speaker 4: And it was an open form where guys can have 402 00:19:09,320 --> 00:19:12,000 Speaker 4: a conversation about being so I didn't want it to 403 00:19:12,040 --> 00:19:14,560 Speaker 4: be a situation where hey, I'm grown, you just do 404 00:19:14,600 --> 00:19:16,439 Speaker 4: what I say do and all these different things, and 405 00:19:16,440 --> 00:19:17,879 Speaker 4: the same thing with my coach, and I'll try to 406 00:19:17,880 --> 00:19:19,879 Speaker 4: get the guy as the why and give them a 407 00:19:19,880 --> 00:19:23,320 Speaker 4: little bit of a voice and empower them to a degree. So, yes, 408 00:19:23,400 --> 00:19:27,160 Speaker 4: the book was therapeutic because it pulled all those layers. 409 00:19:26,840 --> 00:19:28,879 Speaker 2: Back and it also revealed to me a bunch of 410 00:19:28,920 --> 00:19:30,080 Speaker 2: things that I'm. 411 00:19:30,440 --> 00:19:32,399 Speaker 4: I ain't I ain't closed the gap on yet, I 412 00:19:32,400 --> 00:19:33,720 Speaker 4: got I still got some things. 413 00:19:33,720 --> 00:19:35,680 Speaker 2: I'm like, Wow, there's issues. 414 00:19:35,720 --> 00:19:38,520 Speaker 4: There's things that were that are in the book to 415 00:19:38,600 --> 00:19:40,520 Speaker 4: make me say, I still need a whole lot of 416 00:19:40,600 --> 00:19:42,200 Speaker 4: things that I need to overhain. 417 00:19:42,400 --> 00:19:45,159 Speaker 1: Yeah, are there new questions that you now have? Are 418 00:19:45,160 --> 00:19:49,000 Speaker 1: there things that you answered a lot about yourself and 419 00:19:49,000 --> 00:19:51,359 Speaker 1: where you came from, But now as you continue to 420 00:19:51,400 --> 00:19:53,320 Speaker 1: be a part of this new blended family, are there 421 00:19:53,400 --> 00:19:55,080 Speaker 1: new questions or goals that you have? 422 00:19:55,920 --> 00:19:57,960 Speaker 2: Well, I mean, I just want to continue to grow 423 00:19:58,160 --> 00:19:59,200 Speaker 2: in my communication. 424 00:20:00,720 --> 00:20:02,840 Speaker 4: You know, as I said here, I sent this to 425 00:20:02,880 --> 00:20:07,400 Speaker 4: one of my friends and they had asked, have you, 426 00:20:07,440 --> 00:20:12,639 Speaker 4: guys the people in the book have we addressed through counseling, 427 00:20:12,760 --> 00:20:15,800 Speaker 4: et cetera. Some of those things, and I said, no, 428 00:20:15,920 --> 00:20:18,719 Speaker 4: we haven't. And that was an interesting thing just to 429 00:20:18,720 --> 00:20:21,840 Speaker 4: think about. Like I'm kind of doing therapy in real 430 00:20:21,920 --> 00:20:25,879 Speaker 4: time like with the world, like people going get interviewed 431 00:20:25,920 --> 00:20:28,600 Speaker 4: and different things, and I say, how did you overcome this? 432 00:20:28,720 --> 00:20:30,360 Speaker 4: So how do you think about that? I'ma say, I'm 433 00:20:30,359 --> 00:20:33,720 Speaker 4: still figuring it out. Yeah, you know, and look, I'm 434 00:20:33,720 --> 00:20:36,760 Speaker 4: inviting you guys into that process that's going on right 435 00:20:36,800 --> 00:20:39,000 Speaker 4: now and just trying to work my way through it, 436 00:20:39,040 --> 00:20:42,119 Speaker 4: but again being as transparent as possible, and you know, 437 00:20:42,480 --> 00:20:46,000 Speaker 4: letting you know, bearing my scars in the process and 438 00:20:46,080 --> 00:20:48,359 Speaker 4: hopefully people learn from them because I'm still learning from 439 00:20:48,400 --> 00:20:48,960 Speaker 4: them right now. 440 00:20:49,080 --> 00:20:50,480 Speaker 1: I love that there are a lot of people that 441 00:20:50,560 --> 00:20:53,600 Speaker 1: want to wait till they're at the quote unquote finished product, 442 00:20:53,800 --> 00:20:56,400 Speaker 1: but there is so much benefit to letting people see 443 00:20:56,400 --> 00:20:58,919 Speaker 1: the messy middle. I think you're past the middle. I 444 00:20:58,920 --> 00:21:01,320 Speaker 1: think you're further down the way the road than the middle. 445 00:21:01,320 --> 00:21:03,800 Speaker 1: But you're definitely not a finished product. None of us are. 446 00:21:04,320 --> 00:21:07,480 Speaker 1: I learned a lot about myself and my family by 447 00:21:07,800 --> 00:21:11,040 Speaker 1: doing this book, and I really took so much joy 448 00:21:11,040 --> 00:21:13,119 Speaker 1: in doing the research. All the books I read about 449 00:21:13,160 --> 00:21:16,560 Speaker 1: family systems and generational trauma and emotional DNA and all 450 00:21:16,560 --> 00:21:19,280 Speaker 1: that stuff. And I got to play therapist a little 451 00:21:19,359 --> 00:21:22,320 Speaker 1: in my desire to understand each person in the book 452 00:21:22,320 --> 00:21:24,240 Speaker 1: and why they made the choices they did and be 453 00:21:24,359 --> 00:21:28,960 Speaker 1: empathetic and intentional about why they became who they are. 454 00:21:29,000 --> 00:21:31,000 Speaker 1: And that's one of the things I think when you 455 00:21:31,000 --> 00:21:32,960 Speaker 1: get far enough in life and you realize that people 456 00:21:33,000 --> 00:21:34,800 Speaker 1: are the way they are because of things that happened 457 00:21:34,800 --> 00:21:38,439 Speaker 1: to them, things that happened around them, you tend to 458 00:21:38,440 --> 00:21:41,600 Speaker 1: be a little more empathetic. Even if they're jerk offs. 459 00:21:41,960 --> 00:21:44,359 Speaker 1: You tend to feel like they're they're that way because 460 00:21:44,400 --> 00:21:46,959 Speaker 1: of something, and could you help them through it instead 461 00:21:46,960 --> 00:21:50,280 Speaker 1: of just coming, you know, being at odds with them. 462 00:21:50,880 --> 00:21:55,359 Speaker 1: I wonder what's been the best part of the journey 463 00:21:55,359 --> 00:21:58,200 Speaker 1: of finding your birth parents Just. 464 00:21:58,200 --> 00:21:59,800 Speaker 2: That connection, you know. 465 00:22:00,000 --> 00:22:02,760 Speaker 4: I mean, you know, the conversations I have with my 466 00:22:02,840 --> 00:22:04,760 Speaker 4: dad and the conversations I have with my mom. 467 00:22:04,800 --> 00:22:08,120 Speaker 2: I mean, those are like like. 468 00:22:08,119 --> 00:22:11,520 Speaker 4: They complete a circle for me, you know, because forever, 469 00:22:11,680 --> 00:22:15,920 Speaker 4: especially on the father's side, I never had that dad 470 00:22:15,960 --> 00:22:17,719 Speaker 4: who I can just talk to about anything. 471 00:22:17,760 --> 00:22:20,639 Speaker 2: I never had, you know, we had these figures, but 472 00:22:20,680 --> 00:22:21,720 Speaker 2: they weren't good figures. 473 00:22:22,080 --> 00:22:24,399 Speaker 4: They definitely weren't figures that I would say, Hey, I 474 00:22:24,400 --> 00:22:26,440 Speaker 4: need to run something by you and have a conversation. 475 00:22:26,520 --> 00:22:27,160 Speaker 2: I never had. 476 00:22:27,280 --> 00:22:30,119 Speaker 4: So I just think about the type of person I am, 477 00:22:30,560 --> 00:22:33,760 Speaker 4: how quiet I am, different things like that. Maybe having 478 00:22:33,800 --> 00:22:37,159 Speaker 4: that person outside of my brother that I felt like 479 00:22:37,200 --> 00:22:39,840 Speaker 4: I could just speak too freely, you know, it could 480 00:22:39,840 --> 00:22:44,359 Speaker 4: have helped me bridge some gap and maybe prevented some 481 00:22:44,440 --> 00:22:46,600 Speaker 4: things that happened in my early childhood as far as 482 00:22:46,600 --> 00:22:49,479 Speaker 4: some of my decision making. But all those are part 483 00:22:49,520 --> 00:22:51,600 Speaker 4: of the grand plan, you know, to get me where 484 00:22:51,600 --> 00:22:51,920 Speaker 4: I am. 485 00:22:52,000 --> 00:22:55,280 Speaker 2: So but I do know the relationships I have. 486 00:22:55,359 --> 00:22:58,359 Speaker 4: With my mom and my dad, and obviously my stepmom, 487 00:22:58,560 --> 00:23:01,560 Speaker 4: my brother and sisters and all the extended family has 488 00:23:01,680 --> 00:23:04,120 Speaker 4: been outstanding, and I just want to keep building on that. 489 00:23:04,240 --> 00:23:06,920 Speaker 1: What's been the toughest part about finding your birth parents 490 00:23:06,920 --> 00:23:09,040 Speaker 1: and adding them into the mix, I. 491 00:23:09,040 --> 00:23:13,400 Speaker 4: Don't know, just not feeling like I'm slighting the family 492 00:23:13,440 --> 00:23:17,400 Speaker 4: that did everything, laid the foundation for everything. You know, 493 00:23:18,280 --> 00:23:21,960 Speaker 4: the family that you know eighty percent of the book 494 00:23:22,040 --> 00:23:24,040 Speaker 4: is about, you know that I that I grew up 495 00:23:24,080 --> 00:23:27,520 Speaker 4: around in my friends and those guardian angels that we 496 00:23:27,640 --> 00:23:30,160 Speaker 4: referred to in the book. You know, I don't want them, 497 00:23:31,000 --> 00:23:32,760 Speaker 4: and I sent message. How about it is, I send 498 00:23:32,800 --> 00:23:35,359 Speaker 4: messages to all of those guys. This is just a 499 00:23:35,440 --> 00:23:37,440 Speaker 4: lot of people in there, and they were just blown 500 00:23:37,480 --> 00:23:38,400 Speaker 4: away with I just. 501 00:23:38,320 --> 00:23:40,680 Speaker 3: Sent the message to them, thank you and here's what's coming, 502 00:23:41,000 --> 00:23:43,600 Speaker 3: and you were mentioned and different things like that, because 503 00:23:43,600 --> 00:23:45,360 Speaker 3: I don't want anybody to feel like, Wow, he got 504 00:23:45,359 --> 00:23:48,439 Speaker 3: to this point and all he's talking about is you 505 00:23:48,480 --> 00:23:51,680 Speaker 3: know what happened when his birth records. 506 00:23:51,320 --> 00:23:52,439 Speaker 2: Weren't you know. 507 00:23:52,480 --> 00:23:56,080 Speaker 4: I don't want anybody to feel like I forgot the 508 00:23:56,160 --> 00:23:57,960 Speaker 4: impact that they had on me when I was ten 509 00:23:58,040 --> 00:23:59,960 Speaker 4: years old, eight years old, nineteen years. 510 00:23:59,800 --> 00:24:00,920 Speaker 2: Old, thirty years old. 511 00:24:01,000 --> 00:24:05,080 Speaker 4: So it's important to me that everybody feels respected during 512 00:24:05,160 --> 00:24:05,920 Speaker 4: this whole process. 513 00:24:05,960 --> 00:24:09,200 Speaker 2: So the toughest part is making sure that and it's 514 00:24:09,240 --> 00:24:11,800 Speaker 2: not tough, but I got to be intentional. Yeah, well, 515 00:24:12,000 --> 00:24:14,119 Speaker 2: letting those guys know how important they are to me. 516 00:24:15,160 --> 00:24:17,800 Speaker 1: I'm really excited for you. The impact you're going to 517 00:24:17,840 --> 00:24:19,520 Speaker 1: have on some people in your life when you talk 518 00:24:19,520 --> 00:24:21,919 Speaker 1: about them in the book. That's so meaningful to people. 519 00:24:22,000 --> 00:24:24,720 Speaker 1: And I think even though we try to sometimes we 520 00:24:24,800 --> 00:24:26,879 Speaker 1: forget to tell people how we feel in the moment, 521 00:24:27,040 --> 00:24:30,639 Speaker 1: or we feel uncomfortable really expressing to people just what 522 00:24:30,680 --> 00:24:33,480 Speaker 1: they meant to us or our lives. And for those folks, 523 00:24:33,520 --> 00:24:35,560 Speaker 1: those Guardian Angels and a couple others in the book, 524 00:24:35,640 --> 00:24:37,520 Speaker 1: I think they're going to be really moved by the 525 00:24:37,520 --> 00:24:40,400 Speaker 1: impact they had on you. You're talking to me from 526 00:24:40,480 --> 00:24:45,480 Speaker 1: the Las Vegas Raiders facility. Your dad coached under Pete 527 00:24:45,520 --> 00:24:48,040 Speaker 1: Carroll with the Seahawks. You did a coaching internship with 528 00:24:48,080 --> 00:24:50,520 Speaker 1: the two of them way back when before you ever 529 00:24:50,560 --> 00:24:53,440 Speaker 1: knew that Sherman was your dad. Now you're coaching under 530 00:24:53,480 --> 00:24:56,600 Speaker 1: Pete Carroll with the Raiders. How has it been working 531 00:24:56,600 --> 00:24:58,920 Speaker 1: with Pete now that you both know the truth about 532 00:24:58,920 --> 00:24:59,560 Speaker 1: you and your dad? 533 00:25:00,119 --> 00:25:04,080 Speaker 4: It's a real because he'll look and you just you'll 534 00:25:04,080 --> 00:25:06,359 Speaker 4: look across the table and you'll start laughing, like, man, 535 00:25:06,600 --> 00:25:10,560 Speaker 4: I feel like I'm looking at Shirm right. So it's 536 00:25:10,640 --> 00:25:13,600 Speaker 4: been great, you know, just the synergy between us. I think, 537 00:25:13,880 --> 00:25:17,280 Speaker 4: you know, the way he approaches things on a very 538 00:25:17,359 --> 00:25:20,720 Speaker 4: humanistic level, relationship level with. 539 00:25:20,840 --> 00:25:22,480 Speaker 2: Guys that really marries up with. 540 00:25:22,359 --> 00:25:25,560 Speaker 4: My philosophy and the way that our attempt to build 541 00:25:25,560 --> 00:25:31,480 Speaker 4: football players and more importantly create positive young men and adults. 542 00:25:31,680 --> 00:25:32,919 Speaker 2: Obviously, you know. 543 00:25:33,000 --> 00:25:35,480 Speaker 4: So, I mean it's been real cool, you know, right now, 544 00:25:35,560 --> 00:25:37,880 Speaker 4: just getting to know the guys and getting ready. 545 00:25:37,680 --> 00:25:38,280 Speaker 2: For the season. 546 00:25:39,040 --> 00:25:40,840 Speaker 1: Well, I can't wait for people to read the book 547 00:25:40,880 --> 00:25:43,479 Speaker 1: and really understand how wild it is that you end 548 00:25:43,560 --> 00:25:45,800 Speaker 1: up coaching for Pete after your dad did that. You're 549 00:25:45,800 --> 00:25:48,480 Speaker 1: repeating so much of what he did in his life. Again. 550 00:25:49,359 --> 00:25:51,400 Speaker 1: I'm just really excited for the book to be out there. 551 00:25:51,680 --> 00:25:53,200 Speaker 1: I know you're older than me, but I'm proud of 552 00:25:53,240 --> 00:25:55,520 Speaker 1: you dealing for doing this and for being brave enough 553 00:25:55,520 --> 00:25:57,040 Speaker 1: to do it, and for all the people's lives you're 554 00:25:57,080 --> 00:25:58,720 Speaker 1: going to touch. I remember the first story we did 555 00:25:58,720 --> 00:26:02,920 Speaker 1: for ESPN, people coming to send us messages about their 556 00:26:02,960 --> 00:26:06,320 Speaker 1: stories of adoption or their wild ways that they learned 557 00:26:06,320 --> 00:26:08,480 Speaker 1: that someone in their life was part of their family. 558 00:26:09,040 --> 00:26:11,400 Speaker 1: And even the folks to message and said that they 559 00:26:11,440 --> 00:26:13,400 Speaker 1: looked for their birth parents and it didn't work out 560 00:26:13,400 --> 00:26:15,720 Speaker 1: well and it wasn't joyful, and what it meant to 561 00:26:15,760 --> 00:26:19,040 Speaker 1: them to see how things turned out for you. I 562 00:26:19,080 --> 00:26:22,879 Speaker 1: just think that's going to happen twenty fiftyfold with this book, 563 00:26:23,040 --> 00:26:24,800 Speaker 1: and I'm very excited for you to see what an 564 00:26:24,800 --> 00:26:27,159 Speaker 1: impact you can have on other people with just the 565 00:26:27,160 --> 00:26:29,320 Speaker 1: person that you are. I know it wasn't always easy 566 00:26:29,359 --> 00:26:31,960 Speaker 1: every step of the way, especially when you were sending 567 00:26:32,000 --> 00:26:34,000 Speaker 1: me your edits via text message and it was like 568 00:26:34,520 --> 00:26:38,560 Speaker 1: Chinese water torture, all debt boop boop boop. But that's 569 00:26:38,600 --> 00:26:40,919 Speaker 1: the process, and I'm really proud of us that we 570 00:26:40,960 --> 00:26:42,560 Speaker 1: did it, and I'm really excited for the book to 571 00:26:42,560 --> 00:26:43,919 Speaker 1: come out. So thanks for chatting with me. 572 00:26:44,400 --> 00:26:46,680 Speaker 4: No, and I definitely want to say you know everybody, 573 00:26:46,840 --> 00:26:50,159 Speaker 4: I mean, you did outstanding and this the research, putting 574 00:26:50,160 --> 00:26:54,119 Speaker 4: everything together, the interviews, dealing with the text messaging, I 575 00:26:54,160 --> 00:26:58,040 Speaker 4: mean I was copying screen texts and send me all 576 00:26:58,040 --> 00:26:58,840 Speaker 4: these things. 577 00:26:59,040 --> 00:27:01,560 Speaker 2: And just the fact that you had a vision. 578 00:27:01,680 --> 00:27:04,320 Speaker 4: I mean, yes, we put we put everything in this blender, 579 00:27:04,680 --> 00:27:06,320 Speaker 4: but you put it out and kind of laid it 580 00:27:06,359 --> 00:27:10,720 Speaker 4: out in it's accinct manner that there's no I wouldn't 581 00:27:10,760 --> 00:27:13,080 Speaker 4: have thought about writing this on my own anyway, but 582 00:27:13,160 --> 00:27:15,840 Speaker 4: I couldn't think of a better person, especially as we're 583 00:27:15,880 --> 00:27:19,080 Speaker 4: going through the process, and now we are we I. 584 00:27:19,080 --> 00:27:21,000 Speaker 2: Guess we get into the finished line, but maybe the 585 00:27:21,040 --> 00:27:21,720 Speaker 2: starting line. 586 00:27:21,600 --> 00:27:22,400 Speaker 1: Is just the beginning. 587 00:27:22,680 --> 00:27:23,680 Speaker 2: Yeah, the beginning. 588 00:27:23,720 --> 00:27:27,480 Speaker 4: We're ending one part but opening up another. I'm excited 589 00:27:27,520 --> 00:27:30,680 Speaker 4: to see where this thing goes. But I just wanted 590 00:27:30,680 --> 00:27:35,040 Speaker 4: to tell you. I'm just honored and full of pride 591 00:27:35,040 --> 00:27:36,600 Speaker 4: that I had the opportunity to do this. 592 00:27:36,760 --> 00:27:38,879 Speaker 1: Yeah, I'm so grateful to you in your family. They 593 00:27:38,920 --> 00:27:42,360 Speaker 1: were so honest and welcoming and trusted me, and that's 594 00:27:42,359 --> 00:27:44,680 Speaker 1: a really big deal. All right, get back to work 595 00:27:44,720 --> 00:27:46,760 Speaker 1: and also leave work soon. What do you what do 596 00:27:46,760 --> 00:27:47,600 Speaker 1: you do? It's still at work. 597 00:27:47,600 --> 00:27:50,040 Speaker 2: Come on, I'm about to get up out of here 598 00:27:50,080 --> 00:27:50,440 Speaker 2: right now. 599 00:27:54,080 --> 00:27:57,440 Speaker 1: Man. Even after several years of working together, I'm still 600 00:27:57,520 --> 00:28:00,879 Speaker 1: surprised and intrigued by Delan's perspective on this whole journey. 601 00:28:00,960 --> 00:28:03,480 Speaker 1: So I love talking to him and hearing the emotions 602 00:28:03,520 --> 00:28:05,880 Speaker 1: that the book inspires and being reminded of how many 603 00:28:05,880 --> 00:28:09,320 Speaker 1: folks might be deeply affected by it. So grateful to 604 00:28:09,359 --> 00:28:11,119 Speaker 1: him for joining the show and for trusting me with 605 00:28:11,200 --> 00:28:13,640 Speaker 1: this story. We got to take another break, slices. When 606 00:28:13,720 --> 00:28:24,880 Speaker 1: we return, it's time to pull your cameras out. Welcome back, Slices. 607 00:28:24,960 --> 00:28:26,480 Speaker 1: We love that you're listening, but we want you to 608 00:28:26,480 --> 00:28:28,200 Speaker 1: get in the game every day too. So here's our 609 00:28:28,200 --> 00:28:30,439 Speaker 1: good game play of the day. When you get your 610 00:28:30,520 --> 00:28:34,440 Speaker 1: copy of Runs in the Family, since you already ordered it, obviously, 611 00:28:35,200 --> 00:28:37,320 Speaker 1: send me a photo of you reading the book. I 612 00:28:37,359 --> 00:28:39,840 Speaker 1: want to see you slices in your booknooks on your 613 00:28:39,840 --> 00:28:43,520 Speaker 1: picnic blankets, and atop your cozy couches, digging into what 614 00:28:43,640 --> 00:28:47,240 Speaker 1: Dylan and I worked so very hard on. You audiobook folks, 615 00:28:47,400 --> 00:28:50,840 Speaker 1: have someone take a photo of you listening with the 616 00:28:50,840 --> 00:28:53,680 Speaker 1: book on your screen. I'm going to make a big, old, 617 00:28:53,720 --> 00:28:57,000 Speaker 1: gorgeous collage of slices reading and post it on my 618 00:28:57,040 --> 00:28:59,520 Speaker 1: social media, So make sure you make the cut. We 619 00:28:59,560 --> 00:29:01,160 Speaker 1: always love to hear from you, so hit us up 620 00:29:01,200 --> 00:29:04,240 Speaker 1: on email good game at wondermedianetwork dot com, or leave 621 00:29:04,320 --> 00:29:06,520 Speaker 1: us a voicemail at eight seven two two o four 622 00:29:06,680 --> 00:29:10,440 Speaker 1: fifty seventy, and don't forget to subscribe. Rate and review 623 00:29:10,880 --> 00:29:15,120 Speaker 1: It's real easy watch piece of shit degenerates who heckl 624 00:29:15,200 --> 00:29:18,200 Speaker 1: and harass athletes because they can't manage their gambling habits. 625 00:29:18,640 --> 00:29:22,800 Speaker 1: Rating five out of five or straining orders review. Over 626 00:29:22,840 --> 00:29:26,320 Speaker 1: the weekend, five time Olympic medalist Gabby Thomas competed in 627 00:29:26,360 --> 00:29:29,160 Speaker 1: Philadelphia at the third Grand Slam track meet of the season. 628 00:29:29,560 --> 00:29:31,920 Speaker 1: While she was warming up and while she was competing, 629 00:29:32,200 --> 00:29:35,000 Speaker 1: she was subjected to verbal abuse and the culprit is 630 00:29:35,040 --> 00:29:39,000 Speaker 1: apparently bragging about it online. After the meet, Thomas, who 631 00:29:39,040 --> 00:29:41,280 Speaker 1: finished fourth in the one hundred meter and second in 632 00:29:41,320 --> 00:29:43,560 Speaker 1: the two hundred meter at the meat, wrote on social 633 00:29:43,600 --> 00:29:45,600 Speaker 1: media that while she didn't get the results she hoped for, 634 00:29:45,720 --> 00:29:48,840 Speaker 1: she was grateful for all the support she received. Entered 635 00:29:48,920 --> 00:29:53,120 Speaker 1: the aforementioned piece of shit degenerate, who replied to Thomas's post, quote, 636 00:29:53,320 --> 00:29:56,560 Speaker 1: I made Gabby loose by heckling her, and it made 637 00:29:56,640 --> 00:29:59,840 Speaker 1: my parlay win. End quote. He went on to post 638 00:29:59,880 --> 00:30:01,560 Speaker 1: a video of the meet in which you can hear 639 00:30:01,600 --> 00:30:05,240 Speaker 1: someone yelling you're a choke artist. You're going down, Gabby, 640 00:30:05,680 --> 00:30:09,760 Speaker 1: along with two screenshots of bets. And it gets even worse. 641 00:30:10,160 --> 00:30:13,000 Speaker 1: Gabby replied to the post, writing quote, this grown man 642 00:30:13,160 --> 00:30:15,400 Speaker 1: followed me around the track as I took pictures and 643 00:30:15,440 --> 00:30:20,560 Speaker 1: signed autographs for fans, mostly children, shouting personal insults. Anybody 644 00:30:20,560 --> 00:30:26,160 Speaker 1: who enables him online is gross end quote. Absolutely disgusting 645 00:30:26,240 --> 00:30:29,080 Speaker 1: behavior from that dude, but good on Gabby for calling 646 00:30:29,120 --> 00:30:32,800 Speaker 1: him out. There's absolutely no excuse for harassing athletes based 647 00:30:32,840 --> 00:30:35,200 Speaker 1: on the bets that you make. Now it's your turn. 648 00:30:35,440 --> 00:30:37,920 Speaker 1: Rate and review slices. Give us five stars, tell us 649 00:30:38,000 --> 00:30:41,600 Speaker 1: you love us, Thanks for listening. See you Tomorrow. Good Game, 650 00:30:41,680 --> 00:30:45,920 Speaker 1: Delan Good Game writing a book you feelings of anxiety 651 00:30:45,920 --> 00:30:49,320 Speaker 1: about book reviews like I just said, give us five stars, 652 00:30:49,440 --> 00:30:51,880 Speaker 1: tell us you love us. It applies to the show 653 00:30:51,960 --> 00:30:56,120 Speaker 1: and the book, folks. Good Game with Sarah Spain is 654 00:30:56,120 --> 00:30:59,000 Speaker 1: an iHeart women's sports production in partnership with Deep Blue 655 00:30:59,000 --> 00:31:02,160 Speaker 1: Sports and Entertainment. You could find us on the iHeartRadio app, 656 00:31:02,200 --> 00:31:05,640 Speaker 1: Apple Podcasts, or wherever you get your podcasts. Production by 657 00:31:05,680 --> 00:31:09,520 Speaker 1: Wonder Media Network, our producers are Alex Azzie and Misha Jones. 658 00:31:09,800 --> 00:31:13,560 Speaker 1: Our executive producers are Christina Everett, Jesse Katz, Jenny Kaplan, 659 00:31:13,640 --> 00:31:17,240 Speaker 1: and Emily Rutterer. Our editors are Emily Rutterer, Britney Martinez, 660 00:31:17,280 --> 00:31:21,120 Speaker 1: Grace Lynch, and Gianna Palmer. Our associate producers Lucy Jones 661 00:31:21,360 --> 00:31:23,080 Speaker 1: and I'm Your Host Sarah Spain.