Speaker 1: Happy Saturday. The Treaty of Waitangi became international news late
Speaker 1: last week after Maori MP Hanaahiti Mighty Clark started a
Speaker 1: hakka at the end of a vote on the Treaty
Speaker 1: Principles Bill. So footage of Maori members of Parliament and
Speaker 1: people in the public gallery joining this hakka as some
Speaker 1: of the other people in the room either rolled their
Speaker 1: eyes or looked uncomfortable very quickly went viral. This is
Speaker 1: part of ongoing advocacy on the part of Maori people
Speaker 1: to get the terms of this treaty respected, and thousands
Speaker 1: of people have also been marching to Wellington in protest
Speaker 1: of the Treaty Principal's Bill. That march is expected to
Speaker 1: arrive at the Capitol after we record this intro, but
Speaker 1: before this Saturday Classic will come out into our podcast feed.
Speaker 1: Our episode on the Treaty of Waitangi came out on
Speaker 1: June fourth, twenty fourteen, and it talks about some of
Speaker 1: the context for this bill, which is that the English
Speaker 1: and Maori versions of this treaty have significant and meaningful
Speaker 1: differences from one another. If the Treaty Principal's Bill became law,
Speaker 1: it would move interpretations of the Treaty from the Courts
Speaker 1: to Parliament, which critics say would drastically undermine its terms.
Speaker 1: This bill's progression through Parliament is still ongoing, as Tracy said,
Speaker 1: as of when we are recording this. Also, I just
Speaker 1: want to add that in the original version of this episode,
Speaker 1: I made a brief reference to Eddie Izzard kind of
Speaker 1: on the fly, and that was before she began using
Speaker 1: she her pronouns, so that information and the way I
Speaker 1: reference her is outdated. So enjoy the episode. Welcome to
Speaker 1: Stuff You Missed in History Class, a production of iHeartRadio. Hello,
Speaker 1: and welcome to the podcast. I'm Tracy Wilson. I'm Holly fry. So.
Speaker 1: We've had a lot of people who have asked us
Speaker 1: to talk about the Treaty of Why Tangy, and this
Speaker 1: is including a listener mail that we read on the
Speaker 1: podcast a very long time ago in which I pronounced
Speaker 1: why Tangy terribly, like really, really badly. Somebody later wrote
Speaker 1: in and said that I did a good job, and
Speaker 1: I'm pretty sure that person was kidding, because I did
Speaker 1: a very bad job. I'm training behind. Yes, I'm hoping
Speaker 1: to do a better job. Today. I have been listening
Speaker 1: to a whole lot of film from New Zealand. So
Speaker 1: this is a treaty that was signed by representatives of
Speaker 1: the British Government and the Maoring of New Zealand, or
Speaker 1: as it's known in the Maori language Aoteroa, and that
Speaker 1: means land of the long White Cloud. So this is
Speaker 1: the document that established New Zealand as a nation. And
Speaker 1: unlike with many, many, many other treaties between the British
Speaker 1: government and indigenous peoples that had happened earlier in history,
Speaker 1: the spirit of this agreement was really to see to
Speaker 1: the best interests of both the Maori and the Crown,
Speaker 1: which makes it kind of an anomaly and kind of
Speaker 1: groundbreaking in the words are in the world of like
Speaker 1: colonial and indigenous relations. However, the English and Maori texts
Speaker 1: of this treaty are so different that they're almost fundamentally
Speaker 1: different documents, and so debate over exactly what the treaty
Speaker 1: meant and how it should be interpreted started almost immediately,
Speaker 1: And given the history of mankind on the earth, it
Speaker 1: should also be a surprise to no one that not
Speaker 1: everything afterward followed the original spirit of the treaty anyway,
Speaker 1: So that's what we're going to talk about today, this
Speaker 1: treaty and how it came about and some of what
Speaker 1: it led to you. And as with any treaty, there
Speaker 1: are pros and cons to it. But when you look
Speaker 1: at the grand spectrum of relations between colonizing governments and
Speaker 1: indigenous peoples, this one was a lot of different, a
Speaker 1: lot different than a lot of what came before. So
Speaker 1: we're gonna do a little bit of groundwork here about
Speaker 1: New Zealand. Dutch explorer Abel Tasman first cited New Zealand
Speaker 1: in sixteen forty two, and then James Cook's cabin boy,
Speaker 1: who was called Young Nick, spotted it again in seventeen
Speaker 1: sixty nine. Europeans were fairly slow to arrive in New
Speaker 1: Zealand from that point, so the whalers and the sealers
Speaker 1: came first, and then missionaries followed not long after. By
Speaker 1: the eighteen thirties, there were approximately one hundred and twenty
Speaker 1: five thousand Maori living in New Zealand, and a few
Speaker 1: British settlers made it a frontier outpost of New South Wales,
Speaker 1: which at the time was a British penal colony. Overall,
Speaker 1: for the most part, early relations between the Maori and
Speaker 1: The Europeans who were arriving in New Zealand were mostly peaceful.
Speaker 1: There were occasional disputes and fights. However, the British law
Speaker 1: did not extend to New Zealand because New Zealand wasn't
Speaker 1: British territory, and so this meant that there really was
Speaker 1: not any law governing the British subjects who wound up there,
Speaker 1: who naturally did not feel like they were beholden to
Speaker 1: Maori law. And so this was especially problematic given that
Speaker 1: many of the subjects of the Crown who made their
Speaker 1: way to New Zealand were convicts who had escaped from
Speaker 1: New South Wales. So you had people who were convicted
Speaker 1: criminals making their way to this other island where there
Speaker 1: were no laws to govern them. And as more people
Speaker 1: moved in, trading efforts started to grow because people need things,
Speaker 1: and so more than one thousand British ships began visiting
Speaker 1: New Zealand every year, and New Zealand started to become
Speaker 1: more appealing to other European governments as a consequence, including France. Eventually,
Speaker 1: as the population of Europeans started to grow, some of
Speaker 1: them asked the British government to help establish some kind
Speaker 1: of official system to try to maintain order. It was
Speaker 1: this kind of lawless place among the European settlers at
Speaker 1: this point. They were also a lot of the British
Speaker 1: subjects were hoping for protection that would prevent the encroachment
Speaker 1: of other European governments, and at first the British were
Speaker 1: really not eager to do this. They did not really
Speaker 1: want to extend their holdings into New Zealand at all.
Speaker 1: So eventually, in eighteen thirty five, a man named James
Speaker 1: Busby was given the official post of British Resident in
Speaker 1: New Zealand, and this was sort of like being a
Speaker 1: consular official. He was there to represent the Crown. That
Speaker 1: was his job, but he really didn't have any actual
Speaker 1: power and he had almost no support from the British government,
Speaker 1: so consequently people called him the Man of War without guns.
Speaker 1: One of Busby's acts as British residents, which kind of
Speaker 1: cracks me up as a title for some reason, although
Speaker 1: one that was done without any authority to do so,
Speaker 1: was to draw up a Declaration of Independence of the
Speaker 1: Northern Chiefs, and this document declared New Zealand a sovereign
Speaker 1: nation under the absolute rule of its hereditary chiefs and
Speaker 1: tribal leaders, and his goal wasn't so much to make
Speaker 1: the Maori independent as to try to block the French
Speaker 1: from making their own treaty and taking the colony over.
Speaker 1: Yes that Britain was not currently at war at prith
Speaker 1: Prance when this was going on, but they had been
Speaker 1: in the recent past and for many many years, so
Speaker 1: they were at best a little wary of each other.
Speaker 1: All I can think of is the Eddie Izzard bit
Speaker 1: where he does do you have a flag? This is
Speaker 1: actually a lot like this for you. Yes, there is
Speaker 1: real There was real discussion about we need to get
Speaker 1: the flag. We need to get a flag for the
Speaker 1: New Zealanders. People will be more respectful of New Zealand
Speaker 1: if it has a flag like that was a real
Speaker 1: step in this whole process that we're not going into
Speaker 1: a lot of detail about today. So Busby presented this
Speaker 1: declaration to thirty four Maori chiefs at his home on
Speaker 1: the North Island. So additional chiefs then were originally present
Speaker 1: eventually signed the document, and then in nineteen thirty six,
Speaker 1: the Crown officially acknowledged Maori nationhood based on the existence
Speaker 1: of this declaration, and before this point, the Mawori had
Speaker 1: not really had the concept of the state as part
Speaker 1: of their worldview. In their social structure, each tribe governed
Speaker 1: itself under the leadership of a chief known as rangetira. However,
Speaker 1: as word of the declaration of independence spread, it solidified
Speaker 1: the idea among the Maori that they were in fact
Speaker 1: in charge of their own affairs and able to govern themselves.
Speaker 1: So this declaration, though only gave New Zealand a temporary
Speaker 1: respite from the influence of all these political factions from Europe.
Speaker 1: By the late eighteen thirties, there were about two thousand
Speaker 1: settlers from Europe living in New Zealand, and a number
Speaker 1: of British businesses and shipping companies were planning to scale
Speaker 1: up their operations there, and there of course was also
Speaker 1: interest substantially from France. There were also huge amounts of
Speaker 1: trade going on between New Zealand and New South Wales,
Speaker 1: so the Mallori wanted to begin trading with other nations themselves,
Speaker 1: but doing so was difficult without being first officially recognized
Speaker 1: as a nation, which brings us back to the question
Speaker 1: of whether they had a flag, which was a real
Speaker 1: point of discussion in all of this in a move
Speaker 1: that was definitely as much about protecting its own interest
Speaker 1: from France as protecting the Mawori from anybody. In eighteen
Speaker 1: thirty nine, the British government dispatched William Hobson of the
Speaker 1: Royal Navy to go to New Zealand and negotiate on
Speaker 1: behalf of the crown. And his assignment was to establish
Speaker 1: a treaty with the Maori, and once that was done,
Speaker 1: he was to act as Lieutenant governor for any part
Speaker 1: of New Zealand that would agree to become a British colony.
Speaker 1: Hobson got a lot of direction about exactly what he
Speaker 1: was supposed to do, and included in all of this
Speaker 1: were these instructions from Lord normanby the Colonial Secretary regarding
Speaker 1: this assignment. This is quote, All dealings with the Aborigines
Speaker 1: for their lands must be conducted on the same principles
Speaker 1: of sincerity, justice, and good faith as must govern your
Speaker 1: transactions with them for the recognition of Her Majesty's sovereignty
Speaker 1: in these islands. Nor is this all. They must not
Speaker 1: be permitted to into any contracts in which they might
Speaker 1: be ignorant and unintended authors of injuries to themselves you
Speaker 1: will not, for example, purchase from them any territory the
Speaker 1: retention of which by them would be essential or highly
Speaker 1: conducive to their own comfort, safety, or substance. The acquisition
Speaker 1: of land by the Crown for the future settlement of
Speaker 1: British subjects must be confined to such districts as the
Speaker 1: natives can alienate without distress or serious inconvenience to themselves.
Speaker 1: To secure the observance of this rule will be one
Speaker 1: of the first duties of their official protector. So if
Speaker 1: you know anything about relations with indigenous people in the
Speaker 1: world before this point, this is basically the opposite of
Speaker 1: how a lot of these treaties were previously carried out.
Speaker 1: Like there were many many treaties in the settlement of
Speaker 1: what is now the United States and in Africa and
Speaker 1: in the South Pacific and in South America that were
Speaker 1: basically like, here is this treaty where we're going to
Speaker 1: make you think you're getting a good deal, but we
Speaker 1: the people who were colonizing or actually taking you for
Speaker 1: a giant ride. So this was specifically at this point
Speaker 1: the world having learned that this was a bad thing
Speaker 1: to do against the rules, like he was supposed to
Speaker 1: get down there and actually put a treaty together in
Speaker 1: good faith, and so, considering the tone of a lot
Speaker 1: of earlier treaties between the British and indigenous peoples, or
Speaker 1: later Americans and Indigenous peoples, or whoever and indigenous peoples,
Speaker 1: this was hugely progressive. But at the same time some
Speaker 1: of the flavor of the instruction was also kind of racist,
Speaker 1: since a big underlying tone of all of it was
Speaker 1: that from the British point of view, the Mallori were
Speaker 1: not actually capable of handling their own affairs. So there,
Speaker 1: although it was a big step forward in relations with
Speaker 1: indigenous people, it was not entirely free from problems. Hobson
Speaker 1: awry on January twenty ninth of eighteen forty, and he
Speaker 1: had been corresponding with George Gipps, who was Governor of
Speaker 1: New South Wales, about what exactly should go into the treaty,
Speaker 1: and once he arrived, Hobson also worked with his secretary,
Speaker 1: who was named James Freeman, as well as James Buzzby,
Speaker 1: who we discussed earlier on completing this treaty. So they
Speaker 1: basically got completely down to the wire on putting the
Speaker 1: treaty together. They had summoned all of these chiefs to
Speaker 1: a big meeting, but they didn't have a draft of
Speaker 1: the treaty to actually have translated until the night before,
Speaker 1: So on the eve of this meeting they handed the
Speaker 1: treaty over to Henry Williams, who was a missionary, and
Speaker 1: Williams translated the text into Mauri with the help of
Speaker 1: his son Edward. At this point, the Williamses had established
Speaker 1: relationships with the Mallory and they spoke the Maori language,
Speaker 1: but they really did not have a lot of time
Speaker 1: to put their translation together. On February fifth, once again
Speaker 1: in Busby's home, the representatives of Britain prison the treaty
Speaker 1: to about five hundred assembled Maori. Then, while there was
Speaker 1: extensive discussion, no agreement was actually signed. The next day,
Speaker 1: which was February sixth, after a little more discussion, forty
Speaker 1: five chiefs did sign the treaty. The first to sign
Speaker 1: was a chief named Honahicke, who was also called hone Polkai,
Speaker 1: and he felt a treaty with the British was their
Speaker 1: best option. The day before the treaty was signed, he
Speaker 1: reportedly said to Hobson, Governor, you should stay with us
Speaker 1: and be like a father. If you go away, then
Speaker 1: the French and the rum sellers will take us Maori over.
Speaker 1: So Hona Heke's support was really instrumental in getting a
Speaker 1: lot of the other chiefs to sign the treaty, and
Speaker 1: from there the original treaty as well as copies of it,
Speaker 1: were sent around the islands to gather additional signatures, and
Speaker 1: in the end more than five hundred Maori signatures replied
Speaker 1: to the document, and thirteen of the signatures were from women,
Speaker 1: overwhelmingly the Maori who signed the tree he signed a
Speaker 1: Maori language version with at least one British subject signing
Speaker 1: as well, and who this British signatory was varied from
Speaker 1: place to place. Not every rangatira signed the document. Some
Speaker 1: of them never got a chance to because while copies
Speaker 1: of the treaty were distributed, they didn't make it to
Speaker 1: every single part of the islands that make up New Zealand.
Speaker 1: There were also definitely chiefs who opposed the treaty on
Speaker 1: the grounds that the protections that were being granted were
Speaker 1: just not enough to outweigh the independence that they would
Speaker 1: be giving up. There were also chiefs who were suspicious
Speaker 1: of the British government's intent about the whole thing, and
Speaker 1: then farther inland there were chiefs who just didn't see
Speaker 1: the point because they, not being from the more coastal areas,
Speaker 1: hadn't actually had a lot of contact with people from
Speaker 1: Europe by then. And even though not every chief had signed,
Speaker 1: the British government felt that the treaty applied to all Maori,
Speaker 1: whether they had signed it or not. They also almost
Speaker 1: universally viewed the English language version of the text as
Speaker 1: the true version of the texts. Within a few years,
Speaker 1: British officials admitted that crown sovereignty would outweigh Maori leadership
Speaker 1: when the two were in conflict. So to get back
Speaker 1: to this treaty itself, the Treaty of Waitangi opens with
Speaker 1: the preamble and that's followed by three articles. Article one
Speaker 1: quote the chiefs of the Confederation of the United Tribes
Speaker 1: of New Zealand and the separate and independent Chiefs who
Speaker 1: have not become members of the Confederation, cede to Her Majesty,
Speaker 1: the Queen of England, absolutely and without reservation, all the
Speaker 1: rights and powers of sovereignty which the said Confederation or
Speaker 1: individual chiefs respectively exercise or possess, or may be supposed
Speaker 1: to exercise or to possess over their respective territories as
Speaker 1: the sole sovereign thereof. So the extremely short and oversimplified
Speaker 1: version this is basically, you, the British, are the boss
Speaker 1: of us the Maori as of now. Yeah. So Article
Speaker 1: two reads, Her Majesty, the Queen of England confirms and
Speaker 1: guarantees to the chiefs and tribes of New Zealand, and
Speaker 1: to the respective families and individuals thereof, the full exclusive
Speaker 1: and undisturbed possessions of their lands and estates, forest, fisheries,
Speaker 1: and other properties which they may collectively or individually possess,
Speaker 1: so long it is as it is their wish and
Speaker 1: desire to retain the same in their possession. But the
Speaker 1: chiefs of the united Tribes and the individual chiefs yield
Speaker 1: to Her Majesty the exclusive right of preemption over such
Speaker 1: lands as the proprietors thereof may be disposed to alienate
Speaker 1: at such prices as may be agreed upon between the
Speaker 1: respective proprietors and the persons appointed by Her Majesty to
Speaker 1: treat with them on that behalf, So the oversimplified summation
Speaker 1: on that one is you can keep your land and
Speaker 1: your stuff unless you want to give it to us,
Speaker 1: and if you want to do that, we'll figure out
Speaker 1: a price. Article three is in consideration thereof her Majesty,
Speaker 1: the Queen of England extends to the natives of New
Speaker 1: Zealand her royal protection and imparts to them all the
Speaker 1: rights and privileges of British subjects. That one's already pretty short,
Speaker 1: but it basically it exchange for giving up their sovereignty,
Speaker 1: the Maori get the protection of the crown and the
Speaker 1: rights and privileges that are due to British subjects. And
Speaker 1: the document ends with an epilogue which essentially states that
Speaker 1: both parties have entered into the spirit of the treaty,
Speaker 1: which has been important in determining whether future acts violated
Speaker 1: the treaty. It's the spirit, not the letter. So that's
Speaker 1: the English parts. But there are some huge and important
Speaker 1: and meaningful differences between the English and the Maori texts
Speaker 1: in almost every part of the entire treaty, and those
Speaker 1: differences start right from the beginning. The English pre is
Speaker 1: focused on providing for British settlement of New Zealand while
Speaker 1: also protecting the Maori's interests as well as setting up
Speaker 1: a government in the interest of maintaining peace and order.
Speaker 1: But the Maori preamble is focused on securing Maori claims
Speaker 1: to land and tribal governance and autonomy or tino rangatira tanga.
Speaker 1: In Article one of the English version, the Maori chiefs
Speaker 1: are seating quote the rights and powers of sovereignty to
Speaker 1: the Queen of England. But in the Maori translation, the
Speaker 1: word sovereignty was translated to a word that's closer to governorship,
Speaker 1: which is a much less encompassing concept than sovereignty. There
Speaker 1: was no exact translation for the word sovereignty in the
Speaker 1: Maori language. The English version of the article of Article
Speaker 1: two grants the Maori quote the full, exclusive and undisturbed
Speaker 1: possession of their lands and estates, forests, fisheries and other properties,
Speaker 1: but the Maori translation used a phrase that meant quote
Speaker 1: the full essence of chief ship, again suggesting that the
Speaker 1: Maori were more or less getting full control over their
Speaker 1: own affairs. The translation of forest, fisheries and other properties
Speaker 1: is problematic too, since it was translated into a Maori
Speaker 1: word that more closely means treasures. Yeah, there's been a
Speaker 1: lot of discussions about what is included in treasures. Its like,
Speaker 1: is the Maori language a treasure? Yeah, that's a pretty culture,
Speaker 1: that treasure. Yeah, that's a word of nebulous, meaning it's
Speaker 1: very nebulous. And so, with huge differences, like huge meaningful
Speaker 1: differences in the overwhelming bulk of this treaty, the debate
Speaker 1: about what the treaty was really supposed to mean and
Speaker 1: about what the Maori believed that they were signing started
Speaker 1: almost immediately. And on top of that, there is significant
Speaker 1: speculation about how exactly those discrepancies between the two texts
Speaker 1: came to be. There. Was it a simple error, you know,
Speaker 1: due to this sort of rush translation that had to happen,
Speaker 1: or was it actually a more orchestrated effort to slant
Speaker 1: the texts in an effort to make it more palatable
Speaker 1: to the Maori And there is really no clear documentation,
Speaker 1: although there's loads of speculation. There's also a big subject
Speaker 1: of speculation around how much the British signatories were even
Speaker 1: aware that these discrepancies existed. There had been lengthy meetings
Speaker 1: and discussions about the treaty and the text, and the
Speaker 1: Williamses were, as we said before, familiar with the Maori language,
Speaker 1: but you know, they didn't have a lot of time
Speaker 1: to put this all together, so you know, at this
Speaker 1: point in history, it's kind of unclear exactly how much
Speaker 1: both sides knew about the differences between what one was
Speaker 1: signing and what the other was signing. But regardless of
Speaker 1: the differences, with this treaty in place, New Zealand became
Speaker 1: a British colony, at first as part of New South
Speaker 1: Wales and later that same year as its own colony. So,
Speaker 1: because this was the document that established New Zealand as
Speaker 1: a nation, to try to recap everything that happened as
Speaker 1: a result of the Treaty of Waitangi would basically require
Speaker 1: summing up basically the entire history of New Zealand from
Speaker 1: the time that it was signed, so to extremely briefly summarize.
Speaker 1: With the door now opened to settling from Britain, a
Speaker 1: lot of settlers from England, to Ireland and Scotland started
Speaker 1: making their way to New Zealand, with thousands of people
Speaker 1: arriving over the next decade. Within a few years, Hona
Speaker 1: Heke had withdrawn his support for the treaty. He was
Speaker 1: feeling disillusioned that it was not in fact as beneficial
Speaker 1: for the Maori as he had believed it was going
Speaker 1: to be. As an active protest, he had the flagpole
Speaker 1: at a British settlement repeatedly cut down. In the eighteen fifties,
Speaker 1: the European settlers in New Zealand established their own government
Speaker 1: and in eighteen fifty three the first Parliament can be
Speaker 1: in New Zealand. But at that point the Maori were
Speaker 1: completely excluded from holding seats or from voting, following a
Speaker 1: pretty British tradition. Land ownership was a requirement for both
Speaker 1: of these, and most property ownership among the Maori at
Speaker 1: that point was communal instead of individual, so it took
Speaker 1: a while for that to shift so that it was
Speaker 1: more compatible with the Maori worldview to allow the Maori
Speaker 1: to participate in the government. In eighteen sixty seven, Maori
Speaker 1: men gained the right to vote and the Maori people
Speaker 1: actually gained four seats, and that was intended to be
Speaker 1: a temporary move. Today, however, the Mawori continue to have
Speaker 1: seats in Parliament and can choose to vote among the
Speaker 1: general or the Maori electorate. The number of Maori seats
Speaker 1: in Parliament varies depending on how many choose to vote
Speaker 1: in the Maori electorate. I think right now there are
Speaker 1: seven based on that number, and there's a lot of
Speaker 1: debate about whether having specifically Maori seats are whether that
Speaker 1: it's a good thing or a bad thing. There's a
Speaker 1: debate on both sides, and I can see both sides
Speaker 1: of that argument. There are people who feel like maybe
Speaker 1: the Maori would have more representation if they did not
Speaker 1: have these pre arraigned seats, or people who feel like
Speaker 1: having these seats at all is racist in some way.
Speaker 1: Like there's a lot of ongoing discussion about that. In
Speaker 1: nineteen seventy five, the Waitangi Tribunal was established, and this
Speaker 1: investigates claims by Maori on breaches of the Treaty. For
Speaker 1: the first ten years of its existence, this tribunal only
Speaker 1: investigated issues that happened since it was established. However, in
Speaker 1: nineteen eighty five its scope was expanded to include everything
Speaker 1: that has happened since the Treaty was signed in eighteen
Speaker 1: forty and only Maori can make claims, and these are
Speaker 1: against either the Crown or against legislation. They can be
Speaker 1: contemporary or historical. There's also a special Land Court to
Speaker 1: deal specifically with Maori land. So today New zeal has
Speaker 1: grown into a parliamentary democracy with three official languages, English,
Speaker 1: Maori and sign language. The House of Representatives, which is
Speaker 1: a body of elected officials, makes the laws. It's also
Speaker 1: simultaneously a constitutional monarchy, with the reigning Sovereign of Great
Speaker 1: Britain being the Sovereign of New Zealand as well. So
Speaker 1: as we are recording this, Queen Elizabeth two is the
Speaker 1: Queen of the United Kingdom as well as being Queen
Speaker 1: of New Zealand. So in this whole arrangement, that's a
Speaker 1: separate thing. New Zealand is not just part of the
Speaker 1: United Kingdom. The Queen's involvement in the government is also
Speaker 1: mostly symbolic. She's represented by the Governor General, but a
Speaker 1: Prime Minister handles the day to day running of the government.
Speaker 1: I know most of our listeners are from the United States,
Speaker 1: and the sounds like very complicated system of government considering
Speaker 1: what a lot of our listeners are used to. Yeah,
Speaker 1: it's a lot of layers of different branches of government
Speaker 1: sort of all theoretically playing nice together. Yeah. To make
Speaker 1: it even a little bit more complex, the name New
Speaker 1: Zealand does not even come from the British. It comes
Speaker 1: from the Dutch. So when the Dutch cited it, they
Speaker 1: named it after the Netherlands province of Zealand because at
Speaker 1: that point Australia was called New Holland, which you know
Speaker 1: is another part of Netherlands. And the treaty itself was
Speaker 1: actually almost lost or destroyed a number of times over
Speaker 1: the years, including by fire and by efforts to preserve
Speaker 1: the document that we're actually damaging. Now. These documents are
Speaker 1: in the Constitution Room at the Archives of New Zealand
Speaker 1: in Wellington. I like this story because it does represent
Speaker 1: such a big step forward in relationships between colonial governments
Speaker 1: and indigenous peoples, but at the same time, like it's
Speaker 1: not perfect and there's still colonialism happening in this whole situation,
Speaker 1: so like I'm really of two minds about it. But
Speaker 1: without this treaty, like when you look at documents about
Speaker 1: New Zealand or if you ever visit New Zealand, like
Speaker 1: you see it's sort of a multicultural place in a
Speaker 1: lot of ways at this time, and I don't think
Speaker 1: that would exist without this treaty having been created and signed.
Speaker 1: And this story is also a sort of a nice
Speaker 1: snapshot of how issues of government can become extremely complex,
Speaker 1: you know, based on one thing like that one translation
Speaker 1: led to a great deal of discussion in all of
Speaker 1: these sort of bizarre layers of government that happened as
Speaker 1: a consequence. Yeah, So when when the Waitangi Tribunal looks
Speaker 1: at cases where people have filed a grievance against the
Speaker 1: government or against a law, it's sort of looking at Okay,
Speaker 1: what was the spirit of the treaty supposed to be
Speaker 1: in this case? And was the spirit of the treaty followed.
Speaker 1: I tried to find some data about how many cases
Speaker 1: the Tribunal has heard, and I was not able to
Speaker 1: find that before we recorded. So if someone knows and
Speaker 1: you send us, we will probably read it on a
Speaker 1: future listener mail. Thanks so much for joining us on
Speaker 1: this Saturday. If you'd like to send us a note,
Speaker 1: our email addresses History Podcast at iHeartRadio dot com, and
Speaker 1: you can subscribe to the show on the iHeartRadio app,
Speaker 1: Apple Podcasts, or wherever you listen to your favorite shows.