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Speaker 1: So I recorded this episode on Wednesday about nine to eleven.

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Speaker 1: It was an episode I've been looking forward to making

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Speaker 1: and releasing for quite some time, and then the assassination

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Speaker 1: happened of Charlie Kirk, and I just need to take

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Speaker 1: a moment and honor this man who died doing what

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Speaker 1: he believed. I met Charlie when he was about eighteen

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Speaker 1: years old. I think I was in my early twenties,

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Speaker 1: and he told me he was going to start an

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Speaker 1: organization called Turning Point in USA and it was going

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Speaker 1: to change the country, and he had all these big

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Speaker 1: dreams and I kind of laughed at him and I

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Speaker 1: was like, okay, you know, best of luck, and he

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Speaker 1: did them all. The last laugh was on him. He

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Speaker 1: was an amazing operative and someone who always got better

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Speaker 1: over time, and it's something that I noticed and he

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Speaker 1: won over my deep respect. We weren't close for most

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Speaker 1: of his professional life, but in the last few years

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Speaker 1: he'd reach out to me to try to open up

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Speaker 1: a dialogue. And you might have been a show many

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Speaker 1: times and I was on. I was always very haph

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Speaker 1: to be on and I really grew to respect and

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Speaker 1: get to know him a little bit, and he was

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Speaker 1: a good person, a really, really good person, and his

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Speaker 1: death is a tragedy and I send my deepest condolences

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Speaker 1: to his loved ones, to his wife and children and

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Speaker 1: parents and the Tpusa family. I've been praying for the

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Speaker 1: repose of his soul, that he entered the gates of

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Speaker 1: heaven and find eternal salvation. And as a public figure

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Speaker 1: and a public commentator and someone in the public eye,

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Speaker 1: I can tell you it's very scary nowadays. And I'm

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Speaker 1: probably going to do an episode on Monday about assassinations

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Speaker 1: and tempted assassinations and the stream we've had about them.

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Speaker 1: But I just have to honor him and just say that, Arlie,

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Speaker 1: you were better than all your critics combined. They had

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Speaker 1: nothing on you, and you showed them and you were great.

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Speaker 1: And to quote the famous poem, you know, rave Ratio

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Speaker 1: at the gate. Every man upon this earth, death comes

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Speaker 1: sooner the late, And how can men die better than

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Speaker 1: facing fearful odds for the ashes of his fathers and

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Speaker 1: the temple of his gods. Charlie, you lived a life

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Speaker 1: in the truest form, fighting for what you believed in,

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Speaker 1: and you went out a winner. You went out too early,

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Speaker 1: but you went out a winner. You were a good

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Speaker 1: man and I'm so sorry for everything that's happened to you.

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Speaker 1: May you rest in peace and now the rest of

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Speaker 1: the episode. Welcome back to a numbers game with Ryan Gardusky.

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Speaker 1: Thank you guys for being here again. This is I've

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Speaker 1: wanted to do this episode since I got a platform

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Speaker 1: to speak to people about today. Obviously it's September eleventh,

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Speaker 1: twenty twenty five, and twenty four years ago the world changed.

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Speaker 1: Every one of a an age now has their own

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Speaker 1: nine to eleven story, even if they weren't in New

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Speaker 1: York or Washington and they just felt fear and concern

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Speaker 1: and remember it, or if they joined the military afterwards

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Speaker 1: or whatnot. But as time passes, the wild thing is

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Speaker 1: meeting so many people who don't have a memory of

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Speaker 1: it and don't have a story of it, and some

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Speaker 1: who weren't even born. I mean, I've had employees of

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Speaker 1: mine who were not born when it happened, and you're

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Speaker 1: talking about something that is very distant and this moment

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Speaker 1: that changed the world that we live in and was

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Speaker 1: so deeply part of my life for such a long time,

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Speaker 1: coming from the son of someone who worked there and

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Speaker 1: spent so much time going to memorials and meeting with

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Speaker 1: families and also being the son of a cop. I've

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Speaker 1: realized now that so much time has gone by. I

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Speaker 1: was born in nineteen eighty seven, and nine to eleven

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Speaker 1: is as far from us today as like the Kennedy

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Speaker 1: assassination was to me when I was born. So like

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Speaker 1: I mean, I enjoy history, but I cannot relate to

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Speaker 1: that time. And I wanted to do an episode for

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Speaker 1: somebody who doesn't remember nine to eleven. And if you

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Speaker 1: like this episode specifically, I would ask that you would

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Speaker 1: share if you have a kid or a grandkid or

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Speaker 1: somebody who has no memory of it, because I'm trying

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Speaker 1: to say in a way that make them understand. And

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Speaker 1: by the way, this episode is going to be just

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Speaker 1: about this. We're not doing asking me anything. That will

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Speaker 1: all come next week. I will make it up to everybody.

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Speaker 1: But I decided to do it an episode to look

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Speaker 1: back on the day and my experience and my family's experience,

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Speaker 1: specifically my mom, to try to connect with people who

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Speaker 1: have no understanding of what life was like. You know,

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Speaker 1: many historical moments in so they blend together, right, there's

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Speaker 1: a build up there's a build up to a war,

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Speaker 1: there's a build up to technological advances, and then there

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Speaker 1: are those moments that are so sudden and so violent

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Speaker 1: that rather than being like something blending, it's like a

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Speaker 1: page turning or a book shutting. It's immediate and there's

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Speaker 1: no going back to it. So if you're under thirty

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Speaker 1: and you have limited memories of that time, or no

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Speaker 1: memories if you're in your early twenties or you're a teenager,

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Speaker 1: the world back then wasn't as connected as it is now.

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Speaker 1: Growing up, we would learn about history of the world,

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Speaker 1: learn about communism or the world wars or large conflicts,

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Speaker 1: and teach anyway. I would say out loud, like we

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Speaker 1: don't have to worry about that because we have two

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Speaker 1: oceans that isolate us from most of the horrors of

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Speaker 1: the world. Nine to eleven seemed the day before simply impossible,

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Speaker 1: because we were told that we had this comest protective

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Speaker 1: force field in America, and even though we were a

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Speaker 1: less connected country, we had a country with a lot

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Speaker 1: more social trust. Obviously, there are people like you know,

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Speaker 1: you wouldn't you didn't like, and you didn't leave your

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Speaker 1: kids with. But we were more trusting of each other

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Speaker 1: in general. And there's many reasons, many, many, many reasons

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Speaker 1: why that's no longer the case today, but it was

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Speaker 1: at the time. So for me, September eleventh, two thousand

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Speaker 1: and one was my second day of high school at

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Speaker 1: Saint Francis Prep in Queens, New York. The way it

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Speaker 1: worked back then was at my high schools, you would

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Speaker 1: have a first class, and then you would have homeroom

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Speaker 1: for fifteen minutes, and then you would have your second class.

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Speaker 1: And remember there's no smartphones. I didn't home a cell phone, like,

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Speaker 1: none of that existed at all. So second period happened

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Speaker 1: and I had a free period. It was my first

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Speaker 1: free period, and you can go anywhere you want basically

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Speaker 1: as long as you didn't cause chaos during free periods,

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Speaker 1: and back then I let you leave the school too,

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Speaker 1: like it was crazy. So I went up to the

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Speaker 1: library with a girl from my homeroom named Catherine Gonzalez,

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Speaker 1: who left the high school right after freshman year, so

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Speaker 1: I never saw her again. I would love to, I

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Speaker 1: would love to connect with her if that's even possible,

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Speaker 1: but I have no idea where she is at this point. Well,

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Speaker 1: we ended up going to the library. Sitting in the

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Speaker 1: library had these these giant windows Florida ceiling, two story

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Speaker 1: windows that connected the east and west wing of the

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Speaker 1: high school, so you could see onto the highway and

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Speaker 1: into the larger nah in Eastern Queens facing the city.

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Speaker 1: Well you actually you couldn't face You couldn't see the

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Speaker 1: city itself. You could see the area completely anyway. I

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Speaker 1: sat on the third table towards the west wing of

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Speaker 1: the school and talking to Catherine. I think about, like,

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Speaker 1: I don't know what the hell we're talking about, something about

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Speaker 1: probably high school when we think of it so far,

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Speaker 1: and you know, if we like our teachers or whatnot.

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Speaker 1: And I barely knew the girl and I look up

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Speaker 1: and I saw my uncle and I said, oh, I

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Speaker 1: said to her, go though, there's my uncle. And I

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Speaker 1: didn't like she made a face like why is your

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Speaker 1: uncle a year? But I didn't sit there and even

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Speaker 1: think twice of it. It's not like he worked there.

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Speaker 1: It was very strange when he was talking to the

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Speaker 1: librarian and he walked over to me and he said,

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Speaker 1: we made contact with your mom and she's okay. And

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Speaker 1: I said, what are you talking about? And he looked

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Speaker 1: a librarian and he says something like, oh, you didn't

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Speaker 1: tell the students yet, and he said something about an

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Speaker 1: announcement would be made soon. The librarian said that, and

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Speaker 1: he my uncle just had a plane hit the World

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Speaker 1: Trade Center. My mom worked on the ninety seven floor

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Speaker 1: of Tower one at Marsha mcclennan. And for the moment

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Speaker 1: that he told me that, I thought it was like

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Speaker 1: probably some single man plane who was, you know, acting

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Speaker 1: reckless and accidentally crashed into the building. Like that's literally

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Speaker 1: all I could comprehend. And it had happened one time

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Speaker 1: with the Empire State Building like decades before. So I

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Speaker 1: just thought, oh, accidents happened, and my mom was fine,

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Speaker 1: and he was supposed to pick me up, but like

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Speaker 1: in all the panic, my uncle left me and just

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Speaker 1: like left the building. So I don't understand why he

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Speaker 1: didn't remember one job, but he forgot me. And then

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Speaker 1: within minutes of him leaving, there was an announcement on

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Speaker 1: the loud speaker that said, if you are the child

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Speaker 1: of a firefighter, cop EMT or your parents work in

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Speaker 1: the World Trade Center, please come to the Guidance Counsel's office.

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Speaker 1: So now even though he had said my mom was Okay,

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Speaker 1: I still went because I was I was lost, I said,

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Speaker 1: I didn't understand what was going on. And my dad

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Speaker 1: and his two brothers were New York City police officers,

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Speaker 1: so I didn't know what I happened my dad. I

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Speaker 1: didn't know where my dad was. I just knew that

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Speaker 1: he had said someone had contacted my mom. Now I

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Speaker 1: filed into the Guidance Counselor's office, and there were so

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Speaker 1: many kids there. There were so many people, and especially

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Speaker 1: so many cop and firefighter kids. I remember a lot

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Speaker 1: of them being cop and five kids. I only met

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Speaker 1: one other kid whose parent worked in Marshall mcclennan, and

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Speaker 1: he was a senior and I was a freshman. And

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Speaker 1: we did start talking, and the TVs were on, and

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Speaker 1: the TV's had the school of TVs everywhere because of

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Speaker 1: announcements and stuff like that. So there was a TV

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Speaker 1: on with what was fully on display, which was two

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Speaker 1: buildings on fire and obviously not a one man plane.

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Speaker 1: And I was like desperate to try to get my

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Speaker 1: mom on the phone because it was so much worse

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Speaker 1: than I thought about. I didn't know what There was

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Speaker 1: no context of how they had spoken to her or

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Speaker 1: when they had spoken to her or what I was like,

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Speaker 1: I have to hear my mom's voice at that moment,

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Speaker 1: and the classroom bell changed and I didn't go to class,

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Speaker 1: and I just kind of wandered the school. I don't remember,

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Speaker 1: I know I left. I left the guidance Counselor's office

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Speaker 1: before I had spoken to my mom, and I just

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Speaker 1: started wandering the school, did not go into class, just

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Speaker 1: watching it on every television that was playing it. And

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Speaker 1: I ended up at the admissions office and that's when

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Speaker 1: the building fell. And I just looked at someone working

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Speaker 1: at the administra's office and I said, how many people died?

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Speaker 1: And the lady there was like, I have no idea.

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Speaker 1: And there's like those moments where you look to an

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Speaker 1: adult from a child, thinking that they're going to know

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Speaker 1: as a child, you look to an adult day they're

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Speaker 1: going to know every all the answers, and it was

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Speaker 1: just like this emptiness, this emptiness of thought, and I

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Speaker 1: just said, I have to talk to my mom somehow.

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Speaker 1: I have to figure out how to talk to my mom.

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Speaker 1: And I remembers two thousand and one, and there's no

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Speaker 1: like cell phones. Cell phones that existed did not even

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Speaker 1: work because the towers were down. Well, I don't remember

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Speaker 1: when I got to the guidance counse. I went back

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Speaker 1: to the guidance counsel's office, and I don't know how

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Speaker 1: this happened, but my mom ended up on the phone.

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Speaker 1: I don't I have not no recollection how they end

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Speaker 1: up making contact because she'd have a cell phone. My

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Speaker 1: mom is I remember talking on the phone and saying

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Speaker 1: I'm coming home, like I'm going to come home. And

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Speaker 1: my mom has a very almost Protestant like work ethic

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Speaker 1: where she was like, why you know you're gonna put

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Speaker 1: the fire out of the building, You're gonna sit there

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Speaker 1: and dig through rubble. No, you're going to class right now.

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Speaker 1: There's nothing you could do by being home, So go

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Speaker 1: to class, go to math class. And like as as

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Speaker 1: it in such horror, like it wouldn't have it wasn't gonna.

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Speaker 1: It wouldn't have dawned on her to like say, oh,

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Speaker 1: he probably can't concentrate on algebra at the moment. But

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Speaker 1: my mother was like, no, you're going to school, like

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Speaker 1: you're in school, go to class. But I didn't. I

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Speaker 1: didn't make it to class. I didn't go to any

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Speaker 1: other classes. I went as soon as I hung up

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Speaker 1: with from my mom, and I went to the cafeteria

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Speaker 1: for a while and bummed around, and I think I

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Speaker 1: got a payphone and called somebody and said, please pick

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Speaker 1: me up. I'm not staying here. And I told this

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Speaker 1: one girl I knew my whole life, who knew my

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Speaker 1: mom named Christina, that she was that my mom would

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Speaker 1: work there, and the girl and the caffetier just burst

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Speaker 1: into tears, and it was it was just chaotic. It

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Speaker 1: was just so chaotic and so many ins and me

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Speaker 1: and that girl started talking about who we knew his

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Speaker 1: parents were firefighters, and who we knew parents worked there

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Speaker 1: or near there, And eventually someone came to pick me up.

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Speaker 1: I think it was my uncle Mark, and they brought

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Speaker 1: me to my grandma's house. Now, my grandma's house was

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Speaker 1: across the street from my house, and she had two televisions,

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Speaker 1: which was a big deal in two thousand and one

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Speaker 1: in my working class family, it was a big deal anyway.

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Speaker 1: So she had the basement TV going on Cartoon Network

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Speaker 1: because it was the only channel that was not replaying

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Speaker 1: the attacks at three o'clock, and there were a lot

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Speaker 1: of young cousins and my whole family was there, so

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Speaker 1: the kids were sent to the basement to watch cartoons,

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Speaker 1: and I don't know what the adults honestly were doing upstairs,

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Speaker 1: but we all just sat there and waited for my

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Speaker 1: mom to show up. And you know, you couldn't call

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Speaker 1: her and say, what's your eta. We just had to

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Speaker 1: wait and wait and wait. And from my grandma's house

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Speaker 1: you could see. My grandma's house was in Western Queens

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Speaker 1: on a hill, so you could see downtown and you

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Speaker 1: could see the smoke clouds. It was the darkest rain

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Speaker 1: cloud you could possibly imagine. You could smell smoke in

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Speaker 1: the air, that is how palpable it was. In the

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Speaker 1: immediate aftermath, and my brother's elementary school, my old elementary

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Speaker 1: school too. My brother was in sixth grade at the

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Speaker 1: time it was on. It was further up the hill,

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Speaker 1: very near near our house. And the way it worked

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Speaker 1: was the most senior members of the school seventh, eighth, sixth, seventh,

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Speaker 1: and eighth grade, they were in the third story, so

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Speaker 1: they were very high, a perfect clear view of all

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Speaker 1: of the Manhattan skyline. And I don't know why someone

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Speaker 1: did this for but someone ran into my brother's classroom

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Speaker 1: and said, everyone look outside history's made and my brother,

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Speaker 1: who was only in the sixth grade at the time,

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Speaker 1: ran to the window, saw or looked at the window,

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Speaker 1: saw it my mom's building on fire, and left the

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Speaker 1: room and saw got to the stairs of the building,

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Speaker 1: of the floor and saw it was a Catholic sosocis so,

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Speaker 1: the priest and the nun who was the principal, and

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Speaker 1: he just thought that they were about to tell him

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Speaker 1: that his mom had passed away, and he burst into

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Speaker 1: hysterics just by the thought of it. I didn't have

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Speaker 1: the same moment, because my uncle intercepted me right at

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Speaker 1: the very beginning, so I never had that complete fear.

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Speaker 1: I had a worry of not knowing, of a long

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Speaker 1: periods of not being able to get a hold of somebody.

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Speaker 1: Think of how immediate everything is now, and how hours

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Speaker 1: would go by without being able to get a hold

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Speaker 1: of anybody, and how horrific everything looked looked. But my

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Speaker 1: mom made it home that day, very very luckily, and

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Speaker 1: we were all there, the whole family, every cousin, every

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Speaker 1: you know, and an uncle, and she just like collapsed

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Speaker 1: on the couch, and I remember that look of just

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Speaker 1: pure exhaustion on her face and there was a silence.

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Speaker 1: Nobody spoke, and I fell a very long time. It

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Speaker 1: was probably like thirty seconds, but no one spoke, and

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Speaker 1: I remember thinking in my head, like break the silence.

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Speaker 1: You know, there's always me with a trying to make

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Speaker 1: an opportune time out of things. So I looked at

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Speaker 1: my mom and said, you'll never leave the day that

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Speaker 1: I had, which didn't make her laugh. She did say,

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Speaker 1: what happened to you today? But it was primary day

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Speaker 1: in New York City, so cops in New York have

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Speaker 1: to be stationed at different voting sites. And my dad

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Speaker 1: very luckily was stationed in the Bronx and my uncle,

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Speaker 1: but my other uncle, my uncle Jimmy, was stationed at

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Speaker 1: nine to eleven, was in front of the building when

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Speaker 1: it collapsed and he ran one way and his partner

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Speaker 1: around the other, and his partner never made it out alive,

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Speaker 1: and he did. And there were so many million close

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Speaker 1: calls with so many people that I knew, and so

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Speaker 1: many sudden decisions that changed every person's life. And I

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Speaker 1: my mom happened to be running late from work that

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Speaker 1: day and my dad happed me station at the Bronx.

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Speaker 1: But I know, had she not shown up to late

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Speaker 1: to work that day, and had my dad been station

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Speaker 1: anywhere close to the building, my dad would have spent

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Speaker 1: what my dad would have been there, So the moment

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Speaker 1: it came down his head looking for my mom, like

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Speaker 1: I know that in my absolute heart of hearts.

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Speaker 2: So I.

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Speaker 1: Lot of people who were in New York think of

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Speaker 1: the day after, and they think of how united the

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Speaker 1: country was and how united we were as a people.

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Speaker 1: And what I remember most distinctly is there were express

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Speaker 1: bus stops throughout all of Queen's including near my house

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Speaker 1: that I grew up in, and on the express bus

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Speaker 1: was pictures taped onto the glass saying have you seen

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Speaker 1: this person? Have you seen that person? People just hoping

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Speaker 1: that their loved one had suffered amnesia or was in

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Speaker 1: a hospital and was going to make at home. That's

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Speaker 1: like the thing that I kind of stick with the most.

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Speaker 1: I don't remember national mood of the country. I don't

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Speaker 1: remember George W. Bush's speech. I don't remember Giuliana going

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Speaker 1: down there. I remember that glass though, of all those

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Speaker 1: pictures saying please call so and so if you've seen

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Speaker 1: Tom Dick Harry. I think the moment was too big

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Speaker 1: for my fourteen year old brain to comprehend nine to

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Speaker 1: eleven has been harder since the attack, I believe it

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Speaker 1: or not than in the immediate moment because I felt lucky.

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Speaker 1: I felt very, very lucky. But as time passed and

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Speaker 1: I knew so many people who's mostly dads. I knew

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Speaker 1: a lot of dads who didn't come home that day,

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Speaker 1: friends of people that I knew whose fathers, a lot

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Speaker 1: more firefighters. And as life events have happened, people got married,

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Speaker 1: people have children, and seeing their dad not there has

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Speaker 1: made me the impact. I feel the impact so much

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Speaker 1: harder as life goes on because I was so lucky

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Speaker 1: and I did have now these twenty four years of

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Speaker 1: both my parents because like I said, a couple of

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Speaker 1: minutes difference and my mom would have absolutely been killed

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Speaker 1: on impact and my dad would have been in that

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Speaker 1: building looking for my mom until the minute it fell.

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Speaker 1: So this day makes me incredibly grateful. It makes me

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Speaker 1: deeply sad for other people, and it makes me want

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Speaker 1: for someone else who may be the age that I

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Speaker 1: was when it happened, to try to understand how it's

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Speaker 1: more than like a meme you may see online of it.

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Speaker 1: There's a lot of jokes with George W. Bush's reaction

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Speaker 1: or some historical event you learn about in school, how

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Speaker 1: it was so real. And I say that as somebody

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Speaker 1: who didn't end up going to a parent's memorial service.

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Speaker 1: But it was so real and it remains real, and

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Speaker 1: it remains real, not just for what was lost in

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Speaker 1: the day, but what has been lost since. I think,

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Speaker 1: on a bigger idea also, what was lost as far

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Speaker 1: as we were as a country, the facade that the

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Speaker 1: oceans would protect us and that we weren't so entangled

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Speaker 1: in you know, the globe, the way that we are

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Speaker 1: in the ga we were in the proceeding and the

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Speaker 1: post in the post nine to eleven decades. We'll never

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Speaker 1: go back to that place again, and I really wish

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Speaker 1: sometimes we would. In nine ten in America was a

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Speaker 1: really really nice place to live. It genuinely was. So.

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Speaker 1: For this episode, my special guest is my mom, who

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Speaker 1: worked at Marsh mcclennan on ninety seventh floor of Tower one,

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Speaker 1: and she's going to tell her story of survival and

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Speaker 1: grief and what was lost and how she deals with it.

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Speaker 1: And I'm very excited about this conversation, So please stay

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Speaker 1: tuned and that's coming up next with me on today's

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Speaker 1: episode is my mom, Tony Angridowski. Mom, thanks for being here,

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Speaker 1: Thank you for having me. So, Mom, paint a picture

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Speaker 1: for my audience. Where did you work?

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Speaker 2: I worked at Marsha mcclennan in two thousand and one.

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Speaker 2: We were located on the ninety seventh floor of Taro one.

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Speaker 1: So let's go back to that day. You know, when

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Speaker 1: I was a kid who was constantly late to grammar school,

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Speaker 1: people were expecting you to be late because I was

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Speaker 1: always late. And then I went to high school and

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Speaker 1: I had to actually show up on time. So but

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Speaker 1: you were it late that day. So why don't we

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Speaker 1: go over what happened on nine to eleven?

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Speaker 2: Okay, well, on that more. The night before on September tenth,

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Speaker 2: set the alarm and planned on being to work in

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Speaker 2: the office by eight o'clock. We had budget meetings all day,

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Speaker 2: as we did on Monday, and I woke up and

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Speaker 2: something just told me not to rush, and I decided

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Speaker 2: that budget is going to be another hell day. So

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Speaker 2: I just took my time and I would have been

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Speaker 2: in the office at like ten to nine, so I

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Speaker 2: would have been on time. I just wasn't I didn't

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Speaker 2: follow the plan I had of getting in very early.

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Speaker 1: What did you You took the train back then?

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Speaker 2: No, I used to drive to Long Island City, leave

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Speaker 2: my car there and then take the train. The train,

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Speaker 2: no train, the seven to the okay, I'm sorry, the

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Speaker 2: seven to the two to the one.

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Speaker 1: Gotcha? Okay.

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Speaker 2: So that morning it was a beautiful sky. And back

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Speaker 2: then the when the when the l I E breaks

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Speaker 2: off and you get off, and damn street there used

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Speaker 2: to be one lane m but everyone used to make

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Speaker 2: it too. It was just normal every morning because otherwise

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Speaker 2: we do backed up on the BQI forur miles, so

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Speaker 2: we always made two and legally but we cut off

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Speaker 2: the other cars. We just merge.

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Speaker 3: We carriated our own merge.

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Speaker 2: Well that morning because it was so gorgeous that I

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Speaker 2: was like, I'm just taking my time and I didn't again,

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Speaker 2: I didn't rush and cut everybody off like I normally

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Speaker 2: would have. So I so I sat in in the

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Speaker 2: in the in the line of traffic, and then I

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Speaker 2: did my normal commute.

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Speaker 1: So you take the two train, you get off the

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Speaker 1: train at the World Trade Center at the.

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Speaker 2: Two train, I get off and I take the two

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Speaker 2: trains at Express train and you take it to Chamber

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Speaker 2: Street and then you transfer to the local which it

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Speaker 2: would have been the one train, and take it to

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Speaker 2: right inside the building, right, you take it to.

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Speaker 1: The one trains up literally underneath the building.

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Speaker 2: Yes, so that day I just missed the one. There

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Speaker 2: was nobody on the platform, so I know I just

434
00:26:01,440 --> 00:26:03,800
Speaker 2: missed it. I didn't see it leave, but it was

435
00:26:03,960 --> 00:26:05,280
Speaker 2: I knew I just missed it.

436
00:26:05,720 --> 00:26:08,000
Speaker 1: So what time did you pull in underneath the building?

437
00:26:11,280 --> 00:26:12,080
Speaker 3: So the one trains?

438
00:26:12,280 --> 00:26:14,720
Speaker 2: So I'm sitting at the two platform and the one

439
00:26:14,760 --> 00:26:17,320
Speaker 2: train never came, right, we never came, So the two

440
00:26:17,359 --> 00:26:19,720
Speaker 2: trains kept coming. The expresses were still coming. And a

441
00:26:19,760 --> 00:26:23,040
Speaker 2: gentleman that I had met and worked in two World Trade.

442
00:26:23,080 --> 00:26:25,320
Speaker 2: He worked for a different company and we met each other.

443
00:26:25,359 --> 00:26:28,280
Speaker 2: We sat on the platform, We're joking around, laughing, and

444
00:26:28,359 --> 00:26:30,200
Speaker 2: we just got the twos go. We're waiting for one

445
00:26:30,640 --> 00:26:32,280
Speaker 2: and the ones never came. So I said, we have

446
00:26:32,359 --> 00:26:34,320
Speaker 2: to make a decision. We have to get on the

447
00:26:34,400 --> 00:26:36,880
Speaker 2: two and walk because then it leaves you off by

448
00:26:36,920 --> 00:26:39,760
Speaker 2: five World Trade and you walk, or we have to

449
00:26:40,080 --> 00:26:41,760
Speaker 2: go out and Chamber Street. You just walk the whole way.

450
00:26:41,760 --> 00:26:44,159
Speaker 2: He goes let's take the two. So we took the

451
00:26:44,160 --> 00:26:47,000
Speaker 2: two train. I got back on the train then, and

452
00:26:47,359 --> 00:26:50,200
Speaker 2: it takes you to five World Trade. And as you're

453
00:26:50,400 --> 00:26:55,600
Speaker 2: walking underground now we hear an explosion.

454
00:26:55,720 --> 00:26:59,040
Speaker 1: Because New York City subways for those who are not

455
00:26:59,040 --> 00:27:01,800
Speaker 1: from New York and never been here, it's almost a

456
00:27:01,840 --> 00:27:05,080
Speaker 1: block long underground, so you could walk, you could walk,

457
00:27:05,200 --> 00:27:07,520
Speaker 1: you could walk a literal block underground.

458
00:27:07,840 --> 00:27:11,840
Speaker 2: So actually, as we got the train and we're walking,

459
00:27:12,240 --> 00:27:16,400
Speaker 2: a woman walked towards us and said, there's smoke. So

460
00:27:16,440 --> 00:27:17,880
Speaker 2: we were like, oh, let's check it out. We kept

461
00:27:17,920 --> 00:27:21,080
Speaker 2: walking towards the smoke, right, how stupid. So we were

462
00:27:21,119 --> 00:27:24,360
Speaker 2: walking and then within a minute, not even we heard

463
00:27:24,400 --> 00:27:27,400
Speaker 2: an explosion, like there was a bomb in the subway.

464
00:27:27,520 --> 00:27:29,840
Speaker 3: That's how the subway shook.

465
00:27:30,480 --> 00:27:32,960
Speaker 1: So then we there was the second plane.

466
00:27:33,480 --> 00:27:37,560
Speaker 2: So of course we turn around and we leave and

467
00:27:37,600 --> 00:27:39,840
Speaker 2: go out the exit and we go upstairs and then

468
00:27:39,880 --> 00:27:41,760
Speaker 2: we see what's going on. But yes, that was the

469
00:27:41,800 --> 00:27:46,000
Speaker 2: second plane getting hit, the second building getting hit. So

470
00:27:46,400 --> 00:27:50,600
Speaker 2: when we get outside, we can see the fire, the smoke,

471
00:27:50,880 --> 00:27:53,080
Speaker 2: We can count how many floors. I worked on the

472
00:27:53,119 --> 00:27:55,520
Speaker 2: ninety seventh floor, so I can see that the impact

473
00:27:55,520 --> 00:27:59,439
Speaker 2: on my building was on our floors. Both buildings at

474
00:27:59,440 --> 00:28:01,520
Speaker 2: this point were on fire and smelled.

475
00:28:01,280 --> 00:28:03,600
Speaker 1: So you could tell it your floor had been had.

476
00:28:03,720 --> 00:28:04,879
Speaker 3: I could tell my floor I got hit.

477
00:28:05,200 --> 00:28:07,600
Speaker 1: So when what block did you get out of the train?

478
00:28:07,840 --> 00:28:11,920
Speaker 2: I got out on Park Place, which so you get

479
00:28:12,320 --> 00:28:14,840
Speaker 2: it's right there as soon as the subway station, right

480
00:28:15,840 --> 00:28:17,120
Speaker 2: right outside the trade center.

481
00:28:17,160 --> 00:28:19,159
Speaker 1: So could you see debris on the floor on the

482
00:28:19,160 --> 00:28:20,040
Speaker 1: street or.

483
00:28:20,480 --> 00:28:23,600
Speaker 2: I wasn't that close where I could see that. I

484
00:28:23,600 --> 00:28:27,440
Speaker 2: could definitely see the buildings. I don't remember seeing debris

485
00:28:27,560 --> 00:28:30,280
Speaker 2: at that point. It was just the initial impacts. It

486
00:28:30,320 --> 00:28:33,520
Speaker 2: was still early, so the streets were not full yet

487
00:28:33,560 --> 00:28:37,960
Speaker 2: because the buildings were still standing. But I ran in

488
00:28:38,240 --> 00:28:41,560
Speaker 2: so I was with this gentleman. He kept on saying,

489
00:28:41,880 --> 00:28:47,440
Speaker 2: my colleagues, my colleagues, I'm like just an in dazed

490
00:28:47,880 --> 00:28:51,560
Speaker 2: sun because I guess can't figure it all out. And

491
00:28:51,840 --> 00:28:53,880
Speaker 2: I ran to a woman that I did work with,

492
00:28:54,120 --> 00:28:56,400
Speaker 2: and she lived on.

493
00:28:59,400 --> 00:29:00,960
Speaker 3: Like ten teen blocks away.

494
00:29:01,400 --> 00:29:02,560
Speaker 2: I can't think of the name of the street at

495
00:29:02,560 --> 00:29:04,400
Speaker 2: the top of my head, but she lived on the

496
00:29:04,480 --> 00:29:07,120
Speaker 2: upper west side, on the lower west side. So she goes,

497
00:29:07,200 --> 00:29:09,680
Speaker 2: let's go to my house, Let's see what's going on.

498
00:29:09,760 --> 00:29:10,440
Speaker 3: I have three phones.

499
00:29:11,360 --> 00:29:13,680
Speaker 2: Yeah, she had got three phone lines. She's I have

500
00:29:13,720 --> 00:29:15,800
Speaker 2: three phone lines because her husband worked at home. And

501
00:29:16,120 --> 00:29:17,680
Speaker 2: we'll go check out. We'll see what's going on.

502
00:29:17,720 --> 00:29:21,160
Speaker 1: Little three phone lines and two thousands. That's a big deal.

503
00:29:22,680 --> 00:29:26,440
Speaker 2: And she said, then we'll come back, we'll see what's

504
00:29:26,480 --> 00:29:28,960
Speaker 2: going on, we'll get situated, and we'll come back. So

505
00:29:29,040 --> 00:29:31,120
Speaker 2: I said, I can't until I said how long of

506
00:29:31,120 --> 00:29:33,360
Speaker 2: a walk? She said fifteen minutes. I said, great, I

507
00:29:33,480 --> 00:29:36,640
Speaker 2: have to call my family first. So my next thing

508
00:29:36,680 --> 00:29:39,720
Speaker 2: is I stood online for a payphone. We really didn't

509
00:29:39,720 --> 00:29:42,080
Speaker 2: have cell phones. We did, but they didn't work really

510
00:29:42,160 --> 00:29:46,600
Speaker 2: at that day because the tower went out communications which

511
00:29:46,640 --> 00:29:49,160
Speaker 2: is the top of one World trade. So but I

512
00:29:49,480 --> 00:29:53,840
Speaker 2: did have a BlackBerry text message which did still work

513
00:29:54,080 --> 00:29:57,440
Speaker 2: at some points throughout the morning, and people and I

514
00:29:57,800 --> 00:29:59,600
Speaker 2: my people that worked for me, were texting me saying

515
00:30:00,120 --> 00:30:02,640
Speaker 2: I'm going to vote someone else text me, I ran late,

516
00:30:02,680 --> 00:30:04,360
Speaker 2: my son. I fell asleep with my son, never said,

517
00:30:04,600 --> 00:30:06,920
Speaker 2: you know, didn't get up. So I'm getting I was

518
00:30:06,960 --> 00:30:12,560
Speaker 2: getting some text messages and I wait on line for

519
00:30:12,600 --> 00:30:16,680
Speaker 2: the phone, and where is still right by where I

520
00:30:16,680 --> 00:30:18,520
Speaker 2: got off the train, still in the same.

521
00:30:18,840 --> 00:30:20,960
Speaker 1: Still in the same still look the building.

522
00:30:21,000 --> 00:30:26,400
Speaker 2: Yes, So I call my mom and I tell them

523
00:30:26,480 --> 00:30:31,480
Speaker 2: that I'm fine, I'm outside the building, right, And.

524
00:30:31,120 --> 00:30:34,000
Speaker 1: You don't know what time this is about. It had to.

525
00:30:33,880 --> 00:30:39,880
Speaker 2: Be no, no, it had to be like just nine o'clock,

526
00:30:39,920 --> 00:30:42,000
Speaker 2: a couple of minutes after nine, because the building I

527
00:30:42,080 --> 00:30:44,320
Speaker 2: hit at a forty six. So the next one was

528
00:30:44,480 --> 00:30:46,640
Speaker 2: I don't remember the exact times of the second building,

529
00:30:46,680 --> 00:30:49,040
Speaker 2: but it's let's say it's let's say it's about nine o'clock.

530
00:30:49,040 --> 00:30:51,800
Speaker 2: It would take so people are online on the phone,

531
00:30:51,840 --> 00:30:53,840
Speaker 2: they're like talking, tell them, like, you know, sitting on

532
00:30:53,880 --> 00:30:55,959
Speaker 2: the phone for like it seemed like minutes. I'm like,

533
00:30:56,120 --> 00:30:58,200
Speaker 2: everyone's swinging me. Just tell them you're okay and hang

534
00:30:58,280 --> 00:31:00,760
Speaker 2: up the phone because the line, of course, is getting longer.

535
00:31:01,000 --> 00:31:03,040
Speaker 2: So I call my parents, Like I said, I tell

536
00:31:03,080 --> 00:31:05,240
Speaker 2: them that I'm safe from outside the building.

537
00:31:05,440 --> 00:31:06,680
Speaker 1: You go with your colleagues and.

538
00:31:06,960 --> 00:31:10,240
Speaker 2: I go with my friend and we walked to her apartment.

539
00:31:10,360 --> 00:31:14,520
Speaker 2: As we're walking, I hear another explosion. Don't know what

540
00:31:14,560 --> 00:31:18,560
Speaker 2: it is. We keep walking. I get to her apartment

541
00:31:18,600 --> 00:31:20,880
Speaker 2: and her husband's there and he's got the TV on

542
00:31:21,000 --> 00:31:23,160
Speaker 2: and I look at the TV and I'm like, from

543
00:31:23,160 --> 00:31:26,680
Speaker 2: this angle, I could only see one building, and she

544
00:31:26,800 --> 00:31:28,560
Speaker 2: knew it, but she didn't say anything to me, so

545
00:31:28,720 --> 00:31:30,920
Speaker 2: we get When I said that, she said, remember that

546
00:31:31,040 --> 00:31:34,880
Speaker 2: noise we heard, She goes, that's the building. The building fell.

547
00:31:35,040 --> 00:31:38,040
Speaker 2: I had no idea. I didn't even contemplate the building

548
00:31:38,040 --> 00:31:42,960
Speaker 2: would fall. So that's when the building fell. So from

549
00:31:42,960 --> 00:31:46,840
Speaker 2: my parents' perspective, I just called and said I was fine,

550
00:31:46,880 --> 00:31:47,800
Speaker 2: I was outside.

551
00:31:47,880 --> 00:31:49,280
Speaker 3: But I didn't even think of that.

552
00:31:49,480 --> 00:31:53,280
Speaker 2: Right now, we are trying to figure out who's good,

553
00:31:53,320 --> 00:31:53,720
Speaker 2: who's not.

554
00:31:53,960 --> 00:31:54,760
Speaker 3: Who would we call?

555
00:31:55,160 --> 00:31:57,920
Speaker 1: So how long is the walk from the building to

556
00:31:58,320 --> 00:31:58,920
Speaker 1: her apartment?

557
00:31:59,000 --> 00:31:59,760
Speaker 3: Fifteen minutes?

558
00:32:00,080 --> 00:32:00,800
Speaker 1: It's not that long.

559
00:32:00,880 --> 00:32:01,520
Speaker 3: It's not that long.

560
00:32:01,600 --> 00:32:05,120
Speaker 2: So the first building fell while we were walking, and

561
00:32:05,280 --> 00:32:07,120
Speaker 2: like I said, when we got to her house, the

562
00:32:07,240 --> 00:32:08,600
Speaker 2: other building was still standing.

563
00:32:08,920 --> 00:32:12,000
Speaker 1: The second plane had hit so much lower in the

564
00:32:12,040 --> 00:32:14,760
Speaker 1: building that there was a lot more weight that was

565
00:32:14,760 --> 00:32:17,280
Speaker 1: holding and the beams were holding up whatever was surviving.

566
00:32:17,720 --> 00:32:20,240
Speaker 1: So it was going through your head on that fifteen

567
00:32:20,240 --> 00:32:23,400
Speaker 1: minute walk, you remember.

568
00:32:23,280 --> 00:32:24,240
Speaker 3: I don't.

569
00:32:24,800 --> 00:32:27,920
Speaker 2: I don't remember, honestly. I was more, I think, in

570
00:32:28,000 --> 00:32:31,080
Speaker 2: shock than anything else, and we were trying to see

571
00:32:31,560 --> 00:32:34,280
Speaker 2: who else survived. I guess that's what I was thinking of,

572
00:32:34,320 --> 00:32:35,920
Speaker 2: because that's what we went there for. We went there

573
00:32:35,960 --> 00:32:38,280
Speaker 2: to make some phone calls to find out who's okay

574
00:32:38,320 --> 00:32:41,880
Speaker 2: and who's not and why we were at her house.

575
00:32:42,040 --> 00:32:44,760
Speaker 2: The bell rang, the drwbell rang, and we were like,

576
00:32:45,040 --> 00:32:46,720
Speaker 2: who's that going to be? And it ended up being

577
00:32:46,760 --> 00:32:49,680
Speaker 2: someone that she had worked with at a different company

578
00:32:49,680 --> 00:32:51,800
Speaker 2: that was a friend of hers. Showed up and he

579
00:32:52,440 --> 00:32:55,000
Speaker 2: was with us that morning. But we were able to

580
00:32:55,120 --> 00:33:01,000
Speaker 2: call the office. Prime location was Midtown, fifth Street and

581
00:33:01,000 --> 00:33:04,160
Speaker 2: sixth Avenue. Their phone still worked, so we were able

582
00:33:04,240 --> 00:33:06,959
Speaker 2: to call there and see a little bit about what

583
00:33:07,080 --> 00:33:09,920
Speaker 2: was going on, what they were doing there. We were

584
00:33:10,000 --> 00:33:14,320
Speaker 2: even able to actually the gentleman that came to the house.

585
00:33:14,640 --> 00:33:18,040
Speaker 2: His family lived in Florida. We could not call from

586
00:33:18,160 --> 00:33:20,320
Speaker 2: her apartment. Even though we had phone lines. We couldn't

587
00:33:20,320 --> 00:33:24,080
Speaker 2: call Florida, but we were able to call the the

588
00:33:24,080 --> 00:33:28,000
Speaker 2: Midtown office had them transfer us to Florida and he

589
00:33:28,080 --> 00:33:28,960
Speaker 2: was able to get through.

590
00:33:29,040 --> 00:33:31,479
Speaker 3: So the phone lines, yeah, the phone lines were all

591
00:33:31,480 --> 00:33:31,880
Speaker 3: messed up.

592
00:33:32,000 --> 00:33:32,160
Speaker 2: Well.

593
00:33:32,240 --> 00:33:34,840
Speaker 1: One thing I think about before you go any further

594
00:33:35,000 --> 00:33:38,680
Speaker 1: is so my grandparents, my mom's parents who she referenced,

595
00:33:38,800 --> 00:33:41,320
Speaker 1: they were very close to us. They lived across the

596
00:33:41,320 --> 00:33:45,000
Speaker 1: street from us, and my grandfather specifically, was a very

597
00:33:45,320 --> 00:33:48,400
Speaker 1: stoic man. He was very funny, but he wasn't somebody

598
00:33:48,440 --> 00:33:50,520
Speaker 1: who had a lot of expressions. He didn't sit there

599
00:33:50,520 --> 00:33:52,720
Speaker 1: and talk a lot. Is the least Italian thing about

600
00:33:52,800 --> 00:33:55,400
Speaker 1: him was how whiet he was, and he didn't show

601
00:33:55,480 --> 00:33:58,800
Speaker 1: a broad range of emotions. Later on they told me

602
00:33:59,200 --> 00:34:02,880
Speaker 1: that I guess it was Grandma's sister, my aunt Mary,

603
00:34:03,120 --> 00:34:06,320
Speaker 1: who had called Grandma to tell her that the planes

604
00:34:06,320 --> 00:34:09,520
Speaker 1: were hit and she turned on the television and Grandpa

605
00:34:09,560 --> 00:34:12,960
Speaker 1: saw it and Grandpa like According to Ann, Mary who

606
00:34:13,000 --> 00:34:15,080
Speaker 1: said she I mean she told me this even recently

607
00:34:15,120 --> 00:34:18,600
Speaker 1: said she still can hear my Grandma's boys scream at

608
00:34:18,640 --> 00:34:21,640
Speaker 1: like the top of his lungs because he was so

609
00:34:21,840 --> 00:34:25,440
Speaker 1: afraid that you had died, and he that is always

610
00:34:25,480 --> 00:34:28,040
Speaker 1: one of the things I think that send me the

611
00:34:28,080 --> 00:34:31,120
Speaker 1: most chills. Here I met it in the immediate aftermath,

612
00:34:31,239 --> 00:34:33,840
Speaker 1: was because I can't imagine Grandpa being scared, you know

613
00:34:33,880 --> 00:34:34,279
Speaker 1: what I mean.

614
00:34:34,560 --> 00:34:37,520
Speaker 2: And the second, well, what happened too was what I

615
00:34:37,560 --> 00:34:42,480
Speaker 2: heard again, I wasn't there is that they were okay

616
00:34:42,600 --> 00:34:45,319
Speaker 2: when I got to tell them it was fine, But

617
00:34:45,400 --> 00:34:47,879
Speaker 2: then I said I was outside the building, and then

618
00:34:48,080 --> 00:34:49,799
Speaker 2: so I don't know if that conversation with am Mary

619
00:34:49,880 --> 00:34:53,600
Speaker 2: was before half, but the building then fell after I

620
00:34:53,640 --> 00:34:56,840
Speaker 2: just said I was outside, so I heard that he

621
00:34:56,880 --> 00:34:59,799
Speaker 2: went up in his room and he was crying as

622
00:34:59,840 --> 00:35:02,880
Speaker 2: eyes out. But because at that point, I mean, he

623
00:35:02,960 --> 00:35:05,520
Speaker 2: knew the area. He worked down there every day, so

624
00:35:05,560 --> 00:35:08,600
Speaker 2: he knew where I was in the situation, and he

625
00:35:08,719 --> 00:35:10,600
Speaker 2: thought I was buried under the building.

626
00:35:10,680 --> 00:35:12,239
Speaker 1: Do you remember what they said what you said to

627
00:35:12,239 --> 00:35:14,839
Speaker 1: them when you talked? You mention?

628
00:35:15,640 --> 00:35:18,880
Speaker 2: Yeah, I did mention you. I knew you were in

629
00:35:19,040 --> 00:35:21,080
Speaker 2: high school, and I knew you were where you were.

630
00:35:21,239 --> 00:35:25,279
Speaker 2: I was told that your uncle was had gone to

631
00:35:25,480 --> 00:35:28,040
Speaker 2: meet you, and I was told that your other uncle,

632
00:35:28,080 --> 00:35:30,160
Speaker 2: my brother in law, was went to go get Daniel.

633
00:35:30,440 --> 00:35:32,719
Speaker 2: So I knew they were that they were reaching out

634
00:35:32,719 --> 00:35:35,560
Speaker 2: to you both. But at that point in time, that's

635
00:35:35,600 --> 00:35:38,920
Speaker 2: all I knew. After I got it was at the

636
00:35:38,960 --> 00:35:42,239
Speaker 2: how the apartment, we did try making phone calls out

637
00:35:42,440 --> 00:35:44,560
Speaker 2: and I did, and I don't.

638
00:35:44,360 --> 00:35:48,080
Speaker 3: Remember how, but I.

639
00:35:47,200 --> 00:35:50,120
Speaker 2: I did get through too or your high school.

640
00:35:50,200 --> 00:35:52,040
Speaker 1: Yeah, I don't remember how we got you on the

641
00:35:52,080 --> 00:35:52,759
Speaker 1: phone before I.

642
00:35:52,800 --> 00:35:55,799
Speaker 2: Know, Yeah, somehow we got in touch and you were

643
00:35:55,840 --> 00:36:00,120
Speaker 2: with another young man whose father worked in the same company.

644
00:36:00,560 --> 00:36:02,839
Speaker 1: He was a senior and I was a freshman, and

645
00:36:02,880 --> 00:36:03,600
Speaker 1: they were.

646
00:36:03,560 --> 00:36:07,440
Speaker 2: That school did an amazing job at protecting the kids

647
00:36:07,440 --> 00:36:09,840
Speaker 2: and giving them information but making sure they're okay. And

648
00:36:09,840 --> 00:36:13,440
Speaker 2: then he's with Ryan was with a guidance counselor, and

649
00:36:14,239 --> 00:36:16,440
Speaker 2: thisaw the boy was looking for his dad, and they

650
00:36:16,520 --> 00:36:18,800
Speaker 2: kept saying do you know him? And do you know

651
00:36:18,840 --> 00:36:21,600
Speaker 2: if he's okay? And his name was familiar to someone

652
00:36:21,600 --> 00:36:23,840
Speaker 2: I worked with us, so we challenged that for a second.

653
00:36:23,880 --> 00:36:25,279
Speaker 2: He goes, no, this is his name. I said, no,

654
00:36:25,320 --> 00:36:27,479
Speaker 2: I don't know who that is. I don't even know him.

655
00:36:27,880 --> 00:36:30,120
Speaker 2: But I said, the situation down here, there's no way

656
00:36:30,120 --> 00:36:32,400
Speaker 2: I know that anybody's okay. I can't tell you that,

657
00:36:33,200 --> 00:36:38,440
Speaker 2: so fast forward. Thankfully, this man was fine. I actually

658
00:36:38,560 --> 00:36:40,920
Speaker 2: visited him once we went back to the office and

659
00:36:40,960 --> 00:36:43,759
Speaker 2: we're back midtown. I found him and I told him

660
00:36:43,760 --> 00:36:46,399
Speaker 2: that our sons were together during this whole thing.

661
00:36:46,600 --> 00:36:48,399
Speaker 3: So I did chat with him, but I did find dad.

662
00:36:48,440 --> 00:36:48,960
Speaker 3: He was okay.

663
00:36:49,200 --> 00:36:52,920
Speaker 1: Do you do you when you came home that day?

664
00:36:53,160 --> 00:36:56,080
Speaker 1: I remember you saying that you didn't know certain people

665
00:36:56,080 --> 00:36:58,360
Speaker 1: were still alive. How long did it take for everyone

666
00:36:58,400 --> 00:37:02,120
Speaker 1: to like email itach other and just say I'm okay.

667
00:37:02,480 --> 00:37:06,120
Speaker 2: Well, it really wasn't emails we did is they were

668
00:37:06,120 --> 00:37:09,279
Speaker 2: like phone call chains. So I still have it. I

669
00:37:09,320 --> 00:37:12,320
Speaker 2: have like this yellow pad of paper. I could picture

670
00:37:12,360 --> 00:37:15,759
Speaker 2: it and we would like all our friends were calling

671
00:37:15,800 --> 00:37:17,920
Speaker 2: each other and says, oh, I heard from Mary, and

672
00:37:17,960 --> 00:37:20,160
Speaker 2: I heard from John, and I heard from Susan. And

673
00:37:20,239 --> 00:37:22,200
Speaker 2: we was writing names down who we heard from, and

674
00:37:22,200 --> 00:37:24,040
Speaker 2: every time we got through to somebody, we were telling

675
00:37:24,040 --> 00:37:26,880
Speaker 2: them who we heard. Through the grape buying. That was okay,

676
00:37:27,280 --> 00:37:29,600
Speaker 2: but even still there were people that were not okay.

677
00:37:29,920 --> 00:37:33,160
Speaker 2: There was a gentleman who so I used to work

678
00:37:33,160 --> 00:37:37,280
Speaker 2: with his sister in law years prior, like in may se'son.

679
00:37:37,320 --> 00:37:39,440
Speaker 2: I had no idea that they were related until after

680
00:37:39,680 --> 00:37:42,960
Speaker 2: the event. But he had called in so his name

681
00:37:43,200 --> 00:37:45,840
Speaker 2: on the safe list, but he was in a conference

682
00:37:45,960 --> 00:37:48,560
Speaker 2: room in the building and he passed, so he was

683
00:37:48,640 --> 00:37:50,799
Speaker 2: on the list and it was not correct. So there

684
00:37:50,800 --> 00:37:53,880
Speaker 2: were a couple of those. The one gentleman who was

685
00:37:54,719 --> 00:37:57,080
Speaker 2: an admin from my boss, a friend of mine. I

686
00:37:57,120 --> 00:37:59,200
Speaker 2: had not heard about him. So, like when you go

687
00:37:59,239 --> 00:38:01,759
Speaker 2: through the I mean talk about two days of so

688
00:38:01,840 --> 00:38:04,280
Speaker 2: it was Tuesday when I got home. All day Wednesday,

689
00:38:04,800 --> 00:38:07,280
Speaker 2: I went back to the office on Thursday, but almost

690
00:38:07,280 --> 00:38:09,839
Speaker 2: two days. That's all we did is figuring out who

691
00:38:09,880 --> 00:38:10,320
Speaker 2: was around.

692
00:38:10,400 --> 00:38:13,239
Speaker 1: So it was like an email chain saying send me,

693
00:38:13,600 --> 00:38:15,200
Speaker 1: send me a reply if you're alive.

694
00:38:15,040 --> 00:38:16,760
Speaker 3: Or no, no, no, no, no, not at all.

695
00:38:16,880 --> 00:38:20,080
Speaker 2: But there was when you went into the building, there

696
00:38:20,160 --> 00:38:22,560
Speaker 2: was a desk set up to call in if anybody

697
00:38:22,640 --> 00:38:25,440
Speaker 2: had questions, and they did do amazing for family members.

698
00:38:25,600 --> 00:38:28,840
Speaker 2: And then they had like posted sheets on the wall.

699
00:38:28,960 --> 00:38:32,880
Speaker 2: The entire wall was filled with names, so as you

700
00:38:32,960 --> 00:38:35,480
Speaker 2: found out someone was a survivor, that name went up

701
00:38:35,480 --> 00:38:38,840
Speaker 2: on the wall or maybe in reverse, but the names

702
00:38:38,880 --> 00:38:41,640
Speaker 2: were on the wall, so I remember. And they had

703
00:38:41,640 --> 00:38:44,279
Speaker 2: a volunteer list at the desk of who wanted to be,

704
00:38:44,480 --> 00:38:46,920
Speaker 2: you know, make themselves available to answer the phone for

705
00:38:47,000 --> 00:38:48,160
Speaker 2: families and such.

706
00:38:48,680 --> 00:38:49,799
Speaker 3: And this one guy who.

707
00:38:49,760 --> 00:38:52,560
Speaker 2: I worked with, who I was very close with, I

708
00:38:52,600 --> 00:38:54,239
Speaker 2: had not known if he was alive. He was not

709
00:38:54,280 --> 00:38:56,560
Speaker 2: on the list, He was not on any list anywhere,

710
00:38:56,640 --> 00:38:59,319
Speaker 2: and then his name. I go to sign up to

711
00:38:59,440 --> 00:39:02,640
Speaker 2: help and his name is on the list, and I.

712
00:39:02,600 --> 00:39:04,840
Speaker 3: Like freaked down. I was like, how does anyone on

713
00:39:04,880 --> 00:39:05,320
Speaker 3: this list?

714
00:39:05,480 --> 00:39:07,440
Speaker 2: Like like he had signed up, So he was okay,

715
00:39:07,560 --> 00:39:09,480
Speaker 2: but it was just a very emotional moment for me.

716
00:39:10,080 --> 00:39:14,239
Speaker 2: The other emotional moment is some managers like, we still

717
00:39:14,239 --> 00:39:15,759
Speaker 2: have a business, we still have to run it, but

718
00:39:16,080 --> 00:39:18,839
Speaker 2: they were I walked into a conference room and there

719
00:39:18,840 --> 00:39:20,560
Speaker 2: are a bunch of people in there again you've seen

720
00:39:20,600 --> 00:39:23,160
Speaker 2: for the first time, and he's running a meeting and

721
00:39:23,200 --> 00:39:25,799
Speaker 2: I go in and I'm just bawling my eyes out,

722
00:39:25,880 --> 00:39:27,520
Speaker 2: hugging this other woman that's there.

723
00:39:27,520 --> 00:39:31,280
Speaker 3: We're both crying. He's still conducting the meeting. He goes hi, Tony,

724
00:39:31,600 --> 00:39:32,560
Speaker 3: think he keeps on going.

725
00:39:33,160 --> 00:39:36,680
Speaker 2: And that was like another moment that we just saw

726
00:39:36,719 --> 00:39:39,360
Speaker 2: each other. And from that mid day on, from the

727
00:39:39,400 --> 00:39:42,120
Speaker 2: Thursday on, every day they didn't force you to go

728
00:39:42,160 --> 00:39:44,080
Speaker 2: to work. You could have stayed out for two months

729
00:39:44,120 --> 00:39:46,080
Speaker 2: if you wanted to. We chose to go in no thought.

730
00:39:46,080 --> 00:39:50,279
Speaker 2: We got a lot accomplished in the beginning. But the

731
00:39:50,320 --> 00:39:53,919
Speaker 2: office in Midtown and we just kissed and.

732
00:39:53,880 --> 00:39:56,160
Speaker 3: Hogged to loow everybody.

733
00:39:56,200 --> 00:39:59,920
Speaker 2: Is so not the typical work experience, but for like

734
00:40:00,040 --> 00:40:03,319
Speaker 2: a month, it was this bond that we had with

735
00:40:03,440 --> 00:40:04,440
Speaker 2: each other that.

736
00:40:04,800 --> 00:40:05,520
Speaker 3: Was like no other.

737
00:40:06,000 --> 00:40:09,360
Speaker 1: So Marsh mcclennan lost three hundred and fifty eight people,

738
00:40:09,520 --> 00:40:13,040
Speaker 1: which is about twenty percent of the workforce. My mom

739
00:40:13,120 --> 00:40:14,480
Speaker 1: was making a basic On.

740
00:40:14,440 --> 00:40:16,360
Speaker 3: The IT side. I worked in technology.

741
00:40:16,600 --> 00:40:20,160
Speaker 2: We lost fifty about fifty percent, forty five percent consultants

742
00:40:20,200 --> 00:40:20,800
Speaker 2: and some.

743
00:40:22,640 --> 00:40:24,960
Speaker 1: Well they had eight floors and.

744
00:40:24,840 --> 00:40:28,480
Speaker 3: We were ninety four to ninety nine.

745
00:40:28,080 --> 00:40:32,279
Speaker 1: Oh yeah, so it was a lot.

746
00:40:32,480 --> 00:40:35,759
Speaker 2: Yeah, And that day, if we had our budget meetings

747
00:40:35,800 --> 00:40:37,120
Speaker 2: as we did the day before, we would have been

748
00:40:37,120 --> 00:40:39,719
Speaker 2: on ninety nine in the conference rooms the entire day.

749
00:40:39,719 --> 00:40:41,360
Speaker 1: You always would say that you would when you were

750
00:40:41,400 --> 00:40:44,759
Speaker 1: in ORG, you'd see birds flying below you. Well, no,

751
00:40:44,760 --> 00:40:45,960
Speaker 1: I never get to go to your office.

752
00:40:46,000 --> 00:40:48,759
Speaker 2: Well they would actually they would actually walk around and

753
00:40:48,800 --> 00:40:52,120
Speaker 2: put the blinds down because the birds would fly in,

754
00:40:52,760 --> 00:40:55,440
Speaker 2: and they would put nets around the building. That's what

755
00:40:55,520 --> 00:40:58,239
Speaker 2: I was told to catch the birds. So in my

756
00:40:58,480 --> 00:41:01,239
Speaker 2: head even on that day, as counting the floors and

757
00:41:01,280 --> 00:41:03,960
Speaker 2: I see people by the windows, and then I unfortunately

758
00:41:04,040 --> 00:41:05,800
Speaker 2: I did see people jump, and I think I know

759
00:41:05,880 --> 00:41:07,840
Speaker 2: who they were again based upon the floors, and I

760
00:41:07,880 --> 00:41:12,080
Speaker 2: know who was left in the building and who was trapped.

761
00:41:12,120 --> 00:41:14,799
Speaker 2: There was a dozen people together. I'm friends of mine,

762
00:41:14,920 --> 00:41:17,600
Speaker 2: and you know you saw the jumping. I was like,

763
00:41:18,200 --> 00:41:20,400
Speaker 2: the nets are there, Like in my head because you

764
00:41:20,440 --> 00:41:24,040
Speaker 2: aren't making any sense at the moment, but but you

765
00:41:24,080 --> 00:41:26,680
Speaker 2: wanted it all to be. You wanted everyone to be okay, like, oh,

766
00:41:26,680 --> 00:41:29,080
Speaker 2: they're jumping because you know, the firemen have those big

767
00:41:29,280 --> 00:41:32,560
Speaker 2: you know, not thinking that your ninety seven floors, that's

768
00:41:32,560 --> 00:41:33,480
Speaker 2: not going to do a damn thing.

769
00:41:33,680 --> 00:41:39,400
Speaker 1: Right, Hey, we'll be right back after this. I was

770
00:41:39,400 --> 00:41:42,600
Speaker 1: thinking about this to you. I am your age when

771
00:41:42,600 --> 00:41:45,279
Speaker 1: I eleven happened, like I was the agent you were

772
00:41:45,360 --> 00:41:50,440
Speaker 1: now when I'm eleven happened, which is like, really crazy.

773
00:41:50,680 --> 00:41:51,520
Speaker 3: I never thought of that.

774
00:41:51,600 --> 00:41:56,840
Speaker 1: I am. Yeah, and one thing that I think about

775
00:41:56,880 --> 00:42:00,680
Speaker 1: now as an adult, and you presented a very brave

776
00:42:00,760 --> 00:42:04,160
Speaker 1: face in the moment to me and my brother? Were

777
00:42:04,200 --> 00:42:07,520
Speaker 1: you afraid of staying? A lot of left New York

778
00:42:07,600 --> 00:42:10,280
Speaker 1: because they were terrified and they were afraid of another

779
00:42:10,360 --> 00:42:13,799
Speaker 1: terrorist attack? And we didn't do any of that. I

780
00:42:13,880 --> 00:42:17,480
Speaker 1: was in school two days later and we just kept

781
00:42:17,520 --> 00:42:19,840
Speaker 1: on keeping up. But were you, like I got to

782
00:42:19,840 --> 00:42:21,840
Speaker 1: get my family out of New York? Were you afraid

783
00:42:22,080 --> 00:42:23,200
Speaker 1: for living in the city.

784
00:42:23,560 --> 00:42:29,600
Speaker 2: I never never thought of that at all, honestly, and

785
00:42:29,680 --> 00:42:33,640
Speaker 2: I don't know why I didn't, although there was maybe

786
00:42:34,120 --> 00:42:38,000
Speaker 2: it had to be two thousand and three, there was

787
00:42:38,040 --> 00:42:43,759
Speaker 2: an event where there was a power outage and like

788
00:42:43,880 --> 00:42:46,160
Speaker 2: all the lights and everything went out downtown.

789
00:42:46,719 --> 00:42:48,960
Speaker 1: That's one of the whole eastern Chesebar went out.

790
00:42:50,600 --> 00:42:51,359
Speaker 3: I don't know if it.

791
00:42:51,239 --> 00:42:53,719
Speaker 2: Was the same event, but I just remember all of

792
00:42:53,800 --> 00:42:56,440
Speaker 2: downtown was out. Hoboken was out because they moved us

793
00:42:56,440 --> 00:42:59,080
Speaker 2: to Okah Hoboke and that's where our new offices were located.

794
00:42:59,480 --> 00:43:03,160
Speaker 2: And I leave early on Thursdays to come home to

795
00:43:03,400 --> 00:43:06,040
Speaker 2: be with you guys, and I was on the ferry

796
00:43:06,160 --> 00:43:10,080
Speaker 2: and when the lights went out, so then I thought

797
00:43:10,120 --> 00:43:15,120
Speaker 2: that was another attack. But I ever thought of leaving.

798
00:43:16,239 --> 00:43:18,000
Speaker 2: I never thought of leaving the city.

799
00:43:18,120 --> 00:43:20,680
Speaker 1: Did you ever get survivors guilt or did you have?

800
00:43:21,480 --> 00:43:23,680
Speaker 3: I did a lot. I think I still do to

801
00:43:23,680 --> 00:43:24,320
Speaker 3: some extent.

802
00:43:24,920 --> 00:43:27,440
Speaker 2: My good friend that I used to work McDonald's, but

803
00:43:27,480 --> 00:43:30,920
Speaker 2: when we were seventeen, he passed. We worked together at Marsh.

804
00:43:31,520 --> 00:43:34,000
Speaker 2: He passed nine to eleven, and I went to go

805
00:43:34,080 --> 00:43:37,200
Speaker 2: visit his father the next day on the twelfth, and

806
00:43:37,239 --> 00:43:39,920
Speaker 2: his father said to me, after losing his son, he

807
00:43:40,000 --> 00:43:43,000
Speaker 2: said to me, there's a reason why you're still here.

808
00:43:43,680 --> 00:43:46,120
Speaker 2: You have something you have to do, and that is

809
00:43:46,200 --> 00:43:50,240
Speaker 2: stuck with me these twenty four years. And I'm always

810
00:43:50,320 --> 00:43:53,400
Speaker 2: worried that did I do what I'm saying? Am I

811
00:43:53,440 --> 00:43:55,959
Speaker 2: doing what I'm supposed to do? And if I do

812
00:43:55,960 --> 00:43:58,200
Speaker 2: do that, does that mean that's been my last day?

813
00:43:58,760 --> 00:44:00,600
Speaker 2: I really I think of that all the time. But

814
00:44:01,960 --> 00:44:04,239
Speaker 2: it was very you know, especially in the beginning, it

815
00:44:04,280 --> 00:44:08,040
Speaker 2: was very, very hard to be a survivor. And you know,

816
00:44:08,120 --> 00:44:11,600
Speaker 2: as you know, we were forgotten.

817
00:44:12,080 --> 00:44:13,960
Speaker 1: You always would say that, Yeah, I.

818
00:44:13,880 --> 00:44:19,120
Speaker 2: Mean, because I think it's hard. It's hard living through it.

819
00:44:19,200 --> 00:44:21,160
Speaker 2: But the one good thing is we had each other,

820
00:44:21,400 --> 00:44:23,360
Speaker 2: so we got each other through.

821
00:44:23,320 --> 00:44:28,479
Speaker 1: When I mean afterwards, we went to memorials every year,

822
00:44:28,719 --> 00:44:32,319
Speaker 1: all the time, we actually spoke to We spent a lot.

823
00:44:32,360 --> 00:44:35,799
Speaker 1: You've developed very close relationships with people's families, but even

824
00:44:35,880 --> 00:44:38,080
Speaker 1: my brother and I spent a lot of time with

825
00:44:38,239 --> 00:44:42,680
Speaker 1: people's families. How do you keep those people's memories going?

826
00:44:44,400 --> 00:44:48,640
Speaker 2: Well, I guess it's so on nine to eleven every year,

827
00:44:49,000 --> 00:44:51,960
Speaker 2: I had the one group of people that a guy

828
00:44:52,000 --> 00:44:55,839
Speaker 2: that hired me and my original team that I worked with.

829
00:44:56,440 --> 00:44:59,759
Speaker 2: We still get together to this day on nine eleven

830
00:45:00,040 --> 00:45:04,840
Speaker 2: and we tell the same stories about things that happened

831
00:45:04,840 --> 00:45:08,839
Speaker 2: for the people that passed, and we have their you know,

832
00:45:09,000 --> 00:45:13,400
Speaker 2: we drink a maroon for and we toasted that for

833
00:45:13,560 --> 00:45:19,280
Speaker 2: one person that we lost and initially sorry going back,

834
00:45:19,520 --> 00:45:24,080
Speaker 2: is that we used to do for like who used

835
00:45:24,120 --> 00:45:28,799
Speaker 2: to on people that pass birthdays besides the anniversary up

836
00:45:28,800 --> 00:45:32,040
Speaker 2: there of nine to eleven, but on the individual's birthdays

837
00:45:32,080 --> 00:45:34,040
Speaker 2: we would have their fate like this is during the

838
00:45:34,080 --> 00:45:37,000
Speaker 2: middle of the day, we would have their favorite snacks.

839
00:45:37,120 --> 00:45:39,759
Speaker 2: So like one gentleman, I'll never forget this, he used

840
00:45:39,760 --> 00:45:42,160
Speaker 2: to have every morning a can of coke and a

841
00:45:42,200 --> 00:45:46,760
Speaker 2: Krispy Kreme donut every morning, so of course every morning

842
00:45:46,920 --> 00:45:49,479
Speaker 2: his birthday we would do We did that. The first

843
00:45:49,560 --> 00:45:51,160
Speaker 2: year we did it, we did it at a thirty

844
00:45:51,920 --> 00:45:54,560
Speaker 2: and we all crashed by two. So the next year

845
00:45:54,560 --> 00:45:57,279
Speaker 2: we did it at noon, and again it didn't really

846
00:45:57,280 --> 00:45:59,400
Speaker 2: work that great, and so then we started doing it

847
00:45:59,440 --> 00:46:02,320
Speaker 2: like a four o'cl and we don't know how you

848
00:46:02,440 --> 00:46:04,160
Speaker 2: used to eat that every day, but we did that,

849
00:46:04,239 --> 00:46:08,120
Speaker 2: you know. And then other people had their little things

850
00:46:08,200 --> 00:46:12,120
Speaker 2: and we would do special things on their birthdays. Marsh

851
00:46:12,200 --> 00:46:16,319
Speaker 2: has amazing memorial wall that I still visit. Any time

852
00:46:16,320 --> 00:46:17,920
Speaker 2: I was in the building. I always go out there

853
00:46:17,960 --> 00:46:20,759
Speaker 2: and it's very respectful because you're not allowed to go

854
00:46:20,880 --> 00:46:22,080
Speaker 2: on the platform.

855
00:46:22,920 --> 00:46:24,799
Speaker 3: It's a long platform. They're not allowed to go on

856
00:46:24,800 --> 00:46:26,880
Speaker 3: the platform. You're not allowed to use eat lunch on

857
00:46:26,920 --> 00:46:27,960
Speaker 3: there because there's a bench.

858
00:46:28,080 --> 00:46:29,680
Speaker 2: You're not allowed to use your cell phone on there,

859
00:46:29,719 --> 00:46:32,279
Speaker 2: and there's a guard standing watching it to this day.

860
00:46:33,160 --> 00:46:35,960
Speaker 2: And not only do they list the names, but they

861
00:46:36,200 --> 00:46:39,520
Speaker 2: put this, They have an overlay of smoked glass with

862
00:46:39,600 --> 00:46:43,439
Speaker 2: their signatures to show each person was unique. It's not

863
00:46:43,600 --> 00:46:45,840
Speaker 2: just a person's name that died on nine to eleven,

864
00:46:46,160 --> 00:46:49,360
Speaker 2: but it shows a little individuality for each person and

865
00:46:49,400 --> 00:46:50,840
Speaker 2: that they were unique.

866
00:46:51,520 --> 00:46:56,040
Speaker 1: How do you past through something that was both deeply

867
00:46:56,200 --> 00:47:01,080
Speaker 1: personal but a historical A historical I mean, can you

868
00:47:01,120 --> 00:47:04,359
Speaker 1: look at it? We're twenty four years away from it.

869
00:47:04,400 --> 00:47:07,000
Speaker 1: For a lot of people, it is just like it

870
00:47:07,040 --> 00:47:10,319
Speaker 1: would be like you reading about Pearl Harbor, me reading

871
00:47:10,360 --> 00:47:14,680
Speaker 1: about the Kennedy assassination. It doesn't you know what I mean?

872
00:47:15,360 --> 00:47:17,640
Speaker 1: Are you able to look at it at all as

873
00:47:17,680 --> 00:47:19,719
Speaker 1: a historical event that we just lived through.

874
00:47:22,120 --> 00:47:24,759
Speaker 2: I think I take it more personal. I don't. I mean,

875
00:47:25,200 --> 00:47:28,560
Speaker 2: I do think about the landmark dates like next year's

876
00:47:28,560 --> 00:47:31,719
Speaker 2: twenty five years unbelievably, but I really don't look at

877
00:47:31,719 --> 00:47:35,120
Speaker 2: it as a as a national event. Except for the

878
00:47:35,160 --> 00:47:41,200
Speaker 2: fact that it bothered me when the country forgot and

879
00:47:41,520 --> 00:47:45,319
Speaker 2: even as far as the memorial service that's done and

880
00:47:45,400 --> 00:47:51,040
Speaker 2: recorded on the broadcast on the major networks on Thursday,

881
00:47:51,200 --> 00:47:53,239
Speaker 2: the rest of the country doesn't. And I think it

882
00:47:53,280 --> 00:47:57,600
Speaker 2: was maybe year three. I was watching the names of

883
00:47:57,680 --> 00:47:59,440
Speaker 2: the friend of mine in my house and we got

884
00:47:59,480 --> 00:48:02,520
Speaker 2: a phone call from his sister in Florida and said,

885
00:48:02,719 --> 00:48:05,640
Speaker 2: they're not reading the names here. And it was early

886
00:48:05,760 --> 00:48:07,919
Speaker 2: so I was waiting for it to get a little

887
00:48:07,920 --> 00:48:10,200
Speaker 2: bit later. I called my friend in California. I'm like,

888
00:48:10,280 --> 00:48:13,680
Speaker 2: moh is are the names being read? And she said no,

889
00:48:14,120 --> 00:48:16,200
Speaker 2: And that was like year three. I mean, it was

890
00:48:16,200 --> 00:48:19,320
Speaker 2: so early on, and it bothered me that the world

891
00:48:19,400 --> 00:48:22,359
Speaker 2: has forgotten because it was so tragic and it was.

892
00:48:22,320 --> 00:48:23,880
Speaker 3: On our land.

893
00:48:24,280 --> 00:48:27,600
Speaker 2: But again, like you said, Harbor, I don't connect with that,

894
00:48:27,640 --> 00:48:30,120
Speaker 2: but this is very close to him, so I do connect.

895
00:48:29,840 --> 00:48:32,120
Speaker 1: With men bothers to me, did you ever seek therapy

896
00:48:32,160 --> 00:48:33,640
Speaker 1: for PTSD or anything?

897
00:48:34,000 --> 00:48:39,160
Speaker 2: The company made us go to see somebody, So I

898
00:48:39,200 --> 00:48:42,839
Speaker 2: did do the one session that we were required to do,

899
00:48:43,320 --> 00:48:44,879
Speaker 2: but I never did any more than that.

900
00:48:45,040 --> 00:48:47,000
Speaker 3: Should I have possibly, but I did.

901
00:48:47,640 --> 00:48:51,480
Speaker 1: Yeah, you know now that it is so far out.

902
00:48:51,800 --> 00:48:54,720
Speaker 1: The people that I knew who were my age's parents

903
00:48:54,800 --> 00:48:59,640
Speaker 1: didn't come home. You know, all the names. The life

904
00:48:59,680 --> 00:49:02,800
Speaker 1: of that that I see that their parents have missed

905
00:49:03,680 --> 00:49:09,320
Speaker 1: is what I more or less get guilty about sometime,

906
00:49:09,600 --> 00:49:13,319
Speaker 1: as the fact that they just they were like you

907
00:49:13,520 --> 00:49:15,399
Speaker 1: in the sense that they were going to do their

908
00:49:17,640 --> 00:49:19,319
Speaker 1: They were like you, like they were going to do

909
00:49:19,400 --> 00:49:23,520
Speaker 1: their job any other day. They were not. It was

910
00:49:23,560 --> 00:49:27,520
Speaker 1: supposed to be just a beautiful Tuesday. So I feel

911
00:49:27,719 --> 00:49:32,120
Speaker 1: enormously grateful and lucky. But I think that in that

912
00:49:32,920 --> 00:49:36,480
Speaker 1: gratefulness is a lot of sadness when you look at

913
00:49:36,520 --> 00:49:38,960
Speaker 1: other people and you're like, wow, they didn't have that.

914
00:49:39,280 --> 00:49:41,440
Speaker 1: Twenty four years is a long time to have some

915
00:49:41,520 --> 00:49:44,680
Speaker 1: money extra in your life. So I think about that

916
00:49:45,000 --> 00:49:49,239
Speaker 1: quite a bit now, especially it didn't impact me when

917
00:49:49,280 --> 00:49:53,800
Speaker 1: it first happened because it seemed too big, you know

918
00:49:53,840 --> 00:49:56,480
Speaker 1: what I mean. It seemed too big to especially when

919
00:49:56,480 --> 00:49:59,160
Speaker 1: I was fourteen years old. It was too big to understand.

920
00:50:00,239 --> 00:50:02,040
Speaker 1: Now it's not too big for me to understand my

921
00:50:02,080 --> 00:50:06,520
Speaker 1: brain and comprehend. But it's also seeing somebody saying, oh,

922
00:50:06,520 --> 00:50:08,759
Speaker 1: they have they got married their mom walking down the

923
00:50:08,800 --> 00:50:12,680
Speaker 1: aisle because their dad passed away they had a baby.

924
00:50:12,800 --> 00:50:17,480
Speaker 1: There's no grandfather or grandmother. It's mostly grandfathers, mostly men

925
00:50:17,480 --> 00:50:20,560
Speaker 1: that I knew who passed away, like most of tho dads. Yeah,

926
00:50:20,719 --> 00:50:25,120
Speaker 1: but in my case anyway, but like it's their grandfather's

927
00:50:25,160 --> 00:50:30,840
Speaker 1: not there for that that is That's really That's where, honestly,

928
00:50:30,960 --> 00:50:34,520
Speaker 1: it becomes more real every year in a certain way,

929
00:50:34,800 --> 00:50:38,600
Speaker 1: is when we have certain life events and knowing that

930
00:50:38,680 --> 00:50:42,520
Speaker 1: I have both my parents, and I have for two decades,

931
00:50:42,560 --> 00:50:46,120
Speaker 1: and I could have if things were just minusculely different,

932
00:50:46,960 --> 00:50:50,920
Speaker 1: had zero parents. I mean, just dad was assigned to

933
00:50:50,920 --> 00:50:53,920
Speaker 1: a different place that day and you were ten minutes

934
00:50:54,000 --> 00:50:58,360
Speaker 1: late or ten minutes early, radically a radically different life.

935
00:50:58,400 --> 00:51:02,080
Speaker 1: And that's what I think about more as time goes on.

936
00:51:02,880 --> 00:51:05,400
Speaker 1: So I'm sorry for being an utter pain in your

937
00:51:05,400 --> 00:51:10,200
Speaker 1: assert for my teenage part of that. Twenty four years now,

938
00:51:10,480 --> 00:51:13,919
Speaker 1: I think that so so I'm grateful for it. I'm

939
00:51:14,000 --> 00:51:19,960
Speaker 1: sorry such a pain from seventeen to twenty sixteen to

940
00:51:20,080 --> 00:51:21,840
Speaker 1: twenty depending on the moment.

941
00:51:22,480 --> 00:51:24,919
Speaker 2: And you know, I've seen a lot of the kids,

942
00:51:25,360 --> 00:51:26,919
Speaker 2: and I've kept like you said, I've kept in touch

943
00:51:26,960 --> 00:51:31,080
Speaker 2: with many families and some of the parents, you know,

944
00:51:31,480 --> 00:51:35,799
Speaker 2: the surviving parent and families have been amazing, and I

945
00:51:35,840 --> 00:51:39,400
Speaker 2: think those are the kids that are able to cope

946
00:51:39,400 --> 00:51:41,560
Speaker 2: with it better because they have a good support system

947
00:51:41,680 --> 00:51:45,359
Speaker 2: and having and being there for your child to overcome this,

948
00:51:45,440 --> 00:51:48,160
Speaker 2: even through your own grief, because a lot of you know,

949
00:51:48,840 --> 00:51:51,160
Speaker 2: I'll say, women that I know, you know, had to

950
00:51:52,320 --> 00:51:54,920
Speaker 2: deal with their own suffering as well as be there.

951
00:51:55,239 --> 00:51:59,520
Speaker 2: I mean one one good friend of mine, his wife,

952
00:51:59,719 --> 00:52:01,920
Speaker 2: she'd come to all of our because she was friends

953
00:52:01,920 --> 00:52:04,919
Speaker 2: with everyone. She's amazing, like she would remember you your name,

954
00:52:05,360 --> 00:52:08,440
Speaker 2: every geting about you that that her husband told her,

955
00:52:08,480 --> 00:52:10,840
Speaker 2: like I had never met her before, and her husband

956
00:52:10,920 --> 00:52:12,279
Speaker 2: told her things like oh how is your day and

957
00:52:12,320 --> 00:52:14,920
Speaker 2: blah blah blah. He would tell stories and she remembered

958
00:52:14,920 --> 00:52:17,200
Speaker 2: it all, and she would come to all of the

959
00:52:17,280 --> 00:52:19,200
Speaker 2: services because we spent as.

960
00:52:19,080 --> 00:52:20,520
Speaker 3: You know, months.

961
00:52:21,680 --> 00:52:24,759
Speaker 2: I mean there are times I went to four funerals

962
00:52:24,840 --> 00:52:28,960
Speaker 2: or services, memory of life, celebration of life, whatever the

963
00:52:29,000 --> 00:52:32,400
Speaker 2: family deemed it to be a week. I mean I

964
00:52:32,440 --> 00:52:34,759
Speaker 2: went to so many of them, but sometimes multiple in

965
00:52:34,840 --> 00:52:37,440
Speaker 2: a day, and she was in many of them, and

966
00:52:37,480 --> 00:52:39,279
Speaker 2: she'd be like, but how are you guys doing?

967
00:52:39,800 --> 00:52:40,960
Speaker 3: You know, I'm suffering.

968
00:52:41,000 --> 00:52:45,680
Speaker 2: One you're suffering hundreds and I always amazed me because

969
00:52:45,680 --> 00:52:48,359
Speaker 2: she was so beyond herself and she is such the

970
00:52:48,400 --> 00:52:52,040
Speaker 2: best example of what a mother should be in that

971
00:52:52,200 --> 00:52:54,520
Speaker 2: situation and fill in the gap of mother and father.

972
00:52:54,640 --> 00:52:55,960
Speaker 3: She is, She is amazing.

973
00:52:56,120 --> 00:52:59,239
Speaker 1: How was I never asked this question? How is? How

974
00:52:59,239 --> 00:53:02,399
Speaker 1: did Grahama Grandpa? How did they try to be there

975
00:53:02,480 --> 00:53:02,719
Speaker 1: for you?

976
00:53:04,800 --> 00:53:07,480
Speaker 2: I mean they didn't know how to handle that, yeah,

977
00:53:07,600 --> 00:53:08,239
Speaker 2: I mean.

978
00:53:10,200 --> 00:53:12,360
Speaker 1: They were from a different time too, Yeah.

979
00:53:12,400 --> 00:53:15,279
Speaker 2: And the thing is is that they didn't know how

980
00:53:15,280 --> 00:53:18,680
Speaker 2: to comprehend. It's actually I was told at some point,

981
00:53:18,719 --> 00:53:23,520
Speaker 2: aren't you over it yet? And they so they didn't comprehend.

982
00:53:23,560 --> 00:53:26,000
Speaker 2: They didn't understand. And you know what if you didn't

983
00:53:26,040 --> 00:53:28,719
Speaker 2: live through it, that or any other I mean, there

984
00:53:28,719 --> 00:53:32,239
Speaker 2: are some people, luckily enough, have never had loss of

985
00:53:32,360 --> 00:53:37,200
Speaker 2: anyone that wasn't didn't live fully live their life right,

986
00:53:37,840 --> 00:53:40,640
Speaker 2: meaning that they died under the age of seventy or eighty.

987
00:53:40,800 --> 00:53:43,040
Speaker 2: There's a lot of people that ever experienced that. They

988
00:53:43,080 --> 00:53:46,200
Speaker 2: only have death involved in their life when it's you know,

989
00:53:47,000 --> 00:53:49,360
Speaker 2: natural not not natural clauses.

990
00:53:49,400 --> 00:53:52,200
Speaker 1: But you know what I mean, years of sufferings a.

991
00:53:52,320 --> 00:53:55,080
Speaker 2: Year after being eighty years old and saying that person

992
00:53:55,120 --> 00:53:57,440
Speaker 2: had a good life there. No one in our family

993
00:53:57,480 --> 00:54:01,120
Speaker 2: really had or very few people had a loss of

994
00:54:01,160 --> 00:54:04,520
Speaker 2: someone that was eight or someone that was a young,

995
00:54:04,920 --> 00:54:06,200
Speaker 2: newly married spouse.

996
00:54:06,880 --> 00:54:08,200
Speaker 3: So they didn't know how to deal with it.

997
00:54:08,280 --> 00:54:08,720
Speaker 2: So I didn't.

998
00:54:08,760 --> 00:54:11,319
Speaker 3: I didn't hold them hold that.

999
00:54:11,360 --> 00:54:13,480
Speaker 2: Against them or get mad at them for that not

1000
00:54:13,560 --> 00:54:15,279
Speaker 2: being there for me, because they didn't know how.

1001
00:54:15,400 --> 00:54:18,520
Speaker 3: I didn't know how, you know, because.

1002
00:54:18,320 --> 00:54:21,800
Speaker 1: It's dozens of people that just extinguished there there.

1003
00:54:23,120 --> 00:54:25,040
Speaker 2: They didn't know, they didn't know how to get to

1004
00:54:25,120 --> 00:54:29,680
Speaker 2: deal with that. But one thing again, going back to

1005
00:54:29,760 --> 00:54:34,239
Speaker 2: talking about families in Marsh, they MMC, I should say

1006
00:54:34,719 --> 00:54:40,960
Speaker 2: they were amazing for the families. They had hotels set up.

1007
00:54:41,000 --> 00:54:43,439
Speaker 2: People came in and we would we would work the room.

1008
00:54:43,640 --> 00:54:45,560
Speaker 2: I'd sit at a desk and they would come. Families

1009
00:54:45,560 --> 00:54:47,759
Speaker 2: would come up to me. They just wanted to know

1010
00:54:47,840 --> 00:54:51,239
Speaker 2: where their their family sat, like where were they in

1011
00:54:51,280 --> 00:54:53,000
Speaker 2: the building. Not that they were in their desk at

1012
00:54:53,000 --> 00:54:55,520
Speaker 2: that moment, but they wanted to know where they sat.

1013
00:54:55,680 --> 00:54:59,840
Speaker 2: And I drew floor parents on the spot, like you know,

1014
00:55:00,080 --> 00:55:03,120
Speaker 2: for every single person saying okay, so your your son

1015
00:55:03,320 --> 00:55:05,759
Speaker 2: sat here or your daughter sat here. I know the

1016
00:55:05,760 --> 00:55:08,919
Speaker 2: people that I lost for my team because I had

1017
00:55:09,040 --> 00:55:10,200
Speaker 2: I had a team at the time. I had a

1018
00:55:10,239 --> 00:55:13,040
Speaker 2: team of eight people and I lost three, and two

1019
00:55:13,080 --> 00:55:16,160
Speaker 2: of them were on one side of the elevator, the

1020
00:55:16,160 --> 00:55:19,400
Speaker 2: opposite side of the elevate beta bank of impact. But

1021
00:55:19,480 --> 00:55:22,080
Speaker 2: we did sit in the center of the floor. So

1022
00:55:22,160 --> 00:55:24,720
Speaker 2: the way our plane got hit, from what I seen

1023
00:55:24,800 --> 00:55:30,840
Speaker 2: and visualized, is that the plane went right through the building.

1024
00:55:30,880 --> 00:55:33,520
Speaker 2: And they did hear or see a thing like like

1025
00:55:33,560 --> 00:55:35,680
Speaker 2: there was no one of them would have seen it

1026
00:55:35,760 --> 00:55:38,200
Speaker 2: like for a second because she faced the window that

1027
00:55:38,239 --> 00:55:38,680
Speaker 2: got hit.

1028
00:55:39,040 --> 00:55:40,680
Speaker 3: But if she was at her desk, but I don't

1029
00:55:40,719 --> 00:55:41,480
Speaker 3: even think she was.

1030
00:55:42,480 --> 00:55:45,440
Speaker 2: And so you know, but I have millions of stories

1031
00:55:45,440 --> 00:55:49,000
Speaker 2: about millions of people. You asked before about leaving the country.

1032
00:55:49,080 --> 00:55:53,120
Speaker 2: One of the gentlemen that survived, he's a gentleman. Well

1033
00:55:53,160 --> 00:55:55,279
Speaker 2: he was leaving the country. You went to Canada. But

1034
00:55:55,520 --> 00:55:57,359
Speaker 2: he he would be in the opficet eight o'clock every

1035
00:55:57,360 --> 00:56:01,440
Speaker 2: morning because I had shifts. I manage a team back then,

1036
00:56:01,560 --> 00:56:04,080
Speaker 2: and there were shifts, so he was supposed to be there.

1037
00:56:04,080 --> 00:56:06,800
Speaker 2: And he said one that he fell sleep and he

1038
00:56:06,840 --> 00:56:08,239
Speaker 2: didn't get up in time. He told me he was

1039
00:56:08,280 --> 00:56:11,440
Speaker 2: going to be late. He could not handle it. Because

1040
00:56:11,520 --> 00:56:18,239
Speaker 2: his work wife, this woman, she passed and they worked

1041
00:56:18,280 --> 00:56:20,840
Speaker 2: side by side together for the whole time he was

1042
00:56:20,920 --> 00:56:23,520
Speaker 2: employed with me, and he could not handle the loss

1043
00:56:23,520 --> 00:56:27,080
Speaker 2: of her and he ended up taking his son. He

1044
00:56:27,120 --> 00:56:31,960
Speaker 2: had a new young son, moved to Canada. But it's

1045
00:56:31,960 --> 00:56:34,920
Speaker 2: hard when you think about the families. Like the other

1046
00:56:34,960 --> 00:56:39,719
Speaker 2: woman who worked for me, her father planned vacation, and

1047
00:56:41,280 --> 00:56:43,839
Speaker 2: she originally planned it that they were going to leave

1048
00:56:44,000 --> 00:56:47,960
Speaker 2: on whatever day and be back on the twelfth. And

1049
00:56:48,000 --> 00:56:50,760
Speaker 2: she came to me two weeks before the vacation said,

1050
00:56:50,960 --> 00:56:52,960
Speaker 2: my dad changed the dates. Is it okay if I

1051
00:56:53,320 --> 00:56:56,080
Speaker 2: take off a date earlier and come back on the eleventh?

1052
00:56:56,120 --> 00:56:59,800
Speaker 2: Then I said absolutely fine, I pasually wish I said no,

1053
00:57:00,120 --> 00:57:03,440
Speaker 2: because she had an eleven year old son and she passed,

1054
00:57:03,800 --> 00:57:06,160
Speaker 2: and if the original vacation funds would have stayed in place,

1055
00:57:06,160 --> 00:57:06,879
Speaker 2: she would have been alive.

1056
00:57:07,719 --> 00:57:13,360
Speaker 1: So yeah, uncle, who was a window washer at the

1057
00:57:13,360 --> 00:57:17,680
Speaker 1: Worlchair Center, had a colleague who actually believe it or not.

1058
00:57:17,800 --> 00:57:20,600
Speaker 1: He told me because that man, the man who passed away,

1059
00:57:20,640 --> 00:57:25,080
Speaker 1: who was the window washer that our uncle knew, is

1060
00:57:25,120 --> 00:57:29,320
Speaker 1: not on the nine to eleven memorial. And my uncle,

1061
00:57:29,640 --> 00:57:33,280
Speaker 1: our uncle believes that he was illegally in the country,

1062
00:57:33,480 --> 00:57:35,840
Speaker 1: and no one even knew. No one had a record

1063
00:57:35,880 --> 00:57:38,680
Speaker 1: of him a young kid. He was an older person.

1064
00:57:39,400 --> 00:57:41,760
Speaker 3: Somebody else, another window washer passed to another.

1065
00:57:41,600 --> 00:57:43,640
Speaker 1: Win was pass through the Polish name. But there was

1066
00:57:43,680 --> 00:57:47,040
Speaker 1: another man who was not I who was not listed,

1067
00:57:47,240 --> 00:57:51,000
Speaker 1: and our uncle believes that he was illegally in the

1068
00:57:51,040 --> 00:57:54,280
Speaker 1: country and that's why his name is never a listed anywhere.

1069
00:57:55,280 --> 00:57:59,120
Speaker 1: I talked about that anyway, Thank you for coming on

1070
00:57:59,240 --> 00:58:02,920
Speaker 1: and talking about this, mom. I appreciate it, and I

1071
00:58:03,040 --> 00:58:04,800
Speaker 1: normally say working we will go to read your stuff,

1072
00:58:04,840 --> 00:58:08,120
Speaker 1: but nowhere, So thank you. Thank you for just coming

1073
00:58:08,160 --> 00:58:09,840
Speaker 1: on and doing this for me, because I think it

1074
00:58:09,920 --> 00:58:14,000
Speaker 1: is important to have a perspective from someone who was there.

1075
00:58:14,320 --> 00:58:19,439
Speaker 2: Yeah, and for any tragedy that happens, hopefully no more

1076
00:58:19,520 --> 00:58:24,880
Speaker 2: ever happened, but always remember the survivors, like the poor

1077
00:58:25,360 --> 00:58:32,000
Speaker 2: children in the recent shooting Minnesota. Is everyone prais for

1078
00:58:32,040 --> 00:58:35,920
Speaker 2: the families, which they deserve all of our prayers. But

1079
00:58:36,080 --> 00:58:39,040
Speaker 2: I feel for those children who was sitting next to

1080
00:58:39,240 --> 00:58:42,560
Speaker 2: someone that got shot in past yeah, because they'll never

1081
00:58:42,640 --> 00:58:45,920
Speaker 2: be the same and they are more more upfront close

1082
00:58:45,960 --> 00:58:46,600
Speaker 2: to it than.

1083
00:58:46,480 --> 00:58:47,240
Speaker 3: I even was.

1084
00:58:47,280 --> 00:58:50,920
Speaker 2: But those are the people that we need to help

1085
00:58:51,040 --> 00:58:55,280
Speaker 2: to make sure that they, you know, get get get,

1086
00:58:55,560 --> 00:58:58,040
Speaker 2: get past it enough where it doesn't affect the rest

1087
00:58:58,040 --> 00:58:58,880
Speaker 2: of their lives.

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Speaker 1: That's all for this episode of A Numbers Game with

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Speaker 1: Ryan Grodski. If you like this podcast, please like and

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00:59:05,680 --> 00:59:09,920
Speaker 1: subscribe on the iHeartRadio app, Apple Podcasts, wherever gets your podcast.

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Speaker 1: We'll be back to politics on Monday. Why you guys

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00:59:12,920 --> 00:59:15,360
Speaker 1: come and listen to this. I hope you enjoyed this episode.

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Speaker 1: If you did, you could shoot me an email Ryan

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Speaker 1: at Numbers Game podcast dot com. It's Ryan at Numbers

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00:59:21,200 --> 00:59:25,040
Speaker 1: Plural gamepodcast dot com. Or send me a question about

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Speaker 1: anything else. I'll answer them on air for a little

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Speaker 1: backlog so I might do it. Ask me anything, episode

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Speaker 1: come up soon. But thank you again for listening. This

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Speaker 1: meant a lot to me to do so I really

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Speaker 1: appreciate everyone for being on this and listen to this

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Speaker 1: journey with me. Thank you assass