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Speaker 1: Hey, fam, Hello Sunshine. Today.

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Speaker 2: On the bright Side, you're gonna want to swipe right

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Speaker 2: on this conversation because we're joined by the founder and

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Speaker 2: executive chair of the wildly popular dating app Bumble.

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Speaker 1: She's also the founder of Tinder.

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Speaker 2: Whitney wolf Heard is here and she's talking about adapting

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Speaker 2: dating apps for the future, and she's giving you insider

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Speaker 2: tips on everything you need to know to create the

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Speaker 2: perfect dating profile. It's Thursday, January ninth. I'm Danielle Robe.

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Speaker 3: And I'm Simone Boyce and this is the bright Side

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Speaker 3: from Hello Sunshine.

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Speaker 2: For over ten years, our guest today has had her

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Speaker 2: finger on the pulse of online dating and honestly, she's

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Speaker 2: played stupid for many millennials. Whitney wolf Heard is the

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Speaker 2: founder of dating apps Tinder and Bumble. Now I've dabbled

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Speaker 2: in dating apps. You all know that, but it can

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Speaker 2: be kind of overwhelming.

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Speaker 3: Okay, tell me everything, because I've never really been on

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Speaker 3: dating apps. Like, I got married before the dating apps

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Speaker 3: came out. So what is it like on there?

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Speaker 1: It is the wild wild West, Simon.

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Speaker 2: Now listen, I know a lot of people have had

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Speaker 2: a lot of success on apps. I personally am such

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Speaker 2: an in person person that it's tough for me. It's

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Speaker 2: hard for me to like read energy via the phone.

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Speaker 2: I also am not a great texter, Like texting overwhelms me.

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Speaker 2: I just don't love being on my phone, and so

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Speaker 2: dating apps feel like an extension of more texting, more

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Speaker 2: pen pals, and I just I don't know, it's never

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Speaker 2: been my thing.

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Speaker 3: So how far have you gotten with the dating app? Like,

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Speaker 3: have you you've gone on dates?

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Speaker 1: I'm sure?

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Speaker 4: Yeah? Has anything more come of it?

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Speaker 1: Like how promising was it?

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Speaker 2: I met one of my ex boyfriends on a dating

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Speaker 2: app and we dated for two years. But we did

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Speaker 2: have mutual friends who also like outside of the app

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Speaker 2: put us together.

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Speaker 1: So I don't know, it's just kind of hard.

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Speaker 2: I think when you meet someone out of nowhere, I

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Speaker 2: don't know, maybe I have trust issues, But listen, I

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Speaker 2: think dating apps are an amazing technology if you can

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Speaker 2: use them right and they don't overwhelm you. And I'm

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Speaker 2: always curious about what makes a good profile and what

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Speaker 2: dating trends are out there and what the research says

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Speaker 2: about the people using these apps.

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Speaker 3: Well, our guest today can lend so much insight into

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Speaker 3: this conversation. Absolutely Whitney wolf Heard is literally the woman

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Speaker 3: who came up with the name for Tinder and Bumble's

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Speaker 3: signature concept the company that she founded after co founding Tinder,

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Speaker 3: and she's the one who came up with this philosophy

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Speaker 3: of allowing women to make the first move, which was huge.

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Speaker 2: Simone, it was revolutionary at the time. I know, in

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Speaker 2: twenty twenty five, we don't even think twice. But when

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Speaker 2: she came out with that idea of women making the

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Speaker 2: first move, I actually think it was so much deeper

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Speaker 2: culturally because women have been going after everything they want.

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Speaker 1: We go after the jobs we want, we go.

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Speaker 2: After everything, and for some reason, we were still taking

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Speaker 2: a backseat in romantic partnership. And I think that Bumble

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Speaker 2: was on the very cusp of women going after romantic partnership,

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Speaker 2: of saying hello first, of making the first move, And

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Speaker 2: to me, that is what I've always been just enamored by.

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Speaker 2: With Whitney, I think she's the master of understanding what

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Speaker 2: users want and where culture is going. Well.

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Speaker 3: It also shows just how vast this male default setting

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Speaker 3: is in our society, like the fact that all the

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Speaker 3: dating apps before Bumble, it was always the man making

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Speaker 3: the first move right, and how much does that reflect

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Speaker 3: what happens in our world every single day, Like the

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Speaker 3: default is always male, and it's always to accommodate men.

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Speaker 3: So it's just a reminder of like how much of

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Speaker 3: our world is oriented around men and their desires.

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Speaker 2: Well said, And I also think that part of it

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Speaker 2: was inspired by Whitney's own experience.

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Speaker 3: Oh yeah, I mean in twenty fourteen, this was before

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Speaker 3: the height of the Me too movement, Whitney left Tinder,

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Speaker 3: which was the company that she helped found, and she

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Speaker 3: sued the founders for sexual harassment, and at the time

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Speaker 3: she faced a lot of criticism in the public eye.

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Speaker 3: But I mean just a true lesson in resilience here.

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Speaker 3: She went on to found Bumble that same year.

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Speaker 2: Okay, I think we have to actually break that down

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Speaker 2: for a second, because that part was super deep. I

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Speaker 2: remember being in college when Tinder was founded, and it

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Speaker 2: was all over our college campus at Madison, Wisconsin. There

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Speaker 2: were kids who were like Tinder reps. They had Tinder

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Speaker 2: backpacks and Tinder water bottles and they were trying to

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Speaker 2: get everybody to sign up. My friend Chloe was one

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Speaker 2: of these reps, okay, and she was from La and

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Speaker 2: these founders were from la and when all of this

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Speaker 2: went down, because Whitney was dating one of the founders,

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Speaker 2: she happened to be dating one of them, and when

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Speaker 2: all of this went down, they besmirched her publicly. I

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Speaker 2: can't even imagine what she was going through privately, because

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Speaker 2: the public.

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Speaker 1: Ridicule was awful.

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Speaker 2: I remember thinking to myself, like, this is so brutal,

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Speaker 2: the names, the sexist, misogynistic names they were calling her,

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Speaker 2: and everyone thought that she would never work again, and

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Speaker 2: she was so young at the time. And then she

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Speaker 2: started Bumble and it became more successful than Tinder, and

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Speaker 2: so her story was so inspiring to me because the

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Speaker 2: misogyny ran so deep, and yet she proved everybody wrong

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Speaker 2: and everyone thought, ooh, maybe she was the brains of

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Speaker 2: the operation at Tinder more than everybody thought. I'm just

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Speaker 2: I'm really inspired by her resilience.

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Speaker 3: She is such an inspiring entrepreneur, and I'm really curious

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Speaker 3: to hear her thoughts on the dating landscape today because

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Speaker 3: I know that they've been working on some groundbreaking research

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Speaker 3: over at Bumble on the state of modern relationships and dating.

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Speaker 3: So let's go ahead and get into it. Whitney Wolford,

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Speaker 3: Welcome to the bright side.

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Speaker 1: Thanks for having me, Thanks for joining us.

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Speaker 3: Whitney, Bumble was really centered around this idea that women

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Speaker 3: would make the first move, which was so revolutionary at

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Speaker 3: the time.

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Speaker 1: Why was that important to you?

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Speaker 5: I really felt that we've all been raised with very

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Speaker 5: ingrained gender dynamics around connection and love, for women to

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Speaker 5: never go first in love, to always wait and to

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Speaker 5: be chased and to be pursued. And yet this conflicted

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Speaker 5: with what we were being told to do in the

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Speaker 5: rest of our lives. To your point, which was go

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Speaker 5: out there, make the life of your dreams, make the

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Speaker 5: first move in these other areas of your life, be successful.

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Speaker 4: Be independent.

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Speaker 5: But when it came to love, which is actually the

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Speaker 5: center of our lives, whether it's romantic love or platonic love,

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Speaker 5: we're meant to play this entirely different role. And I

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Speaker 5: really felt like it all started at hello, Like who

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Speaker 5: is given permission culturally to go first? That was really

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Speaker 5: where Bumble started, was really giving women an agency to

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Speaker 5: go first in their relationships and connections. And so for me,

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Speaker 5: when I reflect on my career, on my life with

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Speaker 5: my family, even on my health, like had I not

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Speaker 5: made those first moves, I wouldn't have the life I

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Speaker 5: have today, and so many of us are just told

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Speaker 5: to wait for things to fall into our laps, and

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Speaker 5: that's just not the way the universe works.

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Speaker 1: Whitney.

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Speaker 2: I've been following your story since you helped start Tinder

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Speaker 2: in twenty twelve, and I know you went through a

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Speaker 2: really difficult period after you left the company. You ended

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Speaker 2: up sue Tinder for sexual harassment and discrimination, and you

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Speaker 2: face a lot of very public scrutiny because of it,

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Speaker 2: like very public scrutiny, But the end of your story

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Speaker 2: at Tinder became the beginning of your story at Bumble,

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Speaker 2: and I'm curious what the catalyst moment was for you

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Speaker 2: that turned all that doubt and anger into such resilience,

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Speaker 2: and I think that we see that resilience as a

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Speaker 2: through line in your story today.

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Speaker 5: I would say that there was a very pivotal moment

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Speaker 5: and I remember it extremely clearly, even to this day.

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Speaker 5: So when I left Tinder, this is twenty fourteen, so

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Speaker 5: pre me too, This is pre times up. Yeah, this

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Speaker 5: is free, this open conversation around online abuse, and Whitney,

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Speaker 5: to your point, I don't want to interrupt you, but

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Speaker 5: I do think that part is so important because a

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Speaker 5: lot of women that came out against men pre me too,

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Speaker 5: were really seen as the problem, and so I think

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Speaker 5: that adds like a whole layer of resilience to your story.

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Speaker 5: It was extremely scary because I was sort of ostracized,

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Speaker 5: And when I say ostracized, I don't mean just by

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Speaker 5: the people involved, like even people I went to college with.

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Speaker 5: You know, they were judging me and assuming that I was,

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Speaker 5: you know, some vixen.

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Speaker 4: And I was in a complete state of depression. I was.

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Speaker 5: You have to remember I was twenty four years old,

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Speaker 5: which in hindsight is like a baby.

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Speaker 4: Right baby.

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Speaker 5: There was all sorts of terrible articles being written about me,

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Speaker 5: speculating about what my motives were and what my agenda was.

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Speaker 4: The Internet was calling me terrible names.

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Speaker 5: I was getting death threats, and I couldn't turn it off,

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Speaker 5: like I was addicted to refreshing the like the dms

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Speaker 5: and the tweets. I had literally what they describe as

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Speaker 5: an epiphany, like I don't even think it was me.

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Speaker 4: It was like something.

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Speaker 5: Came through me and it all just in a matter

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Speaker 5: of moments made sense. I was like, oh my god,

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Speaker 5: if this is what's happening to me at twenty four.

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Speaker 5: This is happening at scale, and not just women, everyone.

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Speaker 4: This is so dangerous if.

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Speaker 5: I'm feeling the feelings I'm feeling, and I'm in a

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Speaker 5: safe home and I have at the time a loving boyfriend,

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Speaker 5: and I have family that cares about me. Like, what

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Speaker 5: is the thirteen year old going through who cannot escape

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Speaker 5: bullying once she'd leave school? And I had this moment

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Speaker 5: where I said, oh my god, when I was getting

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Speaker 5: bullied in elementary school, my mom would pick me up,

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Speaker 5: we'd get an ice cream cone, and I was safe

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Speaker 5: until the next day. Right, But this was like a

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Speaker 5: permanent playground of hell for everyone. And so I just

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Speaker 5: had this moment where I was like, I'm going to

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Speaker 5: solve this. I'm going to start the world's first positive

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Speaker 5: social network.

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Speaker 4: I called it mayor Cy.

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Speaker 5: I designed this entire currency of compliments, and I figured,

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Speaker 5: if we could get away from shaming one another to

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Speaker 5: celebrating one another and supporting one another, perhaps we could

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Speaker 5: use like digital behavior for good. And that was really

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Speaker 5: like the very early early moment of what would then

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Speaker 5: lead to the next step, to the next step, to

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Speaker 5: the next step that would eventually become bumble.

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Speaker 3: I'm curious how you pulled yourself out of that state

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Speaker 3: of mind where you were dealing with just the relentless

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Speaker 3: onslot of negativity and toxicity. How did you get from

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Speaker 3: that state of despair into that energizing place of I

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Speaker 3: have an idea.

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Speaker 4: Well, when you're on the bottom, there's nowhere else to

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Speaker 4: go but up.

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Speaker 5: And I had hit the bottom, and I actually think

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Speaker 5: there's a gift in hitting the bottom. At this point,

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Speaker 5: my dignity had been stripped from me. What else did

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Speaker 5: I have to lose? Like my greatest fear how to

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Speaker 5: already come true? You know how they say people have

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Speaker 5: these like nightmares when they're young, about like being naked

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Speaker 5: in the hallways in high school. I was that, but

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Speaker 5: on the global stage. So it's like, what else did

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Speaker 5: I have to lose? And I just thought about these

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Speaker 5: thirteen year old girls around the world, and I was like,

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Speaker 5: I'm going to do this for them if I have

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Speaker 5: the talent and the skills and the experience in the

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Speaker 5: tech industry. I felt like it was my duty to

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Speaker 5: serve in a way that could prevent another woman from

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Speaker 5: feeling what I had felt. So I just took myself

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Speaker 5: out of it and was like, this is for the collective,

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Speaker 5: this is no longer about me.

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Speaker 3: We've got to take a quick break out, but we'll

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Speaker 3: be right back with Whitney. Wolf Heard, And we're back

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Speaker 3: with Whitney. Wel heard, Whitney.

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Speaker 2: I think one of the things that I feel taken

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Speaker 2: with in how you've built your company is how you've

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Speaker 2: stayed so true to who you are as a founder

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Speaker 2: throughout these last ten years, and the company stands for

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Speaker 2: so much more than just just love, which are important

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Speaker 2: on its own. I'll never forget the New York Times

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Speaker 2: ad that Bumble took out. It was a full page

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Speaker 2: ad in support of victims of sexual assault. I'm curious how,

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Speaker 2: in these ten years, when the company has gotten so big,

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Speaker 2: how you've managed to scale kindness and scale agency and

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Speaker 2: scale all of these ideals with it.

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Speaker 5: Well, I really appreciate that, and I'll be honest, we

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Speaker 5: are certainly not perfect. But I'll use I guess a

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Speaker 5: metaphor and or analogy however you want to look at

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Speaker 5: this directionally, our compass has always been pointed in the

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Speaker 5: direction of kindness, compassion, inspiration, trying to stand up for

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Speaker 5: the underdog, and that's where the.

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Speaker 4: Direction has always been pointed.

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Speaker 5: You don't have to control everything that happens every single day,

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Speaker 5: but you have to remember where you're going and why.

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Speaker 4: You're doing it.

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Speaker 5: I think intention is the most important thing in the world.

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Speaker 5: And if you set the intention and you try to

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Speaker 5: remain rooted in that intention, no matter how rough or

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Speaker 5: rocky things get, like you kind of always come back

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Speaker 5: to center. That's how you survive, and that's how you

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Speaker 5: keep the DNA alive. And also the faith because being

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Speaker 5: part of a rep like with no faith and no hope,

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Speaker 5: you've got nothing because you're actually writing on it ninety

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Speaker 5: percent of the time.

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Speaker 4: That's literally what it's all about.

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Speaker 3: Can you give us an example of when hope got

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Speaker 3: you through? Is there a story that comes to mind?

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Speaker 4: Every day? Literally every single day.

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Speaker 5: Being an entrepreneur is like this funny blend of like

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Speaker 5: belief and like kind of closing your eyes and jumping

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Speaker 5: and just like hoping for the best because you have

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Speaker 5: to have this psychotic belief in what you're doing. I

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Speaker 5: have just had this unbelievable obsessive belief, like true belief,

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Speaker 5: not fake belief, like genuine belief, like a knowing in

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Speaker 5: my soul that Bumble is going to outlive me. This mission,

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Speaker 5: this purpose, this company is so much bigger than me.

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Speaker 5: And I don't even know why I feel that way,

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Speaker 5: just feel it, and I think you have to be

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Speaker 5: borderline crazy in your belief.

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Speaker 3: Well, Whitney, we have been digging into the research that

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Speaker 3: you're conducting over at Bumble, all about dating and relationships

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Speaker 3: in the modern age, and we wanted to ask you

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Speaker 3: about some of the studies we came across, starting with

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Speaker 3: a survey that found that a third of women said

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Speaker 3: emotional intimacy was more important than sex. That's so fascinating.

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Speaker 3: What do you make of that?

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Speaker 5: As we have become so connected online, we have actually

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Speaker 5: become very disconnected from both ourselves and others. And it's

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Speaker 5: this fascinating conundrum because we are arguably the most connected

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Speaker 5: we've ever been, whether that means being able to get

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Speaker 5: your groceries or talk to people across the world or

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Speaker 5: be in one hundred group chats at once, but we're

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Speaker 5: actually the most disconnected we've ever been. And I think

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Speaker 5: as humans, we are craving emotional nourishment, like real nourishment,

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Speaker 5: not just empty calories. And so this comes back to

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Speaker 5: this quest and desire for real emotional intimacy. But I

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Speaker 5: don't think you can get emotional intimacy from another person

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Speaker 5: until you understand what your actual needs are, like what

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Speaker 5: do you need to be emotionally intimate?

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Speaker 4: Who are you? What are you missing? Where are you fulfilled?

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Speaker 5: And this is what's been missing from dating on the

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Speaker 5: internet for so long. It's like we've all been saying

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Speaker 5: like me, like me back, We've all forgotten to say,

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Speaker 5: like who am I and what do I actually need?

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Speaker 5: So I think that's the next decade of this entire equation.

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Speaker 1: I'm so excited to hear you say that.

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Speaker 2: My entire ethos as an interviewer is that we are

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Speaker 2: in this high communication, low connection world in twenty twenty four,

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Speaker 2: and I think we're seeing that trend so much with

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Speaker 2: gen Z. Forbes Health survey said that seventy nine percent

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Speaker 2: of gen Z feels fatigued by dating apps. And You've

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Speaker 2: always been on the forefront of technology and trends. I'm

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Speaker 2: so curious how bumble is adapting to this burnout of

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Speaker 2: dating apps.

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Speaker 5: So I think, you know, in order to really be

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Speaker 5: the leader in love and dating for gen Z in

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Speaker 5: this next generation, there is going to have to be

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Speaker 5: this like complete both evolution and kind of revolution of

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Speaker 5: self love and self discovered. I think we're moving out

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Speaker 5: of an era of judgment and low self esteem online,

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Speaker 5: which when you think about what we did with this wife,

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Speaker 5: you went from these like e harmonies of the world

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Speaker 5: where you had to fill out out you hours of

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Speaker 5: paperwork and the go robust to just like, oh my gosh,

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Speaker 5: this is great.

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Speaker 4: We're in a digital bar like yes, no, yes, no, woo.

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Speaker 4: I think it's coming next.

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Speaker 5: If my spiding sense is right, my intuition around products

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Speaker 5: is right, is like a hybrid of what we just

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Speaker 5: lived through the last couple decades of online love, where

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Speaker 5: it's not just this platform of quick judgment. Rather, we're

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Speaker 5: going to move into curiosity. How do we get you

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Speaker 5: to be curious by yourself, to ask the right questions

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Speaker 5: about yourself, And then how do we actually inspire you

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Speaker 5: to be more curious about others and give people a chance,

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Speaker 5: because curiosity is what will actually lead to true connection.

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Speaker 5: And then confidence, right like, how do we make you

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Speaker 5: really both feel confident in yourself but also in the journey.

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Speaker 5: Those are probably the two key pillars for how we

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Speaker 5: reinvent this for the next generation.

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Speaker 2: And in thinking about the future of connect I can't

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Speaker 2: help but think during this conversation, how does AI change

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Speaker 2: the way we date?

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Speaker 5: I actually think AI is sensational for dating candidly because

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Speaker 5: AI can take.

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Speaker 4: A lot of the work out of sorting.

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Speaker 5: I do think right now, it's, you know, kind of

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Speaker 5: like online shopping, Like why do you need to scroll

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Speaker 5: through three thousand red dresses to find the three that

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Speaker 5: would actually work for you? Why wouldn't we use AI

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Speaker 5: to supercharge understanding compatibility and then help deliver you people

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Speaker 5: that are like deeply compatible and relevant to you so

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Speaker 5: that you can actually make, you know, use out of

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Speaker 5: your most valuable asset on Earth, which is your time.

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Speaker 5: And I actually think AI helps us tremendously just better

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Speaker 5: match you, like helps you build better profiles, and it

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Speaker 5: just gets you to these real connections quicker, better, faster, safer.

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Speaker 1: It's time for an other quick break, but don't go away.

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Speaker 1: We'll be right back with Whitney Wolf. Heard. We're back

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Speaker 1: with Whitney Wolf Heard.

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Speaker 3: I'd love to hear more about the secret to creating

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Speaker 3: a dating profile that you can feel confident in. And

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Speaker 3: it feels like we have this incredible resource here in you,

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Speaker 3: and we'd be remiss not to ask you what is

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Speaker 3: the secret to creating a perfect dating profile.

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Speaker 5: I think the secret is really going to sound cheesy,

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Speaker 5: and you're gonna be like, of course she said that,

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Speaker 5: but you really have to be yourself like that is

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Speaker 5: the secret. There's only one you, and I mean that

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Speaker 5: so sincerely. I run a product with you know, tens

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Speaker 5: of millions of people, if not more, and there's only

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Speaker 5: one you. So don't try to blend in. Try to

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Speaker 5: stand out. And so by standing out, that is by

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Speaker 5: asking yourself like, what is unique to me? Where do

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Speaker 5: I feel most alive in my life photos? Where do

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Speaker 5: I feel like, oh that is so me? And then

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Speaker 5: really express yourself. If you're funny, like showcase that, if

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Speaker 5: you are hyper intellectual, showcase that. Do not be shy,

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Speaker 5: and do not build a profile in fear of what

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Speaker 5: someone will think of you, because the ultimate outcome here

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Speaker 5: is that you find someone that sees you for you

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Speaker 5: and you can be yourself with And so if you

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Speaker 5: don't present yourself as your true self, you won't connect

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Speaker 5: that way. So I would say, just like, be so

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Speaker 5: uniquely you, and it will attract the people that are

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Speaker 5: meant for you.

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Speaker 1: My worst ones were also me not knowing myself.

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Speaker 5: You're so right, and I think that you will see

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Speaker 5: this be one of the most important pillars of this

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Speaker 5: business in the future. I think that's been the missing

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Speaker 5: link in dating this entire time. I think that's pretty revolutionary.

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Speaker 5: I agree with you now that you are sort of

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Speaker 5: released from the burden of day in and day out

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Speaker 5: CEO ship. I've heard you say that you're really excited

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Speaker 5: to be an ideas person again. Is there anything that

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Speaker 5: you're comfortable sharing with in terms of what you are creating,

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Speaker 5: what you want to put forth into the world via

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Speaker 5: bumble or elsewhere. I'm really focused on these macro cultural

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Speaker 5: themes and integrating them into our vision as a company.

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Speaker 5: How do we actually help people get to know themselves

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Speaker 5: so that they can really express themselves in a way

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Speaker 5: that's more authentic and then attract people that will appreciate

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Speaker 5: them for them And people don't need to fall in

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Speaker 5: love in a pretend version of themselves. It is just

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Speaker 5: like the inevitable, it's going to fall apart and collapse, right,

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Speaker 5: So how do we actually prevent bad relationships from ever

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Speaker 5: happening thematically. I've been spending the bulk of my time

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Speaker 5: on self discovery, self love. That's really where I spend

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Speaker 5: ninety nine percent of my energy right now.

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Speaker 2: Gen Z is so focused on self love. So it's

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Speaker 2: how we save the planet. Candidly, like, if we all

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Speaker 2: learn to love ourselves a little bit more in ten, twenty, thirty,

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Speaker 2: fifty years from not like, we.

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Speaker 4: Will be a better place for sure.

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Speaker 2: So I think some people just have these strong natural

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Speaker 2: instincts that help them pick up on things with culture.

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Speaker 2: And then on the other hand, some people have these

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Speaker 2: very particular external resources that help them get a finger

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Speaker 2: on the pulse of the world around them. Are there

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Speaker 2: ways in which you receive these sort of downloads or

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Speaker 2: information about what's going on in culture at large? Is

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Speaker 2: it from reading? Is it from talking to people? What

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Speaker 2: is it for you? You know?

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Speaker 5: Since I was a kid, I just get these downloads.

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Speaker 5: I just feel things. I don't know what you call it.

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Speaker 5: I just get these like knowings. I went through a

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Speaker 5: harrowing teenage relationship that took me to my like depths

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Speaker 5: of hell, and I just as an innocent young girl,

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Speaker 5: I just could not even imagine that that could happen

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Speaker 5: to someone, and so I just think I wake up

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Speaker 5: every day saying like I am going to just like

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Speaker 5: make sure that whoever the sixteen year old Whitney out

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Speaker 5: there never goes through that again. And I just like

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Speaker 5: feel it. I don't know, that's just how my brain works.

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Speaker 5: I love to meditate. I meditate every single day. It's

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Speaker 5: like the only way I can function. And I don't know,

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Speaker 5: I just try to connect inward to something bigger, whatever

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Speaker 5: you want to call that.

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Speaker 1: Thanks for sharing that.

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Speaker 2: I think your career it's so obvious to me that

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Speaker 2: it's this feeling and this knowing when I look at

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Speaker 2: your career.

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Speaker 5: That's really kind and I really appreciate you guys asking

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Speaker 5: all these amazing questions.

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Speaker 4: It's been really fun. Thanks for saying that. Whitney, Thank you,

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Speaker 4: Thank you.

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Speaker 2: Whitney will have heard as the founder and executive chair

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Speaker 2: of Bumble.

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Speaker 3: Join the conversation using hashtag the bright Side and connect

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Speaker 3: with us on social media. Hello Sunshine on Instagram and

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Speaker 3: at the bright Side Pod on TikTok oh, and feel

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Speaker 3: free to tag us at Simone Voice and at Danielle Robe.

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Speaker 2: Listen and follow the bright Side on the iHeartRadio app

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Speaker 2: Apple Podcasts or wherever you get your podcasts.

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Speaker 3: See you tomorrow, folks, keep looking on the bright side.