WEBVTT - I Have Some Thoughts | Tuskegee's Dress Code, Blade is Cancelled, & Brittney Griner's Divorce 0:00:10.039 --> 0:00:12.640 Hey, y'all, welcome back to I Have Some Thoughts, a 0:00:12.800 --> 0:00:15.360 Therapy for Black Girls, minis old series where we talk 0:00:15.400 --> 0:00:17.639 about all things pop culture, but of course from a 0:00:17.640 --> 0:00:20.720 mental health lens. And I am joined today again with 0:00:20.920 --> 0:00:22.920 bria Hey, bria. 0:00:22.440 --> 0:00:25.599 Hey, doctor Joy. I'm super excited for the topics that 0:00:25.640 --> 0:00:27.160 we have this week. We have a lot of fun 0:00:27.200 --> 0:00:32.280 stuff to discuss, So first let's get into Sky University's 0:00:32.440 --> 0:00:36.560 dress code change. So to Ski University in Alabama rolls 0:00:36.600 --> 0:00:39.159 out a new dress code that people have a lot 0:00:39.200 --> 0:00:43.520 of thoughts on. Last week, President Mark Brown announced that bonnets, 0:00:43.640 --> 0:00:47.800 do rags, bedroom shoes those were banned from classrooms and 0:00:47.840 --> 0:00:51.560 the cafeterias. In the statement, he shares the policy's goal 0:00:51.800 --> 0:00:55.720 isn't to restrict anyone from enjoying the skie experience, but 0:00:55.880 --> 0:00:59.320 to prepare students for the workforce that they will encounter 0:00:59.480 --> 0:01:02.360 upon lead to speaking, I think it's kind of started 0:01:02.400 --> 0:01:05.039 this broader conversation. I think a lot of people have 0:01:05.080 --> 0:01:07.680 a lot of opinions on whether this was the right call, 0:01:07.760 --> 0:01:10.880 whether it was the wrong call, whether it's suppressing expression, 0:01:10.920 --> 0:01:13.520 all these different things. But I think the broader theme 0:01:13.640 --> 0:01:19.360 is can professionalism and cultural expression really co exist. So, 0:01:19.560 --> 0:01:23.640 in your opinion, what is the difference between maybe preparing 0:01:23.680 --> 0:01:26.839 someone for the realities of the world and asking them 0:01:26.880 --> 0:01:28.720 to change who they are to be accepted. 0:01:29.800 --> 0:01:32.039 So this is such a great tapac Bria, and I 0:01:32.040 --> 0:01:34.640 definitely have seen it all over the timelines, right, And 0:01:35.160 --> 0:01:38.720 my understanding is that this isn't necessarily like a complete change, 0:01:38.840 --> 0:01:41.440 like maybe they are kind of maybe being stricter about it, 0:01:41.480 --> 0:01:43.880 but it sounds like there has been a dress code 0:01:44.080 --> 0:01:46.520 in place for lots of years. And I've even seen 0:01:46.520 --> 0:01:48.520 some alone kind of come out and talk about like, yeah, 0:01:48.520 --> 0:01:50.920 this kind of was always the thing, right, And I 0:01:50.960 --> 0:01:53.520 am no stranger to dress code. So many of you know, 0:01:53.560 --> 0:01:56.840 I graduated from Zabor University of Louisiana, which is the 0:01:56.880 --> 0:02:01.240 only predominantly black Catholic university, and so we had nuns 0:02:01.280 --> 0:02:03.400 like live on the yard. I think some of them 0:02:03.400 --> 0:02:06.280 are still there, and so they were very strict about 0:02:06.320 --> 0:02:08.840 like our skirt length and like short length and like 0:02:08.919 --> 0:02:11.080 all of these things, right, And so I'm definitely no 0:02:11.120 --> 0:02:14.600 stranger to dress codes, even at the collegiate level. I 0:02:14.639 --> 0:02:18.640 do think there is some place to this, right, like 0:02:18.720 --> 0:02:21.600 the idea that you know there are certain things that 0:02:21.639 --> 0:02:24.280 we wear in certain situations, Like I think that that 0:02:24.600 --> 0:02:27.679 is expected, right, Like you dress differently when you're going 0:02:27.680 --> 0:02:29.600 to the club versus when you are going to a 0:02:29.720 --> 0:02:32.359 job interview, right, And so I don't think that there's 0:02:32.400 --> 0:02:35.320 anything wrong with like wanting to reinforce that on a 0:02:35.360 --> 0:02:38.560 college campus and like making sure that people understand what 0:02:38.680 --> 0:02:42.359 kinds of things are appropriate to wear when and wear. 0:02:42.919 --> 0:02:45.160 But I do think, you know, you have to be careful, 0:02:45.200 --> 0:02:47.639 and of course it's kind of bleeds into a larger 0:02:47.639 --> 0:02:51.880 conversation around respectability politics, right, Like if we dress certain ways, 0:02:51.960 --> 0:02:54.440 then you know, maybe people are less likely to discriminate 0:02:54.480 --> 0:02:57.760 against us, or maybe we are better crime to have 0:02:57.880 --> 0:03:01.400 better service, and we know actually that is not true, right, 0:03:01.480 --> 0:03:03.320 Like people can dress all kinds of ways, and if 0:03:03.360 --> 0:03:06.040 people are going to be racist of discriminatory, it's going 0:03:06.120 --> 0:03:08.680 to happen. But I do think again, like I said 0:03:08.680 --> 0:03:12.760 that there is some merit to right time, right place. Now. 0:03:12.880 --> 0:03:15.919 Sometimes you have eight o'clock am classes and you don't 0:03:16.040 --> 0:03:18.079 want to get dulled up and like do too much, 0:03:18.160 --> 0:03:21.440 right And I can definitely see that the students kind 0:03:21.480 --> 0:03:23.640 of talking about like, Okay, I don't want to have 0:03:23.680 --> 0:03:25.959 to kind of be in full glam. But I think 0:03:26.000 --> 0:03:30.320 that there is lots of gray area in between, kind 0:03:30.360 --> 0:03:33.040 of like rolling out of bed just going straight to class. 0:03:33.040 --> 0:03:34.960 And I'm not sure that this was the case right like, 0:03:34.960 --> 0:03:38.520 because it especially at HBCU campuses, at least in my experience, 0:03:38.880 --> 0:03:41.000 it was always a fashion show, right like, people weren't 0:03:41.000 --> 0:03:45.320 putting on there exactly exactly. Now, it has been quite 0:03:45.320 --> 0:03:47.440 a year since I have been, you know, a student 0:03:47.520 --> 0:03:50.080 on a campus until maybe things have changed. But I 0:03:50.120 --> 0:03:51.960 think that there are lots of ways that you can 0:03:52.000 --> 0:03:58.080 still be casual dressed down without necessarily rolling out of bed. Again, 0:03:58.120 --> 0:04:00.200 I don't know that that's the case. I don't they 0:04:00.400 --> 0:04:02.920 kids are necessarily kind of just going straight out of 0:04:02.920 --> 0:04:05.440 bed and there pajamas. But if you're an emergency, right 0:04:05.480 --> 0:04:07.240 like you rushing too a final, I could definitely see 0:04:07.240 --> 0:04:09.520 something like that happening. But I do think that there 0:04:09.520 --> 0:04:11.920 are lots of ways to be casual and not like 0:04:11.960 --> 0:04:15.440 completely dulled up in your business professional kinds of thing, 0:04:15.520 --> 0:04:18.200 and still go to class in ways that meet the 0:04:18.279 --> 0:04:19.640 dress code standards. 0:04:20.200 --> 0:04:23.239 No, definitely, And I'm coming to it from like another 0:04:23.320 --> 0:04:25.919 side of the spectrum because I actually went to Ohiose 0:04:25.920 --> 0:04:30.760 State for undergrad which is like PWS PWI can get 0:04:31.080 --> 0:04:34.640 And it's so interesting seeing these conversations. But also from 0:04:34.640 --> 0:04:37.599 my experience kind of seeing a lot of white people 0:04:37.680 --> 0:04:40.480 just roll out of bed and just come to class however, 0:04:40.680 --> 0:04:44.240 whether it was sweatpants or pajamas, like the goal was 0:04:44.240 --> 0:04:46.359 to just be there, and so it's very interesting that, 0:04:46.480 --> 0:04:49.240 like the situations are just so different. 0:04:49.920 --> 0:04:51.880 Yeah, now, but you do bring up a great point, right, 0:04:51.920 --> 0:04:54.680 Like if it is either like put on for real 0:04:54.720 --> 0:04:57.920 clothes or miss class, definitely don't miss class, right, Like 0:04:58.200 --> 0:05:01.600 that definitely is the priority for people to be there regardless. 0:05:01.960 --> 0:05:04.880 As long as you are looking, everything is covered, so 0:05:04.960 --> 0:05:07.360 to speak. This is completely fine. 0:05:07.880 --> 0:05:13.160 Right, So from your perspective, what impact care, respectability, politics 0:05:13.279 --> 0:05:17.600 and maybe constantly monitoring your parents have on your sense 0:05:17.600 --> 0:05:19.719 of authenticity or self expression? 0:05:20.360 --> 0:05:22.040 I feel like we kind of talked about this, maybe 0:05:22.080 --> 0:05:24.760 even related to a topic from last week. Just like 0:05:24.839 --> 0:05:29.800 the enormous amount of mental text and toll it plays 0:05:29.839 --> 0:05:33.360 on you to be constantly hyper vigilant around like appearance 0:05:33.839 --> 0:05:36.640 and kind of constantly kind of scanning an environment like 0:05:36.839 --> 0:05:39.120 is this okay? And am I doing enough? Am I 0:05:39.160 --> 0:05:41.160 doing too much? Right? Like? And I think you know, 0:05:41.240 --> 0:05:43.599 as black people, we are often put in those kinds 0:05:43.600 --> 0:05:47.320 of situations, right, And so especially for young people who 0:05:47.400 --> 0:05:49.640 are just kind of coming into their own you know, 0:05:49.720 --> 0:05:52.440 you don't necessarily want to introduce that added level of 0:05:52.480 --> 0:05:55.760 anxiety because there's so much time later in life to 0:05:55.800 --> 0:05:59.279 deal with that. And I don't think it is often invisible. 0:05:59.440 --> 0:06:01.880 It is visible kind of tax, and so people don't 0:06:01.880 --> 0:06:05.560 always realize how exhausting it is to kind of constantly 0:06:05.560 --> 0:06:08.600 be thinking about how you're perceived and all of those 0:06:08.680 --> 0:06:10.640 kinds of things. And so there is a tax, even 0:06:10.680 --> 0:06:13.080 if it isn't always visible to us. And I think 0:06:13.120 --> 0:06:15.440 that that is the largest mental health impact is that 0:06:15.520 --> 0:06:18.800 it really diminishes our bandwidth for other things when we 0:06:18.839 --> 0:06:21.800 are constantly kind of scanning and paying attention to these 0:06:21.839 --> 0:06:24.800 ideas of how I'm being perceived and you know, do 0:06:24.839 --> 0:06:28.440 I look respectable? Am I representing the black culture? Well? 0:06:28.520 --> 0:06:30.360 You know, like that it does take a toll on 0:06:30.400 --> 0:06:31.240 you after a while. 0:06:31.839 --> 0:06:34.159 Yeah, kind of like this feeling that you are the 0:06:34.200 --> 0:06:37.520 representation of what black people should look like, even though 0:06:37.520 --> 0:06:41.880 that shouldn't partecularly fall on anyone's shoulders. Sorry, right, thank 0:06:41.920 --> 0:06:45.520 you for sharing that. Moving on, to our next topic. 0:06:45.600 --> 0:06:49.240 We're going to talk about how Marvel has shelf Playe 0:06:49.440 --> 0:06:51.920 and hersha Ali has spoken on it. So I think 0:06:51.920 --> 0:06:54.160 this news actually came out a couple of months ago 0:06:54.200 --> 0:06:57.800 about Marvel not moving forward with Playe. Hershal Ali, who 0:06:57.920 --> 0:07:00.800 was supposed to start in the movie as play, has 0:07:00.839 --> 0:07:03.680 finally spoken out on it as well. He shared that 0:07:03.720 --> 0:07:08.200 the project installed upon running into multiple delays and creative differences, 0:07:08.560 --> 0:07:11.760 but he also strongly believes that with the billions of 0:07:11.800 --> 0:07:15.040 dollars that Marvel has, if they wanted to make it happen, 0:07:15.240 --> 0:07:18.640 they would have made it happen. So I think that 0:07:18.800 --> 0:07:21.640 it really feels like kind of another blow when it 0:07:21.680 --> 0:07:26.240 comes to representation in the media space we only have 0:07:26.440 --> 0:07:30.160 but so many, whether it's like black superheroes or black 0:07:30.240 --> 0:07:34.120 characters in TV and film already, and brings up this 0:07:34.200 --> 0:07:38.000 larger conversation of what happens when representation just feels very 0:07:38.160 --> 0:07:42.920 conditional and not something that the studios the media companies 0:07:42.960 --> 0:07:47.720 are consistently working toward. So why can these setbacks feel 0:07:47.840 --> 0:07:51.680 especially painful after we've started to believe that meaningful change 0:07:51.760 --> 0:07:53.640 is happening and then it just gets taken away. 0:07:54.200 --> 0:07:56.920 Yeah, and this feels especially unfortunate because it feels like 0:07:56.960 --> 0:08:00.280 we were just giving Marvel their flowers. Lance Yea found 0:08:00.280 --> 0:08:03.720 out around about Black Panther three, right, and so this 0:08:03.800 --> 0:08:07.640 feels like the worst timing. And I do think it 0:08:07.720 --> 0:08:11.040 speaks to the larger conversations kind of happening in Hollywood 0:08:11.160 --> 0:08:14.880 on the entertainment spectrum just around the lack of investment 0:08:14.960 --> 0:08:18.640 into black and brown projects, right kind of see actors 0:08:18.640 --> 0:08:22.320 and actresses and producers talking about these kinds of things. 0:08:22.760 --> 0:08:25.440 And you know, we've had conversations on the podcast around 0:08:25.520 --> 0:08:28.400 I Think You Me and Tuscany was the latest example 0:08:28.440 --> 0:08:30.560 of this, right of oh, we got to see how 0:08:30.560 --> 0:08:33.120 well this does before we say we're going to, you know, 0:08:33.200 --> 0:08:35.880 kind of greenlight the next show or project that may 0:08:35.880 --> 0:08:38.959 be similar. And I just feel like I'm very tired 0:08:38.960 --> 0:08:41.160 of it. I know kind of black people generally are 0:08:41.160 --> 0:08:44.640 really tired of this idea that we do not support 0:08:44.679 --> 0:08:48.400 these projects because we undoubtedly come out and droves for 0:08:48.720 --> 0:08:53.720 stories that feature people from our community and our culture, right, Like, 0:08:53.760 --> 0:08:56.520 I mean millions and billions maybe even of dollars did 0:08:56.559 --> 0:08:57.960 Black Panther one and two make? 0:08:58.080 --> 0:08:58.240 Right? 0:08:58.320 --> 0:09:01.720 Like? People, we had this whole dress code that we were, 0:09:01.880 --> 0:09:03.800 you know, wearing all white and doing all these things 0:09:03.800 --> 0:09:05.800 like we make it a real big moment. And so 0:09:06.400 --> 0:09:10.040 how much more do we have to do to show 0:09:10.240 --> 0:09:14.440 companies and media houses that these are stories that we 0:09:14.480 --> 0:09:19.319 are invested in seeing and promoting and celebrating. I think 0:09:19.360 --> 0:09:21.600 we've done our part right, Like, I think the larger 0:09:21.640 --> 0:09:25.120 conversation is why can't people who don't look like us 0:09:25.200 --> 0:09:26.760 also celebrate these films? Right? 0:09:26.800 --> 0:09:26.880 Like? 0:09:26.960 --> 0:09:29.400 Now, of course some people do, but I think what 0:09:29.440 --> 0:09:31.920 we see is that they don't come out in droves 0:09:31.960 --> 0:09:35.800 in the same ways to support superheroes and main actors 0:09:35.800 --> 0:09:37.920 and actresses that don't look like them. Right. It's as 0:09:37.960 --> 0:09:41.440 if they can't connect to stories that don't feature like 0:09:41.480 --> 0:09:45.400 a white heroine or superhero when for years we've been 0:09:45.440 --> 0:09:47.240 asked to do that, right, Like, we've been asked to 0:09:47.400 --> 0:09:50.720 suspend us belief and just kind of see ourselves in 0:09:50.760 --> 0:09:53.640 the story, regardless of who the main character is. And 0:09:53.679 --> 0:09:56.079 so I think that that is really something for other 0:09:56.120 --> 0:09:59.080 people to continue with. But it doesn't feel good, right, 0:09:59.080 --> 0:10:02.800 It doesn't feel good. It doesn't I think booth morale 0:10:03.320 --> 0:10:06.760 or I think it also enginders like this sense of hopelessness, 0:10:06.960 --> 0:10:10.320 especially for people in the industry of the story that 0:10:10.360 --> 0:10:12.520 I'm working really hard on and is it ever going 0:10:12.559 --> 0:10:14.880 to see the light of day? So it just doesn't 0:10:14.880 --> 0:10:16.920 feel good. And I think especially right now when we 0:10:16.960 --> 0:10:19.120 are looking for so many things to kind of celebrate 0:10:19.200 --> 0:10:21.160 and make us feel good, when there's so many other 0:10:21.240 --> 0:10:25.760 things the other awful, this just feels like another blow no, 0:10:25.960 --> 0:10:26.360 for sure. 0:10:26.440 --> 0:10:30.240 And I think even it's interesting because for a lot 0:10:30.360 --> 0:10:34.800 of you know, white projects, they have this majority audience 0:10:34.840 --> 0:10:38.000 that's coming out, plus a lot of the minorities that 0:10:38.040 --> 0:10:40.960 are coming out to support these things as well. Whereas 0:10:41.040 --> 0:10:45.720 a lot of the black artists, black filmmakers, they're able 0:10:45.760 --> 0:10:47.880 to capture the core audience. But a lot of these 0:10:47.880 --> 0:10:50.120 studios are looking for what's going to be bigger. You know, 0:10:50.120 --> 0:10:53.439 we're spending money on this, we need as many adds 0:10:53.440 --> 0:10:55.840 on it as possible, And it's just not a super 0:10:55.840 --> 0:11:01.320 fair comparison. So from the viewpoint of a viewer, and 0:11:01.360 --> 0:11:04.960 then also the viewpoint of a creator, someone who's hoping 0:11:05.040 --> 0:11:07.840 to have their TV series or their film at the 0:11:07.880 --> 0:11:12.199 pick screen, how can we maintain hope and continue advocating 0:11:12.360 --> 0:11:15.640 for representation even when you know we have these drokes 0:11:15.679 --> 0:11:18.640 of lots of progress. It seems like we're taking ten 0:11:18.679 --> 0:11:19.200 steps back. 0:11:19.840 --> 0:11:23.880 Yeah, so I've been really excited to see more the 0:11:23.920 --> 0:11:26.439 indie scene kind of continuing to develop. 0:11:26.559 --> 0:11:26.719 Right. 0:11:26.760 --> 0:11:30.040 So people will put a trailer out like on Instagram 0:11:30.160 --> 0:11:32.400 or TikTok or whatever, and then I love seeing the 0:11:32.440 --> 0:11:34.640 comments fill up, like where's the link? We want to 0:11:34.640 --> 0:11:36.840 support this. We got to see how this story ends, right, 0:11:37.040 --> 0:11:38.680 And I think that that is where we're going to 0:11:38.720 --> 0:11:41.400 have to lean into. Right. Of course, we can continue 0:11:41.400 --> 0:11:44.480 to advocate and continue to lobby for major studios like 0:11:44.520 --> 0:11:48.160 a Marble to kind of see our stories and invest 0:11:48.200 --> 0:11:49.920 in them, and I don't think we should stop that, 0:11:50.320 --> 0:11:53.120 but I don't want people's stories not to be told 0:11:53.200 --> 0:11:55.640 and not to be shown because we can't get the 0:11:55.760 --> 0:11:58.720 major dollars. Right. So, if you can't make the Marble 0:11:58.800 --> 0:12:00.960 version of what you want to make, is there a 0:12:01.040 --> 0:12:04.760 Kickstarter version of the show of the project that can 0:12:04.960 --> 0:12:07.160 kind of just get your feet on the ground and 0:12:07.240 --> 0:12:09.640 allow at least a part of the story to be told. 0:12:10.080 --> 0:12:11.760 I think that that is where we're really going to 0:12:11.800 --> 0:12:14.560 have to lean into, because these stories are important and 0:12:14.559 --> 0:12:17.719 they deserve to be made. But also there is an 0:12:17.760 --> 0:12:20.400 active community of people who I think want to support 0:12:20.400 --> 0:12:22.760 these kinds of things right and get really excited. We 0:12:22.960 --> 0:12:25.640 like entertainment right, like we want to see ourselves on 0:12:25.640 --> 0:12:28.319 the screen, whether it's large or small. And so I 0:12:28.360 --> 0:12:31.000 think really leaning into the community support and kind of 0:12:31.000 --> 0:12:34.920 the independent route is at least a step until we 0:12:34.960 --> 0:12:37.600 maybe can see some progress in larger places. 0:12:38.360 --> 0:12:41.040 Definitely, And as you're talking, I actually thought of one 0:12:41.160 --> 0:12:42.920 other thing that I think it's so cool how the 0:12:42.920 --> 0:12:45.920 media industry is always just evolving and doing new things. 0:12:46.400 --> 0:12:49.040 Are you familiar with it? Was who Ray Studios did 0:12:49.160 --> 0:12:54.520 like a TikTok short microdrama. Those are becoming just so popular. 0:12:54.520 --> 0:12:56.440 Like even if you're like scrolling TikTok, you might can 0:12:56.440 --> 0:12:59.600 add for like this microdrama and the story that you're 0:12:59.800 --> 0:13:03.320 kind of following. And so I think it gives us 0:13:03.360 --> 0:13:06.520 an opportunity to kind of step into these spaces while 0:13:06.520 --> 0:13:08.600 people are kind of figuring it out and telling those 0:13:08.600 --> 0:13:12.040 stories from different perspectives, because you know the post of 0:13:12.080 --> 0:13:16.280 TikTok series, it takes time, it takes effort, it takes creativity. 0:13:16.320 --> 0:13:18.760 But as far as the resources that you need, you 0:13:18.800 --> 0:13:21.280 don't need as much as you maybe would to shoot 0:13:21.320 --> 0:13:22.640 something Marvel level. 0:13:22.800 --> 0:13:25.320 So yeah, yeah, and it's a great way, you know, 0:13:25.440 --> 0:13:27.760 to kind of get your product out there, right, like 0:13:27.800 --> 0:13:30.400 it shows proof of concept, you know. So that Hooray 0:13:30.600 --> 0:13:33.520 microdrama did really really well, right, and I mean, of 0:13:33.559 --> 0:13:36.679 course it's already has major backing, but I mean there's 0:13:36.679 --> 0:13:39.600 no reason why somebody else who is in the same 0:13:39.720 --> 0:13:42.680 space couldn't do a version of that for themselves. And 0:13:42.720 --> 0:13:45.080 then maybe you get on the radar of somebody who 0:13:45.200 --> 0:13:48.240 has deeper pockets, right for sure. But you know, Bria, 0:13:48.280 --> 0:13:50.440 the funny thing about when I saw and I don't 0:13:50.480 --> 0:13:54.400 know if PISA's the Horay Studio was the first microdrama, 0:13:54.440 --> 0:13:58.560 but it reminds me of Quibi. Do you remember Quibbi? Yeah, 0:13:58.559 --> 0:14:00.920 And so it kind of feels like that what Quibi's 0:14:00.960 --> 0:14:03.400 kind of premise was all along. So it feels like 0:14:03.440 --> 0:14:05.400 maybe they were just a little too early, because I 0:14:05.440 --> 0:14:08.760 wonder if we're going to see kind of an explosion 0:14:08.920 --> 0:14:11.400 of these micro dramas and people are really leaning into 0:14:11.440 --> 0:14:12.040 that forman. 0:14:12.160 --> 0:14:15.640 Yeah, I saw Bravo was doing something i'ven't looked into it, 0:14:15.679 --> 0:14:19.960 but some type of microdrama or reality TV. I was like, Okay, well, 0:14:19.960 --> 0:14:23.240 we'll see how that goes. So it seems like, yeah, 0:14:23.240 --> 0:14:24.680 you're right, they might have just been a little too 0:14:24.720 --> 0:14:27.640 early because it always comes back around. 0:14:29.000 --> 0:14:34.320 More from our conversation after the break, all. 0:14:34.360 --> 0:14:37.200 Right, and for our last topic, we're going to enter 0:14:37.480 --> 0:14:42.640 WNBA world again. WNBA star Britney Griner has filed for 0:14:42.800 --> 0:14:47.280 divorce from her wife, Cherill Grinder, after eight years of marriage. Now, 0:14:47.280 --> 0:14:50.080 we don't have any details outside of the filing stating 0:14:50.120 --> 0:14:54.000 that the marriage was irritrievedly broken. But as many of 0:14:54.040 --> 0:14:56.520 the headlines are rolling out, I started to see a 0:14:56.560 --> 0:14:59.560 common theme in the framing of the headlines that I 0:14:59.680 --> 0:15:02.000 was love. That's on a lot of the headlines that 0:15:02.200 --> 0:15:06.080 some version of Britney Grinder has filed for divorce from Cherrell, 0:15:06.360 --> 0:15:10.560 despite Cherrell fighting for Britney's freedom while she was in 0:15:10.560 --> 0:15:13.120 the Russian prison. Now for the listeners, if you need 0:15:13.120 --> 0:15:16.640 a reminder, back in February twenty twenty two, Brittany Grinder 0:15:16.840 --> 0:15:20.880 was detained in Moscow after Russian officials found fape cartridges 0:15:20.960 --> 0:15:23.800 in her carry on luggage. She was arrested, charged with 0:15:23.840 --> 0:15:28.120 smuggling narcotic drugs and received a nine year sentence. Cherrell 0:15:28.280 --> 0:15:31.240 was extremely vocal during the ten months that Britney spent 0:15:31.280 --> 0:15:35.880 in Russia fighting for her release. But I think the 0:15:36.040 --> 0:15:38.320 thing that I kind of struggle with the framing is 0:15:38.640 --> 0:15:42.960 do we owe someone a relationship because of what they've 0:15:43.000 --> 0:15:45.720 done for us? So I love your initial thoughts on 0:15:45.760 --> 0:15:49.200 the framing and maybe your thoughts on, you know, in 0:15:49.240 --> 0:15:52.800 what ways we can feel indebted to someone and how 0:15:52.840 --> 0:15:54.800 it makes it a little harder to assess whether a 0:15:54.880 --> 0:15:56.480 relationship is healthy or not. 0:15:57.320 --> 0:15:59.960 Yeah, I agree with you, Ria, Like the framing of 0:16:00.120 --> 0:16:03.760 that I think is incredibly unhealthy and not fair. I 0:16:03.760 --> 0:16:06.000 think in a lot of ways, right, if you are 0:16:06.040 --> 0:16:09.640 in a committed relationship, that is the whole idea is 0:16:09.680 --> 0:16:12.040 that you are supposed to help and support one another, 0:16:12.680 --> 0:16:15.640 but that doesn't mean that you hold that over their head, right, 0:16:15.680 --> 0:16:19.040 And so of course she advocated for her wife to 0:16:19.240 --> 0:16:23.080 be released because it's her wife, right, And so that 0:16:23.200 --> 0:16:25.240 is kind of what you're supposed to do in a committed, 0:16:25.320 --> 0:16:28.600 healthy relationship, and so you know, she did I think 0:16:28.680 --> 0:16:31.200 what any of us would do. It's something similar. We're 0:16:31.200 --> 0:16:34.200 happening to a partner, But that doesn't mean that now 0:16:34.360 --> 0:16:37.800 Berty is like obligated to stay with her, right, Like 0:16:37.840 --> 0:16:41.600 I think you get into very dangerous territory, especially as women, 0:16:41.760 --> 0:16:45.240 right and you know, many women, especially in a heterosexual relationship, 0:16:45.520 --> 0:16:48.200 this idea that you owe somebody something. We know that 0:16:48.200 --> 0:16:51.680 that can lead to lots of different kinds of complications 0:16:51.720 --> 0:16:55.320 and an abuse kind of situation. This idea that I 0:16:55.400 --> 0:16:57.600 can't leave now because they did so much for me, 0:16:58.080 --> 0:17:00.320 right like, that is really messing with some danger is 0:17:00.360 --> 0:17:04.600 I think in imbalance power dynamics in a relationship, which 0:17:04.600 --> 0:17:07.480 are never healthy, right like, that is not a good setup. 0:17:07.760 --> 0:17:10.840 And so I think this does speak to larger conversations 0:17:10.880 --> 0:17:15.520 around these expectations and maybe unspoken rules that people feel 0:17:15.520 --> 0:17:17.919 like they have in relationships. And so, you know, I 0:17:17.920 --> 0:17:19.639 don't think and that's kind of what the purpose of 0:17:19.640 --> 0:17:22.000 this podcast is anyway, is right like, not to say 0:17:22.000 --> 0:17:24.840 whether one person is wrong or one person is right, 0:17:25.160 --> 0:17:28.520 but how can we think about our own relationships and 0:17:29.000 --> 0:17:31.800 this idea that we owe somebody something because they did 0:17:31.800 --> 0:17:34.840 something nice for us? Right? So, I completely agree with you. 0:17:34.880 --> 0:17:37.240 I think the framing of that, of course, is designed 0:17:37.280 --> 0:17:40.119 to make you click and see what is happening. But 0:17:40.200 --> 0:17:42.240 I think when we kind of peel back the layers, 0:17:42.560 --> 0:17:45.400 we can recognize that that is not a fair framing. 0:17:45.680 --> 0:17:48.679 Nor do we want to reinforce the idea that somebody 0:17:48.760 --> 0:17:51.800 is obligated to stay in a relationship just because sacrifices 0:17:51.840 --> 0:17:53.360 have been made on their behalf. 0:17:54.200 --> 0:17:58.840 Yep, absolutely, And so how can the listeners, if they 0:17:59.000 --> 0:18:01.160 maybe feel like they front into something like this, how 0:18:01.200 --> 0:18:04.800 can you possess if this relationship is healthy and I'm 0:18:04.920 --> 0:18:08.320 staying in this healthy relationship? Or am I here just 0:18:08.320 --> 0:18:11.280 because I maybe feel like I owe someone something or 0:18:11.320 --> 0:18:13.159 you know, they've already done so much for me, or 0:18:13.160 --> 0:18:15.719 we've been here so long already even that you might 0:18:15.760 --> 0:18:16.960 as well just not walk away. 0:18:17.560 --> 0:18:21.240 Yeah, and that is not an uncommon sentiment, right, like 0:18:21.280 --> 0:18:23.639 this idea that I've been with them for twenty five years? 0:18:23.640 --> 0:18:25.800 Like is this really what I want to walk away from? 0:18:25.960 --> 0:18:28.240 Is the you know, is the grass greener on the 0:18:28.280 --> 0:18:31.280 other side? And those are I think valid questions to 0:18:31.359 --> 0:18:34.560 ask yourself. So I think with the support of other people, 0:18:34.680 --> 0:18:37.239 maybe that is a trusted friend group, maybe that is 0:18:37.600 --> 0:18:40.439 a pastor maybe that is a mental health professional. Like 0:18:40.480 --> 0:18:42.399 I think, if you are questioning those kinds of things, 0:18:42.440 --> 0:18:44.560 it's good to give voice to those kinds of things 0:18:44.600 --> 0:18:47.360 with somebody who can help you peel back the layers 0:18:47.400 --> 0:18:49.960 on what you're considering now. I do think it's important 0:18:49.960 --> 0:18:52.919 to be mindful of your audience, right, So I wouldn't 0:18:52.920 --> 0:18:55.399 necessarily go to your sister in law and have this 0:18:55.440 --> 0:19:00.240 conversation because she's not likely going to be unbiased. Going 0:19:00.240 --> 0:19:02.560 to somebody who can be neutral and who can kind 0:19:02.600 --> 0:19:05.320 of hear where you're coming from, I think can be 0:19:05.400 --> 0:19:08.639 really helpful. But I think journaling can also be great 0:19:08.680 --> 0:19:10.640 for something like this. And again, I think making sure 0:19:10.640 --> 0:19:12.720 that this is not a place where somebody's gonna stumble 0:19:12.800 --> 0:19:15.159 upon it, right, Like, you don't dcessarily want your partner 0:19:15.240 --> 0:19:17.200 to kind of read this and listen until you're ready 0:19:17.200 --> 0:19:19.560 to maybe share some of these things, but just getting 0:19:19.560 --> 0:19:22.360 your thoughts out right, Like what actually am I feeling 0:19:22.840 --> 0:19:25.480 in this moment? And am I feeling like I am 0:19:25.600 --> 0:19:28.040 only in this relationship because maybe they pay for me 0:19:28.080 --> 0:19:30.439 to go to school or because the kids are not 0:19:30.480 --> 0:19:32.120 old enough, right, Like, I think there are all kinds 0:19:32.160 --> 0:19:35.720 of stories that we create for ourselves when ultimately the 0:19:35.760 --> 0:19:39.480 goal is for everybody to be happy and feeling like 0:19:39.560 --> 0:19:41.919 they are seen and valued in the relationship. And if 0:19:41.960 --> 0:19:44.720 you are not feeling that way, it is not enough. 0:19:44.800 --> 0:19:47.600 History is not enough to keep you in a situation, 0:19:47.760 --> 0:19:49.879 if you are not feeling valued, if you feel like 0:19:50.200 --> 0:19:52.480 you're being abused in any way like, there are lots 0:19:52.480 --> 0:19:56.080 of different opportunities and options for you to explore, I think, 0:19:56.160 --> 0:19:59.199 especially with the supportive person are in the confines of 0:19:59.200 --> 0:19:59.800 your journal. 0:20:00.720 --> 0:20:03.960 Yes, absolutely totally agree. Well, thank you, doctor Joy. This 0:20:04.200 --> 0:20:06.840 was great and that was our last topic for the week. 0:20:07.359 --> 0:20:10.720 Perfect. Thank you so much for real excellent topics as always, 0:20:10.760 --> 0:20:13.080 And if there are things happening in your circles, things 0:20:13.119 --> 0:20:15.719 that are running down your timeline, are being promoted by 0:20:15.760 --> 0:20:18.199 your algorithm that you want us to weigh in on, 0:20:18.480 --> 0:20:20.359 please send those topics you will. You can do that 0:20:20.440 --> 0:20:23.680 at Therapy for Blackgirls dot com slash mailbox. And until 0:20:23.720 --> 0:20:25.320 next time, take good care of yourself.