WEBVTT - Stuart Stevens & John Cassidy 0:00:00.640 --> 0:00:04.160 Hi, I'm Molli John Fast and this is Fast Politics, 0:00:04.360 --> 0:00:07.120 where we discussed the top political headlines with some of 0:00:07.160 --> 0:00:12.000 today's best minds. And Russia has offered political asylum to 0:00:12.280 --> 0:00:16.000 Elon Musk Perfect gotta love it. We have such a 0:00:16.000 --> 0:00:19.000 great show for you today. The Lincoln Project's own Stuart 0:00:19.000 --> 0:00:22.440 Stevens stops by to talk about the Elon and Trump 0:00:22.560 --> 0:00:27.120 breakup and the case for nationalizing SpaceX and Starlink. Then 0:00:27.160 --> 0:00:30.640 we'll talk to the New Yorkers John Cassidy about his 0:00:30.760 --> 0:00:35.240 book Capitalism and Its Critics, a history from the Industrial 0:00:35.320 --> 0:00:36.360 Revolution to AI. 0:00:36.720 --> 0:00:39.239 But first the news, Mally, I'm going to let you 0:00:39.280 --> 0:00:42.680 and Stewart do the discussion of the girls who are 0:00:42.680 --> 0:00:47.239 fighting between Elon and the Trump and all that surrounds it, 0:00:47.280 --> 0:00:49.680 because we have other fish to fry that got buried 0:00:49.680 --> 0:00:52.560 in the news this week. This one is particularly horrifying. 0:00:52.560 --> 0:00:54.560 You and I were both wretching as we read this 0:00:54.640 --> 0:00:58.160 before this question swirl over who's running the CDC? Not 0:00:58.280 --> 0:00:59.440 a headline you want to read? 0:01:00.360 --> 0:01:03.280 This is not good? Okay. First of all, one of 0:01:03.360 --> 0:01:06.040 the things that's happened in this administration which we should 0:01:06.080 --> 0:01:09.080 all be thinking about, worrying about, and talking about is 0:01:09.080 --> 0:01:12.399 that the Trump administration has given up on running the 0:01:12.440 --> 0:01:15.320 federal government the way it's supposed to be run. And 0:01:15.360 --> 0:01:18.480 the problem is they're disrupting things that we actually need, 0:01:18.680 --> 0:01:23.480 like the CDC. Putting RFK Junior in charge of this 0:01:23.680 --> 0:01:28.440 CDC is basically just giving it up right, and that's 0:01:28.480 --> 0:01:32.600 what we're seeing here. Confusion over shifting Center for Disease 0:01:32.680 --> 0:01:37.679 Control and Prevention COVID nineteen recommendations are reuniting questions in 0:01:37.720 --> 0:01:40.880 the public health community about who's actually running the agency 0:01:40.959 --> 0:01:44.000 and the answer is no one. And that is what 0:01:44.040 --> 0:01:46.679 you should be scared of. This is really scary. We're 0:01:46.760 --> 0:01:50.400 six months into the Trump administration. This health agency is 0:01:50.480 --> 0:01:53.560 who we need to be tracking the avian flu, to 0:01:53.640 --> 0:01:58.120 be following food borne diseases, to making sure that you know, 0:01:58.320 --> 0:02:01.640 studies are being followed, that drugs that our dangerous are 0:02:01.880 --> 0:02:04.320 being kept off the market, that you know there's the 0:02:04.400 --> 0:02:07.760 CDC is a huge organization with a really important job. 0:02:08.160 --> 0:02:11.600 And what we're seeing here is that RFK Junior, who 0:02:11.639 --> 0:02:14.119 said he needed to be in charge of public health, well, 0:02:14.160 --> 0:02:17.120 he is falling down on the job. He faced questions 0:02:17.720 --> 0:02:20.040 about the direction of the agency and is send hearing 0:02:20.120 --> 0:02:23.480 last month, and he really couldn't answer them. He said 0:02:23.520 --> 0:02:28.000 things like couldn't answer questions, didn't understand what was happening. 0:02:28.480 --> 0:02:31.920 So here's something important from the Health and Human Services 0:02:31.919 --> 0:02:34.760 spokesperson said, the chief of staff has been carrying out 0:02:34.800 --> 0:02:37.280 some of the duties of the CDC director as a 0:02:37.320 --> 0:02:40.320 senior official. So you see what's happening here, right, They're 0:02:40.400 --> 0:02:42.720 just not doing what they're supposed to be doing, and 0:02:43.000 --> 0:02:46.120 it's very inefficient and we're going to see this is 0:02:46.160 --> 0:02:48.280 going to be bad. This is like what we're seeing. 0:02:48.280 --> 0:02:50.360 They're going to be wholes that need to be fixed. 0:02:50.520 --> 0:02:53.200 It's not good. And you know that this is it 0:02:53.320 --> 0:02:55.560 relates to our next story. So I don't want to 0:02:55.600 --> 0:02:58.239 get ahead of ourselves, but this is the CDC that's 0:02:58.240 --> 0:03:02.080 supposed to be following the bird flu and preventing another 0:03:02.600 --> 0:03:06.000 once in a lifetime pandemic from catching hold. And now 0:03:06.160 --> 0:03:08.680 let us move on to the next big problem coming 0:03:08.720 --> 0:03:09.079 to us. 0:03:09.400 --> 0:03:12.040 Yeah, as you said, it's really similar, which is that 0:03:12.280 --> 0:03:15.960 DOSEE fired too many people. They took a chainsaw that 0:03:16.120 --> 0:03:18.240 was really long to this when they should have been 0:03:18.240 --> 0:03:22.080 in with a scalpel. And now we're seeing absolutely horrifying 0:03:22.280 --> 0:03:24.440 issues with this report from the Washington Post. 0:03:24.840 --> 0:03:28.520 So Jesse put this in our schedule to talk about. 0:03:28.639 --> 0:03:31.560 I read it earlier and could not believe what I 0:03:31.639 --> 0:03:34.359 read me And this is a piece. This's a big 0:03:34.400 --> 0:03:38.720 expose in the Washington Post. And basically what they did was, 0:03:38.760 --> 0:03:42.440 at every point they sent these emails and you could see, 0:03:42.480 --> 0:03:44.520 well it was happening, that this was what was going 0:03:44.600 --> 0:03:47.480 to happen. But it is I don't want to say gratifying, 0:03:47.560 --> 0:03:49.880 because all of this is terrible and they're going to 0:03:49.920 --> 0:03:53.200 be huge consequences that none of us can quite game 0:03:53.240 --> 0:03:58.960 out yet. But basically, they offered these resignations to all 0:03:59.080 --> 0:04:03.360 these people, many of whom needed to actually work in 0:04:03.400 --> 0:04:05.600 the federal government. And this is where it is. So 0:04:06.000 --> 0:04:09.680 this piece is really you should definitely read it. It 0:04:09.800 --> 0:04:14.600 explains how at every point they fired people who were necessary, 0:04:14.800 --> 0:04:17.039 then they listed jobs to try to get them to 0:04:17.040 --> 0:04:19.200 come back. A lot of people didn't want to come 0:04:19.240 --> 0:04:22.240 back because now they worry that the federal government is 0:04:22.400 --> 0:04:25.080 not a reasonable place to work anymore. 0:04:25.600 --> 0:04:28.400 Do you mean that essay for the hiring we talked 0:04:28.400 --> 0:04:30.599 about in the last episode. It makes people not want 0:04:30.640 --> 0:04:32.920 to work in an environment like that. I can't imagine 0:04:32.920 --> 0:04:34.480 why they wouldn't want to work with people who did 0:04:34.480 --> 0:04:36.000 a loyalty essay for Trump. 0:04:36.279 --> 0:04:38.800 And it's also I would say, it's like the top 0:04:38.880 --> 0:04:41.680 line is Elon is done with the federal government, but 0:04:41.760 --> 0:04:46.360 the federal government has been just traumatized and injured by Elon. 0:04:46.560 --> 0:04:49.679 And there are so many different parts of the government. 0:04:49.760 --> 0:04:52.080 I mean, so, we just did a story about there's 0:04:52.160 --> 0:04:55.680 no one running the CDC right the Center for Disease Control, 0:04:55.839 --> 0:04:59.479 an extremely important part of the federal government that keeps 0:04:59.560 --> 0:05:03.120 us healthy and safe. Now in this story, there's reporting 0:05:03.440 --> 0:05:06.320 that all these other parts of the State Department, and 0:05:06.360 --> 0:05:08.280 then they tried to rehire the people in the State 0:05:08.320 --> 0:05:10.320 Department and they don't want to come back, and that's 0:05:10.600 --> 0:05:15.599 security overseas. And then you have Trump doing these bands 0:05:15.680 --> 0:05:18.760 from different countries, and you don't have the State Department 0:05:18.920 --> 0:05:22.279 following up on what's happening in those other countries because 0:05:22.279 --> 0:05:25.440 of these bands, and that's going to be really important. 0:05:25.440 --> 0:05:28.240 And then you have in this article it talks about 0:05:28.440 --> 0:05:31.880 how you have people that were fired from all different 0:05:31.920 --> 0:05:35.120 sections like the Department of Agriculture, the Department of Housing 0:05:35.160 --> 0:05:38.279 in Urban Development, the FDA. These are things food and 0:05:38.320 --> 0:05:42.680 drug administration is housing in urban development, that's like housing, 0:05:42.839 --> 0:05:48.320 that's different cities. And then agriculture that's our food safety. 0:05:48.680 --> 0:05:52.760 So there are so many different parts of the federal 0:05:52.800 --> 0:05:56.279 government that have been devastated by the richest man in 0:05:56.320 --> 0:05:59.480 the world who thought it would be cool to pretend 0:05:59.520 --> 0:06:00.600 to work government. 0:06:00.760 --> 0:06:04.880 Yeah, nice cosplaying there, Speaking of people whose job qualifications 0:06:04.880 --> 0:06:07.640 seem like cosplay. I would say yesterday was in the 0:06:07.680 --> 0:06:10.479 top ten funnest days on the Internet. But I was 0:06:10.640 --> 0:06:13.760 really really sad that something that would have made the 0:06:13.839 --> 0:06:16.880 day fun no matter what, got buried, which was Howard 0:06:16.920 --> 0:06:20.560 Blunick testifying in front of Congress and showing what an 0:06:20.600 --> 0:06:25.760 absolute unqualified person years to be running anything this high up. 0:06:25.960 --> 0:06:26.520 Let's listen. 0:06:26.680 --> 0:06:29.919 What's the terriffon bananas? Americans, by the way, love bananas. 0:06:30.200 --> 0:06:32.200 We buy billions of them a year. 0:06:32.640 --> 0:06:33.400 I love bananas. 0:06:33.400 --> 0:06:35.000 What's the terriffon bananas? 0:06:37.080 --> 0:06:40.680 The tariffone bananas would be representative of the countries that 0:06:40.760 --> 0:06:44.880 produced and what what's that terraff generally ten percent? Correct? 0:06:44.920 --> 0:06:48.680 Ten percent? Walmart has already increased the cost of bananas 0:06:48.720 --> 0:06:49.560 by eight percent. 0:06:50.160 --> 0:06:53.359 As untrust who deals with us, that will go to 0:06:53.560 --> 0:06:56.000 zero as countries do deals right now. 0:06:56.839 --> 0:07:00.720 American consumer now and on the businesses with the confus Now, 0:07:01.360 --> 0:07:05.359 mister Secretary, I believe you know better. I believe you 0:07:05.480 --> 0:07:08.839 recognize that a trade deficit is not something to fear. 0:07:08.920 --> 0:07:13.960 I believe you know that predictability, stability is essential for businesses. 0:07:14.440 --> 0:07:19.520 I wish you would show that truth to this administration. 0:07:19.160 --> 0:07:22.520 And I yeope, back ladies my mind. 0:07:22.640 --> 0:07:25.400 Mister Tairman, if I make one quick comment to the end, 0:07:25.600 --> 0:07:28.160 that'd be okay. I'm sorry, would you mind if I 0:07:28.200 --> 0:07:30.360 make one quick comment to the representative? 0:07:30.520 --> 0:07:31.720 Please? Uh? 0:07:31.800 --> 0:07:32.880 There is no uncertainty. 0:07:32.920 --> 0:07:35.560 If you build in America and you produce your product 0:07:35.600 --> 0:07:37.280 in America, there will be no task. 0:07:37.640 --> 0:07:39.600 We can't be hung as aling in. 0:07:39.560 --> 0:07:43.240 America and pay no tax. You cannot, very very clear. 0:07:43.080 --> 0:07:45.560 You cannot fighting build that as in America. 0:07:46.600 --> 0:07:48.480 Time with the general Lady has expired. 0:07:49.160 --> 0:07:53.560 Wait, you can't build bananas in America. 0:07:53.600 --> 0:07:57.200 It is so far this discussion of on shoring things. 0:07:57.520 --> 0:08:00.800 What it's like, so many these jobs we don't Americans doing, 0:08:00.800 --> 0:08:03.520 and that was what we worked on for seventy five years. 0:08:03.640 --> 0:08:06.080 And then there's just things that are not able to 0:08:06.120 --> 0:08:07.840 be done in our climate. 0:08:08.080 --> 0:08:13.080 Speak for yourself. I'm building American bananas right here. Baby, No, 0:08:13.320 --> 0:08:17.560 this isn't completely insane. And what you don't see, because 0:08:18.280 --> 0:08:22.120 this is audio and now video, is that he has 0:08:22.200 --> 0:08:29.360 this enormous qrin on his face. That is absolutely it just. 0:08:29.600 --> 0:08:31.400 Is so he thought he killed it. 0:08:31.520 --> 0:08:34.120 Yeah, he thinks he killed it. I think that is 0:08:34.200 --> 0:08:37.400 absolutely he thinks he killed it. And my man, he 0:08:37.480 --> 0:08:40.520 did not kill it. It's just very annoying, I mean, 0:08:40.800 --> 0:08:43.160 and also so insane. 0:08:43.440 --> 0:08:46.960 We have more incompetent hires that are totally unqualified for 0:08:47.000 --> 0:08:49.320 their job this time, though it's much more in the 0:08:49.320 --> 0:08:52.199 comical way of that. We have a twenty two year 0:08:52.200 --> 0:08:56.320 old former gardener picked to lead the Terrorism Prevention Department 0:08:56.320 --> 0:08:58.600 of Homeland Security named Thomas Fugate. 0:08:58.960 --> 0:09:02.000 Yeah. I mean, and this is you know, this is 0:09:02.240 --> 0:09:06.920 this story relates to the story about the CDC, relates 0:09:06.960 --> 0:09:12.440 to the story about everything else they are. They're defenestrating 0:09:12.480 --> 0:09:15.080 the federal government, and they're going to be consequences. I 0:09:15.080 --> 0:09:17.480 hope there aren't, but it really seems like they're going 0:09:17.480 --> 0:09:23.880 to be. And it's just such a incredibly insane moment 0:09:23.960 --> 0:09:27.360 in American life and just so fucked up. Excuse my 0:09:27.440 --> 0:09:35.880 fact Stuart Stevens is a legendary campaign manager and the 0:09:35.920 --> 0:09:40.000 author of the Conspiracy to in America Five Ways My 0:09:40.200 --> 0:09:44.240 Old Party is driving our democracy to autocracy. Welcome to 0:09:44.360 --> 0:09:46.160 Fast Politics, Stuart Stevens. 0:09:46.720 --> 0:09:48.959 Thank you, Molly. I've got to use this as a 0:09:49.000 --> 0:09:51.840 shout out for your book. It's really extraordinary. It really 0:09:51.880 --> 0:09:53.160 is an amazing piece of writing. 0:09:53.480 --> 0:09:56.320 Well, thank you. I really appreciate that. And you know, 0:09:56.600 --> 0:10:00.800 Stuart is actually really incredible. You are a boot beautiful writer, 0:10:00.880 --> 0:10:03.760 and you write tends not to be political, writing tends 0:10:03.800 --> 0:10:07.520 not to be so lyrical, and you write very lyrically. 0:10:07.600 --> 0:10:10.480 So I really appreciate that from you. And now we 0:10:10.559 --> 0:10:15.240 must talk about your mad cap idea, which I love 0:10:15.280 --> 0:10:19.400 it so much. It's also just super interesting. So talk 0:10:19.480 --> 0:10:21.200 me through this idea. 0:10:20.920 --> 0:10:25.120 The idea of nationalizing Starlink. And yeah, the deeply troubling 0:10:25.160 --> 0:10:26.880 thing about this is that I seem to agree with 0:10:26.920 --> 0:10:30.120 Steve mannon, but I'm trying to get over that. Look, 0:10:30.160 --> 0:10:33.679 I mean this in all seriousness, never if we had 0:10:33.760 --> 0:10:41.360 one person so deeply embedded into essential related national security industries. 0:10:41.480 --> 0:10:47.400 Companies Starlink and SpaceX are critical elements of American national 0:10:47.400 --> 0:10:51.679 security and of America's power in the world. So, I mean, 0:10:51.720 --> 0:10:53.120 if I just woke up in the Middle nine and said, 0:10:53.160 --> 0:10:55.440 what if we had a guy who you know, has 0:10:55.480 --> 0:10:59.800 a well reported, very high level drug problem, unstable obviously 0:11:00.200 --> 0:11:04.240 mental issues, and he's the person that runs these companies, 0:11:04.920 --> 0:11:07.720 he'd probably say that's really not a great idea. There 0:11:07.760 --> 0:11:10.679 is this thing called the Defense Procurement Act, which is 0:11:10.760 --> 0:11:14.280 passed in nineteen fifty. It was actually updated in nineteen 0:11:14.320 --> 0:11:19.600 seventy to specifically include anything related to space, and in 0:11:19.720 --> 0:11:22.800 earlier versions, the first was around World War One they 0:11:23.480 --> 0:11:26.880 came up with It gives the government in times of 0:11:27.280 --> 0:11:33.079 national emergency the power to direct or nationalize industries, and 0:11:33.120 --> 0:11:37.200 it's been used before from the railways to mining and 0:11:38.000 --> 0:11:42.240 various ways with steel companies. So Republicans say that we 0:11:42.280 --> 0:11:44.600 are in a national emergency, they say that we are 0:11:44.720 --> 0:11:49.800 at war. That's what they used to justify the use 0:11:49.960 --> 0:11:54.000 of the Alien Act, and they call it a regular warfare. 0:11:54.520 --> 0:11:57.280 So if I was a Democrat, though now that Steve 0:11:57.320 --> 0:11:59.439 Bannon has supported this idea, maybe you don't have to 0:11:59.440 --> 0:12:01.959 be a Democrat, I. 0:12:01.880 --> 0:12:03.080 Would take you face value. 0:12:03.120 --> 0:12:06.679 Okay, great, right, we're in a national emergency where it 0:12:06.760 --> 0:12:11.640 war that gives the government the power to nationalize SpaceX 0:12:11.640 --> 0:12:12.280 and Starlink. 0:12:12.559 --> 0:12:17.640 So as a conservative, it's a pretty bold idea. I 0:12:17.679 --> 0:12:22.360 don't think it's wrong. But so the theory of the 0:12:22.400 --> 0:12:25.640 case here is that I think Tesla it doesn't. It 0:12:25.760 --> 0:12:27.679 is sort of a rounding error. But there are two 0:12:28.160 --> 0:12:32.160 companies that Elon Muss that has had that our owns 0:12:32.240 --> 0:12:35.360 that are where he is the largest stockholder of SpaceX 0:12:35.440 --> 0:12:39.360 is actually a private company that he has built through 0:12:39.480 --> 0:12:45.439 government subsidies and a lot of incentive advising with taxes, 0:12:45.920 --> 0:12:47.920 and they have made him the richest band in the world. 0:12:47.960 --> 0:12:52.880 And one is Starlink and one is SpaceX and starlink 0:12:53.280 --> 0:12:56.400 is And again this runs to the idea that you 0:12:56.559 --> 0:13:00.800 have a problem, which is you need SpaceX for satellites 0:13:01.120 --> 0:13:06.360 and also space exploration. You need Starlink for all of 0:13:06.400 --> 0:13:10.000 the stuff that's already in space and yeah, the communication. 0:13:10.320 --> 0:13:13.920 And again Trump tweeted yesterday about canceling a lot of 0:13:13.920 --> 0:13:17.800 Elon's contracts. But there is no other company that can 0:13:17.840 --> 0:13:23.239 do this. So we got here because government refused to regulate. 0:13:23.440 --> 0:13:26.080 I mean, explain is how we got here that we 0:13:26.160 --> 0:13:28.120 have one company that does these things. 0:13:28.760 --> 0:13:33.400 It's interesting because wearing my conservative hat. You could make 0:13:33.440 --> 0:13:35.599 a good case that this goes to the efficiency of 0:13:35.640 --> 0:13:40.199 the marketplace. You had a guy who is extraordinarily gifted, 0:13:40.240 --> 0:13:43.800 if deeply disturbed. So had this been set up by 0:13:43.920 --> 0:13:47.280 NASA from the beginning, you would have had security clearances 0:13:47.280 --> 0:13:49.599 that would have include drug testing, and you wouldn't have 0:13:49.640 --> 0:13:53.880 an elone muff anywhere near this thing. So that's positive. 0:13:54.200 --> 0:13:57.240 But now that it is what it is, one person 0:13:57.240 --> 0:13:59.920 should not be allowed to have this power, particularly someone 0:14:00.080 --> 0:14:03.880 who has such terrible judgment, is obviously in some sort 0:14:03.920 --> 0:14:07.160 of manic personal crisis. And we have a perfect example 0:14:07.200 --> 0:14:11.120 of his insertion of himself in world events when he 0:14:11.240 --> 0:14:17.600 refused in twenty twenty two Ukraine, Yeah, of twenty twenty 0:14:17.600 --> 0:14:21.120 two to allow Ukraine, I mean, just picture this. Ukraine 0:14:21.120 --> 0:14:24.520 had set up the first use of one of their 0:14:24.560 --> 0:14:29.200 now sort of famous water drones, these water power drones 0:14:29.240 --> 0:14:34.400 that carry explosives that they've used to somehow for a 0:14:34.400 --> 0:14:37.440 country that didn't have a navy to defeat the Russian navy. 0:14:37.600 --> 0:14:42.080 So they are seventy kilometers away from their target, which 0:14:42.200 --> 0:14:47.520 was the Muskova flagship, and Elon musk turned off the 0:14:47.560 --> 0:14:50.560 starlink and refused to turn it back on. That is 0:14:51.520 --> 0:14:56.480 extremely dangerous, and there is this weird affinity would be 0:14:56.560 --> 0:14:59.560 the most positive way to put it. Of this group 0:14:59.600 --> 0:15:03.760 of South Africans that he is part of. Sex is 0:15:03.760 --> 0:15:10.040 another one. They have this soft spot for Russia, probably 0:15:10.120 --> 0:15:15.160 but no other reason. It's an oligarch's paradise and they 0:15:15.160 --> 0:15:20.680 are oligarchs or would be firing and they have elections 0:15:20.680 --> 0:15:24.440 that are performative, not determinative, which they obviously you know. 0:15:24.880 --> 0:15:28.240 I just I think it should be done. I think 0:15:28.280 --> 0:15:32.120 if you had any sort of seriousness about national security, 0:15:32.760 --> 0:15:36.280 you would step back from this and say, regardless of 0:15:36.320 --> 0:15:40.320 how we got here, we're here and we can't allow 0:15:40.360 --> 0:15:41.320 this to continue. 0:15:41.560 --> 0:15:43.880 I think it's going to be hard to convince people 0:15:43.920 --> 0:15:46.280 to do that because I think the public markets aren't 0:15:46.280 --> 0:15:48.760 going to like it. I understand the need for it 0:15:48.840 --> 0:15:53.240 because Elon is very erratic, and he's running these companies 0:15:53.280 --> 0:15:55.560 in a very erratic way, and there are certain things 0:15:55.560 --> 0:16:01.160 that are needed from Starlank and SpaceX that you know, 0:16:01.400 --> 0:16:07.440 his personal peccadillos are hurting right like, there are people 0:16:07.560 --> 0:16:10.840 up in the space station who need to be okay, 0:16:10.920 --> 0:16:16.280 there are people in Alabama or rural Kentucky or you know, 0:16:16.320 --> 0:16:20.040 where they need to make sure the satellites, or Ukraine 0:16:20.320 --> 0:16:22.680 where they need to make sure the satellites are working. 0:16:23.120 --> 0:16:27.560 So there is a need that is beyond what Elon's 0:16:27.560 --> 0:16:30.360 personal piccadillos are. But the worry I think a lot 0:16:30.400 --> 0:16:32.040 of us on the both the left and the right, 0:16:32.160 --> 0:16:35.240 is that once you start taking over private companies, it's 0:16:35.280 --> 0:16:36.840 a very slippery slope. 0:16:37.040 --> 0:16:38.560 Yeah, it's look, it's been used before. 0:16:38.600 --> 0:16:41.680 It's always been unpopular with those that are connected to 0:16:41.720 --> 0:16:46.840 the companies, right understandable, going back to when they nationalized 0:16:46.840 --> 0:16:49.840 a lot of use of the railroads, uh, going into 0:16:50.400 --> 0:16:52.720 the US entry into World War One. I think it's 0:16:52.840 --> 0:16:55.840 like everything in life, you have to balance the good right, 0:16:56.640 --> 0:17:01.640 And there's really no two companies that are as deeply 0:17:01.800 --> 0:17:04.000 involved in national security. 0:17:04.400 --> 0:17:04.560 You know. 0:17:04.640 --> 0:17:07.960 This isn't a case of your nationalizing Tesla to get 0:17:08.000 --> 0:17:12.000 FOURD to break or to help Toyota and Tesla, which 0:17:12.040 --> 0:17:14.359 is really the source of most of his wealth. And 0:17:14.400 --> 0:17:16.119 of course, which is one of the reasons they've had 0:17:16.200 --> 0:17:21.280 this extraordinary higher technical fight is Trump wants to cut 0:17:21.320 --> 0:17:25.439 to EV credits and until recently, the only money that 0:17:25.480 --> 0:17:29.280 Tesla made was from EV credits. They were basically an 0:17:29.320 --> 0:17:32.520 ev credit company that also made cars. You take that 0:17:32.600 --> 0:17:38.719 away and the value Tesla's extraordinarily overvalued company. 0:17:38.880 --> 0:17:40.720 Right, Yes, for sure it will. 0:17:40.520 --> 0:17:44.200 Go down, but that's fine. I mean, Tesla's not necessary 0:17:44.560 --> 0:17:48.520 to have financial security. I mean, all my neighbors in 0:17:48.560 --> 0:17:52.240 Santa Monica can make do a print wood will survive. 0:17:54.320 --> 0:18:00.399 But there ought to be responsible adults connected with the 0:18:00.440 --> 0:18:03.920 best interest in the United States government that are at 0:18:03.920 --> 0:18:07.200 this point running starlink and running SpaceX. 0:18:07.800 --> 0:18:09.160 Right, pay him a bunch. 0:18:08.960 --> 0:18:11.240 Of money, right by it from them. 0:18:11.480 --> 0:18:13.200 United States government has a lot of money. You don't 0:18:13.200 --> 0:18:15.399 have to just seize it. Pay them a lot of money. 0:18:15.440 --> 0:18:15.880 That's fine. 0:18:15.960 --> 0:18:19.360 So you feel like it's an imminent domain question. 0:18:19.119 --> 0:18:20.280 Exactly like imminent domain. 0:18:20.320 --> 0:18:22.840 That's a very good it's a very good example, and 0:18:22.880 --> 0:18:27.040 we use it, and it's controversial, and those that are 0:18:27.200 --> 0:18:29.200 eminently domained out usually don't worry. 0:18:29.240 --> 0:18:29.320 Right. 0:18:30.119 --> 0:18:33.800 But I just think that you can't unsee what we've 0:18:33.840 --> 0:18:36.440 seen in the last forty eight hours. 0:18:36.080 --> 0:18:38.000 Right, this is not a person who should be in 0:18:38.119 --> 0:18:39.480 charge of National Saturday. 0:18:39.760 --> 0:18:41.920 I mean you could say, okay, here's a guy. He's 0:18:42.000 --> 0:18:44.720 jumping up and down behind it. You know, President of 0:18:44.720 --> 0:18:47.159 the United States. You look at that footage in the 0:18:47.200 --> 0:18:51.000 Oval Office, and you know, there's not a teenage in 0:18:51.040 --> 0:18:53.160 America that would walk into their home in that kind 0:18:53.160 --> 0:18:55.080 of condition and not know that they're going to be 0:18:55.119 --> 0:18:58.320 busted by their parents. How deeply into drugs do you 0:18:58.400 --> 0:19:03.040 have to be that you can't restrain yourself the morning 0:19:03.240 --> 0:19:05.800 of knowing that you're going to have meeting in the 0:19:05.800 --> 0:19:09.200 Oval Office that's going to be televised. You know, if 0:19:09.200 --> 0:19:11.639 you can't kind of hold it together for that, that 0:19:11.760 --> 0:19:15.680 is a serious indication of a serious problem. 0:19:16.080 --> 0:19:18.240 Right. I mean, we don't want to speculate, but there 0:19:18.240 --> 0:19:23.040 certainly has been reporting in the Wallstreet Journal about a 0:19:23.119 --> 0:19:25.040 box of pills and this and that. 0:19:26.040 --> 0:19:28.520 You also said, did he use this kind of meine? Right, 0:19:28.760 --> 0:19:32.200 and we can now use Donald Trump as a source, right. 0:19:32.040 --> 0:19:35.400 Well, Donald Trump, the two of them did definitely get 0:19:35.440 --> 0:19:41.280 involved in a lot of pretty insane no name calling. 0:19:41.600 --> 0:19:45.080 So right now there are a lot of people who 0:19:45.119 --> 0:19:48.880 want Elan and Trump to sort of take it all down, right, 0:19:49.000 --> 0:19:53.640 they are de accelerate, d you know whatever, stop fighting. 0:19:53.880 --> 0:19:57.000 This is a bad situation for people like Mike Johnson. 0:19:57.680 --> 0:20:03.119 This is a bad situation for people like Anna, Paulina 0:20:03.240 --> 0:20:06.879 Luna or any member of the House goop who is 0:20:06.960 --> 0:20:10.760 got to choose between their richest benefactor and their political 0:20:11.520 --> 0:20:15.400 north star. Do you think, and this is something already 0:20:15.440 --> 0:20:19.080 we're seeing this, do you think like this bill could 0:20:19.160 --> 0:20:25.439 get crashed just by Elon? Should Democrats be pushing that 0:20:25.920 --> 0:20:32.119 even if Elon pash the bill is something totally different 0:20:32.200 --> 0:20:34.240 than why Democrats want to crash it. 0:20:34.840 --> 0:20:37.920 I think that what Democrats have to learn to do 0:20:38.240 --> 0:20:41.400 is to use whatever tools they have available and not 0:20:41.440 --> 0:20:43.520 to feel that like this is beneath me or that 0:20:43.600 --> 0:20:47.320 is right. You can't allow yourself to luxury of pretending 0:20:48.240 --> 0:20:50.439 that the greater good is served by acting like a 0:20:50.520 --> 0:20:56.160 normal governing party. Right, as Jonathan last that brilliantly pointed out, 0:20:56.240 --> 0:20:59.600 we don't need opposition party now, we need a dissident movement. 0:20:59.840 --> 0:21:02.919 So this is a terrible bill for any reason. So 0:21:03.000 --> 0:21:05.720 he didn't need Elon, But the degree to which Elon 0:21:05.800 --> 0:21:09.560 can be useful in this, I think they should grasp 0:21:09.600 --> 0:21:12.680 it and beat him over the head with it. And look, 0:21:12.720 --> 0:21:15.399 this is also just we should not lose sight of 0:21:15.440 --> 0:21:17.400 the fact this is terrible for the country. 0:21:18.040 --> 0:21:21.360 Right, no deep off medicaid. 0:21:21.320 --> 0:21:25.080 Today's no, just this fight is terrible country. The bill 0:21:25.160 --> 0:21:29.719 is terrible too, But today's anniversary of D Day. Yeah, 0:21:29.760 --> 0:21:32.679 but think about what America was doing then and what 0:21:33.080 --> 0:21:38.520 the leadership, the sacrifice, and the image that it secured 0:21:38.600 --> 0:21:43.040 for America's place in the world as a flawed but 0:21:43.400 --> 0:21:48.920 instrument of greater good compared to this fight between two 0:21:49.160 --> 0:21:54.720 deeply flawed, horrible human beings who are two of the 0:21:54.760 --> 0:21:57.679 most powerful people in the world. I mean, it's just 0:21:58.119 --> 0:22:01.239 how far are we falling? Publicans are to blame for this. 0:22:01.640 --> 0:22:04.040 They didn't have to tolerate this, and they've allowed it 0:22:04.080 --> 0:22:04.520 to happen. 0:22:04.880 --> 0:22:08.240 So talk to me about what this looks like now. 0:22:08.320 --> 0:22:12.320 So Democrats really could and I think they should think 0:22:12.359 --> 0:22:14.840 about trying to sink this thing with the help of 0:22:14.840 --> 0:22:18.200 Elon Musk, because Keal and Musks people want it gone. 0:22:18.640 --> 0:22:21.680 This bill, if it passes, will kick people off Medicaid, 0:22:21.760 --> 0:22:24.560 it will cut food stamps for poor kids, It will 0:22:24.680 --> 0:22:28.440 just do everything, and it will extend these ridiculous tax cuts. 0:22:28.640 --> 0:22:30.919 And it will also open the door to no tax 0:22:30.960 --> 0:22:33.680 on tips. How that will work, I have no idea 0:22:33.880 --> 0:22:34.560 talk about that. 0:22:34.840 --> 0:22:37.920 Look, I think the Democrats should have a greater ambition 0:22:38.040 --> 0:22:41.359 than just stopping this bill. They should use what's happened 0:22:41.400 --> 0:22:44.439 with Musk as one of the instruments to undo and 0:22:44.480 --> 0:22:48.240 get all these Doze cronies out of government. I mean, 0:22:48.400 --> 0:22:51.040 just stop and think the guy that we have seen 0:22:51.080 --> 0:22:53.760 in the last twenty four hours. Would you trust him 0:22:53.760 --> 0:22:55.439 to hire someone to paint your house? 0:22:55.960 --> 0:22:56.200 Now? 0:22:56.320 --> 0:22:56.480