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Speaker 1: Hey, welcome in, Doug Gottlieb here. Welcome into All Ball,

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Speaker 1: my all basketball podcast. By the way, uh, if you

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Speaker 1: didn't have us in your queue and you didn't note

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Speaker 1: last week's with Adam Morrison, UM, we cranked up and

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Speaker 1: had like six thousand new downloads. The numbers are crazy

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Speaker 1: for the downloads last week, but feel free to look

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Speaker 1: back and it was a great conversation. This week's guest

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Speaker 1: is none of them Dan Patrick. To those you know

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Speaker 1: who know d P, of course, Dan Patrick show he's

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Speaker 1: done just about everything in the business. But he was

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Speaker 1: a college basketball player at Eastern Kentucky and then I

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Speaker 1: think at Dayton. We'll catch up with him in a moment.

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Speaker 1: He was a high school basketball star in a small

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Speaker 1: town in southeastern Ohio, not far outside of Cincinnati. Dad

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Speaker 1: taught at u D at Daton before he transferred to

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Speaker 1: U D. We'll get to all that. Um Danny's a

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Speaker 1: good friend and we're gonna talk all things hoop with

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Speaker 1: Dan Patrick. I just want to say this about UM

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Speaker 1: Team USA, and while I understand we're going to be

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Speaker 1: better when we have better players, you have Steph Curry,

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Speaker 1: who has already said he wants to play in the Olympics,

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Speaker 1: which means he's gonna play in the Olympics. You look

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Speaker 1: around the NBA, You're like, we're gonna be better with

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Speaker 1: better players. But we should have had better players than

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Speaker 1: teams that played and we still, you know, weren't really

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Speaker 1: competitive for a Metal Serbia beatas Um. You know, they

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Speaker 1: split obviously in the lead up games in Australia, and

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Speaker 1: some of it, you know, you'd have to put out

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Speaker 1: as players. Some of it is kind of simulating a

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Speaker 1: coaching style to a very different sport, but some of

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Speaker 1: it is what Kobe said, which is the world has improved.

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Speaker 1: And I thought it was a smart point that Kobe

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Speaker 1: made where he said, hey, we had to have some

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Speaker 1: things go our way to escape Spain with the Radeem team.

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Speaker 1: Why are people surprised that these foreign teams are so good?

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Speaker 1: The world is catching us and the style of officiating,

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Speaker 1: the style of play does benefit them more than our

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Speaker 1: supreme athleticism, and it's not a style we play all

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Speaker 1: year long. So I'm in agreement. I think we're in

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Speaker 1: for dog fights. We used to be to the point

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Speaker 1: where after maybe the redeem team, we could have gone

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Speaker 1: back to the college kids and been willing to lose

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Speaker 1: games and say, hey, we're gonna do the real amateur thing.

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Speaker 1: But since we're not doing that and we're gonna be

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Speaker 1: USA basketball, I think will be fine in the Olympics,

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Speaker 1: but I think for years to come it's gonna get

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Speaker 1: increasingly difficult as countries become more and more invested in

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Speaker 1: their basketball programs. So do I think we're not the

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Speaker 1: superpower we used to be. No, I think we have

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Speaker 1: the greatest depth of talent uh this world over. But

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Speaker 1: I also will tell you that even once we get

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Speaker 1: our top line talent to play in the Olympics, it's

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Speaker 1: still is not gonna be easy, and it would not

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Speaker 1: would not be crazy if we lost a medal game.

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Speaker 1: Wouldn't be crazy you at all, because the three point

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Speaker 1: shot is the Oakloman equalizer, because the style of basketball

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Speaker 1: is so different, and because you know, I'm not sure

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Speaker 1: that the way in which we play youth and collegiant basketball,

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Speaker 1: maybe if an NBA basketball is conducive to playing team

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Speaker 1: basketball in the physical style which you see in FIBA.

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Speaker 1: Be sure to catch live editions of The Doug got

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Speaker 1: Leaps Show weekdays at noon eastern three pm Pacific on

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Speaker 1: Fox Sports Radio and the I Heart Radio app. All right,

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Speaker 1: let's get to our next guest. Who is uh, the

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Speaker 1: incomparable Dan Patrick, known for the Big Show Sports Center

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Speaker 1: of course to Dan Patrick Show, which he hosts now

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Speaker 1: and he broke off and for thirteen years he's hosted

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Speaker 1: down the Audience Network. He's done Super Bowls, he's done

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Speaker 1: NBA drafts, He's done just about everything. Let's welcome in

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Speaker 1: the one and only Dan Patrick. Dan, Let's let's begin.

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Speaker 1: You grew up in where Mason, Ohio. Paint the picture

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Speaker 1: of Mason, Ohio. You're growing up with a gaggle of

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Speaker 1: brothers and sisters, probably like Mayberry a little bit. It

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Speaker 1: was pretty insulated, pretty isolated. You keep doors unlocked. Uh.

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Speaker 1: My parents didn't worry where I was, and I spent

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Speaker 1: most of the time at the middle school outside morning,

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Speaker 1: noon and night shooting hoops, played baseball, My brothers played football,

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Speaker 1: and a family of six. It was pretty idyllic. I

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Speaker 1: mean when you look back on it, um, you know,

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Speaker 1: we had a lot of freedom, and uh, you know,

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Speaker 1: I had nothing to great memories. Okay, so why what

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Speaker 1: about what drew you to basketball? When did you first

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Speaker 1: start playing? What was it to me? I remember reading

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Speaker 1: my name in the paper in fifth grade amongst the

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Speaker 1: top scores in the fifth grade league, and I was

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Speaker 1: addicted to it. I just i'd stare at the box

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Speaker 1: store and and it was just in a small you know,

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Speaker 1: the local paper. But I remember I got the sixth grade,

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Speaker 1: I was like, I want to put up some numbers here.

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Speaker 1: And then I started playing junior high ball, and it

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Speaker 1: was same thing, and I don't know, just something about it,

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Speaker 1: like I became obsessed. And it wasn't that I was

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Speaker 1: a gunner. It was just I couldn't score enough. I

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Speaker 1: could never ever as soon as you score, I just

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Speaker 1: had this crazy mentality of I gotta get the ball back, score,

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Speaker 1: I gotta get the ball back. Now. It's like I said,

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Speaker 1: I wasn't a gunner, because I think I was second

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Speaker 1: or led led my league and assist, but I also

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Speaker 1: led it in scoring. I was just I was fascinated

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Speaker 1: with stats, fascinated with numbers and that ability to score.

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Speaker 1: I love the sound of the net. Nothing better than

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Speaker 1: if you put the net up on the rim and

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Speaker 1: they had to stop play and get the broom out.

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Speaker 1: Like so it's just small things that attract me to it.

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Speaker 1: But that first time I saw my name in the

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Speaker 1: paper with you know, twelve points and I was like, God,

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Speaker 1: that is awesome. Um, that's called hanging the net, right,

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Speaker 1: And I don't know if you know this, remember me

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Speaker 1: reading Steve Alford's book when I was a kid, and

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Speaker 1: Steve Alford would end every workout by hanging the net

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Speaker 1: like that was that was his thing. And I believe,

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Speaker 1: I believe he asked his wife to marry him because

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Speaker 1: he and the way he did it was he hung

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Speaker 1: the net and then you know, he had the ladder

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Speaker 1: to go up and have her go up and fix it,

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Speaker 1: and then like the ring was up there. I think

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Speaker 1: that's I think that's actually okay. So Southeastern Ohio, were

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Speaker 1: you a Kentucky fit? Like what was your fandom growing up? Like?

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Speaker 1: Who was the who is the hoop guy? You looked

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Speaker 1: up to college pro? What was it? Well, it's fortunate

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Speaker 1: that we had the Cincinnati Royals in town and nobody

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Speaker 1: wants to see them. We would sneak into those games

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Speaker 1: and I got to see at the tail end of

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Speaker 1: Oscar Robertson's career as a Royal, and then they Archibald

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Speaker 1: came in and I fell in love with a five

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Speaker 1: ft ten left hander who went left every single time,

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Speaker 1: and he was just he was fascinating to see him.

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Speaker 1: And I got to see every great team come in

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Speaker 1: from you know that that Laker team that won thirty

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Speaker 1: three in a row. I saw the Knicks, you know,

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Speaker 1: the championship mix. I saw Earl Monroe, I saw Maravich

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Speaker 1: come in. So I was I just I was very,

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Speaker 1: very lucky to be able to have that. We also

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Speaker 1: had the big Red Machine at the time. And then

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Speaker 1: I followed the University of Dayton basketball, in the University

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Speaker 1: of Cincinnati basketball. He was a fan of Beau Lamar

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Speaker 1: in south West Louisiana. Uh I loved the guy who

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Speaker 1: led the nation in scoring. There was just something about

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Speaker 1: I followed them Bird Everett, uh Larry Fogel who was

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Speaker 1: at Southwest Louisiana with Beau Lamar and went to Canisius. Uh.

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Speaker 1: So I once again it came down to numbers. I

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Speaker 1: would get the stats after every Cincinnati Royals game from

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Speaker 1: the play by play guy Don Valentino, and I just

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Speaker 1: study him. I just study everything about you know, how

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Speaker 1: many shots, how many assists, blocks, steals, everything, And uh,

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Speaker 1: I was very fortunate Cincinnati Bearcats. Gail Catlett was the

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Speaker 1: head coach Miami of Ohio. Guy that I went to

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Speaker 1: basketball camp with Randy Airs played at Miami. Uh, you know,

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Speaker 1: so I Darryl Headrick was head coach, so I had

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Speaker 1: basketball surrounding me. Some of it was really good and

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Speaker 1: the Royals weren't good, but they were entertaining. Okay, So

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Speaker 1: uh you end up having what what looks like you

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Speaker 1: know again, and this is more from going and reading

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Speaker 1: your background, having a stellar high school career. How good

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Speaker 1: were you? How good was your team? Team started out

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Speaker 1: real good and we lost in the first round of

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Speaker 1: the tournament. And I was devastated because I, you know,

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Speaker 1: we we were really good and should have been great.

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Speaker 1: And then I didn't know what I was gonna do

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Speaker 1: because I should have gone to a smaller school. I

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Speaker 1: was third team All State, Honorable Mention All Americans, and

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Speaker 1: I just kept waiting, like is the like where where

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Speaker 1: are these phone calls? So I would get letters. Bigger

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Speaker 1: Phelps sent two letters to me, one to say he

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Speaker 1: was interested in me, another one to say he wasn't

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Speaker 1: interested in me. And you know, I appreciated that. B

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Speaker 1: YU was another place air Force at captain, but I

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Speaker 1: I kept thinking, I'm gonna somebody's wanting somebody's gotta want me. Now,

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Speaker 1: we didn't have the three point shot, and I think

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Speaker 1: had we had that, then you know, it would have

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Speaker 1: been a lot easier for me. And I remember playing

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Speaker 1: against a guy in my league who went to Eastern

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Speaker 1: Kentucky and he was playing basketball and I I said, well,

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Speaker 1: I'm better than Jeff Howard. And for some reason, and

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Speaker 1: I still don't know, my parents never said anything about

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Speaker 1: where I should go. Um. My dad didn't want me

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Speaker 1: to go to Air Force because my dad was a marine,

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Speaker 1: and he said, you're not a fly boy, um, And

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Speaker 1: so I uh, I walked on in Eastern Kentucky. And

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Speaker 1: I to this day, I still can't tell you why

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Speaker 1: I did it and why somebody didn't stop me. But

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Speaker 1: I got to play. I played junior varsity both years,

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Speaker 1: and I had a ball because I just got to

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Speaker 1: shoot as much as I wanted to. And I had

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Speaker 1: a coach who knew I should have gone some other

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Speaker 1: place or been able to play for the varsity. But

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Speaker 1: the coach didn't like me. Coach called me golden boy,

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Speaker 1: never called me by my name, and Bob Bob Molkey,

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Speaker 1: and he just he would yell at me, you know,

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Speaker 1: during scrimmages and by golly, golden boy, get out, and

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Speaker 1: then he would send me over, you know, like I

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Speaker 1: just and I said, I couldn't wait for junior varsity games.

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Speaker 1: Like we played at Freedom Hall, we played at Marshall.

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Speaker 1: We we played in a lot of fun places. And

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Speaker 1: I remember I put up twenty five shots one time

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Speaker 1: and I I was like, this is awesome. And I

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Speaker 1: got to shoot whenever I wanted to, as much as

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Speaker 1: I wanted to, and I knew that it didn't matter

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Speaker 1: how good I was, I wasn't going to get called

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Speaker 1: up to the varsity. And it took me a little while.

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Speaker 1: As soon as the season ended, I called my dad,

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Speaker 1: who was a computer programmer at the University of dat

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Speaker 1: and I said, I think I'm a transfer. And he said,

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Speaker 1: you know, coach Donna, or the legendary coach down Donner,

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Speaker 1: doesn't take transfers. And I said, I don't care. I

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Speaker 1: need to figure out what I'm gonna do with my life.

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Speaker 1: My brother at the time was on the radio at

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Speaker 1: uh Dayton w v D, wonderful campus radio station, so

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Speaker 1: my dad worked there two older brothers went there and

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Speaker 1: I just went to day and I torched people in

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Speaker 1: inner murals. I was an angry, angry guy. I wanted

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Speaker 1: to put up fifty because I wanted coach donnaher to

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Speaker 1: notice that I was on campus. And I'd go against

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Speaker 1: the back court Jack Zimmerman and Doug Harris, wonderful players,

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Speaker 1: and I'd play against them, and I, you know, John

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Speaker 1: Paxson played against him in summer league, Like I wanted

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Speaker 1: to embarrass these guys, and and you know, for no

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Speaker 1: other reason than I didn't get to play and they did.

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Speaker 1: And I remember that Jim Paxson, uh what, he dunked

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Speaker 1: on me one time and we joke about it. He

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Speaker 1: also stold my girlfriend like I think that he did.

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Speaker 1: I want wait, wait, wait, wait wait, Jim Paxas to

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Speaker 1: your girlfriend, Yeah, how how did this happen? Well, my

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Speaker 1: girlfriend was a cheerleader and was in love with Jim

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Speaker 1: Pacton and you know would tell me that openly told

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Speaker 1: me that. And then I don't know if he stole

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Speaker 1: or he borrowed her, and you know, they saw each

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Speaker 1: other and dated. I don't know what happened, but so

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Speaker 1: we like you were actually dating her and then she said,

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Speaker 1: you found out she was cheating on you or she

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Speaker 1: dumped you and started dating him, Like, how did it go?

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Speaker 1: Do this story? I need to know she might have

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Speaker 1: dumped me. But you know, in my mind, you know,

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Speaker 1: like it took two years to realize I wasn't going

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Speaker 1: to play at Eastern Kentucky. It takes me a little

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Speaker 1: I'm slow, Doug. It takes me a little time. And

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Speaker 1: I thought, you know what, you know, as long as

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Speaker 1: it makes packs a better player, you know that, I'm

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Speaker 1: fine with that. You know, I'm okay. There's a lot

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Speaker 1: there's other cheerleaders out there. I mean there weren't for me,

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Speaker 1: but there were other cheerleaders. But uh, and it took

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Speaker 1: my My father passed away and the my sister was

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Speaker 1: a cheerleader on the basketball team, and the entire team

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Speaker 1: came to my dad's funeral and don donnaher pulled me

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Speaker 1: aside later, you know, after everybody was having beers, and

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Speaker 1: he said, you know, I made a mistake. I should

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Speaker 1: let you play and it and it really meant a lot,

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Speaker 1: you know, Grant. It was at my dad's funeral, but

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Speaker 1: I thought it was kind of pointed that my dad

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Speaker 1: would have liked to have heard that. And uh, you know,

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Speaker 1: I knew I could hold my own, but you know,

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Speaker 1: it was such an asshole I got. You know, it

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Speaker 1: was really really angry, I mean so much. So. We

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Speaker 1: had a grad league and I played against the guy

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Speaker 1: who was who had been on the team, Tim Pullman,

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Speaker 1: six eight, guy played, you know, for the state championship,

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Speaker 1: and you know, wonderful guy, wonderful guy, and he's playing

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Speaker 1: against us for the championship. And I said, I'm gonna

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Speaker 1: I'm gonna put up forty on Pullman. And for no

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Speaker 1: other reason, then damn it, somebody is going to notice this.

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Speaker 1: And I felt bad. I'm dribbling up the floor, Doug,

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Speaker 1: and I yell over to the guys, I said, how

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Speaker 1: many I got? When I go thirty six? I go,

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Speaker 1: all right, I stuck forty on Pullman. Years later, years,

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Speaker 1: this is probably ten years ago. I'm in Charlotte radio convention.

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Speaker 1: I see this guy staring at me, tall guy, bald,

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Speaker 1: and I go, I don't know what I don't know

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Speaker 1: what the story is with this guy. And it's Tim Polman.

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Speaker 1: He walks over and and he goes, hey, you put

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Speaker 1: up forty on me? And I go, oh my god, Tim,

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Speaker 1: I'm so sorry I was such a jerk to you,

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Speaker 1: and he goes nine, I get it. I don't blame

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Speaker 1: I'm thinking, God, I don't know how I didn't get

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Speaker 1: my ass kicked back then. So, UM, it's interesting, like

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Speaker 1: you carry like my my there's a lot of similarities there,

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Speaker 1: honestly with my dad. My dad was in New Yorker,

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Speaker 1: grew up in the Bronx UM, moved out to Long Island, right,

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Speaker 1: and walked on at Syracuse, was on the freshman team.

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Speaker 1: And again this is his story, was he he took

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Speaker 1: a charge in a varsity player and the coach kicked

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Speaker 1: him off the team. Um. And so he then transferred

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Speaker 1: to Ohio State where he was a walk on and

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Speaker 1: a JV player with Havill check in, Uh, Jerry Lucas

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Speaker 1: and Bob Knight and right right and that and and

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Speaker 1: that crew. And what's interesting about it is he would

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Speaker 1: tell me stories like he was he was in Las Vegas,

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Speaker 1: he coached at Death Valley High School. He would play

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Speaker 1: he played in a league in Las Vegas, like an

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Speaker 1: adult league, and let it in scoring. And he was like,

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Speaker 1: I don't know if I was a late bloomer, or

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Speaker 1: if I was just angry because I didn't play in

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Speaker 1: college whenever, but I just I tried to take it

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Speaker 1: out on everybody that I played against, Whereas the opposite

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Speaker 1: is kind of true with me, where it's not that

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Speaker 1: I don't have a competitive gene, but it's it's almost

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Speaker 1: as if, like I, I struggled to I struggled to

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Speaker 1: find a reason to kick somebody's ask sometimes, you know,

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Speaker 1: even when I could, and other guys come at you

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Speaker 1: a lot, a lot harder. Um, okay, So so let's

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Speaker 1: so you get done, You get done going to Dayton.

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Speaker 1: You don't get to play your dad. Your dad died

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Speaker 1: when you're twenty five. I'm gonna say, right, so what

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Speaker 1: so obviously you didn't have hopes of playing. Did you

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Speaker 1: want to coach you around? Be around ball? Why did

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00:17:02,840 --> 00:17:08,560
Speaker 1: you get into radio? I never had a plan, b Um.

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Speaker 1: I played baseball, Uh played in semi pro baseball league

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Speaker 1: in Cincinnati, which was really competitive pitching and shortstop. And

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Speaker 1: I actually tore my labroom and it took me. I

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Speaker 1: just had it. I finally had surgery three years ago

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Speaker 1: on it. I had blown out my knee when I

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Speaker 1: when I was fourteen, I needed to have knee surgery,

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Speaker 1: but my dad said, can you tough it out, because

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Speaker 1: back then they would have opened me up and I

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Speaker 1: would have been out for a year. I didn't have

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Speaker 1: I needed knee surgery my entire basketball career and waited

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Speaker 1: till I was twenty four and you know, since then,

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Speaker 1: I've had five knee surgeries. I finally had it replaced.

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Speaker 1: So I was sort of playing on borrowed time anyway

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Speaker 1: with it. But I I just thought I was spending records.

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Speaker 1: I was a j but I only knew sports. I

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Speaker 1: was going to get into sports somehow, some way. Wasn't

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Speaker 1: a good student, but I was attracted to numbers. I

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Speaker 1: would read books, I would read starting lineups. I would

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Speaker 1: I would memorize it, and for I never knew if

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Speaker 1: it would come in handy. I'd go to parties and

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Speaker 1: you had to stump me with a trivia question to

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Speaker 1: leave the party. And I took great pride in, you know,

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Speaker 1: keeping guys from going home with their girlfriends, because if you,

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Speaker 1: if I got the question right, you went to the

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Speaker 1: back of the line. And uh, I just that was

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Speaker 1: what I knew, and I I had no idea I

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Speaker 1: was so naive, didn't know how to get into the business.

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Speaker 1: And you know, thank god my brother was on the

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Speaker 1: radio because I learned how to be a disc jockey,

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Speaker 1: queuing up you know, the albums at the time. And

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Speaker 1: then I got hired to do weekends at the rock

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Speaker 1: and roll station in Dayton. And then I was still

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Speaker 1: mowing green said Jack Nicholas golf course during the week

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Speaker 1: So my weekend job was spinning records, and um, you know,

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Speaker 1: there was an opening in the morning and I ended

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Speaker 1: up being the news guy in the morning, and then

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Speaker 1: after that rented out some TV equipment. I filmed an

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Speaker 1: audition tape, sent it to Bob Lee at ESPN and

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Speaker 1: Greg Gumble, and I said, here's five minutes of me

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Speaker 1: had living. Tell me what you think. Um, and Bob

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Speaker 1: Lee sent me a full page letter back and and

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Speaker 1: critiqued my work and said, you know what you getting.

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Speaker 1: You need to, you know, find a job, but you

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Speaker 1: you have what it takes. And you know, maybe he

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Speaker 1: believed it or not. Fast forward to seven six or

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Speaker 1: seven years later, I'm sitting next to Bob Lee on

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Speaker 1: Sports Center. After getting a job, I lost a job

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Speaker 1: at Channel two in Dayton, Ohio. Uh, and everybody knew that,

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Speaker 1: you know, I should get the job, but I wasn't

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Speaker 1: good looking enough. The guy who got it was better

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Speaker 1: looking than me, and it was it blew my mom

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Speaker 1: and him, like, wait, the better looking guy got the

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Speaker 1: job over the guy who knows sports. And then I said,

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Speaker 1: I'm not I'm not cut out for local sports. And

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Speaker 1: then I went down to Atlanta. I had an old

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Speaker 1: girlfriend down there, went to see her, brought in a

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Speaker 1: tape the last day I was there to CNN and

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Speaker 1: got hired that day. I'm like, I don't this business

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Speaker 1: is so crazy. I didn't get a job in Dayton, Ohio,

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Speaker 1: but I now have a job at CNN. Six months later,

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Speaker 1: I took over for Keith Oberman in New York as

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Speaker 1: the New York reporter, met my then you know girlfriend

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Speaker 1: who's now my wife, and went back to Atlanta anchored

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Speaker 1: for a little while, and then went to ESPN, where

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Speaker 1: I spent eighteen years, and then I left thirteen years

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Speaker 1: ago to start, you know, my own show, So Crazy Crazy.

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Speaker 1: You know, I always tell people who you know, there's

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Speaker 1: so much luck in this, but you better be good

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Speaker 1: when they're ready to call on. And that was the

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Speaker 1: case for me. Okay, let's who is the guy in

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Speaker 1: Dayton who got the job because he's better looking than you,

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00:21:04,800 --> 00:21:11,800
Speaker 1: Ken Kettering and we laugh about it, um, but you

378
00:21:11,840 --> 00:21:15,119
Speaker 1: know it, he laughed. He was he's now a limo

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Speaker 1: driver and he's got six kids, and you know, I

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Speaker 1: came to the realization Ken is a better looking guy.

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Speaker 1: But he even said, you should have gotten the job.

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Speaker 1: Thank god I didn't. Uh. I mean not thank god

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Speaker 1: that I'm not good looking enough to get the job,

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Speaker 1: but thank god that I didn't get the job, because

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Speaker 1: you know, it humbled me and I I went to

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Speaker 1: Atlanta and got that job, and obviously on headline sports,

387
00:21:37,720 --> 00:21:40,720
Speaker 1: I wasn't even on camera, so you can imagine the

388
00:21:40,760 --> 00:21:43,600
Speaker 1: inferiority complex. I'm not good enough to get the job

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Speaker 1: in Dayton because I'm not good looking enough. And I

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Speaker 1: go to CNN. I'm still not on camera, so I'm like,

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00:21:49,760 --> 00:21:52,920
Speaker 1: maybe I got a face for radio. So you get

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Speaker 1: to Atlanta. Now you work for CNN. What was the

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00:21:55,720 --> 00:22:01,800
Speaker 1: first big basketball event you've covered? First big basketball? Uh?

394
00:22:02,040 --> 00:22:06,600
Speaker 1: Final Four? Do you know what year it was? Might

395
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Speaker 1: have been Denver when Brent Musburger got fired. Okay, so

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00:22:11,240 --> 00:22:16,040
Speaker 1: that's uh, Denver was ninety right. That was um. And

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Speaker 1: this is this is the fun part for basketball guys.

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Speaker 1: Georgia Tech, Arkansas. Yeah, Georgia Tech and Kenny at least

399
00:22:24,359 --> 00:22:29,600
Speaker 1: weapon three, right, Um Arkansas? You and O V and Duke? Right,

400
00:22:29,720 --> 00:22:31,719
Speaker 1: and and that's Bobby Hurley was sick and they got

401
00:22:31,760 --> 00:22:34,359
Speaker 1: beat by thirty one points or whatever. Actually, you know

402
00:22:34,359 --> 00:22:41,920
Speaker 1: what it was Danny Manning. Danny Manning was the first one, Okay.

403
00:22:41,920 --> 00:22:50,479
Speaker 1: So that was Kansas City. Um. And that was Arizona, Kansas, Oklahoma, Oklahoma.

404
00:22:50,200 --> 00:22:53,080
Speaker 1: Who's the who's the fourth team? Hold on, let's let's

405
00:22:53,080 --> 00:23:02,359
Speaker 1: think of it. This is on the fly. Four was Kansas, Arizona, Oklahoma. Uh.

406
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Speaker 1: And you got any idea you want me to look

407
00:23:04,359 --> 00:23:07,480
Speaker 1: it up. You have to look it up, because whoever can't.

408
00:23:07,800 --> 00:23:10,520
Speaker 1: That first half of the Oklahoma Arizona game was as

409
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Speaker 1: good as any first half I've ever seen in my life. Duke.

410
00:23:14,040 --> 00:23:18,360
Speaker 1: Duke was the other one. There was another Duke Okay, yeah,

411
00:23:18,400 --> 00:23:21,359
Speaker 1: but that was you know. Then I got to be

412
00:23:21,480 --> 00:23:27,760
Speaker 1: around these coaches. I remember Coach k wrote a letter

413
00:23:27,840 --> 00:23:31,440
Speaker 1: to me saying that a question I had for lud

414
00:23:31,480 --> 00:23:37,119
Speaker 1: Olsen wasn't fair. And I kept this letter and he

415
00:23:37,200 --> 00:23:40,520
Speaker 1: was probably right, but you know, I just don't have

416
00:23:40,560 --> 00:23:43,159
Speaker 1: any pace. I want to know an answer and I

417
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Speaker 1: don't want coach speak. So even back then, I could

418
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Speaker 1: see through the bullshit where I'm going, Nah, now I

419
00:23:48,920 --> 00:23:50,840
Speaker 1: need an answer. And I remember Coach K wrote me

420
00:23:50,880 --> 00:23:54,119
Speaker 1: a letter at CNN saying that, uh, you know, it

421
00:23:54,280 --> 00:23:58,679
Speaker 1: was not a fair question and you know what question? No,

422
00:23:59,200 --> 00:24:01,760
Speaker 1: I don't remember. I just know that, Uh, you know

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00:24:01,840 --> 00:24:05,560
Speaker 1: he kind of labeled the unprofessional, which I did. I

424
00:24:05,600 --> 00:24:08,280
Speaker 1: did tell Coach K about that and he said, well,

425
00:24:08,440 --> 00:24:12,159
Speaker 1: you probably were, and I said, yeah, maybe. So my

426
00:24:12,240 --> 00:24:14,439
Speaker 1: Coach K story goes something like this. The guy who

427
00:24:14,520 --> 00:24:16,399
Speaker 1: hired me at ESPN's name is Dan Steer. I know,

428
00:24:16,440 --> 00:24:21,960
Speaker 1: you know Dan Um and uh, we were doing halftime

429
00:24:22,359 --> 00:24:28,199
Speaker 1: of the a C C Champion semifinals and UM at

430
00:24:28,200 --> 00:24:30,960
Speaker 1: the time, Chris Collins was his lead assistant, and Chris

431
00:24:31,000 --> 00:24:33,680
Speaker 1: Collins at the halftime interview, because remember Coach K. For

432
00:24:33,720 --> 00:24:37,480
Speaker 1: a long time there didn't do UM halftime interviews, and

433
00:24:37,520 --> 00:24:39,280
Speaker 1: it was just two questions. And they come to us

434
00:24:39,280 --> 00:24:43,080
Speaker 1: in studio and I'm with Tom Brennan and Scott Reese

435
00:24:43,480 --> 00:24:46,320
Speaker 1: and We're in that little studio of a studio D

436
00:24:46,440 --> 00:24:49,920
Speaker 1: where it's in in the new news room and they

437
00:24:49,920 --> 00:24:53,200
Speaker 1: come to us and I said, like, why can't Coach

438
00:24:53,280 --> 00:24:56,600
Speaker 1: K do the interview? And and you would have thought

439
00:24:56,600 --> 00:24:58,320
Speaker 1: I farted on set, right. I mean, they're like to

440
00:24:58,359 --> 00:25:00,159
Speaker 1: look on those other two fays like, man, I not

441
00:25:00,160 --> 00:25:02,080
Speaker 1: believe you just said. And they're like, why why would

442
00:25:02,080 --> 00:25:04,040
Speaker 1: you Why would you say that? I said, well, like, look,

443
00:25:04,400 --> 00:25:06,399
Speaker 1: when coach Coach K is the coach of tm USA,

444
00:25:06,600 --> 00:25:10,520
Speaker 1: he's synonymous with college basketball when he gets When you

445
00:25:10,560 --> 00:25:13,040
Speaker 1: get in the locker room, nobody listens to the assistant coach.

446
00:25:13,080 --> 00:25:15,119
Speaker 1: They're up there rambling. You listen to the the head coach.

447
00:25:15,600 --> 00:25:19,520
Speaker 1: So why are we asking questions to the assistant coach? Why?

448
00:25:19,760 --> 00:25:21,760
Speaker 1: I'm like, it's two questions. We're not asking that much.

449
00:25:21,760 --> 00:25:24,040
Speaker 1: And Scott reesss like, we'll find out what else is

450
00:25:24,240 --> 00:25:27,600
Speaker 1: pissing Doug Gottlieboff coming up next, right? So I literally

451
00:25:27,920 --> 00:25:30,119
Speaker 1: we get done with that segment and the phone rings

452
00:25:30,160 --> 00:25:33,640
Speaker 1: behind me and it's Dan Steer, what the funk are

453
00:25:33,680 --> 00:25:36,919
Speaker 1: you doing? We have a relationship with Duke, we have

454
00:25:37,000 --> 00:25:39,240
Speaker 1: an agreement that he doesn't want to do the interview.

455
00:25:39,480 --> 00:25:42,160
Speaker 1: We don't ask about it. I was like, okay, but

456
00:25:42,359 --> 00:25:44,199
Speaker 1: I mean, don't you think if you're at home, nobody

457
00:25:44,240 --> 00:25:47,480
Speaker 1: gives a ship anyway. That was my and coach and

458
00:25:47,520 --> 00:25:49,439
Speaker 1: Coach k Actually, I talked to him that summer. He's like,

459
00:25:49,440 --> 00:25:52,080
Speaker 1: I I don't I told him I don't want to

460
00:25:52,080 --> 00:25:53,439
Speaker 1: do it. I just I don't want to do it.

461
00:25:53,440 --> 00:25:56,280
Speaker 1: It's nothink personal. I don't want to do it. The

462
00:25:56,359 --> 00:25:59,600
Speaker 1: first time I covered all of those Big East games,

463
00:25:59,760 --> 00:26:02,040
Speaker 1: so like, you know, I take that back. The first

464
00:26:02,680 --> 00:26:07,960
Speaker 1: I had, you know, Massameno and Villanova cover their victory parade, syraccused,

465
00:26:08,000 --> 00:26:11,120
Speaker 1: did features on Chris Mullin and Mark Jackson and Louis

466
00:26:11,160 --> 00:26:19,600
Speaker 1: carnisaka on Tom tong Um, Villanova, uh, Providence, like the

467
00:26:19,640 --> 00:26:24,200
Speaker 1: whole Beeheim at Syracuse. So those Big East. I didn't

468
00:26:24,200 --> 00:26:27,440
Speaker 1: realize at the time that basketball would never be the same,

469
00:26:28,000 --> 00:26:30,360
Speaker 1: but I would go over there for the Big East Tournament.

470
00:26:30,400 --> 00:26:32,720
Speaker 1: We did features all the time. So that's probably the

471
00:26:32,760 --> 00:26:38,080
Speaker 1: real introduction to big time college basketball. And then graduating

472
00:26:38,119 --> 00:26:42,400
Speaker 1: to cover some final fours and uh after that. So

473
00:26:42,680 --> 00:26:44,560
Speaker 1: it was kind of kind of a magical time if

474
00:26:44,600 --> 00:26:46,680
Speaker 1: you think about it, and oh my god, I mean

475
00:26:46,760 --> 00:26:49,360
Speaker 1: if you think about so so my again, I'm experienced

476
00:26:49,359 --> 00:26:51,480
Speaker 1: in the same thing, only from California, and we had

477
00:26:52,160 --> 00:26:55,360
Speaker 1: you know, with Lauren Ellis and Mike Hopkins, Scott McCorkle.

478
00:26:55,480 --> 00:26:59,120
Speaker 1: We had California kids playing, you know. I mean, look,

479
00:26:59,400 --> 00:27:02,720
Speaker 1: Yukon had a California point guard, um, and they had

480
00:27:02,840 --> 00:27:06,760
Speaker 1: several California players or whatever. Uh and in Syracuse obviously

481
00:27:06,760 --> 00:27:09,760
Speaker 1: I just named a couple of them. There was. It

482
00:27:09,800 --> 00:27:12,600
Speaker 1: was such a it was the beginning really of of

483
00:27:13,320 --> 00:27:17,600
Speaker 1: cable television and college basketball was where ESPN kind of

484
00:27:17,600 --> 00:27:20,280
Speaker 1: stuck their flag into the ground because it was volume programming.

485
00:27:20,720 --> 00:27:22,240
Speaker 1: It could be on and that was the only thing

486
00:27:22,359 --> 00:27:24,479
Speaker 1: decent on in the afternoon. You get home and your

487
00:27:24,520 --> 00:27:26,240
Speaker 1: Californy you turn on, and then everybody in the East

488
00:27:26,240 --> 00:27:28,720
Speaker 1: Coast watch because again kind of same thing, but only

489
00:27:28,760 --> 00:27:31,080
Speaker 1: thing on at night during the week. And then you

490
00:27:31,119 --> 00:27:34,520
Speaker 1: had all these incredible players. You had only eight teams,

491
00:27:34,880 --> 00:27:37,360
Speaker 1: these small schools and that you normally would not pay

492
00:27:37,400 --> 00:27:40,240
Speaker 1: any attention to. Like that was kind of a magical

493
00:27:40,280 --> 00:27:42,360
Speaker 1: time with the big for the Big East and Big

494
00:27:42,400 --> 00:27:47,280
Speaker 1: Monday in the well. You had everybody staying, you know,

495
00:27:47,840 --> 00:27:51,639
Speaker 1: Mullen was staying. You They're all staying four years and

496
00:27:51,640 --> 00:27:55,199
Speaker 1: and so you had star power, um and and the

497
00:27:55,240 --> 00:27:58,359
Speaker 1: coaches were stars. It was a big deal. And to

498
00:27:58,440 --> 00:28:01,000
Speaker 1: go to the Big East back then than to be

499
00:28:02,160 --> 00:28:05,840
Speaker 1: you know, the these people and it was it was wonderful.

500
00:28:05,960 --> 00:28:09,439
Speaker 1: I mean I I probably took it for granted, but

501
00:28:09,520 --> 00:28:13,320
Speaker 1: I don't take it for granted looking back on those memories. Okay,

502
00:28:13,320 --> 00:28:17,080
Speaker 1: so now you uh, then there's the NBA as well,

503
00:28:17,119 --> 00:28:20,960
Speaker 1: and you're again in that this is becoming the Jordan's era.

504
00:28:21,200 --> 00:28:24,399
Speaker 1: Right when you start covering the NBA finals, that was

505
00:28:24,520 --> 00:28:28,320
Speaker 1: like a tail with the tail end of Magic Um

506
00:28:28,400 --> 00:28:32,159
Speaker 1: and you have the bad boy pistons Um. What was

507
00:28:32,200 --> 00:28:35,240
Speaker 1: it like to cover Jordan's kind of before he because

508
00:28:35,440 --> 00:28:37,800
Speaker 1: I think now we look back in a way in

509
00:28:37,920 --> 00:28:40,479
Speaker 1: Jordan's and we think of the six Championships. I do

510
00:28:40,560 --> 00:28:43,040
Speaker 1: think people forget that there was a long time there

511
00:28:43,040 --> 00:28:45,480
Speaker 1: where Jordan's was, Yeah, he's the best player, but he

512
00:28:45,520 --> 00:28:49,680
Speaker 1: hadn't won anything yet. Well, I got to cover the

513
00:28:49,760 --> 00:28:53,720
Speaker 1: NBA Finals. I was there for Birds Championships. I was

514
00:28:53,760 --> 00:28:57,280
Speaker 1: there when Magic hit the hook hook shot. So I

515
00:28:57,680 --> 00:29:00,480
Speaker 1: got to see go to the garden and and do

516
00:29:00,560 --> 00:29:03,200
Speaker 1: a lot of things, uh, you know, even the Knicks

517
00:29:03,320 --> 00:29:06,880
Speaker 1: back then, but more so with the Celtics, and then

518
00:29:07,600 --> 00:29:10,880
Speaker 1: when Jordan's came in and I'm doing Sports Center. I'll

519
00:29:10,920 --> 00:29:14,680
Speaker 1: never forget. Mark Jones is the first one who was

520
00:29:14,720 --> 00:29:19,520
Speaker 1: doing the interviews post game NBA Finals when the Bulls

521
00:29:20,480 --> 00:29:25,320
Speaker 1: played the Portland Trailblazers, and I remember sitting there throwing

522
00:29:25,320 --> 00:29:28,080
Speaker 1: out to him, and as I'm throwing it out to

523
00:29:28,160 --> 00:29:31,320
Speaker 1: Mark Jones standing by with Michael Jordan's, and I said

524
00:29:31,360 --> 00:29:35,840
Speaker 1: to myself, I will be doing the interviews next year.

525
00:29:36,440 --> 00:29:40,360
Speaker 1: And I just became obsessed with it because I just

526
00:29:40,400 --> 00:29:45,520
Speaker 1: said I For some reason, I knew it was there

527
00:29:45,600 --> 00:29:47,960
Speaker 1: was something that was happening that we would never see again.

528
00:29:48,000 --> 00:29:50,600
Speaker 1: And I don't know why I thought this. We were

529
00:29:50,600 --> 00:29:53,880
Speaker 1: seeing a transcendent player. As much as I love Larry

530
00:29:53,920 --> 00:29:58,520
Speaker 1: and Magic, they weren't Mike and I. He was. There

531
00:29:58,600 --> 00:30:01,640
Speaker 1: was still a greta guard about feel to him, like

532
00:30:01,680 --> 00:30:04,960
Speaker 1: we didn't really know him. We watched him and we

533
00:30:05,040 --> 00:30:07,000
Speaker 1: wanted to be like Mike, but we didn't know it.

534
00:30:07,800 --> 00:30:12,160
Speaker 1: And I just thought, you know what, I'm gonna attack

535
00:30:12,280 --> 00:30:15,120
Speaker 1: him with questions the way he attacks people on the floor.

536
00:30:16,400 --> 00:30:19,840
Speaker 1: And he allowed me to. He'd always say before every

537
00:30:20,200 --> 00:30:23,280
Speaker 1: NBA Final that I covered, he would say, I'll talk

538
00:30:23,320 --> 00:30:25,600
Speaker 1: to you after we went, not if, but after we

539
00:30:25,640 --> 00:30:28,200
Speaker 1: win when we win, and he he would come in

540
00:30:28,280 --> 00:30:31,920
Speaker 1: sometimes when they would win, like game two or something,

541
00:30:31,960 --> 00:30:34,920
Speaker 1: but he would always always always come in after they

542
00:30:34,960 --> 00:30:37,800
Speaker 1: won a championship. And I I just remember it was

543
00:30:37,920 --> 00:30:42,000
Speaker 1: fun volleying with him. And that's what I wasn't trying

544
00:30:42,040 --> 00:30:44,200
Speaker 1: to ace him. I was trying to volley with him.

545
00:30:44,240 --> 00:30:46,480
Speaker 1: All I wanted it is was back and forth, have

546
00:30:46,640 --> 00:30:49,960
Speaker 1: some fun, bring out that personality, make him smile, let

547
00:30:50,000 --> 00:30:52,920
Speaker 1: people see. You know, he's the killer on the floor,

548
00:30:53,240 --> 00:30:56,800
Speaker 1: but you know, he became. My goal was to humanize

549
00:30:57,240 --> 00:30:59,920
Speaker 1: Mike in those interviews. And it was a short period

550
00:30:59,880 --> 00:31:02,120
Speaker 1: of time. You know, you got maybe you know, four minutes,

551
00:31:02,160 --> 00:31:05,000
Speaker 1: five minutes. What can you get out of him? I

552
00:31:05,840 --> 00:31:10,640
Speaker 1: he was willing to play, and I always appreciated that, Um,

553
00:31:10,720 --> 00:31:14,560
Speaker 1: your interview style. It's It's interesting because I tell people

554
00:31:14,600 --> 00:31:17,240
Speaker 1: this all the time that when I put together radio

555
00:31:17,240 --> 00:31:21,840
Speaker 1: show and I started doing it at I've been really

556
00:31:21,840 --> 00:31:25,080
Speaker 1: my first solo shows that ESPN were early on two

557
00:31:25,160 --> 00:31:27,400
Speaker 1: thousand three, two thousand four, got my own gig kind

558
00:31:27,400 --> 00:31:31,320
Speaker 1: of two thousand six is two thousand seven. I said, like, look,

559
00:31:31,400 --> 00:31:35,400
Speaker 1: I like the way. Uh, certain people do certain things.

560
00:31:36,080 --> 00:31:41,360
Speaker 1: You're the best interviewer in the business, but but I

561
00:31:40,680 --> 00:31:45,360
Speaker 1: I feel like, um, the two things you do really

562
00:31:45,400 --> 00:31:49,400
Speaker 1: really well is, Yes, you'll ask kind of questions that

563
00:31:49,440 --> 00:31:51,880
Speaker 1: will tweak some guys, but you ask them in a

564
00:31:51,960 --> 00:31:54,480
Speaker 1: way in which you actually want to know the answer.

565
00:31:54,520 --> 00:31:56,400
Speaker 1: There are other people I won't say who they are,

566
00:31:56,680 --> 00:31:58,800
Speaker 1: but they they're they're basically setting up a story that

567
00:31:58,800 --> 00:32:01,680
Speaker 1: they've already heard, whereas you're asking a question that you

568
00:32:01,720 --> 00:32:04,400
Speaker 1: want the answer to. And then the second part that

569
00:32:04,440 --> 00:32:07,280
Speaker 1: you do probably the best job of is actually listening

570
00:32:07,760 --> 00:32:10,720
Speaker 1: and then either forming a different question or coming back

571
00:32:10,760 --> 00:32:12,680
Speaker 1: at somebody because of the way in which they answer.

572
00:32:12,760 --> 00:32:15,040
Speaker 1: Let's let's start with the first part. Where does that

573
00:32:15,080 --> 00:32:18,040
Speaker 1: come from? The ability to ask a question? And I

574
00:32:18,320 --> 00:32:20,880
Speaker 1: feel like that's your style to ask a question that

575
00:32:20,960 --> 00:32:24,520
Speaker 1: you don't know the answer to, well, even if I

576
00:32:24,600 --> 00:32:28,000
Speaker 1: know the answer to it. A common mistake we make

577
00:32:28,120 --> 00:32:33,200
Speaker 1: is you will ask a question while answering a question,

578
00:32:33,200 --> 00:32:35,880
Speaker 1: and then ask the question and then you can basically

579
00:32:35,960 --> 00:32:38,080
Speaker 1: get a yes or no answer. I I want you

580
00:32:38,240 --> 00:32:42,400
Speaker 1: always to tell the story because the audience may not

581
00:32:42,520 --> 00:32:45,040
Speaker 1: know it. I may know it, but I want you

582
00:32:45,080 --> 00:32:47,560
Speaker 1: to tell it instead of me acting like I know

583
00:32:48,320 --> 00:32:50,479
Speaker 1: you know, I don't want to project. I want you

584
00:32:50,560 --> 00:32:53,400
Speaker 1: to talk. If I have you on your my guest,

585
00:32:53,960 --> 00:32:57,080
Speaker 1: you talk, and I always want to set you up

586
00:32:57,240 --> 00:33:02,040
Speaker 1: where I ask you an open ended question, how, where, why, when? Who?

587
00:33:02,720 --> 00:33:05,760
Speaker 1: And then I get you going uh. And then listening

588
00:33:05,880 --> 00:33:10,800
Speaker 1: is just I have three daughters and I have to listen.

589
00:33:11,480 --> 00:33:15,400
Speaker 1: And if you listen, it's amazing once you'll hear. And

590
00:33:15,760 --> 00:33:18,840
Speaker 1: you know, I never want the question to be People say,

591
00:33:18,840 --> 00:33:21,760
Speaker 1: oh yeah, ask great questions, and I always follow up

592
00:33:21,760 --> 00:33:25,120
Speaker 1: by saying, but what was the answer, because a great

593
00:33:25,160 --> 00:33:27,520
Speaker 1: If it doesn't elictit a great answer, then is it

594
00:33:27,640 --> 00:33:30,520
Speaker 1: really a great question? Um? I think we got caught

595
00:33:30,600 --> 00:33:33,080
Speaker 1: up in sixty minutes where Mike Wallace would say, did

596
00:33:33,120 --> 00:33:35,320
Speaker 1: you kill that person? Well, that's not a good question.

597
00:33:36,200 --> 00:33:39,320
Speaker 1: Why do people think you killed this person? I want

598
00:33:39,320 --> 00:33:43,840
Speaker 1: you talking, and once you talk, it's amazing how much

599
00:33:43,880 --> 00:33:46,880
Speaker 1: you'll tell me without trying to not tell me something.

600
00:33:47,040 --> 00:33:50,480
Speaker 1: So those are my goals with with every interview. And

601
00:33:50,520 --> 00:33:53,600
Speaker 1: if you don't remember something that we said during my interview,

602
00:33:53,640 --> 00:33:56,720
Speaker 1: then I didn't do my job. And that is what

603
00:33:56,760 --> 00:33:59,760
Speaker 1: did somebody tell you? Not what my question was what

604
00:33:59,840 --> 00:34:02,320
Speaker 1: was the answer? Because I want somebody to say, oh,

605
00:34:02,360 --> 00:34:05,680
Speaker 1: you know who I heard on Dan Patrick show, this

606
00:34:05,720 --> 00:34:08,239
Speaker 1: guy and you know what he said, boom. So all

607
00:34:08,280 --> 00:34:12,040
Speaker 1: I want is word of mouth that you got something

608
00:34:12,040 --> 00:34:14,959
Speaker 1: that you hadn't heard before. And you know, let's face it,

609
00:34:15,880 --> 00:34:18,600
Speaker 1: athletes are interviewed more than anybody else in the world

610
00:34:19,520 --> 00:34:22,760
Speaker 1: because they're available every game before a game, after game practice.

611
00:34:23,360 --> 00:34:26,880
Speaker 1: How can I ask you something that you haven't heard?

612
00:34:27,000 --> 00:34:28,960
Speaker 1: How do I ask you in a way that I

613
00:34:29,000 --> 00:34:32,719
Speaker 1: get a different answer than somebody else. Those are the challenges.

614
00:34:33,160 --> 00:34:35,240
Speaker 1: When was it when you were doing the Big Show

615
00:34:35,640 --> 00:34:38,640
Speaker 1: that it it changed that you got the ability because

616
00:34:39,480 --> 00:34:41,320
Speaker 1: it's not just getting people on your radio show or

617
00:34:41,360 --> 00:34:43,640
Speaker 1: when you interview people in Sports Center, but because of

618
00:34:44,120 --> 00:34:47,359
Speaker 1: what you and Keith had, you not only could get

619
00:34:47,400 --> 00:34:49,960
Speaker 1: the interview, it felt like you had the poetic license

620
00:34:50,000 --> 00:34:52,200
Speaker 1: to ask the question like is that is that when

621
00:34:52,280 --> 00:34:55,040
Speaker 1: it changed or did you always I feel like you

622
00:34:55,160 --> 00:34:59,359
Speaker 1: had that ability to to ask the question. I thought

623
00:34:59,400 --> 00:35:03,520
Speaker 1: I had the ability. I thought I had the obligation

624
00:35:03,600 --> 00:35:07,480
Speaker 1: to ask questions. It's the ability to be able to

625
00:35:07,520 --> 00:35:10,560
Speaker 1: be on a level playing field with those who you're interviewing,

626
00:35:11,000 --> 00:35:15,839
Speaker 1: because if You'll notice Letterman's chair was always higher than

627
00:35:15,920 --> 00:35:19,680
Speaker 1: his guests, so he was already saying, Hey, you've got

628
00:35:19,680 --> 00:35:21,600
Speaker 1: to come up to me. You've got to play on

629
00:35:21,640 --> 00:35:26,480
Speaker 1: my level, and they would. I didn't do that, but

630
00:35:26,600 --> 00:35:29,840
Speaker 1: in my mind, I wanted to say, we're going to

631
00:35:29,920 --> 00:35:32,279
Speaker 1: go into this on a level playing field. And I

632
00:35:32,320 --> 00:35:35,399
Speaker 1: think having a little bit of cash after Sports Center

633
00:35:35,560 --> 00:35:40,200
Speaker 1: success allowed me to ask some questions to get people

634
00:35:40,280 --> 00:35:42,279
Speaker 1: to open up a little bit more. Because I would

635
00:35:42,320 --> 00:35:45,680
Speaker 1: do the Sunday Conversation. I would travel all over the country,

636
00:35:46,080 --> 00:35:49,440
Speaker 1: sit down with these athletes and we would do thirty

637
00:35:49,480 --> 00:35:52,600
Speaker 1: minutes and pare it down to four minutes Sunday Conversation.

638
00:35:53,600 --> 00:35:56,160
Speaker 1: So I got the repetition and then I got the

639
00:35:56,160 --> 00:36:01,719
Speaker 1: reputation of he does the interviews. And I had a

640
00:36:01,760 --> 00:36:07,319
Speaker 1: wonderful seminar with John Slawatsky, who people at ESPN were

641
00:36:07,719 --> 00:36:11,120
Speaker 1: cursing at me, you under their breath because I read

642
00:36:11,120 --> 00:36:14,040
Speaker 1: an article where it called him the King of the interview.

643
00:36:14,440 --> 00:36:16,760
Speaker 1: And I remember going to John Walsh, my boss, and said,

644
00:36:17,440 --> 00:36:19,840
Speaker 1: can we get this guy in? And I, you know,

645
00:36:19,840 --> 00:36:22,759
Speaker 1: I read this interview and I was just fascinated and

646
00:36:22,840 --> 00:36:26,239
Speaker 1: I just thought, gosh, everybody could benefit from this, and

647
00:36:26,280 --> 00:36:28,840
Speaker 1: really you could benefit it from it even if you

648
00:36:28,880 --> 00:36:31,680
Speaker 1: weren't on the air. It's just the ability to ask

649
00:36:31,719 --> 00:36:35,200
Speaker 1: people questions to get them to talk. And John Slawatski

650
00:36:35,320 --> 00:36:38,279
Speaker 1: came in and we did five days, eight hours a

651
00:36:38,400 --> 00:36:42,360
Speaker 1: day on interviewing and I loved it. I could have

652
00:36:42,440 --> 00:36:47,719
Speaker 1: done two weeks, but people were just grumbling over it,

653
00:36:47,840 --> 00:36:51,600
Speaker 1: and I came away fascinated by it, and I just

654
00:36:51,640 --> 00:36:55,920
Speaker 1: started to put those tips into play. And you know,

655
00:36:56,000 --> 00:36:59,359
Speaker 1: I would talk to John Slawatsky all the time. Uh,

656
00:36:59,680 --> 00:37:02,840
Speaker 1: and and just say, listen to this, what are you hearing? What?

657
00:37:03,280 --> 00:37:06,680
Speaker 1: I wanted him to critique my work and uh, I

658
00:37:06,680 --> 00:37:08,680
Speaker 1: mean I was chasing even though I thought I was

659
00:37:08,719 --> 00:37:12,440
Speaker 1: pretty good. I wanted to be great. I just I did.

660
00:37:12,520 --> 00:37:14,399
Speaker 1: I wanted to leave no doubt. It kind of goes

661
00:37:14,440 --> 00:37:17,440
Speaker 1: back to my basketball days, like I wanted I wanted

662
00:37:17,440 --> 00:37:20,919
Speaker 1: to crush an interview. I wanted to own it. And

663
00:37:21,400 --> 00:37:22,840
Speaker 1: you know, but you can't get out in front of it.

664
00:37:22,920 --> 00:37:24,799
Speaker 1: You can't get in your own way, and you can

665
00:37:24,800 --> 00:37:28,080
Speaker 1: overthink it. And I wanted him to tell me, you

666
00:37:28,120 --> 00:37:30,240
Speaker 1: know what, you could ask that in a shorter question.

667
00:37:30,280 --> 00:37:33,480
Speaker 1: Nothing better than a short question, because then you can't reload.

668
00:37:34,320 --> 00:37:37,879
Speaker 1: You can tell me something and I'll go why. Well,

669
00:37:38,000 --> 00:37:40,680
Speaker 1: normally we'll go why would you answer it that way?

670
00:37:40,680 --> 00:37:42,600
Speaker 1: Because you know I would think you would be like

671
00:37:42,680 --> 00:37:44,960
Speaker 1: this and not feel that way. But why would you?

672
00:37:45,080 --> 00:37:47,920
Speaker 1: And so now you get time to reload, I just

673
00:37:48,000 --> 00:37:52,000
Speaker 1: go why? And we were were so insecure. We don't

674
00:37:52,000 --> 00:37:54,080
Speaker 1: want somebody to go wall. He doesn't even know the answer.

675
00:37:55,000 --> 00:37:57,600
Speaker 1: It's not if I know the answer, it's what answer

676
00:37:57,640 --> 00:38:00,239
Speaker 1: they give you the audience that I care about. I

677
00:38:00,239 --> 00:38:03,239
Speaker 1: don't care about, you know, insecurity or I want to

678
00:38:03,360 --> 00:38:08,400
Speaker 1: I want to get a great conversation going. Um so

679
00:38:08,480 --> 00:38:12,720
Speaker 1: much good stuff there, I'm I'm I'm fascinated. Um on

680
00:38:12,719 --> 00:38:16,040
Speaker 1: on a bunch of levels to it. Let's let's let's

681
00:38:16,040 --> 00:38:19,239
Speaker 1: start with Bird. You did say, hey, I was there

682
00:38:19,400 --> 00:38:26,600
Speaker 1: Bird Finals, Magic's Finals. I feel like now maybe because uh,

683
00:38:26,719 --> 00:38:29,200
Speaker 1: you know, Bird had a reputation and maybe maybe how

684
00:38:29,239 --> 00:38:32,759
Speaker 1: we see him in video as unathletic people don't understand

685
00:38:33,040 --> 00:38:35,319
Speaker 1: even the impact he had on the league, right Like,

686
00:38:35,680 --> 00:38:37,680
Speaker 1: I think they won twenty nine games before he got

687
00:38:37,719 --> 00:38:39,960
Speaker 1: there his senior year in Indiana State, then they won

688
00:38:40,040 --> 00:38:43,759
Speaker 1: sixty his rookie year. Orte is his his rookie year

689
00:38:44,400 --> 00:38:49,280
Speaker 1: for somebody who was alive and as a basketball player, Um,

690
00:38:49,360 --> 00:38:54,840
Speaker 1: how should we contextualize Larry Bird? Well, I look, Magic

691
00:38:54,920 --> 00:38:58,360
Speaker 1: and Larry were very similar. I mean Magic wasn't the

692
00:38:58,360 --> 00:39:03,560
Speaker 1: most athletic guy in what we deem athletic. Athleticism is

693
00:39:04,640 --> 00:39:07,799
Speaker 1: can I beat you? How often? Can I beat you?

694
00:39:08,360 --> 00:39:11,000
Speaker 1: How am I? Being? Larry was so athletic, he would

695
00:39:11,000 --> 00:39:14,200
Speaker 1: tell you how he was going to beat you. We're

696
00:39:14,200 --> 00:39:17,880
Speaker 1: so competitive. I think that's more competitive than athletics. No,

697
00:39:18,000 --> 00:39:20,880
Speaker 1: but he would, Oh, I think you what, but what

698
00:39:21,000 --> 00:39:24,480
Speaker 1: is athleticism? Is athleticism being able to find the right

699
00:39:24,520 --> 00:39:26,440
Speaker 1: bounce past? Is it a you know, is it able

700
00:39:26,480 --> 00:39:28,200
Speaker 1: to no look past that is able to hit the

701
00:39:28,280 --> 00:39:31,359
Speaker 1: jump shot? They ran the Celtics back they ran they

702
00:39:31,360 --> 00:39:35,080
Speaker 1: had fast breaks back then. I think we look at

703
00:39:35,120 --> 00:39:38,000
Speaker 1: athleticism and go, okay, how high do you jump? What's

704
00:39:38,000 --> 00:39:40,880
Speaker 1: your vertical? And they are guys we've played with who

705
00:39:40,920 --> 00:39:45,120
Speaker 1: are unbelievable jumpers. They can't play. Burden and Magic were

706
00:39:45,239 --> 00:39:49,239
Speaker 1: very similar because their athleticism, you know, was that there

707
00:39:49,280 --> 00:39:52,880
Speaker 1: was a mental capacity to athleticism, which I think, you know,

708
00:39:52,960 --> 00:39:55,320
Speaker 1: that's something that's really hard to see, you know, gauge

709
00:39:55,360 --> 00:39:58,160
Speaker 1: like I can see you jump, I can't you know

710
00:39:58,200 --> 00:40:01,800
Speaker 1: your your mental acuity. That that was something that Bird

711
00:40:01,840 --> 00:40:05,320
Speaker 1: and Magic took it to a different level. Uh. And

712
00:40:05,680 --> 00:40:08,160
Speaker 1: it's not to say that Mike and Isaiah and you

713
00:40:08,160 --> 00:40:11,080
Speaker 1: know run down the list weren't smart like Tim Duncan

714
00:40:11,560 --> 00:40:16,120
Speaker 1: had that ability like Bird and Magic where you just

715
00:40:16,160 --> 00:40:21,160
Speaker 1: watched them understand process of game. Um. So it wasn't

716
00:40:21,400 --> 00:40:23,920
Speaker 1: until you know, recently, a couple of years ago, that

717
00:40:24,600 --> 00:40:28,360
Speaker 1: I would have taken Bird over Lebron. You know, Bird

718
00:40:28,440 --> 00:40:30,319
Speaker 1: had a couple of seasons. You know, we look at

719
00:40:30,360 --> 00:40:33,919
Speaker 1: Lebron and you know Larry put up you know, thirty one,

720
00:40:34,120 --> 00:40:36,720
Speaker 1: ten and eight, eight, eight and a half or something,

721
00:40:37,360 --> 00:40:39,720
Speaker 1: and if you would have said Larry average a triple double,

722
00:40:39,880 --> 00:40:44,520
Speaker 1: he would have, uh, you know that the same with Magic. Um.

723
00:40:44,719 --> 00:40:47,640
Speaker 1: You know, we got drunk with stats, I think probably

724
00:40:47,680 --> 00:40:52,040
Speaker 1: starting in the nineties and everybody in Bay all sports.

725
00:40:52,040 --> 00:40:54,200
Speaker 1: But you know that's not what those guys were about.

726
00:40:54,280 --> 00:40:57,560
Speaker 1: It was about did we win. Like John Stockton, I

727
00:40:57,600 --> 00:40:59,000
Speaker 1: don't think he sat there and when you know, I'd

728
00:40:59,000 --> 00:41:01,080
Speaker 1: like the average thirteen assist a game, he was like

729
00:41:01,680 --> 00:41:04,480
Speaker 1: he couldn't care less how many he had he wanted

730
00:41:04,520 --> 00:41:08,000
Speaker 1: to know, you know, hey, did we win? So bird

731
00:41:08,360 --> 00:41:13,200
Speaker 1: Bird to me was you know, fascinating to watch because

732
00:41:13,200 --> 00:41:15,239
Speaker 1: that ability to be able to do you know, he

733
00:41:15,280 --> 00:41:17,360
Speaker 1: would tell guys, I'm gonna I'm gonna hit the jumper

734
00:41:17,440 --> 00:41:19,080
Speaker 1: right here in front of you, and then he go

735
00:41:19,080 --> 00:41:20,480
Speaker 1: out and hit the jumper right in front of you.

736
00:41:21,120 --> 00:41:24,160
Speaker 1: That seems to be athletic. Maybe not in the you know,

737
00:41:24,280 --> 00:41:27,319
Speaker 1: context of what you know, we've we've come to appreciate,

738
00:41:27,440 --> 00:41:32,560
Speaker 1: but I would rather watch that kind of player, that mentality,

739
00:41:32,640 --> 00:41:35,120
Speaker 1: and it's you know, Lebron has a high basketball i

740
00:41:35,200 --> 00:41:39,760
Speaker 1: Q as well, extremely high. I love watching how somebody

741
00:41:39,840 --> 00:41:42,280
Speaker 1: can out thank you and do it in the moment

742
00:41:42,360 --> 00:41:46,719
Speaker 1: in real time. So uh and now it and and

743
00:41:47,000 --> 00:41:50,120
Speaker 1: I love Bird. You know, Bill Walton is probably my

744
00:41:50,200 --> 00:41:53,360
Speaker 1: favorite basketball player of all time because when I saw

745
00:41:53,440 --> 00:41:57,839
Speaker 1: him play at at his peak, he understood the game

746
00:41:58,160 --> 00:42:02,040
Speaker 1: better than anybody I've ever seen. And he was well

747
00:42:02,040 --> 00:42:04,000
Speaker 1: he's also crazy athlete until you know, he had to

748
00:42:04,040 --> 00:42:06,520
Speaker 1: had the foot problems. People forget what it amazing, what

749
00:42:06,600 --> 00:42:10,120
Speaker 1: an amazing athlete. But I just loved watching that. And

750
00:42:10,200 --> 00:42:13,919
Speaker 1: it's not that old Bird worked harder, you Jordan worked

751
00:42:13,960 --> 00:42:17,640
Speaker 1: hard Isaiah worked like, you don't get there without working hard.

752
00:42:18,160 --> 00:42:21,680
Speaker 1: It's we tend to look at athleticism and say, oh,

753
00:42:21,840 --> 00:42:24,359
Speaker 1: like you're lucky. Oh, you don't have to work that hard,

754
00:42:25,480 --> 00:42:29,680
Speaker 1: you know they do. I mean, Mike worked hard on

755
00:42:29,719 --> 00:42:33,200
Speaker 1: the floor, worked hard, um, And I think sometimes that's

756
00:42:33,200 --> 00:42:36,520
Speaker 1: lost on people that because you're athletic, we think that,

757
00:42:36,680 --> 00:42:39,879
Speaker 1: oh it's easier for you. And you know, Vince Carter

758
00:42:40,080 --> 00:42:44,320
Speaker 1: wonderful athletic. Uh, you know, is there a difference between

759
00:42:44,400 --> 00:42:47,319
Speaker 1: him and Michael Jordan's did did Mike worked harder? And

760
00:42:47,520 --> 00:42:50,080
Speaker 1: like I never know that? Like how many guys in

761
00:42:50,120 --> 00:42:51,880
Speaker 1: the history of the game have been more athletic than

762
00:42:51,960 --> 00:42:56,520
Speaker 1: Vince Carter? Not? Not many, But you know he doesn't

763
00:42:56,520 --> 00:42:59,919
Speaker 1: have the resume to show for it, whereas Michael does.

764
00:43:00,680 --> 00:43:04,239
Speaker 1: And you know, so I'm always fast fascinated with how

765
00:43:04,280 --> 00:43:08,160
Speaker 1: does how does that? Like Steve Nash, I remember meeting

766
00:43:08,239 --> 00:43:10,800
Speaker 1: him his rookie year and I thought, God, this is

767
00:43:10,840 --> 00:43:14,839
Speaker 1: a cute story. You know, he looks like Tatum O'Neill's

768
00:43:14,880 --> 00:43:17,719
Speaker 1: boyfriend in Bad News Bears, Like, you know, I had

769
00:43:17,800 --> 00:43:21,200
Speaker 1: kind of at nights, you know, I remember him at

770
00:43:21,200 --> 00:43:24,640
Speaker 1: Santa Clara and I go gut and who is it.

771
00:43:24,719 --> 00:43:27,279
Speaker 1: Bill Duffy was like, Hey, this guy is going to

772
00:43:27,400 --> 00:43:29,080
Speaker 1: start in the NBA, and I went, you know, Bill,

773
00:43:29,880 --> 00:43:31,680
Speaker 1: I love you, but you know you just pumped up

774
00:43:31,680 --> 00:43:35,880
Speaker 1: your clients. And I went, holy ship when I watched

775
00:43:35,960 --> 00:43:39,000
Speaker 1: him play and he wasn't even good enough to you know,

776
00:43:39,040 --> 00:43:41,000
Speaker 1: get on the floor in Phoenix, and I just remember,

777
00:43:41,600 --> 00:43:44,840
Speaker 1: it's that ability to think a game through, you know.

778
00:43:45,040 --> 00:43:48,640
Speaker 1: Jason Kidd saw him at Kansas at you know, when

779
00:43:48,640 --> 00:43:50,919
Speaker 1: they played them in the field House, and I went,

780
00:43:51,239 --> 00:43:55,160
Speaker 1: holy like, he's just it's a different game for these guys.

781
00:43:55,200 --> 00:43:57,719
Speaker 1: And that's why I go when somebody's athletic, it's a

782
00:43:57,719 --> 00:44:00,480
Speaker 1: long winded way of saying the mental part of it.

783
00:44:00,560 --> 00:44:03,520
Speaker 1: To me, there is athleticism in that because you can

784
00:44:03,600 --> 00:44:06,040
Speaker 1: have all the talent the world. If you can't put

785
00:44:06,080 --> 00:44:09,200
Speaker 1: it into motion, then really, how athletic are you know?

786
00:44:09,239 --> 00:44:12,120
Speaker 1: What does it matter how athletic you are? What happened

787
00:44:12,120 --> 00:44:16,680
Speaker 1: with you and David Stern? Oh, we had a great relationship.

788
00:44:16,880 --> 00:44:19,040
Speaker 1: I know you did, but there were there was some

789
00:44:19,480 --> 00:44:22,160
Speaker 1: I was doing the Draft on radio, you were doing

790
00:44:22,160 --> 00:44:23,680
Speaker 1: the Driver. You're the host of the Draft, you the

791
00:44:23,680 --> 00:44:26,640
Speaker 1: face of the network, and there was there was something

792
00:44:26,800 --> 00:44:29,239
Speaker 1: between the two of you that he felt like you

793
00:44:29,280 --> 00:44:31,920
Speaker 1: tweaked him in a way and like he was that

794
00:44:32,000 --> 00:44:33,400
Speaker 1: was just kind of the way he worked. There had

795
00:44:33,440 --> 00:44:38,000
Speaker 1: to be something that happened between you two. Nothing. No, no, no, no,

796
00:44:38,080 --> 00:44:40,920
Speaker 1: absolutely no. We went back and forth with each other.

797
00:44:41,600 --> 00:44:45,719
Speaker 1: I challenged him, uh, and I was not afraid to

798
00:44:45,840 --> 00:44:48,640
Speaker 1: challenge him. But I knew if you challenged him, you

799
00:44:48,800 --> 00:44:51,799
Speaker 1: better be ready. And that was just me having fun.

800
00:44:51,840 --> 00:44:53,520
Speaker 1: He was supposed to come out for a draft pick.

801
00:44:53,560 --> 00:44:55,399
Speaker 1: I was told he was coming out, So we get

802
00:44:55,400 --> 00:44:57,839
Speaker 1: the heads up commissioners, the pick is in. Here comes

803
00:44:57,840 --> 00:45:00,520
Speaker 1: Tomishier and I said, and let's go to the podium.

804
00:45:00,560 --> 00:45:02,600
Speaker 1: The commissioner is here with the pick. And they didn't

805
00:45:02,600 --> 00:45:04,960
Speaker 1: come out. So I did his fill in some time

806
00:45:04,960 --> 00:45:07,479
Speaker 1: and say, all the commissioner playing low hide and seek

807
00:45:07,600 --> 00:45:10,279
Speaker 1: or whatever, peekaboo. And then he came out, and he's

808
00:45:10,320 --> 00:45:14,400
Speaker 1: talked about pithy comments, but it was all that was.

809
00:45:14,400 --> 00:45:17,880
Speaker 1: Was kind of a micro caused him a little peek

810
00:45:17,920 --> 00:45:22,080
Speaker 1: into our relationship. If I was around him, we would

811
00:45:22,120 --> 00:45:26,120
Speaker 1: be the same way. Absolutely positively. Couldn't say enough great

812
00:45:26,160 --> 00:45:29,520
Speaker 1: things about him. He championed me. He knew I loved

813
00:45:29,520 --> 00:45:33,560
Speaker 1: the game. He insisted that I do the NBA because

814
00:45:33,560 --> 00:45:35,839
Speaker 1: Mike Tariko was doing it before. But he insisted that

815
00:45:35,920 --> 00:45:38,880
Speaker 1: I I do. He knew that I loved the game

816
00:45:39,520 --> 00:45:42,680
Speaker 1: and didn't have any other aspirations play by play any

817
00:45:42,719 --> 00:45:46,760
Speaker 1: of that. To know, no issues whatsoever with with David Stern,

818
00:45:47,000 --> 00:45:50,480
Speaker 1: Absolutely not. Obviously, David Stern had a right hand man

819
00:45:50,640 --> 00:45:52,840
Speaker 1: is Adam Silver. Adam Silver is now running the league,

820
00:45:52,960 --> 00:45:56,040
Speaker 1: and their styles, at least out in front of the media,

821
00:45:56,080 --> 00:45:58,680
Speaker 1: could not be any more different. Right Like David Stern,

822
00:45:58,719 --> 00:46:02,600
Speaker 1: though he championed you and Bird and Magic and they

823
00:46:02,640 --> 00:46:05,840
Speaker 1: helped save the league, it felt much more heavy handed

824
00:46:05,840 --> 00:46:08,720
Speaker 1: in his approach as opposed to Adam Silver, who seems,

825
00:46:08,760 --> 00:46:12,680
Speaker 1: at least again outward appearance to be way, way, way

826
00:46:12,719 --> 00:46:16,560
Speaker 1: more player friendly. Do you believe that the NBA isn't

827
00:46:16,600 --> 00:46:20,319
Speaker 1: a good place considering how outspoken the players are and

828
00:46:20,560 --> 00:46:26,919
Speaker 1: how powerful they are in their business. Yeah, I think so.

829
00:46:27,160 --> 00:46:30,239
Speaker 1: I don't think that the old school that hey, we

830
00:46:30,360 --> 00:46:35,520
Speaker 1: drafted you and you have to bye bye our rules.

831
00:46:35,600 --> 00:46:40,279
Speaker 1: And I like that they're able to kind of decide

832
00:46:40,320 --> 00:46:41,920
Speaker 1: what they want to do, where they want to do it,

833
00:46:42,040 --> 00:46:44,879
Speaker 1: how they want to do it, and I don't subscribe

834
00:46:44,880 --> 00:46:49,000
Speaker 1: to Antonio Brown or Jalen Ramsey. But if Kevin Durant

835
00:46:49,080 --> 00:46:52,440
Speaker 1: wants to play in Brooklyn, great, I'm thrilled that he

836
00:46:52,480 --> 00:46:55,920
Speaker 1: went to the East Coast. Uh. You know, let's I

837
00:46:56,040 --> 00:46:59,040
Speaker 1: just want to have rivalries. I want to have competition.

838
00:46:59,120 --> 00:47:02,200
Speaker 1: I wanted to be rates. I wanted to be where

839
00:47:02,440 --> 00:47:04,680
Speaker 1: you're not sure what the outcome is going to be.

840
00:47:05,400 --> 00:47:07,040
Speaker 1: I think it's the worst thing that a lead can

841
00:47:07,080 --> 00:47:09,480
Speaker 1: have is you go. Now, you know what, there's no

842
00:47:09,520 --> 00:47:12,239
Speaker 1: reason to watch the regular season or the posseeds this.

843
00:47:12,400 --> 00:47:15,000
Speaker 1: We know how this script ends. The n b A

844
00:47:15,760 --> 00:47:18,480
Speaker 1: you could say that has any sport ever had an

845
00:47:18,480 --> 00:47:21,279
Speaker 1: offseason like the NBA had, And a lot of that

846
00:47:21,360 --> 00:47:24,160
Speaker 1: has to do with you know, I'm gonna play here.

847
00:47:24,360 --> 00:47:26,160
Speaker 1: You want to play with me? Now? I know the

848
00:47:26,160 --> 00:47:29,000
Speaker 1: old school, like Bird's gonna go I'd never do that,

849
00:47:29,120 --> 00:47:31,279
Speaker 1: or Magic would say that, or Isaiah would say that,

850
00:47:31,360 --> 00:47:34,000
Speaker 1: I get it, But this is today's athlete and it's

851
00:47:34,040 --> 00:47:38,120
Speaker 1: completely different. I think Adam Silver has a velvet hammer.

852
00:47:38,640 --> 00:47:40,719
Speaker 1: I think he's able to do what he needs to

853
00:47:40,760 --> 00:47:43,239
Speaker 1: do how he needs to do it, but he does

854
00:47:43,280 --> 00:47:49,520
Speaker 1: it in a less intrusive way, whereas David Stern. He

855
00:47:49,560 --> 00:47:52,560
Speaker 1: lived up to his name. It's here he comes, and

856
00:47:52,840 --> 00:47:55,040
Speaker 1: he's gonna say what he needs to say, do what

857
00:47:55,080 --> 00:47:57,720
Speaker 1: he needs to do. It's just it's a different approach.

858
00:47:57,800 --> 00:48:00,960
Speaker 1: It's you know, you hire a manager and then once

859
00:48:00,960 --> 00:48:03,160
Speaker 1: you're going to fire him, then you hire a manager

860
00:48:03,160 --> 00:48:06,040
Speaker 1: who's completely opposite of the manager you just had. And

861
00:48:06,120 --> 00:48:09,280
Speaker 1: that kind of the feeling I had with the NBA

862
00:48:10,040 --> 00:48:15,480
Speaker 1: Adam Silver, you know, he governs in a different way. Um,

863
00:48:15,600 --> 00:48:18,600
Speaker 1: your favorite player to watch play basketball ever, is who

864
00:48:20,040 --> 00:48:24,399
Speaker 1: Bill Walton when he was with the Portland Trailblazers. That's

865
00:48:24,480 --> 00:48:29,120
Speaker 1: his selfless as any team I've ever seen, while being

866
00:48:29,360 --> 00:48:33,360
Speaker 1: so much fun. And Dr Jack Ramsey, you had, you

867
00:48:33,440 --> 00:48:37,120
Speaker 1: had guys who wouldn't have started for other teams. But

868
00:48:37,360 --> 00:48:41,480
Speaker 1: with Portland's you didn't like Bobby Gross probably wouldn't have

869
00:48:41,520 --> 00:48:44,840
Speaker 1: started for many other teams. Uh, you know, but he's Garden,

870
00:48:44,960 --> 00:48:48,560
Speaker 1: Dr j in the NBA Finals, or Larry Steele, Johnny

871
00:48:48,719 --> 00:48:53,440
Speaker 1: Dave Is, Dave Towards, Zick, Maurice Lucas and then you

872
00:48:53,520 --> 00:48:57,680
Speaker 1: had Walton. But but Walton was as selfless as any

873
00:48:57,680 --> 00:49:00,560
Speaker 1: player I've ever seen, and play at a very high level.

874
00:49:01,120 --> 00:49:03,400
Speaker 1: And when they beat the seventies six ers after losing

875
00:49:03,400 --> 00:49:06,120
Speaker 1: the first two. And I loved Walton at U c

876
00:49:06,280 --> 00:49:11,080
Speaker 1: l A. Because I just loved the process of you know,

877
00:49:11,160 --> 00:49:14,240
Speaker 1: team basketball and moving at the extra past playing offense

878
00:49:14,320 --> 00:49:17,080
Speaker 1: and defense. Uh. You know, he had a coach who

879
00:49:17,080 --> 00:49:21,040
Speaker 1: was meticulous, and I just so when Walton went to Portland,

880
00:49:21,080 --> 00:49:23,239
Speaker 1: I went to his first game, his first pro game

881
00:49:23,280 --> 00:49:26,680
Speaker 1: was against Kareem Abdul Jabbar at the University of Dayton,

882
00:49:27,440 --> 00:49:30,560
Speaker 1: and you know, Bill was in over his head. But

883
00:49:31,160 --> 00:49:34,080
Speaker 1: you know, you fast forward to that NBA playoffs when

884
00:49:34,120 --> 00:49:37,000
Speaker 1: Bill went, you know, running down the lane and he

885
00:49:37,080 --> 00:49:40,080
Speaker 1: dunked on Jabbar and it kind of, you know, signaled

886
00:49:40,160 --> 00:49:43,840
Speaker 1: a he's not Kareem, but there's a new kid in town.

887
00:49:44,239 --> 00:49:47,200
Speaker 1: And he played the game differently, but he was He

888
00:49:47,239 --> 00:49:49,080
Speaker 1: was one of those guys that I just I was

889
00:49:49,120 --> 00:49:52,400
Speaker 1: always fascinated when he was playing at his peak. If

890
00:49:52,440 --> 00:49:55,680
Speaker 1: I put you in charge of college basketball, what changes

891
00:49:55,680 --> 00:50:01,319
Speaker 1: would you make. Well, I don't know if it's just

892
00:50:01,400 --> 00:50:05,480
Speaker 1: college basketball, but it's it's it's the big sports, the

893
00:50:05,560 --> 00:50:09,839
Speaker 1: revenue producing sports. I just think that the big power

894
00:50:09,920 --> 00:50:12,600
Speaker 1: five should just seceed from the Union and start their

895
00:50:12,600 --> 00:50:16,120
Speaker 1: own n C Double a start their own governing body

896
00:50:16,200 --> 00:50:19,160
Speaker 1: and then decide how do we divvy up you know,

897
00:50:19,239 --> 00:50:21,960
Speaker 1: this piece of the pie. You know, how do you

898
00:50:22,000 --> 00:50:25,160
Speaker 1: pay players? I don't know how to do that. Should

899
00:50:25,160 --> 00:50:28,160
Speaker 1: you be able to capitalize on your image and likeness? Absolutely,

900
00:50:28,400 --> 00:50:31,440
Speaker 1: I mean it's your image and your likeness. The school

901
00:50:31,480 --> 00:50:36,040
Speaker 1: doesn't own that, it should known that. But I just

902
00:50:36,120 --> 00:50:38,600
Speaker 1: think we're going to get to the point where, you know,

903
00:50:38,719 --> 00:50:41,799
Speaker 1: Texas and Ohio staid, and you know, some of these

904
00:50:42,120 --> 00:50:44,279
Speaker 1: Alabama are just gonna say why are we Why are

905
00:50:44,280 --> 00:50:46,799
Speaker 1: we putting up with this? And then you just let

906
00:50:46,840 --> 00:50:51,440
Speaker 1: the other schools, you know, they're gonna have to just survive. Um.

907
00:50:51,560 --> 00:50:53,839
Speaker 1: You know, you know there's gonna be casualties there. But

908
00:50:54,400 --> 00:50:57,040
Speaker 1: the n C double as antiquated. But you know when

909
00:50:57,040 --> 00:50:59,640
Speaker 1: somebody says, oh, how do you pay them? I don't know,

910
00:51:00,560 --> 00:51:04,600
Speaker 1: you know, And I always use this parallel. Sam Donald

911
00:51:04,600 --> 00:51:08,240
Speaker 1: at USC was worth more than Josh Allen at Wyoming.

912
00:51:08,400 --> 00:51:11,400
Speaker 1: They can both be first round picks. But Sam is

913
00:51:11,440 --> 00:51:15,600
Speaker 1: at USC, which is generating far more money than Wyoming is,

914
00:51:17,800 --> 00:51:20,800
Speaker 1: but doesn't. But doesn't that also signify that the school

915
00:51:20,920 --> 00:51:24,120
Speaker 1: has the value more than the player has the value? Right?

916
00:51:24,239 --> 00:51:26,799
Speaker 1: Like like look who I've often pointed this out, like

917
00:51:27,040 --> 00:51:29,640
Speaker 1: who goes to and watches these games? And the first

918
00:51:29,680 --> 00:51:32,359
Speaker 1: thing is we we do we do this one thing

919
00:51:32,360 --> 00:51:35,319
Speaker 1: where we talk about basketball as if basketball players have

920
00:51:35,400 --> 00:51:37,879
Speaker 1: so much value, but as you and I both know,

921
00:51:38,480 --> 00:51:40,239
Speaker 1: that's not really they don't really make the money for

922
00:51:40,239 --> 00:51:43,520
Speaker 1: the university. College basketball programs don't make the college football

923
00:51:43,560 --> 00:51:46,360
Speaker 1: programs make the money. We know the college basketball players

924
00:51:46,360 --> 00:51:48,960
Speaker 1: because you can see their faces. College basketball also has

925
00:51:49,000 --> 00:51:50,279
Speaker 1: the ability you don't have to go to college and

926
00:51:50,440 --> 00:51:52,680
Speaker 1: the G League and if you want to have your

927
00:51:52,680 --> 00:51:54,680
Speaker 1: own shoe deal you can you can go play overseas,

928
00:51:54,680 --> 00:51:56,759
Speaker 1: you don't have to go for a year. But we

929
00:51:56,760 --> 00:51:59,640
Speaker 1: we act like basketball players have this value and they

930
00:51:59,719 --> 00:52:04,000
Speaker 1: really don't. Um we're as football that has the value,

931
00:52:04,040 --> 00:52:06,000
Speaker 1: but we don't actually know the players because we can't

932
00:52:06,000 --> 00:52:08,560
Speaker 1: see them and we cheer for the jerseys. I do

933
00:52:08,640 --> 00:52:11,280
Speaker 1: think that part of that, part of that, we don't

934
00:52:11,320 --> 00:52:17,760
Speaker 1: tell the true story to it. Well, once again, college reform.

935
00:52:17,800 --> 00:52:21,239
Speaker 1: I don't have answers to it. I truly don't, and

936
00:52:21,280 --> 00:52:23,640
Speaker 1: I and I always listen when somebody says, hey, I

937
00:52:23,680 --> 00:52:26,320
Speaker 1: got an idea, and a lot of times it boils

938
00:52:26,360 --> 00:52:30,279
Speaker 1: down to let's give them a stipend or I don't.

939
00:52:30,320 --> 00:52:33,719
Speaker 1: I don't know how that you can distribute evenly. How

940
00:52:33,800 --> 00:52:36,280
Speaker 1: I can say, well, you're at Ohio, you're justin fields

941
00:52:36,280 --> 00:52:39,359
Speaker 1: at Ohio State. Well you're gonna be worth the same

942
00:52:39,400 --> 00:52:43,360
Speaker 1: thing as a quarterback at Central Florida. I don't know

943
00:52:43,400 --> 00:52:47,520
Speaker 1: how we get there, um, because I still think that

944
00:52:49,400 --> 00:52:52,800
Speaker 1: I don't know if we'll ever get there, because I

945
00:52:52,640 --> 00:52:55,080
Speaker 1: and if I give you your let's say, you can

946
00:52:55,120 --> 00:52:57,359
Speaker 1: capitalize your name and likeness, and I say, hey, we're

947
00:52:57,360 --> 00:52:59,840
Speaker 1: gonna do a meet and greet. We just uh Alabama

948
00:53:00,000 --> 00:53:02,239
Speaker 1: to speach South Carolina, and when we go back home,

949
00:53:02,280 --> 00:53:05,000
Speaker 1: we're gonna have a meet and Greek. And I'm a

950
00:53:05,040 --> 00:53:07,880
Speaker 1: card dealer. I can pay you whatever I want to

951
00:53:07,880 --> 00:53:13,600
Speaker 1: pay you right right. You can't. You can't limit earrings.

952
00:53:13,600 --> 00:53:15,400
Speaker 1: They try to do that with assistant coaches, couldn't do

953
00:53:15,440 --> 00:53:18,600
Speaker 1: it years ago. They can't do with players, you know. Yeah,

954
00:53:18,640 --> 00:53:22,839
Speaker 1: So so what's gonna stop me? If you know, Hey,

955
00:53:22,960 --> 00:53:26,640
Speaker 1: the boosters at Alabama they're going to give you a

956
00:53:26,640 --> 00:53:29,800
Speaker 1: million dollars. Let's let's say you're, you know, one of

957
00:53:29,840 --> 00:53:33,000
Speaker 1: their wide receivers. Jury who's gonna be a top ten pick.

958
00:53:33,080 --> 00:53:36,399
Speaker 1: All right, if you come to Alabama, you're gonna make

959
00:53:36,440 --> 00:53:40,400
Speaker 1: a million dollars a year for the first three years.

960
00:53:40,680 --> 00:53:44,120
Speaker 1: If you decide to stay, I'm gonna give you a

961
00:53:44,239 --> 00:53:46,120
Speaker 1: three million dollars. Whatever it is. I mean, you can

962
00:53:46,160 --> 00:53:53,040
Speaker 1: say all hypothetical, what what's what's the butt? No there is.

963
00:53:53,200 --> 00:53:56,239
Speaker 1: I mean, you're you're gonna be able to do that. Well, here,

964
00:53:56,280 --> 00:53:57,600
Speaker 1: there's a couple of butts to me, But go ahead,

965
00:53:57,600 --> 00:54:00,560
Speaker 1: give me your butt. Well, let's say you know the

966
00:54:00,640 --> 00:54:03,239
Speaker 1: late Teboon Pickings. He wants to build a dynasty at

967
00:54:03,280 --> 00:54:05,879
Speaker 1: Oklahoma State. He's got the money to do it, so

968
00:54:06,360 --> 00:54:09,680
Speaker 1: why can't he just pay whatever he needs to pay.

969
00:54:09,880 --> 00:54:13,719
Speaker 1: Let's say he spends fifty million dollars each year on

970
00:54:13,760 --> 00:54:18,359
Speaker 1: the football program with just bonuses name, using your name

971
00:54:18,360 --> 00:54:22,440
Speaker 1: and likeness. Now, now every other school is going to

972
00:54:22,480 --> 00:54:25,239
Speaker 1: be doing that, or there'll be schools that can't do that.

973
00:54:25,880 --> 00:54:29,439
Speaker 1: But I think that that's you know, it's not gonna

974
00:54:29,719 --> 00:54:34,000
Speaker 1: get rid of paying athletes. You'll pay them above table.

975
00:54:34,560 --> 00:54:37,600
Speaker 1: But I just think it's a dangerous precedent. If I'm

976
00:54:37,600 --> 00:54:39,600
Speaker 1: going to bring you in and go I can pay

977
00:54:39,600 --> 00:54:41,880
Speaker 1: you whatever I want. If I have a high to

978
00:54:42,080 --> 00:54:45,040
Speaker 1: a tongue of biolos is worth what right now? Trevor

979
00:54:45,160 --> 00:54:48,520
Speaker 1: Lawrence is worth what to Clemson's football program right now?

980
00:54:49,760 --> 00:54:52,120
Speaker 1: I don't know can you put a dollar figure on that?

981
00:54:52,440 --> 00:54:55,160
Speaker 1: But if I say, hey, don't go to Alabama, Trevor,

982
00:54:55,280 --> 00:54:58,120
Speaker 1: come to Clemson. We got a booster who's gonna pay

983
00:54:58,160 --> 00:55:02,440
Speaker 1: you five million dollar or is a year ten million dollars,

984
00:55:02,480 --> 00:55:04,560
Speaker 1: whatever it is, We're gonna pay you ten million dollars

985
00:55:04,560 --> 00:55:07,960
Speaker 1: over your career. I don't know, but you know that

986
00:55:08,160 --> 00:55:09,680
Speaker 1: that way, some of the money that might be going

987
00:55:09,719 --> 00:55:11,560
Speaker 1: to these head coaches is actually going to go to

988
00:55:11,600 --> 00:55:14,520
Speaker 1: the players. Yeah, my my way of look at I

989
00:55:14,520 --> 00:55:16,320
Speaker 1: just don't think that's what it's supposed to be about.

990
00:55:16,400 --> 00:55:18,439
Speaker 1: Like I get that we're all in this, Like, look,

991
00:55:18,719 --> 00:55:23,000
Speaker 1: all college students make money for their university, Like as

992
00:55:23,160 --> 00:55:25,359
Speaker 1: make a disproportionate amount of money for the un That's

993
00:55:25,360 --> 00:55:27,359
Speaker 1: the way that college works. And when you get done

994
00:55:27,400 --> 00:55:29,879
Speaker 1: with college, then you get one done with college, then

995
00:55:29,960 --> 00:55:31,960
Speaker 1: you use your time with the university to get you

996
00:55:31,960 --> 00:55:34,560
Speaker 1: your first job, to get you your second job, to

997
00:55:34,640 --> 00:55:37,120
Speaker 1: get your fallback jobs where your friendships are. Like that's

998
00:55:37,120 --> 00:55:40,399
Speaker 1: what it's about. And I don't I don't understand how

999
00:55:40,520 --> 00:55:43,839
Speaker 1: we and I don't think you're there, but so many

1000
00:55:43,920 --> 00:55:45,960
Speaker 1: in the media have gotten to this, Well it's it's

1001
00:55:46,000 --> 00:55:49,799
Speaker 1: only about getting money, where I don't. I think there's

1002
00:55:49,840 --> 00:55:52,600
Speaker 1: a ton of value just in getting into school harder.

1003
00:55:52,760 --> 00:55:55,239
Speaker 1: You know, you have you have all your gaggle of

1004
00:55:55,320 --> 00:55:57,399
Speaker 1: kids you've had to put through school, Like how hard

1005
00:55:57,480 --> 00:55:59,879
Speaker 1: is it to get your son into USC? Like that's

1006
00:55:59,880 --> 00:56:02,200
Speaker 1: a USC used to be a super easy school to

1007
00:56:02,200 --> 00:56:05,400
Speaker 1: get into. Now it's not very very difficult in addition

1008
00:56:05,400 --> 00:56:08,640
Speaker 1: to very expensive. Um So, in addition to the scholarship

1009
00:56:08,800 --> 00:56:11,360
Speaker 1: and to the training and to the promotion, which is valuable,

1010
00:56:11,440 --> 00:56:15,520
Speaker 1: just getting into the school is valuable, but more than anything, like, look,

1011
00:56:15,520 --> 00:56:18,160
Speaker 1: that's just now what it's about. And I understand that

1012
00:56:18,200 --> 00:56:22,040
Speaker 1: people think that life is about making money and when

1013
00:56:22,080 --> 00:56:25,200
Speaker 1: somebody makes money off of you, but that's just that's honestly,

1014
00:56:25,640 --> 00:56:28,640
Speaker 1: Colleges make money off their students. It's no different for

1015
00:56:28,920 --> 00:56:31,720
Speaker 1: a football player as it is for an engineering student.

1016
00:56:32,239 --> 00:56:36,040
Speaker 1: Um and Yeah, occasionally there are outliers like a Trevor

1017
00:56:36,160 --> 00:56:40,480
Speaker 1: Lawrence who makes money for them. Initially, um M might

1018
00:56:40,520 --> 00:56:42,200
Speaker 1: come back to the even the Trevor Lawrence thing would

1019
00:56:42,200 --> 00:56:43,799
Speaker 1: be Clemson has never had an empty seat in their

1020
00:56:43,840 --> 00:56:46,600
Speaker 1: house before Trevor Lawrence is there after, he's there for

1021
00:56:46,640 --> 00:56:49,480
Speaker 1: the rest of in perpetuity. So does he make them

1022
00:56:49,520 --> 00:56:52,120
Speaker 1: some money? Sure? Sure, does he make them as much

1023
00:56:52,160 --> 00:56:54,600
Speaker 1: as people try and make it out to be. The

1024
00:56:54,640 --> 00:56:57,800
Speaker 1: answer is no, absolutely not. The value of Clemson's brand,

1025
00:56:57,840 --> 00:57:01,120
Speaker 1: because they put together a product because of the university,

1026
00:57:01,200 --> 00:57:03,960
Speaker 1: is really what's made the most of the money. I'm

1027
00:57:04,000 --> 00:57:06,920
Speaker 1: not here to hand out money. I'm just looking at

1028
00:57:07,000 --> 00:57:09,680
Speaker 1: this and saying, and we can sit here on our

1029
00:57:09,760 --> 00:57:12,319
Speaker 1: high horse and go, oh, how can you, you know,

1030
00:57:12,520 --> 00:57:15,600
Speaker 1: be asking for money or shouldn't you just be appreciative

1031
00:57:15,600 --> 00:57:17,640
Speaker 1: of you get the opportunity to play on a big stage.

1032
00:57:19,040 --> 00:57:21,040
Speaker 1: We were not coming from a lot of places where

1033
00:57:21,040 --> 00:57:23,720
Speaker 1: these kids are coming from. And if I came from

1034
00:57:23,920 --> 00:57:27,480
Speaker 1: inner city or single parents or whatever it might be, yeah,

1035
00:57:27,520 --> 00:57:31,480
Speaker 1: i'd have my hand out. I would. But you know,

1036
00:57:31,600 --> 00:57:34,600
Speaker 1: I was fortunate to have both my parents, and my

1037
00:57:34,680 --> 00:57:38,200
Speaker 1: dad made a whopping twenty dollars a year, so we

1038
00:57:38,200 --> 00:57:42,200
Speaker 1: were swimming in money. But if you know, these kids

1039
00:57:42,200 --> 00:57:45,720
Speaker 1: are looking at say where's mine because they've never had it.

1040
00:57:46,240 --> 00:57:48,640
Speaker 1: So I think we can look at this and say,

1041
00:57:48,840 --> 00:57:51,320
Speaker 1: you know, let's be altruistic and go, boy, just the

1042
00:57:51,360 --> 00:57:54,520
Speaker 1: experience of being in college. Does it help you? Yes?

1043
00:57:54,640 --> 00:57:58,920
Speaker 1: Does it help you with playing professionally? Absolutely? But I

1044
00:57:58,960 --> 00:58:03,560
Speaker 1: also have to look at this realistically and say, what

1045
00:58:03,640 --> 00:58:07,560
Speaker 1: would I feel if I'm a quarterback or running back

1046
00:58:07,680 --> 00:58:11,200
Speaker 1: or and I'm making this money for them or we're

1047
00:58:11,320 --> 00:58:15,880
Speaker 1: keeping the machine going. I would want something and I

1048
00:58:15,600 --> 00:58:19,520
Speaker 1: I played with guys who got things, and you know,

1049
00:58:19,600 --> 00:58:22,400
Speaker 1: it was just commonplace. But I can't sit there and

1050
00:58:22,440 --> 00:58:25,400
Speaker 1: go because I was never good enough to ask for anything.

1051
00:58:26,120 --> 00:58:29,480
Speaker 1: But I can't be naive and go I would you

1052
00:58:29,600 --> 00:58:34,560
Speaker 1: be asking for it? I would be, um, Okay, you

1053
00:58:34,600 --> 00:58:36,440
Speaker 1: were a great you were a shooter, you were a

1054
00:58:36,760 --> 00:58:42,920
Speaker 1: chucker who would pass um. We operate under the auspice

1055
00:58:43,000 --> 00:58:45,760
Speaker 1: that Steph Curry is the greatest shooter we've ever seen.

1056
00:58:46,000 --> 00:58:51,640
Speaker 1: Are you okay with that? Sure? Yeah? I don't. I don't.

1057
00:58:51,880 --> 00:58:55,040
Speaker 1: I'm not beholding to you know, my my childhood days

1058
00:58:55,720 --> 00:58:57,840
Speaker 1: where I go, oh, you know what that guy would

1059
00:58:57,840 --> 00:59:00,760
Speaker 1: have been? He's better. Jerry West was better, teeth Marabich

1060
00:59:00,840 --> 00:59:06,600
Speaker 1: was Steph Curry today is there's there's no rival when

1061
00:59:06,600 --> 00:59:10,920
Speaker 1: it comes to his range. Uh, you know, I I

1062
00:59:11,000 --> 00:59:15,840
Speaker 1: look at Bird doing the and how many guys have

1063
00:59:15,960 --> 00:59:21,240
Speaker 1: done that no matter what generation Steve Nash, Uh, Steph,

1064
00:59:21,400 --> 00:59:25,880
Speaker 1: you know that that's it doesn't It doesn't take long

1065
00:59:26,040 --> 00:59:27,680
Speaker 1: for role called. Now, if you said I'm going to

1066
00:59:27,840 --> 00:59:31,720
Speaker 1: teach the form of shooting, then that's different because I

1067
00:59:31,760 --> 00:59:34,960
Speaker 1: would say Clay Thompson over Steph Curry. I would take

1068
00:59:35,080 --> 00:59:40,440
Speaker 1: Ray Allen over those guys. But as far as shooting

1069
00:59:41,200 --> 00:59:46,640
Speaker 1: been results and range creativity, yeah, I have no problem

1070
00:59:46,680 --> 00:59:50,160
Speaker 1: with Steph Curry, your favorite basketball Jim You've ever been

1071
00:59:50,160 --> 01:00:02,760
Speaker 1: in Larry Birds High School gym and French Look, Indiana.

1072
01:00:02,920 --> 01:00:07,240
Speaker 1: When I went down to do a story on him,

1073
01:00:05,720 --> 01:00:12,760
Speaker 1: Uh huh? What was it like? Quaint home court advantage?

1074
01:00:13,320 --> 01:00:19,680
Speaker 1: Bleachers right there? It I could only imagine when you know,

1075
01:00:19,720 --> 01:00:23,600
Speaker 1: he's firing jumpers from the corner, probably fallen into the

1076
01:00:23,680 --> 01:00:27,720
Speaker 1: stands and just and it was small, the ceiling was

1077
01:00:27,880 --> 01:00:30,200
Speaker 1: lower than what you would think. And I got to

1078
01:00:30,240 --> 01:00:33,240
Speaker 1: believe that that was a pretty good home court advantage

1079
01:00:33,280 --> 01:00:37,640
Speaker 1: for him. That that in Alan Field House, I went,

1080
01:00:37,800 --> 01:00:40,480
Speaker 1: I went. I didn't even work. I went to Alan

1081
01:00:40,560 --> 01:00:44,200
Speaker 1: Field House to watch Ku play against Cow with Jay Kidd,

1082
01:00:44,840 --> 01:00:47,280
Speaker 1: and I went on my own because I just wanted

1083
01:00:47,320 --> 01:00:51,600
Speaker 1: to experience. PAULI was Paully Pavilion wasn't as magical as

1084
01:00:51,640 --> 01:00:54,360
Speaker 1: I thought. It's not. I mean, they've redone it, but

1085
01:00:54,360 --> 01:00:57,760
Speaker 1: it's still not nothing special. Yeah, it was a little

1086
01:00:57,760 --> 01:01:03,200
Speaker 1: more antiseptic. Um Notre Dame. When I went there, I

1087
01:01:03,360 --> 01:01:06,440
Speaker 1: was I was surprised that the football stadium was smaller

1088
01:01:06,440 --> 01:01:08,480
Speaker 1: than I thought because it looks bigger on TV. And

1089
01:01:08,520 --> 01:01:13,120
Speaker 1: then the basketball arena the same way. I really liked

1090
01:01:13,320 --> 01:01:16,000
Speaker 1: the look of that. I like the the I'm big

1091
01:01:16,040 --> 01:01:18,760
Speaker 1: on the acoustics, like I I like hearing it. I

1092
01:01:18,840 --> 01:01:21,680
Speaker 1: like the sound of the ball. I like you know,

1093
01:01:21,720 --> 01:01:25,080
Speaker 1: the net, everything about that. But I Notre Dame. I

1094
01:01:24,800 --> 01:01:28,960
Speaker 1: I appreciated that. I didn't like Assembly because I don't

1095
01:01:28,960 --> 01:01:34,240
Speaker 1: like the way it's configured. Um Syracuses. You know, it's

1096
01:01:34,280 --> 01:01:37,440
Speaker 1: worth seeing, but it's not one of my favorites. Um

1097
01:01:38,840 --> 01:01:42,720
Speaker 1: Duke was great. Uh, but they put put you up

1098
01:01:42,760 --> 01:01:46,200
Speaker 1: all the way in the rafters there, so you lose

1099
01:01:46,240 --> 01:01:49,400
Speaker 1: a little bit of that ambiance. But you know, that

1100
01:01:49,600 --> 01:01:51,520
Speaker 1: was the place that I wanted to go see as well.

1101
01:01:51,560 --> 01:01:53,440
Speaker 1: I mean those are just some off the top of

1102
01:01:53,480 --> 01:01:57,080
Speaker 1: my head. By the way, Springs Valley is the larybirds

1103
01:01:57,120 --> 01:02:00,560
Speaker 1: High school gym. Yeah, and kind of permanent seating all

1104
01:02:00,600 --> 01:02:03,320
Speaker 1: around in like a bowl and then just the floor.

1105
01:02:03,440 --> 01:02:05,360
Speaker 1: That's it, right, It's kind of kind of simple. Same

1106
01:02:05,400 --> 01:02:08,920
Speaker 1: way it was when when Larry Bird was there. I

1107
01:02:09,000 --> 01:02:13,760
Speaker 1: actually went on a vacation to the French Lit Hotel

1108
01:02:15,000 --> 01:02:19,760
Speaker 1: and I took my girlfriend just so because because the

1109
01:02:19,920 --> 01:02:23,000
Speaker 1: thought I could see Larry Bird. I went from Dayton,

1110
01:02:23,040 --> 01:02:27,840
Speaker 1: Ohio with my girlfriend at the time, and Betsy had

1111
01:02:27,880 --> 01:02:29,520
Speaker 1: no idea why we were there, but I said, oh,

1112
01:02:29,560 --> 01:02:31,960
Speaker 1: they got these hot springs and it's it's you know,

1113
01:02:32,000 --> 01:02:35,920
Speaker 1: they got a spa there. And all I did was

1114
01:02:36,080 --> 01:02:41,880
Speaker 1: spend the day driving over to Larry Bird's house hoping

1115
01:02:41,920 --> 01:02:46,120
Speaker 1: he would be there. It's pretty sad. Um. I mean,

1116
01:02:46,120 --> 01:02:48,360
Speaker 1: I'm not gonna that. I can't top that, but I

1117
01:02:48,400 --> 01:02:52,640
Speaker 1: will tell you that my dad and I um one

1118
01:02:52,680 --> 01:02:56,920
Speaker 1: time we drove from New York to Chicago and we

1119
01:02:56,960 --> 01:02:59,560
Speaker 1: stopped in Dylanville, Ohio, where he was a high school coach,

1120
01:03:00,200 --> 01:03:01,920
Speaker 1: and we stayed there for a night. But we also

1121
01:03:02,000 --> 01:03:06,960
Speaker 1: stayed um in um Uh, Steve Alford's hometown, so we

1122
01:03:07,000 --> 01:03:10,040
Speaker 1: could see Chrysler Arena the I think it was Chrysler

1123
01:03:10,600 --> 01:03:12,800
Speaker 1: Field House or something like that where where he played.

1124
01:03:12,800 --> 01:03:16,480
Speaker 1: It was Steve Alford's high school, Jim and we we

1125
01:03:16,560 --> 01:03:19,840
Speaker 1: met with his dad. We talked about his uh uh

1126
01:03:20,080 --> 01:03:22,400
Speaker 1: it was Chrysler Arena. It was the biggest high school

1127
01:03:22,480 --> 01:03:25,040
Speaker 1: gym in the country at the time. And my dad

1128
01:03:25,080 --> 01:03:26,920
Speaker 1: worked me out on the high school floor just so

1129
01:03:26,960 --> 01:03:29,400
Speaker 1: I could kind of get a sense as Newcastle High

1130
01:03:29,400 --> 01:03:32,280
Speaker 1: School in Indiana and it seats like, you know, nine

1131
01:03:32,320 --> 01:03:34,640
Speaker 1: thousand people or something crazy like that, So it doesn't

1132
01:03:34,800 --> 01:03:37,320
Speaker 1: I didn't take my girlfriend there. But there are some

1133
01:03:37,360 --> 01:03:41,760
Speaker 1: similarities in that tale. Oh, I know it's I'm sad,

1134
01:03:41,920 --> 01:03:44,919
Speaker 1: but not now, but you know, I make no apologies.

1135
01:03:45,240 --> 01:03:47,960
Speaker 1: And and Birds not that much older than me, and

1136
01:03:48,040 --> 01:03:51,400
Speaker 1: you know, here I am, you know, following him around,

1137
01:03:51,400 --> 01:03:54,360
Speaker 1: hoping he might be outside shooting hoops there and uh,

1138
01:03:54,520 --> 01:03:57,080
Speaker 1: I never saw him. It's like that movie Searching for

1139
01:03:57,160 --> 01:04:01,120
Speaker 1: Bobby Fisher where they're searching on seeing Burl Larry Bird.

1140
01:04:01,600 --> 01:04:02,840
Speaker 1: I don't know what I was gonna do if I

1141
01:04:02,880 --> 01:04:06,440
Speaker 1: saw him, because you know, he's not the most approachable guy.

1142
01:04:06,720 --> 01:04:10,200
Speaker 1: But I, for some reason, I just I wanted to.

1143
01:04:10,440 --> 01:04:13,160
Speaker 1: I wanted to shoot hoops with him. Last thing, Um,

1144
01:04:13,200 --> 01:04:15,800
Speaker 1: you've gone back and done Sports Center, the four year anniversary.

1145
01:04:16,440 --> 01:04:20,400
Speaker 1: You've done Super Bowls, You've done NBA Finals, You've done

1146
01:04:20,440 --> 01:04:24,520
Speaker 1: just about everything you can do in this business. Um Like,

1147
01:04:24,600 --> 01:04:26,040
Speaker 1: do you want to go back and do like a

1148
01:04:26,120 --> 01:04:28,280
Speaker 1: play by play of a of a college game, of

1149
01:04:28,400 --> 01:04:30,880
Speaker 1: NBA game? Like if you're gonna pick some things you

1150
01:04:30,920 --> 01:04:32,480
Speaker 1: want to do, and like now you have your own

1151
01:04:32,520 --> 01:04:37,240
Speaker 1: you have your own college that teaches broadcasters. What is

1152
01:04:37,240 --> 01:04:38,920
Speaker 1: there anything on the bucket list that you still want

1153
01:04:38,920 --> 01:04:42,480
Speaker 1: to do outside of like personal stuff? Right, Like, obviously

1154
01:04:42,480 --> 01:04:43,760
Speaker 1: I know you want to travel with your wife and

1155
01:04:43,800 --> 01:04:46,280
Speaker 1: see the world. But in terms of sports, you can

1156
01:04:46,320 --> 01:04:47,680
Speaker 1: pick what you want to do. What do you want

1157
01:04:47,680 --> 01:04:53,480
Speaker 1: to do? I don't have anything. I think I wanted

1158
01:04:53,520 --> 01:04:56,200
Speaker 1: to to work as Super Bowl because when I worked

1159
01:04:56,200 --> 01:04:58,840
Speaker 1: at ESPN, we were always on the outside looking in.

1160
01:04:59,040 --> 01:05:03,560
Speaker 1: We weren't the rights holders, and so I like Greg

1161
01:05:03,600 --> 01:05:06,440
Speaker 1: Norman and Nick Faldo. I was there at Augusta, but

1162
01:05:06,600 --> 01:05:09,840
Speaker 1: I wasn't working on the in the broadcast. I was

1163
01:05:09,880 --> 01:05:12,880
Speaker 1: just covering it. Uh you know, I got to go

1164
01:05:12,920 --> 01:05:15,720
Speaker 1: to Super Bowls for the Mothership, but we weren't part

1165
01:05:15,720 --> 01:05:18,360
Speaker 1: of the broadcast team. Or I go to the World Series,

1166
01:05:18,400 --> 01:05:21,040
Speaker 1: but I wasn't part of Fox. And then to be

1167
01:05:21,120 --> 01:05:24,240
Speaker 1: able to go and cover a super Bowl and hand

1168
01:05:24,280 --> 01:05:29,400
Speaker 1: out the super Bowl Trophy, that's probably the highlight. I mean,

1169
01:05:29,400 --> 01:05:32,400
Speaker 1: that's that in the hosting the Olympics, that I just

1170
01:05:32,560 --> 01:05:37,120
Speaker 1: wanted to be a part of the event itself, not cover,

1171
01:05:38,200 --> 01:05:41,360
Speaker 1: you know, the event. It was being in the moment

1172
01:05:41,400 --> 01:05:44,760
Speaker 1: there and to be able to do that um in

1173
01:05:44,840 --> 01:05:47,400
Speaker 1: a few Olympics and then I handed out super Bowl

1174
01:05:47,440 --> 01:05:50,480
Speaker 1: Trophy I think five times. And you know that that's

1175
01:05:50,480 --> 01:05:53,880
Speaker 1: where you got a little kid from Mason, Ohio. And

1176
01:05:54,120 --> 01:05:56,160
Speaker 1: you know, we weren't even a city or a town.

1177
01:05:56,280 --> 01:05:59,200
Speaker 1: We were a village when I was growing up. I

1178
01:05:59,280 --> 01:06:02,000
Speaker 1: never told anybody the first time I did it in Tampa.

1179
01:06:02,160 --> 01:06:04,000
Speaker 1: I didn't tell anybody in my family I was going

1180
01:06:04,040 --> 01:06:06,840
Speaker 1: to give out the trophy because I wanted them to

1181
01:06:06,960 --> 01:06:12,760
Speaker 1: experience it in real in real time, and to do it.

1182
01:06:13,240 --> 01:06:17,040
Speaker 1: And then I walked off that podium and I remember

1183
01:06:17,080 --> 01:06:21,480
Speaker 1: there was all this confetti. Everybody was celebrating, and I

1184
01:06:21,920 --> 01:06:26,040
Speaker 1: walked off as if I won that Super Bowl because

1185
01:06:26,120 --> 01:06:29,880
Speaker 1: I handed out the trophy. And I remember going into

1186
01:06:29,920 --> 01:06:33,600
Speaker 1: the trailer that we had at NBC and I just

1187
01:06:33,880 --> 01:06:39,040
Speaker 1: I sat there, I sat down and I started crying

1188
01:06:40,600 --> 01:06:44,120
Speaker 1: because I was like, how did I get here? My

1189
01:06:44,280 --> 01:06:47,600
Speaker 1: Dad's not alive, and you're just and you know, then

1190
01:06:47,600 --> 01:06:49,600
Speaker 1: all of a sudden, my brothers and sisters were like,

1191
01:06:49,680 --> 01:06:52,960
Speaker 1: oh my god, you're hand out super Bowl. I didn't

1192
01:06:53,000 --> 01:06:56,600
Speaker 1: do it for them, but I'm glad they got to

1193
01:06:56,720 --> 01:07:00,240
Speaker 1: share in that. And you know that that's a lot

1194
01:07:00,240 --> 01:07:03,520
Speaker 1: of the moments that you have, Like it's emotional now,

1195
01:07:04,560 --> 01:07:09,240
Speaker 1: but in the moment, in the moment, you don't no, no,

1196
01:07:09,440 --> 01:07:11,360
Speaker 1: you just do it. But then you you start to

1197
01:07:11,400 --> 01:07:15,040
Speaker 1: reflect and you go, how did I get here? And

1198
01:07:15,080 --> 01:07:18,520
Speaker 1: that's why I always tell people, don't let somebody tell

1199
01:07:18,560 --> 01:07:21,479
Speaker 1: you you can't. You're going to be the one who

1200
01:07:21,520 --> 01:07:24,480
Speaker 1: decides that you can't. There were so many times I

1201
01:07:24,480 --> 01:07:27,000
Speaker 1: could have just said, you know, I'm not gonna do it,

1202
01:07:27,720 --> 01:07:30,720
Speaker 1: you know, the hell with it. I'm not gonna get

1203
01:07:30,760 --> 01:07:34,080
Speaker 1: a chance and to do it, and then just sit

1204
01:07:34,120 --> 01:07:36,520
Speaker 1: there and I'm by myself in a trailer and I'm going,

1205
01:07:37,440 --> 01:07:40,480
Speaker 1: how did I How did I get here? And and

1206
01:07:40,560 --> 01:07:43,240
Speaker 1: everybody else, you know, you don't notice that people handing

1207
01:07:43,240 --> 01:07:46,000
Speaker 1: out the super Bowl trophy unless something bad happens or whatever.

1208
01:07:46,120 --> 01:07:48,800
Speaker 1: And you know, I just did it and then you

1209
01:07:48,880 --> 01:07:54,080
Speaker 1: walk off and you go, I I never would have

1210
01:07:54,120 --> 01:07:57,120
Speaker 1: thought it, you know, I never ever would have dreamed

1211
01:07:57,160 --> 01:08:00,080
Speaker 1: that I'm handing out the super Bowl Trophy and you

1212
01:08:00,560 --> 01:08:02,120
Speaker 1: do it. Yeah, I you know, I always want to

1213
01:08:02,120 --> 01:08:04,000
Speaker 1: work the Final Four. I left ESPN to work the

1214
01:08:04,040 --> 01:08:08,360
Speaker 1: Final Four, and uh, I signed a contract to work

1215
01:08:08,400 --> 01:08:10,880
Speaker 1: the Final Four for five or six years. And I

1216
01:08:10,920 --> 01:08:13,000
Speaker 1: only really did it twice. And I only really sat

1217
01:08:13,080 --> 01:08:16,840
Speaker 1: on that set once. And it's a hard thing for

1218
01:08:16,880 --> 01:08:20,280
Speaker 1: me to process now because my dad was alive, and

1219
01:08:20,360 --> 01:08:22,840
Speaker 1: yet because it was my first year and really turn

1220
01:08:22,960 --> 01:08:25,920
Speaker 1: kind of controls that thing. Like I didn't feel like

1221
01:08:26,520 --> 01:08:29,280
Speaker 1: I didn't push about getting my wife down there, my

1222
01:08:29,439 --> 01:08:32,320
Speaker 1: kids down there, like my wife was you know, met

1223
01:08:32,360 --> 01:08:35,439
Speaker 1: me eventually, but I kind of did it all by myself.

1224
01:08:35,520 --> 01:08:38,479
Speaker 1: My dad didn't come like backstage and and hang out

1225
01:08:38,520 --> 01:08:40,200
Speaker 1: with Charles because I just figured like I'd be doing

1226
01:08:40,200 --> 01:08:42,080
Speaker 1: this for a long time. It's like my first year,

1227
01:08:42,800 --> 01:08:45,960
Speaker 1: and I had the the white man's perspective things. I

1228
01:08:46,000 --> 01:08:49,519
Speaker 1: was kind of walking on eggshells and so not having

1229
01:08:49,520 --> 01:08:51,240
Speaker 1: gotten a chance to be back on that set, like

1230
01:08:51,320 --> 01:08:55,200
Speaker 1: I have a really weird I always wanted to do it,

1231
01:08:55,320 --> 01:08:57,559
Speaker 1: and I did it, and I did a really good

1232
01:08:57,680 --> 01:09:01,080
Speaker 1: job of it. But because I, like I didn't get

1233
01:09:01,080 --> 01:09:03,360
Speaker 1: another opportunity to do it or experience it with the

1234
01:09:03,360 --> 01:09:06,080
Speaker 1: people that I cared about, I don't know if I

1235
01:09:06,120 --> 01:09:09,040
Speaker 1: have the same positive vibes of it that you have

1236
01:09:09,160 --> 01:09:13,840
Speaker 1: with the Super Bowl, for example, I left it like

1237
01:09:13,920 --> 01:09:17,320
Speaker 1: I I it's like the Olympics, Like I don't want

1238
01:09:17,439 --> 01:09:20,160
Speaker 1: to do it super Bowl. I don't long to do

1239
01:09:20,200 --> 01:09:23,760
Speaker 1: it because I did it, and I you know, I

1240
01:09:23,760 --> 01:09:26,360
Speaker 1: don't know if I can do it any better than

1241
01:09:26,400 --> 01:09:28,600
Speaker 1: I did it. Uh, you know, to be there with

1242
01:09:28,680 --> 01:09:32,639
Speaker 1: the NBA Finals, to be there with Jordan's to hand

1243
01:09:32,680 --> 01:09:36,400
Speaker 1: out an NBA championship trophy, like those are things that

1244
01:09:36,479 --> 01:09:41,000
Speaker 1: you dream about. Being on Sports Center was awesome, It was,

1245
01:09:41,400 --> 01:09:46,240
Speaker 1: you know, life changing. But these are moments that are

1246
01:09:46,320 --> 01:09:49,920
Speaker 1: bigger than Sports Center and and and it's never lost

1247
01:09:50,000 --> 01:09:54,120
Speaker 1: on me ever, never took it for granted. Ever. I'm

1248
01:09:54,160 --> 01:09:59,000
Speaker 1: formulating questions during Ben Roethlisberger's two minute drive against Arizona.

1249
01:09:59,560 --> 01:10:01,599
Speaker 1: You know, Arizona is going to win the Super Bowl?

1250
01:10:01,600 --> 01:10:03,280
Speaker 1: Who am I going to have up there? What questions

1251
01:10:03,280 --> 01:10:05,599
Speaker 1: am I gonna ask? Kurt Warner, Larry Fitzgerald? Then Ben

1252
01:10:05,600 --> 01:10:07,640
Speaker 1: froze the touchdown pad. Now I gotta go, Okay, what

1253
01:10:07,720 --> 01:10:11,280
Speaker 1: am I gonna ask? You know, coach the ownership there?

1254
01:10:11,600 --> 01:10:13,360
Speaker 1: Rooney said, what do? I asked, Ben? Who's the m

1255
01:10:13,400 --> 01:10:17,759
Speaker 1: v P? Like I never ever ever took it for granted,

1256
01:10:17,760 --> 01:10:19,240
Speaker 1: where you just get up there and you're stick of

1257
01:10:19,360 --> 01:10:22,559
Speaker 1: Mike and go, hey, how did that feel? Never ever,

1258
01:10:22,640 --> 01:10:26,720
Speaker 1: ever ever? And uh, you know, NBC gave me those opportunities,

1259
01:10:26,760 --> 01:10:30,840
Speaker 1: and ESPN gave me an opportunity and and and as

1260
01:10:30,880 --> 01:10:34,160
Speaker 1: you know, and opportunity is all you want. And therefore

1261
01:10:34,320 --> 01:10:38,640
Speaker 1: my my professional career was really based on what I

1262
01:10:38,680 --> 01:10:41,840
Speaker 1: didn't get in my athletic career. I just wanted a

1263
01:10:41,960 --> 01:10:45,519
Speaker 1: chance and I never got it. And I always vowed

1264
01:10:45,520 --> 01:10:48,439
Speaker 1: if I ever got a chance in my professional career,

1265
01:10:49,080 --> 01:10:52,640
Speaker 1: I would make sure that nobody regretted that and that

1266
01:10:52,760 --> 01:10:55,280
Speaker 1: I did it the right way. So I never ever

1267
01:10:55,280 --> 01:10:58,639
Speaker 1: stopped that feeling of just give me a chance. Um,

1268
01:10:58,760 --> 01:11:01,200
Speaker 1: and it's it's served me well, you know, it's interesting

1269
01:11:01,240 --> 01:11:07,040
Speaker 1: mine similar and my drive to continue to get opportunities

1270
01:11:07,040 --> 01:11:09,680
Speaker 1: and do things comes from I. I feel like I

1271
01:11:09,760 --> 01:11:13,120
Speaker 1: got an opportunity, but I didn't take full advantage of it, right,

1272
01:11:13,240 --> 01:11:16,120
Speaker 1: Like I had a I had a block where I

1273
01:11:16,160 --> 01:11:19,960
Speaker 1: became afraid to shoot. And you know, my my last

1274
01:11:20,000 --> 01:11:22,320
Speaker 1: college game at home at Gallaghi Arena, I hit two

1275
01:11:22,320 --> 01:11:24,679
Speaker 1: threes in the first half. We had a big lead,

1276
01:11:25,160 --> 01:11:27,679
Speaker 1: it got tight. Coach pulled me because he was afraid

1277
01:11:27,720 --> 01:11:30,160
Speaker 1: they're gonna foil me. By the time I got back

1278
01:11:30,200 --> 01:11:32,040
Speaker 1: in the game, we had no momentum. I came down

1279
01:11:32,040 --> 01:11:34,559
Speaker 1: the court and I was wide open on a on

1280
01:11:34,600 --> 01:11:37,240
Speaker 1: a pull up jump shot, three point shot. Something was

1281
01:11:37,280 --> 01:11:39,599
Speaker 1: my shot growing up in high school. And my brother

1282
01:11:39,640 --> 01:11:41,439
Speaker 1: saw me play one game in still Water that was

1283
01:11:41,479 --> 01:11:43,799
Speaker 1: that day, and we worked that morning on that shot,

1284
01:11:44,000 --> 01:11:45,880
Speaker 1: and I chickened out and didn't take the shot and

1285
01:11:45,880 --> 01:11:48,160
Speaker 1: said past to a teammate who was open and he

1286
01:11:48,200 --> 01:11:52,479
Speaker 1: and he missed. And because I didn't take advantage of

1287
01:11:52,520 --> 01:11:55,640
Speaker 1: the opportunity, I've like made a kind of similar but

1288
01:11:55,720 --> 01:11:58,840
Speaker 1: different vow to myself that I'm gonna take advance, I'm

1289
01:11:58,840 --> 01:12:01,360
Speaker 1: gonna I'm gonna shoot every I'm gonna take advantage of

1290
01:12:01,400 --> 01:12:03,519
Speaker 1: every opportunity I can get and keep working to get

1291
01:12:03,600 --> 01:12:07,400
Speaker 1: more opportunity. So there's a huge kind of similar to

1292
01:12:07,439 --> 01:12:09,680
Speaker 1: the look I've I've taken up way too much of

1293
01:12:09,720 --> 01:12:13,400
Speaker 1: your time. But I have one more question. Okay, I

1294
01:12:13,479 --> 01:12:16,000
Speaker 1: do believe that. I do believe that you're a Jordan

1295
01:12:16,040 --> 01:12:20,760
Speaker 1: ahead of Lebron guy, Um Oh yeah, but not but not,

1296
01:12:21,000 --> 01:12:24,920
Speaker 1: you know, exponentially ahead of me, because they're different. Like,

1297
01:12:25,040 --> 01:12:27,200
Speaker 1: I can't like what am I? What am I? If

1298
01:12:27,240 --> 01:12:30,799
Speaker 1: you said who's the better all around player? I'd take Lebron?

1299
01:12:31,920 --> 01:12:34,479
Speaker 1: Who do I want game on the line winning if

1300
01:12:34,520 --> 01:12:37,840
Speaker 1: I take Mike? But like you know, Mike didn't win

1301
01:12:38,080 --> 01:12:41,000
Speaker 1: for a long period. You know, Lebron was winning at

1302
01:12:41,080 --> 01:12:43,679
Speaker 1: least going to the NBA Finals, So I I try

1303
01:12:43,720 --> 01:12:46,519
Speaker 1: not to get caught up in it. I saw something

1304
01:12:46,560 --> 01:12:50,599
Speaker 1: in Mike that I I'll never see again. But Lebron,

1305
01:12:50,720 --> 01:12:54,400
Speaker 1: to me, is absolutely fascinating to watch, fascinating. Is there

1306
01:12:54,439 --> 01:12:57,240
Speaker 1: anything he can do to put himself ahead of Jordan

1307
01:12:57,320 --> 01:13:00,679
Speaker 1: in your mind? If he wins another title with the Lakers,

1308
01:13:01,920 --> 01:13:04,439
Speaker 1: then then I think we have a real conversation here.

1309
01:13:04,560 --> 01:13:08,120
Speaker 1: Because Mike did it with the Bulls. He he always

1310
01:13:08,160 --> 01:13:11,439
Speaker 1: had Scottie, they brought in Coup coach, like he he

1311
01:13:11,560 --> 01:13:13,920
Speaker 1: had a team that you know, after they took it

1312
01:13:13,960 --> 01:13:15,920
Speaker 1: out of his hands, where you know, he wanted to

1313
01:13:15,920 --> 01:13:18,839
Speaker 1: bring in players and Jerry Krauss, and you know, Ryinstor

1314
01:13:18,920 --> 01:13:22,280
Speaker 1: brought in the right people for him. But Lebron has

1315
01:13:22,320 --> 01:13:25,799
Speaker 1: picked his spots. Granted he didn't want to stay in Cleveland,

1316
01:13:26,160 --> 01:13:28,000
Speaker 1: but to do it in Cleveland, do it in Miami,

1317
01:13:28,040 --> 01:13:30,439
Speaker 1: and then if he culminates this by doing it with

1318
01:13:30,479 --> 01:13:34,040
Speaker 1: the Lakers, now we have a real conversation of where

1319
01:13:34,120 --> 01:13:36,240
Speaker 1: is Lebron on that list? You know, we we were

1320
01:13:36,400 --> 01:13:38,920
Speaker 1: we think Michael hit every every game when he shot

1321
01:13:39,439 --> 01:13:42,280
Speaker 1: I remember, remember, Lebron's afraid, you know, he's afraid. He's

1322
01:13:42,280 --> 01:13:45,600
Speaker 1: afraid to say he's not wired that way. You know,

1323
01:13:45,840 --> 01:13:49,040
Speaker 1: nobody ever said, oh does magic doesn't take all the

1324
01:13:49,040 --> 01:13:52,639
Speaker 1: big shots. I mean, he hit a hook, he had

1325
01:13:52,640 --> 01:13:54,960
Speaker 1: a runner, He dribbled the ball out and dribble the

1326
01:13:55,000 --> 01:13:57,519
Speaker 1: clock out one time in a in an NBA fund,

1327
01:13:57,600 --> 01:14:00,599
Speaker 1: Like we forget all of these things. It's a social

1328
01:14:00,640 --> 01:14:05,000
Speaker 1: media Lebron's the first player who is you know, maybe

1329
01:14:05,000 --> 01:14:07,519
Speaker 1: he's benefited from social media, but I think he's also

1330
01:14:07,680 --> 01:14:10,080
Speaker 1: taken a lot of bullets because of social media. I

1331
01:14:10,120 --> 01:14:12,960
Speaker 1: can't think of any other athlete with social media has

1332
01:14:13,000 --> 01:14:16,000
Speaker 1: taken more bullets than him. And he still does it.

1333
01:14:16,160 --> 01:14:19,040
Speaker 1: He does it. He's done a lot of things the

1334
01:14:19,120 --> 01:14:22,160
Speaker 1: right way. I mean, if you're looking at the totality

1335
01:14:22,160 --> 01:14:25,240
Speaker 1: of Mike and Lebron the person and everything else that

1336
01:14:25,320 --> 01:14:28,880
Speaker 1: goes along with it, Lebron's Lebron's got He's done a

1337
01:14:28,920 --> 01:14:31,559
Speaker 1: lot of great things in his life. And you know,

1338
01:14:32,000 --> 01:14:34,080
Speaker 1: but I think if he wins one more title, I

1339
01:14:34,160 --> 01:14:38,840
Speaker 1: really think we have an interesting discussion there. I've never

1340
01:14:38,880 --> 01:14:40,280
Speaker 1: said this to you on air, but I've said to

1341
01:14:40,320 --> 01:14:44,360
Speaker 1: you in person. I always appreciate our conversations more than anything,

1342
01:14:44,920 --> 01:14:47,639
Speaker 1: the friendship that you've shown me for no real reason,

1343
01:14:47,720 --> 01:14:50,479
Speaker 1: right Like, there's nothing I can offer you, but every

1344
01:14:50,479 --> 01:14:52,400
Speaker 1: time we get together and have a beer or have

1345
01:14:52,439 --> 01:14:54,960
Speaker 1: a conversation, you always give me great advice. And I

1346
01:14:55,040 --> 01:14:59,439
Speaker 1: really appreciate joining me on the spot. Well, I just

1347
01:15:00,400 --> 01:15:02,800
Speaker 1: and I do it because I think when I see

1348
01:15:02,840 --> 01:15:05,600
Speaker 1: somebody who has talent and maybe doesn't have all the

1349
01:15:05,640 --> 01:15:09,360
Speaker 1: answers or direction, I always wanted that from me, And

1350
01:15:09,360 --> 01:15:12,320
Speaker 1: if bob Ly didn't write a letter back to me,

1351
01:15:13,080 --> 01:15:15,400
Speaker 1: I may not have had the confidence to think I

1352
01:15:15,439 --> 01:15:18,240
Speaker 1: could do this. So it's never lost on me that

1353
01:15:18,320 --> 01:15:22,200
Speaker 1: if somebody asks, and I hope that I offer and uh,

1354
01:15:22,360 --> 01:15:24,880
Speaker 1: you know, you're a former athlete, and and to be

1355
01:15:24,920 --> 01:15:27,920
Speaker 1: able to do this is sometimes even more difficult because

1356
01:15:27,920 --> 01:15:31,680
Speaker 1: you're an athlete in people's mind. So I do it

1357
01:15:31,760 --> 01:15:35,559
Speaker 1: because I think it's ingrained in me that that's the

1358
01:15:35,640 --> 01:15:39,920
Speaker 1: right thing to do. Thanks so much, Dan, Thank you, buddy.

1359
01:15:40,160 --> 01:15:42,360
Speaker 1: Be sure to catch live editions of The Doug got

1360
01:15:42,439 --> 01:15:45,800
Speaker 1: Leap Show weekdays at noon Eastern three pm Pacific on

1361
01:15:45,880 --> 01:15:50,120
Speaker 1: Fox Sports Radio and the I Heart Radio app. All Right,

1362
01:15:50,200 --> 01:15:52,400
Speaker 1: next week we will uh man, I got a bunch

1363
01:15:52,439 --> 01:15:55,519
Speaker 1: of guests are lining up to join us next week,

1364
01:15:56,840 --> 01:15:59,600
Speaker 1: more great guests, and we'll start to preview both the

1365
01:15:59,720 --> 01:16:03,960
Speaker 1: NBA A and the college game. I appreciate you listening.

1366
01:16:03,960 --> 01:16:05,479
Speaker 1: Make sure you listen to the Doug Gotlip Show, which

1367
01:16:05,560 --> 01:16:08,040
Speaker 1: is on daily three to six Eastern time, twelve to

1368
01:16:08,160 --> 01:16:11,519
Speaker 1: three Pacific on Fox Sports Radio dot com, your Fox

1369
01:16:11,560 --> 01:16:16,000
Speaker 1: Sports Radio app or or the I Heart app or

1370
01:16:16,080 --> 01:16:18,439
Speaker 1: on sirius x M two seventeen or two oh three

1371
01:16:18,479 --> 01:16:21,200
Speaker 1: is actually on Dan Patrick's channel. That's three to six

1372
01:16:21,320 --> 01:16:24,720
Speaker 1: Eastern time, twelve three Pacific every day, and of course

1373
01:16:24,760 --> 01:16:27,400
Speaker 1: you can also download the daily podcast. Follow me on

1374
01:16:27,400 --> 01:16:31,080
Speaker 1: Twitter at god Leap Show, godlip Shows, also my Instagram handle.

1375
01:16:31,320 --> 01:16:33,479
Speaker 1: Send me a question, and I'll talk about it on

1376
01:16:33,560 --> 01:16:36,599
Speaker 1: next week's pod. I'm Doug Gottlieb in This Is All

1377
01:16:36,680 --> 01:16:36,840
Speaker 1: Ball