WEBVTT - Cowboys Break: Upgrades on Defense 0:00:01.200 --> 0:00:03.720 The following is a production of Dallas Cowboys dot Com 0:00:03.720 --> 0:00:06.880 and the Dallas Cowboys Football Club. Are you ready for 0:00:06.960 --> 0:00:10.600 a break? Yes? Are you ready for a break? Absolutely? 0:00:10.760 --> 0:00:14.960 Ready for a break? Yeah, and so much for that. 0:00:15.200 --> 0:00:20.320 It's time for the Break on Dallas Cowboys dot Com 0:00:19.440 --> 0:00:25.599 Wall with Nick Eatman, David Hellman, and bar Garcia and 0:00:25.760 --> 0:00:29.560 Derek Eagleton. It is Wednesday, June twelve, twenty nineteen, Season fifteen, 0:00:29.600 --> 0:00:32.680 episode number thirteen. Welcome to another edition of The break 0:00:32.920 --> 0:00:35.240 Back from the s WBC Mortgage Studios at the Star. 0:00:35.560 --> 0:00:38.040 It is our final episode before we take a little 0:00:38.040 --> 0:00:42.240 break before training camp. Today, the Cowboys are completing their final, 0:00:43.000 --> 0:00:46.199 the final week worth of work in the offseason. They 0:00:46.240 --> 0:00:48.440 have their second day of a three day mini camp. 0:00:49.000 --> 0:00:53.920 They'll finish that up tomorrow. How's everybody doing today? Fantastic? 0:00:54.200 --> 0:00:56.600 So interesting. This is like I feel like I'm in 0:00:56.920 --> 0:01:00.240 like I'm a parent in in twenty nineteen and I'm 0:01:00.240 --> 0:01:02.720 talking and everybody was kind of like on new devices. Sorry, 0:01:02.760 --> 0:01:05.360 I'm promoting our show on social media. I'm not saying 0:01:05.360 --> 0:01:07.280 it was bad. I'm just saying I'm very used to 0:01:07.280 --> 0:01:12.200 that becauscope for later today. Yeah, Sorry, we're trying to 0:01:12.240 --> 0:01:15.640 promote other show is gonna go already, it's our final show. 0:01:15.800 --> 0:01:17.560 We want to hear from you guys too throughout the show. 0:01:17.600 --> 0:01:18.840 If you guys have a chance to give us a 0:01:18.840 --> 0:01:21.639 call or you want to hit hit us on email, 0:01:21.640 --> 0:01:23.520 you're gonna get a call or Twitter. Yeah, we're gonna 0:01:23.520 --> 0:01:26.320 try to get a quality called email. Yeah email I 0:01:26.360 --> 0:01:28.440 got I went way back, I went way back. Yeah, 0:01:28.520 --> 0:01:31.479 hit us on Twitter at Cowboys break Amber can pick 0:01:31.560 --> 0:01:32.959 up some of those if you want to call us 0:01:33.040 --> 0:01:35.640 numbers eight eight eight eight five five two two nine seven. 0:01:35.800 --> 0:01:38.040 We're gonna be talking about defense today. Last week we 0:01:38.080 --> 0:01:40.920 started talking about changes on this team, we specifically talked 0:01:40.959 --> 0:01:44.920 about the offense. Today we talk about the defense, where 0:01:44.920 --> 0:01:47.320 there were quite a few more changes I think then 0:01:47.400 --> 0:01:51.040 then on the offense, but a similar story overall, not 0:01:51.120 --> 0:01:53.120 a lot of positions to be had, not a lot 0:01:53.120 --> 0:01:56.160 of opportunity for new guys coming in. I guess let's 0:01:56.200 --> 0:01:59.160 start first with just kind of talking about overall, what 0:01:59.160 --> 0:02:02.040 were your thoughts of this defense coming out of last year? 0:02:02.080 --> 0:02:04.760 They played far better than they were expected to play. 0:02:04.920 --> 0:02:06.840 What were your thoughts going into the offseason next to 0:02:06.880 --> 0:02:09.760 what the Cowboys really need? To do with this unit. Well, 0:02:10.040 --> 0:02:12.400 I think they were pretty good and then until they weren't. 0:02:12.440 --> 0:02:14.520 I mean in the Rams game. It's really hard. It's 0:02:14.760 --> 0:02:16.919 way to put it. The Rams game just kind of 0:02:17.280 --> 0:02:19.359 messes up everything because it's the last game of the 0:02:19.440 --> 0:02:21.320 year and you're like, well, you know, they couldn't run 0:02:21.360 --> 0:02:22.840 the ball and they couldn't stop the run. Those are 0:02:22.840 --> 0:02:24.800 the two things that you're supposed to do in any 0:02:24.880 --> 0:02:27.120 level of football, and so it's hard to think about 0:02:27.200 --> 0:02:30.280 how the season was successful, which it was, but those 0:02:30.320 --> 0:02:33.200 are the two things that kind of carry over this 0:02:33.240 --> 0:02:36.200 team and the cloud that hangs over them. So defensively, 0:02:36.240 --> 0:02:38.320 you think defensive tackle, they got to get better there. 0:02:38.360 --> 0:02:40.600 They can't get you know, pushed off the ball, and 0:02:41.040 --> 0:02:43.480 you know they gotta get they gotta get more takeaways. 0:02:43.600 --> 0:02:45.400 I mean, as good as Byron Jones was, they've got 0:02:45.480 --> 0:02:48.720 to get more takeaways and get some interceptions and plays 0:02:48.720 --> 0:02:51.120 like that. So pretty good, but it wasn't good enough 0:02:51.160 --> 0:02:54.240 at the end. Everything you just said's right, But I 0:02:54.400 --> 0:02:56.799 try not to overreact to the last game of the year, 0:02:56.919 --> 0:02:59.280 and you know, you gotta look at the whole picture. 0:02:59.360 --> 0:03:01.480 My main thing was like, all right, that was awesome. 0:03:02.240 --> 0:03:07.200 Signed tank and maintain that momentum and not turn this 0:03:07.240 --> 0:03:10.600 into like a Dez Bryant situation, which they didn't. And 0:03:10.919 --> 0:03:13.480 you know which, DeMarcus isn't going through the off season program. 0:03:13.480 --> 0:03:16.200 You needed surgery. I'm curious to see how he comes 0:03:16.240 --> 0:03:18.360 back from that, what his training camp looks like, and 0:03:18.400 --> 0:03:21.320 how quickly he can be ready. But my big thing 0:03:21.480 --> 0:03:24.880 was they're gonna let this fall apart after all the 0:03:24.880 --> 0:03:27.160 good work they did, and I don't think they did, 0:03:27.240 --> 0:03:32.160 so it gives me a pretty favorable impression to this point. Yes, 0:03:32.400 --> 0:03:33.959 well yeah, I didn't know if she was going to 0:03:34.080 --> 0:03:35.840 make a point there too. But but I'm gonna argue 0:03:35.880 --> 0:03:39.120 with you a little bit on that because I understand, like, well, 0:03:39.560 --> 0:03:40.840 you don't want to look at the last game and 0:03:40.880 --> 0:03:44.200 all that, but this team hasn't taken that next level. 0:03:44.240 --> 0:03:46.839 They haven't taken that step, and at some point you've 0:03:46.840 --> 0:03:49.360 got to do that, Like you you can't just just 0:03:49.480 --> 0:03:52.560 keep well, this is a good year divisional around and 0:03:52.720 --> 0:03:56.040 lost again. I mean like you've got to do something there. 0:03:56.160 --> 0:03:59.320 So yes, it was good until they got a team 0:03:59.360 --> 0:04:02.960 that was just better than them and and they I 0:04:03.000 --> 0:04:08.160 mean again, and step number one to that was making 0:04:08.520 --> 0:04:11.880 like again getting to Marcus Arms back fold all of 0:04:12.040 --> 0:04:14.040 you know, like I said, like, you're right, they did, 0:04:14.040 --> 0:04:17.320 they did need to improve it, but you have to 0:04:17.400 --> 0:04:19.800 keep what you had in tact before you can build 0:04:19.839 --> 0:04:22.840 on it, right, I mean, And I was convinced that 0:04:23.279 --> 0:04:25.200 the law was going to be Like I was convinced 0:04:25.240 --> 0:04:27.040 we would be sitting here in June, it's the second 0:04:27.080 --> 0:04:29.000 day of mini camp, and we would be writing about 0:04:29.000 --> 0:04:30.880 whether or not he was here. That's what I was 0:04:30.960 --> 0:04:35.200 thinking in February. So that's a big first step. They 0:04:35.240 --> 0:04:38.960 trade for Robert Quinn, even with Randy Gregory suspended, I 0:04:39.000 --> 0:04:42.000 feel like they made a significant addition that makes their 0:04:42.000 --> 0:04:44.360 defense better. And then what they spend their first pick 0:04:44.400 --> 0:04:45.839 in the draft on. You know, as much as we 0:04:45.920 --> 0:04:48.480 might have wanted a safety, they clearly agree with you 0:04:48.560 --> 0:04:50.799 because they're like, we need to beef up this d line. 0:04:51.120 --> 0:04:53.839 We need a defensive tackle who can pressure the quarterback 0:04:53.880 --> 0:04:56.680 and also preferably defend the run better, free up late 0:04:56.680 --> 0:04:59.600 and Vandrueshi and Jalen Smith to make plays. And they 0:04:59.600 --> 0:05:03.479 did that by drafting Tristan hill Um. So yeah, and 0:05:03.560 --> 0:05:06.039 hopefully that does help just safety, because when you start 0:05:06.080 --> 0:05:08.880 pressuring in the quarterback. Hopefully that would allow for more 0:05:08.920 --> 0:05:12.560 opportunities for them to take away the band. Yesterday, we're 0:05:12.720 --> 0:05:14.880 looking at OTAs at the very end of practice and 0:05:15.560 --> 0:05:17.560 this was a Cooper rush pass and it wasn't one 0:05:17.600 --> 0:05:21.200 of his better days at all yesterday. But that White, 0:05:21.320 --> 0:05:25.160 Mike White, Hey, he threw a Yeah, he wasn't. He 0:05:25.320 --> 0:05:30.480 only threw one three. But the last pick was the 0:05:30.480 --> 0:05:34.240 one that Donovan Wilson covered a lot of ground, runs 0:05:34.240 --> 0:05:37.279 over there, makes a nice play, and it's like this, 0:05:37.279 --> 0:05:39.320 this guy's it's gonna be hard for me to think 0:05:39.360 --> 0:05:42.279 that he doesn't work his way into this this mix. 0:05:42.360 --> 0:05:45.159 Just just looking at him, just the plays he made 0:05:45.200 --> 0:05:48.960 in college, big time hitter. I just I feel like 0:05:49.000 --> 0:05:52.000 he's kind of your next Gave Frasier type guy comes 0:05:52.120 --> 0:05:54.200 right in. I want to get to some of those details, 0:05:54.200 --> 0:05:56.200 but I want to take you back for second. Nick, 0:05:56.240 --> 0:05:58.320 you talked about that final game of the season, Dave, 0:05:58.400 --> 0:06:00.760 you said you don't want to overreact that. How much 0:06:00.800 --> 0:06:02.840 does the Colts game factor into that? Because really, when 0:06:02.880 --> 0:06:04.640 I look at it, you look at really that would 0:06:04.640 --> 0:06:06.880 be the last four or five weeks of the season. 0:06:07.160 --> 0:06:10.680 You had two games where this defense got completely overpowered, 0:06:11.040 --> 0:06:13.920 and that was what to me was more of a 0:06:14.960 --> 0:06:17.600 more of a signal that something was maybe not like, 0:06:17.640 --> 0:06:19.680 maybe there was something that was being figured out about 0:06:19.720 --> 0:06:22.279 this defense far more than just the final game. What 0:06:22.320 --> 0:06:24.640 are your thoughts there? That was the game where they 0:06:24.680 --> 0:06:27.240 walked out with like, oh no, that was at home. 0:06:27.400 --> 0:06:30.960 Marlon Mack just bullied them and Andrew Luck didn't even 0:06:31.040 --> 0:06:34.479 need to do anything. Yeah, and the Cowboys offense didn't 0:06:34.480 --> 0:06:36.960 score point. That was That was the game they got dominated. 0:06:36.960 --> 0:06:39.080 That was the first time all season they got dominated. 0:06:39.160 --> 0:06:41.240 I think they had. They walked out with the hard 0:06:41.279 --> 0:06:45.120 hats on that. Yeah, yeah, yeah, good timing, which actually 0:06:45.200 --> 0:06:47.760 could time. That's a that's a great place to start. 0:06:47.800 --> 0:06:49.920 And I mean, you don't want to overact overreact to 0:06:49.920 --> 0:06:51.760 the Rams game, but you still have to take it 0:06:51.760 --> 0:06:54.440 into account. Obsolete. Give up two hundred rushing yards in 0:06:54.440 --> 0:06:58.120 the NFL, that's that's eyebrow raising in the playoffs, especial playoffs. 0:06:58.279 --> 0:07:00.880 Um so back up, running back, most of that are good. 0:07:00.960 --> 0:07:03.400 Part of that. To see that play again, that last 0:07:03.400 --> 0:07:05.560 play they just showed, Sorry about that. The last play 0:07:05.400 --> 0:07:09.479 they just showed Daniel Ross just gets not to the ground, 0:07:09.600 --> 0:07:13.080 like really, for no reason that's like, Okay, we gotta 0:07:13.120 --> 0:07:16.320 get better. There are defensive tackle rotations, gotta get better. 0:07:16.440 --> 0:07:19.800 He had a nice I mean, he was surprisingly good 0:07:19.840 --> 0:07:24.240 at times. But yes, and I think I think that's, uh, 0:07:24.560 --> 0:07:26.160 that's a great way to put it in my opinion, 0:07:26.280 --> 0:07:30.480 is surprisingly good the Cowboys have. They drafted, identified developed, 0:07:30.480 --> 0:07:33.960 and retained their best pass rusher since to Marcus Ware. 0:07:34.120 --> 0:07:36.480 He to Marcus Lawrence is awesome. If you listen to 0:07:36.520 --> 0:07:38.840 this show ever, you know how I feel about him. 0:07:38.960 --> 0:07:42.960 I don't think the Cowboys pass rush slash slash defensive 0:07:43.000 --> 0:07:46.680 line as a whole is there. It's probably as good 0:07:46.680 --> 0:07:48.800 as it's been since where No, it's definitely as good 0:07:48.800 --> 0:07:51.760 as it's been since Ware retired. But it's not. It's 0:07:51.800 --> 0:07:55.720 not this elite unit that calls to mind the twenty 0:07:55.760 --> 0:07:59.840 fifteen Broncos or even you know, the Philly lines from 0:07:59.840 --> 0:08:02.120 a few years ago, you know, when Cox was even 0:08:02.200 --> 0:08:06.160 younger and Benny Logan was still really good, Vinny Curry. 0:08:06.360 --> 0:08:09.160 They just like waves on waves of good guys. Like 0:08:09.200 --> 0:08:13.240 It's not that the defensive tackle position needs to be upgraded, 0:08:13.280 --> 0:08:16.360 even with Tristan Hill here, I'm not convinced it's elite. 0:08:17.080 --> 0:08:19.160 I thought it was great that they brought in Robert Quinn. 0:08:19.280 --> 0:08:21.600 Be even better if Randy Gregory could work his way 0:08:21.600 --> 0:08:24.440 back from this suspension. But that's where it starts for me, 0:08:25.200 --> 0:08:28.600 the defensive line as a whole. So that was actually upgrading. 0:08:28.640 --> 0:08:29.960 That was a question I was going to ask, and 0:08:30.000 --> 0:08:32.640 maybe it changed your answer changes a little bit when 0:08:32.640 --> 0:08:36.040 I when I make asked this question. But so between 0:08:36.120 --> 0:08:38.240 going out of the season, when the season was done, 0:08:38.520 --> 0:08:41.640 you get to February, what did you think was the 0:08:42.040 --> 0:08:46.199 position of greatest need on the Dallas defense? Safety is 0:08:46.200 --> 0:08:48.280 one that had a lot of people threw out obviously, 0:08:48.280 --> 0:08:50.800 defensive tackle. Where do you think that that Going into 0:08:50.800 --> 0:08:52.560 the offseason, this team felt like they had to be 0:08:53.000 --> 0:08:55.760 most active in trying to upgrade. I think they answered 0:08:55.800 --> 0:08:59.360 the question themselves. I mean they felt like it was 0:08:59.480 --> 0:09:03.200 a defense of tackle, uh not not safety. And they 0:09:03.240 --> 0:09:08.000 showed that because they got one of each Covington and Alca, 0:09:08.520 --> 0:09:10.679 two guys that they're like, you know, hopefully they'll fit 0:09:10.760 --> 0:09:12.720 in here. But they didn't break the bank on either 0:09:12.760 --> 0:09:14.640 one of them. And then when it came down to 0:09:14.800 --> 0:09:17.520 it to get Thornhill was sitting there and they took 0:09:18.480 --> 0:09:20.640 Tristan Hill I mean, I think they just kind of 0:09:20.640 --> 0:09:24.040 showed to answer your question where did they thought? But 0:09:24.200 --> 0:09:26.160 was that more about the player or was that more 0:09:26.160 --> 0:09:30.080 about the position of need? Position? I think okay, yeah, 0:09:30.120 --> 0:09:33.800 I mean I think it was position. I do. And 0:09:34.240 --> 0:09:37.960 from what you know we've heard is um Christopher Shard, 0:09:38.040 --> 0:09:40.400 you know kind of any he kind of I think 0:09:40.400 --> 0:09:43.040 it's position because he talked about the position of what 0:09:43.080 --> 0:09:47.160 they have and said, hey, sound like you know Xavier Woods, 0:09:47.240 --> 0:09:50.439 this guy's gonna be good. I think I'm excited about him. 0:09:51.360 --> 0:09:53.720 I don't know if anyone was saying the same about 0:09:54.440 --> 0:09:57.079 the defensive tackles in there, you know, to that level. 0:09:57.240 --> 0:09:59.960 So and and that speaks volumes for a coach, because 0:10:00.120 --> 0:10:02.120 coaches are greedy. They want their players. They want to 0:10:02.160 --> 0:10:04.480 look they want to look good, so they'll get good players. 0:10:04.679 --> 0:10:06.680 And he was like, listen, this will be a better 0:10:06.720 --> 0:10:09.840 move for us. And so I thought that was that 0:10:09.840 --> 0:10:12.440 that just kind of showed the position of need was 0:10:12.600 --> 0:10:14.400 defensive tackle. Do you think it would have been the 0:10:14.440 --> 0:10:17.280 same if the safety that they were looking at was 0:10:17.320 --> 0:10:21.839 a better replacement for Jeff Heath So if Abrams, Yeah, 0:10:21.880 --> 0:10:25.600 that's a tricky question because when you're drafting fifty eight, 0:10:25.760 --> 0:10:28.440 it's much less likely you're gonna get in him. I mean, 0:10:28.600 --> 0:10:30.640 you want you want guys who can start with your 0:10:30.640 --> 0:10:33.960 first three picks. I always say, but when you drop 0:10:34.000 --> 0:10:35.719 down a fifty eight, as opposed to let's say, you know, 0:10:35.760 --> 0:10:38.040 if they had picked twenty seven, I think that's where 0:10:38.080 --> 0:10:41.800 Abram was picked. The Raiders used our Cowboys pick on him. 0:10:42.640 --> 0:10:45.079 It's less likely you're going to get a guy that 0:10:45.400 --> 0:10:48.839 is ready to beat out of what three year incumbent starter. 0:10:49.440 --> 0:10:53.200 But yeah, I mean if somehow if Jonathan Abram is there, yeah, 0:10:53.280 --> 0:10:55.520 I think maybe that changes their tune. But I think 0:10:55.920 --> 0:10:59.040 that you can say that about seven or eight other positions, 0:10:59.200 --> 0:11:00.680 you know. I think you can say that about an 0:11:00.720 --> 0:11:05.160 offensive tackle, a tight end, a wide receiver. You know 0:11:05.240 --> 0:11:07.720 that they have graded high that falls down there as well. 0:11:07.800 --> 0:11:11.600 So to me, it's always, you know, best player available, 0:11:11.640 --> 0:11:14.160 and if it's close, then it goes the best available need. 0:11:14.280 --> 0:11:16.760 And I think that I think they showed that tackle 0:11:16.840 --> 0:11:18.719 was a bigger need there. As Amber said, you get 0:11:18.720 --> 0:11:21.400 a good tackle, your your safeties will look better. Well, 0:11:21.679 --> 0:11:23.960 And I might sound stupid saying this, but I don't care. 0:11:24.200 --> 0:11:27.320 This is just my perspective on things to me, when 0:11:27.320 --> 0:11:30.720 you start talking about overall versus specific games like the 0:11:30.800 --> 0:11:35.840 Rams game the Colt game, I personally I'm satisfied with 0:11:36.080 --> 0:11:39.240 what the defense did last year. Obviously not in those games, 0:11:39.240 --> 0:11:41.880 but those are the games where you need the offense 0:11:42.160 --> 0:11:45.200 to play their part and pick it up, do what 0:11:45.320 --> 0:11:48.600 you need to do. And there were instances games where 0:11:48.840 --> 0:11:52.120 the defense was doing all they could and then the 0:11:52.280 --> 0:11:55.360 offense get to the ball and they don't really produce anything. 0:11:55.679 --> 0:11:58.800 And to me, that obviously plays into the role of 0:11:59.440 --> 0:12:02.319 how tied your defense gets and how they're gonna keep 0:12:02.360 --> 0:12:05.199 performing throughout the game. But when you have a bad day, 0:12:05.280 --> 0:12:08.000 that's when you need your teammates from the other side 0:12:08.160 --> 0:12:11.679 to be able to contribute and step in, and they, 0:12:12.200 --> 0:12:14.880 from what I remember, weren't able to do that. I 0:12:14.880 --> 0:12:17.880 think that's probably accurately in the Colts game. I think 0:12:18.160 --> 0:12:20.480 I have a little different opinion in the Rams game 0:12:20.520 --> 0:12:23.000 because I felt like the offense kind of got it going. 0:12:23.040 --> 0:12:24.800 It reminded me a lot of that again that playoff 0:12:24.840 --> 0:12:27.360 game against Green Bay. Yeah, they started offense started slow, 0:12:27.720 --> 0:12:30.240 but they kind of got themselves back into position to 0:12:30.320 --> 0:12:32.880 be in that game a little bit. And you know, 0:12:33.120 --> 0:12:36.479 the fateful moment was that, you know that that conversion. 0:12:36.800 --> 0:12:40.040 I think they're showing the play right now where where 0:12:40.400 --> 0:12:43.560 Jeff Heath was basically out of position and they were 0:12:43.600 --> 0:12:45.839 able to convert and game over right, And if they 0:12:45.840 --> 0:12:47.720 get the ball back right there, the offense has an 0:12:47.760 --> 0:12:50.160 opportunity to then be able to make a play or 0:12:50.200 --> 0:12:52.320 make a few plays, and they're they're right there in 0:12:52.320 --> 0:12:55.480 the game right. So I just think that I don't 0:12:55.480 --> 0:12:57.800 know if I would say the offense was completely inept 0:12:58.080 --> 0:13:00.240 in that game like they were in the Colts game 0:12:59.559 --> 0:13:02.160 and the offense was horrible. No, it was their worst 0:13:02.160 --> 0:13:04.319 game of the year, I agree, But the thing about 0:13:04.320 --> 0:13:06.320 it is they only ran for forty seven yards in 0:13:06.320 --> 0:13:08.600 that Rams game, and that middle stretch that had nice 0:13:08.679 --> 0:13:13.480 drive early, they had nice you know, scramble drive late there. 0:13:13.840 --> 0:13:16.480 But in between, there wasn't a whole lot going on. 0:13:16.880 --> 0:13:20.520 It picks up towards the end somehow, when Dak or 0:13:20.520 --> 0:13:22.959 the offense is starting to feel that pressure. It's like 0:13:23.120 --> 0:13:26.480 the light bulb comes on and all that sudden they're 0:13:26.520 --> 0:13:29.559 playing great, but then there's just not enough time on 0:13:29.679 --> 0:13:32.439 the clock to do anything to make it happen. Was 0:13:32.480 --> 0:13:35.640 it me? Xavier Woods looked like he had three really 0:13:35.679 --> 0:13:37.760 bad plays in that I mean, like he didn't have 0:13:37.880 --> 0:13:40.000 I don't look at Xavier Woods just having a bad 0:13:40.040 --> 0:13:42.440 season or anything like that, but just some of those 0:13:42.520 --> 0:13:45.120 plays right there. That wasn't his best game. We've said 0:13:45.280 --> 0:13:48.800 Laton too, all of them. Yeah, I don't think that 0:13:48.840 --> 0:13:51.120 had a good game. Yeah, in that game, Yeah, it 0:13:51.160 --> 0:13:52.840 was bad. It was a bad performance all the way. 0:13:53.040 --> 0:13:56.320 I mean, you know they deserve all yeah, good yeah, 0:13:56.320 --> 0:13:59.440 Sue and even no, actually Donald didn't have a good game. 0:14:02.520 --> 0:14:07.400 Just wait, they had you know, they had amazing seasons 0:14:07.400 --> 0:14:11.080 and they deserved all credit in the world. Uh Leyton 0:14:11.080 --> 0:14:14.160 and Jalen were both bad in that game. Everybody was. Um. 0:14:15.440 --> 0:14:19.040 The best thing that came out of that game, I think, 0:14:19.080 --> 0:14:21.800 I mean is the fact that two of your two 0:14:21.920 --> 0:14:26.240 rookies stepped up and really did you know, some some 0:14:26.360 --> 0:14:29.160 great things in that game. Number one, Michael Gallup had 0:14:29.240 --> 0:14:31.600 a couple of nice plays there. You kind of see that, 0:14:31.720 --> 0:14:33.400 you know, he I think he led the team in 0:14:33.680 --> 0:14:38.000 receiving yards. But more importantly, Connor Williams said, all right, 0:14:38.920 --> 0:14:41.040 you know, you got the best in the world right here, 0:14:41.320 --> 0:14:43.120 and we're not giving you a ton of help. And 0:14:43.200 --> 0:14:47.520 he played really really well, and not because he's a rookie. 0:14:47.680 --> 0:14:50.320 He just played well against the best defensive player in 0:14:50.360 --> 0:14:53.560 all of football. Um, Aaron Donald, I mean it wasn't 0:14:53.600 --> 0:14:55.840 like well for I think there was one play maybe 0:14:55.840 --> 0:14:58.520 he got called for holding, but he won that that battle. 0:14:58.760 --> 0:15:01.200 He had like one tackle in one hurry like he 0:15:01.480 --> 0:15:05.680 I mean, yeah, Sue had the better game handled Zue Martin. Yeah. 0:15:05.680 --> 0:15:07.720 I was a little bit concerning there, but but I mean, 0:15:07.920 --> 0:15:10.200 here's your rookie that is he big enough? Can he 0:15:10.240 --> 0:15:12.760 make this transition? And with all the world watching, he 0:15:12.800 --> 0:15:14.560 did a really nice job. So so that was a 0:15:14.560 --> 0:15:16.400 good move for him. Do you think, and I don't 0:15:16.400 --> 0:15:19.000 want to go too far down this hole, but do 0:15:19.080 --> 0:15:21.760 you think that having a defense that played so well 0:15:21.760 --> 0:15:25.720 throughout most of the season be so thoroughly dominated in 0:15:25.760 --> 0:15:28.480 that game? Do you give any any part of that 0:15:28.560 --> 0:15:31.360 to maybe coaching more so than the players. And the 0:15:31.360 --> 0:15:33.720 reason why I say that is because you're facing a 0:15:33.760 --> 0:15:36.840 guy that is notoriously known as a great offensive mind. 0:15:37.360 --> 0:15:40.000 And was he just better to out was he better 0:15:40.040 --> 0:15:43.840 at out scheming coming up with better opportunities to take 0:15:43.880 --> 0:15:47.000 advantage of this defense than what the defense could counter 0:15:47.520 --> 0:15:50.280 with whatever coaching decisions they were. I mean, he kept 0:15:50.320 --> 0:15:53.520 his job, you know, their offensive coordinator, So yeah, I 0:15:53.520 --> 0:15:55.520 mean definitely was. I mean, you can't say that about 0:15:55.520 --> 0:15:58.000 the Cowboys guy. He didn't keep his job. Yeah, I 0:15:58.040 --> 0:16:00.160 think coaching plays a part of it if it. If 0:16:00.200 --> 0:16:01.720 they didn't, then they wouldn't have made that I was 0:16:01.720 --> 0:16:03.520 talking about the flip side. I was talking more a 0:16:03.480 --> 0:16:06.680 a Cowboys defense and the Rams offense. Okay, I thought 0:16:06.680 --> 0:16:09.000 you're talking about the offensive coase we're talking, you know, 0:16:09.000 --> 0:16:11.640 talking about the defense again and again. I'm trying to 0:16:11.640 --> 0:16:13.760 figure out, is that is what we saw in that 0:16:13.800 --> 0:16:16.520 game in the Colts game and aberration or is it 0:16:16.560 --> 0:16:18.120 really and and if and if you would put it 0:16:18.120 --> 0:16:20.080 more on coaching, then maybe it was. Maybe it's something 0:16:20.080 --> 0:16:21.600 that hey, they just that was just one of those games. 0:16:21.680 --> 0:16:23.800 They just got out schemed. And it happens. That happens, 0:16:23.840 --> 0:16:25.800 and it happens to be because when you think about it, 0:16:25.840 --> 0:16:30.840 I mean, clearly their talent level didn't go down. They're 0:16:31.440 --> 0:16:35.440 they're good players. So maybe that's where you stand from 0:16:35.800 --> 0:16:38.200 coaching and what they were doing and they weren't able 0:16:38.240 --> 0:16:40.920 to match up what the Rams were doing there offensively 0:16:41.000 --> 0:16:42.880 that's I mean, it's a and then we gave the 0:16:42.960 --> 0:16:45.160 Rams so much credit all last year for keeping it 0:16:45.240 --> 0:16:48.800 simple but unpredictable, and yeah, I mean there's definitely an 0:16:48.840 --> 0:16:51.720 element of that, but again, like I think you're kind 0:16:51.720 --> 0:16:55.560 of falling into that trap of overreacting. Basically, it was 0:16:55.560 --> 0:16:57.840 the last game we saw and for the third time, Yeah, 0:16:57.880 --> 0:17:01.160 they were terrible, but I mean Sean Payton's pretty awesome 0:17:01.200 --> 0:17:04.959 coach too. Thirteen points, and it's like, I look at 0:17:04.960 --> 0:17:08.600 the whole body of work like they had. They probably had. 0:17:08.640 --> 0:17:11.800 They had like four really incredible games and three kind 0:17:11.800 --> 0:17:13.919 of lousy ones and then the rest it was somewhere 0:17:13.920 --> 0:17:17.159 in between. And that's that's about right. That it comes 0:17:17.200 --> 0:17:21.040 down to the defensive tackle position, because and those games 0:17:21.160 --> 0:17:24.080 they were they were blown off the ball running. We 0:17:24.160 --> 0:17:26.720 know that their their secondary is pretty good, their linebackers 0:17:26.720 --> 0:17:29.440 are good, but it was just too easy for the 0:17:29.760 --> 0:17:32.720 Colts and the Rams to run the ball, and that's 0:17:32.720 --> 0:17:34.560 what opens up everything, and that's what's going to be 0:17:34.600 --> 0:17:36.600 harder for to get your offense and rhythm and all 0:17:36.600 --> 0:17:39.040 that kind of stuff. So the Colts was just the 0:17:39.040 --> 0:17:41.840 worst game we've seen on both sides of the ball. 0:17:42.400 --> 0:17:45.920 But sorry, go ahead, but I don't. I don't remember. 0:17:46.920 --> 0:17:49.200 This is bad, which well to go to go back 0:17:49.240 --> 0:17:52.280 a minute, and yeah, I mean the Cowboys clearly they 0:17:52.480 --> 0:17:55.400 set the agenda like defensive tackle, and it's hard. It's 0:17:55.440 --> 0:17:58.080 hard to argue with the performance we saw in both 0:17:58.119 --> 0:18:01.200 of those games, just giving up way too many rushing yards. 0:18:01.240 --> 0:18:02.880 And I would I mean, if you if you look 0:18:02.920 --> 0:18:07.560 at the roster, it's so obviously safety and defensive tackle position. 0:18:07.600 --> 0:18:09.399 When you're just like, all right, where where are we 0:18:09.560 --> 0:18:13.040 deficient in talent? It's those two positions, I think, and 0:18:13.400 --> 0:18:17.080 I think most people would agree. Having said that, as 0:18:17.080 --> 0:18:19.280 good as you might feel about defensive tackle, and it 0:18:19.320 --> 0:18:22.600 does I mean Tristan Hill, I think Christian Covington's an 0:18:22.640 --> 0:18:25.360 underrated signing, honestly, like he had a pretty good career 0:18:25.359 --> 0:18:29.240 in Houston. Reminds me a lot of Terrell McClain, who, again, 0:18:29.359 --> 0:18:32.879 like didn't really knew nobody was very excited when he 0:18:32.920 --> 0:18:36.960 signed on and he wound up being pretty useful. Having 0:18:37.080 --> 0:18:40.720 said all of that, I do I like, are there 0:18:40.800 --> 0:18:44.240 enough playmakers on the back end of this defense? Are there? 0:18:44.280 --> 0:18:46.639 I mean, Byron Jones was great last year. He doesn't 0:18:46.640 --> 0:18:50.560 get picks Cheeto has gotten a pick each in the 0:18:50.600 --> 0:18:54.520 season finale of both of his seasons. Jeff Heath is 0:18:54.520 --> 0:18:57.119 your best ballhawk and everybody in the world wants to 0:18:57.160 --> 0:19:01.560 get rid of him. Xavier Woods has shown flashes of it, 0:19:01.640 --> 0:19:05.240 but it hadn't been there on a consistent basis. How 0:19:05.240 --> 0:19:10.320 many career interceptions does he have? No, Xavier Woods, not 0:19:10.480 --> 0:19:13.200 a not a lot. For I think that might even 0:19:13.240 --> 0:19:16.560 be high, um, And that's that's part of it is 0:19:17.200 --> 0:19:18.560 you can have all the talent in the world, like 0:19:18.600 --> 0:19:21.520 takeaways or a big part of it. And basically, for 0:19:21.560 --> 0:19:23.560 the entire time that I've covered this team, they have 0:19:23.680 --> 0:19:26.600 not had a playmaker who can get takeaways, and I 0:19:26.640 --> 0:19:28.520 wonder about that. In order for them to take the 0:19:28.560 --> 0:19:31.200 next step this year, they're gonna need Byron Jones, They're 0:19:31.200 --> 0:19:33.800 gonna need Xavier Woods, The're gonna need Cheat Obey, They're 0:19:33.800 --> 0:19:36.080 gonna need all those guys to start getting their hands 0:19:36.119 --> 0:19:38.159 on the ball and actually turning the ball over. And 0:19:38.600 --> 0:19:40.160 in order for them to turn it, I would love 0:19:40.160 --> 0:19:41.679 where to be. Jordan Lewis, I'd a good friend. He's 0:19:41.680 --> 0:19:43.920 gonna get It's gonna get as many opportunities, but I 0:19:43.920 --> 0:19:46.920