WEBVTT - Future Islands 0:00:15.476 --> 0:00:15.956 Pushkin. 0:00:20.316 --> 0:00:23.996 The Baltimore based synthpop band Future Islands was first thrust 0:00:24.036 --> 0:00:27.356 into the national spotlight in twenty fourteen after making their 0:00:27.396 --> 0:00:31.276 TV debut on The Late Show with David Letterman. The 0:00:31.356 --> 0:00:35.796 bands unassuming frontman Samuel t Herring, danced ecstatically around the stage, 0:00:35.996 --> 0:00:40.276 seething with emotion. The performance quickly went viral, making it 0:00:40.316 --> 0:00:44.836 one of Letterman's most memorable live appearances ever. At the 0:00:44.836 --> 0:00:47.356 time of their big break, Future Islands had already released 0:00:47.356 --> 0:00:51.436 three albums and been touring relentlessly for nearly a decade, 0:00:52.076 --> 0:00:54.076 and while they would become one of the most prominent 0:00:54.116 --> 0:00:56.556 bands on the festival circuit for the next several years, 0:00:56.996 --> 0:01:00.516 Future Islands always managed to maintain a sense of unparalleled 0:01:00.596 --> 0:01:04.316 raw vulnerability on stage, in part thanks to the deeply 0:01:04.396 --> 0:01:09.236 confessional nature of Sam's songwriting and his stage presence. On 0:01:09.236 --> 0:01:12.196 today's episode, Lea Rose talks to Future Island's lead singer, 0:01:12.276 --> 0:01:15.436 Samuel t Harring about the band's latest album, People Who 0:01:15.436 --> 0:01:19.236 Aren't There Anymore. Sam also describes the physical toll his 0:01:19.356 --> 0:01:22.476 energetic performance style has taken on his body over the years, 0:01:23.076 --> 0:01:28.796 and his long held gripe with guitar based music. This 0:01:28.996 --> 0:01:32.236 is broken record liner notes for the Digital Age. I'm 0:01:32.356 --> 0:01:37.476 justin Mitchman. Here's Lea Rose's conversation with Samuel t Herring. 0:01:37.916 --> 0:01:41.716 When Future Islands started. What was important for you to 0:01:42.036 --> 0:01:44.676 convey to audiences through your performance style? 0:01:45.516 --> 0:01:52.036 Well, the beginning of Future Islands is a little strange 0:01:52.156 --> 0:01:56.916 because the impetus for a beginning of the band was 0:01:57.916 --> 0:02:01.756 a tour that we were supposed to have played as 0:02:01.836 --> 0:02:04.516 our first band that we had forgotten about, and so 0:02:04.676 --> 0:02:08.236 the impetus of the band was basically art Lord. Our 0:02:08.276 --> 0:02:11.236 fourth member left at the end of two thousand and five, 0:02:11.716 --> 0:02:13.916 and we kind of just didn't have a band for 0:02:13.996 --> 0:02:16.836 four or five months, and I don't think me, William 0:02:16.876 --> 0:02:18.476 and Garrett really even talked about what we were going 0:02:18.556 --> 0:02:20.036 to do next. I think we were still kind of 0:02:21.196 --> 0:02:24.356 sad and confused about what had happened because our other 0:02:24.436 --> 0:02:26.516 member just like dipped town and was like, you know, 0:02:26.556 --> 0:02:29.556 I'm not doing the band anymore, and we're like, well, 0:02:29.556 --> 0:02:31.716 do we want to keep doing it without, you know, 0:02:31.756 --> 0:02:34.356 our friend that's been here since the beginning. So and 0:02:34.396 --> 0:02:38.036 then in January of two thousand and six, William got 0:02:38.076 --> 0:02:40.636 an email that was basically like, Hey, how's that tour coming, 0:02:41.116 --> 0:02:43.676 because William used to book all of our He booked 0:02:43.676 --> 0:02:45.636 all the Art Lord shows, he booked the first like 0:02:46.076 --> 0:02:48.876 four or five years of Future Islands as well, and 0:02:49.076 --> 0:02:51.676 so yeah, so instead of you, basically William called me 0:02:51.716 --> 0:02:54.436 and Garrett and was like, I was supposed to book 0:02:54.476 --> 0:02:55.716 this tour and I forgot. 0:02:56.116 --> 0:02:58.716 Do you guys? Do you guys want to start a 0:02:58.716 --> 0:02:59.236 new band? 0:02:59.636 --> 0:03:02.836 And so within like three weeks we wrote and recorded 0:03:03.836 --> 0:03:07.756 five six song EP and then we went we did 0:03:07.796 --> 0:03:11.316 a tour. I mean honestly, there was no thought process. 0:03:11.356 --> 0:03:14.236 I mean that's kind of you know, even the roots 0:03:14.236 --> 0:03:16.676 of art Lord, even though it was high concept, the 0:03:17.516 --> 0:03:21.476 function was punk because we didn't own instruments, you know. 0:03:21.516 --> 0:03:25.036 Williams guitar or Williams bass guitar was borrowed from a friend. 0:03:25.156 --> 0:03:27.756 Like all the amps were borrowed. All the keyboards except 0:03:27.796 --> 0:03:30.636 for one were we're like found at thrift stores or 0:03:30.636 --> 0:03:34.476 borrowed from friends. So the mode was really you know, 0:03:34.916 --> 0:03:38.396 eurosynth pop, but it was but we felt like punks. 0:03:38.676 --> 0:03:38.876 You know. 0:03:39.036 --> 0:03:41.716 Yeah, we stunk and we played your living room, so 0:03:41.756 --> 0:03:46.156 we were punks. And with Future Islands, it was it 0:03:46.236 --> 0:03:48.676 started very much the same, you know, and at the 0:03:48.716 --> 0:03:51.636 time I was I had really bad drug problems. I 0:03:51.676 --> 0:03:54.156 was trying to get out of that, you know. Shortly 0:03:54.196 --> 0:03:57.356 after Future Rounds began, I left town to get my 0:03:57.396 --> 0:04:00.596 life together and get clean. So Future Islands just kind 0:04:00.636 --> 0:04:05.436 of began with these songs. Garrett was kind of playing 0:04:05.476 --> 0:04:10.196 solos for the first time. William's bass was going super fast, 0:04:10.276 --> 0:04:14.316 and for the first time ever, I had kind of 0:04:14.356 --> 0:04:17.836 a drum kit behind me that was creating this propulsive 0:04:18.516 --> 0:04:20.596 It was a propulsive element in the music that we'd 0:04:20.596 --> 0:04:24.436 never had before. Like before that, I was trying to 0:04:24.476 --> 0:04:27.356 be the propulsive element through my movement, but it was 0:04:27.756 --> 0:04:30.756 much more of a dance and a performance and a 0:04:30.836 --> 0:04:34.836 bit of theater. But all of a sudden, I wasn't 0:04:34.876 --> 0:04:37.756 the most you know, I wasn't the thing pushing it forward. 0:04:37.796 --> 0:04:39.356 So I had to I had to figure out how 0:04:39.396 --> 0:04:43.036 to match that energy of the drums. And then that 0:04:43.116 --> 0:04:47.276 brought this whole other element of anger and angst, which 0:04:47.316 --> 0:04:48.596 is a lot of things I was going through at 0:04:48.596 --> 0:04:52.316 the time, fighting drug addiction and feeling really lost in 0:04:52.356 --> 0:04:52.876 my life. 0:04:52.956 --> 0:04:55.356 Were you on hard drugs like I was a. 0:04:55.316 --> 0:04:57.956 Cocain It was like two two and a half years. 0:04:57.996 --> 0:05:00.276 It was like a Gramma day habit. But yeah, I was. 0:05:00.316 --> 0:05:04.876 I was a dealer and became a fiend and then yeah, 0:05:04.916 --> 0:05:07.596 it was really really crazy stuff. It's crazy to think 0:05:07.636 --> 0:05:10.476 about now how much that part of my life was. 0:05:10.476 --> 0:05:12.356 I mean, I was selling weed when I was fourteen, 0:05:12.476 --> 0:05:16.396 fifteen and up until I was twenty two, twenty three. 0:05:16.876 --> 0:05:18.556 I was gonna ask you if you ever had like 0:05:18.756 --> 0:05:20.556 a regular job, but I guess. 0:05:21.276 --> 0:05:23.556 Yeah, I was a terrible drug dealer. 0:05:27.076 --> 0:05:29.276 I was just like make sure everybody's got what they 0:05:29.316 --> 0:05:33.916 need and I get high for free. But yeah, all 0:05:33.956 --> 0:05:36.996 this stuff. You know, it's such a strange world to 0:05:37.076 --> 0:05:39.116 think about, but you know, these are the things. This 0:05:39.236 --> 0:05:41.876 is my life that I, you know, one time, was 0:05:41.996 --> 0:05:44.876 very afraid to share that I'm very open with now 0:05:44.916 --> 0:05:48.036 because I want people to know, like, yeah, there is 0:05:48.076 --> 0:05:52.756 another side, and you know, and I've I've slipped many times, 0:05:53.036 --> 0:05:54.756 you know, And that's part of it too, you know. 0:05:55.116 --> 0:05:58.156 Part of it is saying like you don't say like, yeah, 0:05:58.156 --> 0:06:00.276 I used to be I used to have a problem. 0:06:00.396 --> 0:06:02.236 You're like, no, I have a problem. I just don't. 0:06:02.836 --> 0:06:04.996 I don't do it. You know, I have all the problems. 0:06:05.556 --> 0:06:08.276 You know, I'm addicted to so many things. 0:06:08.436 --> 0:06:09.916 And that that's part of it. 0:06:09.996 --> 0:06:15.036 But that process of leaving town began with a conversation 0:06:15.636 --> 0:06:17.436 with the guys to ask them if it was okay, 0:06:17.476 --> 0:06:19.676 and they're like, yes, please, like we know that you 0:06:19.756 --> 0:06:22.476 have a problem, please get go get help. But by 0:06:22.476 --> 0:06:24.796 the time we got to Baltimore, you know, I finally 0:06:24.876 --> 0:06:27.676 was starting to feel like myself again. I was with 0:06:27.716 --> 0:06:30.236 my friends again, who's like lives I'd missed. 0:06:30.756 --> 0:06:30.996 You know. 0:06:31.436 --> 0:06:35.236 That was when I think we decided to believe in 0:06:35.236 --> 0:06:39.236 ourselves and go after a thing that in the past 0:06:39.316 --> 0:06:42.116 it had been like, you know, maybe this this is 0:06:42.156 --> 0:06:44.476 like really fun and people want to see us play, 0:06:44.516 --> 0:06:47.676 so we'll go play some shows, to being like it's 0:06:47.716 --> 0:06:52.076 time to go for it. And that's when we you know, 0:06:52.196 --> 0:06:54.796 once two months after Garrett got to Baltimore, we went 0:06:54.836 --> 0:06:58.436 on our first US tour and then just stayed on 0:06:58.476 --> 0:07:01.356 tour for five years, almost five years. We played like 0:07:01.676 --> 0:07:04.076 in that four and a half years, we played close 0:07:04.116 --> 0:07:05.156 to eight hundred shows. 0:07:05.436 --> 0:07:05.876 Wow. 0:07:06.236 --> 0:07:08.636 And that's when the band grew, you know, from being 0:07:09.356 --> 0:07:13.756 from playing you know, for peanuts and playing like five 0:07:13.796 --> 0:07:16.956 and ten people at the beginning around the country to 0:07:16.956 --> 0:07:19.596 to like making a living at the end. Yeah, you know, 0:07:19.636 --> 0:07:21.676 there was a time in our lives where we wanted 0:07:21.716 --> 0:07:26.156 to you know that you think everybody's listening. 0:07:26.276 --> 0:07:28.796 And when was that time? Was that like around the 0:07:28.836 --> 0:07:30.276 time of the Letterman performance. 0:07:30.756 --> 0:07:33.476 Yeah, that was like twenty into twenty fourteen and fifteen 0:07:33.476 --> 0:07:37.716 we really felt like, oh, people are finally care about 0:07:37.716 --> 0:07:40.876 what we do, you know, our fourth album. You know, 0:07:40.956 --> 0:07:45.676 we're all you know, we didn't expect to be a 0:07:45.716 --> 0:07:49.036 spotlight band at that point, like we were. We had 0:07:49.076 --> 0:07:52.396 gotten over the feelings and like had accepted that that 0:07:52.436 --> 0:07:54.276 was never going to happen, and that was actually really 0:07:54.316 --> 0:07:57.836 freeing to be like, Okay, cool, I guess nobody really 0:07:58.356 --> 0:08:00.556 cares that much, but the audience cares. You know, We've 0:08:00.556 --> 0:08:03.276 built our own We've built our own audience through our 0:08:03.316 --> 0:08:05.636 own hard work, and then all of a sudden we 0:08:05.636 --> 0:08:08.356 were in the spotlight and that really affected us in 0:08:09.316 --> 0:08:12.516 it did make us think about who the audience was 0:08:12.796 --> 0:08:15.476 and writing for that perceived audience. And then we created 0:08:15.516 --> 0:08:20.676 an album that we just kind of rushed and I 0:08:20.676 --> 0:08:23.276 don't think took the proper time, but I think we 0:08:23.276 --> 0:08:27.556 were also so exhausted. Yeah, we were just lost. So 0:08:27.636 --> 0:08:33.796 there was that period where you said, oh, maybe people care, Yeah, 0:08:33.796 --> 0:08:36.436 and let's write for them, and maybe this will take 0:08:36.476 --> 0:08:39.076 us to another step up and then you kind of 0:08:39.076 --> 0:08:41.916 get to that step. I wrote a line in a 0:08:42.036 --> 0:08:45.276 rap song that came out in twenty nineteen, the album 0:08:45.316 --> 0:08:49.636 of by Buddy Kinney Siegel, and I said, uh, basically like, yeah, 0:08:49.676 --> 0:08:51.356 there's no air at the top, and it's hard to 0:08:51.396 --> 0:08:54.276 breathe when your breath is something you lost. And it's 0:08:54.316 --> 0:08:56.676 just like that idea of like I wanted all of this, 0:08:56.836 --> 0:08:58.916 I did all of this, I got to the top 0:08:59.276 --> 0:09:02.716 and I couldn't breathe, and then you know, the years 0:09:02.756 --> 0:09:05.356 after that is accepting like I don't want to be 0:09:05.556 --> 0:09:09.316 up there struggling. I want to be at a place 0:09:09.356 --> 0:09:11.756 where I feel comfortable and I can be the artists 0:09:11.796 --> 0:09:13.036 that I set out to be. 0:09:13.596 --> 0:09:16.356 Yeah, how is that different than what you thought it 0:09:16.396 --> 0:09:16.716 would be? 0:09:16.836 --> 0:09:20.836 Like, I think one of the things that I realized 0:09:21.196 --> 0:09:27.476 is that before we have the really the national exposure, 0:09:29.196 --> 0:09:32.636 I kind of perceived it as when it gets bigger, 0:09:32.676 --> 0:09:37.796 it's easier, but it gets a lot harder. It takes work, 0:09:37.876 --> 0:09:41.636 and I think it made me really respect the people that. 0:09:41.596 --> 0:09:44.116 Can do it for so long and. 0:09:44.476 --> 0:09:46.956 Can do it at that reach a certain level because 0:09:48.076 --> 0:09:49.956 I kind of thought, oh, yeah, you just get bigger 0:09:49.996 --> 0:09:51.716 and then you have a bigger team, and then they 0:09:51.756 --> 0:09:54.676 just figure out, they make all the decisions and you 0:09:54.796 --> 0:09:57.156 just get to walk out on stage and you know, 0:09:57.396 --> 0:10:00.756 maybe that's what like bon Jovi gets to do. But yeah, 0:10:01.116 --> 0:10:03.116 just fly in and play the show and go home again, 0:10:03.756 --> 0:10:07.036 fly out. But it's a lot of jumping through hoops, 0:10:07.036 --> 0:10:08.956 it's a lot of kissing the ring. You have to 0:10:08.956 --> 0:10:11.196 be like more humble, you have to play the game, 0:10:11.876 --> 0:10:16.636 and it's it's all part of the process of getting 0:10:16.636 --> 0:10:19.476 that more and more exposure. And that just wasn't who 0:10:19.556 --> 0:10:22.676 we were. And I think we've just done it too long. 0:10:23.156 --> 0:10:24.956 I mean, the biggest thing, you know, I've always had 0:10:25.156 --> 0:10:29.836 kind of a social anxieties, but through that process they 0:10:29.956 --> 0:10:34.556 really got heightened. And as my life has gone on 0:10:34.796 --> 0:10:40.036 since that point, my social anxieties have gotten worse. Like 0:10:40.316 --> 0:10:44.556 I'm learning how to try to feel more comfortable and 0:10:44.596 --> 0:10:47.716 deal with anxiety and soothe myself and these kinds of 0:10:47.716 --> 0:10:50.796 things you learn about. But but it is like I 0:10:50.796 --> 0:10:54.076 didn't used to feel as out of place as I 0:10:54.116 --> 0:10:55.676 do now. That's part of why I'm like in a 0:10:55.716 --> 0:10:59.196 new city is because I feel a freedom in a 0:10:59.236 --> 0:11:02.276 new place, like I don't feel I feel less judged, 0:11:02.356 --> 0:11:05.756 I feel anonymous. Yeah, you know, and that feels good. 0:11:06.156 --> 0:11:07.916 It's interesting to me that you would say you have 0:11:07.996 --> 0:11:12.596 social anxiety when your performances are so they feel so 0:11:12.796 --> 0:11:17.556 vulnerable and you feel so open and you're so transparent 0:11:17.676 --> 0:11:21.356 with what you're feeling, and you're crying, you're growling, you're 0:11:21.396 --> 0:11:26.396 shaking your fist at the sky, and you're completely wide 0:11:26.436 --> 0:11:29.556 open at that point. Yes, So how are you able 0:11:29.596 --> 0:11:32.356 to do that if you also have the other side 0:11:32.356 --> 0:11:33.556 of you, which can feel scared. 0:11:34.796 --> 0:11:37.756 Well, there's a difference between being in a crowd and 0:11:37.796 --> 0:11:41.156 being in front of a crowd. There's power that comes 0:11:41.196 --> 0:11:45.196 with a microphone in a stage when you're in a 0:11:45.196 --> 0:11:49.036 group of people, or entering into a group of people, 0:11:49.116 --> 0:11:53.076 especially if you're if you don't feel like you have 0:11:53.116 --> 0:11:55.836 a place, or you are searching for a friend, you know, 0:11:55.836 --> 0:11:58.756 somebody to talk to, or you know you're alone, even 0:11:58.796 --> 0:12:02.636 like going to you know, like I have like anxiety 0:12:02.636 --> 0:12:04.756 going to like a friend's house for like a Christmas 0:12:04.796 --> 0:12:08.796 party or something, you know, And that's really sad because 0:12:08.796 --> 0:12:10.876 then you very quickly learn like oh yeah, these are 0:12:10.876 --> 0:12:12.636 all my friends. I don't have anything to be worried about. 0:12:13.436 --> 0:12:16.556 But so when you're entering into a space where you're 0:12:16.556 --> 0:12:20.556 an anonymous person, you don't get to you don't get 0:12:20.596 --> 0:12:23.156 to like express who you are. You're kind of you're 0:12:23.316 --> 0:12:26.036 scene for who you are on the outside. There's none 0:12:26.076 --> 0:12:28.796 of who you are on the inside. You're only viewed 0:12:28.876 --> 0:12:33.756 by people's perceptions. When you're on stage, you get to 0:12:34.316 --> 0:12:37.556 express who you are. You get to share who you are, 0:12:37.636 --> 0:12:39.436 and you get to prove to people who you are. Like, 0:12:39.476 --> 0:12:44.036 my thing is that I've always felt like I didn't 0:12:44.076 --> 0:12:47.356 belong and because of that, I felt like an underdog 0:12:47.396 --> 0:12:50.556 who had to prove themselves. You know, that's the story 0:12:50.556 --> 0:12:53.956 of Future Islands, That's the story of me. Is like 0:12:54.436 --> 0:12:58.556 I have something to prove that I belong, that I'm 0:12:58.756 --> 0:13:02.276 worth a damn, that I have meaning in this world. 0:13:02.316 --> 0:13:04.516 And that's not for me to just prove to other people. 0:13:04.556 --> 0:13:06.476 It's for me to prove to myself and for me 0:13:07.156 --> 0:13:10.596 to share that you can feel this way but still 0:13:10.596 --> 0:13:13.036 make a place for yourself in this world and that 0:13:13.116 --> 0:13:16.356 you're not alone. So you know that that's the difference 0:13:16.396 --> 0:13:20.196 between being the person watching the show and the person 0:13:20.676 --> 0:13:24.596 you know being the show is now I have something 0:13:24.636 --> 0:13:28.676 to tell you. Yeah, I've always loved the stage because 0:13:28.676 --> 0:13:33.436 it allows me to express myself and feel like that 0:13:33.516 --> 0:13:35.996 allows people to see me for who I am. Whether 0:13:36.076 --> 0:13:40.316 or not they like that is not my concern. It's 0:13:40.356 --> 0:13:42.076 really about I mean, you want people to like what 0:13:42.116 --> 0:13:45.076 you do. But it is like, now I've at least 0:13:45.116 --> 0:13:50.156 expressed who I am, and that makes me feel really courageous. 0:13:50.236 --> 0:13:52.316 You know, it makes me feel brave. I don't know, 0:13:52.356 --> 0:13:54.876 it makes me feel free. It is so it is 0:13:54.916 --> 0:14:00.436 such a strange paradox, Like I understand so many of 0:14:00.476 --> 0:14:05.396 these things are like my weaknesses that I've turned into strengths. 0:14:05.836 --> 0:14:08.276 It strikes me when I see you on stage, it 0:14:08.276 --> 0:14:12.036 strikes me that like, you're doing exactly what you're supposed 0:14:12.036 --> 0:14:16.196 to be doing, Like it feels so authentic and for 0:14:16.316 --> 0:14:19.556 somebody to be able to find that feels really really special. 0:14:19.916 --> 0:14:20.876 Yeah, And it also. 0:14:20.676 --> 0:14:23.756 Strikes me that, like, why aren't more people who are 0:14:23.996 --> 0:14:26.956 lead singers or front people, Like why aren't they doing that? 0:14:27.116 --> 0:14:29.636 Like I love that you give it your all and 0:14:29.676 --> 0:14:32.436 you like think about it from the perspective of an entertainer, 0:14:33.396 --> 0:14:34.796 and like why don't more people do that. 0:14:35.596 --> 0:14:38.876 Well, the entertainment is it's the hook, you know, Yes, 0:14:38.916 --> 0:14:41.116 and you got to have a hook. You got to 0:14:41.196 --> 0:14:44.916 have something that catches people. And you know, that's also 0:14:44.996 --> 0:14:48.236 comes into the songwriting and how you choose to what 0:14:48.276 --> 0:14:50.196 you choose to share, and how you choose to share. 0:14:50.276 --> 0:14:54.236 But for me, the performance is a way to express 0:14:54.596 --> 0:14:58.396 without words because words get lost. But then so you know, 0:14:58.436 --> 0:15:02.196 you show the story through your emotions or through actions. 0:15:02.356 --> 0:15:05.316 Yeah, but you know, the dance. The dance is a hook. 0:15:05.516 --> 0:15:08.196 It's to pull people in so that they don't look away, 0:15:08.396 --> 0:15:10.796 and then you hit with truth and you hit them 0:15:10.836 --> 0:15:13.836 with emotion, and that's important. But you know, I believe, 0:15:14.636 --> 0:15:17.436 I mean, there's definitely front people that I watch and 0:15:17.516 --> 0:15:25.916 I say, do something, But I really believe that it 0:15:25.916 --> 0:15:33.116 doesn't matter how you perform if you're bringing something that's honest, 0:15:33.396 --> 0:15:41.756 because my performance comes from an honest expression of emotion 0:15:42.556 --> 0:15:45.556 in a writing process. So then when I come on 0:15:45.676 --> 0:15:49.516 stage and I have to share something that's very personal 0:15:49.556 --> 0:15:51.996 for the first time and the second time the third time, 0:15:52.356 --> 0:15:57.276 things that I'm still becoming comfortable with myself. To share 0:15:57.356 --> 0:16:05.396 that with people is to feel electricity shooting through your body. 0:16:06.236 --> 0:16:11.836 To feel the wall of emotions behind your eyes. It's 0:16:11.876 --> 0:16:17.596 to feel like life coursing. And I mean that that's 0:16:17.596 --> 0:16:21.116 for me. But I believe that if there's an artist 0:16:21.116 --> 0:16:23.356 who sits at a piano and they're just gonna, like 0:16:23.396 --> 0:16:26.156 I've seen it before, if they write an on a song, 0:16:26.396 --> 0:16:28.596 it doesn't matter. They don't have to dance and move around. 0:16:28.636 --> 0:16:30.716 They just have to play that song and you're gonna 0:16:30.756 --> 0:16:34.596 feel that electricity. You're gonna feel the hair stand up 0:16:34.636 --> 0:16:38.476 on your arms. You know, you're gonna feel the emotion 0:16:38.996 --> 0:16:42.356 because the song is honest. So that's always my goal 0:16:42.676 --> 0:16:48.676 is it's reaching a level of truth so that it's 0:16:48.796 --> 0:16:52.916 not dishonest on stage. And I don't feel like I'm 0:16:53.196 --> 0:16:54.756 that I got to put on a show, you know 0:16:54.756 --> 0:16:56.916 what I mean, Like you want to feel, you know, 0:16:56.916 --> 0:16:59.156 because there are times where you go out on stage 0:16:59.156 --> 0:17:02.276 and you're like you're just tired from the road and 0:17:02.356 --> 0:17:05.556 you feel disconnected and you do have to you do 0:17:05.676 --> 0:17:09.396 put on the show. I'm great at those shows too, 0:17:10.716 --> 0:17:14.396 But the but the truly transcendental shows are the ones 0:17:14.516 --> 0:17:18.796 like you're just like really connecting with the original spirit 0:17:18.876 --> 0:17:21.996 of the song. You're seeing the faces of the people 0:17:21.996 --> 0:17:26.356 that are gone, like like you're walking into those rooms, 0:17:26.756 --> 0:17:28.276 you're smelling those smells. 0:17:28.916 --> 0:17:32.876 So I mean my yeah, my performance is a hope. 0:17:32.996 --> 0:17:33.236 You know. 0:17:33.596 --> 0:17:37.316 It's like I hope that I can connect with the 0:17:37.396 --> 0:17:41.116 muse and and share share like some real truth and 0:17:41.156 --> 0:17:44.636 emotion with people. But uh, but yeah I have If 0:17:44.636 --> 0:17:48.676 you're out there and you're a singer who is afraid 0:17:48.716 --> 0:17:51.556 of being open on stage, my my thing that I 0:17:51.676 --> 0:17:54.436 have a personal I have a personal trick that I 0:17:54.596 --> 0:17:58.036 do for those times when I go on stage. And 0:17:58.156 --> 0:18:04.476 it's funny because I I will always watch singers to 0:18:04.516 --> 0:18:07.276 see their body language, and you can you can see 0:18:07.276 --> 0:18:10.436 the people that are that are closed off because there 0:18:10.516 --> 0:18:13.556 they literally hunched their shoulders, they close themselves with them 0:18:14.116 --> 0:18:17.076 with a mic stand and all of this. But if 0:18:17.116 --> 0:18:18.996 I go out on stage and after a couple songs, 0:18:19.036 --> 0:18:21.636 I feel like I'm not connecting with the audience or 0:18:21.676 --> 0:18:25.276 the audience is not connecting with me, then I actually 0:18:25.396 --> 0:18:29.116 like pull my shoulders back, stand up straight, and slowly 0:18:29.316 --> 0:18:32.716 open my arms completely to the audience, which they're very 0:18:32.756 --> 0:18:35.956 confused about. They don't know what's happening. They just see 0:18:36.556 --> 0:18:41.796 it's it's the it's the actual physical opening up for 0:18:42.116 --> 0:18:45.756 whatever you have for me. I am here, I am 0:18:45.836 --> 0:18:51.076 completely open, and you feel the judgment, you feel the fear, 0:18:52.196 --> 0:18:54.436 and you say, I don't I don't care, you know, 0:18:54.676 --> 0:18:57.396 But it's it's that it's a literal opening of my 0:18:57.556 --> 0:19:01.876 body that's always helped me to to like reconnect with 0:19:01.916 --> 0:19:05.636 the feeling why am I here? And but plus, you know, 0:19:05.716 --> 0:19:08.956 it just confuses the hell out of people and then 0:19:08.956 --> 0:19:10.996 you and then you get them. 0:19:11.356 --> 0:19:14.076 Is it purposeful that the rest of the band is 0:19:14.196 --> 0:19:18.476 just like really like looking down, disconnected, like looks like 0:19:18.556 --> 0:19:22.516 they couldn't give a shit about you, like totally disinterested. 0:19:23.476 --> 0:19:24.636 Is that on purpose? 0:19:25.796 --> 0:19:29.396 It might be now, but I don't think it was originally. 0:19:29.436 --> 0:19:32.396 Garrett's always been really shy. You know, when me and 0:19:32.436 --> 0:19:37.876 Garrett were first friends, he Garrett barely spoke like he 0:19:37.996 --> 0:19:41.916 was He was so quiet that a lot of our 0:19:41.956 --> 0:19:44.996 conversations were really it was just like me da da 0:19:45.076 --> 0:19:46.156 da da da da da da da. 0:19:46.036 --> 0:19:50.156 And Garrett like yep, like fuck this, fuck that, fuck this, yep. 0:19:50.596 --> 0:19:53.796 And and you know, Garrett's different now, he's grown up 0:19:53.836 --> 0:19:57.676 a lot and changed. But that's part of when I 0:19:57.756 --> 0:20:01.236 talk about trying to channel, trying to speak for the music, 0:20:01.396 --> 0:20:04.996 is also giving a voice to my friends. They really 0:20:05.036 --> 0:20:09.036 allow me to go into these really honest places about 0:20:09.196 --> 0:20:12.396 my own life and they stand behind it. That's also 0:20:12.476 --> 0:20:17.276 why I won't sing about certain things because it also 0:20:17.556 --> 0:20:21.156 is representative of them. Does that make sense? Like within 0:20:21.236 --> 0:20:24.476 my rap work, I sing a lot more about like 0:20:24.596 --> 0:20:28.916 drug addiction and and things like that, because because that's 0:20:28.956 --> 0:20:32.436 a place where I feel free to express myself about 0:20:32.436 --> 0:20:35.236 these things that maybe they don't, you know, want their 0:20:35.276 --> 0:20:36.036 parents to hear. 0:20:36.676 --> 0:20:39.156 Or Yeah, when you write a new song, do you 0:20:39.196 --> 0:20:41.796 bring the lyrics to them? How do you share the 0:20:41.916 --> 0:20:44.476 song with them? And do you need them to sign 0:20:44.516 --> 0:20:47.436 off in a way or is it just known that 0:20:47.596 --> 0:20:49.596 like you handle lyrics, they handle music. 0:20:50.356 --> 0:20:52.676 I used to be more hands off with them about 0:20:53.116 --> 0:20:57.596 my lyrics. I used to be like, do not criticize 0:20:57.836 --> 0:21:02.876 or say anything. But I'm a lot more open to 0:21:02.916 --> 0:21:06.756 it now, and so when I send demos, so usually 0:21:06.796 --> 0:21:09.636 what happens is whether I'm in studio with them and 0:21:09.676 --> 0:21:12.756 I make a recording on my computer or my phone 0:21:12.996 --> 0:21:14.676 or in the old days, I used to like carry 0:21:14.676 --> 0:21:19.916 around a big brick conference table cassette recorder and I 0:21:20.236 --> 0:21:23.996 come home and write over tapes or off my computer 0:21:25.236 --> 0:21:28.036 and then I take that or or if Garrett sends 0:21:28.036 --> 0:21:30.916 me an idea or William sends me an idea, I 0:21:30.996 --> 0:21:34.996 usually demo kind of on what we're talking through right 0:21:34.996 --> 0:21:38.716 now as best I can, and then I send to 0:21:38.836 --> 0:21:42.516 them Mike, William, Garrett, I send them the song and 0:21:42.596 --> 0:21:45.476 the lyrics. It has to be a safe space. You know, 0:21:45.556 --> 0:21:48.116 there is egos involved when you are in a band, 0:21:48.436 --> 0:21:51.396 and these are things you navigate over time and you 0:21:51.556 --> 0:21:55.836 like learn to recommunicate again. These are like marriages. You know, 0:21:56.356 --> 0:21:58.316 you got to go on dates. Man, got to go 0:21:58.516 --> 0:22:02.156 on dates, keep the spark alive. Yeah, like these things 0:22:02.156 --> 0:22:04.796 are important just to reconnect and yeah, and you know, 0:22:05.356 --> 0:22:07.316 I know that they're in the past. 0:22:07.396 --> 0:22:12.876 I've was like, do you have any suggestions? Like, screw that. 0:22:13.076 --> 0:22:14.196 I don't like that suggestion. 0:22:14.476 --> 0:22:16.956 But now I'm trying to be more, you know, and 0:22:17.356 --> 0:22:20.716 all parts of my life like really taking the time 0:22:20.836 --> 0:22:25.156 to listen to other people's people's thoughts and because it's 0:22:25.196 --> 0:22:27.596 their band too, you know, because there's that part of 0:22:27.596 --> 0:22:29.436 me in the past. It was just like, well, this 0:22:29.556 --> 0:22:32.116 is my life that I'm singing about, so I know best. 0:22:32.796 --> 0:22:35.756 And then you're like, yeah, but everybody's got to play it, 0:22:35.796 --> 0:22:37.356 and everybody's got to stand behind it. 0:22:38.236 --> 0:22:39.876 We're going to take a quick break and then come 0:22:39.916 --> 0:22:43.036 back with more from Lea Rose and Samuel t Hering. 0:22:47.596 --> 0:22:49.756 We're back with Samuel t Hering. 0:22:50.956 --> 0:22:53.276 How long has the album been finished? Like, does it 0:22:53.316 --> 0:22:56.116 feel like it's like an ancient piece of work at 0:22:56.116 --> 0:22:59.836 this point or does it still feel fresh? 0:22:59.916 --> 0:23:03.076 I would say because of the emotions that were captured 0:23:03.556 --> 0:23:07.156 on the back half of songs that were written, it 0:23:07.396 --> 0:23:10.356 feels fresh, like it's it's one of those things where 0:23:10.356 --> 0:23:15.156 it's still revealing itself because you know, sometimes especially if 0:23:15.196 --> 0:23:17.796 you look at even our last album, there was a 0:23:17.836 --> 0:23:21.716 lot of reflection within a new relationship. You know, the 0:23:22.076 --> 0:23:24.316 reflection was, oh, there was a lot of really bad 0:23:24.356 --> 0:23:27.116 things that happened in that once you're in a healthy place. 0:23:27.196 --> 0:23:30.116 So then this album kind of picks up in the 0:23:30.116 --> 0:23:34.276 middle of the pandemic, separated from that person, and then 0:23:34.356 --> 0:23:38.956 ultimately the first seven songs were written through through the pandemic. 0:23:38.996 --> 0:23:42.116 And you know, my ex was was in Sweden and 0:23:42.156 --> 0:23:44.196 I was unable to get to her. So a lot 0:23:44.236 --> 0:23:48.156 of this distance, which is also a big part of 0:23:48.196 --> 0:23:51.396 our work through touring, you know, saying a lot about distance. 0:23:51.596 --> 0:23:53.636 I know, I feel for you. Man, it's like, how 0:23:53.676 --> 0:23:55.836 do you do that? Yeah, Like, how can you maintain 0:23:55.876 --> 0:23:58.676 a relationship on the road all the time. It seems 0:23:58.716 --> 0:23:59.676 nearly impossible. 0:24:00.876 --> 0:24:07.556 Well, I'm a very good example of that. 0:24:07.716 --> 0:24:09.956 You can't. But then you know, there are is successful 0:24:09.876 --> 0:24:10.516 within that too. 0:24:10.636 --> 0:24:15.676 You know, Garrett has a really beautiful family and and 0:24:15.756 --> 0:24:17.196 you know, and also you know, me and Garrett are 0:24:17.236 --> 0:24:17.996 very different people. 0:24:18.036 --> 0:24:18.476 I think. 0:24:18.796 --> 0:24:21.436 I think that's the thing you find too, is why 0:24:21.476 --> 0:24:23.916 things work and why things don't work. The people we choose, 0:24:23.996 --> 0:24:27.036 why we choose the people we choose, why they choose us, 0:24:27.476 --> 0:24:29.636 you know, and these kinds of things that go deeper 0:24:29.636 --> 0:24:31.836 to the root of like who we are as humans. 0:24:31.876 --> 0:24:34.636 But since the first half of the album was written 0:24:35.236 --> 0:24:38.276 before a breakup, and then the back half was written, 0:24:38.796 --> 0:24:41.876 you know, I finally got back to Sweden, I finally 0:24:41.876 --> 0:24:46.356 got my residency card I had an apartment with this person, 0:24:46.516 --> 0:24:50.196 and then I got back and we just it was over, 0:24:50.396 --> 0:24:54.996 you know, like the feelings were the thing that we're gone. 0:24:55.236 --> 0:24:59.036 So then all of a sudden, I'm rushed into this 0:24:59.156 --> 0:25:02.636 breakup which I did not expect or foresee, And those 0:25:02.636 --> 0:25:05.876 songs came very quickly, so as opposed to in the past, 0:25:05.916 --> 0:25:08.396 I could kind of you know, these songs are coming 0:25:08.436 --> 0:25:12.636 with the reflection or an understanding, like over time or 0:25:12.676 --> 0:25:15.676 like this is where I am at now. The first 0:25:15.716 --> 0:25:19.796 four songs were written in the flash and bang of 0:25:21.156 --> 0:25:25.196 this breakup and my whole life feeling like it was. 0:25:25.876 --> 0:25:28.796 You know, you have an idea of where you're going 0:25:28.956 --> 0:25:32.436 and then it's kind of all taken away from you. 0:25:32.436 --> 0:25:32.916 You don't. 0:25:33.436 --> 0:25:37.916 Yeah, I just felt completely upended and confused. And that's 0:25:38.756 --> 0:25:41.676 scary when you're any age. 0:25:41.836 --> 0:25:43.876 You know, is there ever a part of you when 0:25:43.876 --> 0:25:46.716 you're going through something like that and it's maybe becoming 0:25:46.756 --> 0:25:50.756 clear like Okay, this relationship is ending. Is there like 0:25:50.836 --> 0:25:53.636 a small part of you that's like, ooh, the silver 0:25:53.756 --> 0:25:56.956 lining is I'm going to get great material from this. 0:25:57.076 --> 0:25:59.396 I'm going to get great songs from this situation. 0:26:00.596 --> 0:26:01.596 Well that's what you. 0:26:01.796 --> 0:26:06.156 Tell everyone to hide your own emotions, you know. That's 0:26:06.236 --> 0:26:08.236 like the joke that I would make for years and 0:26:08.316 --> 0:26:10.596 years and years of my life, and then I did that. 0:26:10.876 --> 0:26:13.956 I remember I was, you know, like a bachelor party 0:26:13.996 --> 0:26:15.916 for Garrett when he got married a few years ago, 0:26:16.396 --> 0:26:18.876 five six years ago, and you know, we ran in 0:26:18.916 --> 0:26:20.476 a cabin just out in the woods with a group 0:26:20.556 --> 0:26:23.276 of friends and it was a really nice time. One night, 0:26:23.316 --> 0:26:26.196 we ate some mushrooms and I'm like, I'm like staring 0:26:26.236 --> 0:26:29.876 at a tree with Dan Deacon, just like that tree 0:26:29.956 --> 0:26:36.316 is amazing, and talking to him about about this recent 0:26:36.476 --> 0:26:40.836 split with someone, you know, and kind of the realization 0:26:40.956 --> 0:26:44.036 that I, you know, I had this very short, short 0:26:44.076 --> 0:26:46.636 relationship with a person at a time when we were 0:26:46.676 --> 0:26:48.876 finishing our fifth album, The Far Field, or we were 0:26:48.916 --> 0:26:51.796 working on our fifth album, The Far Field, and I 0:26:51.876 --> 0:26:53.596 was very devoid of emotion at that time, and I 0:26:53.596 --> 0:26:54.796 didn't have anything to write about. 0:26:54.916 --> 0:26:55.956 I've just been on the road. 0:26:55.796 --> 0:26:59.676 For three years straight and I was destabilized just because 0:26:59.716 --> 0:27:02.276 the way my life was. But I told Dan about 0:27:02.316 --> 0:27:05.196 this thing, going through this breakup, and you know, but 0:27:05.236 --> 0:27:07.516 at least I'm going to get some I'm gonna get 0:27:07.556 --> 0:27:08.836 some juicy songs out of it. 0:27:08.876 --> 0:27:10.916 And did I like mind that thing? 0:27:11.036 --> 0:27:12.516 And then it's like, oh, yeah, I got into a 0:27:12.556 --> 0:27:14.516 relationship with a person that I really had nothing in 0:27:14.556 --> 0:27:17.996 common with other than we were attracted to one another. 0:27:18.396 --> 0:27:20.756 Because I knew that it would fail. There was no 0:27:20.876 --> 0:27:23.716 way this thing was actually going to work, and then 0:27:23.796 --> 0:27:28.036 I could take from it and Dan. But what Dan 0:27:28.116 --> 0:27:30.836 said to me was just like I basically looked at 0:27:30.836 --> 0:27:33.196 me and cried and said, I don't like to see 0:27:33.196 --> 0:27:35.276 you hurting. I don't like to see you doing this. 0:27:35.676 --> 0:27:37.436 I feel like you're doing this to yourself. 0:27:37.516 --> 0:27:41.396 And it was a very emotional moment. That moment made 0:27:41.436 --> 0:27:42.236 me change the. 0:27:42.196 --> 0:27:45.876 Way I made that joke, because it wasn't a joke, Like, 0:27:45.916 --> 0:27:47.956 if you really look at that on the surf, what 0:27:48.116 --> 0:27:51.556 the truth of that is pretty actually disgusting. I mean, 0:27:51.596 --> 0:27:53.796 you know, of course this is a mutual attraction between people, 0:27:53.836 --> 0:27:56.196 but you're just like, yeah, I shouldn't even been there, 0:27:56.316 --> 0:27:58.396 Like I shouldn't have done this. I shouldn't have like 0:27:58.436 --> 0:28:01.036 waste my time or somebody else's time. I shouldn't like 0:28:01.476 --> 0:28:04.236 be making light of art. And that that's one of 0:28:04.316 --> 0:28:06.236 the reasons that I have issues with that record is 0:28:06.276 --> 0:28:09.396 that I feel that I was I was kind of 0:28:09.476 --> 0:28:13.396 empty that in those years after the success of Singles, 0:28:13.516 --> 0:28:20.276 I was our fourth album and I felt really empty 0:28:20.436 --> 0:28:23.356 and lost and confused about where I was. I used 0:28:23.356 --> 0:28:26.036 to be so sure of myself as an artist and 0:28:26.196 --> 0:28:28.276 what I had to give and why it was important 0:28:28.316 --> 0:28:31.796 to give, but what I missed. The thing that I 0:28:31.956 --> 0:28:35.276 was also not doing was saving anything for myself, Like 0:28:35.316 --> 0:28:38.876 I was just giving. I was just giving it all 0:28:38.876 --> 0:28:41.876 away and not looking. 0:28:41.956 --> 0:28:43.076 And that's what Dan was saying. 0:28:43.116 --> 0:28:46.476 I wasn't looking out for my own emotions. Was I 0:28:46.556 --> 0:28:49.756 was giving and I was I was looking for failure 0:28:49.916 --> 0:28:53.276 so that I could, you know, idealistically get through their 0:28:53.356 --> 0:28:56.116 issues in their lives. But I wasn't actually protecting myself. 0:28:56.156 --> 0:28:59.716 I wasn't keeping anything for myself. There was and there's 0:28:59.716 --> 0:29:05.196 still a part of me now that does fear that 0:29:05.276 --> 0:29:10.916 it's time to stop sharing about my romantic life. And 0:29:10.956 --> 0:29:13.476 that becomes fearful because you're like, well, that's kind of 0:29:14.356 --> 0:29:17.236 it's kind of the story of our albums, you know, yeah, 0:29:17.236 --> 0:29:23.836 Like the albums have become this chronicle of my life, 0:29:24.396 --> 0:29:28.876 and I fear. I don't think it's really hard to 0:29:28.916 --> 0:29:31.876 shut the faucet when it's open, you know, Yeah, I mean. 0:29:31.756 --> 0:29:34.796 But also, like would that make a difference for you personally? 0:29:34.836 --> 0:29:36.476 Do you think you would be able to reach a 0:29:36.556 --> 0:29:40.876 point with someone that would be like unchartered territory if 0:29:40.916 --> 0:29:44.156 you're not so open about what you're going through in 0:29:44.196 --> 0:29:48.396 your experience, what would you actually achieve do you think 0:29:48.796 --> 0:29:49.836 by not sharing so. 0:29:49.876 --> 0:29:55.636 Much, no idea and it's almost like a challenge. 0:29:55.276 --> 0:29:57.796 Maybe, just like I'm going to try something different because 0:29:57.836 --> 0:30:01.396 what I've been doing hasn't been working. It's not serving me, 0:30:01.516 --> 0:30:02.156 is it that. 0:30:02.236 --> 0:30:05.636 Sort of Well, it's also you know, the other thing 0:30:05.636 --> 0:30:07.476 that happened when I got back from Sweden was that 0:30:07.556 --> 0:30:10.436 I went to therapy for the first time, and in 0:30:10.516 --> 0:30:12.916 doing that, you realize, you know it, well, it was 0:30:13.956 --> 0:30:17.036 I went because I was terrified of spiraling out of 0:30:17.076 --> 0:30:20.796 control into a place that I've been before, you know, 0:30:20.916 --> 0:30:26.476 a substance abuse type substance abuse, you know, just like 0:30:26.636 --> 0:30:29.596 too much sex, too much drinking, too much drugs. I 0:30:29.636 --> 0:30:31.756 was like, I'm not that person anymore. I don't want 0:30:31.756 --> 0:30:34.316 to be that person anymore, you know. Like I was 0:30:34.356 --> 0:30:37.756 so happy when I was in a relationship for years 0:30:37.756 --> 0:30:40.556 with someone who I really cared about and thought that 0:30:40.676 --> 0:30:43.436 was my future because I didn't have to go back 0:30:43.476 --> 0:30:46.076 to those places of emptiness, like I finally had somebody 0:30:46.076 --> 0:30:48.156 to share with. And in getting out of that, I 0:30:48.196 --> 0:30:50.596 was like, I don't want to go back there, right, 0:30:50.676 --> 0:30:52.196 I don't want to be at that place where I 0:30:52.196 --> 0:30:54.516 was in twenty seventeen, to twenty eighteen, where I felt 0:30:54.916 --> 0:30:58.356 really empty. I want to continue this feeling of feeling 0:30:58.356 --> 0:31:02.236 like I'm on a positive path for myself and looking 0:31:02.236 --> 0:31:05.916 out for myself, because so often, especially within relationships, I 0:31:05.956 --> 0:31:08.196 look out for the other person and I don't look 0:31:08.236 --> 0:31:10.516 out for myself, which is actually more of a burden, 0:31:10.796 --> 0:31:13.716 as I would find through therapy, is more of a 0:31:13.716 --> 0:31:18.236 burden on that person. But through that process of they 0:31:18.316 --> 0:31:21.116 just really just reflect me onto me so I can 0:31:21.156 --> 0:31:24.396 see me, and it made me see that, Okay, I 0:31:24.516 --> 0:31:29.716 write these songs about these relationships, they're cycling like I'm 0:31:29.756 --> 0:31:31.556 writing a song that I could have written about the 0:31:31.596 --> 0:31:33.156 same relationship. 0:31:32.716 --> 0:31:33.476 Eight years ago. 0:31:34.236 --> 0:31:38.596 Yeah. I don't think the problem is the people. There's 0:31:38.636 --> 0:31:40.996 something else that needs to be broken in this process, 0:31:41.116 --> 0:31:47.076 you know, there's more to explore within myself to illuminate 0:31:47.116 --> 0:31:47.756 something deeper. 0:31:47.956 --> 0:31:50.796 Like I saw a YouTube. 0:31:50.476 --> 0:31:53.476 Comment a couple maybe two or three months ago on 0:31:53.516 --> 0:31:55.116 a new song of ours, and the guy was just like, 0:31:55.436 --> 0:31:59.476 I wish this guy would stop singing about love because. 0:31:59.156 --> 0:32:02.476 Some of us have never had love and will never 0:32:02.636 --> 0:32:06.036 have love. We'll be alone forever. And I was just like, bro, 0:32:07.036 --> 0:32:08.476 please don't feel that way. 0:32:08.636 --> 0:32:12.396 It's kinda be okay, and maybe really sad that, but 0:32:12.476 --> 0:32:15.876 it also was like, okay, I guess there actually are 0:32:15.956 --> 0:32:18.556 people that don't, you know, because for me, I'm always 0:32:18.596 --> 0:32:22.596 trying to find a universal way to sing about all 0:32:22.836 --> 0:32:24.156 all manners of feelings. 0:32:24.396 --> 0:32:27.516 How much do you think about your perceived audience when 0:32:27.556 --> 0:32:28.116 you're writing. 0:32:29.036 --> 0:32:29.916 Not too much. 0:32:30.996 --> 0:32:33.476 I mean, of course I think about them. But if 0:32:33.476 --> 0:32:37.076 it's a good song that good songs just write themselves, 0:32:37.476 --> 0:32:39.916 I mean good to me, So I should I should 0:32:39.956 --> 0:32:43.036 be clear that you know, what I think is a 0:32:43.036 --> 0:32:47.076 good Future Island song isn't. It's not everyone's cup of tea, 0:32:47.196 --> 0:32:50.436 and that's okay, But I know that if I feel, 0:32:51.196 --> 0:32:54.916 if a song makes me feel, it has the potential 0:32:54.956 --> 0:32:57.836 to move people. Like I don't really remember writing the 0:32:57.876 --> 0:33:01.636 good songs. I don't really remember writing songs there except 0:33:01.636 --> 0:33:04.716 for maybe ones that I have struggled with. But the 0:33:04.716 --> 0:33:06.916 ones you struggle with you're really proud of, but they 0:33:06.956 --> 0:33:07.916 aren't the hits. 0:33:08.636 --> 0:33:11.716 As a song writer, what do you think you're best at? 0:33:12.436 --> 0:33:15.396 Just channeling emotion of music? 0:33:15.636 --> 0:33:19.436 I mean, that's my that is my goal is. 0:33:19.356 --> 0:33:24.996 To connect with the music and speak for it, like 0:33:25.036 --> 0:33:29.996 the partnership of the partnership of me, William and Garrett. 0:33:30.156 --> 0:33:33.396 That's a relationship that's gone back, coming up on twenty 0:33:33.436 --> 0:33:37.076 one years. And the thing is is like we didn't 0:33:37.116 --> 0:33:40.156 when we started making music. William had never played bass 0:33:40.276 --> 0:33:43.276 before and Garrett had never played keyboards before. And I 0:33:43.356 --> 0:33:46.436 was a rapper. I didn't I could sing. I knew 0:33:46.436 --> 0:33:48.796 I could sing, but I wasn't a singer, and I 0:33:48.836 --> 0:33:51.156 didn't want to be a singer. Like I wanted to 0:33:51.156 --> 0:33:53.596 be a rapper and that was my goal, like going 0:33:53.636 --> 0:33:56.076 to school musically, I was like wanted to find a 0:33:56.116 --> 0:34:01.196 producer to make beats. And so the strange thing is 0:34:01.236 --> 0:34:04.596 the way that we grew was really together, like everybody 0:34:04.676 --> 0:34:08.276 kind of learned these new instruments together. And the fact 0:34:08.356 --> 0:34:10.716 is is like, for being an eight year old kid 0:34:10.756 --> 0:34:14.756 who never wanted to sing in a band, I immediate 0:34:14.756 --> 0:34:16.036 because I didn't think it was cool. 0:34:16.516 --> 0:34:18.916 Really, what didn't you think was cool about it? 0:34:19.316 --> 0:34:22.556 Well, to me, bands were like they were like. 0:34:22.596 --> 0:34:25.396 Whiny, which is really funny because like future rounds is 0:34:25.436 --> 0:34:32.276 so emotional, but yeah, bands were like whiny and guitary. 0:34:32.356 --> 0:34:35.116 I didn't like guitars. I was like, you know, I 0:34:35.196 --> 0:34:38.236 like beats and like I like descending. 0:34:38.316 --> 0:34:38.596 I live. 0:34:38.636 --> 0:34:40.716 The falling blocks is what I call them, Like these 0:34:40.796 --> 0:34:44.396 kind of descending synth lines and sample based stuff, and 0:34:45.036 --> 0:34:49.756 I just didn't I was never drawn to guitar guitar rock. 0:34:49.796 --> 0:34:53.076 I'm still not, you know, it's just not my not 0:34:53.156 --> 0:34:55.756 my thing. It took me a long time to even 0:34:55.796 --> 0:34:57.796 get into, like I'm a big you know, I'm a 0:34:57.796 --> 0:34:59.636 big jazz head, but it took me a long time 0:34:59.676 --> 0:35:03.036 to even get down with like jazz guitar. I love 0:35:03.076 --> 0:35:09.076 a little django, but I mean like electric jazz guitars. 0:35:09.156 --> 0:35:10.356 Cool. There's some greats. 0:35:10.076 --> 0:35:14.276 Anyways, let's not talk about. But yeah, like it just 0:35:14.356 --> 0:35:16.516 it just didn't appeal to me. But the thing is 0:35:16.516 --> 0:35:19.196 is like when those guys started making music together, it 0:35:19.316 --> 0:35:23.796 pulled something from me that I couldn't explain. And I 0:35:23.996 --> 0:35:26.596 still just like get this feeling. And I don't know 0:35:26.636 --> 0:35:29.556 if it's because of a deeper connection with those guys, 0:35:29.596 --> 0:35:31.556 especially like you know, get me and Garrett were best 0:35:31.556 --> 0:35:34.356 friends through high school and went off to college together. 0:35:34.796 --> 0:35:37.596 I never made music because Garrett played guitar, you know, 0:35:37.636 --> 0:35:39.836 and he was like he was like a metal guitarist, 0:35:39.956 --> 0:35:42.796 you know, he was just like ripping on his Jackson. Yeah, 0:35:42.876 --> 0:35:45.436 you know, and like, yeah, me and Garrett obviously are 0:35:45.476 --> 0:35:49.556 not going to to make music together. So that so 0:35:49.636 --> 0:35:52.316 then for him to kind of come into this conceptual 0:35:52.356 --> 0:35:55.316 project that me and William had together was really cool 0:35:55.396 --> 0:35:57.236 to have my best friend. And then all of a sudden, 0:35:57.716 --> 0:36:00.836 him and William were just like melding and like learning 0:36:00.876 --> 0:36:04.556 and creating really very quickly, like within six or seven months, 0:36:04.636 --> 0:36:08.476 they were creating these really beautiful ideas from this kind 0:36:08.476 --> 0:36:11.916 of from scratch, you know, from where we started, where 0:36:11.916 --> 0:36:16.516 it was a little loose. But anyways, that's just like 0:36:16.516 --> 0:36:18.916 a thing that has continued to pull for me. But 0:36:19.036 --> 0:36:21.636 as Garrett, you know, Garrett being my best friend. When 0:36:21.676 --> 0:36:23.516 we were kids, you know, a lot of our friendship 0:36:23.596 --> 0:36:29.916 was based around mutual anger and alienation about you know, 0:36:30.036 --> 0:36:33.756 the world as fourteen year old kids who didn't feel 0:36:33.796 --> 0:36:36.436 like we fit in and felt like the way fourteen 0:36:36.476 --> 0:36:39.076 year old kids are every moodst What were. 0:36:38.916 --> 0:36:40.636 You guys like? Like, what were you like in middle 0:36:40.676 --> 0:36:41.596 school and high school? 0:36:42.196 --> 0:36:44.756 I mean Garrett was a skater. I hung out with 0:36:44.756 --> 0:36:48.116 skaters like when we were like twelve or thirteen. And 0:36:48.156 --> 0:36:50.796 then I shouldn't give away all Garrett's secrets, that's for 0:36:50.876 --> 0:36:55.076 him to give away. But I started smoking cigarettes and 0:36:55.196 --> 0:36:58.076 smoking weed and went away. We were both like played 0:36:58.076 --> 0:37:00.356 sports and stuff. But then we kind of went away 0:37:00.356 --> 0:37:04.756 from that. I got really into a kind of discovered poetry, 0:37:05.476 --> 0:37:08.436 weed and drawing all at the same time, and that 0:37:08.516 --> 0:37:10.676 kind of became my life. And you know, through that 0:37:10.796 --> 0:37:13.996 hip hop and I was very much you know, by 0:37:14.036 --> 0:37:16.596 the time I was like fifteen sixteen, I was like, 0:37:16.676 --> 0:37:19.116 I'm an artist and I'm a rapper and I know 0:37:19.156 --> 0:37:20.196 exactly who I am. 0:37:21.116 --> 0:37:22.276 And yeah, it was just on this. 0:37:22.316 --> 0:37:25.996 Journey with words and and uh, you know, Garrett was 0:37:26.476 --> 0:37:28.956 Garrett was. We were both like really into art. We 0:37:29.036 --> 0:37:33.076 had a short lived graffiti crew that was not very cool. 0:37:33.436 --> 0:37:34.796 It was just the two of us. 0:37:35.436 --> 0:37:37.876 We're like, go behind the k art and we're like 0:37:37.876 --> 0:37:40.556 we were gonna do a bombing run on the cam art. 0:37:40.636 --> 0:37:43.196 Oh yeah. Was there anyone in your family who was artists? Like, 0:37:43.236 --> 0:37:44.836 did you have anyone to look up to? 0:37:46.156 --> 0:37:48.716 Yeah? Well, my have like a small family, me and 0:37:48.716 --> 0:37:50.436 an older brother. I mean my brother was the one 0:37:50.476 --> 0:37:52.636 who turned me onto He turned me onto hip hop. 0:37:52.636 --> 0:37:55.396 I mean he was the one that brought the records home. Yeah, 0:37:55.476 --> 0:37:59.916 and uh, he was all into Pantera and crazy into 0:37:59.996 --> 0:38:03.196 Jane's addiction and Danzig and I love Danzig, but I 0:38:03.236 --> 0:38:05.996 didn't get Jane's addiction at all when. 0:38:05.876 --> 0:38:06.596 I was younger. 0:38:07.236 --> 0:38:09.876 I can really appreciate some of it now, but back then, 0:38:09.956 --> 0:38:12.116 I was just like, was terrified about what was happening 0:38:12.116 --> 0:38:14.396 to my brother. You had like he had like holes 0:38:14.396 --> 0:38:17.196 punched in the wall with like pictures of Perry Farrell 0:38:17.276 --> 0:38:19.756 and then with he had one that it said like 0:38:19.996 --> 0:38:24.276 written in like oil crayon around on the wall, just 0:38:24.316 --> 0:38:27.076 like in this hole lives the Wicked King. And I 0:38:27.116 --> 0:38:29.916 was just like, this is I'm very concerned about my 0:38:29.956 --> 0:38:30.516 big brother. 0:38:32.116 --> 0:38:32.996 My parents were too. 0:38:34.676 --> 0:38:36.956 I mean that actually affected me really deeply because when 0:38:36.956 --> 0:38:39.396 I was ten, I you know, went snooping through my 0:38:39.396 --> 0:38:42.036 brother's room when I when I played hooky from school 0:38:42.076 --> 0:38:44.396 to like see what kind of trouble he had that 0:38:44.436 --> 0:38:47.196 I could get into. Ye, and I found Jane's addiction. 0:38:47.636 --> 0:38:50.556 This movie called The Gift that he did. It's like 0:38:50.916 --> 0:38:56.356 heroin overdoses and necrophilia. Yeah, oh right, and he had 0:38:56.516 --> 0:38:59.716 so it was that and he also had gg Allen hated. 0:39:00.156 --> 0:39:02.756 So I was like ten eleven years old watching a 0:39:02.836 --> 0:39:07.756 grown man throw feces around naked and I was like, 0:39:08.076 --> 0:39:10.116 I was just like, I think when I get into music, 0:39:12.836 --> 0:39:13.156 were you. 0:39:13.076 --> 0:39:15.196 Close with your parents at that time? Like what was 0:39:15.196 --> 0:39:16.916 your relationship with They were. 0:39:16.796 --> 0:39:20.756 Always like kind of supported music and art and and 0:39:20.796 --> 0:39:22.596 it was years later until I found out that my 0:39:22.716 --> 0:39:24.636 dad was a painter when he was a kid. 0:39:24.796 --> 0:39:27.556 Oh wow, my dad built a lot of furniture. 0:39:27.876 --> 0:39:29.156 Wow, that's cool. 0:39:29.316 --> 0:39:31.996 And uh and my mom, but my mom played piano 0:39:32.076 --> 0:39:34.676 and loved to play and sang. So there was always 0:39:34.756 --> 0:39:37.956 like stacks of sheet music in the house and that 0:39:38.036 --> 0:39:40.116 was kind of something that me and my brother and 0:39:40.196 --> 0:39:43.916 my mom shared, Like still to this day when it's 0:39:43.996 --> 0:39:46.836 around Christmas time, my mom and brother will sit up 0:39:46.876 --> 0:39:50.236 at the piano and play Christmas songs. But then that 0:39:50.436 --> 0:39:53.156 but also the other thing that happens is then they 0:39:53.436 --> 0:39:55.276 they do all of Jesus Christ Superstar. 0:39:55.396 --> 0:39:57.836 And you know, if you've seen me perform, you think 0:39:57.876 --> 0:40:01.116 that I'm I'm a big showman. 0:40:01.316 --> 0:40:03.916 That you should see my brother do Jesus Christ Superstar 0:40:04.076 --> 0:40:08.436 the living room. Yeah, I mean it came from somewhere. Yeah, 0:40:09.156 --> 0:40:11.716 you know, my brother was really the first front person 0:40:11.756 --> 0:40:13.996 I ever saw in person, you know, he was, and 0:40:14.036 --> 0:40:15.396 that was a big thing too, Like he was the 0:40:15.396 --> 0:40:18.476 one who was in bands. So when I when I 0:40:18.516 --> 0:40:22.556 discovered rap that that was kind of like, oh, that's 0:40:22.596 --> 0:40:25.876 what I'm going to do because Joel does. Joel's in bands, 0:40:26.516 --> 0:40:28.356 so I'll do this thing, you know. It would be 0:40:28.436 --> 0:40:30.996 kind of like it was still like out of some 0:40:31.516 --> 0:40:33.116 want to impress him, but at. 0:40:32.956 --> 0:40:35.636 The same time it was differentiating your path. 0:40:36.116 --> 0:40:40.156 Yeah, having my own thing and feeling more like mine. 0:40:40.556 --> 0:40:42.396 And also that was probably had something to do with 0:40:42.476 --> 0:40:46.316 like I always you know, that partnership with Garrett and 0:40:46.316 --> 0:40:48.596 William and now with Mike or is so important to me. 0:40:48.676 --> 0:40:50.396 But I've always been from. 0:40:50.276 --> 0:40:55.676 A young age very alone, you know, in in how 0:40:55.716 --> 0:40:58.276 I want to move or at least how I feel 0:40:58.316 --> 0:40:59.276 comfortable in the world. 0:40:59.596 --> 0:41:02.876 Is it's that lone wolf syndrome, you know. 0:41:03.236 --> 0:41:06.356 I think it's actually a symptom more of feeling, you know, 0:41:06.476 --> 0:41:08.796 that alienation and isolation at a young age and not 0:41:08.836 --> 0:41:11.036 feeling like I fit in. So then I accepted being 0:41:12.196 --> 0:41:14.276 different to be like, oh no, I choose this. 0:41:14.636 --> 0:41:17.636 Yeah, wee last quick break and then the rest of 0:41:17.676 --> 0:41:25.876 Leah's conversation with Samuel t Hearing and now the rest 0:41:26.036 --> 0:41:27.676 of Samuel t Hearing. 0:41:28.836 --> 0:41:31.796 I noticed on this new album, there's a lot of imagery. 0:41:32.836 --> 0:41:37.396 You mentioned night a lot, and was there something specific 0:41:37.476 --> 0:41:40.196 that happened at night or is that just a time 0:41:40.236 --> 0:41:43.236 of day that you feel particularly reflective. 0:41:44.196 --> 0:41:47.836 That's really funny. I didn't realize how much I talked 0:41:47.836 --> 0:41:49.836 about night. Yes, it is. 0:41:50.876 --> 0:41:54.276 I think the night carries And this once again goes 0:41:54.316 --> 0:41:58.876 to I really believe in using these very simple ideas 0:41:58.996 --> 0:42:02.556 to tell the stories, to try to reach as many 0:42:02.556 --> 0:42:05.836 people as possible. And in the way that the day 0:42:06.396 --> 0:42:10.916 has certain connotations or but different times of day have 0:42:10.916 --> 0:42:13.916 have different meaning. You know, the sunrise means something different 0:42:13.916 --> 0:42:16.476 than the sunset, and in the same way the first 0:42:16.556 --> 0:42:19.156 fall of night, you know, deep in the middle of 0:42:19.196 --> 0:42:21.476 the night, or or the end of night hoping for 0:42:21.516 --> 0:42:24.556 the morning, and in these kinds of things like I 0:42:24.596 --> 0:42:28.196 think for me, I spent a lot of time in 0:42:28.236 --> 0:42:32.156 this album. It felt like it was all through the 0:42:32.236 --> 0:42:36.476 pandemic and then after the pandemic, but the pandemic was 0:42:36.516 --> 0:42:41.996 like had created an environment where the sun didn't come 0:42:42.036 --> 0:42:47.436 out again for a bit because of the the split, 0:42:47.556 --> 0:42:51.756 and then my life feeling like I didn't know what 0:42:52.156 --> 0:42:54.996 was up or down or what was night and day 0:42:55.356 --> 0:42:57.516 and the night like scared me, you know, like the 0:42:57.636 --> 0:43:02.796 night was when, yeah, being alone and being afraid of 0:43:03.076 --> 0:43:05.476 those things that I'd said, like being afraid of the 0:43:05.516 --> 0:43:07.316 ghosts of my past. 0:43:07.036 --> 0:43:07.676 To come back. 0:43:07.716 --> 0:43:10.636 And you know, I was like probably going to bed 0:43:10.636 --> 0:43:13.756 at like eight thirty nine every night after that because 0:43:13.796 --> 0:43:16.836 I wanted I didn't want. I didn't just didn't want 0:43:16.836 --> 0:43:18.756 to be tempted by it. I didn't want to be 0:43:18.796 --> 0:43:21.796 alone with my thoughts, which is all I was. You know, 0:43:22.796 --> 0:43:24.636 when I was writing a lot of this album, it 0:43:24.756 --> 0:43:28.556 felt like it wasn't ever going to end. I think 0:43:28.596 --> 0:43:32.236 that's why those moments are important. Like the way the 0:43:32.276 --> 0:43:35.156 Garden Wheel ends the record is to say that, you know, 0:43:35.276 --> 0:43:38.396 the things rise again and and you know the sun, 0:43:38.956 --> 0:43:40.036 the sun is out again. 0:43:40.036 --> 0:43:40.876 We're out of the room. 0:43:41.356 --> 0:43:43.636 But at the same time, like King of Sweden starts 0:43:44.556 --> 0:43:47.196 the record, there's a line in that song that is 0:43:48.156 --> 0:43:50.436 it's an inside story between me and this person. But 0:43:51.276 --> 0:43:53.276 you know, there was a time I was driving on 0:43:53.316 --> 0:43:58.236 the down a back road and in the countryside and 0:43:58.236 --> 0:44:02.956 southern Sweden, and I could see the moon like through 0:44:02.956 --> 0:44:06.796 the clouds, this big bright moon, the perfect circle of it, 0:44:06.916 --> 0:44:09.316 hazy through the clouds, low on the horizon. I was like, 0:44:09.356 --> 0:44:12.236 the moon is beautiful, and she was just like, dude, 0:44:12.276 --> 0:44:13.236 that's the sun. 0:44:15.356 --> 0:44:17.916 The moon. I was like, the moon is shining through 0:44:17.956 --> 0:44:19.476 the clouds in the daytime. 0:44:20.356 --> 0:44:22.876 She's like, you're like a nocturnal creature who should not 0:44:22.996 --> 0:44:24.076 be out during this. 0:44:24.276 --> 0:44:27.556 Yeah, but then we just like laughed. I was like, 0:44:27.596 --> 0:44:30.636 that's hilarious. But yeah, I say in the line, you 0:44:30.676 --> 0:44:33.076 know the moon was low and incensed or was it 0:44:33.076 --> 0:44:35.796 the sun in the horizon that lit the figure in 0:44:35.836 --> 0:44:39.876 the distance. And that's that's how the song start, or 0:44:39.916 --> 0:44:42.316 the album starts with King of Sweden and the sun 0:44:42.396 --> 0:44:46.516 low on the horizon going down into the night, and 0:44:46.636 --> 0:44:50.076 then we rise up again with the last song. 0:44:50.396 --> 0:44:53.236 King of Sweden is such a good song, thank you, 0:44:53.596 --> 0:44:55.676 thank you very much. When you finish that song where 0:44:55.676 --> 0:44:57.996 you're like, oh, this is like a banger, like this 0:44:58.076 --> 0:44:58.636 is a good one. 0:44:58.716 --> 0:45:01.476 Yeah, Yeah, that one felt really good. And a lot 0:45:01.476 --> 0:45:04.236 of those pretty much all the cadences, and I would 0:45:04.236 --> 0:45:07.836 say about fifty percent of the words, if not more, 0:45:07.876 --> 0:45:13.276 were we're actually freestyles or freestyle improvisations. We we wrote 0:45:13.276 --> 0:45:17.036 that on a jam and then I was like, you know, 0:45:17.196 --> 0:45:23.636 press record and I was just like, yeah, getting. 0:45:23.316 --> 0:45:25.276 That flow, and I was like, this feels really good, 0:45:25.356 --> 0:45:26.156 it feels fun. 0:45:26.556 --> 0:45:29.756 It's really really good. And then that I believe it's 0:45:29.756 --> 0:45:34.316 the second song the tower. M do you think about 0:45:34.356 --> 0:45:39.396 like the little like I I like, are those things 0:45:39.436 --> 0:45:43.196 that you add in intentionally for the song to be 0:45:43.356 --> 0:45:46.956 catchy or is that just how the song worked itself out. 0:45:47.876 --> 0:45:50.876 Well, that's just how it got wrote. That's my that's 0:45:50.916 --> 0:45:54.516 my southern coming out. That's how I got wrote. Yeah, no, 0:45:54.516 --> 0:45:57.836 now that wasn't intentional hook put in. I'm glad that 0:45:57.876 --> 0:45:59.196 you think it's hooky. 0:45:59.876 --> 0:46:01.396 Yeah, I mean I think it's the type of song 0:46:01.436 --> 0:46:04.556 where like by the second or third verse, the first 0:46:04.596 --> 0:46:07.956 time hearing it as a listener, you can start participating 0:46:07.956 --> 0:46:10.036 with it and it's you know, you can repeat it 0:46:10.116 --> 0:46:12.516 and it hooks you in really quickly. 0:46:13.276 --> 0:46:15.196 It is funny because I was home at uh I 0:46:15.276 --> 0:46:18.676 was home at Thanksgiving and and I shared the finished 0:46:18.716 --> 0:46:21.636 record with my parents and my mom was doing that 0:46:21.676 --> 0:46:24.876 around the house. I just like here in different rooms. 0:46:25.396 --> 0:46:28.676 I was like, Oh, that's cute, that's real cute. But 0:46:29.156 --> 0:46:32.956 it's actually funny because if you're you know, there's probably 0:46:32.956 --> 0:46:35.756 like five hundred people out there that would know. But 0:46:35.876 --> 0:46:38.596 our first band, art Lord and the Self Portraits. 0:46:38.196 --> 0:46:38.676 Had a song. 0:46:38.756 --> 0:46:41.236 One of the last last songs you wrote was a 0:46:41.356 --> 0:46:42.676 really awesome song called. 0:46:42.516 --> 0:46:47.596 I I I and I would be like I I. 0:46:47.796 --> 0:46:49.436 Is that the band that you like were kind of 0:46:49.436 --> 0:46:50.156 like a character? 0:46:51.196 --> 0:46:51.436 Yeah? 0:46:51.476 --> 0:46:53.396 Yeah, that was me And that was me and William 0:46:53.476 --> 0:46:56.116 and Garrett's first first group before a future. 0:46:56.596 --> 0:46:58.516 So what was the thinking behind the character? Like, what 0:46:59.556 --> 0:47:00.276 was that all about? 0:47:01.156 --> 0:47:02.876 Well, you know, I told you that when I went 0:47:02.916 --> 0:47:04.516 to college, I didn't really want to I didn't want 0:47:04.516 --> 0:47:06.076 to be in a band, like want to be a rapper, 0:47:06.156 --> 0:47:08.436 and and that's kind of how I saw it. And 0:47:08.436 --> 0:47:12.756 then when I met I was also really into conceptual 0:47:12.836 --> 0:47:16.756 and performance art and had discovered that you know, you 0:47:16.836 --> 0:47:21.476 can stand anywhere you want and do a performance. If 0:47:21.676 --> 0:47:25.036 it's a performance to you, then you know, you can 0:47:25.356 --> 0:47:28.676 stand on the sidewalk and do a performance, and you 0:47:28.676 --> 0:47:31.316 can create art in any moment. Like these ideas as 0:47:31.316 --> 0:47:34.636 a very stoned seventeen eighteen year old were a mind 0:47:34.676 --> 0:47:38.116 blowing to me that I could make art that didn't 0:47:38.196 --> 0:47:42.876 have a product. It was creating reactions, you know, creating 0:47:42.916 --> 0:47:46.236 something for people hopefully good, you know, And I think 0:47:46.236 --> 0:47:49.196 that's something that still is a big part of It 0:47:49.236 --> 0:47:51.276 was a big part of when we started Art Lord 0:47:51.276 --> 0:47:53.476 and Self Portraits, and it's still a big part of 0:47:53.756 --> 0:47:59.636 myself today, which is trying to create reactions within an 0:47:59.676 --> 0:48:03.356 audience in a live setting, because I know the value 0:48:03.356 --> 0:48:07.716 of that. Whether negative or positive, the experience or the 0:48:07.756 --> 0:48:12.796 reaction that you get, it is still pulling something from people. 0:48:13.036 --> 0:48:17.156 It's causing them to uh, it's causing them to think 0:48:17.276 --> 0:48:20.476 or feel. That's been the goal of this band for 0:48:20.516 --> 0:48:24.836 a long time, is to create that safe space for 0:48:24.956 --> 0:48:28.836 an audience to be able to feel free and feel 0:48:28.876 --> 0:48:31.876 like they can be vulnerable and not be afraid. Because 0:48:32.436 --> 0:48:38.436 if we're on stage and we're coming from a PowerPoint, 0:48:38.836 --> 0:48:42.036 you know, a place where we have your attention and 0:48:42.116 --> 0:48:45.516 we can and we can share strong emotion and we 0:48:45.596 --> 0:48:49.676 can cry, and we can fight through things and still 0:48:49.716 --> 0:48:53.676 be strong and share in that moment, then we can, 0:48:53.796 --> 0:49:00.156 you know, just just illustrate through living, you know, this emotion. 0:49:00.436 --> 0:49:05.036 So it's a long process. Life is long, Yeah, it's not. 0:49:05.116 --> 0:49:07.996 Life is short. I lived by that idea for so 0:49:08.116 --> 0:49:11.316 many years of my life, just thinking thinking that I 0:49:11.356 --> 0:49:18.996 was going to die, expecting death, wanting death, and really 0:49:19.036 --> 0:49:22.116 coming to terms in the last ten years, like, Nope, 0:49:22.236 --> 0:49:24.396 it's going to keep going and you're going to find 0:49:24.436 --> 0:49:28.316 better ways to get through it and enjoy things and 0:49:29.076 --> 0:49:32.916 enjoy people and to have a good life instead of 0:49:33.236 --> 0:49:36.876 putting yourself into a bad place. Yeah. I mean that's 0:49:36.956 --> 0:49:41.876 been a big change in the last few years. We've 0:49:41.996 --> 0:49:46.236 made the decision to stop touring so much and to 0:49:46.316 --> 0:49:50.516 make more space for our own lives. And part of 0:49:50.516 --> 0:49:54.116 that is just because it just doesn't feel this touring 0:49:54.116 --> 0:49:56.996 feels a lot different between twenty five and forty. 0:49:57.556 --> 0:50:01.396 Yeah, I imagine is that where you get the biggest 0:50:01.396 --> 0:50:04.916 financial gain is through touring. So making that decision, is 0:50:04.956 --> 0:50:07.676 that changing the way that you know you're going to 0:50:07.756 --> 0:50:08.796 do financially in a year? 0:50:09.636 --> 0:50:10.596 Yeah? Part of that is. 0:50:10.676 --> 0:50:13.876 Part of that is an acceptance of for me personally, 0:50:14.636 --> 0:50:18.196 what I need to make a life work. I mean, 0:50:18.396 --> 0:50:20.716 of course, there was a time where we couldn't take 0:50:20.756 --> 0:50:22.516 a day off on a tour because if you take 0:50:22.556 --> 0:50:25.356 a day off, then you lose money, and there isn't 0:50:25.396 --> 0:50:28.436 any money you can't afford to take time off, So 0:50:28.516 --> 0:50:33.836 that that kind of the diy ethos leaked into a 0:50:33.916 --> 0:50:37.396 time when we could have taken a break and Because 0:50:37.396 --> 0:50:40.476 of that, we really hit the wall hard a couple times, 0:50:41.036 --> 0:50:44.756 and the fear of hitting the wall again is is 0:50:44.796 --> 0:50:46.796 the next time you hit the wall the last one, 0:50:47.516 --> 0:50:51.396 you know, because you do run the high risk, not 0:50:51.476 --> 0:50:54.156 even you don't even run the risk of exhaustion. Being 0:50:54.156 --> 0:50:59.636 a Tory musician, you will get exhausted, and some people 0:50:59.676 --> 0:51:03.036 don't recover from that, you know, it mentally scars them 0:51:03.036 --> 0:51:04.116 and affects them ideal. 0:51:04.356 --> 0:51:05.516 I have my own. 0:51:06.596 --> 0:51:10.916 Damage from touring and the things that it's done to 0:51:10.956 --> 0:51:13.676 my personal life, the things that it's done to me physically, 0:51:14.036 --> 0:51:18.236 Like I have a busted knee from playing shows, and 0:51:19.596 --> 0:51:27.596 I now associate like the month before tour is really 0:51:27.636 --> 0:51:29.596 hard for me because I know that I'm about to 0:51:29.636 --> 0:51:34.756 put myself in pain. Yeah, so it's like I'm psychologically scarred. 0:51:35.276 --> 0:51:35.556 You know. 0:51:35.636 --> 0:51:38.996 So this thing that brings me so much joy and 0:51:39.116 --> 0:51:42.756 gives me purpose is also causes me great pain. 0:51:44.036 --> 0:51:45.836 And you know, I'm doing all kinds of things. 0:51:45.876 --> 0:51:48.196 I'm in physical therapy to like try to get to 0:51:48.236 --> 0:51:50.156 a better place with my knee and make it sustainable. 0:51:50.396 --> 0:51:52.916 But that's what the you know, pairing down from playing 0:51:52.916 --> 0:51:55.156 one hundred and fifty shows a year to playing one 0:51:55.236 --> 0:51:57.916 hundred shows and now probably down to like fifty or 0:51:57.916 --> 0:52:01.396 sixty is where we're at now and not pushing past 0:52:01.476 --> 0:52:05.636 that is about making this, making the decision to do 0:52:05.676 --> 0:52:07.636 this for the rest of our lives. Like we could 0:52:07.636 --> 0:52:10.076 either we could eat to do this one hundred and 0:52:10.076 --> 0:52:12.516 fifty shows a year for the next five years until 0:52:12.516 --> 0:52:14.836 we never want to do this again, or we can 0:52:15.036 --> 0:52:17.876 you know, play fifty shows a year for you know, 0:52:17.996 --> 0:52:22.316 years and years and also be more interesting within our 0:52:22.396 --> 0:52:24.956 music because we can actually take the breaks to live 0:52:25.076 --> 0:52:28.236 life so we have something to reflect on and have 0:52:28.276 --> 0:52:31.436 something to speak about and connect with people on. Like 0:52:32.596 --> 0:52:35.836 we have our first, you know baby in the band, 0:52:36.116 --> 0:52:39.516 and like I don't want that child to grow up 0:52:39.596 --> 0:52:42.836 with out their dad around. 0:52:43.036 --> 0:52:45.716 Is that Garrett Garrett has a baby, yeah, and I. 0:52:45.796 --> 0:52:51.316 And that's it's really important to me that everybody is happy. 0:52:51.756 --> 0:52:53.636 I think that think that's where we all got to 0:52:53.916 --> 0:52:56.516 And I know that I don't need you know, this 0:52:57.276 --> 0:52:59.996 potential amount of money to be happy, Like that's going 0:53:00.036 --> 0:53:03.276 to make me less happy. I only need like this 0:53:03.396 --> 0:53:06.436 to survive, you know. Let me just play the shows 0:53:06.996 --> 0:53:10.956 and like get that joy, not hurt myself, not hurt 0:53:10.996 --> 0:53:15.396 my friends and and you know, feed the audience, but 0:53:15.676 --> 0:53:20.756 like also hold something for ourselves and yeah, and enjoy life. 0:53:21.196 --> 0:53:24.556 Yeah. Well, congratulations on the new album and the promo 0:53:24.636 --> 0:53:26.996 and everything that's to come. It sounds like you're in 0:53:27.076 --> 0:53:27.876 a great space. 0:53:28.356 --> 0:53:29.316 Yeah, thank you so much. 0:53:29.636 --> 0:53:31.836 Yeah, thank you for doing this. I really appreciate you. 0:53:32.276 --> 0:53:32.516 Yeah. 0:53:32.596 --> 0:53:34.796 Yeah, no, but I really appreciate you taking the time 0:53:34.916 --> 0:53:37.196 and making space for us on your podcast. 0:53:40.196 --> 0:53:42.756 Thanks to Samuel T. Harring, the feature Islands for chatting 0:53:42.756 --> 0:53:45.676 about the band's latest album, People Who Aren't There Anymore. 0:53:46.116 --> 0:53:48.276 You can hear it along with our other favorite feature 0:53:48.316 --> 0:53:52.076 Islands Songs on a playlist at broken Record podcast dot com. 0:53:52.596 --> 0:53:55.556 Subscribe to our YouTube channel at YouTube dot com slash 0:53:55.596 --> 0:53:57.996 broken Record Podcast, where you can find all of our 0:53:58.036 --> 0:54:02.116 new episodes. You can follow us on Twitter at broken Record. 0:54:02.596 --> 0:54:05.516 Broken Record is produced and edited by Leah Rose, with 0:54:05.636 --> 0:54:09.036 marketing help from Eric Sandler and Jordan McMillan. Our engineer 0:54:09.316 --> 0:54:13.636 is Ben Toliday. Broken Record is a production of Pushkin Industries. 0:54:14.036 --> 0:54:16.836 If you love this show and others from Pushkin, consider 0:54:16.876 --> 0:54:21.236 subscribing to Pushkin Plus. Pushkin Plus is a podcast subscription 0:54:21.316 --> 0:54:24.076 that offers bonus content and ad free listening for four 0:54:24.236 --> 0:54:27.516 ninety nine a month. Look for Pushkin Plus on Apple 0:54:27.556 --> 0:54:31.476 podcast subscriptions, and if you like this show, please remember 0:54:31.556 --> 0:54:34.156 to share, rate, and review us on your podcast app 0:54:34.396 --> 0:54:37.156 Our theme music's by Kenny Beats. I'm justin Richmond.