Speaker 1: Pushkin.
Speaker 2: The Baltimore based synthpop band Future Islands was first thrust
Speaker 2: into the national spotlight in twenty fourteen after making their
Speaker 2: TV debut on The Late Show with David Letterman. The
Speaker 2: bands unassuming frontman Samuel t Herring, danced ecstatically around the stage,
Speaker 2: seething with emotion. The performance quickly went viral, making it
Speaker 2: one of Letterman's most memorable live appearances ever. At the
Speaker 2: time of their big break, Future Islands had already released
Speaker 2: three albums and been touring relentlessly for nearly a decade,
Speaker 2: and while they would become one of the most prominent
Speaker 2: bands on the festival circuit for the next several years,
Speaker 2: Future Islands always managed to maintain a sense of unparalleled
Speaker 2: raw vulnerability on stage, in part thanks to the deeply
Speaker 2: confessional nature of Sam's songwriting and his stage presence. On
Speaker 2: today's episode, Lea Rose talks to Future Island's lead singer,
Speaker 2: Samuel t Harring about the band's latest album, People Who
Speaker 2: Aren't There Anymore. Sam also describes the physical toll his
Speaker 2: energetic performance style has taken on his body over the years,
Speaker 2: and his long held gripe with guitar based music. This
Speaker 2: is broken record liner notes for the Digital Age. I'm
Speaker 2: justin Mitchman. Here's Lea Rose's conversation with Samuel t Herring.
Speaker 3: When Future Islands started. What was important for you to
Speaker 3: convey to audiences through your performance style?
Speaker 4: Well, the beginning of Future Islands is a little strange
Speaker 4: because the impetus for a beginning of the band was
Speaker 4: a tour that we were supposed to have played as
Speaker 4: our first band that we had forgotten about, and so
Speaker 4: the impetus of the band was basically art Lord. Our
Speaker 4: fourth member left at the end of two thousand and five,
Speaker 4: and we kind of just didn't have a band for
Speaker 4: four or five months, and I don't think me, William
Speaker 4: and Garrett really even talked about what we were going
Speaker 4: to do next. I think we were still kind of
Speaker 4: sad and confused about what had happened because our other
Speaker 4: member just like dipped town and was like, you know,
Speaker 4: I'm not doing the band anymore, and we're like, well,
Speaker 4: do we want to keep doing it without, you know,
Speaker 4: our friend that's been here since the beginning. So and
Speaker 4: then in January of two thousand and six, William got
Speaker 4: an email that was basically like, Hey, how's that tour coming,
Speaker 4: because William used to book all of our He booked
Speaker 4: all the Art Lord shows, he booked the first like
Speaker 4: four or five years of Future Islands as well, and
Speaker 4: so yeah, so instead of you, basically William called me
Speaker 4: and Garrett and was like, I was supposed to book
Speaker 4: this tour and I forgot.
Speaker 1: Do you guys? Do you guys want to start a
Speaker 1: new band?
Speaker 4: And so within like three weeks we wrote and recorded
Speaker 4: five six song EP and then we went we did
Speaker 4: a tour. I mean honestly, there was no thought process.
Speaker 4: I mean that's kind of you know, even the roots
Speaker 4: of art Lord, even though it was high concept, the
Speaker 4: function was punk because we didn't own instruments, you know.
Speaker 4: Williams guitar or Williams bass guitar was borrowed from a friend.
Speaker 4: Like all the amps were borrowed. All the keyboards except
Speaker 4: for one were we're like found at thrift stores or
Speaker 4: borrowed from friends. So the mode was really you know,
Speaker 4: eurosynth pop, but it was but we felt like punks.
Speaker 1: You know.
Speaker 4: Yeah, we stunk and we played your living room, so
Speaker 4: we were punks. And with Future Islands, it was it
Speaker 4: started very much the same, you know, and at the
Speaker 4: time I was I had really bad drug problems. I
Speaker 4: was trying to get out of that, you know. Shortly
Speaker 4: after Future Rounds began, I left town to get my
Speaker 4: life together and get clean. So Future Islands just kind
Speaker 4: of began with these songs. Garrett was kind of playing
Speaker 4: solos for the first time. William's bass was going super fast,
Speaker 4: and for the first time ever, I had kind of
Speaker 4: a drum kit behind me that was creating this propulsive
Speaker 4: It was a propulsive element in the music that we'd
Speaker 4: never had before. Like before that, I was trying to
Speaker 4: be the propulsive element through my movement, but it was
Speaker 4: much more of a dance and a performance and a
Speaker 4: bit of theater. But all of a sudden, I wasn't
Speaker 4: the most you know, I wasn't the thing pushing it forward.
Speaker 4: So I had to I had to figure out how
Speaker 4: to match that energy of the drums. And then that
Speaker 4: brought this whole other element of anger and angst, which
Speaker 4: is a lot of things I was going through at
Speaker 4: the time, fighting drug addiction and feeling really lost in
Speaker 4: my life.
Speaker 3: Were you on hard drugs like I was a.
Speaker 4: Cocain It was like two two and a half years.
Speaker 4: It was like a Gramma day habit. But yeah, I was.
Speaker 4: I was a dealer and became a fiend and then yeah,
Speaker 4: it was really really crazy stuff. It's crazy to think
Speaker 4: about now how much that part of my life was.
Speaker 4: I mean, I was selling weed when I was fourteen,
Speaker 4: fifteen and up until I was twenty two, twenty three.
Speaker 3: I was gonna ask you if you ever had like
Speaker 3: a regular job, but I guess.
Speaker 1: Yeah, I was a terrible drug dealer.
Speaker 4: I was just like make sure everybody's got what they
Speaker 4: need and I get high for free. But yeah, all
Speaker 4: this stuff. You know, it's such a strange world to
Speaker 4: think about, but you know, these are the things. This
Speaker 4: is my life that I, you know, one time, was
Speaker 4: very afraid to share that I'm very open with now
Speaker 4: because I want people to know, like, yeah, there is
Speaker 4: another side, and you know, and I've I've slipped many times,
Speaker 4: you know, And that's part of it too, you know.
Speaker 4: Part of it is saying like you don't say like, yeah,
Speaker 4: I used to be I used to have a problem.
Speaker 4: You're like, no, I have a problem. I just don't.
Speaker 4: I don't do it. You know, I have all the problems.
Speaker 4: You know, I'm addicted to so many things.
Speaker 1: And that that's part of it.
Speaker 4: But that process of leaving town began with a conversation
Speaker 4: with the guys to ask them if it was okay,
Speaker 4: and they're like, yes, please, like we know that you
Speaker 4: have a problem, please get go get help. But by
Speaker 4: the time we got to Baltimore, you know, I finally
Speaker 4: was starting to feel like myself again. I was with
Speaker 4: my friends again, who's like lives I'd missed.
Speaker 1: You know.
Speaker 4: That was when I think we decided to believe in
Speaker 4: ourselves and go after a thing that in the past
Speaker 4: it had been like, you know, maybe this this is
Speaker 4: like really fun and people want to see us play,
Speaker 4: so we'll go play some shows, to being like it's
Speaker 4: time to go for it. And that's when we you know,
Speaker 4: once two months after Garrett got to Baltimore, we went
Speaker 4: on our first US tour and then just stayed on
Speaker 4: tour for five years, almost five years. We played like
Speaker 4: in that four and a half years, we played close
Speaker 4: to eight hundred shows.
Speaker 2: Wow.
Speaker 4: And that's when the band grew, you know, from being
Speaker 4: from playing you know, for peanuts and playing like five
Speaker 4: and ten people at the beginning around the country to
Speaker 4: to like making a living at the end. Yeah, you know,
Speaker 4: there was a time in our lives where we wanted
Speaker 4: to you know that you think everybody's listening.
Speaker 3: And when was that time? Was that like around the
Speaker 3: time of the Letterman performance.
Speaker 4: Yeah, that was like twenty into twenty fourteen and fifteen
Speaker 4: we really felt like, oh, people are finally care about
Speaker 4: what we do, you know, our fourth album. You know,
Speaker 4: we're all you know, we didn't expect to be a
Speaker 4: spotlight band at that point, like we were. We had
Speaker 4: gotten over the feelings and like had accepted that that
Speaker 4: was never going to happen, and that was actually really
Speaker 4: freeing to be like, Okay, cool, I guess nobody really
Speaker 4: cares that much, but the audience cares. You know, We've
Speaker 4: built our own We've built our own audience through our
Speaker 4: own hard work, and then all of a sudden we
Speaker 4: were in the spotlight and that really affected us in
Speaker 4: it did make us think about who the audience was
Speaker 4: and writing for that perceived audience. And then we created
Speaker 4: an album that we just kind of rushed and I
Speaker 4: don't think took the proper time, but I think we
Speaker 4: were also so exhausted. Yeah, we were just lost. So
Speaker 4: there was that period where you said, oh, maybe people care, Yeah,
Speaker 4: and let's write for them, and maybe this will take
Speaker 4: us to another step up and then you kind of
Speaker 4: get to that step. I wrote a line in a
Speaker 4: rap song that came out in twenty nineteen, the album
Speaker 4: of by Buddy Kinney Siegel, and I said, uh, basically like, yeah,
Speaker 4: there's no air at the top, and it's hard to
Speaker 4: breathe when your breath is something you lost. And it's
Speaker 4: just like that idea of like I wanted all of this,
Speaker 4: I did all of this, I got to the top
Speaker 4: and I couldn't breathe, and then you know, the years
Speaker 4: after that is accepting like I don't want to be
Speaker 4: up there struggling. I want to be at a place
Speaker 4: where I feel comfortable and I can be the artists
Speaker 4: that I set out to be.
Speaker 3: Yeah, how is that different than what you thought it
Speaker 3: would be?
Speaker 4: Like, I think one of the things that I realized
Speaker 4: is that before we have the really the national exposure,
Speaker 4: I kind of perceived it as when it gets bigger,
Speaker 4: it's easier, but it gets a lot harder. It takes work,
Speaker 4: and I think it made me really respect the people that.
Speaker 1: Can do it for so long and.
Speaker 4: Can do it at that reach a certain level because
Speaker 4: I kind of thought, oh, yeah, you just get bigger
Speaker 4: and then you have a bigger team, and then they
Speaker 4: just figure out, they make all the decisions and you
Speaker 4: just get to walk out on stage and you know,
Speaker 4: maybe that's what like bon Jovi gets to do. But yeah,
Speaker 4: just fly in and play the show and go home again,
Speaker 4: fly out. But it's a lot of jumping through hoops,
Speaker 4: it's a lot of kissing the ring. You have to
Speaker 4: be like more humble, you have to play the game,
Speaker 4: and it's it's all part of the process of getting
Speaker 4: that more and more exposure. And that just wasn't who
Speaker 4: we were. And I think we've just done it too long.
Speaker 4: I mean, the biggest thing, you know, I've always had
Speaker 4: kind of a social anxieties, but through that process they
Speaker 4: really got heightened. And as my life has gone on
Speaker 4: since that point, my social anxieties have gotten worse. Like
Speaker 4: I'm learning how to try to feel more comfortable and
Speaker 4: deal with anxiety and soothe myself and these kinds of
Speaker 4: things you learn about. But but it is like I
Speaker 4: didn't used to feel as out of place as I
Speaker 4: do now. That's part of why I'm like in a
Speaker 4: new city is because I feel a freedom in a
Speaker 4: new place, like I don't feel I feel less judged,
Speaker 4: I feel anonymous. Yeah, you know, and that feels good.
Speaker 3: It's interesting to me that you would say you have
Speaker 3: social anxiety when your performances are so they feel so
Speaker 3: vulnerable and you feel so open and you're so transparent
Speaker 3: with what you're feeling, and you're crying, you're growling, you're
Speaker 3: shaking your fist at the sky, and you're completely wide
Speaker 3: open at that point. Yes, So how are you able
Speaker 3: to do that if you also have the other side
Speaker 3: of you, which can feel scared.
Speaker 4: Well, there's a difference between being in a crowd and
Speaker 4: being in front of a crowd. There's power that comes
Speaker 4: with a microphone in a stage when you're in a
Speaker 4: group of people, or entering into a group of people,
Speaker 4: especially if you're if you don't feel like you have
Speaker 4: a place, or you are searching for a friend, you know,
Speaker 4: somebody to talk to, or you know you're alone, even
Speaker 4: like going to you know, like I have like anxiety
Speaker 4: going to like a friend's house for like a Christmas
Speaker 4: party or something, you know, And that's really sad because
Speaker 4: then you very quickly learn like oh yeah, these are
Speaker 4: all my friends. I don't have anything to be worried about.
Speaker 4: But so when you're entering into a space where you're
Speaker 4: an anonymous person, you don't get to you don't get
Speaker 4: to like express who you are. You're kind of you're
Speaker 4: scene for who you are on the outside. There's none
Speaker 4: of who you are on the inside. You're only viewed
Speaker 4: by people's perceptions. When you're on stage, you get to
Speaker 4: express who you are. You get to share who you are,
Speaker 4: and you get to prove to people who you are. Like,
Speaker 4: my thing is that I've always felt like I didn't
Speaker 4: belong and because of that, I felt like an underdog
Speaker 4: who had to prove themselves. You know, that's the story
Speaker 4: of Future Islands, That's the story of me. Is like
Speaker 4: I have something to prove that I belong, that I'm
Speaker 4: worth a damn, that I have meaning in this world.
Speaker 4: And that's not for me to just prove to other people.
Speaker 4: It's for me to prove to myself and for me
Speaker 4: to share that you can feel this way but still
Speaker 4: make a place for yourself in this world and that
Speaker 4: you're not alone. So you know that that's the difference
Speaker 4: between being the person watching the show and the person
Speaker 4: you know being the show is now I have something
Speaker 4: to tell you. Yeah, I've always loved the stage because
Speaker 4: it allows me to express myself and feel like that
Speaker 4: allows people to see me for who I am. Whether
Speaker 4: or not they like that is not my concern. It's
Speaker 4: really about I mean, you want people to like what
Speaker 4: you do. But it is like, now I've at least
Speaker 4: expressed who I am, and that makes me feel really courageous.
Speaker 4: You know, it makes me feel brave. I don't know,
Speaker 4: it makes me feel free. It is so it is
Speaker 4: such a strange paradox, Like I understand so many of
Speaker 4: these things are like my weaknesses that I've turned into strengths.
Speaker 3: It strikes me when I see you on stage, it
Speaker 3: strikes me that like, you're doing exactly what you're supposed
Speaker 3: to be doing, Like it feels so authentic and for
Speaker 3: somebody to be able to find that feels really really special.
Speaker 1: Yeah, And it also.
Speaker 3: Strikes me that, like, why aren't more people who are
Speaker 3: lead singers or front people, Like why aren't they doing that?
Speaker 3: Like I love that you give it your all and
Speaker 3: you like think about it from the perspective of an entertainer,
Speaker 3: and like why don't more people do that.
Speaker 4: Well, the entertainment is it's the hook, you know, Yes,
Speaker 4: and you got to have a hook. You got to
Speaker 4: have something that catches people. And you know, that's also
Speaker 4: comes into the songwriting and how you choose to what
Speaker 4: you choose to share, and how you choose to share.
Speaker 4: But for me, the performance is a way to express
Speaker 4: without words because words get lost. But then so you know,
Speaker 4: you show the story through your emotions or through actions.
Speaker 1: Yeah, but you know, the dance. The dance is a hook.
Speaker 4: It's to pull people in so that they don't look away,
Speaker 4: and then you hit with truth and you hit them
Speaker 4: with emotion, and that's important. But you know, I believe,
Speaker 4: I mean, there's definitely front people that I watch and
Speaker 4: I say, do something, But I really believe that it
Speaker 4: doesn't matter how you perform if you're bringing something that's honest,
Speaker 4: because my performance comes from an honest expression of emotion
Speaker 4: in a writing process. So then when I come on
Speaker 4: stage and I have to share something that's very personal
Speaker 4: for the first time and the second time the third time,
Speaker 4: things that I'm still becoming comfortable with myself. To share
Speaker 4: that with people is to feel electricity shooting through your body.
Speaker 4: To feel the wall of emotions behind your eyes. It's
Speaker 4: to feel like life coursing. And I mean that that's
Speaker 4: for me. But I believe that if there's an artist
Speaker 4: who sits at a piano and they're just gonna, like
Speaker 4: I've seen it before, if they write an on a song,
Speaker 4: it doesn't matter. They don't have to dance and move around.
Speaker 4: They just have to play that song and you're gonna
Speaker 4: feel that electricity. You're gonna feel the hair stand up
Speaker 4: on your arms. You know, you're gonna feel the emotion
Speaker 4: because the song is honest. So that's always my goal
Speaker 4: is it's reaching a level of truth so that it's
Speaker 4: not dishonest on stage. And I don't feel like I'm
Speaker 4: that I got to put on a show, you know
Speaker 4: what I mean, Like you want to feel, you know,
Speaker 4: because there are times where you go out on stage
Speaker 4: and you're like you're just tired from the road and
Speaker 4: you feel disconnected and you do have to you do
Speaker 4: put on the show. I'm great at those shows too,
Speaker 4: But the but the truly transcendental shows are the ones
Speaker 4: like you're just like really connecting with the original spirit
Speaker 4: of the song. You're seeing the faces of the people
Speaker 4: that are gone, like like you're walking into those rooms,
Speaker 4: you're smelling those smells.
Speaker 1: So I mean my yeah, my performance is a hope.
Speaker 1: You know.
Speaker 4: It's like I hope that I can connect with the
Speaker 4: muse and and share share like some real truth and
Speaker 4: emotion with people. But uh, but yeah I have If
Speaker 4: you're out there and you're a singer who is afraid
Speaker 4: of being open on stage, my my thing that I
Speaker 4: have a personal I have a personal trick that I
Speaker 4: do for those times when I go on stage. And
Speaker 4: it's funny because I I will always watch singers to
Speaker 4: see their body language, and you can you can see
Speaker 4: the people that are that are closed off because there
Speaker 4: they literally hunched their shoulders, they close themselves with them
Speaker 4: with a mic stand and all of this. But if
Speaker 4: I go out on stage and after a couple songs,
Speaker 4: I feel like I'm not connecting with the audience or
Speaker 4: the audience is not connecting with me, then I actually
Speaker 4: like pull my shoulders back, stand up straight, and slowly
Speaker 4: open my arms completely to the audience, which they're very
Speaker 4: confused about. They don't know what's happening. They just see
Speaker 4: it's it's the it's the actual physical opening up for
Speaker 4: whatever you have for me. I am here, I am
Speaker 4: completely open, and you feel the judgment, you feel the fear,
Speaker 4: and you say, I don't I don't care, you know,
Speaker 4: But it's it's that it's a literal opening of my
Speaker 4: body that's always helped me to to like reconnect with
Speaker 4: the feeling why am I here? And but plus, you know,
Speaker 4: it just confuses the hell out of people and then
Speaker 4: you and then you get them.
Speaker 3: Is it purposeful that the rest of the band is
Speaker 3: just like really like looking down, disconnected, like looks like
Speaker 3: they couldn't give a shit about you, like totally disinterested.
Speaker 3: Is that on purpose?
Speaker 4: It might be now, but I don't think it was originally.
Speaker 4: Garrett's always been really shy. You know, when me and
Speaker 4: Garrett were first friends, he Garrett barely spoke like he
Speaker 4: was He was so quiet that a lot of our
Speaker 4: conversations were really it was just like me da da
Speaker 4: da da da da da da da.
Speaker 1: And Garrett like yep, like fuck this, fuck that, fuck this, yep.
Speaker 4: And and you know, Garrett's different now, he's grown up
Speaker 4: a lot and changed. But that's part of when I
Speaker 4: talk about trying to channel, trying to speak for the music,
Speaker 4: is also giving a voice to my friends. They really
Speaker 4: allow me to go into these really honest places about
Speaker 4: my own life and they stand behind it. That's also
Speaker 4: why I won't sing about certain things because it also
Speaker 4: is representative of them. Does that make sense? Like within
Speaker 4: my rap work, I sing a lot more about like
Speaker 4: drug addiction and and things like that, because because that's
Speaker 4: a place where I feel free to express myself about
Speaker 4: these things that maybe they don't, you know, want their
Speaker 4: parents to hear.
Speaker 3: Or Yeah, when you write a new song, do you
Speaker 3: bring the lyrics to them? How do you share the
Speaker 3: song with them? And do you need them to sign
Speaker 3: off in a way or is it just known that
Speaker 3: like you handle lyrics, they handle music.
Speaker 4: I used to be more hands off with them about
Speaker 4: my lyrics. I used to be like, do not criticize
Speaker 4: or say anything. But I'm a lot more open to
Speaker 4: it now, and so when I send demos, so usually
Speaker 4: what happens is whether I'm in studio with them and
Speaker 4: I make a recording on my computer or my phone
Speaker 4: or in the old days, I used to like carry
Speaker 4: around a big brick conference table cassette recorder and I
Speaker 4: come home and write over tapes or off my computer
Speaker 4: and then I take that or or if Garrett sends
Speaker 4: me an idea or William sends me an idea, I
Speaker 4: usually demo kind of on what we're talking through right
Speaker 4: now as best I can, and then I send to
Speaker 4: them Mike, William, Garrett, I send them the song and
Speaker 4: the lyrics. It has to be a safe space. You know,
Speaker 4: there is egos involved when you are in a band,
Speaker 4: and these are things you navigate over time and you
Speaker 4: like learn to recommunicate again. These are like marriages. You know,
Speaker 4: you got to go on dates. Man, got to go
Speaker 4: on dates, keep the spark alive. Yeah, like these things
Speaker 4: are important just to reconnect and yeah, and you know,
Speaker 4: I know that they're in the past.
Speaker 1: I've was like, do you have any suggestions? Like, screw that.
Speaker 1: I don't like that suggestion.
Speaker 4: But now I'm trying to be more, you know, and
Speaker 4: all parts of my life like really taking the time
Speaker 4: to listen to other people's people's thoughts and because it's
Speaker 4: their band too, you know, because there's that part of
Speaker 4: me in the past. It was just like, well, this
Speaker 4: is my life that I'm singing about, so I know best.
Speaker 4: And then you're like, yeah, but everybody's got to play it,
Speaker 4: and everybody's got to stand behind it.
Speaker 2: We're going to take a quick break and then come
Speaker 2: back with more from Lea Rose and Samuel t Hering.
Speaker 2: We're back with Samuel t Hering.
Speaker 3: How long has the album been finished? Like, does it
Speaker 3: feel like it's like an ancient piece of work at
Speaker 3: this point or does it still feel fresh?
Speaker 4: I would say because of the emotions that were captured
Speaker 4: on the back half of songs that were written, it
Speaker 4: feels fresh, like it's it's one of those things where
Speaker 4: it's still revealing itself because you know, sometimes especially if
Speaker 4: you look at even our last album, there was a
Speaker 4: lot of reflection within a new relationship. You know, the
Speaker 4: reflection was, oh, there was a lot of really bad
Speaker 4: things that happened in that once you're in a healthy place.
Speaker 4: So then this album kind of picks up in the
Speaker 4: middle of the pandemic, separated from that person, and then
Speaker 4: ultimately the first seven songs were written through through the pandemic.
Speaker 4: And you know, my ex was was in Sweden and
Speaker 4: I was unable to get to her. So a lot
Speaker 4: of this distance, which is also a big part of
Speaker 4: our work through touring, you know, saying a lot about distance.
Speaker 3: I know, I feel for you. Man, it's like, how
Speaker 3: do you do that? Yeah, Like, how can you maintain
Speaker 3: a relationship on the road all the time. It seems
Speaker 3: nearly impossible.
Speaker 4: Well, I'm a very good example of that.
Speaker 1: You can't. But then you know, there are is successful
Speaker 1: within that too.
Speaker 4: You know, Garrett has a really beautiful family and and
Speaker 4: you know, and also you know, me and Garrett are
Speaker 4: very different people.
Speaker 1: I think.
Speaker 4: I think that's the thing you find too, is why
Speaker 4: things work and why things don't work. The people we choose,
Speaker 4: why we choose the people we choose, why they choose us,
Speaker 4: you know, and these kinds of things that go deeper
Speaker 4: to the root of like who we are as humans.
Speaker 4: But since the first half of the album was written
Speaker 4: before a breakup, and then the back half was written,
Speaker 4: you know, I finally got back to Sweden, I finally
Speaker 4: got my residency card I had an apartment with this person,
Speaker 4: and then I got back and we just it was over,
Speaker 4: you know, like the feelings were the thing that we're gone.
Speaker 4: So then all of a sudden, I'm rushed into this
Speaker 4: breakup which I did not expect or foresee, And those
Speaker 4: songs came very quickly, so as opposed to in the past,
Speaker 4: I could kind of you know, these songs are coming
Speaker 4: with the reflection or an understanding, like over time or
Speaker 4: like this is where I am at now. The first
Speaker 4: four songs were written in the flash and bang of
Speaker 4: this breakup and my whole life feeling like it was.
Speaker 4: You know, you have an idea of where you're going
Speaker 4: and then it's kind of all taken away from you.
Speaker 1: You don't.
Speaker 4: Yeah, I just felt completely upended and confused. And that's
Speaker 4: scary when you're any age.
Speaker 3: You know, is there ever a part of you when
Speaker 3: you're going through something like that and it's maybe becoming
Speaker 3: clear like Okay, this relationship is ending. Is there like
Speaker 3: a small part of you that's like, ooh, the silver
Speaker 3: lining is I'm going to get great material from this.
Speaker 3: I'm going to get great songs from this situation.
Speaker 1: Well that's what you.
Speaker 4: Tell everyone to hide your own emotions, you know. That's
Speaker 4: like the joke that I would make for years and
Speaker 4: years and years of my life, and then I did that.
Speaker 4: I remember I was, you know, like a bachelor party
Speaker 4: for Garrett when he got married a few years ago,
Speaker 4: five six years ago, and you know, we ran in
Speaker 4: a cabin just out in the woods with a group
Speaker 4: of friends and it was a really nice time. One night,
Speaker 4: we ate some mushrooms and I'm like, I'm like staring
Speaker 4: at a tree with Dan Deacon, just like that tree
Speaker 4: is amazing, and talking to him about about this recent
Speaker 4: split with someone, you know, and kind of the realization
Speaker 4: that I, you know, I had this very short, short
Speaker 4: relationship with a person at a time when we were
Speaker 4: finishing our fifth album, The Far Field, or we were
Speaker 4: working on our fifth album, The Far Field, and I
Speaker 4: was very devoid of emotion at that time, and I
Speaker 4: didn't have anything to write about.
Speaker 1: I've just been on the road.
Speaker 4: For three years straight and I was destabilized just because
Speaker 4: the way my life was. But I told Dan about
Speaker 4: this thing, going through this breakup, and you know, but
Speaker 4: at least I'm going to get some I'm gonna get
Speaker 4: some juicy songs out of it.
Speaker 1: And did I like mind that thing?
Speaker 4: And then it's like, oh, yeah, I got into a
Speaker 4: relationship with a person that I really had nothing in
Speaker 4: common with other than we were attracted to one another.
Speaker 4: Because I knew that it would fail. There was no
Speaker 4: way this thing was actually going to work, and then
Speaker 4: I could take from it and Dan. But what Dan
Speaker 4: said to me was just like I basically looked at
Speaker 4: me and cried and said, I don't like to see
Speaker 4: you hurting. I don't like to see you doing this.
Speaker 4: I feel like you're doing this to yourself.
Speaker 1: And it was a very emotional moment. That moment made
Speaker 1: me change the.
Speaker 4: Way I made that joke, because it wasn't a joke, Like,
Speaker 4: if you really look at that on the surf, what
Speaker 4: the truth of that is pretty actually disgusting. I mean,
Speaker 4: you know, of course this is a mutual attraction between people,
Speaker 4: but you're just like, yeah, I shouldn't even been there,
Speaker 4: Like I shouldn't have done this. I shouldn't have like
Speaker 4: waste my time or somebody else's time. I shouldn't like
Speaker 4: be making light of art. And that that's one of
Speaker 4: the reasons that I have issues with that record is
Speaker 4: that I feel that I was I was kind of
Speaker 4: empty that in those years after the success of Singles,
Speaker 4: I was our fourth album and I felt really empty
Speaker 4: and lost and confused about where I was. I used
Speaker 4: to be so sure of myself as an artist and
Speaker 4: what I had to give and why it was important
Speaker 4: to give, but what I missed. The thing that I
Speaker 4: was also not doing was saving anything for myself, Like
Speaker 4: I was just giving. I was just giving it all
Speaker 4: away and not looking.
Speaker 1: And that's what Dan was saying.
Speaker 4: I wasn't looking out for my own emotions. Was I
Speaker 4: was giving and I was I was looking for failure
Speaker 4: so that I could, you know, idealistically get through their
Speaker 4: issues in their lives. But I wasn't actually protecting myself.
Speaker 4: I wasn't keeping anything for myself. There was and there's
Speaker 4: still a part of me now that does fear that
Speaker 4: it's time to stop sharing about my romantic life. And
Speaker 4: that becomes fearful because you're like, well, that's kind of
Speaker 4: it's kind of the story of our albums, you know, yeah,
Speaker 4: Like the albums have become this chronicle of my life,
Speaker 4: and I fear. I don't think it's really hard to
Speaker 4: shut the faucet when it's open, you know, Yeah, I mean.
Speaker 3: But also, like would that make a difference for you personally?
Speaker 3: Do you think you would be able to reach a
Speaker 3: point with someone that would be like unchartered territory if
Speaker 3: you're not so open about what you're going through in
Speaker 3: your experience, what would you actually achieve do you think
Speaker 3: by not sharing so.
Speaker 4: Much, no idea and it's almost like a challenge.
Speaker 3: Maybe, just like I'm going to try something different because
Speaker 3: what I've been doing hasn't been working. It's not serving me,
Speaker 3: is it that.
Speaker 4: Sort of Well, it's also you know, the other thing
Speaker 4: that happened when I got back from Sweden was that
Speaker 4: I went to therapy for the first time, and in
Speaker 4: doing that, you realize, you know it, well, it was
Speaker 4: I went because I was terrified of spiraling out of
Speaker 4: control into a place that I've been before, you know,
Speaker 4: a substance abuse type substance abuse, you know, just like
Speaker 4: too much sex, too much drinking, too much drugs. I
Speaker 4: was like, I'm not that person anymore. I don't want
Speaker 4: to be that person anymore, you know. Like I was
Speaker 4: so happy when I was in a relationship for years
Speaker 4: with someone who I really cared about and thought that
Speaker 4: was my future because I didn't have to go back
Speaker 4: to those places of emptiness, like I finally had somebody
Speaker 4: to share with. And in getting out of that, I
Speaker 4: was like, I don't want to go back there, right,
Speaker 4: I don't want to be at that place where I
Speaker 4: was in twenty seventeen, to twenty eighteen, where I felt
Speaker 4: really empty. I want to continue this feeling of feeling
Speaker 4: like I'm on a positive path for myself and looking
Speaker 4: out for myself, because so often, especially within relationships, I
Speaker 4: look out for the other person and I don't look
Speaker 4: out for myself, which is actually more of a burden,
Speaker 4: as I would find through therapy, is more of a
Speaker 4: burden on that person. But through that process of they
Speaker 4: just really just reflect me onto me so I can
Speaker 4: see me, and it made me see that, Okay, I
Speaker 4: write these songs about these relationships, they're cycling like I'm
Speaker 4: writing a song that I could have written about the
Speaker 4: same relationship.
Speaker 1: Eight years ago.
Speaker 4: Yeah. I don't think the problem is the people. There's
Speaker 4: something else that needs to be broken in this process,
Speaker 4: you know, there's more to explore within myself to illuminate
Speaker 4: something deeper.
Speaker 1: Like I saw a YouTube.
Speaker 4: Comment a couple maybe two or three months ago on
Speaker 4: a new song of ours, and the guy was just like,
Speaker 4: I wish this guy would stop singing about love because.
Speaker 1: Some of us have never had love and will never
Speaker 1: have love. We'll be alone forever. And I was just like, bro,
Speaker 1: please don't feel that way.
Speaker 4: It's kinda be okay, and maybe really sad that, but
Speaker 4: it also was like, okay, I guess there actually are
Speaker 4: people that don't, you know, because for me, I'm always
Speaker 4: trying to find a universal way to sing about all
Speaker 4: all manners of feelings.
Speaker 3: How much do you think about your perceived audience when
Speaker 3: you're writing.
Speaker 1: Not too much.
Speaker 4: I mean, of course I think about them. But if
Speaker 4: it's a good song that good songs just write themselves,
Speaker 4: I mean good to me, So I should I should
Speaker 4: be clear that you know, what I think is a
Speaker 4: good Future Island song isn't. It's not everyone's cup of tea,
Speaker 4: and that's okay, But I know that if I feel,
Speaker 4: if a song makes me feel, it has the potential
Speaker 4: to move people. Like I don't really remember writing the
Speaker 4: good songs. I don't really remember writing songs there except
Speaker 4: for maybe ones that I have struggled with. But the
Speaker 4: ones you struggle with you're really proud of, but they
Speaker 4: aren't the hits.
Speaker 3: As a song writer, what do you think you're best at?
Speaker 4: Just channeling emotion of music?
Speaker 1: I mean, that's my that is my goal is.
Speaker 4: To connect with the music and speak for it, like
Speaker 4: the partnership of the partnership of me, William and Garrett.
Speaker 4: That's a relationship that's gone back, coming up on twenty
Speaker 4: one years. And the thing is is like we didn't
Speaker 4: when we started making music. William had never played bass
Speaker 4: before and Garrett had never played keyboards before. And I
Speaker 4: was a rapper. I didn't I could sing. I knew
Speaker 4: I could sing, but I wasn't a singer, and I
Speaker 4: didn't want to be a singer. Like I wanted to
Speaker 4: be a rapper and that was my goal, like going
Speaker 4: to school musically, I was like wanted to find a
Speaker 4: producer to make beats. And so the strange thing is
Speaker 4: the way that we grew was really together, like everybody
Speaker 4: kind of learned these new instruments together. And the fact
Speaker 4: is is like, for being an eight year old kid
Speaker 4: who never wanted to sing in a band, I immediate
Speaker 4: because I didn't think it was cool.
Speaker 3: Really, what didn't you think was cool about it?
Speaker 1: Well, to me, bands were like they were like.
Speaker 4: Whiny, which is really funny because like future rounds is
Speaker 4: so emotional, but yeah, bands were like whiny and guitary.
Speaker 4: I didn't like guitars. I was like, you know, I
Speaker 4: like beats and like I like descending.
Speaker 1: I live.
Speaker 4: The falling blocks is what I call them, Like these
Speaker 4: kind of descending synth lines and sample based stuff, and
Speaker 4: I just didn't I was never drawn to guitar guitar rock.
Speaker 4: I'm still not, you know, it's just not my not
Speaker 4: my thing. It took me a long time to even
Speaker 4: get into, like I'm a big you know, I'm a
Speaker 4: big jazz head, but it took me a long time
Speaker 4: to even get down with like jazz guitar. I love
Speaker 4: a little django, but I mean like electric jazz guitars.
Speaker 1: Cool. There's some greats.
Speaker 4: Anyways, let's not talk about. But yeah, like it just
Speaker 4: it just didn't appeal to me. But the thing is
Speaker 4: is like when those guys started making music together, it
Speaker 4: pulled something from me that I couldn't explain. And I
Speaker 4: still just like get this feeling. And I don't know
Speaker 4: if it's because of a deeper connection with those guys,
Speaker 4: especially like you know, get me and Garrett were best
Speaker 4: friends through high school and went off to college together.
Speaker 4: I never made music because Garrett played guitar, you know,
Speaker 4: and he was like he was like a metal guitarist,
Speaker 4: you know, he was just like ripping on his Jackson. Yeah,
Speaker 4: you know, and like, yeah, me and Garrett obviously are
Speaker 4: not going to to make music together. So that so
Speaker 4: then for him to kind of come into this conceptual
Speaker 4: project that me and William had together was really cool
Speaker 4: to have my best friend. And then all of a sudden,
Speaker 4: him and William were just like melding and like learning
Speaker 4: and creating really very quickly, like within six or seven months,
Speaker 4: they were creating these really beautiful ideas from this kind
Speaker 4: of from scratch, you know, from where we started, where
Speaker 4: it was a little loose. But anyways, that's just like
Speaker 4: a thing that has continued to pull for me. But
Speaker 4: as Garrett, you know, Garrett being my best friend. When
Speaker 4: we were kids, you know, a lot of our friendship
Speaker 4: was based around mutual anger and alienation about you know,
Speaker 4: the world as fourteen year old kids who didn't feel
Speaker 4: like we fit in and felt like the way fourteen
Speaker 4: year old kids are every moodst What were.
Speaker 3: You guys like? Like, what were you like in middle
Speaker 3: school and high school?
Speaker 4: I mean Garrett was a skater. I hung out with
Speaker 4: skaters like when we were like twelve or thirteen. And
Speaker 4: then I shouldn't give away all Garrett's secrets, that's for
Speaker 4: him to give away. But I started smoking cigarettes and
Speaker 4: smoking weed and went away. We were both like played
Speaker 4: sports and stuff. But then we kind of went away
Speaker 4: from that. I got really into a kind of discovered poetry,
Speaker 4: weed and drawing all at the same time, and that
Speaker 4: kind of became my life. And you know, through that
Speaker 4: hip hop and I was very much you know, by
Speaker 4: the time I was like fifteen sixteen, I was like,
Speaker 4: I'm an artist and I'm a rapper and I know
Speaker 4: exactly who I am.
Speaker 1: And yeah, it was just on this.
Speaker 4: Journey with words and and uh, you know, Garrett was
Speaker 4: Garrett was. We were both like really into art. We
Speaker 4: had a short lived graffiti crew that was not very cool.
Speaker 1: It was just the two of us.
Speaker 4: We're like, go behind the k art and we're like
Speaker 4: we were gonna do a bombing run on the cam art.
Speaker 3: Oh yeah. Was there anyone in your family who was artists? Like,
Speaker 3: did you have anyone to look up to?
Speaker 4: Yeah? Well, my have like a small family, me and
Speaker 4: an older brother. I mean my brother was the one
Speaker 4: who turned me onto He turned me onto hip hop.
Speaker 4: I mean he was the one that brought the records home. Yeah,
Speaker 4: and uh, he was all into Pantera and crazy into
Speaker 4: Jane's addiction and Danzig and I love Danzig, but I
Speaker 4: didn't get Jane's addiction at all when.
Speaker 1: I was younger.
Speaker 4: I can really appreciate some of it now, but back then,
Speaker 4: I was just like, was terrified about what was happening
Speaker 4: to my brother. You had like he had like holes
Speaker 4: punched in the wall with like pictures of Perry Farrell
Speaker 4: and then with he had one that it said like
Speaker 4: written in like oil crayon around on the wall, just
Speaker 4: like in this hole lives the Wicked King. And I
Speaker 4: was just like, this is I'm very concerned about my
Speaker 4: big brother.
Speaker 1: My parents were too.
Speaker 4: I mean that actually affected me really deeply because when
Speaker 4: I was ten, I you know, went snooping through my
Speaker 4: brother's room when I when I played hooky from school
Speaker 4: to like see what kind of trouble he had that
Speaker 4: I could get into. Ye, and I found Jane's addiction.
Speaker 4: This movie called The Gift that he did. It's like
Speaker 4: heroin overdoses and necrophilia. Yeah, oh right, and he had
Speaker 4: so it was that and he also had gg Allen hated.
Speaker 4: So I was like ten eleven years old watching a
Speaker 4: grown man throw feces around naked and I was like,
Speaker 4: I was just like, I think when I get into music,
Speaker 4: were you.
Speaker 3: Close with your parents at that time? Like what was
Speaker 3: your relationship with They were.
Speaker 4: Always like kind of supported music and art and and
Speaker 4: it was years later until I found out that my
Speaker 4: dad was a painter when he was a kid.
Speaker 1: Oh wow, my dad built a lot of furniture.
Speaker 3: Wow, that's cool.
Speaker 4: And uh and my mom, but my mom played piano
Speaker 4: and loved to play and sang. So there was always
Speaker 4: like stacks of sheet music in the house and that
Speaker 4: was kind of something that me and my brother and
Speaker 4: my mom shared, Like still to this day when it's
Speaker 4: around Christmas time, my mom and brother will sit up
Speaker 4: at the piano and play Christmas songs. But then that
Speaker 4: but also the other thing that happens is then they
Speaker 4: they do all of Jesus Christ Superstar.
Speaker 1: And you know, if you've seen me perform, you think
Speaker 1: that I'm I'm a big showman.
Speaker 4: That you should see my brother do Jesus Christ Superstar
Speaker 4: the living room. Yeah, I mean it came from somewhere. Yeah,
Speaker 4: you know, my brother was really the first front person
Speaker 4: I ever saw in person, you know, he was, and
Speaker 4: that was a big thing too, Like he was the
Speaker 4: one who was in bands. So when I when I
Speaker 4: discovered rap that that was kind of like, oh, that's
Speaker 4: what I'm going to do because Joel does. Joel's in bands,
Speaker 4: so I'll do this thing, you know. It would be
Speaker 4: kind of like it was still like out of some
Speaker 4: want to impress him, but at.
Speaker 3: The same time it was differentiating your path.
Speaker 4: Yeah, having my own thing and feeling more like mine.
Speaker 4: And also that was probably had something to do with
Speaker 4: like I always you know, that partnership with Garrett and
Speaker 4: William and now with Mike or is so important to me.
Speaker 1: But I've always been from.
Speaker 4: A young age very alone, you know, in in how
Speaker 4: I want to move or at least how I feel
Speaker 4: comfortable in the world.
Speaker 1: Is it's that lone wolf syndrome, you know.
Speaker 4: I think it's actually a symptom more of feeling, you know,
Speaker 4: that alienation and isolation at a young age and not
Speaker 4: feeling like I fit in. So then I accepted being
Speaker 4: different to be like, oh no, I choose this.
Speaker 2: Yeah, wee last quick break and then the rest of
Speaker 2: Leah's conversation with Samuel t Hearing and now the rest
Speaker 2: of Samuel t Hearing.
Speaker 3: I noticed on this new album, there's a lot of imagery.
Speaker 3: You mentioned night a lot, and was there something specific
Speaker 3: that happened at night or is that just a time
Speaker 3: of day that you feel particularly reflective.
Speaker 1: That's really funny. I didn't realize how much I talked
Speaker 1: about night. Yes, it is.
Speaker 4: I think the night carries And this once again goes
Speaker 4: to I really believe in using these very simple ideas
Speaker 4: to tell the stories, to try to reach as many
Speaker 4: people as possible. And in the way that the day
Speaker 4: has certain connotations or but different times of day have
Speaker 4: have different meaning. You know, the sunrise means something different
Speaker 4: than the sunset, and in the same way the first
Speaker 4: fall of night, you know, deep in the middle of
Speaker 4: the night, or or the end of night hoping for
Speaker 4: the morning, and in these kinds of things like I
Speaker 4: think for me, I spent a lot of time in
Speaker 4: this album. It felt like it was all through the
Speaker 4: pandemic and then after the pandemic, but the pandemic was
Speaker 4: like had created an environment where the sun didn't come
Speaker 4: out again for a bit because of the the split,
Speaker 4: and then my life feeling like I didn't know what
Speaker 4: was up or down or what was night and day
Speaker 4: and the night like scared me, you know, like the
Speaker 4: night was when, yeah, being alone and being afraid of
Speaker 4: those things that I'd said, like being afraid of the
Speaker 4: ghosts of my past.
Speaker 1: To come back.
Speaker 4: And you know, I was like probably going to bed
Speaker 4: at like eight thirty nine every night after that because
Speaker 4: I wanted I didn't want. I didn't just didn't want
Speaker 4: to be tempted by it. I didn't want to be
Speaker 4: alone with my thoughts, which is all I was. You know,
Speaker 4: when I was writing a lot of this album, it
Speaker 4: felt like it wasn't ever going to end. I think
Speaker 4: that's why those moments are important. Like the way the
Speaker 4: Garden Wheel ends the record is to say that, you know,
Speaker 4: the things rise again and and you know the sun,
Speaker 4: the sun is out again.
Speaker 1: We're out of the room.
Speaker 4: But at the same time, like King of Sweden starts
Speaker 4: the record, there's a line in that song that is
Speaker 4: it's an inside story between me and this person. But
Speaker 4: you know, there was a time I was driving on
Speaker 4: the down a back road and in the countryside and
Speaker 4: southern Sweden, and I could see the moon like through
Speaker 4: the clouds, this big bright moon, the perfect circle of it,
Speaker 4: hazy through the clouds, low on the horizon. I was like,
Speaker 4: the moon is beautiful, and she was just like, dude,
Speaker 4: that's the sun.
Speaker 1: The moon. I was like, the moon is shining through
Speaker 1: the clouds in the daytime.
Speaker 3: She's like, you're like a nocturnal creature who should not
Speaker 3: be out during this.
Speaker 4: Yeah, but then we just like laughed. I was like,
Speaker 4: that's hilarious. But yeah, I say in the line, you
Speaker 4: know the moon was low and incensed or was it
Speaker 4: the sun in the horizon that lit the figure in
Speaker 4: the distance. And that's that's how the song start, or
Speaker 4: the album starts with King of Sweden and the sun
Speaker 4: low on the horizon going down into the night, and
Speaker 4: then we rise up again with the last song.
Speaker 3: King of Sweden is such a good song, thank you,
Speaker 3: thank you very much. When you finish that song where
Speaker 3: you're like, oh, this is like a banger, like this
Speaker 3: is a good one.
Speaker 4: Yeah, Yeah, that one felt really good. And a lot
Speaker 4: of those pretty much all the cadences, and I would
Speaker 4: say about fifty percent of the words, if not more,
Speaker 4: were we're actually freestyles or freestyle improvisations. We we wrote
Speaker 4: that on a jam and then I was like, you know,
Speaker 4: press record and I was just like, yeah, getting.
Speaker 1: That flow, and I was like, this feels really good,
Speaker 1: it feels fun.
Speaker 3: It's really really good. And then that I believe it's
Speaker 3: the second song the tower. M do you think about
Speaker 3: like the little like I I like, are those things
Speaker 3: that you add in intentionally for the song to be
Speaker 3: catchy or is that just how the song worked itself out.
Speaker 4: Well, that's just how it got wrote. That's my that's
Speaker 4: my southern coming out. That's how I got wrote. Yeah, no,
Speaker 4: now that wasn't intentional hook put in. I'm glad that
Speaker 4: you think it's hooky.
Speaker 3: Yeah, I mean I think it's the type of song
Speaker 3: where like by the second or third verse, the first
Speaker 3: time hearing it as a listener, you can start participating
Speaker 3: with it and it's you know, you can repeat it
Speaker 3: and it hooks you in really quickly.
Speaker 4: It is funny because I was home at uh I
Speaker 4: was home at Thanksgiving and and I shared the finished
Speaker 4: record with my parents and my mom was doing that
Speaker 4: around the house. I just like here in different rooms.
Speaker 4: I was like, Oh, that's cute, that's real cute. But
Speaker 4: it's actually funny because if you're you know, there's probably
Speaker 4: like five hundred people out there that would know. But
Speaker 4: our first band, art Lord and the Self Portraits.
Speaker 1: Had a song.
Speaker 4: One of the last last songs you wrote was a
Speaker 4: really awesome song called.
Speaker 1: I I I and I would be like I I.
Speaker 3: Is that the band that you like were kind of
Speaker 3: like a character?
Speaker 1: Yeah?
Speaker 4: Yeah, that was me And that was me and William
Speaker 4: and Garrett's first first group before a future.
Speaker 3: So what was the thinking behind the character? Like, what
Speaker 3: was that all about?
Speaker 4: Well, you know, I told you that when I went
Speaker 4: to college, I didn't really want to I didn't want
Speaker 4: to be in a band, like want to be a rapper,
Speaker 4: and and that's kind of how I saw it. And
Speaker 4: then when I met I was also really into conceptual
Speaker 4: and performance art and had discovered that you know, you
Speaker 4: can stand anywhere you want and do a performance. If
Speaker 4: it's a performance to you, then you know, you can
Speaker 4: stand on the sidewalk and do a performance, and you
Speaker 4: can create art in any moment. Like these ideas as
Speaker 4: a very stoned seventeen eighteen year old were a mind
Speaker 4: blowing to me that I could make art that didn't
Speaker 4: have a product. It was creating reactions, you know, creating
Speaker 4: something for people hopefully good, you know, And I think
Speaker 4: that's something that still is a big part of It
Speaker 4: was a big part of when we started Art Lord
Speaker 4: and Self Portraits, and it's still a big part of
Speaker 4: myself today, which is trying to create reactions within an
Speaker 4: audience in a live setting, because I know the value
Speaker 4: of that. Whether negative or positive, the experience or the
Speaker 4: reaction that you get, it is still pulling something from people.
Speaker 4: It's causing them to uh, it's causing them to think
Speaker 4: or feel. That's been the goal of this band for
Speaker 4: a long time, is to create that safe space for
Speaker 4: an audience to be able to feel free and feel
Speaker 4: like they can be vulnerable and not be afraid. Because
Speaker 4: if we're on stage and we're coming from a PowerPoint,
Speaker 4: you know, a place where we have your attention and
Speaker 4: we can and we can share strong emotion and we
Speaker 4: can cry, and we can fight through things and still
Speaker 4: be strong and share in that moment, then we can,
Speaker 4: you know, just just illustrate through living, you know, this emotion.
Speaker 4: So it's a long process. Life is long, Yeah, it's not.
Speaker 4: Life is short. I lived by that idea for so
Speaker 4: many years of my life, just thinking thinking that I
Speaker 4: was going to die, expecting death, wanting death, and really
Speaker 4: coming to terms in the last ten years, like, Nope,
Speaker 4: it's going to keep going and you're going to find
Speaker 4: better ways to get through it and enjoy things and
Speaker 4: enjoy people and to have a good life instead of
Speaker 4: putting yourself into a bad place. Yeah. I mean that's
Speaker 4: been a big change in the last few years. We've
Speaker 4: made the decision to stop touring so much and to
Speaker 4: make more space for our own lives. And part of
Speaker 4: that is just because it just doesn't feel this touring
Speaker 4: feels a lot different between twenty five and forty.
Speaker 3: Yeah, I imagine is that where you get the biggest
Speaker 3: financial gain is through touring. So making that decision, is
Speaker 3: that changing the way that you know you're going to
Speaker 3: do financially in a year?
Speaker 1: Yeah? Part of that is.
Speaker 4: Part of that is an acceptance of for me personally,
Speaker 4: what I need to make a life work. I mean,
Speaker 4: of course, there was a time where we couldn't take
Speaker 4: a day off on a tour because if you take
Speaker 4: a day off, then you lose money, and there isn't
Speaker 4: any money you can't afford to take time off, So
Speaker 4: that that kind of the diy ethos leaked into a
Speaker 4: time when we could have taken a break and Because
Speaker 4: of that, we really hit the wall hard a couple times,
Speaker 4: and the fear of hitting the wall again is is
Speaker 4: the next time you hit the wall the last one,
Speaker 4: you know, because you do run the high risk, not
Speaker 4: even you don't even run the risk of exhaustion. Being
Speaker 4: a Tory musician, you will get exhausted, and some people
Speaker 4: don't recover from that, you know, it mentally scars them
Speaker 4: and affects them ideal.
Speaker 1: I have my own.
Speaker 4: Damage from touring and the things that it's done to
Speaker 4: my personal life, the things that it's done to me physically,
Speaker 4: Like I have a busted knee from playing shows, and
Speaker 4: I now associate like the month before tour is really
Speaker 4: hard for me because I know that I'm about to
Speaker 4: put myself in pain. Yeah, so it's like I'm psychologically scarred.
Speaker 1: You know.
Speaker 4: So this thing that brings me so much joy and
Speaker 4: gives me purpose is also causes me great pain.
Speaker 1: And you know, I'm doing all kinds of things.
Speaker 4: I'm in physical therapy to like try to get to
Speaker 4: a better place with my knee and make it sustainable.
Speaker 4: But that's what the you know, pairing down from playing
Speaker 4: one hundred and fifty shows a year to playing one
Speaker 4: hundred shows and now probably down to like fifty or
Speaker 4: sixty is where we're at now and not pushing past
Speaker 4: that is about making this, making the decision to do
Speaker 4: this for the rest of our lives. Like we could
Speaker 4: either we could eat to do this one hundred and
Speaker 4: fifty shows a year for the next five years until
Speaker 4: we never want to do this again, or we can
Speaker 4: you know, play fifty shows a year for you know,
Speaker 4: years and years and also be more interesting within our
Speaker 4: music because we can actually take the breaks to live
Speaker 4: life so we have something to reflect on and have
Speaker 4: something to speak about and connect with people on. Like
Speaker 4: we have our first, you know baby in the band,
Speaker 4: and like I don't want that child to grow up
Speaker 4: with out their dad around.
Speaker 3: Is that Garrett Garrett has a baby, yeah, and I.
Speaker 4: And that's it's really important to me that everybody is happy.
Speaker 4: I think that think that's where we all got to
Speaker 4: And I know that I don't need you know, this
Speaker 4: potential amount of money to be happy, Like that's going
Speaker 4: to make me less happy. I only need like this
Speaker 4: to survive, you know. Let me just play the shows
Speaker 4: and like get that joy, not hurt myself, not hurt
Speaker 4: my friends and and you know, feed the audience, but
Speaker 4: like also hold something for ourselves and yeah, and enjoy life.
Speaker 3: Yeah. Well, congratulations on the new album and the promo
Speaker 3: and everything that's to come. It sounds like you're in
Speaker 3: a great space.
Speaker 1: Yeah, thank you so much.
Speaker 3: Yeah, thank you for doing this. I really appreciate you.
Speaker 1: Yeah.
Speaker 4: Yeah, no, but I really appreciate you taking the time
Speaker 4: and making space for us on your podcast.
Speaker 2: Thanks to Samuel T. Harring, the feature Islands for chatting
Speaker 2: about the band's latest album, People Who Aren't There Anymore.
Speaker 2: You can hear it along with our other favorite feature
Speaker 2: Islands Songs on a playlist at broken Record podcast dot com.
Speaker 2: Subscribe to our YouTube channel at YouTube dot com slash
Speaker 2: broken Record Podcast, where you can find all of our
Speaker 2: new episodes. You can follow us on Twitter at broken Record.
Speaker 2: Broken Record is produced and edited by Leah Rose, with
Speaker 2: marketing help from Eric Sandler and Jordan McMillan. Our engineer
Speaker 2: is Ben Toliday. Broken Record is a production of Pushkin Industries.
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Speaker 2: Our theme music's by Kenny Beats. I'm justin Richmond.