Speaker 1: Wind Down with Janet Kramer and I heard radio podcast. Okay,
Speaker 1: I'm coming in hot to this podcast, okay, I And
Speaker 1: I don't know if it's because in Eastern I have
Speaker 1: you on too, because I really need like the male's
Speaker 1: perspective even though you are like polar opposite from this person,
Speaker 1: but I still need to have like your you know,
Speaker 1: male nous in this um and I and I get that,
Speaker 1: like I'm about to just sound maybe crazy to some
Speaker 1: Do you have any idea where I'm going, Like no clue,
Speaker 1: I'm trying to follow so bad. I love it, though,
Speaker 1: what is it? Okay? You know, we don't really talk
Speaker 1: about a lot of like pop culture stuff on this podcast,
Speaker 1: like not too much. I mean we talked about you know,
Speaker 1: selling sense and all those things. Blah blah blah. We
Speaker 1: have some housewives on. I have to talk about the
Speaker 1: apology that Tristan gave to Clarie. I'm sorry that was
Speaker 1: not an apology and I'm not, like, can I just
Speaker 1: read it really fast because I like got like actually triggered,
Speaker 1: and I know it's not about me whatever, Like I
Speaker 1: get that I can see where that's triggering. Yeah, So
Speaker 1: I take full responsibility for my actions now that blah
Speaker 1: blah blah blah. I sincerely apologized to everyone I've heard
Speaker 1: or disappointed throughout this ordeal, both publicly, uh and privately. Chloe,
Speaker 1: this is this is where my my my boil goes
Speaker 1: because I'm like, again, I have lived through I haven't
Speaker 1: not to my knowledge, he hasn't. I don't have any
Speaker 1: little babies. So he has little babies out there. I
Speaker 1: don't know, like there's there is always that possibility. Um,
Speaker 1: but Chloe, you don't deserve this, That's right. You don't
Speaker 1: deserve the heartache and humiliation I have caused you. You
Speaker 1: don't deserve the way that I've treated you over the years.
Speaker 1: My actions certainly have not lined up with the way
Speaker 1: I view you. I have the This is the part
Speaker 1: that literally boils my skin ready for it. I have
Speaker 1: the utmost respect and love for you. Mm hmm. Clearly
Speaker 1: not were This is another thing that this is the
Speaker 1: next line is so gaslighting to me, and I don't
Speaker 1: know if it's just me regardless of what you may
Speaker 1: think mm hmm. Again, I am so incredibly sorry. I
Speaker 1: was like, no, that's not an apology, and this is
Speaker 1: what my issue is. And maybe I'm maybe I'm close
Speaker 1: to this because I feel like I haven't gotten the
Speaker 1: apology that I feel like I deserved from my last situation.
Speaker 1: But like, first of all, don't say in there I
Speaker 1: have the utmost respect for you, regardless of what you
Speaker 1: may think. Well, of course he doesn't ever what you don't.
Speaker 1: You don't cheat on someone over and over and over
Speaker 1: and over again and say that I respect you like
Speaker 1: you have an issue. You should have said I have
Speaker 1: been I have been so disrespectful and I haven't respected you.
Speaker 1: That's owning something. That's apologizing, that's saying. And you can say, fine, yes, okay,
Speaker 1: you love her. You You can say I love you,
Speaker 1: but I don't know how to love because that's not loving.
Speaker 1: So if someone says I have respect for you, I
Speaker 1: respect you both, sorry, I'm getting heated because this is
Speaker 1: like same like the ship with Mike. But like, how
Speaker 1: can men like that that say that say they have
Speaker 1: respect for you and then go regardless what you may think,
Speaker 1: Because then then that makes us feel crazy. That goes
Speaker 1: to us to going, oh, well, maybe they do respect
Speaker 1: us because they're saying like the amount of times that
Speaker 1: he would say regardless of what you think, Like I
Speaker 1: won't do it again. And I love you and I
Speaker 1: respect you, and that's not respect and it's not regardless
Speaker 1: of what you may think, Like, that's so gas lighting.
Speaker 1: Am I alone in this? No? No, no, you're not
Speaker 1: not at all. It's a lot, it's a lot. This
Speaker 1: is something dudes do, though, which is terribly upsetting because
Speaker 1: I think when when when guys do something terrible, they
Speaker 1: go into like this dumb panic mode part of their brain. Like,
Speaker 1: these are things I can say that I know they're
Speaker 1: not true, but there's things I can say because they
Speaker 1: make me appear to be something that I am not,
Speaker 1: and then it can get me past this till and
Speaker 1: then I can I can just move on with my life.
Speaker 1: And uh it's always like uh you know, um, I
Speaker 1: I can change. You know, this isn't who I really am.
Speaker 1: Uh yeah, regardless of what you think, I have the
Speaker 1: almost love and respect for you know, regardless of what
Speaker 1: you think, I'm not going to do it again, and
Speaker 1: regardless of what you think. I'm healthy now, regardless of
Speaker 1: what you think, and you know what that does. It's
Speaker 1: just gas lighting and making this woman feel crazy. And
Speaker 1: that's why we take back cheaters every single time. But
Speaker 1: Is that a man thing or is that just like
Speaker 1: an unhealthy a addict behavior. I mean, but both our
Speaker 1: genders are prone to between this, but it's it's heavy
Speaker 1: handed on the man. In my personal opinion, I think
Speaker 1: men do that a lot more than than women do.
Speaker 1: I will say when I like messed up, I never
Speaker 1: said like, well and again I'm not in my last marriage,
Speaker 1: but like and when I was like dating relationships, I'd
Speaker 1: be like, I would never say regardless of what you
Speaker 1: may think, because that's just like I don't have to
Speaker 1: say that. I'd just be like, I'm not going to
Speaker 1: do that or I'm not gonna this is what I did.
Speaker 1: You know, it's like a regardless you may think it's
Speaker 1: so narcissistically gas lighting, that was just throwing something in
Speaker 1: there to make them. Yeah, I don't know. I respect
Speaker 1: you regardless of what don't like. Literally, this is what
Speaker 1: you should have said, Chloe, I messed up. I did
Speaker 1: not respect you. You know, I mess up over and
Speaker 1: over again. I didn't respect you. I have even I
Speaker 1: wanted I love like I tried to love you, but
Speaker 1: I don't know how to love because I don't know
Speaker 1: respect for myself. You know, I don't respect for so
Speaker 1: don't say you respect someone and then do that well,
Speaker 1: And I just think that they probably don't have the
Speaker 1: ability to be that vulnerable and to do that. No,
Speaker 1: they don't have empathy. That's the issue. That's the piece
Speaker 1: that there's actually my ex never got. That's a piece
Speaker 1: that I don't think Tristan get. Then why girls they
Speaker 1: don't feel truly bad. They don't take full ownership. And
Speaker 1: that's my issue with those kind of apologies. And they
Speaker 1: can make up in their head why they did something.
Speaker 1: They can literally make up a reason. Well, I did
Speaker 1: too hard. I was dating Chloe or you know, we
Speaker 1: wrote a book and it was like so much pressure.
Speaker 1: I don't care that you haven't you made choices? Yeah, yeah, yeah,
Speaker 1: I was heated when I read Surprise Now Yeah, because
Speaker 1: when I saw it, I was like Jan was going
Speaker 1: to have a thought about for sure. It's just I
Speaker 1: just don't understand how someone can say I respect you
Speaker 1: and then still like regardless of like, I just can't
Speaker 1: well and then she deserves a reapology, don't Yeah, like
Speaker 1: why didn't you clear that with someone? You know what
Speaker 1: I mean? Did some woman tell him? Yeah? That's not
Speaker 1: like actually because he might here's here's the thing, and
Speaker 1: this is Devil's advocate. He might be like, okay, and
Speaker 1: this is the same thing with Mike or any X
Speaker 1: or whatever uh they might That is how that's that
Speaker 1: that they think they're respecting like to their best ability
Speaker 1: of what respecting is. But that is not true respect
Speaker 1: at all. So I don't know. I just in like
Speaker 1: any woman out there, don't first of all, don't listen
Speaker 1: to regardless of what you think, because regardless of what
Speaker 1: you think they're doing it, they're still doing it. They're
Speaker 1: gonna do it regardless of what you think. I personally
Speaker 1: think that's like the I mean the amount of times
Speaker 1: that I heard that in my last relationship, Like it's
Speaker 1: like you're trying to convince the other person. I don't
Speaker 1: even I don't even understand why. I'm never going to
Speaker 1: do it again, regardless what you think. I'm never I'm
Speaker 1: a changed person, regardless of what you think. I don't
Speaker 1: lie anymore, regardless of what you think. I'm sober, regardless
Speaker 1: of what you think. Because you're telling the other person
Speaker 1: that that their thoughts don't matter, and and that in
Speaker 1: itself means you don't respect them. You know, like, oh,
Speaker 1: what you're thinking isn't the truth, And that's not that's
Speaker 1: it's not important to me the person that is like
Speaker 1: on my hands and knees telling you how much I
Speaker 1: love you. Also, your thoughts don't matter because they're wrong.
Speaker 1: And yeah, and I remember taking that one piece too
Speaker 1: to therapy, like how can you say you respect someone
Speaker 1: and do be? Yeah? How I don't say And that's
Speaker 1: what got me the most. More regardless we're saying I
Speaker 1: respect you, I'm like, no, no, no, you don't get
Speaker 1: to say that. You do not get to say I
Speaker 1: respect you, because out of all the things you might,
Speaker 1: you might actually love that person might actually whatever you
Speaker 1: do not respect to them, or you wouldn't do it.
Speaker 1: I don't think all yeah exactly, like don't say you
Speaker 1: respect me? Like I have disrespected you and I'm so
Speaker 1: sorry for this. I would have I would have accepted that,
Speaker 1: as Chloe. I would have accepted that if Mike said
Speaker 1: that to me, you know, I have disrespected you? Not
Speaker 1: well I did these things because but then would you
Speaker 1: just go back to him because he said the right thing?
Speaker 1: I mean, they're always going to say the right thing.
Speaker 1: That's the that's the problem. But then that's you have
Speaker 1: to look at the pattern. It's like if I were
Speaker 1: to look back at all the things that like Tristan,
Speaker 1: like Mike person said, they're gonna if they do it again,
Speaker 1: it's a pattern. Yeah, I hope she doesn't. Oh, I pray,
Speaker 1: And I was like rooting for them, like to make
Speaker 1: it work because I'm always the person like even to
Speaker 1: this day, everyone's like, do you believe in the good fight?
Speaker 1: Do you believe? I one percent believe that people can
Speaker 1: change and that you can grow. But I mean even
Speaker 1: like you know Lisa Um you know turkish i was
Speaker 1: pronounced her last name butcher. But I love her and
Speaker 1: she's like, you know, people if the patterns they continue,
Speaker 1: and it's like at some point you just have to
Speaker 1: realize it as a pattern and not it's not changing.
Speaker 1: So but I do believe in if someone makes a mistake,
Speaker 1: they ability to change and to not cheat again. I
Speaker 1: do believe that, But I also think there's if there's
Speaker 1: a pattern and it's not changing, like don't stay in
Speaker 1: it because you're gonna be you know you just yeah,
Speaker 1: I mean, honestly, Catherine, if I would have stayed in
Speaker 1: my marriage, it would have happened again, and and how
Speaker 1: who knows when I would have left, would start over
Speaker 1: at fifty sixty. Yeah, yeah, but anyways, I'm sorry. I
Speaker 1: just had to get on my little soapbox because it
Speaker 1: really triggered me the other day when I read it,
Speaker 1: and I can only imagine how freaking Chloe felt. And
Speaker 1: I just like, I don't know, we don't know the
Speaker 1: ins and outs. But regardless of who they are, what
Speaker 1: they are, how they are, that is not an apology,
Speaker 1: and someone who's been in the same shoes deserves a
Speaker 1: better apology. Don't do don't do it to the people,
Speaker 1: do it to her. Yeah, that's the other thing. Anyone
Speaker 1: listening with apology, Come on, I can't with that. Just yeah,
Speaker 1: and anyone else listening, don't say hardless what you think. Yeah,
Speaker 1: just do it. Yeah, just do it. Show people the action.
Speaker 1: Actually yeah, it really is. Yeah, it's all complicating. Yeah,
Speaker 1: actually easiest thing just yeah, just like own what you
Speaker 1: did and uh and talking about how you're going to
Speaker 1: move on. Yeah. I mean, Catherine, you've got some stuff
Speaker 1: you want to talk about too, but we have um
Speaker 1: so can we say that to the end of the show.
Speaker 1: I know you and the wind down. Listeners have some
Speaker 1: burning questions burning um, but we have got Have you
Speaker 1: ever watched catfish? Yes? A few times. Have you ever
Speaker 1: been catfished? Now you haven't, have you? Well they define catfished.
Speaker 1: Well that's what I kind of want to know. I
Speaker 1: want to ask. Okay, I really kind of need the
Speaker 1: definition of catfished. All right, Well, we have a host
Speaker 1: of catfish on the show, Niv Shulman, so I'm excited
Speaker 1: to get him on. Let's take a break and then
Speaker 1: we will talk all about catfish. What's up? Nive? Hey you,
Speaker 1: how are you? I'm really glad you didn't. You probably
Speaker 1: heard that. I'm really glad you didn't. Catfish mean today
Speaker 1: many times to get that one. Oh my mom just
Speaker 1: coming out and saying they're coming. I am a black
Speaker 1: belt in bad jokes. The more than okay good um okay.
Speaker 1: I as a former Dancing with the Stars alumni as well,
Speaker 1: I was really rooting for you on that show. You
Speaker 1: were so fairly good, not hard enough. Maybe you had,
Speaker 1: you know, got a few more people to vote. I know,
Speaker 1: I'm sorry I could I would have had it. But
Speaker 1: do you have fun? Those that experience is the only
Speaker 1: thing that's ever happened. That really made me regret my
Speaker 1: life choices. I should have just been a professional dance
Speaker 1: I should have just pursued dance and been a dancer.
Speaker 1: But alas, I'm happy with what I'm where I'm at,
Speaker 1: So it's fine. No, you were even you were really
Speaker 1: good and you were fun to follow along. So that
Speaker 1: was if anyone wants to go watch your experience semi finals.
Speaker 1: But you know, I had a few breakdowns along the
Speaker 1: way because it's like, you know, I'm not a dancer.
Speaker 1: It was it was in the bottom or yeah, me
Speaker 1: and Gleb we're in the bottom like all the time, glove.
Speaker 1: At the time, I was I was separated. Interesting question, Yeah, yeah,
Speaker 1: I was separated. Um, but yeah, no, it was to
Speaker 1: talk about that another time. But it was it was
Speaker 1: a fun it was it was. It was. It was
Speaker 1: crazy because I feel like it's just mentally just messes
Speaker 1: you up, you know, because you're like you're you and
Speaker 1: you are successful and then you go on a show
Speaker 1: and you're like, I suck and it makes you feel
Speaker 1: like you're just I don't know. For me, it was
Speaker 1: a it was a kind of it was fun. I
Speaker 1: would actually love to go back and then have more
Speaker 1: fun with it, yeah, and not be like miserable with
Speaker 1: my marriage. How your oh I got divorced. Yeah, so
Speaker 1: speaking of catfish, um oh man, we can laugh about
Speaker 1: it now, I know, but I will tell you like
Speaker 1: it's been you know now in like the dating world
Speaker 1: and like the terrified of being like catfished, right because
Speaker 1: like a lot of times you meet people online or
Speaker 1: you know, dating apps, or remember one time and when gosh,
Speaker 1: before I met my ex husband, I went on a
Speaker 1: I think it was I don't even know. I think
Speaker 1: it was okay Cupid, and I met with this guy,
Speaker 1: but he was like not what he had the height
Speaker 1: he was at like he said he was like six
Speaker 1: foot and I show up and he's like five foot.
Speaker 1: I'm like, is that catfished or no? Yeah, well actually
Speaker 1: that's funny. I just I was just talking to someone
Speaker 1: I can't remember the who, but who is in a
Speaker 1: relationship now with a girl. But when they when when
Speaker 1: they met, he was shocked because you know, the pictures
Speaker 1: that she had posted we're either from a long enough
Speaker 1: ago and or had been edited and altered to make her,
Speaker 1: you know, look a lot thinner than she is. And
Speaker 1: if she had posted photos of herself the way she
Speaker 1: really looked, they probably would not have gone out with them,
Speaker 1: but they did and they amazingly it didn't matter and
Speaker 1: they actually ended up in a relationship. But yeah, it's happening.
Speaker 1: A lot of the people are obviously doing whatever they
Speaker 1: can to make themselves as as appealing as possible. And
Speaker 1: I think the word is is technically kitten fishing. Um
Speaker 1: where you're you, but you're sort of bending and blurring
Speaker 1: the lines women want to be. Yeah, like there's that
Speaker 1: there's a little younger or yeah, I mean there's that
Speaker 1: face app I mean there's there's one even filter on
Speaker 1: Instagram that I tried using one time because I was like, oh,
Speaker 1: my friend Caitlin looks so pretty, and I tried it
Speaker 1: and I was like, oh my god, I look nothing
Speaker 1: like myself. So I was like, no, Caitlyn Crosby, because
Speaker 1: we don't, you know, we can't talk. We know, we
Speaker 1: don't talk about Caitlin Bristow. We're good, I know, I
Speaker 1: know I really like her. Anyway, cat fishing for sure,
Speaker 1: still still happening more and more. Um Yeah, but like,
Speaker 1: I mean, your show has been on for ten years,
Speaker 1: so obviously it's still happening. We're going to have our
Speaker 1: tend anniversary soon. We're about to Yeah, we're about to
Speaker 1: actually have our tenure anniversary. And I'm actually at the
Speaker 1: Catfish office in l A right now about to go
Speaker 1: film another episode. I mean, we're just they just keep
Speaker 1: coming in, the emails, the applications, there's no doesn't seem
Speaker 1: to be any end. So it used to be you've
Speaker 1: got catfished, like how did you get catfish? Ten years ago?
Speaker 1: And there wasn't really the dating app were there's dating
Speaker 1: apps ten years ago? There was just like that was
Speaker 1: sort of early on, but not really no. I mean
Speaker 1: I think it it tended to be primarily just sort
Speaker 1: of through social media. Um, that was sort of where
Speaker 1: the show started, which was, you know, I'm on Facebook,
Speaker 1: I got this friend request this guy or girl seems
Speaker 1: really sweet and cute, but they live far away, and
Speaker 1: now we're talking and you know, or we met on
Speaker 1: an a l chat room or on my Space, you
Speaker 1: know like chat right. Yeah, um, I we even did
Speaker 1: an episode once where people met on like a chat line.
Speaker 1: I don't know if you remember that. You know, you
Speaker 1: call in a phone number and you listen to people's
Speaker 1: recordings where they're like, hey, I'm Jeff and I'm twenty five,
Speaker 1: and then you're like, yeah, that sounds good. Then it
Speaker 1: connects you with them. But I never used one, but
Speaker 1: it's a thing, um anyway. So so there've been you know,
Speaker 1: different forms over the years, obviously before the Internet, but
Speaker 1: we're getting catfish, you know, through like letters, right, people
Speaker 1: had pen pals, and it's throughout the ages. There have
Speaker 1: been different ways. Um, but yeah, I mean now it's
Speaker 1: just so easy. What's been like the saddest thing for
Speaker 1: you over the years, Like, was there a story that
Speaker 1: you actually felt like really bad for someone? But yeah,
Speaker 1: for sure there have been. Um it's hard to separate
Speaker 1: them in my brain when I kind of just try
Speaker 1: to like go through the catalog of because I think
Speaker 1: we've done almost two hundred episodes now and and sort
Speaker 1: of pick pick one out. I mean, there have definitely
Speaker 1: been people who I think we're more devastated or heartbroken
Speaker 1: than others, um at sort of discovering the truth of
Speaker 1: this relationship, whether it was because it was a longer
Speaker 1: relationship or just because they had really thought this person
Speaker 1: cared about them. Oh you know what it was there
Speaker 1: was one that just came to mind. That was this girl,
Speaker 1: um and I can't remember the names, but she was
Speaker 1: she was a young black girl, and we took her
Speaker 1: to meet this other black girl. It was the first
Speaker 1: time she'd ever like dabbled in a same sex relationship,
Speaker 1: which was a big deal for her, and she was
Speaker 1: really nervous about it. Um And I don't know if
Speaker 1: she had come out fully to her sort of family
Speaker 1: and friends. Um. And we took her to meet this
Speaker 1: girl in San Francisco, and it turned out the girl
Speaker 1: wasn't lying about who she was. She she was just
Speaker 1: scamming her. She was just like using her for money. Mum.
Speaker 1: And obviously the other girl was just so devastated. She
Speaker 1: felt like she finally put herself out there and and
Speaker 1: met a woman and had felt something, and it turned
Speaker 1: out it was just kind of all fraud. It's a bumber,
Speaker 1: especially like when you're trying to like something that's you know, new,
Speaker 1: and what's tips tips not to get catfished? Um, it's
Speaker 1: getting getting cat fished, you know, just like you know
Speaker 1: nowadays right with like COVID Right, I'm not I don't
Speaker 1: want to try to say that they're similar, but like
Speaker 1: you can take precautions, right, you can wear a mask,
Speaker 1: and you can social distance, you can do all these
Speaker 1: things that were all that are all like good and
Speaker 1: good precautions to take. But you're there's always gonna be
Speaker 1: a vulnerable spot, right, There's always gonna be some way
Speaker 1: in that you can't predict or that you're not looking
Speaker 1: out for or you let your guard down for a second.
Speaker 1: Um And and I think it's the same with like love, right,
Speaker 1: I mean, no matter how closed up someone as or
Speaker 1: how many times they've been burned, or if they have
Speaker 1: trust issues, like if the right person with the right
Speaker 1: message at the right time catches you kind of off guard.
Speaker 1: I think people are so desperate for affection and attention
Speaker 1: that there quick to forget that Oh my god, wait
Speaker 1: a second, this person. I don't know this person. We
Speaker 1: don't have neutual friends. You know, their their profile is weird,
Speaker 1: but like, but god, they're so sweet and oh they
Speaker 1: make me feel so good, so like, let me just
Speaker 1: talk to them. And then before you know it, that
Speaker 1: sort of turns into a flirt flirting and then uh,
Speaker 1: you know, a daily the conversation and feelings like it's hard,
Speaker 1: it's hard and so the trick, I guess is if
Speaker 1: you can give yourself like a very strict rule that
Speaker 1: if you're talking to someone that you don't know in person,
Speaker 1: they have to video chat with you. Um, you know,
Speaker 1: they have to have a certain sort of level of
Speaker 1: presence online, whether it's photos with friends and tagged accounts
Speaker 1: and like people that you interact like. I'd always think
Speaker 1: it's weird when I talked to people on the show
Speaker 1: and I'm like, you've been talking to them for a
Speaker 1: few years, like, who are their friends or or are
Speaker 1: you friends with any of their friends? On Instagram? Who
Speaker 1: do you fall? Like? Surely people post pictures of their
Speaker 1: life and there like if they don't have anybody else
Speaker 1: in their life that's visible that you can sort of
Speaker 1: contact or connect with or follow, like, that's weird. So
Speaker 1: I don't know, there's lots of ways to sort of
Speaker 1: look out for it. But again, it's amazing what the
Speaker 1: sort of brain and heart are able to do to
Speaker 1: convince people when they're something that they want, you know,
Speaker 1: especially if you're wanting that companionship. But to sort of
Speaker 1: tie it in to what you said before, what the
Speaker 1: story I've said before about the girls who kind of
Speaker 1: got scammed. Um. Similarly on like in ways to not
Speaker 1: get catfished, you should also like there's a lot of
Speaker 1: romance scams are happening right now. Like I think people
Speaker 1: forget that just because you're on a dating app means that,
Speaker 1: like someone can't be on there just looking to scam you,
Speaker 1: whether they're lying like not, not to cattish you for love,
Speaker 1: like just to scam you. Um, which is which is which?
Speaker 1: Sort of partly why I did this this whole thing
Speaker 1: with Zel because use Dell. No what is that? Really?
Speaker 1: Don't know what Zell is? No, you do? What is it?
Speaker 1: Heard of it? So I've never heard of it? Oh wow, Okay,
Speaker 1: so I'm looking. Yeah, it's it's a like peer to
Speaker 1: peer payment platform. Um, it's similar. Um the differences at
Speaker 1: Zell is like built into your banking app. Right, so
Speaker 1: if you have is a fast, safe and easy way
Speaker 1: to send and receive money with friends failing others you trust,
Speaker 1: right exactly. And what's cool about Zel is that it's
Speaker 1: it's way more like sort of verified um. And they're
Speaker 1: making a big effort and I'm thrilled to be a
Speaker 1: part of it to like help people avoid sending money
Speaker 1: to the wrong people and getting scammed. Um. And so
Speaker 1: I'm realizing more and more that, like, especially with the pandemic,
Speaker 1: a lot of people are out of work and they're
Speaker 1: turning to sort of online scam activities to support themselves.
Speaker 1: We even did an episode where the person was like, yeah,
Speaker 1: I'm just since the pandemic, I lost my job and
Speaker 1: now I just go online and the catfish guys and
Speaker 1: they send me money. Um, oh my god. Anyway, yeah,
Speaker 1: so you gotta you gotta be really carefully, gotta you
Speaker 1: gotta be smart with your heart and your cash. Yeah,
Speaker 1: don't do that. Don't give cash. No. And it's so
Speaker 1: crazy too because I'll get people being like, oh, you know,
Speaker 1: we've been talking for you know, months, and I'm like,
Speaker 1: that is not my account, like you know, it's like
Speaker 1: and then it's like, are you at this person says
Speaker 1: you're asking for money, and I'm like, anybody with the
Speaker 1: blue check mark is not going to ask for money,
Speaker 1: Like you're just not, like right, I'd hope not Jesus.
Speaker 1: I don't know. I don't know. It's just it's just
Speaker 1: it's great, Like it's just like, yeah, I love it.
Speaker 1: Do the And I always say like within the first week.
Speaker 1: I'm like, I'm face timing with you. I don't care, like,
Speaker 1: because you never know, even if you do have a
Speaker 1: blue checkmark, you could be scammed. Someone could be like,
Speaker 1: um easily, you know, um, maybe their got hacked. I'm like,
Speaker 1: why why is a rod wanted to DM me? I'm kidding,
Speaker 1: but like, you know, so we also we did an
Speaker 1: episode with a guy who was verified and he had
Speaker 1: like he had his nephew kind of running his like
Speaker 1: social media, so he like his nephew was using his
Speaker 1: d MS to like talk to girls, and they thought
Speaker 1: it was you know, like to get to get like
Speaker 1: sexy pictures, you know, like you know, we're just happen.
Speaker 1: It's great. How long have you married for? I will
Speaker 1: have been married we got married and seventeen. I'm glad
Speaker 1: I asked you, so it will be I guess it
Speaker 1: will be five years in June. What's been what's been
Speaker 1: the hardest part of marriage? Doing your wedding day has
Speaker 1: been the hardest part? Um the hardest part about being married?
Speaker 1: Mhm you well, yeah, I mean I think that's in
Speaker 1: a good way though, because like you know, it hasn't
Speaker 1: been that hard. That's good, you know. I mean I
Speaker 1: think the hard right now that the occupied the space
Speaker 1: that gets occupied for me about that's like difficult. It's
Speaker 1: just dark kids, right like pick three having three kids.
Speaker 1: It's just that's hard. Um, it's great, but it's also Hardum,
Speaker 1: So I think right now then the answer would probably
Speaker 1: be like finding time for us, you know, like being
Speaker 1: able to like just to be in love. That's hard.
Speaker 1: But when you're married, like it can get hard to
Speaker 1: be to like just remember to be in love. Um. Yeah, okay,
Speaker 1: So in the next few weeks, surprise your wife with
Speaker 1: a date. Yeah. No, I'm I'm actively always looking for
Speaker 1: ways to do stuff. Um, I even you know, like
Speaker 1: it's embarrassing, but um, you know I get like ads
Speaker 1: on TikTok for like cute like romantic gifts a lot
Speaker 1: just great, you know, like like you know, oh my god,
Speaker 1: if my boyfriend got me this, it would be so sweet. Um.
Speaker 1: And so I even got her. And this is actually
Speaker 1: funny because I kind of sometimes confuse our wedding anniversary
Speaker 1: is it the June twenty So I actually got a
Speaker 1: key chain, like a really cute heart shaped key chaining
Speaker 1: with like the month of I guess it doesn't let me,
Speaker 1: let me, let me google when you got married. And
Speaker 1: but it's got like a circle around the day we
Speaker 1: got married. Get married, so that you got married July.
Speaker 1: That's seventy right, I gotta write on the key chain.
Speaker 1: Please tell me you did, because I would be hilarious. Well,
Speaker 1: I love it. You know what, I think a combination
Speaker 1: of age and now three kids, Like I'm thirty seven. Okay,
Speaker 1: I'm thirty eight. You can't talk about age because that's
Speaker 1: not fair. Now you make me feel really old. Well no,
Speaker 1: I just mean like you start to things. You know,
Speaker 1: I have a lot of dates to keep in my head. Now,
Speaker 1: I got to remember all the kid's birthdays. I gotta remember. Yeah, um,
Speaker 1: well yeah, it's just a lot so security stuff, Like
Speaker 1: there's a lot of things, a lot of numbers up. Yeah. Well,
Speaker 1: you know what, as long as you're happy, it's all
Speaker 1: that matters. And it sounds like you are. And keep
Speaker 1: watching a Catfish on MTV. I'm excited that it's been
Speaker 1: on for so long. Wednesday's eight o'clock, Wednesday's eight talk
Speaker 1: and um, maybe I'll see you on like the All
Speaker 1: Stars Dancing with the Stars, you know, like I thought
Speaker 1: maybe it was gonna happen this year because it was
Speaker 1: like thirtieth anniversary season. But alas here, here, we are here,
Speaker 1: where we are still sitting here, not dancing waiting. All Right,
Speaker 1: you're the best. Don't get catfish out there, and um yeah,
Speaker 1: stop the scammers because that's not cool. You're the best.
Speaker 1: See you Okay. Bye. Oh he's so funny. I love him,
Speaker 1: Thank you bye. He legitimately did not know if it
Speaker 1: was Junior July. He had not a clue. Glad we
Speaker 1: can google it though. So sweet. Um, that was really funny. Um, okay,
Speaker 1: let's take a break and then Catherine, we'll be back
Speaker 1: with some questions. Alright, cat, what's up? Well? First thing,
Speaker 1: I forgot to ask you last week? Oh did you
Speaker 1: cry on New Year's I didn't. I didn't you ear.
Speaker 1: I was just curious. I was gonna ask you. I
Speaker 1: was gonna wait. No, I made my little goal list
Speaker 1: and I it's like I did personal work and relationship
Speaker 1: like you know, friends, whatever what I want for the
Speaker 1: hearts this year? Um, And it was great. And then
Speaker 1: I played ping pong, had some friends over and it
Speaker 1: was it was really really great and I was like
Speaker 1: so happy. I didn't cry. Good. I'm so glad. Yeah,
Speaker 1: it was. It was great. I mean, how many years
Speaker 1: has it been? Years? Years? Years? Hey, there's in your year.
Speaker 1: Oh yeah, I'm like, oh yeah, I actually re listened
Speaker 1: to that episode with um Suarie because it was that
Speaker 1: meditation stuff was good and then just kind of her
Speaker 1: voice is very calming to beause. I loved her. I
Speaker 1: know's so cute. Um. But yeah, no, that was that
Speaker 1: was That was a good way to go into the year.
Speaker 1: But I did have was it the next day? Oh no, no, no, no,
Speaker 1: there wasn't a but but I had like I had
Speaker 1: a freak out because I'm like and I kind of
Speaker 1: posted it. I didn't kind of post I posted it
Speaker 1: on Instagram. It's it's kind of like the unknown year.
Speaker 1: So that kind of freaked me out a little bit
Speaker 1: because I was like, because you know, even though last
Speaker 1: year everything happened whatever, but at least I went into
Speaker 1: the year like as a family and married and like,
Speaker 1: I have no clue what's going to happen this year.
Speaker 1: I have no clue. But it's like kind of great
Speaker 1: and oh in Annie downs um she she because I
Speaker 1: DMed her. I was like, I love you, thanks for
Speaker 1: that talking church. She loved to come on the podcast,
Speaker 1: So we're going to get her on. Yeah, yeah, to
Speaker 1: kind of talk about the Unknown near and all about it.
Speaker 1: But it was just like that. It caused me a
Speaker 1: teeny bit of anxiety. But also I'm kind of like
Speaker 1: looking at it in a way to be like, Okay,
Speaker 1: let's it's exciting. Let's make exciting things happen, and the
Speaker 1: unknown near Steve the Unknown near? Yes, go for it.
Speaker 1: How are how how are how are things? How's your
Speaker 1: love life? Oh? Wow? Okay, Mark, Mark's done here. I
Speaker 1: thought I would just you know, I'm just gonna go
Speaker 1: for it. Didn't even ask me if I could. No,
Speaker 1: you did not. Uh did you see my TikTok asking?
Speaker 1: I feel like if we're posting, I could ask. It
Speaker 1: was cute. It was cute. I'm too old to be
Speaker 1: doing TikTok, but it was fun and I laughed a
Speaker 1: lot and I had a good time. That's all that matters. Yeah,
Speaker 1: there are quite a few questions about the TikTok or no,
Speaker 1: I um, he got it really cost I went to
Speaker 1: so I said, you know, I'm instagramming, I mean instagramming,
Speaker 1: I'm podcasting today. If you guys have any questions. See,
Speaker 1: I'm just asking what the people want to know. And
Speaker 1: the questions were all all that, Yes, new Man, happy
Speaker 1: for you did? Who's the boys her boyfriend? Who's the
Speaker 1: guys in your stories? Hope he's your guy and makes
Speaker 1: you happy? Who's the guy you're hanging with? How did
Speaker 1: you know? They're like? Literally every single one? Who are
Speaker 1: you climbing on? You do look really happy in all
Speaker 1: of them. I appreciate it, all right. I guess that's
Speaker 1: all I'm kidding. Driving people scared? Okay, that's fat. This
Speaker 1: is a scary thing. Dating is scary. Yeah, it's very scary.
Speaker 1: It's a scary world out there. Yeah you know, I know, right,
Speaker 1: and you know it's just it's a's It's just it's
Speaker 1: scary and I'm scared. I'll say that. Taking it a
Speaker 1: day at a time, day at a time, good, Yeah,
Speaker 1: all right, and I'll let you off. I do have
Speaker 1: another question, another one I forgot to ask you. Okay,
Speaker 1: what is the update on your friend? And invited Mike
Speaker 1: to the party. Well, she heard the episode, great unfollowed
Speaker 1: me on Instagram, um, and then posted stuff about like
Speaker 1: real friends, Uh, put truth to you, um, you know,
Speaker 1: speak the truth to you and fake friends just don't
Speaker 1: call you out. And I think that was directed towards me,
Speaker 1: But either way, I'm I kind of sat back with it,
Speaker 1: and again I'm like, Okay, my real friends would never
Speaker 1: have done that. Um, And so I think, I, um, yeah,
Speaker 1: I mean that's kind of what it is. And you know,
Speaker 1: thinking kind of like what Amy said to your therapist
Speaker 1: where she was like, focus on the friendships that really
Speaker 1: matter to you, and that one I just having a
Speaker 1: really hard time with. And I just have no need
Speaker 1: to have that kind of friendship where someone can say
Speaker 1: the negative things about someone support me. It feels very
Speaker 1: like fake supportive and then not say anything to me
Speaker 1: because they were hurt and do something that's a little
Speaker 1: like what was the word use, opportunistic or me? Yeah,
Speaker 1: oh yeah, it felt very um oh I forgot the
Speaker 1: word I used now, but yeah, I mean it was like,
Speaker 1: that's just a friend would never do that. No. Well,
Speaker 1: and you know, we talk a lot in therapy about
Speaker 1: loyalty and loyal friends and even if there was an issue,
Speaker 1: she should have come to you, not just invited him
Speaker 1: and not told you. Yeah, that's not being a loyal
Speaker 1: friend and again like that's fine, Like I have no problem. Again,
Speaker 1: I'm sure we'll be at the same things with but
Speaker 1: I mean that would have been our only friends that
Speaker 1: we would have maybe done something. But I had again
Speaker 1: had no idea since they had said such negative things
Speaker 1: and hadn't spoken to him, So it just felt like, well,
Speaker 1: you hurt me, so I invited him, Like what a
Speaker 1: vindictive Yeah, So that's UM, And I just I don't
Speaker 1: want to go into the year. I kind of send
Speaker 1: my piece, UM, and I want to go into the
Speaker 1: new year with focusing on the friendships that are really
Speaker 1: important to me and cater to those and be a
Speaker 1: good friend to those people, and continue to be a
Speaker 1: good friend to those people. And I don't know what
Speaker 1: about you and your friend. UM, I haven't heard back
Speaker 1: from her, So what are you gonna do? I don't know.
Speaker 1: I'm still struggling with that one. UM. Loyalty is a
Speaker 1: big one for me. I'm just we're talking about that
Speaker 1: a lot in therapy, and we talked more about it
Speaker 1: today your therapy today more lord, UM. But yes, to
Speaker 1: answer that, loyalty is just a very big one to me.
Speaker 1: I think going back to family, I didn't feel like
Speaker 1: my family was loyal and yeah, when when did that
Speaker 1: come up today? No? But I mean like when did
Speaker 1: you realize that literally literally breakthrough a little bit. Yeah, well,
Speaker 1: we've been talking about loyalty with friends, but then it
Speaker 1: just kind of hit me today that I didn't feel
Speaker 1: like people in my life growing up are loyal like
Speaker 1: my mom when I mean for a lot of Yeah,
Speaker 1: So in like, what ways did you not feel like
Speaker 1: loyal from your mom? Well, I didn't feel like she
Speaker 1: had my back. I didn't feel like I could trust her. Um,
Speaker 1: you know, I don't believe the things that come out
Speaker 1: of her mouth still to this day. You know, we
Speaker 1: have a fine relationship now, but there's no there's really
Speaker 1: no trust there. And so when it comes out in
Speaker 1: other people, when it comes out with friends, you know,
Speaker 1: yeah it is And and there's a part of me
Speaker 1: that just wants to email her back and go, Okay,
Speaker 1: forget about it, forget I said anything, It's fine, don't
Speaker 1: worry about it. I'm sorry, And that's always my like
Speaker 1: go to and I still every day sometimes you're you know,
Speaker 1: every whatever, I'm like, maybe I should just do that
Speaker 1: to make everything okay. But I don't want to do
Speaker 1: that this time, you know, I really don't. I just
Speaker 1: want so I don't know. I don't know where that
Speaker 1: will end up. But I never heard back from her
Speaker 1: when we addressed it. So I did the first time,
Speaker 1: but not the second time. So I don't know. If
Speaker 1: it fizzles, it fizzles. You know, it's really interesting that
Speaker 1: you say that piece because a part of me, I
Speaker 1: was even a couple of days ago with the situation
Speaker 1: with that friend of texting and being like, hey, I'm sorry,
Speaker 1: let's sit down and talk, just because I don't want
Speaker 1: And it's not that I don't want negative energy, but
Speaker 1: I just I want her to like me and not
Speaker 1: think that negative energy, yeah, or bad energy about me,
Speaker 1: even though I know that, like I can sit and go.
Speaker 1: I would love to hear how I heard her, even
Speaker 1: it doesn't but yeah, I don't know's yeah, I mean,
Speaker 1: we have mutual friends, and I constantly I'm like, I
Speaker 1: hate that, Like, you know, our mutual friends may think
Speaker 1: badly of me. But I'm like, you know what, I can't.
Speaker 1: I can't at that. You know, there's always two sides
Speaker 1: to every story. I understand that, um, but you know
Speaker 1: it's tough, and I know that I'm gonna lose probably
Speaker 1: some friendships over it. But you know, at the same time,
Speaker 1: I'm not Catherine is not just going to go in
Speaker 1: and say, Okay, I'm sorry, pretend to pretend like I
Speaker 1: never said anything, and just sweep it under the rug.
Speaker 1: I'm not going to do that. So if she wants
Speaker 1: to come to me and say, hey, let's let's really
Speaker 1: talk about this and let me apologize for what I did,
Speaker 1: but here's why I did and here's what you did
Speaker 1: or whatever, I'm fine with that same um. But you know,
Speaker 1: we don't need to go in and just clear the energy.
Speaker 1: To clear the energy, and in my opinion, I mean,
Speaker 1: I think that we can be respectful and we can
Speaker 1: be kind and we can be nice, but that does
Speaker 1: mean we have to cave either. Yeah. I love that. Yeah,
Speaker 1: I like that a lot. Anyway, good is looking good,
Speaker 1: looking great, looking good. We're falling on our butts from
Speaker 1: TikTok's we're learning and therapy ever get it? Like good
Speaker 1: the did you see it? I didn't see the good one? Yeah,
Speaker 1: I didn't post the good ones on Instagram. And then
Speaker 1: we did another one too, and then we might try
Speaker 1: the koala. I saw you post that. I don't know
Speaker 1: what it is. I'm not like a koala. Someone damned
Speaker 1: me and was like, you should try the koala. I
Speaker 1: don't want to watch, so I gotta ask him if, if,
Speaker 1: if we can try that one. But I have a
Speaker 1: feeling I would fall flat on my face. But having
Speaker 1: said that, you're the girl that can't do handstand against
Speaker 1: the Nope, I can't do it. Yeah, okay um, we'll
Speaker 1: be back next week. See them, see