Speaker 1: Hey there, this is Popcorn Book Club. I'm Danis Schwartz.
Speaker 1: Thanks for listening. Last week we started in on Alvis
Speaker 1: Huxley's Brave New World Now a series on NBC's Peacock.
Speaker 1: We discussed a whole bunch of people in it, none
Speaker 1: of whom, as it turns out, are the protagonist. This
Speaker 1: story does not have a protagonist, nobody you want to
Speaker 1: root for. Anyway. If you haven't heard our previous show,
Speaker 1: please go back and start there. This one will make
Speaker 1: a little bit more sense. Today. Jennifer Wright, Karamadaqua, Tan Trent,
Speaker 1: Melissa Hunter and I will get into the thick of
Speaker 1: Huxley's story about sex, drugs, and a complete lack of
Speaker 1: rock and roll. One more tiny good thing that again
Speaker 1: levels don't go this far, but non violent de escalation
Speaker 1: of violence, but every in line. Yeah, I mean, I
Speaker 1: would be much happier if they instead of tear gassing protesters,
Speaker 1: they were blown out weed smoke like that would be
Speaker 1: and they played an audio tape that was just like,
Speaker 1: just be nice to each other, Come on nice cool.
Speaker 1: That's scary. Yeah, it sounds like the music festival they
Speaker 1: used to have at my college. That's not fun. I'll
Speaker 1: just jump us off and then Jennifer, I'm gonna give
Speaker 1: you the climax, but I'll lead us up to there,
Speaker 1: which is uh, John h has you know, had these
Speaker 1: ideals of this brave new world his entire life, hearing
Speaker 1: about it from his mom Linda. But he's conflicted. People
Speaker 1: have no feelings. No one has read Shakespeare here, and
Speaker 1: he's very um confused by this strumpet Lunina because he
Speaker 1: has feelings for her, but she's a strumpet and and
Speaker 1: what is what is going on? So he has these
Speaker 1: this this crisis of faith, and he goes to visit
Speaker 1: his mother at just said dirty word dying in the
Speaker 1: hospital um on Soma on a Soma holiday. Um in
Speaker 1: a hospital where a Booknovski group of like a million
Speaker 1: twins are being death conditioned. Because another pretty good thing
Speaker 1: about the society is people aren't scared of death, which
Speaker 1: genuinely is a is a positive thing that I think
Speaker 1: that humans should be less scared of death of all
Speaker 1: the things that they were conditioning the young children. I
Speaker 1: was like that one fine, because it's also like a
Speaker 1: lot of Latin American cultures have that too, with like
Speaker 1: Dan Dalis Moritos, where it's like death is something to
Speaker 1: celebrate and not to be as afraid of. I think
Speaker 1: that there's a there's a line, and I mean that's
Speaker 1: the whole thing of this book, is that there needs
Speaker 1: to be a line somewhere between the two worlds. But
Speaker 1: I think that like eating a chocolate and Claire of
Speaker 1: being like, is she dead a little much CAUs yes,
Speaker 1: it's a little cavaliering, callous and uncaring and unfeeling because
Speaker 1: they don't have these strong relationships. And so I think
Speaker 1: that being unafraid of death is important, and accepting that
Speaker 1: death is a part of life is important. But also
Speaker 1: seeing that person as a person who people cared about
Speaker 1: is what's missing in this and that's what John gets
Speaker 1: upset about. That's also it it's like people also don't
Speaker 1: see people as individuals. They're like, you're just part of
Speaker 1: the organism, like you're not a person. So to bring
Speaker 1: us into the climax, John witnesses his mother die and
Speaker 1: see sort of the taunting and just like sneers and
Speaker 1: and repulsion of this Bukanovski group twins and John has
Speaker 1: a freak out, a justifiable freak out because his mom
Speaker 1: just died. Uh, and Jennifer, why don't you take it.
Speaker 1: At this climactic moment um, John decides that he's going
Speaker 1: to liberate this world. So he sees saw being handed
Speaker 1: out to a huge group of people. I think they're guilta's.
Speaker 1: They've just been used working for the day, and they're
Speaker 1: getting their ration of selma. They're all lining up and
Speaker 1: John runs back behind the station, screams from Shakespeare at them,
Speaker 1: and throws away all the selma. Understandably, everybody is furious.
Speaker 1: There's a riot. They tried to you understand, they've set
Speaker 1: you free, and no, no, that's not how they felt
Speaker 1: about that. They just did like eight hours of work
Speaker 1: in a factory. They thought we're going to get a drink.
Speaker 1: People are very angry at him. It's gonna jump in
Speaker 1: real quick. At this moment, I thought the plot was
Speaker 1: going to be that he was like that guy from
Speaker 1: the movie Yesterday where he starts like reciting Shakespeare's and
Speaker 1: everyone's like, oh my goodness, Sonnets, he's a god. But
Speaker 1: because it's like lend me your ears, and he's like,
Speaker 1: oh shit, I've never spoken publicly before, so it's very unfortunate.
Speaker 1: But they can't even really rebel because I thought, wow,
Speaker 1: that's some strong emotion, like that's certainly curious anger resulting
Speaker 1: in riot. It's only a very strong emotion because they
Speaker 1: release clouds of so much into the air to calm
Speaker 1: everybody down. And they played this very soothing, automated message
Speaker 1: saying like you should all be good to love each other.
Speaker 1: Wouldn't that be nice? So apparent general orgy, one more
Speaker 1: tiny good thing that again levels don't go this far,
Speaker 1: but non violent shutting down of de escalation of violence
Speaker 1: that they have like a nice little recording. They're like, oh,
Speaker 1: we're gonna play Riot number two, alright, but everyone in
Speaker 1: line like like, yeah, I mean, I would be much
Speaker 1: happier if they instead of tear gassing protesters they were
Speaker 1: blown out weed smoke like that would be And they
Speaker 1: played an audio tape that was just like, just be
Speaker 1: nice to each other, come on, nice cool. That's scary, Yeah,
Speaker 1: it is scary. It sounds like the music festival they
Speaker 1: used to have at my college. It's not fun. Wait,
Speaker 1: wait what spring weekend? They did not play creepy saying
Speaker 1: there was like a bunch of music and weed smoke
Speaker 1: and it was all right. So hem. Holtz and Bernard
Speaker 1: are also present for this. They are worried the savage
Speaker 1: is going to get killed him. Holtz like restless to
Speaker 1: defend him because him Holtz is good at everything and
Speaker 1: that's made him different. Bernard it's like a shitty little
Speaker 1: weasel about this because he's a shitty little person. So
Speaker 1: they all get called in to stand before and also sorry,
Speaker 1: one more interruption when they were like, is this are
Speaker 1: you guys friends with John? They whatever, and Bernard was
Speaker 1: like trying to come up with a way he could
Speaker 1: say no, reading him around. The best part of that
Speaker 1: was when help comes and it says that he starts
Speaker 1: shouting help to give the illusion that he's helping. He's
Speaker 1: the worst. So they're all called in before the World
Speaker 1: Controller and the world and Groler talks about how these
Speaker 1: people can't be in civilife society anymore. The World Controller
Speaker 1: has also read Shakespeare. Uh. He also loved doing true
Speaker 1: science when he was young. He wanted to do real experiments,
Speaker 1: but they weren't conducive to society's happiness. So he had
Speaker 1: a choice when he was young where he could either
Speaker 1: accumulate a huge amount of power or he could be
Speaker 1: exiled to an island, and um, he's like, so all
Speaker 1: of you are going to be exiled to islands. You're
Speaker 1: you're right about that assumption, if that's what you think
Speaker 1: is going on. And Bernard begins sobbing controllably breaks out
Speaker 1: things to be allowed to say, like becomes inconsolable and
Speaker 1: has to be taken and given so many in the
Speaker 1: other room and the world control. He's like, well, that
Speaker 1: hasn't dumb reaction, because if you think about it, you're
Speaker 1: gonna meet the most interesting people you've ever met in
Speaker 1: your life. Uh, it's everybody who was a little bit
Speaker 1: too weird to function here. And also he really nicely
Speaker 1: lets how Lant's choose what island. I love that party.
Speaker 1: He says, you want one with a good climate and
Speaker 1: him holds so snow. I think I'd do better writing
Speaker 1: if I was in a really bad climate. Yeah, he's like,
Speaker 1: the storms will inspire me. I feel like there's you
Speaker 1: don't get a lot of writing done in Hawaii and
Speaker 1: it works for the Russians. Um. Yeah, also goes to
Speaker 1: the Falkland Islands, which is I also really like that.
Speaker 1: It's basically an artists colony. That's the punishment. Yeah, amazing. Also,
Speaker 1: I gotta say I'm really bummed for Helmholds that he
Speaker 1: is banished to an island with his toxic friend that
Speaker 1: he just can't get rid of. Oh I don't think
Speaker 1: they're going to the same island. Yeah. And at the
Speaker 1: end that chapter when he freaks out him home, Helmholds
Speaker 1: is like, I'm gonna go check on my friend, even
Speaker 1: though it's them just being a stem, make sure he's okay.
Speaker 1: It's like, you can do better. As brand is gonna
Speaker 1: be a lot of interesting people. He's gonna be. Yeah,
Speaker 1: he's gonna be He's gonna have a great time at
Speaker 1: the He's going to have a lot of sex. He's
Speaker 1: gonna thrive. One of the things that I did think
Speaker 1: was this is a little separate from the rest of
Speaker 1: the plot. But they talked about how at one point
Speaker 1: Alpha's wanted to have their own island, so they gave
Speaker 1: them an island, and they had an Alpha only island,
Speaker 1: and it went terribly because none of them wanted to
Speaker 1: do menial labor. They were all just constantly jockeying to
Speaker 1: be the most powerful person there. Devolved into like wars
Speaker 1: of revolutions every few years. It fell apart of media, Like, um,
Speaker 1: how would this sign might be different? Like are there
Speaker 1: a lot of poets who wanted to do a lot
Speaker 1: of me? I think I had the idea that maybe
Speaker 1: it's this this society doesn't understand that not all like
Speaker 1: poets and and like what I'm saying is there's a
Speaker 1: flaw with how they're making alpha pluses, you know what
Speaker 1: I mean, Like because not all poets are like straight
Speaker 1: smart or good at engineering, and so like the things
Speaker 1: that they were breeding in their alpha plus is probably
Speaker 1: also weren't the best things for like fun people all ways.
Speaker 1: That was my understanding where I was like, maybe instead
Speaker 1: of just being like the best and smartest people, they're
Speaker 1: specifically breeding alpha plus is to be like engineers for
Speaker 1: their society, and so that makes them all kind of shitty. Yeah,
Speaker 1: it feels like in Cyprus because it was the experiment
Speaker 1: with all the alphice happened in Cyprus. It feels like
Speaker 1: they were like, Okay, we want you to replicate this
Speaker 1: society exactly. And also you're being told, hey, you have
Speaker 1: to do absolon work. So the things that you have
Speaker 1: been conditioned to think are beneath you are the things
Speaker 1: that they now have to do. So they gave them
Speaker 1: all the means of production and they were like, yeah,
Speaker 1: socialism and they were like but no, no, no, we
Speaker 1: are capitalism, and we want capitalism because that is good,
Speaker 1: right you buy new clothes when they get holes in
Speaker 1: them and all that good stuff, and it's like, no,
Speaker 1: I'll figure it out. So I think that's sort of
Speaker 1: the breakdown because they weren't willing to be cooperative because
Speaker 1: they had not been taught that that was the thing
Speaker 1: that you do. Yeah, they've been conditioned totally against that,
Speaker 1: which is why love that. Like John's outburst, not outburst,
Speaker 1: but that he's like going to liberate everyone. Starts off
Speaker 1: with quoting Shakespeare and then he's essentially just like an
Speaker 1: emo boy in high school. That's like, I want to
Speaker 1: be unhappy, so so you want your unhappiness and he's
Speaker 1: like yeah, and they're in pain. He's like, I'll take
Speaker 1: that to all of them, give it all to me.
Speaker 1: I just want to feel okay. So John is not
Speaker 1: allowed to go to the Falklands with his other friends.
Speaker 1: He goes off into the far reachers of the territory
Speaker 1: in takes over an abandoned lighthouse, decides that he'll just
Speaker 1: go on this little Walden adventure and live completely cut
Speaker 1: off from the rest of society. It looks for like
Speaker 1: two days until reporters find them and they're like, it's
Speaker 1: interesting what he's doing. Um John is horrible to them
Speaker 1: and attacks them, and he also starts whipping himself whenever
Speaker 1: he has sexual thoughts about when he so. Um so,
Speaker 1: reporters also see him whipping himself in the wilderness and
Speaker 1: take pictures because that's a crazy story. And then a
Speaker 1: bunch of tourists come out to see him and they
Speaker 1: want to see him whip himself, and eventually maybe Lanina
Speaker 1: is among them. And in any event, there is some
Speaker 1: blue eyed woman who goes up to him. I think
Speaker 1: it is Lenina because she's with Henry Foster. I assumed
Speaker 1: it was belongs to everyone else, So who knows who
Speaker 1: that lady was. I think it's implied to be Yah.
Speaker 1: I think it's implied to be Lenina. But I do
Speaker 1: think it's interesting that he didn't name her and that
Speaker 1: it's like to me, that implies it could have been
Speaker 1: any like it probably is Lanina, but it could have
Speaker 1: been any woman in place of her in that moment. Yeah,
Speaker 1: there is also an interesting part that doesn't have that
Speaker 1: much to do with the blood, but we get this
Speaker 1: neat little dig aggression into a camperman who is filmed,
Speaker 1: very excited about using this as a premise for a feeling,
Speaker 1: and he thinks it's going to be as good as
Speaker 1: like the sex Life of a sperm Whale, which would
Speaker 1: really he's saying something like he really really thinks he's
Speaker 1: gonna he's gonna take the film medium to a new place.
Speaker 1: That made me laugh. And people seem to take a
Speaker 1: lot of satisfaction in their jobs. I will say I
Speaker 1: did find it interesting that that specific photographer slash cameraman,
Speaker 1: he spent like four days in a tree, where I
Speaker 1: was like, isn't that a feeling of like wanting a
Speaker 1: thing and committing and then getting the thing? Like why
Speaker 1: did they let him do that? That seems like way
Speaker 1: too much satisfaction to go to island. He's gonna go
Speaker 1: to an island where he's gonna make his documentary seen
Speaker 1: to me, And also the addition of the reporters felt
Speaker 1: out of place too, because I'm like, why would you
Speaker 1: need someone to be documenting some like all the things
Speaker 1: that you know are supposed to be regimented, like do
Speaker 1: you need competing also seem to want questions. It would
Speaker 1: call their world view into questions when they asked him, okay,
Speaker 1: you know the kind of questions we're gonna ask. It's like,
Speaker 1: what do you think of civilized which is a normal
Speaker 1: question for a tabloid publication. But if somebody says I
Speaker 1: think they're all strumpets women should only sleep with one man,
Speaker 1: that is an incredibly controversial point. Are going to read
Speaker 1: that and be like, wait, ship, wait, just does this
Speaker 1: brave new world have freedom of press? Apparently? Yeah, and
Speaker 1: like a thriving entertainment industry. If that's why it was,
Speaker 1: I was like, wait, where the hell did these reporters
Speaker 1: come from? Yeah? Well, I think that throughout the book
Speaker 1: they do a good job of establishing that there's a
Speaker 1: level of awfulness that they'll allow because everybody's like, oh,
Speaker 1: Marx is so queer, and it's been establish he's kind
Speaker 1: of a weirdo. But there's a point at which he
Speaker 1: becomes too weird. They're like, he's alone a lot. He's
Speaker 1: like starting to ask questions that we don't necessarily think
Speaker 1: are cool, and um, like Helmholtz is also kind of weird,
Speaker 1: which is why they're friends, because they've established that they're
Speaker 1: both alf Us. They're both weird. But I think Helmholtz
Speaker 1: kind of kept it together more until he did that
Speaker 1: thing in his class where he showed them like unapproved rhymes,
Speaker 1: like the teacher that very very long pool, like understandably
Speaker 1: if and the kids are twelve years old, if your
Speaker 1: teacher suddenly just came in four science class. It was like,
Speaker 1: I'm going to I want to tell you all. When
Speaker 1: I was a junior in an ap English class, my
Speaker 1: English teacher, I mean frek, my English teacher brought in
Speaker 1: a poem that he had written and he had us
Speaker 1: read it out loud, like line by line and like
Speaker 1: the poem again, a poem he wrote. And I remember
Speaker 1: specifically there was like a line of like home reading
Speaker 1: these inane essays from students who don't carry Oh, so
Speaker 1: he dragged you and then made you read you're dragging.
Speaker 1: But again that wasn't like the point of the poem.
Speaker 1: It was just like snuck in there, like a little
Speaker 1: line of his own like home life where he's like
Speaker 1: I spend my night reading meaningless essays. Shot him out,
Speaker 1: very funny. I had an acting teacher do that once.
Speaker 1: He had a scene, uh, and it was like at
Speaker 1: a reputable acting school, but he had a scene that
Speaker 1: was from something that he had written that was not
Speaker 1: like it's not like he wrote something that was like
Speaker 1: produced by a major studio. It was like a thing
Speaker 1: that he wrote that he and his friends made some
Speaker 1: like teeny tiny indie film like seventeen years before. And
Speaker 1: he's like, we're doing this in class today, and I
Speaker 1: was like, I don't want to. We are. Acting teacher
Speaker 1: in high school had an unpublished or self published play
Speaker 1: called On Stars Not Falling that was a autobiographical play
Speaker 1: about his coming out, which is, you know, a good
Speaker 1: play but very personal for like a teacher to be like,
Speaker 1: this is about me and my story, and like then
Speaker 1: to have students acted out in front of him like
Speaker 1: we did his play that was autobiographical day. The problem
Speaker 1: is not that any of these people did creative endeavors.
Speaker 1: I think wonderful. I think everybody should do creative things. Happy.
Speaker 1: There's a you tried to turn your classroom for a
Speaker 1: little stadium of friends for my api. English teacher was
Speaker 1: this very famous English teacher in my school. She was
Speaker 1: like probably eighty When I had her, she was at
Speaker 1: Pali High forever. She like donated. She was from very
Speaker 1: rich and like donated her salary to the school and stuff.
Speaker 1: But she was asshole. She like also will bullied half
Speaker 1: of her class. She would call people her fours and fives,
Speaker 1: like the ones that she thought were like the smartest.
Speaker 1: My god, wait, and then she's like has had life,
Speaker 1: think a narcissistic personality sort of. And on the first
Speaker 1: day of class and we were all told this and
Speaker 1: I had her two years in a row, she turned
Speaker 1: on TV and it was like she was on sixty
Speaker 1: minutes or something as uh, like she like one Teacher
Speaker 1: of the Year one year, like twenty years before plays
Speaker 1: it for everyone to be like, this is what you're getting.
Speaker 1: I just been imagining her rolling out the TV cart
Speaker 1: that you like keep for rainy days and days when
Speaker 1: you're hungover as a teacher, like popping in the homemade
Speaker 1: recorded vhs of her on sixty minutes and just the
Speaker 1: ti tik tik happening, and then her face, Oh gosh,
Speaker 1: can you imagine that you're going to watch the Road
Speaker 1: to El Dorado and watching sixty Minutes on your teacher
Speaker 1: Also just like thinking of like a mean girl English
Speaker 1: teacher walking around being like, okay, my fours and fives,
Speaker 1: where are you? I know, it was very It was
Speaker 1: very very and that would be like I would be
Speaker 1: such an insecure little scholar in that room. I mean
Speaker 1: I was four, so I it was I was a
Speaker 1: forward to, but she was her fours and fives. And
Speaker 1: then I remember I saw her one day with like
Speaker 1: her two favorite students, like, oh, here they are my fives,
Speaker 1: and I'm like, oh, that's why you call us collectively
Speaker 1: fours and fives. You're listening to Popcorn book Club for
Speaker 1: My Heart Radio, and we'll be back right after the break.
Speaker 1: So we're back with Popcorn book Club for My Heart Radio. Okay,
Speaker 1: So back to Helmholtz. Yeah, reads a long poem to
Speaker 1: his students, which is cute, and that was like his
Speaker 1: big act of descent. So I think that it was weird.
Speaker 1: But the reported him those acts, but like those acts
Speaker 1: of descent don't seem to warrant like a full camera crew,
Speaker 1: which is which which was why I felt the reporters
Speaker 1: felt so odd that they were like on the ready,
Speaker 1: ready to record John, Like I think part of it
Speaker 1: is like John is so different that John is like
Speaker 1: the only you know, but why the exist? I think
Speaker 1: that's what Like maybe it's I think it's part of
Speaker 1: that economy of distraction, right, Like it's it's the frivolity
Speaker 1: of the media, and like this society has well, yeah,
Speaker 1: it already it already assumes that people are so well
Speaker 1: conditioned that they're not going to do anything like wild
Speaker 1: you know what I mean, Like they're so regimented in
Speaker 1: their like brains everything. Also, like the guy who did
Speaker 1: the whales thing or the nature thing. I wonder if
Speaker 1: that because it does feel like you wouldn't profile individuals
Speaker 1: because this society is so anti individual that I feel
Speaker 1: like you would profile nature or you would profile like
Speaker 1: the the the making of the Feelies or something like that.
Speaker 1: But I don't know, maybe they don't see John as
Speaker 1: an individual. Like that's also a big part of that,
Speaker 1: Like he's so outside the society that he's just like
Speaker 1: a curio. Yeah, I mean, and he's attempting to return
Speaker 1: to nature. He's just thwarted in his attempts immediately and
Speaker 1: even during this period where he is attempting to do
Speaker 1: his walden bit where he is living alone unperturbed by
Speaker 1: the rest of the world. And he bought a few
Speaker 1: canned goods because they were irresistible, but he's not going
Speaker 1: to eat them. That that was very funny. Yeah, so
Speaker 1: he's playing stove entirely alone. It okay. When I kept
Speaker 1: thinking about this book, and I think one thing that's
Speaker 1: interesting about any dystopia is we it forces us to
Speaker 1: think about what he's missing from that society and what's
Speaker 1: valuable to us. And sometimes that's something very obvious, like
Speaker 1: water is missing from this society, and that is something
Speaker 1: I care about. Um, the amazing that seems to be
Speaker 1: missing from this society's love, and John comes no closer
Speaker 1: to be incapable of loving when he's living alone. At
Speaker 1: the end, he's still just whipping himself every time he
Speaker 1: thinks about Lanina when she actually comes back for him.
Speaker 1: I thought a happy ending was going to be, like
Speaker 1: he was going right to her. They were going to
Speaker 1: be together, She was going to live with him in
Speaker 1: his lighthouse, and they were gonna restart the family. And
Speaker 1: I hope be documented by that guy who is a
Speaker 1: documentary and I'm very passionate about his art, Treating Treat
Speaker 1: Treat guy. Yeah, he works really hard. Everyone else. John
Speaker 1: also Eldest Huxley, does that thing where he wants to
Speaker 1: make an argument, so he has two characters argue opposing
Speaker 1: points for ten pages. And that's the argument that John
Speaker 1: has with Mustafa Amount, where it's like two smart people
Speaker 1: with opposite perspectives talking and John's perspective is like, what
Speaker 1: about art and truth and beauty? And Mustafa a Mount goes, Okay, well,
Speaker 1: those are fine, but they're not empirically more important than
Speaker 1: comfort and happiness, and we prioritize comfort and happiness and
Speaker 1: that is a compromise. Look, it's an argument. Some people
Speaker 1: say that, you know, comfort is better than than beauty
Speaker 1: and truth, And I thought it was really nice when
Speaker 1: him Holt says that he's suffering because he wants to
Speaker 1: make art and he can't, and must Amount says that
Speaker 1: actually he's working with very few dramatic situations and he's
Speaker 1: still turning them into feelings and making art, and maybe
Speaker 1: that's more impressive than something shakepeare having experience. But I
Speaker 1: guess what I was saying is like, even John is
Speaker 1: not a hero in the sense of like this book
Speaker 1: where it's like he's not doing anything for truth, or
Speaker 1: beauty or art and or love. He's just like whipping
Speaker 1: himself and being alone, Like he really doesn't do anything
Speaker 1: other than a spouse. These ideas to make us the
Speaker 1: reader route for him. I think that this book is
Speaker 1: a cautionary tale about what happens when you read too
Speaker 1: much Shakespeare, but you don't understand it because he doesn't
Speaker 1: understand it. And I feel like these people, like he
Speaker 1: talks a lot about Romeo and juliet because he fashions
Speaker 1: himself to be Romeo and Lenina to be Juliett And like,
Speaker 1: first off, you didn't read the end of that. Second
Speaker 1: of all, I feel like there is a choice that
Speaker 1: is made. And he is again saying because Juliette could
Speaker 1: have chosen to be with Paris and to take the
Speaker 1: easy road. But to quote Shakespeare in another of his plays,
Speaker 1: the Course of True Love Now or did run smooth?
Speaker 1: And he's saying like, well, everyone would be better if
Speaker 1: they did this, And it's like, well, no, there's no
Speaker 1: way that everyone would have been better, which is why
Speaker 1: they have this island for these misfit toys where they
Speaker 1: send them are several islands. Because he's like, oh, it's
Speaker 1: good that we have so many islands. I don't know
Speaker 1: what we did without him, and um, so it's sort
Speaker 1: of like I feel like Mustaf Ahman is actually the
Speaker 1: most realistic person, and he's like, this is the society
Speaker 1: that we have. And I think that you have some
Speaker 1: valid points, but this is the society that we're in.
Speaker 1: Your society that you come from is not inherently better
Speaker 1: than ours, and you need to stop acting like it is.
Speaker 1: Your society is fine. Ours is not necessarily better than yours.
Speaker 1: And he's kind of the only one who, even while
Speaker 1: referring to it as civilization and savagery, does concede that
Speaker 1: savagery is not inherently bad. It's just different and it's old. Yeah,
Speaker 1: And that's exactly why he's like, yeah, we don't not
Speaker 1: teach this because it's bad or are scared it just
Speaker 1: it doesn't reinforce the society we've built that prioritizes comfort
Speaker 1: above all. And they wouldn't understand it, like that was
Speaker 1: the other piece of it. They wouldn't understand the lot
Speaker 1: like Helmholtz laughs at the idea of like the mother
Speaker 1: and this true love and why wouldn't you in marriage?
Speaker 1: And it is so disconnected um, I will say, you know, Jennifer,
Speaker 1: you're talking about these kind of dystopian books, and the
Speaker 1: one and the other part of it that I usually
Speaker 1: take from them is, you know, what are the things
Speaker 1: in this dystopia that feel familiar? And a lot of
Speaker 1: it feels very familiar, especially now, like the idea of
Speaker 1: never being alone with your thoughts and like always having
Speaker 1: constant distraction, and how constant distraction is a way for
Speaker 1: like the systems of power to keep working and also
Speaker 1: for consumerism to keep working, to like feed the beast,
Speaker 1: and there's always something to buy, there's always something to consume.
Speaker 1: And I did feel like that helm holds thing about
Speaker 1: solitude and that like no one there is ever alone
Speaker 1: is it was just really compelling to me and kind
Speaker 1: of world that we like, Oh my god, it made me.
Speaker 1: I mean, I'm someone I'm alone in quarantine, but I'm
Speaker 1: on Twitter constantly, and I also keep like my TV
Speaker 1: on in the background when I work, just like and
Speaker 1: I always have like two screens up, like I'm always
Speaker 1: my brain is never quiet, and I'm clearly uncomfortable with
Speaker 1: just being alone with my thoughts, which isn't a good thing.
Speaker 1: And the thing that I should work on. Yeah. I
Speaker 1: think there is also this idea that at least if
Speaker 1: you are someone who leaves in public at any kind
Speaker 1: of way, like someone who is on Twitter, there is
Speaker 1: a notion that everyone belongs to everyone else. My husband
Speaker 1: often says that the thing that he thinks that our
Speaker 1: grandchildren will rightly mock us the most as a generation
Speaker 1: for was the idea that random private citizens had to
Speaker 1: issue like public apologies on it, Like the idea that
Speaker 1: you had to be like, I'm sorry, I didn't I
Speaker 1: was not aware of good year tires, poor politics. I
Speaker 1: do not. They do not stand with me. I am
Speaker 1: a teacher from Missouri. Um. It is uh, it is
Speaker 1: somewhat unnecessary that we believe that we belong so much
Speaker 1: to everyone else that we have to constantly make it
Speaker 1: clear that we are standing together as a group. Um.
Speaker 1: Not that you shouldn't try to support, you know, companies
Speaker 1: to do good things and good people in general, and
Speaker 1: the right political causes. But I do think there is
Speaker 1: an idea that if you don't, you will be canceled
Speaker 1: online very very quickly. Um, and well everybody, Yeah, I
Speaker 1: mean I not to bring up something personal from your Twitter,
Speaker 1: but the but that whole like book thing, like, yeah,
Speaker 1: is it's so enough with It's not political, it's just
Speaker 1: the way you organize your books and for you to
Speaker 1: get dragged by strangers and telling you you're an idiot
Speaker 1: because oh yeah, don't worry, I've readden Look, there is
Speaker 1: a very real chance that I have written more books
Speaker 1: than those people have read this. Yes, so I'm not
Speaker 1: too worried. It is like that that they feel like
Speaker 1: they have a right to you know, your time and attention,
Speaker 1: says I didn't specifically want to invoke that example, but yes,
Speaker 1: do you feel like, what kind of insane world are
Speaker 1: we living in? Oh? No, no, it's fine. Honestly, it's
Speaker 1: better than me trying to make up an argument. Yeah,
Speaker 1: insane to me that people feel like they have a
Speaker 1: right to do that. I think it's the same argument
Speaker 1: that Mustafa and John are basically having, where it's like
Speaker 1: you are prioritizing, in that specific instance, beauty and you're like,
Speaker 1: I like the way that this looks. These are books,
Speaker 1: they have information. I use the for information. I like them,
Speaker 1: but I am prioritizing the way I organized my books
Speaker 1: in a beauty sense. I wanted to look pretty and
Speaker 1: be a rainbow, which the same thing. Yeah, is the
Speaker 1: first person I like. I'm like, I live in a
Speaker 1: studio apartment and my bookshelves take up a full wall,
Speaker 1: and so I want them to like look nice of
Speaker 1: my last book at friends, to have those built in
Speaker 1: bookshelves built and get the ladder and do everything they
Speaker 1: are in very important to me. Know, they're stunning. They're stunning. Okay,
Speaker 1: thank you, they are. This is Popcorn book Club. We'll
Speaker 1: be right back after this quick break. Okay, we're back
Speaker 1: with Popcorn book Club. We didn't say what happens at
Speaker 1: the end of the book. Oh my god, Yes, okay,
Speaker 1: Lena runs towards him. I fully assume they're going to
Speaker 1: embrace and restart a family and they're going to have
Speaker 1: an interesting and different world. But that is not what happens.
Speaker 1: He runs out after her and tries to whip her,
Speaker 1: and I think successfully does sound like just fully attacks her. Yes, yeah,
Speaker 1: Henry Foster runs away because um, all men are cowards
Speaker 1: in this world. But yes, and Henry Foster runs away,
Speaker 1: and I think she might be dead anyhow. Then the
Speaker 1: Sandwich goes back to his house and hangs himself. I
Speaker 1: think they also have an orgy on her dead body, yes,
Speaker 1: orgy porgy. Yeah. They have just like just overcome with
Speaker 1: like a motion, but their conditioned not to know how
Speaker 1: to handle it except in that way until they have
Speaker 1: an orgy, which John participates too, because he's like everything
Speaker 1: is so crazy, like I might as well just give
Speaker 1: in to what's happening. And then the next morning he
Speaker 1: is so guilty that he had an orgy that yeah, yeah,
Speaker 1: which again, the scale of things that are bad and
Speaker 1: good about this world is like a certain level of
Speaker 1: sexual openness is I would say, on the better scale
Speaker 1: if you can also marry that with a commitment and love.
Speaker 1: Um and John thinking that every woman who wants sex
Speaker 1: is a strumpet who should be beaten and whipped to
Speaker 1: death not a good thing kind of well, I mean, look,
Speaker 1: is is love incompatible with a society that is this
Speaker 1: calm and happy and prioritize has comfort as much? Well?
Speaker 1: I think they do love things. I think that they
Speaker 1: love things in a different way than we perceive love.
Speaker 1: Like they love electromagnetic and obstacle golf. They love it.
Speaker 1: But I do think love monogamy is possessive, right, and
Speaker 1: there is inherent jealousy and like owning an object, not
Speaker 1: that you're owning a person, but possessing an exclusivity with
Speaker 1: a person, it does lead itself to jealousy and you
Speaker 1: want things that other people have and you can't have
Speaker 1: certain people, and well, feelings aren't quite it. I feel
Speaker 1: like it's toxic. Monogamy is that. I feel like monogamy
Speaker 1: doesn't have to be that monogamy doesn't have to be
Speaker 1: inherently jealous. I think that recognizing that you can't be
Speaker 1: everybody to one person is important, and I don't mean
Speaker 1: that in terms of a sexual way, but like, your
Speaker 1: partner should be able to have friends. Your partner should
Speaker 1: be able to have a coworker where they make cheeky
Speaker 1: jokes and that's okay with you if that's something that
Speaker 1: they want. Like, I think that that there needs to
Speaker 1: be a conversation about what monogamy means to you. But
Speaker 1: I think that there's this culture that exists, maybe more
Speaker 1: so back then but especially now where it's like, oh,
Speaker 1: you're my person, you're my person, that's it. And well,
Speaker 1: I also you really just have to be on the
Speaker 1: same page. Like I don't care if Mike Pens and
Speaker 1: his wife want to do they're thing that I think
Speaker 1: it's kind of weird for he's not allowed to talk
Speaker 1: to other women, and I'm sure she's not allowed to
Speaker 1: talk to other men. And they're calling each other mother
Speaker 1: and father. Okay, it's weird to me. It's not what
Speaker 1: i'd want for my marriage. But it seems like they're
Speaker 1: both very much on the same page and that makes
Speaker 1: them happy. But so I think I think I'm speaking
Speaker 1: a little more abstractly where it's not about the actual
Speaker 1: nature of monogamy. It's the nature of strong feelings for
Speaker 1: anything and a possessiveness. Then like, even if it's not
Speaker 1: like cheating, it's like if the person die, like there's
Speaker 1: a loss and and and there's pain and loving something. Yeah,
Speaker 1: well there's family to family is a kind of love. Yeah.
Speaker 1: I think they're also is that this is this is
Speaker 1: last about all that. Yeah, it's more about familial love
Speaker 1: and romantic love, and those two things inherently as perfect
Speaker 1: and healthy as they it can be in the most
Speaker 1: healthy version, there is grief involved in those relationships, because
Speaker 1: if it's not through a divorce or a breakup, it's
Speaker 1: through someone dying or like with a child, it's them
Speaker 1: moving away, you know, like there's there's so much grief
Speaker 1: because the feelings are so intense, and that this society
Speaker 1: has gotten rid of those griefs and losses in and
Speaker 1: but they've also gotten rid of deep, meaningful love. I mean,
Speaker 1: Dorothy Parker has this great quote where she says, it's
Speaker 1: so easy to be sweet to people until you love them,
Speaker 1: And I think that's true. I would never speak to
Speaker 1: like my postman the way I spoke to my mother
Speaker 1: when I was fifteen, when I told her that she
Speaker 1: was like full on destroying my life. Um, like it is.
Speaker 1: And you know, if if somebody killed my husband, I
Speaker 1: would want to hunt them down and kill them. Those
Speaker 1: are not civilized rational feelings that lead to everybody is
Speaker 1: happiness and well being. And my biggest fear is my
Speaker 1: parents dying, and like that is that rue that ruins
Speaker 1: my life, the thought of that, And yeah, that is
Speaker 1: a pain because I have something good and I don't
Speaker 1: want it to go away. I just want to speak
Speaker 1: to grief. And I think that having community is what
Speaker 1: makes grief bearable and what makes grief something that can
Speaker 1: be compatible with civilization, because it's like the moment when
Speaker 1: some you have somebody in your life die and we
Speaker 1: talked about this um or we don't talk about it,
Speaker 1: but it comes up in the hate you give. How
Speaker 1: everybody comes together after Khalil's death and they're all there
Speaker 1: for each other to support each other in this terrible
Speaker 1: time where somebody has taken too soon. And I think
Speaker 1: that the problem with John losing Linda is that there's
Speaker 1: no template for it. They're like, why are you like
Speaker 1: this eating a Claire have some soma, Like it's not
Speaker 1: that deep. People die, and because I think it's just
Speaker 1: two world views being incompatible. So it is about, like
Speaker 1: Jen just said, being on the same page. I really
Speaker 1: like the quote that John says in his sort of
Speaker 1: like monologue towards me Stop Amount where he's quoting the
Speaker 1: one book he's read and he's talking about Hamlet and
Speaker 1: he says like, you know, to bear the slings narrows
Speaker 1: aboutrage of sports, and he's like, well, you just made
Speaker 1: instead of bearing it, you just do away with the
Speaker 1: slings narrow So it's like, I totally, Karama, You're totally right.
Speaker 1: Like our society has come up with ways to cope
Speaker 1: with that grief through like communities, and they're just like, well,
Speaker 1: what if we just didn't. I was so mad when
Speaker 1: he did that quote because he misquoted it, and I was, yeah,
Speaker 1: I had to double check because I was like, look,
Speaker 1: I don't know much, but I know to be or
Speaker 1: not to be when I used to work out. Hello, well, um,
Speaker 1: I used to recite to be or not to be
Speaker 1: when I was on the rowing machine so that it
Speaker 1: would feel less traumatic. I'm making a face, Karama. That
Speaker 1: is the most taps concentrator ship I've ever happened, where
Speaker 1: I'm sorry. It's something that I remembered that I knew
Speaker 1: well that I could go through. And he says whether
Speaker 1: tis in the book all this? Huxley says whether tis better?
Speaker 1: And I was like, tis nobler? Motherfucker. I was like,
Speaker 1: that's wrong and I checked. It was like, there's no
Speaker 1: version of this that would have been really an amazing
Speaker 1: power move. At the end of Bernard's speech must Off,
Speaker 1: it was like, tis nobler, Oh my gosh, Mike drop
Speaker 1: if I wrote that TV show, That's what I would Uh,
Speaker 1: That's what I would do. Is kind of dumb. John
Speaker 1: is definitely dumb, but I think he could he not
Speaker 1: be also because he doesn't. I mean he formulates his
Speaker 1: arguments well, but the fact that he thinks the solution
Speaker 1: is just go into a forest and pray all day
Speaker 1: on his knees, Like, that's not a productive use of
Speaker 1: your energy. Also, I don't think that's also a weird narcissism,
Speaker 1: a weird distraction. Absolutely, he became very bernard like by
Speaker 1: the end, well, and like he had never really been
Speaker 1: shown much kindness except for that one old man at
Speaker 1: the reservation, and no one really taught him anything, like
Speaker 1: he had been taught how to read, but not to
Speaker 1: comprehend fully what he's reading. And I think that so, like, genuinely,
Speaker 1: how could he not be bad at formulating arguments and
Speaker 1: bad at making these connections like he has he is learning,
Speaker 1: but he has no education. Well, that's almost the most
Speaker 1: interesting thing to me. As also, as we said, there's
Speaker 1: no protagonist in this book, like John is not a hero,
Speaker 1: and again he murders Learning at the end, and if
Speaker 1: he doesn't, he maims her. But in a less nuanced
Speaker 1: or maybe even more modern dystopian book, usually there is
Speaker 1: a character who's meant to be like an audience placeholder,
Speaker 1: who always is like voicing things as if they're the
Speaker 1: reader from our world who just came into that world,
Speaker 1: you know, like Catanus and Hunger games, being like this
Speaker 1: is wrong, we shouldn't have hunger games. Like yeah, they
Speaker 1: shouldn't have a Hunger game right where it's like someone
Speaker 1: who's like predor naturally wise and has a perspective on it.
Speaker 1: So none of these characters have perspective on their society. Honestly,
Speaker 1: I think the only one that does is missed off
Speaker 1: a mom mom, because completely saw that he knew the
Speaker 1: old world. And whether you know, you agree with him
Speaker 1: or not about this dystopia, he gets both sides, Like
Speaker 1: he understands the benefits of not being in the society
Speaker 1: and having romantic love and art, but he like I
Speaker 1: chose not to, which makes his position as the resident
Speaker 1: world controller pretty diabolical. Yes, absolutely, the fact that he
Speaker 1: can just sit there and talk to John about oh yeah,
Speaker 1: I see your side of things, and I saw it
Speaker 1: from that perspective as well, And he probably maybe would
Speaker 1: have ended up in the same position as John if
Speaker 1: he just didn't wasn't offered a position of power. Well,
Speaker 1: that's sort of the scary thing is when you have
Speaker 1: someone like Mustafa Mound looking at a population and saying like,
Speaker 1: all right, we will predestined that everyone just lives a
Speaker 1: comfortable life and lives and does their job and plays
Speaker 1: golf and dies. You're like, well, why are these people
Speaker 1: even living? It's like an ant colony, Like you could
Speaker 1: just kill Like if your life is just like a
Speaker 1: meaningless array of soma pleasantries, Like what is the difference
Speaker 1: between that and life and death? Like if to me
Speaker 1: it reads as Mustafa mind, like playing with an ant colony,
Speaker 1: And that's what to me. I mean, maybe this is interpretation,
Speaker 1: but like propping up billionaires and making them to you
Speaker 1: to be rich and have their machines run and they
Speaker 1: buy their clothes and their soma and their perfumes and
Speaker 1: their feelies and and their mechanical golf and whatever that
Speaker 1: like they need all those people to do that because
Speaker 1: that He even mentions like the iceberg as the perfect
Speaker 1: example of what the society is that like the tip
Speaker 1: is that like at the very top, I was like,
Speaker 1: your numbers are wrong. He was like, it was like
Speaker 1: one night about the water, eight nights below the water.
Speaker 1: But I think it's because I had like nine pasts
Speaker 1: or something. Maybe the wealth disparity was less less crazy,
Speaker 1: because now it is. But it did feel like he
Speaker 1: was describing late stage capitalism for sure. I wanted to
Speaker 1: talk about the epigram, the quote at the beginning, the
Speaker 1: epigraph or epigram, which one is it? Um? I think
Speaker 1: it's the epigraph. Yes, the epigraph, a word that I
Speaker 1: knew for sure. Um. So it's in French um which
Speaker 1: in French. I was one of my teachers force um,
Speaker 1: so I just have to give me a French No.
Speaker 1: I definitely had to use Google Translate to get some
Speaker 1: of this though, because I was like, it's been a while,
Speaker 1: but it basically boils down to um. Utopias are basically
Speaker 1: becoming more realizable then we believed before, and we find
Speaker 1: ourselves actually in front of a more um agonizing question,
Speaker 1: which is, how do we avoid the definitive realization of Utopia's?
Speaker 1: Utopias are realistic life marches towards utopias, and maybe in
Speaker 1: a in the beginning of a new century, a century
Speaker 1: where intellectuals and the cultivate, cultivated class can dream of
Speaker 1: a method of avoiding the utopias, we can return to
Speaker 1: a society non a non utopian society, less perfect and
Speaker 1: more free. And I think that that's a really interesting
Speaker 1: like little summary of the book and the idea of
Speaker 1: less perfect and more free and interesting that we are
Speaker 1: trying to form a more perfect union. I think that
Speaker 1: have any of you read? Yeah, so that's another That's
Speaker 1: another book that is sort of compared to this a lot,
Speaker 1: because you know they I think that was written in
Speaker 1: the fifties, but like similar, similar eras and and both
Speaker 1: dystopi into a degree. Even though nineteen four is like
Speaker 1: objectively a full totalitarian government, I would argue that, you know,
Speaker 1: Brave New World is equally totalitarian, but just like more
Speaker 1: pleasant where it's like the defectors in Brave New World
Speaker 1: when you're different, you just like go to the Falkland
Speaker 1: island and they're like great, we're in like breat In nine.
Speaker 1: They like torture you with rat which is bad. Um
Speaker 1: yea difference rats are islands. Yeah, it's interesting. Mustafa does
Speaker 1: talk about that that like force, that they tried to
Speaker 1: kill people like you do this through force and fear
Speaker 1: and it didn't work, like it could just cause civil
Speaker 1: unrest and they're like, oh no, we can't have that.
Speaker 1: And I thought that was really interesting. And that's how
Speaker 1: you know that this is like every piece of this
Speaker 1: is designed by very evil people because they just want
Speaker 1: to control the masses. It's just that, like what is it,
Speaker 1: you get get more flies with honey? Civil civil unrest
Speaker 1: like inspires heroism, you know what inspires glory? When really
Speaker 1: kissed me off about the misquoted Shakespeare was because he
Speaker 1: had just been talking about being noble and then he
Speaker 1: didn't even say the word noble where it was in
Speaker 1: the text. Like I was a big man about this tongue.
Speaker 1: But I think I used to public speaking. That's I mean,
Speaker 1: he's pretty private at that point. I think it's interesting
Speaker 1: that Mustafaman's last name is world in French. He's like
Speaker 1: born to be the world's controller. Again, I took French.
Speaker 1: I don't know if you all knew I did. Like
Speaker 1: the little came as of all the of all the
Speaker 1: people with their with their names like um, the Malthusian belts,
Speaker 1: which is like the reproduction. But malthest is the the
Speaker 1: economist who talks about population and growth. So that makes
Speaker 1: sense that like to limit, just like Alice is like
Speaker 1: look at all the people. I know, I went to
Speaker 1: major and he did. He didn't even have Google. He
Speaker 1: did not that's impressive. They were just up there in
Speaker 1: his noggin, but apparently not the correct version of to
Speaker 1: be or not to be. It was late in the book. Yeah,
Speaker 1: John is one book, his entire fucking life. Editor, I
Speaker 1: blame Elvis's editors. That's fair. Whoever you are, all this
Speaker 1: is editor. I hope you hear this from beyond the
Speaker 1: grave and you're ashamed of yourself. I bet they are.
Speaker 1: I bet they're hearing it being like we know it's
Speaker 1: really it's one regret. That's why I'm stuck on earth
Speaker 1: because it's my unfinished we talk about the show at all.
Speaker 1: I was about to say most of us did not
Speaker 1: watch the show. The one thing that came up in
Speaker 1: the text chat that I want to bring up is
Speaker 1: actress Demi Moore playing Linda. Yeah, because Demi Demi is
Speaker 1: the antithesis of human age. She's the opposite of human Yeah,
Speaker 1: don't worry to make her into a sex symbol on
Speaker 1: the show. Also, she doesn't like to to die slowly
Speaker 1: by taking soma she's shot is she heroically gets her
Speaker 1: son to safety so he can go back to the
Speaker 1: or likes her as just like this, this like tragic
Speaker 1: figure It was really interesting because in the show, the
Speaker 1: Savage Area is an amusement park. It's not a reservation.
Speaker 1: They love West World, it's our West World, but like
Speaker 1: it's got real quote unquote savages. But they're all like, um,
Speaker 1: they're all working class white people, what some might call
Speaker 1: trailer trash. Is what is the that's the like vibe
Speaker 1: like that. But they're also if you like, yeah, yeah,
Speaker 1: it's exactly like that. But that's also interesting because then
Speaker 1: those people are also are they familiar with Do they
Speaker 1: know they're in a theme park? Yes? And it's like
Speaker 1: they're just we're that's weird because then they know about
Speaker 1: the outside world exactly though some force field that prevents
Speaker 1: them from going out. I just watched the first episode,
Speaker 1: the first two episodes are free um, and I like
Speaker 1: it was very weird because basically they were like, oh,
Speaker 1: the regular people are not regularly. They didn't say regular,
Speaker 1: but the people from New London can walk in and
Speaker 1: out of that blue force field and it makes you
Speaker 1: wonder if they're even human. And I was like, wait,
Speaker 1: are they human? What is this blue force field? What's
Speaker 1: going on? When a lot of stuff happens in the
Speaker 1: TV show that's not happened in the book. A lot
Speaker 1: of it is not good to someone really had to
Speaker 1: take some things that I do enjoy less racist off
Speaker 1: the bat, A lot of people of color characters seems
Speaker 1: like they are not They're not like mixing the They're
Speaker 1: mixing the casts up a little bit more. The C
Speaker 1: A S T E casts, not B C A st cast. Um,
Speaker 1: Henry's Asian. Okay, so everybody's sexually fluid. So everybody everyone
Speaker 1: truly belongs to everyone else. Yeah, um, yeah, so Henry's Asian.
Speaker 1: Franny is black. Um. And then we already talked briefly
Speaker 1: about how Helmholtz is a woman named Wilhelmina. So Holm
Speaker 1: for sure does she is. She's still like a hot commodity.
Speaker 1: She's she's the Andy Warhole. She's doing Andy warhol because
Speaker 1: she wears the silver with yea this little haircut that she's.
Speaker 1: I don't think I saw him in the first episode.
Speaker 1: I I did look at the IMDb, and I think
Speaker 1: Mustafa is that they gender flipped that character too. I
Speaker 1: think dystopian modern dystopians love like a steely woman to
Speaker 1: be in church. That's like the new trend of like
Speaker 1: a woman in a gray suit. Oh yeah, it's like
Speaker 1: totally Kate Winslett and Divergent, Yes, and from You and
Speaker 1: Julianne Moore. Yeah yeah, I think that or Tillington and
Speaker 1: Snow Piercer. Oh yeah, I love Snow for fun. That's
Speaker 1: a that's a good dystopia. That's a fun dystopia. All right,
Speaker 1: they're making it into a TV. Before we leave, let's
Speaker 1: go around and say, if you had to live in
Speaker 1: a dystopia, you have to live in it. You which one?
Speaker 1: What do you want to live in? Wait? Do I
Speaker 1: get to choose? Like? Can I in charge? No, You're
Speaker 1: not in charge. You're just a citizen. It can be
Speaker 1: a book, TV show, anything, but we all have to
Speaker 1: sort of collectively agree to dystopia. What about the one
Speaker 1: we're in now? I just think it's clever, But now,
Speaker 1: oh this one is hot. It's hard, Okay. I mean
Speaker 1: I think, Um, if we lift in the Hunger Games,
Speaker 1: we live in America, and um, you know we live
Speaker 1: in wealthy parts of America, we would definitely live in
Speaker 1: the capital. I doesn't feel bad about the games going on,
Speaker 1: but the clothing is very good. We could have like
Speaker 1: a protest. That is also true where it's like we
Speaker 1: are the coastal elites. And also in the Hunger Games,
Speaker 1: it's it's only ten eleven. Oh, you're not even going
Speaker 1: to come to my capital, lady pro it's tunny, so correct,
Speaker 1: I bet you there are the protests were going afterwards.
Speaker 1: I'll come to the protest, but I'll be like you, look,
Speaker 1: as long as if it keeps everyone. There's a lot
Speaker 1: of deaths now, a lot of kids die. Be clear, kids,
Speaker 1: you're going to be moderate conservatives. I don't say that.
Speaker 1: I think I choose to live in the purge. Can
Speaker 1: I live in the purge? Yeah? I don't scar. I
Speaker 1: I was that's what I was gonna do West World,
Speaker 1: because especially are you a robot or are you a person?
Speaker 1: Either one? There they are benefits. The robots don't ever
Speaker 1: remember anything and then eventually suprising, and that seems very
Speaker 1: fun the robots or whatever if robots, but if you're
Speaker 1: a human. But as a woman visitor, I feel like
Speaker 1: the men visitors are terrible, but the women visitors just
Speaker 1: a saloon like flirt with James Morriston. And I'm saying,
Speaker 1: what about friends? When the robot uprising happens and you're
Speaker 1: a human well, yeah, you would know I was already friends. Yeah,
Speaker 1: we were friends with the robots. We wouldn't be like
Speaker 1: we're Yeah, m if I'm just a regular person, I
Speaker 1: either choose the Purge or Dollhouse, because in Dollhouse, I
Speaker 1: would be a regular person unaffiliated with the Dollhouse. I
Speaker 1: would not be rich enough to partake at the Dollhouse.
Speaker 1: I don't think that I am like conventionally hot enough
Speaker 1: to be a doll So I'm just like a person
Speaker 1: in Los Angeles. Yeah, you know, I think I did
Speaker 1: you guys ever read The Giver when you were a kid?
Speaker 1: Of course? Yeah, I think I know that that's a
Speaker 1: dystopia where like colors don't exist in like strong sexual
Speaker 1: feelings don't exist, but like they're all emotionally healthy and
Speaker 1: your family and you like talk about your day. They
Speaker 1: kill all the twins, do they they have to murder? Yeah?
Speaker 1: God is not I said it happened. Yeah, I was like,
Speaker 1: it has to be a dystopia. Westly slaves sentient beings
Speaker 1: or I mean, honestly, runner up would be bring the
Speaker 1: World and that's sent to one of the tropical islands.
Speaker 1: Oh wait, I might be changing my opinion, which one,
Speaker 1: would you be the bottom? Actually, stufford Wives would be
Speaker 1: great if you just like, don't live in Connecticut because
Speaker 1: I know man like I like, Oh jen Jennifer, Jennifer,
Speaker 1: Oh Jennifer, this is worse than making pies. It is
Speaker 1: Christians decorations. Jennifer. I would purchase shut out of you.
Speaker 1: You're going to be the first courage. The great thing
Speaker 1: about the purchase you get to save up for three
Speaker 1: hundred and sixty four days all of the rage that
Speaker 1: you have and then directed whoever ye with no consequences.
Speaker 1: But every year definitely gets worse because they probably killed
Speaker 1: someone you loved last year, so now you've got to
Speaker 1: go run. And here's the other here's the other upside
Speaker 1: of the purge. All laws cease to exist on the
Speaker 1: night of the purge, which means like doing community gardens.
Speaker 1: I was like, not allowed unity gardens. Yeah, no, no,
Speaker 1: laws that are dumb extortion. I would extort people are
Speaker 1: going to we're going into purge discussion. This is too far.
Speaker 1: I'm very sweaty. I was like, I would build something
Speaker 1: in my backyard without a proper permit. Yeah, I would
Speaker 1: park on the street. Sweeping side of the happens on
Speaker 1: the first I'm not paying rent. Uh, this was a delight.
Speaker 1: Thank you Jennifer, tan Mellis and Grandma for joining me.
Speaker 1: Brave New World is a series on Peacock if you want.
Speaker 1: But it sounds like it is not similar to the book. Uh,
Speaker 1: it has the bones of the book. I'm going to
Speaker 1: say it has the bones of the book, but it's
Speaker 1: got a real different muscles. That's our show for the week.
Speaker 1: Thank you so much for listening. I'm Danis Schwartz and
Speaker 1: you can find me on Twitter at Danis Schwartz with
Speaker 1: three z s. You can follow Jennifer Wright at Jen
Speaker 1: Ashley Right, Karama Downqua is at Karama Drama, Melissa Hunter
Speaker 1: is at Melissa f tw and Tian Tran is smart
Speaker 1: enough to have gotten off Twitter, but she is on
Speaker 1: Insta at Hank Tina. Our executive producer is Christopher Hessiotes
Speaker 1: and we're produced and edited by Mike John's special thanks
Speaker 1: to David Wasserman. Next week we will get some screen
Speaker 1: time and talk about how the Peacock adaptation of Brave
Speaker 1: New World diverges wildly from the novel spoiler alert, but
Speaker 1: like way different. All right, see you next week. Popcorn
Speaker 1: book Club is a production of I Heart Radio.