Speaker 1: Of the Law and Order franchises. SVU is considered especially watchable.
Speaker 2: We are the amateur detectives who kind of investigate the
Speaker 2: vicious felonies. These episodes are based on.
Speaker 3: These are our stories.
Speaker 4: Done done, Hello, and welcome to That's Messed Up an
Speaker 4: sv podcast.
Speaker 2: I'm Kara and I'm Liza.
Speaker 3: Did you get the.
Speaker 1: Sisters from Ariel like a Qualita or whatever? Oh?
Speaker 2: I was thinking more SNNW the Kristen wigs and yeah,
Speaker 2: but here we talk SVU true crime celeb guests sometimes
Speaker 2: sometimes not. You know, we're working women trying our best.
Speaker 2: We're here, I mean, we're in the time machine. This
Speaker 2: is this is post Same Patrick's Day. So you know
Speaker 2: I'm not doing well in real life. If you'd like to,
Speaker 2: if you're listening live on March eighteenth, maybe DM me,
Speaker 2: maybe dm me see how I'm doing.
Speaker 1: Yes, CM Lee's the center a virtual bottle of Gatorade
Speaker 1: today is.
Speaker 2: My god, Oh my god, I feel bad for you.
Speaker 2: What well, we're recording on March eighteenth, and I'm gonna
Speaker 2: be post Saint Patrick's Day.
Speaker 3: Oh boy, I forgot about that.
Speaker 2: But the Luigi Trials tomorrow, so you know I'm going
Speaker 2: to that we can't.
Speaker 3: There's no move got around all day.
Speaker 1: You got to black out the rest of the day
Speaker 1: on the eighteenth so that you're prepped for the nineteenth.
Speaker 1: But today is my twin brother's birthday, Colin and David,
Speaker 1: my twin brothers.
Speaker 3: Happy birthday boys.
Speaker 1: Colin listens, but he is behind, so he'll probably get
Speaker 1: this in like three months. He'll be like half. He'll
Speaker 1: be like at his half birthday when he gets this.
Speaker 1: But you know, love my little twinsies. So that's a
Speaker 1: little happy birthday shout out to.
Speaker 3: That old are they now? I feel like thirty eight,
Speaker 3: thirty seven something like that.
Speaker 1: I forgot. Sorry, Oh they're my age. Yeah, my brothers
Speaker 1: are like your age. There's like, yeah, I always.
Speaker 2: Assumes someone that's a neurologist is older than me, but
Speaker 2: I guess not anymore.
Speaker 3: You're old enough to be an neurologist, you know, which
Speaker 3: is cool.
Speaker 2: Yeah, that's actually so that's always the annoying thing where
Speaker 2: it's like the strict parents that kind of want specific
Speaker 2: careers out of these kids.
Speaker 3: It's like, there's no way I could do that.
Speaker 2: Like if I had Russian ass parents that were like science, science,
Speaker 2: I would be miserable failing. I don't know what I
Speaker 2: would do, Like, I just don't understand, like you need
Speaker 2: some sort of aptitude. I feel for it, some natural inclination.
Speaker 2: It's weird when parents force kids to do, Like I
Speaker 2: can't imagine having to be a doctor if I'm not
Speaker 2: good at science or math.
Speaker 3: Yeah.
Speaker 1: Well it's funny too because my brother is very good
Speaker 1: at math and science. But then he's also very funny
Speaker 1: and good at the other He's just good at everything
Speaker 1: pretty much.
Speaker 3: But well that's why he got like surgeon.
Speaker 2: Yeah he was a surgeon, then he would have chip
Speaker 2: missing in terms of humanity.
Speaker 1: Yes, and but he like took improv at UCB and
Speaker 1: was like very funny, like went through many levels, Like
Speaker 1: I mean, there there's like an alternate universe where he
Speaker 1: went goes into like more of a field like what
Speaker 1: I'm in, you know, so that you know, like I
Speaker 1: feel like, well, he's got special but yeah, you know,
Speaker 1: I think he's enjoying a lot more money than I am,
Speaker 1: which is nice, you know, for him, for.
Speaker 3: Him in this moment, but not overall.
Speaker 2: I think the richest doctor and the richest person in
Speaker 2: comedy the comedy is richer.
Speaker 1: He likes what he does, though, I think I think
Speaker 1: he likes he's you know, he's he likes for me, it's.
Speaker 2: The best special it's the I mean, it's the best schedule.
Speaker 2: Seven days on, seven days off. Oh he helps youel No,
Speaker 2: he is smart, he's doing a good thing. I just
Speaker 2: I don't know. It's just too much work. I would
Speaker 2: never if I had a kid, I would never want
Speaker 2: them to work that hard.
Speaker 3: Ever, I'd be like, chill out, what are you doing?
Speaker 1: Yeah?
Speaker 2: I would not want my kids struggle. I mean, that's
Speaker 2: my mom raised me. My mom always says when I'm dead,
Speaker 2: that's when you can like learn about life. Oh my god,
Speaker 2: she goes, gone, you'll know how hard life is. But like,
Speaker 2: why would I ever do.
Speaker 3: That to you? Yeah?
Speaker 1: I just had parent teacher conferences for Rosie. Oh was
Speaker 1: like she was like showing me Rosie's report cards. She
Speaker 1: was like, yeah, she's doing great, She's doing great. And
Speaker 1: I was like, come on, like give me something like
Speaker 1: I want. I was like digging for I was like
Speaker 1: and her behavior.
Speaker 3: She listening.
Speaker 1: She goes, yeah, I have no problems with her. And
Speaker 1: I was like, wow, this is weird. Like it lasted
Speaker 1: ten minutes. I was like, okay, you nothing or nothing
Speaker 1: because I oh, she was like I didn't.
Speaker 3: I'm just like surprised.
Speaker 1: I'm surprised that she doesn't give like a little bit
Speaker 1: of behavior problem in school because like she does get hyper,
Speaker 1: she does like talk about poop, like she keeps coming
Speaker 1: home telling me that that's inappropriate for school, like she does,
Speaker 1: she leaves all her poop talk for home. But she's
Speaker 1: been using the word inappropriate a lot. Oh, she fell
Speaker 1: out of a window yesterday at our house.
Speaker 3: What I mean, it's low to the ground. I do
Speaker 3: know that which way it is the ground. She okay.
Speaker 1: So Jared has been meal prepping, which is really great.
Speaker 1: I'm happy for him. I want him to be healthy.
Speaker 1: But he makes like this broccoli chicken thing and our
Speaker 1: house smells like fucking broccoli all the time, and it
Speaker 1: drive me crazy. So I opened a bunch of the
Speaker 1: windows in the house because it was a nice day.
Speaker 1: I was like, I gotta get some cross ventilation. I
Speaker 1: can't smell brocoli every day. And then the kids got
Speaker 1: home and they were like, whoa, the windows are open,
Speaker 1: because like, the windows are never open. There are screens,
Speaker 1: but you know, so they just get up on the
Speaker 1: edge of the couch and they're just screaming out the window.
Speaker 1: They're just yelling things, not at anybody, just into the void.
Speaker 1: They're just Oscar's going, hello Helena. He doesn't know anybody
Speaker 1: named Helena. I don't know where any of this came from.
Speaker 1: And he's just like yelling shit out the window. And
Speaker 1: then I look over at the exact moment that I
Speaker 1: see Rosie's body like just gets like almost get sucked
Speaker 1: out of the window, like she just fell into the screen.
Speaker 1: But it looked like she fell backwards into like a
Speaker 1: portal to another dimension. And you've never seen me run
Speaker 1: so fast, like I go, oh fuck, and I like
Speaker 1: run out the front door and I get to her
Speaker 1: so quick, and then I go.
Speaker 3: I go, oh my god, wro'sy are you okay?
Speaker 1: She goes you got here so fast, it's like you teleported.
Speaker 3: I was like, yeah, I mean, it just takes one
Speaker 3: of your kids.
Speaker 1: I mean she fell out into essentially like a soft
Speaker 1: garden of like little trees and bushes and stuff, so
Speaker 1: like it wasn't but she was very shocked and upset, obviously,
Speaker 1: as anybody would be.
Speaker 2: And I was just like, yeah, you guys watching her
Speaker 2: little legs dangle must have been funny, though, I to laugh.
Speaker 2: I know that iar in panic, but then.
Speaker 1: Right I was like, I guess these fucking screens are
Speaker 1: not really in there very tight, so we'll be keeping
Speaker 1: the windows closed from now on. But it was funny anyway.
Speaker 1: She was so excited to tell everybody at school today
Speaker 1: how she fell out of a window. She was like,
Speaker 1: I can't wait to tell my teacher, my friends, my
Speaker 1: after school.
Speaker 3: Like she's excited, so, you know, she loves a little story.
Speaker 3: But got it.
Speaker 1: I don't know if I don't know, if I'm like, yeah,
Speaker 1: I don't know that I'm whatever. I would never push
Speaker 1: my kids into any career, so let alone. Like, but
Speaker 1: my mom never really pushed my brother into being a doctor.
Speaker 1: I think she was like, you're good at that, and
Speaker 1: he was good at it, you know, he was good
Speaker 1: at the chemistry and the classes and stuff, but we
Speaker 1: were never like like, when I told my mom I
Speaker 1: was a theater major, she goes, could you major in
Speaker 1: one more thing? And so I majored in creative writing
Speaker 1: equally pointless, I mean, like great for me, but like
Speaker 1: equally not money making, you know, so like but that's
Speaker 1: like as most as I can think of as my
Speaker 1: mom ever, like pressuring me to do well.
Speaker 2: It's also fresh because I just I namesh Patel his
Speaker 2: Netflix specials coming out in April good Friend. But he's
Speaker 2: just been doing shows at New York Comedy Club and
Speaker 2: it's a moment. It's a big Indian audience, so obviously
Speaker 2: the topics come up, but they're oh yeah, yeah, yeah, yeah,
Speaker 2: but there were So he does a joke where he
Speaker 2: was doing a show in Texas and someone like passed out, fainted,
Speaker 2: stroke something had and thirty doctors stood up at a
Speaker 2: Patel show.
Speaker 3: Thirty He's like, everyone was rushing too.
Speaker 1: It's like edit in Mesh show, you don't say is
Speaker 1: there a doctor in the room. You're like, is there
Speaker 1: a cardiac pulmonologist in the room? And then you probably
Speaker 1: have to sift out between the four of them.
Speaker 2: So, oh, actually, I have my flight to LA got
Speaker 2: diverted medical emergency. We stopped at Kansas City for like
Speaker 2: an hour. Someone had to be taken. They asked for
Speaker 2: a doctor, then they asked for a certain medication if
Speaker 2: anyone had and.
Speaker 3: Then we had to ground the plane.
Speaker 1: Oh my gosh, yeah, wait that reminds me they were
Speaker 1: class so I couldn't see who it was like, I
Speaker 1: couldn't see the commotion. My mom has gotten up on
Speaker 1: a plane before when they've asked for a doctor, and
Speaker 1: she is a pediatrician, and she's usually a bottle of
Speaker 1: wine deep on the plane. So I don't know, maybe
Speaker 1: we should just check before we ask for doctors. Well,
Speaker 1: a lot of doctors won't do it because of malpractice stuff.
Speaker 1: Oh yeah, yeah, yeah, you're like, and some are drinking.
Speaker 1: Some are like, this isn't my responsibility.
Speaker 3: I had a drink. I'm not doing that.
Speaker 1: Yeah yeah, well not my mom. She's like, let me
Speaker 1: in there. You need you need a Maxa sell in.
Speaker 2: Well, so wait, this is still at the Nemesta show.
Speaker 2: So then there's two twenty two year olds. So right
Speaker 2: away I go, are you guys children or human? You know,
Speaker 2: look grown up? They were twenty two. I'm like, oh,
Speaker 2: that means you just graduated. They're Indian. I go, what's
Speaker 2: your major? And he goes psychology And out of the
Speaker 2: whole room only one woman gasps and joy and she
Speaker 2: was white and I just had the field day. I
Speaker 2: was like, this is so funny. I'm like the rest
Speaker 2: of your people are living at you. It's so disappointed.
Speaker 1: I'm like, you only got a gasp from this white
Speaker 1: Like I was crazy.
Speaker 3: It was just so fun, so funny. His audience was
Speaker 3: just so much fun.
Speaker 2: It was also ask for Sunday and they all have jobs,
Speaker 2: so like when people are out on a Sunday night,
Speaker 2: you know they're down for a good night.
Speaker 1: Yeah, yeah, that's fun. Yeah, you know what I was
Speaker 1: gonna say. Though, I don't know if you remember talking
Speaker 1: about this on the episode Manic that we did. We
Speaker 1: talked about gabapentin or whatever, okay, like that was the drug.
Speaker 3: That that was the drug in real life.
Speaker 1: I think that, like whatever, they still prescribe that to people.
Speaker 1: I just heard Tricksy talk about gabapentin for like twenty
Speaker 1: minutes on her podcast that she took for a muscle
Speaker 1: relax or or like she took for a muscle issue.
Speaker 1: People were writing us so many people were writing into
Speaker 1: our Instagram, going I give that to my dog, like
Speaker 1: they give gabapentin for like everything, And I was like, wait, what,
Speaker 1: like maybe they've changed the makeup of it or something.
Speaker 1: But like I was like, in our episode, it was
Speaker 1: like making people have really and some people actually wrote
Speaker 1: and said I had really bad like like suicidal ideation
Speaker 1: and like bad dreams and stuff like that when I
Speaker 1: was on it. So it's not totally like a reformed
Speaker 1: drug or anything. But they're still giving it out like wild,
Speaker 1: they're given anything. They don't give a fuck. Yeah, they
Speaker 1: don't give a fuck.
Speaker 3: Yeah.
Speaker 2: But all of a sudden, did you see RFK All
Speaker 2: of a sudden, like, actually you need to get vaxed? Yeah,
Speaker 2: actually you need to get vax And it's like, oh,
Speaker 2: you think having a bunch of fucking freaks and power,
Speaker 2: Like what the fuck?
Speaker 1: The week before he was like, measles is actually great
Speaker 1: for you, Like it actually it's character building, Like it's
Speaker 1: actually perfect for you, and get it and you should
Speaker 1: want it. And then the next week was like, actually,
Speaker 1: go get your vaxes, Like what a nut? I can't
Speaker 1: I count with that, man, I don't think. I just
Speaker 1: think we should just like turn him off, not listen
Speaker 1: to him. Also, did you know that the new Pete
Speaker 1: Buttera Jedge, the new Transportation Secretary, is Shawn Duffy from
Speaker 1: the Real World. He was on the Real World. He's
Speaker 1: married to Rachel from the Real World. Who was Pedro's
Speaker 1: best friend. I'm like, Pedro's his grave right now, go la,
Speaker 1: I forgot what Arley like early nineties, yes, early the
Speaker 1: early seasons.
Speaker 3: And they have nine kids, and he's the new Pete
Speaker 3: budda jite.
Speaker 2: How do you do that job with nine kids? You
Speaker 2: shouldn't be able to work when you have that many kids.
Speaker 2: How are you in the government? Go take care of
Speaker 2: your kids?
Speaker 1: And he's the one like that's all over the place
Speaker 1: being like, what's this congestion pricing in New York City?
Speaker 1: And it's like, I really don't think you know anything
Speaker 1: about New York City. I think you should let New
Speaker 1: York City do whatever they want.
Speaker 2: You know, what we did need is some high power
Speaker 2: of rails and you shut that down, So go fuck yourself, whatever, whatever, whatever.
Speaker 3: Yeah, I don't know.
Speaker 2: I'm just disassociating as much as possible.
Speaker 3: Yeah, look, we have to find who is this a roach?
Speaker 3: I light it.
Speaker 1: We have to find joy wherever we can, and I
Speaker 1: will in two short weeks be taking my children to
Speaker 1: Lego Lands. And I already bring that up. I told
Speaker 1: you guys, you practice up. Actually, I would say three
Speaker 1: weeks in a row. No one has sent me Lego
Speaker 1: Land tips I need them. No, it's fine. I think
Speaker 1: it's fine. I don't think I need any tips. But
Speaker 1: and then I know, I'm like, what else is?
Speaker 3: What else is? What else am I looking forward to?
Speaker 1: I have a lot of birthday parties coming up, a
Speaker 1: lot of kids' birthday parties, a lot of kid birthday parties.
Speaker 3: I do not know what to do.
Speaker 2: I think I'm just looking forward to being on the
Speaker 2: road and going about my life, living my dream well
Speaker 2: before it's taken away.
Speaker 3: And then I do want to do. I have a
Speaker 3: volunteer things.
Speaker 2: I do want to get more involved in a more real,
Speaker 2: consistent way in my community. And I always say that
Speaker 2: and then I don't do it. But that is you know,
Speaker 2: the Kevin Bacon Foundation woman Stacey that she told me
Speaker 2: it's the antidote to hopelessness.
Speaker 3: Yeah, And I'm always buying supplies, I'm always sending stuff.
Speaker 2: I'm about to do some ridafon for someone's kid, like
Speaker 2: I'm always, you know, like, but that's not what I want.
Speaker 2: I want to be involved with humans that something and
Speaker 2: people sent recommendations and I brought this up in the past,
Speaker 2: but I think that's what I need to look forward
Speaker 2: to it because I'm disassociating but being so self centered
Speaker 2: in the process, like it's all about just me. My
Speaker 2: show is my friend, my show like the TV shows
Speaker 2: I like to watch, Like I need to open up.
Speaker 3: No, it does.
Speaker 1: I mean the twenty sixteen election is what got me
Speaker 1: to be a casa, you know, like that's what led
Speaker 1: me to do that. And then with this election, I
Speaker 1: am like, I'm volunteering a lot for this place that
Speaker 1: a bunch of moms started in a life, for the
Speaker 1: people who lost everything in the fires. It's like a
Speaker 1: little store that we're running for people that they can
Speaker 1: just come and take anything they want. And so I've
Speaker 1: been volunteering there and then I'm even trying to do
Speaker 1: like trying to get do more stuff. So yeah, I
Speaker 1: think that's like the best way, like just try to
Speaker 1: support and if you're the kind of verson's like I
Speaker 1: literally don't have a minute in my day, yes, sending
Speaker 1: money or or spreading awareness.
Speaker 3: Like everybody has to.
Speaker 1: Volunteer within the confines of their capabilities, you know, like
Speaker 1: if you don't have time to go work at a
Speaker 1: soup kitchen.
Speaker 3: Five days a week, that's okay, you know, just.
Speaker 1: Do what you can, because it has been like I
Speaker 1: don't know, at least post La and the fires, it
Speaker 1: feels like everybody really got came together to help people,
Speaker 1: and that gives me faith in humanity.
Speaker 2: Like even though well Esther's co host, I think I
Speaker 2: mentioned her last episode on my La Trip Kalila, their podcast.
Speaker 3: Trush Tuesday lost her home. Oh she did you told
Speaker 3: me that? Yeah?
Speaker 2: Well I didn't. I know, I only know her casually,
Speaker 2: mostly through the internet. So but we we like met
Speaker 2: in a different apartment, like in a place where Esther
Speaker 2: had a confusing time getting in the gate, and I'm like,
Speaker 2: they're best friends. What's going on? And it's because the
Speaker 2: house burned down? Oh wow, it lost everything. Damn damn.
Speaker 1: Listen, let's get started. Let's get started. We've got a
Speaker 1: classic f today, so let's get going.
Speaker 2: All right, we are getting into a greatly named episode
Speaker 2: I would say top ten of SV history Hooked Hooked.
Speaker 2: So there's I would say, five metaphors, five layers. Honestly,
Speaker 2: could be like a college essay prompt, like explain all
Speaker 2: the different ways Hooked is involved in this episode.
Speaker 3: Yes, I think a great Ideeah.
Speaker 1: So if there's out there there should be a college
Speaker 1: course on his view. I mean, there's a college course
Speaker 1: on Taylor Swift's lyrics. I feel that there could be
Speaker 1: a college course on his view and off frankly, we
Speaker 1: could teach it. So I think we're available if any
Speaker 1: universities online.
Speaker 2: I truly, I mean, this is annoying. But this person
Speaker 2: annoyed me. But he always annoys me. I'll say his name,
Speaker 2: we'll bleep it. Please bleep it. Yeah, always fucking trying
Speaker 2: to poke a hole in something. Negmy put me on
Speaker 2: my place. He's always got something to fucking say. And
Speaker 2: I basically was talking about my friend's roommate who almost
Speaker 2: killed me right by leaving the stove on. Do you remember,
Speaker 2: like snapping on the couch, he left the house of
Speaker 2: stoves on. So I'm talking and I'm like, oh my god,
Speaker 2: you know his roommate tried to murder me. I've been
Speaker 2: like on edge. I keep like thinking he's gonna arrive
Speaker 2: in the house, like even though he doesn't live there,
Speaker 2: and then minutes go by, minutes go by, and then
Speaker 2: this person goes, I mean, after I tell the story, goes.
Speaker 2: You know, you said murdered. He didn't try to murder
Speaker 2: you. You kind of didn't really sell this story. I go,
Speaker 2: what are you talking about? Are you playing semantic games
Speaker 2: right now? Will you alluded to something else? I go, fine,
Speaker 2: I didn't realize we were in court. It would be
Speaker 2: in voluntary manslaughter. I don't give a shit. I would
Speaker 2: be dead.
Speaker 3: What are you doing? And when we're comedians, we all
Speaker 3: talk in hyperbole. That is so fucking wise, so annoying,
Speaker 3: so annoying.
Speaker 2: And it was like at dinnerer And then also it
Speaker 2: was like a few now everyone will know, but no,
Speaker 2: no one cares about me that much. But like, and
Speaker 2: then this pissed me off. But it was three women
Speaker 2: and one man going out to dinner and he was
Speaker 2: gonna sit in the booth. And I decide, I go,
Speaker 2: are you out of your fucking mind? He goes, what,
Speaker 2: I go, this is why you can. I'm like, you
Speaker 2: would fucking take the booth when there's three girls? I go,
Speaker 2: And he'd had no idea about that, And I'm like,
Speaker 2: that's probably why your life sucks.
Speaker 3: I don't know what to tell you.
Speaker 2: For you to think that you should have a booth
Speaker 2: over one of the girls is insane to me.
Speaker 1: Like, you mean the inside of the booth. Now we're
Speaker 1: all sitting together.
Speaker 2: Yeah, but you know sometimes it's like a booth in
Speaker 2: two chairs.
Speaker 3: Oh, not a bad booth. I apologize.
Speaker 1: He was getting he was taking the comfy seat, Okay, No,
Speaker 1: I stopped him.
Speaker 2: He goes, I would take it. I go, no, you're not.
Speaker 2: You're sitting on this fucking chair. Are you out of
Speaker 2: your mind?
Speaker 3: And that's all based on what you're talking about.
Speaker 2: That's I guess I could tell other people that I
Speaker 2: was insane at the dinner too, now that I'm thinking
Speaker 2: about it.
Speaker 1: Liza wouldn't was telling me where to sit and was
Speaker 1: accusing people of murder. That's his version of the story.
Speaker 2: No, but then I talked about my monoxide PTSD and
Speaker 2: how it was like three months. Yeahle not listening and helping,
Speaker 2: and he started taking the fire fire's side.
Speaker 1: Yeah.
Speaker 2: He was like, well, yeah, like they didn't find it.
Speaker 2: That's not I go, but that's their fucking job. I go,
Speaker 2: the raidar said monoxide. They left a citizen in a
Speaker 2: monoxide house without finding the source. I go, why are
Speaker 2: you defending these firefighters? I go, this is bonkers. You're
Speaker 2: you're a maniac. I go, you're truly a maniac, and
Speaker 2: I don't want to hang out with you anymore. Like
Speaker 2: I can't. I can't. I can't just be on trial
Speaker 2: at all times, like I'm so sorry I didn't say
Speaker 2: he involuntarily manslaughtered me, Like, but in my head, I'm like,
Speaker 2: is that even the true thing? But I act like
Speaker 2: I know, I act like I like when I talk
Speaker 2: about your regie, I truly am like I am his lawyer,
Speaker 2: and that's the way I like.
Speaker 3: I truly am that in my head.
Speaker 2: And I can't, like, God forbid, the day I get
Speaker 2: into a fight with a real lawyer out in the world,
Speaker 2: I'm going to lose.
Speaker 3: Okay, it's hooked. It's Hooked.
Speaker 2: Season six episodes air date February fifteenth, two thousand and five.
Speaker 2: So a post V Day situation. So we're stargazing. It's
Speaker 2: a lesson for some telescope boys, and of course they're
Speaker 2: young boys. They're going to start spying on topless women
Speaker 2: that are right out of the showers.
Speaker 1: I think the shower and my daughter is a cub
Speaker 1: scout right now, the girls are in so.
Speaker 2: So the teacher obviously goes over and is like, hey,
Speaker 2: quits spying, and but then one of the boys sees
Speaker 2: something bad.
Speaker 3: What is it?
Speaker 2: It's a dead woman on a roof, So Benson and
Speaker 2: Stabler with a uniformed cop giving them the low down
Speaker 2: on what the roof boy scouts saw. Sailor makes a
Speaker 2: joke about merit badges inappropriate. So there's a bag in
Speaker 2: the alley next to the building and we find an
Speaker 2: ID and it says Alison Downey. The address is in
Speaker 2: Yonkers and not a bench. This is a millennium. This
Speaker 2: is a very high end episode of shopping and I
Speaker 2: love it. This episode's for the girls. So the so
Speaker 2: Melinda is on the scene and she goes, I mean,
Speaker 2: I bet that's a good address in Yonkers because this
Speaker 2: stress is eight hundred dollars and maybe she knows about
Speaker 2: the dress from her sister who works at Sacks.
Speaker 3: So yes, that's that's.
Speaker 1: Which was one of our That was one of our
Speaker 1: quiz show questions that I think was one of the
Speaker 1: hardest ones ever.
Speaker 2: Yeah, because I already don't even remember what episode we
Speaker 2: learn that in.
Speaker 1: It's like fucked up. I would put, Yeah, her sister's
Speaker 1: a buyer for Sacks. It's also like, I know if
Speaker 1: I'm looking if I'm like, oh wow, this is a
Speaker 1: Proda dress. This is a Mumer dress. This is a
Speaker 1: dull chain of bonness. Man'm like, I know it's expensive,
Speaker 1: but I don't ever really know how much, you know.
Speaker 1: I'm like, I don't know, what is this twelve hundred
Speaker 1: two grand, Like I don't know.
Speaker 2: Yeah, So, Melinda says cracked skull was something blunt and heavy,
Speaker 2: no weapon recovered, no fluids, but panties are pulled down
Speaker 2: and there is trauma to the vaginal area. And again,
Speaker 2: this is not a sentence I would love you. It
Speaker 2: makes me question everything I say.
Speaker 3: True.
Speaker 1: I always think about the fact that if my computer
Speaker 1: gets caught, like discovered or something, or I don't know,
Speaker 1: like how much how many bad keywords I have written
Speaker 1: in my Google docs and on my computer, Like if
Speaker 1: you just were to like search the word rape on
Speaker 1: my computer, it would come up like dozens, if not
Speaker 1: hundreds of times.
Speaker 2: And it's like, I don't know, and they would probably
Speaker 2: arrest you sooner than they would arrest a real rapist.
Speaker 1: So yeah, they'd be like she had I mean, like literally,
Speaker 1: they tell the press that she had information of interest
Speaker 1: on her laptop or something like that, and then it's like,
Speaker 1: oh wait, but nobody put together. She has a podcast
Speaker 1: about this, and by then my reputation's ruined. You know,
Speaker 1: I thought about it. I thought it through.
Speaker 2: So she has been dead for twenty to twenty four hours,
Speaker 2: which means that between eight and midnight the night before
Speaker 2: this could have occurred. And both roof doors are locked
Speaker 2: from the inside, so maybe the purpose like lives in
Speaker 2: the building. Munchin Fin are going to do a canvas
Speaker 2: and then Benson and Stable are going to go to
Speaker 2: Yonkers to do the no notification to the parents.
Speaker 3: The mom.
Speaker 2: We cut to the mom holding the driver's license, going,
Speaker 2: that's Allison, that's my daughter. She's crying. She saw her
Speaker 2: daughter yesterday morning. She's been living with her like since
Speaker 2: she graduated college.
Speaker 3: Normal.
Speaker 2: I mean, they were ahead of their times with that,
Speaker 2: like we're all moving back. But the mom says she
Speaker 2: goes to the city to hang with her friends and
Speaker 2: stays overnight. That's I just relate to that. And then
Speaker 2: she has a boyfriend who lives in Boston. But then
Speaker 2: the door rattles and who walks in. It's fucking Allison.
Speaker 2: I mean, can you believe the trauma to the joy?
Speaker 2: I like can't even imagine that, like kind of wave
Speaker 2: of emotions.
Speaker 1: It's kind of like what every mom like wishes what
Speaker 1: happen when when this, you know, like it's oh my god,
Speaker 1: it's so yeah yeah.
Speaker 2: But to me, I'm like, you guys are detectives for
Speaker 2: you to not see that the IDs didn't match or
Speaker 2: you would at least like match the DNA from the idea,
Speaker 2: like I can't. I am curious at what the fuck
Speaker 2: because they do look different to me, like the photo,
Speaker 2: they do look different. So it's weird. But I guess
Speaker 2: you don't question that's not your instinct. But I would
Speaker 2: feel for some of the best investigators in Manhattan, they
Speaker 2: would take a double shit.
Speaker 1: Show a crime sceam photo, show her a photo of
Speaker 1: the body, you know, of the body too much.
Speaker 2: But you know, great television, great television, And this is
Speaker 2: one of like eight.
Speaker 3: This episode's amazing. I can't believe we are doing it.
Speaker 1: This is up there with when they go into ID
Speaker 1: and they go, it's not her, it's not her, it's
Speaker 1: not her, you know, like yeah.
Speaker 2: So she hugs her daughter, oh my, and she goes,
Speaker 2: they said you were dead. They said you were dead.
Speaker 2: The daughter's like whoa. She has an amazing blonde blowout,
Speaker 2: and we get to the credits. So now Allison's talking
Speaker 2: to the cops and like where they found the ID
Speaker 2: and it was in the murder victims per s babe,
Speaker 2: and she's like, oh, I lost mine and I got
Speaker 2: a new one, so I guess. And then Benson picks
Speaker 2: up a framed photo and there's a girl who it's
Speaker 2: it's at the actual dead body. Oh so now you
Speaker 2: can figure it out, Benson. So Alison goes, that's my cousin, Lisa.
Speaker 2: She lives in Queens. Allison starts crying and trying to lie,
Speaker 2: but she then admits she gave her ID to Lisa,
Speaker 2: who just turned fifteen. That's so young. But she was
Speaker 2: going out with a college guy and she wanted to
Speaker 2: go to clubs in concerts with him. But Alison's like,
Speaker 2: she didn't do drugs. She was like kind of a door,
Speaker 2: which I didn't. I didn't think it would be a
Speaker 2: bad idea. She never got in trouble. She doesn't know
Speaker 2: the college guy's name. She's crying hardcore and you know
Speaker 2: she did kind of like help her cousin be killed.
Speaker 3: Maybe, So she feels bad.
Speaker 2: And she is dead, and thank god, she's reacting how
Speaker 2: you would react if your cousin is dead, because the
Speaker 2: rest of the people we meet here snakes. Okay, So
Speaker 2: we're in Melinda's house. We see the dead girl on
Speaker 2: a slab and yeah, the girl has a Sarah bro cerebral.
Speaker 2: The girl has a god I want fruity pebbles. Okay,
Speaker 2: a cerebral hemorrhage from blunt force trauma. I feel like
Speaker 2: I kept trying to say cereal instead of cerebral.
Speaker 3: Okay, blunt force trauma.
Speaker 2: She thinks it like it was a metallic and rounded
Speaker 2: end weapon, but she can't really figure it out. She
Speaker 2: also has a bruise on her face that's like four
Speaker 2: to six weeks old, and it's sad.
Speaker 3: She's only fifteen. And Stabler's pissed.
Speaker 2: He's like, what kind of parents let their daughter go
Speaker 2: out clubbing on a school night? And Melinda goes, well,
Speaker 2: you can get ask the dad, go bully him. You
Speaker 2: know he's here. The dad identifies the body. He's crying.
Speaker 2: He's so sad. He can't believe it. She told him
Speaker 2: she was just going out for pizza with some friends.
Speaker 2: I mean, are you gonna AirTag your kids. What do
Speaker 2: you think you're going to do? Oh no, just follow
Speaker 2: like share location.
Speaker 3: By the time they're doing that kind of thing.
Speaker 1: I feel like they're going to have one of these
Speaker 1: little watches that a lot of the kids have, which
Speaker 1: I think are like so that you can text and
Speaker 1: call but no other apps, and I think you can.
Speaker 3: I think that has GPS. Cool. I think I'll have to.
Speaker 2: So he saw her Monday morning, the dad, but he's
Speaker 2: a truck driver, so you know, before he left on
Speaker 2: his long haul, he said bye, and then she called
Speaker 2: him to do the pizza check in that afternoon before
Speaker 2: she was killed. She and she left the day in
Speaker 2: her school uniform. Stabler's a dick though, and is like
Speaker 2: you sure about that. Sabler calms down a bit after
Speaker 2: the dad is visically just you know, upset his daughter's
Speaker 2: and they explained that she was wearing an eight hundred
Speaker 2: dollars dress.
Speaker 3: He confuses him.
Speaker 2: He doesn't know about an older guy or dating sugar.
Speaker 2: Dad like he doesn't know any how she would get
Speaker 2: the dress or the job, or who she was. Hey,
Speaker 2: you know the her mother died nine months ago, so
Speaker 2: double sad. So they leave the dad to sob which
Speaker 2: I think is nice. And then we're at the Catholic school.
Speaker 2: The lady in charge there says that she went to
Speaker 2: all her classes on Monday, so she know she doesn't
Speaker 2: get in trouble. She also says that Lisa would be
Speaker 2: the last kid she would think something like this would
Speaker 2: happen to because after her mom died, she became like
Speaker 2: the head of the household and she had to like
Speaker 2: keep the house in checks since her.
Speaker 3: Dad's always on the road.
Speaker 2: The mom, you know, is dead, and so she cooked clean,
Speaker 2: did schoolwork just but was alone a lot. And then
Speaker 2: when the kid and so the principal explains, when the
Speaker 2: kids don't get the attention and affection they need, they
Speaker 2: look for it elsewhere. And the only time she had
Speaker 2: to call her in was over the sex bracelets. But
Speaker 2: she's like, I feel like that was just peer pressure
Speaker 2: and say blurt sex bracelets. You know, he can't believe it,
Speaker 2: the principle, even though I think there was a season
Speaker 2: three episode about the sex bracelets, you know what I mean?
Speaker 1: Yeah, there was a blow job party one too. I'm
Speaker 1: going to talk a little bit later.
Speaker 2: Ye, the principal takes out a bunch you know, sex
Speaker 2: bracelets from the drawer. Basically, the girls wear them to
Speaker 2: indicate which sex sex are willing to perform. So the
Speaker 2: colors are like hugging, there's a kissing, a lap dance
Speaker 2: that's kind of fun and creative, a oral sex, and
Speaker 2: then you know, all the way all the girls were
Speaker 2: wearing it. But she can't, you know, she doesn't know
Speaker 2: like who did it for, you know, attention and who
Speaker 2: did it because they were acting on the sexual stuff.
Speaker 2: So they go to talk to her best friend Angela
Speaker 2: and Ganlly, and of course it is Hayden Pantare back
Speaker 2: for her second Sview episode. She was a little kid
Speaker 2: in an episode called Abuse from It's a Wild Jump.
Speaker 2: It's only four seasons. Abuse was season two and this
Speaker 2: is season six right now.
Speaker 3: That's four seasons.
Speaker 2: I feel like they gave little Michael what's his name,
Speaker 2: Michael O'Keeffe.
Speaker 1: I'm just like, yeah, I'm just seeing the ohum kids,
Speaker 1: Like I know, kids grow up quick.
Speaker 3: But she was like a tiny little Olivia comes spend
Speaker 3: the day with me, and.
Speaker 1: Then four seasons later she's like a high school babe,
Speaker 1: you know, like, I don't know, make wearing a sex bracelet.
Speaker 3: It's like it's just was a jump for me.
Speaker 1: Yeah, I get what you mean. But and then to
Speaker 1: grow up fast. These kids grow up fast. Obviously you're
Speaker 1: gonna get Hayden pan a teer back as much as
Speaker 1: you can. Yeah, and she's not our guest.
Speaker 2: If you were wondering, We're going to talk to Hayden
Speaker 2: Panitar later today.
Speaker 1: It's not.
Speaker 2: Panater also reminds me of just like some like a panchetta,
Speaker 2: like it kind of makes you want to eat it
Speaker 2: like a deli meat like oh, or like panatone.
Speaker 3: Yeah, but what is that?
Speaker 2: Panatone is like an Italian Christmas cake? Oh yeah, no
Speaker 2: I don't but I've never had that. And I don't
Speaker 2: like panapata either.
Speaker 3: Yeah.
Speaker 2: No, I'm thinking like pshoot, Like it makes me feel
Speaker 2: like I just I want to meet so bad.
Speaker 3: Right now pan tear. Yeah.
Speaker 2: For me, she's remembered that Titans that was That's like
Speaker 2: the big thing for me.
Speaker 1: I didn't even watch Heroes, but that was so big
Speaker 1: and she was the cheerleader. It was like save the cheerleaders,
Speaker 1: save the world, Like I think NBC at that point,
Speaker 1: because Heroes was NBC, Like I think they were, Like
Speaker 1: she's in our pipeline.
Speaker 2: You know, we love her. Yeah, and then was Nashville
Speaker 2: NBC too. I wonder if she was a company now wes.
Speaker 2: I hope she has a Lindsay Lohan style comeback.
Speaker 1: Just no, Nashville was ABC. She made a jump. Oh wow,
Speaker 1: and now we have Hayden.
Speaker 2: She's in a ponytail Catholic schoolgirl caller and she says
Speaker 2: they wore the berry slits to school and it's a
Speaker 2: walk and talk. She and Angela says. She actually named
Speaker 2: them sex bracelets. So she's cool. But none of them
Speaker 2: have boyfriends, and they love studying. They don't have time
Speaker 2: for boyfriends because they're studying. They all want to go
Speaker 2: to college. But she really doesn't seem upset about her
Speaker 2: best friend dying in the at all. She's like, I
Speaker 2: got to get to Spanish class. Like truly, you'd think
Speaker 2: the school would make an announcement of like if anyone
Speaker 2: needs to go to the school therapist or take a
Speaker 2: break like our fellow classmate, your best friend has been
Speaker 2: found brutally murdered on a roof. But yeah, I guess
Speaker 2: you got to get to Spanish class, so skip on
Speaker 2: a over there. But once she goes to class. Stabler goes, yeah,
Speaker 2: I'm actually stuck on this. Well, teenage girls are too
Speaker 2: busy for boyfriends. I don't get I'm not into that.
Speaker 2: I don't buy it. Benson gets a call from Taru.
Speaker 2: Morales has something and they jog up the stairs. Really cute.
Speaker 2: Lisa's BlackBerry is what's been found by the dumpster near
Speaker 2: where the body was, And first it was jumped on
Speaker 2: and ruined on purpose. Water got inside of it. But
Speaker 2: of course it's Morales. He got some data out of
Speaker 2: the SIM card and she went to one website over
Speaker 2: and over and over again, and it's hot personals dot net,
Speaker 2: a teen singles website. You would think that the government
Speaker 2: would shut that down. Does that exist and has it
Speaker 2: ever existed? Like that doesn't seem like a thing that's
Speaker 2: ever existed, a teen singles web.
Speaker 3: I mean, like we've had friends or we've had MySpace.
Speaker 1: You can hook up on these sites, but like they're
Speaker 1: disguised as friend sites. They're not like, Hi, I'm fifteen,
Speaker 1: I'm single. Like what you'd think that that would be
Speaker 1: shut down for sure.
Speaker 3: For sure.
Speaker 2: But this reminds me of something actually very wholesome from
Speaker 2: the Internet. But Coleman Domingo. I was watching an interview
Speaker 2: and he met his partner of now nineteen years from
Speaker 2: a Craigslist miss connections.
Speaker 1: I have a friend who's married from a Craigslist misconnection.
Speaker 2: I think it's like the coolest thing, and it's such
Speaker 2: a period of time, Like I wonder if it's still,
Speaker 2: like I just am obsessed. He was on it for
Speaker 2: something else. He's like, I guess I'll check, and then
Speaker 2: he realized it was him and like, oh my god,
Speaker 2: I don't know.
Speaker 3: I love it. I think they kind of exist on Instagram.
Speaker 1: I've seen them before, like I think, but they just
Speaker 1: don't go like it's just not the same, you know,
Speaker 1: like you used to be able to just go to
Speaker 1: your city and like scan and it would be like
Speaker 1: lady in the camel coat, Like that's how my friend.
Speaker 3: Got met her husband.
Speaker 1: Oh yeah, Like they were on the same flight and
Speaker 1: he was like, you were in like seat whatever, this
Speaker 1: camel coat married child children.
Speaker 3: Wow. Yeah, all right.
Speaker 2: So basically we're on you know, Lisa's page. Her likes
Speaker 2: her tattoos and six packs, her dislikes her piercings and
Speaker 2: ugly guys.
Speaker 3: Her handle is Queen's teen and yeah.
Speaker 2: So basically they go talk to someone who's a neighbor
Speaker 2: of Lisa, and the torp's like, Lisa, who and it's like,
Speaker 2: I don't know, maybe the woman that's been murdered, the
Speaker 2: girl the class like shut the fuck up, I'm sick
Speaker 2: of everyone, arrests everyone. And so they had a photo
Speaker 2: of Lisa to him and he's like, oh, yeah, yeah, yeah,
Speaker 2: he you know, he hooked up with her for a while,
Speaker 2: but that was months ago.
Speaker 3: Friends with Benefits.
Speaker 2: Munch asks why the benefits stopped, and then it cuts
Speaker 2: to Stabler talking to another teen, so you know what
Speaker 2: we're doing, just like a relay race of teens and detectives,
Speaker 2: and so he's like, well, how long you know were
Speaker 2: you and Lisa dating? And he goes, only ugly people date,
Speaker 2: and then he goes, I gotta fly and Stabler grabs
Speaker 2: him like, bitch, what the fuck?
Speaker 3: Who is she hooking up with?
Speaker 2: And then it cuts to Benson, who's talking to a
Speaker 2: girl who answers the question practically every cute guy at
Speaker 2: the school. The girl was on a mission and Benson goes,
Speaker 2: you weren't, and she goes, well, I'm into girls, and
Speaker 2: actually so was Lisa for a while, okay, season six,
Speaker 2: and then she started doing older guys she met on
Speaker 2: the internet. And Benson's like, wait, she wasn't scared to
Speaker 2: meet like men from the internet that she didn't know.
Speaker 2: And the girl goes, why would she be love that
Speaker 2: love that? We would teach that on our syllabus for
Speaker 2: sure if we were to mess me plus that, what
Speaker 2: is there to be scared of? They have got a
Speaker 2: profile picture and they say everything about themselves.
Speaker 3: What are checking out?
Speaker 2: Yeah? But yeah, she likes old rich men, so that's
Speaker 2: what's up. And then she goes, but Angela would probably
Speaker 2: know about that. So now we find Angela. She's at
Speaker 2: Java Jake's coffee. There's cute groovy flowers stuck around the
Speaker 2: walls and windows. She's typing up a storm on a
Speaker 2: laptop and then she looks shocked to see the detectives,
Speaker 2: closes the laptop.
Speaker 3: Benson kneels down and goes, hey, you.
Speaker 2: Forgot to mention Lisa was hooking up with of queens
Speaker 2: Hayden Panetera says she wasn't doing that anymore, That's why
Speaker 2: she didn't want to mention it, like that was her
Speaker 2: olden days.
Speaker 3: Sailor.
Speaker 2: Then slutshames her outfit and then they're like, you lied
Speaker 2: to us. She goes, I'm sorry. I just didn't want
Speaker 2: you to think that she was a slut and tell
Speaker 2: her dad and then was like, she's gonna get in trouble.
Speaker 2: She's at the More Girl. So then they grill her
Speaker 2: to the old man online. About the old man online,
Speaker 2: they want information. She goes, he was in college and rich,
Speaker 2: but he started getting jealous because she was hooking up
Speaker 2: with everybody that he even hit her once and gave
Speaker 2: her a black eye. Lisa never said that, but I
Speaker 2: knew what was up. His name's Andy Wall. So we're
Speaker 2: in cement room bars with this guy. He is an
Speaker 2: ugly guy, which is a Lisa dislike. So I am
Speaker 2: confused by what's going on here. No offense to the actor.
Speaker 2: It was just like a funny thing. I just said okay,
Speaker 2: And this boyfriend goes, I don't know about the fake ID.
Speaker 1: I you know it's Alison. So they go out. They
Speaker 1: go Lisa.
Speaker 2: Lisa goes, I don't know any Lisa, and then he's like, oh,
Speaker 2: you mean Alison. Then he's also shocked that she's fifteen.
Speaker 2: He is shocked that she is dead, and he is
Speaker 2: shocked that her name is not Alison so Bingo three across.
Speaker 2: That's not what I wanted to say, jackpot, jackpot. He
Speaker 2: says he would never hurt her, but also they split
Speaker 2: up and he hasn't talked to her in months, but
Speaker 2: they have the phone records and they talked all the
Speaker 2: fucking time. And he goes, well, we're just friends. Friends
Speaker 2: talk to each other, and it's like, you just lie.
Speaker 2: I guess they might not have seen each other. They
Speaker 2: just talk on the phone, and that's his little semantics play.
Speaker 2: So he loved her but dumped her because she wanted
Speaker 2: to keep screwing other guys. Can I also say one
Speaker 2: thing the cousin told us. The cousin told us that
Speaker 2: she just turned fifteen, and everyone we're talking about is like, oh,
Speaker 2: we were fucking, but we haven't fucked in months. So
Speaker 2: she was fourteen when she was mostly going around fucking
Speaker 2: all these people, and all.
Speaker 1: These people are like, I thought she was twenty one.
Speaker 1: I'm like, she's fourteen. She's like two years into puberty.
Speaker 1: Like it's so fucking crazy. It is crazy, and I
Speaker 1: didn't even realize that. But it's also like I've performed
Speaker 1: at colleges four. Once you meet these kids and perform
Speaker 1: for them, you know that these people know their children. Yeah,
Speaker 1: I'm sorry, Like when you see a teen, you know
Speaker 1: it's a teen. And I'm sick of people being like
Speaker 1: I just had no idea, Like you did have an
Speaker 1: idea people, It's like, yeah, it's not yeah, talk to
Speaker 1: them for three seconds.
Speaker 2: Yeah, and it's like, we also know that that's what
Speaker 2: you like, Like there's porn categories you like, like like
Speaker 2: you can't have porn categories of a thing and then
Speaker 2: deny the thing that you're actually all into, like it's
Speaker 2: it's weird. Okay, So he loved her but dumped her
Speaker 2: because she wanted to keep screwing other guys. I did
Speaker 2: say that, So I said that again. And he also
Speaker 2: does have an alibi. He was in a study group
Speaker 2: till three am, and all five study buddies have vouched
Speaker 2: for him, So fuck, what are we gonna do? Benson
Speaker 2: and Stable are chatting about the case. Craigan comes by
Speaker 2: and it's basically like, now, what what what Melinda called?
Speaker 3: Drum roll? I mean a sad drum roll.
Speaker 2: Never don't drum roll, Lisa has HIV, so that's had
Speaker 2: she's dead.
Speaker 3: So the show.
Speaker 1: Is obsessed with HIV and first ten seasons they really
Speaker 1: are obsessed, Like we have done so many episodes about it,
Speaker 1: Like I honestly forgot that this episode had an HIV
Speaker 1: component and was like, oh my god. Like again, like
Speaker 1: it's obviously it's great awareness at the time, very important,
Speaker 1: but it's like every season there's like two HIV episodes
Speaker 1: on this show. It's it is kind of it is
Speaker 1: kind of wild. Yeah, but yeah, you are totally right,
Speaker 1: and so now it's less in time. I always love this.
Speaker 2: It's a walk and talk as Melinda is filling Benson
Speaker 2: and Stabler on the statistics of teen TEENHIV so a
Speaker 2: third of teens have an STI and then they go,
Speaker 2: this bitch got around. So basically every kid in Queen's
Speaker 2: is at risk, to be honest, and every positive HIV
Speaker 2: infection is to be reported, but names are kept anonymous,
Speaker 2: so like we can't give the names of everybody, but
Speaker 2: like we do know that she knew she was positive.
Speaker 2: They found traces of anti retrovirals in her blood, so
Speaker 2: a doctor was giving her medication and Stabler is looking
Speaker 2: at the list Melinda gave him of like all of
Speaker 2: the people that Lisa had sex with, all her partners
Speaker 2: that we've compiled from the website. Her phone lists the
Speaker 2: interviews they've conducted, and Stabler recognizes a name. Oh my
Speaker 2: god father mode is activated. He shows up to talk
Speaker 2: to Kathleen asap. She's like, what, Dad, And she's like,
Speaker 2: are you guys getting a divorce? And he goes, no, no, no,
Speaker 2: I just I need to make sure you didn't have
Speaker 2: sex with this guy. He has HIV. So I'm it's
Speaker 2: not as blunt as this. I apologize, guys. He doesn't
Speaker 2: say he doesn't. He doesn't say any of that. He
Speaker 2: doesn't break any hippo rules, don't worry, no, no, no,
Speaker 2: which he but he's done before. You know, he does
Speaker 2: not care when it comes to his children. Okay, so
Speaker 2: she realized, you know, the dad's sailor seems serious. So
Speaker 2: she realizes the seriousness of the moment and answers truthfully
Speaker 2: and she goes, he actually dumped me for not being
Speaker 2: more sexual with him. I wasn't ready. So he hugs her.
Speaker 2: He's fucking, you know, thrilled. He pays extra for Catholic school. Yeah,
Speaker 2: so he kisses her forehead, which I don't know. It
Speaker 2: sickens me. So they're back at least is an apartment
Speaker 2: to talk to the dad and I don't know, does
Speaker 2: he have to know? They have to let him know.
Speaker 2: I know they don't have to. They tell him, listen,
Speaker 2: your daughter also had HIV. This guy's in a fantastic actor.
Speaker 2: He's so sad and they actually have work to do.
Speaker 2: So Benson goes through the girl's closet finds more expensive outfits.
Speaker 2: So they're like, hey, did she have a job. What
Speaker 2: is going on? He goes no, the lounges was only
Speaker 2: twenty five dollars a week. So he's like, I guess
Speaker 2: I don't know anything about my daughter. She's rich and
Speaker 2: has HIV. I had no idea. So they find a
Speaker 2: bag like a shopping bag from her boutique where most
Speaker 2: of her clothes are from, so and in the bag
Speaker 2: are all her pills, and then the pills are prescribed
Speaker 2: from a doctor named doctor Derek Tanner. Everything is a
Speaker 2: Sally Seashell shore thing for me right now. I'm like,
Speaker 2: everything is tongue twister in my mind. And in the
Speaker 2: back of clothes were her pills and in the pills.
Speaker 3: There was a like.
Speaker 2: So we got to go talk to doctor Derek Tanner.
Speaker 2: The doctor obviously can't be like talking about people's medical
Speaker 2: records and texts and like, what's going on? And he goes,
Speaker 2: I did everything I legally could for her. I try
Speaker 2: to do the right thing, but I can't do anything
Speaker 2: and like tell you any information unless you get a
Speaker 2: release from Lisa's father, and then I could tell you
Speaker 2: anything that you need to know. So Benson and Stabler
Speaker 2: leave and are like, okay, so how did she get
Speaker 2: all this money? So like, and I love how they
Speaker 2: jumped from the HIV back to the money so quickly.
Speaker 2: So I'm still like, wait, can we get the release?
Speaker 2: What's going on here? But so they go to the
Speaker 2: store and a worker rushes to them because she's like,
Speaker 2: what are you guys doing here? You seem very poor,
Speaker 2: very civil servant. So the worker like looks up the
Speaker 2: dress though and Lisa that Lisa had on and they
Speaker 2: sold one on Monday with cash, so but she wasn't working.
Speaker 2: But they do have surveillance, so now we're watching the tape,
Speaker 2: and this worker's very helpful, honestly, more helpful than her
Speaker 2: best friend. There's a man there, Brian, one of the managers.
Speaker 2: Brian and Lisa leave to the back together. Fast forward.
Speaker 2: She leaves wearing the dress after being gone for over
Speaker 2: ten minutes, and Brian is there again today. So they
Speaker 2: go to meet him back there and we hear moans
Speaker 2: of passion and pleasure. They follow the moans he's getting
Speaker 2: his dick sucked in a stock room by who Hayden?
Speaker 3: Panitare? Can you believe it? So they Angela Agonelli, you know, shocking.
Speaker 2: So they go to woodroom blinds and she's like, ugh,
Speaker 2: I don't even know what I did wrong, And Benson's like,
Speaker 2: you're selling yourself for clothing, and she goes, it's not sex,
Speaker 2: it's oral the Bill Clinton effect, and so so she goes, whatever,
Speaker 2: it's what I did when I just hooked up, but
Speaker 2: now I get something for it, so whatever. And this
Speaker 2: is actually the one time because the costume and the
Speaker 2: department and everything at Sview is so incredible and professional.
Speaker 2: They have a face black Louis. It'son marricam bag, like
Speaker 2: the logos are. It's clearly fake, but they're pretending it's
Speaker 2: real in the show, going, oh you have this louisv's
Speaker 2: on bag, but it's a it's a it's like even
Speaker 2: the symbols aren't the Louis It's on symbols or the letters,
Speaker 2: Like I don't understand what's happening, because like I wonder
Speaker 2: if they couldn't get clearance, and they were like and
Speaker 2: who will notice? Sure, but why not get like the
Speaker 2: product triangle or the like fake that's less noticeable.
Speaker 1: Like it's such a noticeable because it's everywhere and the
Speaker 1: lv's are gone.
Speaker 2: It just was such a confusing thing because the show
Speaker 2: is so grounded, not reality and like how things move,
Speaker 2: but you know they are.
Speaker 3: It's a realistic show. They use real Yeah.
Speaker 2: Yeah, because when we talk to I remember why Clef,
Speaker 2: I asked about his clothes and they were all really
Speaker 2: really expensive because his character was like the leads, so
Speaker 2: I know that they get expensive shit.
Speaker 3: Yeah, so what the fuck? Confusing?
Speaker 2: But Benson clock say, she goes, that's Louis bit'son bag,
Speaker 2: that's adult ching ub on the top, and those are
Speaker 2: prod Is shoes. So one guy spent that much on you.
Speaker 2: So she gets embarrassed and it's like whatever, it's not
Speaker 2: like I do it all the time. And Stablor goes,
Speaker 2: do you want to wind up? Like Lisa? She doesn't.
Speaker 2: So they were hooking at the mall, but then she
Speaker 2: started using the hotels, so that's the thing. So at
Speaker 2: first they were just fucking around the stock rooms, but
Speaker 2: then Lisa got hooked and started going to the hotels.
Speaker 2: The hotel is the Barrington, so she, you know, starts
Speaker 2: spilling tea, tearing up. She's like, oh, we did it
Speaker 2: for clothes. But then Lisa was so into it. And
Speaker 2: then one time a creep picks us up at the
Speaker 2: mall and he was like, you can make some real
Speaker 2: money if you come to the hotel. So they go
Speaker 2: to the hotel to talk to the man. It is Jerome,
Speaker 2: the front desk employee, and Stabler's undercover as like a
Speaker 2: jerk type of businessman, real sol easy in for a
Speaker 2: good time, looking for a massage.
Speaker 3: So that was.
Speaker 1: Takes us so many fucking directions, so many, I mean,
Speaker 1: we've already had like six Red Herring suspects, like and
Speaker 1: now Morning's undercover.
Speaker 3: Like it's so nuts, Like I had.
Speaker 1: To go back and like rewatch parts of it because
Speaker 1: I was like, wait, where who was that?
Speaker 3: Like it's this one's really.
Speaker 2: Wild it is, and like like there was a black Eye,
Speaker 2: and we have one theory of the black Eye. There's
Speaker 2: gonna be more theory. Like there is just like a
Speaker 2: never ending kind of a cool episode. So basically, Jerome's
Speaker 2: a bad guy. He's a pimpage. He works at this
Speaker 2: hotel and he sends up a young blonde named Brandy upstairs.
Speaker 2: They do a money exchange and he takes out his
Speaker 2: badge and well, first he.
Speaker 3: You know, Sailor's like, why do you do this?
Speaker 2: And her back's turned to him, and she goes, oh,
Speaker 2: you're one of those and he goes, no, I'm one
Speaker 2: of these badge out So it's kind of like cinematic.
Speaker 3: I like it.
Speaker 1: And she's three hundred for the hour and two thousand
Speaker 1: for the night, yeah, which I was like, damn in
Speaker 1: one direction, just like that's this is two thousand and
Speaker 1: five five dollars.
Speaker 3: That's a that's a fucking lot, you know. Yeah.
Speaker 2: But so the exchange, Yeah, so then she's pissed obviously,
Speaker 2: and we're all in cement room bars where with Jerome
Speaker 2: and they're like, we hate you because this motherfucker takes
Speaker 2: seventy percent from the girls seven. But that's so much
Speaker 2: you would think it would be a different split. So
Speaker 2: I don't like it. You're a bad pimp.
Speaker 3: I hate you.
Speaker 2: And he's like, I do know they were underage, and
Speaker 2: they're trying to get info from him, and he's being
Speaker 2: like cage and then they're like, okay, we're gonna tell
Speaker 2: your hotel that you're like a suspect for murder, and
Speaker 2: he slips and goes, wait, Allison's been murdered. So at
Speaker 2: first he was denying knowing who you know Lisa is
Speaker 2: or anyone, and then now he's like, Allison's been murdered,
Speaker 2: so he knows about the youth. So everyone just keeps
Speaker 2: letting it slip that they do know her. Everyone's like,
Speaker 2: I don't know, and then they're like wait her. So
Speaker 2: that just keeps on happening. So then he finally is like, oh,
Speaker 2: I have to give them information or you know, the
Speaker 2: hotel's going to know him a murderer but like or
Speaker 2: suspect it. Either way, the hotel should fire him, like
Speaker 2: he is pimping ye scenes yeah, yeah, they're well they're
Speaker 2: threatening him with that, but it's like, honey, that's a lot.
Speaker 2: They're gonna tell them myself like you cannot work at
Speaker 2: the hotel.
Speaker 1: No, thanks saving your job right now? Now, do you
Speaker 1: want to not go to jail. Let's get some info?
Speaker 2: Yeah, so they go uh so then he's like there's
Speaker 2: a guy who's extra fond of her. And they're like okay,
Speaker 2: and they're like, oh yeah, that's all he wants to see.
Speaker 2: And it's the fucking doctor. It's the HIV doctor, doctor Tanner.
Speaker 2: He's ruining all these kids' lives. So then Lisa's dad,
Speaker 2: so they go to the doctor's office. Lisa's dad is
Speaker 2: beating the shit out of the doctor. The doctor's like,
Speaker 2: I want to press charges. Benson's like shut up, like
Speaker 2: what are you talking about. So then Stabler bullies the
Speaker 2: dad like they're in a little He's like, let me
Speaker 2: do my job. It's my job. And the dad's pacing
Speaker 2: around like my wife's gone, Lisa's gone. Who gives a ship,
Speaker 2: My life doesn't matter. Sablor's wagging his finger, but you know,
Speaker 2: he gets it. And then Stabler hangs his head low
Speaker 2: and leans on a medical exam chair and breathes deep,
Speaker 2: and then he goes, I've seen a lot. Honestly, I
Speaker 2: think this is the nicest I've ever seen Stabler to
Speaker 2: an adult, Like I think for kids maybe, but this
Speaker 2: was you know, he really is, like I mean, he
Speaker 2: relates father. I've seen a lot of good people who
Speaker 2: have lost everything that they thought they had nothing left
Speaker 2: to live for. But you got to keep going. Think
Speaker 2: about Lisa and your wife, what they want to see
Speaker 2: you sitting in prison. You can get through this. And
Speaker 2: he promises to deal with doctor Tanner. Stabler's like, I
Speaker 2: got this, don't you worry. So they have the doctor
Speaker 2: in cement room bars and like Stabler enters with the
Speaker 2: fierceness and energy of ellipsying for your life.
Speaker 1: Like he's He's like, this is my third time on
Speaker 1: the bottom. If I do not fucking get this, I
Speaker 1: am out of here and I need this.
Speaker 2: He's sashe's into that room, and he grabs the guy
Speaker 2: by his hair, pulls him up up from out of
Speaker 2: the chair and keeps repeating, how did it feel?
Speaker 3: And he does the classic like she came on to me.
Speaker 3: I didn't know she was fifteen. Again, you're a doctor,
Speaker 3: so that's even crazier.
Speaker 2: And this must be a breakage of some sort of oath,
Speaker 2: you know, one of the oaths that you take like
Speaker 2: it's you're breaking it. Yeah, and he was actual. So
Speaker 2: this is how this all started. He was in town
Speaker 2: for a doctor's convention. She approached him in the hotel lobby,
Speaker 2: said she was twenty one. Again, he had no idea
Speaker 2: full doctor. He also then was like the sex was acredible.
Speaker 2: I was addicted, maybe another word for addicted, hooked hook.
Speaker 2: He denies killing her, and he's like, I don't care
Speaker 2: about the HIV, I don't care about anything. And then
Speaker 2: he's like, I quit my job in Providence just to
Speaker 2: move closer to her. I gave up everything. I gave
Speaker 2: her everything she wanted. I loved her. Sailors like full disgust,
Speaker 2: face like full disgust, and.
Speaker 3: Then looks him.
Speaker 1: I mean, it's like giving the dad in bayn what's
Speaker 1: the bombshell? Bombshell, It's giving the dad in bombshell. But
Speaker 1: at least that was a grown fucking woman. Yes, she
Speaker 1: was fucking her, using you, but she was a grown woman. Yeah,
Speaker 1: oh my god.
Speaker 2: Uh yeah, So I mean he's Stabler leaves in silence,
Speaker 2: cuts to him bench pressing. He's Benson walks in from
Speaker 2: behind the lockers.
Speaker 3: Stabler sits up you know, out of breath.
Speaker 2: His arms look fucking hot, and he's like, times have changed.
Speaker 2: And Benson goes, well, maybe you've changed, and he goes,
Speaker 2: maybe that's true. And so then he goes and gets
Speaker 2: some water. He leans on the water cooler, you know,
Speaker 2: iced tea rule of acting lean, baby lean. So then
Speaker 2: Benson says, you have great kids, and he goes, well,
Speaker 2: Lisa's father thought the same, and they had to. But
Speaker 2: they have to let the doctor go for murder because
Speaker 2: his work. Alibi did check out, he was at the hospital,
Speaker 2: but like, can't they just get him on stats of
Speaker 2: shory rape? What's what? What's going on? He admitted to
Speaker 2: dating and moving to be with a fifteen year old?
Speaker 2: Arrest him? How was he back at work just because
Speaker 2: he didn't do the murder? Yeah, that I don't get Yeah,
Speaker 2: I don't get that. Sorry, we've become too inside, Like
Speaker 2: I'm just noticing too many little moments.
Speaker 3: Maybe they like and like.
Speaker 1: You said before, back at work, it's like, no, does
Speaker 1: his office not know that he's fucking a fifteen?
Speaker 3: I mean like no, I mean the thing is is like,
Speaker 3: I guess you do you? I guess we did? A
Speaker 3: real kid?
Speaker 1: He didn't know. Do you have the defense that you
Speaker 1: didn't know? I mean, this comes in later, This comes
Speaker 1: in later in the true crime a little bit. But
Speaker 1: like if you're just a guy and you have sex
Speaker 1: with a fifteen year old and you're like, she told
Speaker 1: me she was twenty one, But that's the patriarchy because
Speaker 1: they know, but you can know that in core, like.
Speaker 3: I get it. I'm trying to think legally, is there
Speaker 3: like is there no?
Speaker 1: Because like she showed me an ID and she showed
Speaker 1: me a fake ID or whatever.
Speaker 2: Because remember the case with the NBA player, the Colorado
Speaker 2: one with the double catfish, Yeah, it was she he
Speaker 2: thought she was of age, but he she wasn't. And
Speaker 2: when then the pictures of her went out online, he
Speaker 2: was charged like he was taken in or investigated at least.
Speaker 3: For child porn. Didn't matter.
Speaker 2: Okay, I feel like it doesn't matter because if it's
Speaker 2: like you thought she was twenty but then you uh, yeah,
Speaker 2: it doesn't.
Speaker 3: I don't think it matters.
Speaker 1: Yeah yeah, because I also don't know how you prove it. Yeah, yeah,
Speaker 1: prove that you didn't know?
Speaker 3: You know?
Speaker 2: Yeah, I wonder, But Okay, this guy's even crazier Cara
Speaker 2: because then Benson drops it, like you don't know. Benson
Speaker 2: drops the bomb he's married with a kid back in
Speaker 2: Rhode Island, like you know, he had a full family.
Speaker 2: He ditched the family. And then Tanner has become broke
Speaker 2: out there. He ran out of all his money and
Speaker 2: now he's begging his wife to take him back. So
Speaker 2: I hope she doesn't take him back. He's like, I've
Speaker 2: made a huge mistake. He spent all her all his
Speaker 2: money on Lisa. Stablor goes, maybe Lisa actually didn't want
Speaker 2: him to go, like, let's go talk to the doctor again,
Speaker 2: like maybe something's going on.
Speaker 3: You know.
Speaker 2: Stabler has his thinking face on, you know, we'll see
Speaker 2: what he's up to. So then but then when they
Speaker 2: get to the apartment to just you know, talk to
Speaker 2: this doctor about whatever was in Stabler's brain, the doctor's murdered.
Speaker 2: No pulse, blood poured out fully out of there. Stabler
Speaker 2: of course goes, Lisa's father did it?
Speaker 3: Who else? So they have the dad in cement room.
Speaker 2: Bars he's denying the murder, but his fingerprints are on
Speaker 2: the doorknob, and he goes, no, I know I went
Speaker 2: there to do something bad.
Speaker 3: He goes I went upstairs.
Speaker 2: Uh, he goes, I just I opened the door, but
Speaker 2: he was already dead, like I wanted to know what
Speaker 2: was up. And then Stabler sits down AND's like, listen,
Speaker 2: I know you've been through a lot, and if I'd
Speaker 2: found out that she was with an older man in
Speaker 2: a hotel, I would have shot the bastard too. We
Speaker 2: realized the dad has no idea what's going on, so
Speaker 2: that the dad goes, what are you talking about? And
Speaker 2: then starts slowly standing up and is now leering over Stabler,
Speaker 2: who remains sitting and goes, are you saying my little
Speaker 2: girl was a whore? And his golden cross is dangling
Speaker 2: off his neck, and he says Lisa was a good girl,
Speaker 2: and then breathes deep and says he murdered her, didn't he?
Speaker 2: And he goes, I didn't shoot him, but I sure
Speaker 2: as hell wish I did. And Stabler truly doesn't move
Speaker 2: at all. He just looks ahead. He doesn't know what
Speaker 2: to do. The closing shot of this scene is like
Speaker 2: ten seconds on Stabler's face mildly moving in different directions,
Speaker 2: and so this scenem's bad. So it's like again, we're
Speaker 2: slipping more information. So the dad just went to talk
Speaker 2: to the HIV doctor to be like who infected her?
Speaker 3: Like who fucked her?
Speaker 2: And then the stabler breaks it down and is like,
Speaker 2: oh no, she was fucking that old man in a
Speaker 2: hotel for money.
Speaker 3: Yeah, the bad news doesn't end.
Speaker 1: You'd think finding out your child's dead would be the
Speaker 1: worst news you got of the week, but it just
Speaker 1: deeps going.
Speaker 3: So no, I think the death.
Speaker 2: The death is worse, of course, but okay, so meeting
Speaker 2: in the we're in the meddle. We're in the meddle,
Speaker 2: meet me in the meetle. Okay, we're in a meeting
Speaker 2: in the middle precinct. And they searched the dad. They
Speaker 2: can't find any weapons, there's like no proof he did it,
Speaker 2: but and there are prints from one other unidentified person
Speaker 2: in the apartment. So Craigan's like, I still think the
Speaker 2: dad is the best bet and stands no, no, no, no, like
Speaker 2: he did not know. He truly was shocked in cement
Speaker 2: room bars. He doesn't think that dad's the guy. Munchin
Speaker 2: Finn come in. They found a scarf from Saint Tabitha's
Speaker 2: high school.
Speaker 1: Wait if the dad doesn't, I'm sorry, I'm like even
Speaker 1: backing up here, if the dad doesn't know that his
Speaker 1: daughter was fucking the doctor, why was he beating up
Speaker 1: the doctor two scenes ago?
Speaker 3: Oh, he wants to know who gave her aids.
Speaker 2: Gave h Okay, he wants scoop like he's like, help
Speaker 2: tell me.
Speaker 3: Okay, yeah, I got it, got it. I was very confused.
Speaker 2: Okay, it's very confusing, and so it must be Lisa's.
Speaker 2: But Benson goes, no, no, no, I found one of
Speaker 2: the scarfs already in Lisa's classet. She might have two scarfs,
Speaker 2: or it could be someone else's scarf. I also can't
Speaker 2: imagine any police officer being this good at their job
Speaker 2: that they would like be like I've seen the scarf before,
Speaker 2: Like I truly cannot. And so then, uh, there's a monogram.
Speaker 2: What's the monogram AA for Angela agon La the lying salute.
Speaker 2: So the Prince walk Stabler right over to her locker.
Speaker 2: He opens the locker. What is that called? What is
Speaker 2: that thing like that to open a lock?
Speaker 3: Lock? Cutter? Is it just a loutter cut a bolt cutter,
Speaker 3: bolt cutter? So he has a bolt cutter with him,
Speaker 3: you know, stabler with a tool. Okay, the principal walks
Speaker 3: into the locker, he holds it.
Speaker 2: There's a gold, shimmery mini dress and she comes running Angela, Hayden,
Speaker 2: that's my stuff.
Speaker 3: They find a VHS tape.
Speaker 2: That's why you don't say anything to police, because you
Speaker 2: just admitted that everything in the locker is yours and
Speaker 2: that's your stuff. So I guess this tape is yours.
Speaker 2: But she's a fit fire and her hair is pushed
Speaker 2: back with a headband. I'm loving the look. I think
Speaker 2: like in the day, she's the head bam schoolgirl. At
Speaker 2: night she's swoop bang slut. So she says, oh, that's
Speaker 2: that's Lisa's tape. Actually, she asked me to hold it
Speaker 2: for her, and Stabler says, well, we're going to take
Speaker 2: a look at it, and then Hayden looks so worried
Speaker 2: and we cut to the tape. It's Hayden and it's
Speaker 2: I keep saying Hayden, Angela. But I have to pick one,
Speaker 2: you know what I mean. I can't say I can't,
Speaker 2: I can't keep saying both. I'm gonna say Angela.
Speaker 1: I'm gonna also say I'm gonna also do a little
Speaker 1: really quick Italian lesson Agnelli her last name. That's a
Speaker 1: famous Italian family, but also it means lambs in English.
Speaker 1: So I feel like they do that on purpose, Like
Speaker 1: these aren't little They're supposed to be little lambs, but
Speaker 1: they're not.
Speaker 2: They're slutty sheep. You know they're slutty sheep. Yeah, so
Speaker 2: Hayden and so Angela. So Angela isn't a white button
Speaker 2: down and it's like open a little with a bra
Speaker 2: and a scarf, and she's looking at the camera. There's
Speaker 2: like a casting couch behind her. She's not looking thrilled.
Speaker 2: Lisa comes in, starts touching her, she takes the scarf off.
Speaker 2: They're kissing. Doctor Tanner shows up. He's fucking both of them.
Speaker 2: So we have this tape. It's not good. And then
Speaker 2: this is what's worst of all, and it kind of
Speaker 2: goes back to what the principal said, if these kids
Speaker 2: aren't getting attention at home, they'll find it in other ways.
Speaker 2: And so basically they taught They called Angela's parents, they go,
Speaker 2: we'll give you the right to talk to her. We
Speaker 2: actually don't want to interrupt our European vacation. We're not
Speaker 2: coming back. So she has bad parents, even if they're rich.
Speaker 2: What if they're doing like a time sure vacation in Europe? Okay,
Speaker 2: so the fact that.
Speaker 1: They're that rich, but then they would also go, yeah,
Speaker 1: just talk to her that they wouldn't be like we're
Speaker 1: sending our lawyer you know. Ooh, you're right. It's like,
Speaker 1: what's going on? You guys really don't give a shit
Speaker 1: about this girl.
Speaker 3: They really don't. I get yeah. Fuck so whatever.
Speaker 2: It's a three sum and that means that she knew
Speaker 2: about Tanna and Lisa the whole time. So why have
Speaker 2: you not been helping this investigation? And she goes, this
Speaker 2: is humiliating. You didn't watch, did you? And Stabler's like, yeah,
Speaker 2: we did, babe. And they're in woodroom blinds though, and
Speaker 2: she's standing and Benson and Stabler are on either side
Speaker 2: of her, and she's like, I didn't want to do it.
Speaker 2: Lisa made me do it. She begged me to do it.
Speaker 2: She needed money, and we got five hundred dollars each.
Speaker 2: She goes, it's true, and Benson quickly responds, you've lied
Speaker 2: to us about everything.
Speaker 3: Why would we believe you? Now?
Speaker 2: Benson does her voice and goes, we're trying to catch
Speaker 2: the person who killed your best friend, and you just
Speaker 2: keep lying to us. I would have loved just a
Speaker 2: hint of a funeral scene for Lisa, because it seems
Speaker 2: like no one like I just would like something. She
Speaker 2: says she didn't want them to find out what she did.
Speaker 2: Sailor goes, well, what else have you done? She goes, nothing,
Speaker 2: I swear, and then we're like, well what about Lisa?
Speaker 2: And she sighs, and she goes, she made other videos,
Speaker 2: a lot of other videos. She was doing hardcore, she's
Speaker 2: doing porn. She took her friends to the porn store.
Speaker 2: They can't even get into the porn store without these fakes.
Speaker 2: So whatever she shows, she's on the cover of all
Speaker 2: these DVDs. She's a full blown porn star. And she
Speaker 2: was like, we can use the tape of us with
Speaker 2: Tanner as your audition tape. And it's for a guy
Speaker 2: named Max, So obviously we rushed to Max Long's studios.
Speaker 3: He's directing a porno. We meet him.
Speaker 2: He's very focused making this porno. The actors Matt molloy
Speaker 2: and this motherfucker is and everything. He's been working for
Speaker 2: like forty years. He's in every TV show, you can imagine,
Speaker 2: every Law and Order spin off every USA drama. He
Speaker 2: was and dropped dead gorge election and armaged it. I
Speaker 2: looked him because like, how do I know this guy?
Speaker 1: And then I saw that the judges and drop dead
Speaker 1: gorgeous too, and I was like, yes, yeah, I.
Speaker 3: Think he's the porno.
Speaker 2: He's the he's the creep, he's the one with the
Speaker 2: tank no, yeah, yeah yeah. And then in Far from
Speaker 2: Heaven he's unfortunately playing the red faced man, so that's
Speaker 2: uh could have given him a name he was in hitch.
Speaker 3: I don't know.
Speaker 2: I just I love this little porn freak in the
Speaker 2: real world. So Stabler grabs one of the DVD's and
Speaker 2: that are stacked up, and he goes this girl Trudy Stroots,
Speaker 2: which is not even.
Speaker 3: A sexy name.
Speaker 1: Trutsruts like she struts, but still Trudy's not like, no
Speaker 1: offense to any truth's out there.
Speaker 3: That's not like a super hot girl name truthy Boots.
Speaker 3: I don't know. Trudy Struts is hard for me. Oh
Speaker 3: my god.
Speaker 2: Okay, so you also think but he's like, oh, yeah,
Speaker 2: that's Allison and they go no, it's not and he goes, no,
Speaker 2: I'm sorry, that's Allison. We have it on file and
Speaker 2: they're like, well, that's a fake, and he goes and
Speaker 2: it's and they go it's child porn, so bump, you know,
Speaker 2: but um but dumb. Okay, So then they ask where
Speaker 2: were you Monday night? He goes filming Wendy does the
Speaker 2: White House on an apartment at eighth Avenue till two am.
Speaker 3: He says, I would have never killed her. She's like
Speaker 3: a daughter to me.
Speaker 2: Oh Stadler's piss spins him around aggressively and goes, you
Speaker 2: get off watching your daughter have sex. He says, she
Speaker 2: wanted to do porn, you know, like she loved it.
Speaker 2: And if you want to talk to anyone, go talk
Speaker 2: to Derek's hand or not me. And they're like, yeah,
Speaker 2: we know about the doctor. He goes, whoa the guy's
Speaker 2: a doctor and they go yeah, and list says HIV.
Speaker 2: He goes, oh my god, not HIV. We have to
Speaker 2: shoot out a cancel production. I got to call my actors.
Speaker 2: We got to get them tested. This is a farce.
Speaker 2: Poorn actors get tested every two weeks no matter what,
Speaker 2: or you can't work. You need clean bills of help.
Speaker 2: They're actually the cleanest people to fuck out in the world.
Speaker 2: So he's lawyered up fast fast, and he's like, oh,
Speaker 2: I'm going to make bail, and you know, his alibi
Speaker 2: does check out, So we're a little worried about that,
Speaker 2: but we're going to figure it out.
Speaker 3: Find something.
Speaker 2: The hospital was actually investigating Derek's billing and he gave
Speaker 2: a bunch of patients fake names and fake social Security
Speaker 2: numbers to treat them secretly, and Long Video was paying
Speaker 2: for the tests and treatment.
Speaker 3: So this guy's lying.
Speaker 2: Max has been paying Derek to secretly like treat his
Speaker 2: HIV positive porn stars without telling the other actors that
Speaker 2: the underage porn.
Speaker 1: People have HIV. Craigan goes and I figure that's also
Speaker 1: how Lisa found out. Like if you're fifteen and you're
Speaker 1: just like hooking up, right, Like, I don't think you
Speaker 1: know you have HIV unless you get tested for it.
Speaker 1: I don't think fifteen year olds are like routinely getting
Speaker 1: tested for HIV. Right, I'm assuming she found out from
Speaker 1: this job, right, what do you think?
Speaker 3: Yeah? For sure she did.
Speaker 2: Okay, okay, but she she's hooked. She can't stop. So
Speaker 2: Craigan is like, stop it. Why would he risked his
Speaker 2: medical career for Max? Long and Benson goes, oh, Max
Speaker 2: was blackmailing him because he knew he was dating a
Speaker 2: fifteen year old, which means Max knew that she was
Speaker 2: a child and HIV positive.
Speaker 1: So say like the amount of red string they must
Speaker 1: have been using on the writer's room board of this episode.
Speaker 3: It is one of the most complex. I mean, Jerome
Speaker 3: Max Tanner the dad.
Speaker 1: We've had like so many fucking bad guys, and I
Speaker 1: still don't even know who knew what when and what,
Speaker 1: like it's anyway going on and it's.
Speaker 3: Still not solved. It's still not solved.
Speaker 2: No, Stablers are like a cool clear map board and
Speaker 2: I feel like they built this just for the shot
Speaker 2: and it's really cool because we get to see them
Speaker 2: like work through the glass on this map. They figure
Speaker 2: out there is there's enough time for him to go
Speaker 2: from the shoot to Lisa like that he probably scheduled.
Speaker 2: Wendy does the White House close to the place where
Speaker 2: she was found. Trevor Langen is aka mister Mushko Hargate
Speaker 2: is Max's lawyer, and they walk in cocky.
Speaker 3: They are like, we got it.
Speaker 2: You know. It's Benson and Stabler at their smugginess. So
Speaker 2: they found traces of brushed aluminum in the wounds of
Speaker 2: Lisa's head, which are the same as the tripods you use,
Speaker 2: and the tripod at Max's office had Lisa's hair, skin,
Speaker 2: blood and hair in the screw threads. You're done. You're done, bitch.
Speaker 2: He's still denying and lying. They start throwing down all
Speaker 2: the evidence they have against him. Novak's like, hey, Max,
Speaker 2: follow me. They show him a precinct filled with the
Speaker 2: whole cast of Wendy Does the White House. They're all
Speaker 2: spilling tea. They're pissed that he concealed Lisa's HIV status
Speaker 2: from them. All the porn actors are glaring at him,
Speaker 2: pissed off, and he's like, Okay, I admit I made
Speaker 2: a mistake in Casey goes yeah, and you risk all
Speaker 2: these people's like health.
Speaker 3: That was a huge mistake.
Speaker 2: You didn't want to stop filming, and now they all
Speaker 2: hate you so and then they also all say that
Speaker 2: you used to slap her around to shut her up.
Speaker 2: So and we know that you left the film set
Speaker 2: for twenty minutes the day she died.
Speaker 3: You told her to meet her on the roof.
Speaker 2: You beat her brains out because you knew you would
Speaker 2: be fucked when people found out she was a child
Speaker 2: with HIV and you had her working. Trevor's like, this
Speaker 2: is speculation, and Casey goes, you think, like, dude, you
Speaker 2: think once a jury hears the details of who you
Speaker 2: are in this case, they're gonna be like, oh, we
Speaker 2: have sympathy for this guy.
Speaker 3: You suck. You're gonna lose in court.
Speaker 2: And he goes, that's fine, But I didn't kill Tanner
Speaker 2: and at which I think is an admission to killing Lisa.
Speaker 2: So he but he was at a charity dinner during
Speaker 2: the killing of Tanner.
Speaker 3: This guy, I mean.
Speaker 2: This, this porn light lunatic, this like unethical porn guy
Speaker 2: who's molestor of children and is okay spreading HIV was
Speaker 2: at a charity dinner. What charity I want to know
Speaker 2: what charity dinner he was a part of. Yeah, Oh
Speaker 2: my god, Oh my god. So this is yeah whatever.
Speaker 2: So they arrest him for the murder of Lisa Downing.
Speaker 2: He uh, his face eludes, he's you know, he feels
Speaker 2: just only sorry himself.
Speaker 3: He doesn't care about anyone.
Speaker 2: The dad's in the hallway, I'm like a stabler going
Speaker 2: to tell him another evil thing that. Yeah, that she's
Speaker 2: truly struts. I can't believe, I said, streets, I'm like dying. Okay,
Speaker 2: So he's there to say thank you for finding the
Speaker 2: man who killed Lisa. And you know, I hope he
Speaker 2: remarries one day and yeah, moves moves forward in life
Speaker 2: in a positive way.
Speaker 3: I hope so too.
Speaker 1: But if you're just a trucker and it's you in
Speaker 1: the road, I think he might win.
Speaker 3: Some civil he might win some civil lawsuits.
Speaker 2: I think, yeah, yeah, I think he's gonna be able
Speaker 2: to sue the porn guy and the doctor.
Speaker 3: I think he's dead and has no money. Oh, he's dead,
Speaker 3: I forgot already.
Speaker 2: I think he's going to be able to sue Max
Speaker 2: Long in a civil case and get a lot of money.
Speaker 2: Good because I guess the residuals from the Soul DVD.
Speaker 2: I mean, this is a nightmare. Honestly, we just need
Speaker 2: to make sure.
Speaker 1: A plan of how this dad can be Okay, I.
Speaker 2: Want him off the road. Okay, So now what I'm done?
Speaker 2: I am tired.
Speaker 3: Okay, So.
Speaker 2: There's still so much more. Craigan called mystery prints from
Speaker 2: Tanner's apartment match the princes that were on the VHS tape.
Speaker 2: Oh my god, Stabler is thinking again. The school bell rings,
Speaker 2: and now we see Hayden Panita and a ponytail Stable,
Speaker 2: I mean a different hair cell and every scene. Stable
Speaker 2: lets her know they arrested Max Long for the murder
Speaker 2: of Lisa. She goes, great, I guess it's all over now,
Speaker 2: no trauma over here. But they go no, he actually
Speaker 2: didn't kill doctor Tanner, and Stabler goes, do you know
Speaker 2: who did? She goes, no, why would I? Stable goes, listen, bitch,
Speaker 2: the tape in your locker. Lisa didn't ask you to
Speaker 2: keep it for her.
Speaker 3: We know you. Stop lying, stop lying, just be honest,
Speaker 3: your your prince.
Speaker 2: There's a gun residue on the tape, and your fingerprint
Speaker 2: is on the residue. You're done. So basically, she went
Speaker 2: to his apartment. She took her father's gun and she
Speaker 2: starts crying. She goes, I asked him for the tape back,
Speaker 2: and a tear rolls down her cheek. He said he
Speaker 2: couldn't hand over the tape because then he would go
Speaker 2: to jail. But all she kept thinking about, like someone's
Speaker 2: gonna see it, and my life's gonna be ruined. So
Speaker 2: she points the gun at him. She you know, he
Speaker 2: tried to grab it, it went off. Stabler looks at
Speaker 2: her with you know, pity, pity on his face. She
Speaker 2: hugs him, starts bawling, crying, I'm so sorry. I just
Speaker 2: wanted my life back. Is she a victim or a
Speaker 2: psycho or both?
Speaker 1: I can't I can't tell because is really sweet, like, let.
Speaker 3: Me just finish.
Speaker 2: Yeah, let's just finish. I gotta get this over with.
Speaker 2: So he I love this, but I got to end.
Speaker 2: He cups her head and pats her like a baby,
Speaker 2: saying sh He holds her as she like cries in
Speaker 2: this empty hallway. And I went to the school, I
Speaker 2: would try to be catching a peek. I'd be like,
Speaker 2: the detectives are back, Like I would be.
Speaker 1: Like, can I go to the bath and they're hugging Angela, Yeah,
Speaker 1: I got my period, Like I would be running out
Speaker 1: of class.
Speaker 3: But that's a digital baby.
Speaker 2: I hope that she gets leniency in courts unless she's
Speaker 2: a psycho, and that's where I'm at. But if she's
Speaker 2: like a true fifteen year old who's been like hooked
Speaker 2: out and used and as a tape and like groomed
Speaker 2: by these older men. I hope she doesn't get a
Speaker 2: lot of jail time, but she's rich. Hopefully she gets
Speaker 2: a good lawyer.
Speaker 1: I don't know.
Speaker 3: I don't know.
Speaker 1: I will say like that, why do Why didn't the
Speaker 1: two of them, her and Tanner destroy the tape?
Speaker 3: It's bad for both of them if it gets out.
Speaker 3: Just destroy it together. Why is anyone murdered? Why is
Speaker 3: anyone keeping it?
Speaker 1: Just destroy it, like, sit there together and go, hey,
Speaker 1: Lisa's dead. This is bad for both of us. Let's
Speaker 1: just fucking pull all the tape out. It's not the Internet.
Speaker 1: It's not on the internet yet. You know, we're pre internet.
Speaker 3: We're pre internet right anyway.
Speaker 1: But this is this is all wildly like tied into
Speaker 1: a bunch of different cases. So we'll get into it
Speaker 1: right now. This is kind of nuts. One of the
Speaker 1: first cases that fuck, give me a moment, I got it.
Speaker 1: Remember it's real, Jesus Christ.
Speaker 3: Well it's not. I mean it's not. It's all like
Speaker 3: it's all little pieces.
Speaker 1: But like there was a case that this is loosely
Speaker 1: based on, it seems, and but that is the Christina
Speaker 1: Long case, which you covered when we did Praternity, which
Speaker 1: I believe is season nine about Christina Long was like
Speaker 1: a girl. I believe she was like living in Connecticut
Speaker 1: and she moved there and then she was dating guys
Speaker 1: she met on the internet, and then one of them
Speaker 1: killed her. So it was that's like a semi link.
Speaker 1: But if you want to hear more about that case,
Speaker 1: go back to our episode Praternity. Lisa covers that case. Obviously,
Speaker 1: they talk about sex bracelets, which everywhere you look up,
Speaker 1: you look that up. They are called an urban legend.
Speaker 1: It's the urban legend of sex bracelets. So essentially, like
Speaker 1: different colored gel bracelets have been popular since like the
Speaker 1: two thousands, but in two thousand and three they had
Speaker 1: like a slutty little comeback, and urban legends spread that
Speaker 1: they were part of this like widespread sex game where
Speaker 1: teens would wear the bracelet that corresponded to the act
Speaker 1: they would perform, just like the principal said, yellow hugging,
Speaker 1: purple kissing, red lap dance, which I'm assuming lap dance
Speaker 1: is just like dry humping, blue oral sex, and then
Speaker 1: black intercourse. And it was said also that if a
Speaker 1: guy came up to you and like broke your bracelet
Speaker 1: or like ripped it off you, that's like a coupon
Speaker 1: that they can use later to do that sex act
Speaker 1: with you. And then like a bunch of schools banned
Speaker 1: the bracelets of like schools in Florida, you know where
Speaker 1: they love banning shit. And then people also likened the
Speaker 1: bracelet thing to like rainbow parties. Like these parties were
Speaker 1: allegedly girls would wear all these different lipsticks and then
Speaker 1: blow different guys. Honestly, when you look back at it,
Speaker 1: it all seems like satanic panic. It seems like it's
Speaker 1: overhyped hysteria. There wasn't a lot of proof. There weren't
Speaker 1: a lot of kids coming forward going oh yeah, we
Speaker 1: actually did these parties all the time.
Speaker 2: Like did you ever wear those plastic bracelets and you
Speaker 2: could kind of like hook them into each other and
Speaker 2: it looks cooler.
Speaker 3: That kind I wore, like the skinny gel, yeah, skinny gel. Yeah.
Speaker 1: The two thus the three comeback was a lot with
Speaker 1: like the live strong bracelets and like the ones that
Speaker 1: are thicker that you see now it is you know, yeah, yeah,
Speaker 1: so those were like people we were in those colored
Speaker 1: ones as well. But it just feels like there's not
Speaker 1: a lot of proof that these things were actually happening,
Speaker 1: Like there's not a lot of you know, you would
Speaker 1: think there were to at least be like therapists speaking
Speaker 1: and being like, yes, my clients are telling me they're
Speaker 1: doing that, like you know, even if there's not a
Speaker 1: bunch of kids running to newspapers going yeah, we did this.
Speaker 1: I mean two thousand and three is like roughly your
Speaker 1: high school time, Lisa, like you you were, did you
Speaker 1: hear people doing this? Like, I just don't think that
Speaker 1: this was like actually done. I think this was like
Speaker 1: a thing that parents were like, people are doing this,
Speaker 1: or maybe it was like a joke that started out
Speaker 1: like what Hayden Pantier's character says, like, yeah, I'm the
Speaker 1: one that started calling them sex bracelets, but it's not
Speaker 1: real anyway. That's a little a little info on that.
Speaker 1: Then this is very interesting. Part of this episode is
Speaker 1: based on this case involving Tracy Lords.
Speaker 3: Now do you know Tracy Lords is? Okay?
Speaker 1: She's like I know her from like cry Baby and
Speaker 1: she had a small part on Melrose Place. Like she
Speaker 1: was one of the first I would say, adult film
Speaker 1: actresses to make it into mainstream stuff that I knew of,
Speaker 1: Like you know, like you everything you knew about Tracy
Speaker 1: Lords when I was like a teen, was like, oh,
Speaker 1: she used to do porn or whatever, you know, And
Speaker 1: essentially this ended up becoming a Supreme Court case, the
Speaker 1: United States versus Excitement Video, which is obviously spelled X
Speaker 1: DASH C I T E M E N T so excitement.
Speaker 1: And initially what happened was this guy named Ruben Gottsman,
Speaker 1: he owns Excite Entertainment and he's making all these, you know,
Speaker 1: adult movies and Tracy Lords isn't a bunch of them.
Speaker 1: And then an LAPD officer and an FBI agent went
Speaker 1: undercover together as retailers who wanted to like buy his videos,
Speaker 1: and they there were like tons of meats. This was
Speaker 1: like a long operation over the course of nineteen eighty
Speaker 1: six and nineteen eighty seven. And then over the course
Speaker 1: of this operation, these officers said that Gotsman admitted to
Speaker 1: knowing that Lords was underage when he had her starring
Speaker 1: in his movies. So in nineteen eighty nine he's found
Speaker 1: guilty and he sentenced to one year in jail at
Speaker 1: a one hundred thousand dollars fine. That doesn't seem like
Speaker 1: a ton, but it is eighty nine. I think before
Speaker 1: the child sex abuse images were like as treated the
Speaker 1: way I think that they are more seriously now.
Speaker 3: So I did not know this.
Speaker 1: So then in nineteen ninety two, his lawyers get it
Speaker 1: overturned on appeal based on the law being vague grammatically,
Speaker 1: like the law is about transporting child pornography, is what
Speaker 1: they were calling it at the time, And they use
Speaker 1: the word knowingly, and they were talking about it being
Speaker 1: confusing the way the law is worded, And I think
Speaker 1: that's like what they borrow from in this episode where
Speaker 1: the guy's like, well, but I didn't know that, Like
Speaker 1: I got her ID and her idea was on file
Speaker 1: as the right age, and so I didn't. So that's
Speaker 1: what I was kind of asking before, Like even outside
Speaker 1: of like the adult film industry, if you're just like
Speaker 1: dating a girl and she tells you she's twenty one
Speaker 1: and she shows you her ID, and you're like, for
Speaker 1: all intents and purposes, I think she's twenty one, even
Speaker 1: though you and I both know you fucking know she's
Speaker 1: fifteen or sixteen or whatever. What it like legally, what
Speaker 1: are the what is the recourse?
Speaker 3: So I don't I don't really know. I'm sure some
Speaker 3: of our lawyer.
Speaker 1: Lawyers will write us and tell us, I'm maybe it varies,
Speaker 1: But so in ninety two it gets overturned because knowingly
Speaker 1: is confusingly worded, they said. But then it goes all
Speaker 1: the way back up to the Supreme Court and it's
Speaker 1: the United States versus Excitement Video was a federal case
Speaker 1: brought in nineteen ninety four in Los Angeles in California federally,
Speaker 1: so it's California, but like it happened in LA and
Speaker 1: they the Supreme Court upheld the original conviction.
Speaker 3: They were like they were basically like, yeah, I guess.
Speaker 1: You could read it as knowingly this way, but you
Speaker 1: could also read it that it is the right way,
Speaker 1: like you could read it in the lawful way or
Speaker 1: the unlawful way. And of course, like Scalia and Thomas
Speaker 1: were the ones that dissented because they were like, they're
Speaker 1: all about every word in the Constitution, like being exact,
Speaker 1: and that's obviously what the point of.
Speaker 3: The time until they get paid off and then it
Speaker 3: doesn't matter.
Speaker 1: Right until somebody buys you a fucking buys your kid
Speaker 1: into college, and then you're like, it's actually, there's nowhere
Speaker 1: that it says that I can't do that. But then
Speaker 1: this is like the most interesting case and it's it's
Speaker 1: loosely based, but I think this is like I've never
Speaker 1: heard of this case. I thought it was really kind
Speaker 1: of like neat. So I'm going to talk about this one.
Speaker 1: And this is the case of Bob Crane. And this
Speaker 1: episode is you know, there's a you'll see which part
Speaker 1: I think is based on this. But Crane is a
Speaker 1: guy from Connecticut. He was a radio DJ and a
Speaker 1: personality who interviewed a lot of famous stars back in
Speaker 1: like the fifties and sixties, like Marilyn Monroe, Bob Hope,
Speaker 1: Charlton Heston. And he's on this LA radio station. He
Speaker 1: meets Carl Reiner, who's a TV writer and producer on
Speaker 1: his show, and he gives him apart on some small show.
Speaker 1: Then he gets another part on a show. Then eventually
Speaker 1: he gets cast on the show called Hogan's Heroes as Hogan.
Speaker 1: And this is a show that I used to hear
Speaker 1: about all the time because there is a character on
Speaker 1: it named Colonel Klink, which is not my last name,
Speaker 1: but you can tell that to every math teacher I've
Speaker 1: ever had.
Speaker 2: Like well, and then the Simpsons that's how I know
Speaker 2: most things.
Speaker 3: And they ain't made fun.
Speaker 1: Of this, Oh they made fun of Hogans Well, it's
Speaker 1: actually reference.
Speaker 3: I don't know if it was a full make fun,
Speaker 3: but it was a reference.
Speaker 1: It makes sense because it's kind of wild. Like this
Speaker 1: show came out in nineteen sixty five, so it's twenty
Speaker 1: years only after the Holocaust in World War two and
Speaker 1: this is taking place. This show is about POW's in Germany,
Speaker 1: but it's a comedy, so it's like and a bunch
Speaker 1: of the guys playing the Germans are Jews who actually
Speaker 1: one of them escaped Auschwitz, like he had a tattoo,
Speaker 1: so it's kind of like that. They thought the show
Speaker 1: was really good, they thought it was well read, and
Speaker 1: they were like, we're going to be in this show.
Speaker 3: So it's wild.
Speaker 1: This radio DJ now is the like number one on
Speaker 1: the call sheet for Hogan's Heroes, and I just used
Speaker 1: to hear about it so fucking much because everyone you
Speaker 1: to always go ah, Colonel Clink, and I'm like, it's
Speaker 1: spelled differently, And I'm also too young for that show anyway.
Speaker 1: Crane was also Bob. Crane was allegedly also a sex
Speaker 1: and porn addict.
Speaker 3: Okay, he had.
Speaker 1: A wife and three kids with her, but he had
Speaker 1: affairs with cast mates. He had affairs with people all
Speaker 1: the time. He was like just a perennial woman chaser.
Speaker 1: He divorced his first wife and he married a co
Speaker 1: star named Patricia Olsen, and you know, but he cheated
Speaker 1: on her all the time as well. So he has
Speaker 1: this big role on this show, one hundred and sixty
Speaker 1: eight episodes from sixty five to seventy one on Hogan's Heroes,
Speaker 1: and everybody knew him. But then things kind of slowed
Speaker 1: down for him. Some say they thought that maybe he
Speaker 1: was getting a reputation because he would take polaroids of
Speaker 1: women that he'd hooked up with and he would just
Speaker 1: like show them around on the crew, to the crew
Speaker 1: on sets. And there was a rumor that executives found
Speaker 1: out about this and we're like, get this guy out
Speaker 1: of here. But I don't know, it's also the early seventies.
Speaker 1: I don't know if anybody gave a shit about that
Speaker 1: back then. In nineteen seventy two, Like so, right after
Speaker 1: the show ends, he still got some fame. He took
Speaker 1: his son, who was twenty one at the time, to
Speaker 1: the premiere of Deep Throat, and his son talks about
Speaker 1: how he was so pumped to be around all these
Speaker 1: porn stars and meeting all these porn stars and like
Speaker 1: he was just very into this kind of stuff. So
Speaker 1: after things are slowed down for him, he doesn't really
Speaker 1: have much going on, but he still has like some
Speaker 1: level of fame. So he buys the rights to this
Speaker 1: play called Beginner's Luck and he starts toring around doing
Speaker 1: Beginner's Luck at dinner theaters.
Speaker 3: Okay, and you know that's still a thing. Is dinner
Speaker 3: theater a thing?
Speaker 1: I don't know, because dinner theater was always a thing
Speaker 1: for like old people and you would eat and what
Speaker 1: I mean, I bet it is. But I do think
Speaker 1: it is truly like the depths of Hell because it's
Speaker 1: like people eat it. I mean, I don't know, we
Speaker 1: do our shows while people eat, but it just feels
Speaker 1: like the kind of people you don't feel like, yeah
Speaker 1: you're doing like yeah, you're doing like Death of a Salesman,
Speaker 1: like a monolog and you hear people like scraping their
Speaker 1: fork and knife like on their salisbury steak. Like that
Speaker 1: sounds like I mean in Soap Dish, a movie that
Speaker 1: I'm obsessed with Kathy Moriarty's character classically has to go
Speaker 1: back to dinner theater at the end when when everything
Speaker 1: falls apart for her. So that's kind of was considered
Speaker 1: for a long time to be like the bottom when
Speaker 1: you have to do dinner theater.
Speaker 3: But great question.
Speaker 1: I mean, I don't know, let us know if there's
Speaker 1: dinner theater around you anyone. So he starts touring around
Speaker 1: doing dinner theater and at this play called Beginner's Luck. Now,
Speaker 1: earlier in his career, when he was more on top,
Speaker 1: he had met this guy named John Henry Carpenter who
Speaker 1: was a regional sales manager for Sony Electronics, and he
Speaker 1: had helped a lot of celebrities set up their av
Speaker 1: equipment and stuff at their homes or whatever. And these
Speaker 1: two guys became fast friends because they like to hang
Speaker 1: out at bars and chase babes.
Speaker 3: Okay, they like to pick up women.
Speaker 1: And Carpenter introduced Crane to the world of videotape so
Speaker 1: that he could tape his sexual exploits and kind of
Speaker 1: make his own amateur pornography. And that's sort of where
Speaker 1: like the Doctor Tanner and the tape come in for
Speaker 1: all of this, okay. Carpenter allegedly scheduled his business trips
Speaker 1: around Crane's tour schedule so that they could like make
Speaker 1: these movies together on the road. Like it's unclear whether
Speaker 1: like they would be like fucking in the same room
Speaker 1: or like whether one guy would be in there watching
Speaker 1: and taping it, or whether he would just set it
Speaker 1: up while Crane went and hooked up with these women.
Speaker 1: I don't know, but they were making these movies allegedly together.
Speaker 1: So now in nineteen seventy eight, so if you think
Speaker 1: about it, it's like he's seven years out from his
Speaker 1: big show ending. Crane is living temporarily in Scottsdale, Arizona,
Speaker 1: for a run of the show. At dinner at a
Speaker 1: dinner theater there, and a co star enters his apartment
Speaker 1: because he didn't show up to a lunch meeting, and
Speaker 1: she finds Crane, forty nine years old, dead bludgeoned with
Speaker 1: a weapon.
Speaker 3: There is allegedly like the.
Speaker 1: Head injuries really bad, like his sheets are drenched with blood,
Speaker 1: like it's really really bad blunt force trauma to the.
Speaker 3: Head and there.
Speaker 1: The weapon is never found, but it is believed by
Speaker 1: some investigators to be a camera tripod, much like in
Speaker 1: the episode and elected the episode.
Speaker 2: But I also like, anytime something like this happens, I'm like,
Speaker 2: I feel like I'd hide the weapon.
Speaker 3: Good.
Speaker 1: Yeah, well I can't. No one hide a weapon. I
Speaker 1: don't know, especially in New York. It's like throw it
Speaker 1: off any bridge. It's gone forever, you know. Yeah, I
Speaker 1: kiss the CCT and they did.
Speaker 2: I just like don't get how all these weapons are
Speaker 2: constantly found.
Speaker 1: You couldn't buy a new tripod. Yeah, they find them
Speaker 1: in sewer grades and shit. Yeah it's crazy. But in
Speaker 1: this case, they never found the tripods. Maybe this guy
Speaker 1: did hide it better, but investigators believed it was a tripod.
Speaker 1: There was an electrical cord tied around his neck as well,
Speaker 1: but that had nothing to do with his death, Like
Speaker 1: so maybe the person was trying to make it look
Speaker 1: like something else happened. Scottsdale, aras Zona, at the time,
Speaker 1: didn't even have a homicide department, Like this is nineteen
Speaker 1: seventy eight, so they're in over their heads with this one.
Speaker 1: Like a celebrity has found bludgeoned in their district. They
Speaker 1: don't know what's going on, but they didn't have much
Speaker 1: to go on. Evidence wise either no forced entry, nothing
Speaker 1: is stolen. They do find his videotape collection, which is
Speaker 1: extensive and wild, and that is what leads them to Carpenter,
Speaker 1: who actually had been in Arizona that month to hang
Speaker 1: out with Crane. They eventually search. I hardly can't even
Speaker 1: believe all this. I know they I just don't know
Speaker 1: why I didn't know that. I just feel like this
Speaker 1: is something we would know.
Speaker 3: I know.
Speaker 1: It feels like, well, wait, there's a movie about it.
Speaker 1: Let me get to it. Okay, So they find they
Speaker 1: search Carpenter's car. They find blood smears in his car
Speaker 1: that match Crane's blood type, but there wasn't DNA testing yet,
Speaker 1: so it's like you can't even really prosecute based on
Speaker 1: blood type. It's like blood types are one hundreds and
Speaker 1: thousands of people. Millions of people have every blood type. So
Speaker 1: twelve years later, so the case kind of goes nowhere.
Speaker 1: Twelve years later, in nineteen ninety it gets reopened because
Speaker 1: some new DA or somebody comes in and wants to
Speaker 1: clear all these old cases. And then in ninety two
Speaker 1: they arrest Carpenter. He goes on trial in ninety four.
Speaker 1: Bob Crane's son testifies, Yeah, my dad was trying to
Speaker 1: ditch Carpenter.
Speaker 3: He didn't want to be friends anymore.
Speaker 1: He found he thought he was clingy and he he's
Speaker 1: like my dad called me and told me he wanted
Speaker 1: to like start making some changes in his life and
Speaker 1: that that started with cutting off some of these friendships
Speaker 1: like what he had with Carpenter, like you know, sex
Speaker 1: capaid buddies. The son also claimed that Bob Crane called
Speaker 1: Carpenter the night before that he was killed to end
Speaker 1: the friendship. So investigators and the media starts speculating, Oh,
Speaker 1: Carpenter's angry that like Crane is going to be like
Speaker 1: ditching him and sort of cutting off his supply because
Speaker 1: he got a lot of women by hanging out with
Speaker 1: this like celeb, you know, and he.
Speaker 3: Didn't want that to end.
Speaker 1: So Carpenter's lawyers, though, in court they show proof like
Speaker 1: none of this is true.
Speaker 3: These two guys are good as gold.
Speaker 1: They had dinner the night before the murder together, and
Speaker 1: then the camera tripod theory was just a theory because
Speaker 1: the murder weapon had never been found. They pointed out
Speaker 1: a ton of sloppy police work, including that some evidence
Speaker 1: was lost by the police. Like again, this is they
Speaker 1: are now at trials sixteen years after the crime, and
Speaker 1: they're in a district where that didn't even have a
Speaker 1: homicide department when this happened. So yeah, they fucked up.
Speaker 1: They lost a bunch of evidence. There was like genetic
Speaker 1: material that got lost. They also presented the idea that
Speaker 1: since Bob Crane had filmed so many women having sex
Speaker 1: with them and many of them unknowingly, like to bring
Speaker 1: the word back knowingly or unknowingly, you know, that it
Speaker 1: could have been any of those women that committed the
Speaker 1: murder to stop the tape from getting out a Lah Hayden,
Speaker 1: Pantier Angela Agnelli, so not to mention that each one
Speaker 1: of these women's husbands or boyfriends could also be suspects.
Speaker 1: So they basically just introduced reasonable out reasonable out reasonable doubt.
Speaker 1: Carpenter gets acquitted, and he maintained his innocence until he
Speaker 1: died just four years later in nineteen ninety eight. So
Speaker 1: this case is still unsolved today, which is wild. And
Speaker 1: because they basically went back and tried to test DNA
Speaker 1: once DNA came back in, but they had lost a
Speaker 1: bunch of DNA and they they found some DNA matched
Speaker 1: a male and then other DNA was inconclusive, So it
Speaker 1: doesn't exonerate Carpenter, but it does seem like there would
Speaker 1: have been a maybe.
Speaker 3: I don't even know if they had Carpenter's DNA before
Speaker 3: he died. I think they did.
Speaker 1: They did, but it doesn't exonerate him, but it still
Speaker 1: doesn't solve anything. So eventually this was made into a
Speaker 1: movie called Auto Focus and Greg Kinnear which where the
Speaker 1: fuck is Greg Kenneyer? I feel like he was in
Speaker 1: everything for a little while. So this movie came out
Speaker 1: in two thousand and two, Auto Focus and Greg Kenneer
Speaker 1: plays Crane and Lisa's mom's favorite actor Willem Dafoe plays Carpenter. Okay,
Speaker 1: and guess who plays Patricia his second wife Maria Bellow
Speaker 1: aka Calvin's mom from Law and Order SBA.
Speaker 3: Yeah, so everything comes full circle.
Speaker 1: So I don't know if this movie Auto Focus like
Speaker 1: did well or got anything, but it was basically like
Speaker 1: about this Hogan's heroes Guy Rita Wilson's in the movie,
Speaker 1: Michael McKean's in the movie, like, but it's about you know,
Speaker 1: how this fucking TV star gets murdered and like, yeah,
Speaker 1: his case is still unsolved. So but I mean, I
Speaker 1: kind of believe in the Oukham's razor of it all.
Speaker 1: It does feel like it would have been Carpenter, you know,
Speaker 1: like the most obvious thing is like that, or maybe
Speaker 1: that's Murphy's law, but like it just feels like it's
Speaker 1: probably Carpenter and they just simply didn't have enough evidence
Speaker 1: and the police bungled it. But no, you don't say, yeah, yeah,
Speaker 1: you can't be It's not impossible anyway. That is that
Speaker 1: that is the crimes of Hooked.
Speaker 2: Yeah, it's a lot of It's a lot from the episode,
Speaker 2: but also like such an intersection TV the Holocaust.
Speaker 1: Yeah, and this episode was all over the place, so obviously,
Speaker 1: I mean I wanted to I wanted to know if
Speaker 1: there was like a true story of like high school
Speaker 1: girls like from like you know, sort of participating in
Speaker 1: sex work for clothes or for you know whatever. But
Speaker 1: I guess that might be kind of too vague or
Speaker 1: I don't know if that's I'm sure plenty of girls
Speaker 1: do stuff like that.
Speaker 3: I don't know, I don't know. I was wondering if
Speaker 3: that was.
Speaker 1: Based on like a specific thing, but there was nothing
Speaker 1: I could find anywhere about it, so I'm sure the
Speaker 1: listeners will let me know if that's the case.
Speaker 3: But anyway, we.
Speaker 2: Could interview Hayden Panetare but from Remember the Titans.
Speaker 3: Yes, baby girl.
Speaker 1: Yeah, well we don't have a guest today, so we
Speaker 1: can dive right into the post mortem a lot to say, oh.
Speaker 3: My god, oh my god, oh my god. Yeah that
Speaker 3: was fun.
Speaker 1: Yeah, crazy episode crazy, so many twists, turns, like eighteen
Speaker 1: different little moments clues, like it really is a wild episode,
Speaker 1: and we I think we did catch three plot holes, so.
Speaker 3: I don't know.
Speaker 1: Yeah that's something about us, Like I just don't even
Speaker 1: understand they were, like were they like we got to
Speaker 1: get a certain number of guest stars in this episode,
Speaker 1: like just so many extra characters, so many people, and
Speaker 1: yeah kind of.
Speaker 2: Care at her best. I'm sorry, I like teen sluts
Speaker 2: getting in trouble. I like it the character mean, I
Speaker 2: like babes. Like sorry, sorry that I like teen girls
Speaker 2: committing I.
Speaker 1: Feel like in a weird SB though she is the
Speaker 1: girl that grew up from the episode abuse, like she
Speaker 1: like her parents were in Europe. They go, yeah, you
Speaker 1: could talk to her, like you know, like it altered
Speaker 1: a universe, Like that's just that little girl that was
Speaker 1: obsessed with Olivia and wanted to have a girl's day,
Speaker 1: just like now goes to Catholic school and hooks up
Speaker 1: for clothes.
Speaker 2: Like this is so off topic, Like I don't know
Speaker 2: if it's because it's winter and I've been wearing a
Speaker 2: lot of clothes or like I've been in a rush.
Speaker 2: I don't think I've seen my tattoos in a long time,
Speaker 2: and I'm like looking at the zoom and I'm like,
Speaker 2: oh wow, I forgot look at all those or I
Speaker 2: don't think about it well because sometimes I'm like what
Speaker 2: am I doing? But then I look at them, like, oh,
Speaker 2: my arm looks so cool. I'm like a cool, Yeah, cool,
Speaker 2: that is cool. As Hayden Paneterre, Yeah listen, it sucks,
Speaker 2: but I like the overall lesson And it's like if
Speaker 2: you're if you're not getting attention at home, you're gonna
Speaker 2: get it somewhere else. And it could be just being
Speaker 2: a people pleaser or like grades. You know, there was
Speaker 2: like this one incest case and this is actually happening
Speaker 2: podcast where like perfectionism is also a response to abuse,
Speaker 2: but like maybe not attention that might be different.
Speaker 3: I just I don't know.
Speaker 2: It's just how you can't escape your trauma and it
Speaker 2: manifests in all these different ways. And not to go
Speaker 2: back to our government, but these are like Trump, these
Speaker 2: are maniacs. These like you've seen Trump's Parencylon Musk's parents,
Speaker 2: bad parents, bad Yeah, those psychos, psychos. You can't escape
Speaker 2: the trauma. You got to dive in or you're gonna
Speaker 2: be stuck or evil.
Speaker 3: Like it. It is hard.
Speaker 2: And that episode, that one thing has just stuck with me,
Speaker 2: what an electric episode with that one line, like really
Speaker 2: kind of sick. It sticks with me. Yeah, yeah, yeah,
Speaker 2: for sure. And they didn't get attention for different things.
Speaker 2: One it's like we're poor, who has to work hard?
Speaker 2: The mom's dead, and then the other it's like we're rich,
Speaker 2: we're in Europe, we don't care.
Speaker 3: So it's like I love that too, like I love
Speaker 3: us to be I I do you know?
Speaker 2: We found all these little moments, but like such an
Speaker 2: incredible show.
Speaker 1: Yeah, and wow, like this girl, this little teen, the
Speaker 1: main teen who dies. I mean she goes from hooking
Speaker 1: up with half of of the people on the teen
Speaker 1: dating site to hooking up with older men who are
Speaker 1: buying her stuff to full porn career and she just
Speaker 1: turned fifteen. We got to get her some more attention.
Speaker 1: We need the dad to get another job. He needs
Speaker 1: to stay home.
Speaker 3: But he didn't know.
Speaker 2: That's the whole thing, Like she was duplicitous, is that
Speaker 2: the But I mean her mom, I mean her mom's.
Speaker 1: Death is probably what kicked out all all of this off.
Speaker 1: You know, she's probably just like very traumatized by that
Speaker 1: and then was looking for to fill the void.
Speaker 2: But there's nothing old men love more than a teen,
Speaker 2: so that's a lot of it.
Speaker 1: And Bob Crane, Colonel Roberty Hogan himself Bob Crane loving
Speaker 1: the girls. I don't think he liked him underage according
Speaker 1: to what I was reading. But you know this guy,
Speaker 1: I mean, he had a successful life and then it
Speaker 1: was just his He just liked the women too much
Speaker 1: and it led him to it led him astray or
Speaker 1: I don't know if it led to his ultimate death.
Speaker 3: I don't know what the fuck happened.
Speaker 1: But if you have any tips on the old Bob
Speaker 1: Crane murder, let us know. But anyway, let's uh, that
Speaker 1: was a great episode. Top to your teens. Yeah, let's
Speaker 1: move into our What was Mister peg Do, which is
Speaker 1: our weekly segment where we direct you towards an organization
Speaker 1: or a cause, or a document a documentary something to
Speaker 1: give you more info about today today's episode, We're gonna
Speaker 1: do something a little different today because we got this
Speaker 1: amazing email from two of our listeners named Coco and Quinn,
Speaker 1: who work at the Center for Reproductive Rights. And that
Speaker 1: is a center that is a global legal advocacy organization
Speaker 1: headquartered in New York City that seeks to advance reproductive
Speaker 1: rights such as abortion. And the email that they sent
Speaker 1: us is so awesome. Lizai will forward it to you. Wait, no,
Speaker 1: you got it. You got it as well. She originally
Speaker 1: sent it to you. I don't know if you saw it.
Speaker 3: But bump it up. Bump it up. Yeah, I'll bump
Speaker 3: it up.
Speaker 1: But these girls sent us the most creative email where
Speaker 1: they use like the names of all the episodes, like
Speaker 1: basically it says less than a month in our work
Speaker 1: has already been majorly shaken by the born psychopath in
Speaker 1: the White House. Coco is our dearly beloved social media
Speaker 1: manager everybody follow at repro Rights on Instagram and is
Speaker 1: underwater trying to keep up with the bad news and
Speaker 1: obscene attacks that like, they just used all SVU episode
Speaker 1: titles in the whole email, and it goes on and on.
Speaker 1: Quinn's role is doing global repro research. She can confirm
Speaker 1: that it's literally disturbing how all these anti human rights
Speaker 1: politicians and policies around the world are gaining traction. We're
Speaker 1: terrified that all the progress that has been gained towards
Speaker 1: liberalizing abortion laws will decline and fall in part because
Speaker 1: of the devastating, disappearing act of us AID. So, like,
Speaker 1: it's just this wonderful email, and I like the I
Speaker 1: believe we are obviously a very pro reproductive rights podcast,
Speaker 1: so I wanted to call them out, thank them for
Speaker 1: their email, and send you guys to the Center for
Speaker 1: Reproductive Rights. Follow repro Rights on Instagram and get more
Speaker 1: information about that, because I'm sure that that organization is
Speaker 1: getting hit from all over the place from the fuckings born.
Speaker 3: Psychopath in chief.
Speaker 1: So follow repro Rights on Instagram, like we said, and
Speaker 1: then you can also go to reproductive rights dot org
Speaker 1: to get more information about amazing organization. And again, thank
Speaker 1: you so much to Coco and Quinn for listening and
Speaker 1: for all the work that you do that will be
Speaker 1: linked in our stories the day this episode comes out
Speaker 1: and saved forever on Instagram at That's Messed Up Pod
Speaker 1: in our WWSPD highlight.
Speaker 2: Thank you so much for that, and what do you know?
Speaker 2: Another episode next week Spellbound from season eighteen, episode eighteen
Speaker 2: not about a spelling bee, shockingly about witches or is it?
Speaker 3: We love you guys, We'll see you next week. I
Speaker 3: appreciate you so much.
Speaker 2: Bie, That's Messed Up as an exactly right production.
Speaker 1: If you have compliments you'd like to give us or
Speaker 1: episodes you'd like us to cover, shoot us an email
Speaker 1: at That's Messed uppod at gmail dot com.
Speaker 2: Follow the podcast on Instagram at That's Messed Up Pod
Speaker 2: and on Twitter at Messed Up Pod, and follow us
Speaker 2: personally at Kara Klank and at glitter Cheese.
Speaker 1: As always, please see our show notes for sources and
Speaker 1: more information.
Speaker 2: Thank you so much to our senior producer Casey O'Brien
Speaker 2: and our associate producer Christina Chamberlain, and to our.
Speaker 1: Mixer John Bradley and our guest booker Patrick Cottner.
Speaker 2: And to Henry Kaperski for our theme song and Carly
Speaker 2: Geen Andrews for our artwork.
Speaker 1: Thank you to our executive producers Georgia Hardstart, Karen Kilgarriff,
Speaker 1: Daniel Kramer and everybody at Exactly Right Media.
Speaker 3: Dun Dun