1 00:00:46,480 --> 00:00:51,961 Speaker 1: School of Humans. Helen Got Murder Line actively investigates cold 2 00:00:52,040 --> 00:00:55,361 Speaker 1: case murders in an effort to raise public awareness invite 3 00:00:55,401 --> 00:00:58,761 Speaker 1: witnesses to come forward and present evidence that could potentially 4 00:00:58,840 --> 00:01:02,961 Speaker 1: be further investigated by law enforcement. While we value insights 5 00:01:03,001 --> 00:01:06,160 Speaker 1: from family and community members, their statements should not be 6 00:01:06,200 --> 00:01:09,961 Speaker 1: considered evidence and point to the challenges of verifying facts 7 00:01:10,041 --> 00:01:14,001 Speaker 1: inherent in cold cases. We remind listeners that everyone is 8 00:01:14,080 --> 00:01:17,160 Speaker 1: presumed innocent until proven guilty in a court of law. 9 00:01:17,961 --> 00:01:20,840 Speaker 1: Nothing in the podcast is intended to state or imply 10 00:01:21,041 --> 00:01:23,601 Speaker 1: that anyone who has not been convicted of a crime 11 00:01:24,121 --> 00:01:27,121 Speaker 1: is guilty of any wrongdoing. Thanks for listening. 12 00:01:30,200 --> 00:01:33,920 Speaker 2: On January seventh, nineteen ninety five, at around twelve fifty pm, 13 00:01:34,281 --> 00:01:37,881 Speaker 2: two women, Monica Jones and her girlfriend Cheryl Edwards. We're 14 00:01:37,961 --> 00:01:42,080 Speaker 2: driving down Highway fifty six near Brockwell, Arkansas, when Cheryl 15 00:01:42,121 --> 00:01:45,201 Speaker 2: saw smoke coming from a trailer. It was coming from 16 00:01:45,200 --> 00:01:48,801 Speaker 2: the residence of forty three year old Connie Townsend. The 17 00:01:48,841 --> 00:01:51,241 Speaker 2: two women pulled over and ran up to the trailer 18 00:01:51,281 --> 00:01:54,481 Speaker 2: to try to help. At around that same time, another woman, 19 00:01:54,561 --> 00:01:58,841 Speaker 2: Billy Brownie, arrived. Monica and Cheryl both desperately tried to 20 00:01:58,881 --> 00:02:01,601 Speaker 2: get inside the trailer, but the heat was too intense. 21 00:02:02,121 --> 00:02:06,041 Speaker 2: The trailer was already engulfed in flames. By the time 22 00:02:06,081 --> 00:02:08,960 Speaker 2: the first officer from the Izard County Sheriff's Office and 23 00:02:09,201 --> 00:02:12,361 Speaker 2: personnel from the Calico Rock Fire Department arrived on the scene, 24 00:02:12,481 --> 00:02:16,601 Speaker 2: it was chaos. Monica told the responding officer that she 25 00:02:16,721 --> 00:02:19,161 Speaker 2: and Cheryl were trying to check to see if anyone 26 00:02:19,240 --> 00:02:21,641 Speaker 2: was alive in the trailer, but there was so much 27 00:02:21,680 --> 00:02:25,481 Speaker 2: smoke that Cheryl was having trouble breathing. There was a 28 00:02:25,481 --> 00:02:28,441 Speaker 2: lot of confusion at that scene, but all three women 29 00:02:28,561 --> 00:02:31,281 Speaker 2: told the officer that they had seen a man. They 30 00:02:31,361 --> 00:02:33,441 Speaker 2: said that he had arrived right before them and that 31 00:02:33,481 --> 00:02:37,001 Speaker 2: he was driving a blue Forward Ranger. All three said 32 00:02:37,001 --> 00:02:40,000 Speaker 2: he was a medium billed with blonde, curly hair, and 33 00:02:40,121 --> 00:02:43,401 Speaker 2: that he was wearing a baseball cap. According to the 34 00:02:43,401 --> 00:02:46,641 Speaker 2: police support, Monica said that while she was trying to 35 00:02:46,680 --> 00:02:49,761 Speaker 2: break in, the mystery man was saying there wasn't anyone 36 00:02:49,800 --> 00:02:53,401 Speaker 2: inside the trailer. But this mystery man had left the scene. 37 00:02:53,681 --> 00:02:57,361 Speaker 2: No one saw him again. Monica said that they heard 38 00:02:57,401 --> 00:03:00,841 Speaker 2: something inside the trailer, something that sounded like a baby crying. 39 00:03:01,481 --> 00:03:05,121 Speaker 2: They could hear a high pitched voice someone screaming helped me. 40 00:03:05,721 --> 00:03:08,361 Speaker 2: They were desperately trying to pry the door open, but 41 00:03:08,441 --> 00:03:10,441 Speaker 2: the fire shot out the window and they had to 42 00:03:10,441 --> 00:03:14,401 Speaker 2: back off. Cheryl said in her statement quote black smoke 43 00:03:14,521 --> 00:03:17,241 Speaker 2: was boiling, and I could see a few feet inside 44 00:03:17,281 --> 00:03:20,281 Speaker 2: the door end quote. She said that at some point 45 00:03:20,321 --> 00:03:23,401 Speaker 2: the sound of what she described as the baby crying stopped. 46 00:03:24,121 --> 00:03:25,401 Speaker 3: Cheryl was gasping for. 47 00:03:25,361 --> 00:03:29,081 Speaker 2: Breath, and then Monica saw Dale Townsend, the owner of 48 00:03:29,121 --> 00:03:32,921 Speaker 2: the trailer and the father of Connie's estranged husband, David Townsend, arrive. 49 00:03:33,841 --> 00:03:37,121 Speaker 2: According to the police report, by the time police arrived, 50 00:03:37,481 --> 00:03:40,881 Speaker 2: the officer noted there were about twenty to twenty five people. 51 00:03:40,601 --> 00:03:41,921 Speaker 3: Standing in Connie's yard. 52 00:03:43,001 --> 00:03:47,001 Speaker 2: Connie town burned to death while it seemed like half 53 00:03:47,001 --> 00:03:51,361 Speaker 2: the town stood outside, and multiple people told police about 54 00:03:51,441 --> 00:03:55,521 Speaker 2: threats she had received earlier that day, and yet thirty 55 00:03:55,601 --> 00:03:59,601 Speaker 2: years later, no one has ever been arrested or charged 56 00:03:59,761 --> 00:04:00,881 Speaker 2: in connection with her death. 57 00:04:02,281 --> 00:04:03,321 Speaker 3: I'm Catherine Townsend. 58 00:04:03,801 --> 00:04:06,161 Speaker 2: Over the past seven years of making my true crime 59 00:04:06,201 --> 00:04:09,281 Speaker 2: podcast Helen Gone, I've learned that there is no such 60 00:04:09,361 --> 00:04:13,121 Speaker 2: thing as a small town where murder never happens. I've 61 00:04:13,161 --> 00:04:16,281 Speaker 2: received hundreds of messages from people all around the country 62 00:04:16,320 --> 00:04:19,041 Speaker 2: asking for help with an unsolved murder that's affected them, 63 00:04:19,281 --> 00:04:21,361 Speaker 2: their families, and their communities. 64 00:04:21,921 --> 00:04:22,721 Speaker 3: If you have a. 65 00:04:22,681 --> 00:04:24,440 Speaker 2: Case you'd like me and my team to look into, 66 00:04:24,841 --> 00:04:26,681 Speaker 2: you can reach out to us at our Helen Gone 67 00:04:26,760 --> 00:04:29,881 Speaker 2: Murder Line at six seven eight seven four four six 68 00:04:30,041 --> 00:04:33,561 Speaker 2: one four five. That's six seven eight seven four four six' 69 00:04:33,640 --> 00:04:36,681 Speaker 2: one four, five or you can send us a message 70 00:04:36,721 --> 00:04:41,440 Speaker 2: On instagram At helen. Gonepod this Is Helen Gone Murder. 71 00:04:41,481 --> 00:05:28,200 Speaker 2: Line Connie townshend's murder is very well known In, Brockwell. 72 00:05:28,281 --> 00:05:31,880 Speaker 2: Arkansas even though it's been thirty, years people still talk 73 00:05:31,921 --> 00:05:35,320 Speaker 2: about it all the. Time in, FACT i found out 74 00:05:35,321 --> 00:05:38,601 Speaker 2: About Connie townshend's murder in twenty. EIGHTEEN i was in 75 00:05:38,601 --> 00:05:41,961 Speaker 2: the Guy on area Investigating Rebecca goulds murder for season 76 00:05:42,001 --> 00:05:44,601 Speaker 2: one Of Helen, gone AND i remember it. VI i 77 00:05:44,681 --> 00:05:46,721 Speaker 2: was at The Possum trot gas station AND i was 78 00:05:46,761 --> 00:05:49,880 Speaker 2: talking to the clerk. THERE i asked him About Rebecca gould's. 79 00:05:49,881 --> 00:05:51,161 Speaker 3: CASE i told. 80 00:05:50,961 --> 00:05:53,521 Speaker 2: Him my name Was Catherine townsend and the first thing 81 00:05:53,561 --> 00:05:56,041 Speaker 2: he asked me was IF i was any kin To Connie. 82 00:05:56,121 --> 00:05:58,721 Speaker 2: TOWNSEND i, Said i'm not related to. Her we just 83 00:05:58,761 --> 00:06:01,121 Speaker 2: happened to have the same last. Name it's a complete. 84 00:06:01,121 --> 00:06:04,441 Speaker 2: Coincidence he told me that she had burned to death 85 00:06:04,521 --> 00:06:07,641 Speaker 2: and that everybody knew who did, it but that no 86 00:06:07,681 --> 00:06:10,521 Speaker 2: one had ever been arrested or, charged and he believed 87 00:06:10,681 --> 00:06:13,640 Speaker 2: no one ever would. Be we were able to do 88 00:06:13,681 --> 00:06:16,721 Speaker 2: a foyer request and got some copies of the police 89 00:06:16,721 --> 00:06:20,400 Speaker 2: report from The Arkansas State. Police at the, Scene Billy, 90 00:06:20,481 --> 00:06:23,361 Speaker 2: browning one of the, witnesses told the officer that she 91 00:06:23,441 --> 00:06:26,641 Speaker 2: had Moved connie's red car so the fire department vehicles 92 00:06:26,641 --> 00:06:29,481 Speaker 2: could get in closer to the. Trailer she told the 93 00:06:29,521 --> 00:06:31,721 Speaker 2: officer that when she got into the car to move, 94 00:06:31,761 --> 00:06:34,080 Speaker 2: it she noticed that there was a purse sitting on 95 00:06:34,121 --> 00:06:36,841 Speaker 2: the passenger, seat so the officer took the purse and 96 00:06:36,841 --> 00:06:40,041 Speaker 2: looked through. It police noted in their report that when 97 00:06:40,081 --> 00:06:42,401 Speaker 2: they went inside the, car it was undamaged in the. 98 00:06:42,401 --> 00:06:45,881 Speaker 2: Fire all Of connie's things were inside, it including her 99 00:06:45,921 --> 00:06:48,801 Speaker 2: black purse with black and brown, wallet all of her credit, 100 00:06:48,841 --> 00:06:51,881 Speaker 2: cards some checks made out to her for small amounts of, 101 00:06:51,921 --> 00:06:55,681 Speaker 2: money and two hundred and eleven dollars in. Cash so 102 00:06:56,041 --> 00:06:58,320 Speaker 2: if the fire was not an, accident if it was, 103 00:06:58,481 --> 00:07:03,761 Speaker 2: arson robbery was probably not the motive. Here connie's sister 104 00:07:03,841 --> 00:07:07,241 Speaker 2: and brother in, Law delores And John, brown both later 105 00:07:07,321 --> 00:07:11,321 Speaker 2: told police That Connie townshend was divorcing her estranged, Husband. 106 00:07:11,361 --> 00:07:14,721 Speaker 2: David delores said that she had talked To connie several 107 00:07:14,761 --> 00:07:17,121 Speaker 2: times that day and That connie had said she was 108 00:07:17,201 --> 00:07:20,921 Speaker 2: planning on moving. Out delores said That connie was scared 109 00:07:20,961 --> 00:07:23,561 Speaker 2: of her husband and That david had Threatened connie in the. 110 00:07:23,561 --> 00:07:28,361 Speaker 2: Past david And connie had two, Daughters Stacy lane And amber. 111 00:07:28,401 --> 00:07:32,161 Speaker 2: Want david also had a son from another. Relationship his 112 00:07:32,241 --> 00:07:36,281 Speaker 2: name Was David. Lynn connie was his. Stepmother amber had 113 00:07:36,321 --> 00:07:39,761 Speaker 2: been staying With connie in the residence that burned. Down connie's, 114 00:07:39,801 --> 00:07:42,801 Speaker 2: Daughter stacey lived In, salem which is about eighteen miles 115 00:07:42,841 --> 00:07:46,521 Speaker 2: down the road From. Well stacey told detectives that her 116 00:07:46,561 --> 00:07:49,921 Speaker 2: father had threatened her mother's. Life in, fact she Said 117 00:07:50,001 --> 00:07:53,321 Speaker 2: david had Threatened connie the same day the trailer burned. 118 00:07:53,361 --> 00:07:55,281 Speaker 3: Down we talked To Stacy. 119 00:07:55,361 --> 00:07:59,361 Speaker 2: Namber they said they Remember david verbally abusing their mother 120 00:07:59,601 --> 00:08:00,201 Speaker 2: since they were. 121 00:08:00,241 --> 00:08:03,881 Speaker 4: Young it seemed like all the time when we were, 122 00:08:03,961 --> 00:08:07,841 Speaker 4: little EVEN i remember listening to it from our. Bedroom 123 00:08:07,841 --> 00:08:09,081 Speaker 4: don't you Use Stacy. 124 00:08:09,601 --> 00:08:11,041 Speaker 5: WELL i remember on fighting all the. 125 00:08:11,001 --> 00:08:11,961 Speaker 4: Time frighten all the. 126 00:08:12,001 --> 00:08:12,241 Speaker 1: Time. 127 00:08:12,881 --> 00:08:16,401 Speaker 5: Yeah living with him was like walking on. EGGSHELLS i 128 00:08:16,401 --> 00:08:18,681 Speaker 5: mean he drank from the time he got up he 129 00:08:18,721 --> 00:08:20,801 Speaker 5: hits the vodka bottle until the time he went to, 130 00:08:20,801 --> 00:08:24,641 Speaker 5: bed and we all walked on. Eggshells if the dirty 131 00:08:24,681 --> 00:08:27,841 Speaker 5: dishes were, there he saw at, it or if you 132 00:08:27,921 --> 00:08:31,041 Speaker 5: left your curling iron on too, long he fought in the. 133 00:08:31,081 --> 00:08:33,761 Speaker 4: TRASH i remember the dish has been in the in 134 00:08:33,800 --> 00:08:37,081 Speaker 4: the trash when we got home one day Because mom 135 00:08:37,241 --> 00:08:39,001 Speaker 4: wasn't washing when we left or. 136 00:08:39,001 --> 00:08:43,441 Speaker 5: SOMETHING i don't remember the physical threats as far as that. 137 00:08:43,560 --> 00:08:45,321 Speaker 5: Goes it's because when we were, little we just went 138 00:08:45,361 --> 00:08:48,641 Speaker 5: to our. Bedroom now that, morning WHEN i talked to 139 00:08:48,680 --> 00:08:51,361 Speaker 5: her because me And amber we had to work that, 140 00:08:51,481 --> 00:08:53,601 Speaker 5: morning it backed. You lafeb was the only reason we 141 00:08:53,641 --> 00:08:56,681 Speaker 5: didn't help her. Move and WHEN i called, her she 142 00:08:56,800 --> 00:08:59,680 Speaker 5: said That david had already been, there AND i, said, 143 00:08:59,680 --> 00:09:03,121 Speaker 5: oh and she, said, yeah he's already been here and 144 00:09:03,160 --> 00:09:06,320 Speaker 5: threatened me with bodily. Harm of, course you don't ever 145 00:09:06,321 --> 00:09:07,201 Speaker 5: think it'll happen to. 146 00:09:07,241 --> 00:09:10,881 Speaker 4: YOU i remember him telling, her if you Believe i'm 147 00:09:10,920 --> 00:09:14,960 Speaker 4: going to burn the house and everything in, it he, 148 00:09:15,040 --> 00:09:17,761 Speaker 4: said you had her grandpa that had died in a 149 00:09:17,881 --> 00:09:21,920 Speaker 4: house fire and they never found out, why and he, 150 00:09:22,001 --> 00:09:23,521 Speaker 4: SAID i KNOW i can do this thing to. 151 00:09:23,561 --> 00:09:31,321 Speaker 2: You connie And david's marriage had been rocky for quite some. 152 00:09:31,441 --> 00:09:35,281 Speaker 2: Time according to police, records they had been separated for 153 00:09:35,321 --> 00:09:38,321 Speaker 2: around four, years but from reading through the incident, report 154 00:09:38,361 --> 00:09:41,721 Speaker 2: the timeline is a bit confusing Because david said he 155 00:09:41,801 --> 00:09:44,561 Speaker 2: lived full time in the home With connie until around 156 00:09:44,561 --> 00:09:47,121 Speaker 2: a year before the, fire but he also said he 157 00:09:47,161 --> 00:09:50,281 Speaker 2: And connie had not been intimate on a regular basis 158 00:09:50,321 --> 00:09:51,321 Speaker 2: for around eighteen. 159 00:09:51,361 --> 00:09:53,361 Speaker 3: Months it seems like things were. 160 00:09:53,201 --> 00:09:56,761 Speaker 2: Complicated and that even Though david And connie were, separated 161 00:09:57,121 --> 00:09:59,961 Speaker 2: he had a habit of dropping by whenever he. Wanted 162 00:10:01,081 --> 00:10:04,801 Speaker 2: connie's daughters told Us david would stop by even after 163 00:10:04,841 --> 00:10:08,721 Speaker 2: he And connie were, separated and That connie knew that 164 00:10:08,801 --> 00:10:11,721 Speaker 2: she was on a deadline to move, out because they 165 00:10:11,761 --> 00:10:14,561 Speaker 2: said she had recently found out the home was not 166 00:10:14,801 --> 00:10:19,161 Speaker 2: in their, name hers And, david's but actually owned By david's, 167 00:10:19,201 --> 00:10:23,321 Speaker 2: Father Dale. Townsend, stacy And amber said that money was 168 00:10:23,361 --> 00:10:25,401 Speaker 2: tight and That david had a drinking. 169 00:10:25,401 --> 00:10:28,281 Speaker 5: Problem when me And ambers first moved in with, him 170 00:10:28,361 --> 00:10:30,401 Speaker 5: he had a good, job he worked At Colors, hall 171 00:10:30,561 --> 00:10:33,961 Speaker 5: and he always took a thermos of vodka with. Him 172 00:10:33,961 --> 00:10:37,081 Speaker 5: ever not he finally got, fired and THEN i don't. 173 00:10:36,881 --> 00:10:37,721 Speaker 3: Think he worked after. 174 00:10:37,761 --> 00:10:40,321 Speaker 5: That he just depended on mom's chick from the shirt. 175 00:10:40,401 --> 00:10:44,201 Speaker 2: Factory at the time of the, fire conn had been 176 00:10:44,241 --> 00:10:47,001 Speaker 2: living in the trailer on her, own While david stayed 177 00:10:47,001 --> 00:10:50,041 Speaker 2: with his mother and. Father evidence found at the scene 178 00:10:50,201 --> 00:10:53,881 Speaker 2: seemed to confirm What connie's daughters told police That connie 179 00:10:53,881 --> 00:10:56,521 Speaker 2: had been packing up her stuff and planning to move 180 00:10:56,561 --> 00:11:03,681 Speaker 2: out that. Day the trailer burned all the way to the. 181 00:11:03,721 --> 00:11:07,281 Speaker 2: Ground all that remained were some beams and the bricks 182 00:11:07,321 --> 00:11:11,041 Speaker 2: that were around the. Fireplace we will be sharing parts 183 00:11:11,041 --> 00:11:13,401 Speaker 2: of the case file on Our instagram BECAUSE i do 184 00:11:13,521 --> 00:11:16,040 Speaker 2: need some help and detective work from people who live 185 00:11:16,041 --> 00:11:19,801 Speaker 2: in the. Community i'll explain more about that. Later once 186 00:11:19,881 --> 00:11:22,560 Speaker 2: the fire department put out the smoldering remains of the, 187 00:11:22,601 --> 00:11:26,321 Speaker 2: Trailer connie's body was found lying face down on the 188 00:11:26,321 --> 00:11:27,560 Speaker 2: floor of a bedroom that. 189 00:11:27,601 --> 00:11:29,001 Speaker 3: Was being used as a utility. 190 00:11:29,041 --> 00:11:32,881 Speaker 2: Room connie's daughters questioned that they say that was a 191 00:11:32,961 --> 00:11:36,601 Speaker 2: junk room That connie rarely went, into so they wondered 192 00:11:37,121 --> 00:11:39,801 Speaker 2: why was she in there and why couldn't she get? 193 00:11:39,801 --> 00:11:43,601 Speaker 2: Out and there was something else strange found With. Connie 194 00:11:44,001 --> 00:11:47,161 Speaker 2: there was a pair of scissors found underneath her. Body 195 00:11:48,081 --> 00:11:51,761 Speaker 2: why Was, connie in the words of the Fire marshal's, report. 196 00:11:51,361 --> 00:11:52,121 Speaker 3: Trapped in that. 197 00:11:52,241 --> 00:11:55,161 Speaker 2: Room why couldn't she crawl out a window or get 198 00:11:55,161 --> 00:11:59,041 Speaker 2: out the? Door and why were there scissors found underneath her? 199 00:11:59,041 --> 00:12:11,200 Speaker 2: Body connie's daughters provided us with a copy of her autopsy. 200 00:12:11,201 --> 00:12:15,441 Speaker 2: Report this has never been made. Public in that report 201 00:12:15,521 --> 00:12:19,761 Speaker 2: Were connie's autopsy, photos which are. Heartbreaking her daughters say 202 00:12:19,801 --> 00:12:22,081 Speaker 2: they have not looked at the photos and they don't plan, 203 00:12:22,161 --> 00:12:26,081 Speaker 2: to and looking through, THEM i can definitely understand WHY 204 00:12:26,241 --> 00:12:29,961 Speaker 2: i am studying these photos thoroughly to look for any potential. 205 00:12:30,041 --> 00:12:34,081 Speaker 2: Clues it's especially jarring to see the photos Of connie 206 00:12:34,121 --> 00:12:36,841 Speaker 2: from the crime scene juxtaposed with other pictures that were 207 00:12:36,841 --> 00:12:39,721 Speaker 2: part of the case, file mainly polaroids of her hanging 208 00:12:39,761 --> 00:12:44,081 Speaker 2: out inside her home with her daughters and. Pets according 209 00:12:44,121 --> 00:12:48,481 Speaker 2: to the, Report connie's entire body was burned beyond. Recognition 210 00:12:49,121 --> 00:12:53,601 Speaker 2: her skin was. Black the autopsy described her organs as. 211 00:12:53,681 --> 00:12:57,441 Speaker 2: Cooked i'm not an arson, expert But i've actually never 212 00:12:57,561 --> 00:12:58,161 Speaker 2: seen a. 213 00:12:58,081 --> 00:13:01,201 Speaker 3: Fire victim described like. That those are the words in 214 00:13:01,241 --> 00:13:02,921 Speaker 3: the autopsy, report not. 215 00:13:03,081 --> 00:13:07,321 Speaker 2: Mine whatever happened in there must have happened very, fast 216 00:13:07,961 --> 00:13:11,281 Speaker 2: fast enough to engulf the trailer Before connie was able 217 00:13:11,321 --> 00:13:14,641 Speaker 2: to get. Out the report said there was complete charring 218 00:13:14,681 --> 00:13:18,081 Speaker 2: Of connie's chest and abdominal, walls and that they could 219 00:13:18,121 --> 00:13:21,401 Speaker 2: not find other evidence of injury like blunt force, trauma for. 220 00:13:21,441 --> 00:13:24,800 Speaker 2: Example but after looking at these photos and how completely 221 00:13:24,841 --> 00:13:28,201 Speaker 2: she was, BURNED i wonder if with that much tissue, 222 00:13:28,280 --> 00:13:30,961 Speaker 2: damage if it would even be possible to tell if 223 00:13:31,001 --> 00:13:34,321 Speaker 2: there was evidence of. Trauma the cause of death was 224 00:13:34,361 --> 00:13:37,881 Speaker 2: listed as smoke and soot. Inhalation the manner of death was, 225 00:13:37,921 --> 00:13:42,121 Speaker 2: undetermined and if that was the cause of. Death Was 226 00:13:42,241 --> 00:13:46,521 Speaker 2: connie alive when the fire hit or is it possible 227 00:13:46,521 --> 00:13:50,001 Speaker 2: that she was dead or injured before the fire. Started 228 00:13:51,521 --> 00:13:54,801 Speaker 2: so now we have a woman dead and multiple, people 229 00:13:54,881 --> 00:13:58,601 Speaker 2: including the victim's own, children telling police that her relationship 230 00:13:58,641 --> 00:14:01,521 Speaker 2: with her husband had been volatile and that he had threatened, 231 00:14:01,561 --> 00:14:04,321 Speaker 2: her including threats on the same day when she was 232 00:14:04,361 --> 00:14:06,201 Speaker 2: moving out of their home the day of the. Fire 233 00:14:07,201 --> 00:14:10,441 Speaker 2: police Interviewed David townsend at The Izard County sheriff's office 234 00:14:10,441 --> 00:14:14,641 Speaker 2: On january, thirteenth nineteen ninety. Five david told police that 235 00:14:14,761 --> 00:14:17,801 Speaker 2: on the morning of the, Fire, Saturday january, seventh nineteen ninety, 236 00:14:17,841 --> 00:14:20,241 Speaker 2: five that he woke up at his parents' house around five. 237 00:14:20,281 --> 00:14:22,561 Speaker 3: Am he ate breakfast between. 238 00:14:22,281 --> 00:14:24,561 Speaker 2: Six and, seven and then he was supposed to go 239 00:14:24,641 --> 00:14:26,841 Speaker 2: to the farm with his, father But david said he 240 00:14:26,881 --> 00:14:28,041 Speaker 2: was having a problem with his. 241 00:14:28,081 --> 00:14:30,721 Speaker 3: Car it was iced, up so he de iced the 242 00:14:30,761 --> 00:14:31,801 Speaker 3: car with a portable. 243 00:14:31,801 --> 00:14:35,401 Speaker 2: Heater, then at around eight to nine, am he left 244 00:14:35,441 --> 00:14:37,561 Speaker 2: his parents residence and went over to the trailer Where 245 00:14:37,601 --> 00:14:41,361 Speaker 2: connie was. Living david admitted that he argued With connie 246 00:14:41,401 --> 00:14:43,921 Speaker 2: while he was. There he said that they were were 247 00:14:44,001 --> 00:14:46,481 Speaker 2: arguing over who was supposed to help her move. Out 248 00:14:47,401 --> 00:14:49,521 Speaker 2: david said that he offered to Help, connie but she 249 00:14:49,601 --> 00:14:52,081 Speaker 2: told him she didn't want his. Help she wanted her 250 00:14:52,081 --> 00:14:55,281 Speaker 2: two brothers in, Law John brown And Arnie hutchinson to help, 251 00:14:55,281 --> 00:14:58,281 Speaker 2: her and for some, Reason david didn't want those guys 252 00:14:58,361 --> 00:15:01,361 Speaker 2: to help. Her david said that after having words With, 253 00:15:01,441 --> 00:15:04,641 Speaker 2: connie he. Left he wasn't exactly sure what time he, 254 00:15:04,761 --> 00:15:07,121 Speaker 2: left but he estimated it was around nine thirty. Am 255 00:15:07,481 --> 00:15:09,481 Speaker 2: he said he got back to his parents' residence at 256 00:15:09,481 --> 00:15:13,601 Speaker 2: around ten. Am david said that after that he talked 257 00:15:13,601 --> 00:15:16,721 Speaker 2: to his parents About connie moving out and explained that 258 00:15:16,801 --> 00:15:20,281 Speaker 2: she didn't want him around while she was. Moving david 259 00:15:20,281 --> 00:15:22,721 Speaker 2: said that his Son David lynn arrived at his parents 260 00:15:22,841 --> 00:15:25,921 Speaker 2: house sometime that. Afternoon he said he got the times mixed. 261 00:15:26,001 --> 00:15:28,241 Speaker 2: Up at, first he said he Thought David lynn got 262 00:15:28,241 --> 00:15:31,521 Speaker 2: there at around, eleven but he later told police he 263 00:15:31,601 --> 00:15:34,881 Speaker 2: realized he had been wrong about that. Time david stated 264 00:15:34,961 --> 00:15:37,321 Speaker 2: that he his, son his, mother and father had. Lunch 265 00:15:37,361 --> 00:15:40,361 Speaker 2: they had a, sandwich and that sometime between twelve forty 266 00:15:40,401 --> 00:15:43,361 Speaker 2: and one, pm his Son David lynne suggested they go. 267 00:15:43,401 --> 00:15:47,241 Speaker 2: Fishing david said that he said, Okay David lynn picked 268 00:15:47,281 --> 00:15:49,521 Speaker 2: up some, tackle and they took their rods and reels 269 00:15:49,521 --> 00:15:52,281 Speaker 2: and headed. Out david said their plan was to go 270 00:15:52,321 --> 00:15:53,121 Speaker 2: fishing at The White. 271 00:15:53,201 --> 00:15:53,401 Speaker 3: River. 272 00:15:53,481 --> 00:15:55,481 Speaker 2: Now police asked him at that point if they were 273 00:15:55,521 --> 00:15:57,801 Speaker 2: going to go out there without a, boat And david said. 274 00:15:57,881 --> 00:16:01,081 Speaker 2: Yes he said that before, leaving he went back into 275 00:16:01,081 --> 00:16:03,281 Speaker 2: the house and told his mom and dad where they were. 276 00:16:03,281 --> 00:16:06,201 Speaker 2: Going david said that his mom and dad asked when 277 00:16:06,201 --> 00:16:08,401 Speaker 2: they would be, back And david made a joke and 278 00:16:08,441 --> 00:16:11,481 Speaker 2: said probably in a. Week then he Said he And 279 00:16:11,561 --> 00:16:14,321 Speaker 2: David lynn left the home sometime after one pm and 280 00:16:14,361 --> 00:16:15,841 Speaker 2: they started driving Toward Calico. 281 00:16:15,961 --> 00:16:18,721 Speaker 3: Rock he said that along the way they stopped at a. 282 00:16:18,761 --> 00:16:21,081 Speaker 2: Harps david bought a can of corn and a can 283 00:16:21,121 --> 00:16:23,561 Speaker 2: opener and got a coke from a machine. There from, 284 00:16:23,601 --> 00:16:25,441 Speaker 2: there he, said they went to fish off a river. 285 00:16:25,561 --> 00:16:28,401 Speaker 2: Bank he said he wasn't sure how long they were out, 286 00:16:28,401 --> 00:16:30,761 Speaker 2: there but that it was after THREE pm by the 287 00:16:30,801 --> 00:16:33,641 Speaker 2: time they got back to his parents'. House police Asked 288 00:16:33,721 --> 00:16:36,081 Speaker 2: david if there had been any witnesses who could confirm this. 289 00:16:36,161 --> 00:16:40,201 Speaker 2: Story david did mention seeing a couple of people at 290 00:16:40,241 --> 00:16:43,921 Speaker 2: harps and out in the, field but he said that 291 00:16:43,961 --> 00:16:46,321 Speaker 2: these people couldn't see, him so in the end there 292 00:16:46,361 --> 00:16:48,801 Speaker 2: was no one other Than David lynn who could verify 293 00:16:48,961 --> 00:16:53,121 Speaker 2: the fishing trip all. By David lynn did verify his father's. 294 00:16:53,161 --> 00:16:56,161 Speaker 2: Story he said they were out fishing that. Day david 295 00:16:56,201 --> 00:16:58,001 Speaker 2: said that when he and his son were heading back, 296 00:16:58,041 --> 00:16:59,961 Speaker 2: home and we're in the area Of Spring creek off 297 00:16:59,961 --> 00:17:02,921 Speaker 2: the main, highway they saw his Father dale coming toward. 298 00:17:02,961 --> 00:17:05,721 Speaker 2: Them he said that it was just his father driving the, 299 00:17:05,801 --> 00:17:08,761 Speaker 2: vehicle a nineteen ninety FOUR gmc maroon and. 300 00:17:08,761 --> 00:17:10,281 Speaker 3: Silver four wheel drive pickup. 301 00:17:10,281 --> 00:17:13,761 Speaker 2: TRUCK i mention everyone's vehicle making models here by the, 302 00:17:13,801 --> 00:17:17,360 Speaker 2: way because there are several unidentified vehicles seen At connie's, 303 00:17:17,360 --> 00:17:19,401 Speaker 2: trailer and we're trying to figure out who owned those. 304 00:17:19,481 --> 00:17:23,920 Speaker 2: Vehicles david said he glanced down at a clock in the. 305 00:17:23,961 --> 00:17:27,480 Speaker 2: Truck he believed it read either three fourteen or three SIXTEEN. 306 00:17:27,521 --> 00:17:30,881 Speaker 2: Pm he said his father hit the brakes and signaled 307 00:17:30,880 --> 00:17:32,241 Speaker 2: For david to pull over to the side of the, 308 00:17:32,321 --> 00:17:35,080 Speaker 2: road which he said he. Did at that, Point david 309 00:17:35,120 --> 00:17:37,441 Speaker 2: told police that his Father, dale said he had bad 310 00:17:37,481 --> 00:17:41,001 Speaker 2: news for. Him david said he asked what. Happened his 311 00:17:41,120 --> 00:17:43,880 Speaker 2: dad told him the trailer had burned. Down he had 312 00:17:43,921 --> 00:17:45,680 Speaker 2: said his father was shaking at the time and it 313 00:17:45,681 --> 00:17:48,721 Speaker 2: seemed like he was. Distraught david said that's when his 314 00:17:48,801 --> 00:17:50,600 Speaker 2: father told, him that's not the. 315 00:17:50,641 --> 00:17:52,241 Speaker 3: Worst they think someone's in. 316 00:17:52,241 --> 00:17:55,801 Speaker 2: There, then he said that he And David lynne followed 317 00:17:55,801 --> 00:17:59,321 Speaker 2: his father and all went back to their. Residence after, 318 00:17:59,361 --> 00:18:01,641 Speaker 2: that he said they all went to the trailer Where 319 00:18:01,641 --> 00:18:04,641 Speaker 2: connie had been. Living david said that when they got, 320 00:18:04,641 --> 00:18:07,321 Speaker 2: there a crowd had formed, outside and that while he 321 00:18:07,401 --> 00:18:09,721 Speaker 2: was talking to, police someone called him over to the 322 00:18:09,761 --> 00:18:11,961 Speaker 2: side and told him they had found something in the 323 00:18:11,961 --> 00:18:14,481 Speaker 2: trailer and for him to get out of, there so 324 00:18:14,801 --> 00:18:16,721 Speaker 2: he said he got into his truck and drove back 325 00:18:16,721 --> 00:18:19,921 Speaker 2: to his parents'. House david told police that after getting 326 00:18:19,961 --> 00:18:22,120 Speaker 2: back to his parents', house he never returned to the. 327 00:18:22,161 --> 00:18:24,961 Speaker 2: Scene he said he never left his father's house until 328 00:18:25,001 --> 00:18:28,360 Speaker 2: he got woken up at around eleven. Pm we did 329 00:18:28,401 --> 00:18:31,001 Speaker 2: try to reach out To David, lynne but we learned that, 330 00:18:31,121 --> 00:18:34,321 Speaker 2: he as well As david's, parents have all passed. Away 331 00:18:36,441 --> 00:18:40,041 Speaker 2: police Asked david about his relationship With. Connie he said 332 00:18:40,041 --> 00:18:42,761 Speaker 2: that he And connie had separated around four years. Earlier 333 00:18:43,121 --> 00:18:45,601 Speaker 2: he said he had not lived with her at her 334 00:18:45,641 --> 00:18:49,441 Speaker 2: residence for the past. Year, again he admitted to police 335 00:18:49,441 --> 00:18:51,041 Speaker 2: that he was there on the day of the, fire 336 00:18:51,121 --> 00:18:53,321 Speaker 2: but he said he And connie never had a big. 337 00:18:53,441 --> 00:18:57,281 Speaker 2: Argument he said the only disagreement they had was about 338 00:18:57,281 --> 00:19:01,481 Speaker 2: what he'd already told. Police david said that he found 339 00:19:01,481 --> 00:19:05,041 Speaker 2: Out connie had filed for divorce three days, earlier and 340 00:19:05,121 --> 00:19:07,281 Speaker 2: he found that out after his father told him he 341 00:19:07,281 --> 00:19:09,561 Speaker 2: had a registered letter at the post. Office but he 342 00:19:09,601 --> 00:19:12,400 Speaker 2: said the divorce had not been a total shock Because 343 00:19:12,441 --> 00:19:14,761 Speaker 2: connie had said she was going to file for, Divorce 344 00:19:15,481 --> 00:19:19,761 Speaker 2: david said because he had gotten A. Dwi Apparently connie 345 00:19:19,801 --> 00:19:22,441 Speaker 2: was afraid that because of that charge that her car 346 00:19:22,441 --> 00:19:25,600 Speaker 2: insurance rates could go. Up because of, that she wanted 347 00:19:25,601 --> 00:19:28,081 Speaker 2: to get the divorce paperwork, processed and he knew. That 348 00:19:29,080 --> 00:19:33,321 Speaker 2: connie's Daughter stacy And, amber And connie's mother all told 349 00:19:33,361 --> 00:19:38,161 Speaker 2: police they were very suspicious Of david because he had made. 350 00:19:38,241 --> 00:19:41,961 Speaker 2: Threats connie's mother said in a sworn statement That david 351 00:19:41,961 --> 00:19:44,840 Speaker 2: had been threatening her daughter for a, while but she 352 00:19:44,921 --> 00:19:48,120 Speaker 2: Said connie had not really taken the threat seriously up 353 00:19:48,241 --> 00:19:51,920 Speaker 2: until the months leading up to her. Death david was 354 00:19:52,001 --> 00:19:54,441 Speaker 2: there on the day of the, fire on the day 355 00:19:54,481 --> 00:19:57,600 Speaker 2: When connie was moving, out and shortly after he left the, 356 00:19:57,641 --> 00:20:00,921 Speaker 2: residence her house burned to the. Ground and there were 357 00:20:01,041 --> 00:20:04,601 Speaker 2: other things that were odd at that, scene including the family. 358 00:20:04,681 --> 00:20:08,401 Speaker 2: Dog connie And david had a black dog Named, bobo 359 00:20:09,080 --> 00:20:12,401 Speaker 2: and the dog was normally kept chained On connie's. Property 360 00:20:12,761 --> 00:20:15,481 Speaker 2: when he wasn't, inside he was chained to the carport, 361 00:20:15,561 --> 00:20:18,761 Speaker 2: outside but on the day of the, fire the dog 362 00:20:19,041 --> 00:20:24,241 Speaker 2: was nowhere to be. Found did someone unchain the? Dog if, 363 00:20:24,281 --> 00:20:30,641 Speaker 2: so who did it and? Why when detectives Searched Connie townsend's, 364 00:20:30,681 --> 00:20:33,640 Speaker 2: vehicle they found evidence that she and her daughter had 365 00:20:33,681 --> 00:20:37,761 Speaker 2: been packing to. Leave one thing detectives found was children's 366 00:20:37,761 --> 00:20:41,321 Speaker 2: baby clothing in plastic, bags and there was something, else 367 00:20:41,840 --> 00:20:44,961 Speaker 2: a black overnight bag with clothing as in it and. Condoms, 368 00:20:46,080 --> 00:20:49,161 Speaker 2: now investigating a murder puts you in a weird position 369 00:20:49,321 --> 00:20:52,721 Speaker 2: of feeling like you're invading someone's privacy at the same, 370 00:20:52,801 --> 00:20:56,001 Speaker 2: time it's necessary to ask these types of invasive questions 371 00:20:56,001 --> 00:20:57,001 Speaker 2: in order to help solve. 372 00:20:57,080 --> 00:20:59,681 Speaker 3: Cases so one natural. 373 00:20:59,361 --> 00:21:02,881 Speaker 2: Question that came up for me was Was connie planning 374 00:21:02,881 --> 00:21:03,681 Speaker 2: on going to see? 375 00:21:03,681 --> 00:21:06,961 Speaker 3: Someone was she dating anyone at that? Time but that 376 00:21:07,121 --> 00:21:08,160 Speaker 3: question was quickly. 377 00:21:08,201 --> 00:21:12,201 Speaker 2: Answered connie's, Daughter amber told us, that to her, knowledge 378 00:21:12,361 --> 00:21:15,721 Speaker 2: her mother was not dating. Anyone amber also said the 379 00:21:15,761 --> 00:21:19,401 Speaker 2: condoms and overnight bag were. Hers she said that her 380 00:21:19,441 --> 00:21:22,681 Speaker 2: mom's stuff and her stuff was mixed up because. 381 00:21:22,241 --> 00:21:22,881 Speaker 3: They were moving. 382 00:21:22,921 --> 00:21:29,721 Speaker 2: Together On january, thirteenth nineteen ninety, Five David townshend consented 383 00:21:29,801 --> 00:21:32,521 Speaker 2: to taking a voice stress test at The Baxter County Sheriff's. 384 00:21:32,521 --> 00:21:36,521 Speaker 2: Office voice stress, tests also known as voice stress, analysis 385 00:21:37,041 --> 00:21:39,881 Speaker 2: measure very subtle differences in a person's voice while they're 386 00:21:39,881 --> 00:21:44,281 Speaker 2: being questioned in an attempt to detect, deception but like hoolygraph, 387 00:21:44,321 --> 00:21:48,361 Speaker 2: test they are not admissible in, court and their usefulness 388 00:21:48,361 --> 00:21:52,561 Speaker 2: and effectiveness has been questioned. Extensively in two thousand and, 389 00:21:52,601 --> 00:21:55,400 Speaker 2: eight The National institute Of justice did a study that 390 00:21:55,521 --> 00:21:59,201 Speaker 2: found THAT bsa was only accurate about fifty percent of 391 00:21:59,201 --> 00:22:02,241 Speaker 2: the time in a field, Setting so, basically the study 392 00:22:02,281 --> 00:22:06,001 Speaker 2: found THAT vsa was no more reliable than flipping a. Coin, 393 00:22:06,961 --> 00:22:10,761 Speaker 2: now the investigator notes indicated that the stress test results 394 00:22:10,801 --> 00:22:13,521 Speaker 2: would be part of the case, file but they. 395 00:22:13,561 --> 00:22:15,321 Speaker 3: Weren't there were remarks in. 396 00:22:15,321 --> 00:22:18,481 Speaker 2: The case file that indicated that police believed That david was, 397 00:22:18,481 --> 00:22:21,600 Speaker 2: susceptive but a lot of parts of this case file 398 00:22:21,641 --> 00:22:25,641 Speaker 2: appear to be missing or cut. Off investigators also talked 399 00:22:25,641 --> 00:22:28,521 Speaker 2: To David. Lynn David lynn confirmed that he and his 400 00:22:28,561 --> 00:22:30,641 Speaker 2: father were fishing at the time of the house, Fire 401 00:22:31,080 --> 00:22:34,761 Speaker 2: so if this was, arson and If david was, elsewhere 402 00:22:35,041 --> 00:22:39,201 Speaker 2: who else could have been. Involved there are handwritten notes 403 00:22:39,201 --> 00:22:42,080 Speaker 2: in the police case. File some of them involved Joe Anne, 404 00:22:42,080 --> 00:22:45,441 Speaker 2: ellis a woman Who Davevid townsend was dating at the 405 00:22:45,441 --> 00:22:48,761 Speaker 2: time Of connie's. Death according to the police, report they 406 00:22:48,801 --> 00:22:51,440 Speaker 2: had been together for a. While Joe anne And david 407 00:22:51,441 --> 00:22:54,360 Speaker 2: had actually been dating for around three years. Now it 408 00:22:54,401 --> 00:22:56,920 Speaker 2: would seem as Though david's girlfriend would be a natural 409 00:22:56,961 --> 00:23:00,281 Speaker 2: person to talk, to and yet there's no record of 410 00:23:00,321 --> 00:23:02,961 Speaker 2: any law enforcement interview with her in this case. File 411 00:23:03,721 --> 00:23:06,561 Speaker 2: maybe that part of the case file was. Lost maybe 412 00:23:06,601 --> 00:23:09,561 Speaker 2: she was never. Questioned we just don't know for. Sure 413 00:23:10,641 --> 00:23:13,401 Speaker 2: but one of the most cryptic notes in the case 414 00:23:13,441 --> 00:23:17,120 Speaker 2: file is on the handwritten notes. Page at the, bottom it, reads, 415 00:23:17,281 --> 00:23:19,281 Speaker 2: quote talk To eddie About Joeanne. 416 00:23:19,281 --> 00:23:22,840 Speaker 3: Ellis Was joanne With David townsend at the? Time end. 417 00:23:22,881 --> 00:23:26,201 Speaker 2: Quote we are trying to figure out Who eddie is 418 00:23:26,521 --> 00:23:30,041 Speaker 2: and when we, do hopefully we'll find. Him there's another 419 00:23:30,121 --> 00:23:33,160 Speaker 2: interesting thing about Joe Anne. Ellis back in nineteen ninety 420 00:23:33,481 --> 00:23:37,081 Speaker 2: she was involved in allegations of another. FIRE a trailer 421 00:23:37,121 --> 00:23:39,481 Speaker 2: that she had been living at caught fire and burned 422 00:23:39,521 --> 00:23:43,041 Speaker 2: to the. Ground and then in nineteen ninety, two Both 423 00:23:43,121 --> 00:23:46,400 Speaker 2: joanne and an acquaintance of hers Name, ronnie were charged 424 00:23:46,401 --> 00:23:49,360 Speaker 2: in connection with the. Fire Joe anne was charged with 425 00:23:49,401 --> 00:23:53,921 Speaker 2: solicitation to commit, arson which she pleaded guilty. To ronnie 426 00:23:53,961 --> 00:23:56,921 Speaker 2: was charged with arson and theft of. Property he pleaded 427 00:23:56,921 --> 00:23:59,441 Speaker 2: guilty to the theft of, property but the arson charges 428 00:23:59,441 --> 00:24:02,441 Speaker 2: against him were. Dismissed in the, end both Joe anne 429 00:24:02,441 --> 00:24:05,881 Speaker 2: And ronnie got, probation but there was nothing more About 430 00:24:05,961 --> 00:24:10,521 Speaker 2: joanne's previous charges In Connie townsend's case. File it seemed 431 00:24:10,521 --> 00:24:15,041 Speaker 2: to be just another lead that went. Nowhere Joe Anne 432 00:24:15,121 --> 00:24:18,521 Speaker 2: ellis passed away several years, ago about a year after 433 00:24:18,561 --> 00:24:21,201 Speaker 2: she And David townshend were, married so we can't ask. 434 00:24:21,241 --> 00:24:29,160 Speaker 2: Her Was connie's trailer burning down an accident or a 435 00:24:29,201 --> 00:24:33,441 Speaker 2: homicide and potential arson. Investigation there is a report from 436 00:24:33,441 --> 00:24:36,521 Speaker 2: the fire marshal and an electrician went in with law 437 00:24:36,561 --> 00:24:38,961 Speaker 2: enforcement and looked at the service, box the fuse, box 438 00:24:39,281 --> 00:24:42,601 Speaker 2: and the dryer's electrical. Cord Now i'm going to read 439 00:24:42,681 --> 00:24:46,161 Speaker 2: directly from this because i am not an. Electrician they 440 00:24:46,241 --> 00:24:49,001 Speaker 2: found that the service box had been, shorted and that 441 00:24:49,041 --> 00:24:51,281 Speaker 2: there was arching on the hot wire caused by the, 442 00:24:51,281 --> 00:24:54,441 Speaker 2: short and also that one breaker switch was off and 443 00:24:54,521 --> 00:24:58,161 Speaker 2: one was. On the electrician stated that in their, opinion 444 00:24:58,561 --> 00:25:02,120 Speaker 2: the short could have contributed to or caused the fire 445 00:25:02,121 --> 00:25:05,600 Speaker 2: that destroyed the. Trailer so the trailer fire could have 446 00:25:05,601 --> 00:25:08,801 Speaker 2: been an, accident but a lot of people believed that 447 00:25:08,840 --> 00:25:13,561 Speaker 2: the evidence pointed to. Arson there are other potential clues 448 00:25:13,601 --> 00:25:17,241 Speaker 2: buried in the case, fall including some other handwritten. Notes 449 00:25:17,641 --> 00:25:20,201 Speaker 2: they were written by someone with The Arkansas State, police 450 00:25:20,201 --> 00:25:22,840 Speaker 2: and they indicate that at one point police suspected that 451 00:25:22,921 --> 00:25:26,241 Speaker 2: an accelerant like gasoline had been, used because while the 452 00:25:26,321 --> 00:25:29,521 Speaker 2: fire report said they didn't find any signs of. Accelerant 453 00:25:30,161 --> 00:25:33,080 Speaker 2: one of the handwritten, notes which frustratingly was one of 454 00:25:33,121 --> 00:25:36,801 Speaker 2: the hardest to, Decipher reid's quote they started at the 455 00:25:36,801 --> 00:25:40,441 Speaker 2: living room and went to kitchen throwing diesel gas end. 456 00:25:40,521 --> 00:25:44,361 Speaker 2: Quote just because accelerant is not found to the scene 457 00:25:44,561 --> 00:25:48,360 Speaker 2: doesn't mean that accelerant wasn't. Used it might have all burned. 458 00:25:48,441 --> 00:25:52,160 Speaker 2: Up we need to get more details on that note 459 00:25:52,241 --> 00:25:56,521 Speaker 2: and on other handwritten, notes including one that reads Blue 460 00:25:56,601 --> 00:26:00,920 Speaker 2: chevy later seventies was parked on road Behind connie's. Trailer 461 00:26:02,161 --> 00:26:05,081 Speaker 2: this probably refers to the vehicle that the three women 462 00:26:05,121 --> 00:26:08,160 Speaker 2: who arrived at the scene first said they, saw the 463 00:26:08,161 --> 00:26:10,401 Speaker 2: one that was driven by the curly haired man, who 464 00:26:10,441 --> 00:26:14,721 Speaker 2: to my, knowledge has never been. Identified police were building 465 00:26:14,801 --> 00:26:17,880 Speaker 2: a case Against David, townsend but they had some, roadblocks 466 00:26:17,921 --> 00:26:20,801 Speaker 2: including the fact that the manner of death was still. 467 00:26:21,041 --> 00:26:25,321 Speaker 2: Undetermined the prosecuting attorney at the time WAS. Tj, hovey 468 00:26:25,681 --> 00:26:28,761 Speaker 2: and in nineteen ninety, six his office filed a subpoena 469 00:26:29,041 --> 00:26:31,361 Speaker 2: in order to get a complete copy Of connie. 470 00:26:31,121 --> 00:26:32,361 Speaker 3: And david's divorce case. 471 00:26:32,361 --> 00:26:36,321 Speaker 2: File just a few months After connie's, death On august twenty, 472 00:26:36,361 --> 00:26:40,361 Speaker 2: first nineteen ninety, Five David townshend remarried to Joe Anne. 473 00:26:40,361 --> 00:26:45,321 Speaker 2: Ellis one natural question That i'm sure occurred to investigators was, 474 00:26:45,801 --> 00:26:49,680 Speaker 2: who if, anyone stood to profit From connie's, Death and 475 00:26:49,721 --> 00:26:52,681 Speaker 2: there's evidence in the case file that investigators did try 476 00:26:52,721 --> 00:26:55,761 Speaker 2: to follow the. Money In january of nineteen ninety, Six 477 00:26:56,241 --> 00:27:00,361 Speaker 2: Izard county issued a subpoena for all insurance records pertaining 478 00:27:00,401 --> 00:27:02,961 Speaker 2: To Connie, Townsend and there was something else in the 479 00:27:03,001 --> 00:27:07,321 Speaker 2: case file related To connie's work insurance. Policy connie worked 480 00:27:07,361 --> 00:27:10,920 Speaker 2: At White RIVER T shirts factory for many, years she 481 00:27:11,041 --> 00:27:14,241 Speaker 2: would be eligible for life insurance payouts from her. Job 482 00:27:15,080 --> 00:27:17,880 Speaker 2: there's something called A. CSOP i learned that this is 483 00:27:17,921 --> 00:27:21,001 Speaker 2: a type of work insurance. Policy Since connie had worked 484 00:27:21,001 --> 00:27:23,840 Speaker 2: At White RIVER T shirts factory for many, years she 485 00:27:24,001 --> 00:27:27,761 Speaker 2: was eligible for life insurance payouts from her. Job police 486 00:27:27,801 --> 00:27:32,001 Speaker 2: talked To Arlene. Martz arlene said that sometime In october 487 00:27:32,001 --> 00:27:34,241 Speaker 2: of nineteen ninety, four That connie had come in and 488 00:27:34,281 --> 00:27:38,001 Speaker 2: wanted to talk to. Her arlene told Police connie was 489 00:27:38,041 --> 00:27:41,961 Speaker 2: asking questions about Getting david removed as the primary beneficiary 490 00:27:41,961 --> 00:27:46,561 Speaker 2: of her life insurance. Policy arlene Said connie apparently wanted 491 00:27:46,601 --> 00:27:49,400 Speaker 2: to name her daughters as primary beneficiaries and to Take 492 00:27:49,521 --> 00:27:53,400 Speaker 2: david off the. Policy arlene said that she explained To 493 00:27:53,481 --> 00:27:57,160 Speaker 2: connie that Because connie And david were legally, married that 494 00:27:57,321 --> 00:28:01,080 Speaker 2: making a change like that would Require david's, signature And 495 00:28:01,241 --> 00:28:04,600 Speaker 2: arlene Said connie told Her david would never sign that. 496 00:28:04,681 --> 00:28:09,361 Speaker 2: Form arlene said that she Gave connie a new life 497 00:28:09,361 --> 00:28:12,841 Speaker 2: insurance enrollment, form but That connie never returned that. Form 498 00:28:13,801 --> 00:28:17,481 Speaker 2: police also talked to Joe Anne ellis's, Son Michael Wade. 499 00:28:17,481 --> 00:28:21,601 Speaker 2: Bailey michael told investigators On january sixteenth that he had 500 00:28:21,641 --> 00:28:24,441 Speaker 2: just moved back To arkansas From tennessee and that he 501 00:28:24,481 --> 00:28:26,761 Speaker 2: had been staying With david and his, mother Joe. 502 00:28:26,761 --> 00:28:28,681 Speaker 3: Anne he told. 503 00:28:28,401 --> 00:28:32,281 Speaker 2: Police that once When david was, drunk That david Told 504 00:28:32,401 --> 00:28:36,281 Speaker 2: michael that he Killed, connie But michael Said david didn't 505 00:28:36,321 --> 00:28:40,521 Speaker 2: provide any additional details beyond that one, statement and there's 506 00:28:40,601 --> 00:28:44,841 Speaker 2: no record that police ever Interviewed michael. Again there were 507 00:28:44,921 --> 00:28:46,921 Speaker 2: other leads that were apparently never ruled. 508 00:28:46,921 --> 00:28:48,001 Speaker 3: Out on the. 509 00:28:48,041 --> 00:28:51,081 Speaker 2: Day of the, fire a witness Named Jackie stacy said 510 00:28:51,121 --> 00:28:53,721 Speaker 2: she was driving On highway fifty. Six she said she 511 00:28:53,841 --> 00:28:57,241 Speaker 2: Passed connie's house and noticed a black truck with multicolored 512 00:28:57,281 --> 00:29:01,081 Speaker 2: stripes and chrome rims parked outside at around ten thirty 513 00:29:01,161 --> 00:29:04,441 Speaker 2: or eleven am on the Morning connie. Died who was 514 00:29:04,521 --> 00:29:07,241 Speaker 2: driving this truck and were they ever found or. Questioned 515 00:29:08,401 --> 00:29:11,321 Speaker 2: there was another witness Named Peggy. Would she said that 516 00:29:11,441 --> 00:29:14,121 Speaker 2: on the night after the, fire That David townsend showed 517 00:29:14,201 --> 00:29:16,361 Speaker 2: up at her house in a Black. Chevy she said 518 00:29:16,401 --> 00:29:19,401 Speaker 2: it was approximately eight THIRTY pm and That david was 519 00:29:19,441 --> 00:29:22,521 Speaker 2: with a friend of his and That david quote wanted 520 00:29:22,561 --> 00:29:23,281 Speaker 2: to come in and. 521 00:29:23,281 --> 00:29:25,241 Speaker 3: Let his friend get acquainted with me end. 522 00:29:25,321 --> 00:29:28,361 Speaker 2: Quote she Said david hung out there in her yard 523 00:29:28,361 --> 00:29:31,041 Speaker 2: for about ten to fifteen minutes and said he was 524 00:29:31,081 --> 00:29:34,721 Speaker 2: saying she, burned and then. Left peggy said that she 525 00:29:34,841 --> 00:29:39,081 Speaker 2: assumed That david wasn't her, words drunk or. High peggy, 526 00:29:39,161 --> 00:29:42,801 Speaker 2: said according to the, report Quote connie told me just 527 00:29:42,841 --> 00:29:44,921 Speaker 2: a few days before the fire that she was scared 528 00:29:44,961 --> 00:29:47,281 Speaker 2: Of David. Townsend and that he had told her that 529 00:29:47,321 --> 00:29:50,121 Speaker 2: she was not going to divorce, him and, Said i'll 530 00:29:50,201 --> 00:29:53,401 Speaker 2: kill you or make sure nobody gets you except me 531 00:29:53,641 --> 00:29:54,321 Speaker 2: if you divorce. 532 00:29:54,401 --> 00:29:54,921 Speaker 3: Me end. 533 00:29:55,001 --> 00:29:59,921 Speaker 2: Quote connie's, Daughter, stacey told police that at approximately ten 534 00:29:59,961 --> 00:30:03,481 Speaker 2: am On january, seventh she called her. Mother she said 535 00:30:03,481 --> 00:30:05,401 Speaker 2: that she was planning on helping her move out of 536 00:30:05,441 --> 00:30:09,440 Speaker 2: the house that. Day stacy, said, QUOTE i asked her 537 00:30:09,481 --> 00:30:12,440 Speaker 2: If David townsend had been. There she said, yes and 538 00:30:12,481 --> 00:30:14,881 Speaker 2: then he threatened to call the law if she tried 539 00:30:14,881 --> 00:30:17,641 Speaker 2: to take anything out of the. House she also, said 540 00:30:17,681 --> 00:30:21,441 Speaker 2: repeatedly he threatened her with bodily. Harm she didn't sound. 541 00:30:21,561 --> 00:30:24,321 Speaker 2: Right her voice was shaky and sounded kind of. 542 00:30:24,401 --> 00:30:25,201 Speaker 3: Edgy end. 543 00:30:25,281 --> 00:30:29,121 Speaker 2: Quote stacy, said quote while me and my sister were 544 00:30:29,161 --> 00:30:32,481 Speaker 2: living at the, house on numerous, occasions he had threatened 545 00:30:32,521 --> 00:30:33,281 Speaker 2: to burn the house. 546 00:30:33,321 --> 00:30:34,041 Speaker 3: Down end. 547 00:30:34,121 --> 00:30:42,081 Speaker 2: Quote at some, Point Izard county turned the case over 548 00:30:42,161 --> 00:30:43,001 Speaker 2: to The Arkansas State. 549 00:30:43,041 --> 00:30:45,161 Speaker 3: Police in nineteen ninety. 550 00:30:45,161 --> 00:30:48,721 Speaker 2: Five a status report made by an investigator Named Robert 551 00:30:48,801 --> 00:30:52,241 Speaker 2: hicks indicated that the case was still active at the. 552 00:30:52,281 --> 00:30:55,481 Speaker 2: Time the prosecuting attorney for the Sixteenth Judicial district Of 553 00:30:55,601 --> 00:31:00,241 Speaker 2: arkansas Was Thomas James, hively known AS. Tj but On 554 00:31:00,281 --> 00:31:04,161 Speaker 2: Friday april twenty, sixth nineteen ninety, six INVESTIGATOR. T. H 555 00:31:04,241 --> 00:31:06,881 Speaker 2: brown of The Arkansas State police had a conference With, 556 00:31:06,921 --> 00:31:11,961 Speaker 2: tjhvely and according to the investigator's, report after reviewing the, EVIDENCE. 557 00:31:12,041 --> 00:31:14,681 Speaker 2: Tj hively determined there was not enough evidence at that 558 00:31:14,721 --> 00:31:18,041 Speaker 2: point to charge a suspect and concluded that the case 559 00:31:18,081 --> 00:31:21,881 Speaker 2: file should be carried forward as an inactive. Investigation the 560 00:31:22,001 --> 00:31:26,081 Speaker 2: report read quote all investigative leads have been. Exhausted end. 561 00:31:26,161 --> 00:31:31,281 Speaker 2: Quote there's something. Else one other thing to note ABOUT. 562 00:31:31,281 --> 00:31:31,601 Speaker 5: Tj. 563 00:31:31,761 --> 00:31:34,481 Speaker 3: Hively he was the cousin Of David. 564 00:31:34,521 --> 00:31:49,281 Speaker 2: Townsend if you're not From, arkansas you may not have 565 00:31:49,361 --> 00:31:51,201 Speaker 2: heard the Name, Tjhively but. 566 00:31:51,281 --> 00:31:53,721 Speaker 3: In the state Of, arkansas the name is pretty. 567 00:31:53,761 --> 00:31:58,761 Speaker 2: Notorious tjhively was the prosecuting attorney for the Sixteenth Judicial, 568 00:31:58,801 --> 00:32:02,561 Speaker 2: district which Includes Isra, county until nineteen ninety, eight five 569 00:32:02,641 --> 00:32:06,761 Speaker 2: years After connie's trailer. Fire in two, THOUSAND. Tj and 570 00:32:06,801 --> 00:32:10,601 Speaker 2: his law partner and deputy prosecuting, Attorney Wesley John, kettz 571 00:32:10,761 --> 00:32:14,961 Speaker 2: were convicted of mail, fraud money, laundering and. Racketeering this 572 00:32:15,281 --> 00:32:18,081 Speaker 2: was a huge news. Story they were charged with sixty 573 00:32:18,121 --> 00:32:21,441 Speaker 2: four accounts in, Total many of the charges were related 574 00:32:21,481 --> 00:32:24,801 Speaker 2: to two schemes to obtain federal and state grant. Money 575 00:32:25,401 --> 00:32:29,761 Speaker 2: there were also other. Charges according to court, Documents tjhvely 576 00:32:29,881 --> 00:32:33,121 Speaker 2: and a colleague extorted several people during his time as 577 00:32:33,121 --> 00:32:36,681 Speaker 2: a prosecuting, attorney including a man who was charged with, 578 00:32:36,721 --> 00:32:40,841 Speaker 2: molestation a woman whose husband was charged with, murder and 579 00:32:40,921 --> 00:32:42,761 Speaker 2: another man who was charged with drunk. 580 00:32:42,801 --> 00:32:43,161 Speaker 3: DRIVING. 581 00:32:44,001 --> 00:32:47,921 Speaker 2: Tj hively was accused of extorting all three of these. 582 00:32:47,921 --> 00:32:53,001 Speaker 2: People after a federal jury, Trial tjhvely was eventually acquitted 583 00:32:53,041 --> 00:32:56,401 Speaker 2: of money laundering, charges but he was convicted of mail 584 00:32:56,401 --> 00:32:59,921 Speaker 2: fraud and the deputy prosecutor was convicted of aiding and a. 585 00:32:59,961 --> 00:33:04,801 Speaker 2: Betting they were also both convicted of. Racketeering tjhively was 586 00:33:04,841 --> 00:33:08,161 Speaker 2: sentenced to concurrent five year sentences for each count and 587 00:33:08,441 --> 00:33:11,721 Speaker 2: ordered to repay the almost four hundred and thirty thousand 588 00:33:11,801 --> 00:33:13,241 Speaker 2: dollars he received from the. 589 00:33:13,241 --> 00:33:15,761 Speaker 3: Grants, now nothing ABOUT. 590 00:33:15,761 --> 00:33:20,041 Speaker 2: Tj hively's trial and charges mentioned anything About Connie townsend's. 591 00:33:20,081 --> 00:33:23,521 Speaker 3: Case, HOWEVER. Tj hively was a cousin Of David. 592 00:33:23,561 --> 00:33:26,161 Speaker 2: Townsend And i'm bringing this up because we have a 593 00:33:26,201 --> 00:33:30,521 Speaker 2: situation where the person responsible for deciding whether charges were 594 00:33:30,561 --> 00:33:33,641 Speaker 2: brought against one of his own relatives was convicted of 595 00:33:33,681 --> 00:33:37,081 Speaker 2: serious charges later that related to alleged misuse of his. 596 00:33:37,161 --> 00:33:38,921 Speaker 3: Office did the fact THAT. 597 00:33:38,961 --> 00:33:41,601 Speaker 2: Tj hovey was a cousin Of David townsend's affect the 598 00:33:41,641 --> 00:33:45,121 Speaker 2: investigation in any? WAY i think it's a question that's worth. 599 00:33:45,161 --> 00:33:48,401 Speaker 2: Asking with the, caveat of, course we don't know if 600 00:33:48,401 --> 00:33:50,801 Speaker 2: they were. Close we don't know If david was a distant. 601 00:33:50,801 --> 00:33:55,041 Speaker 2: Cousin these are small, towns and, honestly it often seems 602 00:33:55,081 --> 00:33:56,241 Speaker 2: like everyone. 603 00:33:55,881 --> 00:33:57,161 Speaker 3: Is related in one way or. 604 00:33:57,201 --> 00:34:02,521 Speaker 2: Another after the prosecutors declined to pursue charges Against david 605 00:34:02,601 --> 00:34:07,921 Speaker 2: in nineteen ninety, Six Connie townshend's case went. Cold eleven years, 606 00:34:07,961 --> 00:34:12,000 Speaker 2: later in two thousand and, Seven connie's Daughter stacy reached 607 00:34:12,040 --> 00:34:14,040 Speaker 2: out to The Arkansas State police to try and get 608 00:34:14,040 --> 00:34:16,960 Speaker 2: a copy of her mother's case. File in two thousand and, 609 00:34:17,040 --> 00:34:20,000 Speaker 2: nine she tried. Again both times she was. 610 00:34:20,080 --> 00:34:25,001 Speaker 5: Unsuccessful Ezrad county really didn't say anything The State police. 611 00:34:25,080 --> 00:34:27,720 Speaker 5: Die he told me that he really really felt That 612 00:34:27,841 --> 00:34:31,280 Speaker 5: david done, it but he just did not have enough. 613 00:34:31,321 --> 00:34:34,080 Speaker 5: Proof he was six and a retire he, said and he, 614 00:34:34,121 --> 00:34:36,120 Speaker 5: SAID i would love to solve this case BEFORE i. 615 00:34:36,201 --> 00:34:40,600 Speaker 5: RETIREMENT i just don't have enough proof at. All if 616 00:34:40,641 --> 00:34:43,080 Speaker 5: we took him the court and he set free and 617 00:34:43,241 --> 00:34:45,960 Speaker 5: there's nothing we can do about. It we went to 618 00:34:46,040 --> 00:34:48,841 Speaker 5: the prosecute an attorney to see if he would sussecute, 619 00:34:48,881 --> 00:34:51,080 Speaker 5: him and he said, NO i just do not have enough. 620 00:34:51,080 --> 00:34:54,561 Speaker 5: Evidence there's NOTHING i can do about. It it ended. 621 00:34:54,361 --> 00:34:58,921 Speaker 2: There WHICH i really can't understand because at the, time 622 00:34:59,001 --> 00:35:01,841 Speaker 2: as we, said the case file had been labeled. INACTIVE 623 00:35:02,601 --> 00:35:05,721 Speaker 2: i get that police are in a hard. Position obviously 624 00:35:05,801 --> 00:35:07,921 Speaker 2: they don't want to turn over information that would only 625 00:35:08,041 --> 00:35:10,520 Speaker 2: be known to the. Killer but it does seem Like 626 00:35:10,641 --> 00:35:13,640 Speaker 2: connie's case, was like so many other cases we've, seen 627 00:35:14,161 --> 00:35:18,000 Speaker 2: in an investigative dead, zone not officially, closed so the 628 00:35:18,041 --> 00:35:20,761 Speaker 2: files can't be released a family or the general, public 629 00:35:21,161 --> 00:35:24,560 Speaker 2: but also no one is working on. Them we've seen 630 00:35:24,601 --> 00:35:27,401 Speaker 2: the emails sent by members of The Arkansas State police 631 00:35:27,601 --> 00:35:30,321 Speaker 2: where they're talking About stacy reaching out and about her 632 00:35:30,361 --> 00:35:33,160 Speaker 2: wanting a copy of the case, File and from those, 633 00:35:33,241 --> 00:35:37,681 Speaker 2: emails it's clear that the police's prime suspect Was David. 634 00:35:37,681 --> 00:35:42,841 Speaker 2: Townsend so what really happened To Connie? Townsend is there 635 00:35:42,841 --> 00:35:43,721 Speaker 2: a way of figuring that out? 636 00:35:43,801 --> 00:35:46,921 Speaker 3: Out after? All this. Time in my, opinion if there is. 637 00:35:46,881 --> 00:35:49,600 Speaker 2: Ever going to be justice in this, case it's going 638 00:35:49,641 --> 00:35:52,721 Speaker 2: to come from a piece of information from someone in the, 639 00:35:52,761 --> 00:35:56,401 Speaker 2: community someone who was around at the, time not from physical. 640 00:35:56,401 --> 00:36:00,241 Speaker 2: EVIDENCE i say that partially because we learn. That In 641 00:36:00,321 --> 00:36:04,721 Speaker 2: august of twenty twenty, one another, Officer Jackie, stinnett asked 642 00:36:04,761 --> 00:36:07,120 Speaker 2: about the status of evidence that had been seized by 643 00:36:07,121 --> 00:36:10,201 Speaker 2: The State police investigators and sent to The Arkansas State Crime. 644 00:36:10,281 --> 00:36:14,361 Speaker 2: Lab it turned out that the ORIGINAL asp investigator had 645 00:36:14,440 --> 00:36:17,681 Speaker 2: kept some of the, evidence including some burned photos and 646 00:36:17,721 --> 00:36:21,361 Speaker 2: an electrical, plug but it was noted in the report 647 00:36:21,521 --> 00:36:24,640 Speaker 2: that almost all the other items in this case were, 648 00:36:24,721 --> 00:36:29,721 Speaker 2: missing which means tragically that they are almost certainly lost. 649 00:36:29,761 --> 00:36:33,921 Speaker 2: Forever there were only two pieces of evidence, left the 650 00:36:34,001 --> 00:36:37,080 Speaker 2: frames to a pair of, glasses Which connie's daughters say 651 00:36:37,201 --> 00:36:40,641 Speaker 2: were almost certainly hers because she wore, glasses and the 652 00:36:40,681 --> 00:36:45,241 Speaker 2: pair of scissors that were found Under connie's. Body in 653 00:36:45,241 --> 00:36:48,681 Speaker 2: twenty twenty, two a case master report by The Arkansas 654 00:36:48,721 --> 00:36:52,680 Speaker 2: State police indicates that the arson and homicide investigation Into 655 00:36:52,721 --> 00:36:57,921 Speaker 2: Connie townsend's death was officially. Closed Arkansas State police Investigator 656 00:36:57,960 --> 00:37:01,040 Speaker 2: Dennis simons met With. Stacy he told her he had 657 00:37:01,081 --> 00:37:03,921 Speaker 2: reviewed the initial case file and he did not believe 658 00:37:04,041 --> 00:37:06,560 Speaker 2: that there was enough information to change the manner of 659 00:37:06,561 --> 00:37:13,161 Speaker 2: death from pending to. HOMICIDE i believe that there are 660 00:37:13,401 --> 00:37:17,241 Speaker 2: other potential clues in this case. File next week we're 661 00:37:17,241 --> 00:37:19,801 Speaker 2: going to release never before seen pages of this case. 662 00:37:19,801 --> 00:37:22,641 Speaker 2: File we're going to try to figure out If connie's 663 00:37:22,681 --> 00:37:25,281 Speaker 2: house fire could have been an, accident or if there 664 00:37:25,281 --> 00:37:27,841 Speaker 2: are other clues buried in the file that point to. 665 00:37:27,960 --> 00:37:33,081 Speaker 2: Arson and Was David townshend the police's only suspect or 666 00:37:33,201 --> 00:37:36,401 Speaker 2: could other people have been? Involved who was the curly 667 00:37:36,481 --> 00:37:39,480 Speaker 2: haired mystery man at the crime scene and who was 668 00:37:39,601 --> 00:37:43,321 Speaker 2: driving the black truck with the bright colored. Stripes remember 669 00:37:43,321 --> 00:37:45,121 Speaker 2: WHEN i said back at the, beginning we were going 670 00:37:45,201 --> 00:37:47,440 Speaker 2: to be sharing parts of this case file On, instagram 671 00:37:47,641 --> 00:37:49,881 Speaker 2: and THEN i SAID i needed help and detective work. 672 00:37:49,761 --> 00:37:50,761 Speaker 3: From people who lived in the. 673 00:37:50,761 --> 00:37:54,480 Speaker 2: Community we are going to be posting images of this case. 674 00:37:54,521 --> 00:37:56,321 Speaker 3: File i'm going to post them on My. 675 00:37:56,401 --> 00:38:01,161 Speaker 2: Instagram the handle is At Love detective and also at Helen. 676 00:38:01,201 --> 00:38:04,601 Speaker 2: Gonpod there are a lot of case file notes that 677 00:38:04,641 --> 00:38:08,041 Speaker 2: are kind of these cryptic. Scribblings they have partial names 678 00:38:08,081 --> 00:38:10,600 Speaker 2: and a few, details but a lot of them are cut. 679 00:38:10,641 --> 00:38:13,321 Speaker 2: Off i'm hoping there's someone out there who can help 680 00:38:13,361 --> 00:38:16,040 Speaker 2: fill in some of these. Blanks there were twenty to 681 00:38:16,121 --> 00:38:20,921 Speaker 2: twenty five people Outside Connie townsend's. House i'm asking everyone 682 00:38:21,001 --> 00:38:24,201 Speaker 2: to please look at these notes and if you can 683 00:38:24,321 --> 00:38:28,801 Speaker 2: help solve this, mystery please reach. Out even though most 684 00:38:28,801 --> 00:38:31,440 Speaker 2: of the people who were questioned or who were in 685 00:38:31,521 --> 00:38:34,561 Speaker 2: any way involved in this case are, DEAD i believe 686 00:38:34,681 --> 00:38:38,001 Speaker 2: we can still help get justice For connie's. 687 00:38:38,041 --> 00:38:41,841 Speaker 5: FAMILY i know that justice will never be so AND 688 00:38:41,921 --> 00:38:43,960 Speaker 5: i know no one will ever go to, jail old, 689 00:38:43,960 --> 00:38:47,841 Speaker 5: prison be. Arrested that's. Fine i've accepted. THAT i can 690 00:38:47,881 --> 00:38:50,281 Speaker 5: get by with. That BUT i just WISH i knew 691 00:38:50,281 --> 00:38:52,960 Speaker 5: what happened that day and what happened to. Her they 692 00:38:53,081 --> 00:38:55,641 Speaker 5: done something to her that day that she didn't get 693 00:38:55,681 --> 00:38:58,520 Speaker 5: out of that, House AND i just wish somebody would 694 00:38:58,561 --> 00:39:00,721 Speaker 5: just tell me SO i could just get on with, 695 00:39:00,801 --> 00:39:02,721 Speaker 5: it get on with my life and kind of put 696 00:39:02,761 --> 00:39:05,361 Speaker 5: it to the closure and just get mom a boys 697 00:39:05,761 --> 00:39:08,081 Speaker 5: and so like she really never got a, Voice she 698 00:39:08,201 --> 00:39:12,761 Speaker 5: just got. Forgotten ye pushed under the, rug and somebody knows. 699 00:39:12,841 --> 00:39:16,721 Speaker 3: Something I'm Catherine. 700 00:39:16,721 --> 00:39:21,560 Speaker 2: Townsend this Is Helen Gone Murder. Line Helen Gone Murder 701 00:39:21,561 --> 00:39:23,641 Speaker 2: line is a production Of school Of humans And iHeart. 702 00:39:23,641 --> 00:39:26,761 Speaker 2: Podcasts it's written and narrated by Me Catherine townsend and 703 00:39:26,881 --> 00:39:30,721 Speaker 2: produced By Gabby. Watts special thanks To Amy tubbs for 704 00:39:30,721 --> 00:39:31,881 Speaker 2: her research assistance And. 705 00:39:31,960 --> 00:39:33,080 Speaker 3: James wheaton for legal. 706 00:39:33,121 --> 00:39:36,520 Speaker 2: Review Noah camera mixed and scored this. Episode our theme 707 00:39:36,561 --> 00:39:40,921 Speaker 2: song is By Ben. Salek executive producers Are Virginia, Prescott Brandon, 708 00:39:40,960 --> 00:39:44,201 Speaker 2: barr And Else. Crowley listen To Helen gone ad free 709 00:39:44,281 --> 00:39:47,561 Speaker 2: by subscribing to The iHeart True Crime plus channel On Apple. 710 00:39:47,601 --> 00:39:51,201 Speaker 2: Podcasts if you're interested in seeing documents and materials from the, 711 00:39:51,241 --> 00:39:54,481 Speaker 2: case you can follow the show On instagram At helen. 712 00:39:54,521 --> 00:39:57,361 Speaker 2: Gonpod if you have a case you'd like me and 713 00:39:57,401 --> 00:39:59,641 Speaker 2: my team to look, into you can reach out to 714 00:39:59,721 --> 00:40:01,921 Speaker 2: us at Our Helen Gone Murder line at six seven 715 00:40:02,001 --> 00:40:04,201 Speaker 2: eight seven four four six one four. 716 00:40:04,281 --> 00:40:08,520 Speaker 3: Five that's six seven eight seven four four six one four. 717 00:40:08,641 --> 00:40:14,761 Speaker 1: Five school Of humans