WEBVTT - The Microwave, Part 2 0:00:03.000 --> 0:00:09.680 Welcome to Invention, a production of I Heart Radio. Hey, 0:00:09.760 --> 0:00:12.039 welcome to Invention. My name is Robert Lamb and I'm 0:00:12.119 --> 0:00:14.040 Joe McCormick, and we're back with part two of our 0:00:14.080 --> 0:00:17.840 exploration of the invention of microwaves. Now, in the last episode, 0:00:18.200 --> 0:00:20.880 we got we got you through the nineteen seventies or so, 0:00:21.040 --> 0:00:23.599 when the microwave, of course, had actually been invented. It 0:00:23.640 --> 0:00:27.280 was invented by Percy Spencer working for Raytheon in the 0:00:27.360 --> 0:00:30.240 nineteen forties, sort of invented by accident. He was working 0:00:30.240 --> 0:00:34.400 on some radar microwave methods, but in in fact he 0:00:34.479 --> 0:00:38.000 ended up accidentally creating the radar range which cooks food 0:00:38.000 --> 0:00:41.000 with microwave radiation exactly. Yeah, he basically was working on 0:00:41.040 --> 0:00:43.200 some radar equipment. It was like, oh, my candy bar 0:00:43.280 --> 0:00:45.559 has melted. It is something has cooked it in my pocket, 0:00:46.040 --> 0:00:50.839 and uh, you know, some tinkering, uh and some experimentation 0:00:51.080 --> 0:00:54.440 led to the birth of the microwave oven. The technology. 0:00:54.480 --> 0:00:56.360 At first, you know, people were a little hesitant. It 0:00:56.400 --> 0:00:59.680 was expensive, it was bulky. There are some confusion over 0:00:59.760 --> 0:01:02.720 what this radiation, uh you know, aspect of it might 0:01:02.760 --> 0:01:06.480 consist of. But over time and especially through some of 0:01:06.600 --> 0:01:10.880 some relentless marketing. They were able to win people over, 0:01:10.959 --> 0:01:14.120 and and that's why today you will find a microwave 0:01:14.160 --> 0:01:18.080 oven just about everywhere in your home, in your gas station, 0:01:18.160 --> 0:01:22.840 in your dormitory, on ships, in cars. I believe you 0:01:22.920 --> 0:01:26.039 were just looking at some microwaves before we came in, 0:01:26.080 --> 0:01:28.280 and you saw a car model that you can plug 0:01:28.280 --> 0:01:30.640 into your cigarette lighter right, well for kicks, I was 0:01:30.840 --> 0:01:34.000 I was googling, uh, microwave cigarette lighter to see if 0:01:34.520 --> 0:01:36.840 to see if Percy Spencer had ever tried to create one, 0:01:36.920 --> 0:01:39.000 right that you can light a cigarette with microwaves. I 0:01:39.000 --> 0:01:41.160 didn't find that, but I did find a microwave for 0:01:41.200 --> 0:01:46.760 truckers that you plug into the the adapter in your truck. Uh. My, 0:01:46.760 --> 0:01:51.440 my sisters once went to Disney World on the on 0:01:51.480 --> 0:01:54.240 the cheap and brought a microwave oven with them so 0:01:54.280 --> 0:01:57.360 they could cook hot dogs and I think you know 0:01:57.480 --> 0:02:01.840 Kraft cheese uh, in their in their hotel room and 0:02:01.960 --> 0:02:05.000 presumably in their vehicle. Um. So yeah, it's like that 0:02:05.080 --> 0:02:08.639 kind of convenience of the microwave oven provides. But of 0:02:08.680 --> 0:02:11.640 course we know that throughout the years, a lot of 0:02:11.760 --> 0:02:16.800 microwave fears and microwave panic. Uh, it was there initially, 0:02:16.800 --> 0:02:18.799 and in some ways it did persist even though the 0:02:18.840 --> 0:02:22.440 microwave is an extremely popular appliance. Yeah. So well, we're 0:02:22.480 --> 0:02:25.960 gonna be talking a lot in this episode about microwave 0:02:26.040 --> 0:02:29.760 safety and just about it, just just you know, eradicating uh, 0:02:29.800 --> 0:02:34.000 some of your perhaps still lingering fears or superstitions about 0:02:34.040 --> 0:02:37.120 the technology. But but but before this happens, I do 0:02:37.200 --> 0:02:41.000 want to touch on some of the misuses of microwaves 0:02:41.040 --> 0:02:44.720 and TV and film that perhaps on some level contribute 0:02:44.760 --> 0:02:47.600 to these ideas of the dangerous microwave. I think for 0:02:47.680 --> 0:02:51.240 some reason, pop culture is obsessed with perversions of the 0:02:51.280 --> 0:02:54.440 microwave oven. Yeah, in ways that don't always apply to 0:02:54.840 --> 0:03:00.520 other household gadgets. Um. For instance, Uh, the big one, 0:03:00.560 --> 0:03:04.360 of course is the movie Grimlins. Granted, we get to 0:03:04.360 --> 0:03:07.920 see a gremlin destroyed in a blender as well, and 0:03:08.040 --> 0:03:11.040 the blender is perhaps an invention where we look at 0:03:11.080 --> 0:03:12.760 it and we know that there's a certain bit of 0:03:12.840 --> 0:03:15.160 danger to it because it has rotating blades at the bottom, 0:03:15.800 --> 0:03:18.440 but also a gremlin is thrown into the microwave and 0:03:18.560 --> 0:03:21.080 destroyed in there. It explodes just like it's a pad 0:03:21.120 --> 0:03:24.000 of butter that we've put in too long. I think 0:03:24.120 --> 0:03:27.040 maybe this obsession comes from the fact that the microwave 0:03:27.160 --> 0:03:29.720 energy is invisible and you can't see a fire or 0:03:29.760 --> 0:03:32.919 a heating element or anything like that. It's just coming 0:03:32.960 --> 0:03:36.200 out of this whirring object. Yeah, it's this magic box. 0:03:36.240 --> 0:03:39.480 And I mean, if you don't understand the science involved. 0:03:39.840 --> 0:03:42.080 The science, by the way, is explained in the previous 0:03:42.080 --> 0:03:44.960 episode if you need to go back and refresh. But 0:03:45.160 --> 0:03:48.200 other other places that I've enjoyed seeing the microwave used 0:03:48.560 --> 0:03:52.520 um on Futurama, there's a scene where Leila breaks the 0:03:52.560 --> 0:03:55.560 front of a microwave and then aims it at the 0:03:55.600 --> 0:03:58.720 at Bender, the robot Bender biding Red Rodriguez, and just 0:03:58.840 --> 0:04:02.520 completely destroys them with the the the raw cooking power 0:04:02.640 --> 0:04:05.680 of the microwave. And then, of course you will find 0:04:05.880 --> 0:04:09.960 any number of generally like less than top shelf horror 0:04:10.040 --> 0:04:13.800 movies or sometimes like outright sleazy horror movies that will 0:04:14.160 --> 0:04:18.000 utilize a microwave oven in a death. Okay, so, like, 0:04:18.240 --> 0:04:20.880 was there ever a slasher movie or the slasher character 0:04:21.200 --> 0:04:24.000 just used a microwave? Well, there is a nineteen seventy 0:04:24.080 --> 0:04:29.679 nine film titled Microwave massacre, but it contains zero microwave murders, 0:04:30.160 --> 0:04:33.119 just to prepare everybody. And it's um, it's it's quite 0:04:33.120 --> 0:04:36.560 a stinker. Um. But you know, there are other films 0:04:36.600 --> 0:04:39.159 I'm gonna mention some some other films you probably do 0:04:39.240 --> 0:04:43.479 not want to see, um, such as the horror movie 0:04:43.520 --> 0:04:48.240 Ghost in the Shell, no relation to the legendary anime franchise. Uh. 0:04:48.320 --> 0:04:50.960 That one, I think involves a microwave being tampered with 0:04:51.080 --> 0:04:54.520 by a like an ai ghost, you know, uh, some 0:04:54.560 --> 0:04:57.440 sort of spirit in the you know, electrical equipment, and 0:04:57.480 --> 0:05:03.040 it makes an entire room microwaved. Cool. Yeah, there's the 0:05:03.040 --> 0:05:05.880 there's a two thousand seven horror movie title drive Through, 0:05:05.880 --> 0:05:08.400 which is apparently about a killer clown and uh. And 0:05:08.440 --> 0:05:10.200 then there are there are a couple of Oh wait, 0:05:10.279 --> 0:05:12.600 I saw that one. He did. I could have didn't 0:05:12.640 --> 0:05:15.400 remember it first, but yeah, I've seen it. I haven't 0:05:15.440 --> 0:05:17.040 seen it, but I saw some stills and it looked 0:05:17.040 --> 0:05:20.200 it looked terrible. Um, not worth your time. There's the 0:05:20.240 --> 0:05:23.720 unnecessary two thousand and nine remake of the already unnecessary 0:05:23.800 --> 0:05:27.039 nine two film The Last House on the Left. And 0:05:27.080 --> 0:05:31.400 then there's there's also the Lucio Fulcy film Touch of Death, 0:05:31.960 --> 0:05:35.320 which features a microwave death, which which I watched just 0:05:35.440 --> 0:05:39.000 yesterday while researching this, And I think this one is 0:05:39.040 --> 0:05:41.920 certainly on my lucio Fulcy skip list. As much as 0:05:41.920 --> 0:05:45.359 I love many, love many of his films, um, and 0:05:45.400 --> 0:05:48.359 there are many of them, he's often known for gory 0:05:48.440 --> 0:05:52.200 ways of exploring violations of the human body and the microwave. 0:05:52.320 --> 0:05:54.080 I'm sure it had to show up at some point. Yeah, 0:05:54.120 --> 0:05:57.160 when you when you direct that many films, the microwave 0:05:57.279 --> 0:05:59.960 is going to be used, especially when you're so upset 0:06:00.160 --> 0:06:04.640 with melting people. Uh, there's a number of you may 0:06:04.680 --> 0:06:06.880 be thinking of this. There's a microwave death scene in 0:06:06.920 --> 0:06:10.799 the two thousand ten movie kick Ass, which is also 0:06:10.880 --> 0:06:15.360 grizzly and unnecessary. Uh. It's a standard underling murdered by 0:06:15.360 --> 0:06:18.400 a mobster scene. Uh, and I think it was probably 0:06:18.520 --> 0:06:22.839 inspired by the grizzly death of Anthony zerbas character character's 0:06:22.880 --> 0:06:25.440 death in the James Bond film License License to Kill 0:06:25.480 --> 0:06:29.320 From I don't remember Anthony zerbe Got was in that. Yeah. Yeah, 0:06:29.360 --> 0:06:31.800 he played an underling who's killed by the the the 0:06:31.839 --> 0:06:35.239 evil drug boss um in that film. He's he's putting 0:06:35.279 --> 0:06:41.479 like a pressurized change. Yes I remember. Now in kick Ass, 0:06:41.800 --> 0:06:45.880 the underling is put into a walk in microwave and 0:06:45.920 --> 0:06:50.360 the same thing happens. Um. Yeah, it's described as yeah, yeah, 0:06:50.400 --> 0:06:53.720 that's the thing. It's described as being like an industrial 0:06:53.760 --> 0:06:57.640 microwave oven. And yeah, these do not exist as far 0:06:57.680 --> 0:06:59.440 as I can tell. If you if you know of 0:06:59.440 --> 0:07:02.840 a mic walk in microwave oven, uh, please right in 0:07:02.920 --> 0:07:05.160 and set the record straight. But I believe this is 0:07:05.200 --> 0:07:09.320 a complete fictional creation. But it's not just like horror movies, 0:07:09.440 --> 0:07:12.160 melt movies and the like where you see this obsession 0:07:12.200 --> 0:07:15.360 with perversions of the microwave oven to to damage and 0:07:15.440 --> 0:07:18.880 hurt people. Uh Like. There are lots of urban legends 0:07:18.920 --> 0:07:21.520 about it too. Write the things about people putting hamsters 0:07:21.520 --> 0:07:25.160 and microwaves and stuff. Yeah, hamsters, microwaves, dogs and microwaves, 0:07:25.200 --> 0:07:27.480 and of course the big one, the baby in the microwave. 0:07:27.840 --> 0:07:32.360 Ye by grotesque urban legend, uh generally revolving around uh 0:07:32.400 --> 0:07:36.040 you know, a deranged hippie babysitter who's whacked out on trucks. 0:07:36.040 --> 0:07:37.680 So you've got you got the double here. You have 0:07:37.720 --> 0:07:41.040 the microwave panic, and you have uh, you know, a 0:07:41.080 --> 0:07:44.200 panic about say l S d or you know, hippie 0:07:44.200 --> 0:07:47.480 counter culture. The idea is that the parents leave, they 0:07:47.520 --> 0:07:51.080 come back, they find the babysitter, again whacked out on drugs, 0:07:51.160 --> 0:07:55.560 has changed a TV Dinners diaper and has has cooked 0:07:55.560 --> 0:07:58.600 the baby in a microwave. Now, according to the Straight 0:07:58.640 --> 0:08:01.640 Dope and an extensive of uh and and actually quite 0:08:01.640 --> 0:08:07.080 disturbing City Lab article, Uh, there there certainly are unfortunate 0:08:07.120 --> 0:08:10.440 tales of child abuse and or death via microwave. Uh 0:08:10.600 --> 0:08:12.960 and they but they all seem to involve mental illness 0:08:13.120 --> 0:08:17.280 rather than drugs. Still, the urban legend itself lives on. 0:08:17.400 --> 0:08:19.600 You see it referenced even in things like the season 0:08:19.680 --> 0:08:23.200 one of True Detective mentioned but not depicted in that show, 0:08:23.560 --> 0:08:26.720 Folks were getting an urgent update from our producer Seth, 0:08:26.760 --> 0:08:29.080 who tells us that, in fact, there is such a 0:08:29.120 --> 0:08:32.040 thing as a walk in microwave. He looked it up, 0:08:32.040 --> 0:08:34.040 he found out. He says that you can have a 0:08:34.080 --> 0:08:38.280 walk in microwave to treat lumber. Okay, well, I I 0:08:38.400 --> 0:08:42.080 stand corrected. Then, um, kick ass is redeemed. But still 0:08:42.080 --> 0:08:44.600 the scene itself is unnecessary and grotesque. Well, I'd say, 0:08:44.600 --> 0:08:47.720 don't put anything alive in the microwave, even if it's 0:08:47.760 --> 0:08:50.960 a walk in microwave, right, right? What about what about 0:08:50.960 --> 0:08:53.640 the lobster though, that we discussed in the episode, Well, 0:08:53.679 --> 0:08:55.719 I guess, I guess I don't have an opinion on that. 0:08:55.840 --> 0:08:59.839 Darcy Spencer himself, the inventor of the microwave oven, gives 0:08:59.840 --> 0:09:02.000 you a method of cooking the lobster in the microwave, 0:09:02.080 --> 0:09:04.400 and you do not trust his his instincts here, his 0:09:04.440 --> 0:09:08.839 culinary instincts. Where did the marshmallow in the microwave thing 0:09:08.920 --> 0:09:12.040 come from? Oh? Yeah, that is a That is another favorite, 0:09:12.080 --> 0:09:16.040 the exploding of the torture of say a microwave. We're 0:09:16.120 --> 0:09:20.400 especially a peep um peep marshmallow around Easter time. Oh yeah, 0:09:20.480 --> 0:09:22.760 they do they like swell up real big or something. 0:09:23.120 --> 0:09:26.760 Uh they yeah, they do strange things like that. Yeah, alright, Well, 0:09:26.840 --> 0:09:29.240 one thing I think we should separate is the idea 0:09:29.400 --> 0:09:33.160 of using a microwave in a way that it is 0:09:33.200 --> 0:09:36.720 not intended to be used, and that that being you know, 0:09:36.800 --> 0:09:39.640 whether in fiction or in real life. You know, sad 0:09:39.679 --> 0:09:43.080 awful stories from real life that having bad consequences versus 0:09:43.679 --> 0:09:49.640 microwaves representing a danger win in normal use. Yes, So 0:09:49.720 --> 0:09:53.960 let's get into discussion of microwave safety. As we already mentioned, 0:09:53.960 --> 0:09:57.160 the microwave was born into a world somewhat suspicious of 0:09:57.160 --> 0:10:00.600 the word radiation. This was, after all, the during the 0:10:00.640 --> 0:10:04.640 aftermath of the Second World War. Throughout its existence, though, 0:10:04.640 --> 0:10:08.439 the microwave oven has continually been subjected to a fair 0:10:08.440 --> 0:10:12.079 amount of urban legend and misinformation, based generally on an 0:10:12.080 --> 0:10:15.439 incomplete understanding of how a microwave works and what indeed 0:10:15.480 --> 0:10:18.960 microwave radiation actually is. So I want to turn to 0:10:19.200 --> 0:10:22.440 a paper by a John M. O. Sup Chuck called 0:10:22.440 --> 0:10:25.880 a History of Microwave Heating Applications that I found from 0:10:26.080 --> 0:10:29.480 I Triple A Transactions on Microwave Theory and Techniques from 0:10:29.640 --> 0:10:33.800 nineteen eighty four. Uh, And the author here, Chuck, talks 0:10:33.840 --> 0:10:37.000 about how there were actually a number of high profile 0:10:37.200 --> 0:10:41.000 attacks on microwave radiation and the safety of microwave ovens, 0:10:41.080 --> 0:10:43.880 especially in their early consumer years. So I guess this 0:10:43.920 --> 0:10:47.319 would be in the late nineteen sixties. I mean, I 0:10:47.360 --> 0:10:50.080 guess they've been around to some degree for a couple 0:10:50.120 --> 0:10:52.000 of decades at this point, but this is going to 0:10:52.120 --> 0:10:56.400 be when they're first becoming really like affordable and widespread, right, 0:10:57.040 --> 0:11:00.160 So in nineteen sixty eight, the US Congress passed the 0:11:00.400 --> 0:11:03.920 Radiation Control for Health and Safety Act, and osip Check 0:11:04.040 --> 0:11:07.000 argues that this law was enacted mainly in reaction to 0:11:07.160 --> 0:11:11.600 fears that color televisions were emitting harmful X rays, but 0:11:11.760 --> 0:11:14.560 the language in the bill was made much broader and 0:11:14.720 --> 0:11:17.760 ended up raising safety implications for all kinds of radiation 0:11:17.840 --> 0:11:23.360 from electronics, including microwaves, radio waves, and acoustic vibrations, and 0:11:23.440 --> 0:11:26.360 osup Chuck writes that this was quote presumably as a 0:11:26.400 --> 0:11:29.360 prudent step and not because of any practical health or 0:11:29.400 --> 0:11:34.120 safety problem involving microwave or radio frequency energy. But during 0:11:34.160 --> 0:11:39.120 this period, government bureaus and consumer safety organizations coordinated in 0:11:39.120 --> 0:11:43.520 in the following years to test and establish safety standards 0:11:43.520 --> 0:11:47.160 for microwaves, such as the maximum power density of leakage 0:11:47.200 --> 0:11:51.560 from microwave ovens that would be allowed and considered safe. Now, 0:11:51.600 --> 0:11:54.040 of course, it's not practical to make a microwave that 0:11:54.240 --> 0:11:59.800 releases no microwave, that leaks no microwaves into the surrounding area. 0:11:59.840 --> 0:12:03.400 But question is like at what distance is it enough 0:12:03.480 --> 0:12:06.520 microwave energy to really heat you up and burn you 0:12:07.280 --> 0:12:10.200 um And in most cases like modern microwaves are going 0:12:10.240 --> 0:12:13.880 to be very safe in in these regards um but 0:12:14.240 --> 0:12:18.240 due to the fact that some older microwave ovens exceeded 0:12:18.280 --> 0:12:21.920 these established leakage limits, and also due to some popular 0:12:22.040 --> 0:12:26.840 articles raising concerns about the potential dangers of microwaves. Osip 0:12:26.880 --> 0:12:30.319 Chuck writes that the public's perception of risk from microwave 0:12:30.320 --> 0:12:34.480 ovens actually grew somewhat in the early nineteen seventies. And 0:12:34.559 --> 0:12:37.240 I want to do I want to be fair that well. 0:12:37.280 --> 0:12:40.320 I do think microwave ovens are generally extremely safe today. 0:12:40.679 --> 0:12:43.280 If you were living in the early seventies and you 0:12:43.280 --> 0:12:46.560 didn't trust that electronics manufacturers of the time we're being 0:12:46.720 --> 0:12:49.520 completely forthright with you about the safety of their products, 0:12:49.679 --> 0:12:53.360 I probably wouldn't blame you, right. So, one example of 0:12:53.440 --> 0:12:56.760 a microwave fear episode that took place in public, as 0:12:56.920 --> 0:13:01.120 documented BIOSI Chuck, was that in seventy re there were 0:13:01.160 --> 0:13:04.680 allegations by Consumers Union I think this was the magazine 0:13:04.679 --> 0:13:08.480 that later became Consumer Reports, and the allegations were that 0:13:08.559 --> 0:13:11.640 microwave ovens might be a serious radiation hazard. In the 0:13:11.679 --> 0:13:15.240 same year, there were hearings before Congress in which a 0:13:15.280 --> 0:13:19.920 figure named Dr Milton M. Zerret testified that quote there 0:13:20.000 --> 0:13:23.080 is a clear, present and ever increasing danger to the 0:13:23.240 --> 0:13:26.800 entire population of our country from exposure to the entire 0:13:26.920 --> 0:13:31.880 non ionizing portion of the electromagnetic spectrum. And apparently among 0:13:31.960 --> 0:13:36.040 the dangers discussed were things like development of cataracts and 0:13:36.240 --> 0:13:41.160 temporary male sterility due to microwave exposure. And this actually, 0:13:41.160 --> 0:13:43.439 when I was reading about it, this knock something loose 0:13:43.480 --> 0:13:46.520 in my head because I remember now when I was 0:13:46.559 --> 0:13:49.319 a kid, some adult I don't remember, who might have 0:13:49.360 --> 0:13:52.880 been a friend's parent or something, warned me not to 0:13:53.000 --> 0:13:56.680 stare through the window into the microwave because I would 0:13:56.679 --> 0:13:59.720 get cataracts. And I remember thinking this for a long time, 0:13:59.760 --> 0:14:01.920 like I'd stay away from the microwave while it was 0:14:01.960 --> 0:14:05.200 cooking because I didn't want to get cataracts. U. I 0:14:05.240 --> 0:14:07.880 remember being told not to stare through the front of 0:14:08.000 --> 0:14:11.320 a microwave. I don't remember if cataracts were invoked or not. Yeah, 0:14:11.440 --> 0:14:13.680 So I decided to look this up. Is there any 0:14:13.800 --> 0:14:17.360 risk of getting cataracts from a microwave? I would say 0:14:17.360 --> 0:14:21.680 The answer is technically yes, but effectively no. Uh. The 0:14:21.800 --> 0:14:24.800 risk of cataracts from microwave exposure is actually, I think 0:14:24.840 --> 0:14:28.920 best best understood simply as damage to the eyes from heat. 0:14:29.440 --> 0:14:32.960 The lens of the eye is especially sensitive to heat 0:14:33.080 --> 0:14:36.280 because there is little mechanism for it to dissipate heat. 0:14:36.560 --> 0:14:39.720 It can't carry the heat absorbed away through blood flow 0:14:39.840 --> 0:14:43.680 or something. Right now, what are cataracts? Cataracts form when 0:14:43.840 --> 0:14:48.200 the lens of the eye is injured or deteriorates naturally 0:14:48.240 --> 0:14:51.840 with age, causing a breakdown of proteins that leads to 0:14:52.000 --> 0:14:54.720 clouding in this lens, the layer of the eye that 0:14:54.760 --> 0:14:57.480 should ideally be crystal clear because it's supposed to work 0:14:57.520 --> 0:14:59.920 like a lens, and that clouding, of course makes it 0:15:00.080 --> 0:15:03.080 hard to see. Uh So, one cause of the clouding 0:15:03.080 --> 0:15:06.360 and the lens is repeated exposure to intense heat, and 0:15:06.440 --> 0:15:10.240 this is sometimes known as glassblowers cataracts. I don't know 0:15:10.280 --> 0:15:12.800 if you've heard of this, Robert, but yeah, this is 0:15:12.800 --> 0:15:15.359 something I read about before. But it's not just glassblowers. 0:15:15.360 --> 0:15:19.480 It can happen to metal workers, any workers who chronically 0:15:19.520 --> 0:15:23.400 expose their eyes to powerful sources of infrared heat near 0:15:23.440 --> 0:15:27.120 the face, and this heat exposure can damage the lens 0:15:27.200 --> 0:15:29.960 and the iris over time, of course, leading to clouding 0:15:30.040 --> 0:15:33.360 of the lens and which is cataracts. So a modern 0:15:33.640 --> 0:15:38.240 properly functioning microwave oven with standard safety features used in 0:15:38.280 --> 0:15:41.920 a normal way should not leak enough microwave radiation to 0:15:42.000 --> 0:15:44.800 cause this kind of heat damage to the eyes. I 0:15:44.840 --> 0:15:48.120 suppose there could possibly be a risk from say like 0:15:48.200 --> 0:15:53.160 a bootleg microwave you made yourself, or like an old damaged, 0:15:53.320 --> 0:15:57.320 malfunctioning microwave model. I was trying to figure out, how 0:15:57.360 --> 0:16:00.080 would you know if a microwave oven is damaged in 0:16:00.080 --> 0:16:02.960 a way that could possibly cause a risk of microwaves 0:16:02.960 --> 0:16:05.640 coming out and you know, burning your eyes or something. 0:16:06.280 --> 0:16:08.640 The main problem I think you would look for would 0:16:08.640 --> 0:16:11.280 be something in the door, if like the door the 0:16:11.360 --> 0:16:15.760 hinges the seal are warped or damaged, or if it's 0:16:15.760 --> 0:16:19.120 somehow able to operate with the door open. Again, it 0:16:19.160 --> 0:16:21.640 shouldn't be able to do this. Their safety features that 0:16:21.640 --> 0:16:24.680 should prevent any of this from happening. But if somehow 0:16:24.720 --> 0:16:27.760 it operates with damage to the door, not ceiling, or 0:16:27.800 --> 0:16:29.520 being open, you probably want to get rid of it 0:16:29.520 --> 0:16:31.760 and get a new microwave. And I guess that brings 0:16:31.840 --> 0:16:35.320 us back to also the fears about male sterility. Uh, 0:16:35.400 --> 0:16:37.440 And it turns out I think these fears follow a 0:16:37.520 --> 0:16:41.520 similar pattern. Actually, it's again a concern about heating. Right. 0:16:42.120 --> 0:16:44.600 We discussed on stuff to blow your mind, concerns about 0:16:44.800 --> 0:16:49.280 male fertility being related to say, heating of of the testicles, right, 0:16:49.400 --> 0:16:52.920 like immersing yourself in a hot tub, that sort of thing. Yeah, 0:16:52.960 --> 0:16:56.360 and so osup. Chuck writes that scientists engaged in direct 0:16:56.440 --> 0:16:59.240 research at the time about the bio effects of radiation 0:16:59.640 --> 0:17:02.840 fought back against Eric's testimony. In nineteen seventy three, he 0:17:02.920 --> 0:17:06.639 quotes one pair of scientists named Bud Appleton and Tom 0:17:06.680 --> 0:17:10.520 Eli who pointed out that quote jockey shorts promoted in 0:17:10.560 --> 0:17:13.760 the Consumer Union, that magazine that was critical of microwaves 0:17:14.080 --> 0:17:17.320 quote posed a far greater hazard to temporary sterility of 0:17:17.359 --> 0:17:20.560 males than microwave leak is, which I think is a 0:17:20.560 --> 0:17:23.120 decent point of comparison, assuming they're correct. I think they 0:17:23.119 --> 0:17:25.560 probably are there that there's going to be more potentially 0:17:25.600 --> 0:17:30.040 threatening heating of of of the testicles through underwear design 0:17:30.119 --> 0:17:32.960 than there's going to be from microwaves escaping from a 0:17:33.000 --> 0:17:37.800 microwave oven. Uh. And also a scientist named Im Brady 0:17:37.880 --> 0:17:41.520 wrote about quote the humorous contrast between the warning signs 0:17:41.560 --> 0:17:45.399 proposed by the Consumer Union as necessary near microwave ovens 0:17:45.640 --> 0:17:48.400 and the absence of such signs when primitive man first 0:17:48.520 --> 0:17:51.320 learned to utilize the heat of fire. But I mean again, 0:17:51.359 --> 0:17:54.120 it's emphasizing that the main thing that you should actually 0:17:54.160 --> 0:17:57.760 be concerned about when you if you're seriously concerned about microwaves, 0:17:57.840 --> 0:18:01.040 is heat. That they have the ability to heat water, 0:18:01.440 --> 0:18:04.080 and that can damage you. You can get burned by 0:18:04.240 --> 0:18:07.480 the heat from a microwave, but the situations where that's 0:18:07.480 --> 0:18:09.159 going to happen are usually going to be like you 0:18:09.320 --> 0:18:12.040 heating up food in a dangerous way and then taking 0:18:12.040 --> 0:18:14.320 it out and burning yourself with it, right, like heating 0:18:14.400 --> 0:18:16.320 up a cup of noodles or something in the microwaven, 0:18:16.359 --> 0:18:19.000 removing it and and that that's where the dangers. And 0:18:19.160 --> 0:18:22.840 yet the movie is called microwave Massacre, not cup of 0:18:22.840 --> 0:18:26.600 noodles massacre, right, it's not or or Another example I've 0:18:26.600 --> 0:18:29.000 seen is like the stairway in your house is far 0:18:29.080 --> 0:18:33.280 more dangerous statistically than the microwave oven, like seedingly, you know, 0:18:33.440 --> 0:18:36.320 just when you look at the numbers, And yet the 0:18:36.320 --> 0:18:39.880 stairway massacre is as far as I know, not a thing. Right. 0:18:39.960 --> 0:18:43.400 And of course, on top of this, again modern microwave 0:18:43.440 --> 0:18:46.119 ovens that are made by reputable companies, the kind you 0:18:46.200 --> 0:18:48.119 could buy at a store. They're generally not going to 0:18:48.200 --> 0:18:51.919 be leaking many microwaves anyway. They've got safety features, they 0:18:52.000 --> 0:18:54.919 contain the radiation, and they're not supposed to work with 0:18:54.960 --> 0:18:58.399 the door open anything like that, So generally they are safe. 0:18:58.800 --> 0:19:00.320 All right, on that note, we're gonna take a break, 0:19:00.320 --> 0:19:02.240 and when we come back, we're going to continue to 0:19:02.280 --> 0:19:13.199 discuss microwave safety. Alright, we're back. So some of the other, um, 0:19:13.240 --> 0:19:16.080 you know, potential threats of microwaves that are sometimes brought 0:19:16.160 --> 0:19:19.600 up in you know, urban legends and you know, misinformation 0:19:19.760 --> 0:19:22.879 and whispers online. That's the thing is, like some of 0:19:22.920 --> 0:19:27.800 these are still continue to make their way around via 0:19:27.880 --> 0:19:31.439 social media. Uh. We already mentioned not looking through the 0:19:31.480 --> 0:19:34.560 screen at cooking food, but also the idea that microwaves 0:19:34.560 --> 0:19:36.879 will destroy nutrients in your food when you nuke it, 0:19:37.720 --> 0:19:41.040 that microwaves will radiate your house, that will alter your DNA, 0:19:41.240 --> 0:19:43.640 and that they will ultimately give you cancer. And if 0:19:43.640 --> 0:19:46.800 you want to get into the sort of conspiracy theory 0:19:46.840 --> 0:19:51.640 part of the internet, you can find articles alleging this today. Uh, 0:19:51.680 --> 0:19:54.719 there are plenty of great sources though that point us 0:19:54.720 --> 0:19:59.120 in the opposite direction towards truth. For instance, electrical engineer, 0:19:59.200 --> 0:20:03.679 neuroscientists and Chief Scientists of Australia Alan Finkel wrote a 0:20:03.760 --> 0:20:07.760 great article on this for Cosmos magazine back in and 0:20:07.840 --> 0:20:10.080 he stressed that, you know, again, one of the big 0:20:10.119 --> 0:20:13.040 things to keep in mind is that X rays are 0:20:13.080 --> 0:20:16.919 not microwaves. Microwaves are not X rays. Now. Certainly, as 0:20:16.960 --> 0:20:19.320 we've discussed on the show before when we did an 0:20:19.320 --> 0:20:22.399 episode on the X ray, X rays can be quite 0:20:22.440 --> 0:20:25.080 deadly if misused. Of course, you don't want to be 0:20:25.160 --> 0:20:27.879 exposed to any more X rays than you absolutely have 0:20:28.040 --> 0:20:30.400 to write. And the early history of X ray research 0:20:30.480 --> 0:20:34.400 is riddled with cases of radiation injury and death due 0:20:34.400 --> 0:20:38.000 to close proximity and just uh, you know, the individuals 0:20:38.040 --> 0:20:40.920 involved often being just unaware of what the true risks were. 0:20:41.640 --> 0:20:45.560 But Finkel's you know, stresses that there's a key difference here. Quote. 0:20:45.960 --> 0:20:49.840 X rays oscillate more than a billion times faster than microwaves, 0:20:49.840 --> 0:20:52.520 and their wavelengths are more than a billion times shorter. 0:20:53.200 --> 0:20:57.200 At these extremely short wavelengths, X rays act like tiny bullets, 0:20:57.480 --> 0:20:59.800 and if they hit the DNA inside the nucleus of 0:20:59.800 --> 0:21:03.840 a cell, they can do permanent harm. Microwave radiation is 0:21:03.880 --> 0:21:06.720 at a much lower frequency and the wavelength is about 0:21:06.760 --> 0:21:09.760 the length of a toothbrush, millions of times bigger than 0:21:09.760 --> 0:21:13.120 the cell nucleus. These big radio waves pass around our 0:21:13.160 --> 0:21:17.080 tiny DNA molecules without them noticing each other. So he's 0:21:17.080 --> 0:21:20.240 saying that outside, uh the oven with the door closed, 0:21:20.720 --> 0:21:22.359 nothing is going to get to you, and even if 0:21:22.359 --> 0:21:25.320 it did, it would heat you, it would not irradiate you. 0:21:26.200 --> 0:21:30.320 Uh So, Finkelle continues quote by analogy, if you were 0:21:30.359 --> 0:21:33.879 in a rowboat far from land, X rays would be 0:21:33.960 --> 0:21:38.240 like powerful waves that could potentially capsize your boat, while 0:21:38.359 --> 0:21:41.680 microwaves would be like the rising and falling of the tide, 0:21:41.960 --> 0:21:45.560 of which you would be blissfully unaware. And he points 0:21:45.560 --> 0:21:48.960 out that we have more than twenty five thousand research 0:21:49.080 --> 0:21:51.720 articles that have been published over the past thirty years 0:21:52.000 --> 0:21:56.240 on electromagnetic radiation at the frequency of microwave ovens, and 0:21:56.480 --> 0:22:00.000 they conclude that there is no evidence to confirm any 0:22:00.000 --> 0:22:04.520 adverse health consequences from exposure to a microwave oven. Again, 0:22:04.760 --> 0:22:07.520 normal exposure to a microwave oven, if you climb inside it, 0:22:07.760 --> 0:22:10.000 all bets are off and in terms of just the 0:22:10.040 --> 0:22:14.199 effects on the food itself. Microwaves have no non thermal 0:22:14.240 --> 0:22:17.359 effects on food. So again, the microwave oven certainly has 0:22:17.400 --> 0:22:20.560 a thermal effect on your food, and anything that heating 0:22:20.600 --> 0:22:25.359 food can do to food, it can do. But anything 0:22:25.359 --> 0:22:28.720 outside of that, uh is is probably gonna be the 0:22:29.560 --> 0:22:33.880 domain of of misinformation and urban legend. Yeah, I'm trying 0:22:33.880 --> 0:22:37.520 to understand the fear of lingering radiation effects on food 0:22:37.520 --> 0:22:39.679 that That's another thing you'll see is that there's a 0:22:39.680 --> 0:22:43.760 belief that the microwave makes food radioactive, like that if 0:22:43.800 --> 0:22:45.960 you take the food out of the microwave, the food 0:22:45.960 --> 0:22:50.280 will somehow retain some kind of radiation property, even though 0:22:50.359 --> 0:22:53.640 it's non ionizing radiation to begin with. But like even 0:22:53.640 --> 0:22:57.359 if it were ionizing radiation, that it makes the food radioactive. 0:22:57.400 --> 0:23:00.520 I think this just comes from the idea dea of 0:23:00.640 --> 0:23:04.479