Speaker 1: I've heard that there's a house that has some bodies
Speaker 1: in the basement.
Speaker 2: Somebody told you that Shakaia was a victim of human trafficking.
Speaker 1: I'm come to find out. This is like it exploded
Speaker 1: into this huge thing.
Speaker 3: I knew, I just knew something was wrong.
Speaker 4: Police say thirty three year old Jared Bride Again was
Speaker 4: shot dead.
Speaker 3: I kept calling his phone during the drive.
Speaker 4: Gunned down in front of his two year old daughter.
Speaker 4: It's a murder of the stun Jack Speach neighbors.
Speaker 2: His murder has attracted national attention, with the investigators saying
Speaker 2: he was targeted.
Speaker 3: Eventually a police officer answered and told me to come
Speaker 3: to the police station.
Speaker 5: Justice is something that takes different shapes or forms.
Speaker 2: If you know something, heard something, please it's never too
Speaker 2: late to.
Speaker 4: Do the right thing.
Speaker 1: So I'm Dana Thompson aka Body Movin, and.
Speaker 5: I'm John Green. For about a decade, Deanna and I
Speaker 5: spent a lot of time on the Internet, especially in
Speaker 5: the underbelly of the Internet, trying to identify and get
Speaker 5: animal abusers arrested.
Speaker 1: We spent countless hours scouring the dark web helping catch predators.
Speaker 1: We spent over a year and a half trying to
Speaker 1: get law enforcement to take us seriously about a man
Speaker 1: that was killing cats online and he was threatening to
Speaker 1: move on to kill humans. And that was Luca mcnatdah.
Speaker 5: Yeah, you might have heard about the Netflix special called
Speaker 5: Don't Fuck with Cats.
Speaker 1: That's us. Well, now we're turning our online investigator skills
Speaker 1: to some of the most unexplained, unsolved, and just ignored cases.
Speaker 5: This is true Crimes, the production of iHeartRadio and Kat's studios.
Speaker 1: You know, John I was looking at everything and there's
Speaker 1: still so little evidence made publicly available about Jared Bardigan's death,
Speaker 1: and we still have so many holes in the timeline.
Speaker 1: I feel we need to talk to Kirsten again to
Speaker 1: try and fill in some of those holes.
Speaker 5: Yeah, at this point, I feel like we have a
Speaker 5: really good understanding of what happened the night Jared was murdered,
Speaker 5: and we have a bunch of questions that we've been
Speaker 5: writing down. So I think this is a good time
Speaker 5: to talk with Kirsten and ask her our questions about
Speaker 5: that night.
Speaker 1: I especially want to know more about the allegations about
Speaker 1: Shanea spying on Jared during their divorce. I also want
Speaker 1: to know where Jared ate and got ice cream with
Speaker 1: the kids, and that he was killed. We need that
Speaker 1: for our map.
Speaker 3: This is Kirsten.
Speaker 1: Hey, Kirsten, how are you?
Speaker 3: I'm good?
Speaker 5: How are you?
Speaker 1: We just had like a couple questions and we didn't
Speaker 1: want to disturb you, like seven different times, so we
Speaker 1: just got like a bunch together and I hope it's okay.
Speaker 1: We just asked you just a couple of things.
Speaker 2: Okay.
Speaker 1: You mentioned that Jared took the kids to ice cream. Yes,
Speaker 1: was that on his way back to the ex wife's
Speaker 1: house with the kids.
Speaker 3: Yeah, so they went to dinner and ice cream out
Speaker 3: at Jack's speech. They went to the place they got
Speaker 3: dinner is called the Bearded Pig, and then I think
Speaker 3: they just got ice cream at Wendy's before he drove
Speaker 3: them back to their moms.
Speaker 1: Okay, so it definitely was on the way drag. Okay,
Speaker 1: because we're just mapping everything out, We've got pretty much
Speaker 1: everything except for those couple of things. So it was
Speaker 1: in Jack speets. It wasn't down by your house.
Speaker 6: Then, correct?
Speaker 3: No, Yeah, because the time is so short and the
Speaker 3: drive is so long, he would always stay out.
Speaker 1: Her direction was the Volkswagen. It was that the car
Speaker 1: that he drove mostly for date night. Yeah, did anybody
Speaker 1: like search the Volkswagen for like a tracker?
Speaker 2: Do you know?
Speaker 3: I know they? I mean they still have the car, Okay. Yeah,
Speaker 3: so I had to claim total loss on the vehicle
Speaker 3: because oh and they had me sign a form trying
Speaker 3: to remember what it's called burla. It's called where they
Speaker 3: can just rip the entire car apart. So I signed that.
Speaker 1: So they're looking for something, okay, Because we were just
Speaker 1: thinking about you know, we found an article in the
Speaker 1: Daily Mail and we wanted to ask you about that too, Okay,
Speaker 1: that mentioned that the ex wife or that Jared had
Speaker 1: said the ex wife was spying on him at one point.
Speaker 1: Mm hmm, John, what did it say?
Speaker 2: So we were just reading all these articles and it
Speaker 2: mentioned that like right as they were still living together
Speaker 2: having separated, that she had placed surveillance cameras in the
Speaker 2: kids rooms and may have placed a surveillance device on
Speaker 2: his vehicle at that time.
Speaker 6: Do you know what it was?
Speaker 2: Was it like a dash camera just an audio recorder
Speaker 2: or was it like a full on she could travel?
Speaker 3: Yeah, so what he found in his vehicle, it looked
Speaker 3: like a USB like some drive but it was actually
Speaker 3: a voice recorder, so a voice activated recorder. So he
Speaker 3: found that in his car, and Jared told me if
Speaker 3: he knew that she put it there because no one
Speaker 3: else had access to his vehicle, and his attorney was like, well,
Speaker 3: she probably wanted to hear, like all the conversations because
Speaker 3: he went and talk this attorney in the house where
Speaker 3: she was, so that she placed a voice activated recorder
Speaker 3: in his vehicle.
Speaker 1: Snaky, sneaky.
Speaker 2: Yeah.
Speaker 3: And then as far as the kids' bedrooms, so they
Speaker 3: had baby monitors in plaines, right, I'd always had those
Speaker 3: when the divorce is going on. Jared told me if
Speaker 3: he found monitors underneath their bed again, placed by Shanna,
Speaker 3: probably to listen into his conversations with the children.
Speaker 1: Oh my goodness.
Speaker 6: Okay, So as far as that it was just.
Speaker 2: An audio recorder in his vehicle in the bedroom, but
Speaker 2: not like an actual GPS tracking device, or she could
Speaker 2: have seen where.
Speaker 3: He was driving, right, not that I'm aware of. He
Speaker 3: didn't tell me that part, right.
Speaker 1: But it's it's a very small leap to make that
Speaker 1: if somebody could do that, the GPS tracker or something
Speaker 1: on an air tag or something is close by and
Speaker 1: is it possible that whoever did this put a tracker
Speaker 1: on his car when he was up the beard a pig.
Speaker 1: That was kind of what I just one of the
Speaker 1: things that I was looking at, and then this Daily
Speaker 1: Mail article came to light and I was like, oh wow,
Speaker 1: that's kind of in line with what we were kind
Speaker 1: of thinking. Maybe, you know, possibly the other thing was
Speaker 1: would Jared had so you know, there's software that you
Speaker 1: can have on your phones that alert you when an
Speaker 1: air tag is nearby, and they do that basically to
Speaker 1: protect women who are being stalked. Okay, did Jared have
Speaker 1: an iPhone?
Speaker 3: He did, and he had an AirTag?
Speaker 1: Actually he did, Okay, and he had an air tag. Okay,
Speaker 1: she didn't have access to that, did she. No, it's
Speaker 1: I mean obviously not because they were divorced many many
Speaker 1: years ago. Yeah, no, she went and air tags weren't
Speaker 1: even around. Okay, all right, good.
Speaker 2: I don't know your relationship with the detective. I don't
Speaker 2: know how well it is or you don't have to
Speaker 2: call him up whenever you talk to him and say, hey,
Speaker 2: when do these people ask me if you guys did
Speaker 2: a Google geo fence? And what it does is it
Speaker 2: tracks all the phones in a geo geo fank you
Speaker 2: drawing of fen And the reason I'm asking that is
Speaker 2: so we've seen the three security camera videos of the truck.
Speaker 2: The two were driving by the police station and then
Speaker 2: a block away, but it appeared there's a fourth security.
Speaker 6: Camera footage video that we haven't seen.
Speaker 2: We've just seen a screenshot and it looks like it's
Speaker 2: earlier in the day. And we write an article where
Speaker 2: it says Jacksonville police believed that this vehicle was there
Speaker 2: between five thirty and eight thirty in Jacksonville. And I'm wondering,
Speaker 2: if there's a person driving around Jacksonville for three hours,
Speaker 2: they're probably gonna have their cell phone on them.
Speaker 3: Yeah, I know they did geo fencing. I don't know
Speaker 3: if that's different than Google geo fencing.
Speaker 1: Exactly exactly, it's exactly what it is.
Speaker 3: Okay, So, yeah, they have done that.
Speaker 6: If you have the tracker on the car, you would
Speaker 6: have to have a cell phone right in order to
Speaker 6: see where the vehicle's travel is.
Speaker 1: Yeah unless, yeah, no, you would for sure you would
Speaker 1: have to have a cell phone.
Speaker 2: Now, could they have the cell phone.
Speaker 6: Turned on but not the just.
Speaker 1: No, I mean they'd have to be using data, right.
Speaker 1: I wonder if this person in the truck got on
Speaker 1: to an open Wi Fi in advance of the killing,
Speaker 1: And I wonder if the cops have thought about that.
Speaker 1: And I wonder if they have queried to get the
Speaker 1: Mac addresses from the neighbors surrounding neighborhood. Wifis I don't
Speaker 1: think the police are going to do that.
Speaker 6: I don't think that at all. I mean, I think
Speaker 6: this is a low fly. Hit tire in the road,
Speaker 6: stop him, he gets out, walks up, pow pow pow close.
Speaker 1: But how luck? Okay, I think that's him. Your hypothesis
Speaker 1: here is that it's possible that the person was camped
Speaker 1: outside of Shana's house saw him drop off. The kids
Speaker 1: took off knowing that he was right behind right yep,
Speaker 1: got positioned and just waited for the car that they
Speaker 1: think is Jared's to appear. It's not a dumb theory.
Speaker 4: I'm just that's as low fly as you get.
Speaker 6: Yeah, No, you're right, No cell phones, no trackers, no nothing,
Speaker 6: just there he is right, Let's go down there. He'll
Speaker 6: be down here in a few minutes.
Speaker 1: That's entirely possible. Entirely possible. They didn't release like the
Speaker 1: exact location of those security cameras, so we had to
Speaker 1: find it, and we found it pretty easily. But I
Speaker 1: mean when when it popped up that it was pretty
Speaker 1: much the way to get back to her house pretty much,
Speaker 1: and it's two blocks maybe that police station. My mouth
Speaker 1: like hit the floor. My job was just like what.
Speaker 6: Yeah, that's what I'm getting at, Dana.
Speaker 2: They're so calculated, they know to turn off their phones,
Speaker 2: and why would they do such a stupid mistake of
Speaker 2: acting the committee to crime and then drive that vehicle
Speaker 2: right back towards the house.
Speaker 1: That's just the this is targeted. Okay, Well that was
Speaker 1: all the questions we had. I just we really wanted
Speaker 1: to know where they went and ate and stuff. Do
Speaker 1: you know what time it was?
Speaker 3: I wrote this down and talk of it once so
Speaker 3: I wouldn't preget because I went through like our doorball camera,
Speaker 3: like when he left the house, and then the text
Speaker 3: that he sent me. Okay, so Jared actually left our
Speaker 3: house at five three pm and then at six forty
Speaker 3: seven pm I texted Jared asking how date night was going,
Speaker 3: and he said he just got off a work call
Speaker 3: that he had to join, and then said that Abby,
Speaker 3: my stepdaughter, wanted to text me, so she and I
Speaker 3: were texting back and forth, and she told me that
Speaker 3: they were eating at the Bearded Pigs. At six forty seven,
Speaker 3: they were already at the Bearded Pig eating, and then
Speaker 3: I'm not sure what the timeline was of how long
Speaker 3: I stayed there before going to Wendy's. But then at
Speaker 3: seven forty seven pm, I briefly talked to him on
Speaker 3: the phone and he had just dropped them off their
Speaker 3: mom's house.
Speaker 1: That's good to know, all right, we got the timeline,
Speaker 1: So five point fifty three he left, yep, six forty
Speaker 1: seven they were definitely eating at the Bearded Pig. Yeah,
Speaker 1: And seven forty seven is the phone call that he
Speaker 1: made to you while you were on the phone with
Speaker 1: the brother. Okay, correct, Because I'm just kind of wondering,
Speaker 1: like when somebody would have been able to place a
Speaker 1: trucker on the car if that's what happened, and the
Speaker 1: perfect opportunity would have been, well, they were eating, yeah,
Speaker 1: but that person would have to know they were eating
Speaker 1: at the beer to a pig, And I'm like, well,
Speaker 1: you know, it's it's entirely possible that the kids were
Speaker 1: texting mom, Hey, we're getting dinner at the beer to
Speaker 1: pig and.
Speaker 3: Then so they didn't have phones. My stepdaughter was texting
Speaker 3: me from her dad's from Jared's song.
Speaker 6: Okay, So something just came to mind.
Speaker 2: When Jared would have dropped the kids off after Wendy's.
Speaker 2: It doesn't seem like it was one of those things
Speaker 2: where he'd get out of the car and walk them
Speaker 2: to the door. No, no, drove up to the driveway,
Speaker 2: they would have gone out. He would have waited till
Speaker 2: they went inside the door, and he would have drove away. Correct.
Speaker 1: So, yeah, burla, she mentioned Burla. What is that?
Speaker 6: Oh?
Speaker 2: So the burla is you know how your car.
Speaker 6: Has a little computer boxing if the cracks everything when
Speaker 6: you're pressing the pedals, how fast you're going.
Speaker 1: Yeah, that's what it is. Oh, it's like a black box.
Speaker 2: Yes, discover vehicle a vehicle to hold a vast amount
Speaker 2: of data that can be used to uncover critical information
Speaker 2: during the investigation and help determine what happened, where it occurred,
Speaker 2: and mark. So that usually is hidden under the carpet,
Speaker 2: under the driver or passenger seat. That every time we
Speaker 2: get a new piece of information, like the USB thumb
Speaker 2: driving the car record.
Speaker 6: I'm like, that's from a TV show.
Speaker 1: Right, Yeah, there's that's in a lot of TV shows.
Speaker 1: So let's go look at the bearded pig. Where's the
Speaker 1: bearded pig at?
Speaker 2: So there's one in Jacksonville.
Speaker 1: When we find it, she said Jack's Beach.
Speaker 2: I think she means Jacksonville.
Speaker 1: Yeah, well there's Third Street South the bearded pig. This
Speaker 1: one is on Third Street South, and in relation to
Speaker 1: the route, it's.
Speaker 6: Pretty Yeah, that's the one he would have gone to, right.
Speaker 1: I believe that's possible.
Speaker 2: Yeah, when Jesus is also on Third Street like two
Speaker 2: blocks up, all.
Speaker 1: Right, Yeah, so that's got to be it. So I
Speaker 1: mean that could mean a couple things. That could be
Speaker 1: a signal to them, or is it to set her
Speaker 1: up the ex wife?
Speaker 6: Right?
Speaker 2: Right, That's what I was getting at. Because once you
Speaker 2: get you're on Shutter. Once you get to that fifteenth Street,
Speaker 2: you either go left of the house or you go right,
Speaker 2: and you're going back to Ocean Boulevard. Game.
Speaker 6: We don't know when it comes to the t on
Speaker 6: fifteenth whether it goes left or right. But it just
Speaker 6: kind of struck me on that, like, whoever did this
Speaker 6: was very, very calculated. Yeah, I just committed a murder.
Speaker 6: I'm gonna drive right back to if it is the
Speaker 6: ex wife or somebody related to that, you're gonna drive
Speaker 6: right back to the house.
Speaker 1: I don't think so it's just weird or is it narcissism?
Speaker 1: Like I got away with the perfect crime, right, and
Speaker 1: you catch me, right, and we've dealt with that before,
Speaker 1: you know.
Speaker 6: I mean I shot caps with the BB gun and
Speaker 6: nothing never happened to me, right, and I have the
Speaker 6: perfect alibi my wife, who's gonna say I was in
Speaker 6: the house the whole time?
Speaker 1: Right? Or was it a like a hired person? And
Speaker 1: the ex wife can't leave the house because she's got
Speaker 1: the kids, now, okay, so all she does is go
Speaker 1: outside her house if you look at the map and
Speaker 1: stand on the corner there, because it's culed a sack
Speaker 1: and her house is at the end of that cul
Speaker 1: de sack and then it's like a street. All she
Speaker 1: has to do is stand there and oh, there's the truck. Okay,
Speaker 1: everything's good.
Speaker 2: Truck comes to the stop that the te flashes, the light,
Speaker 2: turns off, and drives away.
Speaker 1: Right, something like that.
Speaker 2: Yeah, something like that. Well, I think you and I
Speaker 2: both agree. She didn't commit the aptual app she.
Speaker 4: Made me be aware of it.
Speaker 2: He didn't do it herself. Somebody else did it.
Speaker 1: Either she or if somebody adjacent is the mastermind, like
Speaker 1: hired somebody like this is a hired What did.
Speaker 6: She tell the guy at the tattoo parlor to PIERCERR,
Speaker 6: I wish he'd just shut up. Somebody would just make
Speaker 6: them shut up.
Speaker 1: Yeah, get somebody to shut him up.
Speaker 4: Let's stop here for a break. We'll be back in
Speaker 4: a moment.
Speaker 1: So I got a text message from Christian Brdigan yesterday
Speaker 1: and she asked me if you and I had the
Speaker 1: ability to run DMV records and I said no, we don't.
Speaker 1: And she said, do you have a PI that can
Speaker 1: run records? And I said, well, we do have a PI,
Speaker 1: but he's he's it's for a different case. But let
Speaker 1: me find out if we can use him. You know,
Speaker 1: I don't see why we wouldn't be able to. She said, okay, great,
Speaker 1: it's for the state of Washington. And I said, okay,
Speaker 1: let me find out and I'll get back to you.
Speaker 5: Right Wait, wait, wait, Jared, Jared's incident happened in Florida.
Speaker 4: She wants us to look up DMB in the state
Speaker 4: of Washington, on the other side of the United States. Right,
Speaker 4: is it related to I.
Speaker 1: Would imagine I can't imagine that she would reach out
Speaker 1: to me for something unrelated to Jared Wow. So I
Speaker 1: am going to ask Mike Toth if he can run
Speaker 1: DMB records in Washington. I have the feeling that he's
Speaker 1: going to tell me if we have like a plate
Speaker 1: he could he might be able to run it. I
Speaker 1: don't think he's going to be able to query like
Speaker 1: straight from D and B, but I don't I didn't
Speaker 1: ask her for specifics because I didn't want her to
Speaker 1: feel like she had to tip her hand with me.
Speaker 1: But I just felt like, I'm gonna let her give
Speaker 1: me the information if she wants, and if she doesn't
Speaker 1: want to, I'm not going to push the issue. But
Speaker 1: now that I know we can use Mike Toth, who
Speaker 1: I think is great. And then we also have Chris
Speaker 1: Salgado in Tampa and we have a great relationship with him,
Speaker 1: and he's in Florida. Now I haven't reached out to him, Okay,
Speaker 1: but this is right up Chris's ali. You know what
Speaker 1: I mean. This this case is right up Chris's alley.
Speaker 4: And since he's in Florida, he probably knows about it absolutely.
Speaker 1: What I'm going to do is I'm going to email
Speaker 1: Chris and ask if he's interested, and then if he's interested,
Speaker 1: we can talk about the case.
Speaker 2: Chris, you're on the line, right, Hi, John, Hi Deanna.
Speaker 6: Yeah, So we reached out to you and we wanted
Speaker 6: to see what you've been up to since we saw
Speaker 6: you what was it six seven months ago in May
Speaker 6: and crime Con.
Speaker 7: Since then that crime Con, a lot of stuff has
Speaker 7: picked up for me at the PI business here and
Speaker 7: it's been great. So I'm the CEO of All Points Investigations,
Speaker 7: as you folks said, based out of Tampa, Florida. Here
Speaker 7: we do both cyber and physical investigations across the globe
Speaker 7: for a variety of issues for corporations, individuals, law firms,
Speaker 7: and this kind of scope that we have for types
Speaker 7: of investigations really runs the gamut. We do counterfeit investigations,
Speaker 7: threat management, cults, cult investigations obviously a criminal investigations, but
Speaker 7: from the civil side, right because I'm a private best guer,
Speaker 7: I'm not a law enforcement member, lots of different stuff.
Speaker 2: So, Chris, does your company have the ability to search
Speaker 2: a license.
Speaker 6: Plate like that?
Speaker 7: Yeah, yeah, definitely. We search plates all over the states.
Speaker 7: We again, folks, I seated in Florida, but as you know,
Speaker 7: but we uprate globally. Yeah, we can definitely run different plates.
Speaker 7: We can run bin numbers, we can even run partial plates.
Speaker 2: So, Chris, were you to do your work on your end,
Speaker 2: what would you need Deanna and I to give you,
Speaker 2: like a name and a date of birth or what
Speaker 2: kind of information do you need.
Speaker 4: To do you?
Speaker 7: Yeah, whatever information that you have uncovered so far, and
Speaker 7: we're talking mostly about like names, addresses, dates of birth,
Speaker 7: stuff like that, that could be very helpful with trying
Speaker 7: to lift as much information as possible on these movements,
Speaker 7: specifically with the wife and any other person.
Speaker 2: All right, we'll send you some stuff, Chris, and then
Speaker 2: once you do you report, you can email it to
Speaker 2: us and then we can have a phone call and
Speaker 2: go over everything.
Speaker 4: That.
Speaker 6: Okay, Yeah, that sounds great.
Speaker 7: Thank you both for letting me help out on this
Speaker 7: as much as I can.
Speaker 1: There's a lot of press on Jared. There's a lot
Speaker 1: of internet activity surrounding Jared, but not with from Jared.
Speaker 4: Himself discussing the incident.
Speaker 1: Right, discussing the incident, But there's nothing that Jared has
Speaker 1: for us to look at, right.
Speaker 4: So I haven't dug into him me.
Speaker 1: Either, And so I was thinking when I was at
Speaker 1: work today that maybe, you know, we should maybe start
Speaker 1: doing that.
Speaker 5: What do we want to look for? Do we want
Speaker 5: to look at a social media like? What is it
Speaker 5: we're trying to do? See if he had a social
Speaker 5: media presence.
Speaker 4: What it was like. I have a feeling it's going
Speaker 4: to be all about his family.
Speaker 1: I do too, I.
Speaker 4: Do, and see what goes on from there.
Speaker 1: Well, wouldn't it make sense that if somebody's murdered that
Speaker 1: you look at who they were interacting with on social media?
Speaker 1: Because if let's say, let's just say it was an
Speaker 1: angry coworker, I don't know, maybe they had some sort
Speaker 1: of altercation online that was recorded somewhere. I doubt it.
Speaker 1: Jared doesn't seem like he was the kind of person
Speaker 1: that was like chronically online, but you know, I didn't
Speaker 1: know the man. But I mean, I think it's worth
Speaker 1: at least looking correct. You know, we don't have a
Speaker 1: lot to look at other than people making you know,
Speaker 1: allegations and conjecture and like, you know, coming up with
Speaker 1: like ideas, which is great. I mean, I understand it,
Speaker 1: I do it. But we can do that just you
Speaker 1: and I. I think I did look at his faith
Speaker 1: to see if he had a Facebook page, But I
Speaker 1: think what happened was I found That's how I found
Speaker 1: the Facebook group that his wife create or if somebody
Speaker 1: created that his wife is in Justice for Jared or
Speaker 1: something like that. Let mean, let's let's uh, let's do
Speaker 1: a look here, dude.
Speaker 4: Let's see.
Speaker 5: Can we talk about the differences in Facebook from when
Speaker 5: we started looking at people like ten years ago as
Speaker 5: to how it is.
Speaker 4: I hate Facebook. Now it's so different, right, yeah, it
Speaker 4: is so different.
Speaker 1: There used to be like a timeline kind of thing
Speaker 1: on like the right side of the screen that showed
Speaker 1: you everything that account had done. They like this, they
Speaker 1: were a member of this group, they joined you know this,
Speaker 1: they started liking this page, they liked this photo. It
Speaker 1: was like an activity log for that account.
Speaker 5: The good old days, the good old days, simple and straightforward,
Speaker 5: and you could find it all in one place. Oh yeah,
Speaker 5: and now things have changed on Facebook.
Speaker 4: A lot.
Speaker 1: Right. Oh yeah, so Jared does have a Facebook page and.
Speaker 4: It looks like they turned it into a memorial.
Speaker 1: Like the memorial page it says it says remembering Jared, right.
Speaker 5: I just see pictures of him kids, yep, wedding photos,
Speaker 5: him and Kirsten kissing a lot.
Speaker 4: Yeah, so it looks like a very loving, caring family.
Speaker 5: Yeah, you wouldn't imagine that the person, the husband in
Speaker 5: this picture would one day have his life taken in
Speaker 5: such a scenario where it looks like somebody set them up.
Speaker 4: And it's very hard to imagine that looking at these pictures.
Speaker 1: Very so go to photos, right yep, then and then
Speaker 1: go to albums.
Speaker 4: So this is so we're giving away to our trade
Speaker 4: secrets here.
Speaker 5: So when Dana and I work on cases, especially on
Speaker 5: Facebook or social media, it's not just the person's profile.
Speaker 5: We look at people who liked it. For instance, there
Speaker 5: were seven people who liked this.
Speaker 1: Image, but only five appeer so.
Speaker 4: The other two you don't know.
Speaker 1: So the other two either removed their social media profile
Speaker 1: blocked us, which is unlikely. Yeah, and I mean those
Speaker 1: are the two options, right, they don't exist anymore.
Speaker 5: Those likes, those are the rabbit holes Diana and I
Speaker 5: would go down, our group would go down and trying
Speaker 5: to find people. If you're looking for a person, you
Speaker 5: also want to look for the people around them who
Speaker 5: they associate with.
Speaker 1: There's nothing to keep close to the chest. It's not
Speaker 1: secret evidence that nobody knew about the Preston, know about
Speaker 1: the press, know about this truck. It's already out and
Speaker 1: they release the information. It wasn't like from some secret source. Correct,
Speaker 1: So there's no reason for the cops to say, we're
Speaker 1: not going to tell you.
Speaker 5: I don't think they're going to publicly say, oh, we
Speaker 5: found the truck and we have it in evidence.
Speaker 1: Okay, Well I disagree. I think they would. I would
Speaker 1: say that they would say the truck has been cleared
Speaker 1: or no, it hasn't.
Speaker 4: Well, let's ask yeah.
Speaker 1: First, let's ask Christian.
Speaker 5: And see if she knows, because I think that's I mean,
Speaker 5: that's the one piece of evidence that you know once
Speaker 5: you find that.
Speaker 1: I would like to know. And they're not going to
Speaker 1: tell us this, but I would like to know why
Speaker 1: they're looking for that is it? Is it only because
Speaker 1: it's it's a four f one fifty which matches the
Speaker 1: tire right, and it's got a spare on it? Is
Speaker 1: that the end? It's kind of in that area. Is
Speaker 1: that the reason.
Speaker 4: That's enough reason for me to want to find it?
Speaker 1: Well, I don't know. I mean, if listen, if I'm
Speaker 1: going to commit a murder and I'm like advanced in
Speaker 1: whatever in killing people, which seems to be the going
Speaker 1: theory with some sort of hit, right, Yeah, I Am
Speaker 1: not going to use a tire from the car I'm driving.
Speaker 4: That's the mistake, right, That's a huge mistake. Yeah.
Speaker 5: But at the time, they don't know that they're going
Speaker 5: to be caught on surveillance camera driving by with the
Speaker 5: spare tire on the front, right, going by a police station.
Speaker 5: They don't think they're going to be caught. They think
Speaker 5: they've gotten away with the crime at this point, right, I.
Speaker 1: Mean it's only been less than an hour than the crime.
Speaker 1: How would they know they got away with it? I
Speaker 1: don't know. I mean, I'm just trying to get some
Speaker 1: sort of quote unquote profile on this person, right.
Speaker 4: Yeah. The other issue is is it could have been
Speaker 4: a car jacking. Right.
Speaker 5: They put the tire out there with the idea that
Speaker 5: they're not going to leave the tire, right, So they
Speaker 5: put the tire out there. They're not looking for Jared.
Speaker 5: Let's just say they're just looking for.
Speaker 1: A nice car, right absolutely, And then they see a
Speaker 1: kid and they're like shit, well.
Speaker 4: Yeah no, So here comes Jared.
Speaker 5: He stops, he gets out, they go out, boom boom boom.
Speaker 5: The guy goes to get in the car to drive away,
Speaker 5: looks in the back seats he's a kid. Goes, oh shit,
Speaker 5: I can't take this car. It's got a kid in
Speaker 5: the back. Now I'm kidnapping. That's not you know, stealing
Speaker 5: a car is one thing, but you know they've shot
Speaker 5: the guy murdered. Now I'm in a kidnap And so
Speaker 5: maybe they go oh shit and they flee and leave
Speaker 5: the tire there.
Speaker 1: They've already murdered somebody. What what's the I mean, that's
Speaker 1: like the worst thing you can do, right yeah, what
Speaker 1: is going to stop that person from just going kidnapping? Whatever?
Speaker 4: You know, do you want to have to take care
Speaker 4: of a two year old kid?
Speaker 1: That's a hard point.
Speaker 8: Now you got a two year old kid, you gotta
Speaker 8: feed and bathe and change.
Speaker 5: And if you're willing to kill an adult male, are
Speaker 5: you willing to kill a child? That's a huge that's
Speaker 5: a huge difference, that is right, right, yeah, And so
Speaker 5: I don't know, it's still I mean baffles me how
Speaker 5: nine months and no or rest.
Speaker 1: So let's say it is a car jacking. Let's just
Speaker 1: go with that for a minute.
Speaker 4: Okay.
Speaker 1: Wouldn't it make more sense to do a car jacking
Speaker 1: with somebody at like a stop sign than a tire
Speaker 1: in the road.
Speaker 5: No, because they have a way to escape, Like if
Speaker 5: you're sitting in your car, Like do you lock your
Speaker 5: car doors.
Speaker 4: When you get in your car?
Speaker 1: Yeah?
Speaker 5: Okay, so you're sitting, you're coming up, you're on your
Speaker 5: way to work in the morning. You come up to
Speaker 5: the stop sign right outside your neighborhood. You see a
Speaker 5: guy walking up to your car. Are you gonna stay there?
Speaker 5: You're gonna drive away? Okay, probably gonna You're probably gonna
Speaker 5: drive away, right, Yeah, I locked my car doors. I'm
Speaker 5: constantly keeping an eye around me nowadays in the world
Speaker 5: we live in. And so putting a tire there on
Speaker 5: a one way road where you can't get around because
Speaker 5: there's a sign post on one side and palm trees
Speaker 5: on the other, you know, maybe it fits.
Speaker 1: The m all of the forces him it forces the
Speaker 1: victim of the carjacking to get out of the car, correct, right, yep? Now,
Speaker 1: I mean I think that's an interesting You're.
Speaker 8: Not going up to him capping on the window saying
Speaker 8: get out where they can drive away. They put the
Speaker 8: car in part, they're stepping out, car doors, open keys
Speaker 8: in the ignition, how is he does it.
Speaker 5: Get That's where, like, initially, that's where we're when I
Speaker 5: read about it, That's where my mind went on, like
Speaker 5: this carjacking. Then you read all the other stuff around it,
Speaker 5: regarding his previous marriage, and then you start to question things, well.
Speaker 1: And I wonder, you know, the cops initially, I mean
Speaker 1: very quickly said this was he was a target.
Speaker 5: Right.
Speaker 1: I wonder if there's a puma in this case that
Speaker 1: they haven't told us that we don't know, that makes
Speaker 1: it where they believe that he's targeted. Because that was
Speaker 1: my first thing too. We both talked about this when
Speaker 1: we first started digging into this, was it was this
Speaker 1: maybe you know, like road rage, slash carjacking, you know,
Speaker 1: is it something other than a hit. But every article
Speaker 1: we read from you know, with the police quotes it's
Speaker 1: target and what makes them think that it's kind of
Speaker 1: like that. What's going on with the Moscow murders? They
Speaker 1: have said they were targeted. Why do you think that?
Speaker 1: Why do you think that? And they're not going to
Speaker 1: tell They're not going to give that piece of evidence
Speaker 1: away because whoever is the the suspect or the person
Speaker 1: who did it, I should say, is going to come
Speaker 1: up with some sort of story to make up for that,
Speaker 1: you know what I mean, or change the puma right.
Speaker 4: Yeah.
Speaker 1: Yeah, So I'm just wondering there has to be something
Speaker 1: that we don't know that they haven't released to anybody,
Speaker 1: even Kirsten.
Speaker 5: So when we were talking to Chris Pisay, yeah, said,
Speaker 5: did they check that tire for fingerprints?
Speaker 1: I'm sure they have a right sure, so I'm sure.
Speaker 4: Have you ever changed a tire on your car?
Speaker 2: Yeah, it's a dirty thing.
Speaker 4: It's not easy.
Speaker 5: You're putting your hands all over that tired but getting
Speaker 5: the lug nuts off, you're putting your hands on the
Speaker 5: wrins too. Me because I know how dirty it is.
Speaker 5: I would wear gloves just if I was changing the tire.
Speaker 4: But if my tire went flat while I was.
Speaker 5: Driving on the road, I have, you know, some gloves
Speaker 5: in my car just because of COVID. Now I would
Speaker 5: have put those on to do it, but I don't
Speaker 5: think the normal person would carry gloves in their car,
Speaker 5: so they would have been touching that tire a lot. Now,
Speaker 5: the question is, is your fingerprints show up on rubber tires?
Speaker 5: They would obviously show up on the metal rim, but
Speaker 5: what about the tire?
Speaker 4: I don't know.
Speaker 1: Well, maybe let's I'm gonna make a list of these
Speaker 1: kinds of questions, and these are things that we can research.
Speaker 1: We might not be able to look at, you know,
Speaker 1: Jared himself right now, but maybe we can look at
Speaker 1: like that. Like, for instance, maybe we can look at
Speaker 1: how many cases of carjacking have occurred where the person
Speaker 1: is not at a stoplight or a stop sign, yeah,
Speaker 1: or maybe they've used an obstruction Because here's my fear.
Speaker 1: Everybody is so focused on the ex wife and the husband,
Speaker 1: the X wife and her current husband that And I'm
Speaker 1: not saying that they're innocent. I have no idea, but
Speaker 1: you wonder if they're only looking in that direction. And
Speaker 1: I have a really hard time believing that professional law
Speaker 1: enforcement would have like a one track mind like that.
Speaker 1: And I'm not saying that these cops are doing that,
Speaker 1: but it can happen. It's human nature, it's a human flaw.
Speaker 1: And so maybe we can look at statistics that are
Speaker 1: out there on carjackings and is it possible that in
Speaker 1: all the reported cases it happened that way. Yeah, I
Speaker 1: just want to have some answers for the family to say, listen,
Speaker 1: this has happened in you know, x percent of carjacking
Speaker 1: cases where there's been some sort of reason for the
Speaker 1: person to get out of the vehicle.
Speaker 4: Well, think about this. So the police have said that
Speaker 4: the shooter was close enough to leave stippling from.
Speaker 1: The gun shot, walked right up to him, right, yeah.
Speaker 4: Within three to four feet, they say, right right?
Speaker 5: Do you think Jared if he saw this person coming
Speaker 5: up to him, would put up a fight? Like, we
Speaker 5: don't know where the gunshots were, like where they're defensive shots,
Speaker 5: Like did you go through his arms or anything? Like
Speaker 5: was he putting up a struggle or did they go
Speaker 5: through his back? Did the person come from the back
Speaker 5: of the car. So I don't know how we address
Speaker 5: that questions to her if she knows where the.
Speaker 1: Bullet I'm not comfortable asking that.
Speaker 5: Yeah, I don't want to do it either.
Speaker 1: Maybe we can find that, maybe we can find that information.
Speaker 1: It might be it might be somewhere out there.
Speaker 4: There would have to be an autopsy report.
Speaker 1: It would have to be maybe a news article about
Speaker 1: the autopsy report, not necessarily the autopsic report itself.
Speaker 5: Well, what I'm getting at is if Jared saw the
Speaker 5: person coming up to him and his kids in the car,
Speaker 5: he seems like the type of persons going to put fight.
Speaker 1: Or he's going to be like, take whatever you need.
Speaker 1: My daughter's in the backseat, you can have everything you want.
Speaker 1: Let me get her, you know, maybe something like that.
Speaker 1: I don't know that he would necessarily put up a fight.
Speaker 1: He's protective, clearly. I mean he's he's a dad, and
Speaker 1: he's a young dad. He might have been like, you
Speaker 1: can do you can you can have anything. Just let
Speaker 1: me get my daughter, take the car to take the car,
Speaker 1: wallets in the my wallets in the globe compartment, you know,
Speaker 1: or whatever.
Speaker 4: Right, it seems like things happened so rapidly that I
Speaker 4: don't think there was much discussion.
Speaker 2: I don't know.
Speaker 5: Yeah, but I mean from the time he left her house,
Speaker 5: from the time or the video where you hear the gunshots.
Speaker 4: That was like fifteen minutes. Yeah, so I don't know.
Speaker 4: So there's two you know theories, right, carjacking, possible carjacking too.
Speaker 4: He was targeted, meaning that somebody wanted him dead.
Speaker 5: Now we both obviously we don't think the ex wife
Speaker 5: did it herself.
Speaker 4: Did she hire somebody? That's the one thing we're thinking of.
Speaker 5: You know, they hired somebody to take care to silence Jared.
Speaker 1: Right, But there would be some sort of financial trail, right,
Speaker 1: so let's talk about that. Wouldn't there be some sort
Speaker 1: of financial trail of let's just say the ex wife
Speaker 1: or the husband paying somebody X number of dollars. Okay,
Speaker 1: how would they hide that?
Speaker 5: There are a bank secrecy app that requires bank to
Speaker 5: report large transactions. Right, So if I go to my
Speaker 5: bank and I deposit a large sum of money over ten.
Speaker 4: Thousand dollars, right, same as a casino.
Speaker 5: If I go down to a black chat table and
Speaker 5: I PLoP down twenty thousand dollars and one hundred dollar bills,
Speaker 5: they're going to want me to fill out a form.
Speaker 1: Right, we have to log everything over three thousand.
Speaker 5: Right, So if I go to my bank and I
Speaker 5: want to do a deposit of ten thousand dollars more.
Speaker 5: They're going to fill out a form and submit it
Speaker 5: to somebody saying like, oh, this, the person's made a
Speaker 5: large cash deposit. So I'm assuming the X in this
Speaker 5: scenario is a person of wealth, right and has money available. Yeah,
Speaker 5: depending on however much they agreed to pay for it,
Speaker 5: I would assume they could come up with that money.
Speaker 4: So if you think it was the X, I think
Speaker 4: they would have funds.
Speaker 5: The resource is available to pay somebody, right.
Speaker 1: But there's got to be a pay patrol of that money.
Speaker 4: Right, Well, I'm sure depending on the amount that do.
Speaker 1: You think it was under three thousand dollars?
Speaker 5: I'm trying to say something without saying how I would
Speaker 5: we do it. I wouldn't do it in one transaction.
Speaker 5: You would structure it, right, you'd make pay structure. You
Speaker 5: would structure with your withdrawals, right, m hm, until you
Speaker 5: had the month, right, right.
Speaker 1: But if you're making steady withdrawals in the same amount, no, No,
Speaker 1: you would do different amounts.
Speaker 4: Yeah, or you know you're gonna do different amounts. You're
Speaker 4: not gonna make it so structured that way, right.
Speaker 5: That that's how most people get caught laundering money, as
Speaker 5: they put nine thousand dollars in every month the first
Speaker 5: of every month, and then you know they see that pattern,
Speaker 5: they go, something's on here, start asking questions.
Speaker 4: So I know I'd be like, Oh, we're buying a
Speaker 4: new car.
Speaker 5: We need this money, we need cash, and so I
Speaker 5: don't see that being an obstacle.
Speaker 1: So you think that this was definitely a cash transaction,
Speaker 1: I would I would agree, because you know, cash is untraceable, right,
Speaker 1: but there has to be some sort of source for
Speaker 1: that cash. Let's stop here for another quick break. I'm
Speaker 1: gonna look into carjacking statistics, but I don't know if
Speaker 1: I'm gonna be able to find like how it happened,
Speaker 1: you know what I mean, Like I might I might
Speaker 1: find like in the city in Detroit, you know this
Speaker 1: carjacking happens X number of times. I don't know.
Speaker 5: It seems like there's a lot of car jackings in Jacksonville, Florida.
Speaker 4: That's different than Jacksonville Beach.
Speaker 1: Right it is. But I would necessarily concentrate on Jacksonville
Speaker 1: or Florida for that matter. I would just look at
Speaker 1: like nationwide, because if it's something that happens all over
Speaker 1: the country, like where there's some sort of obstruction to
Speaker 1: get somebody out of their car in order to carjack them,
Speaker 1: then that's enough evidence alone to go well maybe it
Speaker 1: was this. It doesn't necessarily need to be in Jacksonville.
Speaker 4: I just looked up carjacking statistics.
Speaker 5: It's from the Bureau of Justice Statistics October twenty twenty two,
Speaker 5: finding based on three year moving average, the rate of
Speaker 5: non fatal carjacking victimization declined seventy eight percent.
Speaker 4: Wow, from point zero point five three per one thousand
Speaker 4: residents age of sixteen in nineteen ninety five to point
Speaker 4: zero one two per one thousand and twenty twenty one.
Speaker 5: So carjacking has gone down for one thousand dramatically since
Speaker 5: the ninety Holy shit, I think so. Yeah, you wouldn't
Speaker 5: guess that based on media. So what's interesting to this
Speaker 5: on this data is whether they resist, they or not.
Speaker 5: It's basically a corn coin. Fifty three resisted, forty seven didn't.
Speaker 5: Victim injured, seventy four percent weren't injured. So three out
Speaker 5: of four carjackings the person's not injured, but one and
Speaker 5: wore they are. So people getting injured isn't a big
Speaker 5: part of a car jacking normal, Right, So the vast
Speaker 5: majority of carjackings, the victim isn't injured at all all.
Speaker 5: They probably put their hands up and then looking at
Speaker 5: the you know, fifty three percent victim resisted the offender,
Speaker 5: forty seven percent didn't.
Speaker 4: So it's basically a coin flip.
Speaker 5: So if half of them resisted the offender, but the
Speaker 5: majority of them nobody gets injured.
Speaker 4: So it makes me tend to think that this.
Speaker 5: Wasn't a carjacking based on this statistic, right, Yeah, the
Speaker 5: majority of carjackings, the person, whether they resisted or not,
Speaker 5: they go uninjured, seventy four percent of them.
Speaker 1: I just don't have a good feeling about the ex wife,
Speaker 1: and I have no evidence. I have nothing to base
Speaker 1: that on. It's just a gut thing. And in order
Speaker 1: for me to like really bite into that scenario, I
Speaker 1: have to eliminate the other possibilities, right, And how you
Speaker 1: do that is what I'm doing right now. I'm eliminating
Speaker 1: this possibility that it's a car jacking. If there are
Speaker 1: no carjackings with you know, an obstruction used to get
Speaker 1: somebody to get out of their car and move it,
Speaker 1: then it's probably not a car jacking. And I can
Speaker 1: move on, you know what I mean? So I have recently,
Speaker 1: very recently, I was diagnosed with autism, and part of
Speaker 1: my issue, one of my issues, is that I just
Speaker 1: can't let things go. I mean, and clearly people who
Speaker 1: know me understand that to be true of me, and
Speaker 1: I just can't seem to let go of the idea
Speaker 1: that this was not targeted and that it was just
Speaker 1: wrong place and wrong time and he was just the
Speaker 1: guy that pulled up and I need to let it go. Well,
Speaker 1: I don't know if that's right. I don't know if
Speaker 1: I need to let it go. I need to be
Speaker 1: able to accept other possibilities, and the way that I'm
Speaker 1: going to do that is to eliminate those possibilities. And
Speaker 1: that's what I'm trying to do.
Speaker 4: That's what I want to ask Kirsten. Did they say
Speaker 4: have they ruled out carjacking?
Speaker 5: I think in this scenario, I think it sounds like
Speaker 5: the police have been very worthcoming.
Speaker 4: With her and telling her information as they know it.
Speaker 4: So that's what I want to know. Have the police
Speaker 4: completely ruled out carjacking? Two? Are they still looking for
Speaker 4: the Ford.
Speaker 5: F one fifty And is there anything new that she
Speaker 5: could share with us.
Speaker 4: Have they pulled her anything new? So let's say, you.
Speaker 5: Know, Chris runs a report, gives us information, and it shows.
Speaker 4: They've moved out of state.
Speaker 5: That there goes with our whole idea that she wanted
Speaker 5: to move out of state prior.
Speaker 4: To the incident.
Speaker 1: Well, I found something on Reddit in one of my
Speaker 1: solo sessions, Yeah, that the brother of the husband listened
Speaker 1: to Coma and Mario. Mario's brother oh Or lived there
Speaker 1: at one point. So they do have a connection, albeit
Speaker 1: a thin connection to Washington. More on that next time.
Speaker 5: True Crimes is executive produced by Stephanie Leidecker, Deanna Thompson,
Speaker 5: Courtney Armstrong, Jeff Shane, Andrew Arnault, and me John Green.
Speaker 5: Additional producing by Connor Powell and Gabe Castile, Editing by
Speaker 5: Jeff Twi, Music by Vanikor Music.
Speaker 1: True Crimes is a production of iHeart Radio and Katie Studios.
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