1 00:00:11,840 --> 00:00:14,480 Speaker 1: Good morning, Pete Sen. Welcome to woka F Daily with 2 00:00:14,640 --> 00:00:19,239 Speaker 1: Meet your Girl Danielle Moody. Recording from the Home Bunker, Folks, 3 00:00:19,280 --> 00:00:23,640 Speaker 1: Today we are doing a special episode of woke F 4 00:00:23,960 --> 00:00:27,720 Speaker 1: Daily with our friend, doctor Jonathan Metzel. We decided to 5 00:00:27,720 --> 00:00:30,520 Speaker 1: turn the tables this episode. Usually for the past couple 6 00:00:30,520 --> 00:00:33,720 Speaker 1: of years, I mean, Jonathan and I have been talking 7 00:00:33,760 --> 00:00:37,479 Speaker 1: weekly since the beginning of the pandemic. So just think 8 00:00:37,520 --> 00:00:40,440 Speaker 1: about how many conversations you've listened to with the two 9 00:00:40,479 --> 00:00:43,080 Speaker 1: of us. But today we decided to turn the tables. 10 00:00:43,320 --> 00:00:47,080 Speaker 1: We went live from Vanderbilt University where Jonathan teaches a 11 00:00:47,159 --> 00:00:52,720 Speaker 1: class on COVID and society, and essentially today's lecture was 12 00:00:52,800 --> 00:00:57,040 Speaker 1: with regard to how COVID has changed our politics and 13 00:00:57,160 --> 00:01:00,920 Speaker 1: has it changed it forever? And has it changed forever? 14 00:01:01,080 --> 00:01:05,360 Speaker 1: And so in this conversation, instead of me asking Jonathan questions, 15 00:01:05,840 --> 00:01:09,959 Speaker 1: Jonathan asked me questions and turns the table on how 16 00:01:10,040 --> 00:01:14,839 Speaker 1: I think that media has changed how the public views 17 00:01:14,920 --> 00:01:18,120 Speaker 1: public health, whether or not we'll ever get back to 18 00:01:18,480 --> 00:01:21,759 Speaker 1: a community minded space with regard to public health, where 19 00:01:22,200 --> 00:01:25,679 Speaker 1: we really are our brothers, sisters, our friends, keepers and 20 00:01:25,720 --> 00:01:30,880 Speaker 1: we care about their well being and so For me, folks, 21 00:01:30,959 --> 00:01:34,640 Speaker 1: this was a really fun episode to do because I 22 00:01:34,800 --> 00:01:38,679 Speaker 1: miss university. There is a war on education right now 23 00:01:38,720 --> 00:01:41,399 Speaker 1: at K through twelve level, but also at the higher 24 00:01:41,480 --> 00:01:44,959 Speaker 1: education level, and so there are days when I think 25 00:01:44,959 --> 00:01:50,040 Speaker 1: to myself, I couldn't imagine going through and getting my 26 00:01:50,480 --> 00:01:56,360 Speaker 1: degree right now, right Like I remember thinking about you know, 27 00:01:56,520 --> 00:01:59,760 Speaker 1: political science and framing it in terms of how I 28 00:02:00,000 --> 00:02:02,240 Speaker 1: want it to be a force for good and be 29 00:02:02,360 --> 00:02:06,040 Speaker 1: a public servant and helped shape and change the nation. 30 00:02:06,720 --> 00:02:08,440 Speaker 1: And that was at a time when I thought that 31 00:02:08,520 --> 00:02:12,000 Speaker 1: we were on an upswing. So what does it mean 32 00:02:12,639 --> 00:02:15,240 Speaker 1: to be getting a degree in politics or getting a 33 00:02:15,280 --> 00:02:20,080 Speaker 1: degree in journalism at this current time? So the opportunity 34 00:02:20,160 --> 00:02:24,320 Speaker 1: to both speak with and listen to young people for 35 00:02:24,360 --> 00:02:26,920 Speaker 1: me was a huge treat. So I hope that you 36 00:02:27,000 --> 00:02:29,840 Speaker 1: all enjoy this. Who I guess it would be a 37 00:02:29,840 --> 00:02:34,040 Speaker 1: Freaky Friday episode with Jonathan where Jonathan turns the tables 38 00:02:34,120 --> 00:02:37,959 Speaker 1: and puts on his host hat and I enter into 39 00:02:38,280 --> 00:02:42,400 Speaker 1: the guest's chair. So coming up next, my conversation with 40 00:02:42,560 --> 00:02:48,880 Speaker 1: doctor Jonathan Metzel on COVID and society. It's no secret 41 00:02:48,919 --> 00:02:52,240 Speaker 1: that the news is horsepill hard to swallow. Thankfully, there's 42 00:02:52,280 --> 00:02:56,720 Speaker 1: The Bituation Room podcast hosted by comedian and commentator Francesca 43 00:02:56,760 --> 00:02:59,720 Speaker 1: free Erntini, for a lighter take on the heavy stuff. 44 00:03:00,040 --> 00:03:03,680 Speaker 1: Each week, The Bituation Room brings you progressive comedians, experts, 45 00:03:03,680 --> 00:03:05,839 Speaker 1: and activists to break down the issues in a way 46 00:03:05,880 --> 00:03:08,600 Speaker 1: that won't just leave you crying under a weighted blanket. 47 00:03:08,680 --> 00:03:12,320 Speaker 1: Get The Bituation Room on Apple Podcasts, Scotify, Stitcher, and 48 00:03:12,480 --> 00:03:20,600 Speaker 1: streaming on YouTube and Twitch. All right, welcome to class, everybody. 49 00:03:20,639 --> 00:03:23,640 Speaker 1: I am delighted to turn the tables today. For the 50 00:03:23,639 --> 00:03:27,600 Speaker 1: past gosh, how long has it been. Danielle in the pemic. 51 00:03:28,680 --> 00:03:31,079 Speaker 1: We've been talking every dayn week for the pandemic. So, 52 00:03:31,440 --> 00:03:35,000 Speaker 1: Danielle is a dear friend of mine and we used 53 00:03:35,040 --> 00:03:39,080 Speaker 1: to do television together on MSNBC and other stuff like that. 54 00:03:40,080 --> 00:03:44,680 Speaker 1: Danielle and I were also the only people who were, like, 55 00:03:44,760 --> 00:03:48,360 Speaker 1: I think, adequately freaking out before the pandemic happened. And 56 00:03:48,400 --> 00:03:50,440 Speaker 1: so like everybody else was like, oh, two weeks of 57 00:03:50,560 --> 00:03:52,920 Speaker 1: canned soup and cash, and Danielle and I would be 58 00:03:52,920 --> 00:03:55,320 Speaker 1: in the back being like, this ain't two weeks. I 59 00:03:55,880 --> 00:03:57,680 Speaker 1: can't soup. This is like you know the world is 60 00:03:57,800 --> 00:04:00,280 Speaker 1: going to implode or something like that. And so we've 61 00:04:00,280 --> 00:04:03,960 Speaker 1: been actually doing a TV segment every week over the 62 00:04:04,000 --> 00:04:08,560 Speaker 1: course of the entire pandemic processing and every week we say, 63 00:04:09,120 --> 00:04:12,840 Speaker 1: next week, we're going to talk about puppies, or we're 64 00:04:12,840 --> 00:04:15,560 Speaker 1: going to talk about ponies, or we're going to talk 65 00:04:15,560 --> 00:04:19,680 Speaker 1: about springtime. Because we're not like dour people. But what 66 00:04:19,720 --> 00:04:22,160 Speaker 1: we need is for the bummer news to stop happening. 67 00:04:22,240 --> 00:04:25,960 Speaker 1: But instead what happens is the bummer news keeps coming. 68 00:04:25,960 --> 00:04:28,359 Speaker 1: And so I've got a bunch of slides about politics, 69 00:04:28,400 --> 00:04:32,120 Speaker 1: which maybe' all go into afterwards, but let me just 70 00:04:32,160 --> 00:04:34,560 Speaker 1: say a few things that I am delighted to welcome 71 00:04:34,560 --> 00:04:38,919 Speaker 1: to class today my good friend Danielle Moody. Danielle hosts 72 00:04:38,960 --> 00:04:42,600 Speaker 1: a bunch of different shows. The most important ones by 73 00:04:42,680 --> 00:04:47,640 Speaker 1: far are wikaf and Democracy, which are both daniel word 74 00:04:47,640 --> 00:04:51,240 Speaker 1: of those stream everywhere. They stream everywhere. You guys get 75 00:04:51,279 --> 00:04:55,080 Speaker 1: your podcasts, everywhere you get your podcasts. I love this 76 00:04:55,160 --> 00:04:57,760 Speaker 1: on your bio. It says never sorry about shaking things up. 77 00:04:57,800 --> 00:05:00,640 Speaker 1: We're calling bs when she sees it. Danielle has been 78 00:05:00,600 --> 00:05:05,000 Speaker 1: an apologetic commentator about America's racism problem. She made waves 79 00:05:05,000 --> 00:05:07,479 Speaker 1: on election night in twenty sixteen when she called Donald 80 00:05:07,520 --> 00:05:11,599 Speaker 1: Trump's win White Supremacies lest stand video clips went which 81 00:05:11,640 --> 00:05:17,280 Speaker 1: went viral and she's the really I mean, how many 82 00:05:17,400 --> 00:05:20,040 Speaker 1: can you tell us, Danielle really quickly for the audience here, 83 00:05:20,640 --> 00:05:23,039 Speaker 1: tell us a little bit about your media background before 84 00:05:23,080 --> 00:05:26,040 Speaker 1: we get where we get going. Sure, So my background 85 00:05:26,120 --> 00:05:29,440 Speaker 1: is actually in politics and policy. Um. I worked on 86 00:05:29,520 --> 00:05:33,880 Speaker 1: Capitol Hill, uh did education policy, was the lead lobbyist 87 00:05:33,960 --> 00:05:39,360 Speaker 1: for New York City's education lobbying efforts under Mayor Bloomberg 88 00:05:40,800 --> 00:05:45,400 Speaker 1: transition to education environmental education. And I got into media 89 00:05:45,000 --> 00:05:48,520 Speaker 1: by way of the marriage equality fight, so in the 90 00:05:48,560 --> 00:05:52,800 Speaker 1: early two thousands became a national spokesperson for marriage equality. 91 00:05:52,960 --> 00:05:58,800 Speaker 1: From there transitioned into doing more policy around LGBTQ issues 92 00:05:58,920 --> 00:06:01,960 Speaker 1: and recognize seeing that there are two ways to change, 93 00:06:02,000 --> 00:06:04,760 Speaker 1: you know, to change hearts and minds. One of them 94 00:06:04,839 --> 00:06:07,599 Speaker 1: is through media and the other is through policy. So 95 00:06:07,839 --> 00:06:11,719 Speaker 1: that's how I became more active in terms of writing 96 00:06:11,760 --> 00:06:15,480 Speaker 1: and speaking and creating shows that kind of cut through 97 00:06:15,560 --> 00:06:18,800 Speaker 1: the bs, which you can only get so much in 98 00:06:18,960 --> 00:06:25,320 Speaker 1: soundbites on television. And so podcasting and creating content is 99 00:06:25,320 --> 00:06:27,960 Speaker 1: a way for us to really delve into the conversations 100 00:06:28,040 --> 00:06:32,840 Speaker 1: that mainstream media misses wonderful. And as I was just saying, 101 00:06:33,000 --> 00:06:36,200 Speaker 1: you and I have been speaking every single Tuesday and 102 00:06:36,240 --> 00:06:40,080 Speaker 1: Wednesday for the past well since really the second week 103 00:06:40,080 --> 00:06:43,960 Speaker 1: of the pandemic. Yeah, and the class that you're speaking 104 00:06:43,960 --> 00:06:46,920 Speaker 1: in front of there's a audience of students in front 105 00:06:46,920 --> 00:06:48,800 Speaker 1: of me, which will go to in a little bit here. 106 00:06:49,560 --> 00:06:52,040 Speaker 1: But the theme of this class is COVID and society, 107 00:06:52,520 --> 00:06:55,039 Speaker 1: and we're kind of asking how the pandemic change the 108 00:06:55,080 --> 00:06:57,839 Speaker 1: world as we know it, and also how the pandemic 109 00:06:57,960 --> 00:07:01,800 Speaker 1: is changing the future of the future as you know, 110 00:07:02,080 --> 00:07:05,760 Speaker 1: what's the trajectory that is being altered or exposed as 111 00:07:05,800 --> 00:07:08,640 Speaker 1: a result of the pandemic. And so we've done different 112 00:07:08,680 --> 00:07:14,000 Speaker 1: weeks on science, expertise, race, things like that, and today 113 00:07:14,040 --> 00:07:16,600 Speaker 1: we're talking about politics and protests. And I thought, man, 114 00:07:16,640 --> 00:07:18,880 Speaker 1: I've been talking about this every week with Danielle, and 115 00:07:18,920 --> 00:07:21,000 Speaker 1: so I thought, let's do let's do this conversation in 116 00:07:21,040 --> 00:07:23,000 Speaker 1: front of the class and then we'll bring in the class. 117 00:07:23,000 --> 00:07:26,520 Speaker 1: And so the theme today is how did the pandemic 118 00:07:26,680 --> 00:07:31,320 Speaker 1: change either politics as we know it, the future of politics, 119 00:07:31,520 --> 00:07:34,200 Speaker 1: or the future the future of the world in a 120 00:07:34,240 --> 00:07:38,520 Speaker 1: particular way. Wow. I mean, one, I love the fact 121 00:07:38,600 --> 00:07:41,800 Speaker 1: that you do this class, and to those are really 122 00:07:41,960 --> 00:07:45,680 Speaker 1: great questions. I think that the way in which politics 123 00:07:45,680 --> 00:07:49,200 Speaker 1: has changed is fundamentally we have to think about the 124 00:07:49,200 --> 00:07:53,160 Speaker 1: fact that we had never villainized in the way that 125 00:07:53,200 --> 00:07:57,280 Speaker 1: we've seen public health done so over the last couple 126 00:07:57,320 --> 00:08:00,280 Speaker 1: of years, where we were always on the same page, 127 00:08:00,360 --> 00:08:02,280 Speaker 1: like don't we all want to be healthy, don't we 128 00:08:02,320 --> 00:08:04,520 Speaker 1: all want to be safe? Don't we all want what's 129 00:08:04,560 --> 00:08:08,680 Speaker 1: best for our friends, our neighbors, our colleagues, And that 130 00:08:09,360 --> 00:08:13,480 Speaker 1: fundamentally shifted where you had some people then this is 131 00:08:13,560 --> 00:08:16,640 Speaker 1: pre vaccine, right, because we've been talking for a long time, Jonathan, Like, 132 00:08:17,320 --> 00:08:20,720 Speaker 1: pre vaccine, it was wear a mask. Once we understood 133 00:08:20,760 --> 00:08:23,760 Speaker 1: what COVID was and how it was playing out in 134 00:08:23,800 --> 00:08:26,720 Speaker 1: the beginning, it said we were told, wear a mask, 135 00:08:26,840 --> 00:08:29,520 Speaker 1: it'll keep yourself safe, it'll keep those around you stafe, 136 00:08:29,760 --> 00:08:33,839 Speaker 1: have six feet of distance, right, wash your hands, And 137 00:08:33,880 --> 00:08:39,360 Speaker 1: all of a sudden you saw this breakdown with the 138 00:08:39,400 --> 00:08:43,240 Speaker 1: Republican Party and the far right deciding that by telling 139 00:08:43,280 --> 00:08:46,560 Speaker 1: people to be in community with one another in order 140 00:08:46,600 --> 00:08:49,600 Speaker 1: to keep all of us safe, that somehow that was 141 00:08:49,640 --> 00:08:53,760 Speaker 1: in violation of their rights and violation of their liberty right. 142 00:08:53,800 --> 00:08:57,959 Speaker 1: So they wanted the freedom to infect. And so I 143 00:08:58,000 --> 00:09:00,960 Speaker 1: think that by virtue of this, we lost trust in 144 00:09:01,000 --> 00:09:05,720 Speaker 1: our institutions like the CDC and the WHO where you know, 145 00:09:05,920 --> 00:09:09,160 Speaker 1: were they making decisions as the pandemic continue to progress. 146 00:09:09,480 --> 00:09:12,559 Speaker 1: Were they making decisions that were about our public health 147 00:09:12,720 --> 00:09:15,480 Speaker 1: or about politics so as not to be called out 148 00:09:15,520 --> 00:09:18,240 Speaker 1: by the far right? If they're saying, hey, you need 149 00:09:18,280 --> 00:09:21,719 Speaker 1: to quarantine for two weeks, well then you have CEOs 150 00:09:21,720 --> 00:09:25,000 Speaker 1: and shareholders that are concerned that if workers are quarantining 151 00:09:25,679 --> 00:09:27,880 Speaker 1: every time that they get sick for this long period 152 00:09:27,920 --> 00:09:31,400 Speaker 1: of time, well then what happens to productivity? What happens 153 00:09:31,440 --> 00:09:35,559 Speaker 1: to churn? So are we making decisions about capitalism or 154 00:09:35,559 --> 00:09:38,920 Speaker 1: are we making them about people's well being? And as 155 00:09:38,960 --> 00:09:41,599 Speaker 1: time went on, as we would continue in our conversations, 156 00:09:41,640 --> 00:09:44,320 Speaker 1: I think that we saw that, you know, it's kind 157 00:09:44,320 --> 00:09:47,560 Speaker 1: of a mixed bag, right, that these decisions are in 158 00:09:47,640 --> 00:09:50,080 Speaker 1: fact have become politicized, and I think that they will 159 00:09:50,120 --> 00:09:54,000 Speaker 1: be into the future, which is really detrimental in terms 160 00:09:54,040 --> 00:09:56,240 Speaker 1: of how we need to operate because I don't think 161 00:09:56,280 --> 00:10:00,360 Speaker 1: that COVID is going to be our last health pandemic, right, 162 00:10:00,480 --> 00:10:03,000 Speaker 1: And I don't necessarily think that even with each new 163 00:10:03,080 --> 00:10:06,000 Speaker 1: variant that we've seen, that we've shown that we've learned 164 00:10:06,640 --> 00:10:09,439 Speaker 1: really about what it means to not only care for ourselves, 165 00:10:09,440 --> 00:10:12,600 Speaker 1: but to care for those around us and the most 166 00:10:12,720 --> 00:10:16,120 Speaker 1: vulnerable frankly around us. So I do think that it 167 00:10:16,120 --> 00:10:18,679 Speaker 1: has shifted our politics in a way where, you know, 168 00:10:18,840 --> 00:10:21,679 Speaker 1: we thought that we could debate climate change, for instance, 169 00:10:22,440 --> 00:10:25,960 Speaker 1: and science, and that there were two different types of science. 170 00:10:26,280 --> 00:10:29,080 Speaker 1: And this is the way that we've allowed that same 171 00:10:29,120 --> 00:10:33,760 Speaker 1: type of thinking to take over public health. I think 172 00:10:33,800 --> 00:10:35,959 Speaker 1: that's exactly right, and it ties really nicely into a 173 00:10:36,000 --> 00:10:39,160 Speaker 1: bunch of stuff we've been talking about in class. Politics, 174 00:10:39,200 --> 00:10:43,760 Speaker 1: of course, functions on multiple levels. Politics is the politics 175 00:10:43,760 --> 00:10:46,600 Speaker 1: of public health certainly, and what it means. I mean, 176 00:10:46,640 --> 00:10:48,760 Speaker 1: I was just thinking the whole idea. When I was 177 00:10:48,760 --> 00:10:51,439 Speaker 1: in medicool, for example, I learned that public health means 178 00:10:53,120 --> 00:10:56,600 Speaker 1: it's not so much about saving the drowning person from 179 00:10:56,720 --> 00:10:59,520 Speaker 1: the river. It's about making sure they don't fall into 180 00:10:59,559 --> 00:11:02,520 Speaker 1: the river the first place, which means everybody working together 181 00:11:02,600 --> 00:11:07,120 Speaker 1: to put up guardrails around the water, teaching people to 182 00:11:07,120 --> 00:11:09,720 Speaker 1: swim in advance. It takes people kind of working together. 183 00:11:10,800 --> 00:11:12,920 Speaker 1: It feels like in many ways our country has kind 184 00:11:12,920 --> 00:11:15,520 Speaker 1: of fallen into the river, and the idea that we 185 00:11:15,520 --> 00:11:19,760 Speaker 1: could even build guardrails or think about prevention in a way, 186 00:11:20,200 --> 00:11:23,679 Speaker 1: it just becomes so much more unmatchable, which is ironic, right, 187 00:11:23,679 --> 00:11:27,080 Speaker 1: because we've seen what the pandemic can do. But just 188 00:11:27,120 --> 00:11:30,920 Speaker 1: the idea of public health itself, the idea that people 189 00:11:30,920 --> 00:11:35,520 Speaker 1: are working together communally to prevent things from happening before 190 00:11:35,520 --> 00:11:40,120 Speaker 1: they happen, seems awfully fraught right now, would you say, 191 00:11:41,080 --> 00:11:43,600 Speaker 1: I mean, I think that it's it's terrifying with how 192 00:11:43,679 --> 00:11:47,120 Speaker 1: fraught it is. Right when we think about thee like, 193 00:11:48,160 --> 00:11:53,640 Speaker 1: this is a virus that spreads through community, So how 194 00:11:53,679 --> 00:11:56,840 Speaker 1: can you not be community minded when trying to find 195 00:11:56,880 --> 00:12:00,360 Speaker 1: your way to solutions? Right, We had an opportunit unity. 196 00:12:00,400 --> 00:12:02,480 Speaker 1: I think you and I have discussed this and maybe 197 00:12:02,480 --> 00:12:06,120 Speaker 1: our opinions differ. We had an opportunity, you know, at 198 00:12:06,120 --> 00:12:10,520 Speaker 1: the beginning of vaccinations to get everybody vaccinated to kind 199 00:12:10,520 --> 00:12:13,840 Speaker 1: of to work to eradicate COVID. We never thought that 200 00:12:13,880 --> 00:12:16,520 Speaker 1: we would then have twenty five percent of the population 201 00:12:16,800 --> 00:12:19,240 Speaker 1: that would be like, no, I'm good, right, I think 202 00:12:19,240 --> 00:12:21,760 Speaker 1: that you're putting a microchip in my arm, right, and 203 00:12:22,160 --> 00:12:25,520 Speaker 1: not believe doctors who have no agenda, they're not running 204 00:12:25,520 --> 00:12:29,199 Speaker 1: for office, they don't need to be elected, right, So 205 00:12:29,240 --> 00:12:32,040 Speaker 1: why wouldn't you believe what doctors and nurses and health 206 00:12:32,040 --> 00:12:36,680 Speaker 1: practitioners are saying because you've been told that they're out 207 00:12:36,720 --> 00:12:41,840 Speaker 1: to get you. And so I don't know how we, 208 00:12:42,800 --> 00:12:44,920 Speaker 1: as one of guests has said to me recently, how 209 00:12:44,960 --> 00:12:49,200 Speaker 1: we knit our communities back together where we trust one 210 00:12:49,240 --> 00:12:52,880 Speaker 1: another right, where we trust that we're in this for 211 00:12:53,080 --> 00:12:57,600 Speaker 1: the betterment of ourselves and our community at large. And 212 00:12:57,640 --> 00:13:00,280 Speaker 1: if we can't get on the same page about not 213 00:13:00,360 --> 00:13:04,040 Speaker 1: wanting to kill our neighbor because we happen to cough 214 00:13:04,120 --> 00:13:07,079 Speaker 1: on them, or you know, or we refuse to wear 215 00:13:07,120 --> 00:13:10,320 Speaker 1: a mask, then I don't know what we can get 216 00:13:10,320 --> 00:13:14,080 Speaker 1: on the same page about. And that's what scares me. Hey, 217 00:13:14,120 --> 00:13:17,800 Speaker 1: I'm David Plots of Slates Political Gabfest. As another election 218 00:13:18,080 --> 00:13:21,560 Speaker 1: season accelerates, it can be tricky to sort through all 219 00:13:21,679 --> 00:13:24,480 Speaker 1: the noise and the news. Each week on the gap Fest, 220 00:13:24,640 --> 00:13:27,920 Speaker 1: John Dickerson, Emily Bathlon and I decipher the headlines, break 221 00:13:27,960 --> 00:13:31,200 Speaker 1: down the races, and tell you what issues really matter. 222 00:13:31,559 --> 00:13:34,920 Speaker 1: We do not always agree, We definitely do not always agree, 223 00:13:35,240 --> 00:13:38,280 Speaker 1: but we always deliver thoughtful debate and we always have 224 00:13:38,320 --> 00:13:42,240 Speaker 1: a good time. So subscribe to Slates Political Gapfest new 225 00:13:42,280 --> 00:13:47,760 Speaker 1: episodes every Thursday. Politics, of course, functions in many different ways. 226 00:13:48,600 --> 00:13:50,960 Speaker 1: One is about the politics of public health, which just 227 00:13:51,040 --> 00:13:54,319 Speaker 1: the idea, the idea of public health has been challenged 228 00:13:54,360 --> 00:13:57,520 Speaker 1: and just think of the irony right were challenged via 229 00:13:57,640 --> 00:14:01,600 Speaker 1: public health lenked pathogen and the just the concept of 230 00:14:01,640 --> 00:14:05,640 Speaker 1: public health falls apart, which I guess is terrifying. Maybe 231 00:14:05,640 --> 00:14:08,280 Speaker 1: it's understandable because this thing has gone on so too long. 232 00:14:08,400 --> 00:14:11,400 Speaker 1: Maybe who knows, but it does keep happening, and that's 233 00:14:11,640 --> 00:14:13,920 Speaker 1: that's certainly going to be something that plays out. And 234 00:14:13,960 --> 00:14:16,160 Speaker 1: then two other kind of functions of politics I wanted 235 00:14:16,200 --> 00:14:19,480 Speaker 1: to talk about. One is the politics of the media 236 00:14:19,520 --> 00:14:21,280 Speaker 1: and the second is the politics of race. And I'll 237 00:14:21,280 --> 00:14:24,880 Speaker 1: take those in order. I think it would be interesting 238 00:14:24,880 --> 00:14:28,000 Speaker 1: for the students to also hear what is your sense 239 00:14:28,080 --> 00:14:31,080 Speaker 1: of just the politics of your job, What is the 240 00:14:31,160 --> 00:14:33,240 Speaker 1: role of being in the media right now? How does 241 00:14:33,280 --> 00:14:39,280 Speaker 1: what's happening right now change how you conceptualize like your mission, 242 00:14:39,400 --> 00:14:41,480 Speaker 1: or how does it change your daily life? And I 243 00:14:41,520 --> 00:14:43,160 Speaker 1: say that because we've got a lot of students who 244 00:14:43,160 --> 00:14:45,760 Speaker 1: are thinking about going into media, and we'll be doing 245 00:14:45,760 --> 00:14:48,920 Speaker 1: a lot with media in the class. But also because 246 00:14:49,200 --> 00:14:50,600 Speaker 1: you know, if you if you just think back to 247 00:14:50,680 --> 00:14:52,880 Speaker 1: like what you and I were doing in the beginning 248 00:14:52,920 --> 00:14:55,440 Speaker 1: of the pandemic, it was kind of like, let's educate 249 00:14:55,520 --> 00:14:59,400 Speaker 1: people about about the six feet rule and all that stuff. 250 00:14:59,440 --> 00:15:02,160 Speaker 1: Like we thought we were educating people and now it's 251 00:15:02,240 --> 00:15:06,480 Speaker 1: kind of like we're just chronicling. You know. I don't 252 00:15:06,520 --> 00:15:09,640 Speaker 1: want to say, do we'd like something there? So can 253 00:15:09,680 --> 00:15:12,480 Speaker 1: you just talk about kind of what this period has 254 00:15:12,520 --> 00:15:15,920 Speaker 1: done to how you feel like your job is in 255 00:15:16,000 --> 00:15:19,840 Speaker 1: a way? Yeah, I mean that's a really good question, 256 00:15:19,920 --> 00:15:22,880 Speaker 1: And I asked myself, probably what am I doing on 257 00:15:22,920 --> 00:15:26,440 Speaker 1: a regular basis? I think that when I entered in 258 00:15:26,560 --> 00:15:29,720 Speaker 1: when I when I launched woke AF. But WOKAF was 259 00:15:29,840 --> 00:15:34,440 Speaker 1: launched in twenty sixteen, and it was in reaction to 260 00:15:34,480 --> 00:15:38,720 Speaker 1: Donald Trump's even being being a candidate, let alone becoming 261 00:15:38,720 --> 00:15:42,440 Speaker 1: president of the United States. And what I realized at 262 00:15:42,480 --> 00:15:45,480 Speaker 1: that time when I launched woke AF was that a 263 00:15:45,600 --> 00:15:49,160 Speaker 1: majority of the country was asleep in the in believing 264 00:15:49,280 --> 00:15:54,000 Speaker 1: that somebody like him couldn't become president of the United States. Um, 265 00:15:54,240 --> 00:15:56,960 Speaker 1: somebody who had you know, came with a heavy amount 266 00:15:57,000 --> 00:16:01,440 Speaker 1: of misogyny and racism um and said all of these 267 00:16:01,480 --> 00:16:05,480 Speaker 1: things that were totally outside of the political norm. So 268 00:16:06,440 --> 00:16:11,640 Speaker 1: when the pandemic happens, and he's still president of the 269 00:16:11,720 --> 00:16:15,920 Speaker 1: United States at this time, and we're learning in real 270 00:16:16,000 --> 00:16:18,560 Speaker 1: time what he knew, what he didn't know, the fact 271 00:16:18,560 --> 00:16:20,880 Speaker 1: that he knew that it was contagious and not just 272 00:16:20,920 --> 00:16:22,920 Speaker 1: like the flu, and didn't share it with the public 273 00:16:23,000 --> 00:16:25,240 Speaker 1: because he wanted to use it as a political tool 274 00:16:25,280 --> 00:16:28,680 Speaker 1: and weaponize it. I went from thinking about exactly what 275 00:16:28,720 --> 00:16:33,240 Speaker 1: you had said, thinking about our role as providing information 276 00:16:33,520 --> 00:16:38,400 Speaker 1: to people to keep them safe, but safety shifted not 277 00:16:38,520 --> 00:16:42,240 Speaker 1: just about keeping them safe from this virus, but keeping 278 00:16:42,240 --> 00:16:46,600 Speaker 1: them safe from the larger cancer of misinformation. Right that 279 00:16:47,120 --> 00:16:51,560 Speaker 1: you were being misguided purposefully. It wasn't an accident, it 280 00:16:51,600 --> 00:16:55,840 Speaker 1: wasn't unfortunate. It was a strategy. And so I feel 281 00:16:55,880 --> 00:16:58,120 Speaker 1: like I went you know, the role that I have 282 00:16:58,280 --> 00:17:02,160 Speaker 1: has always been to be an alarm clock. Right, Like, 283 00:17:02,480 --> 00:17:06,160 Speaker 1: you know, everyone is busy in this country. Everyone has 284 00:17:06,400 --> 00:17:11,000 Speaker 1: multiple jobs, kids, you know, livelihood, homes, you know, things 285 00:17:11,119 --> 00:17:15,000 Speaker 1: going on. But those all of those aspects of life 286 00:17:15,000 --> 00:17:18,240 Speaker 1: and livelihood go away if you don't have any freedom. 287 00:17:18,920 --> 00:17:21,080 Speaker 1: And you know, I don't know how many of your students, 288 00:17:21,800 --> 00:17:25,199 Speaker 1: you know, have traveled and have traveled into, you know, 289 00:17:25,280 --> 00:17:29,200 Speaker 1: other countries or from other countries with various forms of 290 00:17:30,160 --> 00:17:35,080 Speaker 1: government structure. But I have traveled to places with authoritarianism, 291 00:17:35,119 --> 00:17:37,879 Speaker 1: and I've traveled to places you know, um that have 292 00:17:37,960 --> 00:17:40,639 Speaker 1: climbed their way out of fascism, but still have you know, 293 00:17:40,800 --> 00:17:44,080 Speaker 1: some remnants of that. Um. There is a there is 294 00:17:44,119 --> 00:17:48,200 Speaker 1: a listlessness that the people have. There is a lack 295 00:17:48,359 --> 00:17:51,600 Speaker 1: of hope. There's a lack of hopefulness because what are 296 00:17:51,640 --> 00:17:55,359 Speaker 1: you being hopeful for? And so I find my job 297 00:17:55,480 --> 00:17:57,679 Speaker 1: now not just to be an alarm, but to be 298 00:17:57,720 --> 00:18:01,800 Speaker 1: in a siren an alarm, all the red flags, screaming 299 00:18:01,800 --> 00:18:05,119 Speaker 1: and waving my hands that you know, don't think that 300 00:18:05,160 --> 00:18:08,520 Speaker 1: what you're seeing can't happen in the United States, because 301 00:18:08,520 --> 00:18:11,240 Speaker 1: it is happening, and it's happening every day, and it's 302 00:18:11,240 --> 00:18:14,560 Speaker 1: happening a lot rapid, a lot more rapid then then 303 00:18:14,640 --> 00:18:17,159 Speaker 1: we thought that it would. I mean, it's interesting you 304 00:18:17,160 --> 00:18:20,879 Speaker 1: mentioned misinformation and disinformation because I remember we did a show, 305 00:18:21,640 --> 00:18:23,320 Speaker 1: you know, in the first month of the pandemic where 306 00:18:23,320 --> 00:18:25,720 Speaker 1: we were just explaining to people, Yeah, what is misinformation? 307 00:18:26,160 --> 00:18:28,520 Speaker 1: And everybody was like, well, that happens in Russia. But 308 00:18:28,720 --> 00:18:31,440 Speaker 1: I would I would spot that in a second hair 309 00:18:31,600 --> 00:18:34,239 Speaker 1: like nobody believed it was happening to them. But it 310 00:18:34,240 --> 00:18:36,320 Speaker 1: turns out the way it happens is it's a narrative 311 00:18:36,359 --> 00:18:37,959 Speaker 1: that makes sense to you, and then it becomes your 312 00:18:38,320 --> 00:18:41,600 Speaker 1: form of common sense in a way. I want to 313 00:18:41,600 --> 00:18:44,560 Speaker 1: say to you know, to point out something recently that 314 00:18:44,640 --> 00:18:48,639 Speaker 1: just happened. If if folks are paying attention to a 315 00:18:48,680 --> 00:18:51,200 Speaker 1: lot of the debates that are happenings as we make 316 00:18:51,280 --> 00:18:56,560 Speaker 1: the march to midterms. Representative Marjory Taylor Green out of 317 00:18:56,560 --> 00:19:00,440 Speaker 1: Georgia was in her debate with her opponent and one 318 00:19:00,480 --> 00:19:04,920 Speaker 1: of the things that she said was that, um, Democrats 319 00:19:04,960 --> 00:19:08,040 Speaker 1: are trying to kill us. You want to kill us. 320 00:19:08,080 --> 00:19:10,600 Speaker 1: That's what she said to her political opponent. And then 321 00:19:10,640 --> 00:19:12,560 Speaker 1: she said why do you why do you care? Well, 322 00:19:12,600 --> 00:19:16,399 Speaker 1: you know, why are you for being a predator and 323 00:19:16,400 --> 00:19:19,639 Speaker 1: and and and grooming children? She said all of these things. No, 324 00:19:20,000 --> 00:19:23,720 Speaker 1: the debate moderator didn't stop her. What happened then is 325 00:19:23,760 --> 00:19:26,080 Speaker 1: that it was picked up in all of these news 326 00:19:26,119 --> 00:19:29,720 Speaker 1: outlets and it's normalized because it's oh it's just Marjorie 327 00:19:29,760 --> 00:19:32,040 Speaker 1: Taylor Green saying more of what she has said, and 328 00:19:32,080 --> 00:19:36,040 Speaker 1: I'm like, but there's no disruption. There's no disruption of 329 00:19:36,080 --> 00:19:39,280 Speaker 1: the lies, the dangerous lies that are coming out of 330 00:19:39,320 --> 00:19:42,240 Speaker 1: her mouth, and you don't know who or where they're landing. 331 00:19:42,880 --> 00:19:45,920 Speaker 1: So it's it's it isn't you know? It isn't just like, oh, well, 332 00:19:45,960 --> 00:19:49,000 Speaker 1: those people over there, you know, they're you know, they're 333 00:19:49,040 --> 00:19:52,440 Speaker 1: they're they're crazy. It's like, no, they've become the mainstream. 334 00:19:52,920 --> 00:19:57,840 Speaker 1: And when crazy is mainstreamed, people become dehumanized, and then 335 00:19:57,920 --> 00:20:00,480 Speaker 1: the actions that you decide to take against the people 336 00:20:00,760 --> 00:20:03,680 Speaker 1: can be justified. And you need not look any further 337 00:20:03,800 --> 00:20:07,720 Speaker 1: than justifications for all types of oppression, violence, and torture 338 00:20:07,760 --> 00:20:10,280 Speaker 1: that have happened in this country and around the world. 339 00:20:10,880 --> 00:20:14,679 Speaker 1: I think that's really really well said. We have just 340 00:20:14,720 --> 00:20:16,119 Speaker 1: in a couple of minutes before we go to the 341 00:20:16,160 --> 00:20:18,159 Speaker 1: gap to the audiences. So if you have a question, 342 00:20:19,520 --> 00:20:21,560 Speaker 1: if you have a question, just think about coming up 343 00:20:21,600 --> 00:20:23,920 Speaker 1: to the microphone. If anybody wants to ask about politics 344 00:20:23,960 --> 00:20:25,600 Speaker 1: or media or things like that, So just go ahead 345 00:20:25,600 --> 00:20:27,840 Speaker 1: and line up right here at the microphone. I'm gonna 346 00:20:27,840 --> 00:20:32,359 Speaker 1: ask one more question now, you mentioned before about about 347 00:20:33,000 --> 00:20:35,080 Speaker 1: traveling outside the United States, and I'm kind of laughing 348 00:20:35,119 --> 00:20:38,560 Speaker 1: looking at our room because we have students from pretty 349 00:20:38,600 --> 00:20:42,879 Speaker 1: much all over the world, all over the country, many 350 00:20:43,000 --> 00:20:48,280 Speaker 1: different ideological backgrounds, political backgrounds, and what's nice is we 351 00:20:48,359 --> 00:20:53,840 Speaker 1: come together here to address that. And so there I'll 352 00:20:53,880 --> 00:20:56,960 Speaker 1: ask you about race after the students. But could you 353 00:20:57,000 --> 00:21:02,040 Speaker 1: just say a word a word about just what what 354 00:21:02,160 --> 00:21:04,680 Speaker 1: could you say to students right now, like students who 355 00:21:04,680 --> 00:21:07,399 Speaker 1: for example, might be wanting to go into the media 356 00:21:07,480 --> 00:21:10,399 Speaker 1: or might be wanting to go into the politics. What's 357 00:21:10,480 --> 00:21:12,920 Speaker 1: what's you know, what's the what's the message to this 358 00:21:12,960 --> 00:21:15,560 Speaker 1: audience of the kind of the leaders of tomorrow who 359 00:21:15,560 --> 00:21:18,439 Speaker 1: are getting going to get us out of this? You 360 00:21:18,480 --> 00:21:23,240 Speaker 1: know what I would say is if you're going into media, 361 00:21:23,520 --> 00:21:27,960 Speaker 1: I think that what is really interesting is that media 362 00:21:28,080 --> 00:21:30,879 Speaker 1: has become in a lot of ways democratized. If you 363 00:21:30,960 --> 00:21:34,560 Speaker 1: know how to utilize different social platforms, so you don't 364 00:21:34,600 --> 00:21:39,320 Speaker 1: need to necessarily be a part of a traditional news 365 00:21:39,359 --> 00:21:42,080 Speaker 1: outlet um that may have a newsroom that is not 366 00:21:42,119 --> 00:21:46,440 Speaker 1: reflective of who you are. Are not interested in diverse 367 00:21:46,560 --> 00:21:49,720 Speaker 1: and I mean diverse in all senses of diverse. What 368 00:21:49,840 --> 00:21:54,359 Speaker 1: diversifies our perspective, um of the world around us, of 369 00:21:54,359 --> 00:21:57,760 Speaker 1: our of our body politic and so what what's your 370 00:21:57,920 --> 00:21:59,840 Speaker 1: I would say to really think about what is your 371 00:22:00,000 --> 00:22:02,119 Speaker 1: point of view? You know, what do you want to 372 00:22:02,160 --> 00:22:06,320 Speaker 1: offer that is different? Um, what do you think is missing? 373 00:22:06,760 --> 00:22:09,520 Speaker 1: And then if you figure that out, then you're able 374 00:22:09,560 --> 00:22:13,320 Speaker 1: to actually create a point of view and create content 375 00:22:13,440 --> 00:22:16,520 Speaker 1: around that that will bring people in. But you kind 376 00:22:16,520 --> 00:22:19,879 Speaker 1: of have to figure out what kind of journalists do 377 00:22:19,880 --> 00:22:22,480 Speaker 1: you want to be? And don't fall into the trap 378 00:22:22,520 --> 00:22:25,719 Speaker 1: of neutrality, because I think that in the current climate 379 00:22:25,760 --> 00:22:28,320 Speaker 1: that we're in, neutrality is actually a lie. It is 380 00:22:28,359 --> 00:22:33,119 Speaker 1: a code to just accept the status quo. Um, I 381 00:22:33,160 --> 00:22:35,760 Speaker 1: don't And I also don't refer to myself as a journalist. 382 00:22:35,760 --> 00:22:37,919 Speaker 1: I went to school for politics. I just happened to 383 00:22:38,000 --> 00:22:42,480 Speaker 1: run my mouth really well, you know, but I hadn't 384 00:22:42,480 --> 00:22:45,360 Speaker 1: even go to school for media. So don't even think 385 00:22:45,400 --> 00:22:47,800 Speaker 1: that if you didn't, if you're not getting you know, 386 00:22:47,840 --> 00:22:51,000 Speaker 1: one of your you know, degrees in media or journalism, 387 00:22:51,040 --> 00:22:53,000 Speaker 1: then that means that you can't enter into the field. 388 00:22:53,240 --> 00:22:58,120 Speaker 1: I am sitting you know, evidence to the contrary. Wonderful, 389 00:22:58,160 --> 00:22:59,720 Speaker 1: All right, well, this is this has been really fun. 390 00:22:59,760 --> 00:23:02,200 Speaker 1: This is the one time a year were like, I'm 391 00:23:02,200 --> 00:23:05,159 Speaker 1: the host and you're the guest. Yes, I love it. 392 00:23:05,400 --> 00:23:08,480 Speaker 1: Usually you're interviewing me and I'm like, damn, her job's 393 00:23:08,480 --> 00:23:13,399 Speaker 1: harder than it looks. So anyway, all right, thank you, 394 00:23:13,440 --> 00:23:15,359 Speaker 1: thank you, thank you, Danielle, thank you so much for 395 00:23:15,760 --> 00:23:18,000 Speaker 1: joining us, and we will talk next week at this 396 00:23:18,160 --> 00:23:21,480 Speaker 1: very same time earlier. Thank you, thank you so much. 397 00:23:26,880 --> 00:23:29,359 Speaker 1: That is it for me today, dear friends on Woke 398 00:23:29,400 --> 00:23:32,680 Speaker 1: app as always, power to the people and to all 399 00:23:32,960 --> 00:23:36,520 Speaker 1: the people, power, get woke and stay woke as fuck.