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Speaker 1: You're listening to I Choose Me with Jenny Garth. Hi, everyone,

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Speaker 1: welcome to I Choose Me. This podcast is all about

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Speaker 1: the choices we make and where they lead us. My

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Speaker 1: guest today is a two time Emmy Award winning television

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Speaker 1: host and executive producer of her syndicated talk show that

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Speaker 1: is now in its sixth season Wooo. She's a veteran

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Speaker 1: journalist and best selling author, and she's got a new

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Speaker 1: book out that I just love the message of. I

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Speaker 1: can't wait to talk about it. Please welcome Tameron Hall

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Speaker 1: to the podcast.

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Speaker 2: Hi, so good to see you.

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Speaker 1: It's so good to see you. Oh my gosh. I

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Speaker 1: had the best time on your show.

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Speaker 2: It was like a week ago.

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Speaker 1: Oh my gosh. Thank you so much for dedicating a

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Speaker 1: whole episode to the idea of I Choose Me.

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Speaker 2: What. I was so tickled, tickled love you know what,

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Speaker 2: because I think it's such a great. First of all,

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Speaker 2: I didn't know the exact episode. Kudos to my team

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Speaker 2: for finding the episode, but I think it is. It

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Speaker 2: transcends age race, It transcends where you are in your

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Speaker 2: life because at some point that question of choosing me

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Speaker 2: and what does that feel like? I just thought it

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Speaker 2: was so perfect, So thank you. It was. It was wonderful.

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Speaker 2: Thank you for mine. You get a producer's credit, Oh,

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Speaker 2: thank you so much.

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Speaker 1: I'll take it. But since we talked so much about

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Speaker 1: me last time on your show, today, I choose to

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Speaker 1: talk about you, Tameron Hall, than thank you. Can you

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Speaker 1: take me back to the beginning. I want to know

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Speaker 1: what you were like when you were a little girl,

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Speaker 1: and what kind of home you grew up in. These

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Speaker 1: are the things that I'm curious about.

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Speaker 2: Oh well, you know, I think my mother would describe

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Speaker 2: me as a very interesting child, especially because he was

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Speaker 2: a single, nineteen year old mother of one. My mom

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Speaker 2: was in college when she got pregnant, and she's from

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Speaker 2: a very very small town called Luling, Texas. It's a

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Speaker 2: hill country right outside of Austin. We got the best

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Speaker 2: rivers and the best barbecue were the best test and

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Speaker 2: she came home, I would imagine, and we had not

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Speaker 2: talked a lot about it, but I'm sure that you know,

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Speaker 2: you're nineteen and you come home and you're pregnant. There's

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Speaker 2: a lot of stigma attached to that. There's a lot

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Speaker 2: of shame. My mother's mother passed away when she was

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Speaker 2: ten and so my mom was ten years all the time.

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Speaker 2: So her primary parent was her father, like this giant

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Speaker 2: of a person in our lives, but was shouldering a lot,

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Speaker 2: you know, raising any little girl by himself and her sisters.

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Speaker 2: And you know, she comes home from college and she's pregnant,

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Speaker 2: and the relationship with my biological father was not one

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Speaker 2: that was a stable one for her. And my grandfather,

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Speaker 2: who's a very was a very strong person, said you

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Speaker 2: know what, we're gonna raise her here and we're gonna,

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Speaker 2: you know, give her the best life possible and was

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Speaker 2: very supportive. I was the only child born in the

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Speaker 2: hospital in the entire town that day. Oh, I know.

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Speaker 2: My mother talks about the friends of hers who they

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Speaker 2: all kind of lined up to go to see. Like

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Speaker 2: I make the joke, and it's true. My mother's name

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Speaker 2: happens to be Mary. They did not name me Jesus

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Speaker 2: for their arrival, had all the three wise men's coming,

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Speaker 2: and my mom talks about everyone showing up uh to

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Speaker 2: see me as a kid. So I uh was born

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Speaker 2: in this circumstance that could have been one of great

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Speaker 2: shame for her, and I'm sure she debated it, but

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Speaker 2: it turned into one where instantly she had this great

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Speaker 2: support system of people around her, including her father, and

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Speaker 2: I was the beneficiary of that. And at some point

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Speaker 2: my mother decided that she wanted something bigger than this

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Speaker 2: small town life that she was living. And it wasn't

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Speaker 2: a negative, but like so many of us choosing themselves,

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Speaker 2: she chose herself. And by choosing herself, she gave me

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Speaker 2: the best opportunity she felt, which was leaving our small town.

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Speaker 2: And so I grew up with my mom and a

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Speaker 2: great group of aunts and uncles. You know, my mother

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Speaker 2: would work a couple of jobs because she went back

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Speaker 2: to school to get her degree, and she work a

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Speaker 2: couple of jobs to support me, and this aunt would

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Speaker 2: pick me up on Wednesdays, this uncle would take us fishing,

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Speaker 2: and you know, so it.

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Speaker 1: Was just this It's really cool.

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Speaker 2: It was very, very very cool childhood. In the process,

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Speaker 2: my mother says that she noticed that, you know, I

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Speaker 2: was out going around my family members, but very different

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Speaker 2: out in the world. I was a lot shyer kid.

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Speaker 2: I was an only child, and so all of the

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Speaker 2: kids in my neighborhood had siblings, so I was a target.

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Speaker 2: You know, just how kids work, right, you know, you're

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Speaker 2: gonna they're gonna find your weakness. And my weakness was

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Speaker 2: I was the only child, and so now I'm up

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Speaker 2: against big groups of siblings and you know, and all

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Speaker 2: these things. And so my mom got me in sports.

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Speaker 2: I ran track, you know. I I played volleyball. I

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Speaker 2: did all these things as my mom was trying to

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Speaker 2: build my confidence. I played the clarinet. You know you

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Speaker 2: name it.

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Speaker 1: She's hey, hey, I played the clarinet.

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Speaker 2: What chair were you? I was chair one man?

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Speaker 1: Hello, right here.

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Speaker 2: It was okay, let's stay on the road, Cardigian, let

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Speaker 2: me get Carnigie.

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Speaker 1: My favorite part of playing the clarinet was the read.

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Speaker 1: You had to soak the read. I thought I was

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Speaker 1: so cool soak the read.

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Speaker 2: Oh yeah, that's smell. So that's the best. My mom

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Speaker 2: was always putting me in things for the very thing

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Speaker 2: that just happened, Like putting me in music was a

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Speaker 2: connecting force. So the reason and that my mom put

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Speaker 2: me in band was for the same reason. We just connected.

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Speaker 2: Because music is a connecting thing, you know, it brings

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Speaker 2: me together. So she thought, I guess it'd make me

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Speaker 2: a popular kid or get some friends. She was right, Well,

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Speaker 2: she was right I'm friends with you. Now we're going

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Speaker 2: to go to my mom. But she kept trying to

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Speaker 2: bring this personality out that I showed with my cousins,

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Speaker 2: and I was always really good around adults. Was in

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Speaker 2: fact my nickname was not necessarily because I was very precocious.

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Speaker 2: You know, my cousins. When there was a dispute, I

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Speaker 2: was like the lawyer. I'm like, hey, look at let's

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Speaker 2: hear the side. My grandfather had a soft spot for

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Speaker 2: me because of what happened with my mom, and so

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Speaker 2: if there was something they wanted, they'd like, send me in.

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Speaker 2: I'm like the I'm the un I'm going in making

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Speaker 2: deals for them. They want candy, you know what I'm doing.

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Speaker 2: Very confident around adults, very very safe around my families.

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Speaker 2: But in the world behaviorally, I showed up different, and

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Speaker 2: so my mother really made sure that I had this

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Speaker 2: community of support. She really wanted to always make sure

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Speaker 2: that I could show up as this confident kid, and

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Speaker 2: that's really the start of what I do now for

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Speaker 2: a living. We would do little talent shows I couldn't sing,

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Speaker 2: I couldn't dance, and birthday parties. You know, they do

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Speaker 2: like this little in the South, they have talent shows.

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Speaker 2: Every birthday has a talent show. Like here in New York,

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Speaker 2: every birthday ends with a pizza, you know. When I'm

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Speaker 2: in the South, we have these big birthday parties in

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Speaker 2: the backyard or at a park or at a zoo,

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Speaker 2: and then inevitably someone's like, let's do a talent show.

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Speaker 2: I couldn't sing a dance, but I was a talker,

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Speaker 2: and so I would be like the MC you know,

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Speaker 2: I'd get up and say, next up, it's Jenny and

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Speaker 2: the Jeanettes hit it. You know, Oh my gosh, person

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Speaker 2: in the middle facilitating all of the talent that was

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Speaker 2: around me again, hint, hint, kind of what I do now.

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Speaker 2: And that was, you know, the road and I started

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Speaker 2: out on and I was very fortunate that around the

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Speaker 2: age of nine, my mother fell in love with the

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Speaker 2: person who was the data got meant for me to

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Speaker 2: have my stepfather and who I referred to as my father.

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Speaker 2: And he is that and was that until the day

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Speaker 2: he left this planet. And he too, going back to

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Speaker 2: the mantra of choosing you, and I was, I don't know,

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Speaker 2: messing up in high school. And I remember because in

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Speaker 2: middle school and not doing what I was supposed to.

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Speaker 2: And he pointed to the TV and he said, if

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Speaker 2: you get your grades it was great, that could be you.

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Speaker 2: And he pointed at this woman. She was anchoring the news.

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Speaker 2: Her name was Iola Johnson and she was the first

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Speaker 2: black woman to anchor the news in Dallas for worth

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Speaker 2: and he said, if you get your grades up, that

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Speaker 2: could be you. And I look up and I see

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Speaker 2: this woman and I'm like, what is this you're speaking of?

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Speaker 2: And I love a good challenge. And I then started

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Speaker 2: getting into writing classes. I got in, like there's a

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Speaker 2: group called the Jas and they did this scholarship thing,

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Speaker 2: and I, you know, started writing and applying and just

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Speaker 2: kind of doing these things to prove that woman on

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Speaker 2: the TV could be me. Wow.

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Speaker 1: So it seems like that sort of sparked that interest

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Speaker 1: in you of storytelling.

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Speaker 2: Yeah. Absolutely, I think it was the storytelling and the

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Speaker 2: idea that someone thought enough of me to issue this challenge.

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Speaker 2: I think sometimes when people issue a challenge, particularly to

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Speaker 2: our children, it can be seen as a negative. But

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Speaker 2: I think that people issue a challenge to you because

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Speaker 2: they believe you can do it, and they want you

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Speaker 2: to say sounds something big or something that you can accomplish.

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Speaker 2: That's why you know my son right now, he's five

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Speaker 2: and we have this badge system my husband found on Amazon,

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Speaker 2: and it's so complicated. I let them deal with it.

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Speaker 2: But it's like, if you do this, you get the badge,

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Speaker 2: and then if you do this, give back, and then

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Speaker 2: if you get five badges, you get a rivet and

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Speaker 2: if you get a ribn you can catch. I'm like, oh,

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Speaker 2: my head's spinning, but you just do it. I'm like, dude,

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Speaker 2: she's give them pizza party. But it works because my

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Speaker 2: son's like the other day, he walks like, because Dad,

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Speaker 2: I'm gonna get that badge today, and I'm like, oh

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Speaker 2: my god, okay, so cute. But yeah, he cashes in

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Speaker 2: his badges and so often the cash in is a ribbon,

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Speaker 2: and then he takes the ribbon and then he goes

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Speaker 2: to he likes bowling, and so we're taken bowling or

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Speaker 2: pizza party, but boler, oh, this is the bowler, which

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Speaker 2: I was like, okay, we'll figure that one out. But

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Speaker 2: you know, it's again that idea of giving someone a

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Speaker 2: goal and saying without saying I think you are capable

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Speaker 2: and of reaching that, and that's what he did I.

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Speaker 1: Mean, that's the exact opposite of what a lot of

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Speaker 1: people here, which is you could never beat that right.

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Speaker 2: And you know, and that's the thing. When I wrote

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Speaker 2: my children's book, Harlem Honey, you know, we have adjusted,

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Speaker 2: For example, the way we talked to kids about crying. Right,

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Speaker 2: there was a time people would say, big boys don't cry,

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Speaker 2: or you know, you want to get a right away

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Speaker 2: those tears in some of the language that we all

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Speaker 2: grew up hearing. Right, you say to a kid that's crying,

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Speaker 2: are your tears? There's nothing wrong. Big kids don't cry,

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Speaker 2: Big boys cry. And when I wrote Harlem Honey, it

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Speaker 2: was centered around fear. Right, how do we change the

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Speaker 2: way we talk about fear? We all experience it, we

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Speaker 2: all deal with it different levels, of course, but it's

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Speaker 2: an emotion that is not one that should be tied

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Speaker 2: to shame. And when I was creating this book, much

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Speaker 2: to your point about how we position things now, right,

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Speaker 2: my father positioned this challenge in this positive way that

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Speaker 2: inspired positivity. It's the same with emotions. You know, when

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Speaker 2: I had my son, and I'm sure you've experienced this.

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Speaker 2: Now we're obsessed over like ABC's I Love, I got

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Speaker 2: all the books of the ABC's and the color of shape.

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Speaker 2: And then very early on someone said, you know, social

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Speaker 2: emotional development is more important at this age how to count?

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Speaker 2: And I'm like, what, because I went to pre K

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Speaker 2: and I vividly to this stage and I'm fifty four.

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Speaker 2: I remember the blow up let in my Catholic school kindergarten.

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Speaker 2: I guess it was. There was mister M with a

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Speaker 2: munching mouth. I'll never forget that's him. Oh yeah, fifteen

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Speaker 2: years later, I remember mister M with a munching mouth.

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Speaker 2: And that was the focus. Right, this is nineteen seventy

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Speaker 2: at the time, seventy five, and focus is getting you,

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Speaker 2: you know, reading and academics and the testing that was

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Speaker 2: such a big part of our culture and still is.

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Speaker 2: But it was everything determines everything about you. And then

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Speaker 2: suddenly our eyes awaken through probably some painful situations that

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Speaker 2: we all witnessed and watched over society where kids are

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Speaker 2: bottling themselves or are pushing themselves down and bottling up

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Speaker 2: emotions and not being able to express how you feel

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Speaker 2: is detrimental to your mental health, it's detrimental to the

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Speaker 2: adult you have the capacity to become. And so for me.

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Speaker 2: That's been such a big part of my focus and

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Speaker 2: why I said, you know what, how do we talk

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Speaker 2: about as my father so wonderfully learned to talk about

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Speaker 2: goals with me.

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Speaker 1: I want to talk about your children's book more because

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Speaker 1: I read it and it's really cute and it gave

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Speaker 1: me all just good feelings. So I commend you for it.

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Speaker 1: But I want to go off of what you were

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Speaker 1: just talking about about how your father helped you. I

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Speaker 1: know you've talked about this before. You suffered a grave

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Speaker 1: tragedy in your life and it's just hard to think

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Speaker 1: of getting past that.

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Speaker 2: Yeah, no, I listen and thank you for asking about it.

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Speaker 2: By the way, and just as we talked about on

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Speaker 2: my show, Challenging Things, I was the first to tell you.

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Speaker 2: I said, I don't technically like talking about x's because

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Speaker 2: you're in your future. And I liken it too. When

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Speaker 2: you go to dinner someone suddenly start your current person

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Speaker 2: is there and they're like, oh, did you ever run

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Speaker 2: in a Jimmy? It's like what you know? And so

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Speaker 2: we were on the show. You were so gracious and

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Speaker 2: so wonderful in the way you talked about the evolution

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Speaker 2: of relationships and it's part in your life. As with

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Speaker 2: this conversation we are having, I feel so safe and

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Speaker 2: cared for by you, and I want to thank you

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Speaker 2: for that, because for people who were listening, what we're

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Speaker 2: talking about is the death of my sister. As I mentioned,

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Speaker 2: my stepfather became the dad I was meant to have,

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Speaker 2: and he had two children. My mother had two children,

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Speaker 2: and we really became like a Black Brady bunch and

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Speaker 2: was lended family. And because he was very adamant about

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Speaker 2: not seeing us as half or step or we were

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Speaker 2: a family. This is my sister and my sister, which

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Speaker 2: I'd always longed to have, right, I wanted a sister

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Speaker 2: just because I visualize us, like you know, doing girl stuff,

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Speaker 2: doing her hair and everything. And when I met her,

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Speaker 2: she was like the most beautiful and chic and just

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Speaker 2: seemed worldly, right, just you know, just was awesome, Like

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Speaker 2: she just had the right outfits on it. I remember

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Speaker 2: she was the first person she had a bottle of

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Speaker 2: perfume and it was a necklace and I just I know,

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Speaker 2: she was just like chic. At the same time, she

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Speaker 2: was a person who I would hear my father say, God,

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Speaker 2: you are better than this guy, or you should not

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Speaker 2: be in this relationship with this person. And I would

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Speaker 2: hear these conversations, was in my teen years, but it

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Speaker 2: was always this push pull with them, and that pushful

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Speaker 2: often surrounded the people she was keeping company with romantically,

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Speaker 2: and she would move in with us and move out,

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Speaker 2: then move out, and was always this tumult, you know,

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Speaker 2: around her relationships. And as we got old her, you know,

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Speaker 2: she would say, you know, Dad doesn't understand, and you know,

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Speaker 2: I'd love this person or that. And I was old

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Speaker 2: enough by then high school to recognize, like, these guys

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Speaker 2: are coming over and got these are not. I'm eighteen

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Speaker 2: by now I'm dating, and I can right on here.

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Speaker 2: It's not just Dad being dad, right, I could tell.

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Speaker 2: And as the years would pass, she'd come back into

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Speaker 2: our lives and disappear out of our lives. And at

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Speaker 2: some point she starts to get stable in her life

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Speaker 2: and she is in a relationship with someone and he

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Speaker 2: starts to come by our home, and you know, things

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Speaker 2: start to feel good finally in her life. You know,

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Speaker 2: she's bought a house and things are going great, and

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Speaker 2: I invited her to come to see me in Chicago.

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Speaker 2: By then, I'll figure I'm the big sister who is

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Speaker 2: a big deal. Now I'm the big little sister. I'm

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Speaker 2: an anchor in Chicago. Come and see me, you know.

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Speaker 2: I got a townhouse downtown near Horp. Yes. She comes

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Speaker 2: with me, and she brings the person she was seeing

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Speaker 2: in her life at the time. And I don't know

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Speaker 2: Jenny what day it was of their visit, but I'm

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Speaker 2: in my townhouse and I hear this, like just a

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Speaker 2: rumble of just sound and energy and something crashing. Now,

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Speaker 2: what's going on? And I run down to my bottom level,

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Speaker 2: which was a guest bedroom, and there was a table

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Speaker 2: that was shattered, and she was standing there and she's

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Speaker 2: kind of like clearly dazed. And he's standing there and

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Speaker 2: I know there was an altercation and I can see it,

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Speaker 2: and I instantly started yelling at him, like what get

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Speaker 2: out of my house, and I'm trying to grab the phone.

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Speaker 2: I had a phone downstairs, and there was a like

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Speaker 2: a my garage was nearby, so there was a broom

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Speaker 2: handle thing that was there, and I grabbed this room

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Speaker 2: and I'm like get out, and I'm like not hitting,

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Speaker 2: but I'm threatening, you know, to get out because I

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Speaker 2: get out right now. And I kick them out of

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Speaker 2: our house, my house. I call my d instantly, I

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Speaker 2: just like, lock the doors, call the police. And I

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Speaker 2: go to call the police, and I said, oh, I can't.

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Speaker 2: I'm tammern hall. The police are going to come to

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Speaker 2: my house and they're going to know that it be

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Speaker 2: all over the news. I's going to be all over

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Speaker 2: the news and what I can't So I don't call

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Speaker 2: the police. I you know, bat patch her, you know,

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Speaker 2: get her ice, and we clean up and we don't

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Speaker 2: really I don't really ask what happens because I don't

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Speaker 2: need to know because I can see. And then we

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Speaker 2: go to bed. The next morning, I come downstairs, he's

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Speaker 2: in my house. He's back in the house, and I'm

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Speaker 2: like what. And I said to her, what are you

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Speaker 2: thinking that I kick them both out? She's visiting. They're visiting,

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Speaker 2: and I said, get out. I'm going I remember, I

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Speaker 2: said there was a spa like I'm going and get

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Speaker 2: and when I come back, you get to get out

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Speaker 2: of my house. This whole thing. Call my dad. She's

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Speaker 2: so selfish, she doesn't why you know, blah blah blah

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Speaker 2: blah blah. I'm going off about it. And my Dad's like, well,

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Speaker 2: you know, she'll figure it out. And I'm like, Dad,

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Speaker 2: she's not going to figure out. Because I was hurt.

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Speaker 2: I'm like, what what are you thinking? And I was

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Speaker 2: also mad at her for not believing more in herself.

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Speaker 2: What I'm thinking, like, yeah, it's so hard, so amazing.

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Speaker 2: What is wrong with you? You know? This is me

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Speaker 2: at that time. We don't talk for a couple of months.

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Speaker 2: The holidays rolls around Thanksgiving and my father said, you know,

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Speaker 2: listen enough of this. You know we're not figured out.

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Speaker 2: So I called her and she was getting her nails done,

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Speaker 2: much like us with the clarinet. It was her common thread.

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Speaker 2: She's like, hey, manicure and I was like okay, and

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00:19:50,320 --> 00:19:52,720
Speaker 2: we just start talking. And then we come home for

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Speaker 2: the holidays and she's still with this person and he's

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Speaker 2: there and I don't say anything to him. Really, he

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Speaker 2: hadn't say anything to me. We go on about our way.

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Speaker 2: Fast forward, not very long from that time, my mother

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Speaker 2: calls me on a Sunday and she's like just crying

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Speaker 2: and wailing and she said, Ranata is dead. And I'm

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Speaker 2: like what and she said, call your father, and I'm

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Speaker 2: my mom, pull over. I call my dad and my

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Speaker 2: dad always said that, you know, from his point of view,

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Speaker 2: he always called me his kid of right, like he

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Speaker 2: always says, of all my siblings, I was going to

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Speaker 2: try to be the level headed one, he said to me,

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Speaker 2: very calmly, because my dad was in the military and

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Speaker 2: he's got two purple hearts and he's seen it all.

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Speaker 2: And he said, baby, call and see what's going on.

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Speaker 2: What happened there? I said, okay, And I called my

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Speaker 2: sister's house and the person was there and he said,

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Speaker 2: the police are there. And I said, the police are there.

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Speaker 2: He said, she was found in her pool, face down

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Speaker 2: and they don't know what happened. And I think, you know,

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00:21:04,520 --> 00:21:07,159
Speaker 2: she was drinking maybe and she did you know all this,

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Speaker 2: you know, had a local news friend. And I called

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Speaker 2: a friend and I said, what's going on and he said, well,

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Speaker 2: the police are there and they believe it's not an accident,

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Speaker 2: and so I was like, okay, And you know, we

386
00:21:22,119 --> 00:21:28,040
Speaker 2: started the process and the investigators at the time told

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Speaker 2: us that that they did not have enough evidence to

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Speaker 2: charge someone or got to get the DA to charge someone,

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Speaker 2: but they believed that strongly that the individual who was

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Speaker 2: in the home was the person responsible. She had blunt

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00:21:44,200 --> 00:21:46,960
Speaker 2: forced impact to the back of her head, and there

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Speaker 2: were other signs there that this was not an accident.

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Speaker 2: Her dog, who she affects a mini me because she

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Speaker 2: had this like blonde hair and her dog was kind

395
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Speaker 2: of blonde, was there, and you know, some of the

396
00:22:00,640 --> 00:22:03,040
Speaker 2: details I you know, don't need to get into, but

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00:22:03,119 --> 00:22:09,000
Speaker 2: it was a violent and so yeah, we proceeded on

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Speaker 2: and in the process I never talked about it Jenny ever.

399
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Speaker 2: My family. We kind of just you know, forbid him

400
00:22:18,119 --> 00:22:22,080
Speaker 2: from having contact with my family. We kind of moved forward.

401
00:22:22,359 --> 00:22:27,879
Speaker 2: We laid my sister to rest, and then I'm in

402
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Speaker 2: New York. It's two thousand and eight and I was

403
00:22:30,560 --> 00:22:34,000
Speaker 2: invited to speak at an event, a random event. I'd

404
00:22:34,040 --> 00:22:35,720
Speaker 2: just gotten here and I was at the Today Show

405
00:22:35,840 --> 00:22:39,200
Speaker 2: and at the time, they will invite you to host things,

406
00:22:39,240 --> 00:22:41,080
Speaker 2: you know, people were like, oh, Jenny, can you host this?

407
00:22:41,359 --> 00:22:43,760
Speaker 2: You know, I got an invitation. I host an organization

408
00:22:44,480 --> 00:22:49,320
Speaker 2: that helps young people understand how to love healthy, and

409
00:22:49,440 --> 00:22:51,920
Speaker 2: then I shared my sister's story and that that was

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Speaker 2: the start of me becoming an advocate for survivors of

411
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Speaker 2: domestic violence and speaking more about from the lands of

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Speaker 2: a family member of how to support without judgment because

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Speaker 2: at the time I judged, and now I have the

414
00:23:06,560 --> 00:23:09,720
Speaker 2: tools and the understanding that I try to offer to

415
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Speaker 2: other people through your tragedy.

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Speaker 1: You're helping other people. That's beautiful. I just how do

417
00:23:14,920 --> 00:23:19,320
Speaker 1: you find closure when there is none? Because that's her

418
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Speaker 1: case was never solved, you know.

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Speaker 2: For me, I think, well, my father hassoke in the

420
00:23:25,560 --> 00:23:31,200
Speaker 2: heart of for so long trying to help her. My

421
00:23:31,359 --> 00:23:34,520
Speaker 2: sister battled substance abuse in her past. She was not

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Speaker 2: in that state when she was killed, but her younger years.

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Speaker 2: So we always worried about, you know, this notion that

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Speaker 2: people will blame a victim, and I think that's also

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00:23:44,560 --> 00:23:48,359
Speaker 2: part of why we stayed silent. Nobody deserves that fate,

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00:23:48,480 --> 00:23:50,680
Speaker 2: and certainly no one deserves as a victim to have

427
00:23:50,920 --> 00:23:55,040
Speaker 2: everything about you dragged into a space of judgment when

428
00:23:55,080 --> 00:23:57,520
Speaker 2: you are not there to defend yourself. So I think

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Speaker 2: for us, because the investigators were so clear and we

430
00:24:02,080 --> 00:24:07,320
Speaker 2: understood what happened, I think our view of justice changed.

431
00:24:07,840 --> 00:24:10,680
Speaker 2: I think what we saw was a just thing for

432
00:24:10,920 --> 00:24:15,119
Speaker 2: us was to help other people, you know, hunting someone

433
00:24:15,280 --> 00:24:17,520
Speaker 2: down or I've never even done a show on it.

434
00:24:17,600 --> 00:24:19,240
Speaker 2: To be honest with you, because it's just not that space.

435
00:24:19,240 --> 00:24:23,399
Speaker 2: We've done shows on domestic violence and my sister's youngest

436
00:24:23,440 --> 00:24:27,080
Speaker 2: son came on the show, because we are committed to

437
00:24:27,440 --> 00:24:32,320
Speaker 2: helping families, but we've never approached it from this lens

438
00:24:32,440 --> 00:24:35,600
Speaker 2: of Okay, this is a who done it because from

439
00:24:37,520 --> 00:24:40,320
Speaker 2: the point of view of the investigators, they felt they

440
00:24:40,400 --> 00:24:42,119
Speaker 2: knew and that was enough for us.

441
00:24:43,200 --> 00:24:46,159
Speaker 1: Is that when you started your interest in writing the

442
00:24:46,240 --> 00:24:48,760
Speaker 1: novels that you've written the crime novels?

443
00:24:49,000 --> 00:24:51,200
Speaker 2: Oh? Yeah, you know, because I was a journalist for

444
00:24:51,320 --> 00:24:54,760
Speaker 2: thirty years, and yes you are, Oh gosh. The first

445
00:24:54,840 --> 00:24:57,760
Speaker 2: part of my career was I was a reporter on

446
00:24:57,840 --> 00:25:03,359
Speaker 2: the street, I mean with Brian College Day, Chicago, Philadelphia, Dallas,

447
00:25:03,480 --> 00:25:07,959
Speaker 2: Fort Worth. The novel that I wrote, the Jordan Manning series,

448
00:25:08,520 --> 00:25:11,680
Speaker 2: honestly was inspired by my years of being a crime reporter,

449
00:25:12,080 --> 00:25:16,879
Speaker 2: not related to my personal family search situation. It was

450
00:25:17,000 --> 00:25:19,399
Speaker 2: just I felt like people didn't really know what happens

451
00:25:19,440 --> 00:25:21,680
Speaker 2: when you're a crime reporter. And then I thought I

452
00:25:21,760 --> 00:25:24,080
Speaker 2: wanted her to be this colorful character. I grew up

453
00:25:24,240 --> 00:25:26,920
Speaker 2: loving Nancy Drew novels. That was my whole bed. It

454
00:25:27,040 --> 00:25:28,879
Speaker 2: was like it was if you didn't find oriole cookies.

455
00:25:28,920 --> 00:25:33,399
Speaker 2: You found Nancy the Future, and so I thought it

456
00:25:33,400 --> 00:25:36,480
Speaker 2: would be fun to have this female protagonist that was

457
00:25:36,520 --> 00:25:40,160
Speaker 2: a crime solving journalist. And I thought that it would

458
00:25:40,400 --> 00:25:43,280
Speaker 2: you know, I wanted a little mix of sex in

459
00:25:43,359 --> 00:25:45,560
Speaker 2: the city and waiting to extale. I just wanted her

460
00:25:45,600 --> 00:25:49,800
Speaker 2: to be this fun but intense person that you want

461
00:25:49,880 --> 00:25:52,480
Speaker 2: on your side, like a blood howling, right, And so

462
00:25:52,640 --> 00:25:55,400
Speaker 2: that came and I wrote those Jenny in the Pandemic.

463
00:25:55,520 --> 00:25:58,000
Speaker 2: By the you know, the second or third time, I

464
00:25:58,119 --> 00:26:01,680
Speaker 2: was going to just leave my h for not breaking

465
00:26:01,720 --> 00:26:04,200
Speaker 2: down the Amazon boxes. You know, we're all dug in

466
00:26:04,320 --> 00:26:06,840
Speaker 2: and I'm like, okay, buddy, one more Amazon box and

467
00:26:06,880 --> 00:26:10,760
Speaker 2: not opening. You're out of here. Let me, harness, listen

468
00:26:10,920 --> 00:26:14,159
Speaker 2: to something more positive. So I started to write the

469
00:26:14,280 --> 00:26:17,000
Speaker 2: Jordan Manning crime series. I was I fell asleep watching

470
00:26:17,240 --> 00:26:18,760
Speaker 2: ESPN or he fell asleep and the next thing, and

471
00:26:18,760 --> 00:26:21,960
Speaker 2: I was like, Michael Jordan Peigon Manny. Her name Jordan Manning.

472
00:26:22,040 --> 00:26:24,119
Speaker 2: There it is, you know, And so I love that.

473
00:26:24,640 --> 00:26:27,720
Speaker 2: I would go out on this little deck that we

474
00:26:27,920 --> 00:26:32,760
Speaker 2: have in sag harber and Online Island and I just

475
00:26:32,880 --> 00:26:35,080
Speaker 2: write and I get up with my coffee. I felt

476
00:26:35,160 --> 00:26:38,000
Speaker 2: very Stephen King it's like old and I had my

477
00:26:38,119 --> 00:26:43,640
Speaker 2: little writer's costume and my coffee and evergrease. Meanwhile, because

478
00:26:43,640 --> 00:26:46,000
Speaker 2: we couldn't do anything else, we were stuck. And so

479
00:26:46,080 --> 00:26:48,960
Speaker 2: I wrote that series and then my cookbook. My dad

480
00:26:49,280 --> 00:26:52,560
Speaker 2: loved to cook, my grandfather loved to cook, and I

481
00:26:52,720 --> 00:26:55,000
Speaker 2: happened to be happy to be best friends with a

482
00:26:55,119 --> 00:26:58,720
Speaker 2: James Beard Award winning culinary producer who's a recipe writer.

483
00:26:59,240 --> 00:27:01,240
Speaker 2: And so I know, right, I was like, did I

484
00:27:01,359 --> 00:27:05,920
Speaker 2: pick you? Really? You know? And we became best of friends.

485
00:27:05,960 --> 00:27:10,320
Speaker 2: We're sisters and so proud of our book because that

486
00:27:10,520 --> 00:27:14,600
Speaker 2: cookbook again, it's it's seventy two phenomenal recipes and she's

487
00:27:14,680 --> 00:27:17,399
Speaker 2: the best at recipe writing in the business. But we

488
00:27:18,560 --> 00:27:20,520
Speaker 2: when the publishers looked at the marketplace, we were the

489
00:27:20,640 --> 00:27:22,840
Speaker 2: only cookbook with a white woman and a black woman,

490
00:27:23,600 --> 00:27:26,680
Speaker 2: and the only cookbook with a straight woman or identified

491
00:27:26,720 --> 00:27:29,960
Speaker 2: straight in LGBTQ. And I thought, wow, going back to

492
00:27:30,000 --> 00:27:32,879
Speaker 2: our clarinet story, you know, music is a common thread.

493
00:27:33,200 --> 00:27:35,639
Speaker 2: Food is a common thread. And that was such an

494
00:27:35,760 --> 00:27:39,120
Speaker 2: enjoyable and fun project to do with lish styling. She's

495
00:27:39,200 --> 00:27:41,960
Speaker 2: from Wisconsin, I'm from Texas, and we would joke that

496
00:27:42,119 --> 00:27:43,840
Speaker 2: even now you see the cover of our book with

497
00:27:44,000 --> 00:27:47,879
Speaker 2: the same haircut. So all things really just like what

498
00:27:48,280 --> 00:27:50,679
Speaker 2: you know, like your podcasts and the things you've created.

499
00:27:50,800 --> 00:27:54,600
Speaker 2: We are lucky to have lived long enough to have

500
00:27:54,880 --> 00:27:59,160
Speaker 2: stories and lived long enough to be able to understand

501
00:27:59,240 --> 00:28:03,280
Speaker 2: them and why they are why it's good to share.

502
00:28:03,080 --> 00:28:06,399
Speaker 1: Them, right, Sharing something that that is so important to

503
00:28:06,560 --> 00:28:08,760
Speaker 1: you and you're so passionate about, it's such a no

504
00:28:08,880 --> 00:28:18,800
Speaker 1: brainer to share. So from the mystery novels to the

505
00:28:18,880 --> 00:28:23,720
Speaker 1: cookbook and now a children's book, right, I know you guys,

506
00:28:23,800 --> 00:28:26,679
Speaker 1: you have to pick up this book. It's called Harlem Honey,

507
00:28:27,119 --> 00:28:31,280
Speaker 1: The Adventures of a Curious Kid, and your son is

508
00:28:31,359 --> 00:28:32,400
Speaker 1: the star of the book.

509
00:28:32,840 --> 00:28:36,119
Speaker 2: Yeah, well, you know he's inspired. This little boy happens

510
00:28:36,160 --> 00:28:38,840
Speaker 2: to be named Moses as my son. He's in the

511
00:28:38,960 --> 00:28:42,840
Speaker 2: first grade, and he's just moved from Texas to New York,

512
00:28:43,040 --> 00:28:48,080
Speaker 2: specifically Harlem, and I really wanted to talk about, you know,

513
00:28:48,320 --> 00:28:51,400
Speaker 2: this idea of new places and new faces. I've said,

514
00:28:51,400 --> 00:28:54,240
Speaker 2: when I wrote the Jordan Manning series, it was during

515
00:28:54,280 --> 00:28:56,960
Speaker 2: the pandemic. You know, our lives all shut down. My

516
00:28:57,080 --> 00:29:00,080
Speaker 2: son wasn't one years old yet. Honestly, Jenny, I I

517
00:29:00,120 --> 00:29:02,880
Speaker 2: had my I got pregnant at forty eight. I have

518
00:29:03,160 --> 00:29:06,320
Speaker 2: hosted morning shows for thirty years. I've probably interviewed every

519
00:29:07,040 --> 00:29:10,520
Speaker 2: childbook author on how to raise a kid. But you know,

520
00:29:10,760 --> 00:29:12,200
Speaker 2: until you're on the team, you don't know how to

521
00:29:12,240 --> 00:29:14,840
Speaker 2: play the sport. It's like, so now I'm on the

522
00:29:14,920 --> 00:29:18,000
Speaker 2: team and it's a global pandemic. I didn't even know that.

523
00:29:18,240 --> 00:29:22,520
Speaker 2: You take them off formula to milk if that's your

524
00:29:22,640 --> 00:29:26,000
Speaker 2: choice or whatever. They go. It ends after I'm like,

525
00:29:26,040 --> 00:29:28,080
Speaker 2: wait what. I felt like they stayed on formula for

526
00:29:28,160 --> 00:29:30,480
Speaker 2: like two years and I didn't breastfeed, so I'm really like,

527
00:29:30,560 --> 00:29:33,440
Speaker 2: wait what, And it's a global pandemic and I can't

528
00:29:33,520 --> 00:29:35,880
Speaker 2: get food and I'm like, oh my goodness, the whole

529
00:29:35,920 --> 00:29:38,560
Speaker 2: thing changed. So those are the things that were my focus,

530
00:29:38,720 --> 00:29:42,040
Speaker 2: just the day to day, and then you know, we

531
00:29:42,120 --> 00:29:45,880
Speaker 2: were inside of our home. It really gave me this

532
00:29:46,720 --> 00:29:49,600
Speaker 2: opportunity to be there with my son that I would

533
00:29:49,680 --> 00:29:51,760
Speaker 2: not have had, so first steps, things that I would

534
00:29:51,760 --> 00:29:53,960
Speaker 2: have missed had I been in the studio. I got

535
00:29:54,000 --> 00:29:57,080
Speaker 2: a chance to see firsthand, and we grew so close.

536
00:29:58,120 --> 00:30:02,160
Speaker 2: When things reopen and he was invited to his first

537
00:30:02,200 --> 00:30:07,000
Speaker 2: birthday party, he was hiding in the corner, like this

538
00:30:07,120 --> 00:30:10,920
Speaker 2: guy in the car. He's mister Razzle Dazzle, He's mister

539
00:30:11,000 --> 00:30:13,800
Speaker 2: Talk and he talk. And we get to the birthday party.

540
00:30:14,400 --> 00:30:16,960
Speaker 2: His hands are sweaty, he's next to me. He won't leave,

541
00:30:17,040 --> 00:30:20,640
Speaker 2: and I'm like, okay, but I understand. It's a birthday.

542
00:30:20,680 --> 00:30:24,040
Speaker 2: It's overwhelming. Things happen, but then it happens again and

543
00:30:24,200 --> 00:30:27,080
Speaker 2: again in different circumstances, and then we would come home

544
00:30:27,360 --> 00:30:31,040
Speaker 2: from this scary situation and he'd talk all about it.

545
00:30:31,920 --> 00:30:34,200
Speaker 2: He knew what everyone wore, everything said, the music that

546
00:30:34,320 --> 00:30:37,120
Speaker 2: was played. He was just so I realized that this

547
00:30:37,240 --> 00:30:40,640
Speaker 2: was a kid who was observing but was afraid to

548
00:30:40,680 --> 00:30:46,200
Speaker 2: get in. He wanted it didn't have that, I can

549
00:30:46,280 --> 00:30:49,840
Speaker 2: tell you. I debate whether it was because we were

550
00:30:50,000 --> 00:30:53,760
Speaker 2: inside for a long time or that's his natural personality

551
00:30:53,880 --> 00:30:57,880
Speaker 2: as it was mine. I don't know. But how did

552
00:30:57,920 --> 00:31:00,680
Speaker 2: I How do I address it? What I do became

553
00:31:00,720 --> 00:31:04,440
Speaker 2: the priority, not the what happens right? And so I

554
00:31:04,480 --> 00:31:06,400
Speaker 2: started to talk to other parents who talked about kids

555
00:31:06,400 --> 00:31:11,360
Speaker 2: who present shy or the reality that we all do,

556
00:31:13,360 --> 00:31:16,360
Speaker 2: and that on the other side of fear is often

557
00:31:16,400 --> 00:31:19,520
Speaker 2: something so fun. So this is a book that talks

558
00:31:19,560 --> 00:31:24,720
Speaker 2: about through curiosity and kindness, how you can face your fear.

559
00:31:24,880 --> 00:31:28,120
Speaker 2: The backdrop is half Texas, half Harlem, New York. But

560
00:31:28,360 --> 00:31:32,680
Speaker 2: in truth, the first outside experience all of our children

561
00:31:32,800 --> 00:31:37,000
Speaker 2: have it's not a school, it's the neighborhood. So Harlem

562
00:31:37,160 --> 00:31:39,520
Speaker 2: is his neighborhood, but it's meant to represent whether you

563
00:31:39,600 --> 00:31:42,360
Speaker 2: have a tiny community or you're walking out your door

564
00:31:42,440 --> 00:31:45,400
Speaker 2: to nine O, two, one zero, whatever, it is your

565
00:31:45,520 --> 00:31:49,600
Speaker 2: first exposure outside of the intimacy of your family home

566
00:31:49,800 --> 00:31:54,120
Speaker 2: is your neighborhood. And so we use music, we use food,

567
00:31:54,720 --> 00:31:59,600
Speaker 2: we use kindness and curiosity as this way for adults

568
00:31:59,680 --> 00:32:02,880
Speaker 2: to talk to kids about how you face that fear

569
00:32:02,960 --> 00:32:05,240
Speaker 2: and what fun you can find on the other side.

570
00:32:05,960 --> 00:32:09,160
Speaker 1: Yeah, and the through line too is also back to connection.

571
00:32:09,720 --> 00:32:13,400
Speaker 1: What we were talking about before is realizing how you

572
00:32:13,520 --> 00:32:18,120
Speaker 1: are connected to everything around you if you just take

573
00:32:18,160 --> 00:32:18,560
Speaker 1: a look.

574
00:32:19,760 --> 00:32:21,720
Speaker 2: And it's true, and it's a reminder. You know, when

575
00:32:21,720 --> 00:32:23,640
Speaker 2: I was writing this book and even now we still

576
00:32:23,720 --> 00:32:25,560
Speaker 2: read it, my son's going to go on tour with

577
00:32:25,680 --> 00:32:28,520
Speaker 2: me and he's actually preparing for his first school musical.

578
00:32:28,600 --> 00:32:30,560
Speaker 2: I mean, we went from a few years ago a

579
00:32:30,640 --> 00:32:33,040
Speaker 2: kid who would not you know, participate a birthday party.

580
00:32:33,160 --> 00:32:37,320
Speaker 2: He's Orange Crayon number three and the upcoming music. Wow, hey,

581
00:32:37,400 --> 00:32:40,680
Speaker 2: the crayons quit, and oh my gosh, he's ready to sing.

582
00:32:40,840 --> 00:32:42,960
Speaker 2: He's singing Somewhere over the Rainbow and it's so funny.

583
00:32:42,960 --> 00:32:45,440
Speaker 2: We were watching the Oscars and he has no idea

584
00:32:45,440 --> 00:32:47,600
Speaker 2: who Ariana Grande is. And we're at dinner and the

585
00:32:47,640 --> 00:32:50,960
Speaker 2: Oscars are on. He looks up and he's like, what

586
00:32:51,120 --> 00:32:53,400
Speaker 2: is she singing my song? Who is this singing my song?

587
00:32:53,680 --> 00:32:55,600
Speaker 1: I think he thought it was his life and I

588
00:32:55,640 --> 00:32:58,400
Speaker 1: says original Ariana Grande.

589
00:32:58,480 --> 00:33:00,640
Speaker 2: He's like whoo. And then I said, that's the Oscars, Mom,

590
00:33:00,680 --> 00:33:03,400
Speaker 2: what's the Oscars? So after his musical, I'm gonna get

591
00:33:03,400 --> 00:33:05,080
Speaker 2: like a little fake Oscars made for him so I

592
00:33:05,120 --> 00:33:06,880
Speaker 2: can give him his Oscar once he gets done with

593
00:33:06,960 --> 00:33:09,120
Speaker 2: it on at the end of the month. But you know,

594
00:33:09,360 --> 00:33:17,920
Speaker 2: he's now learned that facing his fear can inspire other things, right,

595
00:33:18,040 --> 00:33:21,480
Speaker 2: and so he really was my test subject in this

596
00:33:21,600 --> 00:33:25,120
Speaker 2: and we have there. We still have moments where he says, Mom,

597
00:33:25,880 --> 00:33:27,840
Speaker 2: I don't want to go in. I'm not ready, you know,

598
00:33:28,040 --> 00:33:30,280
Speaker 2: or he'll say that and I'm okay with that. He

599
00:33:30,400 --> 00:33:33,160
Speaker 2: has to be a well he's walked into as you know,

600
00:33:34,200 --> 00:33:37,080
Speaker 2: you are an international star. I host a talk show.

601
00:33:37,160 --> 00:33:39,720
Speaker 2: Our kids aren't part of our world, but they're not

602
00:33:39,920 --> 00:33:42,960
Speaker 2: part of our world, right, And so with him, I

603
00:33:43,040 --> 00:33:46,760
Speaker 2: even debated namely the character after him, because so he's

604
00:33:46,880 --> 00:33:49,960
Speaker 2: very distinct named Moses, right, He's not the original Moses,

605
00:33:50,040 --> 00:33:54,000
Speaker 2: but he is a Moses, and people see him and

606
00:33:54,040 --> 00:33:56,440
Speaker 2: they say Moses, and they're excited because they're excited. For me,

607
00:33:56,600 --> 00:33:58,840
Speaker 2: being a forty eight year old first time mom at

608
00:33:58,880 --> 00:34:00,920
Speaker 2: the time, that can a lot for a kid to

609
00:34:01,000 --> 00:34:03,720
Speaker 2: take in. But in his own daily life, you know,

610
00:34:05,240 --> 00:34:07,520
Speaker 2: we went to uh he asked me to go to

611
00:34:07,760 --> 00:34:10,319
Speaker 2: see Kids Bop Live. He loves Kids Bop he's all

612
00:34:10,400 --> 00:34:13,800
Speaker 2: about and we got tickets and we took him to

613
00:34:13,880 --> 00:34:18,520
Speaker 2: New Jersey and he was absolutely terrified. Like we get

614
00:34:18,560 --> 00:34:20,600
Speaker 2: there and he's like, wait, this is way bigger than

615
00:34:20,640 --> 00:34:23,759
Speaker 2: I expected. This is way different than I expected. And

616
00:34:23,960 --> 00:34:27,400
Speaker 2: he wanted to leave. And my instinct, you know, was like,

617
00:34:27,560 --> 00:34:29,520
Speaker 2: let's get in this car. We're gonna go right back home.

618
00:34:29,600 --> 00:34:33,200
Speaker 2: But I was like, you know, okay, let me breathe,

619
00:34:33,560 --> 00:34:35,799
Speaker 2: because how I react to this is how he acts.

620
00:34:36,000 --> 00:34:39,000
Speaker 2: If I keep pushing get in there. That's going to

621
00:34:39,080 --> 00:34:43,279
Speaker 2: add a resistance, right, So okay, say well whenever you're ready.

622
00:34:43,480 --> 00:34:47,000
Speaker 2: And then the show started. He starts to hear familiar song.

623
00:34:47,520 --> 00:34:51,000
Speaker 2: I see the side look, you know that that wanting

624
00:34:51,080 --> 00:34:55,239
Speaker 2: to be in behavior and physical change. And before I

625
00:34:55,400 --> 00:34:57,560
Speaker 2: know it, he's in the seat, We're dancing, We're having

626
00:34:57,560 --> 00:34:59,560
Speaker 2: a good time. He's you know, the kids pop. They

627
00:34:59,640 --> 00:35:02,759
Speaker 2: vote on which finale song and his finale song for

628
00:35:02,840 --> 00:35:04,760
Speaker 2: you which one he wanted? Didn't get it. I didn't

629
00:35:04,840 --> 00:35:07,239
Speaker 2: get my song. You know, he's invested in it and

630
00:35:07,320 --> 00:35:10,400
Speaker 2: he's having a great time. He's now in basketball and

631
00:35:10,560 --> 00:35:13,319
Speaker 2: he goes on Sundays. I'm so happy the first time

632
00:35:13,400 --> 00:35:15,320
Speaker 2: he went first, Please not the first time, maybe the

633
00:35:15,400 --> 00:35:19,440
Speaker 2: first week. You want no parts. He sat there on

634
00:35:19,560 --> 00:35:22,239
Speaker 2: the side and he looked and didn't want and I said,

635
00:35:22,280 --> 00:35:24,480
Speaker 2: you know, you love Jalen Brunson. You love the Knicks.

636
00:35:24,520 --> 00:35:26,320
Speaker 2: To my dismay, being from Dallas, I want him to

637
00:35:26,360 --> 00:35:29,680
Speaker 2: love the Mavericks, but he loves the Knicks. And then

638
00:35:30,640 --> 00:35:34,239
Speaker 2: this week the class was the last day and this

639
00:35:34,600 --> 00:35:37,040
Speaker 2: this coach is female coach who was there at the beginning,

640
00:35:37,960 --> 00:35:41,320
Speaker 2: came back for their little ceremony or whatever, and she

641
00:35:41,440 --> 00:35:43,719
Speaker 2: pulled my husband over to the side and she said, oh,

642
00:35:43,800 --> 00:35:46,080
Speaker 2: I can't believe look at this kid. Look at him.

643
00:35:46,400 --> 00:35:48,800
Speaker 2: I mean he's like dribbling with right hand left handed.

644
00:35:49,239 --> 00:35:51,920
Speaker 2: He's like having a great time. He needed to have

645
00:35:52,120 --> 00:35:56,680
Speaker 2: that time. The book is also a reminder, I hope

646
00:35:56,719 --> 00:36:01,040
Speaker 2: to adults, really something that I think you have learned

647
00:36:01,120 --> 00:36:06,080
Speaker 2: and are learning every day, how precious patience is with

648
00:36:06,239 --> 00:36:11,040
Speaker 2: ourselves giving ourselves that time, but also our kids. You know,

649
00:36:11,320 --> 00:36:13,040
Speaker 2: how easy is it to say, Okay, we're gonna go

650
00:36:13,040 --> 00:36:14,680
Speaker 2: to dinner, hurry, put your socks onto the Okay, you

651
00:36:14,680 --> 00:36:16,000
Speaker 2: can't get shucks, let me put it on for you.

652
00:36:16,960 --> 00:36:20,680
Speaker 2: It's delaying and putting their socks one put time to

653
00:36:21,239 --> 00:36:23,719
Speaker 2: let me put the thumbs in to pull the sock up,

654
00:36:23,800 --> 00:36:25,680
Speaker 2: and we gotta go, We gotta go. So I'm gonna

655
00:36:25,680 --> 00:36:28,960
Speaker 2: put this on for you. You know. Yeah, we think

656
00:36:29,000 --> 00:36:31,440
Speaker 2: it's helping. But if we can and by the way,

657
00:36:31,640 --> 00:36:35,719
Speaker 2: baking in that time to watch them put their socks on,

658
00:36:36,160 --> 00:36:38,560
Speaker 2: I mean we like danced around the first time we're

659
00:36:38,600 --> 00:36:42,640
Speaker 2: tackling shoe tie. Now, I's like, oh my god, those

660
00:36:42,680 --> 00:36:48,040
Speaker 2: are the exhilarating, beautiful sensations that we deserve too. Yeah.

661
00:36:48,080 --> 00:36:50,719
Speaker 1: I mean that message is so important and I was

662
00:36:50,800 --> 00:36:54,440
Speaker 1: gonna say that before it. By you having that kind

663
00:36:54,480 --> 00:36:57,520
Speaker 1: of patience and talking about those moments in your real

664
00:36:57,600 --> 00:37:01,000
Speaker 1: life with your son, that will help other people to

665
00:37:01,280 --> 00:37:05,320
Speaker 1: regain some patience, because it's really easy to be impatient.

666
00:37:06,360 --> 00:37:09,719
Speaker 2: Listen, I'm going to work in progress, you know, I am.

667
00:37:10,080 --> 00:37:11,840
Speaker 2: I'm a blank canvas with a little bit of the

668
00:37:11,880 --> 00:37:14,040
Speaker 2: sketch on it because I have to do it for

669
00:37:14,200 --> 00:37:18,200
Speaker 2: myself all the time, you know, and it is we

670
00:37:18,640 --> 00:37:23,399
Speaker 2: know the value of it. We know it is priceless, right, yes,

671
00:37:24,160 --> 00:37:26,919
Speaker 2: but we fall prey to it. You know. Sometimes we'll

672
00:37:26,960 --> 00:37:30,440
Speaker 2: go to a restaurant and my son will you know,

673
00:37:30,480 --> 00:37:33,920
Speaker 2: he's stirring around. Well, we've gone to restaurants for fifty

674
00:37:34,000 --> 00:37:36,560
Speaker 2: years of our lives. The first time this kid has

675
00:37:36,600 --> 00:37:40,120
Speaker 2: walked into this environment, been in this environment. And yes,

676
00:37:40,239 --> 00:37:43,080
Speaker 2: we want them to behave accordingly. We want them to

677
00:37:43,640 --> 00:37:46,400
Speaker 2: be a little perfectly mannered children who go to the

678
00:37:46,480 --> 00:37:49,640
Speaker 2: seat and put their They're just walking into a whole restaurant.

679
00:37:50,239 --> 00:37:51,600
Speaker 1: Yeah, this is all new for them.

680
00:37:51,920 --> 00:38:00,920
Speaker 2: It's all new for them, you know. Speaking of all.

681
00:38:00,960 --> 00:38:03,359
Speaker 1: New for you, I really want to talk about your

682
00:38:03,520 --> 00:38:07,359
Speaker 1: choice to become a mom at forty eight. Ah, I'm

683
00:38:07,480 --> 00:38:10,600
Speaker 1: really interested in that because I was there rooting for

684
00:38:10,760 --> 00:38:13,920
Speaker 1: you the whole time. And I remember when you got pregnant.

685
00:38:14,560 --> 00:38:17,879
Speaker 1: I remember seeing you pregnant and I had already loved

686
00:38:17,920 --> 00:38:21,320
Speaker 1: you from the Today Show. Yeah, and so I was

687
00:38:21,440 --> 00:38:23,200
Speaker 1: just rooting you on and like it was such a

688
00:38:23,239 --> 00:38:25,080
Speaker 1: big deal. She's pregnant at forty eight.

689
00:38:26,320 --> 00:38:30,799
Speaker 2: You know it was. I'll tell you. If I had

690
00:38:31,000 --> 00:38:33,960
Speaker 2: not lost that job, I don't think I would have

691
00:38:34,160 --> 00:38:38,759
Speaker 2: had my son. It was the first time I've worked

692
00:38:38,800 --> 00:38:41,760
Speaker 2: since I was fourteen. My very first job was Toys

693
00:38:41,840 --> 00:38:44,360
Speaker 2: r us. I still have my first paycheck, you know,

694
00:38:44,600 --> 00:38:47,280
Speaker 2: my little stub because I was like, what the takeout

695
00:38:47,320 --> 00:38:50,719
Speaker 2: stuff was as well? You still have it. That's so

696
00:38:50,920 --> 00:38:53,920
Speaker 2: great years later. I've worked since I was fourteen. I've

697
00:38:54,040 --> 00:38:56,680
Speaker 2: never been fired in my life. I was always a

698
00:38:57,360 --> 00:39:00,960
Speaker 2: high achieving person, you know. Or once my dad gave

699
00:39:01,040 --> 00:39:04,719
Speaker 2: me that challenge, my value became. What I saw is

700
00:39:04,760 --> 00:39:07,120
Speaker 2: my value was work, you know, because you can lose that.

701
00:39:07,360 --> 00:39:12,000
Speaker 2: And even at age eighteen, a dear friend mom gave

702
00:39:12,080 --> 00:39:16,359
Speaker 2: me a book and one of the chapters said, who

703
00:39:16,440 --> 00:39:19,200
Speaker 2: are you if there's no title beneath your name? I'm eighteen.

704
00:39:19,280 --> 00:39:21,239
Speaker 2: That means nothing to me. I don't even think about it.

705
00:39:21,360 --> 00:39:25,560
Speaker 2: Fast forward age four six, old boy. That book A

706
00:39:25,640 --> 00:39:28,480
Speaker 2: Path of Light, that's been sitting on my bedside or

707
00:39:28,520 --> 00:39:32,279
Speaker 2: whatever since I was eighteen, suddenly makes sense now. And

708
00:39:33,120 --> 00:39:35,719
Speaker 2: it was the first time that I said, you know,

709
00:39:35,960 --> 00:39:38,239
Speaker 2: I'll be okay if I am not on a TV show.

710
00:39:38,360 --> 00:39:40,800
Speaker 2: I'll be okay if I'm not a reporter, I'll figure

711
00:39:40,920 --> 00:39:45,480
Speaker 2: this out, you know. And whatever aspirations of, you know,

712
00:39:45,640 --> 00:39:48,920
Speaker 2: being on a national news show, it didn't matter to me.

713
00:39:50,360 --> 00:39:52,680
Speaker 2: I left the show. It was important for me to

714
00:39:52,760 --> 00:39:58,040
Speaker 2: take that stand for myself. I at the time did

715
00:39:58,120 --> 00:40:00,759
Speaker 2: not have a child. I was my backup. So trust me,

716
00:40:00,800 --> 00:40:03,080
Speaker 2: I'm looking at the ATM and the numbers are not numbering.

717
00:40:03,280 --> 00:40:04,920
Speaker 2: But I was going to figure it out, right. I

718
00:40:05,040 --> 00:40:06,800
Speaker 2: was like, you know, I didn't my parents didn't have

719
00:40:06,840 --> 00:40:09,279
Speaker 2: a gold Bars buried somewhere. I was on my own.

720
00:40:09,800 --> 00:40:12,160
Speaker 2: My mother's big contribution was to tell me I could

721
00:40:12,239 --> 00:40:14,120
Speaker 2: move back to my room, and I was like, it's

722
00:40:14,160 --> 00:40:15,399
Speaker 2: not going to happen, but thank you for the offer.

723
00:40:15,480 --> 00:40:17,360
Speaker 2: We're not there yet. We're not there yet, you know.

724
00:40:17,920 --> 00:40:24,040
Speaker 2: And during the time of trying to figure out this

725
00:40:24,360 --> 00:40:29,400
Speaker 2: next act in my life. I got an offer to

726
00:40:30,200 --> 00:40:35,319
Speaker 2: have a show executive produced by Harvey Weinstein. That day

727
00:40:35,480 --> 00:40:37,920
Speaker 2: felt like the best day of my life. Right, Oh

728
00:40:38,000 --> 00:40:41,560
Speaker 2: my gosh, I've gone from being invisible in this workspace

729
00:40:41,680 --> 00:40:43,720
Speaker 2: to speaks this guy, this is the guy that everyone

730
00:40:43,760 --> 00:40:47,120
Speaker 2: told this is the guy, right, and thinking, wow, big

731
00:40:47,239 --> 00:40:52,239
Speaker 2: breaks do happen, wonderful And now I'm kind of back

732
00:40:52,280 --> 00:40:54,680
Speaker 2: into the identity. Right, I'm about to be a talk

733
00:40:54,719 --> 00:40:59,399
Speaker 2: show host out here my title it's back. And then

734
00:40:59,520 --> 00:41:07,040
Speaker 2: one day I got a call that his name was

735
00:41:07,120 --> 00:41:10,600
Speaker 2: being mentioned along the lines of the word someone. The

736
00:41:10,680 --> 00:41:14,560
Speaker 2: person actually said the R word, and I said retirement

737
00:41:15,920 --> 00:41:18,920
Speaker 2: and because I have not, and they said fortunately, no,

738
00:41:19,400 --> 00:41:23,640
Speaker 2: yeah exactly, And I said what now everything is like, oh,

739
00:41:27,480 --> 00:41:31,640
Speaker 2: I had at the time already met my now husband,

740
00:41:32,640 --> 00:41:36,800
Speaker 2: because when I agreed to executive produce the show with

741
00:41:36,920 --> 00:41:38,920
Speaker 2: Harvey Weinstein, there were a lot of like just ebbs

742
00:41:38,960 --> 00:41:41,640
Speaker 2: and flows and just just things that were happening. Now.

743
00:41:41,760 --> 00:41:44,920
Speaker 2: I know he was under investigation, but there were these

744
00:41:45,000 --> 00:41:50,279
Speaker 2: inconsistencies that made me not feel certain. Nothing behaviorally toward me,

745
00:41:50,440 --> 00:41:53,520
Speaker 2: but just like so just weird energy. You know, when

746
00:41:53,520 --> 00:41:55,840
Speaker 2: you're like, this is weird energy around here, and I

747
00:41:55,840 --> 00:41:59,680
Speaker 2: didn't know what it was. And I remember throwing myself

748
00:41:59,760 --> 00:42:03,319
Speaker 2: this hitting party because I was in LA And as

749
00:42:03,360 --> 00:42:05,440
Speaker 2: you know, when you go into business with somebody, reach

750
00:42:05,440 --> 00:42:07,040
Speaker 2: an agreement, they're going to give you X amount of

751
00:42:07,080 --> 00:42:09,880
Speaker 2: dollars to hold exclusive rights to whatever you're doing, so

752
00:42:09,960 --> 00:42:13,200
Speaker 2: it's like a holding fee or whatever. And he was

753
00:42:13,280 --> 00:42:16,280
Speaker 2: slow on that payment, and I'm like, I need my money,

754
00:42:16,480 --> 00:42:19,040
Speaker 2: here's my money. What's going on here? So now I'm

755
00:42:19,080 --> 00:42:21,200
Speaker 2: feeling like, oh, this guy sold me a bill of

756
00:42:21,280 --> 00:42:24,640
Speaker 2: goods and this show's never going to happen, and I'm sad, sad, sad.

757
00:42:26,120 --> 00:42:27,719
Speaker 2: And then I went out to the pool at the

758
00:42:27,760 --> 00:42:30,560
Speaker 2: Sunset Marquee. I was actually supposed to stay at another

759
00:42:30,640 --> 00:42:33,320
Speaker 2: hotel because I told my travelation at the time, I

760
00:42:33,480 --> 00:42:35,560
Speaker 2: want to stay where they are, like, guys, I want

761
00:42:35,640 --> 00:42:38,400
Speaker 2: somewhere with a cute bars. I'm single and I am

762
00:42:38,719 --> 00:42:40,960
Speaker 2: ready to date and you know, move on my life.

763
00:42:41,680 --> 00:42:43,640
Speaker 2: He puts me up at a hotel and everyone there

764
00:42:43,760 --> 00:42:45,400
Speaker 2: is like a twenty year old wrapper, and I'm like,

765
00:42:46,760 --> 00:42:49,960
Speaker 2: because twenty year olds are wrapper, this is not my scene,

766
00:42:50,239 --> 00:42:53,520
Speaker 2: not my scene. So he put me up at Sunset

767
00:42:53,640 --> 00:42:56,920
Speaker 2: Marquee only because he's like, it's a great hotel. I

768
00:42:57,000 --> 00:42:58,400
Speaker 2: was like, all right, fine it because I'd given up

769
00:42:58,440 --> 00:43:00,640
Speaker 2: on dating at that point. Now between the hotel in

770
00:43:00,680 --> 00:43:04,120
Speaker 2: the five minutes, I thought that was the deal breaker

771
00:43:04,239 --> 00:43:07,320
Speaker 2: for you. I'm in the room. I throw myself a

772
00:43:07,400 --> 00:43:11,839
Speaker 2: proper pity party, and then I went to the hotel cool.

773
00:43:12,280 --> 00:43:14,080
Speaker 2: I have, like I put a one piece on, so

774
00:43:14,360 --> 00:43:16,640
Speaker 2: clearly I wasn't trying to bring any kind of a game.

775
00:43:16,680 --> 00:43:18,480
Speaker 2: I was done at that point. I got to the

776
00:43:18,520 --> 00:43:22,360
Speaker 2: school and I looked up and walking toward me is Steven.

777
00:43:22,440 --> 00:43:25,720
Speaker 2: And we'd run into each other many times at different events.

778
00:43:25,760 --> 00:43:27,880
Speaker 2: He you know, he's in the music business, he's a manager,

779
00:43:28,000 --> 00:43:31,000
Speaker 2: he's worked with a lot of people. And he sat

780
00:43:31,080 --> 00:43:34,640
Speaker 2: down and we started talking. And I think because I

781
00:43:34,719 --> 00:43:37,480
Speaker 2: didn't have I just kind of got it to this

782
00:43:37,719 --> 00:43:40,160
Speaker 2: fitt moment with work and all of this, su I

783
00:43:40,280 --> 00:43:43,480
Speaker 2: saw this person and we're just talking and then we

784
00:43:43,520 --> 00:43:45,799
Speaker 2: started arguing over who has the best pizza in New

785
00:43:45,880 --> 00:43:48,120
Speaker 2: York and he's like, I'm a New Yorker, I know.

786
00:43:48,840 --> 00:43:51,520
Speaker 2: And then we agree to go on like a pizza showdown.

787
00:43:51,600 --> 00:43:54,759
Speaker 2: It wasn't nothing elaborate, it was no like it was

788
00:43:54,840 --> 00:43:57,680
Speaker 2: a pizza, and when I was back in New York

789
00:43:58,000 --> 00:43:59,520
Speaker 2: and whole turns out he had a place a few

790
00:43:59,560 --> 00:44:02,160
Speaker 2: blocks from min. I'm like, wait, what, this is interesting,

791
00:44:02,840 --> 00:44:05,360
Speaker 2: and we you know, started to hang out, and a

792
00:44:05,440 --> 00:44:10,879
Speaker 2: couple of weeks later we moved in and okay, I'm

793
00:44:11,000 --> 00:44:13,480
Speaker 2: furious as we were talking. That's why I laught. That's

794
00:44:13,520 --> 00:44:15,160
Speaker 2: why I laughed when you said it on my show

795
00:44:15,200 --> 00:44:17,400
Speaker 2: about you, like all the weeks I was like, wait, oh,

796
00:44:17,520 --> 00:44:20,640
Speaker 2: that's funny. So like, within a few weeks we started

797
00:44:20,719 --> 00:44:22,480
Speaker 2: dating and then going to the point that you asked

798
00:44:22,520 --> 00:44:26,719
Speaker 2: me my husband had no children, and he said he

799
00:44:26,760 --> 00:44:32,000
Speaker 2: always wanted children. He had his own childhood journey that

800
00:44:32,200 --> 00:44:35,160
Speaker 2: was complicated and complex, and he just never thought he

801
00:44:35,239 --> 00:44:37,759
Speaker 2: was going to be a dad or that he had

802
00:44:37,800 --> 00:44:40,320
Speaker 2: the skills to be a dad based on how he

803
00:44:40,560 --> 00:44:45,520
Speaker 2: was raised. And then I said, well, you know, I

804
00:44:45,760 --> 00:44:49,440
Speaker 2: love to look into this, you know, this concept of

805
00:44:49,560 --> 00:44:53,040
Speaker 2: us being parents as we're here now, and I think

806
00:44:53,239 --> 00:44:57,120
Speaker 2: that not having the pressure of the job had allowed

807
00:44:57,200 --> 00:45:01,080
Speaker 2: me to give my body grace. Had I had a

808
00:45:01,120 --> 00:45:07,359
Speaker 2: lot less stress, a lot less just everything. I felt

809
00:45:07,400 --> 00:45:10,200
Speaker 2: a lot less it about myself. To be honest, I've

810
00:45:10,360 --> 00:45:12,080
Speaker 2: never shared that with anybody. But I went through that

811
00:45:12,120 --> 00:45:14,719
Speaker 2: phase of just feeling it was like, this is now.

812
00:45:14,920 --> 00:45:17,920
Speaker 1: It sounds like a real transitional time for you, and

813
00:45:19,120 --> 00:45:23,040
Speaker 1: so much uncertainty. Yeah, but I love that you are

814
00:45:23,600 --> 00:45:26,000
Speaker 1: by the pool and just letting it happen.

815
00:45:26,400 --> 00:45:29,000
Speaker 2: But I'll hang out at an unattractive one piece, yeah,

816
00:45:29,040 --> 00:45:31,319
Speaker 2: and this and then this is what comes to you. Yeah,

817
00:45:31,320 --> 00:45:33,279
Speaker 2: And it came to me, it really did. And the

818
00:45:33,440 --> 00:45:37,320
Speaker 2: right person at the right time, under the right circumstances,

819
00:45:37,960 --> 00:45:41,440
Speaker 2: and for me, for me, you know. And we went

820
00:45:41,520 --> 00:45:46,680
Speaker 2: through multiple rounds of IVF, multiple and there were, you know,

821
00:45:46,840 --> 00:45:51,000
Speaker 2: some hard truths. And one day I was driving and

822
00:45:51,080 --> 00:45:54,160
Speaker 2: I saw this sign that talked about adoption and I

823
00:45:54,239 --> 00:45:55,520
Speaker 2: thought that was an the fifth I was like, oh,

824
00:45:55,600 --> 00:45:57,560
Speaker 2: this is it, This is it. I should you know.

825
00:45:57,800 --> 00:45:59,520
Speaker 2: This is the route. I'm not going to do this anymore.

826
00:45:59,680 --> 00:46:02,440
Speaker 2: This is the route. And I wasn't angry, it wasn't resigned,

827
00:46:02,480 --> 00:46:04,560
Speaker 2: it wasn't like, oh, I'll just stood up. It wasn't that.

828
00:46:04,680 --> 00:46:07,000
Speaker 2: It was like, oh, this is the sign. Like when

829
00:46:07,040 --> 00:46:10,040
Speaker 2: I went to the pool. It wasn't a negative or positive.

830
00:46:10,080 --> 00:46:16,440
Speaker 2: It was a sign. And I got a call that

831
00:46:16,600 --> 00:46:24,880
Speaker 2: things were looking good, and then we taped my pilot

832
00:46:25,520 --> 00:46:29,680
Speaker 2: for the talk show that next morning, and I got

833
00:46:29,719 --> 00:46:35,480
Speaker 2: a call early that morning that we, in fact I

834
00:46:35,640 --> 00:46:36,160
Speaker 2: was pregnant.

835
00:46:36,440 --> 00:46:39,840
Speaker 1: Wow timing, I.

836
00:46:39,840 --> 00:46:41,480
Speaker 2: Still kept that out. It was just crazy. So I'm

837
00:46:41,520 --> 00:46:42,680
Speaker 2: walking out of my pilot.

838
00:46:43,680 --> 00:46:46,520
Speaker 1: I remember your pilot, I remember the first time.

839
00:46:46,760 --> 00:46:49,960
Speaker 2: Pilot, and I am I'm pregnant, and I'm just like wow.

840
00:46:50,440 --> 00:46:53,080
Speaker 2: And you know, we kept a private for thirty two

841
00:46:53,080 --> 00:46:55,920
Speaker 2: weeks because I was a geriatric pregnancy. I didn't know

842
00:46:56,040 --> 00:46:59,920
Speaker 2: what that meant, and also I wasn't on daily TV yet,

843
00:47:00,600 --> 00:47:05,440
Speaker 2: and I wanted to protect my relationship my husband. I

844
00:47:05,520 --> 00:47:10,080
Speaker 2: wanted to protect my sanity. As you know, people will

845
00:47:10,239 --> 00:47:11,839
Speaker 2: you tell someone you're pregnant and you're like, oh boy,

846
00:47:12,160 --> 00:47:15,080
Speaker 2: it's gonna be hard to marry. Oh boy, marriage is hard.

847
00:47:15,320 --> 00:47:17,360
Speaker 2: And I get that sentiment of why people do it.

848
00:47:17,360 --> 00:47:19,399
Speaker 2: We're kind of just trained. It's like a rote thing

849
00:47:19,520 --> 00:47:22,800
Speaker 2: to say. But I am more conscious than ever of

850
00:47:22,920 --> 00:47:26,480
Speaker 2: how I respond to whatever someone is sharing with me, right,

851
00:47:27,640 --> 00:47:31,719
Speaker 2: and I wanted to just enjoy it. And then we

852
00:47:31,840 --> 00:47:36,600
Speaker 2: got a call thirty two weeks in. My team called

853
00:47:36,640 --> 00:47:38,960
Speaker 2: and said, oh, there's a tabloid that's about to say

854
00:47:38,960 --> 00:47:42,040
Speaker 2: you're pregnant. I'm like what And what happened was I

855
00:47:42,560 --> 00:47:44,920
Speaker 2: reserved our maternity room and you have to do it

856
00:47:45,000 --> 00:47:48,759
Speaker 2: under your name and someone had told someone and they

857
00:47:49,280 --> 00:47:52,279
Speaker 2: called our team and it almost made it, almost made

858
00:47:52,320 --> 00:47:54,439
Speaker 2: it almost made it. And it was funny way because

859
00:47:54,440 --> 00:47:57,640
Speaker 2: at the time that baby Shark song was like and

860
00:47:57,760 --> 00:48:01,080
Speaker 2: so I ran, I got this like actually dress I

861
00:48:01,200 --> 00:48:03,279
Speaker 2: had and I and my husband's like, what are we

862
00:48:03,280 --> 00:48:04,440
Speaker 2: gonna do? What are you gonna do? I was like,

863
00:48:04,560 --> 00:48:06,680
Speaker 2: We're gonna do Baby Shark. And then I had the

864
00:48:07,000 --> 00:48:09,560
Speaker 2: book in front of my belly and I was like

865
00:48:09,640 --> 00:48:11,279
Speaker 2: do do do do? Do? Do do? And then I

866
00:48:11,440 --> 00:48:13,560
Speaker 2: removed the book and then it's like a baby and

867
00:48:13,719 --> 00:48:16,000
Speaker 2: then it was like People magazine. You know how it

868
00:48:16,080 --> 00:48:19,000
Speaker 2: goes after that? Yeah, you know. I'm but I think

869
00:48:19,160 --> 00:48:21,879
Speaker 2: fast forward when I look at that. As I said,

870
00:48:22,719 --> 00:48:25,880
Speaker 2: the loss became a win and not with the talk show, right,

871
00:48:26,000 --> 00:48:29,000
Speaker 2: it became a win in love the way I think

872
00:48:29,040 --> 00:48:33,080
Speaker 2: I became a more present friend. I think sometimes my

873
00:48:33,160 --> 00:48:36,600
Speaker 2: conversations were one sided, and I know talk show hosts

874
00:48:36,600 --> 00:48:38,600
Speaker 2: are just born that way to have one sided conversations

875
00:48:38,600 --> 00:48:43,239
Speaker 2: because that much. But I just got a chance to

876
00:48:43,320 --> 00:48:46,760
Speaker 2: catch up with my friends and not talk about work,

877
00:48:46,800 --> 00:48:50,520
Speaker 2: and I know that work is what provides the lives

878
00:48:50,560 --> 00:48:53,359
Speaker 2: that we have. So I'm not like I grew up very,

879
00:48:53,480 --> 00:48:55,760
Speaker 2: very poor, So I'm not going to be that person

880
00:48:55,800 --> 00:48:59,400
Speaker 2: to say moody doesn't matter. But it doesn't. It's not

881
00:48:59,480 --> 00:49:02,479
Speaker 2: the total of happiness or our journeys. I've been both

882
00:49:02,600 --> 00:49:06,239
Speaker 2: sides of the conversation, and it's about perspective of what

883
00:49:06,400 --> 00:49:08,200
Speaker 2: it brings and what you can use it to do

884
00:49:08,320 --> 00:49:14,000
Speaker 2: good and help others. It's a complicated conversation, but it

885
00:49:14,200 --> 00:49:18,560
Speaker 2: is recognized that having that break from work gave me

886
00:49:19,239 --> 00:49:23,680
Speaker 2: love time, It gave me my child in so many ways,

887
00:49:24,160 --> 00:49:26,560
Speaker 2: and it gave me a rebirth, which was the show

888
00:49:27,480 --> 00:49:30,640
Speaker 2: back with the wealth of things I feel to offer

889
00:49:31,360 --> 00:49:32,799
Speaker 2: that I didn't have before.

890
00:49:32,719 --> 00:49:35,280
Speaker 1: In your late forties. I mean, I was just talking

891
00:49:35,360 --> 00:49:38,640
Speaker 1: with EVT Nicole Brown and she just got married for

892
00:49:38,719 --> 00:49:39,399
Speaker 1: the first time.

893
00:49:39,800 --> 00:49:43,600
Speaker 2: Yes, she met Oh wait wait, even their date that

894
00:49:44,040 --> 00:49:46,600
Speaker 2: he took her onto the theater happened right after she

895
00:49:46,719 --> 00:49:52,480
Speaker 2: came on my show. That's last Oh lucky to take responsibility.

896
00:49:51,760 --> 00:49:55,480
Speaker 1: For Yes, you should, you absolutely should, but just like

897
00:49:55,680 --> 00:49:58,759
Speaker 1: talking about how society's timeline and just because you do

898
00:49:58,920 --> 00:50:01,239
Speaker 1: things later in life if it doesn't mean that you

899
00:50:01,480 --> 00:50:04,480
Speaker 1: are less deserving of love or motherhood or anything. I mean,

900
00:50:05,600 --> 00:50:08,920
Speaker 1: how have you felt about your experience with motherhood in

901
00:50:09,080 --> 00:50:12,080
Speaker 1: this chapter of your life? Being you know, an older

902
00:50:12,200 --> 00:50:15,960
Speaker 1: mom like you said you were a geriatric pregnancy, and

903
00:50:16,120 --> 00:50:16,360
Speaker 1: it just.

904
00:50:16,400 --> 00:50:19,000
Speaker 2: Hit me hard. And I'm sorry, I just I think

905
00:50:19,040 --> 00:50:22,239
Speaker 2: it's amazing. I love it. No, I got to tell you,

906
00:50:24,840 --> 00:50:27,960
Speaker 2: wisdom has been an interesting thing for me lately. For

907
00:50:28,120 --> 00:50:30,759
Speaker 2: so long, a lot of young women, not just with

908
00:50:30,840 --> 00:50:34,640
Speaker 2: the pregnancy, but with the career rebirth. Oh my god,

909
00:50:34,680 --> 00:50:36,440
Speaker 2: I look up to you, and I didn't know how

910
00:50:36,480 --> 00:50:38,200
Speaker 2: to accept that. Not that I felt like they were

911
00:50:38,239 --> 00:50:40,120
Speaker 2: saying that I was old. I just never felt wise.

912
00:50:41,320 --> 00:50:43,200
Speaker 2: I never felt like I was like, really me because

913
00:50:43,840 --> 00:50:47,320
Speaker 2: I can't relate. I just like, you know, okay, well thanks,

914
00:50:47,400 --> 00:50:48,960
Speaker 2: I don't know what I did, you know, Or when

915
00:50:48,960 --> 00:50:51,279
Speaker 2: people say you're so courageous and I'm like, well, what

916
00:50:51,480 --> 00:50:54,600
Speaker 2: was I going to do? You know? And so I've

917
00:50:54,760 --> 00:51:00,320
Speaker 2: recently tried to step out of body and understand what

918
00:51:00,480 --> 00:51:03,560
Speaker 2: they see. Oh my gosh, I've been doing the same.

919
00:51:04,040 --> 00:51:07,000
Speaker 2: Oh right, that's where as I'm like, it must be

920
00:51:07,040 --> 00:51:07,399
Speaker 2: our age.

921
00:51:07,440 --> 00:51:08,799
Speaker 1: If I'm about to turn fifty three.

922
00:51:09,360 --> 00:51:11,800
Speaker 2: It's our age because I've like, I got to step

923
00:51:12,040 --> 00:51:16,120
Speaker 2: out of this to understand what they see. Yes, and

924
00:51:16,239 --> 00:51:19,000
Speaker 2: it's not about running away from age. I just still

925
00:51:19,040 --> 00:51:23,120
Speaker 2: see myself as this trying to figure it out, you know. Yeah,

926
00:51:23,680 --> 00:51:27,839
Speaker 2: you know. And and so with being a mom, of course,

927
00:51:27,880 --> 00:51:30,279
Speaker 2: I've had some exercise on well, what would I have

928
00:51:30,280 --> 00:51:34,279
Speaker 2: been at twenty seven thirty there? And I can't conceptualize

929
00:51:34,320 --> 00:51:36,400
Speaker 2: it because I just don't can't live in that space.

930
00:51:36,560 --> 00:51:41,640
Speaker 2: But I have been so honored that not just late

931
00:51:41,719 --> 00:51:44,320
Speaker 2: to the party parents as I call us, but like

932
00:51:44,400 --> 00:51:46,759
Speaker 2: women in their thirties talk to me more openly about

933
00:51:46,760 --> 00:51:50,040
Speaker 2: freezing eggs. You know. Dulce Sloan from Daily Show, she

934
00:51:50,320 --> 00:51:52,399
Speaker 2: came on and she talked about like, and we've become

935
00:51:52,480 --> 00:51:56,000
Speaker 2: friends off camera, and she says, you know, freezing her eggs.

936
00:51:56,000 --> 00:51:59,400
Speaker 2: She felt shame because it made her feel like she

937
00:51:59,560 --> 00:52:01,600
Speaker 2: wasn't gonna get it right or whatever. You know. Yah,

938
00:52:02,200 --> 00:52:05,640
Speaker 2: and Ashanti just married Nellie and just had her first

939
00:52:05,719 --> 00:52:08,440
Speaker 2: child at forty three, and she frozen her eggs. When

940
00:52:08,480 --> 00:52:10,239
Speaker 2: they were broken up, She's like, I didn't even know

941
00:52:10,400 --> 00:52:13,360
Speaker 2: he would we were rekindled, but she knew she possibly

942
00:52:13,440 --> 00:52:16,640
Speaker 2: wanted this part, but she felt shame. Right, so much

943
00:52:16,719 --> 00:52:20,640
Speaker 2: shame attached to this, right we are in this. You know.

944
00:52:21,320 --> 00:52:23,800
Speaker 2: I have a girlfriend that I love dearly, and she

945
00:52:24,000 --> 00:52:26,000
Speaker 2: one day said to me with shame, and I could

946
00:52:26,000 --> 00:52:28,040
Speaker 2: hear in her voice, I never want to be a mom,

947
00:52:28,840 --> 00:52:31,520
Speaker 2: she said, Tam, And it's not in me. I haven't

948
00:52:31,520 --> 00:52:33,319
Speaker 2: had any trauma. I had a great mom, I had

949
00:52:33,320 --> 00:52:37,320
Speaker 2: a great day. I just I don't want it, okay,

950
00:52:38,040 --> 00:52:41,360
Speaker 2: And I said, okay, right, you know, And that's so

951
00:52:42,000 --> 00:52:44,520
Speaker 2: there's so much shame was surrounded with you do or

952
00:52:44,600 --> 00:52:45,120
Speaker 2: you don't.

953
00:52:45,280 --> 00:52:45,400
Speaker 1: Right.

954
00:52:46,239 --> 00:52:52,319
Speaker 2: So for me, I have become more aware of womanhood

955
00:52:52,520 --> 00:52:57,600
Speaker 2: and motherhood being two different journeys, and supporting my female

956
00:52:57,680 --> 00:53:03,320
Speaker 2: friends on the womanhood journey and understanding that my motherhood

957
00:53:03,360 --> 00:53:08,279
Speaker 2: journey means something to my other friends. And so I

958
00:53:08,360 --> 00:53:10,359
Speaker 2: guess I'm in that space now. But when I look

959
00:53:10,480 --> 00:53:14,200
Speaker 2: at the parent I am now and I look at

960
00:53:14,200 --> 00:53:18,520
Speaker 2: the age I am now, I think again, it's like

961
00:53:18,600 --> 00:53:21,080
Speaker 2: that book, don't sweat the small stuff. I think I've

962
00:53:21,080 --> 00:53:26,040
Speaker 2: had enough time to know the bull. I don't things

963
00:53:26,120 --> 00:53:31,440
Speaker 2: out frazzle me as much as they used to. I

964
00:53:31,560 --> 00:53:33,800
Speaker 2: do care what people think. We all do to some degree,

965
00:53:33,880 --> 00:53:39,040
Speaker 2: but I have it in greater perspective of it. And

966
00:53:39,160 --> 00:53:41,600
Speaker 2: even you know, when I was writing this book, you know,

967
00:53:42,440 --> 00:53:44,800
Speaker 2: Harlem Honey, really was not me saying, let me just

968
00:53:44,840 --> 00:53:46,640
Speaker 2: put my name on something so I can get a

969
00:53:46,719 --> 00:53:49,320
Speaker 2: check or d d da da dah. Right, thing to

970
00:53:49,440 --> 00:53:54,759
Speaker 2: me means something to me I have. I'll try not

971
00:53:54,880 --> 00:53:58,480
Speaker 2: to cry here. But the two oldest living relatives I

972
00:53:58,600 --> 00:54:07,520
Speaker 2: have are both and they're in their chapters perhaps of goodbye.

973
00:54:09,920 --> 00:54:13,880
Speaker 2: It's an uncle who has been just a champion for

974
00:54:14,000 --> 00:54:18,920
Speaker 2: my mom and me. And it's my aunt who when

975
00:54:19,000 --> 00:54:22,360
Speaker 2: my mom's mom died when she was ten, I was

976
00:54:22,480 --> 00:54:25,920
Speaker 2: much older. She's much older than my mom, and my

977
00:54:26,040 --> 00:54:28,560
Speaker 2: mother tells the story of her bringing her clothes, you know,

978
00:54:28,719 --> 00:54:31,200
Speaker 2: to get ready to go to school in and being

979
00:54:31,239 --> 00:54:33,000
Speaker 2: a big sister but also a mother figure at the

980
00:54:33,040 --> 00:54:35,160
Speaker 2: same time. So it's our patriarch and our matriarch of

981
00:54:35,200 --> 00:54:39,040
Speaker 2: our family. And my mom is down a few days

982
00:54:39,040 --> 00:54:41,480
Speaker 2: from seventy five, and she said, yeah one day, and

983
00:54:41,560 --> 00:54:43,600
Speaker 2: she's very virile. She's go on her cruises and all

984
00:54:43,640 --> 00:54:46,080
Speaker 2: this sudden stuff. But she says to me, it goes

985
00:54:46,160 --> 00:54:52,120
Speaker 2: so fast. I knew her at nineteen. I knew when

986
00:54:52,160 --> 00:54:55,880
Speaker 2: she was a baby who sat out on this adventure

987
00:54:56,880 --> 00:55:00,799
Speaker 2: and this journey with faith and belief that she could

988
00:55:00,920 --> 00:55:04,000
Speaker 2: somehow figure out this better life for her and her kid.

989
00:55:05,040 --> 00:55:08,040
Speaker 2: And I'm the result of that. And so now at

990
00:55:08,960 --> 00:55:13,239
Speaker 2: fifty four, you know, I don't say this to chastise

991
00:55:13,320 --> 00:55:15,880
Speaker 2: the youth or to imply that they don't know or

992
00:55:16,000 --> 00:55:18,640
Speaker 2: you don't know. My nephew's twenty seventy calls for advice

993
00:55:18,640 --> 00:55:22,040
Speaker 2: all the time. He's like my kid. But you know,

994
00:55:22,160 --> 00:55:25,840
Speaker 2: it goes fast. And when you can learn that a

995
00:55:25,920 --> 00:55:29,960
Speaker 2: lot of the crap that people tell you really doesn't matter.

996
00:55:31,719 --> 00:55:33,600
Speaker 1: It is the fills up a lot of headspace.

997
00:55:33,719 --> 00:55:37,520
Speaker 2: Though it fills up the head until it prevents. Creativity

998
00:55:38,400 --> 00:55:41,759
Speaker 2: blocks you from love, sometimes blocks you from loving yourself.

999
00:55:42,480 --> 00:55:46,360
Speaker 2: Oh yeah, it sometimes blocks you from just living your life.

1000
00:55:47,640 --> 00:55:50,160
Speaker 2: And I have an eighteen year old niece who are

1001
00:55:50,200 --> 00:55:54,080
Speaker 2: a door and she'll probably see this interview and wag

1002
00:55:54,160 --> 00:55:55,799
Speaker 2: her finger at me, but she's, you know, I love

1003
00:55:55,880 --> 00:55:58,080
Speaker 2: this kid, and she's not sure what she wants to do,

1004
00:55:58,520 --> 00:56:00,600
Speaker 2: you know, And everybody's like you gotta do it, gotta that,

1005
00:56:00,719 --> 00:56:02,920
Speaker 2: gotta do this, it's gotta do that, gotta it, and

1006
00:56:03,040 --> 00:56:06,600
Speaker 2: it's like set aside your social media, it's just societal

1007
00:56:06,760 --> 00:56:10,160
Speaker 2: pressures like to tell you gotta figure all of this

1008
00:56:10,360 --> 00:56:11,759
Speaker 2: out by eighteen.

1009
00:56:13,239 --> 00:56:16,480
Speaker 1: What it's ludicrous. I feel you because my daughter, my

1010
00:56:16,520 --> 00:56:19,840
Speaker 1: youngest daughter, is eighteen, and I feel there's so much pressure.

1011
00:56:20,080 --> 00:56:23,200
Speaker 2: It's so unfair. And I know we can point a

1012
00:56:23,239 --> 00:56:25,800
Speaker 2: straight line to social media, but even before then, you know,

1013
00:56:25,880 --> 00:56:27,960
Speaker 2: people like gotta go to college, gotta get into gotta

1014
00:56:28,000 --> 00:56:30,160
Speaker 2: get if you don't, and then if you and then

1015
00:56:30,800 --> 00:56:32,800
Speaker 2: you do all that at eighteen, and then by forty

1016
00:56:33,120 --> 00:56:35,879
Speaker 2: it's like, okay, now you got a whole another It's

1017
00:56:35,880 --> 00:56:39,160
Speaker 2: like we just fill our headspace with this stuff. And

1018
00:56:39,320 --> 00:56:41,920
Speaker 2: so being Michelle Obama was on my show one day.

1019
00:56:42,000 --> 00:56:44,520
Speaker 2: She was talking about menopause and she said, you know,

1020
00:56:44,960 --> 00:56:48,920
Speaker 2: it's a blessing to get that far, you know, right right,

1021
00:56:49,840 --> 00:56:52,480
Speaker 2: you know. And so whether it's that change in life

1022
00:56:52,960 --> 00:56:59,520
Speaker 2: or the change that allows you to recognize that if

1023
00:56:59,560 --> 00:57:02,520
Speaker 2: you can some your headspace with the views of others,

1024
00:57:02,640 --> 00:57:08,240
Speaker 2: you will never find your path. That takes time. Because

1025
00:57:08,760 --> 00:57:11,719
Speaker 2: age I didn't have twenty said, I thought I did.

1026
00:57:12,200 --> 00:57:14,400
Speaker 2: I didn't know anything, and I'm okay that I didn't.

1027
00:57:14,960 --> 00:57:18,360
Speaker 2: I'm okay that I did not know how dangerous it

1028
00:57:18,560 --> 00:57:20,840
Speaker 2: was to drive one thy five hundred and twenty eight

1029
00:57:20,920 --> 00:57:24,480
Speaker 2: miles with a dog and a map by myself. I'm

1030
00:57:24,520 --> 00:57:28,200
Speaker 2: okay with not knowing that right deadline crime at the time.

1031
00:57:28,400 --> 00:57:31,280
Speaker 2: I don't even like girls stay home, you know. It's

1032
00:57:31,440 --> 00:57:35,560
Speaker 2: there's a certain amount of fearlessness that comes with I

1033
00:57:35,680 --> 00:57:42,480
Speaker 2: think fearlessness in the twenties springs perspective, I guess for

1034
00:57:42,640 --> 00:57:43,520
Speaker 2: me in the fifties.

1035
00:57:44,320 --> 00:57:47,320
Speaker 1: I think that's a big part of it. Like we're

1036
00:57:47,360 --> 00:57:50,160
Speaker 1: able to step back, like you said, and like kind

1037
00:57:50,200 --> 00:57:54,560
Speaker 1: of widen the scope, like really widen and see it

1038
00:57:54,640 --> 00:57:57,640
Speaker 1: all and also just really see our journey and have

1039
00:57:57,840 --> 00:58:02,920
Speaker 1: such this immense gratitude for the journey that we've been on.

1040
00:58:03,840 --> 00:58:07,200
Speaker 1: And I think that just creates such a piece And

1041
00:58:07,280 --> 00:58:10,920
Speaker 1: I I mean, we all know that leading with gratitude

1042
00:58:10,960 --> 00:58:14,320
Speaker 1: every morning, thinking about what we're grateful for is going

1043
00:58:14,400 --> 00:58:15,960
Speaker 1: to set you up for success for the rest of

1044
00:58:16,040 --> 00:58:19,480
Speaker 1: the day. But this is just like full circle life,

1045
00:58:20,320 --> 00:58:22,040
Speaker 1: coming back to great gratitude.

1046
00:58:22,880 --> 00:58:24,600
Speaker 2: I love that, and that's what I try to do.

1047
00:58:24,760 --> 00:58:27,880
Speaker 2: You know, before I get out of bed, I literally

1048
00:58:27,960 --> 00:58:30,200
Speaker 2: will lie in bed and I want my first thoughts

1049
00:58:30,280 --> 00:58:34,520
Speaker 2: to be gratitude. I want the first thing that I

1050
00:58:35,400 --> 00:58:40,840
Speaker 2: say in my brain right is something that is positive

1051
00:58:41,040 --> 00:58:46,720
Speaker 2: and grateful and an opportunity to start it that way

1052
00:58:47,040 --> 00:58:50,680
Speaker 2: versus some negativity about myself. You know, they always say

1053
00:58:50,720 --> 00:58:52,320
Speaker 2: you say things to yourself you would never say to

1054
00:58:52,440 --> 00:58:55,680
Speaker 2: someone else. You know, I want to start my day.

1055
00:58:55,760 --> 00:58:58,640
Speaker 2: It's like, it's you know, the second best thing is

1056
00:58:58,720 --> 00:59:02,280
Speaker 2: coffee for me, right, It's like I need that that

1057
00:59:02,840 --> 00:59:07,360
Speaker 2: thought of gratitude, and it's and maybe when you're you know, younger,

1058
00:59:07,440 --> 00:59:09,360
Speaker 2: you kind of think, Okay, this is what they're saying

1059
00:59:09,400 --> 00:59:13,920
Speaker 2: because they've had successful lives or My mother again, was

1060
00:59:13,960 --> 00:59:16,280
Speaker 2: a nineteen year old single mother, and I believe she

1061
00:59:16,480 --> 00:59:19,960
Speaker 2: got to where she is now and raised the child

1062
00:59:20,560 --> 00:59:23,080
Speaker 2: that I am as an adult is because she led

1063
00:59:23,120 --> 00:59:26,160
Speaker 2: with gratitude. And that wasn't fame, that wasn't fortune, that

1064
00:59:26,280 --> 00:59:29,080
Speaker 2: was doubts. She could have led with shame, she could

1065
00:59:29,120 --> 00:59:32,280
Speaker 2: have led with you know, y means, she could have

1066
00:59:32,440 --> 00:59:37,520
Speaker 2: led with fear. But she grew up in a town

1067
00:59:38,720 --> 00:59:41,360
Speaker 2: where we didn't get a paved street until the eighties.

1068
00:59:42,360 --> 00:59:46,840
Speaker 2: You know, she didn't have these things. But she had gratitude.

1069
00:59:46,920 --> 00:59:50,760
Speaker 2: So that is not it's not owned by a race,

1070
00:59:50,880 --> 00:59:53,280
Speaker 2: it's not owned by a gender. It's not owned by

1071
00:59:53,360 --> 00:59:59,360
Speaker 2: one socioeconomic group. It is afforded to us all. And

1072
00:59:59,760 --> 01:00:03,880
Speaker 2: I I think the best of the journey is when

1073
01:00:03,960 --> 01:00:06,680
Speaker 2: you can fight the noise and lead.

1074
01:00:06,640 --> 01:00:11,000
Speaker 1: With that yes so true, before I let you go

1075
01:00:11,160 --> 01:00:13,960
Speaker 1: tammeron hall. What was your last I choose me moment?

1076
01:00:14,840 --> 01:00:17,560
Speaker 2: Oh, that's a great one. Oh my last I choose

1077
01:00:17,760 --> 01:00:23,040
Speaker 2: me moment? Oh it was this morning. So yesterday I

1078
01:00:23,200 --> 01:00:25,560
Speaker 2: had a very early morning and I had a very

1079
01:00:25,600 --> 01:00:28,840
Speaker 2: intimidating thing that I had to face, and it took

1080
01:00:28,880 --> 01:00:32,480
Speaker 2: a lot of I actually that shy kid and me

1081
01:00:32,560 --> 01:00:35,000
Speaker 2: showed up yesterday and I had to deal with her

1082
01:00:35,120 --> 01:00:38,880
Speaker 2: and do this event that I wasn't prepared for telling me.

1083
01:00:39,400 --> 01:00:41,560
Speaker 2: So this morning, when it was time to wake up

1084
01:00:41,680 --> 01:00:45,880
Speaker 2: and get my son ready for school, I fought mom

1085
01:00:46,040 --> 01:00:49,400
Speaker 2: guilt as if one morning of not getting him ready

1086
01:00:49,600 --> 01:00:52,240
Speaker 2: versus his dad was going to somehow change the trajectory

1087
01:00:52,280 --> 01:00:56,800
Speaker 2: of his entire life. And I laid in bed and

1088
01:00:56,960 --> 01:00:59,040
Speaker 2: I did it. Get up, and I let my husband

1089
01:00:59,120 --> 01:01:01,640
Speaker 2: warm the care at my And not that he wouldn't,

1090
01:01:02,120 --> 01:01:05,520
Speaker 2: but sometimes even when he's willing to will when he

1091
01:01:05,680 --> 01:01:08,320
Speaker 2: does do it, and he does it every morning with me,

1092
01:01:08,840 --> 01:01:11,120
Speaker 2: but I feel guilty fight when out there, like if

1093
01:01:11,120 --> 01:01:13,640
Speaker 2: I'm not you know, right, give me the kiss, you know.

1094
01:01:13,920 --> 01:01:16,920
Speaker 2: And I was like, my kid knows he loves me

1095
01:01:17,240 --> 01:01:19,240
Speaker 2: and I love him, and I'm going to stay in

1096
01:01:19,280 --> 01:01:22,520
Speaker 2: this bin. Have a good day, kiddo.

1097
01:01:23,040 --> 01:01:25,720
Speaker 1: Oh my god, that's a good one. Just stay in bed.

1098
01:01:27,160 --> 01:01:29,160
Speaker 2: I stayed in bed and it was delicious and it

1099
01:01:29,280 --> 01:01:31,840
Speaker 2: was great. And now he is home and I can

1100
01:01:31,920 --> 01:01:33,920
Speaker 2: hear him and we'll go to taekwondo and then I'm

1101
01:01:33,920 --> 01:01:35,720
Speaker 2: going to drop him at taekwondo and then go to

1102
01:01:35,760 --> 01:01:39,080
Speaker 2: dinner with my husband. But yeah, yeah I did, because

1103
01:01:39,120 --> 01:01:42,040
Speaker 2: he's We fight that, right, We fight the fear of

1104
01:01:42,720 --> 01:01:45,440
Speaker 2: this light thing that I do will somehow spell irel

1105
01:01:45,480 --> 01:01:47,680
Speaker 2: into my kid having a horrible life. That's just not true.

1106
01:01:47,920 --> 01:01:49,880
Speaker 2: And I didn't do it. So I chose that. I

1107
01:01:50,040 --> 01:01:52,040
Speaker 2: chose shows me to stay in the bin.

1108
01:01:52,200 --> 01:01:53,600
Speaker 1: Yeah, you needed to refuel.

1109
01:01:53,960 --> 01:01:56,840
Speaker 2: I did. I needed in and it felt great. Well.

1110
01:01:57,120 --> 01:01:59,080
Speaker 1: I love talking to you. Thank you so much for

1111
01:01:59,200 --> 01:02:02,040
Speaker 1: being on the pod, Jem, and I'm always here for

1112
01:02:02,120 --> 01:02:03,120
Speaker 1: you if you need a guest.

1113
01:02:03,800 --> 01:02:09,320
Speaker 2: Oh, well done. Well if we start practicing, because I'm calling, yes, Paul.

1114
01:02:09,880 --> 01:02:11,520
Speaker 2: They've never seen this coming.

1115
01:02:11,680 --> 01:02:17,400
Speaker 1: Two first chairs. Come on, have a great anniversary and

1116
01:02:17,640 --> 01:02:18,680
Speaker 1: have fun at Taekwondo.

1117
01:02:19,200 --> 01:02:20,320
Speaker 2: I love you and thank you for the coming.

1118
01:02:20,360 --> 01:02:21,120
Speaker 1: Thank you so much.

1119
01:02:21,160 --> 01:02:22,320
Speaker 2: I love you too. Bye.