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Speaker 1: Fresh episode of Fish Fights.

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Speaker 2: Eli Sussman here, I'm the managing editor of Fish Strips,

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Speaker 2: and this is supposed to be a very slow patch

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Speaker 2: on the contint calendar. The Marlins were eliminated from the

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Speaker 2: postseason a week and a half ago, and then we

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Speaker 2: got another week and a half until the full blown

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Speaker 2: MLB off season really begins, So we're in a bit

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Speaker 2: of a limbo right now. Meanwhile, the World Series is

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Speaker 2: on deck, Tua just made his NFL debut, We're about

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Speaker 2: to have a presidential election. There's other stuff going on

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Speaker 2: outside of the Marlins, and thankfully we've got a little

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Speaker 2: bit of a distraction to pull us back into this

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Speaker 2: Marlins conversation even in this current dead period, because the

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Speaker 2: Marlins found a way to thrust themselves into the spotlight

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Speaker 2: on Sunday morning with the announcement that Michael Hill, longtime

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Speaker 2: president of baseball Operations, is gone. He's out of that

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Speaker 2: role after seven plus years and after nineteen seasons in

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Speaker 2: the Marlins organization. It's not a total surprise, I would say,

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Speaker 2: but certainly a bombshell development that puts a new priority

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Speaker 2: on the off season shopping list to fill that void

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Speaker 2: in the front office. Alex Krutchik from the Fish Strip

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Speaker 2: staff is joining me on this episode to react to

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Speaker 2: that and to review what happens with Mike Hill in

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Speaker 2: charge over the last handful of years. You would hope

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Speaker 2: that a lot of factors went into the decision, but

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Speaker 2: ultimately Alex Hill was a holdover from the Jeffrey Loriie

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Speaker 2: of Marlins era, and across the board, Derek Jeter has

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Speaker 2: been pretty consistent with his desire to bring in his

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Speaker 2: own people to shape the future of the franchise.

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Speaker 3: Right, Yeah, Elijah, thanks for having me on. By the way,

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Speaker 3: it's one of those things where it's surprising as to

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Speaker 3: win it happened. You know, you saw one of the

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Speaker 3: first front office moves that and that Jeter made with

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Speaker 3: Bruce Sherman when he first got off here in twenty seventeen,

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Speaker 3: was fired David Samson and a couple of other front

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Speaker 3: office kind of advisors Jeff Conin and Jack McKeon, guys

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Speaker 3: like that, and it's surprising that out of all the people,

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Speaker 3: Mike Hill was the one that stayed. But these last

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Speaker 3: three years, I've been pretty impressed with what Mike Hill

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Speaker 3: has been able to do when he doesn't have Jeff

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Speaker 3: Lauria and David Samson breathing down his neck. So the

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Speaker 3: fact that they waited until now they make their first

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Speaker 3: playoff appearance in seventeen years, now they decide to let

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Speaker 3: him go.

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Speaker 1: It's it's a rough look.

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Speaker 2: I mean, there's no doubt about it, and I guess

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Speaker 2: it took people more by surprise. They were outside Marlon's bubble,

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Speaker 2: but like even us in here, because first postseason appearance

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Speaker 2: in seventeen years, you know, came with the caveat that

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Speaker 2: shortened season, and it took an expanded playoffs for them

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Speaker 2: to get in technically the number six seed but normally

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Speaker 2: just five.

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Speaker 1: Teams in the National League.

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Speaker 2: And as we're going to get into you never know

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Speaker 2: exactly how much Mike Hill himself was involved in these decisions.

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Speaker 2: But yes, as I was mentioned to you before we

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Speaker 2: started getting recording cheater and that ownership group took over

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Speaker 2: three years ago, and at that time, Mike Hill had

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Speaker 2: three years left on his contract that was ready in place,

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Speaker 2: signed by Lauria, And we don't have a precise figure

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Speaker 2: about exactly how much he was making, but apparently substantial

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Speaker 2: enough that they didn't want all that to go to waste,

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Speaker 2: They still wanted him as part of the decision making

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Speaker 2: process and had his voice in that room, And I

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Speaker 2: mean they kept him involved for some of the most

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Speaker 2: important moves in franchise history when they were tearing down

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Speaker 2: that old score, when it started with Stanton coming off

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Speaker 2: one of the best individual seasons in franchise history and Yelich.

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Speaker 2: How much value Yelich had at that time given the

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Speaker 2: contract that he was on, and Ozuna coming off a

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Speaker 2: career year and real Muto coming off a career year

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Speaker 2: when he was traded. I mean, those were hugely critical

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Speaker 2: moves that Hill was involved in. And Hill was the

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Speaker 2: one front and center that was explaining all the moves publicly.

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Speaker 2: He was the one defending these moves. He was the

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Speaker 2: one doing the like line's share of the actual public

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Speaker 2: appearances like trying to justify it. And so I don't

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Speaker 2: think he can blame the public feeling that he was

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Speaker 2: right in the middle of all this and therefore, once

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Speaker 2: this thing has now turned the corner to some extent

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Speaker 2: and they were able to make the postseason that he

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Speaker 2: was a guy you thought would get like a lot

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Speaker 2: of credit and be really involved with that, and it's

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Speaker 2: apparently not. I mean, the statement that came out on

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Speaker 2: Sunday about the decision was pretty brief. Jeter held like

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Speaker 2: this really impromptu press conference, and I guess he was

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Speaker 2: courteous overall about Mike Hill, but didn't exactly go over

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Speaker 2: the top to make this seem like a I think

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Speaker 2: it was clear reading between the lines that this is

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Speaker 2: more so you know, the organization's decision, Like if we

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Speaker 2: were going to say, what they were hoping is that

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Speaker 2: we would treat this as like a mutual parting of ways.

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Speaker 2: But I mean, at least my read on it is

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Speaker 2: that Mike Hill would have been fine sticking around with

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Speaker 2: the same place he's been the left two decades, and

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Speaker 2: that it was more of the team that was kind

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Speaker 2: of turning the page on him.

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Speaker 3: Yeah, based on things that I was hearing, there was

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Speaker 3: mutual interest between them, but it seems like they just

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Speaker 3: couldn't agree on a price tag, which doesn't surprise me

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Speaker 3: considering they've done. Mattingly also had to take a pay

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Speaker 3: cut when he got extended last year.

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Speaker 1: Yeah, that's something I brought up.

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Speaker 2: I think with those the numbers are a little bit

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Speaker 2: more particular, where he was earning like two and a

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Speaker 2: half million dollars a year under his previous contract, and

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Speaker 2: they lowered that to two half a million dollar pay

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Speaker 2: cut for a guy to retain his job, which is

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Speaker 2: just highly unusual. But I mean with him at the

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Speaker 2: time of that deal, they were coming off one hundred.

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Speaker 1: And five losses.

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Speaker 2: They didn't have really any momentum, but they aired on

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Speaker 2: the side of continuity, and I mean that's the one

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Speaker 2: where that you really associate with a lot of these

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Speaker 2: successful franchises that they've continuity at the most important positions

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Speaker 2: in their organization. And of course when new ownership came in,

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Speaker 2: they turned the page on most of the former employees

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Speaker 2: at one time, but they had Mike Hill hanging along.

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Speaker 2: And when he was hanging along after that initial transition,

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Speaker 2: you were hopeful that was about more than just the contract,

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Speaker 2: that they actually valued him and actually saw him as

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Speaker 2: a fit with their whole methodology and their process and

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Speaker 2: their collaborative environment. And so now it leaves like this

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Speaker 2: pretty big void that We're going to get into that

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Speaker 2: a little bit later, but I want to spend most

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Speaker 2: of this episode now is looking at the best and

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Speaker 2: the worst of the Mike Hill era, and there is

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Speaker 2: going to be a lot more bad than good, because,

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Speaker 2: of course, prior to this past season, the Marlins with

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Speaker 2: Mike Hill as the president of baseball Operations, we had

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Speaker 2: seven seasons of that he took over at the end

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Speaker 2: of twenty thirteen. He took over, replacing Larry Beinfest for

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Speaker 2: that top row in the front office, and they, of

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Speaker 2: course were under five hundred for every year of that

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Speaker 2: until this sixty game season where they were able to

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Speaker 2: sneak over that and make it into the postseason. But

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Speaker 2: for the most part, it was a frustrating era, one

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Speaker 2: where they continued to hit this wall, specifically one where

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Speaker 2: they never seem to have quite enough starting pitching, and

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Speaker 2: it squandered a lot of the great star caliber position

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Speaker 2: players they had available on an everyday basis, And of

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Speaker 2: course they had a tragedy right in the middle of

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Speaker 2: that tenure that was frankly would have been impossible for

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Speaker 2: almost any other small market franchise to overcome. And so,

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Speaker 2: I mean, the importance to that can't be overstated. But

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Speaker 2: we're going to focus on the stuff that he can

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Speaker 2: control that well, to some extent, that Mike Kill can control,

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Speaker 2: And as we're going to keep reiterating, we don't know

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Speaker 2: exactly how much control Mike had in this situation, because Lauria,

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Speaker 2: one of the reasons why his tenure was considered so

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Speaker 2: frustrating and disappointing is that he was someone that meddled

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Speaker 2: in these Baseball operations decisions. He's the one that had

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Speaker 2: certain preferences that he fancied himself an expert in this area,

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Speaker 2: and of course he ultimately had control over the spending,

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Speaker 2: and his spending habits were very inconsistent, and I'd say,

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Speaker 2: for the most part, tend to be a little air

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Speaker 2: on the side of greediness and not exactly investing, especially

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Speaker 2: in certain areas we're supposed to invest in to build

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Speaker 2: a sustainable organization. So we're not going to pin all

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Speaker 2: this stuff on Mike Hill, for better or worse, but

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Speaker 2: we did want to go through, you know, the key

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Speaker 2: moves that the front office made and how they shaped

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Speaker 2: the teams that we've been watching over the last seven seasons.

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Speaker 2: As we've talked about before recording, I'd said, a bad

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Speaker 2: outweighs a good by quite a lot. I handle the bad,

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Speaker 2: you're handling the good, and we're going to go alternating

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Speaker 2: with one good move then two bad moves, one good move,

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Speaker 2: too bad moves, and well of some cross talk in

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Speaker 2: between if in case we've missed anything too obvious in there.

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Speaker 2: But we're going to start on a bright note, and

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Speaker 2: one of the positive moves that Mike Hill made during

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Speaker 2: his tenure, go with anyone you want that really sticks

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Speaker 2: out as something that they did on the transaction side

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Speaker 2: that made the team better than it would have been

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Speaker 2: if they just stood that.

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Speaker 3: I'm going to go all the way back to twenty

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Speaker 3: fifteen for this, the acquisition of d Gordon. It was

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Speaker 3: one of the only positive trades in my opinion, that

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Speaker 3: Hill made while still working under the Lauria and Sampson regime.

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Speaker 3: Gordon comes to Miami immediately contributes in such a way

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Speaker 3: that Miami hadn't seen in a long time. He was

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Speaker 3: an everyday leadoff hitter, consistent pretty much every night. He

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Speaker 3: was an anchor at second base. His first season in Miami,

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Speaker 3: he gets selected to the All Star Game, wins the

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Speaker 3: Gold Glove the Silver Slugger. His batting average, is on

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Speaker 3: base percentage, slugging percentage, and OPS with Miami were all

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Speaker 3: higher than any other team that he was with his

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Speaker 3: entire career. The three years that he was in Miami,

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Speaker 3: it was the prime of his career. Not to mention

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Speaker 3: that also during the three years he was here, the

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Speaker 3: Marlins as a team were in the top ten in

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Speaker 3: batting average all three of those years, and in two

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Speaker 3: of those three years they were in the top five.

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Speaker 3: So just as a side note, that same trade is

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Speaker 3: what brought Miguel Rojas to the Marlins from the Dodger Right.

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Speaker 2: I mean, nobody was paying attention to Nicky row when

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Speaker 2: he was in that trade. Uh he had that one

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Speaker 2: like brief rookie call up with the Dodgers before that,

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Speaker 2: and uh, yeah, de was. He had plenty of Major

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Speaker 2: League ten with the Dodgers, but he just was not

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Speaker 2: that same kind of hitter that he would be. He

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Speaker 2: totally broke out, like as soon as that trade happens.

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Speaker 2: And yeah, I mean not just like a great player,

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Speaker 2: but like one of the most marketable players on the team.

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Speaker 2: And I mean there's a brief stretch in there where

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Speaker 2: he was like one of the more dynamic players in

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Speaker 2: the whole league, just for who he was personally. Gordon

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Speaker 2: Strokes at right center field, that's in the game.

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Speaker 3: That's little store too.

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Speaker 2: D Truck scores each little scores. Marlins could probably bring

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Speaker 2: him back like a minor league deal if they wanted to,

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Speaker 2: because of how much things have changed ever since he left.

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Speaker 1: But we're gonna have the transition to the negative side.

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Speaker 1: One of the many, many.

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Speaker 2: Moves that I wanted to get into here, and yeah,

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Speaker 2: these are in no particular order, but I wanted to

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Speaker 2: go with one that was towards the very very beginning

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Speaker 2: of him taking over as president of Baseball Ops. He

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Speaker 2: took over at the end of the twenty thirteen season,

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Speaker 2: and the first big free agent deal that he gave

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Speaker 2: out was to Jared Saltaamachia three years about twenty one

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Speaker 2: million dollars to be the franchise catcher. Salty was coming

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Speaker 2: off a pretty big year with the Red Sox as

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Speaker 2: the catcher on the World Series championship team. So it

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Speaker 2: was a pretty classic example of a guy getting a

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Speaker 2: huge boost from being in the playoffs and being right

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Speaker 2: in the middle of a team that went deep into

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Speaker 2: the playoffs. And he had to be fair, he had

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Speaker 2: a little bit of a track record before that too,

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Speaker 2: a couple of years prior to that, where he was

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Speaker 2: like a solidly average hitter in those years, like good power,

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Speaker 2: but he just didn't get on base at all. And

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Speaker 2: the question with him was his defense. You know, how

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Speaker 2: he handled his pitching staff. He had some pretty inconsistent

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Speaker 2: performance when it came to throwing out runners and all

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Speaker 2: that just fell right off a cliff, Like as soon

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Speaker 2: as he came to the Marlins.

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Speaker 1: He was supposed to be their primary catcher.

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Speaker 2: Of course, from twenty fourteen on, supposed to be a

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Speaker 2: three year deal, and he barely made it into the

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Speaker 2: beginning of that second year before he was Fortunately, they

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Speaker 2: got very fortunate that they had JT. Realmuto in the system,

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Speaker 2: who was by the end of twenty fifteen he was

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Speaker 2: kind of ready to be catching every single day. But

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Speaker 2: that totally set them back in twenty fourteen and twenty fifteen.

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Speaker 2: And it's hard to like perfectly quantify, but I mean,

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Speaker 2: you got to think that the way that he was

248
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Speaker 2: handling that pitching staff, for what he didn't do to

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Speaker 2: handle that pitching staff in those couple of years, had

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Speaker 2: a lot to do with why some of the young

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Speaker 2: pitchers that they had at that time didn't really take off,

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Speaker 2: with the exception of course of Jose Fernandez. And so

253
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Speaker 2: that was A little bit of a tough luck is

254
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Speaker 2: that Jose had his Tommy John surgery pretty early into

255
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Speaker 2: that first year that Salt he was there, so outside

256
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Speaker 2: of him, there just were not a lot of quality

257
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Speaker 2: arms for Salt Lilamachi to work with. But I mean,

258
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Speaker 2: he struck out at such a ridiculous clip even by

259
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Speaker 2: those standards, and strikeout rates across the league got gone

260
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Speaker 2: up a lot since then, but at that time it

261
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Speaker 2: really stood out how much he was totally useless in

262
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Speaker 2: all these high leveraged situations, didn't get on base, and

263
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Speaker 2: his throwing issues like reached a whole other level where

264
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Speaker 2: he was throwing out twenty percent of attempted base dealers

265
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Speaker 2: sometimes less than that when the league averages is closer

266
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Speaker 2: to thirty.

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Speaker 1: And yeah, he's never.

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Speaker 2: Really been the same player ever since with his subsequent teams,

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Speaker 2: and at this moment, I think his career is pretty

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Speaker 2: much over. But all that money was guaranteed to him,

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Speaker 2: so I mean, good for him. It was a good

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Speaker 2: story at the time because he was from I think

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Speaker 2: West Palm Beach. He was swored of, you know, a

274
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Speaker 2: South Florida native. They kind of had that angle going on.

275
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Speaker 2: But he was a total flop, and that was a

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Speaker 2: year where they were trying to rebound from one hundred

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Speaker 2: losses in twenty thirteen, and they didn't rebound exactly the

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Speaker 2: way they thought or I mean, they had some nice

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Speaker 2: moments that first year, totally in spite of him, like

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Speaker 2: he really held him back, and that was a position that,

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Speaker 2: of course, they just didn't really fix until they had

282
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Speaker 2: real Muto come up from the farm system. And I'm

283
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Speaker 2: touching on a second one before flipping back to you,

284
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Speaker 2: because we're trying to get through all the worst moves

285
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Speaker 2: we can in a single episode. That a year after that,

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Speaker 2: in November twenty fourteen, this was one that they stayed

287
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Speaker 2: inside the organization, not getting a new player, but extending

288
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Speaker 2: one of their own. That was when they announced the

289
00:14:35,280 --> 00:14:38,760
Speaker 2: thirteen year, three hundred and twenty five million dollar Gean

290
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Speaker 2: Carlos Stanton extension. And Stanton was coming off a really

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Speaker 2: great twenty fourteenth season. He was a guy that was

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Speaker 2: in the MVP conversation back then for a good chunk

293
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Speaker 2: of the year before missing most of September with his injury,

294
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Speaker 2: and he was only entering his age twenty five season

295
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Speaker 2: and he was established as one of the best hitters

296
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Speaker 2: in the league, one of the most dynamic players in

297
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Speaker 2: the league, and someone that was getting pretty expensive because

298
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Speaker 2: of the skill set that he had and how much

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Speaker 2: power he was already hitting for at such a young age.

300
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Speaker 2: The Marlins were trying to buck that trends that people

301
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Speaker 2: were frustrated that they were trading away all their best players,

302
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Speaker 2: so they went on the total. They went to the

303
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Speaker 2: total opposite end of the spectrum and made sure not

304
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Speaker 2: just to sign him long term, but to like shatter

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Speaker 2: every record in the book.

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Speaker 1: I mean, this was.

307
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Speaker 2: Far and away the largest contract in North American sports

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Speaker 2: history at the time that it happened. It wasn't even close.

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Speaker 2: It just blew the Alex Rodriguez contracts out of the water,

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Speaker 2: and I think even to this point it's only been

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Speaker 2: topped by Mike Trout and Mookie Betts. But the thing

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Speaker 2: with Stanton is he had those durability concerns at the time,

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Speaker 2: and I think pretty immediately in twenty fifteen, he got

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Speaker 2: off to a great start before suffering another major lower

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Speaker 2: body injury that cost him a bunch of games, and

316
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Speaker 2: they gave him it was extremely backloaded, as you would

317
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Speaker 2: expect at the time because for a team that was

318
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Speaker 2: challenged about its revenue, that wasn't really thinking too far ahead.

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Speaker 2: They were going to underpay him those first few years

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Speaker 2: before really spiked into the twenty five million dollars thirty

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Speaker 2: million dollar average salary range, and they got a lucky

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Speaker 2: break that they were able to unload the contract at all.

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Speaker 2: I mean, it took him having one of the best

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Speaker 2: years in franchise history in twenty seventeen, actually winning that

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Speaker 2: MVP Award for them to convince the Yankees to take him.

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Speaker 2: But I mean they kind of buried themselves in a

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Speaker 2: corner with that. They were fighting too far back to

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Speaker 2: like try to get away from that reputation they had

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Speaker 2: as not being player friendly, of giving up on the

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Speaker 2: most popular players, and they went too far to this extreme,

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Speaker 2: Like they gave him a contract that was never going

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Speaker 2: to be good value that if not for that miraculous season,

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00:16:46,440 --> 00:16:48,680
Speaker 2: they weren't going to be able to move, and they

334
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Speaker 2: gave him a full no trade clause. A guy that

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Speaker 2: was twenty five years old and one that although was

336
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Speaker 2: a great player, wasn't necessarily at that top of the list.

337
00:16:57,200 --> 00:16:59,280
Speaker 2: Nobody was going to mistake him for Trout or another

338
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Speaker 2: totally indispensable part of the team, and they gave him

339
00:17:04,160 --> 00:17:07,560
Speaker 2: so much control over his situation, and ultimately that was

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Speaker 2: what set up the trade after twenty seventeen because of

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Speaker 2: how much money was still left over that final ten years,

342
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Speaker 2: and because of the no trade clause, they kind of

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Speaker 2: they didn't allow Mike kill Now under new ownership in

344
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Speaker 2: twenty seventeen, he didn't have There was no way out

345
00:17:24,840 --> 00:17:26,720
Speaker 2: of this to make There's no way to make that

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Speaker 2: exit anything but ugly, and they ended up getting not

347
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Speaker 2: very much in return. They're going to kick in a

348
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Speaker 2: little bit of that money to the Yankees on the

349
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Speaker 2: back end. And it was such an ugly ending to

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Speaker 2: a guy that was like one of the most beloved

351
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Speaker 2: and most productive players in franchise history. And the reason

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Speaker 2: why it ended so ugly was set up by this

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Speaker 2: extension that was signed about six years ago.

354
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Speaker 3: Yeah, it's kind of interesting. I would love to see

355
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Speaker 3: what the financial projections were for the future that Laurie

356
00:17:56,600 --> 00:17:59,440
Speaker 3: and Samson were looking at. Because I was in high

357
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Speaker 3: school at the I mean, I was very excited that

358
00:18:01,480 --> 00:18:05,600
Speaker 3: Stanton in theory was tied down to the Marlins for

359
00:18:05,600 --> 00:18:09,520
Speaker 3: a very long time, but even then the logical side

360
00:18:09,520 --> 00:18:11,280
Speaker 3: of me was like, where are the Marlins going to

361
00:18:11,280 --> 00:18:15,119
Speaker 3: pull this three hundred million dollars out and also be

362
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Speaker 3: able to sign other players to surround him.

363
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Speaker 2: Yeah, I'm going to dig up the clip and put

364
00:18:20,160 --> 00:18:22,800
Speaker 2: it in this pot episode when it goes out that

365
00:18:22,880 --> 00:18:25,480
Speaker 2: he's very careful with his words in the press conference.

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Speaker 1: You know, it's a thirteen year deal for.

367
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Speaker 2: All intents and purposes, a lifetime contract or it's supposed

368
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Speaker 2: to be. But he's very careful in the press conference,

369
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Speaker 2: not to say he's a Marlin for life, not to

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Speaker 2: say that he'll be here for thirteen years.

371
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Speaker 1: He says, I'm excited to be here for the foreseeable future.

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Speaker 4: This is for the city of Miami. This is for

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Speaker 4: newfound confidence and trust. And starting with me, my teammates

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Speaker 4: front office here, we're all in agreement. We need a

375
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Speaker 4: winning environment, a winning city, and this is one building

376
00:19:00,480 --> 00:19:05,119
Speaker 4: block towards a better future and a new way of

377
00:19:05,160 --> 00:19:07,399
Speaker 4: life down here in Miami. And I'm glad to be

378
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Speaker 4: here for my foreseeable future.

379
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Speaker 2: I think even he was a little suspicious of the

380
00:19:13,640 --> 00:19:17,000
Speaker 2: way that was going to work out, and of course

381
00:19:17,000 --> 00:19:19,560
Speaker 2: he had I should mention he had that opt out

382
00:19:19,600 --> 00:19:21,399
Speaker 2: in the contract too. You know, if he was going

383
00:19:21,480 --> 00:19:24,879
Speaker 2: to be after that twenty twenty season right now. Actually,

384
00:19:24,960 --> 00:19:27,679
Speaker 2: he had that opportunity to opt out if he stayed healthy,

385
00:19:27,800 --> 00:19:30,600
Speaker 2: if the free agent market was strong, and for.

386
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Speaker 1: A million different reasons.

387
00:19:31,520 --> 00:19:33,919
Speaker 2: Of course, of course he's not going to use that

388
00:19:34,000 --> 00:19:36,080
Speaker 2: opt out and he's going to stay with the the

389
00:19:36,119 --> 00:19:41,399
Speaker 2: Yankees another seven seven years. Yeah, So there's still no

390
00:19:41,480 --> 00:19:43,520
Speaker 2: light at the end of that contract, and thankfully most

391
00:19:43,640 --> 00:19:46,040
Speaker 2: most of it is now the Yankees problem now. But

392
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Speaker 2: cheer us up a little bit and give us another

393
00:19:48,800 --> 00:19:50,840
Speaker 2: positive move from the Michael Hill tenure.

394
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Speaker 3: So, speaking of that infamous outfield, pretty much one of

395
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Speaker 3: the first big trades of the junior era winter of

396
00:19:59,119 --> 00:20:03,480
Speaker 3: twenty seventeen, Marcelo Zuna gets traded. And it's weird because

397
00:20:03,480 --> 00:20:06,479
Speaker 3: I feel like Ozuna was the least sought out player

398
00:20:06,600 --> 00:20:09,280
Speaker 3: from that outfield that famously had Christian Yealich and John

399
00:20:09,320 --> 00:20:14,600
Speaker 3: Carlos Staton. But looking back, it yielded the best results

400
00:20:15,280 --> 00:20:19,040
Speaker 3: the centerpiece, Sandy al Contre. He was never seen as

401
00:20:19,040 --> 00:20:23,879
Speaker 3: an ace coming in from that trade, but that's pretty

402
00:20:23,920 --> 00:20:26,560
Speaker 3: much what he's been. He's rarely had a bad start,

403
00:20:27,280 --> 00:20:29,120
Speaker 3: and the Marlins get a lot of innings out of him,

404
00:20:29,160 --> 00:20:32,520
Speaker 3: and that's rare for a Don Mattingly team to have

405
00:20:32,560 --> 00:20:35,760
Speaker 3: a pitcher who consistently will get you through six or

406
00:20:35,800 --> 00:20:38,800
Speaker 3: seven innings each night. You've we've seen this year how

407
00:20:38,880 --> 00:20:41,520
Speaker 3: quickly all these players get yanked out of a game.

408
00:20:42,920 --> 00:20:46,000
Speaker 3: And then I also saw something interesting. His fielding independent

409
00:20:46,080 --> 00:20:49,040
Speaker 3: pitching is FIP. He's gone down every year since he's

410
00:20:49,040 --> 00:20:52,120
Speaker 3: been with Miami. He started at four point seventy five

411
00:20:52,200 --> 00:20:55,520
Speaker 3: in a limited sample size in twenty seventeen, then down

412
00:20:55,560 --> 00:20:59,440
Speaker 3: at four fifty five, and then three seventy one this year.

413
00:21:00,520 --> 00:21:03,159
Speaker 3: It's been three years since they've acquired him. He's already

414
00:21:03,200 --> 00:21:05,719
Speaker 3: made an All Star appearance, an opening day start, and

415
00:21:05,760 --> 00:21:09,000
Speaker 3: the ace on this year's playoff rotation. First playoff game,

416
00:21:09,040 --> 00:21:11,280
Speaker 3: he gives up just one run or six and two

417
00:21:11,320 --> 00:21:14,960
Speaker 3: thirds inning. And he's also not a free agent until

418
00:21:15,000 --> 00:21:19,160
Speaker 3: twenty twenty five. Also, shouldn't lose sight of the fact

419
00:21:19,200 --> 00:21:24,399
Speaker 3: that we also got Magnoris Sierra out of that trade,

420
00:21:24,440 --> 00:21:28,520
Speaker 3: which for a couple of years looked like it was

421
00:21:28,560 --> 00:21:31,920
Speaker 3: just kind of an afterthought, but we've seen this year

422
00:21:32,040 --> 00:21:34,879
Speaker 3: when he was healthy, he was a huge part of

423
00:21:34,920 --> 00:21:38,520
Speaker 3: that Marlins offense and defense too. Really, he used to

424
00:21:38,560 --> 00:21:41,760
Speaker 3: be a strikeout machine. He used to have no power,

425
00:21:42,119 --> 00:21:43,919
Speaker 3: and he still won't hit any home runs for you,

426
00:21:43,960 --> 00:21:46,359
Speaker 3: but he'll get a ball into the gap.

427
00:21:46,119 --> 00:21:49,359
Speaker 2: Now, And don't sleep on Zach Gallen as part of

428
00:21:49,359 --> 00:21:51,919
Speaker 2: that trade. Zach Allen was even like he was totally

429
00:21:51,960 --> 00:21:55,240
Speaker 2: buried under the Cardinals depth chart at the time, and

430
00:21:55,440 --> 00:21:57,600
Speaker 2: I think, frankly even the Marlins didn't think that much

431
00:21:57,640 --> 00:22:02,160
Speaker 2: of him until like twenty nineteen, and he just destroys

432
00:22:02,720 --> 00:22:05,679
Speaker 2: all of TRIPLEA for half a season. He pourses his

433
00:22:05,720 --> 00:22:08,960
Speaker 2: way up, he immediately performs, and they're able to flip

434
00:22:09,000 --> 00:22:11,120
Speaker 2: him for who they hope is now what they're shorts,

435
00:22:11,160 --> 00:22:13,400
Speaker 2: top of the future in jazz chism, or at least

436
00:22:13,400 --> 00:22:16,000
Speaker 2: their second base and on the present if nothing else.

437
00:22:16,640 --> 00:22:20,000
Speaker 2: And and Daniel Castano was like he was. He was

438
00:22:20,400 --> 00:22:22,359
Speaker 2: like the definition of a throw in piece.

439
00:22:22,520 --> 00:22:23,040
Speaker 1: Castano.

440
00:22:23,119 --> 00:22:28,760
Speaker 2: He was someone that I think even back then, fastball

441
00:22:28,800 --> 00:22:31,680
Speaker 2: topping out at like eighty eight eighty nine miles per hour,

442
00:22:32,480 --> 00:22:35,120
Speaker 2: someone that had decent results like in the lower levels

443
00:22:35,160 --> 00:22:37,280
Speaker 2: of the minor leagues, but there was just no expectation

444
00:22:37,359 --> 00:22:39,879
Speaker 2: of him being a major league pitcher. And yet his

445
00:22:40,000 --> 00:22:42,760
Speaker 2: numbers this year in the majors were almost as good

446
00:22:42,800 --> 00:22:45,920
Speaker 2: as Sandy's were. Nobody thinks he's going to sustain that necessarily.

447
00:22:46,080 --> 00:22:49,760
Speaker 2: I mean, he doesn't strike anybody out, relies a lot

448
00:22:49,800 --> 00:22:53,520
Speaker 2: on his defense, but I mean, for this particular, she didn't.

449
00:22:53,520 --> 00:22:55,320
Speaker 2: If nothing else, the fact they were able to get

450
00:22:55,359 --> 00:22:58,199
Speaker 2: like a good two months out of him at a

451
00:22:58,200 --> 00:23:02,320
Speaker 2: time when they're like rotation was totally decimated by of

452
00:23:02,359 --> 00:23:05,800
Speaker 2: course COVID related issues, and Castana was able to step

453
00:23:05,840 --> 00:23:08,600
Speaker 2: in there and do stuff, able to skip triple A

454
00:23:08,920 --> 00:23:11,960
Speaker 2: on his way up there and be like a contributing piece.

455
00:23:12,320 --> 00:23:15,520
Speaker 2: I mean, that's the one that totally caught me off guard,

456
00:23:15,560 --> 00:23:18,000
Speaker 2: even though someone that's really fixated on what's going on

457
00:23:18,040 --> 00:23:20,720
Speaker 2: in the minor leagues, like Cassano, he was the one

458
00:23:20,760 --> 00:23:22,440
Speaker 2: that I had totally written off as like a major

459
00:23:22,480 --> 00:23:25,280
Speaker 2: league contributor, and yet he came from that same trade.

460
00:23:25,720 --> 00:23:28,480
Speaker 2: On a somewhat related note, we need to look at,

461
00:23:28,720 --> 00:23:31,480
Speaker 2: of course, one of those other outfield trades, the one

462
00:23:31,520 --> 00:23:34,000
Speaker 2: that has not worked out nearly as well for the Marlins,

463
00:23:34,040 --> 00:23:35,560
Speaker 2: or I should say it has worked out a whole

464
00:23:35,600 --> 00:23:37,439
Speaker 2: lot better for the other team that he would to

465
00:23:37,520 --> 00:23:40,680
Speaker 2: that's going to be Christian Yelich, where just like Ozuna,

466
00:23:40,720 --> 00:23:43,040
Speaker 2: they got four players back in return. They got good

467
00:23:43,359 --> 00:23:46,960
Speaker 2: quantity in the deal, and frankly, at the time, I

468
00:23:47,000 --> 00:23:50,360
Speaker 2: got to admit that I was fairly pleased with it

469
00:23:50,400 --> 00:23:52,600
Speaker 2: because it seemed not only quantity, but a lot of

470
00:23:52,680 --> 00:23:56,200
Speaker 2: quality there, or at least some really high upside. Of course,

471
00:23:56,280 --> 00:24:01,160
Speaker 2: Brentson had that really perfect storyline heading into the trade,

472
00:24:01,160 --> 00:24:03,400
Speaker 2: and that he was someone that grew up a Marlins fan.

473
00:24:03,480 --> 00:24:05,920
Speaker 2: It's so hard to find that, at least for the moment,

474
00:24:06,000 --> 00:24:08,240
Speaker 2: among active major league players, the ones that are young

475
00:24:08,359 --> 00:24:11,960
Speaker 2: enough and actually willing to just stick with the team.

476
00:24:12,200 --> 00:24:14,399
Speaker 2: He was someone that was at the perfect age to

477
00:24:14,520 --> 00:24:18,080
Speaker 2: experienced the two thousand and three title idolized Jan Pierre,

478
00:24:18,840 --> 00:24:21,200
Speaker 2: took Juan Pierre's number when he got called up to

479
00:24:21,240 --> 00:24:25,919
Speaker 2: the Marlins, and he just it with him. It was

480
00:24:26,000 --> 00:24:29,679
Speaker 2: Monte Harrison, it was Is san Diez, it was Jordan Yamamoto.

481
00:24:29,760 --> 00:24:31,399
Speaker 2: At this point, we've seen all four of them in

482
00:24:31,440 --> 00:24:35,159
Speaker 2: the major leagues, and I guess Brentson is the one

483
00:24:35,200 --> 00:24:38,119
Speaker 2: that this past season, he was the one that he

484
00:24:38,200 --> 00:24:41,639
Speaker 2: finally saw some glimpses of what he's capable of, of

485
00:24:41,680 --> 00:24:43,800
Speaker 2: the power he's able to hit for I think I

486
00:24:43,800 --> 00:24:46,879
Speaker 2: thought his defense was better than ever this year. But

487
00:24:47,160 --> 00:24:48,639
Speaker 2: I mean, the bottom line is you look at his

488
00:24:48,680 --> 00:24:51,199
Speaker 2: career to date and he's hitting under two hundred. He

489
00:24:51,240 --> 00:24:53,680
Speaker 2: strikes out thirty percent of the time. He doesn't steal

490
00:24:53,720 --> 00:24:57,719
Speaker 2: bases Monte who steals all the bases and plays as

491
00:24:57,720 --> 00:24:59,960
Speaker 2: a great defense, but doesn't do anything else in the

492
00:25:00,040 --> 00:25:04,480
Speaker 2: played at this moment. Is it's a big long shot

493
00:25:04,480 --> 00:25:07,000
Speaker 2: for him to develop into like an everyday caliber player

494
00:25:07,040 --> 00:25:08,960
Speaker 2: just because he's not getting on base for the time being.

495
00:25:09,520 --> 00:25:11,640
Speaker 2: Is Antillez won the Minor League Player of the Year

496
00:25:11,720 --> 00:25:13,800
Speaker 2: and it has not translated at all since he got

497
00:25:13,800 --> 00:25:17,879
Speaker 2: called up in twenty nineteen. And Jordan Yamamoto was a

498
00:25:17,920 --> 00:25:21,400
Speaker 2: really feel good rookie in twenty nineteen at the very

499
00:25:21,440 --> 00:25:23,800
Speaker 2: start of his career, but he faded as the year

500
00:25:23,800 --> 00:25:27,000
Speaker 2: went on. And he, I mean, he had like a

501
00:25:27,000 --> 00:25:30,639
Speaker 2: forgettable summer if there ever was one. Just he was

502
00:25:30,640 --> 00:25:33,080
Speaker 2: in the middle of the twenty nine to nine game

503
00:25:33,160 --> 00:25:35,359
Speaker 2: that they lost the Braves. And you don't want to

504
00:25:35,400 --> 00:25:38,359
Speaker 2: overreact too much to a tiny sample size, but I

505
00:25:38,400 --> 00:25:40,320
Speaker 2: just wonder what this summer will do to his confidence

506
00:25:40,359 --> 00:25:42,960
Speaker 2: and push it back of that group, you don't know.

507
00:25:43,640 --> 00:25:45,520
Speaker 2: You can't really fully trust any one of those guys

508
00:25:45,520 --> 00:25:47,280
Speaker 2: to be a huge part of the future. Maybe they

509
00:25:47,280 --> 00:25:50,040
Speaker 2: have little roles on the periphery of the contending roster.

510
00:25:50,720 --> 00:25:51,720
Speaker 1: But on the other hand, you.

511
00:25:51,640 --> 00:25:54,280
Speaker 2: Have Yelich, who is on the short list of the

512
00:25:54,320 --> 00:25:58,560
Speaker 2: best players in baseball now, and he was underrated at

513
00:25:58,560 --> 00:26:01,200
Speaker 2: the time of the trade. I think in Miami understood

514
00:26:02,280 --> 00:26:04,880
Speaker 2: that he had great potential. He was a ready guy

515
00:26:04,960 --> 00:26:08,879
Speaker 2: that had such a beautiful swing and already had a

516
00:26:08,880 --> 00:26:10,760
Speaker 2: really good track record in the majors, even if he

517
00:26:10,800 --> 00:26:15,960
Speaker 2: was flying underneath the national radar. But because of the

518
00:26:16,080 --> 00:26:17,760
Speaker 2: very friendly contract that he was on. I don't know

519
00:26:17,800 --> 00:26:19,240
Speaker 2: if you're going to bring that up, but one of

520
00:26:19,280 --> 00:26:21,840
Speaker 2: the most important moves Michael Tener was actually signing him

521
00:26:21,880 --> 00:26:24,680
Speaker 2: to that first extension. I got him for seven years,

522
00:26:24,920 --> 00:26:27,639
Speaker 2: fifty million dollars with a couple of team options on

523
00:26:27,680 --> 00:26:30,000
Speaker 2: the end. And that's what made him such a valuable

524
00:26:30,000 --> 00:26:32,280
Speaker 2: trade ship in the first place. And I don't think

525
00:26:32,280 --> 00:26:34,399
Speaker 2: the Brewers expected this of him, for him to be

526
00:26:34,520 --> 00:26:38,240
Speaker 2: the MVP in twenty eighteen. He was on an MVP

527
00:26:38,359 --> 00:26:40,959
Speaker 2: trajectory in twenty nineteen until he had that freaky injury

528
00:26:41,080 --> 00:26:44,800
Speaker 2: and coincidentally playing against the Marlins. And in twenty twenty,

529
00:26:44,880 --> 00:26:47,600
Speaker 2: I mean, he was one of the more confusing players

530
00:26:47,640 --> 00:26:49,840
Speaker 2: in the league. Like he anyway, he sliced. He was

531
00:26:49,840 --> 00:26:52,320
Speaker 2: a big disappointment for the Brewers at twenty twenty, they

532
00:26:52,320 --> 00:26:56,399
Speaker 2: barely made the playoffs. And it's a really uncertain future

533
00:26:56,400 --> 00:26:58,199
Speaker 2: for him at this moment because now the Brewers have

534
00:26:58,240 --> 00:26:59,919
Speaker 2: since given him a lifetime.

535
00:26:59,520 --> 00:27:00,840
Speaker 1: Deal and I don't know where that's going.

536
00:27:01,480 --> 00:27:04,200
Speaker 2: But either way, I mean, he's he'd be the face

537
00:27:04,240 --> 00:27:08,000
Speaker 2: of the Marlins franchise right now unequivocally, and he's a

538
00:27:08,000 --> 00:27:09,240
Speaker 2: great ambassador for the game.

539
00:27:09,600 --> 00:27:10,680
Speaker 1: And he's not here anymore.

540
00:27:10,720 --> 00:27:13,679
Speaker 2: And so the Marlins were hopeful that the quality of

541
00:27:13,720 --> 00:27:16,400
Speaker 2: that prospect package was going to replace him, but I mean,

542
00:27:16,400 --> 00:27:18,879
Speaker 2: it's immediately apparent that that's not going to happen. You know,

543
00:27:18,960 --> 00:27:20,680
Speaker 2: they're just going to have to try to make most

544
00:27:21,040 --> 00:27:23,800
Speaker 2: of what happened in that deal. And once again, I'm

545
00:27:23,840 --> 00:27:27,119
Speaker 2: going to clump this together with another of the forgettable,

546
00:27:27,280 --> 00:27:30,240
Speaker 2: regrettable moves of the Michael Hill tenure. That would be

547
00:27:30,960 --> 00:27:36,360
Speaker 2: January of twenty sixteen. This was under old ownership, five years,

548
00:27:36,600 --> 00:27:41,239
Speaker 2: eighty million, dollars for way In Chen. Oh boy, So

549
00:27:41,320 --> 00:27:44,320
Speaker 2: that's that's the last big deal that I think the

550
00:27:44,359 --> 00:27:48,199
Speaker 2: team has done with a Scott Boris a free agent player.

551
00:27:48,680 --> 00:27:52,760
Speaker 2: And even in his press conference, Chen was very thankful

552
00:27:52,840 --> 00:27:54,919
Speaker 2: for Scott Boris forgetting him that deal. I think he

553
00:27:55,000 --> 00:27:57,600
Speaker 2: knew at the time that it was more security than

554
00:27:57,640 --> 00:27:59,639
Speaker 2: you'd ever expect for a guy that was at his

555
00:27:59,760 --> 00:28:02,040
Speaker 2: very best, mid rotation starter.

556
00:28:02,520 --> 00:28:05,679
Speaker 5: When we had this opportunity to talk about way In,

557
00:28:05,840 --> 00:28:08,520
Speaker 5: and when Jeffrey gave really he gave the right to

558
00:28:08,600 --> 00:28:10,119
Speaker 5: Mike to go through what do we need to do

559
00:28:10,160 --> 00:28:12,160
Speaker 5: to make the team better? And Mike, I'm gonna ask

560
00:28:12,240 --> 00:28:15,480
Speaker 5: him to talk about his thought process. But the fact

561
00:28:15,520 --> 00:28:18,400
Speaker 5: is that every move we make is thanks in whole

562
00:28:18,440 --> 00:28:20,879
Speaker 5: part to a desire by the owner, Jeffrey Lourie, to

563
00:28:20,880 --> 00:28:22,919
Speaker 5: make sure that we do something that can help improve

564
00:28:22,960 --> 00:28:24,320
Speaker 5: the team.

565
00:28:24,400 --> 00:28:26,560
Speaker 2: I wouldn't say there were red flags about him coming

566
00:28:26,600 --> 00:28:29,480
Speaker 2: into like joining the Marlins. He had been with the

567
00:28:29,520 --> 00:28:32,320
Speaker 2: Orioles the previous four years. He'd been overall, you know,

568
00:28:32,520 --> 00:28:35,159
Speaker 2: more or less an average major league starter, sometimes a

569
00:28:35,240 --> 00:28:39,000
Speaker 2: little bit better than that, but the swing and missability

570
00:28:39,200 --> 00:28:43,640
Speaker 2: wasn't really there. There were some minor injuries along the

571
00:28:43,680 --> 00:28:46,800
Speaker 2: way in Baltimore, and as soon as he got to

572
00:28:46,960 --> 00:28:51,240
Speaker 2: the Marlins, though, I mean, those injuries got a lot

573
00:28:51,280 --> 00:28:53,800
Speaker 2: more severe. I don't think he ever had a surgery

574
00:28:53,960 --> 00:28:56,480
Speaker 2: on that like troublesome left elbow of his, but he

575
00:28:56,520 --> 00:29:02,640
Speaker 2: missed significant time in twenty sixteen and twenty seventeen, and

576
00:29:02,800 --> 00:29:06,320
Speaker 2: I mean by the end of his tenure there. There

577
00:29:06,360 --> 00:29:08,920
Speaker 2: was an amusing part of the twenty eighteen season when

578
00:29:08,920 --> 00:29:11,400
Speaker 2: the Marlins weren't really first year the rebuild, weren't really

579
00:29:11,400 --> 00:29:14,560
Speaker 2: playing for anything. For whatever reason, Chen was amazingly good

580
00:29:14,600 --> 00:29:16,920
Speaker 2: when he started at Marlins Park, and yet he was

581
00:29:17,480 --> 00:29:20,000
Speaker 2: unplayable when he was starting on the road. But for

582
00:29:20,080 --> 00:29:23,760
Speaker 2: that season overall, he was mediocre. In twenty nineteen, they

583
00:29:24,000 --> 00:29:26,400
Speaker 2: finally took the l on him and just stuck him

584
00:29:26,440 --> 00:29:29,000
Speaker 2: in the bullpen in a mop up role, and that

585
00:29:29,040 --> 00:29:31,400
Speaker 2: went worse than anybody could have imagined. I mean, he

586
00:29:31,480 --> 00:29:34,240
Speaker 2: took so much heat during the twenty nineteen season, even

587
00:29:34,280 --> 00:29:37,080
Speaker 2: in games that were already out of hand, because he

588
00:29:37,120 --> 00:29:39,280
Speaker 2: just could not adjust to that role at all, not

589
00:29:39,360 --> 00:29:40,800
Speaker 2: knowing when he was going to pitch or how long

590
00:29:40,840 --> 00:29:43,640
Speaker 2: he was going to pitch. He had an era over

591
00:29:43,840 --> 00:29:46,640
Speaker 2: six in that season pitching out of the pen, and

592
00:29:46,720 --> 00:29:49,200
Speaker 2: they finally did. They sucked it up and here in

593
00:29:49,240 --> 00:29:52,280
Speaker 2: twenty twenty, before the twenty twenty season even got started,

594
00:29:52,320 --> 00:29:55,040
Speaker 2: they released him because they needed the roster spot. They

595
00:29:55,040 --> 00:29:56,760
Speaker 2: wanted to hand it over to someone that was younger,

596
00:29:56,800 --> 00:29:59,320
Speaker 2: that had more team control, that had more upside, and

597
00:30:00,160 --> 00:30:03,520
Speaker 2: they bit the bullet on that under new ownership. But

598
00:30:03,640 --> 00:30:05,560
Speaker 2: the fact that he was able to happen under old

599
00:30:05,600 --> 00:30:08,320
Speaker 2: ownership was it was a mess. It was a mess

600
00:30:08,360 --> 00:30:10,920
Speaker 2: not only because he struggled, but because of his misstime.

601
00:30:11,560 --> 00:30:14,320
Speaker 2: And of course that snowballs when you consider the fact

602
00:30:14,320 --> 00:30:18,640
Speaker 2: that Jose Fernandez wasn't there for most of that, that

603
00:30:18,720 --> 00:30:21,240
Speaker 2: they put so much responsibility on Chen and he wasn't

604
00:30:21,280 --> 00:30:23,360
Speaker 2: able to handle it, and they use that as an

605
00:30:23,360 --> 00:30:27,959
Speaker 2: excuse to suggest that they to use as an excuse

606
00:30:28,000 --> 00:30:30,320
Speaker 2: not to continue spending on the major league product. They

607
00:30:30,360 --> 00:30:34,280
Speaker 2: didn't invest to continue adding rotation depth, and ultimately had

608
00:30:34,320 --> 00:30:36,880
Speaker 2: this team that wasn't good enough to get over the hump,

609
00:30:36,960 --> 00:30:39,840
Speaker 2: that never had a winning record even with Chen on

610
00:30:39,840 --> 00:30:44,480
Speaker 2: their payroll, And that was I mean, you want to

611
00:30:44,520 --> 00:30:46,760
Speaker 2: see in the future. The Marlins have now done this

612
00:30:46,840 --> 00:30:49,400
Speaker 2: rebuild to try to avoid these kinds of situations. Right,

613
00:30:49,440 --> 00:30:52,520
Speaker 2: They've stacked their farm system with so much young pitching,

614
00:30:52,600 --> 00:30:54,760
Speaker 2: and we've seen a lot of that breakthrough to the majors,

615
00:30:55,160 --> 00:30:56,840
Speaker 2: and we still have several waves of that that have

616
00:30:56,960 --> 00:30:59,200
Speaker 2: yet to come up, and you feel very good about.

617
00:30:59,280 --> 00:31:02,600
Speaker 2: So they're hopeful of building their entire rotation from within

618
00:31:02,880 --> 00:31:06,000
Speaker 2: uncontrollable talent, but eventually they're going to have to bring

619
00:31:06,040 --> 00:31:09,640
Speaker 2: in a veteran to really eat those innings and to

620
00:31:09,680 --> 00:31:12,760
Speaker 2: push them over the top. And I guess Chen is

621
00:31:12,800 --> 00:31:16,880
Speaker 2: a cautionary tale. And ultimately I don't think he was

622
00:31:16,920 --> 00:31:21,120
Speaker 2: a bad picture or necessarily a foolish choice, but I

623
00:31:21,160 --> 00:31:25,560
Speaker 2: think definitely it's a It dissuades you from ever giving

624
00:31:25,600 --> 00:31:27,760
Speaker 2: out like a five year deal to a picture that's

625
00:31:27,800 --> 00:31:30,440
Speaker 2: already in his thirties, that if you're gonna make that

626
00:31:30,520 --> 00:31:32,440
Speaker 2: kind of investment, you got to keep it short term,

627
00:31:32,880 --> 00:31:34,840
Speaker 2: and you got to keep it with guys that can

628
00:31:34,880 --> 00:31:39,840
Speaker 2: miss some more bats. Yeah, because I don't think there's

629
00:31:40,360 --> 00:31:42,960
Speaker 2: there's really very few players in recent Marlin's history that

630
00:31:43,000 --> 00:31:45,920
Speaker 2: have been as despised as Chen was. Through no fault

631
00:31:46,000 --> 00:31:50,120
Speaker 2: of himself personally, just didn't have the performance to back

632
00:31:50,200 --> 00:31:51,280
Speaker 2: up that payday that he got.

633
00:31:51,960 --> 00:31:53,600
Speaker 3: Well, you had the one year where he was a

634
00:31:53,640 --> 00:31:56,440
Speaker 3: cy young pitcher at Marlins Park and only Marlins Park.

635
00:31:58,400 --> 00:32:01,120
Speaker 2: Yeah, the home chen phenomen back then.

636
00:32:01,640 --> 00:32:05,160
Speaker 3: So that's gonna baffle baseball historians fifty years from now.

637
00:32:05,200 --> 00:32:07,440
Speaker 3: They're gonna they're gonna take a lot of time on

638
00:32:07,480 --> 00:32:08,600
Speaker 3: that one.

639
00:32:10,200 --> 00:32:14,840
Speaker 2: Well, try try to flip this around for us. Give

640
00:32:14,920 --> 00:32:17,720
Speaker 2: us a third move that you thought went pretty well

641
00:32:17,800 --> 00:32:20,920
Speaker 2: under this old front office headed by Michael Rail.

642
00:32:21,560 --> 00:32:22,560
Speaker 3: So I'm gonna give you two.

643
00:32:23,120 --> 00:32:23,280
Speaker 1: Uh.

644
00:32:23,320 --> 00:32:25,800
Speaker 3: The first move is a pretty easy one. I almost

645
00:32:25,800 --> 00:32:27,680
Speaker 3: didn't want to include it because of just how easy

646
00:32:27,720 --> 00:32:32,600
Speaker 3: it is. Six Do Sanchez for JT Real Mudo. Uh

647
00:32:32,720 --> 00:32:35,480
Speaker 3: or six Do Sanchez and Horgale Faro in exchange for

648
00:32:35,560 --> 00:32:39,120
Speaker 3: JT Real Muto. Not only because six Do Sanchez as

649
00:32:39,200 --> 00:32:43,040
Speaker 3: of right now was projected to be almost as good

650
00:32:43,480 --> 00:32:47,040
Speaker 3: and the same type of player as Pedro Martinez, but

651
00:32:47,160 --> 00:32:50,440
Speaker 3: also you you got Hortel Faro out of it. Now,

652
00:32:51,560 --> 00:32:53,680
Speaker 3: six Tho Sanchez already speaks for himself. I don't think

653
00:32:53,680 --> 00:32:56,680
Speaker 3: I need to elaborate any more on that. He he

654
00:32:56,920 --> 00:32:59,400
Speaker 3: performed great this year. He had a couple of games

655
00:32:59,440 --> 00:33:01,760
Speaker 3: where he looked like a rookie, but then he had

656
00:33:01,800 --> 00:33:03,040
Speaker 3: a couple of games where if you told me he

657
00:33:03,080 --> 00:33:06,000
Speaker 3: was already a five year veteran, I believe you. I

658
00:33:06,040 --> 00:33:10,440
Speaker 3: think that a full spring training next year, hopefully will

659
00:33:10,440 --> 00:33:13,520
Speaker 3: get a full spring training, will help him out a lot.

660
00:33:13,600 --> 00:33:16,560
Speaker 3: And I think another year of one hundred and sixty

661
00:33:16,560 --> 00:33:20,200
Speaker 3: two games so about thirty starts, will hopefully iron out

662
00:33:20,320 --> 00:33:24,240
Speaker 3: any issues that he has. Maybe developed one more pitch

663
00:33:25,240 --> 00:33:26,960
Speaker 3: right now, I feel like he really only has two

664
00:33:27,120 --> 00:33:30,000
Speaker 3: or maybe three that he can really really rely on.

665
00:33:31,240 --> 00:33:32,920
Speaker 3: But I think that he's going to be raged like

666
00:33:32,960 --> 00:33:36,920
Speaker 3: everyone else does porhal Faro. I know that maddingly kind

667
00:33:36,920 --> 00:33:39,320
Speaker 3: of shied away from him during the playoffs, which was

668
00:33:39,560 --> 00:33:43,520
Speaker 3: very concerning to me. But I think that Alfaro will

669
00:33:43,520 --> 00:33:46,280
Speaker 3: still be good. He had a two sixty two batting

670
00:33:46,320 --> 00:33:51,479
Speaker 3: average in a twenty nineteen got you eighteen home runs,

671
00:33:51,520 --> 00:33:54,840
Speaker 3: had a four to twenty five percent. That bad, But

672
00:33:54,920 --> 00:33:57,640
Speaker 3: I think that he is a better version of what

673
00:33:57,760 --> 00:34:01,000
Speaker 3: Jared Saltolimachia was supposed to be, which is is you know,

674
00:34:01,680 --> 00:34:04,560
Speaker 3: he's not exactly gonna get you a bunch of singles

675
00:34:04,560 --> 00:34:06,280
Speaker 3: and doubles, but he'll hit a home run for you

676
00:34:06,360 --> 00:34:09,560
Speaker 3: once in a while, and I think that as long

677
00:34:09,600 --> 00:34:11,479
Speaker 3: as he can become a little bit more consistent, because

678
00:34:11,520 --> 00:34:14,520
Speaker 3: he had those moments this year where he came off

679
00:34:14,520 --> 00:34:17,640
Speaker 3: the covid al and was just terrible for about a week,

680
00:34:18,080 --> 00:34:20,200
Speaker 3: and then he went on a run where he was like,

681
00:34:20,560 --> 00:34:22,120
Speaker 3: I'll have to look up the exact step, and I

682
00:34:22,120 --> 00:34:25,040
Speaker 3: think he was like eight for ten in three or

683
00:34:25,080 --> 00:34:28,719
Speaker 3: four games. So he has it in him. And then,

684
00:34:28,760 --> 00:34:30,759
Speaker 3: of course, not to mention the fact that jt Real

685
00:34:30,800 --> 00:34:33,960
Speaker 3: Mudo may not even sign back with the Phillies, so

686
00:34:34,239 --> 00:34:36,680
Speaker 3: assuming that he goes somewhere else, I've heard the Mets

687
00:34:36,680 --> 00:34:39,840
Speaker 3: are a big player on him, with Steve Cohen getting

688
00:34:39,880 --> 00:34:43,000
Speaker 3: in there with all of his money. Imagine jt Real

689
00:34:43,239 --> 00:34:46,279
Speaker 3: getting only two years of jt rue Mudo and you

690
00:34:46,400 --> 00:34:49,120
Speaker 3: gave up six Do Sanchez and Jorgel Faro for that.

691
00:34:50,360 --> 00:34:52,080
Speaker 3: And then also what I think will be interesting is

692
00:34:52,640 --> 00:34:56,960
Speaker 3: it's very very unlikely, but I was talking to a

693
00:34:56,960 --> 00:34:59,520
Speaker 3: couple of people around baseball and they acknowledge that both

694
00:35:00,320 --> 00:35:04,640
Speaker 3: sides still like each other. I wouldn't say there's interest

695
00:35:05,320 --> 00:35:08,080
Speaker 3: in the sense that they're negotiating with each other, but

696
00:35:08,440 --> 00:35:10,799
Speaker 3: they don't. There's no bad blood between them in the

697
00:35:10,840 --> 00:35:13,120
Speaker 3: same way that, like, you know, I think there's still

698
00:35:13,120 --> 00:35:15,840
Speaker 3: a little bit of saltiness from say John Carlos Stanton

699
00:35:16,360 --> 00:35:20,960
Speaker 3: or Christian Yealich. But jt Roumino has no issues with

700
00:35:21,040 --> 00:35:24,719
Speaker 3: the new Marlins regime, and I don't think they'll have

701
00:35:24,840 --> 00:35:28,000
Speaker 3: enough money to get him this winter, but I think

702
00:35:28,000 --> 00:35:33,480
Speaker 3: he'll still be an interesting storyline. And then my second

703
00:35:33,520 --> 00:35:36,080
Speaker 3: good move, I'm actually gonna go a little bit out

704
00:35:36,120 --> 00:35:39,960
Speaker 3: of the box on this one. Every single move made

705
00:35:40,080 --> 00:35:42,440
Speaker 3: during the first week of August this year during the

706
00:35:42,440 --> 00:35:46,760
Speaker 3: Marlins coronavirus outbreak eighteen play we all know the story.

707
00:35:46,840 --> 00:35:50,160
Speaker 3: Eighteen players go on the ale at once, including eight

708
00:35:50,239 --> 00:35:53,279
Speaker 3: of their twelve relief pictures. Most of the bats were

709
00:35:53,320 --> 00:35:56,160
Speaker 3: replaced by guys that were already in the sixty player pool,

710
00:35:56,200 --> 00:36:00,600
Speaker 3: like Mante Harrison Lewis Prinson, but the relief pictures came

711
00:36:00,640 --> 00:36:05,440
Speaker 3: out of nowhere. The Marlins acquired eleven total players from

712
00:36:05,480 --> 00:36:08,920
Speaker 3: other teams during the eight days that Miami was quarantined.

713
00:36:09,440 --> 00:36:13,600
Speaker 3: Some of those guys, it was Brett Iibner. He was

714
00:36:13,640 --> 00:36:15,880
Speaker 3: throwing around in the independent leagues. He came from the

715
00:36:15,880 --> 00:36:20,080
Speaker 3: Sugarland Skiers, That's who he was signed from. He hadn't

716
00:36:20,120 --> 00:36:22,920
Speaker 3: pitched in the Major League since twenty seventeen, twenty eighteen,

717
00:36:24,160 --> 00:36:27,440
Speaker 3: and he came right out of sugar Land. If I

718
00:36:27,440 --> 00:36:32,720
Speaker 3: had him named one specific player, I really liked James Hoyt.

719
00:36:33,160 --> 00:36:35,239
Speaker 3: Most of us, I feel, have never heard of him

720
00:36:35,239 --> 00:36:39,439
Speaker 3: before this. He came over from Cleveland and he wound

721
00:36:39,520 --> 00:36:41,839
Speaker 3: up being the best reliever on this team. I don't

722
00:36:41,840 --> 00:36:44,839
Speaker 3: know nothing against Brandon Kinsler, because he was good too,

723
00:36:44,880 --> 00:36:50,080
Speaker 3: But I don't know why Hoyt was never considered as

724
00:36:49,840 --> 00:36:53,799
Speaker 3: as a closing pitcher this year. He finished with a

725
00:36:53,800 --> 00:36:56,680
Speaker 3: one point two to three ERA and ended the season

726
00:36:56,960 --> 00:37:00,880
Speaker 3: on a nineteen game scoreless streak. And the fact that

727
00:37:00,880 --> 00:37:04,600
Speaker 3: the Marlins came out and went what was it, twenty

728
00:37:04,840 --> 00:37:07,960
Speaker 3: scoreless innings coming out of quarantine against the Baltimore Orioles.

729
00:37:08,000 --> 00:37:11,800
Speaker 2: He lie remember, I remember because it was Yeah, it

730
00:37:11,880 --> 00:37:14,560
Speaker 2: was at least those first two full games and into

731
00:37:14,600 --> 00:37:15,080
Speaker 2: the third one.

732
00:37:15,160 --> 00:37:16,600
Speaker 1: Yeah, it was incredible.

733
00:37:17,000 --> 00:37:19,359
Speaker 2: Using pictures that for the most part, we hadn't heard

734
00:37:19,440 --> 00:37:22,520
Speaker 2: of because of this situation, it was.

735
00:37:22,719 --> 00:37:23,680
Speaker 1: Yeah, it was amazing.

736
00:37:23,880 --> 00:37:25,720
Speaker 2: I mean, we have a recent article on James Hooyd

737
00:37:25,760 --> 00:37:29,359
Speaker 2: just outlining how freaky his season was. He was one

738
00:37:29,360 --> 00:37:31,120
Speaker 2: of the most unique pitchers you could find. So, I mean,

739
00:37:31,160 --> 00:37:34,600
Speaker 2: he's already thirty four years old at the end of

740
00:37:34,640 --> 00:37:38,200
Speaker 2: the season, and yet he barely had any major league experience.

741
00:37:38,600 --> 00:37:40,879
Speaker 2: He had been with the Astros in fact, the year

742
00:37:40,880 --> 00:37:42,719
Speaker 2: that they won the World Series title, but he got

743
00:37:42,719 --> 00:37:46,800
Speaker 2: overshadowed on that team. He had a couple unlucky injuries,

744
00:37:46,840 --> 00:37:49,640
Speaker 2: not even with not even serious arm injuries, but just

745
00:37:49,760 --> 00:37:53,120
Speaker 2: unlucky ones, and he got buried in the minor leagues.

746
00:37:53,280 --> 00:37:55,200
Speaker 2: You know, in Cleveland, as you said, were there a

747
00:37:55,440 --> 00:37:59,120
Speaker 2: very deep pitching organization, And yeah, the Marlins got him

748
00:37:59,160 --> 00:38:02,359
Speaker 2: for a cash considerations, which is when it's it's such

749
00:38:02,360 --> 00:38:04,719
Speaker 2: a small amount of money that they don't even specify,

750
00:38:04,880 --> 00:38:08,920
Speaker 2: and he immediately jumped in. He is such a unique

751
00:38:08,920 --> 00:38:12,319
Speaker 2: player and that he has. He relied more on his

752
00:38:12,400 --> 00:38:16,640
Speaker 2: slider than like any other pitcher on record in Marlin's history.

753
00:38:16,680 --> 00:38:19,719
Speaker 2: He threw that pitch two thirds of the time because one,

754
00:38:19,800 --> 00:38:21,200
Speaker 2: I mean, he didn't have a very good pass in

755
00:38:21,200 --> 00:38:23,200
Speaker 2: the first place. But no matter if he was facing

756
00:38:23,200 --> 00:38:26,040
Speaker 2: a lefty or alrighty, and no matter what the situation was,

757
00:38:26,080 --> 00:38:27,759
Speaker 2: there was a lot of situations where he came in

758
00:38:27,800 --> 00:38:31,160
Speaker 2: with inherited runners on base, and yet he was able

759
00:38:31,200 --> 00:38:33,680
Speaker 2: to pile up swings and missus keep the ball in

760
00:38:33,680 --> 00:38:35,640
Speaker 2: the park. And now he's a guy that could be

761
00:38:35,760 --> 00:38:38,120
Speaker 2: part of their long term plans. He's under team control

762
00:38:38,160 --> 00:38:39,680
Speaker 2: for a bunch of years, as if they want to

763
00:38:39,719 --> 00:38:42,680
Speaker 2: retain him at the league minimum. So yeah, that one

764
00:38:42,719 --> 00:38:44,680
Speaker 2: in particular sticks out, But just in general, the fact

765
00:38:44,680 --> 00:38:46,799
Speaker 2: that they were able to cobble together all those major

766
00:38:46,880 --> 00:38:50,000
Speaker 2: league caliber arms, and some of them, no doubt, you know,

767
00:38:50,120 --> 00:38:52,560
Speaker 2: lucked out. Some of them just happened to be pitching

768
00:38:52,600 --> 00:38:54,880
Speaker 2: at their best at the perfect time. But some of

769
00:38:54,920 --> 00:38:56,480
Speaker 2: that is a lot of the work you put into,

770
00:38:56,840 --> 00:38:58,879
Speaker 2: like being able to acquire them in the first place,

771
00:38:58,880 --> 00:39:01,640
Speaker 2: and knowing which guys are ready to step in immediately,

772
00:39:01,719 --> 00:39:05,040
Speaker 2: and knowing which situations to use him. Because one of

773
00:39:05,080 --> 00:39:08,360
Speaker 2: the funnier moments of the year was when Don Mattingly

774
00:39:08,560 --> 00:39:11,000
Speaker 2: admitted that he'd never met some of the players that

775
00:39:11,000 --> 00:39:13,080
Speaker 2: he was using before, Like they arrived at the ballpark

776
00:39:13,160 --> 00:39:15,440
Speaker 2: and he didn't know them, but he had to be

777
00:39:15,520 --> 00:39:18,200
Speaker 2: ready to use them in games. So, I mean, you

778
00:39:18,200 --> 00:39:19,880
Speaker 2: want to give credit to Maddingly, he's going to win

779
00:39:19,960 --> 00:39:22,399
Speaker 2: National manager, National League Manager of the Year this year,

780
00:39:22,840 --> 00:39:25,720
Speaker 2: But I mean realistically, he wasn't the one like picking

781
00:39:25,719 --> 00:39:27,680
Speaker 2: out those situations to use the guys, and he didn't

782
00:39:27,719 --> 00:39:30,279
Speaker 2: know those guys. The ones that actually knew those guys were,

783
00:39:30,360 --> 00:39:32,479
Speaker 2: whether it's Michael Hill or whether it was people working

784
00:39:32,520 --> 00:39:35,440
Speaker 2: directly underneath him in the front office. They put in

785
00:39:35,560 --> 00:39:37,840
Speaker 2: all that work in a very limited amount of time

786
00:39:38,040 --> 00:39:42,799
Speaker 2: to like figure out the best fits. And we'll have

787
00:39:42,840 --> 00:39:46,799
Speaker 2: to specify a couple other of the forgettable moments from

788
00:39:46,920 --> 00:39:49,560
Speaker 2: this tenure as the head of Baseball offs before get

789
00:39:49,560 --> 00:39:52,200
Speaker 2: out here a couple of trades in particular that Marvelins

790
00:39:52,200 --> 00:39:54,759
Speaker 2: fans know very well. This was from This was from

791
00:39:54,760 --> 00:39:57,680
Speaker 2: the end of the Jeffrey Laurier era, when the team

792
00:39:58,120 --> 00:40:00,920
Speaker 2: still felt they had a chance to like contend. They

793
00:40:00,960 --> 00:40:03,800
Speaker 2: still they were a couple of pitchers away from really

794
00:40:03,800 --> 00:40:06,960
Speaker 2: putting it together. In the summer of twenty sixteen, they

795
00:40:06,960 --> 00:40:09,719
Speaker 2: head into the twenty sixteen deadline well above the five

796
00:40:09,800 --> 00:40:11,480
Speaker 2: hundred market. I believe they were holding one of the

797
00:40:11,520 --> 00:40:14,360
Speaker 2: wild card positions at the time, and I think this

798
00:40:14,480 --> 00:40:17,360
Speaker 2: was actually a full month before the trade deadline where

799
00:40:17,520 --> 00:40:21,759
Speaker 2: they really set the mark on being a buyer at

800
00:40:21,760 --> 00:40:26,200
Speaker 2: the deadline before anybody else. Fernando Rodney, veteran right handed reliever,

801
00:40:26,280 --> 00:40:27,920
Speaker 2: got off to a great start to this season with

802
00:40:27,960 --> 00:40:31,200
Speaker 2: the Padres, but the Padres weren't going anywhere anytime soon.

803
00:40:32,000 --> 00:40:34,680
Speaker 2: Rodney was about to be named a National League All Star,

804
00:40:35,200 --> 00:40:38,480
Speaker 2: but he had a long track record of being very inconsistent,

805
00:40:38,560 --> 00:40:42,799
Speaker 2: of struggling with his control and the team. I mean,

806
00:40:42,840 --> 00:40:46,080
Speaker 2: there's no other explanation that, Like, they just got fooled

807
00:40:46,120 --> 00:40:50,040
Speaker 2: by the really surface level stats. Rodney had an era

808
00:40:50,520 --> 00:40:53,799
Speaker 2: in he'd only allowed one run the entire year to

809
00:40:53,840 --> 00:40:55,880
Speaker 2: that point, through like the first three months of the season,

810
00:40:56,680 --> 00:40:58,920
Speaker 2: and they thought, for some reason he was going to

811
00:40:58,960 --> 00:40:59,759
Speaker 2: be able to keep that up.

812
00:41:00,120 --> 00:41:03,120
Speaker 1: And half of the year. They went into.

813
00:41:02,920 --> 00:41:06,200
Speaker 2: Their farm system and traded away a very recent draft

814
00:41:06,280 --> 00:41:09,399
Speaker 2: pick that people didn't know much about but was having

815
00:41:09,440 --> 00:41:12,600
Speaker 2: great results in the minor leagues. And that young player

816
00:41:12,640 --> 00:41:16,440
Speaker 2: they traded away turned into Chris Paddock went to the Padres.

817
00:41:16,800 --> 00:41:19,600
Speaker 2: They got a half year of Rodney. Rodney even had

818
00:41:19,680 --> 00:41:22,160
Speaker 2: like an extra year of club control beyond that, but

819
00:41:22,239 --> 00:41:24,920
Speaker 2: he was so bad down the stretch of twenty sixteen,

820
00:41:24,960 --> 00:41:27,239
Speaker 2: and not just in terms of having a six ra

821
00:41:27,520 --> 00:41:30,520
Speaker 2: not in terms of just struggling to throw strikes, but

822
00:41:30,560 --> 00:41:32,840
Speaker 2: the situations that he was used in. He was immediately

823
00:41:32,840 --> 00:41:35,399
Speaker 2: plugged into, i believe, the closer's role, and then even

824
00:41:35,480 --> 00:41:36,759
Speaker 2: down the stretch, they still used it.

825
00:41:36,719 --> 00:41:37,600
Speaker 1: As like a setup man.

826
00:41:37,840 --> 00:41:40,440
Speaker 2: He was pitching the most important endings for the team

827
00:41:40,840 --> 00:41:43,400
Speaker 2: and he was screwing almost all them up. It was

828
00:41:43,880 --> 00:41:47,759
Speaker 2: some of the most disheartening losses that they've had of

829
00:41:47,800 --> 00:41:51,520
Speaker 2: this entire tenure of Michael Hill running baseball ops. Was

830
00:41:51,560 --> 00:41:53,919
Speaker 2: when Rodney was given a two run lead or three

831
00:41:53,960 --> 00:41:56,200
Speaker 2: run lead in the game that the Marlins had to win,

832
00:41:56,719 --> 00:41:59,400
Speaker 2: and he couldn't throw strikes, and he gave up the

833
00:41:59,400 --> 00:42:02,439
Speaker 2: most important hits of those games, and he cost them

834
00:42:02,960 --> 00:42:05,360
Speaker 2: those games. And they put a lot of faith in him,

835
00:42:05,520 --> 00:42:07,880
Speaker 2: even though they had a pretty decent bullpen at that time.

836
00:42:08,320 --> 00:42:11,640
Speaker 2: They pushed those guys further down the hierarchy in order

837
00:42:11,680 --> 00:42:14,560
Speaker 2: to give the veteran his opportunity, and he failed them.

838
00:42:14,680 --> 00:42:17,759
Speaker 2: He failed them, and they traded away Paddock in that situation.

839
00:42:18,320 --> 00:42:21,400
Speaker 2: Paddock blew out his elbow very shortly after that, but

840
00:42:22,080 --> 00:42:23,880
Speaker 2: given a year and a half to recover from that,

841
00:42:24,360 --> 00:42:26,239
Speaker 2: he was one of the most dominant pitchers in the

842
00:42:26,280 --> 00:42:29,719
Speaker 2: minor leagues in twenty eighteen and so dominant that the

843
00:42:29,760 --> 00:42:31,960
Speaker 2: Padres rushed him up to the major leagues for opening

844
00:42:32,040 --> 00:42:35,560
Speaker 2: Day twenty nineteen. I think he skipped triple A and

845
00:42:36,719 --> 00:42:39,080
Speaker 2: he had mixed results his past season in twenty twenty,

846
00:42:39,480 --> 00:42:42,400
Speaker 2: but overall, his two seasons in the major leagues have

847
00:42:42,440 --> 00:42:44,920
Speaker 2: seen a guy that is great at throwing strikes as

848
00:42:45,000 --> 00:42:48,680
Speaker 2: one of the nastiest changeups that we've ever seen. And

849
00:42:49,360 --> 00:42:52,080
Speaker 2: he is only he's heading into his age twenty five season.

850
00:42:52,120 --> 00:42:53,719
Speaker 2: He's gonna be in the majors for a long time.

851
00:42:53,760 --> 00:42:55,920
Speaker 2: He's gonna be a quality starting pitcher for the long time.

852
00:42:56,560 --> 00:42:58,200
Speaker 2: I don't know how you want to compare him exactly

853
00:42:58,280 --> 00:43:01,239
Speaker 2: to six or to Sandy or to pol but if

854
00:43:01,280 --> 00:43:03,040
Speaker 2: he was on the Marlins right now, he would definitely

855
00:43:03,080 --> 00:43:05,960
Speaker 2: be in their rotation. He'd be in consideration for the

856
00:43:06,000 --> 00:43:08,440
Speaker 2: top of their rotation. And they gave him away in

857
00:43:08,520 --> 00:43:12,160
Speaker 2: order to make a patchwork upgrade to a bullpen and

858
00:43:12,840 --> 00:43:15,960
Speaker 2: to be blinded by factors that don't really matter when

859
00:43:15,960 --> 00:43:18,000
Speaker 2: it comes to putting the finishing touches on what they

860
00:43:18,000 --> 00:43:20,680
Speaker 2: hoped would be a postseason team back in twenty sixteen,

861
00:43:21,080 --> 00:43:23,560
Speaker 2: and that team and they didn't make it. They fell

862
00:43:23,640 --> 00:43:26,320
Speaker 2: under five hundred and so much of that was single

863
00:43:26,360 --> 00:43:29,160
Speaker 2: handedly because of how they used Rodney and putting way

864
00:43:29,200 --> 00:43:32,640
Speaker 2: too much trust in him, and a related trade just

865
00:43:32,719 --> 00:43:37,239
Speaker 2: six months later, in January of twenty seventeen, at the

866
00:43:37,280 --> 00:43:41,040
Speaker 2: time where the franchise had could have gone in a

867
00:43:41,080 --> 00:43:43,880
Speaker 2: couple different directions. This was before they formally announced that

868
00:43:43,920 --> 00:43:46,200
Speaker 2: the team was up for sale. They had a lot

869
00:43:46,200 --> 00:43:48,279
Speaker 2: of big contracts on the books for twenty seventeen, and

870
00:43:48,320 --> 00:43:53,360
Speaker 2: they decided, I mean, to the credit of maybe not

871
00:43:53,480 --> 00:43:56,200
Speaker 2: to their credit, but you could admire that they still

872
00:43:56,200 --> 00:43:58,960
Speaker 2: wanted to take one last shot at putting a postseason

873
00:43:59,000 --> 00:44:02,040
Speaker 2: contender on the field because of the great core position

874
00:44:02,080 --> 00:44:04,719
Speaker 2: players they had in place. But they weren't willing to

875
00:44:04,800 --> 00:44:07,920
Speaker 2: dip into free agency to improve this starting rotation, so

876
00:44:07,960 --> 00:44:10,239
Speaker 2: they looked to the trade market. They weren't They didn't

877
00:44:10,280 --> 00:44:13,680
Speaker 2: have the kind of high caliber prospects, you know, no doubt,

878
00:44:14,120 --> 00:44:17,040
Speaker 2: like superstar prospects in order to trade for an actual

879
00:44:17,040 --> 00:44:20,239
Speaker 2: top of the rotation arm, and they settled for Dan

880
00:44:20,320 --> 00:44:25,200
Speaker 2: Strelley from the Cincinnati Reds, trading away Louis Castillo, Austin Bryce,

881
00:44:25,360 --> 00:44:27,960
Speaker 2: a minor league gutfielder named Zeke White in a three

882
00:44:27,960 --> 00:44:31,719
Speaker 2: player package to get Dan Straley, and Straley was he

883
00:44:31,800 --> 00:44:35,799
Speaker 2: was all right for the Marlins. He was. I mean,

884
00:44:36,000 --> 00:44:37,719
Speaker 2: I guess you'd put him in the same bucket as

885
00:44:37,840 --> 00:44:42,760
Speaker 2: Chen except for being a little bit more durable and

886
00:44:42,800 --> 00:44:45,000
Speaker 2: for what it's worth, but he did not move the

887
00:44:45,000 --> 00:44:49,200
Speaker 2: needle much at all with this rotation, and Louis Castillo

888
00:44:49,840 --> 00:44:52,040
Speaker 2: was up in the majors only a few months later.

889
00:44:52,080 --> 00:44:55,759
Speaker 2: They like horribly underestimated how close Castillo was to being

890
00:44:55,760 --> 00:44:59,560
Speaker 2: major league ready. I think David Sampson back in the day,

891
00:44:59,600 --> 00:45:02,680
Speaker 2: he was the one that was still running, had a

892
00:45:02,760 --> 00:45:04,680
Speaker 2: major role in the team at the time of this deal,

893
00:45:05,120 --> 00:45:08,000
Speaker 2: and he admitted that a lot of people within the

894
00:45:08,040 --> 00:45:10,920
Speaker 2: Marlins didn't believe that Castilla was necessarily a starting pitcher

895
00:45:10,920 --> 00:45:13,839
Speaker 2: in the major leagues, and they were so wrong about that.

896
00:45:13,880 --> 00:45:17,360
Speaker 2: Castillo has been a pretty effective starting pitcher for what

897
00:45:17,440 --> 00:45:19,200
Speaker 2: the last three and a half years for the Reds,

898
00:45:19,520 --> 00:45:22,040
Speaker 2: and especially in twenty twenty. I mean, you look at

899
00:45:22,040 --> 00:45:26,280
Speaker 2: his peripheral stats. His fifth was in the mid twes

900
00:45:26,320 --> 00:45:28,640
Speaker 2: this past season, one of the best marks of any

901
00:45:28,719 --> 00:45:31,719
Speaker 2: qualified starter in the major leagues. Pitches in a hitter

902
00:45:31,760 --> 00:45:35,080
Speaker 2: friendly ballpark doesn't allow home runs, and just like Chris Paddock.

903
00:45:35,120 --> 00:45:38,360
Speaker 2: He has one of the single nastiest changeups of anybody

904
00:45:38,480 --> 00:45:40,680
Speaker 2: in the major leagues, and he compliments that with a

905
00:45:40,719 --> 00:45:44,839
Speaker 2: fastball that sits in the high nineties. He has at

906
00:45:44,840 --> 00:45:47,120
Speaker 2: the very least, he's a guy that you're gonna trust

907
00:45:47,160 --> 00:45:50,520
Speaker 2: to be a number two starter for the foreseeable future,

908
00:45:50,800 --> 00:45:52,400
Speaker 2: a guy that is just entering the prim of his

909
00:45:52,480 --> 00:45:55,400
Speaker 2: career right now, and the Marlins would love to have

910
00:45:55,480 --> 00:45:58,040
Speaker 2: him right now. They traded from a farm system that

911
00:45:58,120 --> 00:46:00,000
Speaker 2: was already one of the thinnest and all major League

912
00:46:00,040 --> 00:46:04,839
Speaker 2: Baseball in order to go all in, and it backfired,

913
00:46:04,960 --> 00:46:08,680
Speaker 2: backfired so badly. And these are the trades that I

914
00:46:08,719 --> 00:46:11,520
Speaker 2: guess there are cautionary tales for the future, right because

915
00:46:11,520 --> 00:46:15,040
Speaker 2: this team heading into twenty twenty one is they have

916
00:46:15,160 --> 00:46:17,719
Speaker 2: so much. They're in a better position than the team

917
00:46:17,800 --> 00:46:19,520
Speaker 2: was a few years ago because of all the young

918
00:46:19,560 --> 00:46:21,839
Speaker 2: talent they still have in the pipeline, all these all

919
00:46:21,840 --> 00:46:24,839
Speaker 2: this depth that they have, guys with high ceilings that

920
00:46:25,880 --> 00:46:29,919
Speaker 2: have very realistic chance of becoming homegrown stars for them.

921
00:46:30,239 --> 00:46:33,439
Speaker 2: But eventually there's going to come a point where you're

922
00:46:33,560 --> 00:46:36,560
Speaker 2: need you'll need to look outside the organization for veteran

923
00:46:36,600 --> 00:46:40,480
Speaker 2: reinforcements and guys like Starling Marte when you have an

924
00:46:40,520 --> 00:46:44,080
Speaker 2: opening in center field. I guess the next step for

925
00:46:44,080 --> 00:46:46,440
Speaker 2: this organization could be trying to acquire some late ending

926
00:46:46,560 --> 00:46:51,160
Speaker 2: relief help to really lock down those endings moving forward. Eventually,

927
00:46:51,200 --> 00:46:54,239
Speaker 2: you're gonna need to continue trading for other veterans, and

928
00:46:54,440 --> 00:46:57,960
Speaker 2: the trades are gonna have to make. You just need

929
00:46:58,000 --> 00:46:59,880
Speaker 2: to be careful with these trades because I think in

930
00:47:00,080 --> 00:47:03,360
Speaker 2: the moment, if you're laser focused on the major league team,

931
00:47:04,360 --> 00:47:08,080
Speaker 2: then you can sort of excuse them. But the way

932
00:47:08,160 --> 00:47:10,880
Speaker 2: these trades caught up to the Marlins, I mean essentially

933
00:47:10,960 --> 00:47:15,000
Speaker 2: these two trades Paddock for Rodney, Luis Castillo for Dan Streili,

934
00:47:15,440 --> 00:47:19,200
Speaker 2: those two trades alone had a really pushed the team

935
00:47:19,400 --> 00:47:22,360
Speaker 2: to into this rebuild as soon as the new ownership

936
00:47:22,400 --> 00:47:25,960
Speaker 2: took over, because the very little depth that they had

937
00:47:26,040 --> 00:47:29,040
Speaker 2: in the minor leagues was gone, was gone in these

938
00:47:29,120 --> 00:47:32,239
Speaker 2: like really over aggressive moves, and they left the team

939
00:47:32,320 --> 00:47:35,080
Speaker 2: no choice that they had to really tear it all

940
00:47:35,120 --> 00:47:40,160
Speaker 2: down in order to replenish the farm system. So that's

941
00:47:40,719 --> 00:47:43,319
Speaker 2: and I'm gonna stop here with the negative stuff. I

942
00:47:43,360 --> 00:47:46,120
Speaker 2: have a much longer list of things that didn't go

943
00:47:46,440 --> 00:47:50,160
Speaker 2: very well under Mike Hill's tenure. But yeah, it's some

944
00:47:50,239 --> 00:47:53,000
Speaker 2: of these trades that have absolutely set them back, trades

945
00:47:53,040 --> 00:47:55,640
Speaker 2: of guys that had so much team control remaining too

946
00:47:55,800 --> 00:47:59,440
Speaker 2: these unforced errors that if you're a team that has

947
00:47:59,719 --> 00:48:03,760
Speaker 2: pretty limited payroll constraints and you have a limited window

948
00:48:03,960 --> 00:48:07,480
Speaker 2: in order to take advantage of these competitive cycles, you

949
00:48:07,480 --> 00:48:11,120
Speaker 2: can't missfire on these trades. And they really did. They

950
00:48:11,160 --> 00:48:13,600
Speaker 2: really did, especially in twenty sixteen to twenty seventeen.

951
00:48:14,440 --> 00:48:17,799
Speaker 3: It's weird, I kind of I kind of pointed out

952
00:48:17,840 --> 00:48:21,840
Speaker 3: at the beginning of the pod the way that I

953
00:48:22,040 --> 00:48:25,200
Speaker 3: have viewed Michael Hill since Jeter took over is so

954
00:48:25,320 --> 00:48:30,640
Speaker 3: different because the moves he's made haven't haven't panned out

955
00:48:30,640 --> 00:48:33,319
Speaker 3: as poorly. The Christian Yellich move is the only move

956
00:48:33,320 --> 00:48:35,640
Speaker 3: that I look back on and say, wow, that you

957
00:48:35,680 --> 00:48:38,359
Speaker 3: really messed that up. There's been so many other moves

958
00:48:38,360 --> 00:48:40,440
Speaker 3: that have worked. Like we kind of touched on it,

959
00:48:40,840 --> 00:48:42,759
Speaker 3: you know, the Jean Carl Stanton trade. I wouldn't call

960
00:48:42,800 --> 00:48:44,279
Speaker 3: it a good trade, but it was a trade that

961
00:48:44,360 --> 00:48:48,480
Speaker 3: had to happen. The the Marcelo Zuna trade, the JT.

962
00:48:48,560 --> 00:48:53,120
Speaker 3: Realmuto trade, even the d Gordon trade, is that the

963
00:48:53,120 --> 00:48:55,080
Speaker 3: one where the Martins got Pablo Lopez.

964
00:48:55,920 --> 00:48:58,840
Speaker 2: That was the one they got Nick Knider and Robert

965
00:48:58,920 --> 00:49:04,200
Speaker 2: Duggar and the minor league shortstop Christopher Torres. So that one,

966
00:49:05,200 --> 00:49:07,200
Speaker 2: you know, jury's still out on that, but Nick Knighter

967
00:49:07,360 --> 00:49:09,560
Speaker 2: is the one that they're kind of penning their hopes

968
00:49:09,600 --> 00:49:13,480
Speaker 2: on for that one to yield something. But you know,

969
00:49:13,560 --> 00:49:17,480
Speaker 2: the other relatively low scale under the radar trade that

970
00:49:17,600 --> 00:49:19,440
Speaker 2: was right at the beginning of the tenure that did

971
00:49:19,480 --> 00:49:22,040
Speaker 2: work out pretty well was the other one with the Yankees,

972
00:49:22,160 --> 00:49:25,720
Speaker 2: where they got Caleb Smith and Gary Cooper for Michael

973
00:49:25,840 --> 00:49:28,880
Speaker 2: King and some international bonus money guys that were just

974
00:49:29,280 --> 00:49:30,480
Speaker 2: dwindling on the edges of.

975
00:49:30,440 --> 00:49:31,800
Speaker 1: The Yankees roster. The Yankees.

976
00:49:32,680 --> 00:49:35,919
Speaker 2: The Yankees were the Yankees, and they really they didn't

977
00:49:35,920 --> 00:49:37,759
Speaker 2: have any room in their lineup. They felt good about

978
00:49:37,760 --> 00:49:40,719
Speaker 2: their rotation depth at the time, and the Marlins picked

979
00:49:40,760 --> 00:49:43,120
Speaker 2: up guys that were pretty immediately big parts of their

980
00:49:43,120 --> 00:49:46,840
Speaker 2: major league team, I mean, especially Cooper. I mean Caleb

981
00:49:46,960 --> 00:49:50,000
Speaker 2: was now since been traded in that Starling Marte deal

982
00:49:50,080 --> 00:49:53,160
Speaker 2: in order to like buff up that other area of need.

983
00:49:53,719 --> 00:49:56,839
Speaker 2: But Cooper heading into twenty twenty one is like one

984
00:49:56,880 --> 00:50:00,200
Speaker 2: of their most valuable position players, Like, there's no doubt

985
00:50:00,200 --> 00:50:03,040
Speaker 2: about it. He's coming off this great year that he

986
00:50:03,120 --> 00:50:07,239
Speaker 2: has things that somehow he was able to fall all

987
00:50:07,280 --> 00:50:09,880
Speaker 2: out of favor in New York. But he's someone that

988
00:50:10,000 --> 00:50:14,560
Speaker 2: has really impressive power, and if not for Luke injuries,

989
00:50:14,800 --> 00:50:16,759
Speaker 2: like he'd already be established as one of the key

990
00:50:16,760 --> 00:50:18,840
Speaker 2: pieces of the organization moving forward.

991
00:50:19,800 --> 00:50:21,399
Speaker 3: Man I said that a couple of years ago, it's

992
00:50:21,400 --> 00:50:24,439
Speaker 3: weird he's not injury prone, and he said the same

993
00:50:24,520 --> 00:50:26,759
Speaker 3: thing in spring training. He said, you know, I know

994
00:50:26,800 --> 00:50:29,480
Speaker 3: people think that I'm injury prone, but I'm not. And

995
00:50:29,560 --> 00:50:33,239
Speaker 3: it's true because they're not soft tissue injuries or ligaments.

996
00:50:33,280 --> 00:50:35,880
Speaker 3: It's getting hit on the hand, getting hit on the

997
00:50:35,880 --> 00:50:40,160
Speaker 3: hand again, making a diving play and re injuring that

998
00:50:40,320 --> 00:50:45,919
Speaker 3: same hands. It's getting COVID back in July. It's all

999
00:50:46,360 --> 00:50:50,759
Speaker 3: freak injuries. And when he's healthy, he is one of

1000
00:50:50,800 --> 00:50:52,759
Speaker 3: the best hitters in this lineup and the type of

1001
00:50:52,840 --> 00:50:55,400
Speaker 3: hitter that the Marlins have been missing since Stanton. I'm

1002
00:50:55,440 --> 00:50:58,640
Speaker 3: not saying he's as good as Stanton, but his power

1003
00:50:58,719 --> 00:51:00,640
Speaker 3: is something to the Marlins black.

1004
00:51:02,239 --> 00:51:05,160
Speaker 1: And power to all fields.

1005
00:51:05,239 --> 00:51:07,759
Speaker 2: And of course we saw now at the end of

1006
00:51:07,760 --> 00:51:09,400
Speaker 2: the regular season and end the postseason, he gets some

1007
00:51:09,400 --> 00:51:12,279
Speaker 2: of the most important home runs, not just the longest ones.

1008
00:51:12,280 --> 00:51:13,680
Speaker 2: He did hit some of the longest ones, but some

1009
00:51:13,719 --> 00:51:16,160
Speaker 2: of the most important ones too to help clinch their

1010
00:51:16,200 --> 00:51:18,759
Speaker 2: postseason spot and then of course help clinch that that

1011
00:51:18,880 --> 00:51:22,560
Speaker 2: series against the Cubs and the wildcard rounds. But as

1012
00:51:22,600 --> 00:51:24,759
Speaker 2: we're going to spin this forward before we get out

1013
00:51:24,800 --> 00:51:28,560
Speaker 2: of here, that, I mean, the situation is still developing. Actually,

1014
00:51:28,880 --> 00:51:31,560
Speaker 2: as we're recording this, we just got news that Don

1015
00:51:31,600 --> 00:51:34,840
Speaker 2: Mattingly is going to be addressing the media on Tuesday,

1016
00:51:34,920 --> 00:51:37,480
Speaker 2: tomorrow morning, so we'll be listening in on that to

1017
00:51:38,040 --> 00:51:40,040
Speaker 2: get his thoughts on the end of the Michael Hill

1018
00:51:40,080 --> 00:51:43,680
Speaker 2: era and where the thing stands moving forward. But clearly

1019
00:51:43,680 --> 00:51:46,719
Speaker 2: the organization is still in a pretty early phase when

1020
00:51:46,719 --> 00:51:49,640
Speaker 2: it comes to figuring out next steps. I think there's

1021
00:51:49,719 --> 00:51:54,600
Speaker 2: been naturally some expectation that already executives within the front

1022
00:51:54,640 --> 00:51:57,640
Speaker 2: office are going to be elevated into more significant roles.

1023
00:51:57,680 --> 00:52:00,839
Speaker 2: In fact, they already Cheeter already formally now bounced that

1024
00:52:01,320 --> 00:52:05,799
Speaker 2: Dan Greenley, who's the head of really all their analytics operations,

1025
00:52:05,800 --> 00:52:09,160
Speaker 2: he's been promoted to assistant general manager. There's maybe the

1026
00:52:09,160 --> 00:52:14,160
Speaker 2: possibility that Gary Denbo gets moved up from VP to GM.

1027
00:52:14,360 --> 00:52:18,040
Speaker 2: If he's interested in that, we'll see. But if they

1028
00:52:18,040 --> 00:52:24,000
Speaker 2: do choose to add from outside the organization, the early speculation,

1029
00:52:24,160 --> 00:52:26,320
Speaker 2: it's really all it is is speculation at this point

1030
00:52:26,440 --> 00:52:30,839
Speaker 2: from guys like Craig Mish, just throwing names out there

1031
00:52:30,840 --> 00:52:34,200
Speaker 2: that have pretty strong former Yankee connections and therefore as

1032
00:52:34,200 --> 00:52:38,279
Speaker 2: a result Derek Jeter connections, such as Billy Eppler, who

1033
00:52:38,360 --> 00:52:41,400
Speaker 2: was the GM of Angels the last five years. That

1034
00:52:41,480 --> 00:52:43,839
Speaker 2: was a highly desirable job when he got it, and

1035
00:52:44,120 --> 00:52:46,000
Speaker 2: he things did not work out. You know.

1036
00:52:46,160 --> 00:52:48,279
Speaker 1: It kind of mirrored the situation that.

1037
00:52:48,320 --> 00:52:52,120
Speaker 2: Marlins were in under before the rebuild, and that they

1038
00:52:52,160 --> 00:52:54,520
Speaker 2: just could not figure out how to assemble a competent

1039
00:52:54,600 --> 00:52:57,440
Speaker 2: pitching staff and build around Mike Trout. They never had

1040
00:52:57,480 --> 00:53:00,560
Speaker 2: a winning season with Eppler as GM, and he was

1041
00:53:00,760 --> 00:53:04,240
Speaker 2: understandably let go after that. He's a little bit younger

1042
00:53:04,280 --> 00:53:06,799
Speaker 2: than Michael hill Is. He is a lot of years

1043
00:53:06,800 --> 00:53:09,640
Speaker 2: ahead of him working in the game. But of course

1044
00:53:09,920 --> 00:53:13,359
Speaker 2: this is not the most encouraging. He doesn't have any

1045
00:53:13,400 --> 00:53:16,359
Speaker 2: momentum necessarily going into this job search after a very

1046
00:53:16,360 --> 00:53:20,120
Speaker 2: disappointing tenure with the Angels. Tim Naaring was another name

1047
00:53:20,440 --> 00:53:23,400
Speaker 2: that has been suggested. He had a very substantial playing

1048
00:53:23,440 --> 00:53:27,200
Speaker 2: career in the majors during the nineteen nineties, and after

1049
00:53:27,239 --> 00:53:30,000
Speaker 2: that he moved into the Yankees' front office in the

1050
00:53:30,040 --> 00:53:33,000
Speaker 2: mid two thousands. In fact, when Billy Eppler left for

1051
00:53:33,040 --> 00:53:36,120
Speaker 2: the Angel's job five years ago, tim Naaring took Eppler's

1052
00:53:36,200 --> 00:53:41,719
Speaker 2: jobs as a high ranking scouting official within the Yankees organization.

1053
00:53:42,239 --> 00:53:45,440
Speaker 2: So that's where he's been for the last handful of years.

1054
00:53:45,920 --> 00:53:49,080
Speaker 2: And a third name that I think Misch just mentioned

1055
00:53:49,080 --> 00:53:52,279
Speaker 2: earlier today on Monday was Jim Hendry, who was the

1056
00:53:52,280 --> 00:53:55,319
Speaker 2: Cubs GM for about a full decade from what two

1057
00:53:55,360 --> 00:53:59,200
Speaker 2: thousand and two to about twenty eleven. The Cubs made

1058
00:53:59,200 --> 00:54:01,879
Speaker 2: the playoffs a few times since then. Of course, there

1059
00:54:01,920 --> 00:54:03,759
Speaker 2: was that year where they ran into the Marlins. If

1060
00:54:03,800 --> 00:54:06,439
Speaker 2: not for the Marlins, if not for Steve Bartman, and

1061
00:54:06,520 --> 00:54:09,720
Speaker 2: what else happens that maybe the Cubs make the World

1062
00:54:09,800 --> 00:54:12,840
Speaker 2: Series at the very beginning of Henry's tenure, and they

1063
00:54:12,840 --> 00:54:14,960
Speaker 2: would make it back a few years after that as well.

1064
00:54:15,600 --> 00:54:18,920
Speaker 2: He was a guy that ultimately he got booted in

1065
00:54:19,120 --> 00:54:23,080
Speaker 2: twenty at the twenty eleven season when the team they

1066
00:54:23,160 --> 00:54:25,799
Speaker 2: missed their competitive window, they hadn't fully taken advantage of it,

1067
00:54:26,200 --> 00:54:29,400
Speaker 2: and theo Epstein came in and brought in his own people.

1068
00:54:29,440 --> 00:54:31,479
Speaker 2: So Henry has been out of that job for about

1069
00:54:31,560 --> 00:54:34,040
Speaker 2: nine years now, and since then he has been with

1070
00:54:34,080 --> 00:54:36,920
Speaker 2: the Yankees organization as a special assistant. So all three

1071
00:54:36,920 --> 00:54:39,000
Speaker 2: of these guys have a lot of experience in the

1072
00:54:39,040 --> 00:54:41,520
Speaker 2: Yankees front office. They were there when Jeter was still

1073
00:54:41,520 --> 00:54:44,560
Speaker 2: a player. They were there when Gary denbo was still

1074
00:54:45,160 --> 00:54:48,440
Speaker 2: prominently involved in the playerge development for the Yankees. And

1075
00:54:48,520 --> 00:54:52,040
Speaker 2: so it's with those connections that the speculation has been

1076
00:54:52,040 --> 00:54:54,960
Speaker 2: that they might be guys who receive interviews for this

1077
00:54:55,080 --> 00:54:59,880
Speaker 2: opening with the Marlins organization. I guess I'm just wondering

1078
00:55:00,280 --> 00:55:03,520
Speaker 2: if there's anything you're personally looking for in a candidate

1079
00:55:03,560 --> 00:55:07,560
Speaker 2: to fill this position. I think, frankly, at least from

1080
00:55:07,560 --> 00:55:11,120
Speaker 2: my perspective, there isn't a one sexy candidate in this situation.

1081
00:55:11,520 --> 00:55:15,680
Speaker 2: Sometimes there are guys that have actually led World Series

1082
00:55:15,719 --> 00:55:20,200
Speaker 2: teams or been successful gms more recently, there's not an

1083
00:55:20,239 --> 00:55:24,080
Speaker 2: obvious guy here to me, But I mean, what do

1084
00:55:24,120 --> 00:55:26,680
Speaker 2: you think they should be prioritizing in this job search?

1085
00:55:26,719 --> 00:55:32,319
Speaker 2: What would be higher that you think gets fans to

1086
00:55:32,719 --> 00:55:35,120
Speaker 2: buy into what's going on here and feel like this

1087
00:55:35,200 --> 00:55:36,840
Speaker 2: franchise is still heading in the right direction.

1088
00:55:38,440 --> 00:55:40,360
Speaker 3: Well, I know it sounds simple, but it's something that

1089
00:55:40,400 --> 00:55:43,759
Speaker 3: we were missing during the Samson and Laurier era, which

1090
00:55:43,840 --> 00:55:47,120
Speaker 3: is the ability to keep things balanced between the farm

1091
00:55:47,160 --> 00:55:50,560
Speaker 3: system and the major league roster. I remember David Samson

1092
00:55:50,920 --> 00:55:53,680
Speaker 3: was on an interview with the Dan Levatard Show like

1093
00:55:53,719 --> 00:55:56,799
Speaker 3: a year ago, and he made a comment that it

1094
00:55:57,200 --> 00:56:01,279
Speaker 3: still stays in my head all these months later, where

1095
00:56:01,280 --> 00:56:05,520
Speaker 3: he and this is David Sampson, former Major League Baseball executive,

1096
00:56:05,600 --> 00:56:08,640
Speaker 3: says who cares about a farm system? So it just

1097
00:56:09,040 --> 00:56:11,880
Speaker 3: quote that's that is an actual quote that he said,

1098
00:56:12,560 --> 00:56:15,320
Speaker 3: And it's crazy how that's how the Martins used to operate.

1099
00:56:15,520 --> 00:56:19,160
Speaker 3: I just want someone who can build a farm system

1100
00:56:19,200 --> 00:56:21,960
Speaker 3: the same way that Jeter and Denbo and Hill were

1101
00:56:21,960 --> 00:56:25,520
Speaker 3: able to do these last three years while also being

1102
00:56:25,560 --> 00:56:27,839
Speaker 3: able to make a deal at the deadline when they

1103
00:56:27,880 --> 00:56:31,120
Speaker 3: need to to get major league help. We've seen them

1104
00:56:31,600 --> 00:56:34,400
Speaker 3: replenish this farm system, but other than Starling Marte and

1105
00:56:34,440 --> 00:56:38,000
Speaker 3: a couple of other guys on the peripheral, like you know,

1106
00:56:38,080 --> 00:56:41,080
Speaker 3: Corey Dickerson, a little Bit and Brandon kinsall as a closer.

1107
00:56:41,520 --> 00:56:45,960
Speaker 3: We haven't seen them make a ton of sexy moves

1108
00:56:46,000 --> 00:56:47,640
Speaker 3: in free agency or through trades.

1109
00:56:49,560 --> 00:56:51,759
Speaker 2: The biggest free agent deal that they've handed out so

1110
00:56:51,880 --> 00:56:55,400
Speaker 2: far has been Corey Dickerson last off season, one that

1111
00:56:56,040 --> 00:56:57,600
Speaker 2: I think a lot of people were on board with.

1112
00:56:57,680 --> 00:56:59,959
Speaker 2: But I mean, it's off to a really bad start

1113
00:57:00,120 --> 00:57:02,520
Speaker 2: that first year. Now it's backloaded and you don't know

1114
00:57:02,560 --> 00:57:03,880
Speaker 2: exactly what his future is going to be.

1115
00:57:04,440 --> 00:57:06,000
Speaker 1: And I mean no doubt about it.

1116
00:57:06,040 --> 00:57:08,879
Speaker 2: This is going to be a very uncertain offseason around

1117
00:57:08,920 --> 00:57:12,600
Speaker 2: baseball with no fans in attendance during the regular season,

1118
00:57:12,719 --> 00:57:16,439
Speaker 2: revenues are down, and you don't know exactly how that's

1119
00:57:16,440 --> 00:57:19,080
Speaker 2: going to affect the behavior the way these teams try

1120
00:57:19,120 --> 00:57:23,720
Speaker 2: to balance their competitiveness with the balance sheet that their

1121
00:57:23,720 --> 00:57:26,080
Speaker 2: owners have in one that a lot of them are

1122
00:57:26,120 --> 00:57:28,600
Speaker 2: crying poor, even though there are other factors that suggest

1123
00:57:28,720 --> 00:57:32,680
Speaker 2: that the financial health is still in great shape around

1124
00:57:32,720 --> 00:57:35,600
Speaker 2: the league. So it's unclear exactly. It's a new challenge

1125
00:57:35,600 --> 00:57:39,200
Speaker 2: for whoever heads into this situation, even if it's someone

1126
00:57:39,200 --> 00:57:41,240
Speaker 2: that was already in the front office. It's yeah, it's

1127
00:57:41,240 --> 00:57:44,560
Speaker 2: a really weird year to be taking over. So We're

1128
00:57:44,560 --> 00:57:46,120
Speaker 2: going to have coverage of it every step of the

1129
00:57:46,120 --> 00:57:47,080
Speaker 2: way throughout this search.

1130
00:57:47,120 --> 00:57:48,400
Speaker 1: I mean, the Marlins have a lot of time.

1131
00:57:48,800 --> 00:57:51,840
Speaker 2: The full offseason doesn't start until after the World Series

1132
00:57:51,920 --> 00:57:54,720
Speaker 2: is completed, and we're recording this right on the heels

1133
00:57:54,720 --> 00:57:56,520
Speaker 2: of the World Series starting, so they've still got some

1134
00:57:56,560 --> 00:57:59,840
Speaker 2: time to figure out who to bring in. And until

1135
00:58:00,000 --> 00:58:01,600
Speaker 2: he gets the real meat of the off season, there's

1136
00:58:01,640 --> 00:58:05,040
Speaker 2: no pressure to formally announce anything. We'll have coverage of

1137
00:58:05,120 --> 00:58:08,080
Speaker 2: that Don Mattingly presser coming up on Tuesday and see

1138
00:58:08,080 --> 00:58:10,720
Speaker 2: if he has anything interesting to say, and then we'll yeah,

1139
00:58:10,840 --> 00:58:13,800
Speaker 2: as more substantial reports come in about this opening, we'll

1140
00:58:13,840 --> 00:58:16,560
Speaker 2: figure it out. People can find you on Twitter at

1141
00:58:16,600 --> 00:58:21,160
Speaker 2: Alex krutchik fs. They can find me sitting behind the

1142
00:58:21,240 --> 00:58:24,560
Speaker 2: fish Strips accounts, but also at Real ELI with E

1143
00:58:24,840 --> 00:58:28,120
Speaker 2: L Y ending with why at the ends, and we'll

1144
00:58:28,120 --> 00:58:32,560
Speaker 2: have you covered throughout this entire crazy offseason and that's

1145
00:58:32,600 --> 00:58:34,560
Speaker 2: about to get started the way that things are going

1146
00:58:34,600 --> 00:58:37,040
Speaker 2: to go. Wishing all the best Michael Hill, though, I mean,

1147
00:58:37,360 --> 00:58:39,840
Speaker 2: we've had some little bit opportunities to address him and

1148
00:58:39,960 --> 00:58:44,600
Speaker 2: pressers he's and speaking with people that have worked under

1149
00:58:44,640 --> 00:58:47,920
Speaker 2: him in the organization. I think it's pretty unanimous that

1150
00:58:47,960 --> 00:58:51,880
Speaker 2: he treated people well and that he knew baseball pretty well.

1151
00:58:51,920 --> 00:58:54,200
Speaker 2: Even if he's not exactly the fit that they wanted

1152
00:58:54,240 --> 00:58:58,000
Speaker 2: in this organization moving forward, he was no doubt a

1153
00:58:58,040 --> 00:59:00,880
Speaker 2: big assets of this organization. In one that he has

1154
00:59:00,920 --> 00:59:02,320
Speaker 2: a lot of years left in this game. I think

1155
00:59:02,360 --> 00:59:05,040
Speaker 2: he's only forty nine years old, even though he's spent

1156
00:59:05,080 --> 00:59:08,760
Speaker 2: half his life working for the Marlin sees, there's gonna

1157
00:59:08,760 --> 00:59:10,880
Speaker 2: be some openings for him around the league, So the

1158
00:59:10,960 --> 00:59:12,920
Speaker 2: Marlins are going to have to go through him eventually

1159
00:59:13,000 --> 00:59:15,280
Speaker 2: to consentans He's I'm sure going to be involved in

1160
00:59:15,360 --> 00:59:18,520
Speaker 2: another front office moving forward, whether it's in twenty twenty

1161
00:59:18,600 --> 00:59:20,360
Speaker 2: one or maybe he takes a little bit of time off,

1162
00:59:20,960 --> 00:59:23,880
Speaker 2: but he's Yeah, he had a big impact on this

1163
00:59:24,000 --> 00:59:27,760
Speaker 2: organization seven years as the head of Baseball Ops nineteen

1164
00:59:27,840 --> 00:59:31,920
Speaker 2: years total. He came in at the very start of

1165
00:59:31,960 --> 00:59:36,840
Speaker 2: that Lauria David Sampson era, and he survives when most

1166
00:59:36,840 --> 00:59:39,480
Speaker 2: of the other guys didn't during that transition. So wishing

1167
00:59:39,520 --> 00:59:42,480
Speaker 2: Mike Hill all the best and looking forward to an

1168
00:59:42,480 --> 00:59:46,320
Speaker 2: exciting Marlins offseason. So for Alex Crutcheck, for Eli Susman,

1169
00:59:46,640 --> 00:59:48,320
Speaker 2: thank you for listening. To the pod, be.

1170
00:59:48,280 --> 00:59:51,040
Speaker 1: Sure to rate and review, and tune in.

1171
00:59:51,080 --> 00:59:53,160
Speaker 2: We're going to be doing a lot more pods moving

1172
00:59:53,200 --> 00:59:54,480
Speaker 2: forward throughout this offseason.

1173
00:59:54,960 --> 01:00:05,480
Speaker 1: Go Fish inducted INT