1 00:00:00,320 --> 00:00:03,000 Speaker 1: Brought to you by the reinvented two thousand twelve Camray. 2 00:00:03,240 --> 00:00:10,000 Speaker 1: It's ready. Are you welcome to step Mom Never told you? 3 00:00:10,200 --> 00:00:17,639 Speaker 1: From house stuff works dot com. Hey thereon, Welcome to 4 00:00:17,640 --> 00:00:20,360 Speaker 1: the podcast. This is Kristen and this is Molly, So Molly. 5 00:00:20,440 --> 00:00:24,560 Speaker 1: We got a lot of response from our wonderful mom 6 00:00:24,640 --> 00:00:29,840 Speaker 1: Stuff listeners about our podcast on why women keep or 7 00:00:29,920 --> 00:00:34,280 Speaker 1: give up their maiden names. Yes, everyone's story is fascinating. Yeah. 8 00:00:34,280 --> 00:00:37,560 Speaker 1: We got great stories from guys and girls who kept 9 00:00:37,600 --> 00:00:40,520 Speaker 1: their maiden name, guys who took their wife's names, all 10 00:00:40,560 --> 00:00:43,800 Speaker 1: sorts of versions of of what they did with their 11 00:00:43,840 --> 00:00:47,519 Speaker 1: last names when they got married. But one question that 12 00:00:47,600 --> 00:00:50,880 Speaker 1: came up a lot in these listener emails was about 13 00:00:50,920 --> 00:00:53,600 Speaker 1: what to do if you are a woman who keeps 14 00:00:53,600 --> 00:00:59,160 Speaker 1: her maiden name and you want to signify that you 15 00:00:59,200 --> 00:01:01,000 Speaker 1: were married, but still of the your maiden name, you 16 00:01:01,000 --> 00:01:02,520 Speaker 1: don't have the same last name as your husband. What 17 00:01:02,520 --> 00:01:05,880 Speaker 1: do you do? For instance, I will refer to this 18 00:01:06,000 --> 00:01:10,480 Speaker 1: email from a listener named Lucy, and Lucy kept her 19 00:01:11,080 --> 00:01:13,280 Speaker 1: maiden name when she got married and she says um. 20 00:01:13,319 --> 00:01:17,479 Speaker 1: Among all the questions I received is one, how will 21 00:01:17,480 --> 00:01:19,160 Speaker 1: people know if you're married? If you don't have the 22 00:01:19,160 --> 00:01:21,080 Speaker 1: same name as your husband, and I was interested to 23 00:01:21,120 --> 00:01:23,319 Speaker 1: see if you have any data or thoughts with regard 24 00:01:23,360 --> 00:01:26,240 Speaker 1: to what title women who keep their maiden name prefer 25 00:01:26,360 --> 00:01:29,200 Speaker 1: to adopt. I don't feel like a MSS because I've 26 00:01:29,200 --> 00:01:32,440 Speaker 1: not taken my husband's name, and MS seems to suggest 27 00:01:32,520 --> 00:01:35,520 Speaker 1: that I'm divorced, that I've divorced a lot of people. 28 00:01:35,959 --> 00:01:38,760 Speaker 1: So I've stuck with miss for now. But even this 29 00:01:38,800 --> 00:01:40,959 Speaker 1: has created problems recently when I was applying for car 30 00:01:40,959 --> 00:01:43,360 Speaker 1: insurance and the website wouldn't permit me to state that 31 00:01:43,440 --> 00:01:47,760 Speaker 1: I was a MISS and married. Yeah, so sticky situation. 32 00:01:47,800 --> 00:01:50,320 Speaker 1: It is very sticky because you know, we got email 33 00:01:50,320 --> 00:01:52,840 Speaker 1: from listeners who are like, Mrs So and so is 34 00:01:52,880 --> 00:01:56,720 Speaker 1: my husband's mother if I haven't taken that last name so, 35 00:01:57,120 --> 00:01:59,480 Speaker 1: and you know, if you're addressing wedding invitations to people, 36 00:01:59,520 --> 00:02:01,680 Speaker 1: what do you put? Yeah, what's the etiquette for it? 37 00:02:01,720 --> 00:02:04,280 Speaker 1: And then some people have hang ups with the title 38 00:02:04,360 --> 00:02:07,320 Speaker 1: miss because it seems to have, uh, I don't know, 39 00:02:07,320 --> 00:02:12,359 Speaker 1: political connotations these days that they might not like. So 40 00:02:12,360 --> 00:02:15,200 Speaker 1: so we decided that where the connotations, let's sake, let's 41 00:02:15,200 --> 00:02:17,760 Speaker 1: take this maiden Names Part two and look at the 42 00:02:17,760 --> 00:02:22,520 Speaker 1: difference between Ms Mrs miss and try to figure this 43 00:02:22,520 --> 00:02:26,040 Speaker 1: out and answer some of else questions. So let's start 44 00:02:26,080 --> 00:02:30,160 Speaker 1: with um, just the basic etymology of mrs. Okay, because 45 00:02:30,160 --> 00:02:32,120 Speaker 1: back in the day, you know, your mom was probably 46 00:02:32,200 --> 00:02:37,399 Speaker 1: Mrs Edmunds. My mom was, yeah, you know what I mean. UM. 47 00:02:37,440 --> 00:02:40,480 Speaker 1: That was you know, the general title that the American 48 00:02:40,560 --> 00:02:47,280 Speaker 1: wives gave themselves. So, according to the Online Etymology Dictionary, UM, 49 00:02:47,440 --> 00:02:51,960 Speaker 1: mrs was an abbreviation of mistress and um. It was 50 00:02:52,000 --> 00:02:57,880 Speaker 1: the plural from the French madam, and the pronunciation mrs. 51 00:02:57,960 --> 00:03:01,680 Speaker 1: Was considered vulgar until at least the eighteenth century, and 52 00:03:01,760 --> 00:03:05,440 Speaker 1: it was considered one's wife from around nineteen twenties, so 53 00:03:05,480 --> 00:03:07,360 Speaker 1: it actually hasn't been around as long as I thought 54 00:03:07,360 --> 00:03:09,280 Speaker 1: it had been. So it was weller because people from 55 00:03:09,360 --> 00:03:12,880 Speaker 1: very early on got this connotation with um. The French brothels, 56 00:03:12,880 --> 00:03:17,200 Speaker 1: if you will, There were madame's operating these nightclubs where 57 00:03:17,240 --> 00:03:20,840 Speaker 1: shady dealings were done. But originally just mistress was meant 58 00:03:20,880 --> 00:03:25,760 Speaker 1: to show that you've had power over underlings, basically run 59 00:03:25,760 --> 00:03:28,840 Speaker 1: out a state. Then that meant that you had uh, 60 00:03:28,880 --> 00:03:31,440 Speaker 1: you know, maybe servants that you were taking care of. 61 00:03:31,480 --> 00:03:35,000 Speaker 1: It was just a position of power getting often here 62 00:03:35,080 --> 00:03:39,080 Speaker 1: in older literature, the the the term mistress of the house. 63 00:03:39,520 --> 00:03:42,480 Speaker 1: She's the one who takes care of all the house affairs. 64 00:03:42,480 --> 00:03:46,160 Speaker 1: She's not necessarily someone's wife, and she wasn't necessarily the 65 00:03:46,200 --> 00:03:49,560 Speaker 1: woman that your husband is having affair with. Like that 66 00:03:49,600 --> 00:03:52,280 Speaker 1: connotation came along much later as well. And then on 67 00:03:52,320 --> 00:03:55,560 Speaker 1: the flip side, you have miss, which was usually used 68 00:03:55,560 --> 00:03:59,240 Speaker 1: just to denote a younger girl. Right, so to abbreviate mistress, 69 00:03:59,240 --> 00:04:02,840 Speaker 1: they got mrs. Right, And so then to say, okay, 70 00:04:03,240 --> 00:04:05,160 Speaker 1: mrs is sort of an older lady with this power. 71 00:04:05,440 --> 00:04:08,120 Speaker 1: The young miss of the house, yes, has no power 72 00:04:08,160 --> 00:04:11,600 Speaker 1: yet she's going to school. Yes, I don't know why 73 00:04:11,600 --> 00:04:16,680 Speaker 1: that required accents um. But then in the nineteenth century, 74 00:04:16,760 --> 00:04:19,240 Speaker 1: what we've got is the Industrial Revolution, and so more 75 00:04:19,240 --> 00:04:21,320 Speaker 1: women head off to the workplace. They're not just stuck 76 00:04:21,320 --> 00:04:24,800 Speaker 1: in these big old estates anymore. And for one reason 77 00:04:24,880 --> 00:04:26,760 Speaker 1: or another, the other people that they're working with one 78 00:04:26,800 --> 00:04:29,760 Speaker 1: to know if they're married or not. Social availability, Yeah, 79 00:04:29,800 --> 00:04:33,159 Speaker 1: who who was available in this sweatshop? So the use 80 00:04:33,400 --> 00:04:37,360 Speaker 1: of ms versus mss to define whether or not you 81 00:04:37,480 --> 00:04:40,440 Speaker 1: were married, um, came out as a result of women 82 00:04:40,680 --> 00:04:43,640 Speaker 1: in the workplace, and I guess men wanting to know 83 00:04:43,839 --> 00:04:47,599 Speaker 1: whether or not they could course them. So then another 84 00:04:47,640 --> 00:04:50,160 Speaker 1: common thing for women in the workplace was to be 85 00:04:50,200 --> 00:04:53,560 Speaker 1: a secretary. Yes, and the secretaries would type up all 86 00:04:53,640 --> 00:04:57,719 Speaker 1: the correspondence for their boss. And there's the question of 87 00:04:57,760 --> 00:05:00,479 Speaker 1: if you're sending a letter to a lady and you 88 00:05:00,480 --> 00:05:02,440 Speaker 1: don't know if she's a miss or mrs what do 89 00:05:02,440 --> 00:05:04,760 Speaker 1: you do? You don't want to offender. That was sort 90 00:05:04,800 --> 00:05:08,440 Speaker 1: of the first real instance of miss as this um 91 00:05:08,640 --> 00:05:10,960 Speaker 1: generic term for a woman. Yeah, this is something that 92 00:05:11,000 --> 00:05:15,159 Speaker 1: these secretaries came up with, and the first use of miss. Well, 93 00:05:15,200 --> 00:05:18,359 Speaker 1: the Oxford English Dictionary attributes the first formal use of 94 00:05:18,440 --> 00:05:20,880 Speaker 1: miss to a book called the Simplified Letter, which was 95 00:05:20,920 --> 00:05:24,200 Speaker 1: published in nineteen fifty two for the National Office of 96 00:05:24,240 --> 00:05:27,039 Speaker 1: Management Association. Right, so if you're a secretary, this is 97 00:05:27,080 --> 00:05:28,720 Speaker 1: the book you get, and it says when you don't 98 00:05:28,720 --> 00:05:31,000 Speaker 1: know how to address a woman, just put miss in there. Yeah, 99 00:05:31,320 --> 00:05:34,840 Speaker 1: makes sense, um, But some people do um date the 100 00:05:34,880 --> 00:05:38,279 Speaker 1: first use of miss all the way back to seventeen 101 00:05:38,760 --> 00:05:40,839 Speaker 1: sixty seven when they said that it appeared on the 102 00:05:40,880 --> 00:05:43,839 Speaker 1: tombstone of a woman named Sarah Spooner and it was 103 00:05:43,839 --> 00:05:47,120 Speaker 1: again it was just another abbreviation, abbreviation for mistress like 104 00:05:47,640 --> 00:05:51,240 Speaker 1: mrs m R S was. So originally it's just this abbreviation. 105 00:05:51,680 --> 00:05:54,880 Speaker 1: It's this way to UM, you know, avoid confusion and 106 00:05:54,960 --> 00:05:58,120 Speaker 1: letter writing. And then the feminists got ahold of it, 107 00:05:58,200 --> 00:06:00,960 Speaker 1: and they got ahold of it through these Secretary Aerl handbooks. Right, 108 00:06:01,000 --> 00:06:03,360 Speaker 1: we have second wave feminism which comes up in the 109 00:06:03,480 --> 00:06:07,680 Speaker 1: nineteen sixties, in nineteen seventies, and their tagline, one of 110 00:06:07,680 --> 00:06:10,720 Speaker 1: the taglines at least of the movement was uh, personal 111 00:06:10,839 --> 00:06:14,760 Speaker 1: is political, And it's really this idea of women changing 112 00:06:15,200 --> 00:06:18,800 Speaker 1: how they are perceived UM in their daily lives through 113 00:06:19,120 --> 00:06:23,600 Speaker 1: UM political actions. And in nineteen seventy, the National Organization 114 00:06:23,720 --> 00:06:28,960 Speaker 1: for Women UM made a formal request for or past 115 00:06:29,000 --> 00:06:31,920 Speaker 1: the formal resolution calling for the use of miss to 116 00:06:32,080 --> 00:06:36,120 Speaker 1: denote other, single, married, whatever, so that women would no 117 00:06:36,160 --> 00:06:39,520 Speaker 1: longer have to be defined in terms of whether or 118 00:06:39,560 --> 00:06:42,360 Speaker 1: not that they were connected to another man. Because as 119 00:06:42,360 --> 00:06:48,279 Speaker 1: a mister, anybody who's a mister single, single, married, divorced, widowed, whatever, 120 00:06:48,320 --> 00:06:50,560 Speaker 1: he's going to be MR his whole life. Everyone's amster. 121 00:06:50,720 --> 00:06:53,760 Speaker 1: So they were thinking, by definition, there should be a 122 00:06:53,839 --> 00:06:56,000 Speaker 1: term that all women can be as well. And if 123 00:06:56,000 --> 00:06:58,320 Speaker 1: you've listened to the Maiden Name podcast along with this, 124 00:06:58,360 --> 00:07:01,279 Speaker 1: is sort of the same movement. Hey, A, don't change 125 00:07:01,320 --> 00:07:04,600 Speaker 1: your name. When you're introduced to someone as Mrs. You know, 126 00:07:04,880 --> 00:07:08,080 Speaker 1: John Wayne, you are putting yourself out in the world 127 00:07:08,120 --> 00:07:13,120 Speaker 1: as this person's wife. And by being Mss Molly Edmonds. 128 00:07:13,160 --> 00:07:16,000 Speaker 1: I guess if I married John Wayne, then I'm presenting 129 00:07:16,160 --> 00:07:17,760 Speaker 1: the world. I'm presenting myself to the world as me 130 00:07:17,840 --> 00:07:20,480 Speaker 1: as opposed to this person's property. I don't know why 131 00:07:20,520 --> 00:07:22,080 Speaker 1: I thought of John Wayne. I don't know what. I'm 132 00:07:22,160 --> 00:07:24,920 Speaker 1: picturing your wedding photos right now, and it's kind of 133 00:07:24,960 --> 00:07:29,600 Speaker 1: awesome Wild West wedding. Yes, um. But the interesting thing 134 00:07:29,720 --> 00:07:33,880 Speaker 1: about this push for MISS to become adopted by a 135 00:07:33,920 --> 00:07:38,560 Speaker 1: lot of women is the number one force holding out 136 00:07:38,640 --> 00:07:42,680 Speaker 1: against MISS, the anti MISS faction, led by The New 137 00:07:42,760 --> 00:07:45,280 Speaker 1: York Times. Yeah, this was amazing to me. In the research, 138 00:07:45,320 --> 00:07:47,520 Speaker 1: you know, there there was some quote I read that 139 00:07:48,040 --> 00:07:49,840 Speaker 1: at one point when The New York Times was describing 140 00:07:49,840 --> 00:07:53,280 Speaker 1: a party that UM Gloria Steinham hosted, they had to say, 141 00:07:53,880 --> 00:07:57,280 Speaker 1: you know, Miss Steinham, who works at MS magazine. So 142 00:07:57,320 --> 00:08:00,360 Speaker 1: the only way they had referred to MSS was relation 143 00:08:00,400 --> 00:08:03,560 Speaker 1: to the magazine. So the New York Times basically holds 144 00:08:03,560 --> 00:08:06,119 Speaker 1: this editorial standard, like we're not going to change to MISS, 145 00:08:06,200 --> 00:08:09,080 Speaker 1: even though every other newspaper is doing it. It's just 146 00:08:09,280 --> 00:08:11,440 Speaker 1: it's we don't need it. Yeah, they got flak from 147 00:08:11,440 --> 00:08:14,440 Speaker 1: other publications as well. I think Time published a piece 148 00:08:14,520 --> 00:08:17,680 Speaker 1: in the maybe late seventies early eighties lambast in the 149 00:08:17,680 --> 00:08:19,760 Speaker 1: New York Times for not switching over to MISS because 150 00:08:19,800 --> 00:08:22,760 Speaker 1: a lot of other major news outlets had adopted miss 151 00:08:22,880 --> 00:08:27,160 Speaker 1: as the honorific title for women. And it wasn't until 152 00:08:27,440 --> 00:08:31,600 Speaker 1: nineteen four, when Geraldine Ferraro is running on the Democratic 153 00:08:31,640 --> 00:08:35,120 Speaker 1: ticket for vice president, that the New York Times finally caves. 154 00:08:35,240 --> 00:08:38,400 Speaker 1: Gerlen Ferraro was married to a man named John Zacharo. 155 00:08:38,440 --> 00:08:40,760 Speaker 1: I may not be pronouncing that right, but she kept 156 00:08:40,760 --> 00:08:43,280 Speaker 1: her main names. So she was gerald and Ferraro married 157 00:08:43,320 --> 00:08:46,040 Speaker 1: to John Zacharrow, so she should have been Mrs Zacharo, 158 00:08:46,320 --> 00:08:48,520 Speaker 1: but she kept her maiden name. Now, what she wanted 159 00:08:48,559 --> 00:08:51,880 Speaker 1: to be called was either Miss Ferraro because she liked 160 00:08:51,960 --> 00:08:54,800 Speaker 1: that sort of terminology that these people had adopted, or 161 00:08:54,880 --> 00:08:58,880 Speaker 1: Congresswoman Ferraro. Um. But you know, there was this debate 162 00:08:59,360 --> 00:09:02,000 Speaker 1: with George H. W. Bush and he made this big 163 00:09:02,040 --> 00:09:04,520 Speaker 1: deal of calling her Mrs Ferraro. Yeah, she would refer 164 00:09:04,600 --> 00:09:07,400 Speaker 1: to she referenced him as Vice President Bush, and he 165 00:09:07,400 --> 00:09:09,960 Speaker 1: would come back at her with, well, Mrs Ferraro, right, 166 00:09:10,040 --> 00:09:11,520 Speaker 1: And you know, it was seen as this move to 167 00:09:11,559 --> 00:09:14,440 Speaker 1: put her like distinctly in a domestic sphere as opposed 168 00:09:14,480 --> 00:09:16,960 Speaker 1: woman who could hold a leadership role. And I do 169 00:09:17,000 --> 00:09:20,240 Speaker 1: remember reading that when Biden debated Palin that one of 170 00:09:20,280 --> 00:09:22,200 Speaker 1: the biggest mistakes he could have made was to have 171 00:09:22,240 --> 00:09:25,760 Speaker 1: said Mrs Palin as opposed to Governor Palin. So there's 172 00:09:25,760 --> 00:09:30,400 Speaker 1: this big um sticky situation in spearheaded by Jail and Ferraro. 173 00:09:30,480 --> 00:09:32,800 Speaker 1: And this is only when The New York Times says, okay, 174 00:09:33,280 --> 00:09:36,080 Speaker 1: do you denote the fact that she's this woman in 175 00:09:36,120 --> 00:09:38,760 Speaker 1: a certain situation, We're going to call her Ms Ferraro 176 00:09:39,160 --> 00:09:41,839 Speaker 1: to take out sort of these politics of being married 177 00:09:41,920 --> 00:09:44,040 Speaker 1: or not right. And I think that I think the 178 00:09:44,080 --> 00:09:47,720 Speaker 1: New York Times still does use mrs on occasion because 179 00:09:48,120 --> 00:09:51,440 Speaker 1: one article that I read recently, I was talking about 180 00:09:52,280 --> 00:09:56,760 Speaker 1: the number of UH congresswomen who go by mms and 181 00:09:56,840 --> 00:09:59,320 Speaker 1: some who prefer mrs. Like I want to say that 182 00:09:59,559 --> 00:10:03,960 Speaker 1: um Olympius Snow for instance, is a miss, whereas Hillary Clinton, 183 00:10:04,000 --> 00:10:06,440 Speaker 1: I think is actually Mrs Clinton. And see, that's the 184 00:10:06,480 --> 00:10:09,240 Speaker 1: thing is at this point, because it doesn't really catch 185 00:10:09,320 --> 00:10:12,160 Speaker 1: on the way the feminists designed it to. But the 186 00:10:12,200 --> 00:10:14,120 Speaker 1: fact that The New York Times is hounding out shows 187 00:10:14,160 --> 00:10:16,880 Speaker 1: that not every woman immediately was like, yeah, let's all 188 00:10:16,920 --> 00:10:20,680 Speaker 1: be missed. Yeah. One thing that one kind of strange 189 00:10:20,720 --> 00:10:22,520 Speaker 1: childhood memory. I don't know why it's stuck in my 190 00:10:22,559 --> 00:10:26,480 Speaker 1: head so much, Molly, but I remember um being pretty young, 191 00:10:27,080 --> 00:10:30,320 Speaker 1: and my mom was a teacher, and this was probably 192 00:10:30,360 --> 00:10:34,160 Speaker 1: in you know, late eighties, early nineties, and I remember 193 00:10:34,160 --> 00:10:39,200 Speaker 1: her complaining about her the school she taught forcing the 194 00:10:39,600 --> 00:10:43,040 Speaker 1: we're not forcing, but I wanted to institute women just 195 00:10:43,120 --> 00:10:45,960 Speaker 1: going by miss. All the female teachers no longer being 196 00:10:46,040 --> 00:10:49,120 Speaker 1: miss or mrs just doing miss across the board, probably 197 00:10:49,120 --> 00:10:53,000 Speaker 1: to simplify things. Um, And I remember her complaining and saying, 198 00:10:53,000 --> 00:10:54,640 Speaker 1: you know what, this is not right that my school 199 00:10:54,679 --> 00:10:57,200 Speaker 1: was trying to turn me into Miss Conger because I 200 00:10:57,240 --> 00:11:00,680 Speaker 1: am Mrs Conger. Yeah, I've been Mrs Conger for years 201 00:11:00,720 --> 00:11:02,320 Speaker 1: and years and years, and I don't like the sound 202 00:11:02,360 --> 00:11:04,480 Speaker 1: of miss to be to be honest, I mean, it's 203 00:11:04,480 --> 00:11:05,760 Speaker 1: sort of the same thing when you're just signed to 204 00:11:05,840 --> 00:11:08,480 Speaker 1: change your maiden name. If you've already been Mrs So 205 00:11:08,520 --> 00:11:12,079 Speaker 1: and so for however many years, it's not natural necessarily 206 00:11:12,080 --> 00:11:14,600 Speaker 1: to just all of a sudden become Miss so and so. Yeah, 207 00:11:14,640 --> 00:11:16,120 Speaker 1: and on the flip side of I'm sure there are 208 00:11:16,120 --> 00:11:19,480 Speaker 1: plenty of women out there who would consider miss to 209 00:11:19,559 --> 00:11:22,800 Speaker 1: feel far more empowering than mrs or for people like 210 00:11:22,920 --> 00:11:27,360 Speaker 1: HS Molly who are unmarried women, I wouldn't necessarily like 211 00:11:27,480 --> 00:11:30,280 Speaker 1: to call myself Miss Conger. It does seem a little 212 00:11:30,280 --> 00:11:33,080 Speaker 1: demeaning when a guy calls me miss Conger, like you 213 00:11:33,080 --> 00:11:34,560 Speaker 1: could have pat me on the head, and you know, 214 00:11:34,600 --> 00:11:36,600 Speaker 1: it makes you sound very small, Like I think those 215 00:11:36,640 --> 00:11:40,239 Speaker 1: age connotations are still there. But you know this connotation 216 00:11:40,280 --> 00:11:43,320 Speaker 1: of miss Now, people see miss you know, attached to 217 00:11:43,600 --> 00:11:45,920 Speaker 1: Edmunds or Conger and they probably just assume, well, that's 218 00:11:45,960 --> 00:11:49,240 Speaker 1: because she's of a certain age and still unmarried. They 219 00:11:49,320 --> 00:11:51,400 Speaker 1: might see it on other women as a sign of 220 00:11:51,480 --> 00:11:55,240 Speaker 1: being divorced, like I think now there's this connotation because uh, 221 00:11:55,360 --> 00:11:57,839 Speaker 1: the merried women don't necessarily want to backtrack and become 222 00:11:57,920 --> 00:12:01,000 Speaker 1: miss so and so. That if you're um miss so 223 00:12:01,120 --> 00:12:03,280 Speaker 1: and so, that you're trying to hide something, you know, 224 00:12:03,320 --> 00:12:06,840 Speaker 1: the fact that you're unmarried, divorced, or a raging feminist. 225 00:12:07,440 --> 00:12:09,800 Speaker 1: And a lot of the studies that I found about 226 00:12:09,920 --> 00:12:12,199 Speaker 1: the use of MISS, it kind of echoes all of this, 227 00:12:12,480 --> 00:12:16,440 Speaker 1: saying that uh, miss hasn't replaced really hasn't replaced missrs 228 00:12:16,640 --> 00:12:19,319 Speaker 1: on a wide scale, women are still choosing I'd say 229 00:12:19,320 --> 00:12:23,400 Speaker 1: it's probably UM, but it has more of a replacement 230 00:12:23,480 --> 00:12:26,480 Speaker 1: for MISS. Yes, I think we are getting rid of 231 00:12:26,520 --> 00:12:29,160 Speaker 1: the MISS except for young girls. But it's still this 232 00:12:29,240 --> 00:12:32,200 Speaker 1: choice about whether you want to adopt all this, you know, 233 00:12:32,280 --> 00:12:34,520 Speaker 1: for for lack of a better term, feminist baggage. If 234 00:12:34,559 --> 00:12:36,280 Speaker 1: it was the it's the same thing we discussed in 235 00:12:36,280 --> 00:12:39,520 Speaker 1: our feminism podcast where people don't really like this label 236 00:12:39,520 --> 00:12:41,640 Speaker 1: of feminist and so as a result, they may not 237 00:12:41,720 --> 00:12:45,000 Speaker 1: like this label of title that the feminist came up 238 00:12:45,000 --> 00:12:47,280 Speaker 1: with and pushed for. But one thing only that that 239 00:12:47,480 --> 00:12:50,520 Speaker 1: surprised me when I was researching all of this, because 240 00:12:50,520 --> 00:12:53,839 Speaker 1: you're when you're referring to feminist baggage. I found UM 241 00:12:53,880 --> 00:12:58,280 Speaker 1: a couple of studies UH on people's perceptions towards women 242 00:12:58,320 --> 00:13:02,680 Speaker 1: who labeled themselves as MISS as opposed to MISS or mrs. 243 00:13:02,760 --> 00:13:05,320 Speaker 1: And I was kind of expecting the results to say that, 244 00:13:05,559 --> 00:13:09,400 Speaker 1: you know, people perceive women who call themselves MISS as 245 00:13:09,440 --> 00:13:14,200 Speaker 1: being more you know, uptight and rigid and whatever go 246 00:13:14,280 --> 00:13:18,360 Speaker 1: down the list, um, But it was actually quite the opposite. 247 00:13:18,640 --> 00:13:22,320 Speaker 1: People who are labeled labeled themselves as MSS are perceived 248 00:13:22,559 --> 00:13:26,200 Speaker 1: simply as more having more control over their lives, maybe 249 00:13:26,240 --> 00:13:31,960 Speaker 1: being better achievers um, and better educated and having more um. 250 00:13:32,440 --> 00:13:36,280 Speaker 1: I think the term they used was agency over their world. UM. 251 00:13:36,320 --> 00:13:38,640 Speaker 1: At the same time, they were perceived as less communal, 252 00:13:38,800 --> 00:13:43,199 Speaker 1: but nevertheless still very powerful as individuals, which is why 253 00:13:43,200 --> 00:13:45,880 Speaker 1: I think you see MISS used a lot in the workplace. 254 00:13:46,040 --> 00:13:48,120 Speaker 1: We're reading this article that said a lot of women 255 00:13:48,200 --> 00:13:50,280 Speaker 1: are miss so and so in the workplace, and then 256 00:13:50,280 --> 00:13:52,560 Speaker 1: when they go home their missus so and so, and 257 00:13:52,559 --> 00:13:54,600 Speaker 1: it may just be for ease. You know, you're taking 258 00:13:54,600 --> 00:13:56,920 Speaker 1: your kid to school, and it's easier to say, you know, 259 00:13:56,920 --> 00:14:00,000 Speaker 1: I'm Mrs x X being the same last name, it's 260 00:14:00,280 --> 00:14:04,000 Speaker 1: child's last name. So um. They were talking sort of 261 00:14:04,000 --> 00:14:06,520 Speaker 1: about this, these dual lives that women lead, where in 262 00:14:06,559 --> 00:14:09,600 Speaker 1: their workplace there this very strong and dependent woman as 263 00:14:09,640 --> 00:14:12,240 Speaker 1: defined by their miss whereas when they go home they'll 264 00:14:12,280 --> 00:14:15,000 Speaker 1: still take on these traditional roles almost you know, the 265 00:14:15,040 --> 00:14:18,160 Speaker 1: writer positive that maybe it was to prove that their 266 00:14:18,200 --> 00:14:21,560 Speaker 1: success in their job hadn't defeminized them in some way. So, well, 267 00:14:21,640 --> 00:14:24,720 Speaker 1: if we do have these women who plenty of women 268 00:14:24,840 --> 00:14:28,800 Speaker 1: who are MISS sometimes and their MSS other times, or 269 00:14:29,160 --> 00:14:32,480 Speaker 1: for women like us who are unmarried, and we could 270 00:14:32,480 --> 00:14:35,480 Speaker 1: be MSS or we could be miss, what is what 271 00:14:35,640 --> 00:14:39,960 Speaker 1: is the etiquette? Let's answer our let's answer our listeners questions. Okay, 272 00:14:40,400 --> 00:14:43,400 Speaker 1: let's turn to Emily Post. Yes, Emily Post the maven 273 00:14:43,600 --> 00:14:47,760 Speaker 1: of social etiquette. Yeah, basically, um, as far as business terms, 274 00:14:47,800 --> 00:14:50,280 Speaker 1: it is true, MS is the way to go. Yeah. 275 00:14:50,560 --> 00:14:52,240 Speaker 1: I mean, if it went in doubt, I would go 276 00:14:52,320 --> 00:14:56,200 Speaker 1: MISS because if you assume that it's Mr and Mrs 277 00:14:56,880 --> 00:14:58,760 Speaker 1: so and so, that can be just as offensive. I 278 00:14:58,800 --> 00:15:03,120 Speaker 1: think is doing it the other way. Now, according to 279 00:15:03,200 --> 00:15:07,120 Speaker 1: Emily Post, now her example is someone named Jane Johnson. Yes, 280 00:15:07,480 --> 00:15:10,280 Speaker 1: this is the maiden named Jane Johnson. Emily Post says 281 00:15:10,280 --> 00:15:12,600 Speaker 1: that if you are married Jane Johnson and you keep 282 00:15:12,680 --> 00:15:17,680 Speaker 1: that maiden name, your new formal address is MS. Jane Johnson, 283 00:15:17,880 --> 00:15:20,360 Speaker 1: which is also your form of address. If you are single, 284 00:15:20,440 --> 00:15:23,320 Speaker 1: you're still and your maiden name unmarried, you can still 285 00:15:23,360 --> 00:15:26,400 Speaker 1: be Miss Jane Johnson. And but if you're married and 286 00:15:26,520 --> 00:15:29,520 Speaker 1: you use your husband's name socially, then in your husband's 287 00:15:29,560 --> 00:15:31,720 Speaker 1: last name is Kelly, then obviously you would be Miss 288 00:15:31,840 --> 00:15:37,760 Speaker 1: Jane Kelly in social settings. But what about divorce Molly. Now, 289 00:15:37,800 --> 00:15:40,880 Speaker 1: if you're divorced, you can choose them to keep the mrs. 290 00:15:41,720 --> 00:15:43,120 Speaker 1: It seems like I could be confusing, but you can 291 00:15:43,120 --> 00:15:46,680 Speaker 1: still mean Mrs Jane Kelly because someone someone will keep there. 292 00:15:46,920 --> 00:15:48,560 Speaker 1: I mean, if you got kids and you're trying to 293 00:15:48,600 --> 00:15:51,040 Speaker 1: match your kids, you might keep it. Um. So instead 294 00:15:51,080 --> 00:15:53,760 Speaker 1: of being Mrs John Kelly, who in this hypothetical on 295 00:15:53,880 --> 00:15:55,760 Speaker 1: my post situation is who she's married to, you would 296 00:15:55,760 --> 00:15:59,200 Speaker 1: still be Mrs Jane Kelly UM or Miss Jane Kelly. 297 00:15:59,320 --> 00:16:00,680 Speaker 1: Or if you got back to the main name, then 298 00:16:00,720 --> 00:16:03,520 Speaker 1: you can be Miss Jane Johnson. So basically, once you're divorced, 299 00:16:03,520 --> 00:16:07,040 Speaker 1: it's just a grab bag if you is. Yeah, okay, 300 00:16:07,640 --> 00:16:10,440 Speaker 1: So if you're addressing an invitation to a couple, um, 301 00:16:10,480 --> 00:16:13,040 Speaker 1: this is probably the most confusing scenario if the couple's 302 00:16:13,120 --> 00:16:15,760 Speaker 1: married and she's using the maiden name as opposed to 303 00:16:15,840 --> 00:16:20,000 Speaker 1: using the husband's name socially or just taking it all together. Um, Okay, Mary, 304 00:16:20,080 --> 00:16:22,200 Speaker 1: using maiden name, it would be Mr John Kelly and 305 00:16:22,280 --> 00:16:26,840 Speaker 1: Miss Jane Johnson Ms. Jane Johnson and Mr John Kelly. 306 00:16:26,840 --> 00:16:30,800 Speaker 1: Because you don't always have to put the man first. Finally, 307 00:16:30,800 --> 00:16:35,160 Speaker 1: it's strides we've made now. Finally, Molly. In case anyone's 308 00:16:35,160 --> 00:16:39,920 Speaker 1: wondering if you are addressing something to an unmarried couple 309 00:16:40,120 --> 00:16:44,080 Speaker 1: living together, Oh no, Um, you're supposed to put their 310 00:16:44,160 --> 00:16:47,280 Speaker 1: names on two separate lines. She is very insistent about that, 311 00:16:47,320 --> 00:16:50,080 Speaker 1: two separate lines, not joined. Do you only get one 312 00:16:50,120 --> 00:16:52,680 Speaker 1: line when you're married? Ye, So Jane Johnson, you're going 313 00:16:52,800 --> 00:16:55,480 Speaker 1: underneath John Kelly or a buff or above, but just 314 00:16:55,560 --> 00:16:58,600 Speaker 1: not on the same line. Just not on the same line. Okay. 315 00:16:59,200 --> 00:17:01,480 Speaker 1: So it's I mean, it sounds silly, but a lot 316 00:17:01,480 --> 00:17:04,119 Speaker 1: of people just put all this politics into who goes first. 317 00:17:04,320 --> 00:17:06,760 Speaker 1: And the thing about it is is that mms versus 318 00:17:06,880 --> 00:17:11,399 Speaker 1: miss versus mrs. Has taken on um this political connotation 319 00:17:11,440 --> 00:17:14,040 Speaker 1: the same way that your last name has, because it's 320 00:17:14,040 --> 00:17:15,880 Speaker 1: how you present yourself to the world. But the thing 321 00:17:15,880 --> 00:17:18,400 Speaker 1: that was interesting in researching this is that this kind 322 00:17:18,440 --> 00:17:22,320 Speaker 1: of um gender language is all around us. Yeah, absolutely, 323 00:17:22,400 --> 00:17:24,800 Speaker 1: in ways we don't even realize. I think that this 324 00:17:24,840 --> 00:17:27,160 Speaker 1: one gets the most attention because it's most prominent because 325 00:17:27,200 --> 00:17:29,439 Speaker 1: you do introduce yourself with the name. But we are 326 00:17:29,480 --> 00:17:34,280 Speaker 1: reading examples, um, some feminist critiques of language, if you will, UM, 327 00:17:34,440 --> 00:17:37,919 Speaker 1: take the terms spinster and bachelor. Yeah, they mean the 328 00:17:37,960 --> 00:17:41,480 Speaker 1: same thing and totally different connotations. Which one would you 329 00:17:41,600 --> 00:17:44,280 Speaker 1: rather be? Can be the bachelor? Yeah, he's living it 330 00:17:44,359 --> 00:17:47,800 Speaker 1: up where the Spincers just buy more cat food. I'm 331 00:17:47,800 --> 00:17:52,400 Speaker 1: only well. Gender neutral language can be cumbersome to keep 332 00:17:52,480 --> 00:17:55,640 Speaker 1: up with, let's be honest, and some sometimes I think 333 00:17:55,680 --> 00:17:58,800 Speaker 1: it is important for women to think about it though, 334 00:17:58,880 --> 00:18:02,520 Speaker 1: in terms of of this ms versus mrs debate and 335 00:18:02,640 --> 00:18:07,240 Speaker 1: the spencer versus bachelor and going down the line where 336 00:18:07,880 --> 00:18:11,200 Speaker 1: why is it that with a lot of our language, um, 337 00:18:11,280 --> 00:18:16,080 Speaker 1: the terms used to describe women uh related to their 338 00:18:16,240 --> 00:18:20,119 Speaker 1: sexual life, their sex life or their relationships are usually 339 00:18:20,240 --> 00:18:24,680 Speaker 1: very um negative unless it is attached to a partner 340 00:18:24,840 --> 00:18:28,200 Speaker 1: exactly where your mrs. It's unfortunate, it is unfortunately. I 341 00:18:28,280 --> 00:18:30,679 Speaker 1: think that it's time to uh, may you think of 342 00:18:30,760 --> 00:18:33,560 Speaker 1: some new terms, sminty gals, if you have any awesome 343 00:18:33,600 --> 00:18:38,520 Speaker 1: empowering terms for for single women or married women or 344 00:18:38,560 --> 00:18:41,560 Speaker 1: married women or guys just latest. Yeah, we want to 345 00:18:41,560 --> 00:18:44,160 Speaker 1: hear them because I would. I would really like a 346 00:18:44,160 --> 00:18:48,320 Speaker 1: an alternative dispenser or cat lady. What's the what's the 347 00:18:48,320 --> 00:18:50,800 Speaker 1: female bachelor? Yeah? What's the female bachelor? And I don't 348 00:18:50,800 --> 00:18:52,719 Speaker 1: want to hear cougar. I'm not talking about cougar. Oh 349 00:18:52,760 --> 00:18:54,720 Speaker 1: my god, I hate that word. Yeah, that's a whole 350 00:18:54,760 --> 00:18:58,520 Speaker 1: nother podcast, another podcast. Um, well, before we close out, 351 00:18:58,600 --> 00:19:00,960 Speaker 1: let's read some more interesting name stories. How about that? 352 00:19:01,040 --> 00:19:02,879 Speaker 1: That sounds great. I'm gonna start off with an email 353 00:19:02,880 --> 00:19:06,560 Speaker 1: from Sarah, who writes, first things first, I am transgendered. 354 00:19:06,600 --> 00:19:08,280 Speaker 1: I was once a dude, and now I'm a chick, 355 00:19:08,320 --> 00:19:12,000 Speaker 1: which is awesome. She put that in like bold. Um. 356 00:19:12,080 --> 00:19:14,160 Speaker 1: When I told my family at fourteen about myself, they 357 00:19:14,160 --> 00:19:15,840 Speaker 1: probably threw me out of their house in their lives 358 00:19:15,880 --> 00:19:17,560 Speaker 1: the love with people that took me and saved my 359 00:19:17,600 --> 00:19:19,960 Speaker 1: life and allowed me to take their family name so 360 00:19:20,000 --> 00:19:23,119 Speaker 1: I could completely distance myself in the past. Uh. Sixteen 361 00:19:23,160 --> 00:19:25,000 Speaker 1: years later, I'm engaged to a pretty great guy, and 362 00:19:25,040 --> 00:19:27,639 Speaker 1: when we get married or civil partnered, he's taking my 363 00:19:27,720 --> 00:19:29,840 Speaker 1: family name. He understands that it's a name that means 364 00:19:29,880 --> 00:19:31,680 Speaker 1: a lot to me. That it's very much my identity 365 00:19:31,720 --> 00:19:33,480 Speaker 1: and I want to honor the people that raised me. 366 00:19:34,480 --> 00:19:36,119 Speaker 1: His family, though, took a while to get used to 367 00:19:36,160 --> 00:19:38,159 Speaker 1: the idea. Thankfully the name is she was a bigger 368 00:19:38,160 --> 00:19:40,600 Speaker 1: problem than my gender, Walkinus. But now they're on board 369 00:19:40,600 --> 00:19:42,720 Speaker 1: and we're moving ahead. But we could have both kept 370 00:19:42,720 --> 00:19:45,320 Speaker 1: our regular names, but adoption agencies like their applicants to 371 00:19:45,359 --> 00:19:47,240 Speaker 1: have the same name if they're married. So there you go, 372 00:19:47,400 --> 00:19:50,640 Speaker 1: a different point of view. Awesome, thank you, Sarah. Well, Molly, 373 00:19:50,720 --> 00:19:53,600 Speaker 1: I have another listener male from another Sarah, I don't 374 00:19:53,600 --> 00:19:56,440 Speaker 1: want how about them apples? Uh. Sarah wanted to share 375 00:19:56,440 --> 00:19:59,359 Speaker 1: her perspective on the topic of maiden names. She said 376 00:19:59,400 --> 00:20:01,480 Speaker 1: that she has to married for almost nineteen years. She 377 00:20:01,520 --> 00:20:04,359 Speaker 1: worked as an engineer for several several years before meeting 378 00:20:04,400 --> 00:20:07,280 Speaker 1: her husband, and then several more years before marrying him, 379 00:20:07,320 --> 00:20:10,000 Speaker 1: so it was already well known to people in her 380 00:20:10,040 --> 00:20:13,160 Speaker 1: field that her maiden name um that what her maiden 381 00:20:13,240 --> 00:20:16,200 Speaker 1: name was, and she didn't want to change it. So 382 00:20:16,920 --> 00:20:18,560 Speaker 1: she would say add to this that my mother in 383 00:20:18,640 --> 00:20:20,639 Speaker 1: law had never been in favor of our wedding, so 384 00:20:20,760 --> 00:20:23,280 Speaker 1: becoming known by what I considered her name was even 385 00:20:23,320 --> 00:20:26,080 Speaker 1: more objectionable. To me. However, knowing that we would have 386 00:20:26,160 --> 00:20:29,520 Speaker 1: children someday, I decided to add his last name to mind, 387 00:20:29,640 --> 00:20:33,760 Speaker 1: more like the South American style. I didn't hyphenate um 388 00:20:33,800 --> 00:20:37,119 Speaker 1: my name though. For our children, UM, they use my 389 00:20:37,200 --> 00:20:39,639 Speaker 1: husband's last name. But I still can use whichever I 390 00:20:39,680 --> 00:20:41,639 Speaker 1: feel is right at the moment, be it at work 391 00:20:41,840 --> 00:20:44,280 Speaker 1: or around the family, kind of like the ms mrs 392 00:20:44,280 --> 00:20:46,760 Speaker 1: switch up. Uh. This has worked well for us, even 393 00:20:46,840 --> 00:20:50,280 Speaker 1: after we decided to homeschool our children. Hey, I know 394 00:20:50,359 --> 00:20:53,280 Speaker 1: about that, and the last name in common was less 395 00:20:53,320 --> 00:20:56,480 Speaker 1: of an issue. I feel people should use whatever fits them. 396 00:20:56,640 --> 00:20:58,919 Speaker 1: One of my sons wanted wants to legally add my 397 00:20:59,000 --> 00:21:01,679 Speaker 1: maiden name to his name when he turns eighteen. He 398 00:21:01,720 --> 00:21:03,680 Speaker 1: feels that my maternal side of the family needs to 399 00:21:03,680 --> 00:21:06,760 Speaker 1: be shown and continued on through him, and hence would 400 00:21:06,800 --> 00:21:09,280 Speaker 1: also have a dual last name. He's open to the 401 00:21:09,320 --> 00:21:11,760 Speaker 1: idea of adding his ultimate wife's name to the mix 402 00:21:11,800 --> 00:21:14,000 Speaker 1: as well. My other sons don't see the big deal 403 00:21:14,040 --> 00:21:16,320 Speaker 1: either way in this matter, but as for me, I'm 404 00:21:16,320 --> 00:21:19,000 Speaker 1: glad I just added my husband's name to the mix. 405 00:21:19,080 --> 00:21:21,000 Speaker 1: That way, I kept my name, which my parents gave 406 00:21:21,080 --> 00:21:23,600 Speaker 1: me and which I like, including my middle name and 407 00:21:23,640 --> 00:21:26,119 Speaker 1: added to my identity of my new family by adding 408 00:21:26,240 --> 00:21:30,200 Speaker 1: my husband's name. Just my thoughts on this topic. Okay, 409 00:21:30,400 --> 00:21:35,600 Speaker 1: very nice. Here's one from Liza. UM. So, Liza is 410 00:21:35,600 --> 00:21:38,400 Speaker 1: about to get married on October. So have a nice 411 00:21:38,440 --> 00:21:41,000 Speaker 1: wedding day, Liza. You hear that before? Hear this before? 412 00:21:41,640 --> 00:21:43,760 Speaker 1: Um Liza is a working artist and a hand engraver. 413 00:21:44,000 --> 00:21:46,080 Speaker 1: As a wedding gift, my father has made Michael and 414 00:21:46,160 --> 00:21:48,399 Speaker 1: myself a set of plates and bowls. He too as 415 00:21:48,440 --> 00:21:50,720 Speaker 1: an artist and where I get my talent from. So 416 00:21:50,760 --> 00:21:53,679 Speaker 1: the dishes are amazing, except for the E in the center, 417 00:21:54,560 --> 00:21:57,040 Speaker 1: which is the letter that Michael's last name starts with. 418 00:21:57,080 --> 00:22:00,040 Speaker 1: I won't stay here. Her dad had assumed that you 419 00:22:00,040 --> 00:22:02,439 Speaker 1: would take the name I have no desire to. I 420 00:22:02,480 --> 00:22:04,720 Speaker 1: even made the argument that if Michael finds it unreasonable, 421 00:22:04,720 --> 00:22:06,119 Speaker 1: then it is on the table. Then is it on 422 00:22:06,160 --> 00:22:08,240 Speaker 1: the table for me to take? Mine answer being no. 423 00:22:08,760 --> 00:22:10,400 Speaker 1: So now I don't want to break my dad's heart. 424 00:22:10,480 --> 00:22:12,919 Speaker 1: He spent months on these plates, hand throwing them on 425 00:22:12,960 --> 00:22:15,439 Speaker 1: the wheel. I love the gift, but I'm offended that 426 00:22:15,480 --> 00:22:17,840 Speaker 1: he assumed I would take my husband's name, especially since 427 00:22:17,840 --> 00:22:19,680 Speaker 1: I was raised to have my own identity and belong 428 00:22:19,800 --> 00:22:25,080 Speaker 1: to myself above all. That stinks. Tricky situation, but I 429 00:22:25,119 --> 00:22:26,959 Speaker 1: have I have all the faith that they are going 430 00:22:26,960 --> 00:22:29,240 Speaker 1: to work it out before October. I mean, I'll also 431 00:22:29,280 --> 00:22:31,240 Speaker 1: throw out that my last name starts with any So 432 00:22:31,320 --> 00:22:33,720 Speaker 1: if they want to give the dishes and up plates 433 00:22:33,720 --> 00:22:36,120 Speaker 1: and bowls to me, I mean, I could just take 434 00:22:36,160 --> 00:22:38,400 Speaker 1: this problem right off their hands. I don't I don't 435 00:22:38,400 --> 00:22:40,200 Speaker 1: know how Michael feel about it, but I'm just throwing 436 00:22:40,240 --> 00:22:42,560 Speaker 1: it out there, always thinking of number one Molly. That's good, 437 00:22:43,720 --> 00:22:46,679 Speaker 1: a defendive woman. Um. And to close things out, I 438 00:22:46,760 --> 00:22:51,240 Speaker 1: have an email from j who drumroll, please took his 439 00:22:51,320 --> 00:22:55,840 Speaker 1: wife's name. Wow. Um. I considered this greatly. During our 440 00:22:55,880 --> 00:22:59,159 Speaker 1: engagement period, we looked into traditions and determined that we 441 00:22:59,200 --> 00:23:02,520 Speaker 1: had no particular reason to honor traditions as they were 442 00:23:02,560 --> 00:23:05,320 Speaker 1: antiquated and hell no real meaning to us. So what 443 00:23:05,359 --> 00:23:08,320 Speaker 1: we did take into account were a few factors. He said, 444 00:23:08,320 --> 00:23:10,159 Speaker 1: my side of the family has two other boys to 445 00:23:10,200 --> 00:23:13,280 Speaker 1: carry on the name, and one of those boys already 446 00:23:13,320 --> 00:23:14,879 Speaker 1: has a son, so the name carries on to the 447 00:23:14,920 --> 00:23:17,840 Speaker 1: next generation. Of course, this relies on the sexist tradition 448 00:23:18,119 --> 00:23:21,959 Speaker 1: to continue, but that seems likely. Number Two, my wife's 449 00:23:21,960 --> 00:23:24,400 Speaker 1: family name was going to die off if she were 450 00:23:24,400 --> 00:23:26,760 Speaker 1: not going to keep it going. Uh. This went back 451 00:23:26,760 --> 00:23:29,359 Speaker 1: for several generations that we could trace, and while she 452 00:23:29,440 --> 00:23:31,679 Speaker 1: was never adamant about keeping her name alive, it seemed 453 00:23:31,720 --> 00:23:34,080 Speaker 1: to be a fair consideration. Three, we want to have 454 00:23:34,119 --> 00:23:39,200 Speaker 1: an unhyphenated, unhyphenated common family name. Personal preference here, certainly, 455 00:23:39,200 --> 00:23:40,840 Speaker 1: but we wanted our children to have parents with the 456 00:23:40,840 --> 00:23:43,280 Speaker 1: same last name and to keep it simple. And four 457 00:23:43,440 --> 00:23:45,760 Speaker 1: when we considered the traditional reasons for taking a name, 458 00:23:45,800 --> 00:23:48,600 Speaker 1: I felt extremely welcomed and accepted into my wife's family 459 00:23:48,840 --> 00:23:50,960 Speaker 1: throughout our relationship, and there was no reason for this 460 00:23:51,040 --> 00:23:54,360 Speaker 1: acceptance to have any less validity than any acceptance from 461 00:23:54,359 --> 00:23:57,600 Speaker 1: my family. Because I spent the time to research this 462 00:23:57,720 --> 00:24:00,080 Speaker 1: and investigate my true intentions, I felt entirely just to 463 00:24:00,119 --> 00:24:02,520 Speaker 1: find my decision to take my life my wife's name. 464 00:24:02,840 --> 00:24:05,119 Speaker 1: I haven't suffered any ridicule from my friends from this 465 00:24:05,280 --> 00:24:07,640 Speaker 1: because it was my decision and my choice, not something 466 00:24:07,680 --> 00:24:10,240 Speaker 1: that I was put into a position to consider. My 467 00:24:10,280 --> 00:24:13,399 Speaker 1: family did have issues initially, but everyone respected my choice. 468 00:24:13,560 --> 00:24:15,639 Speaker 1: This is probably the most important thing for anyone to 469 00:24:15,680 --> 00:24:18,480 Speaker 1: consider in changing one's name, why are you doing so 470 00:24:18,760 --> 00:24:21,439 Speaker 1: and what do you believe in those reasons? For me, 471 00:24:21,560 --> 00:24:23,439 Speaker 1: the fact that it was the traditional thing to do 472 00:24:23,680 --> 00:24:27,520 Speaker 1: was not enough of a reason. So very good insight. 473 00:24:27,600 --> 00:24:30,000 Speaker 1: Thank you, Jane. And if you guys have any insight 474 00:24:30,680 --> 00:24:33,520 Speaker 1: on this topic or just have a question or comment 475 00:24:33,560 --> 00:24:36,479 Speaker 1: for Molly, feel free to email us at Mom's Stuff 476 00:24:36,800 --> 00:24:39,360 Speaker 1: at how stuff works dot com And during the week 477 00:24:39,440 --> 00:24:42,640 Speaker 1: you can head over to our blog called how to stuff. 478 00:24:43,200 --> 00:24:49,040 Speaker 1: And if you just want to read and expand your mind, 479 00:24:49,040 --> 00:24:52,080 Speaker 1: have your mind blown, have your mind blown by words 480 00:24:52,080 --> 00:24:54,640 Speaker 1: on the screen, you should head over to our website 481 00:24:55,040 --> 00:25:01,879 Speaker 1: how stuff works dot com for more on this and 482 00:25:01,920 --> 00:25:06,080 Speaker 1: thousands of other topics. 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