1 00:00:05,160 --> 00:00:07,840 Speaker 1: Hey, this is Annie and Samantha. I'm welcome to stuff 2 00:00:07,840 --> 00:00:09,440 Speaker 1: I've never told you, a production of I Heart Radio. 3 00:00:18,560 --> 00:00:22,680 Speaker 1: And today we are thrilled, thrilled, and once again be 4 00:00:22,840 --> 00:00:27,400 Speaker 1: joined by our good friend, the amazing Eves. I'm so 5 00:00:27,840 --> 00:00:32,239 Speaker 1: glad to have you back, yes, because you took you 6 00:00:32,320 --> 00:00:39,680 Speaker 1: took a month off and you were greatly missed. Thank you. Yes, 7 00:00:40,440 --> 00:00:42,320 Speaker 1: How how have you been? Do you have anything that 8 00:00:42,360 --> 00:00:44,640 Speaker 1: you're excited about or that you would like to share? 9 00:00:44,720 --> 00:00:48,479 Speaker 1: What's been going on? Eves? I don't know. I'm excited 10 00:00:48,520 --> 00:00:51,080 Speaker 1: about life, so I guess there's a good place to start. 11 00:00:51,159 --> 00:00:54,560 Speaker 1: You know, Like times are hard and it's really hard 12 00:00:54,600 --> 00:00:58,480 Speaker 1: to stay ground it right now, so I'm excited about life. 13 00:00:58,480 --> 00:01:00,480 Speaker 1: I feel like this is one of those tough of course, 14 00:01:00,640 --> 00:01:03,880 Speaker 1: we're at the end of the year, so everybody's reflecting 15 00:01:04,800 --> 00:01:08,160 Speaker 1: on how the year was, what it's been like, and 16 00:01:08,200 --> 00:01:10,240 Speaker 1: I know that's like a pretty heavy load for a 17 00:01:10,280 --> 00:01:13,720 Speaker 1: lot of people. But I think it's really nice to 18 00:01:13,800 --> 00:01:16,319 Speaker 1: have this moment when we can all expect to think 19 00:01:16,360 --> 00:01:20,360 Speaker 1: about change and expect to be hopeful, because that can 20 00:01:20,400 --> 00:01:26,080 Speaker 1: get really weedy and difficult when, like so many things 21 00:01:26,120 --> 00:01:32,920 Speaker 1: that we talk about on a daily basis hard about hope. Yeah, 22 00:01:33,280 --> 00:01:36,280 Speaker 1: so yeah, I'm excited and I'm glad to be here 23 00:01:36,319 --> 00:01:38,759 Speaker 1: with y'all. Yes, that's a I love that. That's such 24 00:01:39,120 --> 00:01:44,479 Speaker 1: a positive take on it, which I really appreciate because 25 00:01:44,760 --> 00:01:50,160 Speaker 1: we're kind of like me and Samantha been so everything 26 00:01:50,320 --> 00:01:52,960 Speaker 1: is terrible, but that's that's good. I like that taking 27 00:01:53,000 --> 00:01:55,800 Speaker 1: that moment. But I also, yeah, I'm a big at 28 00:01:55,840 --> 00:01:57,520 Speaker 1: least right now, I'm a big proponent of like taking 29 00:01:57,560 --> 00:02:00,240 Speaker 1: that moment, but also being gentle with yourself that that 30 00:02:00,400 --> 00:02:04,360 Speaker 1: that moment of like, it's been rough, but there are 31 00:02:04,440 --> 00:02:09,840 Speaker 1: positives and it's nice to think about still what changes 32 00:02:09,880 --> 00:02:12,200 Speaker 1: you would like to make, however small they may be. 33 00:02:13,520 --> 00:02:19,040 Speaker 1: I am also very, very excited about the woman you 34 00:02:19,160 --> 00:02:24,080 Speaker 1: bought for this episode, because we discussed her very briefly. 35 00:02:24,120 --> 00:02:30,200 Speaker 1: We did a history on women and the USPS, which 36 00:02:30,320 --> 00:02:35,480 Speaker 1: was surprisingly fascinating. It felt like a Western and so 37 00:02:35,600 --> 00:02:41,720 Speaker 1: you actually brought us a Western. Yes, yes, yes, all 38 00:02:41,760 --> 00:02:45,560 Speaker 1: of the dangers people used to face, and I loved 39 00:02:45,680 --> 00:02:48,079 Speaker 1: kind of the community aspect of it too, where everybody's 40 00:02:48,080 --> 00:02:53,919 Speaker 1: sort of new the post person and also a lot 41 00:02:53,919 --> 00:02:59,680 Speaker 1: of controversy around outfits. Of course always are y'all good 42 00:02:59,720 --> 00:03:08,760 Speaker 1: at that. Do y'all converse with your post people? So, like, 43 00:03:09,320 --> 00:03:11,320 Speaker 1: I know, I just had a whole thing because I 44 00:03:11,440 --> 00:03:15,720 Speaker 1: usually give our mail carrier like a gift card for 45 00:03:15,880 --> 00:03:18,519 Speaker 1: the holidays and today thank you, and I had to 46 00:03:18,520 --> 00:03:20,600 Speaker 1: sit back and forth and starting I'm like, I don't 47 00:03:20,600 --> 00:03:23,320 Speaker 1: know their name, and to be honest, they switched up 48 00:03:23,360 --> 00:03:25,680 Speaker 1: so often because I live in an area that's just 49 00:03:25,760 --> 00:03:28,760 Speaker 1: pretty high traffic, there's a lot of complaints. I think 50 00:03:28,800 --> 00:03:33,320 Speaker 1: we had an issue with like mail going missing, slash dumping, 51 00:03:33,720 --> 00:03:35,360 Speaker 1: and I don't know, I don't think it's that person, 52 00:03:35,400 --> 00:03:37,840 Speaker 1: but like issues like that. So I was like, I 53 00:03:37,880 --> 00:03:40,120 Speaker 1: don't even know if they're a man or a woman. 54 00:03:40,320 --> 00:03:44,520 Speaker 1: I don't know, so I don't want to say, you know, postman, postwoman, Malkie. 55 00:03:44,560 --> 00:03:47,000 Speaker 1: So I just called them Maril carrier. But it felt 56 00:03:47,280 --> 00:03:52,400 Speaker 1: awkward and so impersonal. I felt really bad. Yeah, that's 57 00:03:52,400 --> 00:03:57,320 Speaker 1: that's tough. I know. I know the person who does 58 00:03:57,400 --> 00:03:59,880 Speaker 1: most of the like USPS person who does most of 59 00:04:00,000 --> 00:04:02,720 Speaker 1: delivering of my mail, and he's super nice. He's seen 60 00:04:02,800 --> 00:04:06,160 Speaker 1: me like in all kinds of states of like being 61 00:04:06,200 --> 00:04:09,280 Speaker 1: soaked by the rain or like in my pajamas, and 62 00:04:09,360 --> 00:04:11,720 Speaker 1: once I came out, I just happened to open the 63 00:04:11,760 --> 00:04:14,600 Speaker 1: door randomly, and he was right outside my door, and 64 00:04:14,640 --> 00:04:16,839 Speaker 1: I'm easily startled. As you all know. It was a 65 00:04:17,000 --> 00:04:21,040 Speaker 1: huge moment of like like I'm jumping back and almost screaming. 66 00:04:21,440 --> 00:04:23,120 Speaker 1: But then he was like, I hope you don't mind. 67 00:04:23,240 --> 00:04:27,240 Speaker 1: I've just been signing for you. And I was like, 68 00:04:27,279 --> 00:04:29,839 Speaker 1: oh no, I appreciate that because I've never I never 69 00:04:29,920 --> 00:04:32,839 Speaker 1: hear them, and I'm never there to sign or at 70 00:04:32,880 --> 00:04:35,120 Speaker 1: least I never hear it. I'm always here in my apartment. 71 00:04:35,240 --> 00:04:38,160 Speaker 1: But anyway, and he showed me the signature and he 72 00:04:38,240 --> 00:04:42,520 Speaker 1: was like, this is okay with you. It's better than mine. 73 00:04:42,680 --> 00:04:44,520 Speaker 1: That doesn't get have been any trouble. I really do 74 00:04:44,600 --> 00:04:48,400 Speaker 1: appreciate it, but you just got a fine way to go. 75 00:04:48,520 --> 00:04:54,920 Speaker 1: Oh no, I I don't know that that. I don't 76 00:04:54,960 --> 00:04:57,680 Speaker 1: know that. It was like a I actually have no 77 00:04:57,760 --> 00:04:59,560 Speaker 1: idea what he was doing, but he was signing my 78 00:04:59,640 --> 00:05:01,080 Speaker 1: name is owed it to me, And I was like, yeah, 79 00:05:01,080 --> 00:05:03,840 Speaker 1: I've been to it. I love to continue doing that. 80 00:05:04,800 --> 00:05:08,039 Speaker 1: I have missed the many packages for that reason. Yes, 81 00:05:08,640 --> 00:05:11,359 Speaker 1: that's what I'm saying. That's so that's why I'm so appreciative. 82 00:05:11,400 --> 00:05:14,520 Speaker 1: I think I have indicated somewhere like, for the love 83 00:05:14,560 --> 00:05:18,839 Speaker 1: of God, I don't care. Just leave it if it 84 00:05:18,880 --> 00:05:21,360 Speaker 1: needs a signature, and I will take the blame. I 85 00:05:21,400 --> 00:05:23,960 Speaker 1: think I've actually gone into the website and said that, like, 86 00:05:24,120 --> 00:05:30,359 Speaker 1: please please just leave it. What about you, Eaves? No, 87 00:05:30,520 --> 00:05:32,880 Speaker 1: I'm really bad at stuff like that. Um, I feel 88 00:05:32,880 --> 00:05:37,080 Speaker 1: like my social anxiety shows up this kind of thing. Um, 89 00:05:37,120 --> 00:05:39,719 Speaker 1: I want to get better at it though, Like I 90 00:05:39,720 --> 00:05:41,600 Speaker 1: I would love to get better at that. So, like, 91 00:05:41,640 --> 00:05:44,400 Speaker 1: that's that's definitely a goal of mine. It's good to 92 00:05:44,400 --> 00:05:46,240 Speaker 1: be on good terms because, as we talked about in 93 00:05:46,279 --> 00:05:49,880 Speaker 1: my episode, sometimes they'll notice if you like don't answer 94 00:05:49,920 --> 00:05:51,520 Speaker 1: the door, they haven't seen you in a while, and 95 00:05:51,520 --> 00:05:55,919 Speaker 1: then reports stuff and people have been like saved by 96 00:05:56,320 --> 00:06:00,719 Speaker 1: their mail carrier, being like saved about miss Yes. Now 97 00:06:00,760 --> 00:06:07,000 Speaker 1: that's a that's a movie, saved by the mail carrier. 98 00:06:07,440 --> 00:06:10,000 Speaker 1: All right, well, Eves, let's get into the story. I'm 99 00:06:10,000 --> 00:06:12,480 Speaker 1: so excited. Who did you bring for us today? So 100 00:06:12,560 --> 00:06:15,560 Speaker 1: today we're going to be talking about Mary Fields, also 101 00:06:15,680 --> 00:06:19,600 Speaker 1: known as stagecoach Mary. So I have a feeling that 102 00:06:19,600 --> 00:06:21,680 Speaker 1: that's going to be a name that's that a lot 103 00:06:21,680 --> 00:06:24,159 Speaker 1: of people might be familiar with, even if they don't 104 00:06:24,200 --> 00:06:27,560 Speaker 1: know anything about her exactly what she did or even 105 00:06:27,560 --> 00:06:32,760 Speaker 1: what her first was. So Stagecoach Mary Mary Feels was 106 00:06:32,800 --> 00:06:36,000 Speaker 1: the first Black American woman to carry mail on a 107 00:06:36,080 --> 00:06:39,440 Speaker 1: star route for the US Post Office Department. We'll get 108 00:06:39,440 --> 00:06:41,520 Speaker 1: into the weeds of like what a star root is 109 00:06:41,560 --> 00:06:43,880 Speaker 1: in a little bit of the context for the U. 110 00:06:43,960 --> 00:06:48,200 Speaker 1: S Post Department back then. But yeah, like I'm sure 111 00:06:48,200 --> 00:06:50,320 Speaker 1: a lot of people have hurt that because she has 112 00:06:50,360 --> 00:06:52,920 Speaker 1: one of those monikers that like just rolls off the tongue. 113 00:06:52,920 --> 00:06:55,679 Speaker 1: That's so easy to say, stagecoach Mary. It sounds so cool, 114 00:06:56,320 --> 00:06:58,720 Speaker 1: like the two of you were saying earlier, like it's 115 00:06:58,760 --> 00:07:03,080 Speaker 1: the whole persona uh. And the story of Mary Fields 116 00:07:03,120 --> 00:07:08,160 Speaker 1: just is so right for the imagery and the idealism 117 00:07:08,200 --> 00:07:11,800 Speaker 1: and all the like fluff that came along with what 118 00:07:12,040 --> 00:07:15,000 Speaker 1: the old West is. And I was I was recently 119 00:07:15,200 --> 00:07:17,520 Speaker 1: in the West, because I was recently over there. This 120 00:07:17,560 --> 00:07:19,720 Speaker 1: is kind of what inspired me to start thinking about 121 00:07:19,720 --> 00:07:23,320 Speaker 1: black women in the West and like reading about them 122 00:07:23,320 --> 00:07:26,880 Speaker 1: because I'm a Southern girl forever and I've been in 123 00:07:26,920 --> 00:07:29,120 Speaker 1: the South. Um, a lot of my family is from 124 00:07:29,120 --> 00:07:32,280 Speaker 1: the South, So yeah, there's a lot of this mythologizing 125 00:07:32,320 --> 00:07:36,760 Speaker 1: and romanticizing of the Old West, and also the making 126 00:07:36,880 --> 00:07:39,600 Speaker 1: larger of her character itself. When it comes to her, 127 00:07:39,960 --> 00:07:43,480 Speaker 1: she's the perfect subject for legends and myth making. Um. 128 00:07:43,520 --> 00:07:45,880 Speaker 1: So a lot of the tales about who she was 129 00:07:46,000 --> 00:07:48,960 Speaker 1: and what she did during her lifetime, which was in 130 00:07:48,960 --> 00:07:52,240 Speaker 1: the eighteen hundreds in the early nineteen hundreds, is embellished. 131 00:07:53,000 --> 00:07:56,680 Speaker 1: There are definitely a lot of apocryphal stories there. But 132 00:07:57,080 --> 00:07:59,520 Speaker 1: on the other hand, it also means that she's been 133 00:07:59,560 --> 00:08:03,680 Speaker 1: recogniz eyes um. She has a nickname, you know, and 134 00:08:03,760 --> 00:08:07,160 Speaker 1: she's had books written about her. She's been fictionalized in 135 00:08:07,240 --> 00:08:11,440 Speaker 1: TV and film and over the years as well, including 136 00:08:11,480 --> 00:08:15,440 Speaker 1: more recent things. And yeah, so she just has a 137 00:08:15,480 --> 00:08:18,680 Speaker 1: really cool story. Yeah, she absolutely does. Cool picture too 138 00:08:18,720 --> 00:08:24,120 Speaker 1: that usually comes up when you search her pretty pretty bad. Yeah, 139 00:08:24,200 --> 00:08:27,120 Speaker 1: and there's some excellent quotes the picture. I've seen that 140 00:08:27,160 --> 00:08:29,920 Speaker 1: picture even before we were talking, and we've been talking 141 00:08:29,920 --> 00:08:32,200 Speaker 1: about who she was or what she was in relations 142 00:08:32,240 --> 00:08:35,760 Speaker 1: to the US Postal Service, because you've seen that picture, 143 00:08:35,760 --> 00:08:38,000 Speaker 1: whether or not you know where it's from or it's 144 00:08:38,080 --> 00:08:41,200 Speaker 1: pretty famous. And her kind of like she became like 145 00:08:41,240 --> 00:08:44,960 Speaker 1: you said, very very like romantic size and then again 146 00:08:45,000 --> 00:08:47,920 Speaker 1: like a legendary tale almost, but that picture in itself 147 00:08:47,960 --> 00:08:51,400 Speaker 1: so like, oh, you know, like every every man now 148 00:08:51,440 --> 00:08:53,400 Speaker 1: and then you're like, that's one of those that I recognized. 149 00:08:53,440 --> 00:08:56,400 Speaker 1: I don't know why, but it is badass and I've 150 00:08:56,440 --> 00:09:04,040 Speaker 1: seen it. Yeah, it's a legendary picture. So there is 151 00:09:04,080 --> 00:09:07,600 Speaker 1: an author who wrote a book Deliverance Mary Fields, the 152 00:09:07,640 --> 00:09:10,640 Speaker 1: first African American woman's star roots mail carrier in the 153 00:09:10,720 --> 00:09:14,040 Speaker 1: United States of Montana history, had to go through the 154 00:09:14,040 --> 00:09:17,400 Speaker 1: full thing there. Um. But yeah, so according to her, 155 00:09:17,720 --> 00:09:20,360 Speaker 1: the author, I don't want to get her name wrong, 156 00:09:20,400 --> 00:09:25,120 Speaker 1: but I believe it's pronounced Meante metcalfe McConnell. But according 157 00:09:25,160 --> 00:09:28,719 Speaker 1: to the author, the documentation that the author provided to 158 00:09:28,880 --> 00:09:33,880 Speaker 1: United States Postal Service historians enable them to verify her 159 00:09:34,000 --> 00:09:38,320 Speaker 1: quote unquote first. So McConnell also says that through her work, 160 00:09:38,400 --> 00:09:41,120 Speaker 1: she was able to confirm that Mary Fields was the 161 00:09:41,120 --> 00:09:45,680 Speaker 1: first black person to register to vote in Cascade, Montana. Um. 162 00:09:45,760 --> 00:09:50,520 Speaker 1: So that author is also scheduled to release another book. Umo. 163 00:09:51,480 --> 00:09:54,040 Speaker 1: So well, we can get into more of the context 164 00:09:54,120 --> 00:09:57,720 Speaker 1: of all the things that, um, the Postal Service stuff 165 00:09:57,800 --> 00:10:01,360 Speaker 1: and Mary Phil's life, um, and all of that later. Yes, 166 00:10:14,960 --> 00:10:18,559 Speaker 1: I start at the beginning. So Mary Fales was born 167 00:10:19,240 --> 00:10:23,640 Speaker 1: around eighteen thirty two in Hickman County, Tennessee. She didn't 168 00:10:23,640 --> 00:10:26,480 Speaker 1: know her birthday, as so many black people didn't. She 169 00:10:26,640 --> 00:10:30,880 Speaker 1: was born enslaved. She was a servant for the Warner 170 00:10:30,960 --> 00:10:34,840 Speaker 1: family in the years before the Civil War, and she 171 00:10:34,920 --> 00:10:39,760 Speaker 1: was emancipated sometime around emancipation or just after the Civil War. 172 00:10:40,400 --> 00:10:42,600 Speaker 1: She could read and write, but there isn't a lot 173 00:10:43,000 --> 00:10:45,880 Speaker 1: more that's documented about her early years. There's a lot 174 00:10:45,920 --> 00:10:50,120 Speaker 1: more that's documented um into her later years, but it 175 00:10:50,280 --> 00:10:53,720 Speaker 1: is known that after emancipation she worked on steamboats on 176 00:10:53,760 --> 00:10:57,280 Speaker 1: the Mississippi River in the southeast, and one of the 177 00:10:57,280 --> 00:11:01,079 Speaker 1: steamboats that she worked on was the Robert E, which 178 00:11:01,120 --> 00:11:04,400 Speaker 1: garnered attention when it beat the Natchez in a publicized 179 00:11:04,480 --> 00:11:07,959 Speaker 1: race from New Orleans to St. Louis in eighteen seventy. 180 00:11:08,440 --> 00:11:12,760 Speaker 1: So Mary eventually made her way to Toledo, Ohio, and 181 00:11:12,800 --> 00:11:16,360 Speaker 1: there she started working at an Ursulin convent. The Ursulin's 182 00:11:16,520 --> 00:11:20,319 Speaker 1: are a Catholic religious order of women. It's not completely 183 00:11:20,360 --> 00:11:23,400 Speaker 1: clear while she gravitated to the convent. There is speculation 184 00:11:23,440 --> 00:11:26,080 Speaker 1: around it um but one theory being that there was 185 00:11:26,120 --> 00:11:30,120 Speaker 1: some familiarity there because she was a servant for the 186 00:11:30,200 --> 00:11:32,880 Speaker 1: duns for several years and they had relatives who were 187 00:11:32,960 --> 00:11:36,640 Speaker 1: nuns at the convent. But either way, she made it 188 00:11:36,720 --> 00:11:39,880 Speaker 1: there by train in eighteen seventy and she did jobs 189 00:11:39,960 --> 00:11:43,920 Speaker 1: like wash laundry, work in the kitchen, and maintain the grounds. 190 00:11:44,040 --> 00:11:46,040 Speaker 1: And these are things that you'll see come up throughout 191 00:11:46,080 --> 00:11:48,840 Speaker 1: her entire lifetime. As she moved from place to place. 192 00:11:49,320 --> 00:11:53,839 Speaker 1: She continued to do laundry, continued to cook and work 193 00:11:53,880 --> 00:11:57,240 Speaker 1: in the garden. But as a worker there at the convent, 194 00:11:57,400 --> 00:12:01,040 Speaker 1: Mary met Ursulin. Mother Mary Amadeus, and then many of 195 00:12:01,080 --> 00:12:04,439 Speaker 1: the nuns that were there ended up going to Montana 196 00:12:04,920 --> 00:12:09,760 Speaker 1: and running a school for Native Americans. Mary Fields also 197 00:12:09,880 --> 00:12:15,160 Speaker 1: ended up moving to Montana Territory in eight So for context, 198 00:12:15,559 --> 00:12:19,880 Speaker 1: Montana was admitted as a state in eighteen eighty nine, 199 00:12:20,160 --> 00:12:23,199 Speaker 1: so just four years after she moved to Montana Territory. 200 00:12:23,400 --> 00:12:25,679 Speaker 1: It said that she moved to Montana when Arslan Mother 201 00:12:25,720 --> 00:12:30,520 Speaker 1: Amadeus was sick with pneumonia there um Some sources say 202 00:12:30,520 --> 00:12:34,080 Speaker 1: that they knew each other before the convent because Mother 203 00:12:34,160 --> 00:12:37,319 Speaker 1: Mary was related by marriage to the family who had 204 00:12:37,440 --> 00:12:41,640 Speaker 1: enslaved Mary Fields in Tennessee. But like we could go 205 00:12:41,679 --> 00:12:44,400 Speaker 1: on forever with the links and all of the stories 206 00:12:44,440 --> 00:12:51,079 Speaker 1: and speculations, so fly past that. But in Montana she 207 00:12:51,200 --> 00:12:55,160 Speaker 1: worked at St. Peter's Mission near a cascade. She helped 208 00:12:55,160 --> 00:12:58,840 Speaker 1: with construction again, did laundry in the garden and other 209 00:12:58,880 --> 00:13:02,319 Speaker 1: odd jobs, and she also delivered food and supplies in 210 00:13:02,360 --> 00:13:04,880 Speaker 1: the mission. So she drove horses and a freight wagon 211 00:13:04,960 --> 00:13:08,040 Speaker 1: for miles to get stuff to the Ursulain nuns. So 212 00:13:08,120 --> 00:13:12,560 Speaker 1: in a lot of these secondary accounts of Mary Feels 213 00:13:12,559 --> 00:13:21,079 Speaker 1: she is described as being crass, hardened, mean, quick, tempered, um, 214 00:13:21,120 --> 00:13:26,439 Speaker 1: which goes into the myth making around her as a 215 00:13:26,520 --> 00:13:30,080 Speaker 1: figure more so than an actual person. Even if she 216 00:13:30,320 --> 00:13:33,679 Speaker 1: had some of those qualities, a lot of the descriptions 217 00:13:33,960 --> 00:13:38,400 Speaker 1: can be embellishment, exaggerated, and even inaccurate. She has been 218 00:13:38,400 --> 00:13:42,160 Speaker 1: made into this character, as it goes with a lot 219 00:13:42,200 --> 00:13:47,839 Speaker 1: of people who are nicknamed. So she had other There 220 00:13:47,840 --> 00:13:50,520 Speaker 1: were other things people called her as well, um, like 221 00:13:50,600 --> 00:13:56,079 Speaker 1: black Mary, white crow, colored Mary, inward Mary. There's something 222 00:13:56,080 --> 00:13:58,400 Speaker 1: to be said about the way that the Old West 223 00:13:58,679 --> 00:14:04,080 Speaker 1: mythologizing mixed with the stereotypes of black women in her story, 224 00:14:04,520 --> 00:14:07,840 Speaker 1: those things were all wrapped up together. Um. Because she 225 00:14:07,920 --> 00:14:10,240 Speaker 1: was both she lived in the West in this time 226 00:14:10,280 --> 00:14:16,280 Speaker 1: that is portrayed with so much fantastic imagery. Um that 227 00:14:16,480 --> 00:14:22,400 Speaker 1: is understandably fascinating, you know for us to look back on, 228 00:14:22,600 --> 00:14:25,600 Speaker 1: but it is wrapped up in so many so so 229 00:14:25,720 --> 00:14:28,520 Speaker 1: many conceptions that we have of the time that are 230 00:14:28,560 --> 00:14:37,080 Speaker 1: built on media and the propagandizing of of the character 231 00:14:37,240 --> 00:14:40,880 Speaker 1: of the time. So you know, there were sources that 232 00:14:40,920 --> 00:14:44,400 Speaker 1: says she was six ft in two hundred pounds, which 233 00:14:44,880 --> 00:14:47,160 Speaker 1: is like, you know, why we need to talk about 234 00:14:47,160 --> 00:14:52,320 Speaker 1: her weight, but whatever, um, which McConnell says, it's not 235 00:14:52,360 --> 00:14:54,960 Speaker 1: true that she did quote unquote Man's work. So a 236 00:14:55,000 --> 00:14:58,880 Speaker 1: lot of the secondary sources that you'll see, which is like, oh, 237 00:14:58,960 --> 00:15:02,240 Speaker 1: you know, great there talking about this this woman, Like 238 00:15:02,240 --> 00:15:05,560 Speaker 1: it's great that we do have so many, like mainstream 239 00:15:05,600 --> 00:15:08,560 Speaker 1: sources that talk about her, that talk about her history, 240 00:15:08,640 --> 00:15:14,360 Speaker 1: but still fall victim to all of the stereotyping and 241 00:15:14,400 --> 00:15:17,440 Speaker 1: the racism that's been perpetuated from her over time, because 242 00:15:17,480 --> 00:15:20,320 Speaker 1: it's just kind of regardgitating those things so that she 243 00:15:20,360 --> 00:15:23,800 Speaker 1: did Man's work because she was doing things like construction, 244 00:15:23,880 --> 00:15:25,960 Speaker 1: gardening and carried a gun and things like that, and 245 00:15:26,000 --> 00:15:29,400 Speaker 1: that she was generally imposing so with the building of 246 00:15:29,400 --> 00:15:32,840 Speaker 1: this figure, like in my head, you have a picture 247 00:15:32,880 --> 00:15:34,880 Speaker 1: to go along with it. So that picture that Samantha 248 00:15:34,960 --> 00:15:38,520 Speaker 1: mentioned earlier, that is of her standing in a very 249 00:15:38,600 --> 00:15:42,520 Speaker 1: like stately way holding a long rifle that's almost as 250 00:15:42,560 --> 00:15:45,920 Speaker 1: tall as her and in black and white, you know, 251 00:15:46,000 --> 00:15:49,840 Speaker 1: that helps as well, just makes it so that wow, yeah, 252 00:15:49,960 --> 00:15:53,320 Speaker 1: I can see this woman being that person. Maybe these 253 00:15:53,320 --> 00:15:57,520 Speaker 1: things are true. So people have created this larger than 254 00:15:57,560 --> 00:16:04,880 Speaker 1: life character for it was gun toting, pain swearing, fight picking, drinking, smoking, 255 00:16:05,040 --> 00:16:08,880 Speaker 1: cussing woman. But it's important to remember that she was 256 00:16:08,920 --> 00:16:11,520 Speaker 1: a dark skinned black woman in the United States in 257 00:16:11,680 --> 00:16:16,000 Speaker 1: the mid to late eight early nineteen hundreds, and that 258 00:16:16,080 --> 00:16:18,360 Speaker 1: happens all the time with dark skinned black women, where 259 00:16:18,360 --> 00:16:21,360 Speaker 1: they're portrayed as more masculine um and they have to 260 00:16:21,400 --> 00:16:24,080 Speaker 1: be a certain way. Power is inherent in a person, 261 00:16:24,560 --> 00:16:26,680 Speaker 1: especially one who's in the Old West, Like, how could 262 00:16:26,720 --> 00:16:29,480 Speaker 1: a dark skinned black woman who lived, you know, we 263 00:16:29,600 --> 00:16:32,520 Speaker 1: lived and worked just after the Civil War and knew 264 00:16:32,520 --> 00:16:35,000 Speaker 1: how to ride horses and was a sharp shooter and 265 00:16:35,400 --> 00:16:39,440 Speaker 1: all these how could she not be masculine? So yeah, 266 00:16:39,480 --> 00:16:44,280 Speaker 1: this is it's been definitely like that's what spewed in 267 00:16:44,320 --> 00:16:47,080 Speaker 1: her history. Um, So she was a good shooter and 268 00:16:47,080 --> 00:16:50,240 Speaker 1: horseback rider, but she wasn't in gunfights since she wasn't 269 00:16:50,280 --> 00:16:53,640 Speaker 1: in a gang, and she wore pants under her skirt, 270 00:16:54,040 --> 00:16:56,520 Speaker 1: and she was tough. She was devoted to her work 271 00:16:56,720 --> 00:16:59,480 Speaker 1: and the people she cared about. But it's really clear 272 00:16:59,560 --> 00:17:02,400 Speaker 1: that during even during her time, so this wasn't just 273 00:17:02,880 --> 00:17:06,800 Speaker 1: post her you know, posthumous Lee, this was also during 274 00:17:06,800 --> 00:17:08,960 Speaker 1: her time, you know, when she was getting these nicknames 275 00:17:08,960 --> 00:17:11,640 Speaker 1: and things like that. But her figure has been stretched 276 00:17:11,640 --> 00:17:15,560 Speaker 1: beyond her actual personhood with it being clear that racism 277 00:17:15,600 --> 00:17:18,320 Speaker 1: plays a big role in that, which is something that 278 00:17:18,440 --> 00:17:20,280 Speaker 1: I know y'all enculed her a lot, like when y'all 279 00:17:20,320 --> 00:17:25,600 Speaker 1: are doing your history research, um and in feminist history 280 00:17:25,640 --> 00:17:29,480 Speaker 1: in general, I think it's funny that anything that isn't 281 00:17:29,480 --> 00:17:33,160 Speaker 1: shrinking is obviously the opposite of that. Like if you're 282 00:17:33,200 --> 00:17:35,760 Speaker 1: just being, that means you're trying to take up space, 283 00:17:35,880 --> 00:17:38,280 Speaker 1: especially for women of color, especially as you were talking 284 00:17:38,280 --> 00:17:42,000 Speaker 1: about like that, this specific woman in this time. Oh 285 00:17:42,040 --> 00:17:45,320 Speaker 1: my gosh, even today, we know that that still happens 286 00:17:45,359 --> 00:17:49,080 Speaker 1: for people who are not seen as the top tier 287 00:17:49,480 --> 00:17:52,160 Speaker 1: of what they think is success, which is a white 288 00:17:52,200 --> 00:17:56,199 Speaker 1: man in general, so having that and just could just 289 00:17:56,280 --> 00:17:59,760 Speaker 1: clearly be existing, surviving, doing what they're good at. So 290 00:17:59,800 --> 00:18:02,199 Speaker 1: they're for, oh, we have to make a reason as 291 00:18:02,200 --> 00:18:04,360 Speaker 1: to why you were okay with you doing that. We're 292 00:18:04,359 --> 00:18:07,120 Speaker 1: gonna allow this to happen, and it's usually very big 293 00:18:07,119 --> 00:18:10,800 Speaker 1: and very sexist, very racist reasons. Yeah. Can I repeat 294 00:18:10,840 --> 00:18:12,840 Speaker 1: what you just said, Samantham, because I really love that 295 00:18:13,200 --> 00:18:16,360 Speaker 1: when you just said, even if someone is not shrinking, 296 00:18:16,880 --> 00:18:18,680 Speaker 1: it seems like they're taking up space. And I feel 297 00:18:18,720 --> 00:18:22,399 Speaker 1: like you really beautifully worded that, because I don't that 298 00:18:22,600 --> 00:18:26,480 Speaker 1: is just really poetic in a way, even though poetic 299 00:18:26,720 --> 00:18:30,000 Speaker 1: kind of connotes a good thing. But because she was 300 00:18:30,320 --> 00:18:32,800 Speaker 1: like that six ft and two hundred pounds, like that 301 00:18:32,880 --> 00:18:36,080 Speaker 1: translated in a literal way for people who were recording 302 00:18:36,080 --> 00:18:39,480 Speaker 1: her history, like she was a large person, as if 303 00:18:39,480 --> 00:18:41,359 Speaker 1: she couldn't do the things that she did and also 304 00:18:41,440 --> 00:18:45,600 Speaker 1: still have character and you know, be this person who 305 00:18:45,640 --> 00:18:49,760 Speaker 1: was full of life, but you know, she was clearly 306 00:18:50,480 --> 00:18:53,320 Speaker 1: bigger than she needed to be, because I mean, oftentimes 307 00:18:53,359 --> 00:18:55,680 Speaker 1: I guess this is a conundrum in this you know, 308 00:18:56,040 --> 00:18:59,119 Speaker 1: where black people and black women are made more masculine 309 00:18:59,160 --> 00:19:02,879 Speaker 1: and larger, we're all so diminished like made diminutive as well. 310 00:19:03,640 --> 00:19:05,920 Speaker 1: So yeah, I really love the way you put that santhis. 311 00:19:06,000 --> 00:19:09,160 Speaker 1: Thank you for saying that, UM. And I also feel 312 00:19:09,160 --> 00:19:12,000 Speaker 1: like it's important to say that both things can exist 313 00:19:12,040 --> 00:19:13,880 Speaker 1: at the same time. I feel like we talked about 314 00:19:13,920 --> 00:19:16,960 Speaker 1: this a lot when we are talking about these figures 315 00:19:16,960 --> 00:19:19,800 Speaker 1: in history, especially because their first Like there is so 316 00:19:19,880 --> 00:19:22,000 Speaker 1: much contradiction in them where there are people who came 317 00:19:22,040 --> 00:19:25,040 Speaker 1: before them, but this is also accomplishment for them. It's 318 00:19:25,040 --> 00:19:27,440 Speaker 1: the same case in this. It's like, yeah, she could 319 00:19:27,480 --> 00:19:31,320 Speaker 1: have you know, people can't be tough, they can be rowdy, 320 00:19:31,359 --> 00:19:34,040 Speaker 1: they can be all of these things today and yesterday 321 00:19:34,200 --> 00:19:37,040 Speaker 1: and far back in history. Um, they can contain all 322 00:19:37,040 --> 00:19:41,120 Speaker 1: of those characteristics in themselves. But that can also be 323 00:19:41,760 --> 00:19:43,880 Speaker 1: There's so many different elements to it. Like people who 324 00:19:43,920 --> 00:19:46,200 Speaker 1: lived during her time and interacted with her were also 325 00:19:46,720 --> 00:19:51,359 Speaker 1: colored by their perceptions of her based on the world 326 00:19:51,480 --> 00:19:53,040 Speaker 1: views that they had at the time, a lot of 327 00:19:53,040 --> 00:19:56,119 Speaker 1: which was racism, but also ignorance and not interacting with 328 00:19:56,200 --> 00:19:58,679 Speaker 1: black people and expecting a certain thing when it was 329 00:19:58,720 --> 00:20:02,280 Speaker 1: time for them to interact with black people, UM, and 330 00:20:02,800 --> 00:20:07,160 Speaker 1: expecting black people to take certain what roles is specifically 331 00:20:07,160 --> 00:20:11,439 Speaker 1: black women. So yeah, like it could be that she 332 00:20:11,560 --> 00:20:14,439 Speaker 1: had some of those elements in her and also that 333 00:20:14,520 --> 00:20:17,840 Speaker 1: other people who remarked about her, we're remarking from their 334 00:20:17,880 --> 00:20:21,960 Speaker 1: own personal world views. And also that she might have 335 00:20:22,000 --> 00:20:26,080 Speaker 1: been that way for a certain reason because in rural 336 00:20:26,160 --> 00:20:29,640 Speaker 1: Montana in the eighteen hundreds and she had to deal 337 00:20:29,680 --> 00:20:32,520 Speaker 1: with people in their prejudices, Like, it's not it's not 338 00:20:32,560 --> 00:20:35,880 Speaker 1: that it's not that complicated. It's definitely complicated, but it's 339 00:20:35,920 --> 00:20:55,320 Speaker 1: not that complicated. So as if the story goes, the 340 00:20:55,600 --> 00:20:58,440 Speaker 1: state Bishop of Montana ended up ordering Mary to be 341 00:20:58,640 --> 00:21:02,479 Speaker 1: dismissed from the car event, and supposedly because she had 342 00:21:02,520 --> 00:21:06,119 Speaker 1: got enough fight with someone and got an in a 343 00:21:06,160 --> 00:21:10,560 Speaker 1: fight with someone, and he deemed her behavior inappropriate for 344 00:21:11,200 --> 00:21:13,600 Speaker 1: the work that she was doing, the customs that they 345 00:21:13,600 --> 00:21:15,920 Speaker 1: were trying to impart up upon the children, the Native 346 00:21:15,960 --> 00:21:19,040 Speaker 1: American children at the mission school. So after she left 347 00:21:19,040 --> 00:21:23,359 Speaker 1: the mission, she went to near Cascade, which was just nearby, 348 00:21:23,480 --> 00:21:27,159 Speaker 1: and opened a restaurant there. But the restaurant didn't do 349 00:21:27,200 --> 00:21:29,400 Speaker 1: so hot. She gave a lot of away, a lot 350 00:21:29,440 --> 00:21:32,320 Speaker 1: of meals for free, so it wasn't that profitable of 351 00:21:32,359 --> 00:21:36,800 Speaker 1: a venture. And that's in comes the part where she 352 00:21:36,800 --> 00:21:39,320 Speaker 1: gets her first because she pursued a job as a 353 00:21:39,320 --> 00:21:43,240 Speaker 1: mail carrier was that restaurant. Being a restaurateur didn't work 354 00:21:43,240 --> 00:21:46,000 Speaker 1: out for her, she pursued that job as a mail 355 00:21:46,080 --> 00:21:49,199 Speaker 1: carrier for a route between cass Gate and St. Peter's Mission, 356 00:21:49,960 --> 00:21:53,920 Speaker 1: so she knew she knew the area already, and in 357 00:21:55,600 --> 00:21:58,400 Speaker 1: she got that contract to be a star Root mail 358 00:21:58,440 --> 00:22:02,439 Speaker 1: carrier for the U. S. Post Office Department. At this 359 00:22:02,480 --> 00:22:08,760 Speaker 1: point she was in her sixties, so for a little context. 360 00:22:08,920 --> 00:22:14,080 Speaker 1: The department introduced rural free delivery in eight nine in 361 00:22:14,119 --> 00:22:17,960 Speaker 1: West Virginia and it spread from there, though it took 362 00:22:18,000 --> 00:22:20,399 Speaker 1: several years for it to be implemented across the country, 363 00:22:20,400 --> 00:22:23,960 Speaker 1: so it's kind of slow moving because before then, rural 364 00:22:24,000 --> 00:22:26,120 Speaker 1: people would have to travel to pick up their mail 365 00:22:26,200 --> 00:22:29,520 Speaker 1: at the post office are paid private services to deliver them, 366 00:22:29,960 --> 00:22:33,639 Speaker 1: while folks in the city it could have it conveniently delivered. 367 00:22:34,280 --> 00:22:37,399 Speaker 1: And in the years already by default, i should say 368 00:22:37,640 --> 00:22:40,560 Speaker 1: um in the years leading to rural free delivery, customers 369 00:22:40,560 --> 00:22:43,040 Speaker 1: were asking for routes to be established to rural places 370 00:22:43,040 --> 00:22:44,679 Speaker 1: for obvious reasons, like a lot of the time they 371 00:22:44,680 --> 00:22:48,200 Speaker 1: had to travel far to pick up their mail. So 372 00:22:48,280 --> 00:22:52,520 Speaker 1: what exactly is the Star route it is In five 373 00:22:53,240 --> 00:22:56,960 Speaker 1: to reduce mail transportation cost, Congress had a preface for 374 00:22:57,000 --> 00:22:59,600 Speaker 1: stage coaches, but they ditched that, and they made it 375 00:22:59,640 --> 00:23:02,399 Speaker 1: so that contracts would be awarded to the lowest bidder 376 00:23:02,440 --> 00:23:09,119 Speaker 1: for quote, what may be necessary to provide for the due, celarity, certainty, 377 00:23:09,160 --> 00:23:14,800 Speaker 1: and security of such transportation. So postal clerks often shortened 378 00:23:14,840 --> 00:23:19,119 Speaker 1: that phrase to three asterisks for the three points or 379 00:23:19,200 --> 00:23:21,800 Speaker 1: and or stars, whatever you wanna call them. The bids 380 00:23:21,880 --> 00:23:24,879 Speaker 1: became known as starbids, and the roots became known as 381 00:23:24,960 --> 00:23:28,119 Speaker 1: star roots, and they the star roots started off being 382 00:23:28,119 --> 00:23:31,359 Speaker 1: implemented in places that weren't populated enough for an official route. 383 00:23:32,200 --> 00:23:35,200 Speaker 1: So star roots just sounds amazing, though, like she did 384 00:23:35,200 --> 00:23:38,959 Speaker 1: a Star route in actuality, it's it's a lot more 385 00:23:39,040 --> 00:23:43,919 Speaker 1: mundane than than what it sounds like, because the stars 386 00:23:43,960 --> 00:23:47,520 Speaker 1: for astress. But still, you know, a Star route, like 387 00:23:47,600 --> 00:23:54,640 Speaker 1: you know, it's still it felts upgraded, for sure. That's 388 00:23:54,760 --> 00:23:56,439 Speaker 1: the minute the work that she did. Of course, like 389 00:23:56,480 --> 00:23:59,120 Speaker 1: I'm being money, but Mary, she did carry a mail 390 00:23:59,200 --> 00:24:02,280 Speaker 1: on her root for years until nineteen o three. It 391 00:24:02,400 --> 00:24:05,560 Speaker 1: was a thirty four mile round trip. She had to 392 00:24:05,600 --> 00:24:09,040 Speaker 1: deal with the harsh weather and the wildlife like wolves, 393 00:24:09,080 --> 00:24:12,159 Speaker 1: which is where you know, what is the uh is 394 00:24:12,160 --> 00:24:15,880 Speaker 1: it balto? Yeah, that kind of idea of like, oh 395 00:24:15,960 --> 00:24:18,879 Speaker 1: my gosh, it's it's huge adventure that you have to 396 00:24:18,880 --> 00:24:20,800 Speaker 1: go on and make sure day job and you're in 397 00:24:20,840 --> 00:24:31,840 Speaker 1: the wild West like in the United States. Hey was 398 00:24:31,960 --> 00:24:35,720 Speaker 1: low and hours were long, uh. And she would drive 399 00:24:35,760 --> 00:24:38,600 Speaker 1: that stage coach are she wouldn't even walk in snowshoes 400 00:24:38,640 --> 00:24:42,399 Speaker 1: at times when it was necessary, and she was reliable 401 00:24:42,520 --> 00:24:44,520 Speaker 1: and she was quick at her job, and her work 402 00:24:44,560 --> 00:24:47,080 Speaker 1: as a carrier earned her that nickname that you know, 403 00:24:47,200 --> 00:24:50,080 Speaker 1: stage coach Mary. Yeah. I mean it's one of those 404 00:24:50,119 --> 00:24:54,560 Speaker 1: things that I guess, you know, we take for granted 405 00:24:54,600 --> 00:24:57,200 Speaker 1: that mail just arrives and at a time, Yeah, there 406 00:24:57,280 --> 00:25:02,919 Speaker 1: was you going out into the the elements and dealing 407 00:25:03,000 --> 00:25:07,719 Speaker 1: with wolves and all of these things. And I can 408 00:25:07,800 --> 00:25:12,080 Speaker 1: imagine like how you know, people were grateful to be 409 00:25:12,119 --> 00:25:16,840 Speaker 1: able to have the service and that's kind of like wow, yeah, 410 00:25:17,040 --> 00:25:21,359 Speaker 1: here she comes stagecoach Mary. And if you go watch 411 00:25:21,480 --> 00:25:24,640 Speaker 1: videos on I think about how I don't I don't 412 00:25:24,640 --> 00:25:26,919 Speaker 1: know if this is the official slogan, but like the 413 00:25:27,040 --> 00:25:30,520 Speaker 1: for the U. S. Postal Service today, how it's like 414 00:25:30,880 --> 00:25:36,720 Speaker 1: we'll go rain sleek Snow, that's what I thought you 415 00:25:36,720 --> 00:25:40,879 Speaker 1: were referencing at first. So there's kind of pride around, 416 00:25:40,960 --> 00:25:44,080 Speaker 1: you know, being able to deliver at any time and 417 00:25:44,119 --> 00:25:47,120 Speaker 1: get the things to people when they need them. Um. 418 00:25:47,240 --> 00:25:49,440 Speaker 1: And I also want to you know, I said earlier 419 00:25:49,520 --> 00:25:53,240 Speaker 1: that I was thinking about the West, but also another thing. 420 00:25:53,920 --> 00:25:55,399 Speaker 1: You know, it's the time of season when we're all 421 00:25:55,440 --> 00:25:58,160 Speaker 1: talking about the post office. A lot of that talk 422 00:25:58,280 --> 00:26:02,200 Speaker 1: is maligning, but they're doing a lot of work right now, 423 00:26:02,280 --> 00:26:03,920 Speaker 1: and they always are at this time of the year, 424 00:26:04,480 --> 00:26:07,280 Speaker 1: so I feel like it it fits, you know, within 425 00:26:07,960 --> 00:26:11,600 Speaker 1: the theme when we're all the stressed over like when 426 00:26:11,640 --> 00:26:13,800 Speaker 1: things are going to get to certain places and packages 427 00:26:13,800 --> 00:26:15,400 Speaker 1: are going to get to certain places, and if they're 428 00:26:15,400 --> 00:26:16,840 Speaker 1: going to make them one time or not, and if 429 00:26:16,840 --> 00:26:19,000 Speaker 1: they're going to get there safely there's gonna be anything 430 00:26:19,000 --> 00:26:20,600 Speaker 1: in the box when it gets there. Oh my god. 431 00:26:20,600 --> 00:26:25,760 Speaker 1: I could go on about like are you okay? I'm 432 00:26:25,800 --> 00:26:28,520 Speaker 1: just thinking about the things that we complain about, like 433 00:26:28,680 --> 00:26:30,960 Speaker 1: but also thinking about how far we had to come 434 00:26:31,040 --> 00:26:32,680 Speaker 1: to get to a place where we had our male 435 00:26:32,720 --> 00:26:37,800 Speaker 1: conveniently delivered like this. It just feels so extra to 436 00:26:37,840 --> 00:26:41,600 Speaker 1: be complaining about this. I love watching episodes where it's 437 00:26:41,600 --> 00:26:43,320 Speaker 1: supposed to be in the future and you have someone 438 00:26:43,359 --> 00:26:45,919 Speaker 1: from the past and you're trying to explain like deliveries 439 00:26:45,920 --> 00:26:47,960 Speaker 1: in or mail, and they're like, oh, yeah, we'll be 440 00:26:48,000 --> 00:26:51,359 Speaker 1: here like immediately, and it's like, yeah, not really. They 441 00:26:51,480 --> 00:26:54,720 Speaker 1: it worse like that. They're like, those are my favorite 442 00:26:54,760 --> 00:27:01,200 Speaker 1: moments of those comparisons they express is delivered by play. 443 00:27:01,720 --> 00:27:06,760 Speaker 1: I mean it's amazing because I mean the logistics alone 444 00:27:06,960 --> 00:27:11,520 Speaker 1: are make my brain hurt. Yeah, yeah for real. Yeah, 445 00:27:11,600 --> 00:27:14,439 Speaker 1: So Mary was It's part of that history. You know, 446 00:27:14,640 --> 00:27:18,080 Speaker 1: it's not just some separate woman history, not some separate 447 00:27:18,080 --> 00:27:20,560 Speaker 1: black person or black woman history. She's part of the 448 00:27:20,560 --> 00:27:23,320 Speaker 1: whole history of the United States Postal Service that got 449 00:27:23,359 --> 00:27:26,919 Speaker 1: us to this day. And after finishing her stint with 450 00:27:26,920 --> 00:27:31,160 Speaker 1: the post Office Department, she opened a laundry service and Cascade. 451 00:27:31,920 --> 00:27:37,240 Speaker 1: She babysat children, gave them treats, She continued gardening, and 452 00:27:37,359 --> 00:27:40,359 Speaker 1: she went to baseball games in Cascade, and even chose 453 00:27:40,440 --> 00:27:45,760 Speaker 1: to be mascot for the town's baseball team. Which sorry, 454 00:27:45,920 --> 00:27:48,560 Speaker 1: when I heard this, I had to laugh because I 455 00:27:48,600 --> 00:27:51,520 Speaker 1: was like, she was mascot for the team, you know, like, 456 00:27:51,960 --> 00:27:55,640 Speaker 1: did she choose that or know, right, but she did. 457 00:27:55,960 --> 00:27:57,959 Speaker 1: She really liked baseball and you can actually go and 458 00:27:58,000 --> 00:28:01,480 Speaker 1: find a picture of her with the baseball team online, 459 00:28:02,080 --> 00:28:05,639 Speaker 1: so that's pretty cool to look out. And yeah, and 460 00:28:05,680 --> 00:28:07,879 Speaker 1: people in her townel would help her out as well. 461 00:28:08,200 --> 00:28:10,280 Speaker 1: She got free meals and when her house caught on 462 00:28:10,400 --> 00:28:13,640 Speaker 1: fire nineteen twelve, people helped her rebuild it. So it's 463 00:28:13,640 --> 00:28:17,040 Speaker 1: not to say that everybody in Montana treated her will 464 00:28:17,200 --> 00:28:21,280 Speaker 1: like obviously she everybody didn't like her, people had it 465 00:28:21,320 --> 00:28:24,760 Speaker 1: out for her. UM. She didn't necessarily jail immediately in 466 00:28:24,760 --> 00:28:28,680 Speaker 1: the communities that she was in UM, but she did 467 00:28:28,760 --> 00:28:32,480 Speaker 1: have support in her communities, and she did four bonds 468 00:28:32,520 --> 00:28:35,680 Speaker 1: with the nuns also that she worked with UM from 469 00:28:35,800 --> 00:28:39,080 Speaker 1: the mission. So yeah, there were people on her team 470 00:28:39,080 --> 00:28:40,520 Speaker 1: and there were people who weren't on her team, as 471 00:28:40,520 --> 00:28:42,160 Speaker 1: we can say about so many of us in life, 472 00:28:42,320 --> 00:28:44,560 Speaker 1: with the caveat that she's her own individual, last person 473 00:28:44,600 --> 00:28:48,560 Speaker 1: who had her own struggles. But of course, so she 474 00:28:48,680 --> 00:28:52,520 Speaker 1: died on December five, nineteen fourteen, and she's buried in Cascade, 475 00:28:52,680 --> 00:28:54,480 Speaker 1: and December is her month, So I feel like that's 476 00:28:54,520 --> 00:28:59,560 Speaker 1: another good reason for December the month of remembrance. I 477 00:28:59,560 --> 00:29:05,680 Speaker 1: should I'm into it. Yeah, this is it's such a 478 00:29:05,840 --> 00:29:08,280 Speaker 1: it's such an interesting story. And I do think, like, 479 00:29:09,120 --> 00:29:10,720 Speaker 1: you know, going back to what you were saying, Eve's 480 00:29:10,760 --> 00:29:14,760 Speaker 1: about taking this time to kind of reflect and think 481 00:29:14,800 --> 00:29:20,080 Speaker 1: about change and things you want to change. And I, 482 00:29:20,080 --> 00:29:22,239 Speaker 1: I don't know. I remember when Samith and I did 483 00:29:22,240 --> 00:29:24,240 Speaker 1: this episode on this and I had never really considered 484 00:29:24,280 --> 00:29:27,920 Speaker 1: how I just take for granted the mail arriving, but 485 00:29:28,040 --> 00:29:32,680 Speaker 1: also how important you know, that relationship would be to 486 00:29:32,760 --> 00:29:35,360 Speaker 1: somebody if this person bringing you something and bringing email 487 00:29:35,360 --> 00:29:37,680 Speaker 1: and it would foster this and I can totally see 488 00:29:37,960 --> 00:29:40,040 Speaker 1: how it would build this reputation and you would just 489 00:29:40,080 --> 00:29:44,400 Speaker 1: be like, thank goodness, she's she's coming with the mail. 490 00:29:44,600 --> 00:29:47,520 Speaker 1: And I think it's worth like remembering that kind of 491 00:29:47,520 --> 00:29:51,280 Speaker 1: stuff and remembering the history that got us to where 492 00:29:51,360 --> 00:29:55,440 Speaker 1: we are today. Yeah. I agree. That's what I was 493 00:29:55,440 --> 00:29:57,280 Speaker 1: going to say earlier that if you go and look 494 00:29:57,320 --> 00:30:01,760 Speaker 1: at videos of about the Star Roots, just the the 495 00:30:01,800 --> 00:30:05,440 Speaker 1: pride that people in later years also took in being 496 00:30:05,520 --> 00:30:07,760 Speaker 1: the people who were independent carriers to get the mail 497 00:30:07,800 --> 00:30:10,880 Speaker 1: to people like this is this is my boat. I 498 00:30:10,960 --> 00:30:12,680 Speaker 1: know these waters. I'm going to get it to you 499 00:30:12,760 --> 00:30:16,520 Speaker 1: no matter what flood comes it's pretty inspiring. I feel 500 00:30:16,520 --> 00:30:18,360 Speaker 1: like you could add it to a workout playlist or 501 00:30:18,400 --> 00:30:25,719 Speaker 1: like your daily affirmations, morning affirmations. I love that, so 502 00:30:25,800 --> 00:30:27,960 Speaker 1: it's like, what do you do in your daily affirmation? 503 00:30:28,040 --> 00:30:32,720 Speaker 1: So I watched these old us. They really get me going, 504 00:30:34,320 --> 00:30:36,360 Speaker 1: probably works better than the ones we have today, So 505 00:30:36,440 --> 00:30:41,640 Speaker 1: let's do it. That's that's fair. That is really rare. Well, 506 00:30:41,720 --> 00:30:44,160 Speaker 1: this is has always been such a delight. Eaves anything 507 00:30:44,200 --> 00:30:47,120 Speaker 1: else you want to add before we close up? No, 508 00:30:47,440 --> 00:30:50,000 Speaker 1: I think that's all. That's that's it, y'all. Well I do. 509 00:30:50,080 --> 00:30:52,360 Speaker 1: I will have a question though, So as we were, 510 00:30:52,440 --> 00:30:55,440 Speaker 1: you were talking at the beginning that she's portrayed down 511 00:30:55,480 --> 00:30:58,719 Speaker 1: even now today because she's become kind of such a figurehead. 512 00:30:59,040 --> 00:31:04,040 Speaker 1: So apparently both she uh stagecoach Marya as well as 513 00:31:04,120 --> 00:31:08,120 Speaker 1: Cathay Williams are on our portrayed. I think this is 514 00:31:08,320 --> 00:31:12,320 Speaker 1: very loosely base, but they're they're characterized as this on 515 00:31:12,520 --> 00:31:15,760 Speaker 1: Harder to Fall. Has anyone seen this? Yeah, I was 516 00:31:15,800 --> 00:31:17,440 Speaker 1: gonna bring it up, but I hadn't seen it, so 517 00:31:17,480 --> 00:31:22,000 Speaker 1: I haven't seen it, but I do plan on watching 518 00:31:22,040 --> 00:31:24,680 Speaker 1: it because I feel like it's a very loose Uh, 519 00:31:24,680 --> 00:31:27,840 Speaker 1: it's a pretty loose um portrayal of who they were. 520 00:31:28,200 --> 00:31:30,200 Speaker 1: I mean, I will say there was some criticism on 521 00:31:30,240 --> 00:31:32,400 Speaker 1: the on the people who portray it because they were 522 00:31:32,440 --> 00:31:34,840 Speaker 1: trying to make it. As we were talking about like 523 00:31:34,880 --> 00:31:38,840 Speaker 1: the larger than life she is portrayed by Zusi beats. 524 00:31:39,480 --> 00:31:42,360 Speaker 1: I think I'm just saying the right on harder to fall. 525 00:31:42,600 --> 00:31:45,600 Speaker 1: And obviously I think from the photo of what we 526 00:31:45,720 --> 00:31:50,400 Speaker 1: have for who she is, uh in the way back, 527 00:31:50,080 --> 00:31:53,520 Speaker 1: way back when, it's definitely different portrayal, and I think 528 00:31:53,520 --> 00:31:56,480 Speaker 1: that was kind of the same idea with Cathay Williams. 529 00:31:56,520 --> 00:31:59,760 Speaker 1: They're like, Okay, obviously they're not doing it exactly, They're 530 00:31:59,800 --> 00:32:02,800 Speaker 1: not trying to find people looking like them, but representing 531 00:32:02,880 --> 00:32:05,000 Speaker 1: what they did. So I just wondered how that came 532 00:32:05,040 --> 00:32:06,760 Speaker 1: because I've heard a lot of back and forth, and 533 00:32:06,800 --> 00:32:08,600 Speaker 1: I'm really excited about the movie because I do have 534 00:32:08,640 --> 00:32:11,960 Speaker 1: a lot of famous black Western cowboys slash people in 535 00:32:12,040 --> 00:32:14,000 Speaker 1: that time, so I do want to see it and 536 00:32:14,080 --> 00:32:16,959 Speaker 1: I'm really excited by it. But I wondered if anybody 537 00:32:16,960 --> 00:32:20,960 Speaker 1: had actually seen that portrayal. But I'll answer my question 538 00:32:21,040 --> 00:32:26,200 Speaker 1: so a audience, our listeners have seen it, let us know, yes, yes, 539 00:32:26,760 --> 00:32:30,880 Speaker 1: us now maybe we will revisit this episode. Yeah, and 540 00:32:30,920 --> 00:32:33,320 Speaker 1: maybe you can drop a comment on any discrepancies that 541 00:32:33,400 --> 00:32:35,640 Speaker 1: you felt like we're in the film or anything you 542 00:32:35,920 --> 00:32:40,760 Speaker 1: thought that they got really right about. Yeah, yeah, i'd 543 00:32:40,800 --> 00:32:49,840 Speaker 1: been great. We'll do a female first round up that 544 00:32:49,840 --> 00:32:53,560 Speaker 1: would that would be really good of portrayals and fictional media. 545 00:32:55,240 --> 00:32:57,520 Speaker 1: I like that. Yeah. The book that McConnell wrote is 546 00:32:57,520 --> 00:33:00,680 Speaker 1: actually a fictionalized historical account as well. And apparently the 547 00:33:00,680 --> 00:33:05,560 Speaker 1: book that she's supposed to be releasing next year is 548 00:33:06,720 --> 00:33:08,680 Speaker 1: going to be more on the non fiction side based 549 00:33:08,720 --> 00:33:11,520 Speaker 1: on the sources that she used to create the falized account. 550 00:33:12,480 --> 00:33:17,080 Speaker 1: A lot of stuff to check out. I love it, um, 551 00:33:17,080 --> 00:33:21,360 Speaker 1: and we love having you here, Eaves for the last 552 00:33:21,520 --> 00:33:31,080 Speaker 1: female first of one, So we'll see you in two. 553 00:33:31,680 --> 00:33:34,400 Speaker 1: In the meantime, where can the listeners find you? You 554 00:33:34,480 --> 00:33:37,920 Speaker 1: can find me on Twitter at Eve's Deep Code, on 555 00:33:37,960 --> 00:33:43,920 Speaker 1: Instagram at not Apologizing, and on here this very show. 556 00:33:44,360 --> 00:33:47,440 Speaker 1: UM for a lot of other female first episodes, so 557 00:33:47,520 --> 00:33:49,880 Speaker 1: you can go back through the archives and listen to those. Yes, 558 00:33:49,920 --> 00:33:53,560 Speaker 1: but you absolutely should. Thanks as always, Eves. It was 559 00:33:53,680 --> 00:33:56,160 Speaker 1: delight and I hope you enjoyed the rest of your year. 560 00:33:56,480 --> 00:33:59,720 Speaker 1: Thank you. For a wonderful new year. Same to everyone else. Yes, 561 00:34:00,280 --> 00:34:06,680 Speaker 1: and thanks to you listeners for listening. Yes, and also 562 00:34:06,720 --> 00:34:10,320 Speaker 1: to her super producer Christina cannot forget her always always. 563 00:34:10,520 --> 00:34:12,440 Speaker 1: If you would like to contact us, you can Our 564 00:34:12,520 --> 00:34:15,040 Speaker 1: email is Seppidia mom Stuff at iHeart video dot com. 565 00:34:15,320 --> 00:34:17,440 Speaker 1: You can find us on Twitter at mom Stuff podcast 566 00:34:17,560 --> 00:34:20,359 Speaker 1: or on Instagram at stuff I've Never told you. And Yes, 567 00:34:20,680 --> 00:34:22,879 Speaker 1: thanks to all of you, Happy holidays, Happy New Year, 568 00:34:22,960 --> 00:34:26,799 Speaker 1: whatever you happy all the time, but yes all the time. Yes. 569 00:34:27,239 --> 00:34:29,600 Speaker 1: Step Underment plays Prediction, I Hire Radio for More podcast, 570 00:34:29,719 --> 00:34:32,120 Speaker 1: my Heart Radio, Bush Radio, app Apple Podcast, or wherever 571 00:34:32,120 --> 00:34:33,280 Speaker 1: you listen to your favorite ships