1 00:00:00,760 --> 00:00:03,800 Speaker 1: This is the Ben and Ashley I Almost Famous Podcast 2 00:00:03,840 --> 00:00:04,640 Speaker 1: with iHeartRadio. 3 00:00:05,600 --> 00:00:09,160 Speaker 2: Hey everyone, welcome to the Almost Famous Podcast. Today we 4 00:00:09,200 --> 00:00:14,680 Speaker 2: are continuing our countdown to Grant season by interviewing former Bachelor's. 5 00:00:15,000 --> 00:00:17,320 Speaker 2: Today's Bachelor is Ben Higgins. 6 00:00:17,600 --> 00:00:17,920 Speaker 3: Wow. 7 00:00:18,840 --> 00:00:22,960 Speaker 2: Wow. We were joking before starting recording that this could 8 00:00:23,000 --> 00:00:25,439 Speaker 2: be the easiest interview that we've ever done here on 9 00:00:25,440 --> 00:00:29,200 Speaker 2: the Almost Famous Podcast, or it could be the hardest time. 10 00:00:29,200 --> 00:00:33,879 Speaker 2: Will tell Ben, are you worried about some of the 11 00:00:34,000 --> 00:00:36,800 Speaker 2: questions that I might ask? Because you know, I do 12 00:00:36,960 --> 00:00:43,960 Speaker 2: ask some scary questions to our guests, and today our 13 00:00:44,000 --> 00:00:48,160 Speaker 2: producers have written questions that I have been curious about, 14 00:00:48,560 --> 00:00:50,919 Speaker 2: but I wasn't sure I was gonna be brave enough 15 00:00:50,960 --> 00:00:54,280 Speaker 2: to ask. But since we're both thinking it, I might 16 00:00:54,480 --> 00:00:56,960 Speaker 2: have to. And I'm gonna blame them for being the 17 00:00:57,000 --> 00:01:00,280 Speaker 2: ones that really put it on paper. 18 00:01:00,400 --> 00:01:04,240 Speaker 4: Yeah. I haven't seen the rundown. I chose not to 19 00:01:04,280 --> 00:01:06,400 Speaker 4: look because I just want I want to be interviewed. 20 00:01:06,400 --> 00:01:09,559 Speaker 4: It's been so long since I've done a deep dive 21 00:01:09,880 --> 00:01:14,800 Speaker 4: into that season that this is exciting for me. 22 00:01:15,319 --> 00:01:17,080 Speaker 3: You don't scare me, so. 23 00:01:18,080 --> 00:01:20,800 Speaker 2: I am the least scary person of all time. We 24 00:01:20,880 --> 00:01:22,440 Speaker 2: all know this everybody. 25 00:01:22,040 --> 00:01:24,080 Speaker 4: Knows me, not to some of the past Bachelor's I 26 00:01:24,080 --> 00:01:28,560 Speaker 4: think exactly scared. Yeah, Ashley, you got me, Like, I 27 00:01:28,600 --> 00:01:31,480 Speaker 4: don't know about this. No, this will be great. I 28 00:01:31,520 --> 00:01:35,160 Speaker 4: cannot wait to reminisce. Here's the only thing I want 29 00:01:35,200 --> 00:01:40,000 Speaker 4: to start with, though, will be Please forgive me if 30 00:01:40,040 --> 00:01:44,560 Speaker 4: I don't remember. That is such a distant part of 31 00:01:44,600 --> 00:01:46,640 Speaker 4: my life. Not in terms of and I've said this 32 00:01:46,680 --> 00:01:50,000 Speaker 4: many times, I'm very grateful for that opportunity. I had 33 00:01:50,120 --> 00:01:53,120 Speaker 4: met some amazing people, but my life has moved on 34 00:01:53,240 --> 00:01:56,600 Speaker 4: so much from then. Not in terms of my disassociation 35 00:01:56,680 --> 00:01:58,960 Speaker 4: with the show. I want to support the show, just 36 00:01:59,160 --> 00:02:03,720 Speaker 4: mostly with tons that there will probably be things that 37 00:02:03,800 --> 00:02:07,080 Speaker 4: I forget and you'll have to maybe remind me, but 38 00:02:07,120 --> 00:02:09,160 Speaker 4: I'll love to speak into it once you remind me. 39 00:02:09,520 --> 00:02:12,440 Speaker 2: So Ben, we'll start off with when did you know 40 00:02:12,600 --> 00:02:14,520 Speaker 2: you were going to be the Bachelor? And I want 41 00:02:14,560 --> 00:02:17,959 Speaker 2: you to say dead truth, like I knew that they 42 00:02:18,080 --> 00:02:20,919 Speaker 2: were gunning for me during Caitlyn season at this point. 43 00:02:21,880 --> 00:02:27,040 Speaker 4: Yeah, I'd say the first moment that I realized something 44 00:02:27,120 --> 00:02:29,560 Speaker 4: was up. So when we were in the house in 45 00:02:29,600 --> 00:02:34,480 Speaker 4: the mansion, I will say I don't remember many guys 46 00:02:34,919 --> 00:02:37,560 Speaker 4: I don't really remember anybody there that was looking for 47 00:02:38,639 --> 00:02:42,600 Speaker 4: becoming the bachelor. I remember some people talking about it. 48 00:02:42,639 --> 00:02:46,000 Speaker 4: I remember Paradise being brought up, and then I kind 49 00:02:46,040 --> 00:02:50,280 Speaker 4: of remember those conversations never being that existent in our house. 50 00:02:50,320 --> 00:02:52,840 Speaker 4: So it never felt like anybody was there pushing to 51 00:02:52,880 --> 00:02:58,840 Speaker 4: be the lead. It wasn't until San Antonio that I 52 00:02:58,880 --> 00:03:01,799 Speaker 4: started with Yeah, I started to feel like I'm being 53 00:03:01,840 --> 00:03:06,600 Speaker 4: treated a little differently than most here. It was the 54 00:03:06,680 --> 00:03:09,880 Speaker 4: moment when Sean and I were roommates. Yeah, and Caitlin 55 00:03:09,960 --> 00:03:13,760 Speaker 4: snuck into our room, and you know, her and Sean 56 00:03:13,840 --> 00:03:16,400 Speaker 4: had a conversation or whatever they did right next to 57 00:03:16,440 --> 00:03:21,360 Speaker 4: me in the bathroom, and I was very much not 58 00:03:21,520 --> 00:03:25,760 Speaker 4: invited to that party. And in the bathroom, yeah, and 59 00:03:25,800 --> 00:03:28,000 Speaker 4: I left, No, I went to the bathroom. 60 00:03:28,280 --> 00:03:29,400 Speaker 3: I went, well, you went to. 61 00:03:29,400 --> 00:03:32,640 Speaker 2: The bathroom to give them privacy? How long did you 62 00:03:32,720 --> 00:03:33,720 Speaker 2: spend in the bathroom? 63 00:03:33,840 --> 00:03:38,960 Speaker 4: A long time, most of the evening into the wee mornings, 64 00:03:39,640 --> 00:03:40,600 Speaker 4: wee hours of the morning. 65 00:03:40,680 --> 00:03:41,680 Speaker 2: Do you sleep in the tub? 66 00:03:42,680 --> 00:03:45,600 Speaker 3: I sat on the floor. I just I think I 67 00:03:45,600 --> 00:03:46,600 Speaker 3: fell asleep, like. 68 00:03:46,880 --> 00:03:50,840 Speaker 4: I And so that was very early on in the season. 69 00:03:51,360 --> 00:03:55,200 Speaker 4: And I remember leaving the hotel and not being upset 70 00:03:55,360 --> 00:03:58,080 Speaker 4: because it was so early on and I really didn't 71 00:03:58,160 --> 00:04:00,840 Speaker 4: know what I was getting myself into, and I had 72 00:04:00,880 --> 00:04:03,560 Speaker 4: felt very uncomfortable whole time. I remember going to one 73 00:04:03,600 --> 00:04:07,480 Speaker 4: of the producers after they had already asked me if 74 00:04:07,560 --> 00:04:09,920 Speaker 4: Caitlyn came into our room, so I did not out her. 75 00:04:09,960 --> 00:04:11,960 Speaker 4: I want to be clear, I was not the one 76 00:04:12,000 --> 00:04:14,200 Speaker 4: to tell anybody that she was there. This is a 77 00:04:14,240 --> 00:04:18,640 Speaker 4: secret I kept for multiple days. Three days later and 78 00:04:18,680 --> 00:04:21,840 Speaker 4: a producer came to me and said, to Kaitlyn's thinking 79 00:04:21,839 --> 00:04:24,200 Speaker 4: to your room. I said yes. They asked me what happened. 80 00:04:25,279 --> 00:04:27,200 Speaker 4: I explained, I said, you know, the truth of this is, 81 00:04:27,800 --> 00:04:30,200 Speaker 4: I think I want to go home, like if I'm not, 82 00:04:31,200 --> 00:04:34,480 Speaker 4: if I'm just a burden here, then I need to 83 00:04:34,600 --> 00:04:36,880 Speaker 4: go home because I don't want to just be like 84 00:04:36,920 --> 00:04:38,920 Speaker 4: another cog in the wheel and it makes it easier 85 00:04:38,920 --> 00:04:40,479 Speaker 4: for everybody. And I understand where I'm at, in the 86 00:04:40,480 --> 00:04:41,160 Speaker 4: position I'm in. 87 00:04:41,400 --> 00:04:42,200 Speaker 3: I'm just going to go home. 88 00:04:42,600 --> 00:04:44,440 Speaker 4: And they said, let's think of let's talk about it. 89 00:04:44,720 --> 00:04:46,200 Speaker 4: They came back to me that evening and they said, 90 00:04:46,240 --> 00:04:47,920 Speaker 4: we really want you to stay, and Caitlyn wants to 91 00:04:47,960 --> 00:04:50,560 Speaker 4: talk to you. So Caitlyn has this like very friendship 92 00:04:50,600 --> 00:04:52,400 Speaker 4: conversation with me, where she's like. 93 00:04:52,360 --> 00:04:53,600 Speaker 2: You know, on camera. 94 00:04:54,680 --> 00:04:56,840 Speaker 4: It was on camera. It never got showed because they 95 00:04:56,880 --> 00:04:59,600 Speaker 4: never really showed any of that. It would have probably 96 00:04:59,680 --> 00:05:04,680 Speaker 4: ruined the season, right she you know, the producers had 97 00:05:04,680 --> 00:05:07,480 Speaker 4: asked me to keep it quiet, and so I did. 98 00:05:08,240 --> 00:05:10,800 Speaker 4: I didn't tell anybody else, really, I don't think. Maybe 99 00:05:10,800 --> 00:05:12,520 Speaker 4: I told Jared Jard been the only one I would 100 00:05:12,520 --> 00:05:18,279 Speaker 4: have told. But they she has this like very friendly 101 00:05:18,320 --> 00:05:20,680 Speaker 4: conversation with me, like a lot can change before the end, 102 00:05:20,760 --> 00:05:22,760 Speaker 4: and I really want you here, your place of fun 103 00:05:22,800 --> 00:05:26,960 Speaker 4: and comfort and all those things. And I left the conversation. 104 00:05:27,000 --> 00:05:29,120 Speaker 4: I said, if you know what, I'll stay, Like why not? 105 00:05:29,240 --> 00:05:31,719 Speaker 4: This will be fun. I was convinced this could be 106 00:05:31,720 --> 00:05:35,800 Speaker 4: a good experience. I didn't really know what that was 107 00:05:35,920 --> 00:05:40,120 Speaker 4: at the time, but it was, you know, a seed 108 00:05:40,160 --> 00:05:41,800 Speaker 4: in my mind that the show had talked to her 109 00:05:41,800 --> 00:05:43,440 Speaker 4: and been like, hey, you can't let this guy go 110 00:05:43,560 --> 00:05:46,400 Speaker 4: right now, like you can't let him go home yet, 111 00:05:46,520 --> 00:05:49,640 Speaker 4: we need him here a little longer. Then I get 112 00:05:49,800 --> 00:05:54,760 Speaker 4: eliminated from the show. We're in Dublin and I'm sitting 113 00:05:54,760 --> 00:05:57,920 Speaker 4: in my hotel room with my producer at the time, 114 00:05:58,000 --> 00:06:01,120 Speaker 4: Megan and the executive produce her at the show back 115 00:06:01,160 --> 00:06:04,360 Speaker 4: then comes in and she sits with me, and she's 116 00:06:04,360 --> 00:06:06,640 Speaker 4: asking me how I'm doing, and she's talking to me 117 00:06:06,640 --> 00:06:09,280 Speaker 4: about everything and how, you know, how the experience was, 118 00:06:10,200 --> 00:06:12,080 Speaker 4: and at the end of that conversation goes, how would 119 00:06:12,080 --> 00:06:16,320 Speaker 4: you like to be the Bachelor? I was like, this 120 00:06:16,320 --> 00:06:20,640 Speaker 4: seems very soon. I feel like I'm still getting tricked. 121 00:06:20,920 --> 00:06:22,640 Speaker 4: I feel like I'm still in this world. 122 00:06:22,440 --> 00:06:29,240 Speaker 2: And this might be the earliest they've ever asked somebody that. Seriously. 123 00:06:29,800 --> 00:06:33,640 Speaker 4: Yeah, so I you know, we kind of that conversation 124 00:06:33,760 --> 00:06:36,280 Speaker 4: came and went, and I went back home, and then 125 00:06:36,320 --> 00:06:39,279 Speaker 4: I started hearing rumors of other guys getting you know, 126 00:06:39,360 --> 00:06:42,040 Speaker 4: the interviews, and there's rumors of other guys that were 127 00:06:42,040 --> 00:06:47,040 Speaker 4: going to be chosen. And it wasn't until a few 128 00:06:47,040 --> 00:06:49,080 Speaker 4: months before the show that they called me and they 129 00:06:49,120 --> 00:06:54,080 Speaker 4: actually asked officially. But there was a good few months 130 00:06:54,120 --> 00:06:57,640 Speaker 4: in between the airing of the show and when they 131 00:06:57,720 --> 00:07:00,320 Speaker 4: asked that I was kind of hesitant or thinking, no, 132 00:07:00,440 --> 00:07:02,239 Speaker 4: this isn't for me. I mean, I went back to work, 133 00:07:02,880 --> 00:07:04,680 Speaker 4: I was kind of getting back into a rhythm. 134 00:07:06,400 --> 00:07:07,320 Speaker 3: So it was a while. 135 00:07:08,080 --> 00:07:11,320 Speaker 4: But now looking back, I should have been smart enough 136 00:07:11,320 --> 00:07:15,240 Speaker 4: to be like they they treated me differently. 137 00:07:16,160 --> 00:07:22,800 Speaker 2: They certainly did on your Night one totally honest. Who 138 00:07:23,040 --> 00:07:24,640 Speaker 2: was your top three coming out of the limo? 139 00:07:26,160 --> 00:07:30,360 Speaker 3: It's a good question. I mean, I think Night one 140 00:07:30,400 --> 00:07:32,720 Speaker 3: is really such a blur for any bachelor or bachelor. 141 00:07:33,920 --> 00:07:38,280 Speaker 4: It happened so fast, But I remember being it was 142 00:07:38,320 --> 00:07:41,160 Speaker 4: beca tilly for sure, because Becka and I had talked 143 00:07:42,000 --> 00:07:47,280 Speaker 4: before the season started, and I had said, Hey, I'm 144 00:07:47,280 --> 00:07:50,560 Speaker 4: going to be the Bachelor. If you're interesting, coming on, 145 00:07:50,640 --> 00:07:52,840 Speaker 4: come on, And she did and she was great, and 146 00:07:52,880 --> 00:07:55,200 Speaker 4: I was so excited that she took that risk to 147 00:07:55,200 --> 00:07:56,280 Speaker 4: come back a second time. 148 00:07:57,080 --> 00:07:58,800 Speaker 3: Olivia obviously got. 149 00:07:58,680 --> 00:08:00,400 Speaker 2: The final first first impression. 150 00:08:00,760 --> 00:08:02,800 Speaker 4: Yeah, and then Jen Salviana, So like, those were the 151 00:08:02,800 --> 00:08:05,520 Speaker 4: three that I remember on Night one just being super 152 00:08:07,040 --> 00:08:11,920 Speaker 4: like they stood out. But even then, it's it's so 153 00:08:12,000 --> 00:08:15,080 Speaker 4: hard to tell. You have like five minute interactions. 154 00:08:14,520 --> 00:08:18,000 Speaker 2: With each mm hmm. So with Becca, what was the 155 00:08:18,000 --> 00:08:19,920 Speaker 2: extent of your communication before the show? 156 00:08:20,760 --> 00:08:24,160 Speaker 4: We she had I think either we had ran into 157 00:08:24,240 --> 00:08:26,840 Speaker 4: each other somewhere and we were mostly in a very 158 00:08:26,920 --> 00:08:32,160 Speaker 4: like friendly like texting place, fretty friendly. Yeah, yeah, yeah, 159 00:08:32,200 --> 00:08:34,720 Speaker 4: and just kind of conversing back and forth talking about 160 00:08:34,760 --> 00:08:38,360 Speaker 4: the show, joking back and forth with each other. It 161 00:08:38,559 --> 00:08:44,360 Speaker 4: wasn't super extensive, so there wasn't this everyday type of thing. 162 00:08:44,400 --> 00:08:47,240 Speaker 4: It was once a week, you know, once every couple weeks. 163 00:08:47,320 --> 00:08:49,720 Speaker 4: It was Hey, how's this going for you? Kind of stuff? 164 00:08:52,000 --> 00:08:54,080 Speaker 4: And I think once I was announced as the bachelor, 165 00:08:54,480 --> 00:08:57,360 Speaker 4: that became like a less of a friendly thing and 166 00:08:57,360 --> 00:09:01,000 Speaker 4: more of a hey, what Like what should I do? 167 00:09:01,679 --> 00:09:03,360 Speaker 4: Was the question, and I said, you should come on 168 00:09:04,040 --> 00:09:08,560 Speaker 4: if that's something you're interested in doing. During that conversation too, 169 00:09:08,600 --> 00:09:11,240 Speaker 4: because we were able to talk before the show, I 170 00:09:11,320 --> 00:09:13,160 Speaker 4: had told her, and this will be funny later on, 171 00:09:14,679 --> 00:09:19,680 Speaker 4: not funny, it's funny now that because obviously we're great friends. 172 00:09:20,440 --> 00:09:23,120 Speaker 4: I had told her, Hey, because if you do come 173 00:09:23,160 --> 00:09:28,680 Speaker 4: on and you risk this situation, I will never make 174 00:09:28,800 --> 00:09:32,719 Speaker 4: you be eliminated in an unfair way, like at a 175 00:09:32,800 --> 00:09:34,920 Speaker 4: rose ceremony, like I will always do it when I 176 00:09:34,960 --> 00:09:36,680 Speaker 4: want to explain everything. 177 00:09:36,760 --> 00:09:39,839 Speaker 2: Okay, did you promise her a certain point like I'm 178 00:09:39,880 --> 00:09:42,520 Speaker 2: not going to eliminate you in the first couple of weeks. 179 00:09:42,840 --> 00:09:45,400 Speaker 4: No goodness, No, I never said that. No, there was 180 00:09:45,440 --> 00:09:47,720 Speaker 4: never that. It was just hey, when you if you 181 00:09:47,760 --> 00:09:51,040 Speaker 4: do get eliminated, I will always do it like in 182 00:09:51,080 --> 00:09:54,760 Speaker 4: a better way than how everybody else is. Because for me, 183 00:09:55,640 --> 00:09:58,440 Speaker 4: and I think for her, she was in a different world. Right, 184 00:09:58,480 --> 00:10:00,960 Speaker 4: she'd come off of the last season. She was risking 185 00:10:01,000 --> 00:10:05,840 Speaker 4: it again coming on this season. Her family, right was 186 00:10:05,880 --> 00:10:08,240 Speaker 4: going to be involved again. There were so many things, 187 00:10:08,280 --> 00:10:10,520 Speaker 4: and so that was my hope. Now I didn't stick 188 00:10:10,559 --> 00:10:12,720 Speaker 4: to my promise, and she got really mad about it. 189 00:10:13,040 --> 00:10:14,160 Speaker 3: We're in worsea, Indiana. 190 00:10:14,880 --> 00:10:19,880 Speaker 4: She's still there, and at that point I knew that 191 00:10:19,920 --> 00:10:23,920 Speaker 4: we weren't going to, you know, be it there at 192 00:10:23,960 --> 00:10:27,199 Speaker 4: the end. But Becca was always kind of in the 193 00:10:27,240 --> 00:10:30,040 Speaker 4: top because she's such a joy to be around, such 194 00:10:30,040 --> 00:10:31,000 Speaker 4: a joyful human. 195 00:10:31,120 --> 00:10:31,839 Speaker 3: She's so fun. 196 00:10:32,200 --> 00:10:34,680 Speaker 4: She got the process, and the girls loved her right 197 00:10:34,760 --> 00:10:37,640 Speaker 4: like her and Jojo were best friends. They still are, 198 00:10:38,720 --> 00:10:41,959 Speaker 4: And so it was like such a cool I felt 199 00:10:42,000 --> 00:10:42,680 Speaker 4: like maybe. 200 00:10:42,440 --> 00:10:43,319 Speaker 3: I was oblivious. 201 00:10:43,480 --> 00:10:46,280 Speaker 4: I felt like it was such a cool last you know, 202 00:10:46,400 --> 00:10:51,120 Speaker 4: eight people, because everybody's having so much fun. We're figuring 203 00:10:51,120 --> 00:10:55,800 Speaker 4: this thing out, traveling the world bow and warsaw, and 204 00:10:55,880 --> 00:10:57,839 Speaker 4: I kind of come to this realization, Oh my gosh, 205 00:10:57,880 --> 00:11:01,319 Speaker 4: next week is hometowns. Yeah, I don't want to put 206 00:11:01,320 --> 00:11:03,160 Speaker 4: her family through this again. I don't want to put 207 00:11:03,200 --> 00:11:05,920 Speaker 4: her through this again if I know, this isn't going 208 00:11:06,000 --> 00:11:08,400 Speaker 4: to be the one at the end, even though she could, 209 00:11:08,600 --> 00:11:13,040 Speaker 4: you know, be there. And and so I'm like coming 210 00:11:13,040 --> 00:11:16,120 Speaker 4: to this realization right before the Rose ceremony. And so 211 00:11:16,400 --> 00:11:21,520 Speaker 4: I eliminate Becka in Warsaw and we go and I 212 00:11:23,200 --> 00:11:25,839 Speaker 4: specifically said that guy, want to walk you out? And 213 00:11:25,920 --> 00:11:27,679 Speaker 4: she said yes, and we sit down the bench in 214 00:11:27,760 --> 00:11:30,960 Speaker 4: Warsaw and she goes, you promised you wouldn't do this 215 00:11:31,040 --> 00:11:34,640 Speaker 4: to me, and I was like, I know, and I'm sorry. 216 00:11:34,920 --> 00:11:35,920 Speaker 3: I don't know what else to. 217 00:11:35,920 --> 00:11:39,000 Speaker 2: Do because was she the only one eliminated at that 218 00:11:39,080 --> 00:11:41,440 Speaker 2: Rose ceremony because you had a two on one that week? 219 00:11:41,520 --> 00:11:42,640 Speaker 2: Did you have a two on one? No, you didn't 220 00:11:42,640 --> 00:11:45,040 Speaker 2: have a two on one? So then was she the 221 00:11:45,080 --> 00:11:47,640 Speaker 2: only one eliminated at the Rose ceremony so that you couldn't. 222 00:11:47,360 --> 00:11:52,440 Speaker 4: Do it because the twins went home after visiting my parents' house? 223 00:11:52,800 --> 00:11:55,880 Speaker 2: Yeah, exactly, That's what I remembered. Yeah, yeah, so remember 224 00:11:55,960 --> 00:11:57,720 Speaker 2: somebody got eliminated in another way. 225 00:11:58,120 --> 00:11:58,400 Speaker 3: Yeah. 226 00:11:58,440 --> 00:12:00,480 Speaker 4: So it was like a very brutal mon mo from 227 00:12:00,520 --> 00:12:04,000 Speaker 4: me because and my hope was that, you know, Becca 228 00:12:04,000 --> 00:12:06,440 Speaker 4: and I would always stay connected and we have she's 229 00:12:06,520 --> 00:12:08,520 Speaker 4: one of the closest people to me on the show still. 230 00:12:09,000 --> 00:12:11,160 Speaker 4: But at first I think she was really upset, Like 231 00:12:11,200 --> 00:12:15,640 Speaker 4: I think she was really mad that I didn't give 232 00:12:15,679 --> 00:12:19,840 Speaker 4: her the respect that I promised I would give her, 233 00:12:20,120 --> 00:12:21,760 Speaker 4: and I think that was a fair thing. And it 234 00:12:21,800 --> 00:12:24,559 Speaker 4: was one of those moments that you're sitting there and 235 00:12:24,600 --> 00:12:26,560 Speaker 4: you're like, I don't know what I can do, Like, 236 00:12:26,720 --> 00:12:29,040 Speaker 4: there's nothing I can do about this other than you 237 00:12:29,360 --> 00:12:31,400 Speaker 4: have every right to get so mad at me right now. 238 00:12:41,720 --> 00:12:44,800 Speaker 2: We had the most fun week after you eliminated her. 239 00:12:44,880 --> 00:12:47,160 Speaker 2: She was like, I don't, like, I don't feel like 240 00:12:47,200 --> 00:12:50,520 Speaker 2: going home yet. So she came over. She slept over 241 00:12:50,520 --> 00:12:53,920 Speaker 2: at my apartment for three days and we basically took 242 00:12:54,080 --> 00:12:56,440 Speaker 2: We did take out for every meal, and we watched 243 00:12:56,440 --> 00:13:02,839 Speaker 2: Gray's Anatomy all day long. It was so fun. No, 244 00:13:02,920 --> 00:13:05,400 Speaker 2: not at all. No, she didn't give me much details, 245 00:13:05,760 --> 00:13:08,079 Speaker 2: you know, but she's just like bombed. 246 00:13:08,160 --> 00:13:10,600 Speaker 3: But I was hoping you'd be like, yeah, she was 247 00:13:10,920 --> 00:13:12,520 Speaker 3: like just ripping you a new one. 248 00:13:12,880 --> 00:13:18,160 Speaker 2: No, okay, So that means that you were more into 249 00:13:18,200 --> 00:13:23,000 Speaker 2: Becca than you were into say, like Amanda and Kayla. 250 00:13:23,200 --> 00:13:26,319 Speaker 3: I don't know if that is a fair statement. I think. 251 00:13:27,600 --> 00:13:30,760 Speaker 4: At that point, so many of them kind of existed 252 00:13:30,880 --> 00:13:31,880 Speaker 4: within the same. 253 00:13:32,720 --> 00:13:35,240 Speaker 2: Sphere, like they were all like on the same level. 254 00:13:35,280 --> 00:13:36,840 Speaker 2: And then there was Lauren and Jojo. 255 00:13:37,360 --> 00:13:40,040 Speaker 4: Yeah, I'd say that would be the fair statement my 256 00:13:40,280 --> 00:13:47,800 Speaker 4: concern with Amanda m Again, I feel very lucky because 257 00:13:47,800 --> 00:13:49,559 Speaker 4: if you look at the list of people that were 258 00:13:49,559 --> 00:13:51,640 Speaker 4: on that season, you're like, this was the most incredible 259 00:13:51,640 --> 00:13:53,360 Speaker 4: group of all time. And I would stick to that 260 00:13:53,480 --> 00:13:56,200 Speaker 4: and I would scream it from the mountaintops and everybody's 261 00:13:56,240 --> 00:14:01,440 Speaker 4: happy and healthy and doing their thing today. I I 262 00:14:01,520 --> 00:14:07,200 Speaker 4: didn't know about Amanda because it wasn't at that level right, 263 00:14:07,320 --> 00:14:08,840 Speaker 4: Like she wasn't going to be there at the end. 264 00:14:08,840 --> 00:14:10,400 Speaker 3: That was very obvious to me at that point. 265 00:14:11,520 --> 00:14:14,439 Speaker 4: And she had two kids, Yeah, And I had said, 266 00:14:14,640 --> 00:14:19,280 Speaker 4: I don't want to go to her hometown because you're 267 00:14:19,320 --> 00:14:23,280 Speaker 4: bringing kids into this. That feels weird, that feels messy, 268 00:14:24,360 --> 00:14:27,880 Speaker 4: And the show was like, yeah, but kind of what 269 00:14:27,880 --> 00:14:31,400 Speaker 4: they do with me. I think they really wanted Amanda 270 00:14:31,440 --> 00:14:33,120 Speaker 4: to be the lead of this next season. I thought 271 00:14:33,160 --> 00:14:34,960 Speaker 4: that it made sense to me. It would have been 272 00:14:35,040 --> 00:14:36,240 Speaker 4: an amazing lead. 273 00:14:36,760 --> 00:14:38,840 Speaker 2: They saw her as like an Emily Maynard part two. 274 00:14:39,280 --> 00:14:42,520 Speaker 4: Yeah, and I think for me it made sense, and 275 00:14:42,600 --> 00:14:44,480 Speaker 4: I didn't want to take that away from her. Now, 276 00:14:44,520 --> 00:14:46,600 Speaker 4: looking back, I don't think it would have mattered if 277 00:14:46,640 --> 00:14:48,280 Speaker 4: she went home in the top five or the top 278 00:14:48,320 --> 00:14:54,080 Speaker 4: four or whatever that was. But I, in my naive mind, 279 00:14:54,360 --> 00:14:56,400 Speaker 4: and I'm trying to go back to this time, thought 280 00:14:56,680 --> 00:15:00,880 Speaker 4: I'm doing the right thing by giving her the opportunity 281 00:15:01,280 --> 00:15:05,120 Speaker 4: to become the next season's lead, by going to her hometown. 282 00:15:05,640 --> 00:15:08,560 Speaker 2: Well, I still think Amanda would say thank you. I 283 00:15:08,560 --> 00:15:11,160 Speaker 2: think she'd be glad that that happened. And I don't 284 00:15:11,200 --> 00:15:13,080 Speaker 2: think that kids in chart thinking it was anything other 285 00:15:13,160 --> 00:15:13,600 Speaker 2: than cool. 286 00:15:13,920 --> 00:15:17,800 Speaker 4: I don't think they even probably remember it. But I'm 287 00:15:17,840 --> 00:15:19,920 Speaker 4: going back to a place where at the time, it 288 00:15:20,040 --> 00:15:23,600 Speaker 4: is your world, right, So you don't know the outcomes 289 00:15:24,240 --> 00:15:26,720 Speaker 4: or the results from any of these decisions, and so 290 00:15:26,840 --> 00:15:29,600 Speaker 4: for me, you're trying to weigh all those options, and 291 00:15:29,600 --> 00:15:33,120 Speaker 4: you're like, Okay, if I was, since I am the 292 00:15:33,120 --> 00:15:37,080 Speaker 4: one making the decisions here, this does feel like the 293 00:15:37,160 --> 00:15:38,080 Speaker 4: right decision to do. 294 00:15:39,880 --> 00:15:40,040 Speaker 3: So. 295 00:15:41,960 --> 00:15:44,480 Speaker 4: But it wasn't that I was uninterested. I was very 296 00:15:44,520 --> 00:15:45,800 Speaker 4: excited about it. 297 00:15:45,800 --> 00:15:46,600 Speaker 3: It just wasn't. 298 00:15:46,720 --> 00:15:49,720 Speaker 4: I just knew where the outcome was going to be. 299 00:15:50,400 --> 00:15:53,480 Speaker 4: And so we went back to her hometown with her kids. 300 00:15:54,080 --> 00:15:56,880 Speaker 4: I had asked the show to be respectful of that, 301 00:15:57,360 --> 00:16:01,320 Speaker 4: given what I knew was going to be happening. And 302 00:16:03,680 --> 00:16:06,320 Speaker 4: everything went awesome. I had a blast. Her kids are great, 303 00:16:06,520 --> 00:16:10,240 Speaker 4: family's awesome, Amanda's great. And then I think, you know, 304 00:16:10,320 --> 00:16:12,320 Speaker 4: the big moment for me, the moment where I got 305 00:16:12,640 --> 00:16:16,200 Speaker 4: the maddest I ever was on the show was when 306 00:16:16,560 --> 00:16:18,320 Speaker 4: they asked me to tuck the kids in at night. 307 00:16:18,680 --> 00:16:22,920 Speaker 2: Cool. I remember this now in the. 308 00:16:23,240 --> 00:16:26,760 Speaker 3: F Yeah, and I was like, no, I'm not doing it. 309 00:16:26,840 --> 00:16:27,680 Speaker 3: I'm not doing it. 310 00:16:28,400 --> 00:16:30,960 Speaker 4: But then you're sitting so you have to like, this 311 00:16:31,000 --> 00:16:32,720 Speaker 4: will get us a little bit of a scope to 312 00:16:32,880 --> 00:16:34,600 Speaker 4: like the decisions you have to make as the lead. 313 00:16:35,240 --> 00:16:37,040 Speaker 3: You're in the family room with the whole family. 314 00:16:37,120 --> 00:16:40,520 Speaker 4: They go, Hey, the kids are upstairs, are going to bed, Ben, 315 00:16:40,560 --> 00:16:43,120 Speaker 4: you want to go up there? And you're sitting there, like, 316 00:16:43,120 --> 00:16:46,560 Speaker 4: I got two options, say no and then bring up 317 00:16:46,560 --> 00:16:49,720 Speaker 4: a whole array of questions from everybody sitting in the room, 318 00:16:50,200 --> 00:16:53,760 Speaker 4: or say yes and just do it and hope for 319 00:16:53,800 --> 00:16:58,080 Speaker 4: the best. And so I was like, all right, let's 320 00:16:58,120 --> 00:17:00,960 Speaker 4: go because I didn't want I felt like if I 321 00:17:01,000 --> 00:17:04,560 Speaker 4: said no, everybody would be questioning that Amanda would read 322 00:17:04,560 --> 00:17:06,760 Speaker 4: through the lines there this could blow up in my face. 323 00:17:09,040 --> 00:17:11,199 Speaker 4: So I went upstairs and then that's when I went 324 00:17:11,200 --> 00:17:14,439 Speaker 4: out to the van and just blew a gasket. 325 00:17:16,320 --> 00:17:17,240 Speaker 2: What'd you say to them? 326 00:17:18,280 --> 00:17:19,119 Speaker 3: A lot of things I. 327 00:17:20,880 --> 00:17:26,560 Speaker 4: Should have said, honestly, I think mostly you know, you commit, 328 00:17:26,680 --> 00:17:29,080 Speaker 4: like you've asked me to trust you all, and these 329 00:17:29,119 --> 00:17:34,399 Speaker 4: are the moments why I don't. You've put me in 330 00:17:34,440 --> 00:17:38,240 Speaker 4: a situation that can affect others when I've tried so 331 00:17:38,320 --> 00:17:41,320 Speaker 4: hard to not do that. I think I was in 332 00:17:41,359 --> 00:17:43,000 Speaker 4: the right. I think the show thought I was in 333 00:17:43,000 --> 00:17:44,720 Speaker 4: the right. I think every producer there was like, I 334 00:17:44,800 --> 00:17:50,399 Speaker 4: get it, this sucks, but like it's good TV and 335 00:17:50,440 --> 00:17:52,080 Speaker 4: they'll be all right. Those kids will recover. 336 00:17:52,680 --> 00:17:56,840 Speaker 2: So the other time you blew a gasket with the 337 00:17:56,880 --> 00:18:01,359 Speaker 2: show was when you were running for office in Colorado 338 00:18:02,160 --> 00:18:07,719 Speaker 2: Congress the House, and then they told you, after already 339 00:18:07,760 --> 00:18:11,840 Speaker 2: being involved in running, that you had to stop. Can 340 00:18:11,880 --> 00:18:12,760 Speaker 2: you tell us this story? 341 00:18:13,080 --> 00:18:13,320 Speaker 3: Yeah? 342 00:18:13,359 --> 00:18:15,320 Speaker 4: So, I mean there's a long backstory to that. So 343 00:18:15,480 --> 00:18:17,280 Speaker 4: I get off the show, and I had always talked 344 00:18:17,280 --> 00:18:18,960 Speaker 4: and I still to this day, have an interest in 345 00:18:18,960 --> 00:18:22,399 Speaker 4: getting involved in my community in some way. So I 346 00:18:22,600 --> 00:18:24,560 Speaker 4: thought it'd be fun to be on a city council. 347 00:18:24,920 --> 00:18:27,080 Speaker 4: I always thought it would be fun to be in 348 00:18:27,119 --> 00:18:30,920 Speaker 4: some situation where I was in the know. It's something 349 00:18:30,960 --> 00:18:35,920 Speaker 4: I desire and making decisions that feel logical and rational 350 00:18:36,080 --> 00:18:40,399 Speaker 4: on behalf of the community around me. To what scale, 351 00:18:40,600 --> 00:18:43,280 Speaker 4: to what degree, I don't really know, but it was 352 00:18:43,320 --> 00:18:46,720 Speaker 4: always something that intrigued me, and I had brought this 353 00:18:46,800 --> 00:18:48,359 Speaker 4: up when we were filming the show, probably with some 354 00:18:48,400 --> 00:18:51,040 Speaker 4: producers over dinner. So I get off the show and 355 00:18:51,160 --> 00:18:54,120 Speaker 4: right away they have this idea, what if we did 356 00:18:54,200 --> 00:18:57,720 Speaker 4: kind of a docuseries show about you running for office, 357 00:18:58,640 --> 00:19:03,480 Speaker 4: and we helped support the whole thing financially, and we 358 00:19:03,760 --> 00:19:04,760 Speaker 4: filmed the whole. 359 00:19:04,520 --> 00:19:07,000 Speaker 3: Thing, and then maybe one day you're in office. 360 00:19:07,119 --> 00:19:09,720 Speaker 4: And at the time, because I was twenty six with 361 00:19:09,760 --> 00:19:13,600 Speaker 4: no money, I thought, this is an incredible opportunity. If 362 00:19:13,600 --> 00:19:16,399 Speaker 4: I'm going to be able to run for office and 363 00:19:16,480 --> 00:19:20,320 Speaker 4: have somebody support it at the scale that they could, 364 00:19:21,680 --> 00:19:23,800 Speaker 4: then I'm going to say yes. And so I said 365 00:19:23,840 --> 00:19:28,720 Speaker 4: yes and signed a contract for a show. That's an 366 00:19:28,720 --> 00:19:33,359 Speaker 4: important note. Well, I don't know necessarily the behind the 367 00:19:33,359 --> 00:19:35,280 Speaker 4: scenes of what happened, but I went through the whole process, 368 00:19:35,280 --> 00:19:39,560 Speaker 4: got my name on the ballot, advocated for myself around 369 00:19:39,600 --> 00:19:43,160 Speaker 4: my community, had so many five o'clock in the morning breakfasts, 370 00:19:44,000 --> 00:19:47,400 Speaker 4: and then filmed the show of all this stuff, and 371 00:19:47,440 --> 00:19:48,800 Speaker 4: I got my name on the ballot and the night 372 00:19:48,880 --> 00:19:51,639 Speaker 4: of my celebration party for doing that, which is a 373 00:19:51,680 --> 00:19:54,840 Speaker 4: big accomplishment. They call and they say, you need to 374 00:19:54,840 --> 00:19:59,800 Speaker 4: pull out the race because and here's their reasoning, and 375 00:20:00,000 --> 00:20:01,840 Speaker 4: and here's legally what I can say. 376 00:20:01,880 --> 00:20:03,160 Speaker 3: But what is true. 377 00:20:04,480 --> 00:20:08,520 Speaker 4: Is they said they found out recently from some of 378 00:20:08,560 --> 00:20:12,679 Speaker 4: their attorneys that when you run a political campaign on TV, 379 00:20:12,800 --> 00:20:16,880 Speaker 4: you have to show whoever the person's running against, equal amounts, 380 00:20:16,920 --> 00:20:20,920 Speaker 4: which is a true thing. And I don't know if 381 00:20:20,960 --> 00:20:25,240 Speaker 4: this was just them not knowing and figuring out at 382 00:20:25,240 --> 00:20:28,280 Speaker 4: the last moment with wild timing, or if this was 383 00:20:28,320 --> 00:20:33,560 Speaker 4: strategic in whatever way, or if they said, hey, this 384 00:20:33,880 --> 00:20:35,919 Speaker 4: isn't going to be a great look, don't I don't know. 385 00:20:36,359 --> 00:20:40,320 Speaker 4: I have no idea what the situation necessarily behind the 386 00:20:40,359 --> 00:20:41,840 Speaker 4: scenes was. But that's what I was told, and I 387 00:20:41,880 --> 00:20:42,320 Speaker 4: had to. 388 00:20:42,680 --> 00:20:45,880 Speaker 2: And you flipped out. When do you flip out? 389 00:20:46,080 --> 00:20:49,760 Speaker 4: I flipped out when, well, right there, because this is 390 00:20:49,800 --> 00:20:52,560 Speaker 4: my community around me, right these are the like. At 391 00:20:52,560 --> 00:20:57,640 Speaker 4: this point, I was still recently off the show, so 392 00:20:57,920 --> 00:21:01,479 Speaker 4: this had gotten national coverage that I was running. I 393 00:21:01,520 --> 00:21:04,520 Speaker 4: had convinced everybody in the community that this wasn't some 394 00:21:04,680 --> 00:21:09,280 Speaker 4: setup for more attention, and so me backing out makes 395 00:21:09,320 --> 00:21:12,080 Speaker 4: everything that I said and tried to claim within the 396 00:21:12,119 --> 00:21:15,080 Speaker 4: people in my neighborhood go, no, this is exactly what 397 00:21:15,119 --> 00:21:17,199 Speaker 4: it was. It was a seat and it leaves the 398 00:21:17,200 --> 00:21:21,960 Speaker 4: seat wide open. Yeah, And so there was a lot 399 00:21:22,000 --> 00:21:25,920 Speaker 4: of there was a lot of i'd say pain right 400 00:21:26,000 --> 00:21:29,200 Speaker 4: after me as the bachelor. That happened because the people 401 00:21:29,240 --> 00:21:32,520 Speaker 4: around me in my community very much lost trust in me, 402 00:21:32,560 --> 00:21:35,520 Speaker 4: and they should have. They should have. I mean, everything 403 00:21:35,560 --> 00:21:38,920 Speaker 4: I claimed ended up being false. That I was doing 404 00:21:39,000 --> 00:21:41,359 Speaker 4: it for X y reasons and that I wanted to 405 00:21:41,400 --> 00:21:43,199 Speaker 4: be involved, and I thought, I, you know, this was 406 00:21:43,200 --> 00:21:45,679 Speaker 4: a good opportunity to do it, And so I was 407 00:21:45,760 --> 00:21:47,879 Speaker 4: really mad. I was really mad that I was put 408 00:21:47,920 --> 00:21:51,240 Speaker 4: in a position where so many around me would lose trust. 409 00:21:52,119 --> 00:21:55,520 Speaker 4: And then long term I got even madder when they're like, yeah, 410 00:21:55,560 --> 00:21:56,800 Speaker 4: but you still got to do a show. 411 00:21:59,200 --> 00:22:01,000 Speaker 2: Yeah, you're like, oh, I thought my show was going 412 00:22:01,080 --> 00:22:04,159 Speaker 2: to be about this, not about planning a wedding primarily. 413 00:22:04,440 --> 00:22:04,680 Speaker 3: Yeah. 414 00:22:04,800 --> 00:22:07,480 Speaker 2: Yeah, to somebody who probably doesn't really want to marry me. 415 00:22:07,800 --> 00:22:12,240 Speaker 4: Yeah, somebody's not we're not talking. No, we still were. 416 00:22:12,720 --> 00:22:15,240 Speaker 4: That was that was not quite yet. But the show 417 00:22:15,280 --> 00:22:17,000 Speaker 4: I definitely knew was not going to be a healthy 418 00:22:17,880 --> 00:22:21,919 Speaker 4: strategy for the future. And so but I was I 419 00:22:21,920 --> 00:22:25,399 Speaker 4: had signed a contract and you know, said no to 420 00:22:25,440 --> 00:22:31,919 Speaker 4: other opportunities because that show was under contract, and it 421 00:22:32,000 --> 00:22:35,240 Speaker 4: was not necessarily something that I was excited about doing, 422 00:22:35,920 --> 00:22:39,720 Speaker 4: and it was definitely not something that I had planned on. 423 00:22:41,560 --> 00:22:43,439 Speaker 4: Ever wanting to do is to give that kind of 424 00:22:43,880 --> 00:22:47,360 Speaker 4: scope into a life that already felt chaotic. 425 00:22:47,920 --> 00:22:49,439 Speaker 2: Okay, we're going to go back to the show for 426 00:22:49,480 --> 00:22:51,760 Speaker 2: a second, and then we'll go back to Happily ever 427 00:22:51,840 --> 00:22:54,320 Speaker 2: After if you don't mind. So back to the Bachelor, 428 00:22:55,040 --> 00:22:58,720 Speaker 2: where you are now down to your top three and 429 00:22:58,840 --> 00:23:01,639 Speaker 2: you're going to fantasy suitet you have Jojo, Lauren, and Kayla. 430 00:23:02,560 --> 00:23:06,119 Speaker 2: This is a question that the producers have written down 431 00:23:07,119 --> 00:23:11,080 Speaker 2: that I didn't I don't know that it's true. 432 00:23:11,480 --> 00:23:13,520 Speaker 4: You could ask anything, Ashley. You don't have to be 433 00:23:13,560 --> 00:23:14,320 Speaker 4: hesitant here. 434 00:23:14,359 --> 00:23:19,639 Speaker 2: I'm so hesitant. The producers of our show seem to 435 00:23:19,640 --> 00:23:21,560 Speaker 2: think that you didn't sleep with these girls in the 436 00:23:21,600 --> 00:23:23,960 Speaker 2: fantasy suite and I do not believe that is true. 437 00:23:24,280 --> 00:23:25,760 Speaker 3: Why do they think that? You think. 438 00:23:27,160 --> 00:23:30,320 Speaker 2: Because you because you didn't have sex with Chess. I 439 00:23:30,359 --> 00:23:33,679 Speaker 2: guess before you guys got married. I'm pretty sure you 440 00:23:33,680 --> 00:23:35,840 Speaker 2: slept with all these girls in the fantasy suite except 441 00:23:35,840 --> 00:23:39,200 Speaker 2: for Kayla, who I don't think got to a fantasy suite. 442 00:23:39,280 --> 00:23:40,840 Speaker 3: Why do you think all of that? Where are you 443 00:23:40,880 --> 00:23:41,679 Speaker 3: getting that from? 444 00:23:42,320 --> 00:23:44,760 Speaker 2: Where am I getting that from? Because didn't you eliminate 445 00:23:44,760 --> 00:23:48,000 Speaker 2: her before the Fantasy suite part huh of the show? Oh? 446 00:23:48,000 --> 00:23:51,119 Speaker 2: Oh she did go to the fantasy suite? Yeah, okay, 447 00:23:51,119 --> 00:23:52,720 Speaker 2: So I actually think you slept with all of them. 448 00:23:55,000 --> 00:23:58,760 Speaker 4: That is not a true statement, Okay, And that's why 449 00:23:58,800 --> 00:23:59,680 Speaker 4: I'll leave that question. 450 00:24:01,280 --> 00:24:02,879 Speaker 2: So I think there's two out of the three, and 451 00:24:02,920 --> 00:24:04,000 Speaker 2: we'll have to figure out which. 452 00:24:04,359 --> 00:24:05,160 Speaker 3: Why do you think that? 453 00:24:05,600 --> 00:24:10,120 Speaker 2: Oh it could have been? What? I just why you're 454 00:24:10,119 --> 00:24:16,480 Speaker 2: gonna you're flipping the awkwardness onto me? You asked, I 455 00:24:16,520 --> 00:24:18,080 Speaker 2: think you definitely did it with Jojo. 456 00:24:18,640 --> 00:24:20,920 Speaker 3: You have no basis for that, I have no idea. 457 00:24:21,200 --> 00:24:25,199 Speaker 2: I'm going off your guts. Yeah, so you'd rather be 458 00:24:25,280 --> 00:24:27,240 Speaker 2: float around rumors than you just tell us? 459 00:24:27,560 --> 00:24:30,480 Speaker 3: Yeah I would, okay. 460 00:24:30,280 --> 00:24:34,680 Speaker 2: Already, So it really comes down to Jojo and Lauren 461 00:24:34,720 --> 00:24:37,399 Speaker 2: in the end, and I you know, you were, of 462 00:24:37,440 --> 00:24:39,399 Speaker 2: course the famous person who said I love you to 463 00:24:39,400 --> 00:24:42,159 Speaker 2: two people first. As we establish almost every week here 464 00:24:42,200 --> 00:24:44,480 Speaker 2: on the Almost Inness podcast, it's just not a big 465 00:24:44,520 --> 00:24:49,480 Speaker 2: deal anymore. Do you did you really truly not know 466 00:24:49,480 --> 00:24:52,680 Speaker 2: who you're gonna pick that week? No? 467 00:24:52,760 --> 00:24:53,280 Speaker 3: I didn't. 468 00:24:53,560 --> 00:24:56,399 Speaker 4: I really didn't, oh, which is so weird to say, 469 00:24:57,560 --> 00:24:59,840 Speaker 4: and then be so confident in the decision at the 470 00:24:59,920 --> 00:25:01,239 Speaker 4: end end as I was. 471 00:25:01,800 --> 00:25:03,520 Speaker 3: Yeah, I think. 472 00:25:06,160 --> 00:25:08,560 Speaker 4: There was this storyline going on at the time that 473 00:25:08,640 --> 00:25:13,919 Speaker 4: was never shown that was such so vital in my 474 00:25:14,040 --> 00:25:16,800 Speaker 4: decision making. And actually I would love to talk to 475 00:25:16,920 --> 00:25:19,000 Speaker 4: producer and actually know if it was actually happening. 476 00:25:19,640 --> 00:25:22,000 Speaker 2: No, I know it was, Well, can you can you 477 00:25:22,040 --> 00:25:22,439 Speaker 2: tell us? 478 00:25:22,640 --> 00:25:24,440 Speaker 3: Yeah, I'll tell you. I don't think it would be. 479 00:25:24,800 --> 00:25:25,320 Speaker 3: I don't think it. 480 00:25:25,720 --> 00:25:29,359 Speaker 2: It doesn't seem Yeah. 481 00:25:28,480 --> 00:25:31,359 Speaker 4: You know, hometowns every week at the end of it 482 00:25:31,480 --> 00:25:36,880 Speaker 4: are so vital in this process. Hometowns were extremely important 483 00:25:36,920 --> 00:25:41,359 Speaker 4: to me, and I had the experience and I think 484 00:25:41,400 --> 00:25:45,960 Speaker 4: you saw it where you know, JoJo's family was very 485 00:25:46,040 --> 00:25:48,320 Speaker 4: not in favor of this process, which is wild because 486 00:25:48,359 --> 00:25:50,600 Speaker 4: she came to bachelorette and I get it. 487 00:25:50,640 --> 00:25:52,359 Speaker 3: Maybe they just didn't like me. That's fine. 488 00:25:53,000 --> 00:25:56,440 Speaker 2: There's no such thing as nobody liking then, especially if 489 00:25:56,480 --> 00:26:00,440 Speaker 2: you're going to be a potential boyfriend like you are 490 00:26:00,680 --> 00:26:02,960 Speaker 2: every year, Like I don't trust, but every parent wants 491 00:26:03,040 --> 00:26:04,320 Speaker 2: Ben Higgins to come home. 492 00:26:04,920 --> 00:26:06,880 Speaker 3: Her brother's muscles are really big, and I think they're 493 00:26:07,000 --> 00:26:08,399 Speaker 3: questioning me. They're like, do you work out? Because it 494 00:26:08,400 --> 00:26:09,040 Speaker 3: doesn't look like it. 495 00:26:11,400 --> 00:26:15,040 Speaker 4: They they were hard, They were tough, and they should 496 00:26:15,119 --> 00:26:17,439 Speaker 4: be maybe they I think they probably were, you know, 497 00:26:17,640 --> 00:26:20,399 Speaker 4: fueled before I walked in to be tough. But they 498 00:26:20,400 --> 00:26:22,399 Speaker 4: were tough, and it was awkward and it was weird, 499 00:26:22,440 --> 00:26:24,760 Speaker 4: and it was by far the most awkward hometown I had. 500 00:26:25,200 --> 00:26:27,520 Speaker 3: Yeah, and I walked out of it. 501 00:26:27,520 --> 00:26:31,919 Speaker 4: Being like, I can't I can't even consider what this 502 00:26:31,960 --> 00:26:35,560 Speaker 4: would look like. And so that played a huge role 503 00:26:35,600 --> 00:26:37,120 Speaker 4: in my decision making towards the end. 504 00:26:37,200 --> 00:26:37,400 Speaker 3: Right. 505 00:26:38,520 --> 00:26:43,320 Speaker 4: The family's acceptance or at least desire to like give 506 00:26:43,480 --> 00:26:45,040 Speaker 4: this a chance was very important to me. 507 00:26:45,440 --> 00:26:47,800 Speaker 2: So you didn't think it was maybe them putting on 508 00:26:47,840 --> 00:26:52,440 Speaker 2: an act for TV or being too influenced by producers. 509 00:26:54,160 --> 00:26:58,399 Speaker 4: I should have, Yeah, I don't think I did. But 510 00:26:59,800 --> 00:27:02,600 Speaker 4: we get to Jamaica. We're there for two weeks and 511 00:27:02,640 --> 00:27:05,560 Speaker 4: I get this call that says that her brother, oldest 512 00:27:05,600 --> 00:27:07,600 Speaker 4: brother is coming down to Jamaica to talk to me 513 00:27:07,640 --> 00:27:11,639 Speaker 4: because he feels bad about how everything went down. And 514 00:27:11,640 --> 00:27:14,000 Speaker 4: then it like he never Like fully, I think he 515 00:27:14,119 --> 00:27:17,520 Speaker 4: did show up for a second, but it was never. 516 00:27:18,359 --> 00:27:20,320 Speaker 4: It was like we weren't communica. Like it was like 517 00:27:20,359 --> 00:27:24,879 Speaker 4: he wasn't there to apologize or walk me through what 518 00:27:24,880 --> 00:27:26,720 Speaker 4: happened at hometowns. It was like he was there to 519 00:27:26,760 --> 00:27:29,640 Speaker 4: continue on the conversation we had back there. 520 00:27:29,680 --> 00:27:30,920 Speaker 3: So it like really made me. 521 00:27:30,920 --> 00:27:35,280 Speaker 4: Confident and and I don't really know what was happening 522 00:27:35,720 --> 00:27:40,080 Speaker 4: during that, but he was like there, and I thought 523 00:27:40,080 --> 00:27:42,080 Speaker 4: he was there to like clear the water, which would 524 00:27:42,080 --> 00:27:44,080 Speaker 4: have been awesome, but he it was instead it was 525 00:27:44,119 --> 00:27:45,480 Speaker 4: there to like double down, I think. 526 00:27:45,840 --> 00:27:46,720 Speaker 3: And I walked out of that. 527 00:27:46,680 --> 00:27:51,080 Speaker 4: Being very confident in my at least where my thought 528 00:27:51,119 --> 00:27:54,679 Speaker 4: on where the family stood. And that really kind of 529 00:27:54,920 --> 00:27:56,879 Speaker 4: that got towards the last week and it really was 530 00:27:56,960 --> 00:27:59,000 Speaker 4: kind of the deciding factor for me to say, Okay, 531 00:27:59,119 --> 00:28:02,359 Speaker 4: either I walk out of this saying saying with the 532 00:28:02,359 --> 00:28:07,440 Speaker 4: white flag, saying I can't make a decision, or I say, hey, 533 00:28:07,520 --> 00:28:09,480 Speaker 4: I'll go with the you know, with the place that 534 00:28:09,600 --> 00:28:12,720 Speaker 4: feels like it's the right thing, and I think the show. 535 00:28:14,160 --> 00:28:18,480 Speaker 3: I don't know, but I think the show had their ideas. 536 00:28:18,040 --> 00:28:20,360 Speaker 4: Too for how this should play out, and I think 537 00:28:20,359 --> 00:28:22,360 Speaker 4: they were trying really hard to make that play out 538 00:28:22,359 --> 00:28:22,879 Speaker 4: the way they did. 539 00:28:24,040 --> 00:28:25,760 Speaker 2: Are you saying that they really wanted Jojo to be 540 00:28:25,800 --> 00:28:26,600 Speaker 2: the bachelorette? 541 00:28:27,119 --> 00:28:32,320 Speaker 4: I say that that's my opinion obviously, But then I 542 00:28:32,400 --> 00:28:33,520 Speaker 4: know after the show was. 543 00:28:33,520 --> 00:28:35,800 Speaker 3: Done, airing Kayla was like filming. 544 00:28:36,119 --> 00:28:39,120 Speaker 4: Neal to be the best threat, and so I don't 545 00:28:39,120 --> 00:28:42,400 Speaker 4: know if they were that convinced. Honestly, I look at 546 00:28:42,480 --> 00:28:44,320 Speaker 4: that last two weeks and there's still a out of 547 00:28:44,320 --> 00:28:46,520 Speaker 4: confusion on how it all played out the way it did. 548 00:28:47,520 --> 00:28:50,400 Speaker 4: I've never questioned the decision I made, though, So that's 549 00:28:50,400 --> 00:28:52,000 Speaker 4: one thing. I think we were talking about that with 550 00:28:52,000 --> 00:28:53,800 Speaker 4: one of the bachelors that we were interviewing leading up 551 00:28:53,840 --> 00:28:57,840 Speaker 4: to this. When the decision was made, that I never 552 00:28:57,880 --> 00:28:59,840 Speaker 4: will look back and be and had the what if 553 00:29:00,760 --> 00:29:03,280 Speaker 4: it was it was how it was supposed. 554 00:29:02,960 --> 00:29:03,360 Speaker 3: To play out. 555 00:29:03,360 --> 00:29:05,760 Speaker 4: Obviously, look at my life now, I was always very 556 00:29:05,840 --> 00:29:11,360 Speaker 4: confident in whatever path was moving forward. But I am 557 00:29:11,440 --> 00:29:14,040 Speaker 4: confused about that kind of last week on how that 558 00:29:14,080 --> 00:29:15,040 Speaker 4: all went down the way. 559 00:29:14,920 --> 00:29:18,960 Speaker 2: It did, But Lauren was pretty convinced that you were 560 00:29:19,120 --> 00:29:21,160 Speaker 2: having what ifs Am I wrong? 561 00:29:21,920 --> 00:29:23,600 Speaker 3: Oh? I mean I think that's just natural. 562 00:29:24,040 --> 00:29:27,160 Speaker 4: Yes, I mean I think is always the comparison, and 563 00:29:27,200 --> 00:29:30,920 Speaker 4: then every interview you do post show, you know, the 564 00:29:31,000 --> 00:29:33,680 Speaker 4: questions are brought up comparing the two, and so I 565 00:29:33,680 --> 00:29:39,840 Speaker 4: think having those what if ideas are natural in that moment, 566 00:29:40,920 --> 00:29:44,000 Speaker 4: especially coming off of it and watching it and seeing 567 00:29:44,000 --> 00:29:45,840 Speaker 4: how conflicted I really was. 568 00:29:49,160 --> 00:29:49,960 Speaker 3: Yeah, there's a lot of. 569 00:29:49,880 --> 00:29:54,160 Speaker 4: Interesting like takes from that because at the time I 570 00:29:54,200 --> 00:29:57,000 Speaker 4: felt like this is the biggest hardest decision I'd ever made. 571 00:29:57,760 --> 00:30:01,800 Speaker 4: It should have never I don't think it should ever 572 00:30:01,880 --> 00:30:06,000 Speaker 4: be that hard, like when you know you know right, 573 00:30:06,600 --> 00:30:06,960 Speaker 4: so you. 574 00:30:06,920 --> 00:30:08,800 Speaker 2: Should have known in that moment that neither of them 575 00:30:08,920 --> 00:30:10,080 Speaker 2: was going to be your girl. 576 00:30:10,200 --> 00:30:12,040 Speaker 4: I think that's the only what if I've ever had, 577 00:30:12,160 --> 00:30:14,800 Speaker 4: is like why did I go through with any of it? 578 00:30:16,880 --> 00:30:19,360 Speaker 4: And not because it wasn't great and real and fun 579 00:30:19,480 --> 00:30:21,960 Speaker 4: and like excited, but it was like it wasn't right, 580 00:30:22,320 --> 00:30:24,960 Speaker 4: It wasn't the right thing. And so that's the only 581 00:30:25,040 --> 00:30:28,120 Speaker 4: question I now have today is was I confused? 582 00:30:29,400 --> 00:30:29,680 Speaker 3: Maybe? 583 00:30:29,720 --> 00:30:31,040 Speaker 4: But then you look at it and you're like, no, 584 00:30:31,120 --> 00:30:34,400 Speaker 4: it makes it for me. It does make sense on 585 00:30:34,560 --> 00:30:38,720 Speaker 4: how I got to that point, And that's why I 586 00:30:38,760 --> 00:30:44,440 Speaker 4: would never give any lead any critical opinion when they 587 00:30:44,720 --> 00:30:46,880 Speaker 4: are at the end, like tossed in emotion. 588 00:30:57,840 --> 00:31:00,240 Speaker 2: So, Ben, when did you know it wasn't gonna work 589 00:31:00,240 --> 00:31:03,720 Speaker 2: out with Lauren the first mode? Okay, maybe not when 590 00:31:03,760 --> 00:31:06,840 Speaker 2: you first, when you definitely knew, But when did you 591 00:31:06,920 --> 00:31:10,480 Speaker 2: start being like oh no, oh no, oh no, I mean, 592 00:31:10,760 --> 00:31:13,960 Speaker 2: was it as early as your first happy couple? 593 00:31:14,680 --> 00:31:14,880 Speaker 3: Oh? 594 00:31:14,920 --> 00:31:18,520 Speaker 4: Goodness, no, okay, I mean I think I think then 595 00:31:18,920 --> 00:31:21,240 Speaker 4: it's you kind of toss it up to This is 596 00:31:21,280 --> 00:31:25,440 Speaker 4: a strange environment. I don't want to say which you know, lead, 597 00:31:25,680 --> 00:31:29,240 Speaker 4: I've talked to about this recently, but happy couples, even 598 00:31:29,240 --> 00:31:33,080 Speaker 4: for the happiest of couples, are really hard because the 599 00:31:33,120 --> 00:31:38,800 Speaker 4: show's airing, you're doing interviews, the lead is typically getting 600 00:31:39,440 --> 00:31:43,440 Speaker 4: risked away to go on TV somewhere, while the other 601 00:31:43,440 --> 00:31:49,120 Speaker 4: person just kind of sits there and wait, I think 602 00:31:49,160 --> 00:31:53,080 Speaker 4: you toss up those that season of life too. It is, 603 00:31:53,400 --> 00:32:00,800 Speaker 4: it's not natural. It's difficult, and unless the the two 604 00:32:00,880 --> 00:32:05,920 Speaker 4: of you have a clear understanding, I think most people 605 00:32:06,000 --> 00:32:10,320 Speaker 4: within that season, even for the Golden Show, are probably 606 00:32:11,800 --> 00:32:14,840 Speaker 4: having a hard time because there's a lot of conversations 607 00:32:14,840 --> 00:32:17,600 Speaker 4: you shouldn't be having with somebody you know that you're 608 00:32:17,760 --> 00:32:21,240 Speaker 4: you're with, like yeah, sorry about that. You had to 609 00:32:21,240 --> 00:32:23,520 Speaker 4: watch it last night and then get reminded of it 610 00:32:23,560 --> 00:32:26,440 Speaker 4: in two days. 611 00:32:27,080 --> 00:32:28,600 Speaker 3: Yeah it No, it wasn't then. 612 00:32:28,640 --> 00:32:33,200 Speaker 4: I'd say, the first time I really thought started thinking 613 00:32:33,280 --> 00:32:37,520 Speaker 4: that and on that path was during Happily ever After. 614 00:32:38,120 --> 00:32:41,960 Speaker 4: Was it felt like at some point, and I think 615 00:32:42,000 --> 00:32:46,960 Speaker 4: it kind of happened slowly, was like we were work colleagues, 616 00:32:48,080 --> 00:32:51,480 Speaker 4: Like we were just filming a show and you know, 617 00:32:51,760 --> 00:32:55,480 Speaker 4: doing it and then going back and I think at 618 00:32:55,480 --> 00:32:57,920 Speaker 4: that point it felt like, this isn't a team atmosphere. 619 00:32:57,960 --> 00:33:00,280 Speaker 4: This isn't a like this should be more fun, It 620 00:33:00,280 --> 00:33:06,120 Speaker 4: should be a lot easier. We shouldn't be knocking heads 621 00:33:06,120 --> 00:33:12,080 Speaker 4: so much during this process. We should both be happier, right, 622 00:33:12,360 --> 00:33:14,840 Speaker 4: Like you should both be in a happier place. This 623 00:33:14,920 --> 00:33:19,200 Speaker 4: should be a great opportunity, you know. And I was 624 00:33:19,400 --> 00:33:22,240 Speaker 4: at the time not wanting to do that show, but 625 00:33:22,320 --> 00:33:24,960 Speaker 4: also thankful for the opportunity to be filming a show 626 00:33:25,000 --> 00:33:30,320 Speaker 4: and making an income, and that people were at least 627 00:33:30,360 --> 00:33:34,280 Speaker 4: a little bit interested in life, in our life and 628 00:33:34,360 --> 00:33:36,520 Speaker 4: it's I think it was a slow fade to a 629 00:33:36,560 --> 00:33:40,720 Speaker 4: place where we were just colleagues, like there was no 630 00:33:41,360 --> 00:33:42,400 Speaker 4: there was no partnership. 631 00:33:43,000 --> 00:33:47,040 Speaker 2: I'm gonna end with something kind of serious, So sorry, 632 00:33:48,160 --> 00:33:50,280 Speaker 2: because we talk about fun, fluffy stuff all the time, 633 00:33:50,320 --> 00:33:52,600 Speaker 2: and we will talk about you know, your life with 634 00:33:52,760 --> 00:33:55,200 Speaker 2: just and your baby legit within the next couple of 635 00:33:55,240 --> 00:33:58,560 Speaker 2: weeks here, So we'll save baby talk for that podcast 636 00:33:58,680 --> 00:34:03,280 Speaker 2: when it comes more download. Yes, we had a conversation, Yes, exactly. 637 00:34:03,440 --> 00:34:08,320 Speaker 2: We had a conversation with Crystals this week about drinking. 638 00:34:08,640 --> 00:34:12,000 Speaker 2: And you have been open, especially in your book, about 639 00:34:12,640 --> 00:34:17,040 Speaker 2: your addictions to painkillers. How was going through the Bachelor 640 00:34:18,160 --> 00:34:23,760 Speaker 2: having been a former addict just like such an emotional process? 641 00:34:24,280 --> 00:34:28,400 Speaker 4: Yeah, yeah, I mean I think maybe the benefit I 642 00:34:28,440 --> 00:34:33,879 Speaker 4: had was because I was no longer addicted at that time. 643 00:34:33,920 --> 00:34:39,399 Speaker 4: I had done some work on re assimilating myself with 644 00:34:39,560 --> 00:34:44,160 Speaker 4: really hard emotions. Because for me, I think a lot 645 00:34:44,239 --> 00:34:47,239 Speaker 4: of my addiction came from a numbing process of not 646 00:34:47,280 --> 00:34:53,279 Speaker 4: wanting to confront certain behaviors, life choices, the place I 647 00:34:53,320 --> 00:34:56,440 Speaker 4: was at in life and security, all those things, and 648 00:34:56,520 --> 00:35:03,359 Speaker 4: so I was numbing those that pain through addiction, and 649 00:35:03,400 --> 00:35:05,239 Speaker 4: so I had you know, I'd been clean for a 650 00:35:05,280 --> 00:35:09,440 Speaker 4: few years going into that show, and I feel like 651 00:35:09,520 --> 00:35:12,919 Speaker 4: I was at least somewhat prep because I was very 652 00:35:12,960 --> 00:35:18,399 Speaker 4: comfortable confronting really hard things that I was dealing with. 653 00:35:20,000 --> 00:35:24,560 Speaker 4: I also had a very strict drink limit for myself 654 00:35:24,680 --> 00:35:27,320 Speaker 4: on the show when I was the lead, I didn't 655 00:35:27,560 --> 00:35:29,880 Speaker 4: There was only one moment that I let loose, and 656 00:35:29,920 --> 00:35:32,359 Speaker 4: that was in the Bahamas on like a boat. And 657 00:35:32,480 --> 00:35:34,840 Speaker 4: if you get me on any boat, like on what 658 00:35:35,040 --> 00:35:39,279 Speaker 4: and loose like I just love the water. You know, 659 00:35:39,320 --> 00:35:40,799 Speaker 4: I look back, I wish I would have let loose 660 00:35:40,800 --> 00:35:42,239 Speaker 4: a little more. I had a little more fun with it. 661 00:35:42,520 --> 00:35:44,880 Speaker 4: You know, you can look back and think that. But 662 00:35:45,120 --> 00:35:47,400 Speaker 4: I had a very strict limit for myself because I 663 00:35:47,440 --> 00:35:50,680 Speaker 4: didn't want to go through this process having that like 664 00:35:50,840 --> 00:35:53,280 Speaker 4: social anxiety the next morning when you're like why did. 665 00:35:53,120 --> 00:35:55,319 Speaker 3: I say what I said? Why did I do what 666 00:35:55,360 --> 00:35:56,200 Speaker 3: I do? Did? 667 00:35:58,000 --> 00:36:03,720 Speaker 4: I was very nervous about how to communicate with every 668 00:36:03,760 --> 00:36:07,879 Speaker 4: woman because it might be the last thing you really 669 00:36:07,880 --> 00:36:11,239 Speaker 4: get to say to them before they're gone. And I 670 00:36:11,400 --> 00:36:15,960 Speaker 4: just really was. I remember going into the show with this. 671 00:36:16,320 --> 00:36:20,600 Speaker 4: Everybody has their own very well intentioned thoughts going into 672 00:36:20,600 --> 00:36:24,280 Speaker 4: the show. Some must some might be these women are lucky. 673 00:36:25,200 --> 00:36:26,879 Speaker 3: Mine maybe was. 674 00:36:28,280 --> 00:36:32,160 Speaker 4: Our mine was how crazy is it that thirty people 675 00:36:32,160 --> 00:36:34,360 Speaker 4: are giving up this much of their life to be 676 00:36:34,600 --> 00:36:37,160 Speaker 4: here for as long as they're going to be here. 677 00:36:37,680 --> 00:36:39,839 Speaker 4: And I think on my speech on the first night 678 00:36:40,239 --> 00:36:42,279 Speaker 4: that I wrote, I just and I meant it, and 679 00:36:42,320 --> 00:36:44,000 Speaker 4: I still mean it to this day, and I still 680 00:36:44,000 --> 00:36:47,319 Speaker 4: hope it's the case to this day, because I am 681 00:36:47,360 --> 00:36:50,319 Speaker 4: still is. I was just hopeful that every person would 682 00:36:50,360 --> 00:36:52,719 Speaker 4: leave being I'm glad, I say, thinking I'm glad I 683 00:36:52,800 --> 00:36:53,120 Speaker 4: did it. 684 00:36:54,640 --> 00:36:55,799 Speaker 3: I didn't know what that would look like. 685 00:36:56,000 --> 00:36:57,640 Speaker 2: I think everybody feels that way. 686 00:36:57,760 --> 00:36:58,319 Speaker 3: I hope, so. 687 00:36:58,560 --> 00:37:00,640 Speaker 4: I think some people probably have some at men and anger, 688 00:37:00,680 --> 00:37:03,120 Speaker 4: and especially with the breakup. I think you know, there 689 00:37:03,120 --> 00:37:08,680 Speaker 4: were sides chosen based on friendship and kind of loyalty, 690 00:37:08,680 --> 00:37:12,400 Speaker 4: and that's fine. But I was just hoping that every 691 00:37:12,600 --> 00:37:14,239 Speaker 4: person left and was like, I'm glad he did it 692 00:37:14,280 --> 00:37:15,480 Speaker 4: for whatever reason that may be. 693 00:37:15,680 --> 00:37:17,719 Speaker 3: Now night ones are a little harder to. 694 00:37:17,840 --> 00:37:19,839 Speaker 4: Exients that they're glad, they get it, But if you're 695 00:37:19,880 --> 00:37:21,600 Speaker 4: there for a few weeks, I was hoping you'd at 696 00:37:21,680 --> 00:37:23,640 Speaker 4: least look back and was like that was that was 697 00:37:23,640 --> 00:37:26,960 Speaker 4: a cool experience, and it was a great opportunity. 698 00:37:30,440 --> 00:37:30,680 Speaker 3: Yeah. 699 00:37:31,560 --> 00:37:35,799 Speaker 4: So, oh so back to your question, and so it 700 00:37:35,840 --> 00:37:39,839 Speaker 4: wasn't that hard for me. I really don't remember many 701 00:37:39,880 --> 00:37:41,520 Speaker 4: moments where I was like I need to numb anything. 702 00:37:41,600 --> 00:37:43,319 Speaker 4: If anything, I kind of went with the strategy of 703 00:37:43,400 --> 00:37:46,000 Speaker 4: I need to lean in to whatever it is I'm experiencing. 704 00:37:47,719 --> 00:37:52,080 Speaker 2: All right, I totally that's a that's a great response. 705 00:37:52,960 --> 00:37:55,799 Speaker 2: My final question for you is how it felt to 706 00:37:55,880 --> 00:37:58,799 Speaker 2: be called the perfect Ben. I know that that was 707 00:37:59,040 --> 00:38:02,400 Speaker 2: heavy on you. Yeah, and like, looking back, do you 708 00:38:02,480 --> 00:38:05,680 Speaker 2: still feel like cringe about that label? 709 00:38:06,480 --> 00:38:08,680 Speaker 3: Yeah? Yeah, it doesn't fit and. 710 00:38:08,640 --> 00:38:11,640 Speaker 2: It does fit though, like do you get in do 711 00:38:11,680 --> 00:38:14,120 Speaker 2: you do you still feel weird the fact that you 712 00:38:14,280 --> 00:38:18,840 Speaker 2: are definitely look back upon as one of the favorite bachelors, 713 00:38:18,880 --> 00:38:20,160 Speaker 2: as one of the ones that did it right? 714 00:38:21,560 --> 00:38:23,920 Speaker 4: No, I actually like when you say that, like that 715 00:38:23,960 --> 00:38:25,480 Speaker 4: feels very nice to hear. 716 00:38:26,440 --> 00:38:28,919 Speaker 3: I hope, I guess. 717 00:38:28,920 --> 00:38:31,360 Speaker 4: I hope in my life when I make big decisions 718 00:38:31,960 --> 00:38:34,480 Speaker 4: that people see it and say, hey, you did the 719 00:38:34,480 --> 00:38:39,399 Speaker 4: best you could and that you know you you did 720 00:38:39,400 --> 00:38:43,000 Speaker 4: it in a way that maybe was relatable, that showed 721 00:38:43,000 --> 00:38:46,040 Speaker 4: your faith even though it wasn't talked about a lot 722 00:38:46,160 --> 00:38:48,440 Speaker 4: or shown a lot, But that like we could we 723 00:38:48,480 --> 00:38:51,040 Speaker 4: could tell that you had some type of faith and 724 00:38:51,160 --> 00:38:56,680 Speaker 4: respect that maybe was different than others. You had a 725 00:38:56,719 --> 00:39:00,520 Speaker 4: really relatability because you were open, and other people watched 726 00:39:00,520 --> 00:39:04,840 Speaker 4: it and felt less alone. You were human, So you 727 00:39:04,920 --> 00:39:08,040 Speaker 4: struggled a lot through it, and it was messy and 728 00:39:08,080 --> 00:39:11,879 Speaker 4: it wasn't perfect. I guess when I hear that, that's 729 00:39:11,920 --> 00:39:13,759 Speaker 4: what my mind goes to. And I'm proud of that, 730 00:39:13,960 --> 00:39:16,359 Speaker 4: and I'm thankful that in one of the moments when 731 00:39:16,360 --> 00:39:23,759 Speaker 4: I was young, naive, unprepared, that I have a lot 732 00:39:23,800 --> 00:39:25,840 Speaker 4: of pride in myself that in that, in one of 733 00:39:25,840 --> 00:39:29,960 Speaker 4: the what should have been the most confusing, hardest things 734 00:39:30,000 --> 00:39:34,040 Speaker 4: I've ever done, I stepped up and I did it 735 00:39:34,040 --> 00:39:35,839 Speaker 4: in a way that I'm proud of and that other 736 00:39:35,880 --> 00:39:41,120 Speaker 4: people can be proud of. Yeah, so no, I take 737 00:39:41,160 --> 00:39:41,720 Speaker 4: that as a coment. 738 00:39:41,760 --> 00:39:43,640 Speaker 3: The perfect beIN thing was. It was weird. 739 00:39:44,800 --> 00:39:46,520 Speaker 4: There's a long story to it, but we've talked about 740 00:39:46,520 --> 00:39:48,719 Speaker 4: it many times. You know, I had this parasite. I 741 00:39:48,800 --> 00:39:52,520 Speaker 4: was sick the whole show and like couldn't get off 742 00:39:52,520 --> 00:39:55,840 Speaker 4: the toilet, and I felt terrible because at some point 743 00:39:56,120 --> 00:39:58,640 Speaker 4: the women in the house picked up on it. 744 00:39:59,360 --> 00:40:01,920 Speaker 3: They kind of had because I was just like so sick. 745 00:40:02,000 --> 00:40:03,640 Speaker 2: Yeah, wouldn't you rather just tell them? 746 00:40:04,480 --> 00:40:07,759 Speaker 4: Yeah? Yeah, And there's a comfort, and there's a there's 747 00:40:07,800 --> 00:40:11,120 Speaker 4: a weirdness when you're like, hey, yeah, you're committing time 748 00:40:11,160 --> 00:40:11,640 Speaker 4: to date me. 749 00:40:12,200 --> 00:40:13,680 Speaker 3: I already feel weird about that part. 750 00:40:13,880 --> 00:40:20,319 Speaker 4: And also like I've got diarrhea, so like, yeah, this 751 00:40:20,560 --> 00:40:23,680 Speaker 4: is cool, Like I'm feeling really good about myself right now. 752 00:40:24,800 --> 00:40:26,640 Speaker 4: And so I was super sick and we're in the 753 00:40:26,680 --> 00:40:29,000 Speaker 4: Bahamas and you know this has been brought up, but 754 00:40:29,160 --> 00:40:32,080 Speaker 4: it just kind of makes everything go full circle. And 755 00:40:32,120 --> 00:40:35,400 Speaker 4: then all the women get sick because of uh, some 756 00:40:35,400 --> 00:40:38,520 Speaker 4: women in the ocean where there's like the pigs pigs, 757 00:40:38,719 --> 00:40:41,399 Speaker 4: and all those women on that date got super sick 758 00:40:41,440 --> 00:40:44,279 Speaker 4: and so they're you know, on the toilet all the time. 759 00:40:44,640 --> 00:40:46,560 Speaker 4: So then we have this really fun, funny moment in 760 00:40:46,560 --> 00:40:50,799 Speaker 4: the Bahamas that everybody can relate with because everybody in 761 00:40:50,800 --> 00:40:53,840 Speaker 4: that room is sick. I'm literally laying on the bed 762 00:40:54,280 --> 00:40:58,080 Speaker 4: in this like resort that we're in, in my underwear 763 00:40:58,200 --> 00:41:00,200 Speaker 4: with a fan blowing on me, with Chris Harry and 764 00:41:00,239 --> 00:41:02,200 Speaker 4: watching a football game next to me in a chair 765 00:41:02,280 --> 00:41:04,600 Speaker 4: being like, dude, are you good? Like what do we 766 00:41:04,640 --> 00:41:06,600 Speaker 4: gotta do here, and I'm like, we got to cancel everything. 767 00:41:07,640 --> 00:41:09,920 Speaker 4: He's like, we can't cancel everything. I'm like, all right, 768 00:41:09,960 --> 00:41:11,640 Speaker 4: He's like, we can do a Row ceremony right now. 769 00:41:11,719 --> 00:41:13,200 Speaker 4: Just say you know what you want to do, walk 770 00:41:13,239 --> 00:41:15,879 Speaker 4: out there. It takes you ten minutes. We're gonna run 771 00:41:15,880 --> 00:41:17,239 Speaker 4: through it. We'll get over it. 772 00:41:17,280 --> 00:41:19,520 Speaker 2: And I was like three minutes, my ass, Yeah. 773 00:41:19,320 --> 00:41:19,839 Speaker 3: I never did. 774 00:41:20,160 --> 00:41:21,799 Speaker 4: And so we come to that, and then we end 775 00:41:21,920 --> 00:41:24,399 Speaker 4: up going, you know, to Jamaica, and so I'm coming 776 00:41:24,440 --> 00:41:27,640 Speaker 4: off of this experience where I'm feeling pretty down. Everybody's 777 00:41:27,680 --> 00:41:33,320 Speaker 4: kind of feeling like, not great about themselves. And the producers, 778 00:41:33,480 --> 00:41:35,680 Speaker 4: the three head producers the show had moved into my 779 00:41:35,719 --> 00:41:37,040 Speaker 4: house in Jamaica with me. 780 00:41:37,560 --> 00:41:39,600 Speaker 2: That sounds like a blast, knowing who those were at 781 00:41:39,600 --> 00:41:39,879 Speaker 2: the time. 782 00:41:39,960 --> 00:41:41,720 Speaker 4: Yeah, we had a lot of fun. We had great dinners, 783 00:41:41,760 --> 00:41:44,040 Speaker 4: we had great nights together. It was actually really like 784 00:41:44,120 --> 00:41:47,520 Speaker 4: special some of my favorite nights. And one night they go, 785 00:41:47,600 --> 00:41:49,319 Speaker 4: we got a surprise for you, and we walk up 786 00:41:49,360 --> 00:41:52,080 Speaker 4: in the living room in this house and we sit 787 00:41:52,120 --> 00:41:55,640 Speaker 4: down and they air the promo to the season because 788 00:41:55,640 --> 00:41:58,359 Speaker 4: it had just started coming out, and I watch it 789 00:41:58,480 --> 00:42:01,080 Speaker 4: and I'm like, it's so excited, and then at the 790 00:42:01,120 --> 00:42:04,759 Speaker 4: end they go the perfect Ben and I remember in 791 00:42:04,760 --> 00:42:08,000 Speaker 4: that moment just being like, I wasn't mad, I ain't yell. 792 00:42:08,120 --> 00:42:09,359 Speaker 4: I mean, I don't even know if I said anything 793 00:42:09,360 --> 00:42:11,920 Speaker 4: to them. I just remember sitting there and I made 794 00:42:11,920 --> 00:42:13,680 Speaker 4: a joke that said, well, you just set me up 795 00:42:13,680 --> 00:42:18,680 Speaker 4: for failure. And that was because that was the last 796 00:42:18,680 --> 00:42:20,640 Speaker 4: thing with all those things I had just said on 797 00:42:20,680 --> 00:42:23,400 Speaker 4: my intention and what I'm proud of about the show, 798 00:42:23,640 --> 00:42:25,800 Speaker 4: and I'm proud of what I did during the show, 799 00:42:26,800 --> 00:42:29,440 Speaker 4: you know, and it was messy. I'm sure it wasn't perfect, 800 00:42:29,840 --> 00:42:33,120 Speaker 4: and that was the point is it wasn't perfect. And 801 00:42:34,760 --> 00:42:37,560 Speaker 4: I think at that moment I realized that I either 802 00:42:37,680 --> 00:42:39,279 Speaker 4: was going had to be perfect or I was going 803 00:42:39,360 --> 00:42:41,319 Speaker 4: to have to live by a perfect standard, which is 804 00:42:41,320 --> 00:42:45,200 Speaker 4: not me. And that was frustrating to me. I would 805 00:42:45,320 --> 00:42:49,560 Speaker 4: much rather than say something and anything else. I guess 806 00:42:50,040 --> 00:42:52,319 Speaker 4: it was a it was a fine tagline. I get 807 00:42:52,320 --> 00:42:54,759 Speaker 4: why they did it. It just I felt like it 808 00:42:54,800 --> 00:42:56,560 Speaker 4: set me up for failure. It set me up to 809 00:42:56,600 --> 00:42:57,040 Speaker 4: be hated. 810 00:42:57,760 --> 00:43:00,160 Speaker 2: It was right, you were never hated. It was as 811 00:43:00,239 --> 00:43:04,080 Speaker 2: cute and clever and guess what, nobody remembers it, but 812 00:43:04,200 --> 00:43:06,279 Speaker 2: you and I because this is what we do for 813 00:43:06,320 --> 00:43:09,480 Speaker 2: a living and it was about you. All right. Well, 814 00:43:09,520 --> 00:43:12,160 Speaker 2: thank you so much. Ben. This was not the hardest 815 00:43:12,200 --> 00:43:15,080 Speaker 2: interview I've ever done, but also not the easiest somewhere 816 00:43:15,120 --> 00:43:18,520 Speaker 2: in the middle. So thank you for being you and 817 00:43:19,040 --> 00:43:21,000 Speaker 2: thanks for taking this trip down memory lane. 818 00:43:21,320 --> 00:43:24,920 Speaker 4: Yeah, it's this is the countdown. We're interviewing bachelor's today. 819 00:43:25,040 --> 00:43:27,320 Speaker 4: I just happened to be the one leading up to 820 00:43:27,400 --> 00:43:30,960 Speaker 4: Grant season of The Bachelor, which airs January twenty seventh. 821 00:43:31,000 --> 00:43:33,680 Speaker 4: We're gonna have a lot more and many cool interviews 822 00:43:34,120 --> 00:43:37,759 Speaker 4: with past bachelors as we continue. Thank you for giving 823 00:43:37,800 --> 00:43:39,799 Speaker 4: me the opportunity to talk about this. It's been a 824 00:43:39,840 --> 00:43:42,279 Speaker 4: long time and as much as we get to talk 825 00:43:42,320 --> 00:43:45,359 Speaker 4: to everybody else, I don't reminisce on that season of 826 00:43:45,400 --> 00:43:46,240 Speaker 4: life very often. 827 00:43:46,360 --> 00:43:47,200 Speaker 3: And this was fun. 828 00:43:47,360 --> 00:43:51,520 Speaker 2: Wait, Ben, I forgot to ask the question that I've 829 00:43:51,520 --> 00:43:53,360 Speaker 2: been dying to ask you. I wanted to wait to 830 00:43:53,400 --> 00:43:53,680 Speaker 2: the end. 831 00:43:54,120 --> 00:43:54,480 Speaker 3: Okay. 832 00:43:54,719 --> 00:43:57,000 Speaker 2: We asked Chrys Sols this week if you had to 833 00:43:57,040 --> 00:44:00,719 Speaker 2: reorder your season, would you and could you? And Ben? 834 00:44:00,760 --> 00:44:03,279 Speaker 2: Can you just know you're going to try to work 835 00:44:03,320 --> 00:44:06,200 Speaker 2: your way around this. Just give us two people that 836 00:44:06,239 --> 00:44:07,320 Speaker 2: you would have moved around. 837 00:44:08,200 --> 00:44:10,120 Speaker 4: It's a good that's a good question, and I will 838 00:44:10,120 --> 00:44:16,720 Speaker 4: do that for you. I I kind of already mentioned, 839 00:44:16,920 --> 00:44:20,239 Speaker 4: you know, the Becca Tilly Amanda stan Thing. Yeah, so 840 00:44:20,280 --> 00:44:24,640 Speaker 4: that would have been one change I would have made. 841 00:44:25,000 --> 00:44:28,200 Speaker 4: But I still am confident in my decision not to 842 00:44:28,200 --> 00:44:32,040 Speaker 4: go to Beca's hometown. So I would have replaced both 843 00:44:32,040 --> 00:44:32,920 Speaker 4: of them with somebody. 844 00:44:33,320 --> 00:44:34,560 Speaker 2: Oh really, who would it be? 845 00:44:35,200 --> 00:44:40,399 Speaker 4: I think jin Okay, Yeah, I think, uh that kind 846 00:44:40,400 --> 00:44:43,120 Speaker 4: of got a weird, had a weird ending. 847 00:44:45,239 --> 00:44:47,399 Speaker 3: Towards the end, and. 848 00:44:47,360 --> 00:44:53,360 Speaker 4: I and I actually wish I kind of I mean 849 00:44:53,480 --> 00:44:56,160 Speaker 4: this Lauren Himel, who like came and went from the show, Like, 850 00:44:56,160 --> 00:44:57,799 Speaker 4: I don't even know if anybody you. 851 00:44:59,280 --> 00:44:59,959 Speaker 2: Had for Lauren. 852 00:45:00,560 --> 00:45:01,880 Speaker 3: Yeah, I had a lot of Lawrence. 853 00:45:03,239 --> 00:45:05,000 Speaker 4: I think she got there on the deal because we 854 00:45:05,000 --> 00:45:07,000 Speaker 4: didn't get a lot of time, and then she kind 855 00:45:07,040 --> 00:45:09,600 Speaker 4: of went home. And that's kind of how the process works, 856 00:45:09,640 --> 00:45:12,879 Speaker 4: I think, is you have these people you look back 857 00:45:12,920 --> 00:45:15,560 Speaker 4: on you like they were really fun, interesting people and 858 00:45:15,600 --> 00:45:17,759 Speaker 4: you just didn't get any time because of how the 859 00:45:17,760 --> 00:45:21,480 Speaker 4: structure of the show worked. But I would say that's 860 00:45:21,520 --> 00:45:23,320 Speaker 4: what I would have done. That would have been my replacement. 861 00:45:23,360 --> 00:45:27,480 Speaker 4: The top three would have stayed the same. But I 862 00:45:27,480 --> 00:45:30,719 Speaker 4: think I would have not gone to Becka's hometown because 863 00:45:30,719 --> 00:45:32,080 Speaker 4: I want to want to put her family through it. 864 00:45:32,080 --> 00:45:34,960 Speaker 4: I would have gone to Amando's because that ended up 865 00:45:34,960 --> 00:45:37,480 Speaker 4: getting me angry and I don't like being mad, and 866 00:45:37,520 --> 00:45:40,640 Speaker 4: I would have probably, you know, kept gin a little 867 00:45:40,680 --> 00:45:42,240 Speaker 4: longer into that spot. 868 00:45:43,040 --> 00:45:43,880 Speaker 2: What about Olivia. 869 00:45:45,520 --> 00:45:48,000 Speaker 4: Olivia is fantastic and I'm glad you gave me the 870 00:45:48,040 --> 00:45:50,120 Speaker 4: opportunity to speak about Olivia. She got a really raw 871 00:45:50,160 --> 00:45:51,719 Speaker 4: into the deal in the show. She was like the 872 00:45:51,800 --> 00:45:56,839 Speaker 4: villain on a season that the villains didn't exist, and 873 00:45:56,920 --> 00:45:59,840 Speaker 4: that just is awful for her because she doesn't deserve it. 874 00:46:00,040 --> 00:46:03,759 Speaker 4: Didn't deserve it. She was great, but at that point 875 00:46:04,120 --> 00:46:07,000 Speaker 4: it's so hard for me because at that point I 876 00:46:07,080 --> 00:46:09,680 Speaker 4: was so convinced that like she wasn't it, that like 877 00:46:09,760 --> 00:46:11,600 Speaker 4: it was time to go home. And the longer we 878 00:46:11,719 --> 00:46:17,239 Speaker 4: kept going, I think the more she was getting confident that. 879 00:46:17,360 --> 00:46:20,319 Speaker 3: Like this is this is it. So I think that 880 00:46:20,480 --> 00:46:21,680 Speaker 3: was the right decision. 881 00:46:21,680 --> 00:46:25,719 Speaker 4: Then I just, uh, if I have one regret from 882 00:46:25,760 --> 00:46:27,800 Speaker 4: the show, it's that I didn't stand up for Olivia 883 00:46:27,960 --> 00:46:31,440 Speaker 4: sooner out loud and say like, hey, why are we 884 00:46:31,480 --> 00:46:36,160 Speaker 4: all like, you know, bashing this because she's fantastic. She 885 00:46:36,160 --> 00:46:40,040 Speaker 4: had no like, she did nothing wrong other than just 886 00:46:40,040 --> 00:46:43,879 Speaker 4: be really confident in something that you know, maybe that's 887 00:46:43,920 --> 00:46:45,719 Speaker 4: the worst thing, is to have confidence in something you 888 00:46:45,719 --> 00:46:49,840 Speaker 4: should have confidence over. And I just didn't and I 889 00:46:50,200 --> 00:46:53,200 Speaker 4: stayed quiet, and I feel terrible for it. I don't 890 00:46:53,200 --> 00:46:55,920 Speaker 4: know why I did. Maybe I didn't know how much 891 00:46:55,920 --> 00:46:58,239 Speaker 4: it was affecting her. I thought, you know, I thought 892 00:46:58,239 --> 00:46:59,759 Speaker 4: most people would come and go from the show and 893 00:46:59,760 --> 00:47:04,680 Speaker 4: be a k but she got the wrong to the deal. However, 894 00:47:05,680 --> 00:47:10,120 Speaker 4: I think she's doing great now and that's exciting. But 895 00:47:10,160 --> 00:47:12,040 Speaker 4: can you imagine being the villain on a season where 896 00:47:12,040 --> 00:47:12,880 Speaker 4: everybody was awesome? 897 00:47:13,000 --> 00:47:14,080 Speaker 3: Like that's so stupid. 898 00:47:14,480 --> 00:47:17,160 Speaker 2: They were was like, what are your complaints about her? 899 00:47:18,520 --> 00:47:21,480 Speaker 3: She chews weird, Like can. 900 00:47:21,360 --> 00:47:23,560 Speaker 4: You imagine her being a villain on any other season? 901 00:47:23,600 --> 00:47:27,120 Speaker 4: Like it doesn't exist. She's like God, she thrives, but 902 00:47:27,280 --> 00:47:33,239 Speaker 4: because everybody was so awesome, she got you know, blasted, 903 00:47:33,440 --> 00:47:36,440 Speaker 4: and that was that's just unfair, Like that that's a 904 00:47:36,480 --> 00:47:37,840 Speaker 4: bad it's a bad at it. 905 00:47:38,360 --> 00:47:42,520 Speaker 2: Yeah, all right, now we're gonna sign off. Thank you, 906 00:47:42,600 --> 00:47:46,279 Speaker 2: Ben Tutulu. Till next time I've been Ashley and I've 907 00:47:46,280 --> 00:47:48,799 Speaker 1: Been Ben, We'll talk to You, followed the Ben and 908 00:47:48,840 --> 00:47:53,000 Speaker 1: Ashley I Almost Famous podcasts on iHeartRadio or subscribe wherever 909 00:47:53,080 --> 00:47:54,239 Speaker 1: you listen to podcasts.