1 00:00:00,080 --> 00:00:02,640 Speaker 1: Did you know a recent law can leave your personal 2 00:00:02,759 --> 00:00:07,440 Speaker 1: data exposed online for anybody to find. If you've turned 3 00:00:07,440 --> 00:00:09,959 Speaker 1: on the news lately, you know the internet has created 4 00:00:10,000 --> 00:00:13,480 Speaker 1: a dangerous new world. It's time you take back the 5 00:00:13,520 --> 00:00:17,119 Speaker 1: power by using a new website called truth Finder. Have 6 00:00:17,280 --> 00:00:19,920 Speaker 1: you been issued a speeding ticket, received a lean from 7 00:00:19,920 --> 00:00:23,280 Speaker 1: the I R S? Did you forget about embarrassing social 8 00:00:23,320 --> 00:00:28,120 Speaker 1: media profile? That info may already be online. Truth Finder 9 00:00:28,240 --> 00:00:31,600 Speaker 1: can help you find it. Truth Finder searches millions of 10 00:00:31,640 --> 00:00:36,360 Speaker 1: public records, assembling the data together in one report. Members 11 00:00:36,360 --> 00:00:39,600 Speaker 1: get unlimited searches, so you can also look up those 12 00:00:39,640 --> 00:00:42,880 Speaker 1: close to you and make sure they're not hiding something. 13 00:00:43,400 --> 00:00:47,280 Speaker 1: Visit truth finder dot com, slash Nancy, enter your own name. 14 00:00:47,520 --> 00:00:57,360 Speaker 1: Get started. Crime stories with Nancy Grace on sirius x 15 00:00:57,520 --> 00:01:05,000 Speaker 1: M Triumph Channel one thirty two. The shocking, the disturbing 16 00:01:05,440 --> 00:01:09,640 Speaker 1: stories and reports regarding what we believe to be another 17 00:01:09,840 --> 00:01:15,120 Speaker 1: and prolific serial killer, Arthur Reem has rocked the country 18 00:01:15,560 --> 00:01:19,760 Speaker 1: and what we're learning of him. Regarding a burial ground 19 00:01:19,840 --> 00:01:23,479 Speaker 1: of sorts where young girls are buried the same site 20 00:01:23,480 --> 00:01:27,959 Speaker 1: where a young teen girl, Cindy Zarzeki, just thirteen years old, 21 00:01:28,440 --> 00:01:33,840 Speaker 1: was murdered and buried in Little White Mary Janes opened 22 00:01:33,920 --> 00:01:39,399 Speaker 1: up a can of worms, a shocking revelation that more 23 00:01:39,959 --> 00:01:45,400 Speaker 1: teen girls and younger may have been Arthur Reams murder 24 00:01:45,400 --> 00:01:51,160 Speaker 1: and rape victims. The site regarded as a so called 25 00:01:51,280 --> 00:01:56,520 Speaker 1: burial site for all these young girls has not yielded 26 00:01:57,400 --> 00:02:02,120 Speaker 1: what we had hoped for, and now those girls names 27 00:02:02,560 --> 00:02:07,520 Speaker 1: are re added to a list of so called cold cases. 28 00:02:08,040 --> 00:02:16,320 Speaker 1: One of those young girls, Nadine, Nadine Odell, goes missing 29 00:02:16,360 --> 00:02:20,520 Speaker 1: when she's just a teen girl. I'm Nancy Grace. This 30 00:02:20,639 --> 00:02:27,040 Speaker 1: is crime stories we want answers. Nadine is not buried there, 31 00:02:27,120 --> 00:02:31,320 Speaker 1: so where is she? What became of her? Is Arthur 32 00:02:31,400 --> 00:02:34,040 Speaker 1: Rain just taking us all in a wild goose chase. 33 00:02:34,240 --> 00:02:37,720 Speaker 1: He never said her name. It was just supposed that 34 00:02:37,880 --> 00:02:42,480 Speaker 1: maybe she was one of his victims. But now, sadly, 35 00:02:43,520 --> 00:02:48,240 Speaker 1: we have no clue about where this teen girl. Maybe 36 00:02:48,480 --> 00:02:59,680 Speaker 1: her sister has never given up. Listen right there, memories 37 00:03:00,120 --> 00:03:03,280 Speaker 1: back as Brenda Lee hand Looser sees home video of 38 00:03:03,320 --> 00:03:05,960 Speaker 1: her sister Nadine. But I've never seen this much of it. 39 00:03:06,560 --> 00:03:13,399 Speaker 1: There's Nadine, Oh my god, where are you? Nadine? Jean 40 00:03:13,600 --> 00:03:18,120 Speaker 1: Odell was just sixteen years old when she disappeared Inkster, 41 00:03:18,360 --> 00:03:22,000 Speaker 1: August sixteenth, nineteen seventy four. She was walking to a 42 00:03:22,040 --> 00:03:25,639 Speaker 1: babysitting job and never arrived. I know there's somebody out 43 00:03:25,639 --> 00:03:28,520 Speaker 1: there that knows. You know, you hear it all the time, 44 00:03:28,560 --> 00:03:33,040 Speaker 1: you know, somebody seeing something, and I know somebody had 45 00:03:33,040 --> 00:03:34,680 Speaker 1: to have seen something. It was during the day and 46 00:03:34,960 --> 00:03:38,760 Speaker 1: Nadine was last seen after nine thirty am walking down 47 00:03:38,880 --> 00:03:42,720 Speaker 1: John Daily Road towards Michigan Avenue in Inkster. Brenda says 48 00:03:43,080 --> 00:03:46,280 Speaker 1: Nadine was babysitting her frends of younger siblings and Taylor. 49 00:03:46,640 --> 00:03:49,440 Speaker 1: He would meet her at the halfway point. She didn't 50 00:03:49,440 --> 00:03:51,680 Speaker 1: make it to that point. He came to the house 51 00:03:52,120 --> 00:03:56,280 Speaker 1: and he's like, where's Nadine. She wasn't there, and that's 52 00:03:56,280 --> 00:03:58,360 Speaker 1: how it all started. I just remember as a very 53 00:03:58,440 --> 00:04:02,120 Speaker 1: quiet song, she you know, played with us and she 54 00:04:02,240 --> 00:04:05,480 Speaker 1: baby started a lot. This is the last picture that 55 00:04:05,520 --> 00:04:09,520 Speaker 1: I know of that was taken over. If she is alive, 56 00:04:09,640 --> 00:04:13,600 Speaker 1: Nadine would be fifty nine years old. This age progression 57 00:04:13,600 --> 00:04:15,960 Speaker 1: photo was done when she would have been fifty two. 58 00:04:16,360 --> 00:04:19,919 Speaker 1: Brenda fears the worst, but wants closure. Oh I know 59 00:04:20,040 --> 00:04:23,839 Speaker 1: she's dead. Oh I know she's done. Nadine wouldn't have 60 00:04:23,839 --> 00:04:29,240 Speaker 1: stayed away. She would not have stayed away. She went 61 00:04:29,440 --> 00:04:32,000 Speaker 1: home to my mom. I want to bring my sister 62 00:04:32,120 --> 00:04:35,120 Speaker 1: home and layer to rust. I don't care if it's 63 00:04:35,120 --> 00:04:38,560 Speaker 1: a bone, a piece of hair, a nail, I don't care. 64 00:04:38,839 --> 00:04:42,760 Speaker 1: I just want my sister. She's out there somewhere, laying 65 00:04:42,760 --> 00:04:47,440 Speaker 1: in the ground or wherever. The thought of your sister 66 00:04:47,600 --> 00:04:51,719 Speaker 1: or your child, only the only remains you have is, 67 00:04:51,920 --> 00:04:55,440 Speaker 1: as she said, a bone, a fingernail, her hair. Dr 68 00:04:55,480 --> 00:04:59,560 Speaker 1: Bethany Marshall l a psychoanalyst. That has got to be 69 00:05:00,080 --> 00:05:04,239 Speaker 1: devastating that that's all you have left of your child. 70 00:05:04,720 --> 00:05:08,599 Speaker 1: Not only is that all you have left, but you 71 00:05:08,640 --> 00:05:11,680 Speaker 1: don't know what happened to them when they died. You know, 72 00:05:12,080 --> 00:05:16,200 Speaker 1: for most of us, if a situation is ambiguous, we 73 00:05:16,240 --> 00:05:18,960 Speaker 1: don't really quite know what happened. We can't fill in 74 00:05:19,000 --> 00:05:21,839 Speaker 1: the blanks. We fill in the blanks with the most 75 00:05:22,120 --> 00:05:26,800 Speaker 1: negative scenario. That's just human nature. Layer on top of 76 00:05:26,839 --> 00:05:30,640 Speaker 1: that that, you know your loved one has gone missing 77 00:05:31,400 --> 00:05:34,800 Speaker 1: and it's probably dead, and it would fill your mind 78 00:05:34,839 --> 00:05:38,960 Speaker 1: with fantasies of like torture, rape, not knowing what their 79 00:05:39,040 --> 00:05:42,920 Speaker 1: last hours were like so not just that you may 80 00:05:43,000 --> 00:05:45,560 Speaker 1: just have like a bone or hair, but you don't 81 00:05:45,600 --> 00:05:48,560 Speaker 1: know what happened to that person in their final hours. 82 00:05:48,600 --> 00:05:51,000 Speaker 1: The thought of it and playing it over and over 83 00:05:51,040 --> 00:05:54,320 Speaker 1: and over in your mind and never really knowing With 84 00:05:54,360 --> 00:05:57,440 Speaker 1: me is John Linley Crime Stories in ustigative reporter, renowned 85 00:05:57,680 --> 00:06:02,760 Speaker 1: l a psychoanalyst Dr. Bethany Marshall, and private investigator Vincent Hill. 86 00:06:03,320 --> 00:06:06,039 Speaker 1: John Lily, I want to talk about the so called 87 00:06:06,080 --> 00:06:08,719 Speaker 1: cold case, and I hate that term because when people 88 00:06:08,720 --> 00:06:11,000 Speaker 1: hear the words cold case, a lot of times they 89 00:06:11,080 --> 00:06:15,000 Speaker 1: just tuned out. But the pain of the family never 90 00:06:15,080 --> 00:06:17,920 Speaker 1: gets tuned out. It never goes cold, it goes on, 91 00:06:18,400 --> 00:06:21,600 Speaker 1: and not knowing what happened to your child or your 92 00:06:21,640 --> 00:06:25,920 Speaker 1: little sister, it never lets you move to grieving because 93 00:06:25,960 --> 00:06:31,600 Speaker 1: you're always looking that day. Nadine O'Dell was a babysitter. 94 00:06:31,760 --> 00:06:34,800 Speaker 1: She's a kid herself, but she baby sat and she 95 00:06:35,000 --> 00:06:39,279 Speaker 1: was on her way on foot, not too far away 96 00:06:39,520 --> 00:06:42,760 Speaker 1: to babysit. She never made it. What do we know 97 00:06:42,960 --> 00:06:47,760 Speaker 1: about Nadine Odell, John Limley. She was a beloved sister, 98 00:06:47,839 --> 00:06:51,360 Speaker 1: as you can hear in that audio with her sister 99 00:06:52,040 --> 00:06:56,120 Speaker 1: just a moment ago Um, she was the sister that 100 00:06:56,440 --> 00:07:00,080 Speaker 1: this woman has always really wanted to get to know it. 101 00:07:00,160 --> 00:07:03,320 Speaker 1: I know this much. I know. She's five one, weighed 102 00:07:03,480 --> 00:07:09,120 Speaker 1: hundred and five pounds, a little bitty thing. Um. She 103 00:07:09,680 --> 00:07:13,720 Speaker 1: went missing in Inkster, Michigan when she was had just 104 00:07:14,000 --> 00:07:18,640 Speaker 1: turned sixteen. A white female with blond hair and green eyes. 105 00:07:19,360 --> 00:07:23,360 Speaker 1: Really cute and looks like she her face was covered 106 00:07:23,720 --> 00:07:26,960 Speaker 1: and freckles. Her hair is kind of strawberry blonde, and 107 00:07:27,040 --> 00:07:32,000 Speaker 1: the freckles match her hair. And she was on foot. 108 00:07:32,120 --> 00:07:35,120 Speaker 1: And what's interesting about that, John Limley, as a lot 109 00:07:35,120 --> 00:07:39,440 Speaker 1: of the other victims of Arthur Reem were also on foot. 110 00:07:39,480 --> 00:07:43,600 Speaker 1: She was last seeing wearing a white T shirt, baggy jeans, 111 00:07:43,680 --> 00:07:47,800 Speaker 1: and a high school class ring on a chain around 112 00:07:47,800 --> 00:07:50,760 Speaker 1: her neck. All right, So, John Limley, she didn't have 113 00:07:50,800 --> 00:07:53,720 Speaker 1: far to walk, No, not at all. And that seems 114 00:07:53,760 --> 00:07:58,040 Speaker 1: to be the case with a number of these missing persons, 115 00:07:58,080 --> 00:08:03,520 Speaker 1: these missing girls. One of them, uh, Kimberly King was 116 00:08:03,800 --> 00:08:07,720 Speaker 1: just across the street from her grandparents house when she 117 00:08:07,800 --> 00:08:12,040 Speaker 1: was last heard from on a on a phone call. 118 00:08:12,120 --> 00:08:14,760 Speaker 1: Oh gosh, you're giving me chills, because you know what, 119 00:08:14,800 --> 00:08:18,080 Speaker 1: this reminds me of Vincent hild Private investigator. Do you 120 00:08:18,120 --> 00:08:22,600 Speaker 1: recall this gorgeous little girl in Florida, Carly Brecia. She 121 00:08:22,680 --> 00:08:25,960 Speaker 1: had been to a spend the night party the night before. Well, 122 00:08:26,080 --> 00:08:28,080 Speaker 1: not spend the night party. She spent the night with 123 00:08:28,080 --> 00:08:31,640 Speaker 1: her little friend girl and decided to walk home. It 124 00:08:31,800 --> 00:08:37,280 Speaker 1: was less than a ten minute walk home, okay, and 125 00:08:37,679 --> 00:08:42,120 Speaker 1: she happened to cut caddy cornered across the back parking 126 00:08:42,160 --> 00:08:44,040 Speaker 1: lot of a car wash, you know the kind that 127 00:08:44,080 --> 00:08:48,360 Speaker 1: you drive your car into, which a lot of them. 128 00:08:48,400 --> 00:08:51,199 Speaker 1: You can see through the car wash itself. It wasn't 129 00:08:51,240 --> 00:08:54,440 Speaker 1: like she was walking in an industrial area. It was 130 00:08:54,480 --> 00:08:57,600 Speaker 1: a residential area. But this one spot happened to have 131 00:08:57,640 --> 00:09:00,840 Speaker 1: a car wash. She cut caddy cornered across the parking lot, 132 00:09:01,160 --> 00:09:05,680 Speaker 1: and it's caught on video. You see the killer walk 133 00:09:05,800 --> 00:09:09,839 Speaker 1: up to the girl and I think she's twelve, grab 134 00:09:09,880 --> 00:09:13,000 Speaker 1: her by the arm and pull her off. That's the 135 00:09:13,080 --> 00:09:17,240 Speaker 1: last she's ever seen her body. Carly Bruce's body was 136 00:09:17,320 --> 00:09:21,640 Speaker 1: found half naked in the same town behind in a 137 00:09:21,640 --> 00:09:25,760 Speaker 1: wooded area behind Central Church of God. Okay, it the 138 00:09:25,760 --> 00:09:29,200 Speaker 1: the guy was a predator. He was out looking, that's true, 139 00:09:29,240 --> 00:09:33,240 Speaker 1: but he just happened to see her and she was 140 00:09:33,320 --> 00:09:39,000 Speaker 1: gone just like that, just like Nadine Odell to Vincent Hill. 141 00:09:39,800 --> 00:09:46,079 Speaker 1: Why is it children on foot? They're such easy targets. Yeah, Nancy, 142 00:09:46,280 --> 00:09:47,880 Speaker 1: and I think you hit the nail on the head 143 00:09:47,920 --> 00:09:50,000 Speaker 1: a lot of times to these paraters. What they do 144 00:09:50,040 --> 00:09:53,080 Speaker 1: is they go into these neighborhoods because they know at 145 00:09:53,200 --> 00:09:56,040 Speaker 1: some point there's going to be a small child walking 146 00:09:56,080 --> 00:09:58,320 Speaker 1: by themselves, and it's just like a d u I. 147 00:09:58,400 --> 00:10:01,120 Speaker 1: You know, the old thing that you you usually have 148 00:10:01,280 --> 00:10:03,240 Speaker 1: a d o I accident within a few miles of 149 00:10:03,240 --> 00:10:05,880 Speaker 1: your house, is just like an abduction. It's usually a 150 00:10:05,920 --> 00:10:09,200 Speaker 1: few miles from the home. Because that's what these predators do. 151 00:10:09,240 --> 00:10:12,280 Speaker 1: They go to these areas where they know small children, 152 00:10:12,559 --> 00:10:15,760 Speaker 1: easy targets, will be walking around and they can snatch 153 00:10:15,840 --> 00:10:21,760 Speaker 1: them very easily. Again, faded, baggy blue jeans, white T shirt, 154 00:10:22,440 --> 00:10:27,040 Speaker 1: her then her little boyfriend's Taylor High School class ring 155 00:10:27,440 --> 00:10:30,840 Speaker 1: on a chain around her neck. The ring's white gold 156 00:10:30,880 --> 00:10:35,640 Speaker 1: with a blue stone and a ram's head, blonde hair, 157 00:10:36,240 --> 00:10:40,800 Speaker 1: green eyes, freckles. I'm taking a look at her age 158 00:10:40,800 --> 00:10:45,480 Speaker 1: progression photos again. She's last seen walking in an inkster, 159 00:10:46,200 --> 00:10:52,079 Speaker 1: Michigan suburb, in a neighborhood she was on John daily 160 00:10:52,520 --> 00:10:56,680 Speaker 1: road walking towards Michigan Avenue and what's another amazing thing, 161 00:10:56,920 --> 00:11:01,199 Speaker 1: Vincent Hill. She was last seen at nine thirty a m. 162 00:11:01,240 --> 00:11:05,040 Speaker 1: In the morning. I mean, who's thinking about kidnapping, raping, 163 00:11:05,080 --> 00:11:08,720 Speaker 1: and murdering a little girl at nine a m. In 164 00:11:08,880 --> 00:11:11,640 Speaker 1: the morning. Well, obviously a predator. But you know, the 165 00:11:11,720 --> 00:11:15,800 Speaker 1: thing about these early morning abductions is everyone's too busy 166 00:11:15,840 --> 00:11:18,720 Speaker 1: focused on getting the word, getting their kids to school, 167 00:11:19,280 --> 00:11:22,480 Speaker 1: checking the mail, getting the newspaper. They're not really watching 168 00:11:22,840 --> 00:11:25,120 Speaker 1: the things that we really should be watching. So if 169 00:11:25,120 --> 00:11:27,920 Speaker 1: you think about it, it's actually a prime time to 170 00:11:28,080 --> 00:11:32,000 Speaker 1: abduct someone because everyone's so focused on their personal lives 171 00:11:32,080 --> 00:11:35,360 Speaker 1: that they're not watching out for these predators. Nadine was 172 00:11:35,400 --> 00:11:38,120 Speaker 1: on her way to babysit and a house in Tailor 173 00:11:38,920 --> 00:11:43,440 Speaker 1: on foot. In fact, her little boyfriend, they were both 174 00:11:43,480 --> 00:11:46,440 Speaker 1: just kids, was meeting her halfway and he got there, 175 00:11:46,920 --> 00:11:52,440 Speaker 1: So just halfway between her home and halfway there, she 176 00:11:52,640 --> 00:11:56,840 Speaker 1: was taken. Dr Bethany Marshall, l a psychoanalysts It almost 177 00:11:56,880 --> 00:11:59,360 Speaker 1: seems too hard to take in that in that short 178 00:11:59,559 --> 00:12:04,200 Speaker 1: of a moment she's gone, but that is exactly the 179 00:12:04,240 --> 00:12:07,439 Speaker 1: way it happens. And I think about that Dr Bethany. 180 00:12:07,480 --> 00:12:10,320 Speaker 1: Every time I pull up to the grocery store and 181 00:12:10,360 --> 00:12:12,600 Speaker 1: I think only the children in the car, They'll just 182 00:12:12,640 --> 00:12:15,800 Speaker 1: be five minutes. I'll run out. Then I think just 183 00:12:15,920 --> 00:12:19,000 Speaker 1: five minutes. That turns into ten, that turns into fifteen minutes, 184 00:12:19,679 --> 00:12:23,679 Speaker 1: just fifteen minutes, and they could be gone, gone, just 185 00:12:23,920 --> 00:12:27,760 Speaker 1: like that. And and I'm just thinking about her parents, 186 00:12:28,040 --> 00:12:30,200 Speaker 1: the suffering they've been to. I want to circle back 187 00:12:30,240 --> 00:12:33,800 Speaker 1: to what Vincent Hill was talking about. Who is thinking 188 00:12:33,840 --> 00:12:38,840 Speaker 1: about kidnapping, raping, and murdering a child at nine o'clock 189 00:12:38,880 --> 00:12:44,400 Speaker 1: in the morning. Well, you have a predator whose offending 190 00:12:44,480 --> 00:12:48,080 Speaker 1: pattern is being a pedophile, right who has a certain 191 00:12:49,080 --> 00:12:52,920 Speaker 1: target victim. You know some pedophiles right now, when you 192 00:12:53,000 --> 00:12:58,800 Speaker 1: say it's a pedophile with a a routine, we don't 193 00:12:58,840 --> 00:13:01,880 Speaker 1: know who took her, We have no idea. In fact, 194 00:13:01,920 --> 00:13:04,960 Speaker 1: I don't believe anything that Arthur Ream spits out of 195 00:13:05,000 --> 00:13:08,280 Speaker 1: his mouth. Because this guy, Arthur Ream, that people are 196 00:13:08,320 --> 00:13:12,079 Speaker 1: attaching to Nadine's disappearance, I don't believe him, and I'll 197 00:13:12,080 --> 00:13:16,720 Speaker 1: tell you why, because he actually admitted that he had 198 00:13:16,760 --> 00:13:21,719 Speaker 1: considered making up fake maps to give to police. I 199 00:13:22,080 --> 00:13:26,040 Speaker 1: don't think I think we're now looking at a young 200 00:13:26,120 --> 00:13:29,840 Speaker 1: girl who went missing, and we're attributing it to Arthur Ream. 201 00:13:29,880 --> 00:13:33,120 Speaker 1: I don't necessarily believe that that's true. Dr Bethany. So 202 00:13:33,160 --> 00:13:36,079 Speaker 1: why do you say that the person that took her 203 00:13:37,000 --> 00:13:43,520 Speaker 1: is a functioning pedophile? Well, I mean most abductions are 204 00:13:43,559 --> 00:13:48,360 Speaker 1: at the hands of non custodial caretakers. Okay, the stereotypical 205 00:13:48,400 --> 00:13:52,240 Speaker 1: abduction rape is less than one percent of all children 206 00:13:52,280 --> 00:13:55,880 Speaker 1: who go missing. And yet that seems to fall into 207 00:13:55,880 --> 00:14:02,079 Speaker 1: this category because no non custodian caretaker has ever been 208 00:14:02,120 --> 00:14:05,000 Speaker 1: accused or come back. In other words, you might have 209 00:14:05,040 --> 00:14:08,880 Speaker 1: a divorce situation where you know, the father doesn't have custody, 210 00:14:08,960 --> 00:14:12,520 Speaker 1: he becomes obsessed with the child, he absconced with the child, 211 00:14:12,720 --> 00:14:15,520 Speaker 1: takes the child from the mother, But usually that's a 212 00:14:15,559 --> 00:14:19,080 Speaker 1: primary part of the news story. In this case not. 213 00:14:19,440 --> 00:14:24,080 Speaker 1: No relatives have been named. She just seemed to have 214 00:14:24,160 --> 00:14:27,200 Speaker 1: disappeared into thin air, which tells me she's one of 215 00:14:27,280 --> 00:14:33,160 Speaker 1: that one percent of rape, abduction, homicide of children. Where 216 00:14:33,200 --> 00:14:36,080 Speaker 1: you do have a predator, and with pedophilia, you know 217 00:14:36,240 --> 00:14:40,080 Speaker 1: the the victim is more than five years age difference 218 00:14:40,160 --> 00:14:43,720 Speaker 1: between the perpetrator and the victim. The victim is pre pubescent. 219 00:14:44,360 --> 00:14:47,400 Speaker 1: Usually the perpetrator has a type. You know, either they're 220 00:14:47,440 --> 00:14:51,120 Speaker 1: an extra familial molester. Oh wait a minute, wait a minute, 221 00:14:51,200 --> 00:14:52,840 Speaker 1: let me let me talk to you about that the 222 00:14:52,880 --> 00:14:58,400 Speaker 1: time type. I remember studying UM when I had my 223 00:14:58,480 --> 00:15:04,320 Speaker 1: first serial order that I was prosecuting, and I remember 224 00:15:04,600 --> 00:15:10,120 Speaker 1: studying Ted Bundy and um, let me tell you how 225 00:15:10,160 --> 00:15:15,120 Speaker 1: this played out. I was looking at all of his victims, 226 00:15:15,760 --> 00:15:20,320 Speaker 1: and so many of them were the same look white female, 227 00:15:20,880 --> 00:15:26,760 Speaker 1: uh thin thin, long dark hair, and a lot of 228 00:15:26,800 --> 00:15:29,080 Speaker 1: their pictures kind of in a half up date like 229 00:15:29,120 --> 00:15:34,960 Speaker 1: maybe pull back with pens and then falling down, and 230 00:15:35,200 --> 00:15:40,880 Speaker 1: they all looked very, very similar. And the guy I 231 00:15:40,960 --> 00:15:47,800 Speaker 1: was prosecuting his victim, who remained a Jane Doe, I 232 00:15:47,880 --> 00:15:52,080 Speaker 1: might add, we did a facial reconstruction from what we 233 00:15:52,440 --> 00:15:55,280 Speaker 1: could find of her, because she was partially decomposed when 234 00:15:55,320 --> 00:15:58,920 Speaker 1: we found her. Can I tell you something, Dr Bethany, 235 00:15:59,280 --> 00:16:02,240 Speaker 1: I started, sir. I finally got my eye on a 236 00:16:02,240 --> 00:16:07,720 Speaker 1: potential suspect, and I managed to find his ex Okay, 237 00:16:08,040 --> 00:16:15,720 Speaker 1: I found his ex girlfriend. She her face looked almost 238 00:16:15,840 --> 00:16:21,480 Speaker 1: identical to the sketch artist rendition of what my murder 239 00:16:21,560 --> 00:16:28,040 Speaker 1: victim looked. Like. Then I found a rape victim who 240 00:16:28,320 --> 00:16:32,520 Speaker 1: said that her rapist put his hands around her neck 241 00:16:33,080 --> 00:16:35,400 Speaker 1: and kept saying, I would have pretty neck you have, 242 00:16:36,800 --> 00:16:40,720 Speaker 1: I got her, I got her picture. You will never 243 00:16:40,880 --> 00:16:45,880 Speaker 1: believe this, Bethany. All three of them were eerily similar. 244 00:16:46,080 --> 00:16:48,360 Speaker 1: In fact, I use that my closing argument. I put 245 00:16:48,440 --> 00:16:53,200 Speaker 1: up a picture of the girlfriend, the known girlfriend, next 246 00:16:53,240 --> 00:16:58,080 Speaker 1: to the graphic sketch the recreation of what the murder 247 00:16:58,160 --> 00:17:01,320 Speaker 1: victim would have looked like. And in the end I said, 248 00:17:01,680 --> 00:17:05,840 Speaker 1: who would have killed her? Except for the man that 249 00:17:06,080 --> 00:17:09,520 Speaker 1: tried to kill her? And I pulled him back and 250 00:17:09,560 --> 00:17:15,680 Speaker 1: the jury actually went they look so similar. So when 251 00:17:15,680 --> 00:17:18,199 Speaker 1: you say he had a type, I don't know what 252 00:17:18,320 --> 00:17:21,480 Speaker 1: that means. I just know what I what I know. Okay, 253 00:17:21,880 --> 00:17:26,040 Speaker 1: I know it's anecdotal, it's not statistical. So what do 254 00:17:26,119 --> 00:17:29,800 Speaker 1: you mean why he has a type? Well, it's not 255 00:17:29,920 --> 00:17:33,000 Speaker 1: just the type in terms of what the child looks like, 256 00:17:33,240 --> 00:17:35,159 Speaker 1: but it would be the type in terms of the 257 00:17:35,200 --> 00:17:37,920 Speaker 1: relationship with the child too, And now I know that, 258 00:17:38,080 --> 00:17:43,600 Speaker 1: reams Um. Although he had one situation in which he 259 00:17:43,800 --> 00:17:47,720 Speaker 1: abducted a girl with his brother in law, according to 260 00:17:48,000 --> 00:17:54,240 Speaker 1: his mother reports, he also liked to um develop relationships 261 00:17:54,280 --> 00:17:58,120 Speaker 1: with young girls where he tried to influence or course 262 00:17:58,320 --> 00:18:02,200 Speaker 1: or dominate them. So I believe his type would be 263 00:18:02,240 --> 00:18:07,360 Speaker 1: a prepubucent girl or even adolescent whom he could control 264 00:18:07,680 --> 00:18:11,119 Speaker 1: or had some relationship with. The little girl we're talking 265 00:18:11,160 --> 00:18:15,320 Speaker 1: about today. I have not heard any reports that she 266 00:18:15,400 --> 00:18:17,960 Speaker 1: has somebody like that in her life. She appeared to 267 00:18:18,080 --> 00:18:22,000 Speaker 1: have disappeared into sin air, which tells me that whoever 268 00:18:22,119 --> 00:18:26,520 Speaker 1: her perpetrator was or offender, that that was his type. 269 00:18:26,560 --> 00:18:30,280 Speaker 1: A little girl who's like away from her family, out 270 00:18:30,320 --> 00:18:34,359 Speaker 1: in the world, no social ties that he can tie 271 00:18:34,440 --> 00:18:37,720 Speaker 1: her back to where he has her all to himself. 272 00:18:38,080 --> 00:18:40,440 Speaker 1: I don't know about appearance because we have to match 273 00:18:40,520 --> 00:18:43,399 Speaker 1: it with other little girls. Maybe you have gone missing 274 00:18:43,440 --> 00:18:45,719 Speaker 1: in the area. But in this case, it's not just 275 00:18:45,800 --> 00:18:47,720 Speaker 1: the type in terms of what she looks like, but 276 00:18:47,800 --> 00:18:51,399 Speaker 1: the offending pattern, and that doesn't seem to to match 277 00:18:51,600 --> 00:18:55,000 Speaker 1: reams offending pattern. We also know, according to her sister, 278 00:18:55,080 --> 00:18:59,760 Speaker 1: that she's a very quiet and withdrawn. We are trying 279 00:18:59,800 --> 00:19:05,680 Speaker 1: to find Nadine O'Dell who goes missing a teen girl, beautiful, 280 00:19:05,760 --> 00:19:10,400 Speaker 1: young girl, face covered in freckles. If you have information, 281 00:19:10,720 --> 00:19:14,560 Speaker 1: tip line with Instra Police three one three, five, six, 282 00:19:14,680 --> 00:19:20,960 Speaker 1: three five zero three one three five six three five zero. 283 00:19:21,640 --> 00:19:24,240 Speaker 1: There's a brand new website causing a lot of trouble 284 00:19:24,320 --> 00:19:26,760 Speaker 1: for people with something to hide? Have you ever had 285 00:19:26,760 --> 00:19:30,640 Speaker 1: a bad feeling about somebody? May be suspected your partners cheating, 286 00:19:31,359 --> 00:19:35,360 Speaker 1: maybe worried about your online reputation. If you answer yes 287 00:19:35,400 --> 00:19:39,000 Speaker 1: to any of those questions, you may need truth Finder. 288 00:19:39,680 --> 00:19:45,680 Speaker 1: Public records are only recently easily available online. Before websites 289 00:19:45,760 --> 00:19:48,159 Speaker 1: like truth Finder, you most likely have to visit a 290 00:19:48,160 --> 00:19:51,400 Speaker 1: courthouse to get that information. Now it's as simple as 291 00:19:51,560 --> 00:19:55,240 Speaker 1: entering a name. Truth Finder sifts through millions of public 292 00:19:55,280 --> 00:19:59,000 Speaker 1: records from all over the country, assembling them into one 293 00:19:59,200 --> 00:20:02,280 Speaker 1: easy to read report. Search the names of somebody you know, 294 00:20:02,720 --> 00:20:06,960 Speaker 1: you could find criminal and arrest records, bankruptcies, contact information, 295 00:20:07,320 --> 00:20:12,120 Speaker 1: social dating profiles, financial assets, and a lot more. Why 296 00:20:12,240 --> 00:20:16,000 Speaker 1: fork out thousands to a private investigator when you can 297 00:20:16,040 --> 00:20:20,760 Speaker 1: do the job yourself. Everybody you know has something to hide. 298 00:20:21,320 --> 00:20:24,879 Speaker 1: Now you can root out the most dangerous people before 299 00:20:24,960 --> 00:20:28,359 Speaker 1: you become the next victim. It's not just used to 300 00:20:28,480 --> 00:20:33,400 Speaker 1: us bad people. Truth Finder helps Americans reunite with friends, family, 301 00:20:33,560 --> 00:20:37,080 Speaker 1: even people who served with them in the military. It's 302 00:20:37,119 --> 00:20:39,840 Speaker 1: never been so easy to find the truth. Go to 303 00:20:39,920 --> 00:20:43,120 Speaker 1: truth finder dot com slash Nancy and enter any name 304 00:20:43,320 --> 00:20:49,520 Speaker 1: to get started. What happened to Nadine O'Dell? A gorgeous, young, 305 00:20:49,600 --> 00:20:55,240 Speaker 1: strawberry blonde teen girl, her face covered in strawberry blonde freckles, 306 00:20:55,280 --> 00:20:59,320 Speaker 1: a big smile, known to be shy and quiet, was 307 00:20:59,440 --> 00:21:02,280 Speaker 1: on the way to a babysitting job on foot when 308 00:21:02,320 --> 00:21:06,679 Speaker 1: she goes missing. John Linley, Crime Stories, investigative reporter, what 309 00:21:06,720 --> 00:21:09,800 Speaker 1: can you tell me anything specific about the time of 310 00:21:09,960 --> 00:21:14,720 Speaker 1: day or year that she went missing? Absolutely, Nancy, You 311 00:21:14,800 --> 00:21:18,399 Speaker 1: and Dr Bethany Marshall have been looking at sort of 312 00:21:18,440 --> 00:21:23,560 Speaker 1: the profile of of a perpetrator um and if you 313 00:21:23,640 --> 00:21:27,960 Speaker 1: look at the times of year that these different cases 314 00:21:28,000 --> 00:21:31,719 Speaker 1: that have been possibly linked and in some cases definitely 315 00:21:31,840 --> 00:21:35,159 Speaker 1: linked to Arthur Reem, they all seem to take place 316 00:21:35,359 --> 00:21:40,520 Speaker 1: during the warmer months, between late spring and late summer 317 00:21:40,720 --> 00:21:44,560 Speaker 1: maybe early fall, all at a time when you're more 318 00:21:44,640 --> 00:21:50,679 Speaker 1: likely to find people, especially teenagers, out and about and 319 00:21:50,760 --> 00:21:54,439 Speaker 1: as we've mentioned, sometimes on foot, going to meet friends 320 00:21:54,440 --> 00:21:57,359 Speaker 1: at the dairy queen or going to church. Uh, they're 321 00:21:57,440 --> 00:22:01,520 Speaker 1: out and more easily accessible. You know, that's that's a 322 00:22:01,520 --> 00:22:05,040 Speaker 1: big clue, Vincent Hill. Yeah, absolutely, Nancy. Not only that 323 00:22:05,160 --> 00:22:07,680 Speaker 1: when when it's warmer, you actually can see what your 324 00:22:07,760 --> 00:22:11,840 Speaker 1: victim uh looks like, you know, with less clothes on. 325 00:22:12,680 --> 00:22:16,760 Speaker 1: This guy apparently likes young women in in the summertime. 326 00:22:16,800 --> 00:22:20,080 Speaker 1: You would assume that they're dressed, possibly in shorts, maybe 327 00:22:20,080 --> 00:22:23,000 Speaker 1: a short skirt or something like that, so he could 328 00:22:23,000 --> 00:22:26,520 Speaker 1: actually see what he's getting himself into, you know. To 329 00:22:26,960 --> 00:22:30,840 Speaker 1: Dr Bethany Marshall, l a psychoanalyst, going into the mind 330 00:22:30,960 --> 00:22:33,600 Speaker 1: of a killer, it's almost like a hunter out looking 331 00:22:33,680 --> 00:22:38,600 Speaker 1: for their prey. Yeah, they're hunting, and they're hunting from 332 00:22:38,600 --> 00:22:43,360 Speaker 1: a neutral position, meaning that often these men and very 333 00:22:43,440 --> 00:22:48,000 Speaker 1: rarely are they women. Usually they live with families. The 334 00:22:48,040 --> 00:22:52,320 Speaker 1: research shows they drive like a normal family vehicle, like 335 00:22:52,359 --> 00:22:55,439 Speaker 1: a van or a truck. They usually have a couple 336 00:22:55,440 --> 00:22:59,160 Speaker 1: of children. Often, like the bt K killer, they work 337 00:22:59,160 --> 00:23:02,879 Speaker 1: at their local church there like a deacon or something 338 00:23:02,960 --> 00:23:06,600 Speaker 1: like that. They hold down jobs, so they are hiding 339 00:23:06,680 --> 00:23:12,000 Speaker 1: in plain sight. But the rape abduction of sending profile 340 00:23:12,560 --> 00:23:16,080 Speaker 1: is like a compulsion to them. It drives them their 341 00:23:16,200 --> 00:23:20,160 Speaker 1: their sexuality is not a normal sexuality and that they 342 00:23:20,200 --> 00:23:23,760 Speaker 1: they want to attach to somebody, but it is their 343 00:23:24,080 --> 00:23:26,719 Speaker 1: m O. It's their reason for living, it's their reason 344 00:23:26,800 --> 00:23:31,800 Speaker 1: for being. And usually the compulsion is combined with some 345 00:23:31,800 --> 00:23:34,440 Speaker 1: some either some kind of sadism, so they want to 346 00:23:34,440 --> 00:23:40,640 Speaker 1: torture the victim, or if it's just sex without sadism, 347 00:23:40,800 --> 00:23:44,080 Speaker 1: they end up killing the victim anyway because they don't 348 00:23:44,080 --> 00:23:46,679 Speaker 1: want the victim to I d them later the victim 349 00:23:46,760 --> 00:23:50,080 Speaker 1: is completely disposable to them. Well, another thing, I mean 350 00:23:50,160 --> 00:23:55,080 Speaker 1: just a function of a pragmatic function. To Vincent Hill, 351 00:23:55,440 --> 00:23:59,480 Speaker 1: this would have been a Thursday morning at nine. That 352 00:23:59,600 --> 00:24:03,560 Speaker 1: tells me this guy was not working at a job 353 00:24:03,680 --> 00:24:06,960 Speaker 1: where he had to punch in like at a bank, okay, 354 00:24:07,119 --> 00:24:11,080 Speaker 1: or at Target or a manufacturing plant where he had 355 00:24:11,119 --> 00:24:14,480 Speaker 1: to be there at eight o'clock in the morning. I 356 00:24:14,520 --> 00:24:17,000 Speaker 1: would think it was a local to the area where 357 00:24:17,040 --> 00:24:20,200 Speaker 1: she went missing in Inkster, and that it was somebody 358 00:24:20,240 --> 00:24:24,520 Speaker 1: that did not have to report to work before. And 359 00:24:24,560 --> 00:24:27,160 Speaker 1: I mean think it through. Unless he took her home 360 00:24:27,720 --> 00:24:30,480 Speaker 1: and bound her and gagged her and through her in closet, 361 00:24:31,200 --> 00:24:34,760 Speaker 1: he disposed of her then, which means he would have 362 00:24:34,840 --> 00:24:41,879 Speaker 1: been busy murdering up until lunchtime or some time after. Okay. 363 00:24:41,920 --> 00:24:47,160 Speaker 1: So that is the person that got Nadine Odell. Yeah, 364 00:24:47,359 --> 00:24:50,160 Speaker 1: and Nancy, these things happened kind of quick. To your point, 365 00:24:50,240 --> 00:24:52,159 Speaker 1: he wouldn't have taken her home and just held her 366 00:24:52,200 --> 00:24:54,560 Speaker 1: there while he went to clock in. So it tells 367 00:24:54,600 --> 00:24:56,800 Speaker 1: me you're right. He was a local. He probably didn't 368 00:24:56,800 --> 00:24:58,720 Speaker 1: have a job if if he did, it was an 369 00:24:58,760 --> 00:25:01,080 Speaker 1: odd job where he didn't at the clock in. Maybe 370 00:25:01,200 --> 00:25:04,520 Speaker 1: landscaping or something like that. Again, this was during the 371 00:25:04,560 --> 00:25:08,960 Speaker 1: warmer months of the year, so uh, definitely not somebody 372 00:25:09,000 --> 00:25:11,679 Speaker 1: that had to be in front of a supervisor or 373 00:25:11,680 --> 00:25:13,840 Speaker 1: where people would be able to give him an alibi. 374 00:25:14,920 --> 00:25:19,640 Speaker 1: Is Nadine's killer and kidnapper Arthur Riam? I'm not sure 375 00:25:19,680 --> 00:25:23,440 Speaker 1: I believe that we are now attributing multiple murders to Raam, 376 00:25:23,960 --> 00:25:28,560 Speaker 1: but we know that he plays mind games behind bars, 377 00:25:28,600 --> 00:25:33,359 Speaker 1: trying to trick police, claiming boasting that he's responsible for 378 00:25:33,480 --> 00:25:38,919 Speaker 1: multiple murders of young girls. But is he claiming he 379 00:25:39,000 --> 00:25:43,760 Speaker 1: considered creating phony maps and false information to give police? 380 00:25:43,800 --> 00:25:47,320 Speaker 1: What is he doing? Is he trying to use perceived 381 00:25:47,400 --> 00:25:50,800 Speaker 1: information to cut a deal to get out of jail early, 382 00:25:51,119 --> 00:25:55,439 Speaker 1: to modify his current sentence in exchange for information. What 383 00:25:55,680 --> 00:26:00,960 Speaker 1: if that information is fake? Why should I believe a pedophile, 384 00:26:01,480 --> 00:26:07,080 Speaker 1: a killer that takes away focus from finding Medine Odell. 385 00:26:07,280 --> 00:26:12,800 Speaker 1: Take a listen to Arthur Reeam in a secretly recorded conversation. 386 00:26:13,320 --> 00:26:15,600 Speaker 1: I mean, you know, the obvious question that people will 387 00:26:15,600 --> 00:26:18,000 Speaker 1: want to know is did you have anything to do 388 00:26:18,080 --> 00:26:20,320 Speaker 1: with these other cases? Did you know any of these girls? 389 00:26:20,400 --> 00:26:23,000 Speaker 1: Did you ever meet any of these girls? And not 390 00:26:23,080 --> 00:26:26,879 Speaker 1: even close, not even a little bit. I've never never 391 00:26:27,000 --> 00:26:29,840 Speaker 1: had anything to do with any of them. There's there's 392 00:26:30,280 --> 00:26:33,800 Speaker 1: absolutely dull connection between me and them at all. You know, 393 00:26:33,800 --> 00:26:38,639 Speaker 1: I only you know other than detective. I'm not the story. 394 00:26:39,200 --> 00:26:41,399 Speaker 1: The detective is the story if you really want to 395 00:26:41,400 --> 00:26:46,080 Speaker 1: if you want a real story, this detective always the 396 00:26:47,240 --> 00:26:50,679 Speaker 1: uh families of the six girls. He owes them a 397 00:26:50,720 --> 00:26:53,760 Speaker 1: big apology for getting their hopes up in this case. 398 00:26:54,080 --> 00:26:58,720 Speaker 1: He owes uh Sydney's family, Sydney's are Ziki's family, a 399 00:26:58,800 --> 00:27:02,480 Speaker 1: big apology for bringing up bad memories. And he was 400 00:27:02,560 --> 00:27:06,280 Speaker 1: men apology for drank it is. And he owes the 401 00:27:06,320 --> 00:27:10,080 Speaker 1: people with Warren an apology presend the kind of money 402 00:27:10,119 --> 00:27:16,280 Speaker 1: that he did. What Arthur Ream is saying that police 403 00:27:16,359 --> 00:27:21,680 Speaker 1: owe him and apology. John Limley Crime Stories investigative reporter, 404 00:27:22,400 --> 00:27:28,040 Speaker 1: he's claiming that they owe him an apology? Is that correct? 405 00:27:28,119 --> 00:27:33,320 Speaker 1: John Limley? More specifically, Reem is saying that police should apologize, 406 00:27:33,320 --> 00:27:37,040 Speaker 1: should apologize to taxpayers for the money that they spent 407 00:27:37,160 --> 00:27:41,000 Speaker 1: on the search, and to the families of the missing girls. Um. 408 00:27:41,119 --> 00:27:44,760 Speaker 1: He states that they owe them a big apology for 409 00:27:44,800 --> 00:27:47,679 Speaker 1: getting their hopes up in the case. Uh. He owes 410 00:27:47,720 --> 00:27:52,680 Speaker 1: Cindy Sarziki's family a huge apology for bringing up bad memories. 411 00:27:52,840 --> 00:27:56,200 Speaker 1: Vincent Hill, did you hear Arthur ream say they the 412 00:27:56,240 --> 00:28:00,480 Speaker 1: police owe him an apology. I heard that, Nancy. I can't. 413 00:28:00,680 --> 00:28:03,320 Speaker 1: I can't believe it, but yeah, I heard it. I 414 00:28:03,359 --> 00:28:06,240 Speaker 1: heard it. I thought I heard that correctly owe him 415 00:28:06,720 --> 00:28:13,240 Speaker 1: an apology. This is a guy with multiple sex attack convictions, 416 00:28:13,640 --> 00:28:18,399 Speaker 1: one murder conviction. He's saying, cops oh him an apology. 417 00:28:18,800 --> 00:28:21,440 Speaker 1: The first thing I want to address. But he also says, 418 00:28:22,000 --> 00:28:26,280 Speaker 1: Cindy Zarzecki's family they found her body, John, Lily, didn't 419 00:28:26,280 --> 00:28:29,239 Speaker 1: they find her body? Right? They found pieces of her 420 00:28:29,280 --> 00:28:32,600 Speaker 1: body and they do say. Uh. And the last thing 421 00:28:32,720 --> 00:28:35,600 Speaker 1: that he Arthur Reem said in this after he talked 422 00:28:35,640 --> 00:28:40,160 Speaker 1: about that essentially the police owed the world an apology, 423 00:28:40,200 --> 00:28:43,720 Speaker 1: he says, they owe me an apology for just getting 424 00:28:43,720 --> 00:28:47,640 Speaker 1: me dragged into this. So Dr Bethany Marshall, he's saying, 425 00:28:47,680 --> 00:28:51,080 Speaker 1: the cops oh him an apology and Cindy Zarziki's family 426 00:28:51,080 --> 00:28:58,000 Speaker 1: and apology. They because of police found Zarzeki's body. Okay 427 00:28:58,080 --> 00:29:04,800 Speaker 1: number one, because the police. But then based on things 428 00:29:04,960 --> 00:29:08,960 Speaker 1: Arthur Rain himself said behind bars, they started looking in 429 00:29:09,000 --> 00:29:13,280 Speaker 1: a general wooded area for the other bodies, including the 430 00:29:13,320 --> 00:29:17,320 Speaker 1: body um Nadine o'dale, which they did not find. In 431 00:29:17,400 --> 00:29:20,720 Speaker 1: a nutshell, if if it can be done, Dr Bethany, 432 00:29:20,800 --> 00:29:23,960 Speaker 1: why would he be so grandiose is to say, cops 433 00:29:24,000 --> 00:29:28,120 Speaker 1: oh him the killer an apology. You already answered the question. 434 00:29:28,320 --> 00:29:32,080 Speaker 1: It's the grandiose grandiosity of that profile and also lack 435 00:29:32,120 --> 00:29:36,280 Speaker 1: of victim empathy. Um, he's not, as you said, concerned 436 00:29:36,280 --> 00:29:39,560 Speaker 1: about the fact that victims have been found. And thirdly, 437 00:29:39,680 --> 00:29:42,640 Speaker 1: he's having his you know, fifteen minutes of fame. I mean, 438 00:29:42,680 --> 00:29:44,680 Speaker 1: this is quite exciting for him. You know, he has 439 00:29:44,720 --> 00:29:46,880 Speaker 1: a pulpit. He's going to give his message to the 440 00:29:46,920 --> 00:29:50,760 Speaker 1: public and um let them know that he knows something 441 00:29:50,760 --> 00:29:53,560 Speaker 1: the police doesn't know. He's like the holder of what's right, 442 00:29:53,640 --> 00:29:57,560 Speaker 1: the holder of morality, and he's going to demand the apology. Well, 443 00:29:57,640 --> 00:30:01,760 Speaker 1: one thing that it's doing is clouding the search for Nadine. O'Dell. 444 00:30:02,400 --> 00:30:05,920 Speaker 1: We are listening to an interview that Rain gives the 445 00:30:05,960 --> 00:30:12,000 Speaker 1: Detroit Free Press. He goes on, this is totally torpedoing 446 00:30:12,040 --> 00:30:15,040 Speaker 1: the search for Nadine. He looked at the crystal ball 447 00:30:15,160 --> 00:30:17,920 Speaker 1: or something, and that's when he went by. He didn't 448 00:30:17,960 --> 00:30:20,400 Speaker 1: he didn't go by anything but the crystal ball. Well, 449 00:30:20,960 --> 00:30:25,720 Speaker 1: he said that you failed a polygraph test. What my 450 00:30:25,880 --> 00:30:33,920 Speaker 1: detector test? A lie detector? What about it? You failed it? 451 00:30:34,040 --> 00:30:37,800 Speaker 1: So he says, yeah, when did you take it? I'll 452 00:30:37,840 --> 00:30:40,280 Speaker 1: take another one if you want. So I'll tell you 453 00:30:40,360 --> 00:30:43,880 Speaker 1: what happened with that. It's a it's a silly thing, 454 00:30:43,920 --> 00:30:45,680 Speaker 1: but it had happened, and I didn't think about it 455 00:30:45,800 --> 00:30:49,800 Speaker 1: till later. Um, when he came up to see me, 456 00:30:49,840 --> 00:30:53,920 Speaker 1: he took a bunch of my property. And what did 457 00:30:53,920 --> 00:30:56,040 Speaker 1: he take? We know where? We know, you know where 458 00:30:56,080 --> 00:30:57,880 Speaker 1: about it are? We want to know blah blah blah, 459 00:30:58,360 --> 00:31:02,440 Speaker 1: Well we shouldn't. I drew a map I tell him 460 00:31:02,480 --> 00:31:06,440 Speaker 1: where he was. So I was so mad at this detective. 461 00:31:06,840 --> 00:31:09,400 Speaker 1: I drew I drew some maps up and I was 462 00:31:09,400 --> 00:31:12,680 Speaker 1: gonna give them to him and let him go do 463 00:31:13,960 --> 00:31:16,320 Speaker 1: I was just gonna have him go date women. They 464 00:31:16,360 --> 00:31:21,480 Speaker 1: made someplace. You know that I do well. When when 465 00:31:21,480 --> 00:31:23,840 Speaker 1: the guy gave me the test, he says, are you 466 00:31:23,880 --> 00:31:27,400 Speaker 1: gonna be honest about these three? And I said yes, 467 00:31:28,280 --> 00:31:30,640 Speaker 1: In reality, I wasn't gonna be because I was going 468 00:31:30,680 --> 00:31:34,960 Speaker 1: to give the detective to the maps. So that's probably 469 00:31:34,960 --> 00:31:37,440 Speaker 1: why I failed it. Now that might not be why, 470 00:31:37,560 --> 00:31:40,440 Speaker 1: but you know that's that's the only reason I could think. 471 00:31:40,480 --> 00:31:44,760 Speaker 1: I'm not a dumb person, and I would have never 472 00:31:45,480 --> 00:31:49,040 Speaker 1: taken that potograph if I thought there was one chance 473 00:31:49,040 --> 00:31:51,800 Speaker 1: that I would have failed it. He is grandy. I 474 00:31:51,920 --> 00:31:55,960 Speaker 1: was talking about how he's not dumb that he thought 475 00:31:55,960 --> 00:31:58,600 Speaker 1: he was going to fail. But maybe the reason he 476 00:31:58,680 --> 00:32:02,800 Speaker 1: failed is because he was playing in to give detectives 477 00:32:03,000 --> 00:32:09,280 Speaker 1: phony maps. Vincent Hill, why should we believe anything this 478 00:32:09,320 --> 00:32:13,360 Speaker 1: guy has to say because he's planning, as you heard, 479 00:32:13,760 --> 00:32:18,520 Speaker 1: to have cops go dig quote Willie Nilly. Yeah, we 480 00:32:18,560 --> 00:32:21,920 Speaker 1: shouldn't believe anything this guy says. I mean, he says 481 00:32:21,960 --> 00:32:24,200 Speaker 1: the reason he failed the polygraph test is because he 482 00:32:24,280 --> 00:32:26,680 Speaker 1: knew he was going to lie to the police. So 483 00:32:27,080 --> 00:32:29,800 Speaker 1: I mean, who would even take anything this guy says, 484 00:32:29,960 --> 00:32:32,840 Speaker 1: not only as to the truth, but as serious you 485 00:32:32,880 --> 00:32:36,840 Speaker 1: know it. Just mind what about a Dr Bethany. But 486 00:32:37,400 --> 00:32:40,040 Speaker 1: I think he's actually proud of himself that he lied 487 00:32:40,040 --> 00:32:43,360 Speaker 1: about one thing rather than another. Remember we were talking 488 00:32:43,400 --> 00:32:46,880 Speaker 1: recently about the bp K killer and how he bragged 489 00:32:46,880 --> 00:32:49,840 Speaker 1: in court that he comforted one of his victims before 490 00:32:49,920 --> 00:32:52,360 Speaker 1: he killed her, and he thought that they would be 491 00:32:52,400 --> 00:32:54,920 Speaker 1: proud of him, like he deserved a big reward or 492 00:32:54,960 --> 00:32:58,800 Speaker 1: applause for that. Now now he deserves applause because you know, 493 00:32:58,920 --> 00:33:01,400 Speaker 1: it's not that he killed somebody. She all he was 494 00:33:01,480 --> 00:33:04,080 Speaker 1: doing was just giving them fake maps. I mean, isn't 495 00:33:04,120 --> 00:33:07,000 Speaker 1: that clever? So I think he actually thinks people are 496 00:33:07,120 --> 00:33:09,920 Speaker 1: going to be amused by him. He goes on to say, 497 00:33:09,960 --> 00:33:11,920 Speaker 1: to be honest with you, on one hand, I was 498 00:33:12,040 --> 00:33:15,640 Speaker 1: laughing my A s s off. On the other hand, 499 00:33:15,840 --> 00:33:19,000 Speaker 1: I was piste off. So take it for what it is. 500 00:33:19,560 --> 00:33:23,160 Speaker 1: There's nobodies there that I know of after getting all 501 00:33:23,200 --> 00:33:27,640 Speaker 1: the families upset. But you know what, I won't say. 502 00:33:27,760 --> 00:33:30,080 Speaker 1: Let's listen to Raymond his own words. Do you know 503 00:33:30,120 --> 00:33:37,000 Speaker 1: everybody else who's buried? No? So the only person I 504 00:33:37,000 --> 00:33:40,160 Speaker 1: have ever buried in my own life, and I didn't 505 00:33:40,240 --> 00:33:43,959 Speaker 1: kill nobody in my old lind Okay, I didn't kill 506 00:33:44,000 --> 00:33:45,920 Speaker 1: anybody in my whole life, And the only person I 507 00:33:45,960 --> 00:33:49,560 Speaker 1: ever buried was Cindy. Well, Cindy was dead when he 508 00:33:49,720 --> 00:33:53,720 Speaker 1: buried her. John Limley, Crime Stories investigative reporter. How is 509 00:33:53,760 --> 00:33:56,560 Speaker 1: he explained what he found her dead and then buried her? 510 00:33:57,120 --> 00:33:59,960 Speaker 1: Isn't it true he lured I think she's about twelve 511 00:34:00,080 --> 00:34:05,840 Speaker 1: years old. Little Cindy's or ZEKEI. She had a little 512 00:34:05,880 --> 00:34:09,680 Speaker 1: boyfriend who was rem Son, and he told her that 513 00:34:09,760 --> 00:34:12,720 Speaker 1: they were planning a surprise birthday party at the local dairy. 514 00:34:12,840 --> 00:34:17,759 Speaker 1: Queen lured her out of the home and then she disappeared. 515 00:34:18,480 --> 00:34:21,239 Speaker 1: She was found buried in that area, in the same 516 00:34:21,320 --> 00:34:24,960 Speaker 1: little with the same little purse and Mary Jane. She used, 517 00:34:25,680 --> 00:34:27,799 Speaker 1: So what is his story about how she got there? 518 00:34:27,880 --> 00:34:29,759 Speaker 1: She just dropped over dad and he buried her. He 519 00:34:29,840 --> 00:34:34,440 Speaker 1: said that her death was accidental and that the only 520 00:34:34,880 --> 00:34:38,640 Speaker 1: crime he committed was actually trying to cover up her 521 00:34:38,719 --> 00:34:42,920 Speaker 1: death by burying her. He is just playing mind games 522 00:34:43,400 --> 00:34:47,960 Speaker 1: in such an evil way. Vincent Hill, private investigator, What 523 00:34:48,080 --> 00:34:51,640 Speaker 1: do you think this does to Nadine O'Dell's family? For 524 00:34:51,719 --> 00:34:55,040 Speaker 1: him to suggest he knows where Nadine's body is, and 525 00:34:55,120 --> 00:34:57,960 Speaker 1: it's all just a big lie. It's just slapping the 526 00:34:58,040 --> 00:35:01,760 Speaker 1: face Nancy. I mean, I couldn't imagine being her family 527 00:35:01,800 --> 00:35:04,480 Speaker 1: after so long of looking for your loved one that 528 00:35:04,600 --> 00:35:09,359 Speaker 1: this guy's like, yeah, I'm just whatever, just so nonchalant 529 00:35:09,360 --> 00:35:11,680 Speaker 1: and noncaring about it. It is a total slap in 530 00:35:11,719 --> 00:35:14,400 Speaker 1: the face to the family. Take a listen, what have 531 00:35:14,520 --> 00:35:19,839 Speaker 1: you heard about that? Dig Oh? I haven't heard much 532 00:35:19,840 --> 00:35:22,160 Speaker 1: of my I haven't got my TV back yet. So 533 00:35:22,480 --> 00:35:25,000 Speaker 1: you know, when they moved, I watched it a couple 534 00:35:25,040 --> 00:35:29,160 Speaker 1: of times on the TV. Uh. To be honest with John, 535 00:35:29,239 --> 00:35:31,400 Speaker 1: one hand, I was laughing my ass off, and on 536 00:35:31,440 --> 00:35:33,840 Speaker 1: the other hand, I was piste off. So you know, 537 00:35:33,920 --> 00:35:35,440 Speaker 1: you tell it from what it is. You know there 538 00:35:36,000 --> 00:35:39,400 Speaker 1: there's no bodies here that I know, love, So they 539 00:35:39,680 --> 00:35:42,480 Speaker 1: they till when it comes a home and I already 540 00:35:42,480 --> 00:35:45,600 Speaker 1: know what he's gonna say. When they don't find up there. 541 00:35:46,640 --> 00:35:48,600 Speaker 1: That detective is going to turn it out and say, well, 542 00:35:49,040 --> 00:35:52,040 Speaker 1: we have other studies that we're looking at right now. 543 00:35:52,560 --> 00:35:54,239 Speaker 1: You know, I already know how how this is going 544 00:35:54,280 --> 00:35:57,040 Speaker 1: to play out. You know what I mean, This detective 545 00:35:57,120 --> 00:36:00,319 Speaker 1: he's not going to give up, so you know he's 546 00:36:00,560 --> 00:36:03,680 Speaker 1: just gonna keep on saying, well, yeah, uh, we had 547 00:36:03,719 --> 00:36:06,560 Speaker 1: other sights, or like when he when he couldn't find 548 00:36:06,560 --> 00:36:09,600 Speaker 1: anything here? Are you so sure he was gonna find something? 549 00:36:09,719 --> 00:36:13,719 Speaker 1: This second almost mocking the detectives. And did you hear 550 00:36:13,800 --> 00:36:17,720 Speaker 1: the part I haven't seen my TV in a few days. 551 00:36:18,760 --> 00:36:22,160 Speaker 1: This guy is sitting back, as he says, laughing his 552 00:36:22,320 --> 00:36:27,360 Speaker 1: ass off at detectives watching his cable TV. How do 553 00:36:27,440 --> 00:36:31,120 Speaker 1: you think that makes Nadine O'Dell's family feel. He's watching 554 00:36:31,160 --> 00:36:33,640 Speaker 1: our coverage. I want to come see him? What would 555 00:36:33,640 --> 00:36:35,759 Speaker 1: you say? I want to come see him? Because you 556 00:36:35,800 --> 00:36:40,200 Speaker 1: know what if Needin is here? If Needin is here 557 00:36:40,440 --> 00:36:42,680 Speaker 1: and I looked like her so much, how does it 558 00:36:42,719 --> 00:36:45,360 Speaker 1: feel for the dead to look at you in the 559 00:36:45,440 --> 00:36:49,880 Speaker 1: face you ain't seeing crazy? I'm coming for you to 560 00:36:50,000 --> 00:36:52,040 Speaker 1: be honest with John, one hand, I was laughing my 561 00:36:52,040 --> 00:36:54,439 Speaker 1: aunts off, and on the other hand, I was piste off. 562 00:36:54,640 --> 00:36:56,640 Speaker 1: So you know, you tell it from what it is. 563 00:36:56,719 --> 00:36:58,880 Speaker 1: You know that that there's no bodies here that I 564 00:36:58,920 --> 00:37:03,760 Speaker 1: know of. Dr Anny Marshall, l a psychoanalyst, Dr Bethany. 565 00:37:04,000 --> 00:37:07,759 Speaker 1: In a way it reminds me of hannibal lecture and 566 00:37:07,880 --> 00:37:13,680 Speaker 1: silence in the lambs. Not that this the killer Arthur 567 00:37:13,760 --> 00:37:19,440 Speaker 1: Reims anywhere near the the mental capacity of lecture, but 568 00:37:20,480 --> 00:37:26,800 Speaker 1: the grandiocity, the big man on campus. He's got the knowledge. 569 00:37:27,160 --> 00:37:30,880 Speaker 1: He's walking back and forth to the chow line every day. 570 00:37:30,920 --> 00:37:34,200 Speaker 1: All the other inmates know he's playing the police. He's 571 00:37:34,239 --> 00:37:41,080 Speaker 1: getting pressed. I mean, he's the man right now, you know, Nancy, 572 00:37:41,440 --> 00:37:44,719 Speaker 1: what I was listening just now to his voice. He 573 00:37:44,880 --> 00:37:49,360 Speaker 1: actually I think he fancies himself like a news anchor 574 00:37:49,480 --> 00:37:52,440 Speaker 1: or a news announcer. He says it like he's delivering 575 00:37:52,480 --> 00:37:56,400 Speaker 1: the evening news, like you know, he's talking about, you know, 576 00:37:56,440 --> 00:37:59,320 Speaker 1: what's going to happen with the detectives, and he's making 577 00:37:59,360 --> 00:38:03,760 Speaker 1: like social comments on whether the resources should have been spent, 578 00:38:03,960 --> 00:38:07,680 Speaker 1: and you know, looking in that particular place. I think 579 00:38:07,719 --> 00:38:11,640 Speaker 1: he feels when you see grandiosity, I think he feels 580 00:38:11,760 --> 00:38:16,720 Speaker 1: that he's calling the shots. He's like calling the game. 581 00:38:16,960 --> 00:38:21,880 Speaker 1: He's like the radio announcer. Um. It's really kind of creepy. 582 00:38:22,280 --> 00:38:27,000 Speaker 1: And he actually believes that people care whether or not 583 00:38:27,040 --> 00:38:30,319 Speaker 1: he has his TV. That's how grandios he is, Like 584 00:38:30,480 --> 00:38:32,879 Speaker 1: we care if he has his TV in hisself right 585 00:38:32,880 --> 00:38:36,280 Speaker 1: now they search for a teen girl who goes missing 586 00:38:36,560 --> 00:38:39,880 Speaker 1: en route to a babysitting job. She's on foot in Nadine. 587 00:38:39,920 --> 00:38:46,160 Speaker 1: O'Dell has been clouded by known child rapist, known killer 588 00:38:46,920 --> 00:38:52,680 Speaker 1: Arthur Reem, and now he's sitting grandios behind bars giving interviews. 589 00:38:52,680 --> 00:38:55,520 Speaker 1: Here he is speaking to the Detroit Free Press. You 590 00:38:55,600 --> 00:38:57,960 Speaker 1: have kind of a reputation some of the police others 591 00:38:57,960 --> 00:39:00,720 Speaker 1: have said that you like to kind of play with people, 592 00:39:00,800 --> 00:39:02,960 Speaker 1: to mess with their minds and stuff like that. Is 593 00:39:02,960 --> 00:39:07,239 Speaker 1: that fair or accurate? Yeah? Yeah, yeah, yeah, why not? 594 00:39:07,360 --> 00:39:10,560 Speaker 1: You know, I mean, I don't hurt anybody with it. 595 00:39:10,680 --> 00:39:12,880 Speaker 1: You know, I don't get carried away. That's what I 596 00:39:12,960 --> 00:39:15,360 Speaker 1: was saying this detective. I was going to give me 597 00:39:15,480 --> 00:39:19,560 Speaker 1: those those phony maps, you know, But like I said, 598 00:39:19,600 --> 00:39:23,239 Speaker 1: then I changed my mind. But you know, did you 599 00:39:23,280 --> 00:39:25,359 Speaker 1: tell anybody you were gonna make phony maps for him, 600 00:39:25,400 --> 00:39:27,719 Speaker 1: or that you were gonna make mad I didn't say 601 00:39:27,760 --> 00:39:32,000 Speaker 1: nothing to all about it. Yeah, okay, So to be clear, 602 00:39:32,040 --> 00:39:36,520 Speaker 1: you never wrote any maps or anything like that. No, No, no, 603 00:39:37,239 --> 00:39:40,239 Speaker 1: there's Arthur ream I mean John Limley Crime Stories Investigative 604 00:39:40,239 --> 00:39:45,040 Speaker 1: report of the whole reason police did this intensive dig, 605 00:39:45,080 --> 00:39:49,719 Speaker 1: this excavation for these missing girls, including Nadin o'dale, was 606 00:39:49,800 --> 00:39:55,280 Speaker 1: because of what Arthur Reims said exactly. And another contradiction 607 00:39:55,840 --> 00:39:59,560 Speaker 1: is that while in prison, Reem reportedly told cell mates 608 00:39:59,719 --> 00:40:04,080 Speaker 1: that he was a serial killer. As we've just heard earlier, 609 00:40:04,200 --> 00:40:07,680 Speaker 1: he said he hadn't killed anyone. He buried someone, but 610 00:40:07,760 --> 00:40:11,040 Speaker 1: he said he didn't kill anyone, and he claimed he 611 00:40:11,080 --> 00:40:13,960 Speaker 1: claimed to this cell mate that he had killed four 612 00:40:14,040 --> 00:40:17,600 Speaker 1: to six victims. We also know he failed a polygraph test. 613 00:40:17,920 --> 00:40:20,880 Speaker 1: I mean, the really, the only hope to Vincent Hill, 614 00:40:20,960 --> 00:40:24,920 Speaker 1: private an investigator, is that somehow, based on all of 615 00:40:24,960 --> 00:40:27,839 Speaker 1: these interviews he's giving we're listening right now to one too, 616 00:40:28,000 --> 00:40:31,200 Speaker 1: he gave to Detroit Free Press, that we can somehow 617 00:40:31,320 --> 00:40:35,600 Speaker 1: glean the whereabouts if he is connected to the other girls, 618 00:40:35,640 --> 00:40:39,600 Speaker 1: and hope they're in another jurisdiction, because in Michigan he 619 00:40:39,680 --> 00:40:42,000 Speaker 1: can kill all the little girls he wants to and 620 00:40:42,040 --> 00:40:44,080 Speaker 1: never get the death penalty. Yeah, that's right. But the 621 00:40:45,200 --> 00:40:47,640 Speaker 1: nice thing about this is there's always a clue when 622 00:40:47,760 --> 00:40:51,200 Speaker 1: every time this guy speaks Nancy, there's always a clue 623 00:40:51,200 --> 00:40:54,319 Speaker 1: that he's going to release two investigators. Whether he knows 624 00:40:54,360 --> 00:40:56,960 Speaker 1: it or not. These guys are trained. This is their job. 625 00:40:57,400 --> 00:41:00,880 Speaker 1: To find this information. So let him keep talking because 626 00:41:01,120 --> 00:41:02,600 Speaker 1: it's going to lead to what we need to know. 627 00:41:02,960 --> 00:41:06,680 Speaker 1: Then let's listen. Warren police said you brabbed about killing 628 00:41:06,719 --> 00:41:09,880 Speaker 1: full to six people while in prison. Yeah, I'd like 629 00:41:09,960 --> 00:41:14,320 Speaker 1: to know who I brake to. That true, I've never 630 00:41:14,600 --> 00:41:19,399 Speaker 1: I've never said that to anybody. Where do you think 631 00:41:19,400 --> 00:41:23,920 Speaker 1: they could be getting that from? Well, let me put 632 00:41:23,920 --> 00:41:27,280 Speaker 1: it this way. The two to the detectors from Warren, 633 00:41:28,560 --> 00:41:31,480 Speaker 1: assuming naturally was came up here, we're not here, but 634 00:41:31,600 --> 00:41:35,120 Speaker 1: mus Kegan called people off the yard. They don't even 635 00:41:35,160 --> 00:41:40,000 Speaker 1: know me. I've never talked to in my life, offering 636 00:41:40,080 --> 00:41:43,279 Speaker 1: a thousand dollars if they could get me to tell 637 00:41:43,320 --> 00:41:48,879 Speaker 1: them where bodies are. Now, I don't think that was right. 638 00:41:50,320 --> 00:41:52,399 Speaker 1: That that's guys are coming to me and saying, hey, 639 00:41:53,239 --> 00:41:56,960 Speaker 1: I got interviewed about you, and I'm saying what, I 640 00:41:57,040 --> 00:41:59,720 Speaker 1: don't even know you. But they ever made thousand dollars 641 00:41:59,719 --> 00:42:06,040 Speaker 1: if I didn't. He doesn't think that's right. To John Limley, 642 00:42:06,200 --> 00:42:09,440 Speaker 1: Crime Stories investigative reporter explain how this is going down? 643 00:42:09,680 --> 00:42:12,360 Speaker 1: What do you mean? He doesn't think it's right that 644 00:42:12,520 --> 00:42:16,480 Speaker 1: police order inmates thousand dollar rewards, if that's even true, 645 00:42:16,920 --> 00:42:21,720 Speaker 1: in exchange for verifiable information is to where dead bodies 646 00:42:21,760 --> 00:42:24,600 Speaker 1: of little girls are hidden? Why is that wrong? It 647 00:42:24,680 --> 00:42:27,960 Speaker 1: did that really happen? John Limley? His claim is that 648 00:42:28,440 --> 00:42:33,360 Speaker 1: these inmates will they'll say anything to get their hands 649 00:42:34,200 --> 00:42:38,399 Speaker 1: on maybe less prison time, to get money. Uh, he's 650 00:42:38,440 --> 00:42:41,120 Speaker 1: saying it's only in their best interest to make up 651 00:42:41,160 --> 00:42:44,640 Speaker 1: a story. Now, he has said repeatedly that he has 652 00:42:44,719 --> 00:42:51,160 Speaker 1: never killed anyone. Listen to this ridiculous explanation of how 653 00:42:51,239 --> 00:43:01,799 Speaker 1: little Cindy Zeki died. Detail. Okay, I mean, yeah, was 654 00:43:01,840 --> 00:43:08,879 Speaker 1: it my warehouse? They were on some carpet, she fell, 655 00:43:10,480 --> 00:43:18,200 Speaker 1: I went backwards down the elevator shoot and died. I'm responsible. 656 00:43:18,480 --> 00:43:22,520 Speaker 1: The reason why I'm responsible is because I wired the 657 00:43:22,560 --> 00:43:26,080 Speaker 1: gate up. You know, if the gate was down where 658 00:43:26,080 --> 00:43:28,720 Speaker 1: it was supposed to be, she would have never fallen, 659 00:43:29,280 --> 00:43:32,319 Speaker 1: you know what I mean. So I'm responsible for her 660 00:43:32,360 --> 00:43:37,200 Speaker 1: death because I weared the gate up, you know, so 661 00:43:37,640 --> 00:43:40,080 Speaker 1: I would have to be up and down, up and down. 662 00:43:41,520 --> 00:43:43,680 Speaker 1: But why did she go to your warehouse? I mean 663 00:43:43,719 --> 00:43:45,440 Speaker 1: she was going to the dairy queen, I thought, because 664 00:43:45,480 --> 00:43:48,600 Speaker 1: that's where that's our day whole time. That was my 665 00:43:48,719 --> 00:43:52,520 Speaker 1: son's girlfriend. So you're saying Stott was there at the 666 00:43:52,560 --> 00:44:00,160 Speaker 1: time too, right, I wasn't there, you know, So then 667 00:44:00,160 --> 00:44:02,840 Speaker 1: you got to read the paper. I don't have the paper. 668 00:44:02,880 --> 00:44:06,879 Speaker 1: That's why I have to ask you. Sorry. So then 669 00:44:07,000 --> 00:44:10,319 Speaker 1: he uh so, now she she falls down, there, she dies, 670 00:44:10,440 --> 00:44:12,479 Speaker 1: then you come and try to clean up the mess. 671 00:44:12,520 --> 00:44:14,760 Speaker 1: Is that? Is that what happened? He called me instead 672 00:44:14,800 --> 00:44:16,640 Speaker 1: of nine one one. I was here to call nine 673 00:44:16,719 --> 00:44:19,000 Speaker 1: one one to tell me, but you know me, I 674 00:44:19,080 --> 00:44:24,040 Speaker 1: fix everything, So you know, he called me instead. So 675 00:44:24,080 --> 00:44:25,839 Speaker 1: I get there. I could see she was dead right 676 00:44:25,840 --> 00:44:29,960 Speaker 1: from the get you know, he's screaming. I mean, I 677 00:44:30,000 --> 00:44:33,920 Speaker 1: don't know what to do. I just started my business, 678 00:44:33,920 --> 00:44:37,200 Speaker 1: you know, it's just it's just started going good. I 679 00:44:37,280 --> 00:44:41,920 Speaker 1: got no insurance, you know, on on nothing. But so 680 00:44:42,080 --> 00:44:45,960 Speaker 1: I panicked. Now I panicked, he's panicked, you know, so 681 00:44:46,120 --> 00:44:49,080 Speaker 1: what to do? What to do? And I ended up 682 00:44:49,320 --> 00:44:53,560 Speaker 1: making the decision that I made. It was probably the 683 00:44:53,600 --> 00:44:56,600 Speaker 1: worst decision I ever made my life, but I made it. 684 00:44:56,960 --> 00:45:02,040 Speaker 1: And here I am so what she so this idea 685 00:45:02,080 --> 00:45:04,120 Speaker 1: that she was raped before she was killed? Is that 686 00:45:04,280 --> 00:45:09,040 Speaker 1: is that? Fall? No? I mean, where did you get 687 00:45:09,080 --> 00:45:12,120 Speaker 1: that from? Where put that out there? You know? The 688 00:45:12,160 --> 00:45:15,880 Speaker 1: prosecutor of the out there. You know that's for a show. 689 00:45:16,440 --> 00:45:19,640 Speaker 1: Everything everything is for show, you know, saying like I'm saying, 690 00:45:19,680 --> 00:45:21,879 Speaker 1: you can't sell a newspapers, don't make it me look 691 00:45:21,960 --> 00:45:26,359 Speaker 1: a bad guy. Is it possible? Everybody wants what's worth. 692 00:45:26,960 --> 00:45:30,040 Speaker 1: They don't want to know that Sydney died accidentally. It 693 00:45:30,080 --> 00:45:34,160 Speaker 1: would have never made the newspaper. You know, they want, 694 00:45:34,239 --> 00:45:39,440 Speaker 1: they want sensession with them, they want they want at all. 695 00:45:40,440 --> 00:45:42,080 Speaker 1: So why do you think they've come back to you? 696 00:45:42,200 --> 00:45:44,680 Speaker 1: Why do you think they targeted you with these with 697 00:45:44,800 --> 00:45:48,760 Speaker 1: these additional murders. You have to ask a guy from Warren, 698 00:45:49,120 --> 00:45:54,160 Speaker 1: I don't know, you know, I just don't understand it myself. 699 00:45:54,520 --> 00:45:57,400 Speaker 1: You know where he where he comes off thinking that 700 00:45:57,520 --> 00:46:02,239 Speaker 1: I killed those six girls behind the genius, you know, 701 00:46:06,400 --> 00:46:10,120 Speaker 1: thirty year old cases. In one way, he's got to 702 00:46:10,160 --> 00:46:13,200 Speaker 1: get a Nobel peace price. You are listening to convicted 703 00:46:13,280 --> 00:46:16,680 Speaker 1: killer behind bars, Arthur Reem, who was apparently the leading 704 00:46:16,760 --> 00:46:19,680 Speaker 1: place on a wild goose chase in the search for 705 00:46:19,719 --> 00:46:24,320 Speaker 1: the body, among others, of Nadine O'Dell, muddying the water 706 00:46:24,600 --> 00:46:28,560 Speaker 1: in her investigation the Search for Nadine. Let me ask 707 00:46:28,640 --> 00:46:33,839 Speaker 1: you this to Bethany Marshall, do you notice when he's 708 00:46:34,000 --> 00:46:39,200 Speaker 1: coming up with a story about how Cindy Zarzeki fell 709 00:46:39,239 --> 00:46:42,880 Speaker 1: down an elevator shaft and died, as opposed to earlier 710 00:46:42,880 --> 00:46:46,920 Speaker 1: when he was speaking so rapidly and so full of 711 00:46:47,719 --> 00:46:52,080 Speaker 1: piss and vinegar. Now he pauses as he's trying to 712 00:46:52,120 --> 00:46:55,200 Speaker 1: come up with the story. You know, I could notice that, 713 00:46:55,360 --> 00:47:02,560 Speaker 1: and he's pretending to be thoughtful, like he's actually offering 714 00:47:02,600 --> 00:47:09,080 Speaker 1: people something. You know, Nancy, criminals are such children, their babies. 715 00:47:09,239 --> 00:47:13,440 Speaker 1: They're very childlike in their behavior. And I don't know 716 00:47:13,480 --> 00:47:17,720 Speaker 1: if you notice. Remember when um Lucy and John David 717 00:47:17,760 --> 00:47:21,160 Speaker 1: were really little, they would do one tiny little thing 718 00:47:21,280 --> 00:47:23,959 Speaker 1: for you and they would act like they've done so much. 719 00:47:24,360 --> 00:47:26,759 Speaker 1: And that's appropriate for children, Like they might bring you 720 00:47:26,800 --> 00:47:30,000 Speaker 1: a Mother's Day card and they feel like, you know, 721 00:47:30,160 --> 00:47:33,600 Speaker 1: they have just given you the world, or they might 722 00:47:33,640 --> 00:47:35,839 Speaker 1: pick up a dish from the table and they feel 723 00:47:35,840 --> 00:47:38,719 Speaker 1: like they've they're so proud of themselves, almost as if 724 00:47:38,719 --> 00:47:42,800 Speaker 1: they've cleaned the entire house. Well, that's appropriate for children 725 00:47:42,800 --> 00:47:47,320 Speaker 1: at that developmental age. But sociat paths will drop tiny 726 00:47:47,360 --> 00:47:51,160 Speaker 1: little bits of information and then they feel like they've 727 00:47:51,160 --> 00:47:55,640 Speaker 1: helped others so much. They've been so wonderful. They they 728 00:47:55,680 --> 00:47:58,560 Speaker 1: deserve all this praise. So I think the way he's 729 00:47:58,600 --> 00:48:01,520 Speaker 1: telling the story, he's really quite proud of himself, like 730 00:48:01,600 --> 00:48:06,120 Speaker 1: he's entertaining people, helping people, like he's he's he's really 731 00:48:06,160 --> 00:48:09,120 Speaker 1: the the boss. There was the big man, like you 732 00:48:09,160 --> 00:48:12,920 Speaker 1: said earlier. You know, I also notice, and I guess 733 00:48:12,920 --> 00:48:16,640 Speaker 1: this is common, Vincent Hill. We've dealt with so many criminals. 734 00:48:17,520 --> 00:48:20,040 Speaker 1: He blames everybody else. First of all, he's blaming the 735 00:48:20,080 --> 00:48:23,640 Speaker 1: investigators and actually he says, quote laughing my ass off, 736 00:48:24,320 --> 00:48:27,000 Speaker 1: and he blames them, saying they've they've dragged me in 737 00:48:27,120 --> 00:48:30,080 Speaker 1: on this thing. Well, I guess so. Then he blames 738 00:48:30,120 --> 00:48:32,960 Speaker 1: the inmates for speaking to the police, and he blames 739 00:48:33,000 --> 00:48:36,600 Speaker 1: police for offering rewards for information about where the little 740 00:48:36,600 --> 00:48:43,880 Speaker 1: girl's bodies are hidden. Then he blames his own son, Okay, 741 00:48:43,920 --> 00:48:47,719 Speaker 1: for not calling nine on one and calling him. He 742 00:48:47,840 --> 00:48:56,600 Speaker 1: blames everybody else but himself. Vincent, is that common amongst 743 00:48:56,760 --> 00:49:00,080 Speaker 1: died in the Wold criminals? It's so common. But know, 744 00:49:00,200 --> 00:49:03,040 Speaker 1: there's this word that's been out for quite a while now. 745 00:49:03,080 --> 00:49:06,359 Speaker 1: It's called evidence. And these police didn't just stumble upon 746 00:49:06,480 --> 00:49:08,919 Speaker 1: this guy and just make this story up. You heard 747 00:49:08,920 --> 00:49:14,040 Speaker 1: he said they wanted to do it because people like sensation. Well, yes, 748 00:49:14,120 --> 00:49:17,719 Speaker 1: people like sensation, but police, we like evidence, and the 749 00:49:17,880 --> 00:49:22,000 Speaker 1: evidence points to him. That's why they're focused on him. 750 00:49:22,160 --> 00:49:25,560 Speaker 1: And is it true, John Limley Crime Stories investigative reporter 751 00:49:25,640 --> 00:49:29,200 Speaker 1: that police are now searching other areas for Nadine and 752 00:49:29,280 --> 00:49:33,120 Speaker 1: other bodies. That is the truth. They have moved on 753 00:49:33,360 --> 00:49:38,040 Speaker 1: from that original search area after not finding any more 754 00:49:38,080 --> 00:49:41,520 Speaker 1: evidence that there are more bodies in that area. They 755 00:49:41,560 --> 00:49:45,279 Speaker 1: have not named the exact areas for obvious reasons, but 756 00:49:45,719 --> 00:49:49,760 Speaker 1: they have now expanded their search. Well, Arthur ream is 757 00:49:50,400 --> 00:49:55,400 Speaker 1: taking focus away from finding Nadine O'Dell, but one person 758 00:49:55,480 --> 00:49:59,040 Speaker 1: remains focused on finding her. Listen to the final chapter 759 00:50:00,320 --> 00:50:01,960 Speaker 1: and I know what. We keeps saying that too, but 760 00:50:02,600 --> 00:50:09,120 Speaker 1: it is this across it. I keep saying this, and 761 00:50:09,200 --> 00:50:11,040 Speaker 1: on one day she was there. Unless this she was gone. 762 00:50:11,719 --> 00:50:14,759 Speaker 1: That's why I can't leave your tipline three one, three, 763 00:50:15,160 --> 00:50:20,600 Speaker 1: five six, three nine eight five zero. The search for 764 00:50:21,120 --> 00:50:27,120 Speaker 1: Nadine O'Dell goes on. Nancy Grace Crime Stories signing off, 765 00:50:27,960 --> 00:50:35,279 Speaker 1: goodbye friend. There's a brand new website causing a lot 766 00:50:35,320 --> 00:50:37,880 Speaker 1: of trouble for people with something to hide. Have you 767 00:50:37,880 --> 00:50:40,440 Speaker 1: ever had a bad feeling about somebody, suspect that a 768 00:50:40,520 --> 00:50:44,719 Speaker 1: partner of cheating, worried about your online reputation. If you 769 00:50:44,800 --> 00:50:48,080 Speaker 1: answer yes to any of those questions, you may need 770 00:50:48,200 --> 00:50:54,160 Speaker 1: truth Finder. 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