WEBVTT - Gary Koch

0:00:01.440 --> 0:00:03.519
<v Speaker 1>It's see some of the much podcast. I'm your host.

0:00:03.560 --> 0:00:06.160
<v Speaker 1>Claude Harmon, my guest this week, is a six time

0:00:06.200 --> 0:00:09.360
<v Speaker 1>winner on the PGA Tour, won the Payne Stewart Award

0:00:09.480 --> 0:00:12.200
<v Speaker 1>in twenty twenty three, and has been the voice of

0:00:12.800 --> 0:00:15.480
<v Speaker 1>basically the voice of golf for you know, really since

0:00:15.560 --> 0:00:17.959
<v Speaker 1>the nineties. Gary Man, it was good to have you

0:00:18.000 --> 0:00:21.360
<v Speaker 1>back on TV. I know it's only brief these days,

0:00:21.360 --> 0:00:25.000
<v Speaker 1>but as someone that loved your work and stuff, I mean,

0:00:25.160 --> 0:00:27.360
<v Speaker 1>we miss you, man, the fans miss you being on TV,

0:00:27.440 --> 0:00:30.480
<v Speaker 1>and it was great to have you back. Well.

0:00:31.200 --> 0:00:33.800
<v Speaker 2>I appreciate that. First of all, thank you very much

0:00:33.840 --> 0:00:36.600
<v Speaker 2>for the compliments. You know, I tell a lot of

0:00:36.640 --> 0:00:40.800
<v Speaker 2>people it's fun getting to come back and call the

0:00:40.840 --> 0:00:44.440
<v Speaker 2>golf and talk about golf. But the really fun part

0:00:44.520 --> 0:00:46.920
<v Speaker 2>for me is to come back and see the people

0:00:47.600 --> 0:00:50.080
<v Speaker 2>when you're no longer there, and a part of it

0:00:51.040 --> 0:00:54.120
<v Speaker 2>you start to reflect. And you know, I played for

0:00:54.400 --> 0:00:57.800
<v Speaker 2>sixteen years and I did television for close to thirty two.

0:00:59.040 --> 0:01:00.920
<v Speaker 2>In that period of time, I mean you make a

0:01:00.920 --> 0:01:06.479
<v Speaker 2>lot of friends, players, caddies, instructors, tour officials, tournament directors,

0:01:06.920 --> 0:01:09.440
<v Speaker 2>you know, so forth and so on. Then all of

0:01:09.480 --> 0:01:12.280
<v Speaker 2>a sudden when you're not there, you realize that was

0:01:12.319 --> 0:01:15.240
<v Speaker 2>the only time you got to see people. So coming

0:01:15.280 --> 0:01:18.920
<v Speaker 2>back players this year of Al's bar Us open great

0:01:18.959 --> 0:01:21.680
<v Speaker 2>opportunity for me to catch up, see a lot of

0:01:21.720 --> 0:01:24.200
<v Speaker 2>folks that I don't get to see anymore, check on

0:01:24.280 --> 0:01:27.640
<v Speaker 2>how they're doing and what's going on, and.

0:01:26.880 --> 0:01:28.800
<v Speaker 3>That to me is probably my favorite part.

0:01:29.200 --> 0:01:31.200
<v Speaker 1>You know, I don't think people realize that, aren't you

0:01:31.200 --> 0:01:33.200
<v Speaker 1>know part of you know, the tour like we are

0:01:33.280 --> 0:01:35.520
<v Speaker 1>and how much a part of our lives it's been

0:01:36.040 --> 0:01:39.000
<v Speaker 1>that it is one big, kind of giant traveling circus,

0:01:39.040 --> 0:01:42.360
<v Speaker 1>from the players every single week, to the caddies every

0:01:42.360 --> 0:01:45.080
<v Speaker 1>single week, to people like me on the back end,

0:01:45.120 --> 0:01:47.680
<v Speaker 1>the agents, and then you know, when you do television,

0:01:47.880 --> 0:01:50.960
<v Speaker 1>you know, I mean I did Sky Sky Sports Golf

0:01:51.000 --> 0:01:53.600
<v Speaker 1>for a number of years. The bonds that you make

0:01:53.680 --> 0:01:56.360
<v Speaker 1>with the crew and the television people that you work

0:01:56.960 --> 0:01:59.720
<v Speaker 1>day in and day out, I mean, I still I

0:01:59.760 --> 0:02:01.800
<v Speaker 1>got has to do some sky over the last two

0:02:01.840 --> 0:02:04.120
<v Speaker 1>majors and it was great coming back into the compound

0:02:04.200 --> 0:02:09.160
<v Speaker 1>and seeing everybody and so I hear you the US

0:02:09.200 --> 0:02:13.040
<v Speaker 1>Open Man. That was a throwback. It was like we

0:02:13.080 --> 0:02:16.040
<v Speaker 1>were back in the in the glory days of the

0:02:16.160 --> 0:02:20.200
<v Speaker 1>US Open. First of all, Oakmon is a golf course,

0:02:20.520 --> 0:02:23.840
<v Speaker 1>such amazing history there, Gary, What do you like about

0:02:23.840 --> 0:02:27.120
<v Speaker 1>that golf course? And what do you like about that venue?

0:02:27.120 --> 0:02:30.280
<v Speaker 1>Because I just can't think of a harder golf course

0:02:31.000 --> 0:02:33.960
<v Speaker 1>really anywhere on the planet Earth the way they set

0:02:34.000 --> 0:02:37.520
<v Speaker 1>it up and the tests that it demands. But it

0:02:37.560 --> 0:02:39.720
<v Speaker 1>really did feel like we were back to the old

0:02:39.760 --> 0:02:43.239
<v Speaker 1>school days of the USGA. And I think everybody Gary

0:02:43.320 --> 0:02:46.960
<v Speaker 1>got there last week and thought, yeah, even Parr wins

0:02:47.040 --> 0:02:49.919
<v Speaker 1>this easy. What did you like about the setup last week?

0:02:49.960 --> 0:02:52.519
<v Speaker 1>And what did you like about maybe kind of going

0:02:52.560 --> 0:02:57.200
<v Speaker 1>back to that old school kind of USGA bloodbaths setup.

0:02:57.560 --> 0:02:59.680
<v Speaker 2>Well, I would say the first thing I really liked

0:02:59.840 --> 0:03:03.160
<v Speaker 2>there was no graduated rough you know, it was just

0:03:03.240 --> 0:03:05.480
<v Speaker 2>either you were in the fairway or you were in

0:03:05.520 --> 0:03:08.240
<v Speaker 2>the really tall stuff. So it really put a lot

0:03:08.320 --> 0:03:11.799
<v Speaker 2>of pressure on the te shots, which which I liked

0:03:11.840 --> 0:03:14.040
<v Speaker 2>to see. To me, that was always part of the

0:03:14.160 --> 0:03:16.320
<v Speaker 2>US Open. One of the reasons why Lee Trevino had

0:03:16.360 --> 0:03:19.400
<v Speaker 2>so much success in because he could hit the fairways,

0:03:19.880 --> 0:03:22.679
<v Speaker 2>and you know, Jack Nicholas same thing success in the

0:03:22.760 --> 0:03:25.239
<v Speaker 2>US Opened a lot of times wouldn't hit drivers a

0:03:25.240 --> 0:03:27.000
<v Speaker 2>lot of one irons, a lot of three woods off

0:03:27.000 --> 0:03:29.200
<v Speaker 2>the tee, but always making sure that he was playing

0:03:29.240 --> 0:03:32.480
<v Speaker 2>from the fairway. So that was probably the first thing

0:03:32.520 --> 0:03:34.640
<v Speaker 2>that I noticed when I got there and started walking

0:03:34.680 --> 0:03:37.760
<v Speaker 2>around the golf course was like, you know, this reminds

0:03:37.840 --> 0:03:39.680
<v Speaker 2>me of the days when I used to play in

0:03:39.760 --> 0:03:42.720
<v Speaker 2>the US Open. You either hit the fairway or you

0:03:42.760 --> 0:03:47.160
<v Speaker 2>were in a lot of trouble. I like Oakmand from

0:03:47.160 --> 0:03:50.320
<v Speaker 2>the standpoint that it is difficult, There's no question about it.

0:03:50.520 --> 0:03:51.920
<v Speaker 3>I would agree with you.

0:03:51.960 --> 0:03:54.400
<v Speaker 2>I think it's the hardest golf course certainly in the

0:03:54.480 --> 0:03:57.640
<v Speaker 2>United States on a day in and day out basis.

0:03:57.680 --> 0:03:59.920
<v Speaker 2>I mean, the members are crazy. They love the green

0:04:00.080 --> 0:04:03.360
<v Speaker 2>at fourteen fourteen and a half every day, they light

0:04:03.440 --> 0:04:06.840
<v Speaker 2>the rough high, they love the penal bunkers. It is

0:04:07.000 --> 0:04:10.280
<v Speaker 2>just that hard a golf course. It certainly tested the

0:04:10.320 --> 0:04:14.600
<v Speaker 2>players not only from their skill level with the ability

0:04:14.640 --> 0:04:16.920
<v Speaker 2>to hit a golf ball, but it tested them as

0:04:16.920 --> 0:04:21.320
<v Speaker 2>far as their mental capabilities as well, the ability to

0:04:21.360 --> 0:04:26.840
<v Speaker 2>maintain your composure, to maintain your concentration, to accept the

0:04:26.880 --> 0:04:28.839
<v Speaker 2>fact that sometimes you were just going to have to

0:04:28.839 --> 0:04:30.600
<v Speaker 2>pitch out of the rough and down the fairway and

0:04:30.640 --> 0:04:33.400
<v Speaker 2>try to make what we always used to call a

0:04:33.480 --> 0:04:36.720
<v Speaker 2>US Open par which was a wedge out and then

0:04:36.760 --> 0:04:38.640
<v Speaker 2>another wedge to the green and hopefully you get a

0:04:38.680 --> 0:04:41.800
<v Speaker 2>chance to make the pipe. So from that standpoint, I

0:04:41.800 --> 0:04:42.599
<v Speaker 2>thought it was great.

0:04:42.839 --> 0:04:43.520
<v Speaker 3>I really did.

0:04:44.000 --> 0:04:46.800
<v Speaker 2>I'm a little concerned that they went back out and

0:04:46.800 --> 0:04:49.000
<v Speaker 2>played the last six or seven holes when they did,

0:04:49.640 --> 0:04:51.920
<v Speaker 2>But other than that, I thought it was a great

0:04:52.040 --> 0:04:52.560
<v Speaker 2>US Open.

0:04:53.080 --> 0:04:53.279
<v Speaker 3>Yeah.

0:04:53.320 --> 0:04:55.760
<v Speaker 1>I mean, Gary, from your standpoint is a former player,

0:04:55.839 --> 0:04:59.600
<v Speaker 1>as someone that's won, You've won on big golf courses Bahill,

0:04:59.640 --> 0:05:02.000
<v Speaker 1>Tory and stuff like that. But as a former player,

0:05:02.080 --> 0:05:05.240
<v Speaker 1>as a fan, but also as a broadcaster, what do

0:05:05.320 --> 0:05:09.480
<v Speaker 1>you want major championships to test from the best players

0:05:09.520 --> 0:05:13.080
<v Speaker 1>in the world. What do you think these great players

0:05:13.120 --> 0:05:15.560
<v Speaker 1>were the best in the game, right? I mean it's

0:05:15.839 --> 0:05:18.640
<v Speaker 1>not even close. And I think you know the game

0:05:18.680 --> 0:05:21.000
<v Speaker 1>and Lynch sent they sent somebody out to go play

0:05:21.400 --> 0:05:23.799
<v Speaker 1>on the Monday that was a legit, you know, scratch

0:05:23.839 --> 0:05:27.520
<v Speaker 1>golfer and started to bake ninety. I mean, first of all,

0:05:27.520 --> 0:05:30.920
<v Speaker 1>I don't think the fans can appreciate just how hard

0:05:31.720 --> 0:05:34.800
<v Speaker 1>not only all majors are, but that test. But what

0:05:34.880 --> 0:05:37.960
<v Speaker 1>do you want majors to identify.

0:05:37.680 --> 0:05:41.039
<v Speaker 2>From the players, Well, I think, first of all, I've

0:05:41.080 --> 0:05:44.400
<v Speaker 2>always felt like each major has kind of its own personality.

0:05:45.320 --> 0:05:47.000
<v Speaker 2>When I think of the Masters, I think of the

0:05:47.000 --> 0:05:49.760
<v Speaker 2>back nine, and I think of the opportunities on the

0:05:49.800 --> 0:05:52.960
<v Speaker 2>back nine for eagles and Verdi's, but also for disasters

0:05:53.000 --> 0:05:56.040
<v Speaker 2>as well. When I think of the Open Championship, I

0:05:56.080 --> 0:05:58.640
<v Speaker 2>think of the weather conditions. You know, they play such

0:05:58.640 --> 0:06:02.360
<v Speaker 2>a huge part and how the event goes about. PGA

0:06:02.480 --> 0:06:04.280
<v Speaker 2>to me, has always been what I would call the

0:06:04.360 --> 0:06:07.600
<v Speaker 2>tamest of the majors. The setup usually allows for some

0:06:07.640 --> 0:06:11.640
<v Speaker 2>pretty good scoring, but the US Open is always about

0:06:11.960 --> 0:06:14.839
<v Speaker 2>the difficulty and making sure that it is the most

0:06:14.839 --> 0:06:18.479
<v Speaker 2>difficult of the four majors. They accomplished that this year

0:06:18.480 --> 0:06:20.880
<v Speaker 2>and again I think you want to see in a

0:06:20.920 --> 0:06:23.800
<v Speaker 2>major championship, you want to see great shots. Don't get

0:06:23.800 --> 0:06:26.000
<v Speaker 2>me wrong. I mean, you know, you want to see

0:06:26.040 --> 0:06:29.599
<v Speaker 2>these guys be able to perform what they're capable of doing,

0:06:29.640 --> 0:06:32.920
<v Speaker 2>and as you say, they do some amazing things that

0:06:33.240 --> 0:06:36.479
<v Speaker 2>I would agree. I don't think the average viewer understands

0:06:36.720 --> 0:06:39.599
<v Speaker 2>just how good these guys actually are and some of

0:06:39.640 --> 0:06:42.479
<v Speaker 2>the shots that they actually play. I mean, just from

0:06:42.520 --> 0:06:45.920
<v Speaker 2>my generation of players to what I watch now, there

0:06:45.960 --> 0:06:50.000
<v Speaker 2>are times where I literally shake my head and just go, wow,

0:06:50.360 --> 0:06:54.440
<v Speaker 2>that's pretty unbelievable. You know, when I see a guy

0:06:54.560 --> 0:06:57.360
<v Speaker 2>take a threewood off the ground and carry the ball

0:06:57.400 --> 0:06:59.440
<v Speaker 2>two hundred and eighty five two hundred ninety yards in

0:06:59.480 --> 0:07:03.039
<v Speaker 2>the air, I mean, that's mind boggling to me. I mean,

0:07:03.080 --> 0:07:05.240
<v Speaker 2>you know, back in my day, a good drive by

0:07:05.240 --> 0:07:07.480
<v Speaker 2>the longest drivers hit at two hundred and eighty five

0:07:07.560 --> 0:07:08.400
<v Speaker 2>yards off the tee.

0:07:08.920 --> 0:07:09.360
<v Speaker 3>And now.

0:07:10.880 --> 0:07:12.600
<v Speaker 2>And now these guys are hitting it farther than that

0:07:12.800 --> 0:07:15.320
<v Speaker 2>off the ground with a three wood. So you know,

0:07:16.160 --> 0:07:18.760
<v Speaker 2>you want to see that, but you also want to

0:07:18.800 --> 0:07:21.920
<v Speaker 2>see them tested. You want to see them have to

0:07:21.960 --> 0:07:24.160
<v Speaker 2>think a little bit. You want to see them have to,

0:07:24.280 --> 0:07:27.680
<v Speaker 2>as I said at the US Open, maintain your concentration,

0:07:27.840 --> 0:07:31.200
<v Speaker 2>your composure, and every now and then.

0:07:31.560 --> 0:07:32.360
<v Speaker 3>I wouldn't want.

0:07:32.200 --> 0:07:35.520
<v Speaker 2>A steady diet of US Open golf, you know, no question.

0:07:36.120 --> 0:07:39.320
<v Speaker 2>I don't think the fans would like that either. But

0:07:39.400 --> 0:07:41.520
<v Speaker 2>every now and then it's fun to see the best

0:07:41.560 --> 0:07:43.520
<v Speaker 2>in the world tested the way they were there at

0:07:43.520 --> 0:07:47.800
<v Speaker 2>opont and to see if they can, you know, accept

0:07:47.800 --> 0:07:50.680
<v Speaker 2>the fact that you know, being in the fairway two

0:07:50.760 --> 0:07:53.080
<v Speaker 2>hundred and seventy five yards off the tea was better

0:07:53.120 --> 0:07:55.160
<v Speaker 2>than being in the rough three hundred and twenty yards

0:07:55.160 --> 0:07:57.480
<v Speaker 2>off the team most of the time where they play,

0:07:57.640 --> 0:07:58.520
<v Speaker 2>that's not the case.

0:07:58.880 --> 0:08:04.480
<v Speaker 1>Where's the line in your opinion, Gary on fair versus unfair?

0:08:04.520 --> 0:08:07.160
<v Speaker 1>Because there are these US opens that we've seen in

0:08:07.240 --> 0:08:10.840
<v Speaker 1>history to where it seems like, okay, there's that conversation

0:08:11.160 --> 0:08:13.520
<v Speaker 1>late on the weekends, Okay, is the golf course getting

0:08:13.520 --> 0:08:18.440
<v Speaker 1>away from the championship? And then how much of the

0:08:18.480 --> 0:08:22.120
<v Speaker 1>green complexes, certainly at a place like Oakmont where they

0:08:22.160 --> 0:08:25.280
<v Speaker 1>can get those greens so fast, and you know the

0:08:25.760 --> 0:08:28.200
<v Speaker 1>squareness of some of those greens, which is so weird

0:08:28.240 --> 0:08:30.560
<v Speaker 1>to see, you know a few of the holes at

0:08:30.600 --> 0:08:33.640
<v Speaker 1>Oakmont with the square greens. But where do you kind

0:08:33.640 --> 0:08:37.680
<v Speaker 1>of come in on the balance of fair versus from

0:08:37.720 --> 0:08:41.000
<v Speaker 1>a conditioned setup, wise from the rough standpoint, from how

0:08:41.040 --> 0:08:43.440
<v Speaker 1>fast they can get the greens? Because I was talking

0:08:43.440 --> 0:08:45.760
<v Speaker 1>to friend, the head of the USCA, on the Monday

0:08:45.840 --> 0:08:47.360
<v Speaker 1>night and he said, what do you think the players

0:08:47.840 --> 0:08:50.360
<v Speaker 1>want from us from setting up the golf course? And

0:08:50.440 --> 0:08:53.360
<v Speaker 1>I said, you know, whenever I talk to players, they

0:08:53.400 --> 0:08:56.400
<v Speaker 1>don't mind the golf course being hard. They don't mind

0:08:56.440 --> 0:08:58.920
<v Speaker 1>it being a tough test. But what they don't want

0:08:59.520 --> 0:09:04.079
<v Speaker 1>is to hit a good shot and then get punished

0:09:04.120 --> 0:09:06.600
<v Speaker 1>for it and then be made to look stupid. So

0:09:06.800 --> 0:09:10.840
<v Speaker 1>the balance on the setup between what's fair and what's not.

0:09:11.000 --> 0:09:13.440
<v Speaker 1>I mean, you can't control the weather, right, you can't

0:09:13.440 --> 0:09:16.559
<v Speaker 1>control and it was soft and okmont I mean, oh yeah,

0:09:16.559 --> 0:09:18.800
<v Speaker 1>they had rain and then on the Sunday it got

0:09:18.800 --> 0:09:23.199
<v Speaker 1>really soft. If they have no rain for seven days,

0:09:23.559 --> 0:09:26.600
<v Speaker 1>I don't know how anybody would have finished five over.

0:09:26.720 --> 0:09:29.360
<v Speaker 2>Right, right, And and you think about it, I mean

0:09:29.400 --> 0:09:32.640
<v Speaker 2>that's what Cabrera won with that year. He won with

0:09:32.679 --> 0:09:35.720
<v Speaker 2>five over. And the golf course is that tight. I

0:09:35.760 --> 0:09:40.480
<v Speaker 2>think the USGA, you know, especially with their desire to

0:09:40.960 --> 0:09:44.400
<v Speaker 2>make the golf course as difficult as possible but still fair.

0:09:45.160 --> 0:09:49.000
<v Speaker 2>Often time, I shouldn't say maybe not oftentimes, but sometimes

0:09:49.600 --> 0:09:54.240
<v Speaker 2>they get so close to the edge that when mother

0:09:54.360 --> 0:09:57.720
<v Speaker 2>nature doesn't cooperate, all of a sudden, it kind of

0:09:57.720 --> 0:10:00.240
<v Speaker 2>goes overboard and it gets and it gets it's.

0:10:00.160 --> 0:10:00.760
<v Speaker 3>Away from them.

0:10:00.800 --> 0:10:03.400
<v Speaker 2>And you know, we've seen examples of that at Shinnecock

0:10:04.000 --> 0:10:08.000
<v Speaker 2>a couple of times. You know, Pinehurst the one year

0:10:08.360 --> 0:10:12.200
<v Speaker 2>years ago when Michael Campbell won was was pretty close

0:10:12.240 --> 0:10:15.800
<v Speaker 2>to that. It got really firm and really fast, and

0:10:15.880 --> 0:10:17.839
<v Speaker 2>I understand as a player, you know, you want to

0:10:17.880 --> 0:10:22.560
<v Speaker 2>be rewarded for good shots. You don't want to be punished.

0:10:23.080 --> 0:10:25.400
<v Speaker 3>You know. Embarrassment, Well, you know that kind of comes

0:10:25.440 --> 0:10:26.440
<v Speaker 3>with the US Open.

0:10:26.840 --> 0:10:29.040
<v Speaker 2>I hate to say it. I had many a moment

0:10:29.080 --> 0:10:31.439
<v Speaker 2>at the US Open where I was more than embarrassed.

0:10:31.720 --> 0:10:35.560
<v Speaker 2>So you know, that really notts something you can control.

0:10:35.760 --> 0:10:40.160
<v Speaker 2>The one thing I didn't like at the Open last

0:10:40.200 --> 0:10:44.320
<v Speaker 2>week at Oakmont and talking to Gil Hands, Gill said,

0:10:44.320 --> 0:10:46.160
<v Speaker 2>you know, they went back in the design and the

0:10:46.360 --> 0:10:49.079
<v Speaker 2>photos from the phones era and so forth and so on,

0:10:49.520 --> 0:10:51.839
<v Speaker 2>and they had a lot of these steep edges coming

0:10:51.880 --> 0:10:54.240
<v Speaker 2>off the green to where the ball would go down

0:10:54.280 --> 0:10:57.800
<v Speaker 2>into the bunker, and by growing the rough so long

0:10:57.840 --> 0:11:01.200
<v Speaker 2>around the greens and around some of the bunkers, it

0:11:01.360 --> 0:11:05.920
<v Speaker 2>prevented balls from actually going into the sand. Classic example

0:11:05.960 --> 0:11:08.680
<v Speaker 2>to me was Tyrrell Hatton on the seventy first hole

0:11:09.800 --> 0:11:11.800
<v Speaker 2>hit a drive and it was and it wasn't a

0:11:11.800 --> 0:11:14.920
<v Speaker 2>great drive. It was not a great drive, but he

0:11:15.080 --> 0:11:18.640
<v Speaker 2>actually missed it in the right place. If the ball

0:11:18.720 --> 0:11:23.280
<v Speaker 2>goes down into the bunker, it's a relatively easy bunker shot.

0:11:23.320 --> 0:11:25.240
<v Speaker 2>He's got plenty of green to work with. You know,

0:11:25.280 --> 0:11:27.439
<v Speaker 2>the chances are he's going to have a probably ten

0:11:27.480 --> 0:11:30.559
<v Speaker 2>foot birdie putter less, but the five and a half

0:11:30.600 --> 0:11:33.920
<v Speaker 2>inch rough grabs it. And now it's sitting on a

0:11:33.960 --> 0:11:38.160
<v Speaker 2>straight downhill lie where you know, the green's up above him,

0:11:38.200 --> 0:11:41.680
<v Speaker 2>probably eight or ten feet, And yeah, I mean, the

0:11:41.760 --> 0:11:44.160
<v Speaker 2>chances of him getting that ball on the green, we're

0:11:44.200 --> 0:11:47.440
<v Speaker 2>almost not. We saw another example of it on the

0:11:47.480 --> 0:11:50.680
<v Speaker 2>thirteenth hole of the part three one day, Xander Schoffley

0:11:50.760 --> 0:11:53.120
<v Speaker 2>hit a T shot that was pulled. It wasn't a

0:11:53.120 --> 0:11:56.040
<v Speaker 2>great shot by any means, but it just trickled off

0:11:56.080 --> 0:11:58.280
<v Speaker 2>the green to the left and rather than going down

0:11:58.320 --> 0:12:02.080
<v Speaker 2>into the bunker, it hung up on this almost vertical

0:12:02.840 --> 0:12:05.559
<v Speaker 2>face and this five and a half in he had

0:12:05.600 --> 0:12:08.120
<v Speaker 2>to chip the ball away from the hole. He couldn't

0:12:08.120 --> 0:12:10.599
<v Speaker 2>even chip it toward the hole because he didn't know

0:12:10.640 --> 0:12:13.120
<v Speaker 2>if he could keep it on the green from that position. So,

0:12:14.080 --> 0:12:17.280
<v Speaker 2>you know, I think sometimes they maybe go a little

0:12:17.320 --> 0:12:21.200
<v Speaker 2>too far, and especially if you've just gone through this

0:12:21.320 --> 0:12:25.120
<v Speaker 2>restoration to try to create this situation to where the

0:12:25.160 --> 0:12:28.200
<v Speaker 2>bulk goes into the bunker and now you've grown grass

0:12:28.720 --> 0:12:30.800
<v Speaker 2>that prevents it from going in the bunker. To me,

0:12:30.920 --> 0:12:32.400
<v Speaker 2>that's probably a little over the top.

0:12:33.080 --> 0:12:36.240
<v Speaker 1>And I think sometimes when I mean, I listen, if

0:12:36.280 --> 0:12:37.839
<v Speaker 1>you want to go the rough up off petite to

0:12:37.840 --> 0:12:40.559
<v Speaker 1>put a premium on you know, hitting the golf ball

0:12:40.559 --> 0:12:42.439
<v Speaker 1>in the fairway, I mean, okay, you can, you can

0:12:42.480 --> 0:12:44.840
<v Speaker 1>make an argument for that. But it seems to me

0:12:44.960 --> 0:12:48.439
<v Speaker 1>sometimes when we have US Open rough, right, there is

0:12:48.480 --> 0:12:51.680
<v Speaker 1>a term called us Oh yeah, You'll go to a

0:12:51.760 --> 0:12:55.880
<v Speaker 1>regular golf course like Memorial, and you'll sometimes at Memorial

0:12:55.960 --> 0:12:58.680
<v Speaker 1>in summertime, you'll look around and you'll say, yeah, this

0:12:58.800 --> 0:13:01.600
<v Speaker 1>is like US Open rough. Well, do you feel maybe

0:13:02.200 --> 0:13:06.079
<v Speaker 1>at times the rough being so penal around the greens

0:13:06.120 --> 0:13:08.880
<v Speaker 1>and so thick? Is there an argument to be made

0:13:08.880 --> 0:13:10.720
<v Speaker 1>here that it takes some of the skill out of

0:13:10.760 --> 0:13:12.760
<v Speaker 1>it because there is no skill. It doesn't matter if

0:13:12.760 --> 0:13:15.720
<v Speaker 1>you're Patrick Reid or set Me Biosteros. It has an

0:13:15.760 --> 0:13:20.400
<v Speaker 1>amazing short game. It's almost like sometimes the skill level

0:13:20.400 --> 0:13:24.319
<v Speaker 1>around the green complex is it kind of makes everyone

0:13:24.400 --> 0:13:27.720
<v Speaker 1>the same? How much is too much rough around the greens?

0:13:28.040 --> 0:13:31.000
<v Speaker 3>Right? I would agree with that one hundred percent.

0:13:32.120 --> 0:13:34.520
<v Speaker 2>I think when you get the roughest severe it was

0:13:34.760 --> 0:13:37.720
<v Speaker 2>at Oakmont, around the greens, you have a situation.

0:13:37.840 --> 0:13:39.520
<v Speaker 3>I always call it's hack and hope.

0:13:39.920 --> 0:13:41.960
<v Speaker 2>I mean, you hack at it and you hope that

0:13:41.960 --> 0:13:45.040
<v Speaker 2>the ball comes out the way you anticipate based on

0:13:45.400 --> 0:13:48.600
<v Speaker 2>your thought as how the ball is actually lying in

0:13:48.640 --> 0:13:52.320
<v Speaker 2>the grass. And yeah, there's certain techniques. Obviously, you got

0:13:52.360 --> 0:13:53.680
<v Speaker 2>to get the club up in the air a little quicker,

0:13:53.679 --> 0:13:55.120
<v Speaker 2>and you bet got to be a little bit steeper

0:13:55.160 --> 0:13:57.640
<v Speaker 2>and all that kind of stuff. But every one of

0:13:57.679 --> 0:14:01.240
<v Speaker 2>those players has that ability to make that adjustment. But

0:14:01.280 --> 0:14:03.920
<v Speaker 2>then it becomes how hard do I hit it? And

0:14:04.040 --> 0:14:07.240
<v Speaker 2>especially when you short sighted yourself in a US Open,

0:14:07.400 --> 0:14:11.080
<v Speaker 2>and you know you have to have speed to get

0:14:11.080 --> 0:14:13.600
<v Speaker 2>the club through that grass five and a half inches.

0:14:13.640 --> 0:14:16.400
<v Speaker 2>As you say, it was wet, it was sticky, I

0:14:16.440 --> 0:14:20.040
<v Speaker 2>mean it was nasty. You know, to only make the

0:14:20.080 --> 0:14:23.120
<v Speaker 2>ball go say twenty feet and you only need to

0:14:23.160 --> 0:14:27.560
<v Speaker 2>carry it three you know, you can look pretty foolish,

0:14:27.640 --> 0:14:30.600
<v Speaker 2>you really can't. There were certain situations to me where,

0:14:30.760 --> 0:14:33.400
<v Speaker 2>you know, when we had done a US Amateur telecast there,

0:14:33.560 --> 0:14:36.840
<v Speaker 2>we'd done other opens there at Opat they had some

0:14:36.960 --> 0:14:40.960
<v Speaker 2>shaved areas you know around you know, like behind number

0:14:40.960 --> 0:14:44.200
<v Speaker 2>three was shaved, you know, behind the third green it

0:14:44.280 --> 0:14:47.040
<v Speaker 2>was it was cut at fairwey high. To me, that

0:14:47.200 --> 0:14:51.480
<v Speaker 2>allows a little more creativity, a little more skill, you know,

0:14:51.640 --> 0:14:54.960
<v Speaker 2>various shots and that kind of thing. I personally like

0:14:55.040 --> 0:14:57.240
<v Speaker 2>to see that a lot more than what I call

0:14:57.320 --> 0:14:58.280
<v Speaker 2>the hack and hope.

0:15:00.320 --> 0:15:03.920
<v Speaker 1>Let's talk about JJ Spahn. I mean what a performance.

0:15:03.960 --> 0:15:07.320
<v Speaker 1>I mean put it into perspective what he did, because

0:15:07.360 --> 0:15:09.520
<v Speaker 1>if you look at the leader board, not only on

0:15:09.560 --> 0:15:12.360
<v Speaker 1>the weekend, but on Sunday, I mean, you had some

0:15:12.400 --> 0:15:14.120
<v Speaker 1>of the best players in the world, you have some

0:15:14.160 --> 0:15:17.200
<v Speaker 1>of the some of the favorites every single week going

0:15:17.200 --> 0:15:20.080
<v Speaker 1>into these and I think JJ's had an amazing year.

0:15:20.320 --> 0:15:22.680
<v Speaker 1>You know, the playoff at the Players with Rory, but

0:15:22.760 --> 0:15:25.640
<v Speaker 1>JJ spawn is not somebody that anybody had on a

0:15:25.720 --> 0:15:31.120
<v Speaker 1>list of who's going to win the US Open at Oakmont.

0:15:31.480 --> 0:15:33.000
<v Speaker 1>How good was the performance?

0:15:33.880 --> 0:15:36.960
<v Speaker 2>Well, I think it was incredible, no question about it.

0:15:37.000 --> 0:15:39.720
<v Speaker 2>And you know I touched on earlier. I wasn't sure

0:15:39.720 --> 0:15:41.680
<v Speaker 2>they should go back out and play those last six

0:15:41.800 --> 0:15:47.400
<v Speaker 2>or seven holes. JJ Spond's really glad they did. You know,

0:15:47.440 --> 0:15:49.800
<v Speaker 2>it was almost like the weather delay was a reset

0:15:49.840 --> 0:15:52.280
<v Speaker 2>for him. I mean he was headed in the wrong direction.

0:15:52.560 --> 0:15:55.080
<v Speaker 2>I mean it was eerily similar to the players. Remember

0:15:55.120 --> 0:15:58.080
<v Speaker 2>the players had had a weather delay as well in

0:15:58.120 --> 0:16:00.520
<v Speaker 2>the final round, and he came back out of that

0:16:00.600 --> 0:16:03.040
<v Speaker 2>weather delay and actually hit some clutch shots, made some

0:16:03.080 --> 0:16:05.840
<v Speaker 2>great putts and had a chance to win that right

0:16:06.080 --> 0:16:08.480
<v Speaker 2>very late on the last hole. Didn't make the putt there,

0:16:08.560 --> 0:16:10.840
<v Speaker 2>but you know, got himself into the playoff. It was

0:16:10.880 --> 0:16:13.080
<v Speaker 2>eerily similar at the US Open. I mean at the

0:16:13.120 --> 0:16:13.880
<v Speaker 2>start that he.

0:16:13.960 --> 0:16:15.840
<v Speaker 3>Had, I mean you you.

0:16:15.720 --> 0:16:18.600
<v Speaker 2>Wrote him off forty on the front right, I mean,

0:16:18.640 --> 0:16:22.880
<v Speaker 2>he was he was terrible, looked nervous, looked, you know,

0:16:23.200 --> 0:16:25.600
<v Speaker 2>like he just couldn't handle the situation.

0:16:26.120 --> 0:16:27.360
<v Speaker 3>But for some reason or.

0:16:27.360 --> 0:16:30.360
<v Speaker 2>Another, when he came back out after that weather delay,

0:16:30.680 --> 0:16:33.440
<v Speaker 2>the reset was incredible, just amazing. I mean that the

0:16:33.480 --> 0:16:36.080
<v Speaker 2>shot he hit at seventeen, the two shots he hit

0:16:36.120 --> 0:16:39.000
<v Speaker 2>at eighteen, you know, yeah, the putt, I mean, you

0:16:39.040 --> 0:16:41.840
<v Speaker 2>know you're trying to two putt, it goes in. You know,

0:16:41.920 --> 0:16:44.240
<v Speaker 2>he clearly would have been able to putt. It was

0:16:44.280 --> 0:16:45.320
<v Speaker 2>such a great putt.

0:16:45.480 --> 0:16:45.960
<v Speaker 3>I tell you.

0:16:46.040 --> 0:16:49.480
<v Speaker 2>I mentioned earlier, you know that Leechervino did really well

0:16:49.480 --> 0:16:53.360
<v Speaker 2>in US Opens. His swing, maybe not the back swing,

0:16:53.440 --> 0:16:56.720
<v Speaker 2>but the forward motion through the ball and the finish

0:16:57.200 --> 0:16:59.800
<v Speaker 2>and the ball flight kind of a low, you know,

0:17:00.080 --> 0:17:04.080
<v Speaker 2>left to right under control. Shot reminded me a lot

0:17:04.080 --> 0:17:05.920
<v Speaker 2>of Leech Reno, and watching it really did.

0:17:06.240 --> 0:17:09.000
<v Speaker 1>DJ was hitting golf balls next to JJ on Tuesday

0:17:09.000 --> 0:17:10.800
<v Speaker 1>and a friend of mine messaged me and he said, hey,

0:17:11.080 --> 0:17:13.240
<v Speaker 1>I need some sleeper picks. Give me some, you know,

0:17:13.400 --> 0:17:16.520
<v Speaker 1>not superstar picks. And I'm sitting there and I'm thinking, okay,

0:17:16.960 --> 0:17:20.080
<v Speaker 1>Shane Lowry finished second there, you know, had a big lead.

0:17:20.440 --> 0:17:22.480
<v Speaker 1>It's a golf course that you know, I know he

0:17:22.520 --> 0:17:24.640
<v Speaker 1>really really likes. He's been playing well. And I said,

0:17:24.680 --> 0:17:27.120
<v Speaker 1>I think Shane Lowry. But JJ's hitting balls right next

0:17:27.119 --> 0:17:29.840
<v Speaker 1>to us. He's working with his coach, Adam Striver. First

0:17:29.840 --> 0:17:33.360
<v Speaker 1>of all, there's a sound test. There's an audio test

0:17:33.680 --> 0:17:35.560
<v Speaker 1>when you're watching guys hit golf balls.

0:17:35.320 --> 0:17:36.200
<v Speaker 3>On the range.

0:17:36.240 --> 0:17:40.400
<v Speaker 1>And there are guys that have a completely different audio test,

0:17:41.400 --> 0:17:44.080
<v Speaker 1>Rory McElroy, Scottie Scheffler. They're all out of center the

0:17:44.080 --> 0:17:47.240
<v Speaker 1>club face. Gary. I'm watching JJ hit balls and every

0:17:47.320 --> 0:17:48.560
<v Speaker 1>single one of these out of the middle of the

0:17:48.560 --> 0:17:51.880
<v Speaker 1>club face like this sound is good, the balance is good.

0:17:51.960 --> 0:17:54.920
<v Speaker 1>I'm watching the shape and this was through the bag.

0:17:55.000 --> 0:17:57.080
<v Speaker 1>We got to the range about the same time. I

0:17:57.160 --> 0:18:00.720
<v Speaker 1>watched him do an entire practice session watch. So then

0:18:00.760 --> 0:18:04.760
<v Speaker 1>on the weekend I'm thinking, hey, and I thought, when

0:18:04.800 --> 0:18:06.480
<v Speaker 1>you go back, you can always go back and look

0:18:06.520 --> 0:18:10.399
<v Speaker 1>at you know, what helped players win the tournament. But

0:18:10.520 --> 0:18:14.199
<v Speaker 1>I think in looking back, the stretch on was it

0:18:14.240 --> 0:18:20.920
<v Speaker 1>on Saturday makes paws from five to sixteen just does Again,

0:18:21.080 --> 0:18:25.080
<v Speaker 1>we've seen that in the past. We haven't seen that necessarily,

0:18:25.119 --> 0:18:28.840
<v Speaker 1>I think recently from a US Open. But you know this,

0:18:29.000 --> 0:18:31.840
<v Speaker 1>having covered so many of these, the guys that win

0:18:31.960 --> 0:18:35.199
<v Speaker 1>these scenes will have days to where they'll just put

0:18:35.359 --> 0:18:39.440
<v Speaker 1>eleven twelve pors in a row, and in that stretch

0:18:39.720 --> 0:18:43.120
<v Speaker 1>they're making the seven to ten foot or for poor

0:18:43.280 --> 0:18:45.919
<v Speaker 1>that they need to make. I thought it was incredibly

0:18:45.960 --> 0:18:50.119
<v Speaker 1>impressive that JJ had no double bogies for the entire week, right,

0:18:50.200 --> 0:18:53.400
<v Speaker 1>I mean nineteenth and fairways hit ninth in the greens

0:18:53.600 --> 0:18:56.760
<v Speaker 1>ninth and putting that rain delay that you talked about.

0:18:56.840 --> 0:18:58.880
<v Speaker 1>You've probably been a part of a lot of those

0:18:58.880 --> 0:19:01.239
<v Speaker 1>in the course of your career. They can be the

0:19:01.320 --> 0:19:04.040
<v Speaker 1>reset that you need, but then they can also go

0:19:04.119 --> 0:19:06.360
<v Speaker 1>the other way to where you can actually be leading

0:19:06.400 --> 0:19:10.280
<v Speaker 1>and cruising. Do you think maybe the reset helped JJ

0:19:10.480 --> 0:19:13.160
<v Speaker 1>Moore and it hurt Sam Burns and out of scott

0:19:13.320 --> 0:19:16.359
<v Speaker 1>because they came out started double boge in every hole.

0:19:16.440 --> 0:19:18.800
<v Speaker 2>Yeah yeah, well, I mean you look back on it.

0:19:18.840 --> 0:19:20.960
<v Speaker 2>I mean Sam Burns had just birdied the tenth folt.

0:19:21.440 --> 0:19:23.560
<v Speaker 2>I mean you know it was like he kind of

0:19:23.640 --> 0:19:27.480
<v Speaker 2>had taken control. Seemed to be, you know, striking the

0:19:27.480 --> 0:19:30.760
<v Speaker 2>ball as well as anybody, got some momentum back by

0:19:30.840 --> 0:19:33.639
<v Speaker 2>making that birdie at ten, and then man, when he

0:19:33.760 --> 0:19:34.840
<v Speaker 2>came back out, it.

0:19:34.720 --> 0:19:37.400
<v Speaker 3>Was it was just night and day.

0:19:38.040 --> 0:19:40.280
<v Speaker 2>And yeah, you know, as a player, I mean we

0:19:40.359 --> 0:19:43.640
<v Speaker 2>all kind of do the same things in weather delays.

0:19:43.960 --> 0:19:46.480
<v Speaker 2>You kind of hang around, You maybe eat a little bit,

0:19:46.720 --> 0:19:49.080
<v Speaker 2>or you know, you gather in a group of friends

0:19:49.080 --> 0:19:51.880
<v Speaker 2>and you're telling stories, or you know, some guys will

0:19:51.880 --> 0:19:53.880
<v Speaker 2>go off in a corner and kind of lay down

0:19:54.000 --> 0:19:57.480
<v Speaker 2>and try to relax. I mean, there's no magic formulas

0:19:57.520 --> 0:20:00.760
<v Speaker 2>to you know, what guys do during weather delay. But

0:20:01.960 --> 0:20:05.800
<v Speaker 2>you know, obviously, in listening to what JJ's bond said,

0:20:06.280 --> 0:20:08.080
<v Speaker 2>you know, he got together with his team and his

0:20:08.160 --> 0:20:10.399
<v Speaker 2>team kind of said, hey, look, you know you're not

0:20:10.560 --> 0:20:13.320
<v Speaker 2>out of this yet. You know you're four shots behind.

0:20:14.000 --> 0:20:17.240
<v Speaker 2>If we just started on Monday and said Sunday afternoon,

0:20:17.400 --> 0:20:20.880
<v Speaker 2>you would be four shots back with eight holes to go.

0:20:20.920 --> 0:20:24.520
<v Speaker 2>In a US Open, you'd probably said, wow, you know, yeah,

0:20:24.520 --> 0:20:26.480
<v Speaker 2>I take it. I'd take it. You know, I'd like

0:20:26.560 --> 0:20:29.800
<v Speaker 2>to be in that position. So you know, obviously somebody

0:20:29.840 --> 0:20:32.639
<v Speaker 2>planted some good seeds in his brain to you know,

0:20:32.720 --> 0:20:34.600
<v Speaker 2>say hey, you know, look, go back out there and

0:20:34.640 --> 0:20:37.600
<v Speaker 2>play the way you you know you've been playing. You

0:20:37.600 --> 0:20:40.280
<v Speaker 2>don't have to do anything special, just get back to

0:20:40.320 --> 0:20:43.280
<v Speaker 2>what you were doing, and he was able to do it.

0:20:43.800 --> 0:20:45.720
<v Speaker 1>I thought it was also lucky for JJ that they

0:20:45.760 --> 0:20:48.439
<v Speaker 1>didn't shelter in place, because sometimes they'll do that, right,

0:20:48.520 --> 0:20:51.320
<v Speaker 1>they'll call everybody so, yes, it's just a there's no

0:20:51.480 --> 0:20:54.399
<v Speaker 1>there's no lightning, so this is just going to blow through.

0:20:54.720 --> 0:20:57.000
<v Speaker 1>And I think originally they did that they thought it

0:20:57.040 --> 0:20:59.080
<v Speaker 1>was maybe going to go through and to be maybe

0:20:59.080 --> 0:21:01.600
<v Speaker 1>a fifteen to twenty minute to lay shelter in place,

0:21:01.640 --> 0:21:03.639
<v Speaker 1>but then they knew it was going to be longer,

0:21:03.720 --> 0:21:06.000
<v Speaker 1>so then they pull everybody gets pulled off, and then

0:21:06.680 --> 0:21:09.640
<v Speaker 1>after a certain timeframe then they have to let everybody

0:21:09.680 --> 0:21:12.399
<v Speaker 1>warm back up. And I do know that Adam Shreiver

0:21:12.520 --> 0:21:14.639
<v Speaker 1>and Josh greg Green, who has been helping JJ with

0:21:14.680 --> 0:21:18.359
<v Speaker 1>the short game, said to him, listen, take the handbrake off,

0:21:18.760 --> 0:21:21.159
<v Speaker 1>stop it, you know, just let it go, just and

0:21:21.200 --> 0:21:23.840
<v Speaker 1>step up. And I think that's I think that's the

0:21:23.880 --> 0:21:26.560
<v Speaker 1>other thing that I always find interesting about that kind

0:21:26.560 --> 0:21:29.439
<v Speaker 1>of US Open setup is you know it's going to

0:21:29.440 --> 0:21:32.920
<v Speaker 1>be difficult, and you can go out and all you're

0:21:32.960 --> 0:21:34.960
<v Speaker 1>trying to do is not hit bad shots. All you're

0:21:35.000 --> 0:21:37.679
<v Speaker 1>trying to do is not miss the fair way, not

0:21:37.800 --> 0:21:40.159
<v Speaker 1>miss the green. And then you start missing fairways and

0:21:40.160 --> 0:21:44.240
<v Speaker 1>you miss greens that stretch from five to sixteen on Saturday.

0:21:44.680 --> 0:21:46.560
<v Speaker 1>As a former player, you've played in a lot of

0:21:46.600 --> 0:21:48.879
<v Speaker 1>these US Opens, you've played in the old school days

0:21:49.680 --> 0:21:54.240
<v Speaker 1>that stretch. How hard is it Gary to just grind out,

0:21:54.400 --> 0:21:59.520
<v Speaker 1>you know, two solid hours of just making pars because

0:21:59.640 --> 0:22:02.720
<v Speaker 1>the rest of your career as a player, it's not

0:22:02.920 --> 0:22:04.880
<v Speaker 1>like that. You know that they're going to be burned.

0:22:04.920 --> 0:22:08.840
<v Speaker 1>Even the par five sat at Oakmart legit char So

0:22:09.400 --> 0:22:12.480
<v Speaker 1>there really aren't a lot of other than maybe fourteen,

0:22:12.680 --> 0:22:15.399
<v Speaker 1>the short par four that was you know everybody was

0:22:15.440 --> 0:22:18.080
<v Speaker 1>getting close to. That was a legit. Bob Ford told

0:22:18.080 --> 0:22:20.960
<v Speaker 1>me that he was walking around the longtime head pro there.

0:22:21.280 --> 0:22:23.720
<v Speaker 1>He said, listen, I think fourteen is this week is

0:22:23.720 --> 0:22:27.480
<v Speaker 1>the only legit party chance these players have, so everything

0:22:27.520 --> 0:22:29.879
<v Speaker 1>else is just holding on. How hard is it to

0:22:30.000 --> 0:22:33.920
<v Speaker 1>switch that mindset, Gary to Okay, I'm in a US

0:22:33.960 --> 0:22:38.159
<v Speaker 1>Open now, I just have to throw together as many

0:22:38.320 --> 0:22:41.439
<v Speaker 1>pars this week as I can. What do you have

0:22:41.480 --> 0:22:46.679
<v Speaker 1>to do mentally to change that switch from attack to

0:22:46.720 --> 0:22:51.680
<v Speaker 1>not protect, but to play conservatively aggressive? Right?

0:22:52.200 --> 0:22:55.040
<v Speaker 2>Well, I think you know you touched on it very

0:22:55.080 --> 0:22:58.560
<v Speaker 2>early on, and I know I talked to probably half

0:22:58.560 --> 0:23:02.200
<v Speaker 2>a dozen caddies and probably ten players, and every single

0:23:02.200 --> 0:23:04.720
<v Speaker 2>one of them told me the exact same thing. I'll

0:23:04.760 --> 0:23:07.840
<v Speaker 2>take even par right now and never tee off. So

0:23:08.320 --> 0:23:11.239
<v Speaker 2>you know, if that's the mindset going in, and it

0:23:11.359 --> 0:23:14.719
<v Speaker 2>was obviously with a bunch of people, a good caddy

0:23:14.840 --> 0:23:18.119
<v Speaker 2>is going to keep reminding you, hey, every time we

0:23:18.160 --> 0:23:21.359
<v Speaker 2>make a par, we're going to pick up shots on somebody.

0:23:21.520 --> 0:23:22.720
<v Speaker 2>You know, we're going to pick up a half a

0:23:22.720 --> 0:23:25.679
<v Speaker 2>shot on somebody or a full shot on somebody. And

0:23:25.760 --> 0:23:29.400
<v Speaker 2>I do think, you know, so much of that is

0:23:29.600 --> 0:23:33.119
<v Speaker 2>putting well because if you keep making some you know,

0:23:33.160 --> 0:23:36.320
<v Speaker 2>you make those first two or three seven eight footers

0:23:36.359 --> 0:23:39.480
<v Speaker 2>ten foot or whatever, and all of a sudden, you know,

0:23:39.560 --> 0:23:43.440
<v Speaker 2>your confidence grows with that. And now all of a

0:23:43.480 --> 0:23:47.399
<v Speaker 2>sudden you know, you don't feel the need that I

0:23:47.560 --> 0:23:50.320
<v Speaker 2>have to get this ball right next to the hole

0:23:50.400 --> 0:23:52.240
<v Speaker 2>all the time. You know, if I if I'm in

0:23:52.280 --> 0:23:54.000
<v Speaker 2>the rough around the green and I chip it to

0:23:54.000 --> 0:23:56.480
<v Speaker 2>eight feet, it's okay. You know, I can make this

0:23:56.600 --> 0:23:59.119
<v Speaker 2>putt and that you know, as you said, and that

0:23:59.280 --> 0:24:03.399
<v Speaker 2>timeframe on Saturday, he did that time after time after time.

0:24:04.000 --> 0:24:07.280
<v Speaker 2>And you know, once you start doing it, it's like, okay,

0:24:08.320 --> 0:24:11.159
<v Speaker 2>I can play the golf course this way and still

0:24:11.160 --> 0:24:14.919
<v Speaker 2>be in fine shape. So again I go back to,

0:24:15.080 --> 0:24:17.080
<v Speaker 2>you know, the US Open Test, and one of the

0:24:17.160 --> 0:24:21.679
<v Speaker 2>aspects is the mental component of it. And yeah, I

0:24:21.720 --> 0:24:23.879
<v Speaker 2>mean you've got to be able to change your attitude

0:24:23.880 --> 0:24:26.399
<v Speaker 2>and your approach. I mean, that's just the way it is.

0:24:26.720 --> 0:24:28.679
<v Speaker 1>A couple of years ago, we were in rain delay

0:24:28.760 --> 0:24:30.439
<v Speaker 1>and I was talking to David Deval when he was

0:24:30.440 --> 0:24:32.840
<v Speaker 1>doing some TV at the Masters for Golf Channel, and

0:24:33.240 --> 0:24:35.240
<v Speaker 1>we're on one of the tour trucks, and I said

0:24:35.240 --> 0:24:36.680
<v Speaker 1>to him, you know, David, you had a great career.

0:24:36.720 --> 0:24:38.880
<v Speaker 1>You're number one in the world, won a major champion.

0:24:39.720 --> 0:24:42.320
<v Speaker 1>You're a great college player. To be a great player,

0:24:42.480 --> 0:24:45.800
<v Speaker 1>to be a major champion, to be number one in

0:24:45.840 --> 0:24:48.679
<v Speaker 1>the world. What do you think you have to have?

0:24:48.960 --> 0:24:51.440
<v Speaker 1>And I thought he was going to say something about

0:24:51.880 --> 0:24:54.520
<v Speaker 1>shots or something like that, and it's always something that

0:24:54.640 --> 0:24:56.720
<v Speaker 1>stuck with me. He said, I think to be a

0:24:56.760 --> 0:24:59.119
<v Speaker 1>great player and to be a great champion, you have

0:24:59.200 --> 0:25:01.919
<v Speaker 1>to have acceptance. You have to be able to accept

0:25:02.600 --> 0:25:04.920
<v Speaker 1>what is happening. And I think you know, the years

0:25:04.960 --> 0:25:08.320
<v Speaker 1>open at Oakmon is a great example of acceptance. You

0:25:08.359 --> 0:25:10.960
<v Speaker 1>are not going to change that golf course, you know,

0:25:11.240 --> 0:25:13.639
<v Speaker 1>Thirst and Lawrence he was six under run Thursday. You

0:25:13.720 --> 0:25:17.080
<v Speaker 1>knew he wasn't going to finish six under even for

0:25:17.160 --> 0:25:20.600
<v Speaker 1>the day, right, So that acceptance of Okay, I know

0:25:20.720 --> 0:25:23.400
<v Speaker 1>the golf course is hard. I know it is going

0:25:23.440 --> 0:25:25.440
<v Speaker 1>to be a very difficult test. I know I'm not

0:25:25.520 --> 0:25:28.000
<v Speaker 1>going to get a lot of great looks for Birdie.

0:25:28.720 --> 0:25:30.880
<v Speaker 1>But then there's that thing that I think is always

0:25:31.400 --> 0:25:34.639
<v Speaker 1>difficult for you guys as players, to where you're in

0:25:34.920 --> 0:25:38.760
<v Speaker 1>protect mode, You're in defense mode all day. Because I

0:25:38.840 --> 0:25:43.240
<v Speaker 1>always think major championships, the ones that win those are

0:25:43.320 --> 0:25:45.840
<v Speaker 1>the guys that play offense when they need to play offense,

0:25:46.200 --> 0:25:48.520
<v Speaker 1>and they play defense when they need to play defense.

0:25:48.560 --> 0:25:51.840
<v Speaker 1>And the trick of what the USGA does is you

0:25:51.840 --> 0:25:54.040
<v Speaker 1>get out of position and you know you should be

0:25:54.080 --> 0:25:58.120
<v Speaker 1>playing defense, but your brain tells you, Okay, I have

0:25:58.200 --> 0:26:01.240
<v Speaker 1>to play offense. But the opposite of that, the shot

0:26:01.280 --> 0:26:04.640
<v Speaker 1>that JJ hit at seventeen, that is where you have

0:26:04.760 --> 0:26:08.879
<v Speaker 1>to play offense, and to take advantage of that and

0:26:09.000 --> 0:26:12.760
<v Speaker 1>play offense at the right time. To choose to play offense,

0:26:13.040 --> 0:26:17.159
<v Speaker 1>but then to execute that, it must be very difficult

0:26:17.640 --> 0:26:19.800
<v Speaker 1>to say, Okay, I've been in defense mode all day,

0:26:19.840 --> 0:26:22.399
<v Speaker 1>all day, and now I've got a fifteen foot up

0:26:22.440 --> 0:26:23.480
<v Speaker 1>the hill for berdie.

0:26:23.840 --> 0:26:24.320
<v Speaker 3>How do I.

0:26:24.280 --> 0:26:28.320
<v Speaker 2>Handle this all right? Well, and you know on the

0:26:28.320 --> 0:26:31.240
<v Speaker 2>broadcast we said it often. I mean, you know, you

0:26:31.600 --> 0:26:35.200
<v Speaker 2>get so defensive, especially on those greens, I mean running

0:26:35.200 --> 0:26:36.720
<v Speaker 2>as fast as they were, and then you get some

0:26:36.800 --> 0:26:39.800
<v Speaker 2>of the down slopes and the side slopes and everything

0:26:39.840 --> 0:26:43.000
<v Speaker 2>else that you know, your defensive, your defensive, your defensive,

0:26:43.000 --> 0:26:44.919
<v Speaker 2>and then all of a sudden you get a putt

0:26:45.160 --> 0:26:48.720
<v Speaker 2>you know where you are uphill and it's like, oh,

0:26:49.000 --> 0:26:52.359
<v Speaker 2>you know, I could actually hit this one. Well, we

0:26:52.440 --> 0:26:54.240
<v Speaker 2>saw a lot of those puts, you know, kind of

0:26:54.359 --> 0:26:57.639
<v Speaker 2>come up short or not be strug firmly enough, and

0:26:57.680 --> 0:27:00.400
<v Speaker 2>it's just, you know, it plays on your mind. There's

0:27:00.400 --> 0:27:03.400
<v Speaker 2>no question about it. That's that's what makes the US

0:27:03.440 --> 0:27:07.120
<v Speaker 2>Open so unique. So you know, you talked about it.

0:27:07.359 --> 0:27:10.760
<v Speaker 2>He had the opportunity there at seventeen, JJ did he

0:27:10.800 --> 0:27:13.359
<v Speaker 2>pulled the shot off. The one thing about seventeen that

0:27:13.480 --> 0:27:16.359
<v Speaker 2>I liked was, I mean I didn't look at the

0:27:16.400 --> 0:27:20.640
<v Speaker 2>final stats, but I would guess probably ninety five ninety

0:27:20.720 --> 0:27:23.000
<v Speaker 2>seven percent of the time the green, they were going

0:27:23.040 --> 0:27:25.400
<v Speaker 2>for the green. I mean, there's no reason to lay

0:27:25.440 --> 0:27:29.359
<v Speaker 2>out not anymore. I mean, they can all hit it

0:27:29.480 --> 0:27:33.359
<v Speaker 2>far enough. So you knew that that was going to

0:27:33.400 --> 0:27:35.200
<v Speaker 2>be the case. You knew he was going to try

0:27:35.200 --> 0:27:36.760
<v Speaker 2>to drive it on the green and to be able

0:27:36.840 --> 0:27:39.880
<v Speaker 2>to stand up there and make that swing. As you said,

0:27:40.200 --> 0:27:43.240
<v Speaker 2>you know, being aggressive at the right time is one

0:27:43.280 --> 0:27:47.200
<v Speaker 2>thing mentally, but then being able to physically do it

0:27:47.280 --> 0:27:49.680
<v Speaker 2>is a whole other thing. But that's why he's got

0:27:49.680 --> 0:27:53.000
<v Speaker 2>the US Open trophy. He did it at the right time.

0:27:53.119 --> 0:27:55.879
<v Speaker 1>So obviously, I mean, you know this. You win a

0:27:55.920 --> 0:27:58.840
<v Speaker 1>PGA Tour event, your life changes, right, you know, you

0:27:58.880 --> 0:28:01.680
<v Speaker 1>have a career like you have where you win multiple times,

0:28:01.920 --> 0:28:04.119
<v Speaker 1>your life changes. But when you win a major and

0:28:04.160 --> 0:28:06.879
<v Speaker 1>you've never you know, i mean, JJ's never won a

0:28:06.880 --> 0:28:10.960
<v Speaker 1>major before everybody says it's life changing, it's life altering

0:28:11.680 --> 0:28:14.760
<v Speaker 1>in your opinion, deary, how how is it life altering?

0:28:14.840 --> 0:28:18.480
<v Speaker 1>And how does that change affect a player? What now

0:28:19.080 --> 0:28:23.240
<v Speaker 1>happens to JJ? Moving forward? Every time because you know this,

0:28:23.359 --> 0:28:25.639
<v Speaker 1>you win a tournament, you show up at a PJ

0:28:25.760 --> 0:28:29.199
<v Speaker 1>tour bent, everybody looks at you differently, and then you

0:28:29.280 --> 0:28:32.520
<v Speaker 1>win another tournament. So if you're a multiple winner on tour,

0:28:32.680 --> 0:28:35.280
<v Speaker 1>you're looked at in a different light. But if you

0:28:35.320 --> 0:28:39.680
<v Speaker 1>win a major championship, you are forever looked at completely

0:28:39.680 --> 0:28:43.120
<v Speaker 1>differently in the sport by everybody. How do you feel

0:28:43.120 --> 0:28:45.920
<v Speaker 1>like his life changes now?

0:28:46.680 --> 0:28:48.800
<v Speaker 2>Well, I think what'll be fascinating to see and I

0:28:48.800 --> 0:28:52.240
<v Speaker 2>think it happens anytime a guy who maybe you don't

0:28:52.280 --> 0:28:56.040
<v Speaker 2>expect to win a major wins one. Is what happens

0:28:56.080 --> 0:28:58.520
<v Speaker 2>after that? Because it is going to be different, you know,

0:28:58.560 --> 0:29:00.840
<v Speaker 2>now all of a sudden, there are a lot of

0:29:00.880 --> 0:29:04.280
<v Speaker 2>demands on your time, you know, a lot of opportunities

0:29:04.440 --> 0:29:08.320
<v Speaker 2>to make money, you know, but again, does that take

0:29:08.360 --> 0:29:10.880
<v Speaker 2>you out of your normal routine? Does that take you

0:29:11.000 --> 0:29:13.680
<v Speaker 2>out of you know, the things that you used to

0:29:13.760 --> 0:29:16.640
<v Speaker 2>do to get to where you got By winning the

0:29:16.760 --> 0:29:21.080
<v Speaker 2>US Open. I've seen it, you know, happen numerous times.

0:29:21.200 --> 0:29:24.960
<v Speaker 2>I mean, some guys handle it very well, other guys don't,

0:29:25.640 --> 0:29:28.000
<v Speaker 2>and you just never know. But the demands on your time,

0:29:28.720 --> 0:29:32.320
<v Speaker 2>you know, having never won a major, but I just

0:29:32.480 --> 0:29:36.600
<v Speaker 2>know you need to learn how to say no is

0:29:37.240 --> 0:29:41.240
<v Speaker 2>one thing that's really important because now every time something

0:29:41.320 --> 0:29:43.600
<v Speaker 2>comes up, you know, JJ spond is going to be

0:29:43.640 --> 0:29:47.760
<v Speaker 2>asked about it, because he's the US Open champion. Doesn't

0:29:47.800 --> 0:29:52.000
<v Speaker 2>matter whether it's about golf or life or something else, politics,

0:29:52.040 --> 0:29:55.000
<v Speaker 2>even you know, all the world's going, he's going to

0:29:55.040 --> 0:29:58.920
<v Speaker 2>be asked about it. So managing your time and still

0:29:58.960 --> 0:30:01.320
<v Speaker 2>being able to do the thing things that got you

0:30:01.480 --> 0:30:05.160
<v Speaker 2>to where you are, I think is critical, I really do.

0:30:05.240 --> 0:30:09.320
<v Speaker 2>I mean a very dear friend of mine, Bill Rogers, well,

0:30:09.400 --> 0:30:12.200
<v Speaker 2>I had an unbelievable year, you know, won the Open

0:30:12.320 --> 0:30:15.960
<v Speaker 2>Championship one in Australia one, you know, and the next

0:30:15.960 --> 0:30:20.040
<v Speaker 2>few years he you know, chased the money, went and

0:30:20.040 --> 0:30:24.280
<v Speaker 2>played everywhere, got paid to go play. And sure enough,

0:30:24.280 --> 0:30:26.840
<v Speaker 2>within probably a year and a half two years after

0:30:26.880 --> 0:30:30.200
<v Speaker 2>that fabulous year, he was burned out. He was tired

0:30:30.240 --> 0:30:33.280
<v Speaker 2>of golf, and he was never the same player. And

0:30:33.840 --> 0:30:36.479
<v Speaker 2>you know he would admit to this day that you know,

0:30:36.840 --> 0:30:40.320
<v Speaker 2>he didn't handle it very well. So it'll be fascinating

0:30:40.360 --> 0:30:41.800
<v Speaker 2>to see how JJ doesn't.

0:30:45.360 --> 0:30:48.200
<v Speaker 1>Speaking of saying no, you've been on both sides of this.

0:30:48.280 --> 0:30:50.960
<v Speaker 1>You've been on the player side and the broadcasting side.

0:30:51.360 --> 0:30:56.240
<v Speaker 1>Rory McElroy's stance lately, I mean, I saw a tweet

0:30:56.280 --> 0:30:58.680
<v Speaker 1>the other day and said it said, who would have

0:30:58.720 --> 0:31:01.600
<v Speaker 1>thought that Roy mcawaite could win the Masters and get

0:31:01.640 --> 0:31:06.360
<v Speaker 1>the Grand Slam? And we're talking about him negatively the

0:31:06.400 --> 0:31:09.920
<v Speaker 1>way that we have his stance lately to not speak

0:31:09.960 --> 0:31:12.600
<v Speaker 1>to the press. Listen. He is entitled to do it, right.

0:31:12.880 --> 0:31:15.880
<v Speaker 1>It's not mandatory. It's not like it is another team

0:31:15.920 --> 0:31:18.920
<v Speaker 1>sports in the NFL. You are not contractually obligated to

0:31:18.920 --> 0:31:21.400
<v Speaker 1>speak to the media. I think a lot of people

0:31:21.480 --> 0:31:25.240
<v Speaker 1>look at times that I find Rory to be incredibly engaging,

0:31:25.360 --> 0:31:30.239
<v Speaker 1>incredibly curious. I think he's smart. I enjoy talking to him.

0:31:30.280 --> 0:31:32.040
<v Speaker 1>When when I talk to him, we don't really talk

0:31:32.080 --> 0:31:34.200
<v Speaker 1>a lot about golf. We talk about other things. He's

0:31:34.240 --> 0:31:37.840
<v Speaker 1>a smart kid, right, he has a lot to say sometimes.

0:31:37.880 --> 0:31:39.880
<v Speaker 1>I think in the last four years it seems like

0:31:41.040 --> 0:31:43.160
<v Speaker 1>he'd loves the sound of his own voice and then

0:31:43.360 --> 0:31:45.800
<v Speaker 1>right now, it's like he doesn't want to say anything.

0:31:45.880 --> 0:31:48.640
<v Speaker 1>Where are you on this kind of And as a

0:31:48.680 --> 0:31:54.120
<v Speaker 1>wider question, do you feel like the players owe the

0:31:54.280 --> 0:31:56.960
<v Speaker 1>media and the fans interviews?

0:31:58.440 --> 0:32:01.520
<v Speaker 2>You know, having been at a large part of that

0:32:01.640 --> 0:32:04.960
<v Speaker 2>one side of it media for quite some time.

0:32:05.160 --> 0:32:06.480
<v Speaker 3>Yeah, you'd like to think that.

0:32:08.120 --> 0:32:10.120
<v Speaker 2>I don't know if oh is the right word, but

0:32:10.200 --> 0:32:12.320
<v Speaker 2>you'd like to think that most of these guys would

0:32:12.360 --> 0:32:15.560
<v Speaker 2>be smart enough that, you know, every time we show

0:32:15.640 --> 0:32:19.120
<v Speaker 2>their face or they're on TV, or they're doing an interview,

0:32:19.200 --> 0:32:21.880
<v Speaker 2>or they're up there on the media center, you know,

0:32:21.960 --> 0:32:24.400
<v Speaker 2>with all their logos on and all the money they're

0:32:24.400 --> 0:32:27.840
<v Speaker 2>making from their sponsors, that you know, this is just

0:32:27.920 --> 0:32:31.400
<v Speaker 2>another opportunity for me to keep a lot of people happy.

0:32:32.200 --> 0:32:35.280
<v Speaker 2>That being said, I get the sense, and I have

0:32:35.360 --> 0:32:37.760
<v Speaker 2>not had a chance to talk to Rory about this.

0:32:38.240 --> 0:32:41.400
<v Speaker 2>I think he was very unhappy with the driver situation

0:32:41.720 --> 0:32:45.240
<v Speaker 2>and what happened at the PGA and that it came

0:32:45.320 --> 0:32:48.400
<v Speaker 2>out that his driver was non conforming and there were

0:32:48.440 --> 0:32:52.520
<v Speaker 2>other players drivers that were non conforming that didn't make

0:32:52.600 --> 0:32:55.920
<v Speaker 2>big headlines like his did. And you know, you know

0:32:56.040 --> 0:32:57.680
<v Speaker 2>as well as I do as a player, you don't

0:32:57.680 --> 0:33:00.560
<v Speaker 2>know when your driver's non conforming or not. I mean,

0:33:00.560 --> 0:33:02.760
<v Speaker 2>you hit enough balls and sure enough, sooner or later

0:33:02.800 --> 0:33:05.120
<v Speaker 2>the face gets too thin and then it doesn't pass

0:33:05.160 --> 0:33:08.120
<v Speaker 2>the test. But it's not like, you know, all of

0:33:08.120 --> 0:33:11.440
<v Speaker 2>a sudden, your driver's going fifteen yards farther than it was,

0:33:12.400 --> 0:33:14.680
<v Speaker 2>you know, and it's non conforming. I mean, you don't

0:33:14.720 --> 0:33:18.600
<v Speaker 2>know that. So I think he was a little unhappy

0:33:18.600 --> 0:33:22.440
<v Speaker 2>and upset about that and how that was handled. But

0:33:22.520 --> 0:33:26.080
<v Speaker 2>that being said, come out and just say that one time.

0:33:26.200 --> 0:33:28.080
<v Speaker 2>Do want to interview and just say, hey, look, you know,

0:33:28.120 --> 0:33:30.120
<v Speaker 2>I feel like I was treated unfairly. I mean, I

0:33:30.160 --> 0:33:33.480
<v Speaker 2>know other guys drivers were not conforming. I don't like

0:33:33.560 --> 0:33:35.640
<v Speaker 2>the fact that, you know, you guys made such a

0:33:35.640 --> 0:33:37.480
<v Speaker 2>big deal out of the fact that I was non

0:33:37.480 --> 0:33:40.400
<v Speaker 2>conforming and then it would be over, you know, it

0:33:40.440 --> 0:33:44.360
<v Speaker 2>would be done. I will say, I think he's in

0:33:44.440 --> 0:33:49.280
<v Speaker 2>a strange place, you know, after achieving this lifelong goal

0:33:49.360 --> 0:33:52.320
<v Speaker 2>of this career Grand Slam and winning the Masters after

0:33:52.560 --> 0:33:56.080
<v Speaker 2>sixteen attempts or whatever it was, and he's, you know,

0:33:56.120 --> 0:33:59.120
<v Speaker 2>he's struggling a little bit to get reset and come

0:33:59.200 --> 0:34:01.680
<v Speaker 2>up with new goals and everything else. You know, he

0:34:01.760 --> 0:34:05.000
<v Speaker 2>made a comment, he did talk Friday after he birdied

0:34:05.000 --> 0:34:07.160
<v Speaker 2>the eighteenth hold to make the cut there at Oakmont,

0:34:07.160 --> 0:34:09.640
<v Speaker 2>and he made a comment about something about it it's

0:34:09.680 --> 0:34:11.560
<v Speaker 2>a lot easier to do when you really don't care

0:34:11.640 --> 0:34:14.480
<v Speaker 2>whether you're there on the weekend or not, which was like,

0:34:15.200 --> 0:34:18.560
<v Speaker 2>that's just not the Rory McElroy that I know. I mean,

0:34:18.640 --> 0:34:22.239
<v Speaker 2>you know, he's more competitive than that. So I was

0:34:22.280 --> 0:34:24.560
<v Speaker 2>glad to see him play well on Sunday and then

0:34:24.800 --> 0:34:28.399
<v Speaker 2>do a bunch better interview. Seemed to handle last week

0:34:28.440 --> 0:34:31.640
<v Speaker 2>at the Travelers well. Again, I think it was just

0:34:31.680 --> 0:34:35.520
<v Speaker 2>a temporary blip, and you know, I think he'll be back,

0:34:36.120 --> 0:34:37.879
<v Speaker 2>you know, doing what he should be doing.

0:34:38.280 --> 0:34:39.799
<v Speaker 3>Should we make it mandatory?

0:34:40.520 --> 0:34:40.799
<v Speaker 1>To me?

0:34:40.920 --> 0:34:43.920
<v Speaker 2>When you start making stuff mandatory, you start taking away

0:34:43.960 --> 0:34:46.600
<v Speaker 2>the fact that we're independent contractors. The guys who play

0:34:46.600 --> 0:34:49.400
<v Speaker 2>on the tour independent contractors. They set their own schedule.

0:34:49.920 --> 0:34:53.319
<v Speaker 2>They're all CEOs of their own business. So if the

0:34:53.360 --> 0:34:55.600
<v Speaker 2>CEO of the business decides he doesn't want to talk

0:34:55.640 --> 0:34:58.560
<v Speaker 2>to the media, then you know what, it's his decision

0:34:58.640 --> 0:35:00.799
<v Speaker 2>to make. It probably won't go on well, it won't

0:35:00.800 --> 0:35:03.600
<v Speaker 2>come across well, but it is his decision to make.

0:35:04.080 --> 0:35:06.200
<v Speaker 1>When you look at Rory McRoy, now as a you know,

0:35:06.400 --> 0:35:08.640
<v Speaker 1>he was one of the Grand Slam five majors. You

0:35:08.800 --> 0:35:11.719
<v Speaker 1>followed him a lot. What do you like about his

0:35:11.840 --> 0:35:15.839
<v Speaker 1>game and what what do you marvel at about the

0:35:15.880 --> 0:35:18.279
<v Speaker 1>things that he does, Because I I mean, I've been

0:35:18.320 --> 0:35:19.920
<v Speaker 1>lucky enough and that you have those of us that

0:35:20.000 --> 0:35:22.080
<v Speaker 1>have been around the game a long time, and I'm

0:35:22.239 --> 0:35:24.319
<v Speaker 1>I'm glad that I grew up in that kind of

0:35:24.320 --> 0:35:27.279
<v Speaker 1>middle generation. I didn't see Nicholas really play. My dad

0:35:27.280 --> 0:35:29.360
<v Speaker 1>talks about it. He's, you know, my dad kind of

0:35:29.760 --> 0:35:31.759
<v Speaker 1>he'll be eighty two in August. He's like, I've seen

0:35:31.800 --> 0:35:34.839
<v Speaker 1>pretty other than he said, I never really saw, you know,

0:35:35.040 --> 0:35:37.880
<v Speaker 1>Gene Sarason play a lot, or Bobby Jones, but he's like,

0:35:37.960 --> 0:35:39.640
<v Speaker 1>you know, other than you know, my dad's eighty two

0:35:39.719 --> 0:35:43.120
<v Speaker 1>and in eight, but he's like, Rory mcroy's one of

0:35:43.120 --> 0:35:45.560
<v Speaker 1>the greatest golfers I've ever seen in my opinion. I mean,

0:35:45.600 --> 0:35:47.600
<v Speaker 1>I got to watch my dad work with Greg Norman,

0:35:47.800 --> 0:35:49.480
<v Speaker 1>and I think Greg Norman's one of the greatest golfers

0:35:49.520 --> 0:35:51.080
<v Speaker 1>I've ever seen. I got to watch my dad work

0:35:51.120 --> 0:35:53.759
<v Speaker 1>with Tiger Woods. I think Tiger is the greatest all

0:35:53.880 --> 0:35:58.399
<v Speaker 1>but Rory is as good a golfer. As you can

0:35:58.480 --> 0:36:01.319
<v Speaker 1>find what you love about him? What do you like

0:36:01.440 --> 0:36:02.239
<v Speaker 1>watching about it?

0:36:03.440 --> 0:36:08.319
<v Speaker 3>Well, you know, I mean let's start the last.

0:36:08.880 --> 0:36:12.759
<v Speaker 2>With with the way he drives the golf. I mean,

0:36:13.120 --> 0:36:17.399
<v Speaker 2>you know, to to watch that flight, you know, that

0:36:17.600 --> 0:36:23.000
<v Speaker 2>high towering draw, which to me, I feel like when

0:36:23.000 --> 0:36:26.040
<v Speaker 2>you watch a large majority of the players, now, even

0:36:26.040 --> 0:36:28.520
<v Speaker 2>the best players, they all tend to fade the ball

0:36:29.200 --> 0:36:32.600
<v Speaker 2>now right because the way the drivers are building, the

0:36:32.600 --> 0:36:35.800
<v Speaker 2>way the golf balls are designed and everything else, it's

0:36:35.880 --> 0:36:38.640
<v Speaker 2>a lot easier and you can make it go far enough,

0:36:39.360 --> 0:36:42.360
<v Speaker 2>a lot easier to control, playing something left to right.

0:36:42.640 --> 0:36:44.920
<v Speaker 2>And here he'll stand up there and hit this big,

0:36:45.040 --> 0:36:49.280
<v Speaker 2>high towering draw that carries three hundred and twenty yards

0:36:50.040 --> 0:36:52.920
<v Speaker 2>and it's just and his balance is perfect. I mean,

0:36:53.120 --> 0:36:55.960
<v Speaker 2>it's just. It's a marvel to watch, it really is.

0:36:57.760 --> 0:37:00.239
<v Speaker 2>I think a short game is underrated. I think he's

0:37:00.239 --> 0:37:05.000
<v Speaker 2>actually pretty good short game wise. I do think one

0:37:05.040 --> 0:37:07.799
<v Speaker 2>of the things I've been impressed with the most here

0:37:07.880 --> 0:37:10.840
<v Speaker 2>Fairly recently, he talked about he went to a spinniar

0:37:10.920 --> 0:37:14.879
<v Speaker 2>golf ball, and by going to the spinnier golf ball,

0:37:15.000 --> 0:37:17.959
<v Speaker 2>he had to learn how to take some speed off

0:37:18.040 --> 0:37:20.839
<v Speaker 2>the short irons, so he didn't spin the ball too

0:37:20.920 --> 0:37:24.120
<v Speaker 2>much coming into the greens. So to me, you're seeing

0:37:24.120 --> 0:37:26.759
<v Speaker 2>a lot more of these, like kind of three quarter finishes,

0:37:26.800 --> 0:37:30.000
<v Speaker 2>a little slower motion through the ball with the short irons,

0:37:30.239 --> 0:37:32.279
<v Speaker 2>because he always had a tendency to meet us swing

0:37:32.320 --> 0:37:34.920
<v Speaker 2>to short irons a little bit like the driver, big

0:37:35.000 --> 0:37:38.560
<v Speaker 2>full swing, kind of hit a big high draw. Oftentimes

0:37:38.560 --> 0:37:42.440
<v Speaker 2>he'd be long left with a short iron. But now

0:37:42.840 --> 0:37:44.840
<v Speaker 2>I think he's got the ball under control with his

0:37:44.880 --> 0:37:47.799
<v Speaker 2>shorter clubs. I want you know, I can remember your

0:37:47.880 --> 0:37:54.360
<v Speaker 2>dad telling me years ago, telling Dustin Johnson, Dustin, you're

0:37:54.480 --> 0:37:59.000
<v Speaker 2>going to have probably ten to twelve shots of one

0:37:59.080 --> 0:38:02.360
<v Speaker 2>hundred and fifty yards or less every eighteen holes you play.

0:38:03.120 --> 0:38:06.239
<v Speaker 2>That's some sort of wedge for you. You need to

0:38:06.239 --> 0:38:09.320
<v Speaker 2>figure out how to control the distance with your wedges.

0:38:09.719 --> 0:38:12.239
<v Speaker 2>And once he started doing that, track Man with his

0:38:12.320 --> 0:38:15.200
<v Speaker 2>wedge play, you know, he got the number one in

0:38:15.239 --> 0:38:17.920
<v Speaker 2>the world. So if Rory can continue with that and

0:38:18.680 --> 0:38:22.840
<v Speaker 2>continue to improve the short iron play. His putting is streaky,

0:38:23.520 --> 0:38:25.719
<v Speaker 2>you know, there's no question about that. But you know

0:38:25.719 --> 0:38:27.319
<v Speaker 2>there's been a lot of great players that have had

0:38:27.760 --> 0:38:30.120
<v Speaker 2>been streaky with a putter. The good news is is

0:38:30.120 --> 0:38:32.839
<v Speaker 2>when he gets going, he keeps going with it, and

0:38:32.920 --> 0:38:35.560
<v Speaker 2>that's when he wins tournaments and shoots good scores.

0:38:36.320 --> 0:38:39.719
<v Speaker 1>Is he the complete player? When you look at him,

0:38:40.160 --> 0:38:43.560
<v Speaker 1>you look at him and just say he basically because

0:38:43.680 --> 0:38:47.080
<v Speaker 1>like you said, there are players that are dominant now.

0:38:47.280 --> 0:38:49.760
<v Speaker 1>I think you can do that. You can dominate now

0:38:50.200 --> 0:38:53.279
<v Speaker 1>and be a dominant player by doing a couple of

0:38:53.320 --> 0:38:56.719
<v Speaker 1>things really really well. If you've got distance, if you're

0:38:56.719 --> 0:38:59.319
<v Speaker 1>a great driver of the golf ball. When I look

0:38:59.360 --> 0:39:02.040
<v Speaker 1>at Rory his game, in the evolution of his game

0:39:02.120 --> 0:39:05.360
<v Speaker 1>over the years, he has added shots right to the arsenal.

0:39:05.400 --> 0:39:07.960
<v Speaker 1>When he came out, he was winning golf balls by

0:39:08.040 --> 0:39:10.840
<v Speaker 1>just hitting a high bomb, nukedraw right, he hit it

0:39:10.880 --> 0:39:13.800
<v Speaker 1>further than everybody. He won. Well, where majors got the

0:39:13.880 --> 0:39:15.200
<v Speaker 1>number one in the world.

0:39:15.080 --> 0:39:16.880
<v Speaker 2>And you think of those early majors an he won.

0:39:17.120 --> 0:39:19.920
<v Speaker 2>Every one of them was soft. Ye, the golf courses

0:39:19.920 --> 0:39:24.680
<v Speaker 2>were soft, Valhalla, Congressional, you know they were soft. I

0:39:24.800 --> 0:39:29.480
<v Speaker 2>was amazed when I first watched him play how infrequently

0:39:29.600 --> 0:39:31.320
<v Speaker 2>he hit any kind of knockdown shot.

0:39:31.600 --> 0:39:33.200
<v Speaker 1>Yeah, he hasn't really played back.

0:39:33.320 --> 0:39:36.520
<v Speaker 2>Wait for having grown up in Ireland playing you would

0:39:36.520 --> 0:39:39.000
<v Speaker 2>have assumed I mean, it's like when I grew up

0:39:39.040 --> 0:39:41.640
<v Speaker 2>down here in Florida, one of the first things I

0:39:41.719 --> 0:39:44.080
<v Speaker 2>learned is I got to be a better player, was

0:39:44.440 --> 0:39:47.280
<v Speaker 2>how to control the trajectory and knocked the ball down

0:39:47.320 --> 0:39:50.520
<v Speaker 2>into the wind. I was amazed when I first watched

0:39:50.600 --> 0:39:53.839
<v Speaker 2>Rory play that he didn't have more of that ability.

0:39:54.160 --> 0:39:56.360
<v Speaker 2>I think he does now. I think he controls his

0:39:56.480 --> 0:39:58.279
<v Speaker 2>trajectory much better than he used to.

0:39:58.880 --> 0:40:02.839
<v Speaker 1>Speaking of another complete player this run, Scotty Scheffler's all.

0:40:04.680 --> 0:40:07.920
<v Speaker 1>I mean thirteen events this year's and people forget he

0:40:08.040 --> 0:40:10.920
<v Speaker 1>was heard at the beginning of the year. Right, thirteen events,

0:40:11.080 --> 0:40:14.480
<v Speaker 1>nine top tens, three wins a major. You know, I

0:40:14.520 --> 0:40:16.960
<v Speaker 1>asked Steve Sands, I up Sandy on the podcast a

0:40:17.000 --> 0:40:19.880
<v Speaker 1>couple of years ago. And the comparisons that everybody's making

0:40:19.960 --> 0:40:24.800
<v Speaker 1>to Tiger, Right, you watched Tiger, You did the iconic

0:40:24.880 --> 0:40:28.440
<v Speaker 1>better than most all of that. Right, But Tiger is

0:40:28.520 --> 0:40:31.360
<v Speaker 1>kind of the modern benchmark, where for you Jack was

0:40:31.360 --> 0:40:34.959
<v Speaker 1>the benchmark, sure, but for the modern generation post kind

0:40:34.960 --> 0:40:38.400
<v Speaker 1>of Foudo and Norman, Tiger is he's the need all,

0:40:38.480 --> 0:40:42.000
<v Speaker 1>He's the benchmark. So everybody is going to the great

0:40:42.040 --> 0:40:44.920
<v Speaker 1>ones like Rory. Roy gets compared to Tiger. Right, the

0:40:44.960 --> 0:40:48.280
<v Speaker 1>things that Rory does get very closely compared to Tiger

0:40:48.360 --> 0:40:52.600
<v Speaker 1>because he is so dominant and Scotty Scheffler's dominant run

0:40:52.600 --> 0:40:56.839
<v Speaker 1>that he's been on now for three four years, first

0:40:56.880 --> 0:40:59.359
<v Speaker 1>of all, put it into perspective. How good is it?

0:40:59.560 --> 0:41:02.960
<v Speaker 1>And can it continue? And can he get better?

0:41:03.360 --> 0:41:03.560
<v Speaker 3>Right?

0:41:04.360 --> 0:41:09.600
<v Speaker 2>Well, it's amazing would be my one word to describe it.

0:41:09.640 --> 0:41:12.680
<v Speaker 2>It is amazing, you know, just week after week after week,

0:41:12.760 --> 0:41:15.359
<v Speaker 2>which you know does remind you of Tiger a little bit.

0:41:16.680 --> 0:41:20.920
<v Speaker 2>You talk about a complete player, he is very close

0:41:20.960 --> 0:41:21.359
<v Speaker 2>to that.

0:41:21.520 --> 0:41:22.240
<v Speaker 3>In my mind.

0:41:22.560 --> 0:41:25.200
<v Speaker 2>Again, I think his short game is somewhat underrated. I

0:41:25.200 --> 0:41:28.000
<v Speaker 2>don't think people talk about it enough, but he seems

0:41:28.040 --> 0:41:31.719
<v Speaker 2>to be, you know, very adequate. More than adequate with

0:41:31.800 --> 0:41:36.800
<v Speaker 2>his short game. I would say, of all the players

0:41:36.840 --> 0:41:40.799
<v Speaker 2>that I've watched through the Tiger era and now you know,

0:41:41.239 --> 0:41:45.960
<v Speaker 2>post Tiger, Scotty plays his irons closer to what Tiger

0:41:46.000 --> 0:41:48.960
<v Speaker 2>did than anybody I've seen. He tends to hit the

0:41:49.000 --> 0:41:54.480
<v Speaker 2>ball the right distance, a high right, and that was

0:41:54.520 --> 0:41:57.880
<v Speaker 2>Tiger's calling card when he was at his best. You know,

0:41:58.040 --> 0:42:01.240
<v Speaker 2>he hit the ball the right distance all the time,

0:42:01.440 --> 0:42:04.399
<v Speaker 2>And to me, that's something that you can't teach. I mean,

0:42:04.600 --> 0:42:07.080
<v Speaker 2>you're a wonderful teacher, you're a great teacher. You can't

0:42:07.360 --> 0:42:11.359
<v Speaker 2>teach that. That is, that's an innate thing that some

0:42:11.480 --> 0:42:15.200
<v Speaker 2>people have that others don't. I mean, you can have

0:42:15.320 --> 0:42:17.560
<v Speaker 2>the greatest technique in the world, but if you don't

0:42:17.560 --> 0:42:23.080
<v Speaker 2>have that innate feel and ability to visualize the shot

0:42:23.200 --> 0:42:26.160
<v Speaker 2>that's going to go the right distance, and you know

0:42:26.200 --> 0:42:28.719
<v Speaker 2>a lot of times it's a matter of taking just

0:42:28.800 --> 0:42:31.239
<v Speaker 2>a little bit of speed off to make the ball

0:42:31.280 --> 0:42:34.680
<v Speaker 2>go four yards shorter than it normally does. You know,

0:42:34.760 --> 0:42:37.440
<v Speaker 2>you can't teach that. You either have that or you don't.

0:42:38.160 --> 0:42:41.920
<v Speaker 2>Scotty does. Scotty has that, and you see it time

0:42:42.000 --> 0:42:44.799
<v Speaker 2>and time again. You know that he hits the ball

0:42:44.800 --> 0:42:48.120
<v Speaker 2>the right distance with desrons. Putting has gotten better, no

0:42:48.280 --> 0:42:50.600
<v Speaker 2>question about it. The work he's done with Phil Kenyan

0:42:50.680 --> 0:42:53.000
<v Speaker 2>and go into the claw, grip or whatever you want

0:42:53.000 --> 0:42:55.279
<v Speaker 2>to call it. You know, on the shorter putting, he

0:42:55.360 --> 0:42:58.200
<v Speaker 2>seems to be better with that, which was probably his

0:42:58.320 --> 0:43:05.000
<v Speaker 2>biggest concern, you know, two years ago. Can he get better?

0:43:05.600 --> 0:43:07.640
<v Speaker 2>It'll be interesting to me because he does have a

0:43:07.680 --> 0:43:10.080
<v Speaker 2>tendency which you know every player you know as well

0:43:10.080 --> 0:43:13.279
<v Speaker 2>as I do. Every player has tendencies. He has a

0:43:13.360 --> 0:43:17.200
<v Speaker 2>left miss and you see it when he's a little

0:43:17.239 --> 0:43:21.279
<v Speaker 2>off the ball wants to start left and then kind

0:43:21.280 --> 0:43:22.200
<v Speaker 2>of hang left.

0:43:22.040 --> 0:43:23.680
<v Speaker 3>Or maybe even go a little farther left.

0:43:23.680 --> 0:43:25.640
<v Speaker 2>And when you're trying to play a cut shot most

0:43:25.640 --> 0:43:28.120
<v Speaker 2>of the time, a lot of times that's not a

0:43:28.160 --> 0:43:30.759
<v Speaker 2>good thing. And talking to Randy Smith about it, he

0:43:30.800 --> 0:43:32.920
<v Speaker 2>said a lot of times it's in his setup. You know,

0:43:32.960 --> 0:43:35.400
<v Speaker 2>he just gets set up a little cock eyed, and

0:43:35.400 --> 0:43:38.040
<v Speaker 2>and you know the ball starts left of where he

0:43:38.120 --> 0:43:41.040
<v Speaker 2>wants and the face isn't open enough to get the

0:43:41.080 --> 0:43:43.640
<v Speaker 2>ball to come back to the right. But you know,

0:43:43.719 --> 0:43:47.480
<v Speaker 2>and I think that was on full display at Opemond

0:43:47.840 --> 0:43:50.520
<v Speaker 2>on Saturday afternoon, you.

0:43:50.480 --> 0:43:57.360
<v Speaker 3>Know, Sunday on the front end first, everything left right.

0:43:57.480 --> 0:43:57.680
<v Speaker 1>Yeah.

0:43:58.160 --> 0:44:00.839
<v Speaker 2>Now that's not to say that Tiger didn't tendencies too,

0:44:00.880 --> 0:44:03.319
<v Speaker 2>He did, you know. I mean again, every player does.

0:44:04.320 --> 0:44:09.000
<v Speaker 2>Can you manage those and can you maybe minimize that tendency?

0:44:10.320 --> 0:44:12.959
<v Speaker 2>It wouldn't surprise me at all if Scotty figures that out.

0:44:13.480 --> 0:44:17.960
<v Speaker 2>What's the ceiling. Wow, he's already number one, you know what.

0:44:18.320 --> 0:44:20.840
<v Speaker 2>He's on a run now like six or seven straight

0:44:20.880 --> 0:44:23.360
<v Speaker 2>events where it's worst finished is eighth. I mean it

0:44:23.520 --> 0:44:26.720
<v Speaker 2>just worst finished this year is twenty fifth at waste management,

0:44:26.800 --> 0:44:30.399
<v Speaker 2>twentieth afth the players, everything else is a legit, every

0:44:30.440 --> 0:44:33.279
<v Speaker 2>single win to win exactly well. I mean the US

0:44:33.360 --> 0:44:36.160
<v Speaker 2>Open was a great example. I mean, he clearly did

0:44:36.200 --> 0:44:40.560
<v Speaker 2>not have his A game, and I would argue maybe

0:44:40.600 --> 0:44:42.560
<v Speaker 2>the first couple of days it might not even have

0:44:42.640 --> 0:44:45.319
<v Speaker 2>been his B game. And sure enough, come the end

0:44:45.320 --> 0:44:46.560
<v Speaker 2>of the week, where does he finish?

0:44:46.960 --> 0:44:47.479
<v Speaker 3>Top ten?

0:44:48.120 --> 0:44:53.279
<v Speaker 2>So that and you know, I can remember Tiger, you know,

0:44:54.320 --> 0:44:56.600
<v Speaker 2>didn't make a lot of other players very happy. But

0:44:56.680 --> 0:44:58.920
<v Speaker 2>sometimes Tiger would announce that he had won with.

0:44:58.920 --> 0:44:59.560
<v Speaker 3>His B game.

0:45:01.040 --> 0:45:03.800
<v Speaker 1>So I'm going to put you on the spot. Yeah,

0:45:03.880 --> 0:45:05.800
<v Speaker 1>who has more majors at the end of their career?

0:45:05.880 --> 0:45:09.200
<v Speaker 1>Rory or Scotty? Wow, So we got Rory at five

0:45:09.239 --> 0:45:16.000
<v Speaker 1>and yes he's a little bit older now, yeah, and Scott.

0:45:13.880 --> 0:45:15.400
<v Speaker 3>Is at three three.

0:45:17.040 --> 0:45:20.640
<v Speaker 2>I'm gonna say Scotti ends up with I Really, I

0:45:21.280 --> 0:45:24.440
<v Speaker 2>just think he's I think he's got a lot that

0:45:24.520 --> 0:45:27.160
<v Speaker 2>he still wants to do. You know, I think it'll

0:45:27.200 --> 0:45:31.360
<v Speaker 2>be interesting to see if Rory can reset, you know,

0:45:31.480 --> 0:45:34.400
<v Speaker 2>after reaching that goal of the career Grand Slam and

0:45:34.440 --> 0:45:37.279
<v Speaker 2>finally winning the masters. You know, Rory to me is

0:45:37.400 --> 0:45:42.640
<v Speaker 2>entering an age where you know, he's thirty five.

0:45:42.719 --> 0:45:47.239
<v Speaker 3>Now, and you know, yeah, I mean it's you.

0:45:47.200 --> 0:45:50.680
<v Speaker 2>Know, it used to be in my generation, your thirties

0:45:50.680 --> 0:45:51.880
<v Speaker 2>were kind of like your prime.

0:45:52.560 --> 0:45:55.000
<v Speaker 3>Yeah, you know, I mean you kind of got out.

0:45:54.880 --> 0:45:57.400
<v Speaker 2>On tour in your twenties and you kind of figured

0:45:57.440 --> 0:46:01.000
<v Speaker 2>it out and and got better and you know, figured

0:46:01.000 --> 0:46:01.920
<v Speaker 2>out maybe how to win.

0:46:02.040 --> 0:46:03.359
<v Speaker 3>And then you know, by the.

0:46:03.320 --> 0:46:05.920
<v Speaker 2>Time you were in your thirties, kind of your mental

0:46:05.960 --> 0:46:09.640
<v Speaker 2>and your physical kind of melded together to reach your peak.

0:46:10.160 --> 0:46:13.160
<v Speaker 2>I see that happening a lot earlier now with the

0:46:13.280 --> 0:46:16.360
<v Speaker 2>guys on tour, you know, they seem to peak mid twenties,

0:46:16.400 --> 0:46:19.880
<v Speaker 2>some of them, you know, so really maybe Scotty's just

0:46:19.880 --> 0:46:23.440
<v Speaker 2>coming into his peak and Rory is, you know, accomplished

0:46:23.440 --> 0:46:26.880
<v Speaker 2>a lot and can he get himself back and motivated

0:46:27.000 --> 0:46:30.160
<v Speaker 2>enough to keep going so you know, it'd be fun

0:46:30.160 --> 0:46:30.560
<v Speaker 2>to watch.

0:46:32.960 --> 0:46:35.960
<v Speaker 1>Why Gary, do you think we are seeing this kind

0:46:36.040 --> 0:46:39.279
<v Speaker 1>of trend of You know, my dad talks about this

0:46:39.360 --> 0:46:41.479
<v Speaker 1>a lot. When you used to come out on tour,

0:46:41.600 --> 0:46:44.200
<v Speaker 1>you had to serve an apprenticeship. You needed to kind

0:46:44.200 --> 0:46:47.960
<v Speaker 1>of earn your stripes, learn the ropes, learn the tournaments.

0:46:48.320 --> 0:46:50.120
<v Speaker 1>It was going to take you. Even if you were

0:46:50.160 --> 0:46:52.840
<v Speaker 1>a great college player or had a great amateur career,

0:46:53.560 --> 0:46:55.920
<v Speaker 1>it was going to take you. Everybody said, listen, it's

0:46:55.960 --> 0:46:57.800
<v Speaker 1>going to take him three, four or five years to

0:46:57.880 --> 0:46:59.960
<v Speaker 1>kind of figure it out. Man, he's going to start winning.

0:47:00.320 --> 0:47:03.640
<v Speaker 1>But we are just seeing on mass for the last

0:47:03.920 --> 0:47:07.520
<v Speaker 1>five to seven years, the players come out of come

0:47:07.560 --> 0:47:10.680
<v Speaker 1>that wolf comes out of college wins me like, these

0:47:10.719 --> 0:47:13.600
<v Speaker 1>players come out. Do you see anything as to why

0:47:13.640 --> 0:47:18.279
<v Speaker 1>that is happening more and faster now then maybe it

0:47:18.360 --> 0:47:22.839
<v Speaker 1>did in your era or the past. I think one

0:47:22.880 --> 0:47:25.280
<v Speaker 1>of the big things is the technology that's available.

0:47:26.120 --> 0:47:28.040
<v Speaker 3>I really do. The instruction is so.

0:47:28.080 --> 0:47:32.520
<v Speaker 2>Much better, The technology is better. You know a lot

0:47:32.560 --> 0:47:35.880
<v Speaker 2>of a lot of what we did, you know, and

0:47:35.920 --> 0:47:37.920
<v Speaker 2>then this goes back to the mid seventies when I

0:47:37.960 --> 0:47:39.440
<v Speaker 2>started on the tour. A lot of what we did

0:47:39.520 --> 0:47:42.160
<v Speaker 2>was trial and error. I mean it was it was

0:47:42.200 --> 0:47:45.120
<v Speaker 2>just trial and error. I mean, you got you started

0:47:45.200 --> 0:47:46.880
<v Speaker 2>hitting balls, and if it was drawing too much, you

0:47:46.960 --> 0:47:49.319
<v Speaker 2>tried to figure out to make it go to the

0:47:49.360 --> 0:47:49.920
<v Speaker 2>other direction.

0:47:50.200 --> 0:47:53.800
<v Speaker 1>If you were testing drivers, if you found one you liked,

0:47:53.600 --> 0:47:55.600
<v Speaker 1>I just liked it, and you just used it.

0:47:55.840 --> 0:47:56.520
<v Speaker 3>You used it.

0:47:56.600 --> 0:47:59.520
<v Speaker 2>I mean, you didn't have numbers, you didn't have launch angle,

0:47:59.600 --> 0:48:02.400
<v Speaker 2>you didn't you knew it felt good and when you

0:48:02.480 --> 0:48:05.160
<v Speaker 2>swung it produced a shot that you knew you could play.

0:48:05.680 --> 0:48:08.560
<v Speaker 2>So I think these guys are just much better prepared

0:48:08.640 --> 0:48:12.879
<v Speaker 2>from that standpoint. And look, there's no question. I mean

0:48:13.280 --> 0:48:15.600
<v Speaker 2>when I played in college, I played against some great

0:48:15.640 --> 0:48:19.160
<v Speaker 2>players Ben Crenshaw and Tom Kite and you know, Curtis

0:48:19.200 --> 0:48:21.400
<v Speaker 2>Strange and Jay Haas, and I mean, you know a

0:48:21.440 --> 0:48:25.040
<v Speaker 2>lot of great players. But the sheer number of really

0:48:25.200 --> 0:48:29.760
<v Speaker 2>good players now is so much more than when we played.

0:48:30.280 --> 0:48:33.520
<v Speaker 2>And I think because that level of competition is so

0:48:33.640 --> 0:48:38.359
<v Speaker 2>much better, these guys are just used to, you know,

0:48:38.719 --> 0:48:43.239
<v Speaker 2>performing at a top level sooner. It is interesting, you know,

0:48:43.320 --> 0:48:46.759
<v Speaker 2>I think back on my class that you know, when

0:48:46.800 --> 0:48:48.759
<v Speaker 2>I went to the tour school in the fall in

0:48:48.840 --> 0:48:52.319
<v Speaker 2>nineteen seventy five, and everybody talks about, you know, all

0:48:52.400 --> 0:48:53.520
<v Speaker 2>these guys are winning.

0:48:53.280 --> 0:48:55.480
<v Speaker 3>Right out of the gate now and blah blah blah blah.

0:48:55.560 --> 0:49:00.760
<v Speaker 2>Well, in my class, Bob Gilder won is second start

0:49:00.800 --> 0:49:06.160
<v Speaker 2>in Phoenix. I won my sixth start at Tallahassee. Jerry

0:49:06.200 --> 0:49:09.560
<v Speaker 2>Pate won the US Open and the Canadian Open. His

0:49:09.760 --> 0:49:15.200
<v Speaker 2>rookie year, you know. So it's not like this is

0:49:15.239 --> 0:49:19.040
<v Speaker 2>a totally new phenomenon, these guys coming out of college

0:49:19.080 --> 0:49:23.280
<v Speaker 2>and winning tournaments right away. So you know, it's happened before,

0:49:24.360 --> 0:49:28.600
<v Speaker 2>maybe not as frequently for sure, but you know, the

0:49:29.239 --> 0:49:31.759
<v Speaker 2>guys are just better. I mean, they're just better playing.

0:49:31.760 --> 0:49:34.680
<v Speaker 2>I mean I think you know, look, I'm three times

0:49:34.719 --> 0:49:36.840
<v Speaker 2>first time, you know, all American at Florida. I was

0:49:36.960 --> 0:49:40.160
<v Speaker 2>runner up individually in the NCAA tot Crenshaw one year

0:49:40.160 --> 0:49:43.000
<v Speaker 2>and Curtis Strains the next year. These guys are so

0:49:43.160 --> 0:49:46.680
<v Speaker 2>much better than I was coming out of college. I mean,

0:49:47.160 --> 0:49:49.839
<v Speaker 2>you know, I could somewhat hit the ball. I could

0:49:49.840 --> 0:49:53.080
<v Speaker 2>putt like crazy, and I could chip like crazy. These

0:49:53.080 --> 0:49:55.960
<v Speaker 2>guys now strike the ball. I mean, it's just it's

0:49:56.120 --> 0:49:56.640
<v Speaker 2>night and day.

0:49:57.040 --> 0:49:58.439
<v Speaker 3>It really is. It's night and day.

0:49:59.000 --> 0:50:01.920
<v Speaker 1>Other than obviously, maybe we I was going to say,

0:50:01.960 --> 0:50:04.640
<v Speaker 1>other than the equipment. Maybe we can't take the equipment

0:50:04.719 --> 0:50:08.319
<v Speaker 1>out of the equation. But in your mind, what is

0:50:08.560 --> 0:50:11.520
<v Speaker 1>in twenty twenty five the professional game? How is it

0:50:12.040 --> 0:50:16.960
<v Speaker 1>played differently by the players than when you played? What

0:50:17.080 --> 0:50:19.719
<v Speaker 1>do you look at and go okay, that is just

0:50:19.960 --> 0:50:24.879
<v Speaker 1>a completely different way of playing the game. Than we

0:50:24.920 --> 0:50:25.880
<v Speaker 1>played it right.

0:50:26.200 --> 0:50:28.839
<v Speaker 2>Well, I think it starts with the analytics. You know,

0:50:28.920 --> 0:50:33.000
<v Speaker 2>we had no analytics. I mean we just did you know, Yeah,

0:50:33.040 --> 0:50:35.960
<v Speaker 2>you might keep your own you know stats. You know

0:50:36.000 --> 0:50:39.080
<v Speaker 2>I hit so many yeah, I mean, you know, but

0:50:39.160 --> 0:50:42.440
<v Speaker 2>we didn't have analytics as the best way to play holes.

0:50:43.160 --> 0:50:45.759
<v Speaker 2>You mentioned Josh Gregory a little earlier about he's now

0:50:45.800 --> 0:50:48.759
<v Speaker 2>working with JJ spond. So about four years ago, I'm

0:50:48.800 --> 0:50:51.839
<v Speaker 2>on the range at the Players and Josh is there

0:50:51.880 --> 0:50:54.560
<v Speaker 2>and I and I said, Josh, you know, help me

0:50:54.640 --> 0:51:00.600
<v Speaker 2>understand something. I said, I never see this generation players

0:51:01.200 --> 0:51:06.279
<v Speaker 2>lay up. I mean it's always attack, attack, attack, And

0:51:06.360 --> 0:51:07.359
<v Speaker 2>I said, why is that?

0:51:07.440 --> 0:51:07.480
<v Speaker 1>What?

0:51:08.400 --> 0:51:12.480
<v Speaker 2>Help me understand that? And he goes, Gary, these guys

0:51:12.560 --> 0:51:14.720
<v Speaker 2>don't fear penalty strokes.

0:51:15.320 --> 0:51:16.600
<v Speaker 3>And it was like whoa.

0:51:17.719 --> 0:51:22.000
<v Speaker 2>That just blew my mind because in our day, out

0:51:22.000 --> 0:51:26.160
<v Speaker 2>of bounds was a complete sin. I mean, you couldn't

0:51:26.160 --> 0:51:28.560
<v Speaker 2>afford to hit a ball out of bounds. You're going

0:51:28.600 --> 0:51:30.640
<v Speaker 2>to make a double bogie. And we didn't make that

0:51:30.680 --> 0:51:33.560
<v Speaker 2>many birdies, so you know, you got to a hole

0:51:33.600 --> 0:51:34.560
<v Speaker 2>where you weren't comfortable.

0:51:34.600 --> 0:51:36.400
<v Speaker 3>It was tight. I mean, you know, you hit a

0:51:36.480 --> 0:51:39.439
<v Speaker 3>one iron off the tee or whatever. And he goes.

0:51:39.480 --> 0:51:41.840
<v Speaker 2>You have to remember that most of the golf courses

0:51:41.920 --> 0:51:45.040
<v Speaker 2>that these guys play, they're going to reach probably three

0:51:45.120 --> 0:51:47.319
<v Speaker 2>or maybe all four of the par fives and two.

0:51:48.200 --> 0:51:52.400
<v Speaker 2>So they're literally playing par sixty eight or nine golf courses.

0:51:52.400 --> 0:51:53.920
<v Speaker 2>If it's a par seventy two course.

0:51:54.239 --> 0:51:55.320
<v Speaker 1>In their head, they're.

0:51:55.120 --> 0:51:56.879
<v Speaker 3>Like in their head, in their head.

0:51:57.440 --> 0:52:01.080
<v Speaker 1>And I saw recently Gary, but pretty much everybody on

0:52:01.120 --> 0:52:03.640
<v Speaker 1>the PGA Tour every single year is under par on

0:52:03.680 --> 0:52:07.319
<v Speaker 1>the par fix right right, So it's just full attack.

0:52:08.520 --> 0:52:09.040
<v Speaker 3>Exactly.

0:52:09.120 --> 0:52:12.000
<v Speaker 2>So he goes, Look, if they feel like they're going

0:52:12.080 --> 0:52:14.880
<v Speaker 2>to make two three birdies on the par fives, and

0:52:14.920 --> 0:52:17.560
<v Speaker 2>they're probably going to make another birdie or two somewhere else.

0:52:18.000 --> 0:52:20.160
<v Speaker 3>So if they go for the.

0:52:20.120 --> 0:52:22.319
<v Speaker 2>Green and they hit a ball in the water and

0:52:22.320 --> 0:52:24.719
<v Speaker 2>they make a bobie, it's not that big a deal.

0:52:25.160 --> 0:52:25.360
<v Speaker 3>You know.

0:52:25.400 --> 0:52:29.200
<v Speaker 2>They're just not overly concerned about it because they know

0:52:29.800 --> 0:52:32.360
<v Speaker 2>they're going to make enough birdies to still shoot a

0:52:32.400 --> 0:52:35.839
<v Speaker 2>good score. And that was the most mind boggling thing

0:52:35.920 --> 0:52:39.520
<v Speaker 2>to me because it was so opposite of how we played.

0:52:39.600 --> 0:52:42.640
<v Speaker 2>I mean, we feared penalty strokes. I mean we you

0:52:42.719 --> 0:52:45.799
<v Speaker 2>just you couldn't afford them because you just I mean,

0:52:46.680 --> 0:52:50.120
<v Speaker 2>you know, if I made three birdies around average, three

0:52:50.120 --> 0:52:52.719
<v Speaker 2>birdies around that was probably pretty good. You know, a

0:52:52.760 --> 0:52:55.480
<v Speaker 2>little over three birdies that was great. Well, you know,

0:52:55.760 --> 0:52:57.359
<v Speaker 2>if I hit it out of bounds on the whole,

0:52:57.960 --> 0:53:02.680
<v Speaker 2>there goes, there goes the three birdies that I'm gonna make,

0:53:02.840 --> 0:53:05.719
<v Speaker 2>and you know, you can't shoot a good score. So

0:53:06.480 --> 0:53:11.640
<v Speaker 2>the mindset is just totally different. And look, you know,

0:53:12.000 --> 0:53:14.480
<v Speaker 2>I'm an old fogie and you know sometimes I'm.

0:53:14.360 --> 0:53:15.800
<v Speaker 3>Marvel and wonder.

0:53:15.920 --> 0:53:18.200
<v Speaker 2>You know, can playing out of the rough from eighty

0:53:18.280 --> 0:53:20.840
<v Speaker 2>yards be better than playing from the fairway at one hundred?

0:53:21.040 --> 0:53:24.400
<v Speaker 2>I know where I'd prefer to play from. But obviously

0:53:24.480 --> 0:53:28.600
<v Speaker 2>these guys have the statistics, they have the information, and

0:53:28.640 --> 0:53:31.279
<v Speaker 2>they know that you know, closer yard of the whole,

0:53:31.400 --> 0:53:33.040
<v Speaker 2>the better the score is going to be.

0:53:33.520 --> 0:53:35.560
<v Speaker 1>I see Gary in twenty three. I mentioned at the

0:53:35.600 --> 0:53:38.160
<v Speaker 1>beginning you won the Paint Store It award. Such an

0:53:38.200 --> 0:53:41.400
<v Speaker 1>amazing honor to be given to you by your peers,

0:53:41.440 --> 0:53:45.560
<v Speaker 1>by the PJ Tour. When you look back at your career,

0:53:45.640 --> 0:53:48.239
<v Speaker 1>both on the course and off the course, Garret, what

0:53:48.239 --> 0:53:53.640
<v Speaker 1>are you most proud of? Yeah, that's a good question, Claude.

0:53:53.680 --> 0:53:57.560
<v Speaker 1>I you know, probably you know how you conducted yourself.

0:53:58.840 --> 0:54:01.400
<v Speaker 1>You know, I was a I was a big, big

0:54:01.520 --> 0:54:05.359
<v Speaker 1>Arnold Palmer fan when I was a kid. Actually got

0:54:05.400 --> 0:54:07.239
<v Speaker 1>to play with him in an exhibition when I was

0:54:07.239 --> 0:54:09.799
<v Speaker 1>seventeen years old, one of the greatest days of my

0:54:10.040 --> 0:54:10.760
<v Speaker 1>entire life.

0:54:11.320 --> 0:54:14.640
<v Speaker 3>And I can just remember how he made.

0:54:14.400 --> 0:54:17.759
<v Speaker 2>Me feel that day, and how he made everybody that

0:54:18.160 --> 0:54:21.200
<v Speaker 2>was around him feel. And that was always a big

0:54:21.200 --> 0:54:21.840
<v Speaker 2>goal of mine.

0:54:22.120 --> 0:54:22.319
<v Speaker 3>You know.

0:54:22.360 --> 0:54:25.640
<v Speaker 2>I used to get letters from notes from my pro

0:54:25.719 --> 0:54:29.680
<v Speaker 2>am partners saying, what a great day, appreciate it, thank

0:54:29.680 --> 0:54:32.040
<v Speaker 2>you very much for being so you know, kind with

0:54:32.120 --> 0:54:34.839
<v Speaker 2>your time and generous. And I would write him back

0:54:34.880 --> 0:54:37.600
<v Speaker 2>and I say, look, I just treated you the way

0:54:37.640 --> 0:54:39.560
<v Speaker 2>I'd like to be treated if the shoe was on

0:54:39.600 --> 0:54:41.799
<v Speaker 2>the other foot. I mean, you know, it's not that

0:54:41.920 --> 0:54:44.719
<v Speaker 2>big a deal. So how you know how I was

0:54:44.760 --> 0:54:47.279
<v Speaker 2>able to conduct myself, obviously, is a big part of it.

0:54:47.760 --> 0:54:50.359
<v Speaker 2>Peter Jacobson summed it up really nicely too me And

0:54:50.360 --> 0:54:52.839
<v Speaker 2>Peter's a former pain Steward Award winner too, and he goes,

0:54:52.880 --> 0:54:54.719
<v Speaker 2>you know, you play your way into the Hall of Fame,

0:54:55.560 --> 0:54:58.320
<v Speaker 2>but your peers vote to you as the pain Steward

0:54:58.360 --> 0:55:01.239
<v Speaker 2>Award winner, So you know, to be thought of that

0:55:01.440 --> 0:55:05.000
<v Speaker 2>highly by your peers, uh, you know, for a long career.

0:55:05.040 --> 0:55:07.480
<v Speaker 2>I mean I say, I played fifteen or sixteen years

0:55:07.480 --> 0:55:10.480
<v Speaker 2>and did television for you know, another thirty two, so

0:55:10.640 --> 0:55:13.600
<v Speaker 2>you know, it was almost a fifty year career involved

0:55:13.600 --> 0:55:15.520
<v Speaker 2>with a PGA tour. And so to be able to

0:55:15.560 --> 0:55:18.279
<v Speaker 2>be thought of that way by your by your peers is,

0:55:18.800 --> 0:55:20.960
<v Speaker 2>as I said at the acceptance speech that night, it

0:55:21.000 --> 0:55:22.560
<v Speaker 2>was clearly the highlight of my career.

0:55:22.960 --> 0:55:26.239
<v Speaker 1>Wow, it's been so cool to talk to you. You know,

0:55:26.280 --> 0:55:30.759
<v Speaker 1>I missing you and yeah, no team. Honestly, I think

0:55:30.800 --> 0:55:33.480
<v Speaker 1>the game, you know, from a TV standpoint, from a

0:55:33.480 --> 0:55:38.720
<v Speaker 1>broadcast standpoint, is lesser without you on the broadcast weekend

0:55:38.719 --> 0:55:41.040
<v Speaker 1>and week out like you were for NBC. So it

0:55:41.160 --> 0:55:43.440
<v Speaker 1>was just so special and and you know, I got

0:55:43.440 --> 0:55:46.560
<v Speaker 1>to watch Sunday unfortunately DJ missed the cut and I'm

0:55:46.560 --> 0:55:49.239
<v Speaker 1>sitting there watching the whole broadcast and I was like, man,

0:55:49.320 --> 0:55:51.799
<v Speaker 1>it's an old school US Open, and it's an old

0:55:51.800 --> 0:55:54.400
<v Speaker 1>school we got. We got Roger and Gary back. It

0:55:54.920 --> 0:55:58.640
<v Speaker 1>was great. Yeah, great talking to you Gary, and hopefully

0:55:58.719 --> 0:56:01.560
<v Speaker 1>we will get to see you against soon. But thanks

0:56:01.600 --> 0:56:04.880
<v Speaker 1>for everything you do, and like I said, you've been

0:56:04.960 --> 0:56:07.600
<v Speaker 1>such a part of the broadcast, part of golf over

0:56:07.600 --> 0:56:12.279
<v Speaker 1>the last you know, twenty thirty years, and I sure

0:56:12.280 --> 0:56:12.880
<v Speaker 1>as hell miss you.

0:56:13.320 --> 0:56:15.960
<v Speaker 2>Well, I appreciate that, Claude. I also want to say

0:56:16.000 --> 0:56:18.680
<v Speaker 2>thank you to you because you were one of the

0:56:18.719 --> 0:56:21.560
<v Speaker 2>guys and anytime I needed some information about any one

0:56:21.600 --> 0:56:23.680
<v Speaker 2>of your players and I would shoot a text to you,

0:56:23.760 --> 0:56:25.719
<v Speaker 2>and even if it was in the middle of a telecast,

0:56:26.200 --> 0:56:29.040
<v Speaker 2>I would get a response back right away saying, you

0:56:29.080 --> 0:56:31.160
<v Speaker 2>know DJ's working on this, or this is a new

0:56:31.200 --> 0:56:33.880
<v Speaker 2>putter in his bagged today, or Brooks is doing this,

0:56:34.120 --> 0:56:37.040
<v Speaker 2>and you know it helped make the broadcast better when

0:56:37.080 --> 0:56:41.080
<v Speaker 2>I can pass along information like that. So appreciate that

0:56:41.560 --> 0:56:43.360
<v Speaker 2>you were a big help to me in my career.

0:56:43.960 --> 0:56:46.200
<v Speaker 1>Well, you were one of the best, and we really

0:56:46.239 --> 0:56:48.640
<v Speaker 1>appreciate it some of it. Butch comes to you most

0:56:48.800 --> 0:56:52.839
<v Speaker 1>every week, Rate review, subscribe, wherever you get your podcasts.

0:56:53.160 --> 0:56:55.080
<v Speaker 1>It's the son of a Butch pupcast