1 00:00:02,440 --> 00:00:03,080 Speaker 1: Guess what will? 2 00:00:03,120 --> 00:00:03,720 Speaker 2: What's that mango? 3 00:00:03,920 --> 00:00:06,720 Speaker 1: So this week I started looking up Harry Potter knockoffs 4 00:00:06,720 --> 00:00:09,640 Speaker 1: and they are so terrible. I love them so much, 5 00:00:09,760 --> 00:00:12,160 Speaker 1: all right, So what'd you find? So there's this one 6 00:00:12,200 --> 00:00:16,159 Speaker 1: book in Spanish called Harry Porez and he's got his 7 00:00:16,200 --> 00:00:20,840 Speaker 1: friends Ron and Harmonia and they take on this evil 8 00:00:20,920 --> 00:00:24,079 Speaker 1: character named Condo Mort. I love how they change everyone's 9 00:00:24,160 --> 00:00:27,560 Speaker 1: name except Ron's, like there's no alternative name from Ron. 10 00:00:28,200 --> 00:00:30,440 Speaker 1: There's also one from Russia where he's kind of more 11 00:00:30,440 --> 00:00:32,720 Speaker 1: of a rock star and he rides a double bass 12 00:00:32,800 --> 00:00:36,440 Speaker 1: instead of a broom. But my favorite one is from China, 13 00:00:36,479 --> 00:00:41,240 Speaker 1: where Harry has to chase down Voldemort's protege Jandamort, who 14 00:00:41,320 --> 00:00:43,519 Speaker 1: apparently used to work for the circus under the name 15 00:00:43,640 --> 00:00:46,960 Speaker 1: Naughty Bubble. And there's also kind of into that to 16 00:00:47,080 --> 00:00:49,040 Speaker 1: check this out for some reason, there's also a character 17 00:00:49,120 --> 00:00:51,880 Speaker 1: named Big Spinach in it, but none of it makes 18 00:00:51,960 --> 00:00:54,440 Speaker 1: any sense. And can you imagine, like how bummed you'd 19 00:00:54,440 --> 00:00:56,400 Speaker 1: be if you ask for a Harry Potter book from 20 00:00:56,440 --> 00:00:58,240 Speaker 1: your parents and instead they brought you one of these 21 00:00:58,320 --> 00:01:01,480 Speaker 1: knock on ma I'm kind of into the but you know, 22 00:01:01,600 --> 00:01:04,880 Speaker 1: seeing all these crazy titles. Maybe wonder how does copyright work? 23 00:01:04,920 --> 00:01:08,160 Speaker 1: Like why can you remix a Sherlock home story but 24 00:01:08,240 --> 00:01:10,840 Speaker 1: not use Felix the Cat to advertise your work? Like 25 00:01:11,200 --> 00:01:15,200 Speaker 1: why are people so excited about twenty nineteen's public domain day. 26 00:01:15,280 --> 00:01:17,560 Speaker 1: We're gonna get into all of this. Let's dig in. 27 00:01:38,840 --> 00:01:41,319 Speaker 3: Hey, the podcast listeners, welcome to Part Time Genius. I'm 28 00:01:41,319 --> 00:01:43,319 Speaker 3: Will Pearson and as always I'm joined by my good 29 00:01:43,319 --> 00:01:45,520 Speaker 3: friend Mangush hot ticketter and on the other side of 30 00:01:45,560 --> 00:01:48,680 Speaker 3: the soundproof glass celebrating the demise of copyright by eating 31 00:01:48,920 --> 00:01:52,560 Speaker 3: Those are those Charleston jew They are dancing with Charleston. 32 00:01:52,640 --> 00:01:55,400 Speaker 3: That's our friend and producer Tristan McNeil. All right, so 33 00:01:55,520 --> 00:01:57,320 Speaker 3: just explain a little bit. I have to point out 34 00:01:57,320 --> 00:01:59,360 Speaker 3: that part of the reason Christin is doing this is 35 00:01:59,360 --> 00:02:02,320 Speaker 3: because he's lairing the Charleston song. It took me a 36 00:02:02,320 --> 00:02:05,320 Speaker 3: minute to figure this out. You could probably hear this 37 00:02:05,400 --> 00:02:07,840 Speaker 3: in the background now. The song itself was written to 38 00:02:07,920 --> 00:02:10,520 Speaker 3: accompany the dance back when it debuted back in nineteen 39 00:02:10,600 --> 00:02:14,880 Speaker 3: twenty three, and it kicked off this national craze. What's 40 00:02:15,040 --> 00:02:18,400 Speaker 3: notable about this is that twenty nineteen actually marks the 41 00:02:18,600 --> 00:02:22,079 Speaker 3: end of the Charleston Songs copyright protection. I don't know 42 00:02:22,120 --> 00:02:24,080 Speaker 3: if you knew this, if you've been following this, but 43 00:02:24,160 --> 00:02:26,600 Speaker 3: that is the case. So now anyone can make a 44 00:02:26,639 --> 00:02:29,440 Speaker 3: new recording of the song or play a nineteen twenty 45 00:02:29,440 --> 00:02:32,760 Speaker 3: three performance of it on a podcast, all without having 46 00:02:32,760 --> 00:02:35,320 Speaker 3: to pay a dime or worry about getting sued at 47 00:02:35,400 --> 00:02:36,239 Speaker 3: least I hope that. 48 00:02:37,120 --> 00:02:39,440 Speaker 1: Which is obviously great news for any listeners who are 49 00:02:39,440 --> 00:02:42,079 Speaker 1: into the Charleston or at least as into it as 50 00:02:42,240 --> 00:02:44,120 Speaker 1: Kristan is. Apparently I guess so. 51 00:02:44,480 --> 00:02:46,000 Speaker 3: But you know, it turns out there's a lot of 52 00:02:46,040 --> 00:02:48,600 Speaker 3: reasons the party like it's nineteen twenty three this month, 53 00:02:48,639 --> 00:02:51,480 Speaker 3: even if you're not a Charleston fan, And that's because 54 00:02:51,480 --> 00:02:53,839 Speaker 3: a slew of works from this year have just entered 55 00:02:53,840 --> 00:02:56,800 Speaker 3: the public domain for the very first time. Now, believe 56 00:02:56,800 --> 00:02:59,560 Speaker 3: it or not, this is actually the first mass influx 57 00:02:59,600 --> 00:03:02,760 Speaker 3: of public domain material in the US in twenty years, 58 00:03:02,800 --> 00:03:05,400 Speaker 3: I think. So we'll get in exactly why this is 59 00:03:05,480 --> 00:03:08,160 Speaker 3: and how it involves Mickey Mouse a little bit later, 60 00:03:08,560 --> 00:03:11,960 Speaker 3: but the main takeaway is that thousands of classic books 61 00:03:12,040 --> 00:03:15,120 Speaker 3: and movies and songs and other works of art they 62 00:03:15,160 --> 00:03:19,200 Speaker 3: are now free to use, remix, sell, all without any 63 00:03:19,320 --> 00:03:21,160 Speaker 3: legal restriction around them, which. 64 00:03:20,919 --> 00:03:23,280 Speaker 1: Is why we're marking the occasion with an episode all 65 00:03:23,280 --> 00:03:25,160 Speaker 1: about the ins and outs of the copyright. So we'll 66 00:03:25,160 --> 00:03:27,119 Speaker 1: talk a little bit about the history of copyright law, 67 00:03:27,200 --> 00:03:29,959 Speaker 1: including why the terms have been extended in the US 68 00:03:30,000 --> 00:03:32,840 Speaker 1: and also what makes this year so different from others. 69 00:03:32,840 --> 00:03:34,760 Speaker 1: Plus we'll take a closer look at the public domain 70 00:03:34,800 --> 00:03:37,480 Speaker 1: class of twenty nineteen to see exactly what sort of 71 00:03:37,600 --> 00:03:40,400 Speaker 1: hidden treasures just fell into our laps. But you know, will, 72 00:03:40,480 --> 00:03:42,400 Speaker 1: where do you want to start off here? All? 73 00:03:42,480 --> 00:03:42,600 Speaker 2: Right? 74 00:03:42,640 --> 00:03:44,520 Speaker 3: Well, I thought we should give our listeners a little 75 00:03:44,560 --> 00:03:47,200 Speaker 3: bit of context to all of this. So for starters, 76 00:03:47,440 --> 00:03:50,840 Speaker 3: January first is recognized all around the world is Public 77 00:03:50,960 --> 00:03:53,480 Speaker 3: Domain Day, and I actually didn't know that until we 78 00:03:53,480 --> 00:03:55,800 Speaker 3: were doing our research for this episode. But the way 79 00:03:55,840 --> 00:03:57,760 Speaker 3: that it works is that at the stroke of midnight 80 00:03:57,800 --> 00:04:01,000 Speaker 3: on New Year's Eve, older works are automatically enter the 81 00:04:01,040 --> 00:04:04,280 Speaker 3: public domain as they age out of their copyright terms. 82 00:04:04,760 --> 00:04:06,520 Speaker 3: But this is where things get a little bit tricky. 83 00:04:06,800 --> 00:04:09,800 Speaker 3: So different countries have their own rules for how long 84 00:04:09,840 --> 00:04:13,480 Speaker 3: a work can remain under copyright, so most countries will 85 00:04:13,480 --> 00:04:17,040 Speaker 3: provide copyright protection for the life of their author. Plus 86 00:04:17,080 --> 00:04:20,240 Speaker 3: a certain set number of years beyond that, like the 87 00:04:20,279 --> 00:04:23,520 Speaker 3: author's life plus fifty or seventy or whatever it may be. 88 00:04:23,920 --> 00:04:26,599 Speaker 3: But in the US things have traditionally worked a little 89 00:04:26,640 --> 00:04:30,560 Speaker 3: bit differently. So here copyrights made prior to nineteen seventy 90 00:04:30,600 --> 00:04:33,120 Speaker 3: eight have nothing to do with the life span of 91 00:04:33,160 --> 00:04:36,919 Speaker 3: the work's author. Instead, these copyright materials are protected for 92 00:04:36,960 --> 00:04:40,800 Speaker 3: a flat ninety five years after their first publication. It 93 00:04:40,800 --> 00:04:42,599 Speaker 3: always makes you wonder, like where they come up with 94 00:04:42,600 --> 00:04:45,760 Speaker 3: the number why ninety five? So, just as an example, 95 00:04:46,000 --> 00:04:48,599 Speaker 3: the Grapes of Wrath won't enter the US public domain 96 00:04:48,720 --> 00:04:52,400 Speaker 3: until January of two thousand and thirty five, because that 97 00:04:52,440 --> 00:04:56,120 Speaker 3: will be ninety five years after it was first published. Now, 98 00:04:56,160 --> 00:04:58,640 Speaker 3: on the other hand, readers in places like Canada and 99 00:04:58,680 --> 00:05:01,960 Speaker 3: New Zealand, can Rea and rework the text for free 100 00:05:02,000 --> 00:05:05,799 Speaker 3: starting this year, and that's because twenty nineteen is fifty 101 00:05:05,880 --> 00:05:08,960 Speaker 3: years after the death of the book's author, John Steinbeck. 102 00:05:09,080 --> 00:05:11,039 Speaker 1: Isn't that weird? Like something about that like feels so 103 00:05:11,440 --> 00:05:14,080 Speaker 1: off to me. Yeah, I mean, it's this like quintessential 104 00:05:14,160 --> 00:05:16,719 Speaker 1: American novel and people in other countries actually get to 105 00:05:16,720 --> 00:05:18,920 Speaker 1: do whatever they want with it. First, I know, three 106 00:05:18,960 --> 00:05:21,960 Speaker 1: decades before Americans get to. It's super weird, but it 107 00:05:22,040 --> 00:05:24,200 Speaker 1: actually reminds you. I was reading about the rights to 108 00:05:24,240 --> 00:05:26,400 Speaker 1: the song this Land is Your Land, which, of course 109 00:05:26,440 --> 00:05:28,040 Speaker 1: you know what you got through. You wrote the lyrics too, 110 00:05:28,120 --> 00:05:30,920 Speaker 1: and that's a piece of music that just feels inseparable 111 00:05:31,000 --> 00:05:33,560 Speaker 1: from the American identity, and it's kind of come this 112 00:05:33,640 --> 00:05:36,200 Speaker 1: great American almost like an anthem, ever since it was 113 00:05:36,240 --> 00:05:39,920 Speaker 1: published back in nineteen forty five. But again for Canada 114 00:05:39,960 --> 00:05:43,119 Speaker 1: and other countries with copyright terms of life plus fifty years, 115 00:05:43,400 --> 00:05:46,080 Speaker 1: that song entered in the public domain last year, whereas 116 00:05:46,080 --> 00:05:48,320 Speaker 1: in the US you'll actually have to wait till twenty 117 00:05:48,360 --> 00:05:50,680 Speaker 1: forty one to be able to use it. Twenty forty one, 118 00:05:50,720 --> 00:05:52,880 Speaker 1: and that's when you're planning to put out a dubstep rema. 119 00:05:53,360 --> 00:05:56,640 Speaker 1: That's right, absolutely, But before we move on, I do 120 00:05:56,680 --> 00:05:59,080 Speaker 1: want to mention that this Land is Your Land is 121 00:05:59,200 --> 00:06:01,120 Speaker 1: kind of a funny case to look at it. So 122 00:06:01,360 --> 00:06:03,680 Speaker 1: the lyrics clained that the land belongs to you and me, 123 00:06:04,040 --> 00:06:07,200 Speaker 1: and that was actually Guthrie's intention for the song too. 124 00:06:07,680 --> 00:06:10,240 Speaker 1: In nineteen forty five, he published the song with a 125 00:06:10,279 --> 00:06:13,880 Speaker 1: copyright notice that read quote, this song is copyrighted in 126 00:06:13,920 --> 00:06:16,520 Speaker 1: the US for a period of twenty eight years, and 127 00:06:16,680 --> 00:06:20,159 Speaker 1: anybody caught singing it without our permission will be mighty 128 00:06:20,200 --> 00:06:22,640 Speaker 1: good friends of ourn because we don't give a durn 129 00:06:22,880 --> 00:06:26,000 Speaker 1: publish it, write it, sing it, swing to it, yodel it. 130 00:06:26,080 --> 00:06:28,160 Speaker 1: We wrote it. That's all we wanted to do. 131 00:06:28,360 --> 00:06:29,040 Speaker 2: That's hilarious. 132 00:06:29,080 --> 00:06:31,120 Speaker 3: And I'm curious that, like, why didn't the song enter 133 00:06:31,120 --> 00:06:33,320 Speaker 3: the public domain in the seventies, you know, like what 134 00:06:33,400 --> 00:06:34,080 Speaker 3: he wanted it to. 135 00:06:34,480 --> 00:06:37,839 Speaker 1: Well, apparently the publisher renewed the copyright at some point 136 00:06:37,880 --> 00:06:40,960 Speaker 1: without Guthrie's input, so the song's copyright status wound up 137 00:06:41,000 --> 00:06:43,559 Speaker 1: being extended and now it's covered by the current ninety 138 00:06:43,560 --> 00:06:45,000 Speaker 1: five year term we have in the US. 139 00:06:45,120 --> 00:06:47,120 Speaker 3: Okay, all right, well in that case, I mean now 140 00:06:47,200 --> 00:06:49,520 Speaker 3: seems like a good time to break down the key 141 00:06:49,640 --> 00:06:51,880 Speaker 3: changes to the copyright law that have taken place here 142 00:06:51,920 --> 00:06:54,400 Speaker 3: in the US over you know, over several decades. But 143 00:06:55,080 --> 00:06:57,000 Speaker 3: don't worry about your eyes glazing over because I'm going 144 00:06:57,080 --> 00:06:59,560 Speaker 3: to try to keep this short and sweet good. So 145 00:06:59,760 --> 00:07:03,240 Speaker 3: they basically, American copyright law began with the Constitution, which 146 00:07:03,240 --> 00:07:06,479 Speaker 3: grants Congress the power to bestow exclusive rights to the 147 00:07:06,520 --> 00:07:10,440 Speaker 3: author of a work for quote limited times. So at first, 148 00:07:10,480 --> 00:07:13,600 Speaker 3: that limited time meant fourteen years, with the option to 149 00:07:13,640 --> 00:07:17,480 Speaker 3: renew for another fourteen years, making the max possible twenty 150 00:07:17,560 --> 00:07:20,200 Speaker 3: eight years. Now, those rules were mended over time that went. 151 00:07:20,200 --> 00:07:22,760 Speaker 3: By nineteen oh nine, both copyright terms had doubled to 152 00:07:22,840 --> 00:07:25,520 Speaker 3: twenty eight years or fifty six total. 153 00:07:25,600 --> 00:07:26,600 Speaker 2: I guess got it. 154 00:07:26,640 --> 00:07:29,000 Speaker 1: So that's where what you would have gotten that twenty 155 00:07:29,000 --> 00:07:31,960 Speaker 1: eight year term he claimed, you know, for the copyright 156 00:07:32,040 --> 00:07:34,000 Speaker 1: he was talking about. But you know, I'm sure he 157 00:07:34,080 --> 00:07:36,440 Speaker 1: never intended to renew the song for that second twenty 158 00:07:36,440 --> 00:07:37,560 Speaker 1: eight year period. 159 00:07:37,600 --> 00:07:38,040 Speaker 2: That's right. 160 00:07:38,080 --> 00:07:40,680 Speaker 3: So then you fast forward to nineteen seventy six and 161 00:07:40,720 --> 00:07:43,880 Speaker 3: the extension started getting kind of out of hand. So 162 00:07:43,960 --> 00:07:45,960 Speaker 3: the fifty six year period was bumped up to a 163 00:07:46,000 --> 00:07:49,640 Speaker 3: full seventy five years, meaning that any work produced through 164 00:07:49,760 --> 00:07:54,800 Speaker 3: nineteen twenty two would be copyright protected until nineteen ninety eight. Then, 165 00:07:55,000 --> 00:07:57,160 Speaker 3: in nineteen ninety eight, just as the nineteen twenty three 166 00:07:57,200 --> 00:08:00,320 Speaker 3: copyrights were about to expire for the next year, a 167 00:08:00,400 --> 00:08:02,680 Speaker 3: new piece of legislation was passed. It makes you wonder 168 00:08:02,680 --> 00:08:06,120 Speaker 3: why people were so interested in changing the legislation, But yeah, 169 00:08:06,160 --> 00:08:08,800 Speaker 3: the new law attacked on another twenty years for the 170 00:08:08,840 --> 00:08:12,240 Speaker 3: copyright of any work made between nineteen twenty three and 171 00:08:12,400 --> 00:08:14,000 Speaker 3: nineteen seventy seven. 172 00:08:14,000 --> 00:08:16,440 Speaker 1: And that's actually why there's this big twenty year gap 173 00:08:16,480 --> 00:08:18,400 Speaker 1: that we're just coming out of right now. 174 00:08:18,480 --> 00:08:19,600 Speaker 2: That is exactly right. 175 00:08:19,640 --> 00:08:22,600 Speaker 3: So those extra two decades added in, you know, nineteen 176 00:08:22,680 --> 00:08:24,800 Speaker 3: ninety eight was when this happened. It basically put a 177 00:08:24,840 --> 00:08:27,760 Speaker 3: freeze on the public domain editions. So the works that 178 00:08:27,800 --> 00:08:30,600 Speaker 3: were scheduled dinner the public domain were suddenly off the 179 00:08:30,680 --> 00:08:34,120 Speaker 3: table for another twenty years. And so that's what made 180 00:08:34,200 --> 00:08:37,040 Speaker 3: New Years of twenty nineteen such a big deal. 181 00:08:37,040 --> 00:08:39,080 Speaker 2: I mean, the drought is finally. 182 00:08:40,240 --> 00:08:43,080 Speaker 1: And I'm guessing that's for the foreseeable future too, right, 183 00:08:43,160 --> 00:08:45,360 Speaker 1: Like a whole year's worth of work should enter the 184 00:08:45,360 --> 00:08:48,640 Speaker 1: public domain every year now, ongoing. 185 00:08:48,280 --> 00:08:50,200 Speaker 3: Right, right, And it's really just the beginning of like 186 00:08:50,360 --> 00:08:53,680 Speaker 3: four decades worth of annual time capsules, you know, so 187 00:08:53,920 --> 00:08:56,760 Speaker 3: you know, long as corporations don't succeed in extending the 188 00:08:56,760 --> 00:09:00,560 Speaker 3: copyright terms even further. Although if we're being it's not 189 00:09:00,600 --> 00:09:03,200 Speaker 3: like the last twenty years haven't brought any new additions 190 00:09:03,240 --> 00:09:06,320 Speaker 3: to the public domain from this era, because plenty of 191 00:09:06,320 --> 00:09:09,360 Speaker 3: works from the nineteen twenties through the nineteen seventies have 192 00:09:09,480 --> 00:09:12,480 Speaker 3: already entered the public domain because their copyrights were never 193 00:09:12,520 --> 00:09:15,440 Speaker 3: renewed for one reason or another. And in fact, one 194 00:09:15,520 --> 00:09:18,760 Speaker 3: study from twenty eleven suggested that as many as ninety 195 00:09:18,760 --> 00:09:22,360 Speaker 3: percent of works published in the nineteen twenties were never 196 00:09:22,480 --> 00:09:25,280 Speaker 3: renewed at all, and the same is true for roughly 197 00:09:25,360 --> 00:09:27,920 Speaker 3: sixty percent of the works from the nineteen forties, So 198 00:09:27,960 --> 00:09:28,920 Speaker 3: there were a ton. 199 00:09:28,760 --> 00:09:29,840 Speaker 2: Of them that were out there. 200 00:09:30,200 --> 00:09:33,440 Speaker 3: So basically that extension in nineteen ninety eight only applied 201 00:09:33,440 --> 00:09:36,400 Speaker 3: to the works whose copyrights were still active at that time, 202 00:09:36,679 --> 00:09:39,760 Speaker 3: and so anything that hadn't been previously renewed was already 203 00:09:39,800 --> 00:09:40,600 Speaker 3: fair game. 204 00:09:40,440 --> 00:09:41,440 Speaker 2: For public use. 205 00:09:42,000 --> 00:09:44,120 Speaker 3: Of course, the tricky part has been determining whether an 206 00:09:44,160 --> 00:09:46,200 Speaker 3: old copyright has lapsed or not. 207 00:09:46,640 --> 00:09:49,240 Speaker 1: Yeah, I'm guessing that's a pretty murky business trying to 208 00:09:49,240 --> 00:09:50,160 Speaker 1: figure all that out. 209 00:09:50,160 --> 00:09:51,760 Speaker 3: It is, And you know, so in the past it's 210 00:09:51,760 --> 00:09:53,960 Speaker 3: been safer to err on the side of caution and 211 00:09:54,040 --> 00:09:56,360 Speaker 3: just kind of steer clear of any work whose status 212 00:09:56,480 --> 00:09:56,840 Speaker 3: was in. 213 00:09:56,840 --> 00:09:59,200 Speaker 2: Question, of course, to avoid getting sued. 214 00:10:00,000 --> 00:10:02,160 Speaker 3: His concerns are out the window at least as far 215 00:10:02,200 --> 00:10:05,160 Speaker 3: as works from nineteen twenty three go, And now that 216 00:10:05,160 --> 00:10:07,320 Speaker 3: they've passed the ninety five year mark. We know for 217 00:10:07,400 --> 00:10:09,120 Speaker 3: certain that they're in the public domain. 218 00:10:09,720 --> 00:10:11,679 Speaker 1: So I know there are probably some folks listening who 219 00:10:11,720 --> 00:10:13,880 Speaker 1: are thinking, okay, but who cares about all this old 220 00:10:13,920 --> 00:10:16,320 Speaker 1: timey stuff anyway. You know, it's not like I'm going 221 00:10:16,360 --> 00:10:18,640 Speaker 1: to start listening to chart toppers from the nineteen twenties 222 00:10:18,720 --> 00:10:22,760 Speaker 1: or whatever. But you know, that's totally fair. But here's 223 00:10:22,760 --> 00:10:24,600 Speaker 1: the thing that Gabe was pointing out to me. Most 224 00:10:24,600 --> 00:10:27,160 Speaker 1: of us honestly don't know what we've been missing out on. 225 00:10:27,520 --> 00:10:30,160 Speaker 1: Like the public domain provides this great chance for overlooked 226 00:10:30,160 --> 00:10:32,600 Speaker 1: works to find a second lease on life. And if 227 00:10:32,600 --> 00:10:34,920 Speaker 1: you look at what happened to It's a Wonderful Life. 228 00:10:35,080 --> 00:10:37,600 Speaker 1: You know, that movie actually flopped when it was first released, 229 00:10:37,840 --> 00:10:40,920 Speaker 1: but once it entered the public domain, it slowly became 230 00:10:40,920 --> 00:10:43,720 Speaker 1: a holiday classic. And that success only happened because TV 231 00:10:43,800 --> 00:10:46,040 Speaker 1: networks were actually able to play the movie for free 232 00:10:46,240 --> 00:10:49,400 Speaker 1: year after year. So in this weird way, it's like 233 00:10:49,600 --> 00:10:52,400 Speaker 1: cultural worth is actually greater today than it would have 234 00:10:52,400 --> 00:10:55,280 Speaker 1: been had it remained under a copyright. You know, there 235 00:10:55,320 --> 00:10:57,680 Speaker 1: is this author, Glenn Fleischman, and he had this great 236 00:10:57,720 --> 00:11:00,880 Speaker 1: quote in this article for the Atlantic, and he said, quote, 237 00:11:01,280 --> 00:11:04,560 Speaker 1: only so much that's created has room to persist in memory, culture, 238 00:11:04,559 --> 00:11:07,480 Speaker 1: and scholarship. Some works may have been forgotten because they 239 00:11:07,520 --> 00:11:10,760 Speaker 1: were simply terrible or perishable, but it's also the case 240 00:11:10,800 --> 00:11:12,960 Speaker 1: that a lack of access to these works and digital 241 00:11:13,040 --> 00:11:15,680 Speaker 1: forms limits whether they get considered at all. 242 00:11:16,240 --> 00:11:18,160 Speaker 3: I mean, it's a good point, and it actually reminds 243 00:11:18,200 --> 00:11:20,160 Speaker 3: me of something I came across this week from the 244 00:11:20,160 --> 00:11:24,360 Speaker 3: American novelist Willa Cather, and she once called nineteen twenty 245 00:11:24,400 --> 00:11:27,559 Speaker 3: two the year the world broke in two, and that 246 00:11:27,640 --> 00:11:30,200 Speaker 3: was because of all the big literary and cultural shakeups 247 00:11:30,200 --> 00:11:32,400 Speaker 3: that took place that year. It was the start of 248 00:11:32,440 --> 00:11:35,720 Speaker 3: the Harlem Renaissance, plus the publication of works like Ulysses 249 00:11:35,760 --> 00:11:38,520 Speaker 3: by James Joyce and The Wasteland by T. S. 250 00:11:38,600 --> 00:11:39,080 Speaker 2: Eliott. 251 00:11:39,400 --> 00:11:42,400 Speaker 3: So to her, nineteen twenty two was this turning point, 252 00:11:42,440 --> 00:11:44,800 Speaker 3: like there was a world before that year and then 253 00:11:44,840 --> 00:11:47,920 Speaker 3: there was a world after it. And strangely enough, that's 254 00:11:47,960 --> 00:11:51,240 Speaker 3: also how things broke down in terms of US copyright law. 255 00:11:51,360 --> 00:11:54,880 Speaker 3: So everything up through nineteen twenty two is now part 256 00:11:54,920 --> 00:11:57,800 Speaker 3: of the public domain, but it's a different story for 257 00:11:57,840 --> 00:12:01,480 Speaker 3: works from nineteen twenty three and beyond. So hundreds of 258 00:12:01,520 --> 00:12:05,280 Speaker 3: thousands of songs and movies and books and newspapers, magazines, 259 00:12:05,320 --> 00:12:07,959 Speaker 3: like so many different things of that era had been 260 00:12:08,000 --> 00:12:10,880 Speaker 3: held back for decades, longer than they should have been, 261 00:12:11,320 --> 00:12:13,000 Speaker 3: And so as a result, you figure there have to 262 00:12:13,040 --> 00:12:15,199 Speaker 3: be a lot of blind spots in our understanding of 263 00:12:15,240 --> 00:12:16,640 Speaker 3: that period in American history. 264 00:12:16,960 --> 00:12:19,320 Speaker 1: Yeah, like even things we know about, like the Harlem Renaissance, 265 00:12:19,360 --> 00:12:21,720 Speaker 1: so the Great Depression of World War two, Like we 266 00:12:21,800 --> 00:12:24,360 Speaker 1: should get like a fuller picture once we get access 267 00:12:24,360 --> 00:12:25,160 Speaker 1: to these materials. 268 00:12:25,200 --> 00:12:25,440 Speaker 2: Then. 269 00:12:25,640 --> 00:12:27,600 Speaker 1: Also, it'll be so fun to see them show up 270 00:12:27,600 --> 00:12:29,200 Speaker 1: in memes and music and things. 271 00:12:29,280 --> 00:12:29,520 Speaker 2: Yeah. 272 00:12:29,520 --> 00:12:31,000 Speaker 3: All right, Well, I'm excited to hear what you think 273 00:12:31,040 --> 00:12:33,240 Speaker 3: should make the cut this year. But before we share 274 00:12:33,280 --> 00:12:49,000 Speaker 3: our favorites, let's take a quick break. You're listening to 275 00:12:49,000 --> 00:12:51,360 Speaker 3: Part Time Genius, so we're talking about the giant wave 276 00:12:51,480 --> 00:12:54,319 Speaker 3: of classic art that just entered the public domain this month. 277 00:12:54,800 --> 00:12:56,760 Speaker 3: All right, Megan, So I'm curious which works are you 278 00:12:56,920 --> 00:12:59,560 Speaker 3: most excited to have free of their copyrights this year. 279 00:13:00,320 --> 00:13:02,120 Speaker 1: I'm just gonna go ahead and get the literature picks 280 00:13:02,160 --> 00:13:04,120 Speaker 1: out of the way first, because that's where you find 281 00:13:04,160 --> 00:13:06,400 Speaker 1: a lot of the heavy hitters, and honestly, it's too 282 00:13:06,440 --> 00:13:08,920 Speaker 1: many to go through So for fiction, we've got stories 283 00:13:08,960 --> 00:13:13,359 Speaker 1: from authors like Virginia Woolf, Aldus Huxley, Jane Austen Hemingway. 284 00:13:13,440 --> 00:13:16,400 Speaker 1: And then in terms of poetry, there's work from E. Cummings, 285 00:13:16,960 --> 00:13:22,120 Speaker 1: William Carlos, Williams, Wallace Stevens, Pablo Neruda, Robert Frost, including 286 00:13:22,120 --> 00:13:24,440 Speaker 1: one of his most famous poems, Stopping by Woods on 287 00:13:24,440 --> 00:13:27,199 Speaker 1: a snowy evening Like, which is just cool that these 288 00:13:27,200 --> 00:13:29,320 Speaker 1: texts are out there and easier to explore and play 289 00:13:29,320 --> 00:13:31,680 Speaker 1: with them before. But but what about you, Like, are 290 00:13:31,840 --> 00:13:33,360 Speaker 1: there any books you're happy to see in the public 291 00:13:33,400 --> 00:13:34,120 Speaker 1: domain that. 292 00:13:34,120 --> 00:13:36,160 Speaker 2: Was amazing to hear, like all those heavy hitters. 293 00:13:36,320 --> 00:13:36,640 Speaker 1: Yeah? 294 00:13:37,120 --> 00:13:39,920 Speaker 3: Here, But I always like it when famous literary characters 295 00:13:39,960 --> 00:13:41,760 Speaker 3: make their way into the public domain because you get 296 00:13:41,760 --> 00:13:44,400 Speaker 3: a whole bunch of new takes on them, Like that's 297 00:13:44,440 --> 00:13:46,840 Speaker 3: what happened with Robin Hood or Sherlock Holmes. 298 00:13:47,120 --> 00:13:49,480 Speaker 1: You know, I didn't think of that. So what new 299 00:13:49,559 --> 00:13:51,320 Speaker 1: characters are we getting to play with now? 300 00:13:51,679 --> 00:13:54,000 Speaker 3: All right? Well, twenty nineteen is giving us access to 301 00:13:54,080 --> 00:13:57,679 Speaker 3: new Tarzan stories from Edgar Rice Burrows, but also two 302 00:13:57,800 --> 00:14:02,319 Speaker 3: of Agatha Christie's mystery novels, Starr Belgian detective Hercule Puro, 303 00:14:02,880 --> 00:14:06,440 Speaker 3: the Murder of Roger Ackroyd, and the Murder on the Links. 304 00:14:06,960 --> 00:14:09,240 Speaker 1: Wait, wasn't Tarzan already in the public domain? 305 00:14:09,240 --> 00:14:11,920 Speaker 3: Though, Yeah, that's right, there's a story from nineteen ten 306 00:14:11,960 --> 00:14:14,880 Speaker 3: that's been in the public domain. And actually there's one 307 00:14:15,040 --> 00:14:17,720 Speaker 3: earlier Poro novel that's already there too. 308 00:14:18,120 --> 00:14:20,600 Speaker 1: So how do the laws work with characters like that? 309 00:14:20,760 --> 00:14:23,000 Speaker 1: I mean, can people just write their own new Tarzan 310 00:14:23,040 --> 00:14:26,360 Speaker 1: stories or can they only publish and rework the existing books? 311 00:14:26,440 --> 00:14:29,200 Speaker 1: Like is the copyright on the character or just the 312 00:14:29,240 --> 00:14:30,200 Speaker 1: stories he appears in. 313 00:14:30,760 --> 00:14:34,200 Speaker 3: Well, you can't actually copyright a name or a phrase 314 00:14:34,320 --> 00:14:36,160 Speaker 3: or anything like that. But what you can do is 315 00:14:36,200 --> 00:14:39,600 Speaker 3: get your character trademarked while it's still under copyright. So, 316 00:14:39,920 --> 00:14:42,400 Speaker 3: if you take the case of Tarzan, that's what the 317 00:14:42,440 --> 00:14:46,120 Speaker 3: author's airs did. So even though the original Tarzan stories 318 00:14:46,160 --> 00:14:49,280 Speaker 3: can be freely published and adapted for movies or comics 319 00:14:49,360 --> 00:14:52,520 Speaker 3: or whatever else, you still can't publish your own original 320 00:14:52,560 --> 00:14:55,720 Speaker 3: Tarzan books without receiving permission, And of course to do 321 00:14:55,800 --> 00:14:58,720 Speaker 3: that you'd have to pay a fee to the Burroughs estate, 322 00:14:58,800 --> 00:15:00,600 Speaker 3: And so things are a little more icy when it 323 00:15:00,600 --> 00:15:01,240 Speaker 3: comes to Pooro. 324 00:15:01,520 --> 00:15:04,280 Speaker 1: And why is that? Well, not all. 325 00:15:04,080 --> 00:15:08,640 Speaker 3: Copyrighted characters qualify for trademark protection, and some people you 326 00:15:08,680 --> 00:15:12,120 Speaker 3: know maintain that Pooro does not qualify so for reasons 327 00:15:12,120 --> 00:15:14,720 Speaker 3: that they're a little too complicated to get into here. 328 00:15:15,240 --> 00:15:17,760 Speaker 3: But until someone is willing to gamble, you know, a 329 00:15:17,760 --> 00:15:22,000 Speaker 3: potential lawsuit to publish their own unauthorized story, the character's 330 00:15:22,080 --> 00:15:25,360 Speaker 3: legal status is kind of in limen So the new 331 00:15:25,360 --> 00:15:28,520 Speaker 3: public domain additions for those characters are mostly exciting because 332 00:15:28,600 --> 00:15:32,240 Speaker 3: it means there are new Tarzan stories or Pooro mysteries 333 00:15:32,320 --> 00:15:35,720 Speaker 3: that can be safely adapted or altered by anyone, even 334 00:15:35,760 --> 00:15:38,680 Speaker 3: if the characters themselves are still otherwise off limits. 335 00:15:38,880 --> 00:15:40,840 Speaker 1: So I'm a little worried about what that might mean 336 00:15:40,880 --> 00:15:43,000 Speaker 1: for our next pick here, because even though twenty nineteen 337 00:15:43,040 --> 00:15:44,920 Speaker 1: Freese up the rights to a bunch of classic silent 338 00:15:44,920 --> 00:15:48,600 Speaker 1: films from people like a Buster Keaton, Charlie Chaplin, Laurel, 339 00:15:48,640 --> 00:15:51,160 Speaker 1: and Hardy, which is awesome, by the way, because like, 340 00:15:51,240 --> 00:15:53,360 Speaker 1: it'd be so amazing to start seeing these movies on 341 00:15:53,440 --> 00:15:56,400 Speaker 1: late night TV. But you know, the one I was 342 00:15:56,600 --> 00:15:59,720 Speaker 1: most personally excited about was the Felix the Cat cartoons, 343 00:15:59,720 --> 00:16:02,440 Speaker 1: which just hit the public domain, and I was kind 344 00:16:02,440 --> 00:16:04,600 Speaker 1: of hoping we could add it to the PTG logo 345 00:16:04,760 --> 00:16:07,120 Speaker 1: or just make him like the official show mascot or something, 346 00:16:07,120 --> 00:16:09,880 Speaker 1: but I'm guessing that's not the case if he's still 347 00:16:09,920 --> 00:16:10,640 Speaker 1: trademark right. 348 00:16:11,040 --> 00:16:13,520 Speaker 3: You know, Felix was one that stood out to me too, 349 00:16:13,560 --> 00:16:15,640 Speaker 3: so I actually did a little bit of digging on this, 350 00:16:15,760 --> 00:16:18,120 Speaker 3: and it turns out that even though the character is 351 00:16:18,160 --> 00:16:22,320 Speaker 3: still technically trademarked by DreamWorks, they only control his use 352 00:16:22,440 --> 00:16:25,600 Speaker 3: in certain instances. And you know, of course that's really 353 00:16:25,920 --> 00:16:29,560 Speaker 3: around advertising, So how does that work exactly? So you 354 00:16:29,560 --> 00:16:32,560 Speaker 3: could actually publish your own Felix the Cat comic strips 355 00:16:32,600 --> 00:16:36,440 Speaker 3: and even adapt those new stories into animated shorts, but weirdly, 356 00:16:36,520 --> 00:16:39,440 Speaker 3: you just can't include Felix himself and any of the 357 00:16:39,680 --> 00:16:44,960 Speaker 3: advertising for that. Apparently, DreamWorks also owns the Felix trademark 358 00:16:45,080 --> 00:16:48,000 Speaker 3: for quote life saving instruments, so I guess a line 359 00:16:48,000 --> 00:16:50,840 Speaker 3: of Felix branded fire extinguishers is totally off. 360 00:16:52,160 --> 00:16:53,960 Speaker 1: I feel like that's exactly where I was going with this, 361 00:16:54,080 --> 00:16:57,720 Speaker 1: like Felix EpiPens and spook detectors. But you know, if 362 00:16:57,720 --> 00:16:59,680 Speaker 1: cartoons aren't your thing, We've also got plenty of new 363 00:16:59,680 --> 00:17:02,200 Speaker 1: public domain songs to keep us busy, and there's some 364 00:17:02,240 --> 00:17:06,919 Speaker 1: real chestnuts here, tunes like dizzy Fingers Horsey keep your 365 00:17:06,920 --> 00:17:09,159 Speaker 1: tail up, I know that's a favorite in the Pierson 366 00:17:09,200 --> 00:17:14,040 Speaker 1: household aught and that timeless romantic vallid o g oh gosh, 367 00:17:14,080 --> 00:17:15,320 Speaker 1: oh golly, I'm in love. 368 00:17:15,520 --> 00:17:17,879 Speaker 3: I think these are probably in that collection of that 369 00:17:17,960 --> 00:17:21,920 Speaker 3: old amberolla, like, oh yeah, the house that's all those 370 00:17:22,320 --> 00:17:25,159 Speaker 3: wax cylinders. That's pretty cool to listen to, And you 371 00:17:25,160 --> 00:17:27,760 Speaker 3: know it truly was a different time. I was actually 372 00:17:27,800 --> 00:17:29,920 Speaker 3: listening to a few songs from our list this week, 373 00:17:29,960 --> 00:17:31,920 Speaker 3: and I was struck by how many of them were 374 00:17:31,960 --> 00:17:32,520 Speaker 3: just kind. 375 00:17:32,320 --> 00:17:35,000 Speaker 2: Of wide eyed, upbeat nonsense. 376 00:17:35,080 --> 00:17:37,240 Speaker 3: Like there was this one that was basically about how 377 00:17:37,240 --> 00:17:39,600 Speaker 3: strange it is that the earth rotates, and that it 378 00:17:39,640 --> 00:17:41,560 Speaker 3: can be daytime in one part of the world and 379 00:17:41,720 --> 00:17:44,720 Speaker 3: nighttime in another. It was riveting song, but and I 380 00:17:44,760 --> 00:17:46,240 Speaker 3: guess for fun, they just threw in a bunch of 381 00:17:46,320 --> 00:17:49,320 Speaker 3: gibbers that doesn't rhyme or fit the meter or anything. 382 00:17:49,400 --> 00:17:52,360 Speaker 3: So there's this one line that goes, when it's nighttime 383 00:17:52,359 --> 00:17:55,320 Speaker 3: in Italy, it's Wednesday over here, when it's fish day 384 00:17:55,359 --> 00:17:59,560 Speaker 3: in Germany, you can't get shaved in Massachusetts, and the 385 00:17:59,600 --> 00:18:03,080 Speaker 3: whole thing. It's just so bizarre, and I'm really hoping 386 00:18:03,119 --> 00:18:04,080 Speaker 3: this catches on again. 387 00:18:04,760 --> 00:18:07,479 Speaker 1: That is amazing and in the same vein of that 388 00:18:07,600 --> 00:18:10,840 Speaker 1: old timy nonsense songs. I'm pretty pumped that the copyright 389 00:18:10,920 --> 00:18:14,720 Speaker 1: finally expired on Yes We Have No Bananas Today, which 390 00:18:14,800 --> 00:18:16,600 Speaker 1: is actually one of the songs. I know. 391 00:18:17,040 --> 00:18:18,879 Speaker 3: I would definitely leave it to you to zero in 392 00:18:18,960 --> 00:18:21,280 Speaker 3: on the Banana song and a bunch of these, But. 393 00:18:21,960 --> 00:18:25,159 Speaker 1: Weirdly, it turns out there's actually a sequel song called 394 00:18:25,240 --> 00:18:28,159 Speaker 1: the It's called I've Got the Yes we Have No 395 00:18:28,240 --> 00:18:32,400 Speaker 1: Banana Blues, and since it was released the same year 396 00:18:32,400 --> 00:18:34,600 Speaker 1: as the original, it's now in the public domain as well. 397 00:18:34,800 --> 00:18:36,600 Speaker 2: So why did they do a follow up song? Was 398 00:18:36,640 --> 00:18:37,560 Speaker 2: it just that popular? 399 00:18:37,720 --> 00:18:40,359 Speaker 1: It's basically a response to how popular the first song 400 00:18:40,520 --> 00:18:42,760 Speaker 1: was and how sick everyone was of hearing it all 401 00:18:42,800 --> 00:18:45,320 Speaker 1: the time. And so one of the line says, quote, 402 00:18:45,720 --> 00:18:47,800 Speaker 1: it hasn't got a bit of sense, and I go 403 00:18:47,920 --> 00:18:51,520 Speaker 1: wild when they commence bananas bananas, I wish I could 404 00:18:51,560 --> 00:18:53,119 Speaker 1: break up a million pianos. 405 00:18:53,400 --> 00:18:54,760 Speaker 2: I get it. 406 00:18:55,600 --> 00:18:56,919 Speaker 3: I mean, I kind of love that this song is 407 00:18:56,960 --> 00:18:59,600 Speaker 3: going to start annoying everyone all over again. 408 00:19:00,119 --> 00:19:01,639 Speaker 2: Back out there, and I was. 409 00:19:01,640 --> 00:19:03,679 Speaker 3: I guess that's kind of the scenario that these annual 410 00:19:03,720 --> 00:19:05,840 Speaker 3: copyright expirations allow for. 411 00:19:06,040 --> 00:19:07,880 Speaker 2: So it's nice to have them back in the mix. 412 00:19:08,080 --> 00:19:09,919 Speaker 1: Yeah, I guess that's true. But you know, we can 413 00:19:09,960 --> 00:19:12,320 Speaker 1: probably make a more compelling case for them than that, 414 00:19:12,480 --> 00:19:14,879 Speaker 1: I'm guessing. I mean, the public domain is good for 415 00:19:15,119 --> 00:19:17,640 Speaker 1: lots of stuff beyond just annoying your friends with weird 416 00:19:17,680 --> 00:19:18,200 Speaker 1: old songs. 417 00:19:18,240 --> 00:19:20,160 Speaker 3: No, no question, it's just fun to read all those 418 00:19:20,320 --> 00:19:22,280 Speaker 3: lyrics and everything. But all right, Well, now that we've 419 00:19:22,320 --> 00:19:24,760 Speaker 3: checked out some of the most notable inductees for this year, 420 00:19:24,840 --> 00:19:26,679 Speaker 3: I do think we should take a closer look at 421 00:19:26,680 --> 00:19:29,679 Speaker 3: the benefits that come from having the growing catalog of 422 00:19:29,760 --> 00:19:30,840 Speaker 3: public domain works. 423 00:19:30,960 --> 00:19:32,800 Speaker 1: Yeah, it sounds great, But before we get into that, 424 00:19:32,880 --> 00:19:46,880 Speaker 1: let's take another quick break. 425 00:19:47,760 --> 00:19:49,240 Speaker 3: All right, Magael, So we spent a lot of time 426 00:19:49,240 --> 00:19:52,240 Speaker 3: today singing the praises of the public domain and kind 427 00:19:52,240 --> 00:19:54,959 Speaker 3: of lamenting all the extensions that certain copyrights have been 428 00:19:55,000 --> 00:19:57,520 Speaker 3: granted over the years. And honestly, at this point, I'm 429 00:19:57,520 --> 00:19:59,680 Speaker 3: a little bit worried that people might get the impression 430 00:19:59,720 --> 00:20:01,359 Speaker 3: that we or anti copyright. 431 00:20:01,840 --> 00:20:04,359 Speaker 1: Well, I mean, I do think we could survive that 432 00:20:04,480 --> 00:20:06,639 Speaker 1: sort of scandal, but let's go ahead and make the 433 00:20:06,680 --> 00:20:09,399 Speaker 1: case for copyrights anyway, just to be safe. It's actually 434 00:20:09,440 --> 00:20:12,640 Speaker 1: something worth doing, because even though copyrights can feel annoying 435 00:20:12,760 --> 00:20:15,480 Speaker 1: or restrictive, the core idea makes a lot of sense 436 00:20:15,680 --> 00:20:18,639 Speaker 1: granting creators the right to control how their work is used, 437 00:20:19,000 --> 00:20:22,199 Speaker 1: and in its purest form, copyright protections benefit not just 438 00:20:22,240 --> 00:20:25,560 Speaker 1: creators but society as a whole. So the idea is, like, 439 00:20:25,640 --> 00:20:28,399 Speaker 1: that's how copyrights were framed in the US Constitution. It 440 00:20:28,440 --> 00:20:30,439 Speaker 1: was kind of this way to promote the progress of 441 00:20:30,520 --> 00:20:33,760 Speaker 1: science and useful arts, and again in the first Copyright 442 00:20:33,840 --> 00:20:35,639 Speaker 1: Law of seventeen ninety, it was thought of as a 443 00:20:35,680 --> 00:20:37,639 Speaker 1: way to further the encouragement of learning. 444 00:20:38,200 --> 00:20:40,520 Speaker 3: I mean, it's interesting because you'd almost guess that we're 445 00:20:40,560 --> 00:20:44,159 Speaker 3: talking about the public domain again and not copyrights. I mean, 446 00:20:44,160 --> 00:20:48,200 Speaker 3: how does restricting access to a work encourage learning or 447 00:20:48,240 --> 00:20:49,560 Speaker 3: promote science and art. 448 00:20:49,800 --> 00:20:52,080 Speaker 1: So the idea is that it isn't like a short 449 00:20:52,160 --> 00:20:54,560 Speaker 1: term fix, it's one for the long run. So the 450 00:20:54,600 --> 00:20:57,359 Speaker 1: basic idea is that copyright protection offers an incentive for 451 00:20:57,400 --> 00:21:00,280 Speaker 1: people to create new works. I mean, why go to 452 00:21:00,280 --> 00:21:02,000 Speaker 1: the trouble of writing a book or making a movie 453 00:21:02,000 --> 00:21:05,639 Speaker 1: if anyone can just copy it right after it's made public. Right. So, 454 00:21:05,960 --> 00:21:08,480 Speaker 1: one way I've seen it described is that copyright is 455 00:21:08,480 --> 00:21:12,400 Speaker 1: basically a contract between creators and society. They continue making 456 00:21:12,400 --> 00:21:14,560 Speaker 1: new stuff and in return, we promised not to rip 457 00:21:14,600 --> 00:21:16,560 Speaker 1: it off or muck with it for about twenty eight 458 00:21:16,640 --> 00:21:19,359 Speaker 1: years or however long, at which point the work belongs 459 00:21:19,400 --> 00:21:19,840 Speaker 1: to everyone. 460 00:21:20,520 --> 00:21:22,879 Speaker 3: I mean, I get that the premise is sound, but 461 00:21:23,000 --> 00:21:25,640 Speaker 3: it does it feels like these copyright terms have kind 462 00:21:25,640 --> 00:21:28,240 Speaker 3: of ballooned so much that we've kind of lost sight 463 00:21:28,280 --> 00:21:29,560 Speaker 3: of their original purpose. 464 00:21:30,200 --> 00:21:32,280 Speaker 1: Yeah, I mean, the trouble is that there's always someone 465 00:21:32,359 --> 00:21:34,560 Speaker 1: arguing that the length of the copyright is too short 466 00:21:34,600 --> 00:21:36,840 Speaker 1: to make a profit. And back in the days of 467 00:21:36,880 --> 00:21:40,080 Speaker 1: fourteen and twenty eight year terms, content creators may have 468 00:21:40,119 --> 00:21:42,199 Speaker 1: had a point. But you know, now that we're up 469 00:21:42,240 --> 00:21:45,240 Speaker 1: to ninety five years or a lifetime plus seventy years, 470 00:21:45,600 --> 00:21:48,760 Speaker 1: the terms they really start to seem excessive. So the 471 00:21:48,800 --> 00:21:50,920 Speaker 1: contract we started with has gotten a lot more one 472 00:21:50,960 --> 00:21:53,360 Speaker 1: sided over the last century, which is. 473 00:21:53,359 --> 00:21:56,159 Speaker 3: Of course an intentional move on the part of copyright holders, 474 00:21:56,400 --> 00:21:59,320 Speaker 3: or more specifically, the part of companies that hold those 475 00:21:59,359 --> 00:22:02,639 Speaker 3: copyright Yeah, because the ones making money on the ninety 476 00:22:02,640 --> 00:22:06,480 Speaker 3: five year copyrights or lifetime plus copyrights aren't the authors 477 00:22:06,720 --> 00:22:09,880 Speaker 3: or really even their families in most cases. Instead, it's 478 00:22:09,880 --> 00:22:13,600 Speaker 3: the companies that control the rights once the creator is gone. 479 00:22:13,880 --> 00:22:16,400 Speaker 3: Like the Woody Guthrie example you gave earlier, his descendants 480 00:22:16,400 --> 00:22:18,480 Speaker 3: aren't cashing in from licensing deals. 481 00:22:18,480 --> 00:22:19,960 Speaker 2: It's the publisher that is sure. 482 00:22:20,000 --> 00:22:22,639 Speaker 1: I mean, that's a great point. And corporations definitely played 483 00:22:22,640 --> 00:22:26,080 Speaker 1: a huge role in the twentieth century extensions to copyright terms. 484 00:22:26,280 --> 00:22:29,080 Speaker 1: I mean, the most famous example is probably the nineteen 485 00:22:29,240 --> 00:22:32,160 Speaker 1: ninety eight extension you mentioned earlier, the one that raised 486 00:22:32,200 --> 00:22:35,080 Speaker 1: the term for older US copyrights from seventy five to 487 00:22:35,160 --> 00:22:38,200 Speaker 1: ninety five years. And the law was called the Sonny 488 00:22:38,240 --> 00:22:42,320 Speaker 1: Bono Copyright Term Extension Act. And the Disney Corporation was 489 00:22:42,359 --> 00:22:45,040 Speaker 1: actually his biggest and most vocal champion, and that's because 490 00:22:45,040 --> 00:22:47,359 Speaker 1: they wanted to keep the first Mickey Mouse cartoon ever released, 491 00:22:47,400 --> 00:22:50,280 Speaker 1: which is Steamboat Willie, from entering the public domain in 492 00:22:50,280 --> 00:22:51,000 Speaker 1: two thousand and three. 493 00:22:51,880 --> 00:22:54,040 Speaker 3: So what did Sonny Bono have to do with this? Like, 494 00:22:54,040 --> 00:22:56,159 Speaker 3: shouldn't it have been called the Mickey Mouse Act? 495 00:22:56,440 --> 00:22:58,800 Speaker 1: Yeah, I mean that might have been more accurate. And 496 00:22:58,920 --> 00:23:01,560 Speaker 1: actually Disney lobbied so hard for the legislation that some 497 00:23:01,560 --> 00:23:03,760 Speaker 1: people actually do refer to it as the Mickey Mouse 498 00:23:03,760 --> 00:23:07,080 Speaker 1: Protection Act, but in reality, the ninety eight bill was 499 00:23:07,119 --> 00:23:09,000 Speaker 1: named as a way to honor Sonny Bono, who had 500 00:23:09,000 --> 00:23:11,679 Speaker 1: passed away in January of that year. And if that 501 00:23:11,760 --> 00:23:14,040 Speaker 1: sounds kind of random, it isn't just that he was 502 00:23:14,040 --> 00:23:16,800 Speaker 1: an entertainer. It's also that he was a congressman in California, 503 00:23:17,200 --> 00:23:19,840 Speaker 1: and during his tenure, Bono had actually pushed hard for 504 00:23:19,920 --> 00:23:22,520 Speaker 1: better copyright protection. So the gesture kind of made a 505 00:23:22,560 --> 00:23:24,720 Speaker 1: lot of sense if you knew all that. 506 00:23:25,280 --> 00:23:26,879 Speaker 3: Yeah, But I mean, you know, it still strikes me 507 00:23:26,920 --> 00:23:28,919 Speaker 3: about this whole thing is how ironic it is that 508 00:23:28,960 --> 00:23:32,600 Speaker 3: a company built on adaptations of public domain fairy tales 509 00:23:32,720 --> 00:23:35,239 Speaker 3: they're the ones that wound up fighting to keep all 510 00:23:35,280 --> 00:23:37,080 Speaker 3: those adaptations under wraps. 511 00:23:37,800 --> 00:23:40,600 Speaker 1: Yeah, and the ironies don't end there either, because Disney's 512 00:23:40,560 --> 00:23:44,000 Speaker 1: Steamboat Willie cartoon was itself a parody of Buster Keaton's 513 00:23:44,040 --> 00:23:48,320 Speaker 1: short called Steamboat Bill Junior. It actually premiered the same year. 514 00:23:48,520 --> 00:23:52,560 Speaker 1: So yeah, and so while the Keaton short entered the 515 00:23:52,600 --> 00:23:56,240 Speaker 1: public domain years ago, the cartoon it inspired is still 516 00:23:56,320 --> 00:23:58,800 Speaker 1: under lock and key. It's kind of bizarre, but you know, 517 00:23:59,000 --> 00:24:01,480 Speaker 1: just like with Felix the Cat, Mickey Mouse's trademark, so 518 00:24:01,640 --> 00:24:04,840 Speaker 1: when the copyright on his debut cartoon expires, the short 519 00:24:04,920 --> 00:24:07,639 Speaker 1: itself can be bought or sold or given away or 520 00:24:07,680 --> 00:24:10,720 Speaker 1: remixed by anyone, but the Mickey character will still belong 521 00:24:10,760 --> 00:24:12,720 Speaker 1: to the Disney Company for as long as it continues 522 00:24:12,760 --> 00:24:15,600 Speaker 1: to you know, use his likeness and continuity. 523 00:24:16,440 --> 00:24:18,520 Speaker 3: So one of the things you hope doesn't happen is 524 00:24:18,520 --> 00:24:22,880 Speaker 3: that someone makes an adult version of Steamboat Willie. Actually, 525 00:24:23,000 --> 00:24:25,760 Speaker 3: one of the main arguments you hear from staunch copyright 526 00:24:25,800 --> 00:24:28,760 Speaker 3: defenders like the ideas that when work slip into the 527 00:24:28,760 --> 00:24:32,280 Speaker 3: public domain, they will be abused. They're tarnet in some way. 528 00:24:32,680 --> 00:24:35,200 Speaker 3: So for instance, the book could be published with errors, 529 00:24:35,280 --> 00:24:37,400 Speaker 3: or a film could be released in low quality. 530 00:24:37,520 --> 00:24:39,719 Speaker 1: Yeah, or someone could replace every other line in your 531 00:24:39,760 --> 00:24:41,919 Speaker 1: poem with Beyonce lyrics, which. 532 00:24:41,880 --> 00:24:44,760 Speaker 3: Might be an improvement depending on how bad the poetry is. 533 00:24:44,800 --> 00:24:46,520 Speaker 3: But I mean, you get the point. The worry is 534 00:24:46,560 --> 00:24:49,439 Speaker 3: that a public domain work will be over exploited and 535 00:24:49,480 --> 00:24:52,800 Speaker 3: that it's cultural or artistic worth, you know, by because 536 00:24:52,840 --> 00:24:54,600 Speaker 3: of that, it'll be diminished in the process. 537 00:24:55,160 --> 00:24:57,880 Speaker 1: I mean that sounds like a legit concern. Doesn't it. 538 00:24:57,760 --> 00:24:59,880 Speaker 1: But you know, like I love the idea of pride 539 00:24:59,880 --> 00:25:03,440 Speaker 1: and prejudice and zombies, you know, like Jane Austen might 540 00:25:03,480 --> 00:25:05,920 Speaker 1: not have wanted that when you wrote it, but it's 541 00:25:05,960 --> 00:25:07,480 Speaker 1: a pretty great thing for all of us. 542 00:25:07,560 --> 00:25:10,280 Speaker 3: And probably more people went back and actually read Pride 543 00:25:10,280 --> 00:25:13,040 Speaker 3: and Prejudice when that Yeah, yeah, that's true. And for 544 00:25:13,080 --> 00:25:15,439 Speaker 3: the most part, I'm not sure the argument holds that 545 00:25:15,560 --> 00:25:17,639 Speaker 3: much water, you know, because, for instance, there was a 546 00:25:17,640 --> 00:25:20,760 Speaker 3: study back in twenty twelve where researchers took a bunch 547 00:25:20,760 --> 00:25:23,960 Speaker 3: of different audio books, some of the public domains, some 548 00:25:24,040 --> 00:25:27,320 Speaker 3: under copyright, and they had listeners provide feedback on the 549 00:25:27,440 --> 00:25:30,440 Speaker 3: quality of each one and just actually, I'll just read 550 00:25:30,480 --> 00:25:33,240 Speaker 3: here what they found. So our data provided almost no 551 00:25:33,359 --> 00:25:36,400 Speaker 3: support for the arguments made by proponents of copyright term 552 00:25:36,440 --> 00:25:39,639 Speaker 3: extension that once works fall into the public domain, they 553 00:25:39,640 --> 00:25:42,680 Speaker 3: will be produced in poor quality versions that will undermine 554 00:25:42,720 --> 00:25:47,200 Speaker 3: their cultural or economic value. Our data indicate no statistically 555 00:25:47,240 --> 00:25:50,800 Speaker 3: significant difference, for example, between the listener's judgments of the 556 00:25:50,880 --> 00:25:55,040 Speaker 3: quality of the professional audiobook readers or copyrighted and public 557 00:25:55,080 --> 00:25:56,159 Speaker 3: domain texts. 558 00:25:56,440 --> 00:25:58,720 Speaker 1: So it sounds like we're saying, even though there could 559 00:25:58,720 --> 00:26:01,280 Speaker 1: be downsides, to a work entering the public domain, those 560 00:26:01,359 --> 00:26:03,760 Speaker 1: drawbacks tend to be heavily outweighed by the benefits of 561 00:26:03,800 --> 00:26:07,160 Speaker 1: open access. I mean, teachers can make photocopies without breaking 562 00:26:07,160 --> 00:26:09,960 Speaker 1: the law, artists can pay tribute to and even build 563 00:26:10,000 --> 00:26:11,800 Speaker 1: off the worst that inspire them, and the rest of 564 00:26:11,840 --> 00:26:13,800 Speaker 1: us can kick back and listen to Yes, we have 565 00:26:13,920 --> 00:26:17,560 Speaker 1: no bananas on loop, completely free of charge. 566 00:26:17,960 --> 00:26:20,399 Speaker 3: I was there with you until that last part, but 567 00:26:20,680 --> 00:26:23,400 Speaker 3: I do agree the public domain is a win for society, 568 00:26:23,400 --> 00:26:26,640 Speaker 3: and it's exciting to see how it can grow substantially 569 00:26:26,680 --> 00:26:29,800 Speaker 3: again after a twenty year hiatus. But before we go 570 00:26:29,840 --> 00:26:33,000 Speaker 3: exploring into that treasure trove once again, I know we 571 00:26:33,040 --> 00:26:35,240 Speaker 3: still have a bunch of weird copyright facts to share, 572 00:26:35,320 --> 00:26:47,000 Speaker 3: so let's get into the fact off. All right, Well, 573 00:26:47,000 --> 00:26:49,520 Speaker 3: here's something I think is pretty cool. There's this little 574 00:26:49,560 --> 00:26:51,880 Speaker 3: village in England called Wookie Hole. 575 00:26:52,040 --> 00:26:52,840 Speaker 1: That's already cool. 576 00:26:53,000 --> 00:26:56,000 Speaker 3: Yeah, yeah, And there are over three hundred eggs painted 577 00:26:56,040 --> 00:26:59,080 Speaker 3: with clown faces on them. And this collection is known 578 00:26:59,119 --> 00:27:02,479 Speaker 3: as the Clown Register. And while it started as a 579 00:27:02,520 --> 00:27:05,960 Speaker 3: hobby where one individual was cataloging these clowns just for fun, 580 00:27:06,320 --> 00:27:09,520 Speaker 3: the collection grew into a way for professional clowns to 581 00:27:09,600 --> 00:27:13,119 Speaker 3: basically copyright the way they make up their faces, you know, 582 00:27:13,200 --> 00:27:16,199 Speaker 3: to protect from imitators. That's crazy, and so the tradition 583 00:27:16,560 --> 00:27:20,240 Speaker 3: actually continues today. If you register with the Clowns International, 584 00:27:20,640 --> 00:27:23,200 Speaker 3: they will have your makeup painted on a ceramic. 585 00:27:23,920 --> 00:27:26,800 Speaker 1: That's crazy. There's one thing I learned this week that 586 00:27:26,840 --> 00:27:30,840 Speaker 1: you can't copyright, and that's a chicken sandwich. And I 587 00:27:30,920 --> 00:27:35,200 Speaker 1: know this because a man named Narberto Cologne Lorenzana tried 588 00:27:35,240 --> 00:27:38,960 Speaker 1: to do this in the nineteen eighties. Apparently, Narberto added 589 00:27:39,000 --> 00:27:41,560 Speaker 1: a simple chicken sandwich to the menu at Church's Chicken 590 00:27:41,560 --> 00:27:44,880 Speaker 1: in Puerto Rico, and the company made millions off it. 591 00:27:44,960 --> 00:27:47,480 Speaker 1: They even used the name he gave it, the Pache Sandwich. 592 00:27:47,760 --> 00:27:50,919 Speaker 1: But when he tried to sue for intellectual property theft, 593 00:27:51,080 --> 00:27:55,480 Speaker 1: the judge sternly rebuked him, letting him know that while films, books, music, 594 00:27:55,480 --> 00:27:58,960 Speaker 1: and architecture and even some art are all protected, culinary 595 00:27:59,000 --> 00:28:02,400 Speaker 1: inventions are kind of a gray area, especially chicken sandwiches. 596 00:28:03,520 --> 00:28:06,399 Speaker 3: Well, speaking of architecture, it is interesting to note that 597 00:28:06,480 --> 00:28:09,880 Speaker 3: Hershey's has a trademark for the structural design of their 598 00:28:10,040 --> 00:28:13,080 Speaker 3: chocolate bar, and apparently it took a ton of work 599 00:28:13,119 --> 00:28:15,760 Speaker 3: to get that. Basically, they were trying to protect the 600 00:28:15,760 --> 00:28:18,480 Speaker 3: fact that you can snap those little rectangles off to 601 00:28:18,560 --> 00:28:20,919 Speaker 3: fit perfectly on a smorn if you think about like, 602 00:28:21,040 --> 00:28:26,080 Speaker 3: everyone can image those exact rectangles. But as Smithsonian notes, 603 00:28:26,359 --> 00:28:29,800 Speaker 3: functionality is not a qualifying feature when registering a product 604 00:28:29,800 --> 00:28:33,480 Speaker 3: design for trademark, so to win the case, they basically 605 00:28:33,560 --> 00:28:36,639 Speaker 3: had to show that the ridges were more than just utility. 606 00:28:36,960 --> 00:28:41,280 Speaker 3: The architectural design was something that people associated with Hershey Bars, 607 00:28:41,360 --> 00:28:43,760 Speaker 3: even when the brand name was absent from the chocolate, 608 00:28:43,800 --> 00:28:45,160 Speaker 3: and I would completely agree with. 609 00:28:45,160 --> 00:28:47,560 Speaker 1: You, Yeah, it's really interesting. Well, here's a funny one 610 00:28:47,560 --> 00:28:50,160 Speaker 1: for mental phloss. Apparently, the nineteen sixty three Beach Boys 611 00:28:50,240 --> 00:28:53,400 Speaker 1: hit Surfin Usa is a complete knockoff of a Chuck 612 00:28:53,480 --> 00:28:57,200 Speaker 1: Berry song called Sweet Little Sixteen. I had never heard 613 00:28:57,200 --> 00:29:00,000 Speaker 1: of that that when very accused Brian Wilson of steel 614 00:29:00,200 --> 00:29:03,600 Speaker 1: the song without telling anyone, Wilson's dad, who also happened 615 00:29:03,640 --> 00:29:06,480 Speaker 1: to be the band's manager, gave Barry the copyright to 616 00:29:06,520 --> 00:29:08,960 Speaker 1: the tune, but he didn't tell anyone in the band, 617 00:29:08,960 --> 00:29:10,840 Speaker 1: so the band actually only learned that they weren't getting 618 00:29:10,920 --> 00:29:14,680 Speaker 1: royalties from the song twenty five years after it was released. Like, 619 00:29:14,680 --> 00:29:17,000 Speaker 1: why are we not getting any money on this song 620 00:29:17,040 --> 00:29:18,040 Speaker 1: we stole? Yeah? 621 00:29:18,640 --> 00:29:21,800 Speaker 3: Well, speaking of wild did you know that animals can't 622 00:29:21,920 --> 00:29:23,400 Speaker 3: own copyrights manga? 623 00:29:23,600 --> 00:29:25,840 Speaker 1: I don't even know how that could be an issue. 624 00:29:26,000 --> 00:29:29,840 Speaker 3: Well, in twenty eleven, this photographer named David Slater went 625 00:29:29,880 --> 00:29:33,360 Speaker 3: to Indonesia and he had this brilliant idea, like what 626 00:29:33,480 --> 00:29:35,720 Speaker 3: if he set up a tripod and tried to get 627 00:29:35,760 --> 00:29:39,880 Speaker 3: the monkeys to take selfies of themselves. Sure, and somehow 628 00:29:39,920 --> 00:29:44,239 Speaker 3: this one female macaque named Nrudo went crazy, and of 629 00:29:44,240 --> 00:29:47,719 Speaker 3: course the photos went viral. The Wikipedia put them up, 630 00:29:47,760 --> 00:29:51,320 Speaker 3: claiming no one could own the copyright, and David Slater 631 00:29:51,400 --> 00:29:54,360 Speaker 3: assumed that he owned the rights. It was his camera 632 00:29:54,400 --> 00:29:57,720 Speaker 3: and idea after all. But PETA and their ethical treatment 633 00:29:57,760 --> 00:30:01,360 Speaker 3: of all animals decided to sue on the monkey's behalf, 634 00:30:01,880 --> 00:30:05,640 Speaker 3: claiming that this female should get the royalties on the photos. 635 00:30:06,080 --> 00:30:08,720 Speaker 3: So far, the US Copyright Office has taken a firm 636 00:30:08,800 --> 00:30:12,200 Speaker 3: line that quote, the Office will not register works produced 637 00:30:12,240 --> 00:30:15,840 Speaker 3: by nature, animals or plants, and it's put the photos 638 00:30:15,840 --> 00:30:18,840 Speaker 3: in the public domain. But PETA is still fighting for 639 00:30:18,920 --> 00:30:20,360 Speaker 3: its social media star client. 640 00:30:20,800 --> 00:30:23,160 Speaker 1: That's pretty crazy. I mean, I think monkeys are a 641 00:30:23,200 --> 00:30:26,480 Speaker 1: great way to end the show, clown eggs, monkey selfies. 642 00:30:26,600 --> 00:30:29,240 Speaker 1: I do think you deserve today's trophy and to celebrate 643 00:30:29,240 --> 00:30:31,560 Speaker 1: your victory, Tristan, will you please queue up. Yes, we 644 00:30:31,600 --> 00:30:34,680 Speaker 1: have no more bananas. That is it for today's show. 645 00:30:34,840 --> 00:30:36,080 Speaker 1: I do want to give a special shout out to 646 00:30:36,080 --> 00:30:38,600 Speaker 1: our listener Samantha, who tipped us off on some Brady 647 00:30:38,640 --> 00:30:41,200 Speaker 1: Bunch spinoffs from our last nine things that we did, 648 00:30:41,240 --> 00:30:44,520 Speaker 1: our favorite of which is The Brady Brides, where Marcia 649 00:30:44,600 --> 00:30:46,600 Speaker 1: and Jen have a double wedding to their boyfriends and 650 00:30:46,600 --> 00:30:48,600 Speaker 1: then have to live in the same house because they 651 00:30:48,640 --> 00:30:51,520 Speaker 1: can't afford to move out. Unfortunately, The High Drinks only 652 00:30:51,600 --> 00:30:55,920 Speaker 1: last is six episodes, which sounds great and terrible but one. Yeah, 653 00:30:55,920 --> 00:30:57,960 Speaker 1: but thank you so much for that, Samantha. But that's 654 00:30:58,000 --> 00:30:59,520 Speaker 1: it for today's show. If you want to send us 655 00:30:59,520 --> 00:31:02,000 Speaker 1: facts where part time genius at how stuffworks dot com 656 00:31:02,040 --> 00:31:05,080 Speaker 1: and from Gabe, Tristan, Will and me. Thank you so 657 00:31:05,160 --> 00:31:05,880 Speaker 1: much for listening.