1
00:00:07,120 --> 00:00:19,400
Speaker 1: Ah, beaut Force. If it doesn't work, you're just not

2
00:00:19,720 --> 00:00:25,440
Speaker 1: using enough. You're listening to Software Radio, Special Operations, military

3
00:00:25,520 --> 00:01:08,600
Speaker 1: news and straight talk with the guys and the community,

4
00:01:09,840 --> 00:01:13,560
Speaker 1: soft Prep dot Com, on Time on Target people. Jack

5
00:01:13,640 --> 00:01:17,080
Speaker 1: behind last episode, but it went great. I thought I'd

6
00:01:17,080 --> 00:01:19,119
Speaker 1: love to have him on again. Yeah, he's a he's

7
00:01:19,160 --> 00:01:21,679
Speaker 1: an interesting guy. There's so much knowledge there and and

8
00:01:21,760 --> 00:01:24,280
Speaker 1: it sounds like the next book where all the stuffs

9
00:01:24,360 --> 00:01:27,280
Speaker 1: to fight against communism, that will be a really good one. Yeah.

10
00:01:27,319 --> 00:01:28,920
Speaker 1: I kept trying to drill him on that. I don't

11
00:01:28,920 --> 00:01:30,679
Speaker 1: want to don't I want him to explain because I

12
00:01:30,680 --> 00:01:33,759
Speaker 1: think there's a um, you know, we talked about like

13
00:01:33,800 --> 00:01:36,679
Speaker 1: these different covert actions as if they were all like

14
00:01:36,760 --> 00:01:39,959
Speaker 1: little episodes, which they sort of were, but they were

15
00:01:40,000 --> 00:01:43,160
Speaker 1: all aimed at the same thing, which was defeating communism.

16
00:01:43,360 --> 00:01:45,520
Speaker 1: So there's not that much out there. I feel like

17
00:01:45,640 --> 00:01:48,800
Speaker 1: that really puts that in the proper context. And Jack

18
00:01:48,840 --> 00:01:51,760
Speaker 1: Devine is somebody who could potentially do that because he

19
00:01:51,920 --> 00:01:54,520
Speaker 1: was he sat at the top of the director of Operations.

20
00:01:54,640 --> 00:01:57,680
Speaker 1: So yeah, he's truly been there and done that. I mean,

21
00:01:57,760 --> 00:02:01,320
Speaker 1: thirty two years in the CIA conducting all the affairs overseas,

22
00:02:01,720 --> 00:02:04,880
Speaker 1: we had a little talk before we went on AirLand. Uh.

23
00:02:04,920 --> 00:02:07,080
Speaker 1: And it's in his book also how he joined the

24
00:02:07,080 --> 00:02:09,959
Speaker 1: CIA and he wrote a letter to the c i A.

25
00:02:10,040 --> 00:02:12,120
Speaker 1: This was back in the day, you know, and he

26
00:02:12,320 --> 00:02:14,360
Speaker 1: wrote a letter like I'm kind of interested in joining

27
00:02:14,360 --> 00:02:16,440
Speaker 1: your agency, and they like said, like a month later

28
00:02:16,480 --> 00:02:18,120
Speaker 1: they wrote back like, okay, meet this guy in a

29
00:02:18,120 --> 00:02:21,240
Speaker 1: coffee shop. It's like, how quaint does that seem? Today?

30
00:02:21,320 --> 00:02:24,520
Speaker 1: He was like hand almost hand recruited because he wrote

31
00:02:24,520 --> 00:02:27,359
Speaker 1: a handwritten letter into the CIA. I mean, it would

32
00:02:27,400 --> 00:02:31,480
Speaker 1: never work like that today. Yeah, things have changed drastically. Well,

33
00:02:31,480 --> 00:02:34,280
Speaker 1: he has a problem with that because he says a

34
00:02:34,320 --> 00:02:38,040
Speaker 1: lot of qualified people probably get disqualified early on because

35
00:02:38,280 --> 00:02:43,080
Speaker 1: they don't match what some computer algorithm is searching for. Um.

36
00:02:43,160 --> 00:02:45,120
Speaker 1: You know, back in the day, like the OSS, they

37
00:02:45,160 --> 00:02:47,480
Speaker 1: recruited people by hand, and they went and they looked

38
00:02:47,520 --> 00:02:50,960
Speaker 1: for these like eccentric characters who had special skills. Um.

39
00:02:51,520 --> 00:02:54,160
Speaker 1: I think, if I remember correctly, they even recruited someone

40
00:02:54,200 --> 00:02:58,160
Speaker 1: who is an animator for Disney has one more interesting people.

41
00:02:58,160 --> 00:03:00,720
Speaker 1: But they found they found interesting guys like at Yeah,

42
00:03:01,160 --> 00:03:03,480
Speaker 1: um so Dr Leonard one coming on this show. I'm

43
00:03:03,520 --> 00:03:07,440
Speaker 1: excited for that. Of course, Uh, we should address the

44
00:03:07,480 --> 00:03:11,680
Speaker 1: mass shooting that happened in Parkland, Florida. Immediately, you know,

45
00:03:11,760 --> 00:03:14,840
Speaker 1: you get this response on Twitter of the gun control thing,

46
00:03:14,880 --> 00:03:17,359
Speaker 1: and I figured I at least read this email, UM

47
00:03:17,680 --> 00:03:21,120
Speaker 1: question for you really from our listener Mike uh Ian

48
00:03:21,160 --> 00:03:24,920
Speaker 1: and Jack. On February fourteen, there was unfortunately another mass

49
00:03:24,919 --> 00:03:28,040
Speaker 1: shooting at a school in Florida. Seventeen people died in

50
00:03:28,160 --> 00:03:31,639
Speaker 1: fourteen were wounded at the time of this email. UM. Yeah,

51
00:03:31,639 --> 00:03:34,040
Speaker 1: I think that's still what they're telling it, as I

52
00:03:34,080 --> 00:03:37,680
Speaker 1: believe UM. Scrolling through the newspeeds, I am already seeing

53
00:03:37,720 --> 00:03:39,720
Speaker 1: talks about the rifle that was used in a R

54
00:03:39,800 --> 00:03:43,320
Speaker 1: fifteen and some are already calling for it to be banned.

55
00:03:43,640 --> 00:03:46,080
Speaker 1: We have heard this debate before. Why do civilians need

56
00:03:46,120 --> 00:03:49,280
Speaker 1: military style weapons? And it's not the rifle's fault, it's

57
00:03:49,320 --> 00:03:51,600
Speaker 1: the user. It's the user that is to be blamed.

58
00:03:51,920 --> 00:03:54,480
Speaker 1: My question to you, Jack and others is do you

59
00:03:54,520 --> 00:03:57,360
Speaker 1: think the US government should expand the band on what

60
00:03:57,440 --> 00:04:00,320
Speaker 1: types of firearms can be purchased? For some back ground,

61
00:04:00,360 --> 00:04:02,800
Speaker 1: I'm a veteran, a gun owner, and I live in Illinois,

62
00:04:02,920 --> 00:04:05,440
Speaker 1: one of the states with the strictest gun laws. My

63
00:04:05,600 --> 00:04:07,760
Speaker 1: stance is that at this time, we do not need

64
00:04:07,840 --> 00:04:10,960
Speaker 1: to ban more firearms from being purchased, but rather we

65
00:04:11,040 --> 00:04:14,000
Speaker 1: need to have stricter, tougher punishments for those that commit

66
00:04:14,040 --> 00:04:18,040
Speaker 1: crimes with firearms. For example, a Chicago police commander was

67
00:04:18,080 --> 00:04:20,120
Speaker 1: shot and killed by a four time felon who was

68
00:04:20,160 --> 00:04:22,760
Speaker 1: out walking the streets. Why did the courts allow this

69
00:04:22,839 --> 00:04:25,080
Speaker 1: person to be out and pose a danger to society

70
00:04:25,120 --> 00:04:28,200
Speaker 1: with such a criminal record? Uh? And he cites the article.

71
00:04:28,640 --> 00:04:30,839
Speaker 1: I would like to hear your guys take on the issue.

72
00:04:30,920 --> 00:04:35,039
Speaker 1: Keep up the great work, thanks Mike. Uh. Yeah, I

73
00:04:35,080 --> 00:04:39,839
Speaker 1: mean this is uh, you know, you know, perpetual question

74
00:04:39,880 --> 00:04:42,040
Speaker 1: that we always have after every one of these shootings.

75
00:04:42,080 --> 00:04:44,840
Speaker 1: I I personally don't feel that banning the A R

76
00:04:44,920 --> 00:04:47,440
Speaker 1: fifteen rifle it's going to stop a single shooting in

77
00:04:47,440 --> 00:04:52,479
Speaker 1: this country. Um, there's really nothing particularly special about the

78
00:04:52,520 --> 00:04:55,480
Speaker 1: A R fifteen. It's kind of a glorified peace shooter.

79
00:04:56,680 --> 00:04:58,960
Speaker 1: If you, if you could, you banned the A R fifteen.

80
00:04:59,040 --> 00:05:01,880
Speaker 1: Let's say we banned it. I'm the same sorts of

81
00:05:01,920 --> 00:05:05,040
Speaker 1: attacks could be carried out by a A K forty seven,

82
00:05:05,600 --> 00:05:09,640
Speaker 1: with a cig rifle, with any number of semi automatic rifles,

83
00:05:09,640 --> 00:05:13,600
Speaker 1: some of which are higher caliber than the six at

84
00:05:13,600 --> 00:05:16,440
Speaker 1: the A R fifteen newses. So I really don't see

85
00:05:16,440 --> 00:05:19,479
Speaker 1: the point in banning the A R fifteen or how

86
00:05:19,520 --> 00:05:22,000
Speaker 1: that's going to have any sort of impact on shootings.

87
00:05:22,040 --> 00:05:23,960
Speaker 1: I mean, it's it's a much bigger issue than like

88
00:05:24,240 --> 00:05:27,599
Speaker 1: we're gonna ban It's like saying we're gonna ban um,

89
00:05:27,640 --> 00:05:30,520
Speaker 1: you know, a certain type of car and that will

90
00:05:30,560 --> 00:05:33,640
Speaker 1: stop car crashes. You know, it just doesn't work like that.

91
00:05:34,000 --> 00:05:36,839
Speaker 1: I was surprised to see on Twitter Michael Savage, you know,

92
00:05:36,920 --> 00:05:40,400
Speaker 1: the radio host who is pretty hardline conservative but it

93
00:05:40,440 --> 00:05:42,640
Speaker 1: doesn't go with the party line and everything, and he

94
00:05:42,720 --> 00:05:45,799
Speaker 1: was saying that he thinks like armor piercing bullets should

95
00:05:45,839 --> 00:05:47,360
Speaker 1: be banned. So it was interesting to see someone who's

96
00:05:47,400 --> 00:05:50,200
Speaker 1: not a left wing activist that's a that's a conversation,

97
00:05:50,800 --> 00:05:53,800
Speaker 1: um also armor piercing bullets. I mean, I'm not sure

98
00:05:54,040 --> 00:05:57,200
Speaker 1: necessarily what he means by that, but isn't that hollow

99
00:05:57,279 --> 00:06:00,159
Speaker 1: tip bullets? All? The point is why what would that

100
00:06:00,240 --> 00:06:01,960
Speaker 1: have to do with the school show? I don't even know,

101
00:06:02,040 --> 00:06:05,520
Speaker 1: to be honest, So but I could see I could

102
00:06:05,560 --> 00:06:09,240
Speaker 1: see the argument. You know, even though I'm not for it. Yeah,

103
00:06:09,360 --> 00:06:11,480
Speaker 1: I don't. I don't think it's really here and r there.

104
00:06:11,520 --> 00:06:14,240
Speaker 1: I mean, kids will going to school, aren't going to

105
00:06:14,320 --> 00:06:17,440
Speaker 1: be wearing bulletproof vest unless they their parents remembers a

106
00:06:17,520 --> 00:06:23,320
Speaker 1: great club and they have the the cry precision that

107
00:06:23,720 --> 00:06:27,839
Speaker 1: ye being serious, there are probably more parents, you know,

108
00:06:28,000 --> 00:06:30,719
Speaker 1: getting scared about that, and I mean it's it's a concern,

109
00:06:30,920 --> 00:06:33,720
Speaker 1: you know, I understand where people are coming from, you

110
00:06:33,960 --> 00:06:38,760
Speaker 1: I think um. Dave Grossman had an interesting lecture about

111
00:06:38,839 --> 00:06:41,320
Speaker 1: the topic of school shootings, and he said the part

112
00:06:41,400 --> 00:06:44,000
Speaker 1: of the problem is that even though they keep happening,

113
00:06:44,160 --> 00:06:47,479
Speaker 1: we keep convincing ourselves that it can't happen, like what

114
00:06:47,600 --> 00:06:49,240
Speaker 1: we have our head in the sand. And he makes

115
00:06:49,279 --> 00:06:54,200
Speaker 1: the point about fires and schools and how we kept

116
00:06:54,240 --> 00:06:56,599
Speaker 1: having school fires that were killing kids, you know, a

117
00:06:56,640 --> 00:07:00,520
Speaker 1: hundred years ago or whatever, and we accept did that

118
00:07:00,760 --> 00:07:02,760
Speaker 1: fires are going to happen in schools, and so we

119
00:07:02,800 --> 00:07:05,680
Speaker 1: started taking steps. So we started constructing the schools that

120
00:07:05,720 --> 00:07:09,120
Speaker 1: have non flammable material. Um, so, like even the chairs

121
00:07:09,120 --> 00:07:12,480
Speaker 1: in the auditorium he gives the example, are nonflammable. Everything

122
00:07:12,520 --> 00:07:14,960
Speaker 1: in the school is nonflammable. And since we came up

123
00:07:15,200 --> 00:07:17,680
Speaker 1: and we started instituting these regulations. We haven't had a

124
00:07:17,720 --> 00:07:20,600
Speaker 1: single kid die in a school fire and years and

125
00:07:20,680 --> 00:07:23,880
Speaker 1: years and years, and that's really incredible. But when it

126
00:07:23,880 --> 00:07:26,040
Speaker 1: comes to school shootings, we keep acting as if it

127
00:07:26,160 --> 00:07:29,840
Speaker 1: can't happen, but it keeps happening. So they although they

128
00:07:29,840 --> 00:07:33,000
Speaker 1: are having more drills for kids of you know, how

129
00:07:33,000 --> 00:07:37,000
Speaker 1: to protect yourself during a shooting. Even my high school,

130
00:07:37,000 --> 00:07:38,960
Speaker 1: for example, and I think just about every high school

131
00:07:39,320 --> 00:07:41,640
Speaker 1: when I went there, which was not that long ago,

132
00:07:41,840 --> 00:07:43,760
Speaker 1: you were able to walk right in the building, no problem.

133
00:07:43,880 --> 00:07:47,560
Speaker 1: Now it's not like that I remember in my school. Yeah,

134
00:07:47,640 --> 00:07:49,880
Speaker 1: same thing. After Columbine, I think you had to start

135
00:07:49,960 --> 00:07:53,239
Speaker 1: checking in at the front door. But I mean even then,

136
00:07:53,280 --> 00:07:56,600
Speaker 1: I mean some little old lady or some rent the

137
00:07:56,640 --> 00:07:58,720
Speaker 1: cops sitting there isn't really going to do that much.

138
00:07:58,760 --> 00:08:00,240
Speaker 1: I mean, I guess it's better than enough thing, and

139
00:08:00,240 --> 00:08:02,600
Speaker 1: it makes people feel safe. But or if they have

140
00:08:02,680 --> 00:08:06,200
Speaker 1: the doors locked, you know during certain hours and security

141
00:08:06,240 --> 00:08:09,520
Speaker 1: cameras like you have to be buzzed in. Yeah, and

142
00:08:09,560 --> 00:08:12,040
Speaker 1: I think you're doing that, yeah, I mean that could

143
00:08:12,040 --> 00:08:16,440
Speaker 1: be a deterrent, might help. Um, there's other things, you know,

144
00:08:16,520 --> 00:08:18,800
Speaker 1: as far as like putting like locks that the teachers

145
00:08:18,800 --> 00:08:21,400
Speaker 1: can use on this on the classroom doors, that that

146
00:08:21,600 --> 00:08:24,840
Speaker 1: is something that could potentially help. Um, shouldn't we let

147
00:08:24,840 --> 00:08:28,080
Speaker 1: teachers be armed? I mean I remember after column by

148
00:08:28,200 --> 00:08:31,480
Speaker 1: my math teacher who, interestingly enough, he was an Iranian

149
00:08:31,480 --> 00:08:34,480
Speaker 1: immigrant who had fought in the Iran Iraq War. He

150
00:08:34,559 --> 00:08:36,839
Speaker 1: told me about it one time because I wrote a

151
00:08:36,880 --> 00:08:40,480
Speaker 1: school paper about it that he saw. Um. And he

152
00:08:40,800 --> 00:08:43,200
Speaker 1: so he was my math teacher, and he wanted to

153
00:08:43,240 --> 00:08:45,720
Speaker 1: carry a gun. He wanted to conceal carry a pistol

154
00:08:46,160 --> 00:08:49,480
Speaker 1: in class after Columbine happened, because he's like and he's like,

155
00:08:49,520 --> 00:08:52,480
Speaker 1: I petitioned the school, like let me carry my my weapon,

156
00:08:52,800 --> 00:08:54,800
Speaker 1: and they wouldn't let him. But I'm sure it's more

157
00:08:54,840 --> 00:08:57,079
Speaker 1: than the school. I don't think the school could determine that, right.

158
00:08:57,480 --> 00:09:00,719
Speaker 1: I'm sure there's like, yes, state and federal laws. I'm sure,

159
00:09:00,760 --> 00:09:03,040
Speaker 1: especially if you went to school in New York. Yeah.

160
00:09:03,160 --> 00:09:05,880
Speaker 1: So this isn't like you know, Texas gun laws or Florida.

161
00:09:06,360 --> 00:09:08,960
Speaker 1: Yeah no, I'm sure it goes way above the school boards.

162
00:09:08,960 --> 00:09:12,320
Speaker 1: And of course, Um, but is that a potentially answer

163
00:09:12,360 --> 00:09:16,760
Speaker 1: do we let teachers carry guns? Um? Well, if they

164
00:09:16,760 --> 00:09:19,080
Speaker 1: are carrying guns or some of them. Are would that

165
00:09:19,120 --> 00:09:23,000
Speaker 1: be enough of a deterrent to stop school shooters? I mean,

166
00:09:23,000 --> 00:09:26,520
Speaker 1: these are like questions I can't necessarily answer. Now, everybody

167
00:09:26,559 --> 00:09:28,680
Speaker 1: thinks that they have the answer, right, right, But I

168
00:09:28,720 --> 00:09:31,640
Speaker 1: think we should start asking ourselves these types of questions,

169
00:09:31,720 --> 00:09:34,840
Speaker 1: and we need to acknowledge that, yes, these school shootings happen,

170
00:09:34,840 --> 00:09:36,960
Speaker 1: and we should take steps to prevent it. Is that

171
00:09:37,000 --> 00:09:39,800
Speaker 1: a lock on the front door, well with a guard? There?

172
00:09:40,200 --> 00:09:42,240
Speaker 1: Is that a lock on the classroom doors? Is that

173
00:09:42,360 --> 00:09:46,080
Speaker 1: teachers having some weapons or the ability to conceal carry

174
00:09:46,080 --> 00:09:49,760
Speaker 1: a weapon? Um, well, what's the answer. Also, I'd like

175
00:09:49,840 --> 00:09:51,920
Speaker 1: to know all those things. Yeah, I don't know if

176
00:09:51,920 --> 00:09:54,760
Speaker 1: it's been revealed yet, but what if any drugs was

177
00:09:54,840 --> 00:09:58,679
Speaker 1: the shooter on, because oftentimes these these guys are on

178
00:09:58,920 --> 00:10:03,559
Speaker 1: psychotropic drug If you that you've seen the picture of

179
00:10:03,600 --> 00:10:05,520
Speaker 1: the kid, right, I saw the picture of him in

180
00:10:05,559 --> 00:10:09,560
Speaker 1: the communist shirt. Yes, yeah, he looks disturbed. You know,

181
00:10:09,760 --> 00:10:11,880
Speaker 1: he looks like you know, he looks like the Batman shooter.

182
00:10:12,440 --> 00:10:14,520
Speaker 1: You know, like there's something wrong with this dude, Like

183
00:10:14,600 --> 00:10:18,240
Speaker 1: he's not right, you know. I mean I don't know

184
00:10:18,240 --> 00:10:21,720
Speaker 1: what that is. I couldn't speculate, but you know, you

185
00:10:21,760 --> 00:10:26,400
Speaker 1: can he looks not well to me? I was thinking,

186
00:10:26,520 --> 00:10:29,320
Speaker 1: you know, when I saw just the ongoing gun control debate,

187
00:10:29,360 --> 00:10:32,320
Speaker 1: which happens every single time, you know, and we've become

188
00:10:32,360 --> 00:10:35,520
Speaker 1: totally desensitized to the shooting itself. And even though there's

189
00:10:35,520 --> 00:10:37,120
Speaker 1: like I don't even want to see them, but there's

190
00:10:37,160 --> 00:10:40,120
Speaker 1: videos of the classrooms. I saw some last night. Yeah,

191
00:10:40,120 --> 00:10:42,439
Speaker 1: I have no interest in watching it. I mean, I'm

192
00:10:42,520 --> 00:10:45,839
Speaker 1: pretty sure I know what it looks like and it's

193
00:10:45,880 --> 00:10:49,520
Speaker 1: not going to bring anything positive to my life. It won't.

194
00:10:50,080 --> 00:10:53,360
Speaker 1: But um my thought was, so we didn't have him

195
00:10:53,400 --> 00:10:55,320
Speaker 1: on the podcast. He kind of bowed on us. But

196
00:10:55,360 --> 00:10:57,800
Speaker 1: what was that guy's named Cody Wilson. I think, yeah,

197
00:10:57,840 --> 00:10:59,840
Speaker 1: so I know that he's pretty and I would love

198
00:10:59,880 --> 00:11:01,960
Speaker 1: to a mom. We just never got back to us. Uh,

199
00:11:02,080 --> 00:11:05,800
Speaker 1: innovative in the three D printing industry, And like my

200
00:11:05,920 --> 00:11:08,079
Speaker 1: feeling is this whole gun control debate it's gonna be

201
00:11:08,120 --> 00:11:11,040
Speaker 1: obsolete soon because it's gonna be pretty easy to print

202
00:11:11,080 --> 00:11:14,040
Speaker 1: your own automatic weapon or if someone in the neighborhood

203
00:11:14,080 --> 00:11:16,840
Speaker 1: has a three D printer, even if they make it

204
00:11:16,880 --> 00:11:19,400
Speaker 1: so it's not capable to do that, it's probably gonna

205
00:11:19,400 --> 00:11:21,679
Speaker 1: be pretty easy to hack a three D printer and

206
00:11:21,760 --> 00:11:24,679
Speaker 1: print whatever you want, just like you know, I booked

207
00:11:24,679 --> 00:11:27,840
Speaker 1: a guest on Senator Bradley Show whose son they were

208
00:11:27,880 --> 00:11:30,480
Speaker 1: able to print out a prosthetic hand for him, something

209
00:11:30,559 --> 00:11:34,400
Speaker 1: that would have cost way more uh doing it professionally,

210
00:11:34,400 --> 00:11:36,400
Speaker 1: and they printed it at the school's three D printer

211
00:11:36,520 --> 00:11:39,000
Speaker 1: and it works perfectly fine. Believe he was able to

212
00:11:39,120 --> 00:11:42,200
Speaker 1: play basketball with it. Uh. It's gonna be used for

213
00:11:42,240 --> 00:11:43,920
Speaker 1: things like that, but it's also going to be used

214
00:11:43,960 --> 00:11:46,559
Speaker 1: to print automatic weapons, and the government is going to

215
00:11:46,640 --> 00:11:48,880
Speaker 1: have very little they'll be able to do about it. Yeah,

216
00:11:48,920 --> 00:11:51,439
Speaker 1: once you can three D print in akte, I mean,

217
00:11:51,480 --> 00:11:53,960
Speaker 1: gun controls over you know, it's it's gonna be a

218
00:11:53,960 --> 00:11:57,360
Speaker 1: moot point. Yeah, and I don't think, you know, we've

219
00:11:57,480 --> 00:12:00,160
Speaker 1: really grappled with that fact yet. We don't. It's you know,

220
00:12:00,200 --> 00:12:02,200
Speaker 1: the future is coming up on us pretty quick, but

221
00:12:02,280 --> 00:12:05,120
Speaker 1: we haven't really figured out how to deal with these technologies.

222
00:12:05,160 --> 00:12:07,600
Speaker 1: You know, even you know, you can see all the

223
00:12:07,640 --> 00:12:10,800
Speaker 1: consternation about social media and how it's been used to

224
00:12:10,840 --> 00:12:13,600
Speaker 1: manipulate people. I mean, this is something that you know

225
00:12:14,240 --> 00:12:19,319
Speaker 1: was foretold in science fiction, you know, years and years ago. Um,

226
00:12:19,360 --> 00:12:21,680
Speaker 1: even in the the nineties. We would have. You know, I

227
00:12:21,720 --> 00:12:24,120
Speaker 1: think some of us were aware of how you know,

228
00:12:24,200 --> 00:12:27,640
Speaker 1: the technology could be abused. Um, but it's like just now,

229
00:12:27,720 --> 00:12:30,559
Speaker 1: you know, twenty years later, we're just starting to kind

230
00:12:30,559 --> 00:12:33,440
Speaker 1: of grapple with the problem and start to realize it.

231
00:12:34,040 --> 00:12:37,400
Speaker 1: And and you can't uninvent an invention once it's out there.

232
00:12:37,440 --> 00:12:39,320
Speaker 1: You can't put the genie back on the bottle. Yeah,

233
00:12:39,360 --> 00:12:43,640
Speaker 1: And there's whatever gun control is passed, like after Sandy

234
00:12:43,640 --> 00:12:45,320
Speaker 1: Hook in New York you can no longer buy an

235
00:12:45,360 --> 00:12:48,199
Speaker 1: a R fifteen and stuff like that. It is not

236
00:12:48,840 --> 00:12:51,000
Speaker 1: I believe it's never gonna happen. And they're gonna go

237
00:12:51,040 --> 00:12:53,400
Speaker 1: door to door and take everyone's weapons away in America.

238
00:12:53,440 --> 00:12:56,200
Speaker 1: It couldn't happen. It's not reasonable. Yeah, there's too many

239
00:12:56,240 --> 00:12:58,720
Speaker 1: guns in this country. Yeah, and that's the thing there.

240
00:12:58,800 --> 00:13:00,960
Speaker 1: So they're still gonna be out there. Yeah, yeah, of course.

241
00:13:01,000 --> 00:13:04,200
Speaker 1: So I don't I don't think, no matter what side

242
00:13:04,200 --> 00:13:06,760
Speaker 1: of the argument you're on, that there's an easy solution

243
00:13:06,800 --> 00:13:08,000
Speaker 1: of this type of thing. And I do think it's

244
00:13:08,000 --> 00:13:11,080
Speaker 1: a cultural problem more than anything. I mean, I hate

245
00:13:11,080 --> 00:13:13,480
Speaker 1: to like make points I've seen in memes and stuff

246
00:13:13,520 --> 00:13:16,679
Speaker 1: like that, but there was a time where kids went

247
00:13:16,720 --> 00:13:20,240
Speaker 1: to high school, like when our parents were in school,

248
00:13:20,640 --> 00:13:23,400
Speaker 1: and there was like a shooting club. There's like a

249
00:13:23,800 --> 00:13:26,040
Speaker 1: gag club and stuff like that, and none of this

250
00:13:26,080 --> 00:13:29,760
Speaker 1: should happen. There's very few school shootings, yeah, and it

251
00:13:29,800 --> 00:13:32,080
Speaker 1: would be interesting to study like the psychology of it

252
00:13:32,120 --> 00:13:35,400
Speaker 1: and like how it came about, because we like, why

253
00:13:35,400 --> 00:13:38,280
Speaker 1: do people keep doing stuff like this? And is it

254
00:13:39,040 --> 00:13:41,199
Speaker 1: you know, it's like an expression of anger. I mean.

255
00:13:41,200 --> 00:13:43,600
Speaker 1: On the other hand, I mean, you have school shootings

256
00:13:43,640 --> 00:13:45,959
Speaker 1: in the in the black community. Also, for a long time,

257
00:13:46,000 --> 00:13:49,480
Speaker 1: there were more gang related or drug related and um,

258
00:13:49,520 --> 00:13:51,440
Speaker 1: I feel like we kind of turned a blind eye

259
00:13:51,440 --> 00:13:53,880
Speaker 1: to that too. Yeah, and then all of a sudden,

260
00:13:53,880 --> 00:13:57,040
Speaker 1: when Columbine happened, when gun violence or violence in general

261
00:13:57,080 --> 00:13:59,840
Speaker 1: came to White America, suddenly people start freaking out about it.

262
00:14:00,320 --> 00:14:03,040
Speaker 1: The dynamics involved are different, of course, but nonetheless they're

263
00:14:03,080 --> 00:14:05,520
Speaker 1: still school shootings. Are still kids getting shot in school,

264
00:14:05,520 --> 00:14:08,480
Speaker 1: and you know, it's unacceptable either way. I also blame

265
00:14:08,520 --> 00:14:12,360
Speaker 1: the media on some level for making these school shooters famous,

266
00:14:13,000 --> 00:14:16,040
Speaker 1: because well that these these people who school shootings, they're

267
00:14:16,080 --> 00:14:18,920
Speaker 1: all losers. They all have nothing they're really living for.

268
00:14:19,280 --> 00:14:21,200
Speaker 1: They don't give a ship and they want to go

269
00:14:21,280 --> 00:14:23,840
Speaker 1: down in infamy. Like we all know the names of

270
00:14:23,920 --> 00:14:27,400
Speaker 1: the two column Mine school shooters. There has been immortal

271
00:14:27,480 --> 00:14:30,440
Speaker 1: to Yeah. Yeah, And it turned out that those two

272
00:14:30,480 --> 00:14:32,840
Speaker 1: are a good example because they did it to be famous.

273
00:14:32,920 --> 00:14:34,360
Speaker 1: That was what they wanted. It wasn't because they were

274
00:14:34,360 --> 00:14:37,320
Speaker 1: being bullied or anything like that, you know, it was

275
00:14:37,360 --> 00:14:39,800
Speaker 1: because they wanted to be famous. Yeah, and I guess

276
00:14:39,840 --> 00:14:42,360
Speaker 1: they got what they wanted. And I hate to bring

277
00:14:42,440 --> 00:14:45,080
Speaker 1: up like a comedy thing, but did you remember Chris

278
00:14:45,160 --> 00:14:47,680
Speaker 1: rock joke about that where he was like they said

279
00:14:47,720 --> 00:14:50,320
Speaker 1: they were outcast and he was like, it was six

280
00:14:50,360 --> 00:14:52,840
Speaker 1: of those motherfuckers. He was like, I didn't have six

281
00:14:52,880 --> 00:14:54,880
Speaker 1: friends in high school. I don't have six friends now.

282
00:14:55,680 --> 00:14:58,720
Speaker 1: That is still like a great line, I think. But yeah,

283
00:14:58,840 --> 00:15:00,960
Speaker 1: I think you're completely right. And I think most of

284
00:15:01,000 --> 00:15:03,200
Speaker 1: these people do it to be famous because I think

285
00:15:03,200 --> 00:15:05,360
Speaker 1: they have nothing else to live for. They want their

286
00:15:05,440 --> 00:15:10,320
Speaker 1: their picture to be on newspapers. Yeah. It's like, you know,

287
00:15:10,440 --> 00:15:12,880
Speaker 1: you can't do something good in life, do something really bad,

288
00:15:13,400 --> 00:15:16,440
Speaker 1: you know, I don't understand. It's hard for me to

289
00:15:16,480 --> 00:15:19,560
Speaker 1: understand the rationale behind it. Like, no matter how angry

290
00:15:19,640 --> 00:15:23,720
Speaker 1: I was or have been, I can't ever imagine like

291
00:15:23,880 --> 00:15:27,640
Speaker 1: I'm going to go and murder a bunch of kids. Yeah,

292
00:15:27,840 --> 00:15:30,040
Speaker 1: Like the logic just doesn't make sense to me, Like

293
00:15:30,080 --> 00:15:33,400
Speaker 1: there's no rationale behind it. I mean I can even understand, like,

294
00:15:33,720 --> 00:15:36,200
Speaker 1: you know, somebody who's got some screws loose and they're like,

295
00:15:36,360 --> 00:15:38,440
Speaker 1: I'm piste off of the federal government, so I'm gonna

296
00:15:38,440 --> 00:15:40,560
Speaker 1: go shoot up the I R S or something like

297
00:15:40,680 --> 00:15:43,800
Speaker 1: police don't do that. That's terrorism. At least you can

298
00:15:43,840 --> 00:15:48,400
Speaker 1: sort of understand, like there's a certain logic to it. Well,

299
00:15:48,400 --> 00:15:51,000
Speaker 1: like the personality that goes and like shoots up at

300
00:15:51,040 --> 00:15:54,920
Speaker 1: school that it's I don't know, it's psychopathic, It's there's

301
00:15:54,920 --> 00:15:58,000
Speaker 1: something behind that. I'm never gonna understand. I think this

302
00:15:58,160 --> 00:16:00,720
Speaker 1: just proves a conspiracy theory. These shooting has happened so

303
00:16:00,720 --> 00:16:02,920
Speaker 1: that they could pass more gun control because at this

304
00:16:03,000 --> 00:16:05,920
Speaker 1: point there's been so many of them and there has

305
00:16:05,960 --> 00:16:08,840
Speaker 1: not been any massive change in gun controm nationally. So

306
00:16:09,480 --> 00:16:11,920
Speaker 1: no people, you know, people freaked out and they're like

307
00:16:11,920 --> 00:16:14,360
Speaker 1: Obama's going to take our guns. I mean, none of

308
00:16:14,400 --> 00:16:18,160
Speaker 1: that happened. You know, they tried, but you know they tried,

309
00:16:18,280 --> 00:16:21,640
Speaker 1: and they'll they'll try again. No, doubt. Um, I think

310
00:16:21,680 --> 00:16:24,400
Speaker 1: that the gun control issue has largely been settled in

311
00:16:24,440 --> 00:16:27,160
Speaker 1: this country, to tell you the truth, since like the nineties.

312
00:16:28,880 --> 00:16:31,800
Speaker 1: I think a pivotal moment for it was nine eleven.

313
00:16:31,880 --> 00:16:35,360
Speaker 1: After nine eleven, people they were afraid of terrorism and

314
00:16:35,400 --> 00:16:41,320
Speaker 1: other things. Then I think gun ownership, even for self

315
00:16:41,360 --> 00:16:44,000
Speaker 1: defense purposes, like it went really mainstream. If you go

316
00:16:44,040 --> 00:16:48,200
Speaker 1: to the shot show today, like they're marketing heavily towards women, Um,

317
00:16:48,240 --> 00:16:51,600
Speaker 1: I know, normal, Like it seems like normal people you

318
00:16:51,640 --> 00:16:53,920
Speaker 1: would not expect to be quote unquote gun nuts. And

319
00:16:53,960 --> 00:16:55,640
Speaker 1: they left going out to the range and shooting on

320
00:16:55,680 --> 00:16:58,960
Speaker 1: the weekend. You know, I went mainstream. So I just

321
00:16:59,040 --> 00:17:01,280
Speaker 1: don't see gun can were really going anywhere in this

322
00:17:01,400 --> 00:17:04,919
Speaker 1: country anytime soon. Yeah. I agree. Another point that I

323
00:17:04,960 --> 00:17:06,880
Speaker 1: saw that I guess is on the more left wing

324
00:17:06,960 --> 00:17:10,160
Speaker 1: side of the spectrum. Uh, going around Twitter and all

325
00:17:10,200 --> 00:17:14,639
Speaker 1: that was they said, for example, one idiot tried to

326
00:17:14,640 --> 00:17:16,640
Speaker 1: put a bomb in his shoe on an airplane, and

327
00:17:16,720 --> 00:17:18,479
Speaker 1: ever since that time, we all have to take our

328
00:17:18,480 --> 00:17:21,959
Speaker 1: shoes off and we board an airplane. Uh. And on

329
00:17:22,000 --> 00:17:25,600
Speaker 1: the other hand, there's been a plethora of school shootings

330
00:17:25,720 --> 00:17:28,919
Speaker 1: and very little has changed. Yeah, and why do you

331
00:17:28,960 --> 00:17:31,200
Speaker 1: see those kinds of differences. Really, it's because of the

332
00:17:31,240 --> 00:17:35,520
Speaker 1: Bill of Rights. Gun ownership is you know, enshrined, you

333
00:17:35,560 --> 00:17:38,479
Speaker 1: know in the Second Amendment. Um. I had a family

334
00:17:38,520 --> 00:17:42,199
Speaker 1: member of mine actually posting on Facebook today he's like,

335
00:17:42,200 --> 00:17:45,080
Speaker 1: gun ownership is a privilege, not a right. Gun owners

336
00:17:45,119 --> 00:17:46,879
Speaker 1: have to be prepared that they're gonna lose their gun

337
00:17:47,040 --> 00:17:50,800
Speaker 1: rights and it's their fault because they don't police their owns. Like, Okay, actually,

338
00:17:50,800 --> 00:17:54,080
Speaker 1: nothing you're saying there is accurate. You know, gun ownership

339
00:17:54,160 --> 00:17:56,800
Speaker 1: is one of your civil rights in this country, in America.

340
00:17:56,840 --> 00:17:59,960
Speaker 1: It's not a privilege, it's a right. And that's why

341
00:18:00,040 --> 00:18:03,320
Speaker 1: I you know, the the law enforcement and the government

342
00:18:03,320 --> 00:18:05,200
Speaker 1: can do all sorts of things to you know, screw

343
00:18:05,280 --> 00:18:08,400
Speaker 1: with you at the airport, make you take your shoes off,

344
00:18:08,440 --> 00:18:10,840
Speaker 1: and they scan your body, and it's all based on

345
00:18:10,920 --> 00:18:15,920
Speaker 1: constitutional um interpretations and laws, and you know, gun ownership

346
00:18:16,000 --> 00:18:18,119
Speaker 1: is just one of those things they really can't screw

347
00:18:18,200 --> 00:18:20,879
Speaker 1: with now, unless you're like a felon or something like that,

348
00:18:20,920 --> 00:18:22,920
Speaker 1: they can't strip you if your civil rights without any

349
00:18:23,000 --> 00:18:27,399
Speaker 1: due process. Yeah, I think we've covered it, um, And

350
00:18:27,720 --> 00:18:29,280
Speaker 1: I guess the most important thing to say is the

351
00:18:29,359 --> 00:18:32,359
Speaker 1: rest in peace to these seventeen kids. Uh, you know,

352
00:18:32,359 --> 00:18:36,560
Speaker 1: it's a horrible thing to hear. Yeah, and that that

353
00:18:36,720 --> 00:18:38,679
Speaker 1: school is never going to be the same, those families

354
00:18:38,720 --> 00:18:41,320
Speaker 1: will never be the same. Yeah, there's nothing I can

355
00:18:41,359 --> 00:18:43,760
Speaker 1: say that's ever going to change that. I'm with you,

356
00:18:43,880 --> 00:18:45,720
Speaker 1: all right. Well, with that, we should get over to

357
00:18:45,920 --> 00:18:48,680
Speaker 1: Uh Dr Leonard Wong excited to talk to him about

358
00:18:48,720 --> 00:18:53,479
Speaker 1: something completely different. Uh, and let's get over that. On

359
00:18:53,520 --> 00:18:56,080
Speaker 1: the show for the first time is doctor Leonard Long,

360
00:18:56,119 --> 00:18:58,720
Speaker 1: who said call me Lenny. So Lenning is on the show.

361
00:18:59,280 --> 00:19:03,159
Speaker 1: Research for pastor for the Strategic Studies Institute at the U. S.

362
00:19:03,280 --> 00:19:07,240
Speaker 1: Army War College, retired Army officer, taught at West Point

363
00:19:07,320 --> 00:19:09,800
Speaker 1: and serves as an analyst for the Chief of Staff

364
00:19:09,840 --> 00:19:12,480
Speaker 1: of the Army. And I was telling Jack that, So

365
00:19:12,600 --> 00:19:14,440
Speaker 1: Jack had me reach out to you as a guest

366
00:19:14,440 --> 00:19:17,600
Speaker 1: because he really loved the piece that you did um

367
00:19:17,840 --> 00:19:20,480
Speaker 1: on the wine culture in the military, which we're gonna

368
00:19:20,480 --> 00:19:23,439
Speaker 1: get into. But but it was funny that I, you know,

369
00:19:23,480 --> 00:19:24,800
Speaker 1: I was telling you about the show and that we

370
00:19:24,800 --> 00:19:26,840
Speaker 1: were interested in having you on, and you said to me,

371
00:19:27,040 --> 00:19:28,680
Speaker 1: are you sure you have the right guy? I didn't

372
00:19:28,680 --> 00:19:31,879
Speaker 1: do anything that interesting. Well, no, let me just explain

373
00:19:31,920 --> 00:19:34,399
Speaker 1: a little bit why I was so adamant about having

374
00:19:34,640 --> 00:19:38,119
Speaker 1: uh Dr Wang on the podcast is because I was

375
00:19:38,160 --> 00:19:43,080
Speaker 1: talking to a Army officer and he mentioned to me, UM,

376
00:19:43,200 --> 00:19:46,440
Speaker 1: you know this, uh, this guy over the Staff College,

377
00:19:46,520 --> 00:19:50,480
Speaker 1: Dr Leonard Wong, who had done this study UM called lying,

378
00:19:50,600 --> 00:19:53,600
Speaker 1: It's called lying to ourselves, dishonesty and the Army profession.

379
00:19:54,160 --> 00:19:57,200
Speaker 1: And he mentioned, how, you know, there's this study about

380
00:19:57,400 --> 00:20:01,000
Speaker 1: that showed how the Army um has more mandatory training

381
00:20:01,040 --> 00:20:03,520
Speaker 1: then there are actual training days. And what this results

382
00:20:03,520 --> 00:20:08,400
Speaker 1: in is military officers and others in the military essentially

383
00:20:08,400 --> 00:20:11,280
Speaker 1: sending up false reports and lying about what they're realistically

384
00:20:11,320 --> 00:20:14,520
Speaker 1: able to accomplish. And I immediately knew exactly what this

385
00:20:14,600 --> 00:20:17,280
Speaker 1: gentleman was talking about because I had lived in myself

386
00:20:17,320 --> 00:20:20,200
Speaker 1: when I was in the Army. But I was actually

387
00:20:20,359 --> 00:20:22,639
Speaker 1: I mean, I was just so thrilled and happy to

388
00:20:22,680 --> 00:20:27,320
Speaker 1: see uh some an expert like Lenny here who put

389
00:20:27,359 --> 00:20:30,880
Speaker 1: it into academic research and can articulate it so much

390
00:20:30,880 --> 00:20:33,240
Speaker 1: better than I can, because I really believe this is

391
00:20:33,280 --> 00:20:36,040
Speaker 1: an important issue. So thanks for coming on the show today,

392
00:20:36,600 --> 00:20:39,680
Speaker 1: my pleasure. UM, do you want to talk a little

393
00:20:39,720 --> 00:20:42,840
Speaker 1: bit about how this study came about in the white paper.

394
00:20:43,520 --> 00:20:46,119
Speaker 1: Listeners can go and take a look at it themselves,

395
00:20:46,640 --> 00:20:49,400
Speaker 1: UM if they just google Dr Wang's name. And again

396
00:20:49,440 --> 00:20:52,360
Speaker 1: it's called lying to ourselves, dishonesty and the Army profession

397
00:20:52,880 --> 00:20:55,560
Speaker 1: it's it's posted online. So that the study actually started

398
00:20:55,680 --> 00:20:59,440
Speaker 1: UH over a decade ago when the Chief of Staff

399
00:20:59,440 --> 00:21:01,000
Speaker 1: of the Army came up here at the Army War

400
00:21:01,080 --> 00:21:04,400
Speaker 1: College and UH and at that time, he was concerned

401
00:21:04,440 --> 00:21:10,159
Speaker 1: about junior officer UH initiative, the ability to UH to

402
00:21:10,200 --> 00:21:12,760
Speaker 1: make decisions on their own, their visiting, ability to be

403
00:21:12,840 --> 00:21:16,440
Speaker 1: imaginative and independent. And he thought that we were UH

404
00:21:16,880 --> 00:21:20,280
Speaker 1: squelching the innovation in our junior officers. And he thought

405
00:21:20,320 --> 00:21:23,960
Speaker 1: that the place where we were junior officers developed the most,

406
00:21:24,520 --> 00:21:27,280
Speaker 1: we were really squeezing them too hard. And that's company command.

407
00:21:27,640 --> 00:21:30,720
Speaker 1: And so he gave us a tasker up here, UM saying, look,

408
00:21:30,760 --> 00:21:32,000
Speaker 1: I want you to go out there and figure out

409
00:21:32,000 --> 00:21:35,119
Speaker 1: every single thing we put on company commanders and UH,

410
00:21:35,320 --> 00:21:37,399
Speaker 1: every single requirement, and I want you to cut it

411
00:21:37,720 --> 00:21:40,000
Speaker 1: all the non mission essentral stuff in half, and we're

412
00:21:40,000 --> 00:21:42,600
Speaker 1: gonna return white space back on the company commander's training schedule.

413
00:21:43,040 --> 00:21:44,800
Speaker 1: And so they gave me ten war college students. I

414
00:21:44,800 --> 00:21:46,760
Speaker 1: sent him around the world, cut them all up, and

415
00:21:46,760 --> 00:21:49,680
Speaker 1: and we calculated out, you know, how many hours each

416
00:21:49,720 --> 00:21:52,480
Speaker 1: mandatory training takes. And then we said, okay, assume a

417
00:21:52,520 --> 00:21:55,199
Speaker 1: ten hour day and take out Christmas and all this

418
00:21:55,240 --> 00:21:57,199
Speaker 1: kind of stuff. And we came out with you know, uh,

419
00:21:57,280 --> 00:21:58,680
Speaker 1: you know, we had to go back and brief the

420
00:21:58,760 --> 00:22:02,560
Speaker 1: chief saying, uh, Chief, you know that non Michian central training.

421
00:22:02,560 --> 00:22:05,080
Speaker 1: We want to blame it all on. That's not the problem.

422
00:22:05,240 --> 00:22:07,240
Speaker 1: The problems we have all this other mandatory training. Matter

423
00:22:07,240 --> 00:22:08,400
Speaker 1: of fact, when you add it all up, it comes

424
00:22:08,400 --> 00:22:11,720
Speaker 1: out to two seven days that we have to cram

425
00:22:11,760 --> 00:22:15,040
Speaker 1: in into two hundred fifty six available training days. Well,

426
00:22:15,040 --> 00:22:17,800
Speaker 1: and I would point out that you're talking about a

427
00:22:17,840 --> 00:22:20,440
Speaker 1: two thousand to study and correct me if I'm wrong.

428
00:22:20,520 --> 00:22:23,840
Speaker 1: But this was all pre nine eleven data, right, that's correct.

429
00:22:23,960 --> 00:22:25,840
Speaker 1: That's all pre nine eleven. And then that was the

430
00:22:25,880 --> 00:22:27,720
Speaker 1: days of the m R. E S, the peacekeeping and

431
00:22:27,720 --> 00:22:30,280
Speaker 1: all that kind of stuff. And so we had massive

432
00:22:30,359 --> 00:22:33,720
Speaker 1: checklist back then, and uh, now pre nine with nine

433
00:22:33,760 --> 00:22:37,160
Speaker 1: eleven it kicked in, you know, the whole new arfur

434
00:22:37,280 --> 00:22:40,480
Speaker 1: Gen checklists and and things like that, and so uh

435
00:22:41,000 --> 00:22:43,120
Speaker 1: and so back then, so that study hit the Army,

436
00:22:43,160 --> 00:22:45,440
Speaker 1: and you know, it became a topic for a while,

437
00:22:45,880 --> 00:22:47,439
Speaker 1: and so I put it on the shelf. But what

438
00:22:47,520 --> 00:22:49,280
Speaker 1: was always in the back of my head is, wait

439
00:22:49,320 --> 00:22:53,080
Speaker 1: a minute. We established, we showed empirically that it's physically,

440
00:22:53,160 --> 00:22:59,480
Speaker 1: literally humanly impossible to do all the mandatory training in

441
00:22:59,560 --> 00:23:03,119
Speaker 1: the amount of days available. Then what are we reporting?

442
00:23:03,240 --> 00:23:06,120
Speaker 1: And I knew the answer to that, because the answer is, really,

443
00:23:06,160 --> 00:23:09,800
Speaker 1: you're not allowed to report. We all know the answer

444
00:23:09,840 --> 00:23:12,600
Speaker 1: to that, and so so I really wasn't asking that question,

445
00:23:12,960 --> 00:23:15,040
Speaker 1: and so um, I let time go by and time

446
00:23:15,040 --> 00:23:17,560
Speaker 1: go by, but it was always percolating around and then

447
00:23:17,760 --> 00:23:20,159
Speaker 1: uh so then I said, you know, we really have

448
00:23:20,240 --> 00:23:22,600
Speaker 1: to dig into that. And so I went to my colleague,

449
00:23:22,600 --> 00:23:26,199
Speaker 1: Steve Garris, who's on the Army War College the faculty here,

450
00:23:26,200 --> 00:23:29,000
Speaker 1: and I sat down at his PC and he's busy,

451
00:23:29,000 --> 00:23:31,960
Speaker 1: typing away, busy with something. And I said, Steve, I

452
00:23:32,040 --> 00:23:34,120
Speaker 1: got another study we need to do. I think we're lying.

453
00:23:34,400 --> 00:23:36,640
Speaker 1: And he says, what are you talking about? And I said,

454
00:23:36,640 --> 00:23:38,359
Speaker 1: I think we're lying about stuff. And he looks at me,

455
00:23:38,400 --> 00:23:40,800
Speaker 1: he says, what do you mean We I never lie?

456
00:23:41,119 --> 00:23:42,879
Speaker 1: He says, you can ask my wife. It's one thing

457
00:23:42,880 --> 00:23:45,480
Speaker 1: I don't do. I don't lie to people, and I

458
00:23:45,520 --> 00:23:46,920
Speaker 1: don't lie to anything, and so I don't know what

459
00:23:46,960 --> 00:23:49,160
Speaker 1: you're talking about. And so he goes back to typing.

460
00:23:49,200 --> 00:23:51,160
Speaker 1: I said, well, I got this study. I think we're

461
00:23:51,240 --> 00:23:53,600
Speaker 1: lying about the stuff. He says, I think it's a

462
00:23:53,640 --> 00:23:55,040
Speaker 1: dead end. And I said, what are you working on.

463
00:23:55,440 --> 00:23:57,639
Speaker 1: You're not paying attention to me. And he says, I'm

464
00:23:57,720 --> 00:24:00,560
Speaker 1: knocking out the mandatory training. And I said, so you're

465
00:24:00,560 --> 00:24:01,760
Speaker 1: doing it and he says, no, I'm just saying that

466
00:24:01,960 --> 00:24:03,080
Speaker 1: it's not important that you really did it. You just

467
00:24:03,119 --> 00:24:05,560
Speaker 1: got a report that you did it. And it was

468
00:24:05,600 --> 00:24:07,359
Speaker 1: at that point I said, I think you're gonna be

469
00:24:07,400 --> 00:24:11,560
Speaker 1: a good co op. So because exactly as you said, Jack,

470
00:24:11,840 --> 00:24:14,400
Speaker 1: we all know exactly what I'm talking about. But when

471
00:24:14,440 --> 00:24:17,199
Speaker 1: you confront an army officer or an n C O

472
00:24:17,680 --> 00:24:21,320
Speaker 1: and say do you lie, you are getting in their faith.

473
00:24:21,720 --> 00:24:26,440
Speaker 1: It's interesting because it's like so institutionalized that we don't

474
00:24:26,560 --> 00:24:29,080
Speaker 1: see it as a lie anymore. That's the new normal,

475
00:24:29,640 --> 00:24:33,160
Speaker 1: exactly right. And there's two things. It's one, society loves

476
00:24:33,240 --> 00:24:35,840
Speaker 1: us and we listen, and you know they put us

477
00:24:35,880 --> 00:24:38,439
Speaker 1: up on a pedestal, and we're the most trusted. They

478
00:24:38,480 --> 00:24:41,040
Speaker 1: ask of all the leaders of any of any institution

479
00:24:41,080 --> 00:24:43,520
Speaker 1: in the US, who do you trust? You know they

480
00:24:43,560 --> 00:24:46,080
Speaker 1: and they say the leaders I trusted the institution of

481
00:24:46,119 --> 00:24:48,920
Speaker 1: the military. And so we know that. You know, Congress

482
00:24:48,920 --> 00:24:51,160
Speaker 1: and Wall Street are on the other end. We're at

483
00:24:51,680 --> 00:24:53,880
Speaker 1: there are five and six percent. We live up high.

484
00:24:54,280 --> 00:24:56,920
Speaker 1: Society is busy telling us you guys are trustworthy, and

485
00:24:56,960 --> 00:24:58,640
Speaker 1: so we hear that, and we we love it. Then

486
00:24:58,640 --> 00:25:01,840
Speaker 1: we tell ourselves that we are above reproach. We live

487
00:25:01,840 --> 00:25:04,400
Speaker 1: above the common level of life, you know, integrity, respect,

488
00:25:04,760 --> 00:25:06,919
Speaker 1: you know, honor and all that kind of stuff. We

489
00:25:06,960 --> 00:25:09,720
Speaker 1: just live it and breathe it. And yet this is

490
00:25:09,720 --> 00:25:13,560
Speaker 1: so commonplace that we say yeah, yea, got it, got it.

491
00:25:13,680 --> 00:25:15,160
Speaker 1: And yet when I walk up to some and say

492
00:25:15,200 --> 00:25:17,760
Speaker 1: do lie, I had so many people get so angry

493
00:25:17,800 --> 00:25:20,439
Speaker 1: with me, of course, because it was an insult, because

494
00:25:21,480 --> 00:25:25,120
Speaker 1: we we we breathe integrity, and yet we so quickly

495
00:25:25,280 --> 00:25:27,960
Speaker 1: will lie on things and can just for some of

496
00:25:28,000 --> 00:25:31,879
Speaker 1: the listeners who maybe are not military members, can we

497
00:25:31,920 --> 00:25:33,919
Speaker 1: talk a little bit briefly about what some of this

498
00:25:34,040 --> 00:25:37,080
Speaker 1: mandatory training is, because there I think a lot of

499
00:25:37,080 --> 00:25:40,400
Speaker 1: people may not understand that we live in a information

500
00:25:40,440 --> 00:25:45,959
Speaker 1: intensive UM era of computers and technology, emails, phones, all

501
00:25:45,960 --> 00:25:49,760
Speaker 1: that good stuff. And what that's allowed the higher command

502
00:25:49,800 --> 00:25:52,680
Speaker 1: elements to do is to put these training requirements UM

503
00:25:52,720 --> 00:25:56,320
Speaker 1: in the context of online training modules UM all the

504
00:25:56,320 --> 00:25:59,040
Speaker 1: way down to you know, the individual soldier, the private

505
00:25:59,119 --> 00:26:02,919
Speaker 1: to these mandatory training requirements. In the old days, we

506
00:26:02,920 --> 00:26:05,720
Speaker 1: could only uh, you know, you couldn't touch individuals. You

507
00:26:05,720 --> 00:26:11,080
Speaker 1: could only get maybe unit unit reports. And but now

508
00:26:11,119 --> 00:26:13,360
Speaker 1: with the advent of computers, we could reach and an

509
00:26:13,359 --> 00:26:18,320
Speaker 1: advent of a Common Access Card CAC uh. But there

510
00:26:18,320 --> 00:26:20,800
Speaker 1: are d card with a little chip in it that

511
00:26:20,880 --> 00:26:24,240
Speaker 1: identifies each individual with attend digit code. We can now

512
00:26:24,359 --> 00:26:27,439
Speaker 1: track down every single person and find out what they've

513
00:26:27,480 --> 00:26:30,159
Speaker 1: done and what they haven't done. So every year we

514
00:26:30,200 --> 00:26:34,480
Speaker 1: have a suite of mandatory training. Now the Army is

515
00:26:34,480 --> 00:26:37,639
Speaker 1: not alone in this, Okay, the other services have it.

516
00:26:37,720 --> 00:26:39,359
Speaker 1: You know, the Air Force had online training on how

517
00:26:39,400 --> 00:26:42,480
Speaker 1: to operate a fire extinguisher and uh and and the

518
00:26:42,560 --> 00:26:44,800
Speaker 1: Army we've got you know, the dangers of bath salts,

519
00:26:44,880 --> 00:26:50,840
Speaker 1: the dangers of vaping. We have fetal alcohol syndrome problems. Uh.

520
00:26:50,920 --> 00:26:54,119
Speaker 1: So everything that someone says you know we've got a problem.

521
00:26:54,280 --> 00:26:57,080
Speaker 1: They need training on this another block of instruction. But

522
00:26:57,119 --> 00:27:00,399
Speaker 1: here's the key. Though. We can blame the mandatory training

523
00:27:00,920 --> 00:27:03,760
Speaker 1: for this culture we live in, but it's way more

524
00:27:03,800 --> 00:27:06,560
Speaker 1: than the mandatory training. And so you look at our

525
00:27:06,600 --> 00:27:10,480
Speaker 1: administrative burden. Uh. And so every time I want to

526
00:27:10,480 --> 00:27:12,280
Speaker 1: go on leave, and the old days, he would turn

527
00:27:12,280 --> 00:27:14,959
Speaker 1: in a Department of the Army form thirty one and

528
00:27:15,000 --> 00:27:17,080
Speaker 1: that was your leave form, and that's how you got

529
00:27:17,080 --> 00:27:19,000
Speaker 1: on leave. Today you turn in a Department of our

530
00:27:19,119 --> 00:27:22,280
Speaker 1: Army form thirty one. But then you submit your leave

531
00:27:22,320 --> 00:27:25,000
Speaker 1: and Earning statement, and then you submit a vehicle inspection

532
00:27:25,040 --> 00:27:27,480
Speaker 1: signed by a supervisor. And then you have to turn

533
00:27:27,520 --> 00:27:30,920
Speaker 1: in something called TRIPS, which is a travel risk prevention

534
00:27:31,080 --> 00:27:33,600
Speaker 1: system where you have to go on the computer and

535
00:27:33,640 --> 00:27:36,800
Speaker 1: the computer ask you how far are you gonna drive,

536
00:27:37,600 --> 00:27:39,960
Speaker 1: what are you gonna take breaks on a prescripture medicine?

537
00:27:39,960 --> 00:27:41,520
Speaker 1: How much sleep did you get last night? And you

538
00:27:41,600 --> 00:27:43,120
Speaker 1: learned very quickly, if you want to go and leave

539
00:27:43,160 --> 00:27:47,320
Speaker 1: this Wednesday, you got to tell that the right answers exactly.

540
00:27:47,520 --> 00:27:49,920
Speaker 1: So we learned to lie so quickly, and and tens

541
00:27:49,960 --> 00:27:52,000
Speaker 1: of thousands of those are turned in on an o

542
00:27:52,119 --> 00:27:54,680
Speaker 1: e r support form. In other words, for our evaluations

543
00:27:54,720 --> 00:27:57,280
Speaker 1: that we turn in, you have to accompany it with

544
00:27:57,320 --> 00:28:00,000
Speaker 1: a form that says I've been counseled. Well, you gotta

545
00:28:00,040 --> 00:28:04,160
Speaker 1: counseling once a quarter. That's four times and and Jack,

546
00:28:04,240 --> 00:28:06,440
Speaker 1: you know this. It's nice and you get the first

547
00:28:06,440 --> 00:28:09,439
Speaker 1: initial counseling, but to get the four counselings, that's like

548
00:28:09,480 --> 00:28:13,240
Speaker 1: almost impossible. Well, I'll be uh, just be quite candid

549
00:28:13,320 --> 00:28:15,760
Speaker 1: about it. I mean, I used to go on leave

550
00:28:15,800 --> 00:28:18,480
Speaker 1: of course and I'd like to travel abroad, um, go

551
00:28:18,640 --> 00:28:21,439
Speaker 1: backpacking in Central America and stuff like that, and you

552
00:28:21,520 --> 00:28:24,320
Speaker 1: had to go through a litany of like briefings like

553
00:28:24,359 --> 00:28:28,400
Speaker 1: SATA briefs and uh safety and watch these like old

554
00:28:28,480 --> 00:28:31,199
Speaker 1: video tapes made by the State Department about how to

555
00:28:31,280 --> 00:28:34,320
Speaker 1: like safeguard yourself when traveling abroad. And I did that

556
00:28:34,400 --> 00:28:35,840
Speaker 1: the first time when I went I went down to

557
00:28:35,880 --> 00:28:38,920
Speaker 1: Costa Rica after I finished Ranger School to go backpacking,

558
00:28:39,160 --> 00:28:42,000
Speaker 1: went through all the process. But like I was, let's see,

559
00:28:42,040 --> 00:28:45,200
Speaker 1: I was probably twenty years old at the time, and

560
00:28:45,280 --> 00:28:47,720
Speaker 1: that was like a teachable moment for me as a

561
00:28:47,760 --> 00:28:49,200
Speaker 1: young man. I was like, Okay, if I want to

562
00:28:49,200 --> 00:28:51,320
Speaker 1: travel abroad, I'm gonna lie to the army next time,

563
00:28:51,480 --> 00:28:53,200
Speaker 1: so I don't have to go through all this crap

564
00:28:53,400 --> 00:28:56,000
Speaker 1: or what I perceived as as crap. That right, well,

565
00:28:56,080 --> 00:28:58,880
Speaker 1: and that's that's the thing is that, um it becomes

566
00:28:58,880 --> 00:29:03,120
Speaker 1: so rule to us, and it gets passed along to

567
00:29:03,200 --> 00:29:06,040
Speaker 1: everyone else. Is this is the right way to do things, um,

568
00:29:06,240 --> 00:29:10,400
Speaker 1: and it has bigger implications than just a Army specialist

569
00:29:10,520 --> 00:29:13,560
Speaker 1: going on leave and actually ends up having very profound

570
00:29:13,640 --> 00:29:16,360
Speaker 1: implications on the Army as a whole. Right, And then

571
00:29:16,400 --> 00:29:18,440
Speaker 1: so it spills up, so we start with mandatory training

572
00:29:18,920 --> 00:29:22,080
Speaker 1: and uh, and mandatory training examples, there is like, um,

573
00:29:22,120 --> 00:29:24,840
Speaker 1: so right before deployment that everyone goes on block leave,

574
00:29:24,920 --> 00:29:27,280
Speaker 1: they come back, they have about a month before they

575
00:29:27,360 --> 00:29:29,840
Speaker 1: actually deploy, and right then it's like, get every single

576
00:29:29,840 --> 00:29:32,760
Speaker 1: piece of mandatory training done before you deploy. And so

577
00:29:32,800 --> 00:29:34,920
Speaker 1: suddenly it's every and was trying to crank out stuff,

578
00:29:34,920 --> 00:29:37,200
Speaker 1: and I asked, so, what's an example of you know,

579
00:29:37,280 --> 00:29:40,400
Speaker 1: this phenomenon I'm trying to discover going on during that time?

580
00:29:40,400 --> 00:29:42,600
Speaker 1: And someone tells me, what what we do is we

581
00:29:42,640 --> 00:29:44,800
Speaker 1: take the smartest person in a squad and we have

582
00:29:44,880 --> 00:29:48,440
Speaker 1: mandatory training and they get everyone's cock their their I

583
00:29:48,520 --> 00:29:50,240
Speaker 1: D cards and they take the training nine times and

584
00:29:50,240 --> 00:29:53,200
Speaker 1: pass out the certificates when they finished. Um jack, you

585
00:29:53,200 --> 00:29:56,160
Speaker 1: know what I'm talking about. Yeah, absolutely, Actually I wanted

586
00:29:56,160 --> 00:30:00,120
Speaker 1: to ask you about the notion of certificates because this

587
00:30:00,200 --> 00:30:03,320
Speaker 1: is something that really bothers me because I get the

588
00:30:03,360 --> 00:30:06,560
Speaker 1: feeling that certificate certifications become this sort of like c

589
00:30:06,880 --> 00:30:10,040
Speaker 1: y a measure UM, and it just strikes me as

590
00:30:10,080 --> 00:30:13,800
Speaker 1: so cynical that we have soldiers take like UM suicide

591
00:30:13,800 --> 00:30:16,640
Speaker 1: prevention training. They print out a certificate and then we say, oh,

592
00:30:16,680 --> 00:30:19,920
Speaker 1: they're good, they got the training. That's exactly right. And

593
00:30:19,920 --> 00:30:23,520
Speaker 1: and that's where the whole thing, because this is the

594
00:30:23,760 --> 00:30:27,240
Speaker 1: conclusion of this is, so is that what is that

595
00:30:27,280 --> 00:30:29,680
Speaker 1: what we're driving for? Because someone at some point said,

596
00:30:29,920 --> 00:30:31,960
Speaker 1: we really need suicide prevention training because weve got too

597
00:30:32,000 --> 00:30:35,360
Speaker 1: many people committing suicide and they don't understand that you

598
00:30:35,360 --> 00:30:37,240
Speaker 1: can get help, that you're not alone in all this

599
00:30:37,280 --> 00:30:38,640
Speaker 1: kind of stuff. And yet we came up with a

600
00:30:38,680 --> 00:30:42,719
Speaker 1: way to make who feel better, the leaders, so they

601
00:30:42,720 --> 00:30:45,560
Speaker 1: can really so after someone kills themselves, we can to

602
00:30:45,600 --> 00:30:48,600
Speaker 1: make ourselves feel better so we can go to bed

603
00:30:48,600 --> 00:30:51,120
Speaker 1: at night and say, well, thank goodness, everyone's been trained

604
00:30:51,120 --> 00:30:55,000
Speaker 1: on suicide prevention when we all know, you know, I

605
00:30:55,040 --> 00:30:57,160
Speaker 1: don't think the person really paid much attention to it,

606
00:30:57,160 --> 00:30:59,560
Speaker 1: but they have a certificate. But we go to bed

607
00:31:00,080 --> 00:31:02,720
Speaker 1: being easy because it looks like everything's good. And that

608
00:31:02,960 --> 00:31:05,680
Speaker 1: was the problem with our profession is that we we

609
00:31:05,680 --> 00:31:09,000
Speaker 1: were content with the facade. We were content with everything

610
00:31:09,000 --> 00:31:11,720
Speaker 1: green during briefings. We're content with getting a go on

611
00:31:11,800 --> 00:31:15,480
Speaker 1: everything um. But it has consequences that I asked them.

612
00:31:15,480 --> 00:31:18,440
Speaker 1: I asked people, so when you go down range, does

613
00:31:18,440 --> 00:31:20,520
Speaker 1: this kind of stuff come up or things really serious

614
00:31:20,520 --> 00:31:21,920
Speaker 1: down you know? You know, you know when you're allowed

615
00:31:21,960 --> 00:31:24,560
Speaker 1: the line, when you're not allowed to lie. Well, we

616
00:31:24,640 --> 00:31:28,080
Speaker 1: had things like I had one captain tell me what

617
00:31:28,160 --> 00:31:29,960
Speaker 1: we had an I E D go off, we're doing

618
00:31:29,960 --> 00:31:34,000
Speaker 1: a relief in place. Had two lieutenants, UH, both get injured.

619
00:31:34,320 --> 00:31:36,840
Speaker 1: But I lied about the distance to the I E D.

620
00:31:37,000 --> 00:31:41,440
Speaker 1: Because I didn't want both lieutenants being evacuated because of

621
00:31:41,960 --> 00:31:43,960
Speaker 1: t B I. And so I told a lie. I

622
00:31:44,000 --> 00:31:46,400
Speaker 1: knew it was a lie. Um. See in that case,

623
00:31:46,520 --> 00:31:49,120
Speaker 1: the person knows it's a lie, and yet they say,

624
00:31:48,960 --> 00:31:50,680
Speaker 1: I think I think I'm doing it for the best.

625
00:31:51,160 --> 00:31:54,120
Speaker 1: Or we had um we'd have a unit show up

626
00:31:54,160 --> 00:31:57,760
Speaker 1: to train partner units, and when the partner units would

627
00:31:57,840 --> 00:31:59,959
Speaker 1: arrive or when they derive with the partner units, they

628
00:32:00,000 --> 00:32:03,720
Speaker 1: immediately rate them amber or read because they're so poorly trained.

629
00:32:03,760 --> 00:32:05,840
Speaker 1: And then they'd spend six months with them, and then

630
00:32:05,840 --> 00:32:09,360
Speaker 1: they bring them up to green and then they rotate out.

631
00:32:09,360 --> 00:32:10,640
Speaker 1: The next unit will come into what do you think

632
00:32:10,640 --> 00:32:15,920
Speaker 1: they rated them amber amber progress, spent six months with them,

633
00:32:15,960 --> 00:32:17,640
Speaker 1: and then you'd be green again. And you know what

634
00:32:17,640 --> 00:32:20,320
Speaker 1: I'm saying, So do you believe the ratings were giving

635
00:32:20,360 --> 00:32:22,560
Speaker 1: them or are we just feeding this system? Well, this

636
00:32:22,640 --> 00:32:25,040
Speaker 1: is when we get into sort of the larger um

637
00:32:25,160 --> 00:32:28,480
Speaker 1: national security aspects or war fighting aspects. I think of

638
00:32:28,520 --> 00:32:31,400
Speaker 1: your study. UM. When I was in Iraq in two

639
00:32:31,440 --> 00:32:34,320
Speaker 1: thousand and nine with a Special Forces O d A,

640
00:32:35,080 --> 00:32:38,160
Speaker 1: I noticed, and I realized very quickly that my command

641
00:32:38,240 --> 00:32:41,480
Speaker 1: was under a lot of pressure to show progress because

642
00:32:41,480 --> 00:32:43,240
Speaker 1: a policy decision had been made that we were going

643
00:32:43,280 --> 00:32:46,240
Speaker 1: to withdraw out of Iraq. And now once that decision

644
00:32:46,280 --> 00:32:48,600
Speaker 1: had been made, the there was it was like, now

645
00:32:48,640 --> 00:32:51,520
Speaker 1: we had to fabricate the reality that we were ready

646
00:32:51,520 --> 00:32:53,800
Speaker 1: to withdraw, that Iraq was ready to stand on its

647
00:32:53,800 --> 00:32:57,320
Speaker 1: own two feet without us, and exactly right, Yeah, and

648
00:32:57,360 --> 00:33:00,120
Speaker 1: so and so I know when we left, and you

649
00:33:00,120 --> 00:33:03,240
Speaker 1: know this too, every partner unit was green and we

650
00:33:03,360 --> 00:33:06,760
Speaker 1: got the real rating when ICE has showed up, right, right, exactly,

651
00:33:07,440 --> 00:33:09,160
Speaker 1: you know what I'm saying. And yet I know that

652
00:33:09,240 --> 00:33:11,840
Speaker 1: briefings went through. You know, we had storyboards that we

653
00:33:11,960 --> 00:33:15,480
Speaker 1: had to be turned in after every patrol. And then

654
00:33:15,520 --> 00:33:17,240
Speaker 1: I here I have captains telling me, well, you know,

655
00:33:17,320 --> 00:33:19,200
Speaker 1: I had four hours to prepare for the next patrol

656
00:33:19,600 --> 00:33:21,880
Speaker 1: or I could spend it doing the storyboard. What I

657
00:33:21,880 --> 00:33:24,000
Speaker 1: did is either copy and pasted or I just made

658
00:33:24,040 --> 00:33:26,840
Speaker 1: it up. Well, the time crunch was so difficult. I

659
00:33:26,880 --> 00:33:30,120
Speaker 1: remember our team leader, Um, who was really a terrific

660
00:33:30,200 --> 00:33:32,400
Speaker 1: officer and I have a lot of respect for him

661
00:33:32,400 --> 00:33:34,640
Speaker 1: to this day. But I mean, he had a very

662
00:33:34,680 --> 00:33:37,640
Speaker 1: limited amount of time to send those storyboards up and

663
00:33:37,680 --> 00:33:39,880
Speaker 1: they were they had tons of information he had to

664
00:33:39,960 --> 00:33:42,160
Speaker 1: include in there. Eat So I'm not I don't want

665
00:33:42,160 --> 00:33:45,239
Speaker 1: to impugne anyone here. That the thing that we want

666
00:33:45,240 --> 00:33:47,200
Speaker 1: to talk about individuals. I want to talk about the

667
00:33:47,200 --> 00:33:50,280
Speaker 1: whole profession and so, but I mean he, he and

668
00:33:50,320 --> 00:33:53,360
Speaker 1: so many other officers were placed in this situation. In

669
00:33:53,360 --> 00:33:56,480
Speaker 1: this situation, you're describing where it's like they're being told

670
00:33:56,520 --> 00:33:59,840
Speaker 1: they have to fudge things right, and and and so

671
00:34:00,200 --> 00:34:01,800
Speaker 1: when I came up with a study, there is really

672
00:34:02,760 --> 00:34:05,200
Speaker 1: some key points that that had to come out. And

673
00:34:05,200 --> 00:34:07,800
Speaker 1: one is the first one is that we lie. And

674
00:34:07,840 --> 00:34:11,560
Speaker 1: that's really hard for us to say we lie, because

675
00:34:11,719 --> 00:34:14,319
Speaker 1: you know, we're taught so early that we don't lie.

676
00:34:14,360 --> 00:34:16,440
Speaker 1: But you know what we lie. But that's followed by

677
00:34:16,480 --> 00:34:19,880
Speaker 1: another thing, that's that's the system makes us lie. Um

678
00:34:20,040 --> 00:34:22,320
Speaker 1: is that I can't do it all and you won't

679
00:34:22,360 --> 00:34:26,680
Speaker 1: take I'm for human trafficking training. Um, you want me

680
00:34:26,680 --> 00:34:28,680
Speaker 1: to say a hunder, I'll tell you dents I get

681
00:34:28,680 --> 00:34:30,680
Speaker 1: on the bigger and better things. So the first point

682
00:34:30,719 --> 00:34:32,560
Speaker 1: is we lie. I hate to say, but we lie.

683
00:34:32,640 --> 00:34:34,440
Speaker 1: The second point is the system makes us lie. But

684
00:34:34,440 --> 00:34:37,400
Speaker 1: then there's a third point is sometimes we as leaders

685
00:34:37,840 --> 00:34:41,480
Speaker 1: make our subordinates lie to us. And so I I

686
00:34:41,760 --> 00:34:43,680
Speaker 1: view this as you know, sometimes our kids walk down

687
00:34:43,719 --> 00:34:45,879
Speaker 1: the stairs and you say to them, did you clean

688
00:34:45,920 --> 00:34:49,360
Speaker 1: your room? And we know the answer, we know the answers.

689
00:34:49,560 --> 00:34:51,319
Speaker 1: The answers they did not clean room, and yet we

690
00:34:51,360 --> 00:34:55,279
Speaker 1: want them to say, yeah, the rooms clean, and and

691
00:34:55,320 --> 00:34:57,799
Speaker 1: so they lie to us. We take it. We know

692
00:34:57,840 --> 00:34:59,400
Speaker 1: it's a lie, but we take it and then the

693
00:34:59,520 --> 00:35:01,239
Speaker 1: facade goes on. That's what we do in the army.

694
00:35:01,680 --> 00:35:03,320
Speaker 1: Is uh, where it just be so easy to just

695
00:35:03,360 --> 00:35:06,000
Speaker 1: walk upstairs and say, your rooms a disaster. I'm not

696
00:35:06,000 --> 00:35:07,680
Speaker 1: even to ask you if you clean it, just clean it.

697
00:35:08,320 --> 00:35:09,840
Speaker 1: But we do the same thing in the army. Is

698
00:35:09,880 --> 00:35:11,680
Speaker 1: that I went to the department of the Army of

699
00:35:11,840 --> 00:35:14,520
Speaker 1: de Pentagon. I asked those guys up there, so all

700
00:35:14,520 --> 00:35:16,680
Speaker 1: this information that we keep feeding you, what do you

701
00:35:16,719 --> 00:35:18,319
Speaker 1: think about it? And they all say, well, we know

702
00:35:18,360 --> 00:35:20,520
Speaker 1: it's not true. And I said, why do you how

703
00:35:20,520 --> 00:35:21,560
Speaker 1: do you know it's not true? And they said, we

704
00:35:21,640 --> 00:35:22,960
Speaker 1: used to be down there, we know what you're giving us.

705
00:35:22,960 --> 00:35:25,160
Speaker 1: We never we never let a senior leader make a

706
00:35:25,200 --> 00:35:27,719
Speaker 1: decision off this data. And I said, okay, look at

707
00:35:27,719 --> 00:35:30,600
Speaker 1: the situation. We got us down at the bottom feeding

708
00:35:30,760 --> 00:35:32,239
Speaker 1: what we know is not true, you at the top

709
00:35:32,239 --> 00:35:34,799
Speaker 1: receiving stuff that you know it's not true. And so

710
00:35:34,920 --> 00:35:37,640
Speaker 1: we called it mutually agreed deception is that we all

711
00:35:37,640 --> 00:35:40,760
Speaker 1: know what's happening, and yet we all pretend. I also

712
00:35:41,080 --> 00:35:44,160
Speaker 1: wanted to ask you another question, Lenny, about sort of

713
00:35:44,160 --> 00:35:48,360
Speaker 1: the upstream side of this um, because you are not

714
00:35:48,520 --> 00:35:52,680
Speaker 1: you personally. The Army asks subordinate units to provide so

715
00:35:52,760 --> 00:35:55,560
Speaker 1: much information because we live in this electronic age with

716
00:35:55,640 --> 00:35:58,719
Speaker 1: their storyboards and their ops sums and this and that.

717
00:35:59,040 --> 00:36:01,000
Speaker 1: I remember one thing I had to do every week

718
00:36:01,040 --> 00:36:03,400
Speaker 1: was send up fit picks. I just send up pictures

719
00:36:03,400 --> 00:36:06,400
Speaker 1: of myself training the Iraqi swat team to prove to

720
00:36:06,520 --> 00:36:09,000
Speaker 1: hire that I was actually doing my job. And what

721
00:36:09,040 --> 00:36:11,040
Speaker 1: I did was I found like five pictures on the

722
00:36:11,080 --> 00:36:13,160
Speaker 1: shared drive and I sent up the same five pictures

723
00:36:13,200 --> 00:36:16,759
Speaker 1: every week and no one noticed. That's the irony. Um, Yeah,

724
00:36:16,800 --> 00:36:20,120
Speaker 1: that's the irony. Um. And another example I'll bring up,

725
00:36:20,120 --> 00:36:23,600
Speaker 1: and this was not my team, thank god, um, but

726
00:36:23,680 --> 00:36:27,960
Speaker 1: there's a case this happened where a team sent up

727
00:36:28,000 --> 00:36:31,680
Speaker 1: an op sum that included racial epithets on it of

728
00:36:31,840 --> 00:36:34,920
Speaker 1: you know, we killed we killed x amount of you know,

729
00:36:35,000 --> 00:36:38,120
Speaker 1: blank blanks. Um. That shouldn't that should never have been

730
00:36:38,160 --> 00:36:40,880
Speaker 1: put in there. That that never should have happened. But

731
00:36:41,000 --> 00:36:43,040
Speaker 1: that went all the way, That report went all the

732
00:36:43,040 --> 00:36:46,960
Speaker 1: way up to scent Com before anyone noticed. Which so

733
00:36:47,040 --> 00:36:50,040
Speaker 1: the racial epithets, that's a disturbing thing, of course, But

734
00:36:50,280 --> 00:36:53,279
Speaker 1: what's even more disturbing to me is that no one

735
00:36:53,320 --> 00:36:56,600
Speaker 1: read it. They're asking for more information than they can

736
00:36:56,640 --> 00:37:01,719
Speaker 1: actually process. Exactly the process because ms you know the

737
00:37:02,040 --> 00:37:04,759
Speaker 1: green during the briefings that it's the the let's so

738
00:37:04,840 --> 00:37:09,400
Speaker 1: we go this through this uh kabooky dance of briefings

739
00:37:09,400 --> 00:37:12,760
Speaker 1: and and q tb s and uh you know, updates

740
00:37:12,760 --> 00:37:16,480
Speaker 1: and everything where what's important is what's briefed as green,

741
00:37:16,719 --> 00:37:20,120
Speaker 1: not the content of the briefing. And uh and I

742
00:37:20,200 --> 00:37:22,080
Speaker 1: just saw that happening, and it was but you know,

743
00:37:22,320 --> 00:37:26,319
Speaker 1: some people stop me and said, so what, Okay, the

744
00:37:26,400 --> 00:37:29,480
Speaker 1: army is still effective. Maybe this is just a byproduct

745
00:37:30,120 --> 00:37:34,840
Speaker 1: of of looking under the hood too deeply, and uh so,

746
00:37:34,840 --> 00:37:37,719
Speaker 1: so some people pushed back and said, you know this

747
00:37:37,760 --> 00:37:39,959
Speaker 1: went on during Vietnam. We know that the body counts

748
00:37:39,960 --> 00:37:42,080
Speaker 1: and all this stuff. The army is still a good army. Um,

749
00:37:42,080 --> 00:37:45,319
Speaker 1: what's the big deal? And uh so then I had

750
00:37:45,360 --> 00:37:47,480
Speaker 1: to think of, okay, so what so why is it

751
00:37:47,520 --> 00:37:49,680
Speaker 1: a big deal? So why why am I making a

752
00:37:50,440 --> 00:37:52,839
Speaker 1: big deal about it? And uh and so the first

753
00:37:52,880 --> 00:37:55,560
Speaker 1: thing I came up with was because someone told me,

754
00:37:55,640 --> 00:37:57,759
Speaker 1: it's like, well, the problem with the way things are

755
00:37:57,880 --> 00:38:01,440
Speaker 1: right now is that everyone, every end of visual gets

756
00:38:01,480 --> 00:38:04,719
Speaker 1: determined where to draw the line what's right and wrong

757
00:38:05,080 --> 00:38:07,319
Speaker 1: and so and so everyone, you know, should you lie

758
00:38:07,360 --> 00:38:10,560
Speaker 1: about on the storyboard. Some people look at storyboards and say,

759
00:38:10,800 --> 00:38:13,960
Speaker 1: are you kidding that? That's real, actionable intelligence that you're

760
00:38:13,960 --> 00:38:17,040
Speaker 1: passing up. You better not lie on that. Other people say,

761
00:38:17,120 --> 00:38:19,040
Speaker 1: this is a pain in the neck. I have a

762
00:38:19,080 --> 00:38:21,480
Speaker 1: real mission to do and storyboards aren't part of it.

763
00:38:21,840 --> 00:38:23,799
Speaker 1: I should lie on them. And so the first thing

764
00:38:23,840 --> 00:38:26,080
Speaker 1: is everyone gets to determine what's right and wrong. The

765
00:38:26,080 --> 00:38:28,279
Speaker 1: second thing is once we start lying on stuff, you

766
00:38:28,320 --> 00:38:32,480
Speaker 1: can't trust anything. And so we don't know if when

767
00:38:32,520 --> 00:38:35,120
Speaker 1: the Chief briefs Congress on how many starks we have,

768
00:38:35,560 --> 00:38:38,759
Speaker 1: you know, sexual assault spots coordinators, because he doesn't know

769
00:38:38,840 --> 00:38:40,879
Speaker 1: the numbers right, and actually his staff winds up telling

770
00:38:40,920 --> 00:38:44,080
Speaker 1: them they chief those numbers you got they really weren't right.

771
00:38:44,800 --> 00:38:46,960
Speaker 1: So the first thing is every individual gets the termin

772
00:38:47,000 --> 00:38:49,040
Speaker 1: what's right or wrong. Second thing is he can't trust anything.

773
00:38:49,880 --> 00:38:52,960
Speaker 1: Another thing is, as soon as you come into the army, UM,

774
00:38:53,160 --> 00:38:55,840
Speaker 1: what we start teaching is this is the way you

775
00:38:55,920 --> 00:38:58,120
Speaker 1: become a hypocrite. This is if you want to succeed

776
00:38:58,160 --> 00:38:59,879
Speaker 1: in the army, this is the way you gotta act

777
00:39:00,400 --> 00:39:03,320
Speaker 1: and so for me an example of that was a

778
00:39:03,520 --> 00:39:06,480
Speaker 1: brand new second lieutenant engineer officer. You know, I'm down

779
00:39:06,520 --> 00:39:08,759
Speaker 1: at for Belboard, Virginia in the old days, and it

780
00:39:08,880 --> 00:39:12,839
Speaker 1: was our first Army physical and we're sitting in a

781
00:39:12,880 --> 00:39:15,880
Speaker 1: giant classroom, a hundred of us, and there's Army doctors

782
00:39:15,920 --> 00:39:17,120
Speaker 1: up in the front, and they're we're filling out the

783
00:39:17,120 --> 00:39:20,399
Speaker 1: paperwork and you know, first name, uh, going to block one,

784
00:39:20,560 --> 00:39:23,200
Speaker 1: last name going block to block three. So scarity no where,

785
00:39:23,200 --> 00:39:25,440
Speaker 1: get down to the block fourteen or so, and it

786
00:39:25,480 --> 00:39:28,920
Speaker 1: says state your current physical condition. And then the doc

787
00:39:29,040 --> 00:39:31,160
Speaker 1: up front says, all right, in block fourteen, right, I

788
00:39:31,160 --> 00:39:34,359
Speaker 1: am an excellent physical health and all of us the right.

789
00:39:36,160 --> 00:39:38,920
Speaker 1: The Army psychologists are well aware of that phenomena too.

790
00:39:39,120 --> 00:39:41,759
Speaker 1: I had a conversation with one once I still a

791
00:39:41,760 --> 00:39:44,799
Speaker 1: loan civilian here. I feel like this is very similar to, though,

792
00:39:44,960 --> 00:39:47,120
Speaker 1: to what happens in corporate America. You know, there's just

793
00:39:47,160 --> 00:39:50,279
Speaker 1: always like busy work that people fell out and they

794
00:39:50,280 --> 00:39:52,319
Speaker 1: don't give a shit about the accuracy of it. It's

795
00:39:52,360 --> 00:39:54,239
Speaker 1: it's I think it's just like a culture of just

796
00:39:54,760 --> 00:39:58,640
Speaker 1: America or the world in general, of bureaucracy. Yeah, I

797
00:39:58,680 --> 00:40:02,480
Speaker 1: agree exactly, break receive. And so the question is are

798
00:40:02,520 --> 00:40:07,520
Speaker 1: we just a bureaucracy, Because often we're just a bureaucracy,

799
00:40:07,840 --> 00:40:10,440
Speaker 1: then go ahead and lie to it. But we're supposed

800
00:40:10,440 --> 00:40:14,200
Speaker 1: to be a profession. And a profession you know, you

801
00:40:14,200 --> 00:40:18,120
Speaker 1: you you you do something well, you're trusted by society, um,

802
00:40:18,239 --> 00:40:21,200
Speaker 1: you develop your own But a profession also does something

803
00:40:21,200 --> 00:40:25,280
Speaker 1: else is when a profession see something wrong, it polices itself.

804
00:40:26,239 --> 00:40:28,759
Speaker 1: And so if we're really a profession, if we want

805
00:40:28,760 --> 00:40:32,560
Speaker 1: to say that we have standards, then we should do

806
00:40:32,640 --> 00:40:35,600
Speaker 1: something about it, or if we don't do anything about it,

807
00:40:36,239 --> 00:40:38,520
Speaker 1: someone else will step in and fix it for us. Well.

808
00:40:38,520 --> 00:40:42,400
Speaker 1: And unlike other organizations, the consequences in the military literally

809
00:40:42,520 --> 00:40:46,120
Speaker 1: life and death exactly right. And and and we pride

810
00:40:46,160 --> 00:40:49,000
Speaker 1: ourselves we live off of we operate off of an

811
00:40:49,040 --> 00:40:52,480
Speaker 1: assumption of truth. And so I was wondering if you

812
00:40:52,480 --> 00:40:54,279
Speaker 1: could talk a little bit more about that, about the

813
00:40:54,400 --> 00:40:59,319
Speaker 1: spiritual shoosum that is created in the soldier because of

814
00:40:59,360 --> 00:41:01,479
Speaker 1: what you're talking abo that we're asking them to lie.

815
00:41:01,719 --> 00:41:03,879
Speaker 1: And you know, our guys, uh, you know, I think

816
00:41:03,920 --> 00:41:06,840
Speaker 1: most of our soldiers are brought up in this culture

817
00:41:06,920 --> 00:41:12,160
Speaker 1: that emphasizes honor, and integrity, especially organizations like West Point,

818
00:41:12,239 --> 00:41:15,400
Speaker 1: they really pound that into these young men. And then

819
00:41:15,440 --> 00:41:18,040
Speaker 1: they get into the force and now they're being asked

820
00:41:18,080 --> 00:41:20,680
Speaker 1: to deviate, there being asked to lie. And what does

821
00:41:20,719 --> 00:41:22,879
Speaker 1: that do to a to an individual? And I'm sort

822
00:41:22,920 --> 00:41:26,560
Speaker 1: of a spiritual level, Well, we we teach them how

823
00:41:26,560 --> 00:41:29,880
Speaker 1: to be good hypocrites. So we teach them how to

824
00:41:31,360 --> 00:41:36,560
Speaker 1: how to talk the integrity and honor language, and to

825
00:41:36,680 --> 00:41:40,320
Speaker 1: actually look down on society for being less than honorable

826
00:41:40,400 --> 00:41:43,520
Speaker 1: because they're not part of this honorable profession that we're in.

827
00:41:44,480 --> 00:41:48,400
Speaker 1: And yet we have our feet dragging through this not

828
00:41:48,640 --> 00:41:53,280
Speaker 1: so nice meyer and muck of lying that we've become.

829
00:41:53,920 --> 00:41:55,840
Speaker 1: And yet we learn to live with it and pretend

830
00:41:57,360 --> 00:42:02,160
Speaker 1: that it doesn't happen, and so we become very accustomed

831
00:42:02,400 --> 00:42:07,799
Speaker 1: to being hypocrites. That's not that's not a a good

832
00:42:08,000 --> 00:42:09,960
Speaker 1: way to run a profession. Now, I'll tell you what

833
00:42:10,000 --> 00:42:12,960
Speaker 1: I had it. We compared it to civilian organizations. But

834
00:42:13,040 --> 00:42:14,799
Speaker 1: I had an awakening at the beginning of this when

835
00:42:14,840 --> 00:42:16,920
Speaker 1: I was thinking about should I start up a study.

836
00:42:17,719 --> 00:42:19,520
Speaker 1: I was talking with a civilian friend and he says,

837
00:42:19,600 --> 00:42:21,960
Speaker 1: you know, my wife just got moved up in management

838
00:42:22,360 --> 00:42:25,440
Speaker 1: and she worked for fed X, and I said, what happened?

839
00:42:25,520 --> 00:42:26,880
Speaker 1: Why is she moving up? And he says, well, her

840
00:42:26,920 --> 00:42:29,760
Speaker 1: boss got fired. And I said, why did her boss

841
00:42:29,760 --> 00:42:31,160
Speaker 1: get fired? And he said, well, they found out the

842
00:42:31,239 --> 00:42:38,080
Speaker 1: boss was well falsifying rosters for mandatory training. Jack's laughing, okay,

843
00:42:38,160 --> 00:42:40,239
Speaker 1: because I heard that, and all I could think was

844
00:42:40,920 --> 00:42:44,960
Speaker 1: so And he was telling me, can you believe she

845
00:42:45,040 --> 00:42:47,960
Speaker 1: was falsifying rosters for mandatory training? You don't do that.

846
00:42:48,640 --> 00:42:51,960
Speaker 1: And it just showed me how numb I had gotten

847
00:42:52,960 --> 00:42:56,279
Speaker 1: to to something that you could get fired for it

848
00:42:56,400 --> 00:43:02,160
Speaker 1: fed X. So that's incredible. That's so, that's what's going on.

849
00:43:02,360 --> 00:43:04,000
Speaker 1: You know. On one hand, we look at it and

850
00:43:04,000 --> 00:43:07,360
Speaker 1: and this gets to the reaction when the study came out. Um.

851
00:43:07,400 --> 00:43:08,640
Speaker 1: On one hand, you look at it and you go,

852
00:43:08,719 --> 00:43:10,799
Speaker 1: that's that's terrible. In the other hand, it's like, well

853
00:43:10,840 --> 00:43:15,040
Speaker 1: that makes total sense. Well there's this other interesting aspect

854
00:43:15,080 --> 00:43:17,319
Speaker 1: of it. And I guess that I wanted to get

855
00:43:17,360 --> 00:43:19,240
Speaker 1: into a little bit is a lot of people actually

856
00:43:19,280 --> 00:43:22,640
Speaker 1: criticize the military, and even within the military, as we say,

857
00:43:22,680 --> 00:43:27,160
Speaker 1: we've gotten to politically correct, and I think that's misidentifying

858
00:43:27,200 --> 00:43:29,040
Speaker 1: the problem. I think the real problem is that we're

859
00:43:29,080 --> 00:43:33,560
Speaker 1: getting to corporate. And I think what you're well, from

860
00:43:33,560 --> 00:43:36,040
Speaker 1: my standpoint, the way I see it is that we

861
00:43:36,120 --> 00:43:42,520
Speaker 1: swing between a profession and a bureaucracy. And I think

862
00:43:42,520 --> 00:43:45,200
Speaker 1: when you say corporate, it means the bureaucracy. So and

863
00:43:45,200 --> 00:43:48,280
Speaker 1: we can't help it because we love we love rules

864
00:43:48,320 --> 00:43:51,640
Speaker 1: and structure and and and thinking from the top down

865
00:43:52,280 --> 00:43:54,560
Speaker 1: and telling well, you know, you know, we've got to

866
00:43:54,560 --> 00:43:56,640
Speaker 1: be careful about these young kids driving on leaves. So

867
00:43:56,719 --> 00:44:00,359
Speaker 1: let's create a whole system. That's the bureaucracy. And yet

868
00:44:00,360 --> 00:44:02,839
Speaker 1: the profession is on the other end, and that's pushing back.

869
00:44:02,880 --> 00:44:06,040
Speaker 1: And that's what I say. We've we've shifted from the profession.

870
00:44:06,880 --> 00:44:09,360
Speaker 1: You know, in the old days, if a PFC didn't

871
00:44:09,360 --> 00:44:11,000
Speaker 1: come back off of leave because they crashed the car

872
00:44:11,040 --> 00:44:13,680
Speaker 1: because they tried driving too far on leave and they

873
00:44:13,680 --> 00:44:15,680
Speaker 1: didn't get enough sleep, we woul didn't run to the

874
00:44:15,680 --> 00:44:19,040
Speaker 1: filing cabinet to find out if they had everything fixed.

875
00:44:19,080 --> 00:44:21,759
Speaker 1: We would run to where we'd run to their leader

876
00:44:22,960 --> 00:44:25,120
Speaker 1: and we'd say, I can't believe you let Smith go

877
00:44:25,160 --> 00:44:27,200
Speaker 1: on leave. You know his car doesn't work. You know

878
00:44:27,280 --> 00:44:29,400
Speaker 1: he's had guard duty last night. You know he's on

879
00:44:29,440 --> 00:44:31,760
Speaker 1: prescripture medicine, and you would expect him, you would expect

880
00:44:31,800 --> 00:44:34,719
Speaker 1: him to know his soldier exactly right. And we hold

881
00:44:34,719 --> 00:44:39,279
Speaker 1: the leader responsible, not a piece of paper that says, well,

882
00:44:39,280 --> 00:44:41,879
Speaker 1: he told the computer that everything was good. And so

883
00:44:41,960 --> 00:44:44,400
Speaker 1: what we've done as a profession is we've shifted towards

884
00:44:44,400 --> 00:44:47,560
Speaker 1: the bureaucracy and we've learned to trust a system, a

885
00:44:47,680 --> 00:44:50,919
Speaker 1: checklist instead of trusting leaders, and start of trusting people

886
00:44:50,920 --> 00:44:54,520
Speaker 1: because people are imperfect. And when when I was in

887
00:44:54,520 --> 00:44:56,680
Speaker 1: the military, I mean, I can just tell you from

888
00:44:56,719 --> 00:45:00,520
Speaker 1: my own personal experience that there comes this where I

889
00:45:00,520 --> 00:45:04,080
Speaker 1: saw the mandatory training is just a burden that was

890
00:45:04,120 --> 00:45:06,640
Speaker 1: handed down to the some faceless guy in the Pentagon

891
00:45:06,800 --> 00:45:10,879
Speaker 1: I didn't care at all about and you're, I think

892
00:45:10,920 --> 00:45:13,120
Speaker 1: for the soldier on the ground. It results in these

893
00:45:13,160 --> 00:45:16,640
Speaker 1: like divided loyalties, and you know, you choose are you

894
00:45:16,680 --> 00:45:19,359
Speaker 1: more loyal to your mission and your men or are

895
00:45:19,400 --> 00:45:23,160
Speaker 1: you loyal to this online training module? And the question,

896
00:45:23,360 --> 00:45:26,040
Speaker 1: I mean, the answer is obvious to the vast majority

897
00:45:26,680 --> 00:45:30,120
Speaker 1: of young men out there. Yeah. Sometimes I think that

898
00:45:30,200 --> 00:45:34,040
Speaker 1: we we live because we almost feel like we're correcting

899
00:45:34,080 --> 00:45:36,680
Speaker 1: the scales of justice in the world. Yeah, Yeah, is

900
00:45:36,719 --> 00:45:39,720
Speaker 1: that it's totally this is ridiculous, and it's my almost

901
00:45:39,719 --> 00:45:41,640
Speaker 1: my duty to lie back to you because you're creating

902
00:45:41,640 --> 00:45:45,799
Speaker 1: such a ridiculous situation for us down here. But but

903
00:45:46,320 --> 00:45:49,200
Speaker 1: deep down inside we both know though that, um, it

904
00:45:49,200 --> 00:45:51,680
Speaker 1: shouldn't do that. It was created by a well intended person.

905
00:45:52,640 --> 00:45:54,239
Speaker 1: You know, it wasn't created by a person who said,

906
00:45:54,239 --> 00:45:57,200
Speaker 1: I waste someone's time, because I've roamed the halls of

907
00:45:57,200 --> 00:46:00,560
Speaker 1: the Pentagon looking for that evil person and there is none. Right, right,

908
00:46:00,560 --> 00:46:03,160
Speaker 1: they really do think that, you know, they're creating these

909
00:46:03,200 --> 00:46:06,160
Speaker 1: training modules and it's too you know, I love the

910
00:46:06,160 --> 00:46:07,839
Speaker 1: soldiers as much as we do. You have to crack

911
00:46:07,880 --> 00:46:11,560
Speaker 1: down on on women trafficking or to you know, their

912
00:46:11,600 --> 00:46:14,440
Speaker 1: way of doing it is through the bureaucracy, right, and

913
00:46:14,560 --> 00:46:16,400
Speaker 1: I prefer if they would, we would turn to the

914
00:46:16,440 --> 00:46:21,719
Speaker 1: profession and say, leaders, go do your job. Well, I mean,

915
00:46:21,840 --> 00:46:23,960
Speaker 1: it's uh, it goes back to you know, the old

916
00:46:24,000 --> 00:46:26,040
Speaker 1: school where the first sergeant would kind of slide a

917
00:46:26,040 --> 00:46:28,319
Speaker 1: glass of scotch across the and be like, yeah, tell

918
00:46:28,360 --> 00:46:31,239
Speaker 1: me what's got you so blue? Kid? You know, that's

919
00:46:31,239 --> 00:46:34,560
Speaker 1: a different type of leadership. It is. It's it's harder,

920
00:46:34,600 --> 00:46:39,160
Speaker 1: and it doesn't brief well, right right. I guess another

921
00:46:39,280 --> 00:46:42,400
Speaker 1: interesting thing I thought when I when I read your

922
00:46:42,440 --> 00:46:44,799
Speaker 1: study and when I watched your lectures on YouTube, which

923
00:46:44,800 --> 00:46:46,680
Speaker 1: I would actually really encourage people to go and take

924
00:46:46,680 --> 00:46:50,480
Speaker 1: a look at after this, UM, is what do you

925
00:46:50,560 --> 00:46:54,120
Speaker 1: think about the this Uh, there's this notion. I feel

926
00:46:54,160 --> 00:46:57,120
Speaker 1: like that all of these corporations are bringing in these

927
00:46:57,160 --> 00:47:01,200
Speaker 1: retired generals and retired military officers to teach them how

928
00:47:01,200 --> 00:47:05,120
Speaker 1: to lead and like set up their tactical operations center

929
00:47:05,200 --> 00:47:08,239
Speaker 1: for them and bring all these military lessons learned into

930
00:47:08,320 --> 00:47:12,120
Speaker 1: the into the corporate world. Meanwhile, it feels like the

931
00:47:12,160 --> 00:47:15,279
Speaker 1: military itself is trying to drag all these lessons from

932
00:47:15,280 --> 00:47:18,560
Speaker 1: the corporate world to replace our military culture. I'm just

933
00:47:18,560 --> 00:47:20,799
Speaker 1: wondering if you could comment on that from your perspective

934
00:47:20,800 --> 00:47:22,839
Speaker 1: and whether you think I'm right or wrong, and how

935
00:47:22,920 --> 00:47:27,399
Speaker 1: you feel about that. UM. I think that UM our

936
00:47:27,440 --> 00:47:33,440
Speaker 1: society and us that we when we get into a

937
00:47:33,480 --> 00:47:35,799
Speaker 1: position where it's hard to make a decision, it's hard

938
00:47:35,840 --> 00:47:39,880
Speaker 1: to uh. UM. When I say us, I mean the military. UM,

939
00:47:39,920 --> 00:47:43,120
Speaker 1: it's hard to We don't trust our own judgment and

940
00:47:43,160 --> 00:47:46,919
Speaker 1: we want someone who we think is an authority and uh,

941
00:47:47,040 --> 00:47:49,440
Speaker 1: and for the society, they look at us, they look

942
00:47:49,440 --> 00:47:51,280
Speaker 1: at the military, and they say, oh, you're a successful

943
00:47:51,280 --> 00:47:54,759
Speaker 1: military person. You you must be so wise, um, and

944
00:47:54,840 --> 00:47:58,440
Speaker 1: so they trust. But for the military, it's ironic that

945
00:47:58,520 --> 00:48:01,000
Speaker 1: we turn around and say, well, we know who we are,

946
00:48:01,000 --> 00:48:03,560
Speaker 1: we're just average Joe's. Um. Shoot, we get Dr So

947
00:48:03,680 --> 00:48:06,239
Speaker 1: and so he's an expert, and so we bring it

948
00:48:06,360 --> 00:48:09,080
Speaker 1: or or CEO so and so they're experts. And so

949
00:48:09,080 --> 00:48:11,680
Speaker 1: it's funny to watch how we will go out and

950
00:48:11,719 --> 00:48:16,160
Speaker 1: bring in consultants who are just some average joe off

951
00:48:16,440 --> 00:48:20,279
Speaker 1: university to someplace and suddenly they're experts. Um. But then

952
00:48:20,719 --> 00:48:23,080
Speaker 1: the same thing happens in reverse is that you'll see

953
00:48:23,120 --> 00:48:25,799
Speaker 1: military form. Military person goes in place and treated like

954
00:48:25,840 --> 00:48:29,480
Speaker 1: a h an extreme expert just because they serve just

955
00:48:29,640 --> 00:48:32,120
Speaker 1: like the rest of us. And uh So, I think

956
00:48:32,120 --> 00:48:34,759
Speaker 1: it's not necessarily a problem with the military, it's just

957
00:48:35,400 --> 00:48:38,839
Speaker 1: humans in our society at least, is that we just

958
00:48:39,080 --> 00:48:42,160
Speaker 1: love someone who gives an aura of authority because there's

959
00:48:42,160 --> 00:48:46,440
Speaker 1: an insecurity that we have about us. Interesting, what do

960
00:48:46,480 --> 00:48:48,719
Speaker 1: you think, so as as a military, what does the

961
00:48:48,760 --> 00:48:50,680
Speaker 1: military have to do or what can they do better

962
00:48:50,719 --> 00:48:53,560
Speaker 1: to continue to earn that trust that the public has

963
00:48:53,600 --> 00:48:59,880
Speaker 1: in them the military UM as an institution, how do

964
00:49:00,040 --> 00:49:02,200
Speaker 1: we keep you know, we're we're the most trusted institution

965
00:49:02,239 --> 00:49:08,239
Speaker 1: in the US A. But but that's we can't take

966
00:49:08,239 --> 00:49:10,640
Speaker 1: that for granted. And so what what I think there

967
00:49:10,640 --> 00:49:13,520
Speaker 1: are there's a there's factors that will bring this down.

968
00:49:13,719 --> 00:49:15,440
Speaker 1: And uh, I think we're starting to see some of

969
00:49:15,480 --> 00:49:18,759
Speaker 1: those factors uh take place. And so the first factor is,

970
00:49:19,880 --> 00:49:22,239
Speaker 1: you know, the question is what makes us so high

971
00:49:22,360 --> 00:49:24,880
Speaker 1: up in the first place? Why do people trust us?

972
00:49:24,880 --> 00:49:27,240
Speaker 1: And I think there's two reasons. Is one is we're competent.

973
00:49:27,960 --> 00:49:31,000
Speaker 1: We do the nation's biddings, you know, and and we

974
00:49:31,120 --> 00:49:35,880
Speaker 1: execute wars and uh. Now we have failures, we have scandals, UM,

975
00:49:35,920 --> 00:49:38,080
Speaker 1: but we correct ourselves and actually a lot of the

976
00:49:38,120 --> 00:49:40,359
Speaker 1: failures are blamed on the politicians because it wasn't our

977
00:49:40,400 --> 00:49:43,600
Speaker 1: decision anyway. So we're viewed as competent. But the other

978
00:49:43,640 --> 00:49:46,399
Speaker 1: thing is that we don't compete in society. They don't

979
00:49:46,400 --> 00:49:48,960
Speaker 1: see us as being political, they don't see us as

980
00:49:49,040 --> 00:49:53,440
Speaker 1: as selfish, as doing it out of our own self

981
00:49:53,520 --> 00:49:56,759
Speaker 1: gain and and so they look at other people like

982
00:49:56,960 --> 00:50:00,760
Speaker 1: Congress and the presidency and big business and they drop

983
00:50:00,840 --> 00:50:04,080
Speaker 1: those institutions down because they say, no, you're you're trying

984
00:50:04,080 --> 00:50:06,359
Speaker 1: to get your slice of the pie. So given that,

985
00:50:07,080 --> 00:50:09,719
Speaker 1: how do we maintain the confidence our society has in us? Well,

986
00:50:09,719 --> 00:50:12,000
Speaker 1: the first thing is they better not view us as

987
00:50:12,040 --> 00:50:15,600
Speaker 1: competing with them. In other words, we're doing it selflessly.

988
00:50:16,560 --> 00:50:19,560
Speaker 1: When we asked for a giant military budget and we

989
00:50:19,600 --> 00:50:25,560
Speaker 1: start talking about cutting what people view as entitlements, that

990
00:50:25,640 --> 00:50:28,080
Speaker 1: will influence how much confidence they have in US as

991
00:50:28,120 --> 00:50:30,879
Speaker 1: an institution because we've been riding high that they could

992
00:50:30,920 --> 00:50:33,560
Speaker 1: force as much money as they want into us because

993
00:50:33,560 --> 00:50:36,120
Speaker 1: it didn't cost them anything. But if we have to

994
00:50:36,120 --> 00:50:38,239
Speaker 1: start saying you can give us money, but it's going

995
00:50:38,280 --> 00:50:40,799
Speaker 1: to cost you, that might affect it. The other thing

996
00:50:40,880 --> 00:50:42,960
Speaker 1: is it's like I said, they trust us as an

997
00:50:42,960 --> 00:50:47,000
Speaker 1: institution because we're not political. Every time we see a

998
00:50:47,080 --> 00:50:51,480
Speaker 1: bevy of generals in black suits standing on a political stage,

999
00:50:52,320 --> 00:50:56,400
Speaker 1: that erodes that standing that we have that we're not political.

1000
00:50:56,719 --> 00:50:59,200
Speaker 1: And you see it from all sides of the spectrum,

1001
00:50:59,360 --> 00:51:03,080
Speaker 1: is general being political and uh, and that erose them

1002
00:51:03,080 --> 00:51:07,080
Speaker 1: because society thinks we're above that. Uh. And the next

1003
00:51:07,080 --> 00:51:09,640
Speaker 1: thing is that they don't society want to erode the

1004
00:51:09,640 --> 00:51:14,359
Speaker 1: trust that they have in US is that they don't

1005
00:51:14,440 --> 00:51:17,440
Speaker 1: like it when it looks like we're not taking care

1006
00:51:17,480 --> 00:51:20,719
Speaker 1: of our own. So what I'm focusing on specifically is veterans.

1007
00:51:21,480 --> 00:51:24,920
Speaker 1: Even though it's not the military's job to take care

1008
00:51:24,920 --> 00:51:28,800
Speaker 1: of veterans, it's the veterans administration. If we treat veterans poorly,

1009
00:51:29,960 --> 00:51:33,759
Speaker 1: they get upset with the military. And so so when

1010
00:51:33,760 --> 00:51:36,480
Speaker 1: they see how veterans are coming back from wars not

1011
00:51:36,600 --> 00:51:40,600
Speaker 1: being helped and or you know, unemployment or whatever, it

1012
00:51:40,920 --> 00:51:42,759
Speaker 1: looks bad for the military. And then the final thing

1013
00:51:42,840 --> 00:51:46,319
Speaker 1: I think that influences how our society trusts US is

1014
00:51:46,400 --> 00:51:49,719
Speaker 1: when because we saw this in other countries, when the

1015
00:51:49,760 --> 00:51:56,239
Speaker 1: military is used against society itself exactly right. And so

1016
00:51:56,440 --> 00:51:59,120
Speaker 1: when you start military, when you start pulling the National

1017
00:51:59,120 --> 00:52:03,800
Speaker 1: Guard out to to fight rioters, our society just doesn't

1018
00:52:03,800 --> 00:52:08,799
Speaker 1: like that. It's a police thing. Um. But so so

1019
00:52:09,080 --> 00:52:10,919
Speaker 1: that's I see four ways if you want to drop

1020
00:52:11,040 --> 00:52:16,280
Speaker 1: confidence trust in the military institution. Those are the four things. Wow,

1021
00:52:16,800 --> 00:52:20,560
Speaker 1: this has been incredible, um and very helpful for me.

1022
00:52:20,600 --> 00:52:23,440
Speaker 1: I hope a lot of other people also listening. What

1023
00:52:23,719 --> 00:52:26,560
Speaker 1: uh is this the study? It sounds like maybe there's

1024
00:52:26,560 --> 00:52:28,759
Speaker 1: another study You're working on right now from the way

1025
00:52:28,760 --> 00:52:33,640
Speaker 1: you're talking. No, Um, I have other studies, but I'm

1026
00:52:33,680 --> 00:52:36,480
Speaker 1: afraid if I reveal them, I'll either change my mind

1027
00:52:36,520 --> 00:52:40,279
Speaker 1: because you'll convince me otherwise, or I'm or I'm flat

1028
00:52:40,280 --> 00:52:44,160
Speaker 1: out wrong and I'll come to that realization on air.

1029
00:52:44,560 --> 00:52:46,560
Speaker 1: Oh you know, it just sounded like maybe you're working

1030
00:52:46,560 --> 00:52:49,920
Speaker 1: on something about about life after service or something of

1031
00:52:49,920 --> 00:52:53,640
Speaker 1: that nature. Um. Actually I was, I am, I mean,

1032
00:52:53,680 --> 00:52:55,600
Speaker 1: I am. I'm looking at Okay, I'll give you a

1033
00:52:55,640 --> 00:52:59,839
Speaker 1: little hint. Um, I'm looking at does the the eight

1034
00:53:00,040 --> 00:53:08,000
Speaker 1: ability system interesting? What does that do to us? Yeah?

1035
00:53:08,040 --> 00:53:12,120
Speaker 1: These are all like super interesting important questions. Um. Yeah,

1036
00:53:12,280 --> 00:53:14,160
Speaker 1: So okay, Well, maybe better stop there because I don't

1037
00:53:14,160 --> 00:53:17,319
Speaker 1: want to. Yeah, I tap the subject too much. I

1038
00:53:17,400 --> 00:53:18,719
Speaker 1: think you know what I'm getting at. I know, I

1039
00:53:18,800 --> 00:53:22,000
Speaker 1: understand absolutely, and I um, I think I guess there's

1040
00:53:22,120 --> 00:53:24,279
Speaker 1: one other thing I would point out. Here is a

1041
00:53:24,320 --> 00:53:26,799
Speaker 1: lot of this stuff we've been talking about again, A

1042
00:53:26,840 --> 00:53:29,480
Speaker 1: lot of the information, Um, the lot of the data

1043
00:53:29,520 --> 00:53:31,600
Speaker 1: you looked at, not all of it, but at least

1044
00:53:31,600 --> 00:53:34,080
Speaker 1: some of it was UM pre nine eleven. And I

1045
00:53:34,280 --> 00:53:37,720
Speaker 1: just asked people to also consider the amount of wear

1046
00:53:37,719 --> 00:53:40,120
Speaker 1: and tear that has been put on the military the

1047
00:53:40,160 --> 00:53:42,879
Speaker 1: last sixteen years. Um, you know, you have all these

1048
00:53:42,920 --> 00:53:45,560
Speaker 1: mandatory training requirements, but on that's on top of now

1049
00:53:45,640 --> 00:53:50,560
Speaker 1: combat deployments. Exactly. Yeah. Now what we should do though,

1050
00:53:50,600 --> 00:53:52,160
Speaker 1: is we should say, so, what has happened since the

1051
00:53:52,160 --> 00:53:56,440
Speaker 1: study came out? And so because it's you know, and

1052
00:53:56,480 --> 00:53:59,239
Speaker 1: so at first, you know, I got massive resistance, but

1053
00:53:59,320 --> 00:54:02,760
Speaker 1: then uh, believe it or not that you could actually

1054
00:54:02,760 --> 00:54:07,000
Speaker 1: see a bureaucracy is changing. And uh so, and it

1055
00:54:07,080 --> 00:54:08,680
Speaker 1: was not just the army, you know, the air Force

1056
00:54:08,760 --> 00:54:12,680
Speaker 1: they got rid of their computer based training. Uh. Secretary

1057
00:54:12,719 --> 00:54:14,759
Speaker 1: Defense says, We're going to have a review of all

1058
00:54:14,800 --> 00:54:17,680
Speaker 1: mandatory training the army. You know, General Milly says, if

1059
00:54:17,680 --> 00:54:19,799
Speaker 1: it doesn't have any to do with readiness, you have

1060
00:54:19,920 --> 00:54:22,480
Speaker 1: my permission to ignore it. And so you see, like

1061
00:54:22,480 --> 00:54:24,880
Speaker 1: the eighty second Airborne in the first first I D

1062
00:54:25,840 --> 00:54:30,560
Speaker 1: they got rid of all their computer based training. They said, look,

1063
00:54:30,560 --> 00:54:33,880
Speaker 1: if it's not connected the readiness, we're not going to

1064
00:54:33,960 --> 00:54:35,520
Speaker 1: do it. You still have to do training, but just

1065
00:54:35,560 --> 00:54:37,000
Speaker 1: don't do it on the computer. Do it in the

1066
00:54:37,160 --> 00:54:39,879
Speaker 1: in the classroom with a leader standing in front of you.

1067
00:54:40,200 --> 00:54:42,440
Speaker 1: And uh and that's okay. And so what you're starting

1068
00:54:42,440 --> 00:54:46,800
Speaker 1: to see is a lot of subordinate commanders are now saying,

1069
00:54:47,760 --> 00:54:50,239
Speaker 1: you know, before I felt like I had to go

1070
00:54:50,320 --> 00:54:52,720
Speaker 1: through that dog and pony of being green on everything

1071
00:54:52,920 --> 00:54:56,080
Speaker 1: and doing a good, nice briefing. Now I'm allowed to

1072
00:54:56,160 --> 00:54:59,880
Speaker 1: say what's really going on. That's an incredible, you know,

1073
00:55:00,040 --> 00:55:03,399
Speaker 1: cultural change in the military. We're not there yet, We're

1074
00:55:03,400 --> 00:55:05,680
Speaker 1: getting there, you know, we're not there yet, but it's

1075
00:55:05,760 --> 00:55:09,759
Speaker 1: it's very encouraging to see some change. And it's it's

1076
00:55:09,840 --> 00:55:13,000
Speaker 1: a very logical change because it's not like it's foreign

1077
00:55:13,080 --> 00:55:16,359
Speaker 1: to anybody. We all know what what we're talking about. Well,

1078
00:55:16,360 --> 00:55:18,640
Speaker 1: and something had to give to and I'm glad those

1079
00:55:18,719 --> 00:55:21,160
Speaker 1: changes have at least started to begin, rather than wait

1080
00:55:21,239 --> 00:55:24,799
Speaker 1: until the system actually breaks and starts falling apart. That's

1081
00:55:24,800 --> 00:55:27,080
Speaker 1: a good point, especially, like you said, when we're so

1082
00:55:27,160 --> 00:55:28,799
Speaker 1: consumed with war, the last thing we need to do

1083
00:55:28,880 --> 00:55:32,480
Speaker 1: is juggle this facade we had going. Um, when it's

1084
00:55:32,520 --> 00:55:34,920
Speaker 1: so much easier just to be honest. Well, thank you

1085
00:55:35,000 --> 00:55:37,080
Speaker 1: so much. Um. You know, I think this is gonna

1086
00:55:37,120 --> 00:55:40,960
Speaker 1: be actually really helpful for people who listen to it. Okay,

1087
00:55:40,680 --> 00:55:43,560
Speaker 1: ye here anytime, we really appreciate it. So once again,

1088
00:55:44,000 --> 00:55:47,680
Speaker 1: for the listeners. Dr Wang's research professor for the Strategic

1089
00:55:47,719 --> 00:55:51,279
Speaker 1: Studies Institute at the U. S. Army War College, also

1090
00:55:51,320 --> 00:55:54,239
Speaker 1: retired Army officer, taught at West Point and served as

1091
00:55:54,239 --> 00:55:57,000
Speaker 1: an analyst for the Chief Staff of the Army. And

1092
00:55:57,280 --> 00:55:58,960
Speaker 1: I guess last thing, is there anything else you want

1093
00:55:58,960 --> 00:56:01,800
Speaker 1: to get out there on on Software dot Com slash

1094
00:56:01,920 --> 00:56:04,600
Speaker 1: radio on the article, I'll link to the actual study

1095
00:56:04,719 --> 00:56:06,640
Speaker 1: so you guys can check it out. Which, by the way,

1096
00:56:06,680 --> 00:56:09,160
Speaker 1: for the listeners, all the back episodes are there as well.

1097
00:56:09,200 --> 00:56:12,040
Speaker 1: But any any um, anything that you want to plug.

1098
00:56:12,080 --> 00:56:15,160
Speaker 1: I don't think you're on social media or any of that. No,

1099
00:56:15,480 --> 00:56:18,240
Speaker 1: just you guys, keep up the good work. Thanks, thank you,

1100
00:56:18,480 --> 00:56:22,759
Speaker 1: appreciate all right, well much appreciated for Dr Wong coming on.

1101
00:56:23,520 --> 00:56:25,800
Speaker 1: Let us know what you thought of it. And also

1102
00:56:26,200 --> 00:56:29,240
Speaker 1: we're close to I think I think it's a thousand

1103
00:56:29,280 --> 00:56:32,759
Speaker 1: reviews on on Apple podcast, which is great. We'd love

1104
00:56:32,800 --> 00:56:34,800
Speaker 1: to get up to a thousand, and also would like

1105
00:56:34,880 --> 00:56:36,440
Speaker 1: to get back up to being like number one in

1106
00:56:36,480 --> 00:56:39,800
Speaker 1: the government category and and back up to five stars.

1107
00:56:39,840 --> 00:56:42,640
Speaker 1: We've been stuck at like four and a half stubborn

1108
00:56:42,760 --> 00:56:46,280
Speaker 1: league due to due to like a handful of negative

1109
00:56:46,280 --> 00:56:48,840
Speaker 1: reviews so yeah, we're at nine hundred thirty seven ratings.

1110
00:56:49,040 --> 00:56:51,200
Speaker 1: It would be nice to hit the big one thousand,

1111
00:56:51,280 --> 00:56:54,920
Speaker 1: so please leave a review for us. It's much appreciated. UM.

1112
00:56:54,960 --> 00:56:57,239
Speaker 1: As always, as a reminder for all of those who

1113
00:56:57,239 --> 00:56:59,480
Speaker 1: are listening, for a limited time you can receive a

1114
00:56:59,560 --> 00:57:03,800
Speaker 1: fifty sent discounted membership to soft rep TV, our channel

1115
00:57:03,800 --> 00:57:08,480
Speaker 1: that offers the most exclusive shows, documentaries and interviews covering

1116
00:57:08,480 --> 00:57:11,319
Speaker 1: the most exciting military content. Today, I was checking out

1117
00:57:11,360 --> 00:57:13,920
Speaker 1: on the app. They already have episodes up of Inside

1118
00:57:13,920 --> 00:57:18,520
Speaker 1: the Team Room Snipers On that was Nick the Reaper, Irving,

1119
00:57:19,000 --> 00:57:24,000
Speaker 1: Jason Delgado, Nick Betts, and Isaiah Burkhard, so check that out. UM.

1120
00:57:24,120 --> 00:57:28,800
Speaker 1: Softwarep TVs Premiership Training Cell follows former Special Operations forces

1121
00:57:28,880 --> 00:57:31,800
Speaker 1: as they participate in the most advanced training of the country,

1122
00:57:32,080 --> 00:57:36,880
Speaker 1: everything from shooting schools, defensive driving, jungle and winter warfare,

1123
00:57:37,080 --> 00:57:39,880
Speaker 1: climbing and much more. Again, you can watch this content

1124
00:57:40,200 --> 00:57:44,160
Speaker 1: by subscribing to softwarep TV at softwrep tv dot us

1125
00:57:44,560 --> 00:57:47,240
Speaker 1: and take advantage of a limited time offer of fifty

1126
00:57:47,680 --> 00:57:50,840
Speaker 1: off your membership. That's only four a month. I've been

1127
00:57:50,920 --> 00:57:54,920
Speaker 1: checking out Softwrep TV's instagram at soft rep tv and

1128
00:57:54,960 --> 00:57:57,880
Speaker 1: they're posting some really cool footage of stuff they've been

1129
00:57:57,880 --> 00:58:00,320
Speaker 1: working on. Between Drew Wallace who's been on the show,

1130
00:58:00,640 --> 00:58:02,520
Speaker 1: and Nick Cale who has also been on the show,

1131
00:58:02,840 --> 00:58:06,120
Speaker 1: they're doing an awesome job filming everything. UM. And then

1132
00:58:06,160 --> 00:58:09,000
Speaker 1: of course Create Club, which I mentioned earlier in the program.

1133
00:58:09,040 --> 00:58:12,320
Speaker 1: I mean, you know, with tragedies happening, it is really

1134
00:58:12,360 --> 00:58:14,320
Speaker 1: important to be prepared. So if you haven't gotten a

1135
00:58:14,400 --> 00:58:17,240
Speaker 1: chance to check out the softwarep Crate Club, you're definitely

1136
00:58:17,240 --> 00:58:19,520
Speaker 1: gonna want to do that asap. It's a subscription to

1137
00:58:19,560 --> 00:58:23,480
Speaker 1: get a box of badass tactical and survival gear delivered

1138
00:58:23,480 --> 00:58:26,080
Speaker 1: to your door every month. Here's the kicker. All of

1139
00:58:26,080 --> 00:58:29,760
Speaker 1: the gears handpicked and tested by former special ops guys,

1140
00:58:29,760 --> 00:58:31,560
Speaker 1: so you know you're gonna get quality year that they

1141
00:58:31,560 --> 00:58:34,280
Speaker 1: would deploy with crates we've sent in the past have

1142
00:58:34,360 --> 00:58:38,280
Speaker 1: included stuff like custom knives, multi tools, fire starters, e

1143
00:58:38,360 --> 00:58:40,920
Speaker 1: d C, med kits, stuff like the multi tool that's

1144
00:58:40,920 --> 00:58:43,040
Speaker 1: in my wallet, although no one could see it on

1145
00:58:43,240 --> 00:58:45,520
Speaker 1: camera because we're not on camera, but I still keep

1146
00:58:45,600 --> 00:58:49,160
Speaker 1: this thing in a while looking awesome. I love it. UM.

1147
00:58:49,200 --> 00:58:51,160
Speaker 1: So you don't just get great gear with your subscription,

1148
00:58:51,200 --> 00:58:54,320
Speaker 1: you're also supporting a veteran owned and run company. To

1149
00:58:54,520 --> 00:58:58,440
Speaker 1: subscribe and start getting your gear, visit create club dot us.

1150
00:58:58,560 --> 00:59:01,160
Speaker 1: We also have gift options of l Well, that's great,

1151
00:59:01,240 --> 00:59:05,960
Speaker 1: Club dot us and I think that about wraps it up. Um.

1152
00:59:06,000 --> 00:59:09,160
Speaker 1: Of course, rust and peace, UM to those that lost

1153
00:59:09,160 --> 00:59:13,520
Speaker 1: their lives in Parkland, Florida. Really horrible tragedy to hear about.

1154
00:59:13,680 --> 00:59:16,080
Speaker 1: And UM, I'm sure that you know if there's any updates,

1155
00:59:16,240 --> 00:59:19,040
Speaker 1: they'll be up on softwarep dot com. There's always people

1156
00:59:19,080 --> 00:59:22,160
Speaker 1: like Alex Hong's writing um pieces about this. And I

1157
00:59:22,200 --> 00:59:23,840
Speaker 1: know you're looking at the schedule, which I really need

1158
00:59:23,880 --> 00:59:26,720
Speaker 1: to update because it's I have like the older ship there,

1159
00:59:26,760 --> 00:59:29,200
Speaker 1: I mean, next episode, we have, uh, we have rented

1160
00:59:29,200 --> 00:59:32,360
Speaker 1: Glee and coming in studio former Navy seal and I

1161
00:59:32,360 --> 00:59:34,920
Speaker 1: have his book over here to check out, and uh, yes,

1162
00:59:35,000 --> 00:59:36,840
Speaker 1: some other cool stuff coming up. I think next month

1163
00:59:36,840 --> 00:59:40,880
Speaker 1: will have part two with Mike Vining hopefully that'll be cool.

1164
00:59:41,240 --> 00:59:43,480
Speaker 1: And I want to get Philabanti on the podcast. From

1165
00:59:43,480 --> 00:59:45,600
Speaker 1: all that remains, I'm gonna work on that for this month.

1166
00:59:46,160 --> 00:59:48,880
Speaker 1: Uh cool man, anything else from you before we wrap

1167
00:59:48,960 --> 00:59:52,520
Speaker 1: up this week's uh podcast? That's that's it, you know,

1168
00:59:52,680 --> 00:59:56,280
Speaker 1: I'm I'm working behind the scenes on an important story

1169
00:59:56,400 --> 00:59:59,520
Speaker 1: that like like Dr Wong and I can't really allude

1170
00:59:59,560 --> 01:00:03,920
Speaker 1: to at the momentum about my future work, but it'll

1171
01:00:03,960 --> 01:00:06,720
Speaker 1: get there. I think in the next week or two

1172
01:00:06,800 --> 01:00:09,960
Speaker 1: we see something cool, all right, So I'm looking forward

1173
01:00:10,000 --> 01:00:12,800
Speaker 1: to checking that out, and I know everybody's looking forward

1174
01:00:12,800 --> 01:00:14,880
Speaker 1: even though it's way in the works. Is you know

1175
01:00:14,960 --> 01:00:17,600
Speaker 1: your memoir that will be coming out probably next year, right,

1176
01:00:17,680 --> 01:00:23,240
Speaker 1: I'm working on that every day. Um, I'm I'll probably

1177
01:00:23,280 --> 01:00:26,160
Speaker 1: be done. I'm hoping to be done early March. Oh nice,

1178
01:00:26,200 --> 01:00:27,680
Speaker 1: that's when I got to turn it in. But then

1179
01:00:27,760 --> 01:00:33,600
Speaker 1: it comes out probably closer to late exactly what the

1180
01:00:33,640 --> 01:00:36,040
Speaker 1: what the release state is gonna be. But I got like,

1181
01:00:36,120 --> 01:00:39,720
Speaker 1: I got like sixty words so far. So speaking to books,

1182
01:00:39,920 --> 01:00:42,400
Speaker 1: you know, what I noticed is so a couple of

1183
01:00:42,440 --> 01:00:45,680
Speaker 1: podcasts back when we had Nick cough been on, um

1184
01:00:45,880 --> 01:00:47,760
Speaker 1: he was like, yeah, if you're interested in checking out

1185
01:00:47,760 --> 01:00:49,960
Speaker 1: a book for free, just tweet me for a PDF,

1186
01:00:49,960 --> 01:00:53,640
Speaker 1: and like he's getting bobarded tweets because our listeners love

1187
01:00:53,840 --> 01:00:57,240
Speaker 1: to read military books and you guys also love free ship.

1188
01:00:57,480 --> 01:01:02,720
Speaker 1: So everyone loves free stuff, yes they do. So cool?

1189
01:01:02,800 --> 01:01:05,920
Speaker 1: All right, thanks again, guys, and we'll be back with

1190
01:01:06,000 --> 01:01:10,880
Speaker 1: another show on Wednesday. You've been listening to Self Rep Radio.

1191
01:01:11,440 --> 01:01:15,000
Speaker 1: New episodes up every Wednesday and Friday for all of

1192
01:01:15,000 --> 01:01:18,600
Speaker 1: the great content from our veteran journalists. Join us and

1193
01:01:18,640 --> 01:01:22,280
Speaker 1: become a Team Moon member today at solt rep dot com.

1194
01:01:22,480 --> 01:01:26,360
Speaker 1: Follow the show on Instagram and Twitter at self Rep Radio,

1195
01:01:26,960 --> 01:01:29,440
Speaker 1: and be sure to also check out the Power of

1196
01:01:29,480 --> 01:01:34,480
Speaker 1: Thought podcast, hosted by Hurricane Group CEO and Navy Seal

1197
01:01:34,560 --> 01:01:48,400
Speaker 1: Sniper instructor Brandon Webb, M